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Talk:Krugerrand

The Road
In the new novel by Cormac McCarthey, the road, a bag full of Krugerrands are found in a bomb shelter by the main characters. I was wondering if the use of bullion as currency in the event of an apocalypse is popular, and therefore be included in this article, or if it was just some artistic license.

 * My impression is that this is the main reason why people buy gold. My great uncle Gustav S. survived two apocalypses, the German hyperinflation of 1923, and 12 years as an inmate at Dachau (concentration camp outside of Munich). The point is, "apocalypse" doesn't have to mean the end of the planet, humanity, or civilization. If the dollar's inflation rate because similar to that which Argentina experienced at various times in the 20th century (e.g., 50%) that would be apocalyptic enough that more people would wish they owned gold. Zyxwv99 (talk) 01:29, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

purity
"These newer issues have surpassed the Krugerrand in popularity due to their 99.9% (24 carat) purity." This seems like a questionable interpretation. Higher purity is a mixed blessing, as it makes the coins much less durable. Plus, political objections to the apartheid government have to have been a factor. -Daniel.

Illegal to own in South Africa
Umm, what?! As far as I can find out, its only illegal to import, since the SA Reserve Bank is the monopoly supplier. --Dewet 13:22, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * Fine, I've removed that part, since I couldn't find any supporting evidence. Dewet 11:31, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I'm South African, and I own a Krugerrand: it's perfectly legal.--Life in General (Talk) 15:25, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

face value
The Krugerrand face value is not in Rand, like the table says, but in ounces.

Colorado Front range donations
Has any thought been given to including the donation of Krugerands to Salvation Army kettles along the Colorado Front Range in at least the past four holiday seasons? I'm not into numismatics much, but I think it is worthy of inclusion. BabuBhatt 05:01, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

The Krugerrand an attractive coin?
The Krugerrand coins (including the fractionals) are very attractive coins, given the fact that the reverse depicts Coert Steynburg's pronking springbok design, which first appeared on the 1947 Royal Visit 5/- coin. I have got 2 1/10 Krugerrand coins in my collection - 1984 & 1990. - (Aidan Work 06:19, 20 December 2005 (UTC))

On the other side, I've heard them referred to as "nothing to look at, basically a lump of metal." I personally think they're attractive, but no accounting for taste. 70.61.22.110 21:28, 28 June 2007 (UTC)Newt

Face value, use as currency.
As was just stated the face value is in Oz. fine gold, not in Rands or any other currency. Am changing this. Additionaly, while upon it's initial introduction it may not have been intended to be commonly traded for goods and services it is my understanding that this is done not infrequently in places where the value of local currency is unstable. The fact that its face value is based purely on value of gold content and not a particular currency lends itself very well to this purpose. Also, the fact that there are 4 denominations further leads me to believe this to be true. I am basing this on comments by my commodities broker that workers prefer to be paid in Krugerrands in some industries in S.A. Need firsthand knowledge or documentation to confirm.

 * Yes, you would need a citation for that dubious claim by your broker. Tempshill 18:50, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

 * I wondering where it is that workers even get a preference as to how they will be paid.--23.119.204.117 (talk) 19:13, 22 February 2016 (UTC)

Silver Krugerrand
I recently saw a silver krugerrand (one ounce) that was a Commemorative coin. Was this a one-time thing or was it more common? Should this be referenced in the article?

 * The silver Krugerrand were privately minted and were not made by the South African state mint.

 * Some information. Don't know if it warrants an inclusion in the article though.  Surv1v4l1st (talk) 01:27, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

 * I have a silver Kruggerand. It's pretty much identical to the regular gold variety, save for the material, and is marked as being one Troy ounce of ~99.99% (I haven't looked at it in a while, it's in a safe) pure silver. Atypicaloracle (talk) 16:06, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

Quote from taxfreegold.co.uk
The placement of the quote in "These coins 'are not official, have no legal tender value, are not produced or sanctioned by the South Africa Mint [sic!] or Government, [are] not Krugerrands, and not even coins'." gives the impression that it's taken from an official source (South African Mint Company). Since it isn't, maybe we should replace it with an official quote, alternatively rephrase it? (text in brackets are my additions) – Adrian Lozano (talk) 11:13, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

 * I couldn't find an official source last time I checked, because they only mention gold coins. I attributed the quote to the website for now until we find a better source.

