text:
Lewis and Clark County, Montana

Lewis and Clark County is a county located in the U.S. state of Montana. As of the 2020 census, the population was 70,973. Its county seat is Helena, the state capital. The numerical designation for Lewis and Clark County (used in the issuance of the state's license plates) is 5. The county was established on June 2, 1865, as one of the nine original counties of the Territory of Montana named Edgerton County in honor of Sidney Edgerton, first Governor of the Territory of Montana, and was renamed Lewis and Clark County on March 1, 1868, in honor of explorers Meriwether Lewis and William Clark.

Lewis and Clark County is part of the Helena, Montana Micropolitan Statistical Area.

Geography
According to the United States Census Bureau, the county has a total area of 3498 sqmi, of which 3459 sqmi is land and 39 sqmi (1.1%) is water.

Adjacent counties

 * Teton County - north
 * Cascade County - east
 * Meagher County - east
 * Broadwater County - southeast
 * Jefferson County - south
 * Powell County - west
 * Flathead County - northwest

National protected areas

 * Flathead National Forest (part)
 * Helena National Forest (part)
 * Lewis and Clark National Forest (part)
 * Lolo National Forest (part)
 * Rocky Mountain Front Conservation Area (part)

2020 census
As of the 2020 census, there were 70,973 people living in the county.

2010 census
As of the 2010 census, there were 63,395 people, 26,694 households, and 16,705 families in the county. The population density was 18.3 PD/sqmi. There were 30,180 housing units at an average density of 8.7 /sqmi. The racial makeup of the county was 94.0% white, 2.1% American Indian, 0.6% Asian, 0.3% black or African American, 0.1% Pacific islander, 0.5% from other races, and 2.4% from two or more races. Those of Hispanic or Latino origin made up 2.5% of the population. In terms of ancestry, 29.2% were German, 19.3% were Irish, 15.0% were English, 8.9% were Norwegian, and 5.1% were American.

Of the 26,694 households, 28.8% had children under the age of 18 living with them, 49.0% were married couples living together, 9.4% had a female householder with no husband present, 37.4% were non-families, and 30.7% of all households were made up of individuals. The average household size was 2.30 and the average family size was 2.87. The median age was 40.9 years.

The median income for a household in the county was $50,238 and the median income for a family was $65,573. Males had a median income of $44,476 versus $34,893 for females. The per capita income for the county was $25,894. About 5.8% of families and 9.7% of the population were below the poverty line, including 10.2% of those under age 18 and 4.1% of those age 65 or over.

Politics
Lewis and Clark County leans slightly Republican, but it has voted for Democratic candidates three times since 1964. Bill Clinton won by nearly seven percentage points in 1992, but Bob Dole won by 130 votes in 1996. Barack Obama carried the county in 2008 but lost it to Mitt Romney in 2012.

Cities

 * Helena (county seat)
 * East Helena

Census-designated places

 * Augusta
 * Canyon Creek
 * Craig
 * Gilman
 * Helena Valley Northeast
 * Helena Valley Northwest
 * Helena Valley Southeast
 * Helena Valley West Central
 * Helena West Side
 * Lincoln
 * Marysville
 * Milford Colony
 * Rimini
 * Unionville
 * Wolf Creek
 * York

Other unincorporated communities

 * Austin
 * Bald Butte
 * Birdseye
 * Canyon Ferry
 * Dearborn (partially within Cascade County)
 * Fort Harrison Army Air Park
 * Four Range
 * Frontier Town
 * Gearing
 * La Chapelle Place
 * Nelson
 * Silver City
 * Stoner Place
 * Weed
 * Wilborn
 * Winston

Education
School districts include:

K-12 (Unified):
 * East Helena K-12 Schools
 * Lincoln K-12 Schools

High school:
 * Augusta High School District
 * Helena High School District

Elementary school:
 * Auchard Creek Elementary School District
 * Augusta Elementary School District
 * Helena Elementary School District
 * Trinity Elementary School District
 * Wolf Creek Elementary School District

Notable people

 * Seth Bullock, sheriff of Lewis and Clark County, later sheriff of Deadwood, South Dakota.
 * Ted Kaczynski, known as the Unabomber, lived in a cabin in Lincoln from 1971 to 1996, during which time he conducted his infamous bombing campaign.
 * Mike McGrath, Chief Justice of the Montana Supreme Court, former Montana Attorney General, former County Attorney of Lewis and Clark County.
 * Johnny Miljus, major league baseball pitcher, retired to Fort Harrison in Lewis and Clark County.
 * W. A. Boyle, president of the UMW, was born in Bald Butte, approximately two miles southwest of Marysville.
 * Brian Knight, Major League Baseball umpire
 * The governor of Montana, whose official residence is in the state capital of Helena.

title: Lewis and Clark County, Montana


text:
Lake County, Montana

Lake County is a county located in the northwest part of the U.S. state of Montana. As of the 2020 census, the population was 31,134. Its county seat is Polson.

Geography
According to the United States Census Bureau, the county has a total area of 1654 sqmi, of which 1490 sqmi is land and 164 sqmi (9.9%) is water. Over two-thirds (67.7%) of the county's land lies within the Flathead Indian Reservation.

Adjacent counties

 * Flathead County - north
 * Missoula County - east
 * Sanders County - west

National protected areas

 * Bison Range (part)
 * Flathead National Forest (part)
 * Ninepipe National Wildlife Refuge
 * Pablo National Wildlife Refuge
 * Swan River National Wildlife Refuge

2020 census
As of the 2020 census, there were 31,134 people living in the county.

2010 census
As of the 2010 census, there were 28,746 people, 11,432 households, and 7,770 families living in the county. The population density was 19.3 PD/sqmi. There were 16,588 housing units at an average density of 11.1 /sqmi. The racial makeup of the county was 69.4% white, 22.0% American Indian, 0.4% Asian, 0.3% black or African American, 0.1% Pacific islander, 0.5% from other races, and 7.3% from two or more races. Those of Hispanic or Latino origin made up 3.5% of the population. In terms of ancestry, 22.3% were German, 11.6% were English, 11.5% were Irish, 6.9% were Norwegian, and 3.8% were American.

Of the 11,432 households, 31.0% had children under the age of 18 living with them, 51.0% were married couples living together, 11.5% had a female householder with no husband present, 32.0% were non-families, and 26.5% of all households were made up of individuals. The average household size was 2.46 and the average family size was 2.97. The median age was 41.3 years.

The median income for a household in the county was $37,274 and the median income for a family was $47,437. Males had a median income of $37,461 versus $26,637 for females. The per capita income for the county was $20,164. About 15.4% of families and 21.6% of the population were below the poverty line, including 33.9% of those under age 18 and 9.3% of those age 65 or over.

Cities

 * Polson (county seat)
 * Ronan

Town

 * St. Ignatius

Census-designated places

 * Arlee
 * Bear Dance
 * Big Arm
 * Charlo
 * Dayton
 * Elmo
 * Finley Point
 * Jette
 * Kerr
 * Kicking Horse
 * Kings Point
 * Lake Mary Ronan
 * Lindisfarne
 * Niarada
 * Pablo
 * Ravalli
 * Rocky Point
 * Rollins
 * Swan Lake
 * Turtle Lake
 * Woods Bay

Unincorporated communities

 * Allentown
 * Post Creek
 * Proctor
 * Round Butte
 * Salmon Prairie
 * Sipes

Education
School districts include:

K-12 (Unified):
 * Hot Springs K-12 Schools
 * St. Ignatius K-12 Schools

High school:
 * Arlee High School District
 * Bigfork High School District
 * Charlo High School District
 * Missoula High School District
 * Polson High School District
 * Ronan High School District

Elementary school:
 * Arlee Elementary School District
 * Bigfork Elementary School District
 * Charlo Elementary School District
 * Polson Elementary School District
 * Ronan Elementary School District
 * Swan Lake-Salmon Elementary School District
 * Upper West Shore Elementary School District
 * Valley View Elementary School District

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Lake County, Montana


text:
Judith Basin County, Montana

Judith Basin County is a county in the U.S. state of Montana. As of the 2020 census, the population was 2,023. Its county seat is the town of Stanford.

History
Judith Basin County was formed of area taken from western Fergus and eastern Cascade counties on December 10, 1920. In 1895, Yogo sapphires were discovered at Yogo Gulch, about 15 miles southwest of Utica, which at the time was in Fergus County.

Geography
According to the United States Census Bureau, the county has a total area of 1871 sqmi, of which 1870 sqmi is land and 0.8 sqmi (0.04%) is water.

