text:
Talk:Acanthasitta

Acanthasitta
I think this is a not-common misspelling of Acanthisitta. DCDuring TALK 23:45, 4 July 2013 (UTC)
 * It's certainly disconcerting in the etymology of Acanthisittidae. — Pingkudimmi 13:20, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

I agree that it may be a misspelling but it clearly meets the rules of Attestation, aren't you glad it wasn't speedied. Speednat (talk) 18:29, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Delete; yields no hits at all. This could go to RFV, but I actually think it could as well have been speedied, so let us vote on deletion here and be done with it. --Dan Polansky (talk) 09:46, 7 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep; With very little time invested I found three distinct hits.
 * http://newzealandecology.org/nzje/free_issues/NZJEcol34_1_28.pdf
 * http://www.boprc.govt.nz/media/33700/Wildland-091118-TaurangaEcolDistPhase1.pdf
 * http://www.sahs.uk.net/BoTNHAS%20Trans%20Vol%20V,%20Part%20II.pdf
 * The citations clearly fail to meet the "durably archived" test. In any event it is a not very common misspelling. A misspelling that is this close to the correct spelling will cause the correct spelling to be suggested to the user who types the wrong spelling in the search box. DCDuring TALK 17:59, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
 * There are four durably archived quotes coming up in a gscholar search (you need to download the large full pdfs to see some of them), but as these are all referring to Acanthasitta chloris it is a slam dunk they are all a misspelling of Acanthisitta chloris. Actually, the files were downloading while I was typing this and one of the four I can now see is only a google scanno. And another one uses the correct spelling elsewhere in the document.  Spinning Spark  00:54, 30 April 2014 (UTC)

Last call for comments before I close this as no consensus. bd2412 T 17:00, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
 * The standard of evidence presented in defense of this spelling is shamefully low. Google Scholar's count of 4 for this spelling compares to 481 for the Acanthisitta. Not only is the absolute number of hits of the erroneous spelling low, but the relative number would seem to be below 1%. Such a low threshold would vastly increase the number of misspellings that we keep. Also I cannot find instances of the erroneous spelling at Google Books. Spinningspark also acknowledge that only two of the hits he advanced would count for RfV. DCDuring TALK 18:10, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Delete because of that. IMO, a "common" misspelling should be something like miniscule. We already have a spell-check facility. Equinox ◑ 18:27, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

 * Delete, nowhere near a common misspelling. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 18:55, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 19:14, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

RFV discussion: April–June 2014
This is now at RFD, but maybe it is not even attested. Any attesting quotations? Consider placing those found at Citations:Acanthasitta, since that page is kep even when the entry fails RFV. Search:. --Dan Polansky (talk) 18:16, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
 * RFV failed: no quotations anywhere, even not in Citations:Acanthasitta. (Already deleted via RFD.) --Dan Polansky (talk) 18:08, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Acanthasitta


text:
cordier

Etymology
From "corde" + "-er".

Noun

 * 1) tailpiece
 * 2) ropemaker

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: cordier


text: upraktiske

title: upraktiske


text: schmexy

title: schmexy


text:
trimodally

Adverb

 * 1) In a trimodal manner.

title: trimodally


text: timidaj

title: timidaj


text: timidan

title: timidan


text: timidajn

title: timidajn


text:
dysbiotic

Adjective

 * 1) Relating to dysbiosis.

title: dysbiotic


text: dysbioses

title: dysbioses


text:
astromathematical

Adjective

 * 1) Relating to astromathematics.

title: astromathematical


text:
økonomisere

Etymology
From.

Verb

 * 1) to economise (UK), or economize

title: økonomisere


text: økonomiser

title: økonomiser


text:
cwrs

Etymology
Borrowed from, itself borrowed from , , from.

Noun

 * 1) course; manner of life; pursuit, chase; trouble
 * 2) space, period, while; spell, fit; considerable quantity
 * 3)  course of instruction, series of lessons or lectures, etc.
 * 4) order, rule
 * 5) a course in a meal, a dish
 * 6) lode; course ; layer

title: cwrs


text: gwrs

title: gwrs


text: chwrs

title: chwrs


text: nghwrs

title: nghwrs


text: økonomiserer

title: økonomiserer


text: økonomiserte

title: økonomiserte


text:
cyrsiau

Etymology
From.

title: cyrsiau


text: gyrsiau

title: gyrsiau


text: nghyrsiau

title: nghyrsiau


text: chyrsiau

title: chyrsiau


text:
Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/þurstuz

Etymology
From. Exact cognate to 🇨🇬.

Noun

 * 1) dryness, thirst

title: Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/þurstuz


text: økonomisert

title: økonomisert


text:
hydrefau

Etymology
From.

title: hydrefau


text:
nudifidian

Noun

 * 1)  One who relies on faith alone without works for salvation.

title: nudifidian


text:
wrth gwrs

Adverb

 * 1) of course

title: wrth gwrs


text:
aasiankultakutoja

Noun

 * 1) Asian golden weaver,

title: aasiankultakutoja


text:
Thread:User talk:CodeCat/Sources

Hi, I was wondering what were the sources (any particular book or site) for the etymology of certain English words? Notably, for tracing "husk" to PIE *kawəs- / kawes- via Proto-Germanic *husōn, *hausaz. A link to the site or the impressum of a book would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

title: Thread:User talk:CodeCat/Sources


text:
aasianvihervarpunen

Noun

 * 1) yellow-breasted greenfinch

title: aasianvihervarpunen


text:
պատուանդան

Etymology
Certainly an borrowing, but the details are unclear.

Ačaṙyan remarks that 🇨🇬 fits in form but not meaning. J̌ahukyan is more positive, adducing also 🇨🇬,. Compare also Pazend 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬. All of these ultimately go back to 🇨🇬 +.

Noun

 * 1) footrest, footstool

title: պատուանդան


text: 欢腾

title: 欢腾


text:
歡騰

Verb

 * 1) to rejoice; to exult; to jubilate
 * (Source: )
 * (Source: )

title: 歡騰


text:
glorifisere

Etymology
From.

Verb

 * 1) to glorify

title: glorifisere


text: glorifiser

title: glorifiser


text: glorifiserer

title: glorifiserer


text: glorifiserte

title: glorifiserte


text: glorifisert

title: glorifisert


text:
Thread:User talk:CodeCat/Sources/reply

I don't know what the sources are. Many of them don't have sources.

title: Thread:User talk:CodeCat/Sources/reply


text:
lengaç

Etymology
Ultimately from, from. Judging by the ending, borrowed through either Occitan (possibly via Italian) or French.

Noun

 * 1) language

title: lengaç


text:
kremere

Verb

 * 1) to cremate

Etymology
From.

Verb

 * 1) to cremate

title: kremere


text: kremer

title: kremer


text: kremerer

title: kremerer


text: kremerte

title: kremerte


text: kremert

title: kremert


text:
Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/hurdiz

Etymology
From Pre-Germanic, from. Cognate with 🇨🇬.

Noun

 * 1) wickerwork door or frame, hurdle

title: Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/hurdiz


text:
terrorisere

Etymology
From.

Verb

 * 1) to terrorise (UK), or terrorize

title: terrorisere


text:
Thread:User talk:CodeCat/Sources/reply (2)

Figured as much. Thanks anyway.


text: terroriserer

title: terroriserer


text: terroriserte

title: terroriserte


text:
pigeonplum

Noun

 * 1) The plant.

title: pigeonplum


text:
doveplum

Noun

 * 1) The plant.

title: doveplum


text: terrorisert

title: terrorisert


text: pigeonplums

title: pigeonplums


text: seagrape

title: seagrape


text: seagrapes

title: seagrapes


text:
leg before

Adverb

 * 1)  Leg before wicket.

title: leg before


text: aasianvuoripeippo

title: aasianvuoripeippo


text:
aasianmetsäpyy

Noun

 * 1) hill partridge bird of the genus

title: aasianmetsäpyy


text: reorganisational

title: reorganisational


text:
intersensory

Adjective

 * 1) Between senses means of perception.

title: intersensory


text:
intersensorial

Adjective

 * 1) Between senses (means of perception).

title: intersensorial


text:
truthseeker

Noun

 * 1) One who goes in quest of the truth.

Translations

 * Swedish:

title: truthseeker


text: truthseekers

title: truthseekers


text: pseudosynaesthesia

title: pseudosynaesthesia


text:
pseudosynesthesia

Noun

 * 1) A condition resembling synesthesia that is not true synesthesia.

title: pseudosynesthesia


text:
improsciuttire

Etymology
From.

Verb

 * 1) to become thin and gaunt

title: improsciuttire


text: outstands

title: outstands


text:
liftless

Adjective

 * 1) Without lifts.
 * a liftless ski slope

title: liftless


text:
wicked pissah

Etymology
A combination of two regionalisms: wicked + pissah.

Adjective

 * 1)  Outstanding; awesome

title: wicked pissah


text: professionshøjskolen

title: professionshøjskolen


text: professionshøjskoler

title: professionshøjskoler


text: professionshøjskolerne

title: professionshøjskolerne


text: professionshøjskoles

title: professionshøjskoles


text: professionshøjskolens

title: professionshøjskolens


text: professionshøjskolers

title: professionshøjskolers


text: professionshøjskolernes

title: professionshøjskolernes


text: tilhør

title: tilhør


text: højskolen

title: højskolen


text: højskoler

title: højskoler


text: højskolerne

title: højskolerne


text: højskoles

title: højskoles


text: højskolens

title: højskolens


text: højskolers

title: højskolers


text: højskolernes

title: højskolernes


text:
Talk:níłtsą́

Classifier and verb stem
This verb appears to have the common classifier and verb stem. In the entry's present state, this verb is presented as having no classifier at all, not even the null classifier, and a verb stem of that includes an unprecedented łtsʼ, consonant cluster as the verb stem's initial consonant.

I'm happy to accept the possibility that this particular verb stem is only ever used with the classifier. However, I don't think that means that the classifier is now part of the verb stem; given what I've read about Navajo verb stems and Athabaskan languages in general, łtsʼ as verb-stem-initial doesn't seem quite right. Deriving from  is reasonable, but  from  seems unlikely: where would the ł come from?

Does anyone have any more information? ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │ Tala við mig 18:15, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

 * Just as some verbs, even in English, semantically can only be transitive, others only intransitive, this sense requires the classifier . There is no -tsą́, only . is made from, which comes from  + . If anyone ever makes an entry for , it will show this.
 * I had planned to enter all of the verb stems that I could think of, but CFI was changed to exclude most terms in languages such as Navajo, so the project has been shelved. —Stephen (Talk) 00:20, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:níłtsą́


text:
Talk:香港語言學學會粵語拼音方案

香港语言学学会粤语拼音方案
Def.: The Linguistic Society of Hong Kong Cantonese Romanization Scheme Remove both Cantonese and Mandarin entries, traditional/simplified. Not a dictionary material. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 03:10, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Supposedly, the term describes more specifically the term Jyutping, except that it doesn't, literally the same as English "The Linguistic Society of Hong Kong Cantonese Romanization Scheme". --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:41, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
 * I've just speedied it. Doesn't look like there will be strong objections. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 00:20, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:香港語言學學會粵語拼音方案


text:
Talk:no vayas

RFD discussion: October 2013–May 2014
Sum of parts. There's a reason the verb and not the whole phrase is wikilinked for negative imperatives in the conjugation template. Chuck Entz (talk) 02:23, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Delete. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:21, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Delete --Diuturno (talk) 18:49, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Deleted.--Jusjih (talk) 05:39, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:no vayas


text:
Talk:魔法の薬草

RFD discussion: May 2014
魔法の薬草 is a simple sum of its parts, comparable to the English phrase "magical herbs". (As a side note, I don't think the English gloss "herbal magic" is appropriate.) Same applies to 魔法の薬, 魔法の大釜, 魔法の釜 and 魔法の霊薬. Whym (talk) 08:28, 15 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Nuke. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 08:29, 15 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:魔法の薬草


text:
Talk:魔法の箒

RFD discussion: May 2014
Simple sum of parts, comparable to the English gloss "magic broomstick". Whym (talk) 03:54, 15 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Delete. Also delete 魔法の帚, 飛行箒, and 飛行帚. — T AKASUGI Shinji (talk) 04:30, 15 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:魔法の箒


text:
Talk:Dauern

RFD discussion: May 2014
Both my dictionary and this site say that Dauer does not have a plural. However, there is also de:Dauern. Can a native speaker please confirm this one way or the other? Spinning Spark  12:10, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
 * I'm a fluent nonnative speaker, and it didn't take me long to find these instances of Dauern:, , . It definitely has a plural, though Duden says the plural belongs only to "Fachsprache" (technical language). I don't know about that, but Dauer has two meanings at de-wikt, (1) duration and (2) permanence. The first sense is countable, but the second may well not be. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 12:23, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
 * I've added one cite of the plural to the main lemma page . —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 12:52, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Ok, withdrawn. I should have included the article when I searched: all I got was a bunch of "dauern" the verb. Spinning Spark  12:57, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that's why I looked for it with an adjective, "längeren Dauern". If you're really withdrawing the RFD, could you take the tag off the top of the entry please? —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 16:25, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
 * done. Spinning Spark  17:34, 17 May 2014 (UTC)

