text:
Talk:Ezra Taft Benson

Old conversations
I added the following as 2nd 'graph in Ezra Taft Benson:
 * (His family should not be confused with that of another Western political figure of the next generation, Lloyd Bentsen.)

A WP colleague may have been right in removing it, summarizing:
 * Deleted comment about Lloyd Bentsen. Not in any way relevant, nor likely that anyone would confuse or even relate the two.

Unlikely things do happen. So my confusion, that led to my doing the research that led in turn to my addition of the "don't confuse" text, doesn't guarantee that such confusion is likely! But on the other hand, it does make it possible that my colleague has underestimated that likelihood. And more eyeballs than our four can be applied to making that judgement in the long term. --Jerzy(t) 03:13, 2004 May 20 (UTC)

Lloyd Bentsen
You are absolutely right. This was my first time to actually edit an article, and as soon as I posted my comments/deletion, I realized how rude my comments/action appeared. Please forgive...I'm new to this. I'm actually a direct descendant of Ezra T. Benson (Ezra Taft Benson's grandfather), so to me there is obviously no confusion between ETB and Lloyd Bentsen--but I totally acknowledge that I'm not the "average" reader.

Thanks for your patience with me. I will use much more tact/patience/collaboration in the future.
 * [Two 'graphs by User:207.46.238.136 precede this. --Jerzy(t)]
 * Just a friendly note, please sign all your posts. You can do this by typing three tildes, thus:  .  Using four tildes, ~, adds a time stamp.  The latter form is what most Wikipedians use.  Cheers! —Frecklefoot 18:57, May 20, 2004 (UTC)

 * 207, i didn't find you rude or unreasonable, and i apologize if my agnostic approach to this came across as irony intended to make you look bad. What i said about eyeballs means that even when two of us agree, we don't know we've got it right. The effectiveness of Wiki lies in our "editing boldly", making lots of mistakes, and getting lots of feedback.
 * You edited boldly, and were off to a good start by doing so; don't get embarrassed or whatever, and start holding back.
 * And by the way, i'm not sure i've ever seen a note quite like the one i wrote; i'm waiting to see if others think it was "encyclopedic". Your edit called my attention, indirectly, to that issue, and further thot resulted in another way of attacking the same issue, which you'll see if you link via the "What links here" link on Lloyd Bentsen; probably still the last item on that list by the time you look at it.   (I thot i had already done the equivalent re Ezra Taft Benson, but i'll get to that soon.)  I probably wouldn't have gotten around to thinking of it soon, if you hadn't enhanced  the discussion by offering your opinion. So accept my thanks, instead of my accepting your apology, OK?
 * --Jerzy(t) 23:29, 2004 May 20 (UTC)

It's a deal. Btw...though a newbie, I am quickly realizing how Wikipdedia can become a religion. Consider this my baptism. :) Thanks!!!  Brolap 21:53, 21 May 2004 (UTC)

I never once associated Ezra Taft Benson with Lloyd Bentsen. However, I've always wondered where the "Taft" in his name came from? Is he any relation to the Tafts who are somewhat of a political dynasty in Ohio, with William Howard Taft being the 27th President, his son and grandson each serving as U.S. Senators, and his great-grandson being the current Governor of Ohio? 198.86.235.111 20:23, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes. See the Taft family entry. Acsenray 19:31, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Japanese IW
Hi, why are there two interwiki links to Japanese? --Amir E. Aharoni 17:10, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

"Outed" vs. "Ousted"
I changed the term "outed" to "ousted;" the term "outed" is confusing, as it generally relates to one being discovered to be a homosexual, whereas "ousted" is generally the term used in politics for one who is forced out of his position. BarrettBrown 03:16, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

From Talk:Ezra Taft Benson/Comments

 *  The following was origionally posted to Talk:Ezra Taft Benson/Comments, but should have been posted here, so moved. -- 208.81.184.4 (talk) 16:27, 13 May 2011 (UTC)

I understand that Benson attended and graduated from Iowa State College (now University)in Ames, Iowa. However, I don't have any dates. 70.246.50.126 03:49, 9 December 2006 (UTC)Russel Lane

Confusing misplaced modifier in article.
I am starting this subject to try and clear up a confusing misplaced modifier in the Biography section of the article. The relevant confusing paragraph states: "Born on a farm in Whitney, Idaho, Benson was the oldest of eleven children. He was the great grandson of another Ezra Taft Benson, now known as "Ezra T. Benson", who was appointed by Brigham Young as a member of the Quorum of Twelve Apostles from 1846 on. Beginning his academic career at Utah State University, he was a 1926 graduate of Brigham Young University (after serving a church mission in Britain from 1921 to 1923)." The way it is currently worded, it sounds as if President Benson's great-grandfather, Ezra T. Benson, was the one who began his academic career at Utah State University, graduating from BYU in 1926. I know that's not the meaning we were trying to convey, but I don't know how we could fix that. Any thoughts? --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable (talk) 19:53, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

 * Beginning his academic career at Utah State University, the younger Benson was a 1926 graduate of Brigham Young University..." ? Just a suggestion ... Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:15, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

 * I like that rewording. If there are no objections within the next few days, let's go with that. --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable (talk) 16:46, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

picture
you can use this one  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.180.63.89 (talk) 02:50, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Not a member of the John Birch Society
Benson was not a member of the John Birch Society. He was a supporter of the organization’s cause and members of his family were in the Society, but he was not on the rolls of the organization. (Matthew R. Lee) 15:03, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

No evidence for age as a factor in ordination
It may be possible that Spencer W. Kimball was ordained an apostle before Ezra Taft Benson as a result of age but I find no evidence to support this claim.

Spencer W. Kimball was extended the called 18 days before Ezra Taft Benson. He is senior to Benson in both his calling and ordination. Here are two sources on the timing of the calls:

Kimball was extended the called to “fill one of the vacancies in the Quorum” of the Twelve by President J. Reuben Clark Jr. on July 8, 1943 (Kimball, Edward L., Kimball, Andrew E. Spencer W. Kimball. Bookcraft, Inc. 1977, p.188-189).

Benson was extended the called to be a member of the Council of the Twelve by President Heber J. Grant on July 26, 1943 (Dew, Sheri. Ezra Taft Benson: A Biography. Deseret Book Company. 1987, p. 174).

Both were ordained by President Heber J. Grant in the Salt Lake Temple on October 7, 1943.

It could be true that age was the factor in who was called first but I find no evidence to support this claim.

I understand that this is a completely different issue than whether or not Benson was called to fill vacancy in the Quorum created by the death of Sylvester Q. Cannon or Rudger Clawson. Because Cannon died first it is my opinon that Kimball filled the vacancy created by Cannon's death and Benson fileld the vacancy created by the death of Clawson. Until this, like the claim related to age about, is verified it is only opinon.

Removing the text: “a decision that was made because Kimball was older than Benson” due to lack of evidence.

(Matthew R. Lee) 01:53, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

Shocking but true
Hard to believe that such a "respected" religious leader would write the foreword to a book like this. Ugh. Stonemason89 (talk) 15:38, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Regardless of the shock value of the cover, the text of the foreward seems to be unavailable anywhere. A cursory search for the above shows that the person making the biggest deal of this was Benson's grandson Steve Benson - who (reading his other writings) seems to have quite the chip on his shoulder regarding his grandfather.  He advertises his stance against the LDS church and just about anything associated with it.  I dont think this trivial rises to the level of inclusion in this article.  To illuminate: when reading the old quotes of E.T. Benson as noted by by Steve Benson, it quickly becomes clear that most (if not all) of these statements are taken out of context an pieced together for a more inflammatory effect.  The bulk of them come from a talk given in 1967.  When read more critically than a cursory glance looking for buzzwords,  you see that the talk is more about communists than black people.  In that very talk, E.T. Benson qualifies his statements thus:
 * "'First of all, we must not place the blame upon Negroes. They are merely the unfortunate group that has been selected by professional Communist agitators to be used as the primary source of cannon fodder. Not one in a thousand Americans-black or white-really understands the full implications of today's civil rights agitation. The planning, direction, and leadership come from the Communists, and most of those are white men who fully intend to destroy America by spilling Negro blood, rather than their own.'"
 * While not very PC language, the intent is obviously *not* advocating violence against African Americans. E.T. Benson was a noted anti-communist, and in the 1950s and 1960s, such conspiracy theories abounded at every level of society and government; And he uses the vocabulary of that time to express his views.  But using today's PC-paintbrush to color him as a racist isn't clearly representing the person.  And throwing trivial (out-of-context) factoids out there doesnt do justice, or give perspective.  Nothingofwater (talk) 20:47, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Reliable source?
The quote attributed to Benson regarding Martin Luther King, Jr. was from the student newspaper of the University of Utah. I think a more reliable source should be used for a quote like that. Alanraywiki (talk) 05:36, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I've added an additional source ~ David O. McKay and the Rise of Modern Mormonism, by Gregory A. Prince & William Robert Wright, University of Utah Press, 2005, ISBN 0874808227, pgs 72-73, 92-93, 473. The partial passages can be seen on google books ---> here.   Red thoreau  -- (talk) 13:53, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
 * That's a much better source. School newspapers may be okay as a reference for school events, but I believe the consensus is that they are not reliable sources beyond that. Thanks for finding the new reference. Alanraywiki (talk) 14:12, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Archive?
Is it time to archive this talk page? -- 208.81.184.4 (talk) 21:02, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Apostle/U.S. federal office holder
I agree with User:FyzixFighter's edit here, which removed the suggestion that only Benson and Brigham Young held a U.S. federal office while they were an apostle of the LDS Church. In addition to Reed Smoot, there was also George Q. Cannon, who was delegate to the House of Representatives from Utah Territory beginning in 1873. If I'm not mistaken, Thomas S. Monson was also appointed by Ronald Reagan to be on a Presidential commission on community service and volunteerism, though that may not qualify as quite the same thing as a "federal office". Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:37, 10 March 2011 (UTC)

