text:
Talk:Diet soda

"Health risks"

Where it says drinking no soda is healthiest, it makes me wonder why. Diet soda, aside from the caffeine, is pretty much the same as water once it's been drank. So far as I'm aware, caffeine-free diet soda is as healthy and safe as water. Ralphael 21:29, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

Probably more health risks should be added, associated with each non-water ingredient:
 * caffiene : addictive, possibly other health risks ( see Caffeine )
 * aspartame, other artificial sweetener : unknown health effects ( see Sugar substitute )
 * acid : bad for teeth --GodWasAnAlien 03:56, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

 * "Other health risks." "Unknown health effects." The technical term for these items is "making stuff up." Thanks for making your agenda crystal clear. File these under NNPOV. --Darksasami 19:55, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

 * I updated the list above. I was just responding to above poster who said "diet soda is as healthy and safe as water", which is quite an amazing thing to say. --GodWasAnAlien 20:57, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

 * Diet Soda has a ph level of 2.5-4.5 according to this dental page:http://www.mndental.org/classroom/grades_4_6/ . http://www.dentalgentlecare.com/diet_soda.htm shows that diet soda tends to be less acidic than its regular counter parts. That's close to the acidity of Orange Juice. yet, no one is talking about not drinking OJ because of its acidity.

I'm pulling the following statement:

 * During that era, diet sodas accounted for 1.5 percent of the total soda market's share.

It's unclear what it's talking about, and I don't know how to fix it, since some pedestrian research isn't finding me that 1.5% figure. What era? Surely not between 1958 and 1963, when there was only one diet soda available. If someone can fix this wording, feel free to put it back. TreyHarris 08:17, 27 May 2004 (UTC)

 * no study has ever been made to demonstrate percentages related to which people drink these types of sodas

This seems prima facie unreasonable, considering what big business diet beverages are. No study has ever been made of the consumer demographics of a $30B industry? Do you have any citation to back up this claim? I was tempted to just remove it. TreyHarris 09:30, 27 May 2004 (UTC)

I don't think you can

Dear Trey: Interesting questions. I got the tidbid about the 1.5 percent of the total soda market's share at a website, I dont remember which but it must have been cocacola.com or something maybe, because it is a well known fact that Tab was the first diet soda...now, I asked myself, if Tab was the first diet soda, then why did diet sodas already accoubnted for 1.5 percent of sodas? I do admittedly make research on other sites because I want to stick to the facts. That tidbit of info seemed somewhat confusing but I included it because that was part of what I found in my research but youre right, I mean mathematically speaking it doesnt make sense that Tab, the first sugar free soda, entered at a time where 1.5 of all sodas were diet. Then, mwe have to look to see what they defined as diet sodas then, maybe they were low carb, low something but I dont know.. As far as the other statement, I, at least havent heard of any study done on consumers. I guess I assumed that companies and study makers figure these products are only drunk by diabetics and fitness conscious people I dont know.

Thanks for noticing and God bless you! Sincerely yours, ''Antonio suga u up Martin!!

Listing based on corporate parent
I think the change to, for instance, put Mountain Dew under Pepsi is wrong. The Coca-Colas go together, obviously, as do the Pepsis. But unless you're already aware that Mountain Dew is a Pepsi product, you're not going to look under Pepsi. And this list is already larger than will fit in a normal-sized screen, so scanning the entire list isn't easy. The alternative is to break the list out into a "list of" article, with cross-references, so that Mountain Dew can go both under 'M' and under 'P'. Dale Arnett, would you mind reverting your change, or do you disagree with my reasoning here? --TreyHarris 21:20, 4 Jun 2004 (UTC)

 * There's probably a way to organize them to make them easier to read and/or cross reference them. Pegasus1138 Talk 02:09, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Diet vs Lite
Would it be necessary to mention that in America sodas cannot be listed as "lite" due to "lite" being the beer equivalent of "diet"?

Diet Soft Drink
This page should be moved to Diet Soft Drink, with Diet Soda as a redirect. This is a more generic name, and is more dialect-neutral. --68.0.212.218 18:53, 5 August 2006 (UTC) Joe

 * I agree, especially now that the page has been marked as US-centric. Does anyone object to the page move?  Confiteordeo 19:55, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

List vs Table?
Would it make sense to convert the list of drinks per sweetener to a table of drinks that use each sweetener?

It would be similar to this:

... and so on and so forth. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dimwell (talk • contribs) 04:19, 26 February 2007 (UTC).

Stevia
Are there any sodas made with stevia Puddytang 18:41, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, Coke sells a version of their products in Japan using Stevia as a sweetener. The American Food and Drug Administration decided it might be dangerous though, so they banned it's use as a sweetener, although it's been used for several centuries as one.  Many people suspect Monsanto was behind that decision since it coincided with aspartame being approved by the FDA and it could have competed against Nutrasweet.  When Nutrasweet was approved, saccharine was still considered to be a carcinogen even though it was used extensively during WWII when sugar was rationed.  And for the record, Monsanto is absolutely evil - this is a company that sold seeds that would produce crops that wouldn't produce seeds, it bankrupted thousands of poor 3rd world farmers and led to a massive amount of suicides. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.80.56.115 (talk) 10:50, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Flawed Article
I'm removing the statement "While these drinks are often marketed to those who are weight conscious, no published study has shown that drinking diet soda will cause a person to lose weight." This statement is misleading. First of all, there is NO drink out there that CAUSES people to lose weight. The only things that cause people to lose weight are activity and a lack of eating. However, considering that diet soda has less calories (typically zero) than regular soda, the calories are less and this makes weight loss easier for regular soda drinkers.Kakomu 15:07, 28 August 2007 (UTC) I've read the article further and I find most of the findings to be specious. First, there is the flawed test group, where about 60 percent of the people in the study were an abnormal weight (compared to 30% for the national average), and an astounding 70-80% of their test group became overweight by the end of the study. Second, the conclusions they draw appear to confuse causation and correlation. lastly, the sports nutritionist appears to confuse the actual definition of diet. "People often mistake diet drinks for diets, says Bonci, director of sports nutrition at the University of Pittsburgh Medical Center and nutrition consultant to college and professional sports teams and to the Pittsburgh Ballet." Since a diet (in the meaning they intended) is a reduction in caloric intake and an increase in healthier foods, switching from regular soda to diet soda is, in fact, a reduction of caloric intake (all things held the same). I would say that this article should be removed from Wikipedia's article, simply because it is horribly flawed.Kakomu 21:49, 10 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I think you were right in removing that leading sentence,
 * but the reference to the University of Texas study should remain.
 * While the University of Texas study mentioned on WebMD may not be perfect, It does address an important issue: The effectiveness of Diet soda for a diet.
 * As for supposed confusion of causation and correlation,
 * "Fowler is quick to note that a study of this kind does not prove that diet soda causes obesity."
 * Concerning supposed confusion of the diet drinks and diets, well I think the quote is relevant, and I don't see a problem. "People often mistake diet drinks for diets". "Diet" is the sum of consumed food. "Dieting" means regulating food intake or regulating ones diet (sum of consumed food) to achieve some objective. I believe the quote is saying that just drinking diet soda is not exactly regulating ones total diet. I switched to drinking diet soda with my cheeseburgers, but the scale keeps going up....
 * If someone has a reference to a a better article than WebMD on this study, or better study (even one that shows that diet soda actually helps with dieting), that would be helpful to mention. GodWasAnAlien (talk) 08:17, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

For anybody that wants to add this to the chart on the page - diet lipton green tea has aspartame and acesulfame potassium. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Defono47 (talk • contribs) 03:41, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

fragment
"Furthermore, the natural responses to eating sugary foods (eating less at the next meal and using some of the extra calories to warm the body after the sugary meal)."

