text:
Wikinews:Deletion requests/Archives/2008/Q4

This is the archive of Deletion Requests that were closed from October 1, 2008 through December 31, 2008.

Template:Terrorism
Unused template that was part of some concerted effort by former users to push on articles pertaining to terrorism to make it more "NPOV." Widely defeated by consenus in Water cooler. --TUFKAAP (talk) 16:30, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * as nom. --TUFKAAP (talk) 16:30, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * useless. If the term "terrorism" is being used in violation of WN:NPOV in an article, the article should be changed, not just labeled with this silly tag. --SVTCobra 22:09, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Cirt (talk) 22:24, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * God, I remember this bullshit. --Brian McNeil / talk 22:45, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I really thought we got rid of this a long time ago. DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 22:48, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * as per SVTCobra's comments. Gopher65talk 13:14, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

YouTube experiments with HD videos
It's stale. --TUFKAAP (talk) 15:27, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * as nom. --TUFKAAP (talk) 15:27, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * - Any way to find newer sources on this, update/expand it into a piece with some more recent info and rescue it? If not, then I am not opposed to [[Image:Symbol delete vote.svg|15px]] delete. Cirt (talk) 17:24, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree. I find this an interesting story, and I'd like to see it published if there is any way it could be reasonable be saved. Gopher65talk 21:21, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

 * for now: what, specifically, makes the article stale? Jade Knight (talk) 00:14, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Comments
I really dislike having the technical details in this article about how to access higher resolution content. This has put me off reviewing this as it seems like something for Slashdot, not Wikinews. --Brian McNeil / talk 17:22, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * hi, it's not completele about "hot to get the hd version". there are infos about that youtube finally do progress in their service. even if it's more technical, news is news. If that is a reason for not reviewing it, why not telling me that before and I would have spent some more time to get mor news worty facts. and by the way, this is no reason, this can be done with sports or arts or else. I dont agree, that there are not spaces here for more tech news, or we could even say, that sport news should be done on a sport related website. greets, --Andreas -horn- Hornig (talk) 18:24, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

Indian NE state of Nagaland now under President's rule.
I came across this article while archiving. It clearly does not meet the standards for publishing; it was self published. It is missing the date template so it never showed up on the front page. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 22:00, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * as nom. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 22:00, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom --SVTCobra 22:07, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
 * per . Cirt (talk) 22:16, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Le sigh... --TUFKAAP (talk) 15:21, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This was probably my first article on WN. Sorry for my mistakes as I was not aware of WN:MOS at that time. I have done copy editing now. Please review again. --Gppande (talk) 19:21, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
 * if no one objects to the changes Gppande made. Delete if objections to the minor (non-content) adjustments that s/he made to the article. Gopher65talk 23:48, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
 * As per gopher's comments. DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 00:02, 6 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Jade Knight (talk) 00:11, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Template:Archived protected
Unused. Template was used with old way of archiving, which is not in use anymore. No need to keep. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 22:53, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * as nom. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 22:53, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Cirt (talk) 15:37, 2 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Looks like a "1 day project" that never got off the ground. --SVTCobra 02:30, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom. --TUFKAAP (talk) 16:31, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Category:High-definition television
Encyclopedic category, will become irrelevant when HD TV is the norm. --Brian McNeil / talk 15:23, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Comments
Speedied by SVTCobra but recreated. --Brian McNeil / talk 15:23, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * hi, there are at least 4 more news here, which could be integrated there, but me, as a normal user, can't add new categories to them, because they are older news. and please tell me, when hdtv will be the norm? that will take some time, and then, where do you want to put sdtv topics, which will be coexisting for a long time. I don't vote here, becuase I'm new and I added it. I just added my point here. greets, --Andreas -horn- Hornig (talk) 10:25, 2 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Television will remain television, at least as far as Joe Public is concerned. The only time HDTV is going to be an issue is when you're buying a new TV set. As to YouTube, that's not television, they don't broadcast. To be really pedantic they do video on demand over the Internet. --Brian McNeil / talk 11:04, 2 December 2008 (UTC)
 * yep, but it doesn't solve a problem if one portal, eg. Televion, is stuffed with article nobody wants to search topics. so what's the non category option so list articles according to their content, which is also visible underneath the article? If I want to know more about one aspect of the news, I usually look in which category they are in and find more and more up to date news. so, if I just want to be more precise and want to accumulate all high-definition articles into such a "folder", what is the alternative? greets, --Andreas -horn- Hornig (talk) 11:51, 2 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Andreas, the article for which you created this category doesn't even fit under television, nevermind high-definition television. Your article was about YouTube and some sort of higher resolution videos at 1280x720, which do not (by any measure) approach high-definition television standards. --SVTCobra 02:44, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * as nom --Brian McNeil / talk 15:23, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * - Unless there are already 5 or so articles on this topic, Category:Television should do fine. Cirt (talk) 15:33, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom and my own previous speedy --SVTCobra 15:40, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * per Cirt. Jade Knight (talk) 21:26, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
 * DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 00:03, 6 December 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom, Cirt and SVTCobra. --TUFKAAP (talk) 16:33, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Archived articles protection list/June 2007
and

Archived articles protection list/May 2007
These subpages are lists of articles that have been archived, but not protected. While we need such a list, I suggest a more comprehensive one that doesn't discriminate based on date. However, the bigger problem is that these lists are malformed. As you can see, in some cases they replicate entire articles. Worse still (in my opinion), they show up in every category that the articles on the lists show up on. Before deleting, a new list should be created and linked to from WN:ARCHIVE and the project page Archived articles protection list should be marked Historical. --SVTCobra 00:03, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

Comments
It seems that PatrickFlaherty depopulated the May version (by protecting the articles) and then deleted it. --SVTCobra 17:33, 12 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, I'm halfway done with June. I removed all the ones I've done from the page already. I'll finish the rest when I get back in a few days. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 04:13, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

Votes
— Agreed Gopher65talk 00:43, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * - I agree with the above rationale by, just not sure of the best way to go about this. Cirt (talk) 00:34, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete for sure wastage of space. -- Danger^Mouse (talk) 11:45, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * if there is no other opposition. Jade Knight (talk) 09:45, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Due to something I can't quite figure out these are erroneously appearing in some categories. --Brian McNeil / talk 13:28, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * - these are pretty much useless. -- Sken   my talk 20:40, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

The Rosicrucian Fellowship announces its 13th International European Conference
Several editors have expressed concerns, both on the talk page and in tags to the article, that there are WN:COI issues, not news issues, and that the article is Written more like a press release than an NPOV news article. I think it is not appropriate for a news article on this site and should be deleted. Cirt (talk) 13:17, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Comments
Hi. All the previous raised concerns, WN:NPOV, WN:COI and Newswordiness were addressed at the news collaboration page in a variety of occasions. Deep re-editings to the news, including removing links and paragraphs that appearently were not consensual, were made from its initial version previous to the 1st review, in order to comply those concerns to its current version. I hereby suggest that, in spite of all editing efforts made by its author in a spirit of good will, the issue currently raised, tagged for deletion, is an irreflected act of personal bias (POV) from some review editor(s) that features suppression of news from the field of Religion, that is Religious intolerance, in this valuable Wikimedia project, in spite of the established revelance of the news of the mentioned near 100 years old Christian organization in the U.S. that has a international formal presence, membership and has endeavoured fraternal and humanitarian work worldwide throughout all the past 20th century and into this new 21st century. My humbly request is a rather inner one, philosophical if you wish, it is an appeal I make to all good hearted Wikinews editors and readers to support this constructive news article that intends no promotion but only to spread little good news of HOPE (the only gift of the gods left in Pandora's box) into the troubled world we currently dwell in. Blessed be. --Vilalva (talk) 14:06, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Let me put a simple question to you: are you willing to have an article written on your particular brand of Christianity linked with articles on Satanism, Scientology, and Islamic Terrorism? Cause those are all "religious" articles. Wikinews has a duty to be as unbiased as possible. With respect, I'd say that you don't desire to have articles espousing the awesomeness involved in converting from Christianity to Satanism. But that means that Wikinews can't have an extremely biased article espousing the views of Christianity either.