Adjacent counties

 * Chouteau County – north
 * Fergus County – east
 * Wheatland County – south
 * Meagher County – south
 * Cascade County – west

National protected area

 * Lewis and Clark National Forest (part)

City

 * Hobson

Town

 * Stanford (county seat)

Census-designated places

 * Geyser
 * Moccasin
 * Raynesford
 * Sapphire Ridge
 * Surprise Creek Colony
 * Utica
 * Windham

Other unincorporated communities

 * Arrow Creek
 * Benchland
 * Hughesville
 * Kolin
 * Lehigh
 * Sapphire Village
 * Sipple
 * Spion Kop

 * Utica

Former town

 * Ubet

Politics
This small county strongly leans Republican; a Democrat has not won this county in a Presidential race since Lyndon Johnson's landslide win in 1964.

2020 census
As of the 2020 census, there were 2,023 people living in the county.

2010 census
As of the 2010 census, there were 2,072 people, 924 households, and 600 families in the county. The population density was 1.1 PD/sqmi. There were 1,336 housing units at an average density of 0.7 /sqmi. The racial makeup of the county was 98.3% white, 0.8% American Indian, 0.1% Asian, 0.1% from other races, and 0.7% from two or more races. Those of Hispanic or Latino origin made up 1.2% of the population. In terms of ancestry, 30.9% were German, 16.7% were English, 16.1% were Irish, 10.3% were Norwegian, 6.7% were Czech, 5.0% were Danish, and 1.7% were American.

Of the 924 households, 24.0% had children under the age of 18 living with them, 55.7% were married couples living together, 5.2% had a female householder with no husband present, 35.1% were non-families, and 30.3% of all households were made up of individuals. The average household size was 2.24 and the average family size was 2.80. The median age was 48.3 years.

The median income for a household in the county was $41,473 and the median income for a family was $54,479. Males had a median income of $36,295 versus $29,750 for females. The per capita income for the county was $24,029. About 6.4% of families and 9.9% of the population were below the poverty line, including 8.9% of those under age 18 and 9.0% of those age 65 or over.

title: Judith Basin County, Montana


text:
Jefferson County, Montana

Jefferson County is a county in Montana, United States. As of the 2020 census, the population was 12,085. Its county seat is Boulder. The county was created in 1865 and named for President Thomas Jefferson.

Jefferson County is part of the Helena, MT Micropolitan Statistical Area.

Geography
According to the United States Census Bureau, the county has a total area of 1659 sqmi, of which 1656 sqmi is land and 2.6 sqmi (0.2%) is water.

Major highways

 * [[Image:I-15.svg|20px]] Interstate 15
 * [[Image:I-90.svg|20px]] Interstate 90
 * [[Image:US 12.svg|20px]] U.S. Highway 12
 * [[Image:US 287.svg|20px]] U.S. Highway 287
 * [[Image:MT-2.svg|20px]] Montana Highway 2
 * [[Image:MT-41.svg|20px]] Montana Highway 41
 * [[Image:MT-55.svg|20px]] Montana Highway 55
 * [[Image:MT-69.svg|20px]] Montana Highway 69

Adjacent counties

 * Lewis and Clark County - north
 * Broadwater County - east
 * Gallatin County - southeast
 * Madison County - south
 * Silver Bow County - west
 * Deer Lodge County - west
 * Powell County - northwest

National protected areas

 * Deerlodge National Forest (part)
 * Helena National Forest (part)

2020 census
As of the 2020 census, there were 12,085 people living in the county.

2010 census
As of the 2010 census, there were 11,406 people, 4,512 households, and 3,301 families residing in the county. The population density was 6.9 PD/sqmi. There were 5,055 housing units at an average density of 3.1 /sqmi. The racial makeup of the county was 95.5% white, 1.4% American Indian, 0.4% Asian, 0.1% black or African American, 0.4% from other races, and 2.2% from two or more races. Those of Hispanic or Latino origin made up 2.0% of the population. In terms of ancestry, 31.3% were German, 19.1% were Irish, 17.2% were English, 10.8% were Norwegian, and 4.2% were American.

Of the 4,512 households, 28.8% had children under the age of 18 living with them, 63.7% were married couples living together, 5.4% had a female householder with no husband present, 26.8% were non-families, and 22.6% of all households were made up of individuals. The average household size was 2.48 and the average family size was 2.90. The median age was 46.2 years.

The median income for a household in the county was $56,695 and the median income for a family was $67,195. Males had a median income of $50,978 versus $34,148 for females. The per capita income for the county was $26,437. About 2.7% of families and 12.8% of the population were below the poverty line, including 5.1% of those under age 18 and 8.6% of those age 65 or over.

Towns

 * Boulder (county seat)
 * Whitehall

Census-designated places

 * Basin
 * Cardwell
 * Clancy (includes Alhambra)
 * Elkhorn
 * Jefferson City
 * Montana City
 * Rader Creek
 * South Hills

Unincorporated communities

 * Amazon
 * Bernice
 * Corbin
 * Elk Park
 * Homestake
 * Leadville
 * La Hood Park
 * Louisville
 * Pappas Place
 * Paul Place
 * Piedmont
 * Pipestone
 * Renova

Former communities

 * Comet
 * Wickes

title: Jefferson County, Montana


text:
London Borough of Harrow

The London Borough of Harrow is a London borough in northwest London, England; it forms part of Outer London. It borders four other London boroughs Barnet to the east of ancient Watling Street (now the A5 road), Brent to the southeast, Ealing to the south and Hillingdon to the west  plus the Hertfordshire districts of Three Rivers and Hertsmere to the north. The local authority is Harrow London Borough Council. The London borough was formed in 1965, based on boundaries that had been established in 1934. The borough is made up of three towns: Harrow, Pinner and Stanmore, but also includes western parts of Edgware.

History
The area of the modern borough broadly corresponds to the three ancient parishes of Harrow on the Hill, Great Stanmore and Little Stanmore (also known as Whitchurch), all of which were historically in the county of Middlesex. Harrow on the Hill was the largest of the three parishes. Pinner was a chapelry of Harrow on the Hill until 1766 when it was made a separate parish.

The central part of the parish of Harrow on the Hill was made a local board district in 1850, with an elected board overseeing public health and responsible for the provision of infrastructure. The local board district covered the original hilltop village and the adjoining hamlets of Roxeth, Sudbury and Greenhill. Greenhill subsequently developed into the modern town centre of Harrow following the opening of Harrow-on-the-Hill station there in 1880.

Such districts were reconstituted as urban districts under the Local Government Act 1894, which also said that parishes could no longer straddle district boundaries. The parts of the old parish of Harrow on the Hill outside the urban district were therefore split into three new parishes called Harrow Weald, Wealdstone and Wembley (the latter now part of the London Borough of Brent). Wealdstone and Wembley were both made into urban districts at the same time.

The urban district was significantly enlarged by the Middlesex Review Order 1934 to take in the neighbouring urban district of Wealdstone and the parishes of Harrow Weald, Pinner, Great Stanmore and Little Stanmore. The urban district was renamed from 'Harrow on the Hill' to just 'Harrow' as part of the 1934 expansion. Harrow Urban District was incorporated as a municipal borough on 4 May 1954. At the 1961 census, the borough had a population of 209,080, making it the most populous local government district in the administrative county of Middlesex.

In 1965 the borough was transferred from Middlesex to Greater London under the London Government Act 1963. It kept the same boundaries, but was renamed the London Borough of Harrow, becoming one of the 32 London Boroughs. It was the only London borough which comprised a single pre-1965 district with no changes to its boundaries. There has since been an adjustment to the borough's northern boundary, where the village of Elstree straddled Harrow and Hertfordshire; on 1 April 1993 Elstree was placed entirely in Hertfordshire (and its district of Hertsmere).

Governance
The local authority is Harrow Council, which meets at the Harrow Arts Centre in Pinner and has its main offices at the Council Hub on Kenmore Avenue in Wealdstone.

Greater London representation
Since 2000, for elections to the London Assembly, the borough forms part of the Brent and Harrow constituency.

Location
Its site on and near the green belt and ease of access to central London (20 minutes by train to Marylebone and 12 minutes to Euston via West Midlands Trains) make Harrow a convenient place to live. Rising property prices in all London areas have helped to see a large increase in property redevelopment of its existing Edwardian and 1920s to 1940s housing stock.

Ethnicity
Harrow is a diverse borough, having 63.8% of its population from the BME (Black and Minority Ethnic) communities, with the largest group being of Indian ethnicity (specifically those from Gujarat and South India). The borough can also claim to have the largest concentration of Sri Lankan Tamils in the UK and Ireland as well as having the highest density of Gujarati Hindus in the UK.

Wards with the highest white British population were:
 * Pinner
 * Pinner South (a long-stretched ward covering Pinner Village, the area west of North Harrow and Rayners Lane, and east of Eastcote)
 * Stanmore Park (an area mostly covering Stanmore)

The lowest wards meanwhile were:
 * Kenton East (the area west of Honeypot Lane, bordering Kenton Lane),
 * Queensbury (the area north of the station, around Honeypot Lane)

Since 2005, on the last Sunday in June Harrow Council hosts Under One Sky - Harrow's largest festival, to celebrate and the joint communities of Harrow. This has a programme of dance, world music, sports activity, youth music, spoken word, free children's activity, a carnival parade, information and stalls, health promotion, a world food zone and outside radio broadcast.

