text:
User talk:KYPark/2008

Korean cleanup
Could you help? Mutante has been working to trim down our list of uncategorized pages, and this has led to a cleanup of those pages. There are 32 Korean entries with no category. Would you be able to remedy this? --EncycloPetey 14:02, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

 * I've just finished categorizing and editing 26 out of 32 pages. The remaining 6 pages are inflectional or conjugational, hence unworthy of a separate page, I fear. In this regard, I don't like the so many red links involved in the verbial or adjectival conjugation chart. --KYPark 18:12, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Re: Category:Euro-Korean words
I've replied to your comment on User_talk:Dmcdevit. Conrad.Irwin 11:59, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Wiktionary:Beer parlour#Can someone else please be the bad guy
I thought you should be made aware of this conversation. -Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 06:38, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

title: User talk:KYPark/2008


text:
User talk:KYPark/2006

Korean indexes
Hello. I've just mashed those index pages together to make them comform to the new style (when they were moved from the Wiktionary: namespace to Index: namespace). Feel free to change them to anything you feel serves better their purpose. Cheers, — Vildricianus 14:08, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Thanks a lot for your visit and encouragement. Perhaps I will try soon. --KYPark 14:56, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Looks pretty well-done. I myself don't know anything about Korean (unfortunately, yet, too little time), but I'm sure it's useful to those who do. I don't think we've had many editors interested in the language - we have only about 600 Korean entries. Keep up the good work! — Vildricianus 12:32, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Templates
I have been working on formatting the single Han character (hanzi/kanji/hanja) entries. We have two templates that I have been using; and. The first is for the single characters, displays them in the correct font, shows the Hangeul, the Eumhun reading, and the romanizations in 3 systems. is for words, formats the line and categorizes the words. Robert Ullmann 23:24, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

Derived terms
This section is reserved for words in the same language as the entry. When the words are in a different language, we use the section header "Descendants". See the ELE --EncycloPetey 03:20, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

clew
Hiya. I've reverted your change to the etymology here, as I can't find any use of the OE word cliewen. What's your source? Widsith 09:29, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

 * I think M-W are mistaken, or at the least they have picked a very unusual form of the word. The word is almost always spelt cliwen in OE, occasionally cleowen.  I can't find any use of cliewen.  The OED agrees with me, as does www.etymonline.com.  Widsith 10:32, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:KYPark/2006


text:
Wiktionary:Grease pit/2012/January

= January 2012 =

"familiar" and "slang" templates
Hi there,

can someone in the know fix the said templates to accommodate for this type of edit, please? http://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=reek&diff=15713037&oldid=15505223

Thanks, --Jerome Potts 06:15, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Why would adjusting them for that be a fix? Use . —msh210℠ (talk) 18:37, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Aha, thanks. --Jerome Potts 21:11, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
 * @Jerome Charles Potts I actually thought you meant 'can someone fix all these edits'. I probably can, I'll give it a go. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:25, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Watchlist issue - deletions and blocks not showing up
I've noticed recently that I'm not seeing page deletions or user blocks on my watchlist. I remember seeing blocks a while ago, but I'm not sure I've ever seen deletions. Is this an admin-privileges thing, or a site issue? — lexicógrafa | háblame — 19:57, 8 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't know, but here are some data: I'm an admin here, but not at enWP. I picked an arbitrary deleted-today page at enWP and watchlisted it, and the deletion shows up on my watchlist. I did the same at wikt, and the deletion doesn't show up on my watchlist. Both sites are using the same version of the site software. —msh210℠ (talk) 20:00, 8 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I deleted ceiler: a little while ago. I've just gone back and "Watched" it. It shows up when I "view and edit watchlist". SemperBlotto 20:17, 8 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Should have specified - I meant the "relevant changes" page of the watchlist, I can see recently deleted pages on the edit watchlist page too. — lexicógrafa | háblame — 20:20, 8 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Ditto. —msh210℠ (talk) 22:53, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Babel for language varieties
Do you think it would be useful to have babel templates for specific varieties of a language? It might be useful if you need someone who specifically speaks Belgian Dutch for example, or Valencian Catalan, especially for pronunciation sections. —CodeCat 18:30, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Our pronunciation sections need to be based on reliable sources rather than users' personal intuitions anyway, don't they? —Angr 18:33, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Ideally they ought to be, yes, but that's not how it's usually done AFAICT. Knowledge of what dialect someone has may be useful for things other than pronunciation. —msh210℠ (talk) 20:45, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

Proposed change to {{does-template-exist}}
I'd like to replace the current contents of with the current contents of. Since that is one of the most widely transcluded templates on the entire project, and it depends on weird parser edge cases, I thought I should post here first, and request review.

This is the change:

 * <onlyinclude><includeonly>{{safesubst:#switch:{{safesubst:urlencode:{{safesubst:Template: {{{1}}}}}}}|%5B%5B%3ATemplate%3A{{safesubst:urlencode:{{{1}}}}}%5D%5D=|%7B%7Bsafesubst%3ATemplate%3A {{safesubst:urlencode:{{{1}}}}}%7D%7D=|#default=1}}</includeonly></onlyinclude> {{documentation}}

As you can see, it's a small change. I believe it should have only the following effects:

 * Currently, always reports that  doesn't exist (even if it does), and  always reports that it does exist (even if it doesn't). After the proposed change, both versions will correctly report whether it exists or not.
 * The main situation I've encountered this is, which frequently gets tested-for when lang= isn't specified in a template like.
 * This effect is the purpose of the change.
 * Currently, (or any other namespace) correctly reports whether User:... exists, but  (transcluded rather than substituted) always reports that it does exist, even if it doesn't. After the proposed change, both versions will always report that it doesn't exist (because it will actually be testing for the existence of Template:User:...).
 * In particular: whereas currently correctly reports whether Template:... exists and  currently always reports that it does exist, both of these will now always report that it doesn't, because they'll actually be looking for Template:Template:.... This special case could be (mostly) addressed, by testing for the existence of    rather than the existence of  Template: , but I don't think the currently-proposed behavior is a problem, since there should never be a need for the caller to specify Template: anyway.
 * In particular: whereas currently correctly reports whether ... exists and  currently always reports that it does exist, both of these will now always report that it doesn't, because they'll actually be looking for Template::....
 * This effect was not specifically intended, but it doesn't seem detrimental to me.

I've tested this at User:Ruakh/Test.

