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Talk:Main Page/Archive 1

This archive page covers approximately the dates between January 2004 and January 2005.

Remove of book listings on the front page?

 * Just too many books to list here
 * When you click on a topic, the list of books under that topic are most likely different then the books on the front page (either the author adds it to the topic listing or directly to the front page).

Lets just simplify it and put all the books on topic pages and have one or two books per day/per topic as "books of the day" for the front page--RobKohr 17:17, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Book of the month
I would like to suggest a "book of the month", similar to how it is working in the German version of Wikibooks, because it seems to work quite well there: Every month all registered Wikibook users can vote from a couple of nominated books for beeing next month's "book of the month". I guess Wikibooks is maturing to allow for 12 excellent books to be displayed on the main page a year (similar to Wikipedia's "Featured article"). --Andreas Ipp 18:39, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * I would like to reserve at least a quarter of the main page for the Book of the month, to increase the value of this award. In the future this should preferably be a well-selected picture with some introductory text to the "book of the month". In the last week of January, I would like to increase the interest in the vote by placing a picture of a big question mark "?" with the last call for voting. I will try to set something up during the next couple of days on my user subpages, and present it here first. If somebody could create a really cool kind of questionmark (maybe floating above a book, ...) that would be great! Otherwise, I would probably only contribute a very simple question mark. Also if you have other suggestions for this, let me know. (PS: Googling around, one can find a few very nice question marks, but I'm not sure whether I can just upload them to the commons?) --Andreas Ipp 08:15, 20 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * Here is my suggestion for the change of the main page: User:Andreas_Ipp/Main_Page_suggestion. If you have administrator right, all you have to do is put these three lines

===Book of the month===
 * before this line.

===About Wikibooks===
 * (The main page has been locked just a week ago by User:Gentgeen, and I don't have administrator rights). Thank you very much! --Andreas Ipp 12:57, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * I just found out that the main page was not locked anymore, and I made the change by myself. :-) --Andreas Ipp 13:17, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Change Featured Wikibooks to Most Active Wikibooks

 * Since the book of the month (see above) would take the role of the "Featured Wikibooks", I would suggest to rename Featured Wikibooks to "Most Active Wikibooks" - and list the, say, Top 5 of currently active Wikibooks (that means highest number of contributors in the last month (can be checked e.g. by "Related changes" or by a still to be defined SQL query).
 * "New Wikibooks" is fine, as books get rotated through, but..
 * "Struggling Wikibooks" is quite undefined. It is not clear who can add books to this category and who will take them away again. Either it should be also organized in a kind of rotating manner (add books with a date and delete the first in list), or by some kind of voting system.
 * "Wikijunior" is just promotional, but to be fair it should contain a link to the Wikijunior background, stating that it is a project started by the Beck Foundation approaching the Wikimedia Foundation. --Andreas Ipp 19:17, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

I replaced Featured and Struggling Wikibooks by. --Andreas 20:24, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Here the last featured and struggling books:

Featured Wikibooks

Struggling Wikibooks
 * Open Source
 * Visual Basic
 * Alchemy
 * Alchemy

Connexion

 * Le login fiche le camp derriere le logo pourriez vous remediez a cela?
 * --www-MG-fr-@ Main Page Accueil 11:16, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Imitating the new page on Wikipedia
If someone has the time to dedicate this main English page could look a lot better if it imitated the clean, colored, outlined-box format of the Wikipedia main page. Man this page does not look so nice to me in terms of the three pasty colored boxes (even though I helped design it) and the Wikipedia page looks very nice. We should of course keep the pretty icons .. --Karl Wick
 * I went ahead and did my best shot of redesigning the main page in the shadow of the 'Pedia. --Karl Wick

 * I don't like it. I have to scroll down loads to get to the books I want. The blank space on the right looks bad. I would revert, but it is the main page of course, so I would like more opinions. It doesn't matter much to me, actually, because I just type "LD" or "HSE" into the top-left box and use the Go button. r3m0t (cont) (talk) 12:21, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
 * I like it a bit - I agree there are problems, but I think they can be overcome. We have too many books to list them all on the first page now. I think we should list categories only. Languages in particular are a huge list. We could also have the book column wider than the community one. That should solve the problem of blank space on the LHS. I think it's a good idea to have our front page similar to wikipedia's. It lets users know visually that we are a sister project. It's branding. Theresa knott 14:19, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)

 * My last edit should improve things a bit, making the book names flow accross the lines instead of having a line break after each one. Maybe we should get rid of the red dots too, using the top box to showcase the more completed books. --Karl Wick
 * What do y'all think ? Looking better ?

 * Should we include the little red (and yellow) dots again that indicate levels of completion ? --Karl Wick
 * I liked them. They made it easy to check at a glance if a book was ready to read for reading's sake, or more under construction.  When a user goes to a book, they shouldn't expect it to be mostly done if it's just beginning.  --Spikey 01:42, 19 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Finally, the Main (English) page looks nice because the rightmost side of the right column isn't cut off like it used to be sometimes in the past. H Padleckas 15:52, 25 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that comment. It still is cut off, just not so blatantly. But also notice that this discussion is from February. - SamE 21:18, 25 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Cologne Blue Skin
It looks like the Style Sheet for the Wikibooks has a little problem... On the Cologne Blue style underneath the logo pic, it still says "The Free Encyclopedia", instead of the (i think proper) "The free textbook project". btw, this problem is the same with the other wikimedia pages as well --Mobius 08:44, 15 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Centered change
I don't like it, I think it looks very ugly (sorry) - however, Karl still hasn't reverted it, meaning that at least he prefers it that way. Opinions? r3m0t (cont) (talk) 21:48, 23 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * I changed it so it now has a buffer zone of 23% on the left, and 25% on the right. I think it looks better, but I'm not sure about how large the buffers on each side should be, as screen sizes differ from user to user. --flonejek 06:59, 30 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Logo design
It would be an improvement to see the slogan read "Think freely. Learn freely" rather than "Think free. Learn free" under the Wikibooks logo; someone coming here to learn something might be slightly put off by a source of knowledge which doesn't know the difference between an adjective and an adverb. Paul Clenton

I am thinking about modifying the logo to mimic the more elegant Wikipedia logo (as the designer of the current logo I feel confident in saying this). I am thinking of a smooth, gray version of the current. What kind of images could we put on the front of the top book that suggest learning / education / academia / textbooks ? eyeglasses, a feather in an inkwell, bust of Wm Shakespeare, human skeleton, strand of DNA, a sailing ship, a compass, a lightning bolt, a human brain, a radioactive physics-type symbol (as now), etc etc. Help me figure out what makes sense here. --Karl Wick

I don't like the sailing ship or lightning bolt. Apart from that any of the images you have in mind would be great. My ideas include Rodin's "the thinker". A bust of any of the classical philosphers, a mortarboard, A scroll or something that looks like a diplomer. You could also put words along the spines of the books. It would have to be simple. Something like "Quantum electrodynamics for dummies" would be amusing but impractical. Something like maths, poetry, french, science on each of the spines would indicate the range of different subjects on offer. That's all I can think of at the moment. Theresa knott 09:23, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
 * I like the logo the way it is... I don't think it needs changing - it's simple and elegant and a little more interesting than it would be in plain grey. KJ 02:27, 23 Feb 2004 (UTC)

 * Besides the logo in the upper-left corner of each page, could we update the "favicon.ico" ? ( http://visual.wiki.taoriver.net/moin.cgi/FavIcon ) ? At the moment the Wikipedia "favicon.ico" is identical to the Wikibooks "favicon.ico".

 * I second the call for a new favicon. All that's needed is shrinking down the present logo. A unigue favicon would help people differentiate between Wikipedia and Wikibooks bookmarks in the Favorite Places or Shortcut Bar. -- Everlong

Good job Karl. I like Theresas idea of 'The Thinker' and would like to see a simputer or PDA in there. Books have had it (well maybe in a few hundred years time . . .) I would suggest a pile of books with an 'explosive' Light - all the knowledge symbols coming out with a childs face behind as if reading a screen (perhaps wearing a mortar board) This is similar to the world jigsaw created in the wikipdea logo 82.69.58.117 10:41, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Wikibook arrangement
I don't know if anyone else feels the same but I think the arrangement of wikibooks by developmental stages to be uneasy to the eyes. Also, when a wikibook progresses to the next stage, it is moved further up the listing which just adds to more unpleasantness. I think a fixed alphabetical arrangement would be best since the stage icon next to the wikibook link shows what stage it's at anyway. So when a wikibook progresses to the next stage, we only change the icon, no need to move the wikibook link around. Shuffling of the links is just not user friendly. I forgot what the technical term is... the principles of design... such as ease of readability, navigation, etc. What do the rest of you think? — Mkn 22:26, 1 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * I was the one who came up with that idea, and the only person that said anything was NeuronExMachina, who liked it. See below, at . Should we put it to a vote? - SamE 01:30, 2 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * Sure. — Mkn 01:29, 4 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Book completion
What do you think of the high ratio of stubby books to books which are even only partially written?

Key to Completion Labels
Here's my idea for a key to the completion labels in the Textbooks box. I think it's easier to read than the paragraph at the top. --Spikey 04:40, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)
 * Good idea, I'll implement it --flonejek 11:04, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)
 * I also changed the images, making them thinner and darker so their a bit less conspicuous and don't drown out the titles/links --flonejek 12:10, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I like the new images, but I don't like the idea of "completed" books. Can we come up with some other phrasing ? Usable perhaps ? Complete gives the impression that there is nothing left to do. Theresa knott 14:31, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * That's why I used "edition"; a "complete edition" means it's in a full, complete form, but can still be updated and made better. It has attained 1.0-ness.  If you think it's too strong though, perhaps "full" or somehting like it.  I don't like "being finalized" for this reason; a "complete edition" shouldn't be a "final edition".  "Being touched up" wasn't very professional, though.  Anyone have a better term?  --Spikey 11:05, 1 Mar 2004

What about
 * "completed initial draft"
 * "Ready to use"
 * "All topics covered"
 * "A beta version"
 * "Ready for testing"

Do you like any of these. As for being touched up. It may not sound professional, but it's very clear what is meant. I say keep it. Theresa knott 17:15, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * Actually, thinking about it again, "Being touched up" sounds like it's approaching finalization too. I like "completed initial draft" and "All topics covered" for the final phase, though.  Maybe we need to look into what we mean by "[[Image:Yellow.png]]".  --Spikey 21:45, 2 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * Perhaps instead of just blobs of colour you have a red D image for in development; an orange F for being finalised and a green C for complete?

