text:
Talk:Sarajevo

wrong picture
This bridge shown in picture Sarajevo_bridge.jpg is not The bridge in Sarajevo which directly across the street from where Archduke Franz Ferdinand was killed.--92.36.170.195 10:40, 15 January 2013 (UTC)

 * Please plunge forward and help us fix it! --Inas (talk) 10:41, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Done: This picture is no longer on the page when I checked. Doubleplusjeff (talk) 06:36, 21 October 2016 (UTC)

Should we call it "Old Town" or "Bascarsija"?
This article switches back and forth between both terms, and they're used approximately equally. (Most use is in addresses and directions.) I  think it would be helpful to standardize on one term. I never heard the area called "Old Town" while a tourist in Sarajevo, so my vote would be in favor of standardizing upon "Bascarsija". (And I believe this meets wikivoyage's Romanization recommendations by omitting haceks.) Doubleplusjeff (talk) 06:35, 21 October 2016 (UTC)

 * It's most helpful to the traveller to use the name they'll see, so please plunge forward and make the changes you propose. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:44, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
 * According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stari_Grad,_Sarajevo, Old Town (Stari Grad in Bosnian) is a real name, and it consists of both Bascarsija and the old Austro-Hungarian half. As a traveller this makes sense to me too. I'm clarifying locale listings' Directions to specify Bascarsija instead of Old Town (when they are in fact in the Bascarsija neighborhood).  I'll leave "Old Town" when it appears in locale descriptions ("Content") or when the listing is located in the Austro-Hungarian half (since I don't have any better name for that neighborhood). Doubleplusjeff (talk) 20:00, 30 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I don't think there is a policy to ignore diacritcal markers for names written in Latin alphabet originally. And if there is, I think it should be changed. Hobbitschuster (talk) 15:59, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Haven't seen Old Town anywhere in Sarajevo, but many guides and places refer to Bascarsija (for example, the indication on tram 3). The term Stari Grad is also used a lot as a reference to Bascarsija + the Austrian part. ArticCynda (talk) 00:17, 12 September 2017 (UTC)

Rafting/canoe excursions
The rafting and canoe excursions listed in the Do section all take place in Konjic instead of in Sarajevo, on the Neretva river. Should they not be moved to the Konjic article instead? Suggesting to keep SarajevoFunkyTours, since this company offers rafting and canoe including a shuttle bus from/to Sarajevo.

 * This sounds sensible. Ikan Kekek (talk) 15:08, 30 August 2017 (UTC)
 * Done. Moved rafting, canoe and canyoning excursions to their respective articles (Konjic and Foča) ArticCynda (talk) 23:56, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Alas some tout put them back again. Re-done, I left the Sarajevo mentions as web links, since they do run packages from the city. Grahamsands (talk) 20:29, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

Embassies Table

 * The "Tel.", "Fax" and "Email" columns "abuse" the listing_template by not providing a name (which is a required field), and thus the "edit"-function beside each item in these three columns doesn't work properly (cannot save any changes) - so the only way to edit the table is to edit the source code. I guess at least the Fax-column could be changed so, that it would not include the listing_template. Also ☎ could replace the icons in the Tel-column. And of course one could put just plain email addresses in the last column... Found this out this "feature" after the fact... Loaoa (talk) 06:14, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
 * It's not the end of the world that the table can only be updated in source, but it's not a very elegant solution. Perhaps there are other ways to get the icons in the table? There doesn't seem to be a consensus to include embassies in the capital articles of countries; every article does it in its own way: a long list of listings (for example Helsinki), a list in 2 columns (for example Berlin) or a full listing with generic markers (for example Brussels). I personally do prefer the table, since it's a cleaner representation, and the type of data also favors a table format rather than an incoherent list. Perhaps a template for embassy lists should be added to Wikivoyage to provide an uniform way of presenting embassy data in each capital article. ArticCynda (talk) 22:52, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

 * I wish the "type=vicinity" marker color (dark red) could be more different than the "type=go" marker color (red). Is there a way to modify the marker colors? Page template options, perhaps? Loaoa (talk) 06:14, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
 * There seems to be no formal context definition for the use of the vicinity marker type, so I'm not even sure if it's the right one to use here. Alternatively, the more generic markers (green) could be used, which are also the default for tourism offices and medical facilities. ArticCynda (talk) 22:41, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

 * {|class="wikitable sortable mw-collapsible mw-collapsed"

! scope="col" | Country ! scope="col" | Address ! scope="col" | Tel. ! scope="col" | Fax ! scope="col" | Email
 * + style="white-space: nowrap;" | Embassies marker color options
 * 🇦🇹 Austria
 * Address 01 [the_current_version]
 * Address 01 [the_current_version]

 * 🇦🇹 Austria
 * Address 02 [almost_formatted_as_the_current_version]
 * ☎ +387 33 279 400
 * fax: +387 33 668 339
 * e-mail: sarajewo-ob(at)bmeia.gv.at

 * 🇦🇿 Azerbaijan
 * Address 03 [current_version_stylized]
 * ☎ +387 33 279 400
 * fax: +387 33 668 339
 * sarajewo-ob(at)bmeia.gv.at

fax: another_fax_number
 * 🇧🇪 Belgium
 * Address 04 [generic_default empty type field]
 * ☎ +387 33 111 111
 * fax: +387 33 222 222
 * somewhere@example.az

another_email
 * 🇧🇷 Brazil
 * Address 05 [generic_default called with a goofy term]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇧🇬 Bulgaria
 * Address 06 [the_green_marker]
 * ☎ +387 33 555 555
 * fax: +387 33 666 555
 * somewhere@example.com

 * 🇨🇳 China
 * Address 07 [middle red]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

fax: another_fax_number
 * 🇨🇿 Czech Republic
 * Address 08 [the_green_marker]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

another_email
 * 🇪🇬 Egypt
 * Address 09 [light blue]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇫🇷 France
 * Address 10 [purple]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

another_email
 * 🇩🇪 Germany
 * Address 11 [deprecated (?)]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number fax: another_fax_number another_email
 * 🇬🇷 Greece
 * Address 12 [deprecated (?)]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

 * 🇭🇺 Hungary
 * Address 13 [deprecated (?)]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number ☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇮🇩 Indonesia
 * Address 14 [deprecated (?)]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇮🇷 Iran
 * Address 15 [already in use]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇮🇹 Italy
 * Address 16 [already in use]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇯🇵 Japan
 * Address 17 [already in use]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇰🇼 Kuwait
 * Address 18 [already in use]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇱🇾 Libya
 * Address 19 [already in use]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇲🇰 Macedonia
 * Address 20 [already in use]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com

☎ another_phone_number
 * 🇲🇾 Malaysia
 * Address 21 [the_green_marker]
 * ☎ +387 33 333 333
 * fax: +387 33 444 444
 * somewhere@example.com
 * }

 * I guess the formal formatting style would omit the empty lines between each row_datacluster, but personally I like them, because it makes it easier to read the code (and doesn't break the page). Of course there's the option to write each row_datacluster on a single line, but that would IMO make each line excessively long. AFAIK the "br /" is permitted (if not, then a series of colspan commands could be inserted where there's more than one datasource in one cell (or those be separated with a comma without a new_line)... --Loaoa (talk) 16:07, 1 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Not sure if br/ is permitted to force a line ending, some might see it as HTML injection into a wiki. But it does the job elegantly, so I don't have any objections against it. The only minor bother is the point after the country names, which are inserted because of the listing type. ArticCynda (talk) 12:41, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

Changed the marker type to silver as a compromise to the remark that the red tint of go was too similar to vicinity. The tint of silver is quite easily distinguishable from do markers. Thoughts on silver makers for the embassy table? ArticCynda (talk) 17:58, 27 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Silver was one of my favourite colors for the Embassies markers - the color gives a nice contrast to the other markers... Loaoa (talk) 00:51, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

Administrative Buildings
A list of administrative buildings has been added under See, but it seems that most of them have little to no touristic value: they cannot be visited (or there would be nothing to see/experience inside), and the architectural value from the outside is limited. I don't think they should be listed under See, and probably not even listed at all. It should be noted that, at the time of writing, there are 72 different See listings in the article (!), which becomes impractical from a visitor's perspective. Unless there are objections, I propose to remove the list of Administrative Buildings, and move Konak to one of the other sections. ArticCynda (talk) 23:05, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

 * Myself, I start thinking about subdividing city articles into some kind of districts when the number of listings in one section starts approaching 40-50 (or several sections start approaching 30). If the listed places aren't really of interest to visitors it's better to remove them, though. --ϒpsilon (talk) 17:06, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

