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Nommo

The Nommo or Nummo are primordial ancestral spirits in Dogon religion and cosmogony (sometimes referred to as demi deities) venerated by the Dogon people of Mali. The word Nommos is derived from a Dogon word meaning "to make one drink." Nommos are usually described as amphibious, hermaphroditic, fish-like creatures. Folk art depictions of Nommos show creatures with humanoid upper torsos, legs/feet, and a fish-like lower torso and tail. Nommos are also referred to as "Masters of the Water", "the Monitors", and "the Teachers". Nommo can be a proper name of an individual or can refer to the group of spirits as a whole. For purposes of this article, "Nommo" refers to a specific individual and "Nommos" is used to reference the group of beings.

Nommo mythology
Dogon religion and Dogon cosmology says that Nommo was the first living creature created by the sky god Amma. Shortly after his creation, Nommo underwent a transformation and multiplied into four pairs of twins. One of the twins rebelled against the universal order created by Amma. To restore order to his creation, Amma sacrificed another of the Nommo progeny, whose body was dismembered and scattered throughout the universe. This dispersal of body parts is seen by the Dogon as the source for the proliferation of Binu shrines throughout the Dogons' traditional territory; wherever a body part fell, a shrine was erected.

In the latter part of the 1940s, French anthropologists Marcel Griaule and Germaine Dieterlen (who had been working with the Dogon since 1931) wrote that they were the recipients of additional, secret mythologies, concerning the Nommo. The Dogon reportedly related to Griaule and Dieterlen a belief that the Nommos were inhabitants of a world circling the star Sirius (see the main article on the Dogon for a discussion of their astronomical knowledge). The Nommos descended from the sky in a vessel accompanied by fire and thunder. After arriving, the Nommos created a reservoir of water and subsequently dived into the water. The Dogon legends state that the Nommos required a watery environment in which to live. According to the myth related to Griaule and Dieterlen: "The Nommo divided his body among men to feed them; that is why it is also said that as the universe "had drunk of his body," the Nommo also made men drink. He gave all his life principles to human beings." The Nommo are also thought to be the origin of the first Hogon.

Controversy
Walter van Beek, an anthropologist studying the Dogon, found no evidence that they had any historical advanced knowledge of Sirius. Van Beek postulated that Griaule engaged in such leading and forceful questioning of his Dogon sources that new myths were created in the process by confabulation, writing that:

"...though they do speak about sigu tolo [what Griaule claimed was Sirius] they disagree completely with each other as to which star is meant; for some it is an invisible star that should rise to announce the sigu [festival], for another it is Venus that, through a different position, appears as sigu tolo. All agree, however, that they learned about the star from Griaule."

Carl Sagan has noted that the first reported association of the Dogon with the knowledge of Sirius as a binary star was in the 1940s, giving the Dogon ample opportunity to gain cosmological knowledge about Sirius and the Solar System from more scientifically advanced, terrestrial societies whom they had come in contact with. It has also been pointed out that binary star systems like Sirius are theorized to have a very narrow or non-existent Habitable zone, and thus a high improbability of containing a planet capable of sustaining life (particularly life as dependent on water as the Nommos were reported to be).

Daughter and colleague of Marcel Griaule, Geneviève Calame-Griaule, defended the project, dismissing Van Beek's criticism as misguided speculation rooted in an apparent ignorance of esoteric tradition. Van Beek continues to maintain that Griaule was wrong and cites other anthropologists who also reject his work.

The assertion that the Dogon knew of another star in the Sirius system, Emme Ya, or "larger than Sirius B but lighter and dim in magnitude" continues to be discussed. In 1995, gravitational studies indicated the possible existence of a red dwarf star circling around Sirius but further observations have failed to confirm this. Space journalist and sceptic James Oberg collected claims that have appeared concerning Dogon mythology in his 1982 book and concedes that such assumptions of recent acquisition are "entirely circumstantial" and have no foundation in documented evidence and concludes that it seems likely that the Sirius mystery will remain exactly what its title implies: a mystery. Earlier, other critics such as the astronomer Peter Pesch and his collaborator Roland Pesch and Ian Ridpath had attributed the supposed "advanced" astronomical knowledge of the Dogon to a mixture of over-interpretation by commentators and cultural contamination.

References in fiction
The belief structure surrounding Nommo, as well as Robert Temple's conclusion from his pseudoarchaeology book The Sirius Mystery, were used by Larry Niven and Steven Barnes as the background for the role-playing game in The California Voodoo Game, the third volume in their Dream Park series. Novelist Tom Robbins discusses Nommo and the Sirius mysteries in his novel Half Asleep in Frog Pajamas. Nommo and the Dogon are also widely mentioned in Philip K. Dick's novel V.A.L.I.S.. The Nommo are also mentioned in the second book of Ian Douglas's Legacy Trilogy (Battlespace) where the marines encounter the Nommo in the Sirius star system. There are also references to the Nommo in Grant Morrison's comic book series, The Invisibles. A major character in the webcomic series Forming by Jesse Moynihan is inspired by (and named) Nommo.

Since 2017, the African Speculative Fiction Society has given out a prize called the Nommo Award to science fiction and fantasy writing from the African continent or by writers from the African diaspora.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Nommo


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List of women's colleges

A women's college is an institution of higher education where enrollment is all-female. In the United States, almost all women's colleges are private undergraduate institutions, with many offering coeducational graduate programs. In other countries, laws and traditions vary.

Somaliland

 * Barwaaqo University, Baliga cas, Somaliland (est. 2017)

Sudan

 * Ahfad University for Women, Omdurman
 * Sudan University College for Women, Khartoum

Zimbabwe

 * Women's University in Africa, Harare (co-ed since unknown, Wikipedia page lists enrollment policy as 80% women and 20% men)

Bangladesh

 * Asian University for Women, Chittagong

China

 * China Women's University, Beijing
 * Shandong Women's University, Jinan
 * Hunan Women's University, Changsha
 * Ginling Women's University, Nanjing (renamed Ginling College in 1927 and merged with the University of Nanking in 1951)
 * Guangdong Women's Polytechnic College, Guangzhou
 * Zhejiang Women's College, Hangzhou
 * Hebei Women's Vocational College, Shijiazhuang
 * Fujian Hwa Nan Women's College, Fuzhou

India

 * Sophia Girl's College (Autonomous), Ajmer
 * Mody University, Sikar
 * Lady Shri Ram College
 * Miranda House
 * Lady Hardinge Medical College
 * Indira Gandhi Delhi Technical University for Women
 * Women's College, Aligarh Muslim University
 * Assam Women's University
 * Bhagat Phool Singh Mahila Vishwavidyalaya
 * Banasthali University
 * Jayoti Vidyapeeth Women's University
 * Karnataka State Women's University
 * Mother Teresa Women's University
 * Rama Devi Women's University
 * SNDT Women's University
 * Sri Padmavati Mahila Visvavidyalayam
 * Avinashilingam Institute for Home Science and Higher Education for Women
 * Gargi college for women
 * MKSSS, Maharshi Karve Stree Shikshan Samstha, Pune

Indonesia

 * International Women University, Bandung
 * Mahad Aisyah binti Abu Bakar Li al-Dakwah, Bogor

Azad Kashmir

 * Women University of Azad Jammu & Kashmir in Bagh, Azad Kashmir

Balochistan

 * Sardar Bahadur Khan Women's University in Quetta

Islamabad Capital Territory

 * Women's Institute of Science & Humanities in Islamabad

Peshawar

 * Jinnah College for Women in Peshawar
 * Shaheed Benazir Bhutto Women University in Peshawar

Mardan

 * Women University Mardan in Mardan

Swabi

 * Women University Swabi in Swabi

Bahawalpur

 * Government Sadiq College Women University in Bahawalpur

Faisalabad

 * Government College Women University Faisalabad in Faisalabad

Lahore

 * Fatima Jinnah Medical University in Lahore
 * Kinnaird College for Women University in Lahore
 * Lahore College for Women University in Lahore

Multan

 * Women University Multan in Multan

Rawalpindi

 * Fatima Jinnah Women University in Rawalpindi
 * Rawalpindi Women University in Rawalpindi

Sialkot

 * Government College Women University Sialkot in Sialkot

Karachi

 * Jinnah University for Women in Karachi
 * Government Elementary College of Education in Karachi

Sukkur

 * Begum Nusrat Bhutto Women University in Sukkur

Philippines

 * Philippine Women's University (co-ed since unknown)
 * Miriam College (since 1999)
 * Assumption College San Lorenzo

South Korea

 * Duksung Women's University
 * Dongduk Women's University
 * Ewha Womans University
 * Kwangju Women's University
 * Seoul Women's University
 * Sookmyung Women's University
 * Sungshin Women's University
 * Baewha Women's University
 * Busan Women's College
 * Hanyang Women's University
 * Kyung-in Women's University
 * Seoul Women's College of Nursing
 * Soongeui Women's College
 * Suwon Women's University

 * Former
 * Hansung Woman's University, Seoul (co-ed since 1978)
 * Soodo Women Teachers' College, Seoul (co-ed and renamed Sejong university since 1979)
 * Sangmyung Women's University, Seoul (co-ed since 1996)
 * Songsim Women's College, Bucheon (merged with Catholic College in 1995; co-ed since 1995)
 * Hyosung Women's College, Daegu (merged with Catholic College of Daegu in 1995; co-ed since 1995)
 * Armed Forces Nursing Academy, Daejeon (co-ed since 2012)

