text:
Talk:Ulsan

Hotels or accommodations
Unless it's the hotels that the city is famous for, then information about accommodations seem inappropriate for an encyclopedia and is probably much more appropriate in its entry in WIkitravel. YooChung 07:05, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Need information
Need information about the rock drawings at Bangu-Dae. Badagnani (talk) 23:37, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

Daegok-ri
Is there a place here called Daegok-ri? Badagnani (talk) 00:34, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Sea of Japan (East Sea)
Per Wikipedia naming conventions: Korea, the name of the body of water separating Korea and Japan is named Sea of Japan (East Sea). --Mtd2006 (talk) 18:04, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Pronunciation
How is the name pronounced? According to Korean phonology, tends to become  rather than. Is this the case with Ulsan? Is it or ? - Gilgamesh (talk) 22:20, 29 November 2009 (UTC)
 * It is in Standard Korean, with a short first syllable (for those still making vowel length distinctions). The Pyojun Gugeo Daesajeon provides pronunciation keys when the spelling is ambiguous. In the local dialect, however, I have a feeling that  and  would be merged, so that you would have the non-standard . Actually, Korean  is aspirated as well as lenis, and the fortis  is for virtually all intents and purposes identical to  in most other languages, but this is a whole other can of worms. --Iceager (talk) 13:29, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
 * For further clarification, this was not a case of ambiguous spelling as I originally thought. The fortis pronunciation in  is regular, because in Sino-Korean words like "Ulsan" (the vast majority of major Korean place names are Sino-Korean with the notable exception of "Seoul")  triggers the fortition of the following tautomorphemic coronal obstruents, , and  to , , and  respectively. So in addition to Ulsan  you have Uljin   and Paldang.
 * For the status of the Korean, you can consult "The Acoustics of Korean Fricatives Revisited" by Charles B. Chang for a summary of the debate whether to group it as part of the lenis or the aspirated series. It is true that it displays characteristics associated with both aspirated plosives and lenis plosives at the phonetic level, though it doesn't necessarily follow that it should be grouped as part of the lenis and aspirated series at the same time at the more abstract phonological level. My actual inclination would be to reserve judgement and describe it simply as non-fortis, since only the two-way distinction with the fortis is salient. Iceager (talk) 10:22, 8 January 2013 (UTC)

World's Largest...
Is it the world's largest plant operated by Hyundai? Or is it the world's largest plant, operated by Hyundai? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.56.131.92 (talk) 01:19, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

World's Largest or third largest oil refinery
both descriptions appear, need to decide which is correct — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.72.144.66 (talk) 15:59, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Shipyard
What's the name of the shipyard? It seems notable, should be stubbed. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 06:26, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 3 external links on Ulsan. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added tag to http://pda.ulsan.go.kr/Common/Detail.neo?id=U0010711
 * Added archive https://archive.is/20120716090353/http://ulsanonline.com/bus5001.html to http://ulsanonline.com/bus5001.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140103163905/http://english.ulsan.go.kr/business/city.jsp?mNum=2&sNum=1 to http://english.ulsan.go.kr/business/city.jsp?mNum=2&sNum=1
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160114234014/http://english.ulsan.go.kr/ to http://english.ulsan.go.kr/

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 21:32, 3 September 2017 (UTC)

Changes to History and Economy sections
Hi everyone. I've added a brief history section, although there is certainly a lot of room for expansion. I hoped to find reference to Ulsan's role in WW2 past the Battle of Ulsan. Perhaps somebody with access to more specific history sources will fill that in at some point.

I also removed the "shipping" subheading under economy. HHI is a shipbuilder, not a shipper, and the petroleum refinery info only fit "shipping" very loosely. HHI now has its own section, "shipbuilding," and I moved the refinery info to "petroleum." There are a lot of changes happening with HHI and Ulsan right now, with the purchase of DSME by HHI. This section will likely need updating as the details of that merger become more apparent, as well as the effects on the city and its shipyard. Skeletor3000 (talk) 18:37, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 01:59, 4 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Ulsan montage.png

title: Talk:Ulsan


text: Talk:Ungjin

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Ungjin


text: Talk:Unification Shoes

title: Talk:Unification Shoes


text:
Talk:United Liberal Democrats

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 1 one external link on United Liberal Democrats. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20040212055403/http://www.jamin.or.kr:80/eng/index01.html to http://www.jamin.or.kr/eng/index01.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at ).

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 23:17, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Liberal Unification Party which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 15:51, 12 March 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:United Liberal Democrats


text:
Talk:HAKMEM

Etymology
And with references, please. 74.130.9.253 01:04, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Answer?: HAKMEM = "Hacks Memo" or "Hackers Memo", a list of useful hacks or programming tricks.

--Plasma g (talk) 01:45, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

title: Talk:HAKMEM


text: Talk:Wang Ko

title: Talk:Wang Ko


text:
Talk:Wiman Joseon

The Bare Facts of the Only Historical Account of Wiman
The Records of the Grand Historian is the only extant contemporary account of the founding of Wiman's Joseon state. I'm afraid there is no mention of any powerful kingdom of Gojoseon he destroyed and replaced. Any other material regarding this period of Korean history comes from documents which were written hundreds of years later, and therefore cannot be authenticated. Archaeological searches have also not made any discoveries of fabulous lost civilizations. Thus this is the only verifiable account we have. The following is a passage taken from the Records of the Grand Historian from Wikipedia's entry on Wiman / Wei Man :

(Wei Man, known as Wiman in Korean, was a man from the State of Yan of China who established a kingdom in north-western Korea in the 2nd century BC. He was the first figure in the history of Korea to have been recorded in documents from the same time period. The Records of the Grand Historian simply calls him Man, so the surname Wei was probably added later.)

Man served Prince Lu Wan of the Yan Principality. Although Lu Wan was an old ally of the Han Emperor Gao, he was eventually suspected of rebellion and attacked. Lu Wan sought refuge with the Xiongnu in 195 B.C, while Man fled to the east.

According to the Records of the Grand Historian, Man led 1,000 men, dressed in non-Chinese costume and crossed the border river of Paesu/Peishui (浿水; probably Chŏngchŏn River). Based on the upper and lower fortresses of the former Qin Dynasty, he organized the natives named the Jinbeon/Zhenfen and the Joseon and Chinese refugees from Yan and Qi, and came to the crown. Man's capital was named Wanggeom/Wangxian (王險, generally identified as P'yŏngyang).[1] Since the Han Empire was not completely stabilized yet, the Governor of Liaodong appointed Man as an outer subject, provided that he did not prevent natives going up to the empire. The appointment is dated at 191 or 192 BCE.[2] With the support of the Han Empire, he expanded his territory by conquering many small towns. His kingdom was eventually conquered by Emperor Wu in 108 B.C during the reign of his grandson Ugeo.Wayne Leigh (talk) 02:24, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Talk:State of Nangnang
See Talk:State of Nangnang for discussion. -- ran (talk) 18:29, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

 * Hairwizard91, please do not include fabricated stories into this article and into State of Nangnang. Your are in violation of WP:OR.
 * Byeonjoseon is an imaginary nation; see Talk:Three Gojoseon.--Endroit 09:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
 * It is fixed as Gojoseon. Gojoseon is not fabricated. If you think, please give me the citation or references so that my article is proved to be fabricated. I have references for all article, but you do not have. --Hairwizard91 10:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

More Info
http://byeongjupark.wordpress.com/article/gojoseon-2zvfgrgyend5c-5/ a good article with more information to add to your topic.(Armorbeast (talk) 05:18, 23 April 2012 (UTC))

title: Talk:Wiman Joseon


text:
Talk:Wonju

county or city

 * Wonju city and Wonju/Wonseong county (원주시, 원성군) were united 11 years ago, in 1995. See English-language history of Wonju.  The map should -- and as far as I can tell, does -- correspond to the modern Wonju city, which covers the former territory of both the city and the county.  -- Visviva 07:06, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.234.208.29 (talk) 04:38, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

Map
Could someone explain the difference between the light gray and the dark gray regions on the map, as there doesn't appear to be a clear explanation on the page nor the image. 121.75.57.99 (talk) 00:44, 17 January 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Wonju


text:
Talk:Whole language

POV
Also took out the following phrase "Despite the attempts to find some common ground here, some critics have...etc". The very fact of whether balanced literacy advocates are trying to find common ground in earnest is the very topic of contention regarding "Balanced Literacy," and Moats, for one, portrays it as little more than smoke and mirrors to continue promoting Whole Language policies. The "despite" clause used the narrtive "encyclopedic" voice to deliver a specific side of the argument. I've put it on more of a "He said; She said" level. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.197.236.146 (talk) 04:13, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

Took out various adjectives describing Phonics as "decontextualized" etc. Frankly, no advocate of Phonics endorses "decontextualization"; this is a straw-man that Whole-Language proponents use. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.197.236.146 (talk) 18:37, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

"that it serves chiefly to provide employment for special ed teachers."