 * RFD withdrawn by the nominator. --Dan Polansky (talk) 10:12, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dauern


text:
Talk:系小

RFD discussion: May 2014

 * See Talk:係小.

title: Talk:系小


text:
Talk:香港语言学学会粤语拼音方案

RFD discussion: May 2014

 * See Talk:香港語言學學會粵語拼音方案.

title: Talk:香港语言学学会粤语拼音方案


text:
Talk:魔法の薬

RFD discussion: May 2014

 * See Talk:魔法の薬草.

title: Talk:魔法の薬


text:
Talk:魔法の大釜

RFD discussion: May 2014

 * See Talk:魔法の薬草.

title: Talk:魔法の大釜


text:
Talk:魔法の釜

RFD discussion: May 2014

 * See Talk:魔法の薬草.

title: Talk:魔法の釜


text:
Talk:魔法の霊薬

RFD discussion: May 2014

 * See Talk:魔法の薬草.

title: Talk:魔法の霊薬


text:
lip wisdom

Noun

 * 1) Wise talk without practice, or unsupported by experience.

title: lip wisdom


text:
Jacob's staff

Noun

 * 1)  A single straight rod or staff, pointed and iron-shod at the bottom, for penetrating the ground, and having a socket joint at the top, used, instead of a tripod, for supporting a compass.
 * , the common mullein.
 * 1) The ocotillo, one of certain desert shrubs of southwestern United States and Mexico having slender naked spiny branches that after the rainy season put forth foliage and clusters of red flowers.
 * 1) The ocotillo, one of certain desert shrubs of southwestern United States and Mexico having slender naked spiny branches that after the rainy season put forth foliage and clusters of red flowers.

title: Jacob's staff


text:
Talk:button stitcher

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014
Derogatory term for lesbian. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 02:17, 13 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Seems like a protologism. The only reference I could find online was an Urban Dictionary entry created last year. The definition given on UD is more specific than the one given in our entry. -Cloudcuckoolander (talk) 19:29, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

 * Failed RFV. Equinox ◑ 18:29, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:button stitcher


text:
Talk:double tucker

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014
Another derogatory term for lesbian. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 02:20, 13 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Same with "button stitcher" above: the only reference I could find was an Urban Dictionary entry created last year (and by the same UD user who created the UD entry for "button stitcher"). -Cloudcuckoolander (talk) 19:34, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

 * Failed RFV. Equinox ◑ 18:29, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:double tucker


text:
Talk:塤

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014
Rfv-sense for "simplified variant of 壎" definition; the 塤 character is already a traditional character for its primary definition and this instance isn't cited or in the Unihan database. Bumm13 (talk) 10:19, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

 * That's right. The simplified version of 塤 is 埙 and 壎 is both traditional and simplified. It's not the right way to display simplified/traditional equivalents, anyway. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 10:59, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

 * RFV failed on the sense: no quotations provided. --Dan Polansky (talk) 08:55, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:塤


text:
Talk:sitcom

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014
Rfv-sense 2: "an episode of such a program". I've never heard it used this way. --WikiTiki89 04:59, 14 December 2013 (UTC)

situation comedy replicates the mistake (if it is one). 63.81.2.130 06:14, 14 December 2013 (UTC)

 * I suppose if someone says ‘I watched a sitcom last night’, you could argue they don't mean they're watching an entire series, just one episode. But this is the usual mania for over-classification, it should be merged with the main sense (in my opinion). Ƿidsiþ 20:51, 14 December 2013 (UTC)
 * If you watched two episodes of one sitcom last night, you wouldn't say "I watched two sitcoms last night." On the other hand if you watched one episode each of two different sitcoms, you probably would say exactly that. --WikiTiki89 21:26, 14 December 2013 (UTC)

situation comedy
As 63.81.2.130 kindly pointed out. --WikiTiki89 03:01, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

 * Both RFV-failed. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 04:03, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Striking out the headings. --Dan Polansky (talk) 08:58, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:sitcom


text:
Talk:Xingjiangi

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014
Appears not to exist in English. With the sole exception of this all Google hits are not English. This, that and the other (talk) 02:19, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

 * RFV failed. Equinox ◑ 19:39, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Xingjiangi


text:
Talk:fibienulo

RFV discussion: January–May 2014
Esperanto for slumlord. Nothing on Google Books, Usenet, or Tekstaro. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 03:16, 3 January 2014 (UTC)

RFV failed. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 19:42, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:fibienulo


text:
Talk:hanyunulo

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014
Ido for "male chick". —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 01:53, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

Failed. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 18:33, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:hanyunulo


text:
Talk:hanyunino

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014
Ido for "female chick". —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 01:54, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

RFV failed. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 18:34, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:hanyunino


text:
Talk:ekspluatantaĉo

RFV discussion: January–May 2014
Esperanto. This is a plausible word (although the definition should probably be adjusted if it passes), but I can't find it being used anywhere online, let alone in durably archived sources. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 21:01, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

Mi eksigis ekspluatantaĉo. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 18:49, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:ekspluatantaĉo


text:
Talk:fidomo

RFV discussion: January–May 2014
Esperanto for whorehouse. Again, I can only find a couple of mentions, no uses. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 02:22, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

Quoted multiple bgc mentions on Citations, removed entry without prejudice. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 20:08, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:fidomo


text:
Talk:pugumi

RFV discussion: January–May 2014
Esperanto for "moon" (display buttocks). The only use of this word I can find is not for this sense - it's a translation of the Latin word pedico. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 03:22, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

Moved reference to Citations, removed entry. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 19:39, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:pugumi


text:
Talk:Décortainment

RFV discussion: January–May 2014
Marking this for RFV in case it turns out this word actually exists, but based on a not-so-thorough look through indicates a few traces of it, but it probably needs renaming to a new title and a different definition. I suggest something like "leisure activity performed through arranging decor in a house" or somesuch. TeleComNasSprVen (talk) 20:57, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

 * Failed RFV. Equinox ◑ 18:25, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Décortainment


text:
Talk:radun

RFV discussion: February–May 2014
- -sche (discuss) 04:35, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

 * Failed RFV. Equinox ◑ 15:15, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:radun


text:
Talk:sagacecoj

sagacecojn
Plural forms of sagaceco, which is Esperanto for acumen. My impression is that sagaceco is uncountable, and the plural forms aren't on Google Books, Usenet, or Tekstaro. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 20:19, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

Plurals deleted and removed from singular entry. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 19:29, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:sagacecoj


text:
Talk:fibuŝo

RFV discussion: January–May 2014
Esperanto for potty mouth. I can find mentions, but no uses on Google Books, Tekstaro, or Usenet. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 02:19, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

RFV failed. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 19:44, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:fibuŝo


text:
Talk:duoniĝotempo

RFV discussion: February–May 2014
And the alternative form duoniĝtempo, which is currently a redirect. Esperanto for half-life. I've found one dictionary entry for duoniĝtempo on Google Books, but nothing else on Google Books, Usenet, or Tekstaro. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 20:26, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

RFV failed. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 19:25, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:duoniĝotempo


text:
Talk:flugokompanio

RFV discussion: February–May 2014
Esperanto alternative form of flugkompanio, which means airline. Nothing on Usenet, Google Books, or Tekstaro. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 23:53, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

RFV failed. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 19:19, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:flugokompanio


text:
Talk:moonshee

RFV discussion: February–May 2014
Sense 2: "a Muslim harkaras". (And what's a harkaras? I only know it as a plural.) Equinox ◑ 01:04, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

 * Well I'm gonna call that an RFV failed then. Equinox ◑ 05:33, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:moonshee


text:
Talk:jumbo

RFV discussion: February–May 2014
Rfv-sense "A popular name for an elephant." Seems almost like a speedy as a lowercase common noun, but I give it the benefit of the doubt, that perhaps some elephant-related common noun belongs here. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 18:56, 9 February 2014 (UTC)
 * RFV failed: no quotations provided. I checked other dictionaries for plausibility. --Dan Polansky (talk) 09:11, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

"jumbo" means "elephant" to me, I doubt that I'm the only one. Helenpaws (talk) 19:10, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

Possible missing nautical sense
What does it mean here, in "ease your jumbo"? It might be a sailor's instruction to do something, or perhaps it's nautical slang for "shut up, stop complaining".

 * 1897, Rudyard Kipling, Captains Courageous
 * "Never seen anchor weighed before?" said Tom Platt, to Harvey gaping at the damp canvas of the foresail. "No. Where are we going?" "Fish and make berth, as you'll find out 'fore you've been a week aboard. It's all new to you, but we never know what may come to us. Now, take me—Tom Platt—I'd never ha' thought—" "It's better than fourteen dollars a month an' a bullet in your belly," said Troop, from the wheel. "Ease your jumbo a grind."

Equinox ◑ 17:31, 17 February 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:jumbo


text:
Talk:absentmindeder

absentmindedest
This adjective does not actually seem to be inflected using -er, -est, despite the claims of some other dictionaries. - -sche (discuss) 00:17, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
 * And even if it did, shouldn't it be "absenterminded" and "absentestminded"? ;-) —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 08:58, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
 * um, not really...

 * Failed RFV. Equinox ◑ 18:35, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:absentmindeder


text:
Talk:-ent-

RFV discussion: March–May 2014
RFV of both senses. Esperanto. I have never heard of this suffix. The entry gives prezidento as an example, but that doesn't really count—the word prezidento was borrowed into Esperanto as a unit, not composed from the verb prezidi plus a suffix. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 14:32, 5 March 2014 (UTC)

RFV failed. Mi estas forprenento. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 18:44, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:-ent-


text:
Talk:drinkado

RFV discussion: March–May 2014
Ido for drinking. This word is easily attestable in Esperanto, but I can't find any uses in Ido. —Mr. Granger (talk • contribs) 20:53, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

RFV failed. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 19:32, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:drinkado


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/June


text:
Talk:situation comedy

RFV discussion: December 2013–May 2014

 * See Talk:sitcom.

title: Talk:situation comedy


text:
Talk:absentmindedest

RFV discussion: February–May 2014

 * See Talk:absentmindeder.

title: Talk:absentmindedest


text:
Talk:sagacecojn

RFV discussion: January–May 2014

 * See Talk:sagacecoj.

title: Talk:sagacecojn


text:
worm fence

Noun

 * 1) A zigzag fence composed of rails crossing one another at their ends.

title: worm fence


text: worm fences

title: worm fences


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/May 29


text:
Talk:Television

Is it ok to create this page?
 * Why would you need to? 18:43, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Television


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/May 30


text:
Taimyr Pidgin Russian

Proper noun

 * 1) A -based  used by the Dolgans and Nganasans.

title: Taimyr Pidgin Russian


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/May 31


text:
Template talk:deseret

Template:shavian
This is being used as a pronunciation template, along with IPA and enPR. Deseret script sees no mainstream academic usage as a notation for English pronunciation, and I think it's rather inappropriate to use it. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 00:10, 10 February 2014 (UTC) Edit: I have added as a subheader. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 02:21, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Doesn't seem to be doing any harm, though; no more so than at any rate. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 10:44, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Well the problem is the overcrowding of the pronunciation section. We don't want people to be able to just glance at it and not have to read through all our various transcription schemes until they find the right one. --WikiTiki89 15:14, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * We could put Deseret and Shavian under alternative forms instead, though obviously without links since I suspect we all agree there shouldn't be entries for them. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 15:28, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