—Ruakh TALK 22:29, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I won't pretend to understand all of this, but it looks good, and more importantly, I trust you. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:43, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Ditto. —msh210℠ (talk) 17:19, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

 * ✅ (once it clears the job queue . . . so, it'll be awhile). If anyone notices any adverse effects, please speak up. —Ruakh TALK 22:53, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

Default script for Serbo-Croatian
Right now this is Cyrillic, but that's only used in Serbia as far as I know, Bosnia and Croatia use only the Latin alphabet if I'm not mistaken (I don't know what Montenegro uses). So wouldn't it be better to make Latin the default script? —CodeCat 20:52, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

 * I agree. —Ruakh TALK 23:15, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Probably more important for us is that we have more sh in Latin script than we do in Cyrillic. Mglovesfun (talk) 19:39, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

Wiktionary very slow or not loading at all
Since I got home last night, Wiktionary is very slow or not loading at all. This also affects AWB. Am not having any problems with other websites. Mglovesfun 11:13 18 01  2012
 * I am getting instant responses. I assumed it was because -pedia is blacked out. SemperBlotto 11:15, 18 January 2012 (UTC)
 * The interface has been getting faster and faster for me all day; still a bit slow now, AutoWikiBrowser can't load Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:infl in order to change it to head; by the way, down to about 50 000 now which will be about two days work, starting from whenever AWB can load the list. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:11, 18 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Back to normal again, hmm. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:52, 19 January 2012 (UTC)
 * That was the same on fr.wikt. JackPotte

A little bug
If, in Recent Changes, you try to look at the diff of a page which has been deleted in the meantime, you get an inappropriate error message: "Sorry: the page title you requested is not supported by our software." (Example, a page I deleted: ). Equinox ◑ 19:41, 20 January 2012 (UTC)
 * That's the same on fr.wikt. JackPotte 17:36, 21 January 2012 (UTC)

Collapsible templates, especially

Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisicing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. With MW 1.18 there are two classes,  and  1 which are available to make nearly any html element collapsible. This may obviate some of the measures currently in use on en.WT. This is particularly relevant to mobile use of wiktionary, with the infamous example of the translation tables at en.m/water. The mobile site is served using Extension:MobileFrontend2, which strips out a range of content deemed inappropriate for mobile devices - apparently including the show/hide scripts used by Wiktionary via common.js.

The reason this has been noticed as a problem is a group of student developers are working to create and improve a Wiktionary-specific Android app. They have a working product now, but are working on adding wiktionary-specific features and functions, and very very long translation tables which do not collapse correctly are UX issue for their project. - Amgine/t·e 05:38, 22 January 2012 (UTC)
 * A simple demo is at Template:trans-top/new. It would be easy to move the correct styles over. It should be straightforward to tweak User:Yair rand/TargetedTranslations.js and User:Conrad.Irwin/editor.js. The visibility toggling might also have to be tweaked, but I can't remember how that's handled. If it's possible, the shift sounds like a good idea since we'd be shifting to more standardized mediawiki structures as well as helping mobile users. --Bequw → τ 21:04, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
 * The mobile site does not load the scripts for  and , either. It would be difficult (if not impossible) to switch everything over, but even if it was simple, I don't think it's a good idea. The $.makeCollapsible script used is not better than our NavBar script.
 * What I'd like to have would be the expandable tables using the <tt> </tt> and <tt> </tt> elements to allow native handling of expandable sections, with a JS fallback for nonsupporting browsers, but unfortunately those elements are not in the Mediawiki tag whitelist. --Yair rand 22:50, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
 * That would certainly not work across many wiktionaries. I am working with the MW developers to get support for collapsible inside the MobileFrontend. The local solution which only works in traditional desktop browsers will certainly break any support by the MW developers in the MF. Do you think you will consider using the standard which does exactly the same thing? - Amgine/t·e 23:00, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Yair rand informs me this is unlikely to ever be implemented on en.WT. Most likely this means the app will never be published as en.WT is pretty illegible and useless huge scrolls translation tables. I guess that's the community's choice. - Amgine/t·e 06:08, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
 * This seems like a WT:BP matter. From this discussion, it is not clear what the implications would be for either mobile users or computer users under the options that seem to be proposed. It may be that our current entries with full translation tables are not suited for mobile applications on most current hardware. Perhaps we need private developers to implement display of translations only in languages selected by the user. DCDuring TALK 12:40, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
 * For mobile users, currently all collapsible templates are uncollapsed, but all L2 sections are collapsed by default. For desktop/laptop users all L2 sections except the top one (English or International) are collapsed, and all collapsible templates are collapsed. (en.WT is completely responsible for the maintenance of this script, and none of it is internationalised.)

 * If en.WT implemented mw-collapsible, for mobile users the collapsible templates will be collapsed, all other elements will remain the same. For desktop users there will be no visible change. (en.WT will not be responsible for maintenance of the script, and it will continue to be internationalised.) - Amgine/t·e 17:40, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Wouldn't we want to follow MW for the medium- and long-term good of en.wikt? What are the other considerations? It certainly seems like a BP matter, rather than a narrowly technical one. DCDuring TALK 18:44, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
 * It is not correct that there would be no visible change for desktop users. The VisibilityToggles system, which allows users to change the default visibility of all of any type of expandable table (see the "Visibility" section of the sidebar), requires that the current system be used. The thread referenced by Amgine is here, by the way. --Yair rand (talk) 20:34, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

 * Presumably we could rewrite VisibilityToggles to work with the new MW standard. If it's a standard baked into the MW software, I suspect we'd want to make use of it, all else being equal.  Of course, whether all else is actually equal is a question we'll need to answer with some trial.  The new mw-collapsible forces the user to click on the show/hide button, whereas our homebrew solution allows them to click anywhere.  Also....the mw-collapsible seems to expand really slowly, as in it takes about a full second to fully expand.  If that's a standard speed in terms of pixels/time, then large translation tables would take forever.  If it simply takes that long to open, regardless of how big the underlying content is, that's probably ok.  -Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 20:53, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
 * *tests a bit* It seems to be a constant amount of time, so if there's more content, then it opens and closes proportionally faster. —Ruakh TALK 20:56, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
 * If we have a sufficient number of technically adept admins with eyes on this matter and we are not departing from MW's technical evolution, this need not be a BP matter. DCDuring TALK 13:02, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

 * Eventually this'll probably need to go to the BP, but not before we have the technical details hammered out as best we can. Once we have all our technical stuff worked out, then we can bring them there and let the general public (so to speak) weigh the pros and cons of all the options.  -Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 05:25, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

I've given the matter a bit more thought, and here's where I'm at so far. I really like Conrad's global visibility toggles, and use them quite frequently. As mw-collapsible is currently coded, there's no good way that it could plug into that system, and so if we converted everything to mw-collapsible, we'd lose the visibility toggles, and I think that would be a shame. Some of you may have noticed the wording 'good way', and, to be clear, there are probably some really terrible, kludgy ways we could make it work, like adding an event to the show/hide buttons, so we'd have the link activating the actual toggling, with an event communicating with the global toggles. I've no idea if it would even work. If any of our resident JS ninjas have any thoughts on this, they should produce them. Another route is we could post a note at the MW talk page and see if they'd be willing to add some kind of a hook we could attach stuff to, in which case it would be pretty easy to make everything work. It should be noted that fixing this or not fixing this shouldn't be a deal breaker for the mobile Wiktionary site. The English Wiktionary is clearly the biggest and most important of the Wiktionaries, and if the developers can't deal with our homebrewed translation tables, they're really being a bunch of slackers. It shouldn't be that hard, regardless of what we do on this end. That being said, it behooves us to do what we can to make their lives as easy as we can practically do. Also, and this is admittedly an idle rant, but this all comes back to the fact that MW is a fucking terrible platform to build a dictionary on. Home-brew solutions are the only route we have to making our project somewhat presentable, but they can come back to bite us from time to time. However, I remain convinced that they're better than simply accepting MW as given. -Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 05:25, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * The mobile team is looking at some options which will deal with this.
 * Simplest: delete all translation/derivation templates and content.
 * Create a custom solution for each collapsible template on en.WT, which will break as soon as en.WT alters those template. (Process will need to be replicated for each language which uses en.WT's custom code.)
 * More options are being looked at, but those are the two most likely to be implemented at the moment. - Amgine/t·e 18:38, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

categorytree
Apparently, trying to do tries to load up Category:Canids instead, while all other languages work fine. This seems to be a remnant from when we still had English words in the parent category, so can this be fixed? -- Liliana • 05:51, 23 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Actually, I think this is because en: is this wiki, so it strips out en: from the beginning of any links. works. --Yair rand 05:55, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