"None Dare Call it A Conspiracy"
The article states that Benson recommended all Mormons read the above titled tract. A keyword search of the general conference address cited reveals neither the name, "None Dare Call it A Conspiracy," nor the author's name, Gary Allen. Josephah8 (talk) 14:12, 12 July 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Josephah8 (talk • contribs) 14:09, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

 * I have since watched the footage of this talk, and indeed he does bring up Gary Allen's "None Dare Call it A Conspiracy." It doesn't seem to be in the text of the address.Josephah8 (talk) 14:58, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

 * Ad hominem criticisms and assumptions about Steve Benson & D. Michael Quinn are not of any real value to the content of this article, and should be avoided. -- 208.81.184.4 (talk) 00:05, 22 October 2013 (UTC)

I agree with the editor and am sorry for any earlier comments involving personal attacks on Steve Benson and D. Michael Quinn. I hope that I have not embarrassed anyone or made anyone feel targeted. I sincerely apologize and request that my account will not be blocked because of my inappropriate behavior. Thecoatman1 (talk) 00:38, 23 October 2013 (UTC)

Why is Merlo Pusey not considered a reliable source?
Jgstokes reverted my edits. Why is a book by Merlo J. Pusey, a Pulitzer Prize-winning author and Washington Post editorial-page writer (and LDS, who knew Benson during his two stays in DC) not considered a reliable source? The book's URL is in the edits so anyone can verify that I cited it accurately. Ylee (talk) 15:06, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
 * The edits look good to me, and Pusey is certainly a reliable source. Good Ol’factory (talk) 18:04, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Let the record show I never impugned the source. My explanation was that the edits were taken out of context and were inaccurate. In rereading the source, I can see that I was in error. I was basing my judgment on the first part of what I had read, which says nothing about Benson's call. The later pages do, however, so that was a major oversight on my part. I ask forgiveness for my hastiness in jumping to this conclusion. I will be more careful in the future. Sorry. --Jgstokes (talk) 00:11, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Infobox
Propose changing to Infobox Officeholder, as appears here. Please note that this continues to accommodate the specific features and religious terminology included in the LDS Infobox in a clear, aesthetically pleasing and respectful way, while also far better accommodating Benson's political career. The current infobox features his tenure as Agriculture in a clunky, and frankly inappropriate way; the bizarre "in office" stripe looks more like an "Incumbent" stripe as featured in Infobox Officeholder, and his partisan affiliation is included with his predecessor and successor, rather than with personal information as seen in nearly all other infoboxes. While it could be argued that the use of an LDS Infobox is standard for all church presidents, I would argue that the use of Infobox Officeholder is standard used across the articles of all Agriculture Secretaries! Quite frankly, this seems like a specific case where Infobox Officeholder would appropriately be used.--Ministre d'État (talk) 19:07, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * As noted in the edit summary I did, I feel efforts to alter and not use the long-standing, existing infobox template doesn't make a significant difference. It moves the information up for his service as Sec of Ag up and plops it square in the middle of various church service roles he had.  That seems more clunky than it not shows.  It would limit the consistent use with other church presidents and places where inserting the template into a listing or other situation would not be possible.  I would not characterize the current use as inappropriate, but I would note that it would be good to include Eisenhower in the portion of the box about Benson's service. ChristensenMJ (talk) 16:11, 9 August 2016 (UTC)

I agree fully with ChristensenMJ. The current infobox should stay, as it is consistent with infoboxes for others that have held the same positions in the LDS Church that Benson has held. --Jgstokes (talk) 23:39, 9 August 2016 (UTC)

The Black Hammer
Benson wrote the forward to a book that is controversial both due to its cover and content. I'd thought about posting the book cover in the article, but it is a bit disturbing. I thought I'd ask the Wikipedia community for their thoughts. My vote is to put it in the article. Here is the image: Epachamo (talk) 19:36, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

 * Apparently, I can't legally post a book cover on the talk page. I've been bold and put it in the article in as NPOV way as possible, trying to explain Benson's motivations in a way that he would have agreed with.  Epachamo (talk) 20:59, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Ezra Taft Benson


text:
Rind et al. controversy

The 'Rind et al''. controversy''' was a debate in the scientific literature, public media, and government legislatures in the United States regarding a 1998 peer reviewed meta-analysis of the self-reported harm caused by child sexual abuse (CSA). The debate resulted in the unprecedented condemnation of the paper by both chambers of the United States Congress. The social science research community was concerned that the condemnation by government legislatures might have a chilling effect on the future publication of controversial research results.

The study's lead author is the psychologist Bruce Rind; it expanded on a 1997 meta-analysis for which Rind is also the lead author. The authors stated their goal was to determine whether CSA caused pervasive, significant psychological harm for both males and females, controversially concluding that the harm caused by child sexual abuse was not necessarily intense or pervasive, that the prevailing construct of CSA was not scientifically valid, as it failed empirical verification, and that the psychological damage caused by the abusive encounters depends on other factors, such as the degree of coercion or force involved. The authors concluded that even though CSA may not result in lifelong, significant harm to all victims, this does not mean it is not morally wrong and indicated that their findings did not imply current moral and legal prohibitions against CSA should be changed.

The Rind et al. study has been criticized by many scientists and researchers, on the grounds that its methodology and conclusions are poorly designed and statistically flawed. Its definition of harm, for example, has been the subject of debate, as it only examined self-reported long-term psychological effects in young adults, whereas harm can have several forms, including short-term or medical harm (for example, sexually transmitted infections or injuries), a likelihood of revictimization, and the amount of time the victim spent attending therapy for the abuse. Numerous studies and professional clinical experience in the field of psychology, both before and after Rind et al.'s publications, have long borne out that children cannot consent to sexual activity and that child and adolescent sexual abuse cause harm. Psychologist Anna Salter comments that Rind et al.'s results are "truly an outlier" compared to other meta-analyses.

A later CSA study by Heather Ulrich and two colleagues, published in The Scientific Review of Mental Health Practice, attempted to replicate the Rind study, correcting for methodological and statistical problems identified by Dallam and others, and it ultimately supported some of the Rind findings but also acknowledged the limitations of the findings, and, ultimately did not endorse Rind's recommendation to abandon the use of the term child sexual abuse in cases of apparent consent in favor of the term adult-child sex.

The Rind paper has been quoted by people and organizations advocating age of consent reform, pedophile or pederasty groups, in support of their efforts to change attitudes towards pedophilia and to decriminalize sexual activity between adults and minors (children or adolescents).

Studies and findings
In 1997, psychology professor Bruce Rind of Temple University and doctoral student Philip Tromovitch of the University of Pennsylvania published "A meta-analytic review of findings from national samples on psychological correlates of child sexual abuse", a literature review in The Journal of Sex Research of seven studies regarding adjustment problems of victims of child sexual abuse (CSA). To avoid the sampling bias that, they argued, existed in most studies of CSA (which drew from samples mostly in the mental health or legal systems and thus were, as a sample, unlike the population as a whole), the 1997 study combined data from studies using only national samples of individuals expected to be more representative of the population of child sexual abuse victims. This study examined 10 independent samples designed to be nationally representative, based on data from more than 8,500 participants. Four of the studies came from the United States, and one each came from Great Britain, Canada, and Spain.

Based on the results, they concluded that the general consensus associating CSA with intense, pervasive harm and long-term maladjustment was incorrect. In 1998, Rind, Tromovitch and Robert Bauserman (then a professor at the University of Michigan) published "A Meta-Analytic Examination of Assumed Properties of Child Sexual Abuse Using College Samples", a meta-analysis in the Psychological Bulletin of 59 studies (36 published studies, 21 unpublished doctoral dissertations, and 2 unpublished master's theses) with an aggregate sample size of 35,703 college students (13,704 men and 21,999 women). In most of the 59 studies, CSA was defined by the authors based on legal and "moral" criteria.

Integrating the sometimes disparate and conflicting definitions, CSA was defined as "a sexual interaction involving either physical contact or no contact (e.g., exhibitionism) between either a child or adolescent and someone significantly older, or between two peers who are children or adolescents when coercion is used." "Child" was sometimes defined, not biologically, but as underaged or as a minor under the legal age of consent. All these studies were included in the meta-analysis because many CSA researchers, as well as lay persons, view all types of socio-legally defined CSA as morally and/or psychologically harmful. When this research, the U.S. Congress, and the APA refer to CSA and "children" in the context of sexual relations with adults, they are not only referring to biological (prepubescent) children, but to adolescents under the age of consent as well; this age varies between 16 and 18 years old in the U.S.

The results of the meta-analysis indicated that college students who had experienced CSA were slightly less well-adjusted compared to other students who had not experienced CSA, but that family environment was a significant confound that may be responsible for the association between CSA and harm. Intense, pervasive harm and long-term maladjustment were due to confounding variables in most studies, rather than to the sexual abuse itself (though exceptions were noted for abuse accompanied by force or incest). Both studies addressed four "assumed properties" of CSA, identified by the authors: gender equivalence (both genders affected equally), causality (CSA causes harm), pervasiveness (most victims of CSA are harmed) and intensity (the harm is normally significant and long-term), concluding that all four "assumed properties" were questionable and had several potential confounds.

