text:
User talk:-sche/Archive/2018

Westphalian
, if you have a second, could you weigh in here. Much appreciated. --Victar (talk) 14:35, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

WT:RFM
As always, there is a backlog of language code discussions that could use some attention. Hardly anyone comments in a substantive way, let alone a scholarly way, on the issues I raise there, so your input is much appreciated. I'll try to clean out the ones that you've actually responded to. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 22:15, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

 * Thank you for the reminder; it prompted me to spend the past few weeks (and hopefully coming weeks) going through more of the requests. I could (and perhaps should) go through adding codes much faster if I only segregated out the ones that seem like they might need further checking to be sure there is content in them (e.g. Gamela, and maybe Èrsh depending on whether more than placenames are attested and what language we prefer to include the placenames as), and just added all the rest in one go, but I try to find and add content in them at the same time as I add the codes, which slows things down. On a related note, it is probably time to start going through the chaos of Category:Tasmanian language and assigning the words to actual languages. - -sche (discuss) 06:56, 19 January 2018 (UTC)

 * Just as you started to catch up, we got swamped with a new deployment of ISO codes: WT:Requests for moves, mergers and splits. Most of these should be fairly straightforward, but I'd especially like your input on those for which I have abstained or disagreed with the ISO outcome. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 10:42, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

 * It always interests me that we and the ISO/SIL find different things to grant new codes to — we have a lot of exceptional codes they haven't added yet, while all of their additions look like things we hadn't spotted. Cuitlatec is also interesting because I also thought I had read somewhere that the ISO/SIL/Ethnologue had decided not to grant codes to any more extinct languages besides the ones already included, but perhaps I misremember. Anyway, thanks for spotting the changes; I've retired all the codes they retired and will look into the rest. - -sche (discuss) 17:55, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

 * I remember reading that about extinct languages too! I had actually spotted one of the missing codes already (Nzadi), but I hadn't gotten around to posting about it on RFM because it's part of a confusing and mostly poorly documented cluster of uncoded languages, which still need to be addressed at some point. If you ever care enough about ridding us of exceptional codes, we could team up to submit some requests and see if we get any.  —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 18:45, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

schließen
Hey. This has been on WT:RFC for 200 years, more or less. It looks to me to have been cleaned up already - is the conjugation correct now? If so, we can remove it from the RFC page. --Gente como tú (talk) 12:40, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

 * I think it can be removed from RFC, because it now uses its own custom conjugation template, so any additional forms that need to be added can just be added. - -sche (discuss) 06:45, 19 January 2018 (UTC)

I have been using since I learnt how to spell, and I don't see any need to change and I don't consider it offensive. It can't be eliminated entirely, all words in all languages remember? It may be worth listening to the pronunciations here. BTW, you undid all of my revision. DonnanZ (talk) 18:56, 21 January 2018 (UTC)
 * -sche said "that spelling is dated and chiefly used by Islamophobes these days, as the entry warns, and is just an extra click users have to make to get to the lemma". There are several important considerations here. You may not consider it offensive, but its use is often intended to be thus (as our entry documents). The pronunciations are irrelevant, because we are talking about spelling. And "all words in all languages" refers to the fact that we should (and do) have an entry for, not that you should use a spelling that requires users to click through in order to find content. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 20:43, 21 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, my opinion is that there's no need to list a dated and sometimes pejorative/offensive alternative form, which is also not the lemma, anyway (so users who click on it then have to click again to get to the definitions at Muslim). I'm sorry I undid the other parts of your edit; I have now restored them. - -sche (discuss) 22:32, 21 January 2018 (UTC)

male
Template:seemreCites in sense 1. (Also, I have some research associates in this specific topic.) - Amgine/t · e 15:07, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for catching that typo! :) I'd appreciate more feedback from knowledgeable people on how this word could be defined, if they'd like to take a look, though please consider what's been said in Tea room/2018/February, particularly about the inclusion of any more qualifiers ("[typically] has a penis"—but not all species or individuals who are referred to as male do; "[typically] has XY chromosomes"—but not all species or individuals do, references to "XX male" people are numerous; etc). One must be cautiously aware of how (flexibly) the word is actually used. - -sche (discuss) 15:28, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
 * In humans there are many variants of sex-linked genes, not simply two. Phenotypic expression (having 'typical' genitals) mismatching sex-linked genes is rather more common than many 'normal' genetic variations, for example red hair or A+ blood type. Although rare in mammals, phenotypic expression can change from one to another; this is more common in other animals - for example parrot fish. My partner's implications for practice essay on the topic. - Amgine/t · e 20:54, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Todo/Non-templatised genders (old)
Hey. Is Todo/Non-templatised genders still useful? Can it be regenerated? --Otra cuenta105 (talk) 20:46, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
 * I regenerated it in AWB, but found that it was mostly false positives (cases where e.g. "n" was mentioned as a letter, or sometimes short for "noun". So I regenerated it in a probably over-narrow way. - -sche (discuss) 03:34, 19 February 2018 (UTC)
 * (Regenerated again. - -sche (discuss) 20:20, 24 October 2019 (UTC))

from from
Hey. I've also noticed you adding "from from" in etymologies. It's a weird mistake, but please try not to make it. Thanks for your awesome work. --Otra cuenta105 (talk) 21:01, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

 * Can you point to examples? I usually find myself cleaning up the error, including working from the cleanup list that probably inspired you to make this post. :p - -sche (discuss) 21:04, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

 * I went for the old-fashioned googling approach. Typing "from from" site:en.wiktionary.org and then searching "from from" in the browser brings up a ridiculously big number of such things. Maybe most of them are not done by you, but I suspect you're a member of The Etymology Club, who is responsible for this henious crime. --Otra cuenta105 (talk) 21:11, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
 * When I search for the "from from" in quotes using Wiktionary's search, I get about 125 entries. Most of those have from ending a line and from beginning the following line. I cleaned up three so far. DCDuring (talk) 21:51, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
 * A more precise search line is:

"from from" insource:/[fF]rom [fF]rom/
 * Running it now shows no such duplications occur. Thanks for noticing the problem. There must have been more than 30 or more of them, mostly in etymologies. DCDuring (talk) 22:11, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

Statistics/generated
Another question for you while I've got your attention. Why the heck does Statistics/generated take so long to sort in ascending order? --Otra cuenta105 (talk) 21:17, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Probably because we include so many languages. - -sche (discuss) 21:20, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

kimono usage note
Did you mean "literary"? DTLHS (talk) 02:01, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Oh! I'm glad you caught that typo. I meant "literal". Literary might also be accurate. - -sche (discuss) 02:08, 25 February 2018 (UTC)

truther
I think your rollback is in error because there is a profound lack of clarity and bias in the definition. Let's discuss this on the definition discussion page. ~ JasonCarswell (talk)

Manners
Calling me "stick in the mud" is rude. Please desist. --Dan Polansky (talk) 15:37, 17 March 2018 (UTC)

Bureaucratic masturbation
You wrote in an edit summary: "since I'll make use of this section as part of my general opposition to what one of our more colourful users once called bureaucratic masturbation".

