text:
Talk:George H. W. Bush

"Honest and approachable"
"George H.W. Bush is an honest and approachable man that the American people can relate to, he has made mistakes in his life like all good natured people."

A World Transformed quote
Quote removed:

 * "Trying to eliminate Saddam ... would have incurred incalculable human and political costs. Apprehending him was probably impossible ... We would have been forced to occupy Baghdad and, in effect, rule Iraq ... there was no viable 'exit strategy' we could see, violating another of our principles. Furthermore, we had been self-consciously trying to set a pattern for handling aggression in the post-Cold War world. Going in and occupying Iraq, thus unilaterally exceeding the United Nations' mandate, would have destroyed the precedent of international response to aggression that we hoped to establish. Had we gone the invasion route, the United States could conceivably still be an occupying power in a bitterly hostile land." (1998)
 * Source: A World Transformed

See http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/gulfwar.asp for the reason why: much of the context was removed, destroying the intent. I don't like Bush (either one) and I certainly don't like the war, but that doesn't mean we need to get nasty and quote out of context, or we're no better than they are. I'd replace it with the full quote, putting back in the stuff in ellipses, but I worry that somebody would just hack it back up again to try and make a point. - Furrykef 10:04, 7 Nov 2004 (UTC) The full quote as provided by the snopes link above: Trying to eliminate Saddam, extending the ground war into an occupation of Iraq, would have violated our guideline about not changing objectives in midstream, engaging in "mission creep," and would have incurred incalculable human and political costs. Apprehending him was probably impossible. We had been unable to find Noriega in Panama, which we knew intimately. We would have been forced to occupy Baghdad and, in effect, rule Iraq. The coalition would instantly have collapsed, the Arabs deserting it in anger and other allies pulling out as well. Under the circumstances, there was no viable "exit strategy" we could see, violating another of our principles. Furthermore, we had been self-consciously trying to set a pattern for handling aggression in the post-Cold War world. Going in and occupying Iraq, thus unilaterally exceeding the United Nations' mandate, would have destroyed the precedent of international response to aggression that we hoped to establish. Had we gone the invasion route, the United States could conceivably still be an occupying power in a bitterly hostile land. It would have been a dramatically different— and perhaps barren— outcome.

I would place the full quote back where it was, but coming from the book A World Transformed which was a collaboration between George H. W. Bush and Brent Scowcroft it is not at this point certain that it was a comment by Bush, though it seems to be, and I believe that I remember him making similar remarks in interviews. ~ Kalki 17:38, 8 Nov 2004 (UTC)

POV!!!!
Would it really hurt to actually put in a few quotes that sound normal or even good? Practically everything here is an example of something stupid or distasteful that he happened to say. This makes it seem like the authors of this page are very biased against Bush sr. — unsigned comment by 60.234.157.64 on 10:01, 8 September 2006

 * Feel free to help by adding some quotable quotes that you don't find "stupid or distasteful". ~ Robin Lionheart (talk) 18:37, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

George H.W. Bush "Atheist" Remark

 * Reporter (Roger I. Sherman): Surely you recognize the equal citizenship and patriotism of Americans who are atheists?  Bush: No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God.
 * Campaign press conference at O'Hare Airport, Chicago (August 27, 1987); as quoted in "Can George Bush, with impunity, state that atheists should not be considered either citizens or patriots? The History of the Issue" by Madalyn O'Hair

This quote can not be sourced beyond a single reporter. The reporter himself (Robert Sherman) even admits on his website (http://www.robsherman.com/advocacy/060401a.htm) that there is no other record - audio, video, or from the memory of any other reporter at the press conference - that any such thing was ever actually said.

The Madalyn O'Hair quote listed in the body of the article is a blind link to a defunct website that only seems to be there for the purpose of being a "source" for this quote.

The fact that this quote is also the only bolded quote in this section of the leads me to believe that this is a politically motivated addition to the quotes.

---

Well, sort of. That Robert Sherman was at the conference is provable. And Sherman's website via your link does include a PDF from the Bush Presidential library containing quite a bit of mail correspondence about this. Some of the letters sent specifically include the quote, but in the responses from the White House that Bush said made such a hateful remark is never denied. If someone demands you apologize for your statement that 30 million Americans should be stripped of their citizenship and you never actually said such a thing, wouldn't your first priority be to correct the misunderstanding? Not to, as they did, use a whole lot of meaningless weasel answers to vaguely affirm that you'll consider treating atheists like actual American citizens? In fact, at some point during the exchange the staffers in the WH decided just to brush the whole thing under the rug (as the remarks would be "not too easy to defend") and ignore the issue from that point on. This is not the behavior of someone committed to freedom of religion and separation of church & state. Dyolf Knip 19:21, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

 * I've restored the "atheists not citizens" quote, placing it into the "Attributed" section because it is infamous but elusive; i.e., well-known and sourceable, but not independently so. When we have a quote like this, it's important to cite it with the best available evidence, which should itself demonstrate why we don't consider it properly sourceable.

 * In this case, I've given the PDF document (of a voluminous Bush Library fax) that Robert Sherman includes on his advocacy website as a provisional source. My quick review did not show any actual proof that Bush made the statement, contrary to the implications of Sherman's site and correspondence. It seems that Bush and his representatives, while reaffirming a stance unfavorable to atheism, avoided confirming or denying the actual publicized statement. With this "he said/he won't say" situation and no independent sourcing, I don't see that this quote will ever be more than "attributed". ~ Jeff Q (talk) 01:43, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

 * There were other reporters present at this press conference, yet I can find no report of any one of them contradicting Sherman's account of what was said.--Kenneth Cooke 12:52, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

 * There were other reporters present at this press conference, yet I can find no report of any one of them confirming Sherman's account of what was said. --Dual Freq 23:59, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

The fact that the President or his advisers decided not to deny this quote is relevant evidence when deciding the likelihood that it was said. This was not "faxed correspondence with the Presidential Library" as Dual Freq writes. These are official copies of official white house documents which were faxed to Sherman by the library archivist. They include documents generated by White House staff and presidential advisers as well as copies of letters sent by US citizens to their president and his advisers. The letters from the public make it clear to the President and his staff that there were many citizens who were under the impression that this quote was made by the President. The memos from White House staff make it equally clear that the President was well aware that some citizens believed that he had said this, and felt offended, and furthermore that the President was in no hurry to correct this impression.--Kenneth Cooke 01:27, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

 * There are many reasons why a politician may be "in no hurry" to correct an erroneous or inaccurate impression by a vocal minority of the population. Speaking as one of the minority who would find such a quote monumentally reprehensible, I must nevertheless point out that Wikiquote is not in the business of interpreting motivations, only listing specific reliable sources. Sherman doesn't strike me as a particularly reliable source by Wikimedia standards (having an axe to grind and not being backed up by any other reliable source). But since this quote is so widely distributed, we need to include it here with what evidence is available. It would be good to add as a sub-bullet a specific, dated, sourced quote from Bush or one of his lieutenants (like Gray) that refutes it or otherwise responds directly to the controversy, one which adequately balances the claims being made about this attributed/disputed quote. ~ Jeff Q (talk) 06:20, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Done.--Kenneth Cooke 14:09, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

You can't put this in the Disputed section because you as an editor dispute it, or by arguing that someone else should have disputed it. You have to show that someone has disputed it on behalf of the speaker. I don't know why anyone would dispute it anyway. It's typical of Bush's speech patterns and not an unreasonable thing for someone of his generation to say. If a remark is not consistent with your own assumptions about the man, that is not a reason to mark it "disputed." BTW, I don't really find it plausible that Sherman would send a series of whining letters over an in-person remark that never actually happened. w:User:WillOakland 00:49, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

 * The RIDICULOUS disputes over this ridiculous remark have continued to this point in a very ridiculous fashion. I have just restored it to the disputed section, having countered the attempts of zealots from opposite poles of the sphere of stupidity from either removing it entirely or treating it as absolutely beyond dispute. Though I, for one, do not think it very likely that this remark is a complete fabrication, there remains much room for reasonable doubt as to its accuracy, and as there are apparently no recordings of the incident, the disputes are never likely to be settled absolutely one way or another, and thus the quote should remain in the Disputed section. ~ Kalki 00:55, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

"considered patriots" vs "regarded as patriotic"
Using "regarded as patriotic" because Sherman's account on his website has used that wording since 2002, but the earliest print citations I've found use "considered patriots":

The alt.atheists FAQ also incompletely sources it to the Boulder Daily Camera newspaper (27 Feb 1989).

Does anyone have a pre-2002 citation for "regarded as patriotic"? ~ Robin Lionheart (talk) 21:00, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Rob Sherman just replied to my e-mail asking about this discrepancy:

 * From: Rob Sherman
 * To: Robin Lionheart
 * Date: Thu, May 17, 2012 at 11:32 PM
 * Subject: Re: “considered patriots”/“regarded as patriotic”

 * The first that I wrote about it was on my own web site, in the stories that I sent you. I provided an oral report to American Atheists, but I was not a writer for them at any time.  However, I have spoken countless times about the exchange, on a regular basis, since the time that it occurred.

 * I have thought long and hard, today, about your question about "regarded" or "considered." I'm sure he said, "regarded."