 * Someone with access to numismatic magazines and books should find an article and quote it here with the name of the magazine, issue, date, etc. For example The Numismatist, in this old issue I can see through google that it says: "Counterfeit Silver Krugerrands Seized Unauthorized "silver krugerrands," but I can only see this piece of text because it only has fragment view. --Enric Naval (talk) 21:55, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

Legal tender?
If it's legal tender, what's the denomination in rands?

Don't tell me "1 ounce fine gold" because that's not a South African monetary unit. I'm not asking what's marked on the coin, I'm asking what the official status is as legal tender. For example: The American 1-ounce gold coin is legal tender in the value of $50.00 76.254.87.79 00:12, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * The practical effect of being "legal tender" is that you can pay debts, particularly taxes, with them. I can't imagine how the South African government accepts them, though. --Vuo (talk) 23:17, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

 * It doesn't have a rand value in the same sense that our Gold Eagles have an absurdly low dollar value given to it by the US government mint, the Krugerrand just has the gold value. The South African government makes money by minting their surplus gold bullion and selling it to world investors in this form.

 * I suppose the denomination is "Krugerrand", as the coins read (for instance) "1/4 Krugerrand" in addition to "1/4 oz fine gold". I don't know, however, whether that is a monetary unit in South Africa, by law.--92.75.207.138 (talk) 16:00, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

 * Who says legal tender needs to have a denomination? Sometimes legal tender merely stipulates what people are required (or permitted) to accept as money. Zyxwv99 (talk) 01:38, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * If the law requires to accept Krugerrands in payment for debts, then the law must also stipulate the amount in which a Krugerrand counts as payment of these debt; otherwise it would not be legal tender. SchnitteUK (talk) 15:15, 7 September 2016 (UTC)

The Krugerrand is legal tender and can be exchanged at the South African Reserve Bank at the current value of the Krugerrand, less a handling fee. ie one can physically go to the Reserve Bank and stand in a queue and hand in the Krugerrand to be exchanged for Rands which are paid into your banking account. To find the current value of a Krugerrand go to any South African share trading broker website eg. http://sharenet.co.za and type in KR as the code of Krugerrand to find the buy and sell values — Preceding unsigned comment added by 105.184.149.125 (talk) 09:49, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Major copyright violation
Most the this article was copied from here. I have stubified the article; it needs to be completely rewritten. External links in the article can be used as source, but they cannot be copied. Jon513 (talk) 22:53, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Why do you feel the article was copied from there? It would appear to have been constructed organically, looking at the history (for example).  Is there a reason you feel they did not copy from here?  Kuru  talk  23:20, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * The first edit (almost exactly a year ago) to the page was a cut and paste from the site posted above. Despite a moderate amount of edits the page remained largely intact.  I think that the best thing to do is to start over. Jon513 (talk) 23:30, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * There seems to be some confusion - the edit you just linked to was a few minor changes to existing text from 12-29-06. The article has existed quite a bit longer than that.  Did you look at the edit I linked to above?  Kuru  talk  23:38, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

 * After looking in to this more, it seems the page at 'allgoldcoins' was last modified on August 9th. It includes this addition from July 26th, but not this spelling correction from August 27th.  I'm thinking you should restore the article, and send a note to 'allgoldcoins' asking them live up to our GFDL. What am I missing here?  Kuru  talk  23:39, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