Based on the closely mirrored results of both studies, Rind, Tromovitch and Bauserman questioned the scientific validity of a single term "child sexual abuse" and suggested a variety of different labels for sexual contact between adults and non-adults based on age and the degree to which the child was forced or coerced into participating. They concluded with a discussion of the legal and moral implications of the article, stating that the "wrongfulness" and "harmfulness" of sexual acts are not inherently linked, and finished with the statement: "the findings of the current review do not imply that moral or legal definitions of or views on behaviors currently classified as CSA should be abandoned or even altered. The current findings are relevant to moral and legal positions only to the extent that these positions are based on the presumption of psychological harm."

Controversies
The first set of peer reviewers for Psychological Bulletin had rejected the paper, with the authors being told not to submit it again, as it was considered too flawed. The authors did try again, following a change of editors at the journal; this time, only one reviewer turned it down. None of the other reviewers came forward, and it is still unclear who, if anybody, recommended it for publication.

The paper was published by the American Psychological Association (APA) in July 1998, in Psychological Bulletin. Strong reactions ultimately resulted, from both psychologists and psychiatrists who study sexual abuse and treat victims, and from social conservatives and later, from most of the US Congress.

Scholars familiar with the literature on sexual abuse, as well as experts in the field, found the study's conclusions surprising.

Initial reactions
The first substantial public reaction was a December 1998 criticism by the National Association for Research & Therapy of Homosexuality, an organization dedicated to the discredited view that homosexuality is a mental illness that can be cured by psychotherapy.

In March 1999, conservative talk show host Laura Schlessinger criticized the study as "junk science" and stated that, since its conclusions were contrary to conventional wisdom, its findings should never have been released. She criticized the study's use of meta-analysis, saying. "I frankly have never seen this in general science. ... This [pooling of studies] is so outrageous." "This was not a study. They didn’t do a study. They arbitrarily found 59 studies that other people had done [and] combined them all."

Shortly thereafter, the North American Man/Boy Love Association posted an approving review of the study on their website, furthering the impression that the piece was an endorsement of pedophilia.

Government
The paper eventually provoked a reaction from several conservative American members of Congress, notably the Republican representatives Matt Salmon of Arizona and Tom DeLay of Texas, who both condemned the study as advocating for the normalization of pedophilia.

In response, the APA declared in a press statement that child sexual abuse is harmful and wrong, and that the study was in no way an endorsement of pedophilia. The APA mandated a policy change by which APA journal editors would alert the organization of potentially controversial topics in order to be more proactive with politicians, the media and other groups. In an internal organization email, APA Executive Vice-President Raymond D. Fowler stated that, because of the controversy, the article's methodology, analysis and the process by which it had been approved for publication were reviewed and found to be sound. In June 1999, Fowler announced in an open letter to DeLay that there would be an independent review of the paper and stated that, from a public policy perspective, some language used in the article was inflammatory and inconsistent with the position of the APA's stance on CSA. The APA also implemented a series of actions designed to prevent the study from being used in legal arguments to defend CSA, and stated an independent review would be undertaken of the scientific accuracy and validity of the report. The request for an outside review of a controversial report by an independent scientific association was unprecedented in APA's 107-year history.

In April 1999, a resolution was introduced in the Alaska Legislature condemning the article, with similar resolutions introduced in California, Illinois, Louisiana, Oklahoma, and Pennsylvania over the subsequent two months. Some of these states' psychological associations reacted by asking the APA to take action.

On July 12, 1999, the United States House of Representatives passed HRC resolution 107 by a vote of 355-0, with 13 members voting "Present", declaring sexual relations between children and adults are abusive and harmful, and condemned the study on the basis that it was being used by pro-pedophilia activists and organizations to promote and justify child sexual abuse. The condemnation by Congress of a scientific study was, at that time, an unprecedented event. The resolution passed the Senate by a voice vote (100-0) on July 30, 1999 and was greeted among psychologists with concern due to the perceived chilling effect it might have among researchers. Representative Brian Baird, who has a Ph.D. in clinical psychology and was one of the 13 Congressmen to abstain from the condemnation of the study, stated that of the 535 members of the House and Senate, fewer than 10 had actually read the study, and even fewer were qualified to evaluate it based on its merit.

Independent review
In September 1999, the American Association for the Advancement of Science (AAAS), upon a request by the APA to independently review the article, stated that it saw no reason to second-guess the peer review process that approved it initially and that it saw no evidence of improper methodology or questionable practices by the authors. The AAAS also expressed concern that the materials reviewed demonstrated a grave lack of understanding of the study on the part of the media and politicians and were also concerned about the misrepresentation of its findings. The AAAS stated that the responsibility for discovering problems with the article lay with the initial peer reviewers, and declined to evaluate the article, concluding with a statement that the decision to not review the article was neither an endorsement nor a criticism of it.

APA new position
In August 2000, the APA drafted and adopted a position statement in response to the Rind et al. controversy that opposed any efforts to censor controversial or surprising research findings, and asserting that researchers must be free to investigate and report findings, as long as the research has been conducted within appropriate ethical and research standards.

Academic criticism and response
A series of 2001 papers published in the Journal of Child Sexual Abuse discussed and criticized the findings of the Rind et al. study. Stephanie Dallam stated that, after reviewing the evidence, the paper was best described as "an advocacy article that inappropriately uses science in an attempt to legitimatize its findings". Four other researchers also discussed possible flaws in the methodology and generalizability of Rind's findings, and concluded the paper's results were scientifically invalid. The criticisms were co-published in the 2001 book Misinformation Concerning Child Sexual Abuse and Adult Survivors. In 2002, a rebuttal to many of the claims made by critics was submitted to the APA journal, the American Psychologist by Scott Lilienfeld. After passing a normal peer review, the editor of the journal re-submitted the article in secret and, on the basis of this second review, the paper was rejected. Lilienfeld reported this subsequent rejection on several psychology Internet fora, which produced an intense response and resulted in the APA and American Psychologist ultimately printing the article as part of a special issue focusing on the controversy.

Possible sample bias
The paper has been criticized for restricting its analysis to convenience samples of college students, possibly introducing systematic bias by excluding victims so traumatized that they did not go on to attend college. Another possibility was that Rind et al.'s conclusions may not be generalizable beyond college populations in general as individuals with a history of CSA were more likely than non-abused individuals to drop out of college after a single semester.

Rind, Bauserman and Tromovitch responded to this criticism by saying that "the representativeness of college samples is in fact irrelevant to the stated goals and conclusions of our study" since the purpose of their research was "to examine the validity of the clinical concept" of CSA. They added that according to the commonly understood definition of the term, child sexual abuse is extremely and pervasively harmful, meaning that "in any population sampled - drug addicts, psychiatric patients, or college students - persons who have experienced CSA should show strong evidence of the assumed properties of CSA." The authors of the study say that because the college sample did not show pervasive harm, "the broad and unqualified claims about the properties of CSA are contradicted". Rind et al. also said that using college samples was appropriate because their study found similar prevalence rates and experiences of severity and outcomes between college samples and national samples.

Non-standardization of variables
Dallam et al. said that Rind et al. did not standardize their definition of child sexual abuse, leaving out certain studies that were appropriate, and including studies that were inappropriate. That is, they allege that Rind et al. uncritically combined data from studies of CSA with data from studies looking at other phenomena such as consensual peer experiences, sexual experiences that occurred during adulthood, and homosexual approaches during adolescence.

Rind, et al. have also responded to this criticism, defending the appropriateness of including all five of the studies (Landis, 1956; Schultz and Jones, 1983; Sedney and Brooks, 1984; Greenwald, 1994; and Sarbo, 1985 ) specifically identified by Dallam et al. as inappropriate to a study about child sexual abuse.

Dallam et al. said that the first three studies focused on all types of child sexual activity, not just child sexual abuse. Rind et al. reject this criticism. In regard to the Landis study, Rind et al. note that it has been used by many other sex researchers (e.g., Finkelhor, Fishman, Fromuth & Burkhart, Sarbo, and others) as an example of an early study about child sexual abuse. In regard to the Shultz and Jones study, Rind et al. concede that the study "looked at all types of 'sexual acts' before age 12," but explained that the respondents in the study were all asked "if their experience was with a person over the age of 16," thus allowing Rind et al. to include only the relationships that were age-discrepant. In regard to the Sedney and Brooks study, Rind et al. admit that the study used a broad definition of child sexual abuse, but explain that the researchers themselves chose to use such a definition "because of the difficulty posed by a priori decisions about what type of sexual experiences are 'problems.'"

Similarly, psychiatrist David Spiegel said that the inclusion of Landis' 1956 study was unjustified. He argued that, while weighting larger studies more than smaller makes sense, combining the results of a large study examining very mild trauma (such as fending off an attacker) with studies of long-term physical and sexual abuse was inappropriate and led to erroneous conclusions. Rind et al. replied that Spiegel misrepresented their analysis, since they did not use Landis' study in the meta-analysis of childhood sexual abuse – symptom correlations, but only for examining the self-reported effects of CSA. They contend that the way they handled Landis' data maximized negative reports and minimized the possible deflating effect of Landis' data on the overall effect sizes.

The last two studies, according to Dallam et al., were inappropriate because they included respondents who were over the age of 17 when the CSA occurred. Persons 18 years old or older are above the legal age of consent in all states of the USA, and thus are not "children" even in the loosest definition of the term. Rind et al. responded to Dallam et al. by saying that, in the effect-size calculations of the Sarbo and Greenwald studies (i.e., the calculations that show the alleged harmfulness of CSA), they had included only respondents aged 16 and 15 and under, respectively, at the time of the CSA and all CSA incidents included in Sarbo's and Greenwald's original analysis occurred before the age of 17.

