text:
Wikinews interviews Steve Kissing, independent candidate for US President

February 16, 2008

While nearly all coverage of the 2008 Presidential election has focused on the Democratic and Republican candidates, there are small political parties offering candidates, and those who choose to run without a party behind them, independents.

Wikinews is interviewing some of these citizens who are looking to become the 43rd person elected to serve their nation from 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW.

Our second interview is with Cincinnati, Ohio's Steve Kissing, a divorced father of two who is a creative director at an advertising agency.

Interview
Why do you want to be President?
 * In a very real sense, I don’t want to be President of the United States. It's not something I've been planning or hoping to do. (Though I have long-fantasized about "sleeping with" my wife in the Lincoln Bedroom.) But I know, at the very core of my being, that true and dramatic change is required and that someone, a non-politician, must step forward. Rather than stand on the sidelines and wonder why no one was volunteering to lead the revolution, I thought it only fair and responsible to toss my own hat into the ring.

 * I want to help bring about a true sea change, one that will lead to a better America, and a better world. Specifically, I want to help lay to rest, permanently, the political class and establishment. This blood-sucking behemoth, which many of us have resigned ourselves to living with, is more concerned about power than prosperity, more interested in power than peace, more vested in power than eradicating poverty.

Have you ever run for political office before?
 * I have never run for a political office, outside of student government. I consider this a strength, not a weakness.

 * We keep expecting politicians to bring about real change as it relates to health care, education, the environment and other key concerns of all Americans. But real change rarely comes from our politicians who often seem more eager to appear on the Sunday morning talk shows than to get real, bi-partisan work accomplished. This is also why one of my slogans is: "Elect a person, not a politician."

 * Over the years (I am 44 years old), I have voted for Republicans, Democrats and Independents. I have done a small bit of campaigning for candidates running for local offices at the city or county level. But it has been years since I have done so.

'''What is your current job? What skills or ideas do you bring from this position, or previous positions, that will benefit the Oval Office?'''
 * I have spent nearly 25 years in the advertising industry, and I am currently a creative director at an ad agency called Barefoot, located in Cincinnati.

 * Through my profession, I have come to appreciate that how things are communicated is just as important as what is being communicated. Sometimes the words we choose or the method we select to share an idea gets in the way of people appreciating it and embracing it. Why is this important? Because a President who is attentive to not only what he is saying, but how he is saying it, is apt to be more effective at rallying people to a common cause.

 * My work in advertising, for which I have won many awards, has demanded that I generate creative solutions, and help inspire them in others, virtually every single day. I know how to "think outside the box." Why is this important? We all know that our country and world face major challenges, to put it mildly. Our only hope in overcoming these challenges is our ability to generate innovative solutions.

'''Identify the three most important issues, what would they be? How will you address these issues?'''

 * Global warming. I endorse tax incentives and government grant programs to support and reward those private-sector initiatives aimed at developing renewable energy sources, or improving the efficiency of traditional, carbon-based energy sources.

 * In addition, I have proposed that NASA be “repurposed” for two to three decades to help fight global warming. What I envision is asking the very bright scientists and engineers at NASA to direct their gaze down at Earth rather than up in the stars. This way, we can tap into their collective brainpower to help develop new technologies to improve energy efficiency and to slow global warming.

 * I have long been a fan of NASA and space travel, and I understand and appreciate the many benefits of space exploration. But the need is so great to slow, and eventually halt, global warming, that drastic measures are required.

 * National Security. As President, I would keep a healthy military and intelligence budget, all along making sure that we are training and caring for our soldiers as they prepare and wait for duty, as they are assigned and as they return and adjust to civilian life. Our record on this hasn’t been pretty of late. I would also raise the pay of all military personnel. Finally, I would make sure that we have the best-equipped fighting force in the world.

 * I would work quickly to secure our borders by putting additional measures in place: monitored fencing; more border crossing guards; small, mobile groups of elite soldiers to “spot check” our borders; more resources for the Coast Guard to protect our shores; and more human and technical resources to monitor those who come to play or work in our country.

 * We need to talk more with other nations, especially those we consider enemies or those that are particularly influential in world affairs. As such, I will invest in a more robust diplomatic core, particularly with China and the Middle East.

 * I will also work with diplomats as well as community and religious leaders to create an atmosphere of mutual respect and understanding among the great faiths of the world, particularly, though not exclusively, between Christianity and Islam.

 * Finally, as noted above, I will be an advocate for new technologies and more eco-friendly ways of living that can drastically reduce our dependence on foreign oil.

 * Education and Healthcare. I combine these issues because, if America is to remain a vibrant nation, our citizens must be strong and nimble when it comes to both mind and body.

 * I support vouchers and privatized education. Let’s allow the free market and competition improve the effectiveness and efficiency of our educational system.

 * We need to also better compensate our teachers, but we must also hold them to higher standards of excellence. Teachers have an important, tough job, but too many have "tuned out". I would love our culture to evolve to the point where teaching is given the respect, admiration and financial incentives that, say, doctors and lawyers do.

 * We absolutely need universal health care, but the free market should remain at the helm, with private companies competing for the government’s business.

 * In addition, our national healthcare program must focus on patient education, motivation and preventative health. Treating people via the emergency room for conditions that could have easily been prevented with some attentive care, need to be eliminated.

'''Campaigning for the American presidency is one of the most expensive exercises in the world. How do you deal with the cost and fundraising?'''
 * The fact that it costs so much to run for President should alarm every American. The huge sums of money required to be a viable candidate only serve to keep politics and politicians focused on money, and those who provide it and the special interest they represent.

 * I am hoping to rely on my own creativity and that of my supporters to get our message out. With any luck, our "untainted" message will breakthrough. I'm not foolish enough to expect that this will be easy, or that it’s likely. But my longing for a different kind of politics, and a different kind of politician keeps me hopeful.

'''Do you have a running mate yet? Who are they? What are you looking for in a running mate?'''
 * I do not have a running mate, but I am seeking nominations on my website (kissing4prez.org). I’m looking for someone who shares my fundamental belief that politics as usual needs to go, and fast. I am looking for someone with a proven track record in generating creative thoughts and solutions; someone who is open-minded and willing to make compromises; some who is hopeful and optimistic. Since my campaign doesn't have a significant budget, I would love to have a vice-presidential candidate who has some forum, be that via celebrity, a popular blog or even just being in a band. Personally, I would love to have a candidate who is a person of color, and, ideally, a non-Christian. In fact, I would be most pleased to have a Muslim on my ticket.

'''Can you win the 2008 Presidential election? Can any third party or independent candidate ever win?'''
 * The odds are miniscule, at best, that I can win this election. I know that. I’m not a moron. Nor am I delusional. Or high (at least not at this moment). But I forge on, helping raise awareness for the issues that I think are most pressing. And I want to help encourage people to say bon voyage to the status quo brought to us (and protected) by professional politicians and those who stuff their pockets.

 * People are so frustrated with politicians and politics as usual that I do believe an independent or third-party candidate can indeed win.

If you can't make it into the Oval Office, who would you prefer seeing taking the presidency?
 * Someone who is not a professional politician. Someone with big ideas. Someone with “balls.” Someone with humility.

What should the American people keep in mind, when heading to the polls this November?
 * Two words: Steve Kissing


text:
Talk:Wikinews interviews Steve Kissing, independent candidate for US President

Raw text
(note that the Word document sent by Kissing included italics in some areas, reflected in the published article itself. --  Zanimum - (talk) 19:14, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Why do you want to be President?

In a very real sense, I don’t want to be President of the United States. It’s not something I’ve been planning or hoping to do. (Though I have long-fantasized about “sleeping with” my wife in the Lincoln Bedroom.) But I know, at the very core of my being, that true and dramatic change is required and that someonea non-politicianmust step forward. Rather than stand on the sidelines and wonder why no one was volunteering to lead the revolution, I thought it only fair and responsible to toss my own hat into the ring.

