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Ronnie Peterson

Bengt Ronnie Peterson (14 February 1944 – 11 September 1978) was a Swedish racing driver. Known by the nickname 'SuperSwede', he was a two-time runner-up in the Formula One World Drivers' Championship.

Peterson began his motor racing career in kart racing, traditionally the discipline where the majority of race drivers begin their careers in open-wheel racing. After winning a number of karting titles, including two Swedish titles in 1963 and 1964, he moved on to Formula Three, where he won the Monaco Grand Prix Formula Three support race for the 1969 Grand Prix. Later that year he won the FIA European Formula 3 Championship and moved up into Formula One, racing for the March factory team. In his three-year spell with the team, he took six podiums, most of which were scored during the 1971 Formula One season in which he also finished as runner-up in the Drivers' Championship.

After seeing out his three-year contract at March, Peterson joined Colin Chapman's Team Lotus in the 1973 season, partnering defending champion Emerson Fittipaldi. During his first two seasons with Lotus, Peterson took seven victories, scoring a career-best 52 points in 1973. After a poor 1975 season, Peterson moved back to March and scored his final victory for the team at the 1976 Italian Grand Prix. After spending the 1977 season with Tyrrell, he moved back to Lotus for the 1978 season as number two driver to Mario Andretti. Peterson scored two wins, at the South African and Austrian Grand Prix races, and finished second in the Drivers' Championship standings despite his fatal first-lap accident at Monza during the Italian Grand Prix.

Early life
Peterson was born in the bourough Almby in Örebro, Sweden. He developed his driving style at a young age while competing in karting, and rapidly worked his way up to the pinnacle of European karting before switching to cars.

Formulas Three and Two
After his karting years, Peterson entered Formula Three racing in the Svebe, a 1-litre, Brabham-derived Formula car he co-designed with his father Bengt (who was a baker) and Sven Andersson.

Superb results from the outset quickly attracted the attention of the ambitious Tecno company from Italy, who signed him in 1968. With them, he won the 1969 Formula Three Championship.

Even after his elevation to F1 status Peterson still drove in lower echelon racing series (which was common at the time), winning the 1971 European Formula Two Championship driving for March.

Early years
Peterson made his Grand Prix debut in a March 701 for Colin Crabbe's works-supported Antique Automobiles Racing Team at the 1970 Monaco Grand Prix. The limited budget of Crabbe's privateer team allowed only minimal testing, and Peterson qualified 12th out of 16 cars in the race. He was 10 places behind Jackie Stewart and Chris Amon, both on the front row of the grid in their newer specification 701s, but only just behind the more experienced Jo Siffert in the second works March. Peterson was the only March driver to finish the race, in seventh place. In 1971 Peterson moved up to the full March works team, and made an instant impression. Five Formula One Grand Prix second places earned him the position of runner-up to Jackie Stewart in that year's World Championship. Within that year, Peterson drove in the World Sports Car Championship driving an Autodelta Alfa Romeo to win the Watkins Glen 6 hours. Peterson stayed at March until 1973, when he signed for John Player Team Lotus to partner Emerson Fittipaldi.

1973–1976
Peterson's first Grand Prix win was at the 1973 French Grand Prix, held at Paul Ricard, in a Lotus 72. He took three more wins that year, in Austria, Italy and the United States, but poor reliability restricted him to only third place in the World Championship at season's end.

For 1974, the Lotus 76 was brought forth. The car, however, proved to be a failure, disliked by both Peterson and his teammate Jacky Ickx. The team therefore opted to let them drive the much older Lotus 72s. Peterson did well in the old car and claimed three more victories: the French and Italian Grands Prix, as well as the Monaco Grand Prix. 1975 was a bad year for Lotus. Peterson and Ickx were forced to drive with the now archaic 72 model, whose age was now really beginning to show.

Peterson had signed for Shadow but Lotus owner Colin Chapman convinced him to stay with Lotus due to a promise Chapman made to accelerate the rate of development on the Lotus 77. He drove the first race of 1976 in the Lotus 77 before rejoining March Engineering. Driving the March 761, he won the Italian Grand Prix.

He also continued to drive sports cars, particularly for BMW in 1974 and 1975. For instance, he was paired with Hans-Joachim Stuck in a BMW 3.0 CSL for the South African "Wynn's 1000" in November 1975, where they started on pole but finished in second after a number of stops with engine vibrations, spark plug, and similar problems. Stuck and Peterson raced together for BMW in Europe, Africa, and also in North America.

1977: Tyrrell
In 1977, he raced for Tyrrell, driving the six-wheel Tyrrell P34B. Peterson retired from the opening four races of 1977, he spun off in Argentina, was involved in a crash with Jochen Mass's McLaren and Clay Regazzoni's Ensign in Brazil, and suffered fuel systems problems in South Africa and United States West. He finished eight in Spain but retired at Monaco with brake failure. Peterson's only podium finish was a third place at a rain-affected race in Belgium. Hopes were high at home in Sweden but Peterson retired with ignition problems and then finished 12th at France. He had an engine failure in Britain, finished ninth at Germany and got fifth in Austria. Peterson retired with ignition problems at Holland, sixth in Italy and 16th in the United States. Peterson retired from the last two races of 1977, a fuel leak in Canada and in Japan, he collided with Gilles Villeneuve's Ferrari but the crash killed a marshal and photographer as they were standing in a prohibited area of the track when the accident occurred.

1978: Lotus
Peterson surprised many by leaving Tyrrell to return to John Player Team Lotus for 1978. He won the 1978 South African Grand Prix, with a last-lap victory over Patrick Depailler, as well as the Austrian Grand Prix, in the innovative 'ground effect' Lotus 79. His teammate Mario Andretti won the Drivers' Championship with Peterson acting effectively as the Team "No. 2" with the pair scoring four 1–2 wins, all with Andretti at the lead. Both of Peterson's wins occurred when Andretti encountered trouble, with Andretti winning once when Peterson failed to finish (not including the Italian Grand Prix). Many times, Peterson followed Andretti closely home, leading to speculation that team orders were in place.

Throughout the 1970s Peterson had the reputation of being the fastest driver in F1 in terms of raw speed. During the 1978 season Andretti would frequently post the faster qualifying time. Another view, held by some contemporary observers, was that while Peterson may have in fact been the outright quicker of the two, it was Andretti's considerable car development skills that brought the recalcitrant Lotus 78 and 79 to full potential, and Peterson's seeming deference to Andretti was a tacit acknowledgement of this. Despite this, Peterson was offered a seat at McLaren at 1979. Peterson refused to contribute to any controversy, and on numerous occasions dismissed the speculation by stating that Andretti had simply turned the faster time.

Death
The 1978 Italian Grand Prix at Monza started badly for Peterson. In practice he damaged his Lotus 79 race car beyond immediate repair and bruised his legs in the process. Team Lotus had a spare 79, but it had been built for Andretti, and the much taller Peterson did not fit comfortably inside. The team's only other car was a type 78, the previous year's car, which had been dragged around the F1 circuit that season with minimal maintenance.

In the days after the race, many drivers on circuit stated that the race starter lit the green light for the race too early. Although a Formula One start is meant to be a standing start for all cars in the field, the early green light meant that cars in the rear rows were still rolling when the green light came on. This resulted in cars in the back getting a jump on those at the front, and an accordion effect as the cars approached the first chicane, bunching them tightly together. The front four, Andretti, Gilles Villeneuve, Jean-Pierre Jabouille and Niki Lauda, were far enough ahead to avoid any drama, but Peterson had made a poor start from the third row of the grid, and was immediately passed by Alan Jones, Jacques Laffite and John Watson.

Jody Scheckter and Riccardo Patrese, starting 10th and 12th, had moved to the right across the line that separated the Grand Prix front straight from the approach to the old Monza banking. While Scheckter's Wolf was able to rejoin the track well ahead of the bunching pack, Patrese moved back in just ahead of James Hunt, who feinted left and collided with Peterson, with Vittorio Brambilla, Carlos Reutemann, Hans-Joachim Stuck, Patrick Depailler, Didier Pironi, Derek Daly, Clay Regazzoni and Brett Lunger all involved in the ensuing melee.

Peterson's Lotus went into the barriers hard and caught fire before bouncing back into the middle of the track. He was trapped in the burning wreck, but Hunt, Regazzoni and Depailler managed to free him before he received more than minor burns, while track marshals were extinguishing the car. He was dragged free and laid in the middle of the track fully conscious, but with severe leg injuries. Hunt later said he stopped Peterson from looking at his legs to spare him further distress.

At the time there was more concern for Brambilla, who had been hit on the head by a flying wheel and was slumped comatose in his car. Brambilla was seriously hurt and did not race again in Formula One until a year later. Peterson's life was not seen to be in any danger. Sid Watkins and his medical team headed over to Brambilla's car to extract him from the wreckage. The injured drivers along with Peterson were taken to a hospital in Milan and the race was restarted when the track had been cleaned up.

At the hospital, Peterson's X-rays showed he had about 27 fractures in his legs and feet. After discussion with him, Peterson was sent to intensive care so that the surgeons could operate to stabilize the bones. There was some level of dispute between the doctors regarding whether all fractures should be immediately fixed or not. During the night, Peterson's condition worsened, and he was diagnosed with fat embolism. By morning he was in full kidney failure due to the embolism, and was declared dead at 9:55am on 11 September 1978.

His teammate Mario Andretti clinched the championship at the race. "It was so unfair to have a tragedy connected with probably what should have been the happiest day of my career", Andretti said, "I couldn't celebrate, but also, I knew that trophy would be with me forever. And I knew also that Ronnie would have been happy for me". Peterson took second place in the 1978 drivers' standings posthumously.

Peterson competed in 123 Grand Prix races during his career, winning ten of them.

At his funeral, the pallbearers included Åke Strandberg, James Hunt, Jody Scheckter, John Watson, Emerson Fittipaldi, Gunnar Nilsson and Niki Lauda.

