text:
Talk:Lelang Commandery

The location of lelang commandery
Based on chinese history books, it was located at west manchuria. So, the location of lelang commandery should be modified. See below for reference 集解張晏曰：「朝鮮有濕水、洌水、汕水，三水合為洌水，疑樂浪、朝鮮取名於此也. 」索隱案：朝音潮，直驕反.

高驪平壤城本漢樂浪郡王險城，即古朝鮮地，時朝鮮王滿據之也.

括地志云：「高驪都平壤城，本漢樂浪郡王險城，又古云朝鮮地也. 」

集解徐廣曰：「昌黎有險瀆縣也. 」 索隱韋昭云「古邑名」. 徐廣曰「昌黎有險瀆縣」. 應劭注「地理志遼東險瀆縣，朝鮮王舊都」. 臣瓚云「王險城在樂浪郡浿水之東」也. --Hairwizard91 16:47, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

 * The above is original research by User:Hairwizard91, which directly contradicts Encyclopedia Britannica's article on Nangnang. According to Britannica, Lelang Commandery (Nangnang) "occupied the northwestern portion of the Korean peninsula and had its capital at P'yongyang".--Endroit 09:05, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
 * This is not original research. It is already published as books., .      --Hairwizard91 03:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

this talk page is for discussion on improving the article, not a platform for korean nationalism as hairwizard is using it for. i just thought i wanted to make that clear here because alot of china related articles are being messed up by korean nationalists trying to remove material and distort history.ㄏㄨㄤㄉㄧ (talk) 21:04, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Alternate names for "Lelang"
According to the following entry from Merriam-Webster Unabridged Collegiate Encyclopedia, Lelang and Lo-lang are variant names for Nangnang:
 * Main Entry: Nangnang
 * Variant(s): or Lelang or Lo-lang
 * Colony of Han-dynasty China in N Korea, near modern-day Pyongyang, from which the Chinese incorporated S Korea and parts of Japan into their sphere of influence. The Chinese maintained a commandery there for 400 years. Its presence introduced the local people to wet-rice cultivation, iron technology, and high-fired ceramic technology.
 * Collegiate Encyclopedia copyright © 2006 by Merriam-Webster, Incorporated

--Endroit 07:09, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

 * They're all the same name, just different pronunciations and romanizations thereof. Nangnang is the SK pronunciation; if I'm not mistaken, Nakrang is the standard NK pronunciation.  Lelang and Lolang, of course, are differing romanizations of the standard Mandarin Chinese pronunciation. Would not oppose a move to Nangnang, although it's striking that there has never been any interest in such a move...  If I'm not mistaken, this is only at the Chinese name because User:Nanshu happened to create it.  -- Visviva 09:08, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

 * Sure, should we move it to "Nangnang Commandery" or just "Nangnang"? Either way, I think we should merge/redirect State of Nangnang into this article as well.--Endroit 09:19, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

 * Assuming that a merge is in the offing, I think "Nangnang" would be best, per WP:NPOV and also Naming conventions (unambiguous and easier to link). -- Visviva 10:04, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

 * OK, I will agree with that merge. And "Lelang Commandery" could still be mentioned as an alternate name in the first paragraph.--Endroit 18:50, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Secondary source for the location of lelang
The location of lelang was Liaodong and Liaoning. See the references,. --Hairwizard91 04:01, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Sources in English

 * Columbia Chronologies of Asian History and Culture, By John Stewart Bowman 2000 Columbia University Press, ISBN 0231110049

 * State Formation in Korea: historical and archaeological perspectives, By Gina Lee Barnes 2001 Routledge, ISBN 0700713239
 * map showing the location (Gina Lee Barnes)

 * "Nangnang" Encyclopædia Britannica

 * The History of Korea, By Djun Kil Kim, Chun-gil Kim 2005 Greenwood Press, ISBN 0313332967

 * For historical reference, the first group of references (in Korean) were added by User:Hairwizard91, and presumably support the Liaoning hypothesis; the second group (in English) were added by User:Endroit, and support the Pyongyang hypothesis. -- Visviva 16:34, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

 * For my part, I think this article should mention that the location of Lelang/Nangnang is not known with certainty, and that some sources believe it was not located on the Korean Peninsula at all -- but also that the consensus of historians supports the Pyongyang hypothesis. -- Visviva 16:34, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

 * Thanks for clarifying, Visviva (I forgot to sign). The links in English above show the consensus view outside of Korea.  We should definitely mention that North Korea opposes this consensus view, as Gina Lee Barnes suggests (in her link above).  I am curious to see if there are any sources in English elaborating, and even supporting, any alternate view.  If there aren't any sources in English, it probably proves that the alternate views are in the minority.--Endroit 16:58, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

The english book to view that Nangnang state and Lelang commandery. About the location of lelang commandery in Liaoning.
 * Lee Hyun Hee, Park Sung Soo and Yoon Nae Hyun, New History of Korea (2005). ISBN : 89-88095-85-5
 * Yong ho Choe Reinterpreting traditional history in north korea. The Journal of Asian Studies, Vol 40(3), 503 - 523 --Hairwizard91 19:01, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

hohoho, funny how your references are in korean, which would make them clearly biased in korean POV, but the references supporting the chinese side are in ENGLISH, which wouldnt make them chinese, so for all purposes what hairwizard is pulling up here is nonsense.ㄏㄨㄤㄉㄧ (talk) 21:06, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

korean trolling
several koreans have removed the chinese names os people mentioned in the article, this vandalism needs to stop.ㄏㄨㄤㄉㄧ (talk) 02:30, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

chinese disruptive trolling
Some disruptive chinese editor named has removed the Korean category and tried to insert redundant links to the article, this vandalism needs to stop.--Caspian blue (talk) 02:49, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, mocking the above editor won't help your cause though (as you did here and in your edit summary when you edited the article). If the editor in question is really a nationalist, you wouldn't want to mock him or her! 122.105.150.242 (talk) 04:54, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

wow this korean caspainblue thinks hes above the rules here, first of all, the chinese names were here FIRST, until historapher changed them, and second when i added them back, i had been nice enough to keep the korean names... keep going on like this and i will ensure the korean names will be GONEㄏㄨㄤㄉㄧ (talk) 17:02, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

i didnt delete the korean category intentionally... i was reverting your unconstructive vandalism....ㄏㄨㄤㄉㄧ (talk) 17:03, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You did, so I reverted your vandalism. Stop such disruptive behaviors.--Caspian blue (talk) 17:08, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

wow you think your the boss, huh? the chinese names were here first, until histographer changed them, but you decide to come along and delete them....ㄏㄨㄤㄉㄧ (talk) 17:14, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Hut, look whose talking? you're very arrogant for everything from the start. Do not falsely accuse somebody who disagree with your nationalistic POV of being a vandal. That does not help you for anything.--Caspian blue (talk) 17:21, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

This conversation shouldn't even be happening. It's a simple solution: keep both the Chinese and Korean names. That's it. It's not rocket science, people.-- Pericles of Athens  Talk 17:55, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

wow caspian look whos talking, YOU were the one who removed the chinese names beforeNefbmn (talk) 00:31, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Please stop fighting!
Can the two above editors accept that quite often, an event or place can be part of the history of more than one country please? Or have I missed something here? 122.105.150.242 (talk) 04:54, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

nice sockpuppet david.Nefbmn (talk) 00:32, 3 October 2008 (UTC) one ref map from textbook. Evawen (talk) 20:20, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Lelang location, once and for all
Lelang location has never been in controversy. The academia has globally confirmed it to be in the northern Korea peninsula with sufficient written records and archeleogical evidence. The Korean nationalists keep moving Lelang outside Korea peninsula which has been considered as a sad joke by western scholars. Several supporting evidence are listed below; as a reminder, the ref book "Korea, Old and New" is reviewed by academia to be "most reliable and useful" on Korean history study.

1. the book "Korea, Old and New":

pp 13: The territorial extent of the Four Chinese Commanderies seems to have been limited to the area north of the Han River.

pp 14: As its administrative center, the Chinese built what was inessence a Chinese city where the governor, officials, merchants, and Chinese colonists lived. Their way of life in general can be surmised from the investigation of remains unearthed at T'osong-ni, the site of the Lelang administrative center near modern P'yongyang. The variety of burial objects found in their wooden and brickwork tombs attests to the lavish life syle of these Chinese officials, merchants, and colonial overloads in Lelang's capital. ... The Chinese administration had considerable impact on the life of the native population and ultimatedly the very fabric of Gojoseon society became eroded.

pp 16: map of "Korea in the confederated Kingdoms period (ca. 1st-3rd centuries A.D)"

2. http://www.shsu.edu/~his_ncp/Korea.html

Han Chinese built four commanderies, or local military units, to rule the peninsula as far south as the Han River, with a core area at Lolang (Nangnang in Korean), near present-day P'yongyang. It is illustrative of the relentlessly different historiography practiced in North Korea and South Korea, as well as the projection backward of Korean nationalism practiced by both sides, that North Korean historians deny that the Lolang Commandery was centered in Korea. They place it northwest of the peninsula, possibly near Beijing, in order to de-emphasize China's influence on ancient Korean history.

3. the book "A history of Korea, from Antiquity to the present":

pp 18: For the next four centuries a northwestern part of the Korean peninsula was directly incorporated in to the Chinese Empire.... The Taedong River basin, the area where the modern city of P'yongyang is located, became the center of the Lelang commandery.

pp 19: The way of life maintained by the elite at the capital in the P'yongyang area, which is known from the tombs and scattered archaeological remains, evinces a prosperous, refined, and very Chinese culture. --EJcarter (talk) 08:31, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

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What scholars say about Lelang Commandery

 * "Lelang Commandery was crucial to understanding the early history of Korea, which lasted from 108 BCE to 313 CE around the P'yongyang area. However, because of its nature as a Han colony and the exceptional attention paid to it by Japanese colonial scholars for making claims of the innate heteronomy of Koreans, post 1945 Korean scholars intentionally avoided the issue of Lelang."
 * "Lelang Commandery was crucial to understanding the early history of Korea, which lasted from 108 BCE to 313 CE around the P'yongyang area. However, because of its nature as a Han colony and the exceptional attention paid to it by Japanese colonial scholars for making claims of the innate heteronomy of Koreans, post 1945 Korean scholars intentionally avoided the issue of Lelang."

