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Talk:Driving in China

Pictures
A picture says a thousand words so here are 20 pictures about driving in China...my advice is don't unless you absolutely have to.... http://www.koval.net/china_driving_test.htm

Loved 'em. Thanks (WT-en) Pashley 21:44, 11 May 2006 (EDT)

 * Funny how some people are naive enough to believe whatever they see. Its probably made by people who like to mock other countries.

 * To be honest, that kind of thing does happen relatively often.

Comment
Not sure where all this is coming from, drove in the mainland for over three years and it was a pleausre once you get used to the flow of things. Definitely not more dangerous than other jurisdictions by my observations and nighttime driving is just as fun as anywhere else.

 * Exactly. The description in the article is how things appear to those coming in from outside. Once you get used to the idea of traffic rules being optional (I kid, I kid, though there is a grain of truth in that) it's easy to get around.

What a lot of nonsense from you two above. As far as you are concerned, pedestrians are not a variable in this equation. The flow of "things" you refer to is equivalent to the flow of diarrhoea down the toilet pipe. Drivers in China are all a bunch of selfish motherfvckers who regard pedestrians as worthless pieces of excrement. In Beijing there are roads that are impossible to cross unless you take chances (which usually involves running across while cars are approaching fast). I wonder how old people cross roads here. In many places you have to wait up to 5 minutes for the lights to go RED so that the fvcking cars stop and pedestrians can cross; then pedestrians only get 30 seconds to make it. I am in my late twenties and 30 seconds is not long enough to cross certain wide roads. Plus, cars turning right don't need to stop, which means that there is never a time when pedestrians can cross without fear of being hit. Zebra crossings are only painted to use up surplus paint, or just because "if foreigners have them so should we". It is clear that the people who make the traffic rules in China are the ones who drive their fat rich assess in expensive cars and don't give a fvck about pedestrians or cyclists. If things look so peachy from your car, perhaps you should try not using it for a month and then come back here to post you findings. You may be surprised.

Surely you jest. I wonder where you were driving, because my opinion on the matter sure differs with yours. I am an excellent driver in Canada with the highest discount on my insurance. However, I would not even think about driving over here. It's taxis for me.

Me too from Canada, agree with the above. I would lose my driver's license in a day or less if I'd drive in Canada the same way as the best drivers in Yiwu, Zhejiang do. I however, fell in love with Chinese people, they are very friendly and helpful except when they are driving.

Are there age limits on driving? What are the minimum and maximum driving ages in China?

Where are the sources to back up all of this?
Not trying to put down the article but it would be wise to have references to support some of the claims. I know it would be difficult to find sources (even if you did, it would be in Chinese). But because this page is probably viewed by many people especially foreigners; what is said on this page maybe taken seriously. Any personal opinions and stereotypes would be included and mis-guide the general public.

 * Sorry anonymous, but I had to revert your changes (that template doesn't work on Wikivoyage). If you check out other pages you'll see that we don't find it necessary to reference our information.  Is there something in particular that you don't agree with in the article?  If yes, please plunge forward and fix it.  -- (WT-en) Fastestdogever 01:11, 2 May 2007 (EDT)

 * Suggested reading: Project:Be fair and Project:The traveller comes first. -- (WT-en) Sapphire • (Talk) • 01:59, 2 May 2007 (EDT)

Comment
I have lived in Changsha for two years and drive an electric scooter. I found the article to be about the most accurate thing I've ever read on the Internet regarding anything about China. The article reads just like HOW IT IS here. It seemed completely familiar to me and I've forwarded the article to my friends as it describes a facet of Chinese life better than any other articles I read so far. I've no doubt there are better or more accurate articles about daily life in China, but I've yet to read them. This article even FEELS like China.

For what it's worth, having spent about six weeks in China last summer (2007), I find the characterization of driving in China is spot-on. Beijing was crazy. For example, I was in one cab where the driver, fed up with a long line of traffic, drove on the wrong side of a two-way street for about 200 yards before oncoming traffic forced him to merge back in. At intersections it would only take a half-dozen vehicles to cause a traffic jam, even in light traffic, because drivers would pull out into the intersection instead of waiting for the light to change. And waiting for a "walk" signal before crossing often seemed to be counterproductive (*especially* if there was a bus coming). Part of my trip was spent in Xi'an, which proved to be quite a bit saner, but still on the dangerous side. My advice is to try to sit in the back-seat when someone is driving you (otherwise you have to see what's going on). Or, just take the bus (dirt cheap, very frequent, and nobody messes with the buses).

If you really want an external source, this site says there are about 680 deaths each day because of car accidents in China. This is almost six times the number of people killed each day in 2005 in the United States. Car ownership per capita in China hasn't reached parity with the United States, which provides some evidence that unsafe driving behavior is very common in China.

I can testify to that sort of cab driving. I too was in a cab in Nanjing where the impatient driver decided to hop over the double-yellow line and cut in line at a red light. She was forced to merge back in by an oncoming bus that being bigger wasn't going to slow down for the cab...I almost jumped out of the passenger side window in terror. There were plenty of other crazy things...hopping up on sidewalks, turning across lanes of traffic, nearly clipping pedestrians, etc. Driving in China, at least in a larger urban area, is an activity best left to the intrepid. Surviving as a pedestrian in that melee is difficult enough as it is.

As cabs go I found the Beijing cabs utterly fearless, and Nanjing's almost as bad (luckily streets aren't big enough there to permit Beijing speeds), and Shanghai's fairly tame. Didn't go all the way down to Hong Kong, but being ex-British, I'd expect them to be excellent in comparison. I can't honestly say that I think the Chinese are bad driver's as they seem to have an uncanny ability to avoid a collision at the last possible instant--all the time, but I wouldn't say that they would inspire any peace of mind if I tried to get down the road. If I drove in a city there I can imagine being cut off by every impatient car on the street, each one barely clipping my front end.

The average driving population is by and large 'new' to driving. On the roads of the US there are a few teen drivers here and there sprinkled amongst an overwhelming number of drivers who have decades behind the wheel. Since accessibilty to car ownership is a recent phenomenon in China, almost all drivers are basically new to the wheel: a few may have ten years or so, most two/three or less. Ironically the more experienced drivers were used to having the then empty roads to themselves--bus drivers, truck drivers, cabs, drivers for party officials and party officials--and so these drivers are essentially reckless too, if maybe a little more practiced.

Compounding this is the fact that despite what most Americans think about China's rule of law, the average Chinese driver is blatantly dismissive of traffic policing and regulations--they know that they can do as they please and probably (the numbers being what they are) get away with it. If a PSB working the traffic directs a line of cars to stop or turn you can bet there will be a few who completely disregard him, even drive around him. I always marveled at that--I suppose those drivers all realize that statistically there is only a small chance if that they would get in trouble out of the number of offenders. The police never do anything about it as they're just too busy or don't care. If the average driver even knows anything about yielding right of way, traffic signals, and road markings they don't demonstrate it in their driving habits. I assume every driver just learns how to cope with all of the offensive driving by becoming more competently offensive themselves in their driving: the best defense is a good offense after all.

The general unwritten rule of thumb is that vehicles try to get away with as much as they possibly can without actually coming into contact with something. Opportunism is the name of the game. The only time one thing yields to another is when they are smaller of the two. Buses and semis can pretty much drive as they please because they are the biggest things on the street, and can do more damage to others than others can to them. Driving there analogous to walking quickly down a busy sidewalk--there aren't observed lanes or any observed rules...everybody is just doing their own thing, constantly weaving, going with the flow of the current, cutting where they can, trying to get where they're going, without a collision.

If I had to drive there I would not do so in the cities, cabs are cheap, and the cab drivers better than I could hope to be; their beautiful brand-new interstate system on the other hand seems made for long-distance driving. Oddly enough these seem very empty compared to their N American counterparts. I'd happily drive these express routes out in the rural areas. I've heard that on more secondary roads out in the country-side there will be people and livestock just milling around in the middle of the road.

The basic rule of the road
The main article says that it seems to be keep moving no matter what.

On this I disagree. It seems to me that it's anything is ok so long as it does not force an accident. You don't do something that gives the other driver no way to avoid an accident.

It's also amazing how different drivers behave when they know there is a cop about. As all traffic enforcement I have seen has been by cops on foot the drivers often don't know one is about.

However, to illustrate how bad it can be: I was crossing a street with the light. I was nearly hit by a bus. I saw the bus coming along in the left turn lane. I wasn't all that concerned about it as it was quite apparent the bus couldn't actually make a left turn at that moment, he was going to have to stop. He didn't stop--because he was making a right turn.

Is this entry becoming too moderate in tone?
Consider the following paragraph (emphasis added):

''Unless you are used to Asian traffic, Chinese drivers in general will seem very dangerous, even insane or suicidal. To a newcomer, Chinese traffic appears to have no rules or, if there are rules, it seems they are neither followed nor enforced. In reality, of course, there are some rules; they are just very different from what most travelers are used to.''

Why have so many qualifiers been added? Driving in Chinese is incredibly dangerous, not just for drivers and passengers, but for bicyclists and pedestrians too. While there have been many improvements, it used to be possible to get a license in China if you could drive a car in a straight line for 30 meters in an empty lot. Plenty of people on the road in China do not know basic traffic laws or simply do not care. Driving etiquette is generally minimal and often comes down to laying down the horn before pulling an illegal and dangerous maneuver such as driving down the sidewalk, going down the wrong way of the street, or entering a busy intersection when the light is red.

The driving situation in China does not just appear to be dangerous because of differences in cultural norms and perspectives. The driving situation in China absolutely is significantly more dangerous than the driving situation in much of the world. Couching the danger with less direct wording will not help prepare visitors for the risk they face when they travel to China.

 * I wrote that, trying to tone down warnings I thought were over the top. You're right; I went too far. I've now rewritten that paragraph. (WT-en) Pashley 00:10, 22 October 2008 (EDT)

 * The rewritten paragraph is much better. And it is accurate.  I personally never saw a car accident in China during my stay there.  Most drivers there are good at following the most important "don't hit anything and don't get hit by anything" rules.

Hi, I am in Changzhou atm, I just came up here from Macau, HK and GZ, I do agree with the photo satire, lol, it is effing crazy here, who ever is 1st, gets the right of way, errr....this does not include bikes, moped, pedestrians, but only equal sized cars....\i think hummers and full size suv's and cars with army plates are the exception to this group. Just a few hours ago we were in a cab and we were on a 6 lane road coming back to my inlaws place, the cabbie drove into oncoming traffic 2 lanes over into the wrong direction and you know whats funny, no one honked at him, they all just got out of the way because there was room to do so.

