text:
Template talk:ja-see

"For a list of all kanji with on'yomi えい, not just those used in Sino-Japanese terms, see [...]"
What about linking to Category:Japanese kanji with on reading えい? —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 04:55, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

そほづ
This page doesn't have any categories added by the template . DTLHS (talk) 14:31, 22 April 2019 (UTC)
 * solved; just forgot to put an "h" to . ～ POKéTalker（═◉═） 21:19, 22 April 2019 (UTC)
 * "h" is no longer needed :) --Dine2016 (talk) 06:10, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

historical kana spellings
Do you think showing the historical kana spelling in (e.g. ) is a good idea? I'm afraid casual readers may mistake it as the katakana spelling or the (modern) pronunciation of the term, but I don't know any better way to place it. --Dine2016 (talk) 06:10, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

 * Hm, perhaps it is inappropriate if ja-see is supposed to be simple. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 06:15, 26 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Actually the template would look much clearer if the whole header (しらかわよふね〔シラカハヨフネ〕【白河夜船・白川夜船・白川夜舟】) got removed:

 * The header were added solely to distinguish between words in rare cases like this:

 * What about removing the header when there is only one matching word and displaying the headers when there is more than one? --Dine2016 (talk) 06:42, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

 * I don't have a particular opinion. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 06:50, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

Category:Japanese terms with usage examples
, see かんじざいぼさつ for 観自在菩薩. The Category:Japanese terms with usage examples should not be in kana spelling form of the kanji entry, is this intentional? ～ POKéTalker（═◉═） 22:58, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Um..., when I wrote, I was influenced by western linguistics, which regarded the spoken language as the language and the written language a mere encoding of it. Given this view, かんじざいぼさつ and 観自在菩薩 denoted the same term, and since that term had an usage examples, it followed that かんじざいぼさつ and 観自在菩薩 would both be Category:Japanese terms with usage examples. What distinguished the two was that 観自在菩薩 belonged to Category:Japanese spellings with usage examples while かんじざいぼさつ did not.
 * However, it seems that Wiktionary doesn't distinguish spellings from terms, so I wouldn't object to removing that category. (It's easy, just remove

elseif a == 'ja-usex' or a:find('^quote') then -- special hack return '{{=' .. b
 * and add  to   from Module:ja-parse.) --Dine2016 (talk) 11:42, 18 August 2019 (UTC)

Should we consider using Template:ja-see for romaji entries as well?
This template provides much more useful information to the user than the older. Should we consider using in romaji entries, instead of ?

If readers of this page support this idea, then would need a bit of reworking. Here's an example of what looks like on romaji entries. The template now states that the romaji form is an "alternative" spelling.

Also, if we decide to proceed with this idea, considering the kerfuffle from last time when we tried a few iterations of, we should probably broach the topic at WT:BP or WT:GP. ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 22:34, 28 August 2019 (UTC)

 * I don't think so. The very first reason I created was because the older format for kana soft-redirects,

Noun

 * 1)  A reading pattern for certain kanji compound words, using the Chinese-derived on'yomi for the first kanji, and the native Japanese kun'yomi for the second kanji.

 * duplicated content (POS, definition, category) from the lemma entry. The current format for rōmaji,

Romanization

 * does not duplicate any content, so there is no reason to replace it with when the current format does a good job. --Dine2016 (talk) 01:35, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Granted, reducing data duplication is a good motive, and does an excellent job of that.
 * I realize I wasn't very clear on my main motivation for bringing this up for romaji entries: usability. The current approach with  is poor usability, in that it presents the user with nearly no information, and it requires the user to click through two different entries (the links on the romaji entry, and then the links on the kana entry) before arriving at the desired main entry.  I think it would be much more useful and user-friendly to do something at least similar to, by providing users with entry information already on the romaji page, without having to click through -- and if they want to see a full entry, have the romaji page provide direct links, rather than the indirect link to the kana entry, where the user would have to click through again.
 * Perhaps itself isn't the correct template for the job for romaji entries.  Would you be supportive of something similar?  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 04:09, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Rōmaji could use a similar idea to that for kyūjitai entries (c.f. Talk:天道蟲), namely to simply point to the kana form (in source code) and have the template find the lemma (by fixing double redirects). But it needs to filter the result once again. For example, after fetches content from  and fixes double redirects, it should discard words like  as well as POS like the "proper noun" part of, which are romanized differently. (Well, kyūjitai also needs to filter the result once again, if the words involve ambiguous kanji like .)
 * Alternatively, rōmaji could link to the lemma entries (in source code) directly. The advantage with this approach is that acceleration is faster (After creating, simply make and  point to it, instead of creating a two-level hierarchy). The disadvantage is that homophone lists like , , , ... must be repeated on both  and . --Dine2016 (talk) 06:38, 29 August 2019 (UTC)

 * The inclusion of romaji forms was based on discussions many years ago relating to usability and discoverability. As this is the English Wiktionary, we can safely assume that our readership can read English, which is written in the Latin alphabet (romaji).  We cannot assume that our readership can read kana or kanji.  So if an EN WT user has encountered a Japanese word, possibly in transcription, and they come here to look it up but without being able to input Japanese, the argument went that we still needed some way for them to find the entry.  Since Hepburn is the most common Japanese transcription system used in the English-reading world, this was what we adopted here at Wiktionary (with some tweaks).  That doesn't mean that we cannot include other romaji renderings -- just that we only include modified Hepburn in our "official" links, such as in translation tables, or in entry headword lines, or as the romanization we target with  and similar templates.
 * We specifically don't target 訓令式, as that is the romanization scheme adopted in Japan for Japanese readers, and it has various oddities that make it inappropriate for English readers (like zi not being pronounced, or syu not being pronounced ), and oddities that actually render it deficient for describing Japanese (the inability to transcribe certain sounds, like ファ or ティ).
 * We also specifically don't target ワープロ式, as this isn't a standard so much as a de facto practice with many variations, based on what various input method editors will accept for conversion. For instance, long vowels might be the same vowel twice, or the vowel plus a hyphen.  Various consonantal sounds have multiple representations, with ちゃ renderable as tya, tixya, cha, cya, and possibly more.  ん might be nn, as you note, but even in ワープロ式 it could be a single n or even an m so long as it's followed by a consonant.
 * Again, we have no stricture against the creation of romaji entries based on such alternative spelling conventions, and indeed, if users create such entries, I believe we should keep them, so long as they are properly formatted and redirect the user to the appropriate Japanese entries. However, we do not target these for display in our lemma entries, and in Japanese transliteration (linked to from WT:AJA) we explicitly explain that we use a modified version of Hepburn.
 * Returning to your main question of "why anyone would want to look up modern Japanese terms by rōmaji", it comes down to the basic position that we have no alternatives for how to help English readers find Japanese terms, when they don't know kana or kanji and might not even have a Japanese IME installed. This is the same reason we have romanization entries for Gothic, and why the topic of romanized entries for other scripts keeps coming around from time to time in the Beer Parlor and other discussion pages.  If you have some technical approach that would allow a user to input romaji in either the search bar or the URL and still land on the lemma page (or at least the kana soft-redirect page) corresponding to that romaji string, and somehow that romaji string cannot also be interpreted as a word in another language, then I think we can safely get rid of all of our Japanese romaji entries.  I agree that romaji entries are a cludge, and an inelegant one at that, but we (the EN WT community dealing with JA entries) have not been able to come up with a better approach.  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 17:44, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
 * What about building rōmaji indexes in the Appendix or Index namespace? We can support multiple transcriptions (standard Hepburn, Waapuro Hepburn and Kunrei-shiki) this way.
 * As for mainspace, I have no objections against rōmaji entries as long as they're voluntary and within reasonable bounds. I vehemently opposed them in the posts above because I mistakenly believed they would be given equal weight to kana entries like a writing system. For example, the current entry is already taking up 20 MB of memory. If we transclude or build the same list at i it will probably cause memory error and break the rest of the page. But that's clearly not your intention, and I apologize for that. I should have said "The time for using  for rōmaji entries is not mature" rather than attacking users looking up by rōmaji directly (though I still suspect anime fans may try to find 竜 at "ryuu" and be disappointed).
 * What about this compromise: employ something like in ordinary entries like tentō mushi, but switch back to the older format for entries like "i" once memory limits are breaked? --Dine2016 (talk) 19:40, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Re: multiple romanization schemes in the  or   namespaces, I think that's a wonderful idea.  Theoretically, we could have a separate appendix or index set up for each romanization scheme, with the boilerplate at the top of each such page explaining what the scheme is and (in brief) how it encodes the Japanese kana and/or sound values.  Presumably, so long as each scheme is a regular encoding, this could be programmatically generated?  And we wouldn't need to have existing romaji pages for each word's spelling, like we do for the categories?  I have no idea how to go about implementing something like this, however.
 * Re: using something like for romaji entries that don't have memory issues, I would also welcome that.
 * Good ideas, thank you! ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 21:10, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Good ideas, thank you! ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 21:10, 17 September 2019 (UTC)

inflected forms
Hi everyone. What do you think is the best way to show inflection of alternative spellings?

My initial plan was to make them automatically generated by, on the respective entries of alternative spellings. For example, let's suppose we're soft-redirecting to. In addition to fetching the definitions and categories from, could also fetch the inflectional type (godan verb ending in -su) and inflect the alternative spelling accordingly:

The advantage of this approach is that no extra work is needed, as far as modern spellings are concerned. However, once we start creating kanji spellings involving historical kana such as or, then we need some way to tell the template to use the volitional ending -さう instead of -そう, to keep kana orthography consistent. In other words, the template needs to know whether the current alternative spelling is in modern or historical kana, so that it can supply appropriate inflectional patterns. (Spellings like add additional complexity: if we give modern inflections to  and historical inflections to, then it makes sense to give both to . So there are really three possibilities, not two.)

It might be tempting to add a new parameter to to indicate the kana orthography of the current alternative spelling, but that defeats the purpose of automatically generating the inflection table and is essentially no better than adding  manually. An alternative solution is to mark the kana orthography in the lemma entry, for example via or. I prefer this approach, but I'm not sure which format is better. What do you think?

Alternatively, we could expand the lemma entry directly:

Conjugation of " 言い出す " (See Appendix:Japanese verbs.)

The advantage with this approach is that it is more logical, and users searching alternative spellings of inflected forms is likely to land on the lemma entry directly, with MediaWiki's searching facility. The disadvantage is that the inflection templates must be reworked, and such a format would increase data duplication.

Which approach do you prefer?

--Dine2016 (talk) 11:08, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Both approaches are very interesting, thank you for the efforts. I have no objections. Let's see what other people are going to say. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 11:46, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

 * After briefly looking over the proposal, my only concern at this point is the proposal for expanding the lemma entry's table, particularly in edge cases where a given term might have multiple historical kana spellings. The sample above seems to be able to show two forms side-by-side well enough, but I'm not sure it would scale very well to three, as with  -- modern kana もちいる, historical etymological kana もちゐる, historical technically-misspelling kana もちひる.  There are probably other examples out there as well of terms with multiple historical spellings.  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 19:35, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

 * I'm not sure which one I like yet, but the second one is rather busy. Perhaps newlines would be an improvement. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 04:27, 17 September 2019 (UTC)

 * It seems only users with certain permissions (sysop, autopatrolled, etc.) that could edit with this template (when the whole page is only contains a Japanese entry, I guess). I got this error when trying to edit 除ける:

Errors: If you believe your action was constructive, please inform an administrator of what you were trying to do. A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: strips L3 Marlin Setia1 (talk) 23:43, 14 October 2019 (UTC)
 * This action has been automatically identified as harmful, and therefore disallowed.