England

 * Bedford College, University of London (co-ed since 1965; merged with Royal Holloway in 1985)
 * Girton College, University of Cambridge (co-ed since 1979)
 * Lady Margaret Hall, University of Oxford, Oxford (co-ed since 1979)
 * Lucy Cavendish College, University of Cambridge (co-ed since 2020)
 * Murray Edwards College, University of Cambridge (mixed-sex Fellowship)
 * Newnham College, University of Cambridge
 * Royal Holloway, University of London (co-ed since 1965; merged with Bedford College in 1985)
 * Hughes Hall, University of Cambridge (co-ed since 1973)
 * Somerville College, University of Oxford (co-ed since 1994)
 * St Aidan's College, Durham University, Durham (co-ed since 1981)
 * St Anne's College, University of Oxford (co-ed since 1979)
 * St Hilda's College, University of Oxford (co-ed since 2008)
 * St Hild's College, Durham University (co-ed since merged with the College of the Venerable Bede in 1975)
 * St Hugh's College, University of Oxford (co-ed since 1986)
 * St Mary's College, Durham University (co-ed since 2005)
 * Trevelyan College, Durham University (co-ed since 1992)
 * Westfield College, University of London, Hampstead (1882: co-ed since 1968; merged with Queen Mary's College in 1989)
 * Queen Elizabeth College, London (co-ed since 1953; merged with King's College London in 1985)
 * Hillcroft College, Surbiton (1920: as the National Residential College for Women; co-ed since merger to form Richmond and Hillcroft Adult Community College in 2017)

Scotland

 * Edinburgh School of Medicine for Women, Edinburgh (1886: closed in 1898)
 * Edinburgh College of Medicine for Women, Edinburgh (1889: co-ed since merger with main medical schools in 1916)

Nova Scotia

 * Mount Saint Vincent University, Halifax (co-ed since 1967)

Ontario

 * Brescia University College, London (affiliated with the co-educational University of Western Ontario)
 * Ewart College, Toronto (merged with Knox College of the University of Toronto in 1990)

Iran

 * Alzahra University, Tehran
 * Refah University College, Tehran

Saudi Arabia
All universities in Saudi Arabia must have a separate campus for women. Men are not allowed to study or work at female campuses, with the exception of King Abdullah University of Science and Technology. There is one women's university, without a male campus, which is:
 * Princess Nora bint Abdul Rahman University

United Arab Emirates

 * Abu Dhabi Women's College, Abu Dhabi
 * Al Ain Women's College, Al Ain
 * Dubai Women's College, Dubai
 * Fujairah Women's College, Fujairah
 * Ras Al Khaimah Women's College, Ras Al Khaimah
 * Sharjah Women's College, Sharjah
 * Zayed University, Abu Dhabi and Dubai
 * Dubai Medical College for Girls
 * Dubai Pharmacy College

New South Wales

 * The Women's College, University of Sydney

Queensland

 * Women's College, University of Queensland, St Lucia
 * Duschesne College, University of Queensland, St Lucia
 * Grace College, University of Queensland, St Lucia (co-ed since 2022)

Victoria

 * St Hilda's College, University of Melbourne (co-ed since 1973)
 * University College, University of Melbourne (co-ed since 1975)

Peru

 * UNIFE, Universidad Femenina del Sagrado Corazón in Lima

title: List of women's colleges


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Katmai National Park and Preserve

Katmai National Park and Preserve is an American national park and preserve in southwest Alaska, notable for the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes and for its brown bears. The park and preserve encompass 4,093,077 acres, which is between the sizes of Connecticut and New Jersey. Most of the national park is a designated wilderness area. The park is named after Mount Katmai, its centerpiece stratovolcano. The park is located on the Alaska Peninsula, across from Kodiak Island, with headquarters in nearby King Salmon, about 290 mi southwest of Anchorage. The area was first designated a national monument in 1918 to protect the area around the major 1912 volcanic eruption of Novarupta, which formed the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes, a 40 sqmi, 100 to 700 ft pyroclastic flow. The park includes as many as 18 individual volcanoes, seven of which have been active since 1900.

Initially designated because of its volcanic history, the monument was left undeveloped and largely unvisited until the 1950s. The monument and surrounding lands became appreciated for their wide variety of wildlife, including an abundance of sockeye salmon and the brown bears that feed upon them. After a series of boundary expansions, the present national park and preserve were established in 1980 under the Alaska National Interest Lands Conservation Act.

Geography

Katmai occupies the Pacific Ocean side of the Alaska Peninsula, opposite Kodiak Island on the Shelikof Strait. The park's chief features are its coast, the Aleutian Range with a chain of fifteen volcanic mountains across the coastal southeastern part of the park, and a series of large lakes in the flatter western part of the park. The closest significant town to the park is King Salmon, where the park's headquarters is located, about 5 mi down the Naknek River from the park entrance. The Alaska Peninsula Highway connects Naknek Lake near the entrance to King Salmon, continuing to the mouth of the river at Naknek. The road is not connected to the Alaska road system. Access to the park's interior is by boat on Naknek Lake. Another road runs from Brooks Camp to Three Forks, which overlooks the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes. The 497 mi long coastline (however, see coastline paradox) is deeply indented, running from the entrance to the Cook Inlet at Kamishak Bay south to Cape Kubugakli. The mountains run from southwest to northeast, about 15 mi inland.

The park abuts McNeil River State Game Sanctuary and Refuge on Kamishak Bay. The Alagnak River, designated a wild river, originates within the preserve at Kukaklek Lake. The Naknek River, which empties into Bristol Bay, originates within the park. The park adjoins Becharof National Wildlife Refuge to the south. Of the park and preserve's acres, 3,922,529 acres are in the national park where all sport and subsistence hunting is prohibited. 418,548 acres are preserve lands, where both sport and subsistence hunting are permitted. The most commonly hunted species in the preserve includes the brown bear, which has led to some problems about bear hunting due to small preserve population sizes and stalking bears to close limits.

The foundation rocks on the Alaska Peninsula are divided by the Bruin Bay Fault into fossiliferous sedimentary rocks of Jurassic and Cretaceous age to the east and metamorphic and igneous rocks to the west. The granite Aleutian Range batholith has intruded through these rocks. The majority of the higher mountains in the park are of volcanic origin. The park has been extensively altered by glaciation, both in the high lands where the mountains have been sculpted by glaciers, and in the lowlands where lakes have been excavated. Outwash plains and terminal moraines are also featured in the park. Soil types vary from rock or volcanic ash of vary depth to deep, wet soils overlain with peat. Although permafrost exists at higher elevations, it is not present in the lowlands.

Two physiographic provinces cover the park. The Aleutian Range province is composed of the Shelikof Strait coastline, about 10 mi deep along the coast, the Aleutian Mountain zone, and the lake, or Hudsonian zone. Farther west the Nushagak-Bristol Bay Lowlands province is separated from the Aleutian zone by the Bruin Bay Fault, occupying a small corner of the park.

Volcanoes
The active volcanoes in the park are Mount Katmai, Novarupta, Trident Volcano, Mount Mageik, Mount Martin and Fourpeaked Mountain. Other volcanoes that have erupted in recent times in geological terms, but not in historical times, are Mount Douglas, Mount Griggs, Snowy Mountain, Mount Denison, Mount Kukak, Devils Desk, Mount Kaguyak, Mount Cerberus, Falling Mountain and Kejulik Volcano. Martin and Mageik produce steam that can be seen from King Salmon, while Trident was active in 1957–1965 and 1968.

The most significant volcanic event in historical times was the simultaneous eruption of Mount Katmai and Novarupta in June 1912. Novarupta's eruption produced a pyroclastic flow that covered a nearby valley with ash as much as 300 ft thick. At the same time the summit of Katmai collapsed into a caldera. As the valley deposits cooled, they emitted steam from fissures and fumaroles, earning the name "Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes". As heat has dissipated from the deposits the steam vents have subsided and the valley has been eroded. At present streams have cut canyons as much as 100 ft deep, but only 5 to 10 ft wide. Katmai is a stratovolcano, 6716 ft in height, with a large summit caldera. Several glaciers originate from the mountain, and one in the caldera is one of the few to have formed in historical times. The caldera floor is about 250 m below the rim. The mountain stands on Jurassic sedimentary rocks, and its volcanic components are less than 1500 ft thick. Apart from the 1912 eruption, no significant activity has occurred in historical times. Novarupta is described as a Plinian pyroclastic vent with a plug dome, a 2000 m diameter crater with a 65 m, 400 m diameter dome in the middle. Its only historical activity was the 1912 eruption. Trident is a complex of three stratovolcanoes, the highest of which is 3599 ft tall, standing up to 1894 ft above their base. Trident has been intermittently active in historical times, primarily between 1953 and 1974. During that time about 0.7 cubic kilometers of material was erupted to form a new peak called Southwest Trident from the former site of a large fumarolic pit. Mount Martin is 6102 ft high, standing on a 1400 m high ridge near Mount Mageik, partly overlapping the much older Alagogshak volcano. The summit has a 300 m diameter crater, containing fumaroles and sometimes a crater lake. A large lava flow extends from the mountain to fill the upper part of Angle Creek's valley with about five cubic kilometers of material. There have been no significant eruptions from Martin, but the summit emits steam and the volcano is the site of earthquake swarms. Mageik stands on the same sedimentary rocks as Martin. The composite structure has four vents, the highest at 7103 ft and three subsidiary vent cones. A small crater hold a lake and fumaroles on the highest cone's flank. Apart from steaming there has been no recent activity, but there was a large debris avalanche in 1912, probably associated with the eruption of Katmai, amounting to between 0.05 and 0.10 cubic kilometer in volume. Fourpeaked Mountain is a stratovolcano with a probable vent at the summit. Much of the 6903 ft mountain is covered by Fourpeaked Glacier. Fourpeaked produced phreatic eruptions in September 2006.