 * One other thing that many other media reports have said that is not accurate: Many reports say that the exchanged happened on August 27, 1988, but it was actually on August 27, 1987.  That part is indisputable, in that the exchange was in relation to his having just announced his candidacy for President.  The political conventions and the election took place in 1988 so, by 1988, Bush would have been a long way down the road from having just announced his candidacy for the nomination.

~ Robin Lionheart (talk) 04:39, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

The citation referencing Robert Sherman's personal website should not be used. The other citation listed is quite sufficient. Additional, the article should indicate that Sherman is an political activist. 128.229.4.2 14:23, 4 April 2014 (UTC)
 * I have no significant objections to the journalist being labeled an activist by activists — I do have objections to efforts to CENSOR out the source, or links to his remarks or his side of the story. As I have pointed out in the past, in regards to MUCH asininity on either side of this dispute — some who do not wish it labeled "Disputed" and others who don't wish it to be cited at all — the quote is NOTABLE and the LINKS to the sources available SHOULD be provided, and the quote SHOULD be labelled "Disputed." Efforts to remove the "Disputed" seem to have worked during a lack of attention on the part of some here — but I hold that the efforts to remove valid links to the source are even more contemptible. ~ ♞☤☮♌Kalki·†·⚓⊙☳☶⚡ 14:37, 4 April 2014 (UTC) + tweaks
 * Though it's not a big deal to me, my understanding is that "Disputed" was disputed because readers could get a false impression that anyone connected to Bush disputes it. (Bush and his people never have.) So "Attributed" split the difference, implying neither that it's unquestioned, nor that anyone is gainsaying Sherman's account. Seemed like a good compromise to me. ~ Robin Lionheart (talk) 07:53, 5 April 2014 (UTC)
 * "Attributed" makes sense to me. I have thus far read not one rebuttal to  w:User:WillOakland excellent comment of 00:49, 12 April 2009 (UTC) that to list something as disputed on Wikipedia, you need to list a published source that does dispute it - you can't just dispute it yourself as an editor.TheCormac (talk) 00:32, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

I will never apologize for the United States, ever. I don't care what the facts are
This is obviously a hoax that either originated here or was brought here. If this statement was made there is no doubt that some media outlet would have reported it. Supposedly, Newsweek ran with the story in 1988, so without visiting a library in person it's impossible to verify with the original source. However, a quote like this would certainly have been picked up by secondary sources very quickly - sources which have been archived via Google's news archive. Several of the sources given, "rotton.com" and "www.iranchamber.com" can hardly be considered as authoritative. The quote from a reporter on CNN, Bruce Morton, just mentioned the quote in passing and may very well have simply heard the quote from somewhere, very possibly Wikipedia, and repeated it without further research.

Until we can get verification of this quote from some media outlet around the time of the alleged statement, I think we should be very cautious with accepting this quote as accurate. Lottering 10:51, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

 * Isn't this enough? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10qatUWwIeg

 * This is hardly a hoax. There were many reports upon it on television at the time it was made that I personally clearly remember. Googles News "archives" of articles are hardly maintained for a week on many articles, let alone for articles published before the World Wide Web even existed, and Newsweeks archives of its issues only go back to 1993. The article cited is from 1988. ~ Kalki 10:51, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

 * If there were many reports then why is there no mention of it on NexisLexus or Google News Archives?. Surely if I could find a news story of my father's arrest for DUI in 1986 in a small town newspaper via both Nexis Lexus AND Google News then such an explosive newsworthy quote would also be reported?  Also, the Google News archives are not simply archives of what was reported on the WWW, it goes several hundred years back from actual scans of actual news print.  Lottering 11:06, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

 * One other question: If I actually go to the library and look up the Newsweek article in question and find there is no quote to support this claim, will you allow the quote to be removed from here or would you simply keep it and remove mention of Newsweek being a source? Lottering 11:16, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

My interest in retaining the quote is motivated by a clear rememberance of it at the time, and I have no doubt of it being genuine. It could be slightly misquoted, as there are a few very minor variants to its phrasing that exist. Further confirmation and accuracy is welcome, and I have added citations of two more published sources other than "Perspectives" in Newsweek (15 August 1988) p. 15:

 * The 267 Stupidest Things Democrats/Republicans Ever Said (2000) by Ted Rueter

 * "Rally Round the Flag, Boys" by Michael Kingsley in TIME magazine. As an indication of errors and omissions that can occur in any electronic (or printed) archives, this article is clearly misdated, and is plainly a contemporary account of the 1988 Presidential campaign, though it is currently dated as having been published in 2001. Hopefully this will soon be corrected, as I have just sent a memo to the TIME archives site about the current error. ~ Kalki 12:20, 16 April 2007 (UTC

 * Okay, you seem to be right. While the quote given is not 100 percent I have found matches what come to the same meaning doing google news searches in 1988-1989.  Even the different news agencies at the time gave slightly different quotes.  I now believe there is no reason to doubt the 1988 Newsweek article so I'll back off! Lottering 13:07, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Your most recent post got me wondering how you confirmed this, as I previously had thought your mention of the Google News "archive" was of the articles linked to in their long established "News" option; and I only just now realized it was actually a newer option that you were referring to: the News Archive search. This should be a helpful resource for further searches, and a very good thing to be aware of for improving our accuracy: I see that there are citations for the remark in The New York Times and other newspapers as well, and indications that he said the core remark on more than one occasion, which also confirms my own memory of things. Thanks for alerting me to this new function at Google. ~ Kalki 13:57, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

 * I see there are more recent updates on the main George H.W. Bush WikiQuote page, but I'm adding this information here since this page still seems to rank high in the search engine results:
 * Please see "Bush Ethnic Coalition Speech" (2 August 1988) National Press Club, Washington, D.C., - Recorded for C-SPAN's "Road to the White House" coverage. [Note that the C-SPAN post is dated 2 August 1988, but the video timestamp is 5 August 1988]. The cited line discussed above can be heard in Bush's remarks to members of The Coalition of American Nationalities:
 * "I will never apologize for the United States of America – ever - I don’t care what the facts are.  I will lead her.  I will do my level best to stand up for freedom and democracy around the world by keeping the United States of America strong, and by keeping our eyes wide open.  If we welcome change in the world, by keeping our eyes wide open. [sic]"
 * ---Link to full C-SPAN video [Bush's remarks begin at roughly 35:20 minutes, cited phrase (with context) at 42:21]: http://www.c-span.org/video/?3816-1/bush-ethnic-coalition-speech
 * ---Link to brief YouTube video excerpt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10qatUWwIeg  ~User: RWrite 11 July 2016

Since we now can see exactly what he said, in the C-SPAN video, I made these changes. First, I linked to the video as the main citation. Second, I merged two "variants" of the quote, since they were cited to the same occasion and we know what wording he used. Third, I edited the description to make clear that the connection to the Flight 655 was made by Newsweek and Times, and that Bush didn't mention the shoot-down in the speech itself. Vilhelm.s (talk) 20:50, 4 July 2018 (UTC)

New World Order Quote
"We have before us the opportunity to forge for ourselves and for future generations a 'new world order'. A world where the rule of law, not the law of the jungle, governs the conduct of nations. When we are successful, and we will be, we have a real chance at this 'new world order', an order in which a credible United Nations can use it's peacekeeping role to fulfill the promise and vision of the U.N.s' founders."

http:www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CWBTL33MpA I don't know when he said that and I don't know what speech but I know he said it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Coyote sprit (talk • contribs) 19:24, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

 * I love how the NWO conspiracy video makers edit the original video adding dramatic music and zoom in on Bush's head for an extreme close up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7a9Syi12RJo is another example of this type of video editing. Audio is so unsynced in the youtube video that it could be dubbed, but I added a NYT ref for the quote in question. That video also incorrectly captions the joint session speech with the "fifth objective" line as September 11, 1991. NYT printed a transcript September 12, 1990 of the Joint session of Congress speech, 9/11/1990. I guess it sells more videos to change it to 1991. --Dual Freq 16:05, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

So it was exactly 11 year before 9/11, interesting. And he talks about this new world order and says its a very old plan, 100 generations. They sure are planning ahead then. If he says so, I belief him.