Measured variables
Spiegel criticized that Rind et al. included a long list of measured variables in order to appear comprehensive, but remarkably omitted posttraumatic stress disorder - "the most salient symptom" - from their analysis. Rind et al. replied that including PTSD was impossible due to the fact that the original studies did not examine it. Furthermore, they cited Kendall-Tackett et al. to illustrate the lack of a common pattern of symptoms in children who have been abused.

Consent
David Spiegel also argued that Rind et al.'s suggestion of relabeling some forms of sexual encounters between adults and children/adolescents as adult-child (or adult-adolescent) sex is fundamentally flawed, because children cannot give meaningful consent to sexual relations with an adult. Some critics also argued that using value-neutral terminology would normalize CSA and that redefining terminology is not in the interest of the general public because it confuses the underlying moral issues. Rind et al. replied that the construct of consent used in their study was misinterpreted by critics; they only asserted that children/adolescents are capable of simple consent (willingness) as opposed to informed consent used in legal contexts, and used this as a variable in their study simply because it was used in the original studies - where it had predictive validity. Thus, they conclude that although the construct of willingness might be morally unacceptable, it is a scientifically valid term. A similar argument was put forward by Oellerich, who stated that considering all adult/non-adult sexual behavior as abusive and lacking consent can lead to bias in scientific research in the area, and that recognizing this distinction does not necessarily lead to considering adult/non-adult sexual interactions as morally permissible.

Statistical errors
Dallam et al. also contend that Rind et al. miscoded or misreported significant amounts of the underlying study data, thereby skewing the results. Dallam et al. contend that Rind et al. incorrectly used "Pearson's r" instead of "Cohen's d" to calculate the effect size, which resulted in a failure to correct for base-rate differences of CSA in male and female samples, and which led to the finding that males were less harmed by CSA. After correcting for base-rate attenuation, Dallam et al. said they arrived at identical effect sizes for male and female samples.

In response to this criticism, Rind et al. contend that they did indeed describe the contrast between the effect size estimates as "nonsignificant, z = 1.42, p > .10, two-tailed". However, they argue, "What [they] did report as significantly different was the contrast between male and female effect size estimates for the all-types-of-consent groups, where rus = .04 and .11, respectively. In "follow[ing] Dallam et al. (2001) [by] apply[ing] Becker's correction formula to these values, they become rcs = .06 and .12 for men and women, respectively. The contrast is still statistically significant (z = 2.68, p < .01. two-tailed), contrary to Dallam et al.'s (2001) claim".

Rind et al. said that their own "handling of Pearson's r in the face of base-rate differences was methodologically proper and produced no important bias, if any at all." Furthermore, they contend that Dallam's criticisms "exhibited bias ... [by] selectively ignoring key clarifying quotes ... and citing them elsewhere in their critique to argue different points, and [by] ignoring or overlooking a key caveat by Becker (1986) regarding appropriate use of his correction formula".

Critics also argued that Rind et al.'s statistical approach for controlling for family environment as a cause of maladjustment was conceptually and methodologically invalid. Spiegel stated that inferring the source of maladjustment from analyzing the shared variance between CSA and family environment does not answer the question of which variable explains maladjustment better; the authors answered that this statement shows a misunderstanding of the statistical procedure used their meta-analysis. Dallam, however, addressed the topic of several prior studies having found statistically significant relations between CSA and maladjustment even after controlling for family environment.

Conceptual issues
Rind et al.'s model of "assumed properties of child sexual abuse," (that is, of universal and pervasive harm in all victims of CSA) has been criticized as a straw man assertion in that it is both simplistic and misleading. The reactions of victims in their adult lives have been found to be extremely varied, ranging from severe to nearly unnoticeable, and many pathologies are not diagnosable in the strictly clinical sense Rind uses. Victims often have a flawed or distorted appraisal of their abuse, minimize the impact as adults often do with traumatic events, and fail to connect distressing and sometimes debilitating pathologies with their experiences. Further, these studies make no accounting for emotional support of the victim's family, clinical treatment of the victim prior to the study, or personal resiliency, which can easily account for less severe outcomes.

Possible bias
Rind, Bauserman and Tromovitch stated that research findings can be skewed by an investigator's personal biases, and in Rind et al. claimed that "[r]eviewers who are convinced that CSA is a major cause of adult psychopathology may fall prey to confirmation bias by noting and describing study findings indicating harmful effects but ignoring or paying less attention to findings indicating nonnegative outcomes". They defended their deliberate choice of non-legal and non-clinical samples, accordingly avoiding individuals who received psychological treatment or were engaged in legal proceedings as a way of correcting this bias through the use of a sample of college students.

Dallam and Anna Salter have stated that Rind and Bauserman have associated with age of consent reform organizations in the past. In the years before the paper was written, both Rind and Bauserman had published articles in Paidika: The Journal of Paedophilia, a journal which was dedicated to "[demonstrating] that pedophilia has been, and remains, a legitimate and productive part of the totality of human experience". In addition, Dallam and Salter stated that Rind and Bauserman were keynote speakers at a pedophile advocacy conference occurring in the Netherlands.

Citation outside of scholarly discussions
Despite the authors' comments that the findings of the paper "do not imply that moral or legal definitions of or views on behaviors currently classified as CSA" should be changed, the study caught the attention of, and was used by, advocates for pedophilia. It has been used to argue that the age of consent should be lowered.

Social psychologist Carol Tavris noted several groups who reacted negatively to the study. The anti-homosexuality group National Association for Research & Therapy of Homosexuality (NARTH), who "[endorse] the long-discredited psychoanalytic notion that homosexuality is a mental disorder and that it is a result of seduction in childhood by an adult", objected to the study's implications that boys who are sexually abused are not traumatized for life and do not become homosexuals as a result. Therapists who supported the existence of recovered memories and recovered-memory therapy, as well as those who attributed mental illnesses such as dissociative identity disorder, depression and eating disorders to repressed memories of sexual abuse also rejected the study. Tavris attributed this rejection to the fear of malpractice lawsuits. Tavris expressed her belief that the study could have been interpreted positively as an example of psychological resilience in the face of adversity, and noted that CSA causing little or no harm in some individuals is not an endorsement of the act, nor does it make it any less illegal.

Subsequent research and legacy
Numerous research studies as well as expert opinion in the field of psychology, both before and after Rind et al's publications, have long supported the stance that children cannot consent to sexual activity and that child and adolescent sexual abuse cause harm. The then-American Psychological Association CEO Raymond D. Fowler succinctly reiterated the prevailing view in a 1999 letter to Congressman Delay "that children cannot consent to sexual activity with adults," and "sexual activity between children and adults should never be considered or labeled as harmless or acceptable".

A study by Heather Ulrich and two colleagues published in The Scientific Review of Mental Health Practice attempted to replicate the Rind study, correcting for methodological and statistical problems identified by Dallam and others. It supported some of the Rind findings, both with respect to the percentage of variance in later psychological outcome accounted for by sexual abuse and in relation to the finding that there was a gender difference in the experience of child sexual abuse, such that females reported more negative effects. It, however, acknowledged the limitations of the findings (college student sample, self-report data), and did not endorse Rind's recommendation to abandon the use of the term child sexual abuse in cases of apparent consent in favor of the term adult-child sex. In their conclusion, the authors address the objection that Rind's work and their own would give support to those who deny that child sexual abuse can cause harm: "The authors of the current research would hesitate to support such a general statement. Instead, our results, and the results of the Rind et al. meta-analysis, can be interpreted as providing a hopeful and positive message to therapists, parents, and children. Child sexual abuse does not necessarily lead to long-term harm."

There has been greater emphasis in subsequent work on the range of responses that are possible from victims. For example, a few studies make reference to the paper's findings about "consensual" encounters, but approach it from the opposite direction (i.e., that the use of force causes more intense negative outcomes). Heather Ulrich, author of the aforementioned replication of the meta-analysis, later drew on the findings to study the reasons for the variability in outcomes of CSA victims, such as attributional style (individual's causal explanations for why the abuse occurred), family environment, and social support.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Rind et al. controversy


text:
Talk:Once (Nightwish album)

Untitled
um, who made this album? Gentgeen 03:15, 20 May 2004 (UTC)

Cleanup
Someone had added a cleanup template to the track listing section, which i removed. If you really want it to be there, please explain what should be cleaned up. bbx 13:09, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

OK, first - there's no reason for "4 million copies" to be bolded, it's completely unprofessional. Second - the source cited says over 1 million copies, not 4 million. I'm changing it back to 1 million, feel free to go back if you can find a source to support the claim of 4 million copies sold. --Random person, 30 August 2008 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.162.86.47 (talk) 07:04, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

statue on the cover??
hey, that statue of an angel on the cover, i think it exists somewhere.. does anybody know where it is?? -- PASSIVE (Talk|E-Mail) 17:41, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Coincidentally, I just ran into a picture of it on the web. Do a search for Nightwish on flickr.com and you'll see it passing by. —♦♦ SʘʘTHING  (Я)  17:45, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Its Called "Angel of grief" and was orginal made in 1894 original by William Wetmore Story. But there is also one at Stanford university, which was made in the eraly 1900, and is as I understand much bigger. 22 August 2006 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eyelessfade (talk • contribs) 00:58, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

 * Interestingly it also appears on the cover of Evanescence EP from 1998. —Ben FrantzDale 01:51, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Album Numerology
It says on the page that 'Once' is the sixth album from Nightwish; isn't it the fifth? The previous album 'Century Child' is marked as the fourth, and 'Once' comes right after, making it fifth.

The only reason 'Once' would be marked as the sixth album is if you count the EP 'Over the hills and far away' as being an album, but you shouldn't do that: Full-length studio albums are albums. EPs are regurgitations*.

