text:
Talk:Ayman al-Zawahiri releases new tape

No credible source for reference to suspected deaths of terrorists
Albeit with weasel words, the Whitehouse spokespeople have now denied that they know of any terrorists being killed in the bombing of the village in Pakistan;

"J.D. CROUCH, DEPUTY NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: Great to be here, Wolf.

BLITZER: What about last Friday's attack on that building along the Pakistan-Afghan border? Have you confirmed definitively who died, who was killed in that attack?

CROUCH: I don't think there's any confirmation on that. Obviously, I know there have been things that have come out of Pakistan. But all I know at this point is what you have seen, you know, in the press.

BLITZER: But do we know one way or another whether Ayman al- Zawahiri, the number two to Osama bin Laden, whether or not he was killed?

CROUCH: Like I said, I don't think there's any -- there's a full understanding of that at this point.

BLITZER: But there -- but you do -- can you confirm that other senior al Qaeda operatives were killed?

CROUCH: Not at this point, no."

Thus the reference to suspicion of there having been such deaths is not factual and was not when this story was being actively edited. Neutralizer 03:11, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Supply proof for this and the blitzer statement. Have the link? I saw this "spoof" on your user page. You need to stop editing to your POV. The sources state that the strike killed 4 terrorists. if you do not like the facts then too bad. Jason Safoutin 03:29, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

 * The link is at the top left of this page, and here it is again; [[[User:Neutralizer|Neutralizer]] 03:39, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * As far as I am concerned that is not a source. that is one statement by one man. There are no toher sources to support HIS opinion. So unless you can back his statement up, then your so called source, in not crediable. Jason Safoutin 03:42, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

 * This is not enough evidence. This person doesn't even seem like he was qualified to comment on the ordeal so far.  I therefore am reverting the edit back to its previous position before Neutralizer made his edits; this is very thin proof, and Neutralizer has violated WN:NOT.  --MrMiscellanious (talk) – 03:44, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * MrM.please advise specifically what part of WN:NOT you feel I have violated as I certainly do not want to do it agian. I have looked but am unable to see what you are referring to? Neutralizer 04:47, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Read it. It's plain on there, Wikinews articles are not works of progress.  AT THE TIME OF PUBLISH, all that was stated was factual.  It's not our job to rewrite history as it were.  --MrMiscellanious (talk) – 20:28, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

From the South Asia Terrorism Portal (SATP) managed by The Institute for Conflict Management, an NGO supported by the Indian Council for Social Science Research (ICSSR) a segment on the site http://www.satp.org/satporgtp/detailed_news.asp?date1=1/14/2006#1 where the first section provides review. There is also consideration of the missile attack as extension of earlier attack on the family of Maulvi Noor Muhammad and another of it as attempt to attack possible members of Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi (TNSM). Given this, I support instead either inclusion of all of this type of supposition from sources with some modicum of authority or that none are included. To be just, none of this type of supposition has a place in the story. Aside, that source also only makes reference apart from the supposition to only the deaths of some women and children. That I believe is the best option given that listing the varied alternative explanations of the attack by implied wording added onto the comment so far made would deflect the focus of this entry. Opalus 04:09, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Given this is only an opinion, and really not factual, I see no reason to add anything. If there is new news on this missile attack then a new article needs to be started. Jason Safoutin 04:13, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Is it not only a matter of opinion to state that four terrorists may have been also killed by the attack without any official support as much as the joint opposition to both providing any alternate suppositions and lack of providing official confirmation of presence of supposedly present four terrorists? It is a question, in my mind at least, why the one possible explanation of supposedly killing four terrorists is included while it is not officially supported yet that no alternate explanations are considered when in an article with a divergent focus the relevance of any explanation of the situation is at best secondary to the subject of its not being mentioned on the tape itself. I have the position and state again that the removal of all supposition would be the better option but also that the inclusion of equal additional fragment implications should be added for these and other as yet unofficial possible explanations if even one is in order to avoid a POV preference of position on possible explanations. Opalus 04:24, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Resolution explanation
Quite appropriate, Shaukat Aziz has now stated and it is being reported on in a new story that "There is no evidence, as of half an hour ago, that there were any other people there," and also that the official death toll now is 13 rather than 18 civilians. Source link the present source of the new article mentioned: http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/01/22/pakistan.attack/ Opalus 04:41, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Deputy National Security Advisor
Who this J.D. Crouch guy is, other than by tiltle, I don't rightly know. Ever since Condi Rice was replaced by Stephen Hadley as National Security Advisor, his people are the new kids on the block. How hooked in the office is to the events across the border from Afghanistan into Pakistan is an open question. Does Crouch know anything? If he did, it's a sure bet he would have spouted it to Blitzer. -Edbrown05 05:32, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Historical article
Please keep in mind that Wikinews articles are not works in progress. They report what was known, reported, and believed about a news event at that time.

Where new information, reports, and beliefs become known, create a new article reporting the changes in what is known. Earlier articles are corrected by new articles, not by changing previous reporting. This is how we create a valuable historical record - one of the primary aims of Wikinews. -  Amgine | talk en.WN 07:51, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

The goal to serve as record also was not previously known. Information available at the time of publishing but not included yet, as with the greater location information, may still be added, yes? Opalus 07:58, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Yes, generally in addition to rather than in place of. Subtraction of factual statements supported by sources from a published article is problemeatic. -  Amgine | talk en.WN 08:01, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Amgine and MrM. Please note the pertinent dates
Great point Amgine and MrM., we seem in agreement that the cogent point is whether what was stated at the time of publishing was factual or, as MrM says, "AT THE TIME OF PUBLISH, all that was stated was factual"; perhaps you both have misread the dates? The Blitzer interview was on the 19th. this article was published the 21st. Do either or both of you have another interpretation of the dates ? Neutralizer 22:59, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Does anyone object if we include the older Blitzer interview as a source for this story? Neutralizer 23:13, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * That doesn't change anything. It is clearly stated in WN:NOT that articles are not works of progress, and shouldn't be touched after being published.  This article was published for two days.  You are violating WN:NOT if you continue to remove the information, and are knowingly breaking site policy if you continue to violate.  Heed yourself.  --MrMiscellanious (talk) – 23:15, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

 * MrM; please help me understand your concern;

1; at first you said(thereby implying it was of some importance);"AT THE TIME OF PUBLISH, all that was stated was factual"; are you now saying that it doesn't matter whether "AT THE TIME OF PUBLISH, all that was stated was factual"?

2;Now in terms of your several references to WN:NOT ;I have read it and here are the words;

"Wikinews articles are not works in progress. Developing articles are marked with the "develop" template. Once written and published they are historical documents; they should not continue to be updated or changed. Especially, they should not be altered to an angle or POV not reflective of the article as it was published. Wikinews is not an encyclopedia."

Your interpretation is "that articles are not works of progress, and shouldn't be touched after being published" ; so maybe you haven't noticed the word "continue" in our policy..which means (to me) the articles should not be changed on an ongoing basis, not that they should never be changed at all. MrM you might agree that had the policy intended to never allow changes after being published; it could simply say so. If you believe it should say never, then why not bring the suggestion to the water cooler? But for now, at least in my understanding of the English language, it does not say or mean "never", at least that is how I see it. Neutralizer 23:29, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * The document is clear and concise. End of discussion; the edit is in violation.  --MrMiscellanious (talk) – 23:43, 23 January 2006 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Canadian federal election; 23/01/2006 A.D.

Sources and other notes
This article is not ready to publish. Please provide sources for the factual statements in the article. Also, please remove in-article notes (those in parentheses) before publishing. --Chiacomo (talk) 04:22, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Articel sources and development
This article as it now stands, is meant as a beginning only.

The story will develop over the course of the day, possible running into tomorrow.

Contributions and/ir updates are welcomed... :) At this point, the article is completely original material, based on commonly/publicly available information, i.e.:

www.cpac.ca  www.cbc.ca  www.ctv.ca   www.pluse24.com  www.canada.com    www.canoe.ca www.thestar.com  etc.

Article sources and development
This article as it now stands, is meant as a beginning only.

The story will develop over the course of the day, possible running into tomorrow.