 * That's because the template breaches the standard entry layout, which requires alternative spellings be formatted as

Verb

 * The new format with has not been formally recognized.
 * This issue needs to be brought to Grease pit. In the meanwhile, you can try the following instead:

Definitions

 * --Dine2016 (talk) 03:37, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

 * I'm confused -- there isn't any conjugation that should go at, as that is just a soft-redirect alternative form. Any conjugation tables for よける should currently go in the  entry.  The  entry already has almost the simplest form for soft-redirects:

==Japanese==

Etymology 2

 * (It's a bit wonky, as there's  even though there's only one etym on that page right now, and it's missing the のける reading, but anyway. :) )
 * The absolute smallest form for these soft-redirects, for spellings with only one reading, would be something like the following (assuming that 除ける were only read as yokeru):

==Japanese==

 * I'm uncertain how was running into the abuse filter?  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 19:03, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

Sorting on pages using this template
, anyone else interested --

I'm curious if this template / module could be updated to apply sorting. By way of examle, uses, but the 抱っこ entry is currently sorted in Category:Japanese_childish_terms under 抱っこ rather than the expected だっこ. ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 18:05, 7 November 2019 (UTC)
 * I gave it a try, but I still think sortkeys should eventually be eliminated. Sorting だっこ under た and 抱っこ under 抱 (or 扌/手) allows users to look up the same term by either spelling. This may not be obvious for small categories like Category:Japanese childish terms but will make a difference for larger categories with hundreds or thousands of words. But the most important argument against custom sortkeys is that many editors forget it. For example, the editors of the current entry for だっこ forgot to add a sortkey, so that it is sorted under だ instead of the correct た. --Dine2016 (talk) 03:34, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
 * I've asked a few times in a few different fora over the years, both here and on other WM sites, about how to fix sorting for Japanese, and no one seems to know jack shit about how to improve things at the base level, frankly. (That may be my frustration showing.  苦笑)  There was a related thread not long ago asking similar questions about categories for Hungarian, which at least uses the Latin alphabet.  The approach there was to use Lua to customize how sorting happens.  Given the MediaWiki team's complete apathy with regard to some of our basic-functionality needs, perhaps a similar approach, leveraging Module:languages/data2 or some other code, could be applied to Japanese?  (Asking in ignorance of the possible complexity, as I have not understood the current module infrastructure -- IMHO, our module documentation and code comments are pretty horribly lacking...)  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 18:58, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
 * If we use modules then it must be for converting だ to た', 抱 to ⼿05, etc. There is no easy way to convert kanji to kana.
 * MediaWiki categories are unservicable in the first place. The best we can do is to sort kana under kana and kanji under kanji, so that the user can look for terms beginning with むらさき by https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=Category:Japanese_lemmas&from=むらさき, and look for terms beginning with 紫 by https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=Category:Japanese_lemmas&from=紫, but there's no way to look for terms ending with something or do composition (kanji beginning with X and kana beginning with Y, both a verb and obsolete, etc.). And most importantly, there are no way to customize how entries appear in categories, for example to make むらさきいろ appear as "むらさきいろ【紫色】" and 紫色 appear as "紫色（むらさきいろ）". Suzukaze-c thinks that the best way to improve Wiktionary's usability is via some third-party searching function, and this requires Wiktionary data to be machine parseable. Looking at the current entry layout, I don't think it is. And more disappointing is the fact that the community's efforts are wasted in pandering to MediaWiki's deficient facilities (sorting, references, etc.) even when it would burden more complexity on page sources and make them unserviable to other interfaces than MediaWiki. --Dine2016 (talk) 01:26, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Apologies for my lack of clarity; regarding sorting features, what I was envisioning was actually what you propose: for kana, using Lua to deal with the current hackish workarounds of adding  on the end for initial kana with 濁点 and   for initial kana with 半濁点, and for kanji, using Lua to sort by radical + additional stroke count, rather than just sorting by the raw character itself.  Ideally, editors wouldn't have to bother with sortkeys for Japanese at all.  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 07:14, 10 November 2019 (UTC)

New implementation
The new implementation parses the lemma entry in one pass, instead of dividing it by Etymology headers and accepting/rejecting each in an all-or-nothing manner. This means that the following snippet is parsed correctly:

Noun

 * 1) musical note // current list of alt spellings: おたまじゃくし

Noun
But it also means that fewer categories are copied. In fact, only categories from headword lines and definitions are copied, since the new implementation does not make any assumptions of the format of the rest of the entry.
 * 1) tadpole // current list of alt spellings: おたまじゃくし, オタマジャクシ

The new implementation also handles and  in the same manner (as the old ), and their only difference is that the latter speaks of "Sino-Japanese terms" instead of "terms". What about using for both kango and wago, and putting "Sino-Japanese" in the Etymology section? --Nyarukoseijin (talk) 11:26, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I think it is good to unify these 2 temps. I don't think it is quite necessary to clearly distinguish kango from wago in a soft redirect page. -- Huhu9001 (talk) 02:44, 24 March 2020 (UTC)

 * I discovered what might be a failure mode of sorts. See  and .  The call to  on the  page should presumably only pull in the   section from, the section that has  (which I think was also the previous implementation's behavior).  However, what I see on the  page is senses from both etym sections at , which incorrectly gives  the "saint" sense as well.  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 17:44, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Odd rendering at いただきます
, anyone else -- could you please have a look at the いただきます page and suss out why this template isn't working correctly there? I suspect it might be related to the POS header at lemma form 頂きます, but that's just a guess. ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 22:15, 11 June 2020 (UTC)

 * ✅? This made it better somehow. —Suzukaze-c (talk) 04:26, 13 August 2020 (UTC)

Oddness at きかい
Pinging, welcoming anyone else with insight --

Issue
doesn't handle alt spellings very well. If a listed kanji compound is an alternative form entry that is just a stub, it gets placed at the bottom of the list in smaller font:

 * (The following entry is uncreated: .)

I haven't confirmed, but this might affect too.

Background
I just had a go at and, lemmatizing at. The other two use. The two kanji entries are rendering as expected. However, has the  (the stub entry) at the bottom, stating that it hasn't been created yet.

Ideas
I've found that this happens if can't find an alt spelling or a kana spelling. I'm not sure of the best way of adding it to a stub entry; has, so we could presumably add  , but that feels weird since this isn't really an "alternative" spelling, strictly speaking, and listing kana in the "alternative spellings" box looks odd. I also and it didn't seem to work, so if we decide to go with this approach, it would require a change to, and possibly.

Looking forward to your input.

‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 18:24, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

 * I don't understand the code, but my guess is that it calls 機械 'uncreated' because there isn't really content— just ja-see. —Suzukaze-c (talk) 20:22, 22 September 2020 (UTC)
 * (I still don't really understand, but following variables, it seems to call it 'uncreated' because there aren't any definitions— and ja-see isn't a definition. —Suzukaze-c (talk) 20:25, 22 September 2020 (UTC))
 * I'll echo Suzukaze's guess.
 * To add to that, in combination with Dine2016's notes at User talk:Eirikr, is that is not intended to point to entries that amount to little more than stubs as alternative spellings, which is effectively what  is.
 * I didn't understand the intended behavior when I last edited the entry, and the template's output message stating that the  entry didn't exist -- when it clearly does, albeit as a stub -- was confusing to me.
 * The easy solution at the entry is simply to remove  from the list of arguments.  ... Which I've now done.  :)  ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 17:31, 19 July 2021 (UTC)

"key" param -- what is this for?
The documentation isn't clear what the use case is for this parameter. Could someone please explain? ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 22:49, 24 December 2020 (UTC)
 * As far as I understand, it's just like pagename of other templates. Used only in tests. -- Huhu9001 (talk) 14:55, 12 January 2021 (UTC)

Message from Dine2016
This is Dine2016, the original creator of this template.

There are some things I did wrong with this template:

 * 1. Having two variants, and , is certainly wrong. Most Japanese dictionaries don't treat Sino-Japanese words specially. It is unclear why Wiktionary should.
 * I initially introduced so that Sino-Japanese words could be grouped together. Later I realized that native words were also rich in homophones, and remodeled  after . Now the two templates are almost identical; the only difference is that the later says "Sino-Japanese" in the footer.
 * The current practice seems to group soft-redirects to native words in one Etymology header, and those to Sino-Japanese words in another. I suggest dropping this boundary, using a single ===Etymology n=== section and a single for all soft-redirects on the same page.
 * 2. Creating  was also a mistake. The original assumption was that graphemes like 竜/龍, 灯/燈, 画/畫/畵, and 代々/代代 were always interchangeable, regardless of which words they spell. So we could simplify

 WORDS      SPELLINGS

だいだい ／ 代々 代々  ─  代代

／ 代々 よよ  ／  代代 世々  ─  世々 ＼ 世世

せぜ 世々  ─  世々 ＼ 世世
 * to

 WORDS    SPELLINGS   GRAPHEME-VARIANTS

だいだい 代々                代々 ＼       ／              代々  ＼  代代 よよ  ／ 世々                世々 ＼       ／             世々  ＼  世世 せぜ  ／ 世々
 * The problem is that I didn't convey this two-level hierarchy clearly (I couldn't write good English, to begin with), so people started using the template in the wrong way, like redirecting from 代代 to 世々. This totally defeated what the template was created for.
 * 3.  requires the alternative spelling to appear in the main entry. This is not necessary if the main entry contains only one word, in which case no ambiguities will arise.
 * 4. Current version looks too ugly. Unfortunately I was not a web designer and didn't know how to make it mobile-friendly.

Part of the reason I couldn't write good English lies in the fact that Wiktionary's terminology was unclear. For example, Wiktionary has never developed a concept for "words" (or more accurately, "lexical items"). Instead, its entries are organized around spellings. So one entry may contain several words (くらい = 'dark', 'rank/approximately', 'eating') and one word may span several entries ('rank/approximately' = くらい, くらゐ, 位). requires you to think in words, to organize the data around words, which is difficult in a spelling-centric mode of editing. So I kinda regret creating these templates.

--2409:894C:3C36:279D:5B65:2A08:CFCA:DED6 16:23, 11 July 2021 (UTC)

"The following entry is uncreated"—what?
I don't understand what the template means when it says this. Is it broken in detecting whether entries are created, or is it worded/placed poorly?

