text:
Talk:Rochester (Minnesota)

Movies
Is the "Movies" listing really necessary? (WT-en) Zepppep 12:52, 27 October 2009 (EDT)

 * I think so. Going out to the movies is something that I think visitors often do. Given that there are not that many other things to do, I think there is room to add it.  And finding information about movies can be hard.  Searching on google, for example, does find the main sites of all three, but it finds other stuff as well that is confusing.  And the 2010 phone book, for example, only lists 2 of the 3 theatres (!).  So I added it back in.  If you really object, go ahead and remove it and I won't add it back in.  [BTW, the only other change of yours I undid was to add back in restaurant types.  While some may be obvious to most (e.g. "Hunan" is probably Chinese), I thought strange that some have types and some don't.  Plus, adding the type makes searching easier.  Again, if you object, remove it and I won't add it back]  (WT-en) Jbradfor 16:48, 29 October 2009 (EDT)

 * I don't know if this applies to Rochester, but for cities that aren't "tourist" destinations our guides will most likely be used by people going to the area for reasons other than vacation. For those folks knowing about more common activities such as movie theatres, public parks, etc. is definitely valuable.  For a major tourism destination such as Hollywood (for example) visitors are looking for more unique sights and activities, so these sorts of listings would be less appropriate. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 17:04, 29 October 2009 (EDT)

 * "Not a tourist destination"? Yeah, that pretty much describes Rochester.  Besides people coming to visit friends/family, the vast majority of visitors come for treatment at the Mayo Clinic, and secondly for amateur sports events. (WT-en) Jbradfor 10:54, 2 November 2009 (EST)

TV & Radio
I think a few clicks of the remote or the scan button will find this stuff pretty easily, and there nothing terribly unusual about the channel types or news times. It is not a standard section, and doesn't make for very interesting or useful reading for the traveller, so I removed it. I'll put it below for posterity's sake. (WT-en) texugo 11:55, 2 July 2011 (EDT)

The news channels and news broadcast times are:
 * KTTC - NBC (Ch. 10.1 digital/12 cable) 6 AM, Noon, 5 PM, 6 PM & 10 PM news
 * KAAL - ABC (Ch. 6) 6 AM, 5 PM, 6 PM & 10 PM news
 * KXLT - FOX (Ch. 47.1 digital/8 cable) 9 PM news
 * KIMT - CBS (Ch. 3) 5:30 AM, Noon, 4 PM, 5 PM, 6 PM & 10 PM news
 * My3.2 (run by KIMT - Ch 3.2) 7 AM & 12:30 PM news

FM Radio Stations:
 * 88.7 KMSE - Adult Album Alternative "The Current" (Minnesota Public Radio)
 * 89.9 KRPR Classic rock (Rochester Public Radio, Inc.)
 * 90.7 KZSE News & Talk (Minnesota Public Radio)
 * 91.7 KLSE-FM Classical music (Minnesota Public Radio)
 * 92.9 KFSI Christian
 * 96.5 KWWK Classic country
 * 97.5 KNXR Easy Listening
 * 98.9 KNLW Christian
 * 101.7 KRCH "Laser 101.7" Classic rock
 * 102.5 KMFX Country
 * 104.3 KVGO Classic rock/Oldies.
 * 104.9/105.3 KYBA "Y105" Adult Contemporary
 * 106.9/106.3 KROC Top 40
 * 107.7 KDZZ Active Rock

AM Radio Stations: Many AM stations can be picked up from the Twin Cities.
 * 1270 KFAN Sports/Sports Talk, The Fan network
 * 1340 KROC News/Talk
 * 1520 KOLM Sports/Sports Talk, ESPN Radio network

title: Talk:Rochester (Minnesota)


text:
Talk:Rochester (New York)

Does this belong?
''Does this belong in the article according to our policies? -- (WT-en) Ilkirk 17:18, 29 Nov 2005 (EST)''

 * Stop by Park Ave Travel at 25 Buckingham Street in the historic preservation district of Park Ave. They offer friendly service and a wealth of information on local attractions and events.

Drivers' City
It seems, that RTS provides a pretty good bus system, at least to get around down-town. There are special fares for students, and all day passes for $3. I don't think that it is virtually impossible to see this city only with public transport / foot.

Map
I have added a downtown map. Let me know if you think it's useful or if you have suggestions for improvements. I intend to make a region map at some point as well. (WT-en) LtPowers 22:20, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Okay, I've got two versions of the downtown map: which one is more useful? (WT-en) LtPowers 12:16, 16 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Make that three, now. (WT-en) LtPowers 17:05, 23 July 2008 (EDT)

 * I've changed the map to the one in the middle above. I think it works the best.  (WT-en) LtPowers 21:06, 29 July 2008 (EDT)

Too promotional?
This edit has a lot of information in it, but a quick review of the content indicates that it's largely statistics and information that's more relevant to residents (or potential residents) than to travelers. I hate to remove so much information, but I think it's really misplaced. (WT-en) LtPowers 10:47, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

Improvement request from the pub
Hi LtPowers! You ask in the pub what suggestions we might have on Rochester.
 * 1) An overview map (not just of downtown like in the get around section or maybe bump it up in the get in like in San Francisco) would be very helpful because the small maps are good for local navigation by the relation between these maps is not clear to me.
 * 2) The whole article just have four pictures. If a city is famous for images (no picture in the museum section) then a picture of the lakeside first picture is fine but have a look at Zurich what is really impressive) and some others would greatly improve the article. The festival section would benefit of a picture or two very much too
 * 3) The Learn and Work section are empty. Either delete them or fill them with what Rochester has to offer.
 * 4) Eat: I was a bit confused about this section. You write alot about Pizza and below is no listing. Why you seperate American and Burger restaurants? Burgers/hots are integral parts of the american kitchen, so i don't see the reason for two. Maybe you sort budget/midrange/splurge for american food and group the other under specialities? The Greek restaurant should be listed under greece not /Middle East because it should be clear that this cuisine's are complementary. The whole section about Wegmann's should be part of the part of the local food above. The whole written part is a bit jumping around. Maybe you start with local, then american and finally immigrant influenced kitchens but that's just one way... Now i can't see a structure.
 * 5) Sleep: If you say that most hotels are in the suburbs than write some links so people know where to look and don't need to scroll up to the breadcrump links to find out what's in the region.

I tip my hat for the almost completely listified article. I don't even dare to dream to ever achieve that in Zurich or Berlin. (WT-en) jan 12:52, 7 May 2010 (EDT)

 * Thanks for the input. I'm still working on the listification and organization of the Eat section, and I intend to add a few more hotels when I get a chance to figure out which ones would be appropriate.  I also do have plans for an overview map.  =)  Mostly I was interested in finding out if I'm on the right track with tone and style of writing, although your comments will certainly be useful!  (WT-en) LtPowers 15:40, 7 May 2010 (EDT)
 * Imho the tone is fine only structure/thread has potential and with this style will improve. (WT-en) jan 09:14, 8 May 2010 (EDT)

Listings to add?
Possible restaurants to add once they become established: -- LtPowers (talk) 01:11, 5 October 2012 (CEST)
 * Tap & Table
 * Trata

Salvatore's
It looks like someone put a lot of work into this article so I don't want to step on any toes here, but Salvatores is not where you want to send people for pizza in Rochester. Everyone I know who isn't from Rochester thinks it is the worst pizza they've ever had. I understand that many locals really like it so maybe it should stay in as a local landmark, but with a warning that you probably won't like the food.

~Godsendlemiwinks
 * Well, the article does say that everyone has their own favorite. But Salvatore's is the largest chain in the area; we can't just ignore it.  They've gotta be doing something right.  LtPowers (talk) 02:14, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

 * ok, what about about non-chains then? There must be some good ones worth mentioning. I like Acme on Monroe ave, but I have to admit I've never had their pizza entirely sober.  I never had much luck finding a good local place during the nearly 5 years I lived there, but I lived in Henrietta for most of that time so maybe that's why.  I refuse to believe a metro area with 1 million plus people doesn't have a place where someone from the east coast can get a good slice of pizza.  The reason I'm so caught up on the pizza thing is that someone I work with was passing through Rochester and he was referred to salvatore's by a local.  After not liking the pizza, he sort of dismissed Rochester as having terrible food (personally I think this is a kind of silly attitude) when the city actually has a lot of good places to eat.  There's a really popular Italian restaurant near my hometown that is not very good (that's being polite).  I listed it since someone asking about for Italian food is likely to be directed there, but with a warning about the food. Here's what I wrote: "Longtime residents love this place, but most likely for nostalgic reasons since it isn't particularly good compared with other Italian restaurants in the area.  Still, the interior probably hasn't changed since it opened who knows how long ago and it's quite cheap.  Consider it a cultural experience"

Maybe something along these lines would work for salvatore's? Godsendlemiwinks (talk) 17:04, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Well it's been ages since I ate at Salvatore's, but the pizza can't be that bad if they get enough business to support two score locations in and around a single city. "Someone from the east coast" is likely used to much better pizza than locals, but not all of our travelers are from the east coast, either.  That said, a review of the comments at RocWiki indicate some support for the view that Salvatore's pizza is more ubiquitous than good.  We should probably adjust the listing and prose to reflect some debate over the quality.  LtPowers (talk) 18:02, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

 * How about "New York style purists should probably avoid pizza in Rochester since they will most likely be disappointed. With so many good places to eat, just pick somewhere else.  If you're open to a different style of pizza, feel free to give one of the local places a try.  "for the pizza paragraph in the section about Rochester food? Godsendlemiwinks (talk) 18:42, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

 * That's a bit harsh, don't you think? It's not like Rochester is any more of a NY-style-pizza wasteland than anyplace else in the country.  For instance, The Rochester NY Pizza Blog recommends The Pizza Stop as having very good NY-style pizza.  But I don't see any particular reason to focus on NY-style over others as far as giving advice goes.  LtPowers (talk) 21:16, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

 * Maybe it just needs a more in depth description of what "Rochester" style pizza is. How you put it is basically how I'd describe it to someone, but I'm not sure they would really understand until they saw it.  Maybe a picture would help.  The reason I specified NY style is because Rochester is in NY state and most people don't realize how big of a state it is.  They will probably assume everywhere in NY state has NY style pizza, even though most of New England is closer to NYC than western NY.  Anyone whose been to Syracuse will be even more confused since its only about 70 miles from Rochester, but is in my experience overwhelmingly NY style pizza. While we're at it, there should be a description for what a white hot is.  I'd never heard of them until I moved to Rochester so I don't think they're a nationally known thing. Godsendlemiwinks (talk) 00:33, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

 * Let me take a stab at adjusting the pizza text a bit, see if it suits you better. LtPowers (talk) 15:19, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
 * That works. Godsendlemiwinks (talk) 01:02, 19 April 2013 (UTC)
 * I added a description for white hots, but I'm not sure I have the flavor right since I haven't had one in about a year. Godsendlemiwinks (talk) 00:50, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
 * I could have sworn there was a description in there before, but a perusal of the history indicates otherwise. Thanks for adding it.  LtPowers (talk) 15:19, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Alternative banner for this article?

In the Hebrew Wikivoyage we are currently using this banner instead of the one which is currently used here. Do you think too that this banner would would better than the existing one? ויקיג'אנקי (talk) 06:56, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

 * No, not in this case. I don't really like the composition and prefer the pretty flowers. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:54, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

Tone and prose
I really have some problems with [//en.wikivoyage.org/w/index.php?title=Rochester_(New_York)&oldid=2660876&diff=prev this edit], but since I reverted it once and it was put back in, I'm coming here to discuss it.