A cheap trick, isn't it? The responsibility for inflamming the discussion by using terms like "bureaucratic masturbation" is yours; you cannot shift the responsibility to unnamed "colourful users".

Prevalence:.

--Dan Polansky (talk) 16:06, 17 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Firstly, a warning: the behaviour you are engaging in is not an appropriate use of a Wiktionary talk page. Secondly, you are either ignorant or lying; either way, you have decided to attack -sche in bad faith. That phrase was first notably used at Wiktionary by Dick Laurent, and searching the site would have revealed that very quickly if you had bothered to try. —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 20:47, 17 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Huh? I do not deny that the phrase was used by someone else before; indeed, the link above I provided makes it very easy to verify. Rather, I point out that people are responsible for their use of phrases regardless of whether these phrases were used by someone else before. I believe that the use of the phrase is rude, unnecessary, inflammatory, and therefore to be avoided. A talk page seems like one obvious venue to raise that in; I do not see why e.g. Beer parlour would be a better venue. --Dan Polansky (talk) 20:56, 17 March 2018 (UTC)

xmn
Hi -sche. When you changed the language code xmn to pal, I think you missed a few. They are in CAT:E. —Internoob 23:32, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

Code for Kam-Sui language family
Hi there. I think we need a code for. What do you think it should be? — justin(r)leung { (t...) 02:51, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

 * Since no (super-)family to which it belongs has an ISO code, it'll need a  code, like , or any other three letters that approximate the name of the family if you would find e.g. something with a vowel in it like   easier to remember/use. (You may already know this, but for the benefit of anyone who doesn't, how to construct codes is documented in Families.) - -sche (discuss) 03:10, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

 * looks good to me. Thanks! — justin(r)leung { (t...) 03:25, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

Hi again. Do you think we need a code for Hlai languages (which is the family including Hlai and related languages, like Cun)? — justin(r)leung { (t...) 02:51, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

 * How many languages would go in the family? It looks like most of the Hlai lects are currently lumped into one language code, lic. If there would only be a couple of languages in the family, it might not be that useful, unless it would help you in some other way — for example, if you need to be able to say "from a Hlai language" in etymologies, then go ahead and create a family code (although, if there really would be just two languages/codes in the family, it would seem like etymologies could say "from Hlai or Cun"). - -sche (discuss) 03:13, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

 * Well, there's, which is used sometimes for comparison in Chinese etymologies and can be used for Hlai/Cun/Jiamao entries. (Ethnologue seems to put Cun under Kra rather than Hlai, but Glottolog puts it under Nuclear Hlai.) — justin(r)leung { (t...) 03:25, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

 * As I skimmed through Norquest's reconstruction of Proto-Hlai, it seems like even Jiamao's classification into Hlai is doubtful. Since we're treating all the varieties of Hlai as one language, I'm not sure how we could include something like Proto-Hlai in etymologies. — justin(r)leung { (t...) 03:41, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

 * Well, we do have Proto-Basque, despite the Vasconic family consisting of only Basque and arguably Aquitanian, so a family being ultra-small doesn't stop us from including Proto-Hlai if scholars have reconstructed it. (And I think we usually create a family code whenever we create a proto-language code.) If you'd like to include Proto-Hlai reconstructions, then go ahead and create a code. (Do you think the Hlai varieties should be split? Or are they, like Zhuang, usually treated/standardized as one language?) - -sche (discuss) 04:37, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

 * The written language is only standardized to the Ha dialect, similar to the situation with standard Zhuang. I'm not sure how other dialects are written (or if they are written at all). It's usually treated as one language, so I think we should leave it as is for now. — justin(r)leung { (t...) 05:27, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

The Tai-Kadai node above Kam-Sui has an ISO 639 code, "tai". Evertype (talk) 22:35, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

 * If I'm not mistaken,  is for Tai languages which is one of the branches of the Tai-Kadai family, not the same as the Tai-Kadai family itself. Hlai and Kam-Sui are sisters to Tai. — justin(r)leung { (t...) 03:03, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

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Old High German Ôstara
Hello, I'm confused on why you marked the template for clean up when it is quite neat in its presentation. I had to use a blank template so I can put all the correct declined words. Leornendeealdenglisc (talk) 08:15, 6 April 2018 (UTC)

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Addition of Idiom Neutral to Module:languages/datax
I see you edited Module:languages/datax today. Could you take a look at my request at the talk page? 10:38, 23 April 2018 (UTC)

usex at down, 2015

 * I no longer recall... possibly so that it didn't sound like AAVE speakers were the only ones who used the (widespread) sense. - -sche (discuss) 16:04, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

Middle English Etymology
Hi--thanks for fixing those etymologies from the non-lemmas. I included them because I didn't realize that I could just have the Etymology heading without any content, but I'm glad to know that's not necessary. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 23:41, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

 * No problem. :) By the way, the reason I noticed them in the first place is that you used and similar templates to link to other words in the same language, which caused them to be categorized as "twice-borrowed", which should actually only happen in a case like . If you just need to mention that the current word is a variant of another word in the same language, you can either just use  (it's assumed the word is in the same language unless otherwise specified), or . - -sche (discuss) 17:34, 10 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Ohh, right, now I see that. That was carelessness, I'll admit.  I know not to use the  and the like with the same language (I had made that mistake in the past), but with some of these I had imported existing etymologies from the en entries of direct descendants (e.g.  for  where it was applicable (i.e. when the enm members were mentioned in the en etymologies), and in some cases I must have accidentally just changed en to enm for enm members of chains instead of fixing to the .  In any case, I'll not do that again. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 22:22, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Just a quick question...
Do you have any idea why /æɹ/ and /ɛəɹ/ distribution differs slightly between British English and some North American English dialects lacking the Mary-marry-merry merger, such as my own? Is it due to hypercorrection, or is it due to something else? To be more specific, /ɛəɹ/ in my dialect is never where /æɹ/ ought to be, but /æɹ/ is sometimes where /ɛəɹ/ is in British English. I'm not sure if I asked you this question before, but if I did, I don't remember your answer. I'm just wondering. Tharthan (talk) 19:37, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