I want to help bring about a true sea change, one that will lead to a better America, and a better world. Specifically, I want to help lay to rest, permanently, the political class and establishment. This blood-sucking behemoth, which many of us have resigned ourselves to living with, is more concerned about power than prosperity, more interested in power than peace, more vested in power than eradicating poverty.

Have you ever run for political office before?

I have never run for a political office, outside of student government. I consider this a strength, not a weakness.

We keep expecting politicians to bring about real change as it relates to health care, education, the environment and other key concerns of all Americans. But real change rarely comes from our politicians who often seem more eager to appear on the Sunday morning talk shows than to get real, bi-partisan work accomplished. This is also why one of my slogans is: “Elect a person, not a politician.”

Over the years (I am 44 years old), I have voted for Republicans, Democrats and Independents. I have done a small bit of campaigning for candidates running for local offices at the city or county level. But it has been years since I have done so.

What is your current job? What skills or ideas do you bring from this position, or previous positions, that will benefit the Oval Office?

I have spent nearly 25 years in the advertising industry, and I am currently a creative director at an ad agency called Barefoot (thinkbarefoot.com), located in Cincinnati.

Through my profession, I have come to appreciate that how things are communicated is just as important as what is being communicated. Sometimes the words we choose or the method we select to share an idea gets in the way of people appreciating it and embracing it. Why is this important? Because a President who is attentive to not only what he is saying, but how he is saying it, is apt to be more effective at rallying people to a common cause.

My work in advertising, for which I have won many awards, has demanded that I generate creative solutionsand help inspire them in othersvirtually every single day. I know how to “think outside the box.” Why is this important? We all know that our country and world face major challenges, to put it mildly. Our only hope in overcoming these challenges is our ability to generate innovative solutions.

Identify the three most important issues, what would they be? How will you address these issues?

Global warming. I endorse tax incentives and government grant programs to support and reward those private-sector initiatives aimed at developing renewable energy sources, or improving the efficiency of traditional, carbon-based energy sources.

In addition, I have proposed that NASA be “repurposed” for two to three decades to help fight global warming. What I envision is asking the very bright scientists and engineers at NASA to direct their gaze down at Earth rather than up in the stars. This way, we can tap into their collective brainpower to help develop new technologies to improve energy efficiency and to slow global warming.

I have long been a fan of NASA and space travel, and I understand and appreciate the many benefits of space exploration. But the need is so great to slow, and eventually halt, global warming, that drastic measures are required.

National Security. As President, I would keep a healthy military and intelligence budget, all along making sure that we are training and caring for our soldiers as they prepare and wait for duty, as they are assigned and as they return and adjust to civilian life. Our record on this hasn’t been pretty of late. I would also raise the pay of all military personnel. Finally, I would make sure that we have the best-equipped fighting force in the world.

I would work quickly to secure our borders by putting additional measures in place: monitored fencing; more border crossing guards; small, mobile groups of elite soldiers to “spot check” our borders; more resources for the Coast Guard to protect our shores; and more human and technical resources to monitor those who come to play or work in our country.

We need to talk more with other nations, especially those we consider enemies or those that are particularly influential in world affairs. As such, I will invest in a more robust diplomatic core, particularly with China and the Middle East.

I will also work with diplomats as well as community and religious leaders to create an atmosphere of mutual respect and understanding among the great faiths of the world, particularly, though not exclusively, between Christianity and Islam.

Finally, as noted above, I will be an advocate for new technologies and more eco-friendly ways of living that can drastically reduce our dependence on foreign oil.

Education and Healthcare. I combine these issues because, if America is to remain a vibrant nation, our citizens must be strong and nimble when it comes to both mind and body.

I support vouchers and privatized education. Let’s allow the free market and competition improve the effectiveness and efficiency of our educational system.

We need to also better compensate our teachers, but we must also hold them to higher standards of excellence. Teachers have an important, tough job, but too many have “tuned out.” I would love our culture to evolve to the point where teaching is given the respect, admiration and financial incentives that, say, doctors and lawyers do.

We absolutely need universal health care, but the free market should remain at the helm, with private companies competing for the government’s business.

In addition, our national healthcare program must focus on patient education, motivation and preventative health. Treating people via the emergency room for conditions that could have easily been prevented with some attentive care, need to be eliminated.

Campaigning for the American presidency is one of

the most expensive exercises in the world. How do you deal with the cost and fundraising?

The fact that it costs so much to run for President should alarm every American. The huge sums of money required to be a viable candidate only serve to keep politics and politicians focused on moneyand those who provide it and the special interest they represent.

I am hoping to rely on my own creativity and that of my supporters to get our message out. With any luck, our “untainted” message will breakthrough. I’m not foolish enough to expect that this will be easy, or that it’s likely. But my longing for a different kind of politics, and a different kind of politician keeps me hopeful.

Do you have a running mate yet? Who are they?

What are you/were you looking for in a running mate?

I do not have a running mate, but I am seeking nominations on my website (kissing4prez.org). I’m looking for someone who shares my fundamental belief that politics as usual needs to goand fast. I am looking for someone with a proven track record in generating creative thoughts and solutions; someone who is open-minded and willing to make compromises; some who is hopeful and optimistic. Since my campaign doesn’t have a significant budget, I would love to have a vice-presidential candidate who has some forum, be that via celebrity, a popular blog or even just being in a band. Personally, I would love to have a candidate who is a person of color, and, ideally, a non-Christian. In fact, I would be most pleased to have a Muslim on my ticket.

Can you win the 2008 Presidential election? Can any third party or independent candidate ever win?

The odds are miniscule, at best, that I can win this election. I know that. I’m not a moron. Nor am I delusional. Or high (at least not at this moment). But I forge on, helping raise awareness for the issues that I think are most pressing. And I want to help encourage people to say bon voyage to the status quobrought to us (and protected) by professional politicians and those who stuff their pockets.

People are so frustrated with politicians and politics as usual that I do believe an independent or third-party candidate can indeed win.

If you can't make it into the Oval Office, who would you prefer seeing taking the presidency?

Someone who is not a professional politician. Someone with big ideas. Someone with “balls.” Someone with humility.

What should the American people keep in mind, when heading to the polls this November?

Two words: Steve Kissing

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/


text:
User:AzaToth/Tickertest

This is a template to include the ticker. More information is on the ticker page.

title: User:AzaToth/Tickertest


text:
Talk:Wikinews interviews Brad Lord-Leutwyler, independent candidate for US President

Raw text
Brad Lord-Leutwyler Independent Presidential Candidate 2008 WWW.VOTEFORBRAD.COM "We the People must take our country back."

-Original Message- From: Nicholas Moreau [mailto:nicholasmoreau@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 12:35 PM To: INFO@VOTEFORBRAD.COM; physhead999@yahoo.com; crisericson@yahoo.com; info@frankforthefolks.org Subject: Re: Wikinews (like Wikipedia) wants to interview you

- Show quoted text - Just noticing your the campaigns for the three of you, thought I'd send the questions by.