In all honesty, we have travelled quite a ways so far in the past 3 weeks and I thought I would see alot of accidents and mahem, but all I have seen so far is a little kid rolling down the street after he fell off the 3 wheeler bike with a piece of plywood roped onto the back somehow, that his mom was riding, along with grandma and about 4-5 other brother, sisters or friends all hanging onto something for the ride.

While I saw traffic signs indicating, or maybe suggesting speeds, and saying no horn, I can't recall seeing a single yield or stop sign. Maybe I just didn't recognize the format for them. But I suspect the Chinese don't have stop signs...just lights to control busy intersections. China doesn't seem to have the hierarchy of streets the US has...alleys, residential streets, feeder avenues/blvds, highways, and finally interstates. Over there it seems to be hutong alleys emptying out onto massive multilane roads; that's it.

What Rules ?
As I am considering the possiblity of driving on my next visit to China I thought I would have a look on Wiki to see what advice it could give me. Haha... I'm so glad that I'm not alone in what I think of Chinese driving !

On my previous visit my Chinese fiancee was in charge of all the travel arrangements (not least because she was the only one of us who had the faintest idea of where we were going), but she doesn't drive so we got about by airplane, bus, taxi, brother's car, office car (with office driver) etc etc or good old Shanks's Pony.

Arriving originally in Hong Kong, we had hardly got as far as Shenzhen on the bus and I was already starting to wonder what I was seeing.

By the time we had been to Guangzhou and finally arrived in Nanning I had come to the conclusion that there was actually only one "rule of the road" in China and that was that one stops at a red light.

Finally content with that, we were in a taxi going back to our hotel one day and, as we got to the junction by the hotel, both our taxi and the bus it was overtaking went clean through a red light !! That was it... I threw my hands up in the air in horror and said to my fiancee "I don't believe it ! You're all mad !"

We laugh about it, but hells teeth... even a Parisian taxi driver would do well to stay sane over there !

Perhaps the fact that an International Driving License isn't recognised in China at present is a blessing in disguise.

Guide and FTT?
This looks like a pretty extensive usable article, at least at a quick glance. Perhaps it's not very far from Guide status and FTT eligibility. Comments? --ϒpsilon (talk) 18:30, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

 * Have the issues raised at been adequately dealt with? More generally have we hit the right balance? We do not want to write something Chinese would find gratuitously insulting, but we do need some fairly strong warnings for anyone about to encounter Chinese traffic. That is tricky! Pashley (talk) 21:35, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

 * It also needs review to ensure it is up to date. For example "A 125 cc plain-jane Suzuki sells for around ¥4000 ($600 US)." was accurate when I wrote it, but that was about ten years ago. The exchange rate has changed & prices may have as well. Pashley (talk) 12:44, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

 * Well, the main purpose of the article is explaining driving in China to people from outside China. And while a local is used to the chaotic(?) traffic in the country, travellers may not be, and therefore we need to be fair and tell them. Do we have anyone around with recent travel experience of China? --ϒpsilon (talk) 12:56, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

 * User:Andrewssi2, User:Jianhui67, User:Zhuyifei1999 or User:Citobun perhaps would have something to say. How up-to-date is the article (information wise) in your opinion, and how well does it describe Chinese traffic to someone visiting China? --ϒpsilon (talk) 10:31, 14 September 2017 (UTC)

 * That is a very detailed article! It isn't actually recommended for foreigners to drive in China at all (taxis are cheap enough, public transport is well developed, and dealing with a traffic accident is almost certainly going to have you at a massive disadvantage even if you are 'clearly' not to blame). However if you really must drive, then this definitely looks like a good place to start.
 * Many long term visitors/ex-pats do use electric-bikes, and I'm surprised there isn't more to say about them. Not as challenging as driving a car, but still with some significant risk areas. --Andrewssi2 (talk) 11:40, 14 September 2017 (UTC)

 * Regarding the chaotic-ness, the situation may have been improved in some large cities due to increased regulation, but it can still be difficult to get used to for a foreign traveller. --Zhuyifei1999 (talk) 16:06, 14 September 2017 (UTC)

 * I've upgraded to guide status because there's a lot of useful information. If there's some issues here that I don't know about and are serious issues in the article as of September 2018, you can downgrade to usable. --Comment by Selfie City  (talk about my contributions ) 17:18, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

EVs
Since you live in China, is there anything we could potentially cover here about EVs, as in where you can find charging stations and the like? Given that China is the world leader in EV adoption, I think that would be appropriate. The dog2 (talk) 22:31, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

 * Possibly, but I'm not really the best person to ask about this. You see, I've never owned or driven a car (or other motorized vehicle) in my life, not even in my home country, let alone in China. In fact, I almost always get around by walking or taking public transport.
 * Of course, I'm aware that EVs have become very common here and charging stations have also become quite common. I believe, however, that the distribution of charging stations tends to vary from place to place. I recall for instance that when my friends (who own an EV) took me to a smaller city early this year, we were only able to find charging stations that had a slow charging rate and because the charging rate was slow, the amount we had to pay was also a bit more than what we would normally expect to pay in the city where I live. STW932 (talk) 02:59, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Driving in China


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Talk:Driving in France

Habits
Should there be something about French driving habits (not stopping at pedestrian crossings etc)? —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 87.89.238.127 (talk • contribs)

Tolls
How much are the tolls? —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 68.171.233.244 (talk • contribs)

 * You can expect about 0.10€/km. Some specific motorways are more expensive, especially recent ones or if they offer shortcut bridge such as Millau. Urban motorway (near major cities) are usually free of charge. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 77.195.153.130 (talk • contribs)

Navigation Systems
Is it helpful to use a navigation system when renting a car?

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Driving in France


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Talk:Driving in Los Angeles County

I figured since driving information for LA can and should be very extensive, this topic merited its own page. If it was all put under the 'Getting around' header, that might overwhelm the rest of the LA County page. - Tim

 * I'm not sure I agree on this. I don't think there's much that needs to be in Los Angeles County, anyways, and it could maybe be slimmed down with careful editing.

 * It might make sense as a travel topic, but I'm not sure. Frankly, I think it should just remain in Los Angeles County. --(WT-en) Evan 18:38, 29 Dec 2003 (PST)

I was thinking there was a great deal more that could be added - travel tips, scenic or historic drives, etc. But I don't really care where it goes. - Tim

 * Yeah, I can definitely picture it -- Driving in Australia is kinda the same way. It's definitely another way of seeing travel. I'm not sure where it fits, though.

 * My big issue is making sure that destination guides are complete -- that we don't slice and dice things into tiny pages in the mistaken belief that our goal is just to make a Web-based travel guide. Anywho, just throwing in my two cents. --(WT-en) Evan 21:02, 29 Dec 2003 (PST)

Moved
I moved this so it wasn't a sub-page anymore. We only use sub-pages for districts of cities. --(WT-en) Evan 02:01, 10 Apr 2004 (EDT)

Redirecting to Los Angeles
Would anyone have any objections to redirecting this page to Los Angeles? It seems like that was the intent a long time ago, per Votes for deletion/March 2012, and all the information here seems to have been successfully merged. PerryPlanet (talk) 15:22, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Driving in Los Angeles County


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Talk:Driving in Mexico

I'm just getting started on this (so please, edit away if you'd like!). I'm used to driving in Baja so I'm not entirely sure where the rules differ. Needs a section on etiquitte. But I've got to go to work, so...--(WT-en) Justfred 15:39, 27 September 2006 (EDT)

One thing I'm not sure of, is how I go about inserting this into articles. I've already linked this from Travel Topics where the other "driving in" articles are. I mean, I can probably figure out where to stick it, but it seems like going through every Mexico page and inserting it would be wrong. I figure I'll remove generic tips from pages where I see them, but...--(WT-en) Justfred 23:20, 27 September 2006 (EDT)

 * The appropriate place to link to this would be the Mexico article. We (have to) assume that anyone traveling somewhere in Mexico reads that article, so linking from more specific guides would be redundant. - (WT-en) Todd VerBeek 11:21, 19 May 2007 (EDT)

What's the deal with the hearing you have to go to if you get done speeding mentioned in the main article. All I can interpret this as is that you don't just get written a ticket. (WT-en) Tarcus 17:41, 12 October 2007 (EDT)

Discussion moved out of the article
I beg to differ with the above advice. It is outdated. The reason you have auto insurance is to keep from going to jail. I have had accidents and know this. What the author above is referring to is that in the case of a death or serious injury, the drivers are expected to stay until it is sorted out. For gringos, that means staying in a hotel, not jail. Your insurance adjuster is there to protect your rights and should be called immediately after an accident.

I have been helped by so many Mexicans who have stopped to help me that it seems chauvinistic to not stop and help others. In nearly 40 years of driving Mexico, I have never seen a bandito.

 * RE Advice: You Sir, obviously were not near a tourist location. 2 people I met at our resort both stopped to give assistance and both were robbed. Granted, the resort had hundreds of people, and if others stopped without issue I'm sure I would not have been notified. However, 2 I heard of in 2 weeks? Yes, it is a problem.

title: Talk:Driving in Mexico


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Talk:Driving in New Zealand

Give way to the right
Any reason this section needs to be kept? Texugo (talk) 13:27, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Not that I can see. I have removed it now. Nurg (talk) 19:28, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

Mile conversions
I dimly recall there having been km Templates and the likes. They appear to have been removed. Should some of them judiciously be reinserted at strategic locations? Hobbitschuster (talk) 17:11, 6 August 2018 (UTC)

Banner
I think we can do a bit better for a banner here. As NZ is mostly known for its mountain scenery, I think we should try and use a banner that has some mountain scenery. Unfortunately, there were few that could perfectly fit our 7:1 ratio, but here's what I've cropped. -- SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 11:50, 2 May 2022 (UTC)

 * 1, 2, 0. Ikan Kekek (talk) 15:14, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Definitely 1. How could we consider anything else? Ground Zero (talk) 16:04, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
 * 0=, 1=, 2. The long bridges with picket fences are iconic of New Zealand, as shown in 0. However 0 can be reused on Renting a motorhome in New Zealand. 1 will work well. Ideally I would have liked to have an image like we used when this was on the main page [[file:DrivingNZBanner2.jpg|75px]], but none of the kiwi sign images work well as a 7:1 crop - I added a few more of my own to the category but not quite. AlasdairW (talk) 20:41, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I actually tried looking for a kiwi sign, but yeah, unfortunately none fit our 7:1 ratio, though I do think 0 superior to the banner used in Renting a motorhome in New Zealand. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 10:16, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Either 1 or 2. Nurg (talk) 04:57, 4 May 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅ -- SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 07:23, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I eventually found good use for banner 2 on Milford Road. -- SHB2000  (talk | contribs | meta) 22:27, 17 February 2024 (UTC)

Driving (i.e. speed camera) apps
What apps do NZ drivers use to warn each other about speed cameras? It's certainly not TomTom's free app - I think that pinged once for a rare fixed speed camera while there, although I passed plenty of temporary speed checks. Lovingboth (talk) 23:10, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

 * Maybe Waze? It's been a while since I've been to NZ, though. SHB2000  (talk | contribs | meta) 04:47, 14 April 2023 (UTC)

 * Looking, there is a small number of reports on Waze about things like road closures, but they are often be months old (yes, all the damage from the recent cyclone hasn't been fixed, but..) and I can't spot any speed camera ones. So it clearly has some NZ users, but it doesn't look like very many. Lovingboth (talk) 10:39, 14 April 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Driving in New Zealand


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Talk:Driving in Sweden

Separate article needed?
Shouldn't this information be contained in Sweden rather than in a seperate article? -- (WT-en) Andrew H. (Sapphire) 16:04, 30 November 2006 (EST)

Implicit speed limits or not
Driving in Sweden no says "Some signs also indicate the speed limit." and lists them, but goes on saying "... is always posted together with a sign indicating the speed limit".