Mount Griggs is a 7602 ft stratovolcano near Novarupta, and somewhat to the northwest of the otherwise straight line of volcanoes in Katmai. The flat-topped mountain has three concentric craters, the largest 1500 m wide. The mountain's geochemistry differs from its neighbors. Griggs has active sulfurous fumaroles. Snowy Mountain is a small volcano 7090 ft tall, with ten significant glaciers covering almost all of the mountain. Roughly a third to half of the mountain has been eroded by glacial action. The volcano has two vents about 4 km apart, and active fumaroles at the tallest summit. Mount Denison is a 7605 ft peak with four related vents at the head of three glaciers, the tallest point in the park. Mount Kukak is another ice-covered volcano, 6693 ft tall. It has a strong fumarole field near the summit. Devils Desk is a heavily eroded stratovolcano, 6411 ft high. Kaguyak is a stratovolcano truncated by a caldera, like Katmai. The highest peak is 2956 ft, with a 2.5 km diameter crater lake. There are two large domes within the caldera and two on the flanks. Mount Douglas is a 7021 ft stratovolcano, extensively eroded by ice, with a small acidic crater lake at its summit. 7454 ft Mount Steller is located between Kukak and Denison, with an unknown number of vents in ice-covered terrain. Kejulik is a 4977 ft eroded volcanic remnant. None of these volcanoes have exhibited significant behavior in historic times.

Activities
Activities at Katmai include hiking, backpacking, camping, backcountry skiing, fishing, kayaking, boat tours, and interpretive programs.

Katmai is also well known for Alaskan brown bears and the sockeye salmon that attract both bears and people. Katmai contains the world's largest protected brown bear population, estimated to number about 2,200. Bears are especially likely to congregate at the Brooks Falls viewing platform when the salmon are spawning, and many well known photographs of Alaskan brown bears have been taken there. The salmon arrive early at Brooks Falls compared to other streams, and between 43 and 70 individual bears have been documented at the falls in July and an equal number of bears are seen in the lower river in September. The coastal areas such as Hallo Bay, Kukak Bay, Kuliak Bay, Kaflia Bay, Geographic Harbor and Chiniak Bay also host very high population densities of bears year-round, due to the availability of clams and edible coastal sedge as well as salmon and other fish. Other hotspots include Swikshak Lagoon, American Creek, and in the preserve, Moraine Creek and Funnel Creek.

The vast majority of Katmai visitors come to Brooks Camp, one of the only developed areas of the park, and few venture further than the bear viewing platforms and the adjacent Brooks Camp area. Rangers at the park are extremely careful not to allow bears to obtain human food or get into confrontations with humans. As a result, bears in Katmai Park are uniquely unafraid of and uninterested in humans, and will allow people to approach (and photograph) much more closely than bears elsewhere. The bears of Brooks Camp can be seen on computers and smartphones via webcams pioneered by the National Park Service. July and September are by far the best months for viewing brown bears in the Brooks Camp area.

Lodging is available in the park at Brooks Camp and Grosvenor Lodge and at several other lodges scattered around the park on inholdings.

Climate
According to the Köppen climate classification system, Katmai National Park and Preserve has a subarctic climate (Dfc) with cool summers and year around precipitation. Dfc climates are defined by their coldest month averaging below 32 F, 1–3 months averaging above 50 F, all months with average temperatures below 71.6 F and no significant precipitation difference between seasons. According to the United States Department of Agriculture, the Plant Hardiness zone at Brooks Falls at 92 ft elevation is 3b with an average annual extreme minimum temperature of -30.9 F.

Ecosystems
Weather at Katmai is variable, though reliably rainy or drizzly. Summer high temperatures average about 63 F and winter lows are between -4 and 40 F. Fall is somewhat drier than the rest of the year, and warm days can occur year-round. Rainfall is heaviest near the coast, with up to 60 in, and lighter to the west. The park supports 29 mammal species, 137 bird species, 24 freshwater fish species and four anadromous fish species.

Mammal species that inhabit Katmai include snowshoe hare, moose, timber wolf, brown bear, coyote, beaver, lynx, wolverine, river otter, mink, Arctic and red fox species, weasel, porcupine, and marten. Marine mammals include the harbor seal, sea lion, sea otter, beluga whale, killer whale and gray whale. Caribou are occasionally within the park during winter seasons.

The most important fish in the park are sockeye salmon, which feed bears, bald eagles and others during their spawning runs in the park's rivers. Salmon enter the Naknek River drainage from Bristol Bay in June and July and spawn from August to October.

The park also supports a variety of plant communities. Common wildflowers that grow in the park include beachhead iris, nootka lupine, and woolly geranium.

Precontact period and archaeology
Prehistoric artifacts have been found dating to about 6,000 years before the present near the old Katmai village on the park's south coast. A number of other sites have been found along the coast, notably those of Kaguyak and Kukak, with occupation into historic times. Some of these, including sites "49 AF 3" near Kanatak and "49 MK 10", present clear evidence of habitation up to the 1912 eruption, but have not been investigated in detail. The Amalik Bay Archeological District is a major area containing evidence of some of the earliest human activity in the area, with finds dating back more than 7,000 years.

Inland, Brooks Camp is a significant archaeological site dating to about 4500 BP, listed on the National Register of Historic Places (NRHP) in 1977 and designated a National Historic Landmark in 1993. A village abandoned after the 1912 eruption at the mouth of the Savonoski River is documented as the "Old Savonoski Site", while a more extensive district of sites is located near the mouth of the Grosvenor River. The "DIL-161 Site" is located in the watershed of the Alagnak River, and shows evidence of habitation in the first millennium.

Russians and Americans
Russians were the first Europeans to arrive in the area in significant numbers, trading in furs. They encountered the Aglegmuit Eskimos on the Bristol Bay side of the peninsula and the Koniag Eskino on the Shelikov Strait side. Katmai Village was the only location within the park where Europeans lived through the mid-19th century, though their numbers were always few. In the latter part of the 19th century a few villages were established inland at Severnosky and along the coast at Douglas and Kukak. American traders operating for the Alaska Commercial Company took the place of the Russians. As sea otters became scarce the trade dried up, and Katmai and Douglas were abandoned in the early 20th century. In the 1890s the region was a route for travelers going to Nome for Nome's short-lived gold rush. Writer Rex Beach was one of these, writing about life on Bristol Bay during the salmon run in The Silver Horde. Prospects for oil, gold and coal received brief attention, then died out by 1912.

By 1898 there were reports of frequent earthquakes in the vicinity of Katmai Pass. These intensified around June 1, 1912, inducing the few local residents to leave. Katmai and Novarupta erupted on June 6 with a noise heard in Fairbanks, 500 mi away, and Juneau, 750 mi distant. Heavy eruptions continued through June 7, then gradually declined from June 8 onwards. Ash fell 6 to 12 in deep in Kodiak, and ash fell on the Alaskan mainland and eastwards as far as Puget Sound. Atmospheric haze was noted worldwide, and temperatures were depressed in the northern hemisphere during the second half of 1912. Initial reports pinpointed Mount Katmai as the center of eruption. Later reports cast doubt on Katmai's primary role, and it was not until 1954 that Novarupta was found to be the primary volcanic center. The region around the mountains, which had received heavy ashfall, was devastated.

The National Geographic Society backed five expeditions to Katmai, beginning in 1915 with a trip to Kodiak Island and a short stay on the mainland. The expedition, led by Robert Fiske Griggs, a botanist who was initially interested in the study of plant recolonization. Griggs' follow-up expedition in 1916 discovered and named the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes and found Novarupta. The National Geographic Society, delighted with the discoveries, funded a larger expedition in 1917 to make a survey of the region. The subsequent articles published in National Geographic magazine brought the region to prominence in the public, and Griggs began to advocate for the protection of the area in the national park system, backed by the National Geographic Society. At this time legislation to establish Mount McKinley National Park (later renamed Denali National Park) was pending, and the idea of making Katmai a national park was discussed by National Park Service acting director Horace M. Albright and National Geographic Society president Gilbert Hovey Grosvenor. Albright advised that national park legislation was unlikely to pass, suggesting instead that the region be protected as a national monument by the President, using the Antiquities Act of 1906. After some negotiation, and after a 1918 expedition opined that the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes was a permanent feature, a proclamation was prepared to protect 1080000 acre around Mount Katmai, the valley, and the most of Iliuk Arm of Naknek Lake. Although only a third the area of the present park and preserve, the monument was nevertheless half the size of Yellowstone National Park from the outset. President Woodrow Wilson signed the proclamation of Katmai National Monument on September 24, 1918.