Nick

On Thu, Feb 14, 2008 at 3:10 PM, Nicholas Moreau  wrote: > Hi, > > I'm a reporter for Wikinews, and I'd like to interview you for our > 2008 Presidential election coverage. > > We had planned coverage of the independent and third party candidates

> a while back, and I contacted many of you then, but due to some > delays, it was pushed back until now. > > Posted below are a series of questions. Most are for all candidates,

> but the second question is worded two ways, one for third party > candidates, another way for independents. Same base question, just the

> slightest of changes. The questions have word limits, please respect > them. I only put these in place to remind you that most voters > appreciate politicians getting to the point. > > Anyway, whenever you can return this interview to me, I will publish

> it on Wikinews, and link to it from Wikipedia. > > Thanks, > Nick Moreau > Accredited reporter > Wikinews > > > > > > > All (max 500 words): Why do you want to be President? RESPONSE:      I do not WANT to be the President. The major party candidates have two fatal flaws: They cannot "make change happen" because they will always have to fight the other party in congress, and they are all so indebted to their contributors that they are going to have to "pay back" the FIFTY to ONE HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS they raised with special favors. OBAMA is guilty of doing it already, as are McCain and Clinton. NOT I. CHANGE WILL ONLY COME FROM AN INDEPENDENT PRESIDENT. Congress will KNOW that the People have had enough if I am sent to Washington, and they WILL make the change we demand for fear of WE THE PEOPLE voting them out of office too: they love their cushy jobs, and WE need to make them fearful of losing them.

I WILL END THE WAR I WILL SECURE THE BORDER I WILL WIPE OUT POVERTY I WILL FIX THE EDUCATION CRISIS I WILL GET UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE.

> > Third party (max 500 words): Have you ever run for political office > before? RESPONSE: NO

Have you ever been a member of a political party,other than the one you're currently in? RESPONSE: I AM NOT A MEMBER OF A PARTY NOW. I used to belong to the democratic and republican parties until BOTH of those parties put the interests of their party above that of the people.

Have you ever campaigned for another political candidate?

RESPONSE: NO

> > All (max 500 words): What is your current job? REPLY: COLLEGE PROFESSOR -Teacher of Logic and critical thought at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. What skills or ideas do you bring from this position, or previous positions, that will benefit the Oval Office?

RESPONSE: ALL OF OUR IDEAS ARE POSTED AT WWW.VOTEFORBRAD.COM. They are not designed to benefit the oval office. They are designed to benefit ALL AMERICANS.

> All (max 1000 words): Obviously, the next American President and his

> or her administration will face many diverse issues. But if you were > to narrow identify the three most important issues, what would they > be? How will you address these issues? RESPONSE: 1) WAR/NATIONAL SECURITY- End it NOW.  Bring the troops home.  See WWW.VOTEFORBRAD.COM for details. 2)  ECONOMY - Banks and financial/investment institutions have had the last seven years to prove how they will behave under relaxed regulation. They created the sub-prime debacle in the process. They cannot be trusted to act in a responsible manner which takes into account the best interest of the American people. Rather, they act in a greedy and selfish fashion. Theses key institutions need greater regulatory oversight. Also, government spending needs to be brought under control. Obama says that he will pay for his plans with the money he saves by ending the war. THIS IS A LIE! The war is funded by deficit spending. Stopping the war and then spending the money is STILL DEFICIT SPENDING. 3) POVERTY/EDUCATION - Education and poverty are intimately linked. Thomas Jefferson knew it. MLK knew it. I learned it from them.  When you deny proper education, you create poverty, you weaken your economy, you weaken your defenses, you WEAKEN your nation.  NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND must be eliminated and replaced with an intelligent plan, not a specious, knee-jerk fool's errand.

> > All (max 200 words): Campaigning for the American presidency is one > of the most expensive exercises in the world. How do you deal with > the cost and fundraising? REPLY: WE HAVE OVER 3,000,000 supporters and we have not spent a dime. Word of mouth on the internet is our primary way of promoting the campaign. IT IS OBSCENE to be spending 150 MILLION DOLLARS on a campaign. It is also irresponsible and immoral. I REFUSE to do it.

> > All (max 300 words): Do you have a running mate yet? Who are they? > What are you/were you looking for in a running mate?

REPLY: WE ARE DRAFTING GEN. COLIN POWELL AS OUR RUNNING MATE.

> > All (max 300 words): Can you win the 2008 Presidential election? Can

> any third party or independent candidate ever win? REPLY: ANY person can win the Presidency. THE AMERICAN PEOPLE need to take responsibility for their government, STOP FALLING FOR EMPTY SLOGANS and start THINKING about who they are voting for and why. As soon as Americans THINK about those issues, the major parties will be in serious trouble.

> > All (max 100 words): If you can't make it into the Oval Office, who > would you prefer seeing taking the presidency? REPLY: COLIN POWELL

> > All (max 200 words): What should the American people keep in mind, > when heading to the polls this November? > REPLY: Vote for the best candidate with the best team of thinkers. Republicans voted for Bush because they did not want Kerry, NOT because they loved Bush. Now, MOST republicans regret their choice. Democrats do the same thing. THE BEST CANDIDATE and team is found at WWW.VOTEFORBRAD.COM. If you vote with your BRAIN and NOT with irrational fear (i.e. "If I vote for Brad, I might be helping candidate XXX win." is irrational, illogical and IS WHY WE ARE IN THE MESS WE ARE IN.


text:
Wikinews interviews Brad Lord-Leutwyler, independent candidate for US President

February 16, 2008

While nearly all cover of the 2008 Presidential election has focused on the Democratic and Republican candidates, there are small political parties offering candidates, and those who choose to run without a party behind them, independents.

Wikinews is interviewing some of these citizens who are looking to become the 43rd person elected to serve their nation from 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW.

Our third interview is with Henderson, Nevada's Brad Lord-Leutwyler, a professor of logic and critical thought at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. Capitalisation and formatting is that of the candidate, not Wikinews.

Interview
Why do you want to be President?
 * I do not WANT to be the President. The major party candidates have two fatal flaws: They cannot "make change happen" because they will always have to fight the other party in congress, and they are all so indebted to their contributors that they are going to have to "pay back" the FIFTY to ONE HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS they raised with special favors.  OBAMA is guilty of doing it already, as are McCain and Clinton.  NOT I.  CHANGE WILL ONLY COME FROM AN INDEPENDENT PRESIDENT.  Congress will KNOW that the People have had enough if I am sent to Washington, and they WILL make the change we demand for fear of WE THE PEOPLE voting them out of office too: they love their cushy jobs, and WE need to make them fearful of losing them.

 * I WILL END THE WAR
 * I WILL SECURE THE BORDER
 * I WILL WIPE OUT POVERTY
 * I WILL FIX THE EDUCATION CRISIS
 * I WILL GET UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE.

Have you ever run for political office before?
 * NO

Have you ever been a member of a political party, other than the one you're currently in?
 * I AM NOT A MEMBER OF A PARTY NOW. I used to belong to the democratic and republican parties until BOTH of those parties put the interests of their party above that of the people.

Have you ever campaigned for another political candidate?
 * NO

What is your current job?
 * COLLEGE PROFESSOR -Teacher of Logic and critical thought at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas.

What skills or ideas do you bring from this position, or previous positions, that will benefit  the Oval Office?
 * ALL OF OUR IDEAS ARE POSTED AT WWW.VOTEFORBRAD.COM. They are not designed to benefit the oval office.  They are designed to benefit ALL AMERICANS.

'''Obviously, the next American President and his or her administration will face many diverse issues. But if you were to narrow identify the three most important issues, what would they be? How will you address these issues?'''
 * 1) WAR/NATIONAL SECURITY- End it NOW.  Bring the troops home.  See WWW.VOTEFORBRAD.COM for details.
 * 2) ECONOMY - Banks and financial/investment institutions have had the last seven years to prove how they will behave under relaxed regulation. They created the sub-prime debacle in the process.  They cannot be trusted to act in a responsible manner which takes into account the best interest of the American people.  Rather, they act in a greedy and selfish fashion.  Theses key institutions need greater regulatory oversight.  Also, government spending needs to be brought under control. Obama says that he will pay for his plans with the money he saves by ending the war.  THIS IS A LIE!  The war is funded by deficit spending. Stopping the war and then spending the money is STILL DEFICIT SPENDING.
 * 3) POVERTY/EDUCATION - Education and poverty are intimately linked. Thomas Jefferson knew it. MLK knew it. I learned it from them.  When you deny proper education, you create poverty, you weaken your economy, you weaken your defenses, you WEAKEN your nation.  NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND must be eliminated and replaced with an intelligent plan, not a specious, knee-jerk fool's errand.