 * Now, if you want to do an interview... even a relatively softball interview (as many of our interviews are)... with one of the people involved, I'd be fine with that. But don't be ticked off when it ends up sitting beside an interview on Satanism. Religion is religion, and we can't favour one above another. Wikinews is not a pulpit to be used for brainwashing people in one direction or another. Gopher65talk 19:50, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

 * Dear editor Gopher65, the viewpoint you present, through your straightforward comment, deserve my respect as it is argumented-reasoned upon logic. However, being that same logic (devived from the Logos), that is, the grasp of Logic, currently as limited as the individuals who reason upon it, the deductions made are lacking of higher understanding regarding where Religion comes from (origin), what Is (function) and how It evolves... Also, the key to your comment -- and to the whole wide world -- has a name: Healing. Neverthless, the answer to the simple question of yours and, simultaneously, to the final outcome of the humble request for HOPE this little servant is bringing forth has already been taught unto us all: not my will, but Thine, be done.
 * --Vilalva (talk) 23:08, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Can you please learn to write concise comments that don't worship the deity you choose? --Brian McNeil / talk 23:11, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * Whether or not WN:COI can be proven, this article is the announcement of of a conference held by and for the Rosicrucian Fellowship, it is not a conference open to all. Therefore, it fails the "what is news" requirement that stories "reflect events that impact people and explain why their subject matter is important to readers who may be unfamiliar with the topic." This is better left for a fellowship newsletter, which incidentally is the sole source for the announcement. --SVTCobra 22:59, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * A little note in two parts; part #1: please keep in mind that althouth this news I am trying to get published may not have relevance to the usual reader, they can however have direct relevance to the specific audience, groups of individuals, that I have identified in the collaboration page, which being a restricted audience it nevertheless may count from a few thousands to a few millions of individuals (while potential interested readers); note too that the same happens to many news subjects published at the Wikinews [or any other media agency] from specific fields: politics, sports, technology, etc. news which may or may not [clearly] have a broader specific audience, it varies upon the news contents; however, in spite of being valuable news from a specific field, some or many of the times they have litte or even no direct interest-relevance to the usual reader.--Vilalva (talk) 18:22, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * A little note in two parts; part #2: As an example, let us look into the technology field, my professional field: imagine that the Open Source community announces that a software called "Baby4" (invented name as no promotion of any possible real software currently under development is intended) is being released in an announced date -- after many years of being under development -- and Wikinews, along with other media agencies, publishes a news, under that specific field of technology, with one of two sources from the related community saying that this new open source cross-platform Directory services software is expected to be released and with a brief paragraph of what this mentioned software contains. The usual reader usually only superficially acquainted with this field, will most probably say "What do I care?", that is, finds it not relevant. However, those from the field and most probably the news author-editor, knows that those news constitute news for hundred of thousands, eventually more, of sytems and network administrators worldwide (in ISPs, companies, schools, governments, universities, ...) that have been expecting for a long time ago for this kind of software to allow full compatibility in computer server-client networks running Windows and Unix/Linux operating systems, an open source software that is (hipotetically) known to have all it takes to re-shape the current domain of proprietary systems worldwide; to the usual reader, he does not know, but he and millions, if not more, will most probably be working (internet access, mobile communications, teaching platforms, etc.), only a few months or years later, upon an implementation of the same Directory Service "Baby4" that he was reading about in the news and that made him, due to being not so well acquainted with the field, profer the initial comment of "What do I care?" (not relevant). It is not easy to give a so clear picture as I intended due to my English language limitations, but still I hope this example, with hipotetical news from the technology field, is written clear enough. So, "I rest my case". ;) Best, --Vilalva (talk) 18:22, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * These superlengthy responses are not helpful. Re your part 2. That comparison doesn't work. The story in question is akin to the makers of "Baby4" calling a meeting for their employees. That is not news. --SVTCobra 07:48, 10 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Ah, but then, following your logic, how came these "calling a meeting for their employees" to be considered news?:, , & , etc. ... Cases of two weights and two measures? Thanks. --Vilalva (talk) 19:17, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Ah, but then those are publicly held companies and companies whose products are used by anyone (without restriction on race, creed, or religion). They are not upcoming meetings between employees and or members. I suppose this is my fault. I should not have replied to you within my vote. It gave the false impression that it is OK to badger people that vote differently than that which you wish. Actually, this behavior is not usually well received. --SVTCobra 19:45, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Dear editor SVTCobra: as well as those companies are known to many costumers so also the Rosicrucians have been known to many Spiritual seekers ("without restriction on race, creed, or religion": The world is my country, and to make good is my religion., Thomas Paine) in the history of the western countries throughout the last centuries. Personally, and with all the respect that your editorial function here deserves, it is not too important what you and your fellows choose to vote, as far as you do it, sustain your point of view and may take responsability for it if needed be; thus my words do not aim to change your position. Anyway, I had already perceveid since an earlier stage the annoyance of my comments and the reluctancy to address the major issues they raise. Yours sincerely, --Vilalva (talk) 20:09, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

 * until creator's concerns have been addressed; it is rude and unnecessary to delete an article while good faith discussion is underway. Jade Knight (talk) 08:55, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * To closing admin: Please note that this was a canvassed keep vote. Cirt (talk) 08:59, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Are you suggesting that my vote should be discounted, as if I have not posted recently on the Deletion requests page? Jade Knight (talk) 09:34, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Your last post to this page was over a week ago. Cirt (talk) 09:37, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Nevermind the fact that I have been out of town for nearly the entire past week, and did not have time to check out this page in that time. It seems to me that you are attempting to dig up reasons to discount a perfectly valid opposing vote, Cirt.  Please remember that my vote is cast in good faith.  Jade Knight (talk) 09:40, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * It is merely a note to the closing admin. The closing administrator may interpret the sequence of events from canvass to vote as they see fit, and I will of course respectfully defer to their judgment on that. Cirt (talk) 09:46, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Please allow a note too to the closing admin : due to the previous lack of will to address the point of views and the request for help that I have expressed at the collaboration page and the subsequent added deletion tag by the above review editor, I have been trying to follow the Dispute resolution steps. Also please note that my appeal to editor Jade Knight, featuring an alert to the discussion process that is occurring here, and that I would like to extend to all Wikinews readers and editors, does not and could not -- Principle -- contain a direct canvassing request to the mentioned editor for a specific support-voting as explicitly inferred by review editor Cirt, both in his above comment and in the comment this reviewer has left in my talk page. --Vilalva (talk) 16:47, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Your intention in posting to 's talk page is pretty obvious that you wanted the editor to come here and vote Keep. You say yourself in your comment above: featuring an alert to the discussion process that is occurring here... Cirt (talk) 22:58, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, Vilalva in no way told me which way to vote, and had Vilalva received significant responses to his or her concerns, I would have voted "remove" here. I vote keep because I feel that there have been a significant number of unaddressed concerns and comments coming from Vilalva which appear to have been largely ignored; the deletion request is premature.  Jade Knight (talk) 03:32, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I would not usually vote delete in a DR until concerns have been adressed, and I think that this article could probably be brought to publish status quite quickly. However, due to all the failed reviews and such, the announcement was made too long ago for it to be publishable. I am sorry Vilalva, and it is not your fault, but this is the way I am going to have to vote. Also Cirt, not going to DR for one week does not mean anything. I often don't vote for weeks on DR, and I do not believe that makes my vote less valid. It did not look like canvassing to me, and I have no problem with Vilalva seeking the opinion of others. Anonymous101talk 20:37, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I sincerely welcome your warm gentle words and also for having explained your position in a very honest way. Thank you indeed. --Vilalva (talk) 22:32, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
 * - I have to agree with the viewpoints presented here by the nominator and others. The content is newsworthy, in my opinion, however it is not written in such a way as to be a news story, rather than an encyclopaedic entry. -- Sken   my talk 20:38, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Please note that I had tried to address the style issue by rewritting paragraphs and I even had requested help, that was not provided, at the collaboration page. Otherwise, truly respecting your whole comment, I appreciate those words of yours addressing the newsworthy issue. Thank you. --Vilalva (talk) 22:32, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Sarah Palin's Medical History Revealed
Attempt to insert story into archives which is poorly formatted, does not use date, is now stale, and borderline notnews as Palin is not VP-elect. --Brian McNeil / talk 15:52, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Comments
That article was tagged as abandoned on Nov 5 (diff). Can't we just reinstate that tag and let WN:PROD run its due course? --SVTCobra 16:11, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * as nom --Brian McNeil / talk 15:52, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom Durova (talk) 18:54, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 19:11, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * - I don't think we can go back to the abandoned tag because of this. Cirt (talk) 23:00, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Though I still think it would have just been easier to revert the change. Removal of abandoned requires actual work to have resumed. Switching to review does not constitute "work". --SVTCobra 23:04, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * --TUFKAAP (talk) 14:33, 7 November 2008 (UTC)
 * , though I agree with SVTCobra. Jade Knight (talk) 09:44, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

User:Brianmc/Obama assassination attempts
This page is inappropriate use of this project space and should be deleted. I agree with this comment and this comment at this page's talk page by. Cirt (talk) 00:29, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Comments
Users are generally left to do what they will, within reason, inside their userspace. That is provided they are a mostly constructive contributor. Normal project rules don't apply to userspace, and I could have created this in Story prep and run the pool on the talk. Then you would have grounds for complaint that the pool is inappropriate, but face facts. It would be highly surprising if someone does not try to take a shot at Obama. --Brian McNeil / talk 09:32, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * This is a human being, and someone's life that we are talking about. It is a page hosted by the Wikimedia Foundation, on project space normally used in a project that is intended to be part of the press. It is highly inappropriate and disgusting. And it reflects very poorly on Wikinews that this page exists. Cirt (talk) 10:05, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * And you don't think MSM already have obits based on a successful assassination? That's reality. --Brian McNeil / talk 10:24, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Prepared obituaries - yes. Pages like this, absolutely not, I do not think the mainstream media maintains pages like this hosted on their websites. Cirt (talk) 11:12, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