 * Orphan and delete this (and ) per nom; they are decidedly not pronunciation templates. Re: moving uses of both templates out of pronunciation sections and into alt forms sections: the templates are so little used and offer so little of use that I think it would be best to simply remove them, like the (generally malformatted) "Shorthand" sections one may still stumble across from time to time as (as DCD once put it) "remnants of clearly failed experiments". Why would "we all agree there shouldn't be entries for them"? The only reasons I can think of are that they are categorically unattested, or there is some notion that the only attested form of English we should have entries for is the Latin-script form. But if either of those is the case, then why should we list the Deseret forms anywhere? - -sche (discuss) 17:13, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

Old discussion: especially WT:Beer parlour/2013/January; also WT:Beer parlour/2010/May and WT:Grease pit/2010/April. —msh210℠ (talk) 04:11, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

 * These have been orphaned for a little over three weeks, and (as was to be expected from the minuscule number of uses which exited to begin with) no new uses have arisen. - -sche (discuss) 02:42, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

 * Deleted by -sche, striking. — Keφr 20:34, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

title: Template talk:deseret


text:
Appendix talk:Latin reduplicative conjugation

RFDO discussion: April–May 2014
Unnecessary. Reduplicated Latin verbs are garden-variety third-conjugation verbs with an unusual way of forming the perfect stem (third principal part), but there is no one "usual" way of forming the perfect stem in the third conjugation anyway. It always has to be memorized on a word-by-word basis. The actual conjugation of the reduplicated verbs is no different from that of verbs whose perfect stem has been formed differently, making this appendix (to which nothing links, incidentally) superfluous. All information in it is already covered by Appendix:Latin third conjugation. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 18:41, 9 April 2014 (UTC)
 * We have Template:la-conj-2nd-redup and Template:la-conj-3rd-redup as well, which do the exact same thing as the usual inflection templates, except that they also categorise in Category:Latin reduplicative verbs. 19:04, 9 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes, but they point to Appendix:Latin second conjugation and Appendix:Latin third conjugation respectively, so still no one gets taken to Appendix:Latin reduplicative conjugation. I had forgotten about the second-conjugation reduplicating verbs; now this appendix isn't only unnecessary, it's downright incorrect for verbs like . I don't mind having the category; it's interesting and useful for historical linguists to have a list of reduplicating verbs in Latin. But the conjugation appendix isn't helping anyone. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 19:19, 9 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Having identical templates just for the purpose of adding an extra category doesn't seem hugely useful either, though. I think those templates should go, and the categories added by other means. 19:22, 9 April 2014 (UTC)
 * OK, but maybe that should be a separate RFDO rather than a rider to this one. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 19:25, 9 April 2014 (UTC)

Delete all that has been mentioned (useless templates + this page) altogether. --Fsojic (talk) 16:29, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Deleted the appendix and the templates. 19:32, 11 May 2014 (UTC)


text:
Category talk:Norwegian Bokmål words suffixed with -maskin

RFDO discussion: May 2014
This category can be deleted. Maskin is a noun meaning "machine" and shouldn't be treated as a suffix. I have altered the only entry that was in there to a compound word, so the category is now empty. Donnanz (talk) 09:33, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Speedied as "created in error". —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 10:55, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Cheers. Donnanz (talk) 10:58, 14 May 2014 (UTC)


text:
Template talk:shavian

RFDO discussion: February–April 2014

 * See Template talk:deseret.

title: Template talk:shavian


text:
Malacca Creole Portuguese

Proper noun

 * 1) A -based  spoken in  and.

title: Malacca Creole Portuguese


text:
resurrection plant

Noun

 * 1) Any poikilohydric plant that can survive periods of extreme dehydration, including.
 * , also known as the, a plant species native to deserts of North Africa
 * 1)  spp.
 * 2)  spp., members of the families  and  with snapdragon-like flowers
 * 3)  spp., which plants can revive within a short period of time after a drought
 * , a plant species native to Southern Africa
 * , also known as resurrection fern
 * , a species in the family Gesneriaceae
 * , a plant species native to North America, Central and South America, and sold as a novelty
 * 1)  spp.
 * 2)  spp., of a monocotyledonous genus typically occurring on rock outcrops in Southern African grasslands
 * 3) Lichen, a symbiosis that can survive in extreme desiccation
 * 1)  spp., of a monocotyledonous genus typically occurring on rock outcrops in Southern African grasslands
 * 2) Lichen, a symbiosis that can survive in extreme desiccation

title: resurrection plant


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/June 1


text: resurrection plants

title: resurrection plants


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/June 2


text:
lamp fount

Noun

 * 1) A reservoir for oil in a lamp.

title: lamp fount


text: mellemkrigstider

title: mellemkrigstider


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/June 3


text: mellemkrigstiderne

title: mellemkrigstiderne


text: mellemkrigstids

title: mellemkrigstids


text: mellemkrigstidens

title: mellemkrigstidens


text:
Principense

Proper noun

 * 1) A -based  spoken in the island of.

title: Principense


text: mellemkrigstiders

title: mellemkrigstiders


text: mellemkrigstidernes

title: mellemkrigstidernes


text: østen

title: østen


text: synchronizers

title: synchronizers


text: Wiktionary:Foreign Word of the Day/2014/June 4


text: østs

title: østs


text:
minôr

Etymology
From.

Adjective

 * 1) less
 * 2) lesser, minor

Noun

 * 1) minor

title: minôr


text: østens

title: østens


text:
Döbereiner's lamp

Etymology
It was invented by the German chemist Johann Wolfgang Döbereiner.

Noun

 * 1) An early lighter in which zinc metal reacts with sulfuric acid to produce hydrogen gas. When a valve is opened, a jet of hydrogen is released and bursts into flame. The ignition is catalyzed by platinum metal.

title: Döbereiner's lamp


text: nordvesten

title: nordvesten


text: nordvests

title: nordvests


text: nordvestens

title: nordvestens


text:
mancul

Adverb

 * 1) less

title: mancul


text: burger-baren

title: burger-baren


text: burger-barerne

title: burger-barerne


text: burger-bars

title: burger-bars


text: burger-barens

title: burger-barens


text: burger-barers

title: burger-barers


text: burger-barernes

title: burger-barernes


text:
Category talk:Flemish Dutch

RFM discussion: March 2013–May 2014
I don't think there is any difference between these two names, so they should probably be merged. However, "Flemish" is ambiguous because it can refer either to historical Flanders (the modern provinces of East Flanders and West Flanders) or to all of the Flemish community (all the Dutch-speaking areas) of Belgium. So the name Category:Belgian Dutch would probably be clearer. I would like to explicitly display "East and West Flanders" for this reason, too. 19:41, 4 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Support. - -sche (discuss) 19:51, 16 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Merged. 20:31, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Category talk:Flemish Dutch


text:
Category talk:Wiktionary language considerations

RFM discussion: January 2013–May 2014
Why fake the Wiktionary namespace in a category name? Seems a bit illogical to me. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 07:08, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I think it is useful for making clear that it is a category for Wiktionary-related things rather than lexical things. It's also common practice on Wikipedia I think. But we don't apply it very consistently right now. 14:17, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
 * If we were to follow Wikipedia's practice, we would call it Category:Wiktionary language considerations rather than making it look like a namespace within a namespace. —Angr 15:46, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Category:Wiktionary language considerations is better. — Ungoliant (Falai) 14:38, 18 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Sounds better to me too. ~ Röbin Liönheart (talk) 02:16, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

 * ✅. All links have been switched to Category:Wiktionary language considerations. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 14:20, 7 May 2014 (UTC)


text:
Category talk:Belgian Dutch

RFM discussion: March 2013–May 2014

 * See Category talk:Flemish Dutch.

title: Category talk:Belgian Dutch


text:
Template talk:only in

RFM discussion: January–May 2014

 * See Template talk:no entry.

title: Template talk:only in


text:
měrná tepelná kapacita

Noun

 * 1) specific heat capacity

title: měrná tepelná kapacita


text: bistroerne

title: bistroerne


text: bistroens

title: bistroens


text: bistroers

title: bistroers


text: bistroernes

title: bistroernes


text:
ریه

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) lung

title: ریه


text:
tepelný

Etymology
From.

Adjective

 * 1)  thermal, heat

title: tepelný


text: brugeren

title: brugeren


text: brugere

title: brugere


text:
مویرگ

Noun

 * 1)  capillary

title: مویرگ


text: brugers

title: brugers


text: brugerens

title: brugerens


text: brugeres

title: brugeres


text: piet-my-vrous

title: piet-my-vrous


text:
Indian fire

Noun

 * 1) A pyrotechnic composition of sulfur, nitre, and realgar, burning with a brilliant white light.

authors: Celui qui crée ébauches de football anglais

title: Indian fire


text: bear leader

title: bear leader


text:
democidal

Adjective

 * 1) Causing or relating to democide.

title: democidal


text:
korrumpere

Etymology
From.

Verb

 * 1) to corrupt

Related terms

 * (adjective)

title: korrumpere


text:
korrumpert

Etymology
Derived from the verb

Adjective

 * 1) corrupt

title: korrumpert


text:
Kimism

Noun

 * 1) The political philosophy of the former North Korean leader.

title: Kimism


text: korrumper

title: korrumper


text: korrumperer

title: korrumperer


text: korrumperte

title: korrumperte


text: revisualise

title: revisualise


text: revisualisation

title: revisualisation


text: revisualisations

title: revisualisations


text: revisualises

title: revisualises


text: revisualised

title: revisualised


text: revisualising

title: revisualising


text:
revisualization

Noun

 * 1) visualization again or anew

title: revisualization


text:
revisualize

Verb

 * 1)  To visualize again or anew.

title: revisualize


text: revisualizations

title: revisualizations


text: revisualizes

title: revisualizes


text: revisualizing

title: revisualizing


text: revisualized

title: revisualized


text:
memoizable

Adjective

 * 1)  Suitable for memoization.

title: memoizable


text: mannlige

title: mannlige


text:
cholangiopancreatographically

Adverb

 * 1) By means of, or in terms of, cholangiopancreatography.

title: cholangiopancreatographically


text:
pancreaticobiliary

Etymology
From, reflecting New Latin : =.

Adjective

 * 1) Relating to the pancreas and bile duct.

title: pancreaticobiliary


text:
bear garden

Noun

 * 1)  A public place where bears are kept for diversion or fighting.
 * 2)  Any place where riotous conduct is common or permitted.
 * 3) * 1867-1868,, Culture and Anarchy
 * He sees the rich, the aristocratic class, in occupation of the executive government, and so if he is of us, stopped from making Hyde Park a bear-garden or the streets.
 * He sees the rich, the aristocratic class, in occupation of the executive government, and so if he is of us, stopped from making Hyde Park a bear-garden or the streets.

title: bear garden


text:
kvinnelig

Etymology
From.

Adjective

 * 1) female

title: kvinnelig


text: kvinnelige

title: kvinnelige


text:
antibiblical

Adjective

 * 1)  Opposing or contradicting the Bible.

Translations

 * Portuguese:

title: antibiblical


text:
antiprayer

Adjective

 * 1) Opposing prayer.

title: antiprayer


text: empalmarse

title: empalmarse


text:
have two strings to one's bow

Verb

 * 1) To have another means or expedient kept in reserve in case the current one fails.

title: have two strings to one's bow


text: Category:Sanskrit terms with redundant transliterations


text:
lindeza

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1) prettiness

Noun

 * 1) prettiness
 * 2) niceness; decentness

title: lindeza


text:
garden nail

Noun

 * 1) A cast nail used for fastening vines to brick walls.

title: garden nail


text:
garden syringe

Noun

 * 1) A syringe for sprinkling plants with water, insecticide, etc.

title: garden syringe


text:
Kimist

Noun

 * 1) A supporter of Kimism.

title: Kimist


text: Kimists

title: Kimists


text:
Majorite

Noun

 * 1)  A political supporter of  (born 1943), British Conservative politician who served as Prime Minister from 1990 to 1997.

title: Majorite


text: Majorites

title: Majorites


text:
unbankrupted

Adjective

 * 1)  Not made bankrupt.

title: unbankrupted


text:
beat the hoof

Verb

 * 1)  To walk; to go on foot.

title: beat the hoof


text:
beat time

Verb

 * 1)  To measure or regulate time in music by the motion of the hand or foot.