 * That's an interesting situation; I'm not familiar with it, and don't know a cause. If you can't find a historical reason (e.g., if the forerunners of your dialect community spoke a variety of English with a different distribution of those sounds than current canonical/common BrE), perhaps it's interference from other dialects that are around you geographically or in media, or just . If it interests you, you might try to track what words it happens in and look for commonalities (which could be clues), like if certain phonological environments trigger, enable, or prevent it, or if the words affected are ones you hear from outsiders more than from fellow dialect-speakers (perhaps leading to something like hypercorrection, as you speculate, if you unmerge the sounds "wrong"), or if the words tend to be ones you use a very little (which might thus be "book words" your brain guessed the "wrong" unmerged sound for) or if they're words you use a lot, or if the shift helps distinguish the words from (or draws them closer to) other words. - -sche (discuss) 05:37, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Trans definitions
Thank you for your attention to the edits around trans and cis terminology. I have not edited Wiktionary before and am not terrifically familiar with the platform. (Thank you as well if it was you that unblocked me - it was very upsetting having my first edits result in a ban for "gibberish" when I explained all of them and provided citations!) The entries for "transmasculine" and "transfeminine" are still not quite accurate - in retrospect I should have checked elsewhere first for clearer definitions, as on Wikipedia "transfeminine" is defined as "an umbrella term describing individuals who were male at birth but identify on the female side of the gender spectrum" and on the Gender Wiki it is defined as "a term used to describe transgender people who were assigned male at birth, but identify with femininity to a greater extent than with masculinity". Both of these are accurate and much clearer. The main idea is that "transfeminine" describes feminine trans people who were assigned male at birth; it is not exactly a synonym either for "trans women" or for "feminine trans people" because the former is not inclusive of transfeminine nonbinary people and the latter is overly inclusive (i.e. includes feminine trans people who were assigned female at birth). I don't mean to heap more work on you but frankly I'm afraid that if I make the edits myself I'll just be banned for gibberish again. Best wishes.

Please delete اسهال
Hello, please delete this page to make room for a move. I have copied the information. Thank you.Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:14, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:26, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Middle English Etymology
Hi--thanks for fixing those etymologies from the non-lemmas. I included them because I didn't realize that I could just have the Etymology heading without any content, but I'm glad to know that's not necessary. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 23:41, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

 * No problem. :) By the way, the reason I noticed them in the first place is that you used and similar templates to link to other words in the same language, which caused them to be categorized as "twice-borrowed", which should actually only happen in a case like . If you just need to mention that the current word is a variant of another word in the same language, you can either just use  (it's assumed the word is in the same language unless otherwise specified), or . - -sche (discuss) 17:34, 10 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Ohh, right, now I see that. That was carelessness, I'll admit.  I know not to use the  and the like with the same language (I had made that mistake in the past), but with some of these I had imported existing etymologies from the en entries of direct descendants (e.g.  for  where it was applicable (i.e. when the enm members were mentioned in the en etymologies), and in some cases I must have accidentally just changed en to enm for enm members of chains instead of fixing to the .  In any case, I'll not do that again. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 22:22, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Just a quick question...
Do you have any idea why /æɹ/ and /ɛəɹ/ distribution differs slightly between British English and some North American English dialects lacking the Mary-marry-merry merger, such as my own? Is it due to hypercorrection, or is it due to something else? To be more specific, /ɛəɹ/ in my dialect is never where /æɹ/ ought to be, but /æɹ/ is sometimes where /ɛəɹ/ is in British English. I'm not sure if I asked you this question before, but if I did, I don't remember your answer. I'm just wondering. Tharthan (talk) 19:37, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

 * That's an interesting situation; I'm not familiar with it, and don't know a cause. If you can't find a historical reason (e.g., if the forerunners of your dialect community spoke a variety of English with a different distribution of those sounds than current canonical/common BrE), perhaps it's interference from other dialects that are around you geographically or in media, or just . If it interests you, you might try to track what words it happens in and look for commonalities (which could be clues), like if certain phonological environments trigger, enable, or prevent it, or if the words affected are ones you hear from outsiders more than from fellow dialect-speakers (perhaps leading to something like hypercorrection, as you speculate, if you unmerge the sounds "wrong"), or if the words tend to be ones you use a very little (which might thus be "book words" your brain guessed the "wrong" unmerged sound for) or if they're words you use a lot, or if the shift helps distinguish the words from (or draws them closer to) other words. - -sche (discuss) 05:37, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Trans definitions
Thank you for your attention to the edits around trans and cis terminology. I have not edited Wiktionary before and am not terrifically familiar with the platform. (Thank you as well if it was you that unblocked me - it was very upsetting having my first edits result in a ban for "gibberish" when I explained all of them and provided citations!) The entries for "transmasculine" and "transfeminine" are still not quite accurate - in retrospect I should have checked elsewhere first for clearer definitions, as on Wikipedia "transfeminine" is defined as "an umbrella term describing individuals who were male at birth but identify on the female side of the gender spectrum" and on the Gender Wiki it is defined as "a term used to describe transgender people who were assigned male at birth, but identify with femininity to a greater extent than with masculinity". Both of these are accurate and much clearer. The main idea is that "transfeminine" describes feminine trans people who were assigned male at birth; it is not exactly a synonym either for "trans women" or for "feminine trans people" because the former is not inclusive of transfeminine nonbinary people and the latter is overly inclusive (i.e. includes feminine trans people who were assigned female at birth). I don't mean to heap more work on you but frankly I'm afraid that if I make the edits myself I'll just be banned for gibberish again. Best wishes.

Please delete اسهال
Hello, please delete this page to make room for a move. I have copied the information. Thank you.Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:14, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:26, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Middle English Etymology
Hi--thanks for fixing those etymologies from the non-lemmas. I included them because I didn't realize that I could just have the Etymology heading without any content, but I'm glad to know that's not necessary. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 23:41, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

 * No problem. :) By the way, the reason I noticed them in the first place is that you used and similar templates to link to other words in the same language, which caused them to be categorized as "twice-borrowed", which should actually only happen in a case like . If you just need to mention that the current word is a variant of another word in the same language, you can either just use  (it's assumed the word is in the same language unless otherwise specified), or . - -sche (discuss) 17:34, 10 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Ohh, right, now I see that. That was carelessness, I'll admit.  I know not to use the  and the like with the same language (I had made that mistake in the past), but with some of these I had imported existing etymologies from the en entries of direct descendants (e.g.  for  where it was applicable (i.e. when the enm members were mentioned in the en etymologies), and in some cases I must have accidentally just changed en to enm for enm members of chains instead of fixing to the .  In any case, I'll not do that again. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 22:22, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Just a quick question...
Do you have any idea why /æɹ/ and /ɛəɹ/ distribution differs slightly between British English and some North American English dialects lacking the Mary-marry-merry merger, such as my own? Is it due to hypercorrection, or is it due to something else? To be more specific, /ɛəɹ/ in my dialect is never where /æɹ/ ought to be, but /æɹ/ is sometimes where /ɛəɹ/ is in British English. I'm not sure if I asked you this question before, but if I did, I don't remember your answer. I'm just wondering. Tharthan (talk) 19:37, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