I know this is not Wikipedia, but since we don't seem to have a written policy, it may be useful to look at what they have at w:WP:UP. --SVTCobra 11:39, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Had I written two articles in story prep, one on a failed attempt, and one on a successful attempt, I don't see a huge difference. --Brian McNeil / talk 15:06, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Are you dense? You don't see a difference between prepared stories, which I believe are standard for the media, and a pointless betting pool? I mean, really? Are you serious? Okay, so let's just break this down. Is it possible, even likely, that someone will at least attempt to assassinate Obama? Unfortunately, yes. Thus, is it reasonable to have prepared stories for either successful or unsuccessful attempts? Of course. Now, as for this page of yours, what purpose does it serve? Nothing. So not only is there a difference, there is a huge difference. Jennavecia (talk) 15:16, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Here are some excerpts from Wikipedia's policies on user pages, that I believe apply. Wikinews does not have a formalised policy, which is why we had to have a DR. Please see: Reasons for deleting this. --SVTCobra 16:24, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * — I'd delete it, if for no other reason than to stop the inevitable bad press and vandalism that it would eventually bring. Gopher65talk 00:44, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * "inevitable bad press"? Wouldn't you also expect that from censorship of a bit of gallows humour? --Brian McNeil / talk 09:34, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

 * I tend to agree, also NPOV reasons. Though it is in the User's namespace? DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 01:30, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * It's Userspace, NPOV doesn't apply. --Brian McNeil / talk 09:30, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

- Think of the bad press. I also don't think a page where users vote on when we think someone will be assassinated is very appropriate.   סּ    Talk 08:19, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * It's a userpage, you don't get to claim NPOV rationality. It's intended to be humor. -- Shakata Ga Nai  ^_^ 07:34, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Can you add your eng-lang username to your sig? Eg, "talk to Samekh"?
 * The page does not expect a successful assassination, but an attempt or attempts. --Brian McNeil / talk 09:29, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

 * If you don't like it, don't look at it. Just like porn. Those who are voting delete are pitting my right to free speech against their right to go, "Eww, that's tasteless - censor it!"; this is simply not valid grounds for deletion. Nobody has put forward anything per policy or even obliquely linked to policy that justifies this deletion. --Brian McNeil / talk 10:49, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * You wouldn't be allowed to host porn on your user page, either. Just in case you were wondering. --SVTCobra 11:31, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * The comparison I was making was to not looking at things you find offensive, not suggesting I place porn in my user space. --Brian McNeil / talk 14:29, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * That's not the point Brianmc. I'm voting against this not because I think it is tasteless (I like tasteless things), but because I think it is inappropriate for Wikinews. If you want to host this on your own webpage then I would have no problem with it. Gopher65talk 16:17, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

 * A bit of fun dosen't really matter... Danger^Mouse (talk) 14:34, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Just because something is possible, doesn't make it appropriate for user space. This page is a disgrace and it reflects poorly on not only the creator, but the project. Where this project lacks a user space guideline, common sense should pick up. Jennavecia (talk) 14:44, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Wikinews doesn't have a written WN:UP policy, if we did we wouldn't have this DR. However, it has been common policy on all Foundation run wikis, that I have ever been a part of, that User Pages and subpages are a place to let others know a bit about who you are. They can also be places for works-in-progress or for collaboration with other users in a way that furthers the aims of the overall project. Our overall aim is News, this page does nothing to further this project.  User pages are not to be thought of as personal websites or blogs.  User pages are not for running games, be they dead pools or otherwise.  --SVTCobra 16:03, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I favor removal but only weakly. If this were on a private website I'd be more than happy to chime in and give my own estimate. But there's no good reason to keep this on wikinews. However, I'm generally inclined to give productive users a lot of leeway about what they do in userspace and Brian is obviously in that category. JoshuaZ (talk) 17:47, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * per JoshuaZ. Anonymous101talk 17:49, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * because it's in userspace. Respectfully requesting Brianmc migrate it voluntarily to a more appropriate venue, such as a personal offsite blog.  The length of this discussion suggests it detracts attention from our main goal of writing news. Durova (talk) 19:00, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * - this isn't funny, that page makes WIKIMEDIA look racist and prejudice and the actions of one project will indirectly affect all the other projects, betting on when and how someone will die just gives Wikinews a bad name and even worse, it was started by an admin/CU...-- Cometstyles 20:27, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Category:Corporations
We have two categories that essentially are the same: Category:Companies and Category:Corporations. Several companies are listed in both. I proposed we delete Category:Corporations and move over the cats that are not already in Category:Companies.

Comments

 * - Category:Corporations is now empty, though if there are any objections feel free to change that. Cirt (talk) 01:19, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
 * If Category:Companies has been populated by the non-overlapping members, then the closing-admin should feel free to do their thing. --SVTCobra 01:54, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * As nom. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 17:08, 31 October 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom --SVTCobra 17:35, 31 October 2008 (UTC)
 * good idea. Cirt (talk) 20:02, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

Orson Scott Card criticizes journalists for blaming housing crisis on Bush
Failed three reviews. Plus, makes a valid point on the talkpage: Further, it is stale, if for no other reason than the fact that his open letter was written October 5. Cirt (talk) 19:36, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Comments

 * The third "review" contained no specific details other than Bastique's opinion (without any evidence) that Card is an unreliable source. It did not criticize the article in question at all.  Jade Knight (talk) 22:07, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And I worked hard to address (fix) the concerns voiced in the first two reviews. Is it Wikinews policy to delete anything which fails x number of reviews, when it clear that the writer is trying to improve the article?  Jade Knight (talk) 22:12, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I would also appreciate seeing the Wikinews policy or guideline on the timing of news; I am not a professional reporter, and I've had trouble finding Wikinews' policy on this; is there some reference which talks about how to evaluate whether a potential piece of news is "too old"? This seems like a critical issue at Wikinews: I've put a few hours into trying to find sources, engaging in discussion, etc., here, and it's very important to me to be able to determine this in advance, so I don't waste my time in the future. Jade Knight (talk) 22:07, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Would appreciate it people would consider responding to my comments. Jade Knight (talk) 09:04, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * did we even need a DR? Blood Red Sandman  (Talk)   (Contribs) 19:42, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * This has no redeeming features. The rant or op-ed it is based on is - in news terms - now ancient history. There is very little can be done to report on someone else's editorial commentary, and the commentator is known as an author of science fiction and not as a political pundit; his opinion carries less weight than a fart in a spacesuit. --Brian McNeil / talk 19:49, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * So if one is not a political pundit, one's opinion "carries less weight than a fart in a spacesuit"? Is that how you feel about those who report on political matters at Wikinews, who are not professional political reporters?  Jade Knight (talk) 22:01, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Wikinews does not do editorials, you are attempting to do a report on an editorial. Mal-function! Wrong input! --Brian McNeil / talk 23:55, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * If you bothered to read my comments on the talk page, you would have noticed that I discussed the option of trying to modify it to avoid that issue. And I guess WN:E doesn't apply to you (as you seem to enjoy ignoring it)?  Jade Knight (talk) 04:16, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * . I have contacted Card for an interview; if an interview is included, there is no question this article would be notable news; time needs to be given at least for him to respond!  Jade Knight (talk) 21:59, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * If that is the case, move it into an appropriate space within Story preparation. --SVTCobra 02:18, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

 * In its current state the article is stale, and I'd vote delete. However, if the article can be revamped to be the opening of an interview, that would be great — especially if the Ender's Game movie eventually moves into production. Gopher65talk 20:28, 29 October 2008 (UTC)
 * If the interview materializes, then a new introduction can be written (even one that includes this material). There is no reason to keep this around as it stands now. --SVTCobra 01:47, 31 October 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom. Durova (talk) 10:45, 31 October 2008 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Symbol unrelated.svg|15px]] Super Remove Wipe it from the face of the Earth. --TUFKAAP (talk) 07:10, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Template:1
Useless. Anonymous101talk 17:35, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * — This is one of many useless or test templates on wikinews that was created once upon a time for a good reason, but has now served its purpose. So as the Cybermen would say: Delete! Gopher65talk 17:47, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep - example template used in help system to teach concepts regarding templates. -  Amgine | t 17:51, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Any other real template could be used on this help page. And this isn't even transcluded on the help page so it could be used as an example without actually existing.Anonymous101talk 18:14, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The purpose of using these templates is to keep our help pages in sync with the Meta help pages. Unless you think en.Wikinews should take over the creation and maintenance of all Mediawiki help systems, it would probably be best if we keep the linked templates and other support articles as necessary. It's simply a volunteer cost-savings measure. -  Amgine | t 18:29, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't believe that template:1 was purposefully created as part of that help page. If you look at the help page it is a near solid mass of red links, with that 1 as one of the few blue links. But it doesn't show what the help page says it should show. So what I think happened is that someone just created a template named "1", which happened to be the same name as a template linked from the help page. Gopher65talk 18:43, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Mmm... It used contain the text <nowiki></nowiki>, iirc. But it appears the meta help page has dramatically changed since then so we should figure out how to use the help system again. -  Amgine | t 19:00, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

--  T harikrish  Talk 02:06, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Awesome. It says <!-- testing something --> -- Shakata Ga Nai ^_^ 16:22, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Joinus
This simply replicates the function of Welcome-anon. One of them should be deleted. I think that it would be better to keep Welcome-anon, because it is the same as the standard Welcome template, but targets anonymous users. Gopher65talk 22:17, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * I tend to agree with the nomination. If deleted, don't forget to update Template messages/User talk namespace. --SVTCobra 22:50, 14 October 2008 (UTC)
 * --  T harikrish  Talk 01:59, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Good nomination. Durova (talk) 05:16, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Make redirect. --Brian McNeil / talk 13:52, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it occurred to me a while after I made this that even if this DR went through it would be a redirect rather than a delete. It's still an effective delete though (removing content), so I'm going to wait for consensus be decided. No opposition so far though:). Gopher65talk 16:16, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

 * -- Shakata Ga Nai ^_^ 16:18, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Category:Browsing Wikinews
Unused category from 2006. Appears to serve no current function. --Durova (talk) 07:22, 14 October 2008 (UTC)).