 * About the architectural value of the Presidency building of Bosnia and Herzegovina it could be mentioned, that it was designed by the architect Josip Vancaš in the style of Florentine Early Renaissance. The groundbreaking ceremony was held on March 1884 and the building was opened in March 1886. It was discussed back in the day that should the building be built in Florentine Early Renaissance style, in Italian Gothic style or in Italian Late Renaissance style, but due to the limited funds, the cheapest option was selected. Source: http://www.predsjednistvobih.ba/zgr-konak/predsjednistvo/default.aspx?id=10007&langTag=en-US Loaoa (talk) 22:33, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

 * About the architectural value of the Building of the BiH Parliamentary Assembly could be noted, that at the time it was finished, the building of the Assembly of SRBiH was the only building for that purpose in this part of Europe designed in a modern style. It was commenced back in 1954, designed by the architect Juraj Neidhard, and finally built during 1978–1982. The architect, who was a close associate of Le Corbusier, considered this building to be one of the most important achievements of his creativity. A guideline of "Architecture is always a work of an individual, an individual who sees and understands, who decides and creates; it is the sublime moment of crystallization arising in the depth of one's inner personality, just like in a foundry" was followed when designing the building, and by the words of Hamdija Salihović: "The Parliament building interprets a creative productive and sculptural act in a dynamic architectural composition, being a synthesis of functional requirements and the spatial organization of its epistructure in modelling its semantic character. Neidhardt's inimitable modern architectural art shows fancifulness in its conceptual imagination by playing with lines, planes, volumes and shapes in a harmonious and proportional manner."
 * Source 1: http://www.parlament.ba/Content/Read/195?title=ZgradaParlamentarneskup%C5%A1tineBiH
 * Source 2: http://www.parlament.ba/Content/Read/196?title=MonumentalnodjeloJurajaNeidharta Loaoa (talk) 22:39, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

 * I thought that the Central Bank building of BiH would be a no-brainer to include, but seems that it's of no interest to every traveller (or rather, maybe I'm in the minority here...). Likewise, from where I'm from, there's no cantonal system in place, and for me, at least, I think it'd be nice to see the building where the local Canton officers work, even though not admitted in. But as earlier, I might be in the minority. An apparent question of course is, that if something from a certain category is included, why not then include XYZ, which arguable is "more important" or wields more decision making power? As the original submitter of these places I feel like I have to recuse myself and let the community next editor decide on this matter. Loaoa (talk) 23:55, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
 * The descriptions should focus on the qualities of the buildings, rather than the roles of the institutions, which are more appropriate for Wikipedia articles, which have been linked. I have edited to reflect this. Ground Zero (talk) 06:26, 1 October 2017 (UTC)
 * I trimmed the list a bit and added descriptions about the buildings. I really wish that there was a way to list places such as the Head Office of the Central Bank of BiH or The Government of Sarajevo Canton, but as ArticCynda noted, they really aren't great touristic destinations at all, and thus don't belong under the "See" category. -- Loaoa (talk) 16:51, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
 * For a travel guide, articles should focus on the most interesting things to see/do for a destination, from the perspective of a traveler with limited available time. Few travelers would spend an entire vacation of a week in Sarajevo alone, but are likely to visit the city in the context of a weekend city trip or as a day excursion in a tour around Bosnia. So if you'd only have a day or two to see Sarajevo, then the administrative buildings are in my opinion not worth the detour, if that means dropping other more unique see/do experiences. I'm not an architecture expert, but I presume that most of the administrative buildings share large architectural similarities with other contemporary buildings in other cities, and would therefore not be considered a must see. ArticCynda (talk) 12:53, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * I'm afraid I have to agree with ArticCynda on all points made. For me the biggest issue is the header itself (Administrative buildings), which can't easily be traced on the https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Wycsi page or from the header guidelines https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Wikivoyage:Section_headers page, so the remaining POIs would have to be listed as regular buildings under "See". But then comes the 7±2 rule ( https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/7%2B2 ) of avoiding long lists... So perhaps one could move the excessive POIs here, the Konak where it could fit (on the main page) and remove this header altogether? -- Loaoa (talk) 20:32, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * I also don't like the sound of Administrative Buildings, it does not sound very inspiring to the visitor to take a look at all! Perhaps a new section Architecture can be created, with buildings of architectural value that don't fit well under other sections. Maybe the City Hall can also be moved there, since this building has exceptional architectural value? ArticCynda (talk) 21:30, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Basically, we're looking for the English equivalent of the Italian word "palazzi". "Architecture" doesn't quite do it. How about "Notable buildings"? Ikan Kekek (talk) 21:38, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * "Notable buildings" is just fine IMO or perhaps something along the lines of "Notable buildings with architectural value"? In any case I think you guys are better with these headers than I am, and will be content with any structural modifications you come up with... --Loaoa (talk) 22:16, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * According to Wikipedia, the word Palace as a literal translation from the Italian Palazzi would fit the description quite nicely, although it doesn't quite match the definition in English. A proper English word seems to be missing. Think about why a traveler would be interested to visit the POI: is it because of the contents inside (i.e. like a museum)? Or for the architectural value of the building itself? In the latter case, a denominator like Architecture seems a good option. If the POI doesn't have anything interesting to offer inside or outside, then why would a visitor be interested in the first place? ArticCynda (talk) 22:45, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * That's quite wrong. Palazzi are buildings, not usually palaces. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:47, 5 October 2017 (UTC)
 * From the Wikipedia article you linked: "In Italy, any urban building built as a grand residence is a palazzo; these are often no larger than a Victorian townhouse." Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:48, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

International organisations
Added this header. Any thoughts (include, exclude, move, delete, add a listing, remove a listing...)? Loaoa (talk) 22:43, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Office of the High Representative - Almost certainly one of the most powerful ruling offices in the complex political system of BiH, overseeing the civilian implementation of the Dayton Peace Agreement. OHR is only responsible to the Peace Implementation Council and has dismissed over a hundred officials from their posts including judges, ministers, civil servants and members of parliaments. This hierarchical setting and OHR's position in it is unique in the world, I guess.
 * Council of Europe Office - removed
 * World Bank Country Office - One of the key facilitators in changing the economical landscape in BiH. International Bank for Reconstruction and Development (IBRD) finances the country ca. US$750 million during FY16-20, and the level of the International Finance Corporation (IFC) investment program will be dependent on the pace of reforms made in the business sector ("the Reform Agenda"). Some of the notable projects include for instance the Federation Road Sector Modernization Project (€58 million), which was approved in August 2016, cofinanced by the European Investment Bank and the World Bank, in which 178 kilometers of main roads will be rehabilitated, including three tunnels and nine bridges, and a new route M17.3 (Neum-Stolac road) will be constructed. Also provided financial support (a US$100 million International Development Association (IDA) credit from the World Bank Group's Crisis Response Window) for emergency goods, when an unprecedented rainfall in 2014 affected more than 1 million people (25% of the population), and the resulting heavy flooding caused estimated damages and losses equivalent to nearly 15% of the country's GDP. (Source 1: https://pubdocs.worldbank.org/en/705141492622353847/Bosnia-Herzegovina-Snapshot13Apr2017.pdf (PDF, 644kb) Source 2: http://documents.worldbank.org/curated/en/752481468194999174/Bosnia-and-Herzegovina-Country-partnership-framework-for-the-period-FY2016-20 )
 * International Crime Tribunal for former Yugoslavia Field Office - Self explanatory (I guess), since there are other war related POIs listed on the page, but ICTY is also mentioned under the UN House, so this POI might be redundant.
 * UN House - Trimmed the description field as noted by Ground Zero above. There are many UN sub-branches currently working in this building and around the city under the UN umbrella.

