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Sikorsky CH-53 Sea Stallion

The CH-53 Sea Stallion (Sikorsky S-65) is an American family of heavy-lift transport helicopters designed and built by the American manufacturer Sikorsky Aircraft. The Sea Stallion was originally developed in response to a request from the United States Navy's Bureau of Naval Weapons made in March 1962 for a replacement for the Sikorsky CH-37 Mojave helicopters flown by the United States Marine Corps (USMC).

In July 1962, Sikorsky's proposal, which was essentially a scaled-up S-61R fitted with twin General Electric T64 turboshaft engines and the dynamic system of the S-64/CH-54, was selected. On 14 October 1964, the YCH-53A performed its maiden flight; the first deliveries of production CH-53s to operational units commenced on 12 September 1966. The first combat use of the type occurred during the following year when it was deployed to the Vietnamese theater; the CH-53 quickly proved its value for moving heavy payloads, particularly in the recovery of damaged aircraft.

Several variants of the type were promptly introduced. The United States Air Force introduced the HH-53 "Super Jolly Green Giant", configured for special operations and combat search and rescue (CSAR) missions, during the latter part of the Vietnam War; the majority of these were subsequently rebuilt into the MH-53 Pave Low. The visually similar CH-53E Super Stallion is a heavier-lifting improved version of the rotorcraft, designated S-80E by Sikorsky; its third engine makes it more powerful than the Sea Stallion and thus displaced it for the heavy-lift mission. Furthermore, many early-build CH-53s were refitted with more powerful engines, while others were reconfigured for different mission roles, such as US presidential flights, training, and airborne mine countermeasures (AMCM) operations.

Several export deals for the CH-53 were made, leading to several international operators of the type. Among these are Germany, Iran, and Israel. Several unusual or high-profile operations have been undertaken, such as the capture and transportation of a Soviet advanced radar system to Israel under Operation Rooster 53 in 1969, and Iran's capture of five American CH-53s as a result of Operation Eagle Claw in 1980. Various operators deployed their CH-53s during international missions, often under the auspices of NATO or the United Nations, such as for UNSCOM in Iraq, in Kosovo with KFOR, IFOR in Bosnia and Herzegovina, and the ISAF in Afghanistan. While several operators have opted to retain the type into the twenty-first century, many others have opted to supplement or withdraw their Sea Stallions in favor of other platforms, sometimes with the more powerful CH-53E. The CH-53 remains in service with German and Israeli forces, and is one of the largest military helicopters in service. Germany is planning to replace its fleet as of the 2020s, with the latest version of the twin-rotor CH-47 Chinook. The latest version of the CH-53, the K model King Stallion is in production as of the 2020s entering service with the United States Marine Corps; this is replacing the Super Stallion, itself an upgraded version of Sea Stallion. The heavily upgraded Jolly Green Giant and Pave Low versions of the CH-53 were retired by 2008, flown by the U.S. Air Force for combat search and rescue. Overall, the CH-53 was replaced in many roles by the V-22 tilt rotor in U.S. service.

Origins
In 1960, the United States Marine Corps (USMC) began to seek a replacement for their HR2S piston-powered helicopters. On 27 January 1961, the USMC began working with the U.S. Army, Navy, and Air Force on the "Tri-Service VTOL transport", which would eventually emerge as the LTV XC-142 tiltwing. The design became more elaborate and the program stretched out, causing the USMC to drop out when they decided they would not receive a working machine in a satisfactory timeframe. In particular, there were concerns that the high levels of downwash produced by the XC-142A would render shipborne operations impractical. In the end, the XC-142A, although a very innovative and capable machine, never entered production.

In March 1962, the United States Navy's Bureau of Naval Weapons, acting on behalf of the USMC, issued a request for a "Heavy Helicopter Experimental / HH(X)". The specifications dictated a load capability of 8000 lb with an operational radius of 100 nmi at a speed of 150 kn. It was also specified to possess a higher top speed and greater lifting capacity than existing helicopters while also having a lower empty weight than preceding designs as well. The HH(X) was to be used in the assault transport, aircraft recovery, personnel transport, and medical evacuation roles. In the assault transport role, it was to be mostly used to haul heavy equipment instead of troops.

In response, Boeing Vertol offered a modified version of the CH-47 Chinook; Kaman Aircraft offered a development of the British Fairey Rotodyne compound helicopter; and Sikorsky offered what amounted to a scaled-up version of the S-61R, with twin General Electric T64 turboshaft engines and the dynamic system of the S-64/CH-54, to be designated the S-65. Kaman's proposal quickly died when the British government dropped its backing of the Rotodyne program. Competition between Boeing Vertol and Sikorsky was intense, with the Chinook having an advantage because it was being acquired by the United States Army. During July 1962, it was announced that Sikorsky's bid had been selected as the winner on account of various considerations, including cost, technical factors, and production capability. However, a contract was not immediately forthcoming due to budgetary limitations.

The USMC had originally sought to procure four prototypes. However, in light of funding shortfalls, Sikorsky, determined to keep the deal, reduced their estimate for the program's development costs by proposing that development could be performed with only two prototypes. Military officials favourably received the company's proposed reduction; in September 1962, Sikorsky was awarded a $9,965,635 (~$ in ) contract for the production of a pair of YCH-53A prototypes, as well as a mockup and a ground-test airframe.

The development program did not go entirely smoothly, due to a shortage of engineering resources plus various failures of subcontractors and the government, but these problems were gradually overcome. There was also pressure against the program from U.S. Secretary of Defense Robert S. McNamara, who promoted the concept of "commonality" between the armed services by adopting the Chinook instead. However, the USMC managed to convince McNamara's staff that the Chinook could not meet their requirements without numerous expensive changes.

The first YCH-53A performed its initial flight at the Sikorsky plant in Stratford, Connecticut, on 14 October 1964, about four months behind schedule. During the previous month, the USMC had already placed an initial production contract for 16 helicopters. Flight trials went more smoothly than expected, helping make up for the time lost in development; on 19 November 1964, the type was formally introduced to the general public. Around this time, it received the military designation and name CH-53A Sea Stallion. On 12 September 1966, the first deliveries of the CH-53 to an operational unit occurred.

Further development
The CH-53A arrived in Vietnam in January 1967 and proved useful, eventually recovering even more downed aircraft than the CH-54. A total of 141 CH-53As were built, including the two prototypes. The U.S. Navy acquired 15 CH-53As from the USMC in 1971 for airborne mine countermeasures (AMCM) activities. The helicopters had more powerful T64-GE-413 turboshafts installed and received the designation RH-53A.

The United States Air Force ordered the HH-53B in September 1966 and it first flew on 15 March 1967. It added a refueling probe, drop fuel tanks and a rescue hoist; it also featured upgraded T64-GE-3 engines. The Air Force used the HH-53B for combat search and rescue (CSAR). HH-53C was an improved CSAR variant with a smaller 450 USgal fuel tank in exchange for more armor and better communication systems. The CH-53C was similar except it lacked a refueling probe. It was used by the USAF for more general transport work.

Heavy lifting in tropical climates demanded more power, so the USMC decided to acquire an improved variant, the CH-53D, with uprated engines, originally the T64-GE-412 then later the T64-GE-413. The CH-53D also included an uprated transmission to go with the more powerful engines, and a revised interior to permit a load of 55 troops.

The initial flight of the CH-53D was on 27 January 1969. The CH-53D served alongside the CH-53A through the rest of the Vietnam War. A VIP transport version designated VH-53D with plush accommodations was used by the USMC for the US presidential flights. The US Navy also acquired CH-53D-based helicopters for minesweeping. These were designated RH-53D and included mine sweeping gear such as a pair of 0.50 BMG (12.7 mm) Browning machine guns for detonating mines. The Navy received 30 RH-53Ds beginning in 1973. After the RH-53Ds were in service, the RH-53As were handed back to the USMC and restored to CH-53A configuration.

During the 1980s, Israeli Air Force's CH-53 Yas'ur fleet was upgraded by Israel Aircraft Industries and Elbit Systems. The project – which ended only in 1997 – improved the CH-53 avionics, robustness and extended its life span by at least two decades.

In 1989, some of the CH-53As being retired by the USMC were passed on to the U.S. Air Force for training, with these helicopters redesignated TH-53As. The TH-53As were stripped of most operational equipment and painted in USAF camouflage colors.

Design

The Sikorsky CH-53 Sea Stallion is a heavy lift military transport helicopter. The CH-53A carries a crew of four; pilot, copilot, crew chief, and an aerial observer. It can carry various payloads, including up to 38 fully-equipped troops, 24 litters with medical attendants, an internal cargo load of 8000 lb, or an external load of 13000 lb on the single-point sling hook. Access to the main cabin is via the large passenger door on the right side of the fuselage behind the cockpit, as well as by a power-operated loading ramp to the rear. This loading ramp was capable of facilitating drive-on loading operations, enabling quicker cargo movements. The CH-53A was designed to have a useful payload capacity, in terms of weight, of almost half of the rotorcraft's empty weight.

It is provisioned with mechanical flight controls, which are backed by three independent hydraulic systems. As noted by Sikorsky engineer Edward S Carter Junior, the rotorcraft could be equipped to facilitate all-weather operations. It shares a somewhat similar fuselage design, albeit on a substantially larger scale, with the Sikorsky S-61R series. While the Sea Stallion's fuselage is watertight, the helicopter is not intended for amphibious use and its ability to land on water is meant to only be used in emergency situations. To save space, which is normally at a premium on board most naval vessels, both the tail boom and the rotors can be folded while the helicopter is stowed; to reduce the workload involved in this process, an automated folding system was developed by Sikorsky. Both the crew and vital systems are protected by armouring across key areas. All of the fuel was housed within sponsons on either side of the fuselage. The CH-53A was typically equipped with a pair of 7.62×51mm NATO M60 machine guns that point out to each side of the fuselage.

