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Space Patrol (1950 TV series)

Space Patrol is an American science fiction adventure series set in the 30th century that was originally aimed at juvenile audiences via television, radio, and comic books. It was broadcast on ABC from March 1950 to February 1955. It soon developed a sizable adult audience, and by 1954 the program consistently ranked in the top 10 shows broadcast on a Saturday.

Premise
The stories followed the 30th-century adventures of Commander-in-Chief Buzz Corry (Ed Kemmer) of the United Planets Space Patrol and his young sidekick Cadet Happy (Lyn Osborn), as they faced interplanetary villains with diabolical schemes.

The show was targeted to children, but attracted a sizable adult audience. Many episodes featured commercial tie-in merchandise, like toys and mail-order premiums, that were advertised during commercial breaks. Many of the ads for corporate sponsor Ralston Purina's Chex cereals used the show's space opera motif in their pitches. A unique feature of the TV and radio adventures was that the premium of the month was often worked into the story action. This permitted young viewers to feel that they were participating in the radio or televised adventures. Space Patrol's best known premium was a "Name the Planet" contest wherein the winner was awarded the program's Terra IV spaceship. The prize was a giant trailer in the shape of the series' space craft. One of the many "Name the Planet" commercials may be viewed online.

The program sponsored a Space Patrol club, which viewers could join. Continuing merchandise tie-ins perpetuated the connection, producing such a sizable following that many of the nation's magazines chronicled the phenomenon. Many, but not all, of the 30-minute TV episodes are still currently available in various video/ DVD formats.

Radio series
The radio version ran from 4 October 1952 to 19 March 1955, for 129 episodes. The same cast performed on both shows. The writers, scripts, and directors were reused between the radio and TV incarnations, but the radio broadcasts were not limited by studio sets and became more expansive in scope than the television programs. Although there was seldom any deliberate crossing-over of storylines, some of the television villains regularly appeared on the radio (notably Prince Bacarratti), and during the "Planet X" story, both the TV and radio versions explored the rogue planet's invasion of the Space Patrol universe.

While the radio series lacked the sophistication of sci-fi shows like the later X Minus One, it was enjoyed as a throwback to the Golden Age of space opera popularized in the 1930s by pioneering magazine editor Hugo Gernsback. Only 117 of the original broadcasts survive. 97 are on the OTR site and a few others on torrent sites.

Main

 * Ed Kemmer as Commander-in-Chief Edward "Buzz" Corry – Corry is the senior officer of the Space Patrol whose assigned task including clearing the space lanes and maintaining peace in the galaxy. As the series continued, his mission expanded to exploring the outer regions of intergalactic space and time.
 * Lyn Osborn as Cadet Happy Osborn – Osborn is a graduate of the Space Patrol's Space Academy who is given an initial training assignment as cadet and aide to Commander Corry.
 * Virginia Hewitt as Carol Carlisle – Carlisle is the daughter of the Secretary General of the United Planets who works in both an administrative and scientific capacity at the United Planets' Headquarters.
 * Ken Mayer as Maj. Robbie Robertson – Robertson is the Security Chief of the Space Patrol and friend and fellow adventurer with Commander Corry.
 * Nina Bara as Tonga – Tonga had been a villain in earlier episodes known as The Lady of Diamonds. She is converted from the "dark side" and became the Chief Assistant to Major Robertson and a valuable ally of the Space Patrol.
 * Bela Kovacs as Prince Baccarratti, and other villains and characters appearing in the series – However, it is his portrayal as Bacarratti or the "black falcon" for which he is probably best remembered. He is also Associate Producer for 16 episodes.
 * Norman Jolley as Agent X – Agent X is one of the original recurring arch villains in the series. Jolley is also the "chief writer" for the show and served double duty.
 * Marvin Miller as Mr. Proteus – Mr. Proteus was a popular recurring villain who could assume many disguises making him extremely difficult to capture.
 * Paul Cavanagh as The Secretary General of the United Planets – He is the chief executive for the government of the United Planets. Commander Corry reported directly to him.
 * Glen Denning as Commander Kit Corry – the original star, Denning was replaced by Ed Kemmer very early in the series (after about 25 episodes). Kit Corry is Buzz's older brother and original "Commander-in-Chief" of the Space Patrol.

Recurring
Space Patrol hired many actors who later became well known in their own right. The episodes included such personalities as Ray Bolger, Gene Barry, Bill Baldwin, Lee Van Cleef, I. Stanford Jolley, Robert Shayne, William Schallert, Richard Devon, Carleton Young and Ed Nelson. The following cast members are some of those actors who appeared in multiple episodes:

 * Ben Welden as Johnson (9 episodes, 1952–54)
 * Joel Smith as Android (8 episodes, 1952–55)
 * Tom McKee as Ahyo (7 episodes, 1953–54)
 * Lawrence Dobkin as Marco (7 episodes, 1953–55)
 * Morgan Shaan as Axel (6 episodes, 1953–54)
 * Fred Howard as Andrews (6 episodes, 1951–53)
 * Richard Karlan as Captain Dagger (5 episodes, 1953–54)
 * Valerie Bales as Yula (4 episodes, 1955)
 * Bill Baldwin as Barti (4 episodes, 1951–54)
 * Jack Reitzen as Keller (4 episodes, 1951–53)
 * Lee Van Cleef as Herrick (4 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Charles Horvath as Corporal (4 episodes, 1952–55)
 * Bob Carson as Governor Willis (4 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Charles Victor as Dr. Jerry Taylor (4 episodes, 1953–55)
 * William Justine as Benjamin (4 episodes, 1953–54)
 * Robert Shayne as Groata (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Joel Marston as Bill Redrow (3 episodes, 1952–54)
 * Norbert Schiller as Bit (3 episodes, 1953–55)
 * I. Stanford Jolley as Dr. Lambert (3 episodes, 1953–54)
 * Oliver Blake as Ezekial Martin (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Dorothy Ford as Queen Riva (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Henry Corden as Brooks (3 episodes, 1951–53)
 * Jack Brown as Josiah (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Gail Bonney as Goodwife Martin (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Peter Mamakos as Herrick (3 episodes, 1951–52)
 * Ward Wood as Farlon (3 episodes, 1951–52)
 * John Alderson as Bolen (3 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Frederic Berest as Bender (3 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Stephen Chase as Sloan (3 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Leo V. Matranga as Freddie (3 episodes, 1952)
 * William Boyett as Guard (3 episodes, 1953)
 * Joe Cranston as Guard (3 episodes, 1953)
 * Gabriel Curtiz as Dr. Gruber (3 episodes, 1953)
 * Anne Dore as Letha (3 episodes, 1953)
 * Frances Farwell as Calva (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Hannes Lutz as Doctor Kurt (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Gloria Pall as Zamba (3 episodes, 1954)
 * Kurt Katch as Arachna (3 episodes, 1955)
 * Carleton Young as Gen. Narda (2 episodes, 1954)
 * Alvy Moore as Ferris Macklin (2 episodes, 1951–52)
 * Lisa Howard as Lisa (2 episodes, 1951)
 * Keith Larsen as Bradford (2 episodes, 1952)
 * Paul Guilfoyle as Brunner (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * George Pembroke as Carl Marsden (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Jerry O'Sullivan as Hefler (2 episodes, 1952)
 * Bert Holland as The General (2 episodes, 1955)
 * John Larch as Korwin (2 episodes, 1953–54)
 * Pierce Lyden as Chaney (2 episodes, 1951–55)
 * Jerry Sheldon as Bit (2 episodes, 1951–55)
 * William E. Green as Pop Stanton (2 episodes, 1951–53)
 * Richard Bartlett as Harris (2 episodes, 1951–52)
 * Maurice Hill as Capt. Hayward (2 episodes, 1951–52)
 * William Schallert as Craig (2 episodes, 1951–52)
 * Jean Howell as Nurse (2 episodes, 1952–54)
 * Jan Arvan as Kruse (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Phil Chambers as Forman (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Thomas Browne Henry as Holliday (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Bruce Payne as Breckrenridge (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Dan Seymour as Kovel (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * Roland Varno as Doc (2 episodes, 1952–53)
 * George Douglas as Bit (2 episodes, 1953–55)
 * Marshall Bradford as Perry (2 episodes, 1953)
 * Michael Colgan as Fredericks (2 episodes, 1953)
 * Gene Roth as Cole (2 episodes, 1953)
 * Ed Nelson as Guard (2 episodes, 1954–55)
 * Ed Hinton as Tyler (2 episodes, 1954)
 * Jack Lynn as Guard (2 episodes, 1954)
 * Lloyd Taylor as Bookstore Clerk (2 episodes, 1954)
 * Richard Devon as Molak (4 episodes, 1950)

Production
Space Patrol was the first West Coast morning network program broadcast to the East Coast, via a massive network of cable and electronic interchanges. The program was televised from the original soundstage where the Lon Chaney motion picture Phantom of the Opera had been filmed. The "Phantom Stage" was one of the largest TV stages in Hollywood, and made a great home for Space Patrol. While other televised science fiction programs such as Captain Video and Tom Corbett, Space Cadet used smaller sound stages, Space Patrol sets grew larger and larger. The studio had catwalks high above the stage that were used for many of the scenes, especially those requiring large castle-like sets. Likewise, cast members could be suspended in "space" outside their spacecraft without the problems of studio cramping.