IDK how all this relates to the https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Wikivoyage:Listings#Relevance but personally I find these POIs very interesting even if not let inside the buildings. But as always, the next editor may decide otherwise. -- Loaoa (talk) 11:11, 1 October 2017 (UTC)

 * Removed the WB and ICTY offices, since they are not great travel destinations. If there only was a better way of adding these kinds of interesting POIs... but as a POI for "see", I don't think they qualify. -- Loaoa (talk) 13:15, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Moved the remaining two POIs here, since I couldn't find a suitable category for these on the https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Wikivoyage:Where_you_can_stick_it page. Politics is mentioned on the Understand section of a City, Country, or Region page, but I don't know how the data should be formatted. So here they are, if found somehow useful: -- Loaoa (talk) 22:33, 2 October 2017 (UTC)

Weak POI candidates
From the traveller's point of view some of the POIs in the city really aren't that great visiting destinations. As noted on the 7±2 page ( https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/7%2B2 ) Wikivoyage shouldn't be a phone book and list everything, so I'm putting up this section mainly for case by case study and discussion about the POIs that are (or have been) featured on the main page, but have awoken some concerns about their status. -- Loaoa (talk) 21:17, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Officers’ Casino
 * Even though the story behind this building is great and gives insight to the history of the city, the building itself is bit underwhelming and not much of a visiting destination. It is classified as one of the "National monuments" of BiH, but so are about ~150 other buildings in Sarajevo (including the Central Bank building...). Source: http://old.kons.gov.ba/main.php?mod=spomenici&extra=Odluke&blok=2&indexGrad=1&lang=4&idGrad=86 -- Loaoa (talk) 21:37, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * A photo gallery of the Officers' Casino (Federation Army Centre, Army Centre): http://aplikacija.kons.gov.ba/kons/public/nacionalnispomenici/galerija/2810 -- Loaoa (talk) 06:36, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

 * This mosque is very modestly built and probably not worth visiting at all. As a part of a list of places in Sarajevo this would be great, but as a travel destination, well, not that great. -- Loaoa (talk) 21:46, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * There are literally dozens of mosques scattered around Sarajevo, it's probably sufficient to add the most historically relevant ones, or those with exceptional architectural beauty. ArticCynda (talk) 22:25, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * There are literally dozens of mosques scattered around Sarajevo, it's probably sufficient to add the most historically relevant ones, or those with exceptional architectural beauty. ArticCynda (talk) 22:25, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

 * Yes, there is a church in that complex, but for most travellers this wouldn't be much of an interest, I guess. -- Loaoa (talk) 21:46, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Agreed, the link mentions  valuable frescos in Neo-Renaissance style but I can't find any other reference to them, so probably not that exceptional after all. ArticCynda (talk) 22:30, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * A photo gallery of the church: http://aplikacija.kons.gov.ba/kons/public/nacionalnispomenici/galerija/3335 -- Loaoa (talk) 06:36, 5 October 2017 (UTC)
 * A photo gallery of the church: http://aplikacija.kons.gov.ba/kons/public/nacionalnispomenici/galerija/3335 -- Loaoa (talk) 06:36, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

 * Interesting to the historians, maybe, but for the regular travellers? Not so much. Besides there's so little Jewishness left in this building, that I'm not sure to which category this would actually belong. -- Loaoa (talk) 21:57, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Interesting to the historians, maybe, but for the regular travellers? Not so much. Besides there's so little Jewishness left in this building, that I'm not sure to which category this would actually belong. -- Loaoa (talk) 21:57, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

 * Might be relevant to the Judaism article, though? Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:03, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Yes, thank you! I think the perfect new home for this POI could be Judaism -> See -> Synagogues -- Loaoa (talk) 22:31, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Didn't know there was a Jusaism article, but it seems it might be more fitting there indeed. ArticCynda (talk) 22:33, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

The Central Post Office seems to be a debatable weak POI candidate, since it is located closer to the touristic districts, and can be visited freely by travelers (unlike the other administrative buildings which are restricted). I added it to the Administrative Buildings section for now. ArticCynda (talk) 15:59, 5 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Another version of Central Post Office (Obala Kulina bana 8) is also/still listed under "Connect". Should the (even weaker / "unupdated") duplicate version under Connect be removed? Personally I'd include the updated version of the Central Post Office on the main page, but would not object the removal of this POI (Central Post Office) in its entirety, either, if consensus that way could be achieved. Post offices usually reside in the Connect section of a City page. If stamps can be purchased and postcards be posted there, I think the (newer) POI (perhaps with the alt name changed to BH Pošta) might be useful to some tourists. Loaoa (talk) 21:27, 10 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Apparently it's architecturally quite impressive, at least the interior seems worth a visit judging from the pictures, so that's why I added it to "See" as well. Stamps are sold by most post card vendors too, so it's not really a necessity to list the postal office under "Connect" I think. There is a small post office selling stamps and accepting post cards in Basarsjia as well. ArticCynda (talk) 20:15, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

IMHO this is a too obvious POI, since there are over 100 cafés around the city. This café can't be missed if Sebilj is visited. Loaoa (talk) 01:38, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

Promotion to Star
The quality of this article has significantly improved in the last months, so let's make a list of stuff that needs to be done to make it into a Star article. ArticCynda (talk) 13:15, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
 * adding static map
 * checking spelling and grammar —The preceding comment was added by ArticCynda (talk • contribs)

 * In the meantime, I think the article could be nominated for Destination of the month, I believe there is still one month open next summer. However, I notice the article has quite many listings in the See section so we might need to divide it into districts first. --ϒpsilon (talk) 14:21, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

 * ϒpsilon - Depending on how late in the year Sarajevo can be featured, we have empty DotM slots in August, September, and October of next year. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:04, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

 * It'll be August or September, I believe. ϒpsilon (talk) 17:09, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

 * I don't think that dividing the city into districts would be useful since most of the attraction are located in one district (the old town). The article is more valuable to travelers if it is not split up. ArticCynda (talk) 20:18, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
 * My vote also goes for not splitting up the Sarajevo article, since the city is such a special destination... But if it has to be split to subdistricts, I'd fancy the division between an eastern and western part (made as westernly as possible), for instance along the Kulovica street (between National Theatre and Central Post Office), or more preferably along Halida Kajtaza (between National Museum and Bosnian Historical Museum), but I've have not yet calculated, if these would actually do the trick of reducing the POIs up to 9. As ArticCynda mentioned, all the main POIs are densely located in the old town (Baščaršija). Vratnik could also be another district, too, as it previously has been. Loaoa (talk) 22:41, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
 * The See POIs are already properly divided in subsections so that none exceed the 9 items per section rule. However, as far as I know, there are no formal limits to how many POIs an article can have in total (across all subsections). Perhaps one of the admins could shine their light on this matter? ArticCynda (talk) 00:02, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

Since no consensus on districtification (yes/no) could be reached, and the discussion has stalled for over 5 months, I have removed the districtification banner from the page (status quo). ArticCynda (talk) 10:54, 4 July 2018 (UTC)

Static Map Project
Before making a chance of being upgraded to a Star article, Sarajevo still needs a static map. As the consensus seems to be to not districtify the article, the question is how such a static map for Sarajevo should look like. I propose 2 maps: a general one of Grad Sarajevo (including the airport and attractions like the Tunel Spasa, yellow and white fortress etc.), and a close-up of Bascarsija. What do other Wikivoyagers think? ArticCynda (talk) 00:14, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

 * By no means is there a consensus not to districtify. See dotm, where I said districtification would probably be a necessity for Star status if not for DotM status, and Granger strongly implied that s/he felt similarly. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:28, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

 * To clarify my thinking: It looks to me like the article is long enough that districtifying might be worth considering, but it also might be fine as is. I don't know the city at all, so I'll defer to others' judgment. —Granger (talk · contribs) 21:01, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

 * It would be hard to do proper districtification without breaking the coherence of the article, I think. For instance, if you would split into Grad Sarajevo, Bascarsija and Vratnik, then the Latin Bridge and Goat's Bridge would end up in different sub articles, wheras they're currently discussed together in a neat section to illustrate their important. And where to put the Festina Lente bridge then? The same goes for many other sections as well. In my opinion, breaking up the article solely because of its length would harm readability more than it could improve it, and reduce its value for the traveler. ArticCynda (talk) 13:46, 3 February 2018 (UTC)

Embassies in Sarajevo
The embassies section in the Sarajevo article is setup as a table, which is different to all other articles. Should we change it to a listing format, similar to the others? -- WOSlinker (talk) 21:53, 1 May 2019 (UTC)
 * I think so. Currently, you could miss that "expand" button altogether, and therefore miss valuable information in the article. --Comment by Selfie City  ( talk  |  contributions ) 22:52, 1 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Did we not have a discussion some months ago about collapsing embassy lists as they take up a large amount of some articles and are only interesting to travelers on rare occasions? --Traveler100 (talk) 05:38, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
 * If it's too hard to see the button, then we need to change the button. A background color would help signal that something is different there.  WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:13, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
 * See Madrid for an example of a collapsible section, but just listings the list format rather than a table. -- WOSlinker (talk) 22:10, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
 * I plunged forward and made them all conventional listings but took most markers down since it looked like there'd been an accident in Sarajevo to a truckload of Brussels Sprouts. If the listing is now too long, my suggestion is to dismiss most of them in a one-liner: "Other countries represented here include Indonesia, Iran, blah blah". Grahamsands (talk) 20:39, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 04:39, 10 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Sarajevo Holiday Inn.JPG

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 05:07, 10 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Sarajevo-City-Center Hochhaus (2022).jpg

 * No FoP in Bosnia and Herzegovina. Do we want this? SHB2000  (talk | contribs | meta) 06:00, 10 September 2022 (UTC)

 * That building is not devoid of interest, but it's not visible on the page and there are a lot of images already there. I'd rather some effort be made to distribute the existing images more evenly than that more be added. And is Sarajevo well-known for its post-modernist architecture, anyway? I think it's better known for old iconic structures like the bridge. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:27, 10 September 2022 (UTC)

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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 04:42, 30 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Greece–Bosnia and Herzegovina Friendship Building (by Pudelek).jpg

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 * Sarajevo Tram-291 Line-3 2013-10-25 (cropped).jpg

title: Talk:Sarajevo


text:
Talk:Saranac Lake

Hi, everyone. Here's some publicity that I cut from the "New York (state)" page. Decide whether you want to use some of it.