National monument
The proclamation had little immediate effect, other than grumbling from territorial officials. A 1923 expedition found that the region had little exploitable mineral potential. Tourists in the early 1920s amounted to a few dozen. No National Park Service staff were assigned to the site, which was in theory administered by Mount McKinley. By 1928 more visitors arrived. The most prominent among them was Father Bernard R. Hubbard, an explorer of Alaska who gained fame as "The Glacier Priest". Hubbard documented the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes in movies that he showed at lectures until the 1950s. At the same time, the Park Service became aware that Katmai was among the best habitat for grizzlies in Alaska, and that the monument should be expanded to protect them and the prolific salmon spawning grounds. In 1931 President Herbert Hoover issued a proclamation expanding the monument under the Antiquities Act to 2697590 acre, more than doubling it in size and creating the largest single Park Service unit. Crucially, the expanded monument included the falls at Brooks Camp, while avoiding lands along the coast thought to have potential oil deposits.

In 1937 a ranger was finally assigned to Katmai, seconded to the monument from Mount McKinley, spending most of June trying to get there and one day in the monument before returning to Mount McKinley. In 1939 the United States Bureau of Fisheries established an encampment at the Brooks Lake outlet, having previously blasted out part of the falls in 1921. At about the same time the Park Service became concerned about illegal trapping in the monument, asking the Alaska Fish and Game Commission to send wardens to patrol the area. Several trappers were apprehended, and Park Service personnel visited the monument, sending back positive reports on the scenery and wildlife. These reports, and efforts to make poaching more difficult, led to another boundary adjustment that included the islands in the Shelikof Strait and Cook Inlet within 5 mi of the old boundary, signed by President Franklin D. Roosevelt on August 4, 1941, which increased the monument's area by several thousand acres.

Poaching increased after World War II. At the same time, Alaskan territorial interests sought to have the monument disestablished or reduced in size to allow mining and fishing, because the activity at the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes had declined, and because the Park Service had made no effort to develop the monument for visitors. These proposals were turned aside, and in 1950 a seasonal ranger was assigned to Katmai. William Nancarrow built a small camp at Brooks River. By the mid-1950s the Park Service embarked on its Mission 66 program to expand visitor services. Katmai was to receive a headquarters at King Salmon, a visitor center at Valley Junction in the Valley of Ten Thousand Smokes, ranger stations, campgrounds, modest roads and dock facilities on the lakes. An airstrip was also proposed for Brooks Camp. The airstrip was not built, but a road from Brooks Camp to the valley was built. In the early 1960s a road was proposed that would run across the peninsula through the park, connecting to King Salmon. The Park Service was opposed. The 1964 Alaska earthquake stalled the proposal for several years, resurfacing in 1968 with local support. However, the Park Service opposed the plans and the road project was set aside. In the meantime headquarters facilities were developed at King Salmon. In 1967 the state of Alaska set aside the McNeil River State Game Sanctuary with 85000 acre under protection to safeguard the bear fishing grounds on the river, adjacent to Katmai. McNeil River was declared a National Natural Landmark in 1968. In the 1990s a state game refuge, with 120000 acre was established to the north of the sanctuary to protect Chenik Lake, which supported a smaller fish run, attracting bears. The refuge and the expanded 128000 acre sanctuary have remained closed to hunting, despite an unsuccessful 2005 attempt by Governor Frank Murkowski and again in 2007 by Sarah Palin's Board of Game. Recently there have been proposals to merge the sanctuary and refuge into Katmai.

When George B. Hartzog Jr. became director of the National Park Service in 1964 he commissioned a report on Alaskan public lands, entitled Operation Great Land. The study identified 39 site that might become preserves or recreation lands, and it recommended that Katmai be expanded somewhat to the west and substantially to the north. The boundary adjustments were amended to a westward expansion of 94547 acre that President Lyndon B. Johnson signed in 1968, producing anger in Alaska. In 1971 Katmai finally gained a full-time, on-site park superintendent. Also in 1971, Congress passed the Alaska Native Claims Settlement Act (ANCSA), which established a framework to divide up Alaska's federal lands. ANCSA established a timetable for claims, withdrawals and designations, requiring the Park Service to come up with a plan for future park units. The Park Service proposed 33000000 acre of new park lands, among them a 1218490 acre expansion of Katmai. Through the mid-1970s a variety of proposals were circulated for expansion and wilderness designation. At the same time, concerns were raised about the withdrawal of game lands from sport hunting, and the ability of local residents to continue to practice subsistence hunting. To address these concerns, legislation was proposed to create national preserve lands that would confer protection while allowing regulated sport hunting. Early versions of the Alaska National Interest Lands Conservation Act (ANILCA) proposed Katmai National Park and Preserve as a combination of park and preserve lands. This legislation was stalled in Congress by 1978. Because a deadline was approaching for state selection of public lands, President Jimmy Carter used his authority under the Antiquities Act to expand Katmai by 1370000 acre on December 1, 1978, mainly on the northern side of the monument.

National park and preserve
It took two more years for Congress to act on a final ANILCA bill. On December 2, 1980, the final bill established Katmai National Park and Preserve with 1037000 acre of additional park, bringing it to 3,674,529.33 acre and 308000 acre of preserve, with 3,384,358 acre of wilderness lands. Unlike most ANILCA parks, the legislation for Katmai did not grant subsistence hunting access to national park lands, only to the preserve. Sport and subsistence hunting is prohibited in Katmai National Park but allowed in the preserve.

Exxon Valdez oil spill
The grounding of the oil tanker Exxon Valdez in Prince William Sound on March 24, 1989, produced extensive contamination of the Katmai coastline. By early April, oil had reached Kenai Fjords National Park. Oil reached Cape Douglas in Katmai on April 26 and points southwards in the following week. In early May, a variety of dredges and skimmer vessels were working in the Shelikof Strait, but 90% of the Katmai coastline was oiled. The worst-hit areas were Cape Chiniak and Chiniak Lagoon, Hallo Bay Beach and its lagoon, Cape Gull and Kaflia Bay, and Cape Douglas. Casualties in birds alone were estimated at 8,400 dead birds. Work resumed in 1990, with smaller efforts in 1991 to catch the last oil.

Administrative
The superintendent of Katmai is also responsible for Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve and Alagnak Wild River.

List of superintendents

 * Gilbert E. Blinn 3/1971 – 6/1979
 * Roy M. Sanborn (acting) 6/1979 – 9/1979
 * David K. Morris 9/1979 – 4/1987
 * James R. Pepper (acting) 7/1987 – 8/1987
 * Gilbert R. (Ray) Bane 8/1987 - 3/1990
 * James F. Ryan (acting) 3/1990 – 6/1990
 * Alan D. Eliason 6/1990 – 7/1993
 * Will Tipton (acting) 8/1993-12/1993
 * William Pierce 12/1993 – 1998 (moved to Anchorage in 1996)
 * Deborah O. Liggett 10/1998 - 7/2003
 * Joe Fowler (acting) 8/2003 – 11/2003
 * Joe Fowler 11/2003 – 4/2005
 * Steve Frye 6/2005- 3/2006
 * Troy Hamon (acting) 4/2006 – 7/2006
 * Ralph Moore 7/2006 – 10/2012
 * Diane Chung 2013 – 2016
 * Karen Bradford 2016 – 2017
 * Mark Sturm 2017 – Present

title: Katmai National Park and Preserve


text:
Talk:Symmetry group

Major mistakes in section about symmetry groups of two-dimensional objects
In the section Two dimensions one assertion reads as follows:

"D2, which is isomorphic to the Klein four-group, is the symmetry group of a non-equilateral rectangle . . . "

But this is not true. In fact the entire section is filled with mistakes like this. The symmetry group of a non-equilateral rectangle has 8 elements, not 4. Since every element is of order 2, this must be isomorphic to the group Z/2Z ⊕ Z/2Z ⊕ Z/2Z.

The section discusses only orientation-preserving symmetries, and it does this without saying so. There is no particular reason to restrict to only orientation-preserving isometries, and even though the discussion is about 2-dimensional objects there is no reason for a reader to assume that symmetries need to be orientation-preserving.

On the other hand, orientation-preserving symmetry groups (of orientable objects) are interesting in their own right, so in my opinion they should be mentioned as long as they are clearly labeled as to what they are.

And so this needs to be fixed.Daqu (talk) 16:54, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

 * replacing my previous edit I think we should find a suitable figure, then. —Quondum 20:45, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Fixed: non-equilateral rectangle → non-equilateral isosceles triangle.  —Quondum 20:49, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I count only two symmetries for a non-equilateral isosceles triangle: the identity and the median through the different side. Which are the other two? --DonBex (talk) 00:02, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

 * This fix is wrong, the symmetry group of a non-equilateral isosceles triangle is not isomorphic to the Klein-four group. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.50.93.196 (talk) 22:49, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

 * I will start with two general statements before answering the specific questions. First, it is important to remember that this section deals with two dimensions. Some of the above statements are valid for three dimensions but not with two. And second, the elements of a group are symmetry operations such as rotations and reflections, rather than symmetry elements such as axes and planes.
 * In two dimensions, the isosceles triangle has only two symmetry operations = the identity operation and a single reflection in the plane which bisects the triangle. The rectangle has four symmetry operations: the identity operation, reflections in two planes, and rotation by 180o. So the rectangle is isomorphic to the Klein-four group and the isosceles triangle is not. DonBex's original fix was therefore correct in two dimensions and I will restore it. I will also add the list of the symmetry operations.
 * Note however that in three dimensions, the isosceles triangle has four symmetry operations and the rectangle has eight. In the Schoenflies notation of spectroscopy and chemistry, the isosceles triangle has symmetry group C2v which is isomorphic to the Klein-four group, while the rectangle has symmetry group D2h. These facts may be the source of the confusion, but they are not strictly relevant to the section on two-dimensional objects. Dirac66 (talk) 01:15, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