That's really treading on POV. That's an insult, not a fact asserted by the critics. It's true that the insult is properly attributed to the critics, but it's still not really a fact they believe so much as a slur on the educational system.

Might be possible to NPOV this by ending the sentence before this thought and saying something like, "They further assert that whole language is the primary reason so many remedial reading teachers and programs are necessary."

Jdavidb 18:47, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * --Which is the truth. Most children receiving special education services shouldn't even be getting them in the first place if the curriculum wasn't so fouled up.  High school-style language arts instruction, which "whole language" really is at bottom, is inappropriate in the early school years.  Children need to know how to decode in order to get "meaning" from what they read.  "Whole language" merely prompted an "accountability" backlash which has resulted in the monstrous No Child Left Behind.

 * Thanks, Ken Goodman, for nothing.-sn, a special ed teacher 1/14/07 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.53.202.49 (talk • contribs)

article needs work
Speaking as a language teacher, this page seems very biased toward a part-to-whole, discrete approach like phonics vs a whole-to-part, immersive approach like Whole Language. This would be analogous to a chef throwing out all cookbooks requiring more than 20 ingredients per recipe and two hours of prep time in favour of simple, quick dishes. I can't help wondering if the main author(s) of this article might be politically motivated, as a phonics-based approach has tended to be the baby of the right wing. Since the late 1980s, language teachers have adopted an eclectic approach to language teaching, with elements from a wide range of approaches and methodologies; phonics is but one cookbook in my stack of effective cookbooks. Food for thought.

This page needs significant work. Having been taught by phonics myself I have no understanding of what this alternative is, and why people advocate it, so I can't help directly. However, as a start I can at least point out why the bullet-points on this page don't tell me anything

 * literate classroom environment

What's a "literate environment"? Three things come to mind: a) the teachers are literate, which should a prerequisite for any literacy program, b) the pupils are literate, which means that you don't need a literacy program at all, or c) the walls are talking to you.

 * reading to and with students

Surely you can't teach literacy without reading, so this should be a characteristic of any literacy program. It's certainly a characteristic of phonics.

 * individualized instruction

This is just a resourcing issue, not a different style of teaching.

 * independent reading

Again, surely you can't teach literacy without reading. I'd expect all programs to have this.

 * students as authors

And you can't teach literacy without writing. Nothing special.

_____

This article is biased and NOT VERIFIABLE. Please revise.

 * integrating literacy skills into curriculum across disciplines

What, like reading textbooks and writing things on a board? Were there schools that just talked phonics in an isolated setting and then threw away the blackboard and didn't use any textbooks? Or is there something more to this?

 * increased parent involvement

This, again, is a resourcing issue, not really a style of teaching. Ideally you'd get parents to help out with teaching all parts of the curriculum.

I'm not attacking Whole Language, I think the problem is that the article doesn't explain what Whole Language is.

Ben Arnold 7 July 2005 23:05 (UTC)

This article is written at too advanced a level to be helpful to people seeking an introduction to the topic. It assumes a background in related topics that many people are not likely to have. Terms need to be explained, rather than used assuming that the reader understands them. Rainexpert (talk) 21:14, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

removed
"Arguing against the pictographic point of view aforementioned, some employ the following simile: teaching a phonetic language using Whole Language is like teaching people to read Chinese without teaching them how to write the letters. This would, they hold, hamper one's ability to remember and distinguish between letters."

 * Aside from the awkward sentence structures, this implies that the Chinese written language has letters - obviously it does not. While it does have pronunciation systems to aid in its teaching that either have letters (pinyin) or something similar (zhuyin), I find that this para doesn't seem to add much to the article, and I'd rather take it out than make the corrective edits.  Perhaps someone else wants to put this back in cleaner and correct form?  --Ur Wurst Enema 06:00, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Perhaps I should also add that while I'm no linguist I do agree with the general idea of the removed para. It would be pretty hard to be literate in Chinese without learning either pinyin or zhuyin.  --Ur Wurst Enema 06:04, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Article needs work reply
I believe this is what the author meant in the bullets:

Literate classroom environment = Print-rich environment as in having lots of print such as stories written by students, labels, poems, diagrams, etc... on the walls of the classroom where students can view them.

Reading to and with students = reading to/with students using authentic literature rather than using textbooks which are usually written to teach specific skills and lack the vocabulary, style, subject matter, variety of form and complexity that mainstream and prize-winning children's books have.

individualized instruction = could mean differentiated instruction where the teacher works with small groups of students to develop skills they need to develop that other students may have already developed. This would be different than in a class where the teacher teaches and paces the skills equally for the entire class and ignores the fact that the students are different levels of proficiency.

independent reading = independent reading of reading level appropriate, authentic literature.

students as authors = students writing using the writing process and acting as professional authors do by choosing their own topics, revising their work and publishing (making books out of) their material. The traditional writing instruction would be focused on teacher-given writing assignments with the focus on spelling and convention.

integrating literacy skills = using reading, writing, listening and speaking as a means to learning information about other subjects such as math, science and social studies. Not just reading textbooks and writing things on the board but using literacy skills to read articles, stories, non-fiction books, internet sources, letters from professionals in that field etc...

Anyway, like I said, I think that's what the author may have meant but I could be wrong.

National Geographic Channel randomised intermediate letters
National Geographic Channel has an item that demonstrates that so long as the first and last letters of a word are correct, the letters in between can be randomised without affecting the meaning.

Nioatanl Gorghpeaic Cnenahl has an ietm that datsntoarems taht so lnog as the frsit and lsat lteerts of a wrod are cerorct, the lteters in beweten can be romdanised wuhtiot atecffnig the minneag.

This claim is superficially true, but what you cannot be sure of is whether two or more words share the same random pattern. Should pairs of words share the same pattern, sometimes this might lead to loss of meaning, while other times this might lead to a completely wrong and dangerous meaning. It may also be true that the longer words are the harder they are to decode, in which case the reader may get stuck. Since Microsoft Word doesn't have a word-randomising function, the randomisation has to be done by hand, which is slow and difficult.

It is hard to think of dangerous word pair examples, however the onus in on the advocates of National Graphic randomised intermediate letters to show that such problems will never occur.

Tabletop 04:17, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Origin and Development of the Philosophy
Why is there nothing on the origins of this educational philosophy? It would be a good addition to the article.

Major Revision
I made major changes to the text of this article. I retained from the original author's work the clear substantive points made but took pains to reframe the article so that this controversial subject is treated neutrally. I do hope that I have accomplished that task. It SHOULD be clear that this is an area over which there is considerable debate, rancor, and disagreement. It SHOULD be clear that whole language has important benefits and that many have raised concerns. It SHOULD NOT seem like an endorsement of whole language or like it is supporting the "non-whole language" view.

As the previous poster suggested, I included some basic epistemological background. I am happy to discuss further revisions and share my understanding of this area with those interested.

--Kearnsdm 09:19, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

National Geographic Channel randomised intermediate letters goes haywire
An example of the National Geographic randomized intermediate spelling going haywire has surfaced. This week's Economist newspaper has a heading that read:

 * Tanzania - Bye bye poverty.

but due to greater familiarity with another place it was read as

 * Tasmania - Bye bye poverty.

OK, its not a perfect transposition, as an N is swapped with a M, and a S is swapped with a Z.

Nonetheless, such misunderstandings are asking for trouble in the long run. National Geographic fails to warn of any problems.

Tabletop 04:03, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

National Geographic Randomised Letters - Jump to conclusions
When using NGRIL, your eyes sometimes jump to conclusions:

 * Ivan Lazarev was of Armenian origin.
 * Ivan Lazarev was of American origin.

Tabletop 04:34, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Chomsky
Was Chomsky really associated with the idea that written language should be imparted the way spoken language is? --Gargletheape 04:08, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

No, but Ken Goodman used to claim he was. Apparently he had bagels with Chomsky at breakfast during a conference in the early 1960s and Chomsky told Goodman that his work sounded interesting. That's all there is.

 * Chomsky's theory was about learning spoken language. Goodman applied Chomsky's theory and extended it to written language, asserting that just as children learn to speak "naturally" by being surrounded by people speaking, children learn to read "naturally" by being surrounded by print.

 * Not true. It's proven not to be true.  Nonetheless, the theory continues to be discussed and promoted by many.