 * That's an interesting situation; I'm not familiar with it, and don't know a cause. If you can't find a historical reason (e.g., if the forerunners of your dialect community spoke a variety of English with a different distribution of those sounds than current canonical/common BrE), perhaps it's interference from other dialects that are around you geographically or in media, or just . If it interests you, you might try to track what words it happens in and look for commonalities (which could be clues), like if certain phonological environments trigger, enable, or prevent it, or if the words affected are ones you hear from outsiders more than from fellow dialect-speakers (perhaps leading to something like hypercorrection, as you speculate, if you unmerge the sounds "wrong"), or if the words tend to be ones you use a very little (which might thus be "book words" your brain guessed the "wrong" unmerged sound for) or if they're words you use a lot, or if the shift helps distinguish the words from (or draws them closer to) other words. - -sche (discuss) 05:37, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Trans definitions
Thank you for your attention to the edits around trans and cis terminology. I have not edited Wiktionary before and am not terrifically familiar with the platform. (Thank you as well if it was you that unblocked me - it was very upsetting having my first edits result in a ban for "gibberish" when I explained all of them and provided citations!) The entries for "transmasculine" and "transfeminine" are still not quite accurate - in retrospect I should have checked elsewhere first for clearer definitions, as on Wikipedia "transfeminine" is defined as "an umbrella term describing individuals who were male at birth but identify on the female side of the gender spectrum" and on the Gender Wiki it is defined as "a term used to describe transgender people who were assigned male at birth, but identify with femininity to a greater extent than with masculinity". Both of these are accurate and much clearer. The main idea is that "transfeminine" describes feminine trans people who were assigned male at birth; it is not exactly a synonym either for "trans women" or for "feminine trans people" because the former is not inclusive of transfeminine nonbinary people and the latter is overly inclusive (i.e. includes feminine trans people who were assigned female at birth). I don't mean to heap more work on you but frankly I'm afraid that if I make the edits myself I'll just be banned for gibberish again. Best wishes.

Please delete اسهال
Hello, please delete this page to make room for a move. I have copied the information. Thank you.Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:14, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:26, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Middle English Etymology
Hi--thanks for fixing those etymologies from the non-lemmas. I included them because I didn't realize that I could just have the Etymology heading without any content, but I'm glad to know that's not necessary. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 23:41, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

 * No problem. :) By the way, the reason I noticed them in the first place is that you used and similar templates to link to other words in the same language, which caused them to be categorized as "twice-borrowed", which should actually only happen in a case like . If you just need to mention that the current word is a variant of another word in the same language, you can either just use  (it's assumed the word is in the same language unless otherwise specified), or . - -sche (discuss) 17:34, 10 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Ohh, right, now I see that. That was carelessness, I'll admit.  I know not to use the  and the like with the same language (I had made that mistake in the past), but with some of these I had imported existing etymologies from the en entries of direct descendants (e.g.  for  where it was applicable (i.e. when the enm members were mentioned in the en etymologies), and in some cases I must have accidentally just changed en to enm for enm members of chains instead of fixing to the .  In any case, I'll not do that again. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 22:22, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Just a quick question...
Do you have any idea why /æɹ/ and /ɛəɹ/ distribution differs slightly between British English and some North American English dialects lacking the Mary-marry-merry merger, such as my own? Is it due to hypercorrection, or is it due to something else? To be more specific, /ɛəɹ/ in my dialect is never where /æɹ/ ought to be, but /æɹ/ is sometimes where /ɛəɹ/ is in British English. I'm not sure if I asked you this question before, but if I did, I don't remember your answer. I'm just wondering. Tharthan (talk) 19:37, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

 * That's an interesting situation; I'm not familiar with it, and don't know a cause. If you can't find a historical reason (e.g., if the forerunners of your dialect community spoke a variety of English with a different distribution of those sounds than current canonical/common BrE), perhaps it's interference from other dialects that are around you geographically or in media, or just . If it interests you, you might try to track what words it happens in and look for commonalities (which could be clues), like if certain phonological environments trigger, enable, or prevent it, or if the words affected are ones you hear from outsiders more than from fellow dialect-speakers (perhaps leading to something like hypercorrection, as you speculate, if you unmerge the sounds "wrong"), or if the words tend to be ones you use a very little (which might thus be "book words" your brain guessed the "wrong" unmerged sound for) or if they're words you use a lot, or if the shift helps distinguish the words from (or draws them closer to) other words. - -sche (discuss) 05:37, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Trans definitions
Thank you for your attention to the edits around trans and cis terminology. I have not edited Wiktionary before and am not terrifically familiar with the platform. (Thank you as well if it was you that unblocked me - it was very upsetting having my first edits result in a ban for "gibberish" when I explained all of them and provided citations!) The entries for "transmasculine" and "transfeminine" are still not quite accurate - in retrospect I should have checked elsewhere first for clearer definitions, as on Wikipedia "transfeminine" is defined as "an umbrella term describing individuals who were male at birth but identify on the female side of the gender spectrum" and on the Gender Wiki it is defined as "a term used to describe transgender people who were assigned male at birth, but identify with femininity to a greater extent than with masculinity". Both of these are accurate and much clearer. The main idea is that "transfeminine" describes feminine trans people who were assigned male at birth; it is not exactly a synonym either for "trans women" or for "feminine trans people" because the former is not inclusive of transfeminine nonbinary people and the latter is overly inclusive (i.e. includes feminine trans people who were assigned female at birth). I don't mean to heap more work on you but frankly I'm afraid that if I make the edits myself I'll just be banned for gibberish again. Best wishes.

Please delete اسهال
Hello, please delete this page to make room for a move. I have copied the information. Thank you.Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:14, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 18:26, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

carranchano?
We don't even have a definition for yet. SemperBlotto (talk) 05:20, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Minderico
To answer your comment, I never found any evidence that Minderico is anything more than a cant like Lunfardo or Polari. Most of my research was done in 2013~2014. The only linguistic information I was able to find were glossaries. I never found anything about its phonological system or syntax, and the glossaries consisted of high-content lexical items. I also remember that one of the arguments someone made in favour of classifying it as a language was that Minderico is passed from father to child rather than being learned. This circumstantial evidence convinced me that Minderico is a cant, but I chose not to nominate the langcode for deletion before I had more information.

