text:
Talk:Socialist Republic of Romania

Deletion
Wikipedia does not care about your opinion. Or mine, for that matter. We only WP:CITE WP:RS, that's all. I advise you to proceed accordingly.

For me it is useless to poke holes in your opinion, since it is sheer WP:OR, and therefore irrelevant to our article. tgeorgescu (talk) 09:37, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

 * Still, I actually lived in that period, of SR Romania and it was not a totalitarian state at all. Why to give the people fake information?! With all my respect, I ask you to remove " under a totalitarian dictatorship" references. Detective Chief Inspector Endeavour Morse (talk) 16:56, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

 * Who cares about what you think? Or about what I think? Personal opinions are unwelcome at Wikipedia. We follow WP:RS, we don't ventilate our personal opinions.
 * So: WP:CITE some WP:RS, since we aren't prepared to trust editors on their word of honor. tgeorgescu (talk) 11:31, 6 August 2023 (UTC)

Title is wrong
Romania was socialist, not communist. Communism was never achieved. KnowledgeKeeper161 (talk) 19:18, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Start a discussion at WP:RM if you object. — Biruitorul Talk 19:20, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Requested move 17 April 2024

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not Moved, based chiefly on consistency with other similar states, and to avoid a POV slant to the title. (closed by non-admin page mover) Bensci54 (talk) 16:29, 25 April 2024 (UTC)

Socialist Republic of Romania → Socialist Romania – Here we are again. Two years ago I proposed a move to Communist Romania, which was unsuccessful. Many of the opposers focused on the appropriate use of Marxist terminology, as Romania did not achieve communism, which would imply if I am not mistaken an abolishment of the state, despite meeting the definition used at Communist state. Now that the page has been subject to some moves I think it is a good moment to revisit the alternative I proposed and which went largely undiscussed, Socialist Romania

This article deals with all of Romania's communist regime. During this time, Romania was known by two names, Romanian People's Republic (1947–1965) and Socialist Republic of Romania (1965–1989). The current title, using the last of the two names, leaves out 40% of this period. This is not based on any policy, convention or common practice. People's Socialist Republic of Albania uses the second out of three official names, which was used only half the time the first one was; Czechoslovak Socialist Republic also uses the second out of three official names, this time it is the one used for the longest. Most other Eastern Bloc states had only one official name throughout their history and are not valid comparisons. Per WP:OFFICIALNAMES we are not required to stick to official names and can resort to descriptive rather than proper names if there is good reason.

"Socialist Romania" gives 4,890 results in Google Scholar, while "Socialist Republic of Romania" gives 4,950 (and "Romanian People's Republic" gives 711). The proposed title is practically just as common (WP:COMMONNAME) as the current one. Worth noting that "Communist Romania" gives 12,700 results and is the most common name, but it is not the focus of this RM, because it was rejected on the last one.

Thus, "Socialist Romania", while not violating WP:OFFICIALNAMES and WP:COMMONNAME, is shorter than the current title (WP:CONCISE), actually covers the whole period (WP:PRECISE) and is seemingly in line with Marxist terminology. The choice of using the last official name is not based on any formal procedure (and is thus arbitrary by definition), and we are not pressed to keep it. For all of these reasons I believe the proposed title is a better alternative. By the way, this will be my last attempt at altering this article's title. Super  Ψ   Dro  20:11, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

 * Support for the well-reasoned argumentation above, with a fall-back position in favor of Communist Romania as a second choice. — Biruitorul Talk 20:43, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

 * Comment. Attempting to stay in line with the aforementioned Marxist terminology (no Communist Party-run country is ever truly communist) is a textbook example of falling in line with the No true Scotsman fallacy. Turgidson (talk) 21:14, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
 * A core tenet of Communism is the abolishment of any private ownership of the means of production, which are turned into the community's property (hence the name, Communism). This was never fully implemented in Romania as far as I know, where small private businesses were allowed to thrive. Other than a few Western politicians and media, nobody in Romania at the time claimed that the country was Communist; not even its government. — kashmīrī  TALK  14:01, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Yep, sure thing. By the same token, the Soviet Union was never Communist, nor is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea: they all are (or used to be) on the Shining Path towards les lendemains qui chantes. It's all a moving target, never falsifiable. The No true Scotsman fallacy lives on. Turgidson (talk) 14:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Well, maybe that's why we don't have country articles titled Communist Russia or Communist Korea. Agree that Communism served as the ideal that was to be marched to, and the fact that it wasn't there is one of the reason why we shouldn't name countries as "Communist" in Wikipedia voice. — kashmīrī  TALK  18:06, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Oppose. WP:TITLECON with almost all other former socialist/communist states around that period. The current title works and is clear. Move is believed to be unnecessary. Cfls (talk) 23:50, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Unless exceedingly common, we normally use official names of countries, and not a given government's ideology – see British Raj (not: Colonial India), Soviet Union (not: Communist Russia), etc. Besides, the term "Socialist Republic of Romania" is incomparably more popular than "Socialist Romania". Finally, the proposed title is imprecise and can be considere misleading: socialism is neither an antithesis of free-market economy, which Romania began to implement since 1990, nor we can say that socialism ended in Romania on 10 December 1989, given that many EU countries embrace socialist policies even today (incl. democratic socialism, popular socialism, etc.). — kashmīrī  TALK  13:48, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
 * This is starting to get ridiculous. We all know very well "communist"/"socialist" refer to the 1947–1989 regime in Romania. Let's stop playing around with words that have a very clear meaning for the vast majority of the population. I could understand it on the last RM but now? Really? Romania now is, quite obviously, not socialist. There is no imprecision, no misleading.
 * On the other hand, the Ngrams are a much more valid point. Super   Ψ   Dro  18:20, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
 * We all know very well "communist"/"socialist" refer to the 1947–1989 regime in Romania Wikipedia is not written for your or for me but for ordinary readers who will be looking for the country of that era whatever you think its system was. Google Trends show with no doubt what is the more common search term. And since that common search term happens to be the same as the official name of the country, the naming choice is obvious. — kashmīrī  TALK  18:08, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
 * I was replying to Finally, the proposed title is imprecise and can be considere misleading: socialism is neither an antithesis of free-market economy, which Romania began to implement since 1990, nor we can say that socialism ended in Romania on 10 December 1989, given that many EU countries embrace socialist policies even today. Romania is not socialist today. The proposed title is not imprecise in that sense.
 * Also, per WP:COMMONNAME, "Communist Romania" has been the most popular option for the longest time . Super   Ψ   Dro  20:40, 21 April 2024 (UTC)
 * You've done it wrong. Correct chart: ("Communist Romania" should be a search term, not a topic). — kashmīrī  TALK  00:12, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Comment as an uninvolved editor: @Kashmiri, your comparisons are very bad. British Raj (Hindi for British rule) is the modern-day common name of the period of crown rule in India as the opening sentence of the article itself says, not the country. It is about the period, rather than the country. The country was officially called "India" (see the infobox in the article) or "Indian Empire" (see passports, government maps, documents, etc.). The Soviet Union is the common name not the official name. The official name was the "Union of Soviet Socialist Republics" (USSR). "Soviet Union" had no legal force and was only a common name. PadFoot2008 (talk) 05:25, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

 * Oppose. Sounds POV, and causes more problems that it solves. Don't know if it really was Socialist or not - I am sure many would prefer to describe as Communist or Soviet satellite or a Ceausescu dictatorship. Just as I am sure many could describe the current Romanian state as "socialist" as well (indeed, Art. 1 of its constitution explicitly identifies is "a social state"). I would rather not to engage in guessing games.  And this "We all know..." kind of argumentation holds no water. The current name is preferable, and happens to also be WP:COMMONNAME. Walrasiad (talk) 03:46, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

Let's decide about the title
& everyone else: hi! Salut!

The article now starts like this:
 * "The Socialist Republic of Romania ... existed officially in Romania from 1947 to 1989"

No it didn't. Blatantly wrong.

It was, however, a constituent part of the Communist block, along with Communist Bulgaria, Communist Hungary (1946-49 + 49-89), Communist Czechoslovakia, Communist Poland, Communist Germany, all under the control of Communist Russia; and to a certain degree along with Communist Albania and Communist Yugoslavia. Now, what do we notice?

Let's try something else: Socialist block, Socialist Bulgaria, Socialist Hungary, Socialist Czechoslovakia, Socialist Poland, Socialist Germany, Socialist Russia; Socialist Albania, Socialist Yugoslavia.

Now, what do we notice?
 * 1) The topic here is Romania between Dec. 1947 and Dec. 1989. The title must necessarily reflect this, and not just a partial aspect (PRP 1947-1965 and/or RSR 1965-89).
 * 2) Nobody pays any attention to Marxist-Leninist doctrine. Even those allegedly following it came up with the concept of real socialism. Selling plots of real estate on the Moon is not politology or encyclopedically relevant. Hitler also declared some remote idealistic goals; we're still entitled to call his state Nazi Germany. Dictatorial regimes don't get to impose their terminology outside their sphere of influence.
 * 3) Most Communist block members (not Socialist block members) kept one name from the start of Soviet occupation at the end of WWII until recovering their freedom in 1989, when they quickly reverted to pre-WWII names or similar ones. And they all distanced themselves from - what? Socialism as a provisional step on the enlightened road of the proletariat... blabla, blabla? No, from Communism.
 * 4) What term does cover both periods in Romania's Communist period? Hard to guess, right?
 * 5) Does anyone care how the Party called itself? No. The Romanian Communist Party was just that, with obvious changes of ideology and political platform, along with its name - Partidul Comunist din România ("from Romania") as part of the Comintern; Partidul Muncitoresc Romîn ("Workers' Party", with "Slavic" î, 1948-1964) and P.M. Român (with "Latin" â, 1964-1965) when expedience required it; and Partidul Comunist Român after 65, when it started becoming more national-communist (or does anyone prefer national-socialist? Fine by me.) To everyone it was and stayed: the Romanian Communist Party, or the Romanian communist party, nobody gives a fuck here about caps or no caps.

Still anyone who disagrees calling the article "Communist Romania"?

Then the other minor revert in the lead: it wasn't just "officially" this & that, but in every possible way, both de jure AND the facto. So "officially" must be removed. Again, as illustration: fascist Italy wasn't just "officially" Fascist Italy, Nazi Germany wasn't just "officially" a Nazi state, and the "dictatorship of the proletariat" was not just an official doctrine, but a real dictatorship, only not of the proletariat, but of Stalin's.