 * Rosmoran (talk) 02:18, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

There is plenty of science that shows that children do indeed learn to read as they learn to speak. It is the same brain and the Language acquisition device Chomsky spoke of performs the same function in all four, speaking, listening, reading and writing. Show me the studies that show that being in a literacy rich environment, with lots of modeling and support doesn't lead to reading development. Emerging literacy happens in children 4-7 with little direct instruction. But one has to be able to read each child to know when to provide what kind of support to make learning optimum. Margaret Shaw Ph.D Reading, Language and Cognition — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.113.229.161 (talk) 20:17, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Meaning-based phonics?
Is that like colour-based smell? Not to sound peevish, but I hope we as writers of this article are not products of this system. :) Some of it is a little opaque - but I'm afraid there isn't anything I can suggest. :(    Stevebritgimp (talk) 21:30, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

 * What should be communicated (in a non partisan way, which is why I don't try to write it myself!) is that many whole language proponents claim that they also "teach phonics." What teachers actually do is to point out individual letter/sound combinations opportunistically, that is, when they encounter a letter that the teacher knows students need help with -- these are called "mini lessons."  It's not meaning-based phonics.  It's really a way for whole language supporters to counter the resurgence of phonics as a useful method of early reading instruction.

 * Best, Rosmoran (talk) 02:25, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

 * I changed the offending sentence to "meaning-based word recognition" and added a clause specifically about phonics. Very funny. There's a complete discussion of whole language "phonics" in the "contrasts with phonics section." Rosmoran, I'm not sure if you were indicating you think that section should be changed or not. Take a look at it again, and maybe we can think of ways to strengthen it. I do think it covers a fair amount of the territory you mention above. Kearnsdm (talk) 05:38, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

 * I'm probably just showing my ignorance here, but I don't know what is meant by the term "meaning-based word recognition". Is this the (misguided) theory of using context to identify an unknown word, rather than looking at the orthographic representation of the unknown word?

 * Rosmoran (talk) 07:10, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

 * Hi rosmoran. Yes, what you're talking about is exactly what is advocated. Frank Smith (as recently as 2004) and Ken Goodman (as recently as 2003--I think that's the right year) are still saying phonics does no good. That view has been quite marginalized in a lot of the literature, but it's more prevalent than you might think. This idea of word recognition is also meaning-based in the sense that it happens in the context of reading quality literature for a comprehension purpose. There may be a better way to say all of this. Thoughts? Kearnsdm (talk) 04:43, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

 * Hi, Kearnsdm. I doubt I'd be surprised by the prevalence of this view --- I see it everywhere from elementary classrooms to university teacher programs.  Not too much in research literature, though, but whole language proponents explain this away by saying that "scientific" research is irrelevant for what they do.  Convenient, no?

 * Perhaps the focus of the section ought to be individual word identification, contrasting how whole language and phonics programs approach this issue.

 * If we can agree on this purpose, here's a proposed list of items to be communicated in this section:
 * Students are discouraged from using phonics to identify an unknown word
 * Students are encouraged to read the sentence and "guess" what word would work in context of the sentence (I think this is the "making meaning" part of word identification in whole language)
 * Mistaken word identification is acceptable if the meaning is not changed (for example, reading "pony" instead of "horse")
 * I'm sure I'm missing things, but it's a start. Let's shoot arrows at the strawman. :-)
 * Rosmoran (talk) 08:36, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

 * I think that's a great idea. However, I think we will actually need two subsections. The first should contain the information already in the "contrasts with phonics section" regarding "embedded phonics," which actually does mean phonics instruction. So, I think we should have the subsections, "Whole language word identification: embedded phonics" and "Whole language word identification: no phonics" (not these exact titles, but ones that communicate these ideas), because they are different.
 * Also, I think you're right about the "pony/horse" example; that's part of the three cuing systems idea that is mentioned in the article (i.e., reading is the product of three cuing systems which overlap and contribute uniquely to word identification and comprehension).
 * It will be especially important to have good references for all of this because, whether or not it's a straw man, it is not universally acknowledged to be one! I do have the original Goodman article (1967) if you'd like to take a look (I can e-mail it if you give me your e-mail address) as well as Pressley (2006), whose book Reading Instruction that Works gives a really clear explanation for why whole language for word identification could be problematic. It's also good because Pressley took a mixed methods approach and is pretty much liked by people on all sides of the issues.
 * Kearnsdm (talk) 17:39, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

 * Ha! I was referring to my proposed list of topics as a "strawman"!  Whole language proponents would most definitely not consider it a strawman.  In my experience, it rather seems to be a religion based on blind faith. (There I go showing my reading politics again ....)

 * I'll leave you my email address on your personal page.

 * Best, Rosmoran (talk) 23:17, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Refimprove and OR
Very little of this article carries any citations and what is here goes far beyond synthesis of the provided documentation. I am tagging the entire page as original research and needing citation, pending a mass wipe of the unsupported claims, as I myself have not done sufficient research to cite/rewrite. For instance, the "Overview" contains a list of attributes that seem applicable to all reading education and are not clearly related specifically to whole language. This opacity would be easily resolved by providing a source for the list.

Yourself In Person (talk) 17:21, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Edited Lede
I re-wrote the lede, adding what I think is a clearer statement of the fundamental principle underlying the whole language philosophy of reading, noting (with lots of relevant sourcing) that the principle has been discredited by both psychologists and linguists. I also summarized the current state of knowledge regarding the effects of the use of whole language based methods vs direct instruction in phonics on learning to read.

I also added a description of the recent events in Bethlehem PA ( https://www.npr.org/2019/01/02/677722959/why-millions-of-kids-cant-read-and-what-better-teaching-can-do-about-it )as an informative example of a district's experiences with the transition from the use of whole language approaches to phonics-focused approaches. Regutten (talk) 20:33, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

If all anyone gets from my post, please understand that whole language is NOT WHOLE WORD! I am a reading specialist who has used whole language and natural approaches and this is the worst misinformation of all. Learning whole words is not what Whole language is about. Whole language is about reading writing, speaking and listening to meaningful texts that have a purpose for the student. The science has not shown that whole language is inefficient and of course the whole in whole language means nothing is left out. However phonics instruction teaches decoding, not reading and if the child really doesn't know how to use it as only one of 3 tools, you teach them separately from when they read the whole text. Making a child sound out any word while reading interrupts the comprehension process. When many of us old folks learned to read using whole language before it was called that. Those large lined pads where teachers wrote stories that we dictated were done using the Language Experience approach, a basic component of Whole language. Unfortunately, a study was done during the GW Bush admin and not one reading specialist was included on the panel. It was a Metanalysis and the panel threw out those studies that didn't conclude what they were asked to conclude. Whole language is writing stories, reading real literature and depending more on what a student knows about the world than trying to sound out words and then trying to find out what they mean in an unfamiliar context. I taught all my students to read via whole language and my students, even those who spoke Spanish only when I began with them, to read and write for 14 years. The learned fast and didn't fall behind. Margaret Shaw Ph.D Reading, Language and Cognition — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.113.229.161 (talk) 20:10, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

"Discredited"
The use of the word "discredited" in the first sentence doesn't serve the overall tone and sentiment of the piece. I removed the word to allow the research to speak for itself. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EdHistory101 (talk • contribs) 11:57, 11 September 2019 (UTC)
 * It is discredited. Not to mention it has been idiotic from the start. Mikus (talk) 20:24, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

 * Lucy M Calkins' name appears nowhere in this article. Very odd. Hasn't she done loads to discredit Whole Language and its subsequent re-brandings? In Sept 2023 Columbia's affiliated teacher college "dissolved" her program and put her on sabbatical (i.e. into exile post public disgrace). 6lbr (talk) 15:18, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

edweek.org Lucy Calkins Revisits and Revises Her Reading Curriculum (Opinion) By Lucy Calkins — November 09, 2022 edweek.org Readers Had a Lot to Say About Lucy Calkins' Essay. Here's a Sampling (Opinion) December 13, 2022 Never Heard Of Lucy Calkins? Here’s Why You Should Have A flap over a popular curriculum sheds light on why many American kids struggle to read. by Natalie Wexler, Senior Contributor, Nov 14, 2021 In the Fight Over How to Teach Reading, This Guru Makes a Major Retreat Lucy Calkins, a leading literacy expert, has rewritten her curriculum to include a fuller embrace of phonics and the science of reading. Critics may not be appeased.

Lucy Calkins, an education professor, created a popular curriculum called “Units of Study,” built on a vision of children as natural readers and writers.

by Dana Goldstein, May 22, 2022

For decades, Lucy Calkins has determined how millions of children learn to read. An education professor, she has been a pre-eminent leader of “balanced literacy,” a loosely defined teaching philosophy.

Dana Goldstein is a national correspondent, writing about how education policies impact families, students and teachers across the country. She is the author of “The Teacher Wars: A History of America's Most Embattled Profession.” Amid Reading Wars, Teachers College Will Close a Star Professor’s Shop Lucy Calkins ran a beloved — and criticized — center at Teachers College for four decades. It is being dissolved.