Not sure what the author intended but the above is not a complete sentence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Reklar (talk • contribs) 22:12, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Soda vs other terms
Why does this article have "soda" in its title? Who decided soda was the term of choice? It's not the title of the soft drink article. I suggest a name change. Shouldn't it be Diet soft drink for consistency reasons?  hmwith  τ   04:04, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Kool-Aid, Lemonade, Fruit Punch, and Shirley Temples are all "soft drinks". A soft drink is just like a hard drink, except no alcohol, hence the word "soft" drink.  Soda is a carbonated beverage, a soft drink is just a beverage that, I believe, is sweet and contains no alcohol.

Health risks
Here is a medical article about the health risks. Should be integrated in the article. MaxPont (talk) 15:14, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

Definition of "Diet"
I have a can of Diet Orange Crush in front of me that contains 5 grams of high fructose corn syrup (25 calories total). So not all sodas labeled "diet" are actually sugar-free. Therefore I'm changing the first sentence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Brancron (talk • contribs) 01:21, 16 August 2009 (UTC) you know i hate you all for ruining the soda name and what its about you bas-terds!!! from:??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.155.216.41 (talk) 16:36, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

why?
why are you ruining the name of the soda? why are you ruinging evrything? why are you so mean? e-mail me why. at lightbit45@yahoo.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.155.216.41 (talk) 16:38, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Health
I made an edit here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diet_soda?diff=327976851 stating that the artificial sweeteners in diet sodas are proven to be unhealthy, which is very true. So, why the heck was it reverted? 98.216.203.117 (talk) 02:57, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
 * If it is true, then you need to specify references and cite the sources which indicate that this is true. Please reference the policy WP:NOR. If you can supply a citation to go along with it, it would be fine to me. Happy editing! --Mpdelbuono (talk) 03:00, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

Health concerns
Aspartame and sucralose are proven to be worse for you than sugar, especially when it comes to diabetics. I have added this information to the article, and I have references for it. --76.119.154.85 (talk) 02:46, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Proven by who? You need better sources than blogspot and some "Doctor's" personal webpage. Until you can find some credible sources, these additions should be outright removed. I only modified the page citing the need for better confirmation. Preferably a genuine study rather than one person's story or a blog. 70.41.204.97 (talk) 11:51, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

"A preliminary abstract presented by the University of Miami's Hannah Gardener linked daily consumption of diet soda to a 61% higher incidence of "vascular events" such as strokes and heart attacks" This presentation was an abstract and not in the form of being published in a peer review journal. The average person does not understand that there is a difference here. Simply stating that "The author stated confirmation was required prior to drawing conclusions" does not provide sufficient balance. There are far too many articles that published this study that did not point out significant facts of the abstract, such as the mean age was 69 years old, and that only 116 out of 2564 participants drank diet soda daily. My entry was removed in favor of "The author stated" line. It leads the reader to think that the study has been properly reviewed and analyzed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Airpain (talk • contribs) 09:48, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually, you understated it. The 116 drank one can or more of diet soda per day at one time point in the 10 year study when they were asked. The findings conflict with prior studies. The caveat you added was pretty good in content (maybe it did not go as far as it should) but was off stylistically. I missed the "action points" box the first time, so the editorialzed-sounding text was sourced. My only remaining problem is now use "preliminary" twice—far from horrid. My inclination is to delete the paragraph for the reasons stated below, but give it a fair discussion. Did you intend to post to this section rather than "The Manhattan study [5]" below? Novangelis (talk) 14:57, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

Re: Health concerns
"Aspartame and sucralose are proven to be worse for you than sugar, especially when it comes to diabetics. I have added this information to the article, and I have references for it. --76.119.154.85 (talk) 02:46, 21 December 2009 (UTC)"

I take serious issue with your "references." The page liked to is not acceptable as a serious reference. It reads of conspiracy, there is nothing to indicate anything to do with science, and it links directly to the "Aspartame Toxicity Center" - notorious for their outlandish claims that Aspartame causes everything from Lupus to Cancer with absolutely nothing to back it up. Statements such as these have no place in the article and can hardly be construed as neutral, unbiased, or factual. The same goes with the reference to Sucralose, which uses a blog called "Splenda Sickness" as its reference. Again, neither factual nor unbiased.

As a result, I am removing the following statement from the article: "Some artificial sweeteners are also linked to even worse health risks, however. Aspartame is linked to some very bad health problems. It is proven to add formaldehyde to the consumer's body. Too much formaldehyde leads to methanol poisoning, which can lead to death. In addition, it is actually worse for diabetics than sugar. It can cause them to go into convulsions and can also damage their optic nerve.[7] Sucralose has also caused many bad side effects in many people.[8]"

96.49.137.132 (talk) 06:29, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

 * Do you really think that hundreds of people would lie about Splenda? If so many people say that it gave them side effects, they can't all be lying, don't you think? 76.119.154.85 (talk) 22:54, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

 * I don't think that hundreds of people would lie about Splenda. I do think that hundreds of people might draw the wrong conclusions based on only anecdotal evidence.  "Hundreds of people" can be found who believe a lot of weird things. 60.32.77.130 (talk) 05:56, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

 * Went to undo 96.49.137.132's re-insertion of biased and unsupported claims and found note not to remove until discussion on talk page is over. Since the reference is akin to a conspiracy theory site, I will be removing the passage in question UNTIL 96.49.137.132 can cite a proper reference for these claims. 60.32.77.130 (talk) 06:01, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

 * Listen. I personally used to be a huge Diet Coke addict. Whenever I drank it, I got an extreme migraine and really bad back pain. I'm not alone here, either. There are tons of other people who have had the same things happen to them. And those people did not draw the wrong conclusions about Splenda. Some of them specifically stated that when they tried to stop their symptoms, they removed several things from their lives, but until they stopped using Splenda, they still had horrible things happening to them. Not a coincidence. 76.119.154.85 (talk) 16:45, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

