text:
User:AJim/extensions

Extensions is a place to collect my thoughts about how to extend the utility of the wiki software.

Why I like this wiki
I have begun to use the Wikimedia software for a private project. I have been looking into the whole area of knowledge management, collaborative software, content management, or whatever you want to call it, for a while. I am aware of some successful products in this general area that have been going for 10 years now. My interest and involvement has been increasing rapidly as I saw greater and greater value in the techniques and as it became clear that I could use them, now. I began using Wikipedia a few months ago, and rapidly became hooked, this thing is fun! It is very rewarding to work on and with. I chose this software because of the power of the tools, the maturity, the depth of support, general high quality, and the fact that I could use it almost immediately.

An Objection to Wikis
So, in my first attempt to create a convert, I ran into the objection that "customers" expected a manual in Word format. Could the work on the wiki contribute to the writing of a manual? Surely they do expect a Word file, Word is probably all they see. I suggested that perhaps pdf could be produced, and pdf is OK, it seems. In the end, I expect that once people become aware of the power of interactive, collaborative software like this that demand for fixed formats will fade away. In the meantime, there are lots of purchase evaluators with simple-minded approaches to software selection, mostly concerned with avoiding mistakes, who use simple checklists to exclude as many choices as possible. I think this is one of the springs driving "featuritis". In any event, I pointed out that each page could be printed, and that settled the matter for the moment.

Aha, something wikis need
But, in thinking about the issue, some ideas emerged that could be useful. The fact that a document has to be printed in some fixed order has never been too much of a problem because most documents have a structure that works well that way. Call it a narrative structure, a story. Story telling seems almost built-in to people, in fact. For technical documentation though, this structure is sometimes a bit arbitrary, there are often several ways to tell the story, depending on the interests and backgrounds of the readers. Sometimes this leads to multiple, partly-redundant documents.

Hyper-linking, of course, is a way to break out of this one-way restriction. This is similar to what conventional books do with cross-refrences and indexes, although the change in speed and ease of use creates something new.

There is still a benefit to linking articles into a narrative thread at times. In fact, it would be nice if several threads could traverse a set of articles, each in it's own order, as appropriate. some documents also have hierarchies, and this can be useful as well. It would be nice, I think, if one could choose which thread links were visible, to reduce clutter. I guess what I envision is something like the navigation links I see on so many online documents today, next, previous, up. I think this reflects a tree structure and provides a way to traverse this tree.

looking to share
In any event, I am writing this here because the lesson is clear that I will benefit if I share these ideas with others, and that these ideas may benefit the wiki software itself, and others with whom I might collaborate. I have begun searching for existing and related work, and I will note here what I find.

Existing Wiki Work
Category seems to be the key term. There is a discussion in wikipedia, a related discussion in meta and in the mediawiki-l list, and ongoing experiments in the development head and on the test wiki.

I found some historical stuff at other wiki sites too. It seems that other distinctions have been tried, for example, between category and topic, but the distinction did not take. Another important concept emerged too, a roadmap, which seems to be primarily a tutorial kind of structure.

articles in wikipedia
User:Zocky/Bottom-up categorization has some interesting ideas about how to allow categories to "create themselves". Perhaps this could simplify the work of creating narrative threads.

One difference between the syntax in this proposal and the syntax being implemented is that the sort key, as implemented, is not going to appear as the item in the category list, the page name will still show there. See the discussion in wikitech-l or the code.

articles in meta.wikipedia
Most of the discussion seems to be in the meta wiki. It is clear that this subject is of concern to many others besides me.

The main starting point seems to be MediaWiki development. From here there is a link to the specific topic Categorization.

There is also a proposal for a more general kind of tag in two linked pages Categorization with field-value pairs and Field-value pairs. In this proposed system, the field name can be something other than category.

The categorization with field-value pairs page has links to other proposals, Technical categories in Wikipedia.

I guess the most unusual thing I am asking for, so far, is a definite order. On the one hand, this would, clearly, be hard to maintain. On the other hand, this is sometimes what a reader wants, a story to follow. Maybe that is what roadmaps are.

Well, perhaps not so unusual. I just found a discussion of a way someone has already found to do it Series of Articles using the existing software and transclusion, a new term for me.

Finally, Offensive content is a recent discussion of another set of reasons for wanting to classify elements of the encyclopedia and allow selective control of their display.

test wiki, development
There is work ongoing to implement a category system in media wiki:

The current syntax is explained in the test wiki main page - category section

 * Assign a page to a category by using . The categories will be displayed in the top bar, below the subtitle. Click a category to get its category page, where you can view all articles in that category, and describe the category itself. You can also add subcategories to a category.

 * Test area: Categories

In the example in the test wiki, I think the way the category links are used appears similar to the practice of including keywords in articles, or in web page headers. It appears that one might search for articles that were in the intersection of several categories. Now what I am talking about, ordering, seems different, but it is a good sign, I think, that the basic mechanism has many uses.

wikitech-l discussions
The category term appears in discussions on the wikitech-l list.

Recently a discussion started about introducing a separate links table, so that a page with a category link would not automatically become part of the category. The latest version of this idea supports a useful extended syntax. Besides, one can write.

The category links table contains a field, cl_sortkey. By default this is filled with the name of the page the link is on, but this value is overridden by "Some Sort Key", if it exists. There is also an index to the category links table, cl_sortkey, based on cl_to (the category name) and cl_sortkey, so the items in a category can have a definite order in this index if each article has a distinct sort key. The sort key names would have to be constructed in a way that created the desired order, but this may not be a big nuisance.

Outside Work
A google search turns up some other likely links, and the related, important idea of a roadmap, like this one in meatball wiki:

Categorize Everything There are hints there of even better solutions, such as roadmap outlines that authors fill-in incrementally.

and another discussion on C2

about articles that resist categories I think that a single rigid structure is likely to break. Apparently this wiki allows multiple category links on single article. An interesting insight is that categories and roadmaps go together, categories helping to build roadmaps.

C2 has a Road Maps page. They have a Categories Discussion. There is also a Category Category page.

Producing a Static Version
Also, about producing the output, in some static, serial order, there are some projects:

WikiPDF - wiki-to-PDF converter - this seems like the final step needed for the objection that started me thinking. For this to work though, there needs to be a thread to follow through the articles, alphabetical only works for encyclopedias, and maybe not there.

offline reader is a proposal to start a project to enable reading offline, say from a CD. This seems like another form of static content, one aspect of what people are used to now. I suppose, though, that one could allow editing the offline version using extension files, but the changes would not be shared or moderated.

title: User:AJim/extensions


text:
User:AJim

I discovered Wikipedia in February 2004, and was delighted with what I found. I am learning how to use these excellent tools and, in the process, trying to make useful contributions to topics where I have some expertise.

I am greatly impressed with the power and potential of a collaborative encyclopedia project. I am proud to be able to make a contribution.

some things to do:
 * relay history - the contributions of Henry and Morse as a coherent development path
 * relay surge - tungsten loads are the worst case, not inductive, fix that application section

despite all that there is in here, there are some important design insights still missing in the transformer article there could usefully be a section on unintended or accidental transformers in the foldback current limit article
 * schmitt trigger - for connecting fast logic to slowly changing signals
 * related discussion of how slow signals might burn up cmos
 * related discussion of logic level definitions and "undefined zone"
 * inverter transfer functions, it is strange these are missing
 * show black-box y=x connection
 * use of some types of logic as hf amplifiers
 * show derivation of bistable solution
 * link to ring oscillator
 * cross coupling, of course, and why twisted pairs and transpositions are used
 * slipped pairs - when twisted pairs are misused
 * why power wires must not be split in conduits - with NEC reference etc.
 * induction inside airplane struck by lightning from the huge skin dI/dT, why all metal parts, such as seats, must be bonded to prevent shock
 * a more general treatment of the generally useful foldback strategy for dealing with overload or saturation
 * and the stragegy of forcing a limit-cycle oscillation for automatic recovery

helpful links

 * Useful templates
 * Navigational templates
 * Find templates
 * Extended image syntax
 * MediaWiki User's Guide: Creating special characters
 * Template:Chem2 chem formulas
 * Template:EqmR chem arrows
 * Blanking sections sometimes violates policies

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User:AJim


text:
War of the Emboabas

The War of the Emboabas (Guerra dos Emboabas) was a conflict in colonial Brazil waged in 1706-1707 and 1708-1709 over newly discovered gold fields, which had set off a rush to the region between two generations of Portuguese settlers in the viceroyalty of Brazil - then the Captaincy of São Vicente. The discovery of gold set off a rush to the region, Paulistas asserted rights of discovery and non-Paulistas challenged their claims. Although the Portuguese crown sought more control in the area and the Paulistas sought protection of their claims, the Emboabas won. The crown re-assessed its position in the region and made administrative changes subsequently.

History
Starting from the village of São Paulo dos Campos de Piratininga (now São Paulo) the Bandeirantes had explored most of what is now southeastern and southwestern Brazil, effectively taking advantage of the union of the Crowns of Portugal and Spain from 1580 to 1640 to incorporate all the former Spanish territories then west of the Tordesilhas Line. Their goal was to capture new Indian slaves (which put them in conflict with the Jesuit Reductions), recapture runaway slaves and find precious minerals.

Their search was rewarded in an area just north of their original Capitania, until then inaccessible, which became Minas dos Matos Gerais and is now Minas Gerais. However the mines, while rich, were in a vast area they could not effectively settle, so they attracted a gold rush from Portugal. The newcomers, called Emboabas, found an alternative, shorter route to the sea; the Caminho Novo das Minas dos Matos Gerais to São Sebastião do Rio de Janeiro on Guanabara Bay, bypassing and alienating the original discoverers.