OK, let's cut this BS. Enough of it. Arminden (talk) 21:28, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

 * Two more important aspects re. Communist (!) block:
 * Comecon
 * Warsaw pact.
 * Before anyone starts fantasising about Ceauşescu's independence, unalignment and so forth.
 * I'm fine with a model similar to the Czechoslovak Socialist Republic, where the last historical name of Communist Czechoslovakia is kept as the title of the article, but the change of official names is made more than visible from the very top of the lead on, and also graphically (separate, framed infoboxes with thick letters for each name). Arminden (talk) 21:45, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Now, what do we notice? — We notice that virtually ALL these terms, be it "Communist X" or "Socialist X", are either REDIRECTS or DISAMBIGUATION PAGES. None serves as article title, certainly for a host of reasons. Not even the term "Communist block". See? — kashmīrī  TALK  18:13, 20 April 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Update
Informations needs to be updated. 2600:1006:B005:6B15:1979:658D:FDD6:5D5F (talk) 20:27, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

 * Meaning what? tgeorgescu (talk) 20:45, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Socialist Republic of Romania


text:
Sawfish (disambiguation)

A Sawfish is a large, endangered cartilaginous fish with a saw-shaped nose.

Sawfish may also refer to:

 * Sawfish (window manager), a window manager for Unix systems running X
 * Sawfish harvester, a submersible robot equipped with a chainsaw for harvesting underwater trees

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Sawfish (disambiguation)


text:
Arctic roll

An Arctic roll is a British ice cream cake made of vanilla ice cream wrapped in a thin layer of sponge cake to form a roll, with a layer of raspberry flavoured sauce between the sponge and the ice cream.

History
The dessert was invented in the 1950s by Ernest Velden, an immigrant from then Czechoslovakia. He set up a factory in Eastbourne producing Arctic Roll in 1968, and the dessert soon became a successful product. During the 1980s, more than 25 mi of Birds Eye Arctic Roll were sold each month. However, sales slumped during the 1990s and eventually the manufacturer of Arctic roll, Birds Eye, stopped producing the dessert. The 2008 economic downturn saw the reappearance of Arctic roll as consumers increasingly looked for low-cost foods.

While some consumers view the Arctic Roll as comfort food, others view it as old fashioned and the food writer Nigel Slater has even described it as tasting of "frozen carpet". Nonetheless, Birds Eye reported "overwhelming consumer demand" for the dessert. Indeed, from when Birds Eye started marketing Arctic Rolls again in December 2008 until April 2009, sales of the product were estimated at £3.5 million, or 3 million boxes (around 250 mi of Arctic Roll). Commentators suggest that aside from Arctic Roll's low price, many consumers buy the dessert out of feelings of nostalgia. A number of UK supermarkets sell their own brand versions of Arctic Roll, both chocolate and raspberry variants, and did so even when Birds Eye were not marketing the product.

Flavours
The original Arctic Roll features vanilla ice cream and raspberry jam; Birds Eye also produce a variant using chocolate ice cream.

title: Arctic roll


text:
Asset management in China

Asset management companies in China came into being in 1998. The founding of commercial Asset management companies (AMC; ) established by the Ministry of Finance tasked with professionally managing third-party assets was a major landmark in the development of China's financial system. It marks a transition in Chinese regulation away from an unregulated environment toward a system where specialist companies started to operate according to a defined set of standards and regulations.

Development of AMCs
From 1998 to 1999, the Chinese government created 10 AMCs in China. 4 as bad banks, one for each of the four commercial state-owned banks. and 6 Fund management companies. As of 2018 there are over 130 asset management companies in china, with a combined US$2 billion in assets under management.

The original asset management companies include:
 * China Great Wall Asset Management - for the Agricultural Bank of China
 * China Orient Asset Management - for the Bank of China
 * China Cinda Asset Management - for the China Construction Bank
 * China Huarong Asset Management - for the Industrial and Commercial Bank of China
 * Guotai Asset Management
 * China Southern Asset Management
 * HuaAn Fund Management
 * Bosera Asset Management
 * Penghua Fund Management
 * China Asset Management

Other AMCs that were established later on include:
 * Changsheng Fund Management
 * China Universal
 * Dacheng Fund Management
 * E Fund Management
 * Fullgoal Asset Management
 * Harvest Fund Management
 * ICBC Credit Suisse Asset Management
 * Tianhong Asset Management

title: Asset management in China


text:
Marcia Hines

Marcia Elaine Hines AM (born July 20, 1953) is an American-born Australian singer and TV personality. Hines made her debut, at the age of 16, in the Australian production of the stage musical Hair and followed with the role of Mary Magdalene in Jesus Christ Superstar.

She achieved her greatest commercial successes as a recording artist during the late 1970s with several hit singles, including cover versions of "Fire and Rain", "I Just Don't Know What to Do with Myself", "You" and "Something's Missing (In My Life)"; and her Top Ten albums Marcia Shines, Shining and Ladies and Gentlemen. Hines was voted "Queen of Pop" by TV Week's readers for three consecutive years from 1976.

Hines stopped recording in the early 1980s until she returned with Right Here and Now in 1994, the same year she became an Australian citizen. She was the subject of the 2001 biography Diva: the life of Marcia Hines, which coincided with the release of the compilation album Diva. From 2003 to 2009 and again in 2024, she was a judge on Australian Idol, and her elevated profile led to a renewed interest in her as a performer. Her 2006 album, Discotheque, peaked at number 6 on the Australian Recording Industry Association (ARIA) albums chart. Hines was inducted into the ARIA Hall of Fame on July 18, 2007.

Hines is the mother of singer Deni Hines, with whom she performed on the duet single "Stomp!" (2006). Hines has sold 2.6 million albums and was the first Australian female artist to have a platinum-selling album, as well as the first female to have seven consecutive top 20 album releases.

Early life
Hines was born in Boston, Massachusetts, to Jamaican parents, Eugene and Esmeralda Hines. Eugene died when Hines was six months old due to an operation to remove shrapnel from a war wound. Colin Powell, a former US secretary of state, was her cousin, as is the performer Grace Jones. She was raised with her older brother Dwight by their mother and began singing as a nine-year-old in her church choir. By her teens she was performing with groups in her local area and briefly used the stage-name Shantee Renee. At 14, Hines won a scholarship to the New England Conservatory of Music but left after three months. A month after turning 16, Hines attended the Woodstock Festival. In 1970, at age 16, Hines moved to Australia after landing a role in the Australian stage production of Hair.

1970–1974: Hair and Jesus Christ Superstar
At the age of 16, Hines was discovered by Australian entrepreneur Harry M. Miller and director Jim Sharman who were visiting the U.S. to audition African-American singers in preparation for the new season of the Australian stage production of Hair, which had already premiered in Sydney on 6 June 1969. Because she was underage, Miller was made her legal guardian. When she made her debut in April 1970, Hines became the youngest person in the world to play a featured role in any production of Hair. It was produced by Miller and directed by Sharman. Fellow performers included Keith Glass, Sharon Redd, Reg Livermore, John Waters and Victor Willis. During the show's run Hines learned she was pregnant; her daughter, Deni Hines, was born on 4 September 1970, and nine days later Hines returned to the stage to continue her role. The show was a major success. Hines was well received and an Australian tour followed. Miller and Sharman approached her to play Mary Magdalene in the Australian production of Jesus Christ Superstar and Hines assumed the role from Michele Fawdon in the summer of 1973 with Hines' tenure in the role until February 1974 making her a major star in Australia. Other cast members included Trevor White, Jon English, Doug Parkinson, Stevie Wright and John Paul Young.

1974–1984: Queen of Pop and beyond
When Jesus Christ Superstar finished in February 1974, Hines joined the jazz orchestra Daly-Wilson Big Band, releasing the album Daly-Wilson Big Band featuring Marcia Hines in 1975. Hines' vocals were on the cover songs "Ain't No Mountain High Enough" and "Do You Know What It Means to Miss New Orleans?". Hines toured with Daly-Wilson Big Band from Australia to United States, supporting B. B. King and Wilson Pickett in Los Angeles, then to Europe and into Soviet Union for a month. During late 1974 Hines also performed as the backing vocalist on Jim Keays' solo concept album The Boy from the Stars.

A record contract with Robie Porter's Wizard Records in July 1974 led to Hines' first solo single, a cover version of James Taylor's "Fire and Rain", that peaked at number 17 on the Australian singles charts in May 1975. Five Top Ten singles were released between 1976 and 1979, including her cover versions of Artie Wayne's "From the Inside", Burt Bacharach/Hal David's "I Just Don't Know What to Do with Myself", "What I Did for Love" (from A Chorus Line) and Karen Carpenter's "Something's Missing (in My Life)".

Hines' biggest hit was with Tom Snow's "You", which reached number 2 in the singles charts in Australia in October 1977. It was an up-tempo dance song, later covered in the U.S. by Rita Coolidge. The song, however, nearly didn't make it to Marcia. Robie Porter had put the song into his "don't use" pile. Mark Kennedy, her backing band's drummer (ex-Spectrum, Doug Parkinson in Focus, Ayers Rock), saw the sheet music in the studio and began arguing the songs' worth to Porter. Porter subsequently changed his mind about the song.

Top Ten Australian album chart success also occurred in the 1970s with Marcia Shines peaking at number 4 in January 1976, Shining number 3 in November 1976, Ladies and Gentlemen number 6 in August 1977 and Marcia Hines Live Across Australia number 7 in March 1978. Her albums have sold close to a million copies and Hines was the first Australian female performer to attain a Platinum record.

Hines was voted "Queen of Pop", the country's most popular female performer, each year from 1976 to 1978, by the readers of TV Week. Hines was Australia's best-selling local act for 1977 and 1978, and she was the top concert attraction for 1976–1979 inclusive. Her success had been boosted by appearances on Australian Broadcasting Corporation's (ABC) popular TV music show Countdown. Her touring band, the Marcia Hines Band, included Kennedy, bass guitarist Jackie Orszaczky, lead guitarist Stephen Housden (later of Little River Band) and drummer/percussionist Peter Whitford. Hines was married to Kennedy during the late-1970s; he designed and made an elaborate and colourful stage costume for her. In 1978 and 1979, Hines also had her own TV series, Marcia Hines Music on the ABC.