Legacy
Peterson is considered by some to be one of the best Formula One drivers to have never won a championship, as well as the best racing driver from Sweden. In 2016, in an academic paper that reported a mathematical modeling study that assessed the relative influence of driver and machine, Peterson was ranked the 21st best Formula One driver of all time, and the sixth best to never win a title.

Arrows driver Riccardo Patrese was blamed by several members of the Grand Prix Drivers' Association (mainly by James Hunt) with being a primary cause of the first lap wreck at the Italian Grand Prix. He was banned from competition for one race, from the 1978 United States Grand Prix.

In 1979, George Harrison paid tribute to Peterson with a song and music video called "Faster".

The circumstances of Peterson's death were prosecuted in an Italian criminal court. Driver Riccardo Patrese and race director Gianni Restilli were both charged with roles; Patrese, for manslaughter because of an unsafe maneuver on track which was considered to be a primary cause of the wreck, and Restilli, as contributing to Peterson's death by starting the race with a premature start signal. Both were cleared of criminal charges on 28 October 1981.

Peterson's widow Barbro (née Edwardsson) never got over his death and committed suicide on 19 December 1987. She was buried alongside Ronnie in the Peterson family grave in Örebro. She and Ronnie had a daughter named Nina Louise (named after Jochen Rindt's wife) who was born in November 1975.

There is a statue of Peterson in Örebro (59.26193°N, 15.23812°W) by Richard Brixel. The official Ronnie Peterson museum was officially opened by Ronnie's daughter, Nina Kennedy, in Örebro on 31 May 2008. The museum closed in October 2009 because it was unable to secure further government funding.

Superswede: A film about Ronnie Peterson (2017), directed by Henrik Jansson-Schweizer, with the participation of Mario Andretti, Emerson Fittipaldi, Nina Kennedy, and Niki Lauda, is available on YouTube, as are several other short tributes.

During the 2014 Monaco Grand Prix fellow Swedish Formula One driver Marcus Ericsson wore a special helmet in tribute to Peterson which was modeled on Peterson's. Ericsson wore a similar helmet en route to victory in the 2022 Indianapolis 500.

Career summary
Graded drivers not eligible for European Formula Two Championship points

Complete European Formula Two Championship results
(key) (Races in bold indicate pole position; races in italics indicate fastest lap) Graded drivers not eligible for European Formula Two Championship points

Complete Formula One World Championship results
(key) (races in bold indicate pole position; races in italics indicate fastest lap)

Non-Championship Formula One results
(key) (races in bold indicate pole position; races in italics indicate fastest lap) (Races in italics indicate fastest lap)

title: Ronnie Peterson


text:
User:Jolinar

Hello,

I'm from the South of France. I'm currently in Preston, UK.

Wikipedia is really great !

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User:Jolinar


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List of museums in Quebec

This list of museums in Quebec, Canada contains museums which are defined for this context as institutions (including nonprofit organizations, government entities, and private businesses) that collect and care for objects of cultural, artistic, scientific, or historical interest and make their collections or related exhibits available for public viewing. Also included are non-profit art galleries and university art galleries. Museums that exist only in cyberspace (i.e., virtual museums) are not included.

 * See also List of museums in Montreal for museums in the Montreal region.
 * See also List of museums in Quebec City for museums in Quebec City.

Defunct museums

 * Aux couleurs de la campagne, Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu
 * Centre national des naufrages du Saint-Laurent, Baie-Trinité
 * Fort de la Martiniere, Lévis
 * Jardin des glaciers, Baie-Comeau
 * Musée Bon-Pasteur, closed in 2014
 * Musée de bateaux miniatures et légendes du Bas-Saint-Laurent, Rivière-du-Loup, closed in 2014
 * Musée du Domaine, Pohénégamook
 * Musée Normantique, Saint-Alexandre, closed and contents auctioned in 2015
 * Parc de l'aventure basque en Amérique, Trois-Pistoles
 * Quebec Wax Museum (Musée de Cire), closed in 2007, figures now at the Musée de la civilisation

title: List of museums in Quebec


text:
User talk:Pcr

Hello, welcome to Wikipedia. Here are some useful links in case you haven't already found them;

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If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my talk page. I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian!

Tip: you can sign your name with ~

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title: User talk:Pcr


text:
Talk:Voynich manuscript

Where was VM found by Voynich
The article gives Villa Mondragone, Frascati as the place where the VM rested until offered for sale to W. M. Voynich. But apparently, that's not right and the actual place was Villa Torlonia in Castel Gandolfo (near Rome again). There was some secrecy around the sale that perhaps led to this confusion. (source: ) Mandevil (talk) 19:23, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

Terminological distinctions

 * ApLundell, the reason why, in the "Voynich manuscript" lead, I changed "decipher" to "decrypt" is that cryptologists reserve "decipherment" for the reading of a cipher by its intended recipient; and "decryption", for the reading of either a cipher or a code by an unauthorized recipient.
 * Similarly, while persons innocent of the difference between a cipher and a code often, in English, refer to either as a "code", there is a very basic distinction between a cipher and a code. (Some other languages commit the opposite error, calling both a code and a cipher a "cipher".) David Kahn, in his The Codebreakers (loosely titled thus for readers innocent of the differences!) very carefully explains the distinctions.
 * Best, Nihil novi (talk) 04:36, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

 * You don't need to put a message on my talk page, page me to it, then put the same message here, and page me here.
 * Anyway, here's the reply I was about to put on my talk page :

 * "Decipher", outside of crypto industry jargon, has a bunch of meanings at least one of which must apply to the manuscript, but "decrypt" specifically implies that the text is some form of code or cipher, which is not established and implying otherwise is a point of contention. If using the plain English meaning of "decipher" offends those who insist words must only be used according to narrowly defined jargon, then I suppose "understood" or "explained" would also work there, but to my mind that would be a slightly weaker sentence.
 * I'm not sure why you bring up the difference between codes and ciphers. I do understand the difference, but to my knowledge applying either to the manuscript is entirely speculation. ApLundell (talk) 04:56, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Very much with ApLundell here. Approaching the Voynich as being written in either a code or a cipher is to assume facts not in evidence and very much in dispute.  Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 13:18, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
 * As I note above, the verb "to decrypt" is applicable to either a cipher or a code, particularly to the reading of an enciphered or encoded text by an unintended recipient.
 * The verb "to decrypt" comes from the Greek for "to uncover" or "to render unsecret". Even If the Voynich manuscript were to prove neither a cipher nor a code, the verb "to decrypt" would still remain applicable to that manuscript. At the same time, that verb's use would make a small contribution to preventing public misapprehension and misapplication of the terms "cipher" and, more especially, "code", which in recent years has been massively misused.
 * Nihil novi (talk) 01:05, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
 * You are still assuming facts not in evidence. In order to be "decrypted," there would have to be an underlying message.  It has not been proven that is the case.  Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 02:19, 1 March 2024 (UTC)

Greek italics could be the way it has been written
The text in the Voynych Manuscript could be Greek Italics. Lara3030 (talk) 09:02, 1 March 2024 (UTC)

 * It could be telling a story about nitric oxide (which was not even discovered at the time of the manuscript's assumed creation date) and the importance of health directions to try and avoid ovarian cancer. These words could be picked up by running a Greek to Russian translation with Google Lens (Google Lens seems to pick up some parts of the text as Greek Italics). Lara3030 (talk) 09:22, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
 * There is also something about the Greek army service in 401 BC, though I may be wrong. Lara3030 (talk) 09:23, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
 * The text could be many things, but only hypotheses repeated in reliable secondary sources warrant inclusion in the article. Otherwise the article would be much too long.  Also, Google Lens, like all machine learning models, is based on guesswork and often makes mistakes. Justin Kunimune (talk) 22:18, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
 * @Lara3030 What do you mean? This is what I intend with "Greek italics".-- Carnby (talk) 11:12, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

Spake by David L Williams
The manuscript is a major plot point in a play - Spake, by David L Williams. See https://newplayexchange.org/plays/14094/spake. 66.76.14.59 (talk) 15:35, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

 * Thank you very much for the heads-up! I am not sure that it is WP:DUE for inclusion in the article at this point, but it may be in the future.  Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 18:56, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

Another attempt
News from Italy. Scholar Eleonora Matarrese states she has deciphered the manuscript: la Repubblica (quite reliable source).-- Carnby (talk) 11:00, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
 * It may be churnalism given how much of that text is an exact copy of similar sites like Adnkronos and iLLibraio. I'm not sure if this is enough to warrant mentioning as a decipherment claim on the article itself, but news articles come out every few years with similar claims and it's just the latest of a very, very long list. - Aoidh (talk) 22:28, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

And what about this paper ? It seems pretty sound and well documented to me. --95.233.177.138 (talk) 12:13, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

 * It's from November 2022. If it hasn't made it into reliable secondary (or tertiary) sources by now, it is with high probability because it is fringe, and not a reliable wp:SOURCE. (If it had been new, I'd have said that it with high probability was fringe, and shouldn't be included until it made it into reliable sources -- unless it had created so much of a stir in mainstream media that we should cover that stir (probably without endorsing the theory). Nø (talk) 15:09, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
 * What I'm seeing online marks that publisher as a predatory publisher, and whether that's true or not I don't see any evidence that this paper is in any way peer reviewed or acknowledged in any reliable sources. - Aoidh (talk) 16:22, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
 * So only attempts or claims published in a peer-reviewed journal should be mentioned?-- Carnby (talk) 21:02, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Claims that have been covered by independent reliable sources should be considered as possibly mentioning, but if every claim was mentioned it would be a list hundreds of names long. The Voynich manuscript may be an important part of a scholar's work, but is the scholar's work an important part of what we know of the Voynich manuscript? Routine churnalism isn't evidence that this is the case. - Aoidh (talk) 21:34, 22 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Voynich manuscript


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Táin Bó Cúailnge

Táin Bó Cúailnge ( Modern ; "the driving-off of the cows of Cooley"), commonly known as The Táin or less commonly as The Cattle Raid of Cooley, is an epic from Irish mythology. It is often called "the Irish Iliad", although like most other early Irish literature, the Táin is written in prosimetrum, i.e. prose with periodic additions of verse composed by the characters. The Táin tells of a war against Ulster by Queen Medb of Connacht and her husband King Ailill, who intend to steal the stud bull Donn Cuailnge. Due to a curse upon the king and warriors of Ulster, the invaders are opposed only by the young demigod, Cú Chulainn.