Translations

 * Chinese:
 * Mandarin:
 * Finnish: lyödä tahtia
 * French:
 * Polish: wybijać rytm, wybić rytm
 * Russian: отбивать такт, отбивать ритм

title: beat time


text:
earth dog

Noun

 * 1) Any dog that digs in the earth, for example to catch foxes in holes

title: earth dog


text: windburnt

title: windburnt


text:
aasiankääpiösorsa

Noun

 * 1) cotton teal, Indian pygmy-goose,

title: aasiankääpiösorsa


text: ribbonsnake

title: ribbonsnake


text: ribbonsnakes

title: ribbonsnakes


text:
ribbon snake

Etymology
From its long, thin shape.

Noun

 * , a common garter snake endemic to eastern North America.

title: ribbon snake


text: ribbon snakes

title: ribbon snakes


text:
kääpiösorsa

Noun

 * 1) pygmy goose bird of the genus

title: kääpiösorsa


text:
grub-saw

Noun

 * 1) A handsaw used for sawing marble.

title: grub-saw


text:
false quarter

Noun

 * 1) A cleft in the quarter of a horse's foot.

title: false quarter


text:
quarter block

Noun

 * 1)  A block fitted under the quarters of a yard on each side of the slings, through which the clewlines and sheets are reeved.

title: quarter block


text: aasianiibishaikara

title: aasianiibishaikara


text:
on like Donkey Kong

Etymology
From the Nintendo video game gorilla-like character Donkey Kong, which is used in the phrase because of the character’s stereotypical strength and for the near-rhyme between and Kong; likely influenced by the earlier construction.

Phrase

 * 1) * 2011 January 4,, meeting:
 * I will politically haunt you for the biggest fumble in the history of San Francisco politics. It's on like Donkey Kong.
 * 1) * 2011 January 4,, meeting:
 * I will politically haunt you for the biggest fumble in the history of San Francisco politics. It's on like Donkey Kong.
 * 1) * 2011 January 4,, meeting:
 * I will politically haunt you for the biggest fumble in the history of San Francisco politics. It's on like Donkey Kong.
 * I will politically haunt you for the biggest fumble in the history of San Francisco politics. It's on like Donkey Kong.

title: on like Donkey Kong


text:
maiden plum

Noun

 * 1) Any tree from the Caribbean islands, or other parts of North America, of genus.

title: maiden plum


text:
plate press

Noun

 * 1) A press with a flat carriage and a roller, used for printing from engraved steel or copper plates.

title: plate press


text:
plate wheel

Noun

 * 1) A wheel whose rim and hub are connected by a continuous plate of metal, instead of by arms or spokes.

title: plate wheel


text:
take a horn

Etymology
In reference to a drinking horn.

Verb

 * 1)  To consume an alcoholic drink.

title: take a horn


text:
hag moth

Noun

 * , a moth of the family.

title: hag moth


text:
monkey slug

Noun

 * 1) The larva of the hag moth.

title: monkey slug


text:
Talk:poker face

vagina
Isn't this also a slang term for vagina, per the Wikipedia article on the Lady Gaga song? Ready Steady Yeti (talk) 22:48, 28 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Reading WT:ATTEST now, I realise one could probably abuse the "use in a well-known work" criterion to have it listed here... but I would not add it myself. — Keφr 06:16, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:poker face


text: brugernavnene

title: brugernavnene


text: brugernavns

title: brugernavns


text: brugernavnets

title: brugernavnets


text: brugernavnes

title: brugernavnes


text: brugernavnenes

title: brugernavnenes


text:
User talk:SantiagFOCT

Ready Steady Yeti (talk) 23:16, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

title: User talk:SantiagFOCT


text:
User talk:Joshua1~enwiktionary

Ready Steady Yeti (talk) 23:17, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

Your account will be renamed
Hello,

The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called Joshua1. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name Joshua1~enwiktionary that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name.

Your account will still work as before, and you will be credited for all your edits made so far, but you will have to use the new account name when you log in.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 23:54, 17 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
 This account has been renamed as part of single-user login finalisation. If you own this account you can |log in using your previous username and password for more information. If you do not like this account's new name, you can choose your own using this form after logging in: . -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 07:10, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Joshua1~enwiktionary


text: parkeringsgarager

title: parkeringsgarager


text: Rhymes:Icelandic/eiht

title: Rhymes:Icelandic/eiht


text:
cjariâ

Etymology
From, from.

Verb

 * 1)  to load, charge

title: cjariâ


text: rìwén

title: rìwén


text: éyǔ

title: éyǔ


text:
cjarie

Etymology
From. Compare 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬,, 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬.

Noun

 * 1) charge
 * 2) load

title: cjarie


text:
perucă

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) wig

title: perucă


text:
coafură

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) hairstyle (especially for women), coiffure

title: coafură


text:
frizură

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) hairstyle
 * 2) haircut

title: frizură


text:
freză

Etymology 1
From, from.

Noun

 * 1) haircut (for men)

Etymology 2
From.

Noun

 * 1)  bur

title: freză


text:
óþægindi

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1) discomfort

title: óþægindi


text: parkeringsgaragerne

title: parkeringsgaragerne


text: parkeringsgaragers

title: parkeringsgaragers


text: parkeringsgaragernes

title: parkeringsgaragernes


text: benzinstationen

title: benzinstationen


text: benzinstationer

title: benzinstationer


text: benzinstationerne

title: benzinstationerne


text: benzinstations

title: benzinstations


text: benzinstationens

title: benzinstationens


text: benzinstationers

title: benzinstationers


text: benzinstationernes

title: benzinstationernes


text:
畜牲

Noun

 * 1) domestic animal; livestock; brute
 * 2)  beast; bugger; contemptible person; brute; bastard

title: 畜牲


text: chùshēng

title: chùshēng


text: bagagevognen

title: bagagevognen


text: bagagevogne

title: bagagevogne


text: bagagevognene

title: bagagevognene


text: bagagevogns

title: bagagevogns


text:
不如

Verb

 * 1) to be not like; to be not equal to; to be not as good as; cannot compare to; to be inferior to

Conjunction

 * 1) it would be better to; might as well; let's

title: 不如


text: bagagevognens

title: bagagevognens


text: bagagevognes

title: bagagevognes


text:
котлета

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) meat patty,
 * 2) cutlet, pork chop
 * 3)  bomb, a large sum of money

Etymology
Borrowed from.

Noun

 * 1) meat patty, meatball, frikadelle
 * 2) cutlet, chop

title: котлета


text: bagagevognenes

title: bagagevognenes


text: brugerdiskussionen

title: brugerdiskussionen


text: Category:Wu prefixes

title: Category:Wu prefixes


text: Category:Hakka conjunctions

title: Category:Hakka conjunctions


text: brugerdiskussioner

title: brugerdiskussioner


text:
Module talk:ru-pron/Archive 1

Complete table: Module talk:ru-pron/testcases/complete

Wyang (talk) 02:23, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

Exceptions identified
There are some exceptions in your list (it's quite big for the first cut!). The most frequent exception is when "е" does not palatalise (palatalisation is marked with /ʲ/) the preceding hard consonant (b,p,d,t,n,r,l,m,k,g,s,z,v,f,) in SOME loanwords. The resulting vowel is /ɛ/ (stressed) or /ɨ/ (unstressed) and no /ʲ/. The phonetic respelling for such words is using "э". ада́птер -> ада́птэр /ɐˈdaptɨr/, not expected /ɐˈdaptʲɪr/

ш /ʂ/, ж /ʐ/ and ц /t͡s/ are ALWAYS hard (unpalatalised), with a very small number of exceptions. ч /t͡ɕ/ and щ /ɕː/ are always soft (palatalised).

сегодня is respelled as сево́дня

что is respelled as што

I have gone through the list, it's a bit too large. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 02:45, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

Thanks! Do you think would it be better to show syllabification, like Module:pl-IPA? I didn't find much reference on the detailed structure of Russian syllables. We would need this information for the placement of the accent mark, even if we do not mark syllable division. I know the maximally allowed syllable structure is CCCCVCCCC, with the vowel nucleus being obligatory. What are the allowed combinations in the onset (s-p/t-, p/t/d/k/g/s/f/v-r-, p/t/d/k/g/f-l-)?

Should, , be /ədmʲɪnʲɪˈstratər/, /ərbʲɪˈtraʂ/, /ərʲɪˈstant/ instead? is /ɐkˈvarʲɪʊm/? is /ɐkˈtʲivnəsʲtʲ/? is /ɐkˈt͡sɛpt/? is /zəvʲɪxˈrʲenʲɪjə/? is /ɪsˈlam/? is /əktʲɪbˈrʲɵnək/? is /ɐkˈtʲæbrʲ/? is /ɪstrʲɪbˈlʲenʲɪjə/ like ?

Are 'br-', 'dr-', 'gr-' allowed in the onset? бед-ро́, внед-ри́ть but вне-дре́-ни·е, why?

Thanks. Wyang (talk) 04:33, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

 * Your analysis and examples look correct to me but I have to admit, I have to research this myself. Yes, 'br-', 'dr-', 'gr-' are allowed in the onset - бро-дить, дроз-ды, гряз-ный. There's very little on syllabification (слогоделение) in Russian. This Russian page has some examples. The theory in that page says that syllabification happens in ascending order of "sonority" (?). 1 – voiceless sibilants, 2 – voiced sibilants, 3 – resonant (liquid?), 4 – vowels. I'll try to translate it a bit but let me know, if examples make any sense to you. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 04:59, 29 May 2014 (UTC)
 * User:Ivan Štambuk chose a simpler way for Ukrainian pronunciation. It's probably OK but I'm asking around. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:54, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

 * Thanks. I found a really useful reference on this: Peter Chew's dissertation "A Computational Phonology of Russian". Yes, there is the in phonotactics, which analyses the patterns of allowed syllable onsets in a theoretical way. Russian syllables often violate that rule, though.
 * I have another question. Do /o/ and /a/ in absolute word-initial, non-pre-tonic positions undergo level-1 /ɐ/ or level-2 /ə/ reduction? What about hard /o/ and /a/ in the first non-pre-tonic syllables? Currently it is inconsistent but mostly the latter: /nədɐˈjesʲtʲ/,  /nətkɐˈlʲenʲːɪk/ but  /nɐdʲɪˈvatʲ/, although Wikipedia and a number of other sources suggest the level-1 is true for at least some words. Wyang (talk) 00:50, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * The difference between /ɐ/ and /ə/ is so small that it's better to rely on official researches in this area, if they exist. Besides, it's based on "Moscow accent", not necessarily the most common and the only standard way to pronounce those words. There may be slightly wrong IPA in the Wiktionary (including my own edits - I sometimes used similar sounding words and may have repeated other people's incorrectness - I do find /ɐ/ and /ə/ inconsistency a bit confusing as well). If Wikipedia and other sources contradict what you see here, you may fix it. Do those sources mention any exceptions, can you give me a link? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 01:07, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia only mentions this briefly:
 * in "Russian phonology": "[ɐ] (sometimes transcribed 〈ʌ〉) appears in the following positions: ... In absolute word-initial position.[22]..."
 * in "Vowel reduction in Russian": "In the syllable immediately before the stress[2] and in absolute word-initial position,[3] both reduce to [ɐ] (sometimes also transcribed as [ʌ])."

The other sources are:

1. Cubberley, "Russian: A Linguistic Introduction":

"/a/ and /o/ after hard C or # (/HC,#- or /-Sharp,#-):
 * Level 2
 * [ʌ] (as in Eng up)
 * pre-tonic /a/: s a dy‘ 'garden' NP; n a sto‘l 'onto the table';
 * /o/: m o rʲa‘ 'sea' NP; p o mo‘rʲu 'over the sea';
 * absolute initial even if not pre-tonic /a/: a br‘iko‘s 'apricot';
 * /o/: o goro‘d 'kitchen garden'
 * Level 3
 * [ə] (as in Eng article a)
 * pre-pre-tonic /a/: k a randa‘š 'pencil'; ''n a stolʲe‘‘' 'on the table';
 * /o/: g o lova‘ 'head'; p o stranʲe‘ 'around the country';
 * post-tonic, including absolute-final /a/: ko‘mn a t a 'room';
 * /o/: go‘r o d o m 'town' IS; slo‘v o 'word'.