Contributions and/ir updates are welcomed... :) At this point, the article is completely original material, based on commonly/publicly available information, i.e.:

www.cpac.ca  www.cbc.ca  www.ctv.ca   www.pluse24.com  www.canada.com    www.canoe.ca www.thestar.com  etc.

help editng/revising article
Hi;

1. I'm having trouble figuring out the controls for revising/fixign this article I started.

2. The article was intended to be a beginning on a report of the Canadian federal election happening today, with the idea of adding material/inviting contributions as the story develops.

Also, for the moment, I am out of time to work on this, and so I would like to invite contributions/revisions within the limits of factual truth, and wiht clear differentiation between reporting of facts, and editorial opinions on the subject.

And if anyone wants to tell me how to use the controls to fix/write articles properly, i'd very much appreciate the advice too... :)

 * Please don't use leading spaces to indent lines... I'm sure someone will come along and flesh this out and revise it. I know several users had been working on election related stuff. --Chiacomo (talk) 05:45, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/


text:
No evidence of dead terrorists in US bombed Pakistan village

January 23, 2006 In an interview with CNN, Pakistani Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz said "There is no evidence, as of half an hour ago, that there were any other people there". United States officials have previously stated that as many as eight al-Qaeda operatives were dining in Damadola when struck by United States missiles. As many as eighteen individuals were killed in the strike.

In the interview Prime Minister Aziz labelled a U.S. report that senior al Qaeda leaders were killed in a CIA attack as "bizarre".

Mr Aziz said, "The area does see movement of people from across the border. But we have not found one body or one shred of evidence that these people were there."

"If you just reflect on what happened; first, we heard that there was a dinner meeting with all the seniors," the Prime Minister said. "I think that's a bizarre thought, because these people don't get together for dinner in a terrain or environment like that."

The U.S. network ABC News reported January 18 on its Web site that the attack killed Khabab, quoting "Pakistani authorities." However a number of Pakistani officials have told CNN they cannot confirm the ABC report.

J.D. Crouch, the USA's Deputy National Security Advisor to President Bush told CNN on January 19, that there was no confirmation that any senior al Queda operatives were killed in the bombing.


text:
Bali Nine refused access to federal police files

January 23, 2006 The Bali Nine have been dealt another blow with the Federal Court of Australia dismissing an application for them to gain access to documents held by the Australian Federal Police (AFP).

The application was bought to court on behalf of Scott Rush, Renae Lawrence, Martin Stephens and Michael Czugaj, four of the nine Australians being held in Indonesia for allegedly attempting to smuggle heroin out of Bali.

Their lawyers have claimed that the AFP may have acted illegally by passing information onto Indonesian authorities, which led to their arrest. In Indonesia, convicted drug smugglers may face the death penalty, which Australia is opposed to.

The basis of the argument is that the AFP provided information knowing that Australians could be sentenced to death if the information was correct.

When handing his ruling down in Adelaide, Justice Paul Finn said "It is now the applicants' position that each of them, in their capacity as Australian citizens, has a substantiative legitimate expectation that the Australian government, its agencies and public officers will not act in such a way as to expose them to the risk of the imposition of the death penalty,"

"(But) there would be no arguable basis at all for any contention that AFP officers had a legal responsibility to warn any of the applicants either that they were under police surveillance or that they were exposing themselves to the foreseeable risk of the death penalty.

"Having been prepared for whatever reason to engage in criminal activity, the applicants would properly be regarded as the authors of their own harm.

"And the police would have been entitled to have treated them as no more than subjects of an ongoing criminal investigation which fell clearly within the mandated functions of the AFP."


text:
Sri Lankan attack disrupts peace envoy

January 23, 2006 Suspected Tamil Tiger rebels have ambushed and killed three soldiers in Sri Lanka's volatile eastern region, as a Norwegian peace broker flew in to the country in a last-ditch peace bid.

The patrol was ambushed with a fragmentation mine - the most recent in a series of attacks which have killed over 70 military personnel since December.

The attack came after Norwegian peace envoy Erik Solheim arrived in Sri Lanka for truce talks. As he arrived, three soldiers were killed in a landmine explosion in the east, which the army blamed on the Tamil Tigers. Rohan Abeywardene, deputy inspector general of police said the Tamil Tigers were responsible for the attack.

The Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam have threatened to resume their armed struggle this year unless President Mahinda Rajapakse grants independence - which he has refused to do. The Tamil Tigers want a separate state in the north and east of Sri Lanka.

The rebels have fought the government since 1983 to create a separate homeland for ethnic minority Tamils, accusing the majority Sinhalese-dominated state of discrimination.

The rebels say they are ready to use suicide bombers, as in the past, if war resumes. The Sri Lankan army is preparing for the worst with analysts say both sides are already engaged in an undeclared war. The Tigers, accuse the military and government-backed paramilitaries of a litany of abuses, including rape and executions of Tamil civilians and rebels.

About 65,000 people were killed in the conflict before the cease-fire. Peace talks broke down in April 2003, when the Tigers withdrew, demanding autonomy in the Tamil-majority northeast region.

Over 100 people have been killed in the escalating violence since December.

title: Sri Lankan attack disrupts peace envoy


text:
User talk:65.92.201.66

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Chiacomo (talk) 05:46, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
 * Cite sources - everything in a Wikinews article must be sourced
 * Introduction - overview of the site
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 * Content guide - what's suitable for Wikinews
 * Contents - the contents page.
 * Newsroom - The comunity portal
 * Existing articles need expanding and checking for spelling and mistakes
 * The front page lead articles often need updating
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 * And of course, stories need writing!

title: User talk:65.92.201.66


text:
Greenpeace, Sea Shepherds end Southern Ocean whaling protest

January 23, 2006

Anti-whaling activists are heading home after a month of pestering the Japanese whaling fleet near Antarctica. With dwindling food and fuel supplies, the Greenpeace ships Arctic Sunrise and Esperanza are heading for Cape Town. The Sea Shepherd's Farley Mowat has also left the area due to a refuelling cancellation.

The three ships were in the Whale Sanctuary where the controversial Japanese whaling fleet continue to hunt and kill hundreds of Minke whales, including the endangered Fin whales - for what Japan calls "lethal scientific research."

Greenpeace say they will now switch the focus of the campaign to shed light on the corporate entities behind the commercial whaling industry. Greenpeace New Zealand whales campaigner, Pia Mancia, said the two ships exposed the reality of the Japanese commercial whaling operation to the world. She said: "it is now time to focus action on those controlling the whaling fleet."

Greenpeace Southern Ocean Expedition Leader Shane Rattenbury said, "Logistically we cannot remain in the Southern Ocean any longer, but this certainly isn't the last you'll hear of us... We now need the public to focus their attention on the corporates linked to the commercial whaling."

"For a month now we have dogged, delayed and disrupted the whaling fleet in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary, and have no doubt that they have fallen far behind in their bid to slaughter 935 minke whales and 10 endangered fin whales. It is our hope that this struggle will inspire people to help us defend whales, so that it goes down in history as the last time the peaceful silence in the Sanctuary is broken by the sound of a grenade-tipped harpoon," Mr Rattenbury said.

Japan has welcomed Greenpeace's decision to leave the Southern Ocean. Hideki Moronuki from Japan's Fisheries Agency is pleased the whaling mission will no longer be obstructed: "Although Greenpeace say that they're activities are peaceful, their activities are really dangerous and illegal," he said.

Protesters spent much of their time in the Southern Ocean in inflatable Zodiac boats, placing themselves precariously between harpoons and whales. They escaped serious injury when the Japanese allegedly rammed their vessel, and when a protester was pulled overboard by a harpoon rope. Activists were also blasted out of boats by water cannons.

The incidents caused slanging matches between Greenpeace and Japan's Institute of Cetacean Research, both arguing they had evidence the other was at fault. The Japanese say their whale cull is scientific research and that they will continue their whaling.

Greenpeace Expedition Leader Shane Rattenbury has defended the risks taken by activists during the protests. "We feel it's been a justifiable risk somebody had to come down here and do something, politics and diplomacy have failed." he said.

Japan says it's too early to tell what effect Greenpeace has had on its current research mission. The Japan Whaling Association (JWA), which promotes and protects Japan's whaling culture says, "The moratorium on commercial whaling is an anomaly."

Japan's Institute of Cetacean Research (ICR) says the whale research programs are conducted in accordance with the International Convention for the Regulation of Whaling.