By November 1979, Hines had fallen out with Wizard Records' owner Robie Porter, and moved on to the Midnight label under Warner Music Australia, after waiting out her contract she returned to recording to achieve a few more hits including the dance track version of Dusty Springfield's "Your Love Still Brings Me to My Knees", which reached Top Ten in 1981. A compilation Greatest Hits, released by Porter's Wizard Records, peaked at number 2 in January 1982. In April 1981, Hines' brother Dwight committed suicide, and Hines later recalled being given the news by her mother.

"So she called, so I knew something was very, very, very wrong. So the first thing I said is, 'What's wrong with Deni?' And she said, 'Deni's fine. Your brother's dead.' My mother was to the point, you know, I said, 'What do you mean he's dead?' and I started boo-hooing, and she said, 'Shut up.' She said, 'Look, I took that child through measles, mumps and chicken pox. I gave birth to that child. That's my son, don't cry. Go home and bury him.' And I did just that."

Hines combined with fellow Jesus Christ Superstar artist Jon English to release a duet single "Jokers & Queens" and an associated six-track mini-album Jokers and Queens in July 1982. The album reached No. 36 and the single peaked at number 62 on their respective charts. Her next album, Love Sides, and its singles, "Love Side" and "Shadow in the Night", did not chart. Hines returned to theatre for a Jesus Christ Superstar revival in late 1983, and she then decided to devote more time to raising her daughter. During this time, she suffered with health and relationship problems.

1984–1994: Hiatus
Theatre projects for Hines, from 1984, included Big River, Are You Lonesome Tonight? and Jerry's Girls. In 1986, a fall in her kitchen resulted in the diagnosis of her diabetes, which was treated by daily injections of insulin, careful monitoring of her diet and a commitment to fitness. Hines performed the closing act of the 1990 Sydney Gay and Lesbian Mardi Gras. It was a turning point for her and she later described the crowd ovation her most pleasing audience reception ever. Hines decided she would return to singing, while her daughter Deni was achieving her own successes initially singing with Rockmelons for their top-five hits "Ain't No Sunshine" and "That Word (L.O.V.E.)" and then solo for her top-five "It's Alright". Hines returned to the stage with a performance in The Masters of Rhythm and Taste in 1993.

1994–2002: Recording again
In March 1994, Hines toured nationally for the first time in seven years. She signed a new contract with Warner Music Australia to release Right Here and Now in October, which peaked at number 21; its singles included "Rain (Let the Children Play)", which peaked at number 47, and "Give it All You've Got", which had less success. Her career was gradually revived with concert and TV appearances. By 1998, Hines enlisted Rockmelons' members Bryon Jones and Ray Medhurst as producers for Time of Our Lives, which charted from August 1999 and peaked at number 17. The singles "Flashdance, What a Feeling" (originally recorded by Irene Cara) and "Time of Our Lives" were released with the latter peaking at No. 31. Hines recorded "Rise", an official song for the Australian team at the Sydney 2000 Olympic Games. In September 2001, music producer and writer, Karen Dewey wrote Hines' fully authorised biography Diva: the life of Marcia Hines and Hines released a companion compilation CD, Diva, in October.

2003–2010: Australian Idol and more
In May 2003, Hines endured the illness and death of her mother Esme;  she returned to the public eye with her role as a judge on the television show Australian Idol from July 27, 2003. She has been described as "the nice judge" and has been accused of being a "fence-sitter" – unable to provide criticism of any kind. Hines counters such criticism with: "Well, you know, I'm living it, if you get my drift, so the advice I give the kids is the advice I'm living." The success of the program has led to further interest in her as a recording artist, and in 2004 she released an album of cover versions, titled Hinesight – Songs from the Journey which featured a duet, with former Home and Away star Belinda Emmett, "Shower the People". In 2005, Hines released a remixed version of her earlier hit "You", followed in 2006 by Discotheque, an album containing her versions of disco classics, which peaked at number 6. Hines made a cameo appearance on Neighbours in early 2007; on 18 July, she was inducted into the ARIA Hall of Fame. In November 2007, Hines released a new album, Life, and during December she toured in support of Lionel Richie. From August 31, 2008, the sixth season of Australian Idol was broadcast, with Hines continuing as a judge, and she is the only judge to appear in every season of Australian Idol.

2010–present: continued success and return to Idol
In October 2010, Hines released Marcia Sings Tapestry, a tribute to Carole King's 1971 album Tapestry; it peaked at number 16. In April 2014, Hines released her first album of original material in two decades, called Amazing. It spawned three singles and peaked at No. 27 in Australia. In 2015, Hines starred on stage in the disco musical Velvet, with performances at the Adelaide Fringe, Brisbane and Edinburgh. Velvet played at the Sydney Opera House from late 2015. In early 2015, Marcia Hines covered the song "These Boots Are Made for Walkin'", specifically for the trailer of season two of The Real Housewives of Melbourne.

In January 2023, Hines returned to the Channel 7 reboot of Australian Idol, after the show's fourteen-year hiatus, as a judge in the top 50 rounds for three episodes while regular judge Meghan Trainor was in New York due to other commitments. In 2024, Hines will be rejoining Australian Idol as a main judge alongside returning judges Kyle Sandilands and Amy Shark, permanently replacing Trainor.

Later in 2023, Hines released two songs under the same singles package, which was titled Last One Standing. The two songs were called "Last One Standing" and "Hard to Breathe". These two songs then went on to feature in her brand new greatest hits album, Still Shining: The 50th Anniversary Ultimate Collection, which was officially released in July 2023, through ABC Music. The album was supported by an Australian tour from July to November 2023. On 25 August 2023, Hines released a cover of Bill Withers' "Lean On Me", which featured as the lead single for her forthcoming fifteenth studio album. The album's second single "Loves Me Like A Rock", was released on 13 October 2023. The album, which was titled The Gospel According to Marcia, was officially released on 3 November 2023. Hines has said that the inspiration for the album came when she performed several live shows titled The Gospel According to Marcia Hines alongside a rhythm section and a 12-member choir. These shows received positive reviews inspired Hines to record a gospel album. The Gospel According to Marcia did not reach the ARIA top 50, but peaked at number 15 on the ARIA Australian Artist chart and at number 2 on the Australian Independent Label Albums chart.

Personal life
Hines has a daughter, Deni Hines, who was born in Australia on September 4, 1970. Hines had been performing in Hair since she was 16 years old. Hines has been married four times: French businessman Andre DeCarpentry, keyboard player Jamie McKinley, businessman Ghassan Bayni, and, in April 2005, she married Christopher Morrissey, whom she divorced in 2014.

Hines grew up with asthma, missing months of schooling as a result of life-threatening attacks, and was diagnosed with diabetes after collapsing at her home in 1986. Her elder brother Dwight's death by suicide, in April 1981, devastated Hines, but her mother Esmeralda (Esme) helped her through their grief. Esme relocated to Australia to live with Hines and Deni in the 1980s, and she died in May 2003.

Studio albums

 * Marcia Shines (1975)
 * Shining (1976)
 * Ladies and Gentlemen (1977)
 * Ooh Child (1979)
 * Take It from the Boys (1981)
 * Jokers and Queens (with Jon English) (1982)
 * Love Sides (1982)
 * Right Here and Now (1994)
 * Time of Our Lives (1999)
 * Hinesight (2004)
 * Discotheque (2006)
 * Life (2007)
 * Marcia Sings Tapestry (2010)
 * Amazing (2014)
 * The Gospel According to Marcia (2023)

ARIA Music Awards
The ARIA Music Awards is an annual awards ceremony that recognises excellence, innovation, and achievement across all genres of Australian music. They commenced in 1987. Hines was inducted into the Hall of Fame in 2007.

 * 1989
 * "The Lords Prayer"
 * Best Female Artist
 * Nominated
 * 2000
 * Time of Our Lives
 * Best Adult Contemporary Album
 * Nominated
 * 2007
 * herself
 * ARIA Hall of Fame
 * inductee
 * herself
 * ARIA Hall of Fame
 * inductee

Australia Day Honours
On January 26, 2009, Hines was appointed as Member, Order of Australia for service to the entertainment industry as a performer, judge and mentor, and to the community through a range of charitable organisations.

Australian Women in Music Awards
The Australian Women in Music Awards is an annual event that celebrates outstanding women in the Australian Music Industry who have made significant and lasting contributions in their chosen field. They commenced in 2018.

 * 2019
 * Marcia Hines
 * Lifetime Achievement Award
 * Nominated
 * Nominated

King of Pop Awards
The King of Pop Awards were voted by the readers of TV Week. The King of Pop award started in 1967 and ran through to 1978.

 * 1976
 * herself
 * Queen of Pop
 * Won
 * 1977
 * herself
 * Queen of Pop
 * Won
 * 1978
 * herself
 * Queen of Pop
 * Won
 * herself
 * Queen of Pop
 * Won

Mo Awards
The Australian Entertainment Mo Awards (commonly known informally as the Mo Awards), were annual Australian entertainment industry awards. They recognise achievements in live entertainment in Australia from 1975 to 2016. Marcia Hines won one award in that time. (wins only)
 * 2004
 * Marcia Hines
 * Classic Rock Performer of the Year
 * Won
 * Won

TV Week / Countdown Awards
Countdown was an Australian pop music TV series on national broadcaster ABC-TV from 1974 to 1987, it presented music awards from 1979 to 1987, initially in conjunction with magazine TV Week. The TV Week / Countdown Awards were a combination of popular-voted and peer-voted awards.

 * 1979
 * herself
 * Most Popular Female Performer
 * Nominated
 * 1981
 * herself
 * Most Popular Female Performer
 * Nominated
 * Most Popular Female Performer
 * Nominated

title: Marcia Hines


text:
Ministry of Finance (China)

The Ministry of Finance of the People's Republic of China is the constituent department of the State Council of the People's Republic of China which administers macroeconomic policies and the annual budget. It also handles fiscal policy, economic regulations and government expenditure for the state.

The ministry also records and publishes annual macroeconomic data on China's economy. This includes information such as previous economic growth rates in China, central government debt and borrowing and many other indicators regarding the economy of mainland China.

The Ministry of Finance's remit is smaller than its counterparts in many other states. Macroeconomic management is primarily handled by the National Development and Reform Commission (NDRC). State-owned industries are the responsibility of the State-owned Assets Supervision and Administration Commission, and there are separate regulators for banking, insurance and securities. It also does not handle regulation of the money markets or interest rates. These, together with other aspects of monetary policy, are governed by the People's Bank of China (PBC), mainland China's central bank. The Ministry, NDRC and PBC are equal in status, with their political heads all sitting on the State Council.