Votes
--SVTCobra 21:45, 14 October 2008 (UTC) — Yeeeet another useless Category/Template: Exterminate! --  T harikrish  Talk 02:01, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * first, ask questions later. -- Shakata Ga Nai ^_^ 16:19, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Template:2
Template used in help system, teaching how to use templates on Wikinews. -  Amgine | t

Votes

 * Undelete - as per nom. -  Amgine | t 17:56, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Any other real template could be used on this help page. And this isn't even transcluded on the help page so it could be used as an example without actually existing. Anonymous101talk 18:16, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * See my reply above: I don't think Wikinews wishes to spend it's volunteer hours writing help manuals. -  Amgine | t 18:30, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Template:2005 London bombing articles
Unused template, I see no use in it. Its about something that happened years ago so, if it's not used now it will never be used Anonymous101talk 17:40, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * —useless Gopher65talk 17:47, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Kamnet (talk) 17:50, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * --Brian McNeil / talk 17:54, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom. Durova (talk) 17:58, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Not likely to see any new use (hopefully). EVula // talk // 22:19, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * what Brian said User:iDangerMouse
 * nothing links to it anymore. --SVTCobra 21:56, 14 October 2008 (UTC)
 * --  T harikrish  Talk 02:01, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * -- Shakata Ga Nai ^_^ 16:19, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Template:2004 Indian Ocean earthquake casualties
Unused template, I see no use in it. Its about something that happened years ago so, if it's not used now it will never be used Anonymous101talk 17:39, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Votes
—again, useless Gopher65talk 17:47, 13 October 2008 (UTC) Kamnet (talk) 17:50, 13 October 2008 (UTC) Jesus, I would just speedy delete it o.o Julián (reply) 22:03, 13 October 2008 (UTC) --  T harikrish  Talk 02:04, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom. Durova (talk) 17:59, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Inclined to agree with Julián; this is just a source, not even a template in the truest sense of the word. EVula // talk // 22:21, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * nothing links to it now, if ever. --SVTCobra 21:57, 14 October 2008 (UTC)
 * More with the speedies, less with the voting. -- Shakata Ga Nai ^_^ 16:21, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Image:Bob Friend.jpg
From competing news agency. Anonymous101talk 17:18, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

Comments
PROCEED TO DELETE - This image is not presently replaceable with one from a non-news agency source. Go ahead and shift it, and I will keep looking. :) Iceflow (talk) 18:32, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * The uploader is resolving this issue.Anonymous101talk 18:22, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

Template:Extreme templating
A mocking piece of humour allegedly never used but generally added to articles facing imminent death. Sneaky deletion with few votes by long-standing contributors. --Brian McNeil / talk 20:58, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Comments
The original August 8, 2008 deletion request can be seen here. --SVTCobra 22:03, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

Votes
While I was ambiguous about the deletion, it is not worth restoring. Proper use of Tasks should avoid the need for this and should be the direction in which we are moving. --SVTCobra 22:08, 14 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Restore as nom --Brian McNeil / talk 20:59, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * We are not Unnews, we don't need joke templates. Anonymous101talk 21:02, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * meh. wasn't purdy, didn't fit with the rest of the templates. -- Shakata Ga Nai ^_^ 21:37, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * per . It was pretty obtrusive. Cirt (talk) 22:20, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * per Anonymous101. Durova (talk) 00:35, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

German Wikinews - Editorials
... and the redirect Editorial ... I cannot fathom why we need or want this page. It seems to be a translation of de:Wikinews:Editorial, but otherwise unrelated to en.wikinews. It is not part of our history and it does not serve any purpose. Thus, I feel it should be deleted. The redirect needs to be deleted or point to WN:NOT. --SVTCobra 01:52, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Votes

 * per nom. Anonymous101talk 17:18, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
 * — yup, that's totally pointless. Gopher65talk 17:37, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Editorials? Not allowed! --Brian McNeil / talk 17:56, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * per all. Durova (talk) 18:00, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Category:Latin America
This is a linguistic category, not a geographical one. It was previously deleted and serves no competent purpose on Wikinews. My personal opinion is that any category which covers more than one country should only be used where multiple countries are impacted or mentioned in the article and this particular category cannot competently be applied. --Brian McNeil / talk 19:51, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Comments

 * See previous deletion request from August 2006. This is a category essentially to help with using w:User:Wikinews Importer Bot at w:Portal:Current events/Latin America, though I also think it is a useful category for news articles as well. Of course bearing in mind the prior deletion request and consensus here, I have no problem if consensus is to delete and I can try to figure out other ways to make it work to bring these articles linked at Wikipedia. Either way, no worries. Cheers, Cirt (talk) 20:05, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Votes
Not a well defined geographical region--  T harikrish  Talk 13:17, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * as nom. --Brian McNeil / talk 19:51, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * per Brian. --TUFKAAP (talk) 01:13, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * per nom. Durova (talk) 05:35, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * per the nomination. I hate doing "per nom" comments, but damn if Brianmc didn't sum it up sufficiently. :) EVula // talk // 22:22, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Kill it! -- Shakata Ga Nai ^_^ 16:24, 15 October 2008 (UTC)


text: Template:Quiz status

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Template:Quiz status


text:
Comments:Oversight Committee: White House attempted to influence Congressional elections

Do you think that the administration was justified in using the Political Affairs office?
No. --99.150.96.219

Are we going to impeach them already? --Poisonous (talk) 03:57, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

The most corrupt administration since the Nixon Administration. How has Bush not been impeached??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.59.226.106 (talk) 10:47, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

It is next to impossible to impeach a "fear" elected president. Vote for freedom not oppression.--BurningWolf (talk) 14:56, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Ah, the old "they did/do it too makes it okay" argument. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.65.192.1 (talk) 15:17, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

A waste of time and taxpayer money? Sounds just like the use of that money that the Committee investigated --199.190.223.190 16:55, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

How unprecendented?
the article says that all admininstrations have done this, but doesn't say to what extent the current has outdone the others. this information would serve the article very well. - Imind (talk) 01:58, 18 October 2008 (UTC)


text:
NHL: Montreal Canadiens open 100th season

October 16, 2008 The Montreal Canadiens, the oldest and most successful National Hockey League team, played their 100th home opener against Original Six rivals the Boston Bruins on the night of October 15, 2008. The Canadiens won the game in a shootout, 4-3.

Pre-Game Ceremonies
During the opening ceremonies the Canadiens brought out 12 Hall of Famers onto the ice. The players were Emile "Butch" Bouchard, Elmer Lach, Jean Beliveau, Dickie Moore, Henri Richard, Yvan Cournoyer, Guy Lafleur, Bob Gainey, Guy Lapointe, Steve Shutt, Larry Robinson and Dick Duff. While they were on the ice, the Canadiens unveiled a new installation in their home arena, the Bell Centre: a "ring of honour" that stretched around the top of the entire arena above the last row of seats, depicting in a mural the 54 former Montreal Canadiens who are now in the Hockey Hall of Fame.

Bouchard and Lach, the two oldest Canadiens Hall of Famers, were chosen to drop the ceremonial puck to start the game.

The Game
Barely two minutes into the game, newly acquired enforcer Georges Laraque got into his first fight as a Canadien, fighting Scott Thornton. Both players were given five-minute majors for the incident.

Montreal opened the scoring with three quick goals in the first period. Alexei Kovalev scored first on the power play, collecting a rebound off his own shot 15 minutes into the game, and scoring from the crease. Team captain Saku Koivu scored less than two minutes later by stuffing a loose puck from the side of the net. Another two minutes after that, Maxim Lapierre scored a short-handed goal to give the Canadiens a three-goal lead.

But after that, it was all Boston as the Bruins would hold an advantage in shots in every period thereafter. David Krejci scored in the second period, and it would have been more except for some terrific saves by Canadiens goaltender Carey Price.

In the third period, Marc Savard struck twice, first on a power play goal seven minutes into the frame. Then in the last minute of regulation, Price was fooled by a fluke bounce off the boards, and Savard easily guided the puck into the vacated net to tie the game.

There was little action in the extra frame, leading to a shootout. Phil Kessel, Patrice Bergeron, and former Canadien Michael Ryder were designated for the Bruins, while Andrei Markov and Alex Tanguay replied for the Habs. Tanguay scored the only goal, ensuring that Montreal's 100th home opener would go down as a victory for the home team.