By Dana Goldstein, NY Times, Sept. 8, 2023

In the urgent debate over how U.S. schools teach children to read, few figures have been as central as Lucy Calkins, the literacy professor and curriculum entrepreneur.
 * @6lbr, can you provide any references to support your claims? Also, please keep your comments constructive and avoid language that unnecessarily disparages Wikipedia. Revirvlkodlaku (talk) 15:49, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
 * @6lbr, can you provide any references to support your claims? Also, please keep your comments constructive and avoid language that unnecessarily disparages Wikipedia. Revirvlkodlaku (talk) 15:49, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

Unbalanced?
I disagree that this article is unbalanced. The refs are thorough and the research is solid. It's certainly not glowing, but the information is clear. The editor that added the "Unbalanced" tag has done no other edits, and has given no justification for the addition of this tag. If they don't add some rationale, I'll be removing the tag. peterl (talk) 01:51, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

 * I would just add here that that the research itself is unbalanced, as noted in the Minority View of the National Reading Panel Report. The NRP Report has been taken up as the call to focus on skills-based instruction, but Yatvin, the author of the Minority View, cautioned against that. Similarly, Pressley (in a report adopted as a policy white paper by the Literacy Research Association) highlights the incomplete view of the field of research as experimental and quasi-experimental studies were the only ones considered by the NRP. So, the references may be sound, but the exclusion of citations that consider other viewpoints (e.g. qualitative research) in both the NRP Report and this article have a troubling effect on the public's perception of reading instruction. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.193.222.193 (talk) 14:37, 4 March 2022 (UTC)

Unbalanced Tag
As a former teacher of language arts, and a current professional in the field of teacher training, this article certainly IS "unbalanced." Leading with "discredited" is just one example of this unbalanced POV. I will be rewriting that description shortly, using widely accepted definitions of "whole language" used in education circles, and not the anti-whole language propagandistic description currently used. KevinHallward's Ghost (Let's talk) 22:35, 9 December 2021 (UTC)

 * I disagree. The seven strong references that were removed all support the use of that word. Please don't remove seven strong references. If there are other viewpoints that are not represented, and there are reliable sources for those, then feel free to add those. peterl (talk) 17:15, 10 December 2021 (UTC)

 * The references in question are cited in other parts of the article. And it doesn't MATTER if you "disagree." Many of those "references" are to sources with academic axes to grind against the theory. Either way, you don't lead with "discredited" in an article about a theory still in wide practice in educational circles. Don't remove the tag without far more justification than this. KevinHallward's Ghost (Let's talk) 20:12, 10 December 2021 (UTC)

 * Correct. Whether I disagree or not is not relevant. What I disagree with is your edit. What is relevant are valid, academic, well researched references. And the article leads with seven of those. There are seven good references that support the term "discredited". Is that unbalanced? Not if there is very good support for that statement - and there is. That the theory is still in wide practice is not relevant to this discussion. I could accept "discredited but widely practiced", but it's very clear that the theory is discredited. I acknowledge your background in education; like my background, unless one of your published works is being referenced, or there is a conflict of interest, your background is not relevant. You state that they have "academic axes to grind" - what is your support for that? I don't understand your "far more justification than this" statement - there's seven very good, clear references supporting that statement - and yes, there is more in the body. I'm restoring the "discredited" with refs, but will leave the "may be unbalanced tag. Feel free to discuss the "not discredited" viewpoint here. peterl (talk) 03:45, 11 December 2021 (UTC)

 * I have reworked the lede, without the inflammatory and non-NPOV "discredited" descriptor, but moving the scholarly view that there isn't support for the original view of "whole language" within the scholarly community. But it's a MUCH more nuanced discussion than just "discredited" implies, and this article should reflect that fact. KevinHallward's Ghost (Let's talk) 17:49, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Additionally, I just accessed as many of the "references" for that word that I could, and only one uses it in a REMOTELY similar context to what the non-NPOV version of the lede was doing. One of the references was non-accessible (a broken link) and another was to an offline book with which I'm unfamiliar. Because the rest of the article makes clear that the scholarly viewpoints have primarily moved away from whole language, there's simply no need to include a word like "discredited" in the very first line of the article. KevinHallward's Ghost (Let's talk) 17:57, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
 * The overwhelming scientific consensus is that whole language is an ineffective method of reading education. You can't just remove the citations that confirm this viewpoint then call it unsubstantiated. Shadybabs (talk) 13:41, 27 May 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Whole language


text:
Talk:Yanbian Korean Autonomous Prefecture

Kando kanji
Are we sure that 간도 was not in fact from 間道? 218.49.116.218 02:08, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

"Korean Manchurian descents"
Gando or Manchuria was part of Korea. ( Land, History, Political Territory). Korean-Manchurian descent is about 107,430,000 millions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Koreanstudy1 (talk • contribs) 13:21, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

1) 간도, means " Manchuria" in Korean. 2) Historically Kando was part of Korean Peninsula. 3) Korean-Manchurian descents meaning. Manchurians with Korean blood numbera about 107,430,000 million ( Korean-Manchurians) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bostonjj (talk • contribs) 04:35, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

 * Repeating this number all over the place without telling anyone what reliable source it came from (if any) doesn't make it true. cab (talk) 05:49, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

 * Also, 107,430,000 million is a lot of people :) 121.130.76.131 (talk) 12:48, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

 * Manchurians, Koreans, and other ethnicities of Mongolian ancestry have been assimilated into Chinese culture through diplomatic intervention. Granting Chinese Citizenship and changing ethnic status to Han Chinese can make more economical sense when living in the People's Republic of China.  It may not be politically incorrect but China is like the United States of Asia where hundreds of ethnic groups lose their identity for status and faster intergration into Chinese Culture.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.32.106.120 (talk) 04:26, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

unless you can provided me with a date of your so call 107,430,000 Korean-Manchurian then this is really a nationalistic/imperialistic statement.

“China is like the United States of Asia where hundreds of ethnic groups lose their identity for status" unless that or China should separate ethnic from each other like how America separate Black and white in the past and just like how you call Korean-Manchurian here, didn't you just make Manchurian take on Korean identity? I'm sure most Manchus want to keep their identity. As far as ethnic mixing goes, it's people's choice to integrate into other cultures, if they don't want to then they can remain the same.

Stop using 1995 data to clarify everything. 2009 Data Korean population in China ( 2.9-3.5 Million). Please update Koreans in China population. Korean-Manchurians: 107,430,000 Korean- Manchurian is correct. ( Nationalistic/Imperialistic statement is done by Chinese " Communist" government distorting facts and information ( History Books, History Research, Categorizing " Mongolian, Manchurian culture/history into one bracket of Han-Chinese". Wrong fact. Northeast Korea/Manchuria or Koryo-Kando region was never part of China. Han-People never controlled Manchuria. Han-People or Han-Chinese cannot claim " Korean-Kando region as part of Han-Chinese cultural sphere. Han-Chinese never settled in Manchuria before Koreans.

Buyo Tribe: is Korean tribe before Manchurians, Mongolians, Han-Chinese ever settled foothold in Manchuria. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Korea1Koreans (talk • contribs) 06:42, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
 * 107,430,000 Korean- Manchurian is INCORRECT unless you give a source. 1995 data is better than '2009 Data' with no source. Nationalistic/Imperialistic statement is done by korean nationalists like you who distort information.  Asserting your number is correct without giving a source just proves how desparate you lot are.  Stating something as wrong without giving sources to support yourself just shows YOU are wrong.
 * Han-Chinese cultural sphere includes Korea, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_cultural_sphere, reliable sources given at the end of the article. Han-Chinese cultural sphere does not mean the korean nationalist 'definition' of Han-Chinese cultural sphere, it means the definition given by James Matisoff, which means it includes any country that was historically under heavy Chinese influence.  Note: James Matisoff is not a Chinese nationalist/communist/imperialist, and nor is Wikipedia, and nor is the person who wrote the article on the Chinese cultural sphree, if that's what you are going to say.  Korean nationalists like you keep on calling whoever that disagree with you on these topics as a 'Chinese nationalist'; it's actually quite pathetic.
 * You've only said one thing half-right: 'Han-Chinese ever settled (sic) foothold in Manchuria'. Well, they settled there after the Qing dynasty fell, so you're not completely right. 219.89.55.235 (talk) 09:37, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

Map
I added the same map here I added for the other prefecture-level divisions, though I saw there was one here before. Feel free to change if you feel my map is worse, though personally I value conformity when it comes to map standards. It just looks better, IMO (with conformity). Also, there were some differences as to the Korean names in the two tables. Anyone who actually knows a bit of Korean, please correct if wrong.Maggern87 (talk) 15:27, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