Space Patrol's creator was William "Mike" Moser, a World War II veteran United States naval aviator. In frequent interviews such as one given to Time magazine in March 1952, Moser stated that he developed the series idea while flying across the Pacific. He was determined to create a children's television program that was as exciting to them as Buck Rogers and Flash Gordon had been to him during his youth. Moser took his idea to KECA-TV, a local Los Angeles ABC station. They bought the concept and Space Patrol began airing in March 1950.

Glen Denning was originally cast in the lead as Commander-in-Chief Kit Corry and comedian Lyn Osborn as the youthful sidekick Cadet Happy. Denning had continual problems remembering lines and delivering them and was replaced after about 25 episodes. War hero Ed Kemmer, a graduate of the Pasadena Playhouse, was his replacement. Denning most likely didn't mind leaving the show, as each cast member was paid only $8 per episode (by 1952, however, the show's budget had increased to $25,000 a week and by 1954 Lyn Osborn's salary alone had increased to around $900 a week.) Osborn, like Kemmer, studied at the Playhouse and had introduced Kemmer to Mike Moser. Kemmer's seriousness and military bearing brought a maturity to the role that helped to increase the popularity of the series.

Both the 30-minute and 15-minute programs were performed and broadcast live. If a line was flubbed or an accident happened, the actors recovered as quickly as possible and soldiered on. The pressure of memorizing lines for a new live 15-minute show every day (Monday through Friday) was onerous enough, but became even more burdensome when the 30-minute weekly Saturday show was added beginning Dec. 30, 1950. Around this time, Moser began sharing the writing chores with Norman Jolley. The actors' tasks were increasingly difficult because they faced the complexity of coordinating their on-camera movements with intricate special effects, which also had to be created live and in real-time. For example, pistols that shot invisible rays necessitated pre-positioning small electrically wired explosive charges on the surface they were supposed to strike. An actor would aim the prop ray gun at that location and squeeze the trigger, whereupon a special effects worker off-scene would throw the detonation switch.

A practical videotape system was not available until after Space Patrol's run, so for distribution to distant stations the image on a small, bright TV monitor was filmed using a motion picture camera with a specially modified and synchronized shutter mechanism, creating kinescope recordings on 16 mm or 35 mm film. Most of the Saturday half-hour TV broadcasts survived in this form and so are still available today. The 15-minute weekday version of the program was at first seen mainly in the Los Angeles broadcast area, but was later also seen nationwide by syndication via kinescope films.

When Mike Moser was killed in a car accident in 1954, his wife Helen became executive producer and Bela Kovacs was appointed associate producer. Moser's plans for another, more adult-oriented sci-fi series called Report to Earth never came to fruition as the result of his sudden death. After the Russians launched Sputnik, "Space Patrol" was hurriedly syndicated under the title Satellite Police, with new titles and credits spliced onto the kinescopes.

Broadcast
The Space Patrol television show began broadcasting March 9, 1950, as a Monday-through-Friday 15-minute show on the American Broadcasting Company (ABC) owned-and-operated Los Angeles station, KECA (now KABC-TV). On December 30, 1950, ABC added a half-hour version of the program to its Saturday schedule. It became an overnight sensation, and the new weekly show and the 15-minute shows continued concurrently on a local basis. It was seen via kinescope syndication in other cities. A 1953 30-minute episode was the subject of the first U.S. experimental 3D television broadcast on April 29 in Los Angeles on KECA (since renamed KECA-TV).

The series made history by being the first regular live West Coast morning network program beamed to the East Coast. At the time, it took an intricate network of cable and relay stations to accomplish this enormous task.

The ABC television Space Patrol broadcasts became one of the nation's first mass media phenomena, and an ABC radio companion series was developed. The radio program was also popular and ran from September 18, 1950 until March 19, 1955 producing 129 thirty-minute episodes.

The televised Space Patrol aired continuously until July 2, 1954; after a short break, it reappeared on September 4, 1954, before finally disappearing from the air on February 26, 1955. 210 half-hour shows and close to 900 15-minute shows were made over Space Patrol's 5-year run. The sponsors included Purina/Ralston and Nestles.

Despite the American series being nearly a decade old, when a similarly themed UK children's puppet series also titled Space Patrol was syndicated to America in the early 1960s, it had to be retitled Planet Patrol so as to avoid confusion.

Records
There were at least two records available in the early 1950s, featuring "prequel" situations involving Commander Corry and Cadet Happy, and starring the radio/TV cast, although the 'origin' story for Cadet Happy contradicted both the 15-minute and 30-minute TV show versions.

Columbia Gramaphone (Aust) Pty. Ltd released a 78 record in the 1950s KO1015, Space Patrol Adventures No.1 of a series, "Cadet Happy Joins Commander Corry". Happy wins the Corry Scholarship and is then practically adopted by Commander Corry to train as his aide on the side of right and justice. It is based in the 31st century. Buzz Corry is played by Ed Kemmer, Cadet Happy by Lyn Osborn, Gaff Carter by Roy Engel, and Carol Carlyle by Virginia Hewitt; the narrator is Dick Tufeld, and the Control Tower voice is Norman Jolley.

Books, comic books, and other publications
A comic book tie-in, Space Patrol, published by Ziff-Davis in 1952, ran two issues. It featured cover paintings by Norman Saunders and Clarence Doore. Bernard Krigstein illustrated the scripts by Phil Evans. The comics retail for about $1,000 each today in high grade condition.

Unlike Tom Corbett, Space Cadet, Space Patrol was never featured in a daily or Sunday newspaper comic strip, nor was there a series of juvenile novels recounting Space Patrol adventures.

Jean-Noel Bassior authored an extensive book in 2005 titled Space Patrol: Missions of Daring in the Name of Early Television. The book from McFarland & Company, Inc., Publishers was well received and created new interest in the television and radio show.

There was a three-issue Space Patrol comic book series in the early 1990s which purported to be of the TV series, but whose writer and artist admitted they had never seen the show. This adaptation suffered greatly because of this.

Legacy
Actor Ed Kemmer attended many of the important film festivals during the late 90s and early 2000s and discovered a renewed Space Patrol popularity that continued up until the time of his death in 2004. The emergence of electronic media during the 1990s permitted a greater interchange of Space Patrol merchandise that heretofore had been closely held by collectors. This stimulated new interest and, in turn, production of new publications and merchandise for Space Patrol fans. A rather extensive book written by Jean Noel Bassior furthered interest in the series, as did the production of a new set of Space Patrol trading cards, replicas of the program's space craft, clocks, jackets and other period paraphernalia.

The original space ship prop control panel sold at auction in 2014 for $23,000.

Further listening

 * OTR Network Library: Space Patrol (97 episodes)

title: Space Patrol (1950 TV series)


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User talk:Morwen/archive1

Arrival
Welcome Morwen,

You have done a good job so far in Wikipedia (a.k.a. 'Pedia or WP). I can see that you're a serious Wikipedian interested in improving our project. If you stay for a while, you'll discovered that collectively, we're a cooperative and friendly community. We are all here to learn, and hopefully can give something back. If you have questions or doubts of any sort, do not hesitate to post them on the Village Pump, somebody will respond ASAP. Other helpful pages include:
 * How does one edit a page
 * Manual of style
 * Naming conventions

Just keep in mind that while relevant discussions and constructive criticisms and are welcome, anything unproductive and/or destructive in nature is not (see Wikiquette). Most importantly, we do not tolerate discrimination of any kind.

Who knows? Perhaps you'll soon become a Wikipediholic and make it into the list of Most active Wikipedians! :-) --Menchi 09:38, Aug 2, 2003 (UTC)

 * Hi, thanks for the welcome. I'm just settling in atm, but enjoying myself so far. Morwen

Hi! Nice work keeping a watch on the Tamil articles. Unfortunately jingoism is pandemic in Tamil land. The supposed oldness of the language, in particular, is a central theme of both political rhetoric and mainstream religious dogma, and the combination is particularly deadly! The other day someone told me with a perfectly straight face that Tamil is "billions" of years old :) If you suspect NPOV in any India-related articles in general, but aren't too sure yourself, feel free to drop me or Paddu a note. Thanks -- Arvindn 08:27, 18 Aug 2003 (UTC)

 * Thanks very much - I reacted without thinking much and was later quite worried about how I had handled it, but I figured the other person was quite unlikely to listen to reason and bluntness was called for. ;) -- Morwen.

Morwen, please do not added smart quotes or curved apostrophes to pages like you did on HMS Victory it is not a Wikipedia style convention. See: Manual_of_style. Thanks. Alex756 19:06, 14 Sep 2003 (UTC)

 * Alex, please do not accuse people of things they didn't do like you did it is not nice. See: http://www.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=HMS_Victory&diff=1433186&oldid=1432455
 * You will note all I did there was make change a blah's which was nasty to
 * the nice blah ' s. I can assure you that no curved apostrophes were used at all.
 * Thanks, Morwen.
 * Thanks, Morwen.
 * Thanks, Morwen.