The ICR say they "do not, in any way, involve illegal whaling... under the IWC's no waste rules the by-products of the research program, including whale meat, are required so far as practicable to be processed. It is this aspect of the program which is often inaccurately sensationalised as illegal commercial whaling, reads a statement on their website.

Sea Shepherds head to Capetown
A second protest group - The Sea Shepherd Conservation Society - has also left the Southern Ocean. Their ship, the Farley Mowat is also headed for Cape Town. Captain Paul Watson said: "Greenpeace and Sea Shepherd together have completed the most intensive and ambitious campaign ever mounted against Antarctic whaling activities. For 15 days, whales were prevented from being killed."

Captain Watson said he made the decision to stay in the Southern Oceans for as long as possible to continue to chase the "illegal Japanese whaling fleet across the bottom of the world," he said. "After a 4,000 kilometre chase, the Farley Mowat had reached its limit."

The Sea Shepherds had made arrangements to refuel from a tanker scheduled to supply a fishing fleet near the French Kergulen Islands. However, the South African company supplying the tanker cancelled the tanker rendezvous, citing extreme weather conditions.

"At that point, there was no choice," said Captain Watson. "We were 2600 miles from the nearest port... We had to drop out of the chase and make for South Africa. We had no safety margin, in fact, we were short of fuel. The figures were ominous. Our chase suddenly became a race to survive."

After fuel conservation measures paid off the Farley Mowat is expected to make it to Cape Town. "We have just completed the longest voyage that this ship has made in its entire 48-year career," said 1st Officer Alex Cornelissen.

Whilst the Sea Shepherds and Greenpeace were not officially working together, 1st Officer Alex Cornelissen of the Farley Mowat said, "we believe we were working in cooperation with ...(Greenpeace). We had different roles, different tactics, and different strategies but the bottom line is that we were both opposing illegal whaling by Japan."

The Sea Shepherd Conservation Society says it will return to the Southern Ocean next year with a another, faster vessel to confront the Japanese whaling fleet. The Farley Mowat may also return to Antarctica as a secondary confrontation vessel.

The whale hunting season will continue until the middle of March. Greenpeace say they targeted this particular hunt because Japan had decided to double its quota of minke whales this year in the internationally recognised Southern Ocean whale sanctuary.

"This is supposed to be a whale sanctuary and the Japanese government is the only one in the world which is defying the ban on whaling here," Rattenbury said. "Unfortunately so far we have seen 123 whales killed or brought back to the mother ship."

The Japanese Institute of Cetacean Research has a quota of 935 minke whales and 10 Fin whales. Fin whales are the second biggest animal on the planet, after the Blue whale. Greenpeace say they saw none killed during their actions. "So far we have only seen minkes slaughtered, we have seen no fin whales being killed," Rattenbury said.

The Greenpeace ships are expected to arrive in Cape Town around February 5th. The Sea Shepherd ship Farley Mowat is expected to arrive in Cape Town on January 25th 2006.


text:
Talk:No evidence of dead terrorists in US bombed Pakistan village

picture
There is a picture on Wikipedia that i cant get to work in this article. Can somewiki help and put it in? International 06:27, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * While that picure is tagged as public domain it has no source listed so that claim is dubious. I found a free image of Aziz and uploaded it to the commons, feel free to use that if you think it is appropiate. --Deprifry|+T+ 16:10, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Article about the mis-reporting?
I am wondering whether the mis-reporting by western media about this event would be an appropriate news story? I don't want to spend time on it if it will be tagged as "not-news". Any thoughts? Neutralizer 13:45, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Or tagged NPOV everywhere. Jason Safoutin 19:57, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I would not make a separate news story out of it unless you have several instances of misreporting. This is also a very mild way of misreporting where someone reported "news" with a very thin factual basis. If handeled correctly, this could be valid news. Howeve, I would like to remind everyone that this is not how things were done when wikinews picked up that story, where some editors went to great length to push the story further than the facts allowed (see Al Qaeda bomb maker reportedly killed in U.S. airstrike in Pakistan and Talk:Al_Qaeda_bomb_maker_reportedly_killed_in_U.S._airstrike_in_Pakistan).

 * For one it says REPORTADLY. No where in that article does it state for a FACT that he or any terrorist was killed. its REPORTADLY. Wikinews is based on news reported THAT DAY...sorry but my crystal ball was in the shop and I could not see into today when the strike occured. Jason Safoutin 16:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Jason; thanks for the response. Of course the technical loophole word of "reportedly" as with "allegedly" would work even if we were quoting an anonymous crackhead on his report that little green men from Mars just beamed up his 6 legged dog. The question, in my opinion is, did western media, for whatever reason, sink to an unacceptable level of original and cooberative sources ("Pakistani officials"..."anonymous intelligence sources") over hte past 10 days concerning the attack on the village? What do you think in retrospect?Neutralizer 20:05, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I think reports are conflicting. Possibly a cover up. Who knows? I do know ABC stands by their word at what they reported. When the article developed new news the next article stated that clearly. reportadly is a good way to use the words because its what was reported at the time the article was published. Reports change, a new article should be written and usually is. We reported what we had and that was published. There were no objections at the time to using the word and there is only one right now. Either way, thew article is poublished and old. Changes per policy are not to be made. Jason Safoutin 20:22, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Jason, In the light of Pakistan PM facts still is not clear, the story can turn again. But what s clear is that it shows the importans of value sorces. And to use common sense. For example the word confirmed demand very good sourses. I guess you must learn, excuse me for lecturing you, some things from this story. Read the articles history and examine your part of what happned. Its really important. International 22:04, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Well then you cannot read. The sources are in the article. Thats what was reported on that day and thats what ALL the sources say. Can't get over it can ya? Jason Safoutin 22:10, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * To be really honest Jason, if you dont use your common sense in valuating sorces you should think of blogging. International 22:20, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Maybe I contributed to start this unhappy conversation, so I would like to reiterate the central point here. Yes, it is ok to report news like ABC's information and the use of the words "reportedly", "allegedly" and so on reflect the uncertainty connected with this information. And after some initial struggle, the article achieved that. What is not accpetable though is to weight cerain information based on personal bias which is not backed by the sources. In particluar I am referring to this diff, which, except for cosmetics, only differs by one sentence moved to the bottom and the insertion of the word "earlier" purely for POV purposes. This is where the line between reporting and mis-reporting was crossed in this article on wikinews. --vonbergm 23:14, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Like, Vonbergm (who I happen to agree with completely in his summation of the issue), I'm kind of sorry I even brought it up. If mistakes were made before, either they will be repeated again or else they won't be. I'm moving on to new stories now. Thanks to everyone for the provoking thoughts. Neutralizer 23:41, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Headline is a quote.
The article refers primarily to Aziz's comments and therefore sould appear as a quote

"No evidence of dead terrorists in US bomber Pakistan village: Aziz (or Pak Pres)"

(In the states, the subject comes first.)

This is very basic journalism. Without this it is asserting that wikinews reporting has come to this conclusion.

Compare it with all the sources provided that are based on quotes:

"Pakistani Official claims 'foreign terrorists' among civilians killed in U.S. airstrike"

"Pakistan PM: CIA attack reports 'bizarre'"

"Pakistan PM: No evidence of al-Qaida dead"

Does wikinews have guidelines on writing headlines somewhere? 24.94.246.41 00:07, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Please see WN:SG. --Chiacomo (talk) 00:08, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
 * You got a point. The headline could be formed as a quote. But as I see it it is not baised or wrong. 1st, title dont claim no terrorist was killed. Just that there is no evidence. 2st, there is no evidence (yet, if it is true is that terrorists was killed). 3rd, Wikinews have published statements like confirmed killing of terrorist wich was speculative. Confirmation need a reliable source. But I will not interfere if someone change title to a quote. International 08:14, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

Edit
editprotected Category:Shaukat Aziz, Category:Federally Administered Tribal Areas (site of incident). Ali Rana (talk) 08:12, 1 October 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅--Brian McNeil / talk 18:33, 24 November 2009 (UTC)


text:
Witnesses of fire in Vladivostok under investigation

January 23, 2006

Nearly 300 people turned out at a protest meeting held in Vladivostok, Russia on January 21st. Relatives and friends of the victims and survivors of the recent fire, as well as ordinary citizens were there and full of anger. They had come to protest against the authorities, whom they say mishandled the rescue operation in the terrible fire and have withheld the truth about the real number of dead.