Religion
Harrow is the most religiously diverse local authority area in the UK, with a 62% chance that two random people are from different religions, according to Office for National Statistics, October 2006. According to the 2011 census, 25.3% of Harrow's population identified themselves as Hindu - the highest in the UK. A large number of Jewish people live in Stanmore and Hatch End. The Stanmore and Canons Park Synagogue boasts the largest membership of any single synagogue in the whole of Europe. Harrow also has a sizable Muslim community, about 1 in 10 of its population.

As per the 2011 census, Harrow has a larger than average Jewish, Hindu and Muslim population.

Other
In a national detailed Land Use Survey by the Office for National Statistics in 2005 it was found that the London Borough of Harrow had the second highest proportion of land being domestic gardens: 34.7% of all 326 districts in England; this compared with the London Borough of Sutton's 35.1% (highest proportion nationally) and Bournemouth's 34.6%.

Arts and culture
The first and only contemporary artist-led gallery in Harrow was set up in 2010 by the Usurp Art Collective. The space is called the Usurp Art Gallery & Studios and is based in West Harrow, a bohemian part of Harrow. Usurp Art provides professional support to artists and runs the only public artists studios in the borough. It is a flagship project for Arts Council England.

There are 289 listed buildings located in the London Borough of Harrow, including more than 80 in Harrow-on-the-Hill ward and over 50 in Pinner ward. Grade I and II* buildings in the borough include the Church of St Lawrence, Stanmore and Headstone Manor, and Grade II listed buildings include Bentley Priory, Grim's Dyke and Harrow and Wealdstone station.

Economy
Major employers included Kodak, the Royal National Orthopaedic Hospital and Ladbrokes, which formally has its headquarters in Harrow.

Crime
Crime figures are generally lower compared to the Greater London average; the borough had 2,618 notifiable offences in April 2009, compared with an average of 2,204 across London's boroughs. Between the annual year of June 2017 to June 2018, Harrow was ranked 28th out of the 32 London boroughs in terms of number of criminal offences, and recording just one murder in the period. The Pinner South ward was recorded as having the lowest crime rate out of all wards of Greater London in 2014/15.

Sport and leisure
The London Borough of Harrow has 4 non league football clubs, including Wealdstone FC who play at The Vale, Harrow Borough F.C. who play at Earlsmead Stadium and Rayners Lane F.C. who play at the Tithe Farm Social Club. Barnet F.C. are also based in Harrow, having moved into The Hive Stadium from the neighbouring London Borough of Barnet in 2013 after disagreements with the local authority over their former home Underhill Stadium. Five of the 30 cricket clubs which play in the Middlesex County Cricket League are based in the London Borough of Harrow: Harrow, Harrow St Mary's, Harrow Town, Kenton and Stanmore. Hatch End Cricket Club previously played at Shaftesbury playing fields in Hatch End but following an arson attack on their clubhouse and a subsequent failure to raise enough funds to build a new one, the club moved to Elstree in 2011.

Harrow also had a professional rugby league team when London Broncos played at The Hive Stadium in 2014 and 2015. The club relocated to Ealing from 2016 onwards.

Education
The borough is often perceived as having a good educational record, and features many state-funded primary and secondary schools as well as a handful of large tertiary colleges.

For a long time the secondary schools of Harrow did not feature integrated sixth form education, with all school leavers having to join the tertiary colleges such as Harrow College and Stanmore College, or the faith-based St Dominic's Sixth Form College. The tertiary system was implemented in 1987 after years of discussions and delays, with Harrow becoming the first London borough with a complete change to tertiary; the Pinner Observer called it an education "revolution". There have been critics of the tertiary colleges, with many arguing the standard of education does not continue the standard set by the Borough's secondary schools. The council eventually went into another re-organisation, creating the Harrow Sixth Form Collegiate, a co-ordinated partnership between many of the borough's secondary schools, which led to the first admission of school sixth form students in September 2008. Both Catholic faith-based Salvatorian College and Sacred Heart Language College were unaffected, the students of which could transfer to St Dominic's Sixth Form College.

From September 2010, the primary sector was modified to enable transfer to secondary education at age 11 in line with other London Boroughs.

The Borough has a Music Service which provides instrumental tuition for 15% of all Harrow state sector pupils (the national figure is 8% of all state pupils receiving instrumental tuition) and a range of ensemble opportunities for pupils.

The independent schools of the Borough are dominated by the presence of Harrow School and John Lyon School for boys and North London Collegiate School for girls which consistently rank as among the best schools in the country. Notable independent primary schools include Orley Farm School and Reddiford School, both of which are co-educational.

There are also a number of voluntary aided schools in the Borough. These include: Salvatorian College (Roman Catholic, boys), Sacred Heart Language College (Roman Catholic, girls) and Moriah Jewish Day School (Jewish, co-ed).

There are two special needs high schools; Kingsley High School (co-ed) and Shaftesbury High School (co-ed).

Other state secondary schools in the London Borough of Harrow are: Whitefriars High School (co-ed); Bentley Wood High School (girls); Canons High School (co-ed); Harrow High School (co-ed); Hatch End High School (co-ed); Nower Hill High School (co-ed); Park High School (co-ed); Rooks Heath School (co-ed); Whitmore High School (co-ed). Mountview High School in Wealdstone - a comprehensive school formed out of Whitefriars Secondary Modern in the early 1970s - closed in 1986 with the site being partially redeveloped into industrial units. The catchment area was dispersed between Nower Hill and Hatch End Schools.

Middle schools include Whitchurch Middle School.

 * GCSE examination performance

 * The table on shows the percentage of students gaining five A* to C grades, including English and Maths, for state schools in the London Borough of Harrow
 * The rightmost column shows the percentage of students gaining five A* to C grades, in five core subjects - maths, English, two science qualifications, a foreign language and either history or geography.
 * Source: Department for Education

All of Harrow's pupils have the chance to be elected onto the Harrow Youth Parliament. This is a group of around 50 young people in the Borough who come together to work on projects that benefit other young people. They are also the official youth voice for the council and are in constant communication with the council on all youth matters.

Transport
The London Borough of Harrow was historically in the heart of an area known as "Metro-land" and therefore is very well served by the London Underground compared with other boroughs in Outer London. It is located near the northwestern extremity of the modern-day network, with 4 lines serving the area. The Bakerloo and Jubilee lines terminate in the borough, at Harrow and Stanmore respectively. Meanwhile, the Piccadilly and Metropolitan lines pass through the southern edge of the borough on shared track before both terminating at Uxbridge. The Northern line terminates just outside Harrow at Edgware tube station in the London Borough of Barnet.

The London Overground also serves the borough, sharing track with the Bakerloo line between Queens Park and Harrow & Wealdstone before it continues beyond the latter station to eventually terminate at Watford Junction.

The numerous National Rail, London Overground and London Underground stations in the borough are:
 * Canons Park
 * Harrow & Wealdstone
 * Harrow-on-the-Hill
 * Hatch End
 * Headstone Lane
 * North Harrow
 * Pinner
 * Rayners Lane
 * South Harrow
 * Stanmore
 * Sudbury Hill
 * Sudbury Hill Harrow
 * West Harrow

In March 2011, the main forms of transport that residents used to travel to work were: driving a car or van, 27.5% of all residents aged 16–74; underground, metro, light rail, tram, 5.9%; bus, minibus or coach, 5.9%; train, 4.5%; on foot, 4.3%; work mainly at or from home, 3.5%; passenger in a car or van, 1.6%.

Town twinning
Harrow is twinned with:
 * 🇫🇷 Douai, France

Coat of arms
A coat of arms was granted to Harrow Urban District Council in 1938. Supporters to the arms were granted in 1954, when the urban district was incorporated as a municipal borough. The municipal borough became the London Borough of Harrow in 1965, with unaltered boundaries, and thus the council retained use of the arms. The arms are also used by Harrow Borough F.C. The motto reads as "Salus Populi Suprema Lex" which translates from Latin as "The well-being of the people is the highest law."

Freedom of the Borough
The following people and organisations have received the Freedom of the Borough of Harrow.

Individuals

 * Sir Winston Churchill: 30 December 1955.
 * Sir Roger Bannister: May 2004.
 * Keith Toms: 26 November 2020.