Well, it is hard to see why you would do that in any case. It looked to me like a curved apostrophe which sometimes gets converted into something weird if you don't put it in with the nowiki codes. I have already ordered new glasses; I just haven't had time to pick them up in the last few weeks. Please do not take it personally, it just did not occur to me that someone would do that in such a complicated way. Please, it was just an honest mistake. Don't take it personally. I hope you accept my apology for the misreading. But putting in the apostrophe as you did would not be my obvious first choice. Did you try HMS Victorys giving one: HMS Victorys. That would work with emphasis and italics. With the plain italics I guess the alternative is a little better: HMS Victorys resulting in: Victorys which gives on the italicized apostrophe unlike your attempt in which the apostrophe is not italicized (I guess that is what you were trying to do, no?). Once again forgive me for misreading your error. Alex756 03:57, 15 Sep 2003 (UTC)

 * Ok. I didn't know a better way to do it, but I did know that way worked ;). My summary was even something to the effect of "is there a cleaner way to do this?". Thanks for telling me what it is.

 * You are welcome. You also taught me a valuable lesson. I hope you stay a valuable contributor for a long time. Alex756

Hello Morwen, RE: your comments on county terms: when talking of ' administrative "counties" ' I have consistently put "county" in parentheses with a lower-case "C" in order to (correctly) emphasize the fact tha these entities are "counties" only by name - in the same way, perhaps, as the fins of a lungfish might be called "legs" but certainly not legs. This wasn't intended to in any way harm the neutrality of the article, but simply differentiate between true Counties and administrative entities that are not true Counties (and indeed which the government have repeatedly stated are not true Counties). I'm sure you can see that leaving out the quotation marks could give the misleading impression that administrative "counties" are of "equally validity and stature" to true Counties, and this is manifestly not the case - the latter are simply administrative boundaries which have been labeled "counties" for want of a better term. I certainly don't believe this could be contrued as bias. However, I don't mind using the term "administrative counties" if you still contest the above. Regarding Counties with a captial C - I believe this is justified because "The Counties" is a proper noun, whereas "the administrative counties" certainly isn't! Best regards, 80.255 16:37, 7 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Much as I would be more than happy to debate in detail both the status and practical value (of the greatest importance today) of the 39 Counties as opposed to their historically insignificant blind ally (administtritive "counties"), I don't think it would be of much value in this discussion. The term "the Counties" is certainly treated as a propper noun by a very great number of people, not simply polemicists for the County system; finding examples of this at the drop of a hat is easier said than done, but I can attempt to do so if you don't accept it.

However, I will suggest what I consider to be a happy medium in the way that this matter is treated in articles. Since the term "administrative county" is basically government jargon, it is most justified to put it in quotation marks, quite apart from the fact that these "counties" are not counties, but that isn't relevant to this line of argument. The capitalisation of County in the geographical sense, in addition to its propper noun status I mentioned above, serves to further distiguish it from its administrative (poor!) relation. Whatever your your views on the matter, I'm sure you'd agree that different definitions of the term "county" should be clearly deliniated to avoid possible confusion.

Therefore, I would suggest something along the formula of: "xyz town is in the historic County of Suchandsuch and the "administrative county"/UAA/"metropolitan administrative county" of Such-and-such."

Of course, your beloved "administrative counties" change their boundaries every time the wind direction changes, so the above may need to be more involved, e.g. "xyz town is in the historic County of Suchandsuch. It was formerlly in the "administrative metrolpolitan county" of Thisandthat, but following the local government act of 1998 it has been administered as part of the "administrative county" of This-and-that."

I would consider this both an accurate representation of the truth, and a non-biased one at that. Any thoughts? Best regards, 80.255 21:41, 7 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Very well: If County with a captial C is taken to mean Historic County, then (although it pains me too!) I'll refrain from parenthesizing bearocratic jargon terms such as "administrative county". Even so, I think the presence of quotation marks in that case helps dispell ambiguity, but I'm willing to compromise if you'll accept it. 129.234.4.10 22:15, 7 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Pronunciation of Windsor
Hi, as someone who used to live there I would definitely not pronounce it "winzer". More like "Wind-ser" the way I say it (Essex accent) though possibly "win-za" with a Thames Valley accent. Have you noticed David Martland has also commented on it on my talk page? Perhaps it's best to leave it out or to say that "winzer" is how Americans would pronounce it (if you think that is the case). Angela 14:06, Oct 26, 2003 (UTC)
 * I just checked my dictionary and that says wInZ@ so maybe that is the official way of saying it. Not how I'd say it though. I'm not too keen on putting in sampa translations anyway. That would seem more the function of a dictionary rather than an encyclopædia. Angela
 * Americans aren't the only ones who'd say 'winzer'. So would I and I'm from Gloucestershire. You can't take local dialect as a guide here. Bristolians pronounce their town 'bristaw' but no pronunciation guide (except a local dialect one) would give that as correct. I suspect most would go for whatever is commonest usage in southern England as a whole. Chris Jefferies

History of British Socialism
Just saw your comments on Talk:History of British Socialism. Good luck with the original author of that piece; he has a lot to learn about NPOV. Fortitude! -- Viajero 13:23, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

I saw you're comments, what do you make of this "historic counties" business?, I think the whole notion that historic counties "still exist" in any meaningful form is utterly silly myself G-Man 22:26, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

geography headers.
Morwen, please understand why the headers cannot be as you like them. with the headers in that format, it aligns the country names all the way to the left, confusing the alphabetization of the overall page. Kingturtle 11:15, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

geography headers.
Morwen, please understand why the headers cannot be as you like them. with the headers in that format, it aligns the country names all the way to the left, confusing the alphabetization of the overall page. Kingturtle 11:16, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

 * What I am referring to is the alphabetization of the overall categories. For example, if you look at version, the categories read: Education, Environment, Feminism, Food, Games, Gardens, Geography, Government, etc. In version , the categories read: Education, Environment, Feminism, Food, Games, Gardens, Geography, Afghanistan, Australia, Canada, Greece, etc.

 * Do you see the difference? Kingturtle 11:24, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

 * This was the last version with your formatting: . As you can see, in spite of the slight difference, the alignment still fools the viewer. Kingturtle 11:33, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

 * Looking good! Kingturtle 11:42, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

Administrative Counties of Scotland
Whilst it is true that there are traditional counties of Scotland, the newer unitary authorities that have existed since 1995 have NEVER been referred to as counties. Therefore I don't believe your new article on that subject is valid. Maybe you should delete it and re-list as Unitary Authorities of Scotland, although I think an article already exists.

JDH

Administrative Counties of Scotland Part Two
Hi Morwen,

See you made the changes. Don't mean to keep on about this, but I don't think the term county was even used up until 1995. In 1975 Local Government was reorganised into a two tier system of Regional and District Councils.

Therfore I think the term county died in Scotland in '75. Do not think either regions or districts were ever referred to as administrative councils, so I don't think it is even useful as a redirect article title.

Could be wrong, but don't think so.

JDH

Of course I mean I don't think regions or districts were ever referred to as administrative counties rather than administrative councils. :o)

JDH

Morwen,

Just to let you know that it is me that's being a pain in the arse about the Scottish counties stuff. Just set up an account so you can direct comments to me at my user talk page.

User:Big Jim Fae Scotland

Hi Morwen,

A bit of a coincidence, and the first time it's happened to me in 3 months or more on Wikipedia - I started an article on Bicester as nothing existed, and then when I came to save it - you'd already made one! :-)

Chris Jefferies

More counties!
Hi Morwen, I see you did a small change to Flintshire this evening. I wouldn't bother doing any minor changes to the Welsh county articles if I were you -- despite 80.255's protestations about "historic counties" that argument is total **** as far as Wales is concerned, the 13 old counties were scrapped in 1974 and 11 of the names were recycled in 1996 with little commonality of area. I've put a few comments on Talk:Flintshire to say why the article is crap :)

-- Arwel 20:29, 6 Nov 2003 (UTC)

Regarding Administrative counties of England. Although the East Sussex County Council and the West sussex County council were established in the 1888 act, the single county of Sussex remained until 1974. The county town of Sussex remained at Chichester for most of this period. I am a collector of Pears Cyclopaedias, and the 1948 edition lists the county town of Sussex as Lewes, whilst all previous editions show it as Chichester. I've not yet discovered how and why this should be. Mintguy 12:09, 7 Nov 2003 (UTC)

Argh! Ruthin is the county town of the CURRENT Denbighshire. It was also the administrative centre of the old county of Denbighshire (county offices built in 1904, if I remember the plaque properly, currently being demolished and replaced by a flash and expensive new set of offices) but the county town if you're going back beyond 1888 was Denbigh! -- Arwel 12:27, 7 Nov 2003 (UTC)

AAAAGGGHHH Morwen, every time I go to put something on the Northern Ireland Women's Coalition article I lose it cos you are changing it at the same time. I've lost a lot of text twice now. Cannot be arsed trying again, oh well ho hum. :o( And all this after I helped you with the counties of Scotland too! Big Jim Fae Scotland

Don't worry about it Morwen, I wiz only kidding. :op

I'll probably put some stuff on the article later.

Big Jim Fae Scotland

Some useful resources
Hi there Morwen I've noticed you've been making lots of articles about towns etc so I've found some websites which you might fing useful:

 * http://www.world-gazetteer.com/fr/fr_gb.htm

This website list the population figures for towns/cities in the UK: Most of them are, but unfortunately not all of the figures are accurate, so it's probably best to double check.