So isn't it enough to note the speed limit sign instead of memorizing the implied limits? If the two conflict, as I suppose they sometimes do, you have to note the speed limit sign anyway.

--LPfi (talk) 20:07, 9 July 2020 (UTC)

Parking and plates
It seems the issue with parking apps has been resolved, as the supreme court ruled that not knowing how to type in the numbers is not the driver's fault. I suppose the police has stopped harassing drivers after this (see the linked article – and update to the previously linked one), but I'd like to hear from somebody in the know, as we shouldn't send our readers to legal disputes. –LPfi (talk) 22:15, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

A tractors
We currently say that drivers in Sweden should learn how to interact with the A tractors. It would be more useful to say how you should interact with them. What issues are there? I suppose that them driving slower than the general traffic is a risk factor, are there other ones? Anything special you need to do or be aware of when overtaking or in other situations? –LPfi (talk) 09:11, 11 November 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Driving in Sweden


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Talk:Drogheda

Newgrange is definitely NOT the same as Drogheda, it isn't even in the same county. Perhaps the content for Newgrange needs to be moved from here to Newgrange in it's own right. Thanks.

title: Talk:Drogheda


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Talk:Drugs

Hmmm, I'm concerned about the "advice by country" section -- shouldn't that all go in the country articles? (WT-en) Maj 16:53, 25 July 2006 (EDT)

 * Definitely. (WT-en) Ricardo (Rmx) 17:05, 25 July 2006 (EDT)

 * Yeah, we might need to capture this somewhere in the MoS. We really don't want to have travel topics that are just slicing data from country destination guides in a different way... do we? --(WT-en) Evan 17:27, 25 July 2006 (EDT)
 * Not to go way off on a tangent *but* I can toally see having "slices" stacked in new and interesting ways, but I think it should be an automagical process. Anyway, I said more about this at Project:Article templates.

title: Talk:Drugs


text:
Talk:Drumheller

Useable?
Do you think this article's ready for USEABLE status? (WT-en) Edmontonenthusiast 01:05, 26 October 2008 (EDT)

title: Talk:Drumheller


text:
Talk:Dubai

Translation
Here's a handy link to an English translation of the Japanese Wikivoyage article which seems to have a lot of content:

 * Dubai

Here's the Systranbox version as well:
 * Dubai

Note: Be careful not to edit the babelfished version by mistake!

 * This is absolutely hilarious! "11.1 you stay -- Flophouse!" (WT-en) Jpatokal 21:54, 15 Feb 2006 (EST)

 * Indeed! I love this one:  "Walking:  If some movement which is while blocking it is possible also to turn with walking. However, because it is very hot country, you pay attention to the hear stroke and the like. You take the moisture mainly, overstrain excessively and walk and in order not to turn, (above thinking, you consume the physical strength)." 12.27.44.149 22:21, 11 April 2006 (EDT)

Useful site for info
The above is not a government site! Please see http://www.dubai.ae/portal/en.portal?dea_visitors,dae_visitors_accommodations,0,&_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=package -- which is run by the Dubai Government.

Erm
Surely something about the draconian drug laws that can lead to a jail sentence even if you have a small speck of cannabis on your shoe or have eaten a poppyseed bagel are worth pointing out here. 128.227.179.138 09:32, 29 February 2008 (EST)

A while back, I added a fairly detailed description of several cases where travelers were imprisoned for those kinds of "crimes" and how human rights groups have tried to intervene and warn travelers who plan to fly into Dubai, but someone deleted what I wrote almost immediately. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 65.81.165.32 (talk • contribs) 08:46, 2008 July 30
 * Hi, welcoome to Wikivoyage, both of you! I've never been to Dubai, so I'm glad to see people with specific knowledge thinking about contributing it. It's certainly fine to add information about drug enforcement. My suggestion is to make sure that it's factual not advocacy, and informative not sloppy.  Some people put in out-of-place strangeness like this, which most experienced WT editors would revert right away.  Offhand, "a small speck of cannabis on your shoe or have eaten a poppyseed bagel" sounds a bit anecdotal, and "human rights groups have tried to intervene" sounds like advocacy. So take some care to craft something useful and good. I look forward to seeing your contributions! (WT-en) JimDeLaHunt 00:57, 31 July 2008 (EDT)

Jpatokal
Sorry, (WT-en) Jpatokal but I think your wrong. What part of "Roller Coaster" does not make it clear that this is not a "Merry-Go_Round" ? What makes you think the driver will not stop and give you a break if you do start feeling bad ? (Try that on a roller coaster !) And if you do insist on keeping this "Warning", can you at least word it so it does not sound like a five year old whining ? (WT-en) Woodstock 09:45, 27 March 2008 (EDT)

 * 'Twasn't my wording, but I've edited it. And seriously, it wouldn't have occurred to me that people get car-sick from dune bashing. Killed, mangled, or just shaken up, yes, but not nauseous... (WT-en) Jpatokal 12:25, 27 March 2008 (EDT)

Kissing
Nothing here on how it's illegal to kiss in public, surely this is extremely important for someone traveling to the state? Just wondering if there's any reason it's not detailed.

 * Please go ahead and add this warning. It probably belongs at United Arab Emirates, and can be referenced from Dubai. --(WT-en) Burmesedays 10:41, 14 March 2010 (EDT)

As a Dubai resident I would like to clarify - kissing is not "illegal" but necking is! There is a difference and I think it is important to note this! --(WT-en) Shafeeq

Districts
Dubai is actually divided into districts or municipalities. Will it be helpful if I add the list of districts? --(WT-en) SnappyHip 14:57, 24 April 2010 (GST)

 * Yes. I would suggest starting an Orientation sub-section of Understand and putting the information there.--(WT-en) Burmesedays 02:15, 25 April 2010 (EDT)

about the warning note.
The warning note seems to be inappropriate in the article. The article is talking about a city/emirate of UAE. However, the warning note seems to imply the UAE as a whole. I was thinking of moving that warning note from this article to the United Arab Emirates article.--(WT-en) Dark Paladin X 17:00, 4 May 2010 (EDT)

xl
I have noticed the following paragraph:

 * Recreational drug use and distribution is a serious criminal offence, even when in the company of the person consuming the material. A few grammes can lead to a prison sentence of several years, while production and distribution could land yourself in front of the firing squad. Passenger baggage is screened quite thoroughly when entering Dubai. Even prescription drugs or ones that you bought over the counter in your country can lead to a prison sentence. A list of banned medication can be found, with an official UAE list of controlled drugs found at.

The links appears to be helpful but, I am in doubt if they are in accordance with our external link policy, any thoughts?, --(WT-en) ClausHansen 14:56, 31 July 2010 (EDT)

 * I'd say definitely keep moh.gov.ae, since it's the official page (like we do keep links to ministries of foreign affairs for full explanations on visa issues). I'm not sure about the other one but since it seems very useful and is not explicitly listed at Xl, I'd say (borderline) keep it as well. And the list of fairtrials.net looked more user-friendly to me at first glance. I wouldn't mind removing it in order not to set a precedent for external links, though. – (WT-en) Vidimian 15:22, 31 July 2010 (EDT)

Districts 2.0
Mates, i started the districtification of Dubai. It's a first draft and i'm grateful for feedback. Maybe Jebel Ali justifies an addtional article due to its remoteness and the international district is not perfect either. User:Saqib has some local knowledge, so he started to discuss with me. I move this discussion to the article talk page, so any other interested user understands, what we are up to. jan (talk) 10:03, 22 April 2013 (UTC)
 * What about four districts : Deira, east Dubai, west Dubai and Bur Dubai? or lets districtify it into N.E.S.W.. --Saqib (talk) 18:17, 22 April 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not a big fan of the American NESW system and would like to keep it local as everybody knows Deira, Jumeirah, Bur Dubai, Marina and Jebel Ali. How about if we give up international city and just take the first four? I like the diversity of Dubai but the traveller needs orientation. Do you think there is enough input for the Jebel ali region or do we just some it up in a dubai desert and southern region? jan (talk) 20:14, 22 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Saqib: I have limited the districts now to four. Deira, Bur Dubai, Jumeirah (incl. Marina, Emirates hills + Mall of the Emirates) and Jebel Ali. I hope that this is fair. What do you think? jan (talk) 12:44, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
 * What about the eastern and southern part of the city? Where the listings of these region will goes? Frankly speaking jan, I'm satisfied with Deira and Bur Dubai districts but not with the rest. Btw, jan, do you really think we should districtify Dubai? To me, it seem bit difficult to create a comprehensive districts hierarchy for Dubai, which has no gaps, no overlaps. --Saqib (talk) 16:55, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Saqib, everything south of Jumeirah to the Abu Dhabi border belongs to Jebel Ali and the east to Bur Dubai. I know that this is not perfect but we will need districts as people definitely divide between Deira, Jumeirah and Jebel Ali. south and east is either industrial or residents so not so interesting for travellers. If you have a better idea for the east, please feel free. I know my interpretation of Bur Dubai is wide but what else? jan (talk) 08:17, 24 April 2013 (UTC)
 * The airport is large and important enough to get its own article (per Airport Expedition) so maybe it could be mentioned as a "district" as well? Anyways, I think you who are familiar enough with Dubai to districtify it have some additional first hand information about DXB to add to its article? Ypsilon (talk) 16:41, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