Incidentally, I was similarly stumped when I sought material on the so-called Cafundó Creole, but some authors did something much more shady: they described some syntactic and phonological characteristics of the “creole” that proved that it was different from Portuguese, but in fact those characteristics were also found in the low-prestige dialect of Portuguese spoken in the same area. — Ungoliant (falai) 18:19, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

 * Should it be relabelled / merged into Portuguese, then, you think? Will that effectively ban it? (Do we care?) I notice that even a basic word like carranchano doesn't seem like it would meet WDL requirements. - -sche (discuss) 19:04, 19 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I wouldn’t make this call without knowing more about Minderico, but even if it is merged with Portuguese, we can have a full appendix page with words. — Ungoliant (falai) 19:09, 19 June 2018 (UTC)
 * OK. I've moved the entry to Appendix:Minderico, but left the language code as-is. - -sche (discuss) 19:34, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Sum of parts
I've generally only done that when it's stood out as notable and recurrently used over years in different contexts. "Individual racism" is an important concept especially now with pushes to narrow the definition of racism from its previously broad past to only refer to systemic/historic ones. Fake family units are a much more notable concept than fake motorcycle licenses. The latter has not come up as the main concept of several movies and present political issues.

SoP is a potentially very broad objection which could result in the loss of many useful pages if the basis was that we shouldn't recognize compound words and just let people figure it out for themselves. ScratchMarshall (talk) 01:36, 23 June 2018 (UTC)

Kermanic language codes
Hey -sche, could I get you to comment on Etymology_scriptorium? Thanks! --Victar (talk) 21:05, 4 July 2018 (UTC)

"Lives" in the context of life insurance
Re: diff. Since you ask, yes: this terminology is still used in life insurance today. But it refers not to a policy but to a life assured (a somewhat subtle difference that only matters when discussing joint life contracts). I've edited accordingly. :-) -Stelio (talk) 10:07, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

 * Neat; thanks! I wonder if those are distinct senses, though. The Century Dictionary is where I found the sense, as "an insurance on a person's life; a life insurance policy". Does one speak of renewing a life assured, or of an assured life lapsing? If so, I guess it is best handled as the same sense, but for comparison: I asked some baseball fans about the baseball sense to see if it was still current, and they insisted it would only ever have been metaphor, like "the mistake gave the batter new life", because that's the only way they were familiar with it — but old examples make clear (IMO) it had a different (specific, idiomatic) sense a century ago. Btw, from the usage notes on life assured, it looks like that entry itself may really be two senses that belong in two different entries, life assured and assured life... - -sche (discuss) 16:54, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

 * That's a good point. When life insurance started, it will have been only single life (with joint life a later innovation, although I don't have records to say how later). As such, the idea of a "life" being a life assured could be equivalent to a policy. So perhaps there's a sense of "a life assured" (still in use) and a separate sense (by extension, obsolete) "a life insurance policy". That seems a fine stance to take, given citations, and I'd be happy with that.
 * Heh, I added the entry for life assured just before posting here. ;-) It felt to me like "life assured" was a valid entry but that "assured lives" is more sum-of-parts (lives that are assured). It was a subjective stance. -Stelio (talk) 19:52, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Special:Contributions/2A01:E35:2E6F:D760:64:CE18:477E:1ED5
I suspect our bad Thai IP is now using a French IP- the style of their Verlan edits and their obsession with adding inflection templates to anything that moves are very suggestive. Unfortunately, my German isn't good enough to tell if their German edits make any sense. Please have a look. Thanks! Chuck Entz (talk) 13:35, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

 * It's a mixed bag, e.g. the declension of Scheiß was wrong, Scheiße was merely lacking a header, and fixing the POS of qqn seems helpful. The edits to e.g. and p. ex. were misguided but the sort of understandable mistakes a relatively new user (who had just edited labels and seen in other entries) might make... but the haphazard interests of the IP and the quick arrival at that editor's favored topic of verlan, suggest it might not be a new user at all. - -sche (discuss) 14:10, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

Iroquois
Thanks so much for your formatting assistance on Iroquois! I'd kept trying to mark it in the IPA template itself, to multitudinous error messages. 76.10.186.58 05:26, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

What do you think about ?
Following. Do you think that it is only to be used for multi-sense terms, provided the categorization is not different (which it is when for example writing rare or archaic)? is probably more visible for you, on the other hand this largely rests on old habits and we could deploy further to make it more familiar and it or a predecessor probably should have been used much earlier. Fay Freak (talk) 10:11, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

 * When I created it (as Template:term-context, back in the era of Template:context), I envisioned it as enabling a distinction between e.g. entirely archaic words/spellings vs still-common terms with a single archaic sense, and as enabling not having lengthy not-meaning-specific labels like "American spelling" or "British spelling" take up space in front of all the meanings of especially a highly polysemous word with other labels like [[realize]]. (I am surprised at how much it's caught on, which still isn't that much.)
 * To me, "bally means balaclava in MLE" feels more like sense/definition/"meaning"-specific information, like disco fries being a NJ/NY term and hence also led on the sense-line even though it only has one sense — because terms in dialects could have or develop other senses that aren't limited to the dialect, like stoop or favor do (and having the label in the same place in disco fries and stoop seems helpful to me). Whereas, something like "flavour is a British spelling" is what feels like term-level information to me, since it's unlikely flavour would develop a sense that wasn't limited to British spelling.
 * But it is debatable, and using on bally is arguably consistent with what the documentation of that template says. Maybe we should change the documentation, or maybe that's how the template has come to be used / how people want to use it and and I should change my ideas about it. - -sche (discuss) 08:11, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Are quotation templates reference templates?
Yesterday, you renamed a template to be R:pi:Sai Kam Mong. Now, I had decided not to give it a name like that because it is not being used in a reference section (under '===References==='), but as an expansion of '#* Quotations' in WT:EL. I had half-expected to need a prefix 'Q:', but that is not defined. Are you sure this template deserves an 'R:' prefix?

If it does, there's the group of templates that invoke it that I should probably similarly rename. I'm making the texts that I have work very hard, but as at the moment I'm just using them to confirm the spelling of known words in a less familiar script, I don't think it is unreasonable to work them hard.