The Bandeirantes, or Paulistas, tried to assert rights of precedence but were defeated. As a result, the provinces of Minas Gerais and Rio de Janeiro were formed, their capital cities of Vila Rica do Ouro Preto and São Sebastião do Rio de Janeiro, respectively, became the new centers of power in the vice-kingdom of Brazil. São Sebastião (later shortened to its present name of Rio de Janeiro) became the capital city of the viceroyalty and later of the United Kingdom of Portugal, Brazil and the Algarves.

As soon as news of the discovery of gold spread thousands of outsiders moved to the area and became known pejoratively as "Emboabas". The term is derived from the Tupi mbóaba which literally means "hairy leg" (mbo (leg) + tab (hairy)). Originally the term referred to birds with feathered legs and as, unlike the Paulista pioneers, the outsiders always wore knee-high boots with their trousers tucked in, giving them the name.

Alternatively, according to the Dicionário Houaiss emboaba could be derived from the Tupi words mbo (do) and tab (hurt) meaning "those who invade or attack" and would be applied to a group rather than an individual.

Consequences

 * Regulation of the distribution of mines between Emboabas and Paulistas.
 * Regulation of collection of the quinto do ouro tax.
 * Breakup on 3 November 1709 of the Province of São Vicente into São Paulo e Minas de Ouro and Rio de Janeiro, ruled directly by the Crown.
 * São Paulo attained city status.
 * End of the wars in the mining areas with the crown assuming the administrative control of the region.
 * The defeat of Paulistas caused some of them to move west where, years later, they would discover new gold deposits in the current states of Mato Grosso do Sul, Mato Grosso and Goiás.
 * The production of gold after the war increased so that Minas Gerais became the richest region of Brazil between 1740 and 1760.

title: War of the Emboabas


text:
User talk:Tdent

Welcome to the Wikipedia
Here are some links I find useful

 * Policy Library
 * Cite your sources
 * Verifiability
 * Wikiquette
 * Conflict resolution
 * Brilliant prose
 * Neutral point of view
 * Pages needing attention
 * Peer review
 * Bad jokes and other deleted nonsense
 * Village pump
 * Boilerplate text

Cheers, Sam Spade 15:58, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

Elgar's Enigma
Tdent, you wrote: I think that unfortunately, using these sloppy, untestable methods of 'proof', one can 'prove' almost anything. Elgar could have written "Circle of friends" - but he didn't. There are dozens of nursery rhymes and poems which have 'dark' things in them: what is special about blackbirds? What has 'four and twenty' got to do with pi? Has pi really been a universal part of primary school education for the last century?? Every piece of music abounds in numerical values, and with enough mathematical ingenuity these values can be rearranged into almost any form a person wants. The "derivation" of 22/7 is simply numerological mystification. Why exactly should one multiply 11 by 2 and then divide by 7, rather than any other set of operations on these three numbers? The decimal expansion that goes on for ever begins 3.14159, but the rounding is 3.142: you can't have it both ways, at least considering a melody where you have to choose either '1' or '2'. --Tdent (talk) 21:34, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Additional "proof" (of the Pi solution)was provided by Elgar in 1929 in a set of notes issued with the Aeolian Company pianola rolls published in 1929:

The alternation of the two quavers and two crotchets in the first bar and their reversal in the second bar will be noticed; references to this grouping are almost continuous (either melodically or in the accompanying figures - in Variation XIII, beginning at bar 11 [503], for example). The drop of a seventh in the Theme (bars 3 and 4) should be observed. At bar 7 (G major) appears the rising and falling passage in thirds which is much used later, e.g. Variation III, bars 10.16. [106, 112] - E.E.

In 1929, Elgar was 72 years old and in ill health. His wife Alice had died as had his best friend August Jaeger. No one had solved his enigma in 30 years and he steadfastly refused to give up the answer. In the 1929 notes, he provided three strong hints to confirm that Pi was the solution. The first sentence refers to two quavers and two crotchets. This is a hint at 22 of 22/7, the common fractional approximation of Pi. (Remember, the first four notes are scale degree 3-1-4-2, a common decimal approximation of Pi.) In the second sentence, he points out the drop of the seventh in bars 3 and 4. These two sevenths (2/7) are preceded by the first eleven notes of the piece and 11 x 2/7 = 22/7. The third sentence contains a reference to bar 7. This is a hint at /7 of 22/7.

Could this possibly be a coincidence in a piece of music written the year after the humorous Indiana Pi Bill of 1897? Elgar loved japes and that piece of legislation regarding Pi was one of the best. "Four and twenty blackbirds (dark) baked in a (Pi) was just a pun. An enigma is only a puzzle or a riddle, and this obviously was one of the best.  (it took over 110 years to solve).

Best Wishes,

Dick Santa dnlsanta@hotmail.com Dnlsanta (talk) 17:26, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

title: User talk:Tdent


text:
User talk:A1r

Please feel free to add a section if you'd like to tell me something.

--Air 13:15, 20 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Image source
Thank you for uploading Image:Arbroath signal tower museum.jpg. Its copyright status is unclear, so it may have to be deleted. Please leave a note on the image page about the source of the image. Thank you. --Ellmist 04:11, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Ah, forgot to add my credit. Fixed. --Air 13:02, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Tide
Hi A1r, are you still watching the article on "tide"? I finally got around to checking more sources and correct the article. I think I have a balanced account now of scientific insight. Also any discrepancy between explanation of effects by moon and sun has disappeared.

Warhammer 40k
I was wondering how I can join this project and help it get up and running. Please get back to me. General Aion 01:12, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Notification: changes to "Mark my edits as minor by default" preference
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ArbCom elections are now open!
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title: User talk:A1r


text: User talk:136.206.1.17

title: User talk:136.206.1.17


text:
Marc-Joseph Marion du Fresne

Marc-Joseph Marion du Fresne (22 May 1724 – 12 June 1772) was a French privateer, East India captain and explorer. The expedition he led to find the hypothetical Terra Australis in 1771 made important geographic discoveries in the south Indian Ocean and anthropological discoveries in Tasmania and New Zealand. In New Zealand they spent longer living on shore than any previous European expedition. Half way through the expedition's stay Marion was killed during a military assault by the Ngare Raumati iwi.

He is commemorated with the toponym Marion Bay, Tasmania, as well in the name of two successive French oceanic research and supply vessel the Marion Dufresne (1972) and the Marion Dufresne II, which service the French Southern Territories of Amsterdam Island, the Crozet Islands, the Kerguelen Islands, and Saint Paul Island.

Early career
Born in Saint Malo in 1724 into the non-noble, but wealthy, Marion family of shipowners and merchants, he eventually inherited a farm 'Le Fresne' near the village of Saint-Jean-sur-Vilaine and styled himself Marion Dufresne (or in some instances Dufresne-Marion). He was never known simply as (or signed himself) 'Du Fresne', but this has become a familiar appellation in New Zealand and Tasmania. He first went to sea in 1741 on a voyage to Cadiz aboard the 22-gun Saint-Ésprit.

During the War of the Austrian Succession Marion commanded several ships as a privateer, including the Prince de Conty where he transported Charles Edward Stuart from Scotland to France. In the Seven Years' War, he was engaged in various naval operations including taking the astronomer Alexandre Guy Pingré to observe the 1761 transit of Venus in the Indian Ocean.

In January 1762 Marion received a grant of 625 argents of land at Quartier Militaire in Mauritius. Although he returned to France in 1764 and 1767, he made the island home in 1768.

Terra Australis expedition

In October 1770 Marion convinced Pierre Poivre, the civil administrator in Port Louis, to equip him with two ships and send him on a twofold mission to the Pacific. Marion's fellow explorer Louis Antoine de Bougainville had recently returned from the Pacific with a Tahitian native, Ahutoru. Marion was tasked with returning Ahutoru to his homeland, and then to explore the south Pacific for the hypothetical Terra Australis Incognita. For these purposes Marion was given two ships, the Mascarin and the Marquis de Castries and departed on 18 October 1771.

Marion spent most of his personal fortune on outfitting the expedition with supplies and crew. He hoped to make a significant profit on the journey by trading with the reportedly wealthy islands of the South Pacific. No part of Marion's mission could be achieved; Ahutoru died of smallpox shortly after embarkation, and the expedition did not locate Terra Australis or make a profit from trade. Instead, Marion discovered first the Prince Edward Islands and then the Crozet Islands before sailing towards New Zealand and Australia. His ships spent several days in Tasmania, where Marion Bay in the south-east is named after him. He was the first European to encounter the Aboriginal Tasmanians.

Arrival in New Zealand

Marion sighted New Zealand's Mount Taranaki on 25 March 1772, and named the mountain Pic Mascarin without knowing that James Cook had named it "Mount Egmont" three years earlier.

Over the next month, they repaired their two ships and treated their scurvy, first anchoring at Spirits Bay, and later in the Bay of Islands. Apparently their relations with Māori were peaceful at first; they communicated through the Tahitian vocabulary learned from Ahu-toru and sign language. They befriended many Māori including Te Kauri (Te Kuri) of the Ngāpuhi iwi (tribe). The French established a significant vegetable garden on Moturua Island. Sixty of the French sailors had developed scurvy and were on shore in a tent hospital. They had been invited to visit local Māori at their pa – a very rare event – and had slept there overnight. Māori in return had been invited on board the ships and had slept in the ships overnight. The French officers made a detailed study of the habits and customs of Māori including greetings, sexual mores, fishing methods, the role of females, the making of fern root paste, the killing of prisoners and cannibalism.

In these months there were two instances where Māori were detained. The first had sneaked on board ship and stolen a cutlass. He was detained for a brief period to give him a fright, then released to his friends. Later the Māori made a night raid on the hospital camp taking away many guns and uniforms. While the soldiers chased the raiders, Māori slipped back and stole an anchor. Two men were held as hostage against the return of the stolen goods. One of them admitted he had been involved in the theft but accused Te Kauri of being involved. Marion, finding the men bound, ordered them unbound and released. Later an armed party of Māori approached the French as if to challenge them, but the French understood enough tikanga to make peace with them by exchanging gifts.