α
The link on the upper right of the entry for α that should go to β is a redlink, but β is definitely an article. What's going on, and how do I fix it? Metaknowledge 20:55, 23 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Fixed. SemperBlotto 20:58, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Similar problem at ζ and σ, except worse: no link appears. Metaknowledge 21:34, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

 * Fixed. —Stephen (Talk) 23:29, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

A question about template transclusions...
Does anyone know if a template with no parameters that is transcluded many times on a page is any slower than when it's transcluded only once on the page? —CodeCat 23:00, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

 * Normally, the hard work of transclusion takes place when you edit a page that uses the template, or when you edit a template that is directly or indirectly transcluded in such a page. (This includes the case where you edit the template itself, of course.) So it shouldn't have a noticeable effect. (Unless the template itself does expensive things, of course, but it doesn't sound like that's what you mean?) —Ruakh TALK 23:35, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

 * I was wondering mostly... if a page includes many language templates, would it hurt to include them all a second time on that page? —CodeCat 23:45, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

 * Not noticeably, no. —Ruakh TALK 00:32, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

Problem with accelerated entries
For a little while now accelerated entries I've created have ended up looking like this. Could someone fix this so we don't have to replace with #? I would ask Conrad.Irwin, but he hasn't been active in a while. Ultimateria 22:13, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I bet someone with a non-Unicode capable browser broke the script. -- Liliana • 22:15, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
 * It works for me. I don't know if that's because someone has fixed it, or because there's some relevant difference between our browsers. (FWIW: I'm using Firefox 9.0.1 on Windows 7.) —Ruakh TALK 23:02, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Since posting this, I see no green links even where I know they should be (anomal for instance). I use Chrome on Windows 7 but I also tried Internet Explorer, I checked my per-browser preferences, and I connected to a different network. I'm not sure what else to do... Ultimateria 23:45, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Update: takeover bids appeared as a green link, but non-English forms are still redlinks. Ultimateria 00:04, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I fixed the issue; the lack of green links for non-English entries is new to me, I have no idea why that is. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:10, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
 * By the way, (a really bastard to type) isn't needed anymore, is it? WT:ACCEL uses it for section linking, such as  whereas as  does the same thing. No piped link needed, not for about 18 months now. Mglovesfun (talk) 22:59, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Everything is working again. I don't know if it's something you guys did...but just in case, thank you. :P Ultimateria 18:11, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Quotations
Hi, may I ask my question here? If not, please tell me where to go ...

I've got a question regarding quotations, and another Wiktionary (no.wiktionary.org): We like your way of making quotations collapsable (with the text "quotations [arrow]", but so far, I haven't been able to adopt the script to no.wikt ... Is there anyone that could help me? If you know, I would appreciate it a lot! Mewasul 18:28, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I think that you're making reference to the paragraph Hidden Quotes of MediaWiki:Common.js. JackPotte 19:06, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Maybe fr:MediaWiki:Gadget-HiddenQuote.js can help you to install the function. JackPotte 20:08, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I am refering to that paragraph exactly .. and I can copy it, but I still don't get how to make it work on no.wikt. What exactly do I write in on the entries, or at the quotation template, to make it use that function? Mewasul 10:24, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Nothing special needs to be added. Any unordered list inside an ordered list will be collapsed:

 * --Yair rand 10:27, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * --Yair rand 10:27, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * --Yair rand 10:27, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

I see – thank you so much, every one of you!! It works perfectly. Greetings, Mewasul 13:44, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Beer parlour --> 敠
Why on earth, when I click on Beer parlour, does it redirect to 敠? This is unusually infuriating. Metaknowledge 23:56, 28 January 2012 (UTC)

 * It appears to have been vandalism. has reverted it now. —Ruakh TALK 01:28, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Successful troll was (ephemerally) successful I guess? 50 Xylophone Players talk 01:10, 2 July 2012 (UTC)

Template:recons feature request
I think it would be useful, if when you hovered over ' * ', a tool-tip saying “unattested” appeared. If we are replacing '<' with 'from', this should be done too; not everyone knows what * means. --Vahag 09:22, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Done. --Yair rand 09:26, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Vahag 11:56, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

title: Wiktionary:Grease pit/2012/January


text:
User talk:KYPark/2007

Memory

 * Talk:개

Syllable
Please see reply at User Talk:AutoFormat. Robert Ullmann 12:07, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

The discussion there is getting way off the page topic (what AutoFormat does).

If we want to have entries for every useful precomposed block, we can do a lot better than generating them by hand; I have the code I used to generate (and update) all the Mandarin pinyin syllables (with diacritics; BD2412 has been doing the others.) But either way, they have to follow wikt format. Robert Ullmann 15:00, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

 * Very good news :-) after harsh screaming :-(. Actually I've been planning to ask you to help with that sort of things, after resolving the troubled question between us. I hope you would not too much be annoyed here --KYPark 04:03, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

dogga
Hi KY. Where did you see this word? I've never seen it spelt this way. Widsith 09:54, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Hi, Widsith. See dogga after expanding the image by clicking on the down right corner. Cheers. --KYPark 10:04, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

OK mate, thanks. I might change it to an, do you mind? Widsith 10:30, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

 * I don't know about that template. But you go ahead. Then I'll see what's the difference and if I should mind. --KYPark 11:05, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Some help with Korean entries for religious terminology?
Your help would be much appreciated in creating entries for the terms listed in the template for belief systems on the Korean Wikipedia. There are 30 in all, but some may not yet be terms defined in Wiktionary, so any of those probably need not be bothered with at this point. Cheers! bd2412 T 07:31, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Wow, actually that's far better than what I had hoped for - really I just want to see a basic entry on each of the Korean terms in the template, with the proper translation/pronunciation (and perhaps plug those into the translation sections of the corresponding English articles). But the derived terms and related terms sections are great additions as well. Thanks! bd2412 T 06:56, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Hi, what's the difference between 일신교 and 일신론? Cheers! bd2412 T 05:04, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

title: User talk:KYPark/2007


text:
Wiktionary:Grease pit/2012/February

= February 2012 =

⁶₄
Is there a way to put a six above a four as shown on the ⁶₄ page but on only one line and smaller instead of using a table with the images of both numbers? Celloplayer115 01:15, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I used head=64. It's not perfect and you can do what I did on ̥| ̥ if you have an image of the thing. —Internoob 02:49, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * How about now? —Ruakh TALK 17:54, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * FWIW combining digits have been proposed for inclusion in Unicode, so in the future this ugly hack shouldn't be needed anymore. -- Liliana • 17:59, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * displays correctly ($$6\atop4$$) but is an image. (FYI, the spacing before and after  doesn't matter.) —msh210℠ (talk) 21:23, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Combining diacritics
In the entry " ̥", the title is placed in an odd position, since there isn't anything for the character to combine with. It'd be nice to have a placeholder there to combine with:

 * 1) In MediaWiki:Common.css, add the following rule:
 * 2) Create a template containing with the following wikitext:
 * 3) Include the template in entries named after a combining diacritical mark. Unfortunately we can't just stick it in, because that infobox is used in some non-combining entries.