 * There's only five Nightwish albums, but there's 21 if you count all the remixed material. But you shouldn't do that. JimmmyThePiep 03:33, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

For the purpose of an enciclopedia EPs shouldn't be conidered LPs, but for common sense if the material is not featured in the other studio non-compilation LPs are studio albums as the LPs. It's plain stupid to not consider them part of a discography — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.232.236.152 (talk) 09:52, 29 December 2018 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Nightwish - Nemo.ogg
Image:Nightwish - Nemo.ogg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 00:49, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

"The Falador Massacre"
This particular section needs to be either heavily edited or completely deleted. It does not contribute anything meaningful to the article, is confusing, lacks clarity and relevance, and fails to display rationale behind its statements. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Felojiro (talk • contribs) 20:21, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

DVD-Audio version
I see that there is no mention of the DVD-Audio version of Once. It would be helpful to list any mastering differences, bonus videos, bonus songs, and/or the differences in bit-rates and quality. I do not own the DVDA so I do not feel qualified to talk about it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.28.228.112 (talk) 05:38, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

Links
I hate the circular references, if you click e.g. Higher than Hope or Ghost Love Score, you'll just end up back here! --84.249.164.59 (talk) 02:54, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Romanticide live
I have removed this sentence: ("Romanticide" was only performed with Anette Olzon on vocals in 2008).

Romanticide premiered live in 2009, at Brixton Academy in London. It featured Marco and Anette on vocals. If someone wants to put a corrected sentence to this effect back into the article, feel free. However I don't think it's worth it as that part of the article is detailing songs that HAVE NOT been played live. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.7.166.104 (talk) 23:10, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Once (Nightwish album). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110510083043/http://www.ifpi.no/sok/index_trofe.htm to http://www.ifpi.no/sok/lst_trofeer_sok.asp?type=artist
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110511092844/http://www.ifpi.at/?section=goldplatin to http://www.ifpi.at/?section=goldplatin

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 22:43, 20 May 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Once (Nightwish album). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081223081854/http://www.hs.fi/english/article/Nightwish+release+Finlands+costliest-ever+album+/1135230577662 to http://www.hs.fi/english/article/Nightwish+release+Finlands+costliest-ever+album+/1135230577662
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20151006123952/http://www.dark-domain.co.uk/2013/01/john-two-hawks-denies-allegations-that.html to http://www.dark-domain.co.uk/2013/01/john-two-hawks-denies-allegations-that.html
 * Added tag to http://www.roadrunnerrecords.com/blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=37653

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 02:56, 15 December 2017 (UTC)

Please delete
This page be speedy deleted as an attack or a negative unsourced biography of a living person, because a significant portion of the article is a personal and unsourced attack on an eminent, Grammy-Nominated Native American artist, John Two-Hawks. This issue has been flagged and no action taken. --37.228.255.242 (talk) 17:58, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I agree that the section in question was unreliably sourced, but that is reason to remove that section, which you could have done, and indeed are encouraged to do, yourself, rather than to delete the whole article. If you see such things in articles then please don't be frightened to edit them out yourself. There's no need to ask for anyone's permission, and if you make a mistake in good faith then someone will come along and fix it. Phil Bridger (talk) 19:02, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Once (Nightwish album)


text:
Penobscot (disambiguation)

The Penobscot are an indigenous ethnic group of North America.

Penobscot may also refer to:

Places

 * Penobscot, Maine
 * Fort Pentagouet (or Fort Castine or Fort Penobscot or Fort Saint-Pierre), Castine, Maine
 * Penobscot Bay, Maine
 * Penobscot County, Maine
 * Penobscot Indian Island Reservation, Penobscot County, Maine
 * Penobscot Knob, Pennsylvania
 * Penobscot Narrows Bridge and Observatory, Maine
 * Penobscot River, Maine

Buildings

 * Penobscot Block, Detroit, Michigan
 * Penobscot Building, Detroit, Michigan
 * Penobscot Building Annex (or Penobscot Annex), Detroit, Michigan
 * The Penobscot Building, Detroit, Michigan

Ships
(Chronological order)
 * USS Penobscot (1861), a gunboat launched 19 November 1861
 * USS Penobscot (SP-982), a tug placed in service 29 August 1917
 * USS Penobscot (ATA-188), a tug launched 11 September 1944

Other uses

 * Penobscot Expedition, a failed attempt by American rebels to seize Penobscot, Maine from the British during the American Revolutionary War
 * Donald Penobscott, the character Major Margaret "Hot Lips" Houlihan's husband on the TV show M*A*S*H

title: Penobscot (disambiguation)


text:
ARA

ARA may refer to:

Media and the arts

 * American-Romanian Academy of Arts and Sciences
 * Artistička Radna Akcija, compilation album released in former Yugoslavia
 * Associate of the Royal Academy, denoting membership in the British Royal Academy of Arts
 * ARA News, an online Arabic and English language news service focussed on Syrian and Kurdish events

Organisations

 * Academic Research Alliance, an organization created to involve students in scientific activities
 * Alliance for Retired Americans, a senior citizen organization
 * American Relief Administration, a relief mission after World War I
 * Amateur Rowing Association, the governing body of rowing in the United Kingdom, now renamed British Rowing
 * Amateurs Radio Algeriens, the national amateur radio organization of Algeria
 * American Radio Association, a national AFL-CIO affiliated labor union representing U.S. Flag Merchant Marine Licensed Communications and Electronics Officers
 * American Railway Association, precursor to the Association of American Railroads
 * American Rally Association, governing body of rallying and championship in the United States
 * Anti-Racist Action, a network of anti-racist activists
 * Anti-Racist Alliance, a defunct anti-racist organisation in the United Kingdom
 * Applied Research Associates, a research and engineering company
 * Arab Rescue Army, a volunteer army during the 1948 Palestine war
 * Arcade and Attica Railroad, from its reporting mark
 * Archives and Records Association, professional body for UK and Irish archivists, archive conservators and records managers
 * Assets Recovery Agency, a British agency for the recovery of the proceeds of crime
 * Athénée Royal d'Auderghem, a school in Brussels, Belgium
 * Australasian Raptor Association, a special interest group of the Royal Australasian Ornithologists Union

Military

 * Aerial Rocket Artillery, helicopter artillery units used by the U.S. Army in the Vietnam War mainly to engage ground targets
 * Armada de la República Argentina, the Argentine Navy (Argentine Navy ships use ARA as a name prefix, just as the US Navy uses USS)
 * Armenian Revolutionary Army, an armed militant group
 * Aryan Republican Army, white nationalist criminal group
 * Australian Regular Army

Government

 * Auckland Regional Authority, a former local government council in New Zealand

Sciences

 * Angiotensin II receptor antagonist, more often called angiotensin receptor blocker (ARB)
 * Aldosterone receptor antagonist (mineralocorticoid receptor antagonist, that is, antimineralocorticoid)
 * Ant-based Routing Algorithm, a wireless mesh network routing protocol; see Swarm intelligence
 * AppleTalk Remote Access, a communications protocol
 * Audio Random Access, an extension to audio plug-in interfaces
 * Arachidonic acid (also AA), as found in breast milk and infant formula
 * The Arrow-Pratt measure of absolute risk aversion
 * Askaryan Radio Array (ARA), a GZK neutrino detector based on the Askaryan effect and will be positioned in the Antarctic ice sheet

Computer science

 * Application release automation

People

 * Amedeo Rocco Armentano (1886–1966), Italian esotericist and musician

title: ARA


text:
Stolypin (disambiguation)

Stolypin may refer to:

 * Pyotr Stolypin (1862–1911), Prime Minister of Russian, leader of the third Duma (1906–1911)
 * Stolypin reform, a series of changes to Imperial Russia's agricultural sector instituted during the leadership of Pyotr Stolypin
 * Stolypin's necktie redirects to Pyotr Stolypin
 * Stolypin car, a type of railroad carriage in the Russian Empire and Soviet Union

title: Stolypin (disambiguation)


text:
Talk:Zogam

Untitled
The first para was removed as I found it on this page. . I am not certain as to rest of it. It does not appear to be a copy vio. Burgundavia 03:20, May 20, 2004 (UTC)

Requested Citations
This article is lack of citation about the original birth of 'Zomi'. I believe, in international level 'Chin' is accepted as their national name. Perhaps it should give more references.

Wikipedia about "Chin"
It's an article about the ethnic group normally referred to as "Chin". Maybe the point is that if Burma can call itself Myanmar then the Chins can call themselves "Zomi". I do know there seem to be several different Kachin ethic groups alone, many of whom like to refer to themselves by their local name, not Kachin.

The articles should have citations though and there seems to be a lot of duplication.

In the past I knew a lot of Chin people and some of the basic things newcomers will want to be familiar with it the distinction between Haka and Falam and where the major city is, Kalei I believe, and the border towns with Assam. Adding the photos from your internet site would be great and people would also be interested in regional dress differences. I know different areas have different affiliations with churches in the United States. This might be interesting for some people also.

Regarding factual verification, this is relevant:

"...I began forming the Tedim, Falam and Haka Associations during 1952. Then in order to constitute an overall organization, I asked the three Associations to select ten leaders each from the three Associations to form a Constitution Drafting Committee....Then I proposed that we should take ZOMI as our name as this is our correct historical name. And we should call our organization ZOMI BAPTIST CONVENTION." http://www.zogam.org/documents.asp

(Jonfernquest 11:07, 30 August 2006 (UTC))

Copyright problem removed
One or more portions of this article duplicated other source(s). The material was copied from: http://www.zogam.org/history.asp?article=history_111. Infringing material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a license compatible with GFDL. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.) For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use external websites as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 14:46, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Request
Please do not make changes to this page if you cannot provide any authentic reference. Please always try to give an unbiased input.Lyanaz (talk) 20:11, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Thoughtful considerations needed
The word Zogam is inferred by peoples of Tedim and Tonzang townships to denote the current official Chin State or "Chinland in the British colonial time". The township peoples from Tedim (Tiddim) and Tozang usually identify themselves in their local term as Zomi (Zo peoples) and Zogam (Zo country or land) which hardly exists in official terminology and extensively needs further verification of its validity. The intention of the article seems to envisage a geographically consolidated presentation of both Mizoram and Chin State which lie in different countries which share a common ethnicity. Either Chin State is called Chinland in colonial time. The fact that it still stands as an acceptable article is just interesting. I think further thoughts on this article is needed.

