text:
Talk:Tofino

Tofino, Long Beach and Pacific Rim NP
So the Tofino article currently covers both Tofino and the Long Beach section of Pacific Rim National Park, and I wonder if it should? Long Beach could be a destination in its own right (it seems to meet the definition of what an article is), or it could be included in the Pacific Rim NP guide. Pros and cons I see are:

1. Include Long Beach in Tofino guide Pros - Long Beach is a common destination on trips to Tofino, so it would be one less guide a traveller would have to print Cons - not consistent with our hierarchy or normal article standards -- Long Beach is part of Pacific Rim NP, not Tofino, so it would be more difficult to make a complete Pacific Rim NP guide if Long Beach is included in the Tofino guide

2. Include in Pacific Rim National Park guide Pros - Consistent with our hierarchy since Long Beach is part of the park. Cons - Probably doesn't put the traveller first since Long Beach isn't connected to the rest of the park. Almost everyone travelling to Tofino will pass through Long Beach, but very few of those travellers will go to the other parts of Pacific Rim NP.

3. Create a Pacific Rim National Park - Long Beach Unit guide Pros - Compromise that can still respect the hierarchy and help the traveller. It would create a focused Long Beach article that is relevant to people travelling to Tofino/Ucluelet, but could also be linked to from the the main body of the Pacific Rim NP guide. Cons - Creates two articles where there could be one (i.e., someone looking to cover all of Pacific Rim NP would have to print two articles instead of one)

I prefer option 3, but would like to hear what others think or any other ideas people might have. - (WT-en) Shaund 00:47, 23 May 2012 (EDT)

Vacation rental listings
I would delete all but Tofino Vacation Rentals, whose listing includes an address. I believe it's a pretty hard-and-fast rule that "Sleep" listings without a physical address are deleted. The content of the apartment listing policy may be instructive in this situation. Please comment on whether you agree or disagree with deleting all listings with no physical address. If no-one comments, I will plunge forward and make the deletions within one to a few days. Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:34, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

 * I prematurely made an edit without posting a coherent editing summary (the summary is simply the characters my glass hit on its way to the "Enter" key on my keyboard; fortunately, the glass was empty). I deleted all accommodation listings that had neither an address nor rates listed. The next steps would be to delete all listings with no address and listings without listed rates. Please, if you know the addresses or rates at the listed establishments, insert them as soon as you reasonably can. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:55, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

 * What's the rush? The policy says if accommodation listings need to be pruned (i.e., more than nine) then look for listings that omit price and/or location info. These aren't spam listings and the guide isn't being overrun by Sleep listings. I think we would be doing the traveller a disservice if the Sleep section was nearly empty because listings weren't 100% MoS compliant. -Shaundd (talk) 03:47, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

 * Listings with neither address nor pricing info are more promotional than useful to travelers. And "as soon as you reasonably can" isn't a rush. As you can see, it took me about a month and a half to follow through with my initial plan to delete everything that had neither address nor rates listed, and what prompted me to do it was a new non-compliant listing. I hope you're not suggesting that those listings should be reinstated the way they were before I deleted them. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:01, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

 * Also, look at don't tout: "[...]listings without pricing information may be deleted.[...\]If prices vary, provide a price range (example: `$100-$200, varies by season')." Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:08, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

 * No, I'm fine with deleting the apartment rentals. I tried to find address and rate info for a couple of them last year when visiting Tofino, but couldn't come up with anything. It's the proposed phase two that I have an issue with.
 * I disagree that listings with neither address nor pricing are necessarily more promotional than useful. If the description is vague and full of flowery language, sure, but otherwise the listing is likely just incomplete. Promotional listings should be cut or reworked, but incomplete listings should be left so someone else can build on it (unless we have too many listings and need to prune). Having been to Tofino, most if not all of those hotels should be in our guide if it's going to be complete. And the listings themselves are mostly complete and generally not promotional (although the Pacific Sands one is pushing it). To remove the Wickaninnish Inn -- a very famous hotel and probably on many top 10 hotel lists in Canada -- just because no one has dug up its address yet seems silly and not the point of Don't tout. -Shaundd (talk) 05:43, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

 * I can see that what you're saying is reasonable and based on specific knowledge of the place. I won't follow through with deleting listings that have at least either an address or rates listed. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:07, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tofino


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Talk:Tofo Beach

What's meant with R in the context of diving prices? All other prices are shown as Mtn? —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 212.17.140.202 (talk • contribs)

 * R = Rand... Most places in Tofo (and other Mozambican tourist sites) are owned by and cater to South Africans, and you'll often see prices quoted in both Rand and Meticais. – (WT-en) cacahuate  talk 01:33, 31 July 2007 (EDT)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Tofo Beach


text:
Talk:Togo

For future reference the Project:CIA World Factbook 2002 import can be found at Talk:Togo/CIA World Factbook 2002 import. -- (WT-en) Huttite 17:16, 1 Apr 2005 (EST)

Travel section
It does not seem that a Porsche Carrera GT would be the only option of getting into Togo by car. Especially Togo being a quite small country, and may I say one in poverty. Excuse me for I may be mistaken though.

mv from article
80.88.137.19 07:07, 13 January 2009 (EST)Be aware that the Immigration officers at the airport will charge double or more for a visa, although the price list is posted on the window. I was charged 20 Euros (visa price: 15 Euros) then told that was not enough. When I produced US Dollars, the Immigration officer snatched the $50 out of my hands and threw both the bills under the window. I was told to return after getting my luggage. Upon returning I was informed that I had not paid anything yet and that a visa would cost 30,000CFA (offical price: 15,000CFA). Furthermore, I was asked no less than 4 more times for money from various customs officers so they "Wouldn't have to search my bags." With a welcome like this, why would anyone want to go?

Regions
Togo may look small, but since it extends perpendicular to the coast it covers several different landscapes and has a few major ethnicities. The five regions that exist are a good way of dividing the country, but I feel five regions is too many for such a small country. So: (WT-en) AHeneen 04:27, 27 January 2010 (EST)
 * Northern Togo (Savanes & Kara)—savanna and some granite rock formations in the far northwest; Kabye peoles
 * Central Togo (Centrale, Plateaux)—rolling hills and forests; mix of Ewe, Kotokoli, & Tchamba peoples
 * Coastal Togo (Maritime)—coastal mangrove marshes & lagoons; mix of all ethnicities; this is part of the country the overwhelming majority of tourists see

 * Done. --(WT-en) Burmesedays 04:56, 8 February 2010 (EST)

Regions again
Why do we even have regions? We have only five articles for the whole country, all of which are linked from the country article. None of the region articles have any content. I propose to remove the unnecessary regions until such time as there is more content and more articles. Ground Zero (talk) 21:26, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

 * Seems obvious. Go for it. Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:37, 12 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Agree. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 22:39, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

Done. Ground Zero (talk) 11:55, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Togo


text:
Talk:Tok Pisin phrasebook

I've found a very good free tok pisin / english online dictionary that may help you, located here: http://www.calibercreations.com/pisin/

 * Thanks! I couldn't help laughing at some of these translations:
 * airplane: balus: pigeon (not to be confused with pidgin, which is pisin, not to be confused with pisin, which is bird, but comes from pigeon :))
 * areca nut: bitolnat. The word "areca" is correct. "Betel" properly refers to a species of pepper (daka) which is chewed with buai.
 * art gallery: haus tambaran: ancestor house. I'd use "haus piksa" or something like that.
 * aunt, paternal: bikmama, smolmama.
 * And that's just the A's. -(WT-en) phma 16:34, 18 Dec 2003 (PST)

 * Further checking turns up "let bilong karapela", which I've seen before. Terry Gilsenan, who has spoken tok Pisin for over 35 years, never heard of "karapela", and suggests "rop bilong fen". -(WT-en) phma 17:03, 18 Dec 2003 (PST)

Man
I really want to talk Tok Pisin now! --(WT-en) Evan 16:48, 18 Dec 2003 (PST)

Whoa
What an amazingly fascinating language. Me too! ;-) --(WT-en) Jeremy 15:14, 20 Feb 2004 (EST)
 * Yes, me three! I so want to learn this language, but books on it are expensive (I found one at Amazon for about $200). :( -- 12.148.255.202 16:49, 24 Jun 2005 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tok Pisin phrasebook


text:
Talk:Tokushima

I'm moving this in from the article. If you can't eat it, it doesn't belong in Eat. (WT-en) Gorilla Jones 12:51, 8 August 2009 (EDT)

Awaodori is Tokushima's native chicken. Its name is a play on words with Awa Odori (the dance) — the word Odori means "dance" but it can also be spelled with the Japanese characters for "tail" and "bird". However don't expect to find any places that serve Awaodori as the locals will look at you like your crazy if you ask for it.

title: Talk:Tokushima


text:
Talk:Tokyo

New banner

 * See Talk:Japan for other banner contests.

These banners could be considered for Tokyo (prefecture), Kanto and even Japan as well. Tokyo/Shinjuku and Tokyo/Minato have poor banners, which should be reconsidered. /Yvwv (talk) 01:19, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Banner 2 (Tokyo night banner.JPG) SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 01:26, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * 2, 4 and 3 tied, then 1. Ikan Kekek (talk) 01:28, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Clarified the numbering and added a new banner. Please reconsider votes. /Yvwv (talk) 01:35, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * I did a little rethinking, anyway. 3, 1, 2, 5, 4, 6, 0. Very close between 1 and 2, though. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:11, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * For me, 3 and 0, I voted for another I think on the Shinjuku article? A lot of proposals have overlap. ChubbyWimbus (talk) 13:15, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

By train section of the get around section has got very long...
Would it make sense to turn the section of the article into its own article? It's gotten very very long, and I suppose it could be turned into something similar to Trams in Melbourne. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 05:51, 3 November 2021 (UTC)
 * I don't know. I don't think we've ever done this before, but there's always a first. The dog2 (talk) 05:54, 3 November 2021 (UTC)
 * We have Public transportation. /Yvwv (talk) 09:56, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Akihabara

See & Do
Transportation Museum is now officially closed. Any substitutes that can replace the listing in the article?
 * Can anyone descibe more on the shops and things there?

Can anyone list a few hobby shops in the Buy section? Thanks in advance.