Pinging User:50.195.72.217 so that the user is aware of this discussion.

Here are the changes I disagree with and why:
 * 1) The change of the airport URL from http://www.ROCairport.com to http://www2.monroecounty.gov/airport-index.php
 * We have a history of preferring shorter URLs to longer ones, and more readable URLs to less. As well, the former is likely to remain valid even if Monroe County changes the organization of their web site, while the latter is not.
 * 1) Changing "six" to "6"
 * Normal grammar rules suggest spelling out numerals ten and below.
 * 1) Removal of carriers and addition of destinations
 * While I can see how the list of destinations is useful, it's also a freakin' bear to maintain, as it changes relatively often. (Less so for ROC but other cities see frequent changes.)  But even assuming we want the list of destinations to stay, I don't see what purpose it serves to remove mention of JetBlue and Southwest in favor of just saying that "most" airlines fly out of ROC.
 * 1) Removal of the bus paragraph
 * I'm not too bothered about the addition of a link to the bus route page, though it's really unnecessary; the real problem is the conversion of the detailed prose into a boring list. The list fails to explain the inconvenience of RTS service for getting out of the airport, and it also doesn't explain how the airport is the only reliable place to hire a taxi without calling ahead.
 * 1) The warning paragraph on the Amtrak environment
 * Really, now. Calling the area "seedy" is an overstatement, and removing the parenthetical "this is Amtrak after all" just seems pointless.

I'd appreciate any further thoughts.

-- Powers (talk) 13:05, 16 September 2014 (UTC)

Copyedits
"Recently" and similar words are words to avoid for two reasons:
 * 1) they become out of date quickly and editors may not know that the information should be updated, and
 * 2) readers don't know when this was written -- here is lots of information in Wikivoyage written as far back as 2007 (or possibly earlier), so it would be a mistake to assume everything is up to date.

For example, "Wegmans recently replaced their old East Avenue store" is wrong. They replaced it five years ago. When my edits we're partially reverted, User:LtPowers incorrectly assumed that the information was still up to date.

Since December 2013, the article has been describing wine bars as a "recent innovation". Now that that it's been 4½ years, the innovation isn't so recent, is it?

When did the food truck scene explode? Was it in the years that are recent to 2018, or recent to 2014, or recent to 2007?

Manufacturing employment in New York State fell by about 75% from 1970 to 2010, and then has been stable since. I don't think we should describe the decline as recent. It is now historical.

Generally in Wikivoyage we use numbers instead of words where possible -- 19th century" is shorter and easier to read than "nineteenth century", so why wouldn't we use it? We're not aiming for formal writing here - quite the opposite.

"And more" is a phrase we should avoid - this is a travel guide, not advertising copy.

Including the past dates of events makes the guide look out of date - it is better to provide the general description of the timing ("First Sa in May", "Mid-May", "mid-Jun"...) as the article does.

Why is it important for the traveller to know that bartenders started getting together to share recipes in 2014? Does knowing when this started enhance the travel experience?

"Ubiquitous" means "being everywhere at the same time". Something is either ubiquitous or it's not. It can't be "a little ubiquitous", "somewhat ubiquitous" or "overwhelmingly ubiquitous". Ground Zero (talk) 02:04, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

 * As I've had no response to these comments from 11 days ago, and as the reversion restored factual errors and words to avoid, I'm going to restore my edits. I am pleased to discuss these changes further. Reverting edits without being willing to discuss them is not an appropriate way of dealing with disputes. Ground Zero (talk) 14:12, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Still a Guide?
After years of stagnation, during which I only made occasional changes, I've completed a thorough review of this article for anything that's out of date, as well as adding several new listings. I feel like it's in a decent state but I no longer feel like I have a good sense of what makes a good article. (Or a Guide article.) I'd be interested in outside opinions and suggestions for further improvements.

Note that the maps still need to be updated. That will be my next step, but I didn't want to do that before making sure the listings were more-or-less complete.

One concern I have is the number of listings. I've got over 50 restaurants in here, though broken up by price range. It feels like a lot -- it's certainly a lot of markers on the map. Is it too many? Should I subdivide them further? (And not just the Eat listings; the Do sections is also quite voluminous, and the Buy section is largely undivided.)

-- Powers (talk) 01:13, 11 July 2024 (UTC)
 * From a quick glance, the article looks great to me. I'd say it's easily guide status – thanks for the update! I'm planning to visit Rochester later this year, so this will be useful for me.
 * I think subdividing the long lists sounds like a good idea. Restaurants could possibly be subdivided by neighborhood (like we do in Oakland) or by cuisine (like in Rock Hill) in addition to price. —Granger (talk · contribs) 19:07, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Rochester (New York)


text:
Talk:Rock climbing

Thoughts on the direction of the page
I was inspired by the Scuba diving page and thought that a rock climbing travel topic might be suitable. As you can see from the outline, I'm thinking that a little information for a traveler new to climbing, a collection of info on individual climbing destinations (such as when to go, type of rock, type of climbing and what it is noteworthy for), a link to the Wikivoyage article, and eventually (one day) some suggested itineraries for those wanting to travel and climb (probably a different article).

Destinations Map
Would a map of climbing destinations be useful? I've created an interactive climbing map at TopoHawk.com. Not sure if linking to my site is a faux pas or not. In any event, I feel like it's a good way to show climbing locations. —The preceding comment was added by Alecdhuse (talk • contribs)

 * Thanks for asking. Linking your map on a talk page would be OK, but not in an article, per external links. If you'd like to create a Wikivoyage map of those destinations, the maps we use on this site are either static maps or dynamic maps. Please have a look at How to draw static maps and How to use dynamic maps. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:59, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Rock climbing


text:
Talk:Rock Creek Lake

Project:Bodies of water
Typically bodies of water don't get their own article, although we do add articles about regions named after bodies of water, such as Lake Tahoe. I've not heard of Rock Creek Lake so I'm not sure if it falls into the second category or not, but if it does not then the information in this article should be moved to whatever region contains the lake. -- (WT-en) Ryan 10:07, 3 December 2006 (EST)

title: Talk:Rock Creek Lake


text:
Talk:Rockledge

Comments
Cocoa and Rockledge are two separate cities. I do not understand why they are combined here? (WT-en) Gamweb 15:43, 28 July 2007 (EDT)

 * Probably shouldn't be. I'd say separate them. Probably should move it to Cocoa and start Rockledge. (WT-en) OldPine 20:41, 29 July 2007 (EDT)
 * I moved the page to Rockledge. (WT-en) OldPine 14:47, 31 July 2007 (EDT)

title: Talk:Rockledge


text:
Talk:Rocky Mountain National Park

Fees
An anonymous user added a note to this page that the fees were incorrect, however, according to http://nps.gov/romo/pphtml/fees.html and http://www.rockymountainnp.com/RMNP-Planning-ParkFees.HTML: "Automobiles: Fee is $20 and is valid for 7 consecutive days, including date of purchase. The fee increased from $15 on January 3, 2005!" so the current information seems to be correct. If anyone knows differently please update the page. -- (WT-en) Wrh2 13:07, 30 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Ready to feature?
Can we nominate this article in Dotm? /Yvwv (talk) 17:34, 14 November 2022 (UTC)
 * I have updated the fees from 2020 to 2022, which is really the bare minimum that should be done before the article is nominated. The rest of the listings are from 2020, so they aren't old now, but by the time this article is featured in a year or two, they will be. Ground Zero (talk) 17:50, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Rocky Mountain National Park


text:
Talk:Rocky Mountains

Moved from travellers' pub by (WT-en) Evan

I know something should change here, but I don't know exactly what. We have two overlapping articles, Rockies and Rocky Mountains (United States of America). I think the Rockies should be in here as a region independent of the US and Canada, but I'm not sure. (WT-en) Rhobite 19:30, 7 Nov 2003 (PST)

 * Yeah, so, Rocky Mountains (United States of America) is not actually about the mountains per se. It's one of the 10-12 major regions we used to split up the United States of America into usable chunks (like New England (United States of America), the Southwest (United States of America), etc.). Rockies was started a long time ago. Anyways, I don't really think travelers need a full article about the Rocky Mountain chain qua geological formation, any more than they need one about arugula, Metternich, or car alarms. See Project:What is an article? for details. If someone wanted to do an itinerary stretching from the USA to the Canadian Rockies, well, I guess that would make sense. But as of right now, I think Rockies should go. -- (WT-en) Evan 08:23, 8 Nov 2003 (PST)

 * What I think the Rocky Mountains article should include is an overview of the tourist sites and good places to go, and how to get there. I might want to know what the highest mountain is and which country it is in, or where the best skiing is, etc. While I do not see this article replacing the more specific country articles, the mountains stretch a long way. This article would be my first port of call to find some information. BTW: The redirect from Rockies is useful as an alternative spelling. -- (WT-en) Huttite 07:35, 12 Mar 2004 (EST)

 * One problem with this is that the Rockies are so durn big. I have been working lately on a number of articles relating to northern New Mexico, which contains the southernmost parts of the Rockies (specifically the Sangre de Cristo Mountains), and this area has roughly as much in common with the Canadian Rockies as, say, Florida has with British Columbia.  How is one to package the information so that it's useful?  Not obvious to me.  "What the highest mountain is"?  Isn't this better as a WikiPedia subject?  "Where the best skiing is" -- this I can see, but is it really more efficient, from a traveler's perspective, than picking a region of the Rockies and asking the same question there?  Because you don't travel to "the Rockies," you travel to part of them.

 * If someone from outside the area can give some suggestions on how to organize it, I'll expand the page when I get a minute, but being a local, I really don't know what a tourist would find useful. Incidentally, it is quite misleading to say the Rockies "extend down the western side" of North America.  My home in the Rockies is nearly a thousand miles from the Pacific, with two major mountainous regions between here and there.  I'll fix this, but that begs the question of just what the page is, or should be, actually good for. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 22:59, 12 Oct 2005 (EDT)

title: Talk:Rocky Mountains


text:
Talk:Rocky Mountains (Canada)

Shouldn't this be the Canadian Rockies. The Rockies are in the USA too... (at least I've linked my pages to the Canadian Rockies entry...) Use the most obvious title where possible. (WT-en) KJ

 * I full on agree. This redirect should be reversed, ie: Rocky Mountains (Canada) should redirect to Canadian Rockies. It is not nearly as awkward. - (WT-en) bulliver 19:09, 17 March 2006 (EST)

I moved this per the discussion in Talk:Canada. -- (WT-en) Evan 15:57, 10 Nov 2003 (PST)

Rocky mountains really should be 1 article since it's all the same mountain. (WT-en) Kingjeff 15:46, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

Canadian Rockies Region
Discussion moved from Talk:British Columbia

Looking at this article, I have to say that the Canadian Rockies region really doesn't make sense to me. Everything in the British Columbia section of that article is located in the Kootenays, which makes that somewhat redundant. To further complicate matters, Travel Alberta (the offical Alberta DMO) lists Canadian Rockies as one of the major regions of Alberta. So, would it possibly make more sense to convert Canadian Rockies so that it refers purely to the region in Alberta, and remove all mention of it from British Columbia? (WT-en) Ame detoile 14:43, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