I put some sources about Chinland

1. A BRIEF HISTORICAL SKETCH OF CHINLAND

2. Chinland Constitution Draft (published by Chin Forum)

3. Chin-Lushai Country (Book about Chin-Lushai land before it split into two)

4. [https://market.android.com/details?id=book-6spNAAAAMAAJ&feature=similar_books#?t=W251bGwsMSwyLDEwOCwiYm9vay02c3BOQUFBQU1BQUoiXQ.. The Chin Hills (Book on Chin Hills in British colonial time)]

5. Mantles of Merit (Book on Chin textiles)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 one external links on Zogam. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added tag to http://www.tongdotcom
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20091213151511/http://www1.atwiki.com:80/zolai to http://www1.atwiki.com/zolai
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20081215170312/http://siamsin.org:80/ to http://www.siamsin.org

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at ).

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 23:22, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

To add to article
Basic information to add to the opening paragraph of this article: in which country or countries this territory is located. It's ridiculous that this information is not included in the text of the current version of this article. 173.88.246.138 (talk) 22:26, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

You forgot this page
@Kautilya3 Flyingphoenixchips (talk) 19:23, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

 * This is not a great page either. But, if you check, you will find rather more sources discussing Zogam than for the other topics that you have made pages for. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 22:09, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
 * I have listed journal articles for the Swadhin Axom Page. Let me explain how to perform rudimentary searches. Go to jstor.org- its an unbiased website containing academic articles, its not biased for your information. Google searches should not be relied on. Go to search. Enclosing several terms in quote marks will help you find a certain phrase. Do it for the page. For more focused search results, you can also utilize Boolean operators like AND, OR, or NOT. Multiple search phrases entered without an operator will be combined together using AND. Let me know! If you need any help from now on, finding sources. Hit me up, always happy to train young people. Flyingphoenixchips (talk) 22:22, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Won't you be deleting this page, since it goes against the POV as well Flyingphoenixchips (talk) 22:22, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Udayon Misra. “Sub-National Challenges to Indian State: An Assamese Perspective.” Economic and Political Weekly, vol. 35, no. 20, 2000, pp. 1727–30. JSTOR, http://www.jstor.org/stable/4409292 . Accessed 21 June 2024.
 * The above is definitely a biased POV source Flyingphoenixchips (talk) 22:32, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Zogam


text:
Vince Vaughn

Vincent Anthony Vaughn (born March 28, 1970) is an American actor. He began acting in the late 1980s, appearing in minor television roles before attaining wider recognition with the 1996 comedy Swingers. Vaughn then appeared in the sci-fi action movie The Lost World: Jurassic Park (1997), the dramas The Locusts (1997) and Return to Paradise (1998), the Western South of Heaven, West of Hell (2000), and the thriller Domestic Disturbance (2001). He starred as Frank Semyon in the second season of the HBO anthology crime drama television series True Detective (2015).

Vaughn's comedy films include Old School (2003), Dodgeball (2004), Wedding Crashers (2005), The Break-Up (2006), Fred Claus (2007), Four Christmases (2008), Couples Retreat (2009), The Dilemma (2011), The Watch (2012), The Internship (2013), Delivery Man (2013), and Unfinished Business (2015). He returned to serious genres with roles in Hacksaw Ridge (2016), Brawl in Cell Block 99 (2017), and Dragged Across Concrete (2018).

Early life
Vaughn was born in Minneapolis, Minnesota. His mother, Sharon Eileen (née DePalmo), is a real estate agent and stockbroker who was once ranked as one of the United States' top money managers by Bloomberg Wealth Manager magazine. His father, Vernon Lindsay Vaughn, worked as a salesman for a toy company. As a child, he was raised both Protestant and Catholic by his Catholic mother and Protestant father. He has Italian, Irish, English, Lebanese, and German ancestry.

Vaughn grew up in Buffalo Grove, Illinois, where he played football and baseball and wrestled, although he has called himself "unathletic" and "very average" at high school sports. He then moved to Lake Forest, where he graduated from Lake Forest High School in 1988. He was introduced to musical theater at a young age and decided to become an actor in 1987. He has credited his mother as the inspiration for his career, saying, "I saw her overcome stuff, and I thought if you worked hard at something you'd give yourself a chance".

Career
In 1988, Vaughn was cast in a Chevrolet commercial and subsequently moved to Hollywood. He appeared in the 1989 season of the television series China Beach and in three CBS Schoolbreak Specials in 1990. His first film role was 1993's Rudy as Notre Dame football tailback Jamie O'Hara. He struck up a friendship with Jon Favreau, who was also a first-time actor. Two years later, he was cast in a lead role in a proposed revival of 77 Sunset Strip that was to air on the fledgling WB Television Network, but the project ceased development after initial testing. Vaughn did not gain wider success until his role in 1996's Swingers with Favreau.

Afterward, Steven Spielberg cast Vaughn in the 1997 blockbuster The Lost World: Jurassic Park, which gave him increased exposure. He followed that up with the lead role in The Locusts the same year. In 1998, he starred in the critically acclaimed drama Return to Paradise with Anne Heche, and starred in Clay Pigeons with Janeane Garofalo and Joaquin Phoenix. In 2000, he starred in The Cell with Jennifer Lopez and in 2001, appeared in Made, another film penned by Favreau. Vaughn also appeared in Dwight Yoakam's directorial debut, South of Heaven, West of Hell (2000). He also starred with John Travolta in the thriller Domestic Disturbance (2001). Vaughn's performance in the 2003 comedy Old School increased his popularity.

In 2004, Vaughn appeared alongside Ben Stiller in the hit films Starsky & Hutch and Dodgeball. After this series of roles, he was dubbed one of the Hollywood "Frat Pack", a group of actors who frequently co-star in film comedies. He appeared in 2005's Thumbsucker, Be Cool, and Mr. & Mrs. Smith. Also in 2005, Vaughn starred alongside Owen Wilson in Wedding Crashers, which grossed over $200 million at the U.S. box office. In 2006, Vaughn starred with Jennifer Aniston in the comedy drama The Break-Up.

In 2007, Vaughn starred in Fred Claus as a sarcastic, wild-at-heart older brother of Santa Claus (Paul Giamatti). The film was directed by David Dobkin, who had directed Vaughn in Wedding Crashers, and co-starred Elizabeth Banks and Kevin Spacey. Next, he moved from comedy to drama in Sean Penn's Into the Wild, a film about the adventures of Christopher McCandless, based on the best-selling book by Jon Krakauer.

In 2008, Vaughn starred in his second Christmas comedy, Four Christmases, with Reese Witherspoon. The film portrays a couple who struggle to visit all four of their divorced parents on Christmas. In 2009, he starred in Couples Retreat, a comedy chronicling four couples who undergo therapy sessions at a tropical island resort. Malin Åkerman played his wife. Vince's father, Vernon, portrayed his father in the film. In February 2010, Vaughn was among the nearly 80 musicians and actors to sing the charity-single remake of We Are the World.

Vaughn starred in Ron Howard's comedy The Dilemma, released in January 2011. It was produced by Wild West Picture Show Productions, his production company. On July 31, 2012, it was announced that Vaughn would be developing a reboot produced by CBS to the sitcom The Brady Bunch, which was taken off the air in 1974.

In 2013, Vaughn co-wrote and starred alongside Owen Wilson in The Internship. In 2015, he starred in Unfinished Business, which grossed $4.8 million in its opening weekend, a career low for Vaughn. He also starred in the second season of True Detective alongside Colin Farrell, which premiered on June 21. In 2016, he starred in the crime thriller Term Life, which featured Favreau in a supporting role and was directed by Peter Billingsley. Also in 2016, he played a drill sergeant in the war film Hacksaw Ridge.

In 2018, Vaughn co-starred alongside Mel Gibson in Dragged Across Concrete, his second collaboration with S. Craig Zahler, whom he worked with the year before on Brawl in Cell Block 99. In 2020, he starred with Kathryn Newton in the horror-comedy film Freaky, in which they play a serial killer and a teenage girl who switch bodies.

On January 20, 2022, it was announced that Vaughn will produce a sequel to the 1983 film A Christmas Story titled A Christmas Story Christmas with Peter Billingsley (who will reprise his role as Ralphie) through his production company Wild West Picture Show Productions for Warner Bros. Pictures and HBO Max.

In March 2022, Vaughn, Greg Olsen, and Ryan Kalil launched a podcast network and production company named Audiorama. The first podcast available from the network, "Youth, Inc.", focuses on youth sports.

Personal life

In 2005, Vaughn began dating Jennifer Aniston, his co-star in The Break-Up. In late 2006, Vaughn sued three tabloid magazines for reporting that he had been unfaithful to Aniston. They broke up in November 2006.

In March 2009, it was announced that Vaughn was engaged to Canadian realtor Kyla Weber. They married on January 2, 2010, in the Armour House at Lake Forest Academy in Lake Forest, Illinois. They have two children, born in 2010 and 2013.

Vaughn describes himself as a libertarian. He supported Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul in both the 2008 and 2012 elections, and Rand Paul in the 2016 election. In June 2015, Vaughn expressed his opposition to gun control.