Death and reprisals
No French witness to Marion's death survived and it was some time before his crew were aware of his fate. Two contemporary accounts were written by French officers, Jean Roux and Ambroise du Clesmeur.

During the night of 9 June 1772, French sentries at the hospital camp noticed about six Māori prowling. In the morning it was discovered that Māori had also been prowling around a second camp where the French had been making masts. The next day Māori arrived with a present of fish. Roux said the Māori were astonished at the blunderbusses he had mounted outside his tent. He noticed the visiting chief taking a close look at the weapons and how they worked, as well as the defences of the camp, and became suspicious of his motives. The chief asked for the guns to be demonstrated and Roux shot a dog.

That night more Māori were found on Moturua Island prowling around the hospital camp but ran when sentries approached. Captain du Clesmeur alerted Marion to the rise in suspicious activity, but Marion did not listen. On the afternoon of 12 June 1772 Marion and 15 armed sailors went to Te Kauri's village and then went in the captain's gig to go fishing in his favourite fishing area. Marion and 26 men of his crew were killed. Those killed included de Vaudricourt and Pierre Lehoux (a volunteer), Thomas Ballu of Vannes, Pierre Mauclair (the second pilot) from St Malo, Louis Ménager (the steersman) from Lorient, Vincent Kerneur of Port-Louis, Marc Le Garff from Lorient, Marc Le Corre of Auray, Jean Mestique of Pluvigner, Pierre Cailloche of Languidic and Mathurin Daumalin of Hillion.

That night 400 armed Māori suddenly attacked the hospital camp but were stopped in their tracks by the threat of the multiple blunderbusses. Roux held his fire and realised that they had narrowly escaped being killed in their sleep. One chief told Roux that Te Kauri had killed Marion. At this point longboats full of armed French sailors arrived with the news that Marion and the sailors had been killed. One survivor, who had been spared, told them Māori had tricked them into going into the bush, where they had been ambushed, with all the others being killed.

In the following days the French came under relentless attack. The next day about 1,200 Māori surrounded the French, led by Te Kauri. As they approached, Roux ordered Te Kauri shot. Later even more Māori reinforcements arrived. The French decided to abandon the hospital camp. The Māori then stole all the tools and supplies and burnt the camp down. They were close enough that the French could see they were wearing the clothes of Marion and his fellow dead sailors.

The French retreated to Moturua Island. That night Māori again attacked the camp and this time the French opened a general fire. The next day even more Māori arrived taking their forces to about 1,500 men. The French charged this huge force with 26 armed soldiers and put them to flight, the Māori fleeing back to Te Kauri's pa. The French attacked the pa, firing at the defenders, who showered them with spears. The remainder got into canoes and fled. About 250 Māori including five chiefs were killed in the battle. Many of the French were wounded.

Roux, Julien–Marie Crozet and Ambroise Bernard-Marie du Clesmeur took joint command and undertook reprisals against the Māori over a one-month period as the ships were prepared for departure.

A month later on 7 July Roux searched Te Kauri's deserted pa and found a sailor's cooked head on a spike, as well as human bones near a fire. They left on 12 July 1772. The French buried a bottle at Waipoa on Moturua, containing the arms of France and a formal statement taking possession of the whole country, with the name of "France Australe." However, both published and unpublished accounts of Marion's death circulated widely, giving New Zealand a bad reputation as a dangerous land unsuitable for colonisation, and challenged the stereotypes of Pacific Islanders as noble savages then prevalent in Europe.

Possible motives for military assault
There are different possible reasons for the Māori military assault on the landing site, including that the chief Te Kauri (Te Kuri) considered that Marion was a threat to his authority or Te Kauri became concerned at the economic effect of supplying food for the two crews, or that Marion's crew, possibly unwittingly, broke several tapu laws related to their not carrying out the rituals required before the cutting down of kauri trees, or breaking of tapu by fishing in Manawaora Bay.

An account told by a Ngāpuhi elder to John White (ethnographer 1826–1891), but not published until 1965, describes Te Kauri and Tohitapu as leading the military resolution to the landing. Tapu had been placed on Manawaora Bay after members of the local tribe drowned here some time earlier, and their bodies had been washed up at Te Kauri's (Tacoury's sic) Cove. Since the interlopers did not leave, a military resolution was required.

title: Marc-Joseph Marion du Fresne


text:
Windgap, County Kilkenny

Windgap, is a village in County Kilkenny, in Ireland. Windgap is located in the south-western part of Kilkenny on the border with Tipperary, just south of Callan. The village is located on the R689 regional road, the nearest main road being the N76 from Kilkenny to Clonmel.

Windgap was named for its location on a pass through hills east of Slievenamon. The landscape of Windgap is dominated by steep hills and large wooded areas. Windgap lies in a former slate-quarrying district spanning the Kilkenny-Tipperary border. Today, agriculture is Windgap's main economic activity, with dairy products as the main export. The most notable buildings in Windgap are its 19th-century graveyard, The Old League House, which once served as a home for poor tenant farmers (see Irish National Land League), and early 20th-century grotto.

Those who hail from the village are sometimes referred to as 'Gappers'.

History and culture
The Mayor of Windgap is an 1834 novel by Michael Banim set in Windgap in 1779. Windgap is also referred to in the 1907 book The Placenames of the Decies by Rev. P. Power.

Sport
Windgap GAA club was founded in 1954 following the advent of the "one parish rule" in the county. Gaelic games have been played in the area since the 1890s. In the early days, it was better known for football, but hurling was played with the Slatequarries in 1929 and St. Joseph 's in Tullahought in the 1940s. Handball first made its appearance in the Slatequarries in the early 1900s before it spread to Windgap. Camogie started in Lamogue in the 1920s and was played in many areas of the parish with teams representing Windgap and Tullahought at various stages. Ladies Football was played in the area for a time in the 1970s with a team in Tullahought. Windgap Camogie Club that was founded in 1994 and Windgap Handball Club in 1984. Galmoy and Windgap's teams amalgamated in 2005.

Notable people

 * John Banim (1798–1842) writer
 * Fearghus Ó Fearghail priest and academic
 * Sharon, Zsara & Nadia Whelan Murder victims (kd. 2008)

title: Windgap, County Kilkenny


text:
User talk:Howardjp/Page 1

Welcome to the Wikipedia
Here are some links I find useful

 * Policy Library
 * Cite your sources
 * Verifiability
 * Wikiquette
 * Conflict resolution
 * Brilliant prose
 * Neutral point of view
 * Pages needing attention
 * Peer review
 * Bad jokes and other deleted nonsense
 * Village pump
 * Boilerplate text

Cheers, Sam Spade 16:02, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

UMCP Alumni
Hi, I've finished what I wanted to contribute to that section. Just wanted to make sure a little bit more was listed. Tallyho70 19:43, 15 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Limited liability company
Quick catch! Yes, that was wrong. I note that Types of companies does state: (also Ltd in UK and Inc in US)
 * Limited liability company or LLC

This is wrong isn't it? Mark 19:28, 3 May 2005 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I believe that is wrong.  My understanding is that the UK does not have a business type similar to the LLC or GmbH.  But I do not know for certain.  -Howardjp 20:11, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Not Necessarily true
Take for instance this from UMCP page..."launching the joint NASA-University of Maryland "Deep Impact" spacecraft in early January, 2005. On July 4, 2005 the craft will land on the "Temple 1" comet to analyze its compenents and help scientists at the university and NASA better understand the composition of the universe"

Does that "sound like an advertisement," and to me that has "dated material." Your argument is not consistent; I can show you 47 more examples like that from colleges and universities across the wiki site. Who’s to say what is and isn’t appropriate. As long as the data is relevant, and accurate, I think it has a place
 * It includes a date, but it is not dated. It doesn't say "launching the joint NASA spacecraft recently...", which is out of date the moment it is typed.  That is also specific research.  While there are plenty of other university pages that are more hype for a second- (or lower) tier school than usable content, this is one I happened to catch pretty quickly. -Howardjp 18:59, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

It is poignant to see an individual like yourself accuse me of copyright violation. I’ve been to hundreds of college and university pages here on Wikipedia, and it seems that you’re not complaining about other schools (esp. UMCP), but you have a burden for the information on UMBC’s page.
 * You're an idiot. User:Jussenadv accused you of copyright violation.  And even if you were right, I am certain "poignant" is not the word that would describe it.  Frankly, I am not even certain relevant would come to mind.  Regardless, those other pages are not in my watchlist.  Just a handful of schools whose pages I have previously edited.  -Howardjp 18:59, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

How can you be certain as to what describes MY feelings. Information that I posed first was not dated material, but did refer to dates. Even if there was, this is an encyclopedia, but it is important to understand that this is also a fluctuating encyclopedia. This can be seen even on the UMCP site with phrases like “In the past five years…” Obviously, in the next five years that statement becomes irrelevant and not true.

 * You're right. I just fixed it so it says "Since 2000..." -Howardjp 18:20, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

Second, you have no information as to a copyright violation, because you (or any other user) did not consult me as to the permission I had to present such information. Copyright violation deals with the owner of the material, and the individual who copies it, not third party accusers. If User:Jussenadv accused me of violation, they had no contact with me to ask about permissions granted to display such information, so therefore their accusation is irrelevant in my site.

 * Again, you're an idiot. I never accused you of copyright violation and have never edited your posts on those grounds.  Feel free to complain, if you'd like, but at least find the right target.  -Howardjp 18:20, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

In addition, “hype,” in your connotative sense, refers to information that is not usable, because there is an assumption that is is not relevant or true. That has absolutely nothing to do with second (or lower) tier schools. Hype can plague “first tier” or “fifth tier” schools. “First tier” schools have no more right to have a plethora of information about its institution that a “fifth tier” school. It is a fallacy to think that “hype” is only something that second (or lower) tier schools display.