Can someone add the history of Yanbian before Ming dynasty?
Chinese wiki includes the history of this region that started from pre-historical era. Both Mongolian Yuan and Jurchen Jin dynasty had history of governing this region. Can someone please add/translate this part? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.33.81.62 (talk) 05:51, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Yanbian Korean Autonomous Prefecture. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110720131853/http://tris.yanbian.gov.cn/ to http://tris.yanbian.gov.cn/

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 12:36, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

"West Korea" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect West Korea and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 February 23 until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. feminist (talk) 16:32, 23 February 2022 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Nianfo

Untitled
It seems to me that the Japanese word Nembutsu is much better attested in English than the modern Chinese word Nianfo, even if the modern Japanese term derives from a Chinese original. I would suggest placing this entry under Nembutsu. Charmii 02:36, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * True, but the Chinese originally coined the term, so it's probably sensible to leave it at that. Still, I see what you're seeing.  --Ph0kin (talk) 13:54, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I am also more familiar with "nembutsu" than "nianfo", but as the scholarship around Pure Land Buddhism has improved in the last 15 years, nianfo is an increasingly used term, so it would make sense to continue aligning with that. --Ph0kin (talk) 23:52, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

Vietnamese pronunciation
I believe the Vietnamese pronunciation is "a zee da fut", and is true for all dialects, but I'd appreciate if someone could confirm. I learned it in college-courses, but it's been a long time, and I only know Northern Dialect. --Ph0kin (talk) 13:54, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 1 one external link on Nianfo. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20120213084251/http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/roger8789/article?mid=2068&sc=1 to http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/roger8789/article?mid=2068&sc=1

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers.—cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 11:17, 8 February 2016 (UTC)

External links modified (February 2018)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Nianfo. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150521183524/http://www.bdkamerica.org/digital/dBET_ThreePureLandSutras_2003.pdf to http://www.bdkamerica.org/digital/dBET_ThreePureLandSutras_2003.pdf

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 09:56, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

Pronounciation Link
Is there anyone skilled with adding english pronounciation, under Indian Sanskrit Nianfo it would be great to have it under Namo'mitabhaya buddhaya and namo'mitayuse buddhaya.

Mistake
The correct transcription of the mantra in Sanskrit would be as follows:

"namo'mitābhabuddhāya" — "na mō mi tā bha bu ddhā ya"

1) https://books.google.ru/books?id=CyLiDQAAQBAJ&pg=PT123&lpg=PT123&dq=namo%27mitabhabuddhaya&source=bl&ots=lEVOp9T5kE&sig=ACfU3U2sNPspF1vTmBI16qej1d6cyW1umg&hl=ru&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj9wIDfpZHvAhVyoosKHTn8Ca4Q6AEwA3oECAoQAg#v=onepage&q=namo'mitabhabuddhaya&f=false

2) https://archive.org/stream/in.ernet.dli.2015.264226/2015.264226.The-New_djvu.txt

3) https://archive.org/stream/SanskritLessonsOnAmitabhaSutraInVajraBodhiSeaIssues_201807/Sanskrit%20Lessons%20on%20Amitabha%20Sutra%20in%20Vajra%20Bodhi%20Sea%20Issues_djvu.txt

4) http://www.drbachinese.org/vbs/1_100/vbs25/25_4.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:1FA0:8474:5AB7:0:69:9B51:301 (talk) 09:39, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Changing the title?
Shouldn't the title be the romanised Sanskrit term, not the Chinese term, since the Sanskrit term is older then the Chinese term itself? 203.29.147.127 (talk) 15:05, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

 * It seems to have developed as the basis of a new sect much more in East Asia than in India. Wikipedia follows common usage in English, not what is most theoretically correct (WP:COMMONNAME)... AnonMoos (talk) 00:36, 7 April 2021 (UTC)

Restructuring Article
It seems a lot of people (myself included) have added a lot of great information, but the article's format is a bit scatter-shot, so I've tried to rearrange things into three general categories: practice, origins, and history. This definitely needs further refinement on my part, but given that it's such a broad subject, it's hard to encapsulate all this content into a cohesive narrative. Anyhow, I tried. :-p --Ph0kin (talk) 23:52, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

Further Restructuring
(or, "I Tried, Part 2")

I've attempted to make major rewrites of the "purpose of the nianfo" section in order to provide more balanced views of the different interpretations and practices associated with the nianfo, while minimizing the essay-link tone that got this article flagged. It still needs more work, and admittedly, I had to chop up quite a bit of text to make things flow more smoothly, but I think the banner is no longer warranted and have removed it. --Ph0kin (talk) 06:09, 20 April 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Nianfo


text:
Talk:Yeongdong County

Fair use rationale for Image:Yeongdong.jpg
Image:Yeongdong.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 03:17, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

title: Talk:Yeongdong County


text:
Talk:Yeongju

Isn't Eyngcwu the yale of Yeongju? WhisperToMe 05:29, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

 * No, that would be Yengcwu. -Sewing - talk 13:55, 8 Sep 2004 (UTC)

title: Talk:Yeongju


text:
Talk:Yi I

Untitled
This article on a truly important Korean is in need of references. 64.229.149.239 21:51, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Comment by User:Mark A. Peterson
moved from main page

In the table to the right Yi I has his name listed under two romanizations: in the revised system, it is correct as: I I. In the McCune-Reischauer table it is liste INCORRECTLY as I I. The title of the article, the biography, is Yi I, which is the McCune-Reischauer standard. The table should be corrected from I I, it should be Yi I.

 * Indeed, "Yi" is widely used (and widely used in the Revised system as well), which is why it's reflected in the article title. However, it does not appear to have official status, and so here and elsewhere it is not reflected in the name table.  -- Visviva 07:29, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

 * “Actually [李] is pronounced in the standard dialect and should be Romanized I, but some may prefer to retain the older Romanization, Yi, because that is already the familiar form. In any case the other Romanizations of 李, Ri and Li, should not be used.”—McCune, Reischauer
 * (Emphasis mine.) As I understand the above quote, McCune and Reischauer say that while the McCune-Reischauer romanisation is I, some may prefer to use Yi, which – unlike Ri and Li – would be all right, but wouldn't be McCune-Reischauer. Wikipeditor 13:25, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject class rating
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 04:37, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 one external links on Yi I. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20110614035130/http://www.ekoreajournal.net/upload/html/HTML43412.html to http://www.ekoreajournal.net/upload/html/HTML43412.html
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20110614035130/http://www.ekoreajournal.net/upload/html/HTML43412.html to http://www.ekoreajournal.net/upload/html/HTML43412.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at ).

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 16:01, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

title: Talk:Yi I


text:
Talk:Solar energy

Analysis of solar energy for project work
Solar energy 117.206.251.165 (talk) 08:48, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

Duplication with solar power
Currently, solar power as a higher quality article is both redundant and losing viewership, as "solar energy" is a more popular term than "solar power". This article should talk about energy from the Sun in general, not just about it as electricity. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 17:02, 6 November 2022 (UTC)

 * Good idea - I suggest you go ahead. Also maybe the photovoltaics section should be removed. Chidgk1 (talk) 17:39, 10 November 2022 (UTC)
 * @CactiStaccingCrane December views show this continues. I tried removing photovoltaics from here - don’t know if that will make a difference Chidgk1 (talk) 09:27, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Moved a para from lead to Solar_power Chidgk1 (talk) 09:34, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Maybe floating solar and solar aircraft should be moved elsewhere? If so where? Chidgk1 (talk) 09:40, 6 January 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Research Process and Methodology - FA22 - Sect 201 - Thu
— Assignment last updated by Ruizhouruizhou (talk) 13:24, 5 December 2022 (UTC)

Sunlight للطاقة المتجددة
More information for the solar energy systems in Egypt.

The main difference between poly crystalline panels and mono crystalline panels? Ans: the main difference is the panel efficiency, mono crystalline efficiency have reached 23%.