In 2016, Vaughn began training in Brazilian jiu-jitsu at the Gracie Academy in Torrance, California. He received his blue belt in 2018.

On June 10, 2018, Vaughn was arrested on suspicion of drunken driving and resisting arrest in Manhattan Beach, California, after failing a sobriety test at a police checkpoint. In May 2019, Vaughn was convicted of a reduced charge of reckless driving after he entered a no contest plea. He was sentenced to three years' probation and ordered to undergo a three-month alcohol abuse program.

title: Vince Vaughn


text:
United States congressional delegations from Delaware

Delaware became a U.S. state in 1787, which allowed it to send congressional delegations to the United States Senate and United States House of Representatives beginning with the 1st United States Congress in 1789. Voters in each state elect two senators to serve for six years, and members of the House to two-year terms. Before 1914 United States Senators were chosen by the Delaware General Assembly and before 1935 all congressional terms began March 4.

This is a chronological listing, in timeline format, of the congressional delegations from Delaware to the United States Senate and United States House of Representatives.

The dates for the various Congress represent the range of dates they could have been in session, rather than the actual dates of the sessions. Congressional terms began on March 4 through 1933. Since 1935 they have begun on January 3. The juxtaposition of the terms with the sessions is approximate; see the footnotes for actual dates of special appointments, elections, resignations or deaths.

Current delegation
Delaware's current congressional delegation in the consists of its two senators and its sole representative, all of whom are Democrats.

The current dean of the Delaware's delegation is Senator Tom Carper, having served in the Senate since 2001, and previously served in the House from 1983 until 1993.

United States Senate
The alternating grey and white boxes indicate the duration of the six-year Senate terms.

United States House of Representatives
In Delaware all representatives have been elected statewide at-large, rather than by district. Delaware has always had one seat apportioned to it, except for the 13th through 17th Congresses (1813–1823), when it was apportioned two seats per 1810 census.


text:
Lob

Lob may refer to:

Sports

 * Lob (pickleball)
 * Lob (tennis)
 * Lob (association football), a lofted pass or shot in association football
 * Lob bowling, an archaic bowling style in cricket

People

 * Lob Brown, American college football player
 * Löb Nevakhovich (between 1776 and 1778–1831), Russian writer
 * Löb Strauß, birth name of Levi Strauss (1829–1902), German-born American businessman
 * Eliezer Löb (1837–1892), German rabbi
 * Jacques Lob (1932–1990), French comic book creator
 * Leopold Löb, birth name of Leopold Einstein (1833–1890), German esperantist
 * Martin Löb (1921–2006), German mathematician

Other uses

 * Lob (haircut)
 * Lob bomb, a rocket-fired improvised explosive device
 * Lobi language (ISO 639-3: lob), a Gur language of western Africa
 * Lob, in folklore, a type of brownie
 * Lob, a poem by Edward Thomas

title: Lob


text:
Hasinai

The Hasinai Confederacy (Caddo: Hasíinay ) was a large confederation of Caddo-speaking Native Americans who occupied territory between the Sabine and Trinity rivers in eastern Texas. Today, their descendants are enrolled in the Caddo Nation of Oklahoma and the Natchitoches Tribe of Louisiana.

Name
The name Hasinai means "our own people" in Caddoan. The Spanish knew the Hasinai as the Tejas or Texas, from a form of greeting meaning "friend", which gave the state of Texas its name.

Variants of Hasinai include: Hasini, Asenai, Asinai, Assoni, Asenay, Cenis, Senis, Sannaye, Asinaiz, Asinayes, Assinais, Azinais, Azinays.

Government
When the Spanish and the French encountered the Hasinai in the 1680s, they were a centrally organized chiefdom under the control of a religious leader, known as the Grand Xinesi. He lived in a secluded house and met with a council of elders.

The chieftainship consisted of several subdivisions, which have been designated "cantonments". Each was under the control of a Caddi. There were also men designated as Canahas and Chayas, who helped the Caddi run the system.

History
During the 17th century, the Hasinai traded with the Jumano at the western Hasinai city of Nabedache. Some consider the residents of Nabedache to have been a distinct people designated by that name.

Historic populations
It is estimated that in 1520, the people who would become the Hasinai, the Kadohadacho and the Natchitoches, numbered about 250,000. Over the next 250 years, the population of these Caddoan-speaking peoples was severely reduced by epidemics of endemic diseases carried by Spanish and French colonists and spread through indigenous trading networks. Native Americans had no acquired immunity to the new diseases, and suffered high mortality.

In 1690, the Hasinai numbered in the vicinity of 10,000 people or a little more. By 1720, as a result of infectious diseases such as smallpox, the Hasinai population had fallen to 2,000.

Closely related peoples

 * Arikara
 * Chitimacha
 * Kadohadacho
 * Natchitoches
 * Pawnee
 * Tula

title: Hasinai


text:
The Stars and Stripes Forever

"The Stars and Stripes Forever" is a patriotic American march written and composed by John Philip Sousa in 1896. By a 1987 act of the U.S. Congress, it is the official National March of the United States of America.

History
In his 1928 autobiography, Marching Along, Sousa wrote that he composed the march on Christmas Day, 1896. Sousa was on board an ocean liner on his way home from a vacation with his wife in Europe and had just learned of the recent death of David Blakely, the manager of the Sousa Band. He composed the march in his head and committed the notes to paper on arrival in the United States. It was first performed at the Philadelphia Academy of Music on May 14, 1897, and was immediately greeted with enthusiasm. Following an Act of Congress in 1987, it was officially adopted as the national march of the United States of America.

Historically, in show business and particularly in theater and the circus, this piece is called "the Disaster March". In the early 20th century, when it was common for theaters and circuses to have house bands, this march was a traditional code signaling a life-threatening emergency. It subtly notified personnel of emergency situations and ideally allowed them to organize the audience's exit without causing the chaos and panic that an overt declaration might. Except for impending disaster, circus bands never played the tune under any circumstances. One memorable example of its use was during the Hartford circus fire of July 6, 1944. At least 168 people were killed, though some estimates are much higher.

Music
"The Stars and Stripes Forever" follows the standard U.S. military march form—of repeated phrasing of different melodies performed in sections called strains: a Sousa legacy. Performances vary according to the arrangements of individual band directors or orchestrators, especially regarding tempo and the number and sequence of strains employed.

Analysis
The march begins with a four-bar introduction, following with the first strain, which is repeated; then the second strain, which is also repeated; and sometimes both are repeated again if (the band is) marching in parade (or the breakstrain may be interjected and repeated). Now follows the dominant woodwinds in the first run of the famous Trio strain—familiar to many for the nonsense lyrics: "Be kind to your web-footed friends..."—which repeats, and later repeats again as the piccolos obligato. (Here, in some performances, Sousa's patriotic lyrics may be sung in a choral overlay.) Then follows the breakstrain, the final strain, and the breakstrain repeated. The final repeats of the Trio (the Grandioso) render the famous obligato of the piccolo players—joined to a subdued but prominent countermelody by the brass section, then bringing everything to a close with once-more repeats of the grand finale.

Sousa explained to the press that the three themes of the final trio were intended to represent the three regions of the United States. The broad melody, or main theme, portrays the North. The South is represented by the famous piccolo obligato, and the West by the bold countermelody of the trombones. The three come together in the climax, representing the Union itself.

Instrumentation
The march is written for a standard full American concert band. On the page for The Stars and Stripes Forever on the official United States Marine Band website, under The Complete Marches of John Philip Sousa, additional parts are written in at the bottom of the downloadable score. These parts are from Sousa's Encore Book, and are handwritten for "Drums & Bells" and harp.

Sousa's lyrics
Sousa wrote the lyrics to the piece, although they are not as familiar as the music itself. A typical pairing of Sousa's lyrics with various sections of the march—here the First strain and the Grandioso strain—is noted in the colored bars.

First strain Let martial note in triumph float And liberty extend its mighty hand A flag appears 'mid thunderous cheers, The banner of the Western land. The emblem of the brave and true Its folds protect no tyrant crew; The red and white and starry blue Is freedom's shield and hope.

Let eagle shriek from lofty peak The never-ending watchword of our land; Let summer breeze waft through the trees The echo of the chorus grand. Sing out for liberty and light, Sing out for freedom and the right. Sing out for Union and its might, O patriotic sons.

Second strain 𝄆 Other nations may deem their flags the best And cheer them with fervid elation But the flag of the North and South and West Is the flag of flags, the flag of Freedom's nation. 𝄇

Trio Hurrah for the flag of the free! May it wave as our standard forever, The gem of the land and the sea, The banner of the right. Let tyrants remember the day When our fathers with mighty endeavor Proclaimed as they marched to the fray That by their might and by their right It waves forever.

Grandioso Hurrah for the flag of the free. May it wave as our standard forever The gem of the land and the sea, The banner of the right. Let tyrants remember the day When our fathers with mighty endeavor Proclaimed as they marched to the fray, That by their might and by their right It waves forever.

Tidmarsh's additional lyrics
In 1942 the John Church Company published a four-part choral version of the march with a piano arrangement by Elmer Arthur Tidmarsh. This arrangement has additional lyrics written by Tidmarsh for the Breakstrain section of the march.