Military units

 * 131 Independent Commando Squadron, Corps of Royal Engineers (Volunteers): 10 March 1983.
 * 47 (Middlesex Yeomanry) Signal Squadron, 31st (Greater London) Signal Regiment Royal Corps of Signals: 10 March 1983.
 * 257 (Southern) General Hospital Royal Army Medical Corps (Volunteers): 10 March 1983.
 * RAF Stanmore Park: 20 October 1988.
 * RAF Bentley Priory: 20 October 1988.
 * Roxeth & Harrow Company, Church Lads' & Church Girls' Brigade: 20 October 1994
 * Royal British Legion (Harrow Branch): 18 July 1996.
 * Girls' Brigade North West London District: 1 May 2014.
 * 1454 (Harrow) Squadron Air Training Corps: 1 May 2014.

title: London Borough of Harrow


text:
Talk:Addington, London

Village? In Croydon? Secretlondon (talk) 22:22, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

 * Croydon wasn't always as big as it is now. Although Addington is technically part of Croydon, there is a lot of green space between Croydon proper and Addington Village, so it is still relatively isolated.  To reinforce the point, the road that runs through it is called 'Addington Village Road' and was part of the main A2022 before the bypass (Kent Gate Way) was built in the 1970's. DieSwartzPunkt (talk) 15:33, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

A tense debate
Uakari, I see nothing in the guidelines you refer to that says what tense should be used. You have also failed to comply with other guidelines that state the historic county of a place can be mentioned in the lead. Refering to the historic county in the present tense does not contravene the guidelines you mention because the tense used is a grammatical, not a factual, matter. Past events can be mentoned with a present tense if the context allows, which in this case it does. I have inserted a rather pointless citation to illustrate the point. It refers specifically to other parts of London but the point of the citation is the tense used, which relates directly to your argument. BTW, please do not revert detail referenced with a reliable secondary source, which this is. To avoid doubt, this reference was published in 1996, well after 1974, or 1965. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 10:07, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

 * Using the present tense implies that the area concerned is still in the stated historic county, which is not the case, and is specifically against the guidelines in paragraph 3 of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_UK_geography/How_to_write_about_counties#:~:text=Avoid%20using%20headings%20that%20arrange%20the%20history%20of,A%20note%20on%20the%20geology%20of%20the%20territory. I fail to see what you mean by 'a grammatical, not a factual, matter'. Using the present tense implies that the persistence of historic counties is a fact, whereas the guidelines specifically state that it is not. What is your specific objection to writing: 'Prior to 1965, Addington was in the historic county of Surrey'? I also notice you have not been consistent in adding historic county information to London areas. You have mainly done so for areas outside the area with the post-town LONDON, thus violating WP:NPOV. To be consistent, you need to add historic county information to ALL London neighbourhoods outside the City of London, and keep the same tense: Westminster and Piccadilly as much as Addington or Aperfield. It seems this is a pet issues for you, but individual personal beliefs do not trump Wikipedia guidelines, which have been reached by consensus. Your suggestion to alter how historic counties are referred to was not adopted, as per the discussion here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_UK_geography/How_to_write_about_counties#Request_for_Comment_-_Proposed_change_to_guidelines_on_how_to_write_about_counties. You are thus causing a lot of correction work to every random London neighbourhood article where you have inserted historic county information in the present tense, which is inconsiderate. user:MRSC may also wish to comment here. For the reasons stated, I am again reverting your changes to this article. Uakari (talk) 14:14, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

 * Uakari, as Roger 8 Roger stated, there are other guidelines that state that the historic county can be mentioned in the lead. I would object to writing "was in the historic county of Surrey" as this would mislead readers by implying that the historic county of Surrey was abolished. The area was removed from the administrative county of Surrey. The fact this area is no longer within the area of Surrey County Council (the non-metropolitan county of Surrey) does not mean the area is not part of the historic county of Surrey. As for your suggestion regarding consistency, I do not see any issue in adding historic county information to all areas in Greater London, as many articles already have - including those for inner-conurbation areas that are part of the LONDON post town. You have raised Roger 8 Roger's proposal to change a set of guidelines regarding the default meaning of the word "county" on Wikipedia from several years ago; I do not see how this is relevant to this discussion, which is about whether Addington's location in the historic county of Surrey should be mentioned as being "in the historic county of Surrey", alongside the informally defined "south London", the local authority district (LB Croydon) and the ceremonial county of Greater London. PlatinumClipper96 (talk) 16:29, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

It has been made absolutely clear the policy we've settled on is not to put history in the present tense. I'd support pursuing a topic ban at this point. MRSC (talk) 16:50, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

 * PlatinumClipper96 The wording I suggested does not imply that Surrey as a county no longer persists, just that it no longer exists as a historic county 'with the former boundaries', as per the wording of the guidelines. The historic county of Surrey 'with the former boundaries' was indeed abolished when the County of London was created in 1889. Humans established counties and humans can and do change them: that's what human geography is. Then Addington ceased in 1965 to be part of that newly-established county of Surrey, so perhaps better wording would be: 'Historically, it was in the county of Surrey.' But again, this would need to be done for ALL areas of London outside the City of London, or not at all. Using the present tense implies that Surrey, as a historic county 'with the former boundaries', persists to this day, and that Addington is presently part of that entity. This is not only false but against the guidelines/consensus. The complex history of changes to counties is why in my view it is better to leave this information out of the lead altogether and explain it in the history section instead (in the past tense). I would agree that a lot of irrational, unilateral and unsupported edits are taking place to give false information that historic counties persist 'with their former boundaries', and these keep happening even when the matter has been resolved by consensus or no change in consensus. Therefore I would support MRSC's suggestion of a topic ban, if this also makes it easier to revert edits that state or imply the persistence of historic counties 'with their former boundaries'. How could this be implemented? The proposal I linked is relevant because it involves a discussion about whether historic counties 'still exist with their former boundaries', and the result was that there was no change to the consensus that they do not. Uakari (talk) 17:32, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Addington, London


text:
Talk:Addiscombe

Suggestion
Kate Moss is perhaps one of the most famous people to have come from Addiscombe. Should this not be added to the list of famous residents? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.222.168.9 (talk) 13:26, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * ✅--Pierre et Condat (talk) 09:11, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

Athletes on the brickworks
I am not sure if the following qualifies to go in the article.

The site of the former brickworks lying behind Beckford Road has been redeveloped as housing. The roads have been consistently named after athletes who were in the news at the time - late 1980s, early 1990s. They are:

 * Akabusi Close - Kriss Akabusi
 * Christie Drive - Linford Christie
 * Grindley Gardens - ? David Grindley
 * Gunnell Close - Sally Gunnell
 * Pickering Gardens - Karen Pickering
 * Rendle Close - Sharon Rendle

 * Adams Way - ? Neil Adams
 * Davies Close - Sharron Davies or possibly Diana Davies
 * Goodhew Road - Duncan Goodhew
 * Hardcastle Close - Sarah Hardcastle
 * Redgrave Close - Steve Redgrave

 * Backley Gardens - Steve Backley
 * Coe Avenue - Sebastian Coe
 * Anthony Road - misleading! This road is much older. The name is just as likely to be that of the developer or one of his family.

— RHaworth 21:38, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

 * Interesting... maybe could be include on the Woodside article if a decent reference can be found? WisDom-UK (talk) 14:04, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Orphaned references in Addiscombe
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Addiscombe's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "Willey": From Spring Park, Croydon: Willey, Russ. Chambers London Gazetter, p. 467. From Shirley, London: Willey, Russ. Chambers London Gazetteer, p 439 From Monks Orchard: Willey, Russ. Chambers London Gazetteer, p 327 From Woodside, London: Willey, Russ. Chambers London Gazetteer, p 565-6

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 14:43, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Addiscombe


text:
Talk:Alperton

Demographics
I have just put a tag on this paragraph:

"There is a high incidence of Indians living in Alperton (about 75% of the population). There is also a small Sri Lankan community in Alperton (about 15%), and 10% stated as others"

This is unsourced and is at variance with the census results for Alperton Ward on Brent Council's website: which gives (for 2001) Indians as 32.4%, "other Asian" as 12.3% and White British as 29.2% Lozleader (talk) 15:04, 13 July 2012 (UTC)

Incorrect information on Wikipedia shock
My father, the sculptor Neville Boden was not born in Alperton, I have no idea where this mis-information has originated. He was born in Cape Town, South Africa 86.162.234.84 (talk) 10:18, 29 July 2013 (UTC)

History
Alperton's pre-1965 history is sadly lacking from this article. It was previously a part of Wembley, Middlesex, but we are not even given this bit of information to know where we might go to find some background for the neighbourhood's existence. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Oldontarian (talk • contribs) 10:42, 4 October 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Alperton


text:
Talk:Balham/Archive 1

10 Years ago
I like the way the main article is written by someone who obviously has moved there and is trying to bigup the area - 20 years ago the place was a bit of a nogo area, but like Tooting really.

Yeah - talk of period Victorian housing, Waitrose and gentrification defintely gives that impression. Was this page edited by an estate agent?