In browsers that support CSS generated content, the title would look like:

Browsers without generated content support would be unaffected. An alternative to the letter "o" would be the dotted circle (◌).

– Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 10:19, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * No objections from me though the dotted circle would really be better than the letter o. -- Liliana • 12:53, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

 * It would, but many fonts render the circle way too small. We could specify font families on the placeholder, but its metrics might not match the diacritic, then. – Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 16:44, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Could it be used with a no-breaking space? —CodeCat 16:48, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

 * A non-breaking space likely wouldn't be wide enough (depending on the user's font). Though that is an idea: without modifying any stylesheets, we could just apply  to the title using a template. I still like the idea of indicating somehow that the character is combining, though. – Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 17:25, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

 * The problem with using the letter o as a placeholder is that it may cause confusion with the actual combination of o + diacritic, especially if that entry exists as well. -- Liliana • 16:48, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

That's why I made the "o" a light gray. But it turns out that, in Firefox on the Mac, the diacritic also turns gray if both characters come from the same font. (For me, Firefox was doing font replacement on the diacritic, so it showed up black.) Typically you'd use a dotted-line "o", which is what the Unicode standard uses in its code charts. But ironically, the closest thing in Unicode itself is "◌", which doesn't render well in fonts other than Arial Unicode MS. So how about using a dotted circle and specifying that font for the entire title:

Note that this is just a simulation; if these styles are implemented, the placeholder character won't be selectable, just the diacritic.

– Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 17:25, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't it be better to use the existing  class, instead of defining just a single font? -- Liliana • 17:31, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * And what about those who don't have that font? —CodeCat 21:27, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

 * True, for now I've created the template to simply shift the title over by one character. I added it to all the entries I could find. It still would be nice to display some kind of placeholder, to indicate a combining character. – Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 07:11, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Using language templates in entries directly
As far as I know, our practice has been to subst: these templates whenever they are used directly in entries. But I'm not sure why; it seems to me that a lot of the benefits of using templates are lost this way. Can someone explain this to me please? —CodeCat 12:46, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * There are two places where these templates could conceivably be used in entries: headings, where they break section linking, and translation sections, where they make sorting unnecessarily difficult. -- Liliana • 12:52, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm also thinking of language names in etymology sections and in descendants. —CodeCat 12:57, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * In etymology sections you should really use or similar (which displays "🇨🇬"), but it isn't that widespread yet. As for descendants, same argument from translation sections applies here. -- Liliana • 12:59, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * User:msh210/format.js has a 'lang subst' function, in User:Mglovesfun/vector.js I changed this to change to . The script looks for two or three Latin letters wrapped up in  –, so codes like  get ignored. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:03, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Is there a reason why that would be preferred in etymology sections? It seems to me that it just complicates things and results in more code and slower pages without any benefit. —CodeCat 13:05, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * It gives a Wikipedia link for (1) languages that aren't linked in translations sections and (2) all languages, if you enable the relevant option at WT:PREFS. —Ruakh TALK 13:32, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Sorting out the multitude of linking templates
Right now we have a wide variety of templates used to create links. Some are more commonly used than others, some are used only to support other templates. But in many cases there are several templates that fulfill a similar function. The overlap is quite huge, as people who don't know of the other templates decide instead to create their own. It's hard to see the template forest with the trees in the way, and I wouldn't mind pruning some of them! I'd like to make an inventory of linking templates and their different functions. I think it would be nice if we had a set of small templates that perform one function and nothing else. For example, one template that creates just a link, nothing else without formatting or scripting. (I propose that we use for that purpose, by offloading the additional things like scripts, transliterations, glosses and genders to another template (which in turn transcludes ).) Are there any others? Please add them to the above list. —CodeCat 16:40, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Category:Internal link templates, though some of them aren't quite 'linking templates' in this way. I created recons: to do the same as but for any language, not just one's that start 'proto'. So you can link to Appendix:Frankish/foo or even to languages that are attested but have unattested forms, like Appendix:Old Dutch/foo. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:44, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * is a nice template in itself, because it can be widely used. To me it makes a little redundant, especially now that reconstructed languages have their own language codes. Instead of using  why not use  ? This practice might even make  redundant as well, as it does the same thing. —CodeCat 16:55, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * is needed for Qapla' I think -- Liliana • 16:57, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Proto may do the same job as etyl and recons separately, but it's easy to use and saves a little bit of space. I find that a bit like saying is redundant to . Mglovesfun (talk) 10:33, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

Recent changes
What is all this rubbish at the top of "Recent changes" - after "Wanted" and before the "options"? SemperBlotto 19:56, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Developers must be fiddling with something, it's happening at en.wikiquote as well. -- Cirt (talk) 19:57, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Gone away now. SemperBlotto 20:01, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Yeah, must've been a temporary glitch. -- Cirt (talk) 20:03, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Language templates listed as unused templates
Currently most of the templates in Special:UnusedTemplates are language code templates along with their corresponding script subtemplates. This doesn't really seem desirable to me because they aren't 'unused' in the sense that they may be deleted; they're just waiting to be used. And in the mean time they clog up the list, which is limited to 5000 entries, so there is no way to see the remaining actually unused templates. Is there a way to make it so language templates are not shown in the list? —CodeCat 18:29, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Create a page that embeds them. It can even be in the User namespace. As long as they're embedded *anywhere*, they won't show up in the list. -- Liliana • 18:30, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Oh I didn't think of that... Etymology/language templates and Index to templates/languages seem like good candidates, but the bot that generates those pages would need to be modified. (Why do we have both pages though, aren't they the same?) —CodeCat 18:40, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I think you just need to stop interpreting 'unused' as 'may be deleted'. That seems like the quickest possible solution. --Mglovesfun (talk) 19:24, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I think the issue is the interaction with the 5000 entry limit, which problem occurs in some other Special Pages lists as well. DCDuring TALK 19:34, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Oh I see. I think 5000 is the limit for all special pages. The number of unused categories is over 1500, which is why I'm in favor of regularly deleting unused categories. Mglovesfun (talk) 19:42, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * In Index to templates/languages, instead of linking the name of the language like English, use . That'll do it. Just need to get the agreement of the bot owner that updates this list. Mglovesfun (talk) 15:06, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

Import bot for translation pairs
What follows is a request for help (or input) with creating a bot for volume import of translation pairs into Wiktionary.