 * Deuteranope simulation of our Main Page. According to some people in my class who are deuteranope, the simulation and the original version look identical in most cases (for most websites - the only one which was a little different was the bright red Yahoo logo). This seems pretty accurate. r3m0t (cont) (talk) 21:44, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)
 * I agree-even if you aren't deuteranope, the blobs can be kind of hard to see. Kagredon 01:01, 4 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I tried adding a header but i can't get it too look right, could somebody either fix it or revert it? Also about the letter/images, I'm trying too keep the images as small as possible kinda inconspicuos, because I looked at the old version and I think the drowning out of the text was what ended the previous development status system. Some random guy also made the names better, thanks whoever you are :) --flonejek 23:48, 2 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * I pulled the header into the table; think it looks pretty good. I'd use a better phrase than "Development Scheme", though.  If I could come up with one.  I also think that "Intermittent" is a very odd choice for yellow.  As I said above, I think we need to better define what yellow means.  --Spikey 01:53, 3 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I added a section on the right for better development stages descriptions, and made the names better (i think). Hope you like it. --flonejek 09:33, 3 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * I've replaced "guru" with "comprehensive" as it seems be more reflective of the actual status of development ("guru" in this sense conveys a notion of omniscience, which is not the aim of any single Wikibook). In addition, the portion of text that indicates the completeness of various other Wikimedia projects has been omitted as the scheme is too subjective to be applied towards entire databases. --Taoster 18:13, 3 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Completion label feedback
I like the color-blind-friendly blobs ! --Karl Wick
 * Yes, the little squares are much better—easier it see. But how does Errata rate anything but the first level. There is almost no text there? - Marsh 18:30, 4 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * Just a prod at the descriptions - if you were to look at most red books, they have the structure but not the content. The lucid dreaming wikibook really is approaching completion and its structure has barely changed at all since the first few edits*. HSE, among other yellow or red books, also has structure as well as content. r3m0t (cont) (talk) 22:58, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)
 * I understand that lucid dreaming is a bit of an anomaly because it doesn't have much content (and won't even after all the reality check pages are finished)

The descriptions are subject to interpretation.. Perhaps a better system is "testing" a wikibook. Level 1 - Outline of the book; Level 2 - Most (ie. more than 50%) of all proposed pages have been drafted; Level 3 - All of the pages have been drafted and finally level 4 - all initally proposed pages written and checked. Maybe?

Also, I have updated the blobs to be have a transparent background so they look a bit nicer against the style of the Main Page

Given the nature of a wiki, the notion of "completion" labels seems fairly useless. Granted there is an initial period during which the majority of the pages are written, but even established pages can still be edited and revised. This is to say nothing of pages which may be affected by new technologies or discoveries. The page revision history readily indicates whether the page is undergoing active development, and coupled with the page itself the stage of development can be ascertained. I see no reason to append a subjective label.

Lastly, I think the inconsistent use (not all pages have labels) will be highly confusing.

--Eibwen 07:51, 25 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * I disagree. First, I tried to give all Wikibooks labels on the main page, but within Wikibooks, the labeling will vary greatly. I think all Wikibooks on the bookshelves have completion labels, and whenever someone adds a book without it, I add the label. Notice the explanation of the labels on the right side of the main page and at Template:Stages2. Note that nowhere does it say that pages shouldn't be edited and revised. Also, the labels don't say anything about how fast the book is progressing right now, but rather how much is done so far. If I wanted to learn some obscure language, and we didn't have completion labels, I would be severely disappointed to find just the introduction written. Again, if I wanted to see which foreign languages are the farthest completed, I wouldn't be able to tell as easily as with completion labels. No one wants to read a page from every language book to decide something we can decide for them. We want to make it easy for the reader - SamE 13:37, 25 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * It is entirely possible to browse the wiki without reading the Main Page, and thus have no idea as to the significance of the symbols, as was the case when I first encountered them. Perhaps the symbols themselves could be linked to the explanation.  Having subsequently read about the symbols, I'd suggest changing the orientation of the intermediary symbols.  Two vertically stacked blocks can readily be confused with a 'B' or an '8'.  I'd replace it with two horizontal blocks -- which interestingly has the effect of appearing as a staircase when taken collectively:

 * Horizontalified the 50% blob.--Boit 00:54, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * --Eibwen 22:07, 25 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Time-stamped completion labels
I created some new templates that should help to provide "time-stamped" development stages. As explained in Help:Development stages, the template is easy to use ( gives  ) and provides a descriptive text when you place the mouse above the picture. (template  is without the small date next to it and can be used in books). This is meant to gradually replace the old images, and the date ("time-stamp") helps to keep the stages up-to-date. --Andreas Ipp 18:27, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Books: Featured Books
Botany and German have been on since Template:Featured was first made. Could we replace with HSE and something else? (Not lucid dreaming, because then it would be on two lists, and there aren't any new books to replace it on the New list...). Actually, you could just replace them with HSE, the column widths would still be fine. r3m0t (cont) (talk) 19:04, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * The Statistics book I am currently working on is new...very new...--Boit 16:55, 6 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Book categorization
I would like to start an Arts & Crafts text. Would this be better placed in the Wikipedia Howto section, or is there room for such a text on Wikibooks? If so, in which category should it be placed? All the Wikibooks I have seen so far are very theoretical in nature. --23/4/2004

 * *pokes towards lucid dreaming, a practical guide* An arts and crafts wikibook would require a huge amount of photographs and diagrams, and is therefore a major project. If, however, you want to start one, you can start by putting in under Miscellanous. Remember to make an origami section :) r3m0t (cont) (talk) 16:57, 23 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * Theoretical in nature? Probably due to the contributors more than by plan. I think that this would be a great place for a book about arts & crafts. In fact, someone was mentioning that not too long ago but it has not gotten started up yet (to the best of my knowledge). --Karl Wick

 * Ouch, I think I may have made a boo-boo through my limited command of the English language, for which I apologise.

 * What I meant was a category that collects practical knowledge about how to apply oneself in different arts and different crafts. I wasn't talking about pottery, weaving etc. as such, although that would of course also fit into such a category. My immediate goal was to write a text about authoring web pages.--branko

Books: Arrange books by completion
I think we should arrange the books within the bookshelves in the order of completion (finished books first), and alphabetize the ones at the same level. This would keep the new books that just happen to start with 'A' out of the first slot and, conversely, bring completed and mostly completed books up to the front. It would also encourage people to update the completion of the book (maybe even get more done to look better). Lastly, it would make it easier to see from a glance which bookshelves need the most work and which books are completed. What do you guys think? - SamE 21:36, 25 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Same thing as the templates, same thing as the black edge; if you don't like the change, please tell me right here. - SamE 15:07, 27 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I think this was a great idea! Thanks for making the change. --NeuronExMachina 03:12, 29 Jul 2004 (UTC)

One more thing: Should there be a note somewhere on the main page describing this ordering? --NeuronExMachina 03:13, 29 Jul 2004 (UTC)

 * I put a sentence at the end of Template:Stages2 that explains this. It appears on the right side of the Main Page. - SamE 04:21, 29 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Books: What makes a Wikibook?
Alright, I've been looking around various wikibook pages and discussions and can't figure out when something should be a wikibook project and when it should be done seperatly. In particular I decided to start a wiki project to develop a universal pen-and-paper RPG engine ( http://www.invariant.org/media/ at the moment...if it takes off I will get a domain name.....yes yes I know shitty html pages puporting to have this aim pop up all the time but I want to see if doing this collaboratively with a wiki system allowing for nice layout and some good ideas can do better).

I assumed at first that wikibooks was clearly an inappropriate place to put this project but while failing to find a list of third party MediaWiki run projects I noticed that there were wikibooks like "Getting a Girl". Not that I would object to a serious scientifically sound discussion of dating strategies but this book is filled with gems like, "Ok, first, please forgive me to compare handling a girl's mind with jerking off a dog. The principle is the same. You want to get a girl feel horny / greedy for love." If this is an okay wikibook maybe my project belongs here as well. So I have two questions

First, would the project I described be best kept on my servers/account or get accepted as a wikibook. I imagine it is best kept distinct (although this makes it difficult to attract eyes.....especially since there seems to be no obvious page indexing outside MediaWiki projects) and that only projects of a more concrete nature belong on Wikibooks (like textbooks, how-to manuals). However, if Wikibook is going to allow things like this entierly unsubstantiated 'Getting a Girl' guide then why shouldn't my project take advantage of being hosted on wikibooks (BTW is there any page detailing the advantages/disadvantages with starting a whole project or being part of something like wikibooks). Logicnazi 11:45, 29 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * Since you started a wiki on your own server, you will be interested in Wiki Science.
 * There is a third option. Consider posting your pen-and-paper RPG ideas on some other wiki. Perhaps http://freegames.wiki.taoriver.net/ would be appropriate ? --DavidCary 16:08, 31 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the link. This is one of the things I found really annoying I looked for a fair amount of time for a wiki with such a purpose but couldn't fine one.  Is there any page which functions as a list of all the various wikis? Logicnazi 02:04, 1 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * Ohh, freegames is for computer games and doesn't use MediaWiki. I'd still like a page listing all MediaWiki projects (if not least so people could find my project) even if freegames wouldn't be on there and isn't quite appropriate for my project (MediaWiki seems to be the only wiki engine which is visually appealing enough to have a hope of creating a succesfull pen and paper RPG.) Logicnazi 02:08, 1 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * Yes, there is a list of all wiki. It's at http://www.worldwidewiki.net/wiki/SwitchWiki . A few people write wiki descriptions that include the wiki engine it uses. Want to help them ? --DavidCary 23:43, 1 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * Also check out http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgamewiki.

