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Police Squad!

Police Squad! is an American television crime comedy series that was broadcast on the ABC network in 1982. It was created by David Zucker, Jim Abrahams, and Jerry Zucker, starring Leslie Nielsen as Frank Drebin. A spoof of police procedurals and many other television shows and movies, the series features Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker's usual sight gags, wordplay, and non sequiturs. It resembles the Lee Marvin police show M Squad (in particular the opening credits) and the late 1960s series Felony Squad. It was canceled after six episodes, and yielded The Naked Gun film series from 1988 to 1994.

Overview
Police Squad! was created by David Zucker, Jim Abrahams, and Jerry Zucker (ZAZ), who had previously worked on the films, The Kentucky Fried Movie (1977) and Airplane! (1980). ZAZ wanted to make another spoof film similar to Airplane!, using the television series M Squad as a basis for the spoof. Lacking an overarching plot to the concept, Paramount Pictures president Michael Eisner instead secured them a six-episode television series, despite ZAZ wanting to make it into a film.

The show aired as a mid-season replacement in March 1982, but was taken off the schedule after four episodes. The remaining two episodes were dumped onto the summer schedule in place of the usual summer reruns. Against critical acclaim, the show was canceled by ABC after just six episodes. The show gained a strong cult following through repeat broadcasts on cable channels.

Alan North played Captain Ed Hocken, and Peter Lupus co-starred as Officer Norberg. In the films, those roles were played by George Kennedy and O. J. Simpson respectively, with Norberg renamed Nordberg. The only actors who reprised their roles in the films are Leslie Nielsen, Ed Williams as scientist Ted Olson, and Ronald "Tiny Ron" Taylor as the very tall Al. Joyce Brothers played herself in the fourth episode and in The Naked Gun: From the Files of Police Squad!. Robert Goulet, one of the "special guest stars" killed during the title sequence, plays the villain Quentin Hapsburg in The Naked Gun 2½: The Smell of Fear.

Episodes
Each episode's voiced title differs from that displayed on screen. In the following list, the voiced title is in parentheses.

Cast
Leslie Nielsen portrayed Sergeant Frank Drebin, detective lieutenant of Police Squad. Jerry Zucker explained that the name Drebin was picked blindly from the phone book. Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker had met Nielsen when working on Airplane! (1980) and decided that their kind of humor matched. The team said that Nielsen would be perfect as Drebin, as the character lampooned the roles that Nielsen had played in television dramas such as The Bold Ones: The Protectors and S.W.A.T.. Ed Williams, who co-starred as lab technician Ted Olson, had been a science teacher for many years and had some previous acting experience. Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker were amazed by his performance.

 * Leslie Nielsen as Detective Frank Drebin
 * Alan North as Captain Ed Hocken
 * Peter Lupus as Officer Norberg
 * Ed Williams as Ted Olson, Scientist
 * William Duell as Johnny the Snitch
 * Ronald "Tiny Ron" Taylor as Al

Rex Hamilton is credited in every episode as "Abraham Lincoln", with the same clip in all opening credits as his only appearance. Nielsen, Taylor, and Williams were the only members of the main cast who reprise their characters into The Naked Gun film series. Captain Ed Hocken was portrayed by George Kennedy in the film series, and O. J. Simpson played Officer Nordberg (slightly renamed from "Norberg").

Opening sequence
The show's opening sequence is a satire on traditional crime-drama opening sequences, particularly those of M Squad and various Quinn Martin shows such as The Fugitive and particularly The New Breed (which also stars Nielsen). Hank Simms, who had worked as an announcer for some of Martin's programs, announced the title of each episode, though the spoken title never matches the title caption. The sequence introduces Nielsen and North during a shootout, and Abraham Lincoln impersonator Rex Hamilton, who dramatically returns gunfire to John Wilkes Booth, as his only appearance.

Another recurring gag in the opening credits sequence is the "special guest star", a celebrity who is introduced but immediately murdered. These special guest stars are Lorne Greene, Georg Stanford Brown, Robert Goulet, William Shatner, Florence Henderson, and William Conrad. John Belushi was slated as "special guest star" for the fifth episode and a scene with Belushi tied to blocks of concrete under water was filmed. Following Belushi's unexpected death in March 1982, the scene was replaced with footage of Florence Henderson before the episode was broadcast the following July. Belushi's accidental death shocked Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker, as they had joked about it after he had nearly choked during the filming of the scene. A list of possible celebrity death shots was included in the DVD release.

Writing
The show was intended to mock police dramas in the same way in which Airplane! mocks disaster movies. Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker wrote the pilot episode, in which most straight lines were directly copied from an M Squad episode. The pilot episode is a near scene-for-scene remake of "More Deadly", the opening episode of the second season of M Squad. Pat Proft, who had worked with Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker on The Kentucky Fried Movie (1977) and Airplane! (1980), wrote the third episode. Robert Wuhl was invited to join the writing staff after he had auditioned for the lead role in Airplane!. He co-wrote the show's second and sixth episodes with Tino Insana. Both episodes contain cultural references to old movies such as On the Waterfront and The French Connection. In Wuhl's audio commentary for the DVD, he mentioned that it was a nice opportunity, but that he did not really feel a connection with the show, especially because of its short run.

Direction
The first episode of Police Squad! was directed by Jim Abrahams, David Zucker, and Jerry Zucker. Two of the show's six episodes were directed by filmmaker Joe Dante, who recalled in 2008,

I knew the Zuckers from second unit on Rock 'n' Roll High School and Kentucky Fried Movie and had turned down Airplane! – don’t ask! When they got Police Squad! going, they asked me to do the second one. It only lasted six episodes, two of which I directed.

ABC had no idea what to do with the show, which had no laugh track and resembled a rerun of a ’60s program. The network kept changing the time slot so no one could find it, and people casually switching it on thought it really was an old TV show! Like they did in their features, the boys used real TV episodes as their template, mostly a ’50s Lee Marvin series called M Squad. It was lots of fun to do and was the first thing I ever directed on a studio lot. I prefer the TV show to the later Naked Gun movies.

Cancellation
ABC announced the cancellation of Police Squad! after four of its six episodes had aired in March 1982. The final two episodes were aired that summer. In an interview for the DVD release of the series, Nielsen said ABC entertainment president Tony Thomopoulos asserted Police Squad! was canceled because viewers had to pay close attention to the show in order to get much of the humor: "the viewer had to watch it in order to appreciate it". Nielsen also thought the premise was more effective in the successful Naked Gun films because the much larger screen size in a cinema increases the efficacy of the visual gags. In its annual "Cheers and Jeers" issue, TV Guide magazine called the explanation for the cancellation "the most stupid reason a network ever gave for ending a series".

Home media
In 1985, Paramount Home Video first released all six episodes of the show on VHS, Betamax, and LaserDisc formats as two separate volumes: Police Squad!: Help Wanted! and ''More! Police Squad!'', each with three episodes in their production order. Paramount and CBS DVD first released the series on DVD in 2006 in a keep case on one disc. The episodes are in airing order from ABC. The DVD extras include production notes from network executives, a "freeze-frame" that was filmed but never used, bloopers, casting tests, and an interview with Nielsen. Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker, producer Robert K. Weiss, and writer Robert Wuhl recorded audio commentary for the first, third, and sixth episodes. Critics universally praised how the show was still funny after more than 20 years. The series was released in Blu-ray format in the US on April 14, 2020.

Naked Gun film series
After the cancellation of Police Squad!, ZAZ returned to films, creating the comedies Top Secret! and Ruthless People. At this point, they were able to identify a narrative to apply to the Police Squad! formula for a theatrical film by adding a romantic plotline, and the film The Naked Gun: From the Files of Police Squad! was readily greenlit by Paramount. It performed well at the box office, grossing around $78,756,177. The film lead to the Naked Gun trilogy with two sequels, The Naked Gun 2½: The Smell of Fear (1991) and Naked Gun $33 1/3$: The Final Insult (1994), were released. The Naked Gun $2 1/2$: The Smell of Fear was considered the most successful of the three, grossing around $86,930,411, and Naked Gun $33 1/3$: The Final Insult grossed $51,132,598. Roger Ebert rated the first movie $3 1/2$ out of four stars and gave three stars to each of the two following films.

Spin-offs
A series of British advertisements for Red Rock Cider were made in the same style, with the opening titles changed to other names such as "Fraud Squad" or "Fried Squid", and featuring Leslie Nielsen. The advertisements were shown in British cinemas as well as on television. They were directed by John Lloyd, with such apparent success that Zucker, Abrahams, and Zucker approached him to direct Naked Gun $33 1/3$: The Final Insult, but he turned them down. During the WWE's SummerSlam 1994 pay-per-view event, the Police Squad! characters look for The Undertaker, who had previously vanished.

Critical response
On Rotten Tomatoes, Police Squad! has an aggregate score of 90% based on 28 positive and three negative critic reviews. The website’s consensus reads: "Wacky, inventive, and endlessly quotable, Police Squad! is a hysterically funny leap forward for TV comedy that was tragically ahead of its time."

Upon the home video release in 1985, Washington Post critic Tom Shales commented "People can rent them and laugh, and then cry that ABC was so cruel." In 2009, the DVD set was nominated for a Satellite Award for Best DVD Release of a TV Show, though it lost to the DVD set of the eighth season of Fox's The Simpsons. In 2013, TV Guide ranked it #7 on its list of 60 shows that were "Cancelled Too Soon".

Matt Groening, creator of The Simpsons, has said, "If Police Squad! had been made twenty years later, it would have been a smash. It was before its time. In 1982 your average viewer was unable to cope with its pace, its quick-fire jokes. But these days they'd have no problems keeping up, I think we've proved that."