The slogans at the protest read, "Who will tell us the truth?", "We want to know the truth!", "Our lives cost nothing!", "Authorities should respond!", and "Firemen are those who should be set on fire!"

The Chief of Vladivostok City Police Department colonel Nikolay Panchenko commented: "The meeting participants are sure, that the authorities hide a true number of the dead and refer to the web-site fire.zloe.net."

The web-site "Truth about the fire in Vladivostok" has been created to spread information about the fire.

Panchenko said "We verified the published messages, but none of them was confirmed. We have detected the two authors of the messages. One of them has already denied everything he wrote, another is still hiding out".

Today, a news agency in Vladivostok, which maintains another web-site where information about the fire is collected, reports they received an official order from the government services. Additional private information about people who post comments on news.vl.ru has been requested.

Some human rights experts warn that the witnesses may be persecuted in a situation where the authorities want to hide the truth, and thus to escape responsibility.


text:
Four Australian states ablaze, two dead, homes lost

January 23, 2006 Bushfires are burning across Victoria, South Australia, Western Australia and Tasmania assisted by very hot conditions.

Victoria is the hardest hit with a single blaze burning out over 100,000 hectares (247,000 acres) and destroying 20 homes.

There are around a dozen fires burning in Victoria, with others in South Australia, Western Australia and Tasmania.

Police are investigating whether or not two people found dead in their car near Moyston in South-West Victoria died as a result of the fire or died when their vehicle struck a tree.

Firefighters in the south of New South Wales have been placed on high alert as the hot weather moves North.

Firefighters across the affected states are hoping to take advantage of a cool change expected today.

Earlier this month bushfires damaged property in New South Wales and Victoria.


text:
User talk:213.254.223.206

Welcome
213.254.223.206, welcome to Wikinews! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
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Additionally, thanks for experimenting with Wikinews. Your test worked, and has now been reverted or removed. Please use Sandbox for any other tests you want to do, since testing in articles will be reverted quickly. --Brian McNeil / talk 11:07, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

title: User talk:213.254.223.206


text: Template:Football headlines

title: Template:Football headlines


text:
Concerns over Neville's Celebration

January 23, 2006

Gary Neville is likely to face an inquiry from the Football Association as complaints filter in from Liverpool Supporters present at the game. Neville, who had ran the entire length of the pitch celebrating, was alleged to remark inappropriate comments at the fans, after they had taunted him the entire game.

The true nature of these comments, however, is yet to transpire, but due to police intervention, it may be thought they were anfield related, although such claims are unfounded. Despite the fact Neville has not been formally charged, the attacks have, at least prompted police to request the referee's report so they are able to fully start correspondence with the FA.

title: Concerns over Neville's Celebration


text:
Talk:Greenpeace, Sea Shepherds end Southern Ocean whaling protest

Great story-Great work
imo. Neutralizer 13:47, 23 January 2006 (UTC)


text:
User talk:151.188.16.12

FCPS contacted
 Dear Sir/Madam,

I am one of the administrators of the English version of the Wikinews project which can be found at http://en.wikinews.org/. Along with other editors I have had to deal with childish vandalism of a number of key pages on our site by someone at a FCPS-registered IP address, specifically 151.188.16.12. You may view the history of disruptive edits made by this person at the following URL:

http://en.wikinews.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Contributions&target=151.188.16.12

Click on the "diff" item next to each edit to see what text was put in.

I would really appreciate if someone could have words with the person responsible for these edits. They do not seem to realise that there is little or no anonymity on the Internet and their actions can be traced back.

At the moment this IP address is blocked from making edits on the Wikinews project, we really don't like blocking educational establishments as wikis are an excellent tool for introducing collaborative working practices and encouraging people to join an online community.

Your attention to this matter would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,

Brian McNeil

Please do not delete messages
Please do not delete warnings from your talk page. Flipbaywood 20:53, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Please stop
Vandalism of important pages, such as Audio Wikinews and Template:Lead article is not appreciated. Please stop or you will be blocked. Flipbaywood 21:00, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

title: User talk:151.188.16.12


text:
Brazilian Carnival season is opened

The Brazilian Carnival season opened Sunday, February 6. The annual festival is scheduled to continue until Tuesday, February 15 (longer in some regions).

The samba schools parade in Rio de Janeiro is scheduled for the first day. The parade occurs at the Sambódromo plaza, a place which was constructed specially for the event. Thousands of onlookers and participants are expected for the televised event, starting at 9:00 p.m. local time and continuing without interruption until Monday morning around 6:00 a.m. The parade will then restart Monday night at 9:00 p.m.

The samba schools which are scheduled to be in Sambódromo plaza Sunday, February 6 are: Mocidade, Império Serrano, Salgueiro, Mangueira, Unidos da Tijuca, Tradição and Vila Isabel. Monday, February 7, the following schools are scheduled: Porto da Pedra, Caprichosos, Viradouro, Portela, Imperatriz, Grande Rio and Beija-Flor.

Although the samba schools' parade in Rio de Janeiro is a great event of the Brazilian carnival, the Brazilian people also celebrate carnival in another ways: going out to the streets, going to saloons, participating in blocos and bandas and following the Trio Elétrico.

title: Brazilian Carnival season is opened


text:
Sample from Turkish patient shows mutated Bird Flu virus

January 23, 2006

A mutated form of the Avian (Bird Flu) virus has been found in a sample taken from a Turkish patient.

The mutated form is said to make the virus easier to attach itself to humans rather than animals says a report in the Nature journal.

The situation is being monitored by the World Health Organization but says "it is too early to know whether the virus is changing in ways that would signal the start of a human flu pandemic," says Maria Cheng a spokeswoman for the WHO. "It's one isolate from a single virus from Turkey. The sample suggests the virus might be more inclined to bind to human cells rather than animal cells, but there's no evidence that it's becoming more infectious. If we started to see a lot more samples from Turkey with this mutation and saw the virus changing, we'd be more concerned."

However, the Nature report says there is a second mutation that also "signals adaptation to humans." Cheng also said that "flu viruses mutate all the time. For us to assign public health significance to a genetic change we need to match it to what is happening epidemiologically — how the virus is behaving — and clinically — if it's more or less virulent."

In Turkey the fatality rate from the Bird Flu is 50% where elsewhere in the world reports of infection were only scattered. Entire families have been affected in Turkey and more reports come out almost every day of mild symptoms.

So far, Turkey has suffered four deaths and 21 infections. In addition to those cases the WHO reports 145 cases and 80 deaths in Cambodia, China, Indonesia, Thailand and Vietnam.

"When this outbreak (in Turkey) was first reported, there was a lot of concern it was behaving differently," said Cheng. Subsequent investigation, however, has indicated no major behavioral change.

"The team there told us that after two weeks of investigating, they haven't found substantial differences in the pattern we've seen in Southeast Asia," said Cheng.

The mutations were discovered by scientists in London, England in a lab.

Cheng said this may "signify the virus is trying different things to see if it can more easily infect humans. So far, we haven't seen that the virus has the ability to do this. But it's important that we continue monitoring. We would be concerned if we were seeing successive generations of spread of the virus. We haven't so far. All these people had a very clear history of contact with diseased birds."

Health officials say that so far they do not see any evidence yet that the virus can spread easily in humans.

The Bird Flu virus, strain H5N1, first started to infect humans in 1997 in Hong Kong. In 2003 it re-emerged and it has so far been difficult to control.


text:
Talk:Unmanned spacecraft leaves for Pluto

Can't we publish this?? It's outdated now, and I don't believe anyone will contribute to this anymore. What are we supposed to do when this happend? (--random signature)

Damn, didn't knew there was allready that news. Just wished someone has spoted that before we tried to publish this one... Well, I tried to do the merging, is it OK to delete this now? (--signature)

 * Article has been redirected. Thank you for merging! -  Amgine | talk en.WN 02:04, 27 January 2006 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Sample from Turkish patient shows mutated Bird Flu virus

Please use the links in the infobox to check details on the death toll. The current figure on Wikipedia is 80. --Brian McNeil / talk 16:51, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * If you want to know why I caught the death toll error, look at the edit history for the template. I maintain that figure for the site. :-) --Brian McNeil / talk 17:09, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Clarification
In Turkey the fatality rate from the Bird Flu is 50% where elsewhere in the world...