I see it in entries like 遣る, where it says:
 * (The following entry is uncreated: やる.)

but やる does, in fact, exist—it's the main entry for the word. What's going on here? --TreyHarris (talk) 20:01, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

 * Fixed. The reason is that you used two kanjitab for each alternate form, where in actuality you just need one kanjitab and group the alternative forms together separated by comma. Because how the template were designed, having two kanji tabs confused the ja-see template as it doesn’t know which one to direct. Shen233 (talk) 20:36, 6 December 2021 (UTC)

Category
I noticed that this template automatically adds entries to Category:Japanese non-lemma forms, which seems problematic. It's a bit inconsistent for Category:Japanese lemmas to contain some kanji spellings, but not others. Binarystep (talk) 23:02, 14 March 2022 (UTC)

Show romaji at kana-only spellings
I understand why we don't transliterate when this template is placed at a spelling that contains kanji, but when there's nothing but kana there are no technical reasons not to: we don't have to worry about dealing with multiple readings, and it should be easy to transliterate plain kana without having to fish around in other entries like we do when kanji are involved. We don't even have to link to a romaji entry- it would be fine to just display it like we do in our other templates:. As for the matter of consistency: I would argue that almost all kana-only entries with this template are basically transliteration entries already- but in a script that's opaque to those who haven't completely mastered the kanas (i.e., most of our readers). Chuck Entz (talk) 07:39, 1 May 2023 (UTC)

title: Template talk:ja-see


text:
Talk:people are people

RFD discussion: June 2018–January 2019
Googling phrases of the form "X are X" or "X is X" tends to produce hits, usually with a meaning like, "the nature of X is what it is". Examples are "men are men" and "dogs are dogs". What makes a Randian phrase of the type "A is A" worthy of inclusion? In some cases (e.g., boys will be boys) this may be an established saying, but in general it is a snowclone whose meaning is basically a sum-of-parts and not idiomatically fixed. Compare the present sense ("People are basically the same everywhere") with the sense supplied by the original creator ("People are inherently imperfect, and thus should be expected to make mistakes"). While I contend the first one is more commonly implied, both are within the vague spectrum of meanings of phrases of the form "X is Y" for the case where Y is the same of X, depending on the speaker's incidental notion of the nature of X. Lambiam 10:48, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm confused, wasn't this added by User:Lambiam? DonnanZ (talk) 19:50, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, wrong revision. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 00:10, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I merely edited it, after it had been added by another editor. See also Tea room/2018/June. --Lambiam 01:20, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I think DonnanZ was referring to the username I attributed to the post? You forgot to add your username (one too many hyphens). —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 01:29, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * This hasn't really reached the status of "boys will be boys". It seems SoP to me and I would lean toward deletion. I am also reminded of the modern Internet slang of e.g. "obvious troll is obvious" or "long cat is long". Equinox ◑ 22:24, 27 June 2018 (UTC)

 * I have never been particularly happy with the definition, I'm not sure how to redefine it (if it's salvageable). All people have human failings? DonnanZ (talk) 09:12, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, might be worth an entry in the snowclones Appendix. Per utramque cavernam 15:11, 1 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per PUC. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 01:16, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Moved to Appendix:Snowclones/X are X. Per utramque cavernam 18:35, 10 January 2019 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:people are people


text:
Talk:kindergarten tactic

elementary school tactic
And grade school tactic and elementary school tactic. Following up from Tea_room/2018/January. Equinox ◑ 03:52, 5 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Per utramque cavernam 13:17, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete all, unless someone can come up with a good reason for keeping them. Not even directly linked to grade school and elementary school. DonnanZ (talk) 10:00, 8 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. As much as I like these, they seem just to be metaphorical uses of elementary school, etc. + tactic. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 00:25, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * You like them? Are they terms (commonly) used in American English? DonnanZ (talk) 08:46, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I do like them: I think they're comical. And I've definitely heard kindergarten tactic and elementary school tactic used in this way (the term grade school is uncommon in my region). I don't think they quite qualify as "common", but they're certainly not rare, in my experience.  Perhaps somewhere in the "unusual" zone.  But they'd be understood by most people even so. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 13:51, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hmm. Maybe not understood by British readers. DonnanZ (talk) 14:02, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Oh, I meant most people in my area. Sorry, I worded it unclearly. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 14:07, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete this (and so many other similar phrases that use a noun metaphorically). DCDuring (talk) 19:42, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

I see a consensus to delete. Per utramque cavernam 12:37, 20 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted, as to all. bd2412 T 17:17, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:kindergarten tactic


text:
Talk:mud over

mud down
I'm starting to get really tired of all these recent phrasal verbs. How is mud over not covered at the verb section of to mud already? I also nominate mud up, mud down for deletion and a thorough verification of all the phrasal verbs added by anons lately. --Robbie SWE (talk) 19:20, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

 * Never heard of it. Tentative delete. DonnanZ (talk) 23:28, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I have added the other two at the top. I must confess I haven't heard of any of them. DonnanZ (talk) 18:24, 7 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete all. There's nothing unique about these--they're just mud (verb) with up (adv sense 13), down (adv senses 14-15) and over (sense 1). --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 00:22, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

 * I am somewhat curious as to whether these forms exist in common usage at all. Equinox ◑ 03:38, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yeah, the one that seems the most likely to me is mud up--maybe something like "The boy came in from the back yard all mudded up"--but in reality that just sounds like an example of the American habit of using everything as a verb. And in any case, "muddied up" would be the more likely option, it seems to me. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 13:48, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. We Americans DO have a habit of being creative in converting nouns to verbs. DCDuring (talk) 19:38, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete all. But many so-called phrasal verbs have similar problems, including some legitimate phrasal verbs that have questionable definitions. Phrasal verbs seem to attract advocates who seem to love expanding what they call phrasal verb. DCDuring (talk) 19:37, 17 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per all of the above. Per utramque cavernam 09:40, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Deleted, as to all. bd2412 T 17:18, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:mud over


text:
Talk:what the hell

RFD discussion: June 2018–January 2019
Sense "(mildly vulgar, slang) An intensive form of what.". SOP, just what + the hell. Compare why the hell ("why the hell did you do that?"), where the hell ("where the hell are my keys?") and so on.__Gamren (talk) 15:12, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Of course, we should add and leave the example sentence as it is.__Gamren (talk) 15:14, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete per proponent. Per utramque cavernam 10:12, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

 * Keep via WT:LEMMING: in MW although only as boldfaced part of their "hell" entry, and oxforddictionaries.com. My lemming-free instinct would be to keep as well; compare also what the fuck. --Dan Polansky (talk) 14:39, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Leaning keep, I see no reason to leave the "who cares" sense by itself, as if that is the only meaning. bd2412 T 02:48, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Kept. Even without my input, there would be no consensus after more than half a year. bd2412 T 18:38, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:what the hell


text:
Talk:dirty language

RFD discussion: December 2018–January 2019
Sum-of-parts. S URJECTION ·talk·contr·log· 17:11, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, I think we've already been over this. Per utramque cavernam 17:04, 13 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Speedy delete per Talk:filthy_language. Per utramque cavernam 11:17, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Equinox ◑ 17:08, 13 December 2018 (UTC)
 * We don't say *špinavý jazyk in Czech in relation to speech, only in relation to the biological organ, but this can be due to an additional sense at dirty. There are also "dirty words". Which sense of dirty is it, "Morally unclean; obscene or indecent, especially sexually"? . --Dan Polansky (talk) 07:22, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, that sense. English seems to like "dirt" metaphors for this kind of thing. Compare dirty joke, gutter, filthy, smut, foul, dig up dirt, sordid, and clean. (After looking through Wikisaurus to find some of those words, I feel like I want to take a shower...) —Granger (talk · contribs) 06:26, 29 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:34, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:dirty language


text:
Talk:InnoDB

RFD discussion: July 2018–January 2019
Specific proprietary database system; not a household word, and something for Wikipedia, I would think. Similar "terms" (products) that we don't have might include MySQL, Hadoop, Access, FoxPro, dBase, and so on. Equinox ◑ 17:03, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

 * Not arguing the deletion but just want to correct that InnoDB is free software, while being dual licensed under GPL *and* a possible proprietary license if a company needs it. C0rn3j (talk) 18:53, 4 August 2018 (UTC)

 * , . DCDuring (talk) 21:02, 17 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I agree, it and point people to Wikipedia. Although, we don't have a clear policy on this kind of thing. - -sche (discuss) 06:30, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Per utramque cavernam 09:40, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Overly specific. Fay Freak (talk) 01:14, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:15, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:InnoDB


text:
Talk:fundamental theorem

RFD discussion: June 2018–January 2019
"Fundamental theorem of arithmetic", etc., so it's somewhat of a set phrase in mathematics, but still just fundamental + theorem. DTLHS (talk) 03:36, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Keep. As is made clear in the, here is not used in the obvious sense ("serving as a foundation"). It is a fairly vague considered central - admittedly, in some cases, having been thus considered for a long time. For newer usages, even this sense is watered down. It is emphatically not necessary that the theorem form the basis of a logical exposition of the related theory.— Pingkudimmi 05:06, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Keep. There may be translations anyway. DonnanZ (talk) 08:12, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
 * In another place I found (being used this way)  (oops) and . Neither is word for word. DonnanZ (talk) 08:41, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
 * From one could - if the entry were more informative - find types of Sätze, but one has to differ between linguistics (Hauptsatz, Nebensatz, Fragesatz, ...), mathematics (Fundamentalsatz, Hilfssatz (Hilfsatz), Lehrsatz, ...) and others. -80.133.107.120 13:07, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Fundamentalsatz is word for word: Satz is theorem. --Dan Polansky (talk) 11:09, 10 November 2018 (UTC)

Kept. bd2412 T 18:36, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:fundamental theorem


text:
Talk:fleeting moment

RFD discussion: December 2018–January 2019
SOP. Per utramque cavernam 21:42, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  08:11, 12 December 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete, SOP. Fay Freak (talk) 22:03, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:42, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:fleeting moment


text:
Talk:nasty language

RFD discussion: December 2018–January 2019
Sum-of-parts. S URJECTION ·talk·contr·log· 17:11, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, I think we've already been over this. Per utramque cavernam 17:04, 13 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Speedy delete per Talk:filthy_language. Per utramque cavernam 11:17, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Equinox ◑ 17:08, 13 December 2018 (UTC)
 * In Czech, we don't say ošklivý jazyk in relation to profanity, but that might be covered by an additional sense in nasty, perhaps "Indecent or offensive; obscene, lewd". --Dan Polansky (talk) 07:26, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:34, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:nasty language


text:
Talk:pose as

RFD discussion: December 2018–January 2019
SoP, like "act as", "dress up as", "present oneself as". Equinox ◑ 21:06, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. — Mnemosientje (t · c) 12:26, 12 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Abstain, there are entries in online M-W and MM, but I cannot find them as lemmas in older print editions. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  14:25, 12 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, SOP. Per utramque cavernam 17:06, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete, SOP. Fay Freak (talk) 22:03, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:40, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:pose as


text:
Talk:campus legend

campus-legend
Two senses: 1. a person famous on campus; 2. a story told around campus. I think this is SoP: I just searched for "hotel legend" by way of comparison, and also found both senses: 1. "The general manager of the Gresham was a hotel legend in Dublin"; 2. "According to the hotel legend, this lady [now a ghost] was once a guest". Equinox ◑ 13:13, 1 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete this and campus-legend (, want to add it to this RFD?) —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 18:55, 1 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Same two senses found for “village legend”. Delete. --Lambiam 19:32, 1 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete-Sonofcawdrey (talk) 23:59, 1 December 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete, NISOP. A "legend" of some kind on a "campus" of some kind. bd2412 T 02:03, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete both, SOP. Per utramque cavernam 09:19, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Del per nom. - -sche (discuss) 22:50, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:26, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:campus legend


text:
Talk:tram route

RFD discussion: September 2018–January 2019
Looks like tram route to me. Also, bus route might wanna follow suit --XY3999 (talk) 15:02, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I would keep it as a transport-related subject. DonnanZ (talk) 19:34, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure why it being a transport-related subject makes it any more dictionary-worthy. Delete. Andrew Sheedy (talk) 02:51, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Would you also keep "The history of trams in the UK during the 20th century"? That's also a transport-related subject (see if you can find that in the OED...). Chuck Entz (talk) 03:22, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I would if I had it, I have a few tramway books like "Hammersmith and Hounslow Tramways" (try finding that), and a tram route a few miles away at Wimbledon. I rewrote the definition, I hope it reads better. DonnanZ (talk) 09:35, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete NISoP: A route for trams. DCDuring (talk) 15:56, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete: hard to see what else this would mean. If it were a full sentence then perhaps it would be good for a travellers' phrasebook. Equinox ◑ 20:42, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