@Ypsilon, DXB is pretty big and i'm always happy to get out of it as fast as possible;) I would not object an article for DXB but i wouldn't do it at the moment. Currently the soft opening for the new airport https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubai_World_Central_-_Al_Maktoum_International_Airport started. This shift will be major and i would suggest we wait until early 2014 for the new one to start an article on how to reflect this. Traffic flows between the airports and shift of airlines will change within the next 3-6 months so better wait until decisions are made. This will reduce confusion. Regards, jan (talk) 09:07, 26 April 2013 (UTC)
 * I personally don't think there will a big change in traffic flows and shifting of airlines will be seen within next year. Perhaps new airport will take a bit long time to replace the current DXB airport. Further, new airport has capacity for up to seven million passengers a year according to sources whereas DXB airport annual passenger capacity is around 75 million. --Saqib (talk) 10:16, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

The article seems now to have four sub articles for districts so I guess it is districtified, right? Or is there something that still needs to be done? As for now the links to those articles are listed in a subsection of Understand and there is no district map, which is surprising as one of our best map makers knows the city. ϒpsilon (talk) 16:45, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi Ypsilon, i still thinks districtification is not yet completed. --Saqib (talk) 17:08, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
 * OK, I was just wondering. Sadly jan seems to be gone for good and I myself don't really know anything about Dubai. I made a request for comment, because Dubai is after all an important destination. ϒpsilon (talk) 17:26, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
 * There is a big need to define where we are going to place the boundary between Bur Dubai and Jumeirah. I moved some material to district articles, but it is difficult when one cannot tell from the article where Bur Dubai ends and where Jumeirah starts. Nurg (talk) 19:16, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I would suggest the boundary to be Al Dhiyafa Rd (or D 73 rd). Localities situated in East to the road belongs to Bur Dubai and West to Jumeirah. --Saqib (talk) 19:32, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Highway D73 is very visible on a map (it seems to have the name 2nd of December Street too) so I think it would make a quite good boundary between the districts. ϒpsilon (talk) 11:13, 10 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes correct, the name was changed to 2nd of December St two years back but still it is popularly known as Al Dhiyafa Rd. --Saqib (talk) 11:23, 10 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Problem. Things like Burj Khalifa, Dubai Mall, Emirates Towers Boulevard are in the Dubai/Bur Dubai article but are south-west of D 73. Should they be moved to Dubai/Jumeirah or do we need to reconsider using D 73 as the boundary? Nurg (talk) 06:26, 21 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi, thanks for working on the article lately, yes the listings surely needs to be moved. --Saqib (talk) 12:00, 21 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Should all the Festival City stuff go into the Deira article? Nurg (talk) 10:51, 23 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes! --Saqib (talk) 11:25, 23 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I think Dubai Outlet Mall should be moved to one of the district articles but I don't know which one. Nurg (talk) 22:42, 23 November 2013 (UTC)
 * This is located in the suburbs of Dubai and I think we need to create a more district article and this listing should be moved there but I'm not sure what to name it. --Saqib (talk) 10:29, 24 November 2013 (UTC)
 * What to name a new district? 1. Would the new district coincide with one or two official, "real" districts? Then use their name. 2. Otherwise, where is the district in relation to the central part of Dubai? East, West, Northeast, Southwest..? 3. On the other hand if it is rather close to the city center and there are other districts further East, West etc., call it "Central East", "Central Southwest" or "Inner East", "Inner whatever" etc. like they have done it in the Sydney district division. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:37, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Perhaps all the neighbourhoods in suburb could be incorporated into a new district article and name it "Emirates Rd". Btw, pinged didn't worked as I got no notification. --Saqib (talk) 19:59, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
 * The name sounds good (but keep in mind that I haven't ever been to Dubai). If there are a couple of sights, eating and drinking places and hotels then go ahead and create it. It's the first time I used the ping template, and as it is doesn't function, it was probably the last time too :P. ϒpsilon (talk) 20:09, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not aware of eat, drink and sleep establishments in the suburbs as I'm mostly based in downtown but yes there're attractions and we should have an article which could incorporate everything located in suburbs. --Saqib (talk) 20:21, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, as I said when we discussed the Karachi districts, no matter where you are in the world suburbs aren't very exciting. Here I was tempted to just write that you can go and spend half of your day in a hardware store looking at cement and tools, the rest at a furniture store and eat a hamburger at McDonalds's afterwards and look at the traffic at highway 170 in the afternoon rush hour but forced myself to find something that would be of serious interest for visitors. ϒpsilon (talk) 20:38, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Where do we place the boundary between the Emirates Road district and the other districts? Nurg (talk) 02:26, 19 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I can't say where exactly we should place the boundary yet but anything in the suburbs should be places in Emirates Rd article. --Saqib (talk) 10:35, 19 January 2014 (UTC)

I have created a dynamic map taking the input from your discussion above into account. Please have a look and give feedback, if any. --Renek78 (talk) 21:59, 18 July 2017 (UTC)

Banner
Dubai is a pleasure to make a banner for due to it's beautiful skyline. Below are two variations I was thinking of. Any thoughts or preferences, or further ideas? Maybe one could be used for Dubai, and the other for one of the districts.

Thoughts? James A ▪ talk 11:19, 7 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Second one seems fine to me. --Saqib (talk) 11:22, 7 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree, the first one lacks Burj Khalifa. Jjtkk (talk) 11:35, 7 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I have polished the (second) banner and uploaded a new version: now it doesn't have blown highlights. Armigo (talk) 01:45, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Good work, Armigo. Do you live in Dubai, by any chance? --Saqib (talk) 12:36, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I do not, but I visited the city a couple of years ago and it truly is a very banner-compatible place! :) Armigo (talk) 22:54, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree that the second one is best. The first one is just a view of JBR and the Marina. The second is a far larger view of the city. (talk) 13:35, 6 March 2013 (PST)

Dubayy
What is the significance of "Dubayy" in the first sentence? Do we really need it? Nurg (talk) 05:38, 1 February 2014 (UTC)
 * No significance. It is just a pronunciation. --Saqib (talk) 09:17, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

Get around - by tout?
I noticed Saqib removed the contributions of an anonymous tout who keeps adding links to their yacht and cruise services - they've been adding this a couple of times since September at least. Is it something we should put on a spam black list? (The Spam filter policy is confusing and the spam lists can be edited just by admins, not that I'd start editing such lists it without asking first.) ϒpsilon (talk) 16:17, 22 March 2014 (UTC)
 * You're right. Few unregistered contributors has added many times a link to their yacht company since last year and I even once thought of adding the name of that yacht companies to spam black list but I was not sure whether that would be appropriate. --Saqib (talk) 17:49, 22 March 2014 (UTC)
 * And again, and again... Looks like Wikivoyage is very popular among Dubai's yacht touts. ϒpsilon (talk) 14:58, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

NY Times on Dubai laws
Holding Hands, Drinking Wine and Other Ways to Go to Jail in Dubai. Checking the page, it looks like we already cover this under Dubai. Pashley (talk) 20:52, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 08:54, 28 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Burj-Al-Arab-inside-fountains-at-main-entrance.JPG

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 04:25, 19 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Burj-Al-Arab-inside-fountains-at-main-entrance.JPG

 * No FOP in the UAE. Do we want this? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 05:45, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Islamic laws
In Islamic laws we say:
 * Exercise caution and common sense when visiting, and make sure you are aware of all their laws or expect severe consequences that could seriously ruin your visit.

Shouldn't we advice on all laws one should know about not to get one's visit ruined? "A simple kiss" in public, alcohol and keeping your temper are mentioned, and one should assume that any indecent or provoking behaviour might be covered by some law. But are there other surprising things? The most important covered, we could have some more general statement on things needing caution, but we shouldn't advice the travellers to have a semester or several on law before visiting. –LPfi (talk) 10:02, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dubai


text:
Talk:Dublin

Untitled
It is on a par with many bigger European cities in terms of its vibrancy... I've seen reports that Salamanca and Trieste both vibrate at a much higher frequency, and that Tblisi is somewhere in the gigahertz range (although it's arguably Asian rather than European). --(WT-en) Evan 14:38, 22 Jan 2005 (EST) P.S. Joke!

 * Which is called Salamanca (city) or Salamanca (province)?. Do we have to use parenthesis, It looks ugly in URL's -- (WT-en) elgaard 13:53, 23 Jan 2005 (EST)

Trains
The part in the article discussing the rail interconnecter proposed is a bit off the mark - it's not supposed to be between Heuston and Connolly stations, it's supposed to connect Heuston to the Northern line, bypassing Connolly altogether. This would permit dircect Cork to Belfast services, but Galway to Wexford would require the train to switch directions on exiting the tunnel, a bit awkward. This section is a bit misleading, so it should probably be removed. So I've done it. 193.120.116.177 18:00, 6 January 2008 (EST)

Buses
Hmm, the article is really against using the normal buses back from the airport. Did it today and they were fine, a bus came straight away, cost 1.80 euros, and took around 40 minutes to get into the city. Unless you're in a major rush it seems like the best option. 213.79.46.170 16:51, 6 July 2006 (EDT)

Parks!
Well, the Phoenix park certainly can't be the second largest city park in the world? It's only 1.700 acres or something. According to this list, http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0933260.html, there are 30+ parks in the US alone that are bigger.

 * To the best of my knowledge, it should be "2nd biggest in Europe" (One in Birmingham is supposed to be bigger). I'll change it. 86.42.237.27 16:38, 15 March 2007 (EDT)

CotW
In the Project:Collaboration_of_the_week note by Tim, he mentions the need for a map and for more photos. I have a huge collection of Creative Commons photos of Dublin on flickr, and at home -- I just need some guidance as to what to contribute. Also, I'd be willing to make a map. Is there an example on Wikivoyage of an ideal city map? (WT-en) WillB 03:34, 19 October 2007 (EDT)
 * As for map-making, have a look at our How to make a map article.(WT-en) Texugo 04:19, 19 October 2007 (EDT)

Postal codes?
Is that what those are--the Dublin1, Dublin 2, Dublin 4, etc.? Are those useful to the traveler? (WT-en) OldPine 19:55, 20 October 2007 (EDT)

In general even numbers are southside Dublin and odd numbers are Northside, there are one or two exceptions I think, is it worthwhile mentioning this?