 * http://www.aboutbritain.com/TownsAllRegions.asp

This website has detailed information about a fair number of towns. Which you might like to incorporate into some articles. There I hope that's of help G-Man 22:44, 7 Nov 2003 (UTC)

Re: Coventry. I've found out something which you might find potentially interesting. Apparently Coventry ceased to be a county in it's own right in 1847, when it's county status was revoked by the "Boundary act of 1847"

see here http://homepage.ntlworld.com/robert.orland/cov/main.html

I've tried to find out more about this boundary act but with little success. However if other counties have been abolished by this legislation, it would rather ruin the "traditional counties" brigade's arguments about the surposed unchanging/untouchable nature of the traditional counties. G-Man 18:37, 9 Nov 2003 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:Morwen/archive1


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Bigot (surname)

Bigot is a French surname. Notable people with the name include:

 * Alexandre Bigot (1862–1927), French ceramicist
 * Antoine Bigot (1825–1897), French writer, poet, and translator in Occitan
 * Bernard Bigot (1950–2022), French physicist and chemist
 * Christophe Bigot (born 1965), French diplomat
 * Claude Bigot de Sainte-Croix (1744–1803), French Foreign Minister
 * Eugène Bigot (1888–1965), French composer and conductor
 * François Bigot (1703–1778), French government official
 * François Bigot (royal notary) (1643–1708), notary royal of New France
 * Fred Bigot, French musician better known as Electronicat
 * Georges Ferdinand Bigot (1860–1927), French cartoonist, illustrator and artist
 * Guillaume Bigot (1502– c. 1550), French writer, doctor, and poet
 * Jacques Bigot (Jesuit) (1651–1711), French Jesuit priest and missionary in Canada
 * Jacques Bigot (politician) (born 1952), French politician
 * Jacques-Marie-Frangile Bigot (1818–1893), French naturalist and entomologist
 * Joseph Bigot (1807–1894), French architect
 * Jules Bigot (1915–2007), French footballer
 * Marie Bigot (1786–1820), French musician and composer
 * Marthe Bigot (1878–1962), French schoolteacher, feminist, pacifist, and communist
 * Paul Bigot (1870–1942), French architect
 * Quentin Bigot (born 1992), French athlete
 * Sébastien-François Bigot (1706–1781), French soldier, sailor and naval tactician
 * Trophime Bigot (1579–1650), French Baroque painter
 * Vincent Bigot (1649–1720), French Jesuit priest and missionary in Canada

title: Bigot (surname)


text:
User talk:Daniel C. Boyer/Archive 4

Discussion over who created the article.

It seems many consider Daniel was the main creator of all Daniel C. Boyer related articles, and Tim Starling may have been the primary creator of the main article, by consolidating Daniel dispersed articles in a big central one. Daniel participated to the article on him as well. Many editors seem to consider Daniel was the real creator.

Mbecker indicates that accepting the article would create a precedent and defacto lead others to create vanity article as well.

Kosebamse is opposed to vanity pages.

See Wikipedia Talk:Auto-biography

Opening the floodgates
A note on GWO's suggestion above: I think that if this article is not deleted, it should definitely be mentioned (since it is about him) that there was a huge controversy on wikipedia about whether or not he should be allowed to create an article about himself. Then mention that this provides precedent for others to do the same. (Open up the flood gates ;) MB 15:46, Jul 31, 2003 (UTC)

 * Boyer didn't create this article. As Tim has told you already. Check out this edit by Tim, in which he stubs it.
 * Boyer has edited it, and has created other related articles, and has added links to it. But Tim Starling created this article.
 * Got it? :) Martin 18:16, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

 * I didn't say THIS article, I said AN article. This article was essentially created by him, b/c it was a consolidation of many other articles he created about himself.  So by AN article, I meant any and all articles he started about himself.  Is that clear enough?  MB 18:34, Jul 31, 2003 (UTC)

 * Much clearer.
 * Mind you, the current version is as much the work of Kat as anyone... Martin

Deletion
In light of the ongoing and fragmented discussion, how shall we best make a decision on whether or not to delete the page? Kat 19:56, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

 * I suggest we postpone the decision and focus on finding a general policy about pages like this one. Once that's achieved, we'll have a guideline for Boyer's page. I seem to recall there was some initial discussion on a page of its own yesterday, but I don't remember the name. My vote for such a policy is clear: eradicate the vanity pages (see my comments on what is now Talk:Daniel C. Boyer/Archive 3). Kosebamse 20:30, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

 * I believe you are referring to Wikipedia Talk:Auto-biography. Somewhere there must be a conversation about the 1000 person test and other article appropriateness tests, though I know not where. Kat 20:44, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

 * That's the page I was thinking of. I'll add my thoughts there. Kosebamse 21:38, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

 * The autobiographical roots of the article, and the related articles, is only part of the trouble. In fact, I think there is a fairly wide consensus that an accurate, relevant, NPOV, well-referenced article about Boyer would be welcomed, or at least tolerated--despite Boyer's involvement with the article.  It is for this reason that I made my earlier edits to the article.  It is becoming clear that arriving at an accurate, relevant, NPOV, well-referenced article is going to be difficult, at best; maintaining such an article may prove equally difficult.  In that light, perhaps the decision need not be postponed until the Wikipedia Talk:Auto-biography matter is resolved. Kat 04:03, 1 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Daniel Quinlan: Earlier in this discussion, Martin stated that "Boyer didn't create this article". On Talk:Daniel C. Boyer/Archive 2, Tim Starling stated:"I think it went something like this: In Feb 2002, 141.219.44.92 created Daniel C. Boyer as a one sentence stub. In March 2002, it was moved to User:Daniel C. Boyer by user:Stephen Gilbert, by cutting, pasting and manually redirecting. Daniel expanded the user page. In April 2003, I replaced the redirect with a 5 sentence stub. Daniel then greatly expanded it, and started his campaign of increasing his visibility in Wikipedia by whatever means possible." 141.219.44.92 is a machine named patpc4.lib.mtu.edu located at Michigan Technological University in Michigan, US; User:Daniel C. Boyer has been edited by these class C subnets (this only shows the times when editing was done by someone not logged in):

 * That another article was created over a year ago and swiftly replaced with a redirect doesn't change the fact that this article was created by Tim, April 2003, with his five sentence stub. Subsequently edited by a bunch of people - to the extent that I doubt you'll find a single sentence here which is wholly Boyer's work. Martin 12:34, 1 Aug 2003 (UTC)

STOP!
Look, all of this continued arguing is pointless. The fact is, a few months ago, Daniel created a bunch of articles about himself. Then, Tim consolidated them all into one article about Daniel. I don't know his motivation for simply not deleting them. Maybe he didn't realize they were created by Daniel? Maybe he was giving him the benefit of the doubt? I don't know. However, the fact remains that this all started because Daniel created articles about himself. It is really irrelevant who created THIS article, because it all started with the articles Daniel created. Is that clear? So, if someone says "This article was created by Daniel himself" it is essentially true, because this article would not exist if he hadn't created the original articles which were moved here. OK?! Now, lets move onto the problem at hand. I think everyone involved here (that is still paying any attention), should head on over to Auto-biography, and throw in their two cents on the talk page. MB 14:22, Aug 1, 2003 (UTC)

 * No, you're still wrong. Tim created a five sentence stub on Boyer. I consolidated all the articles into one article. We're different people. :) Martin 15:27, 1 Aug 2003 (UTC)

 * This is not the point. Was the first article created concerning Daniel the article Tim made?  I believe that the first articles about Daniel were the articles about his work, which he created so that he would have something to link to on the text on his user page.  If you look at his user page, and the history, and the history of the articles he created in that time period, you will see that that is exactly what he was doing.  When he originally created the article, they should have been delete (which they eventually were, after way too much argument). This article should have never been created.  If Tim can tell me that he created this article, without any knowledge of the other articles Daniel was creating, then I will concede.  However, I seriously doubt this is the case.  And if this article was created b/c of the other articles, then it should definitely be deleted.

 * This article and all other articles about his works were created by Daniel C. Boyer himself. Article moves/merges/restorations all came later.  The logs provide ample evidence of this.  Daniel Quinlan 01:10, Aug 2, 2003 (UTC)

 * We will have to agree to disagree.
 * I consider that in no meaningful way did Boyer create this article, based on the same logs and talk page archives that you are looking at. Specifically, I view Tim's replacement of a redirect with a five sentence stub, after discussing the matter on the village pump, as the point at which the very first version of this article was created. 05:04, 29 Apr 2003 . . Tim Starling (stub).
 * You disagree, presumably viewing M 15:51, 25 Feb 2002 . . 141.219.44.92 as the point of creation, despite its subsequent replacement with a redirect an hour later. M 17:07, 23 Mar 2002 . . Stephen Gilbert.
 * No doubt you find my position as illogical as I find yours. We will have to agree to disagree. Martin 01:29, 2 Aug 2003 (UTC)

 * However, I still insist that even if someone else created the article completely independently, it still is not something meant for wikipedia. Especially in light of all the freaking evidence that so many users have wasted their time finding which proves that he is not famous on any scale, and that he doesn't deserve and article. Not to mention, that according to the official vote on the top of the page, the delete's are winning with 9 voting delete, 5 alright with keeping it in some form, and 5 who aren't really sure.  So with all these reasons for deletion, why the hell are we still arguing about this?!  MB 20:58, Aug 1, 2003 (UTC)

 * We're still arguing because we disagree on this subject, you are attempting to convince me, and the methods you are using to convince me are not being successful.
 * You could try calming down, taking a breath, and waiting to see what I have to say. I rather get the feeling, at the moment, that you're attempting to shout me down, rather than genuinely caring about what I have to say. Martin 22:30, 1 Aug 2003 (UTC)

I would not have created my 5 sentence stub if Daniel had not written a few articles about his works. However, that is not a very good reason for deletion. Importance or lack thereof is the only issue worth discussing. The fact that Daniel created Daniel C. Boyer in Feb 2002 is rather academic. If that's a crime then Mav's guilty too. -- Tim Starling 04:20, Aug 2, 2003 (UTC)
 * No he's not. Mav was getting rid of his in February 2002.  I assume most others with user pages in the main namespace were at that time, as well, not starting new ones. - Hephaestos 04:28, 2 Aug 2003 (UTC)

title: User talk:Daniel C. Boyer/Archive 4


text:
Ideal Home Show

The Ideal Home Show (formerly called the Ideal Home Exhibition) is an annual event in London, England, held at Olympia. The show was devised by the Daily Mail newspaper in 1908 and continued to be run by the Daily Mail until 2009. It was then sold to events and publishing company Media 10.