 * Sure but try to understand that "a lot of people say", "I had a personal experience" etc., don't count when you're talking about science. If there's a published study about this issue, then fine, but otherwise, it's not reliable information.  Removing it again. 118.152.79.97 (talk) 08:05, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

 * Search for "aspartame poison" and "aspartame bad for diabetics" on Google and you'll find out that I'm not lying about it. 76.127.217.214 (talk) 18:07, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

 * Whether or not you had a bad experience that you believe was caused by aspartame is not in question. Your personal experience cannot be taken as proof on any scientific basis. A study must be conducted on humans of differing conditions for a lengthy period of time with regulated doses in order to be a proper source. "I said", "He said", "She said" doesn't cut it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.186.26.1 (talk) 16:24, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

It seriously makes me wanna cry that people are dying from this stuff and we're not doing anything to prevent it. Wikipedia is meant to be a reliable of information that people need to know. It's a fact that people have died from Aspartame, but if we don't have the information in the article, people won't know about its dangers. It really has killed many people and made many others suffer. If the information was in the article, that would be preventable. But I am seriously going to cry if the information gets removed again. You guys don't really want to deprive people of safety information that they need to know, do you? Only cruel people would do that. 76.127.217.214 (talk) 05:24, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

 * Sigh... This is growing tiresome. You appear to have difficulty with the notion of what an appropriate source is.  I'll quote directly from the blurb at the bottom of Wikipedia's page: "Encyclopedic content must be verifiable".  Please take it upon yourself to learn the rules and what is acceptable content and what is not. Whether you have a particular personal opinion on this simply does not enter into it.  And I'm sorry if that makes you cry.  96.49.137.132 (talk) 03:52, 18 February 2010 (UTC)
 * This stuff is not some kind of joke! This is serious! These horrible sweeteners are killing people! If we had information here about how dangerous they are, less people would die from them! But you guys are depriving people of important information they need to know! 76.127.217.214 (talk) 17:51, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Look, Wikipedia is not a news site. We're not here to alert the population about new unproven health risks. Once there's verifiable coverage of this by reliable sources then it will merit inclusion. I also take issue with the way you're phrasing your inclusions so decisively. Not even scientific and medical papers are that certain with this sort of thing. It's one thing to say "smoking cigarettes might lead to lung cancer and other health issues", but that doesn't happen to everyone who smokes. I urge you to please read WP:RS and WP:V before attempting to add this back into the article. If you add it again with no reliable sources, I will report you for edit warring. X X X antiuser eh? 19:08, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * So you think it's good that these sweeteners are killing people?! 76.127.217.214 (talk) 19:28, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * There is no proof that they are, or that they aren't. It's all speculative and that does not belong on Wikipedia. If it's ever proven that Aspartame or Sucralose cause the effects you and your dubious sources claim they do, the media will be all over it. Find me a peer-reviewed scientific journal or a report by a major media outlet that says someone conclusively died because of sweetener ingestion and I will add it to the article myself. X X X antiuser eh? 19:35, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * There's ton of websites about how dangerous they are. And I nearly died of a brain tumor from Aspartame, as well. 76.127.217.214 (talk) 19:43, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

There's also a ton of websites about how Elvis is still alive or how 9/11 was an inside job or how man never landed on the moon. That doesn't make any of those allegations real. X X X antiuser eh? 19:48, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, like I said, I nearly died of a brain tumor from Aspartame, and seeing as how there are some websites that say that Aspartame causes brain tumors, they're not lying. 76.127.217.214 (talk) 20:23, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm glad you're still with us. But how do you know your tumour was caused by Aspartame? What basis did your doctor have to diagnose it as such? If they are referencing a journal you might want to ask them for its doi. That would be a valid ref. X X X antiuser eh? 21:11, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, basically, here's my story.

 * 1) I first had Diet Dr Pepper in 1996 when I was 4 years old, and OMG! I loved it so much!
 * 2) I drank it a few times between then and my 8th birthday.
 * 3) The day of my 8th birthday was when I started drinking it everyday.
 * 4) By my 12th birthday, I was drinking several cans of it a day, rather than just 1 can per day.
 * 5) One day in July 2009 (when I was 17), I suddenly had a seizure and at the hospital, they discovered the tumor.
 * 6) I had an operation to have the tumor removed, and it was 100% successful.
 * So, shortly afterwards, me and some of the doctors at the hospital wanted to discover what caused the tumor. When we were going over what my habits were prior to the tumor, I told them I drank several cans of Diet Dr Pepper everyday.
 * 1) Then, they told me that it was likely that the Aspartame from the Diet Dr Pepper caused the tumor. They also said I was very lucky that the operation was successful and especially that the tumor was able to be operated on. Most brain tumors caused by Aspartame can't be operated on.

I have not drank Diet Dr Pepper since then. Prior to getting the tumor, my hair was also falling out and my legs and arms would also go numb at random times. Those are also things that Aspartame can do. 76.127.217.214 (talk) 22:06, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I hate that this happened to you, but it proves nothing. Cancer is caused by a mutation in the DNA of your cells. It could be exposure to some outside stimulant or it could just... have mutated (evolved). You could be genetically predisposed. Not to be blunt, but it's far more likely you should blame your parents than diet soda. 96.37.240.48 (talk) 23:14, 17 February 2013 (UTC)

Also, if you search for "diet soda" on Google, the first 2 results are pages about how bad Aspartame is. 76.127.217.214 (talk) 22:29, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Claimed personal experiences are original research, and not a viable basis for content additions. Remember, the threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth — what counts is whether readers can verify that material added to Wikipedia has already been published by a reliable sources, not whether editors think it is true. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 22:39, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * EDIT CONFLICT I find your story hard to believe, but I'm going to assume good faith and just walk away from this discussion. X X X antiuser eh? 22:41, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Unless you can provide reliable references to back this up, this is seen as original research, which is forbidden here. I could always say that I use Splenda all the time and I've never had a migraine. That would effectively cancel out your claims, and the article would be none the better. Therefore, we don't accept claims without some reliable source that can back it up. - Tbsdy (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) talk 04:55, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Search for "diet soda" on Google. You will be AMAZED at how many of the results are about how bad it is. And that's on the first page ALONE. 76.127.217.214 (talk) 01:15, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

 * Aspartame and sucralose are causing global warming, AIDs, and America to be the fattest country in the world. If you disagree with me you are ignorant and have no sources. Michael J. Fox does not have Parkinson's disease, he just drinks too much Diet Coke. Also, Chuck Norris would never drink Aspartame and sucralose because he shits excellence. STOP FEEDING THE TROLLS. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.86.230.202 (talk) 21:41, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

The Manhattan study [5]
The Manhattan that's been reported in the press, and is linked to reference [5] refers to the International Stroke Conference. There's no mention of this study in the the actual abstracts from that conference, only the related study that was reported as well (salt intake vs stroke risk) (page 50).