 * Those are postal districts rather than postal codes, and as previously noted they can usually at least give an indication of which side of the river it is. In 2015 Ireland introduced a genuine postal code system, “Eircodes”, but I would say that they are not helpful to tourists as they are unique to every address - e.g. D02 VR94 is The Porterhouse mentioned elsewhere in the article, the “D02” indicates it’s in Dublin 2, but the last 4 characters can be numbers or letters in any order. It’s only in Dublin that you can even deduce what the town is from the Eircode (D), the Porterhouse in Bray is A98 H6Y2. — Arwel Parry (talk) 23:20, 27 December 2017 (UTC)

Zozimus Haunted Tours
I think the link is dead, I didnt want to edit it, not sure what the policy is on link removal!

Style for directions
I'm new to Wikivoyage and I'm wondering what the style is for north, south, east, west. Is the first letter upper case or lower case? Obviously, it's upper case if it's at the start of sentence. Thanks in advance for your help!

--Liz Westover

 * I don't think there's a firm policy on this, but I'd go with lower case. (WT-en) Jpatokal 01:16, 12 June 2008 (EDT)

 * Just go with standard English rules. It is lower case if you're talking about a direction ("go north three blocks") but capitalized if talking about a region ("in the South you can find great seafood"), but not when just describing an area ("we are staying north of Dublin").

Cycling in Dublin
"Dublin has a large student population and is relatively cycle-friendly" Dublin clearly has a large student population. But cycling-friendly!!! Relative to what? The Antartic? No seriously - at best you can say that Dublin has an average policy towards cyclists but there are hundreds of cities worldwide with much better infrastructure than Dublin. Only this year did Dublin Corporation recruit someone to overlook the development of cycling in Dublin (Cycling Officer - advertised some months back). I have been cycling in Dublin for 15 years and have often been accosted by drivers. I have seen people, driving in the opposite direction, roll down their windows to shout abuse. Its amazing. The vast majority of cycling infrastructure are narrow on-road cycling lanes. There are very few safe cycling-exclusive paths (along the Dodder - near Miltown is about the best of it). Cyclists are at best tolerated, but cycling in Dublin is seen as a leisure activity and not as a means of transport. Irish people are friendly, ine general, but they are not particularily friendly to cyclists.

Offensive sentence about safety and tracksuits
"Young people wearing tracksuits generally are troublemakers who prowl the city at all times."

This statement needs to be removed quickly. I think it over generalises to the point of being downright ignorant. Overt working class youth style should not be identified with overall safety issues in Dublin. I think large groups of youths in Dublin should warrant increased vigilance but saying what sort of clothes the said troublemakers will be wearing is the result of a class biased mind. Why don't we provide a less stupid and ignorant face for potential visitors to Dublin?

 * I think you may be missing the realities of what thugs (and thug-wannabees) are like. They often choose certain clothing to signal to the world that they're troublemakers (usually as a way to fit in and gain status with their peer group, or to feel powerful by intimidating others).  In some places it's wearing your pants down around your knees.  In some places it's wearing certain color baseball caps with the store's stickers still on them.  If in Dublin the de facto thug uniform is the tracksuit, I don't see why this commentary wouldn't be fair and relevant.  The issue should be whether it the tracksuit in Dublin is just working class youth style, or if it actually is more associated with a smaller sub-culture that travelers should be weary of.

British isles
Ireland isn't in the British isles, as the navigation suggests.

Taxis
Reading the brief mention of Taxis in the article would lead me to believe that Taxis in Dublin are an inexpensive way to get around. In my own experience (living in Dublin for most of my life), I've found them to be some of the most expensive Taxis in the world, far more expensive than even places like New York & Tokyo. It would be great to see some examples of distances/prices (say Airport to City Centre etc.) to show the real expense. The only experience I have with them these days is from the Airport to home and this costs anywhere between €20-€25 for a 9km journey!

 * Please amend the article as you see fit. --(WT-en) Burmesedays 08:40, 6 December 2009 (EST)

Dublin 1 or D1
Someone changed all instances of D1, D2, etc. to "Dublin 1," "Dublin 2," etc. It strikes me as repetitive to have "Dublin" named in virtually every listing. Would anyone mind if I change this back? Also, at least when used in listings, it is our policy to abbreviate words like "street" and "road." This is harder to fix, though. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 15:30, 17 March 2010 (EDT)

 * I'd say we should obviously keep Dublin 1 etc. as more readable. However, I have lost arguments along these lines before — e.g. arguing for three-letter day-of-the-week abbreviations — so others may disagree. Pashley (talk) 16:44, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

 * I agree. Unless we're going to take the unusual step of having a key to abbreviations, D1 D2, etc. are going to be unintelligible to most and people will not find it in Dublin. Abbreviations should not be used where they are too strange or ambiguous. I'm willing to join you in a crusade for the introduction of Mo, Tu, We, Th, Fr, Sa, Su, but not to extend that 50% to Mon, Tue, Wed, Thu, Fri, Sat, Sun. --118.93nzp (talk) 16:55, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

How to get a bus map?
The page recommends getting a map from Dublin Bus, but it doesn't say how. I can't find one online anywhere, and the Wikipedia article on Dublin Bus seems to think there isn't a paper one, either? -- Beland (talk) 00:39, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

Usable
I just demoted this article from Guide to Usable. The most obvious Mos issues are the lack of listings in the "Buy" section and the need to substitute larger photos of individual sights for the montage at the top of the page. Ikan Kekek (talk) 14:40, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

Remove some sleep entries?
There are several sleep entries that are not actually in Dublin. e.g. The Ritz Carleton is "30 minutes from Dublin" and a couple of others have addresses the include "County ...". These might be perfectly reasonable if they are near the airport or on a transport line that makes going downtown easy. Otherwise, I suspect they should be deleted, but someone who knows the city should make that call. Pashley (talk) 16:36, 31 January 2014 (UTC)
 * You're right. --118.93nzp (talk) 16:39, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

Districts?
The article is quite large and, at least to me, somewhat confusing. Should it be split up into districts? Pashley (talk) 02:08, 6 February 2014 (UTC)
 * It would then face the same problems of many of our districtified cities: People continually writing listings in the main city-wide article instead of the district articles, readers not even realising they need/bothering to go to the city centre article to find out where to eat, drink, sleep, sightsee, etc and skeleton articles that are a very bad example of our travel guide for the outer district articles. My attitude is always the same when this is proposed: demonstrate that you can flesh out the district articles first (perhaps in user space) and before the city article is chopped about. --118.93nzp (talk) 02:21, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

Cabinteely
Should Cabinteely be a separate article or the listing merged into Dublin? --Traveler100 (talk) 19:57, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

Style tag in Eat section
There is a tag  in the Eat section. Could anyone or the person who put it there be more specific as to what needs to be changed/improved? Thanks. 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm (probably) not the person who's added it, but the one problem I see with the Eat section is the subheadings. Eateries should be grouped according to their price level into Budget, Mid-range and Splurge. ϒpsilon (talk) 14:11, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * I removed the style tag after grouping the restaurants into the mentioned price level sections. Feel free to add the style tag back if this wasn't the only problem with the eat section. Also feel free to rearrange specific listings if you think they belong to a different price group. —The preceding comment was added by Dowetz (talk • contribs) 8 July 2015 (UTC)

Restaurants
These two listings were mentioned in the eat section text, but they don't provide a lot of information. If you know more about them, please add them back to the main page: —The preceding comment was added by Dowetz (talk • contribs) 8 July 2015 (UTC)

Great photo of Newman University
This is a Featured photo I find interesting to look at, but there's no listing for the university, so I'm not sure whether to add it or not. Should there be a listing for the university, or for its church? If you think so, go ahead and add it and this photo. If not, just enjoy looking at the image here.

Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:58, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Dublin Airport
Discussion swept in from the Pub

Currently Dublin Airport redirects to Dublin. Should we create a dedicated article? Hobbitschuster (talk) 20:03, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

 * Seems like something to discuss at Wikivoyage talk:Airport Expedition. But since you brought it up here, make your case. Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:36, 8 June 2019 (UTC)
 * it's got over thirty million pax p.a. It is the hub of a major network carrier (Aer Lingus) with a network on both sides of the pond and it is one of only two European airports with U.S. Border preclearance Hobbitschuster (talk) 21:06, 8 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Is it also complex and not self-explanatory? Ikan Kekek (talk) 01:01, 9 June 2019 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure Hobbitschuster (talk) 13:38, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
 * It's surely as complex as, or more complex than, Stansted, what with having two terminals and the U.S. border thingy. But then again, it's been argued that STN doesn't deserve its own article either. As I've said before, we have few editors with any knowledge of Ireland on Wikivoyage, to drive article development forward or offer an informed opinion on matters such as this.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 08:16, 13 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Stansted is a kind of borderline case. I didn't think at the time that an article was started about it that it was urgent to start an article about it, but its distance from London and the fact that at the time, passengers taking early flights often chose to sleep the night at the airport made an article about it useful, and it is quite a high-traffic airport. On the face of it, it sounds like it's reasonable for there to be an article about Dublin Airport if someone is motivated to start one, but whether it's necessary or not hasn't been established. Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:28, 13 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Dublin Airport is in the nearby town of Swords, but is kind-of part of the capital in a way that Stansted is not part of London. I thought to resolve this by creating subsections in both destinations, based on whether you'd travel via the airport to reach a particular hotel say, or via Dublin city centre or via Swords. That aside, the airport is big but straightforward, and the need-to-know stuff fits into a standard "Get in" without swamping the page. I could rattle off a long list of Ireland pages that badly need overhaul and the rest of youse could no doubt do similar, but the airport wouldn't feature on mine. Grahamsands (talk) 20:32, 18 June 2019 (UTC)

UCD campus
Views please on what best to do about Bellfield, the UCD campus in the south of the city. It earns its page on the basis of being a “city within a city” – it’s large, but not dramatically larger than say U of Limerick at Castletroy or U of Ulster at Coleraine. The page feels touty, and obviously we should only mention facilities available to the general public, and can’t comment on the academic or student-social qualities. Grahamsands (talk) 08:40, 1 October 2021 (UTC)
 * The page has been moved to Booterstown. Please help by trimming the university stuff and adding more local info about the coastal area. AlasdairW (talk) 22:16, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Districts again?
This is a fine article, but Dublin is large and important enough to be districtified. Can we make a simple districtification? /Yvwv (talk) 12:44, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Accommodation Prices
The accommodation prices need to be updated as the prices these days are far higher and some of the places are closed. I've updated the hostels in Dublin. 78.16.165.70 19:40, 17 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the updates! Wikivoyage is entirely written by volunteers, so any contributions you make will help travellers. Unfortunately, we do not have paid staff who can respond to specific requests. When you update a price, please change the date on the entry also so that readers know how current it is. Ground Zero (talk) 20:14, 17 June 2023 (UTC)

Additional Photo to the Drinks Section.
@Ground Zero

@AlasdairW

As on the my UserTalk page, I'm proposing adding a this photo to the `Drinks` heading, in addition to the current photo that persists there.