Why is this page not protected and Barack Obama's is?
This is an example of intellectual dishonesty. Most of these quotes would not pass muster, according to the decision to leave out Barack Obama's Special Olympic quote by one of the editors of the Barack Obama page:

How about you give a reason why that quote shouldnt be included on this page. The fact that it is not flattering to President Obama is not sufficient to exclude it. --Henrybaker 06:43, 22 March 2009 (UTC) If it was flattering to Obama, it still wouldn't merit inclusion in my opinion. If Obama went on the Tonight Show and recited his grocery list, some people would find things there to praise and others to criticize, but it wouldn't be quoteworthy. Wikiquote:Quotability sets forth a number of factors to be weighed in determining whether either deserves a place in this compendium. These include: Is the quote itself particularly witty, pithy, wise, eloquent, or poignant? Is the author of the quote notable? If so, are they very notable, moderately notable, barely notable? Are they notable as a source of quotes (i.e., as a poet, pundit, or Yogi Berra)? Is the quote itself independently well known (as with proverbs and certain well-reported comments)? Is the subject of the quote a notable subject? Is it about a broad theme of the human experience such as Love, Justice, or Loneliness? Or is it about a narrow or mundane topic, like porcupines, lunch meat, or that new car smell? If the quote is about another person, is that other person highly notable? Has the quote stood the test of time? Is the quote verifiably sourced? The quote at issue here fails the first, fourth, and fifth factors utterly. Certainly it is not inherently memorable if considered apart from the author. The topic is bowling, which is mundane (or, arguably, the Special Olympics, which is a narrow topic). Per the Quotability guidelines, "any quote made within the past ten years will be scrutinized under the presumption that it is not inherently quotable". If we include everything said by a notable person simply because that person is notable, then we would for example transcribe every word of Shakespeare's plays, duplicating the function of Wikisource while drowning truly poignant comments and notable observations in a sea of chaff. I note that we include Obama's heavily criticized "they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion" remark, which is far more unflattering to Obama than the bowling comment, but which is also (unlike the bowling comment) relevant to his role in society, as a policymaker explicitly addressing things such as guns and religion. BD2412 T 07:16, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

If that page is protected, then so should this one. If the quotes (gaffes) over there are not considered worthy of Wikiquote, then why are these? Eschudy

 * Many forms of conscious and unconcious dishonesty and hypocrisy abound among many people, but to target the fact that this page is not currently protected as somehow an example of that seems more than a little extreme. Pages are protected according to the level of vandalism which tends to be occurring on them. Obama as current president, currently is a subject of massive attention and the page is likely to be a target of much vandalism. You specify one quote which was not included after it's removal from Obama's page. Frankly it seems to have been a quote most people were not all that interested in discussing or including. Personally, I have no strong objections to the quote in question either being included or removed, for even though it is not one I find particularly notable, obviously many others seem to think it was. I am not interested in having anyone on any of these pages being presented in entirely flattering or entirely damning ways, but neither is it anyone's obligation here to be more interested or involved in any particular page or issue than they choose to be. The omission of that quote simply seems to be a case of no one objecting strongly enough to a short list of rationale for it being removed (which I, being a bit more "inclusionist" than some, would personally say is somewhat flawed, no matter how earnest and well motivated). In regard to semi-protecting this page: I have no strong objections to it, but perceive no strong need for it at this point. Vandalism of both the Bush pages certainly has substantially subsided since the younger Bush left office. ~ Kalki 07:17, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

 * Noting the argument for protection of this page, and recent activity upon it, I have now semi-protected this page for a period of one month. ~ Kalki 06:55, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

Quote served up by Google
I happened to do a search for 41, and Google's summary box in the righthand column highlighted this quote:

 * I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them.

A quick search turns up mentions at the usual bogus quotation sites, but no valid references. Has this one come up before?--NapoliRoma (talk) 22:56, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

title: Talk:George H. W. Bush


text:
User talk:HI332211-

Vandalizing pages that are provided as a free resource to everyone endears you to no one. Contributing to worthy efforts sometimes actually can be a means of discovering one's own worth; working to diminish them reveals nothing but stupidity. Vandalization will result in reverts, often in blocks, and is always a waste of everyone's time and life, not least of all yours. Don't waste people's time. ~ Kalki 18:28, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:HI332211-


text:
Ender's Game

Ender's Game (1985) is the most famous novel of Orson Scott Card. The book originated as a science fiction novelette in Analog magazine (1977). Card later expanded the novel into the Ender's Game series, dealing with the long-term results of the war.

Quotes

 * “The essence of training is to allow error without consequence.”
 * Introduction to "Ender's Game" (hard cover novel)

 * "“Because never in my entire childhood did I feel like a child. I felt like a person all along--the same person that I am today.  I never felt that I spoke childishly. I never felt that my emotions and desires were somehow less real than adult emotions and desires.”
 * Introduction to "Ender's Game" (hard cover novel)

 * "That monitor is going to come out today. We're going to take it right out, and it won't hurt a bit." Ender nodded. It was a lie, of course, that it wouldn't hurt a bit. But since adults always said it when it was going to hurt, he could count on that statement as an accurate prediction of the future. Sometimes lies were more dependable than the truth.
 * Ch. 1: Third

 * For a moment, the others backed away and Stilson lay motionless. They were all wondering if he was dead. Ender, however, was trying to figure out a way to forestall vengeance. To keep them from taking him in a pack tomorrow. I have to win this now, and for all time, or I'll fight it every day and it will get worse and worse.
 * Ch.1: Third

 * "I'll lie to him." "And if that doesn't work?" "Then I'll tell the truth. We're allowed to do that, in emergencies. We can't plan for everything, you know."
 * Ch. 3: Graff

 * "Ender didn't like fighting. He didn't like Peter's kind, the strong against the weak, and he didn't like his own kind either, the smart against the stupid."
 * Ch.3: Graff

 * He toyed with the idea of trying to be like the other boys. But he couldn't think of any jokes, and none of theirs seemed funny. Wherever their laughter came from, Ender couldn't find such a place in himself. He was afraid, and fear made him serious.
 * Ch. 4: Launch

 * “It isn't the world at stake, Ender. Just us. Just humankind. As far as the rest of the earth is concerned, we could be wiped out and it would adjust, it would get on with the next step in evolution. But humanity doesn't want to die. As a species, we have evolved to survive."

 * As a species, we have evolved to survive. And the way we do that is by straining and straining and, at last, every few generations, giving birth to genius.
 * Colonel Graff, Ch. 4: Launch

 * Human beings are free except when humanity needs them.
 * Colonel Graff, Ch. 4: Launch

 * He could see Bonzo's anger growing hot. Hot anger was bad. Ender's anger was cold, and he could use it. Bonzo's was hot, and so it used him.
 * Ch. 7: Salamander

 * So he believed. Believed, but the seed of doubt was there, and it stayed, and every now and then sent out a little root. It changed everything, to have that seed growing. It made Ender listen more carefully to what people meant, instead of what they said. It made him wise.
 * Ch. 8: Rat

 * The world is always a democracy in times of flux, and the man with the best voice will win. Everybody thinks Hitler got to power because of his armies, because they were willing to kill, and that's partly true, because in the real world power is always built on the threat of death and dishonor. But mostly he got to power on words, on the right words at the right time.
 * Peter, Ch. 9: Locke and Demosthenes

 * Remember - the enemy's gate is down.
 * Ch. 10: Ender

 * There was no doubt now in Ender's mind. There was no help for him. Whatever he faced, now and forever, no one would save him from it. Peter might be scum, but Peter had been right, always right; the power to cause pain is the only power that matters, the power to kill and destroy, because if you can't kill then you are always subject to those who can, and nothing and no one will ever save you.
 * Ch. 12: Ender

 * Perhaps it's impossible to wear an identity without becoming what you pretend to be.
 * Ch. 13: Valentine

 * "In the moment when I truly understand my enemy, understand him well enough to defeat him, then in that very moment I also love him. I think it's impossible to really understand somebody, what they want, what they believe, and not love them the way they love themselves. And then, in that very moment when I love them... I destroy them. -" "You beat them." For a moment she was not afraid of his understanding. "No, you don't understand. I destroy them. I make it impossible for them to ever hurt me again. I grind them and grind them until they don't exist."
 * Ender & Valentine, Ch. 13: Valentine

 * "Human beings didn't evolve brains in order to lie around on lakes. Killing's the first thing we learned. And a good thing we did, or we'd be dead, and the tigers would own the earth."
 * Valentine, to Ender, Ch. 13: Valentine

 * "If one of us has to be destroyed, let's make damn sure we're the ones alive at the end. Our genes won't let us decide any other way. Nature can't evolve a species that hasn't a will to survive. Individuals might be bred to sacrifice themselves, but the race as a whole can never decide to cease to exist."
 * Graff, to Ender, Ch. 13: Valentine

 * He had long since learned that when something unusual was going on, something that was part of someone else's plan and not his own, he would find out more information by waiting than by asking. Adults almost always lost their patience before Ender did.
 * Ch. 14: Ender's Teacher

 * "All right," Ender gasped. "You win." The man's knee thrust painfully downward. "Since when," ask the man, his voice soft and rasping, "do you have to tell the enemy when he has won?"
 * Ch. 14: Ender's Teacher

 * "I am your enemy, the first one you've ever had who was smarter than you. There is no teacher but the enemy. No one but the enemy will tell you what the enemy is going to do. No one but the enemy will ever teach you how to destroy and conquer. Only the enemy shows you where you are weak. Only the enemy tells you where he is strong. And the rules of the game are what you can do to him and what you can stop him from doing to you. I am your enemy from now on. From now I am your teacher."
 * Ch. 14: Ender's Teacher

 * "Remember, boy. From now on the enemy is more clever than you. From now on the enemy is stronger than you. From now on you are always about to lose." The old man's face grew serious again. "You will be about to lose, Ender, but you will win. You will learn to defeat the enemy. He will teach you how."
 * Ch. 14: Ender's Teacher

About

 * Reverse colonial sci-fi don't always have to be anti-imperialist, though. Ender's Game, both film and book, use the invasion of the superior aliens not as a critique of Western expansion and genocide, but as an excuse for those things. The bugs invade human worlds, and the consequence is that the humans must utterly annihilate the alien enemy, even if Ender feels kind of bad about it.
 * Noah Berlatsky, “Why Sci-Fi Keeps Imagining the Subjugation of White People”, (April 25, 2014).