 * (edit conflict - we agree) On closer examination, I think you are right; they copied us. It appears to be a copy of the November 2 version of the page, right before the link to http://allgoldcoins.co.uk/allgold/shop_files/other/Krugerrands.htm was added. I have restored the article, and I apologize. Jon513 (talk) 23:43, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Absolutely not a problem - these kinds of puzzles are interesting to shake about. :) Kuru  talk  23:45, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

 * If you want to send them a letter reading Standard GFDL violation letter can help. Jon513 (talk) 23:49, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Please Help to improve this article.
I have recently added this

 * Maximum dimensions

unsourced sections
Could you point at specific sentences or facts that you think are incorrect? And could you tag them by adding right after the sentence? This indicates to other users that the sentence needs a citation backing it.

As Corvus says, it's not good to remove wholesale everything that doesn't have a citation hanging right after it. When removing stuff, you have to try to make an editorial judgement and take into account if the removal is improving the encyclopedia, or if it's better to just tag it in case that the text happens to be correct, and someone finds a source for it. --Enric Naval (talk) 19:41, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

silver krugerrands
It seems that they actually exist. See the warnings on the internets about buying one of these fake things instead of an authentic krugerrand:

There are now many items offered on eBay as "Krugerrands" which are NOT Krugerrands''"
 * "''Beware Krugerrand Imitations in Silver or Miniature

 * "There is no such thing as a silver Krugerrand. Silver Krugerrands do not exist.(...)Some dealers offering "silver Krugerrands" on eBay are actually fairly honest, in that they do describe their offerings as "silver rounds / bars", (...) Even then, they hardly ever spell out in a completely idiot-proof manner that the "coins" are not official, have no legal tender value, are not produced or sanctioned by the South Africa Mint or Government, not Krugerrands, and not even coins. (...) You would have to be pretty stupid to believe that it was an official coin, a Krugerrand, or even from South Africa"

So they should have a section, if only so that article explains how krugerrands are falsified for selling to collectors. Let's see if someone can find a reliable source, and then erroneus facts can be sorted out from the correct facts. --Enric Naval (talk) 19:59, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

 * Cointalk.org has some information on silver coins, referred to as silver krugerrands. --NewbyG (talk) 06:33, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

 * The source currently on the article is not a newspaper article, but an advert (see the format and the subtitle, which are clearly for an advert trying to look like an article) for a mint called "Philadelphia International Monetary Mint" for which I can't find any reference. The FTC warns "Make sure the bullion coins you purchase are not imitation medals created by fraudulent "mints."", which I am sure is the case with this mint. I'm gonna remove that and write a section. --Enric Naval (talk) 22:10, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Silver Krugerrands exist only from 2017, onward to mark the 50th anniversary of the gold Krugerrand of 1967. The 2017 Silver Krugerrand has a 50 privy mint mark on the reverse side of the coin which is omitted on subsequent releases ie from 2018, onward. All other silver Krugerrands prior to 2017 are fake and illegal, even if they contain 99.99% silver. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 105.184.149.125 (talk) 09:43, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Silver Krugerrands most definitely exist, I have some of my own. They've been minted since 2017 and are available in bullion and proof varieties. What's more, platinum Krugerrands exist too. The silver coins have now become relatively common, but I'm not sure how common the platinum coins are or if they are still in production. Government coins in South africa are minted by the South African Mint and Rand Refinery. I'm not changing the article myself as I don't want to tramp on the toes of those who have come before me, and I'm not coin expert. Here are the links you need to verify and obtain information on Silver Krugerrands: http://www.randrefinery.co.za/faqs_krugerrands.htm, http://www.samint.co.za/collectable-coins/2017-range/ ,  http://www.samint.co.za/2018-range/  ,   http://www.samint.co.za/2019-range/   ,   https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces143754.html  and   https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces101323.html. I hope that helps clear up any confusion. Mounty01 (talk) 01:09, 25 February 2019 (UTC)

non-encyclopedic external links
Do we need to link every currency-to-gold convertor? Wikipedia is not a repository of links. Looking at WP:EL, this sort of website is not listed at Links normally to be avoided, but it's not listed either ot What should be linked or Links to be considered. This is supposed to be an encyclopedia article, not a guide on how to trade Krugerrands, currency converters are not meaningful content that can add to the encyclopedic value of the article. Links I removed:

 * Current price of Gold Ounces (XAU) in U.S. Dollars (USD)
 * British Pounds (GBP)
 * South African Rand (ZAR)

To make myself clear: it would be a better to put a link detailing the historical price of the ounce of gold throught history, and the greatest changes to the price, and why they happened. --Enric Naval (talk) 23:08, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

Gold Rands
South African coins very similar to Krugerrands exist. For instance, the 1/4-oz coin has a face value of 2 R, the 1/8-oz coin 1 R. Shouldn't those be mentioned? --92.75.194.36 (talk) 17:37, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

 * I have expanded the article Coins of the South African rand to include these gold bullion coins. In some respects, they are similar to the Krugerrands, for example they have the same fineness (22 karat) and also feature the springbok design. Concerning their specifications, they are however more similar to the British sovereign. The fine gold content of the 1 R coin is not 1/8 oz or 1/10 oz, but 0.1177 oz. The 2 R coin contains 0.2354 oz of fine gold, not 1/4 oz.--Alban (talk) 17:47, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

krugerrand not a coin.
it has no numeric currency value in the currency of the country. nutura series are gold coins. There should be an article about nutura series. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.232.132.131 (talk) 03:47, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

first minted in 1967
It's a bit confusing. The official website says "the first coin was struck on the 3 July 1967", but the official PDF brochure says "Launched in 1970". What does this mean? Could it be that the first strikings were internal tests, and the public only was able to buy Krugerrands three years later? --BjKa (talk) 09:50, 27 March 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 1 one external link on Krugerrand. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090310043710/http://www.samint.co.za:80/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=13&Itemid=96 to http://www.samint.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=13&Itemid=96

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers. —cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 23:52, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

Legal tender
Not sure how to add a citation myself, but here is the missing citation for the KR being legal tender

South African Reserve Bank Act Number 90 of 1989 - section 17 - Legal tender

https://www.resbank.co.za/BanknotesandCoin/CurrencyManagement/Documents/SA%20Reserve%20Bank%20Act%2090%20of%201989.pdf

A tender, including a tender by the Bank itself, of an undefaced and unmutilated coin which is lawfully in circulation in the Republic and of current mass, shall be a legal tender of payment of money- (a) in the case of gold coins, in settlement of any amount, and the value of each gold coin so tendered shall be equal to the net amount at which the bank is prepared to purchase that gold coin on the day of such tender thereof; and

Pronunciation
How come it's pronounced [ˈkrœjərˌrant] if Kruger is pronounced [ˈkrœχər], not [ˈkrœjər]? 89.64.26.80 (talk) 00:11, 3 February 2020 (UTC)

Where are they exchanged
I have plenty of them l really need help to exchange them 41.13.70.73 (talk) 21:03, 12 February 2022 (UTC)

Circumventing sanctions in the 1980s
I added the sentence about Krugerrands having been melted down in Hungary in the 1980s. The source is the foreman of the precious metals metallurgy, Mr. Istvan Polgar, who was my father. He spoke of several kilograms of Krugerrands that arrived to the workshop, and he worked with them with a few select coworkers in utmost secrecy. He also told that once a UN delegation arrived to the state mint, and some manager, who was apparently not aware of the secret operation, attempted to guide them through the workshop. Someone quickly tossed a tarpaulin on the box with the Krugerrands, so the secrecy wasn't blown. Sadly, he only ever told this to me orally, and he passed away in 2016. To this day I'm not aware of any official confirmation of the operation. 80.99.120.76 (talk) 23:06, 30 April 2023 (UTC)

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