--81.19.57.130 13:07, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, but the sad fact is that the article is correct - Balham is going that way. No point trying to hide the truth. --Richardrj talkemail 09:25, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Hyde farm estate has an article. Secretlondon 17:38, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Seen the film 'Atonement' this week in which the Keira Knightley character lives in Balham during the Second World War. At the end of the film, it's said that she died in Balham Underground station with many other people when a German bomb hit a Gas and Water works above it and she, and the others, were drowned in the ensuing flood. Having grown-up in South London after the war, I thought I might have heard from my parents (now dead) of such a catastrophe. No reference is here, so it is just fiction? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.250.101.173 (talk) 11:06, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

 * There's a plaque in Balham tube station commemorating the 64 people who died in the tube station bombing on Oct 14th 1940. This is mentioned in Balham tube station. I think that Atonement talks about a water pipe being hit, not a water works. That sounds far more likely. Davorg 21:46, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

There were some famous bombings of Balham during WW2. One of them was a direct hit on the subway (a memorable photo of a double decker bus fallen into the crater exists). Also the neighbourhood between Fernlea Rd and Rossiter Rd, approximately midway along their length, was destroyed by one of the first V2's sent by Germany. Hence the 60's/70's built apartment blocks, and unconformist terraced units along both streets. I have not heard of a gas and water works near Balham station. Mr. Henry Kelly, a famous resident of Balham, and local greengrocer for the open air market, was interviewed and recorded for National Geographics article for his memories of the London Blitz, sometime in the 1990's. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.162.3.155 (talk) 16:08, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Peter Sellers - Balham - Gateway To The South excerpt.ogg
Image:Peter Sellers - Balham - Gateway To The South excerpt.ogg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 07:20, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

'Victorian terraced houses now highly prized as family homes'
Sorry to be pedantic, but as someone else suggested, the following sentence sounds like it was written by an estate agent:

Balham is an inner London suburb containing many Victorian terraced houses now highly prized as family homes.

It's not even correct:
 * much (most?) of Balham is Edwardian or later: the Hyde Farm estate, central streets like Oakmead Road and Ravenstone Street, DuCane Court, Ravenstone School (I think), and so on
 * much of Balham is not 'family homes'
 * I don't like the word 'containing' :-).

I say get rid of it! Any objections?

Sam Dutton (talk) 10:40, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Peter Sellers - Balham - Gateway To The South excerpt.ogg
Image:Peter Sellers - Balham - Gateway To The South excerpt.ogg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 14:16, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Rupert Penry-Jones and Dervla Kirwan
According to an interview in the Times on June 15th 2008: "They moved from Balham to a big house in Hampshire two months ago." So I've removed them from the list of notable people. Davorg (talk) 08:45, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

title: Talk:Balham/Archive 1


text:
Talk:Barnes, London

external link
The link to BarnesSW13 is a bit funny - the link shows the site is monitoring the use of the link. Is this against wikipedia policy, is it considered advertising? Jfr26 22:47, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

I think it should be against policy if it isn't already.. The barnes-online site isn't exactly relevant either. Despite the name, there's very little that's Barnes-specific on it - it seems to be mainly about Richmond-upon-Thames / the Richmond Park constituency and the council. Also, not sure the negative section on North Barnes at the top deserves so much prominence.. What do others think? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.45.22.123 (talk • contribs).

 * The relevant guideline here, IMHO, is WP:EL (and, I suppose, WP:NOT). To be sure, the referral tracking is wholly inappropriate in view of WP:SPAM's proscription against external link spamming, inasmuch as, in its ertswhile fashion, the link existed, we can safely infer, primarily to solicit traffic; I modified the link in order that the provenance of site hits should not be tracked.  The question of whether we ought to include the link at all is a closer one.  Because the site would seem to contain neutral and accurate material (even as the site ostensibly advocates that one partake of the activities there enumerated, many of those activities are non-commerical, and, in any event, certain activities, at least vis-à-vis others, are not treated tendentiously) and be a relevant web directory (as, for example, might be a link to a given Chamber of Commerce for an American city; we don't tend to look with such links with disfavor), I can abide its inclusion, even as the site does seem to exist as advertising or to promote products or services; I will understand, though, if others disagree and think the link ought to be removed straightaway.  Joe 03:14, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Deleted vandalism
Have deleted the following: The pub is noted for the very poor service and a very rude bar manager. --Technopat 19:43, 16 August 2007 (UTC) Looks like that vandalism is back! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.125.56.252 (talk) 18:46, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

That's not vandalism - it is a statement of fact and therefore is to remain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.145.176.152 (talk) 16:22, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
 * It is actually not relevant in an encyclopaedia. In any case, such a statement about a living person needs to be backed up by reliable sources - see WP:BIO. Thanks. Kbthompson (talk) 18:32, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Notable residents
Am increasingly concerned about that growing list of notable residents. Several issues at stake here, including lack of references, for one, and non-encyclopedic, for another. Feedback, anyone? --Technopat (talk) 09:53, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

 * With all due respect to the hard work, zeal and enthusiasm editors are showing in adding sections of long lists of notable citizens to articles, let's see if we can get some consensus going on this issue.

 * Among my many concerns is that article pages corresponding to big cities - New York is one that springs readily to mind, with over 19,000,000 (2008 est.) citizens - but of course we mustn't limit it to our particular ethnocentricity (pun intended) - may end up with long lists of notables far exceeding the relative importance to the article itself.

 * The fact that someone or another lives somewhere is really all not that important (after all, we ALL have to live somewhere) unless s/he has actually "done" something notable towards, shall we say, improving that particular place or is of some historical relevance.

 * Other issues at stake here include inline references, what Wikipedia is/is not, etc.

Looking forward to feedback on this one.--Technopat (talk) 18:35, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

Removed unreferenced list of notable residents
Have removed the following un-encyclopaedic list - even if it were referenced, am not sure it should be included:

Notable residents
Well-known people who have lived in Barnes include:

 * Chris Patten, the last UK Governor of Hong Kong, who was present along with the Prince of Wales at the handover to the People's Republic of China in 1997 is officially Baron Patten of Barnes, having chosen his place of residence as the basis for his title. He is currently the patron of the Tory Reform Group and Chancellor of Newcastle University and Oxford University.
 * James King, political activist
 * Henry Fielding, writer
 * Gustav Holst, composer
 * Tim Henman, tennis player
 * Brian May, member of rock group Queen
 * Alistair McGowan, comedian
 * Lynn Redgrave and John Clark, actors
 * Tim Rice, lyricist
 * Anneka Rice, broadcaster
 * Kurt Schwitters, artist
 * Ray Stubbs, broadcaster
 * Dame Ninette de Valois, founder of the Royal Ballet
 * David Harsent, poet
 * Roger McGough, poet
 * Marcel Desailly, sportsman
 * Simon Le Bon, member of pop group Duran Duran
 * Basil Moss, actor
 * Aled Jones, singer
 * Jon Pertwee, actor
 * Jan Pienkowski, artist, illustrator, and children's author
 * Sheherazade Goldsmith, author and environmentalist
 * Zac Goldsmith, environmentalist
 * Robert Pattinson, actor, musician
 * Ralph McTell, songwriter and singer
 * Pete Tong, radio 1 disc jockey

Feedback? --Technopat (talk) 21:26, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Noteable (sic) residents
--Technopat (talk) 18:45, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Michael Ball

Political representation
Is the inclusion of Zac Goldsmith's candidature justified? It's hard to see what is notable about this: he is not a politician of note, not is the parliamentary seat of any particular electoral significance, for example as a key marginal. It smacks slightly of the possibility that someone has added it with the aim of giving publicity to or promoting Mr Goldsmith's candidature.

MJCHA (talk) 08:20, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Agreed, it is not justified. Goldsmith is of no relevance to Barnes per se, and of marginal relevance to the wider constituency since he has not run for election. But I've restored Baron Patten of Barnes to the "political representation" section since he is the local peer, and therefore has a stronger connection to the place than simply living there as do the other "famous residents".

01:04 8 February 2009 (GMT) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.65.113.237 (talk)

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title: Talk:Barnes, London


text:
Talk:Barnsbury

Untitled
Colin Roberts does not seem to be very notable, does anyone have any evidence to the contrary? Tarquin Binary 16:02, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

title: Talk:Barnsbury


text:
Talk:Battersea

Location of Battersea Park
The Park is not in Central London. See this article (including the map), which excludes LB Wandsworth from Central London. Also see this article, which describes the borough where the park is as being in SW London. A P Monblat (talk) 03:22, 29 December 2014 (UTC)

Removal of infobox image - File:Vauxhall - Nine Elms - Battersea - Pimlico at night.jpg
I have removed File:Vauxhall - Nine Elms - Battersea - Pimlico at night.jpg from the infobox. It's a lovely image, really well done. But it is not representative or evocative of Battersea, with perhaps the exception of the power station. It is mainly of the Thames at Vauxhall, and the shorelines of Vauxhall, Nine Elms and Pimlico ... Vauxhall's St. George's Wharf Tower and its Thames Clippers pier ... with a tiny bit of the periphery of Battersea in the distance. It is in my view not an appropiate lead image for Battersea.