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Dru Drury

Dru Drury (4 February 1725 – 15 December 1803) was a British collector of natural history specimens and an entomologist. He received specimens collected from across the world through a network of ship's officers and collectors including Henry Smeathman. His collections were utilized by many entomologists of his time to describe and name new species and he is best known for his book Illustrations of natural history which includes the names and descriptions of many insects, published in parts from 1770 to 1782 with most of the copperplate engravings done by Moses Harris.

Life
Dru Drury was born in Wood Street, London. His father, also Dru Drury, was a citizen, goldsmith and silversmith of the City of London. Drury's great-grandfather, William, Lord of the Manor of Colne, was Sheriff of Cambridgeshire in 1676. The Drury family traced back to a Thomas Drury, of Fincham, Norfolk, who died in 1545. Descendants of Dru Drury retained the status of citizen and goldsmith of the City of London until at least 1969.

Drury apprenticed to his father in the Goldsmith's Company in 1739 and became a liveryman in 1751. In 1748 he married Esther, the daughter of his father's fourth wife from an earlier marriage to soapmaker John Pedley of London. Drury then inherited his father's business and became the owner of several freehold houses in London and Essex. By 1771 he was earning nearly £2000 a year and had amassed enough wealth to buy the entire stock of a fellow silversmith, Nathaniel Jeffreys. Despite his wealth, he was forced into bankruptcy in 1777 after he was cheated by two Yorkshire cutlers, William Tate and John Wheate. Assisted by Joseph Banks, John Fothergill, and other friends, he resumed business but retired in 1789 to devote all his time to entomology. Drury and his wife had three children, Mary, born 1749; William (who became a silversmith) born 1752; and Dru, born 1767. He spent his retirement between London and Broxbourne, Hertfordshire where he collected insect specimens. Around 1797 the family moved to Turnham Green but Drury began to face ill health starting with stones in his bladder. Other complications followed and he died in the home of his son in the Strand on 15 January 1804. He was buried at St. Martin-in-the-Fields on 21 January.

Natural history career
Drury was keenly interested in entomology even before retiring as a silversmith and was the president of the Society of Entomologists of London from 1780 to 1782. He was also a member of the Linnean Society. Beginning in 1770, Drury corresponded with a number of entomologists from all over the world from India to Jamaica and America. He offered 6 dimes for any insect of any size from officers of merchant ships travelling afar. He also had a three-page pamphlet on instructions for collecting. It is through these connections that Drury received much of his collection. "(26) To Mr. Keuchan, at Jamaica. June 13, 1774.""You inquire after Mr. Smeathman, who is settled on the Coast of Africa. He, has been there almost three years but has sent nothing over except insects, a circumstance which astonishes us, for his patrons expected a great variety of subjects long before this in ye different branches of Natural History. Many of the insects that he has sent are surprisingly fine. A great number entirely new, especially among, the Coleoptera, some of which are very large.""--From a collection of letters published in The Scientific Monthly."From 1770 to 1782, he published the three-part Illustrations of Natural History, Wherein are Exhibited Upwards of 240 Figures of Exotic Insects, with copperplates by Moses Harris and Peter Mazell. This was later revised and republished under the title Illustrations of Exotic Entomology in 1837. A German translation of the first volume was published by Georg W. F. Panzer. Drury's work was self-published and many of his correspondences with various workmen in the publishing industry have survived. In the letters, detailed accounts of prices and publishing techniques are provided which shed light on Britain's early printing industry. The original drawings for this book, by Moses Harris and Mary Gartside, were recently rediscovered in rural Virginia, USA.

One of Drury's special hunt was for a specimen of the Goliath beetle. A specimen had been obtained by William Hunter and was lent to Emanuel Mendes da Costa. Da Costa had drawings of the beetle made by Moses Harris but before it could be published he was embroiled in an embezzlement scandal in the Royal Society which led to a prison term. The drawing however was bought by Drury and it went into Drury's book with Westwood's name of Goliathus druryi. Hunter was understandably angry with what he saw as "theft" and Drury subsequently made a special search for another specimen of the beetle. A specimen was sent by Henry Smeathman but Drury misidentified it. Drury was also interested in rocks and minerals and took a special interest in the distribution of gold around the world. He also took an interest in gardening, angling in the River Lea, and in making his own wines.

Drury's collection comprised over 11,000 specimens. Many species were described and given their binomial names by contemporary entomologists like J.C. Fabricius, Ernest Olivier, and Kirby: "there may be in Holland collections more numerous, having in many instances a great number of a single species, yet no collection abounds with such a wonderful variety in all the different genera as this. All the specimens of which it is composed, are in the highest and most exquisite state of preservation, such an extensive collection can be supposed to be, and a very considerable number are unique, such as are not to be found in any other Cabinet whatever, and of considerable value; many of which, coming from countries exceedingly unhealthy, where the collectors, in procuring them, have perished by the severity of the climate, give but little room to expect any duplicate will ever be obtained during the present age; and the learned quotations that have been taken from it by those celebrated authors Linnaeus and Fabricius, in all their late editions, are incontestable proofs of the high degrees of estimation they entertained of it."

After his death, the collections were sold in a three-day auction by King and Lochee and earned £614 8s. 6d. with an additional £300 for his cabinets and books. A catalogue of the collections was published. Unfortunately, Drury's collections, while large, lacked substantial location and other data (as it was not customary at the time). Thus, it is difficult, if not impossible, for any sound scientific data to be formed in regards to the history of its specimens.

Drury's illustrations, mostly by Moses Harris, were published in three volumes (1770, 1773, 1782), and the original paintings, inherited through his descendants, were sold at auction in London in March 1964. They are now in the Oak Spring Garden Library, Upperville, Virginia USA.

Other sources

 * Evenhuis, N.L. 1997. Litteratura Taxonomica Dipterorum. Leiden: Backhuys Publishers. 209–212
 * Gilbert, P. 2000: Butterfly Collectors and Painters. Four Centuries of Colour Plates from the Library Collections of the Natural History Museum, London. Singapore, Beaumont Publishing Pte Ltd : X+166 S. 27–28, Portr., 88–89, 140–141, 148–149: Lep.Tafel
 * Osborn, H. 1952: A Brief History of Entomology Including Time of Demosthenes and Aristotle to Modern Times with over Five Hundred Portraits Columbus, Ohio, The Spahr & Glenn Company : 1–303.
 * Salmon, M. A. 2000 The Aurelian Legacy. British Butterflies and their Collectors. – Martins, Great Horkesley : Harley Books : 1–432
 * Osborn, H. 1952: A Brief History of Entomology Including Time of Demosthenes and Aristotle to Modern Times with over Five Hundred Portraits Columbus, Ohio, The Spahr & Glenn Company : 1–303.
 * Salmon, M. A. 2000 The Aurelian Legacy. British Butterflies and their Collectors. – Martins, Great Horkesley : Harley Books : 1–432
 * Salmon, M. A. 2000 The Aurelian Legacy. British Butterflies and their Collectors. – Martins, Great Horkesley : Harley Books : 1–432

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Dru Drury


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Tamil Jain

Tamil Jains (Tamil Samaṇar, from Prakrit samaṇa "wandering renunciate") are ethnic-Tamils from the Indian state of Tamil Nadu, who practice Jainism, (Tamil ). The Tamil Jain is a microcommunity of around 85,000 (around 0.13% of the population of Tamil Nadu).They are predominantly scattered in northern Tamil Nadu, largely in the districts of Tiruvannamalai, Kanchipuram, Vellore, Villupuram, Ranipet and Kallakurichi. Early Tamil-Brahmi inscriptions in Tamil Nadu date to the third century BCE and describe the livelihoods of Tamil Jains. Samaṇar wrote much Tamil literature, including the important Sangam literature, such as the Nālaṭiyār, the Cilappatikaram, the Valayapathi and the Civaka Cintamani. Three of the five great epics of Tamil literature are attributed to Jains.

Origins
Some scholars believe that Jain philosophy must have entered South India some time in the sixth century BCE.

According to other scholars, Jainism must have existed in South India well before the era of Jain tirthankara Lord Mahaveer Swami. There are plenty of caves as old as fourth century with Jain inscriptions and Jain deities found around Madurai, Tiruchirāppaḷḷi, Kanyakumari and Thanjavur.

A number of Tamil-Brahmi inscriptions have been found in Tamil Nadu that date from the second century BCE. They are regarded as associated with Jain monks and lay devotees.

The exact origins of Jainism in Tamil Nadu is unclear. However, Jains flourished in Tamil Nadu at least as early as the Sangam period. Tamil Jain tradition places their origins are much earlier. The Ramayana mentions that Rama paid homage to Jain monks living in South India on his way to Sri Lanka. Some scholars believe that the author of the oldest extant work of literature in Tamil (3rd century BCE), Tolkāppiyam, was a Jain Shraman.

Tirukkural by Thiruvalluvar is considered by many to be the work of a Jain by scholars like V. Kalyanasundarnar, Vaiyapuri Pillai, Swaminatha Iyer, and P. S. Sundaram. It emphatically supports strict vegetarianism (or veganism) (Chapter 26) and states that giving up animal sacrifice is worth more than thousand burnt offerings (verse 259).

Silappatikaram, the earliest surviving epic in Tamil literature, was written by a Samaṇa, Ilango Adigal. This epic is a major work in Tamil literature, describing the historical events of its time and also of then-prevailing religions, Jainism, Buddhism and Shaivism. The main characters of this work, Kannagi and Kovalan, who have a divine status among Tamils, Malayalees and Sinhalese were Jains.

According to George L. Hart, who holds the endowed chair in Tamil Studies by University of California, Berkeley, has written that the legend of the Tamil Sangams or "literary assemblies", was based on the Jain sangham at Madurai: "There was a permanent Jain assembly called a Sangha established about 604 CE in Madurai. It seems likely that this assembly was the model upon which tradition fabricated the Sangam legend."

Jainism became dominant in Tamil Nadu in the fifth and sixth century CE, during a period known as the Kalabhra interregnum.