 * So this user (with a name like a car number plate) thinks he's doing everyone a favour by nominating this for deletion? Poppycock. DonnanZ (talk) 11:08, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This feels similar to a COALMINE situation: where we accept one term (e.g. tramway, US English) we should accept alternate forms of that term (tram route, British English). The alternative (without losing information) would be a usage note on tramway, I guess? -Stelio (talk) 12:00, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Nothing more than "tram" + "route". Mihia (talk) 13:55, 18 September 2018 (UTC)

 * Keep. The requisite sense of route collocates only with few nouns, it seems, especially bus route and tram route, and I think our readers are better off with our having both. We have bus stop and so has M-W, but this could be free-variabled (Talk:free variable) deleted by having the right definition at stop and claiming bus stop and tram stop to be sum of parts. Wikidata: ; perhaps someone will be able to find the kind of translations there that could support WT:THUB. I wonder whether our users will have to use a combination of Wiktionary and Wikidata for translation purposes; Wikidata keeps all sorts of sum of parts entries with translations into multiple languages. Correction: Neither tram route nor bus stop seem to really be Talk:free variable cases; I take that back. --Dan Polansky (talk) 08:39, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It seems to me that in fact many words can designate a type of route, and hence collocate with "route". In a few minutes I came up with: cycle route, pedestrian route, HGV route, lorry route, shipping route, taxi route, coach route, ferry route, passenger route, freight route, air route, sea route, canal route, ski route, caravan route, ice-cream van route, trolley-bus route, hovercraft route. I don't see what's special about "tram route". Mihia (talk) 16:59, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Most of these are not of the requisite sense of route: "A regular itinerary of stops, or the path followed between these stops, such as for delivery or passenger transportation". One intuitive reason why I may desire to keep bus route and tram route is that they reinforce the separate sense of route, which does not apply to "cycle route" and "ski route"; it is the sense that has line as a synonym, and for which I would usually expect there to be a timetable, and which could alternatively be defined not as an "itinerary" but rather as an "operation", the way Wikidata defines "line" as a "regular operation of a particular path for a type of transportation". --Dan Polansky (talk) 13:42, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * So? That's just a semantic limitation of the sense- there aren't that many things that have that kind of route. If there were a sleigh pulled by unicorns that made regular stops to pick up passengers, there would be no problem referring to a "unicorn-sleigh route". Should we have an entry for see a bet because it doesn't use a more common sense as in "see a rainbow" or "see a patient", and you can't use it for something like a donation? Chuck Entz (talk) 15:07, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Fay Freak (talk) 22:34, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, SOP. Per utramque cavernam 15:34, 17 October 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:22, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:tram route


text:
Talk:American option

European option
These are not the only collocations. One can talk about, , and. Better therefore to move the definition to as an adjective applying to financial options. The equivalent is true for Bermudan and European, as well as a range of other option types that I haven't yet added as entries (I'm holding off pending this decision, but other types include: Asian, Boston, Canary, Evergreen, Israeli, Parisian, Russian, Verde). -Stelio (talk) 11:03, 12 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep using the talk:free variable rationale. I would never look up Bermudan option under "Bermudan", and I think "Bermudan call" and "Bermudan put" are basically derived terms of Bermudan option. If keeping is not feasible, at least redirect, but we can serve our readers best by keeping, I think. --Dan Polansky (talk) 13:53, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

 * Move definitions to etc. Add redirects, sure, but don't keep the main definition at "... option". Note that "American" etc. can be used directly as adjectives:
 * 2009,, Options, Futures, and other Derivatives (Seventh Edition), Pearson Education, page 182:
 * All of these trade on the Chicago Board Options Exchange. Most of the contracts are European. An exception is the OEX contract on the S&P 100, which is American.
 * 2009, Shih-Feng Huang and Meihui Guo, Applied Quantitative Finance (Second Edition), Springer, page 295:
 * Multi-dimensional option pricing becomes an important topic in financial markets (Franker et al., 2008). Among which, the American-type derivative (e.g. the Bermudan option) pricing is a challenging problem.
 * 2010, Johnathan Mun, Modeling Risk + DVD: Applying Monte Carlo Risk Simulation, Strategic Real Options, Stochastic Forecasting, and Portfolio Optimization (Second Edition), John Wiley & Sons:
 * Based on the analyses throughout the case study, it is recommended that the use of a model that assumes an ESO is European style when, in fact, the option is American style with the other exotic variables should not be permitted, as this substantially overstates compensation expenses.
 * -Stelio (talk) 13:52, 31 July 2018 (UTC)

No consensus to delete, after an absurdly long time for consideration. bd2412 T 02:31, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:American option


text:
Talk:debug menu

RFD discussion: June 2018–January 2019
I think this is SoP. The creator evidently knows the term from video games, but any kind of menu used for debugging is a "debug menu", e.g. in Microsoft's Visual Studio IDE. Equinox ◑ 01:15, 25 June 2018 (UTC)
 * In video gaming contexts at least, a debug menu and a debug mode are practically one and the same. But debug here doesn't mean looking through the code as it does in programming contexts. When debug menus/modes are left in video games and accessed by players, they are not technically used for debugging (although that would have been its original purpose), but for cheating and other such stuff, but they're still called debug. Adam9007 (talk) 17:47, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Well, I was reminded of : a lot of 1990s console games have a "sound test" openly exposed in the options menu that will play all the sounds and music of the game. This could be used for testing but clearly anyone messing with it on a final released game isn't doing testing in that sense. Hmm. Maybe opinions from people who aren't either gamers or programmers? Equinox ◑ 22:21, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
 * To my knowledge, such sound and music tests are not called debug menus, although they can sometimes be found in debug menus. My understanding of it (but I could be wrong) is that in general, if it's not hidden in any way (that is, if it's clearly intended for the player to access it if they want to), it's not debug. Debug stuff in video games is almost always hidden from the player and accessible only by doing things like entering a code, adding of modifying an out-of-game setting, or in extreme cases, hacking. The hidden sound test in the PlayStation version of Ridge Racer may be considered debug as you cannot access it without hacking. But the one in the Mega Drive version of is not, as from the main menu all you have to do is go into Options and there it is. Also, unlike sound tests and say, cheat menus (I don't think anyone with any common sense would need further explanation for those), what you get in a debug menu can vary considerably depending on what game you're playing. Sometimes it's stuff that can be used to cheat, sometimes it's extra configuration stuff, sometimes it's tests, sometimes it's a mixture etc. In fact, one of the citations felt the term needed explaining. Adam9007 (talk) 22:54, 28 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Abstain. I think the nom is right but I cannot summon enough energy to look closer. --Dan Polansky (talk) 11:01, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  13:55, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, SOP. Per utramque cavernam 22:56, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:11, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:debug menu


text:
Talk:floating palette

RFD discussion: June 2018–January 2019
"A palette window that floats above other standard windows." Floating above etc. is what "floating" means; we can also easily find floating toolbar, floating window, and so on. So: SoP. Equinox ◑ 08:01, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * I haven't got a clue, but shouldn't it be kept as a technical term? DonnanZ (talk) 09:02, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * No, because it's made of two words whose sum is the same as the two-word phrase. For example on your computer you can open up a new "window" (technical term) and you can maximise/expand it to fill the screen ("maximise" is another tech term): then you have a "maximised window". But because a maximised window is nothing beyond "a window that has been maximised" it's not worth an entry, any more than "pink flower" for a gardener's term for a flower that happens to be pink in colour. This is the same. Anything can "float": that means it hovers/exists over the main window/interface without being visually connected to it. A floating palette is no different from any other floating thing, lexically. Equinox ◑ 09:16, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * I can see where you're coming from, however I found and added a Wikipedia reference, for what it's worth. DonnanZ (talk) 11:38, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
 * And what does "floating" actually mean here? Looking at (sense 2) I assume it doesn't float of its own accord, like a floating leaf on water, but has to be dragged to "float". DonnanZ (talk) 12:47, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * But you're asking what "float" means, not what "floating palette" means. Anything that does "whatever float means" is "floating". So the entry is still sum of parts. As someone who has spent decades writing code for Windows I could tell you in horrible detail what "floating" means. Let's say in short it means that something BELONGS TO a parent window or application (which is usually "underneath", meaning that it is covered by the floating thing), AND that the floating thing has its own free position on the screen that doesn't automatically change when you move the parent. (For example, if you open some tabs in your browser, and move the browser, then the tabs move too; but if something is floating over the top, then it stays still, even if that thing was created and is owned by the browser.) Note that NONE OF THIS HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH PALETTES: it is just a generic sense of "what it means to be floating". So having an entry for "floating palette" (versus floating window, toolbar, editor, etc.) is as silly as having an entry for "brown hair, dog, potato" instead of just saying what "brown" means. PLEASE don't make me explain this again. Equinox ◑ 14:39, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
 * It may be obvious to a professional, but not to a layman. DonnanZ (talk) 14:52, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete: float (verb sense 17, or perhaps nouns sense 25) + palette (sense 3). --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 13:59, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
 * IMO having to go to float is too far to look, float usually implies it is free to move, but I get the impression it's static and has to be physically moved. Correct me if I'm wrong. DonnanZ (talk) 14:29, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * If it's too far to go from floating palette to float then it's too far to go from brown leaf to brown. Our entire SoP policy uses brown leaf = leaf that is brown = (no entry required) as a basis. So if you are disputing that then you need to bring some strong arguments. Saying "I don't know about computers so I don't know a two-word computer term" is not sufficient. I know nothing about genetics therefore I don't really know what a "non-repeating nucleotide" is; however, it's pretty fucking clear that it must be a nucleotide (and I can learn what that means, if I choose to) that does not repeat. Equinox ◑ 14:41, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Going from brown leaf to brown is one step. Going from floating palette to floating, and then having to go to float is two steps. DonnanZ (talk) 15:06, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Absolutely true, but I am not sure that this is something that should dictate our entry-making. Perhaps what this tells us is that going to a page floating and seeing present participle of float and having to do an extra click/tap is not good enough. The main point is not to duplicate information: we need to keep things clear and simple AND to reduce editor effort: that doesn't mean I'm placing editor effort above learner/user reward, but it means that we might e.g. need to merge forms of a verb into a single page, instead of having the "islands" we have now. If there are generic problems like this, we should 1. address them and 2. not punish individual cases like "floating palette" because of them. Equinox ◑ 15:50, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
 * In this case is a common adjective anyway, and I have just updated the derived terms. I think it has to be considered separately from float. Comparing with Oxford Online, there's a few missing that we may be interested in: floating charge, floating cloche, floating debt, floating holiday (not a holiday afloat!), and floating restaurant, but floating toolbar or floating palette aren't listed. DonnanZ (talk) 18:23, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * I would send to RfV to see if citations support the use of this as a set phrase (i.e. used outside of a context that explains the meaning), but would otherwise keep. It combines an unintuitive sense of "float" with an unintuitive sense of "palette", which is itself easily confused with "palate". bd2412 T 14:50, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * The palette-palate thing is at least measurable. Presumably that would require redirects for all phrases with either of the confusable words (e.g. palate knife -> palette knife; soft palette -> soft palate). As I've said before, I think this is the point where we need to rely on the search engine (which may use spell-checking and soundalikes: I recently in my real-life job implemented Double Metaphone, which is damn good at matching up "close enough" surnames): to create extra entries for every entry whose headword includes any of the disputed words is a scary ballooning. Equinox ◑ 15:47, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete per nom. - -sche (discuss) 16:23, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