Books: XML(Chinese Version)
Someone put this Chinese Wikibook on the. It's Chinese, so it doesn't belong here. Where does it belong, and how can we tell the user that created the page this (in Chinese, maybe)? I reverted the link, but they put it back there. - SamE 21:02, 1 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Arts bookshelf?
Should there be an Arts bookshelf? I imagine it could include handbooks on things like 3D modeling, drawing, game creation, etc. How can I make a bookshelf? - NeuronExMachina 02:42, 2 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Ok, here's a preliminary.

Bookshelf: Computer Science?
What's up with ? Right now there's a link to it on the main page in the. Should we make it a simple redirect to IT bookshelf, at least until there's enough books that it makes sense to split into 2 bookshelves ? --DavidCary 20:27, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)

New Bookshelf - Travel Guides?
I am currently working on a travel guide for the Isle of Arran. I can think of no book better suited to the wikibook site, than travel guides. For a start anyone can add to them whether it be about their home region or their favourite holiday spot. Could we please add a bookshelf, or how do i add a bookshelf (sorry a bit new at this), for Travel Guides.

Pluke 20:49, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)

 * Have you already seen Wikitravel? Perhaps this might be better over there. --NeuronExMachina 08:52, 15 Jul 2004 (UTC)

 * This belongs at Wikitravel, no doubt. I'll take it off the main page, but we'll need an admin to move/delete the pages. - SamE 20:06, 15 Jul 2004 (UTC)

 * Cheers Guys i'll move it over, sorry about that, there are so many of these wiki things about :) - Pluke 14:09, 16 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Error: How-Tos links to arts
On the main page, a link to the How-Tos bookshelf links to the Arts bookshelf

 * Sorry, I can not find this link. The two links labelled "How-Tos" link to the "How-Tos" bookshelf. --Andreas Ipp 05:12, 20 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Layout: Black edge
Can we do away with the black edges around the selected wikibooks, bookshelves, and community sections? I tried that out with Show Preview, and it looks better. Any thoughts? - SamE 04:54, 17 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I took the edges away for everyone to see, and adjusted the columns a bit; any comments on it are welcome. - SamE 18:56, 17 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Opening paragraph
Here's my idea (added text in italics):
 * Welcome, newcomers! Wikibooks is dedicated to developing and disseminating free, open content textbooks and other classroom texts. ''We currently host over X textbooks, over X of them marked Thorough/Complete Editions/Somethingelsewecomeupwith.  However, every book is open to revision and addition by anyone–even you.

Needs a little work, but there's the general idea. --Spikey 23:48, 2 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * Nice -I'd like to modify it a bit to We currently host over X textbooks,in various stages of development; from those needing a lot of work to those that are nearly perfect. Every book is open to revision and addition by anyone–even you. Theresa knott 12:43, 16 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Number of users
Someone tried to add We currently have editors working on around textbooks... which displays as
 * We currently have editors working on around  textbooks...

I'm not sure how is counted, but I thought it was a nice thing to stick in that opening paragraph. Then it was reverted. Then it was added again. Then reverted again. I considered adding it again, but I'd rather not get sucked into an edit war. Would you, calmly and rationally, state why this is, or is not, a good thing to stick in that paragraph ? -- DavidCary 20:07, 16 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * Did you see the ? Unless this is computed value, i don't see how it could be useful. Would have to update it every time a new user gets in... BTW it's already false. Yann 22:04, 16 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Oh. Thanks for pointing that out. Yes, we need to replace that silly number with a computed value. Unfortunately, I don't see one in http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Variable. Where does the "registered users" number in Special:Statistics come from ? -- DavidCary 06:28, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Converting html to wikicode
html2wikibooks(*nix/Cygwin) - I modified the html2wikipedia filter so it could be used with wikibooks. It only works with the *nixes (linux, BSD, *nix, Mac OSX) and Cygwin under windows. Its only 28KB, but I have a monthly bandwith limit of 10 megs so I would [be really grateful if someone mirrored it and updated the links. When you use it don't forget to make sure all the links in the html page are correct. I did a demo page here - original. --flonejek 06:37, 30 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Style: Book navigation
do we have a [book-format] consensus here? all the books are different in fmt. i advice adding a header like: Main Page > Computer programming > C ^ C ^ | Basic Concepts | Variables | Simple Input and Output What do u guys think? --Yacht (talk)Q 03:09, 21 Feb 2004 (UTC)

 * Yacht, you are talking about page navigation links at the top of each wikibooks module, correct ? I agree on principal with what you are saying and started my Organic Chemistry book with something like you suggested, but stopped adding the navigation links after a while because I would change how the pages were linked together. My thought now is to put in navigation links later, when a book is more stable. Ideally, we will eventually have software that will do the navigation automatically for us. --Karl Wick

 * Since the Wikibook I'm writing (Vietnamese) is still pretty new and unstable, I've just added a simple link back to the TOC on every article page, using this code:
 * It doesn't require much work or maintenance, and I can other links next to it later on easily. – Minh Nguyễn 02:40, 25 Feb 2004 (UTC)
 * It doesn't require much work or maintenance, and I can other links next to it later on easily. – Minh Nguyễn 02:40, 25 Feb 2004 (UTC)

 * I use Template:LDTOC and Template:LDRCTOC in the Lucid dreaming wikibook. I "include" them with and  . As they are they look pretty cool, however this system wouldn't work very well for more than the two levels I have now. Luckily lucid dreaming is a fairly small subject, if you exclude dream examples :) r3m0t (cont) (talk) 00:02, 4 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * I've put navs in Genealogy and Game Guides and Strategy, and it easily extends to more levels - just use more colors. Should'nt there be a page about constructing navs? I'll get to work on it! KirbyMeister 21:43, 4 May 2004 (UTC)

Standards: Book structure
Does anyone think that the books should follow a similar format or structure? Like the language books for instance, I like the idea of dividing them into level I, II, III sections and the title page for each book is a nice touch too. However, some of them have a bit of poor formatting. An example of a nicely formatted language book in my opinion, is the Norwegian text (I like the use of the green tables for key parts), should we think about making a common layout for these books?

Another thing that is pretty evident - the way books are set up, using the book title prefix to prevent cross-articles from other books. IE: naming pages like Electronics:Circuit Diagrams or German:Types of Good Beer etc. Maybe we should come up with a way to do this automatically within books?

 * I don't think our textbooks should try too hard to be similar to one another. Unlike with Wikipedia, we don't have any easy method of determining the best format for a book except by evaluating it as it's written. While it makes a text look "polished" to be so neatly broken down, it doesn't really help anyone study, and overloading the site with rules is probably only going to drag down people's drive to contribute. --Jwh 04:57, 17 Aug 2004 (UTC)

New main page to mimic the english wikipedia
I have started a proposed new main page to mimic the professional look of the english wikipedia. Please improve the test page as it is far from complete. Perl 02:30, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)

 * For this format, we would need something catchy, like Wikipedia's "In the News", "Did you Know..." and "Featured articles". We could expand on the featured and new books (with a few pictures), but they aren't as exciting as the stuff on Wikipedia. If you could find some way to present the books in an attractive way, it might work, but I personally like it the way it is. - SamE 03:49, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Language books: Curse words?
What is your stand on teaching curse words in language books?

 * Don't. Why should you? No usual language book does so. r3m0t (cont) (talk) 13:54, 11 Apr 2004 (UTC)

 * They are words just like any other, and not to mention Wikipedia has a large entry on the F-word...
 * I think you are allowed to mention curse words. Go ahead. Perl 17:38, 11 Apr 2004 (UTC)

 * Plus it is a way to add some humor on the subject, as I'm not even talking about the really terrible curse words. For instance, the Polish language has a phrase, when translated, is similar to: "Your face resembles a Warsaw sidewalk". This is referring to the sidewalks which are normally caked in dog feces as owners do not usually pick up after themselves :)

 * Go for it IMO the fact that other language books don't do is their problem not ours. Make sure the words are in common use, and clearly mark them as curse words so that no mistakes can be made. Most people I know want to learn "hello two beers please" "Can you tell me how to get to my hotel" "I like you very much, will you go to bed with me?" and some varient of "You like to have sexual relations with your parents", "Why don't you go and masturbate yourself" or similar insults. But that probably tells you more about my friends (and myself) than how language should be taught ;-) Theresa knott 08:48, 5 May 2004 (UTC)

"Plus it is a way to add some humour on the subject": what is considered funny usually differs tremendously between cultures and even between individuals. Adding curse words is not a fail-safe way to inject humour. Having said that, I would like to say: go ahead, write as you like. If somebody disagrees, they are sure to change your text. That is, after all, the way a wiki works. :-)

 * Regarding the cultural aspect. We don't actually have to cater to every culture in the English books - we only have to include the English-speaking ones. Other cultures have their own languages and corresponding books, so the problem is solved for us --Jwh 05:05, 17 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * But when learning a language, usually one would want to use that language in a realistic environment, such as visiting Germany or France after learning German or French. If we teach them a curse word and don't identify it as a curse word, or don't say that it only is a curse word in southern France and in northern France, means something totally seperate, etc., then we have a problem. - SamE 14:12, 17 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * I agree entierly. The goal should be language use in a realistic enviornment which happens to include fairly frequent use of curse words.  Of course it would be terrible not to identify them as curse words but I don't think anyone is suggesting this.Logicnazi 16:56, 4 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I think it is absolutely essential to add the curse words. First of all to get the same respect for a collaborative online project as with a more traditional medium you need to be more overly principled about your content. Since a wiki project, by its very emphasis on encouraging cooperation, makes people more aware that the individuals writing the information are just as fallible as they are. It might not be a warranted reaction but given this likely attitude I think it is a very bad idea to engage in anything that might even resemble censorship or subjectivity.

Furthermore on a more pragmatic note I find wiki books MOST advantageous because they include so many practical tidbits left out of more staid and traditional publications. Don't emasculate one of the major wikibook benefits just to avoid offending a few people. This is also pragmatically quite difficult in a wiki-text as these sorts of words are quite likely to be added by people who decided not to respect your nicely worded plea not to include curses. It certainly seems like a better solution to add a classy presentation of swears rather than let an immature teenager do it for you. At best you could create all the curse word pages and lock them empty but this will hardly stop people from adding links to these pages and asking why they can't edit them. Besides you now look like a ham-fisted censor instead of just happening to think these words didn't belong. Logicnazi 22:04, 29 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * This is a bad idea. We're not suggesting censorship as a solution, but rather not to mention curse words in foreign languages at all. It is a bad idea to censor material Curse words aren't at all 'practical tidbits', rather a hinder to our efforts. If people don't like it that we don't have curse words, that's what the discussion pages are for, to work out and resolve conflicts. If the general consensus is against curse words, but the user continues to persist, we can ban their IP address at worst.

