text:
Talk:Regulus Black

Note: This article has been redirected to Talk:Dark wizards in Harry Potter

Spouse: James Potter (deceased)

Making improvements
Hello guys, thanks for responding. Sandpiper, I will reply to your comments above within your response. I think that there are a number of issues that we need to separate, in order to make progress.

 * The first is whether my edit of the article presented an improvement over the presentation, and a good basis on which to make further improvements. Needless to say, I feel that it did present all the necessary information in a concise way, and that is the important basis for an encyclopedia article. As I said, I came to the article not intending to contribute anything, but rather to find the relevant information, which I felt was not really presented here. That is why I tried to make an improvement. I am wondering whether we can possibly agree to go back to that edit, and then think about what we *can* and *should* add to it. In my opinion, for a good encyclopedia article, there is an onus on really making a case why anything other than the basic information is relevant enough to be *included*, rather than why it should be left out. So starting with a well-organized slim article and discussing what to add to it seems to me to be the most reasonable way to go.

 * The second issue is actually unrelated to my edit, and this is whether or not a theory that Regulus is not really dead should be included in this article. I can see that this has been hotly debated between the two of you, and I hope that I might be able to mediate a little bit here, provided that both of you are willing to tone down your opinion a little bit. My personal feeling at the moment is that a necessary (though not sufficient) condition for including some version of this theory in the article would be to obtain some form of concensus on the matter. (I will explain this a bit more some other time.) On the other hand, I do not think that we can preclude the possibility of the theory a priori, either. The most important thing is to stop bickering and get on with improving the article in an acceptable way. I will note that this theory was not included in the article which I originally edited.

 * Another question is how much of the actual developments in the RAB=Regulus theory should be included here. My main points here are that we should not repeat everything stated in the main R.A.B. article, as that would be unencyclopedic; that whatever we write needs to be complete at the level of detail we choose (e.g. in the article I edited, there was no mention of the foreign translations); that there is a clear indication that "R.A.B." is the actual main article; that the text is understandable to someone who knows none of the rumours.

 * Finally, there are some other details which you may want to discuss the inclusion of. As mentioned above, I think we should start the article without them, and then argue for and against each of them before we decide.

Does this seem like a reasonable way forward? LR 21:08, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

 * Since no-one seems to have had any major objections, I think I will at least clean up the beginning and first section of the article, using my previous edit as a basis. If there is any information you feel is missing, let's try and discuss it on here first. LR 20:07, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

 * Ok, I've done it, and spent quite a bit of time trying to make sure information isn't missed, and adding references which were missing previously. Please do not revert this edit again without giving adequate justification, and time for discussion. Also, if you feel that any information is missing, let's discuss this here beforehand.

 * I'll say straightaway that I did not include the information on Regulus's father and uncle, since we haven't established its relevance. Also, I did not include the statement about Sirius not having any contact with his family shortly before or after his brother's death, since I couldn't find a reference for it easily. If there is a definite reference, then we can include it, but I do not think it is vital. Improvements in style etc. are very welcome. LR 21:34, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

 * The 'meaning of the name' section has now also been fixed. As mentioned, I have removed the information on the 'diamond of spring', which not only seems questionable to me, but whose relevance is also not established in the article. I have slightly shortened the information on the star Regulus, as again the appropriateness of the detailed description to the article didn't seem clearly established. I have also removed the mention of "Demon Regulus"; this seems to be a rather minor meaning of the name, it is covered by the reference to the disambiguation page. It is not clear why this should have been listed on the page, but not some of the other meanings, so I think it's an instance of NPOV. Comments welcome, but please don't add information to this section unless its relevance (and NPOV) is clearly established. Best to discuss here first. LR 21:21, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

 * The "R.A.B." section has now also been treated. Since there were concerns that my previous edit contained too little information, I have tried to give an expanded, though still succinct, account of the developments here. However, as a result I feel that this section could still use some improvements. The prose can probably be fine-tuned. But most importantly, it could do with some more "mainstream" references to avoid the appearance of OR. It seems as though it should be possible to find a mainstream newspaper account of Isabel Nunes's revelation (perhaps in a Portuguese newspaper?).

 * I am very happy with how the other sections look now (what do you think?); with this one, I am somehow not completely happy, but I cannot completely pinpoint why. I do feel, however, that the amount of detail provided is appropriate, and the section (or other parts of the article) should not be significantly expanded at this point in time. Again, any input is appreciated. LR 23:35, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

 * Hello Folken, I saw your edit. I was a little bit unhappy with my formulation there myself, but I'm not sure that I feel not making a connection with the previous section is good style either. Apart from not being good prose, we are *implying* a connection to the previous theory, but leaving the reader to make it, which is not a good thing to do. I have made another attempt; how about this:"In connection with this theory, it has been observed that foreign editions consistently translate the final initial of 'R.A.B.' to agree with the first letter of the Black surname." This is supported by the reference to the Guardian article, and seems worded in a more neutral way than before.

 * I'm not sure I am yet 100 per cent happy with the section as it is, but I do feel that this has been an improvement. What do you think? The filmfodder link that you referred to seems to work fine for me. What is the problem you get with it? LR 16:39, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

"Regulus is alive" theory
Alright, let's get right into it. I imagine this discussion will take a while to settle, and in the meantime we can improve the rest of the article. Here is how I see this.

 * As far as I understand, there is a theory that Regulus is not really dead, and the discussion is whether the theory is noteworthy enough to be included on this page.

 * *If* this theory was to be included on Wikipedia, this would be the article for it.

So it needs to be decided whether this theory is relevant enough to be included on Wikipedia. Since the article can stand quite easily by itself, it needs to be *verifiably* established that the existence of this theory is important enough to be reported in an encyclopedia. As mentioned above, one question we can ask ourselves is whether we would still would want to include mention of it in a few months' time, if the theory has turned out to be false? If not, that would be a strong argument against inclusion. We need to remember that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia.

Here is another issue, which is related to NPOV. I am sure we agree that we cannot and should not include all existing Harry Potter rumors on Wikipedia. It needs to be argued very carefully that this is one of *the* main theories generating discussion about the final Harry Potter installment, in which case *all* theories of the same stature should be included on Wikipedia.

I will give an example. I am not a big Harry Potter fanatic, but I did a few searches online recently, having idly come up with some ideas myself about the final book. On my browsing of some of the fan's websites, I *didn't* actually come across the 'Regulus is alive' theory. On the other hand, I did come across a theory, which I did not find particularly convincing, about Madam Pince being Snape's mother, and a number of similarly far-fetched ideas. If you want to include the Regulus theory, you would need to argue convincingly, and back this up in a verifiable manner, that either the existence of the Regulus rumor is more significance than that of the Pince = Prince rumor (contrary to my first impression), or that the Pince rumor should also be on Wikipedia (which I am, to say the least, very dubious about). LR 23:27, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

 * If RAB=Regulus is developed in some sort, it's precisely because someone asked JKR about it (so it appeared in an "official" interview with the author of the books, the existence of this theory has been acknowledged in front of the author, she even talked about it and said "fine guess"). So you see, it's not because of the number of followers of the theory, but because the theory managed to gain importance outside the restricted circle of the HP fandom, because it was acknowledged by the author herself.
 * That other theories are discussed on forums and in obscure self-published books in which fans from forums are directly involved, is not enough to deserve mention on WP. WP is a general encyclopedia, and its articles shouldn't adress exclusively to these little, restricted fan circles. What exists only among underground circles of fans and underground self-published books definitely shouldn't be included on WP. These theories have not become notable because their existence is still restricted to fansites underground books. Interviews from Rowling are notable (because she is the author), however.

 * So it's all about notability, and mentioning every fan theory, or only the theories that we like/that we judge popular is simply not notable enough for WP, because WP isn't a part of these underground fan circles, but a general encyclopedia, and it's not because we're dealing with HP that WP should become a part of these underground circles: HP notability on WP is defined by its status as an internationally-published and internationally-successful series of books, not because of the work of some fans. What never went beyond these circles of die-hard fans obviously doesn't have its place on a general encyclopedia. We don't have to, and in fact we can't, report "discussions and debates" which concern only these restricted fan circles. What's on WP must have a global relevance, and reporting every single debate theese fan circles have had on every single HP theory that has appeared on the web, is obviously of no interest for Wikipedia.

 * There is also another problem with theories, also linked to notability in a way: WP has very clear rules about the sources that can be used, we cannot include self-published sources or dubious sources, and the source that was used to report the "Regulus is not dead" theory was a self-published book in which those fan circles were heavily involved. Was Rowling ever asked about it in an interview ? Has she ever qualified it a "fine guess" ? Has a translator ever reported that Rowling told her that Regulus was not dead ? Given that this theory couldn't go beyond the restricted circles of die-hard fans and obscure publications related to the fans themselves, I really can't see how it could deserve inclusion here.

 * Sandpiper is a little bit too much enthusiast about these fan circles, and it's sad that he is mistaken when he goes on WP to include content that really doesn't have its place. However, if Sandpiper absolutely wants to praise fan theories or build his own theories using the Wiki system, he can go to the HP Wiki, where everything will be accepted.