The CH-53A features a fully-articulated six-bladed main rotor and four-bladed tail rotor. According to Carter, the relatively high speed requirement stipulated by the USMC was the primary factor shaping the dynamic design. While the Sea Stallion's dynamic systems were largely derived from those used on the earlier Sikorsky S-64 Skycrane, substantial reengineering were also involved due to the vastly different operating requirements. Extensive use of titanium was made across its dynamic components, particularly for elements that may have been susceptible to degradation over time due to metal fatigue. Initially, the CH-53 was powered by a pair of General Electric T64-6 turboshaft engines, each of which provided up to 2850 shp. These engines were located on the upper fuselage. Later engines included the T64-1, capable of generating up to 3080 shp, and the T64-16, which was rated for up to 3485 shp. The HH-53B model featured T64-3 engines, which produced up to 3080 shp.

The improved CH-53D features uprated engines, initially using the T64-GE-412 that could provide up to 3695 shp, then the T64-413 with its further elevated output of 3925 shp; these more powerful engines necessitated the use of an uprated transmission. Interior changes included additional seats, which allowed for up to 55 troops to be carried at a time. The CH-53D is generally armed with twin .50 BMG (12.7 mm) M2/XM218 machine guns. During the type's later years of service, it has become commonplace for CH-53Ds to have been retrofitted with various defensive countermeasures; such apparatus has often included an AN/ALE-39 chaff dispenser and an AN/ALQ-157 infrared countermeasure.

Later production CH-53Ds featured a Blade Inspection Method (BIM) scheme to detect cracks in its metal rotors. BIM involved pressurizing the interior of the rotor blades with nitrogen. If a crack is present pressure is lost and a red indicator on the rotor blade tip was tripped. Later, the BIM system was connected to a cockpit display. BIM reduced the need to routinely swap rotor blades.

United States

The CH-53/HH-53 has seen considerable use in warzones and served in various conflict during its service. It was first used in the Vietnam War, often recovering downed aircraft and evacuating personnel. The CH-53D served alongside the CH-53A through the latter portion of the US's presence in Vietnam; both types played a critical role at the end of the conflict, performing evacuations of personnel during Operation Frequent Wind.

U.S. Air Force HH-53 Super Jolly Green Giants were the primary search-and-rescue helicopter in Southeast Asia between 1967 and 1975, inserted the Operation Ivory Coast rescue team into the North Vietnamese prison camp at Son Tay in 1970, and carried the USMC and Air Force Security Forces who attempted to rescue the crew of SS Mayagüez. Marine-flown Navy Sea Stallions were the rotary-wing element of Operation Eagle Claw, the attempted rescue of American hostages in Iran in 1980 that ended in disaster and embarrassment at "Desert One". Marine CH-53s were used in Grenada during Operation Urgent Fury.

The CH-53 was operated by the Air Force, Marine Corps and Navy in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom. It is also operated by all three services in support of Operation Enduring Freedom in Afghanistan. It was in the Afghan theatre than the final operational missions of the CH-53D fleet were performed during February 2012.

On 17 September 2007, VMM-263 of the USMC was deployed with ten MV-22B Ospreys, a tiltrotor aircraft. The V-22 has been the primary replacement for the USMC's fleets of CH-53Ds and CH-46E Sea Knights, but not the more powerful CH-53Es; instead, the in-development CH-53K is planned to supplant the Navy and USMC CH-53E fleets.

During September 2011, HMH-463 replaced its CH-53Ds with CH-53Es. HMH-363 and HMH-362 are to operate D-models until the squadrons are deactivated. Both units are to be reactivated as MV-22 and CH-53K squadrons respectively. Several CH-53D helicopters will be retained for the 3rd Marine Regiment for training. HMH-362 retired the last CH-53Ds after its combat deployment in August 2012 and decommissioned in November 2012.

Israel
In August 1968, an Israeli Air Force (IAF) delegation visited Sikorsky's Connecticut plant while seeking information to select the service's next assault helicopter. The delegation was looking for a helicopter with augmented payload carry capacity, highly maneuverable and robust, that could survive direct hits from different caliber projectiles. They examined Boeing's CH-47 Chinook and Sikorsky's CH-53, it was recognised that the latter was both larger and stronger than any of the IAF's other helicopters, and thus represented a major advancement in terms of capability. Based upon experience gained from the intense combat of the then-recently fought Six-Day War, the delegation opted to favour the CH-53.

On 2 October 1969, the first S-65C-3 (CH-53D) helicopters were delivered to Israel of an initial order of seven. At the time, the country was engaged in the War of Attrition, and thus the type was quickly dispatched into combat. Receiving the Hebrew name Yas'ur (Petrel), a further 35 helicopter were delivered to fulfil subsequent orders. On 6 August 1970, the first Yas'ur squadron was established. For several decades, the type has served as the primary cargo helicopters of the IAF, being routinely used to carry both troops and heavy equipment.

In 1969, during the War of Attrition, IAF CH-53s landed in Egypt and conveyed a captured Soviet advanced radar system back to Israel for examination by Israeli scientists and engineers (see Operation Rooster 53). The Yas'ur was also used in various other capacities during the conflict, including the retrieval of a navigator from a downed IAF F-4 Phantom II under sustained enemy fire on 30 June 1970.

During the 1973 Yom Kippur War, the Yas'ur routinely moved artillery batteries and for the insertion of IDF units around the fronts. The type was also used to evacuate hundreds of wounded soldiers and rescued pilots from behind enemy lines in both Egypt and Syria. In one engagement, a single Yas'ur was attacked by multiple aircraft, including a pair of MiG-21s; while sustaining damage, it was still able to return to base. Since 1973, Yas'urs have also been used by the IDF to land and extract Sayeret commandos on raids and patrols deep behind enemy lines in Lebanon Syria and the greater Middle East.

During the 1980s, Israel Aircraft Industries, along with Elbit Systems, commenced a major upgrade program for the IAF Yas'ur fleet. The project, which was completed in 1997, improved the CH-53's avionics and increased its robustness, as well as extending the fleet's operating life by at least two decades.

In 1989, several Yas'urs were used to perform firefighting operations on and around Mount Carmel. They performed dozens of low flyovers into the smoke and flames, dumped 700 tons of water on the fire, and doused it. On 8 November 1992, a pair of CH-53s performed one of the IAF's longest-distance sea rescue operations to retrieve passenger from the distressed yacht Fantasy 2 off the coast of Sudan.

During the 2006 Lebanon War, Hezbollah shot down an Israeli CH-53 Yas'ur with an anti-tank missile, killing five air crew members. This was reportedly the only combat loss of an Israeli CH-53 during this conflict.

On 16 August 2012, the IAF temporarily grounded its CH-53 fleet following one having experienced in-flight difficulties that led to an emergency landing; initial reports state the issue was related to the rotor blades. The fleet was again grounded for three weeks after a CH-53 was destroyed by a fire during a training exercise; the IAF subsequently attributed this loss to a defective component and blamed Lockheed Martin for failing to communicate the issue.

During 2015, it was announced that Israel planned to withdraw the last of its Yasurs around 2025. Replacement options studied included the CH-53K and the CH-47F Chinook, with a prospective order for approximately 20 helicopters being placed for the preferred option. During February 2021, the Israeli Ministry of Defense announced the selection of the CH-53K to replace the Yasur fleet.

On 7 October 2023, during the first day of the Israel-Hamas war, and the first time after 17 years since the 2006 Lebanon War in a similar incident, Hamas shot down an IAF CH-53 with an anti-tank rocket and hitting its left engine, while carrying about 50 paratroopers (a very unusual procedure, as opposed to the approved IAF's max capacity of 33 troops). The pilot managed to land safely in an open field, offloading both the aircrew and the paratroopers. The CH-53 was then hit by a second anti-tank rocket, completely destroying the helicopter. The occupants survived the attack with minor to medium injuries.

Iran

During the 1970s, an initial fleet of six RH-53D Sea Stallions was delivered to the Imperial Iranian Navy (IIN). Following the Iranian Revolution in 1979, the Sea Stallions continued in service with the renamed Islamic Republic of Iran Navy (IRIN). These were supplemented by five U.S. Navy examples that were abandoned during Operation Eagle Claw in 1980. Despite US sanctions that have blocked the nation from acquiring spares and support from overseas, Iran has reportedly been able to keep at least a portion of their Sea Stallions in an operational condition; this effort has been aided by illegal exports of controlled parts to Iran by US citizens.

Germany
In 1966, the German military evaluated both the CH-53 and CH-47 as a replacement for the H-21 and H-34G helicopters with an initial requirement for 133. The purchase of the CH-53 was approved in June 1968 but due to budget constraints only 110 were ordered. Following the delivery in 1969 of two pre-production helicopters from Sikorsky the production aircraft were licence built by VFW-Fokker at Speyer in Germany. The first German-built CH-53G Mittlerer Transporthubschrauber helicopter flew from Speyer on 11 October 1971 and was delivered to the Erprobungsstelle der Bundeswehr 61 flight test center at Manching on 1 December 1971.

The German Army Aviation Corps received 110 type CH-53Gs, derivatives of the CH-53D, between 1971 and 1975. 108 helicopters were built in Germany by VFW-Fokker. The first flight by a German CH-53G was made in 1971, followed in March 1973 by the delivery of the first machines to Heeresfliegerregiment (HFlgRgt, Army Aviation Corps Regiment) 35 in Mendig, and shortly afterwards to the newly formed Army Aviation Corps Regiment 15 based at Rheine and Army Aviation Corps Regiment 25 based at Laupheim.