 * What works with Ender's Game is Ender's community-building. There's a disparate group of kids who could be rivals, and he's able to bind them together through his personal service to them, through his loyalty, his trustworthiness. They know he'll never waste them, that he's not exploiting them for his own gain. I certainly was not conscious of it as I was writing him—I'm not much of a follower, and I'm not a good team player—and yet I created the kind of guy that I would follow.
 * Orson Scott Card in “Orson Scott Card Talks Ender's Game in Rare Interview”, by Shane Snow, WIRED, (10.31.13).

 * As it's written, Ender's Game is adaptable. The book takes place entirely inside Ender's head. If you don't know what Ender is thinking, he's just an incredibly violent little kid and not terribly interesting. You have to find ways to externalize what he's thinking. But he can't be the kind of person who explains himself to other people. That would weaken him.
 * Orson Scott Card in “Orson Scott Card Talks Ender's Game in Rare Interview”, by Shane Snow, WIRED, (10.31.13).

 * Le Guin first mentions the Ansible in her novel Rocannon’s World, published in 1966, and the invention of the device itself was a central motif to her 1974 novel, The Dispossessed. The main character of that novel was the inventor. Card, either through laziness or lack of imagination, appropriated Le Guin’s device full-bore and for reasons that have escaped me over the last thirty odd years, is that no one’s complained or cried foul. Indeed, other writers since then have also used the Ansible for their FTL communication needs. If Card had stolen a tune from a song and incorporated it in a song of his own (and consequently made a boat-load of money) without sharing the credit with the original songwriter, he’d have his ass handed to him in a sling in court. This is what happened to M.C. Hammer when he stole a famous riff from Rick James in 1990 for his song, “U Can’t Touch This”. The riff that made the song a world-wide hit (and made Hammer’s career) came from the creative mind of Rick James and it was only after a lengthy court battle did James end up sharing credit for Mr. Hammer’s song. Did Hammer say in court that it was a homage to Rick James? No. Did he say that everyone steals from everyone else in the music business and that it’s no big deal? No.
 * Paul Cook, “Our Ansible is Missing – Intellectual Property Theft in Science Fiction”, (July 17, 2013)

 * That Ender could be tricked into believing a real battle scenario was a game-like video simulation is one of the most believable post-modern twists in modern science fiction, particularly considering how often the difference between our digital and "real" lives is debated and conflated. Ender becomes a "hero" in a supposed video game, something that embodies and magnifies fears about video games, both in 1985 when the book was published and today.
 * Rachel Eddin, "Ender's Games: What Child Soldiers in Dystopian Fiction Teach Us About Ourselves", WIRED, (10/30/13).

 * Sure, people get new jobs, or go to different schools, or grow in prestige. But at no point over the course of the novel do we see a demonstrable growth or change in any of the characters, despite the fact that Ender ages from six to roughly eleven. I'm willing to grant Card the "exceedingly young hero" just because every science fiction novel geared toward young adults — and many that aren't — runs into this problem. But to see no demonstrable character growth just sort of removes the stakes from it. Card in many ways suffers from the same problem that Asimov faced in some of his great novels, the fact that he had a rocking plot concept but his characters were two-dimensional cardboard cutouts just going through the motions to make that awesome plot happen.
 * Walt Hickey, “I Finally Figured Out Why I Hate Ender's Game, The Cult Sci-Fi Novel That Everyone Else Apparently Loves”, (Aug 12, 2013)

 * Ender gets to strike out at his enemies and still remain morally clean. Nothing is his fault.
 * John Kessel, "Creating the Innocent Killer: Ender's Game, Intention, and Morality". Science Fiction Foundation, (2004).

 * I don't know of any pair of novels that have been as consistently misinterpreted as Card's Ender's Game and Speaker for the Dead. Even a reader with a rudimentary knowledge of twentieth century history might be expected to guess that the character of Ender Wiggin, the near messianic superhero, is based on that of Adolf Hitler. Card himself is the "Speaker for the Dead" who seeks to understand and forgive the genocidal dictator's behavior by demonstrating that his intentions were good. Because Hitler/Ender committed genocide to preserve the existence and dignity of what he defined as human, he is not a monster but a true Superman who willingly shouldered the heavy responsibility thrust upon him.
 * Elaine Radford, "Ender and Hitler: Sympathy for the Superman (20 Years Later)", (2007-03-26).

 * For the reader who isn't convinced that writing a book (no matter how highly acclaimed) makes up for exterminating a race, Card offers an alternative, albeit rather contradictory, excuse for his genocide's actions -- genetic determinism. Although this "science" has been shown to represent such an oversimplification that it's a downright distortion, Card makes it the foundation of the biology of his universe. From the very beginning, authorities can breed geniuses more easily than you or I could establish a strain of purebred blue budgies, and never mind that breeding for color and size involves at most a few genes, while breeding for intelligence would require a total understanding of the complicated interactions between whole chromosomes. In Card's strange world, children can inherit advanced qualities like a talent for xenobiology -- a bizarre combination of genetic determinism and Lamarckianism since these characteristics were presumably artificially acquired at some point in the past. (Or does Card imagine that there is literally a gene for xenobiological talent that we can breed for? How could such a thing evolve? Surely our genes would have to be macroscopic to carry all the information he assumes they do.) In any case, his pseudo-science serves primarily as an excuse for ugly actions running the gamut from genocide to vivisection.
 * Elaine Radford, "Ender and Hitler: Sympathy for the Superman (20 Years Later)", (2007-03-26).

 * In Ender's Game, the Nebula Award-winning 1985 novel by Orson Scott Card, a 6-year-old boy is taken from his family on Earth to an orbital military academy to be molded into a soldier for a looming extraterrestrial war. For Ender, a misfit genius among some of the world's scariest adolescent prodigies, surviving the other cadets is a violent affair in itself—from maiming fellow students in the shower to orchestrating zero-gravity battles.
 * Shane Snow, “Orson Scott Card Talks Ender's Game in Rare Interview”, WIRED, (10/31/13).

 * One doesn’t need Freud to work out why Card’s novel is popular. “Ender’s Game” tells the story of an infant prodigy, Andrew Wiggin (nicknamed Ender), who is torn from the bosom of his family at 6 to be trained in “Battle School.” Earth is under threat from aliens -- the Buggers. Future war is waged as a computer game. And who are the virtuosos of the game console? Kids. Who are the best de-Buggers? Not Donald Rumsfeld’s generation.
 * John Sutherland, “Science Fiction and Science Fact”, Los Angeles Times, (March 27, 2005).

title: Ender's Game


text:
Simon LeVay

Simon LeVay (born 28 August 1943) is a British neuroscientist and author known for his studies about brain structures and sexuality.

Quotes

 * Scientists are supposed to live in ivory towers. Their darkrooms and their vibration-proof benches are supposed to isolate their activities from the disturbances of common life.  What they tell us is supposed to be for the ages, not for the next election.  But the reality may be otherwise.
 * Queer Science: The Use and Abuse of Research into Homosexuality, 1996, Cambridge: MIT Press. p. 9

title: Simon LeVay


text:
François de La Rochefoucauld

François VI, duc de La Rochefoucauld, le Prince de Marcillac (September 15 1613 – March 17 1680) was a noted French author of maxims and memoirs, as well as an example of the accomplished 17th-century nobleman.

Reflections on Various Subjects (1665–1678)

 * See also Reflections; or Sentences and Moral Maxims

I. On Confidence

 * Though sincerity and confidence have many points of resemblance, they have yet many points of difference. Sincerity is an openness of heart, which shows us what we are, a love of truth, a dislike to deception, a wish to compensate our faults and to lessen them by the merit of confessing them.

 * Confidence always pleases those who receive it. It is a tribute we pay to their merit, a deposit we commit to their trust, a pledge which gives them a claim upon us, a kind of dependence to which we voluntarily submit. I do not wish from what I have said to depreciate confidence, so necessary to man.

 * We should make it a rule never to have half confidences. They always embarrass those who give them, and dissatisfy those who receive them. They shed an uncertain light on what we want hidden, increase curiosity, entitling the recipients to know more, giving them leave to consider themselves free to talk of what they have guessed. It is far safer and more honest to tell nothing than to be silent when we have begun to tell.

II. On Difference of Character

 * Although all the qualities of mind may be united in a great genius, yet there are some which are special and peculiar to him; his views are unlimited; he always acts uniformly and with the same activity; he sees distant objects as if present; he comprehends and grasps the greatest, sees and notices the smallest matters; his thoughts are elevated, broad, just and intelligible. Nothing escapes his observation, and he often finds truth in spite of the obscurity that hides her from others. A lofty mind always thinks nobly, it easily creates vivid, agreeable, and natural fancies, places them in their best light, clothes them with all appropriate adornments, studies others' tastes, and clears away from its own thoughts all that is useless and disagreeable.

 * Satire is at once the most agreeable and most dangerous of mental qualities. It always pleases when it is refined, but we always fear those who use it too much, yet satire should be allowed when unmixed with spite, and when the person satirised can join in the satire. It is unfortunate to have a satirical turn without affecting to be pleased or without loving to jest.

 * Raillery is a kind of mirth which takes possession of the imagination, and shows every object in an absurd light; wit combines more or less softness or harshness.

 * There is a difference between an ardent and a brilliant mind, a fiery spirit travels further and faster, while a brilliant mind is sparkling, attractive, accurate.