 * I think you view curse words too harmless. Way more than 'a few people' are offended by curse words. Many people don't use curse words (I honestly can say that I've never used one in my life, spoken or written). As for realizing fallibility, if I, or someone else like me, read something with curse words, the 'likely reaction' is to turn away from the material/project: not a positive reaction. Instead of what you're saying, the likely reaction is negative. If curse words aren't presented, then no one cares, and if they do, that's what the discussion page is for. It's not like people are *begging* to add pages on curse words. 'Respect' for the project doesn't come at all from curse words, rather from not having them.

 * A question arises: What are curse words? Curse words vary degrees in English and foreign languages, so native speakers would be best to explain this. But the simplest explanation is a word that has a definition other than how one would use it and means something in that situation. For example, 'rats' is not a curse word because it doesn't mean anything in that situation.

 * Teaching curse words is not a benefit. We have to ask ourselves, "Do we want people to use curse words in other languages?" - SamE 04:16, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * Look, whether you like curse words or not you have to admit they are extremely common parts of discourse. It is just foolish to think that because you don't happen to use curse words they aren't important.  In fact someone who was completly unaware of curse words would have a great deal of difficulty understanding modern society, at the very least it is important to know the word is a curse word and whether it is a deadly insult or a friendly saluataion (I certainly call my friends fucker in a friendly manner on occasion...while in some cultures no doubt any use of a similar word is a deadly insult).  Whether you like it or not it is pratically important to know what the curse words are and their cultural position.

 * As for the issue of censorship and respect. The notion that we aren't censoring the curse words but just choosing not to include them is just linguistic sophistry.  I personally believe that including curse words is quite important (for a variety of reasons..some above some below) and you are straightforwardly advocating rolling back my edits if I was to include them.  Let try that again, you are suggesting that some additions to this language book be prevented not because of factual inadequacy, stylistic issues or even for being offtopic (or do you deny that curse words are a commonly used and occupy a unique linguistic position) but simply because someone is offended.  If this isn't censorship please tell me what is?

 * How about the notion that this will give us a negative image? I simply don't find it credible that a well-marked link to a curse word section would discourage many people from making use of the wikibook.  The oxford english dictionary certainly puts in it's fare share of curse words with just as detailed information and even m-w.com has 'fuck'.  These works decided the benefit of increase credibility outweighed the harms of a few offended individuals (and yes I really do believe it is few percentagewise).  Personally, I think it is a much better goal to create the most informative/usefull work you can than something fuzzy parents let their kids read.  Finally, I don't think this is information we can simply leave to the dictionaries (even assuming language dictionaries of that language carry swears).  More so than any other class of words the meaning/usage of swears is context/phrase dependent.

 * Also, I really do want people using curse words (in english or otherwise). I think it makes language more expresive and colorfull not to mention increased usage reduces the flak people who do use them take.  I respect the fact that other people may be offended by them and try to avoid them in public discourse (like here..except to discuss that word) despite the fact that I prefer using them.  Those who are offended by curse words should return the courtesy but not trying to stop others from using these words in there conversations(by denying them education/knowledge about them).  While one certainly doesn't need to rush out and put in swears in some begining language lessons a NPOV really does require that they have their own (well marked) link/pages.

 * The issue of curse words may not be that significat but the precedent advocated here is very dangerous. What happens when someone writes a wikibook about family planning and 'doesn't mention' (in the sense of rolling back updates which do mention) abortion.  The example may be extreme but it really is quite similar to the arguments presented against mentioning curse words.  Even more people may be quite offended by the mention of abortion.  You might object saying that abortion is surely practically relevant to family planning, however those who want to leave it out would disagree.  They would claim abortion is murder and is no more relevant to family planning than a guide about hiring hitmen to kill excess children would be.  Just like the curse words issue a group wants to avoid presenting certain information because it is offensive and want to discourage people from acting on that information (i.e. getting an abortion/using curse words).  Similarly there is a valid differnce of opinion (i.e. not a logical error but a differnce in basic value) over whether that effect is desierable or not.  Consequently the two cases really should have the same solution and I certainly find the notion of wikibooks witholding abortion information troublesome. Logicnazi 11:02, 29 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * If we ever do mention curse words in language books, it should be debated on the talk pages for the writers of that wikibook, not here. Since curse words vary in how harmful they are and how often they're used, I think this discussion should be continued when and where they occur. If the writers/authors of the wikibook take a vote or something similar, and come up with a solution, that should be the way it goes in that case. - SamE 18:20, 31 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * Yes, I agree that the deciscion of a vote of the project members should decide the issue. In so far as the question is 'should we go out and add in curse words' I agree this should be left up to the members of that particular book.  If the question is 'should we role back curse word additions' I'm not so sure if it shouldn't be decided by the wikibook community at large.  However, this is a differnt issue than the one we have been discussing (which since it affects many books seems reasonable to discuss here).  How disputes about the correct practice are resolved is a very differnt question.  For instance I would argue strongly that an ammendment prohibiting gay marriage is wrong and violates the basic principles this country was founded on yet I completly agree that it's adoption should be decided by a vote in congress and ratification by state legislators.  In other words I am offering up reasons why any such vote should turn out a particular way. Logicnazi 02:01, 1 Sep 2004 (UTC)

WikiChongqing
This site is in chinese/japanese (can't tell which), which just look like question marks on older browsers. However, the URL is unexpected for a wiki. I'd say, keep the link out, unless someone who can read the language confirms it is a wiki.

Class contributions
Hello, I'm a teacher and would love to get my students to contribute here for credit. Any thoughts on how we can get students to participate as part of a class assignment?
 * Our sister project Wikipedia has developed a page to give pointers and keep track of school and university projects. The page over there can be found at w:Wikipedia:School and university projects.  I did a search here but didn't find a similar page, so we might want to consider starting one.  However, read wikipedia's page for the basic ideas.  The most important thing is to have the students create user names, so you as the instructor can easily track their contributions. Gentgeen 00:41, 30 May 2004 (UTC)
 * Welcome to wikibooks! You can sign your username and current time using ~ . Glad you decided to have a project here. The students may wanna use their own psuedonyms for usernames, so I'd let them (it's also helpful for us to track who's who as well). To see a user's contributions, just access their user page and click on the "User Contributions" link on the sidebar. Remember to teach your students the basics - NPOV, dont vandalize, how to create links and such - first, just in case. Feel free to start anytime - the more users here, the better. KirbyMeister 19:55, 30 May 2004 (UTC)

See also Wikiversity and the tips for teachers section of the Wikipedia FAQ. There should be something like that on wikibooks, too...

Printing: Wikis for developing countries
The concept of Wikibooks is excellent, but to use Wikibooks in classrooms in developing countries is problematic: there are no computers. Is there a way to print an entire book? Then paper copies could be made and distributed to students. --Steve

 * Two things would help this: subdomains/categories for each book to define what's in it, and at least a way to print each page ("Printable Version") like Wikipedia had before MediaWiki 1.3. We also would have the problem of links being impossible on paper. See Wikibook Press, a printing suggestion. There will be many problems, though. Of course, most of our Wikibooks are not even close to getting done, so this is in many cases low priority. - SamE 17:31, 24 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Languages: Editions in Other Languages
On this page, someone added (it looks like) every single language that is possible. Most of them get a "Wiki does not exist" error message upon clicking on them, so I was wondering if others think that should stay. How many languages, and which languages, is Wikibooks in (as in subdomains)? We need to update to show that. Is there a way to keep track of this? - SamE 15:07, 27 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Languages: romanian Wikibooks
I'm sorry. Why were this two pages deleted: and  ? You could at least wait that they are copyed to the romanian version, and then delete them. Please revert the delete, and let them there for at least one week, because I'm not sure when I will have time to copy them, but be shore that I will notice you here then. Thank you.--Danutz

BTW. Please chnage in the main page the link to the romanian version, so it goes to http://ro.wikiquote.org.

 * "ro.wikiquote.org"? Do you mean ro.wikibooks.org? - SamE 03:06, 3 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Yes, I mean that. Sorry. Can a sysop undelete the files I mentioned for a while, until I copy them to romanian Wikibooks? --Danutz

Main: Protect Page?
Wikipedia's Main Page is made up mostly of templates, and so therefore can be protected. Now that our main page is template-ified, I think it would be a good idea to protect it. Could an admin please do this? - SamE 18:16, 2 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * I was about to suggest that now. I just came here and found this. Reub2000 11:26, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Admins: Administrators
Could someone please update this page? It currently has 12 sysops that have been sysops for a year now and Special:Statistics says there are 18. Who are they? - SamE 04:22, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)
 * Sam, they are all listed at Special:Listadmins. Gentgeen 14:57, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I'll be updating the admins page soon. - SamE 18:04, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Wikiversity, and adding MusicML
I don't know whether I've overstepped the bounds of user participation, but I've created a School of Music in the Wikiversity, since I believe that's one area that should have its own school.

However, the reason I comment is that I think it'd be great for the wiki engine, if at all possible, be extended to support MusicML insertion into documents?

Relevant links:

Interviews?
For the US Government text book, I was going to ask some governor and senator's offices to let me interview their representee. Is this sort of thing okay? -- user:zanimum

YES! Just make sure that you understand the GNU free documentation license in case there are questions. --Waxmop

Automated Table of Contents
I forget how those things work! Is there a tutorial somewhere or at least an example page? I feel so foolish cuz not long ago I was using them. I have just spend quite a while trying to figure it back out and am not having much luck... Thank you! --Karl Wick 21:49, 12 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Linguistics
I don't know where to post this comment, but I absolutely adore the Linguistics textbook on here and read it avidly. I hope you will all keep working on it! Thanks, anon.