The Táin is traditionally set in the 1st century in a pagan heroic age, and is the central text of a group of tales known as the Ulster Cycle. It survives in three written versions or "recensions" in manuscripts of the 12th century and later, the first a compilation largely written in Old Irish, the second a more consistent work in Middle Irish, and the third an Early Modern Irish version.

The Táin has been influential on Irish literature and culture. It is often considered Ireland's national epic.

Synopsis

The Táin is preceded by a number of remscéla, or pre-tales, which provide background on the main characters and explain the presence of certain characters from Ulster in the Connacht camp, the curse that causes the temporary inability of the remaining Ulstermen to fight and the magic origins of the bulls Donn Cuailnge and Finnbhennach. The eight remscéla chosen by Thomas Kinsella for his 1969 translation are sometimes taken to be part of the Táin itself, but come from a variety of manuscripts of different dates. Several other tales exist which are described as remscéla to the Táin, some of which have only a tangential relation to it.

The first recension begins with Ailill and Medb assembling their army in Cruachan; the purpose of this military build-up is taken for granted. The second recension adds a prologue in which Ailill and Medb compare their respective wealths and find that the only thing that distinguishes them is Ailill's possession of the phenomenally fertile bull Finnbhennach, who had been born into Medb's herd but scorned being owned by a woman so decided to transfer himself to Ailill's. Medb determines to get the equally potent Donn Cuailnge from Cooley to equal her wealth with her husband. She successfully negotiates with the bull's owner, Dáire mac Fiachna, to rent the animal for a year. However, her messengers, while drunk, reveal that Medb intends to take the bull by force if she is not allowed to borrow him. The deal breaks down, and Medb raises an army, including Ulster exiles led by Fergus mac Róich and other allies, and sets out to capture Donn Cuailnge.

The men of Ulster are disabled by an apparent illness, the ces noínden (literally "debility of nine (days)", although it lasts several months). A separate tale explains this as the curse of the goddess Macha, who imposed it after being forced by the king of Ulster to race against a chariot while heavily pregnant. The only person fit to defend Ulster is seventeen-year-old Cú Chulainn, and he lets the army take Ulster by surprise because he is off on a tryst when he should be watching the border. Cú Chulainn, assisted by his charioteer Láeg, wages a guerrilla campaign against the advancing army, then halts it by invoking the right of single combat at fords, defeating champion after champion in a stand-off lasting months. However, he is unable to prevent Medb from capturing the bull.

Cú Chulainn is both helped and hindered by supernatural figures from the Tuatha Dé Danann. Before one combat the Morrígan, the goddess of war, visits him in the form of a beautiful young woman and offers him her love, but Cú Chulainn spurns her. She then reveals herself and threatens to interfere in his next fight. She does so, first in the form of an eel who trips him in the ford, then as a wolf who stampedes cattle across the ford, and finally as a heifer at the head of the stampede, but in each form, Cú Chulainn wounds her. After he defeats his opponent, the Morrígan appears to him in the form of an old woman milking a cow, with wounds corresponding to the ones Cú Chulainn gave her in her animal forms. She offers him three drinks of milk. With each drink he blesses her, and the blessings heal her wounds. Cú Chulainn tells the Morrígan that had he known her real identity, he would not have spurned her.

After a particularly arduous combat Cú Chulain is visited by another supernatural figure, Lug, who reveals himself to be Cú Chulainn's father. Lug puts Cú Chulainn to sleep for three days while he works his healing arts on him. While Cú Chulainn sleeps the youth corps of Ulster come to his aid but are all slaughtered. When Cú Chulainn awakes he undergoes a spectacular ríastrad or "distortion", in which his body twists in its skin and he becomes an unrecognisable monster who knows neither friend nor foe. Cú Chulainn launches a savage assault on the Connacht camp and avenges the youth corps sixfold.

After this extraordinary incident, the sequence of single combats resumes, although on several occasions Medb breaks the agreement by sending several men against Cú Chulainn at once. When Fergus, his foster-father, is sent to fight him, Cú Chulainn agrees to yield to him on the condition that Fergus yields the next time they meet. Finally, Medb incites Cú Chulainn's foster-brother Ferdiad to enter the fray, with poets ready to mock him as a coward, and offering him the hand of her daughter Finnabair, and her own "friendly thighs" as well. Cú Chulainn does not wish to kill his foster-brother and pleads with Ferdiad to withdraw from the fight. There follows a physically and emotionally gruelling three-day duel between the hero and his foster-brother. Cú Chulainn wins, killing Ferdiad with the legendary spear, the Gáe Bolga. Wounded too sorely to continue fighting, Cú Chulainn is carried away by the healers of his clan.

The debilitated Ulstermen start to rouse, one by one at first, then en masse. King Conchobar mac Nessa vows, that as the sky is above and the Earth is beneath, he will return every cow back to its stall and every abducted woman back to her home. The climactic battle begins.

At first, Cú Chulainn sits it out, recovering from his wounds. Fergus has Conchobar at his mercy, but is prevented from killing him by Cormac Cond Longas, Conchobar's son and Fergus' foster-son, and in his rage cuts the tops off three hills with his sword. Cú Chulainn shrugs off his wounds, enters the fray and confronts Fergus, whom he forces to make good on his promise and yield before him. Fergus withdraws, pulling all his forces off the battlefield. Connacht's other allies panic and Medb is forced to retreat. Cú Chulainn comes upon Medb having her period (Is and drecgais a fúal fola for Meidb "Then it was that the issue of blood came upon Medb" ). She pleads for her life and he not only spares her, but guards her retreat.

Medb brings Donn Cuailnge back to Connacht, where the bull fights Finnbhennach, kills him, but is mortally wounded, and wanders around Ireland dropping pieces of Finnbhennach off his horns and thus creating placenames before finally returning home to die of exhaustion.

Oral tradition
The Táin is believed to have its origin in oral storytelling and to have only been written down during the Middle Ages.

Although Romanas Bulatovas believes that the Táin was originally composed at Bangor Abbey between 630 and 670 AD, there is evidence that it had a far older oral history long before anything was written down. For example, the poem Conailla Medb michuru ("Medb enjoined illegal contracts") by Luccreth moccu Chiara, dated to c. 600, tells the story of Fergus mac Róich's exile with Ailill and Medb, which the poet describes as having come from sen-eolas ("old knowledge"). Two further 7th-century poems also allude to elements of the story: in Verba Scáthaige ("Words of Scáthach"), the warrior-woman Scáthach prophesies Cú Chulainn's combats at the ford; and Ro-mbáe laithi rordu rind ("We had a great day of plying spear-points"), attributed to Cú Chulainn himself, refers to an incident in the Boyhood Deeds section of the Táin.

The high regard in which the written account was held is suggested by a ninth-century triad, that associated the Táin with the following wonders: "that the cuilmen [apparently a name for Isidore of Seville's Etymologiae] came to Ireland in its stead; the dead relating it to the living, viz. Fergus mac Róich reciting it to Ninníne the poet at the time of Cormac mac Faeláin; one year's protection to him to whom it is related."

Various versions of the epic have been collected from the oral tradition over the centuries since the earliest accounts were written down. A version of the Táin was taken down in Scottish Gaelic by folklore collector Calum Maclean from the dictation of Angus Beag MacLellan, a tenant farmer and seanchaidh from South Uist, in the Outer Hebrides. A transcription was published in 1959.

Manuscripts
Despite the date of the surviving manuscripts, a version of the Táin may have been put to writing already in the eighth century.

Táin Bó Cúailnge has survived in three recensions. The first consists of a partial text in Lebor na hUidre (the "Book of the Dun Cow"), a late 11th-/early 12th-century manuscript compiled in the monastery at Clonmacnoise, and another partial text of the same version in the 14th-century manuscript called the Yellow Book of Lecan. These two sources overlap, and a complete text can be reconstructed by combining them. This recension is a compilation of two or more earlier versions, indicated by the number of duplicated episodes and references to "other versions" in the text. Many of the episodes are superb, written in the characteristic terse prose of the best Old Irish literature, but others are cryptic summaries, and the whole is rather disjointed. Parts of this recension can be dated from linguistic evidence to the 8th century, and some of the verse passages may be even older.

The second recension is found in the 12th-century manuscript known as the Book of Leinster. This appears to have been a syncretic exercise by a scribe who brought together the Lebor na hUidre materials and unknown sources for the Yellow Book of Lecan materials to create a coherent version of the epic. While the result is a satisfactory narrative whole, the language has been modernised into a much more florid style, with all of the spareness of expression of the earlier recension lost in the process.

The Book of Leinster version ends with a colophon in Latin which says:

"But I who have written this story, or rather this fable, give no credence to the various incidents related in it. For some things in it are the deceptions of demons, other poetic figments; some are probable, others improbable; while still others are intended for the delectation of foolish men."

An incomplete third recension is known from twelfth-century fragments.

In translation and adaptation
19th century translations of the work include Bryan O'Looney's translation made in the 1870s, as Tain Bo Cualnge, based on the Book of Leinster in Trinity College Library, Dublin. John O'Daly's also translated the work in 1857, but it is considered a poor translation. No published translation of the work was made until the early 20th century – the first English translation was provided L. Winifred Faraday in 1904, based on the Lebor na hUidre and the Yellow Book of Lecan; a German translation by Ernst Windisch was published at around the same time based on the Book of Leinster.