 * Though the gifts of the mind are infinite, they can, it seems to me, be thus classified. There are some so beautiful that everyone can see and feel their beauty. There are some lovely, it is true, but which are wearisome. There are some which are lovely, which all the world admire, but without knowing why. There are some so refined and delicate that few are capable even of remarking all their beauties. There are others which, though imperfect, yet are produced with such skill, and sustained and managed with such sense and grace, that they even deserve to be admired.

III. On Taste

 * The word taste has different meanings, which it is easy to mistake. There is a difference between the taste which in certain objects has an attraction for us, and the taste that makes us understand and distinguish the qualities we judge by.

 * Some have a species of instinct (the source of which they are ignorant of), and decide all questions that come before them by its aid, and always decide rightly. These follow their taste more than their intelligence, because they do not permit their temper and self-love to prevail over their natural discernment. All they do is in harmony, all is in the same spirit. This harmony makes them decide correctly on matters, and form a correct estimate of their value. But speaking generally there are few who have a taste fixed and independent of that of their friends, they follow example and fashion which generally form the standard of taste.

V. On Conversation

 * The reason why so few persons are agreeable in conversation is that each thinks more of what he desires to say, than of what the others say, and that we make bad listeners when we want to speak. Yet it is necessary to listen to those who talk, we should give them the time they want, and let them say even senseless things; never contradict or interrupt them; on the contrary, we should enter into their mind and taste, illustrate their meaning, praise anything they say that deserves praise, and let them see we praise more from our choice than from agreement with them. To please others we should talk on subjects they like and that interest them, avoid disputes upon indifferent matters, seldom ask questions, and never let them see that we pretend to be better informed than they are.

 * We should never say anything with an air of authority, nor show any superiority of mind. We should avoid far-fetched expressions, expressions hard or forced, and never let the words be grander than the matter.

 * We are sure to displease when we speak too long and too often of one subject, and when we try to turn the conversation upon subjects that we think more instructive than others, we should enter indifferently upon every subject that is agreeable to others, stopping where they wish, and avoiding all they do not agree with.

 * We should observe the place, the occasion, the temper in which we find the person who listens to us, for if there is much art in speaking to the purpose, there is no less in knowing when to be silent. There is an eloquent silence which serves to approve or to condemn, there is a silence of discretion and of respect. In a word, there is a tone, an air, a manner, which renders everything in conversation agreeable or disagreeable, refined or vulgar.

VII. On Air and Manner

 * There is an air which belongs to the figure and talents of each individual; we always lose it when we abandon it to assume another. We should try to find out what air is natural to us and never abandon it, but make it as perfect as we can. This is the reason that the majority of children please. It is because they are wrapt up in the air and manner nature has given them, and are ignorant of any other. They are changed and corrupted when they quit infancy, they think they should imitate what they see, and they are not altogether able to imitate it. In this imitation there is always something of falsity and uncertainty. They have nothing settled in their manner and opinions. Instead of being in reality what they want to appear, they seek to appear what they are not.

 * All men want to be different, and to be greater than they are; they seek for an air other than their own, and a mind different from what they possess; they take their style and manner at chance. They make experiments upon themselves without considering that what suits one person will not suit everyone, that there is no universal rule for taste or manners, and that there are no good copies.

 * Few men, nevertheless, can have unison in many matters without being a copy of each other, if each follow his natural turn of mind. But in general a person will not wholly follow it. He loves to imitate. We often imitate the same person without perceiving it, and we neglect our own good qualities for the good qualities of others, which generally do not suit us.

 * But, yet acquired qualities should always have a certain agreement and a certain union with our own natural qualities, which they imperceptibly extend and increase.

 * We should not speak of all subjects in one tone and in the same manner. We do not march at the head of a regiment as we walk on a promenade; and we should use the same style in which we should naturally speak of different things in the same way, with the same difference as we should walk, but always naturally, and as is suitable, either at the head of a regiment or on a promenade.=

 * Thousands of people with good qualities are displeasing; thousands pleasing with far less abilities, and why? Because the first wish to appear to be what they are not, the second are what they appear. Some of the advantages or disadvantages that we have received from nature please in proportion as we know the air, the style, the manner, the sentiments that coincide with our condition and our appearance, and displease in the proportion they are removed from that point.

Reflections; or Sentences and Moral Maxims (1665–1678)

 * See also Reflections; or Sentences and Moral Maxims

 * Nos vertus ne sont, le plus souvent, que de vices déguisés.
 * Our virtues are most frequently but vices in disguise.
 * Epigraph. Note: "This epigraph, which is the key to the system of La Rochefoucauld, is found in another form as No. 179 of the Maxims of the first edition, 1665; it is omitted from the second and third, and reappears for the first time in the fourth edition at the head of the Reflections". Aime Martin, editor, Bartlett's Quotations, 1919 edition.

 * Ce que nous prenons pour des vertus n'est souvent qu'un assemblage de diverses actions et de divers intérêts, que la fortune ou notre industrie savent arranger; et ce n'est pas toujours par valeur et par chasteté que les hommes sont vaillants, et que les femmes sont chastes.
 * What we term virtues are often but a mass of various actions and diverse interests, which fortune or our own industry manage to arrange; and it is not always from valour or from chastity that men are brave, and women chaste.
 * Maxim 1.

 * L'amour-propre est le plus grand de tous les flatteurs.
 * Self-love is the greatest of all flatterers.
 * Maxim 2.

 * La passion fait souvent un fou du plus habile homme, et rend souvent les plus sots habiles.
 * Passion often renders the most clever man a fool, and even sometimes renders the most foolish man clever.
 * Variant translation: Passion often makes a fool of the cleverest man and often makes the most foolish men clever.
 * Maxim 6.

 * Les passions sont les seuls orateurs qui persuadent toujours. Elles sont comme un art de la nature dont les règles sont infaillibles; et l'homme le plus simple qui a de la passion persuade mieux que le plus éloquent qui n'en a point.
 * The passions are the only advocates which always persuade. They are a natural art, the rules of which are infallible; and the simplest man with passion will be more persuasive than the most eloquent without.
 * Variant translation: The passions are the only orators who always persuade. They are like a natural art, of which the rules are unfailing; and the simplest man who has passion will be more persuasive than the most eloquent man who has none.
 * Maxim 8.

 * Il y a dans le coeur humain une génération perpétuelle de passions, en sorte que la ruine de l'une est presque toujours l'établissement d'une autre.
 * In the human heart there is a perpetual generation of passions, such that the ruin of one is almost always the foundation of another.
 * Maxim 10.

 * Nous avons tous assez de force pour supporter les maux d'autrui.
 * We all have strength enough to endure the misfortunes of others.
 * Maxim 19.

 * La philosophie triomphe aisément des maux passés et des maux à venir. Mais les maux présents triomphent d'elle.
 * Philosophy triumphs easily over past and future evils; but present evils triumph over it.
 * Maxim 22. Compare: "This same philosophy is a good horse in the stable, but an arrant jade on a journey", Oliver Goldsmith, The Good-Natured Man, Act i.

 * Il faut de plus grandes vertus pour soutenir la bonne fortune que la mauvaise.
 * We need greater virtues to sustain good than evil fortune.
 * Maxim 25.

 * Le soleil ni la mort ne se peuvent regarder fixement.
 * Neither the sun nor death can be looked at steadily.
 * Maxim 26. Sometimes incorrectly translated as "with a steady eye".

 * Le mal que nous faisons ne nous attire pas tant de persécution et de haine que nos bonnes qualités.
 * The evil that we do does not attract to us so much persecution and hatred as our good qualities.
 * Maxim 29.

 * Si nous n'avions point de défauts, nous ne prendrions pas tant de plaisir à en remarquer dans les autres.
 * If we had no faults, we should not take so much pleasure in noting those of others.
 * Maxim 31.

 * La jalousie se nourrit dans les doutes, et elle devient fureur, ou elle finit, sitôt qu'on passe du doute à la certitude.
 * Jealousy lives upon suspicion; and it turns into a fury or ends as soon as it passes from suspicion to certainty.
 * Maxim 32.

 * Nous promettons selon nos espérances, et nous tenons selon nos craintes.
 * We promise according to our hopes; we fulfill according to our fears.
 * Maxim 38.

 * L'intérêt parle toutes sortes de langues, et joue toutes sortes de personnages, même celui de désintéressé.
 * Self-interest speaks all sorts of tongues and plays all sorts of characters, even that of disinterestedness.
 * Maxim 39.

 * Ceux qui s'appliquent trop aux petites choses deviennent ordinairement incapables des grandes.
 * Those who apply themselves too much to little things often become incapable of great ones.
 * Maxim 41.

 * L'homme croit souvent se conduire lorsqu'il est conduit; et pendant que par son esprit il tend à un but, son coeur l'entraîne insensiblement à un autre.
 * A man will often believe himself a leader when he is led; while with his mind he endeavours to reach one goal, his heart insensibly drags him toward another.
 * Maxim 43.

 * On n'est jamais si heureux ni si malheureux qu'on s'imagine.
 * One is never so happy or so unhappy as one fancies.
 * Maxim 49.

 * Pour s'établir dans le monde, on fait tout ce que l'on peut pour y paraître établi.
 * To succeed in the world we do everything we can to appear successful already.
 * Maxim 56.