 * But now and here, there is not much possibilities, theories really can't stay on WP.Folken de Fanel 10:46, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

 * I think you are being a little bit too dogmatic here, which I don't think is going to help finding a concensus. As I said, if someone wants a theory to be included, they need to show verifiably that this theory has "global relevance", as you call it. However, in principle it is something that might be possible. I don't think that Sandpiper has made a very good case for this particular theory so far. However, that doesn't mean that there *couldn't* be circumstances under which a 'fan theory' can be significant enough to be included on Wikipedia. Let Sandpiper make his case, and we will try to reach a concensus. LR 14:37, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

 * I don't see that a debate about madame pince is really helpfull. what is her relevance to Regulus Black? The Regulus page would discuss those things which have arisen regarding Regulus, not the school librarian, however popular she may be. What other theories did you come up with which might be considered for mention or not on this page? My point is that the whole lot of mainstream debate about the character is not going to amount to very much length in words, so there is really no point in not mentioning it in a comprehensive article. As to whether or not it will be mentioned in two months time, I don't know. I rather think that it should, but you also need to consider that what is being reported now as existing current theories about the books will no longer be true in two months, for obvious reasons. The article now should suit the situation now. Sandpiper 01:52, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

 * You miss my point. The question is not whether the theory is relevant *to Regulus Black*; the question is whether it is relevant enough *to be included on Wikipedia at all*. Of course no-one would include the 'Madam Pince' rumor here; but it's not included elsewhere (and, I think, probably rightly so), and *that*'s my point. If we report on a theory, we do so because we believe that *the existence of the theory* is a noteworthy fact. There is probably a better rule for this, but consider WWIN:News Reports: "Wikipedia properly considers the long-term historical notability of persons and events ... The briefer the appearance of a subject in the news the less likely it is to create an acceptably comprehensive encyclopedic biography."

 * This was stated with a somewhat different subject in mind, but I think it is still relevant here. The existence of the Regulus=RAB theory, for example, is an event which I would probably advertise keeping even after Deathly Hallows is out.

 * I will also point out that one of your previous comments, a quote from the MuggleNet publication, suggests that the theory is not widely accepted: "Unfortunately for Harry, Regulus Black is almost certainly dead. ... On the off chance that Regulus has been faking his death all these years ..." LR 09:40, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Which shows that the issue has been thought about, which is the point. An absence of debate does not simply indicate that a point is not worth debating, but also that it is settled and there is a conclusion to report. While the issue of what to include will definitely change in a couple of months, I would point out the clock started ticking two years ago. Are you suggesting we should blank all the HP articles because they will all be changed in two months? Say in an article on law, should we delete the article about existing legislation because a new act will be passed in two months? I think we would just explain that things are about to change. My own point was that what constitutes sufficient noteability to include depends upon the context. regulus Black has been widely discussed, as witness the fact that the mugglenet book has a whole chapter on him. The issue of whether he is dead or not will influence what happenes in the next book, specifically whether he will be alive to answer questions. Which I think was basically the point being quoted. Aside from that the book referenced is basically making a comment on the series, that fake death has appeared before, and this might be a situation where it could apply. I'm not sure why that is an issue. Sandpiper 13:19, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't think you have read my points carefully, because you seem to be misreading or avoiding them. I think you will have a hard time convincing anyone that a theory which is not considered convincing, or at least plausible, by a majority of the Harry Potter community, and which hasn't been reported on in the mainstream media, should be included in Wikipedia. (That doesn't mean that these criteria are by themselves sufficient.) What evidence is there that this is one of the most notable theories regarding Harry Potter, so notable that it should be included in a Wikipedia article? To address this point, you also haven't answered whether you think that the Madam Pince theory is less substantial than this one or not.

 * Whether a question is relevant to the last book or not is not really relevant to its inclusion on Wikipedia, since Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, and not a crystal ball. What we can report on is the existence of the theory, but it should have a lasting interest. What people *believe* to be relevant, however, *can* be worth reporting. I made this point above before. The question is whether this is *notable* enough, or not. At the moment, it seems your argument could be used to include a whole lot of theories which I feel are *not* relevant enough - I don't think we can justify documenting every theory appearing in Granger or the mugglenet book etc. What you need to do here is convince me that this theory is *more* notable. As far as I can tell, you haven't yet tried to make an argument for this.

 * Speculation that faked death has appeared before in the series and therefore should happen again would, in my eyes, count as original research. Of course, if there are secondary sources (i.e., something written and published by an expert on children's novels, etc.) which give this theory credence, then it could be included. Similarly, if it is one of the central beliefs held in the Harry Potter community prior to the publication of the book (so much so that it will remain notable if the belief is not fulfilled), then it could be concluded. Again, you need to argue for this.

 * To try and make the point succinctly: you need to argue why this theory is demonstrably more notable than many others which may seem of similar importance to the non-"expert". If you can demonstrate that it belongs e.g. in the ten most widely discussed theories prior to the release of book 7, perhaps we can make a case for its inclusion. If not, I'm not sure you have a case. LR 16:41, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Fringe theories?
I think Fringe theories is a relevant guideline here. I know it is not necessarily written with fan theories on works of popular culture in mind, but many of the remarks are still relevant. LR 20:09, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * That guideline seems to be discussing whether a particular theory deserves its own article. Which theory are we suggesting deserves its own article? I would also ask what you consider to be 'mainstream' journals, when it comes to debating the subject of HP. It is pointless looking to any source which does not customarily cover debate about contemporary fiction for a quote. The place to look is where this subject is debated...which is online. Sandpiper 12:38, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * And "online" isn't reliable and notable.Folken de Fanel 12:49, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * ah, but you see, that is imposing your own view, not that of wikipedia. Online just means something is on the internet and immediately available to anyone with an internet connection. That ought to make anything a very good source indeed. The issue is about content, not the medium whereby something is published. How can anyone writing an online encyclopedia claim that nothing on the internet can ever be considered reputable or reliable?Sandpiper 13:12, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah but you see, I'm not imposing anything, only what the rules of Wikipedia state. Online means also unreliable, because "anyone can create a website", post comments on forums, etc. Wikipedia works with reliablility and notability, and isolated comments on forums from isolated members of a restricted circle of die-hard fans is not notable enough for WP, which is a general encyclopedia, not the extension of online fan circles.
 * The issue is about content and the medium. As in your case, both elements don't respect the principles of WP.
 * It's not because this is an online encyclopedia that we can include just any fan theory there is on forums, Wikipedia works on notability and reliability, and there things on the web that are not reliable, because anyone can write anything on the web.
 * As for your recent edits, you still haven't proved the validity of them in this talk page, and you still haven't reached consensus with others, so you're not including them by force.Folken de Fanel 13:19, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * 'general encyclopedia' means it gives information about everything. Just so. Anyone can write any kind of rubbish on a web page. So very true. Just as they can on a printed page. That is why editors make choices about which sources are reputable and reliable, and which are not. It is this last bit which you are failing to apply. Frankly, the websites being quoted are much better edited than is this encyclopedia, so it is hard to see why anyone here can complain about quoting them. Sandpiper 13:49, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * It means it is directed to a general audience, not dedicated only to restricted people like fan clans, etc.
 * And so, we have policies and which sources are acceptable, and which aren't. And online forums just aren't acceptable because they are neither reliable nor notable.
 * On a side note, I'm glad you finally agree to discuss instead of disrupt. I hope you will keep it like that long enough to show how good faithed and experienced you are.~Next step is to stop vandalizing the french Wiki, and disrupting it just for the sake of opposing me and reverting each of my edits just for your personal pleasure of provoking and insulting me. Folken de Fanel 14:28, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah the french wiki. You mean where you nominated the RAB article for deletion after it had been chopped to pieces by anonymous editors, deleted the comments I made in the AfD there that the article being considered was totally different to the one which had been there previously, closed the deletion debate yourself which you yourself had started, argued that people wanted a rewrite which you interpreted as deleting most of the article despite their actually asking for it to have added references, and indeed be expanded as per the english one? Or do you mean that consensus there came down on including the content and references which I have been supporting here?
 * Now, who exactly do you imagine reads articles about Hp on wiki if not fans? Why do you argue that we should not include content which would be of interest to fans? That's how many million copies of the new book have already been paid for? This issue has already been clearly decided. Please stop your guerilla action to remove all mention of your pet hates from any article. Sandpiper 21:17, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * It's sad you're not willing to do anything to make the situation better for everyone, including the readers. It's sad, really. But it shows that you're merely a disrupter, and you merely prove my point.
 * Yes the french Wiki, were you insulted me in afd comments (were, obviously, personal comments and attacks have nothing to do), yes I closed the talk and I'm proud of it, yes peole officially said they wanted a clean of the original research (and, anyway, there is no need for a clean up request, when it is written in the rules that original research cannot stay in articles). People have asked for references, yes, for one part (and I don't remember you adding any reference, merely reverting back unsourced original research), and delete anything that cannot be reliably sourced, for a second part, which is merely what I've done. Anyway, what's the problem if I remove something strictly forbidden on Wikipedia ? You still fail to answer to any of this, hiding being ludicrous excuses of afd debates, which you don't even respect yourself (and don't start to invent imaginary worlds, no one supported the inclusion of your bad sources, either here or there) ...You even bring silly excuses of article length, but you see, length is nothing if you article a huge pile of nonesense, are you going to add insults to articles just to make them seem longer ?
 * Die-hard fans can have their own wikis, forums and websites, Wikipedia just can't be turned into a mirror of a fansite, that's all. It's a general encyclopedia for everyone, irrelevant and badly sourced (when it is sourced) trivia only for restricted fan circles doesn't interest anyone.
 * "The issue has already been clearly decided" ? Yes, each time you create a new incident, every one points out your bad behavior and warns you to calm down (to "stop trying the patience of other editors), and admits your edits harm WP. I remind you also that you can "decid" everything you want alone in your corner, it doesn't have any importance at all. You don't have decisional power, and you cannot oppose to general consensus. Ignoring it only makes things worse for you.
 * Please stop your guerilla action to add mention of your pet likes from any article.
 * Ironically, I notice that you're no more discussing your contribs to this article (you've jumped on an occasion to conveniently change the subject), further proving that you can't even justify them, and that they don't deserve to be included. Folken de Fanel 21:54, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