Overview
The goal of the Ideal Home Show is to bring together everything associated with having an "ideal home", such as the latest inventions for the modern house, and to showcase the latest housing designs. A regular feature of the show for many years was the Ideal House Competition, where designs were invited and the winning schemes erected at the exhibition the following year.

The first exhibition was held in 1908 at the Olympia exhibition centre, with sections dedicated to "phases of home life" such as construction, food and cookery, furniture and decoration. Demonstrations and contests included an Arts and Crafts competition and a competition to design the "Ideal Home". Wareham Smith, advertising manager of the Daily Mail, founded the exhibition as a marketing event for the newspaper. It was often visited by celebrities and royalty.

The archive is held at the V and A Museum.

1908–1919
The inaugural Daily Mail Ideal Home Exhibition was opened by the Lord Mayor of London at Olympia and the Daily Mail explained that you would see: Streets of a town lined with hundreds of bright little buildings of varying shape and design – red roofed cottages, brown bungalows, and gaily coloured pavilions – and moving between them endless lines of interested visitors. Visitors queued to view the furnished houses and to tour a landscaped garden. Stands became rooms with all the merchandise available for sale – offering the opportunity for people to see the latest designs for luxury living.

In 1908, 90 per cent of the population rented their home. It took more than 3,000 men a week to build the first Exhibition.

Lord Northcliffe, proprietor of the Daily Mail, founded the Ideal Home exhibition in 1908 at London's Olympia exhibition centre, in the spirit of social reform, to stimulate debate about better housing conditions. For a fee of one shilling, the public were educated and entertained by displays of labour-saving appliances and show homes.

The exhibition was next held in 1910, then 1912 and 1913, disrupted by the 1914–18 First World War.

A dispute about the content of a room designed by members of the Omega Workshops for the 1913 show was instrumental in the secession of several artists from that group.

The 1920s and 1930s
Technological developments gathered pace throughout the 1920s and 1930s and new products were often featured in demonstrations at the Show. The event became a focal point for the housewife to view the latest in household technology.

Throughout the 1930s building was Britain's chief industry, and the suburbs began to spread. Mortgages were becoming more accessible and more people than ever before bought their first home.

The Daily Mail was committed to the drive for greater efficiency and for one year in 1921 it even renamed the show the "Daily Mail Efficiency Exhibition". In 1939, the BBC transmitted a television broadcast from the event for the first time although it had been making radio broadcasts from the exhibition since 1923.

1940s–1970s
The Second World War meant that the exhibition was suspended from 1940 to 1946 but from 1947 onwards it continued to grow, culminating in a huge attendance in 1957 of almost 1.5 million people. The show continued to "Educate and Entertain" throughout the decades and in 1953, year of the Coronation of Elizabeth II, the exhibition even featured a two-thirds scale copy of the state coach.

The first microwave oven was launched at the show in 1947. In 1957 the British housewife still spent an average of 70 hours a week on housework

The 1960s was an era of forward-looking fashion and the first humans on the Moon, yet the most popular house style of the period was mock-Georgian. One exhibit, in 1960, "A Home in Space" was created by the Douglas Aircraft Company. It was a full mockup of a potential space station design and visited by 150,000–200,000 people. It has been cited as an important step towards the creation of operative space stations.

The disco decade of the 1970s ushered in a new look for interiors featuring chrome and smoked glass, and the show reflected trends in all the latest house designs and interiors.

1980–present

Corner baths and conservatories caught the eye in the 1980s and new technology was still very much in evidence. Through the 1990s, a new shopping experience was developed for the Show, with entertainment high on the agenda and a mission to provide everything for the home in one environment.

In 1997, a rainforest was created and visitors could experience a tropical downpour every hour from the shelter of a tree house. In 2008, people could take a trip down memory lane and see some of the highlights of the last century in the Century Street. In September 2009 the show changed hands for the first time in its history, after being sold by the Daily Mail to Media 10. The 2010 Ideal Home Show won the award for Best Consumer Show over 2,000sqm at the Industry AEO Awards. The 2011 Ideal Home Show took place from 11 to 27 March at Earls Court Exhibition Centre. With more than 50,000 buyers each exhibitor sold goods worth £1,000,000.

In 2008, one of the more adventurous bedroom recreations was that of Shirley Bassey. Bassey appeared to have a 10' x 10' bedroom, with bedlinen from Dunelm Group. A mannequin of Bassey, dressed in tight-fitting sequined nightie, was stood – arms outstretched – as though she'd just got out of bed to sing "Goldfinger" to members of the public passing through her Ideal Home bedroom.

title: Ideal Home Show


text:
SMT

SMT may refer to:

Based in Scotland

 * Scottish Mortgage Investment Trust (LSE stock symbol: SMT)
 * Scottish Motor Traction, a defunct bus operator

Based in the United States

 * SMT (media company), a provider of live sports scoring
 * Seismic Micro-Technology, a seismology software developer
 * Society for Music Theory, a learned society

Rail transport

 * St Margarets railway station (Hertfordshire), England
 * Semarang Tawang railway station, Indonesia
 * Shanghai maglev train, a Transrapid line in China

Science and technology

 * Satisfiability modulo theories, in computer science and logic
 * Simultaneous multithreading, in computing
 * Statistical machine translation, in computational linguistics
 * Sulfamethazine, an antibiotic drug
 * Surface-mount technology, in electronics
 * Heinrich Hertz Submillimeter Telescope, Arizona, United States

Other uses

 * Senior management team, at schools in the UK
 * Shin Megami Tensei, a video game series
 * Shrimati (Smt.), an Indian feminine honorific
 * Simte language, spoken in India (ISO 639-3 code)
 * Social mirror theory

title: SMT


text:
Talk:Türkmenbaşy

Copyedit needed: It's a run-on and I can't get tails or heads out of it at all.

What does it mean? RickK 19:55, 2 Aug 2003 (UTC)

 * Sorry, what do you mean? The article clearly informs about two things: that the president-gone-dictator of Turkmenistan has issued himself the title of 'Turkmenbashi', and that (probably in honour of this president) there is a city called 'Turkmenbashi', also. -- till we *) 20:11, Aug 2, 2003 (UTC)

When I initially wrote the comment, no one had said what the word meant. That has since been corrected. RickK 20:13, 2 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Redirect or Disambiguation?
This article, as I found it, consisted of what seemed to be a poorly done dab page followed by a lengthy quote from a humor book. I tried to improve the former and, of course, removed the latter, but now I pose the question: Should this page, instead, simply redirect to Saparmurat Niyazov, which I think is certainly the most common usage, and then from Niyazov's page, create a link to a new Türkmenbaşy (disambiguation) page to list the other alternative uses? (Or, perhaps, we could put the dab directly on the Niyazov article, such as "For the city, see...")

Thoughts? Comments? --SuperNova |T|C| 21:22, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

title: Talk:Türkmenbaşy


text:
Talk:Anti-LGBT rhetoric

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 12 January 2022 and 22 April 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jiayimeng.

 * Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by Sangdeboeuf (talk) 04:51, 26 October 2022 (UTC)

Which article are you evaluating? Anti-LGBT rhetoric

Why you have chosen this article to evaluate? The LGBT group are constantly under attacked by the social prejudice, their experiences sometimes are beyond others comprehensions. The LGBT group was never fully supported or accepted by the society, but this article may acknowledge others to consider things differently, and recognize that understanding others from their perspectives could make a difference on their life.

Evaluate the article (Compose a detailed evaluation of the article here, considering each of the key aspects listed above. Consider the guiding questions, and check out the examples of what a useful Wikipedia article evaluation looks like.)

This article has a good lead section on briefly explaining what the topic is focused on, but it is also slightly lacking details on providing backgrounds of the anti-LGBT group. Details could help guiding the readers' interests. The article also appears lending too many quotations in each section, readers may have difficulty reading the content. The word choice and paraphrasing of some sections are not consisted enough, which could transmit false information, or lead to false understandings. Articles that are being published should be cautious with the wording and tone as Wikipedia states to have a neutral point of view of all.