Transformation
Shouldn't the transformations in the symmetry group of for instance a triangle be isometries?Madyno (talk) 13:35, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

 * I would say it depends on what one means by "triangle". If it is a geometrical triangle, then yes, the symmetry group in mind is likely the isometry.  If it is a triangle graph (for example), then no, it would not be because there is no distance structure to preserve.  In general, what one means by "symmetry" is always in the context of what structure one is preserving.  That may include the distance, or it might not.   Sławomir Biały  (talk) 16:42, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

 * Right, yes, but my proble is that not every transformation of a triangle, that maps the triangle on itself is a symmetry. Yet the definition says so. Madyno (talk) 18:42, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

 * Not knowing the specific context you're referring to, I would guess that by "transformation" is intended Euclidean transformation. In that case, the statement is true, but could perhaps be clarified.  Sławomir Biały  (talk) 19:23, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

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"Blue arrows"?
The arrows in the figure are, roughly speaking, some sorts of pink and burnt orange. I do not edit pages any more. Perhaps someone could get cracking on this legend. 207.229.130.147 (talk) 02:39, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

Clarify that the 12 "rotations" of the tetrahedron includes the identity rotation
Re. "A tetrahedron is invariant under 12 distinct rotations, reflections excluded. These are illustrated here in the cycle graph format,": The graph shows only 11 rotations. The 12th is the "identity rotation", which is not actually a rotation; it is the rotation of no rotation. So (A) the caption should clarify that, and (B) why do we even count the identity rotation as a rotation? Philgoetz (talk) 15:30, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

 * I reworded the caption. I think this is much more accurate. The identity rotation is counted as a rotation to complete the rotation subgroup.—Anita5192 (talk) 16:13, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Symmetry group


text:
Religious perspectives on Jesus

The religious perspectives on Jesus vary among world religions. Jesus' teachings and the retelling of his life story have significantly influenced the course of human history, and have directly or indirectly affected the lives of billions of people, including non-Christians. He is considered by many to be one of the most influential persons to have ever lived, finding a significant place in numerous cultural contexts. In Christianity, Jesus is the Messiah (Christ) foretold in the Old Testament and the Son of God. Christians believe that through his death and resurrection, humans can be reconciled to God and thereby are offered salvation and the promise of eternal life. These beliefs emphasize that as the willing Lamb of God, Jesus chose to suffer in Calvary as a sign of his full obedience to the will of his Father, as an "agent and servant of God". Christians view Jesus as a role model, whose God-focused life believers are encouraged to imitate.

In Islam, Jesus (commonly transliterated as Isa) is the Messiah and one of God's highest-ranked and most-beloved prophets. Islam considers Jesus to be neither the incarnation nor the Son of God. He is referred to as the son of Mary in the Qu’ran. Islamic texts emphasize a strict affirmation of monotheism (tawhid) and forbid the association of partners with God, which would be idolatry (shirk).

In the Druze faith, Jesus is considered one of God's important prophets and the Messiah.

The Baháʼí Faith considers Jesus to be one of many manifestations of God, who are a series of personages who reflect the attributes of the divine into the human world. Baháʼís reject the idea that divinity was contained with a single human body.

Apart from his own disciples and followers, the Jews of Jesus' day generally rejected him as the Messiah, as do the great majority of Jews today. Mainstream Jewish scholars argue that Jesus neither fulfilled the Messianic prophecies in the Tanakh nor embodied the personal qualifications of the Messiah.

Sikhism views Jesus as a high-ranked Holy man or saint.

Other world religions such as Buddhism have no particular view on Jesus, and have but a minor intersection with Christianity.

For non-religious perspectives on Jesus, see historical Jesus.

Christianity
Christian views of Jesus are based on the teachings and beliefs as outlined in the Canonical gospels, New Testament letters, the Christian creeds, as well as specific denominational teachings. These documents outline the key beliefs held by Christians about Jesus, including his divinity, humanity, and earthly life, and that he is the Christ and the Son of God.

Although Christian views of Jesus vary, it is possible to summarize the key beliefs shared among major denominations, as stated in their catechetical or confessional texts. Generally speaking, adhering to the Christian faith requires a belief that Jesus is the Son of God and the Messiah or Christ. Jesus refers to himself as the Son of God in the New Testament.

Christians consider Jesus to be the Messiah (Christ) and believe that through his death and resurrection, humans can be reconciled to God and thereby are offered salvation and the promise of eternal life. These teachings emphasize that as the willing Lamb of God, Jesus chose to suffer in Calvary as a sign of his full obedience to the will of his Father, as an "agent and servant of God". The choice Jesus made thus counter-positions him as a new man of morality and obedience, in contrast to Adam's disobedience.

The five major milestones in the gospel narrative of the life of Jesus are his Baptism, Transfiguration, Crucifixion, Resurrection and Ascension. These are usually bracketed by two other episodes: his Nativity at the beginning and the sending of the Paraclete at the end. The gospel accounts of the teachings of Jesus are often presented in terms of specific categories involving his "works and words", e.g. his ministry, parables and miracles. The words of Jesus include several sermons, in addition to parables that appear throughout the narrative of the Synoptic Gospels (the gospel of John includes no parables).

Christians not only attach theological significance to the works of Jesus, but also to his name. Devotions to the Holy Name of Jesus go back to the earliest days of Christianity. These devotions and feasts exist both in Eastern and Western Christianity.

Incarnation
Most Christians believe that Jesus was both human and the Son of God. While there have been theological debate over the nature of Jesus, Trinitarian Christians generally believe that Jesus is God incarnate, God the Son, and "true God and true man" (or both fully divine and fully human). Jesus, having become fully human in all respects, suffered the pains and temptations of a mortal man, yet he did not sin. As fully God, he defeated death and rose to life again. According to the Bible, God raised him from the dead. He ascended to heaven, to the "right hand of God," and he will return again for the Last Judgment and the establishment of the Kingdom of God.

Islam
In Islam, Jesus (Isa) is considered to be a messenger of God (Allah) and the Messiah (al-Masih) who was sent to guide the Descendants of Israel (Bani Isra'il) with a new scripture, the Gospel (Injil).

The Quran mentions Jesus by name 25 times—more often than Muhammad —and emphasises that Jesus was a mortal human who, like all other prophets, had been divinely chosen to spread God's message. Unlike Christian writings, the Quran does not describe Jesus as the son of God, but as one of four major human messengers (out of many prophets) sent by God throughout history to guide mankind. Jesus is said to have lived a life of piety and generosity, and abstained from eating flesh of swine.

Muslims also believe that Jesus received a Gospel from God, called the Injil. However, Muslims hold that Jesus' original message was lost or altered and that the Christian New Testament does not accurately represent God's original message to mankind.

Despite major differences, the Quran and New Testament overlap in other aspects of Jesus' life; both Muslims and Christians believe that Jesus was miraculously born without a human biological father by the will of God, and that his mother, Mary (Maryam in Arabic), is among the most saintly, pious, chaste and virtuous women ever. The Quran also specifies that Jesus was able to perform miracles—though only by the will of God—including being able to raise the dead, restore sight to the blind and cure lepers. One miracle attributed to Jesus in the Quran, but not in the New Testament, is his being able to speak at only a few days old, to defend his mother from accusations of adultery. It also says that Jesus was a 'word' from God, since he was predicted to come in the Old Testament.

Most Muslims believe that he was neither killed nor crucified, but that God made it appear so to his enemies. With the noteworthy exception of Ahmadi Muslims who believe that Jesus was indeed put on the cross, survived the crucifixion and was not lifted bodily to the heaven, the majority of Muslims believe that Jesus ascended bodily to heaven and is alive. Some Muslim scholars maintain that Jesus was indeed put up on the cross, but did not die on it; rather, he revived and then ascended bodily to heaven. Others say that it was actually Judas Iscariot who was mistakenly crucified by the Romans. Regardless, Muslims believe that Jesus is alive in heaven and will return to the world in the flesh to defeat the Antichrist, once the world has become filled with sin, deception and injustice, and then live out the rest of his natural life.

Islam rejects the Trinitarian Christian view that Jesus was God incarnate or the son of God, that he was ever crucified or resurrected or that he ever atoned for the sins of mankind. The Quran says that Jesus himself, when asked by God if he said that people shall regard him and Mary as gods, will deny this.

Judaism
Judaism rejects the idea of Jesus being God, or a person of a Trinity, or a mediator to God. Judaism also holds that Jesus is not the Messiah, arguing that he had not fulfilled the Messianic prophecies in the Tanakh nor embodied the personal qualifications of the Messiah. According to Jewish tradition, there were no more prophets after Malachi, who lived centuries before Jesus and delivered his prophesies about 420 BCE.

According to Conservative Judaism, Jews who believe Jesus is the Messiah have "crossed the line out of the Jewish community". Reform Judaism, the modern progressive movement, states "For us in the Jewish community anyone who claims that Jesus is their savior is no longer a Jew and is an apostate".

Jesus in Jewish writings
The Babylonian Talmud include stories of Yeshu יֵשׁוּ; the vast majority of contemporary historians disregard these as sources on the historical Jesus. Contemporary Talmud scholars view these as comments on the relationship between Judaism and Christians or other sectarians, rather than comments on the historical Jesus.