History
The Ministry of Finance of the People's Republic of China was formerly known as the Ministry of Finance of the Central People's Government, which was established on October 1,1949. In September 1954, the First Session of the First National People's Congress was held in Beijing, at which the Constitution of the People's Republic of China and the Organic Law of the State Council of the People's Republic of China were adopted. The former Ministry of Finance of the Central People's Government was transformed into the Ministry of Finance of the People's Republic of China, which took over the related work and became a constituent department of the State Council.

In 1969, during the Cultural Revolution, the State Council approved the consolidation of PBC's headquarters as a bureau within the Ministry of Finance. Local PBC branches were merged into local government finance departments. In 1978, the PBC was separated from the Ministry of Finance.

The Ministry held China's first bond auction in 1996.

In 2009, the Ministry converted its ownership of $200 billion of China Investment Corporation's debt into equity, a result which relieved CIC of interest payments on the special treasury bonds that had initially capitalized it and instead resulted in CIC paying an annual dividend to the Ministry.

The Ministry has sought to implement property taxes since the early 2010s, but has been opposed on this issue by the National People's Congress and many local governments. As of at least early 2024, property taxes have been kept off the legislative agenda.

The Ministry is among the state entities which contribute to the China Integrated Circuit Industry Investment Fund, which was established in an effort to decrease China's reliance on foreign semiconductor companies. The fund was established in 2014.

Role
During the pre-Reform period of centrally planned public finance, capitalization of industrial and infrastructure projects has handled through public expenditure. The State Planning Commission designated projects and the Ministry allocated revenue to them.

The main functions of the Ministry is to carry out the following duties of the state: The Ministry of Finance in involved the foreign aid process through making China's donations to multilateral financial institutions.

Organizational structure
Organizational structure obtained from the Ministry of Finance website:

 * General Office
 * Policy & Programme Department
 * Legal Department
 * Tax Policy Department
 * Tariff Policy Department
 * Budget Department
 * Treasury Department
 * National Defense Department
 * Administrative & Law Enforcement Department
 * Education, Science & Culture Department
 * Economic Construction Department
 * Agriculture Department
 * Social Security Department
 * State Equity & Corporate Finance Department
 * Finance Department
 * International Department
 * Accounting Regulatory Department
 * Supervision Department
 * State Rural Development Office
 * Personnel & Education Department

Leadership
All of the leaders are members of the Ministry's Communist Party Committee, with Lan Fo'an as its secretary.

As shareholder
The MOF also acted as the controlling shareholder for a number of financial service companies of China, such as People's Insurance Company of China, China Life Insurance Group (parent of China Life), China Taiping Insurance Group (parent of China Taiping Insurance Holdings), etc. The Ministry also owned Industrial and Commercial Bank of China, the Agricultural Bank of China, the Bank of Communications, China Great Wall Asset Management, China Cinda Asset Management, China Orient Asset Management, China Huarong Asset Management and China Re, etc.

MOF also owned China Railway, China Tobacco and CITIC Group.

title: Ministry of Finance (China)


text:
Pentagrid converter

The pentagrid converter is a type of radio receiving valve (vacuum tube) with five grids used as the frequency mixer stage of a superheterodyne radio receiver.

The pentagrid was part of a line of development of valves that were able to take an incoming RF signal and change its frequency to a fixed intermediate frequency, which was then amplified and detected in the remainder of the receiver circuitry. The device was generically referred to as a frequency changer or just mixer.

Origins
The first devices designed to change frequency in the manner described above seem to have been developed by the French, who simply put two grids into what would otherwise have been an ordinary triode valve (the bi-grille or bi-grid). Although technically a four electrode device, neither the term tetrode nor the tetrode valve as it is known today had yet appeared. The bi-grid differed from the later tetrode because the second (outer) grid was coarsely wound compared with the tetrode's screen grid which had to be finely wound to provide its screening effect. Each grid was able to accept one of the incoming signals, and the non-linearity of the device produced the sum and difference frequencies. The valve would have been very inefficient, but, most importantly, the capacitive coupling between the two grids would have been very large. It would therefore have been quite impossible to prevent the signal from one grid coupling out of the other. At least one reference claims that the bi-grille was self-oscillating, but this has not been confirmed.

In 1918, Edwin Armstrong used only triodes when he invented the superheterodyne receiver. One triode operated in a conventional oscillator circuit. Another triode acted as a mixer by coupling the oscillator signal into the mixer's cathode and the received signal to the grid. The sum and difference frequencies were then available in the mixer's anode circuit. Once again, the problem of coupling between the circuits would be ever present.

Shortly after Armstrong invented the superheterodyne, a triode mixer stage design was developed that not only mixed the incoming signal with the local oscillator, but the same valve doubled as the oscillator. This was known as the autodyne mixer. Early examples had difficulty oscillating across the frequency range because the oscillator feedback was via the first intermediate frequency transformer primary tuning capacitor, which was too small to give good feedback. Keeping the oscillator signal out of the antenna circuit was also difficult.

The invention of the tetrode demonstrated the idea of screening electrodes from each other by using additional earthed (grounded) grids (at least, as far as the signal was concerned). In 1926, Philips invented a technique of adding yet another grid to combat the secondary emission that the tetrode suffered from. All the ingredients for the pentagrid were now in place.

Pentagrid

The development of the pentagrid or heptode (seven-electrode) valve was a novel development in the mixer story. The idea was to produce a single valve that not only mixed the oscillator signal and the received signal and produced its own oscillator signal at the same time but, importantly, did the mixing and the oscillating in different parts of the same valve.

The invention of the device at first sight doesn't seem to be obscure, but it would appear that it was developed in both America and the United Kingdom, more or less at the same time. However, the UK device is different from its American counterpart.

It is known that Donald G. Haines of RCA applied for a patent for the pentagrid on 28 March 1933 (subsequently granted on 29 March 1939) under US patent number 2,148,266. The pentagrid also featured in a UK patent (GB426802) granted on 10 April 1935. However, the Ferranti company of Great Britain entered the valve business with the first known UK-produced pentagrid, the VHT4, late in 1933 (though it must have been in development, and would certainly have existed as a prototype well before that time).

The pentagrid proved to be a much better mixer. Since the oscillator circuit was more or less self-contained, good feedback for reliable oscillation across the frequency range was easy to obtain. Some manufacturers that had adopted the autodyne mixer converted some, if not all, of their designs to pentagrid mixers.

What was the goal to develop a reliable self-oscillating mixer? The reasons were to differ from the UK to America. The UK radio manufacturers had to pay a royalty of £1 per valve holder to the British Valve Association to cover use of their members' patent rights. Further, they dictated that not more than one electrode structure could be contained in a single envelope (which would have evaded the royalty - at least in part). The Americans appeared to be driven by the desire to produce a low-cost 'every expense spared' design which was to lead to the All American Five. By making the mixer self-oscillate, the necessity of providing a separate oscillator valve is avoided. The All American Five was to use a pentagrid converter from when it first appeared in 1934, right up until valves became obsolete when transistors took over.

In the UK, the five grids operated thus. Grid 1 acted as the Armstrong oscillator grid in conjunction with grid 2 which acted as its anode. Grid 4 accepted the incoming signal with the remaining two grids, 3 and 5 connected together (usually internally) which acted as screen grids to screen the anode, grid 4 and grid 2 from each other. Because grid 2 was a 'leaky' anode in that it allowed part of the modulated electron stream through, the oscillator was coupled into the mixing section of the valve. In fact, in some designs, grid 2 consisted of just the support rods, the actual grid wire itself being omitted.

In America, the configuration was different. Grid 1 acted as the oscillator grid as before, but in this case, grids 2 and 4 were connected together (again usually internally). Grid 2 functioned as both a screen and the oscillator anode; in this case the grid wire had to be present to provide the screening. Grid 3 accepted the incoming signal. Grid 4 screened this from the anode, and grid 5 was a suppressor grid to suppress secondary emission. This configuration limited the oscillator design to one where the oscillator 'anode' was operated from the HT+ (B+) rail. This was often accomplished by using a Hartley Oscillator circuit and taking the cathode to the tap on the coil, which requires an indirectly heated heptode.

The UK version would have had significant secondary emission and would also have had a tetrode kink. This was exploited in providing the non linearity necessary to produce good sum and difference signals. The American devices although having no secondary emission due to the suppressor grid, nevertheless were able to get the required non linearity by biasing the oscillator such that the valve was overdriven. The American version was also a little more sensitive because the grid that accepted the signal was closer to the cathode increasing the amplification factor.

The pentagrid converter in either guise operated extremely well, but it suffered from the limitation that a strong signal was able to 'pull' the oscillator frequency away from a weaker signal. This was not considered a major problem in broadcast receivers where the signals were likely to be strong, but it became a problem when trying to receive weak signals that were close to strong signals. Some short wave radios managed quite satisfactorily with these devices. Special high frequency versions appeared after World War II for the 100 MHz FM bands. Examples are the 6SB7Y (1946) and the 6BA7 (1948). The pulling effect had a beneficial side effect in that it gave a degree of automatic tuning.

Another disadvantage was that in spite of the presence of the screen grids, the electron beam, modulated by the oscillator electrodes, still had to pass through the signal grid, and coupling of the oscillator into the signal circuit was inevitable. The American Federal Communications Commission (FCC) started requiring radio manufacturers to certify that their products avoided this interference under Part 15 of their rules. In the UK, the Postmaster General (who was responsible for radio licensing at this time), laid down a set of stringent rules concerning radio interference.

Hexode

The hexode (six-electrode) was actually developed after the heptode or pentagrid. It was developed in Germany as a mixer but was designed from the start to be used with a separate triode oscillator. Thus the grid configuration was grid 1, signal input; grids 2 and 4 screen grids (connected together - again, usually internally) and grid 3 was the oscillator input. The device had no suppressor grid. A major advantage was that by using grid 1 as the signal input grid, the device was more sensitive to weak signals.

It was not long before the triode and hexode structures were placed in the same glass envelope - by no means a new idea. The triode grid was usually internally connected to the hexode grid 3, but this practice was dropped in later designs when the mixer section operated as a straight IF amplifier in AM/FM sets when operating on FM, the mixing being carried out in a dedicated FM frequency changing section.

The UK manufacturers were initially unable to use this type of mixer because of the BVA prohibition on multiple structures (and indeed unwilling to use separate valves because of the levy). One UK company, MOV, successfully enforced the cartel rules against the German Lissen company in 1934 when they attempted to market a radio in the UK which had the triode-hexode mixer.