Sunlight solar energy is Sol agent for Quantum Solar and the importer for Ja solar in Egypt for more than 5 years صن لايت للطاقة المتجددة الوكيل الحصرة لشركة Quantum Solar و مستورد معتمد لشركة JA solar فى مصر لاكثر من 5 سنوات. 2C0F:FC89:108:BB5F:4C48:29D5:7416:EEB7 (talk) 14:41, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

 * Talk:Energy in Egypt or Talk:Solar panel might be a better place for you to suggest changes but please first read Conflict of interest Chidgk1 (talk) 19:54, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Solar energy


text:
Talk:Yoido Full Gospel Church

Move
This page should be restored to Yoido Full Gospel Church, per our standing naming conventions, which prefer customary romanizations (where they exist) over strict RR or MR. Unfortunately I made a mistake when attempting to undo the initial move, which is why the page is now at a title which is not correct by any standard. Sorry! Hopefully this will be fixed soon. -- Visviva 08:53, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

 * I agree. Regardless of the ROK spelling conventions, YOIDO is the name used on the international correspondence/letterhead of the church (I know, because I've corresponded with it myself). I have restored the original spelling, thank you very much.  David Cannon 11:46, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

Mr not Dr
Please remove all references to Dr. Cho and change to Mr. Cho. To be styled as "Dr" it is necessary to have received an accredited Doctorate/Phd. It appears that Mr. Cho does not, I do realize that "Dr." in Korea is often used as a term of respect however in the English language section it is misleading. Mr. Cho on his published biography states that he received 2 (non-honorary) degrees. One from Bethany Bible college and the other from California Graduate School of Theology. Bethany Bible college is not accredited to issue any Doctorate degrees (Only up to Masters level) and is listed by the California Schools and Universities Accrediting authority, Western Association of Schools and Colleges (WASC) http://www.wascsenior.org/wasc/ as "Accreditation continued-warning issued" The California Graduate School of Theology is not listed by WASC as being accredited at all. Regional Accrediting Authorities can be found at the Department of Education website http://www.ed.gov/admins/finaid/accred/accreditation_pg7.html

'''Someone has a disagreement with this and keeps undoing this change. Before you undo this again could you please comment and say why you are doing it i.e. why refer to David Cho as Dr if he does not have any accredited PHD remembering that an honourary doctorate does not entitle the person to be refered to as Dr. Here is Mr. Cho's self published biography/profile on the Yoido Full Gospel Church wedsite'''

While it is true the Rev. Cho does not have a doctorate, it is inappropriate to address him as Mr. The appropriate title would be Pastor Choe or Rev. Choe.

'''I dont think there is any reason to edit the title of this section. In fact there is no reason to ever edit any discussion section as this is just a discussion - after all, it would be impossible to edit a verbal discussion. The subject title here refers to the original discussion about someone insisting that Mr. Cho be refered to as "Dr". This was misleading.'''

Please be aware that anyone can start a company and register its name as, for example, "The Waltern University" and carry on an educational business. You could then start awarding Doctorates - but that person would not be untitled to use Dr. as a term of address because it is misleading. The term of address "Dr." implies an accademic Doctorate. Each countries educational accreding authority keeps control of this - otherwise the terms would be meaningless. (E.g. the cost of company registration in my area is about USD 110 so for the cost of a 110 Dollars I could start my own University and award myself a Doctorate).

As for the term "Pastor" see the wikipedia section - this was a creative term for missionaries to avoid offence. As for the term "reverend" this term has only until recently been used solely as a term of honour for Anglican church dignatories - as in for example " the reverend John Smith Vicar of Smallvilliage". It is an honorific in the same style as "his grace Whateveverhisnameis the Duke of Westminster". This because of the religions age, "reverend" for an Anglican Vicar and "Father" for a Catholic Priest. However all this being considered "Pastor" and "Reverend" are never included on any official documents whilst "Dr." is allowed and has a recognised meaning. These days anyone can set up their own church in the same way a company can be set up.

850,000 Members. Not accurate, regardless who says it
Yoido has hovered around a very respectable 250,000 members for many years now. They count all present and past members in their 850,000 number, not actual current members. To change this lofty number would only cause them to lose face. I wish they would own up to the actual number of current members in the church today and not do this. It discredits them in my opinion. They're still the largest church in the world though... with a not-so-close second of 160,000 in San Salvador (Elim Church). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.251.209.183 (talk) 04:33, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

title: Talk:Yoido Full Gospel Church


text:
Estado Novo

There have been two regimes known as Estado Novo (meaning "New State"):

 * Estado Novo (Portugal), or Second Republic, the Portuguese authoritarian regime between 1933 and 1974
 * Estado Novo (Brazil), the period from 1937 to 1945, under the leadership of Getúlio Vargas

title: Estado Novo


text:
Talk:Claves

Origin
Claves were originally hardwood roller bearings used in the hubs of wooden cart wheels. I was taught to hold claves with the first clave floating on the top of an open fist. It touched only the end of the index finger and the crotch of the thumb. My Flatley (talk) 23:55, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Claves = palitos?
Are claves and palitos the same? Mikkalai 18:54, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * I think they may be. Possible merge. Jason Quinn (talk) 16:04, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Clave or Claves?
Is "claves" plural or singular? It feels as if one clave is a wooden dowel, while the instrument consists of two claves, hence "claves". Han-Kwang (talk) 14:18, 20 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * In Spanish, where the name comes from, clave is singular and claves is plural. The plural form is often used, of course, because the claves normally come in pairs. So, you're correct. [See RAE (definition 10) (the definition is given for the singular form, but it notes that the word is usually used in plural) and also the Spanish Wikipedia entry ] --Jonik 18:00, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Removing of rhythm
I suggest to remove the image of the clave rhythm from this page because this rhythm is described in the article about the clave_(rhythm) and isn't actually a description for the instrument. --Melligem 13:03, 16 October 2005 (UTC)

I agree, so have got rid of it. As well as not really being relevant, its description was incomplete, and if completed, it would have been simply repeating the article on clave (rhythm). --Pscholl 21:43, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Shouldn't there be a link to that page then? --Goldencrisp87 19:26, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

There already is - it's in the second paragraph. --Pscholl 23:00, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Another Picture
I highly reccomend a picture of someone holding claves.

Cut out waffle
This reads like it is a wholesale cut and paste from someones PHd thesis complete with notation of references which don't lead anywhere in this article Could do with a lot of cutting to make it readable. Freddythehat 16:04, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

cut superfluous info
I cut this.. it would be better placed on his bio page. >>Ortiz, Cuba's foremost authority on ethnographic and anthropological studies, was perhaps the only scholar to catalog the island's hundreds of musicological innovations and instruments, the clave among them. The result was a five-volume compilation, published over a period of three years (1952-55), which remains unparalleled in the world of Afro-Caribbean musicology.>> Freddythehat 19:04, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

more cuts
This bit belongs in an article on the history of cuban music more generally: >>>>However, there has never been a comprehensive musicological study of the clave's diverse and multi-faceted parameters, particularly within the last several decades, which have seen numerous developments since Ortiz's research was published. Perhaps the most significant factors impacting the clave's evolution are linked to geographic and political events within recent years, the most obvious being the Cuban Revolution, which undoubtedly shaped the musical events of several hemispheres. The influence of Cuban music throughout the world may be witnessed on a variety levels, particularly its most fundamental yet most complex level: its rhythm. The Cuban clave has evolved on a multitude of levels, bringing with it a full range of musicological and even sociological questions which often create more confusion than necessary. It is the author's wish that this endeavor will help to "demystify" the clave's role, both within the structural components of Afro-Cuban music as well as its impact on other world musics. It is important to this study, therefore, to place the developments of Cuban rhythmic structures and the clave, in particular, within a chronological as well as a global context as we approach the twenty-first century.

But before launching into this study of the clave, it is important to recognize several factors pertaining to Cuba's historical, cultural and musical development, which will shed some light as to the clave's place in the music world. Perhaps the most accurate and concise view is summarized in John Storm Roberts' seminal work, The Latin Tinge:

Taken as a whole, Cuban music presents a more equal balance of African and Spanish ingredients than that of any other Latin country except Brazilian. Spanish folklore enriched the music of the countryside, of the city, and of the salon. At the same time, aided by an illicit slave trade that continued right through the 19th century , the pure African strain remained stronger in Cuba than anywhere else. As a result, western African melody and drumming, and even the Yoruba [and other African] language, were brought cheek by jowl with country music based on Spanish ten-line décima verses and southern Spanish [flamenco] melody. The co-existence of European and African rhythmic, melodic, and harmonic procedures led, of course, to their blending, and that blending took place at the most profound level.>>>>> Freddythehat 11:19, 19 February 2007 (UTC) WAFFLEZ

title: Talk:Claves


text:
User talk:MooseDigits~enwiki

Dear MooseDigits!

Thank you! Drbug 18:56, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Your account will be renamed
Hello,

The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called MooseDigits. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name MooseDigits~enwiki that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name. If you think you might own all of the accounts with this name and this message is in error, please visit Special:MergeAccount to check and attach all of your accounts to prevent them from being renamed.