 * I think Rocky Mountains (Canada) is one of the odd standalone regions that sometimes occur when an area doesn't fit into our more hierarchical regions but is still something that travelers expect to find an article about. Great Lakes and Lake Tahoe are two similar articles - both overlap existing regions (Tahoe straddles California & Nevada, the Great Lakes straddle Canada & the US).  We currently just don't have a really good way of handling such places, and end up keeping the articles as informational material, but don't really treat them as part of the regional hierarchy. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 14:59, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

 * Hmm, I can see your point. Keeping that in mind, I think what I might do is just put the Columbia-Rockies and East Kootenays regions as a sub-region of Canadian Rockies in addition to their current listing under Kootenays.  The current list of cities is a little random.  (And if it gets comprehensive it'll be rather large) (WT-en) Ame detoile 15:23, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

 * Looks good. The Alps article takes a similar approach. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 16:35, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

title: Talk:Rocky Mountains (Canada)


text:
Talk:Rocky Mountains (United States of America)

Utah and not New Mexico?
Utah is not a part of the Rocky Mountains, properly speaking. The high mountains of Utah are part of the "basin and range" country between the Rockies and the Sierra Nevada. New Mexico, by contrast, does contain a significant hunk of the Rockies (the Sangre de Cristo Mountains, one of my favorite places in the world and one that I've been working on via several articles), even though it's lumped with the Southwest (United States of America) here. Evan, you're the one that set things up this way, if I read the attributions correctly; how would you suggest dealing with this incongruity? My own fix is to put New Mexico in this article, in the same dual status as Utah which is already listed in both regions. That seem OK? -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 20:38, 14 Oct 2005 (EDT)

 * I think we're going to have to give up something here. Either a) we're going to have to give up the idea of having each region in exactly one other region (by listing NM twice), or b) we're going to have to think up some more accurate but less traditional names for what we're calling the Southwest and the Rocky Mountains, or c) we're going to have to live with the fact that these inexact names (Northeast, Southwest, Midwest, etc.) are mostly useful for organization, and we shouldn't spend a lot of time worrying about them too literally. --(WT-en) Evan 11:28, 15 Oct 2005 (EDT)

 * I'd vote for a). After all, Utah already appears in both.  The advantage of region names is that they may be known to international travelers who otherwise don't know some of the details of American place names.  Therefore "more accurate but less traditional names" may not help the readers who need the help, and "inexact names ... mostly useful for organization" are still the tool that those readers will use, so best to at least make them reasonably descriptive.  The number of exceptions to the one-region-per-state principle should be small (NM, Utah, maybe Montana, one or two in the eastern Midwest), but they're important since both NM and UT are significant travel destinations.  May as well get them right. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 11:58, 15 Oct 2005 (EDT)

Renaming suggestion
I believe that this article should be renamed. The preferred alternatives are (in my own order of preference, but obviously subject to discussion): Usage in the region is that the term "Rocky Mountains" refers to the range itself, while the states are more commonly called the "Mountain States" with "States" explicit and "Rocky" not. The term "Mountain West" is also widely used but may get into some proprietary territory. Changing the name to match local practice is both an attempt at clarity and a recognition that many -- maybe most -- of the mountains in the region aren't really part of the Rocky Mountains range. It also resolves the ambiguities regarding New Mexico and Utah noted above.
 * 1) Mountain States (United States of America)
 * 2) Mountain West (United States of America)
 * 3) Rocky Mountain States (United States of America)

Opinions? If this is going to be done, let's do it soon, before there are zillions of links to be fixed. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 11:50, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

 * No! Absolutely NOT! It goes with Rocky Mountains. Though if you want to write articles about.

 * 1) Mountain States - States with mountains?
 * 2) Mountain West - States in the West with Mountains? or West side of the Mountain?
 * 3) Rocky Mountain States - The states where the Rocky Mountains are.
 * Feel free and see how they turn out. I think the local view is not the only view or even the most popular view. While local usage may be these terms, the traveler from abroad does not care what states the Rocky Mountains are in. They just want ot go see them. There is no reason why we cannot have two different region articles that cover and overlap the same region. Besides, mountains don't have political boundaries, they are a physical thing. State boundaries are often an accident of history and are imaginary lines conceived in the head of some politician or land office draughtsman, who couldn't be bothered to actually go see the country before drawing a boundary. -- (WT-en) Huttite 15:29, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

Does (United States of America) have to be in the name? (WT-en) Kingjeff 15:41, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

 * Based on both of these comments, maybe there's some confusion as to what the existing article is for. It is NOT about the "Rocky Mountains" themselves as a destination; rather, it is one of the "regions" of the United States.  (KJ, that's why (United States of America) is in there.)  Check the breadcrumbs on the article, look at the contents so far, and look at the defined regions in the United States of America article.

 * I agree that the traveler from elsewhere should have a syntactically easy way to get to an article about the mountains themselves. The top-level Rocky Mountains article is a start in that direction that should be expanded.  My objection is to using the same terminology as part of the regional hierarchy for the US, when it doesn't fit well and is misleading.  Does that clarify? -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 15:55, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

 * I think the reason that the split occured along nationalistic lines was because different travel requirements applied to the different areas. I see Rocky Mountains as being an orientation article for the overall mountain range. Rocky Mountains (United States of America) is an orientation article for that part of what people might think could be parts of the Rocky Mountains and nearby areas in the United States of America. You then write regional articles off this that refer to the actual regional hierarchy articles for the area. In the Rocky Mountains (United States of America) you then explain what all the regions mean and why they are misleading to be lumped into Rocky Mountains (United States of America), and yes the (United States of America) is needed because we already have an article called Rocky Mountains. These articles do not need to be mutually exclusive and some information can be repeated. I think what we are dealing with here is a topic fork. One way we look at it by geography (Mountains, etc.) the other way we look at it by people, culture and politics (states, towns and communities of common interest). It's like the difference between a house and a home - one is a building that a group of people live in, the other is a group of people that live in a building. Logically both the same and different! It is permissible to develop both (multiple?) ways, perhaps inefficient, but probably practical in this case. Both are useful. Think of it as another way of seeing travel. -- (WT-en) Huttite 17:13, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

 * This makes sense. Suppose we take this approach: consider the present article to be a sub-region of the Rocky Mountains and develop it so that there are appropriate sub-sub-regions, while creating a new region name for the United States of America hierarchy -- which was actually what I was suggesting all along, I probably wasn't clear on that.  That allows both ways of seeing travel to have their say.

 * I propose to continue this discussion in Talk:United States of America. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 18:41, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

 * Certainly an acceptable approach. I would see the Rocky Mountain article as linking in all the relevant regions and sub-regions that pop up in the various state articles, even though a State is only mentioned in passing (for a link). I would see this article as being more descriptive and informative but with less of a complete region template. It might even just have a big understand section. The article that is written off the USA hierarchy would be the primary article for IsIn linking. -- (WT-en) Huttite 19:32, 31 Dec 2005 (EST)

Mountain West
OK, so per discussion here and in the USA talk page, I'm starting to move the USA-level region description to Mountain West (United States of America) -- with the assumption that this Rocky Mountains page will be a sub-region of the Mountain West, as reflects the actual geography, culture, and so on. This should basically be pretty transparent; I'm redoing the isIn links for the US states affected (btw, one of the reasons for doing this is to resolve the region ambiguity for New Mexico noted above) as well as a few links that should now go to Mountain West. About the only side effect that I can see is that a few pages may wind up with bogus isIn trails until I get them hunted down and fixed. If anybody else notices problems or side effects, please leave me a note on my talk page. It make take a day or two to get these resolved. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 12:44, 21 Jan 2006 (EST)

Added Other Destinations
I have taken the liberty of adding some national parks and monuments to the Other Destinations section to bring the list up to 9. I tried to spread them between the RM states so that each is represented. (Even though not all are pictured on the map). Please let me know your thoughts and opinions on the additions. Thanks! (WT-en) WineCountryInn 23:26, 31 January 2009 (EST)

 * Looks fine to me! (WT-en) Texugo 23:31, 31 January 2009 (EST)

Swapped Lead Photo
As beautiful as the bald eagle is, I thought it might be more appropriate to show a pristine, iconic snow covered mountain from a national park. I moved the eagle further down the page. Any thoughts? Thanks! (WT-en) WineCountryInn 00:32, 1 February 2009 (EST)
 * Fine with me, though I'm not sure I like having the eagle in the "Eat" section! (WT-en) LtPowers 11:49, 1 February 2009 (EST)
 * Aw, c'mon, eagles are delicious! ;) (WT-en) WineCountryInn 14:08, 1 February 2009 (EST)

list of cities
I can't help but notice that Aspen with its population of a whopping 6,642 people made the top tier list of cities. I understand that this is a major tourist draw area, but is it that major of a tourist draw? I'm willing to bet that some small towns at the edges of Yellowstone get more tourists passing through than Aspen. What is the criteria for being listed on the top list of cities? Is there any? --Lumpytrout (talk) 21:08, 28 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I'd say they are: # visitors, general travel importance, fame, geographic spread (they shouldn't be all clustered in one area), "interestingness," and probably a few other considerations. Towns by Yellowstone are not themselves the primary destination—Yellowstone is (and is listed), while I think Aspen is the destination itself? It's certainly more famous than half the other cities listed. --Peter Talk 21:54, 28 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Aspen's pretty well known, but the presence of Coeur d'Alene proves that we don't have a high bar for cities in this region. There just aren't that many big tourist cities in the Rockies; they're all about the Other Destinations.  LtPowers (talk) 22:04, 28 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm actually wondering about Bozeman and Missoula in Montana. Either one strikes me as being more of a tourist town than Billings and certainly comparable with Boulder Colorado that made the map.  There also happens to be a nice geographic need to have some more cities listed in Montana. --Lumpytrout (talk) 00:47, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, not all travel is tourism. Billings is a major city in the region, and the closest thing to a "big city", with all the attendant traveler services, that Montana has.  And replacing Billings with Bozeman or Missoula wouldn't improve the geographic spread any.  LtPowers (talk) 16:10, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not suggesting replacing, I'm suggesting adding to the map and list. Boulder is on the list despite having a population of 98,889 and essentially being a megalopolis with the surrounding areas and kind of smeared together on the map.  Missoula on the other hand has a population of 67,290 but is geographically very isolated and would be a welcome addition.  If anything could be replaced, it should be Boulder.
 * I could get behind removing Boulder; we already have three Colorado cities on the list. LtPowers (talk) 18:59, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

Denver being a rail hub
In light of this edit, maybe it doesn't qualify as one one North America's principal hubs, but in terms of passenger rail in and through the Rockies, Denver still is the most important one, isn't it? Hobbitschuster (talk) 15:54, 22 March 2017 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Roehampton

Roehampton

 * delete/merge a part of the London borough of Wandsworth. Delete or merge into South West London.--(WT-en) Wandering 15:05, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Looks to me like this should be merged and redirected rather than deleted. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 18:24, 12 February 2008 (EST)

title: Talk:Roehampton


text:
Talk:Roger Williams Park

Deletion of this article
This article does not fall under wikivoyage criteria for an article. I will be nominating it for deletion. The content could be included in page of the relevant city. (WT-en) Cardboardbird 03:31, 26 October 2010 (EDT)
 * So i just read the what is the article guidelines, and i understand that city parks are not included but this park is also considered a National Historic District, so I believe this article should NOT be deleted. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) Cristin mar (talk • contribs)

 * Is this article being created as part of a school course of some sort? It looks like there have been a number of new articles created for New England towns in the past week.