Following pressure from the UK manufacturers, the BVA were compelled to relax the rules and the UK started to adopt triode-hexode mixers. The Mullard ECH35 was a popular choice.

One company, Osram, made an ingenious move. One of their popular pentagrid converter designs was the MX40, initially marketed in 1934. They put on sale in 1936, the X41 triode-hexode frequency changer. The clever bit was that the X41 was a direct plug-in pin-compatible replacement for the MX40. Thus a pentagrid radio could easily be converted to a triode-hexode without any other circuit modifications.

America never really adopted the triode-hexode and it was seldom used, even though the 6K8 triode-hexode was available to manufacturers in 1938.

In some designs, a suppressor grid was added to produce yet another heptode design. Mullard's ECH81 became popular with the move to miniature nine-pin valves.

Octode
Although not strictly a pentagrid (in that it has more than five grids), the octode (eight-electrode) nevertheless operates on the pentagrid principle. It resulted simply from the addition of an extra screen grid to the UK version of the pentagrid heptode. This was done mainly to improve the antenna/oscillator separation and to reduce the power consumption for use in radio sets operated by dry-cell batteries that were becoming increasingly popular.

In North America, the only octode manufactured was the 7A8. Introduced by Sylvania in 1939 (and used mostly by Philco), this valve was the product of adding a suppressor grid to type 7B8, which was the loctal version of type 6A7. Adding the suppressor allowed Sylvania to lower the current of the 6.3-volt heater from 320 milliamperes to 150 milliamperes while maintaining the same conversion transconductance (550 microsiemens). This allowed Philco to use this valve in every line of radio throughout the 1940s.

The Philips EK3 octode was designated as a "beam octode". The novel part about the design was that grids 2 and 3 were constructed as beam-forming plates. This was done in such a way that Philips claimed that the oscillator electron beam and the mixer electron beams were separated as much as possible and thus the pulling effect was minimised. No information is available as to the degree of success. The manufacturer's information also notes that the valve's high performance comes at a cost of a high heater current of 600 mA – double that of more conventional types.

Pentode
The use of a pentode would seem an unlikely choice for a frequency converter because it only has one control grid. However, during the Great Depression, many American radio manufacturers used pentode types 6C6, 6D6, 77 and 78 in their lowest priced AC/DC receivers because they were cheaper than pentagrid type 6A7. In these circuits, the suppressor (grid 3) acted as the oscillator grid, and the valve operated in a similar manner to a true pentagrid.

One UK company, Mazda/Ediswan, produced a triode-pentode frequency changer, the AC/TP. Designed for low-cost AC radios, the device was deliberately designed to allow strong signals to pull the oscillator without the risk of radiating the oscillator signal from the aerial. The cathode was common to both sections of the valve. The cathode was connected to a secondary coil on the oscillator coil and thus coupled the oscillator into the pentode mixer section, the signal being applied to grid 1 in the conventional manner. The AC/TP was one of the AC/ range of valves designed for low-cost radios. They were considered durable for their time (even the AC/TP frequency changer, which was normally troublesome). Any AC/ valves encountered today are likely to be brand new as service shops stocked up on spares which were seldom required.

Nomenclature
In order to distinguish between the two versions of the heptode, manufacturers data often describes them as "heptode of the hexode type" for a heptode without a suppressor grid, and a "heptode of the octode type", where a suppressor grid is present.

True pentagrids

 * 2A7 and 6A7 – The first of the RCA pentagrids, 1933
 * VHT1 – Ferranti pentagrid, 1933
 * MX40 – Osram pentagrid, 1934
 * 6SA7 and 6BE6/EK90 – Pentagrids produced by RCA, Mullard, etc.
 * 6SB7Y and 6BA7 – VHF pentagrids, 1946
 * 1LA6 and later 1L6 – Battery pentagrid for Zenith Trans-Oceanic and other high-end portable short-wave radios
 * DK91/1R5, DK92/1AC6, DK96/1AB6, DK192 – Battery pentagrids
 * 1C8,1E8 - Subminiature battery pentagrids

Octodes (operating on the pentagrid principle)

 * EK3 – Beam octode produced by Philips
 * 7A8 – The only octode produced in America by Sylvania, 1939

Triode/hexode types (not operating on the pentagrid principle)

 * X41 – Osram triode-hexode, 1936; plug-in replacement for MX40 above
 * ECH35 – Mullard triode-hexode
 * ECH81 (Soviet 6И1П) – Mullard triode-heptode of the octode type
 * 6K8 – American triode-hexode, 1938

This list is by no means exhaustive.

title: Pentagrid converter


text:
Talk:Mohammad-Reza Khatami

Untitled
There is an interview at http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4339408/ which may be source of some information, like his participation in the takeover of the American Embassy. Roozbeh 13:26, 25 Feb 2004 (UTC)

 * The Number of votes you added was announce by Guardian Council and ofcourse it's not real number.Ministry of Interior annouced real number of votes and that was about 2.2 millions. Sina

 * Would you please add both numbers and explain the difference, please? Roozbeh 01:32, 28 Feb 2004 (UTC)

 * Well,Guardian Council announced this number:1,794,365,but you know it was not real number,I don't have exact number now but Ministry of Interior said his votes was about 2.2 millions.And the difference was this:Guardian Council denied about 600,000 votes of people of Tehran,why?Because they want to send Hadad-Adel to parliment,and because of this 2.2 millions went down to 1,794,365!OK,what do u believe?Guardian council or Ministry of Interior?:)

--213.233.160.15 09:05, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * It's all about the NPOV. We need to mention the GC view also. Best is to write the whole story: why are the numbers different, what did MoI say, what did GC say, what was the final ruling, what was the resulting change (Haddad-Adel and Rafsanjani getting in, Rajai and Mohtashami(?) getting out). Roozbeh 14:44, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * I am strongly agree with you!Why you didn't write the story?You better start it.The guy who sent out of parliment was not Mohtashami,I think it was MontajabNia,Am I right!? Sina

 * I really can't remember the exact details. That was the reason I didn't write it. Roozbeh 06:28, 9 Mar 2004 (UTC)

title: Talk:Mohammad-Reza Khatami


text:
Culture of Colombia

Many aspects of Colombian culture can be traced back to the early culture of Spain of the 16th century and its collision with Colombia's native civilizations (see: Muisca, Tayrona). The Spanish brought Catholicism, the feudal encomienda system, and a caste system that favored European descendants. After independence from Spain, the criollos struggled to establish a pluralistic political system, between conservative and liberal ideals. The conservatives supported the involvement of the Catholic Church in the state, while liberals favored the separation of these. The conservatives managed to outsource public education to the Catholic Church, and for many years, the church controlled the country's education system. Both parties engaged in multiple civil wars resulting in a slow development of the country and the isolation of regions until the end of the 19th century. Ethno-racial groups maintained their ancestral heritage culture: whites tried to keep themselves, despite the growing number of illegitimate children of mixed African or indigenous ancestry. These people were labeled with any number of descriptive names, derived from the casta system, such as mestizo, mulatto and moreno. Blacks and indigenous people of Colombia also mixed to form zambos, creating a new ethno-racial group in society. This mix also created a fusion of cultures. Carnivals for example became an opportunity for all classes and colors to congregate without prejudice. The introduction of the bill of rights of men and the abolishment of slavery (1851) eased the segregationist tensions between the races.

Geography and climate
The hydrography of Colombia is one of the richest in the world. Its main rivers are Magdalena, Cauca, Guaviare, and Caquetá. Colombia has four main drainage systems: the Pacific drain, the Caribbean drain, the Orinoco Basin and the Amazon Basin. The Orinoco and Amazon Rivers mark limits with Colombia to Venezuela and Peru respectively.

The striking variety in temperature and precipitation results principally from differences in elevation. Temperatures range from very hot at sea level to relatively cold at higher elevations but vary little with the season. Temperatures generally decrease about 3.5°F (2°C) for every 1,000-ft (300-m) increase in altitude above sea level, presenting perpetual snowy peaks to hot river valleys and basins. Rainfall is concentrated in two wet seasons (roughly corresponding to the spring and autumn of temperate latitudes) but varies considerably by location. Colombia's Pacific coast has one of the highest levels of rainfall in the world, with the south east often drenched by more than 200 in (500 cm) of rain per year. On the other hand, rainfall in parts of the Guajira Peninsula seldom exceeds 30 in (75 cm) per year. Rainfall in the rest of the country runs between these two extremes.

Colombians customarily describe their country in terms of the climatic zones. Below 900 m in elevation is the tierra caliente (hot land), where temperatures vary between 24 and 38 °C. The most productive land and the majority of the population can be found in the tierra templada (temperate land, between 900 and 1980 m), which provide the best conditions for the country's coffee growers, and the tierra fría (cold land, 1980 and 3500 m), where wheat and potatoes dominate. In the tierra fría mean temperatures range between 10 and 19 °C. Beyond the tierra fría lie the alpine conditions of the zona forestada (forested zone) and then the treeless grasslands of the páramos. Above 4500 m, where temperatures are below freezing, is the tierra helada, a zone of permanent snow and ice.

About 86% of the country's total area lies in the tierra caliente. Included in this, and interrupting the temperate area of the Andean highlands, are the long and narrow extension of the Magdalena Valley and a small extension in the Cauca Valley. The tierra fría constitutes just 6% of the total area, but supports about a quarter of the country's population.

Natural regions

Because of its natural structure, Colombia can be divided into six very distinct natural regions.

 * Amazon Region: Comprises the part South of the eastern region of Colombia, flat low-lying region. It is the region of the Amazon jungle of Colombia.
 * Andean Region: The Colombian part of the Andes, including the inter-Andean valleys of the rivers Cauca and Magdalena.
 * Caribbean Region: The region of the Colombian Caribbean coastal plains and mountainous groups which do not belong to the Andes as the Sierra Nevada de Santa Marta.
 * Insular Region: comprises the areas outside the continental territories of Colombia in the Caribbean region as the islands of San Andrés and Providencia and the islands of Gorgona and Malpelo in the Pacific Ocean.
 * Orinoquía Region: North of the eastern region of Colombia that belongs to the Orinoco River watershed, flat low-lying region. Also known colloquially as the Eastern Plains.
 * Pacific Region: It includes the coastal plains of the pacific coast and the mountainous groups which do not belong to the Andes, in particular the Serranía del Baudó.