Parody lyrics
There is a parody of the lyrics to "The Stars and Stripes Forever" that begins "Be kind to your web-footed friends". Its exact origin is unclear, but versions of it were being quoted as early as the 1930s on college campuses, and during the 1940s, where it was sung for entertainment by soldiers at the USO. Some newspapers of that time referred to it as the "Duck Song." In 1954, Charles Grean and Joan Javits composed "Crazy Mixed Up Song", using these lyrics along with the march's theme. It was made somewhat popular by Peter Lind Hayes & Mary Healy in that year. In the early 1960s, it reached a wider audience as a part of Mitch Miller's nationally syndicated sing-along show, Sing Along with Mitch. This version has perhaps the best known lyrics, which were used to end every show: Be kind to your web-footed friends, For a duck may be somebody's mother. Be kind to your friends in the swamp, Where the weather is very, very damp, Now, you may think that this is the end, Well, it is!

The last two lines were later used for the theme song of the 1985 television series The Berenstain Bears, but with the lyrics changed to: You may think that this starts our show, Well, it does!

Later versions of "Be kind to your web-footed friends" extended the lyrics of the second verse. One popular version goes like this:

Be kind to your web-footed friends For that duck may be somebody's mother, She lives in a nest in a swamp Where the weather is always damp.

You may think that this is the end, Well it is, but to prove we're all liars, We're going to sing it again, Only this time we'll sing a little higher.

And the song repeats itself ad infinitum, getting higher in tone each repeat until the singer is ready for the final as per Mitch Miller: You may think that this is the end, Well, it is!

"Well, you're right!" may be substituted for "Well, it is!".

Another version goes like this:

Be kind to your web-footed friends For a duck may be somebody's mother, Be kind to your friends in the camp, Where the weather is always damp.

You may think that this is the end, Well it's not, we are just teasing. There's something that you need to know, We're gonna sing it _______________, here we go.

The blank may be filled with appropriate adjectives like "low", "high", "silly", "fast", etc., until ready for the finale, when the singer may end with "Well, it is!" as did Mitch Miller.

Soccer chants
"Here We Go", the British soccer chant, consists of the words "here we go" continuously repeated to the tune of The Stars and Stripes Forever. It was described by Auberon Waugh as the national anthem of the working classes. It was the basis of Everton F.C.'s official song for the 1984 FA Cup Final. The tune has been repurposed for many other, similarly repetitive, football chants.

Variations and notable uses
"The Stars and Stripes Forever" is featured in many U.S. musical performances and instances of pop culture:
 * There are several orchestral transcriptions of "The Stars and Stripes Forever", including one by conductor Leopold Stokowski and one by Keith Brion and Loras Schissel. There was also an orchestral arrangement of the march by Carl Davis and David Cullen for the album Carl Conducts...Classical Festival Favourites. Orchestral versions are typically transposed one-half step lower than the original band version, to put the march in a key that is more familiar to string players.
 * The tune is widely used by soccer fans, with the trio/grandioso section sung with the words "Here We Go". The supporters of Spanish side Valencia CF used to sing it with the words Xe que bó! which means something like "Oh! How good" in Valencian, and those words have become a symbol for the team. Another version uses the word cheerio repeatedly, normally sung to players or coaches when they have been sent off or occasionally when an underdog has ended its opponent's cup campaign. Finally, certain clubs such as Forest Green or Sunderland use the chant just using the club name; this only works if the name has three syllables. A nickname can instead be used for the chant, such as Gateshead fans chanting "Tynesiders".
 * In the 1933 film Duck Soup, Harpo Marx, playing Pinky, a spy infiltrating a house in the middle of the night, attempts to open what he believes to be a safe, but turns out to be a large radio, which loudly begins playing "The Stars and Stripes Forever" when he turns the knob. Pinky spends the next several moments futilely (and loudly) trying to quell the noise before throwing the radio out a nearby window.
 * The march was used in the 1939 cartoon Officer Duck, after Donald Duck successfully subdues Tiny Tom, played by Pete. It is played by a marching band of police officers who further advance Tom's arrest. On the highest note of the brass, Donald kicks Tom on his rear end.
 * Classic Popeye the Sailor cartoons by Fleischer Studios make frequent use of the tune in the music score accompanying the climactic fight between Popeye and the villain starting with the moment Popeye gets a spinach power boost.
 * Parts of the tune feature in two Laurel and Hardy short films, The Chimp and Come Clean.
 * In show business, as said before, particularly theater and the circus, this piece is called "the Disaster March". It is a traditional code signaling a life-threatening emergency. This helps theater personnel to handle events and organize the audience's exit without panic. Circus bands never play it under any other circumstances. One memorable example of its use was at the Hartford Circus Fire in July 1944, in which at least 160 people were killed.
 * A 1952 biographical film, Stars and Stripes Forever, gives an account of the composer's life and music.
 * Russian-American pianist Vladimir Horowitz wrote a famous transcription of "The Stars and Stripes Forever" for solo piano to celebrate his becoming an American citizen. In an interview, Horowitz opined that the march, being a military march, is meant to be played at a walking tempo. He complained that many conductors played the piece too fast, resulting in music that is "hackneyed".
 * Timmy Mallett was fond of chanting "Wacaday, Wacaday, Wacaday" to the tune in children's TV show Wacaday, often getting child guests to do the same.
 * In "Evolution", the first episode of the third season of the television series Star Trek: The Next Generation, a malfunction in the ship's systems causes the main computer to play Sousa's march on all channels throughout the ship. The episode was first aired on September 25, 1989.
 * The song is usually played for the President of the United States after he gives a speech at a public forum, event, or ceremony, whereas "Hail to the Chief" is played when the President is introduced.
 * The tune of the song appears in the 1970 animated TV special adaptation of Horton Hears a Who! by Dr. Seuss, used as the melody for the song Be Kind To Your Small Person Friends.
 * In 1981, fingerstyle guitarist Guy Van Duser made an arrangement of the march for guitar. It was later performed by guitarists such as Chet Atkins, Rick Foster and Doug Smith.
 * The march was used during the Opening Ceremonies of the 1984, 1996 and 2002 Olympics, all hosted by the United States of America: while in 1984 was immediately played after the USA Olympic Team was introduced at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum, both in 1996 and 2002 the tune was played after John Williams Olympic Fanfare (that "introduced" Team USA at the former Centennial Olympic Stadium and six years later at Rice-Eccles Olympic Stadium).
 * The march was adapted for the theme song to The Berenstain Bears 1985 cartoon.
 * An 8-bit version of the song is used in the MS-DOS and Commodore 64 versions of Wheel of Fortune when solving a puzzle correctly.
 * The student band Strindens Promenade Orchester in Trondheim, Norway, has the world record in "speed playing" of "The Stars and Stripes Forever" (absolutely all notes must be played). The band calls their speedy rendering of the march "Stars and Stribes", and performs the march at all solemn occasions at the Trondheim Student Society. Set during the fall term of 1999, the record time is 50.9 seconds (nominal time is 3 minutes 50 seconds). For this, the band is noted in the Norwegian edition of the Guinness Book of Records.
 * The march in a specific rendition is in the soundtrack of the video game Postal 2, where it's performed by the marching band.
 * American composer Robert W. Smith parodied Stars and Stripes Forever along with "Jingle Bells" with his composition "Jingle Bells Forever", published by Alfred Publishing Co.
 * In 2008, the Muppets performed a web version starring Sam the Eagle, Beaker, a clucking chicken, Bobo the Bear, The Swedish Chef, and Crazy Harry.
 * The video game Fallout 3 has the Stars and Stripes Forever as one of the songs on the Enclave Radio.
 * In 2009, Fetch! with Ruff Ruffman used this tune as a jingle in advertising character Ruff Ruffman's "RuffMeal" in the episode "The RuffMeal Needs More Roughage".
 * At the conclusion of WWE's Extreme Rules pay-per-view in 2011, Stars and Stripes Forever played following John Cena announcing the death of Osama Bin Laden. It was also played during the January 5, 2015 episode of WWE Raw from Corpus Christi, Texas, also involving Cena, during the main event segment called John Cena Appreciation Night, where The Authority (Triple H and Stephanie McMahon) thanked Cena for (kayfabe) re-hiring them following the previous year's Survivor Series event's main event match, only to slander him and then (kayfabe) fire his teammates from that night, Dolph Ziggler, Ryback and Erick Rowan. The Big Show, who was also Cena's teammate during the aforementioned match, was not fired since he turned his back on Cena during the match and then joined The Authority. Balloons and confetti then fell from the rafters as Cena and his teammates stood in the ring, dejected, as the song played.
 * In Argentina, a sensationalist news channel, Crónica TV, always uses the first 22 seconds of this march as a background music on reporting breaking news stories.
 * The Grateful Dead finished their 50th reunion concert on July 4, 2015 with fireworks accompanied by a recording of "The Stars and Stripes Forever", in front of 70,000 people in Soldier Field in Chicago.
 * In 2022, a March Madness-themed commercial from Capital One featured the opening notes of "The Stars and Stripes Forever" being played by a marching band led by Charles Barkley, who claimed to represent a fictional university named "Chuck U". Samuel L. Jackson and Spike Lee are also featured in the commercial.

title: The Stars and Stripes Forever


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Stank

This page is an archive of the discussion surrounding the proposed deletion of the page entitled Stank.

This page is kept as an historic record.

The result of the debate was to delete the article.

Stank is nothting more than a definition, and can't be expanded. Gentgeen 03:27, 20 May 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. It's just a slang dictdef. -- Stevietheman 03:31, 20 May 2004 (UTC)
 * I say "stink." Also, delete. - Lucky 6.9 05:41, 20 May 2004 (UTC)
 * "Stunk". I mean, delete. -- Cyrius|&#9998 01:40, May 25, 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete, though so few titles are such a perfect description of the page. Well, it will be a perfect description once the page is deleted so we can refer to it in the past tense thusly. Lord Bob 15:02, May 20, 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete - Mud 12:20, 25 May 2004 (UTC)

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue or the deletion should be placed on other relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.

title: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Stank