 * With respect to the question of merging it into Providence, how difficult would it be to merge the content? Is there any downside to doing so?  As you've indicated, there could be some argument made for keeping this separate, but it sets a bad precedent as typically we try to consolidate city information into single articles.  About the only city park I can think of with its own article is Central Park, but that's a massive park that one could write an exhaustive guide about; even Golden Gate Park (which is much larger and more diverse than Roger William Park) does not have its own article. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 00:57, 27 October 2010 (EDT)

I've protected this article against anonymous edits for ten minutes - to the anonymous user, please stop removing the merge & vfd notices. As they clearly state:

 * "Please do not remove this merge notice without first discussing on the talk page." (merge)
 * "Please note that removing this message won't stop the article from being deleted; it will just make it harder to discuss the deletion." (delete)

Wikis are collaborative tools, and there are processes and guidelines in place that govern what gets its own article, how deletions are handled, etc. Please use this talk page to discuss your concerns rather than trying to force changes to be made. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 01:31, 27 October 2010 (EDT)

 * yes this is part of a school project, but there is no point on arguing with you because you obviously have your mind set up on deleting this page. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) Cristin mar (talk • contribs)

 * The VFD notice means the article has been nominated for deletion. Wikivoyage policy is that once an article is nominated there are 14 days to come to some consensus on keeping or deleting it.  If the VFD notice on the article is removed, anyone seeing this article will be unaware that it has been nominated and no discussion can take place.  That's why the notice about not removing the template is provided. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 00:12, 29 October 2010 (EDT)

VFD Discussion
Stand alone article for a park in Providence, Rhode Island. Doesn't meet WT article criteria. There is some ok looking content that could be incorporated into the relevant city article. - (WT-en) Cardboardbird 03:35, 26 October 2010 (EDT)

 * Merge to Providence/South Providence. City parks are explicitly identified in Project:What is an article as things that do not get their own articles, and while exceptions are sometimes made (see Central Park), per this edit the user who started this article is apparently not going to argue further for keeping this article. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 21:58, 28 October 2010 (EDT)

Result: Merge tag added for Providence/South Providence. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 15:31, 27 November 2010 (EST)

title: Talk:Roger Williams Park


text:
Talk:Roi Et

TAT Listings
I moved clutter and other TAT listings to Talk:Roi Et/Listings for future reference. --(WT-en) globe-trotter 12:52, 6 February 2010 (EST)

title: Talk:Roi Et


text:
Talk:Roi Et/Listings

Amphoe Mueang Roi Et
Roi Et National Museum (พิพิธภัณฑสถานแห่งชาติ ร้อยเอ็ด) Located on Phloen Chit Road, near the city hall. It was initially established by Dr. Ko Sawatdiphanit with an aim to showcase local silk textiles and handicrafts of Roi Et. It was later renovated when the Fine Arts Department had the policy to set up a national museum. Today, it showcases the province’s geography, natural resources, archaeology, history, way of life and local hand-woven silk products. The museum is open every day, except for Mondays, Tuesdays and public holidays from 9:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m.

The entrance fee is 30 baht. For more information, call Tel. 0 4351 4456. The Monument of Phra Khattiyawongsa (Thon) (อนุสาวรีย์พระขัติยะวงษา (ทน)) It is located at the centre of the Sai Nam Phueng Roundabout near the Roi Et College of Dramatic Arts. Phra Khattiyawongsa (Thon) was the son of Thao Chan Kaeo. He was appointed to be the first ruler of Roi Et in 1775 during the reign of King Taksin the Great. He was the leader in setting up this city, by migrating people from Mueang Thong to settle at Mueang Kum Rang or Mueang Roi Et. He was considered a great ruler as he could restore the city until Roi Et became one of the most prosperous cities in the region.

Somdech Phra Srinakarindra Park Roi Et (สวนสมเด็จพระศรีนครินทร์ร้อยเอ็ด) It is a public park in the heart of the city, located in front of the city hall. The park was founded in 1986 on an area of 225 rai. It is decorated with a variety of flowers and shady trees. The highlight is the fountain in the middle of the park and a clock tower. There is also a public library. The park is used as a venue for various cultural occasions and events of the province. Bueng Phalan Chai (บึงพลาญชัย) The picturesque lake on the area of 200,000 sq.m. in the central city is a symbol of Roi Et. It is blessed with a relaxing atmosphere, with an island decorated with a large flower garden. The pond also has various types of fish. Bueng Phalan Chai is also used as a venue for various events of the province. Inside is situated the city pillar shrine, the sacred shrine that is highly revered by the people of Roi Et. There is also a large walking Buddha image located amidst the flower garden, a Constitution atop a Footed Tray, flower clock, Phu Phalan Chai (an artificial waterfall), animal sculptures, playground and exercise areas. Mueang Roi Et Municipality Aquarium (สถานแสดงพันธุ์สัตว์น้ำเทศบาลเมืองร้อยเอ็ด) It is located near Bueng Phalan Chai. One of its twin buildings comprises an auditorium, lecture room, exhibition room, office, a ticket booth and a souvenir shop. The next building features an aquarium comprising 24 small tanks and one 8 x 16 metre tank with a capacity of 400 cubic metres of fresh water and a ‘bio filter’ system, which shows fresh water fish. The highlight of the exhibition is the underwater tunnel through which one can view the movements of the marine animals from any direction. The aquarium is open everyday (except Mondays, Tuesdays and public holidays) from 8:30 a.m. – 4:30 p.m. The entry fee is 30 baht. For more details, call Tel. 0 4351 1286. Wat Klang Ming Mueang (วัดกลางมิ่งเมือง) It is located on Charoen Phanit Road. The old temple is believed to have existed before the establishment of Roi Et. The Ubosot was built during the late Ayutthaya period. In the past, it was used for the Oath of Allegiance Ceremony. At present, it is a venue for dharma practice and is known as Sunthon Thamma Pariyat School. The Ubosot houses beautiful murals depicting the life of the Lord Buddha. For more details, call Tel. 0 4351 2400. Wat Sa Thong (วัดสระทอง) It is located in the city on Hai Sok Road. The temple houses Luangpho Phra Sangkatchai (Kaccayana), a sacred Buddha image highly revered by the people of Roi Et. It is not known when it was built. In 1782, Phraya Khattiyawongsa (Thon), the first founder of Roi Et, discovered this image and relocated it to Wat Sa Thong to be the image of the city. In the past, all civil servants had to make a promise before the image that they would be honest in their work. Wat Buraphaphiram (วัดบูรพาภิราม) It is located in Roi Et city. The third-class royal temple was formerly known as Wat Hua Ro and was later renamed as Wat Buraphaphiram. There is the tallest standing Buddha image in Thailand known as Phra Phuttha Rattanamongkhon Mahamuni or Luangpho Yai, which was built with reinforced concrete in the blessing attitude. The Buddha image is 59.2 metres tall and if the base is included, it would be 67.85 metres tall. There is a museum at the base. Luangpho Yai is highly-revered by the people of Roi Et.

Amphoe Thawat Buri
Prang Ku or Prasat Nong Ku (ปรางค์กู่ หรือ ปราสาทหนองกู่) It is located at Ban Yang Ku, Tambon Ma-ue. Prang Ku is a complex of buildings with a plan that resembles the Khmer nursing home known as ‘Arogayasala’. It comprises the main prang, a library, wall and entrance pavilions, and a pond outside of the wall. The ruins are in good condition, especially the roof structure of the main prang which still maintains its three tiers and the lotus base of the pinnacle. Other ruins of the temple have been restored and are located in a shady environment. Apart from this, to the southeast inside of the front wall, there are many more archaeological finds being kept such as a sandstone lintel depicting a personage sitting on an elephant’s or bull’s back in a niche above the Kala face. The abbot of Wat Si Rattanaram where Prang Ku is located said the lintel belonged to the front porch of the main prang. There are also 2 fragments of colonnette; one with a hermit at the base, a large Siva Lingam with its receptacle – Yoni - and a fragment of the pinnacle’s lotus base, which was adapted to be the base of a stucco image of Phra Sangkatchai. Prang Ku was built during the 12th – 13th Century A.D. To get there: From the city, take Highway No. 23 (Roi Et – Yasothon) for 10 km. until reaching Thawat Buri district, then turn left for 6 km. to Prang Ku. Or take Highway No. 2044 (Roi Et – Phon Thong) for 8 km., then turn right for just about 1 km. to Prang Ku.

Wat Pa Non Sawan (วัดป่าโนนสวรรค์) It is a huge temple built from the abbot’s omen. It was embellished and decorated with local earthenware, so it looks strikingly eye-catching. The entrance of the multi-tiered chedi represents Hanuman’s mouth. Each floor of the chedi has murals illustrating the life of the Lord Buddha. At the temple’s gate, there are two huge tortoises which look like Khmer or Indian art. To get there: Take the Roi Et – Thawat Buri – Selaphum Road. It is about 13 km. from Thawat Buri district and about 30 km. from Roi Et town. The entrance is on the right side. Bo Phan Khan Rattanasophon (บ่อพันขันรัตนโสภณ) The park which was set up to commemorate the 50th Anniversary Celebrations of His Majesty’s Accession to the Throne is situated inside Wat Bo Phan Khan Rattanasophon. It is also where the beautiful image of Phra Phuttha Sahatsakhantha Mahamuninat is located. To get there: Take the Roi Et - Phanom Phrai route from King Amphoe Nong Hi to Tambon Den Rat. It is approximately 85 km. from Roi Et.

King Amphoe Thung Khao Luang
Ban Wai Luem (บ้านหวายหลึม) It is located in Tambon Maba. The village famous for silk weaving is part of the province’s One Tambon One Product (OTOP) project, so it is also the distribution centre for local handicraft products such as handbags, cotton, and ready-to-wear clothes. To get there: Take the Roi Et – Yasothon route along Highway No. 23. It is between Km. 145-146, approximately 25 km. from Roi Et.