P.S. It is bad taste to refer to me as an “idiot,” sure we may not agree, but name-calling is starkly immature.

 * Then don't prove me right. -Howardjp 18:20, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

title: User talk:Howardjp/Page 1


text:
Talk:Baby Bear (Sesame Street)

The old article was:

Baby Bear is a muppet character on Sesame Street.

Originally part of a skit telling the story of Goldylocks and the Three Bears, he has since emerged as an independent character in his own right.

He is friends with Elmo and Zoe.

title: Talk:Baby Bear (Sesame Street)


text:
Borisoglebsky, Yaroslavl Oblast

Borisoglebsky (Борисогле́бский) is an urban locality (an urban-type settlement) and the administrative center of Borisoglebsky District of Yaroslavl Oblast, Russia, located on the Ustye River, 16 km from Rostov and 77 km southwest of Yaroslavl. Population: 4,600 (1968).

The settlement's principal tourist attraction is the famous Borisoglebsky Monastery, now a museum. The monastery is named after Saints Boris and Gleb. The monastery was favored by Ivan the Terrible who personally supervised the construction of towered walls and bell-tower around an even more ancient cathedral. The only addition made to the monastery after Ivan's death is a superb carved barbican church, commissioned by the metropolitan Iona Sysoevich in the late 17th century.

In 2005, the statues of monk Peresvet (by Zurab Tsereteli) and of Prince Pozharsky were installed near the monastery walls.

title: Borisoglebsky, Yaroslavl Oblast


text:
User talk:Samnell~enwiki

Welcome to the Wikipedia
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Cheers, Sam Spade 16:02, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

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Renamed
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title: User talk:Samnell~enwiki


text:
Cratloe

Cratloe is a village in County Clare, Ireland, situated between Limerick and Shannon in the mid-west of Ireland. It is possible that the name derives from Croit-shliabh meaning "hump-backed hill", referring to Woodcock Hill. The present-day parish of Cratloe consists of the former parish of Kilfintinan and a portion of the contemporary parish of Killeely. This was agreed upon by priests in the 18th century, who claimed there were not enough members of the clergy to operate fully in both parishes.

History
The area of Cratloe is first mentioned in the Annals of the Four Masters, where it is recorded that in 376 AD, Crimthann mac Fidaig, King of Munster and High King of Ireland died in the Cratloe area from poison administered by his sister, Mongfind, who wished for her son Brión mac Echach Muigmedóin to be High King. Mongfind herself also died later, as she drank the poison to convince the king to take some. In the end, however, Brian had to settle for the Kingdom of Connaught, while the High Kingship went to his half-brother, who was later known as Niall of the Nine Hostages.

In the 9th century, when the McNamaras territory was invaded by warriors from the Kingdom of Aileach in Ulster, the invaders chopped down oak trees in Cratloe Woods and brought them back to Ulster for the roof of the Aileach Royal Palace. Cratloe Woods have since been known for their oak trees and their wood used in many important buildings throughout Europe.

It was recorded in 940 that King Muirchertach of the Leather Cloaks and his forces, found that Cretshalach, as it was then known, was the worst passageway during their Circuit of Ireland. In ancient times the passageway through Cratloe ran over a steep hill, and was the main route from Munster into Connacht. The army stayed the night on top of the mountain where High King Crimthann was murdered, Sliabh-Suidhe-an-riogh, or in English, The Mountain Of The Death Of The King.

In 1510, an Anglo-Irish army led by Gerald Mór FitzGerald, the 8th earl of Kildare, marched on Thomond, and was met and defeated near Cratloe by an army of the O'Brien, McNamara, Sil-Aedha and Clanrickard clans led by Turlough O'Brien, son of Teige Mac Murrough O'Brien, the Lord of Thomond. The invading army were defeated with ease as the entire force had taken the short cut through Cratloe into Limerick, and as a result were ambushed by the Gaelic army.

Geography
Cratloe is bounded to the south by the tidal estuary of the River Shannon, and to the west by the Ratty/ Uí gCearnaigh (Garney) river. A large part of the eastern boundary is formed by a creek known locally as the Sandy River, or the Cratloe Creek. With the exceptions of a few low hills, the portion of Cratloe south of the N18 dual-carriageway, and west of the R462 to Sixmilebridge mainly consists of the low lying flood plains of the tidal rivers. The farmlands in these areas are protected by levees. The remainder of the parish consists of the south-western and western portion of Woodcock Hill, which summits at 310 m (1,016 ft) just outside Cratloe's boundary. The western side of this hill is commonly known as Gallows Hill, named after the executions of rebels by Cromwellian forces that took place here around the year 1650.

Cratloe Woods
A state forest has been planted over a large portion of the Cratloe area, with mostly Spruce and Pine Trees covering the 800 acre woodland. On the back road to Limerick that passes through the village, the ancient oak trees of Garranon Wood are still visible, and the forest has been historically dated to exist from at least 700 AD. The oak trees from this forest provided the timbers for the roofs of London's Westminster Hall and the Royal Palace in Amsterdam. St Mary's Cathedral in Limerick city was also built using Cratloe timber.

Places of interest
The area around Cratloe village contains several ancient and medieval sites. One of the oldest historic sites in the village itself is in the Craughaun Cemetery, where a megalithic wedge tomb, known as the Ballinphunta Dolmen, was discovered. This tomb was excavated in 1990 during an enlargement of the graveyard and a replica erected some time later in the newer section of the graveyard. Also in this graveyard is a vault to the Blood family, dating to 1738 when the first member of the family, Robert Maghlin, was buried. The ruins of the old Craughaun Church, dating from 1418, are also present.

D'Esterre Bridge, built in 1784, crossing the Ratty/O'gChearnaigh River between Bunratty and Sixmilebridge, is characterised by the ruins of the gate-towers remaining from its days as a toll-crossing. Henry D'Esterre built this bridge at his own expense as he wanted a crossing close to his own estate. The famous duel in February 1815 between Daniel O'Connell and Henry D'Esterre's son, John Norcot, arose in local tradition because O'Connell refused to pay the toll, although this conflicts with the conventional account of the duel.

Within the Garranon Oak Wood, a roadside well known as the Squire's Well can be found. The novelist and travel writer Georgiana Chatterton stated in 1841 that it flows from a clear stream, but over the time it has not been used, it has nearly been swallowed up in foliage and natural growth. The remnants of several small ráths, or ring-forts are located in various fields around Cratloe, although several of these forts were destroyed when the Western Railway Corridor was built in the late 19th century.

Castles
Cratloe is the location of several ruined castles and tower houses, including Cratloemoyle Castle (sometimes referred to as 'Cratloe Castle'), located just to the north of the N18 road on the approach to Limerick. The castle is 5 stories high and was built sometime in the early 1500s. John McNamara, who died in 1780, was the last occupant of the castle and as he had no one to pass the castle onto, the castle was sold and for the first time in 700 years the land around the castle was not in the possession of the McNamara family.

Less than half a mile away, on the opposite side of the road, Cratloekeel Castle sits on a low outcrop, and can be seen from the road among the surrounding trees. This castle was built by Sean McNamara in the latter part of the 15th century, but by 1641 it had passed out of the McNamara family and was owned by a Dutch Protestant.

Further south, on the banks of the River Shannon, is the site of Castle Donnell or Cratloemore Castle, though now little of the ruins are left. This was once one of the biggest castles in Cratloe, being used by the McNamaras as a trading post because of its location on the River Shannon and its proximity to both Bunratty and Limerick. In 1730 most of this castle was destroyed and the stones were used to build Cratloe Wood House, the only example of an Irish longhouse still lived in by a family.

On the western slopes of Woodcock Hill, towards Sixmilebridge, the ruins of Ballintlea Castle lie in a farmyard. All of these castles are recorded as being built by the MacNamara clan, one of the most powerful families in the Kingdom of Thomond.

Churches and graveyards
In addition to the parish church, the Church of St. John, Cratloe, there is another church within the parish, on the approach to the village of Sixmilebridge. This church is known locally as "The Little Church", and is unusual in that it is not dedicated to any particular saint. This church was built in the late 1700s but was demolished in 1858 and replaced with a new edifice. Again this church was renovated in 1988, with the Bishop of Limerick calling it "the little gem of the Limerick Diocese".

The ruins of several other chapels and churches can be found in the area. As mentioned above, there is one such ruin within the cemetery at Craughaun, and there is another near Cratloemoyle Castle, which was not really a church but an oratory for the owners of the castle. This oratory, together with the nearby well, were dedicated to St. John. In his 1893 work The History and Topography of the County of Clare, James Frost mentions that one Augustus Stafford O'Brien MP removed the ruins of a friary from the grounds of his residence, Cratloe Woods House, apparently because it interfered with the view. The ruins of the medieval parish church and cemetery of Kilfintenan can be found in the townland of Carrowmore on the road from Sixmilebridge to Gallows Hill. Kilfintenan graveyard is known as the smallest graveyard in Ireland. This graveyard was reserved for burying children and strangers who were travelling though the parish. The ruins of Cill an Bothair, or the Church of the Road, can also be found in the north of the parish. The graveyard of this church was again specifically used as a burial grounds for children. Kilcredaunnadober Graveyard in the townland of Cratloemore was a small burial ground for unbaptised children.

Transport
The largest road that passes through Cratloe is the N18 national primary road that connects Limerick and Galway. The road splits in two at Cratloe, with one direction going towards Limerick and the other bypassing the city via the Limerick Tunnel, changing into the M7 motorway to Dublin just outside the city. The R462 regional road, which begins as the Cratloe exit from the N18, connects the towns of Sixmilebridge and Tulla and the villages of Kilkishen and Kilmurry to Limerick. Shannon Airport and the Shannon Free Zone are located just 15 km away from the village.

