text:
Talk:FC Dallas

Homegrown Player table
Hey, as a Timbers' fan. Before I leave Wikipedia, I would like to know if it should be a good idea for FC Dallas' page having a chart of it's homegrown players making it unique to FC Dallas, since the franchise does value their talent from their academies and so forth unlike LA Galaxy who depends on old players whose names are already known. Should include name, nationality, and year of signing. Any comments or concerns?

There previously was such a page, but it and several other MLS academy pages were deleted. See [] --Lhts120 (talk) 23:47, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Comment
This was my first wikipedia edit. I added the info about the U.S. Open Cup. I'm a fan of the team and thought the one trophy they've won should be mentioned. Dave Walker

Name Change
Does the 'F.C.' in the team name stand for something? I thought it might be 'FrisCo', but now I think it might be 'Football Club'. Acjelen 04:54, 27 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Acjelen, It does indeed stand for Football Club. And, it's actually "FC" not "F.C.". I've changed all the "F.C" that I found, but I don't know how to change the name of the article. I love the way people have taken this article and improved it so much since my first tiny change last summer.

Dave Walker 01:50, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

The page could be moved to "FC Dallas", by either moving its contents (that will lose history) or posting on Requested moves or asking an admin for the move. Frankly, I don't see the big deal with the dots; the page can stay here as is (it looks consistent with D.C. United and C.D. Chivas USA), and if you want to link here, you can always do FC Dallas. But either way is fine... --Dryazan 14:21, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

At the moment the page "FC Dallas" redirects to "F.C. Dallas" These two pages could be transposed. That is, copy and past the contents of one onto the other. I've never done that to an article with graphics. There is a nice long list of other pages that link to "F.C. Dallas". By switching the two pages, we could avoid editing those links. Hopefully others would notice the redirect and make the changes themselves. --Acjelen 16:32, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

The problem with that is that the article will lose its history. --Dryazan 16:34, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I'm ok with leaving it as is, so as not to lose the history. Dave Walker 18:06, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Actually, F.C. stands for Futbol Club. That has been always the name since day one of rebranding. According to FCDallas' own fact sheet: "What does FC in FC Dallas stand for? F stands for "Futbol" which is the globally used term for the sport, and C stands for "Club" which again is the accurate reference to a team globally."

I wouldn't have a problem with this move to "FC Dallas (MLS)", except for the (MLS) part. As of now, the original "FC Dallas" page is sitting stagnant, and at this point would follow with two redirections, which is not done automatically. There is nothing else that would prevent that site with being taken back. It simply sounds easier to restore it to reduce or even eliminate all the redirections. One more reason is that this page in EVERY other language exists as "FC Dallas". Otav347 2:19, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I moved it to FC Dallas. It's just logical. DR31 (talk) 12:57, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

The full name is Football Club Dallas. It is taken from European clubs which states that as well. FC Dallas can't be an exception. It wasn't established as the European clubs with the similar name. It wasn't the original name of the club either. Bluhaze777 (talk) 14:32, 27 August 2017 (UTC)
 * It alludes to the European team (or club) names, but it could also be Spanish and be "Fútbol Club", particularly with their location in the U.S. and who they're attempting to appeal to. It could be that the club is appealing to a German crowd and be a "Fußball Club". All would be just as reasonable as the English spelling, especially considering the league's allowance of "Real Salt Lake" and not having any royal appointment of that name.
 * The fact is that while it may stand for something that would be translated into English as "Football Club" it doesn't ever expand to that exact phrase in print or legal documents. Toronto's article was expanded because of two tenuous uses of the term. Unless you can find substantial use of the full phrase, we would have to exclude its use here as well. Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:32, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

"Move" needs to be fixed
When Dr31 "moved" this page from FC Dallas (MLS) to here, it wasn't actually moved. Everything was simply copied and pasted to here. That lost all the edit history to the page. That edit history is still sitting over there at the (MLS) one. Can someone fix this? Metros232 13:10, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, my bad. I just requested the move at Requested moves DR31 (talk) 15:29, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I've tagged this for a fix by the guidelines on WP:SPLICE. This will have an admin delete this page, move the FC Dallas (MLS) page to here.  The admin should probably also combine the histories of these two pages since a couple of edits have been made since its move to here.  Metros232 15:38, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Done. — Nightst a  llion  (?) 07:11, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