 * "After a period of decline, Old Choson falls to Wiman, an exile from the Yan state in northern China. Wiman proves to be a strong ruler, but his ambitious program of expansion eventually brings him into conflict with the Han dynasty of China. The Han defeats Wiman Choson and establishes a protectorate over northern Korea in 108 b.c. Resistance to Chinese hegemony, however, is strong, and China reduces the territory under its active control to Nang-nang colony with an administrative center near modern Pyongyang."
 * "After a period of decline, Old Choson falls to Wiman, an exile from the Yan state in northern China. Wiman proves to be a strong ruler, but his ambitious program of expansion eventually brings him into conflict with the Han dynasty of China. The Han defeats Wiman Choson and establishes a protectorate over northern Korea in 108 b.c. Resistance to Chinese hegemony, however, is strong, and China reduces the territory under its active control to Nang-nang colony with an administrative center near modern Pyongyang."

 * "Chinese civilization had started to flow into the Korean Peninsula through Nang-nang. This was the only time in Korean history that China could establish its colonies in the central part of Korea, where occupation forces were stationed. The Han Empire not only occupied Korea, but expanded westward to Persia and Afghanistan."
 * "Chinese civilization had started to flow into the Korean Peninsula through Nang-nang. This was the only time in Korean history that China could establish its colonies in the central part of Korea, where occupation forces were stationed. The Han Empire not only occupied Korea, but expanded westward to Persia and Afghanistan."

 * "In the corridor between the peninsula and northeast China, the Chinese Han dynasty established four “commanderies” that ruled over parts of the peninsula and Manchuria, much as modern imperial powers governed their colonies ."
 * "In the corridor between the peninsula and northeast China, the Chinese Han dynasty established four “commanderies” that ruled over parts of the peninsula and Manchuria, much as modern imperial powers governed their colonies ."

 * "As its administrative center, the Chinese built what was inessence a Chinese city where the governor, officials, merchants, and Chinese colonists lived. Their way of life in general can be surmised from the investigation of remains unearthed at T'osong-ni, the site of the Lelang administrative center near modern P'yongyang. The variety of burial objects found in their wooden and brickwork tombs attests to the lavish life syle of these Chinese officials, merchants, and colonial overloads in Lelang's capital. ... The Chinese administration had considerable impact on the life of the native population and ultimatedly the very fabric of Gojoseon society became eroded."
 * "As its administrative center, the Chinese built what was inessence a Chinese city where the governor, officials, merchants, and Chinese colonists lived. Their way of life in general can be surmised from the investigation of remains unearthed at T'osong-ni, the site of the Lelang administrative center near modern P'yongyang. The variety of burial objects found in their wooden and brickwork tombs attests to the lavish life syle of these Chinese officials, merchants, and colonial overloads in Lelang's capital. ... The Chinese administration had considerable impact on the life of the native population and ultimatedly the very fabric of Gojoseon society became eroded."

 * The sources look reliable, except the first one which has an invalid Google books url and ISBN (which I just removed from the article). The key is that you need to write coherently, avoid repeating the same points to push a point of view, and stop edit warring. -Zanhe (talk) 22:50, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

 * see

 * "Lelang Commandery was crucial to understanding the early history of Korea, which lasted from 108 BCE to 313 CE around the P'yongyang area. However, because of its nature as a Han colony and the exceptional attention paid to it by Japanese colonial scholars for making claims of the innate heteronomy of Koreans, post 1945 Korean scholars intentionally avoided the issue of Lelang."--133.137.209.160 (talk) 19:16, 9 February 2019 (UTC)
 * "Lelang Commandery was crucial to understanding the early history of Korea, which lasted from 108 BCE to 313 CE around the P'yongyang area. However, because of its nature as a Han colony and the exceptional attention paid to it by Japanese colonial scholars for making claims of the innate heteronomy of Koreans, post 1945 Korean scholars intentionally avoided the issue of Lelang."--133.137.209.160 (talk) 19:16, 9 February 2019 (UTC)

Debate over the location of Lelang started as early as 500AD by Chinese historians
The Pei river in the original <> by Chinese historian Sang Qin(300 AD)- 浿水出乐浪镂方县，东南过临浿县，东入于海 Translation : The Pei river flows out of Lelang luofang County, passes Linyi County in the southeast, and enters the sea in the east.

The Pei river in the revision <> by Li Daoyuan (500 AD) -若浿水东流，无渡浿之理，其地今高句丽之国治，余访番使，言城在浿水之阳. 其水西流迳故乐浪朝鲜县，即乐浪郡治，汉武帝置，而西北流. 故《地理志》曰：浿水西至增地县入海. 又汉兴，以朝鲜为远，循辽东故塞至浿水为界. 考之今古，于事差谬，盖《经》误证也. If the Pei river flows eastward, there is no reason to cross the Pei river. The river is now under the control of Goguryeo, upon interviewing the Goguryeo missionaries, it's located in the city, the water flows westward to Lelang Korea County, namely Lelang County, which was set up by Emperor Wu of the Han Dynasty, thus flows northwest. GoldenTaurus (talk) 03:31, 10 April 2022 (UTC)

 * Is there a non-primary source for this? Qiushufang (talk) 18:26, 10 April 2022 (UTC)

 * We had the discussion and came to an consensus before.
 * WP:NOR Primary source is allowed in Wikipedia
 * WP:V Citations to non-English reliable sources are allowed on the English Wikipedia. GoldenTaurus (talk) 01:48, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes but someone else removed the content citing WP:OR, so it would be good to clear it up with a non-primary souce now. Qiushufang (talk) 04:07, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
 * WP:V As with sources in English, if a dispute arises involving a citation to a non-English source, editors may request a quotation of relevant portions of the original source be provided, either in text, in a footnote, or on the article talk page Talk:Four_Commanderies_of_Han GoldenTaurus (talk) 08:36, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
 * This does not negate point 2, 3, 4 of WP:PRIMARY or WP:SYNTH and WP:OR. There is no mention of a debate in the primary source, which would make it original research as Esiymbro pointed out. Qiushufang (talk) 08:54, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

The quotations you cited are Shuijing zhu correcting a mistake in the original Shuijing on the direction of the river. Again, there was no debate in 500 AD about the location of Lelang.

Also, Shuijing zhu explicitly said that Lelang was Goguryeo's capital at the time. Similarly, Bak Jiwon's argument was that both Lelang and Goguryeo's Pyongyang was located in Liaodong, which is completely different from the modern North Korean view that Goguryeo's Pyongyang, but not Lelang, was at the same place as the modern city. You seem to be deliberately leaving this part out.

Unless you go all the way to Tangshan or Beijing there are no major eastward flowing rivers. While some online nationalists indeed claim that Lelang was around Beijing, I have not yet seen anyone crazy enough to say that Goguryeo was also centered in Beijing. Instead they just selectively ignore these texts, like you did. Esiymbro (talk) 04:59, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

 * The revision by Li daoyuan < > just so happened three hundred years after the original < > was published and the revision was merely based on Li Daoyuan’s conversation with Goguryeo missionaries, No mention of field trip or on-site investigation ever made to verify the claim. The added content doesn’t conclude whether original text or revised text is correct, it merely states the fact that ancient Chinese records are not consistent and had gone through revision. added content is not claiming Lelang was in Beijing or Goguryeo was centered in Beijing. Please refrain from ad hominem sarcasm and base your argument on facts with respect. Healthy discussion, No WP:NPOV dispute POV pushing GoldenTaurus (talk) 08:23, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

 * This is all interpretation. The "debate", the dates, and authors are not mentioned once in the primary source and this is WP:SYNTH. You are interpreting the primary source which violates point 3 of WP:PRIMARY since it's in Classical Chinese and cannot be easily verified by other users. This does require a secondary source regardless of the translated quotation provided and I had provided tags for it to be improved, which it never was. Qiushufang (talk) 08:50, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Lelang Commandery


text:
Peelite

The Peelites were a breakaway political faction of the British Conservative Party from 1846 to 1859. Initially led by Robert Peel, the former Prime Minister and Conservative Party leader in 1846, the Peelites supported free trade whilst the bulk of the Conservative Party remained protectionist. The Peelites later merged with the Whigs and Radicals to form the Liberal Party in 1859.

Overview
The Peelites were characterised by commitment to free trade and a managerial, almost technocratic, approach to government. Though they sought to maintain the principles of the Conservative Party, Peelites disagreed with the major wing of that party (the landed interest) on issues of trade, in particular the issue of whether agricultural prices should be artificially kept high by tariffs. The Peelites were often called the Liberal Conservatives in contrast to Protectionist Conservatives led by Benjamin Disraeli and Edward Smith-Stanley, 14th Earl of Derby.

Facing a serious famine in Ireland in 1845, the Peelites sought to lower food prices by repealing the Corn Laws. Peel was able to carry the repeal vote in the House of Commons, but only at the price of splitting the Conservative Party, a split which led to the fall of Peel's government in June 1846 and its replacement by a Whig government led by John Russell, 1st Earl Russell.

The leading members of the Peelite faction that developed after the 1846 split of the Conservative Party were the following:

The Peelites numbered about a third of the old Conservative party in the House of Commons following the 1847 general election. Their main political positions at that time were closer to the Protectionist Conservatives than to the Whigs and Radicals in parliament, except on the issue of free trade. The split had been so bitter on a personal level, with attacks on Peel by Protectionist Conservatives such as Lord George Bentinck and Benjamin Disraeli, that the Conservative Party was unable to reconcile the Peelites even after the Conservatives officially abandoned protection in 1852. The Peelites also had their own newspaper The Morning Chronicle to highlight their political position.