Decline and survival
Jainism began to decline around the eighth century CE, with many Tamil kings embracing Hindu religions, especially Shaivism. Still, the Chalukya, Pallava and Pandya dynasties embraced Jainism. The Shaivite legend about the impalement of the Jains in Madurai claims that 8000 Jains were impaled after they lost a contest against the Saivites, Thirugnana Sambandhar was invited by the queen of Madurai to check the atrocities against Jains and their influence on the King; however, this legend is not mentioned in any Jain text According to Paul Dundas, the story represents the abandonment of Madurai by Jains for various reasons or the gradual loss of their political influence.

Jainism survived in the region during the period of decline. The Melsithamur matha was established by a monk Shantisager who arrived from Shravanabelgola sometime during the 9-12th century period as attested by the 12th century inscriptions. A Jain center associated by Acharya Akalanka in the eighth century survives at Thiruparuttikundram near Kanchi. The Tamil Jain texts of this period include 13th-century (orlater) Aruṅkalacceppu, 14th cent. Mērumantarapūrāṇam and the 15th-century Śrīpurāṇam.

Revival
When India became independent in 1947, Madras Presidency became Madras State, comprising present day Tamil Nadu, coastal Andhra Pradesh, South Canara district Karnataka, and parts of Kerala. The state was subsequently split up along linguistic lines. In 1969, Madras State was renamed Tamil Nadu, meaning Tamil country.

Acharya Nirmal Sagar was the first Digambar Jain monk to reenter Tamilnadu in 1975 after a gap of several centuries. After him some of the Jain nuns have visited Tamilnadu resulting in a renaissance of Jainism among the Tamil Jains. Many abandoned and crumbling temples have been renovated as a result of renewed interaction between Tamil Jains and the Jains from the rest of India. Financial grants have been provided by Bharatiya Digambar Jain Tirth Samrakshini Mahasabha and the Dharmasthala institutions. Local Jain scholars and activists have started "Ahimsa walks" to bring attention to the Tamil Jain heritage.

Archaeological evidences
Archaeological remains in Tamilnadu are discovered time to time that attest to popularity of Jainism in Tamilnadu. Most of the rock inscriptions are related to the Jain ascetics who used to commonly reside in hill caves. The ruins of Anandamangalam vestiges were discovered in Anandamangalam, a small hamlet near Orathi village in Kancheepuram district of Tamil Nadu. The ruins had the rock-cut sculptures of yakshini (tutelary deity) Ambika and tirthankara Neminatha and Parshvanatha.

Population
The total number of Jains in Tamil Nadu as per 2011 Indian census is 83,359, which forms 0.12% of the total population of Tamil Nadu (72,138,958). This include the Jains who have migrated from North India (mainly Rajasthan and Gujarat). The population of Tamil Jains is estimated to be 25,000-35,000.

The Tamil Jains are ancient natives of Tamil Nadu and belong to the Digambara sect. They generally use the title Nainar. A few in Thanjavur District, use Mudaliar and Chettiar as titles. The former North Arcot and South Arcot (now Tiruvannamalai, Vellore, Cuddalore and Villupuram Districts) districts have a large number of Jain temples, as well as a significant population of Tamil Jains.

At present, most of the Tamil Jains are from the Vellalar social group. The present Hindu members of this sect are originally believed to have been Jain before they embraced Hinduism. The Tamil Jains refer to the Shaiva Vellalar as nīr-pūci-nayinārs or nīr-pūci-vellalars meaning the Vellalars who left Jainism by smearing the sacred ash or (tiru)-nīru. While some of the Jains assign this conversion to the period of the Bhakti movement in Tamil nadu others link it to a conflict with a ruler of the Vijayanagara empire in the 15th century. The villages and areas settled by the Shaiva Vellalar even now have a small number of Jain families and inscriptional evidence indicate that these were earlier Jain settlements as is evident by the existence of old Jain temples.

The title Nainar has been used since antiquity for Jain monks. In Cilappatikaram a Jain temple is mentioned as Nayinar Koil and the Kalugumalai inscription refers to Jain munis as Nayinar. It is akin to the term Sahu or Sadhu in North Indian Jain inscriptions.

Laxmisena
Laxmisena of the Jina Kanchi Jain Mutt or madam at Mel-Sithamoor (near Tindivanam, Villupuram District) is one of the religious heads of the community. He performs the upadesha ceremony for Jain children. In the past, this mutt had been the centre for religious study, guiding and helping the economic activities of its members, organising religious discourses, maintenance of temples and such activities. The mutt was able to achieve such multifarious operations with the help and contributions of its members. At present the mutt is also maintaining a gousala (for cows and others).

The present finance position of the mutt is inadequate for even day-to-day maintenance. Planting of coconut and mango trees has been started to increase the revenue of the fund for the purpose of day-to-day maintenance of the mutt. The car ('ther') in the mutt requires replacement of wooden wheels.

Dhavalakeerthi
In addition to the above, a new mutt named Arahanthgiri Jain Math located at Thirumalai near Polur, Tiruvannamalai district, has been functioning from 8 February 1998 with the name Dhavalakeerthi. Now in the mutt around 2300 students are studying from primary to higher secondary school including Jain philosophy with free boarding and lodging. Maintenance of the above is done through contributions from donors.

Lifestyle
The traditional occupation of the majority of the Tamil Jain families has been landowners of agricultural land. Now many are teachers. A considerable number of them are settled in urban areas, they are employed in public and private sectors. A small population has settled overseas (US, Canada, UK, Australia and other places).

Cuisine
Tamil Jains are ardent vegetarians. With the turn of the 20th century, they were a self-sustained rural-based farming community. They were landowners and used contract labourers for their agricultural activities. Their household included large tracts of land, cattle, and milch cows. They had kitchen gardens growing vegetables for their daily need. Dairy food such as milk, curd, butter and ghee were cooked in house. Daily food was very simple consisting of a brunch with rice, cooked lentils (paruppu), ghee, vegetable sambar, curd, sun-dried pickles of mango, lemon or citron, and deep-fried sun-dried 'crispies' (vadavam) made from rice pie. Evening snacks of deep-fried lentil preparations and before sunset dinner consisting either idli, dosa or rice with buttermilk and lentil chutney (thogaiyal). While seniors, people undergoing religious fast and ardent followers of religious principles avoided garlic, onions and tubers in their daily food, these were occasionally used by others in the household.

Identity
Tamil Jains are well assimilated in Tamil society, without any outward differentiation. Their physical features are similar to Tamils. Apart from certain religious adherences, practices and vegetarianism, their culture is similar to the rest of Tamil Nadu. However, they name their children by the names of Tirthankaras and characters from Jain literature. It is also notable that the men of the Tamil Jain community also wear the sacred thread.

Lifetime ceremony
Ezhankaapu - on the seventh day of its birth, a new born baby is adorned with bracelets. Kaathu Kutthal - ear piercing and adorning child with earrings. This ceremony is mostly performed in either Aarpakkam temple or Thirunarangkondai i.e.Thirunarungkundram. (Appandai Nathar is the deity).

Other Ceremonies
Upadesam - the formal induction into religious practices and adherences is called Upadesam. This is done to both boys and girls, at around the age of 15. After Upadesam, one is supposed to follow religious practices with vigor and seriousness.

Marriage - outwardly, Jain marriages resemble Hindu marriages. However, the mantras chanted are Jain. There is no Brahmin priest; instead there is a Samaṇar called a Koyil Vaadhiyar or temple priest, who conducts the ceremonies.

Pilgrimage - most Jains go on pilgrimage to tirthas and major Jain temples in North India - Sammed Shikharji, Pavapuri, Champapuri and Urjayanta Giri - as well as places in South India such as Shravanabelagola, Humcha or Hombuja Humbaj, Simmanagadde in Karnataka and Ponnur Malai in Tamil Nadu.

There are private amateur tour operators as well who take pilgrims to newly identified ancient Tamil Jain sites in western Tamil Nadu (kongunadu) and northern Kerala (vayanadu).

Funeral rites - the dead are placed on a pyre and incinerated. Ashes are then disbursed in water courses and ceremonies are performed on 10th or 16th day. Annual remembrance ceremonies similar to Hindu practice are not performed. But no festivities or functions are followed that year on the paternal side.

Festivals

 * Akshaya Tritiya commemorates the first Tirthankara, Rishabha, partaking food after many long years of penance.
 * Jinaratri commemorates Rishabha's moksha.
 * Mahavir Janma Kalyanak celebrates Tirthankara Mahavira's birth.
 * Diwali commemorates Mahavira's moksha.
 * Vasant Panchami honors the Jain Agamas
 * Upaakarma commemorates the Chakravartin Bharata, son of Rishabha, acknowledging the true scholars by awarding them the Upanayana.
 * Karthikai Deepam at the onset of the month of Kartika
 * Puthandu and Thai Pongal are the other common festivals celebrated along with other Tamils.

Religious practices
Full moon days, Chaturdasi (14th day of the fortnight), Ashtami (8th day of the fortnight) are days chosen for fasting and religious observations. Women take food only after reciting the name of a tirthankara five times. People undertake such practices as a vow for certain period of time - sometimes even for years. On completion, Udhyapana festivals (special prayer services) are performed, religious books and memorabilia are distributed. People who take certain vows eat only after sunrise and before sunset.

List of Tamil Jains

 * Thiruvallur Jain Saint
 * Prof. A. Cakravarti Nayanar, scholar and author, including "Jain Literature in Tamil", 1941,
 * Jeevabandhu T.S Sripal
 * S. Sripal, Director General of Police in Tamil Nadu.
 * Prof. J. Srichandran, Founder, Varthamanan Padippagam
 * Air Marshal Simhakutty Varthaman.
 * Wing Commander Abhinandan Varthaman.
 * DMK MLA, A. Rajendran from Polur.