The Mishneh Torah, an authoritative work of Jewish law, states in Hilkhot Melakhim 11:10–12 that Jesus is a "stumbling block" who makes "the majority of the world err to serve a divinity besides God". "Even Jesus the Nazarene who imagined that he would be Messiah and was killed by the court, was already prophesied by Daniel. So that it was said, "And the members of the outlaws of your nation would be carried to make a (prophetic) vision stand. And they stumbled." Because, is there a greater stumbling-block than this one? So that all of the prophets spoke that the Messiah redeems Israel, and saves them, and gathers their banished ones, and strengthens their commandments. And this one caused (nations) to destroy Israel by sword, and to scatter their remnant, and to humiliate them, and to exchange the Torah, and to make the majority of the world err to serve a divinity besides God. However, the thoughts of the Creator of the world — there is no force in a human to attain them because our ways are not God's ways, and our thoughts not God's thoughts. And all these things of Jesus the Nazarene, and of (Muhammad) the Ishmaelite who stood after him — there is no (purpose) but to straighten out the way for the King Messiah, and to restore all the world to serve God together. So that it is said, "Because then I will turn toward the nations (giving them) a clear lip, to call all of them in the name of God and to serve God (shoulder to shoulder as) one shoulder." Look how all the world already becomes full of the things of the Messiah, and the things of the Torah, and the things of the commandments! And these things spread among the far islands and among the many nations uncircumcised of heart."

Baháʼí Faith
The Baháʼí Faith consider Jesus to be a manifestation of God, who are a series of personages who reflect the attributes of the divine into the human world for the progress and advancement of human morals and civilization. In Baháʼí belief, the Manifestations have always been sent by God, and always will, as part of the single progressive religion from God bringing more teachings through time to help humanity progress. The Manifestations of God are taught to be "one and the same", and in their relationship to one another have both the station of unity and the station of distinction. In this way each Manifestation of God manifested the Word of God and taught the same religion, with modifications for the particular audience's needs and culture. Bahá'u'lláh wrote that since each Manifestation of God has the same divine attributes, they can be seen as the spiritual "return" of all the previous Manifestations of God. In this way, Baháʼís believe that Bahá'u'lláh is, in both respects, the return of Jesus.

Druze Faith
In the Druze faith, Jesus is considered one of God's important prophets and the Messiah, being among the seven prophets who appeared in different periods of history. The Druze venerate Jesus "the son of Joseph and Mary" and his four disciples, who wrote the Gospels. In the Druze tradition, Jesus is known under three titles: the True Messiah (al-Masih al-Haq), the Messiah of all Nations (Masih al-Umam), and the Messiah of Sinners. This is due, respectively, to the belief that Jesus delivered the true Gospel message, the belief that he was the Saviour of all nations, and the belief that he offers forgiveness.

According to the Druze manuscripts Jesus is the Greatest Imam and the incarnation of Ultimate Reason (Akl) on earth and the first cosmic principle (Hadd), and regards Jesus and Hamza ibn Ali as the incarnations of one of the five great celestial powers, who form part of their system. Druze believe that Hamza ibn Ali was a reincarnation of Jesus, and that Hamza ibn Ali is the true Messiah, who directed the deeds of the messiah Jesus "the son of Joseph and Mary", but when Jesus "the son of Joseph and Mary" strayed from the path of the true Messiah, Hamza filled the hearts of the Jews with hatred for him - and for that reason, they crucified him, according to the Druze manuscripts. Despite this, Hamza ibn Ali took him down from the cross and allowed him to return to his family, in order to prepare men for the preaching of his religion.

In an epistle ascribed to one of the founders of Druzism, Baha al-Din al-Muqtana, probably written sometime between AD 1027 and AD 1042, accused the Jews of crucifying Jesus.

Other
Traditionally, Buddhists as a group take no particular view on Jesus, and Buddhism and Christianity have but a minor intersection. However, some scholars have noted similarities between the life and teachings of Gautama Buddha and Jesus. These similarities might be attributed to Buddhist missionaries sent as early as Emperor Ashoka around 250 BCE in many of the Greek Seleucid kingdoms that existed then and then later became the same regions in which Christianity began.

Jesus was seen as the saviour and bringer of gnosis by various Gnostic sects, such as the quasi-extinct Manichaeism.

The Vietnamese syncretic religion Cao Dai locates Jesus in the celestial Council of Great Spirits that directs the universe.

In the Ahmadiyya Islamic view, Jesus survived the crucifixion and later travelled to India, where he lived as a prophet (and died) under the name of Yuz Asaf.

According to The Urantia Book, Jesus was one of numerous sons of God named Michael of Nebadon, who took on earthly incarnation.

In Raëlism, Jesus and several other religious figures are considered prophets sent by an extraterrestrial race called the Elohim.

The Religious Science movement considers Jesus to be a teacher of “Science of Mind”.

The Lacandon people of Central America acknowledge Äkyantho', the god of foreigners. He has a son named Hesuklistos (Jesus Christ) who is supposed to be the god of the foreigners. They recognize that Hesuklistos is a god but do not feel he is worthy of worship as he is a minor god.

Unlike other religions, Hinduism has no established set of beliefs and thus no universal or common view of Jesus. However, a lot of Hindus, including religious and political leaders, tend to variously venerate Jesus as either a Āchārya, Sadhu or Avatar. Some Hindus and Hare Krishnas also claim that Jesus was predicted or prophesied in the scripture Bhavishya Purana.

title: Religious perspectives on Jesus


text:
Scream queen

A scream queen (a wordplay on screen queen) is an actress who is prominent and influential in horror films, either through a notable appearance or recurring roles. A scream king is the male equivalent. Notable female examples include Barbara Steele, Sandra Peabody, Linda Blair, Olivia Hussey, Marilyn Burns, Neve Campbell, Daria Nicolodi, Dee Wallace, Jamie Lee Curtis, Mia Goth, Samara Weaving, Heather Langenkamp, Shawnee Smith, Emma Roberts, Sarah Michelle Gellar and Linnea Quigley.

Definition
The term "scream queen" is more specifically used to refer to the attractive young damsels-in-distress characters that have appeared in a number of films in the horror genre. Lloyd Kaufman, co-founder of Troma Entertainment, noted that being a scream queen is "more than just crying and having ketchup thrown on you. You not only have to be attractive, but you also have to have a big brain. You have to be frightened, you have to be sad, you have to be romantic."

Debbie Rochon, often described as a scream queen herself, wrote in an article originally published in GC Magazine that "a true Scream Queen isn't The Perfect Woman. She's sexy, seductive, but most importantly attainable to the average guy, or so it would seem." Although the earlier scream queens might be women that "just had to look pretty and shriek a lot until the hero of the film got around to save them." The later scream queens showcase women worrying about something other than a guy...unless said guy is the one trying to kill them, with some of them wreaking vengeance by defeating the villain.

Beginnings
The prominence of women in horror films dates back to the silent film era, with films such as The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari (1920) and Nosferatu (1922). George Feltenstein, film historian and senior vice president of theatrical catalog marketing at Warner Home Video, states, "Women screaming in terror has been a Hollywood mainstay – even when films were silent". Fay Wray, an actress starring in King Kong (1933), is sometimes referred to as the "very first scream queen". Anne Gwynne, Chris Pine's grandmother, is known for scream queen roles in the 1930s and 1940s. Janet Leigh, playing Marion in Alfred Hitchcock's Psycho (1960), is regarded as the "one of the most iconic " scream queens in horror film history.

1970s

Four actresses in the 1970s became seminal examples of a "scream queen" for the decade: Sandra Peabody, who portrayed Mari Collingwood in The Last House on the Left (1972), Marilyn Burns, who portrayed Sally Hardesty in The Texas Chain Saw Massacre (1974), Olivia Hussey, who portrayed Jess Bradford in Black Christmas (1974), and Jamie Lee Curtis, who portrayed Laurie Strode in Halloween (1978).

After The Last House on the Left, Peabody went on to appear in the horror films Voices of Desire (1972), Massage Parlor Murders (1973), Case of the Full Moon Murders (1973), and Legacy of Satan (1974). Burns followed her performance in The Texas Chainsaw Massacre with roles in Helter Skelter (1976) and Eaten Alive (1977). In Halloween, Jamie Lee Curtis, daughter of Psycho actress Janet Leigh, had her first film role. Portraying Laurie Strode in Halloween, Curtis has been called the "ultimate 'scream queen'". Curtis went on to star in several other horror films after that, including The Fog, Prom Night, Terror Train, Halloween II, and Halloween H20: 20 Years Later.

Dee Wallace appeared in Wes Craven's 1977 horror film The Hills Have Eyes before going on to establish herself as a scream queen in the 1980s by appearing in The Howling (1981), Cujo (1983) and Critters (1986).

Daria Nicolodi played the role of the scream queen in most of her films (Deep Red, Inferno, Phenomena, Terror at the Opera). Director Mario Bava also called on Nicolodi for Shock (1977). In 1982, Nicolodi played Anne in Dario Argento's Tenebrae.

Veronica Cartwright was also a prominent scream queen of the 1970s, appearing in the 1978 remake of Invasion of the Body Snatchers as well as Alien in 1979. She began her career as a scream queen in Alfred Hitchcock’s The Birds.