After Peel's death in 1850, the Peelite faction was led by Sir James Graham and Lord Aberdeen. In the 1852 general election, the number of Peelite MPs was estimated at 40. In that same year, George Hamilton-Gordon, 4th Earl of Aberdeen was invited by Queen Victoria to form a coalition government with the Whigs and the Radicals. This government fell in 1855 as a result of the unpopularity of its hesitant attitude during the Crimean War.

After the fall of the Aberdeen government, the Peelite faction took most of the blame for their management of the war in the Crimea. The group further lost cohesion with some members including William Ewart Gladstone, Sir James Graham and Sidney Herbert accepting cabinet posts in the new government led by Viscount Palmerston only to resign a few weeks later when the government agreed to hold a commission on the conduct of the recent war. Others stayed, including George Campbell, 8th Duke of Argyll and Stratford Canning, 1st Viscount Stratford de Redcliffe after which the Peelites with now no agreed overall leader appeared to be a band of independents rather than a putative political party. In the 1857 general election, their numbers in the House of Commons further decreased to around 26, or maybe less than 20 as identifying who was and who was not a Peelite became increasingly difficult.

The Peelites finally disappeared as a distinctive political entity after the 1859 general election. On 6 June 1859 a meeting was held at the Willis's Rooms, St James Street with most of the remaining Peelites agreed to combine with the Whigs, the Radicals and the Independent Irish Party Members of the United Kingdom Parliament to bring down the Conservative government of Edward Smith-Stanley, 14th Earl of Derby in a vote of no confidence. The vote was won by the opposition by 323 votes to 310 on 10 June.

The subsequent creation of Palmerston's ministry out of this combination was the birth of the British Liberal Party. Several leading Peelites (including Gladstone, Herbert, Cardwell, and Newcastle, but notably not Graham, who was one of the driving forces behind the coalition) accepted cabinet posts in this ministry, though some Peelites became independents or returned to the Conservatives.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Peelite


text:
Talk:List of cities in North Korea

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the . Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

move. -- Kjkolb 03:41, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Survey and discussion
Please add * Support  or  * Oppose  followed by a brief explanation and then your signature ("~~~~").
 * Support as nom. David Kernow 15:37, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Unicode
There are lots of HTML entities in the source -- they should be turned into normal Unicode. (218.228.195.44 13:39, 20 July 2006 (UTC))

Bad links
The link for Sangwon redirects to Korean name and the link for Tokch'on redirects to Sungri Motor Plant. StuRat 09:16, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

This is not a list
I recommend changing this article to follow the example of Cities of South Korea. If no body is opposed I will do that.DaronDierkes (talk) 07:13, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

Hungnam
Why is Hungnam missing, if it has the third largest population? --Uncle Ed (talk) 20:29, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It appears that it is now part of Hamhung. --Aqwis (talk) 15:40, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

title: Talk:List of cities in North Korea


text:
Robert Caesar Childers

Robert Caesar Childers (1838 – 25 July 1876) was a British Orientalist and the compiler of the first Pali–English dictionary to be published. He was the father of the Irish nationalist Erskine Childers and the paternal grandfather of the fourth president of Ireland, Erskine Hamilton Childers.

Early years
Childers was born in 1838 in Cantley, South Yorkshire, the son of Reverend Charles Childers, an English chaplain in Nice.

In 1857, at the age of nineteen, he was admitted to Wadham College, Oxford, where he studied Hebrew.

Ceylon
From 1860 to 1864, Childers was employed by the civil service in Ceylon, first as private secretary to the governor, Charles Justin MacCarthy, and then as office assistant to the government agent in Kandy.

During his time in Ceylon, he studied Sinhala and Pali with Ven. Yātrāmulle Śrī Dhammārāma Thera at Bentota Vanavāsa Vihāra, and established a firm friendship with Ven. Waskaḍuwe Śrī Subhūti.

His time there was brought to an end when ill health forced him to return to England.

Pali dictionary
Upon his return to England, Childers continued his study of Pali, influenced by Reinhold Rost and Viggo Fausböll.

In 1870, he published the text of the  Khuddaka Pāṭha with an English translation and notes in the Journal of the Royal Asiatic Society. This was the first Pali text ever printed in England.

The first volume of his Pali dictionary was published in 1872. In the autumn of that year, he was appointed sub-librarian at the India Office under Reinhold Rost, and early in the following year became the first professor of Pali and Buddhist literature at University College, London.

The second and concluding volume was published in 1875. A few months later, the dictionary was awarded the Prix Volney for 1876 by the Institut de France.

Family
Childers was married to Anna Mary Henrietta Barton, who came from an Anglo-Irish family with an estate in Glendalough, County Wicklow. Childers and his wife had five children (two sons and three daughters).

Death
Childers died from tuberculosis on 25 July 1876, at the age of thirty-eight. Thomas William Rhys Davids states in the Dictionary of National Biography that Childers died in Weybridge, but the Encyclopædia Britannica records his place of death as London.

title: Robert Caesar Childers


text:
Talk:List of Korean Americans

J Church
I don't see Lance Hahn of the band J Church on this list. The band is from San Francisco. Lance is very well respected and does a lot of music writing now for MRR and other publications. Should the founder of Asian Man Records be here also? --McDogm 03:12, 30 May 2005 (UTC)

Sandra Oh
I see that Sandra Oh is included here. As far as I know, she is Korean-Canadian, not American. Am I missing something here? Are we extending the list to people of Korean heritage who have spent a lot of time in the U.S.? --Iceager 1 July 2005 14:57 (UTC)
 * Well, there are a lot of Korean-born people on the list, notably Philip Jaisohn. I don't see why Canadian-born people couldn't be included as well.  Of course, Sandra Oh should also be included on the List of Korean Canadians. -- Visviva 4 July 2005 03:08 (UTC)
 * The difference is that Philip Jaisohn became an American citizen. In general, not everyone who spends a lot of time in the U.S. identifies oneself as American or takes on American citizenship. We don't generally call Syngman Rhee Korean-American, for example, although he spent much of his life in the U.S. and died in Hawaii. I see that the introduction of the list has been modified to include Korean Canadians in parentheses, but if the nature of the list is being modified, it should be moved to List of Korean Americans and Korean Canadians; I don't know if such a modification is wise. But maybe we should be thinking about alternate lists, either to replace this one or to complement it.
 * In general, I'm not too fond of "Ethnic-American" categorisations, as I've observed many Americans use the terms carelessly and apply it to non-Americans as if these were names substituting for entire ethnic or racial groups. Maybe the person who included Sandra Oh or Leonard Nam on the list genuinely thought they were American, but I'm not sure it ever enters people's minds to apply the "American" criterion.
 * What people usually mean when they say "Korean American" (and I myself have been called "Korean American" numerous times), it seems, is "people of Korean descent". Currently the list of Koreans says it includes people of Korean descent, but it doesn't clarify what its relationship with the list of Korean Americans is. I'm all for a list of non-Korean nationals of Korean descent, which would include Americans, Canadians, Australians, Japanese, Chinese, Russians, and Germans of Korean descent. There are lots of noteable people in this general category that are not really collected in any list. One could of course include all of them in the current List of Koreans, but I think a separate list would be useful. --Iceager 01:48, 19 July 2005 (UTC)

Leonardo Nam
Born in Buenos Aires, educated in Australia.

Proposal for list inclusion
I have made the following proposal regarding the criteria for inclusion for these lists. If this is something that you have comments or ideas about, please provide feedback. Thanks. Wikibofh 9 July 2005 19:15 (UTC)

Elizabeth Shin
An anon has twice removed Elizabeth Shin from this list without explanation. Although I note that her article does not currently refer to her ethnicity (except via a category link), I don't think that has anything to do with the removal. It might have more to do with notability, but to me she seems amply notable. Comments? -- Visviva 03:36, 20 July 2005 (UTC)

This is a list of famous Korean-Americans and although tragic, there have been just too many deaths of non-celebrities that are relevant for inclusion in this section. Krballer 17:06, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

regarding Korean MLB player
Please note that none of Korean MLB players are Korean-American. They are Korean. None of them immigrated to America. All of them live in Korea during offseason. Only MLB player who can be possibly considered as Korean-American is Terrmel Sledge (however, he is half African-American and Korean).

Ethnicity lists discussion
Please see discussion at Wikipedia:Village pump (policy) for current discussion of a potential policy to apply to all ethnicity lists on Wikipedia, including this one. JackO'Lantern 20:36, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

Please be careful when adding people on the list.
Please be careful when adding people to the list. Just because people you want to add are well-known in America, that does not mean they are Korean-American. For example, Park Chan-wook and Kang Jae-kyu. Yes... I know they are well-known movie directors and have directed several Korean movies that are also well-known to American viewers. However, they are NOT Korean-American. They were not born in America. They were born in Korea. They are Korean citizens. They live in Korea. Do you see it? They are far away from being Korean-American.

Please be careful.

 * Nowhere does it say that an American Citizenship defines an American citizen. No where does it say that you must be born in America to become one. An American is simply someone who inhabits America for a long time while taking on the life-style. Got it? Secondgen 11:27, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

 * I agree with the first writer that, although a Korean-born person lived in the United States for years, does not make the person an American citizen. If the person of Korean heritage was born outside of the U.S. and its territories or were not born of parents who are U.S. citizens, then the only way the person can become a citizen is through the naturalization process where the person applies for and accepted for U.S. citizenship. A Korean-born person who lives in the United States can theoretically remain a U.S. permanent resident for many years without attaining U.S. citizenship, as long as the permanent residency is kept current with the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services. Many long-time residents become "Americanized" in their lifestyle after spending many years here, in spite of not having U.S. citizenship.