The full french RAB article only contained just the same stuff as was and still is contained in the article here, which as yet you have not suggested here ought to be deleted and nor has anyone else. The specific argument revolved around whether David Langford was a good source for the contention that the RAB was Regulus, and that the horcrux locket was the same one at Grimmaud place. It was held that Langford was indeed a good source and the material should remain in the article. This specifically is the content which you and I are debating now. I did not insult you, and it was held that I did not. I inserted information about your past editing history, which was held to be fair comment and relevant to the debate, as it clearly showed your own point of view and indeed rather different approach to editing the same article on two different wikis. As to re-stating the clear arguments I have already made about this content, it seems to me that the only result of this ongoing conversation is that these have disappeared somewhere into the ever lengthening nonsense debate. However, since you insist, I will again point out that the 190 books written about HP by third parties have already sold more copies than many original novels, that a vast number of people are interested in this debate, that specific websites have been acknowledged by fans, Rowling and even Warner bros as experts in this field, that people like Langford are respect commentators on works such as Rowling's in their own right. I'm sure he's not the only one, but I'm damned if i'm going to buy the other 187 books just to satisfy your disbelief, particularly since I do not believe any number of authors saying the same thing would convince you. One example is entirely enough to make the case for inclusion, especially when you can not demonstrate any counter evidence. Sandpiper 07:46, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Too bad you can't read french, because the french article didn't contain anything like that. It was merely original research from one editor proposing his own speculations and theories, but I see now you're shutting yourself into a room of lies and fabrication. The specific argument never revolved around Langford, as it was already established that fan theories were not acceptable and thoroughly and undisputably proved that langford was unreliable and not acceptable on Wikipedia. By the way, you still haven't reached consensus with Lasserempe about theories here, which completely proves my point.
 * The locket horcruxe location is your own opinion, and whether you concider it true has nothing to do with Wikipedia and cannot (and will not) influence any decision here (except your block for NPOV violation).
 * You did insult me and you still are, and it was held that you did. You inserted only personal attacks which were recognised as such. This was irrelevant in the debate as we were discussing original research in articles, not your own frustrations in life.
 * Have you read these 190 books ? Do you know what they are about ? Do you remember the rule about self-published and unreliable sources ? This sums up the "debate" about you, your sources are just bad, and however hard you try to insult me, and to impose your content in articles, you'll never succeed, because you're just wrong.
 * I have also already said that these theories concern only die-hard fan forums which do not interest the majority of the readers, and anyway we follow Wikipedia's guidelines, not yours, it's too easy to rewrite the rules each time...
 * The specific websites your talking have never been recognized as "experts" (you're again manipulating words), some people acknowledged their qualities as compilers of facts from the existing books, however no one has ever said anything about theory expertise, and here you're just manipulating comments, giving them a meaning that they never have. So of course we're not accepting this kind of arguments. If you're obliged to invent imaginary comments to back up your views, then it means you're completely wrong. So really, stop talking about fansites being "recognized", you were already told by others that it wasn't valid.
 * As for Langford, he's no one, as I've said he's no authority on the subject since he has no special knowledge on book 7 plot and has no special powers of divination. He's reliable, he's never written on HP before, so that's it.
 * I have demonstraed many counter evidence, that you simply refuse to answer them because you know they're right, and because you just fear them. As I've said, you've got no decisionary power whatsoever, and you cannot "decide" what to include or not, when every other users involved in these debates have proved you wrong and have been opposed to your actions.
 * Even here, in this very talk page, you've failed to convince Lasserempe, and now you've given up trying...You've lost, and you know it, and you're beginning to fall into a false word, you're losing contact with reality, you invent alternative worlds, you're using self-deception, but all this isn't going to make you win. It only makes you weak. You mind is weak and is losing ground, lies and deceptions are devoring it, and and you need to be helped because otherwise, you'll face serious mental illness. Really, stop fighting and let people help you, we're only here to help you, but if you continue to go into imaginary worlds, you'll never come back to reality. You'll be trapped in the worlds you have created. Folken de Fanel 09:34, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Anyone who wants to see the the view of the french pompier (arbitrator) on whether langford is a good source (and can make out French) see here, and anyone wanting to read the deletion debate for the french RAB page, see here The deletion  debate history makes interesting reading. I particularly like the bit where Folken argues that Langford (who is accepted as a source on the french wiki) is not even mentioned as a source in the articles, when it is Folken on both wikis who keeps deleting him as a ref. I quote from the deletion debate in response to a comment by Folken:
 * Ce qui m'ennuie chez toi ce sont tes mensonges constants, tes aggressions verbales constantes, ta croyance que tu détiens la vérité et le magnifique WP:POINT que tu es en train de faire. n'ayant pas réussi à obtenir ce que tu voulais sur en: tu essaies de le faire sur fr:, tu ment, tentes de dicréditer les gens en désaccord avec toi, t'autoproclame meilleur spécialiste de Fantasy qu'un professionnel du domaine, déforme les propos de tes contradicteurs etc. Ton comportement est très problèmatique, tu as déjà été prévenu, par Bourbarki, par Bapti, plusieurs autres admins ont déclaré que ceci était du vandalisme. Tout ce qu'on a obtenu de toi c'est une tentative d'embrouiller la situation tout en continuant tes mensonges. Si l'accusation d'être un menteur te gène, vas-y WP:CAR te tends les bras. - phe 13 mai 2007 à 02:11 (CEST)

Sandpiper 18 June 2007 (UTC).

Ongoing debate
I've been trying to make heads or tails where the debate stands now and I can't seem to figure out where we're at on it. I'm of the opinion that there should be a brief mention of RAB and them direct them to the RAB article. It is redundant to post the same information in 5 different articles. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Angielaj (talk • contribs)
 * That is all we have at present. I must admit I havn't had time to go through the old version of the article to see if anything else was deleted which I feel ought to be here. Sandpiper 00:57, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * The section above started as a discussion about whether the suggestion that Regulus might still be alive ought to be mentioned. I have to say I think it should, because 1) the article is rather short and needs all the content it can get, and 2) it is an interesting point about the use of faked deaths in the series, and a possible further example. I don't really see why it should be objectionable. Sandpiper 01:03, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

 * I disagree. Information should only be in the article unless it's needed. Fluff does not make an article any strong. As well keeping the same infomation in more then one location make maintance of all the articles harder, and less stronger. Further this isn't a forum for speculation. Fake deaths as interesting as they are hardly encyclopedic.

 * One last thing. I think it's highly inaapropiate to put information in an article is THERE IS NOT A CONSENSUS. You should leave the article in the state it was BEFORE you edited it. PLEASE be curtious to the other editors and not impose your will on everyone. This is GROUP effort.(sorry about spelling) Angielaj 01:56, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * All the information, and more, was already in the article before I edited it. Read further back in the history?
 * wiki is not paper. The only reason we need to limit information about a subject on one page is because it is getting too long for comfortable reading, and we are nowhere near that here. If you care to go and research Regulus on the internet, then you will find that one of debates about him is whether he may still be alive. This is obviously a side issue to whether he is RAB (which is essentially accepted by everyone) but hardly an irrelevant one. Obviously if he is alive then an appearance in the final book is more likely. Similarly, what he did with the locket is of great interest.
 * I disagree that trivia makes a page worse. Humour is always, always a good thing in getting across information, wiki articles should not be boring. In this case, the issue does not seem to be that the information is trivial, irrelevant or the like, but in fact that some people consider it so important that they demand its removal. Odd, really.
 * placement of information is always difficult. There are two conflicting requirements. Placing information together as much as possible, and placing it where it is relevant. I am not a believer in requiring readers to make multiple page switches to find something unless there is no alternative. In this case the page currently contains a very short summary of the RAB issue, and if anything I would have thought expanding it a bit would be sensible. It is not sensible to just have a link on a page referring people elsewhere without a summary version of that information essentially explaining why they might be interested in reading more. In a case such as this, such a summary would likely immediately be subject to challenge unless it goes some way towards demonstrating exactly why people believe RAB is Regulus, whereas a conventional encyclopedia would be able to simply get away with a line like 'Regulus is widely believed to be RAB, and to have hidden the locket at Grimmauld place'. Sandpiper 08:34, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Humor as nice as it is doesn't belong in an encyclopedia. no one will take it seriouslyAngielaj 12:20, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

 * plus there is stuff in here that it about who RAB might be that has nothing to do with regulas. The only thing that needs to be here is hard evidence of why RAB might be Regulas. The rest is speculation.Angielaj 12:25, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

 * I keep looking at that section and it bothers me. It's all over the place. It needs reorganized.Angielaj 12:31, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * That is a very odd thing to say about humour. If people are enjoying themselves they learn better. But in this case its not a question of including jokes, but rather 'entertaining' information. Why will no one take an encyclopedia seiously if it is fun to read? Isn't that the worst kind of stereotyping, equating knowledge with non-fun things to do? Or simply equating knowledge with bad writing?
 * I'm not sure what you mean by 'all that stuff about who RAB might be'. Regulus is a character who has been mentioned from time to time so that we get snippets of information about him, but who has never appeared. Except... that if he is RAB then he has appeared, and done something rather important. You can't write an article explaining Regulus' role without explaining why he might be RAB, including at least the bare explanation of the events in the book and the consideration of other candidates basically showing that there aren't any.