Future Celebrations
The Canadiens will continue to celebrate their 100th year all season long, with future highlights expected to be the retiring of former Habs great Patrick Roy's number 33 in November, and the NHL all-star game in January. As well, the Canadiens are considered to be strong contenders for the Stanley Cup this season, so it is possible the Bell Centre will see one more celebration in June.


text:
Talk:NHL: Montreal Canadiens open 100th season

Truth be told, I've never done a Wikinews story before. I'm used to Wikipedia. Uh... help?
 * I can try and help you out. So far, it's in good shape. I would recommend adding one another source so we can make sure that all the facts are correct. Let me know if you have any more questions. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 04:28, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Didn't see the second source. Sorry about that. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 04:33, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Okay. I've got the basic frame of the story down, I think... I'm going to go hunt for more sources, specifically to back up the all-star game, Roy's number retiring ceremony, and the assertion that the Habs are favourites to win the East. All should be readily available; I just need to find them.

I suspect the article needs to be wikified. Help on that front would be appreciated.(66.62.165.3 04:42, 16 October 2008 (UTC))
 * We tend not to link like wikipedia does. We only link on the major topics such as NHL or the teams. So I think the current links are probably fine. When you think everything is ready replace the develop with review and somebody will come along and review the article. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 04:52, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

I'd like to get more post-game reports as sources of this event, but they appear to have not been written yet. Then again, this event did just finish under three hours ago.(66.62.165.3 05:02, 16 October 2008 (UTC))
 * I think it's enough sources. Did you by any chance attend the game? It would be great to have an image for the article. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 05:06, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I wish I could have, but sadly I'm four hours away (by plane). (66.62.165.3 05:12, 16 October 2008 (UTC))

 * Okay, I'll try to stop adding sources now. <>  ("Just walk away.  Slowly.  You CAN go offline long enough to fall asleep.")(66.62.165.3 05:52, 16 October 2008 (UTC))

pic
yes a pic would be great maybe a pic that has significance to the canadines like a logo or something? idk just my two cents since i'am up this late. good luck on publishing it looks good. --72.73.119.76 05:14, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

 * Does Youtube count as public domain? There's a couple of videos of the Laraque-Thornton fight already up.  See here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UU_ir-veRp4 (66.62.165.3 05:22, 16 October 2008 (UTC))

 * And here's a fan-shot video of the opening video, also on Youtube. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjW_dGnI3jY (66.62.165.3 05:25, 16 October 2008 (UTC))

 * idk about youtube videos but the logo patrick added good job. review is just needed now looks like and great job 66. --72.73.119.76 05:23, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

 * That logo is great. It adds a LOT.  Thanks Patrick! (66.62.165.3 05:27, 16 October 2008 (UTC))
 * No worries. Thanks for doing the article. Hopefully it will get reviewed shortly by another editor. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 05:30, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

So. Anyone going to review this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.139.186.71 (talk) 16:35, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * After thinking about this, I didn't really add much except for some categories and minor changes so i'm going to go ahead and review it. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 17:09, 16 October 2008 (UTC)


text:
User talk:66.62.165.3

Welcome
Welcome!

66.62.165.3, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews:
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
 * Cite sources - everything in a Wikinews article must be sourced
 * Introduction - overview of the site
 * Writing an article - how to write and publish a complete article
 * Content guide - what's suitable for Wikinews
 * Style guide - how articles should look before publishing
 * Contents - the contents page.
 * Existing articles need expanding and checking for spelling and mistakes
 * The front page lead articles often need updating
 * Developing stories need finishing and publishing
 * Discussions need your input
 * And of course, stories need writing!

Here are some other hints and tips:

 * I would recommend that you get a username. You don't have to log in to read or edit articles on Wikinews, but creating an account is quick, free and non-intrusive, requires no personal information (not even an e-mail address), and there are many benefits of having a username.  (If you edit without a username, your IP address is used to identify you instead.)

 * When using talk pages (the "collaboration" tab at the top of the page), or the comments pages (tab "opinions"), please sign your name at the end of your messages by typing four tildes (~~). This will automatically produce your username (or IP address) and the date.

If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!--PatrickFlaherty (talk) 04:24, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

title: User talk:66.62.165.3


title: File:Canadiens100Anniversary.png


text:
Thai-Cambodian generals in talks after border clash kills two

October 16, 2008 Today saw high-level talks between Thai and Cambodian military leaders following a border skirmish yesterday which left two Cambodian soldiers dead, injuries on both sides, and ten Thai troops captured. Several hours of talks have led to an agreement for joint military patrols along the disputed border.

Wednesday's exchange of fire in the disputed border region surrounding Preah Vihear Temple is the latest in a dispute over an area of scrubland which both Cambodia and Thailand claim. While each side claims the other initiated the clash, government officials in both capitals have sought to downplay the seriousness of the incident and stress that a negotiated settlement is the only reasonable solution. The disputed territory is a little under five square kilometres and was, in 1962, awarded to Cambodia by the International Court of Justice. The decision caused resentment in Thailand which continues to this day.

Downplaying the incident, Cambodian Foreign Minister Hor Namhong spoke of the negotiations in positive terms, stressing the skirmish was, "an incident between soldiers and not an invasion by Thailand". Thai Prime Minister, Somchai Wongsawat stressed the need for the dispute over territory to be resolved peacefully.

According to officials, apart from the two Cambodian soldiers who died in the skirmish, an additional two Khmer troops and five Thais were injured. Thailand has denied the claim by Cambodia that ten soldiers were captured in the disputed territory. On the other side of the border, Cambodian officials have said the captives will be returned upon request. The dispute over the contested territory flared up in June; UNESCO awarded the Hindu Preah Vihear Temple the status of World Heritage Site as a Cambodian property, bringing the issue back into the spotlight. The 900-year-old temple sits at the centre of a military build-up on both sides of the border and despite an agreed pull-back in August the situation deteriorated when Cambodia asserted that Thai troops had returned to the entrenched positions that now see around 1,000 soldiers from both sides facing each other. The return of Thai military forces saw the Cambodian Prime Minister, Hun Sen threaten to turn the area into a "death zone".

United Nations Secretary General, Ban Ki-moon spoke yesterday on the incident, expressing grave concern over the escalation of the conflict and loss of life. A spokesperson for the Secretary-General said, "He calls on both parties to exercise utmost restraint and urges them to expedite bilateral talks so that their differences can be resolved peacefully". This is not the first time Ban Ki-moon has spoken on the issue; previously calls for restraint have been issued as the military build-up in the area has continued.

The ongoing dispute and yesterday's escalation have seen moves to take civilians out of harm's way. The government in Bangkok urged Thai citizens in Cambodia to leave the country if they were not there on urgent business. Over 400 returned on a Thai Airways flight following the call to evacuate Thai nationals. With a 2003 dispute and unrest having seen Thailand's embassy in Phnom Penh torched, Cambodian authorities deployed riot police around the building yesterday in case the dispute led to violence. In the disputed region, thousands of Cambodians have left due to the build-up of forces on both sides of the border and increased tensions.

The current flare-up along the border is the second incident this month; on October 3 there was a clash where Thailand claims Cambodian forces crossed the border and fired on Thai rangers causing two injuries. That incident saw both sides exchange protest letters. Thailand claimed that rangers patrolling on their side of the border encountered Cambodian troops and demanded they return across the border. The alleged response was apparently orders from superiors for the Cambodians to begin firing. The strongly-worded complaint stated, "the above-mentioned intrusion of the Cambodian soldiers into Thailand's territory is a serious violation of Thailand's sovereignty and territorial integrity. Furthermore, the shooting by the Cambodian troops against the unarmed Thai para-military rangers is regarded as a brutal and aggressive act and is contrary to the spirit of friendly relations between Cambodia and Thailand."


text:
Comments:Thai-Cambodian generals in talks after border clash kills two

= Should UNESCO take total control over all World Heritage Sites and their surroundings to avoid conflicts like this? =

Two Buddhist countries at war because of a Hindu temple. It would be ridiculous if people weren't dying because of it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.95.47.71 (talk) 12:35, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Should UNESCO take total control over all World Heritage Sites and their surroundings to avoid conflicts like this? Of course not, nations who manage their UNESCO sites in a peaceful and correct way shouldn't have to lose territorial sovereignty because in some distant land, an authoritarian monarchy, where people foolishly worship the king as some sort of demi-god, and a third-world country recovering from genocide are bickering over a temple. Besides, the International Court has ruled that the land belongs to Cambodia, Thailand is obviously being belligerent so that it can get its peoples minds off of the political conflicts taking place in the country. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.199.93.16 (talk) 20:25, 16 October 2008 (UTC) Don't add more problem. This situation is not a child play! Let erase the question now!


text: Talk:Thai-Cambodian generals in talks after border clash kills two


text:
Medical helicopter crashes near Chicago, Illinois killing four

October 16, 2008 🇺🇸A medical helicopter has crashed near Chicago, Illinois killing three crew members and the patient, a thirteen-month-old baby girl. The crew aboard the helicopter included the pilot, a nurse and a paramedic.