Overall, besides what has been discussed above, the article has given liberal quantity of details, and well organized. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jiayimeng (talk • contribs) 17:37, 29 January 2022 (UTC)

Split proposal
The content in "Anti-gay themes" should probably be separated. I have suggested Anti-LGBT trope as analogous to Antisemitic trope, but I don't know if this is the best article title. But the current article seems to have too much of a detailed list on specific anti-gay tropes/themes/rhetoric, rather than a broad overview of the topic, and I think would benefit from a split. I'll inform WP:LGBT of the proposal for further eyes on this article. GnocchiFan (talk) 15:38, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

 * I don't like "trope" singular at all. These are multiple themes/tropes here. (I think the same mistake has been made with Antisemitic trope.) Splitting out that whole section would leave the article with little coverage of specific anti-gay rhetoric and would make the coverage of anti-trans rhetoric look disproportionate, which is isn't at all. For that reason I'm not keen on a split. It is not like the article is huge at the moment. What the article could do with is more coverage of anti-bi/pan rhetoric and possibly also sections on the hate that asexual and aromantic people get, which is truly a bizarre phenomenon. Maybe also the anti-gay stuff should do more to cover specific rhetoric aimed at lesbians and at gay men. We don't want to lose the common threads here but the rhetoric is adapted for each target group and that needs to be covered, preferably all in one place. DanielRigal (talk) 18:11, 25 September 2023 (UTC)
 * I am leaning agree with split, but it should be split into "Anti-gay rhetoric" or "Anti-gay arguments" or something similar. Zenomonoz (talk) 03:45, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

Conflation with child abuse
What is the purpose of the span class anchor? Is it being used?

With regards to See above: "Neutral cross-references, e.g. (See also Cymric cat.), are permissible (and best done with the template), but are often best reworded (The Cymric cat is a recent breed developed from the Manx.).". Simply telling people to look above is a bad way of explaining the situation. Iterresise (talk) 21:13, 22 October 2023 (UTC)

 * Section links are a useful way to direct readers to relevant information without unnecessary repetition on the same page, and serve to bind the project together into an interconnected whole. I'm unsure how we would tell whether the link were being used or not, but simply being being unused or unnecessary is not really an argument to omit the link. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 15:31, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
 * And what about the span class anchor? Is it being used? It's better to remove it if it isn't. Iterresise (talk) 08:46, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Why? —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 00:31, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I can be confusing for new editors. Iterresise (talk) 06:56, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is designed to inform readers, not for the convenience of editors. Many sections in the article have hidden anchors using  tags as suggested per WP:ANCHOR: "Anchors are also used when renaming a section, yet still allowing links to the old name to function".
 * Since the section was, there may be links both on and off Wiki pointing to the old section title; omitting the anchor would break those links causing link rot. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 11:00, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Now there's a new problem: how long will it take until something is no longer recent and allowed to be removed? Iterresise (talk) 21:03, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Until no other links (including on archived pages) exist pointing to the old section title. If you are confused by the use of HTML in section markup you can refer to Template:Anchor, switch to VisualEditor, or ask for assistance at the help desk. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 23:40, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Sdb, thanks for holding down the fort and being the good-faith responder here, patiently trying to answer their questions. In case you weren't aware of the backstory, they are now community banned; the ANI thread is here. Thanks again, Mathglot (talk) 07:32, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

Legality and censorship section
This section just repeats what has already been said and is not expanded in a way that adds any usefulness to the article.

Its contents also doesn't seem to justify the use of the word censorship in the heading title. PitterPatter533 (talk) 00:42, 13 February 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Anti-LGBT rhetoric


text:
Settling

Settling is the process by which particulates move towards the bottom of a liquid and form a sediment. Particles that experience a force, either due to gravity or due to centrifugal motion will tend to move in a uniform manner in the direction exerted by that force. For gravity settling, this means that the particles will tend to fall to the bottom of the vessel, forming sludge or slurry at the vessel base. Settling is an important operation in many applications, such as mining, wastewater and drinking water treatment, biological science, space propellant reignition, and scooping.

Physics
For settling particles that are considered individually, i.e. dilute particle solutions, there are two main forces enacting upon any particle. The primary force is an applied force, such as gravity, and a drag force that is due to the motion of the particle through the fluid. The applied force is usually not affected by the particle's velocity, whereas the drag force is a function of the particle velocity.

For a particle at rest no drag force will be exhibited, which causes the particle to accelerate due to the applied force. When the particle accelerates, the drag force acts in the direction opposite to the particle's motion, retarding further acceleration, in the absence of other forces drag directly opposes the applied force. As the particle increases in velocity eventually the drag force and the applied force will approximately equate, causing no further change in the particle's velocity. This velocity is known as the terminal velocity, settling velocity or fall velocity of the particle. This is readily measurable by examining the rate of fall of individual particles.

The terminal velocity of the particle is affected by many parameters, i.e. anything that will alter the particle's drag. Hence the terminal velocity is most notably dependent upon grain size, the shape (roundness and sphericity) and density of the grains, as well as to the viscosity and density of the fluid.

Stokes' drag
For dilute suspensions, Stokes' law predicts the settling velocity of small spheres in fluid, either air or water. This originates due to the strength of viscous forces at the surface of the particle providing the majority of the retarding force. Stokes' law finds many applications in the natural sciences, and is given by:

 * $$w=\frac{2(\rho_p-\rho_f)gr^2}{9\mu}$$

where w is the settling velocity, ρ is density (the subscripts p and f indicate particle and fluid respectively), g is the acceleration due to gravity, r is the radius of the particle and μ is the dynamic viscosity of the fluid.

Stokes' law applies when the Reynolds number, Re, of the particle is less than 0.1. Experimentally Stokes' law is found to hold within 1% for $$ Re \leq 0.1$$, within 3% for $$Re \leq 0.5$$ and within 9% $$ Re \leq 1.0$$. With increasing Reynolds numbers, Stokes law begins to break down due to the increasing importance of fluid inertia, requiring the use of empirical solutions to calculate drag forces.

Newtonian drag
Defining a drag coefficient, $$C_d$$, as the ratio of the force experienced by the particle divided by the impact pressure of the fluid, a coefficient that can be considered as the transfer of available fluid force into drag is established. In this region the inertia of the impacting fluid is responsible for the majority of force transfer to the particle.

 * $$ C_d = \frac{F_d}{\frac{1}{2}\rho_f U^2 A} $$

For a spherical particle in the Stokes regime this value is not constant, however in the Newtonian drag regime the drag on a sphere can be approximated by a constant, 0.44. This constant value implies that the efficiency of transfer of energy from the fluid to the particle is not a function of fluid velocity.

As such the terminal velocity of a particle in a Newtonian regime can again be obtained by equating the drag force to the applied force, resulting in the following expression

 * $$ w = 2.46\left( \frac{(\rho_p-\rho_f)gr}{\rho_f}\right)^{\frac{1}{2}} .$$

Transitional drag
In the intermediate region between Stokes drag and Newtonian drag, there exists a transitional regime, where the analytical solution to the problem of a falling sphere becomes problematic. To solve this, empirical expressions are used to calculate drag in this region. One such empirical equation is that of Schiller and Naumann, and may be valid for $$ 0.2 \leq Re \leq 1000$$:

 * $$ \frac{F}{\rho_f U^2 A} = \frac{12}{ \mathrm{Re}} \left( 1 + 0.15\mathrm{Re}^{0.687} \right) . $$

Hindered settling
Stokes, transitional and Newtonian settling describe the behaviour of a single spherical particle in an infinite fluid, known as free settling. However this model has limitations in practical application. Alternate considerations, such as the interaction of particles in the fluid, or the interaction of the particles with the container walls can modify the settling behaviour. Settling that has these forces in appreciable magnitude is known as hindered settling. Subsequently, semi-analytic or empirical solutions may be used to perform meaningful hindered settling calculations.

Applications
The solid-gas flow systems are present in many industrial applications, as dry, catalytic reactors, settling tanks, pneumatic conveying of solids, among others. Obviously, in industrial operations the drag rule is not simple as a single sphere settling in a stationary fluid. However, this knowledge indicates how drag behaves in more complex systems, which are designed and studied by engineers applying empirical and more sophisticated tools.

For example, 'settling tanks' are used for separating solids and/or oil from another liquid. In food processing, the vegetable is crushed and placed inside of a settling tank with water. The oil floats to the top of the water then is collected. In drinking water and waste water treatment a flocculant or coagulant is often added prior to settling to form larger particles that settle out quickly in a settling tank or (lamella) clarifier, leaving the water with a lower turbidity.

In winemaking, the French term for this process is débourbage. This step usually occurs in white wine production before the start of fermentation.

Settleable solids analysis
Settleable solids are the particulates that settle out of a still fluid. Settleable solids can be quantified for a suspension using an Imhoff cone. The standard Imhoff cone of transparent glass or plastic holds one liter of liquid and has calibrated markings to measure the volume of solids accumulated in the bottom of the conical container after settling for one hour. A standardized Imhoff cone procedure is commonly used to measure suspended solids in wastewater or stormwater runoff. The simplicity of the method makes it popular for estimating water quality. To numerically gauge the stability of suspended solids and predict agglomeration and sedimentation events, zeta potential is commonly analyzed. This parameter indicates the electrostatic repulsion between solid particles and can be used to predict whether aggregation and settling will occur over time.