Michael 07:04, 27 Apr 2006 (UTC)

Saranac Lake, NY. Saranac Lake is a charming, if not quirky village tucked away deep in the Adirondack Mountains of northern New York State. It is the largest commercial hub in the Adirondack State Park, which is the largest park inside of the contiguous United States. The Adirondack Park is actually larger than Yellowstone, Yosemite and the Grand Canyon combined and includes thousands of miles of lakes and rivers, some of the tallest mountains and best skiing in the Eastern United States.

Shortly after its inception as a village in the late 1800's, Saranac Lake became one of the most prominent health restoration centers in the United States. When TB was raging across the great cities of Europe and North America, some of the wealthiest people sought refuge in Saranac Lake, believing the fresh air was "the cure." Grand homes and palatial residences were built for this influx of wealthy patients and the attending physicians. Thousands did survive in Saranac Lake and it's long history as a second home for affluent city dwellers began.

In the mid-1900's, with the advent of antibiotics, TB was no longer viewed as a death sentence. The time coincided with the Jet Age and many full and part time residents left the area for more exotic, far-flung destinations. Economically, the area was on a downward spiral and endured several decades of general economic depression. The phrase "too proud to whitewash, too poor to paint" summed up the remaining populace. Historic buildings and residences remained standing, if only due to benign neglect.

As the 1990's began and an unprecedented prosperity swept across America, historic Saranac Lake and its inspiring natural beauty was rediscovered. Surrounded by soaring mountains, covered in a lush carpet of evergreen and pines, an appreciation of what the area had offered was reborn. Historic buildings were saved, village neighborhoods gentrified and a fresh influx of wealth came to a destination known as "America's Emerald Village."

With the dawn of the new millennium, artists discovered Saranac Lake and it has become the largest Arts Colony in northern New York. Visual, performing and interpretive artist come to the area for its abundance of natural beauty and inspiration. The historic Saranac Club and Inn in Saranac Lake has become the center of the area's arts movement, where receptions, discussions, readings and showings are performed regularly. Actors and musicians are often in residence, mingling with regular guests at the luxury inn. Performances are held regularly and are open to the public during the peak seasons of Summer, Autumn and Winter.

Other major centers for the Arts include the Pendragon Theatre (the only year-round theatre group in the Adirondacks,) and the Lake Placid Center for the Arts. Artists galleries, interspersed with bistro's and coffee houses, line the main thoroughfare of the village of Saranac Lake. Several film festivals are held throughout Saranac Lake and Lake Placid. The "Cabin Fever Film Festival" is held annually at the Hotel Saranac and the annual summer "Screen in the Green" is held weekly at the Saranac Club and Inn.

In line with Saranac Lake's original reputation as a "Curing destination," in 2005 it became a "Caring destination," with the opening of Tranquility Lodge USA. It is a collection of properties devoted to providing respite and retreat services to men and women who are in the final stages of various life ending illensses. As a community with a unique and complete history devoted and dedicated to serving others, the history and beauty Saranac Lake makes it one of America's most distinctive destinations.

For additional information on Saranac Lake, Lake Placid and the remote, rugged Adirondack Mountains, go to http://www.nationaltrust.org/dozen_distinctive_destinations/2006/index.html

Understand
Saranac Lake, NY Understand that time spent in Saranac Lake is best spent enjoying the magnificent scenery and enjoying the wide array of outdoor activities. In the summer, days are best spent on the lakes boating and fishing. Landlubbers will dig the hiking (thousands of miles of trails within an hour of Saranac Lake.) As you can imagine, the scenery is stunning in the Autumn when the leaves are changing. In the winter, Saranac Lake is often reported as the coldest location in the nation. As a result, winter is best celebrated although not for the light-hearted. Ice fishing, cross-country, snow mobiling, bobsledding, luging, dog sledding, riding in a horse drawn sleigh, hockey, curling and some of the most challenging downhill skiing on Earth is all within 15 minutes of the heart of the village. This area, along with Lake Placid (10 minutes away!) is one of only three places on EARTH, selected to host the Winter Olympics twice!

Once the sun sets, evening are often spent relaxing in front of a crackling fire. Where? Either at one of the Great Camps that surround the lakes or at one of the luxury hotels. When something a bit more stimulating is in order, have the hotel shuttle take you the ten minutes to the heart of Lake Placid village, where there are bars and restaurants galore! All in all, after a day of breathing in the clear mountain air, this is a community that hits the sacks relatively early. Few disco's are open past midnight as most people are asleep.

While culture and the arts are taking an increasingly prominent place in village life, understand that physical acitivity is part of the local culture. Being fit and outdoorsy is the local mantra and as a result, is home to many of the most fit and attractive people in New York State. Olympians from all over the planet live here and train year round. There aren't many communities where bumping into international athletes at the grocery store is a daily occurrence.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Saranac Lake


text:
Talk:Sarasota

So, as described in Project:What is an article?, we don't usually do one-article-per-attraction. It'd be great to change these links to actual listings -- you can see the listings format in the Project:manual of style. --(WT-en) Evan 14:26, 18 Dec 2003 (PST)

Article moved here for mining:

Sarasota Jungle Gardens

History:

The history of Sarasota Jungle gardens is very typical of many of the early Florida attractions created in the 1920's through the 1950's. Sarasota Jungle Gardens started life as typical Florida wetlands, or as what most people would refer to as a 'swamp'. Two men, David Breed Lindsay and Pearson Conrad, developed the initial 10 acres into a botanical gardens for their own pleasure. After a while, many people began wandering around the gardens and the owners decided to charge admission. The Gardens got their formal name in December of 1940 and although the Gardens were sold numerous times, they are still open to visitors today. A more detailed account may be found at their website http://www.sarasotajunglegardens.com

The Gardens today:

As of this writing, there are 5 shows at the gardens in addition to the grounds themselves which are filled with many interesting plants. Please refer to the attraction's web site for show schedules and changes to show offerings (http://www.sarasotajunglegardens.com). As with most early attractions, the offer some animals shows and a chance to see some rare plants, many of which are of extraordinary size.

It is hard to imagine in today’s fast paced world what it was like when the automobile first gave people the ability to travel the country to see things outside their hometown. This attraction is a rare opportunity to see what Florida was like in the tourist boom of the early 1900's. Many of these types of attractions are now extinct and although they do not offer the thrill rides of today’s modern amusement parks, they do offer a unique opportunity to relax and enjoy a real gem of Americana. I strongly encourage visitors to Florida to see at least one of these rare and very special gems before they are gone forever, existing only as fading pictures and memories in forgotten attics.

title: Talk:Sarasota


text:
Talk:Saratoga County

VfD discussion
Looking at the New York regional structure, a county article is not really appropriate. There is already a reasonably developed Saratoga Springs article so if anything, maybe a redirect there? --(WT-en) Burmesedays 13:08, 17 October 2009 (EDT)
 * Keep. The regions of New York are not, themselves, well-divided into subregions.  Counties seem to be the default option until someone comes up with a better organization.  (WT-en) LtPowers 13:59, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

 * Redirect to Hudson Valley. It's a problematic county, as it is split across two parent regions. But more importantly it's not yet necessary, nothing links there, nor does it have any content. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 15:11, 17 October 2009 (EDT)
 * As you say, it's split across two parent regions, so why redirect to one? (WT-en) LtPowers 16:21, 17 October 2009 (EDT)
 * There's almost nothing northwest of the park border (to this we owe the beautiful views from Saratoga Springs!). I'm pretty sure miniscule Corinth is all there is—everything else is on the Hudson Valley side. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 17:33, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