Alternatively, this template, but not its invokers, deserves the 'R' prefix because it can be used to define a citation by giving it no arguments. I don't think I will use that functionality, but it's there in case anyone needs it. Please advise. - RichardW57 (talk) 13:58, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

 * Sorry, I initially interpreted it as a reference template, because the displayed content made it look like one, and then I didn't have time to reformat it as a template when I saw that that was what it was aiming at, so I posted a note on WT:RFM. It looks like it should be formatted as a "RQ" template; I will try to help you with that. - -sche (discuss) 18:49, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Derp.
Ya. It's late, and I'm feeling stupider than normal after a few longer-than-normal weeks IRL. I appreciate. ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 05:07, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

use
Hi, in this edit made back in March, you left a comment "will specify with glosses shortly" under the "Verb > Notes" section of use, referring to the senses that are pronounced /juːs/ rather than /juːz/. It seems you never got back to do that, with the result that the note is presently in a somewhat unclear state. It is also not clear what "respectively" refers to, and not very clear in what situations "use" in "did not use" is pronounced as /juːs/. I could try and fix it up myself, but perhaps you may remember exactly what you had in mind and may prefer to complete it yourself. Mihia (talk) 20:14, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

 * Thanks for catching this. The part about glosses was just that I intended to provide a terse gloss of (the former) "sense 1" etc in place of those numbers, since numbers are subject to change (indeed, my edit reordered the definitions). The old note claimed that both the "habituate" and "habitually do / employ" senses were pronounced with /s/, but I'm only familiar with "habituate" being pronounced that way, so that's the only sense I've edited the usage note to say has that pronunciation. "Respectively" seems superfluous and I removed it, and indeed rewrote the note. "Did not use" would be pronounced with /s/ in a sentence like "the soldiers did not use [=habituate] to the hard weather", I think. But please revise it further, or let me know, if there are still nay problems (or omissions) ... :) - -sche (discuss) 01:10, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

 * Thanks for looking at it. I think the second sense pronounced as /juːs/ was supposed to be the "I used to like her" sense, with negative "I didn't use to like her" (their example presently "I used to get things done"). Do you not pronounce that one as /juːs/? I also question the statement that the "to accustom; to habituate" sense (the other "used to" sense) "is now found chiefly in the past tense, and as a past participle". As far as I can think, this sense is only nowadays used as a past participle, as in "I am used to hard work". Did you have an example of ordinary modern past tense use in mind? It could be that I am misunderstanding something here. Mihia (talk) 11:13, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Extension:PageNotice
-sche, how should we move forward with mw:Extension:PageNotice? --Victar (talk) 20:30, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

 * I don't know. If you want it installed, file a request on Phabricator, and link to the two discussions to show that there's consensus/support for installing it. (If the folks on Phabricator want a clearer show of consensus we could run a straw poll or vote.) - -sche (discuss) 01:42, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I... have no clue how to do that., do you think you could help with that? --Victar (talk) 01:58, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * There's already a request here. You can post on the thread there. It's less threatening than having to post a whole request. — Eru·tuon 02:48, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

More details on your revert for "gender"?
Hi -sche, last week you reverted my edit on gender, but your explanations did not answer my questions, so I added more details. Can you give more details? I understand that you find it "a bit tricky to define all these words" but I does not seem to me to be a valid reason to revert a change trying to make the definition clearer (by removing its circular aspects). I'm tempted to reproduce my modification and then wait for you to provide appropriate explanations for the non-change. 09:33, 1 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Hi! I outlined the problems with your change on the talk page, in more detail than you quote, but thanks for the poke: in thinking about this some more, it occurs to me that we could perhaps just replace "male/masculine" with "a man", and solve several issues at once; I will suggest that on the talk page. - -sche (discuss) 19:04, 1 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Hi, thanks for the answer. I appreciate that you propose a modification to solve the issue, however I still have questions that I detailed on the talk page. Lboukoko (talk) 19:04, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Vowel allophones?
Hey -sche. I just had a question about the pronunciation of the vowel "o" in different areas.

I understand that the general rule is that the vowel is pronounced as /oʊ/ in North America (aside from in the South, where it is pronounced /ɛʊ/, and aside from some parts of the Upper Midwestern and at least one area in the Western United States where it is pronounced /oː/) and generally as /əʊ/ in the United Kingdom (except in Scottish English, where it is pronounced /oː/, and except in wholly [in regular RP speakers], where it is pronounced [ɒʊ̯]). I know that there are variations on these, but they are beside the point here.

My question is this: have you heard of any North American English dialects that have /əʊ/ as an allophone of /oʊ/ depending on the environment that the sound is in? I ask this, because I notice this as being a natural part of my own speech (something that I am working to correct, actually). It's hard to explain, but like I said, in some environments, I pronounce "o" as /oʊ/, whereas in others, I pronounce it as /əʊ/. For example, unless I am being self-conscious, I pronounce go as /gəʊ/. With that said, /oʊl/ is always /oʊl/, never /əʊl/ (as far as I can tell) in my speech (although that may be because, when I was younger, I had a tendency to merge /ʌl/ and /oʊl/ to /oʊl/). There are other examples of this, but I can't think of any specific examples off of the top of my head.

Do you have any clue as to what might be going on? Tharthan (talk) 18:08, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

 * I'm not aware of such a phenomenon, sorry, though it wouldn't surprise me if certain phonological environments pulled the diphthong in one direction or the other in certain dialects. Searching for any mention of it in literature is made difficult by the frequency with which /əʊ/ vs /oʊ/ is discussed; the closest thing I spot is a book saying that some English people use [ɒʊ] in cold, bolt etc in contrast to [əʊ] in code, etc. - -sche (discuss) 22:56, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

harborough
I found an edition of the work that contained the cite with different, more modern spellings (of other words) that was published by the Hakluyt Society. Hakluyt used that spelling often in most of his works. DCDuring (talk) 23:46, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

title: User talk:-sche/Archive/2018


text:
User talk:-sche/Archive/2019

Algonquian templates
Hey, did you ever create a header template for any Algonquian languages? I'm looking for something to use for Munsee verbs, like. -- 02:28, 11 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Or any templates for Algonquian languages for that matter. -- 17:24, 13 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Sorry I forgot to respond to this earlier. No, I don't recall creating any templates besides reference templates. - -sche (discuss) 19:54, 13 January 2019 (UTC)

water translation "Soi"
Do you know what this is? "soj" isn't a valid language code and "Soi" isn't a language name. DTLHS (talk) 18:05, 27 January 2019 (UTC)

 * Let's see... I added it in diff, using the translation-adder script, at which time it was a code, but then it was removed as a code in diff following this, but I evidently didn't catch the use on [[water]]. I'll fix it up now; thanks for catching it. - -sche (discuss) 18:25, 27 January 2019 (UTC)

/ə/
I'm sorry to bother you on this matter, because I think that we might have touched on this slightly once before quite some time ago, but I have a very particular question. It is about something that I feel ought to have been something that I learnt early on, but nevertheless never did.