Cave temples

 * Tirumalai (Jain complex)
 * Kalugumalai Jain Beds
 * Thirakoil
 * Samanar Hills
 * Sittanavasal Cave
 * Kurathimalai, Onampakkam
 * Panchapandavar Malai
 * Seeyamangalam
 * Kanchiyur Jain cave and stone beds
 * Ennayira Malai
 * Andimalai Stone beds, Cholapandiyapuram
 * Adukkankal, Nehanurpatti

Puja temples
(in alphabetical order):
 * is done in the following old (built several centuries ago) and new (built in the last 100 years) Tamil Digambara Jain temples

 * Aadhinath Jain Temple, Cuddalore (old)
 * Anumanthakudi, Sivagangai dt.(new)
 * Adambakkam, Adi Nath Digambar Jain Temple Chennai (New)
 * Agalur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Agarakorakottai, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Alagramam Jain Temple, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Arahanthgiri Jain Math, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Arani (S.V.Nagaram), Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Arani (Pudukamur), Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Arani (Saidapet), Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Arani (Palayam), Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Arani (Kosapalayam) Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Arani (sevoor) Thiruvannamalai
 * Arungulam Kanchipuram Dt. (Old)
 * Arpaakkam, Kanchipuram Dt. (Old)
 * Arugavur, Solai, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Avadi, Chennai Dt.(New)
 * Ayalavadi, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Chitharal Jain Temple,(Old) : ninth century temple
 * Chitharal malaikovil,(Old) : before 425 CE
 * Cheyyar, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Deepangudi, Nagapattinam Dt. (Old)
 * Easaakolathur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Elangadu, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Eyyil, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Erumbur, Thiruvannamalai Dt.(Old)
 * George Town, Chennai Dt. (New)
 * Gingee, Viluppuram Dt. (Old)
 * Ilayangudi, Sivagangai Dt. (New)
 * Kannalam, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Kallapuliyur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Kallakullathur, Villupuram Dt. {old}
 * Karanthai, Kanchipuram Dt. (Old)
 * Karanthai Jain Temple, Thanjavur Dt. (Old)
 * Kalugumalai Jain Beds Dt. (Old)
 * Kanchiyur Jain cave and stone beds Dt. (Old)
 * Kattumalaiyanur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Keezh Villivanam, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Keezh Edayalam, Villupuram Dt.
 * Kilsathamangalam, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Koliyanur, Villupuram Dt.(Old)
 * Kolathur, Chennai Dt. (New)
 * Kovilampoondi, Thiruvannamalai Dt (Old)
 * Kumbakonam, Thanjavur Dt. (Old)
 * Mannargudi Mallinatha Swamy Jain Temple, Nagapattinam Dt. (Old)
 * Melapandal, Vellore Dt. (New)
 * Melmalaiyanur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Mel Sithamur Jain Math, Villupuram Dt.
 * Mettu Street, Kanchipuram (New)
 * Mudalur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Nallavanpalayam, Thiruvannamalai Dt.(New)
 * Nallur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Nanganallur, Chennai Dt. (New)
 * Naval, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Nedimolliyanur Villupuram Dt. {old}
 * Nelliyankulam, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Othalavaadi, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Parshwa Padmavathi Jain Temple, Sundampatti, Orappam Krishnagiri Dt. (Old)
 * Pammal, Chennai (New)
 * Peranamallur, Thiruvannamalai Dt (Old)
 * Perani, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Peravoor, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Periyakozhappalur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Perumandur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Perumbogai, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Poondi Arugar Temple, Arani, Tiruvannamalai Dt(Old)
 * Ponnur Malai, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Puzhal, Chennai Dt. (New)
 * Renderipet, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * R.Kunnathur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Shri Vasupujya Temple, Sathuvachari, Vellore Dt. (old)
 * Sathuvachari, Vellore Dt. (New)
 * Sevur, Vellore Dt. (Old)
 * Sitharaal, Nagercoil Dt. (Old)
 * Sittanavasal, Pudukottai Dt. (Old)
 * Sitthamur, Villupuram Dt. (Oldest Jain temple and Jain math)
 * Somaasipadi, Thiruvannamalai (New)
 * Thellar, thiruvannamalaiDt.
 * Thirunarunkundram, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Thiruparuthikundram temple, Kanchipuram Dt. (Old)
 * Thirupanamoor, Thiruvannamalai Dt. near Kanchipuram
 * Thachambadi, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Thatchur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Thayanur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Thennathur, Thiruvannamalai Dt.(old)
 * Thirakoil, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Thirupparankunram, Madurai Dt.(Sangam literature Paripadal 19 step 51)
 * Thiruvannamalai, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (New)
 * Thondur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Tindivanam, Villupuram Dt (New)
 * Tirumalai,Polur Dt.(Old)
 * Trilokyanatha Temple, Kanchipuram Dt (Old)
 * Valathi / Valathy, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Vandavasi, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Valapandal Vellore Dt. (Old)
 * Veedur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Veeranamur, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Vellimedupettai, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Vempoondi, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Venbakkam, Kanchipuram Dt. (Old)
 * Vilangadupakkam, Chennai Dt. (Old)
 * Vizhukkam, Villupuram Dt. (Old)
 * Vijayamangalam, Erode Dt. (Old)
 * Virudur, Thiruvannamalai Dt. (Old)
 * Nasiyan Jain Temple,Prithvi Raj Road,ooty,dedicated to Rishabhdevji.
 * Sri 1008 Vaupujya Swamy Swethambar Jain Temple, Ooty

Tamil Jain Books
"Jeevaka Chinthamani", "Sripurana" by J Srichandran.

title: Tamil Jain


text:
Yellowtail (fish)

A yellowtail may be any of several different species of fish. Most commonly the yellowtail amberjack Seriola lalandi is meant. In the context of sushi, yellowtail usually refers to the Japanese amberjack, Seriola quinqueradiata. Other species called simply "yellowtail" include:

 * Atlantic bumper, Chloroscombrus chrysurus
 * Yellowtail flounder, Limanda ferruginea
 * Yellowtail snapper, Ocyurus chrysurus
 * Whitespotted devil, Plectroglyphidodon lacrymatus
 * Yellowtail horse mackerel, Trachurus novaezelandiae

In addition, "yellowtail" appears in many other common names of fish:

 * Butter yellowtail Seriolina nigrofasciata
 * California yellowtail Seriola dorsalis
 * Cape yellowtail Seriola lalandi
 * Common yellowtail croaker Umbrina xanti
 * Dusky yellowtail Seriolina nigrofasciata
 * Giant yellowtail Seriola lalandi
 * Great yellowtail Seriola dumerili
 * Greater yellowtail Seriola dumerili
 * Indian yellowtail angelfish Apolemichthys xanthurus
 * Longfin yellowtail Seriola rivoliana
 * Pacific yellowtail emperor Lethrinus atkinsoni
 * Queensland yellowtail angelfish Chaetodontoplus meredithi
 * Rainbow yellowtail Elagatis bipinnulata
 * Redbelly yellowtail fusilier Caesio cuning
 * Slender yellowtail kingfish Alepes djedaba
 * Southeast Asian yellowtail rasbora Rasbora tornieri
 * Southern yellowtail Seriola lalandi
 * Yellowtail amberjack Seriola lalandi
 * Yellowtail angelfish Apolemichthys xanthurus
 * Yellowtail angelfish Centropyge fisheri
 * Yellowtail angelfish Chaetodontoplus personifer
 * Yellowtail ballyhoo Hemiramphus brasiliensis
 * Yellowtail barracuda Sphyraena flavicauda
 * Yellowtail bass Bathyanthias mexicana
 * Yellowtail blue damsel Chrysiptera parasema
 * Yellowtail blue snapper Paracaesio xanthura
 * Yellowtail butterflyfish Chaetodon xanthurus
 * Yellowtail catfish Pangasius pangasius
 * Yellowtail chromis Chromis enchrysura
 * Yellowtail clownfish Amphiprion clarkii
 * Yellowtail clownfish Amphiprion sebae
 * Yellowtail coris Coris gaimard
 * Yellowtail croaker Austronibea oedogenys
 * Yellowtail damsel Chrysiptera parasema
 * Yellowtail damselfish Microspathodon chrysurus
 * Yellowtail dascyllus Dascyllus flavicaudus
 * Yellowtail demoiselle Neoglyphidodon polyacanthus
 * Yellowtail dottyback Pseudochromis linda
 * Yellowtail emperor Lethrinus crocineus
 * Yellowtail fangblenny mimic Plagiotremus laudandus
 * Yellowtail flounder Limanda ferruginea
 * Yellowtail fusilier Caesio cuning
 * Yellowtail fusilier Caesio teres
 * Yellowtail fusilier Paracaesio xanthura
 * Yellowtail goldie Pseudanthias evansi
 * Yellowtail hamlet Hypoplectrus chlorurus
 * Yellowtail horse mackerel Trachurus novaezelandiae
 * Yellowtail kingfish Caranx heberi
 * Yellowtail mullet Ellochelon vaigiensis
 * Yellowtail mullet Minimugil cascasia
 * Yellowtail parrotfish Sparisoma rubripinne
 * Yellowtail poison-fang blenny Meiacanthus atrodorsalis
 * Yellowtail rasbora Rasbora dusonensis
 * Yellowtail rasbora Rasbora tornieri
 * Yellowtail reefcod Epinephelus flavocaeruleus
 * Yellowtail reeffish Chromis enchrysura
 * Yellowtail rockcod Epinephelus flavocaeruleus
 * Yellowtail rockfish Sebastes flavidus
 * Yellowtail sailfin tang Zebrasoma xanthurum
 * Yellowtail sardinella Sardinella rouxi
 * Yellowtail scad Atule mate
 * Yellowtail scad Trachurus novaezelandiae
 * Yellowtail sergeant Abudefduf notatus
 * Yellowtail snapper Ocyurus chrysurus
 * Yellowtail surgeonfish Prionurus punctatus
 * Yellowtail surgeonfish Zebrasoma xanthurum
 * Yellowtail tamarin Anampses meleagrides
 * Yellowtail tang Zebrasoma xanthurum
 * Yellowtail tetra Alestopetersius caudalis
 * Yellowtail trumpeter Amniataba caudavittata
 * Yellowtail tubelip Diproctacanthus xanthurus
 * Yellowtail wrasse Anampses meleagrides

title: Yellowtail (fish)


text:
Winter sports in Slovakia

Ski and winter sports in Slovakia are very prominent and popular given the mountainous topography of the region and the fact that much of the country is covered by snow for a long part of the year.