 * Keep and disambiguate or redirect - I am not sure why there is such an aversion to creating US counties but to me it would seem reasonable to have county pages, simply because Wikipedia has them and there is a risk that someone will link to Wikivoyage and expect to find a county organised the same way. It could be a disambiguation page at this stage that points to all the places you want to redirect it to. - (WT-en) Huttite 06:22, 3 November 2009 (EST)
 * Result: Keep. (WT-en) LtPowers 15:53, 7 March 2010 (EST)

title: Talk:Saratoga County


text:
Talk:Sarawak

Contributor link - to research this article try: - (WT-en) Huttite 05:47, 15 Apr 2005 (EDT)
 * http://www.cuti.com.my/guide_sarawak.htm

Visa for Sarawak?
I'm planning to visit Sarawak in few days so I thought of consulting this guide. I'm amazed to see the line under Get in section that "If you do need an advance visa for Malaysia, you'll need one specifically for Sarawak." I wonder if it is correct? I've yet to check with Malaysia mission in Pakistan.--Saqib (talk) 14:36, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
 * The Malaysia article says the same. According to a discussion on TripAdvisor an additional visa isn't necessary if you have a visa for Malaysia. Also, most countries' visa applications require you to fill in which cities you are going to visit. If they know you're going to Sarawak and have issued a visa, you should be able to use it. But I would definitely ask the Malaysian embassy or immigration authorities just to be sure. ϒpsilon (talk) 16:00, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay. No specific visa required for Sarawak and Sabah but yes, both states has autonomous law in immigration so there's passport control between East and West Malaysia. Have made changes accordingly. --Saqib (talk) 17:01, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Sarawak


text:
Talk:Sardinia

I rolled back the addition of an external guide link; see Project:External links for more info on why. --(WT-en) Evan 09:48, 26 September 2006 (EDT)

Ok but if you decide not to accept links like hoildays-in-sardinia.com you mustn' accept sardegna.com either! It's the website of a Tour Operator! I have added a link to the Official English Website of the Region Sardinia now!

vitaly.ivanov >> Apparently "Eat" misses Casu Marzu and Fregola

conservative?
according ti which sources sardinians should be conservative? because they attend folk festival and mantain ancient traditions? sardinians are not conservative from a social point of view, the region shows the lowest fertility rate in italy, high level of equality of gender, in sardinia set many times gay prides without causing scandals, and it's the region with the highest level on integration of immigrants —The preceding comment was added by 78.12.220.32 (talk • contribs)

Regional subdivision
Given how empty they are and my doubts that they matter for the traveler can we merge the "regions" back here? Hobbitschuster (talk) 20:59, 19 February 2020 (UTC)

 * Support per Talk:Corsica.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 14:57, 22 February 2020 (UTC)
 * I've expanded many of the regions, so there is no need to merge them. Ground Zero (talk) 13:31, 10 June 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Sardinia


text:
Talk:Sari

Sari
Thank you,i have read the rules. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) Andy2000 (talk • contribs)

title: Talk:Sari


text:
Talk:Sarrebruck

20,000
Just wanted to announce that this is Wikivoyage's 20,000th destination guide! --(WT-en) Peter Talk 15:26, 22 November 2008 (EST)
 * It's Fort Saskatchewan, right after I created it I looked on the main page and it turned to 20,000. Keep Smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee]  .T.A.L.K. 15:29, 22 November 2008 (EST).

I've transferred the text over to French Wikivoyage... English travel already has a page for Saarbrucken in Germany.(WT-en) Jnich99 15:45, 22 November 2008 (EST)

Sarrebruck

 * Delete The page is in French. I relocated the text into French Wikivoyage. We already have a page in Wikivoyage/en for Saarbrücken. I think it was created in error. (WT-en) Jnich99 11:33, 24 November 2008 (EST)
 * Redirect per deletion policy. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 16:29, 24 November 2008 (EST)
 * The redirect seems clearly appropriate for this one. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 13:05, 8 December 2008 (EST)

Outcome: Redirected to Saarbrücken. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 12:38, 9 December 2008 (EST)

title: Talk:Sarrebruck


text:
Talk:Saskatchewan

Region Changes
I added additional content for Saskatchewan and I'm wondering the the top-level regions should be updated, including splitting both Central Saskatchewan and Southern Saskatchewan? Both regions could be split east-west along Highway 2/11/6 from Prince Albert to the US border. The regions are geographically quite large, stretching the width of the province.

 * Southeastern Saskatchewan - east of Hwy 2 (north of Chamberlain), Hwy 11 (Chamberlain-Regina), and Hwy 6 (south of Regina). The line could actually be slightly west of Regina so the city would be in the SE. Northern boundaries of the Qu'Appelle River/South Saskatchewan River could remain, but the Qu'Appelle valley (i.e Fort Qu'Appelle, etc) would be included in this region.
 * Southwestern Saskatchewan - west of the line outlined above, with Moose Jaw, Chamberlain, Lake Diefenbaker and points west being included. Northern boundary is fine. It should be noted that the topography does slightly change from prairie/parkland in the east to grasslands in the west.
 * West Central Saskatchewan - west of Hwy 2, includes Saskatoon; southern boundary is fine.
 * East Central Saskatchewan - east of Hwy 2 and includes the Hwy 2 communities such as Wakaw and Watrous-Manitou Beach; southern boundary is fine.

I'm thinking quadripoint would be somewhere between Liberty and Holdfast, so Chamberlain is in the SW (closest to Moose Jaw), Regina Beach is the SE (included with Regina), and Davidson is in West Central.

 * Northern Saskatchewan - I would recommend pushing the boundaries southward so anything along Hwy 55 is automatically in the north. Generally the parkland/agricultural land transitions to more northern forests between Hwys 3 & 55, so places like Loon Lake, Meadow Lake, Shellbrook, and Nipawin belong in the north. On the eastern section, the landscape starts changing a lot further south, so the Northern/East Central boundary could head in a southeasterly direction from Nipawin and include Hudson Bay (its included in the Northern region but the Saskatchewan map shows it in Central).

Any thoughts? --MuzikMachine (talk) 06:31, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
 * I see your point that South and Central regions are now over-full with destinations. Great work. I've not been to Saskatchewan yet — I plan to go in the fall if we get the jabs and things open — so I will defer to your local knowledge. Ground Zero (talk) 04:12, 1 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I took another look at the map, while Hudson Bay is definitely a transition to have a "northern" feel, it's far enough south to still be in East Central. --MuzikMachine (talk) 17:27, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

great work on reorganizing the regions! Ground Zero (talk) 15:36, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you! All that's needed is an updated map and I think that would wrap it up; unfortunately I don't have tools readily available to do that. I noticed there was a Spiritwood article floating around (wasn't listed on the Northern Saskatchewan page), so I'm thinking the Northern/West Central line should be south of SK 3 west of Prince Albert. --MuzikMachine (talk) 17:28, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Regions
I made a list of regions that could be included in Saskatchewan, but what are people's thoughts on them? Keep smiling, (WT-en) ee talk 17:38, 14 November 2008 (EST).

 * The regions here are looking a bit neglected. The provincial tourism site lists seven regions .  I don't think we need that many since the content is very sparse, so I'm proposing to have three regions -- Southern, Central and Northern.

 * Northern Saskatchewan - Essentially everything on SK Highway 55 and north. This would include the city of Prince Albert.
 * Central Saskatchewan - Everything south of SK Highway 55 and north of the South Saskatchewan and Qu'Appelle Rivers. Includes the cities of Saskatoon and North Battleford. East Central Saskatchewan would be merged into this region.
 * Southern Saskatchewan - Everything south of the South Saskatchewan and Qu'Appelle Rivers to the US Border. Includes the cities of Regina and Swift Current. Southwest (Saskatchewan) would be merged into this region.

Thoughts? - (WT-en) Shaund 00:57, 23 March 2011 (EDT)

 * No comments so I implemented the region structure today. - (WT-en) Shaund 00:37, 15 June 2011 (EDT)

Changing the boundaries of the Southwest Region
Hi there,

As per Great Southwest (https://greatsouthwest.ca/), which appears to be the only regional tourism authority in the province (or at least the one best at advertising itself), I am suggesting we extend the boundaries of the Southwest Region.