Now, the difference between folken and i which we are warring at the moment seems to be that he is repeatedly deleting the lines: ''It has been suggested that this must be the same locket. ''

Which is a pretty odd thing for him to delete, i would say. Stating that this specific locket is the horcrux locket is the whole point of making any mention of it at all; it is at the heart of Regulus' importance and basically why he merits an article. The existence of this article logically presupposes that there is a real likelihood that RAB=regulus, and that people are interested in what he did with the locket. Mostly what Folken seems to be seking to do is remove all mentions of sources which confirm that this debate is widespread. Very peculiar editing. Sandpiper 22:23, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

If you want a real theory to include, I would suggest adding: 'Regulus discovered that Voldemort was a half-blood, and in his fury at being duped, resolved to steal the horcrux.' This theory is also nicely supported by snippets here and there, such as bella's fury when Harry tells her Voldemort is a half blood (which also tells us the information had been secret). talking about rewriting articles, we have still not settled the consequences of the last person who did this, which gave rise to the unresolved deletion of: ''It is unclear how Sirius received his information on his brother's death, and what agenda his informants may have had. Although J.K. Rowling has stated Regulus is actually dead, she has not indicated that the allegations of Regulus's death via the Death Eaters nor Voldemort are accurate.''

The series has been noted as following certain patterns: Philosopher's Stone shares features with Order of the Phoenix, and Chamber of Secrets shares features with Half-Blood Prince''. According to this pattern, Prisoner of Azkaban would correspond to Deathly Hallows, and it has been suggested that the plot device of a faked death (Peter Pettigrewin PoA) may be repeated. Regulus was one of two characters - along with Dumbledore - who many readers have considered might still be alive. Some argued that Regulus needed to survive if the facts surrounding his mysterious life and death, and around the horcruxes, were to be told, whereas there were plenty of means of discovering any of Dumbledore's remaining secrets. "if Reggie's true tale is to be told, he will probably have to tell it himself. Because there doesn't seem to be anyone else around to do it for him." Rowling made a statement specifically that Dumbledore was definitely dead, but has made no such comment about Regulus.

According to the Black family tree, Regulus Black's father Orion and his uncle Cygnus Black both died in the same year as Regulus.

which was being debated above, which i have politely not been reinserting into the article. Sandpiper 22:23, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

 * First the humor thing. This isn't about entertainment. You don't see britanica doing humor.It's a source for information should not try to entertain you by telling you a knock knock joke. It's not about stereo typing knowlage as not fun, it's about being a reliable repiable source for knowledge.

 * Second what I meant about "All the people RAB could be" Specifically I mean the line where Hermione finds other people with the intials RAB. This isn't an article about RAB it's about regulas. That line should be taken out. Further more I have doubts if the bit about how the locket was found by Dumbledore and harry should be in this article as it nothing to do with Regulas as RAB.

 * What I think needs to happen is to simply list out the citable facts from REPITABLE sources on why Regulas could be RAB and then point to the RAB article.

 * The Repitable part is why the locket bit keeps getting deleted because Mugglenet as nice of a fan site is as it is, isn't repitable enough to cite as fact. The book was not edited by an impartial editor, but self published. It's FAN SPECULATION.
 * AngielaJ 01:30, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I've done some editing to show what I mean by organization because it's easier to show then to explain in prose. AngielaJ 01:53, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

So...
No debate now? WookMuff 00:15, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Should all of the speculation of R.A.B. be saved somewhere? --michael180 18:59, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

R.A.B. merged here
I have merged R.A.B. into Regulus Black. That page's talk page can still be accessed at Talk:R.A.B.. GarrettTalk 20:23, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I think the pre-release leaks and educated guesses (foreign translations et al) be summarized into a single section (rather than the three as now). Coz that info is no more relevant to the series, it only exists for historical interest. --Ayleuss 07:45, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I think it is important that the debat needs to be retained in the article. The reason for the existence of the HP articles at all is the enormous interest they created, and the the historical trail of clues is part of that. 88.108.117.107 11:01, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Of course it needs to be preserved, we just do not need details. Like the exact wordings of the conversation and such stuff. --Ayleuss 12:24, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
 * why not? it is a description of the events which took place. Sandpiper 23:36, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
 * What "description" does quoting an interview verbatim provide that a summarization cannot? --Ayleuss 08:52, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
 * But what is wrong with using a quotation when one is available? Sandpiper 20:11, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

This section (three sections) is way over the top. The debate should be mentioned, but a full analysis is inappropriate. This is an encyclopaedia, not a discussion board.Snuffulufagus 22:31, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
 * The distinction is that an encyclopedia reports (and explains) the discussion, rather than originating it. Are you saying that a point which literally held the attention of millions of people isn't worth the space explaining it? Sandpiper 01:20, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

My Article
You worthless Muggles did a horrible job writing my article. — R.A.B. 04:28, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

title: Talk:Regulus Black


text:
Marganus

Marganus (Welsh: Margan) was a legendary king of the Britons as accounted by Geoffrey of Monmouth. He came to power in 850BC.

He was the son of Maglaurus, Duke of Albany, and Goneril, the daughter of King Leir.

Marganus, grandson of Leir, despised the rule of his aunt Cordelia in Britain. With the help of his cousin Cunedagius, Marganus took over the kingdom from Cordelia and ruled half of it. Following Cordelia's suicide, Marganus came to rule the region of Britain northeast of the Humber.

Marganus was eldest male heir of Leir and, influenced by his peers, became discontent with ruling only half of Britain. He began a scorched earth march through Cornwall until reaching the army of Cunedagius. Cunedagius defeated Marganus and Marganus fled. Cunedagius followed him throughout Britain until cornering him in Wales. There, Cunedagius killed Marganus and became king of all Britain. He named the place Margon in honour of his cousin.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Marganus


text:
User talk:Astaines

Please consider joining the Wikidocs WikiProject Clinical medicine Kd4ttc 03:23, 22 May 2004 (UTC)

Category
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Hi: My name is Tess and I work for a global independent research firm in New York. I am interested in hiring you for a Wikipedia editing project, based on your technology and medical experience and expertise. I attempted to email you through your user page. If you received it, please read it over and contact me with any questions. If you did not receive this email, please let me know and I would be more than happy to tell you more about this project. (You can call 512-651-1797 or email tfurman@glgroup.com). Thank you and I hope to hear from you soon! Tess - Gerson Lehrman Group 18:46, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

Wikiversity Journal of Medicine, an open access peer reviewed journal with no charges, invites you to participate
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title: User talk:Astaines


text:
Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders

The Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders, often abbreviated to SWB RailRiders, are a Minor League Baseball team of the International League (IL) and the Triple-A affiliate of the New York Yankees. They are located in Moosic, Pennsylvania, in the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area, and are named in reference to Northeastern Pennsylvania being home to the first trolley system in the United States. The RailRiders have played their home games at PNC Field since its opening in 1989.

Founded as members of the International League in 1989, the team was known as the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Red Barons during their affiliation with the Philadelphia Phillies from 1989 to 2006. They became known as the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees in 2007 after affiliating with the New York Yankees. They rebranded as the RailRiders in 2013. The RailRiders became members of the Triple-A East in 2021, but this league was renamed the International League in 2022.

Scranton/Wilkes-Barre has won two International League championships (2008 and 2016) and one Triple-A National Championship (2016).

Prior professional baseball in the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area
Professional baseball teams first played in the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre (SWB) area of Pennsylvania in the late 19th century. In Scranton, the predominant moniker of these teams was the Scranton Miners, who originated in 1886 as the Scranton Indians, though they were also known as Coal Heavers and Red Sox throughout their history. The Miners' last season was in 1953 as members of the Eastern League. The franchise was surrendered to the league after it was unable to secure backing by a Major League Baseball team for 1954. In Wilkes-Barre, the Wilkes-Barre Barons, originally the Coal Barons, who were established in 1886, played their last season in the Eastern League in 1955. Financial problems resulted in the relocation of the franchise to Johnstown during the 1955 season.

Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Red Barons (1989–2006)
Over three decades after Minor League Baseball left the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area, the Maine Phillies were relocated from Old Orchard Beach, Maine, to Lackawanna County in 1989. A group from Scranton, called Northeast Baseball, Inc. (NBI), purchased the team in 1987. The previous owner tried to renege on the sale, but after a lengthy court battle, NBI won control of the franchise and moved forward with its relocation. The team was renamed the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Red Barons in reference to the Scranton Red Sox and the Wilkes-Barre Barons, who had preceded them. They were to play in the International League (IL) as the Triple-A affiliate of the Philadelphia Phillies, as had the franchise in Maine. Their home ballpark was the newly-constructed Lackawanna County Stadium, later renamed PNC Field, located in nearby Moosic, Pennsylvania.

The Red Barons struggled in their early years, finishing under .500 in their first three seasons. In 1992, manager Lee Elia led SWB to an 84–58 record and the Eastern Division title. In the playoffs, they defeated the Pawtucket Red Sox in the semifinals but lost the league championship versus the Columbus Clippers. The Red Barons posted losing records for the next six seasons.

Marc Bombard took over as manager in 1997 and led the club to four consecutive postseason appearances from 1999 to 2002. The 1999 Northern Division champion Red Barons were eliminated from the playoffs in the semifinals by the Charlotte Knights. In 2000, the team missed winning the division but qualified for the IL wild card spot. They defeated the Buffalo Bisons in the semifinals but fell to the Indianapolis Indians in the championship round. Another wild card berth in 2001 sent SWB back to the playoffs. They won the semifinals over Buffalo, 3–2, and advanced to face the Louisville RiverBats for the league title. After losing Game One of the series, the postseason came to abrupt end when it was cancelled in the wake of the September 11 terrorist attacks. Louisville, with a 1–0 series lead, was declared the champion. The Red Barons returned to the playoffs in 2002 with the Northern Division title but were eliminated by Buffalo in the semifinals. They made one more postseason appearance as the Red Barons and as a Phillies affiliate in 2006 via a division title win, but the Rochester Red Wings ended their championship hopes in the semifinals.