The railway line from Limerick to Ennis also passes through the village, although the station remains closed at present. Cratloe railway station opened on 17 January 1859, but finally closed on 17 June 1963. As of 2008 it was hoped, with the re-opening of the Western Railway Corridor in 2010, that Cratloe Station would again be operational in the future. As of 2023, the station is still closed and used as a private dwelling.

Education
The local primary school is St. Johns National School, located just across the road from Cratloe Church. There were two previous schools before this school was built in 1980, the first one was built in 1849 and is now the local community hall and the second was built in 1965 and is now a small shopping area. Both these schools were built because of the expanding population. The present school, St. Johns National School, had an enrollment of 285 pupils as of 2023.

Sport
The most played sports in Cratloe are Gaelic games, although sports such as rugby and soccer have been catching up. In terms of Gaelic games, 2014 was the most successful year for Cratloe GAA club, as the Clare Senior Hurling Championship and the Clare Senior Football Championship was won, making Cratloe the first club in 85 years to win both senior county titles since Ennis Dalcassians achieved it in 1929. This year also marked Cratloe's second Clare Senior Hurling Championship title, with the first coming five years earlier in 2009.

Notable people

 * Naomi Carroll, international hockey player.
 * Podge Collins, Gaelic footballer and hurler
 * Conor McGrath, All-Star hurler
 * Conor Ryan, All-Ireland winning hurler

title: Cratloe


text:
User talk:R h c

Welcome to the Wikipedia
Here are some links I find useful

 * Policy Library
 * Cite your sources
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 * Conflict resolution
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 * Boilerplate text

Cheers, Sam Spade 16:03, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

 * Let me see... Our "Leader" is Jimbo Wales. Some other leaders include User:Eloquence and User:Maveric149. You don't need to contact them however to make improvements, even sweeping ones. The wikipedia strives to be very egalitarian, and at least theoretically encourages change ;) Be bold! is a common phrase to accentuate this. On the other hand, those among us are varying in their degree of friendliness and acceptance of policy. I have spend far too much of my time as of late dealing with internet trolls on the wiki, and thus felt inclined to spend more of my time welcoming newcomers and creating new articles, rather than editing controvercial topics (which is where the more difficult folks tend to gather, BTW). In any case good luck, and feel free to enquire as to any questions you might have (altho the above links should answer most of them) and simply to be sociable as well. Unlike some I tend to be fairly chatty, so don't be suprised if the next interaction (or one of them) is of a less polite and endearing nature than mine. Such is the way of the internet, where the lowest common denominator of social discourse all to often rises to the top. Welcome aboard and thanks for your improvements, Sam Spade 22:34, 13 May 2004 (UTC)

 * P.S. one of your questions (expert resource) left me a bit stumped. Some questions should go to the Village pump, some to the Reference_desk, but most are best answered within the talk page of the article in question, reached by either clicking "discuss this page" on the taskbar to the left, or typing Talk:Life insurance (or talk:XYZpage name). Questions left there may or may not be answered promptly, but its often the best place to start w a specific question. Sam Spade 22:41, 13 May 2004 (UTC)

User Categorisation
You were listed on the Wikipedians/Ontario page as living in or being associated with Mississauga, Ontario. As part of the User categorisation project, these lists are being replaced with user categories. If you would like to add yourself to the category that is replacing the page, please visit Category:Wikipedians in Mississauga for instructions.--Rmky87 02:35, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

title: User talk:R h c


text:
User talk:Munkee

Welcome to the Wikipedia
Here are some links I find useful

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Cheers, Sam Spade 16:04, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

Thanks
For the typo fixes on the A&M pages. — BQZip01 — talk 03:13, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

title: User talk:Munkee


text:
Pietro Maria Bardi

Pietro Maria Bardi (La Spezia, February 21, 1900 – São Paulo, October 1, 1999) was an Italian writer, curator and collector, mostly known for being the Founding Director of the São Paulo Museum of Art in Brazil.

Bardi started his career in the 1920s as a journalist, writing about art and architecture for newspapers like Gazzetta di Genova and Corriere della Sera. Between 1926 and 1930, Bardi's focus shifted "from journalism to the art market." In 1928 he opened the Galleria Bardi in Milan, which exhibited many artists of the Scuola Romana. Two years later he moved to Rome and opened the Galleria di Roma, where the Second Exhibition of Rationalist Architecture was held in 1931. "Throughout the 1930s, Bardi argued for the alliance of Rationalist architecture and fascist politics in the pages of Milan newspaper L'Ambrosiano, in the architecture journal Quadrante ... and in the Rome newspaper Meridiano."

Bardi visited Brazil for the first time in 1933 and permanently relocated in São Paulo in 1946 with his wife, architect Lina Bo Bardi. In 1947 he co-founded with Assis Chateaubriand the São Paulo Museum of Art, which he directed until 1996, stirring the Brazilian artistic community with his ideas about popularizing museums by making both modern and classical art more accessible. Hand-in-hand with this idea, he and his wife, Lina Bo Bardi, developed the concept of an open, wide exhibition space where paintings were fixed to acrylic pedestals, thus making the whole space visible at once and the works seemingly suspended in space. The substitution of traditional walls for the acrylic pedestals became a big point of debate.

He died in São Paulo in 1999, four months before his 100th birthday.

title: Pietro Maria Bardi


text:
User talk:CCChen

Welcome to the Wikipedia
Here are some links I find useful

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Cheers, Sam Spade 16:05, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:CCChen


text:
Talk:1997 Red River flood

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Mhubbe2.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 13:02, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Recent Updates/additions
I added the "Societal Response" Section along with the information and citations that go with it. --Mhubbe2 (talk) 23:39, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

Missing Citations
Citations missing for the entire overview section, the first paragraph for the "Previous floods" section, and the first paragraph for the "Impacts" section. --Mhubbe2 (talk) 23:39, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

Untitled
This article is quite Manitoba-centric -- quite inappropriate considering most of the damage was done in Grand Forks. Unfortunately, I don't have much direct knowledge of the floods, so this is going to take a bit of research. Care to help? --Alexwcovington 16:08, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

I don't think it's style to use the definite article in the title. - Montréalais 17:27, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

 * I agree. Perhaps "Red River Flood, 1997" would be better. --Alexwcovington 18:26, 12 May 2004 (UTC)

I'm not very happy with the title of this article. It seems a little confusing to have a comma in a title. Would "Red River Flood of 1997" be better? --MatthewUND 06:17, August 16, 2005 (UTC)

I think it's fine either way. Subsurd 07:35, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

Ugh, now it's too North Dakota-centric. --AtomicCactus 07:42, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Questioning snowfall amount
This statement needs clarification: “There was overabundant snowfall the past winter. A total of 98.6 inches (250 cm) of snow accumulated.”

In what city was this number? Does “accumulation” mean the snow that was on the ground at the end of winter or the total snowfall over the winter? My recollection is that for Fargo the previous record snowfall for a winter was 89.9 inches, and then Fargo got about 120 inches of snowfall in the winter of 1996-97, exceeding the previous record by a third. This is my unresearched recollection.

Olivia

 * If I recall, (I am at work right now but will do some serious editing when I get home tonight), the 98.6 was in canada. Fargo received well over 100 inches that year.  I have a few taped news broadcasts from that year.  Let me break them out of storage and fire up the VCR (haven't done that in years).  I'll see if we can balance this article out a bit.-- Brian  ( How am I doing? ) 15:36, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Should add table of final crest levels
I'd think it would be informative to provide a table of the final river crest levels for each major city along the river. In light of the current flooding of the Red in 2006, I've seen incorrect information pop up in current news reports comparing this year's flood to 1997 (GF's crest of 54 feet in 1997 was recently used to incorrectly contrast against Fargo's projected crest of 37.5 feet for this year). --Djamund 04 Apr 2006

I think that's a good idea. I wouldn't mind seeing a Fargo-Moorhead section either. Subsurd 18:36, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Causes of flood
As I remember, one of the problems involved the river flowing from south to north. The land in the south thawed earlier (naturally), but the water couldn't drain easily because further north the river was still choked with ice.

Image not from 1997?
The arial photo below the photo of the river gaudge seems to not be from 1997. The Blue Moose Bar and Grill building is not in the photo- at the time of the 1997 flood it was located just south of DeMers Ave between Opticare and the dike. The Pillsbary Bridge still has rails and ties on it. At the time of the flood, the bridge had been converted to a pedestrian bridge, with a fence lineing the sides. -JWGreen 13:37, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Correct I was there and suffered through ALL of it. There was over 100 inches of snow ON THE GROUND. We had a blizzard. The temperature rose above freezing, then it rained. Fargo got hit first - being south of Grand Forks some 75 miles, they experienced overland flooding first as a result of the frozen ground not being able to absorb the melting snow and rain runoff. The water literally ran across I-29 towards the river. All the bridges spanning the river at Grand Forks dammed the river ice and contributed to the rising waters. They dropped soot at dynamited the ice to no avail. Prior to the main dykes breaking that Friday night we were sandbagging to 35 feet - the figure they said would be the crest. (makeshift signs appeared after the flooding stating "35 feet my ass") The damage was unbelievable. Because Grand Forks is in a bend of the river - the water flowed through town (path of least resistance). In that water was everything you could imagine - animals, fuel oil, diesel,gas, and sewage. Dumpsters became lethal as they plowed through fences and into homes. Along the river neighborhoods on both sides were picnic tables in tress, and decks ripped free and travelling towards Canada.