Translated sections of the text had been published in the late 19th century, including one from on the Book of Leinster by Standish Hayes O'Grady in The Cuchullin Saga (ed. Eleanor Hull, 1898), as well as extracts, and introductory text. Lady Gregory's Cuchulain of Muirthemne (1903) also contains a paraphrased version of the tale. There were also several works based on the tale published in the very late 19th and early 20th century often with a focus on the hero Cú Chulainn, such as Cuchulain, the Hound of Ulster (E.Hull, 1911); Dun Dealgan, Cuchulain's Home Fort (H.G. Tempest, 1910); Cuchulain of Muirtheimhne (A.M. Skelly, 1908); The Coming of Cuculain (S. O'Grady, 1894); and several others; additionally a number of prose works from the same period took the tale as basis or inspiration, including works by W. B. Yeats, Aubrey Thomas de Vere, Alice Milligan, George Sigerson, Samuel Ferguson, Charles Leonard Moore, Fiona Macleod, as well as ballad versions from Scotland. Peadar Ua Laoghaire adapted the work as a closet drama, serialized in the Cork Weekly Examiner (1900–1).

In 1914 Joseph Dunn authored an English translation The Ancient Irish Epic Tale Táin Bó Cúalnge based primarily on the Book of Leinster. Cecile O'Rahilly published academic editions/translations of both recensions, Táin Bó Cúalnge from the Book of Leinster (1967), and Táin Bó Cúailnge Recension 1 (1976), as well as an edition of the later Stowe Version, The Stowe version of Táin Bó Cuailnge (1961).

two translations by Irish poets are available in mass-market editions: Thomas Kinsella's The Táin (1969) and Ciarán Carson's The Táin (2007). Both are based primarily on the first recension with passages added from the second, although they differ slightly in their selection and arrangement of material. Kinsella's translation is illustrated by Louis le Brocquy (see Louis le Brocquy Táin illustrations) and also contains translations of a selection of remscéla.

Victorian era adapters omitted some aspects of the tale, either for political reasons relating to Irish Nationalism, or to avoid offending the sensibilities of their readers with bodily functions or sex. , focusing on translations and adaptation of "The Táin", analysed how 19th- and 20th-century writers used the original texts in creating Irish myths as part of the process of decolonization (from the United Kingdom), and so redacted elements that did not show Cuchulain in a suitably heroic light. Not only was sex, and bodily functions removed, but also humor. The version by took on a more 'folkish' aspect, whereas in O'Grady's version (see ) the protagonists more resembled chivalrous medieval knights.

Several writers bowdlerized the source: for example the naked women sent to attempt to placate Cú Chulainn were omitted by most adapters of the Victorian period, or their nakedness reduced. Others interpreted the tale to their own ends - One of Peadar Ua Laoghaire's adaptations of the work, the play "Méibh", included a temperance message, blaming the conflict over the bull on the drunkenness of the Connacht messengers. In Ua Laoghaire's serialization Medb retains her role as a powerful woman, but her sexuality, exploitation of her daughter Fionnabhair, and references to menstruation are heavily euphemized. Slightly later works such as Stories from the Táin and the derived Giolla na Tána   were more accurate.

The version by is considered to be the first (English) translation that accurately included both grotesque and sexual aspects of the tale; however the German translation by  is considered to be complete, and lacks alterations and omissions due to conflicts of interests in the mind of contemporary Irish scholars.

Remscéla
The story of the Táin relies on a range of independently transmitted back-stories, known as remscéla ('fore-tales'). Some may in fact have been composed independently of the Táin and subsequently linked with it later in their transmission. As listed by Ruairí Ó hUiginn, they are:

 * De Faillsigud Tána Bó Cuailnge (How the Táin Bó Cuailnge was found), recounting how the story of the Táin was lost and recovered.
 * Táin Bó Regamna (The cattle raid of Regamain)
 * Táin Bó Regamon (The cattle raid of Regamon)
 * Táin Bó Fraích ('The cattle Raid of Froech'): Froech mac Idaith is a Connacht warrior, killed by Cú Chulainn in the Táin; this tale gives him some back-story.
 * Táin Bó Dartada (The cattle raid of Dartaid)
 * Táin Bó Flidhais ('The cattle raid of Flidais'), a relatively late story drawing on older material
 * Echtrae Nerai ('The Adventure of Nera')
 * Aislinge Oengusa ('The Dream of Oengus'). Oengus Mac ind Óc, son of the Dagda has no part in the Táin Bó Cúailnge as we have it, but this tale relates how the otherworld woman Caer Ibormeith came to him in a vision how Oengus found her through the aid of Medb and Ailill. According to the story, this is why he helped them in their cattle-raid.
 * Compert Con Culainn ('The Conception of Cú Chulainn')
 * De Chophur in Dá Mucado (Of the cophur of the two swineherds)
 * Fochann Loingsi Fergusa meic Róig (The cause of Fergus mac Róich's exile), only the beginning of which survives, apparently explaining how Fergus came to be part of the army of Connacht
 * Longas mac nUislenn ('The Exile of the Sons of Uisliu'), explaining how Fergus and various other Ulster exiles came to be in the army of Connacht
 * Tochmarc Ferbe (The wooing of Ferb).
 * Ces Ulad (The debility of the Ulstermen), not actually considered one of the remscéla, but providing an important account of why Macha curses the Ulaid: they made her race against the king's horses while she was pregnant. The tale's primary purpose, however, is to provide an etiology for the place-name Emain Machae.

Cultural influence

 * See Irish mythology in popular culture

In 1973, the Irish Celtic rock band Horslips released a concept album named The Táin, which recounts the story from the points of view of Cú Chulainn, Queen Maeve of Connacht and Ferdia, among others.

In 2004, indie rock band The Decemberists released a five-part single named The Tain, which recounts loosely the story of Táin Bó Cúailnge.

Texts and Translations

 * , with illustrations by John Patrick Campbell
 * Translation
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 * , with illustrations by John Patrick Campbell
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title: Táin Bó Cúailnge


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Thermohaline circulation

Thermohaline circulation (THC) is a part of the large-scale ocean circulation that is driven by global density gradients created by surface heat and freshwater fluxes. The adjective thermohaline derives from thermo- referring to temperature and -haline referring to salt content, factors which together determine the density of sea water. Wind-driven surface currents (such as the Gulf Stream) travel polewards from the equatorial Atlantic Ocean, cooling en route, and eventually sinking at high latitudes (forming North Atlantic Deep Water). This dense water then flows into the ocean basins. While the bulk of it upwells in the Southern Ocean, the oldest waters (with a transit time of about 1000 years) upwell in the North Pacific. Extensive mixing therefore takes place between the ocean basins, reducing differences between them and making the Earth's oceans a global system. The water in these circuits transport both energy (in the form of heat) and mass (dissolved solids and gases) around the globe. As such, the state of the circulation has a large impact on the climate of the Earth.

The thermohaline circulation is sometimes called the ocean conveyor belt, the great ocean conveyor, or the global conveyor belt, coined by climate scientist Wallace Smith Broecker. It is also referred to as the meridional overturning circulation, or MOC. This name is used because not every circulation pattern caused by temperature and salinity gradients is necessarily part of a single global circulation. Further, it is difficult to separate the parts of the circulation driven by temperature and salinity alone from those driven by other factors, such as the wind and tidal forces.

This global circulation has two major limbs - Atlantic meridional overturning circulation (AMOC), centered in the north Atlantic Ocean, and Southern Ocean overturning circulation or Southern Ocean meridional circulation (SMOC), around Antarctica. Because 90% of the human population lives in the Northern Hemisphere, the AMOC has been far better studied, but both are very important for the global climate. Both of them also appear to be slowing down due to climate change, as the melting of the ice sheets dilutes salty flows such as the Antarctic bottom water. Either one could outright collapse to a much weaker state, which would be an example of tipping points in the climate system. The hemisphere which experiences the collapse of its circulation would experience less precipitation and become drier, while the other hemisphere would become wetter. Marine ecosystems are also likely to receive fewer nutrients and experience greater ocean deoxygenation. In the Northern Hemisphere, AMOC's collapse would also substantially lower the temperatures in many European countries, while the east coast of North America would experience accelerated sea level rise. The collapse of either circulation is generally believed to be more than a century away and may only occur under high warming, but there is a lot of uncertainty about these projections.

History of research

It has long been known that wind can drive ocean currents, but only at the surface. In the 19th century, some oceanographers suggested that the convection of heat could drive deeper currents. In 1908, Johan Sandström performed a series of experiments at a Bornö Marine Research Station which proved that the currents driven by thermal energy transfer exist, but require that "heating occurs at a greater depth than cooling". Normally, the opposite occurs, because ocean water is heated from above by the Sun and becomes less dense, so the surface layer floats on the surface above the cooler, denser layers, resulting in ocean stratification. However, wind and tides cause mixing between these water layers, with diapycnal mixing caused by tidal currents being one example. This mixing is what enables the convection between ocean layers, and thus, deep water currents.

In the 1920s, Sandström's framework was expanded by accounting for the role of salinity in ocean layer formation. Salinity is important because like temperature, it affects water density. Water becomes less dense as its temperature increases and the distance between its molecules expands, but more dense as the salinity increases, since there is a larger mass of salts dissolved within that water. Further, while fresh water is at its most dense at 4 °C, seawater only gets denser as it cools, up until it reaches the freezing point. That freezing point is also lower than for fresh water due to salinity, and can be below −2 °C, depending on salinity and pressure.

Structure

These density differences caused by temperature and salinity ultimately separate ocean water into distinct water masses, such as the North Atlantic Deep Water (NADW) and Antarctic Bottom Water (AABW). These two waters are the main drivers of the circulation, which was established in 1960 by Henry Stommel and Arnold B. Arons. They have chemical, temperature and isotopic ratio signatures (such as 231Pa / 230Th ratios) which can be traced, their flow rate calculated, and their age determined. NADW is formed because North Atlantic is a rare place in the ocean where precipitation, which adds fresh water to the ocean and so reduces its salinity, is outweighed by evaporation, in part due to high windiness. When water evaporates, it leaves salt behind, and so the surface waters of the North Atlantic are particularly salty. North Atlantic is also an already cool region, and evaporative cooling reduces water temperature even further. Thus, this water sinks downward in the Norwegian Sea, fills the Arctic Ocean Basin and spills southwards through the Greenland-Scotland-Ridge – crevasses in the submarine sills that connect Greenland, Iceland and Great Britain. It cannot flow towards the Pacific Ocean due to the narrow shallows of the Bering Strait, but it does slowly flow into the deep abyssal plains of the south Atlantic.