The water sample to be measured should be representative of the total stream. Samples are best collected from the discharge falling from a pipe or over a weir, because samples skimmed from the top of a flowing channel may fail to capture larger, high-density solids moving along the bottom of the channel. The sampling bucket is vigorously stirred to uniformly re-suspend all collected solids immediately before pouring the volume required to fill the cone. The filled cone is immediately placed in a stationary holding rack to allow quiescent settling. The rack should be located away from heating sources, including direct sunlight, which might cause currents within the cone from thermal density changes of the liquid contents. After 45 minutes of settling, the cone is partially rotated about its axis of symmetry just enough to dislodge any settled material adhering to the side of the cone. Accumulated sediment is observed and measured fifteen minutes later, after one hour of total settling time.

title: Settling


text:
Tribadism

Tribadism or tribbing, commonly known by its scissoring position, is a sexual practice involving vulva-to-vulva contact or rubbing the vulva against the partner's thigh, stomach, buttocks, arm, or other body parts (excluding the mouth), especially for stimulation of the clitoris. A variety of sex positions are practiced, including the missionary position.

The term tribadism originally encompassed societal beliefs about women's capability of being penetrative sexual partners. Women accused of having been penetrative during sexual activity were subject to ridicule or punishment. In modern times, the term typically refers to various forms of non-penetrative sex between women. It may also involve vaginal penetration by use of the fingers, a dildo or double penetration dildo.

It is analogous to frot, which is penis-to-penis contact between men.

Etymology and usage
The term tribadism derives from the Greek word τριβάς (tribas), which in turn comes from the verb τρίβω (tribō), "rub". In ancient Greek and Roman sexuality, a tribas, or tribade (IPA:), was a woman or intersex individual who actively penetrated another person (male or female) through use of the clitoris or a dildo. The term tribade did not begin to refer exclusively to eroticism between women until Late Antiquity. Because penetration was viewed as "male-defined" sexuality, a tribas was considered the most vulgar lesbian. The Greeks and Romans recognized same-sex attraction, but as any sexual act was believed to require that one of the partners be "phallic" and that therefore sexual activity between women was impossible without this feature, mythology popularly associated lesbians with either having enlarged clitorises or as incapable of enjoying sexual activity without the substitution of a phallus. This appears in Greek and Latin satires as early as the late first century.

In English texts, tribade is recorded as early as 1601, in Ben Jonson's Praeludium (Poem X in The Forest), to as late as the mid-nineteenth century; it was the most common lesbian term in European texts, through the proliferation of classical literature, anatomies, midwiferies, sexual advice manuals, and pornography. It also came to refer to lesbian sexual practices in general, though anatomical investigation in the mid-eighteenth century led to skepticism about stories of enlarged clitorises and anatomists and doctors argued for a more precise distinction between clitoral hypertrophy and hermaphroditism.

Author Bonnie Zimmerman stated, "More often, however, [European] writers avoided the term, instead euphemistically invoking 'unnatural vice,' 'lewd behavior,' 'crimes against nature,' 'using an instrument,' and 'taking the part of a man.' In the eighteenth century, where the term saw one of its most popular uses, it was employed in several pornographic libels against Marie Antoinette, who was "tried and roundly convicted in the press" as being a tribade. "[Her] rumored tribadism had historically specific political implications," stated author Dena Goodman. "Consider her final (fictive) testimony in The Confession of Marie-Antoinette: 'People!' she protests, 'because I ceded to the sweet impressions of nature, and in imitating the charming weakness of all the women of the court of France, I surrendered to the sweet impulsion of love...you hold me, as it were, captive within your walls?'" Goodman elaborated that in one libel, Marie-Antoinette is described as generously providing details of her husband's "incapacity in the venereal act" and that her lust resulted in her taking an aristocratic beauty Yolande de Polastron, the Duchess of Polignac (1749–1793), "into [her] service" and later specifying that what makes sex with a woman so appealing is "Adroit in the art of stimulating the clitoris"; Marie-Antoinette is described as having stated that La Polignac's attentions produced "one of those rare pleasures that cannot be used up because it can be repeated as many times as one likes".

By the time the Victorian era arrived, cited Zimmerman, "tribadism tended to be constructed as a lower class and non-Western phenomenon and often was associated with the supposed degeneration of prostitutes and criminals". By the twentieth century, "tribade had been supplanted" by the terms sapphist, lesbian, invert, and homosexual, as tribade had become too archaic to use. Fricatrice, a synonym for tribade that also refers to rubbing but has a Latin rather than a Greek root, appeared in English texts as early as 1605 (in Ben Jonson's Volpone). Its usage suggests that it was more colloquial and more pejorative than tribade. Variants include the Latinized confricatrice and English rubster.

Sex positions and other aspects
Tribadism is a common sexual practice among women who have sex with women (WSW). Although the term tribadism is often applied to the act of vulva-to-vulva stimulation, it encompasses a variety of sexual activity. In addition to the scissoring position, which involves the partners interlocking their legs in a position similar to the shape of scissors and pressing their vulvas together, tribadism may involve the missionary position, the woman on top position, the doggy style position or others,  or simple movement of the woman's vulva against her partner's thigh, stomach, buttocks, arm, or another body part. Vaginal penetration by use of the fingers or by use of a dildo may be accompanied, and so sometimes "mutuality and reciprocation tend not to be the main objective, although satisfaction for both partners through different means most definitely is its aim". Women who enjoy or prefer tribadism report finding pleasure from its allowance of whole-body contact, the experience of timing hip movement and feeling their partner's motions without manual stimulation, which is considered exciting, erotic and a much easier way to achieve orgasm due to ample clitoral stimulation.

Some lesbian and bisexual women do not engage in the scissoring position because they find or think it would be physically uncomfortable. They may also think it is a misconception that lesbians engage in the act and is therefore not representative of lesbian sexual practices, attributing it more so to the male fantasies of the heterosexual porn industry. By contrast, some sources, including Shere Hite's 1976 and 1981 research, indicate that women may enjoy performing the scissoring position with other women because it is a variation of vulva-to-vulva contact or can allow for maximum such contact and therefore an elevated level of intimacy.

Scissoring is commonly used as an umbrella term for all forms of tribadism, and many lesbian and bisexual women are unaware that some of the sexual acts they include in their lovemaking are aspects of and are formally labeled tribadism, as tribadism is commonly omitted from mainstream sex research. Scholar Judith Halberstam stated, "If we trace the use of the term forward into present, we find that tribadism is one of those rarely discussed but often practiced sexual activities, and the silence that surrounds it now is as puzzling as the discourse it produced in earlier centuries." Halberstam added that Sigmund Freud "had nothing to say" with regard to the topic, "and few contemporary lesbian sex books even discuss it".

According to older studies, "approximately one-third of lesbian women used tribadism, or body contact, as a means of achieving orgasm (Saghir & Robins, 1973; Jay & Young, 1977)". Masters and Johnson's 1979 study on lesbian sexual practices found that lesbians tend to do more overall genital stimulation than direct clitoral stimulation, which is also often the case for heterosexual relationships. Vaginal or anal penetration with dildos or other sex toys is less commonly practiced among lesbians and other WSW. In 1987, a non-scientific study (Munson) "was conducted of more than 100 members of a lesbian social organization in Colorado" and "[w]hen asked what techniques they used in their last 10 lovemaking sessions, 100% were for kissing, sucking on nipples, and manual stimulation of the clitoris; more than 90% reported French kissing, oral sex, and fingers inserted into the vagina; and 80% reported tribadism".

In 2003, Julia V Bailey and her research team published data based on a sample from the United Kingdom of 803 lesbian and bisexual women attending two London lesbian sexual health clinics and 415 WSW from a community sample; the study reported that 85% of the women engaged in tribadism (which included genital-to-genital contact or rubbing genitals against another part of a partner's body). 50% engaged in the genital-genital form. Like older studies, vaginal penetration with dildos, or with other sex toys, among the women was rare.

Safe sex
As with any exchange of body fluids during sexual activities, genital-to-genital tribadism is a high-risk sexual practice because it may transfer sexually transmitted infections (STIs) if those are present in one or more of the partners. Genital-genital and genital-body contact (including tribadism) can spread STIs such as human papillomavirus (HPV), pubic lice (crabs) and herpes.

Safe sex options, such as using a dental dam or a cut-open condom, may be practiced. However, there "is no good evidence" that using a dental dam reduces STI transmission risks between women who have sex with women; studies show that using a dental dam as a protection barrier is rarely practiced, and that, among [women who have sex with women], this may be because the individuals have "limited knowledge about the possibilities of STI transmission or [feel] less vulnerable to STIs [such as HIV]".

In terms of the Female Sexual Function Index (FSFI), sexual behaviors between women such as tribadism are neglected.

Popular culture and other media
Tribadism has been referenced in various aspects of popular culture. The glam pop band Scissor Sisters derived their name from the scissoring position. Jake Shears of the group stated that while many of their songs have gay themes, they do not want to be labeled a gay band; they "are first and foremost a pop band". Other bands named after tribadism include lesbian punk band Tribe 8 and all-male group Scissorfight.

Genital–genital tribadism was depicted three times during the "D-Yikes!" episode of the cartoon South Park, referred to in the episode as scissoring. The episode is credited with having brought more recognition to the act of scissoring. The term additionally received mainstream recognition after the episode "Duets" of the television series Glee had characters Santana Lopez and Brittany S. Pierce reference scissoring while making out. The scene received some criticism for possibly being inappropriate for children.

In 2010, in response to California State University, Long Beach refusing to advertise the play The Night of the Tribades on the Seventh Street marquee because of the word tribades in its title, approximately 24 theater arts majors protested in front of Brotman Hall by simulating tribadism (including scissoring). "When you put tribade into a Google search image, apparently it comes up with the word tribadism, which is a sex act and they decided it was inappropriate," stated one student.