In order to meet ever more demanding specifications, over time the CH-53G received modifications from 1990 designed to improve its service life and operational capabilities. These involved three major upgrades: new missile warning and self-protection systems; provision for two external fuel tanks allowing range to be increased to 1800 km when carrying 36 armed soldiers or a 5500 kg payload; and addition of a night vision goggles-compatible cockpit for night low-level flying capabilities. All CH-53Gs were upgraded by Eurocopter Germany by early 2001, resulting in updated GS/GE/GA variants. As a result of foreign military operations 20 CH-53G helicopters were converted to perform Combat Search and Rescue (CSAR) missions. Version CH-53GS is equipped with modernized IFR equipment, additional exterior fuel tanks, low-flight night vision cockpit and NVG, partial ballistic protection, engine dust collectors, missile counter measure and self-defence armament. Additionally the original engines were replaced by the more powerful T64-100 engines. German Army Aviation Corps units have carried out a wide range of international missions under the auspices of NATO and the UN, providing transport for members of UNSCOM in Iraq, serving in Kosovo with KFOR, with IFOR in Bosnia and Herzegovina, and more recently with ISAF in Afghanistan. On 1 January 2013, all Army Aviation Corps CH-53Gs were transferred to the German Air Force and incorporated into Helicopter Wing 64.

During the 2010s, Germany was reportedly considering options for replacing its aging CH-53G fleet, with candidates including the Chinook and the CH-53K model. On 29 September 2020, the German Ministry of Defense cancelled the "Schwerer Transporthubschrauber" (STH) heavy-lifting helicopter program for 45 to 60 helicopters after the initiative was judged to be too expensive and stated that its CH-53Gs fleet would be replaced following a period of reexamination. In 2022, the Federal Government announced that all of Germany's CH-53s would be replaced by 60 CH-47Fs.

Austria
During 1970, a pair of S-65C-2 or S-65Ö (equivalent to the CH-53D standard, albeit without the aerial refuelling probe) helicopters were delivered to Austria. Intended primarily to perform airborne rescue operations in the Alps, they were assigned to 1st Helicopter Wing of the Austrian Air Force, making the service the second foreign operator of the CH-53. Their equipment included same rescue hoist as the HH-53 and fittings for auxiliary fuel tanks and accommodation for 38 passengers. Although they performed well in high altitude operations, the type's relatively high operating costs were a major contributing factor in Austria's decision to sell both rotorcraft to Israel in 1981. However, since the 1999 Galtür avalanche, in which over 7000 thousand people had transported by international collaboration of helicopter resources from Austria, USA, German, France, and Switzerland including 50 helicopters, more helicopter resources have been pursued.

Mexico
During 2003, the Fuerza Aérea Mexicana (FAM) acquired four surplus CH-53D Sea Stallions from Israel at a combined cost of $25 million (~$ in ). Prior to their delivery in 2005, all helicopters were upgraded to the Yasur 2000 standard. Due to restricted budgets, only two were actually operated by 104th Air Squadron, while the other pair served as a source of spare parts. Their initial missions were troop transport and commando insertion, but their principal mission was subsequently changed to performing rescue and disaster relief operations, being relocated to BAM 8 at Yucatán. By 2013, all examples had been permanently withdrawn from service.

Civil use
During 2007, the first commercially owned CH-53D was being converted by the Californian company Heavy Lift Helicopters into a firefighting configuration, which was referred to by the firm as the Fire Stallion Having acquired a batch of six ex-military CH-53Ds, the company planned to make them available for hire by other operators; in addition to fire-fighting, construction work and general transport duties were envisioned for the fleet. While the fleet reportedly flew for a handful of years, they entered storage after only a short period of use due to component shortages.

Variants

 * YCH-53A: Two prototypes with two 2850 shp T64-GE-3 engines.

 * CH-53A: Initial production variant for the USMC. 139 built.

 * RH-53A: CH-53A re-engined with two 3925 shp T64-GE-413 engines as Airborne Mine CounterMeasures (AMCM) variants for the United States Navy. 15 conversions.

 * TH-53A: Stripped CH-53As used for training by the United States Air Force.

 * CH-53D: CH-53A with an improved transmission, larger cabin for 55 troops and automatic rotor blade folding for the United States Marine Corps, 126 built.

 * RH-53D: United States Navy AMCM variant of the CH-53D, fitted with 0.50-inch caliber machine guns and provision for air refueling. 30 built for the USN. Six examples were also exported to Iran, before the Iranian Revolution in 1979. This version can carry 11340 kg of cargo with cargo hook.

 * VH-53D: Two CH-53Ds for USMC VIP transport.

 * VH-53F: Six unbuilt VIP helicopters for the US Navy/Marine Corps.

 * CH-53G: German base version of the CH-53D for the German Army Aviation Corps. The internal Sikorsky designation was S-65C-1. A total of 112 were produced including 2 pre-production and 20 assembled by VFW-Fokker and 90 built by Speyer., 89 German CH-53s were in service, with 80 planned to be in service in 2014. All German CH-53s are going to receive T64-100 engines (in 3 batches; first batch has already been installed, second batch is currently being installed and 3rd batch is planned with funding made available). All will receive IFR-capability.

 * CH-53GS: Update of 20 CH-53Gs in the late 1990s, with additional missile counter measure, upgraded communication and navigation system and two external fuel tanks added. They later received the first batch of T64-100 engines to operate in hot and high conditions that prevail in Afghanistan. MG3 and M3M machine guns were also fitted. A CH-53GS/GE update has also been ordered to provide combat search-and-rescue (CSAR) capability to 26 helicopters.

 * CH-53GE: A configuration based on CH-53GS combat search-and-rescue (CSAR) capabilities. The upgrade configuration was formerly known as CH-53GSX. It further updates with modern electronics, two external fuel tanks, counter measures and dust filters for the engines. Upgrade was ordered to support Afghanistan deployment.

 * CH-53GA: Update of further 40 CH-53Gs with new flight deck, new flight control system, autopilot, navigation and communication systems, FLIR, ECM and missile counter measures as well as provisions for additional internal fuel tanks. The CH-53GA helicopter successfully completed its first flight in February 2010. The upgrade was completed by 2013.

 * S-65Ö: Export version of the CH-53D for the Austrian Air Force. Internal Sikorsky designation was S-65C-2. Only 2 were built, subsequently sold to Israel.

 * S-65C-3: Export version of the CH-53D for the Israeli Air Force. The Yas'ur 2000 version are helicopters upgraded and improved by the Israel Aircraft Industries to extend life span past 2000. The Yas'ur 2025 is a further upgraded version with new systems and new gearboxes. Israel completed the upgrade by 2015 and currently operates 21 Yas'urs as of November 2023.

Operators

 * 🇩🇪 Germany
 * German Air Force
 * Helicopter Wing 64

 * 🇮🇷 Iran
 * Islamic Republic Iranian Navy

 * Israeli Air Force
 * 118 Squadron "Night Birds", 1970–present
 * 118 Squadron "Night Birds", 1970–present

Former operators

 * 🇦🇹 Austria
 * Austrian Air Force 1970–1981 (sold to Israel)

 * 🇩🇪 Germany
 * German Army Aviation Corps
 * Medium Transport Helicopter Regiment 15 Münsterland, 1971–2012 (disbanded)
 * Medium Transport Helicopter Regiment 25 Oberschwaben, 1971–2012 (initially disbanded, later reformed in 2013 as Helicopter Wing 64 in the German Air Force)

 * 🇲🇽 Mexico
 * Mexican Air Force
 * 104th Air Squadron, 2003-2013 (all CH-53s withdrawn from service)

 * Israeli Air Force
 * 114 Squadron "Night Leaders", 1969–2023 (temporarily inactive, pending reactivation in 2025 while converting to CH-53K King Stallion)
 * 114 Squadron "Night Leaders", 1969–2023 (temporarily inactive, pending reactivation in 2025 while converting to CH-53K King Stallion)

 * 🇺🇸 United States
 * United States Air Force (see MH-53 Pave Low)
 * United States Marine Corps
 * HMH-361 "Flying Tigers", 1977–1990 (converted to CH-53E Super Stallion, 1990–present)
 * HMH-366 "Hammerheads", 1994–2000 (converted to CH-53E Super Stallion, 2008–2022)
 * HMH-461 "Ironhorse", 1966–1988 (initially converted CH-53E Super Stallion, 2008–2022; subsequently converted to CH-53K King Stallion, 2022-present)
 * HMH-462 "Heavy Haulers", 1965–1992 (converted CH-53E Super Stallion, 1992–present)
 * HMH-769 "Titan", 1971–1990 (initially converted RH-53D Sea Stallion, 1990–1996; later converted to CH-53E Super Stallion, 1996–2008; subsequently will be converted to CH-53K King Stallion in 2026)
 * HMH-772 "Flying Armadillos", 1971–2000s (converted to CH-53E Super Stallion, 2000s–present)
 * HMHT-302 "Phoenix", 1987–1995 (trained aircrews and technicians on the CH-53 until 1995, today only trains on the CH-53E Super Stallion, 1987–present)
 * United States Navy (converted to MH-53E Sea Dragon)

Israel

 * On display
 * 471 (#65-078) - CH-53A on display at Israeli Air Force Museum, Hatzerim Airbase, Israel.

United States

 * On display
 * 153304 – CH-53A on display at Flying Leatherneck Aviation Museum, MCAS Miramar, California.
 * Fort Worth Aviation Museum, Fort Worth, Texas
 * 158690 - RH-53D on display at Air Victory Museum, Lumberton, New Jersey
 * CH-53D - at the National Naval Aviation Museum.

Accidents and incidents
Due to the aircraft's large size and troop capacity, aerial accidents involving CH-53 helicopters have been some of the deadliest helicopter accidents.