In the Southern Ocean, strong katabatic winds blowing from the Antarctic continent onto the ice shelves will blow the newly formed sea ice away, opening polynyas in locations such as Weddell and Ross Seas, off the Adélie Coast and by Cape Darnley. The ocean, no longer protected by sea ice, suffers a brutal and strong cooling (see polynya). Meanwhile, sea ice starts reforming, so the surface waters also get saltier, hence very dense. In fact, the formation of sea ice contributes to an increase in surface seawater salinity; saltier brine is left behind as the sea ice forms around it (pure water preferentially being frozen). Increasing salinity lowers the freezing point of seawater, so cold liquid brine is formed in inclusions within a honeycomb of ice. The brine progressively melts the ice just beneath it, eventually dripping out of the ice matrix and sinking. This process is known as brine rejection. The resulting Antarctic bottom water sinks and flows north and east. It is denser than the NADW, and so flows beneath it. AABW formed in the Weddell Sea will mainly fill the Atlantic and Indian Basins, whereas the AABW formed in the Ross Sea will flow towards the Pacific Ocean. At the Indian Ocean, a vertical exchange of a lower layer of cold and salty water from the Atlantic and the warmer and fresher upper ocean water from the tropical Pacific occurs, in what is known as overturning. In the Pacific Ocean, the rest of the cold and salty water from the Atlantic undergoes haline forcing, and becomes warmer and fresher more quickly.

The out-flowing undersea of cold and salty water makes the sea level of the Atlantic slightly lower than the Pacific and salinity or halinity of water at the Atlantic higher than the Pacific. This generates a large but slow flow of warmer and fresher upper ocean water from the tropical Pacific to the Indian Ocean through the Indonesian Archipelago to replace the cold and salty Antarctic Bottom Water. This is also known as 'haline forcing' (net high latitude freshwater gain and low latitude evaporation). This warmer, fresher water from the Pacific flows up through the South Atlantic to Greenland, where it cools off and undergoes evaporative cooling and sinks to the ocean floor, providing a continuous thermohaline circulation.

Upwelling
As the deep waters sink into the ocean basins, they displace the older deep-water masses, which gradually become less dense due to continued ocean mixing. Thus, some water is rising, in what is known as upwelling. Its speeds are very slow even compared to the movement of the bottom water masses. It is therefore difficult to measure where upwelling occurs using current speeds, given all the other wind-driven processes going on in the surface ocean. Deep waters have their own chemical signature, formed from the breakdown of particulate matter falling into them over the course of their long journey at depth. A number of scientists have tried to use these tracers to infer where the upwelling occurs. Wallace Broecker, using box models, has asserted that the bulk of deep upwelling occurs in the North Pacific, using as evidence the high values of silicon found in these waters. Other investigators have not found such clear evidence.

Computer models of ocean circulation increasingly place most of the deep upwelling in the Southern Ocean, associated with the strong winds in the open latitudes between South America and Antarctica. Direct estimates of the strength of the thermohaline circulation have also been madeat 26.5°N in the North Atlantic, by the UK-US RAPID programme. It combines direct estimates of ocean transport using current meters and subsea cable measurements with estimates of the geostrophic current from temperature and salinity measurements to provide continuous, full-depth, basin-wide estimates of the meridional overturning circulation. However, it has only been operating since 2004, which is too short when the timescale of the circulation is measured in centuries.

Effects on global climate
The thermohaline circulation plays an important role in supplying heat to the polar regions, and thus in regulating the amount of sea ice in these regions, although poleward heat transport outside the tropics is considerably larger in the atmosphere than in the ocean. Changes in the thermohaline circulation are thought to have significant impacts on the Earth's radiation budget.

Large influxes of low-density meltwater from Lake Agassiz and deglaciation in North America are thought to have led to a shifting of deep water formation and subsidence in the extreme North Atlantic and caused the climate period in Europe known as the Younger Dryas.

title: Thermohaline circulation


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The La's

The La's were an English rock band from Liverpool, originally active from 1983 until 1992. Fronted by singer, songwriter and guitarist Lee Mavers, the group are best known for their hit single "There She Goes". The band was formed by Mike Badger in 1983 and Mavers joined the next year, although for most of the group's history, the frequently changing line-up revolved around the core duo of Lee Mavers (vocals, guitar) and John Power (bass, backing vocals) along with numerous other guitarists and drummers including Paul Hemmings, John "Timmo" Timson, Peter "Cammy" Cammell, Iain Templeton, John "Boo" Byrne, Chris Sharrock, and Neil Mavers.

After the departure of Badger in late 1986, the band signed to Go! Discs in 1987 and started recording their debut album. Following the release of singles "Way Out" (1987), "There She Goes" (1988) and "Timeless Melody" (1990) and having aborted several recording sessions with different producers, the band released their debut album, The La's, in 1990 to critical acclaim and modest commercial success. John Power left The La's to form Cast and the group entered a prolonged hiatus in 1992. The group later reformed briefly in the mid-1990s, 2005 and 2011. However, no new recordings have been released.

1983–1986: Formation and early years
The La's formed in 1983, with original member Mike Badger stating that the band name occurred to him in a dream, as well as it being Scouse for "lads", and having obvious musical connotations. The band existed briefly as an arthouse/skiffle-type outfit with a few tracks released on local compilations. Lee Mavers joined in 1984 as rhythm guitarist, eventually gaining songwriting prominence and emerging as the band's enduring figurehead. Bernie Nolan, accomplished musician formerly of the Falcons, The Russian Rockabillys and The Swampmen was the original bassist. John Power joined the group in 1986, having met Badger on a local council-run musicianship course. Badger left the group in late 1986 to form the Onset.

The band attracted the attention of several record labels after a series of performances in their hometown in 1986, and demo tapes copied from a session at the Flying Picket rehearsal studio in Liverpool began circulating. One of these demo tapes was sent to Underground Magazine. A journalist there with the task of reviewing unsigned bands gave the cassette to Andy McDonald at Go Discs. Several record labels later became interested in signing the band. The band chose to sign with Go! Discs.

1987–1990: Record deal and The La's album

The band's first single, "Way Out", was mixed with producer Gavin MacKillop. When it was released in October 1987, it broke into the top 100 and was praised by the Smiths' frontman Morrissey in the music magazine Melody Maker, but attracted little notice. The band continued to perform around the UK and gained success as a live act, drawing comparisons to the Beatles due to their origins, vaguely Merseybeat sound, and Mavers' expressive lyrics. "There She Goes" was released in 1988 with the B-sides "Come in Come Out" and "Who Knows". The song garnered moderate attention and airplay, but performed poorly in the charts. The music video for "There She Goes" features the La's scampering through run-down Liverpool streets and was filmed in an afternoon on a hand-held camera. It was re-released a number of times, the earliest being 1990's Steve Lillywhite mix. After working with producer Jeremy Allom at the Pink Museum Studio in Liverpool in May 1989, the band were set to release "Timeless Melody" as a single. While test pressings had been sent out for review, and it was awarded "single of the week" in Melody Maker, Mavers was reportedly unhappy with the production and the single release was scrapped.

The La's then spent two years fruitlessly recording and re-recording their intended debut album, with a constantly changing band line-up, where only the core of Mavers and Power remained the same. Discarded producers included The Smiths' producer John Porter, as well as John Leckie and Mike Hedges. Both Leckie and Hedges have nevertheless spoken positively in interviews about the band's songs and their respective sessions. The previously volatile band line-up settled in 1989 with Lee's brother, Neil Mavers on drums, and Peter "Cammy" Cammell as lead guitarist. The group then entered London's Eden Studios in December 1989 to again record their debut album with Simple Minds and U2 producer Steve Lillywhite. Despite this line-up being arguably the most stable, and press interviews from the time painting them as extremely confident, the sessions still did not satisfy Mavers. In one instance Mavers was reported to have rejected a vintage mixing desk, claiming it did not have the right sound because "it hasn't got original Sixties dust on it", although this claim has since been revealed as apocryphal. The Eden sessions with Lillywhite would become the band's final attempt at recording the album. The frustration of not achieving the right sound and mood in their songs, as well as increasing friction with Go! Discs, who had spent considerable money on recording sessions for the album, led to them simply giving up on the sessions. Lillywhite pieced together the recordings he had made with the group into what became the eventually released album. The band, particularly Lee Mavers, were not pleased with this decision. Among the band's complaints were that Lillywhite used vocal guide tracks on the LP and that he did not "understand" their sound. In an October 1990 NME interview with Stuart Maconie, Mavers said that he "hated" the album because of the sound, which was "All f---ed up like a snake with a broken back".

However, recognition, at least critically, came for the La's in 1990 when the self-titled album, The La's, was released. The album reached No. 30 in the UK charts and received a Silver certification, but the album did not fare as well overseas. The album only reached No. 196 on the Billboard 200 and to date has sold fewer than 50,000 copies in the U.S. The album included, among new material, re-recorded versions of all the previous singles, including a remixed version of "There She Goes" which was then re-released as a single. This time around, the song reached number 13 in the UK singles chart and remains the most visible and enduring of all the band's songs. Additional singles from the album included the LP versions of "Timeless Melody" and "Feelin'". Both sold reasonably well, reaching chart placings around the top 40. A short promotional tour proceeded, accompanied by television appearances on shows such as Top of the Pops.

1991–2003: John Power's departure and hiatus
1991 promotional tour dates were fulfilled in the UK and Europe including a few festivals, and a US tour. Bassist John Power left the group on 13 December 1991, frustrated with having played essentially the same set of songs since 1986, and resurfaced a year later with his band Cast. The remainder of the 1991 concerts were performed with James Joyce on bass as well as a handful of 1992 dates. The band stopped touring and rehearsing in 1992 until further short-lived reunions, with various line-ups, throughout the 1990s and 2000s.