 * Le bonheur et le malheur des hommes ne dépend pas moins de leur humeur que de la fortune.
 * The happiness and misery of men depend no less on temper than fortune.
 * Maxim 61.

 * La sincérité est une ouverture de coeur. On la trouve en fort peu de gens; et celle que l'on voit d'ordinaire n'est qu'une fine dissimulation pour attirer la confiance des autres.
 * Sincerity is an openness of heart; we find it in very few people; what we usually see is only an artful dissimulation to win the confidence of others.
 * Maxim 62.

 * La bonne grâce est au corps ce que le bon sens est à l'esprit.
 * What grace is to the body, good sense is to the mind.
 * Maxim 67.

 * Il est difficile de définir l'amour. Dans l'âme c'est une passion de régner, dans les esprits c'est une sympathie, et dans le corps ce n'est qu'une envie cachée et délicate de posséder ce que l'on aime après beaucoup de mystères.
 * It is difficult to define love. In the soul it is a passion to rule; in the mind it is sympathy; and in the body it is only a hidden and tactful desire to possess what we love after many mysteries.
 * Maxim 68.

 * Il n’y a point de déguisement qui puisse longtemps cacher l’amour où il est, ni le feindre où il n’est pas.
 * There is no disguise which can hide love for long where it exists, or simulate it where it does not.
 * Maxim 70.

 * Il n'y a guère de gens qui ne soient honteux de s'être aimés, quand ils ne s'aiment plus.
 * There are very few people who are not ashamed to be loved when they no longer do.
 * Variant translation: There are very few people who are not ashamed to have loved when they no longer do.
 * Maxim 71.

 * Si on juge de l'amour par la plupart de ses effets, il ressemble plus à la haine qu'à l'amitié.
 * If we judge love by the majority of its results, it resembles hatred more than friendship.
 * Maxim 72.

 * On peut trouver des femmes qui n'ont jamais eu de galanterie; mais il est rare d'en trouver qui n'en aient jamais eu qu'une.
 * We may find women who have never indulged in an intrigue, but it is rare to find those who have intrigued but once.
 * Maxim 73.

 * Il n'y a qu'une sorte d'amour, mais il y en a mille différentes copies.
 * There is only one kind of love, but there are a thousand different versions.
 * Maxim 74.

 * L'amour aussi bien que le feu ne peut subsister sans un mouvement continuel; et il cesse de vivre dès qu'il cesse d'espérer ou de craindre.
 * Neither love nor fire can subsist without perpetual motion; both cease to live so soon as they cease to hope, or to fear.
 * Maxim 75.

 * Il est du véritable amour comme de l'apparition des esprits: tout le monde en parle, mais peu de gens en ont vu.
 * True love is like the appearance of ghosts: everyone talks about it but few have seen it.
 * Variant translation: With true love it's like with the appearance of ghosts:  everyone talks about it but few have seen it.
 * Maxim 76.

 * L'amour de la justice n'est en la plupart des hommes que la crainte de souffrir l'injustice.
 * The love of justice is simply in the majority of men the fear of suffering injustice.
 * Maxim 78.

 * Le silence est le parti le plus sûr de celui qui se défie de soi-même.
 * Silence is the surest resolve for him who distrusts himself.
 * Maxim 79.

 * Ce que les hommes ont nommé amitié n'est qu'une société, qu'un ménagement réciproque d'intérêts, et qu'un échange de bons offices; ce n'est enfin qu'un commerce où l'amour-propre se propose toujours quelque chose à gagner.
 * Friendship is only a reciprocal conciliation of interests, and an exchange of good offices; it is a species of commerce out of which self-love always expects to gain something.
 * Maxim 83.

 * Il est plus honteux de se défier de ses amis que d'en être trompé.
 * It is more disgraceful to distrust than to be deceived by our friends.
 * Variant translation: It is more shameful to distrust our friends than to be deceived by them.
 * Maxim 84.

 * Tout le monde se plaint de sa mémoire, et personne ne se plaint de son jugement.
 * Everyone complains about his memory, and no one complains about his judgment.
 * Maxim 89.

 * Les vieillards aiment à donner de bons préceptes, pour se consoler de n'être plus en état de donner de mauvais exemples.
 * Old men delight in giving good advice as a consolation for the fact that they can no longer provide bad examples.
 * Maxim 93.

 * Tel homme est ingrat, qui est moins coupable de son ingratitude que celui qui lui a fait du bien.
 * A man may be ungrateful but is less chargeable with ingratitude than his benefactor.
 * Maxim 96.

 * Chacun dit du bien de son coeur et personne n'en ose dire de son esprit.
 * Everyone speaks well of his heart; no one dares speak well of his mind.
 * Maxim 98.

 * Dans l'adversité de nos meilleurs amis, nous trouvons toujours quelque chose qui ne nous déplaît pas.
 * In the adversity of our best friends we often find something that is not exactly displeasing.
 * Maxim 99. This maxim is found only in the 1665 edition, and was removed by the author in later editions.

 * L'esprit est toujours la dupe du coeur.
 * The mind is always the dupe of the heart.
 * Maxim 102.

 * Tous ceux qui connaissent leur esprit ne connaissent pas leur coeur.
 * Those who know their minds do not know their hearts.
 * Maxim 103.

 * On ne donne rien si libéralement que ses conseils.
 * Nothing is given so profusely as advice.
 * Maxim 110.

 * Il y a de bons mariages, mais il n'y en a point de délicieux.
 * There are good marriages, but no delicious ones.
 * Maxim 113.

 * L'intention de ne jamais tromper nous expose à être souvent trompés.
 * The intention of cheating no one lays us open to being cheated ourselves.
 * Maxim 118.

 * Si nous résistons à nos passions, c'est plus par leur faiblesse que par notre force.
 * If we resist our passions, it is more through their weakness than our strength.
 * If we conquer our passions, it is more from their weakness than from our strength.
 * Maxim 122.

 * Le vrai moyen d'être trompé, c'est de se croire plus fin que les autres.
 * The truest way to be deceived is to think oneself more knowing than others.
 * Maxim 127.

 * Il suffit quelquefois d'être grossier pour n'être pas trompé par un habile homme.
 * Sometimes one must be base in order not to be tricked by a clever man.
 * Maxim 129.

 * Il est plus aisé d'être sage pour les autres que de l'être pour soi-même.
 * It is easier to be wise for others than for oneself.
 * Maxim 132.

 * Il y a des gens qui n'auraient jamais été amoureux s'ils n'avaint jamais entendu parler de l'amour.
 * There are people who would never be in love had they not heard [others] speak of love
 * Maxim 136. Variant translations:
 * People would never fall in love if they hadn’t heard love talked about.
 * There are some people who would never have fallen in love if they had not heard there was such a thing.

 * On parle peu quand la vanité ne fait pas parler.
 * When not prompted by vanity, we say little.
 * Variant translation: We say little when vanity does not make us speak.
 * Maxim 137.

 * On aime mieux dire du mal de soi-même que de n'en point parler.
 * We would rather speak ill of ourselves than not talk about ourselves at all.
 * Maxim 138.

 * Comme c’est le caractère des grands esprits de faire entendre en peu de paroles beaucoup de choses, les petits esprits au contraire ont le don de beaucoup parler, et de ne rien dire.
 * The stamp of great minds is to suggest much in few words; by contrast, little minds have the gift of talking a great deal and saying nothing.
 * Maxim 142.

 * On ne loue d'ordinaire que pour être loué.
 * Usually we only praise to be praised.
 * Maxim 146.

 * Il y a des reproches qui louent et des louanges qui médisent.
 * Some condemnations praise; some praise damns.
 * Maxim 148.

 * Le refus des louanges est un désir d'être loué deux fois.
 * The refusal of praise is only the wish to be praised twice.
 * Maxim 149.

 * Il est plus difficile de s’empêcher d’être gouverné que de gouverner les autres.
 * It is more difficult to avoid being ruled than to rule others.
 * Maxim 151.

 * Ce n'est pas assez d'avoir de grandes qualités, il en faut avoir l'économie.
 * One must not just have great qualities, but also economize them
 * Variant translation: It is not enough to have great qualities; one must also make use of them sparingly.
 * Maxim 159.

 * The art of using moderate abilities to advantage wins praise, and often acquires more reputation than actual brilliancy.
 * Maxim 162.

 * Il est plus facile de paraître digne des emplois qu'on n'a pas que de ceux que l'on exerce.
 * It is easier to seem worthy of positions one does not have than of those one does.
 * Maxim 164.

 * Il vaut mieux employer notre esprit à supporter les infortunes qui nous arrivent qu'à prévoir celles qui nous peuvent arriver.
 * It is better to set one's mind to bearing the misfortunes that are happening than to think of those that may happen.
 * Maxim 174.

 * Notre repentir n'est pas tant un regret du mal que nous avons fait, qu'une crainte de celui qui nous en peut arriver.
 * Our repentance is not so much sorrow for the ill we have done as a fear of the ill that may befall us.
 * Maxim 180.

 * Il n'appartient qu'aux grands hommes d'avoir de grands défauts.
 * Only great men have great faults.
 * Maxim 190.