First picture
The picture is not from a manga and anime shop, but from a pachinko shop. I think it should be replaced.

 * 2nd picture, you mean. Fair point, I've changed the caption until a better one comes along. (WT-en) Jpatokal 07:58, 18 June 2007 (EDT)

 * If this is in regard to the picture of the Evangelion-themed pachinko parlor, I changed it. "Even pachinko parlors in Akihabara are anime-themed" suggests that an anime-themed pachinko parlor would be less common outside of Akihabara when they're really all over the place.  I know of a handful just in the Susukino area of Sapporo and more in other areas of town.

Moved to Talk for time being

 * Standard-issue business hotel located right outside Akihabara station. There is a Web-based reservation system, but it expects a Japanese name, address, and phone number. The hotel will be closed for renovations starting March 31st, 2008 and will not reopen until 2010.

Street closure on sundays
it seems that chuo dori no longer closes on sundays ever since the knife attack (I'm here now and it didn't close, and that's what I read elsewhere). That should probably be removed. --(WT-en) Thenickdude 08:57, 27 June 2010 (EDT)

I was at Akihabara today (September 25th 2011) and the street was closed at 13:00. I too was confused if it was going to be closed at all since I went there before noon. Might be a good idea to add that it's closed at 13:00. rgds, anon. exchange student in japan
 * Um, I don't know what was going on today exactly but that is totally non-typical of the area. (WT-en) texugo 11:56, 25 September 2011 (EDT)

Which temple?
I'm translating the page to French, but I could not figure out which temple the page is talking about. Maybe it is Kanda shrine, but it is located in Chiyoda. Any idea?

Radio Center - isn't that gone?
I never knew this by name, but if the Radio Center was what I think from the description then it's been gone for a while already.
 * I searched the web a bit and it seems that Radio Center (near the station) is still opened. Radio Store closed in 2013 though. — Fabimaru (talk) 15:15, 28 March 2016 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 23:19, 9 June 2019 (UTC)
 * At home cafe show time.jpg
 * This will clearly be deleted for copyright violation. I will delete the thumbnail. Ikan Kekek (talk) 00:50, 10 June 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Akihabara


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Aoyama

vfd discussion

 * The article should make up its mind on whether it is a valid district of Tokyo or not. If it is, then it should be listed as one. Right now, two two districts link to it. — (WT-en) Ravikiran 20:34, 23 March 2006 (EST)
 * It is a district, although not an administrative unit, and it's not a particularly touristy bit of Tokyo. I've redirected to Tokyo/Minato for now. (WT-en) Jpatokal 21:19, 23 March 2006 (EST)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Aoyama


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Chiyoda

Anonymous critic
We just got back from the guided tour of the Imperial Palace, and really, really, really don't recommend it - you walk along a few concrete roads, see few concrete buildings, and have an English audio guide chattering away in your ear while the Japanese tourists (of which there are well over 100) get talked to by a man with a huge megaphone. There's nothing to see of interest, and it takes a good 90 minutes once you factor in the introductory video. Really, if you have grand ideas of the Tokyo imperial palace being in any way imperial or indeed a palace, you'll be disappointed.

Yorimichi
Please explain how the format has changed for the worse instead of just deleting the entry! (WT-en) Jpatokal 23:59, 10 October 2006 (EDT)

New banner
Banners which can also be considered for Tokyo, Tokyo (prefecture), Kanto or even Japan. /Yvwv (talk) 02:46, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * Banner 2, 3 and then 0. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 02:50, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * Very hard choice. 2, 1 and 3 are all very appealing and should be banners on something, if possible. 0 is also nice, but the picture quality is not as good. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:23, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * I think I like 0, then 1. 2 looks a bit fuzzy to me. ChubbyWimbus (talk) 13:04, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Chiyoda


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Gotanda

The number of conferences and events taking place in Gotanda has been increasing, so it is becoming a purpose-destination rather than a tourist one. Also, a huge boom in real estate development over the past several years is bringing the attendant growth in restaurants etc., so I though it was a good time to start this. (WT-en) Ted 22:49, 14 August 2010 (EDT)

Merge back into Shinagawa?
Does Gotanda need a separate article of its own? Shinagawa's article was only at outline status even before chunks of it were moved over here — given the amount of material available, I'd think it makes sense to keep it within the one article until it's large enough that a split is essential for readability. The trending thought on Talk:Tokyo has also been to keep the number of districts small and even consider further merges; adding this one brings us up to 30 districts, of which 17 are still down at outline status. — (WT-en) D. Guillaime 00:50, 20 August 2010 (EDT)

Re: Merge back into Shinagawa?
Hi,

Thanks for the feedback (WT-en) D. Guillaime. I was away traveling for a week, so I'm just getting back online or else I would have responded earlier.

Before I reply, I guess I should introduce myself a bit and give a little context. I really got into Wikivoyage a few years ago and loved working on it. Other projects came (and have now gone) so I wanted to dig in again. Hope my recent "plunge" wasn't too disruptive. In the interest of full disclosure: 1) My wife has started a travel-related business in the past couple years, but I think I do a pretty good job of not pushing that. 2) I do live in Gotanda, so I may (some might say do) have some hometown bias.

I'll try to discuss the very clear comments from Dguillame in ascending order of difficulty. Time dissipation alert: I may get a bit long-winded. Short version: I think this is worth doing to make the information more useful to visitors.

Does Gotanda need a separate article of its own?

Well, maybe it doesn't but here are a few entirely anecdotal reasons why I think it just might. And practical reasons too.
 * More and more foreign visitors are staying at hotels in the area and lots more short-term expats. I see more and more of these people wandering around looking lost. Expect this to increase as Haneda adds more direct international flights in the autumn.
 * I know of at least one conference/tradeshow bringing around 200 foreign visitors to Gotanda this November. There is a good chance it will become annual. Decent info for visitors is scanty.
 * I didn't get around to adding the local universities to the page yet, but they also have conferences. I've twice been emailed to help set up info in English for the area. Why not Wikivoyage it for anyone to use?
 * I really do think it is a good, convenient base to explore the city from but has been overlooked and gets pretty much zero coverage anywhere else.
 * Lots more info still to add, especially Eat, Drink, and a little bit about the character of the area.
 * Having a hard time seeing how to make this info work well in a larger district. But if there is a good example out there, please, please point me to it.
 * One more-although it looks close to Shinagawa Station on the map, roads, hills, and a large Mitsubishi estate tend to block the way on foot, so it is a bit disconnected in practice.

Shinagawa's article was only at outline status even before chunks of it were moved over here

I think the real problem here is that the Shinagawa page is woefully in need of work. That was sort of next on my personal to-do list for the rest of my vacation before I trudge back to the office. Shinagawa needs a lot more info. The only entries I moved over were ones that you'd really have to take the train two stations to Gotanda to access if you were staying in/visiting Shinagawa Station area.

I'd think it makes sense to keep it within the one article until it's large enough that a split is essential for readability.

I guess I just thought it was easier to work up, rather than do it all in one and then go through splitting. The readability question is the main thing. How to organize entries under Stay, Do, Eat, Drink that then require a kind of sub-organization based on where they are or a lot of directions that all begin "Get on the Yamanote Line and go to Gotanda"? The Takanawa-side of Shinagawa is pretty far from the area on this page and distinctly different in character. The old problem of Shinagawa Station being a clear point of reference, but that it is actually in Minato Ward still messy but just goes to show how difficult organizing Tokyo can be. I'll leave that one for another day!

The trending thought on Talk:Tokyo has also been to keep the number of districts small and even consider further merges

OK. For anyone playing at home, picture me reaching for the opener and a large, dusty old can labeled "Worms". If you are still reading, this may be a good time to take a break.

Some of the districts are so large, or so varied in character/purpose for visiting/interest that they require extensive transport to get around within them or they don't feel coherent. That is not meant as a criticism at all, but I think it just reflects the nature of this city. Here are some examples:

 * Minato, including the business centers of Akasaka and Shinbashi and the neighbouring nightclub district of Roppongi, the port district (at least in name) which includes the artificial island of Odaiba, the skyscrapers of Shiodome

Shinbashi and Roppongi are worlds apart as far as experience goes. The Minato page is essentially a container linking to these separate areas. Seems like a great idea and leaves a good organizational structure for filling in detail.

 * On the other hand we have this: Shibuya, the fashionable shopping district which also encompasses the teenybopper haven of Harajuku (also home to the Meiji Shrine) and the nightlife of Ebisu

The Shibuya page is a detailed exploration of the Shibuya Station shopping/nightlife area, not a container, but then links to Harajuku and Ebisu which are places in Shibuya Ward. So, things are inconsistent. Not terrible, but just a bit different. Kind of like Tokyo itself.

Anyway, to my point here. I have a hard time picturing a visitor (or remembering myself when I was new in town) with some of these larger divisions as a location. I think people will tend to ask themselves the questions "Where am I?" or "Where do I want to go?" Shinagawa is not an especially useful answer unless you are right in the immediate Shinagawa Station area. The answer is more likely to be a landmark or a major station.

…adding this one brings us up to 30 districts, of which 17 are still down at outline status

Looking at Tokyo namespace and comparing it with some others such as London (at 103) or Chicago (at 133), is 30 excessive? If many are down at outline status, is the solution to merge them back, or to build them up? I think merging them tends to reduce coherence, introduces possible complicated names, and makes it more difficult to add information to, or to find information within. Too many outlines? Maybe? But outlines are easy to add to, right?

OK. I did say I might be long-winded, right? Sorry about that! But, it's as complicated as Tokyo can be.

In retrospect, maybe I should have put some of the above in the Talk:Tokyo pages instead? But I'll wait and see.

Thanks, (WT-en) Ted 21:28, 25 August 2010 (EDT)

 * Sorry for the late response myself. I haven't been around much lately, and the site's been almost unusably slow more often than not for the last week as well.

 * First off, many thanks for the contributions you've been making to Tokyo listings lately. Shinagawa-ku has been badly lacking before, it's great to have its articles looking so much better!