Your account will still work as before, and you will be credited for all your edits made so far, but you will have to use the new account name when you log in.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 01:57, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
 This account has been renamed as part of single-user login finalisation. If you own this account you can |log in using your previous username and password for more information. If you do not like this account's new name, you can choose your own using this form after logging in: . -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 16:33, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:MooseDigits~enwiki


text:
Talk:Gothic metal

The article is contradictory
This article has a huge contradiction. In the beginning and the "Characteristics" section the gothic metal genre is decribed as a subgenre of death-doom with corresponding features. However, later Evanescence, HIM and Nightwish are introduced despite having 0% death-doom influence. So you should either remove the mention of death-doom and bands that play in this style (real gothic metal) completely, or remove the pseudo gothic metal bands and create a separate article for them. The way this page looks now is unacceptable and misleading. The sentence that is started with "Other variations include" doesn't have any sources. 5.18.243.129 (talk) 21:38, 21 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Because none of these bands are Gothic metal, and the article is ridiculously bad. Beaumain (talk) 20:34, 14 July 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 19:21, 21 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Amy Lee 2.jpg

First usage of the "Gothic Metal" label
Citing Gavin Baddeley - a reasonably informed source - the article's "Etymology" section opens by stating that the "gothic metal" tag was first used with Paradise Lost's 1991 "Gothic" album. That's actually incorrect. There is a headline from an August 1990 The Morning Call article that reads: "ON TOUR, GOTHIC METAL BAND DANZIG USUALLY GOES IT ALONE". Here's the source:. I think that should be mentioned in the article. Musicaindustrial (talk) 12:46, 17 May 2020 (UTC)

 * The term already appeared in 1985 in connection with the band 45 Grave. Could be older. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.70.206.102 (talk) 06:41, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

Were the "Peaceville Three" the true pioneers of Gothic Metal?
It appears to be common knowledge that Paradise Lost initiated gothic metal with Gothic - female vocals, the orchestral flourishes, the goth rock influence - but it was really with 1993's Icon that the blueprint of goth metal was laid. The other two british death-doom bands, My Dying Bride and Anathema, soon followed suit. What I rarely see in articles about goth metal metal's history is that roots of the style were actually in goth bands - specifically Fields of the Nephilim, Sisters of Mercy & Christian Death - making metal-like songs rather than metal bands going goth. An example? Field of the Nephilim's 1988 track "Phobia" sounds a lot like Motörhead's "Ace of Spades":. To be fair, this Wikipedia briefly mentions this. My suggestion: write something about this in the opening paragraphs, before talking about the so-called "Peaceville Three" as the pionners of the subgenre. Musicaindustrial (talk) 14:08, 17 May 2020 (UTC)
 * The Gathering (Always, 1992) and Type O Negative (Bloody Kisses, august 1993) both released gothic metal albums before Icon (september 1993). Tiamat released Wildhoney in 1994, and in 1995, when the other two "followed suit", there were already Inferno by Lacrimosa and Theatre of Tragedy by Theatre of Tragedy. Looks like it's "common knowledge" to just ignore anyone who's not british death-doom. Beaumain (talk) 20:06, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
 * You also had Saviour Machine's Saviour Machine I released in August 1993, and the band itself formed in 1989 , . All of this can be added, just make sure that it's backed up with references.--3family6 (Talk to me | See what I have done ) 22:12, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

Lot of bands are missing...
...and a shit load of crap bands dominates the article. Cradle of Filth? Not Goth metal. Evanescence? Not Goth metal. HIM? I'm really not a fan of bad jokes...
 * Cradle of Filth is basically a symphonic black metal band with occasional gothic songs (such as Nymphetamine, Death of Love or The Persecution Song). To them, it seems, these songs serve the same purpose as power ballads for heavy metal bands. Beaumain (talk) 08:00, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Gothic metal


text:
Talk:Johann Christian Bach

Three operas?
It says that... ''In 1762, Bach travelled to London to première three operas at the King's Theatre, including Orione on 19 February 1763. ''

Other sources claim that he actually wrote two operas while at the King's Theatre. I know that Orione and Zanaida were written there, but does anyone know what could've been the third opera?

Thanks, Anonymous.

WHOA!
Ridiculously long list of meaningless words hidden under the words "Work List"! Oh no!

Really, to be serious, this needs to be cleaned up and the "Work List" moved to a separate page, and, keeping with Wikipedia tradition, called something like "List of works by J. C. Bach".

It's discouraging to readers (like myself!) to see an intimidatingly long list of works that are not even hyperlinked. There should be more information about musical style/aesthetic and cultural importance.

-Anonymous

Suggestion
From a skimming comparison between the first version of this article, which was based on the 1911 EB, and the entry in The New Grove Dictionary of Music & Musicians, there doesn't appear to be any factual errors here, unlike many other articles based on the 1911 EB. I did remove this POV statement:

 * His works, though elegant and pleasing, were ephemeral in character and have been largely forgotten.

Other than that, my editing was a matter of expanding the article based on what I read in the Grove. Dmetric 18:58, 5 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Mozart's 12th concerto?
Someone recently added a statement that "Mozart composed his Piano Concerto No. 12 in A Major as a tribute to Bach, his music and his importance to Mozart's own work. The Andante second movement of this concerto consists of a series of variations on a theme by Bach."

I'd like to see what that's based on. The books I've read indicate that there is a casual resemblance between the 2nd movement of K. 414's theme and one of J.C.'s overtures (which may have been intentional--or may not have been), but what was written into the article makes it sound to me like Mozart is depicted writing a formal tribute to J.C. Bach. As far as I know, that just didn't happen. Can anyone help with sourcing? Thanks. --MollyTheCat 00:46, 24 July 2005 (UTC)

 * Well, one thing - series of variations?? It's an abridged sonata-form/ternary-form, as Mozart uses in many of his concerto slow movements.  It's not even a loose set of variations of the Elgar Enigma sense. Lacks the feel.  That said, I believe most if not all of the evidence for the slow movement being a tribute to JC Bach lies in the younger composer's friendship with the older, his having remarked on hearing of JC Bach's death that it was a sad day for music, and the similarity (I'll look up the overture - written by JC Bach in 1763 for the revival of La Calamità dei Cuori by Galuppi; the first bars of its slow movement, andante grazioso, in D, this information from Girdlestone's Mozart and his Piano Concertos, Dover repub) but I gather it's fairly close, as later between the incipit of the finale of KV 526 and a theme from a work of CF Abel) between the two themes.  I don't know of any stronger evidence though. Schissel : bowl listen 02:26, July 24, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for your comments, Schissel. I have now edited this section in a way I can live with, also removing the mention of "variations" based on your comments. The last straw was looking at the New Grove Mozart and seeing:
 * "The main theme of the Andante quotes, not necessarily intentionally, an overture by J.C. Bach (to La calamità dei cuori, 1763, published 1770); the music's elegiac character has led to its being interpreted as an act of homage to J.C. Bach, who had lately died" (--Stanley Sadie, The New Grove Mozart, NY: Norton, 1983, ISBN 0393300846, p. 103).

Since I don't know what "source" if any the person who tossed this in used, but I do know what Stanley Sadie (a noted Mozart scholar) says is reliable, I have adapted the article text accordingly. --MollyTheCat 13:10, 20 August 2005 (UTC)

What does this mean?
I'd like to reword the following, if I could figure out what the author was trying to say:

 * Pop culture (in this case London musical critics and scholars) can shape history very easily. Men like Haydn deserve their great fame, but geniuses such as Johann Christian tend to suffer in the wake. The proof of this is in the concert halls across America and other countries; they are filled with the grand music of Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, and more, but lacking in composers like Johann Christian Bach.

I can grasp the ending, but what "pop culture" and "London musical critics and scholars" have to do with this is utterly beyond me. Anyone have any ideas?

Also, does anyone have a source for the "90" symphonies attributed to J.C. in the current state of the article? This number seems rather high. -MollyTheCat 04:28, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

 * The problem with the paragraph quoted above no longer exists, thanks to Adambiswanger1, who did an excellent rewrite. -MollyTheCat 16:11, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Why Catholicism?
Do we know why he converted to Catholicism? AdamBiswanger1 23:29, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure the exact reason is known. It did not happen until after J.C.'s move to Italy; I had thought I read something about it being related to his successful pursuit of the position of organist at Milan Cathedral (there were two organist positions). But on looking at The New Grove Bach Family (p. 316), I see that he was received into the Roman Catholic faith in 1757, but did not become organist till 1760. So career could have been a factor, but then again he did not switch back to Protestantism when he went to England, where it would have been to his advantage to do so. Perhaps there was something of a wish to distance himself from his father at work here (in religion as well as in musical style and delving into opera, which none of the other Bachs ever touched), but we can only speculate. --MollyTheCat 01:50, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

 * Perhaps someday in a flurry of motivation I'll run to the library and take out some books relating to JCB and answer our questions. AdamBiswanger1 02:43, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

"90" Symphonies?
I would like to point out in the works list, the lack of inclusion of works published for harp or harp as well as keyboard in his time, that is to say, the additional instrumentation. This makes research very difficult for harpists. We have six concerti, and a Sinfonia Concertante recently published, at the least. All instrumentations should be included, even if publisher's designations, as it was the practice of the time and ever since. S.D.