1980s
The success of Halloween revived slasher films during the late 1970s and 1980s. Examples include Terror Train and Prom Night, in which Jamie Lee Curtis would again play the scream queen; Friday the 13th, the first entry to have both a female antagonist (Betsy Palmer) and protagonist (Adrienne King); and A Nightmare on Elm Street, now considered a slasher classic, which introduced supernatural serial killer Freddy Krueger, and whose leading actress, Heather Langenkamp, was dubbed a scream queen, and went on to become one of the most influential.

Linnea Quigley was a scream queen during the 1980s, appearing specifically in low-budget and cult-classic films such as 'Graduation Day', Silent Night, Deadly Night, Return of the Living Dead and 'Night of the Demons'. British actress Catriona MacColl became a scream queen after appearing in three Italian horror films directed by Lucio Fulci, City of the Living Dead (1980), The Beyond (1981) and House by the Cemetery (1981).

Following her Saturn Award-nominated performance in Exorcist II: The Heretic, Oscar-nominee Linda Blair parlayed her classic 1973 The Exorcist role into a slew of 80s horror performances, including Hell Night. She would continue making horror films into the 1990s, with a cameo in Wes Craven's Scream. In 2008, at the Malaga Fantasy & Horror Film Festival, Blair received a lifetime achievement award for her work in the horror genre.

1990s
During the 1990s, Debbie Rochon starred in dozens of Troma Production horror films and was voted by Draculina magazine as its "Scream Queen of the Decade". Sheryl Lee played murder victims Laura Palmer and Maddy Ferguson in the TV series Twin Peaks (1990–91) and spin-off film Twin Peaks: Fire Walk with Me (1992) and has been described as a "scream queen", in particular for scenes in the otherworldly Black Lodge.

Neve Campbell's first American feature film was the cult horror classic The Craft (1996). She later starred as Sidney Prescott in the Scream film series. Jennifer Love Hewitt was labeled a scream queen after starring as Julie James in the I Know What You Did Last Summer films. The first film of that trilogy also had a starring role for Sarah Michelle Gellar as Helen Shivers, who went on to appear in other horror films made during the 1990s and new millennium, including Scream 2 and The Grudge film series.

2000s
In 2005, Shauna Macdonald starred in The Descent, which established her as a scream queen  and for which she was nominated for the Saturn Award for Best Actress. Elisha Cuthbert starred in the horror film House of Wax (2005) and Captivity (2007), gaining the status by from films. In 2007, USA Today published an article listing on modern scream queens interviewing actresses Sheri Moon Zombie, Jaimie Alexander, Andrea Bogart, Mercedes McNab, Tiffany Shepis and Cerina Vincent. Since 2007 and her appearance in Halloween, Danielle Harris has increased her genre work, being subsequently called "horror's reigning scream queen" by the NY Daily News. Erica Leerhsen has been called a scream queen because of her roles in films like Book of Shadows: Blair Witch 2 (2000), The Texas Chainsaw Massacre (2003), and Wrong Turn 2: Dead End (2007).

2010s
Bipasha Basu has been referred as "Bollywood's Scream Queen" due to her contributions to horror in India with her blockbuster horror movies like Raaz (2002) and Raaz 3D (2012), as well as films like Aatma (2013), Creature 3D (2014), and Alone (2015).

In 2016, Screen Rant listed the "15 Greatest Scream Queens in Horror History", which includes Linda Blair, Danielle Harris, Lisa Wilcox, Vera Farmiga, Janet Leigh, Marilyn Burns, Veronica Cartwright, Neve Campbell, Naomi Watts, Heather Langenkamp, Eva Green, Chloë Grace Moretz, Sarah Michelle Gellar, Barbara Steele and Jamie Lee Curtis.

Indonesian actress Tara Basro has been described as a "scream queen" for her roles in Joko Anwar's films Satan's Slaves (2017) and Impetigore (2019). Australian actress Samara Weaving began her contribution to the horror genre by starring in the first season of Ash vs Evil Dead (2015), before landing the lead role in the black comedy horror The Babysitter (2017). Weaving solidified her status as a scream queen with her performance in the commercially and critically successful Ready or Not (2019). In 2023, Weaving played the iconic role of opening kill in Scream VI. Popularised by the Scream franchise.

2020s
Melissa Barrera having starred in the slasher Scream (2022) and the sequel Scream VI (2023) and the horror thriller Bed Rest (2022), establishing herself as a scream queen. Mia Goth having started in several horror movies previously before her breakout roles in the X trilogy (2022–2024), it was inevitable that she would gain the title "scream queen". Jenna Ortega starred in the slasher films X and Scream (both 2022), also known as a scream queen. Ortega reprised her Scream role for the sequel, Scream VI (2023).

Scream Queens Illustrated magazine
Scream Queens Illustrated magazine featured pictorials, interviews, reviews, and other content concerning such Hollywood scream queens as Barbara Bauer, Becky Sunshine, Tina Krause, Julia Hayes, Julie Strain, Monique Gabrielle, Brinke Stevens, Linnea Quigley, Rhonda Shear, Xenia Gratsos ("Brioni Farrell"), Lorissa McComas, June Wilkinson, Debbie Rochon, Sherri Frazer, Melissa Wolf, and Cassandra Peterson ("Elvira").

Scream king
The term "scream king" has been used to refer to male leading actors who have made their name through taking on leading roles in horror movies as a "final guy" character. Rachel Roth defines the rise of the "scream kings" as a result of moving away from formulas where men are typically cast as monsters for a female character to fight off and female actresses being cast less as victims and sometimes as the monster or villain themselves. Roth cites Bruce Campbell as an early example of a scream king for his role in the Evil Dead  franchise. Campbell has also been referred to as "the definitive scream king." Another notable early example of a scream king would be Robert Englund, who played Freddy Krueger in the Nightmare on Elm Street franchise.

Other notable scream kings include Devon Sawa, known for Idle Hands and Final Destination; Patrick Wilson, who appeared in the Insidious and The Conjuring franchises; Evan Peters for his recurring roles in American Horror Story; Bill Skarsgård, for his appearances in It, Barbarian and Nosferatu; Daniel Kaluuya, for his performances in Get Out and Nope; Kyle Gallner, whose appearances include The Haunting in Connecticut, Scream and Smile;  Finn Wolfhard, for his roles in It and the Netflix series Stranger Things; and Shawn Roberts, who has appeared in zombie films such as Land of the Dead, Diary of the Dead, and the Resident Evil franchise.

Mark Patton, star of A Nightmare on Elm Street 2: Freddy's Revenge (1985), has been touted at horror conventions as mainstream horror's first "male scream queen".

title: Scream queen


text:
Talk:Nommo

Old discussion
I removed the section below because no indication is given that anyone ever claimed that these are related to the Nommo. I wouldn't be averse to their reinclusion, as long as connections are explicit. Tuf-Kat 06:21, Nov 12, 2003 (UTC)

Zecharia Sitchin, an archaeologist and linguist specialising in the Sumerian and Hebrew languages, claims that an ancient race of extraterrestrials, the Anunnaki, genetically engineered the original humans, and that they probably still exist in some form or another, with some degree of influence over humankind. These beings are speculated by Sitchin to be either reptilian, quasi-reptilian, or amphibious, from ancient description.
 * Did he ever claim that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

Erich von Däniken theorises that extraterrestrials have influenced human history for millennia, and that they may have influenced human evolution.
 * Did he ever claim that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

Robert Anton Wilson once claimed to have contacted three-eyed beings from Sirius.
 * Did he ever claim that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

Timothy Leary claimed contact with three-eyed beings from Sirius.
 * Did he ever claim that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

Pythagoras spoke esoterically of a magickal Mother Essence coming from Sirius, which may have been the result of his having spoken to priests of Isis in Egypt. He apparently believed in many worlds, and in higher intelligences.
 * Did he ever claim that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

The Zulu shaman Credo Mutwa claims that the Zulu people have known of a reptilian species for centuries. He is the official historian of the Zulu people. He mentions amphibious beings from Sirius in his book, Song of the Stars.
 * Did he ever claim that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

The Sumerian God Enki, said to have created the first humans (Adam), had a mystical connection with Sirius, as well as water, and was depicted as amphibious or semi-fish on many occasions.
 * Has anybody ever claimed that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

The Gnostic Archons
The Gnostics believed in a class of beings they called 'Archons', meaning 'rulers', who came from the stars and ruled over Humankind in the physical realm. Some of these beings were said to have come from Sirius, particularly those believed in by Gnostics living in Egypt.
 * Has anybody ever claimed that these beings were the Nommo of Dogon lore?