The proposed changes are:
 * 1) to the north: extending the boundary to Highway 7, so as to include all of the Great Sandhills and all of Lake Dief and surrounding area (Kindersley and Rosetown, etc. would still be part of West-Central region, but on the edge of it)
 * 2) to the east: extending the boundary to Highway 6, so as to include all of the badlands, Ogema, etc.

These proposed changes are based on the guidebook/map on the Great Southwest website and my own experiences in this region.

I strongly suggest that the 2nd reccomended change happens, and hope that the first one is considered as well.

Thank you --Tundraski (talk) 22:45, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

 * Am ok with it. does this work out? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 22:57, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Which 9 cities?
Per 7+2, non-bottom-level region articles cannot have more than 9 cities in the "Cities" sections. Which of these should be removed? Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:40, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

 * — the provincial capital offers museums, art galleries, and a professional football team
 * — the province's largest city, and its economic and cultural hub
 * — twin communities of North Battleford and Battleford at the confluence to the Battle and North Saskatchewan Rivers
 * — the sunniest city in Canada
 * — take a tour through the extensive underground tunnels that were used by bootleggers in the 1920s and by early Chinese immigrants
 * — a city that straddles the border between Saskatchewan and Alberta
 * — gateway to Northern Saskatchewan
 * — home to a Mennonite heritage village
 * — home of the world's first curling museum
 * — home of North America's longest-running film festival

I visited Saskatchewan for the first time last month, so I will defer to anyone with more experience. If no-one steps forward, based on the See and Do listings, I nominate Estevan and Swift Current for demotion from this list. I had a decent coffee in Swift Current, but otherwise it struck me as a very ordinary town. (I note that 7±2 does not always equal 9 for anyone who objects to me proposing 2 cities for demotion.) These cities of course would remain in the subregion articles for Southeastern and Southwestern Saskatchewan. Ground Zero (talk) 00:40, 12 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Done. Ground Zero (talk) 03:28, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Saskatchewan


text:
Talk:Saskatoon

Wikipedia copying (2004)
I reverted the content of this page; it was copied from Wikipedia. Wikivoyage and Wikipedia have incompatible copyleft licenses, so we can't just copy stuff from there. Sorry. --(WT-en) Evan 22:09, 26 Jan 2004 (EST)

Delta Bessborough "shabby genteel"
"The room style can best be described as "shabby genteel"." < Shabby? Can anyone confirm? --I don't have an account yet :( 04:06, 4 July 2008
 * I just walked through the hotel, looked at the lobby and meeting room floors and walked the hall of one of the guest room floors. As far as I can see, it's a perfectly well-maintained corporate hotel in a fine old building, and the label "shabby genteel" is not deserved. JimDeLaHunt (talk) 05:41, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

 * The Wikivoyage history doesn't show where that "shabby genteel" language came from. A revision revision on 08:20, 30 March 2013 seems to have no entry for the Bessborough. The next revision, on 01:34, 21 May 2013, has an entry with the "shabby genteel" comment. The funny thing is, this edit seems to be converting an XML-style listing, not adding it. Maybe an edit got lost from the history, perhaps related to the fork from Wikitravel. I see a Wikitravel edit on 23:27, 27 May 2008 by Wikitravel user Zannah adding the "shabby genteel" language. After 8 years, I think it's OK to reevaluate. JimDeLaHunt (talk) 05:41, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

C'mawn!
Hi! I think we need Saskatoon specialist's to start Editing this page majorly, I am not very knowledged on Saskatoon, but I could help a little, but II need to see other people interested in this! (WT-en) Edmontonenthusiast 01:15, 23 October 2008
 * Challenge accepted! I am now making a quick visit to Saskatoon, my first, and I'm rewriting and improving freely throughout the article. I'm using my traveler's needs as my guide. I don't know the town well, though, so I hope locals will correct any mistakes I make. JimDeLaHunt (talk) 07:50, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

title: Talk:Saskatoon


text:
Talk:Sassari

THIS GUIDE SUCKS, Sassari is a town, the beach in the photo shown is neither located in province of Sassari, but far almost 200 kms from the town, the list of hotels is full crap, two hotels are neither located in Sassari, one of them is located in another province. The airport is in AlgHERO not AlgUERO.

title: Talk:Sassari


text:
Talk:Sattahip

TAT Listings
Placed some listings from the province page on Talk:Sattahip/Listings for future reference. --(WT-en) globe-trotter 23:29, 2 February 2010 (EST)

Airplane-turned Café
Sattahip has a new café made out of an airplane named Coffee War. --Apisite (talk) 02:47, 8 October 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Sattahip


text:
Talk:Sattahip/Listings

TAT listings
Some listings from the Province page, don't want to clutter the page, so I just place them here. If you visited one of these, place them back and add your traveler experience.

Amphoe Sattahip
On the last curvy bay of Chon Buri is situated the Royal Thai Nabal Base. Presently Sattahip is simply small fishing town by the sea. Domestic tourists come to pay homage to Wat Luang Pho I, a renowned Buddhist monk. Its big squid pier at Samaesan is still viable. Thai Alangkarn Theater (โรงละคร ไทย อลังการ) Located at Km. 155 on Sukhumvit Road. The entire project includes a prototype Hexa stage Theater with 2,000 seats in tiers, Cultural Rostrum and a Restaurant with 1,000 seating capacity. The state of the art shows called ‘The Thai Extravaganza Show‘, is presenting Thailand through our new Panoramic Concept with the use of hi-tech equipment such as the Multi-Color Lasers, Real Surround Sound System, Pyrotechnic and etc, which synchronize with the act from more than hundred experienced of performers on stage. Perform daily except Wednesday. Show time 6PM. For reservation call +66 (0) 38 256 000 E-mail:rsvnpty@alangkarnthailand.com or www.alangkarnthailand.com. The Laser Beams Cast Buddha Image of Khao Chi Chan (พระพุทธรูปแกะสลักเขาชีจรรย์) is on the same route as Wat Yanasangwararam, 6km from Km. 160 of Sukhumvit Road., The image is in the subduing Mara posture, cast by laser beams on the Khao Chi Chan cliff. It is a combination of Sukhothai and Lanna arts with a height of 130 metres and width of 70 metres at the lap of the image. The image called “Phra Phuttha Maha Wachira Uttamophat Satsada” was constructed in 1996 to honour His Majesty the King. Inside the chest of the image resides the Lord Buddha’s relic. Moreover, the garden in the compound is decorated for relaxation and is under the supervision of the Royal Thai Marine Corps, Royal Thai Navy. Nong Nooch Tropical Garden and Resort (สวนนงนุช) About 18km south of Pattaya, with a left turn from Sukhumvit Road., at Km. 163, Nong Nooch Garden is a sprawling recreation park in typical Thai settings. Groups of traditional Thai houses and gardens of different plants, for example, an orchid garden, a palm garden, a banana garden, a bonsai garden, a cactus garden and a heliconia garden, are dotted around the beautifully landscaped site. A zoo and a butterfly garden are also in the compound. There are daily cultural and elephant shows attracting crowds of delighted visitors. Show times are 9.45AM, 10.30AM, 3PM, 3.45PM and holiday 2.45AM. Admission: 400 baht. Tel. 0 3842 9321, 0 3842 9958, 0 3870 9358-62 or Bangkok Tel. 0 2252 1786. The admission fee to the garden is 100 baht, while that including the performance is 400 baht. Moreover, the garden provides a tram for touring around costing 20 baht per one round per person. For more information, Tel. 0 3842 9321, 0 3842 2958 Bangkok Tel. 0 2251 2161, 0 2252 1786. Bang Sa-re (บางเสร่) This is a fishing village some 16km south of Pattaya, with a right turn at km 164. South of Bang Sa-re is a deep bay suitable for angling. To the north are accommodation and dining facilities along the beach.

Wat Sattahip or Wat Luangpho I ((วัดสัตหีบ หรือ วัดหลวงพ่ออี๋) is in Sattahip Sub-district. Its back side is next to the sea. It was constructed during the reign of King Rama V by Luangpho I or Phrakhru Worawet Muni who possessed knowledge of meditation and was the comforter for local in their difficult times. Therefore, the monk was highly respected among the locals. They, therefore, cast an actual-size statue of him residing inside the Ubosot.