Indigenous influences
The culture of Colombia has vibrant indigenous influences within its culture. Full Indigenous peoples of Colombia are estimated to be around 4-10% of the country’s population,  however most still hold on to indigenous traditions and folklore. Indigenous influences in Colombian culture include cuisine, music, architecture, language, folklore, clothing, etymology, and artisan crafts. The national hat of Colombia, the Sombrero Vueltiao, comes from the Zenú, and has been worn since pre-hispanic times. Food like the Arepa has been consumed in Colombia for around 3,000 years, and were made by the many indigenous peoples within the Colombian coast. Each Region of Colombia has their own indigenous culture that influenced the local culture, such as the Quechua in the Southwest, the Quimbaya in the Paisa Region, the Zenú and Tairona in the Caribbean, the Calima in Valle del Cauca, and the largest indigenous influence in Colombia, the Muisca in the Altiplano Cundiboyacense. Artisanship remains popular among indigenous peoples in Colombia to this day, one of the most popular being the Arhuaca mochila.

Immigrantion and foreign influences
Colombia did not receive substantial immigration after the period of Spanish rule. Some exceptions are the capital city of Bogota, the second largest city Medellín and the Atlantic port city of Barranquilla. Groups of French, Swiss, Dutch, Belgian, German, Italian, Lebanese and Syrian-Lebanese-Palestinian immigrants settled in the city and played a large role in its development. Shakira, a native of Barranquilla, is of partial Lebanese ancestry. Bogotá received some immigrants from Europe in the period following World War II; the eccentric former mayor of Bogotá and semiotics professor Antanas Mockus is the son of Lithuanian immigrants. Most Chinese in Colombia originally came from Panama, where they helped in the building of the railways of the Panama Canal, to help in building the train and road routes between the Pacific port of Buenaventura and the interior city of Cali. Today, in the surrounding area of the Cauca Valley, virtually every town has a Chinese restaurant.

A few Japanese families settled in Colombia, inspired by the bucolic description of the Cauca Valley in Jorge Isaacs' novel María. The heads-of-household of Japanese descent would be interred in prisons near Zipaquirá, during World War II.

Colombian politicians, intellectuals, and members of elite society turned to England and France for inspiration in the period, following independence from Spain. Colombian's civil code (adopted in 1887) is based on the Napoleonic Code. French architect Gastón Lelarge (1861–1934) designed many of the public edifices in Bogotá, as well as the cupola of the church of Saint Peter Claver in Cartagena.

Starting in the 20th century, North American culture had increasing influence on the culture of Colombia. Shopping malls and tract housing in the style of North American suburbs are very popular. Hollywood films, American fashions, and English-language popular music are also popular.

Regional identities
Due to existence of geographical and climatic barriers, regions in Colombia remained isolated for much of their history, boosting strong local identities. This is attributed to the fact that Colombia was not a unified nation during the Pre-Columbian Era and different regions had different indigenous civilizations inhabiting it, such as the Quimbaya in the Paisa region, the Muisca in the Altiplano Cundiboyacense, the Zenú and the Tairona in the Caribbean, the Pubenenses in Popayán, the Incas in Nariño, and the Calima in Valle del Cauca. These strong indigenous identities in each region led to the regions developing their own distinct dialects of Spanish influenced by the indigenous languages and distinct and unique cultures.

Despite the constitution of 1886 tried to establish an unified national identity around Spanish language and Catholic faith, Panama successfully seceded from Colombia in 1903. Even today, national consciousness remains low in much of the country.

During 20th century, government encouraged migration from inner regions to Amazon basin and San Andrés island, fostering a process of colombianization (see: Colombianization of Leticia, Putumayo and Caquetá).

However, separatism is a significant political force in San Andrés and Providencia, where raizals (Protestant Afro Caribbean group) are up one-third of population.

Other groups with a strong regional identities include:
 * Paisas from Paisa region (Antioquia department and Coffee Axis), influenced by Basque and Quimbayan culture, they speak Paisa Spanish;
 * Costeños from Caribbean region, influenced by African, Tairona, and Zenú culture and related to other Spanish speaking Caribbean nations, they speak Costeño Spanish;
 * Pastusos from Southern Andean region, influenced by Inca culture and related to Ecuadorian Highlands, they speak Pastuso Spanish;
 * Chocoanos from Pacific region, influenced mostly by African and Emberá culture, they speak Chocoano Spanish;
 * Llaneros from Orinoquia region, influenced by the various indigenous groups and related to border populations from Venezuela, they speak Llanero Spanish.

Education
The educational experience of many Colombian children begins with attendance at a preschool academy until age five (Educación preescolar). Basic education (Educación básica) is compulsory by law. It has two stages: Primary basic education (Educación básica primaria) which goes from first to fifth grade – children from six to ten years old, and Secondary basic education (Educación básica secundaria), which goes from sixth to ninth grade. Basic education is followed by Middle vocational education (Educación media vocacional) that comprises the tenth and eleventh grades. It may have different vocational training modalities or specialties (academic, technical, business, and so on.) according to the curriculum adopted by each school.

After the successful completion of all the basic and middle education years, a high-school diploma is awarded. The high-school graduate is known as a bachiller, because secondary basic school and middle education are traditionally considered together as a unit called bachillerato (sixth to eleventh grade). Students in their final year of middle education take the ICFES test (now renamed Saber 11) in order to gain access to higher education (Educación superior). This higher education includes undergraduate professional studies, technical, technological and intermediate professional education, and post-graduate studies.

Bachilleres (high-school graduates) may enter into a professional undergraduate career program offered by a university; these programs last up to five years (or less for technical, technological and intermediate professional education, and post-graduate studies), even as much to six to seven years for some careers, such as medicine. In Colombia, there is not an institution such as college; students go directly into a career program at a university or any other educational institution to obtain a professional, technical or technological title. Once graduated from the university, people are granted a (professional, technical or technological) diploma and licensed (if required) to practice the career they have chosen. For some professional career programs, students are required to take the Saber-Pro test, in their final year of undergraduate academic education.

Public spending on education as a proportion of gross domestic product in 2012 was 4.4%. This represented 15.8% of total government expenditure. In 2012, the primary and secondary gross enrolment ratios stood at 106.9% and 92.8% respectively. School-life expectancy was 13.2 years. A total of 93.6% of the population aged 15 and older were recorded as literate, including 98.2% of those aged 15–24.

Family
The family is a highly important institution to Colombians as engraved by the traditional Roman Catholic church teachings. Members of the extended family are close and children rarely move far away from their parents. There is a deep sense of familial responsibility that stretches through many generations.

Traditionally, men were usually the head of the household, in charge of earning most of the family's income, while women were responsible for cooking, housework, and raising children. However, as in most cultures around the world, the dawn of the 20th century brought forth a great empowerment for women who were given a right to vote during the 1950s rule of dictator Gustavo Rojas Pinilla. The Constitution of 1991 gave a wider opportunity for women, and today, the majority of families (regardless of economic class) have two working parents due to the need of an income to sustain a family.

At a child's baptism, the parents of the child will choose godparents, padrinos. A child's padrinos will play an important role in their life, giving advice.

Political attitudes
The Politics of Colombia take place in a framework of a presidential representative democratic republic, whereby the President of Colombia is both head of state and head of government, and of a multi-party system. Executive power is exercised by the government. Legislative power is vested in both the government and the two chambers of Congress, the Senate, and the House of Representatives of Colombia. The Judiciary is independent of the executive and the legislature.

Food
There is a large variety of dishes that take into account the difference in regional climates. For example: Inland, the dishes reflect the mix of cultures, inherited mainly from Amerindian and European cuisine, and the produce of the land mainly agriculture, cattle, river fishing, and other animals' raising. Such is the case of the sancocho soup in Valledupar, the arepas (a corn based bread-like patty). Local species of animals like the guartinaja, part of the wayuu Amerindian culture.
 * In the city of Medellín, the typical dish is the bandeja paisa. It includes beans, rice, ground meat or carne asada, chorizo, fried egg, arepa, and chicharrón. It is usually accompanied by avocado, tomato, and special sauces.
 * In the city of Cali, the most traditional dish is "sancocho de gallina" - a soup composed mostly of chicken, plantain, corn, coriander, yuca root, and other seasonings.
 * In Bogotá and the Andean region, ajiaco is the traditional dish. It is also a type of soup made of chicken, potatoes, and flavoured with a locally grown herb called "guasca". Traditionally, cream and capers are added just before eating. Both soups are served with white rice, salads with a hint of lemon, avocado, or plantain chips, sweet or salty. For breakfast people often eat changua, a milk, scallion, and egg soup.
 * In the Caribbean coast, seafood is popular, including fish and lobster. Coconut rice is a common dish along the coastal cities, as are patacones, or fried plantain patties.
 * In the Llanos, meat from the barbecue, such as the "ternera llanera" is common, and also typical river fishes like the "amarillo".
 * In the Amazonas, the cuisine is influenced by Brazilian and Peruvian traditions.
 * In the Tolima region, the Tamales Tolimenses are a delicacy. These tamales are made of a corn dough and feature peas, carrots, potatoes, rice, chicken, pork, and various spices. They are wrapped in plantain leaves and boiled for three to four hours. It also typical to have Pandebono for breakfast, with hot chocolate.
 * On the Islands of San Andres, Providencia, and Santa Catalina, the main dish is rondon, a seafood dish made of coconut milk, fish, conch, cassava root (yuca), sweet potato, white yams, and pumpkin seasoned with chili peppers and herbs. They also have a crab soup which is considered a delicacy. It is made with the same ingredients as rondon, without the fish.
 * Ají picante, a spicy, cilantro-based sauce, is used as a condiment for many dishes and sides, including empanadas, patacones, and soups. This traditional sauce is from the city of Antioquia.

Folklore
Colombia has many traditional folk tales and stories about legendary creatures, which are transmitted orally and kept for next generations to come. Some of them are common with other Latin American countries. The Colombian folklore has strong influences from Spanish culture, with elements of Native American and African cultures.

Painting

Colombians have been producing art for thousands of years. Ornate golden figures, and jewelry from millennia ago have been discovered by both ruthless conquistadors and careful archaeological digs.

In the colonial time, the painting was characterized by the works of the three Figueroa, pioneers of this art: Baltasar de Figueroa, the old; Gaspar the Figueroa, his son and Baltazar de Figueroa, the young. Gaspar was the teacher of important artists, lie Gregorio Vásquez de Arce y Ceballos. José María Espinoza Prieto, painter and engraver, also is important for his portraits, landscapes and caricatures. Epifanio Garay is highlighted, especially by his portraits.