The helicopter, operated by Air Angels Inc., was transporting the baby to Children's Memorial Hospital from Valley West Hospital, when it hit a wire connected to a 734-foot (224-meter) radio tower in Aurora and burst into flames around 12:00 a.m. (EDT). The baby was suffering from epileptic seizures.

The cause of the crash is not known, and there were no reported problems with the helicopter before it took off. An investigation by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) is ongoing.

This is the third crash which involved an Air Angels helicopter. In 2003, a pilot was killed when his chopper crashed. An investigation concluded that the cause was pilot error, and bad weather. Another chopper crashed in 2007, but there were no injuries.


text:
User talk:TLee53

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here are some pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 11:35, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
 * Cite sources - everything in a Wikinews article must be sourced
 * Introduction - overview of the site
 * Writing an article - how to write and publish a complete article
 * Content guide - what's suitable for Wikinews
 * Style guide - how articles should look before publishing
 * Reviewing articles - how articles pass through editorial review
 * Contents - the contents page.
 * Existing articles need expanding and checking for spelling and mistakes
 * The front page lead articles often need updating
 * Developing stories need finishing and publishing
 * Discussions need your input
 * Audio Wikinews could always use more contributors
 * And of course, stories need writing!

title: User talk:TLee53


text:
User talk:Agindia

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here are some pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 12:24, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
 * Cite sources - everything in a Wikinews article must be sourced
 * Introduction - overview of the site
 * Writing an article - how to write and publish a complete article
 * Content guide - what's suitable for Wikinews
 * Style guide - how articles should look before publishing
 * Reviewing articles - how articles pass through editorial review
 * Contents - the contents page.
 * Existing articles need expanding and checking for spelling and mistakes
 * The front page lead articles often need updating
 * Developing stories need finishing and publishing
 * Discussions need your input
 * Audio Wikinews could always use more contributors
 * And of course, stories need writing!

title: User talk:Agindia


text:
User:Tinucherian

I am usually active in English Wikipedia Tinucherian (talk) 15:28, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

title: User:Tinucherian


text:
User talk:Tinucherian

I am usually active in English Wikipedia Tinucherian (talk) 15:29, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

title: User talk:Tinucherian


text:
Ilham Aliyev claims landslide victory in disputed Azerbaijani elections

October 16, 2008

Incumbent President of Azerbaijan, Ilham Aliyev, has claimed victory by winning 89% of the vote in the recent Azerbaijani presidential election, which were boycotted by all major opposition parties.

The major opposition parties boycotted the election due to claims that the government was limiting people's democratic rights and restricting freedom of the press. These parties described the elections as nothing more than a charade.

"Despite the boycott by some opposition parties, the Azeris made their choice in favour of Ilham Aliyev," said Ali Akhmedov, a press spokesperson for Aliyev's New Azerbaijan Party.

Aliyev faced six opponents in a presidential election. None of these competitors were considered a serious competitor by the newly re-elected president.

Isa Gambar, leader of the Musavat party, which was the main opposition party until it entered the boycott, commented on the result. "It's a farce, a tragicomedy," he stated. "The authorities were trying to force people to vote."

Authorities state that there was a 78% turnout in the election.

At 15:00 UTC today, the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE) criticized the election, but said that progress had been made. The organisation said in a press release that "yesterday's presidential election in Azerbaijan marked considerable progress, but did not meet all of the country's international commitments."

"The election was conducted in a peaceful manner, but was characterized by a lack of robust competition and vibrant political discourse facilitated by the media, and thus did not reflect all principles of a meaningful and pluralistic democratic election," continued the OSCE. "Regrettably, some opposition parties boycotted the election, citing longstanding obstacles. This further limited the scope for meaningful choice for the electorate."


text:
Comments:Ilham Aliyev claims landslide victory in Azerbaijani elections

=Should Aliyev be internationally accepted as president?=


text: Talk:Ilham Aliyev claims landslide victory in disputed Azerbaijani elections


text: Template:User IRC

title: Template:User IRC


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Talk:Medical helicopter crashes near Chicago, Illinois killing four

Names?
The names of the deceased have been reported in two of the sources provided for this article, is it appropriate for us to in turn report them? Mendaliv (talk) 12:43, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

New category
editprotected Please add Category:DuPage County, Illinois. Benny the mascot (talk) 01:59, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
 * ❌. From one of the few sources that still works this appears to have been in Aurora, Illinois which spans several counties and the specific location of the crash site (county-wise) is unavailable. --Brian McNeil / talk 02:08, 13 February 2010 (UTC)


text:
Comments:Medical helicopter crashes near Chicago, Illinois killing four

not known??
I don't understand this story. This reads "helicopter hit a tower wire" and "the cause of the crash is unknown."

Three cheers to it's author, and my nomination for a new journalism award that I just made-up, called: "Best daily news aneurysm, the cause of which is unknown and under invertigation."

 * We don't know if it hit the wire after power loss, if so why, if control was lost - pilot error? Mechanical malfunction? So no, we don't the cause. We know what happened, no why is yet availible. Three cheers to yourself, I guess. Blood Red Sandman  (Talk)   (Contribs) 17:54, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Will Obama Extend His Sympathies?
Probably not. He didn't seem to care or comment about the flooding in Illinois when he was having his party on the west coast. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.252.61.169 (talk) 22:48, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

 * What does that have to do with anything? Is there some basis for that comment? Does Bush read every local paper reading every obituary and write letters expressing his condolences for each one or something? Well, I guess he's got to do something while waiting for Bonanza to come on but I mean some basis among real politicians. 65.1.171.67 03:23, 17 October 2008 (UTC)


text:
Oil prices drop as inventories grow

October 16, 2008 International oil prices sank on Thursday as investors worried that a looming global recession will lower demand. Crude oil for future delivery fell to below US$71 a barrel in electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange, its lowest price in more than a year. In London, Brent crude oil for November dropped below $66 a barrel.

Oil prices have dropped more than 50 percent since hitting a record high of $147 a barrel in July. A report released today showed an unexpected increase in inventories. Analysts expected only a 1.9 million barrel increase last week, but the actual amount was 5.6 million barrels

The Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) cut its estimate for crude oil demand next year in a report released Wednesday. OPEC, which was planning on having an emergency meeting next month on the issue of lower oil prices, pushed forward the meeting to next week. The cartel is expected to cut production by 500,000 barrels a day, in a bid to boost oil prices. Saudi Arabia, which initially did not support the cut a few weeks ago, now supports such a move. Some Asian governments are under pressure to reduce domestic fuel prices in light of the decline of the price of oil. In China, some drivers are paying more for gas than drivers in the United States, which last occurred several years ago. India, China, and Indonesia appear to be to content to keep the price at the same level; however, some other Asian governments have lowered the price already. Malaysia and Vietnam have cut prices and are expected to do the same if oil drops some more.

title: Oil prices drop as inventories grow


text:
Comments:Oscar Diös tells Wikinews about his hostel within a Boeing 747

Seems like it might be fun to stay at once or twice, but I don't know if I'd really like sleeping in an airplane before getting up early to board another airplane for my flight. It would be like adding 10+ hours to your flight time. 65.1.171.67 18:11, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Trains and planes
This will apparently be a parallel to the Train Hostel in Lund, southern Sweden. --LA2 (talk) 20:18, 16 October 2008 (UTC)


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Spanair mechanics to be questioned under criminal suspicion over Flight 5022 crash

October 16, 2008

Three Spanair mechanics—including the head of maintenance for the airline in the area—are to be questioned under suspicion of manslaughter in connection to the Spanair Flight 5022 disaster. The other two workers checked the plane, a MD-82, before the failed takeoff at Madrid that killed 154 and left only eighteen survivors. The aircraft, destined for the Canary Islands, failed to maintain altitude after takeoff from Barajas Airport.

A preliminary report concluded that the wing flaps were not correctly set for takeoff, and an alarm that should have sounded to alert the flight crew to this problem failed. No reasons have been determined for these occurrences.

A judge has now summoned the head of Spanair maintenance at Barajas and the two mechanics who checked the aircraft. They were summoned by Juan Javier Perez of Madrid’s Superior Court, who heads the judicial enquiry into the accident.

Aircraft manufacturer McDonnell Douglas—which has since merged with Boeing—has suggested that operators should check the wing flaps before every flight. However, Spanair only checked them every morning and after each change in flight crew. The recommendation came after the 1987 crash of Northwest Flight 255.

So far, no one has been charged with a crime.


text:
Category:OPEC

The Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) is an intergovernmental organization of 14 countries as of May 2017, made up of Algeria, Angola, Ecuador, Equatorial Guinea, Gabon, Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, Libya, Nigeria, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, United Arab Emirates, and Venezuela. The organization has maintained its headquarters in Vienna since 1965, and hosts regular meetings among the oil ministers of its Member Countries.

es:Categoría:OPEP fa:رده:اوپک

title: Category:OPEC


text:
Talk:Spanair mechanics to be questioned under criminal suspicion over Flight 5022 crash

typo in headline
should be criminal. Galatee (talk) 19:45, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks so much for the catch. --PatrickFlaherty (talk) 19:46, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * You're welcome. :) Galatee (talk) 19:47, 16 October 2008 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Zimbabwe opposition claims early victory in election

Audio recording
An audio recording of this article was archived back in May. Ottre (talk) 19:36, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * ✅ --SVTCobra 01:36, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


text:
User talk:Galatee~enwikinews

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here are some pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!--PatrickFlaherty (talk) 19:47, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
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title: User talk:Galatee~enwikinews


text:
User talk:Chelsea1995~enwikinews

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here are some pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!Cary Bass (talk) 21:22, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
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Hello,

The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called Chelsea1995. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name Chelsea1995~enwikinews that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name.