...

Special cases:
 * Potential [ə] > [ʌ] before another unstressed vowel: n a uga‘d 'at random' ([nʌu-]); v o obščʲe‘ 'in general'' ([vʌʌ-])"

2. Hamilton, "Introduction to Russian phonology and word structure":

"A weak stressed syllable occurs immediately before the stressed syllable within a given word, and in one other position, namely in the initial syllable of a word if that word begins with a vowel sound. This exception applies no matter how far to the end the stress is. So words like осторожно, американец, умопомрачительны show the extra elevation of weak stress at the beginning, but the pattern is otherwise the same as the basic one above. Note that this exception does not apply to words like языкознание, Екатерина, because these do not begin with a vowel sound. (Diagrams omitted)"

(previous post modified)

Wyang (talk) 01:39, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * It must be very hard. Do you have any controversies? Can you make "prodigious" based on the above (misspelled earlier)? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 02:29, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * I just created that. Please check!
 * I think it would be good if absolute word-initial /o/ and /a/ are level-1-reduced, whereas the occurrences in other first syllables are level-2. Wyang (talk) 03:18, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * You did a great job, умопомрачительно! :) I couldn't do any better. Re: level-1/2-reduced: Could you give me examples of both, so that I understand you correctly? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 03:33, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * I meant: /prəsvʲɪˈɕːætʲ/,  /zəvʲɪˈɕːætʲ/, but  /ɐpəvʲɪˈɕːætʲ/, per reference 1 and 2. I think I will just ignore the "Special cases" in reference 1. What do you reckon? Wyang (talk) 03:48, 30 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Sounds good. Could you give an example or two of "Special cases" in reference 1, please? Perhaps, the module should allow parameterised exceptions, if they are valid, also for other typical exceptions - е->э, г->в, ч->ш. More in WT:RU TR and Russian phonology article. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 03:56, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * , it seems, from what reference 1 suggests. Although ru.wikt seems to disagree about the non-reduction regarding the first one. Wyang (talk) 04:05, 30 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Both /nɐʊˈgat/ and /nəʊˈgat/ sound OK for "наугад" but /nɐʊˈgat/ is probably better, "вообще" is pronounced /vɐɐpˈɕe/ or /vɐpˈɕe/ (colloquially). --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 04:28, 30 May 2014 (UTC)
 * I see. We need a parameter for this then:  . Wyang (talk) 04:33, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * I have asked User:Wanjuscha. He thinks "наугад" probably sounds more like /nəʊˈgat/ but is not sure. I'll let you do what you find from your research and handle exceptions, difficult cases later. There's no module yet, how do "test cases" work with 'Module:ru-pron' not found error?
 * BTW, I think unstressed "е" after vowels should have variants - with or without "j", see my edit on наедине. Could you make поединок? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:22, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

80 tests failed.
Some comments:
 * 1) аа́нгич - ŋ is non-existent
 * 2) ааро́новщина - v is devoiced in front of voiceless consonants
 * 3) аба-вуа́ - just ʊ is ok
 * 4) абаку́мыч - should be ɨ
 * 5) абашá - should be ɐbɐˈʂa
 * 6) абба́си - to verify if gemination is needed, probably not
 * 7) абба́тство - v doesn't affect preceding consonants voiced/unvoiced remain unchanged
 * 8) аббревиату́ра - should be -vʲɪɐ-
 * 9) аббревиа́ция - same
 * 10) а́бвер - two variants exist, for ˈabvᵻr the respelling is а́бвэр
 * 11) абда́л - ɐbˈdal is ok, we don't transliterate hard l as ɫ
 * 12) абде́ст - ɐbˈdʲest is ok, no need for e̞
 * 13) а́бджа́д - means two variants: ˈabdʒət and ɐbˈdʐat
 * 14) абеве́га exception = абэвэ́га
 * 15) абельмо́ш should be ɐbʲɪlʲˈmoʂ
 * 16) аберра́ция should be ɐbʲɪˈrat͡sᵻjə
 * 17) абецеда́рий exception = абэцеда́рий
 * 18) абзе́тцер exception = абзэ́тцер

More to do --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 11:21, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * Please note, exceptions can't be determined from the script alone, the module should be told when е=э.

Does it make sense? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 12:48, 30 May 2014 (UTC)
 * 1) ааро́новщина ɐːˈronəfɕːɪnə - ɨ never follows щ or ч, which are always palatalised
 * 2) аба-вуа́ - ɐбɐvʊˈa correct
 * 3) аббревиа́ция - ɐbrʲɪvʲɪˈat͡sɨjə correct, just need to fix transcription ц=t͡s, ы, и (after ж, ш and ц) =ɨ
 * 4) а́бджа́д - as above, two stress marks mean two variants

 * I just saved what I wrote when I left work... The thing is there are many inconsistencies in the IPA. Thanks for all the notes above, I have tried to address the first batch, and cut it down to 50. There are still many to do, as noted in the module. Too late now; I'm going to sleep. Thanks again, it'll probably be tomorrow night before I have a chance to tackle the rest, but please comment about the errors if you can. Wyang (talk) 13:12, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

 * Please don't remove gemination completely. It definitely happens - at the beginning of words - ссо́ра, ввод and there are many cases - ванна, военный but I can't give you the rule right now. Overall, it looks good. The errors are minor, can be explained or fixed, some are non-errors. Some comments for today:

 * 1) 	ааро́новщина	-	ɪ - after щ
 * 2) 	аба-вуа́	-	ɐ - pretonic
 * 3) 	аббревиа́ция	-	t͡s and ɨ
 * 4) 	а́бвер	-	а́бвер or а́бвэр
 * 5) 	а́бджа́д	-	two stress variants
 * 6) 	абдика́ция	-	ɨ
 * 7) 	абевегеде́йка	-	е - э
 * 8) 	абельмо́ш	-	stress mark should be before "m"
 * 9) 	аберра́ция	-	ɨ
 * 10) 	абе́с	-	stress is missing
 * 11) 	абецеда́рий	-	е - э
 * 12) 	абзе́тцер	-	е - э
 * 13) 	абиогене́з	-	е - э
 * 14) 	аблакта́ция	-	???
 * 15) 	абля́ция	-	c + я́ = ʲæ
 * 16) 	абсе́нт	-	е - э
 * 17) 	абсентеи́зм	-	е - э
 * 18) 	брю́ки-галифе́	-	е - э
 * 19) 	заво́д-подря́дчик	-	devoicing, - symbol should be ignored
 * 20) 	пинг-по́нг	-	stress mark, devoicing
 * 21) 	хме́ли-суне́ли	-	е - э
 * 22) 	в чём де́ло	-	devoicing

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 13:54, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

26 tests
I have removed exceptions, since don't follow the reading rules and words with two possible stress patterns. Cleaned otherwise erroneous "expected" transcriptions

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:08, 31 May 2014 (UTC) Remaining words: --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 08:13, 31 May 2014 (UTC)
 * 1) ааро́новщина - should be always ɪ after ɕː
 * 2) абэвэ́га - э is always ɛ (stressed) and ɨ (unstressed)
 * 3) абельмо́ш - position of the stress mark should be fixed
 * 4) абсорби́роваться - something's wrong with the ending -ться, should always be t͡sə, (same with -тся) - consistent irregular reading
 * 1) абстра́кт, абстра́ктный, абстра́кция - stress mark position is incorrect but I don't know the rule
 * 2) абсце́сс ɐpˈsʲt͡ses has two errors: ц is "hard" in most cases, including cases before е and и, so is followed by ɛ and the consonants before it don't get palatalisation. correct: ɐpˈst͡sɛs
 * авансце́на - same as абсце́сс
 * 1) абха́з - devoicing is missing, /x/ is voiceless
 * 2) авантю́ра, авантюри́зм, авантюри́ст, авантюри́стка - palatalisation is missing - nʲ
 * 3) авиаотря́д - т, д, б, п, в, ф, к, г, л, м, н, р are not affected by following palatalised consonant - ɐvʲɪɐːtˈrʲæt, not ɐvʲɪɐːˈtʲrʲæt
 * авиапредприя́тие same as авиаотря́д
 * 1) заво́д-подря́дчик - 1st and 3rd "д" is devoiced
 * 2) пинг-по́нг - both "г" are devoiced, stress mark position
 * 3) пти́ца-адъюта́нт - "ъ" should always be /j/ (no palalisation necessary on preceding consonant), if followed by iotised vowel (е, ё, ю and я), the 2nd "j" should be suppressed, e.g. подъезд = pɐdˈjest
 * 4) в чём де́ло - "в" is palatilised
 * 5) да́мы и господа́ - normal /i/ after vowels.

A few new rules
Gemination:

 * 1) Double consonants are pronounced long: 1. when they are in the initial position:  ˈsːorə,  vʲːɪˈdʲenʲɪjə,  vːot. 2. When they appear immediately after the stressed vowel:  ˈtonːə,  ˈvanːə
 * 2) сч зч are pronounced as щ -  ˈɕːæsʲtʲjə,  ˈgruɕːɪk
 * 3) ц is mostly unpalatalised (as I said before), even if it precedes е or и but it's palatalised before ё, я, ю.  xʊˈɐˈt͡sʲao (final "о" is nor reduced here, exception) --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 09:06, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

 * Hi Anatoli, I have implemented most of the above. Please have a look at the errors in the testcases now.

 * One question - unstressed э: /ɨ/ or ? Wyang (talk) 15:19, 31 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Good job! It's /ɨ/, see, so is unstressed "е" after ж, ш and ц.

 * 1) сча́стье - stressed "а" after ɕː and t͡ɕ (both palatised) is the same as after other palatised consonants - сча́стье ˈɕːæsʲtʲjə. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 02:02, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

More on palatalisation, assimilation and some consonant clusters
Palatalisation rules are complicated for neighbouring consonants. Here's what I found

Source:

Mandatory palatalisation (Russian often write "ь", which is incorrect):

s and z are always palatalised in front of palatalised tʲ and dʲ - sʲtʲepʲ,  zʲdʲesʲ (to me stʲepʲ and zdʲesʲ sound also acceptable, though)

n is always palatalised in front of t͡ɕ and ɕː -  ˈponʲt͡ɕɪk and  ˈkamʲɪnʲɕːɪk

Optional palatalisation (hard and soft are both acceptable):

s and z in front of lʲ and nʲ - snʲek/sʲnʲek,  zlʲitʲ/zʲlʲitʲ

t and d in front of nʲ - pədˈnʲætʲ/pədʲˈnʲætʲ,  ətˈnʲætʲ/ətʲˈnʲætʲ (the source used s and z, must be a typo)

n in front of sʲ, zʲ, tʲ, dʲ - ˈvʲinʲtʲik/ˈvʲintʲik,  ˈpʲenʲsʲɪjə/ˈpʲensʲɪjə

Assimilation:

(alread mentioned с+ч and з+ч - done) с+щ has the same effect: rəɕːiˈpʲitʲ, ,

с+ш = ʂː, с+ж = ʐː

ʂːɨtʲ, ʐːatʲ

т+ц = t͡sː, т+ч = t͡ɕː

De-assimilation:

г+к = xk - ,

Dropping of consonants in consonant clusters:

 * 1) вств – [ств] (stv): ,
 * 2) здн – [зн] (zn):
 * 3) здц - [сц] (st͡s):
 * 4) лнц - [нц] (nt͡s):
 * 5) ндц - [нц] (nt͡s): голла́ндцы
 * 6) ндш - [нш:] (nʂ)
 * 7) нтг - [нг] (ng):
 * 8) рдц - [рц] (rt͡s):
 * 9) рдч - [рч’] (rt͡ɕ):
 * 10) стл - [сл’] (slʲ):
 * 11) стн - [сн] (sn):

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 11:08, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

34 tests
I think spaces, hyphens, etc. should be ignored, as we need to cater for phrases as one unit, e.g. should produce vːɐˈdʲe. I will remove spaces, sorry, it will increase the number of failed cases