Right now I don't have a candidate for replacement. Despite that I have removed it because its use is spreading to other language wikipedias. I'd like to avoid the situation that tout le monde is led to believe that this image is illustrative of Battersea, rather than of an variety of London settlement shorelines. --Tagishsimon (talk) 11:32, 16 June 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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Bad map
When I clicked on the map, I got an unlabeled may of the London area with no pointer to Battersea, and no labels at all. So where is Battersea exactly? Someone who knows, please fix.

MarkinBoston (talk) 22:16, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

 * Looks like they have fixed it. Cherie Lyon (talk) 12:12, 23 July 2023 (UTC)

Contemporary Culture
Battersea is mentioned in a number of The Chronicles of St. Mary's, a humorous fictional series by Jodi Taylor. It is featured in a short story, The Battersea Brigades, which can be found in the collection, Long Story Short, by the same author. 2601:247:C800:AF30:9C54:52E8:D711:7EE9 (talk) 11:56, 23 July 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Battersea


text:
Talk:Bayswater

Surely Bayswater is more cosmopolitan than most parts of London (and I've lived in a few) - kaleidoscope of nationalities is pretty rare. Gerry Lynch 14:46, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

Why is Bayswater described as a "built-up district"? What does built-up mean?

 * I've lived in Bayswater for a number of years - like other parts of inner london, it has virtually no single-story buildings, in fact, the average building height would probably be 3-4 stories. mgream 18:43, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Map Needs Help
The way the map is set up does not work. When you fetch the larger version, Bayswater disappears. Why have a map that explicitly excludes the article's subject location? Nickrz (talk) 14:12, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

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Changes to description of immigrant communities
The recent addition, by a series of related IPs, of an excessively large list of nationalities was reverted by here:. I support that revert. Subsequently, an IP in the same range has repeatedly removed the original shorter list, which was reverted by and me. The IP editor is now claiming a lack of sources, but it appears to me that the removal is a reaction to the rejection of their additions to make a point, which may be considered disruptive, see WP:POINT. I've now reinstated the original list, and added a "citation needed" tag, as there doesn't seem to be reasonable justification to remove it altogether at this time. --IamNotU (talk) 13:28, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
 * The IP editor was adding specific ethnicities (mainly Norwegian) to a series of articles including this one, and when the edits were reverted as unsourced, removed other ethnicities in what appeared to be a kind of "tit for tat". Jayjg (talk) 13:12, 19 August 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Bayswater


text:
Talk:Becontree

What about Wythenshawe, Manchester, England. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:CB05:1D9:5600:7C51:5C8D:856C:B395 (talk) 19:18, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

Cudham
Cudham and Pratts Bottom are nowhere near Becontree, being on the South East extreme of Greater London, whereas Becontree is to the North East of Greater London. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 212.137.34.25 (talk • contribs).

Size
One part of the article says the B Estate is the largest public housing development in the world and another the largest council housing development in Europe (from which we can infer there is one bigger o/s Europe). If this is correct it is confusing and should be explained. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.7.53.2 (talk) 21:12, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

Becontree in Ilford
Is any of the estate still in Ilford/Redbridge? Looking here a new ward of Becontree was created in 1994 to include land transferred from Redbridge to Barking and Dagenham. This corresponds to "north of Longbridge Road, to the south of Mayfield Road, and to the west of Goodmayes Park. It includes Becontree Avenue, Gainsborough Road, Butler Road, Campden Crescent, Lindsey Road and related development". Does that leave any part of the Becontree estate in Redbridge? MRSC (talk) 08:25, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Answering my own question using and a current map. This transfer pretty much exactly corresponds to the boundary of the estate. MRSC (talk) 15:26, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

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Scope
Some of the sections of / statements in this article seem to be about the London Borough of Barking & Dagenham, or its council, rather than about the estate in particular.

For instance, the schools. I don't know how the author has decided which schools etc serve the estate and s/he has not limited him/herself to schools that are physically within the estate's boundary, so I suspect this item in fact refers to the borough as a whole.

Alf Ramsey
The W/P article on Ramsey says he was born in a "quiet Essex village#, which it names as Dagenham. He was born in 1920, before building of the Becontree Estate began, so I don't see why he is classed as a resident of the estate. 82.46.163.160 (talk) 16:12, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Becontree


text:
Talk:Beckenham

A poor effort!
I really cannot believe that this is the best that can be done for Beckenham! Was the river named after the town - or does it just mean stream? Following a rapid "history", which isn't even given a heading, it is simply a series of lists which give little or no feel for the place itself. Taking each paragraph:
 * Nearest places: I never quite see the reason for this. With such a built-up area, it is simply not much help. In addition, some of those listed here give no idea just how near they are. Catford is one: yet Bellingham, which is actually nearer, is not included. Surely some thought must be taken to see that the nearness of a place reflects the ease of access to it. It is possible that the most important thing is that it is almost completely part of "greater" Bromley, and the other places are immaterial.
 * Nearest railway stations: Beckenham Junction is located near the town centre: OK. Radially, the next stations are: New Beckenham, Kent House, Clock House, Shortlands, and Ravensbourne. Beckenham Hill and Birkbeck are beyond; why not Elmers End and Eden Park? This is not using logic, just a quick look at the map; again, for what purpose?
 * Beckenham today: Wow! three sports clubs and a speakers club! There isn't even any text to suggest there might be a little more to say about the town.
 * Notable people: OK, although perhaps too jumbled up - historical, pop, etc etc
 * References in pop culture: surely there must be some references in other genre? literature? Daniel Defoe & William Cobbett both wrote about it.
 * Notable places: OK, so some of these have their own article, but surely those that do not could be included in this article? Even the entries here could have had an explanatory note beside each.

Altogether, a thoroughly unsatisfactory experience. I wish I had time to do more, but I don't know enough about Beckenham - and this article tells me nothing more!! Peter Shearan 19:39, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

19:43, 27 April 2015 (UTC)5.68.59.87 (talk)§§5.68.59.87 (talk) 19:43, 27 April 2015 (UTC) ==Notable people== I have put together a new article listing all those noted in the "What links here" side reference. The note here simply refers to some of them: there were over sixty. Three names have been omitted from those originally shown: the article about each one shows no connection with Beckenham. Perhaps someone could check - have they a connection?: If they have, then the individual articles should be amended too Peter Shearan (talk) 07:24, 1 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Nigel Benn
 * Sir Robin Knox-Johnston The first person to sail solo non-stop around the world lived in Beckenham from 1947 until 1960
 * Buster Mottram

Rewrite
I have now completed this as far as I can: I only have a little personal knowledge of the town. I hope others can now tackle additional information, using the outline I have now set down. Peter Shearan (talk) 14:48, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

External links modified
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Sentence, grammar and fact
The lead sentence was changed again. It is the same alteration constantly made to many articles. My comment on reversal is here, not in the edit tag. - Undid revision 1122948130 by Sirfurboy (talk)This isn't about whether the HC are extant entities, it is simply about grammar and the level of understanding of readers. The original statement you have changed is factually correct, whether HC currently exist or not is not relevant, so there is no need to change it. Remember, this is an encyclopedia not a tabloid - we assume a certain level of intelligence of the average reader. The issue should not be about present or past but whether the place's connection to the historic county is strong enough to warrant inclusion at the start of the lead. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 21:12, 20 November 2022 (UTC)

 * There was a typo in that edit. Is that the grammar issue? Usually one simply corrects the typo rather than reverting the edit. I shall attempt a new formulation, but note we need to summarise what the page actually says, which is that it was in Kent until 1965 when it became a London Borough. Leads should summarise the main, not contradict it. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 21:21, 20 November 2022 (UTC)
 * This is what I mean: it does not contradict anything. The problem is certain editors misunderstand English and also cannot grasp that a place can be defined as being in more than one area. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 21:43, 20 November 2022 (UTC)
 * As we have discussed elsewhere, it is clear that guidelines and editor consensus is that in wikivoice we do not assert the minority view that historical counties still exist within their old borders. The act of Beckenham coming under the ceremonial county and administrative control of Greater London means it is no longer in the county of Kent. I understand that you disagree, but also that you are aware of the guideline. If you would like to open an RFC on the guideline, we can discuss the issue there, but as long as the guideline remains, it is correct that pages written in wikivoice do say that the place was in one county and is now in the other. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 21:53, 20 November 2022 (UTC)