So far four have died in Turkey and twenty-one have been infected.

4 / 21 != .5 ... what is the source of the 50% mortality rate? If this is not an innacuracy, perhaps a link to a source indicating the method for calculating the mortality rate (e.g. death after 30 days rather than immediate death after contraction) would be prudent. Or, at the very least, a footnote indicating where this statistic was lifted from. 70.92.174.251 00:38, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

The title is wrong. Either change "Sample" to "Samples", or change "show" to "shows" "Sample from Turkey patient show mutated Bird Flu virus" makes no sense.


text:
User talk:65.244.153.5

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 16:57, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
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title: User talk:65.244.153.5


text: File:Omar Khadr.jpg

title: File:Omar Khadr.jpg


text:
House of Supreme Court Justice threatened

January 23, 2006 In the town of, New Hampshire, a movement is under way to force Supreme Court Justice to sell his home for "public benefit," an expansion of the  provision in the  of the  that the Supreme Court legalized in the controversial 5–4 decision  in  where Souter was on the majority side. In the June 2005 decision this majority ruled that "public use" included "public benefit," stating that a local council could use the Fifth Amendment to compulsorily acquire private property for the express purpose of selling it to other private parties whose use was expected to yield increased tax revenues. The decision left many worried that homes would be seized for commercial enterprises or that the decision could be used as a means to remove minority property owners deemed inconvenient.

The campaign to have Souter's house removed is headed by, who is petitioning to replace it with the , a tongue-in-cheek name for what he says will be a memorial to lost freedom. Clements already has 188 signatures to put the issue on a ballot, and only 25 are needed. Once it is on the ballot, the measure can be approved as soon as March. Weare has 8,500 residents.

So far, neither Justice Souter nor Kathy Arberg, Supreme Court spokeswoman, have commented on the matter.


text:
User talk:GCNSk8boarder

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 17:49, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
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title: User talk:GCNSk8boarder


text:
User talk:Flygmaskin~enwikinews

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 17:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
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Your account will be renamed
Hello,

The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called Flygmaskin. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name Flygmaskin~enwikinews that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name.

Your account will still work as before, and you will be credited for all your edits made so far, but you will have to use the new account name when you log in.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 23:17, 17 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
 This account has been renamed as part of single-user login finalisation. If you own this account you can |log in using your previous username and password for more information. If you do not like this account's new name, you can choose your own using this form after logging in: . -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 06:31, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Flygmaskin~enwikinews


text:
User talk:Inic~enwikinews

Welcome
Please donate to Wikipedia. I did. 2007-01-09 05:57:16 USD 15.00 , welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 17:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
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Your account will be renamed
Hello,

The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called Inic. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name Inic~enwikinews that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name.

Your account will still work as before, and you will be credited for all your edits made so far, but you will have to use the new account name when you log in.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 23:15, 17 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
 This account has been renamed as part of single-user login finalisation. If you own this account you can |log in using your previous username and password for more information. If you do not like this account's new name, you can choose your own using this form after logging in: . -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 06:32, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Inic~enwikinews


text:
User talk:Spannman~enwikinews

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 17:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
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Your account will be renamed
Hello,

The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called Spannman. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name Spannman~enwikinews that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name.

Your account will still work as before, and you will be credited for all your edits made so far, but you will have to use the new account name when you log in.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 23:32, 17 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
 This account has been renamed as part of single-user login finalisation. If you own this account you can |log in using your previous username and password for more information. If you do not like this account's new name, you can choose your own using this form after logging in: . -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 06:37, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Spannman~enwikinews


text:
User talk:Rajesh Narayanan

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 17:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
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title: User talk:Rajesh Narayanan


text:
User talk:David Comley~enwikinews

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 17:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
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Your account will be renamed
Hello,

The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called David Comley. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name David Comley~enwikinews that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name.

Your account will still work as before, and you will be credited for all your edits made so far, but you will have to use the new account name when you log in.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 23:14, 17 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
 This account has been renamed as part of single-user login finalisation. If you own this account you can |log in using your previous username and password for more information. If you do not like this account's new name, you can choose your own using this form after logging in: . -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 06:30, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:David Comley~enwikinews


text:
User talk:151.143.72.30

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! --Brian McNeil / talk 18:28, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
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title: User talk:151.143.72.30


text:
User talk:83.70.215.48

Welcome
83.70.215.48, welcome to Wikinews! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!
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Additionally, thanks for experimenting with Wikinews. Your test worked, and has now been reverted or removed. Please use Sandbox for any other tests you want to do, since testing in articles will be reverted quickly. --Deprifry|+T+ 18:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

title: User talk:83.70.215.48


text:
New case of Mad Cow disease found in Canada

January 23, 2006 A cow in the Province Alberta, Canada, has tested positive for Mad Cow disease, said Canadian Food Inspection Agency officials on Monday.

Officials also stated that the six-year-old cross-bred cow did not make it into the human or animal feed chain.

"Last evening the...laboratory for BSE located in Winnipeg confirmed the presence of BSE in a cross-bred cow born and raised in Alberta," said CFIA chief veterinarian Brian Evans. "The animal was detected on the farm where it was born and no part of this animal entered the food for human consumption or feed for animal consumption purposes."

It is the fourth case to turn up in Canada since 2003.

Evans also stated that it is too early to tell whether or not export markets would ban Canadian cows and beef.

The United States has seen two cases of Mad Cow disease. The first was discovered in December of 2003 in the state of Washington. Officials later linked this case to Canada because the cow was born on a farm in Alberta. The second infected cow was discovered in Texas in 2005. The later case was diagnosed in England after earlier samples tested had shown conflicting results.


text:
Template:Latest news 2

Refresh to see the latest news! If you find a problem with an article, fix it or comment on the article's discussion page. RSS What is RSS?

 category=Published notcategory=Disputed notcategory=Portal notcategory=Brief count=10 addfirstcategorydate=true namespace=Main suppresserrors=true

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title: Template:Latest news 2


text:
User talk:66.222.43.26

Welcome
66.222.43.26, welcome to Wikinews! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!
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 * Existing articles need expanding and checking for spelling and mistakes
 * The front page lead articles often need updating
 * Developing stories need finishing and publishing
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 * Audio Wikinews could always use more contributors
 * And of course, stories need writing!

Additionally, thanks for experimenting with Wikinews. Your test worked, and has now been reverted or removed. Please use Sandbox for any other tests you want to do, since testing in articles will be reverted quickly. Bawolff ☺☻ 18:59, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

title: User talk:66.222.43.26


text:
User talk:Akn0128

Welcome
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title: User talk:Akn0128


title: User:TShilo12~enwikinews


text:
Talk:New case of Mad Cow disease found in Canada

Source
Re worte some factually incorrect information. Added a link to the disease. The new source for the info is on the External links area. Jason Safoutin 20:39, 23 January 2006 (UTC)


text:
User talk:K1v1n

Welcome
, welcome to Wikinews! Thank you for your contributions; I hope you like the place and decide to stay! If you haven't done so already, you may want to create an account.