 * I like it, too. You should put this comment is on either the book's discussion page, or on the talk page of the author. - SamE 03:42, 20 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Promoting free textbooks, how to change the world
This is great! I am so happy to find Wikibooks, and to see it growing! The down side is the way I found it: After having a attending the "home and school club" (modern PTA) meeting for my son's elementary school and seeing the uphill battle of their fund-raising, I started thinking hard about how to cut costs in schools. Something that floated to the surface rather quickly was the textbooks - textbooks are not cheap. I very quickly thought, Open Source! Open source textbooks, compiled online by teachers, students, whoever, is the answer. Of course, getting these into elementary schools would be difficult (politics), but one might be able to break into community colleges and private schools...

So, as with any idea, I started searching the web to see if someone was already doing it. There's the down side of Wikibooks - it took me a little while to find on Google (searching on "free textbook" and "free college textbooks" - I ended up here following a blog link).

So, here's the point of my writing: This is a great project! We can change the world! Make education more affordable for everyone! We need to promote the heck out of this!!! But is what I'm describing part of Wikibooks' current vision? If so, what promotion activities are underway already? Who is the top Wikibooks Evangelist? I want to help! And if not, who do I have to convince? Since printed books will be a staple of educational institutions for a long time to come (until every student has a laptop), a long term goal would be to either publish printed docs through a nonprofit, or minimally make Wikibooks available (which they sort of are already, through the copyleft license) for printing - but I think there will need to be a way to readily download whole books (as PDFs perhaps).

Aerik Sylvan http://aerik.thesylvans.com/blog

(This is cross posted to Karl Wick's user page)

 * We desperately need to get better books made before we start any promoting. This site is not yet useful except in a few cases, and it certainly doesn't have any completed textbooks (there's Lucid dreaming, but that would never be taught, and High school extensions is going along pretty well) and if people get the image of a site of half-done textbooks we will keep that image for a long time and it would take a lot of effort to change it. We ought to leaave it for the time being.
 * I would like book-to-PDF too, but it's hard stuff to do. I could probably write something to minimally convert a page from here into (La)TeX but to get it all done is difficult. r3m0t (cont) (talk) 06:32, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * I've said this on Karl's talk page and on the staff noticeboard. I don't normally spam, but I'm really excited about this and so please forgive me for posting it here too. Wikmedia has secureed a grant from the Beck foundation for producing short books/magazines (anyway they'll be 48 pages long no matter what thery are called aimed at the 7 -12 year old age group. The books will be developed here on wikibooks before being printed and sold. (They'll be cheap because we only have to cover the cost of printing). If this takes off, and I'm pretty sure it will, it'll be a massive boost to wikibooks as a whole and may well mean that we can get print versions of other books up and running too. Soo come to meta wikijunior and join in the fun. We still need to decide on a title (Wkijunior is only a working title) and what the forst topic should be. (it looks like big cats is the top contender at the moment). Theresa knott 13:02, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)

 * Very cool stuff - I agree wholeheartedly about needing more completed works before promoting the site for public consumption ("come use these books"), BUT I think we desperately need more promotion for development ("come write books and change the world") - I am thinking of a campaign of posting flyers aimed at both students and teachers at junior colleges - making it clear of course of exactly what is being marketed (the opportunitiy to participate in writing books). Any thoughts?

 * The printing of books (not for profit) is a longer term goal, but I think it's appropriate to have a clear vision of that, and plan for technology and processes to support it.

 * Theresa, great news about the grant, and you're absolutely right, that is the perfect kind of project to springboard wikibooks as a whole - count me in. 16:33, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)- Aerik
 * Great! Do come to meta and help make the decisions that are needed to get the project off the ground. As for you advert idea. i thinks it's good. Do it thw wiki way though - put your suggeted text here Advertising poster so we can all help you with the design. Theresa knott 16:52, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)

 * Okay, started! I think it would also be appropriate to continue discussions around  the advertising poster in the discussion for that page?  Thanks for setting up the page, and suggesting the communitiy help develop it - excellent! --Aerik 17:41, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Hey, the philosophy wikibook is listed as 'struggling'. Are there any people out there who want to struggle with me on this one? At the moment we need authors who know what they are talking about, but hopefully soon we will need intelligent neophytes to assess how useful the work is. I'm working on the logic section mainly. This could even develop into an into an independent wikibook in its own right. We could end up having a whole shelf of wikibooks on philosophy, but perhaps that is a few years off yet. How do we get philosophy promoted from 'struggling' to the next category, whatever that is? --publunch 10:35, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Languages list
--Circeus 01:34, 13 Dec 2004 (UTC)

In the classic skin, the languages for the main page appears at the top, so the actual content of the main page begins 8 lines later than I believe it should. If you take a look at Wikipedia's main page, you can see that they have a great solution there, with the "other languages" section at the bottom. In addition, this allows for users to see how many pages that encyclopedia has. Personally, I see only advantages- so why not set it up like they have there? -[[User:Frazzydee|Frazzydee|✍]] 01:47, 10 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Addisionally, the link to the Norwegian (norsk/no) version is wrong. I don't know how to fix this!
 * You sure it's wrong? Works for me... -[[User:Frazzydee|Frazzydee|✍]] 00:47, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)

How about listing languages by area? Or by Classification? --Circeus 02:30, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * Most people don't know anything about the classification (Italian is under Italic -> Romance -> Italo-Western -> Italo-Dalmation) but perhaps areas would be good (Western Europe, Eastern Europe, South America, etc). r3m0t (cont) (talk) 07:34, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * I was thinking general family grouping. say listing the romance language togethers, the slavic togethers, etc.--Circeus 01:34, 13 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Wikibooks Featured on Main Page
Nobody will deny that there is an unsightly mess of a large number of Wikibooks (most of which probably don't even qualify for a 25% rating. I propose that the main page be locked like on Wikipedia so that only those who have power granted to them can add Wikibooks to the front page (ie. When the book has enough content to be worth mentioning it is advertised on the Main Page). Some of the worst examples of empty wikibooks that are listed on the front page:

 * Environmental Science
 * Greek
 * Piano
 * Greek
 * Piano
 * Piano

And... Selected Wikibooks
The selected wikibooks is a great idea. But I feel that it takes up far too much room. There is a huge amount of space wasted to the left and to the right of the selected wikibooks.

Also, when I first joined Wikibooks there was one or two wikibook in each category of the selected wikibooks. I count up to nine now. Now that is excessive. Perhaps there should be some kind of waiting list to be added to the new & struggling; and the books on it are changed on a month, week or even daily basis. --Boit 00:15, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * Well, I pruned stuff which wasn't very new any more. Theoretically we could get stuff off the "Struggling" section by actually helping those books. r3m0t (cont) (talk) 08:50, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * That's a good idea, in theory however not everyone has the knowledge or understanding to be able to help. For example, Introduction to Philosophy - I wouldn't even know where to start. I have never even used Linux in my life so thereofre I wouldn't be able to help in Linux-Compendium either. The same goes for the rest of the struggling textbooks.

Languages on the Main Page
Why are there links to different languages in the community section on the main page? Aren't these a bit unnecessary. There are links down the LHS of the webpage anyway AND when you first visit Wikibooks you are presented with a huge list of different language versions.

 * Done. -- [[User:Mkn|Mkn (Talk)]] 21:01, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Oh no not another suggestion!
Sorry, I seem to be posting the hell out of the talk page, but something else has bugged me from trying to browse the main page. There is so much wasted space around the Selected wikibooks area. Why can't we make a (perhaps red) cell in the table, put it above the community section which would mean there is more space for the huge number of bookshelves.

 * Today I just found out about Main Page/test started by User:Perl. I've been trying to edit it to resemble Wikipedia. What does everyone think about this layout?
 * Also the main problem is there's too many wikibooks now. So for the Main Page/test page, I removed the listing and replaced it with the Template:Bookshelves bar just under the welcome text. And just under this template I added a Template:Bookshelves (all) link which leads to a page displaying all the wikibooks in their bookshelves (in other words, moved all bookshelves templates from the current Main Page to a separate page). -- [[User:Mkn|Mkn (Talk)]] 02:04, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * On Firefox for Windows XP the tables are not displayed correctly at all. Under IE, the test page renders fine (though I feel it's too crammed, aesthetically). However, since the page does not display properly I've reverted it instead of first discussing my aesthetic objections.

 * In the following, let X be the green table and Y the "selected wikibooks" table. Properly displayed (as in IE) it would appear as: XY. Under Mozilla Firefox it looks like this:

X_ _Y

Where _ is just blank.

 * Perhaps we shouldn't redirect the main page (or radically change the layout) at all until more people have seen it (and testing has been performed on Mozilla by the designer). --MShonle 09:34, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Graded Readers
It would be really nice if there were a graded readers section where kind members might consider rewriting short stories and great works of a fiction and non fiction using Enlgish that learners might be able to cope with (at various levels perhaps). Or is there such an attempt going on already?--Timtak 09:16, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)

no-table version
I've put together what I think is a close facimile of the main page without any tables at. Please check it out, to see if it works on your browser and system. Gentgeen 14:54, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * It looks fine. Great job :) -- [[User:Mkn|Mkn (Talk)]] 14:17, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)

ok, I'm going to move it to Main Page (table free). Gentgeen 01:58, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Main page locked
Somebody locked the main page just yesterday or a few days ago. I don't see any post announcing or explaining this procedure. I think the main page still needs to be changed and is less than optimal (e.g. The first paragraph is almost repeated in the "About Wikibooks" box - what a waste of space! I thought about changing this, but now I can not without admin rights. Where can I apply for temporary admin so that I can change the main page? --Andreas Ipp 08:54, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Sorry for not discussing it, but I locked the main page after it became a target for vandalism, due to a current VfD debate. Once that is over, and our bruised ego friend goes away, then the page can be unblocked. Gentgeen 09:03, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Follow up, I've protected the main page again, but this time it is only protected from page moves. Gentgeen 06:37, 27 Jan 2005 (UTC)