'''Campaigning for the American presidency is one of the most expensive exercises in the world. How do you deal with the cost and fundraising?'''
 * WE HAVE OVER 3,000,000 supporters and we have not spent a dime. Word of mouth on the internet is our primary way of promoting the campaign. IT IS OBSCENE to be spending 150 MILLION DOLLARS on a campaign.  It is also irresponsible and immoral.  I REFUSE to do it.

'''Do you have a running mate yet? Who are they? What are you/were you looking for in a running mate?'''
 * WE ARE DRAFTING GEN. COLIN POWELL AS OUR RUNNING MATE.

'''Can you win the 2008 Presidential election? Can any third party or independent candidate ever win?'''
 * ANY person can win the Presidency. THE AMERICAN PEOPLE need to take responsibility for their government, STOP FALLING FOR EMPTY SLOGANS and start THINKING about who they are voting for and why.  As soon as Americans THINK about those issues, the major parties will be in serious trouble.

If you can't make it into the Oval Office, who would you prefer seeing taking the presidency?
 * Colin Powell.

What should the American people keep in mind, when heading to the polls this November?
 * Vote for the best candidate with the best team of thinkers. Republicans voted for Bush because they did not want Kerry, NOT because they loved Bush. Now, MOST republicans regret their choice.  Democrats do the same thing.  THE BEST CANDIDATE and team is found at WWW.VOTEFORBRAD.COM.  If you vote with your BRAIN and NOT with irrational fear (i.e. "If I vote for Brad, I might be helping candidate XXX win." is irrational, illogical and IS WHY WE ARE IN THE MESS WE ARE IN.


text:
User talk:213.118.188.35

Welcome
Welcome!

213.118.188.35, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews:
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 * Existing articles need expanding and checking for spelling and mistakes
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 * Discussions need your input
 * And of course, stories need writing!

Here are some other hints and tips:

 * I would recommend that you get a username. You don't have to log in to read or edit articles on Wikinews, but creating an account is quick, free and non-intrusive, requires no personal information (not even an e-mail address), and there are many benefits of having a username.  (If you edit without a username, your IP address is used to identify you instead.)

 * When using talk pages (the "collaboration" tab at the top of the page), or the comments pages (tab "opinions"), please sign your name at the end of your messages by typing four tildes (~~). This will automatically produce your username (or IP address) and the date.

If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!Cirt - (talk) 20:42, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

title: User talk:213.118.188.35


text:
User:MDP23/Log1

Text indicated by bullet has been reviewed and added into Interview format to: Wikinews interviews Mark Bunker, producer of anti-Scientology website 'XenuTV'.
 * ✅: Everything done here. DragonFire1024 (Talk to the Dragon) 22:12, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