Our key policies - if you read anything, read these! Here a few pointers to help you get to know Wikinews: There are always things to do on Wikinews: By the way, you can sign your name on Talk pages using four tildes ( ~~~~ ), which produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, you can ask them at the water cooler or to anyone on the Welcommittee, or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! Brian | (Talk) | New Zealand Portal 20:52, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Neutral point of view - tell every side to a story in a fair and balanced way
 * Cite sources - everything in a Wikinews article must be sourced
 * Introduction - overview of the site
 * Writing an article - how to write and publish a complete article
 * Content guide - what's suitable for Wikinews
 * Contents - the contents page.
 * Newsroom - The comunity portal
 * Existing articles need expanding and checking for spelling and mistakes
 * The front page lead articles often need updating
 * Developing stories need finishing and publishing
 * Discussions need your input
 * And of course, stories need writing!

title: User talk:K1v1n


text:
Talk:Interview: Danny O'Brien of the Electronic Frontier Foundation/Transcript-Raw

January 23, 2006

Raw Transcript: [8:01p] Amgine: Okay, I'd like to start this interview now please. [8:02p] dannyob: • dannyob adjusts tie. [8:02p] Amgine: First, the request: We'd really like only the moderators and the interviewee to talk for the next hour, but we don't want to moderate the channel if we can avoid it. [8:02p] Amgine: I want to make an official introduction, to those few of you who do not know Danny O'Brien. [8:03p] Amgine: He is the activism coordinator at the Electronic Frontier Foundation, and a journalist by career choice. [8:04p] Amgine: Okay, Dannyob, would you like to start off with any presentation? [8:04p] dannyob: No presentation. I just wanted to say that I'm immensely honored to be asked along to speak. We're all great fans of the Wikipedia/Wikinews experiment at EFF, and it's fascinating to take a part in any aspect of it. [8:05p] dannyob: The other point I guess I should make is to point out that EFF is a weird hybrid [8:05p] dannyob: It's what's known in the US as a public interest law firm [8:05p] Amgine: All right. We've been building a set of questions and research links about the EFF at http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikinews/Interview_of_the_month/January_2006_EFF [8:05p] dannyob: That means that I am -- and the EFF is -- slightly more constrained than a lot of organisations, esp. advocacy orgs about what we can say [8:06p] dannyob: So, I'll just emphasise that nothing I'll say here should be construed as legal advice, and I'll probably not be able to talk in much detail about current cases [8:06p] dannyob: That's about the least legalese I could make that :) [8:06p] Amgine: I'd like to invite people to develop and compose questions in #wikinews-en, and I will try to squeeze them in as we go along. [8:06p] Amgine: [8:07p] Amgine: Okay, thanks for the warning. [8:07p] dannyob: Very happy to talk about advocacy itself though, and refer people to writings that our *real* lawyers have written on topics. [8:07p] dannyob: Anyway, on with the questions! [8:08p] Amgine: I'd like to jump into some direct questions which were suggested by people on the research page. [8:08p] dannyob: Sure! [8:08p] Amgine: These first ones relate to the US government and online privacy: [8:08p] Amgine: Since 9/11 the US administration has been progressively violating privacy standards in online communications, including circumventing its own surveilance laws and developing—and possibly implementing—the Total Information Awareness project. [8:08p] Amgine: What is EFF's position regarding government monitoring of private communications such e-mail, instant messaging, and voice over IP? [8:09p] dannyob: Okay, that's pretty straightforward. Since the very beginning, the EFF has worked hard to keep the traditional laws regarding wiretapping and monitoring away from the Internet [8:09p] dannyob: not just because we believe in strong 4th Amendment rights [8:09p] dannyob: but because technologically, a wiretap on an individual line is miles away from what is needed to do the equivalent on the Internet [8:10p] dannyob: that's why, for instance, we fought against CALEA being extended to the Net, and why we're fighting the FCC's extension of it now [8:11p] dannyob: A lot of simple approaches to surveillance that the govt would like to take are far from reasonable [8:11p] dannyob: to use the language of the 4th amendment. [8:11p] dannyob: I should say that I'm using American examples here, but we're obviously concerned more generally [8:12p] Amgine: We'll need to use some shorthand, so I know when you've completed an answer. [8:12p] dannyob: I'll just say "over" at the end, if you like :) [8:12p] Amgine: A related question: Will EFF be involved in cases, even as amicus, such as the cases filed by ACLU Detroit and the Center for Constitutional Rights New York, which allege the National Security Agency violated US law prohibiting wiretaps without a warrant? [8:12p] dannyob: or just butt in [8:12p] Amgine: [8:12p] dannyob: We're currently looking into every possible avenue. One of the difficulties is trying to ascertain exactly what the govrenment program involved [8:13p] dannyob: The EFF has a battery of lawyers, with different areas of interest [8:13p] Spum: Is this on the same "vein" as the recent requests for google to poney up it's search database? [8:13p] Spum: (sorry to interrupt, by the way) [8:14p] dannyob: Spum, no, that's a great question. The two issues are very different, but I think speak to the problems that the Internet is now being seen as a resource for government surveillance [8:14p] dannyob: and research [8:15p] dannyob: Which we think that all Net companies have to become aware of. There's a real danger in simply logging everything: you end up risking being a tool for the invasion of your own customer's privacy [8:15p] dannyob: over [8:15p] dannyob: :) [8:16p] Amgine: I have a sort of mass-question relating to that particular issue. [8:16p] Amgine: Google alone of the largest search engines refused the Justice Department's demands to turn over user data. The EFF is on record as criticizing Google's privacy policy. How does the EFF feel about that privacy policy now? What does EFF feel about the other search engine's behaviour—did they comply with their own privacy policies? Does this incident reflect the strength or weakness of corporate privacy policies online? [8:16p] dannyob: Privacy policies largely extend at the moment to merely the descriptions of what information is stored. [8:17p] dannyob: We've long warned against companies collecting large amounts of data about their customers, and doing nothing to anonymise or aggregate it. [8:17p] mbecker: Does the EFF have any material or programs that seek to educate employeers and companies on the advantages of privacy? [8:18p] dannyob: We think that companies are storing up trouble for themselves this way. [8:18p] dannyob: We do -- hold on, I should be handing out more URLs [8:18p] dannyob: http://www.eff.org/osp/ [8:18p] dannyob: Is our guide to "online service providers" for the best practicies in loggin data [8:19p] dannyob: I'm also speaking at the MySQL conference later this year on what *not* to include in your schema [8:19p] dannyob: It's an interesting area, because it's one where coders have a degree of power over what can be done [8:19p] dannyob: Personally, I'd like to see a great deal more knowledge about how to aggregate and anonymise data being spread among the community [8:19p] dannyob: I'm constantly recommending the book Translucent Databases, which covers this very nicely [8:20p] dannyob: also the OSS source would do a great service by setting reasonable defaults for software logging behaviours [8:20p] dannyob: The trouble is, and I think we all fall into this trap, we assume the more logging the better. [8:20p] dannyob: How many of us are casually logging this, for instance? :) [8:21p] dannyob: er, over. [8:21p] Amgine: [8:21p] dannyob: Translucent Databases URL: http://www.wayner.org/books/td/ [8:21p] Amgine: I'd like to talk about the Sony BMG case for a bit, if that's okay. [8:21p] Amgine: First, congratulations to EFF in regard to some of the successes in the Sony BMG case. There are some questions, clarifications about the case, however. [8:21p] Amgine: The settlement appears to cover the XCP and SunComm software delivered on CDs. What about OpenMG XCP, DRM used by Sony BMG's SonicStage software for Sony Connect? \ [8:22p] dannyob: Okay, this is where I have to say that I'm a *bit* limited in what I can say. [8:22p] dannyob: ah, if only out of blind ignorance in this particular case. [8:22p] Amgine: [8:23p] Amgine: Do you know if the OpenMG XCP software is mentioned at all in the agreement? [8:23p] dannyob: I don't know about OpenMG: we joined the case representing XCP and SunComm users, so I don't think that was covered. But watch me shine the giant neon IANAL sign above me [8:23p] dannyob: I don't believe so. [8:23p] dannyob: If you like, I can ask after the interview, and we can add that to the results. [8:23p] Amgine: I'd appreciate that. [8:23p] Amgine: Can you disclose the terms of the settlement regarding future use of software DRM measures? Have they promised not to alter users machines in the future? [8:24p] dannyob: Again, it's always dangerous to paraphrase legal documents [8:24p] Amgine: [8:24p] Amgine: This case also has some connection to copyright infringement: the XCP software included code taken from the VLC media player software, which is released under the GPL. Is EFF involved in any cases regarding this? [8:25p] dannyob: Ah, we have an FAQ that covers this. Thank goodness: http://www.eff.org/IP/DRM/Sony-BMG/settlement_faq.php [8:25p] Amgine: What would we do w/o faqs! [8:25p] dannyob: Amgine, no we didn't cover this. [8:26p] dannyob: We don't have standing to take on the copyright issue - i.e. we would have to represent a copyright holder [8:26p] Amgine: Would EFF be involved in such a case if asked? [8:26p] dannyob: It'd be an interesting case, but we try to distribute these cases to where the expertise lies [8:27p] dannyob: During the Sony BMG case, we spoke to groups like the FSF and the Software Freedom Law Center [8:27p] dannyob: Generally speaking, they're the people who would be best placed to investigate cases like this [8:28p] dannyob: It's worth saying that we're really pleased that there's now a whole constellation of great organisations that we work with [8:28p] dannyob: FSF, the Berkmann Center, Public Knowledge in D.C. [8:28p] dannyob: the list goes on [8:28p] Amgine: The Sony BMG case is a content producer attempting to enforce DRM on their clients. The US FCC is trying to do the same thing on the hardware of US citizens with the Broadcast Flag. [8:29p] dannyob: • dannyob rubs hands. [8:29p] dannyob: Ah, the Broadcast Flag! [8:29p] Amgine: I know the EFF is involved in the lobbying on this, but I have questions which lead into this. [8:29p] dannyob: Sure, go ahead. [8:29p] Amgine: This is a hardware issue. Does it matter on the internet? [8:29p] dannyob: Yes, for a number of reasons. [8:30p] dannyob: The point about the broadcast and audio flags is that they set up a kind of ghetto for content [8:30p] dannyob: the whole point of both is to *prevent* distribution onto the Internet [8:30p] dannyob: but in order to dothat, you need to create a hardware world which is fenced off from not just the Net, but from user modification, and open source development [8:31p] dannyob: This ghetto has to be created in every audio-visual device, by government mandate./ [8:32p] dannyob: So that affects the Net a couple of ways. Firstly, you essentially curtail the Net's use. [8:32p] dannyob: But secondly, these flags are easily (though illegally) circumventable [8:32p] Amgine: Not at the moment, neutralizer: I'm trying to do an interview with Danny O'Brien of the Electronic Frontier Foundation. [8:32p] dannyob: so they generally prompt even more draconian laws (which are just as easily circumventable) [8:33p] dannyob: One of our biggest problems with the flags is they cross a Rubicon. They create a government technological mandate in user tech [8:33p] dannyob: once you start down that path -- especially when you discover your initial mandate doesn't actually work -- you just ask for more and more control. [8:33p] dannyob: Er, over. [8:34p] Amgine: Isn't this already the case, considering the HDTV standard and others? Isn't standards an element of the FCCs mandate? [8:34p] dannyob: Standards for broadcast and reception, but not standards for what you do *after* you receive something. [8:35p] dannyob: Remember the FCC's primary job is to prevent interference, and to manage the commons of the public airwaves [8:35p] dannyob: It's a huge overreach for it to take over what you do with what comes from over those airwaves [8:36p] Amgine: Then getting on to the legislature... Because this is a rule, not a law, how does the EFF plan to approach it in the US Congress? [8:36p] dannyob: Well, the initial regulation was thrown out by the courts [8:36p] dannyob: who agreed with us that this was agency overreach [8:37p] dannyob: So what we've seen now is groups like the MPAA and RIAA attempt to extend the FCC's powers by law [8:37p] dannyob: For all of last year, they attempted to do that by -- well, for want of a better word, sneakily attaching the necessary language to other bills [8:37p] dannyob: As you say, it can potentially be a very small amendment, so I suppose they felt that they could do this [8:38p] dannyob: Everyone fought an incredibly effective campaign to prevent this [8:38p] dannyob: And a lot of that had to do with the Net -- we'd hear from the Hill of a lobbyist attempt to include the regulation [8:38p] dannyob: and we'd be able to organise calls and letters from constituents very quickly. [8:39p] dannyob: Most politicians, strangely enough, don't like it when something is sneaked past them [8:39p] dannyob: And we managed to alert a lot of them to arguments they weren't hearing from broadcasting lobbyists [8:39p] dannyob: Now, we're seeing a second stage [8:40p] dannyob: Which is Hollywood coming out into the open, and presenting the flags openly [8:40p] dannyob: That stage begins tomorrow, with Senate hearings on the topic [8:40p] Amgine: The Senate will begin hearings on this rule tomorrow. What does EFF expect to happen during this legislative process? How might this affect online communities? to get specific and personal, what does it mean to Wikinews readers and contributors? [8:41p] dannyob: If the law passes, it'll have dramatic effects [8:41p] dannyob: Particularly to wikinew's future, actually: I think we can all foresee a time when Wikinews would take fair use samples of the news and public affairs, both audio and visual [8:42p] dannyob: With a broadcast or audio flag in place, that usage - while legal - would effectively disappear [8:42p] dannyob: or at least be much much harder [8:43p] dannyob: More generally, you'll see advancement in tech frozen in a lot of areas, the pulling away of open source development in anything that was connected to HD TV or digital radio [8:43p] dannyob: The biggest problem here is that tech like the flag gives the ent industry a stick to hit the tech industry [8:43p] dannyob: before the broadcast flag was even introduced, hollywood was lining up objections to technology like Tivo-To-Go [8:44p] Amgine: Okay, I understand that would be the case in the USA, but could you explain how this might affect people in the EU? or anywhere outside the USA? [8:44p] dannyob: Sure, one of the areas that we spend a lot of time with these days -- we have two staff working full time on international issues - [8:45p] dannyob: is what's called policy laundering [8:45p] dannyob: so for instance, the worst provisions of the DMCA have generally been introduced into law in countries like Australia [8:45p] dannyob: by their inclusion in bilateral Free Trade Agreements [8:46p] dannyob: Already, Hollywood representatives have been working in Europe and elsewhere [8:46p] dannyob: to introduce the equivalent of the broadcast flag there [8:46p] dannyob: the rule is that if you can introduce it in one country, that makes it a lot easier to export it elsewhere [8:47p] dannyob was granted voice by MrMiscellanious. [8:47p] dannyob: Copyright extension is a great example of this [8:47p] dannyob: in that the last US copyright extension was introduced to track Europe [8:47p] dannyob: and now Europe is being encouraged to match its copyright with the US [8:48p] dannyob: We're already seeing that with copy control mandates like the flag. [8:48p] dannyob: Er, over. [8:48p] Amgine: [8:48p] Amgine: The Broadcast flag is a form of Digital Rights Management, in this case implemented by the US FCC. There are other DRM issues to talk about. [8:48p] Amgine: and quickly [8:48p] Amgine: In the French Parliament the DADVSI law, which relates to the implementation of the 2001 European Directive on Copyright in France, is under active consideration. Has the EFF had the opportunity to consider this law, and what is the opinion if so? [8:48p] dannyob: okay, i'll speed up :) [8:48p] Amgine: I'm talking about me. [8:49p] dannyob: Actually, I was just talking to Submarine about this before the interview started. We're keeping as close an eye on this as we can. [8:49p] Amgine: Canada and Belgium apply heavy taxes on copying medium, and the revenues from these taxes are used to support creative artists and developers, as an alternative to supporting DRM. What does EFF feel about such a method to control fair use/fair dealing? [8:49p] dannyob: It's a good example of the ratchet problem as it's an implementation of the EUCD. [8:49p] Amgine:  [8:50p] dannyob: Actually, we prefer a system of voluntary licensing schemes over either of these approaches [8:50p] dannyob: http://www.eff.org/share/collective_lic_wp.php [8:50p] dannyob: over [8:50p] Amgine: There are efforts under way to develop an open standard DRM, such as a project by Sun Microsystems which is relatively fair to users. Would EFF support an open standard/open source DRM, or is the entire concept of DRM considered unacceptable in any form? [8:51p] dannyob: Our take on Sun's DRM: http://www.eff.org/news/archives/2005_08.php#003929 [8:52p] dannyob: Essentially, our disagreement isn't with DRm per se: it's DRM backed up by the DMCA's anti-circumvention laws. [8:52p] Amgine: A follow-on question from