I have a video I made the Wednesday after the crest. I worked at UND and rode an Oskosh snow plow into town to help retrieve computers at the federal building downtown. Even 4 days after the crest, the water was high enough to come into the back end of the snow plow as we slowly drove into town and back. Anyone wanting a DVD e-mail me and I will send it along with a written narrative. I now live in Sioux Falls SD, and what a difference 310 miles makes. As I write this the town of Fargo is struggling with a flood of even greater magnitude with hopes the dykes hold and they do not lose all. Time will tell. MSgtUSAFret (talk) 16:36, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

GA candidate
I plan on bringing the article up to Good article status in the next few weeks. I'm planning on using sources from two books I got at my campus's library and will search for online sources after that. If there are any errors, please correct them, and the article may be changed quite a bit as I create new sections for the information I find. --Nehrams2020 23:39, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I uploaded a photo of the amount of snow from 1997 to wikipedia commons, Image:1997snow.JPG. It isn't the best quality, but it definitly illustrates the amount of snow, which there isn't any photos of in the article. -JWGreen 00:25, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm interested where this measurment was taken, because without that information, the measurment means nothing. "The worst flood on record was in 1826, when settlers of the Selkirk Colony fled water reaching 36½ ft (11.1 m) above the river bed." Theres also no citation for the text. -JWGreen 18:38, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
 * If you can't find a source for it, remove it for now or make it a hidden comment and we can look for it later. I have a large amount of information on the fire in downtown Grand Forks. Should that be its own section, or do we want to limit it to two or three paragraphs? --Nehrams2020 05:44, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I think the fire is notable enough to have its own section. -JWGreen 21:18, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

As far as getting this to GA status, I think this article is well on its way. One thing that I think could be confusing is that, although parts of the article deal with the flood in Canada, most of the article is focused on the flood in the U.S. - namely in Grand Forks. Many of the sections (Origins, Preparations, Donations and damages, Criticism and blame, Recovery, Future flood prevention, and Cultural references) really only deal with the flood in Grand Forks. If I was unfamiliar with the events of 1997, I think I might find that a bit confusing. --Matthew UND (talk) 23:29, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I had noticed that, and was going to add more sources for more mention on the Canadian floods, and I also realized that there is almost no information on Fargo either. The main reason that the article is mostly centered on Grand Forks is because most of the sources I have found (including books) focus on Grand Forks, but I'll start focusing my searches on the other areas later this week (I have 2 tests to study for). --Nehrams2020 23:44, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Would it be totally out of the question to break the article into 1997 Red River Flood in the United States and 1997 Red River Flood in Canada? We could keep 1997 Red River flood as a brief overview that links to the other two articles. Since so much of what we have in the article focuses on the flood in the US, 1997 Red River Flood in the United States would be more than ready for GA status and 1997 Red River Flood in Canada would have a ways to go. I don't know...I'm kind of thinking out loud. Let me know what you think. I'm not sure if there is any precedent for breaking down an article like this into individual country articles. --Matthew UND (talk) 00:50, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I think that would be a good idea, if others agree as well. With the amount of information we have already, I do think that "1997 Red River Flood in the United States" would reach GA status fairly quickly once we incorporated more information on Fargo, EGF, and any other areas that were afflicted. If there is no reasons against it, I'd say that we should do it. --Nehrams2020 00:54, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm glad you like my idea...I wasn't sure if I was thinking too far out of the box with that one. I think splitting the article would make it less confusing for readers. If you really like the idea, go ahead and split the article. --Matthew UND (talk) 01:05, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I'll probably do it on Thursday or this weekend sometime, which will leave time for some people to raise any objections they have. Otherwise, I'll start splitting it into the two articles. --Nehrams2020 01:44, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

I have split the article and removed information from this page so it isn't duplicated in the two daughter articles. I'll continue to work on 1997 Red River Flood in the United States and bring it to GAN hopefully within the week. --Nehrams2020 22:52, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Merge
I just placed the merge tempalte without being aware of teh above discussion; I suppose of this had been "in the United States" I might not have noticed; but I see no reason for them to be separate, other than the bulk of inforamtion. Flood-control efforts were bi-national and it's hard to talk about the one without talking also about the other; rather than breaking this on "national" lines I think the river is a single "organism" and this was one event, not two.....Skookum1 (talk) 16:16, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree that it is a single event, but for the amount of information present for the "in the U.S." article, I believe it is justified to have its own article. If you look at some major hurricanes, you can see separate articles for the impact of the storm on different states or regions (examples include: Effects of Hurricane Dennis in Mississippi, Effects of Hurricane Dennis in Georgia, Effects of Hurricane Noel in the United States, Effects of Hurricane Wilma in Florida, or Effects of Hurricane Wilma in The Bahamas) Due to the amount of information for "in Canada", it may possibly be merged back into the original article (and possibly split off again when there is significant expansion on it in the future). However, I think "in the U.S." should remain separate due to its current size/coverage and the reasons in the discussion above. --Nehrams2020 (talk) 17:30, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

I'm in favour of the merge, as discussion of either needs to over-lap. Also un-mentioned in the devastation in Grand Forks as compared to Canadian towns/Winnipeg is the differing methods of Crest calculation. At the time, in ND, the average of the expected range was announced as the expected crest. In MB, the highest point of the range was used. This tended to result in better preperations, north of the US/Canada border —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.126.163.20 (talk) 20:17, 3 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge. One event, two sides of the border. "Canada" is misleading in the other article since the Red River only exists in Manitoba, and no-one east of Thunder Bay even heard about it. --Wtshymanski (talk) 19:13, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree with the comment above that the U.S. article has enough detail to stand on its own and need not be merged with this article. --Wtshymanski (talk) 15:15, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

Prior Floods
There is no citation listed for the closing sentence in the Prior Flood section “Homes not damaged in that flood were incorrectly assumed to be safe from a future flood.” I am researching the potential for catastrophic floods. One section looks into the perceptions held by the general populations regarding risk. A citation for your closing sentence would be helpful to my research. Thank You.Rharmon1200 (talk) 18:09, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Dead link
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!

 * http://www.ccrs.nrcan.gc.ca/radar/spaceborne/radarsat1/action/canada/images/may01.jpg
 * In 1997 Red River flood on 2011-05-25 06:28:00, 404 Not found
 * In 1997 Red River flood on 2011-06-08 18:28:43, 404 Not found

--JeffGBot (talk) 18:29, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Dead link 2
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!

 * http://www.state.nd.us/dem/flood97/history.htm
 * In 1997 Red River flood on 2011-05-25 06:28:00, 404 Not Found
 * In 1997 Red River flood on 2011-06-08 18:28:57, 404 Not Found

--JeffGBot (talk) 18:29, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Dead link 3
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!

 * http://www.library.uiuc.edu/gex/bibs/redriverflood.html
 * In 1997 Red River flood on 2011-05-25 06:28:02, 404 Not Found
 * In 1997 Red River flood on 2011-06-08 18:30:41, 404 Not Found

--JeffGBot (talk) 18:30, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Red River floods

 * I am having some issues here. This article and some others capitalizes flood. This is a list of floods from Red River floods:

 * 1826 Red River flood
 * 1861 Red River flood
 * 1882 Red River flood
 * 1897 Red River flood
 * 1950 Red River flood
 * 1966 Red River flood
 * 1969 Red River flood
 * 1978 Red River flood
 * 1979 Red River flood
 * 1989 Red River flood
 * 1996 Red River flood
 * 1997 Red River flood
 * 1998 Red River flood
 * 1999 Red River flood
 * 2001 Red River flood
 * 2006 Red River flood
 * 2009 Red River flood
 * 2010 Red River flood
 * 2011 Red River flood
 * 2013 Red River flood
 * 1997 Red River Flood in the United States (a "good article")
 * "Flood" was capitalized in the list and I changed those but there is still this article that is "B" class. The problem is the naming inconsistencies across Wikipedia. I actually find it somewhat alarming that an article can be elevated to good article class with the word "flood" capitalized when it is not a proper noun like the Great Flood of 1844. With this reasoning January 2009 North American ice storm should be Ice Storm or October 2013 Great Plains blizzard Great Plains Blizzard.
 * Here are some examples:

 * Missoula Floods
 * Bonneville flood
 * Johnstown Flood
 * Willamette Valley Flood of 1996
 * The vast majority of articles do not capitalize "flood" as can be seen at Category:Floods in the United States or List of floods, List of floods in Europe, 2009 Brazilian floods and mudslides, and many other but there are so many exceptions. How about 1966 Flood of the Arno River
 * There needs to be consistency on such a simple matter. Otr500 (talk) 05:03, 31 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree, but in order to do this, 1997 Red River flood needs to be deleted, and therefore (see next heading). Anomalocaris (talk) 09:54, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

1997 Red River flood listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect 1997 Red River flood. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you have not already done so. Anomalocaris (talk) 09:54, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