Above I questioned the count of J.C. Bach's symphonies as approximately 90. I have now counted the ones in the The New Grove Bach Family work list for J.C. (symphonies on pp. 345-7), and found the following:

 * Number of entries for authentic symphonies: 48
 * Number of entries in "doubtful" classification: 43

This gives a rough total of 91, but the authentic grouping includes some duplications of symphonies published in slightly different editions or versions, and the doubtful group includes some works very unlikely to be authentic, including many symphonies attributed to various other composers.

A rewrite of the relevant passage of the article is therefore in order, but the reference is entangled with a lot of stuff comparing J.C.'s symphonies to Joseph Haydn's on the basis of how many symphonies each wrote. Most of these comparisons probably should be tossed as they are now seen to be bogus (since 90 authentic symphonies by J.C. do not exist), but maybe someone can think of a way to rewrite this that would keep what is really informational and edit out what is not. -MollyTheCat 09:47, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

 * I have now done a thorough rewrite of the so-called "Acclamation" section, renaming it "J.C. Bach and the Symphony" and revamping it considerably. I had to throw out a lot of the bogus comparisons to Haydn since they don't hold water, and give a rough idea of how their comparative symphonies are different. I welcome comments and further improvements. -MollyTheCat 09:32, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Galant music and J. C. Bach
J. C. Bach was not a typical galant composer and, I think, his style should not be evaluated by reverting to that of galant music in general- his music contains not only delicacy and clear lines but also drama (in his chamber works more often than his orchestral, that I've found- at least one oboe quartet, a two-piano work, for example, in their first movements more than their more typical minuet finales. And of course his C minor keyboard sonatas- from opp. 5 and 17- are famous attempts to combine styles- as was attempted often, it's true- before Mozart did so much more successfully and with fewer seams.) Schissel | Sound the Note! 18:27, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Schissel, your point is well taken. Since the article originated in the 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica's entry for J.C. Bach, it's possible that some of the outdated appraisals that you note are hold-overs from that source. As shown in my edit noted in the "'90' Symphonies?" topic above, this article continues to benefit from rewrites.-MollyTheCat 09:32, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

From queen's music master to pauper
Can someone add what happened to JCB's fortunes that he ended up a pauper? The article jumps from queen's music master to burial in a pauper's grave. thanks. Delmlsfan 03:16, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Music Festival?
The article doesn't mention the festival J.C. Bach started. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.235.174.73 (talk) 18:37, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

The Bach-Abel concerts? Schissel | Sound the Note! 07:58, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Symphony op. 18/2?
One of the more often-recorded symphonies, the double-orchestra symphony opus 18/2 in B-flat major, is not listed. True, opus 18 no. 2 is also given to a violin sonata- that's one of the main reason why one uses catalog numbers, not opus numbers, when one can; I don't know the WCno. of the symphony, or its history, such information not being common knowledge for JC Bach as it often is for better-known composers by now (consider this problem when it arises with opus nos. & Pa. nos. for Krommer!) ... - but is the symphony there in fact, just somewhere "else"? Schissel | Sound the Note! 07:58, 2 January 2009 (UTC) (Oh- that's the Adriano in Siria ov., isn't it...)

Wrong Picture Credits
The credit given for the portrait is wrong. It is not in the Museo Civico, Bologna as stated. In fact, that 1776 portrait of JC by Thomas Gainsborough is hanging in Room 12 at the National Portrait Gallery in London. Its catalogue number is NPG 5557. You can see it here

Prustage (talk) 12:44, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

 * The confusion stems from these two images:
 * Johann Christian Bach.jpeg File:Johann Christian Bach.jpeg turns right, looks left, Museo Civico
 * Johann Christian Bach by Thomas Gainsborough.jpg File:Johann Christian Bach by Thomas Gainsborough.jpg turns left, looks right, National Portrait Gallery
 * It seems to me that the source information on #1 is wrong and that that image has been flipped. If so, that should be noted at Commons. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 05:25, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Johann Christian Bach. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160304051930/http://www.pianosociety.com/cms/index.php?section=1860 to http://www.pianosociety.com/cms/index.php?section=1860
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070921141643/http://www.earlymusicworld.com/id1.html to http://www.earlymusicworld.com/id1.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 17:32, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

Misattribution of Harpsichord Concerto recordings
After a ton of research, including consulting Bach experts and German libraries, it has been conclusively shown that a 1960’s recording by the Angelicum Orchestra of Milan,(first released on Harmonia Mundi, then Odyssey, and others, mis-identified two Concertos, (C minor and G major), as by J.C.Bach. C minor is actually by J. W. Hertel and the G Major is by Georg Anton Benda. The error may have been the result of two things:

1) No access by the West to pertinent materials kept behind the Iron Curtain.

2) The “discovery” of a set of parts which had the name “G.C.F. Bach” attached. My speculation is that communication between the (Western), scholar, (DeNys), and the Conductor, (Cattini), broke down, resulting in the omission of the “F” in the believed composers name. Doelrich (talk) 21:33, 31 May 2020 (UTC)
 * See response at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Composers. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 07:31, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Children
I was really surprised to learn about how many Children that Bach had. Mitchellwagg (talk) 20:20, 4 February 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: 19th Century Concert Life
— Assignment last updated by Jmares3218 (talk) 03:40, 12 May 2023 (UTC)

Infobox proposal
I'd like to propose that the following infobox (or something similar) be added to the article. Feel free to propose adjustments and improvements to the proposal. Thanks, Cremastra (talk) 21:44, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

 * And cue the same arguments made 50 times over and over at other pages. ♫ Melodia Chaconne ♫ (talk) 05:52, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
 * (sound of crickets) 🎄Cremastra 🎄 (talk) 23:20, 27 December 2023 (UTC)
 * I like the idea. Spouse looks not notable. Image caption might end after the year. Fell free to implement, - you waited long enough, Cremastra. - I boldly made some fixed: no link to capital London, remove Germany which didn't exist in this sense until centuries later, made dates European. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:02, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Classic and Romantic Music History
— Assignment last updated by Megankaustin86 (talk) 04:57, 30 January 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Johann Christian Bach


text:
Chester College of New England

Chester College of New England was a bachelor's degree-granting college that provided a foundation in the liberal arts and the fine arts, complemented by majors in the professional arts. It opened in 1965 as White Pines College and closed at the end of the 2011-2012 academic year for financial reasons.

Located in Chester, New Hampshire, the college offered degree programs in creative writing, professional writing, photography and media arts, graphic design, computer science, fine arts, communication arts and interdisciplinary arts. Chester College also offered minor programs in creative writing, illustration, photojournalism, and writing. The college featured a student-to-faculty ratio of 10:1, artist-in-residence programs, and a program of guest lectures, exhibitions, art and photography exhibits, internships, and relationships with professional associations.

In April 2012 the college disclosed an operating deficit. Despite fundraising efforts, in May 2012, the college's board of trustees announced that they had voted to close the college.

History
The college was founded in 1965 as White Pines College by Faith Preston, Ed.D. The first class was admitted in 1967.

The name of the school was changed in 2002, under Dr. William Nevious, third president of the college. Around this time, the college expanded from a 2-year program to a 4-year college with an emphasis on the arts. Nevious was credited with growth and transformation of the college during his presidency. "Dr. Nevious took this college, which was literally on its death bed, and revived it," said Fred Kocher, a member of the college's board of trustees.

On June 30, 2007, Nevious stepped down as the college's president after six years. Former Manchester mayor Robert Baines was named interim president. Baines served as president of the college until he and the board of trustees decided to close the school in 2012. Prior to the closure of the school the faculty and staff of the college arranged a vote of no confidence against Baines. Baines remained as president until the official closing.

New England College and the New Hampshire Institute of Art (NHIA) each offered to accept Chester students as transfers after the college's closure. Over 80% of the students chose to transfer to NHIA, as did several faculty members.

The campus was sold in 2015 to Jiahui Education, which inaugurated a summer program in 2016 as Busche Academy for elementary and middle-school aged students from China.

Visiting Artists and Writers Series
The college's Visiting Artists and Writers Series welcomed artists and authors to lecture, sit in on classes, and host readings and gallery exhibits. Notable authors included Steve Almond, Nicholson Baker, Mary Gaitskill, Jennifer Haigh, Sharon Olds, George Saunders, and Michelle Tea. Notable visual artists included Henry Horenstein and Pipo Nguyen-duy.

title: Chester College of New England