The La's reunited sporadically for a series of live performances throughout 1994 and 1995. The comeback was brought about due to a merchandising debt from the 1991 U.S. tour and the band played support slots to artists such as Oasis, Paul Weller and Dodgy. The reformed band consisted of differing line-ups for each concert and as well as Lee Mavers other performers included several former members such as Barry Sutton, Lee Garnett, John "Boo" Byrne, James Joyce, Peter "Cammy" Cammell and Neil Mavers.

In 1996, Mavers began recording at The Arch studio in Kew, London owned by ex-the Damned drummer Rat Scabies. Initially working alone, he was later joined in the studio by ex-the Stairs frontman Edgar Jones, Lee Garnett and Neil Mavers. The sessions ended because of damp in the studio, however Mavers and Summertyme continued to rehearse and record in Liverpool for a year. After the collapse of Go! Discs, Mavers recording contract with the label was acquired by PolyGram and eventually expired in 1998. In 1998, Mavers began rehearsing with the then unsigned Liverpool band the Crescent. A bootleg recording of one of these rehearsals known as The Crescent Tape would later leak on to the Internet.

In the late 1990s, Mavers renewed contact with founder member Mike Badger and subsequently two compilation albums of early demos and home recordings were released by The Viper Label (founded by ex-La's Badger and Hemmings), Lost La's 1984–1986: Breakloose (1999) and Lost La's 1986–1987: Callin' All (2001). A Japan only compilation album Singles Collection (2001) was released by Universal Music Japan containing all of the band's singles and b-sides released from 1987 to 1991. A biography about the band In Search of The La's: A Secret Liverpool by MW Macefield was published in 2003. The book contained interviews with many former members of the La's including Lee Mavers, John Power, Mike Badger, Paul Hemmings, Barry Sutton, Peter "Cammy" Cammell and Neil Mavers.

2004–2011: Reformations
Following a reunion between Mavers and John Power, The La's reformed in June 2005 with a line-up of Lee Mavers (vocals, guitar), John Power (bass, backing vocals), ex-Cracatilla frontman Jay Lewis (guitar) and Nick Miniski (drums), playing dates in England and Ireland ahead of an appearance at the Summer Sonic festival in Japan as well as a spot at the 2005 Glastonbury Festival and other UK festivals. After three concerts, Miniski was replaced as drummer by roadie Jim "Jasper" Fearon, who was Mavers' school friend and one time bass player for the La's. The set lists were mostly the same as in the late 1980s, although certain encores contained some previously unheard songs such as "Gimme the Blues" and "Sorry". Since the reunion gigs it has been rumoured that Mavers has continued working on the La's' elusive second album. When interviewed in August 2006, John Power explained that Mavers was still "tinkering with something that's majestic" and of the release date, "I can’t tell you where and when...' cos whatever he does, whether it’s in this lifetime or the next, it can’t be rushed".

A compilation of the La's' live radio sessions BBC in Session was released on 18 September 2006. In 2008, a new deluxe edition of The La's was released containing the lost Mike Hedges album, alternate recordings and live recordings for radio and television including previously unreleased songs "I Am the Key" and a Buddy Holly cover "That'll Be the Day". Also Lost Tunes (2008) was released as a download only EP of studio out-takes and alternate recordings.

After being introduced to each other by Gary Murphy of the Bandits, Lee Mavers began jamming with Pete Doherty in 2008 and appeared on stage with Doherty during his 2009 tour. Mavers then started performing live with artists such as Drew McConnell and Jon McClure in London in April 2009. In 2009 Babyshambles drummer Adam Ficek revealed plans of the La's' second album to be recorded with the Babyshambles as backing band and Drew McConnell revealed plans for him to join the La's as bassist; this supposed lineup did not materialise and live appearances were cancelled. In 2010, a four-disc box-set of singles, b-sides, studio out-takes, alternate recordings and live material Callin' All (2010) was released by Polydor which collected most of the band's still unreleased recordings produced whilst signed to Go! Discs.

In June 2011 Lee Mavers, accompanied by Gary Murphy on bass guitar, played a surprise concert in Manchester under the name Lee Rude & The Velcro Underpants. Following this Mavers and Murphy reformed the La's and played a series of "stripped back" shows across the UK and Europe including a performance at Rock en Seine festival in France in August 2011.

Musical style and legacy
Lee Mavers has described their sound as "rootsy" and "raw and organic", whilst AllMusic have noted the band's "simple, tuneful, acoustic-driven arrangements". The La's were also noted for their distinctly different style to other popular British bands in the late 1980s, such as the Stone Roses and Happy Mondays, who were part of the Madchester movement.

The sound of the La's has been compared to that of Merseybeat and 1960s British rock music, and the band received comparisons with the earlier Liverpudlian band the Beatles. Founding member Mike Badger has named Captain Beefheart as the La's' main influence; the band have also cited artists such as Bo Diddley, Bob Dylan, Louis Armstrong, the Beatles, the Rolling Stones, the Who, the Kinks, Bob Marley, Pink Floyd, Jimi Hendrix, Duke Ellington, and Ella Fitzgerald as influences.

Pitchfork named The La's as one of the best Britpop albums, placing the album at #14 in their 50 Best Britpop Albums list. Noel Gallagher of Oasis named it as one of his 13 favourite albums, and they have been cited as an influence by the Courteeners, the Stone Roses, the Charlatans, the Libertines and the 1975.

Post-La's activities
Bassist John Power went on to form Cast in 1992, releasing 4 studio albums before splitting in 2001. Guitarists Barry Sutton and Peter Cammell featured in an early lineup of the band. Cast reformed in 2010. In 2016, Jay Lewis who performed with the band in 2005, later joined Cast as bassist.

Mike Badger and Paul Hemmings later played together in the Onset and started The Viper Label, releasing many early recording compilations by the La's.

In the mid-'90s, Neil Mavers joined Liverpool group Bullit, featuring David McDonnell, later of the Sand Band.

In 1998, Cammell and drummer Neil Mavers continued to work together after the La's' breakup under the name Cami. The band was managed by former La's and then-current Cast manager, Rob Swerdlow. The band recorded a nine-track album with future Coldplay producer Ken Nelson at Parr Street Studios in October 1999, but the band split up leaving the album unreleased. The album tapes re-surfaced in October 2015, with plans for a near-future release. The tapes required "baking" to remove layers of oxide that had formed on them after twenty years; this was carried out at London's FX Copyroom.

Neil Mavers and Cammell briefly reunited once more in 2002, performing with another former La's member, guitarist Barry Sutton in Heavy Lemon. The band played three shows in 18 months before disbanding. Cammell also performed with Sutton again in his jam-style project Beatnik Hurricane in 2015, playing dates in Liverpool, including residencies at The Everyman Bistro and a tour of Ireland, most notably a sold-out show in Dublin.

In 2015, previous recordings and demos by Cammell's band surfaced online (most notably the song "Make A Chain"), which led to Cammell forming a new band named Cami & the Reverbs, managed by La's associate Chris Parkes. The band consisted of Mick Marshall (guitar, the Joneses) Phil Murphy (drums, the Red Elastic Band) Leon De Sylva (drums, Electrafixion), Daniel Lunt (bass), David 'Swee' Sweeney (drums, the Bandits), and Mark McInnes (bass, the Levons). Cami & the Reverbs played sporadic shows across Liverpool including a support slot with Liverpool group Rain and a Christmas Show at The Zanzibar.

In 2018, a BBC TV comedy-drama series entitled There She Goes features a cover version of the La's song of that name.

Members

 * Lee Mavers – guitar, vocals (1984–1992, 1994–1995, 2005, 2011)
 * Mike Badger – guitar, vocals (1983–1986)
 * Sean Eddleston - guitar (1984)
 * John "Timmo" Timson – drums (1984–1985, 1986–1987)
 * Phil Butcher – bass (1984)
 * Jim "Jasper" Fearon – bass, drums (1985, 2005)
 * Bernie Nolan – bass (1985–1986)
 * Tony Clarke – drums (1985–1986)
 * Paul Rhodes – drums (1986)
 * John Power – bass, backing vocals (1986–1991, 2005)
 * Barry Walsh – drums (1986)
 * Paul Hemmings – guitar (1987)
 * Mark Birchall – drums (1987)
 * Peter "Cammy" Cammell – guitar, bass (1988, 1989–1992, 1994–1995)
 * Iain Templeton – drums (1988; died 2022)
 * John "Boo" Byrne – guitar (1988, 1995)
 * Chris Sharrock – drums (1988–1989)
 * Barry Sutton – guitar (1988–1989, 1991)
 * Neil Mavers – drums (1989–1992, 1994–1995)
 * James Joyce – bass (1991–1992, 1994)
 * Lee Garnett – guitar (1994–1995)
 * Jay Lewis – guitar (2005)
 * Matt Jefferson - bass (1993)
 * Nick Miniski – drums (2005)
 * Gary Murphy – bass (2011)

Timeline

Compilation albums

 * Lost La's 1984–1986: Breakloose (1999)
 * Singles Collection (2001)
 * Lost La's 1986–1987: Callin' All (2001)
 * BBC in Session (2006)
 * Lost Tunes (2008)
 * De Freitas Sessions '87 (2010)
 * Callin' All (2010)
 * There she goes: the collection (2015)
 * The La's 1986-1987 (2017)
 * The La's Live (1986–1987) (2021)

Other appearances

 * A Secret Liverpool (1984) "I Don't Like Hanging Around"
 * Elegance, Charm and Deadly Danger (1985) "My Girl (Sits Like a Reindeer)" and "Sweet 35"
 * Unearthed: Liverpool Cult Classics, Vol. 1 (2001) "Don't Lock Me Out"
 * Lo-Fi Acoustic Excursions (2004) "Cool Water"
 * Lo-Fi Electric Excursions (2006) "Midnight Shift", "Painting Dub", "Space Rocketry"

title: The La's


text:
Talk:Thermohaline circulation

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 4 October 2021 and 9 December 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Wikisun1952.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 11:16, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

MOC
"The thermohaline circulation is sometimes called the ocean conveyor belt, the great ocean conveyer, the global conveyor belt, or, most commonly, the meridional overturning circulation (often abbreviated as MOC)."