When we transcribe words such as bottom (/ˈbɒtəm/ or the like) kingdom (/ˈkɪŋdəm/), mumble (/mʌmbəl/), etc., we use the schwa to transcribe their final vowel. Perhaps there is something up with my dialect (or, perhaps, my idiolect) because I don't quite understand how /ə/ in this instance is a different sound than /ʌ/. Is it anything like how, at least in my dialect, just in the middle of a sentence can be /d͡ʒʌst/ ~ /d͡ʒʊst/? But I was under the impression that /ə/ was supposed to be used to represent a distinct vowel per se...

Similarly, when we transcribe a word like fighter ([ˈfʌɪtɚ]/[ˈfʌɪtəɹ]), we transcribe the "er" as /ɚ/ or /əɹ/. I fail to understand how this isn't the same sound as /ɝ/. Conversely, I fail to see how, when /ɚ/ / /əɹ/ is realised in a non-rhotic dialect / in a situation where a non-rhotic pronunciation is used in a semi-rhotic dialect (such as mine), how this plain /ə/ is different from /ʌ/ (as I said earlier).

In other words, if I were to say "I'm not any better than you" fully pronounced, and then you were to ask me to give a rough transcription of that, I would transcribe that either as (and this is more narrowly transcribed than usual, but a. this is not as narrow as I could transcribe it, and b. to this day I still have trouble properly indicating certain things in transcription, therefore I have this marked with slashes rather than square brackets) /ɑi̯m nɑt ɛni bɛtɝ ðæn ju/ or /ɑi̯m nʌt ɛni bɛtɝ ðæn ju/ (I have told you previously about the complicated situation in my dialect with the realisation of historical /ɒ/. My dialect doesn't have /ɒ/, unlike the dialect of, say, Boston. It does seem to have once been present where I live, but not for a very long time. In modern times, my dialect realises historical /ɒ/ as /ɔ/ [a sound which is not present in, say, the Boston dialect, because--in that dialect--it merged with /ɒ/ instead; a form of cot-caught merger] in words like dog and foster (my father, who is originally from a different New England state technically--but comes from a part of that state that is not particularly far from the "dividing line" between the state that I and my mother are from, and his original state--, pronounces chocolate as /ˈt͡ʃɔklᵻt/, whereas my mother pronounces it as /ˈt͡ʃɑklᵻt/. This was sometimes the subject of casual conversation {usually my mother noting the difference in pronunciation between them for that word} when I and my sibling were young] It realises it as /ɑ/ in a whole lot of words, but in some cases it realises it as /ʌ/ in those very same words. This is particularly true with particularly older speakers of the dialect, although I clearly recall that there were other people my age that I knew during high school that pronounced got, gotten, and similar words with /ʌ/ in some instances. Furthermore, as I may have told you before, my mother always pronounces the name of the cartoon sailorman, Popeye as /ˈpʌp.aɪ/, stressed or unstressed. I ought to note that my father's dialect does not do this; historical /ɒ/ is /ɔ/ or /ɑ/ depending upon the particular word for him. There is no /ʌ/ realisation of it).

If I were to say the same line, but in unstressed speech, and you then were to ask me to give a rough transcription of that, I would transcribe that either as (and forgive my butchering here. I'm not great at transcribing casually spoken sentences) /ɑi̯mˈnɑʔn̩ibɛɾʌˌðɘ̞nju/ or /ɑi̯mˈnʌʔn̩ibɛɾʌˌðɘ̞nju/ (I'm just loosely using /ɘ̞/ here to stand for a vague representation of a sound in between /ɛ/ and /ʌ/. I don't know how I ought to transcribe that).

Keep in mind that I don't have the hurry-furry merger. It is for that very reason that I would get confused if we used "/əɹ/" in the middle of a word in a transcription. Would /əɹ/ represent the /ɝ/ (I'm not saying that /ɝ/ is an accurate transcription here for this) that it seems to when it is at the end of a word if it were to potentially be in the middle of a word, or would it represent /ʌɹ/ in that situation?

The -burgh suffix in placenames like Edinburgh would be said as [standard transcription, not my transcription] "/bʌɹə/" where I live. Yet, in British English, it is /bəɹə/ (or /bɹə/). The British pronunciation of borough is closer to my pronunciation of (in certain placenames) -burgh (in my dialect of New England English, borough would be /ˈbʌɹoʊ/). My mother and younger sister pronounce bureau as [standard transcription, not my transcription] /ˈbjʊɹ.ə/, so I wonder if there were words ending in -ough that were pronounced similarly (thoroughly is the only word that I can think of like that generally). So why are rough and tough not transcribed as /rəf/ and /təf/?

..Anyway, this can cause some trouble for me when I am transcribing words here on Wiktionary, because it sometimes seems arbitrary whether or not to use /ə/ for an o or the like when it seems to call for such a vowel, because, for instance, o can also be pronounced as /ʌ/ in some words as well.

Might you be able to help clear this up somewhat? Tharthan (talk) 08:00, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
 * After looking at our entry for come on, and reading the pronunciations given, I think that I notice an oh-so-slight difference. I seem to realise whatever /ə/ is (in the unstressed pronunciation of "come" in "come on") as a sound that is fairly close to /ʊ/, but that I recognise is not actually /ʊ/. I don't know how else to describe it. Perhaps this is what I am doing with the word "just" which I sometimes pronounce differently than /d͡ʒʌst/ when I am speaking casually or swiftly. I would have represented that casual pronunciation as /d͡ʒʊst/ if you had asked me to transcribe it, but perhaps "/d͡ʒəst/" would be more accurate (I won't use narrow transcription there, because I don't actually know what the vowel actually is in my case). Tharthan (talk) 03:02, 11 May 2019 (UTC)

 * When I learned (the basics of) IPA I initially had trouble distinguishing /ə/ from /ʊ/. I have learned it by convention (mainly based on stress) but it still seems to me that my own "neutral vowel" is very close to /ʊ/. Equinox ◑ 03:11, 11 May 2019 (UTC)

transgenderism
Sorry if this edit was a bit confusing. Saw someone inserting wild shit like "Soros funded Transgenderism!!" the other day. Should have wrote things like cultural Marxism for a comparison. Tsumikiria⧸ 🌹🌉 22:29, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

Grammatical description
Dear -sche. Concerning λύνομαι format.I have often found it difficult to place the grammatical 'recognition' or description of words in en.wiktionary: there is etymology, there is headwοrd line, there are definition lines, but there is no 'grammatical description' line. As in la:legendum or la:caveat. As here before it was changed. I do not mind following each wiktionary's style and instructions. But I would like an 'identity card' of the lemma, well, for greek -I do not know about other languages- Just a thought. --sarri.greek (talk) 01:08, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