Was the soda article even printed somewhere? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.234.197.105 (talk) 00:11, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

 * The abstract can be found here. This is problematic material, but highly topical (by definitions, favorable and unfavorable). It's inclusion runs into problems with WP:MEDRS and Recentism. I would love to find a reliably sourced evaluation of press coverage that allows discussion of the coverage without overly focusing on the content of a preliminary report. So far, all I have seen is blogs. I took the liberty of rewriting it with less of a statement/editorial caveat format.Novangelis (talk) 19:10, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Fair use candidate from Commons: File:Soft Drink.svg
The file File:Soft Drink.svg, used on this page, has been deleted from Wikimedia Commons and re-uploaded at File:Soft Drink.svg. It should be reviewed to determine if it is compliant with this project's non-free content policy, or else should be deleted and removed from this page. If no action is taken, it will be deleted after 7 days. Commons fair use upload bot (talk) 21:23, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

Fair use candidate from Commons: File:Soft Drink.svg
The file File:Soft Drink.svg, used on this page, has been deleted from Wikimedia Commons and re-uploaded at File:Soft Drink.svg. It should be reviewed to determine if it is compliant with this project's non-free content policy, or else should be deleted and removed from this page. If no action is taken, it will be deleted after 7 days. Commons fair use upload bot (talk) 21:37, 27 May 2014 (UTC) read the article why diet soda bad for you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.169.172.225 (talk) 15:17, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

== Coke Zero and Sucralose

The "Amount of artificial sweeteners in diet soft drinks" chart list sucralose content in Coke Zero https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diet_drink#Amount_of_artificial_sweeteners_in_diet_soft_drinks however, it doesn't appear on any of the ingredient lists on Coke Zero labels or on Coca Cola's website. This is true both for the old Coke Zero formulation and the current Coke Zero Sugar. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kool kitty89 (talk • contribs) 00:21, 30 June 2018 (UTC)

Old Tang containers glass
I would like to know if you still manufacture them if so I would like to buy one. Will send picture if necessary Brendacollis (talk) 14:41, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

The table for aspartame count etc doesn't match the citations
I have no idea how to actually fix this, so if someone wants to make those match that'd be stellar. 98.184.236.185 (talk) 19:52, 15 November 2020 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Research Process and Methodology - SP23 - Sect 201 - Thu
— Assignment last updated by StellaQuan441 (talk) 01:44, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Diet soda


text:
Talk:Marathi language

Don't know where to put this: 404 error coming on footnote 8
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marathi_language#cite_note-8

"Abstract of Language Strength in India: 2001 Census". Censusindia.gov.in. Retrieved 2013-05-09.

On the referenced website, I see a sub section called linguistic survey of India but I don't see what the footnote seems to verify, namely the breakdown of how many people speak the various languages in India. If I search 'language strength' I am taken to this section also. http://www.censusindia.gov.in/2011-documents/lsi/ling_survey_india.html

I apologize if this isn't the right place to bring this up. I never have contributed before.

Quillman (talk) 23:17, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Request for Comment: Konkani Section
This is a dispute regarding the Konkani section. The disagreement is about how the section should be worded. Refer to section " Why the Sahitya Akademi verdict should be put in the Konkani section" for details of previous discussion. 07:14, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

 * It is more than a month since this RFC has been put up. Since no one is interested in discussing it, I feel I am justified in reincluding the line I had put up. --Deepak D'Souza (talk • contribs) 11:48, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

 * The controversial remarks were edited out and the present contents are full-proof. I request Deepak to not speak on behalf of all Konkanis. I am myself a Konkani and like lakhs of Konkanis in Maharashtra,we do think it is Marathi's dialect.The contents are balanced. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 59.95.29.38 (talk) 05:00, 18 April 2007 (UTC).

 * Struck out Sarvabhaum IP. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 07:24, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

 * Why do I get the feeling that this anonymous chap may be User:Maharashtraexpress???. Anyway . I have waited long enough for this RFC. All this time you weren't interested in discussing it, and nobody else was. Now that I have changed the content you come along and demand that you have your way. Now you claim that you are a Konkani to justify a biased line. Doesn't fool anyone. --Deepak D'Souza (talk • contribs) 05:54, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
 * One more thing, even if you are Konkani as you claim, please read this : WP:CAI. --Deepak D'Souza (talk • contribs) 06:24, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Sharad Raghav Rane
Sharad Raghav Rane has been nominated for deletion. I think we need to ask some Marathi speakers about his notability. Ventifax 07:44, 1 April 2007 (UTC) (see also list of India-related deletions)

what about the influence of kannada on Marathi ??

--

The deplorable attempt to change Marathi "la" with Hindi "La"Bold text

On one hand the text tells about how marathi is different in certain ways than Hindi and then goes on to use Hindi "la" all throughout the text. This can be easily seen by comparing the "la" in The main text with the text in the green colour roadsign board shown as an example of Marathi. There has been a deliberate attempt to wipe out Marathi "la" and replacing it with hindi style "la" even in the text books produced by Maharashtra Government's Pathya Pustak Mandal (BalBharati). A poor defence is that font/typeface for Marathi "la" is not available. That is just a way of covering up lethargy that has set-in among the language experts. Dr. Hemant Datye, Pune By SAURABH.L  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.79.179.99 (talk) 14:26, 26 June 2011 (UTC) --

Wrong use of chandrabindi
In the following content: "There are two more vowels in Marathi to denote the pronunciations of English words such as of 'a' in act and 'a' in all. These are written as 'अँ' and 'आँ'. The IPA signs for these are /æ/ and /ɔ/, respectively." अँ and आँ have a chandrabindi and not a ardhachandra (which is correct). The pronounication of these symbols in marathi would be with a nasal sound for example chandrabindi would be used to write 'Bank' in devnagari while ardhachandra should be written to write 'Back' in devanagari. I hope I have explained it without confusing further. I did not know how to change it in Devnagari so thought I would leave a note. --Kaveri 18:22, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

New articles of Marathi grammar and Marathi phonology are created as they are occupying considerable space here and they deserve seperate articles.(Stateofart 13:00, 18 October 2007 (UTC))

Corrected. But because there is no widely accepted way to write अॅ in Unicode (the way suggested by Unicode, U+0972 ॲ, yet hasn't gained enough support from fonts), some readers may see it not rendered properly. Here I use the sequence <U+0905, U+0945>, which is rendered properly under Mac OS X, but may not be so under Windows or Linux. But it is the most resonable ad hoc solution for this letter. 梁海 (talk) 12:13, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

GA Review?
How about nominating this article for Good Article ? - Swapnil —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slimmer Eric Cartman (talk • contribs) 11:09, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Marathi is product of the Pali language
Dear Friends, It's purposely being propagated that the Marathi is product of the Prakrit. This is not 100% true.