 * 23 June 1967: USMC CH-53A Bu. no #65-082 collided with a US Army UH-1B #63-8572 while taking off from Camp Lejeune, all 20 marines on board were killed along with two occupants of the UH-1B.
 * 8 January 1968: USMC CH-53A #65-100 of HMH-463 crashed in the Hải Lăng Forest south of Đông Hà Combat Base, killing all 46 personnel on board
 * 19 February 1968: USMC CH-53A #65-055 crashed into Monkey Mountain killing all 13 personnel on board.
 * 22 February 1968: USMC CH-53A #65-060, was hit by antiaircraft fire and crashed at Khe Sanh Combat Base, killing two Marines.
 * 1 May 1968: USMC CH-53A #65-058 crashed into the sea off Quảng Trị Province killing one crewman.
 * 28 July 1968: USMC CH-53A #65-061 crashed south of Danang killing all five crewmen.
 * 1 September 1969: USMC CH-53A #65-059 crashed in Thừa Thiên Province killing all five crewmen.
 * 13 September 1970: USMC CH-53D #65-181 was hit by antiaircraft fire and crashed with no fatalities.
 * 26 October 1970: USMC CH-53D #65-192 crashed on a test flight near Danang, killing one crewman.
 * 30 October 1970: USMC CH-53D #65-259 was hit by antiaircraft fire and crashed in Quảng Nam Province, killing two crewmen.
 * 18 February 1971: USAF CH-53C #65-227 of 21st Special Operations Squadron was hit by antiaircraft fire and crashed in Laos with no fatalities.
 * 18 February 1971: USMC CH-53D #65-189 crashed near Huế, killing all nine personnel on board.
 * 1 March 1971: USAF CH-53C #65-229 of 21st Special Operations Squadron was hit by antiaircraft fire and crashed near Long Tieng, killing six personnel.
 * 11 July 1972: USMC CH-53D #65-177 was hit by a surface to air missile and crashed near Quảng Trị, killing three crewmen and 45 South Vietnamese Marines.
 * 24 January 1975: USAF CH-53C #65-338 of 21st Special Operations Squadron suffered main rotor head failure and crashed near Nakhon Phanom Royal Thai Navy Base, killing all four personnel on board.
 * 13 May 1975: USAF CH-53C #65-231 of 21st Special Operations Squadron crashed west of Nakhon Phanom Royal Thai Air Force Base, killing 23 Air Force personnel
 * 15 May 1975: during the Mayaguez Incident, three CH-53s of the 21st Special Operations Squadron were shot down by the Khmer Rouge, resulting in the deaths of ten Marines, two Navy Corpsmen and two Air Force crewmen.
 * 26 September 1975: USAF CH-53C #65-342 of the 601st Tactical Air Support Squadron crashed near Delbrück (Paderborn) Germany killing 16 personnel on board.
 * 10 May 1977: a CH-53 crashed in Israel, resulting in the deaths of 54 people.
 * 21 October 1977: a CH-53 crashed in Mindoro, Philippines during sling load operations due to a design flaw in the tail rotor drive; 31 US Marines serving in Operation Fortress Lightning were killed.
 * 11 December 1978: a CH-53G of the German Army Aviation Corps' Medium Transport Helicopter Regiment 25 crashed at Laupheim Air Base, Germany. During landing in poor visibility the tail rotor hit the ground. Of the four occupants, one was killed.
 * 25 April 1980: six USN RH-53s were lost in Operation Eagle Claw, the failed attempt to rescue American hostages in Iran.
 * 26 November 1980: a CH-53G of the German Army Aviation Corps' Medium Transport Helicopter Regiment 15 crashed in a forest near Wippenkausen, North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany. All four occupants were killed.
 * 14 September 1982: CH-53A #65-083 crashed into the North Sea off the coast of Denmark during NATO exercise "Northern Wedding" killing all 5 servicemen aboard: the Pilot, Capt. William H. "Sonny" Coke; Co-Pilot Capt James B. Huff; Crew Chief SSgt. Gary J. "Butch" Lester; Sgt. Timothy A. "Tim" Creighton; and chaplain, Navy Cdr. David R. Morrison. The Sea Stallion was part of Marine Heavy Helicopter Squadron-777.
 * 27 April 1983: a CH-53D crashed in the Atlantic off the coast of Virginia. The crash resulted in the drowning of Marine 1st Lt David A. Boyle. The suit brought by Boyle's father went to the Supreme Court.
 * 24 March 1984: a CH-53D crashed into a mountain in South Korea during a night troop operation, killing 29.
 * 6 May 1985: a CH-53D experienced a transmission failure and fell into Sea of Japan, killing 17. It was returning to Marine Corps Air Station Futenma from MCAS Iwakuni, Yamaguchi Prefecture.
 * 29 December 1988: an Israeli Yas'ur crashed during a border-stone laying mission at the Israel-Egypt border. Investigation determined that high-frequency heterodyne vibration, induced by a late control column attitude correction during hover by the pilot (the sole fatality), caused a structural failure; the separation of the aircraft's tail and its immediate, rapid counter-rotation and subsequent crash. The three remaining occupants were injured. A footage of this crash can be viewed on-line. A system of dampers to prevent rapid correction and thus the heterodyne vibrations, has been installed since on the remaining Yas'ur helicopters.
 * 20 March 1989: a Sea Stallion crashed while on maneuvers off mountainous east coast of South Korea, near P'ohang. 22 on board were killed. Sixteen other Marines, including one on the ground, were injured in the crash.
 * 18 May 1990: a USMC CH-53D en route to Marine Corps Air Station Tustin crashed in Imperial County, California, killing one crew member and injuring five others. In climbing flight, a pitch lock engaged in one main rotor blade causing a violent vibration that resulted in the tail rotor departing the aircraft at 2200 ft AGL. Torque and rapid rotation contributed to the aircraft breaking apart further just aft of the main transmission.  Auto-rotation resulted a bounce, roll over and fire.  Auxiliary tanks were attached. More than 200 servicemen had been killed in accidents involving the CH-53A, CH-53D, and CH-53E from 1969 to 1990.
 * 14 March 1994: a CH-53D landed tail-first and burst into flames on a military runway in Northern California. One Marine was killed and four Marines were injured.
 * 4 February 1997: two CH-53s collided in the Helicopter Disaster in Israel. A total of 73 people died in the accident.
 * 21 December 2002: a CH-53G of the German Army Aviation Corps' Medium Transport Helicopter Regiment 25 crashed near Kabul killing all seven occupants. An investigation following the accident concluded that the crash was caused by mechanical failure.
 * 23 November 2003: a MH-53M crashed near Bagram Air Base in Afghanistan. Five U.S. servicemen were killed.
 * 13 August 2004: a USMC CH-53D from Marine Corps Air Station Futenma crashed into Okinawa International University on Okinawa, Japan. No serious damage or injuries resulted but the crash caused an international incident because of strained relations about the US use of Futenma. The crash was caused by a maintenance error.
 * 28 November 2008: CH-53G Registratin 84+36 of the German Army Aviation Corps' Medium Helicopter Transport Regiment 25 had a hard landing during an exercise at an altitude of 6,900 feet (2,300 m) near Engelberg in the Swiss Alps, injuring one of the six occupants. The dismantling and partial recovery of the helicopter wreckage was completed in June 2009 by helilifting 84+36 slung below her sister 84+32 down to the village of Alpnach.
 * 26 July 2010: an Israeli CH-53 crashed during a training flight in the Carpathian mountains in Romania, killing six Israeli soldiers and one Romanian.
 * 29 March 2011: a USMC CH-53D from MCBH Kaneohe Bay crashed into the bay, killing one and injuring three.
 * 19 January 2012: a USMC CH-53 crashed in southern Afghanistan. Six International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) troops, all Marines, were killed in the accident.

title: Sikorsky CH-53 Sea Stallion


text:
City of Nedlands

The City of Nedlands is a local government area in the inner western suburbs of the Western Australian capital city of Perth, about 7 km west of Perth's central business district. The city is situated within the western suburbs of the metropolitan area—known colloquially as the “golden triangle” for the concentration of wealth and high housing values.

History
The City of Nedlands originated in the Claremont Road District, which was established on 30 March 1893 after a petition from ratepayers who lived in the areas of Nedlands and Claremont, which had grown substantially in population at the end of the 19th century. Seven men were nominated to the new Board, which became the first local government authority for the Nedlands/Claremont area.

In 1898, Claremont itself split away to form a municipal government, which still exists today as the Town of Claremont.

It was renamed the Nedlands Road District on 12 August 1932 and given municipal status as the Municipality of Nedlands on 17 February 1956. It then assumed its current name when it was granted city status on 1 July 1959. The city was made up of four wards – Melvista, Hollywood, Dalkeith and Coastal. These wards continue to the present day.

Following an unsuccessful effort to amalgamate metropolitan local governments in 2016, the state government expanded the boundary of the City of Perth to incorporate a portion of the City of Nedlands that included the University of Western Australia and surrounding residential areas.

Following the change of government in the 2017 state election, the City of Nedlands experienced sustained political pressure to accommodate infill development and higher residential densities. The failure of Council to cooperate in replacing the city's 30-year old planning scheme led to the imposition of a new planning scheme by the Minister of Planning. A subsequent spate of development applications led to significant community unrest and opposition and contributed to the resignations of key executive staff (including the chief executive officer and director of planning) and the mayor.

Wards
The town is divided into four wards, each electing three councillors. The mayor is directly elected.

 * Coastal Ward
 * Dalkeith Ward
 * Hollywood Ward
 * Melvista Ward

Mayor
The current mayor of the City of Nedlands, since July 2021, is Fiona Argyle.

Suburbs
The suburbs of the City of Nedlands with population and size figures based on the most recent Australian census: * Shared with other council areas (Subiaco; Cambridge; Perth)

Heritage listed places
, there are 22 places on the State Register of Heritage Places in the City of Nedlands, among them the Captain Stirling Hotel and Graylands Hospital.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: City of Nedlands


text:
Talk:Skræling

Wrong Map
Beothuk were an extension of Innu that arrived in the 13th century. The map is someone's fictional MS paint drawing. Someone fix it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.162.211.252 (talk) 05:35, 11 October 2019 (UTC)

æ
Isn't it skræling? —Chameleon 09:25, 23 May 2004 (UTC)
 * Yeap, Oxford dictionary uses æ, but this character or ä isn't used longer in English. (?) // Rogper 13:23, 23 May 2004 (UTC)
 * Well, we have never used ä, and æ is largely obsolete, but this is not an English word. I'm going to correct the articles. Chameleon 15:42, 23 May 2004 (UTC)
 * I've moved the page to Skræling (accidentally creating the page Ææ in the process) Chameleon 15:49, 23 May 2004 (UTC)

I thought it meant "thrall".