Amphoe Kaset Wisai
Ku Ka Sing (กู่กาสิงห์) It is situated in Wat Burapha Ku Ka Sing, Tambon Ku Ka Sing. It is another huge temple with Khmer-style architecture, comprising three prangs on the same laterite base, and rectangular library buildings in front. All of them are surrounded by a wall, with entrance pavilions known as Gopura at the four directions. Outside is a U-shaped moat surrounding the wall. The three prangs of the main building are situated on a single base in the north – south direction. They have a square shape, facing east. The central prang is larger than the other two prangs. It has a long antechamber with three entrances at the front and on the two sides. The base of the prang was made of sandstone and carved in various rows and strips of motifs such as lotus petals and the flame-like ‘kanok’ motifs. Inside the inner chamber of the central prang, there is a Siva Lingam, which represents the Supreme God Siva and fertility, according to the beliefs in the Sivaite Sect of Hinduism. Several lintels were also found here. One piece depicts the God Indra on his mount – the Erawan or Airavata elephant – in a stylized arch above the Kala face whose hands hold the garland. There is also a gable depicting the God Indra sitting on his mount, Erawan elephant, amidst the ‘kan khot’ or scroll motif. The other two prangs have the same size and common features, having a sandstone base and brick wall with a single front entrance. There are pedestals of sculptures inside. Considering the art style, architectural plan, as well as archaeological evidence, they show that Ku Ka Sing followed the pattern of the Baphoun style of Khmer art, which is dated around 1017 – 1087 A.D. It was meant to be a shrine dedicated to Siva, one of the supreme gods in Hinduism. To get there: There are two routes to get there; follow the Roi Et – Kaset Wisai route or Highway No. 214 for 47 km. and continue further on the Kaset Wisai – Suwannaphum route for 10 km. Turn right to Ku Ka Sing for 10 km; or take the Roi Et – Suwannaphum – Surin route (Highway No. 215) and continue onto Highway 214 for 60 km. until reaching Wat Ku Phra Kona. On the opposite side, there is a route to Ku Ka Sing, which is about 18 km. further. Thung Kula Ronghai (ทุ่งกุลาร้องไห้) It covers an area of 2,107,681 rai spanning across five provinces. To the north, it covers the areas of Pathumrat district, Kaset Wisai district, Suwannaphum district, and Phon Sai district of Roi Et province. To the south, it sides with the Mun River which covers the areas of Chumphon Buri district and Tha Tum district of Surin province. To the west, it passes Phutthaisong district of Buri Ram province, Maha Chana Chai district of Yasothon province, and Phayakkhaphum Phisai district of Maha Sarakham province. About three-fifths of the area of Thung Kula Ronghai is in Roi Et province. The legend of Thung Kula Ronghai had it that, in ancient times, there were Kula people who travelled around for trading; they were known for being strong and tolerant. But when they reached this field, the hardship even made them cry (Ronghai) because there was not a single drop of water or big trees in sight. In the dry season, the soil became so dry and cracked. But at present, there is the Office of Land Development located in Thung Kula Ronghai. To get there: It is about 6 km. from Suwannaphum district and about 200 metres from Ku Phra Kona, opposite the Sopha Phitthayaphon School.

Amphoe Suwannaphum
Ku Phra Kona (กู่พระโกนา) It is situated at Ban Ku, Mu 2, Tambon Sa Khu. Ku Phra Kona comprises three east-facing brick prangs lying in the north – south direction, standing on a single sandstone base. They are surrounded by a boundary wall, with entrance pavilions or Gopuras in four directions; all were made from sandstone. The central prang was renovated in 1874 by plastering and making the roof into tiers. Each tier has niches of Buddha images in four directions. The front of the central prang was a ‘wihan’ of the Buddha’s footprint, decorated with the original six-headed Naga. The other two prangs were also renovated, but they remain in their usual styles; unlike the central prang which has been considerably changed. The northern prang was covered with a ‘sala’ building providing shelter for a gable depicting the Ramayana. Meanwhile, the lintel carving that represents the reclining Vishnu remains in situ above the front entrance. The lintel of the western false door was laid on the floor; it depicts the God Vishnu on his mount Garuda. The southern prang still has lintels above the false doors. The one in the north depicts a deity kneeling inside a stylised arch above the Kala face. In front, there is also a fallen lintel depicting the God Siva on his bull. There are also some causeway boundary stones lying over there. It is assumed that Ku Phra Kona formerly had a Naga bridge and causeway lined with boundary stones on both sides from the front entrance pavilion (Gopura) to the lake (Baray), which was located about 300 metres away. All sculptural features suggest that Ku Phra Kona probably dates from the Baphoun period, or the 11th Century. To get there: It is 60 km. from Mueang district along Highway No. 215, passing Mueang Suang and Suwannaphum districts. Then, take Highway No. 214 for 12 km. Ku Phra Kona will be on the left-hand side. There is a rubber plantation at the entrance and a lot of monkeys residing in the temple. Sim Wat Traiphum Khanachan (สิมวัดไตรภูมิคณาจารย์) It is situated at Ban Tak Daet, Tambon Hua Thon. The architectural structure suggests that it is a traditional small ‘Sim’ – local dialect for Ubosot - of the Northeast with a low boundary wall. Its gable and ‘Rang Phueng’ – decoration underneath the lower tie beam – are elaborately carved. The Sim houses murals illustrating Buddhist stories. It is assumed that it dates back to around the Ayutthaya or early Rattanakosin period. Outside the Sim is situated an Isan-style Buddha image which was moved from Wat Tai Wilai Tham (same district). Sim Wat Traiphum Khanachan was renovated by the Fine Arts Department in 1998 and awarded for outstanding architecture by the Association of Siamese Architects under Royal Patronage in the year 1998. To get there: From Mueang district, take Highway No. 214 to Highway No. 215 until reaching Suwannaphum district, then turn left and continue for 5 km.

Amphoe Selaphum (อำเภอเสลภูมิ)
Bueng Kluea (Salt Lake or Sea of Isan) (บึงเกลือ หรือ ทะเลอีสาน) Situated in Tambon Bueng Klua, it is a large lake covering a total area of 7,500 rai, with water all year round. There is a vast white sandy beach on the bank, lined up with raft restaurants. It is one of the favourite spots for tourists who come for relaxation and water sports. To get there: From Mueang district, take Highway No. 23 passing Thawat Buri district and upon arriving at Selaphum district, take Highway No. 2259 for 10 km. and turn left and continue about 8 km. further.

Amphoe At Samat (อำเภออาจสามารถ)
Sim Wat Chakkrawan Phum Phinit or Wat Nong Muen Than (สิมวัดจักรวาฬภูมิพินิจ หรือ วัดหนองหมื่นถ่าน) It is situated at Ban Nong Muen Than, Tambon Nong Muen Than. It features a small ‘Sim’ of traditional northeastern style. Its gable and ‘Rang Phueng’ (decoration underneath the lower tie beam) feature fine woodcarving with a wooden shingle roof. Outside is decorated with mural paintings. They depict the life of the Lord Buddha when He subdued Mara - devils, hell, and the Great Renunciation when the Lord Buddha cut his hair and the God Indra took it to be enshrined at Chedi Chulamani in heaven. The murals inside the Ubosot illustrate the folk tale of ‘Sang Sin Chai’. They are believed to date back to the early Rattanakosin period. To get there: From Mueang district, take Highway No. 2043 to At Samat district, continue for 10 km., then turn into Ban Nong Muen Than for 2 km.

Amphoe Nong Phok (อำเภอหนองพอก)
Pha Nam Yoi or Isan Buddhist Park (ผาน้ำย้อย หรือ พุทธอุทยานอีสาน) The large stone cliff is situated at Ban Khok Klang, Tambon Pha Nam Yoi. It borders Nong Sung district of Mukdahan province and Kuchi Narai district of Kalasin province. The total area is about 20,000 rai. It covers a forest with wide varieties of hardwood trees and is home to various kinds of wild animals such as boar, barking deer, deer, red junglefowl, etc. Pha Nam Yoi rises 200 metres from the ground level, and 380-500 metres above sea level. On the hill is situated Wat Pha Namthip Thep Prasit Wanaram, which covers an area of 2,500 rai. The temple was built by Phra Achan Si Maha Wiro, a follower of Phra Achan Man Phurithat. The temple houses Phra Mahachedi Chai Mongkhon, one of Thailand’s largest chedis that was designed by the Fine Arts Department. The white chedi is embellished with golden motifs, and surrounded by smaller chedis at the eight directions. The large chedi is 101 metres wide, 101 metres long, and 101 metres high situated on a piece of land with an area of 101 rai. It houses the relics of the Lord Buddha and is beautifully decorated with a mixture of an ancient and contemporary-style of art. This Phra Mahachedi Chai Mongkhon is situated in the compound of Wat Pha Namthip Thep Prasit Wanaram. There are six floors inside the chedi including: &Floor 5: Winding staircase of 119 steps leading to the bell-shaped hall where the Buddha’s relics are enshrined. To get there: Take the Roi Et – Phon Thong – Nong Phok route. It is about 80 km. from Roi Et, along Highway Nos. 2044 and 2136. Literature Botanical Garden (สวนพฤกษศาสตร์วรรณคดี) It is the regional literature botanical garden of the Northeast situated in Dong Ma-i National Forest Reserve, Tambon Pha Nam Yoi, about 86 km. from the city. It covers a total area of about 1,000 rai, featuring plants mentioned in Thai literature such as the Vessantara Jataka, Khun Chang - Khun Phaen, Lilit Phra Lo, Lilit Taleng Phai, Buddha’s history, etc. There is also an herb garden. The entire garden has a lively atmosphere. Tham Pha Nam Thip Non-hunting Area (เขตห้ามล่าสัตว์ป่าถ้ำผาน้ำทิพย์) It covers a total area of approximately 151,242 rai, comprising steep and complex undulating sandstone mountains with abundant dry evergreen forest, deciduous forest, and deciduous dipterocarp forest. Fauna found in this area include boars, barking deer, foxes, monkeys, squirrels, etc. The interesting sight-seeing spot is Pha Phu Thai, which is the best point to view the sunrise; and Pha Mok Mi Wai is the best spot to view the sunset. There are also two nature trails of about 2 km. and 3 km. which tourists can trek by themselves. The park provides accommodation and camping areas for those who want to stay overnight. Reservations should be made in advance to the Head of the Northeastern Literature Botanical Garden, Pha Nam Thip Non-hunting Area, P.O. Box 1, Tambon Bueng Ngam, Amphoe Nong Phok, Roi Et 45210. Pha Mok Mi Wai (ผาหมอกมิวาย) Situated inside Pha Nam Thip Non-hunting Area, it is the best viewpoint and is covered with mist all year round, as it is an abundant area with high humidity. So the area is shady green and perfect for nature lovers. To get there: From Bangkok to Khon Kaen, take Highway No. 2, the Khon Kaen – Nong Phok route, take Highway Nos. 209 and 2116 from Nong Phok to Ban Tha Sa-at, for 9 km. Turn left from Ban Tha Sa-at and drive for 13 km., to the Office of the Pha Nam Thip Non-hunting Area.
 * Floor 1: The large hall for multi-purpose use and meetings.
 * Floor 2: The ‘Sala’ for assembly of the monks. The pictures on the walls depict the life of the Lord Buddha.
 * Floor 3: The Ubosot, which houses a collection of 101 life-like marble images of highly-respected monks of the Northeast and models of monks who have practiced well.
 * Floor 4: Museum.

Festival
Bun Khao Chi and Pho Chai Products Festival or Bun Duean Sam (งานประเพณีบุญข้าวจี่ของดีเมืองโพธิ์ชัย หรือบุญเดือนสาม) It is held according to Hit Sip Song - the Northeastern twelve festivals for the twelve months. The Northeasterners believe that by making merit with Khao Chi or grilled sticky rice, they would gain huge merit. The festival also features a beauty pageant and competition of a giant-sized Khao Chi.

Kin Khao Pun Bun Phawet Festival (งานประเพณีกินข้าวปุ้นบุญผะเหวด) First held in 1991, it has been held annually around early March every year ever since. The event takes place at the Somdech Phra Srinakarindra Park and Bueng Phalan Chai. Bun Phawet, or known in the Central Region as Bun Mahachat, is usually held in the 4th lunar month. It is a Buddhist ceremony in which the monks give a sermon of all chapters of the Vessantara Jataka, otherwise called the Great Birth Sermon. There are also 13 parades of Phawet, according to the number of the chapters of the sermon, arranged by various public and private organisations. The area around Bueng Phalan Chai has stalls providing free ‘Khao Pun’ - rice noodle - for participants. There are also contests of traditional arts and culture such as making the ‘bai si su khwan’ tray. Bun Bangfai Festival (ประเพณีบุญบั้งไฟ) The festival is organised annually around June. Every district will organise colourful parades of Bangfai rockets that reflect the folk culture and local traditions of Roi Et province, especially the parades from Phanom Phrai and Suwannaphum districts will be lavishly decorated. Candle Festival (ประเพณีแห่เทียนพรรษา) It is organised annually on Asalha Puja Day at the Somdech Phra Srinakarindra Park. Each temple will beautifully decorate their candle floats with colourful flowers, and the parade will move along the road via the market to the cruciform pavilion in the Park. There will also be contests of decorated candles and floats with cultural performances.