Marathi is the product of the Pali language and the script modi is outcome of the Pali script made complex so that common people will not easily understand it.

If you study Pali language you will find that the most of the Marathi words are derived of this language. If we say that Marathi is product of the Pali, then people will start study of the Pali as mother language of Marathi. This way all the Buddhist literature will be easily understood by them. This was the fear in the minds of the brilliant Brahmins so when saying that Marathi is product of Prakrit they tried to take common people away from Pali; and thus putting a common man away from the reach teaching of the Buddhism.

I am not spreading Buddhism here. I am not Buddhist. But when I started studying (with curiosity to understand meditation)the pali literature of Theravada I found that this language is very close to the Marathi that is being spoke in village areas. The Puneri Marathi is basically rich with Sanskrit.

Why pure marathi is being propagated in the world? Just again to make difference in common public. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.54.41.53 (talk) 06:12, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

 * Hi, welcome to Wikipedia!. Please understand that Wikipedia has some rules. One of them is that the talk page is to discuss the "article" and not the subject of the article itself. Another rule is that we need reliable references. Do you have any scholarly references that say that Marathi has emerged from Pali. Please let us know the names of the books (or online sources if there are any) so that we can discuss this issue further. --Deepak D'Souza 17:51, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

 * Pali language is a special case of Sanskrit+Prakrit language. Prakrit language was the language of people as opposed to Sanskrit which was used to write spiritual texts. Over a great history of Indian languages, Prakrit diverged into 3 main streams Sauraseni, Magadhi, and Maharashtri. please consider reading main article on Prakrit.--Onef9day (talk) 18:57, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

This is in reference to above mentioned statement that "Marathi is product of Pali Language"The word Maharashtra has derived from Sanskrit word Maharashtri. The Sanskrit name of marathi language is Maharashtri. The process of marathi language is as follow Sanskrit---Prakrit---Apabhamshi---ShauryaseniMagadhiMarathi This language does not belongs to PALI — Preceding unsigned comment added by 112.79.176.20 (talk) 12:17, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

About Shravanabelagola inscription
Chavundaraje karaviyale ,gangaraje suttale karaviyale

it can be transliterated to modern Marathi as:

Chamundarajane kele ani gangarajane te sagalikade karun ghetle

and not as : chamundaraja got it done the son of gangaraja!

Nijgoykar (talk) 07:24, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Maharashtra
There is dispute on Talk:Maharashtra about the definition of standard Marathi language. It affects Marathi (lead), Maharashtra and Pune articles. Please help to form a consensus by giving your valuable comments. A request is also put at Requests_for_comment/All. Thanks. -- Redtigerxyz Talk 05:34, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Marathi Language agitation?
Should the agitation by Raj Thackeray about Marathi sign boards & Marathi call-centers be included in this article? I think they should be coz i guess this would be the only language for which such agitation was made. It being controversial, i am asking views here. -Animeshkulkarni (talk) 18:17, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

About the loanwords!
Marathi,and for the matter even Konakni तूप is not a Kannada loanword moreover it comes Prakrit तऊप,Sanskrit version of which is तनुनुप which means clarified butter,and the kananda word tuppa is a Prakrit loanword into Kannada.so is the case with bega,coming form Sanskit word वेग. Though there are hundreds of common verbs in Marathi and Kannada,it does not mean that they are derived from Kannada,all it means that the verbs have same Dravidian roots!

who gave this theory..it could be kannada word found in prakrit or what is the proof that tuppa was in prakrit..similarly both bega and vega words exist in kannada..if the words found in marathi is same as kannada most likely marathi has loaned words from kannada barring exact sanskrit words..

Can you check number of kannada inscriptions and kannada names in maharasthra from your history books...

Nijgoykar (talk) 04:53, 25 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanjavur Marathi
I speak Thanjavur Marathi. In the illustration section of the article on Thanjavur Marathi, I have put some sentences both in my mother tongue and Puneri marathi. For those who can read/write it well, please correct the Puneri marathi parts, without editing the Thanjavur Marathi parts, as my Puneri marathi may not be as good as yours. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.192.128.91 (talk) 15:58, 5 August 2012 (UTC)

10^
In the section “Vocabulary” # “Counting”, it lists powers of ten, but the higher powers are hard to read because of the profusion of zeros. please, someone change them (everything 104 and greater, I recommend) to scientific notation ( “10N”; “1 × 10N” is clutter; two unnecessary characters). --Solomonfromfinland (talk) 09:56, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

dil
dil dosti — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.179.156.50 (talk) 09:37, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

Call for volunteering to report bugs for VisualEditor + Universal Language Selector input: Marathi and Hindi
Hello,

While technically unicode input has been enabled in VisualEditor,It is long way to practically usable for indic languages.Since most developers would not be using Universal Language Selector input methods and would not be knowing indic languages such as Marathi and Hindi it would be defficult for them to understand problem areas.

Only few people doing effort is not enough.We need more volunteering specially indic people on english wikipedia atleast know what is Visual Editor by now.Please do take a lead to test Universale language input methods for indic languages in VE environment.Please report problems at VisualEditor/Feedback.For a while please do keep aside your individual aprehensions about Visual Editor and come forward to report problems. Your lead will benefit indic wikipedias.

Thanks in advance.

Mahitgar (talk) 07:36, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

TRAIT
TRAIT — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.219.241.85 (talk) 13:24, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

I don't know true history but marathi is language of Maharashtra and India. So we should not discriminate. We all are unite. Wikibhushan (talk) 16:17, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

Marathi language materials
https://archive.org/details/compendiumofmole00mole

https://archive.org/details/dictionaryenglis00molerich

https://archive.org/details/agrammarmahratt00ballgoog

https://archive.org/details/grammarofmarathi00belluoft

https://archive.org/details/agrammarmahratt00caregoog

https://archive.org/details/agrammarmahratt01caregoog

https://archive.org/details/grammaticaltreat00wilb

https://archive.org/details/principlesofmura00stevrich

https://archive.org/details/marathigujarati00brit

https://archive.org/details/catalogueofmara00brit

https://archive.org/details/cataloguemarath01blumgoog

https://archive.org/details/supplcatalogueof00brituoft

https://archive.org/details/catalogueofmarat00brituoft

https://archive.org/details/catalogueofmarat1915brit

https://archive.org/details/sukabahattaridie00sukauoft

https://archive.org/details/sukasap00suka

Rajmaan (talk) 23:42, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Assistance, please
The article on the new film Sata Lota Pan Sagla Khota could use help with sourcing. Thanks.  Schmidt,  Michael Q. 03:16, 15 November 2014 (UTC)

Incorrect color
Incorrect color on the legend of the infobox. It says light blue but it displays white. Can somebody fix this please. 37.210.60.174 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 06:20, 2 August 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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language of big heart
It's not just a language it's a pride. It's a feeling. You get tears of joy when you heard that language. I love it. Wikibhushan (talk) 16:12, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