Tribadism and other lesbian sex scenes are featured in the 2013 film Blue Is the Warmest Colour. The scenes were the subject of debate among lesbians and critics, with the depiction of scissoring being one of the acts that were criticized; in an interview surveying a small panel of lesbian women, one of the women, who was skeptical that lesbian sexual activity included scissoring at all, seemed more open to the idea of a reverse cowgirl position of scissoring; another woman had engaged in the reverse cowgirl position of scissoring. Smith et al. argued that while the portrayal of scissoring in Blue Is the Warmest Colour may be considered "entirely lesbian" and "expunging men" because it is non-penetrative sex between women, "the positions chosen seem based more on their ease to photograph/film in a way that provides maximum exposure of both female bodies, as well as an inability to imagine, or depict within heterosexual representational norms, fulfilling sex without direct genital-on-genital contact."

The 2016 film Blood of the Tribades is a lesbian-themed vampire story examining gender politics and bigotry.

Among female bonobos
Female-female genital sex is not exclusive to humans. Females of the bonobo species also engage in this act, usually referred to by primatologists as GG rubbing (genital-to-genital). "Perhaps the bonobo's most typical sexual pattern, undocumented in any other primate, is genito-genital rubbing (or GG rubbing) between adult females," stated primatologist Frans de Waal. "One female facing another clings with arms and legs to a partner that, standing on both hands and feet, lifts her off the ground."

In bonobos, the clitoris is larger and more externalized than in most mammals. Ethologist Jonathan Balcombe states that bonobos rub their clitorises together rapidly for ten to twenty seconds, and this behavior, "which may be repeated in rapid succession, is usually accompanied by grinding, shrieking, and clitoral engorgement"; on average, female bonobos engage in genital–genital rubbing "about once every two hours".

title: Tribadism


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Michel Chamillart

Michel Chamillart or Chamillard (2 January 1652 – 14 April 1721) was a French statesman, a minister of King Louis XIV of France.

Chamillart was born in Paris of a family recently raised to the nobility. Following the usual career of a statesman of his time he became in turn councillor of the parlement of Paris (1676), master of requests (1686), and intendant of the generality of Rouen (January 1689). His attractive personality won the confidence of Madame de Maintenon and pleased the king. In 1690 he was made intendant of finances, and on 5 September 1699 the king appointed him Controller-General of Finances, to which he added on the following 7 January the ministry of war. From the first, Chamillart's position was a difficult one. The deficit was more than 53 million livres, and the credit of the state was almost exhausted. Chamillart lacked the intelligence and energy necessary for the situation, and was unable to moderate the king's warlike tastes, or to inaugurate economic reforms. He could only employ the usual expedients of the time—the immoderate sale of offices, the debasement of the coinage (five times in six years), reduction of the rate of interest on state debts, and increased taxation.

Chamillart attempted to force into circulation a kind of paper money, billets de monnaie, with disastrous results owing to the state of credit. He studied Vauban's project for the royal tithe, and Boisguillebert's proposition for the taille, but did not adopt them. In October 1706 he showed the king that the debts immediately due amounted to 288 million, and that the deficit already foreseen for 1707 was 160 million. In October 1707 he saw with consternation that the revenue for 1708 was already entirely eaten up by anticipation, so that neither money nor credit remained for 1708. In these conditions Chamillart, who had often complained of the overwhelming burden he was carrying, and who had already wished to retire in 1706, resigned his office of controller-general. Public opinion attributed to him the ruin of the country, though he had tried in 1700 to improve the condition of commerce by the creation of a council of commerce.

As secretary of state for war he was responsible for raising an army for the War of the Spanish Succession, and had to reorganize it three times, after the defeats of 1704, 1706 and 1708. With an empty treasury he succeeded only in part, and he warned the king that the enemy would soon be able to dictate the terms of peace. He was reproached with having secured the command of the army which besieged Turin (1706) for his son-in-law, the incapable duc de la Feuillade. Even Madame de Maintenon became hostile to him, and he was dismissed from his position on 9 June 1709, retiring to his estates.

Chamillart's papers were published by Gustave Esnault, Michel Chamillart, contrôleur général et secrétaire d'état de la guerre, correspondance et papiers inédits (2 vols, Paris, 1885); and by A de Boislisle in vol. 2 of his Correspondance des controleurs généraux (1883).

title: Michel Chamillart


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Hydrothermal circulation

Hydrothermal circulation in its most general sense is the circulation of hot water (Ancient Greek ὕδωρ, water, and θέρμη, heat ). Hydrothermal circulation occurs most often in the vicinity of sources of heat within the Earth's crust. In general, this occurs near volcanic activity, but can occur in the shallow to mid crust along deeply penetrating fault irregularities or in the deep crust related to the intrusion of granite, or as the result of orogeny or metamorphism. Hydrothermal circulation often results in hydrothermal mineral deposits.

Seafloor hydrothermal circulation
Hydrothermal circulation in the oceans is the passage of the water through mid-oceanic ridge systems.

The term includes both the circulation of the well-known, high-temperature vent waters near the ridge crests, and the much-lower-temperature, diffuse flow of water through sediments and buried basalts further from the ridge crests. The former circulation type is sometimes termed "active", and the latter "passive". In both cases, the principle is the same: Cold, dense seawater sinks into the basalt of the seafloor and is heated at depth whereupon it rises back to the rock-ocean water interface due to its lesser density. The heat source for the active vents is the newly formed basalt, and, for the highest temperature vents, the underlying magma chamber. The heat source for the passive vents is the still-cooling older basalts. Heat flow studies of the seafloor suggest that basalts within the oceanic crust take millions of years to completely cool as they continue to support passive hydrothermal circulation systems.

Hydrothermal vents are locations on the seafloor where hydrothermal fluids mix into the overlying ocean. Perhaps the best-known vent forms are the naturally occurring chimneys referred to as black smokers.

Volcanic and magma related hydrothermal circulation
Hydrothermal circulation is not limited to ocean ridge environments. Hydrothermal circulating convection cells can exist in any place an anomalous source of heat, such as an intruding magma or volcanic vent, comes into contact with the groundwater system where permeability allows flow. This convection can manifest as hydrothermal explosions, geysers, and hot springs, although this is not always the case.

Hydrothermal circulation above magma bodies has been intensively studied in the context of geothermal projects where many deep wells are drilled into the system to produce and subsequently re-inject the hydrothermal fluids. The detailed data sets available from this work show the long term persistence of these systems, the development of fluid circulation patterns, histories that can be influenced by renewed magmatism, fault movement, or changes associated with hydrothermal brecciation and eruption sometimes followed by massive cold water invasion. Less direct but as intensive study has focused on the minerals deposited especially in the upper parts of hydrothermal circulation systems.

Understanding volcanic and magma-related hydrothermal circulation means studying hydrothermal explosions, geysers, hot springs, and other related systems and their interactions with associated surface water and groundwater bodies. A good environment to observe this phenomenon is in volcanogenic lakes where hot springs and geysers are commonly present. The convection systems in these lakes work through cold lake water percolating downward through the permeable lake bed, mixing with groundwater heated by magma or residual heat, and rising to form thermal springs at discharge points.

The existence of hydrothermal convection cells and hot springs or geysers in these environments depends not only on the presence of a colder water body and geothermal heat but also strongly depends on a no-flow boundary at the water table. These systems can develop their own boundaries. For example the water level represents a fluid pressure condition that leads to gas exsolution or boiling that in turn causes intense mineralization that can seal cracks.

Deep crust
Hydrothermal also refers to the transport and circulation of water within the deep crust, in general from areas of hot rocks to areas of cooler rocks. The causes for this convection can be:
 * Intrusion of magma into the crust
 * Radioactive heat generated by cooled masses of granite
 * Heat from the mantle
 * Hydraulic head from mountain ranges, for example, the Great Artesian Basin
 * Dewatering of metamorphic rocks, which liberates water
 * Dewatering of deeply buried sediments

Hydrothermal circulation, in particular in the deep crust, is a primary cause of mineral deposit formation and a cornerstone of most theories on ore genesis.

Hydrothermal ore deposits
During the early 1900s, various geologists worked to classify hydrothermal ore deposits that they assumed formed from upward-flowing aqueous solutions. Waldemar Lindgren (1860–1939) developed a classification based on interpreted decreasing temperature and pressure conditions of the depositing fluid. His terms: "hypothermal", "mesothermal", "epithermal" and "teleothermal", expressed decreasing temperature and increasing distance from a deep source. Recent studies retain only the epithermal label. John Guilbert's 1985 revision of Lindgren's system for hydrothermal deposits includes the following:

 * Ascending hydrothermal fluids, magmatic or meteoric water
 * Porphyry copper and other deposits, 200–800 °C, moderate pressure
 * Igneous metamorphic, 300–800 °C, low to moderate pressure
 * Cordilleran veins, intermediate to shallow depths
 * Epithermal, shallow to intermediate, 50–300 °C, low pressure
 * Circulating heated meteoric solutions
 * Mississippi Valley-type deposits, 25–200 °C, low pressure
 * Western US uranium, 25–75 °C, low pressure
 * Circulating heated seawater
 * Oceanic ridge deposits, 25–300 °C, low pressure

title: Hydrothermal circulation