Following the 2006 season, the Philadelphia Phillies ended their affiliation with the Red Barons and signed a player development contract with the Ottawa Lynx in anticipation of that team's move to Allentown's new Coca-Cola Park as the Lehigh Valley IronPigs for the 2008 season.

Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees (2007–2012)

In 2007, the club became the Triple-A affiliate of the New York Yankees and rebranded as the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees. In terms of regular-season records and championships, the Yankees affiliation has been more successful than that with the Phillies. From 2007 to 2009, the SWB Yankees made four consecutive trips to the postseason, all by virtue of winning the Northern Division title. The 2007 team was eliminated in the semifinal round by the Richmond Braves. In 2008, the Yankees won another division title with an 88–56 record behind manager Dave Miley. After defeating Pawtucket in the semifinals, 3–1, the Yankees beat the Durham Bulls, 3–1, in the final round to earn the Governors' Cup, their first IL championship. This qualified them for the Bricktown Showdown, a single game against the Pacific Coast League's champion to determine an overall champion of the Triple-A classification. They lost the Triple-A championship versus the Sacramento River Cats by a score of 4–1. SWB won the 2009 semifinals over the Gwinnett Braves, 3–1, but were swept by Durham in the finals, 3–0. The 2010 team was eliminated by Columbus in the semifinals.

In November 2010, the Lackawanna County Multipurpose Stadium Authority voted to sell the SWB Yankees to Mandalay Baseball Properties, which planned a $40-million renovation of PNC Field. However, negotiations stalled the actual sale for over a year. The sale was finalized on April 26, 2012, with the franchise being sold to SWB Yankees LLC, an ownership entity that was a joint venture between the New York Yankees and Mandalay.

Empire State Yankees
The SWB Yankees chose to temporarily relocate their operations for the 2012 season to allow major renovations to PNC Field to be completed in one season, rather than being spread over two to three years. The team based itself in Rochester, New York, at Frontier Field, home of Red Wings. They played their entire schedule on the road, often being designated as the home team at an opponent's ballpark. In addition to Frontier Field, the Yankees also played home games at Dwyer Stadium in Batavia, New York; Alliance Bank Stadium in Syracuse, New York; Coca-Cola Field in Buffalo, New York; Coca-Cola Park in Allentown, Pennsylvania; and McCoy Stadium in Pawtucket, Rhode Island. The team was known as the Empire State Yankees in the 2012 season for promotional purposes, though it retained its official SWB Yankees moniker. After missing the playoffs in 2011, the Yankees returned in 2012 by winning the Northern Division title, but they were eliminated by Pawtucket in the semifinals.

Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders (2013–present)
In anticipation of their return to the renovated PNC Field in 2013, a name-the-team contest was launched to select a new moniker for the SWB franchise. Among the finalists were "Blast", "Black Diamond Bears", "Fireflies", "Porcupines", and "Trolley Frogs". The chosen name, "RailRiders", is in reference to Northeastern Pennsylvania being home to the first trolley system in the United States. Although RailRiders received the most first-place votes by fans, Porcupines received the most overall fan votes on the ballots ranked one through three. As a result, a porcupine was incorporated in the RailRiders' logos.

The 2013 and 2014 RailRiders finished under .500 and did not qualify for the postseason. In September 2014, Mandalay Baseball Properties sold its 50% interest in the team to SWB Investors LLC, a group consisting of David Abrams, David Blitzer, Grant Cagle, and Michael Hisler, for approximately $14 million. The RailRiders returned to the playoffs in 2015 with a Northern Division title win, but they were swept out of the semifinals by Indianapolis. After nine seasons, six division titles, and one league championship, the 2015 season was the last for Dave Miley as the team's manager.

Al Pedrique was hired to lead the team in 2016. SWB finished with a league-best 91–52 record and another Northern Division title. They swept Lehigh Valley, 3–0, in the semifinals and won their second Governors' Cup over Gwinnett, 3–1. The IL championship qualified them for the Triple-A National Championship Game versus the El Paso Chihuahuas, where they won, 3–1, claiming their second Triple-A championship.

The 2017 RailRiders won the division title and defeated Lehigh Valley in the semifinals but lost the IL championship to Durham. The 2018 club made another postseason run via a wild card berth. Like in the previous season, they advanced to the finals by beating Lehigh Valley but again lost in the finals to Durham. The RailRiders finished the 2019 season tied for first place with the Syracuse Mets, each with a 75–65 record. On September 3, SWB defeated Syracuse in a one-game playoff, 14–13, to win the Northern Division title. They were, however, swept in the playoff semifinals by Durham.

The start of the 2020 season was initially postponed due to the COVID-19 pandemic before being cancelled altogether.

In conjunction with Major League Baseball's restructuring of Minor League Baseball in 2021, the RailRiders were organized into the Triple-A East. No playoffs were held to determine a league champion; instead, the team with the best regular-season record was declared the winner. SWB placed third in the league standings with a 68–49 record under manager Doug Davis, who had been with the club as a coach since 2017. However, 10 games that had been postponed from the start of the season were reinserted into the schedule as a postseason tournament called the Triple-A Final Stretch in which all 30 Triple-A clubs competed for the highest winning percentage. The RailRiders finished the tournament in sixth place with a 7–3 record.

In December 2021, SWB Investors sold their 50% stake in the club to Diamond Baseball Holdings. In 2022, the Triple-A East became known as the International League, the name historically used by the regional circuit prior to the 2021 reorganization. Davis returned to the club for his second season as manager, leading the team to an 83–67 record, finishing second in the ten-team East Division.

Uniforms

The RailRiders' primary home uniform is white with navy blue pinstripes, mirroring those of the New York Yankees. The primary home jersey features a descending "SWB" logo on train tracks on the left chest and a navy interlocking New York Yankees "NY" logo on the right sleeve. The home cap is navy with a golden "R" set against a railroad track. The team's road uniform is gray with "RailRiders" across the jersey's chest and is worn with a navy cap with a white interlocking "SWB" logo.

An alternate solid navy jersey was introduced in 2022, featuring the white interlocking "SWB" crest on the left chest and a white interlocking New York Yankees "NY" logo on the right sleeve. These are worn with the navy cap feature the same "SWB" logo.

Radio and television
SWB's first radio play-by-play announcer was Kent Westling, a former local television sportscaster who previously worked on telecasts of the St. Louis Blues hockey team. While cutting back on his schedule in later years, he retired following the 2007 season after having called over 2,000 games since the team's inaugural 1989 campaign. Mike Vander Woude served as the team's second play-by-play announcer from 2008 until 2012. He was followed by John Sadak from 2013 to 2017. Adam Marco has been the "Voice of the RailRiders" since 2018.

All RailRiders home and road games are broadcast by WICK across their five frequencies in Northeastern Pennsylvania: 1400 WICK (Lackawanna and Luzerne Counties), 1440 WCDL (Lackawanna County and Pocono Lake Region), 93.5 FM (Scranton and Northern Lackawanna County), 106.7 FM (Wayne and Pike Counties), and 107.9 FM (Lackawanna County). Live audio broadcasts are also available online through the team's website and the MiLB First Pitch app. All home and road games can be viewed through the MiLB.TV subscription feature of the official website of Minor League Baseball, with audio provided by a radio simulcast.

Awards

Eight players, five managers, and two executives have won league awards in recognition for their performance with Scranton/Wilkes-Barre in the International League.

Managers

Scranton/Wilkes-Barre has had 17 managers since their inaugural 1989 season.

Ownership
The Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders are owned by Diamond Baseball Holdings, a subsidiary of the investment firm Silver Lake, previously a subsidiary of Endeavor Group Holdings.

Prior to the Diamond Baseball Holdings ownership, the Railriders were owned by SWB Yankees LLC, a joint venture between Yankee Global Enterprises and SWB Investors LLC and was previously a joint venture between Yankee Global Enterprises and Mandalay Baseball Properties until Mandalay sold its stake in SWB Yankees LLC to SWB Investors LLC. Yankee Global Enterprises is the owner of the RailRiders' parent club the New York Yankees and SWB Investors LLC was the local ownership group that handled the day-to-day operations of the RailRiders. The joint venture's name comes from the name SWB Yankees, an alternate name that was used by the RailRiders when they were known as the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees to distinguish themselves from their MLB affiliate, the New York Yankees. Yankee Global Enterprises and SWB Investors LLC each owned 50% in the SWB Yankees LLC joint venture, automatically gave each 50% ownership in the RailRiders. SWB Investors LLC's 50% stake in the SWB Yankees LLC joint venture was originally held by Mandalay Baseball Properties. Former MLB pitcher Andy Ashby was one of the team's owner-investors.

title: Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders


text:
Reedy Island

Reedy Island is a small island in the middle of the channel of the Delaware River near its mouth on the Delaware Bay in the U.S. state of Delaware. It is about 1 mi east of Port Penn, Delaware and 5 mi southwest of Salem, New Jersey.

The island was the location of Reedy Island Range Front Light and the Reedy Island Quarantine Station. The Reedy Island Range Rear Light, in nearby Taylors Bridge, is a historic lighthouse first established in 1910. The light is operated by the United States Coast Guard. The nearby keeper's house was destroyed in 2002.

title: Reedy Island


text:
Cicuta virosa

Cicuta virosa, the cowbane or northern water hemlock, is a poisonous species of Cicuta, native to northern and central Europe, northern Asia and northwestern North America.