Downhill Skiing
In spite of its small area, which is mostly hilly, Slovakia is densely interwoven by a net of ski-tows and ski-lifts. More than 1000 ski-tows and 40 ski-lifts are in operation and their number is growing. From the top the terminal stations there are hundreds of down-hill pistes, from the very gentle – for beginners, to the most demanding, which comply with the international criteria for master competitions.

At present, approximately 50 Slovak ski resorts make snow.

Snowboarding
Snowboarding is the fastest developing winter sport in the world. Slovakia is no exception - the number of snowboarders has been increasing every year, partly due to the type of terrain available in ski resorts. Well equipped board parks at the larger resorts offer excellent jumps, ramps and rail-slides. This is especially true of Jasna which is the largest resort in Central Europe and very boarder friendly.

Ski-Alpinism
Ski-alpinism is a combination of cross-country skiing, mountaineering and alpine skiing. Its fans seek new opportunities for testing own stamina and strength in the extreme conditions of winter alpine nature. The Slovak mountains provide very good conditions for pursuing this sport, and ski-alpinism fans recommend Jasenská dolina in the Veľká Fatra Mts., the area of Chopok and Ďumbier in the Low Tatras, Malá Studená dolina and Veľká Studená dolina and Skalnatá dolina in the High Tatras, Roháče and Žiarska dolina in the Western Tatras, and the well known Vrátna dolina in the Malá Fatra Mts.

Cross-country skiing
Bigger ski resorts offer well kept cross-country paths, but skier made paths can be found virtually by any village or tourist centre. Slovakia is rather small, so there is not much of "cross country".

Ski jumping
Ski jumping is not a popular sport in Slovakia. However, some jumping hills exist.

title: Winter sports in Slovakia


text:
Talk:Auguste Molinier

Untitled
Is his first name August or Auguste?
 * Judging by the WikiProject France designation, I'd say it's almost certainly "Auguste," the French-language version of the given name "August". — AnnaKucsma   (Talk to me!) 15:23, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

title: Talk:Auguste Molinier


text:
Talk:Sakhnin

Untitled
I hope that the following information would be added about Sakhnin:

1. Sakhneen is a part of what is known as the "Land Day Triangle", which consists of Sakhnin and the neighboring villages Arraba and Deir Hanna. Land Day, which is remembered annually on March 30th started in 1976 when demonstrations broke out in the Sakhnin area following a government decision to confiscate lands belonging to the arab villages of that area. Two citizens of Sakhnin were killed by the Israeli security forces.

2. Sakhnin was also at the center of events in the October 2000 events in Israel which led to the death of 13 arab citizens, two of which were from Sakhnin, and another two from neighboring Arraba.

3. In May 18th 2004 Sakhnin's football team known as "Bne Sakhnin" Or "Sakhnin's Sons Union" won the Israel Cup, becoming the first Arab team to win the cup.

Best regards Tommy

this refers to a book by Hatim Kanaaneh, A Doctor in Galilee, 2007, and like it has some information on Sakhnin and 1976. Nishidani (talk) 17:13, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

title: Talk:Sakhnin


text:
Talk:B. R. Ambedkar

Request for comment on infobox image change

 * The following discussion is an archived record of a request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.  A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
 * There is unanimous consensus that File:Colorised Ambedkar.png should not be used, and that the current image (File:Dr. Bhimrao Ambedkar.jpg) should remain. Tol  (talk | contribs) @ 16:18, 11 November 2021 (UTC)

The present image may not be the best image we have of Ambedkar. It is unusually close-up for a portrait and is of side profile. If we agree to change the image, then this I feel is a good candidate. Consider taking part in the consensus. Appu (talk) 16:01, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

 * Oppose – The relevant pages here are: Image use policy (in particular, WP:IMGCONTENT), and the guideline Manual of Style/Images (especially MOS:IMAGERELEVANCE), and ideally any decision to keep or change the image should be based on them.  I don't agree with the description above that the current image is a side profile (it's more like 3/4). The fact that the proposed image has been artificially manipulated means it may not represent reality but a colorising editor's preference. Based on MOS:LEADIMAGE which says, "Lead images should be natural and appropriate representations of the topic" and the fact that the colorised image is not natural, I oppose changing the image. (Even if it were not colorised, I would still oppose the change, as I believe the current image is a better quality representation.) Mathglot (talk) 20:17, 14 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Appu, just a procedural note: this Rfc lacks an Rfc question at the top. Please read WP:RFCBEFORE about preparing for an Rfc, and WP:RFCNEUTRAL about writing the Rfc question. In my opinion, the Rfc should start with a simple question, such as: "Should the current image of Ambedkar at the top of the article be replaced with File:Colorised Ambedkar.png?". Your argumentation in favor of one position or the other goes in a separate comment beneath the neutral statement that opens the Rfc, usually as a bullet item and the word Support or Oppose in bold font. Don't worry, you're still pretty new and you can't be expected to know everything right away, but just try to keep it in mind for next time. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 20:30, 14 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose –   In addition to above concerns, which I share to some degree, can you please provide evidence that the photo is licensed under a compatible license? The source image is public domain, but colourisation by hotpot.ai is likely to be a transformative work, which would put the colourised version under new term of copyright. Based on an (admittedly) casual look at the service's website, I was unable to ascertain that images produced by the service are licensed under a compatible license.   Mel ma nn   21:40, 14 October 2021 (UTC)
 * , good point. I added a question about this at Commons:Village pump/Copyright. Mathglot (talk) 02:40, 15 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose apart from any copyright issues which MAY apply, it's a poor image and inferior to the current B+W photo. Pincrete (talk) 05:49, 15 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose - Current image is fine. I really don't see any reason to change it, especially with a picture that doesn't actually look as good as the current one. PraiseVivec (talk) 14:37, 16 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose - Okay with the current image. Sea Ane (talk) 18:05, 17 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose - Current image is way better.  Peter Ormond 💬  15:24, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Name
Wouldn't be correct transcription of the name Bhimrav … ? Regards, —Mykhal (talk) 05:15, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

 * No wt are saying aa.. 2409:4071:4D42:EDC1:8401:CBF3:9AD2:84E4 (talk) 01:52, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

Request for change in IPA transliteration of 'Babasaheb'
The IPA transliteration given for Babasaheb is incorrect. The word is written in Marathi as well as Sanskrit as बाबासाहेब, which when converted to Latin script through ISO 15919, results in 'Bābāsāheb', and when compared with Help:IPA/Sanskrit, gives the correct IPA transliteration as [baːbaːsaːɦeb].

Therefore I request that [bʌbəsɑheb] be changed to [baːbaːsaːɦeb]. Thank you SomePacifisticGuy (talk) 11:53, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Central Provinces
The text of the article says: Ambedkar was born on 14 April 1891 in the town and military cantonment of Mhow (now officially known as Dr Ambedkar Nagar) in the Central Provinces (now in Madhya Pradesh).

The source cited for this does not mention that it was in Central Provinces. The source says: Bhim Rao Ambedkar was born on April 14, 1891 in Mhow, a garrison town close to Indore–the capital of a princely state of the same name which was to be incorporated into the province of Madhya Bharat (contemporary Madhya Pradesh) after independence. Please can you make a suitable correction. -- Toddy1 (talk) 20:21, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
 * The latter is correct, but sidesteps the Central India Agency question. Indore State was a part of the Central India Agency, commonly just called "Central India," just as Jaipur State was a part of Rajputana Agency, commonly called "Rajputana," or Porbandar a part of Kathiawar Agency; all the "Agencies" were groupings of princely states, which the British oversaw with residents.  "Madhya Bharata" was the name given to Central India during the period of the Dominion of India (from 1947 to 1950, and probably for some time thereafter until Madhya Pradesh came into being which incorporated both Central Provinces and Central India and maybe a few other small political units.  You may view its map in Dominion_of_India.  Mhow on the other hand was a British garrison town in a princely state. I'll check if it had any independent existence outside of CIA; if it did, it might explain why Jaffrelot is resorting to that circumlocution.  Thank you.  Fowler&fowler  «Talk»  20:44, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
 * The Census of India, 1891, the year Ambedkar's birth, mentions Central India and Mhow in paragraphs 14 and 15 in volume 1, Intro, published 1890, page 177.  This is not a reliable source but gives a feel for that time, at least in the official document.  Fowler&fowler  «Talk»  21:11, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
 * And the enumeration, published 1892, says on page 22], that Mhow (cantonment), Indore State, Central India, increased in population by 4.5K from the previous census of 1881. I wonder if baby Bhimrao was counted in it.   Fowler&fowler  «Talk»  21:17, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
 * I see, (I was going to remove that [Central Provinces] though went per article body) but agencies have not been added in infoboxes and with other details such as district et al are just WP:OVERLINKING (all of which were recently added). Reduced them from infobox per MOS and removed the mention of Province from body. Gotitbro (talk) 04:12, 26 February 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 March 2022
Add the category "Category:Marathi people" as Dr. BR Ambedkar had Marathi heritage as mentioned in article GujaratiHistoryinDNA (talk) 00:23, 9 March 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅--Krutarth (talk) 01:52, 9 March 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 March 2022
He was a social reformer ,activist 117.215.149.37 (talk) 13:04, 15 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 13:15, 15 March 2022 (UTC)

School segregation
In early life section, it says They were not allowed to sit inside the class. In his book Waiting for Visa, he says For instance, I knew that in the school I could not sit in the midst of my class students according to my rank but that I was to sit in a corner by myself. This suggests that he was allowed inside the class but had to sit in corner.