 * Also, American citizenship is defined in the article for United States nationality law (that is, in the political sense) and also here, unlike the case of permanent residence only, regardless of whether that suits our view of how things should be. → Lwalt ♦ talk 21:00, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Michael Kang
Currently Michael Kang, who is listed as director/actor (presumably of The Motel) has a bluegrass band's instrumentalist as his link...
 * I fixed this one. ColourBurst 03:01, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

NAMING
In order to be consistent with wiki naming policies we should change all these names to reflect proper Korean name order, that is, last name first followed by first name. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.209.18.216 (talk • contribs)

==Definition of "Korean-American"?

Shouldn't a "Korean-American" be someone who is "Korean" (according to how people in Korea define the term "Korean," which is-- born of a Korean mother and father) who now lives in America? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 147.46.57.159 (talk) 02:32, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

That is way too narrow of a definition for "Korean American." And so, how does an American who has mixed ancestry refer to themselves? By the above definition, they likely cannot refer to themselves as anything except American. Or, they could just be put under the umbrella term, "multiracial." I have a Korean mother and a white father, and refer to myself as "Korean American." I would guess to venture that many in my situation do the same.

We should be careful in limiting the term, "Korean American." This list should cover those who have considerable Korean ancestry and have been born in America and/or have spent significant time living here. This would be both an accurate and inclusive way of keeping this listing. --Mulder8281 (talk) 18:49, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

Azia Kim (Troy High School graduate who posed as Stanford University student for 9 months until caught)
Is this person noteworthy enough to be put in the main article? Apparently she was a BelowAverageAsian (when measured in terms of public high-school academics), who wanted so much to fit into the top students at Troy Tech, she decided to attend Stanford after her high school graduation. Unfortunately, she was never admitted, yet somehow managed to device her friends and family for a full 9 months (until someone at Stanford finally wised up.) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.127.246.249 (talk) 04:13, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Removals and Need to Add References to Entries
Recently, a large number of Korean Americans were deleted from the list because they lacked both a wikipedia entry or references. In a way, this is a good thing - many of those deleted did not belong in the list. However, many do belong, and just need to either be linked to their wiki entry or need a citation.

Below is the list. Any help in reentering them with appropriate citations would be appreciated!

 * Doug Juhn, art director, visual effects concept art, montage design (Elektra, Daredevil, Superman Returns, Friday Night Lights)
 * Nic Cha Kim, creator of Gallery Row in Downtown Los Angeles
 * Maggie Oh, Digital artist (Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man's Chest, Star Wars: Episode III - Revenge of the Sith)
 * Youngsuk Y.S. Chi, Vice Chairman & President of Elsevier Inc., former Chairman of Random House Asia, former President of Random House Inc., Board Member of Princeton University, KACF, Association of American Publishers, Princeton University Press.
 * Jason Chon, CEO of Locus Telecommunications, Leader of the Board, former International Sales Manager for Samsung Electronics.
 * Brian Chung, CEO and President of Frontier Logistics Services
 * Amerie Mi Marie Rogers, Grammy nominated singer
 * Alexander Baik, Producer and Personal Manager
 * Erwin Cho, The Amazing Race 10 contestant
 * Godwin Cho, The Amazing Race 10 contestant
 * Stacy Kimball, Survivor: Fiji contestant
 * Hyun (Mookie) Lee, Survivor: Fiji contestant
 * Nina Noh, singer/dancer (Superstar USA)
 * Samuel Yang, model, actor, comedian, musician, songwriter, dancer, cartoonist
 * Jordan Young, adult film actor
 * Juju Chang, ABC News anchor and reporter
 * Sophia Choi, CNN Headline News, KVBC anchor
 * Sunhee Grinnell, Beauty Director of Vanity Fair and wife of artist Toland Grinnell.
 * K.W. Lee, founding president of the Korean American Journalists Association
 * Mia Lee, KCAL 9 News Anchor in Los Angeles, CA
 * Janice Min, Editor-in-chief of US Weekly magazine
 * Alice Rhee, NBC News producer
 * Charles Kim, Lead singer and writer for the rising band Sol of Madison. Their newest release, Synesthesia, encompasses the band’s aesthetic of simplistic melodies mixed with technologically-fresh ornamentation and carefully crafted lyrics. Sol was selected as one of the top 25 college bands in the nation for the 2005-2006 MTVu Best Music on Campus Competition. Since then, Sol has played with various national acts including Robert Randolph and the Family Band, G. Love and Special Sauce.
 * David Choi, popular musician on youtube & song writer. Choi has garnished over 77,778 subscribers and is known as youtubes #17 most subscribed of all time. He is also been a chain smoker for 5 years.
 * Stephanie Hwang of Girls' Generation, singer based in South Korea
 * Jessica Jung of Girls' Generation, singer based in South Korea
 * Malea McGuinness, adult contemporary singer
 * Dan Oh, musician, disc jockey, songwriter
 * Hyun-Woo Lee, R&B singer based in South Korea
 * Eugene Park, violinist based in South Korea
 * Sooyoung Park, singer and guitarist in indie bands, Seam and Bitch Magnet
 * Craig Pfunder, lead vocalist and guitarist of VHS or Beta
 * Ha Jin Rhim, R&B singer based in South Korea
 * Joseph Cho, City Councilmember of Cerritos, California
 * John J. Choi, Saint Paul City Attorney, appointed by Saint Paul Mayor Chris Coleman (D) in January 2006.
 * Philip Y. Choi, Councilman (D) of Leonia, New Jersey, first elected Korean-American in Leonia, New Jersey
 * Sukhee Kang, Mayor of Irvine, California, largest city with a Korean American mayor.
 * Jane Kim, San Francisco Unified School District Commissioner
 * Jason Kim, Councilman (D) of Palisades Park, New Jersey, the first Korean-American elected on the East Coast of the United States (2004).
 * Jerry Kong, Trustee on the Buena Park School District Board of Education in Buena Park, California, and at 27 years of age the youngest current Korean American in elected office.
 * Ilryong Moon, At-Large Member, former vice chairman, and former chairman of Fairfax County School Board; former member of Fairfax County Planning Commission in Fairfax County, Virginia
 * Sunny K. Park, Georgia, Secretary & Treasure; Georgia Ports Authority, former member of The White House Commission on Asian Americans. SunnyPark.com
 * Kevin Cho, District Aide to Florida State Representative Mary Brandenburg - District 89.
 * Wendy Van Horne, 2006 Green-Rainbow Party candidate for Massachusetts Lt. Governor.
 * Art Yoon, Mayor of Hermosa Beach, California, April 13, 2004 - January 25, 2005
 * Natalie G. Ahn, Howard Hughes Medical Institute Investigator, Professor of Biochemistry at University of Colorado at Boulder, co-discover of MAP Kinase pathway.
 * Jung-Hoon Chun, MIT Professor of Mechanical Engineering
 * Suk Ju Hong, chemical engineer, BS, MS & Ph.D from Seoul National University, retired from Kodak, who invented and pioneered laser digital printing plate process. He is the grandson of Hong Jin.
 * Hyung-Soon Kim, inventor of the nectarine fruit.
 * Hae-Seung (Harry) Lee, MIT Professor of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science
 * Lloyd Lee, former football player
 * Dawn Riehl, Bodybuilder and powerlifter.
 * John Yim, Professional Drifter, Formula D series
 * Gregory Lee, the first Korean American Firefighter/Paramedic in the United States. Lee retired in 2002 from the Los Angeles County Fire Department after 30 years.
 * Commander Heedong Choi, USN, first Korean American naval officer to command a destroyer (USS Chafee (DDG-90)).
 * Paul Kim, Top 24 contestant, American Idol (season 6)
 * Brian Hirano, Quest Crew b-boy and dancer from MTV's America's Best Dance Crew
 * Victor Kim, Quest Crew b-boy and dancer from MTV's America's Best Dance Crew
 * Lydia Paek, Quest Crew and Boxcuttuhz dancer from MTV's America's Best Dance Crew
 * Janice Min, US Weekly, Editor-in-Chief
 * Natasha Reid, born Natasha Shanta Reid (Korean name, YOON Mi Rae), is a South Korean hip-hop singer

--Mulder8281 (talk) 16:16, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

Dominic Pangborn?
As far as I know Dominic Pangborn is a Korean adoptee in the USA turned fashion designer. Komitsuki (talk) 16:37, 13 October 2011 (UTC)

Lee Yeon-hyang
Anybody has more info on Lee Yeon-hyang (이연향) in English? She's a Korean language interpreter who works at the General Branch Chief, Interpreting Division (US government) and has some decent exposure in the Korean newspapers. Komitsuki (talk) 10:13, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

inclusion criteria
It seems like list articles have a variety of inclusion criteria so there is no one guideline. I think there needs to be wider agreement before a solid rule is used an so many names taken out. Themwave (talk) 13:36, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

 * This discussion for lists of people was over years ago. Either this criteria as written at the start of the article is used or others (not me) will delete delete the entire article as not referenced.  This was the compromise with a batch of deletionists. Hmains (talk) 02:33, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Tommy Gibbons of Rock Band Tantric
Tommy is Korean born in 1991 in Seoul Korea. He was adopted and raised in Arizona. He started playing guitar at 11 and was world class at age 13. Most recently he joined the rock band Tantric who has a previous Platinum record and still tour all over the world. Tommy is the lead Guitarist and co writer of their songs now. His name is on Wikipedia under Tantric. Tommy is a 2nd degree black Belt in Tang Soo Do, winner of Best Guitarist in the 2014 L.A. Music awards, winner of Guitar Center competition "Guitarmageddon for South West Region in 2003 at only 12 years old. Winner of Louis Armstrong soloist award in 2008 for best musician in Arizona High Schools. Tommy has recorded or played on 16 Albums and has been the subject of Korean magazine articles, local television human interest stories and several newspaper articles.  I hope he is considered for the list.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Triplerpool (talk • contribs) 04:27, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

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Images
Does anybody think we should add any images to help improve the article? Matt Campbell (talk) 01:53, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:List of Korean Americans


text:
Talk:List of monarchs of Korea

I removed Tondemo theories. Those who believe Hwandangogi or other apocryphal books added them. I think I removed all of them but maybe some are left. --Nanshu 02:11, 6 Aug 2004 (UTC)

According to Dangi Gosa, five planets appeared in the same palce(五星聚婁) in fiftieth year of Dangun Heuldal, BC 1733. Modern astronomers figured out that this event really happened in July 13, BC 1734. That one year error is because of different counting of years. There is no chance authors could use this modern astronomical devices before 1979, and no other Chinese records describe this astronomical event in 1734 BC. At least Dangi Gosa cannot be a forgery. -- Caffelice 17:31, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)
 * I could find only one reference to it in English. Here - Caffelice 13:14, 25 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Reversion of July edits
An anonymous contributor made major changes and additions to this article on 14-15 July 2004. Unfortunately, the changes fall wholly into 2 categories:
 * 1) Replacing the existing and perfectly fine lists of rulers for various kingdoms and dynasties with slightly different lists that had inexplicable misspellings in them (for example, the kings and queens of Silla);
 * 2) Inserting quasi-mythical lists of rulers.