Long Boat Races of Tambon Mueang Bua, Kaset Wisai District (งานแ��่งขันเรือยาวประเพณี ตำบลเมืองบัว อำเภอเกษตรวิสัย) The event is held annually at the end of the Buddhist Lent, or around mid-October when there is plenty of water in the river. Boats joining the races are from Roi Et and nearby provinces including Kalasin, Maha Sarakham, Si Sa Ket, and Nakhon Ratchasima.

Local Products and Souvenirs
Roi Et province produces various kinds of handicraft products such as silk of Ban Wai Luem, Thung Khao Luang minor district, which is best known to be one of the best-quality, award-winning silk and silk products; ‘Khaen’ - bamboo woodwind instrument - of Ban Si Kaeo, Mueang district, is among the best in Thailand; and also ‘Fuem’ for handlooms at Ban Khueang, Thawat Buri district.

Local Products and Souvenir Shops

 * Chanphen (จันทร์เพ็ญ) (Silk products): Suriyadet Bamrung Road, selling silk and silk products.
 * Charin (จรินทร์) 383-5, Phadung Phanit Road, Tel. 0 4351 1646, selling silk, silk products and souvenirs.
 * Nok Noi (นกน้อย) 63-5 Rat Uthit Road, Tel. 0 4351 1159, selling shredded pork and other pork products.
 * Yuanjit (ยวนจิต) 91/1 Chaeng Sanit Road, opposite Roi Et Agronomy Experimental Station. The shop sells local products, silk, cotton and related products. Tel. 0 4351 2077.
 * Roi Et Mai Thai (���้อยเอ็ดไหมไทย) 38-38/1 Santi Suk Road, Tel. 0 4352 0185, 04351 3792. It sells all types of products from local textiles.
 * Local Products Distribution Centre (Thai Phatthana) (ศูนย์จำหน่ายผลิตภัณฑ์พื้นเมือง (ร้านไทยพัฒนา)) Located behind the city hall, Ratchakan Damnoen Road, Roi Et province. Tel. 0 4351 1260. It is the centre for all types of traditional products such as silk, local woven cloths, ‘Khit’ pillows, basketry and local utensils.
 * Silk and Local Products Centre (ศูนย์ผ้าไหมและหัตถกรรม) 75 Ratchakan Damnoen Road, Tel. 0 4351 1582, 0 4351 1120, 0 4351 4097. It sells all types of products from local textiles.

Itinerary
Example of Tour Programmes

Half-day Tour One-day Tour
 * 8:00 a.m.	Depart from Amphoe Mueang Roi Et.
 * 8:10 a.m.	Stop at Bueng Phalan Chai, a relaxation area in the heart of Roi Et.
 * 8:45 a.m. 	Leave to pay homage to Phra Phuttha Rattanamongkhon Mahamuni, the highest standing Buddha image in the gesture of giving blessing in Thailand.
 * 9:30 a.m.	Leave to visit Prang Ku in Amphoe Thawat Buri, a complex of ancient buildings known as Arogayasala or nursing home.
 * 10:30 a.m. Stop and shop for famous local products of Roi Et at Ban Wai Luem in Amphoe Thawat Buri.
 * 11:30 a.m. Return to hotel.
 * 8:00 a.m.	Depart from Amphoe Mueang to Ku Phra Kona in Amphoe Suwannaphum.
 * 9:15 a.m.	Arrive at Ku Phra Kona--the Baphoun style of ancient Khmer art.
 * 10:15 a.m. Leave to visit Ku Ka Sing in Amphoe Kaset Wisai.
 * 10:45 a.m. Arrive at Ku Ka Sing, a huge Khmer sanctuary of Roi Et province.
 * 12:00 a.m. Lunch.
 * 1:00 p.m.	 Return to Amphoe Mueang. Visit Bueng Phalan Chai.
 * 2:30 p.m. 	Pay respect to Phra Phuttha Rattanamongkhon Mahamuni, the tallest standing Buddha image in the gesture of giving blessing in Thailand.
 * 3:00 p.m.	Leave to visit Prang Ku in Amphoe Thawat Buri.
 * 4:00 p.m. Return to hotel.

Sleep

 * Khaenkham (แคนคำ) 12-14 Ratthakit Khlaikhla Road, Tel. 0 4351 1508, 0 4351 4037, Fax. 0 4352 0048. 31 rooms, 150 - 250 baht.
 * Banchong (บรรจง) 81-83 Suriyadet Bamrung Road, Tel. 0 4351 1235. 30 rooms, 180 - 230 baht.
 * Bua Thong (บัวทอง) 6 Ratthakit Khlaikhla Road, Tel. 0 4351 1142, 0 4351 4081. 30 rooms, 100 - 200 baht.
 * Pannatda Resort (พรรณณัฎฎา รีสอร์ท) 251 Mu 16, Tambon Nuea Mueang, Tel. 0 4351 3822-4, Fax. 0 4351 2487. 88 rooms, 300 - 350 baht.
 * Petcharat Garden (เพชรรัตน์ การ์เดนท์) 404 Mu 17, Khotchaphlayuk Road, Tel. 0 4351 9000-7, Fax. 0 4351 9008. 148 rooms, 540 – 1,740 baht. www.petcharatgardenhotel.com.
 * Phrae Thong (แพรทอง) 29 Ploen Chit Road, Tel. 0 4351 1127. 58 rooms, 150 – 330 baht.
 * Roi Et City (ร้��ยเอ็ด ซิตี้) 78 Ploen Chit Road, Tel. 0 4352 0387 – 400, Fax. 0 4352 0401. 167 rooms, 825 – 7,800 baht. Email: roietcity@hotmail.com.
 * Rong Raem 99 (โรงแรม 99) 100 Sunthon Thep Road, Tel. 0 4351 1035, 0 4351 3985-6. 30 rooms, 250 – 320 baht.
 * Saket Nakhon (สาเกตุนคร) 66-80 Hai Sok Road, Tel. 0 4351 1741, 0 4351 1937, 0 4351 4058, Fax. 0 4351 4078. 146 rooms, 300 ��� 800 baht.
 * Sai Thip (สายทิพย์) 95 Suriyadet Bamrung Road, Tel. 0 4351 4028, 0 4351 1742. 66 rooms, 260 - 360 baht.
 * Mai Thai (ไหมไทย) 99 Hai Sok Rd., Tel. 0 4351 1136, 0 4351 1038, 0 4351 4044, 0 4352 2776 – 9, Fax. 0 4351 2277. 112 rooms, 450 – 750 baht.

Eat

 * Ko Liang (โกเหลียง) Thewaphiban Road. (Around Bueng Phalan Chai)
 * Krua Thong (ครัวทอง) Ratchakan Damnoen Road (on the way to Wapi Pathum)
 * Chong Charoen (จงเจริญ) Opposite Thawat Buri Police Station, Thawat Buri district (genuine Northeastern cuisine). Tel. 0 4356 9205 pen from 9:00 a.m. – 6:00 p.m.
 * Tako Rai (ตะโกราย) 30/2 Suk Kasem Road, Tel. 0 4351 1107. Northeastern food. Open from 9:00 a.m. – 6:00 p.m.
 * Too Kung Phao (ตู่กุ้งเผา) Nong Phok – Loeng Nok Tha Road (about 4 km. from Nong Phok district), Tel. 0 4357 9335.
 * Ban Suan (บ้านสวน) 123 Ban Lao Nuea, Rop Mueang Road, Tambon Nai Mueang. Tel. 0 4352 4311.
 * Bueng Luang (บึงหลวง) Patthamanan Road, Tel. 0 4351 2798.
 * Marin (มาริน) Mi Chok Chai Road, Tel. 0 4351 2795.
 * Mae Ploy Thai Food (แม่พลอยอาหารไทย) 38/ 6 -7 Santi Suk Road, Tel. 0 4351 5209.
 * Rochana (รจนา) 48/8 Pracha Thammarak Road, Tel. 0 4351 1311.
 * Si Ocha (ศรีโอชา) Rat Uthit Road, (coffee and breakfast).
 * Forkland Restaurant (ส��นอาหารฟอร์คแลนด์) 223 Nong Ya Ma Village, Ronnachai Chan Yut Road, Tambon Rop Mueang, Amphoe Mueang. Tel. 0 4351 3500.
 * Ratri Restaurant (สวนอาหารราตรี) 35 Rop Mueang Road, Tel. 0 4351 1921.
 * Saha Coffee (สหกาแฟ) Rat Uthit Road (coffee and breakfast).
 * Moo Hao (หมู่เฮา) 362 Ronnachai Chan Yut Road, Tel. 0 4351 2477.
 * LA Restaurant (ห้องอาหารแอลเอ) 188 Sunthon Thep Road, Tel. 0 4351 5041.
 * Khun Aeo (คุณแอ๋ว) Prem Pracharat Road (coffee, ‘Khai Kratha’ - fried egg with topping, etc.)
 * Breakfast like coffee and ‘Khai Kratha’ are also available on Rat Uthit Road, Phloen Chit Road; and local cuisine like grilled chicken, ‘Somtam’ and ‘Lap’ at Ronnachai Chan Yut Road in front of Roi Et Hospital.

--(WT-en) globe-trotter 12:59, 6 February 2010 (EST)

Sleep from Roi Et town

 * Petcharat Garden Hotel,.

 * Roi Et City Hotel,.

 * Mai Thai Hotel, 99 Thanon Hai Sok, Tel. 0 4351 1136, 0 4351 1038 Rate 455 – 750/night.

 * Banchong Hotel, 99-101 Thanon Suriyadet Bamrung, Tel. 0 4351 1235, Rate ß 120 – 200/night.

 * Sai Thip Hotel, 133 Thanon Suriyadet Bamrung, Tel. 0 4351 4028, 0 4351 1742 Rate 280 – 380/night.

 * Khaen Kham Hotel, 52-62 Thanon Ratthakit Khlai Khla, Tel. 0 4351 1508, Rate 180 – 220/night.

 * Bungalow 99 Hotel, 102-104 Thanon Sunthon Thep, Tel.0 43 51 1035, 0 4351 3986 Rate 220 – 320/night.

 * Bua Thong Hotel, 40-46 Thanon Ratthakit Khlai Khla, Tel. 0 4351 1142 Rate 120 – 270/night.

 * Pannadda Resort, 251 MU 16 Tambol Nua Mueang, Tel. 0 4351 3822-4 Fax. 0 4351 2487 Rate 300 /night.

--(WT-en) globe-trotter 12:59, 6 February 2010 (EST)

title: Talk:Roi Et/Listings


text:
Talk:Roma

Roma is the Italian name for Rome, Italy's capital. Maybe we should add a disambiguation page?
 * I don't think we need a full disambig page, because the two cities do have distinct names by our naming conventions (i.e. use the popular English names). Adding something like
 * For the city in Italy, see Rome.
 * at the top of this page should be good enough. - (WT-en) Todd VerBeek 18:47, 30 May 2006 (EDT)

 * It seems Roma was at one stage made a disambig. Have to feel sorry for Roma (Queensland) being "demoted" for a foreign language name of a city.  Is there any precedent with any other city?  --(WT-en) Inas 21:49, 20 May 2009 (EDT)

title: Talk:Roma


text:
Talk:Romania

Rewrite
Get in

By Car:

'Traveling by car or coach is the easiest way and a vast majority...'