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 01:40, 2 June 2014 (UTC) --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 02:36, 2 June 2014 (UTC)
 * 1)  - gemination, щ is always long: ɐːˈronəfɕːɪnə
 * 2)  - "э" is never palatalised, ɛ - stressed, ɨ - unstressed: ɐbɨˈvɛgə
 * 3)  - z is not palatalised here
 * 4)  - rm space (new) and 2nd "s" is not palatalised gələsɐˈvɨjəˈsvʲæskʲɪ
 * rm space - ˈdamɨigəspɐˈda
 * rm space - ft͡ɕomˈdʲelə
 * 1)  - final "е" is ə/ʲə, not ʲɪ/ɪ
 * after ц, it should be treated as "э", anyway - ˈsʲert͡sə, see also cluster rule
 * 1)  - should be ˈɕːæsʲtʲjə, same rule as "я" after soft consonants, including щ (сч, зч) (ɕː) and ч (t͡ɕ), final "е" rule - ə, not ɪ
 * 2)  - nə(j)ɪdʲɪˈnʲe - unstressed "е" after vowels can be both jɪ and ɪ
 * - pə(j)ɪˈdʲinək
 * 1)  - palatalisation rule
 * 2)  - ˈponʲt͡ɕɪk, palatalisation rule
 * - ˈkamʲɪnʲɕːɪk
 * 1)  -  pɐd(ʲ)ˈnʲætʲ, palatalisation rule
 * - ɐt(ʲ)ˈnʲætʲ
 * - ˈpʲen(ʲ)sʲɪjə
 * 1)  - rəɕːɪˈpʲitʲ, assimilation rule
 * - ʂːitʲ
 * - ʐːatʲ
 * - ɐt͡sːɨˈpʲitʲ
 * - ɐˈt͡ɕːot
 * 1)  - ˈlʲɵxkʲɪj, de-assimilation rule
 * - ˈmʲæxkʲɪj
 * 1)  - ˈzdrastvʊj, consonant cluster rule
 * - ˈt͡ɕustvəvətʲ
 * - ˈpoznə
 * - ʊzˈt͡sɨ
 * - ˈsont͡sə
 * - gɐˈlant͡sɨ
 * - lɐnˈʂaft
 * - rʲɪnˈgʲen
 * - ˈsʲert͡sə
 * - sʲɪrˈt͡ɕiʂkə
 * - ɕːɪsˈlʲivɨj (see also "а/я" after palatalised consonants)
 * - ˈmʲesnɨj
 * - ˈmʲesnɨj
 * 1)  - -тся and -ться are pronounced the same way - t͡sə, should be ʊlɨˈba(j)ɪt͡sə
 * 1) Hmm, the above is complicated. тся/ться should be цца after stressed syllable and simply ца otherwise. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 02:52, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

отцепи́ть, отчёт should have geminations
Sorry, I can't explain but they should have geminations. It must be to do with semantics or etymology? Also, and  are two different words with different pronunciations.

It should be:
 * 1) self:check_pron("отцепи́ть", "ɐt͡sːɨˈpʲitʲ")
 * 2) self:check_pron("отчёт", "ɐˈt͡ɕːot")

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 04:48, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for the above!

Should I limit word-initial 'отц' and 'отч' to geminate then?

Why is 'абсце́сс' /ɐpˈst͡sɛs/ but 'уздцы́' /ʊsˈt͡sɨ/?

'абиети́н': /ɐbʲɪ(j)ɪˈtʲin/ or /ɐbʲɪjɪˈtʲin/?

Wyang (talk) 04:52, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

 * I have corrected уздцы́ and /ɐbʲɪ(j)ɪˈtʲin/ is the correct one. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:15, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Yes, perhaps limiting word-initial 'отц' and 'отч' is a good idea. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:17, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Long consonants again, final "о" after vowels in loanwords, palatalised ц (t͡sʲ)
I got a bit disheartened by irregularities of Russian double consonants, the "rules" are complicated or rather, there are no rules one can follow. I'd like to be able to add variants, e.g. for кассир (var1=касси́р), so that both pronunciations, e.g. /kɐˈsʲir|kɐˈsʲːir/ were available. I'd like to have up to six variants. The German Becker is pronounced in four ways in Russian: /ˈbʲekʲːɪr|ˈbʲekʲɪr|ˈbɛkʲːɪr|ˈbɛkʲɪr/. Could you variants to, please?

A new rule 1 - final "о" after vowels in loanwords is not reduced
 * 1)  - should be ˈvʲidʲɪo
 * 2)  - should be ˈsʲtʲerʲɪo
 * 3)  - should be ˈradʲɪo
 * 4)  - should be kɐˈkao
 * 5)  - should be xʊɐˈt͡sʲæo (also see below)

A new rule 2 - "ц" can also be palatalised (marginally, rarely) but only in front of "я, "ю" and "ё", not "е" and "и" (це = цэ, ци = цы).

 * 1)  - should be xʊɐˈt͡sʲæo (also see above)

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 02:28, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

 * These two rules have been added. Could you expand the bit on gemination and variants? Are geminate consonants often optionally geminate and optionally non-geminate? There is no rule at all for them? Wyang (talk) 03:31, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

 * I'm struggling to find a definite guide. Yes, gemination after the stress is almost mandatory but теннис (тэнис) is pronounced short. I started a discussion on a forum and it seems it quite unpredictable. All prefixes double the next consonant. I'm not giving up, it's just a bit complicated. It may be easier just to do /kɐˈsʲir|kɐˈsʲːir/ as above. My suggestion is for кассир: (for one variant, etc.) --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 03:48, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

 * I found a couple of sources describing geminate consonants in Russian, mainly by Dmitrieva. An interesting one is her thesis: (page 62):

"The Russian prescriptive tradition acknowledges the variability in the pronunciation of double consonants and provides a set of rules which define environments where long or short pronunciation is recommended. Long pronunciation of double consonants is prescribed for all concatenated geminates in general (Avanesov, 1984; Matusevich, 1976) and on the boundary of prefixes and stems in particular (Panov, 1979). Long pronunciation is also advised in intervocalic position (Kolesnikov, 1990; Panov, 1979) and after stressed vowels (Avanesov, 1984; Kalenchuk and Kasatkina, 1997; Kolesnikov, 1990; Matusevich, 1976). Some sources suggest that long pronunciation is justified in adjacency to stressed vowels on either side, whether before or after the consonant (Panov, 1979).

Prescriptive literature warns against long pronunciation in preconsonantal positions (Avanesov, 1984; Cubberley, 2002; Kalenchuk and Kasatkina, 1997; Panov, 1967, 1979), word-finally (Avanesov, 1984; Cubberley, 2002; Kalenchuk and Kasatkina, 1997; Panov, 1967, 1979), and when not adjacent to stressed vowels (Sazonova, 1998). Thus, long pronunciation is favored intervocalically and next to stressed vowels, while short pronunciation is favored in adjacency to consonants, at the end of the word, and intervocalically when not preceded or followed by stressed vowels. Once again, we can see that these prescriptive generalizations follow the pattern of the crosslinguistic preferences. They show similarities in terms of the tendency to avoid geminates in adjacency to other consonants and at word-edges (word-finally in particular); we can also see signs of the connection between geminacy and stress, just as in the crosslinguistic literature.

Kasatkin and Choj (1999) showed that natural patterns of degemination in speech are governed by the same factors that are appealed to in prescriptive literature. They analyzed a corpus of television programs and college lectures and established that speakers degeminated long consonants more frequently in preconsonantal and wordfinal positions than in intervocalic and word-initial positions; intervocalic long consonants were degeminated more often if neither of the surrounding vowels was stressed. Long pronunciation was particulary favored in post-stress position.

Kasatkin and Choj (1999) also report that sonorant geminates, nasals and liquids, degeminated in speech more easily than fricatives, affricates, and stops. Degemination happened more often in fast and spontaneous speech as opposed to slower, prepared speech, and in reading.

Thus, the short-long consonantal distinction in Russian, although not uncontroversially phonemic, does play a functional role, is familiar to speakers of Russian, who produce and perceive it without difficulties, and is realized phonetically as a function of a number of contextual factors, which appear to follow the pattern of crosslinguistic tendencies in the distribution of geminate consonants across contextual positions."

Here is another paper abstract by Dmitrieva: Variation in pronunciation of geminate consonants in Russian:

"Morphology contributes to frequency of degemination: geminates were preserved more often on the morpheme boundary than inside a morpheme. Geminates adjacent to a stressed vowel - preceding or following it - are more protected from degemination than geminates between two unstressed vowels.

Geminates are most likely to be preserved in word-initial position than in word final position. Long pronunciation is favored in intervocalic position as opposed to preconsonantal position.

Stops and fricatives were the most successfully preserved geminates, followed by nasals, [n] in particular. Liquids were the most frequently degeminated segments. [v] analyzed separately from other fricatives was preserved as a geminate even more often than stops and fricatives. The fact that [v] occurred only in word-initial position and only on morpheme boundary is probably responsible for this effect."

Another source is Cubberley :

"Geminate consonants. As indicated above (section 3.3.4.1), geminate consonants in native words arose because of lost jers at morpheme boundaries; as such the group continued - and still continues - to be pronounced as double (or long). It was only in borrowings that geminates could appear inside roots, and, perhaps through the influence of the foreign pronunciation, for example of English (the more and more frequent source of borrowings), the reduction to a single consonant appears to be becoming more and more common, though, as noted above, the trend is unclear. While there is no effect on the phonemic or phonetic system related to this feature, there is a problem related to the graphic system and its relation to pronunciation: generally speaking, the Russian graphic system is a good guide to, or predictor of, the pronunciation (see details below), and that system has probably been the most important motive for change this century (the 'spelling influence' factor), and this would make us expect that geminate consonants would be, or continue to be, pronounced double. If the trend towards single pronunciation is accurate, it is a move against spelling influence."

I think we probably could use the following rules:
 * Preserve the geminacy if it is:
 * Word-initial,
 * On the morpheme boundary between prefix (from a list) and root, or
 * Intervocalic (not followed by or following any consonant), and one of the adjacent vowels is stressed.

What do you think? Wyang (talk) 05:18, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Thanks, I will let you do it, if you can and if you will. The last point of preserving the geminacy - I think it's more when a double consonant follows a stressed vowel, not before but there are exceptions in both cases - the geminacy is preserved when it shouldn't (if these rules are followed) - can be ˈkamʲɪnɨj or ˈkamʲɪnːɨj or it's not preserved, when it should: (usually) Ди́ккенс, те́ннис . --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 23:28, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

[тд]с, дз, тс, etc.
Various assimilations. In front of vowels it's only partial:

 * 1)  - should be ɐt͡sˈsʲek (in front of a vowel)
 * = "ц + с"? Do we need any changes to the module?
 * It's a consistent (predictable) change, all depends on whether the combination is followed by a vowel (t͡ss) or a (voiceless) consonant (t͡s)

 * 1)  pɐt͡sˈsaʐɨvətʲ (in front of  a vowel)
 * Does it only exist in 'под- + с', or any 'дс + vowel'?, ?
 * Yes, 'дс + vowel' as well.

 * 1)  - should be pɐd͡zˈzuʐɨvətʲ (d͡z - voiced variant of t͡s, in front of  a vowel) but see next
 * Same as above., ,
 * Yes, it's predictable (also for "тз" - "отзанима́ться" (sometimes not easy to choose a common word to get an example but if you want translations of any word, let me know)

 * 1)  - ɐt͡stəj is OK (in front of  a consonant)
 * 2)  - should be pɐd͡zˈdam (d͡z - voiced variant of t͡s)
 * Added.

 * 1)  should be boɣdast (ɣ is a voiced version of x, is also used occasionally in some words
 * ɣ added as voiced allophone of x.