 * I wasn't exactly on the fence, but keep, I think. DonnanZ (talk) 18:52, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
 * IMO, being a technical term makes it (automatically?) keepable. DonnanZ (talk) 10:49, 18 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete for the reason given by SanctMinimalicen. — SGconlaw (talk) 19:31, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Per utramque cavernam 10:11, 17 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Inclined to delete: this does seem SOP: if you know what a floating window is, then you know what a floating palette is; further, it is not in OneLook dictionaries ; by contrast, floating holiday is found: . GNV: . --Dan Polansky (talk) 12:32, 31 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 02:32, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:floating palette


text:
Talk:-nazi

RFD discussion: November 2018–January 2019
Not actually a suffix, as pointed out by Eq. Heck, the entry itself admits it's not a suffix in its usage notes. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 05:34, 25 November 2018 (UTC)

 * Haha look at the usage notes blushing and shuffling their feet. Sorry honey, I'm not going to ask you to dance, I'm going to delete your arse. (And my comment which MK deleted because it was part of an RFD for a word that already failed was: being a common part of many compounds doesn't turn an everyday native word into a prefix. That's my rationale.) Equinox ◑ 05:54, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, is enough. Per utramque cavernam 12:11, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  07:53, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete, composition. Fay Freak (talk) 11:59, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, I also believe that should be enough. --Robbie SWE (talk) 07:21, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Yeah, delete. I will revise the derived terms in preparation. DonnanZ (talk) 12:33, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Probably delete. The use in blends such as Dan Polansky (talk) 08:23, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 03:08, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:-nazi


text:
Talk:-holed torus

RFD discussion: November 2018–January 2019
Suffix entry disguised as a noun entry — but I would think something like 4-holed torus is better regarded as 4-holed + torus and not by suffixing -holed torus as a unit. (One way around this might be to have an entry for n-holed torus or some such; we do have n-dimensional, even though the n is a fairly arbitrary mathematical variable and could really be any letter.) Equinox ◑ 03:55, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom; NISOP. If we were going to have an entry, it would be at -holed, as this can apply to anything capable of having an indeterminate number of holes. bd2412 T 04:31, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

 * I don't think it's accurate to call holed a suffix in any case. It's like armed, legged, bathroomed. Equinox ◑ 04:39, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm not calling for the creation of -holed, merely pointing out that if we were to address things having multiples of them, it wouldn't be with an entry naming one of the things having such multiples. bd2412 T 12:25, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Just delete it. SemperBlotto (talk) 06:22, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Its biggest problem is that it looks incomplete, and I'm not sure that anybody is going to look for it, let alone find it. A bit like an entry for -hole golf course. Deletion is probably the answer. DonnanZ (talk) 12:38, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, for the record the creator had as edit summary: "not SoP because hole can also mean a removed disk". ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  15:12, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete: despite what the creator said, it looks pretty SoP to me. (Perhaps we should add an adjective sense to, if verifiable.) — SGconlaw (talk) 03:33, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
 * I think the word holed as used here is an adjective, just like broken is an adjective in broken promise. --Lambiam 13:21, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
 * I believe that the creator's comment is referring to a topological distinction between "hole" like the hole through the middle of a tyre, and "hole" like a hole that would puncture the tyre, the "hole" in "-holed torus" being of the former type. I don't think this entry is the way to do it though. If it is thought necessary to explain this distinction, I suppose it should go at hole. Mihia (talk) 15:11, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
 * All my socks have holes. That is quite convenient. I use them to put my feet through when putting on socks. The torus holes are more like the holes in Swiss cheese. We are not a topology textbook and if we try to be pedantically precise we are not likely to get all subtleties right. Like the current definition of : “A topological space which is a product of two circles.” That only makes sense if a circle is a topological space; however, none of the sixteen senses supplied at define a topological space. Also, with that definition, a 2-holed torus is not a torus.  --Lambiam 18:56, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

 * Delete per nom. Per utramque cavernam 17:04, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 03:07, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:-holed torus


text:
Talk:rule over

RFD discussion: December 2018–January 2019
SoP, like "reign over", "tyrannize over". Equinox ◑ 20:39, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. Compare lord over, which has a genuine idiomatic meaning. bd2412 T 22:33, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't see how it's different. It's simply, verb, sense 1: "to domineer or act like a lord" + . seems like the real idiom to me. Per utramque cavernam 17:08, 13 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  14:17, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete as SoP. — SGconlaw (talk) 14:30, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, SOP. Per utramque cavernam 17:08, 13 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, normal verb government. Fay Freak (talk) 22:03, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

Deleted. bd2412 T 17:35, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:rule over


text:
Talk:mud down

RFD discussion: August 2018–January 2019

 * See Talk:mud over.

title: Talk:mud down


text:
Talk:Bermudan option

RFD discussion: June 2018–January 2019

 * See Talk:American option.

title: Talk:Bermudan option


text:
Talk:campus-legend

RFD discussion: December 2018–January 2019

 * See Talk:campus legend.

title: Talk:campus-legend


text:
Talk:European option

RFD discussion: June 2018–January 2019

 * See Talk:American option.

title: Talk:European option


text:
Talk:grade school tactic

RFD discussion: August 2018–January 2019

 * See Talk:kindergarten tactic.

title: Talk:grade school tactic


text:
Talk:elementary school tactic

RFD discussion: August 2018–January 2019

 * See Talk:kindergarten tactic.

title: Talk:elementary school tactic


text:
Talk:mud up

RFD discussion: August 2018–January 2019

 * See Talk:mud over.

title: Talk:mud up


text:
денник

Noun

 * 1) box stall

title: денник


text:
wrąb

Etymology 1
.

Noun

 * 1) notch, groove

title: wrąb


text: wręb

title: wręb


text:
Reconstruction:Proto-Ryukyuan/no

Etymology
From.

Usage notes
Ryukyuan languages use a hierarchy to determine which of its nominative and genitive markers, and, to use. This hierarchy has two layers, consisting of higher and lower layers.

 * The higher nominative and genitive marker is, used primarily by pronouns referring to humans.
 * The lower nominative and genitive marker is, used by any nominals that do not use.

This hierarchy is subject to much variation in the daughter languages. In Northern Amami-Ōshima, genitive is only used with demonstrative pronouns, while personal pronouns, names of humans, and kinship terms do not take any genitive marker, while Yaeyama lost its reflex of  altogether.

Descendants

 * Northern Ryukyuan: (Haytong Ceykwukki, 1501)
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:

title: Reconstruction:Proto-Ryukyuan/no


text: Category:Proto-Ryukyuan particles

title: Category:Proto-Ryukyuan particles


text:
Reconstruction:Proto-Ryukyuan/ga

Etymology
From.

Usage notes
Ryukyuan languages use a hierarchy to determine which of its nominative and genitive markers, and, to use. This hierarchy has two layers, consisting of higher and lower layers.

 * The higher nominative and genitive marker is, used primarily by pronouns referring to humans.
 * The lower nominative and genitive marker is, used by any nominals that do not use.

This hierarchy is subject to much variation in the daughter languages. In the Yamatohama dialect of Northern Amami-Ōshima, genitive is only used with demonstrative pronouns, while personal pronouns, names of humans, and kinship terms do not take any genitive marker. Meanwhile, in the Ishigaki-Shika and Hatoma dialect of Yaeyama, this term only attaches between the first person pronoun and an uninflectable noun, and this reflex is missing from the Taketomi dialect altogether.

Descendants

 * Northern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan
 * Southern Ryukyuan

title: Reconstruction:Proto-Ryukyuan/ga


text:
しちー

Noun

 * 1)  moon

title: しちー


text:
つぃきぃ

Noun

 * 1)  moon

Noun

 * 1)  moon

title: つぃきぃ


text:
ってぃー

Noun

 * 1)  moon

title: ってぃー


text:
Reconstruction:Proto-Ryukyuan/tuki

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1) moon
 * 2) month

Descendants

 * Northern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:
 * Southern Ryukyuan:

title: Reconstruction:Proto-Ryukyuan/tuki


text: żłoba

title: żłoba


text: dęli

title: dęli


text: Template:RQ:Shakespeare All's Well

title: Template:RQ:Shakespeare All's Well


text: dałby

title: dałby


text:
Talk:hunt the slipper

Chambers 1908 definition
"An old-fashioned game in which one in the middle of a ring tries to catch a shoe which those forming the ring upon the ground shove about under their hams from one to another." Equinox ◑ 06:00, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:hunt the slipper


text: dęty

title: dęty


text: dęta

title: dęta


text: dęte

title: dęte


text: dęci

title: dęci


text:
Template:RQ:Shakespeare All's Well/documentation

Usage
This template may be used in Wiktionary entries to format quotations from 's work All's Well that Ends Well, which was first published in the  (1623). It can be used to create a link to an online version of the work at the Internet Archive.

Parameters
The template takes the following parameters:

 * 1 or act – mandatory: the act number of the play quoted from in uppercase Roman numerals.
 * 2 or scene – mandatory: the scene number of the play quoted from in lowercase Roman numerals. As the act and scene numbers in the original play may differ from those in modern editions, look up the act and scene numbers from a modern edition of the play.
 * 3 or page, or pages – mandatory in some cases: the page number(s) of the work. If using pages to quote a range of pages, note the following:
 * Separate the first and last pages of the range with an en dash, like this: 230–231.
 * You must also use pageref to specify the page number that the template should link to (usually the page on which the Wiktionary entry appears).
 * This parameter must be specified to have the template link to the online version of the work.