This article should be combinded with the one on the Dorset culture and the one on Thule and Classic Thule, since they all talk about elements of the same thing.

Micmac?
I thought the Micmac were also called by the Norse as Skraelings (Im sorry, I do not konw how to create the proper letter).
 * That's right. Noone can be sure on who the Skraelings were that the Norse met on the western coast of Baffin Bay and the David Strait and further south, it might have been several or all of the Dorset, Thule, Innu, Beothuk and Mi'kmaq or even more first nation tribes along the coast.Masae 14:25, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * The article should reflect that instead of focussing on the Thule/Dorset culture as if a conclusion about who they were has been made/verified.Skookum1 (talk) 16:22, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Vinland
Not sure Newfoundland should be equated with Vinland - this is a contentious issue (no vines grow in Newfoundland). 163.1.42.86 12:35, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Addition: seconding this. Newfoundland is not Vinland, it is most likely New Brunswick where vines grow. Mik'maq were there when Norse arrived according to the Sagas. Newfoundland had no other people at the time as Beothuk arrived in the 1200s. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.162.216.133 (talk) 09:47, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

Addition: The norse word "vín" (with long i) did not mean wine but grassland. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.11.69.90 (talk) 10:21, 29 December 2016 (UTC)

In English
What? Who uses this term to describe AAVE speakers? Ubermonkey 15:51, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

A native name?
I have removed this from the article: "As recounted in the Greenlander (Grœnlendinga) saga, the word skraeling may have been the name of one of the North American tribes encountered during initial contact. A Norseman saved two Skraeling boys from the sea.  As was their custom, the Skraeling boys became the Norseman's life-long servants.  During this service the Skraeling boys indicated that the word "skraeling" was how their peoples' name was pronounced in Norse." This simply is not true. Nowhere in the Grœnlendinga saga is there anything about the Norse saving Skraelings and taken them to Greenland. On the other hand ther is in the Saga of Eric the Red a paragraph about how the Norse took with them two Skraeling boys back to Greenland (actually after trying to kill their parents) but there is no mentioning of them using or explaining the word "skraeling". Masae 22:32, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

RESPONSE: Please note; the story of a Norseman saving two skraelings from the sea is correct, but this is not located in the Greenlander Saga or the Saga of Eric the Red. As documented in Certain Pre-Columbian Notices of American Aborigines by William H. Babcock, the word skraeling may have been the name of one of the North American tribes encountered during initial contact. Norseman Bjorn the Bonde saved two Skraeling siblings from the sea. As was their custom, the Skraeling siblings decided to became the Norseman's life-long servants. During this service the Skraelings indicated that the word skraeling was how their peoples' name was pronounced in Norse. Eventually, “The brother and sister killed themselves and threw themselves down the cliffs into the sea when they were prohibited from following along with Bjorn Bonde. . .” to Greenland. [Certain Pre-Columbian Notices of American Aborigines by William H. Babcock, American Anthropologist, New Series,  Vol. 18,  No. 3 (Jul. - Sep., 1916), pp. 388-397]  —Preceding unsigned comment added by SouthernThule (talk • contribs) 03:00, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

 * Yes, but where did Babcock get this story from? He didn't "document" it since he wasn't there. Clearly he must have been deriving it from some Norse source? --Jfruh (talk) 16:16, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

A name "based on what they said"
The Norwegian word "skrall" (in Norwegian)(on some dialects: "skrell") means lasting high noise. A skrelling would then be one who produces lasting high noise. Any old American movie about cowboys and Indians will show the correctness of the logic.St.Trond (talk) 06:55, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Old Hollywood movies about cowboys and Indians don't have anything to do with correctness; and like many Europeans you're assuming that there's a continuity of culture across North American indigenous peoples - i.e. by assuming that the Beothuks or Mikmaq share the same culture as the Sioux and Comanche and Cheyenne, i.e. "movie Indians". Do Norwegians dance like Spaniards, just because they're on the same continent??.  It's true that old-old movies used bona fide Indians and drew on actual cowboy and Plains Indian culture(s), but any idea you may have that native cultures were represented correctly is just make-believe.....Skookum1 (talk) 12:50, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
 * And Original Research. de Bivort 14:43, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Just to give an idea how far indigenous reality was from the stereotypes invoked by St. Trond, have a look at this, which is from the Kwakwaka'wakw people of northern Vancouver Island. Doesn't look like any Hollywood-scripted movie I've ever seen......Skookum1 (talk) 19:10, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

Looking at the map, the bay west of "Promontorium Winlandiae" would probably end in Quebec. Then "Skralingeland" would be in continental Canada and may be in USA. Vinland would probably be along the coast south of Promontorium Winlandiae, as those who gave these names came from north by boat. ( See also:) St.Trond (talk) 18:53, 27 July 2008 (UTC) This may close in on the number of tribes that need to be considered.St.Trond (talk) 23:17, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
 * You're committing original research "Bzzzt! not allowed!" - and more qualified and more deeply-read scholars than you have puzzled over such maps and their potential correpondence to actual geography; Promontorium Winlandiae could be anything from Florida to Delaware to Long Island to Cape Cod to Cape Breton to Gros Morne; yes, this does narrow down the tribes involved (all Atlantic-area Algonkians) but they, too, looked and behaved nothing like your Hollywood Indians you seem to think are authentic or some kind of example; there's just no knowing - i.e. there is no answer, some things can never be unravelled; Farley Mowat made an engrossing (but highly inaccurate) stab at discerning/divining where Vinland was, and who was there, in his West-Viking but he's not considered a reliable source and his theories are all off-the-wall (albeit interesting).Skookum1 (talk) 02:06, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Skrælingi
It´s Skrælingi in nominativus as seen here And in nominativus here in Grænlendinga saga: Þá rétti Guðríður húsfreyja hönd sína til hennar að hún sæti hjá henni en það bar allt saman að þá heyrði Guðríður brest mikinn og var þá konan horfin og í því var og veginn einn Skrælingi af einum húskarli Karlsefnis... --157.157.240.50 (talk) 18:28, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

Plural/singular
This is in the current article: Skræling (plural skrælingar)

Well I can understand that skræling may be an English word, as the Norse word was skrælingi, and the plural for the English word is skrælings, not skrælingar.

So, it should either look like this: Skræling (plural skrælings)

Or like this: Skrælingi (plural skrælingar)

Though, it may be that skræling is just an Anglicized version of the Norse word skrælingi, so the Norse plural version is still appropriate? -MrGulli (talk) 01:08, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

If "skræling" should be Anglicized it shoud be scraling/scralings, the "a" being pronounced like in "scratch". St.Trond (talk) 08:03, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Meaning of Skrælling in modern danish
The article states that the word basically means weakling in modern danish -- being danish :-) I have alway thought the this is only one aspect of the word. To me the word has always ment a person who is weakwilled -- easily manipulated or controlled through force of will or physical power -- usually combined with cowardice. Another aspect is being physically frail, more so than weak, or even sickly. In all cases, to use the word skrælling about a person (to me) means that you scorn the person for being weak when they should have been strong (in some sense). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.167.145.44 (talk) 18:54, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

Pygmies
This needs rewriting. Seaver's views can be seen at but it's an older idea. Fridtjof Nansen wrote about it in his book In Northern Mists which can be found at which should be linked to the appropriate page. Dougweller (talk) 17:00, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

 * I looked at Nansen's text, the Norwegian original of which is here. Basically, what Nansen says is that the accounts of the skrælings in Norse literature have elements of the fantastic (which he demonstrates with quotes), and show similarities with other accounts of mythical creatures, like pygmies. Nansen also mentions the monopod pointing out that it occurs in an account of events in Vinland. Nansen quotes a professor Alf Torp, who says some German dialects (Ober-Pfalz) have a word "schrähelein", "ein zauberisches Wesen, Wichtlein", possibly derived from Middle High German, "walt-schreckel", translated as "faunus".
 * My conclusion is that it's true that the Viking's accounts of the skrælings have fantastic elements. Whether that's relevant to a Wikipedia article on skrælings I guess is debatable. Further, we have two theories for the etymology of the term, one by Nansen from German (which might have some plausibility) and one by Seaver from Latin (which seems very stretched, unless you want to argue Latin -> Old Germanic -> Norse, in which case, where's the evidence?).
 * Nansen's theory might reasonably be added to the etymology section. If a literary evaluation of how the norse wrote about the skrælings is considered relevant, it should be moved to the end (together with the worldview section), and rewritten. I can have a look at Seaver's text as well before making such an attempt. It may be that her actual text is more reasonable than the paraphrase of it given in this article. Thoughts on this? LarsMarius (talk) 07:18, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Seaver's a recognised expert in the general field of Vinland, Greenland and related issues, which is why I'm suggesting it should stay in the article. I haven't been able to read her paper, but the book says "No explanation would have been needed in either Greenland and Iceland, because Skr£eling(j)ar was a direct Old Norse translation of Pygmaei (Pygmies), used specifically about one of the monstrous races assigned to the extreme edges of the world, first by the authors of Antiquity and then perpetuated in the medieval Christian canon. Skrasling(j)ar were the small people who constituted the least threatening and most evolved of the monster races, and who lived on the far northeastern fringes of the habitable world as imagined by knowledgeable Europeans - Eirik the Red, Thorfinn Karlsefni and other leading figures in the two Vinland sagas among them." Dougweller (talk) 11:57, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
 * That explanation makes no sense. Far less than 0.1% of all Norse who ever lived would have known Latin, so how could they understand "skrælingar" as a translation of "pygmaei"? Even if they did know Latin, how would they know that specific word was the Norse translation of that specific Latin word? Explanation would definitely have been necessary. The authors of Antiquity and the medieval Christian canon were both unknown to the Norse of Greenland and Iceland. That Eirik the Red and Thorfinn Karlsefni should have read Pliny is absurd. Even to assume they could read Latin characters at all is quite a leap. She may be an authority, but even so her theories have to conform to basic logic. LarsMarius (talk) 17:07, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm wondering if you understand what we mean by reliable sources. If you think she doesn't meet the criteria here, see if people at WP:RSN agree. The important thing it to attribute the idea explicitly to her so that it's not being said in Wikipedia's own voice. Doug Weller (talk) 21:00, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Norse Worldview?
As it is now, this section says absolutely nothing about Skrælings aside from a completely weak introductory sentence clearly intended to justify the section's inclusion in this article. The section is interesting, but unless rewritten I don't see why it's here. 71.37.51.247 (talk) 01:59, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Agreed - which is why I just deleted this paragraph. Albrecht Conz (talk) 22:14, 24 August 2016 (UTC)

Indigenous?