 * 1)  - should be ɐɣˈda (ɣ is a voiced version of x)
 * So 'ах' is accentless here? How do I know 'ах да́' is 'ɐɣˈda', but 'бог даст' is 'boɣdast' (not 'bəɣdəst')? What are some other inherently accentless words?
 * They are just monosyllabic, both pronounced clearly (not reduced) but the expression has the stress on the 2nd word (ах да́! = "oh yes!"). Maybe I should have done them "а́х да́" and "бо́г да́ст" to avoid confusion? From the top of my head, only prepositions are reduced (vowels are not stressed, pronounced together with the next word), unless the stress is moved from the noun onto the preposition, which happens. обо я|мне́ should be read as "обомне́", "о пого́де" -> "опого́де", "в кварти́ре"->"вкварти́ре"

 * 1)  - should be vɨˈtalʲɪɪ (initial "и" becomes "ы" after prepositions ending in consonants, hence - и́мя -> безымя́нный: name-> nameless)
 * So it is {без, близ, в, вдоль, взамен, внутрь, вокруг, вслед, из, к, меж, над, наперекор, напротив, насупротив, насчёт, об, окре́ст, от, перед, поверх, под, поперёк, пред, против, с, сверх, сквозь, средь, супротив, через} + ' ' + 'и'?
 * Yes, excluding palatalised - вдоль, внутрь

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 23:49, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Thanks. Could you please give me more multi-word examples? With and without prepositions. I'd like to know what's the best way to handle them. I think I will slightly rewrite the code, to split by word (accentless + accented units), and then by syllable. Thanks! Wyang (talk) 05:26, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I have given some above. Please let me know if you want to know more. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад)

сегодня

 * - should be [sʲɪˈvod⁽ʲ⁾nʲə], no big /j/ --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 13:55, 4 June 2014 (UTC)

3 tests failed.
Failed cases for аба́з, аборда́ж, абрази́в are all legitimate. Somehow the devoicing didn't work. I've also posted сегодня above. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 00:27, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

Is the 'а' in 'аx' of reduced? What would be the best way to handle "бох даст"? It seems the other ones from the three sections above are all done. :) Wyang (talk) 05:34, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Thank you :) Can this test module use phonetic respelling? In and  both vowels are not reduced - [ax da] and [box dast]. They're pronounced as two separate words. I wonder now, if the module shouldn't cater for multiple words to avoid undesired reduction, and words with prepositions or with a single expression stress could be fed as one word into the module (на рабо́те -> нарабо́те), otherwise they'll be processed as two words. ( is pronounced irregularly in the nominative  case - [box], not [bok] - ) . --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:51, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

I introduced a table of monosyllabic prepositions and let the module treat them differently from other monosyllabic words:

на рабо́те:

ах да:

бох даст:

в чём де́ло:

In this way the accent mark is only used to mark stressed vowels in a multisyllabic word and the IPA ignores intonation. What do you think about this?

What about conjunctions like "и"? Does any of Category:Russian conjunctions belong to the inherently accentless group of words or otherwise warrant special consideration? (You mentioned и is 'i' after vowels, what about consonants?) Wyang (talk) 06:23, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Great. A minor thing - в чём де́ло has two stresses, one is unwritten - "ё" is (almost) always stressed and the stress unmarked. It should actually be [f‿ˈt͡ɕɵmˈdʲelə] :) Conjunctions are not reduced (но is always [no]). "и" after unpalatalised consonants is "ы" (в институ́те) [v‿ɨnstʲɪˈtutʲə] but (сын и дочь) [sɨn i dot͡ɕ] or [sɨnʔidot͡ɕ] (?). I'd like to review the list of prepositions. Longer prepositions carry additional stress, even if they merge with the next word: "напро́тив избы́" should be [nɐˈprotʲɪv‿ɨzˈbɨ] (also: nɐˈprotʲɪf izˈbɨ). --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 07:23, 5 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Particle не is also reduced. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 07:38, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Thanks. Should unreduced monosyllabic words bear stress (i.e. the primary stress sign ˈ)? Would 'ах да' be instead?
 * With the alternative stress pattern - Is it a common pattern in phrases which are potentially entries here? Wyang (talk) 07:17, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Unreduced monosyllabic words usually don't have a stress mark but for technical reasons, they may have it (if there is no other way). BTW, they do have stress marks in declension tables, today I edited рок-гру́ппа, where "рок" part is not reduced, even if the word stress is on "у́", added a stress mark on "ро́к", so that it's not reduced. It seems to work, [rokˈgrupːə] is the correct IPA (can also be [rogˈgrupːə].
 * A simple example of a word with alternative stresses is - I have just edited it. Perhaps alternatives can be done like this - on separate lines. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 07:53, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

ь - after hissing consonants
Final "soft sign" after ш, ж, ч, щ - have only grammatical role - 1. marks feminine nouns (ч in плач and ночь is pronounced identically), marks 2nd person singular for verbs (also + -ся), imperatives (also + -те)
 * 1)  - should be not͡ɕ
 * 2)  (cry (n)) - OK, pronounced exactly as плачь (see next)
 * 3)  - should be nʲɪˈplat͡ɕ
 * 4)  - should be nʲɪˈplat͡ɕtʲə (don't cry) --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 07:41, 5 June 2014 (UTC)
 * 5)  - should be smʲɪˈjɵʂs⁽ʲ⁾ə
 * 6)  - should be ˈprʲæt͡ɕs⁽ʲ⁾ə (note pronunciation of -ся -s⁽ʲ⁾ə when not merged with -т/ть
 * 7)  - should be ˈprʲæt͡ɕtʲɪsʲ

Between a consonant and an iotated vowel, ь serves as a "separating soft sign", without any affect on palatalisation (t͡ɕ and ɕː are already soft (palatalised)) Other consonants in the same position
 * 1)  - ˈnot͡ɕjʉ
 * 2)  - ˈvʲeɕːjʉ
 * 3)  - nʲɪt͡ɕˈjæ
 * 1)  - ˈnʲitʲjʉ (OK)
 * 2)  - ˈplatʲjə (OK)

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 12:02, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

 * :-) Wyang (talk) 06:44, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Спасибо :-), I know you can fix those. I have already started using it, cautiously. Do you want me to write Appendix:Russian pronunciation? I'm not sure I can describe everything. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:46, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Yes, definitely. It would be great if you could. Wyang (talk) 06:56, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

['н[дт]ц'] = 'нц' and голла́ндцы
I must have done something wrong голла́ндцы should be [gɐˈlant͡sɨ]. Is ['н[дт]ц'] = 'нц' wrong? I want to make sure that both д and т are silent in such positions. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:30, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
 * There was another rule which converts '(non-р) + д/т + ц' to 'цц'. Wyang (talk) 06:38, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

format and parameters
I'd like to add a parameter adj=y, so that ['(.[ое])го$'] = '%1во' (added by Kenny) would work, e.g. to make "г" transcribed as [v]

I think separate words should be phoneticised separately and a space displayed, treat "-" as a word separator, unless the first word is a preposition, e.g. "кре́сло-кача́лка", "рок-гру́ппа" (two words) but "по-англи́йски" (one word).

(pls also see my question above) --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:36, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
 * What about words with spaces? Should they follow the same rules? Wyang (talk) 06:38, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

- should be [kɐˈvo]

 * Yes, I think spaces should be displayed, I might try testing with phrases, expressions, "-" should be replaced with a space if pronounced as two words ("кре́сло-кача́лка") or use "‿" if pronounced as one word ("по-англи́йски"). --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:57, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Spaces, hyphens, suffixes, attached words
As per previous discussion, I have added a space between words, which are pronounced separately and some separated by "-", such "ага́р-ага́р" and "заво́д-подря́дчик", "пти́ца-адъюта́нт". Unfortunately, not all words separated by a hyphen behave the same way, so, "пинг-по́нг", "аба-вуа́", "аба-ко́ст" are pronounced as one word (such words are often misspelled). I wonder if it's possible to make this module to allow phonetic respelling? is it possible to test "пинг-по́нг" as if it were spelled "пингпо́нг", i.e. allow phonetic respelling in the tests?

Apart from most prepositions and particle "не", there are some suffixes, particle attached to the end, which are don't have a separate stress: -то, -либо, -нибудь (only if spelled with a hyphen!) and words бы/б, же/ж

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 00:00, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
 * 1)  - OK
 * 2)  - OK
 * 3)  - OK
 * 4)  - should be [ˈjabɨ tak nʲɪ‿skɐˈzal]
 * 5)  - should be [tɨp ʊdʲɪˈvʲils⁽ʲ⁾ə]
 * Аддед а тхирд (ор, ин фацт, фоуртх) аргумент то check_pron. — Keφr 04:40, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Thanks :) I see, it takes a third argument. What will the fourth, fifth arguments do? Variants? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 04:48, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

 * (Before E/C) @Kephir. Pls, note, some failed cases are new (if you're trying to fix them), they are about the treatment of spaces and hyphens. Hyphens can be either ignored ("пинг-по́нг" is considered solid) or treated as a word separator ("заво́д-подря́дчик") for pronunciation purposes. Wyang has not addressed this new request yet. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 04:57, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Nothing. They have not been assigned a purpose. — Keφr 04:53, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
 * On second thought though, this seems like something relatively easy to detect in the module, actually. — Keφr 04:52, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
 * The future purpose of 4, 5, etc. might be alternative pronunciations, and alternative expected results? After phonetic respellings, that is, which is essential. Not sure it needs alternative pronunciations, just several calls might do. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 04:57, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Like this? Wyang (talk) 05:05, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Excellent! It looks great. Do you also think that it would be better to use respellings for hyphen cases? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:10, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
 * It seems from below that at least some hyphen cases would require respellings. Wyang (talk) 23:55, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

 * I just saved a version which splits hyphenated words if (and only if) there are two stress marks. I am not sure of the extent to which this assumption is reasonable. — Keφr 05:22, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

 * I think it's better to replace - with a space and treat as such. Most prefixes (e.g. "по-" and some suffixes separated by "-" don't have a separate stress and are reduced., could you add handling for suffixes, the same way you did prepositions? E.g. "-то"? I will add respelling for "-" as " " (space). --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 00:12, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

 * I think it is added (?) (cf. кто́-то above). Please add more (failed) testcases! Wyang (talk) 01:00, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

Re: split or merge hyphenated words based on whether there are two stress marks or one. That's not right, sorry! You misunderstood. "пинг-по́нг" and "рок-конце́рт" are not the same - 1. is "пингпо́нг" and 2. is "рок конце́рт". It's predictable with prefixes/suffixes but combined words need to have a respelling param.--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:25, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Reverted in that case. — Keφr 05:30, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks. It seems that both sides of the hyphen are mostly not reduced in pronunciations, except for cases with some prefixes and suffixes. Even they have many exceptions. E.g. prefixes "кое-" and "контр-" are not reduced - [kojə] and [kontr]. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:38, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

It seems monosyllabic words need a word stress but it's working as expected, some tests with comment where it didn't work 100%: I guess it's complicated to get it to work with phrases? (No need to change the module until decided.) --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 04:58, 12 June 2014 (UTC) New: Marginal sounds - [ʑː] (alternative pronunciations of дожди́, во́жжи), [ʑ] (alternative pronunciations of Жюльен), [ɣ] (alternative pronunciations of ага́, ого́) cannot be described via phonetic respellings. Could you add parameters for them - correspondingly |zhzh=y, |zh=y, |h=y or something similar? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 05:16, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
 * 1)  - should be [jaʐ nʲɪ‿znal], [ʐ] preserves voiceness in front of [n], не should still be [nʲɪ‿], я́ is [ja], not [jæ]
 * 2)  - should be [jæb v‿ɐˈxot⁽ʲ⁾nʲɪkʲɪ pɐˈʂol], [b] preserves voiceness in front of [n]
 * 1)  - should be [jæb v‿ɐˈxot⁽ʲ⁾nʲɪkʲɪ pɐˈʂol], [b] preserves voiceness in front of [n]
 * 1)  - should be [jæb v‿ɐˈxot⁽ʲ⁾nʲɪkʲɪ pɐˈʂol], [b] preserves voiceness in front of [n]
 * 1)  - should be [jæb v‿ɐˈxot⁽ʲ⁾nʲɪkʲɪ pɐˈʂol], [b] preserves voiceness in front of [n]
 * 1)  - should be [jæb v‿ɐˈxot⁽ʲ⁾nʲɪkʲɪ pɐˈʂol], [b] preserves voiceness in front of [n]
 * 1)  - should be [ˈdʲejstvʲɪnːɨj] - it seems "-енн-" + vowel is geminated in any position
 * 2)  - should be [ˈdod͡ʑbɨ], [d͡ʑ] is the voiced version of [t͡ɕ]
 * 3)  - (or any stressed я́ after vowels, beginning of words, after ь and ъ) should be [ja] but I don't know the rule

Longer test
ɐdːəxnʊtʲ - OK - ɐdːɐxˈnʲɵt - OK

- ja - OK - ja

--Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:56, 13 June 2014 (UTC) New rule: initial [j] (or after vowels, excluding ь and ъ) is optional in the unstressed positions - should be (j)ɪjˈt͡so - (j)ɪˈɕːɵ - ˈza(j)ɪt͡s - OK --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 07:13, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