Over the last month, other contributors have tried to make piecemeal corections to these changes, but more drastic action had to be taken:

 * For (1), I reverted the affected sections back to gdr's edit of 30 June 2004, since article titles are tied to that version.

 * For (2), I accept that somewhere in the history of Go-Joseon, that kingdom moved from myth into reality, so I have kept the list of rulers for Go-Joseon, and for the historically more recent Buyeo, Bukbuyeo, and Dongbuyeo. But I have removed the section on Paedal, unless someone can find a good reason for putting it back in.  As for the section on Barhae, the list that this contributor inserted bears absolutely no relationship to the Korean names of the list of rulers on the Bohai page—unless those names were in the native language of Barhae....

I am the most diligent and prolific contributor on Korean topics on Wikipedia, but this article in its current state was frankly unacceptable. -山道子 (Sewing) - talk 22:26, 24 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I agree that Baedal section should be deleted. Not even "Apocrypal" books have detailed records of Baedal rulers. - Caffelice 13:14, 25 Aug 2004 (UTC)

korean era name article
any thoughts on merging Korean era name with this article? maybe make the former an explanatory article, with the actual list being integrated with the rulers list here? that would mean creating proper tables. Appleby 23:30, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

also, there's already a President of South Korea that pretty much duplicates part of this list. does anyone know if north korea considers the provisional gov't to be legitimate gov't, so that it belongs in "korea," or does it belong only in "south korea"? i was going to suggest renaming this article to be consistent with List of German monarchs & Table of Chinese monarchs, but obviously only if post-monarchy leaders are covered elsewhere. Appleby 03:42, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

 * I agree, the inclusion of the modern presidents here has always seemed a little odd to me... I think a "see also" link would suffice. And though I don't have an authoritative text at hand, I'm almost certain that the Provisional Government was always a relatively right-wing element of the independence movement, and thus would not be recognized by the North. -- Visviva 04:55, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

goguryeo list
i had extensively edited the kings list when i moved them here from the goguryeo article. goguryeo is considered korean, not chinese, not chinese/korean, by virtually all, if not all, authoritative publishers outside of korea/china. it's simply not a serious dispute outside of china's political program. even balhae, which is arguably less completely "korean" is described as korean by britannica, columbia, encyc of world history, etc etc. the controversy is properly discussed in a paragraph at the goguryeo article, but the extreme minority position need not be reflected in "rulers of korea" list. Appleby 17:00, 22 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I disagree. Deleting the Chinese pronunciations is just a loss of information, and the sources for these names are all written in classical Chinese. —Babelfisch 05:33, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

the list of japanese emperors does not contain chinese pronunciations. adding information in itself is not necessarily a good thing for an encyclopedia. other reference works treat goguryeo as korean, and we should be consistent. Appleby 07:17, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

gojoseon list
any thoughts on 환단고기, 규원사화, 태원선우씨세보 lists for gojoseon? i bring this up because wiman's usurpation of jun's throne is generally accepted as history, but jun's lineage back to gija is not. i've recently created Jun of Gojoseon & wanted to add to this list, but it brings up some messy issues. Appleby 01:25, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

it's not easy getting to the bottom of this. can anyone help out with some credible sources for more info? i'm still not quite sure how to place Jun of Gojoseon in this conflicting list of lists. Appleby 07:44, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

Courtesy names?
I notice that the Goryeo emperors, in the box to the right, have temple names, birth names, and courtesy names. But the boxes for the Joseon rulers often list only temple names and birth names. Is it because Joseon didn't have courtesy names or just because the boxes didn't include these? Badagnani 09:29, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

 * The Joseon rulers certainly had courtesy names; however I think we might question whether it is necessary to include such information here for either Goryeo or Joseon, since it should already be present in the individual rulers' articles. -- Visviva 15:50, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Chadae
please see   Appleby 02:55, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Requested move
List of Rulers of Korea → List of Korean monarchs – This is the standard form for articles of this nature; see Category:Lists of monarchs. Since the list includes kings, monarchs, and others whose status is not perfectly clear, the hypernym "monarchs" is most appropriate. In fact, this was the title of this page for some time. The page was moved away from this title on 18 June without any comprehensible justification, and later moved to the current capitalization-challenged version. Visviva 15:50, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Survey
Add "* Support" or "* Oppose" followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your opinion with ~

Discussion
Add any additional comments

 * Oppose Its not a "monarch". Where did you come up with that? Japan and China both use the title "emperor" for the royal line and Korea uses "king". I don't understand why "monarch" should be used. A monarch is a lower status than king and I have never seen "monarch" used to describe a Korean ruler. King Sejong is not called Monarch Sejong. I support "List of Rulers of Korea" because it best and clearly represents what they are: rulers. Good friend100 04:01, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Comment - Just to make sure everyone is aware what a monarch is--by definition all kings and queens are monarchs. See Encarta's definition, for example, "1. supreme ruler: somebody, especially a king or queen, who rules a state or territory, usually for life and by hereditary right" — LactoseTI T 20:41, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

But its not neccescarily used and outside people will most likely refer to as kings or emperors when searching for Korean rulers. "Monarch" is not commonly used. Also, "ruler" is perfectly fine; theres nothing wrong with it.

Here you want the best definition even though its less used and at the Imjin War talk page you insist the "most commonly used title". What is it that you really want? Good friend100 23:18, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

 * I was just leaving a note that in English, monarch is a general term that refers to "king and queens". It is commonly used, and has the added benefit of being gender neutral. — LactoseTI T 23:27, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

 * In response to the question: mostly I would like people to stop moving pages around for no apparent reason.  "List of rulers of Korea" (note the small "r") would be acceptable, and in fact this page was at that title for a long time.  However, I think that using the term "rulers" can give rise to issues of inclusion (Daewon-gun was arguably a ruler, though not a monarch) as well as POV (see Talk:Kim Jong Il for amusingly tedious discussions of this).  For that reason, I think Appleby was correct to move this page from "rulers" to "monarchs."  With the title "List of Korean monarchs" (or "List of monarchs of Korea"), the inclusion criteria are reasonably clear and non-controversial.  -- Visviva 11:53, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Support as long as the list only includes monrachs. And Good friend100, you need to check the definition of monarch as it includes kings and emperors. -   AjaxSmack   05:03, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Support as nominator. (thanks to AjaxSmack for the reminder). -- Visviva 11:53, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Support. "Monarchs" is a more precise term for ancient rulers, and is preferred.  Also, it is correct English, despite some of the comments above.--Endroit 18:38, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

 * "Ruler" does not make a specific gender reference. And if "ruler" is such a bad title, then whats with the sudden "lets move it move it"? The article was moved quite a long time ago and nobody complained about it after the move. Good friend100 01:51, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

 * And "Imjin War" is an English name. Good friend100 01:52, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Support per nominator and others. There is no real reason to have different wording for this group of monarchs. — LactoseTI T 12:31, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

If "monarch" is the best word, then why is "ruler" not? "Ruler" includes both Kings and Queens so it is not sexist. Also, some leaders of Korea were not monarchs because they didn't rule Korea as a country, like Dangun. And is ruler not an English word? Ruler has the most broad definition. It doesn't neccesarily reference a king and can mean any type of leader of Korea. Good friend100 18:40, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

 * List of rulers of Tahiti? If the word monarch should be used, then why isn't this article not moved? This article seems very stable, as a talk page has not even been started. To the Tahiti talk page at once! Good friend100 18:43, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Perhaps you were being facetious--I would suggest moving that stub of a page now directly, as I doubt it will be controversial. — LactoseTI T 22:21, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Then move it. You want monarch right? Good friend100 21:33, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

The article still uses "ruler" and not "monarch". If using monarch is important, then why don't you change it? Good friend100 22:44, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