 * 4 or column, or columns – the column number(s) to be quoted from in Arabic numerals, either 1 or 2. When referring to a passage that spans both columns, either omit the parameter or use an en dash like this: 1–2.
 * line or lines – the line number(s) to be quoted, from a modern edition of the play.
 * 5, text, or passage – the passage to be quoted.
 * 6, t, or translation – a translation of the passage into contemporary English.
 * footer – a comment about the passage quoted.
 * brackets – use on to surround a quotation with brackets. This indicates that the quotation either contains a mere mention of a term (for example, "some people find the word manoeuvre hard to spell") rather than an actual use of it (for example, "we need to manoeuvre carefully to avoid causing upset"), or does not provide an actual instance of a term but provides information about related terms.

Examples

 * Wikitext:
 * }}; or
 * }}
 * Result:


text:
hallpass

Etymology
From.

title: hallpass


text:
dalas

Noun

 * 1)  poverty, penury

Etymology
Possibly, or from  or. Compare 🇨🇬 /, 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬 /. . See also.

Noun

 * 1) frequency
 * 2) rapidity; swiftness
 * 1) rapidity; swiftness

title: dalas


text:
ghetto pass

Etymology
From, modelled after , etc.

Noun

 * 1)  The acceptance of whites into a nonwhite community; or, a privilege or permission given to whites to appropriate nonwhite culture, attitudes, language, and behavior.
 * 2)  Any permission or tolerance given to enter, experience, or share in another's community.

title: ghetto pass


text: ghetto passes

title: ghetto passes


text: teucallis

title: teucallis


title: Template:el-conjug-sub6


text:
Talk:gearing

Possible derived terms, from Chambers 1908

 * multiplying gearing: a combination of cog-wheels for imparting motion from wheels of larger to wheels of smaller diameter, by which the rate of revolution is increased.
 * straight gearing: one where the planes of motion are parallel; opposed to bevelled gearing, when the direction is changed.

Equinox ◑ 06:39, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:gearing


text: acariosis

title: acariosis


text:
accordability

Noun

 * 1) The condition of being accordable

title: accordability


text: redlina

title: redlina


text:
豬年

Noun

 * 1)  Year of the Boar

title: 豬年


text: 猪年

title: 猪年


text:
chimney swallow

Noun

 * 1) barn swallow
 * 2) chimney swift

title: chimney swallow


text: chimney swallows

title: chimney swallows


text:
redło

Etymology
, from, from , with the Old Polish dialectal change ra->re-. This change affected northern and central dialects, but has since been reversed, except for a handful of words, of which redło has the widest range.

title: redło


text: redeł

title: redeł


text: redlica

title: redlica


text:
decoctible

Adjective

 * 1) Able to be decocted, or boiled down.

title: decoctible


text: sieją

title: sieją


text:
allexivirus

Noun

 * 1) Any virus of the genus

title: allexivirus


text: allexiviruses

title: allexiviruses


text: sieję

title: sieję


text: sieje

title: sieje


text: siał

title: siał


text:
aminoprotease

Noun

 * 1)  A protease that reacts with a protein's free amino group

Related terms

 * aminoproteolytic

title: aminoprotease


text: aminoproteases

title: aminoproteases


text: siała

title: siała


text:
aminoproteolytic

Adjective

 * 1)  Relating to aminoproteases

title: aminoproteolytic


text:
aminosteroidal

Adjective

 * 1) Relating to aminosteroids

title: aminosteroidal


text:
shell sand

Noun

 * 1) Sand consisting mainly of fragments of shells, and often containing a small proportion of organic matter.
 * Shell sand is a useful manure for clay soils, heavy loams, and newly reclaimed bogs.

title: shell sand


text: ampilliform

title: ampilliform


text: ampuliform

title: ampuliform


text:
amylome

Noun

 * 1)  All the parenchymal proteins (of a plant) that are capable of forming amyloid fibres

title: amylome


text: anectic

title: anectic


text: łęki

title: łęki


text: lęki

title: lęki


text:
corps de garde

Etymology
Borrowed from.

Noun

 * 1) A body of soldiers stationed on guard.
 * 2) Their station, a guardhouse.

Noun

 * 1) guards,  body of soldiers stationed on guard
 * 2) guardhouse, guardroom, gatehouse,

title: corps de garde


text: Template:RQ:Scott Tales of a Grandfather


text:
angioinductive

Adjective

 * 1) That encourages the growth of new blood vessels

Related terms

 * angioinduction

title: angioinductive


text: sęki

title: sęki


text: angioprotein

title: angioprotein


text: sęka

title: sęka


text: sęku

title: sęku


text: bulletrie

title: bulletrie


text: bolletrie

title: bolletrie


text: bolletries

title: bolletries


text: bulletries

title: bulletries


text:
ankylosauromorph

Noun

 * 1) Any dinosaur of the former order † (now †)

title: ankylosauromorph


text: łęku

title: łęku


text:
styletiform

Adjective

 * 1) Shaped like a stylet.

title: styletiform


text:
antichimeric

Adjective

 * 1)  That counters the formation of chimeras

title: antichimeric


text: lęków

title: lęków


text:
Template:RQ:Scott Tales of a Grandfather/documentation

Usage
This template may be used on Wiktionary entry pages to quote 's series of works entitled  (1st edition, 4 series, 1828–1831, 3 volumes in each series). It can be used to create a link to online versions of the works at Google Books:

 * Series 1
 * Volume I.
 * Volume II.
 * Volume III.
 * Series 2
 * Volume I.
 * Volume II.
 * Volume III.
 * Series 3
 * Volume I.
 * Volume II.
 * Volume III.
 * Series 4
 * Volume I.
 * Volume II.
 * Volume III.

Parameters
The template takes the following parameters:

 * 1 or series – mandatory: the series number quoted from in Arabic numerals, either 1, 2, 3, or 4.
 * 2 or volume – mandatory: the volume number quoted from in uppercase Roman numerals, either I, II, or III.
 * 3 or chapter – the name of the chapter quoted from (where available), or the chapter number quoted from in uppercase Roman numerals. The chapter numbers restart in each volume.
 * 4 or page, or pages – mandatory in some cases: the page number(s) quoted from. When quoting a range of pages, note the following:
 * Separate the first and last pages of the range with an en dash, like this: 110–111.
 * You must also use pageref to specify the page number that the template should link to (usually the page on which the Wiktionary entry appears).
 * You must specify this information to have the template create an automatic link to the online version of the work.

 * 5 or passage – a passage to be quoted from the work.
 * brackets – use on to surround a quotation with brackets. This indicates that the quotation either contains a mere mention of a term (for example, "some people find the word manoeuvre hard to spell") rather than an actual use of it (for example, "we need to manoeuvre carefully to avoid causing upset"), or does not provide an actual instance of a term but provides information about related terms.

Examples

 * Wikitext:
 * ; or
 * Result:
 * Result:


text: εμποράκου

title: εμποράκου


text: łęków

title: łęków


text: anticonceptive

title: anticonceptive


text: εμποράκο

title: εμποράκο


text: anticonceptives

title: anticonceptives


text: εμποράκων

title: εμποράκων


text: εμποράκοι

title: εμποράκοι


text: leków

title: leków


text: εμποράκους

title: εμποράκους


text: έμπορα

title: έμπορα


text: lekom

title: lekom


text: antineurogenesis

title: antineurogenesis


text: έμπορες

title: έμπορες


text: lękom

title: lękom


text: łękom

title: łękom


text:
antisalmonellal

Adjective

 * 1) That counters the effects of salmonella

title: antisalmonellal


text: εμπορεύματος

title: εμπορεύματος


text: εμπορευμάτων

title: εμπορευμάτων


text: εμπορεύματα

title: εμπορεύματα


text: nettlerash

title: nettlerash


text:
tafonomia

Etymology 1
(see 🇨🇬). Contains the suffix.

Noun

 * 1)  taphonomy

Noun

 * 1)  taphonomy

title: tafonomia


text:
smoking cap

Noun

 * 1) A light ornamental cap shaped like a shallow cylinder, traditionally worn by smokers.

title: smoking cap


text: smoking caps

title: smoking caps


text: lekami

title: lekami


text: lękami

title: lękami


text: łękami

title: łękami


text:
lekach

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) A Jewish honey-sweetened cake, mainly associated with Rosh Hashanah.

title: lekach


text: lękach

title: lękach


text: łękach

title: łękach


text:
quarterite

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1) An inhabitant of a particular quarter.

title: quarterite


text: quarterites

title: quarterites


text: presentáu

title: presentáu


text: lekiem

title: lekiem


text: lękiem

title: lękiem


text: łękiem

title: łękiem


text: sanguinolence

title: sanguinolence


text: lekowi

title: lekowi


text: lękowi

title: lękowi


text:
arvoarvostelma

Noun

 * 1) value judgment

title: arvoarvostelma


text:
arvoasema

Noun

 * 1) rank, dignity

title: arvoasema


text: łękowi

title: łękowi


text:
arvoaste

Noun

 * 1) rank

title: arvoaste


text:
arvoasunto

Noun

 * 1) luxury property, prestige property residence

title: arvoasunto


text:
arvohenkilö

Noun

 * 1) dignitary

title: arvohenkilö


text:
arvojohtaminen

Noun

 * 1) value-based leadership

title: arvojohtaminen


text:
arvojärjestelmä

Noun

 * 1) value system

title: arvojärjestelmä


text:
arvojärjestys

Noun

 * 1) precedence, hierarchy

title: arvojärjestys


text:
arvokala

Noun

 * 1) valuable fish, prized fish

title: arvokala


text:
arvokasvu

Noun

 * 1) rise in value

title: arvokasvu


text:
ขันทองพยาบาท

Etymology
From 🇰🇲; literally "golden bowl's vengeance".

Noun

 * 1)  , of the family.

title: ขันทองพยาบาท


text:
arvokortti

Noun

 * 1) stored value card
 * 2)  honor, honour

title: arvokortti


text:
arvoleima

Noun

 * 1) stamp-postmark

title: arvoleima


text:
arvoluokitus

Noun

 * 1) classification of values

title: arvoluokitus


text:
arvolähetys

Noun

 * 1) delivery of valuables

title: arvolähetys


text:
arvonimistö

Noun

 * 1) titulature

title: arvonimistö


text:
arvopaikka

Noun

 * 1) valuable spot, valuable seat

title: arvopaikka


text:
arvopohja

Noun

 * 1) set of values, basic values

title: arvopohja


text:
arvopuu

Noun

 * 1) valuable tree

title: arvopuu


text:
arvopäivä

Noun

 * 1) value date

title: arvopäivä


text:
arvosija

Noun

 * 1) valued position

title: arvosija


text:
arvoteos

Noun

 * 1) valuable work, valuable piece of art

title: arvoteos


text:
arvotilaisuus

Noun

 * 1) formal occasion

title: arvotilaisuus


text:
arvotulli

Noun

 * 1) ad valorem duty

title: arvotulli


text:
arvovalinta

Noun

 * 1) value judgment

title: arvovalinta


text:
arvovaraus

Noun

 * 1) connotation

title: arvovaraus


text:
arvoväritys

Noun

 * 1) connotation

title: arvoväritys


text:
Talk:tycoon

Historical reference?
Chambers 1908 defines it as "the title by which the shoguns of Japan were known to foreigners from 1854 to 1868". Equinox ◑ 08:07, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Use outside of Roblox
I don't know anything about Roblox, but "tycoon" is used to describe a lot of other games (see w:The Sims 2: Open for Business, Business simulation game, Transport Tycoon, OpenTTD, RollerCoaster Tycoon, OpenRCT2 for examples). I don't think it exactly matches the Roblox use but it seems like it would be more mainstream and worth adding. Pokechu22 (talk) 20:55, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

 * This is unrelated use. It's just sense 1, "a wealthy and powerful business person". That's what you play in those games, just like in the game called Street Fighter you play a street fighter. Equinox ◑ 20:58, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:tycoon


text:
niff-naffy

Adjective

 * 1) fastidious; fussy about small details

title: niff-naffy


text:
broad arrow

Etymology
From, ,.