 * Thanks. I have fixed от-, geminate n and initial unstressed я. Я́ - ever /ˈja/? за́яц - /ˈza(j)ɪt͡s/ or /ˈzajɪt͡s/? Wyang (talk) 06:25, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks. (assume) я́ is always [ˈjæ] (sorry, if I have to change in the future). за́яц - /ˈza(j)ɪt͡s/. How can I check/add other prefixes, I don't see, which part of code fixes "отдохну́ть"? Which part does geminate "n"? --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 06:37, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Why is за́яц /ˈza(j)ɪt͡s/ (я not in initial position)? ot- is at line 287; geminate n is at line 289. Wyang (talk) 06:41, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
 * It's the same case as with "поеди́нок", which you have already done. Unstressed "я" (or "а" after "ч" and "щ" but without optional (j)) is the same as unstressed "е". Clear [j] is only mandatory in stressed (initial positions or after vowels, ь and ъ) with a small number of exceptions, like "прое́кт" respelled as "проэ́кт", which has no [j]. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 07:10, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I see, thanks. It is /ˈza(j)ɪt͡s/ now. :) Wyang (talk) 07:30, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you. I will keep digging failed test cases :) --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 07:39, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you!
The module is doing a great job. I have just tested on a larger text. I may still add new cases and request changes but they may be minor, hopefully. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 00:39, 19 June 2014 (UTC)
 * No worries, thanks for all your help. :) Wyang (talk) 00:25, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Prefixes, which will cause gemination:
Frank, it's a list of prefixes, which will cause gemination: аб- ад- без- брам- бром- в- воз- вос- из- изо- ин- контр- над- низ- нис- ом- от- под- пред- раз- рас- роз- с- сверх- суб- трёх- черес- четырёх- чрез- --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 00:02, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

 * I have added all the above to the existing ones, apart from аб- (a lot of абб- are loanwords). Wyang (talk) 00:26, 20 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you! Yes, that sounds right. Adding аб- may cause more incorrectness than fix anything. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 01:04, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

ю
Iotated vowel "ю" never loses /j/ in initial positions or after vowels. The е, я rule with optional /j/ doesn't apply here. So, is always /jʉˈpʲitʲɪr/. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 13:19, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Fixed - . Wyang (talk) 23:57, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you! Also used here: . --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 00:04, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Just gl, not bl and dl?
Re: Just gl, not bl and dl? - Probably yes but I'd need to go through more cases to be sure.

I'd like to add a forced gemination paramter when it's normally not geminated, e.g. in is usually geminated and the reverse, to remove the gemination where it should be normally geminated by our current rules, especially in loanwords -.

Also (lower priority), for completeness, I'd like to add marginal/alternative sounds like [ʑː] and [ɣ], e.g. for and  (etym. 3) and palatalised [ɕ] and [ʑ] (vowels after them would behave like  after soft consonants) for some French and Lithuanian words e.g.  (even though жю usually жу as in ) and. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:21, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

 * There's an argument (see Wikipedia), if [ʔ] (glottal stop) exists in Russian. Yes, it does! E.g., I'd pronounce "с А́ней" (with Anya) as [ˈsʔanʲɪj] for clarity and is pronounced [ˈnʲeʔə]. There are also interesting examples with  (narrowed) and  (betrothed). The former would be [ˈsʔuʐɨnɨj] (n can be geminated). --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:32, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

The lua parameter has been added:

 * -
 * -
 * -
 * -
 * -
 * -

[ʑː], [ɣ], [ʔ], palatalisation:
 * -   - please check the hardness of [ʑ]
 * - <tt> </tt>
 * - <tt> </tt>
 * - <tt> </tt>
 * - <tt> </tt>
 * - <tt> </tt>
 * - <tt> </tt>
 * - <tt> </tt>

All good? :) Wyang (talk) 02:21, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

 * Thank you so much! You did quickly and efficiently and it's all correct. Yes, [ʑː] is palatalised (soft), voiced equivalent of щ. I just that instead of "ʔ", "ъ" could be used before un-ioated vowels (а, э, о, и, ы), so "су́женный" is sometimes respelled as "съу́женный", which would makes sense to Russians. Can't be helped with ӂ and χ but that's a good idea to use special symbols. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 02:34, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

 * Sorry, found an error, should not be [dɐˈʑːɨ] but [dɐˈʑːi]. This should also fix дрожжи and вожжи. ˈsʔuʐɨnːɨj should be ˈsʔuʐɨn(ː)ɨj --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 02:46, 17 July 2014 (UTC)
 * I'd like to set up some test cases with the new params. e.g. вожжа should be [vɐˈʑːæ], not [vɐˈʑːa]. could you help here, please? The new params are "pal" and "gem" in . --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 02:59, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

 * I've just added four failed cases - сʔу́женный/съу́женный, воӂӂа́, дро́ӂӂи - they are not Russian words with this spelling, they should link to суженный, вожжа, дрожжи. How can I do that? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 03:18, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

 * I've made some changes to ъ, nn, the softness of ʑ. Please check. Wyang (talk) 00:34, 21 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks a lot and welcome back! вожжа́ is actually [vɐˈʑːæ], since it's palatalised (soft) (also: [vɐˈʐːa], with hard pronunciation).
 * Could you make [χ] devoice to [x], as in бог? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:53, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

 * How about now? Wyang (talk) 01:32, 21 July 2014 (UTC)
 * It looks good, thank you! I was hoping Kephir could add the ability to use new params in for test cases here. You have fixed those but they may be needed in future testing. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:43, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

пятьдесят, шестьдесят
I have created two new failed test cases. They are not based on new rules but they have "ь", which may cause the problem. Please let me know if you have questions.

One of the (careful) readings for пятьдесят has gemination /pʲɪdʲːɪˈsʲæt/. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:50, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

 * I've added respellings of these accordingly. Would 'zd' (and also 'st') be 'z⁽ʲ⁾dʲ' or 'zʲdʲ'? Wyang (talk) 01:04, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

 * Thank you. Strictly speaking, it would be /z⁽ʲ⁾dʲ/ and /s⁽ʲ⁾tʲ/, so /ʂɨz⁽ʲ⁾dʲɪˈsʲæt/ is correct. The soft version is more common. I'm OK just to leave it as /zʲdʲ/ and /sʲtʲ/. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:18, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

 * Gemination didn't work on пятьдесят:

--Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:29, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

 * Fixed. Wyang (talk) 01:34, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

Suppressing gemination
could you make it [ɐˈdʲinət͡sətʲ], please :)  --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 08:48, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Done. :) Wyang (talk) 23:27, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Спасибо! :) --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 23:40, 24 July 2014 (UTC)

пятьсот
"тьс" or "тс" should produce "цс" before vowels and "ц" before consonants (also "дс": "а́дский" (hellish) [а́цкий] ). I thought it was already done before. Could you take a look at it, please? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:16, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
 * On пятьсот, what should the third pronunciation be? [pʲɪt͡sʲˈsot]? Wyang (talk) 00:38, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes, thank you! t͡sʲ is not very common, though, the first two pronunciations are more common but it's also used in the loanword from Chinese and some diminutives, such as  "little kraut", pejorative diminutive of  "pejorative for German". --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:46, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
 * I see, thanks. Would it be OK now? Wyang (talk) 00:52, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Just as the doctor prescribed. :) Do you think that you're getting a feel of Russian after some exposure? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:00, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes, thanks, the phonology part has become a lot clearer now. How the pronunciation is predictable from the text is very interesting. Wyang (talk) 01:15, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
 * We can make Wiktionary a kickass resource for Chinese, Russian and other languages :) I'm not planning to work much with Lua but I have a passion for languages. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 01:19, 25 July 2014 (UTC)

Вьетнам, Вьентьян
Hi Frank, I've added a new failed test case: /j/ is not optional after "ь" and "ъ" before unstressed "е" and "я", only after vowels and at the beginning of words. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 05:25, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

 * I'd like to add a possibility to add a secondary accent as well, please, e.g. should [kʊˌalə ˈlumpʊr] and  [vˌodənʲɪprənʲɪˈt͡sa(j)ɪmɨj]. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 05:41, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

 * Hi Anatoli. Seems to be OK now. Wyang (talk) 10:59, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

 * Thank you, Frank! I'm sorry but I realised that and  are in the same boat. They should be  [v‿jɪvˈropʲə] and [v‿jɪˈponʲɪɪ]. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 21:51, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Secondary stress - a new failed case
Hi Frank,

Could you address the secondary stress please, if you can? The rules are the same as for the primary stress - vowels are not reduced, pretonic vowels behave the same way (e.g. ɐ, not ə) and the stress mark should appear before the syllable. See налогоплательщик, currently using manual IPA. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 22:57, 17 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Hi Anatoli, could you please create some testcases for this? It is a little abstract... Wyang (talk) 03:05, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

 * Well, one test case is already there - налогоплательщик. Not sure if наˌлогоплате́льщик is the best way to mark it though. Another symbol could be used for that, perhaps, e.g. "нало̀гоплате́льщик". There are many, usually longer words that have two stresses. There's no vowel reduction on the secondary stress syllable. Please ask, if you don't understand something. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 03:59, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

 * I prefer the second notation, since the secondary stress is indicated in a way consistent with the primary stress (also post-syllable). The two testcases are now fixed. Wyang (talk) 06:08, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

 * Great job! Yes, it seems easier, agree with your change. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 06:26, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

Please use Module talk:ru-pron instead of here
Please use Module talk:ru-pron for further discussion instead of here, it will be easier for others to find. Benwing2 (talk) 05:24, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Outstanding failed cases
(move to Module talk:ru-pron)

title: Module talk:ru-pron/Archive 1


text:
rakonokka

Noun

 * 1) openbill bird of the genus

title: rakonokka


text: full circles

title: full circles


text:
波布

Etymology
Borrowed from. Likely cognate with 🇨🇬. The kanji spelling 波布 is an example of ateji, with the characters chosen purely for their phonetic values.
 * Possibly an alteration from, an obsolete term for a kind of Chinese medicine made from the skin and/or organs of certain venomous snakes.
 * More likely, may be an alteration from . Some dialects distinguish between non-poisonous hebi and poisonous habi.
 * Possibly also related to, or influenced by, -derived verb . An -  alternation can be found in some Japanese words, so a shift from hamu to habu is a reasonable possibility. The standard modern Japanese word hebi for “snake” may similarly be derived from, or have been influenced by, hamu “to bite”.

Noun

 * 1) a venomous pit viper of species  (syn. Trimeresurus flavoviridis), native to Okinawa

Derived terms

 * : the “real” or “true” habu
 * : the genus
 * :, also called coffee senna or coffeeweed, a wide-ranging tropical plant with seeds sometimes used for a beverage similar to coffee
 * : a beverage made by roasting senna seeds and steeping in water

Etymology
Cognate with mainland 🇨🇬.

Noun

 * 1) snake, viper, Okinawan habu

Etymology
Cognate with mainland 🇨🇬.

Noun

 * 1) snake, viper, Okinawan habu

title: 波布


text:
はぶ

Noun

 * 1)  Trimeresurus flavoviridis (now ), a species of venomous pit viper native to Okinawa

Noun

 * 1)  snake, viper, Okinawan habu

title: はぶ


text:
生ふ

Etymology
From.

Appears to be cognate with an op- stem that also derives modern, , and possibly.

Verb

 * 1)  to grow large, spring up

Etymology
Appears to be cognate with an op- stem that also derives the stem and possibly the verb.

Verb

 * 1)  to grow large, spring up
 * "ojp"
 * "ojp"
 * "ojp"

- 烏玉之夜之深去者久木生留淸河原爾知鳥數鳴

title: 生ふ


text: ראינו

title: ראינו


text: aasianrakonokka

title: aasianrakonokka


text: Category:Kumyk terms derived from Arabic


text: afrikanrakonokka

title: afrikanrakonokka


text: aasiansatulahaikara

title: aasiansatulahaikara


text: Category:Kumyk terms derived from Arabic languages


text: Category:Kumyk terms derived from Central Semitic languages


text: Category:Kumyk terms derived from West Semitic languages


text: Category:Kumyk terms derived from Semitic languages


text: Category:Kumyk terms derived from Afroasiatic languages