Hat Toei Ngam (หาดเตยงาม) Lines of toei trees (Pandanus kaida Kurz) on the 200 metre crescent beach add to the tranquillity of the atmosphere. The northern side of the beach is located a naval museum and monument. Toei Ngam Beach is under the navy’s supervision. It is, however, open to the general public from 6AM-9PM everyday. Hat Dong Tan (หาดดงตาล) Next to Sattahip Market is the curvy bay with lines of fan-palms call.ed “tan” trees from which the name of the bay is derived. The peaceful and quiet atmosphere of the bay attracts local regulars who would like to take a rest. Hat Sai Kaeo (หาดทรายแก้ว) is a beautiful beach under the supervision of the Royal Thai Navy and is near the Naval Rating School. Accommodation for tourists is provided. For more information, Tel. 0 3843 6187 Ext. 2201-2. Hat Nang Ram (หาดนางรำ) Situated close to the Sattahip deep-water port, Nang Ram beach is about 200 metres long. At the tip of the beach stands the shrine of Kromluang Chumphonkhetudomsak, the Father of Royal Thai Navy. The atmosphere is very peaceful with shadowy pine trees and lines of frangipani trees.

Hat Nang Rong (หาดนางรอง) is a little beyond Hat Nang Ram. It is a 200- metre beach with pine trees, suitable for swimming and relaxation. There are various beach accessories for rent such as a hammock for 30 baht, a football for 20 baht and a takro for 10 baht. It is open every Saturday and Sunday, as well as, public holidays. The entrance fee is 20 baht for a car, while 10 baht for a motorcycle. Hat Thian Tale (หาดเทียนทะเล) is a new tourist destination under the supervision of the Air and Coastal Defence Command, Royal Thai Navy. It is a sandy beach alternating with rocks, covering an area of 900 metres. It is a panoramic sightseeing point, with a bizarre shape of cliffs where a view of the sunset on the horizon can be admired. Moreover, there are various kinds of marine plants for study, kayaks for rent, as well as restaurants for food and beverage. For more information, please contact the Queen Sirikit Hospital, ext. Air and Coastal Defence Command at Tel. 0 3824 5760. HTMS Chakri Naruebet (เรือรบหลวงจักรีนฤเบศร) is an offshore Patrol Helicopter Carrier anchored at the Chuk Samet Deep Seaport. His Majesty the King named the ship “Chakri Naruebet” meaning the Sovereign of the Chakri Dynasty. It was constructed in Spain in 1994. It is an 11-storey ship measuring 182 metres in length and 30.5 metres in width. It is equipped with modern weapons, as well as, long-range surveillance radar. The important missions during wartime are the Flagship of the fleet, controlling and commanding the fleet in the sea, as well as the aircraft carrier and air defence mission. It is open daily from 8AM-4PM. It is closed only on Wednesday from 8AM-12AM. It is free of charge. International visitors will have to write a letter to the Commander of the Royal Thai Fleet, Sattahip, Chon Buri, 20180. For more information, Tel. 0 3843 8547-62 ext. HTMS Chakri Naruebet. Turtle Conservation Center, the Royal Thai Navy (ศูนย์อนุรักษ์พันธุ์เต่าทะเล กองทัพเรือ) is a source of knowledge on the biology of the sea turtle life cycle for the government agencies and other groups of visitors. The center also provides a lecture for the public and youth, VDO presentation and exhibitions. Visitors can admire the cuteness of the sea turtles in the nursery ponds. Its objective is to create love and the preservation awareness towards Thai sea turtles. The Center is open everyday from 8AM-5PM. Please contact in advance at the Air and Coastal Defence Command, Tel. 0 3843 1477ext.1035-6, 0 3824 5760, ext.066-3809 www.navy.mi.th

Chong Samaesan Village (หมู่บ้านช่องแสมสาร)	Chong Samaesan is another village offering good fishing opportunities. It is located some 17km further from the Sattahip deep-water port. There are bungalow-type accommodations and tourists can charter boats to enjoy fishing around the nearby islands. These entire small islands are under the jurisdiction of the navy. Suan Chunlakan Sathit Sathan Banphachon Siam (สวนจุลการสถิตสถานบรรพชนสยาม) is a park built for Admiral Prince Krommaluang Chumphon Khet Udomsak in 1995. It is situated at Mu 1, Tambon Phlu Ta Luang where a shrine and statues of Prince Krommaluang Chumphon Khet Udomsak and significant persons in Thai history as well as revered Buddhist monks in the past are situated. The park is open daily from 7AM-6PM.

Agro-tourism Attractions

 * Silver Lake Vineyard (ไร่องุ่นซิลเวอร์เลก) is located at Mu 7, Tambon Na Jomtien, Sattahip District, on the road to the entrance of Khao Chi Chan-Wat Yanasangwararam Woramahawihan, covering an area of 400 rai with 12 kinds of grapes, 11 of which are for fresh consumption and the other one is for making wine. Visitors can taste and purchase fresh grapes, preserved ones and pure juice as souvenirs. The vineyard is open everyday without any entrance fee. Note: Cars are not allowed in the vineyard. The vineyard provides the ATV for rent for 200 baht for 20 minutes and 600 baht for 1 hour. For more information, Tel. 08 1700 4527 Bangkok Tel. 0 2261 2278-9 ext.100

Ecotourism Attractions

 * Ko Kham Underwater Park (อุทยานใต้ทะเลเกาะขาม) is an ecotourism attraction within the compound of the Royal Thai Navy in Sattahip. Take a boat from Klang Ao Pier in the area of Ao Dong Tan for 45 minutes. On Ko Kham lie white sandy beaches in a perfect natural condition. There are many Chan Pha (Dracaena loureiri Gagnep.) trees. It looks like two islands connecting each other with extending land. Snorkeling can be done at the island. However, it is not freely open for the public due to its preservation area. Those interested can contact the Coastguard Command, Sattahip District. For more information, call 0 3843 1177, 0 3843 2170. There is a one-day trip provided.

Golf

 * Plu Ta Luang Royal Thai Navy Golf Course (สนามกอล์ฟราชนาวี พลูตาหลวง) Mu 6, Plu Ta Luang, Tel. 0 3870 1891, www.geocities.com/plutaluang196, 36 Holes: open everyday. 6.00 a.m.-6.00 p.m.