16 Feb 2008 21:42:31<@brianmc> Q: Scientologists can be divided into three main groups: public Scientologists, staff at lower orgs, and Sea Org members with each group smaller than the previous. The Sea Org members can be further divided into two groups; the large number of rank and file and a very small group that includes OSA and RTC. Does it strike you odd that a large percentage of outspoken critics claim to have... 16 Feb 2008 21:50:54<+Mark_Bunker> ..."Think for yoursef?" 16 Feb 2008 21:51:13<+Mark_Bunker> okay... 16 Feb 2008 21:51:29<@DragonFire1024> How do you think most Church members feel about your protests? What would you say to those who would criticize your protests as misguided or the information you post and expose as untrue? 16 Feb 2008 21:55:20<+Mark_Bunker> The only major policy change I've seen from DM is the introduction of the Lisa Cause. What Scientology learned from the tragic death of Lisa McPherson is to have all their members sign a form to say they grant Scientology the right to treat them as they did Lisa and to promise not to sue. Otherwise the group seems to be as militant as when hubbard was still around which is astonishing in a... 16 Feb 2008 21:55:21<+Mark_Bunker> ...way. A cult usually dies with it's founder. I believe Scientology is a cult yet it lurches on with the help of it's richest members and the ability to bleed dry the rank and file. 16 Feb 2008 21:56:29<@brianmc> I assume you mean "Lisa Clause"? 16 Feb 2008 21:57:03<+Mark_Bunker> We are seeing some indications that the Scientologists insde the group are responding to the protests. There was one insider who got a message of support out. Clearly, when materials like the Tom Cruise tape are being leaked, there are people inside who are concerned about how the group is behaving. 16 Feb 2008 21:57:18<+Mark_Bunker> yes. Lisa Clause 16 Feb 2008 21:58:31<+Mark_Bunker> As to Scientologists who say that I don't know what I'm taling about, why do I have documents to back up my claims and they have shore stories? 16 Feb 2008 21:59:38<+Mark_Bunker> ready 16 Feb 2008 21:59:41<@brianmc> We have a somewhat difficult question to put next... 16 Feb 2008 21:59:42<@DragonFire1024> Is R2-45 Auditing a joke within Scientology, or is it actually real? 16 Feb 2008 22:04:16<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker_: Is R2-45 Auditing a joke within Scientology, or is it actually real? 16 Feb 2008 22:04:39-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v Mark_Bunker_] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:06:26<+Mark_Bunker_> I think it was probably a sick joke by Hubbard but he did actually put it in some orders. It's not anything I ever discuss. There is so much sensational material about Scientology. People find it hard to believe the actual truth. I have no knowledge of anyone being shot by Scientology and wouldn't claim otherwise... 16 Feb 2008 22:07:27<@brianmc> Do they actually run camps associated with that? 16 Feb 2008 22:07:34<+Mark_Bunker_> That said, I find it unbelievably odd that DM's mother-in-law supposedly committed suicide by shooting herslef with a shotgun...three times. That's wierd. But I won't say it's murder. 16 Feb 2008 22:08:34<+Mark_Bunker_> R2-45 camps? Never heard of it. DM loves guns but there's no camps fr shooting. 16 Feb 2008 22:09:01<+Mark_Bunker_> next 16 Feb 2008 22:09:07<@brianmc> DF? 16 Feb 2008 22:09:30<@DragonFire1024> What is the next step we should take in raising the general public's awareness of the atrocities of the "Church" of Scientology. Also, besides http://www.XenuTV.com, what are some other, reputable, citable sources of information on these abuses? 16 Feb 2008 22:09:32<+Mark_Bunker_> DM? Dabid Miscavige. 16 Feb 2008 22:09:36<+Mark_Bunker_> David 16 Feb 2008 22:09:39<@DragonFire1024> :L) 16 Feb 2008 22:09:41<@DragonFire1024> :) 16 Feb 2008 22:10:31<@brianmc> DF = DragonFire1024 our raving reporter. :P 16 Feb 2008 22:10:44<@DragonFire1024> :) 16 Feb 2008 22:11:30<+Mark_Bunker_> There are plenty of great sites starting with the granddaddy of them all - www.xenu.net. Professor David Touretzkys various sites are well researched and important resources.  Stop-Narconon and such... 16 Feb 2008 22:12:44<+Mark_Bunker_> My favorite book on Scientology is Bare-Faced Messiah.  It and many others can now be read on the web.  I'd like to do audio book versions of them for people to download.  Where or where is the time, however. 16 Feb 2008 22:12:57<+Mark_Bunker_> next 16 Feb 2008 22:13:02<@DragonFire1024> Why does Scientology accuse people of crimes when they are asked questions? 16 Feb 2008 22:15:28<+Mark_Bunker_> Hubbard put it into writing.  "Always attack - Never defend."  There are policy letters where he ordered people never to answer questions about Scientology but instead twist it around to the crimes of the critic. So when you see that happening in my videos, you are hearing Hubbard's words come through the Scientologist's mouth, whcih is one of the reason I never get mad at them. This is... 16 Feb 2008 22:15:30<+Mark_Bunker_> ...what they are taught. They literally can't think for themselves. 16 Feb 2008 22:15:33<+Mark_Bunker_> next 16 Feb 2008 22:15:46<@brianmc> Mark, we're sitting at a little over an hour of your time used up here, are you game to keep going, or should we be picky on the questions and try and wrap up? I suspect all these people from anonymous are eager to get voiced and have a word with you - the interview was advertised on their network 16 Feb 2008 22:15:47<@DragonFire1024> Why do you think Scientology dangerous? From a European (French) point of view there are many strange organizations in the United States (Nazi party, many religious groups). Why is Scientology your fight? 16 Feb 2008 22:16:15<@DragonFire1024> true 16 Feb 2008 22:16:21<+Mark_Bunker_> I have the afternoon free but it must be boring as hell waiting for me to type something. 16 Feb 2008 22:16:27<@brianmc> heh 16 Feb 2008 22:16:43<@DragonFire1024> :) 16 Feb 2008 22:19:13<+Mark_Bunker_> I think Scientology is dangerous to individuals who find their realities stripped. I think it;s dangerous to families when they are broken up by disconnection.  I think it's dangerous to society when they write laws that our politicians back to attack psychiatry.  Anytime they stop free speech, I think that's bad in general.... 16 Feb 2008 22:21:46<+Mark_Bunker_> Scientology is my fight ebcause others were too afrain to take them on.  I hate bullies.  Scientology (while dangerous) acts like a big school yard bully.  Now if that bully in 4th grade had a crack legal team and a gang of devoted foillowers who would do dirty tricks t send you to jail, a mental ward or the grave -- he would have been a real threat! ... 16 Feb 2008 22:22:45<+Mark_Bunker_> Scientology also brings together my general interest in cults, sci-fi and Hollywood in a unique way. I never expected to pick a fight with a dangerous cult but someone had to stand up to them. I thought I could help. 16 Feb 2008 22:22:48<@brianmc> And that's part of the reasons you support 'Anonymous' and - apart from DDoS - their actions? 16 Feb 2008 22:24:13<+Mark_Bunker_> People need to stand up and speak out. If Anonymous can do that legally and you've shown me you can, then I will happily support that... 16 Feb 2008 22:24:22<@brianmc> I've seen your response to their protest on YouTube you almost seemed proud that a younger generation had "taken up the torch" 16 Feb 2008 22:25:49<+Mark_Bunker_> People have been attempting to get Scientology to reform for close to 60 years. They have resisted all change. When I reached out to Anonymous, I thought I may well get attacked myslef but I saw immediate reform in the group. Scientology could learn a lot from Anonymous. 16 Feb 2008 22:26:58<@brianmc> DF? 16 Feb 2008 22:27:03<@DragonFire1024> What happened to Bob Minton? He is alleged to be in favor of Scientology now. Did they give him an 'incentive' to stop his protests of the Church? In a video of yours, posted on YouTube (Scientology: Clearwater Trip - Day 3 - Pt 2), Minton says that the Church attempted to "pay him money" several times. Did they finally succeed? Or was he blackmailed into shutting up? 16 Feb 2008 22:28:35<+Mark_Bunker_> The biggest protest in the past was maybe 50 - 60 people. Anonymous got thousands of people out everywhere around the globe and did so peacefully. I am proud of them for that. We've laid the groundwork for years. Now hopefully, some of Anonymous will continue to learn more and to speak out. There will be attrition but so far there seems to be an eagerness to make a real positive impact. 16 Feb 2008 22:29:27-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v AutisticPsycho] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:30:28<+AutisticPsycho> How many members of Scientology do you estimate are within the organization? 16 Feb 2008 22:30:53<+Mark_Bunker_> I wrote about Bob on my blog last week. He is my friend and I was there through most of his struggle. Scientology launched a global assault on Bob which we came to describe as having the Terminator coming after you. Rather than type it all out again, check out the blog. 16 Feb 2008 22:30:56<+Mark_Bunker_> http://xenutv.wordpress.com/about-bob-minton-and-the-lmt/ 16 Feb 2008 22:32:27<+Mark_Bunker_> Far fewer than Scientology estimates. they now say ten million but I think they are counting me for coming in a and playing with the e-meter.... 16 Feb 2008 22:33:13<+Mark_Bunker_> The best source would be the census reports which put the number pretty low. More people claimed to be Jedi Knights than Scientologists in the UK for example.... 16 Feb 2008 22:33:53<+Mark_Bunker_> http://www.xenu.net/archive/COS_members.html 16 Feb 2008 22:33:57<+Mark_Bunker_> next 16 Feb 2008 22:34:11<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker_: we are going to open the floor...is it ok that the rest of the pre asked questions be done VIA e-mail? 16 Feb 2008 22:34:16<@brianmc> I think we're about done here, is there anything we should have asked that we didn't? 16 Feb 2008 22:34:17<+Mark_Bunker_> sure 16 Feb 2008 22:34:34<@DragonFire1024> I got a few PM's with some Q's 16 Feb 2008 22:34:38<+Mark_Bunker_> not that I can think of 16 Feb 2008 22:34:44<+Mark_Bunker_> kay 16 Feb 2008 22:34:47<+AutisticPsycho> I have one. 16 Feb 2008 22:34:51<+AutisticPsycho> One more. 16 Feb 2008 22:35:06<+AutisticPsycho> Mark: What is your opinion on Free Zone Scientologists? 16 Feb 2008 22:36:08-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v AutisticPsycho] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:37:18-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+o skenmy] by ChanServ 16 Feb 2008 22:37:20<+Mark_Bunker_> I consider them friends. I support their wish to follow Hubbard's tech. They do so without the criminal aspects of Scientology itself. People can knock themselves auditing as far as I'm concerned. I'm worried about the fraud and abuse. I believe Hubbard was a conman and we have the documents to prove it. If the freezoners don't care, I can't stop them. They aren't emptying people... 16 Feb 2008 22:37:21<+Mark_Bunker_> ...accounts and breaking up families. 16 Feb 2008 22:37:41<@brianmc> Mark_Bunker_: Thank you for your time Mark, you've done pretty well for someone who types with two fingers. :P Smithers! Release the hounds! 16 Feb 2008 22:37:56<@DragonFire1024> ok 16 Feb 2008 22:38:06<@DragonFire1024> I have some users with a few questions 16 Feb 2008 22:38:08<+Mark_Bunker_> Typing is not a favorite past time 16 Feb 2008 22:38:13<@brianmc> heh 16 Feb 2008 22:38:17<@skenmy> Damn - looks like I missed most of the fun ;) 16 Feb 2008 22:38:30-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v DA-freakshow] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:38:36<+DA-freakshow> As you know now, the Anonymous Protests Was Extremely Huge, But we are planning a Second Round The 15th Of March. And i - a 12 year old WILL attend, is that a Good Sign that so young a person Want to be involved, or is it a bad sign? 16 Feb 2008 22:39:10-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v DA-freakshow] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:40:38<+Mark_Bunker_> Well, it's good if you understand what you're getting yourself into and your parents or guardians are aware as well. Scientology is serious.  They won't harm you but the don't play games either.  12 year old kids get swept into Scientology's Cadet Org and moved into the Sea Org shortly after.  That is far more dangerous to a 12 year old than picketing fraud and abuse. 16 Feb 2008 22:41:13-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v Carbonflux] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:41:24<+Carbonflux> Mark_Bunker, can you put any of this in a historical context ? have you studied the history of Scientology in relation to its "parent" organizations ( cults praying on the elite ) in the 18th - 20th centuries ? ( Many of El Ron Hubbard's ideas were taken directly from OTO which he was a member of in his early life for example. ) 16 Feb 2008 22:41:28<+Carbonflux> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordo_Templi_Orientis 16 Feb 2008 22:41:33<+Carbonflux> thanks :) 16 Feb 2008 22:41:39-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v Carbonflux] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:44:09<+Mark_Bunker_> Hubbard did call Crowley his good friend but I doubt that he was seriously deep into it. I think he stumbled into a situation at Jack Parson mansion in whcih he could live high off the rich guys cash and steal his hot girlfriend.  