 * I don't know if it's worthwhile to have each individual article represent "a location" — they do need to be useful for people that have never visited Tokyo (or any other article's city) before, which also means not overwhelming them with the minutiae of smaller neighborhoods that only make sense after more substantial time on the ground. This is especially the case if a new visitor prints out some articles to take with them, where they'd have to know the geographic proximity of different articles to get between them, and the more of them there are, the harder it gets.  The namespaces are misleading, because they include bunches of redirects: Tokyo's 30 districts is the second most of any city on WT, with Chicago in first at 34, and London trailing just behind at 28 [and Chicago down at 21, see below].  If you include the Tama region (highly debatable, I know), it's even more... but it's still not a very good article, with most of its districts still messy and underfilled.  Compare to other large Japanese cities like Osaka and Yokohama that are still all in one article!

 * Broadly speaking, I'm mostly still wondering if Gotanda is so different for a tourist that it needs separation... for conference visitors, it seems like some additional explanation of the stations in Shinagawa and the placement of hotels could serve just as well, and as you noticed the transportation discussion will need improvement anyhow as Haneda adds international flights. Expats have different needs – they certainly will understand the different neighborhoods, but they'll also be more interested in things like municipal services that the short-term visitor has no need of.

 * I think the model I'd like to adopt is more like Kyoto, which pushes its huge number of attractions into just five district articles, broken down by smaller areas with explanations for each and more text describing their relationship to each other. (Of course Tokyo needs many more than 5!)  They're larger areas geographically, but each district article itself is solid enough to stand on its own for a solid day of sightseeing, without necessarily needing the adjacent districts to make sense.  Now, to be fair, this is also heavily biased by my own personal fondness for the Kyoto article, because I helped divide it that way... so take that recommendation with a suitably large grain of salt.  :)  Rome also works.

 * — (WT-en) D. Guillaime 01:04, 10 September 2010 (EDT)
 * (Just a quick FYI: Chicago actually only has 21 districts.) --(WT-en) Peter Talk 14:14, 10 September 2010 (EDT)
 * Ah, I was just counting up Chicago's regionXitems entries without having noticed that some went to the same articles. Fixed, thanks. I believe that puts Tokyo into the #1 spot.  — (WT-en) D. Guillaime 16:02, 10 September 2010 (EDT)
 * Thanks for the pointers and corrections, (WT-en) D. Guillaime] and [[User:(WT-en) Peterfitzgerald|Peter. I really have been away for a while and totally misunderstood the namespace--redirect--actual district numbers. Point that 30 might be a lot. Kyoto is a great example of coherent and consistent districts, but I can't imagine trying to map Tokyo in the same way. Kyoto was built on a grid from the start and Tokyo is more of an agglomeration of neighborhoods. Rome looks interesting, but I've never been there.

 * Gotanda may not be so different, but that could probably apply to other districts like Meguro too. I also tried to clean up and combine the Jiyugaoka/Jiyuugaoka pages see Talk:Jiyugaoka which raise the same issues. Maybe it should be merged, but where to? Meguro or Setagaya? It is certainly distinct in feel, interest, and transport from Meguro. If these two districts were merged into a larger district, which one? And how to keep it coherent?

 * I guess I'm just not sure how/why to merge districts into other districts that don't hang together all that well. (Although here is where I have to admit that I may be responsible for some of those bad divisions in the first place. Sorry!) If Gotanda merges into Shinagawa, should it just be Shinagawa-ku (moving all of the station area info into Minato)? Still like the way Minato is a brief intro linking to all of the neighborhood-type districts. That basically leaves Minato to forever be an outline, but it works.

 * One other thing I'm wondering about is how specifically to move the Gotanda info into Shinagawa. For example, eat. Just have the same Budget/Mid-Range/Splurge divisions as any other district? That would leave listings of restaurants grouped together that could take you 30 minutes to get between, even using a train. Or, make subdivisions under Budget etc by location? For example: Budget sublistings by station area? Just seems that grouping everything scattered across a wide area might lead tourists back and forth and up, down, and around.

 * I know I could just "plunge ahead" wanted to try to discuss this a bit before merging so as not to thrash back and forth. If I read it correctly, the city-district-model on Wikivoyage might have trouble encompassing the many different neighborhoods of Tokyo. Keeping the districts big gets a bit unmanageable and each one loses some coherence. Keeping the districts small gets you a huge list. There are already pretty well established sub-districts like Harajuku district within Shibuya district. I know Wikivoyage doesn't really have a sub-district, but we've seen to got them already. I could see something like this:

 * Tokyo/Minato with the existing district-in-district of
 * Minato is a fairly sprawling ward with no single center. The following parts of Minato have their own articles:
 * Akasaka - a business district and nightlife area near the government center
 * Odaiba - the Tokyo of the future built on reclaimed land in Tokyo Bay
 * Roppongi - nightlife central for Tokyo's foreign population
 * Shiodome - a still-growing cluster of brand new skyscrapers
 * Shinbashi - an older business and commercial district
 * and a new district-in-district of Takanawadai which would collect all of the Shinagawa Station area info

 * Tokyo/Shinagawa district which would be stripped of all of the station information (but with a prominent pointer to Takanawadai) which could collect Shinagawa-ku proper, including Gotanda, Osaki, and outlying areas like Togoshi Ginza (which I'd love to work up-a great walking neighborhood).

 * Does that make sense?

 * (WT-en) Ted 01:01, 19 September 2010 (EDT)

 * So, long story short, we — including any other interested contributors — should really figure out what we're doing with all the Tokyo districts once and for all. Shall we shelve this specific discussion until that happens?

 * It later occurred to me that New York City definitely has more districts now, but only because it turned into a three tier article, which in turn only worked because the five boroughs are unambiguously separated. That exact structure won't work for Tokyo, but your suggestion above of parent and child districts is a similar idea in concept.  It might solve some problems....  — (WT-en) D. Guillaime 01:52, 21 September 2010 (EDT)
 * Hi (WT-en) D. Guillaime! Thanks for checking in again and letting me talk through some ideas. Right, nothing neat and unambiguous about Tokyo districts. I guess we have to pick this up later on the Tokyo Talk page. A bit too busy with work right now to actually try to undertake such a project, but it is still percolating away in my brain. Several ways of looking at it. In many ways organizing by station names is more intuitive (that's how people will tend to get around or be able to identify where they are). But, so many stations sit squarely on a line between different wards etc. I think the parent/child approach might help with that. Also, looking at something like the Tokyo/Setagaya district would be a good test. Setagaya is huge and at least Sangenjaya and Shimokitazawa deserve separate coverage. Right now, the Setagaya page is mainly Shimokitazawa anyway. In any event, I hope eventually getting some districts cleared up will encourage people to add useful info. For myself, I sometimes hesitate to add stuff because I'm not sure where exactly to add it. More later over on Talk:Tokyo(WT-en) Ted 20:28, 24 September 2010 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Gotanda


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Harajuku

Best time
what is the best time to visit Harajuku?

 * After you've fallen in love with Hello Kitty. Kawaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii! ♪┏(・o･)┛♪┗ ( ･o･) ┓♪┏  ┛♪┗ (･o･ ) ┓♪┏(･o･)┛♪ (WT-en) Jpatokal 02:31, 22 February 2007 (EST)

Eat
Recommendations from a Japanese friend living in the area, if someone could check and add them:

Hotcake: http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130601/13139698/ http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130601/13150264/

Gyoza: http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130601/13001284/

Bistro: http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130601/13045024/

Soba: http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130601/13129390/

Casual Japanese food: http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130602/13154538/

Churasco: http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130602/13003475/

Mexican: http://tabelog.com/tokyo/A1306/A130601/13004395/

02:30, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Harajuku


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Ikebukuro

ZOZOI?? Don't tell me there's also a LALA'O... -(WT-en) phma 18:55, 18 Jun 2004 (EDT)

Ikebukuro or Toshima
"Ikebukuro" has been recognized as a major place name to many Japanese in the same way as "Akihabara".

Most Japanese don't have a image of the Toshima. --(WT-en) Kambayashi10:11, 16 August 2011

 * Yes., but does it make sense to combine both in one article? So combining Toshima and Ikebukuro and then naming it Ikebukuro, is that appropriate? --(WT-en) globe-trotter 10:01, 16 August 2011 (EDT)

 * Toshima is one of the Tokyo's 23 special wards. Ikebukuro is one of the areas in Toshima. I don't think you should combine both in one article. --(WT-en) Kambayashi

 * Let's continue the discussion here: Talk:Tokyo. --(WT-en) globe-trotter 11:07, 17 August 2011 (EDT)
 * User:Jpatokal: I believe merging (Toshima into Ikebukuro) is helpful from a traveller point of view and I've seen a discussion was started years back. A quick glance gives the idea that it was agreed to merge both into one. But I'm not sure why the merging was never progressed. --Saqib (talk) 11:40, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

 * Because people are lazy and the districting of Tokyo is such a hard problem. But I'd say go for it! Jpatokal (talk) 22:41, 15 March 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Ikebukuro


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Meguro

Meguro station is actually located in the Shinagawa Ward, not Meguro ward. The Tokyo Metropolitan Teien Art Museum is located in the Minato Ward. Reference http://www.teien-art-museum.ne.jp/info/e_access.html

 * Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn. =) We're aiming for travellers here, not bureaucrats. (WT-en) Jpatokal 11:56, 20 October 2006 (EDT)

 * Then pray tell the legitimacy of using wards as a means of categorization. Even natives don't consciously acknowledge ward boundaries inside Tokyo; areas centering on main train stations for example would be a more practical option. (e.g. Ebisu/Meguro/Daikanyama area) If on the other hand wards is the direction you want to go with, shouldn't they at least be accurate?

 * Wards are useful when they correspond to rational divisions, and eg. Tokyo/Shibuya and Tokyo/Shinjuku are centered around stations of the same name, but Wikivoyage doesn't follows wards religiously: consider eg. Tokyo/Asakusa (not a ward) and Tokyo/Odaiba (theoretically split between three wards). The fact that Meguro Station is not in Meguro Ward is, even by Japanese standards, so bizarre that I don't think we need to burden tourists with this pointless trivia — if it's between Meguro stn and Meguro ward, it's Meguro enough for me. (WT-en) Jpatokal 12:01, 22 October 2006 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Meguro


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Minato

Older discussions
Copied from Project:10 June 2004 by (WT-en) Evan

There's a description of the Tokyo Tower in Tokyo/Minato. A Google search for "Tokyo Tower" finds a lot of similar text. Especially http://metropolis.japantoday.com/BigInJapan/381/biginjapaninc.htm which includes the fragment
 * The Tokyo Tower has two observation galleries - a "main" one at 150 meters and a "special" one at 250 meters. On a fine - and relatively unpolluted - day

...
 * spectacular views of Mt. Fuji to the west, the Boso and Miura peninsulas (on either side of Tokyo Bay), the Hakone mountains and Mt. Tsukuba to the northeast.