 * Skræling (Old Norse and Icelandic: skrælingi, plural skrælingjar) is the name the Norse Greenlanders used for the indigenous peoples they encountered in North America and Greenland.[1]

Norse people were in Greenland way before the Thule people arrived. How come can they be called indigenous, when it's clearly the Norse the indigenous ones? --46.25.48.186 (talk) 06:33, 20 June 2016 (UTC)

"Thule" refers to a culture, which is not neccesarily a 'people' or 'race'. The preceding Dorset culture were also indigenous and far more closely related to Thule culture. As the Norse left in the 15th c. applying the term 'indigenous' to them is silly. It's all semantics anyway.1812ahill (talk) 18:40, 17 November 2016 (UTC) 1812ahill (talk) 18:40, 17 November 2016 (UTC)
 * I think the Greenland tourist board tries to spin it that way. The Dorset culture was NOT connected to the Thule (the newly-arrived Eskimo culture).  Dorset society was quite different in terms of hunting and tools used.  And the Dorset are believed to have been gone before either Vikings or Inuit Eskimos arrived.  It's unclear which New World people the Vikings first encountered and even where the first contact happened.  However, the term skraeling was applied to all New World people, so when the Thule (Inuit Eskimos) did eventually reach Greenaland and work their way down the west coast, they were called skraelings when they came into contact with the Norse.  71.226.227.121 (talk) 14:24, 13 August 2020 (UTC)

Correct meaning of Skræling
ItsACityOfApes has read extensively on the Vikings, their culture and in North America. Let us set you straight. The word has its origins in Germanic and means 'yelper' or 'screecher' and was derived from the fact that those tribes used captured people to temper their swords while they were still alive. The 'skræl' sound is the verbal sound of their screeching sound upon impalement. [At this time, the proto-viking peoples were also known to take captured children, fling them in the air, and impale them alive - but not in tempering their swords.] Skræling comes to mean 'outsider' in a generic way. If you were banished from the tribe, you were called a skræling, and if you helped a skræling you also became a skræling. The Vikings did indeed refer to the occupants of North America as outsiders and thus skræling. This was used to describe the Dorset - their main friendly trading partners on Elsemere Island obtaining walrus tusks from them; - and also to the Beothuk. The Inuit, arrive and wipe out the Dorset using bows and arrows which was a lost technology in North America c. 1450 AD. [The Inuit were a brand new culture emerging from the Inupiat culture in Point Barrow, being adapted to live on the ice only 3 years hence]. The Vikings did not hear from those in Settlement #3 in Northern Greenland for a few years and an expedition from Settlement #2 saw 'heathen' - that is, the Inuit occupying the site. Understanding the Viking North American sagas correctly, they are not a map of how to travel to North America [such trade and captain's knowledge was never written down but transmitted orally], but a lesson guide of how to live with the natives. The sagas state that when the North American Natives get uppity, you are to leave. The remainder of the Greenlanders, noting the aggressive Inuit occupying iron sites in the North and killing all others, left by migrating with their friends the Dorset to their homeland - Hudson Straight and Foxe Basin. The Vikings were slightly particular in the words they used in Greenland for outsiders; there were skræling banished from their culture, but the Dorset may not have been described as such because they were friendly, whereas the Inuit were a brand new culture and described as 'heathen'. The rest of the article is really about the Vikings exploring vast portions of North America which they did indeed do, but is not related to 'skræling'. ItsACityOfApes (talk) 18:39, 27 December 2022 (UTC)

 * user:ItsACityOfApes we only care about reliable published sources, see WP:RS. Doug Weller  talk 18:32, 27 December 2022 (UTC)
 * That's why it was placed in talk section. ItsACityOfApes (talk) 18:40, 27 December 2022 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 05:38, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Thorfinn Karlsefni 1918.jpg

Afrikaans 'skraal'
In Afrikaans the word 'skraal' means scrawny and is considered an insult. Not sure of the etymology or whether this is cognate with the English 'scrawny.' 2001:8003:1D5D:5401:207A:5BF8:100C:C24A (talk) 07:42, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

 * This is a bit off-topic for this talk page, but just to give a reply: 'Scrawny' could have Scandinavian origins, possibly Old Norse 'skrælna'. Afrikaans 'skraal' comes from Dutch 'schraal', which in turn seems to share a Germanic origin with these similar Scandinavian words. So 'skraal' and 'scrawny' are probably cognate, but the connection is a bit long and complex.213.219.153.155 (talk) 19:20, 12 February 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Skræling


text:
Granville Eliot, 7th Earl of St Germans

Granville John Eliot, 7th Earl of St Germans (22 September 1867 – 20 November 1942) was an English aristocrat.

Early life
Granville Eliot was the son of Charles George Cornwallis Eliot (16 October 1839 – 22 May 1901) and his wife, Constance Rhiannon Guest (November 1844 - 1916). He was educated at Castleden Hall School, Farnborough, Hampshire and Charterhouse School and became a Bank Clerk, living in the Malverns.

Title
On 21 March 1922, on the death of his first cousin John Granville Cornwallis Eliot, 6th Earl of St Germans, Granville became the 7th Earl of St Germans. He died unmarried on 20 November 1942 and his titles passed to his younger brother, Montague.

title: Granville Eliot, 7th Earl of St Germans


text:
Upper Island Cove

Upper Island Cove, Newfoundland and Labrador is a town in Newfoundland and Labrador, Canada. It is located in Census Division No. 1 and was incorporated on October 19, 1965. It is located northeast of Bay Roberts. , the population is 1,401.

History
Upper Island Cove is a unique town both in its physical location and its culture. Built at the bottom of high cliffs, the town was once known as “The Walled City." A number of today's residents are descendants of these early fishermen from England and Ireland.

Demographics
The population was 942 in 1940; 1,346 in 1951, 1,563 in 1956, and 1,762 in 1966.

In the 2021 Census of Population conducted by Statistics Canada, Upper Island Cove had a population of $1,401$ living in $582$ of its $669$ total private dwellings, a change of NaN% from its 2016 population of $1,561$. With a land area of 7.82 km2, it had a population density of in 2021.

St. Peter's Church and School
The Parish of Upper Island Cove is made up of three congregations. St. Peter's, Upper Island Cove; St. John the Evangelist, Bishop's Cove; and St. Andrew's, Bryant's Cove. The Parish dates to 1815 when construction began on the first church building at Upper Island Cove.

Today, Upper Island Cove is one of the largest Anglican Parishes in the Diocese serving over 850 families in the three communities. Each of the Church buildings is unique in architecture and is well maintained. The Parish is served by active Sunday Schools, a Vacation Bible School, J.A., C.L.B., Three A.C.W. Branches, an A.C.A.A., and various Adult Christian Education Programs.

St. Peter’s School celebrated its 50th anniversary in 2011. It is a part of the Eastern School District, whose main offices are in St. John's. St. Peter's currently has an enrollment of 248 students and offers grades Kindergarten through Grade 9. The average class size is 22.5 students. The school serves the communities of Bishop’s Cove, Bryant’s Cove and Upper Island Cove. Approximately 91% of students are bussed to school on a daily basis. Although its name dates back to the time when there was a denominational school system in Newfoundland and Labrador, and schools were run by various churches, today it is a public school.

Notable people

 * Craig Sharpe, musician and contestant on season four of Canadian Idol
 * Jason Greeley, musician and contestant on season two of Canadian Idol
 * Robert Slaney, ice hockey centre
 * John Lundrigan, member of the Newfoundland and Labrador House of Assembly and House of Commons
 * Haig Young, member of the Newfoundland and Labrador House of Assembly

title: Upper Island Cove


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kyb IE GetEmAll

Update: I count 5 votes to delete. I've deleted Kyb IE GetEmAll. Wile E. Heresiarch 23:38, 29 May 2004 (UTC)

Smells ad-ish. grendelkhan|(blather) 09:27, 2004 May 23 (UTC)

 * Ad. Delete. - David Gerard 10:40, May 23, 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. Software advert. Andrewa 11:17, 23 May 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete - advert - Tεx τ urε 02:18, 24 May 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. Johnleemk 11:43, 28 May 2004 (UTC)


text:
Ararat, Victoria

Ararat (Djabwurrung: Tallarambooroo) is a town in the Central Highlands region in Victoria, Australia, about 198 km west of Melbourne, on the Western Highway on the eastern slopes of the Ararat Hills and Cemetery Creek valley between Victoria's Western District and the Wimmera. Its urban population according to 2021 census is 8,500 and services the region of 11,880 residents across the Rural City's boundaries. It is also the home of the 2018/19 GMGA Golf Championship Final.

It is the largest settlement in the Rural City of Ararat local government area and is the administrative centre.

The discovery of gold in 1857 during the Victorian gold rush transformed it into a boomtown which continued to prosper until the turn of the 20th century, after which it has steadily declined in population. It was proclaimed as a city on 24 May 1950. After a decline in population over the 1980s and 90s, there has been a small but steady increase in the population, and it is the site of many existing and future, large infrastructure projects, including the Hopkins Correctional Facility development project.