Noun

 * 1) (A stylized representation of) a metal arrowhead, comprising a tang and two barbs meeting at a point; used traditionally in heraldry, and later by the British government to mark government property and convict uniforms.
 * 2)  An arrow fitted with this arrowhead.
 * 1)  An arrow fitted with this arrowhead.
 * 1)  An arrow fitted with this arrowhead.
 * 1)  An arrow fitted with this arrowhead.

title: broad arrow


text: broad arrows

title: broad arrows


text:
東呉

Proper noun

 * 1)  (229–280)

title: 東呉


text: voetangelen

title: voetangelen


text: prevaricat

title: prevaricat


text:
dry bob

Noun

 * 1)  A schoolboy who goes in for cricket or football etc. in preference to rowing.

title: dry bob


text: dry bobs

title: dry bobs


text:
cheatercock

Noun

 * 1)  Someone who violates rules in order to gain an advantage; a cheater.

title: cheatercock


text:
User talk:용인 학생

HelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHello--현무기휘무기 (talk) 08:59, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

title: User talk:용인 학생


text:
sidey

Adjective

 * 1)  Exhibiting side, or unjustified self-importance; arrogant.
 * 2)  Insignificant; small-time.
 * 1)  Insignificant; small-time.

Translations

 * Polish:

title: sidey


text:
overvoeren

Etymology 1
Compound of.

Verb

 * 1)  to transfer

Etymology 2
From nl.

Verb

 * 1)  to overfeed
 * 2)  to excessively stimulate or burden

Etymology 3
The Woordenboek der Nederlandsche Taal considers this a. The Deutsches Wörterbuch does indeed the attest the phrase. In Dutch this was obviously associated with unrelated in etymology 2 above (which in German, however, is ). The said German phrase is obsolete; one would now say.

Verb

 * 1)  to import in excess, so that demand is over-saturated

title: overvoeren


text:
баялаг

Etymology
From, from ; equivalent to. Cognate with 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬, etc.

Noun

 * 1) riches, wealth
 * 2) richness

title: баялаг


text: Aramaics

title: Aramaics


text:
Talk:sketch

Possible missing sense
Slang: the quality of being "sketchy" or dubious (Canadian or North American slang?). Seen in this Reddit exchange about a cat: "Name's Max. Sweetest, kinda sketchy, little boy." "Every good kitty's gotta a bit of the sketch in them." Equinox ◑ 09:20, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:sketch


text:
米糕米䬫

Idiom

 * 1)  to be hard up; to be short of money

title: 米糕米䬫


text: 米糕米𬲮

title: 米糕米𬲮


text:
米粒

Noun

 * 1) rice grain
 * 2)  granule

title: 米粒


text:
米蕊

Noun

 * 1)  rice grain that has not yet been cooked thoroughly

title: 米蕊


text:
resistibly

Adverb

 * 1) Such that it can be resisted.

title: resistibly


text:
resistibleness

Noun

 * 1) The state or quality of being resistible.

title: resistibleness


text:
米心

Noun

 * 1)  center of a rice grain
 * 2)  rice grain that has not been cooked thoroughly yet

title: 米心


text:
米漿

Noun

 * 1) rice and peanut milk

title: 米漿


text:
米奶

Noun

 * 1) rice milk
 * 2)  rice and peanut milk

Etymology 2
From.

Noun

 * 1)  BMW

title: 米奶


text: 米浆

title: 米浆


text: aansporingen

title: aansporingen


text:
Loipe

Etymology
Early 20th century, from. Related with.

Noun

 * 1) loipe cross-country skiing trail

title: Loipe


text:
aphelenchid

Noun

 * 1) Any nematode of the order

title: aphelenchid


text: aphelenchids

title: aphelenchids


text:
apipuncture

Noun

 * 1) The sting of a bee (as a supposed therapy)

title: apipuncture


text: arbiraterone

title: arbiraterone


text: οὕνεκ'

title: οὕνεκ'


text:
arsenotrophy

Noun

 * 1)  feeding on arsenic compounds (typically by microbes)

Related terms

 * arsenotrophic

title: arsenotrophy


text: Πατρόκλῳ

title: Πατρόκλῳ


text:
arsenotrophic

Adjective

 * 1)  That feeds of arsenic compounds

Related terms

 * arsenotrophy

title: arsenotrophic


text:
dieselmotorvogn

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1)  a diesel multiple unit (DMU), diesel railcar

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1)  a diesel multiple unit (DMU), diesel railcar

title: dieselmotorvogn


text:
asphondyliine

Noun

 * 1) Any gall midge of the tribe

title: asphondyliine


text: asphondyliines

title: asphondyliines


text:
egy darabig

Phrase

 * 1)  for a while, awhile

title: egy darabig


text: atlantoccipital

title: atlantoccipital


text: 大寨

title: 大寨


text:
helajuhla

Etymology

 * the first component is from the same origin as in.

Noun

 * 1) a traditional Finnish festival during which bonfires  are lit

title: helajuhla


text:
auchenorrhynchan

Noun

 * 1) Any cicada or similar insect of the suborder

title: auchenorrhynchan


text: auchenorrhynchans

title: auchenorrhynchans


text: autostimulating

title: autostimulating


text:
δῶ

Etymology 1
From.

Noun

 * 1) house

Verb

 * 1)  when the sense is "tie, fasten"

title: δῶ


text:
backcalculate

Etymology
From.

Verb

 * 1)  To perform backcalculation

title: backcalculate


text: backcalculated

title: backcalculated


text:
bacteriostaticity

Noun

 * 1) The condition of being bacteriostatic

title: bacteriostaticity


text: ISVs

title: ISVs


text: bellfrog

title: bellfrog


text:
bell frog

Noun

 * 1) Any of the genus  of tree frogs'.

title: bell frog


text: bell frogs

title: bell frogs


text:
biodegrader

Noun

 * 1)  Any organism that takes part in biodegradation

title: biodegrader


text: biodegraders

title: biodegraders


text: NODs

title: NODs


text: biofertilisation

title: biofertilisation


text:
superpermutation

Noun

 * 1)  For some value n, a string that contains each permutation of n symbols as a substring.

title: superpermutation


text: biofertiliser

title: biofertiliser


text: superpermutations

title: superpermutations


text: BTECs

title: BTECs


text: dieselmotorvogna

title: dieselmotorvogna


text:
bioluminance

Noun

 * 1) The luminance of a bioluminescent organism

title: bioluminance


text: dieselmotorvognen

title: dieselmotorvognen


text:
biomultiplier

Noun

 * 1)  Any organism (typically a plant) that accumulate toxins from the environment

Related terms

 * biomultiplication

title: biomultiplier


text: biomultipliers

title: biomultipliers


text:
biotribology

Noun

 * 1)  biological tribology

Related terms

 * biotribological

title: biotribology


text:
Talk:mixture

Possible missing sense
Chambers 1908 also has "a preparation in which an insoluble compound is suspended in an aqueous solution". Equinox ◑ 10:37, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I've expanded the "medicinal compound" sense. SemperBlotto (talk) 10:40, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:mixture


text:
biotribological

Adjective

 * 1) Relating to biotribology

title: biotribological


text:
bisphosphoinositide

Noun

 * 1)  Any compound that has two phosphoinositide groups

title: bisphosphoinositide


text: bisphosphoinositides

title: bisphosphoinositides


text:
bovinize

Verb

 * 1)  To introduce bovine genes into the genome of an organism

Related terms

 * bovinization

title: bovinize


text:
bovinization

Noun

 * 1)  The process or the result of bovinizing.

title: bovinization


text: bovinizing

title: bovinizing


text:
carolo

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) hull; husk
 * 2) corncob
 * 3) bread crust
 * 4) inedible or hard inner nucleus of a fruit, such as an apple or a pear
 * 1) bread crust
 * 2) inedible or hard inner nucleus of a fruit, such as an apple or a pear
 * 1) inedible or hard inner nucleus of a fruit, such as an apple or a pear

title: carolo


text:
Template:el-conjug-sub6/documentation

 * This is an internal template called by 2nd category verb inflection templates, it enables the choosing of individual infix values.
 * Compare with which allows for standard infix patterns

Parameters

 * txt   —  manual entry of cell contents, including links etc
 * stem  —  form stem
 * ifx1  —  infix for 1st form
 * ifx2  —  infix for optional 2nd form form
 * end  —  ending
 * blank  —  flag initiating blank o/p (eg no-a-imperfect, etc)

title: Template:el-conjug-sub6/documentation


text:
doeidoei

Etymology

 * compare and 🇨🇬.

title: doeidoei


text:
hoihoi

Etymology

 * compare.

Verb

 * 1) to be interesting, fun

Usage notes
Both and  are pronounced in Neo-Hawaiian as hoyhoy, reflecting.

title: hoihoi


text:
User talk:132.64.70.189

beigeist
Please only add citations that actually contain the word "beigeist"! "Beige" is not evidence. Equinox ◑ 11:01, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

title: User talk:132.64.70.189


text:
Talk:CNY

Initialism for Chinese New Year

 * Wishing you all a happy and prosperous Chinese New Year! Does anyone know whether the term CNY is used as an initialism in other regions besides Singapore and Malaysia? KevinUp (talk) 11:01, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Happy Chinese New Year! I suggest you search for evidence: try Google Books, Google News, and so on. — SGconlaw (talk) 11:03, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I remember sometime a week or two ago, I was scrolling through my WeChat and saw "CNY" used in relation to a pet watching service in Beijing- people that needed their pets watched during the holiday period. That was the first time I had ever seen the initialism. Happy New Year! --Geographyinitiative (talk) 11:08, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Happy CNY! I've definitely seen it used elsewhere, so it's not restricted to Singapore and Malaysia. — justin(r)leung { (t...) 20:29, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * 新年快樂！ I can't say that I've heard of it before. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 21:55, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

 * It's definitely commonly used in Chinese-speaking communities. It may be attestable outside. ---> Tooironic (talk) 01:59, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I looked up the term on Google News (Australia) but nothing came up from that region. Almost all of the search results are from Singapore and Malaysia. I did find the initialism used in the titles of  (China/HK-based news portal),  (China/New York),   (Cambodia), but it's only used in the title. KevinUp (talk) 05:39, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:CNY


text:
ওলন্দাজ

Etymology
.