Does this count as "too similar?" -- (WT-en) Colin 21:32, 10 Jun 2004 (EDT)

 * I think so. I'll blank the section, and let's copy this note to Talk:Tokyo/Minato. --(WT-en) Evan 23:59, 10 Jun 2004 (EDT)

 * Sorry about that. I pointed this student to Wikivoyage. Sometimes it is tough to catch plagiarism with some of the more skilled writers. I knew he had looked at Wikipedia about Tokyo Tower, but not the Metropolis page. I didn't Google for phrases as he is usually a good writer anyway. I'll ask him about it and try to keep a closer eye on things. Thanks. (WT-en) Ted 23:11, 15 Jun 2004 (EDT)

Organizing this article better
I really think that "Minato-ku" is not a particularly good subject for a travel article, since the ward is so big and many of its area are really best lumped in with others. Specifically, here's the breakdown I'm thinking of:

 * Akasaka/Kamiyacho
 * Aoyama/Omotesando
 * Roppongi/Azabu
 * Shinbashi/Shiodome
 * Shirokane/Takanawa/Konan (perhaps in the "Shinagawa" article)
 * Shiba/Mita/Hamamatsucho
 * Odaiba

This would make more sense with regard to "what can be seen in XX area," no? - (WT-en) Sekicho 01:31, 23 September 2007 (EDT)

 * I agree that the current districts are terribibable, and there's been a lot of talk about redoing the whole city on Talk:Tokyo. Chip in! (WT-en) Jpatokal

Districts of districts
Where is the discussion on making this district a huge city with its own districts. Just want to be clear this is the correct thing to do? --Traveler100 (talk) 16:33, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Sengaku-ji: duplicated in Minato and Shinagawa
User 隼鷹 copied this temple from Shinagawa to Minato, and now it is duplicated. I don't know which of them makes more sense: it is located in Minato (like Shinagawa station!), but it is not located near any other attraction of these two wards. — Fabimaru (talk) 19:16, 23 May 2016 (UTC)

 * I think as a rule, attractions should be listed in the district where they're located, unless perhaps there's a compelling reason to do otherwise. Is there a compelling reason otherwise in this case, and if so, what would it be? Also, let's note that it's always possible to include text like this in Tokyo/Shinagawa, if it's accurate: "The famous Sangaku-ji, though associated with Shinagawa, is actually in Minato; see that article for its listing." Ikan Kekek (talk) 21:21, 23 May 2016 (UTC)

 * I have seen it in the past, for example it Tokyo/Roppongi which lists some attractions from Akasaka with the following text: "Some of the attractions listed bellow are officially located in Akasaka, but it is more practical to include them in a visit on Roppongi.". I would prefer this approach but only when it makes sense (which should not be frequent). For example if a cluster of attractions is located near a group of another district but far from the rest of the attractions of its district. – Fabimaru (talk) 17:24, 24 May 2016 (UTC)

 * I believe this is an actual, not a proposed rule, but I don't think your points contradict mine. Did you note "unless perhaps there's a compelling reason to do otherwise"? What would the reason be, in this case? In any case, we absolutely should not have listings in two different destination articles. That's prohibited by the don't tout policy. Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:25, 24 May 2016 (UTC)

 * I don't know if it is an actual rule, I tried to search a bit in the help but did not find (maybe that is what the text around Geographical_hierarchy means). I did notice "unless perhaps there's a compelling reason to do otherwise". Do you mean for this page, or in general? In this specific case, I don't know. In general, I gave an example of "compelling reason": "if a cluster of attractions…". Maybe I did not understand correctly your question…
 * Finally, concerning this specific case, as 隼鷹 did not answer in this page (I hoped to grab his/her attention by mentioning him/her), I will try in his/her discussion page. Maybe it was an oversight. Anyway, any insight is still welcome from anyone who knows the area. – Fabimaru (talk) 16:50, 25 May 2016 (UTC)

 * I looked in the history for this temple, it had been added in the first revision of Shinagawa in 2004, and later added in Minato in 2005 by Jpatokal. In 2015, it has been removed from Shinagawa by 49.239.64.174. If nobody gives a reason after a few days, I propose to remove it from Shinagawa. — Fabimaru (talk) 17:16, 25 May 2016 (UTC)

 * Sengakuji Primarily at Tokyo/Minato but near than Shinagawa St. The question is similar station name priority address?
 * I am the opinion address priority other things. --隼鷹 (talk) 02:10, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

 * That's been my view in regard to some debatable listings in Manhattan, too. Unless someone else gives a strong reason to delete the listing here and leave it in Tokyo/Shinagawa, we should delete the listing in Tokyo/Shinagawa. And in terms of the compelling reason to do otherwise, I was asking in regard to this case in particular, as putting a listing in the "wrong" district could be confusing and should never be the rule. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:20, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
 * So many exception the rule, Beginners difficult to understand or writing, and also confusion. Most clarity things, it use the address. But this case in the first place "wrong" Shinagawa St not at Shinagawa Ward, at Minato Ward. I think not clearly this page is Shinagawa St or Shinagawa Ward, Thus, I am not delted Sengakuji on Shinagawa. --隼鷹 (talk) 16:39, 27 May 2016 (UTC)

 * I think there's a very clear rule on the don't tout page forbidding attractions from being given full listings in more than one destination article. There's no problem with mentioning it in another article and pointing to the one that covers it, though. Does that make sense? Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:30, 28 May 2016 (UTC)

 * OK, I do not challenge the rules, and not an intricate knot. I have to delte Sengakuji on Shinagawa. So Thank you to discuss with me. --隼鷹 (talk) 03:18, 29 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Certainly. Ikan Kekek (talk) 10:26, 30 May 2016 (UTC)

No point of having a separate article for Shinbashi?
Not too many listings in the article for Shinbashi so far. Maybe it would be better to remove this subdistrict again and add the information back to Minato? --Renek78 (talk) 13:30, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Could be. The tree goes really deep. /Yvwv (talk) 22:11, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

New banner

Suggesting new banner; see Talk:Japan for ongoing votes. /Yvwv (talk) 01:49, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * [Edited] 5, 1, 2. I prefer 1 to 2 because the perspective distortion is not as strong. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:02, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * I prefer 2, 1, 0, distantly 4 and then 3. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 02:40, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * 1, 2, I like the cherry blossom. I find it a little confusing seeing a banner being proposed for multiple articles. AlasdairW (talk) 21:42, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

 * If a banner wins more than one contest, we should use it for the highest-level article; continent, country or huge city. These articles get the most exposure. /Yvwv (talk) 22:08, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Minato


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Odaiba

Political correctness gone wild
As the article says, Venusfort is explicitly targeted for women, which is why the article suggests it as an alternative for women. (WT-en) Jpatokal 04:28, 23 July 2007 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Odaiba


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Roppongi

Opiniated
This article's a bit opinionated, especially with the use of the words "desperate." I've been to Gas Panic several times, and would hardly qualify myself as such.

 * This is not Wikipedia, we're allowed to be opinionated. Incidentally, nobody living in Tokyo ever admits to going to Gas Panic, yet they all do =) (WT-en) Jpatokal 21:13, 24 May 2005 (EDT)
 * Well Gaspanic is admittable if your below 25. But nobody EVER admits going to Motown. And of course I have never met a couple who would admit having met in Roppongi whatsoever.

Atelier de Joel Robuchon
"Atelier de Joel Robuchon. Roppongi Hills Hillside 2F, 6-10-1 Roppongi, tel. 03-5772-7500, [8] (http://www.robuchon.com/). The first overseas venture of the eponymous Paris-based Michelin-starred chef. Each dish is a work of art almost as breathtaking as the price tag, at ¥1000-4000 per dish."

Is this price a typo? It seems a little cheap for the 'expensive' section? (WT-en) Thewayoftheduck 05:58, 5 Feb 2006 (EST)

 * Why so? ¥4000 per dish is a leedle expensive even by Tokyo standards... (WT-en) Jpatokal 08:31, 5 Feb 2006 (EST)

 * Heh. Just couldn't get my mind around Michelin and $40 tops. Just googled it (should have done that first. sorry!) and the course menus range from 2900yen to 12800yen, but there are indeed (presumably small) dishes for 1000yen. Ignore the above :) (WT-en) Thewayoftheduck 23:11, 6 Feb 2006 (EST)

 * This is more important that the prices of individual appetizers (especially as I've once gotten a starter in a fancy Japanese restaurant that consisted of three (3) beans), so I've added in the course pricing. (WT-en) Jpatokal 23:42, 6 Feb 2006 (EST)

avoid the roppongi crossing "main street"
One piece of advice that this article lacks is that all the "hustlers" congregate on the main street near roppongi crossing. Real places that japanese people go to are beyond the main street. Never believe someone that approaches you in the street for a proposition - especially here! If possible, take some adventuresome Japanese people with you, that could help have a good time.

I tried to delete the reference to the "Almond" but they put it back. The Almond closed some time ago, so don't arrange to meet people there!

 * Almond is open again. Syced (talk) 04:44, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

Exchange rate of the century

 * 500 Yen for 100 USD.