"Study help desk" links wrongly
The link on the left bar, "Study help desk", links to Current events (which by itself is a redirect to Bulletin board), instead of linking to the existing Study help desk. Either change the name or change the link. I'd prefer a link to a Wikibook community page, whichever this might be. (Wikiversity seems like a project on its own, and doesn't give much help on Wikibooks which is for all age and knowledge levels, not just University related - see e.g. Wikijunior as part of Wikibooks, but not of Wikiversity..). I'd prefer "Wikibook community" or just "Community portal", since this would give a familiar look across the wikis. (Study help desk seems related to studying problems, and not problems related to working at Wikibooks). --Andreas Ipp 09:09, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

title: Talk:Main Page/Archive 1


text:
Cookbook:Lady Finger

Lady finger is an ambiguous term that can mean:

 * Okra, a green vegetable from Africa.
 * Savoiardi, a kind of small sponge cake cookie from Italy.
 * In North America, "ladyfinger" typically refers to a more modernized, smaller, thinner cookie than the traditional savoiardi, from which its name is taken; the two are often used interchangeably, but are completely different in flavour and texture, with the newer more closely resembling uncoated chocolate fingers.
 * The "lady finger" cocktail.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Cookbook:Lady Finger


text:
File:Sig effect both.GIF

/Images

title: File:Sig effect both.GIF


text:
File:Sign maineffect no interaction.GIF

/Images

title: File:Sign maineffect no interaction.GIF


text:
File:Sig fact b not a.gif

/Images

title: File:Sig fact b not a.gif


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Category:Subject:Board games

cy:Categori:Gemau bwrdd he:קטגוריה:משחקי לוח ko:분류:보드 게임 th:หมวดหมู่:เกมกระดาน

title: Category:Subject:Board games


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Category:Subject:Games

ca:Categoria:Jocs cs:Kategorie:Hry es:Categoría:Juegos fr:Catégorie:Jeu hy:Կատեգորիա:Խաղեր it:Categoria:Giochi oc:Categoria:Jòc

title: Category:Subject:Games


text:
Cookbook:Vegemite Sandwich

| Australian Cuisine | New Zealander Cuisine | Sandwiches

The Vegemite sandwich is a simple dish, known to frequent the lunchboxes of school children and the plates of casual breakfasters alike. The lunchbox variety often involves two slices of bread, whereas the breakfast variety usually only involves one, and is often toasted. Margarine may be used as a replacement for the butter.

Ingredients

 * 2 slices bread
 * Butter
 * Vegemite
 * Sliced cheese (optional)
 * Sliced onion (optional)

Procedure

 * 1) Toast the bread slices.
 * 2) Spread butter thickly and evenly on bread.
 * 3) Spread Vegemite a little less thickly, and evenly on bread.
 * 4) Add cheese and onion.

Notes, tips and variations

 * Add avocado for an avocado and Vegemite sandwich.
 * Another variation is to not use butter during the creation and have just the Vegemite and bread.
 * Yet another variation is to spread Vegemite and then place sliced onions and a slice of cheese on toast and then place under a broiler or toaster to melt the cheese.
 * Some consumers assert that white sliced bread will give a superior result.
 * Staples of school lunches, particularly from the Tuck Shop or school canteen, are Vegemite and Lettuce and Vegemite and Cheese Sandwiches. In each case, it's simply a standard Vegemite Sandwich with an additional ingredient added.
 * Try to add ham and cheese as another idea, makes a very nice sandwich.
 * Vegemite on toast is a favourite breakfast food.
 * The reason why some people might search this up is due to the song "Down Under" by Men at Work which briefly mentions it.

title: Cookbook:Vegemite Sandwich


text:
Van Dwelling/Bathroom

Composting toilets
Composting Toilet are a great option for mobile toilets if budget permits. There are compact models made for mobile use, however a blackwater tank is required for excess urine, which can be emptied at any sani-dump station.

Sawdust toilet
Several plans exist on the internet for making a toilet out of a 5 gallon pail.

Other toilets

 * Cassette toilet
 * RV toilet/blackwater system

Alternative methods
Newspaper/garbage bags

Kitty Litter - Buy litter that comes in its own bucket. Use the kitty shovel to form a depression in the litter so your contribution doesn't touch the side walls of the bucket. Make your contribution. Use your kitty shovel (or an inside out zip lock style baggy over our hand like a glove)to cover it up. Either immediately lift it out or let it set up a bit. Remove it from the kitty litter bucket with your kitty shovel or inside out zip lock style baggy worn like a glove over your hand. Zip close the baggy and deposit it in a dumpster. Drive with the lid closed on the bucket and placed so sudden stops won't tip it over.

The simplest method is to lay out some newspapers. After defecating, wrap it in newspaper, then tie it up in a grocery bag. Dispose of it in the nearest garbage can or dumpster.

Newspaper method #2, wrap in newspaper with sawdust (to absorb moisture) and a handful of soil, store outside where it can dry up w/o smelling, turns into a humanure compost burrito, yum!

Re-closable jug such as water or milk. Ladies use a funnel which is rinsed clean with water before storing.

Toilets on the road
Portapotty

Gas station/fast food joints - Good for going to the bathroom, though frequently unclean and smelly

Grocery stores

title: Van Dwelling/Bathroom


text:
User talk:139.18.191.12

Vegemite sandwich... one or two slices of bread? Toasted? Please elaborate. If it's 1-sided and margarine would be OK, we have a picture on the New Zealand page.

title: User talk:139.18.191.12


text:
Rich Internet Applications for SLA Research/Overview

= Overview of Rich Internet Applications =

According to the Wikipedia entry "Rich Internet Application,"

Rich Internet Applications (RIA) are a cross between web applications and traditional desktop applications, transfering some of the processing to the client end.

Macromedia, the software company which makes, among other programs, Flash and Dreamweaver, is credited with introducing this term in a 2002 whitepaper.

RIAs represent a set of technologies that SLA researchers can use to create on-line environments. This section of the RIA Wikibook will present a specific set of technologies which may be used for research into individual, pair, and group second language acquisition.

Flash MX 2004
Flash MX 2004 (hereafter, "Flash") is an authoring program which allows users to create applications (often called "movies" in the Flash literature) with varied user interfaces (UI), featuring still and animated graphics as well as audio elements. It features drawing tools (e.g. lines, boxes, ovals, shading, paint brushes), an animation timeline, and a programming language, ActionScript (version 2.0), which is based on the proposed standard for version 1.5 of Javascript. Applications authored with Flash are exported as Shockwave files (with .swf extension), which may then be run by the Flash Player plug-in or a stand-alone player.

GUI resources include...
 * text fields (both plain text and HTML)
 * buttons
 * movie clips
 * audio and video display and capture objects
 * custom mouse pointers
 * pull-down menus

Example GUI Designs
Text Chat: A collaborative application (see discussion of Flash Communication Server) may be easily authored using a multi-line text field (for display of the transcript), a single-line text field (for entry of messages), and a button (for sending a new message entered in the single-line text field).

Total Physical Response (TPR) Tasks: A solitary activity might use a collection of so-called "drag-and-drop" movie clips as items to be manipulated in response to text and/or audio prompts. Feedback would be provided when each item is moved to the proper location. For example, a learner might hear "Place the table to the left of the chair." Placing the table anywhere except to the left of the chair would result in the application informing the user that the table had been misplaced.

Asynchronous Audio/Video Electronic mail: Flash's audio and/or video capturing functions make it possible for learners to save their speech for later listening and viewing by others (i.e., partners or researchers).

Flash Communication Server
Flash Communication Server 1.5 (hereafter, "FlashComm") provides real-time audio, video, and data exchange between connected applications running in the Flash Player plug-in from Macromedia. FlashComm servers may also interact with other FlashComm or web servers (e.g., the Apache server) in order to access dynamically generated data via a scripting language such as PHP, Perl, or ColdFusion. Such interaction is frequently used to retrieve, add, or update information to a database (e.g., MySQL or PostgreSQL). Though this scripting and database interaction is also available to SWF files running in the Flash Player, routing the interactions through FlashComm may be preferable when the results of each interaction should update all clients or when extra layers of security are desired.

PHP
One of the possible readings of "P" in the common acronym "LAMP" (the first three letters standing for "Linux," "Apache," and "MySQL"), PHP is a scripting language that features a broad variety of capabilities such as text searching, database connections, file management, and HTML form processing (via CGI). In general, the LAMP suite of software is popular because it is free for anyone wishing to set up their own web hosting, and it allows web hosting companies to offer very cheap (under six U.S. dollars per month) web hosting. As noted in in the Wikipedia entry for the LAMP acronym, "Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia, runs software that can be characterized as a LAMP application. Wikipedia's MediaWiki software is developed primarily under Linux, using the Apache HTTP Server, with its content being stored in a MySQL database, and the program logic being implemented in PHP."

AMFPHP
One particular technology built with PHP, AMFPHP (available for free at http://www.amfphp.org), is especially useful for RIA-enabled research. This collection of scripts decodes and encodes Macromedia's Action Message Format (AMF), a data format that allows for the exchange of almost every type of data object defined in ActionScript such as numeric and string variables as well as custom objects. In contrast to extensible markup language (XML), also used to exchange a wide variety of data types, AMF is designed so that information may be transmitted quickly. An immediate benefit of this format is the time saved by not having to program conversions of the applications data into XML for transmission as well as conversion of XML from a server back into an application's data structures.

One of the most important reasons for using an implementation of AMF is the availability of AMF-compatible scripts libraries for the free scripting languages Perl and Python (the other possible readings of the "P" in the LAMP acronym) in addition to the native support for the format in Macromedia's proprietary ColdFusion scripting language. This almost guarantees that the particular model in which an RIA is deployed may be changed (e.g., using Perl and PostgreSQL instead of PHP and MySQL) with minimal alteration of the Flash and/or FlashComm code.

MySQL
A free (for non-commercial use) database server, MySQL (or any other database) is primarily responsible for making Internet applications rich. The long-term, centralized, and rapidly searchable storage provided by a database enables an application to minimize, if not completely eliminate, the data it must contain within itself each time it is loaded. Once loaded and running in the Flash Player, for example, an application can request only those data sets which are needed at a given point in a user's interactions with the system. Free web-based utility applications such as PhpMyAdmin, installed with most scripting- and database-enabled hosting services, make modifying, archiving, and moving database entries easy for most moderately skilled users, thereby insuring data integrity and security.