Rahmstorf, S., Thermohaline Ocean Circulation, Encyclopedia of 	Quaternary Sciences, S. A. Elias Elsevier, Amsterdam 2006.

The MOC is related to the THC but is not the THC. The MOC is at least partially wind driven as opposed to being due to temperature and salinity differences alone.

Conveyor belt is obsolete: Lfstevens (talk) 23:24, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

 * Conveyor belt is an obsolete and false concept. --Fev 21:45, 6 February 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fev (talk • contribs)

Better Diagram?
That one was clearly done in MS Paint. Come on, folks. - Darkhawk

This is sourced from an h2g2 article I started writing a while ago, so it needs some work: style, wikification, and gaps filling [also references need page numbers]. It may also be better to split some of this into separate articles e.g. water mass properties. Comments? Tonderai 16:38, 4 Dec 2003 (UTC)

I made a few changes here regarding the wind-vs-density issue. It is increasingly clear that the geometry of the thermohaline circulation (where deep water sinks) is determined by buoyancy, but the rate at which water cycles through this system is determined by mechanical energy supply- though not in a simple way (Ferrari and Wunsch, Ann. Rev. Fluid Mech., 2004; Gnanadesikan et al., J. Climate., 2005).

they are so wrong its not even funny —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:70.51.130.77 (talk • contribs).

Effect on Europe?
I think this pushes the balance too far the other way William M. Connolley 09:45, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

 * Hi. I think you might mean the previous edit; that one only adds a weblink for the extra reference.  Regarding said earlier edit, I was concerned that the study that suggested Europe wasn't warmed by the THC wasn't actually a study; it was a popular review.  I wasn't sure if I should  -tag it or something for a better reference, so I altered the language instead (it sounded like it was overstating things anyway).  This has possibly made things more ambiguous however.  The second part of my edit cleared up a chronology problem: the second reference was supposed to be criticising the first, but was actually published before it.  I reworded to try to make more sense while retaining the same reference.  Anyway, I'm not wedded to the changes at all, but if the text has to revert, I'd prefer a much stronger cite in support of the proposition.  It's not really my area of expertise, but I as an oceanographer I routinely hear people describing the THC's northward heat transport as being at least partially responsible for Europe's warmer climate (of course, maybe they're all wrong - I'm no physicist!).  Cheers, --Plumbago 10:21, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

 * OK, I probably meant . But there is a Seager et al paper in QJRMS on the same issue that should be referenced. No need for reverting - its more a matter of needing more tweaking I think. And anyway its not the THC is the North Atlantic Drift William M. Connolley 11:34, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

- It would really cool if there was some information or links to other effects the conveyor belt has on the world, or effects other than on europe its break down would have. Cheers.

And the complete shutdown of the system which is faced by global climate change would be good to include as well.

 * A cycle slowdown would cause arctic cooling, which would causes increased freezing, which would increase salinity fix the cycle... increasing density... perhaps so far as to speed up the cycle. This feedback can keep the balance.  Or it can cause seasonal thrashing with very hot summers and very cold winters every XXX years.   These "waves" of hot/cold cycles could also, occasionally, interact and have extreme effects.  Call this "thermohaline cycle thrash" 71.111.198.84 (talk) 14:21, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

Cycle duration? (just a few basic calculations)
100,000km (length of circuit source:this talk) / 6.4km/hr (speed of Gulf Stream source:Wikipedia) = 15625hr = 651 DAYS! Doesn't anyone question numbers that are *ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE* out of whack? Common Sense folks. 68.196.179.246 (talk) 01:41, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

1600years cycle duration seems intuitively a bit long, the heat being moved at this rate wouldn't amount to much at all, and any way, with an estimated length of 100,000km the speed would be about 70km/year or less than 1mm/s, which seems intuitively a bit slow.

given a MAX flow rate of 10cm/s, (as i've found quoted elsewhere on-line) then the MIN cycle time is about 30years.

could it be that the 1600years is sort of a misquote, originally intended as a illustration of just how slow the slowest cycle time was, out near the edges of the conveyor where the speed obviously tappers off? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.2.61.215 (talk) 21:20, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

 * 100,000 km? William M. Connolley (talk) 22:17, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

 * earth diameter ~ 12,750km
 * guess of longest conveyor as between 2 and 3 circumferences
 * so length between; 76,000km and 115,000km  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Asplace (talk • contribs) 17:12, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
 * i've now found another quote of 3cm/s for flow rates, (fits with the 10cm/s max.) and which just can't be squared with the 0.1cm/s given by the 1600 period.Asplace (talk) 19:36, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

 * I suspect that the 1600 years comes from the isotopic age of the oldest ocean water (which I've usually heard as 2000 years, but that could just be rough rounding). That is to say that there are parts of the ocean that haven't engaged in gas exchange with the atmosphere for ~2000 years.  In that sense, it would represent a maximum time for the motion of water from the surface, to the deep, and back to the surface.  Water packets that stay along the primary flow lane probably do cycle much faster than that.  Dragons flight (talk) 21:19, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

 * that sounds much more realistic, and a logical source of the 1600years, so anyone against including this and some clarification on the intro, perhaps with speed readers in mind?
 * i originally got here having seen the period of the conveyor quoted on TV as the 1600 years value, as if some lazy journo had just read and misunderstood this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Asplace (talk • contribs) 20:49, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

 * Just to clarify, the 'conveyor' schematic is purely that: it illustrates some major oceanic transports, but the arrows usually don't correspond to a clearly delineated flow. Much of the transport is done by turbulent mixing, etc...  In the case of THC, there really isn't an identifiable circulation -- it's intrinsically associated with the partly wind-driven meridional overturning.  Some of the water may complete a transit over many thousands of years, while some may transit much faster.  Other water may find a place at the bottom of the ocean and just stay there for hundreds or thousands of years!  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.247.105.241 (talk) 00:18, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Greenland / Agassiz
Slightly unconvinced by. I have a feeling LA was supposed to be gone by 8.2kyr, but I'm not sure William M. Connolley (talk) 20:51, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

 * No, remnants of Lake Agassiz / the Laurentide Ice Sheet probably persisted till ~8ka. It's a common hypothesis that the 8.2 ka event was associated with the last major emptying of Agassiz, though its not the only hypothesis for the 8.2 event.  Dragons flight (talk) 22:27, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

Move?
Shouldn't this be moved to meridional overturning circulation, as that's the more accurate term? Andrewjlockley (talk) 00:41, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

 * Yes, it should be. It would require a bit of fixes to the language and images as well (to de-emphasize the term thermohaline circulation), but it should definitely be moved. Does anyone object to it being moved? Aleph-seven (talk) 06:30, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

 * Not if we believe The term thermohaline circulation (THC) refers to the part of the large-scale ocean circulation that is driven by global density gradients created by surface heat and freshwater fluxes William M. Connolley (talk) 08:32, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

 * I'm with William — the term THC should be preferred both as one that is in common use, and one whose name describes a central aspect of it. --P LUMBAGO  08:44, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

 * MOC and THC are not the same. The MOC has a wind-driven component whereas the THC is by definition the density-driven part of the circulation. Basically MOC is a geographical descriptor and THC is a process. We should have articles on both, or have a single article that makes the distinction clear. Short Brigade Harvester Boris (talk) 05:11, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

 * Almost all of this article is about the MOC, not the THC. The first paragraph discusses wind driven circulation, the side diagram shows the global conveyor system (the MOC), etc. I can see an argument for having an article about the THC, but most of this article should be the article about the MOC. Aleph-seven (talk) 08:59, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm agreeing with the people who want the article to be moved to MOC. The article refers to both wind and and thermohaline effects. Also, the first couple of paragraphs could be altered to read better if the title MOC was used. It seems odd to start off with a definition of THC (density driven) and then immediately move on to talk about the importance of the wind. The MOC is a description of the currents that we observe. The circulation is driven by both density differences and wind. The details of these mechanisms are a topic of active research. The article should start off with a physical description and then go on to the driving mechanisms. FMacTavish (talk) 18:59, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Agree. THC should redirect to it. Lfstevens (talk) 20:12, 11 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Agree. The article even says that MOC is the more accurate term.  Vaughan Pratt (talk) 16:06, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

Deep Ocean Conveyor Belt Reconsidered
“This confirms suspicions that have been around since the 1990’s, and likely plays havoc with global models of climate change. The findings by Drs. Amy Bower of Wood’s Hole and Susan Lozier of Duke University et al. are published in a forthcoming issue of Nature.”

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Yayay (talk • contribs) 17:39, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

 * Um. Its a blog. And it says The implications would be for more cold, oxygenated water along the Mid-Atlantic Ridge, but I’m just making that last part up William M. Connolley (talk) 22:18, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Maybe correponding Nature article would be more interesting but I don't have access. Nature article YayaY (talk) 02:27, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

History?
A few points seem to be inadequately dealt with. Some may be easy to fix, but some would seem to require expert assistance:

 * History: The piece links to the Younger Dryas, but somehow never uses the phrase "ice age" or mentions the role played by the THC in abrupt climate change. Similarly, the more recent little ice age mentioned in the Shutdown article doesn't seem to be brought up at all here.
 * Deep history: What caused the initial formation of the current cycle? Has anyone studied precusors? Did a similar system arise during earlier periods?
 * Future: Shutdown of thermohaline circulation warrants a brief summary here, and some of the points requested above should be expanded upon there as well.