I'd prefer List of monarchs of Korea over List of Korean monarchs on the grounds that the latter sounds a bit like ‘List of monarchs who were Koreans’ rather than ‘List of monarchs who reigned over Korea’. Just out of curiosity – would “List of sovereigns” exclude (I guess so) or include Daewongun? Wikipeditor 04:53, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Comment: What about List of monarchs in the British Isles and List of monarchs of the United Kingdom? They are not of the form List of fooian monarchs.  Guy 09:56, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Move
I made the move. I decided that List of Monarchs of Korea would best fit MoS. --Woohookitty(meow) 09:59, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Um, can you explain the capitalization? Seems like it should be "List of monarchs of Korea" at least.  -- Visviva 11:59, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree; probably just an oversight? — LactoseTI T 12:01, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't think it really matters. Good friend100 02:59, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
 * As "List of Monarchs of Korea" is not a proper noun, "monarchs" should not be capitalized per Naming conventions. --Kusunose 06:40, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
 * And as to "Korean monarchs" vs "monarchs of Korea", the latter is preferable per Naming conventions. --Kusunose 01:49, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

tag
Is it possible to remove the move tag off this talk page? It says when full consensus has been reached and I think it has been now. Good friend100 20:33, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Gojoseon
Anybody against moving the Gojoseon monarchs to List of legendary monarchs of Korea? It is presented here in a matter-of-fact style with dubious sources, which is very misleading for uninformed readers. Wikipeditor 12:31, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Readers are apprised of their legendary/controversial nature, so I don't think it's necessary. Cydevil 04:05, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd like to revisit this thread. I think it would be better to put all the rulers from Gojoseon to Mahan in the List of legendary monarchs of Korea exclusively. As things stand there is some repetition. I think it is beside the point that readers know of their legendary nature. Check out the two equivalent articles for British monarchs -- they keep things straight. Articles need to be to-the-point overviews. I think that we need to develop History of Korea articles just as we need to develop Mythology of Korea articles. For the sake of Korean mythology articles, why not keep things straight? For the sake of consistency and developing a smokin' encyclopædia, it is necessary to keep things in their correct categories. No slight intended, but not to keep things straight is a little sloppy, no? Thoughts? Mumun 無文 21:21, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Kim Jung Il
NO mention of Kim Jung Il, current dictator of North Korea? What is the difference between a dictator and an absolute monarch? --69.234.209.204 16:14, 25 July 2007 (UTC)Jknight 98

Academic consensus

 * "The continuing popularity of Tan'gun studies (Yun I-hum et al. 1994) clearly reflects the progressively ultra-nationalistic trend in Korean historical and archaeological scholarship today."
 * "The continuing popularity of Tan'gun studies (Yun I-hum et al. 1994) clearly reflects the progressively ultra-nationalistic trend in Korean historical and archaeological scholarship today."

 * "Consequently, Korean studies that address topics such as the emergence of ancient Korean civilization, statehood, religion, and identity are inexplicable without reference to a complex jumble of contradictory narratives filled with Tan'gun fiction, competing dynastic myths, and hypothetical invasions of tribes, as well as unaccountable archaeological data. This state of confusion has rendered it virtually impossible to distinguish fact from fiction in studies on ancient Korea."
 * "Consequently, Korean studies that address topics such as the emergence of ancient Korean civilization, statehood, religion, and identity are inexplicable without reference to a complex jumble of contradictory narratives filled with Tan'gun fiction, competing dynastic myths, and hypothetical invasions of tribes, as well as unaccountable archaeological data. This state of confusion has rendered it virtually impossible to distinguish fact from fiction in studies on ancient Korea."

 * "An extreme manifestation of nationalism and the family cult was the revival of interest in Tangun, the mythical founder of the first Korean state... Most textbooks and professional historians, however, treat him as a myth."
 * "An extreme manifestation of nationalism and the family cult was the revival of interest in Tangun, the mythical founder of the first Korean state... Most textbooks and professional historians, however, treat him as a myth."

 * "Although Kija may have truly existed as a historical figure, Tangun is more problematical."
 * "Although Kija may have truly existed as a historical figure, Tangun is more problematical."

 * "Most [Korean historians] treat the [Tangun] myth as a later creation."
 * "Most [Korean historians] treat the [Tangun] myth as a later creation."

 * "The Tangun myth became more popular with groups that wanted Korea to be independent; the Kija myth was more useful to those who wanted to show that Korea had a strong affinity to China."
 * "The Tangun myth became more popular with groups that wanted Korea to be independent; the Kija myth was more useful to those who wanted to show that Korea had a strong affinity to China."

 * "If a choice is to be made between them, one is faced with the fact that the Tangun, with his supernatural origin, is more clearly a mythological figure than Kija."
 * "If a choice is to be made between them, one is faced with the fact that the Tangun, with his supernatural origin, is more clearly a mythological figure than Kija."

First posted on Template talk:History of Korea, reposting here as these are clearly related to the current discussion and will be useful for expanding and/or rewriting the article with more reliable sources.--219.111.108.11 (talk) 16:25, 26 January 2015 (UTC)

 * Disclaimer: the above message was originally posted by me here. The anom user (who uses many different IPs) has reposted my message on several talk pages without proper attribution. I have absolutely no connection with this user. -Zanhe (talk) 05:06, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

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Is another Dangun war ready to be launched ?
It seems that another Dangun edit war is on the verge of being launched. If this Dangun was really an historical figure, it would be interesting to use him and replace the picture
 * Sunjong of the Korean Empire.jpg

in the desinfobox. Indeed, this picture resumes all the dynasties by someone that personified a temporary failure rather than anything else. On the contrary, who, better than a founding guy, can personify the Korean dynasties ?

And here, we have a problem. This portrait of the famous Dangun was not painted in 2332 BCE by some of his retainers, but by Chae Yong-sin (who died in 1941). Some more probing traces should be used, if any.

Of course, Queen Seondeok would be a better candidate to personify historicity, power and success. Pldx1 (talk) 22:18, 29 September 2015 (UTC)

 * Have not found any portrait of Seondeok. But Sejong is a second great choice: an Hall of Encyclopedia, whaow !!! Pldx1 (talk) 16:23, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

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Monarchs succession boxes
Hi. Someone added succession boxes to all korean monarchs articles. I find very odd the use of the ,,King/Queen of Korea" title and the use of the syntagm ,,Titles in pretence" for kings of pre-Goryeo periods. Does this monarchs realy used and pretended the title King/Queen of Korea, and to pretended rule all the koreans/Korean Peninsula ?! From what I read, I doubt. Shouldn't this be modified? Here are some examples: 1; 2; 3; 4; 5. Or at the Balhae monarchs, do we know for sure that they were Goguryeo claimants and pretended the same King of Korea title? Ex: 1; 2. Could a connoisseur of history check this? --Daduxing (talk) 17:40, 27 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Hi. You are totally right. Jumong was not a ruler of Korea in any possible meaning. Describing him as a ruler somewhere south of the Sungari would be better (but perhaps seen as controversial by several sides...). Anyway, these boxes are not here to convey any balanced description of the facts, so that you better be prepared to face a strong opposition from the boxers. Pldx1 (talk) 18:43, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

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Post Korean Empire
Yi Seok is the recognized king. Furthermore, the Imperial Family is constitutionally recognized in the latest 1987 Constitution. Yi Won is not in line to receive the crown. Theoneyihistorian (talk) 23:54, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

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Why including fictional rulers/pretenders in this list?
There is a dedicated list for the legendary parts of korean dynasties, so what was the reason for this revert? As there was no rationale given, I'm reverting this change. Best, --Enyavar (talk) 10:36, 10 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Please stop by here and explain your stance on the topic before you revert again... --Enyavar (talk) 17:20, 11 January 2019 (UTC)
 * More precisely, this list is intended to gather monarchs (Kings and Queens) that actually ruled over one of the Kingdoms of Korea. Pretenders and fictional people have their own lists.Pldx1 (talk) 17:35, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

 * I'd say we should still make exceptions for both Dangun and Gija, seeing how detailed these two "semi-mythological" figures have been reviewed scholarly. Both uncritical and critical research has been applied. Though maybe we could remove the wikitables, relegating Dangun+Gija to a textual preface to the actual lists. Their supposed successors are nothing but placeholder cut-outs, a link to the "legendary rulers" list is information enough.
 * ...I have no idea what the stance on en-WP is on the articles of List of Gija Joseon monarchs, Template:Gija Joseon monarchs and all included stubs. In de-WP I'd file deletion requests on everything that isn't already described under Gija Joseon and List of legendary monarchs of Korea. --Enyavar (talk) 18:06, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

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title: Talk:List of monarchs of Korea


text:
James Blades

James Blades OBE (9 September 1901 – 19 May 1999) was an English percussionist.

He was one of the most distinguished percussionists in Western music, with a long and varied career. His book Percussion Instruments and their History (1971) is a standard reference work on the subject.

Blades was born in Peterborough in 1901. He was a long-time associate of Benjamin Britten, with whom he conceived many of the composer's unusual percussion effects. In 1954, Blades was appointed Professor of Percussion at the Royal Academy of Music.

As a chamber musician he played with the Melos Ensemble and the English Chamber Orchestra.

Blades' pupils included the rock drummers Max Sedgley, Carl Palmer, and Richard James Burgess as well as percussionist Evelyn Glennie.

His most famous and widely heard performances were the sound of the drum playing "V-for-Victory" in Morse code, the introduction to the BBC broadcasts made to the European Resistance during World War II, and providing the sound of the gong seen at the start of films produced by the Rank Organisation. Blades played this sound on a tam-tam. On screen Blades's sound was interpreted by an actor miming a character called the "Gongman".

His autobiography Drum Roll: A Professional Adventure from the Circus to the Concert Hall was published by Faber & Faber in 1977.

title: James Blades


text:
Spectral theory

In mathematics, spectral theory is an inclusive term for theories extending the eigenvector and eigenvalue theory of a single square matrix to a much broader theory of the structure of operators in a variety of mathematical spaces. It is a result of studies of linear algebra and the solutions of systems of linear equations and their generalizations. The theory is connected to that of analytic functions because the spectral properties of an operator are related to analytic functions of the spectral parameter.

Mathematical background
The name spectral theory was introduced by David Hilbert in his original formulation of Hilbert space theory, which was cast in terms of quadratic forms in infinitely many variables. The original spectral theorem was therefore conceived as a version of the theorem on principal axes of an ellipsoid, in an infinite-dimensional setting. The later discovery in quantum mechanics that spectral theory could explain features of atomic spectra was therefore fortuitous. Hilbert himself was surprised by the unexpected application of this theory, noting that "I developed my theory of infinitely many variables from purely mathematical interests, and even called it 'spectral analysis' without any presentiment that it would later find application to the actual spectrum of physics."

There have been three main ways to formulate spectral theory, each of which find use in different domains. After Hilbert's initial formulation, the later development of abstract Hilbert spaces and the spectral theory of single normal operators on them were well suited to the requirements of physics, exemplified by the work of von Neumann. The further theory built on this to address Banach algebras in general. This development leads to the Gelfand representation, which covers the commutative case, and further into non-commutative harmonic analysis.