We have a saying in Finnish: you're not a fool if you sell, but you're a fool if you buy. (WT-en) Jpatokal 09:55, 15 June 2007 (EDT)

Unclear description.
In understand section: "nightlife has been striving since the 19th century" - what does this mean? • • • Peter (Southwood) (talk): 07:18, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Thriving? I thought Roppongi was already a hotbed of nightlife earlier than the 19th century, but perhaps I'm incorrect about that. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:21, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Cheers to those working on this article
Hi folks. Just wanted to say looks like a pretty well-balance picture of Roppongi you've created here. Mostly accurate from what I can see. Been living in Tokyo from 6 years and have had many client meetings in Roppongi. I might reiterate that it seems plausible to highlight (perhaps a little more) some of the more attractive aspects of Roppongi, while giving a stern reminder of the pitfalls (mainly, getting ripped off in a strip joint, seems to be conveyed at this point.) —The preceding comment was added by Goodmoto (talk • contribs)

Map pitfalls ?
I just looked at the map, and I'm troubled by the fact that only a couple of street names are shown without zooming in, and even more troubled by the fact that there are still lots of unnamed streets at the highest level of zoom when I'm looking at the map in a full-screen view. Can something be done about this? Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:28, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I see your question just now. - You can only do one thing: convince the Japanese that these streets should have names. Street names are seldom used in postal addresses (except in Kyoto and some Hokkaidō cities such as Sapporo), and most Japanese streets do not have names. The addresses consist of the number or name of city blocks and the number of the cadastral parcel or a section number of the block (see ). - Joachim Mey2008 (talk) 10:28, 2 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I know Tokyo addresses, for instance, are very difficult to understand. As I recall, the oldest building on a street (or block?) was #1, the second oldest was #2, etc. During my first trip to Tokyo in 1975, neither taxi drivers nor policemen were able to tell us where the Isseido Bookstore was, and we just lucked out in randomly running into the only other people my parents knew in Tokyo, who directed us to the store, which was right near where we got out of a cab. Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:53, 2 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes, I seriously doubt any of those smaller streets have names at all. There's no problem with the map. Texugo (talk) 17:45, 2 April 2014 (UTC)
 * While most streets have no name, the map is missing some existing names. I added a few ones to OpenStreetMaps. The street names are not even on Google Maps. Syced (talk) 05:09, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

Pub crawl
I deleted the pub crawl listing on the basis that people don't need to take tours to go to pubs, but I think perhaps this is the unusual pub crawl that actually does deserve a listing based on value added. Here's what User:Goodmoto said in his/her recent edit summary:

"Clearly fulfills tour requirements as a value-added activity per description regarding discounts and free shots for participants."

I've invited Goodmoto to post an argument here, but under the circumstances, I'm quite inclined to revert my own reversion of his post and let the pub crawl listing stand.

What say you all? Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:37, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

 * Never been to any, but doesn't every pub crawl everywhere offer discounts? I'm against listing pub crawls since a traveller can fulfil the substance of the tour (getting drunk and meeting people) on their own. Jjtkk (talk) 15:38, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

 * I haven't, either. Do they all offer discounts and free shots? You're right that you can fulfill the substance of this on your own, and if that's the sole guiding standard, it can't be listed. Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:46, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

 * I typed pub crawl in google and checked several links to events organised in Prague, Sao Paulo, Boracay, Dublin and Minneapolis. They all offered unlimited beer, amazing free drinks, super special cocktails, free T-shirts and what have you. Jjtkk (talk) 19:06, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

 * The thing this pub crawl offers are free shots, one at every venue it goes too. Also the walk between the bars pub crawl also gives away shots to help people who want to get a extra in their system.  4 bars 4 shots.  3 bars changes 3 more shots 7 total.  Roppongi drink prices standard ranges from 800-1500Yen.  Pub crawl members get drinks from 300 to 500Yen(Max).  Free entry to a night club.   One of the reason I believe it should be listed is I believe pub crawl is doing a service to the bars in the area and the attendees.  Tokyo Pub Crawls focuses on developing that particular area of roppongi and helping the business get more regular customers. TPC is conciously trying to change the reputation of roppongi as "sketchy" and "dangerous" to safe and reputable.  The event and activities are geared solely toward creating the best social interaction environment possible.  Not only with free drinks, but games, mixers, and activities focused on getting to know one another.  Tokyo Pub Crawl is a staple of Roppongi nightlife and should be listed as event that currently ongoing. The Bar Sponsor of the pub crawls allows memmbers who visit the bar at a non event time will still be able to receive discounts just by saying the Pub Crawl name.  For regular roppongi customers buying 3 drinks in any bar would fulfill the cost of the Tokyo Pub Crawl. —The preceding comment was added by Andrewnguyend (talk • contribs)

 * Thanks for inviting me to this talk page. I'm not sure about other instance on WikiVoyage, but reading the description and thinking about the actual purpose and benefit to the end users of Wikivoyage (vs. the benefit to the vendor), it seemed to me this would be a valid listing. My rationale is as follows: First, there may be other pub crawls with similar offerings, but nonetheless these constitute "value-added" benefits, i.e. discounts or free drinks or whatever it is that you couldn't otherwise obtain. Second, as someone who has attended pub crawls before, I would argue that there is definitely value in such an event in that you know exactly where to meet, you don't have to figure out which bars are hot and which one are not, and most importantly there's a lot other like-minded people (traveling alone, have no idea where to go, don't know anybody) waiting for you. Goodmoto (talk) 08:04, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

 * My opinion is that pub crawls are like tour operators: They find spots, negotiate deals with owners, sell the result as a package that costs less than the sum of its separately-bought parts, and customers are often put in groups which is an opportunity for socialization. Our policy is to NOT list tour operators. You wrote that pub crawl operators know "*which bars are hot*" ... well Wikivoyage's goal is already to maintain that kind of information, so no need to list pub crawls. Syced (talk) 05:21, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

Cinem@rt-
I remove this listing as the building is currently being torn down, not sure if it is temporary or definitive:

Syced (talk) 03:52, 12 October 2015 (UTC)
 * The website indicates that it closed mid-June, with no comment about a re-opening. – Fabimaru (talk) 21:17, 16 October 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Roppongi


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Setagaya

Should Setagaya and Shimokitazawa be separated? See also the incorrectly namespaced Shimokitazawa, which should be merged. (WT-en) Jpatokal 14:17, 20 Oct 2004 (EDT)

Names
I have had difficulty finding places here with only the English name. Please include the Japanese name under "alt" if possible. Also, the phone number is very important. --(WT-en) Orcrist 22:23, 12 July 2011 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Setagaya


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Shibuya

in the Sleep section it is stated that: Shibuya is also surrounded by love hotels. Can anyone explain this love hotel euphemism. Is it Japinglish for a red light district, honeymoon hotels, a quick marriage and wedding chappel area like Las Vegas has or something else? -- (WT-en) Huttite 08:11, 5 Apr 2004 (EDT)

 * Love Hotel is a bit of a euphemism, I suppose the more accurate term would be sex hotel. They can be found in and near red light districts, but most are not. Many of them are often clustered around highway interchanges or main train stations out of the city and back to the suburbs. Basically you can rent a room by the night or the hour. They are generally clean, safe, and very private. Some have fantastic themes like castles, Disney, sports, whatever. Think about the housing shortage that plagued post-war Japan for years, and the way people still live in extended families. If you are 28 years old and still at home, do you really want to bring your mate back to your folks' house? Or, if you are a married couple in a 40 square meter apartment with your two grade school children, do you really want to get down to it?

 * Thus, the love hotel. They can be seedy, but mainly they are just practical and fulfill a social need. I guess I need to really write them up in a more traveler friendly way, but school is keeping me busy these days.

 * (WT-en) Ted 21:19, 8 Apr 2004 (EDT)

 * Thanks for the explanation. How you explained it sounds pretty good to me. I have put your explanation in Japan under the Sleep heading as a subheading for Love hotels as I thought that would probably be a good place to stick it. -- (WT-en) Huttite 22:05, 8 Apr 2004 (EDT)

 * Gee, Ted, thanks for ruining the mystery; I thought my very minor addition to the Tokyo page would convey the answer. :)

 * I think all of the 'Stay' stuff under Tokyo should be moved over to 'Japan'. And we can also add minshuku, which aren't very common in any city, but worth experiencing. -- (WT-en) Paul Richter 23:22, 8 Apr 2004 (EDT)

Book 1st
This listing was recently deleted. All I could find on-line was there were plans to move the store from this location to Shinjuku in fall 2008. Can anyone confirm this has happened and update the listing?

 * Book 1st. (Bunkamura-dori), . One of Tokyo's largest bookstores. Carries a good range of foreign language magazines, add to a huge array of venues to eat and drink.

(WT-en) Shaund 12:13, 23 September 2008 (EDT)

The pink cow
It seems to have moved to roppongi ?

title: Talk:Tokyo/Shibuya


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Shinagawa

Closed listing
It really is closed--along with some other places too. (WT-en) Ted 01:04, 27 August 2010 (EDT)
 * An anonymous user reported that the following listing has been closed. I am copying it here just in case. – (WT-en) Vidimian 04:50, 22 June 2010 (EDT)

 * Unfortunately, this cafe closed on May 31, 2010. The Executive Tower has also been renamed the Annex Tower. You will need to purchase a drink. After purchasing a drink, you would need to fill out a form with your name and your address at the front desk. You will receive a USB key. This place has very good and friendly (English speaking) service and personnel, but the laptops have very small keyboards, with keys unusually close together - so it is a bit hard to type. Camera available on some of the computers. Available printing: Regular at ¥30 and Color at ¥150.

How to organize Eat in such a sprawling district
Could someone please take a look at what I've done with the Budget section of Eat? I know it doesn't really follow the template, but just trying to make the information more useful. It's a couple minutes walk just from the East to West exits of the station, plus there is quite a bit inside the station. Lumping them all into single Budget list seemed like it might be difficult to navigate-especially if I get around to adding more entries.

I might have done the wrong thing recently by splitting off Talk:Tokyo/Gotanda and just want to see what people think before I go further.

This does raise a few issues about the pesky old Shinagawa district as a whole though. I'm not sure how well this kind of organization will hold up over time-especially to cover farther flung parts of the district such as Osaki or Togoshi-Ginza. And, the station itself is in Minato-ku anyway.

Thanks!

(WT-en) Ted 01:02, 27 August 2010 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Shinagawa


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Shinbashi

N or M?
"You say "Shinbashi", I say "Shimbashi", let's call the whole thing off."