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1. राज्य सरकारी कर्मचारी मध्यवर्ती संघटना, महाराष्ट्र राज्य महत्त्वाच्या बाबी.
राज्य सरकारी कर्मचारी यांचे प्रश्न साेडवणारी महत्त्वाची संघटना म्हणून महाराष्ट्रभर नावलौकिक आहे, प्रत्येक जिल्ह्य़ात संघटनेचे जाळे पसरले आहे. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Santosh A. Ambatkar Union Leader (talk • contribs) 13:41, 8 October 2017 (UTC)

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Use of Modi script in the Title.
Previously Marathi was also written in Modi script.Modi should be used in this article. SPJ5Mr (talk) 13:28, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

Date of Marathi literature
According to the text, the "Encyclopædia Britannica 2007 Ultimate Reference Suite" supports that "The language has some of the oldest literature of all modern Indian languages, dating from around 600 AD." I don't have access to this source (I presume it's a print publication) so I can't validate this statement, but it is not reflected in the version of the article in the online Britannica which doesn't mention Marathi at all. The online article "Marathi literature" however contradicts it, stating Marathi literature dates to about 1000 CE. Hairy Dude (talk) 13:51, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

Vowel missing
Marathi has one more vowel - ऌ found only in one word - कॢप्ति. The word is not in much use, however, it does exist in grammar books. ऌ is pronounced the same as लृ. Arnav Bhate (talk) 06:01, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Maharashtri Prakrit is derived from Sanskrit
Why is everyone implementing incorrect informations in The Marathi Language Page? All the Prakrit languages were derived from Vedic Sanskrit and it has been universally accepted... Go and check the 'Prakrit and Hindi Languages Wikipedi' and you'll see those languages having 'Vedic Sanskrit' as their ancestor. so why can't Vedic Sanskrit be ancestor to Marathi also? Arkam Knight (talk) 08:40, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * See your talk page. Marathi is indeed derived from Sanskrit, but it is probably not derived from attested Vedic. 2601:642:4780:6B0:4909:4440:CB55:AFEE (talk) 17:32, 13 March 2022 (UTC)

 * So is it accurate to place "Sanskrit" as the ancestor of "Marathi" language in this page? not "Vedic Sanskrit", I said "Sanskrit". Arkam Knight (talk) 18:41, 13 March 2022 (UTC)

Marathi as a classical language in India..
Hello! I always wondered, that what are the requirements for a particular language to gain "classical language" title in India? cuz "Marathi" has been qualified for the status of classical language I guess, it has a history of at least 2300 years, it's even in its modern form is much more pure, it has it's own script "Modi Script" as well.. So why doesn't the Indian Government grant Marathi the status of "Classical Language" ? Arkam Knight (talk) 04:15, 14 March 2022 (UTC)

Marathi bhasha ki lipi
Marathi bhasha ki lipi 2409:4081:830A:A6F:0:0:2A87:70A4 (talk) 06:43, 11 September 2022 (UTC)

Hindi
Marathi 106.193.238.234 (talk) 13:45, 5 November 2022 (UTC)

Are these grammatical features really so unusual?
In the grammar section, it is noted that "unusually" Marathi uses participle forms which resemble those of Dravidian languages, and has an "inclusive we" distinction. However these statements are as true of Punjabi, Hindustani, Gujarati, Sindhi and others as they are of Marathi and it may perhaps be the case that they are properties most Indo-Aryan languages have in common with each other and not ones peculiar to Marathi. Part of the theory behind "India as a linguistic area" holds that these shared traits are areal features observable in most languages of the subcontinent, just like we see retroflex consonants available in languages as distant as Pashto and Tamil. I do not know enough about Marathi to reword this properly but this could use some review (John Beames's comparative grammar would come in handy here). عُثمان (talk) 04:03, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Marathi language


text:
Caraga, Davao Oriental

Caraga, officially the Municipality of Caraga (Lungsod sa Caraga; Bayan ng Caraga), is a 1st class municipality in the province of Davao Oriental, Philippines. According to the 2020 census, it has a population of 39,704 people. It is one of the oldest settlements in the island of Mindanao.

The Pusan Point located in the town of Caraga is geographically the easternmost point of the Philippines.

History
The official founding of Caraga as a municipality was in October 29, 1903, under Organic Act 21, making it one of the oldest towns of the province of Davao Oriental. As early as 1591 Caraga was already listed as a mission registered under the jurisdiction of Encomienda of Bislig.

The etymology of the word “Caraga” is named after the Kalagan people (Spanish "Caragan"), a Mansakan subgroup (related to Visayans) native to the regions of Davao and parts of Caraga who speak the Kalagan languages. The name itself is from kalagan (literally "[strong] spirited") which means "fierce" or "brave"; from kalag ("spirit" or "soul") in the native animistic anito religions.

Hence, the whole Provincia de Caraga of 1622 was called "region de gente animosa", that is "region of spirited men". This being "spirited men and women" is grounded on its cultural, religious and political background. With culture, Caragans were spirited in view of their closeness to nature and attitude towards the creation. With religiosity, Caragans were spirited as to their belief on the spirits of nature (like the trees "balete tree", the rivers and mountains, sun and moon); in fact, they have "anito worship" and "ancestor worship" led by the dancing priestess (balyan) and the singing priestess (catalunan). With primitive politics, Caragans were spirited as they invited a "bagani system" of governance. A "bagani" is like a "warrior" kinglet or datu" who ruled by banditry and by occupation.

Geography
The municipality is located 254 km from Davao City, the regional center of Region XI, and 84 km from Mati, the capital town of the province of Davao Oriental on the island of Mindanao. It lies along the eastern coast of this province, facing the Pacific Ocean. It is bounded in the north by the Municipality of Baganga in the south by the municipality of Manay, in the west by the Municipality of New Bataan, Compostela Valley Province, and on the east by the Pacific Ocean. Pusan point of Barangay Santiago is the easternmost point of the Philippines.

Caraga coastline is irregular and the municipality is traversed by the two rivers: Caraga River in the south and Manurigao River in the north.

Land area
Caraga has a total land area 64270 ha, representing 12.45% of the total land area of the Province of Davao Oriental, and seventeen (17) barangays. Barangay Pichon occupies the largest land area with 16300 ha which are 25.35% of the total land area of the municipality. Barangay D.L Balante, which is located in the south-west of Barangay Poblacion, is the smallest barangay with a land area of 975 ha or 1.51% of the total land area of this municipality.

Barangays
Caraga is politically subdivided into 17 barangays. Each barangay consists of puroks while some have sitios.

• Alvar

• Caningag

• Don Leon Balante

• Lamiawan

• Manorigao

• Mercedes

• Palma Gil

• Pichon

• Poblacion

• San Antonio

• San Jose

• San Luis

• San Miguel

• San Pedro

• Santa Fe

• Santiago

• P.M. Sobrecarey

Climate
Caraga has a tropical rainforest climate (Af) with very heavy rainfall from December to February and moderate to heavy rainfall in the remaining months.