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Infobox update
@Nikkimaria If you don't know yet, Infobox flood is now deprecated, and process in currently underway to replace it with Infobox weather event. Yes, it's not really a significant change, but for me, it's still necessary. It's likely if someone in the future wants to upgrade this article to GA for example, they'll definitely wanted this article to use the newer template. Just a small, harmless update; all data in the old template will be retained. PEACE SEARCHΞR  [Talk]  00:56, 17 September 2023 (UTC)  PEACE SEARCHΞR   [Talk]  00:56, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * PeaceSearcher, could you provide a link to the discussion where that was decided, please? Nikkimaria (talk) 01:01, 17 September 2023 (UTC) reping: User:PeaceSeekers (please update your signature). Nikkimaria (talk) 01:06, 17 September 2023 (UTC)
 * You can refer here for more info. PEACE SΞΞKΞRS   [Talk]  02:51, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * Okay, thanks. I see in that discussion an accessibility concern with cyclones, which isn't relevant here; in fact most of the arguments supporting the change seem to be irrelevant to this article. I don't see anything else in that discussion which would support a quality concern with articles using the more specific template here. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:14, 17 September 2023 (UTC)
 * If that's the case, perhaps I'll better leave the template as it is for now. I'll try to contact with the developers of the new template to discuss in detail on what benefit(s) the weather event template has over the flood one, as it seems that they focus a lot over the cyclone templates. I'll inform you on how this discussion worked out.
 * For now, I'll shift my focus on replacing the cyclone templates first, which we can both agree is necessary. Thanks! PEACE SΞΞKΞRS   [Talk]  06:46, 17 September 2023 (UTC)
 * The flood template is an old, outdated template that lacks much padding which is addressed with the new template. Additionally, there is also the ability to add more statistics such as economic losses, houses destroyed, power outages, etc.. We allow the year and type of currency to be input in the new infobox so it will display accurately. Using the storms sub-box, various meteorological statistics can be added, the most relevant usually being maximum rainfall for floods. Noah, AATalk 11:21, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * We discussed replacing multiple weather infoboxes with a single one at the RfC, including the flood one. I ask that you please stop restoring the old infoboxes which is in violation of that consensus. Noah, AATalk 11:08, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * The "consensus" claimed is unfortunately flawed and limited. As noted, most of the deficiencies discussed were irrelevant to this template, and its development is reflective of the fact that it is far more suited to address cyclones. Commenters arguing about "standard design" also failed to note that the current template's design is also widely used - for example in infobox event. Finally, the implementation is much more challenging than the previous design for article editors. Some of the conversions implemented by the OP, for example, had obvious problems - if someone familiar with the template can't be expected to get it right, how can you expect others to? Nikkimaria (talk) 13:34, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:1997 Red River flood


text:
Captaincies of Brazil

The Captaincies of Brazil (Capitanias do Brasil) were captaincies of the Portuguese Empire, administrative divisions and hereditary fiefs of Portugal in the colony of Terra de Santa Cruz, later called Brazil, on the Atlantic coast of northeastern South America. Each was granted to a single donee, a Portuguese nobleman who was given the title captain General.

Beginning in the early 16th century, the Portuguese monarchy used proprietorships or captaincies—land grants with extensive governing privileges—as a tool to colonize new lands. Prior to the grants in Brazil, the captaincy system had been successfully used in territories claimed by Portugal—-notably including Madeira, the Azores, and other Atlantic islands.

In contrast to the generally successful Atlantic captaincies, of all the captaincies of Brazil, only two, the captaincies of Pernambuco and São Vicente (later called São Paulo), are today considered to have been successful. For reasons varying from abandonment, defeat by aboriginal tribes, occupation of Northeast Brazil by the Dutch West India Company, and death of the donatário (lord proprietor) without an heir, all of the proprietorships (captaincies) eventually reverted to or were repurchased by the crown.

They were effectively subsumed by the Governorates General and the States of Brazil and Maranhão starting in 1549, and the last of the privately granted captaincies reverted to the Crown in 1754. Their final boundaries in the latter half of the 18th century became the basis for the provinces of Brazil.

Establishment as colonies

Following the successful expedition of Martim Afonso de Sousa in 1530, in order to exploit the trade in brazilwood discovered on the Atlantic coast, as well as explore rumors of vast riches in silver and gold in the interior, the Portuguese Crown determined to establish permanent colonies in their claim on the new continent. The Portuguese realized that they had no human or financial resources to invest in a large and distant colony, and decided to enlist private entrepreneurs, called donatários. Each would become owner and administrator of a capitania or captaincy, a land grant. This system had previously been successful in settling of the Portuguese colonies, first in Madeira, the Azores and various islands mostly along the coast of Africa.

The first captaincies were drawn in strips parallel to the equator, commencing at the Atlantic coast and terminating in the west at the Tordesillas Line (where Spanish territory began). They were established by King John III of Portugal, starting with Pernambuco by the royal "Golden Letter" (Carto Dourado) on 24 September 1534.

Within a system of royal patronage and nepotism, five of the captaincies were given to two cousins of finance minister António de Ataíde: Martim Afonso de Sousa and his brother Pero Lopes. An additional captaincy was issued to Pero de Gois, captain of Afonso's 1530 expedition. The remaining captaincies were granted to a trusted mixture of military men (more precisely called conquistadores) and court bureaucrats.

Each captaincy was to be of fifty leagues "height" (measured north-south), but in practice, boundaries were marked by pairs of rivers, a plethora of which emptied into the Atlantic Ocean on the northeastern coast of the continent. So actual heights varied, as shown in the map at right. Initially fifteen, they were granted to twelve donees. They were the following (north to south):

All but four captaincies failed, due to inadequate resources of the donees and lack of support from the Crown. Four donees failed to take possession of their lands, and four more quickly succumbed to Indians. Only four captaincies survived past 1549: São Vicente, Pernambuco, Ilhéus and Porto Seguro.

Subordination of the Captaincies
The history of the captaincies is turbulent, reflecting the needs of the Kings of Portugal, a small European country, to colonize and govern an enormous expanse of South America. Throughout the early colonial era Captaincies were granted, divided, subordinated, annexed, and abandoned. In 1548 when the captaincy of Baía de Todos os Santos (Bahia) reverted to the Crown due to the massacre, by indigenous cannibals, of its donee, Francisco Pereira Coutinho and his settlers; the King, Dom João III, established a royal governor (later a governor-general) at Bahia. At the same time Dom João rescinded some of the expansive privileges he had previously granted the donatarios (lords-proprietor). However, clearly demonstrating the crowns desire to accommodate whatever worked, Dom João instructed his first Governor to visit all the remaining captaincies, except for Pernambuco, the one singularly successful captaincy. In fact no royal governor visited Pernambuco until the Seventeenth Century. The captaincies continued to exist as governments subordinate to the royal governors, governors-general, and viceroys. All captaincies, sooner or later, reverted to being royal rather than proprietary captaincies (variously thru some failure or repurchase by the crown).

During the Philippine Dynasty, some of the captaincies attained the status of provinces with royal governors (i.e. "states"), and Portuguese Brazil thereafter was a mixture of donatary captaincies, royal captaincies and states.

List of post-1549 captaincies
Some complications result from captaincies being merged and recreated with the same name, but representing altered regions. At least a few of the later captaincies were islands or capes of negligible size. Dates are of independent captaincies; in some cases, new captaincies were created as administrative divisions or subcaptaincies of existing ones before becoming fully independent (eg. Para was established as early as 1616 as a north and westward annex of Maranhão).
 * Fernando de Noronha (not occupied or abandoned) 1504-1737
 * Itaparica and Itamarandiba (islands), 1556, split from Bahia
 * Rio de Janeiro, 1563, renamed first (northern) section of São Vicente + Paraiba do Sul(?)
 * Paraguaçu, 1566, carved from Bahia
 * Paraíba, 1580, created from part of Rio Grande, enlarged by acquisition of most of Itamaracá, 1585
 * Rio Grande de Norte, 1597, merger of northern portion of Rio Grande, Ceara and Maranhão
 * Cabo Frio, 1615, promontory in Rio de Janeiro
 * Pará, ~1616 as division of Maranhão from newly incorporated territory west of the Tordesillas Line; independent in 1652
 * Itapecuru (renamed Icatu after 1691), 1621
 * Caeté (originally Captaincy of Vera Cruz de Gurupi), 1622, merged into Maranhão 1654
 * Itanhaém, 1624
 * Paranaguá, 1624
 * Paraíba do Sul (originally São Tomé), 1629
 * Gurupa, 1633
 * Santa Cruz de Cametá, within Grão-Para on the lower Amazon, 1633 (see Cametá)
 * Rio São Francisco, ~1634
 * Cabo Norte, 1637, from newly incorporated territory; merged into Maranhão 1654
 * Vigia, 1652
 * Ilha Grande (island of Marajo), 1665, merged into Maranhão
 * Xingu, 1685, within Maranhão
 * Ararobá, 1690, within Pernambuco
 * São Paulo and Minas de Ouro, 1709, renamed from São Vicente
 * Minas Gerais, 1720, split from São Paulo and Minas de Ouro
 * São Paulo, 1720, remaining after Minas Gerais split
 * Mearim, 1723, within Maranhão
 * Cumã, 1727, sub-captaincy split from Maranhão;
 * Santa Catarina, 1739, split from São Paulo
 * Goiaz, 1748, split from São Paulo
 * Mato Grosso, 1748, split from São Paulo
 * São José de Rio Negro (most of Amazonia region), 1755, split from Pará
 * Grão-Pará, 1755, renamed portion of Pará after Rio Negro split
 * Piauí, 1759, split from Maranhão
 * Espírito Santo, 1799, independent from Bahia
 * Rio Grande do Sul, 1760, newly incorporated territory of Rio Grande de São Pedro
 * Ceará, 1799, split from Pernambuco
 * Rio Grande do Norte, 1808, split from Pernambuco
 * Alagoas, 1817, split from Pernambuco
 * Colônia de Caiena e Guiana, 1809, annexation of French Guiana
 * Sergipe, 1820, split from Bahia

Pernambuco and São Vicente
The Captaincy of Pernambuco thrived due to sugarcane plantations. The Captaincy of São Vicente, called São Paulo after the city of São Paulo became its capital in 1681, obtained success through the exploration of the hinterland known as bandeiras. In 1621, these became the basis for the southeastern State of Brazil.

Provinces of Brazil
In 1815, the State of Brazil was elevated to a kingdom and all existing provinces and Crown captaincies became provinces of the United Kingdom of Portugal, Brazil and the Algarves.

Legacy of the Captaincies
Thirteen modern states have names of their predecessor captaincies, and several cities. The captaincies immortalized a set of Tupi-guarani place names, chiefly those of rivers and mountains.

In echoes of the feudal system of landed noblemen, the huge fazendas of the 18th and 19th centuries were allocated from the land holdings of the captaincies.