I am in contact with a person who is considering to donate some English-Czech translations to English Wiktionary. He asked me whether the following could be done using a bot:

Let us have a list of tab-separated records of the form \t\t \t. For each row of the table, the bot should add the translation to a suitable translation table in the entry, by finding "{{trans-top|". As the tab-separated list has been created using translation glosses extracted from Wiktionary, the bot can assume that  perfectly matches the string found after "{{trans-top|". To make it generic, one column of the input table could contain language code. For simplicity: if the translation table already contains a Czech translation (or that of another specified target language), the bot should skip the record or row; this can be made more complex by requiring the bot to append the translation to the list of translations of the target language unless the translation is already in the list.

Does anyone have a bot whose parts could be used to create such an importing bot? Does writing the bot seem doable with a fairly low amount of effort?

Here is a test set for import: pumpkin	fruit of this plant	dýně	f decade	a period of ten years	desetiletí	n Armenian	person	Arménec	m The target language is Czech, thus "cs".

Thank you for any help. --Dan Polansky 18:22, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
 * coding modified so it won't interfere with the rest of the page Chuck Entz (talk) 14:20, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

na:k
Remember this page, which caused us so much trouble due to starting in an invisible character so it can be allowed as a page title?

Well as I just found out, Unicode has a solution for this: ꞉. This isn't the IPA colon, but a new character, which is intended for languages which use the colon orthographically. Even though it might not be supported by older systems, it would be a perfect fit in this case, in my opinion. -- Liliana • 02:39, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
 * No idea. Use your judgment, it's been serving us well so far. Mglovesfun (talk) 14:39, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Brilliant! —msh210℠ (talk) 07:19, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Moved to na꞉k. -- Liliana • 17:26, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Right-to-left Babel boxes
So I know WT does a lot of things different from WP (and in this case from Commons and WB as well). But is there a particular reason that the language codes for languages written right-to-left, like Arabic and Hindi are on the left rather than the right? --Quintucket 21:10, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
 * That's what Wikipedia does as well. Or did I miss something? -- Liliana • 21:16, 4 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Odd. I just realized that I'm completely wrong. Wikipedia, puts the language code for rtl languages on the left for native speakers, and right for level 1 speakers, but all other wikis put both on the left. I wonder why it is that I didn't notice it when I put my Babel boxes on Commons and Wikibooks. --Quintucket 21:25, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

Georgian blends
I've just added the Georgian language tag "ka" to არაფერი to move it out of the "English blends" category and into a new category "Georgian blends". First of all, that is the right language tag, isn't it? Secondly, the new category isn't showing up here. Is there something I need to do to make it appear? — Paul G 15:37, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, that is the right language tag (/ language code). The category wasn't showing up in Blends by language because it hadn't been created yet. :) --Yair rand 16:23, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Ah, OK :) Thanks for doing that. — Paul G 18:02, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Bot not working
Although I can edit normally (but somewhat slow?) my bot is not working - I get "HTTPError: 504 Gateway Time-out". As far as I can tell, no bot has run since 18:11 yesterday. (They are running OK on -pedia) SemperBlotto 08:44, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Now it is almost working. It adds one or two words then goes into a loop of dozens of "Pausing 300 seconds due to database server lag" messages. It will never catch up at this rate. SemperBlotto 14:34, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Server lag now down to single figures. Light at the end of the tunnel. SemperBlotto 15:00, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I had the same problem using AWB this morning; a couple of hours later, it was okay. --Dan Polansky 15:47, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

Template not discriminating language when categorizing
This discussion (Requests for cleanup) points out that the template in question is adding the word to an en: category, even though the template is in the section for a specific non-English language and not in the English section. How hard is it to make the template aware of what language section it's in?
 * Very. But a bot can add a  parameter based on section. (Liliana, you reading this?) —msh210℠ (talk) 07:13, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
 * To repeat myself, the problem with this template is quite small; with context labels, I wouldn't be surprised if there were between 10 000 and 100 000 pages using context labels with the wrong language. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:04, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Subpage problem
Talk:error/mistake distinction ought not to be a subpage of Talk:error; its content relates to that of Citations:error/mistake distinction. How do I prevent the software from treating it as a subpage of Talk:error? — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 12:01, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

 * I'm not sure that you can. I tried adding the entry (with a definition based on guesswork) - but that didn't help. SemperBlotto 12:11, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

 * It's strange; neither the mainspace page nor the Citations: page is affected. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 12:15, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

 * That's because we don't have the 'subpage' feature turned on in those namespaces. (See mw:Manual:$wgNamespacesWithSubpages.) —Ruakh TALK 14:49, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Do we want subpages to be enabled for mainspace talk pages? — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 17:35, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Good question. We don't use talkpages anywhere nearly as much as WP (which needs subpages for archiving), but we do use them. Conceivably, we'll need to archive one at some point. Can you think of a way to do so without the use of subpages? (The subpage feature is necessary if we're using subpages for the "Entry" link atop the archival page to link to the correct entry.) —msh210℠ (talk) 18:15, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

 * I wouldn't know; I'm no good at this sort of thing. Do we have any mainspace talk pages with archival subpages? — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 04:26, 14 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Not that I can find. I think we have to assume that we will, though. I suppose we can put them in project namespace (Talk archive/entrytitle). (Archived talk is as valid there as in the talk namespace, since it's Wiktionary-related and is no longer actual talk.) —msh210℠ (talk) 16:32, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Is there a way to use JavaScript to test for the existence of a page? If so, we can have JS test for  and set the CSS of   to  . I think that would work (but only, of course, for users with JS and CSS, which is far from ideal), though it may need some tweaking. —msh210℠ (talk) 16:56, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
 * But Talk:error does exist... —CodeCat 17:05, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Right, but that JS would test for the existence of [[error/mistake distinction]]. (Come to think of it, that might not be ideal, as we sometimes have talkpages for nonexistent pages, especially where the latter have been deleted. I suppose if the JS could check for the existence of a page or a log entry therefor....) The existence or non- of [[talk:error]] has nothing to do with it. —msh210℠ (talk) 18:10, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
 * That's certainly possible, though I'm not sure it that would be a good idea... --Yair rand 16:43, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Technically speaking, to test for the existence of the mainspace page, we can just check if the "Entry" tab is a redlink, with something like . That said — this approach seems error-prone. Note that the talk-page that sparked this discussion, Talk:error/mistake distinction, was orphaned (or rather, not-yet-parented) when the discussion began. If we want to suppress the breadcrumb for non-archive pages, I think it's simpler to check if the pagename looks like .../Archive.... (But to be honest, I'm not sure how much harm the breadcrumb really does. And that's the only effect of being a subpage, so far as I can tell, aside from parser variables like {{SUBPAGENAME}} that we're not using, and that couldn't readily be fixed by JavaScript even if we were.) —Ruakh TALK 17:53, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

 * I suppose there's no way to escape characters in strings used as headers, but is there any look-alike Unicode character that could be substituted? It might be good to look for such look-alikes for all the syntactically-significant characters, which would be used like a non-breaking space substitutes for a space. Chuck Entz 18:45, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
 * There are some, yes — see mw:Help:Subpages — but that cure would be infinitely worse than the disease. —Ruakh TALK 18:56, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
 * The bug is still present at enwiki more than 10 years after it was brought up there, so that pages like w:Talk:OS/2 still have a "backlink" to w:Talk:OS. Soap (talk) 02:53, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
 * That's because it's not a bug. —Ruakh TALK 19:48, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