Dashes and hyphens
All other MLS team pages use regular dashes in the team info box and in player, coaches area. If you switch this page to use mdash and ndash, please be consistent and change all other MLS pages as well. DR31 (talk) 13:01, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

 * Those articles and the version you keep changing back to are NOT dashes—they are hyphens. Hyphens and dashes are used for different things. I suggest you consult with an English instructor or take a look at how to use hyphens and dashes in the college writing manual. Please do you not change dashes to hyphens again. You are using it incorrectly! I do not have time to change all of the articles to the proper en dash and em dash. Also, please do not force your preferences on using the hyphens on all articles. I believe it was you that made all the articles "consistent" by improperly using the hyphens instead of dashes.

 * Here are examples of what the hyphen, en dash, and em dash look like and when to use them:

 * Hyphen: (third-largest)
 * En dash: (1995–2003)
 * Em dash: (2005—)

 * RJN 22:05, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Honors
I noticed that the Brimstone Cup was included among the "Honors." Should 2-club contests really be included with true competition awards? Other club pages omit them under their "Honers." Would it be better to note it in its own section? -- Quinn 33 11:10, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

General Managers
How about adding GM's? arthur 23:01, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
 * There was a GM section but all the guys on the list were redlinked so I removed the section. In truth, MLS GMs are rather non-notable and somewhat excessive information. м info 17:54, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Ok, I just saw GM sections with other MLS teams and thought it would be good for Dallas to also have one, especially since they were ownerless for a long time, and the President/GMs played a bigger role than with most other teams. arthur 15:38, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

International matches
I am from the Dutch Wikipedia and I'm expanding that article a lot, but my question is: is it right that they played for the 5th place after winning the semifinals? Or am I wrong... my userpage at the dutch wikipedia

Using Football v. Soccer on a N. American article
I think it is more reasonable to use "football (soccer)" as opposed to "football" or "soccer" for a couple of reasons:

1. While this is an article based on a North American team, the bottom line is that the official team name incorporates FC in its name. Whether or not this is an attempt to be trendy, the fact of the matter is that FC stands for Football Club. The term soccer is directly taken from association football so as to discern between it and (most notably in the UK) rugby football. If the team didn't have the FC attached to it, it would be a different story in that respect.

2. This article, as part of a greater body of articles on the game and clubs that play it, should adhere to certain naming conventions. The game is called football by a good 95% of the world's population, and while this is a North American based article, viewable by everyone, thus it should, to be consistent and fair, adhere to those same conventions. A compromise, since this team is based in North America where 'football' means something the Cowboys and Steelers play, is for soccer to appear in parentheses as it does in the actual article about the game. Ryecatcher773 18:11, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Picture of Shirts
The picture of the home/away shirts, while much prettier than the hodgepodge approximations we have usually on team's websites, they are eggregiously outdated and are in serious need of update. Can someone with a little more technical skill work on this? --  Grant  .  Alpaugh  15:48, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Mike Graczyk
Is it correct that Mike Graczyk is a Dallas-player and not from the Colorado Rapids...?? Rubietje88 (nl) 17:28, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

 * Graczyk officially plays for Colorado not Dallas. Minfo (talk) 03:18, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

2009 Season article
Your club doesn't yet have a 2009 Season article, we are hoping to get each of the MLS teams up and going like these; Sounders, Fire, Dynamo, Wizards, and TFC. If you have any questions or concerns feel free to contact me at anytime. Thanks Morry32 (talk) 01:16, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

conference champs
Talk:New York Red Bulls

just adding a link to a centralized discussion on division champions conventions. Please post comments there.

Nlsanand (talk) 04:04, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

Photo request
Getting a picture of the team is not likely to happen outside of an official team photo, and therefore probably copyright to the team. I'm removing the photo request as it would require us to violate wikipedia policies. Hasteur (talk) 12:55, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

El Capitán image
Does anyone have a picture of El Capitán? I think an image of the cannon would really raise the value of this article and the Texas Derby article. --Blackbox77 (talk) 18:40, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

Change in roster format
There was a discussion about the new roster format and we have had a trial at both the Timbers and Whitecaps articles and recently Cascadia Cup rival Sounders have converted. The idea is to move all club articles on Wikipedia to the new format as is discussed in the original discussion and more recently at the football project.