This article very good written but under the wrong subject. It must come under 'Get around'. Get in means --> how do you travel to Romania, not how is travel in Romania. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 81.243.187.162 (talk • contribs) 25 Dec 2006
 * I'll take a look at it, but feel free to plunge forward and fix it yourself. -- (WT-en) Jonboy 11:39, 25 December 2006 (EST)

Rewrite
I don't know if romainia is safe for anyone to visit. Last night my brother was bitten so hard thathe is in coma. two people attacked him last night stole his money and bitt them on his head with an iron pipe and was left to die. even the police is not persouing who committed the crime. this is not the first time that has been happening to tourist visiting romainia. I think all other countries specialy europian countries should band people visiting Romainia, then may be then the police and the government start looking into this mega problem. I hope someone do something before more inocent tourist get violated and killed. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 65.9.204.192 (talk • contribs) 27 January 2008

This article sounds like "national tourism promotion". bit of whitewashing, bit of national proud, bit of "good presentation" - but limited use for the traveller.

as this project serves not as a base to promote tourism destinations, i think this article should be re-written with a distant/critical/neutral aproach. it's not the place to tell people, how great romania is, but to tell them what to expect, and what be helpfull in the country.

(refers mainly to the first chapters..)

31/aug/06 nagchampa

CIA factbook import
Did we have CIA factbook stats for this country? I thought it was decided that they would NOT all be deleted, especially the Geography part? (WT-en) KJ 04:04, 16 Sep 2003 (PDT)

 * So, I think this article needs to be whacked on a bit to conform with the

Project:Country article template, but there's a lot of great info in here. -- (WT-en) Evan 12:08, 16 Sep 2003 (PDT)

 * Yeah, sure. I deleted the CIA Factbook so that the article wouldn't be too similar to the Wikipedia article, but I will restore parts of it to conform to the country structure of Wikivoyage - and, new content is on the way! Thanks for telling me about this! -- 203.109.249.138, September 17, 2003

 * Really great content! You might want to look at Switzerland for an example of the factbook stuff to leave or remove. Or both Karen and myself are good at 'weeding' the facts down... but really, great article!(WT-en) Majnoona

The original CIA Factbook 2002 import is now at Talk:Romania/CIA Factbook 2002 import -- (WT-en) Huttite 02:43, 12 Apr 2004 (EDT)

Corruption
To my experience, the corruption problem in Romania is much bigger than stated in this article - sometimes you just bribe coz it's cheaper! for instance, friends of mine using the train bribed the conductor instead of buying a ticket and paid only 2/3 of the amount! Also, stories concerning corrupt policemen (first-hand experienced this as well) are anything but rare! (My last visit to Romania was in spring 2003).

I do not want to insult anyone, but it seemed to me on several visits to Romania that you just bribe everybody... (WT-en) Christoph

 * yes christoph that was probably th case in 2003; things have improved (quite a bit) since then in all areas.

 * bull shit things are worse mr where have you been? may be on dodo planet wake up I advise people to not to visit this country. I had such a bad exprience that i don't want anyone else go through it.So please don't give wronge information to people. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 65.9.204.192 (talk • contribs) 27 January 2008

 * Yes, things have improved significantly in terms of corruption - salaries have gone up, so fewer and fewer people resort to small bribes, especially with the increased penalties. However, it should be clear that bribing is still a quite widespread phenomenon, but rather then the police, it's doctors taking most bribes nowadays. And you can still bribe your way on a train, but, unless you're either a commuter or a large group, it's far harder then it used to be. --(WT-en) Xanthar 03:31, 16 November 2008 (EST)

 * I have heard that in 2006/7, police stopped a bus carrying tourists and harassed them until they coughed up some "foreign" beer (which the tour director had heard about ahead of time and had brought along deliberately for bribes). Ironic when you consider the article's take on drunken driving.

- "foreign beer" as bride? Are you kidding? If money, I would believe it, but not "foreign beer". After all Romania is not Ethiopia :)
 * no way that's true - first, it's more-or-less impossible for the police to actually know who's on the bus and if the bus is a tour bus or a regular passenger bus, even if the bus is not registered in Romania. Second, buses don't get stopped unless there is a really big problem (bus company owners have some "informal" agreements with the police, plus bus drivers will never pay a fine, rather take the ticket to the company that will quickly contest it). And third, beer? Beer is cheap - back then, even a Leffe or some Belgian Trappist beer (those are the most expensive) would have gone for 1.2-1.3€ a bottle, while a can of Stella Artois or Carlsberg or whatever would have been 0.4-0.5 €, if not even less. So, 24 beers would be like 12 €, a stupidly small sum of money, and putting the cans in the police car, that's not really a good idea. --(WT-en) Xanthar 03:31, 16 November 2008 (EST)

 * In a second incident, a specific tourist was singled out. The policeman demanded a $200 "fine" (bribe). This was impossible for that particular tourist and the policeman deliberately spilled coffee on his passport by way of retaliation. (WT-en) Student7 22:56, 11 September 2007 (EDT)

 * This is believable - 200 dollars however was a large bribe to ask, most policemen resorting to such schemes would go for less. I'm wondering if it was a real cop or a fake cop, there was a problem with police impersonators in 2006 (since, the ring has been busted). Strangely, corrupt policemen don't typically target foreigners for bribing purposes - locals are far more knowledgeable in bribe-giving, and the risk for a local is far higher (getting points and your license suspended for a dirty tail lamp or whatever other bizantine rule in the Romanian Driving Code is one example), so the incentives to bribe are also higher. And spilling coffee on a passport? What good/bad does that do? The passport is still good, tearing it up might have been a better retaliation. --(WT-en) Xanthar 03:31, 16 November 2008 (EST)

Credit cards
Visa or Mastercard are very easy to use, the article states that it is "problematic". A huge load of bullshit.

I think it is not o.k. to tell people that something is a "huge load of b..." and to stay anonymous. Personally, I do not think that credit cards are really problematic to use. But in a hotel, although they had a credit card reader and the VISA sign at the front door, they insisted on paying in cash. -- (WT-en) Codica 15:28, 3 Aug 2005 (EDT)

"For locals, since owning a car is still not so common in Romania, ..." That's completely untrue. The average is way above other neighboring countries

Still a Outline ?
It apears to me that the artcile can be qualified as usable now. -(WT-en) anurag 17:07, 31 Jan 2006 (EST)

White shopping experience?
The article says.. "Despite this, all Romanian supermarkets sell products of European quality, and usually make for a very quiet, clean and white shopping experience that can best be likened to duty free shopping in airports at night.' Now what on earth is a "white shopping experience". Are you saying if all shoppers are white people, its a very pleasant experience?

I guess it meant white as in legal and not white as in color. I have never been to romania but that what I feel the line means. -(WT-en) anurag 14:15, 22 April 2006 (EDT) white goods-origin controled grey goods-false origin
 * The phrase "white goods" usually refers to refrigerators, washing machines, etc. In contrast to "brown goods" which include hi-fis, tvs, dvd players. (WT-en) Jnich99 12:09, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

Night Life?
Anyone have a notion of the Romanian nightlife? Or how it is like on the coast of the Black Sea Resort towns? Answer: For sure nothing compare to Bulgaria. The Romanian resorts are underdeveloped and very expensive.

Cities list too long
The current "Regions and cities" section does not correspond to our Manual of Style and there are too many cities - we should stick to 9 at most. I'm copying below the current content of that section and leaving on the main article only the regions and a few of the cities I've heard about and which I suppose are some of the most popular. Anybody shoud feel free to change that list but please do not list all cities in Romania - those should go inside the region articles. Thanks. -- (WT-en) Ricardo (Rmx) 13:07, 11 November 2006 (EST)

 * Bucharest (Bucureşti), the capital city
 * Transylvania and its cities and destinations:
 * Sibiu, European Cultural Capital 2007
 * Braşov, Poiana Braşov and Bran Castle
 * Cluj-Napoca
 * Oradea
 * Sighişoara
 * Timişoara
 * Apuseni Mountains and surrounding villages
 * Transylvanian Alps or Carpathian Mountains ski resorts:
 * Azuga
 * Busteni
 * Păltiniş
 * Poiana Braşov
 * Predeal
 * Sinaia
 * Black Sea Coast and its resorts:
 * Constanţa
 * Mamaia
 * Costinesti
 * Eforie
 * Jupiter
 * Mangalia
 * Navodari
 * Neptun
 * Olimp
 * Saturn
 * Vama Veche
 * Venus
 * The Danube Delta and Tulcea
 * Romanian Moldavia:
 * Suceava
 * Iaşi, the main city
 * Piatra Neamţ
 * Galaţi, Danube-side city
 * Gura Humorului, a good starting point for visiting some Monasteries
 * Painted Monasteries
 * Oltenia, and the cities of
 * Craiova
 * Drobeta-Turnu Severin

Traveling VISA
It has said that U.S.A, E.U, etc can stay in Romania for up to 90 days without VISAS. What about Australia? do Australians have to apply for VISA to stay in Romania for over 30 days? 01:18, 1 April 2007 (EDT)

No, they don't have to apply for visas. Starting January 1st 2007 Australians too can stay without a visa in Romania for 90 days. (WT-en) Axi 14:25, 24 April 2007 (EDT)

Traveling outside Romania to inside of Romania.
Whats the best way to travel from Berlin to Romania? and the costing, if by train, plane or rental car? thank you.

There is a train going directly from Prague to Brasov, which is at the center of Romania (and allso a very nice Town). Check out http://oebb.at/vip8/oebb/en/ to find connections. Its the homepage of the Austrian Train company. I think that train is the cheapest, since car rentals are payed by rental time and you get to see Prague! 195.190.143.254 07:33, 7 May 2007 (EDT)

Been to Romania, most countries can stay up to 90 days. Romania is beautiful, the only thing that bothers me, is the gypsies targeting foreign travelers. There's less gypsies in the countryside though. Other than that, Romania is beautiful. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 121.217.144.2 (talk • contribs) 13 September 2007

 * Romania is beautiful, but I don't think you have been mugged and beaten to death. it happens all over Romania, everyone beware.Untill the police don't take this serious, all tourist are in eminent danger, these murderers hide between cars and they attac you so hard that if you are lucky and stay alive you can not remembe your name. please listen to me and avoid going to Romania. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 65.9.204.192 (talk • contribs) 27 January 2008
 * hey buddy! I have read all your insults to my country and it is time for me to say to you: ENOUGH!! You are portraiting Romania as a sience fiction movie, with criminals waiting at every corner praying for an easy kill... Grow up. It might be that you had an unfortunate event, but this kind of things are happening all over the world in case you are not watching! For your knowledge, nowadays, foreigners can be seen in center of Bucharest walking and enjoying their time peacefully, being treated with respect and oftenlly helped by romanians which you so strongly accuse. May i ask you which country are you from? Then maybe i can collect some information and also characterize your country, but fairly! So please, learn some respect!