The current three sentences dropped into the very end of the piece seem out of place and grossly inadequate: Anyone feel comfortable expanding them to answer the questions above? MrZaius talk  03:57, 11 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Strangely enough, two hours after I posted this I happened to be watching British Isles: A Natural History, and the third episode says that an older ice age was triggered by a moving THC when the landbridge joining the Americas came into being. Showed a map that had the circulation flowing through a sea where the Isthmus of Panama is now, and then being redirected to the North Atlantic. Where can we find more reasonable, detailed sources discussing that change and others like it?. Would be nice to have a good deal more coverage of changes in the THC. MrZaius  talk  05:35, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Non-sequiturs and other blunders
Lead
 * While the bulk of it upwells in the Southern Ocean, the oldest waters (with a transit time of around 1600 years) upwell in the North Pacific... Ummm...  Where is the Southern Ocean upwelling documented?

Movement of thermohaline circulation
 * At the Indian Ocean, some of the cold and salty water from the Atlantic — drawn by the flow of warmer and fresher upper ocean water from the tropical Pacific — causes a vertical exchange of dense, sinking water with lighter water above....
 * This generates a large but slow flow of warmer and fresher upper ocean water from the tropical Pacific to the Indian Ocean through the Indonesian Archipelago to replace the cold and salty Antarctic Bottom Water. This sentence -- actually the entire third para -- needs a rewrite to bring it into line with the summary image.

Upwelling
 * Computer models of ocean circulation increasingly place most of the deep upwelling in the Southern Ocean, associated with the strong winds in the open latitudes between South America and Antarctica. Ummm...  Where is the Southern Ocean upwelling documented?

All of these are simply not present in the image Thermohaline_Circulation_2. While I do not regard a simple diagram as definitive documentation, the absence of the described features is grounds for suspicion that somebody may have misread the journals used to source the article. 122.200.166.186 (talk) 13:15, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

Copied
Is this copied from http://martinfrost.ws/htmlfiles/aug2007/thermohaline.html or the other way around? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fulldecent (talk • contribs) 13:08, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

Removed the word bullshitting
The world bullshitting existed instead of shifting on line 61 of the article. I removed it last week anonymously. My change was reverted. I have removed it again. Change was reverted again. I give up, keep the curse word in the article. I tried to fixed it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Valarauca (talk • contribs) 15:44, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Relationship of THC, (A)MOC, and Gulf Stream?
What is the relationship between all these currents? Is the AMOC and the Gulf Stream the same thing, with "gulf stream" just being a "layperson-name", or is it something completely (or somewhat) different? Jimw338 (talk) 16:53, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

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Hello. I had to remove several references as they were citing a copyvio from Oceanography: An Invitation to Marine Science. After removal, I saw that several citations were left over without any prose as they were citing the copyvio. To prevent them from being lost in the edit history, i've left them here in case someone wants to add information from them without copyvios: --MrLinkinPark333 (talk) 02:10, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed
Prior content in this article duplicated one or more previously published sources. The material was copied from: https://books.google.ca/books?id=JqBsCgAAQBAJ&pg=PA256 https://books.google.ca/books?id=JqBsCgAAQBAJ&pg=PA257. Copied or closely paraphrased material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a compatible license. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.)

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Clarifying the connection with AMOC and with the shutdown
I've just made some small changes to make it clearer how AMOC and THC are related and in an attempt to try to reduce overlap between the two articles. This is based on advice by Tim Jickells who wrote to me: "It seems like both terms are used almost interchangeably, even though the A in AMOC refers to the Atlantic. The UK Met Office climate change pages refer to AMOC, but perhaps they inevitably focus on the Atlantic particularly. I see there are wikis on both terms and they do seem to cross link the two terms, so I think generally using a phrase like “the Atlantic Meridional Ocerturning circulation (AMOC) which is part of a global thermoholine circulation (THC)” somewhere in the text is the simplest way to handle this.". I think there is probably potential to reduce overlap between the two articles further but would need to think further about this. EMsmile (talk) 12:24, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

Re-label hyperlink for reduced jargon
Change the link text in "imagined spatially but rather in a T-S-diagram" to 'temperature-salinity diagram' to make the article easier to understand. Brh418 (talk) 03:40, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

USGS: Sea Level Rise in Melting Glaciers: 263’ @CassandrsasGhost
One a major concern from this article: "The slowdown or shutdown of the thermohaline circulation is a hypothesized effect of climate change on a major ocean circulation... a decline would also be accompanied by strong sea level rise along the North American coast." GeoVenturing (talk) 12:16, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Thermohaline circulation


text:
Alternative DNS root

The Internet uses the Domain Name System (DNS) to associate numeric computer IP addresses with human-readable names. The top level of the domain name hierarchy, the DNS root, contains the top-level domains that appear as the suffixes of all Internet domain names. The most widely used (and first) DNS root is administered by the Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN). In addition, several organizations operate alternative DNS roots, often referred to as alt roots. These alternative domain name systems operate their own root name servers and commonly administer their own specific name spaces consisting of custom top-level domains.

The Internet Architecture Board (IAB) has spoken out strongly against alternative roots in.

Overview
The DNS root zone consists of pointers to the authoritative domain name servers for all top-level domains (TLDs). The root zone is hosted on a collection of root servers operated by several organizations around the world that all use a specific, approved list of domains that is managed by ICANN. By contrast, alternative roots typically include pointers to all of the TLD servers for domains delegated by ICANN, as well as name servers for other, custom top-level domains that are not sanctioned by ICANN. Some alternative roots are operated by the organizations that manage these alternative TLDs.

Zach Bastick proposes that alternative DNS roots have allowed for more democratic control of the Internet:

"The implementation of alternative gTLDs predates any significant debate on name space extension by official actors, and this exemplifies how democratising the DNS alters the pace of developing Internet policy, the nature of decisions that justify that policy development, and political dynamics and user autonomy in the network infrastructure."

Unless one specifically changes their DNS resolution settings, alternative DNS top level domains are generally unreachable, and very few Internet service providers provide this configuration by default.

Implementations
Some organizations provide alternative DNS root services, such as additional top-level domains.

Handshake
Handshake is a decentralized implementation of a DNS root zone using blockchain and cryptocurrency technology to create a peer-to-peer alternative to the 13 root name servers managed by ICANN.

Unlike other attempts, Handshake does not aim to replace the existing DNS; rather, it seeks to supplement and enhance it by allowing anyone to bid, register, and manage their own TLDs without an intermediate registrar or delegating authority. Since the root zone file records are not centrally managed, and instead are stored on a public blockchain, owners of Handshake TLDs can add or change top-level resource records to delegate authoritative name servers and set up DNSSEC zone signing directly.

Existing TLDs are reserved in the Handshake blockchain such that resolving traditional domain names (i.e. zones under .com, .org, .net, etc.) through a Handshake node or name server are directed back to ICANN's root servers. In addition, the top 100,000 most popular domains are reserved as Handshake TLDs which can be redeemed by the original domain owner.

Namecoin
Namecoin is a blockchain and cryptocurrency to support the alternative top-level domain .bit.

OpenNIC
OpenNIC is a user owned and controlled alternative to InterNIC and ICANN providing a non-national democratic alternative to traditional domain registries. OpenNIC servers are able to resolve all ICANN top-level domains, some OpenNIC original top-level domains, and the resolution of other Alternate DNS Roots with which they have reached peering agreements.

Yeti DNS Project
Yeti DNS Project is an attempt to build an alternative root server dedicated to IPv6. Sponsored by a Chinese state agency, the project aims at experimenting with different new DNS-related technology and enabling sovereign countries to explore and control the internet and enhance their network sovereignty.

.chn
.chn is a new top-level domain with its own root DNS server for an Internet of Things (IoT) network in China. The company developing this alternative root claims that China has its own intellectual right on this new alternative domain name root and the associated IoT network, and that it will become the second computer network in the world. It is claimed to be part of a "IPv9" decimal network/numeric domain name system developed and innovated in China.

Russian National Domain Name System
The Russian National Domain Name System (НСДИ) is an alternative DNS root project started in 2019 by Roskomnadzor, a government department, and is to gradually become mandatory for all ISPs in Russia. As of March 2021, servers are located on the Moscow Internet Exchange. The mission of the project is to provide an alternative DNS root for all users of the Internet within Russia. The main goal is to continue the functioning of the Russian Internet subnetwork in case of its disconnection from the rest of the Internet (Sovereign Internet Law).

Open Root Server Network (ORSN)
Open Root Server Network (ORSN) was a network of Domain Name System root nameservers for the Internet. ORSN root zone information was normally kept in synchronization with the "official" root nameservers coordinated by ICANN. ORSN Public DNS Servers were operated by the community of ORSN, providing Domain Name System access freely for everyone, without any limitation. ORSN public DNS servers did not log usage. "The ORSN project was canceled on May 2019 and will never come back."

AlterNIC
AlterNIC was created before ICANN's creation to challenge the monopoly of InterNIC on domain name governance at the time.

eDNS
eDNS (Enhanced Domain Name Service) was founded by a coalition of ISPs led by Karl Denninger of the Chicago-area MCSNet. It ceased operation in 1998. It served the following domains: biz (general business use), corp (corporations), fam (for and about family), k12 (for and about children), npo (non-profit organizations), per (personal domains), web (web-based sites, Web pages).

Open RSC
One of the notable challengers to ICANN's control of the DNS namespace was Open RSC (Open Root Server Confederation), a group that grew out of private discussions and developed into a public mailing list. It grew large enough that the group decided to submit an application to the United States government to run the DNS.

The organization posted bylaws and articles of incorporation outlining ORSC's position following extensive public discussion regarding the manner in which the DNS was operated.

ICANN chairwoman Esther Dyson acknowledged adopting features such as membership from ORSC in her response to the United States Department of Commerce.

ORSC publishes a root zone containing additional top level domains not found in the ICANN root zone.

RealNames
Microsoft offered the RealNames service on its Internet Explorer browser address bar. RealNames, to users of Internet Explorer, was in effect a domain registry. RealNames shut down operations in 2002 following a decision by Microsoft to redirect the 1 billion page views per calendar quarter that RealNames was resolving from the browser address bar into its MSN search engine.

title: Alternative DNS root