Is it worth standardizing on one spelling throughout? I'm inclined to pick M because that's what the station is named (and if you can't trust JR East, who can you trust?), but conversely, N leads using this highly sophisticated research tool. -- (WT-en) Dguillaime 02:07, 8 December 2008 (EST)

 * Project:Romanization says we use revised Hepburn, and that says N, not M. But creating redirects is always good. (WT-en) Jpatokal 04:52, 8 December 2008 (EST)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Shinbashi


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Shinjuku

Should this page be rewritten to be more like Chiyoda, with separate sections for the major areas of the city (Shinjuku station area, Waseda/Takadanobaba, Shin-Okubo/Okubo, Ichigaya/Yotsuya, Kagurazaka, etc.)? It's currently heavily biased towards Shinjuku station, which makes including info on other areas a bit of a pain.61.118.147.157 02:45, 5 August 2009 (EDT)

 * I don't think so. It's not that long right now, and splitting into too many sections makes it confusing (I personally think the Chiyoda-area articles are too messy already).  New listings in other areas of Shinjuku are always appreciated.  - (WT-en) Dguillaime 17:08, 5 August 2009 (EDT)

 * Chiyoda's current sections are not separated into major areas. While the Imperial Palace Gardens could be considered an area, "Shrines and churches" and "Other" are not areas. If there are areas that can be designated, I think they do make articles more organized, but Chiyoda is not a good example of that. (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 20:09, 5 August 2009 (EDT)

 * Sorry, I meant more like Tokyo/Minato, with separate sections (pages) for each major center within the ward. At any rate I'll try to keep expanding it. -61.118.147.157 00:45, 6 August 2009 (EDT)

Where are all the GLBT listings?
For talking about how Ni-chome is the main gay district of Tokyo, there are no such listings under the Drink section. Did they get deleted, or just forgotten? --(WT-en) BigPeteB 15:01, 6 December 2011 (EST)

 * Indeed, an article on Shinjuku is not complete without this information. Anoby just jump in and add relevant listings, thanks! Syced (talk) 06:59, 7 August 2015 (UTC)

Oak House listing
I'm moving this listing here for discussion:

If we list this, since its headquarters are in Shibuya, it presumably should be listed in Tokyo/Shibuya. But what's the policy on listing apartment listing sites? I don't think we list sites like AirBnB or HomeAway in articles for cities, do we? But I think the governing policy is actually laid out in Apt, as follows:

Wikivoyage is neither an apartment-finder service nor a real estate listing service, so in general real estate and rental agency listings are not allowed. The only exception to this rule is for locations where rental properties are a common form of travel accommodation and the following requirements are met:

 * 1) Consensus must be achieved on the article's talk page that rental listings should be allowed.  When trying to build consensus provide some evidence that rental properties are commonly used by travelers to the destination and that their addition will improve the article.  Please do not argue the merits of any particular company, but instead focus on the value of such accommodation for travelers to the destination city/region.
 * 2) If consensus is achieved, rental agency listings must be placed into a separate sub-section of the article's "Sleep" section.
 * 3) Agency listings must include a local address with a phone number that specifies the physical address at the destination for picking up the keys, managing the property and/or resolving rental issues.  This address must also be prominently displayed on the agency web site.
 * 4) Apartments or cabins must be available for rentals of one week or less - remember, Wikivoyage is a travel guide, not an apartment-finder service.

So, is it common for travelers to rent an apartment in Tokyo while they visit for a week or less? Please comment on this. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:56, 19 April 2016 (UTC)

New banner
In my opinion, the banner does not make justice to the district, and is also used for another article. Please consider the new banners. /Yvwv (talk) 01:43, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Banner 2 SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 01:44, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Either is better, I lean towards 2 Tai123.123 (talk) 01:46, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Ditto, except that I prefer 1, but if 1 is used for another article, 2 would be fine. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:03, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * See Talk:Japan for banner contests. Motifs with crowds of homogenously looking people are an overused stereotype for East Asia. We should find other themes. /Yvwv (talk) 14:19, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Vote is still open. /Yvwv (talk) 22:18, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Shinjuku


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Sumida

Popeye Beer Club
Are you sure that it isn't english friendly? They seem to have a fairly comprehensive English website and western food. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 133.51.82.122 (talk • contribs)

 * That caveat was added recently by another anonymous contributor, . If you know the place, please feel free to edit it accordingly.  -- (WT-en) D. Guillaime 13:24, 18 March 2010 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Sumida


text:
Talk:Tokyo/Ueno

is there a cost for the Ueno Zoo and the Ueno Park?

 * The park is free, but there is an admission charge for the zoo. While in the area, visit the street market across from the station, and if you are up for a long walk, see old Tokyo by hiking over to the Asakusa Temple in Asakusa. (WT-en) WindHorse 28 Jan 06

City walk plagiarized from Lonely Planet
Sorry, but the city walk looks like a close plagiarism of the walk on p99 of the current Lonely Planet Japan. —The preceding comment was added by 128.237.154.30 (talk • contribs)

 * If you know that, you should delete it right away. I'll try to find the exact section you're referring to, but you know exactly what it is, so why didn't you delete it and put this remark in an edit summary you would type in the "Summary" box below your edit screen? Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:39, 22 May 2024 (UTC)

 * That said, I found nothing in a web search and haven't found anything in a search of the Lonely Planet site. I guess the city walk is only in print copies of Lonely Planet Japan? Why wouldn't they have included it on their site? Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:47, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Earwig's gives a 44.7% chance that the article contains "copyvio" from Flickr, but it seems that the Flickr user took the description from us (not the other way around). -- SHB2000  (t | c | m) 12:30, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for checking that out, User:SHB2000! I don't think we should delete the section unless we have more evidence. User:128.237.154.30, which edition of Lonely Planet Japan were you looking at? Was it published before the edits were made to this article by User:SNN95 on November 19, 2017? Could you please type some passages from the printed guide in question, so that we can compare the phrasings? I think that quoting a few sentences with a citation on a talk page for the purposes of determining plagiarism is a respectable fair use. Ikan Kekek (talk) 13:38, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I have edited the text to improve the flow and style. Ground Zero (talk) 17:27, 22 May 2024 (UTC)

Shinjyuku? Not Shinjuku?
Dear 隼鷹, you reverted my modification by changing "Shinjuku" into "Shinjyuku". As far as I know, the official/usual name is "Shinjuku". Could you explain in which context "Shinjyuku" would be a more adapted writing please? — Fabimaru (talk) 18:54, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

Changed banner
I changed the banner which was a panda. I thought it was a good illustration of the Ueno zoo… until I realized it was a photo from San Diego. I am not completely satisfied with the replacement (a rotated view of the National Museum), but I find it more honest. If you find better do not hesitate. I think that the good candidates are the zoo, the park, the pond and the National Museum. — Fabimaru (talk) 20:00, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tokyo/Ueno


text:
Talk:Tokyo Disney Resort

Hello, I had a last minute question about Tokyo Disney -- I'm planning to go in a few days, and I was wondering what the chance is of being able to see all of the original attractions (ie, not in Orlando) in both parks in one day over December? For example, I was able to see both parks in Disneyland Paris in one day during peak season summer months. Need to know if it would be worth it to buy a one day park hopper. Thanks.--121.55.243.66 13:51, 9 December 2007 (EST)

WDW/Disney comparison..
I'm thinking of making a sub-section in understand, which attempts answers the question - I've done WDW and/or Disneyland in the states, and I'm in Japan for a holiday - is it worthwhile spending a couple of days at Tokyo Disney Resort. Then rounding up all the remaining bits of comparision between disney parks, and putting them there. --(WT-en) inas 19:30, 10 September 2009 (EDT)

Tokyo Disney Resort article status
I just completed a prolific overhaul of the Tokyo Disney Resort article, which included replacing the flawed map with a more accurate one. However, I'm not quite sure if it meets the quality of a guide or even star article. Please, let me hear some comments before I decide whether to push the article status up to guide. (WT-en) Jonathan 784 19:16, 7 September 2009 (EDT)

Whoops, forgot to mention that this was an unsuccessful nomination for Collaboration of the Month. (WT-en) Jonathan 784 19:18, 7 September 2009 (EDT)

 * It's a lot better than it used to be and could almost squeak by as a guide in my book, but the lead pic is terrible, and the restaurants and hotels need proper listings. (WT-en) Jpatokal 00:34, 8 September 2009 (EDT)

 * I think JPatokal pretty much summed up the issues with the article as it is. I got rid of the box about driving, because that information belongs on the Japan page. If your goal is to push this to a star article, then I think the "See and Do" section should be more than just a summary of what each place offers. It should be more like the Walt Disney Pages: Walt Disney World/Hollywood Studios

every attraction is listed as something to See/Do, and I think it makes a much more complete and informative article. Right now, in order to know what the attractions are, we have to "Visit the Screening Room" as it says in the article, but I believe the goal of Wikivoyage is to be the sole source of information. With that, I don't think it's a good idea to give links to websites with better information. That shows a weakness in our article. (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 00:56, 8 September 2009 (EDT)

 * Many parts seem to take the style of, you've been to Disneyland or WDW, and now here are the differences. As far as possible each article should stand on its own.   I'm sure if I were to edit the WDW so the opening line of the attractions section says, fans of the Japanese Disneyland will be disappointed, because the Magic Kingdom is just the same, it wouldn't be the best opening.  Sure the info has a place in both articles, but primarily we should be describing the park, and putting any required comparisons in a subsection. --(WT-en) inas 01:13, 8 September 2009 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tokyo Disney Resort


text:
Talk:Toledo (Ohio)

There's another Toledo, actually.