Demographics
Based on the 2010 census, the Municipality has a total population of 36,912 people, or about 7.1% of the total population of the province.

Of the 17 barangays comprising the municipality, Pichon has the highest population of 5,188 or 14.1% of the municipality's population. Barangay Poblacion is the second population barangay at 4,710 equivalent to 12.8% of the total population and this is closely followed by Barangay Sobrecarey which has a population of 4,544 or 12.3% of the population of Caraga.

Barangay Alvar is the least populated barangay contributing only 1.7% or 627 persons to the total populations. It is followed by Barangay San Miguel, which has 833 people, and Barangay D.L. Balante which has population of 834 or 2.3% of the entire population.

Language
Household population by mother tongue (based on 1990 participation rate):
 * Cebuano – 30%
 * Hiligaynon  -   .22%
 * Bagobo  -         .032%
 * Bilaan       -      .35%
 * Butanon  -    .17%
 * Davaweño – 93.45%
 * Mandaya – 99%
 * Yakan        -   .14%
 * Not stated  - .51%

Economy
Coconut products are the inhabitants main source of income aside from some lucrative business. It has a number of eco-tourism resources like the Caraga Lagoon, San Luis Beach, Pusan Point, and some historical heritage like the San Salvador Church Bell from 1802, and the Caraga Fortification with 80 ft high stone-built walls.

The municipality of Caraga has sixteen (16) wholesale trade establishment which are mostly involved in the buy and sell agricultural products. Four of these establishment are found in Barangay Poblacion while the rest are found in other Barangays. Retail establishment, which includes repair/welding shops, dormitory, lodging houses, cable television, telephone services providers, total to 23, most of which are found in the Poblacion.

The present industries thriving in the locality are the agriculture based, presently there are nine rice /corn mills found in Barangay San Luis, San Antonio, Poblacion, San Pedro, San Jose, and P.M Sobrecarey. There are also one furniture shop in the poblacion and one handicraft industry making dagmay novelties.

Tourism
Scenic spots:
 * Jubilee Cross, Pusan Point – a 16 ft Jubilee cross made of cement and sand meant as a landmark of Millennium Sunrise event ushering the historic great Jubilee Year 2000 celebration located at Barangay Santiago, Caraga, Davao Oriental, First Light First Sight.
 * Santiago Cave – a 6 m2 cave near the shoreline before reaching Pusan Point, with century-old human fossils with lengths beyond the standard measure of a native Filipino fossils.
 * Old Church and Convento – a century-old building of San Salvador Parish, which served as the central mission station of the Spanish missionaries, it is made of Tisa out of the processed shells from the seashores of Caraga, the convento ground floor served as a temporary prison cell sometimes during the Spanish occupation.
 * Parish Development Center – a T-shaped building within hectare land area of the San Salvador Parish of Caraga which serves as the center for seminars, retreats, and conference overlooking the Pusan Point from the Southeast Pacific Coast.
 * Tourism Complex – a 3-story building meant to house the Davao Oriental Historical Museum and some historical Artifacts w / utmost significance to the Mandayan Cultural customs and traditions.
 * Bango Beach Resort
 * Kapuka Falls in Lamiawan
 * Oguad Falls in Lamiawan
 * Sungkuan Falls in P.M. Sobrecarey
 * Kiti-kiti Falls in Pichon
 * Bawgo Beach in Poblacion, Bawgo
 * Friar's Beach (LIKSIM) Beach Resort in Poblacion
 * Sunrise at Pusan Point, Barangay Santiago
 * Crystal Cave in Santiago
 * Philippine Eagle's Nest at Maglahus, P.M. Sobrecarey

Transportation
The Davao Oriental–Surigao Coastal Highway passes through the municipality mostly along the coastal area with a total stretch of 33.462 km. Provincial Roads which branch out from the National Road to the barangays of P.M Sobrecarey and San Pedro amount to 32.079 km. The Municipal Roads which are located in the Urban center of Poblacion have a total stretch of 4.968 km, 1.316 km of which are cemented and the remaining 3.652 km are mostly all weather graveled roads.

The municipal has 14 bridges. 4 of these bridges are reinforced concrete, located along the national Road.

title: Caraga, Davao Oriental


text:
Resurgam

Resurgam (Latin: "I shall rise again") is an early submarine from the Victorian era and its prototype, designed and built in Britain by Reverend George Garrett. She was intended as a weapon to penetrate the chain netting placed around ship hulls to defend against attack by torpedo vessels.

Resurgam I
The first Resurgam, built in 1878, was a 14 ft (5 m), hand-powered, one-man vessel nicknamed "the curate's egg" because of her shape. She was a one-third size prototype for Garrett's design.

Construction
The second Resurgam was built by Cochran & Co. at Birkenhead and launched on 26 November 1879. Her construction was of iron plates fastened to iron frames, with the central section of the vessel clad with wood secured by iron straps. As built, she was 45 ft long by 10 ft in diameter, weighed 30 LT, and had a crew of three. She was powered by a closed-cycle steam engine originally patented in 1872 by the American engineer Emile Lamm, which provided enough steam to turn the single propeller for up to four hours. She was designed to have positive buoyancy, and diving was controlled by a pair of hydroplanes amidships. At the time she cost £1,538.

After successful trials in the East Float at Wallasey, it was planned that Resurgam should make her way under her own power from Birkenhead to Portsmouth for a demonstration to the Royal Navy.

Loss
On 10 December 1879 Resurgam, crewed by Garret, Jackson (as skipper) and Price (engineer) set out for Portsmouth. However, during the voyage mechanical problems caused the crew to dock at Foryd Harbour, Rhyl, for repairs. Once completed, and after trials, the crew set sail on the night of 24 February 1880 in a high wind, towed by the steam yacht Elphin, which Garrett had bought to act as a tender. The Elphin developed engine problems and the Resurgam's crew transferred to her to assist. Because the entry hatch on the Resurgam could not be fastened from outside, the submarine began to ship water and the tow-rope broke under the added weight, the Resurgam sinking in Liverpool Bay off Rhyl on 25 February 1880.

Discovery of wreck
For many years the exact location of Resurgam was a mystery. In 1995, she was found by an experienced wreck diver, Keith Hurley, while he was attempting to clear snagged fishing nets in 60 ft of water. On 4 July 1996 Resurgam was designated protected wreck No. 42 under the Protection of Wrecks Act. The site of the wreck covers an area 900 ft in radius at 53.39633°N, -3.553°W.

The Resurgam's hull is intact although partially damaged and remains at risk from illegal diving and trawling. Since her discovery, the conning tower steering wheel has been broken and portable items have gone missing.