Either the sentence can be removed, since the line before it mentions untouchable children were segregated, or rewritten that Ambedkar was made sit in corner by himself.--Krutarth (talk) 17:30, 15 March 2022 (UTC)

 * He's been hagiographed to death and unlike Gandhi he was a grandiose figure; it is hard to know what the truth was. He was after all the recipient of an elite education (Elphinstone Bombay, Columbia, LSE); the discrimination was very likely not so extreme as have deprived him of an education altogether which was the case with most Dalits, even the very talented ones.  Fowler&fowler  «Talk»  21:15, 15 March 2022 (UTC)
 * But, regardless, being a Dalit in late 19th-century early 20th-century India, he had to have experienced discrimination, perhaps even a more humiliating kind than one of merely having sit outside the classroom. Dalits are still discriminated against in manifold ways. Will look for sources. Thanks for posting. Fowler&fowler  «Talk»  21:56, 15 March 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 23 March 2022
Change "literary translation" to "literal translation" in the intro. Jānis Barbans (talk) 17:05, 23 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. I don't see that prose in this article. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 17:12, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 April 2022
Under the section about the LSE, could we add a link to his LSE student file, which you can freely download from here? https://www.lse.ac.uk/library/assets/documents/Ambedkars-LSE-student-file.pdf That PDF link is presented on this page, in case that is a better link https://www.lse.ac.uk/library/whats-on/exhibitions/educate-agitate-organise — Preceding unsigned comment added by Politicscurator (talk • contribs) 09:25, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

 * We can't really add it to the article main body, as it is a primary source. I am delighted to add it to the external links.  I read much of that file and was impressed by how highly his professors rated him. A man of considerable genius he certainly was, one in a million.  Thank you for posting this and for the link.  Fowler&fowler  «Talk»  09:57, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Wonderful, thank you! Politicscurator (talk) 09:58, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 12 April 2022
Bharataratn Dr. B. R. Ambedkar Mr. Jyoshil (talk) 17:42, 12 April 2022 (UTC)

Instead of B. R. Ambedkar use Bharataratn Dr. B. R. Ambedkar Mr. Jyoshil (talk) 17:44, 12 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: We don't use titles in article names. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 17:52, 12 April 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 24 October 2022
The local description of this page is Former minister of law and justic in india But it should be 'The Father of Indian Constitution'. Please do this change. Shreyas143 (talk) 01:49, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

The Greatest Indian Shreyas143 (talk) 01:50, 24 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. – Jonesey95 (talk) 02:01, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 April 2023
Babasaheb Dr. B.R. Ambedkar did not get his surname from a Marathi Brahmin Teacher whose surname was Ambedkar. There is evidence for proving that. Babasaheb got his surname from his village's name.Babasaheb Dr.B.R. Ambedkar's elder brother Bala also had this surname which is mentioned in the official documents. so, please remove this error of information from the Wikipedia Dr. B.R. Ambedkar's page's Early life Part. This can lead to a controversy also because it is fake information that is present on that Wikipedia page.So, change the information that Babasaheb Dr. b.R. Ambedkar got his surname Ambedkar from a Marathi Brahmin Teacher whose surname was Ambedkar to the information that Babasaheb Dr. B.R. Ambedkar got his surname Ambedkar from his village's name "Ambadawe". 43.231.55.155 (talk) 06:45, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Do you have reliable sources for confirming this information? Aman Kumar Goel (Talk) 06:48, 9 April 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 April 2023 (3)
Babasaheb Dr. B.R. Ambedkar did not get his surname from a Marathi Brahmin Teacher whose surname was Ambedkar. There is evidence for proving that. Babasaheb got his surname from his village's name.Babasaheb Dr.B.R. Ambedkar's elder brother Bala also had this surname which is mentioned in the official documents. so, please remove this error of information from the Wikipedia Dr. B.R. Ambedkar's page's Early life Part. This can lead to a controversy also because it is fake information that is present on that Wikipedia page. The change should be done from Wikipedia page named Dr. B.R. Ambedkar's Early life Part. Please change "His Marathi Brahmin teacher, Krishnaji Keshav Ambedkar, changed his surname from 'Ambadawekar' to his own surname 'Ambedkar' in school records" to "His original surname was Sakpal but his father registered his name as Ambadawekar in school, meaning he comes from his native village 'Ambadawe' in Ratnagiri district." 43.231.55.155 (talk) 06:49, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Lightoil (talk) 08:24, 9 April 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 14 May 2023
please add a link to an article on Mooknayak https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mooknayak sumedhdmankar (talk) 16:14, 14 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: The Mooknayak article needs some substantial work; until it's clear that it's notable as a separate subject from B.R. Ambedkar, linking it may not make sense. Lizthegrey (talk) 17:47, 14 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Mooknayak is a newspaper started by B. R. Ambedkar in 1920. Mooknayak is B. R. Ambedkar's own newspaper. then how it is not notable.
 * Ref 1
 * Ref 2
 * Ref 3 sumedhdmankar (talk) 19:21, 14 May 2023 (UTC)
 * ✅ Added wikilink. Aman Kumar Goel (Talk) 19:24, 14 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Thank you so much sumedhdmankar (talk) 19:27, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 June 2023
Change

""On 25 November 1949, Ambedkar in his concluding speech in constituent assembly said:[74]

"The credit that is given to me does not really belong to me. It belongs partly to Sir B.N. Rau the Constitutional Advisor to the Constituent Assembly who prepared a rough draft of the Constitution for the consideration of the Drafting Committee."

To

“…however good a Constitution may be, it is sure to turn out bad because those who are called to work it, happen to be a bad lot. However bad a Constitution may be, it may turn out to be good if those who are called to work it, happen to be a good lot.

…The Constitution can provide only the organs of State such as the Legislature, the Executive and the Judiciary. The factors on which the working of those organs of the State depends are the people and the political parties they will set up as their instruments to carry out their wishes and their politics.”" Ericbana19sdk (talk) 14:46, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

 * seems like this page is a deliberate attempt at misrepresenting and dismissing Ambedkar of his achievements. The most important part is omitted while the most popular tweets by idiots are taken as references. This is not only not intellectual honesty, but intellectual suicide. Ericbana19sdk (talk) 14:48, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
 * No reason provided to replace the verified quotation. Aman Kumar Goel (Talk) 17:22, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Have already given the reason. The quote misreprents Ambedkar's position as the top Constitution authority and influence. His comment is only partial and not full. Why is only that part which he credits his team and BN Rau prominently displayed and not the whole quote, which is much more contextual is helpful?
 * Again a very sad and deliberate mischief. 103.76.57.20 (talk) 14:31, 28 September 2023 (UTC)
 * @103.76.57.20 Dr b r ambedkar born in Maharashtra 45.252.73.140 (talk) 05:07, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

Heading is Wrong.
The heading written is wrong. So please take note of that it's not only B.R.Ambedkar but it is Dr.B.R.Ambedkar. Because Man's reputation is considered by its Educations. And we Indians inspired from Dr.B.R.Ambedkar through his Education. So I hope you can change the heading in correct manner. Thank you. 112.79.73.64 (talk) 09:22, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Please see MOS:DOC. Rasnaboy (talk) 14:25, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 December 2023
Religion - Hindu Atheist Rebel (talk) 10:00, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate.  Delta  space 42 (talk • contribs) 10:34, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

removing Barrister-at-Law
hello.

Looking at your edits, it looks like you are deliberately omitting the mention of Ambedkar's barrister degree, why? Your edits - 6 August 2023 and 22 January 2024.

In 1922, Ambedkar was called to the bar and became a "barrister-at-law". source. 2409:4042:806:ACAA:38B2:7060:FC8B:DDE4 (talk) 16:21, 22 January 2024 (UTC)

 * He was called to the bar there, but did not earn a degree as you mentioned. GuardianH (talk) 16:25, 22 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Isn't Grays Inn Ambedkar's alma matter as you deleted? Is Barrister-at-Law a degree? 2409:4042:806:ACAA:927:3ABE:CF77:6CD4 (talk) 20:18, 22 January 2024 (UTC)
 * It's a little different in the UK. They may study there, but being called to the bar does not mean earning a degree. A Barrister-at-Law is a profession, not a degree. GuardianH (talk) 23:05, 22 January 2024 (UTC)
 * OK. But Ambedkar studied law at Gray's Inn, and that should be mentioned in the article's infobox, along with Columbia University and LSE. 2409:4042:806:ACAA:ADD4:7751:95CC:297A (talk) 10:04, 23 January 2024 (UTC)
 * My understanding is that the Inns of Court are not usually displayed in the infobox, unless the subject spent more than the usual amount of time there. It's more like gaining an accreditation there rather than receiving a formal education. When I added it to the infobox originally, I thought it might add some value, but it just extends this rather long infobox. GuardianH (talk) 18:29, 23 January 2024 (UTC)

Who helped in 1952
You should mention which party elected ambedkar as rajiyasabha member. Jana santha parent party of bjp. HariHaran Honest (talk) 23:59, 1 February 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 March 2024
The Two tallest statues of B. R. Ambedkar must be included in the article

On 14 April 2023, a 125 feet tall statue of Ambedkar was installed in Hyderabad city of Telangana, which is situated on a 50 feet high base building. On January 19, 2024, a 125 feet tall "Statue of Social Justice" of Ambedkar was installed in Vijayawada, Andhra Pradesh, which stands on an 81 feet high platform. The Ambedkar statues in Hyderabad and Vijayawada are the fifth and fourth tallest statues in India respectively. In May 2026, a 450 feet tall "Statue of Equality" of Babasaheb Ambedkar will be ready at Indu Mill in Mumbai, which will be the second tallest statue in India and the third tallest in the world.