Concordance:Wikipedia
An editor has asked whether Wikipedia has a concordance of its own most-used words. This seems to me like a useful thing to create here, if we can do so. Obviously, since Wikipedia is in a constant state of flux, it would need to be date-specific. Cheers! bd2412 T 16:46, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Someone was reaping words common on WP that we don't have entries for. (That's not the same thing, of course, but I thought I'd mention.) I forget who, or where it is. —msh210℠ (talk) 19:10, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Haven't found it. bd2412 T 23:23, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

creole languages linking to the creole cat
Languages like Category:Greenlandic Eskimo Pidgin language are placed in the blue Category:Pidgins and creole languages, but link (in their descriptive text) to a nonexistant Category:Creole and pidgin languages. This is possibly Template:etyl:crp's fault, but I can't work out how. Can this be fixed, so that the descriptive-text link is also a blue link to Category:Pidgins and creole languages?
 * ✅ -- Liliana • 22:19, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Aha, thank you! And thanks for expanding the number of countries langcatboiler can handle a language being spoken in... I've started to fill up Category:Languages of the United States now, and have just about reached the old limit. :P - -sche (discuss) 22:29, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

Wiktionary trigraphs
Which language does ang stand for? Is there anywhere I can get a complete list of Wiktionary trigraphs (and digraphs)
 * -> Old English. You can find a complete list here: Category:Language templates. Maro 21:22, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

unpatrolled edits in own userspace
This edit showed up in Recentchanges as unpatrolled. I marked it as patrolled, but I thought all edits by users to their own userspace were supposed to be auto-marked as patrolled. - -sche (discuss) 01:28, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

 * No, currently only edits to [[Special:MyPage]] and [[Special:MyPage/Sandbox]], not edits to other subpages; see . But that can be changed quite easily, if so desired, by modifying [[MediaWiki:Gadget-PatrollingEnhancements.js]]. —Ruakh TALK 02:01, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Ah. That's a good point about promotional material. OTOH, there's no reason to think promotional material couldn't just be added to a /Sandbox page, so... I would favour extending protection to all userspace pages (or removing it entirely). - -sche (discuss) 03:16, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

Edits reverted, but still marked as unpatrolled
New question: this edit showed up as unpatrolled, although by the time I looked at it, it had (long) been reverted. Is it possible/practical to mark any reverted edit as patrolled? - -sche (discuss) 07:27, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I think that feature would be very useful too. It would also be nice if an edit were marked as patrolled if a patroller makes any further edits to the page, or perhaps just the sections that were edited before, with the assumption that if they made further changes, they also saw the edits and therefore agree with them. —CodeCat 13:36, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
 * de.Wikt's "Stabilversionen" (apparently an official Mediawiki feature) function that way: patrollers making edits to a page must specify if they don't want to mark it patrolled despite making a change. Patrollers can also simply approve the current version, which approves all revisions up to that point. However, that system also has the downside of not displaying the actual/current revision of a page until it's approved, which can be a long time. - -sche (discuss) 14:04, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

and WT:LOP
What would it take to enable to direct users to the subpages now at WT:LOP? Doing so would enable us to eat our cake and still have it, by letting us:
 * 1) keep new terms out of principal namespace until they met our standards,
 * 2) appear to be reasonably open to new terms, and
 * 3) discourage creation of full entries which then attract RfVs and RfDs.

We could even go so far as to set up a tickler system, based on a parameter in to remind us of when we might have hope of meeting the "spanning one year" requirement. DCDuring TALK 03:34, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Separate issue, as long as we're modifying : per Template talk:only in, let's simplify it to simply take the target (e.g. "w:Word" or "WT:LOP/Word") as a parameter, rather than the convolution it presently requires. - -sche (discuss) 03:39, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Could Conrad.Irwin have been trying to make the display consistent? How could we otherwise consistency of appearance? DCDuring TALK 04:11, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Set the text of to something like <tt>Wiktionary does not have a dictionary entry for this term. See | . Help us collect evidence of this word being used at Citations:X.</tt>? Or we could make it obvious that the link wasn't to a main-namespace place, <tt>...See  . Help...</tt> That would work for any link, whether to [[Appendix:whatever]], [[WT:LOP/whatever]], [[w:Whatever]]. - -sche (discuss) 06:31, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Would the shortcuts appear as shortcuts or expanded? DCDuring TALK 06:39, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * What do you mean by "shortcuts"? Viewers would see "w:Whatever" if they looked at the second code I suggested; they would only see "Whatever" (actually, PAGENAME) if they looked at the first code. - -sche (discuss) 06:43, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I was focused on the second approach because I think we want to have a match between what the link says and the landing page after clicking. I guess someone would have to type in List of protologisms/G-P to get within a couple of pgdns of the entry for "Linsanity". That looks ugly. And it doesn't really get the user very close, so that a new user might miss what we would have. I suppose diligent page maintenance (adding two- and three-letter section headings when required) would address the second concern. DCDuring TALK 07:06, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, we could make the person adding the template specify a long, 'piped' string like <tt>Wiktionary:List of protologisms/G-P#L|Linsanity</tt> (and <tt>w:Whatever|whatever</tt>, and <tt>Appendix:Things#W|whatever</tt>). The would produce something that didn't look ugly. It's a long string to put in, but I wouldn't mind it: it's still easier that the current mechanism, which requires users to remember and call different templates for different places. In fact, the more I think about it, the better I like it, letting the person adding the template specify exactly where the template should point and what the displayed link should say, all with just one template and one parameter. I would change the template right now, but I'm not sure how to not break existing uses of the template. - -sche (discuss) 09:05, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Would it work to have named parameters for the new options that bypassed the error-handling for the old? What about another template like or ? DCDuring TALK  15:17, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * A new template would be the easiest thing (although my ideal solution would be to switch all the existing uses with the aid of a bot). I think it'll be easy enough that even I can design it, and make it accept links to anywhere: WP, Appendices, LOP... now the question is, does anyone have any objection to linking to LOP? - -sche (discuss) 19:48, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I had been thinking that I should have gone to WT:BP first, but I was wanted to make sure that there wasn't some fatal flaw or that it would require a technically complicated solution. There might be some better idea, but at least it seems that there is a simple solution and no obvious problem. DCDuring TALK 19:54, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Whatever the desirability of changes or an alternative to, there seems to be an emerging consensus @ WT:RFM to move List of Protologisms and subpages to various "Appendix:lang code:List of protologisms" pages. DCDuring TALK 14:45, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

 * I've created, which can handle links to anywhere. (Even off-wiki webpages, I think, although I presume that's disallowed.) - -sche (discuss) 01:16, 28 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks. We might need it for unattestable terms in WT:Glossary. It might be desirable for terms that appear in Citations namespace, but not principal namespace. Gee, we could have many terms that are "only in" both LoP and Citations namespace. At the very least, the LoP entry and the Citations namespace entry for a word should link to each other. DCDuring TALK 01:40, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

Implementing Votes/pl-2009-03/Context labels in ELE v2
We voted to not link the display of context information and topical categorization. We have not implemented the change. To see the problem consider Category:en:Arithmetic. It contains such terms as odd, even, half, fraction, sum and more than a dozen others which clearly have senses that are not limited to an "arithmetic" usage context. Other terms are clearly so restricted, eg, rabdology, augend. Others may be more uncertain, eg, integer, divisor.