LMK if there's an objection to this. Davekern (talk) 19:09, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * as said before, Image policy and Don't tout apply. Speaking just for myself, only mega iconic spots like Liverpool's Cavern Club would qualify as the exceptions allowed. Let's hear other opinions. Ibaman (talk) 20:18, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * "Exceptions include images that are meant to be illustrative of the type of business establishment in a certain region"
 * Only Liverpool's Cavern Club would qualify under this? That's super specific - isn't it, @Ibaman? I'm pretty sure you're reading this in a way too narrow definition.
 * I wouldn't class the Cavern Club as an illustrative type of business establishment specific to the Liverpool region.
 * An Irish pub in Dublin, Ireland - would generally fall under a illustrative of the type of business establishment in a certain region, similar to something like an Izakaya in Tokyo, or a Fish & Chip shop in Brighton. Davekern (talk) 20:35, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * For all avoidance of doubt @Ibaman, there are two exceptions to the Image policy
 * images that are meant to be illustrative of the type of business establishment in a certain region OR
 * exceptionally famous establishments
 * An Irish Pub, located in Ireland, would be illustrative of the type of business establishment in a certain region.
 * Liverpool's The Cavern Club would fall under the exceptionally famous establishments.
 * I don't understand how you came to the conclusion that this means that "only mega iconic spots like Liverpool's Cavern Club would qualify as the exceptions allowed". as it clearly doesn't come close to being an illustrative of the type of business establishment in a certain region. Davekern (talk) 21:11, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I think that we could have another pub photo in the article, but as we already have one it should be an informative photo of a typical pub, a very well known establishment or one with historic interest (including a pub which has been trading for over 100 years). For an informative photo, I have a slight preference for a view inside a pub. For an iconic photo, we might add a photo of a certain brewery.
 * The Ferryman photo tells me that I can find a pub between two office blocks, next a main road - is this the message that you want? AlasdairW (talk) 21:54, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Frankly, yes - @AlasdairW
 * The Dublin Docklands was an area of historic deprivation - and over the last 3 decades has undergone major urbanization.
 * The Ferryman, does well do showcase Traditional Dublin vs contemporary Urban Dublin along the Dublin Quay.
 * It gets away from the Stereotypical Twee-Diddley-Eye image of Dublin's Pub that is Temple Bar, and contrasts that pretty well. Davekern (talk) 22:34, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Just to clarify, it's not a "conclusion", it's an "opinion", believe me, I've been around this travel guide long enough to spot from a mile away every little trick that business owners might devise to get "their" establisment's picture, and theirs only, up and running on a given page. I'm not saying it's your case, though. Ibaman (talk) 12:43, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
 * FWIW, Opinion is a synonym of Conclusion. Davekern (talk) 11:48, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Shades of meaning separate them. A person can have a preliminary opinion about something without having reached a firm conclusion, and since I believe you're a native English speaker, I expect that you'll agree with me, but that expectation is not a conclusion, either. Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:51, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
 * and about the subject under discussion, as an admin I like our pages clean and tight and fast to load and easy to read on a phone screen and devoid of any intentional or subliminal or random promotion of specific businesses. In this respect I am and has always been really strict enforcing Don't tout and Image policy. A real martinet, yes. Our beautiful online travel guide must someday become faultless, I'm gladly doing my part. Ibaman (talk) 21:53, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
 * FWIW, Opinion is a synonym of Conclusion. Davekern (talk) 11:48, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Shades of meaning separate them. A person can have a preliminary opinion about something without having reached a firm conclusion, and since I believe you're a native English speaker, I expect that you'll agree with me, but that expectation is not a conclusion, either. Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:51, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
 * and about the subject under discussion, as an admin I like our pages clean and tight and fast to load and easy to read on a phone screen and devoid of any intentional or subliminal or random promotion of specific businesses. In this respect I am and has always been really strict enforcing Don't tout and Image policy. A real martinet, yes. Our beautiful online travel guide must someday become faultless, I'm gladly doing my part. Ibaman (talk) 21:53, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

Banner Image

I'd like to discuss the possibility of updating the banner image.

The current banner taken from eye-level on O'Connell Street suffers from a number of issues:

 * 1) Busy, lots of pedestrians
 * 2) Poorly framed (the Spire being a notable landmark is completely cut-out-of-shot
 * 3) Not recognizable.

Typically, other nearby cities like London, Edinburgh, Belfast. Paris utilize panoramic images of the city, were as - Dublin get a really poor showing with an eye level shot of a major street pointed upwards.

Any suggestions on what we should be aiming for here? Davekern (talk) 22:53, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

 * I agree that it is time to change. The current banner was created 10 years ago, when there was a much small selection of images on Commons.

 * To make a start, I have uploaded a couple of alternatives to consider, but please add some others.

 * Banner 0 is the existing view of O'Connell Street
 * Banner 1 is the Custom House at night.
 * Banner 2 is also the Custom House, but during the day also showing the modern buildings next it.

 * More alternatives would be very welcome, but remember that the banner needs to be a 7:1 image, at least 1800 pixels wide. AlasdairW (talk) 23:26, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I agree with Ikan, 2 -> 1 -> 0.
 * Give's the Customs House context. Davekern (talk) 10:50, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

 * 2, 1, 0 for me. I like seeing the combination of old and new in the banner because Ireland has experienced a huge amount of economic development in recent decades. -- Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:34, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * 2, 1, 0 per Davekern and Ikan Kekek. Ground Zero (talk) 13:31, 9 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I agree, 2 is the best, nicely juxtaposing old and new. —Granger (talk · contribs) 13:19, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
 * 1=2, 0. -- SHB2000  (talk | contribs | meta) 20:37, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks for all the votes. I have changed the banner to 2. AlasdairW (talk) 22:25, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

James Joyce Joke
There's a small paragraph just under the `Do` section that contains a joke along the lines of:

So Padraig comes for a job in construction, and the hiring boss says "So can you tell me, what's the difference between a joist and a girder?" "Sure, everyone knows that. Joist wrote Ulysses and Girder wrote Faust."

Is there an history to this joke, and does it make sense to be here?

It seems kinda looped in, I was surprised to see it there. There's not really a direct relation to Dublin itself. Davekern (talk) 16:32, 9 October 2023 (UTC)
 * is a fan of James Joyce, and started the itinerary about James Joyce's Dublin. I think this is his work. I hope he might say something about it. Ibaman (talk) 21:53, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dublin


text:
Talk:Dubrovnik

Random question
!~

This part is making my head spin.

"If you are involved in a car accident, no matter how insignificant, you are required to call the Police.

The phone number of the police is 92, but the sentence above does not apply any more and in fact you will pay a fine (500kn) for calling the police for a fender bender.If you are involved in a car accident, no matter how insignificant, you are required to call the Police."

Which is correct and which is not?

~!

Dubrovnik to Venice
Going to Dubronik in Sept and want to get to Venice....Austrian air one way is $$$$$....anyone ever bus to Slpit and take the ferry to Ancora Italy and then train to Venice????????? better: Ferry Dubrovnik-Bari!

Best route is to take the Jadrolinja (sp?) ferry sraight up the coast to Rijeka, then catch a train to Venice. Travel in Croatia is cheaper than Italy, so better to do the majority of your travel in Croatian waters.

I've taken the boat across the adriactic to Bari. Not a bad trip at all. Although Bari has one of the highest crime rates in Italy (at least when I was there...) so I don't recommend showing up late at night.

Ferrys also only run from Split and Dubrovnik every few days, so plan your schedule accordingly. If you miss the boat, you'll be stuck for a few days.

Best of luck.

By Plane
Doing some research-- as far as I can tell, there is no flight on Brussels airline from Brussels to Dubrovnik. Will continue to research and delete it in next few days if I can't find the flight referenced here from 2006.

Names of attractions
I have some images, but I don't know exatly what is on the photo. Can help me anybody who well know Dubrovnik? (the linked images are can find at Wikimedia commons or Wikipedia)

1. What is the name of the cathedral: ? I find this as Velika Gospa cathedral, but what is the international name? At http://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Dubrovnik I found several name to attractions. May it can be the Cathedral of the Assumption of the Virgin Mary, but may at an other page write about a connection with Saint Blaise.

2. This shows the Sponza Palace? The description writes 	Rector's Palace. Sponza=rector? Or is that an other building? After my search I think yes, this pictures show the Sponza, the other the Rector's where there are the warmemorial.

3. I found the name of my photos subject: Franciscan Monastery. But at an other pages descript this site as Dominican Monastery! At http://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Dubrovnik there are writing as this is to several monastery, what is the truth?

--(WT-en) Beyond silence 03:38, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Attraction listing details
Addition of street addresses and telephone numbers is something that would really help the traveller. (WT-en) OldPine 07:43, 30 September 2007 (EDT)

 * Almost 8 years later, I agree, and it's the lack of these details that makes this article a doubtful Guide. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:41, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

 * And, downgraded to Usable for that reason. Ikan Kekek (talk) 10:15, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Visia Dubrovnik 5D Theatrum and Ethnographic Museum
Is there a reason why the Theatrum listing was substituted for the Ethnographic Museum listing? Did one replace the other? If not, the edit would be unjustified. If so, please tell us. I haven't visited Dubrovnik and don't know. (WT-en) Ikan Kekek 08:31, 18 March 2011 (EDT)

Luxury hotels
The city has many luxury hotels, as do Split and Hvar. It is a good thing to mention in "Understand". Today it says: Out of the 23 top luxury hotels in Croatia in 2010, 13 were located in Dubrovnik. I am quite think it is based on the World Travel Award nomineees. The 2013 numbers are 5 of 16. /Johan Jönsson (talk) 18:53, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

"Learn" section, moved from article
The optional "Learn" section should be used only for institutes that offer courses lasting about 2 weeks or less. Mere names with links are useless, but I copy them here in case any of them happen to offer short courses in something. If they do (such as perhaps the language school?), please restore those listings, but make the fully templated listings, including descriptions of the short courses on offer.