RfC
See here Roger 8 Roger (talk) 07:11, 23 November 2022 (UTC)

improvements?
Still minimal even though I've edited some aspects. Our more comprehensive history of beckenham runs to about 500 pages of pdf doc so not suitable for repeating here but now in webpage format on www.beckenhamplaceparkfriends.org.uk history links Which is still far from being a complete account. various local historians have produced books with collections of photographs etc etc. I'll add some more edits soon. (jan 2023) -- unsigned comment left by Novafact 14:30, 25 January 2023 (UTC)
 * I am afraid these edits are problematic, adding unsourced content and a few other issues. I don't want to revert the lot, as you clearly put effort into it, so will add some templates and fix a couple of issues. If we cannot find reliable sources for the material, however, then it will have to go (and another editor may revert it at any point). Also, please don't mark edits as minor when adding significant content. Minor edits are for typos or similar uncontroversial small edits. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 23:28, 25 January 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Beckenham


text:
Talk:Beddington

Queen Elizabeth's Walk
"Queen Elizabeth's Walk is a short wooded trail that dates back to the first Elizabeth. Local legend has it that the Monarch and Sir Walter Raleigh used to stroll together there." Actually, it was the proposed route for the M23 motorway. -- Grand Edgemaster Talk  19:39, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Beddington


text: Talk:Bellingham, London

title: Talk:Bellingham, London


text:
Talk:Bermondsey

Untitled
The following is coming from Talk:Bermondsey: I have written a timeline of the history of Bermondsey: http://www.bermondseyhistory.com/ Is it appropriate to like to this work here? -- User:Robert Brook --- Absolutely. But I've taken the liberty of entering a stub just in case someone marks the article for deletion on grounds of emptiness. Please feel free to replace it with something more substantial. User:David Parker

Millwall "has never been located in Bermondsey" - it is currently in the neighbourhood known as South Bermondsey, adjacent to South Bermondsey train station.

Bold text

Removed for revision
''Bermondsey also gained the first underground tube railway, the Tower Subway of 1869-1870. This was supplanted in 1894 by Tower Bridge, which links the westernmost edge of Bermondsey to the City of London.'' - if Tower Bridge is the western border of Bermondsey the Tower Subway can't be in Bermondsey.

WRONG: The Tower Subway had a hauled cart on a track, which was prone to break down, so was removed and became a pedestrian tunnel; this hardly constitutes a 'tube railway' in the sense understood even at that time. In the period between 1870 and 1894 there was no local authority called 'Bermondsey' other than the 'civil parish' created under the 1855 Metropolis Management Act. The area between St Saviour's / Dockhead was a parish 'union' ('District Board of Works') between the Southwark parishes of St Olave's, St John-Horsleydown and St Thomas. In 1899 the parishes of Southwark St Olave and St Thomas were combined as a civil Parish. Both were known as 'St Olave's'. Sortly after these were placed in the Metro Boro of Bermondsey, which explains why some believe they have always been in something called 'Bermondsey' today. An example; the 1571 Seal of the St Olave grammar school is inscribed "The Seal of the Free School of the Parishioners of St Olave's Southwark, Found by Q Elz" 79.75.2.246 (talk) 13:28, 22 April 2008 (UTC) (Tony S)

WRONG; Definitions of 'Bermondsey' are anachronistic, and Tower Bridge has never been a boundary of anything. The site of the Tower Subway, when used as a passenger system, wasn't in the 'Metropolitan Borough of Bermondsey', but St Olave's, as that only existed from 1900 to 1964, as UTC says below. 79.75.2.246 (talk) 13:28, 22 April 2008 (UTC) (Tony S)

 * The Met Boro went further west than Tower Bridge to about as far as Weston Street. There are still a few street signs that have survived since 1965 indicating this. MRSC 20:10, 18 October 2005 (UTC)

YES: Met Boro boundary went along just behind the eastern side of Borough High Street. 79.75.2.246 (talk) 13:28, 22 April 2008 (UTC)(Tony S)

 * Despite the confusion as to the 'boundaries' of Bermondsey, I think it would be best to include Tower Subway and Hay's Wharf. --Robert 10:03, 19 October 2005 (UTC)

THE DISCUSSION is confused because of lack of definition of 'Bermondsey' within a specified period. An example is the use of 'Tooley Street', which is part of old Southwark and was in the Metro Boro of Bermondsey for only the first part of the twentieth century. The contribution below is not about anywhere recognisable as the place under discussion at all. 79.75.2.246 (talk) 13:28, 22 April 2008 (UTC) (Tony S)

Lets see if i can help clarify things ,ive lived here in Bermondsey all my life and cannot believe you guys marked it as being unsignificant.It runs from South Bermondsey Stn which is also home to our football team MILLWALL FC...NO1 LIKES US ..WE DONT CARE!...THE LIONS FROM THE DEN,2 mins further up the OLD KENT RD famous the world over for featuring as the cheapest RD ...on the Monopoly board.Then we stretch right up to London Bridge,Southwark Cathedral,Borough Market,The Globe Theatre,The Tate Modern Art Gallery,Tooley Street,Wine Cellars,Britain At War Exhibition,The London Dungeons,Open-Top Buses,Thames River Cruise,HMS.Belfast,Tower Bridge and Tower of London,The Engine Rooms,Bermondsey Sq antique market,Shad Thames where Oliver Twist was filmed,Restaurants,Tavernas,Pubs,Were on the route of the annual London Marathon,Guys Hospital Old Operating Theatre,Guys teaching hospital...i could go on selling Bermondsey to you for hours but i think ive said enough to put us on the map where we rightfully belong dont you...i rest my case!

WRONG IN ALL ASSERTIONS: 'The New Den', the ground of Millwall FC, is in the London Borough of Lewisham and previously the Metropolitan Borough of Deptford. Old Kent Road was in Camberwell parish and its succeeding Metropolitan Borough. I have covered the other places in my comments above or in my edit of the article. 79.75.2.246 (talk) 13:28, 22 April 2008 (UTC) (Tony S)

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Bermondsey, Surrey
Recently it has been asserted that Bermondsey was historically in the county of Kent. A solid foundation for the argument that Bermondsey was in the historical county of Surrey is the Victoria County History's volume 4 of the history of Surrey, in which the parish of Bermondsey is described. Then there are several further reliable sources that I have to hand, which back this up: Among maps, there is the website A Vision of Britain Through Time, which displays the map for Surrey from the HMSO's Boundary Commission Report of 1832, where the location of Bermondsey is clearly within Surrey,, as evidenced by comparison with the location of Bermondsey Abbey on a modern Ordnance Survey map; A Vision of Britain Through Time also quotes from John Bartholomew's 1887 Gazetteer of the British Isles as follows: "Bermondsey, par. and ry. sta., Southwark bor., E. Surrey, forming a SE. suburb of London, 627 ac., pop. 86,652 ; extensive wool stores, tanneries, and wharves."
 * Blair, J., "Frithuwold's kingdom and the origins of Surrey", in Bassett, S. (ed.), The Origins of Anglo-Saxon Kingdoms, Leicester University Press, 1989, pp. 97–107, in which Bermondsey is taken to be part of Surrey in the early 8th century (p. 106). Incidentally, this source has been cited in the article for many years now.
 * Domesday Book of 1086 lists Bermondsey as part of Surrey – see for example Williams, A. & Martin, G.H. (eds.), Domesday Book A Complete Translation, Penguin, 1992, pp. 72 & 80. Domesday Book is strictly a primary source, but it is unimpeachable here.
 * Ekwall, E., The Concise Oxford Dictionary of English Place-Names (4th edn.), Oxford University Press, 1960, p. 39, has Bermondsey in Surrey.
 * Stenton, F.M., Anglo-Saxon England (3rd edn.), Oxford University Press, 1971, p. 160, puts Bermondsey in Surrey, again in an 8th-century context.
 * Youngs, F.A. Jr, Guide to the Local Administrative Units of England Volume I: Southern England, Royal Historical Society, 1979, p. 473, states that Bermondsey was part of Surrey until it was transferred to London in 1889.