2409:4042:271D:9BCF:21A6:B070:3299:6E01 (talk) 09:07, 31 March 2024 (UTC)

 * I'll see if I might be able to incorporate this somehow. GuardianH (talk) 22:58, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Any update on this? * Pppery * it has begun... 23:02, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

 * ✅. Capitals00 (talk) 17:39, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

 * Hello, Thank you for adding the information about the statue in Vijayawada to the article.
 * Looks like you didn't add the Hyderabad statue information on the talk page into the main article. The article already has some information about the Hyderabad statue, but it is insufficient. The article does not mention the height of the statue, nor the height of its base. Also wiki linking is not done.
 * The article should also have photos of both the Ambedkar statues in Hyderabad and Vijayawada. Please think positive.

157.33.222.253 (talk) 20:16, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

When was B R Ambedkar awarded with Yugpurush
Italic 103.183.90.156 (talk) 07:49, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

 * ❌ It is unclear what you want done. Peaceray (talk) 20:47, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

Social
Br ambedkar biography 2409:4070:478C:B7C2:D9F1:5E52:F5B1:3A0D (talk) 15:00, 27 April 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 June 2024
"We should remove the whole paragraph where Indira, the wife of jagjivan Ram mentioned that ambedkar persuaded jagjivan Ram to talk to Mahatma Gandhi for the giving him a post in a cabinet of Nehru ministry. It has no any valid evident it's just a personal view even jagjivan Ram never mentioned that. We all know how ideologically both Ambedkar and jagjivan Ram are different poles apart." Callmehelper (talk) 10:16, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
 * . It is accurately attributed and reliably sourced. Ratnahastin  (talk) 02:43, 2 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:B. R. Ambedkar


text:
User talk:Pehrs

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Your submission at Articles for creation: Kattis (January 22)
 Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. Please read the comments left by the reviewer on your submission. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved. ''' Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia! ''' Arthur goes shopping (talk) 11:55, 22 January 2014 (UTC)
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title: User talk:Pehrs


text:
User talk:Louis Labrèche

Welcome to the Wikipedia
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Hello Louis, I did a minor edit to the energy page and was a bit shocked to see how little information it conrains. It used to be more complete, as you wrote. Can you please help to revert it partially to previous versions? Thanks in advance. Andries 15:04, 22 May 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:Louis Labrèche


text:
User:ALargeElk/Welcome

Welcome
Hello, welcome to Wikipedia.

You might find these links helpful in editing pages or creating new ones: Tutorial, How to edit a page, Naming conventions, Manual of Style. You should probably read our policies at some point too.

But don't feel you have to read every policy document before you do anything. Dive in, be bold in editing, and if you do anything wrong, someone will be quick to correct it and let you know (hopefully, politely!)

If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my talk page. I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! --   ALargeElk | Talk 13:25, 17 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Welcome
Hello, welcome to Wikipedia.

You might find these links helpful in editing pages or creating new ones: Tutorial, How to edit a page, Naming conventions, Manual of Style. You should probably read our policies at some point too.

But don't feel you have to read every policy document before you do anything. Dive in, be bold in editing, and if you do anything wrong, someone will be quick to correct it and let you know (hopefully, politely!)

If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my talk page. I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! --~

title: User:ALargeElk/Welcome


text:
Talk:Hildegard Puwak

Untitled
I found out that the information promoted by wikipedia.org and spread through other search services about me is totally wrong. I never was under investigation for corruption. The truth is that I asked the Romanian Anticorruption Prosecutor Office to investigate the information released by the press on the use of funds from the Leonardo da Vinci program. The result of the investigation on the members of my family was issued by this authority on the 20-th of December 2003, published in the press, and available in the archive of the mentioned authority. There was no confirmation of misuse of funds. The content of this program has nothing to do with investments as you are mentioning in your statement. In this respect, I appreciate as incorrect and unfair the information you issued on this webpage. Please let me informed about the existing possibilities to correct this information.

Hildegard Puwak

 * I rewrote the article using the information I found on some Romanian newspapers. If you think that there are any factual errors, you can edit yourself, but keep in mind the policy of Wikipedia: everything to be written in Neutral Point of View (see: Neutral point of view). Bogdan | Talk 19:58, 20 May 2004 (UTC)

Rewriting, kind of
I feel like this should be rewritten to not be a few walls of text. Multi-paragraph reads well. Tessaract2 (talk) 22:26, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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title: Talk:Hildegard Puwak


text:
User talk:Puwak

Welcome to the Wikipedia
Here are some links I find useful

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Feel free to ask me anything the links and talk pages don't answer. You can sign your name by typing 4 tildes, likes this: ~.

Cheers, Sam [Spade] 09:26, 19 May 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:Puwak


text:
Talk:Same-sex marriage in South Africa

early discussion
I can't find any confirmation that same-sex marriages are legal in South Africa. The date of July 2002 mentioned was that of a court decision that one same-sex couple should receive the financial benefits of a married couple (see ). Google yields several pages from later dates that state that SA does not yet have legal recognition of SSMs. Can someone quote an authority on this? -- Kimiko 09:27, 19 May 2004 (UTC)

 * Same-sex marriages are not legal in South Africa. I can't quote any authority but myself (since I live here). However, the courts have ruled that it is unconstitutional to ban same-sex marriage, and has directed Parliament to amend the law. So SSM must be legalised, but it is very unpopular, both among voters and (possibly) parliamentarians, so they seem to be putting it off as long as possible. --Taejo | [[User talk:Taejo|Talk]] 06:48, 17 November 2005 (UTC)

 * My understanding is that the court ruled that the legislature must change the law within one year's time to include same-sex couples or the court will change the law itself. Liamdaly620 17:32, 2 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Which would be absolutely, totally unprecedented in any country in the history of mankind, for any court to write new words into a law, instead of a democratically elected body. "Democracy" is now dead, welcome to "Activist Judicocracy", with threats and ultimatums. 17:03, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Actually, this is hardly unprecedented, and fully within the court's authority to interpret laws according to the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa, which is fairly clear on there being no discrimination based on gender. Now, the role of the legislature is not overridden in this, as the legislature still controls the most important power of all: The authority to amend the Constitution. So, I don't know who you are (you chose to refuse to associate your name with your comment), but you evidently know little about the workings of democracy, and so your claim that it is dead rings somewhat hollow. —  Imp i  10:11, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Courts of law have been interpreting law, and deciding between conflicting laws, for at least a few hunderd years. thirty-seven 07:19, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Each paragraph now seems to be referenced, and in terms of quality I can't see any particularly sloppy mistakes, so I'm removing the cleanup/citation tags. Arvedui 22:26, 2 December 2005 (UTC)

The article says "Many white South Africans, particularly Afrikaners, are very conservative on social issues.", which implies (though it doesn't state) that opposition is primarily from white South Africans, particularly Afrikaners. However, it's my understanding (which might be wrong) that same-sex marriage is unpopular among black South Africans as well, possibly even more so. Is that the case? --Delirium 07:22, 4 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Yes, a fair amount of black South Africans are very socially conservative, and are not in favour of it. I'm not sure why the article focuses only on white South Africans, because it's pretty clear that if only white South Africans were opposed to it, it would have been law long ago. —  Imp i  10:11, 4 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Agreed, I've been meaning to make that change for a while - but was waiting for time to do a major rewrite (that doesn't look really necessary anymore). Most South Africans are probably (and regretably) homophobic. Certainly most are anti-SSM. --대조 | Talk 16:19, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

The article reads "Because homosexuals were accepted, it was easy for the government to write the legislation into the constitution." Easy? Accepted by whom? This is too vague, too general, denies the hard work of too many people, and ties into the correction about conservatism. One mixed race bar does not mean acceptance. If homosexuality was so readily accepted, why did the new government have to remove sodomy laws that were on the books? Lesbian and Gay activists joined in the struggle with the ANC to fight apartheid, thereby giving homosexual rights a place on the platform. That line should be removed entirely. Jsandrsn 19:02, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Most recent events
Cabinet assents to same-sex marriage Bill

-M-, Afrikaans Wikipedia

Sodomy?
Removed the startling assertion that homosexuality was legal in apartheid-era South Africa. Rubbish; sodomy was a criminal offence until 1998. Also removed the POV statements that homosexuals were accepted, and that the 2005 decision was met with much opposition - it was, but it was also met with rejoicing from gay and lesbian South Africans and those who support sexual equality. 82.108.5.59 12:09, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Wouldnt it be possible to still have sodomy illegal and same-sex marriage legal?
 * Technically, no. Marriage is defined (in part) as a sexual union.  As such, if it is made legal the acts that define it must also be made legal. - 24.10.95.220 08:02, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

 * Your saying anal-sex defines (in part) gay marriage? I'm skeptical. Brentt 00:35, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Conjugal relations are one of the traditional factors in determining whether a marriage is consummated or not. This is particularly important because of the prevalence of "sham" marriages for the purposes of fooling immigration or financial officials.

Granted, same-sex unions are a relatively new concept, but every jurisdiction that has legalized domestic partnerships, civil unions, or same-sex marriage has done away with their sodomy laws first. 24.69.166.109 21 March 2007

Republics

 * "[South Africa] will be the first African country and the first republic to legalize same-sex marriage."