Also: private cars?! --(WT-en) Evan 02:18, 11 Feb 2004 (EST)

Banner Update
Hello,

We may want to update the banner - I think the site shown in the current banner has been turned into a park. Mbrickn (talk) 00:09, 29 October 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Toledo (Ohio)


text:
Talk:Toledo

I added some stuff to "Buy." I'm usually not one to edit but since I've been to Toledo, I thought I'd add something. Do edit accordingly, so it sucks less. --129.21.117.115 14:36, 4 Dec 2005 (EST)

Sangria
I don't thin 6€ is cheap for Sangria!

title: Talk:Toledo


text:
Talk:Toledo District

Should this be "Toledo District" or just "Toledo" -- or, I guess "Toledo (Balize)" ? (WT-en) Majnoona 14:12, 1 Dec 2005 (EST)

 * I moved it to Toledo (district) because the Toledo (Belize) would imply a town. The Toledo disambiguation page is getting crowded.... -- (WT-en) Huttite 04:18, 26 Dec 2005 (EST)

title: Talk:Toledo District


text:
Talk:Tollesbury

VfD discussion
Seems like a load of bull to me --(WT-en) Stefan (sertmann) Talk 11:38, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

 * a point or two for humour (vibrant night life in Tollesbury is an amusing concept). --(WT-en) Burmesedays 11:48, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
 * Blank and Outline.  (WT-en) LtPowers 17:33, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
 * Keep and add a destination template. It is probably worth a mention as a destination in Essex, so that it is no longer an orphan page. Then again the vibrant nightlife reminds me of Peter Sellers Belham with its beautigul flashing lights - green - orange - red and back to green again! - (WT-en) Huttite 06:44, 3 November 2009 (EST)
 * Result: Keep. (WT-en) LtPowers 15:56, 7 March 2010 (EST)

title: Talk:Tollesbury


text:
Talk:Tomiai

I moved Tomiai town to Tomiai, because I do not think town is really part of the name of the place. If it was, then a lot of articles would end with town, city, village, etc.

title: Talk:Tomiai


text:
Talk:Tonga

History
This section states "It remains the only indigenous monarchy in the Pacific." That is far from correct. There are still three kingdoms in nearby French Wallis and Fatuna. These present day Kings are recognised by the French. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallis_and_Futuna (History section).

I believe there are also other Pacific monarchies. (WT-en) Tiddy 22:10, 4 November 2009 (EST)

 * Please plunge forward! --(WT-en) Peter Talk 00:43, 5 November 2009 (EST)

I have lived in Tonga for 3 years….This article is a vastly distorted representation of what you would actually encounter. This article needs not only to be updated but checked for accuracy. Monarchal powers are definitely strong but parlimentary influence is on the increase. Young people are not the driving force in the pro-parliment movement. Tongans have access to education but the quality of education is deplorable.

The vast majority of Tongans live on less than US$100 per week. Violent crime and theft are pervasive and grossly under-reported. The police are ineffectual. Police response times are long even in an emergency.

The hospital is very poorly equiped and personell are minimally trained. Many of the doctors have training that is similar to an EMT.

The vast majority of Canadian, USA & European citizens would not consider a visit to Tonga to be either safe or enjoyable.

There are a handfull of very nice but pricey accommodations but service is not good. Service expectations in the South Pacific region are not on a par with Canada, USA, Caribbean or Europe. Most accommodation in Tonga would be similar to an old motel.

Quality and variety of dishes at restaurants is limited. There are several options for Sunday Lunch and Dinner. The article is painting the typical bucolic picture of Tonga. There are at least 3 chinese restaurants open for lunch and dinner. Pangaimotu island offers lunch. The scenic hotel offers brunch. There are two restaurants open on sunday as well as resorts. KKC chinese sells alcohol, cigarettes and carryout all day on sunday. —The preceding comment was added by 202.129.228.228 (talk • contribs)

 * This is a Wiki, which means that it depends on edits from readers. Please plunge forward and correct everything that you know to be wrong. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:24, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 14:08, 24 January 2019 (UTC)
 * LocationTonga.png

title: Talk:Tonga


text:
Talk:Tongren (Qinghai)

What are Tangkas? If the article says that somewhere is not where they are made, should it not say where they are made? (WT-en) Shep 10:31, 29 August 2010 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tongren (Qinghai)


text:
Talk:Tonle Sap Lake

Tonle Sap Lake
Article on a body of water doesn't comply with policy. Some info might useful in other articles for nearby towns. - (WT-en) Cardboardbird 21:03, 11 September 2011 (EDT)

 * It's a tough one and I remember looking at this when I regionalised Cambodia in 2009. Our policy on bodies of water still confuses me greatly. Massive tomes have been written on this - here for example. I still don't really understand. We have articles about bodies of water that are certainly not regions (if that is the criterion?) but have a "convenient" region template applied (eg Loch Ness). Could do the same for Ton Le Sap. --(WT-en) burmesedays 21:32, 11 September 2011 (EDT)
 * Comment Tough one indeed. I read the related discussions and I really couldn't decipher anything that even looks like policy. Seems that it could either go as a region, disambiguation page or a straight redirect. From what I understand, Tonle Sap is generally a day trip from Siem Reap for most travellers. Would the Tonle Sap Lake article contain anything travel related that is not already in the SR article? - (WT-en) Cardboardbird 10:18, 14 September 2011 (EDT)
 * I think this discussion should move to the article's talk page - this one shouldn't be deleted per Project:Deletion policy, so the discussion is about whether it should be redirected, and if so where. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 21:49, 25 September 2011 (EDT)
 * Any objections? Going twice... -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 20:12, 17 October 2011 (EDT)

Moved here (WT-en) Pashley 01:48, 26 October 2011 (EDT)

 * It can just be redirected to Cambodia? The bodies of water policy was designed to avoid articles about non-destinations. However, if there are placed where you can sleep on this lake, like at Ha Long Bay, then an article could be justified. --(WT-en) globe-trotter 12:26, 26 October 2011 (EDT)

 * Converting this to a disambiguation page might make sense. I suspect many people searching for "Tonle Sap" will be looking for information on the floating villages, so if this page presents a "you might be looking for" list with the floating villages and the Cambodia regions that border the lake that might be the most useful. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 12:42, 26 October 2011 (EDT)

 * I think Ryan has good suggestion as having this page as a redirect. There are several places to access the Tonle Sap and I think that the relevant travel information should be listed in those places' articles.(WT-en) Travelpleb 03:15, 1 April 2012 (EDT)

title: Talk:Tonle Sap Lake


text:
Talk:Top End

Copy Right and Left
In regards to all Northern Territory information I have added, you may notice that some of the text I am adding appears in another website eg travelnt.com, that is because I am the original author. Please contact Ryan Campbell if you require confirmation. Ryan Campbell Manager – Web and Digital Development Brand & Marketing Services Marketing Communications Tourism NT t: 61 8 8999 3919  :   f: 61 8 8999 3920 e: ryan.campbell@nt.gov.au (WT-en) Lex 00:38, 1 December 2008 (EST)
 * Since you are the one adding it, please do this part yourself. The site lists it as a copyright not in your name. If you are not yourself legally able to rerelease the rights under a Creative Commons license, please obtain written permission from them yourself and post it here. Otherwise the text will be subject to deletion. (WT-en) Texugo 00:41, 1 December 2008 (EST)

Hierarchy?
This doesn't fit our current Australia hierarchy, which splits by state. Redirect? Disambiguate? (WT-en) Jpatokal 01:37, 1 December 2008 (EST)

 * I think a disambiguation would work, after we have moved the content. (WT-en) Globe-trotter 18:23, 23 December 2009 (EST)

 * Disambiguate to what? Move the content to where?  --(WT-en) inas 18:24, 23 December 2009 (EST)

 * Moved the content to either Kimberly, Western Australia, the new to form northern region(s) of Northern Territory and Far North Queensland. And then let this page disambiguate to those regions (or maybe redirect to the northern region of Northern Territory). (WT-en) Globe-trotter 19:39, 23 December 2009 (EST)

 * Yep - sounds okay. Along the lines the discussion at Talk:Northern Territory We should probably just make this a NT only region, and include a line at the top of the new NT region to point people to FNQ, etc.  --(WT-en) inas 21:32, 23 December 2009 (EST)

Stay safe
It seems Stay safe was copied from Kakadu National Park without much checking or editing. I tried to remove park specific advice and reword the rest, but as I don't know the area, I might have removed important advice or left something that doesn't apply. Please check. –LPfi (talk) 08:55, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Top End


text:
Talk:T or C

It might seem a little odd to set up a redirect for something that has never existed, but Truth or Consequences, New Mexico is a real place, with that improbable name, and it is almost universally called "T or C" in the area. May as well make life easy for the traveler who has to deal with things as they really are, rather than theory. Anyway... -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 19:29, 7 April 2006 (EDT)

title: Talk:T or C


text:
Talk:Tornados

Tornados!

Tornados is the most dangeroust wind storm on earth! Many peple die from being tossed up in the air and then just fallling! As people say most tornados errupt in America and that is true because it is normally quite windy! Tornados are so strong it would be able to lift up a massive humengous Manchen! It is amazing but very very pettrifing! Thankyou so much for listening to my story or point of view! Bye:Rebecca

title: Talk:Tornados


text:
Talk:Tornado safety

Not just US
Tornados don't just happen in the United States, they happen in other countries too. Also, while the emphasis is on safety, there is also an extreme weather tourism industry associated with chasing tornados. Some mention should, perhaps, be given about this too. -- (WT-en) Huttite 04:56, 24 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * I agree with international tornados, but wanted to start it this way covering the US as I am not aware of how warning systems work in other countries. I can rework it to be more generic with specifics for the USA. I agree they happen all over.

 * As far a "tourism industry associated with chasing tornados", that does NOT happen in the US and if it is and I am not aware of it, I think it is insane. There may be people who come to do just that, but I don't think anyone who has been around tornados would want to encourage that. I have been a Ham Radio weather spotter for about 15 years, and I can say tornados are very dangerous and anyone not familiar with them and safety to be taken should take cover and not attempt to chase them or attempt it distract someone who is chasing them. Sorry, but I can not be a part of anything that would encourage tourists to "Chase Tornados". That would be very dangerous. If this article is going to encourage "Extreme Weather Tourism" by "Chasing Tornados", then I will need to have my name deleted from the work, sorry but I can not be a part of encouraging the uninformed to do foolish life threatening things for just the thrill of it. Not to mention the liability.

 * Now if we are taking about "Tornado Safety" for the tourist, I do want to continue and provide information to people about what can happen in a tornado and how they can be safe. I am currently working in Oklahoma City and I have seen what can happen when an F5 tornado gets loose in a major metropolitan area.