After the war of independence, in 1819, the Colombian art still was dependent of the figurative. Some people explain that delay in the evolution of the Colombian artistic style is due to the geography of the country, that make difficult a contact and dialogue between the different creative tendencies

In the decades between 1920 and 1940, Marco Tobón Mejía, José Horacio Betancur, Pedro Nel Gómez, Ignacio Gómez Jaramillo, Santiago Martínez Delgado, and Alipio Jaramillo created some dynamics in the elaboration of murals. They were influenced by the Mexican art, although with neoclassic and Art Nouveau characteristics. At the beginning of the 1940 decade, are created works that was new in Colombia, inspired in the post-impressionism and the academic French style.

Many historians of art believe that the Colombian art only began to have a distinctive character in the second half of the 20th century, with a new point of view, integrating the cultural and artistic traditional elements, with the concepts of the art in the 20th century. Ignacio Gómez Jaramillo, for example, combine the new techniques with cultural elements, in his Portrait to the Greiff Brothers. Pedro Nel Gómez, highlighted in the drawing, the water color, the fresco, the oil painting, and the sculpture in wood, stone, and bronze, shows, for example in "Autorretrato con sombrero" (1941), his familiarity with the works of Gauguin and Van Gogh. In other works, he reveal the influence of Cézanne. Alejandro Obregon, considered by many as the father of the Colombian art (most by his originality), has been acclaimed by critics and the public, because of his painting of national landscapes characterized by violent strokes and the symbolic and expressionist use of animals (specially birds, like the condor). His work is influenced by Picasso and Graham Sutherland.

In last years, some Colombian artists, such as Fernando Botero, Enrique Grau, David Manzur, Luis Caballero, Santiago Martinez Delgado, Ignacio Gomez Jaramillo, Débora Arango, Kajuma and have received international fame, awards and wide public acclaim.

Religion
Studies suggest that about 70.9% of Colombians are Roman Catholic. However, Colombians are notable for their acceptance of other creeds and faith.

The National Administrative Department of Statistics (DANE) does not collect religious statistics, and accurate reports are difficult to obtain. However, based on various studies and a survey, about 90% of the population adheres to Christianity, the majority of which (70.9%) are Roman Catholic, while a significant minority (16.7%) adhere to Protestantism (primarily Evangelicalism). Some 4.7% of the population is atheist or agnostic, while 3.5% claim to believe in God but do not follow a specific religion. 1.8% of Colombians adhere to Jehovah's Witnesses and Adventism and less than 1% adhere to other religions, such as Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Mormonism, Hinduism, Indigenous religions, Hare Krishna movement, Rastafari movement, Eastern Orthodox Church, and spiritual studies. The remaining people either did not respond or replied that they did not know. In addition to the above statistics, 35.9% of Colombians reported that they did not practice their faith actively.

While Colombia remains a mostly Roman Catholic country by baptism numbers, the 1991 Colombian constitution guarantees freedom of religion and all religious faiths and churches are equally free before the law.

Literature
Gabriel García Márquez, winner of the Nobel Prize for Literature in 1982, is from Aracataca, Colombia. His novel One Hundred Years of Solitude is recognized as a landmark of the literary movement known as "magical realism (realismo mágico)".

Other important writers are Álvaro Mutis, winner of the Cervantes Prize, Jorge Isaacs, who wrote "María", Gonzalo Arango, founder of the Nadaismo movement, Fernando Vallejo, winner of the Rómulo Gallegos prize, José Asunción Silva, precursor of Latin American romanticism, Raúl Gómez Jattin, Efraím Medina, Andrés Caicedo, the poets Piedad Bonnet and María Mercedes Carranza, Aurelio Arturo, the novelist Germán Espinosa, Augusto Pinilla, and Rafael Chaparro Madiedo. The most important literary magazines are El Malpensante, Arcadia, Número, La Movida Literaria, Universidad de Antioquia, and Puesto de Combate.

Colombian theatre

 * Cali Festival Theater
 * Cali Performance Festival
 * Carnavalada - Theater to the Streets - Open Air Theater Festival of Barranquilla
 * Colombian Theater Festival of Medellin - Medellin en Escena
 * Festival de teatro Gitanos en Macondo - first week of September in Aracataca, Madalena.
 * Iberoamerican Theater Festival of Bogota
 * International Theater Festival and Storytellers Encounter of Popayan
 * International Theater Festival of Barrancabermeja - Theater for the Peace
 * International Theater Festival of Manizales

Film and television

The interest for the film production came late to Colombia. Vicenzo and Francesco Di Doménico, of Italian origin, were the pioneers in the films production. In 1912, it is inaugurated the first movie theater in Colombia: the Salón Olympia, with a capacity of three thousand people. The most outstanding directors of the film production are Sergio Cabrera, Felipe Aljure, Luis Ospina, Víctor Gaviria, and Carlos Mayolo. Between the most recent proposals, we find to Andy Baíz and Juan Felipe Orozco, director of "Al final del espectro". The work of Dago García and Rodrigo Triana is in a commercial line.

Sports

Soccer, or, Association Football (Spanish: fútbol) is the most popular sport in Colombia. Soccer games are popular social events in Colombia. Baseball has become popular in recent years; it is especially popular along the coast, and is strongly promoted all around the country. Édgar Rentería is an example of a famous Colombian baseball player, but football is still the main sport in the country. Boxing and martial arts are also very popular amongst the male population, and all of these are practiced avidly by the youth.

An ancient game called Tejo, inherited from the Muisca, is also played. The object of tejo is to throw a small metal disk at a gunpowder detonator in a small circular area. The winner is calculated by the number of explosions compared to number of throws.

Comedy
Colombian comedy's original birthplace is the radio, since this was the first original mass media with wide coverage of the national territory rendering radio a very important medium for the promotion of comedy. A distinctive representative of Colombian comedy on the radio and who was praised by generations, even before television became popular was Colombian comedian Gullermo Zuluaga, better known by his stage name Montecristo. Since then, many other comedians and storytellers have shaped Colombian's concept of what is humorous in many cases at the expense of the tragedies of war, economic distress, and misbehaved politicians.

Music
Modern Colombian music is a mixture of Native Indigenous, European, and African influences, as well as more modern American, Puerto Rico and other Caribbean music forms, such as Trinidadian, Cuban, and Jamaican. The music varies greatly between regions but cumbia is widely accepted as the national musical genre.

Cumbia is a mixture of Spanish, Native Indigenous, and African music, the latter brought by slaves. The style of dance is designed to recall the shackles worn around the ankles of the slaves. In the 19th century, slavery was abolished and Africans, Indians, and other ethnic groups mixed more fully. Styles like bambuco, vallenato, and porro were especially influential. When the waltz became popular in the 19th century, a Colombian version called pasillo was invented. International Latin, a type of pop, ballad, and salsa music are best-represented by Charlie Zaa and Joe Arroyo, respectively.

Music and dancing are very popular in Colombia, with dozens of popular vibrant styles. The most popular local musical styles are Vallenato, salsa, Merengue, Cumbia and Bambuco. The latter is a very complicated dance with many differently named steps.

Colombian rock developed after an influence of Rock en español generating fusion of Rock Music with traditional Colombian music and other musical styles.

The musical genre of Colombian pop music has been growing recently with artists like Fonseca, San Alejo, Lucas Arnau or Mauricio y Palo de Agua. Pop with strong traces of traditional Colombian music is also currently rising. Los De Adentro and Maía represent this trend. Many Colombian artists are recognized internationally including among others, Shakira, who is the most recognized Colombian artist in the world.

title: Culture of Colombia


text:
Joseph Bertrand

Joseph Louis François Bertrand (11 March 1822 – 5 April 1900) was a French mathematician whose work emphasized number theory, differential geometry, probability theory, economics and thermodynamics.

Biography
Joseph Bertrand was the son of physician Alexandre Jacques François Bertrand and the brother of archaeologist Alexandre Bertrand. His father died when Joseph was only nine years old; by that time he had learned a substantial amount of mathematics and could speak Latin fluently. At eleven years old he attended the course of the École Polytechnique as an auditor. From age eleven to seventeen, he obtained two bachelor's degrees, a license and a PhD with a thesis concerning the mathematical theory of electricity, and was admitted to the 1839 entrance examination of the École Polytechnique. Bertrand was a professor at the École Polytechnique and Collège de France, and was a member of the Paris Academy of Sciences of which he was the permanent secretary for twenty-six years.

He conjectured, in 1845, that there is at least one prime number between n and 2n − 2 for every n > 3. Chebyshev proved this conjecture, now termed Bertrand's postulate, in 1850. He was also famous for two paradoxes of probability, known now as Bertrand's Paradox and the Paradox of Bertrand's box. There is another paradox concerning game theory that is named for him, known as the Bertrand Paradox. In 1849, he was the first to define real numbers using what is now termed a Dedekind cut.

Bertrand translated into French Carl Friedrich Gauss's work concerning the theory of errors and the method of least squares.

Concerning economics, he reviewed the work on oligopoly theory, specifically the Cournot Competition Model (1838) of French mathematician Antoine Augustin Cournot. His Bertrand Competition Model (1883) argued that Cournot had reached a very misleading conclusion, and he reworked it using prices rather than quantities as the strategic variables, thus showing that the equilibrium price was simply the competitive price.

His book Thermodynamique states in Chapter XII, that thermodynamic entropy and temperature are only defined for reversible processes. He was one of the first people to state this publicly.

In 1858 he was elected a foreign member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences.