 * The connection to the Nommo should be obvious. Especially in the case of Credo Mutwa--he spoke of the Nommo themselves from the perspective of the Zulu people!  (Khranus)

 * However, if you can't personally see the connection, it gives you NO RIGHT to delete the information. The connections will arise with new knowledge.  Khranus
 * The connections are not obvious. The Dogon believe in deities that they connect with a particular star -- therefore anybody that combines some sort of alien-type creature with the same star is describing the same beings?  That doesn't make any sense... surely it is possible that the Dogon beliefs are unrelated to actual Sirius-aliens, or that there are no aliens/deities and the Dogon are simply wrong, or a thousand other possibilities.  If Sitchin et al claimed that the deities of Dogon mythology are equivalent to aliens from Sirius, then include that claim.  Otherwise, this is just a random collection of facts with a few minor connections. Tuf-Kat 02:53, Nov 13, 2003 (UTC)

 * Start a new page on Beings from Sirius if you wish to propagate information correlating to that subject and have an interactive knowledge base. Information grows on digital trees also. - Kaos

Remove Tags?
I've cleaned up the article. Are we ok to remove the NPOV and Standards tags? Isotope23 15:21, Jun 22, 2005 (UTC)

I've removed the tags. If anyone disputes the neutrality of this article or feels it need further work, go ahead and restore the tags. Isotope23 1 July 2005 12:55 (UTC)

sentence
"Some have made a connection between the Nommo and the "ancient ones" in the Cthulhu stories of H.P. Lovecraft." Removed as unsourced. If you can source this claim, add it back in.--Isotope23 19:46, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Unbalanced Source
The entire voice of the controvery bit is set from a European academic perspective, there is no counter our other claims from African Academic sources like Van Sertima etc. Even today in the NEW AFRICA magazine there is a huge article on this. Please discuess and until an agreement is reached do not remove any tags as Wiki rules allow dispute tags to be placed esp when a debate is in progress. It is dishonest not to question this section which has one plan to discredit the Dogon. --Enathager (talk) 20:01, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

 * No one is discreding the Dogon. Van Sertima is an American academic born in Britain, he is not an African although he obviously has African ancestors (so do we all, but of course for some of us ours are further back). And Wiki 'rules' have something to say about calling other editors dishonest. The tag was put on without any discussion or effort to do anything by an IP editor with only one other edit to their name, thus possibly someone who had no idea what they were doing. There was no debate in progress.

And no one so far seems able to say how the Dogon are being discredited (or more importantly, show that they think they are). If they are, is it Temple who is discrediting them by suggesting that Nommos were aliens?

 * I will be very interested to see evidence that the Dogon are being discredited, since that seems to be the substance of the complaint. Let's concentrate on that please.--Doug Weller (talk) 20:24, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

when all the evidence sources are being used to say 'they didnt and they couldnt' it is biased per the tag. to develop the article i am sure more could be done to research the counter to the claim. it is a mystery how African-American van sertimas place of birth has to do with his knowledge on dogon!!! i guest no one can have a theory about jupiter unless from jupiter. but what is the issue is the trend where any and everything 'good' in Africa is disnissed by western scholars.--Enathager (talk) 22:49, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

see http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/S/Siriusred.html more detail on the argument] i am sure if this stuff is added to show both sides for and against it would be better, the issue is the article only champions crushing dogon claim.--Enathager (talk) 23:02, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

 * You wanted African scholarship, all I was pointing out that Van Sertima is not African. And the article definitely does not champion crushing the Dogon. Saying that the Dogon didn't get information from aliens is not an insult to them.  Nor is saying that they didn't have astronomical knowledge that wasn't know elsewhere either an insult to them. And with all respect to you, that encyclopedia neither adds anything new to the discussion nor is acceptable as a source (you might want to read up on Wikipedia guidance on this) (and it is certainly not African).Doug Weller (talk) 07:54, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Minor correction of a citation
The former phrase "astronomers Peter Pesch and Roland Pesch", though a reasonable conjecture, is incorrect. I am the Roland Pesch who was one of the authors of the cited article. I am not now, nor have I ever been 8-) an astronomer. That distinction belongs only to my brother Peter, the other author.  I have rephrased to make it clear that only one astronomer was involved; another, perhaps clearer, formulation would be simply to avoid stating the profession of either of us, which would also have the virtue of being more concise... Rhpesch (talk) 18:58, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

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Removing irrelevant clutter
I an removing the below controversy section as per my edit summary. It is so inappropriate. The editor(s) copied and pasted the same old rubbish all over Dogon articles. This article is about the religion /spiritual beliefs or mythology of the Dogon. People come here because that's what they want to learn about, not some silly Western scholars or so called scholars arguments about these people. Almost the entirely article was dominated by this silly Sirius stuff and people arguing over it — copying and pasting it all over Dogon articles. Notice however that, these controversy nonsense are not in Griaule and Dieterien articles. If one wants to create a controversy article, create Criticism of Dogon religion or something like that. Not to use our articles and fill it with rubbish stuff that has nothing to do with the article in the first place. This has been here for years and I'm surprise that few have taken action. I come here to read about the Nommo and Dogon spiruality and mythology, not what some Western scholars and so called scholars are arguing about. I am deleting this nonsense. This should go in the articles of those scholars/writers. Where it even deserve mention, see also, or a brief summary with respect to weight is quite sufficient. Not to fill up Dogon articles with rubbish and irrelevant stuff. Take it out with the authors. Any particular reason why those biographies do not have these controversies or criticism, yet are in many Dogon's articles? Hmm! I don't care what Griaule or Temple said or anybody else thinks or said. I don't care what scholar X or wannabe scholar X says or thinks of Griaule or Temple's work. I am here to learn about the Nommo, not to spend my time reading waffle.

 * Controversy

 * In the 1970s a book by Robert Temple titled The Sirius Mystery popularized the traditions of the Dogon concerning Sirius and the Nommos. In The Sirius Mystery, Temple advanced the conclusion that the Dogon’s knowledge of astronomy and non-visible cosmic phenomenon could only be explained if this knowledge had been imparted upon them by an extraterrestrial race that had visited the Dogon at some point in the past. Temple related this race to the legend of the Nommos and contended that the Nommos were extraterrestrial inhabitants of the Sirius star system who had travelled to Earth at some point in the distant past and had imparted knowledge about the Sirius star system as well as the Solar System upon the Dogon tribes.

 * Walter van Beek, an anthropologist studying the Dogon, found no evidence that they had any historical advanced knowledge of Sirius. Van Beek postulated that Griaule engaged in such leading and forceful questioning of his Dogon sources that new myths were created in the process by confabulation, writing that "'though they do speak about sigu tolo [what Griaule claimed was Sirius] they disagree completely with each other as to which star is meant; for some it is an invisible star that should rise to announce the sigu [festival], for another it is Venus that, through a different position, appears as sigu tolo. All agree, however, that they learned about the star from Griaule'." Carl Sagan has noted that the first reported association of the Dogon with the knowledge of Sirius as a binary star was in the 1940s, giving the Dogon ample opportunity to gain cosmological knowledge about Sirius and the Solar System from more scientifically advanced, terrestrial societies whom they had come in contact with.  It has also been pointed out that binary star systems like Sirius are theorized to have a very narrow or non-existent Habitable zone, and thus a high improbability of containing a planet capable of sustaining life (particularly life as dependent on water as the Nommos were reported to be).

 * Daughter and colleague of Marcel Griaule, Geneviève Calame-Griaule, defended the project, dismissing Van Beek's criticism as misguided speculation rooted in an apparent ignorance of esoteric tradition. Van Beek continues to maintain that Griaule was wrong and cites other anthropologists who also reject his work.
 * The assertion that the Dogon knew of another star in the Sirius system, Emme Ya, or "larger than Sirius B but lighter and dim in magnitude" continues to be discussed. In 1995, gravitational studies indicated the possible existence of a red dwarf star circling around Sirius but further observations have failed to confirm this.
 * Space journalist and sceptic James Oberg collected claims that have appeared concerning Dogon mythology in his 1982 book and concedes that such assumptions of recent acquisition are "entirely circumstantial" and have no foundation in documented evidence and concludes that it seems likely that the Sirius mystery will remain exactly what its title implies: a mystery. Earlier, other critics such as the astronomer Peter Pesch and his collaborator Roland Pesch and Ian Ridpath had attributed the supposed "advanced" astronomical knowledge of the Dogon to a mixture of over-interpretation by commentators and cultural contamination.

Senegambianamestudy (talk) 01:17, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I disagree entirely. We can't just cite Griaule and ignore Meeks. If you want to get rid of Temple, fine. This is still about their religious beliefs. The unbalanced tag, like the OR tag, was added before the article was considerably revised and both should have been removed. Your removal is I think a violation of NPOV, feel free to discuss it at WP:NPOVN. Doug Weller  talk 16:12, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I see the French article on the Dogon says "It is now accepted that this myth of Sirius B, as well as other astronomical facts not observable with the naked eye that the Dogon cosmogony would have integrated, such as the four largest moons of Jupiter 12 or the rings of Saturn 12, are most likely a case of "cultural contamination", and that this knowledge would have entered Dogon culture only during recent contacts with Westerners". This sort of cultural contamination has also damaged our understanding of Native American religion. Doug Weller  talk 16:15, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * When I deleted that section it was nothing against Meek or any scholar. Because the section I deleted (the waffle section) contained citation about Meek, it was deleted for the waffling reasons rather than about Meek. The issue seems to be the article, and similar articles spends a lot of time and space discussing controvercies and arguments about one scholar against another rather than what the article should be about. Of course any controversies should be included per sources, but IMO, those controvercies should go under the biographical article of the scholar who made the work. The problem is, a lot of these copy and pastes are in the Dogon articles rather than the article of the author (who did the work in the first place). In the end, we just end up learning nothing about the Dogon or the subject of the article e.g. Nommo. For me that's what I'm concerned about. All I'm saying is that people who check these articles want to learn about the culture and spiritual system of these people. If we have 3/4 of the article merely discussing scholarly arguments rather than the spiritual beliefs of these people, the reader ends up learning nothing just some scholarly arguments. I see you've added it back. It's ok. Senegambianamestudy (talk) 22:34, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * thanks for your reasonable attitude, which of course is what I would expect from you. When I've raised similar issues I've usually been told that the answer is to add relevant material to the article, not delete. You seem to be a good person to do this. Doug Weller  talk 16:28, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Nommo