Though the fundamental problem is that the usage context labels should never have been used for the purpose of populating the topical categories, a simple solution is to edit each and every context label inserting a bit of code that allows a switch that suppresses the display by default. If a registered user wants to display topical contexts, they can do so by some appropriate preference selection. What say all? DCDuring TALK 17:14, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Be careful, the vote does only apply to context labels, not to categories. So manually adding is ok. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:38, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Of course. Though I think the implementation of topical categories is an arbitrary and closed process, it is not inherently wrong. DCDuring TALK 19:08, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * It's subjective, but isn't all human activity subjective? Mglovesfun (talk) 19:27, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm just an engineer (at heart) not a metaphysician. DCDuring TALK 19:55, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

http links in Mediawiki interface pages
Because Wiktionary can be accessed directly using https for some time now (without secure.wikimedia.org), a problem with interface (Mediawiki:) pages still including http:// links or which load pictures or scripts using http only has shown up (those should be replaced by links like //en.wiktionary.org/wiki/User:Hoo_man which are protocol relative). If Wiktionary gets accessed using https:// now, this can cause a security risk and annoying warnings might appear in some browsers. The problem has already been discussed on meta and I fixed all the smaller Wikimedia wikis. But we've decided to let the big wikis decide over that at their own. That can be resolved either by me, because of my global rights (if you reach consensus for that just contact me) or by a local administrator using pywikipedia with the following fixes.py extension (I've used it to fix all the smaller wikis, you can start the script then using python replace.py -fix:https -namespace:8 -start:MediaWiki:! -family:wiktionary -lang:en). All edits need to be reviewed per hand (sometimes manual fixes are required and sometimes fixes would break something). Because of that the admin who does that should know what he/ she does (Javascript and CSS knowledge is a must-have) - Hoo man (talk) 01:52, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

Redirect classes
Lately I notice .... appears in redirects from capitalized titles. Is this a bug, or is it something to do with my browser? I know it's not a big deal, most of those pages don't have any useful content, I just think if it's possible to change it should be changed. Soap (talk) 02:50, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Fixed, thanks. Previously the page-title appeared directly inside <h1> tags, but now it appears inside <span dir="auto"> tags within said. —Ruakh TALK 20:16, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

Using Template:l on rhymes instead of bare links
Could the template be used to link to rhymes on rhyme pages, instead of bare links? This will need some bot work to update and the script that adds the rhymes would need to be changed as well. —CodeCat 19:04, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Sounds good to me, but it would need to be used consistently. If it was only used on some rhymes pages it would break the alphabetizing system in the rhymes adding script. --Yair rand (talk) 22:17, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes that's why I'm discussing it here. If it's changed, it would have to be changed all in one go, or things will start breaking... —CodeCat 22:49, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
 * It's a good idea... don't ask me how to actually do it. Mglovesfun (talk) 23:05, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

Google books and quotes
The search seems to treat the quotes poorly; this used to work correctly. Any ideas how to fix it? --Dan Polansky (talk) 18:43, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

 * It's a bug in Google Books. I'm guessing they don't plan to fix it, because they haven't kept the books.google.com search interface up-to-date with the new interface that's more closely integrated with web search. So, I've changed (and hence ) to link to that new interface instead. —Ruakh TALK 20:25, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

Mass entry of words
I wonder if someone could guide me a little with this: I am trying to mass-enter a number of nouns with identical declinations into the Norwegian Wiktionary (my native W). I already have a handy template (called side) that creates all the necessary information when you want to create one word. A subst works fine. So opening a new entry I do like this:  no  and that word is created.

I have created a long list of words that do not have any definition. And a template that marks an entry as «entry to be checked for quality». These would take forever to enter manually one by one. I have no idea if one can build a template around another template that does this or if there is a specific javascript that does the trick. I am no programming expert but can read and understand templates as long as they aren't overly complicated... Any help would be welcome! --Teodor (talk) 21:03, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
 * no:template:side already includes and others; it can likewise include, can't it? Or am I misunderstanding your question? —msh210℠ (talk) 21:06, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, I think you are talking about the actual template. This works fine. I have my own template based on this one that does include some more information. What I am talking about is creating a routine that can create, say, 50 words at a time. If all words are of the same type I should get 50 new masculine nouns at the speed of one. I want to do this as a pilot to see if it is feasible to enter literally thousands of words very fast. This, however is something we won't do until we are sure we are all right with so many words lacking a definition. That still has to be entered manually I think. --Teodor (talk) 21:13, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I think I have been unclear about an important detail. The list I was referring to is from a public domain list of Norwegian words. These are currently not in the Norwegian Wiktionary, or washing the two databases is fairly simple. Copying these into Wiktionary and making entries for them is what I want to achieve :) --Teodor (talk) 21:18, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Assuming you get permission from the no.wikt community, I think you should create a bot account and run this as a bot. If you have a Perl interpreter, I can help you with this. —Ruakh TALK 21:28, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

 * Thanks for your offer to help. I assume I would get that kind of permission. I am probably the most active contributor there at the moment. But I am not familiar with bots and Perl. Does it take a lot of effort to get the knack of it? --Teodor (talk) 21:34, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

 * If you have programming experience, then it's pretty simple. If not, then . . . I don't know. I guess you can try it and see? —Ruakh TALK 21:53, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
 * You can also use Python instead if you prefer, using the pywikipediabot framework. My bot User:MewBot uses it too. —CodeCat 22:01, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