Sleep

 * Ambassador City Chom Thian (แ��มบาสเดอร์ ซิตี้ จอมเทียน) 21/10 Km. 155 Sukhumvit Road,    Na Chom Thian, Tel. 0 3825 5501-40 Fax. 0 3825 5731 Bangkok Tel. 0 2266 6442-3, 0 2266 6449-52 www.ambassadorcityjomtien.com, 4,210 rooms: 1,200-65,000 baht
 * Ban Nam Mao Resort (บ้านน้ำเมา รีสอร์ท) 8/1Mu 2 Na Chom Thian, Sukhumvit Road., Tel. 0 3825 5431, 0 3825 5937, 78 rooms and 12 bungalows: 700-1,000 baht
 * Bang Sa-re Resort (บางเสร่ รีสอร์ท) 171 Mu 8 Tambon Bang Sa-re Tel. 0 3873 7152, 30 rooms: 300-700 baht
 * Bang Sa-re Villa (บางเสร่ วิลล่า) 24 Mu 2 Tambon Bang Sa-re Tel. 0 3843 7919, 24 rooms: 300 baht
 * Best Inn (เบสท์ อินน์) 18/88 Mu 2 Sukhumvit Road, Tel. 0 3843 7965, 40 rooms: 150-400 baht
 * Bon Kai Resort Sattahip (บ่อนไก่ รีสอร์ท สัตหีบ) 31/3 Soi Bon Kai, Tel. 0 3843 8120, 17 rooms: 200-300 baht
 * Chom Thian (จอมเทียน) 37/2-11 Mu 2 Sukhumvit Na Jomtien, Tel. 0 3825 0100 Bangkok Tel.        0 2641 4688 www.panaclehotels.com, 60 rooms: 2,000-3,100 baht
 * Golden Beach (โกลเด้นท์ บีช) 5/1 Mu 2 Sukhumvit Road, Km. 154 Na Chom Thian, Tel. 0 3825 5590-6 Bangkok Tel. 0 2258 8452, 30 rooms: 1,800 baht
 * Khum Det (คุ้มเดช) 472 Ban Na Road, Tel. 0 3843 7304, 25 rooms: 150-400 baht
 * King Resort (คิง รีสอร์ท) 112-113 Mu 7 Sukhumvit Road, Tel. 0 3823 7825, 120 rooms: 550-750 baht
 * Lek Charoen Resort (เล็กเจริญ รีสอร์ท) 171/60 Mu 2 Chom Thian, Tel. 0 3843 8041, 17 rooms: 250-350 baht
 * Palm Resort (ปาล์ม รีสอร์ท) 51/17 Mu 8 Sukhumvit Road, Chom Thian Tel. 0 3843 6607, 16 rooms: 350 baht
 * Pan Marine Fishing Lodge (แพนมารีน ฟิชชิ่ง ลอดจ์) 42 Mu 5 Bang Sa-re Tel. 0 3843 5021, 0 3843 6802 Fax. 0 3843 5201, 18 rooms: 800-1,700 baht
 * Pattaya Sea Sand Sun Resort (พัทยา ซี แ���นด์ ซัน รีสอร์ท) 78/4 Mu 3, Km. 163 Sukhumvit Road, Tel. 0 3842 5171, 0 3843 5163, 0 3843 6157-8, 45 rooms: 1,400 baht
 * Penacle Golden Beach Resort (พีนาเคิล โกลเด้นท์ บีช รีสอร์ท) 5/1Mu 2 Sukhumvit Road, Na Chom Thian Tel. 0 3825 5590-6 Fax. 0 3825 5597 Bangkok Tel. 0 2258 8452, 30 rooms: 1,000-2,200 baht
 * Pinnacle Chom Thian Resort and Spa (พีนาเคิล จอมเทียน รีสอร์ท แอนด์ สปา) 37/2-11 Mu 2 Sukhumvit Road, Chom Thian, Tel. 0 3825 9100, 0 3825 9111 Fax. 0 3825 9123 Bangkok Tel. 0 2641 4688-93 Fax. 0 2641 4695 www.pinnaclehotels.com, 245 rooms: 1,400-4,050 baht
 * Phlu Luang (พลูหลวง) 33/33 Mu 1, Tel. 0 3843 6177, 0 3843 6055, 29 rooms: 150-300 baht
 * Ruethai Lodge (ฤทัย ลอดจ์) 36 Mu 8 Sukhumvit Road, Tel. 0 3843 6413, 0 3843 7181, 30 rooms: 300-400 baht
 * Sakon Bungalow (สากล บังกะโล) 5/14 Mu 14 Tambon Samaesan, Tel. 0 3843 1368-9, 14 rooms: 600-1,500 baht
 * Samaesan Fishing Bridge (แสมสาร พิชชิ่ง บริดจ์) Ban Chong Samaesan, Tel. 08 1714 4955, 10 rooms: 300-600 baht
 * Samaesan Fishing Lodge (แสมสาร พิชชิ่ง ลอดจ์) Ban Chong Samaesan, Tel. 08 1211 4695, 16 rooms: 400-1,200 baht
 * Samaesan Resort (แสมสาร รีสอร์ท) 2/4 Mu 1 Ban Chong Samaesan, Tel. 0 3843 1561, 5 bungalows: 300-500 baht
 * Samaesan Villa (แสมสาร วิลล่า) 1/23 Mu 2 Ban Chong Samaesan Tel. 0 3843 7077, 12 bungalows: 1,400-2,000 baht
 * Sattahip (สัตหีบ) 496/1-2 Ban Na Road, Tel. 0 3843 6131, 17 rooms: 90-140 baht
 * Sattahip Resort (สัตหีบ รีสอร์ท) 38 Mu 2 Tel. 0 3843 7447, 35 rooms: 300-500 baht
 * Sigma Resort Jomtien (ซิกม่า รีสอร์ท จอมเทียน) 64 Mu 1 Na Jomtien, Tel. 0 3823 1226-34 Bangkok Tel. 0 2236 8223-5 www.sigmaresort.com 214 rooms: 1,400-4,500 baht
 * Nong Nooch Tropical Garden and Resort (สวนนงนุช) Km. 163 Sukhumvit Road, Tel. 0 3842 9321, 0 3823 8061, 0 3870 9358-63 Bangkok Tel. 0 2252 1786, 0 2251 2161 www.nongnoochtropicalgarden.com, 93 rooms: 980-12,640 baht (Spa, Thai Massage)
 * Suan Phai Resort (สวนไผ่ รีสอร์ท) 33 Mu 6 Tel. 0 3843 7495, 0 3843 7342, 30 rooms: 140-250 baht
 * Sunset Park (ซันเซท ปาร์ค) 99/19 Soi 2 Sukhumvit Road, Na Chom Thian Km.161.5, Tel. 0 3823 5565 Fax. 0 3823 5570, 58 rooms: 3,500-6,000 baht (Spa Thai Massage)
 * Sunset Village (ซันเซท วิลเลจ) 89/5 Mu 8 Soi Sunset 4, Chom Thian Km.162.5 Sukhumvit Road., South Pattaya, Tel. 0 3823 7940, 0 3823 7979-80 Bangkok Tel. 0 2247 6700-1www.sunsetvillage.co.th, 60 rooms: 3,200-10,400 baht
 * S. T. S. Beach Resort Jomtien (เอส ที เอส บีช รีสอร์ท จอมเทียน) 215 Km. 159 Sukhumvit Road, Na Chom Thian, Tel. 0 3823 7983-5 Fax. 0 3823 7988, 150 rooms: 1,400-5,600 baht
 * S. Y. Garden Beach (เอส. วาย. การ์เดน บีช) 5/26-29 Na Chom Thian, Tel. 0 3825 5305, 8 rooms: 850-1,250 baht
 * Tarzan Hut Resort (ทาซาน ฮัท รีสอร์ท) 59/1 Mu 1 Chom Thian Soi 4, Tel. 0 3823 1213-4, 18 bungalows: 2,400-3,200 baht
 * Wong Darin (วงศ์ดารินทร์) 469 Mu 2 Ban Na Road, Tel. 0 3843 7996, 18 rooms: 170-350 baht
 * 24 Tao Than (24 เตาถ่าน) 33/1 Mu 8 Sukhumvit Road, Tel. 0 3843 6713, 20 rooms: 150–300 baht

Eat

 * Bang Sa-re Seafood (บางเสร่ ซีฟูด) Bcach Road, Bang Sa-re, Tel. 0 3843 6856, 08 1865 8630 (Open 900 a.m-10.00 p.m. Plakapong Samrot, Yam Kason Hoi, Seafood)
 * Cha-le Seafood (ชเล ซีฟูด) 2/3 Bang Sa-re, Tel. 0 3843 5235 (Open 10.00 a.m-10.00 p.m. Seafood)
 * Chom Tha-Le Tang Ke (ชมทะเล ตังเก) 321/6 Chom Thian Beach Road, Tel. 0 3823 1070, 0 3823 1304 (Open 24 hrs. Seafood)
 * Joi Rotdee 2 Baan Amphoe Tel. 0 3823 8763 (Open 9.00 a.m-10.00 p.m. Seafood)
 * Lung Sawai (ลุงไสว) 31/2 Mu 1 Chom Thian Beach, Tel. 0 3823 1398 (Open 10.00 a.m-10.00 p.m. Seafood)
 * Mak Mai Sai Lom (แมกไม้สายลม) Sattahip, Tel. 0 3843 8555
 * Preecha (ปรีชา) 0548/33 Bcach Road., Tel. 0 3843 7977
 * Rim Hat (ริมหาด) Bang Sa-re, Tel. 0 3843 6643
 * Rim Tha-le Seafood (ริมทะเล ซีฟูด) Samaesan, Tel. 0 3843 1979
 * Ruen Tha-le (เรือนทะเล) Bang Sa-re, Tel. 0 3843 6572-3
 * Si Nuan Seafood (ศรีนวล ซีฟูด) Ban Amphoe, Tel. 0 3823 7783
 * Tha-le Seafood 1 (ทะเล ซีฟูด 1) 81 Ban Amphoe, Tel. 0 3823 7256 (Open 10.00 a.m-10.00 p.m. Seafood)
 * Tha-le Seafood 2 (ทะเล ซีฟูด 2) Ban Amphoe, Tel. 0 3823 7503

--(WT-en) globe-trotter 13:13, 2 February 2010 (EST)

title: Talk:Sattahip/Listings


text:
Talk:Satun

TAT Listings
I moved the TAT listings from the Satun (province) page, including listings of the islands in the province, to Talk:Satun/Listings for future reference. --(WT-en) globe-trotter 17:20, 5 February 2010 (EST)

title: Talk:Satun


text:
Talk:Satun (province)

Un-merging
The content in this article probably needs to be covered in 6 or 7 separate articles, one for each district, at least. As it stands it is just too much to comprehend in one go. I have suggested the sections to be (un)merged out of this page into the separate articles (and the content be removed from here). Hopefully this makes sense to someone familiar with Thailand, as I am not. Please advise if this is a bad idea and I am going to make this a bigger mess than it already is. - (WT-en) Huttite 06:30, 30 November 2009 (EST)

title: Talk:Satun (province)