Brazil today still lives with the legacy of a plantation culture that utilized 4million African slaves and concentrated land ownership. An elite 1.7percent of the landowners continue to own nearly half the arable land; the top 10percent of the nation earns half the income.

title: Captaincies of Brazil


text:
Thallus (historian)

Thallus or Thallos (Θαλλός), perhaps a Samaritan, was an early historian who wrote in Koine Greek. He wrote a three-volume history of the Mediterranean world from before the Trojan War to the 167th Olympiad, 112–108 BC, or perhaps to the 217th Olympiad (AD 89-93) or 207th Olympiad (AD 49-52). Most of his work, like the vast majority of ancient literature, has been lost, although some of his writings were quoted by Sextus Julius Africanus in his History of the World. It is not known when he lived and wrote, but his work is quoted by Theophilus of Antioch, who died around AD 185, and most scholars date Thallus' writings to around 50 AD.

The works are considered important by some Christians as confirming the historicity of Jesus and providing non-Christian validation of the Gospel accounts. According to the early Christian scholar Julius Africanus, Thallus apparently refers, in the third book of his histories, to the darkness at the time of the crucifixion of Jesus Christ and explained it away as a solar eclipse; there is a range of interpretations on the matter.

The fragments of Thallus

 * 1) There are fragments from the 3 books of Thallus, in which he made a summary in abbreviated fashion from the sack of Troy to the 167th Olympiad [i.e. 109 BC] (Eusebius, Chronicle, I. K125.2)
 * 2) Castor and Thallus [recorded] Syrian events. (Sextus Julius Africanus, in Eusebius, Praeparatio Evangelica, X.10)
 * 3) The archives of the most ancient races—the Egyptians, Chaldaeans, and Phoenicians—need to be opened, and their citizens must be called upon, through whom knowledge must be provided—a certain Manetho the Egyptian and Berossus the Chaldaean, but also Jerome the Phoenician king of Tyre; and their followers, too: Ptolemy the Mendesian and Menander the Ephesian and Demetrius the Phalerean and king Juba and Apion and Thallus and the one who either proves or refutes these men, Josephus the Jew. (Tertullian, Apologeticum 19)
 * 4) Sextus Julius Africanus writes, concerning the passion of Christ, "Concerning each of his deeds and his cures, both of bodies and souls, and the secrets of his knowledge, and his Resurrection from the dead, this has been explained with complete adequacy by his disciples and the apostles before us. A most terrible darkness fell over all the world, the rocks were torn apart by an earthquake, and many places both in Judaea and the rest of the world were thrown down. In the third book of his Histories, Thallos dismisses this darkness as a solar eclipse. In my opinion, this is nonsense. ..." (Africanus, in George Syncellus, Cronography)
 * 5) For Thallus also remembers Belus the ruler of Assyria and Cronos the Titan, asserting that Belus waged war along with the Titans against Zeus and the select gods who were with him, stating at this point: 'and defeated, Ogygus fled to Tartessus. While at that time that region was famous as Akte, now it is called Attica, which Ogygus then took over.' (Theophilus of Antioch, Ad Autolycum 3.29)
 * 6) For according to the history of Thallus, we find that Belus was born 322 years prior to the Trojan War. (Lactantius, Divine Institutions I.23)
 * 7) And so ... neither Diodorus the Greek nor Thallus, neither Cassius Severus nor Cornelius Nepos, nor any commentator on such ancient matters, prints that Saturn was anything but a man. (Tertullian, Apologeticus 10).
 * 8) Therefore, not only all poets, but even all historians and all writers on ancient matters, who have published for posterity his deeds done in Italy, agree he was a man: in Greek, Diodorus and Thallus, and in Latin, Nepos and Cassius and Varro. (Lactantius, Divine Institutions. I.13).
 * 9) All writers of Greek and Roman antiquities tell us that Saturn, the first of his kind, was a man: Nepos knows this, and Cassius in history, as well as Thallus and Diodorus, say this.  (Marcus Minucius Felix, Octavius, 21)
 * 10) Regarding the events before the Olympiads, consider how the Attic chronologers reckon: from the time of Ogygus, during whose tenure the first great flood occurred in Attica, while Phoroneus was ruling the Argives, as Acusilaus records, up to the time of the first year of the first Olympiad, the point after which the Greeks consider time to be reckoned more accurately, 1020 years passed, which agrees with those mentioned earlier and with those who were listed in order. For the writers on Athenian history, Hellanicus and Philochorus (who wrote Atthis) and writers on Syrian affairs, Castor and Thallus, and writers on world affairs, Diodorus (who wrote the Library) and Alexander Polyhistor, and some of our contemporaries record these events even more accurately than all the Attic historians. (Africanus, in Eusebius, Praeparatio Evangelica, X.10)
 * 11) So know this: of all those among us [the Jews] happen to be more ancient than many: [for instance] ... Moses ... as is clear to us in the histories of the Greeks. ... For in the times of Ogygus and Inachus ... they record Moses ... so does Polemon in his first book of history of the Greeks, and Apion ... and Ptolemaeus the Mendesian, who wrote a history of Egypt, all these men agree. And the writers on Athenian history, Hellanicus and Philochorus (who wrote Atthis), Castor and Thallus and Alexander Polyhistor, and also those most wise of men, Philo and Josephus ... [all these men] mention Moses, as they do the very old and ancient origin of the Jews. (Pseudo-Justin, Cohortatio ad Graecos, 9)
 * 12) 41 Assyrian kings ruled the kingdom of the Arabs, who also ruled from the [?] year of the world to the [?] year of the world, enduring all of [?] years from the first of them, Belus, until the 41st king, Macoscolerus, the son of Sardanapallus, as most noted historians agree, including Polybius, Diodorus, Cephalion, Castor, Thallus and others. (Syncellus, Chronography)
 * 13) After the 70th year of the captivity, Cyrus was king of the Persians in the first year of the 55th Olympiad, as we find in the Library of Diodorus and the Histories of Thallus and Castor, and also in the works of Polybius and Phlegon, but also in those of others who concern themselves with Olympiads: they are all in agreement about the date. (Africanus, in Eusebius, Praeparatio Evangelica, X.10)
 * 14) Those most wise men, Thallus, Castor [259 F 11], and Polybius [254 F 4]...and among others, Herodotus...and the wise Theophilus, all recorded the chronology of the reign of Croesus. (John Malalas, Chronografia, VI).

Time and subjects of work
Thallus is first mentioned around AD 180 by Theophilus Bishop of Antioch in his Ad Autolycum ('To Autolycus'), which at 3.29 states:

"Thallus makes mention of Belus, the King of the Assyrians, and Cronus the Titan; and says that Belus, with the Titans, made war against Zeus and his compeers, who are called gods. He says, moreover, that Gygus was smitten, and fled to Tartessus. At that time Gygus ruled over that country, which was then called Acte, but is now named Attica. And whence the other countries and cities derived their names, we think it unnecessary to recount, especially to you who are acquainted with history."

Eusebius of Caesarea in a list of sources mentions his work:

"From the three books of Thallus, in which he collects (events) briefly from the fall of Ilion [Troy] to the 167th Olympiad."

However the text is preserved in an Armenian translation where many of the numerals are corrupt. The fall of Troy is 1184 BC, but the editors, Petermann and Karst, highlight that the end-date of the 167th Olympiad (109 BC) is contradicted by George Syncellus, who quotes Julius Africanus, and suggest that the end-date should read "217th Olympiad" (AD 89–93), a change of one character in Armenian. Others suggest "207th Olympiad" (AD 49-52).<

Thallus and Josephus
Josephus may have referred to Thallus in Antiquities of the Jews 18.6.4:

"Now there was another Samaritan, a freed-man of Caesar, of whom he borrowed a million of drachmae, and thence repaid Antonia the debt he owed her; and by sending the overplus in paying his court to Caius, became a person of great authority with him."

The identification depends on two assumptions. All the manuscripts have "another Samaritan" (ἄλλος Σαμαρεὺς γένος) in the section, but since Josephus does not refer to a previous Samaritan in this context, all modern editors except one consider it to be a corruption in the text where the Samaritan's nameis missing a Θ, and was "Thallos". The second assumption is that the Thallos being named is the same one Eusebius and Africanus were referring to considering that such a name was likely rare at the time.

Others believe that the name Thallos was common at the time so the reference is not clear. A minority have disagreed with the mainstream view above and have suggested that the text is not corrupted and may have read "Now there was another, namely a Samaritan by race (birth), a freedman of Caesar." and not have had a person named Thallos.

Africanus on Thallus
In his Chronicle of Theophanes, 9th-century Christian chronicler George Syncellus cites the Chronographiai of Sextus Julius Africanus as writing in reference to the darkness mentioned in the synoptic gospels as occurring at the death of Jesus:

"On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun. For the Hebrews celebrate the passover on the 14th day according to the moon, and the passion of our Saviour falls on the day before the passover; but an eclipse of the sun takes place only when the moon comes under the sun. And it cannot happen at any other time but in the interval between the first day of the new moon and the last of the old, that is, at their junction: how then should an eclipse be supposed to happen when the moon is almost diametrically opposite the sun? Let that opinion pass however; let it carry the majority with it; and let this portent of the world be deemed an eclipse of the sun, like others a portent only to the eye. Phlegon records that, in the time of Tiberius Caesar, at full moon, there was a full eclipse of the sun from the sixth hour to the ninth — manifestly that one of which we speak. But what has an eclipse in common with an earthquake, the rending rocks, and the resurrection of the dead, and so great a perturbation throughout the universe? Surely no such event as this is recorded for a long period. But it was a darkness induced by God, because the Lord happened then to suffer. And calculation makes out that the period of 70 weeks, as noted in Daniel, is completed at this time."

So it is Africanus that goes on to point out that an eclipse cannot occur at Passover when the moon is full because it is diametrically opposite the Sun.

title: Thallus (historian)