 * Les défauts de l'âme sont comme les blessures du corps: quelque soin qu'on prenne de les guérir, la cicatrice paraît toujours, et elles sont à tout moment en danger de se rouvrir.
 * The defects and faults in the mind are like wounds in the body. After all imaginable care has been taken to heal them up, still there will be a scar left behind.
 * Variant translation: The defects of the mind are like the wounds of the body. Whatever care we take to heal them the scars ever remain, and there is always danger of their reopening.
 * Maxim 194.

 * Ce qui nous empêche souvent de nous abandonner à un seul vice est que nous en avons plusieurs.
 * What often prevents us from abandoning ourselves to one vice is that we have several.
 * Maxim 195.

 * Le désir de paraître habile empêche souvent de le devenir.
 * The desire to appear clever often prevents one from being so.
 * Maxim 199.

 * Il y a des gens niais qui se connaissent et qui emploient habilement leur niaiserie.
 * There are foolish people who recognize their foolishness and use it skillfully.
 * Maxim 208.

 * Qui vit sans folie n'est pas si sage qu'il croit.
 * Who lives without folly is not as wise as he thinks.
 * Maxim 209.

 * En vieillissant on devient plus fou et plus sage.
 * As we age, we become more foolish and wiser.
 * Maxim 210.

 * La plupart des gens ne jugent des hommes que par la vogue qu'ils ont, ou par leur fortune.
 * Most people judge men only by success or by fortune.
 * Variant translation: Most people judge men only by their fashion or their fortune.
 * Maxim 212.

 * L'hypocrisie est un hommage que le vice rend à la vertu.
 * Hypocrisy is an homage that vice pays to virtue.
 * Maxim 218.

 * Le trop grand empressement qu'on a de s'acquitter d'une obligation est une espèce d'ingratitude.
 * Too great a hurry to be discharged of an obligation is a kind of ingratitude.
 * Maxim 226.

 * Les gens heureux ne se corrigent guère; ils croient toujours avoir raison quand la fortune soutient leur mauvaise conduite.
 * Fortunate people seldom mend their ways, for when good luck crowns their misdeeds with success they think it is because they are right.
 * Maxim 227.

 * C'est une grande folie de vouloir être sage tout seul.
 * It is a great folly to wish to be wise alone.
 * Maxim 231.

 * Nul ne mérite d’être loué de bonté, s’il n’a pas la force d’être méchant: toute autre bonté n’est le plus souvent qu’une paresse ou une impuissance de la volonté.
 * Nobody deserves to be praised for goodness unless he is strong enough to be bad, for any other goodness is usually merely inertia or lack of will-power.
 * Maxim 237.

 * Il n'est pas si dangereux de faire du mal à la plupart des hommes que de leur faire trop de bien.
 * It is less dangerous to treat most men badly than to treat them to well.
 * Maxim 238.

 * C'est une grande habileté que de savoir cacher son habileté.
 * There is great skill in knowing how to conceal one's skill.
 * Maxim 245.

 * La véritable éloquence consiste à dire tout ce qu’il faut, et à ne dire que ce qu’il faut.
 * True eloquence consists in saying all that need be said and no more.
 * Maxim 250.

 * Il y a des personnes à qui les défauts siéent bien, et d'autres qui sont disgraciées avec leurs bonnes qualités.
 * Some people's faults are becoming to them; others are disgraced by their own good traits.
 * Maxim 251.

 * Dans toutes les professions chacun affecte une mine et un extérieur pour paraître ce qu'il veut qu'on le croie. Ainsi on peut dire que le monde n'est composé que de mines.
 * In all professions we affect a part and an appearance to seem what we wish to be. Thus the world is merely composed of actors.
 * Variant translation: In all professions, each affects a part and an appearance to make him seem as he would wish to be believed. And so it is that one can say that the world is made only of appearances.
 * Maxim 256.

 * Le plaisir de l'amour est d'aimer; et l'on est plus heureux par la passion que l'on a que par celle que l'on donne.
 * The pleasure of love is in loving; we are happier in the passion we feel than in what we inspire.
 * Maxim 259. Compare: "They who inspire it most are fortunate, As I am now; but those who feel it most Are happier still", Percy Bysshe Shelley, Prometheus Unbound, Act ii, Scene 5.

 * Il n'y a guère d'homme assez habile pour connaître tout le mal qu'il fait.
 * Hardly any man is clever enough to know all the evil he does.
 * Maxim 269.

 * L'absence diminue les médiocres passions, et augmente les grandes, comme le vent éteint les bougies et allume le feu.
 * Absence extinguishes the minor passions and increases the great ones, as the wind blows out a candle and fans a fire.
 * Variant translation: Absence weakens the minor passions and adds to the effects of great ones, as the wind blows out a candle and fans a fire.
 * Maxim 276.

 * Il est impossible d'aimer une seconde fois ce qu'on a véritablement cessé d'aimer.
 * It is impossible to fall back in love with what one has stopped being in love with.
 * Maxim 286.

 * Nous aimons toujours ceux qui nous admirent; et nous n'aimons pas toujours ceux que nous admirons.
 * We always like those who admire us; we do not always like those whom we admire.
 * Maxim 294.

 * La reconnaissance de la plupart des hommes n'est qu'une secrète envie de recevoir de plus grands bienfaits.
 * The gratitude of most men is but a secret desire to receive even greater benefits.
 * Variant translation: Gratitude is the lively expectation of favours yet to come.
 * Maxim 298. Compare: "The gratitude of place-expectants is a lively sense of future favours", attributed to Sir Robert Walpole.

 * Nous pardonnons souvent à ceux qui nous ennuient, mais nous ne pouvons pardonner à ceux que nous ennuyons.
 * We often forgive those who bore us, but we cannot forgive those whom we bore.
 * Maxim 304.

 * On a fait une vertu de la modération pour borner l’ambition des grands hommes, et pour consoler les gens médiocres de leur peu de fortune, et de leur peu de mérite.
 * Moderation has been called a virtue to limit the ambition of great men, and to console undistinguished people for their want of fortune and their lack of merit.
 * Maxim 308.

 * Il arrive quelquefois des accidents dans la vie d'où il faut être un peu fou pour se bien tirer.
 * There are many predicaments in life that one must be a bit crazy to escape from.
 * Maxim 310.

 * Ce qui fait que les amants et les maîtresses ne s'ennuient point d'être ensemble, c'est qu'ils parlent toujours d'eux-mêmes.
 * Lovers never get tired of each other, because they are always talking about themselves.
 * Variant translation: What makes lovers and their mistresses never weary of being together is that they are always talking about themselves.
 * Maxim 312.

 * L’extrême plaisir que nous prenons à parler de nous-mêmes nous doit faire craindre de n’en donner guere à ceux qui nous écoutent.
 * The extreme pleasure we take in talking about ourselves should make us afraid that we may scarcely be giving any to our listeners.
 * Translation by E.H. Blackmore et. al., in Collected Maxims and Other Reflections, de La Rochefoucauld, Oxford University Press (2008) : ISBN 019162313X
 * Maxim 314

 * Ce n'est pas un grand malheur d'obliger des ingrats, mais c'en est un insupportable d'être obligé à un malhonnête homme.
 * It is not a pain to give to ingrates, but it is an intolerable one to be obliged to a dishonest man.
 * Variant translation: It is not a great misfortune to be of service to ingrates, but it is an intolerable one to be obliged to a dishonest man.
 * Maxim 317.

 * Il y a dans la jalousie plus d'amour-propre que d'amour.
 * In jealousy there is more of self-love than love.
 * Maxim 324.

 * Nous n'avouons de petits défauts que pour persuader que nous n'en avons pas de grands.
 * We confess to little faults only to persuade ourselves we have no great ones.
 * Maxim 327.

 * On pardonne tant que l'on aime.
 * We pardon to the extent that we love.
 * Maxim 330.

 * Nous ne trouvons guère de gens de bon sens, que ceux qui sont de notre avis.
 * We hardly find any persons of good sense save those who agree with us.
 * Maxim 347. Compare: "'That was excellently observed,' say I when I read a passage in another where his opinion agrees with mine. When we differ, then I pronounce him to be mistaken." Jonathan Swift, Thoughts on Various Subjects.

 * Ce qui nous donne tant d’aigreur contre ceux qui nous font des finesses, c’est qu’ils croient être plus habiles que nous.
 * What makes us so bitter against people who outwit us is that they think themselves cleverer than we are.
 * Maxim 350.

 * La jalousie naît toujours avec l'amour, mais elle ne meurt pas toujours avec lui.
 * Jealousy is always born with love but does not always die with it.
 * Maxim 361.

 * Il y a peu d'honnêtes femmes qui ne soient lasses de leur métier.
 * There are few honest women who are not tired of what they do.
 * Maxim 367.

 * Les esprits médiocres condamnent d'ordinaire tout ce qui passe leur portée.
 * Mediocre minds usually dismiss anything which reaches beyond their own understanding.
 * Maxim 375.

 * Le plus grand défaut de la pénétration n'est pas de n'aller point jusqu'au but, c'est de le passer.
 * The greatest fault of a penetrating wit is to go beyond the mark.
 * Variant translation: The greatest fault of a penetrating mind is not to fail to attain the mark but to go beyond it.
 * Maxim 377.

 * On donne des conseils mais on n'inspire point de conduite.
 * We may bestow advice, but we cannot inspire the conduct.
 * Variant translation: We give advice but do not inspire behavior.
 * Maxim 378.