It is named after Mount Ararat 10 kilometres south-west of the town which was named by politician/pastoralist Horatio Wills in 1841.

Ararat is the only city in Australia founded by Chinese people.

History
Prior to the European settlement of Australia, Ararat was inhabited by the Djab wurrung group of Aboriginal Australian people. The area encompassing Ararat has many Djabwurrung language placenames; 'Karangajaruk' refers to 'the valley in which Cathcart and the Ararat (gold) diggings lie', 'Warrayatkin' refers to Green Hill Lake, 'Butingitch' refers to the Ararat town site, 'Gorambeep barak' refers to Mount Ararat, and 'Pandort' refers to a large waterhole to the south.

Europeans first settled in the Grampians region in the 1840s after surveyor Thomas Mitchell passed through the area in 1836. In 1841, Horatio Wills, on his way to selecting country further south, wrote in his diary, "like the Ark we rested" and named a nearby hill Mt Ararat. It is from this entry and the nearby Mount that the town takes its name. The post office opened 1 February 1856 although known as Cathcart until 31 August 1857.

In 1857, a party of Chinese miners en route to the Central Victorian gold fields struck gold at the Canton Lead which marked the beginning of great growth in Ararat. The Chinese community was substantial in Ararat, and the Gum San Chinese Heritage Centre commemorates the history of the community.

Rapid growth brought about a municipality, which was incorporated as a borough on 24 September 1858.

In the aftermath of the goldrush, Ararat soon became known for its asylum. The Aradale Mental Hospital opened in 1865 with the former the Ararat County Gaol converted in 1887 to J Ward, a psychiatric facility for the criminally insane. The Hospital remained open as a treatment facility until 1997 and has since become the site for paranormal and haunted house tours.

Vines were planted in 1863 by Swiss settlers, the Pola family.

Traditional ownership claims
The formally recognised traditional owners for the area in which Ararat sits, north-west of Campbell Street and the Pyrenees Highway and north-east of the Western Highway and Lambert Street are the Wotjobaluk, Jardwadjali (also known as Jaadwa), Wergaia and Jupagalk nations. These nations are represented by the Barengi Gadjin Land Council Aboriginal Corporation.

The formally recognised traditional owners for the area in which Ararat sits, south-east of Campbell Street and the Pyrenees Highway are the Djab Wurrung people. The Djab Wurrung people are represented by Martang Pty Ltd.

In the area of Ararat that is south-west of the Western Highway and Lambert Street, traditional owners have not yet been formally recognised. However, the Eastern Maar people are negotiating a recognition and settlement agreement with the Victorian Government. The boundary of the agreement is under negotiation. The Eastern Maar people are represented by the Eastern Maar Aboriginal Corporation (EMAC).

Economy
Ararat's economy is driven by primary industries of the region including wool, beef and the Grampians Wine Region. The region has a number of wind farms including the Challicum Hills Wind Farm produce large amounts of renewable energy to the National Electricity Market. It is also home to AF Gason Pty Ltd one of Australia's largest manufacturers of farm machinery and wood heating.

The city also has a significant service economy with health, community services and is a regional commerce centre. Hopkins Correctional Centre, formerly known as H.M. Prison Ararat, is located on the town's eastern outskirts.

Servicing visitors to the Grampians National Park and the local wine industry, tourism is a relatively small but significant industry in Ararat, employing 150 people and generating around $8 million to the economy, however its impact on the surrounding region is significant with tourists spending $270 million annually. Key tourist attractions include the Ararat Regional Art Gallery, Mount Langi Ghiran winery, tours through Aradale (Australia's largest abandoned 1800s lunatic asylum) and the Gum San Chinese Heritage Centre.

Geography
Ararat is nestled between several mountain ranges, including the Grampians National Park, Mount Langi Ghiran, Mount Cole, Mount Buangor, Ararat Hills Regional Park and the Pyrenees Ranges. Cemetery Creek, the valley's main catchment runs through the north of the town while Green Hill lake is on the city's eastern fringe.

Climate
Ararat has a cool oceanic climate (Köppen Cfb), with warm summers that are frequently interrupted by cold fronts; and cool, usually rainy, winters.

Demographics
As of the 2021 census, Ararat City has a population of 7,015 with 1831 families total. The Ararat Local Government Area has a population of 11,880 with 2,973 families total.

88% of people in Ararat were born in Australia.

62% of people in Ararat identify as Christian. Anglican and Catholic faiths are evenly represented with 18% of people identifying with each.

Governance
The city is the location of the municipal offices and seat of government for the Rural City of Ararat local government area. Ararat is represented by the federal Division of Wannon.

For law enforcement, Ararat has a single police station as well as a magistrates court and a children's court all located on Barkly Street.

Education
Ararat has four primary schools - Ararat Primary (colloquially known as "Ararat 800" by locals); Ararat West Primary; Ararat North Primary and St Mary's Catholic Primary School. In addition there are several kindergartens in the city. There are two main secondary colleges, Ararat College and Marian College, the latter of which is a Catholic secondary school. Ararat has regional campuses of the Federation University Australia (formerly the University of Ballarat) and Melbourne Polytechnic (formerly the Northern Melbourne Institute of TAFE).

Art
Ararat's National Trust listed former town hall with its elaborate clock tower, designed by Molloy and Smith and built in 1899, is now home to the Ararat Regional Art Gallery, and the Ararat Performing Arts Centre for the city.

Sport
Australian rules football is a popular sport in Ararat. The Ararat Football Club (formed in 1871) was a founding club of the Wimmera Football League and continues to compete with its most recent premiership in 2023. A second club, the Ararat Eagles Football Club was formed more recently in 2000 to play in the Lexton Plains Football League, but now play in the Mininera & District Football League. Like many country football clubs, Ararat's clubs offer netball as a popular sport for women in Ararat, with the Ararat Rats representing the city in the Wimmera Netball Association.

The horse racing club, the Wimmera Racing Club, schedules around five race meetings a year at Ararat including the Ararat Cup meeting in November.

Ararat Harness Racing Club conducts regular meetings at its racetrack in the town.

Golfers play at the Aradale Golf Club on Grano Street or at the course of the Chalambar Golf Club on Golf Links Road.

Motocross has become a popular sport in the area, and the Ararat Motorcycle Club regularly holds events up to state level.

Ararat is also home to the Grampians Soaring Club, a recreational gliding club that supports "Yes Girls Glide" and has a successful juniors program.

Association football is played at junior level, with the Ararat and Grampians YMCA school competition from years 8–12.

Festivals
The city's main community festival is known as the Golden Gateway Festival and has run since 1958 when it was set up to commemorate the city's centenary.

The Jailhouse Rock Festival (since 1994 a retro 1950s themed festival) is the other major festival event in Ararat.

In popular culture
Two Royal Australian Navy ships have been named after this town. HMAS Ararat (K34), a Bathurst-class corvette, and HMAS Ararat (ACPB 89), an Armidale-class patrol boat.

In 2014 Ararat residents appeared in the Channel 10 hit show The Biggest Loser.

Ararat was the setting for the 2008 film Lake Mungo.

Attractions
Popular tourist destinations include the Gum San Chinese Heritage Centre, Aradale Lunatic Asylum Tours, Langi Morgala Museum, The Astor Cinema, and J Ward. Guests can attend a day time history tour of J Ward or be incarcerated for an evening on the J Ward Ghost Tour.

Transport
The main form of transport is road transport and motor vehicles. According to the 2006 Census, 88% of people traveled to work by motor vehicle, the vast majority of which traveled by automobile. Ararat is situated at the junction of several main roads including the Western Highway via High Street (running eastward to Ballarat and Melbourne and westward to Horsham and Adelaide); the Pyrenees Highway via Vincent Street (running east to Avoca and Maryborough); Ararat-Pomonal Road via Barkly Street (westward towards Halls Gap) and the Mortlake-Ararat Road via Vincent Street (running south with connections to the west and Hamilton, south and Warrnambool and to the east and Geelong). Ararat's urban area streets are laid out in grid plan. Roads are also important for public transport. Ararat Transit provides 120 bus services on three routes 6 days a week, connecting with train services. According to the 2006 Census, just 4 persons in Ararat traveled to work by bus. Taxi services are provided by Ararat Cabs (since November 2010), provides 6 normal taxi-cabs and 1 wheel-chair bus, capable of 2 wheelchairs or 10 standard passengers.

Rail transport includes both passenger rail and freight rail. The city's only station is Ararat's railway station which is on the Ararat railway line and is the terminal train station for the Ararat V/Line rail service. Twice daily peak VLocity services run to Ballarat (53 minutes) and on to Melbourne (133–143 minutes), with some trains stopping at stations in between. The rail station is at the junction of the Ararat line, the Western standard gauge railway and Avoca railway. The Overland runs to Melbourne twice weekly (140 minutes) and travel to Adelaide is also possible (8 hours).

A regional airport, Ararat Airport YARA (ARY) is located 5 km south of the city on the Western Highway and provides for general aviation.

Health
Ararat & District Hospital (established in 1850) is a major regional hospital and is coordinated by the East Grampians Health Service and Ararat Medical Centre.

Utilities
Water and waste-water services are supplied by Grampians-Wimmera-Mallee Water (GWMWater). Ararat's water supply source is a combination of Mt Cole Reservoir and Lake Fyans, with the smaller Langi Ghiran (Picnic Road) Reservoir also part of the water supply system. Olivers Gully and Copes Hill reservoirs provide additional water storage.