Learn

Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:39, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

Game of Thrones Effect
Since 2012 the city of Dubrovnik is the location to take Game of Thrones, the American fantasy drama television series. Fans of the film like to go there. Their aim is to see those places being prominent in the film. There are reports saying that the city is more crowded then ever. True or not? Effecting travelers or a none issue? --Ppso (talk) 05:29, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

 * It's very visible in the city just now, and I'll add some snippy remarks to the page. But easy enough to swerve; overall crowding depends on multiple factors such as kn exchange rate, cruise ship itineraries, and recent collapse of Thomas Cook Travel. Grahamsands (talk) 09:58, 27 September 2019 (UTC)

Page banner

To the right is a selection of page banner. Banner 1 - the current one - is nice, just don't really like, that it's dark and cloudy at the moment of the shot.--Renek78 (talk) 18:55, 5 September 2019 (UTC)
 * All three are good, but #2 is just about my favorite. --Comment by Selfie City  ( talk  |  contributions ) 19:27, 5 September 2019 (UTC)
 * In full width mode, yes, definitely #2 --Comment by Selfie City  ( talk  |  contributions ) 19:28, 5 September 2019 (UTC)
 * #2 is my favourite as well. --Renek78 (talk) 22:36, 5 September 2019 (UTC)
 * I think we have consensus now. Not many people are likely to vote here. --Comment by Selfie City  ( talk  |  contributions ) 22:57, 5 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Number 2 is the best of a good selection. Ground Zero (talk) 23:45, 5 September 2019 (UTC)

 * ✅ Banner changed. FYI, Renek78, there is also Banner expedition/Banner suggestions where we vote on replacing banners. You may or may not get more publicity there. --Comment by Selfie City  ( talk  |  contributions ) 00:17, 6 September 2019 (UTC)

Problem with Dubrovnik banner
Hi all, I made a mistake in Commons by, which was then used as the page banner for Dubrovnik. Later I reverted my mistake, created a and linked to this one in the  article. But somehow the original version of the picture is still shown in the article. Anybody knows why? --Renek78 (talk) 08:46, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
 * I have sorted it. There was a syntax error in the pagebanner on Dubrovnik ("File:" was included), so it was fetching the banner from Wikidata, which still had the old entry. I have updated both the page and the WD entry. AlasdairW (talk) 15:01, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Ah, stupid mistake! Thanks, AlasdairW!--Renek78 (talk) 15:33, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
 * When I (originally) added the new pagebanner, I simply copied in the filename from the earlier image and did the Commons/Wikidata work. It probably would have been wiser to let Renek78 do the work, but 1) I didn't want to seem lazy and 2) I'm impatient some of the time. --Comment by Selfie City  ( talk  |  contributions ) 19:58, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
 * You did nothing wrong at all, Selfie City . 100 percently my mistake when I created this page banner in Commons and then making a syntax error in Wikivoyage. Thanks for plunging forward regarding the banner. --Renek78 (talk) 07:36, 7 September 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dubrovnik


text:
Talk:Dubuque

I moved this from Dubuque (Iowa), because I think there's not another important Dubuque out there. Correct me if I'm wrong! --(WT-en) Evan 20:20, 27 Aug 2004 (EDT)

title: Talk:Dubuque


text:
Talk:Duisburg

Surely there is more in Duisburg than Legoland. Let's have some content please! (WT-en) Shep 15:37, 23 September 2010 (EDT)

Can we get the Stadtbahn to show up on the Dynamic map?
I mean this one Hobbitschuster (talk) 23:54, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Duisburg


text:
Talk:Dulan

Okay, completely new to this medium...my apology for the multiple listings.

(WT-en) Oldhand 03:18, 18 March 2011 (EDT)

title: Talk:Dulan


text:
Talk:Duluth

Duluth has one of the most beautiful fall seasons in the world. It is splashed with vibrant color at every turn and is graced by cool, crisp winds off the majestic Lake Superior. —The preceding comment was added by 131.212.44.18 (talk • contribs) 20:31, 19 September 2007

Stay Safe?
The "Stay Safe" section of this article seems to imply that Duluth is a rather dangerous community. While I have yet to look up any crime statistics for Duluth, my experience as a person who lives in the Northern Great Plains, is that this is rather unlikely. I'm really not sure what purpose such a seemingly paranoid spiel contributes to the article. KevinOKeeffe (talk) 03:38, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

Need for the (Minnesota) qualifier
It seems self-evident to me that Minnesota's is a far more famous Duluth than some rinkydink Atlanta suburb. Does anyone disagree with moving the current article to simply Duluth, and the current Duluth article to Duluth (disambiguation)? -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 04:49, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

 * I've never heard of any other Duluth, so I support you. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:53, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

title: Talk:Duluth


text:
Talk:Dunagiri

This whole page reads like spam... —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 203.156.38.151 (talk • contribs)

 * This is a community wiki, so please plunge forward. --(WT-en) Stefan (sertmann) talk 05:15, 31 December 2009 (EST)

title: Talk:Dunagiri


text:
Talk:Dundalk

I think this is a bit one-sided. "constant violent disorder on the streets"? It's not a warzone.

title: Talk:Dundalk


text:
Talk:Dundee

Under 'To See', there are also sporting events, most noticeably Dundee F.C. and Dundee United F.C. football teams. One is generally playing at home each weekend from the middle of August through to the end of April.

For information, Dundee has two excellent newspapers, the Courier and the Evening Telegraph.

Safety in Dundee
Not accurate to state "Dundee is one of the most dangerous cities in the UK, and Europe". No evidence of this in any statistics. Suggest this inaccuracy is either deleted or some objective evidence is presented to support it.

Talk
This section could possibly be trimmed down as many travellers to Dundee would not hear many of these words. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 94.125.16.11 (talk • contribs)

 * Don't wait for someone else to do it, please plunge forward and make the changes as you see fit! --(WT-en) Peter Talk 21:30, 9 March 2010 (EST)

I've moved a shortened version of this list to "Scotland: Talk", leaving only a comment on pronunciation on the Dundee page, as the vocab isn't specific to the city. The other consideration was that it side-tracked the flow of the article. Grahamsands (talk) 18:16, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

To see & do
I removed the list of churches, leaving only a short mention in "Do". They don't rate as attractions "to see", and a full list of places of worship is beyond the scope of WV. The Mormon visitor from Canada will specifically be looking for the Church of Latter Day Saints, and will have his / her own better sources of info. Grahamsands (talk) 12:30, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

Angus
Is it really appropriate for Dundee to be treated as part of Angus when it doesn't ever appear to have been so or at least isn't today, there's nothing wrong with it simply being under North East Scotland. Carnoustie is indeed in Angus but Dundee isn't so even though both are in the same area they aren't in the same region in the case of lieutenancy/council area. Crouch, Swale (talk) 10:59, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

 * Dundee was in the pre-1975 county of Angus. I think we have everywhere in Scotland two regions down from Scotland, and don't have any "cities" in the larger regions - North East Scotland etc. I think that a "Dundee Region" would only contain Dundee and Broughty Ferry.
 * Looking at the hotels we have listed, Best Western say their hotels are in Angus, Premier Inn say Tayside and the others just say Scotland.
 * If Dundee is moved to be part of North East Scotland, then both the North East Scotland and Angus pages and maps need to be edited to reflect the new structure, in addition to changing IsPartOf.
 * I am not strongly opposed to moving Dundee to be part of North East Scotland, but let's not rush. I would be interested in hearing the thoughts of others. AlasdairW (talk) 22:21, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
 * OK I see it indeed actually was part of Angus though its not now part of it similar to Bolton now being in Lancashire even though many of its residents resent the change. I understand though that as you note unlike Greater Manchester there is only Broughty Ferry which doesn't have an article here and probably shouldn't. There is also Aberdeen that we need to look at. If we do keep it in the Angus IsPartOf then we should at least note that its no longer actually part of it but included for convenience. Note that this is quite different to say Blackburn that although not part of the administrative county it is still in the ceremonial county and although we don't care as much about facts as Wikipedia we should still make sure we don't give incorrect information. Crouch, Swale (talk) 12:56, 30 June 2021 (UTC)
 * The pre-1975 counties are sometimes still used as part of a postal address - the Royal Mail wasn't keen on the Region, District structure, but postcodes are more important these days. Neither Edinburgh or Glasgow mention their regions at the start (and Glasgow is in the vague Clydeside.
 * "Angus" can be removed from the first sentence, and we can have an explanation later: "Dundee is in its own council area, but for convenience we have it in the historic county of Angus." - or perhaps a better way of saying this. I have added a note in Angus to explain that it is not the current council area. AlasdairW (talk) 21:29, 30 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks, its true that a small part of Dundee does still fall in Angus today namely the Ballumbie Castle Estate. Crouch, Swale (talk) 13:43, 12 July 2021 (UTC)
 * "historically part of Angus" sums it up and aligns lede and breadcrumb. Lots of towns eg Bolton are similar, no need to make a meal of it. Grahamsands (talk) 18:52, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
 * (Later) Angus was missing "Understand", we can deal with the admin status there. That county now looks "usable". - GS

title: Talk:Dundee


text:
Talk:Dunedin

Travelling times
The longer suggested traveling times assume the driver is conservative and travels at recommended safe corner speeds and below the speed limits, with average speeds of 80 km/h on open sections of road, remains within traffic streams, avoids overtaking and generally enjoys the scenery. Times includes rest breaks of 5 to 10 minutes about each hour. Some travellers are likely to want to travel considerably faster and the shorter time is given as an indication of the possible time the journey may be acomplished in.

University of Otago
The University of Otago has been described as the first | earliest | oldest university in New Zealand. I prefer earliest. Here is why.