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Sorry for the inconvenience.

Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 23:15, 17 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
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title: User talk:Chelsea1995~enwikinews


text: Talk:Oil prices drop as inventories grow


text:
User:Fconaway

A Spanish judge has opened an investigation of Federico García Lorca's death, among many others, of those executed and disappeared during the Spanish Civil War and the Franco years.

title: User:Fconaway


text:
Comments:Oil prices drop as inventories grow

I love how I'm still paying the price as when gas was 120 a barrel at the pump. There's no regulation or market competition here. It concerns me that OPEC feels it necessary to cut production to increase the price.

This is awesome. I went to see my family last weekend :D. Fephisto (talk) 01:22, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

Since a lot of people blamed bush for Oil going up, can we thank him for making it go down? --66.229.17.181 13:26, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

Petrodollars are running dry...
Good-bye, Mr. Putin! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.5.96.47 (talk) 17:02, 18 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And Chavez and...Fephisto (talk) 01:39, 22 October 2008 (UTC)


text:
Template talk:Convert

There's a lot of template stuff that still needs to be copied over for this guy to work. Mendaliv (talk) 00:09, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

 * Yep, and it's also relying on a lot of other templates, including:
 * Template:Color
 * Mathematical function templates (w:Category:Mathematical function templates)
 * You really need a bot to get it done (and to keep it up to date). :/ Van der Hoorn (talk) 16:21, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

I redirected the page to Category:Conversion templates as those templates are usable. Cheers, Van der Hoorn (talk) 15:25, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

title: Template talk:Convert


text:
Clash of cultures: Somali and Latino workers at U.S. meat packing plants

October 17, 2008 Muslim Somali workers at a meat packing plant in Grand Island, Nebraska wanted to pray. Their colleagues from Latin America wanted to work. A dispute over the company's break schedule led to formal discrimination claims, mass job walk-offs and public protests by both sides last month, and a reported 200 firings.

Tensions at the plant began after a Federal government raid in December 2006 removed 200 undocumented workers. An equal number of employees quit shortly afterward. Altogether, six government immigration raids at meat packing plants of Brazilian-owned JBS Swift & Co. had removed 1,200 employees from the company's work force, which caused substantial production problems. Management at the Nebraska plant responded by hiring approximately 400 Somali immigrants who resided in the United States legally as political refugees. Stricter Federal enforcement of immigration laws has had a significant impact on the meat packing industry because few native-born Americans are willing to work in its low-wage factories. Employers advertise to immigrant communities and after the immigration crackdowns the company turned to the Somali community, which was unlikely to be targeted for deportation.

Many of the new Somali workers were observant Muslims who wanted to practice the traditional religious prayer schedule, and few spoke English. The existing union contract had been negotiated before Muslims became a significant part of the factory work force, when religious needs had not been an issue, and break times were assigned according to a rigid schedule to ensure continuous production and prevent workers from working too long without a break. The sharp knives the meat packers wield for their job pose a substantial risk of accidental injury.

At first the Somali workers prayed during scheduled breaks and visits to the rest room. A few Somalis were fired for "illegal breaks" they had spent praying. Rima Kapitan, a lawyer who represents the Muslim meat packers of Grand Island, told USA Today, "they shouldn't be forced to choose between their job and their religion." The Somalis offered to let their employer deduct pay for time at prayer, but supervisors considered it unworkable to lose the labor of hundreds of people simultaneously, even if the interruptions lasted less than five minutes.

Plant worker Fidencio Sandoval, a naturalized United States citizen who was born in Mexico, had polite reservations. "I kind of admire all the effort they make to follow that religion, but sometimes you have to adapt to the workplace." An immigrant from El Salvador was less sympathetic. "They used to go to the bathroom," said José Amaya, "but actually they're praying and the rest of us have to do their work." Raul A. García, a 73-year-old Mexican meat packer, told The New York Times, “The Latino is very humble, but they [the Somalis] are arrogant... They act like the United States owes them.”

Differences of opinion arose over whether the prayers, which are a religious obligation five times a day for practicing Muslims and vary in exact time according the position of the sun, constitute a reasonable accommodation or an undue burden upon non-Muslim coworkers. Abdifatah Warsame, a Somali meat packer, told The New York Times that "Latinos were sometimes saying, ‘Don’t pray, don’t pray’".

As the Muslim holy month of Ramadan approached during 2007 the Somalis requested time off for religious reasons. Observant Muslims fast throughout daylight hours during Ramadan. Management refused, believing it would affect the production line. Dozens of Somali workers quit their jobs temporarily in protest. Negotiations between the Somali workers and management broke down in October 2007. Some of the fired Somalis filed religious discrimination complaints with the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

Problems resurfaced after September 10, 2008 when Somali workers approached plant general manager Dennis Sydow with a request to start their dinner half an hour before the usual schedule in order to break their Ramadan fast closer to sundown. Sydow refused due to concern the request would slow production and burden non-Muslim workers. During the same month a Somali woman complained that a plant supervisor had kicked her while she was praying. The union investigated the charge and the supervisor responded that he had not seen her while she bent in prayer and had only kicked the cardboard that was underneath her.

Somali workers walked out on strike September 15 and protested at Grand Island City Hall, asking for prayer time. The following day the union brokered a compromise with plant management to move the dinner break by 15 minutes. Plant scheduling rules would have reduced the work day by 15 minutes with resulting loss in pay for the hourly workers.

A Somali worker, Abdalla Omar, told the press "We had complaints from the whites, Hispanics and [Christian] Sudanese". False rumors spread about further cuts to the work day and preferential concessions to the Somalis. Over 1,000 non-Somalis staged a counterprotest on September 17. Union and management returned to the original dinner schedule. Substantial numbers of Somali workers left the plant afterward and either quit or were fired as a result. Sources differ as to the number of Somalis who still work at the plant: The New York Times reports union leadership as saying 300 remain, while Somali community leaders assert the number is closer to 100.

The EEOC has sent staff to determine whether treatment of Somali workers has been in compliance with the The Civil Rights Act of 1964. Under the law, employers must make reasonable accommodation for religious practices, but the law grants exceptions if religious practice places substantial hardship on an employer's business.

Doug Schult, the JBS Swift manager in charge of labor relations, expressed frustration at the inability to resolve the problem, which had surfaced in a Colorado plant as well as the Nebraska plant. He told The Wall Street Journal that his office had spent months trying to understand and comply with new EEOC guidelines in light of conflicting pressures. Local union chapter president Daniel O. Hoppes of United Food and Commercial Workers worries that similar problems could continue to arise at the plant. "Right now, this is a real kindling box".


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IMF prepares to help Hungary and Ukraine

October 17, 2008

The International Monetary Fund (IMF) is preparing a series of loans to both Hungary and Ukraine as financial problems are hitting the two countries. Hungary has already received a 5 billion credit line from the (ECB). Ukraine is seeking a loan of up to 14 billion.

The credit line to Hungary will be used to cover banks’ shortage of euros. Hungary has a severe debt problem with them posting an account deficit of €5.3 billion or 4.9% of GDP this year. As a result of this, Hungary is unable to find suitable credit to store up its supply of euros.

"We are in close dialogue with the Hungarian authorities and the EU to discuss further responses to the current challenges, including possible technical and financial support by the IMF", said Dominique Strauss-Kahn, Managing Director of the IMF. "I have informed the authorities that the IMF stands ready to assist their efforts. We will provide technical assistance as needed and, in the context of a supportive policy setting, are ready to undertake [decisions] on possible financial assistance, responding rapidly."

Ukraine's Finance Minister met with an IMF team on Thursday. In a statement, Pynzenyk said "the parties discussed a situation of influence the world financial crisis had on the economy of Ukraine." It is not yet known how much the IMF is expected to lend to Ukraine but it is expected to be between $3 billion to $14 billion. It is also not known what type of conditions might be placed on the loan.

In addition to financial uncertainty, Ukraine is suffering from political turmoil with the current President, Viktor Yushchenko, calling a snap parliamentary election for December. The Prime Minister,, has made moves to stop the election. Ukraine's yearly trade deficit has increased by almost $7 billion since last year.

The credit line by the European Central Bank is the first time publicly that it has extended help to countries other than the 15 that make up the.

According to, Hungary might be able to start the process of joining the euro quicker then expected. Currently, Hungary is on track to join the euro in 2011 or 2012, but if sped up, it is possible it could join as early as 2010. This might protect Hungary from further financial problems.


text:
Fear and loathing on the campaign trail, September 2008

October 17, 2008 September 2008 on the campaign trail was a month full of surprise and calls for unity despite a growing negativity. The was held and the start of the  threatened to plague the first.