Notable people

 * Shane KellyOlympic cyclist and silver and bronze medallist
 * Rene KinkAustralian Rules footballer
 * Neil MurrayArarat-born, Lake Bolac-raised singer-songwriter
 * Air Chief Marshal Sir Frederick Schergerborn in Ararat on 18 May 1904
 * James Scobie (1860–1940)jockey and racehorse trainer, was born in or near Ararat
 * Geoff Toddartist
 * Ella WoodAustralian Women's Rules footballer

title: Ararat, Victoria


text:
Talk:Royal Canadian Mounted Police

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Priya1302.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 08:24, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Women in the RCMP/Role in colonization
These are two sections that are very similar - they talk about a specific but unique part of the RCMP's history - but are formatted differently. At the moment Women in the RCMP is its own category, while Role in colonization is a subcategory of the History section. Should they both be moved to the History section, or should Role in colonization be made into its own category to be consistent with Women in the RCMP? The content from Women in the RCMP could also maybe be folded into the general historical narrative. ReactionEquipment (talk) 01:06, 14 August 2022 (UTC)

 * Agreed, there is redundancy. I think it might be worth it to have a completely separate section titled "Controversies" that could link to List of Controversies involving the Royal Canadian Mounted Police for a more in-depth description of incidents. Women in the RCMP subsection would fit into Controversies as there have been a number of investigations into workplace culture highlighting misogyny. Subsection could also be "RCMP relationship with women" to capture a broader experience than just female RCMP employees. Other sections allude to Indigenous women and MMIWG investigations that would fit well under this subsection. Colonialism section certainly needs to be expanded, the fact that Project SITKA isn't mentioned says that this is really lacking! Controversies could include: use of force, women, colonialism, racism, privacy infringement (linking to PROFUNC page and RCMP Security Service page) and misuse of funds to start. Privacy infringement could include mention of relationship with private sector (some CRCC investigations touch on this) or it could be distinguished in its own right as some aspects of this controversy are simply about the relationship alone (like C-IRG). Thoughts on sections would be appreciated! 17dsrd (talk) 21:00, 26 July 2023 (UTC)
 * There was a controversies section ages ago, but I think it got folded into the general history narrative and gradually edited out (I might have done some of that, my bad :P). I think a controversies section would honestly do the page well.  If we do add one, I think it could maybe look like this:
 * ==Controversies and criticisms==
 * ===Structural criticisms===
 * (Concerns about Depot, contract policing, etc could go here)
 * ===Role in colonization===
 * (I'm still not decided if this goes better in history or here, it kinda fits well in both and I think a decent chunk of the controversy stems from the fact that they were and are still colonizing, not just for the way in which they're doing it)
 * ===Workplace sexual misconduct===
 * (working title, could honestly be expanded to cover corporate culture as a whole - beyond misconduct, there's a culture of opaqueness and centralized decision-making about which there has been enough noteworthy controversy to discuss)
 * ===Privacy infringement===
 * (PROFUNC, 1960s barn burning, project sitka, probably also facial recognition - I don't think this title totally captures it though. Maybe internal espionage?)
 * ===Corruption===
 * (Savoie incident, probably that recent arrest of the retired federal detective could go under here too)
 * Given that the article is already this long, I don't think it'd be fair to try and add use of force controversies, not in the least because that's usually the realm of individual detachments, not the force as a whole as these other controversies are. Maybe some, like the killing of Robert Dziekanski might warrant a mention though?
 * I think the current "Women in the RCMP" subsection, which has since been folded into the History category, could stay as-is or be integrated with the rest of the historical narrative (which is what's currently done for racialized mounties). I think it's worth separating it from the sexual misconduct because A) women do have a distinct but not necessarily controversial history in the RCMP and B) the sexual misconduct includes both women and men as victims as well as perpetrators. ReactionEquipment (talk) 04:14, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Maintiens le droit
It is getting a bit tiresome having to amend the translation of Maintiens le droit. I think some of these translations must be coming from users who have no knowledge of French. If that describes you, would you please desist from posting translations, even if you find said translation at a source, as there seem to be plenty of RCMP officers who know no French.

Maintiens le droit does not mean "Maintain the right" (and yes, I know that online translation websites will translate it that way, but they are notorious for not realizing what the context is). This would be Maintiens le bien in French. Le droit only means "the right" in French if the speaker or writer means "the unassailable entitlement", such as the right to a fair trial by one's peers or a citizen's right to vote in elections (which is what the online translation websites assume, not knowing the context). "Defend the law" is a bit of a free translation (ie somewhat inexact), but perhaps a fair one. "Maintain the right", on the other hand, is a load of guff.

Maintiens le droit means "Uphold the law".Kelisi (talk) 02:48, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

 * Reverted to the previous phrasing. The translations are not coming from Google, or people who are unfamiliar with French.  They are coming from three Canadian government cites:  the Gov Gen's grant of the badge and motto, and two RCMP webpages.  We have to rely on the what the reliable cites say, not personal opinions.  If you have a reliable cite that contradicts the GovGen's and the RCMP's own websites, please provide it.  Otherwise, I think we have to keep with what the Gov Gen and the RCMP give as the meaning of the motto.  Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 03:03, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
 * They are not reliable sites just because they are government sites, and I was stating facts, not opinions. I remind you that the Governor General only recently began learning French; so what might she know about the RCMP's motto? Why don't you contact a few bilingual francophone Wikipedians? You ought to consider them a more reliable source than any website maintained by people who don't speak French (and you are wrong about the translations not coming from people who are unfamiliar with French, I assure you). You obviously don't speak French yourself, but I do. Cette traduction n’est pas juste. Elle a été faite par quelqu’un dont les connaissances du français étaient minimales. Je devrais mentionner aussi que les références à l’autorité sont une faute de logique. On ne peut pas présumer que c’est un fait seulement parce que c’est une autorité qui le déclare.Kelisi (talk) 04:28, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

 * just as Wikipedia is not a reliable source, neither are individual wikipedians. « Because a wikipedian says so » is ORIGINAL and therefore not allowed. Not is it a logical error to appeal to authority; Wikipedia is based on the concept of reliable sources, which is intrinsically an appeal to authority, rather than personal knowledge.  I would also disagree with your statement that government websites are not reliable sources.  Nor it is appropriate for you to make personal attacks by questioning other editors’ knowledge sets. Finally, since the purpose of a talk page is to allow all interested editors to participate in the discussion, I would suggest that you should make your comments in the language of the particular variant of Wikipedia in which you are posting.  Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 05:30, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

Condensing the lead
The lead is too long and this has been tagged as an issue since February. There is my suggestion to condense it, I will upload if no one raises any issues on talk.

The Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP; Gendarmerie royale du Canada; GRC), commonly known in English as the Mounties (and colloquially in French as la police montée), is the national police service of Canada. The RCMP is an agency of the Government of Canada; it also delivers police services under contract to eight provinces, all three territories, over 150 municipalities, and 600 Indigenous communities.

The Royal Canadian Mounted Police was established in 1920 with the amalgamation of the Royal North-West Mounted Police and the Dominion Police. Sworn members of the RCMP have jurisdiction as a peace officer in all provinces and territories of Canada. Under its federal mandate, the RCMP is responsible for enforcing federal legislation; investigating inter-provincial and international crime; border integrity; overseeing Canadian peacekeeping missions involving police; managing the Canadian Firearms Program, which licenses and registers firearms and their owners; and the Canadian Police College, which provides police training to Canadian and international police services. Policing is considered to be a constitutional responsibility of provinces, however, the RCMP provides local police services under contract in all provinces and territories except Ontario and Quebec. Despite its name, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police are no longer an actual mounted police service, and horses are only used at ceremonial events and certain other occasions. — WildComet talk 21:44, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

 * This looks fantastic, I especially like the succinct explanation of contract policing. My only notes are:
 * - I think given the decades-long controversy in the public, policing world, and RCMP itself about its mandate, a small note after the list of roles that says that the RCMP has faced criticism for its broad mandate/that the mandate is controversial;
 * - I would maybe say "Policing in Canada is considered to be a constitutional..." rather than simply "policing is considered.." for clarity; and finally,
 * - It may be worth including a third, brief paragraph that summarizes the RCMP's cultural role? Something along the lines of "The Government of Canada considers the RCMP to be an unofficial national symbol, and in 2013, 87 per cent of Canadians interviewed by Statistics Canada said that the RCMP was important to their national identity." or similar.
 * This is probably the only police force in the world that is simultaneously beloved internationally, considered a symbol of national unity, and almost universally lambasted in the press and parliament - I think mentioning the controversy as well as the cultural role captures the nuanced, verifiable space that the RCMP currently occupies in Canada. ReactionEquipment (talk) 04:35, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Great, I went ahead and added it with your suggestions. — WildComet talk 18:21, 12 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Great, I went ahead and added it with your suggestions. — WildComet talk 18:21, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

New Guidon
As of 2023, the RCMP has a new guidon, and the photo needs to be updated. https://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/en/guidon 128.189.152.10 (talk) 16:42, 24 October 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Royal Canadian Mounted Police


text:
Talk:New York Public Library

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Peer reviewers: Vanessa Sang, Dianehyi, Aleishar21.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 05:14, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Compensation
Peviously I used to look at Guidestar to see what was the compensation of various library administrators. Someone recently showed me the website See Through NY https://www.seethroughny.net/payrolls which provides salaries for various people who contribute to NY State's pension system. I checked my own salary and that of various other people I know and I believe this is pretty accurate. I'm an employee so I'm not going to add the information, but - recognizing that we're in an era of transparency - I provide the URL if anyone else wants to add such information. - kosboot (talk) 02:37, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

Interview with Michele Mayes (legal council for NYPL)
Really interesting interview with NYPL's head laywer, Michele Mayes. Provides interesting facts and perspective - some of which I think is worth incorporating into the article: https://news.bloomberglaw.com/business-and-practice/n-y-public- library-legal-boss-aims-for-judicious-spending. --

Vartan Gregorian
No mention of vartan Gregorian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vartan_Gregorian) anywhere? What a shame.
 * That might be better done at this page: List of presidents of the New York Public Library, since this particular article does not talk about the Library's many esteemed presidents. Why not make an appopriate edit of your own there?

title: Talk:New York Public Library