In 1997, a project called SUBMAP was undertaken by the Archaeological Diving Unit to study the wreck site. Over one hundred volunteer divers, coordinated by the Nautical Archaeology Society, surveyed the structure of the hull and the colonising marine life around it, using remote sensing equipment to search for debris in the surrounding area. The results of the SUBMAP project have been published as a comprehensive digital archive using Site Recorder. The wreck is currently protected against further corrosion by sacrificial anodes that had been attached to the hull. Plans to raise her have so far not been fruitful.

Resurgam was featured in the TV programme Wreck Detectives in 2004. In 2007 divers from the British Sub-Aqua Club in Trafford undertook conservation work, placing zinc sacrificial anodes on the wreck. In 2012 divers from the British Sub-Aqua Club in Chester also replaced sacrificial anodes on the wreck.

Replica
A replica of the vessel was built by trainees at the AMARC Training College attached to the Cammell Laird shipyard, Birkenhead, in 1996–97. She was put on display at Woodside Ferry Terminal, Birkenhead, in March 1997.

After falling into disrepair the replica was refurbished by students of the North West Maritime and Engineering College in 2009.

title: Resurgam


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List of artillery by type

This list of artillery catalogues types of weapons found in batteries of national armed forces' artillery units.

Some weapons used by the infantry units, known as infantry support weapons, are often misidentified as artillery weapons because of their use and performance characteristics, sometimes known colloquially as the "infantryman's artillery" which has been particularly applied to mortars.

The distinguishing feature of infantry support weapons from artillery weapons is in the unit that provides the personnel for the weapon crew.

This list does not differentiate between guns and cannons, although some designations use one word or the other. The word "cannon" is of Latin origin, borrowed into the English language from the French, while "gun" appears to be of German language origin and is found in earlier use in England. There is almost universal use of gunner in the English language to refer to artillery personnel, and not the French term cannonier. Some English speaking armies do use the originally French term bombardier as a rank in artillery units.

Recoilless guns
A recoilless gun or recoilless rifle (RCL) is a lightweight weapon that fires a heavier projectile than would be practical to fire from a recoiling weapon of comparable size. Technically, only devices that use a rifled barrel are recoilless rifles. Smoothbore variants are recoilless guns. This distinction is often lost, and both are often called recoilless rifles.

Normally used for anti-tank roles, the first effective system of this kind was developed during World War II to provide infantry with light, cheap and easily deployable weapon that does not require extensive training in gunnery. The near complete lack of recoil allows some versions to be shoulder-fired, but the majority are mounted on light tripods and are intended to be easily carried by a soldier.

Self-propelled recoilless guns
Self-propelled recoilless guns are vehicles designed to carry recoilless guns. Only a few such designs have been successful, many mounting multiple rifles.

Self-propelled anti-aircraft guns
Anti-aircraft guns are weapons designed to attack aircraft. Such weapons commonly have a high rate of fire and are able to fire shells designed to damage aircraft. They also are capable of firing at high angles, but are also usually able to hit ground targets as well in a direct-fire role.

Self-propelled anti-tank guns
Anti-tank guns are typically high-velocity guns designed to fire anti-tank shells. They are usually designed to be easily transported and concealed to maximize responsiveness and surprise.

Assault guns
Assault guns are guns mounted in armored vehicles designed to provide direct fire support for infantry and armored forces. Typically, the gun is mounted in the hull and the front of the vehicle most heavily armored.

Autocannons
Autocannons are like machine guns but their calibers are at least 20mm.

Aircraft artillery
Aircraft artillery has been used since the first world war.

Tank guns
Tank guns are high-velocity guns designed to be fitted into the turret of a tank. They share many design features with anti-tank guns and in many cases are directly related to anti-tank gun designs. The primary objective of most tank guns is to be able to destroy other tanks, but other tasks such as fire support and anti-personnel missions often are required.

Naval artillery
Naval guns are manufactured based on the same principles as the land based artillery ordnance, but differ significantly in system design and use. Never referred to as "artillery" it is however often called upon to provide naval artillery fire support to the land forces operation in the coastal region within their range.

Railway artillery
Railway artillery involved large guns and howitzers mounted and transported on specially-constructed railway cars.

Infantry mortars
The List of infantry mortars catalogues weapons which are issued to infantry units to provide close range, rapid response, indirect fire capability of an infantry unit in tactical combat. In this sense the mortar has been called "infantryman's artillery", and represents a flexible logistic solution to satisfying unexpected need for delivery of firepower, particularly for the light infantry. In general infantry mortars are defined by what a team of infantrymen, sometimes known as mortarmen, can transport unaided by significant vehicle support. Because of this intrinsic restriction mandated by weight, mortars are only considered "infantry" to a caliber of 120mm. These larger weapons usually require wheeled assemblies to allow their towing either by hand or by light tactical vehicles.

Heavy mortars
Heavy mortars are large-caliber mortars designed to fire a relatively heavy shell on a high angle trajectory. Such weapons have a relatively short range, but are usually less complex than similar caliber field artillery.

This category includes the "Trench Mortars" of World War I which were all too heavy and cumbersome, and hence lacked the mobility, to be classed as infantry mortars.

Self-propelled infantry guns
Infantry guns are designed to provide direct organic support for infantry forces. They fire a range of shells, primarily in a direct-fire mode. Most are lightweight and capable of being manhandled for limited mobility to accompany infantry.

Mountain artillery
Mountain artillery, which includes pack howitzers, mountain howitzers and mountain guns, is designed to accompany mountain infantry forces. Usually lightweight and designed to be broken down to be portable by pack animals or even soldiers, they often are in limited calibers with low muzzle energy. Correspondingly, range and anti-armor capabilities are limited. However, they can deliver useful firepower in locations that may be inaccessible to heavier support forces.

Self-propelled field guns
Field guns are one of two primary types of field artillery. Guns fire a heavy shell on a relatively level trajectory from a longer barrel, allowing for very high muzzle velocity and good range performance. Guns are most adequate for providing long range fire support and counter-battery fire.

Self-propelled howitzers
Howitzers are one of two primary types of field artillery. Howitzers fire a heavy shell in a high trajectory from a relatively short barrel. Range is limited but howitzers are slightly more mobile than similarly sized field guns.

Wheeled self-propelled howitzer
It is a sub-category of self-propelled howitzers, where the artillery gun is mounted on a wheeled vehicle, usually a 8×8 or 10×10 APC, or 6×6, 8×8, 10×10 trucks.

Tracked self-propelled howitzer
It is a sub-category of self-propelled howitzers, where the artillery gun is mounted on a tracked vehicle.

Siege artillery
Siege artillery are heavy guns and other bombardment devices designed to bombard fortifications, cities, and other fixed targets. They are capable of firing heavy shells but require enormous transport and logistical support to operate. They lack mobility and thus are rarely useful in more mobile warfare situations.

title: List of artillery by type