"Transactions on the Internet in Romania"
What's the use of the informations in that chapter for a regular tourist ? For now, I will remove the second part, the one about the Bucharest Opera website - that site is obviously problem-free. (WT-en) Axi 10:06, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

 * I removed the whole thing. (WT-en) Jpatokal 12:26, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

Traditional Divisions of Romania
CRISANA IS TRANSYLVANIA

I think that the division of Romania that you make is a nonsense. The Crisana and Maramuresh vwas part of Transylvania from 1100 year, is a nonsense too divide them. Oradea was ever thew gate of Transylvania.I propose to unifie them in a only one name. I ythink is important if some traveller want to understand better their culture.
 * The Principality of Transilvania did not have Crisana and Maramures. Crisana is the old Partium and Maramures is the old voivodship of Maramures, both distinct of Transylvania: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Grossfuerstentum_Siebenbuergen_1857.JPG

Anyway, the map is wrong, so I'm going to replace it. --79.116.201.29 16:34, 17 August 2009 (EDT)

the new map is nice, crisana should be a distinct region because it makes sense for the travel to notice the obvious differences between transylvania and crisana.(WT-en) Deni120 15:53, 20 September 2009 (EDT)

 * The map still has a mistake. The region of "Moldavia" is labeled as "Moldova", which is definitely not the same thing. (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 17:01, 20 September 2009 (EDT)

 * Fixed. (May require browser refresh to see new image.) --(WT-en) Peter Talk 20:52, 20 September 2009 (EDT)

Other destinations
I removed a wohle bunch of towns which were listed in this section. That left only ski resorts. I have added Carpathian Mountains and Transylvanian Alps. Are there no national parks worthy of a mention?--(WT-en) Burmesedays 08:38, 10 May 2010 (EDT)

New Regions map
Whilst the old regions map was perfectly usable, I have produced a new version in line with Wikivoyage standards. If I have missed anything important or made any errors, please do say so here.--(WT-en) Burmesedays 09:51, 10 May 2010 (EDT)

 * The new map has some issues. Vatra Dornei and Sinaia are swapped. Also, Ploieşti is wrong spelled. 82.137.8.34 20:06, 23 April 2011 (EDT)
 * Thank you for pointing those out. All done and corrected. I am not though spending ages creating place names with diacritics - not necessary for an English language map. --(WT-en) Burmesedays 03:41, 13 June 2011 (EDT)

Get in entry requirements
In case anyone wants to know the source of my edits to include information about the visa exemption for 'Annex II' nationals to work during their 90 day visa-free entry, see this European Union document -. (WT-en) Yeahtravel 09:37, 31 May 2011 (EDT)

Cab fare foreigner ripoff verified
(No new information, just verifying what's already here)

Arrived at Henri Coanda airport an hour ago, took a 3.5 leu/km (listed on the side) cab from the International Terminal taxi queue and rode into the city. The driver had a meter on the seat next to him. When arriving the fare was about twice what it should've been (150 instead of ~70 leu), handwritten on a receipt.

Still cheap in the grand scheme of things so we paid, but it might be useful for others know.

90.231.138.199 15:17, 25 September 2011 (EDT)

Bucovina as a division of Romania
Dividing Bucovina From Moldova(Moldavia in English) on a Romania map is like dividing Bavaria from the rest of Germany on an Europe map. The capital of Moldova(Historic State) was Suceava. I think it would be good for travellers to know that when they visit Suceava, they actually visit the capital of the historic state Moldova. I agree that Bucovina is a distinct part inside Moldova, but I think it should be striped over the orange hatch, so that it can be seen that it is part of Moldova. (WT-en) Nyd 10:07, 30 April 2012 (EDT)

First competition of the Romanian Wikivoyage Project
A competition by:Vladislavian (talk) 11:30, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 03:07, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Timisoara collage.jpg

 * It's a collage so we can't have it in the first place as it violates WV:IP. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 03:09, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Romania


text:
Talk:Romanian phrasebook

Good start
This page is a great start on the Romanian phrasebook. It needs to be rounded out to have all the phrases on the Phrasebook template, though. Once that's done, it should be one of the features phrasebooks on the Main Page. -- (WT-en) Evan 09:33, 12 Nov 2003 (PST)

Moved some editorial comments
I moved some editorial comments from the main page. We need to work with this kind of stuff on the talk pages -- that's what they're there for.

 * For "When does the train/bus for _____ leave?": This may be incorrect. I'm not a native speaker, but I'd expect this to mean "the train/bus from ______" not "...for (/to) ______." Would a native speaker please verify? - (WT-en) Jmabel
 * For section "Eating": Note: this section added by a non-native speaker (and is incomplete). Review by native speaker needed. Please remove this note when that is complete.
 * For "I only eat kosher food": I suspect this may be wrong - (WT-en) Jmabel
 * For "Money": Note: this section added by a non-native speaker. Review by native speaker needed. Please remove this note when that is complete.
 * For "Duration": Note: this section added by a non-native speaker. Review by native speaker needed. Please remove this note when that is complete.

In general, it's not really necessary to ask for help on Wikivoyage pages. People are going to do it whether you ask or not. Just go ahead and add what you know, even if you're not sure. We need the info! Thanks! --(WT-en) Evan 00:34, 3 Jan 2004 (EST)

 * I think the notes should be left on the Romanian phrasebook - it helps me a lot when I'm looking to correct the phrasebook, because otherwise I have to either look at page history or go through the whole phrasebook. So, I personally think we should leave them in. Evan, if you don't like them, then that's OK, but can you please bear with them just a few more days! I promise I'll correct the phrasebook and take out the native-speaker notes as quickly as possible - they don't usually stay there more than a few hours. -- (WT-en) Ronline 04:40, 3 Jan 2004 (EST)

I see "pain reliever (e.g., aspirin or ibuprofen)" has been translated as "calmant". I would have thought that mean something stronger then aspirin or ibuprofen, more like a "painkiller". Does "calmant" cover both of these? (WT-en) Jmabel 16:49, 3 Jan 2004 (EST)

Calmant indeed does mean something else. It is stronger than aspirin; closer to a sedative. The correct translation would be "anti inflamator". (WT-en) Alina 00:49, 17 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Very, very nice
What an excellent phrasebook, and a great group effort. Thanks to everyone who worked on this! --(WT-en) Evan 23:49, 3 Jan 2004 (EST)

One question still open 04 Jan 03

 * When does the train/bus for _____ leave? : Când pleacă trenul/autobuzul de _____ ? (COOHND PLACK-uh TREHN-ool/OU-toh_BOOZ-ool DEH _____) This may be incorrect. I'm not a native speaker, but I'd expect this to mean "the train/bus from ______" not "...for (/to) ______", which is what we need. Would a native speaker please verify? -- (WT-en) Jmabel 06:43, 3 Jan 2004 (EST)

 * Seems OK to me. "Când pleacă trenul de Constanţa?" would mean "When does the train for Constanţa leave?".
 * For "from", you would need "... de la Constanţa". 193.231.116.73 11:47, 6 Jun 2004 (EDT)

Thanks from EV

One day is missing
Hello, the word for "saturday" is not in the phrasebook. --(WT-en) zeno 15:12, Aug 9, 2004 (EDT)

sâmbătă

Sound files don't work
The .wav files, e.g. don't work. Not sure why.

 * It seems the audio files are missing :-( Someone silently removed them ? (WT-en) Wojsyl 05:43, 5 Feb 2005 (EST)

 * This is still broken. (WT-en) Murray Cumming April 9th 2006.

 * The pronunciation sound links are still broken as of May 14, 2008.(WT-en) Gordon Sabaduquia May 14,2008.

Some comments related to changes made April 17, 2005
1. In reference to the formal way of addressing others: I changed 'voi' to 'dumneavoatra' as 'voi' is not the formal manner of addressing the second person singular. Unlike the 'vous' in French, in Romanian it only means the second person plural. Also, I added the forms for the third persons.

2. In reference to "May I have a ...": The direct translation would be "Pot sa am" but this would be inapropiate to use. Firstly, it means "Can I have" and secondly it sounds odd. The form "I would like", that is "As dori..." is better. (WT-en) Alina 00:49, 17 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Slight Rewrite - Background Section
With respect to the original author of the 'Background' section, I've taken the liberty of rewriting it slightly with the intention of improving the clarity. This has mostly been in terms of English grammar, the odd bit of punctuation and spelling, and once or twice rewording phrases or sentences to make them a little clearer to English speakers.

Hopefully I've preserved the bulk of what was already a good and informative summary, and I hope my edits are taken in the spirit in which they were meant. If, on the other hand, I've spent too long on Wikipedia and we don't just wade in and rewrite stuff on Wikivoyage, then somebody please feel free to revert. - (WT-en) Shrivenzale 07:17, 27 February 2007 (EST)

You are kidding yourselves
English IS the MOST spoken and known foreign language (Romance, Germanic or otherwise). Probably the person who wrote that English is second after German is a learner of German; they seem to think everyone knows German. Also most people who have been to Italy or who have relatives that have been to Italy seem to think that everyone knows Italian in Romania. I prefer to stay with the statistics. In more than 80% of the schools in Romania, English is the FIRST foreign language learnt, German usually being second (and therefore not so often actually learned properly); sometimes French is second. Also English has become a part of Romanian pop culture and of Romanian computer culture (it is generally required to operate a computer as most computers in Romania use English). German has not become part of the Romanian pop culture. So check things out before you write something that might not help people. In large cities, chances are that 1 out of 2 persons or maybe even 2 out of 3 know English. The same cannot be said about German, despite German's cutural infulence in Transylvania and parts of Wallachia.

Also...
The person writing about who learns what language in Romania seems to have written it only through the point of view of the academic community. Most Romanians don't hvae the slightest idea what the Latin Union is and till last year many didn't know what the Francophonie is. But even in the academic community, the fact that since the 70's English has been the most taught language is primary middle and high-school has made English a widely spoken language, meybe also the most spoken language in the academic community.

More...
I am a native Romanian speaker, living in Romania. Some phrases sound awkward or even not understandable to me. I shall correct them.

This needs fixing:
Would a Romanian speaker please sort this passage out:

''Note: For all of the above, the correct, literary way to express duration is by saying una oră, una ziuă, una săptămână... instead of o oră, o ziuă, o săptămână, but this is never really used in speech, even if the context is very formal. Therefore, it is much easier to learn that o is used to express one or a in the case of minute, hour, month, etc, not una. This is because all of these nouns are feminine. With year, which is masculine, un is used (as in, un an - one year)

''The above "note" is false. UNA dose not exist in romanian, the "o" is used for the feminine, and "un" for masculine. The confusion was made due to the text written on the banknotes - like "UNA SUTA LEI" (instead of "O SUTA DE LEI"), which sounds extremely formal, but it is incorrect.''

It is entirely unhelpful to have such a confusing and contradictory pair of paragraphs. If a piece of information is false, change it, or else raise it as a topic on the talk page, don't just write a paragraph complaining in the prose of the article itself. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 16:29, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

 * Pinging User:IonutBizau, who I think is the only Romanian speaker around here. ϒpsilon (talk) 17:42, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

 * Tack, ϒpsilon. Great idea --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 19:04, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

 * I confirm, the note is bullshit. Deleted it. Cheers. IonutBizau (talk) 08:49, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

What happened last Wednesday?
Very funny pair of sentences, just after the basic greetings, more so without a hint of context. But what is their purpose? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 15:49, 5 October 2019 (UTC) ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 15:51, 5 October 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Romanian phrasebook