Description
It is a perennial herbaceous plant which grows up to 1–2 m tall. The stems are smooth, branching, swollen at the base, purple-striped, and hollow except for partitions at the junction of the leaves and stem. In cross section the stems have one flat side and the other sides are rounded. The leaves are alternate, tripinnate, only coarsely toothed, unlike the ferny, lacy leaves found in many other members of the family Apiaceae. The flowers are small, white and clustered in umbrella shaped inflorescences typical of the family. The many flowered umbellets have unequal pedicels that range from 5 to 11 cm long during fruiting. An oily, yellow liquid oozes from cuts to the stems and roots. This liquid has a rank smell resembling that of parsnips or carrots. The plant may be mistaken for parsnip due to its clusters of white tuberous roots.

It grows in wet meadows, along streambanks and other wet and marshy areas.

History
Scholars dispute whether a hemlock of the genus Cicuta or the genus Conium served in ancient Greece as a state poison, administered as a method of capital punishment. The Greek philosopher Socrates drank a cup of some kind of hemlock infusion at his execution in 399 BC. Cicuta virosa is however primarily a northern European species, rare or absent from the Mediterranean region, making its use in Greece unlikely. See Poison hemlock for more information.

The dose of hemlock used for Greek executions was not always immediately fatal, and sometimes it proved necessary to administer a second cup of the poison.

 * ...having drunk all the Hemlock juice, the quantity was found insufficient and the executioner refused to prepare more unless he was paid 12 drachmas.
 * —from an account of the execution of Phocion in 318 BC

Considering the extreme toxicity of Cicuta virosa, this passage provides further evidence that it was not the species of hemlock used.

In the past, this plant has had a number of colorful names, including Mackenzie's water hemlock, Beaver-poison, Children's-bane, Snakeweed and Musquash-poison.

Toxicity

The plant contains cicutoxin, which disrupts the workings of the central nervous system. In humans, cicutoxin rapidly produces symptoms of nausea, emesis and abdominal pain, typically within 60 minutes of ingestion. Poisoning can lead to tremors and seizures. A single bite of the root (which has the highest concentration of cicutoxin) can be sufficient to cause death. In animals the toxic dose and the lethal dose are nearly the same. One gram of water hemlock per kilogram of weight will kill a sheep and 230 grams is sufficient to kill a horse. Due to the rapid onset of symptoms, treatment is usually unsuccessful.

Fossil record
Cicuta virosa fossil fruit halves are described rare in the Pliocene of Europe but common in the Pleistocene interglacial floras of the East European Plain.

title: Cicuta virosa


text:
Syracuse Mets

The Syracuse Mets are a Minor League Baseball team of the International League and the Triple-A affiliate of the New York Mets. They are located in Syracuse, New York, and play their home games at NBT Bank Stadium, which opened in 1997 and has a seating capacity of 10,815. The Mets are named for their major league affiliate and owner, the New York Mets.

Throughout most of its existence, from 1934 to 1996 and again from 2007 to 2018, the team was known as the Syracuse Chiefs, while from 1997 to 2006 it was known as the Syracuse SkyChiefs. The club was rebranded as the Syracuse Mets in October 2018.

Establishment (1934–1957)
The Syracuse Chiefs baseball team was established in 1934, when the Jersey City Skeeters moved to Syracuse and were renamed the Chiefs. The team played in the International League (IL) through 1955. They won five Governors' Cup championships during this stretch, including back-to-back championships in 1942 and 1943. The team was then sold and moved to Miami as the Marlins for the 1956 campaign. Another team known as the Syracuse Chiefs competed in the Class A Eastern League (then two levels below the IL) in 1956 and 1957, but moved to Allentown, Pennsylvania, on July 13, 1957. The Chiefs played at MacArthur Stadium from 1934 to 1996, moving to new then-P&C Stadium (1997–2005) in 1997.

Restart and multiple affiliations (1961–1978)
Syracuse was without professional baseball from 1957 until 1961, when the Montreal Royals franchise was abandoned by its owners (the Los Angeles Dodgers) and relocated to Syracuse as the top affiliate of the Minnesota Twins, becoming the Syracuse Chiefs. After that, the team had affiliations with the New York Mets and Washington Senators (1962), the Detroit Tigers (1963,) and the New York Yankees (1967–1977). Baseball has been played in Syracuse without interruption since the rebirth of the Chiefs in 1961.

Toronto Blue Jays (1978–2008)
From 1978 to 2008, the Chiefs were the Triple-A affiliate of the Toronto Blue Jays. The three-decade Toronto–Syracuse affiliation is the longest of the 11 major league affiliations the team has had since 1936. While the Chiefs reached three Governors Cup finals during this time, many of the players who helped lead the Blue Jays to consecutive World Series titles in 1992 and 1993 passed through Syracuse. In 1994, outfielder Shawn Green hit .344 for the Chiefs, winning the International League batting title and the International League Rookie of the Year Award. The team was renamed the SkyChiefs in 1997 before reverting to simply "Chiefs" in December 2006.

Washington Nationals (2008–2018)
On September 20, 2008, the Chiefs signed a two-year affiliation agreement with the Washington Nationals, ending their relationship with the Blue Jays. That first season, the players wore a decal on their uniforms with the letters "HB" to commemorate Harold Berman, former member of the team's board of directors, who died after the 2007 season. In 2009, the Chiefs wore a decal on their uniforms with the letters "HM" to commemorate Hy Miller, former state assemblyman and former member of the team's board of directors, who died after the 2008 season.

In 2010, the Chiefs celebrated their 50th season of community-owned baseball (1961–2010), wearing 1961 jerseys for every Thursday home game. The team brought back radio announcers from the past, such as Dan Hoard and Syracuse University alumnus Sean McDonough. They had a 76–67 win–loss record, with pitching prospect Stephen Strasburg winning two games and losing one in five appearances.

In 2011, the Chiefs, wore throwback jerseys for every Thursday home game to commemorate the 35th anniversary of their last International League Governors' Cup championship team (managed by Syracuse Wall of Fame member Bobby Cox). The Chiefs added four alternate jerseys to their rotation for the season: one for Latin American Day, a second for Jackie Robinson Day (commemorating Negro league uniforms), a third for national holidays such as Independence Day and Memorial Day, and a fourth for Breast Cancer Awareness Night. The team played the Pawtucket Red Sox on August 20 at Fenway Park as part of a doubleheader in conjunction with the sixth annual Futures at Fenway event, featuring games involving Boston Red Sox minor league teams. The Chiefs, behind starter Brad Meyers, defeated the PawSox 3–1 before more than 29,000 fans. At Alliance Bank Stadium (now NBT Bank Stadium) the Chiefs added a "Home Plate Club" to the stadium: premium seating in the first four rows behind home plate, with waitstaff for merchandise, food and drinks.

On May 14, Chiefs DH Michael Aubrey went four for four, hitting four home runs in an 11–0 victory over the Durham Bulls and becoming the second player in team history to hit four home runs in a game; Gene Locklear was the first, on July 14, 1977. On August 27, Stephen Strasburg pitched his only rehab game for the Chiefs, against the Rochester Red Wings. Giving up two hits in the sixth inning (his only hits allowed before departing, with the Chiefs leading 1–0), he received no decision in Syracuse's 4–3 win. It did, however, clinch the Chiefs' third Thruway Cup victory; the team's other wins were in 1999 and 2010. The club's record for the season was 66–74, 14 games out of first place and fourth place in the six-team North Division.

On April 5, 2012, the Chiefs opened at home against the Rochester Red Wings. Top draft pick Bryce Harper, later that month promoted to the Nationals, made the opening-day roster. Randy Knorr did not return for a second season as manager, and Tony Beasley was promoted from the Harrisburg Senators. The Chiefs played all 16 of their games against the Scranton/Wilkes Barre Yankees at the now renamed Alliance Bank Stadium (2005–2013) due to stadium renovations at the Yankees' ballpark in Moosic, Pennsylvania. On May 7, the Chiefs unveiled a new high-definition video board in left field, replacing the board which had been in place since the stadium's 1997 opening.

The 2013 season, with manager Tony Beasley in his second season with the team, began on April 4 in Allentown, Pennsylvania, against the Lehigh Valley IronPigs; the Chiefs' home opener was eight days later against the IronPigs. On Throwback Thursdays, the team wore jerseys from 1983 to 1996.

On September 30, 2013, it was announced that 16-year general manager John Simone and any family members associated with the team, including assistant GM Mike Vounitas, were fired. On October 8, former Auburn Doubledays general manager Jason Smorol became the Chiefs' GM, with Jason Horbal as his assistant. It was the first time since 1970 that someone not named Simone was general manager of Syracuse; John Simone had taken over the job from his father, Anthony (Tex) Simone, in 1997.

The Chiefs opened their 2014 season on April 3 with a loss at home to the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders and finished the season with the best record (81–62) in the International League, clinching a playoff spot for the first time since 1998 and the first IL North Division title since 1989. NBT Bank Stadium hosted its first ever playoff game on September 5, 2014, a 7–6 loss to the Pawtucket Red Sox which capped off a 3–0 first round series sweep for the Red Sox. The season featured an aggressive promotional campaign, including Social Media Monday, Two-for-One Tickets on Tuesday, Winning Wednesday, Dollar Thursday, Fireworks Friday, Giveaway Saturday, and Family Sunday. The Chiefs sold out the outfield wall, the dugouts, and the field tarp, earning $500,000 in advertising.