Pardon my American ignorance, but aren't the Netherlands, Belgium, Spain, and Canada all parliamentary and/or democratic republics? --BDD 20:53, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

 * They are all monarchys. See Politics of Canada, Politics of Spain, Politics of Belgium and Politics of the Netherlands. Canada is still under the Brittish crown, since its an old colony. Spain restored its monarchy after the death of Franco in 1975. Belgium and the Netherlands are monarchys as well. They are both parliamentary democracys (or at least if I remember it right), but they are not republics.
 * --Screensaver 21:18, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Alright, since checking the article here on republics, this seems consistent with Wikipedia definitions. It still seems strange to me, however, that monarchies and republics are considered mutually exclusive categories. In practice, the people in all four of those countries elect representatives who govern in their stead, which sounds like a republic to me. A bit semantical. I won't dispute it though. Thanks. --BDD 23:15, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
 * It doesn't sound strange to me. Perhaps you just have a different understanding of republic then the rest of us? I don't think many people in there countries dispute that they are not a republic and in most (especially Canada I suspect) there are probably republic movements which seek to remove the monarchy as well as monarchist movements which seek to maintain/preserve the monarchy. More precisely, these countries are called constitutional monarchies and parliamentry demoracies. I think both terms together accurately convey what kind of countries they are. If you were to call them republics, it would be rather confusing. How do you differentiate between a real republic and a monarchy? Nil Einne 02:16, 15 November 2006 (UTC) (Just to clarify, I was referring to the idea that Canada, Spain etc should be called republics. BDD seemed to be suggesting it was just semantical and we should call them republics. My point was it was actually a bit silly to call them republic because if we did, how would one differentiate between a republic with a monarch and a republic without one Nil Einne 12:44, 23 March 2007 (UTC))
 * Easy: monarchies have a monarch, and republics don't. Although we democratically elect our effective government (a situation called responsible government), and the monarch reigns at the suffrance of the democratic government, the monarch is still a monarch, rather than a head of state elected either by the people or by other democratically elected officials. - Montréalais 05:29, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I think this still gives the impression it was the first country to legalize it, you could simply say it is the 5th country to legalize it? Or something like "the 5th country on the world and the first republic", but that is not a very good sentence ;) I agree with BDD, it's a bit semantical. -- Sirius81 | Talk 12:36, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree, it appears to me to be a distinction without a substantive difference and an attempt to claim a spurious 'first'. It should be replaced with wording indicating that SA is the 5th country to legalise gay marriage. No more than that is necessary, I should think. —  Imp i  17:18, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
 * In the context of this article is it even noteworthy that South Africa is a republic? --192.156.102.6 20:26, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Nope. —  Imp i  22:00, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I was planning to mention this myself but forgot. I agree that it's not particularly relevant Nil Einne 15:00, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

The sentence is quite correct as is, grammatically, semantically and factually, and the "first" is not spurious. Let it go, folks. :-) BTW, Canada is not under the "British crown"; H.M. Elizabeth II is Queen of Canada quite separately from being Queen of the UK, as she is also Queen of about 15 other Commonwealth Countries.  See Monarchy in Canada.  Canadians have been totally on their own since the repatriation of their Constitution in 1982 cut the last tenuous links with the British government. Textorus 23:35, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Context
The lead section needs more context and content. --70.39.133.138 12:15, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Page tampering or vandalism?
As of 11:20 AM, Central Time, the page is "pie face" followed by excessive exclamation points, repeatedly, for its entire content.

11:21 AM: Sorry, must have been a fluke.

Ugh someone did tamper with the page. Hopefully someone can reverse it ASAP.

why the photo at the beginning?
I do not see what an photo of male genitals has to do with this discussion and it makes it impossible to send it to people who would be interested if I know they will access it at work. I would edit it out but I can't figure out how. Also, this is not just a male issue.Dsrtwrendsrtwren
 * This was vandalism and has been cleaned up. You can learn more about how you can clean up vandalism by checking out the Counter-Vandalism Unit.—WAvegetarian•(talk) 21:06, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

What's the deal with the first sentence?
It says that it is widely believed to spread more AIDS in Africans, and then cites a BBC article which says nothing of the sort. It's a very biased comment, and I hope someone removes it.
 * That was just vandalism by SRD (some random dolt). — BRIAN 0918 • 2006-11-16 18:19Z

Same-sex marriage in South Africa & The Mediation Cabal
The following section, added to the article by User:IZAK was deleted by User:JBKramer from the article with the insulting comment that it's "just plain made up" with only threats being hurled on IZAK's talk page. In view of this behavior, and after serious comments by IZAK have been repeatedly deleted from this talk page, the Mediation Cabal has been contacted to see if they can help out with the blanket censoring of IZAK's comments here, see Mediation Cabal/Cases/2006-11-17 Religious opposition to same-sex marriage in South Africa. Hopefully, a more serious dialogue will now ensue. Thank you. IZAK 12:13, 17 November 2006 (UTC) :

 * Religious roots of the opposition to same-sex marriages

 * Thus far, the push to create same-sex marriages in South Africa would amount to civil unions devoid of any religious sanction. Over 80% of South Africans belong to a religious group: (Zion Christian 11.1%, Pentecostal/Charismatic 8.2%, Catholic 7.1%, Methodist 6.8%, Dutch Reformed 6.7%, Anglican 3.8%, other Christian 36%, Islam 1.5%, other 2.3%, unspecified 1.4%, none 15.1% - 2001 census .)

 * Indeed, the broader public debate over the rejection or acceptance of same-sex marriage by the general public in South Africa, as noted above, requires an understanding of the degree to which South Africa's various population groups have had a historical connection to mainstream Christianity, Islam, and other religions, all of which reject the notion of same-sex marriage as being anti-Biblical or anti-religious. While individuals such as Desmond Tutu may have their personal views, they are not regarded as the definitive spokespeople for Christianity. (See Homosexuality and Christianity.)

 * The majority of South Africans belong to Christian churches, such as to the Uniting Reformed Church in Southern Africa, Anglican Church of Southern Africa, Methodist Church of Southern Africa, the Zionist Churches, Roman Catholicism in South Africa and Afrikaner Calvinism, all of which have neither condoned nor accepted same-sex marriages in their congregations.

 * The Muslims in South Africa are uniformly opposed to accepting same-sex marriages, in keeping with Islamic teachings and Islamic countries world-wide. (See Homosexuality and Islam.) Jewish South Africans who are mostly alligned with Orthodox Judaism are opposed to the notion and practice of same-sex-marriages. (See Homosexuality and Judaism.)

 * It is therefore no surprise that many religious groups have opposed the proposed law.

A few comments. Firstly although you signed your post, if you are referring to self it's usually best to do it in the first person rather then the third person so people don't get confused. Secondly, the above either seems inappropriate given that it is unsourced, looks like original research and sounds like it's expressing a POV. I can't comment on JBKramer's alleged personal attacks on your talk page, but I feel his comment in removing what you added is fair even if ideally should be avoided. Also, I note from your talk page, you've been expressing a POV on this talk page, which many find offensive. As other's have reminded you, the talk page is not a soapbox. Nil Einne 15:12, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Sharif Ahmed
I have linked this article to Sharif Ahmed. Is it the same man? If so it would be worth explaining who he is if he is to be quoted. Rich Farmbrough, 15:46 21 November 2006 (GMT).

Social reaction
I moved material to this section from the 2002 ruling section. It doesn't really have anything substantive to say about reaction to the ruling; instead, it talks (a little bit) about general receptiveness of the country to the gay lifestyle. I think this needs to be either rewritten to include actual quotes or summaries thereof. It could also simply be moved to Gay rights in South Africa. -- Beland 13:36, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Merge of civil unions?
Is this merge of Civil unions in South Africa happening or what? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 23:59, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
 * It should. — Nightst a  llion  (?) 12:47, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Opposite sex?
Can a man and woman enter a civil union in South Africa? Carolynparrishfan 12:30, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

 * An excellent question, and one that the courts will probably have to resolve. Orginally, the government bill had differentiated "civil partnerships" (same-sex unions) from "domestic partnerships" (opposite-sex unions). However, since the draft bill did not include the word "marriage" for same-sex couples, as the Constitutional Court ruling required, the government was forced to change the term "civil partnerships" into "marriage partnerships" at the last minute. Meanwhile, the "domestic partnerships" in the original legislation somehow morphed into "civil partnerships" during the amendment process, even though other parts of the bill remained exactly the same. This means some parts of the legislation now refers to "civil partnerships" in terms of "two persons of the same-sex", while other parts still say "two persons" (regardless of gender). So...it's not exactly clear. Eventually, they're going to have to harmonize all these marriage laws. South Africa now has three totally separate and contradictory marriage laws, which is the cause of great confusion. --24.69.176.155 03:33, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Odd statistics
I wondered if anyone would ask. (Note that I have just updated the table with the 2010 statistics.) The problem with StatsSA's numbers is that they disagree with numbers from other reliable sources about SSM in South Africa. Primarily this NY Times article from July 2010:

Which doesn't tally with the numbers that only show 2,460 marriages or civil partnerships by the end of 2010. There was another article that I can't find now that said about 1,000 same-sex marriages had been carried out in the first year after the law passed which, if it were true, would be even more at odds with the statistics.

That being said, I think I may know the reason for the difference (as regards the NY Times article, anyway): the Stats SA figures only reflect marriages of South African citizens and permanent residents, and not marriages solemnized in South Africa between two foreigners. (See page 1 of the report, "Statistics South Africa (Stats SA) publishes marriage data on citizens and permanent residents that are collected through the civil registration systems of DHA.") Marriages between foreigners are permitted but are not recorded in the National Population Register, and don't appear in these statistics.

The other problem is that a Civil Union Act marriage/civil partnership is open to opposite-sex couples as well as same-sex couples, so these statistics aren't actually the number of same-sex marriages conducted. However most opposite-sex couples do still marry under the 1961 Marriage Act.

If we included a note in the table mentioning these two points that would work for me, I guess. Also, in October of this year South Africa had a national census and when that data is released it will hopefully give us more accurate information about how many same-sex married couples there are in the country. - htonl (talk) 09:11, 28 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, certainly let's include the NYT numbers in the statistics section; more information to help readers get a sense is good. –Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 17:53, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

title: Talk:Same-sex marriage in South Africa


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