Proper noun

 * 1) Dutch language

Etymology
. Compare 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬.

Proper noun

 * 1) Dutch (language)
 * 2) Dutch (people)

title: ওলন্দাজ


text: lājù

title: lājù


text: dieselmotorvogner

title: dieselmotorvogner


text: calvarian

title: calvarian


text: dieselmotorvognene

title: dieselmotorvognene


text:
candelabraform

Adjective

 * 1) Having a branched form, similar to that of a candelabrum

title: candelabraform


text:
carbohydrolytic

Adjective

 * 1)  That breaks down complex carbohydrates into simple sugars

title: carbohydrolytic


text:
cephalochromin

Noun

 * 1)  The antibacterial chromenone dimer 5,6,8-trihydroxy-2-methyl-9-(5,6,8-trihydroxy-2-methyl-4-oxo-2,3-dihydrobenzo[g]chromen-9-yl)-2,3-dihydrobenzo[g]chromen-4-one

title: cephalochromin


text:
cervicocranial

Adjective

 * 1)  Relating to the neck and the cranium

title: cervicocranial


text: cervicofascial

title: cervicofascial


text: chrenarchaeal

title: chrenarchaeal


text: chromaffinomas

title: chromaffinomas


text: Category:te:Cities in India

title: Category:te:Cities in India


title: Template:el-conjug-sub5/Table


text:
clinicohistopathological

Adjective

 * 1) clinical and histopathological

title: clinicohistopathological


text:
traction motor

Noun

 * 1)  An electric motor used for the propulsion of a vehicle, such as a tram, trolleybus, electric or diesel-electric locomotive or train.

title: traction motor


text:
coinvade

Verb

 * 1)  To invade along with another organism

title: coinvade


text: coinvaded

title: coinvaded


text: coinvading

title: coinvading


text: traction motors

title: traction motors


text: τέτυκται

title: τέτυκται


text: colposcopical

title: colposcopical


text: Πάτροκλον

title: Πάτροκλον


text: commensalists

title: commensalists


text: compromized

title: compromized


text:
confrontive

Adjective

 * 1) That confronts

Related terms

 * confrontative

title: confrontive


text:
నలందా

Proper noun

 * 1)  A large Buddhist monastery in the ancient kingdom of Magadha (modern-day Bihar) in India.

title: నలందా


text: corticoamigdalohippocampectomy

title: corticoamigdalohippocampectomy


text: κελεύεις

title: κελεύεις


text: crrna

title: crrna


text: crrnas

title: crrnas


text: aanplantingen

title: aanplantingen


text:
craniovascular

Adjective

 * 1)  Relating to the blood vessels of the head

title: craniovascular


text: cycloskeletal

title: cycloskeletal


text: ἑκάστου

title: ἑκάστου


text:
chaquira

Etymology
Early 16th century, from.

Noun

 * 1) bead, wampum

title: chaquira


text: Αἴαντος

title: Αἴαντος


text:
aanplanten

Etymology
Compound of.

Verb

 * 1)  to plant

title: aanplanten


text:
fluyente

Adjective

 * 1) flowing

title: fluyente


text:
acostillado

Adjective

 * 1) ribbed

title: acostillado


text:
kalkaanslag

Etymology
Compound of.

Noun

 * 1)  limescale

title: kalkaanslag


text:
contrarrotativo

Adjective

 * 1) contrarotating

title: contrarrotativo


text:
sovjós

Noun

 * 1) sovkhoz

title: sovjós


text:
bomaanslag

Etymology
Compound of.

Noun

 * 1) bomb attack

title: bomaanslag


text: bomaanslagen

title: bomaanslagen


text: Sangareddy

title: Sangareddy


text:
revisteril

Adjective

 * 1) pertaining to a review (the literary subgenre)

title: revisteril


text:
grecobactriano

Adjective

 * 1) Greco-Bactrian

Noun

 * 1) Greco-Bactrian

title: grecobactriano


text:
prix de marché

Noun

 * 1) market price

Synonyms

 * / /  /  abbreviation
 * / /  /  abbreviation

title: prix de marché


text:
Talk:grecobactriano

needs a f=grecbactriana bit in there. Sadly, this is a n00b account so I can't do it

title: Talk:grecobactriano


text: ἵκηται

title: ἵκηται


text:
perceptrón

Noun

 * 1) perceptron

title: perceptrón


text:
entreala

Noun

 * 1)  inside forward

title: entreala


text: Category:te:Telangana

title: Category:te:Telangana


text: P. M.

title: P. M.


text:
estatalmente

Etymology
From.

Adverb

 * 1) by the state

title: estatalmente


text: Category:en:Telangana

title: Category:en:Telangana


text:
electriz

Etymology
From. Compare 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬 and 🇨🇬.

Noun

 * 1) electress

title: electriz


text:
psicoestimulante

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1) psychostimulant

title: psicoestimulante


text:
roquete

Noun

 * 1) rochet

title: roquete


text:
alcaldicio

Adjective

 * 1) municipal; from the mayor's office

title: alcaldicio


text:
coprófago

Adjective

 * 1) coprophagous

title: coprófago


text: సంగారెడ్డి

title: సంగారెడ్డి


text:
prejuvenil

Adjective

 * 1) in an age group prior to the juvenil (age depends on the country)

title: prejuvenil


text:
cospel

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1) planchet coin blank

title: cospel


text: A. M.

title: A. M.


text:
pitarra

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1)  little bustard

Noun

 * 1) a variety of wine from Extremadura and neighbouring regions

title: pitarra


text:
velasquista

Adjective

 * 1)  of  ; Ibarra's

Noun

 * 1) a supporter of José María Velasco Ibarra

title: velasquista


text:
subcordado

Adjective

 * 1) subcordate

title: subcordado


text:
bocel

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1)  torus a large convex molding

Noun

 * 1) a type of cylindrical mould

title: bocel


text:
yesífero

Etymology
From.

Adjective

 * 1) gypsiferous

title: yesífero


text:
metaserie

Noun

 * 1) metaseries

title: metaserie


text:
mentolisavuke

Noun

 * 1) menthol cigarette

title: mentolisavuke


text:
savukeaski

Noun

 * 1) pack of cigarettes

title: savukeaski


text:
savukekartonki

Noun

 * 1) cigarette carton

title: savukekartonki


text:
savukekotelo

Noun

 * 1) cigarette case

title: savukekotelo


text:
savukepakkaus

Noun

 * 1) cigarette packet

title: savukepakkaus


text:
savukepaperi

Noun

 * 1) cigarette paper

title: savukepaperi


text:
savukerasia

Noun

 * 1) cigarette case

title: savukerasia


text:
savukkeenpätkä

Noun

 * 1) cigarette butt

title: savukkeenpätkä


text:
käännösharjoitus

Noun

 * 1) translation exercise

title: käännösharjoitus


text:
käännöskieli

Noun

 * 1) translationese, a type of interlanguage as a result of a bad translation

title: käännöskieli


text:
käännöskirja

Noun

 * 1) translated book

title: käännöskirja


text:
käännöskirjallisuus

Noun

 * 1) translated literature

title: käännöskirjallisuus


text:
hiperhidrosis

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1) hyperhidrosis

title: hiperhidrosis


text:
käännöskoe

Noun

 * 1) translation test

title: käännöskoe


text:
käännöspalkkio

Noun

 * 1) translation fee, translation reward

title: käännöspalkkio


text:
käännöstehtävä

Noun

 * 1) translation task, translation exercise

title: käännöstehtävä


text:
käännöstoimisto

Noun

 * 1) translation agency, translation office

title: käännöstoimisto


text:
käännöstyö

Noun

 * 1) translation work

title: käännöstyö


text:
käännösvirhe

Noun

 * 1) mistranslation

title: käännösvirhe


text:
konekäännös

Noun

 * 1) machine translation

title: konekäännös


text:
lappalaiskäännös

Noun

 * 1) a method of turning around when skiing by turning one ski at a time

title: lappalaiskäännös


text:
lehmänkäännös

Noun

 * 1)  gybe

title: lehmänkäännös


text:
raakakäännös

Noun

 * 1) raw translation

title: raakakäännös


text:
raamatunkäännös

Noun

 * 1) Bible translation

title: raamatunkäännös


text:
copilotar

Verb

 * 1) to copilot
 * 2) to codrive

title: copilotar


text:
romaanikäännös

Noun

 * 1) translation of a novel

title: romaanikäännös


text:
runokäännös

Noun

 * 1) translation of a poem

title: runokäännös


text:
simultaanikäännös

Noun

 * 1) simultaneous translation

title: simultaanikäännös


text:
pilanpäiten

Etymology

 * a combination of the genitive or instructive singular of  and the causative plural of.

Adverb

 * 1) as a joke, for fun

title: pilanpäiten


text:
pilanteko

Noun

 * 1) pranking, jest

title: pilanteko


text:
pilaesitys

Noun

 * 1) satirical play

title: pilaesitys


text:
pilahinta

Noun

 * 1) measly price

title: pilahinta


text:
pilajuttu

Noun

 * 1) wisecrack, crack, joke

title: pilajuttu


text:
galeaza

Noun

 * 1) galleass

title: galeaza


text:
pilalaulu

Noun

 * 1) parody song, joke song

title: pilalaulu


text:
pilalehti

Noun

 * 1) satirical magazine

title: pilalehti


text:
pilapuhe

Noun

 * 1) jibe, crack, wisecrack

title: pilapuhe


text:
hankikeli

Noun

 * 1) weather with blankets of snow

title: hankikeli


text:
hiihtokeli

Noun

 * 1) skiing conditions, good weather for skiing

title: hiihtokeli


text:
kesäkeli

Noun

 * 1) summer weather

title: kesäkeli


text:
kurakeli

Noun

 * 1) muddy weather

title: kurakeli


text:
lehtikeli

Noun

 * 1) weather with lots of leaves on the ground

title: lehtikeli


text:
lumikeli

Noun

 * 1) snowy weather

title: lumikeli


text:
nollakeli

Noun

 * 1) weather with around zero (Celsius) degrees of temperature

title: nollakeli


text:
nuoskakeli

Noun

 * 1) weather with packing snow

title: nuoskakeli


text:
pääkallokeli

Noun

 * 1) dangerously slippery weather conditions

title: pääkallokeli


text:
hexacampeón

Etymology
From.

Noun

 * 1) six-time champion

title: hexacampeón


text:
rapakeli

Noun

 * 1) muddy weather

title: rapakeli


text:
rekikeli

Noun

 * 1) good weather for driving a sleigh or sled

title: rekikeli


text:
suksikeli

Noun

 * 1) good weather conditions for skiing

title: suksikeli


text:
suojakeli

Noun

 * 1) thaw warmth of weather sufficient to melt that which is frozen

title: suojakeli


text:
talvikeli

Noun

 * 1) winter weather

title: talvikeli