The University of Otago was founded in 1869 by the Otago Provincial Council. It opened in July 1871. But the University of New Zealand, which had the power to examine students and confer degrees was established in 1870, by statute. Both sought charters. In 1873 the University of Canterbury became affiliated with the University of New Zealand. Otago subsequently withdrew its charter application and only became affiliated to the University of New Zealand in 1874. Technically, only the University of New Zealand (of which Otago was a member College from 1874) had the power to confer degrees prior to 1961. Consequently, the University of New Zealand could be said to be the 'oldest or first but Otago is indisputably the earliest established. See and  for more. -- (WT-en) Huttite 16:03, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

E-Mail Addresses
Some of the cheaper accomodation alternatives (e.g., Dunedin Central Backpackers), don't have working websites. Would it be okay to publish their e-mail addresses? Other sites that provide information about accomodation in Dunedin (e.g., University of Otago's site), provides this information. Is it against Wikivoyage policies? Please let me know. --(WT-en) Pueben 08:29, 20 June 2006 (EDT)
 * Sorry for the long wait for a reply.
 * I don't think we have any rules against including e-mail addresses where they are in the public domain. BushelCandle (talk) 22:49, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

article humour
I feel attempts at humour should be kept to a minimum or not made at all (eg.fush and chups). It will only confuse readers who don't get the jokes. (WT-en) Doc Risk

University Oval
University Oval is mentioned under See as well as Do. Is it really an attraction for travellers even when there is no sport being played? Nurg (talk) 23:54, 17 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Not for me, but then I'm not sports-mad. My vote would be to list it once only, but with more information. -- A l i c e ✉ 23:58, 17 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Not in itself an attraction for most people, I think. I'd suggest removing it from the See section, and expanding on who you'd typically see playing cricket there in the Do section (as in the rugby listing above it). --Avenue (talk) 11:46, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Thx. I have removed it from See. Nurg (talk) 20:15, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Good move. Pf! -- A l i c e ✉ 01:21, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

Hey Guys. I agree - there is definitely nothing to see there unless you are a mad cricket fan who likes to visit cricket grounds (they do exist). No attraction for the average tourist. I think the listing under do in the 'go to a cricket game' context is fine. Armin-t (talk) 04:07, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Railway Station is most photographed building in NZ
"Dunedin Railway Station ... is regarded as the most photographed building in New Zealand." What backing is there for this? Nurg (talk) 06:47, 30 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Probably none, but we all know the philosophical difficulties with proving a negative assertion that it is not.
 * Until very recently that sentence was "Dunedin Railway Station ... is regarded as the most photographed ugly building in New Zealand" (my boldening added) which was probably much closer to the truth, bearing in mind how many tourists visit the Beehive and Te Papa in Wellington and how many tourists visit Dunedin Railway Station... I'll chop it out until someone can substantiate the claim. -- A l i c <font . color="#00EEFF">e <font color="#FF3333">✉ 07:04, 30 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Its a pretty commonly spouted fact in town - google confirms its noted in dozens of other sites - -  - . As to its truth, who knows, it does seem like a relatively unprovable fact, hence i added 'regarded' —The preceding comment was added by  Armin-t (talk • contribs) at about 10:10, 30 January 2013 (UTC)

"...revert unexplained change about kumara chips"

 * http://www.fmcgbusiness.co.nz/2014/11/19/new-proper-kumara-crisps/
 * http://www.propercrisps.co.nz/store/products/kumara-crisps-40g/
 * http://www.findlayfoods.co.nz/products/view/kiwi_kumara_crisps_natural/15/64/
 * http://www.fieldco.co.nz/recipes/entrees/kumara-crisps
 * http://www.kumara.co.nz/recipes/meals/risottokumarabacon.php

In the mainland of New Zealand, kumara crisps are what are called chips in the U.S. and are relatively thin and crispy. They are analogous to potato crisps.

I appreciate that nomenclature may be different in the north where Asian immigration is much higher and that language is in a continual state of flux but both potato and kumara chips are a different product where the thickness is a similar ratio to the width - more like a rectangular sausage. Tasmania also preserves this distinction between potato products that are normally eaten hot (chips) and those normally eaten cold (crisps). BushelCandle (talk) 11:40, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

 * I think what was originally being written about is kumara chips (US: sweet potato French fries). (Kumara is the local word for sweet potato.) Unfortunately the original link is dead, but this page on the same site gives some info, and this recipe for an oven cooked version has a picture. AlasdairW (talk) 22:09, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

 * Yes, I think you're both right and I was wrong to make the change I did (and doubly wrong not to explain in an edit summary what I was intending). Sorry! BushelCandle (talk) 22:22, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks. No worries. Nurg (talk) 07:19, 10 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Thank you for being vigilant. BushelCandle (talk) 07:22, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

The Wains Hotel
Grand old hotels includes a listing for Wains Hotel (fablehotelsandresorts: fable-dunedin). I cannot find it among the Sleep listings in the article. If it is worth a listing in the travel topic, it should have a listing here (linked from there). Is it just not yet listed or is there some problem with it (or am I blind)? –LPfi (talk) 19:58, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dunedin


text:
Talk:Dunedin (Florida)

I visit Dunedin during the holidays in December. Not your typical Florida town...big scottish influence. Walkers/bikers will love this place. Stop for sangria and guamole w/chips at Casa Tina's. Check the Arts Center and listen for the high school  marching band .... bagpipes(WT-en) Littlecorp 12:35, 16 July 2011 (EDT)

title: Talk:Dunedin (Florida)


text:
Talk:Dunfermline

Get Out
Is there excellent shopping in Kirkcaldy? (unsigned comment 17 Jan 2007 imported from Wikitravel)

 * No, and I removed that and similar nonsense that all looked like cut-and-paste from a local government PR puff. But there it has festered on the page for at least 13 years, so please plunge forward and promptly edit any such obvious bunkum. A ripe target from the same habitual offenders is anything described as "the fastest growing xxx" Grahamsands (talk) 12:22, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dunfermline


text:
Talk:Dunmore

History
Some of the history section was taken by User:(WT-en) Kelley.dougherty from Susan W. Pieroth's compilation found at http://www.rootsweb.com/~palackaw/news/providence.html, apparently uncopyrighted, as it was compiled from texts published in the 1800s. (WT-en) Texugo 21:37, 27 September 2009 (EDT)

title: Talk:Dunmore


text:
Talk:Durango (Colorado)

I've made a few additions to this, but Durango is really outside my back yard. Anybody interested in adopting it? -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 22:24, 30 Oct 2005 (EST)

USA Today article
Hmm..."For the Durango, Colo., Chamber of Commerce, Blizzard made a list of five things visitors could do there on Wikivoyage.org, an outgrowth of Wikipedia, the online encyclopedia that's written by the general public."

 * Nice. A whole article legitimizing being an SEO-scumming jackass.

 * Yeah, blizzard (User:(WT-en) DrakesTravels, but sometimes logged out and contributing anonymously) is one of our regular travel-industry-shill contributors. They do ok work, but they often need to be de-SEOed. Interesting that they actually advertise that they contribute to us.  Maybe it would be a good thing if more travel-industry companies did the same. Or maybe the deSEOing would annoy me. I liked the felcor corporate shills (User:(WT-en) Redbug) better because they didn't SEO, they properly added new articles as needed, and they tried to format stuff right. -- (WT-en) Colin 18:48, 14 June 2006 (EDT)

 * Looking at DT's contributions, I don't really see a big problem. Yes, the tourist office reference is unnecessary, but more experienced Wikivoyageers than DT have done things like that.  The other additions appear to be normal.  Durango has tons of stuff to see/do/eat/sleep in, little of it represented in the article.  Give thanks for those who help, even if they come with wrinkles or even warts... -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 20:01, 14 June 2006 (EDT)

 * Yup, it's worthwhile despite the need to de-SEO. Some of the more annoying edits were done as anon User:216.237.70.157 (see this history which shows they are the same, and my favorite editing accident by this user ).  Consider this listing for a place called "Woodlands Trails B&B" : . Notice that the link is named with something they'd like to be indexed by with Google, rather than anything resembling the actual name.  It's not consistently SEO, which is a relief.  And they are actual locations volunteering to be listed, so we just have to futz with it a bit and MoS it and we're there. -- (WT-en) Colin 20:49, 14 June 2006 (EDT)

title: Talk:Durango (Colorado)


text:
Talk:Durgapur

Train info moved here
Perhaps you can glean useful information from these tables and the wall of text below that isn't already in the article and should be:

Originating Station: Howrah:

Train No.     Name                      Dep.at 12019          Shatabdi Exp (except Sun)   06:05 13317         Black Diamond Exp           06:15 13051         Doon Exp                    06:45 31448         Shaktipunj Exp              14:30 12339         Coalfield Exp               17:15 12341         Agnibina Exp                18:20 12333         Vibhuti Exp                 20:00

From Sealdah:

3503         Intercity Exp               16:40

From New Delhi/Delhi 2314         Rajdhani Exp                16:45 2304/2382    Poorva Exp                  16:25 2312         Kalka Mail                  06:30 (at Delhi)

Some of the long distance trains passing through Durgapur are: 2313/2314 Sealdah New Delhi Rajdhani Express, 2381/2382 or 2303/2304 Howrah-New Delhi Poorva Express 2311/2312 Howrah Delhi Kalka Mail, 2321/2322 Howrah Mumbai Mail (via Allahabad), 3009/3010 Howrah Dehra Dun Doon Express, 3151/3152 Sealdah Jammu Tawi, 3025/3026 Howrah Bhopal (departing Howrah on Monday, departing Bhopal on Wednesday), 1448/1449 Howrah Jabalpur Shaktipunj Express, 1159/1160 Howrah Gwalior Chambal Express (departing Howrah on Tuesday, Wednesday, Sunday; departing Gwalior on Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday), 9306/9305 Howrah Indore Shipra Express (departing Howrah on Monday, Thursday, Saturday; departing Indore on Tuesaday, Thursday, Saturday), 5630/5629 Guwahati Chennai Egmore Express (departing Guwahati Friday, departing Egmore on Monday), 5930/5929 Dibrugarh Chennai Egmore Express (departing Dibrugarh on Sunday, departing Egmore on Monday), 3007/3008 Howrah Sriganganagar Udyan Abha Toofan Express, 3049/3050 Howrah Amritsar Express, 3005/3006 Howrah Amritsar Mail, 2023/2024 Howrah Patna Jan Shatabdi Express (No train on Sunday), 2329/2330 Sealdah Delhi West Bengal Sampark Kranti Express, 3019/3020 Howrah Kathgodam Bagh Express, 3021/3022 Howrah Raxaul Mithila Express, 5640/5639 Guwahati Puri Express (departing Guwahati on Thursday, Departing Puri on Saturday).

Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:26, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Durgapur


text:
Talk:Durham (England)

I need help from people in the north, east and west of the county. I can fill in lots of details about the Darlington area but my knowledge isn't deep enough for other areas. (WT-en) Hpc1989 14:52, 10 January 2012 (EST)

title: Talk:Durham (England)


text:
Talk:Durham (North Carolina)

Comments
Well I've fleshed out what I can about the city, but I only get down to my hometown about 3-4 times a year now. Other Durhamites I urge you to contribute! Go Devils... 66.9.126.26 14:09, 14 July 2006 (EDT)

New Restaurants
Many of the restaurants listed in this article (Pop's, Ox and Rabbit, etc.) are now closed, and some (George's Garage) have been closed for years and years. I would delete them from the list except that I don't consider myself enough of an expert to know which restaurants I should replace them with. Help/suggestions? Thanks. --Danberbro (talk) 22:47, 31 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Go ahead and delete the closed restaurants even if you can't think of any replacements. No info is better than false info. PerryPlanet (talk) 22:52, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Durham (North Carolina)