I think he probably enjoyed a good laugh at the satanic rituals he engaged in but it certainly informed his understanding of how to run such a group and how... 16 Feb 2008 22:44:11<+Mark_Bunker_> ...people can buy into any wacky beliuef system. 16 Feb 2008 22:44:49-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v toresbe] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:44:59<+toresbe> By sheer virtue of numbers, we have become very hard to harass, to the point of the personal risk to ourselves being almost negligible. There have been others before us with far more courage who have spoken up against far greater odds. 16 Feb 2008 22:45:26<+toresbe> What do you think the effect of our actions have been on these "pioneers"? (yourself included) Do you personally feel that we anons have revitalized the more "serious" efforts of those in the past who have come out with full names - and have probably gotten into problems over this? And do you believe it serves to ease the process for those scientologists who were already considering leaving? 16 Feb 2008 22:45:32<+toresbe> thanks 16 Feb 2008 22:45:37-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v toresbe] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:45:38<+Mark_Bunker_> To deny Hubbard's connection to OTO is impossible but it also one of the most bizarre aspects of his life and many people would think it impossible and over the top criticism. That was one of the many flaws of the movie, The Profit. 16 Feb 2008 22:49:19<+Mark_Bunker_> Ultimately Anonymous' rise will be beneficial. It can cause people inside to rethink their beliefs and draw media attention to Scientology's fraud and abuse. All very good. The way they rose however is a double edge sword because when I do interviews, I have to respond to white powder mailings and bomb threats. The anonymous nature and early attacks on Scientology make it easier for... 16 Feb 2008 22:49:21<+Mark_Bunker_> ...Scientology to blame these more serious charges on the group. People in the vast unwashed public aren't looking into it very deep and can believe Scientology's distortions... 16 Feb 2008 22:50:13<@brianmc> The issue has had very positive press in Belgium :) 16 Feb 2008 22:51:21<+Mark_Bunker_> There is also the fear that we old timers can be lumped in with those abuses. I'm sure Scientology is going to accuse me of being a  leader of terrorists.  That is a huge risk I run but in helping reshape Anonymous to a kroe peaceful leag group, I believe I am doing a great service to Scientology.  Not that thyey'll thanks me.  Especially if the Tax Exempt status is revoked. 16 Feb 2008 22:51:39<@brianmc> heh 16 Feb 2008 22:52:05-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v jennam] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:52:11<+jennam> Hi Mark, I was just wondering if you were aware of the many other abuses of other religions such as The Watchtower organisation of Jehovah's Witnesses.. They do things strikinly similar to Scientology with regards to killing and abusing members and disconnection policies - now, I'm in no way in favour of the management of Scientology but it does look a little blind to me when these other so-called religions get off scott-fr 16 Feb 2008 22:52:12<+jennam> Have you heard of any such allegations before? My concern is that while a step forward is good against one religion, there are others out there just biding by without no real exposure essentially letting them get away with their abuses. 16 Feb 2008 22:52:13<+jennam> I was also wondering if you knew if The Profit would ever be released for viewing? 16 Feb 2008 22:52:17<+Mark_Bunker_> even i don't know what kroe was supposed to be. Although I remember wanting to type legal after it. 16 Feb 2008 22:52:23<+jennam> (Thanks) 16 Feb 2008 22:52:27-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v jennam] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:55:12<+Mark_Bunker_> jen, there are some horrible abuses in other churches. I interviewed a couple people in a christian cult in Wisconsin with horrific stories to tell. I feel I have my hands full fighting Scientology and hope others speak  out for what they feel needs to be redressed... 16 Feb 2008 22:56:29<+Mark_Bunker_> I stumbled upon a great site awhile back from former members of the Children of god. This group's founder promoted sex with kids and sent women out to recruit new members by sleeping with them. Give me a moment and I think I can find the site... 16 Feb 2008 22:57:17<+Mark_Bunker_> http://www.xfamily.org/index.php/Category:Video_Archives 16 Feb 2008 22:57:50-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v themandotcom] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 22:57:51<+Mark_Bunker_> Watch some of these videos and your jaw will drop. This kind of thing happens every day and we are unaware of it. 16 Feb 2008 22:57:57<+themandotcom> What do you say to those people that say that Anonymous and the similar groups are religous bigots? 16 Feb 2008 22:58:02<+themandotcom> thanks :D 16 Feb 2008 22:58:19-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v themandotcom] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 23:00:17<+Mark_Bunker_> Just say no. People can believe what they want. Just stop the fraud and abuse. And if you speak out against my god Zeus, I will call you a bigot, too! 16 Feb 2008 23:00:59-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v StevenFruitsmaak] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 23:01:16<+StevenFruitsmaak> Mark_Bunker_: Isn't it strange that some countries are recognising Scientology as an official religion while other countries pursue the Church? What would you say to lawmakers in the former country? Perhaps a short 3 things you need to now about CoS? 16 Feb 2008 23:01:17<+StevenFruitsmaak> thanks 16 Feb 2008 23:01:26-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v StevenFruitsmaak] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 23:04:30<+Mark_Bunker_> While there is a shared humanity, there are differences in laws and customs, too. Religion is such a taboo here in the U.S. that cloaking themselves with that was the smartest think Hubbard ever did. Germany has a unique perspective since it is in their charter that they will never again allow an extremist political group to rise again... 16 Feb 2008 23:05:26<+Mark_Bunker_> That is an important thing to point out. They are not just a church. Hubbard wrote about how they should take over the government and be the ones to say what is legal BEFORE Scientology is stopped. 16 Feb 2008 23:05:46-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v Kakama] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 23:06:20<+Kakama> Mr. Bunker, what do you think of the fact that Anonymous' motivations are not a moral outrage and are in fact based on the desire to destroy something and get laughs, aka lulz? What about the fact that Anonymous regularly uses illegal activity for it's purposes (though we have suspended most in this raid) and is often risque and perverted in nature? 16 Feb 2008 23:06:21<+Mark_Bunker_> Another important thing to know is that Scientology lies. If they are talking to you, they are lying to you. Look for the documented proof. 16 Feb 2008 23:06:23<+Kakama> I would also like to add that we wish for you to join us on irc.partyvan.org #xenu for more assistance with establishing long term goals to destroy/cripple the cult. 16 Feb 2008 23:06:45-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v Kakama] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 23:07:01<+Mark_Bunker_> The third thing, DM is a snappy dresser. 16 Feb 2008 23:07:04<+Mark_Bunker_> Sorry couldn't come up with a third thing right now. 16 Feb 2008 23:07:12<@DragonFire1024> lol 16 Feb 2008 23:08:16<+Mark_Bunker_> The thousands in ANonymous who have reached out to me have moved beyond the lulz. There are going to be many who drop out but there are more who will learn and continue.... 16 Feb 2008 23:08:17<@brianmc> Okay, we're going to close off the managed session shortly and allow this to descend into anarchy. 16 Feb 2008 23:09:07<+Mark_Bunker_> Just this morning a member sent me a link to a Portuguese version of the Anonymous message to get people involved in his country... 16 Feb 2008 23:09:32<@skenmy> Bare in mind that we will remove anyone who is offensive or derogatory. Be mature and sensible :) 16 Feb 2008 23:09:47<@DragonFire1024> and patient 16 Feb 2008 23:10:25<@skenmy> I would like to extend my utmost thanks to Mark, on behalf of the Wikinews team :) I'm sure they'll want to chip in as well :) 16 Feb 2008 23:10:32<@DragonFire1024> skenmy: moment 16 Feb 2008 23:10:34<@DragonFire1024> one more 16 Feb 2008 23:10:40<@skenmy> Of course ;) 16 Feb 2008 23:10:56<+Mark_Bunker_> And a 14-year-old girl in Finland said she gave a class report on Scientology because of this and got an A+. She also told me she baked a cake for her mom and dad -- and put my name on it. I told her she's done something no one else on the planet has ever done. :0) 16 Feb 2008 23:11:10<+Mark_Bunker_> So the word gets out at the positive succeeds. 16 Feb 2008 23:11:11<@DragonFire1024> :) 16 Feb 2008 23:11:19<@DragonFire1024> ok one more managed question 16 Feb 2008 23:11:27-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [+v Neglacio] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 23:11:29<+Neglacio> Hey Mark. How do you feel about the several nicknames given to you, like Wise Beard Man, and the several slogans accompanying it? And, by the way, what music do you like? ;) Thanks :D 16 Feb 2008 23:11:44-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-v Neglacio] by DragonFire1024 16 Feb 2008 23:12:43<+Mark_Bunker_> WBM is great. The people at work love it.  I suspect many of the ladies are wearing Wise Beard Man thongs -- but won't admit it.  And possibly some of the guys... 16 Feb 2008 23:13:08<@DragonFire1024> LOL 16 Feb 2008 23:13:22<@skenmy> XD 16 Feb 2008 23:14:27<@brianmc> One last thing before the onset of anarchy... Do you have a photo for us? see http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/WN:YOURPHOTO 16 Feb 2008 23:14:41<+Mark_Bunker_> As for my taste in music, I have to admit I was never in my era at anytime in my life.  I never listended to the radio growing up so I became a fan of people in old movies like Bing Crosby from the Hope and Crosby films.  Don't hate me for it.  My taste runs more to Mel Torme and Rosemary Clooney in their later jazz period and can be heard in some of my videos. 16 Feb 2008 23:15:09<@DragonFire1024> ok...well that's all I have...Mark_Bunker_ anything you want to add? 16 Feb 2008 23:15:32<@DragonFire1024> before we let them take over the channel 16 Feb 2008 23:15:49<+Mark_Bunker_> yes. I hate to lose any cred by saying I love Rosemary Clooney. 16 Feb 2008 23:15:56<@DragonFire1024> heh 16 Feb 2008 23:16:15<@DragonFire1024> We are Wikinews. We don't take sides...We report them 16 Feb 2008 23:16:18<@DragonFire1024> ;) 16 Feb 2008 23:16:18 * skenmy snickers. 16 Feb 2008 23:17:13<@DragonFire1024> ok...the rest of the pre asked questions will be sent VIA e-mail 16 Feb 2008 23:17:24<@DragonFire1024> only because there were so many...so don't feel left out 16 Feb 2008 23:17:25<@skenmy> Thanks everyone! 16 Feb 2008 23:17:41<@DragonFire1024> MarkBunker_ thanks for your time and knowledge 16 Feb 2008 23:17:49<+Mark_Bunker_> Here's perhaps my favorite song however... 16 Feb 2008 23:17:51<+Mark_Bunker_> http://www.ronthemusicmaker.org/music/eng10.ram 16 Feb 2008 23:18:12<+Mark_Bunker_> It's Hubbard himelf singing one of his original songs, "Thank you for Listening." 16 Feb 2008 23:18:21<@DragonFire1024> heh 16 Feb 2008 23:18:32<+Mark_Bunker_> You have to be in a cult to believe this man was a master at everything he touched. 16 Feb 2008 23:19:34<@skenmy> Thanks again to Mark, the Wikinews team running the event, and everyone who asked questions! 16 Feb 2008 23:19:38<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker_ thanks again for everything :) we will e-mauil the questions soon 16 Feb 2008 23:19:47<@skenmy> Keep an eye on http://en.wikinews.org/ for further news and articles 16 Feb 2008 23:19:50<@skenmy> NOTICE: All chat in this room will be logged. That means we can use it if we want :) Consider yourselves warned! 16 Feb 2008 23:20:21<@skenmy> Mark_Bunker_, feel free to drop out at any point :) 16 Feb 2008 23:20:27<+Mark_Bunker_> thanks. 16 Feb 2008 23:20:31-!- mode/#wikinews-interviews [-m] by skenmy --- END OF MODERATED SESSION ---
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:06:57<@brianmc> Okay, time to start I think.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:07:02<@DragonFire1024> I agree
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:07:08<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: ready?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:07:22<@brianmc> have you voiced him?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:07:46<@skenmy> That would, of course, help :)
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:09<@DragonFire1024> OK...
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:19<@DragonFire1024> ground rules
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:22<@DragonFire1024> We have a lot of questions
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:30<@Adambro> DragonFire1024: can we hide the joins/quits, I can't remember how to do it
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:37<@DragonFire1024> not sure
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:40<@DragonFire1024> skanemy
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:42<@DragonFire1024> oops