the French one: does eff plan to set up some chapters in Europe ? [8:52p] dannyob: If users had the right to circumvent DRm to eexercise their fair use rights, we think the market would quickly sort out what ocntrols on media use were acceptable and what were not. [8:53p] dannyob: France like many countries, has a great core of activists and advocates already. We'd be delighted to help them in any way they can [8:53p] dannyob: s/they/we/ :) [8:54p] Amgine: A follow-on question regarding the Sony BMG case:  Does EFF have a response to the Register article http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/12/06/eff_needs_to_die/ [8:54p] dannyob: Sigh. [8:54p] Amgine: ?? [8:54p] dannyob: I wondered if this would turn up. [8:55p] dannyob: It's a really odd article, given that it includes a bunch of cases that aren't ours, ones that we didn't lose, and other oddities. [8:56p] dannyob: I think we'd rather let the facts speak for themselves. Here's a list of our victories. There's a longer list at the wikipedia entry. [8:56p] dannyob: http://www.eff.org/legal/victories/ [8:56p] Amgine: [8:56p] dannyob: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EFF&ei=BUPVQ6SsNJLc4QG7k-D5CA&sig2=_9ubmlfAf-CKoC_j2BDKWA [8:56p] dannyob: oops [8:56p] dannyob: well, that's Google tracking my moves... [8:57p] dannyob: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EFF [8:57p] dannyob: over [8:57p] Amgine: Are there any questions I should have asked you, which I did not? [8:57p] dannyob: Hahah [8:58p] Amgine: [8:58p] dannyob: No, but I'm happy to take additional questions [8:58p] dannyob: I'm actually trying to think of some of the harder questions [8:58p] Amgine: Well, I think I'll ask MrM to unmoderate now, and let everyone mob you. [8:59p] MrMiscellanious: :) Alright, here we go... [8:59p] MrMiscellanious made this room no longer moderated for normal users. [8:59p] dannyob: I guess the question we often get asked is "Why aren [8:59p] dannyob: 't you doing something about X?" [9:00p] dannyob: where X is a matter that really is important [9:00p] Amgine: Yes, there were a few of those... Why aren't you doing something about TOR is one which came up. [9:00p] dannyob: -- the simple answer to that is that we have limited resources [9:00p] dannyob: Which is why I'm really happy to see lots of other organisations spring up [9:00p] Amgine: Does EFF support TOR, financially or otherwise, anymore? [9:01p] dannyob: Amgine, we host Tor's website, but direct funding was for last year [9:01p] dannyob: Actually, the Tor questions really are so frequentlyl asked that they're best answered on Tor's FAQ [9:01p] dannyob: (including the legal FAQ we wrote for them) [9:01p] dannyob: http://tor.eff.org/faq.html.en [9:02p] Amgine: en.Wikipedia prevents TOR endpoints from editing on the site; does EFF consider such class-blocking an acceptable response to behavior, or is it generally inappropriate? [9:03p] SonicWN: European Organisations which have similar gooals like the EFF were not succesful in preventing Telecommunications data retention. Which conclusion does the EFF draw for their own campaigns. [9:03p] dannyob: SonicWN, i have a long answer to that, with my EFF hat off, [9:03p] dannyob: which i'll get to [9:04p] dannyob: Amgine, we're disappointed. We hope there's a way of providing a technical solution that would work to support Tor's aims, and would be practical for Wikipedia [9:04p] dannyob: if we can work as an intermediary in that discussion, we'd be happy to. [9:05p] Amgine: Question: "Danny O'Brien "once successfully lobbied a cockney London pub to join Richard M. Stallman in a spontaneous demonstration of Bulgarian folk dance." Can you ask him to give details?" [9:05p] dannyob: SonicWN, okay, so the reason I'll take my EFF hat off to answer your question, is because I'm also involved in ORG which is one of those organisations in Europe [9:05p] dannyob: The conclusion is that advocacy needs resources [9:06p] dannyob: One of the strengths of EFF and other US advocacy groups is they are permanent, with a paid staff [9:06p] Amgine: (ORG = Open Rights Group = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Rights_Group) [9:06p] MrMiscellanious: Wikipedia was earlier attacked by a group, which has launched a website, claiming that Wikipedia should be upheld by law to have 100% factuality in their website (relating to an earlier case where a bogus biography was posted to Wikipedia). What is the EFF's stance on the issue? [9:06p] KevinMarks: http://openrightsgroup.org [9:06p] dannyob: I think that now there are sites like www.pledgebank.com around, and facts like the wikipedia funding drive [9:07p] dannyob: show that we're getting to the point where we can turn volunteer organisations into groups that have that flexibility, plus financial resources [9:08p] dannyob: which means you get to the situation where the group of volunteers who formed ORG can now work on projects like submitting to UK parliamentary inquiries: http://www.openrightsgroup.org/orgwiki/index.php/APIG_DRM_Public_Inquiry [9:08p] dannyob: There are fantastic groups in Europe, like EDRI and FFII and I think the time is now right for those groups to be given more resources by everyone [9:08p] dannyob: And I speak as someone who traditionally comes out in hives when money is mentioned [9:09p] dannyob: it's a big leap, but I think it's one we all have to work at getting right [9:09p] dannyob: Okay, next question going through the heap [9:09p] • dannyob puts EFF hat back on [9:09p] dannyob: Amgine, RMS is a great fan of folk-dancing, and was teaching me and some friends the dance moves to the Free Software Song [9:10p] dannyob: in a pub in Shoreditch [9:10p] Amgine: [9:10p] dannyob: maybe it was the alcohol, all the alledgedly viral nature of the GPL, but by the end, we had most of the pub doing them [9:11p] Amgine: I'm still trying to wrap my head around the image of RMS folk dancing. [9:11p] dannyob: MrMiscellanious, I'm not sure of the site that you refer to, but obviously we'd support Wikipedia on this matters. We don't see any problem with Wikipedia's process [9:11p] Amgine: The site is a part of Greg Lloyd Smith's scam empire, imo. [9:11p] dannyob: Amgine, he loves it, although recently I believe he's hurt his leg and can't do it so much any more [9:12p] dannyob: Amgine, I couldn't possibly comment [9:12p] dannyob: :) [9:12p] Amgine: one more question coming in... [9:13p] dannyob: Links to those european groups: http://www.edri.org/ [9:13p] dannyob: http://www.ffii.org/ [9:13p] Amgine: There is an article on de.wikipedia (German) about the hacker "Tron". His full offline name is included in the article. [9:14p] Amgine: A German court has issued an injunction preventing the Wikimedia.de website (the website of the German Wikimedia Foundation) from linking to the de.wikipedia site, which is outside the jurisdiction of that court. [9:14p] dannyob: Give to them, at exactly the same time as you join the EFF: http://www.eff.org/support/ [9:14p] Amgine: What does EFF think about such extranational effects of local laws? [9:15p] Amgine: Does a person's name, especially a figure as well known as Tron, deserve special privacy? [9:15p] dannyob: It's a good question: honestly, it depends on the law, and the practicality of the law. [9:16p] MrMiscellanious: The order was obtained based on a proposal by the deceased hacker's family. [9:17p] dannyob: I can't speak to the case, particularly as the last i heard, the facts weren't clear. [9:17p] Deprifry: And it should be pointed out that the hacker's real name was known for a long time [9:18p] dannyob: In this case, it's not the territoriality of the law that's of concern, it's whether anyone should be forbidden from linking to a resource [9:18p] Amgine: [9:18p] Amgine: [9:19p] Amgine: Thanks a lot for taking the time to speak to us. If you don't mind being peppered, people would love to ask you questions for the next several days... [9:19p] dannyob: well, i'm not always the best person to answer questions, but I am at danny@eff.org [9:19p] dannyob: and our general clearing house for all questios is information@eff.org [9:20p] Deprifry: • Deprifry claps for interviewer and interviewee [9:20p] dannyob: Thanks for giving me a chance to talk! [9:20p] Amgine: I'd offer you a virtual coffee mug, but I didn't go find one before the interview. [9:21p] dannyob: It's alright, I was caffeinated enough already :) [9:21p] Amgine: I'll make sure to send you the links to articles we develop from the interview. I hope to have the transcript available to people shortly. [9:21p] Amgine:


text:
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text:
NASA postpones Stardust mission briefing, no revised date as of yet

January 23, 2006

NASA cancelled a media briefing on its Stardust mission, expected to provide an update about analysis of both the "" particles and gathered during the nearly seven year mission. In "MEDIA ADVISORY: M06-016," issued earlier today, the space agency announced postponement of the briefing, originally scheduled for Tuesday, January 24, 1 p.m. EST. No announcement has been made about when the briefing will be re-scheduled. NASA's stated reason for delay was to, "allow the Stardust science team additional time to assess and distribute cometary samples."


text: User:Brian/message

title: User:Brian/message