The difference can be seen in making the connection with Fourier analysis. The Fourier transform on the real line is in one sense the spectral theory of differentiation as a differential operator. But for that to cover the phenomena one has already to deal with generalized eigenfunctions (for example, by means of a rigged Hilbert space). On the other hand, it is simple to construct a group algebra, the spectrum of which captures the Fourier transform's basic properties, and this is carried out by means of Pontryagin duality.

One can also study the spectral properties of operators on Banach spaces. For example, compact operators on Banach spaces have many spectral properties similar to that of matrices.

Physical background
The background in the physics of vibrations has been explained in this way:

"Spectral theory is connected with the investigation of localized vibrations of a variety of different objects, from atoms and molecules in chemistry to obstacles in acoustic waveguides. These vibrations have frequencies, and the issue is to decide when such localized vibrations occur, and how to go about computing the frequencies. This is a very complicated problem since every object has not only a fundamental tone but also a complicated series of overtones, which vary radically from one body to another."

Such physical ideas have nothing to do with the mathematical theory on a technical level, but there are examples of indirect involvement (see for example Mark Kac's question Can you hear the shape of a drum?). Hilbert's adoption of the term "spectrum" has been attributed to an 1897 paper of Wilhelm Wirtinger on Hill differential equation (by Jean Dieudonné), and it was taken up by his students during the first decade of the twentieth century, among them Erhard Schmidt and Hermann Weyl. The conceptual basis for Hilbert space was developed from Hilbert's ideas by Erhard Schmidt and Frigyes Riesz. It was almost twenty years later, when quantum mechanics was formulated in terms of the Schrödinger equation, that the connection was made to atomic spectra; a connection with the mathematical physics of vibration had been suspected before, as remarked by Henri Poincaré, but rejected for simple quantitative reasons, absent an explanation of the Balmer series. The later discovery in quantum mechanics that spectral theory could explain features of atomic spectra was therefore fortuitous, rather than being an object of Hilbert's spectral theory.

A definition of spectrum
Consider a bounded linear transformation T defined everywhere over a general Banach space. We form the transformation: $$ R_{\zeta} = \left( \zeta I - T \right)^{-1}.$$

Here I is the identity operator and ζ is a complex number. The inverse of an operator T, that is T−1, is defined by: $$T T^{-1} = T^{-1} T = I. $$

If the inverse exists, T is called regular. If it does not exist, T is called singular.

With these definitions, the resolvent set of T is the set of all complex numbers ζ such that Rζ exists and is bounded. This set often is denoted as ρ(T). The spectrum of T is the set of all complex numbers ζ such that Rζ fails to exist or is unbounded. Often the spectrum of T is denoted by σ(T). The function Rζ for all ζ in ρ(T) (that is, wherever Rζ exists as a bounded operator) is called the resolvent of T. The spectrum of T is therefore the complement of the resolvent set of T in the complex plane. Every eigenvalue of T belongs to σ(T), but σ(T) may contain non-eigenvalues.

This definition applies to a Banach space, but of course other types of space exist as well; for example, topological vector spaces include Banach spaces, but can be more general. On the other hand, Banach spaces include Hilbert spaces, and it is these spaces that find the greatest application and the richest theoretical results. With suitable restrictions, much can be said about the structure of the spectra of transformations in a Hilbert space. In particular, for self-adjoint operators, the spectrum lies on the real line and (in general) is a spectral combination of a point spectrum of discrete eigenvalues and a continuous spectrum.

Spectral theory briefly
In functional analysis and linear algebra the spectral theorem establishes conditions under which an operator can be expressed in simple form as a sum of simpler operators. As a full rigorous presentation is not appropriate for this article, we take an approach that avoids much of the rigor and satisfaction of a formal treatment with the aim of being more comprehensible to a non-specialist.

This topic is easiest to describe by introducing the bra–ket notation of Dirac for operators. As an example, a very particular linear operator L might be written as a dyadic product:

 * $$ L = | k_1 \rangle \langle b_1 |, $$

in terms of the "bra" ⟨$b$1|  and the "ket"  |$k$1⟩. A function $f$ is described by a ket as |$f$ ⟩. The function $f(x)$ defined on the coordinates $$(x_1, x_2, x_3, \dots)$$ is denoted as
 * $$ f(x)=\langle x, f\rangle $$

and the magnitude of f by
 * $$ \|f \|^2 = \langle f, f\rangle =\int \langle f, x\rangle \langle x, f \rangle \, dx = \int f^*(x) f(x) \, dx $$

where the notation (*) denotes a complex conjugate. This inner product choice defines a very specific inner product space, restricting the generality of the arguments that follow.

The effect of L upon a function f is then described as:

 * $$ L | f\rangle = | k_1 \rangle \langle b_1 | f \rangle $$

expressing the result that the effect of L on f is to produce a new function $$ | k_1 \rangle $$ multiplied by the inner product represented by $$\langle b_1 | f \rangle $$. A more general linear operator L might be expressed as:

 * $$ L = \lambda_1 | e_1\rangle\langle f_1| + \lambda_2 | e_2\rangle \langle f_2| +   \lambda_3 | e_3\rangle\langle f_3| + \dots, $$

where the $$ \{ \, \lambda_i \, \}$$ are scalars and the $$ \{ \, | e_i \rangle \, \} $$ are a basis and the $$ \{ \, \langle f_i | \, \} $$ a reciprocal basis for the space. The relation between the basis and the reciprocal basis is described, in part, by:

 * $$ \langle f_i | e_j \rangle = \delta_{ij} $$

If such a formalism applies, the $$ \{ \, \lambda_i \, \}$$ are eigenvalues of L and the functions $$ \{ \, | e_i \rangle \, \} $$ are eigenfunctions of L. The eigenvalues are in the spectrum of L.

Some natural questions are: under what circumstances does this formalism work, and for what operators L are expansions in series of other operators like this possible? Can any function f be expressed in terms of the eigenfunctions (are they a Schauder basis) and under what circumstances does a point spectrum or a continuous spectrum arise? How do the formalisms for infinite-dimensional spaces and finite-dimensional spaces differ, or do they differ? Can these ideas be extended to a broader class of spaces? Answering such questions is the realm of spectral theory and requires considerable background in functional analysis and matrix algebra.

Resolution of the identity
This section continues in the rough and ready manner of the above section using the bra–ket notation, and glossing over the many important details of a rigorous treatment. A rigorous mathematical treatment may be found in various references. In particular, the dimension n of the space will be finite.

Using the bra–ket notation of the above section, the identity operator may be written as:

 * $$I = \sum _{i=1} ^{n} | e_i \rangle \langle f_i | $$

where it is supposed as above that $$\{ |e_i\rangle\}$$ are a basis and the $$ \{ \langle f_i | \}$$ a reciprocal basis for the space satisfying the relation:

 * $$\langle f_i | e_j\rangle = \delta_{ij} . $$

This expression of the identity operation is called a representation or a resolution of the identity. This formal representation satisfies the basic property of the identity:
 * $$ I^k = I $$

valid for every positive integer k.

Applying the resolution of the identity to any function in the space $$| \psi \rangle$$, one obtains:

 * $$I |\psi \rangle = |\psi \rangle = \sum_{i=1}^{n} | e_i \rangle \langle f_i | \psi \rangle = \sum_{i=1}^{n} c_i | e_i \rangle $$

which is the generalized Fourier expansion of ψ in terms of the basis functions { ei }. Here $$c_i = \langle f_i | \psi \rangle$$.

Given some operator equation of the form:
 * $$O | \psi \rangle = | h \rangle $$

with h in the space, this equation can be solved in the above basis through the formal manipulations:
 * $$ O | \psi \rangle = \sum_{i=1}^{n} c_i \left( O | e_i \rangle \right) =  \sum_{i=1}^{n} | e_i \rangle \langle f_i |  h \rangle, $$
 * $$\langle f_j|O| \psi \rangle = \sum_{i=1}^{n} c_i \langle f_j| O | e_i \rangle  =  \sum_{i=1}^{n} \langle f_j| e_i \rangle \langle f_i | h \rangle  = \langle f_j |  h \rangle, \quad \forall j $$

which converts the operator equation to a matrix equation determining the unknown coefficients cj in terms of the generalized Fourier coefficients $$\langle f_j | h \rangle$$ of h and the matrix elements $$O_{ji}= \langle f_j| O | e_i \rangle $$ of the operator O.

The role of spectral theory arises in establishing the nature and existence of the basis and the reciprocal basis. In particular, the basis might consist of the eigenfunctions of some linear operator L:

 * $$L | e_i \rangle = \lambda_i | e_i \rangle \, ; $$

with the { λi } the eigenvalues of L from the spectrum of L. Then the resolution of the identity above provides the dyad expansion of L:

 * $$LI = L = \sum_{i=1}^{n} L | e_i \rangle \langle f_i| = \sum_{i=1}^{n} \lambda _i | e_i \rangle \langle f_i | . $$

Resolvent operator
Using spectral theory, the resolvent operator R:

 * $$R = (\lambda I - L)^{-1},\, $$

can be evaluated in terms of the eigenfunctions and eigenvalues of L, and the Green's function corresponding to L can be found.

Applying R to some arbitrary function in the space, say $$\varphi$$,

 * $$R |\varphi \rangle = (\lambda I - L)^{-1} |\varphi \rangle = \sum_{i=1}^n \frac{1}{\lambda- \lambda_i} |e_i \rangle \langle f_i | \varphi \rangle. $$

This function has poles in the complex λ-plane at each eigenvalue of L. Thus, using the calculus of residues:

 * $$\frac{1}{2\pi i } \oint_C R |\varphi \rangle d \lambda = -\sum_{i=1}^n |e_i \rangle   \langle f_i | \varphi \rangle  = -|\varphi \rangle,$$

where the line integral is over a contour C that includes all the eigenvalues of L.