Southwark Council's website has a page on researching family history, from which I quote: "The family history society for the London Borough of Southwark is the East Surrey Family History Society. There may be overlapping interest with neighbouring areas covered by the West Surrey and North-West Kent Family History Societies." I hope that helps. Nortonius (talk) 10:27, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * That seems exhaustive. TheGreaterLondonEditor argued on their talk page that Google Maps, Bing Maps and the Southwark Council support his claim that Bermondsey is in the historical county of Kent, but I don't see that they do. Google Maps, for example, doesn't know the borders of the historical counties and places Bermondsey in Greater London, which of course is correct but doesn't say anything about the historical county either way. The Southwark Council mentions Old Kent Road, but doesn't say anything about county Kent, and I'd expect that road used to lead to Kent and wasn't within Kent. Huon (talk) 14:56, 14 January 2018 (UTC)

 * Thanks, yes I saw TheGreaterLondonEditor talking about online maps that don't show historical county boundaries; and mentioning Southwark Council, which is why I included a page from their website among sources that say, in this case implicitly, that Bermondsey was in Surrey. And, exactly – just as I was driving a few minutes ago along Lewes Road, which is not in Lewes but in Brighton, and leads to Lewes. Similarly, if I wanted to leave Brighton, and therefore Sussex, for London, I would start by driving along the London Road, in Brighton. The same editor claims to know that Bermondsey was in Kent because they're from London; I was born in London and lived there for 33 years but that has nothing to do with it, obviously. Cheers. Nortonius (talk) 16:22, 14 January 2018 (UTC)

Bermondsey,Kent
I do know you want to win this dispute but clearly you are accessing fake websites claiming to be real, when I followed the link my security program warned me about the page's security rating and programming. TheGreaterLondonEditor (talk) 17:51, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

 * I just double-checked all the external links in Nortonius' post above, and none gave me any warnings. What's the URL of the page you had a problem with?
 * I'll add that I don't want to "win this dispute" but to have an accurate Wikipedia article. If you can provide reliable sources that state Bermondsey is in Kent, I'll gladly consider them just as I considered those presented by Nortonius. For example, I did try to follow up your comment that "google maps, bing maps and southwark council" confirm it's in Kent but didn't succeed. Some more precision, such as links to the specific web pages that say Bermondsey is in Kent, would help. Huon (talk) 19:02, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

 * Agreed, about not wanting to "win" – the thing is always to present a neutral point of view. If a reliable source or sources were found to support Bermondsey having been in Kent, the article would have to reflect that conflict in a balanced way too. Wikipedia depends entirely on reliable sources. For my part, I have found none that support Kent. Nortonius (talk) 20:40, 15 January 2018 (UTC)
 * By the way, I notice that HMSO's 1832 boundary map for Kent shows that county's nearest approach to Bermondsey was a little west of Greenwich, Deptford and Lewisham, which settlements are shown. In this regard, it is probably worth noting that the site of Surrey Commercial Docks is about a mile east of Bermondsey. Also there is mention of Bermondsey in Jones, B., Kent Hundred Rolls, Kent Archaeological Society, 2007,, which gives a transcript and translation of the Hundred Roll for Kent of 1274–75 (search the page for Bermondsey): according to the jurors the abbot of Bermondsey had "the assize of bread and ale and the gallows and the market in the vill of Charlton from the time of the lord King Henry, the present king’s father [i.e. King Henry III, the "present king" being Edward I ] and they do not know by what warrant." Charlton was formerly in Kent, but, according to the Annales Monasterii de Bermundeseia, edited by H.R. Luard in 1866, Bermondsey Abbey was given the manor of Charlton by Bishop Robert Bloet of Lincoln in 1093, and Henry III granted the abbey a Monday market and an annual fair at Charlton in 1268 (pp. 428 & 463–4). Those would be the warrants of which the jurors were ignorant. But of course they did not make Charlton part of Surrey, or Bermondsey part of Kent. They merely meant that Bermondsey Abbey had property and rights in Kent, which was quite normal. According to volume 2 of the Victoria County History for Surrey, in 1291 the abbey owned land, rents and rights in the dioceses of Rochester, London, Lincoln, Chichester, Salisbury, Bath and Wells, Winchester, York, Norwich and Worcester. The contemporary Hundred Roll for Surrey does not appear to have survived. Nortonius (talk) 00:15, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

 * I even asked some of the locals and they said Bermondsey is in kent TheGreaterLondonEditor (talk) 16:50, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

 * Please try posting less because my email account inbox is getting full of your disagreements and I do not have enough time to read them TheGreaterLondonEditor (talk) 16:53, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

 * And plus I hate that so please stop also by the way I tapped/clicked on the link so you could have gotten on a fake site TheGreaterLondonEditor (talk) 16:55, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

 * I too have much more interesting things to do than to keep digging up reliable sources on the historical county to which Bermondsey belonged. You can stop those emails from Wikipedia by going to your preferences. Huon asked you previously to clarify which websites appear unsafe to you, but you haven't replied; and, unfortunately, "the locals" do not consitute a reliable source. Since you don't seem to trust any of the sources that have been offered, why not go to a local library and ask a member of staff to help you answer the question, "Was Bermondsey in Kent or Surrey?" – if you find anything useful in a reliable source you could then share the details with us here. Nortonius (talk) 17:01, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

bermondsey,kent
Please do not send me anything or talk about me from 01/02/2018 to the date of 16/02/2018 during that time I will not be able to reply to your comments and enquires because I will be busy

TheGreaterLondonEditor TheGreaterLondonEditor (talk) 18:42, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

title: Talk:Bermondsey


text:
Talk:Bethnal Green

Multiple issues - this article requires a lot of work
This article needs a lot of work, especially in light of the recent disruptive editing (see Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_London).

 * There is a serious lack of inline citations with some entire sections either completley or mostly unreferenced.

 * The division of the article into subheadings is very strange, particularly the "Contemporary" section which should probably be reworked completely.

 * Significant parts of the article are just listing of facts and trivia which are neither relevant to, nor well integrated into, the wider article.

 * The article goes into excessive detail on some aspects and is low on content in other important ways.

 * The article includes reference to a number of locations which are not actually in Bethnal Green.

 * There are many paragraphs which are very clearly not relevant to the section they are in. These should either be moved to another section or removed, as appropriate.

I will work on this going forward but any help would be appreciated. TheSLEEVEmonkey (talk) 16:31, 28 August 2019 (UTC)

 * Note also that wherever the article history shows a paragraph being deleted with no edit summary by a sockpuppet/IP of User:Hopeful2014, it's probably been moved to another article. In the case of Bethnal Green, content has been moved out to Shoreditch, Spitalfields or Globe Town, London whenever Hopeful2014 thought they knew best, possibly without any regard as to whether the original article should still mention the landmarks in question.
 * It's more visible when seen as a history of the user's edits for a given day, eg --Lord Belbury (talk) 17:18, 28 August 2019 (UTC)

 * Am on mobile so it is a pain to track the history. Not sure if the above comments were acted upon but the article still seems to be disorganised, eg: the comment about Mendoza & another boxer is out of place in the Growth section. I am currently reading The Blackest Streets by Sarah Wise and am surprised that I cannot spot it being used here - ISBN 978-1-844-13331-4 - Sitush (talk) 20:25, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 September 2019
Section: Community, paragraph 4:

The Nomadic Community Gardens, once an area fenced off and overgrown, is now a occupied by a temporary project or "meanwhile use" run by a private limited company[122] on behalf of the property developer Londonewcastle, which leases the site to the garden operator for a peppercorn rent and provided start-up funding[123]. The space has been filled with temporary buildings and installations made up of found materials, street art, sculpture and allotments.[124] Londonewcastle gained planning consent for a development of "affordable housing, townhouses and apartments"[125] on the site in November 2015[126]. Construction on the Fleet Street Hill Project was intended to commence in 2016[123] but, as of June 2019, no work has begun on the site.

I would like to add the following:

In the summer of 2019 Nomadic Community Gardens ltd made an application for a premises license to sell alcohol from the Fleet Street Hill site. The application was unanimously refused by the Tower Hamlets Council Licensing Sub Committee on 10 September 2109 at a public meeting. (http://democracy.towerhamlets.gov.uk/documents/g10723/Decisions%2010th-Sep-2019%2014.30%20Licensing%20Sub%20Committee.pdf?T=2). In the pack of evidence made public before the committee meeting, a letter sent by Tower Hamlets licensing officers dated 25 June 2019 warned Nomadic Community Gardens not to hold the unlicensed music events it had previously advertised, as the authority would not tolerate the use of a licensing loophole that allows community organisations to hold unlicensed music events. The Licensing Officer found that as Nomadic Community Gardens is operated by a Limited Company with two directors, it is therefore a private business, not a community organisation. (http://democracy.towerhamlets.gov.uk/documents/g10723/Public%20reports%20pack%2010th-Sep-2019%2014.30%20Licensing%20Sub%20Committee.pdf?T=10 Page 254). Within the same pack of evidence a representation from Tower Hamlets Council's Environmental Health Technical Officer concluded that the sub-committee should not support the license application because of "great likelihood of disturbance to residential premises if the licence was granted" (http://democracy.towerhamlets.gov.uk/documents/g10723/Public%20reports%20pack%2010th-Sep-2019%2014.30%20Licensing%20Sub%20Committee.pdf?T=10 Page 264) Spitalfieldtown (talk) 20:01, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: Probably too much about Nomadic Community Gardens there, also only from primary sources; without secondary sources (some newspaper coverage may be suitable), it's unlikely to be significant enough to be included. Peter James (talk) 15:57, 23 September 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Bethnal Green