Use of These Technologies
Because PHP communicates easily with Flash Player applications and with FlashComm via multiple connection methods (e.g., AMFPHP), these connections allow PHP to return information retrieved from a database (e.g., MySQL). This functionality may be used for a variety of SLA research purposes such as...
 * presenting pre-prepared texts to users
 * logging user behavior (e.g., quiz results or text from chat sessions)
 * tracking user behavior over time
 * matching users by common interests, languages, skill levels, etc.

Resources and Further Reading

 * Wikibook: PHP Programming
 * Wikibook: PHP and MySQL Programming
 * Wikibook: Using PHPEclipse to install Apache, MySQL, and PHP
 * http://www.php.org - Homepage for PHP
 * http://www.mysql.com/ - Homepage for MySQL
 * ISBN 0-596-00504-0 - Programming Flash Communication Server, by Lesser et al. (accompanying website: http://www.flash-communications.net)
 * http://www.macromedia.com/software/flashcom/ - Macromedia's main page for FlashComm; features free developer's edition of FlashComm and documentation (HTML and Adobe Acrobat format)
 * http://www.macromedia.com/software/flash/ - Macromedia's main page for Flash MX 2004; features trial edition (30 days) of Flash MX 2004 and documentation (HTML and Adobe Acrobat format)
 * http://www.sephiroth.it - Useful source of information covering Flash Player and FlashComm applications that utilize AMFPHP and MySQL; features code for working examples of Flash and FlashComm connectivity
 * http://www.amfphp.org - Homepage for AMFPHP open-source project; features code for working example of Flash connectivity
 * http://sourceforge.net/projects/amfphp/ - Sourceforge project page for AMFPHP
 * http://simonf.com/flap/ - AMF::Perl, Flash Remoting in Perl and Python project
 * http://sourceforge.net/projects/openamf/ - Java port of AMFPHP


text:
Rich Internet Applications for SLA Research/Required Foreknowledge

This section of this book presumes familiarity with the technologies laid out in the Overview.

= Necessary Skills and Knowledge = In general, researchers wishing to build RIAs for their research should be enthusiastic amateurs. Among the most important skills required in order to understand, use, and modify the following sample applications are...
 * familiarity with the Flash MX 2004 authoring environment and with the ActionScript programming language
 * access to and familiarity with a Flash Communication Server (FlashComm), including the documentation included with a FlashComm installation (see Resources, below)
 * access to and familiarity with a web hosting service that includes PHP and MySQL; a hosting service that includes the PhpMyAdmin web interface for MySQL management is optimal
 * intermediate knowledge of PHP scripting (view Wikibook), including MySQL-related functions (view Wikibook)
 * intermediate knowledge of general database design
 * experience using a file-transfer protocol (FTP) program

= Resources =

Flash MX 2004
A trial version of Flash MX 2004, including tutorial and documentation, may be downloaded from http://www.macromedia.com/software/flash/.

Flash Communication Server
The FlashComm Documentation page (http://www.macromedia.com/support/documentation/en/flashcom/) includes the following essential documents (HTML and Adobe Acrobat format):
 * Developing Communication Applications
 * Client-Side Communication ActionScript Dictionary
 * Server-Side Communication ActionScript Dictionary

PHP
There is a PHP Wikibook. In addition, the main page for PHP development and related links, such as tutorials, is http://www.php.net.

MySQL
The PHP Wikibook covers PHP-MySQL interaction. The main page for the MySQL corporation is http://www.mysql.com/; the main page for developers is http://dev.mysql.com, and the main page for phpMyAdmin is http://www.phpmyadmin.net/.


title: User:Dannya222


text:
Serial Programming/Windows TAPI

Also see Telephony Application Programming Interface.

title: Serial Programming/Windows TAPI


text:
Talk:Puzzles/Escaping from Prison/Solution

This really does not seem like latteral thinking to me, but just... silliness that does not depend on puzzle ability
 * This puzzle is based on the fact that many English words sound the same but have many different meanings. Therefore you have to think laterally about the words.


text: Template:Print version notice

title: Template:Print version notice


text:
How To Assemble A Desktop PC/Printable version

= Contents = If this is a digital file, click on a link to go to that section.

 * Noted contributors · External links

 * 1)  Choosing the parts
 * 2)  Assembly
 * 3)  Software
 * 4)  Overclocking
 * 5)  Silencing
 * 6)  Conclusion

= Preface = Building a computer can be a very rewarding experience. Since you’re reading this, you’re probably thinking about building your next computer instead of buying one pre-built. This is a very viable option these days and can bring many benefits; you can learn a lot about computer hardware by building one, you get a totally personalized computer, you can choose better components and you may be able to save some money and have fun. Additionally, if you are the sort of person who wants to understand how things work, if you take broken stuff apart just to see how it all fits together, if you have a drawer somewhere full of “parts” you think may come in handy someday, then you just may be in the right place.

= Choosing the parts =

= Assembly =

= Software =

= Overclocking =

= Silencing =

= Conclusion =

= Appendices =

= Noted contributors =

= External links =


text:
User talk:Niallj

Incomplete edit
No worries - had to guess if it was right tho - all the best -- Herby  talk thyme 17:24, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

And Welcome
Hello and welcome to Wikibooks!

Here are some tips to help you get started:
 * You can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using four tildes, like this: ~~~~.
 * Remember to conduct any editing experiments in the sandbox.
 * If you're a Wikipedian, see Wikibooks for Wikipedians for a primer on how things work here (it's a little different).
 * If you want to base your work here on materials from Wikipedia, please use WB:RFI to bring the material over in compliance with the GFDL.
 * If you're an instructor and plan on using wikibooks for a class project, see Guidelines for class projects
 * Please say hello at the Staff Lounge with any questions or ideas.
 * Eventually, you might want to read the Manual of Style and Policies and Guidelines.
 * Please take a look at Naming policy before starting a new book.
 * Remember to maintain a Neutral point of view.
 * Explore, be bold in editing pages, and have fun!

You will find more resources in Community Portal. If you want to ask a question, visit the Study help desk, the Staff lounge, IRC channel or ask me personally on my talk page.

Good luck! -- Herby talk thyme 17:25, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Wikibooks Newsletter, Volume 1
(Wikibooks gazette home | Discuss | Bulletin board | Subscription list)

This is a short newsletter that is being distributed to all active wikibookians. You are getting this message because you are recognized as an established contributor to the project. This newsletter will be distributed on a regular basis to help share news, information, and tips. It comes from a bot account, User:The Staff. User:The Staff is currently operated by a team of wikibooks admins, the complete list of which is available on the user page of the bot. If you would like to not receive this newletter anymore, please remove your name from the list at Active wikibookians.

The work you do at Wikibooks is greatly appreciated. However there are plenty of other opportunities for you to get involved and help us to create a thriving Wikibooks community. We are sure that there are things we can do to help you and your understanding of Wikibooks and similarly there are certainly things you could do to help Wikibooks become a better place.

We would like to ask all wikibookians to add the Bulletin Board to your watchlists. The Bulletin Board is a fast and easy way for wikibookians to communicate important news and events to the entire community. If you have important news to share with the community, you can feel free to add your own entry to that page.

If you have general questions or comments about Wikibooks, you are welcome to post a message on The Staff Lounge, a free discussion area. Your input would also be welcomed in the Votes for Deletion and Requests for Adminship discussion pages. These pages are all active discussion areas that help to shape the Wikibooks community as a whole.

Sometimes it is easy to forget that the Wikibooks community is much larger and more diverse then the people who work in a single book, or on a single bookshelf. Hopefully, together we can all make Wikibooks a better place, and a more valuable educational resource.

The Staff 04:17, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

title: User talk:Niallj


text:
Cookbook talk:Tomato

Described green tomatoes as firm instead of hard, but have now decided that unyielding would be a better word to use. (Donovan|Geocachernemesis|Interact) 12:28, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Eh, OK. I guess I can see that somebody might think "hard" means like a coconut shell. Maybe "as hard as a lemon" would be better? Tomatos should be kept somewhat cool in storage. Intense cooking heat was covered by the following sentence; I don't imagine that anyone would be tempted to use intense heat for storage. BTW, given your comments on my talk page against changing spelling, I find it interesting that you changed the spelling of flavor. AlbertCahalan 16:33, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Okay, but you would want to discourage people storing them on a sunny window sill, for example. I've changes it to a cool room temperature. As I've rewritten almost all of the first paragraph, I just went with what my spell checker suggested (but not in the next paragraph). (Donovan|Geocachernemesis|Interact) 01:50, 5 May 2005 (UTC)

title: Cookbook talk:Tomato


text:
User talk:62.165.34.130

Please stop. If you continue to use Wikibooks for advertising, you will be temporarily blocked from editing.

title: User talk:62.165.34.130


text:
Talk:US History/Ford Carter Reagan

the w.bush adminstration is the most un-american, ethnocentric, hypocritical, and unjust grabastic bunch of lunatics and selfish, unrealistic, blind, ideological peons in this great country's history

if this is not blatantly and hideously obvious to you, you are either not well educated or are a psycho conservative prick pretending to be patriotic yet supporting bad people for illogical reasons

Why have you posted a commentary on George W. Bush's administration on the Ford-Carter-Reagan page?

---

This book is the perfect example why it is difficult to take the English Wikipedia/Wikibooks seriously. If you want good, objective information, instead of Thatcher/Reagan/Ann Ryan anti-intellectual nonsense, go to the German Wikipedia/Wikibooks.

title: Talk:US History/Ford Carter Reagan


text:
Ada Programming/Pragmas/Atomic

pragma Atomic (local_name);

Description
Atomic is a representation pragma that can be used with types and variables to specify that the code generated must read and write the type or variable from memory atomically, i.e. as a single/non-interruptible operation. It implies pragma Volatile, the difference is that pragma Atomic is stronger: the compilation must fail if the variable cannot be updated atomically.

This is typically used in the context of interfacing with hardware registers, which must be written atomically and where the compiler must not reorder or suppress any redundant read or write. In some cases it can also be used for tasking, but for communication of Ada tasks it is safer to use protected types or other synchronization primitives.

Example
Device_Status : Status_Register; (Device_Status); Device_Status' .To_Address (16#8010_FF74#);

Compilers
Atomic is a standard pragma since Ada 95, defined in the Systems Programming Annex (Annex C). This is a specialized needs annex, therefore this pragma is not available in those compilers not implementing that annex.