 * Il n'y a point de gens qui aient plus souvent tort que ceux qui ne peuvent souffrir d'en avoir.
 * There are few people who are more often wrong than those who cannot suffer being wrong.
 * Maxim 386.

 * Ce qui nous rend la vanité des autres insupportable, c'est qu'elle blesse la nôtre.
 * What makes the vanity of others insufferable to us is that it wounds our own.
 * Maxim 389.

 * Il faut gouverner la fortune comme la santé: en jouir quand elle est bonne, prendre patience quand elle est mauvaise.
 * Luck must be dealt with like health: enjoy it when it is good, be patient when it is bad.
 * Maxim 392.

 * Il y a une élévation qui ne dépend point de la fortune: c’est un certain air qui nous distingue et qui semble nous destiner aux grandes choses; c’est un prix que nous nous donnons imperceptiblement à nous-mêmes; c’est par cette qualité que nous usurpons les déférences des autres hommes, et c’est elle d’ordinaire qui nous met plus au-dessus d’eux que la naissance, les dignités, et le mérite même.
 * There is a certain dignity of manner independent of fortune, a certain distinctive air which seems to mark us out for great things. It is a value we set upon ourselves without realizing it, and by means of this quality we claim other men’s deference as our due. This does more to set us above them than birth, honors, and merit itself.
 * Maxim 399.

 * Il y a du mérite sans élévation, mais il n'y a point d'élévation sans quelque mérite.
 * There is merit without attainment, but no attainment without some merit.
 * Maxim 400.

 * Nous aurions souvent honte de nos plus belles actions, si le monde voyoit tous les motifs qui les produisent.
 * We should often be ashamed of our very best actions if the world only saw the motives which caused them.
 * Maxim 409.

 * La vivacité qui augmente en vieillissant ne va pas loin de la folie.
 * The vivacity which increases with old age is not so far removed from folly.
 * Maxim 416.

 * En amour, celui qui est guéri le premier est toujours le mieux guéri.
 * In love, the first healed is the best healed.
 * Maxim 417.

 * Peu de gens savent être vieux.
 * Few know how to be old.
 * Maxim 423.

 * Rien n'empêche tant d'être naturel que l'envie de le paraître.
 * Nothing prevents us being natural so much as the desire to appear so.
 * Maxim 431.

 * Il est plus aisé de connaître l'homme en général que de connaître un homme en particulier.
 * It is easier to know man in general than to know one man.
 * Variant translation: It is much easier to know men generally, than to know a particular man.
 * Maxim 436.

 * Dans l'amitié comme dans l'amour on est souvent plus heureux par les choses qu'on ignore que par celles que l'on sait.
 * In friendship and in love, one is often happier because of what one does not know than what one knows.
 * Variant translation: In friendship as in love, we are often happier due to the things we are unaware of than the things we know.
 * Maxim 441.

 * Nous essayons de nous faire honneur des défauts que nous ne voulons pas corriger.
 * We try to make virtues out of the faults we have no wish to correct.
 * Maxim 442.

 * Il s'en faut bien que l'innocence ne trouve autant de protection que le crime.
 * Innocence is very far from finding as much protection as crime.
 * Maxim 465.

 * De toutes les passions violentes, celle qui sied le moins mal aux femmes, c'est l'amour.
 * Of all violent passions, the least unbecoming to a woman is love.
 * Maxim 466.

 * Dans les premières passions les femmes aiment l'amant, et dans les autres elles aiment l'amour.
 * In their first passion, women love their lovers; in all the others, they love love.
 * Maxim 471. Compare: "In her first passion woman loves her lover: In all the others, all she loves is love", Lord Byron, Don Juan, Canto iii, Stanza 3.

 * Il y a peu de femmes dont le mérite dure plus que la beauté.
 * Few women's merit lasts as long as their beauty.
 * Maxim 474.

 * Il n'y a que les personnes qui ont de la fermeté qui puissent avoir une véritable douceur.
 * Only firm people can be truly soft.
 * Variant translation: It is only those who are firm who can be genuinely kind.
 * Maxim 479.

 * Ceux qui ont eu de grandes passions se trouvent toute leur vie heureux, et malheureux, d'en être guéris.
 * Those who have had great passions are happy all their lives and would be unhappy to have been cured of them.
 * Maxim 485.

 * Les querelles ne dureraient pas longtemps, si le tort n'était que d'un côté.
 * Quarrels would not last long if the fault were only on one side.
 * Maxim 496.

 * Il ne sert à rien d'être jeune sans être belle, ni d'être belle sans être jeune.
 * It is useless to be young without being beautiful, or beautiful without being young.
 * Maxim 497.

Later Additions to the Maxims

 * C’est une espèce de bonheur, de connaître jusqu’à quel point on doit être malheureux.
 * It is a kind of happiness to know how unhappy we must be.
 * Maxim 8 of the Maximes supprimées.

 * Comment prétendons-nous qu'un autre puisse garder notre secret, si nous ne pouvons le garder nous-mêmes?
 * How can we expect others to keep our secrets if we cannot keep them ourselves?
 * Maxim 64 of the Maximes supprimées.

 * C'est une ennuyeuse maladie que de conserver sa santé par un trop grand régime.
 * Preserving your health by too strict a diet is a tedious illness.
 * Maxim 72 of the Maximes supprimées.

 * Il ne faut pas s’offenser que les autres nous cachent la vérité puisque nous nous la cachons si souvent à nous-mêmes.
 * We should not be upset that others hide the truth from us, when we hide it so often from ourselves.
 * Maxim 11 from the Manuscrit de Liancourt.

 * Ce qui nous fait croire si facilement que les autres ont des défauts, c'est la facilité que l'on a de croire ce qu'on souhaite.
 * We are eager to believe that others are flawed because we are eager to believe in what we wish for.
 * Variant translation: What makes us believe so easily that others have faults is the ease with which we believe what we hope for.
 * Maxim 25 from the Manuscrit de Liancourt.

 * Il est quelquefois agréable à un mari d'avoir une femme jalouse; il entend toujours parler de ce qu'il aime.
 * Sometimes it is pleasant for a husband to have a jealous wife: he always hears what he loves being talked about.
 * Maxim 48 from the Manuscrit de Liancourt.

 * Il est plus difficile de dissimuler les sentiments que l'on a que de feindre ceux que l'on n'a pas.
 * It is harder to hide the feelings we have than to feign the ones we do not have.
 * Maxim 56 from the posthumously published 1693 edition of the Maximes.

 * Les petits esprits sont blessés des plus petites choses
 * Small minds are hurt by the smallest things
 * Maxime 34 from the 1705 Amsterdam edition

 * Ce qui fait que si peu de personnes sont agréables dans la conversation, c'est que chacun songe plus à ce qu'il veut dire qu'à ce que les autres disent.
 * The reason that there are so few good conversationalists is that most people are thinking about what they are going to say and not about what the others are saying.
 * Réflexions diverses, IV: De la conversation.

 * Il faut écouter ceux qui parlent, si on veut en être écouté.
 * One must listen if one wishes to be listened to.
 * Réflexions diverses, IV: De la conversation.

 * La pompe des enterrements regarde plus la vanité des vivants que l'honneur des morts.
 * Funeral pomp is more for the vanity of the living than for the honor of the dead.
 * "Pensées Tirées des Premières Éditions," Réflexions: Ou, Sentences Et Maximes Morales de La Rochefoucauld (1822)

Quotes about La Rochefoucauld

 * This is no time to be getting all steamed up about La Rochefoucauld. It's only a question of minutes before I'm going to be pretty darned good and sick of La Rochefoucauld, once and for all. La Rochefoucauld this and La Rochefoucauld that. Yes, well, let me tell you that if nobody had ever learned to quote, very few people would be in love with La Rochefoucauld. I bet you I don't know ten souls who read him without a middleman.
 * Dorothy Parker short story The Little Hours published in Here Lies (1939), the narrator during insomnia dwelling on La Rochefoucauld's pronouncement that if nobody learned to read, very few people would be in love.

 * As Rochefoucauld his maxims drew From Nature, I believe 'em true: They argue no corrupted mind In him; the fault is in mankind.
 * Jonathan Swift, Verses on the Death of Doctor Swift

title: François de La Rochefoucauld


text:
Talk:Pinky and the Brain

Seems like there's a word missing from this quote:

"Um, I think so, Brainie, but why would anyone want to Pierce Brosnan?"

but I have no idea which.

 * It's a pun, silly: "pierce" as in, poke a hole into?

The joke works better if you aren't reading it.

"I think so, Brain, but how will we get the Spice Girls into the paella?"

I always thought it was "I think so, Brain, but how will we fit all the spice girls in one bath tub"

possible quote source
There are more of the pondering quotes here: http://www.sph.umich.edu/~rwatt/ponderin.htm Lar 03:20, 26 July 2006 (UTC) Although this link works, taking you to the person's page, there are no "Pondering" quotes on it.

Additional Pinky response to "pondering"
I think there was one like this -- I couldn't have made this up. Bold textPinky:I thnk so Brain but where are we going to get pink dancing flowers?
 * Pinky: "Yes, but shouldn't the winner get the fresh stuff?"

title: Talk:Pinky and the Brain