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"Botnian"
Is there any source for the usage of "Botnian" to refer to Finnish, seeing you added it to the language data in this diff? — surjection ⟨?⟩ 21:27, 23 September 2019 (UTC)
 * It's amazing (although I suppose it shouldn't be) how many things like that one does and then has no memory of... my guess is that I found it attested as the name of a dialect that would be subsumed under fi, and included it on that basis, like e.g. "Afshar" is listed as a 'name' of (a dialect of) Azeri so that people (like me!) who come across Afshar texts/wordlists/etc know what language they are to be treated as. Some quick re-Googling now suggests that the term exists in reference to things from the Bothnian Bay area, but there's enough interference from scannos of "Bosnian" that I can't be sure those hits include references to a dialect. Remove it if you like. - -sche (discuss) 21:42, 23 October 2019 (UTC)

East African German
I was just adding some Namibian German, and I was interested in whether there were more words from German East Africa like that could pass CFI. Any leads on where I could find such words? —Μετάknowledge discuss/deeds 01:32, 2 October 2019 (UTC)

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Sincerely, RMaung (WMF) 17:04, 4 October 2019 (UTC)

Todo/Non-templatised genders
Hey. Can you regenerate Todo/Non-templatised genders please? --Vealhurl (talk) 11:41, 23 October 2019 (UTC)
 * And notify me please. Perhaps we can have it deleted from Todo --Vealhurl (talk) 11:42, 23 October 2019 (UTC)
 * Thanks for showing an interest, I've regenerated the list. - -sche (discuss) 20:19, 24 October 2019 (UTC)

Transfeminine
Hi, -sche. Can you have another look at the following, which you created in 2013-2015: transfemale, trans female, transfeminine, trans-male, or contributed to: transmasculine, trans male, trans-male, transmale, trans male. None of these seem to be referenced, and I wonder which, if any, are supported, or should be merged into each other or into trans man and trans woman. Mathglot (talk) 09:44, 11 December 2019 (UTC)

 * So, none of them will be "merged", per se: whereas Wikipedia (as an encyclopedia) treats variations on the same basic topic in one article, Wiktionary (as a dictionary) gives every word its own entry. (And alternative spellings, for better or worse, get their own entries that say "Alternative form of ___" and direct people to the most common spelling. This is because the string of letters may be a mere alternative spelling in one language, but a main spelling/word in another language, like with hors-d'œuvre, hence hard redirects are not used.) Or do you mean only that e.g. "trans female" should be defined as just a synonym of "trans woman"? The noun is already, and perhaps the adjective could be as well, but in a case like this where the meaning of the "parts" of the word is so transparent, I might be inclined to leave the first part of the definition which mentions them, and just add to the end of it, giving a definition like "Female and trans, that is, being a female who was assigned male at birth; being a trans woman". what do you think, does that look alright/accurate to you? The way entries are "referenced" is also a bit different; instead of finding e.g. books or journal articles discussing the concept, it's sufficient to find any "durably archived" cases of the words being used (with the sense/definition in question). (What counts as "durably archived" is a little tricky; the web usually doesn't, even when on e.g. archive.org; it's mostly books, journals, etc which libraries keep copies of.) I'll set about adding instances of use. - -sche (discuss) 17:35, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
 * , I've added citations to Citations:transfemale, Citations:trans female, Citations:transmale and Citations:trans male; I didn't add a full three citations (the standard) to some because for now I added only citations where it was clear within the snippet that e.g. "trans male" meant "trans man" (and not "trans woman"), but more citations can be found at (etc) and I would think at least some (enough) of them probably clarify what they mean elsewhere in the book and could be added if you or anyone else actually doubts the meaning or existence of the terms. I also added citations to transfeminine and transmasculine and expanded their definitions to include the broader concept the citations refer to. (Other entries with relatedly "broad" definitions include femme and masc, so it occurs to me to check if transmasc and transfemme/transfem are attested...) The hyphenated compounds proved harder to cite, but I'll make another effort later to find cites before taking up other people's time by submitting them to WT:RFVE. - -sche (discuss) 18:46, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
 * , thanks! As you've probably gathered, although I've made a few edits here at en-wikt, I'm very much less familiar with how it all works compared to en-wiki, so thanks for those basic principles. I understand the point now, about separate entries here, vs. the way Wikipedia handles it.
 * Back a couple of years ago, when I added a template to Transfeminine above moving content here, I understood even less.  I'm not even sure how I came to do that, but I think I must have read something about transwikification (probably not that page) and tried to follow some instructions on what to do with articles about expressions or terms that were unlikely to become stand-alone articles.  Maybe adding that template was a mistake; I'm not even sure, now. Do you mind having a look, and advising what should be done there, if anything? Redirect to trans woman? Merge here? Mark it a stub and leave it? Something else? Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 22:37, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Crossroads, you may be interested in this discussion. Mathglot (talk) 22:41, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the ping. The Wikipedia article appears to be a DICDEF, so I think if -sche (who is clearly more experienced than me with Wiktionary) could copy over whatever information they see as worth preserving, then maybe we can convert the Wikipedia entry to a redirect to Trans woman, same as Transmasculine goes to Trans man. Or, they could both go to Non-binary, since the two terms seem to refer to people who do not fully identify as women/men respectively, given what the Wikipedia article says. Any thoughts on this -sche and Mathglot? However, I don't see any basis for a separate encyclopedia article for Transfeminine and Transmasculine under GNG, NOTDIC, and NOPAGE, even though a separate Wiktionary entry for each of those does make sense. Crossroads (talk) 23:30, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
 * I don't think there's anything in the wording of the Wikipedia article that's so vital as to need to be copied over (if there were, then for licencing & all, someone with "Transwiki"-ing user-rights would probably need to transwiki it over, unless we were sure the content would not be deleted / made inaccessible but merely hidden in the edit history underneath a redirect). I may add one or two of the sources Wikipedia mentions to the Wiktionary entry as "references". It seems like there may not be enough (any?) sources which primarily/in-depth focus on the topic, for it to have its own article; it could probably be reduced to a redirect to Non-binary and a sentence or two in that article and in the Trans woman article — but I'll comment about that over on the Wikipedia article's talk page. - -sche (discuss) 17:55, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:-sche/Archive/2019


text:
rasuli

Etymology
From. .

Adjective

 * 1)  apostolic

Etymology
.

Noun

 * 1)  prophet

title: rasuli