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:45<@DragonFire1024> skenmy might
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:53<+Mark_Bunker> can you see me?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:08:58<@skenmy> It's not possible server-side on Freenode :)
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:09:00<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: yes :)
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:09:20<+Mark_Bunker> okay. goood.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:09:30<@DragonFire1024> So everyone:
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:09:48<@DragonFire1024> IF there is time after the pre-asked questions, we will have live Q and A
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:10:15<@DragonFire1024> gonna be a lot of people, so only voiced users can speak, and OPs
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:10:54<@DragonFire1024> So...
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:11:10<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: Why don't you start by telling us about yourself and what you do
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:11:21<@skenmy> I hope we can look past the immense amounts of joins / parts :)
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:11:40<@DragonFire1024> yes...unfortunately it only works on a user basis
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:12:18<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: Why don't you start by telling us about yourself and what you do
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:13:03<+Mark_Bunker> I work in TV news in San Diego and have been speaking out about Scientology's fraud and abuse since 1998. I worked "anonymously" for a year before showing my face and starting my website XENU TV.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:13:41<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: Tell us about your history with criticism of Scientology?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:15:14<@DragonFire1024> There is a bit of a lag everyone. So hang in there
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:18:03<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: is All ok?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:18:07<+Mark_Bunker> In 1998 I was living in a house in the Hollywood hills. The woman who lived there prior to em was a Scientologist.  Probably at the Celebrity Center because I would get her issues of Celebrity magazine and other Scientology periodicals.  Reading them left me bewildered.  They have their own language in many ways.  I was intrigued and visited the Celebrity Center at one point to check the...
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:18:08<+Mark_Bunker> ...place out with a friend -- as a skeptic, mind you. I took the personality test, played with an e-meter and got my own personal screening of Orientation before sitting down with the head of the CC.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:18:46<+Mark_Bunker> I had seen the 60 Minutes reports in the 80's but didn't have a lot of knowledge at my fingertips.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:19:05<+Mark_Bunker> I wish I knew then what I know now so I could have asked pointed questions.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:19:30<@brianmc> Such as?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:19:48<+Mark_Bunker> I did ask things like, "Do I have to buy all these books?  Don't you have a library?"
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:20:02<+Mark_Bunker> Of course, they want you to buy everything
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:20:33<+Mark_Bunker> After 45 minutes, I broke it to him that I wasn't interested.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:20:54<+Mark_Bunker> I went home, did a quick search on the net and found out about XENU.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:21:41<+Mark_Bunker> Then I discovered Operation Snow White and Operation Freakout and other crimes committed by Scientology.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:21:52<+Mark_Bunker> This was more than some silly little group.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:22:29<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: Has the Church ever been convicted of any crimes?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:22:46<+Mark_Bunker> I was amazed that this whole different world existed inside the U.S. and no one really paid attention to it.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:22:59<@brianmc> okay this has been advertised globally on the irc.partyvan.org network, we're just going to have to live with all the join/leaves
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:23:57<+Mark_Bunker> It has been convicted in the Canada for some of the same same espionage tactics they used here in Operation Snow White.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:24:47<@DragonFire1024> How would you describe yourself in the context of religions, churches, and belief systems, and what you are seeking to accomplish
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:25:20<+Mark_Bunker> There have been more but I don't have them at the tip of my fingers. That's the nice thing about the net.  You can now quickly research anytime, anywhere.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:26:36<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: How would you describe yourself in the context of religions, churches, and belief systems, and what you are seeking to accomplish
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:27:06<+Mark_Bunker> I think I stand outside the religious arena. I'm not interested in buying a ticket for the big game.  People are free to believe anything they want but when it comes to fraud and abuse, I think it's important to object.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:28:03<@DragonFire1024> Mark_Bunker: There are other religions that practice things that are just as bad as Scientology. For example the Catholic Church, Scientology and Islam dislike/sin homosexuals. Why protest Scientology? The Catholic Church, in terms of atrocities, has likely committed more? Even Muslim extremism...Is Scientology really worth more to protest than those religions or any other?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:28:05<+Mark_Bunker> The Catholics standing outside the Boston churches, protesting the priest sex abuse scandals were heroes in my mind.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:28:55<+Mark_Bunker> Scientologists who stand up to David Miscavige and say stop disconnection, forced abortions, the Rpf and fraud are as well.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:29:05<@brianmc> That was protest the crime and coverup? Similar to your work?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:31:09<@brianmc> People, Wise Beard Man is obviously not a fast typist, please be patient.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:31:44<+Mark_Bunker> Exactly. It says nothing about the Catholic religion to say stop the priest sex abuse.  Except it does make one wonder how a religion could systematically cover up such rampant abuse.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:32:03<+Mark_Bunker> Sorry. I am a slow typist and slow thinker.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:32:11<@DragonFire1024> no problem :)
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:32:18<@brianmc> Considered responses are more valuable
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:32:32<@brianmc> next Q DF
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:32:46<@DragonFire1024> Other that your experiences with ex-members of Scientology, do you have any special qualification that would make you an expert on so-called "cults", i.e. do you have a degree in sociology, anthropology, psychiatry, psychology, theology, or any similar related subject area?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:33:18<+Mark_Bunker> none whatsoever. I took one course in world religions back i college.  That's it.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:33:56<@DragonFire1024> would that include the fields of tax law, i.e. do you have a degree in accounting, finance, law, or any similar related subject area?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:34:27<+Mark_Bunker> I am not a psychologist. I am not not going to council people in need of therapy.  I speak out against fraud and abuse.   Anyone can do so.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:34:43<+Mark_Bunker> Far from it.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:35:35<@DragonFire1024> Ok now onto general questions on Scientology
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:35:37<+Mark_Bunker> Nor have I studied Political Science but that does not prevent me from speaking out against the Bush administration.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:35:43<@brianmc> heh
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:35:46<@DragonFire1024> indeed
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:35:49<@DragonFire1024> :)
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:36:05<@DragonFire1024> Scientology, as many members have claimed, has saved their lives. Do you think, comparing the circumstances, the good things Scientology has done, out weighs the supposed bad things it has done?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:38:38<+Mark_Bunker> Well, people can feel they gain benefits from a wide range of things. I am not opposed to anyone following Scientology and auditing themselves till the time they drop their bodies.  But along the way, many people are getting hurt.  Fix that and people would stop protesting.  Although I think they may stiull giggle about Xenu.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:39:27<@DragonFire1024> What will it take to get Congressional Hearings to review the Church of Scientology?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:39:46<@brianmc> Specifically, their tax-exempt status
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:40:02<+Mark_Bunker> We have the amazing ability to convince outselves about anything. Our government is protecting us by wiretapping our phones and getting us into a needless war while letting the real terrorists regroup.  But - hey -we were scared and went along with it.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:40:48<@brianmc> giving up freedom for temporary safety?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:41:09<+Mark_Bunker> Sit in a dar room and imagine there is some scary creature about to get you and you can probably raises some goosebumps. That doesn't mean that there is actually anything i the room.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:41:39<+Mark_Bunker> We easily can be tricked and trick ourselves and lead with emotion instead of intellect.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:42:32<@brianmc> ...knowledge granted only to the smallest percentage of Sea Org members?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:43:18<+Mark_Bunker> So people may feel that Scientology has saved their lives but has it? Have they not also lured them into a group which takes over an increasingly large part of their lives and income, at the same time it is stripping them of their reality to replace it with Hubbards?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:45:08<@brianmc> Q: What, if any, changes or improvements have been made in Church policy and structure since Hubbard died, and more recently too, that might have already addressed, at least partially, issues such as Snow White, Lisa McPherson, disconnection, unrealistic promises of Scientology benefits, etc? On what do you base your answer to this question?
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:45:39<+Mark_Bunker> Sorry for falling nehind. As to the Hearings, it is going to take a groundswell of media interest into the abuses before it happens.  There's a lot of work that needs to be done.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:46:07<@DragonFire1024> its ok :)
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:46:49<@brianmc> We can and likely will reorder stuff - its just that with so many people here there is quite a lag.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:48:30<@DragonFire1024> just say "ready" when you are ready for next question Mark_bunker
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:48:51<+Mark_Bunker> On public knowledge versus Scientologist knowledge, that is troubling for me. We on the outside know what is in store for the people moving onto the brdge.  I think it is bait and switch  to not tell them that their real problems are they are covered with BT's.  That's a major case of fraud in my mind.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:49:19<@brianmc> If you want to type a couple of responses to a question finish the first off with ... then we know there's more to come.
 * 16 Feb 2008 21:50:52<+Mark_Bunker> I spoke with Billy Sheehan last weekend at the picket and he told me is an OT3 and would talk about anything about his religion. I asked him to tell me about Xenu and Body Thetans and he couldn't.  He just can't.  He's not allowed to.  I am free to do so.  how are you becomng a better, more free individual when you have to follow such strict orders or a group that promises to theach you to...