Works by Bertrand

 * Traité de calcul différentiel et de calcul intégral (Paris : Gauthier-Villars, 1864–1870) (2 volumes treatise on calculus)
 * Rapport sur les progrès les plus récents de l'analyse mathématique (Paris: Imprimerie Impériale, 1867) (report on recent progress in mathematical analysis)
 * Traité d'arithmétique (L. Hachette, 1849) (arithmetics)
 * Thermodynamique (Paris : Gauthier-Villars, 1887)
 * Méthode des moindres carrés (Mallet-Bachelier, 1855) (translation of Gauss's work on least squares)
 * Leçons sur la théorie mathématique de l'électricité / professées au Collège de France (Paris : Gauthier-Villars et fils, 1890)
 * Calcul des probabilités (Paris : Gauthier-Villars et fils, 1889)
 * Arago et sa vie scientifique (Paris : J. Hetzel, 1865) (biography of Arago)
 * Blaise Pascal (Paris : C. Lévy, 1891) (biography)
 * Les fondateurs de l'astronomie moderne: Copernic, Tycho Brahé, Képler, Galilée, Newton (Paris: J. Hetzel, 1865) (biographies)

title: Joseph Bertrand


text: User talk:212.219.195.8

title: User talk:212.219.195.8


text:
Talk:Indri

Disambiguation
There should be a disambiguation for this page. Indri can also mean other things. Dan Carkner 18:57, 4 November 2006 (UTC) -My friend told me there is also a city in India called Indri? thx,Dan Carkner 19:02, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Indri people

 * Thanks. I've started the disambiguation page. - UtherSRG (talk) 19:26, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Largest lemur
A note to 174.89.125.3 and anyone else who thinks about changing the sentence in the lead about the Indri being "one of the largest living lemurs": The first sentence under "Physical characteristics" states "Along with the Diademed Sifaka, the Indri is the largest lemur still in existence." This and the measurements together are a referenced statements. Please do not make the claim that the Indri is the largest living lemur if it shares the title with the Diademed Sifaka. –  VisionHolder  «  talk  »  00:59, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

Subspecies and synonyms
So, if there are no recognized subspecies, should variegatus be listed as a synonym? The taxobox should be changed to show the synonyms are Species level, not subspecies level. - UtherSRG (talk) 19:26, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Honestly, I'm not sure how to show variegatus in the taxobox. The subspecies was just a color morph.  Hmmm.... Do you know of any similar examples within Primates? –   VisionHolder  « talk »  01:26, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, it was described legitimately, yes? Then relegated to "morph" status which makes it a junior synonym, yes? Hrm.... Lemme email Groves again. LOL! - UtherSRG (talk) 01:46, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
 * No need, I fixed the synonym list. It's a legitimate name, so it should be listed there. Ucucha 12:07, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

Size... it matters
Some recent changes to both this article and the ruffed lemur articles try to get away from referring to these species as the "largest", and instead use terms like "longest" and "heaviest". Although these are correct, the sources cited specifically use the term "largest" in their comparision. In the literature, every book that I've seen on mammals uses weight as the scale of comparison. For example, when comparing African herbivores, sources usually agree that the elephant is the largest (3.6 m at the shoulder, and 5,400 kg in weight), even compared to the giraffe (5.2 m head to foot, and 830 kg in weight). Anyway, I've never seen a source compare lemur "length" outside of a genus or species. We really should go by the sources and their comparisons.

Also, one addition was made about the range of Indri sizes ("weights"), which was incorrect. At the time, the article claimed that the Indri weighs up to 13 kg. Subfossil specimens aside, the information was incorrect, and I updated it from the cited source. The editor, in good faith, appended "though most adults only weigh around half" while citing a valid source. I have fixed this. I apologize for any confusion. Though I am working to rewrite all 100+ lemur articles (slowly but surely), I have not fixed all of them up. Nor I have had time to proofread and correct factual errors in everything that currently exists. All Indriidae articles are high on my priority list due to their relatively completeness. Some are fairly well written and won't require as much work. Others are length and possibly full of errors... sometimes due to vandalism. If there are any questions regarding numbers, sources, or anything on a lemur article, feel free to drop a note on the article's discussion page or on my personal talk page. –  VisionHolder  «  talk  »  22:42, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Two specification (just to be sure "uninvolved" don't misunderstand): Calling both this and the ruffed lemurs the largest was not a recent change, but a contradiction that has been there for a long time (added in 2008 for ruffed lemur, 2008 for B&W Ruffed Lemur and 2006 for Indri). I simply removed the contradiction by specifying exactly what was meant. As that was reverted resulting in the reinstatement of the contradiction, I have added the contradiction templates, though I still think a much simpler solution was to make the small specification I suggested. Alternatively, the largest claim could be removed entirely from the ruffed lemur articles. Both because of the valid comment in the above (the comparison of length example), but also because the measurements for the length of the ruffed lemurs are overlapped by several species of sifakas, though the max. still is for the ruffed lemurs (of course the same could be said about weight of Indri+Diademed Sifaka, where measurements also overlapped by other sifakas). However, length is sometimes used for size comparison in animals, as a fast check of the sources used in the articles also reveal. Ruffed lemurs are called "largest" in Garbutt (2007), the current reference used for size in Black-and-white Ruffed Lemur, and he provides specific measurements in length and weight for all (then recognized) lemur taxa. A simple comparison reveals that length is what must have been used, as it is far surpassed in weight by several other taxa. Consequently, not only was the change to longest correct (as noted in your comment), the reference also supports it. The exact same can be said about the change to weight. Secondly, just to be sure there are no misunderstandings, I did not make an incorrect addition to weight. A fast check reveals the mistaken claim (13 kg) has been there since 2002 (!); I simply noted that around half that weight is typical. Anyhow, I'll leave the solution of the largest issue to others, but it is clear that the contradition must be dealt with. If both are maintained as "largest", at the very least a specification would be needed. 212.10.95.14 (talk) 10:04, 28 May 2010 (UTC)
 * I have to get ready for a 16-hour day at work, so I only have time for a very brief response. Except for the ridiculous mistake I made in 2008 on the Black-and-white Ruffed Lemur page, there is no contradiction.  The Indri article reads: "...the Indri is the largest lemur still in existence."  The ruffed lemur reads: "[Ruffed lemurs] are the largest extant lemurs within the family Lemuridae."  Lemurs (generally) are classified under the infraorder Lemuriformes, and contain multiple families.  Ruffed lemurs are in the family Lemuridae, in which they are the largest.  The Indri is in the family Indriidae.  It, too, is the largest in its family, but it (along with the Diademed Sifaka) is also the largest among all lemurs, regardless of family.
 * Again, I value your help. I'm sorry I reverted you using WP:TW, but I didn't think it would matter since I used the option for AGF.  It saves a few button clicks, and I had a lot to do last night in a limited amount of time.  Please keep reviewing the lemur articles and helping find errors, contradictions, and other faults.  Best, –   VisionHolder  «  talk  »  11:56, 28 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Managed to miss Lemuridae versus Lemuriformes [Lemuroidea] somehow! Contradict templates removed. 212.10.95.14 (talk) 14:52, 30 May 2010 (UTC)
 * No problem. I've made more than my fair share of similar oversights.  Thanks for removing the contradiction template.  I intentionally left them up for you to revert to ensure that you were content with my explanation.  Again, keep up the good review work. –   VisionHolder  «  talk  »  16:18, 30 May 2010 (UTC)

Etymology of name
Please note that the guy whose word you're basing the "probably incorrect" judgement of the name's origin being from "indry izy" also claims that the indri is found all over the island, is easily tamed, and is used for hunting like a dog - all of which are incorrect. So his pronouncement on the word may also be wrong. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ridger11 (talk • contribs) 12:20, 23 April 2012 (UTC)
 * There was a lot of incorrect information recorded about various lemurs in the time of Sonnerat. The "Etymology" section is largely correct, and it's appropriate to mention the common myth about its etymology for historical purposes.  The section may be updated soon with the release of the upcoming edition of Lemur News, in which will be an article dedicated to the etymology of lemur names. –  Maky  « talk » 19:38, 23 April 2012 (UTC)
 * It's interesting that this etymology myth persists in David's Attenborough's Memoirs of a Broadcaster in the Lions and Madagascar chapter (released in 2000s too). Yathin S Krishnappa (talk) 16:12, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
 * As I said, myths about lemur etymologies abound and can even be found printed on signage in zoos. Because these myths are so widely printed and shared, it's hard to kill them off.  Once a book or zoo sign is printed, they can influence and confuse people for years or decades... depending on how much research people do.  Although I love Attenborough's work, and I feel that he generally does top-notch research for his documentaries, when it comes to primates, he often drops the ball.  The best (or worst?) example is Uncovering Our Earliest Ancestor: The Link, which talks about Darwinius in language that clearly demonstrates a one-sided and dated view of fossil primates and early primate evolution.  Anyway, if I weren't preparing to move tomorrow, I would make the whatever fixes are needed tonight.  Hopefully I'll have time soon.  At least the etymology of lemur is finally correct. –  Maky  « talk » 22:12, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Audio recording
Requesting audio of its vocalizations, also maybe a photo of it making a call. Richard001 (talk) 04:45, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

http://macaulaylibrary.org/audio/97903/indri-indri-indri-madagascar-mark-barsamian

Here is a link to audio of it's calling, don't know how to add it would somebody please? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.79.124.177 (talk) 07:08, 4 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I've added a recording of their duet, though from a free source. Sorry this took so long. –  Maky  « talk » 02:18, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Indri. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070701230930/http://www.websters-online-dictionary.org/definition/Malagasy-english/ to http://www.websters-online-dictionary.org/definition/Malagasy-english/

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 15:24, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Etymology section confusion
Hi,

The article says the name comes from Malagasy endrina, but then says that the Malagasy word for it is babakoto.

Of course there could be two words for the animal in that language, but I think that if this is the case it would be clearer to explicitly say so. The sources cited are not readily available for me to check. IAmNitpicking (talk) 14:13, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

"Indri Animal" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Indri Animal. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Elmidae (talk · contribs) 19:32, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

Cuvier vs Geoffroy & Cuvier as an author
I just want to future-proof my last edit, and I didn't want to put a long-winded explanation in the "short summary". Many online sources prior to Wilson & Reeder cite only Etienne Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire as the author, but after their work it has been cited more as Geoffroy & Cuvier. I found a source that I think Cuvier himself authored, or at least was involved in alongside Schinz. In it he lists Geoffroy as the sole author of the genus Indri. Other works from the time also mention Geoffroy as the sole author. I don't know how involved Cuvier was in the German text, but he seemed involved in some way as he is in the title of the work and listed as an author by biodiversitylibrary and Google Books. Also, further adding to at least my confusion is that Wilson & Reeder cite Galago and Loris, described in the same article as Indri, as Geoffroy alone. In case the reference ends up missing the title is: Das Thierreich, eingetheilt nach dem Bau der Thiere als Grundlage ihrer Naturgeschichte und der vergleichenden Anatomie von den Herrn Ritter von Cuvier. Sorry if this isn't the right place to say this, and sorry if I end up incorrect. Tylbrooks1998 (talk) 08:23, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Indri


text:
User:Xor~enwiki

I am Noone.

title: User:Xor~enwiki