Following the 2014 season, the Chiefs would not make the playoffs during the final years of the Nationals' affiliation, including a 54–87 record during the 2017 season, their worst since 1966. Many prospects passed through Syracuse on their way to MLB, including Trea Turner, Lucas Giolito, and Victor Robles. Randy Knorr replaced Gardner Jr. after 4 seasons as Chiefs' manager for the 2018 season, his second stint with the Chiefs.

Syracuse Mets
The chief operating officer of the New York Mets, Jeff Wilpon, joined Governor Andrew Cuomo and Joanie Mahoney, Onondaga County Executive, at NBT Bank Stadium on October 11, 2017, to announce that the Mets would purchase the Chiefs from the Community Baseball Club of Central New York in early 2018. Under the deal, the Chiefs' affiliation with the Washington Nationals continued through the end of the 2018 season, with the Chiefs becoming the Mets' Triple-A affiliate beginning with the 2019 season. The team was rebranded as the Syracuse Mets, adopting the New York Mets' blue, orange, and white color scheme along with new logos and uniforms on October 16, 2018.

The Syracuse Mets started their 2019 inaugural season with one of the most experienced rosters in the minor leagues. Of the 25 players on the roster, 21 of them had previously played in the majors. They had combined for 7,006 total games. The Opening Day roster consisted of veteran outfielders Carlos Gómez and Rajai Davis, former Syracuse Chief Danny Espinosa, catcher René Rivera, and cult-star outfielder Tim Tebow. The Mets played their first game on April 4, against the Pawtucket Red Sox in front of an Opening Day home crowd of 8,823 fans. Syracuse took a 3–2 lead in the bottom of the sixth inning, but Pawtucket tied the game in the top of the eighth. The PawSox scored three more runs in the top of the tenth, defeating the home team, 6–3. The Mets' first win came in game one of a doubleheader on April 6 in which they defeated Pawtucket, 6–3 in 7 innings. In that same first Mets win, with one out in the bottom of the fourth inning, Dilson Herrera hit the Syracuse Mets first home run.

On May 31, 2019, Travis Taijeron hit the first cycle in Syracuse Mets history in a 13–4 win over the PawSox. It was the first in franchise history since 1987. Rubén Tejada also hit for the cycle on June 19, 2019, against the Charlotte Knights. Despite his efforts, the Mets lost 9–7.

At the 2019 All-star break, the Mets were 42–47, good for 5th place in the IL North Division. After August 7, they made up 6.5 games in the standings to put themselves in a share of the division lead with the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders after sweeping a doubleheader versus the Lehigh Valley IronPigs on August 26. They also had a winning season for the first time since 2014. Syracuse went into the final weekend of the 2019 season tied with Scranton/Wilkes-Barre for the division lead. Both teams split both of their respective series' to stay tied for the division lead. The two teams played a one-game tie breaker in order to decide who would win the division, and ultimately make the playoffs. The Mets would lose the one-game tiebreaker by a score of 14–13. Syracuse had led 13–6 going into the bottom of the eighth inning, but Scranton/Wilkes-Barre would come back and score eight runs in the bottom half of the inning to eventually win the game, effectively eliminating the Mets from qualifying for the playoffs.

The 2020 season was cancelled due to the COVID-19 pandemic. In conjunction with Major League Baseball's restructuring of Minor League Baseball in 2021, the Mets were organized into the 20-team Triple-A East. The start of the season was pushed back to May.

Aside from winning on 2021 Opening Day, the Mets got off to a slow start, ending the month of May with an 8–16 record. The struggles continued in the month of June, where they endured a 15-game losing streak from June 6 to June 24. The 2021 regular season will be followed by the Triple-A Final Stretch, a 10-game tournament among all 30 Triple-A clubs, wherein the team with the best winning percentage over that stretch will receive a prize from Major League Baseball.

On August 29, 2021, the Syracuse Mets tied with the Rochester Red Wings to finish a game for the first time in franchise history. With the game tied at 3 in the bottom of the 7th inning, a 40-minute rain delay was in place before the game was called due to the rain. The game was ruled as a tie because the two teams would not play each other again that season.

In 2022, the Triple-A East became known as the International League, the name historically used by the regional circuit prior to the 2021 reorganization.

New York Mets
In October 2017, the New York Mets, headed by then-Mets owner Jeff Wilpon, agreed to purchase the Chiefs for approximately $18 million pending approval by team shareholders. A vote was held on November 17, 2017, in which 88 percent of shareholders voted in favor of selling the team, thus meeting the required two-thirds vote needed for approval. The Mets organization assumed ownership in early 2018.

Community Baseball Club, Inc.
Prior to the Mets' purchase, the franchise was owned by the Community Baseball Club of Central New York, Inc., "a community-owned club, controlled by a [13-person] board of directors,"  acting on behalf of approximately 4,000 shareholders, who together held 15,857 shares from 1961 to 2017.

According to Dick Ryan, a former club chairman of the board and treasurer, a majority of the Community Baseball Club shares were "owned by people who own one or two shares." Shares in the club were first sold in 1961, at a price of $10 each; as of 2011, shares had a resale value of approximately $126, but were not publicly traded. A provision in the Chief's certificate of corporation stated that "no one may vote more than 500 shares." This provision was intended to make it difficult for the club to be sold and moved to another location, as happened earlier in its history.

Management
Officers of the Community Baseball Club of Central New York, Inc., included:

 * Robert F. Julian, Chairman of the Board
 * William Dutch, President
 * Jason Smorol, General Manager

Among those serving on the organization's Board of Directors were Stephen A. Rogers, Chairman, Syracuse Media Group; and Crandall Melvin III, "a software executive from Syracuse and the team's largest single shareholder with 502 shares."

Dutch was a partner in Chiefs First LLC, an investment company established in September 2013, which loaned the Chiefs $500,000 in return for 600 shares and controlled the team's 13-member board.

Finances
The Chiefs operated at a loss from 2006, except for the 2010 season when they ended the season $100,000 in the black. The team lost $973,516 in the 2013 season, on operating expenses of $3.1 million. Under general manager Jason Smorol, their losses were reduced to $241,584 in 2014, and $169,011 in 2015.

Due to the COVID-19 pandemic, the cancelled 2020 Minor League Baseball season, and the delayed start to the 2021 Minor League Baseball season, the Syracuse Mets lost about $5 million, according to general manager Jason Smorol.

NBT Bank Stadium

 * 1999: 446,025
 * 2001: 423,405
 * 1998: 420,488
 * 2010: 416,382
 * 2002: 413,566
 * 2000: 402,450
 * 1997: 400,804
 * 2009: 392,518
 * 2008: 392,028
 * 2005: 382,896
 * 2007: 380,152
 * 2004: 364,648
 * 2003: 356,303
 * 2006: 347,699
 * 2013: 345,047
 * 2019: 327,478
 * 2016: 274,427
 * 2015: 262,408

* Includes playoffs

MacArthur Stadium

 * 1994: 368,971*
 * 1991: 307,922
 * 1995: 300,589
 * 1996: 300,405
 * 1992: 276,786
 * 1993: 265,486
 * 1970: 257,650*
 * 1990: 250,048
 * 1989: 233,161*
 * 1985: 232,073*
 * 1971: 216,115*
 * 1987: 211,315
 * 1964: 208,956*
 * 1975: 201,725*
 * 1977: 200,302
 * 1981: 198,101
 * 1979: 196,228*
 * 1976: 196,121*
 * 1980: 189,250
 * 1986: 187,758
 * 1988: 184,967
 * 1973: 184,461
 * 1982: 184,297
 * 1974: 182,082*
 * 1963: 180,971*
 * 1972: 179,048
 * 1983: 163,859
 * 1978: 160,427
 * 1967: 152,781
 * 1969: 152,201*
 * 1965: 152,072*
 * 1968: 150,295
 * 1984: 142,571
 * 1961: 126,016
 * 1966: 106,669

* Includes playoffs

Top 40 attendance dates since 1961

 * 1) May 7, 2010 (14,098)
 * 2) May 24, 2010 (13,288)
 * 3) July 17, 1993 (13,124)
 * 4) May 29, 2010 (13,115)
 * 5) July 17, 1967 (13,082)
 * 6) July 25, 1967 (13,063)
 * 7) August 17, 1995 (12,711)
 * 8) July 30, 2010 (12,674)
 * 9) June 28, 1995 (12,659)
 * 10) July 4, 2015 (12,526)
 * 11) July 14, 2001 (12,455)
 * 12) June 28, 2001 (12,368)
 * 13) August 17, 1999 (12,344)
 * 14) August 22, 1972 (12,322)
 * 15) August 16, 1961 (12,321)
 * 16) August 14, 2009 (12,288)
 * 17) May 30, 2018 (12,269)
 * 18) July 11, 1998 (12,255)
 * 19) July 23, 1994 (12,224)
 * 20) August 1, 2008 (12,208)
 * 21) July 13, 2001 (12,121)
 * 22) April 3, 1997 (12,112)
 * 23) May 29, 1994 (12,112)
 * 24) July 4, 2019 (12,063)
 * 25) July 4, 2014 (12,045)
 * 26) July 18, 1994 (11,899)
 * 27) July 11, 1994 (11,679)
 * 28) August 20, 1994 (11,485)
 * 29) August 9, 1963 (11,476)
 * 30) August 30, 1994 (11,469)
 * 31) July 10, 1995 (11,455)
 * 32) May 9, 1970 (11,398)
 * 33) June 25, 2002 (11,356)
 * 34) June 29, 2000 (11,295)
 * 35) August 18, 1999 (11,228)
 * 36) June 22, 1999 (11,219)
 * 37) July 13, 1970 (11,144)
 * 38) June 27, 1977 (11,100)
 * 39) May 5, 2006 (11,012)
 * 40) July 16, 1981 (10,835)

Governors' Cup
The Chiefs won the Governors' Cup (the IL championship) 8 times, and played in the championship series 17 times.