Ada versions

 * Available in Ada 95 and Ada 2005.
 * In Ada 83 pragma Shared produces similar effects than pragma Atomic (but it is obsolescent since Ada 95).

Platforms
Atomic is a portability aid between different platforms. For example, when porting between a 64-bit to a 32-bit architecture, the compiler will detect portability problems thanks to this pragma.

Interfacing
The effects of pragma Atomic can be achieved in C using the type volatile sig_atomic_t, defined in signal.h (called volatile std::sig_atomic_t in C++). It is worth noting that the only values that can be portably stored in this type are 0–127, whereas the Ada pragma doesn't impose any specific limit (other than the type of the atomic object).

However, this C type is rarely known by programmers. Therefore, the C volatile qualifier is the approach widely used both for volatile and atomic data, even if atomic access in required. Thus, when interfacing with existing C code, the programmer must first read the code to understand whether the data needs atomic load and stores or not. If needed, the data should be marked in the Ada side with pragma Atomic or Atomic_Components. Otherwise, pragma Volatile or Volatile_Components should be added instead.

C++11 and C11 incorporated atomic operations and types, but differ from the semantics in Ada and are not compatible.

Wikibook

 * Ada Programming
 * Ada Programming/Pragmas
 * Ada Programming/Pragmas/Volatile
 * Ada Programming/Pragmas/Atomic Components
 * Ada Programming/Pragmas/Volatile Components
 * Ada Programming/Pragmas/Shared (obsolescent)

title: Ada Programming/Pragmas/Atomic


text:
User:Bobbyandck

Hello,

I am a swiss guy who is in his 1st year studying Economics & International Relations in the University of St Andrews, Scotland

About Me
I love sports, Sailing in particular, Golf, Running and Mounaineering is also cool

I love to do non-mainstream things (camping in the snow, biking down a mountain through footpaths, sailing for 8 months, swimming in the north sea when it is snowing ...)

Political Views:
Moderate

Interests:
Sports, Adventure, Travel, ... and Stamps collecting

Music
Hoobastank, Korn, Rammstein, Lagwagon, Pennywise, Goliath

Books
The Godfather, Omertà, The DaVinci Code

Movies
Gangs of New York, The Godfather, Asterix et Obelix

Quotes
I don't want my home to be walled in and my windows stuffed. I want the culture of all lands to blow about my house freely, but I refuse to be blown off my feet. (Gandhi)

Yes, I am a criminal. My crime is that of curiosity. My crime is that of judging people by what they say and think, not what they look like. My crime is that of outsmarting you, something that you will never forgive me for. (The Mentor)

Mens sana in corpore sano (A Healthy Mind in a Healthy Body)

Websites
I have a blog at : Blog My main website is the following: Home Page I have mainly pictures there, the older website with pictures is Webshots

Here are a few of my favourite websites:
 * Global Issues - (NC)
 * Indy Media - News - This one is very alternative, so expect some non mainstream ideas and news
 * OpenDemocracy - Discussions about different issues
 * Theyr.net - Precise and explicit weather forecast

Contributions
My current contributions are mainly the Kennedy clan and the wikibooks:Open Culture

title: User:Bobbyandck


text:
Research Methods/Mixed-model Design

Introduction
The mixed-model design gets its name because there are two types of variable, a between-subjects variable and a within-subjects variable.

Example 1:
An investigator is interested in the extent to which children are attentive to violent acts on television. An experiment is run with a sample of children: half boys and half girls. Each child views six scenes differing with respect to the level of violence. The dependent variable is a measure of attention during presentation of the scene.

The basic research question in this research scenario is the relationship between children’s attention to violent acts and the level of violence. A reasonable expectation is that children might be more attentive to scenes with a high level of violence. However, this relationship may depend on the gender. We might expect a stronger relationship between attention and level of violence for boys than for girls. To test these hypotheses, a mixed-model design is used: The dependent variable is ‘attention’.

There are two independent variables: the level of violence (factor A), and gender (factor B). Each participant views six scenes differing with respect to the level of violence. Therefore, level of violence (factor A) is a within-subjects variable.

There are two groups of participants: boys and girls. They are independent with each other. Therefore, gender (factor B) is a between-subjects variable.

If the relationship between one factor and the dependent variable depends on the other factor, or is at a different level of the other factor, we say there is a interaction between the two factor (A*B). If we graphically plot the relationship, we will find that the lines are not parallel and interact.

Therefore, just like in two-way ANOVA, we test three effects: the effects due to the within-subjects variable, the effects due to the between-subjects variable, and the interaction between the two factors. A hypothetical result of the research example is shown in the following figure:

As indicated in the figure, there is a main effect due to factor A (Levels of violence). Increasing level of violence results in the increase of attention. There might be a main effect of factor B (Gender). Overall, boys are more attractive to the violent acts. There is a clear interaction between the two factors.

Example 2:
To compare three teaching methods, an experiment was conducted in which one group was taught probability by a standard instructional method (A1), a second group was given additional problems (A2), and a third group received additional problems from a computer that provided immediate feedback (A3). It is expected that the new teaching method (e.g., A3) will be more effective than the traditional teaching method (e.g., A1). However, people might ask the question about how long the comparative advantage of the new teaching method will last. It might be possible that at the beginning the new teaching method is better than the traditional one. But as time pass by, the new teaching method may lose its comparative advantage. Therefore, the effects of the three teaching methods are compared in multiple occasions. In this study, all three groups were tested at the end of the instructional period, and then once every 2 weeks until four different tests had been given. The following table presents a data set for this hypothetical experiment. Assume that the tests were equated for difficulty so that any differences could be attributed to the passage of time. This design permits us to compare the instructional methods (A) and also to see the time course (B) following the end of instruction for each method.

Data analysis using SPSS
1. The data structure

There must be one variable to define the between-subjects variable.

2.ANOVA analysis

To conduct the ANOVA analysis, click ‘Analyze’---‘General Linear Model’---‘Repeated Measures’. In the window titled ‘Repeated Measures Defin..’, give the within-subject factor a name by typing in “Time”. Tell SPSS how many levels the within-subject factor has. In our case, we have 4 levels (B1, B2, B3, and B4). Therefore, in the box right to ‘Number of Levels’, type in “4”. Click ‘Add’, you will see ‘time(4)’ appears in the box. This tells you that the within-subject factor is named as “time” and it has 4 levels. Click ‘Define’.

In the window titled ‘Repeated Measures’, you will see a box under ‘Within-Subjects Variables’. This is where you define the levels of the within-subjects variable. Highlight ‘b1’ and click the black arrow to move to the right box. You will see that the SPSS defined ‘b1’ as the first level of the within-subjects variable ‘time’. Highlight ‘b2’ and click the black arrow to move to the right box. You will see that the SPSS defined ‘b2’ as the second level of the within-subjects variable ‘time’. Continue this until all the levels are defined.

In the left box, highlight the between-subjects variable ‘teaching’, click the black arrow and move to the box under ‘Between-Subjects Factor(s):’. To ask SPSS to calculate the means or other descriptive statistics, click ‘Options’. In the window titled ‘Repeated Measures: Options’, highlight all the factors in the upleft box and move to the box under ‘Display Means for:’. Click ‘Continue’. (The means for the overall sample, for each teaching method, for each time series, and for each combination of teaching method and time series will be calculated.)

To plots the trends by teaching methods, click ‘Plots’. In the window titled ‘Repeated Measures: Profile Plots’, in the box under ‘Factors’ highlight the within-subjects variable ‘time’ and move to the box under ‘Horizontal Axis’. Highlight the between-subjects variable ‘teaching’ and move to the box under ‘Separate Lines’. Click ‘Add’. You will see that ‘time*teaching’ appears in the bottom box. Click ‘Continue’.

Finally, click ‘OK’.

title: Research Methods/Mixed-model Design


text:
File:Mixed model 1.gif

Licensing
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File:Mixed model 2.gif

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File:Mixed model 3.gif

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File:Mixed model 4.gif

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File:Mixed model 5.gif

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File:Mixed model 6.gif

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File:Mixed model 7.gif

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File:Mixed model 8.gif

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File:Mixed model 9.gif

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Cookbook talk:Poutine

What, and when I said Atlantic provinces New Brunswick didn't count as one? Yeesh. - Nmontague 16:52, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

I was going to move this to Cookbook:Poutine but noticed that there was already a redirect from there to here. What gives? Is this something that is specifically lowercased? If so, why? Kellen 00:45, 18 Jun 2005 (UTC)

title: Cookbook talk:Poutine


text:
User talk:Tetraminoe

Hi, I've updated my user profile, thank you for your help Bobbyandck 17:55, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

title: User talk:Tetraminoe


text:
Cookbook:Tamarillo

The tamarillo or tree tomato is related to the tomato and tomatillo. It is egg-shaped and pointed at both ends. The skin is tough and bitter and may be red, purple, amber, or golden yellow in color. The outer layer of apricot-colored flesh is slightly firm and the inside is filled with dark edible seeds that are slightly harder than those of a tomato. The flesh is tangy and tart, but flavorful. Tamarillos are native to South America, but most tamarillos sold in the United States are imported from New Zealand. This fruit is popular in South and Central America, the Caribbean, parts of Asia, and Australia.

Selection
Select fruit that is firm, unblemished and is heavy for its size. When ripe, tamarillos should be fragrant and should yield slightly to gentle pressure. Tamarillos are available from May to October in specialty stores and some supermarkets. They can occasionally be found out of season.

Storage
Tamarillos may be ripened at room temperature, then stored in the refrigerator or eaten once they are ripe. They last up to ten days in the refrigerator if wrapped in a plastic. Tamarillos may also be frozen if they are peeled and wrapped individually.

Preparation
Tamarillos should be peeled before eating or cooking. Blanching in boiling water for 2 to 3 minutes is often the easiest way to remove the skin if the fruit is not ripe. They are often eaten raw, when ripe. Dip in frozen orange juice concentrate to sweeten the fruit and add to fruit or vegetable salads. Tamarillos are also often made into jams, chutneys and relishes.

title: Cookbook:Tamarillo