 * Republicans
 * At the Republican National Convention in, some notable moments included ’s coining of the phrase “” during a convention speech not carried on the major networks. Rudy Giuliani and  each gave keynote addresses that attacked Senator Obama, especially in Giuliani’s case.  The most memorable moment was Governor Sarah Palin’s speech, seen by as many Americans as Obama’s during the , in which she gave a critically acclaimed performance that overshadowed McCain’s speech on the final day.
 * Congressman and former Presidential candidate Ron Paul held a counter convention of his own at the in  that drew a crowd of 12,000 people.  The convention featured former Minnesota governor, widely speculated to make a presidential run in 2012. During the convention Ventura.
 * Following the Republican Convention McCain experienced a surge in polling, which greatly reduced Obama’s slight lead and showed McCain with a lead in most polling for the first time since May 2008. The selection of Palin also increased Republican voter enthusiasm in the polls.
 * Following the stock market crash later in September and the subsequent negotiations for a, Senator McCain suspended his campaign and returned to Washington D.C. to try to reach an agreement. He asked Senator Obama to join him and postpone the debate scheduled for later in the week but Obama responded that he could do both and that he would show up for the debate at the.
 * On the day of the debate, questions swirled over whether or not McCain would show, he did and the debate was held. The debate moderated by was supposed to surround foreign policy but the economic crisis took center stage, which Obama and McCain mostly agreed upon. The differences surrounded McCain’s differences with Obama on the  and Obama’s earlier suggestion that he would meet with leaders of rogue nations without preconditions.

 * Democrats
 * As most media attention surrounded Sarah Palin in the beginning of September, Obama-Biden fell in the polls and were not at the focus of most news stories, however on September 11, Obama and McCain called a truce and met in New York City for the seventh anniversary of 9/11.
 * Barack Obama launched an ad campaign that criticized John McCain as “out of touch” and “out of date” highlighting his . Biden criticized his running mate’s ad as “terrible” and also criticized an ad by the McCain campaign from earlier in the month that suggested that Obama supports  for  level children.
 * Later in September Obama abandoned his earlier 50-state strategy withdrawing resources from traditional red states such as North Dakota, Montana and Georgia that Obama stated he would contest. The campaign removed staffers from some states and sent them to nearby states considered to be winnable, such as from Georgia to North Carolina.
 * Following the economic crisis, Obama’s numbers raised significantly in the polls leading McCain by as many as seven points by the end of the month. Obama asked McCain to appear with him at a press conference to restore consumer confidence. Obama also joined McCain in Washington to help with the negotiations on a bailout plan. But he rejected McCain’s call to postpone the presidential debate.
 * At the presidential debate many critics believed Obama presented himself as presidential, the task many claimed he needed to accomplish. During the debate Obama linked the financial crisis to policies and spoke out against the lead up to the war in Iraq and the need for more troops in Afghanistan.

 * Third parties
 * presidential nominee Bob Barr asked Congressman and Libertarian Party presidential nominee Ron Paul to run with him as his . Barr’s running mate  volunteered to step down if Paul accepted, but he declined.
 * Congressman Ron Paul appeared at a press conference with the and ’s presidential nominees  and  as well as Independent candidate . He announced that he was endorsing all four major third party candidates including Libertarian nominee Bob Barr.
 * After Barr admonished Paul for his endorsement of four candidates, believing the congressman should endorse, Paul removed his endorsement for Barr and decided in a statement to endorse Constitution Party nominee , a candidate whom he called a “friend” and an “active supporter” of his campaign.
 * Following the presidential debate in which he was not allowed to participate in, Barr criticized both presidential candidates for their support of the bailout plan; he called it a “debate between big government and bigger government.” Barr then referred to himself as the “change” candidate.

Editor's Note
Fear and Loathing on the Campaign Trail... is a monthly article about the campaign events during the past month. The title is based on the series of articles written by journalist and compiled into a publication entitled .


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Talk:Fear and loathing on the campaign trail, September 2008

sorry about the tardiness of this article. Next month's will not be this late.--William Saturn (talk) 00:46, 17 October 2008 (UTC)


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User talk:60.234.223.8

Your disruptive edits have earned you a short-term time-out from editing. --SVTCobra 00:59, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

title: User talk:60.234.223.8


text: Talk:IMF prepares to help Hungary and Ukraine


text:
Template:Quiz

This is a hopefully simplified interface to the quiz extension. For more advanced features of the quiz system or for longer than 60 questions see mw:extension:Quiz.

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 * Q[question numb between 1-60]=Question text (and optionally an image) - [[image:SomeAssociatedImage.png|right|40px]] what is foo?
 * Q[question numb between 1-60][Choice letter (capital, A-E)]=text of choice
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title: Template:Quiz


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User:Raghuvarv~enwikinews

A lazy but intelligent and crazy dude. Interests include chats(a breed of junk food),astronomy,paleontology and military history. I'm an atheist. I can't stand nonsensical beliefs like those of creationists.

title: User:Raghuvarv~enwikinews


text:
Comments:Dinosaur tracks found in Arabian Peninsula

Dinosaur tracks found in Arabian Peninsula
what is the dinosaur that made that foot print —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 2001:8f8:1731:3121:8de:eddf:26ee:feb6 (talk • contribs) 15:37, 24 November 2022 (UTC)

 * A . Augusthorsesdroppings10 (talk) 02:15, 25 November 2022 (UTC)


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Fire ruins historical building of Prague Exhibition Grounds

October 17, 2008

The left wing of the Industrial Palace (Průmyslový palác) – central building of the Prague Exhibition Grounds (Výstaviště) in the capital city of Czech Republic was destroyed by fire yesterday night. The fire began at the roof and flames were visible from kilometers away. Two hundred firefighters fought the fire and got it under control in less than three hours. Two firefighters suffered minor injuries.

The left wing of the Art Nouveau building was destroyed, the roof and most of enclosure walls collapsed. The amount of damage can rise up to 1 billion Czech crowns (approx. 40 million euro). Although a student music festival was organized in close surroundings, none were injured.

Mayor of Prague Pavel Bém promised the city will rebuild the Palace, but refused to comment immediately on the view of the new or renewed building.

The Industrial Palace was inaugurated in 1891. It was the biggest building on the exhibition grounds. Architect Bedřich Münzberger used the glassed-in steel structures for the first time in the Czech lands. The building was 238 meters long and its main tower was 51 meters tall. It was used mainly for trade fairs and exhibitions, but also for concerts and other culture events.

The cause of the fire is under investigation, and could take a week to discover the cause. Press reports suggest the fire is connected to the October 9 murder of businessman Václav Kočka junior, whose father is engaged in the Incheba company and has been leasing the exhibition grounds since 2001. Václav Kočka senior is a friend of former Czech prime minister Jiří Paroubek. However, authorities mentioned an accident – explosion of pressure gas cylinder – was the probable cause. Incheba said they have video of the explosion recorded from the security cameras.


text:
Comments:MUFON releases report on UFO sighting in Stephenville, Texas

Comments from feedback form - "roflroflrofl rofl"
roflroflrofl rofl —202.45.119.61 (talk) 04:27, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Comments from feedback form - "i would to say that this is a ..."
i would to say that this is a very good report —170.190.40.78 (talk) 21:28, 18 July 2010 (UTC)

Comments from feedback form - "AWESOME"
AWESOME —76.30.88.207 (talk) 13:33, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Comments from feedback form - "Why is there no link to the le..."
Why is there no link to the lengthy report on radar records from Stephenville? —67.233.169.233 (talk) 01:20, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

its true
i have documents i am just waiting to verify, when i meet hmmm lets call them the x ppl, it was over bushes ranch and it used a transporter same kind as when they abduct ppl and drop them off will show you proof soon once i have met and verified the leaked docs with the x ppl

My husband and I
My husband and I saw the UFO over the Bush ranch. We were interviewed by a rep from MUFON. We were living in a house on my family's farm just west of Crawford at the time. We use to watch the presidential helicopter land out at the ranch...we knew exactly where it was on the horizon. The UFO was right over it. It was a bright light traveling slowly parallel to the ground and then it shot UP at a speed that I would call faster than a shooting star. 69.7.89.74 (talk) 17:07, 10 June 2023 (UTC)

Similar 1969
We have very similar UFO report, that happened 1969. In Pori city airforce radar found 7 fireballs over the Pori airport. At the same time there was one Fouga Magiater Jet pilot on air. He was ordered to fly there and report what there is. When a pilot was coming there, those 7 balls ordered to convoy and speed up about 1000 mph and disappeared. Fouga jet was too slow to follow them.

Soon another airport in Vaasa city noticed a radar signal of 7 balls near Vaasa airport, 500 km from Pori.

This is public information. You can check details from airforce report. Unsigned by 14BB:CD:83B5:E105:8F6:EA61:93DB on 20:09, 11 June 2023}}


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Talk:Clash of cultures: Somali and Latino workers at U.S. meat packing plants

Review
--Brian McNeil / talk 12:10, 17 October 2008 (UTC)