title: User:MDP23/Log1


text:
Comments:Baltimore police officer accused of assault two teens, one caught on video

Suspended with pay?! That's not a punishment... that's more like a reward! You don't give the guy time off AND allow him to collect pay for it! That's ridiculous!! --71.232.227.162 21:46, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

read the effing sign
"Bush was skateboarding along a promenade of the Inner Harbor despite a city ordinance that prohibits skateboarding in the Inner Harbor area."

Don't skate here or you get your ass whoop. I bet that the last time he skating in a prohibited area. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.229.35.146 (talk) 22:15, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

And this man is allowed carry a gun? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.16.22.85 (talk) 22:19, 17 February 2008 (UTC)


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Comments:'Blaspheming' movie should be prohibited says Iran government

Of course, only the Muslims raise a major stink over having their holy books and figures ridiculed. Them and Scientologists. You don't see (most) Christians going apeshit over Raptor Jesus, or blowing themselves up because God is portrayed as an amalgam of animal parts on South Park. I personally have nothing against the Muslim faith, but come on... don't be so freaking oversensitive!! --71.232.227.162 21:52, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

 * Even most of the Muslims are ok, just an idiot minority. But Christians can do it too - think of the shitstorm that erupted over Life of Brian. Though things have improved a lot with Christians since then... Blood Red Sandman  (Talk)   (Contribs) 21:58, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

remember what happen last time
the last guy to make a movie like this was shot dead. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.229.35.146 (talk) 22:17, 16 February 2008 (UTC)