Suppose our functions are defined over some coordinates {xj}, that is:

 * $$\langle x, \varphi \rangle = \varphi (x_1, x_2, ...). $$

Introducing the notation

 * $$ \langle x, y \rangle = \delta (x-y), $$

where δ(x − y) = δ(x1 − y1, x2 − y2, x3 − y3, ...) is the Dirac delta function, we can write

 * $$\langle x, \varphi \rangle = \int \langle x, y \rangle \langle y, \varphi \rangle dy. $$

Then:

 * $$\begin{align}

\left\langle x, \frac{1}{2\pi i } \oint_C \frac{\varphi}{\lambda I - L} d \lambda\right\rangle &= \frac{1}{2\pi i }\oint_C d \lambda \left \langle x, \frac{\varphi}{\lambda I - L} \right \rangle\\ &= \frac{1}{2\pi i } \oint_C d \lambda \int dy \left \langle x, \frac{y}{\lambda I - L} \right \rangle  \langle y, \varphi \rangle \end{align}$$

The function G(x, y; λ) defined by:

 * $$\begin{align}

G(x, y; \lambda) &= \left \langle x, \frac{y}{\lambda I - L} \right \rangle \\ &= \sum_{i=1}^n \sum_{j=1}^n \langle x, e_i \rangle \left \langle f_i, \frac{e_j}{\lambda I - L} \right \rangle \langle f_j, y\rangle \\ &= \sum_{i=1}^n \frac{\langle x, e_i \rangle \langle f_i, y\rangle }{\lambda  - \lambda_i} \\ &= \sum_{i=1}^n \frac{e_i (x) f_i^*(y) }{\lambda - \lambda_i}, \end{align}$$

is called the Green's function for operator L, and satisfies:

 * $$\frac{1}{2\pi i }\oint_C G(x,y;\lambda) \, d \lambda = -\sum_{i=1}^n \langle x, e_i \rangle \langle f_i, y\rangle = -\langle x, y\rangle = -\delta (x-y). $$

Operator equations
Consider the operator equation:

 * $$(O-\lambda I ) |\psi \rangle = |h \rangle; $$

in terms of coordinates:

 * $$\int \langle x, (O-\lambda I)y \rangle \langle y, \psi \rangle \, dy = h(x). $$

A particular case is λ = 0.

The Green's function of the previous section is:

 * $$\langle y, G(\lambda) z\rangle = \left \langle y, (O-\lambda I)^{-1} z \right \rangle = G(y, z; \lambda),$$

and satisfies:

 * $$\int \langle x, (O - \lambda I) y \rangle \langle y, G(\lambda) z \rangle \, dy = \int \langle x, (O-\lambda I) y \rangle \left \langle y, (O-\lambda I)^{-1} z \right \rangle \, dy = \langle x, z \rangle = \delta (x-z).$$

Using this Green's function property:

 * $$\int \langle x, (O-\lambda I) y \rangle G(y, z; \lambda ) \, dy = \delta (x-z). $$

Then, multiplying both sides of this equation by h(z) and integrating:

 * $$\int dz \, h(z) \int dy \, \langle x, (O-\lambda I)y \rangle G(y, z; \lambda)=\int dy \, \langle x, (O-\lambda I) y \rangle \int dz \, h(z)G(y, z; \lambda) = h(x), $$

which suggests the solution is:

 * $$\psi(x) = \int h(z) G(x, z; \lambda) \, dz.$$

That is, the function ψ(x) satisfying the operator equation is found if we can find the spectrum of O, and construct G, for example by using:

 * $$G(x, z; \lambda) = \sum_{i=1}^n \frac{e_i (x) f_i^*(z)}{\lambda - \lambda_i}.$$

There are many other ways to find G, of course. See the articles on Green's functions and on Fredholm integral equations. It must be kept in mind that the above mathematics is purely formal, and a rigorous treatment involves some pretty sophisticated mathematics, including a good background knowledge of functional analysis, Hilbert spaces, distributions and so forth. Consult these articles and the references for more detail.

Spectral theorem and Rayleigh quotient
Optimization problems may be the most useful examples about the combinatorial significance of the eigenvalues and eigenvectors in symmetric matrices, especially for the Rayleigh quotient with respect to a matrix M.

Theorem ''Let M be a symmetric matrix and let x be the non-zero vector that maximizes the Rayleigh quotient with respect to M. Then, x is an eigenvector of M with eigenvalue equal to the Rayleigh quotient. Moreover, this eigenvalue is the largest eigenvalue of M. ''

Proof  Assume the spectral theorem. Let the eigenvalues of M be $$\lambda_1 \leq \lambda_2 \leq \cdots \leq \lambda_n$$. Since the $$\{v_i\}$$ form an orthonormal basis, any vector x can be expressed in this basis as

 * $$x = \sum_i v_i^T x v_i$$

The way to prove this formula is pretty easy. Namely,

 * $$\begin{align}

v_j^T \sum_i v_i^T x v_i = {} & \sum_{i} v_i^{T} x v_j^{T} v_i \\[4pt] = {} & (v_j^T x ) v_j^T v_j \\[4pt] = {} & v_j^T x \end{align}$$ evaluate the Rayleigh quotient with respect to x:

 * $$\begin{align}

x^T M x = {} & \left(\sum_i (v_i^T x) v_i\right)^T M \left(\sum_j (v_j^T x) v_j\right) \\[4pt] = {} & \left(\sum_i (v_i^T x) v_i^T\right) \left(\sum_j (v_j^T x) v_j\lambda_j \right) \\[4pt] = {} & \sum_{i,j} (v_i^T x) v_i^T(v_j^T x) v_j\lambda_j \\[4pt] = {} & \sum_j (v_j^T x)(v_j^T x)\lambda_j \\[4pt] = {} & \sum_{j} (v_j^T x)^2\lambda_j\le\lambda_n \sum_j (v_j^T x)^2 \\[4pt] = {} & \lambda_n x^T x, \end{align}$$ where we used Parseval's identity in the last line. Finally we obtain that
 * $$\frac{x^T M x}{x^T x}\le \lambda_n$$

so the Rayleigh quotient is always less than $$\lambda_n$$.

title: Spectral theory


text:
Managing the news

Managing the news is the deliberate influencing of the presentation of information within the news media. The expression managing the news is often used in a negative sense. For example, people or organizations that wish to lessen the publicity concerning bad news may choose to release the information late on a Friday, giving journalists less time to pursue the story. Staying "on message" is a technique intended to limit questions and attention to a narrow scope favorable to the subject.

An example cited by the Communication, Cultural and Media Studies infobase regards a February 1996 Scott Report on arms sales to Iraq. In the United Kingdom, the report was given early to certain officials.

title: Managing the news


text:
Talk:List of mountains in Korea

Untitled
It appears that North Korea is flat ;-) --Kokiri 17:57, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

In fact. North Korea is much less flat than the South. I have added some mountains of the North. The information is from Korea Review. // Wellparp 17:23, 21 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Kwanmo Peak
The list seems to be missing Kwanmo Peak (2,540 m). Regards, RJH (talk) 02:28, 22 July 2012 (UTC)

Spelling of Units
The mountain heights are given (with one or two exceptions) using the British spelling of metres, while many of the articles use the American spelling meters. Is there a prefered way to give units when editing, for example just using m? Kellnerp (talk) 14:30, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Seoul Mountains
The list contains major Seoul mountains with the exception of Eunbongsan(은봉산) - 81 meters, but leaves out many others between 100m to 400m in height. There is another list of Seoul mountains on wikipedia (List of mountains in Seoul) that is much more exhaustive, but at the same time includes mountains that may be in the Seoul environs without being in the city proper. Seoul itself is in a 'bowl' of mountains most of which are in this articles list. To be complete this list might want to include all the mountains inside the city limits, including mountains that have been built upon like Naksan(낙산), which has a significant historical fortress wall on it. Kellnerp (talk) 14:41, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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title: Talk:List of mountains in Korea


text:
Talk:List of political parties in South Korea

Untitled

 * The general rule on naming applies. That means: the parties are named in the English translation and the original native name is placed on the first line of the article unless the native form is more commonly used in English than the English form. Rationale and specifics: See: Naming conventions (use English).

File nominated for deletion on commons
The file c:File:Emblem of Korean Courts.svg used in this article has been nominated for deletion on Commons Reason: I think time has come to finish the long-forgotten (or ignored) question: Is free? I doubt its freeness, based on the fact that we do not have definite answer for Template talk:KOGL. To save your click...   We, as of 2018, do not have a final answer for this. And this means, we have to delete these images, including some VIs and FPs. Deletion request: link Message automatically deposited by a robot - -Harideepan (talk) 06:16, 23 March 2018 (UTC).

File nominated for deletion on commons
The file c:File:Emblem of the Government of the Republic of Korea.svg used in this article has been nominated for deletion on Commons Reason: I think time has come to finish the long-forgotten (or ignored) question: Is free? I doubt its freeness, based on the fact that we do not have definite answer for Template talk:KOGL. To save your click...   We, as of 2018, do not have a final answer for this. And this means, we have to delete these images, including some VIs and FPs. Deletion request: link Message automatically deposited by a robot - -Harideepan (talk) 07:51, 23 March 2018 (UTC).

In the 'Current parts-Main parts' section, we will modify the 'Position' section.
Because the position of the Liberty Korea Party, the Bareunmirae Party document, has been revised.

If you don't agree, you can revert to editing the document. Instead, I want you to argue back at the debate. --삭은사과 (talk) 23:29, 12 May 2019 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:List of political parties in Abkhazia which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 16:26, 29 March 2024 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Peelite

Would there be any objection to making this a redirect? Pakaran. 17:58, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

There was an identifiable Peelite faction for many years after Peel died - better treated as a political party in its own right.

Charles Matthews 18:00, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Ideology
How were the Peelite different from the Whigs? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.144.245.25 (talk) 14:10, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Peelite