My suggestion is to complete the MLS team articles first, so if you could respond at this discussion, that would be ideal. In short, the new layout is slightly taller and less wide, but it correctly impliments WP:MOSFLAG and is better for visually impared users of Wikipedia and others who use readers. I plan to implement the change to this article by the weekend of January 20-22, however other editors could make the change sooner. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:53, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140828142711/http://www.mlssoccer.com/matchcenter/2011-08-17-pumas-unam-vs-fc-dallas/recap to http://www.mlssoccer.com/matchcenter/2011-08-17-pumas-unam-vs-fc-dallas/recap

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Jesse González
González filled one-time switch and it was accepted by FIFA, which means that for all purpose he's now cap-tied for USA and will NEVER play for Mexico anymore. Therefore, his flag should be the american flag, since is pointless to --SirEdimon (talk) 02:54, 30 June 2017 (UTC)keep his name attached to mexican flag, if he is considered american by FIFA and will never play for Mexico.--SirEdimon (talk) 23:25, 29 June 2017 (UTC)
 * And when he steps onto the field for the US, he'll be American, until then, he's still Mexican. Ask at WP:FOOTY if you don't believe me. Walter Görlitz (talk) 00:26, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * He's already CAP TIED fo US. He doesn't need to step onto the field for US. In the moment, FIFA accepted his request, he became american for all purpose. You want to pretend he's still mexican when is not. --SirEdimon (talk) 00:49, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * He does have to cap for the US. He does need to step onto the field for the US. I recognize that FIFA has accepted his request, but he's still not American until he takes to the field. You want change the rules that we use on Wikipedia for this one player? Walter Görlitz (talk) 00:57, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * From the moment FIFA accepted his request, he's already cap-tied. Even though, he never plays for US. Jesse Gonzalez and Kenny Saief are americans internationals for FIFA even if they never ever dress for US, because from the moment you file a one-time switch and FIFA accepted it, it's done. You are commited with a NT for the rest of your life. It's different, for example, of Dom Dwyer. He was born in England and for all purposes, he's english. Even though, he had declared his commitment with US, until he steps on the field for the americans, he still english, because, he was not capped (or cap tied) for any nation, which means that his born place stands over anything.--SirEdimon (talk) 02:07, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * That's very interesting and wrong. Suppose he dies before he takes the field. Dwyer is not the same case. But nice try. Walter Görlitz (talk) 02:33, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Man, if you look at any website covering this story, you gonna see that they say the same thing. González can now ONLY represent the United States at the international level. The same as Saief. But show me where in Wikipedia is written that cap-tied players must to keep wearing their youth NT flag and then you can keep pretending González is still mexican and Saief is still israeli.--SirEdimon (talk) 02:54, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Correction: if you look an any American website.
 * What happens if González dies or is injured so that he is incapable of playing and never steps onto the field? What nation would his last international game be for? Are you anticipating his first step onto the field? You can keep pretending he played for the US, but the truth is.... Walter Görlitz (talk) 03:08, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * If he dies now, he will be an american international, because from the moment FIFA confirmed his one-time switch he became an american international for all purposes. For FIFA, he's american since June 29, 2017 and he's cap-tied. It means, he cannot play for Mexico or any other nations. Lets just wonder, ok. Even, if Arena or any another USMNT coach, don't give him any minute of playing time for US, he will never be able to play for any other country because he cap-tied for US. So, this is my point. He already a cap-tied american international player for FIFA rules and therefore should use american flag ahead of his name, just like Saief.--SirEdimon (talk) 03:35, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * You're so absolutely wrong, but you don't seem to care. Have a nice life. Walter Görlitz (talk) 06:09, 30 June 2017 (UTC)

Orphaned references in FC Dallas
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of FC Dallas's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "auto": From United States:  From New York City:

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 12:38, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

title: Talk:FC Dallas


text:
Bawls

Bawls (marketed as BAWLS Guarana) is a non-alcoholic, highly-caffeinated soft drink.

Created in 1996, the citrus-and-cream soda-flavored beverage leans heavily on the caffeine and natural flavor of the Amazonian guarana berry. Packaged in unique cobalt-blue bottles and cans, the drink was well received by gamers, to whom the company quickly began extensively marketing (through both sponsorships and video games themselves). The soda's name has an unclear provenance, and is still sold alongside six other flavors.