 * If you want to create a article "Tornado foolish, wreak less, unwise", then go for it, but I don't want to encourage it. (WT-en) Xltel 08:49, 24 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * I guess I have to back down on what I said above about "NOT happening in the US". I should have know better. I did some research on this and see some enterprising people are making a buck on this. So, it may need to be covered, but I would hope it would not be it this article. My thoughts about the safety of chasing tornados has not changed. Thanks! (WT-en) Xltel 09:39, 24 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * After even further research, we may want to start an "Extreme travel" article and I guess we could provide a link from here, but I would still like this article to be about saftey around tornados while you are traveling. Thoughts by others? (WT-en) Xltel 10:33, 24 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * I was thinking of something along the lines of: "DO NOT chase tornados on your own - they kill the foolish. If you badly want to get up close and personal with a tornado, find a tour guide who is an experienced tornado chaser and wise to the fickle ways of the whirling winds. They may seem expensive but you are paying for these crazy people to (not) put their lives on the line along with yours. Besides chasing tornados is a chancy business that requires that you race all over the countryside, on the wildest rumour or suggestion, only to find yourself in the wrong place at the wrong time. With tornado chasing there is no right place or time because nobody in their right mind would deliberately go near one. So if you are wanting to see a tornado, you are probably better off watching a program from National Geographic or Discovery Channel or renting a video of the Wizard of Oz or Twister." -- (WT-en) Huttite 05:19, 25 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * I agree with everything you said, except maybe "the wildest rumor or suggestion". I suspect the |Severe Storm Prediction Center in Norman, Oklahoma would take issue also. They do a pretty good job of predicting when and where conditions will be right for the formation of tornados. Granted that can cover an area over three states, but it does give the storm chasers and weather spotters a good heads up as to where best to locate. At that point you wait for the line of thunderstorms to form and then get mobile. I'm not sure how you schedule a vacation around that, we can go weeks without having the right conditions. The thing on renting Wizard of Oz was pretty funny. I keep thinking of the group in Twister who had the corporate sponsorship and got to see an F5 up close and personal. Bottom line is, I think we are on the same page for this. Thanks again Huttie for all your help and direction. (WT-en) Xltel 09:44, 25 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * Although tornados happen everywhere, to the best of my understanding they are far more frequent in the central US. For example, here in the Bay Area, tornados have caused damage in the last decade.  But they are so infrequent that no preparations occur.  By contrast, when I stayed in a motel in Illinois, the motel had posted instructions of what to do if a tornado occurs; most houses have a basement prepared for evacuation; and schools practice what to do.  Are there any other spots on the globe that have tornados so frequently that preparation is required? -- (WT-en) Colin 11:07, 24 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * I would also like to know how severe they are in other places in the world. An F3, F4 and F5 are real killers. An F1 or F2 are not quite as bad. You get a lot of those in Florida and some start a water spouts. Also, in my travels I think there is a lot of fear about Oklahoma and Texas it relation to Tornados. And, most of it is unwarranted or overblown. Lightning kills a whole lot more people the tornados, but does not do the physical damage or get the media attention. Still I can see a need to leave this open for other areas of the world. (WT-en) Xltel 12:10, 24 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * Wikipedia says the UK is second in the world for tornados. So if they don't have a warning system, then probably we can infer this is a US-only problem.  (Though the problem does extend into Canada, so we should check if they also have a warning system).

 * I know what you mean about people's fears. Earthquakes are a common fear amount California visitors, but as a real danger, not so much.  Northeast snowstorms are far more dangerous (by orders of magnitude) than CA Earthquakes. In the end, when you travel, you'll most likely to die in a car accident.  -- (WT-en) Colin 12:54, 24 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * Besides earthquake, don't forget volcanic eruption, land slip, avalanche, flood, tornado, hurricane and storms of lightning, thunder, wind, rain, hail as well as snow - the world is full of natural hazards that kill people. I suppose it is like shark attacks, they are so rare and dramatic that almost all of them make the news. Probably because they are worst case scenarios. What if every serious vehicle crash was given the same amount of coverage? ... Perhaps an article about road safety for travellers is needed next - or is that off topic? -- (WT-en) Huttite 05:19, 25 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * Someone could do a Hurricane saftey article, but not me... I don't know enough about that. (WT-en) Xltel 09:44, 25 Jan 2006 (EST)

 * Not everything Wikipedia says is true. People in Canada, Bangladesh, India and Ukraine, and even the Netherlands on a per-area basis, might have some issues with the notion that the UK is "second in the world for tornados."  Thing is, though: who's qualified here to write on whatever warning systems those places have?  The fact that the current article is US-centric is pretty well inescapable given that (1) "Tornado Alley" in the US does get more of 'em than anywhere else, (2) the US has a warning system, and (3) Wikivoyage contributors from the other places with relatively high tornado frequency are few and far between, at least in the English-language version.

 * To be honest, I'd be quite interested in the international view of tornado safety, and hope that this article is the start of something that can address it. We already have other "hazard" articles that people don't seem to have much trouble with, e.g. Altitude sickness (a big deal for many destinations, including several I write about that are at elevations above 7,000'), Tropical diseases, Volcanoes.  Those articles tend to be broadly useful; no reason why this one shouldn't be, if authoritative international info can be added. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 09:38, 22 March 2006 (EST)
 * Germany does not issue specific warnings about tornadoes, nor is any kind of weather alert radio existent. Weather alerts are usually given with the forecasts on TV, radio or (local) newspapers in advance (e.g. windstorms), but they are admittedly not very useful for tourists who do not understand the German Language.
 * Best advice is to check a weather forecasting site via the internet for the specific area (e.g. https://www.dwd.de/EN/weather/warnings/warnings_node.html, English language) for weather alerts.

 * Germany experience about 30-50 tornadoes per year which are mainly in the EF 0-2 range. Most of them occur during the summer within severe thunderstorms, but there is no definitive area like the Tornado Alley (it seems that the northwestern part of Lower Saxony and Hamburg is affected a bit more frequently, but there are no credible statistics available). In 1968, a tornado rated as a F4 struck the town of Pforzheim (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pforzheim#Post-World_War_II).

Tornado Alley map
In checking some facts to update this article, I noticed that Wikipedia has a FEMA-published map showing tornado frequencies in the States, and in looking for a cleaner version I also found a nice NOAA map, both of which are public-domain and either of which gives a clearer picture of where travelers are (relatively) likely to get caught in a twister. Preferences? - (WT-en) Todd VerBeek 21:29, 10 April 2006 (EDT)
 * I did the tornado alley map and I agree it does not represent the total risk for the US, but it does show the location where tornado alley is considered to be located. Looking at the maps you are proposing, the one from FEMA looks pretty good for general risk in the US. We should be careful to point out they can occur anywhere and I think that has been done. I don't like the one from NOAA as well as the FEMA map. I don't think it represents risks properly (you look safe in central Missouri, but at high risk in a small area in the northeast US). If you want to add additional maps, I don't see a problem. I am not even against removing the tornado alley map as the area is described fairly clearly in the text. I added the map because I thought a picture would be better then just the words. Thank you for your work on this article. -- (WT-en) Tom Holland (xltel) 07:55, 13 April 2006 (EDT)
 * I'd rather not add maps; one should be enough. I managed to find the original document that the FEMA map is taken from and got a clean copy of it, which I'll substitute for the alley outline.  The current version of the map apparently resamples a larger data set, so it uses more red and orange... perhaps a bit of fear-mongering to bolster the agency's budgeting position? :) - (WT-en) Todd VerBeek 09:36, 13 April 2006 (EDT)

Myth section?
Should we include a myth section to dispel some of the myths about tornadoes? Some of the info could fit in other sections, but I'd see it useful as dispelling the myth that tornadoes don't hit large cities, as was the case in London on December 7, 2006. Also, the myth that highway overpasses provide adequate shelter, when that's not always the case. -- (WT-en) Andrew H. (Sapphire) 16:49, 12 January 2007 (EST)
 * Read the section on Car and see if that satisfies your need about highway overpasses. There were 3 people killed with the F5 that hit Moore, Oklahoma City, Del City and Midwest City in May 1999 by getting under overpasses. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_Tornado_Outbreak
 * Damn it! Yet another case where I should have read before posting.  Oh well.  -- Andrew (Sapphire)
 * You do have a good point that it might be worthwhile to collect them in a myth section. Need to add something about taking time to open windows so the house doesn't explode... of course another myth and takes too much time when you are in the path. -- (WT-en) Tom Holland (xltel) 06:15, 13 January 2007 (EST)

World wide tornado safety

 * Also, I'd like to document other places where tornadoes occasionally occur like Turkey. -- (WT-en) Andrew H. (Sapphire) 16:51, 12 January 2007 (EST)
 * Yeah, that is a good idea.. It would be good to document other areas, but to be honest I don't know how to go about it. The article at this point is more for the United States, but I think we all recognize that tornadoes can occur all around the world. I don't want to down play the danger along the downside of the rockies in tornado alley, but the safety applies world wide. I would say if you or anyone else has some ideas in that area... then plunge forward. Thank you for your suggestions Andrew. -- (WT-en) Tom Holland (xltel) 06:15, 13 January 2007 (EST)

Weather alert radio
I've removed the information about weather alert radios, because I don't think it's particularly applicable to travelers. Radios make sense for people who live in Tornado Alley and its suburbs (like I do), but for someone just visiting the area suggesting them seems a bit... alarmist. - (WT-en) Todd VerBeek 11:08, 19 June 2007 (EDT)
 * Tourists who travel the US by car, bike or even as a backpacker might find some tips about how to receive weather alerts quite helpful.

Mention Fujita scale?
Fujita scale covers a scale for tornados. Add it here? Pashley (talk) 22:41, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

title: Talk:Tornado safety


text:
Talk:Tornved

Maybe it should be split op, but until we have more material I'll leave it all in Tornved Municipality. --(WT-en) elgaard 14:22, 20 Feb 2006 (EST)

I think it would be better to go ahead and create articles for all the cities, breaking things up later on is a real hassle and it makes it harder for other people to contribute ...

Also, please see the updated external links policy and start using the updated templates. Thanks! (WT-en) Majnoona 14:35, 20 Feb 2006 (EST)

Disambig?
So is Tornved the name of both the city and the region? Or is the city really called "Tornved City"? I think this page should probably be moved to Tornved (region) and the city should be Tornved (city), but I just want to check first. (WT-en) Majnoona 14:39, 20 Feb 2006 (EST)

 * Tornved is place, but a very, very smal place. But as part of a new structure fully implemented in 2007 Tornved together with Holbæk, Jernløse, Svinninge, Tornved, and Tølløse will form the new Holbæk. So we should forget Tornved and make a Holbæk (region). --(WT-en) elgaard 16:36, 20 Feb 2006 (EST)

title: Talk:Tornved