 * 1935 – Defeated Montreal, 4–2
 * 1942 – Defeated Jersey City, 4–2
 * 1943 – Defeated Toronto, 4–1
 * 1946 – Lost to Montreal, 4–3
 * 1947 – Defeated Buffalo, 4–1
 * 1948 – Lost to Montreal, 4–0
 * 1951 – Lost to Montreal, 4–3
 * 1954 – Defeated Montreal, 4–2
 * 1964 – Lost to Rochester, 4–1
 * 1969 – Defeated Columbus, 4–1
 * 1970 – Defeated Columbus, 4–1
 * 1974 – Lost to Rochester, 4–3
 * 1975 – Lost to Tidewater, 4–3
 * 1976 – Defeated Richmond, 4–1
 * 1979 – Lost to Columbus, 3–1
 * 1994 – Lost to Richmond, 3–0 (All games aired on ESPN, due to the MLB strike.)

The Chiefs won the International League pennant — finishing the regular season with the best record in the league — eight times.

Junior World Series
The Chiefs played in the Junior World Series five times, winning it once, in 1970 against the Omaha Royals, 4–1.

All-time records
''Note: One playoff series is missing from the original Syracuse Chiefs. It will be added to the records when found.''

Players

 * Richard Bleier
 * A. J. Burnett
 * Robinson Canó
 * Chris Carpenter
 * Kevin Cash
 * Bobby Cox
 * Jacob deGrom
 * Carlos Delgado
 * Tony Fernández
 * Lucas Giolito
 * Shawn Green
 * Carlos Gomez
 * Ron Guidry
 * Roy Halladay
 * Bryce Harper
 * Aaron Hill
 * Matt Kemp
 * Jimmy Key
 * Adam Lind
 * Gene Locklear
 * Fred McGriff
 * Denny McLain
 * Thurman Munson
 * Stu Pederson
 * Anthony Rendon
 * Alex Ríos
 * Víctor Robles
 * Goody Rosen
 * Deion Sanders
 * Hank Sauer
 * Max Scherzer
 * Travis Snider
 * Jhonatan Solano
 * Luis Sojo
 * Ed Sprague Jr.
 * Stephen Strasburg
 * Dave Stieb
 * Tim Tebow
 * Trea Turner
 * David Wells
 * Vernon Wells
 * Jayson Werth

Broadcasters

 * Marv Albert (1962)
 * Hank Greenwald (1962)
 * Greg Papa (1982–83)
 * Sean McDonough (1982–84), current ESPN play-by-play man for Major League Baseball, NCAA Men's Basketball, NCAA Football, and the National Football League
 * Dan Hoard (1985–95), former Cincinnati Reds fill in broadcaster, now voice of the Cincinnati Bengals
 * Ken Levine (1988), film and television writer who also broadcast for the Baltimore Orioles, 1991, Seattle Mariners, 1992–94, 2011–12, San Diego Padres, 1995–1997, Los Angeles Dodgers, 2008–2010
 * Matt Vasgersian (1995)
 * Bob McElligott (2000–2009), radio broadcaster for the Columbus Blue Jackets
 * Jason Benetti (2009–2014), broadcaster for the Chicago White Sox
 * Kevin Brown (2010–2017)
 * Michael Tricarico (2018–Present)
 * Evan Stockton (2022–Present)

Game broadcasts
Locally games are broadcast on the Mets' flagship radio station, WSKO "The Score" 1260 AM, and globally online via SyracuseMets.com. In addition, all games are broadcast on MiLB.TV, an internet video subscription service. Select games were broadcast live on Spectrum Sports, provided on Spectrum Cable services throughout the Central and Northern New York area until Spectrum ceased operations of its sports channels in the state sometime around 2017. The games on Spectrum Sports were called by Steve Grilli, Syracuse Wall of Fame member and former major leaguer. All games against thruway rivals Rochester or Buffalo were broadcast on Spectrum Sports and fed between the cities, with the host city providing the presentation and announcers.

In popular culture
Writer Ken Levine based the Springfield Isotopes minor league team in The Simpsons episode Dancin' Homer on experiences as an announcer for the Syracuse Chiefs. The episode includes references to former announcer Dan Hoard and owner Anthony "Tex" Simone (named Antoine "Tex" O'Hara in the episode).

The Chiefs gained national media attention for a promotion planned for 2014's Tattoo Appreciation Night, where anyone who got a tattoo of their "C" logo would receive free tickets to Chiefs games for life.

title: Syracuse Mets


text:
User talk:Evanherk

Please consider joining the Wikidocs WikiProject Clinical medicine Kd4ttc 03:27, 22 May 2004 (UTC)

Category
Placed category physician on your userpage.--Nomen Nescio 10:24, August 27, 2005 (UTC)

March 2009
Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, adding content without citing a reliable source is not consistent with our policy of verifiability. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. If you are familiar with Citing sources, please take this opportunity to add references to the article. --Ericdn (talk) 21:37, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

I beg your pardon, but I have been a regular contributor for many years with thousands of articles to my name in the Dutch Wikipedia, and am of an age where I watched Klimbim when it was first broadcast. This show was watched weekly by 20 million viewers, about half the viewing population of Germany at the time, and I will thank you not immediately to assume that I do not know what I am talking about. There is nota bene a reference to my addition in the first footnote to the article which refers to her as "the Klimbim star", showing that to a german audfience this is the first thing that leaps to mind, not the marge simpson dubbing. Bart van Herk.

 * 1.) For reasons of style, your edit requires some rewriting. I will do this for you.  2.) All edits require a verifiable source to support information.  Therefore, I will add a "request citation" tag to your edit.  When you are able to provide documented proof for your claim, you may delete the "request citation" tag and replace it with information about the reference. // P.S.: Due to an edit conflict, you added another sentence as I wrote my original post.  I will examine your added source about Klimbim, and, if it fits, I will replace "request citation" with information about that source. --Ericdn (talk) 21:47, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

Dermatology
Do you have an interest in dermatology? If so, I am always looking for more help ;) kilbad (talk) 22:54, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes. But I am not a dermatologist, just a GP with an interest. Bart
 * Well I am looking for some help creating several dermatology stubs. Do you have any interest in that? kilbad (talk) 22:41, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
 * If you give me a stub, I can try to flesh it out a bit. Bart

 * The redlinks I am looking for help with are located under the Epidermal nevi, neoplasms, cysts section in the list of skin-related conditions. All those diseases have been included from a reliable secondary text Andrews' Diseases of the Skin: Clinical Dermatology, and I think most probably deserve their own article (as each will have its own characteristics, incidence, prevalence, treatment, etc.).  If you have any problems finding a particular disease, just pass over it and I can do it later.  Also, if possible, I ask that you discuss any changes you plan on making to the actual list before doing so as I am currently in the process of actively editing it.  Thanks again for your willingness to help! kilbad (talk) 18:25, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Klaas Rusticus

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Wikiversity Journal of Medicine, an open access peer reviewed journal with no charges, invites you to participate
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Did you know about Wikiversity Journal of Medicine? It is an open access, peer reviewed medical journal, with no publication charges. You can find more about it by reading the article on The Signpost featuring this journal.

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title: User talk:Evanherk


text:
Leo II

Leo II (or Leon II) may refer to:

People

 * Leo II (emperor), Byzantine emperor who reigned from January 18 to November 17, 474
 * Pope Leo II, pope from August 682 to July 683
 * Leon II of Abkhazia (767/68–811/12)
 * Leo II (1150–1219), King of Armenia, sometimes referred to as Leo I, King of Armenia or Levon I of Armenia, initially known as Prince Leo II
 * Leo II, King of Armenia (1236–1289), sometimes also referred to as Leo III
 * Leo II of Halych (d. 1323)

Other

 * Leo II (dwarf galaxy), a dwarf galaxy discovered in 1950
 * LEO II (computer), an early commercial programmable computer
 * Leo II (theorem prover), an automated theorem prover
 * Leopard 2, a German battle tank

II. Leo

title: Leo II


text:
Cunedagius

Cunedagius (Latinized form; Cunedda ) was a legendary king of the Britons, as recounted by Geoffrey of Monmouth. He came to power in 850BC.

He was the son of Henwinus, Duke of Cornwall, and Regan, the daughter of King Leir.

Cunedagius, grandson of Leir, despised the rule of his aunt Cordelia. With the help of his cousin Marganus, Cunedagius took over the kingdom from Cordelia and ruled half of it. Following Cordelia's suicide, Cunedagius came to rule the region of Britain southwest of the Humber.

Two years after they split the island, Marganus invaded Cornwall and destroyed much of the land. Cunedagius met him in battle and defeated him. Marganus fled throughout Britain until he was cornered in Wales. Cunedagius killed him and became king of all of Britain. He ruled all of Britain for 33 years and was succeeded by his son Rivallo.

Geoffrey synchronizes Cunedagius' reign with the ministry of the Jewish prophet Isaiah and the founding of Rome by Romulus and Remus. Both events are dated to the 8th century BC.

title: Cunedagius


text:
User talk:Tnewell

Please consider joining the Wikidocs WikiProject Clinical medicine Kd4ttc 03:29, 22 May 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:Tnewell