 * I have installed both Perl and Python and tried to suss out how to use these. Since I have very little programming experience I realise this would be a very tall order for me. So I won't try to learn them for the moment. But could someone tell me if it's possible to write a short programme which could batch submit some new articles based on a common template, a subst and a list of words to be created? I would appreciate if someone could give me a code I could try out with a few words. I could tehn post-correct these manually if anything went wrong. Best regards, --Teodor (talk) 23:44, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
 * If you e-mail me detailed information about the format of this list, and how to translate from that list-format to Wiktionary-entry-format, I can send you a Perl program to run. —Ruakh TALK 02:47, 28 February 2012 (UTC)
 * That is very kind of you. The list is at :no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmma and the template I intend to use is no, located at the Norwegian Wiktionary. Not sure how to link that template directly for you... That template marks an article as one that needs to be checked, as well as a number of other things, so it is okay to create a small number of articles for test purposes. However we need to discuss how to proceed before we start using it. If you write such a Perl programme I would appreciate it very much. If you are able to write comments to the places where I need to change templates etc that would also be excellent. I obviously need to use different templates for different word classes and declension styles.--Teodor (talk) 11:09, 28 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Ah, that's simpler than I expected. In that case, a JavaScript solution might be more convenient; you can follow these steps:
 * Create a preload template, say, no:Mal:preload-subst-sideteodorm1-no-sub, with the contents <tt> no </tt>.
 * Modify no:Bruker:Teodor605/common.js to do two things:
 * When you visit no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmma, it can go through all the redlinks and change their URLs from http:/ //no.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=...&action=edit&redlink=1 to http:/ //no.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=...&action=edit&redlink=1&preload=Mal:preload-subst-sideteodorm1-no-sub&save=instant
 * When you visit a URL of the form http:/ //no.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=...&action=edit&redlink=1&preload=Mal:preload-subst-sideteodorm1-no-sub&save=instant, it can automatically click the "Lagre siden" button.
 * Slowly go through the page, opening each appropriate redlink in a new browser tab.
 * Does that sound good to you? If so, I'm pretty sure I can put together the JavaScript you need. (I've done the same sort of thing on en.wikt before.)
 * —Ruakh TALK 12:40, 28 February 2012 (UTC)
 * This sounds good to me. I am just not sure if you wanted med to modify my common.js file before you start testing out a javaScript. I haven't modified an javascripts before; only copied other user javascripts to my own page (not really understanding the code).
 * Seems to me what you are suggesting is the same thing as what I have been doing previosuly, only without a script. I visit no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmma and then click on a redlink, paste <tt> no </tt> in the edit window and save. So 50 new entries takes me about 50 minutes. And that is before the real work of writing a definition, checking the etymology and writing any translation has even begun.
 * Feel free to do the necessary changes to my common.js page if you think that is wise. I can try out the javascript.
 * Before I start any mass production of entries I am going to discuss my experience with this apporach with the other contributors at the Norwegian Wiktionary. The no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmma list is very big, so I am dead scared to let any javascript run wild, thus creating thousands of new words lacking definitions. I would like to be able to excercise some control, like being able to decide if I want to do 1, 10, 50 or any specific number of new entries. Once again, thanks a million for you willingness to help! --Teodor (talk) 21:25, 29 February 2012 (UTC)
 * BTW the no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmma list is only one of several. It contains regular declension masculine nouns starting with ‹A›. There is one for all the others letters of too, and new lists for verbs, adjectives etc. Only these have not been uploaded yet. I need to be able to substitute no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmma with any other of these lists. Hope that isn't complicating things for you. --Teodor (talk) 21:36, 29 February 2012 (UTC)
 * If you copy the contents of no:Bruker:Ruakh/common.js and no:Bruker:Ruakh/common.css into no:Bruker:Teodor605/common.js and no:Bruker:Teodor605/common.css, you'll be set for no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmma. You should find it easy to create entries as quickly or as slowly as you want. (Or, nearly so.) After you've used that approach for a bit, you can decide for yourself whether you're happy with it, or whether you'd prefer to try the bot approach instead. —Ruakh TALK 22:29, 29 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, that looks beautiful! One entry takes just one click. I was thinking more like batch submissions, but this is blisteningly fast anyway. Thanks a lot!!! Now if I want to use this approach on no:Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank bmmb I understand I substitute that in the common.css. But if I want to use it simultaneously for many list, do I then just write several more if-statements, like
 * <tt> if(mediaWiki.config.get('wgPageName') != 'Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank_bmma') </tt>
 * <tt>  else if(mediaWiki.config.get('wgPageName') != 'Bruker:Teodor605/Ordbank_bmmb') </tt>
 * <tt> return; </tt>
 * Correct? Hope you can guide me through that last question too! --Teodor (talk) 23:12, 29 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Re: "One entry takes just one click. I was thinking more like batch submissions, but this is blisteningly fast anyway": I use Firefox, which lets me middle-click on a link to load it in a new tab in the background; so when I use this sort of interface, I can quickly load a dozen links at a time, then quickly go through and close those tabs. Does your browser not support that?
 * Re: using it simultaneously for many lists: I've modified no:Bruker:Ruakh/common.js to be more extensible in that respect.
 * —Ruakh TALK 00:39, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I see how you modified the common.js file. Think I know how to modify it further now. I use Firefox too, so I'll have to look into that. Didn't know one could... I usually right-click and choose "open in new tab", but your suggestion should be even faster. --Teodor (talk) 00:56, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

 * Are you using a Firefox plugin to be able to middle-click to open a link in a new tab? If so, which one? I tried to to this yesterday but I couldn't find any solution. --Teodor (talk) 09:00, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
 * No, no plugin; it's the default behavior. To verify it, open a new tab, navigate to <tt>about:config</tt>, and type the filter <tt>browser.tabs</tt>. The <tt>browser.tabs.opentabfor.middleclcik</tt> option and the <tt>browser.tabs.loadInBackground</tt> options should both be <tt>true</tt>. —Ruakh TALK 13:25, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

Vandalism
There seems to be some vandalism somewhere in regard to Navajo entries, but I can’t locate it. For example, the Navajo translation in goat says " ". At tłʼízí, under Noun it says " ". —Stephen (Talk) 15:38, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

 * I found it. The vandalism was in Template:nv/script. Fixed. —Stephen (Talk) 15:51, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

 * I have applied cascading protection to Wiktionary:Index to templates/languages/protection (warning: massive page!) and the pages of families and scripts it links to. At the moment, the protection is so high it prevents any non-admin from editing the pages. If a helpful IP wanted to add family info, that would be a problem, so other admins might consider reducing the protection to "block new and unreg users only". For now, I explained in the protection that users who need to edit the templates should comment at WT:ID. - -sche (discuss) 19:25, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

 * It's okay. If someone wants to change these, they can come here or to the BP. -- Liliana • 22:38, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

title: Wiktionary:Grease pit/2012/February


text:
User talk:KYPark/갈

갈
the term 갈 in the article 칼 is maybe wrong info. i can't find it at amy dictionary. have you any souce to prove it? and if you are korean, please answer in korean. i'm net good at english.. 210.205.40.75 12:49, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

 * '갈'은 '칼'의 옛말 맞습니다 맞고요. 옛말이 많이 실린 사전을 찾아 보시기 바랍니다. 예컨대
 * 금성교과서(주) '뉴에이스 국어사전'은 작아도 쓸만하고,
 * 교학사 '교학 고어사전'은 더욱 쓸만합니다.

 * 인터넷에서 손쉬운 국립국어원의 표준국어사전에는 예컨대 갈(刀)도 뫼(山)도 안나옵니다.

 * 갈치

 * ``우리에게 친숙한 생선인 `칼치`는 `갈치`가 바른 말이다. [...] 방언으로 널리 쓰이고 있는 `칼치`는 그 모습이 칼처럼 생겼다 해서 한자로 도어(刀魚)라 불리기도 한다. `칼(刀)`의 옛말 `갏`에서 `ㅎ`이 탈락한 뒤 물고기나 물고기 이름을 나타내는 접미사 `치(넙치.날치.꽁치.버들치)`가 붙어 만들어진 `갈치`가 표준어 자리를 차지하고 있다.`` [출처 : 중앙일보] --KYPark 14:08, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Finnish translations deleted
See : User_talk:Hekaheka

--KYPark 12:17, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

title: User talk:KYPark/갈