History
In 1994, Hobart C. Buppert III (born 1974 (age 24)) was a student at the Cornell University School of Hotel Administration. While traveling through Vienna, he found club dancers were paying US$10 1994 for cans of non-alcoholic, highly-caffeinated, "sludgy brew" derived from guarana beans. Himself unable to tolerate coffee, Buppert saw potential in refining the drink he saw in Europe and received permission from Cornell to develop a business plan as an independent study.

Buppert graduated from Cornell in 1995 with a degree in finance. In 1996, he took out a loan for US$200000 1996 to launch Hobarama in Miami Beach, Florida. That November in South Beach, he launched his first product: Bawls Guarana, a soft drink with three times the caffeine of Coca-Cola Classic. Bawls capitalized upon trends of the mid-1990s by being highly caffeinated, derived from natural ingredients, and having a gimmicky premise. By 1998, Bawls was not only popular in the nightclubs of New York City, South Florida, and Southern California, but was spreading to grocery stores in the US and Europe. In its first year, Bawls brought in revenue of US$400000 1998. By 2000, Bawls was distributed by Arizona Distribution, and two years later, Hobarama moved into new Miami Beach offices at 311 Lincoln Road.

By November 2009, Hobarama was struggling, and creditors like Fifth Third Bank forced out chief executive officer (CEO) and founder, Buppert. A restructuring plan was put into place, and the company was entertaining any buyout offers. On stable footing by 2012, the company bought out competitors Crunk Energy Drink and Strut & Rut. Jon Gunnerson was the company's CEO in 2014, which had since moved its offices to Twinsburg, Ohio.

The marketing and higher caffeine content of Monster Energy delivered the first damage to Bawls' market share in 2002 by being more-widely appealing. The company later lost even its gamer niche to brands including Mtn Dew Game Fuel, Rockstar, and G Fuel—a brand with over 111 times more social-media followers. In 2022, the drink was being produced by Solvi Acquisition, and Bon Appétit reported on both Buppert's prediction that Bawls was in its twilight, and that the drink was "nearly impossible to find in stores".

Composition
The Baltimore Sun described Bawls' taste as citrus-flavored cream soda, and the soft drink gets its caffeine from the Amazonian guarana berry.

In 2002, a 12 USfloz bottle had 80 mg of caffeine, and cost about US$1.00 2002. In 2004, a 10 USfloz bottle had as much caffeine as 1.5 cups of coffee, and cost between US$1–1.50 (equivalent to $– in ).

In 2015, the 16 USfloz can of original Bawls had 95 cal, and both the composition and guarana suppliers were yet unchanged from 1996.

Packaging
In 2003, Bawls sourced its cobalt-blue bottles from Germany, and the bottle caps from Ecuador. They came together in Hillside, New Jersey where Bawls was bottled with guarana from Brazil. Circa 2005, Buppert described the drink's brand identity as based on the unique bottles, where the raised bumps "convey the idea of 'bouncing balls inside the bottle punching their way out.

In 2006, Hobarama developed a canned variant of Bawls both for shipping to overseas fans serving with the United States Armed Forces, and distribution at events prohibiting glass containers (e.g. paintball tournaments). The company partnered with Crown Beverage Packaging to develop a can that would evoke the uniqueness of the textured bottles: the 16 USfloz aluminum cans are the first to feature foaming ink, a new and then-unused technology that applies a low-gloss print that swells when heated, giving the cans a surface akin to the bottles. In Montreal, Crown's manufacturing of these new cans took 18.6–30 percent longer than traditional can-printing processes. The can was one of Brand Packaging selections for "best new consumer package goods packages of 2006."

Marketing
By 2002, Bawls was focusing its marketing on gamers, who amounted to 50 percent of the drink's consumers, and were "typically males between 18 and 34." Eschewing the health-benefits claims of other energy drinks of the time, Bawls instead focused on just being a soft drink with lots of caffeine, earning "an almost cult-like following among computer addicts looking for a source of energy to keep them awake for gaming binges lasting 15 to 24 hours straight." That year, the company sponsored 2500 LAN parties.

To capitalize on the connection, the national chain CompUSA began selling the soda in its stores "to court the hard-core gamer market" (those who played PC games for more than 40 hours per week). From 2004 through at least 2008, Bawls was featured at the Penny Arcade Expo, which brought the drink "a huge amount of attention". Bawls partnered with GameFly in 2008 to cross-promote each other through mutual discounts. In 2014, the Bawls was still marketed to gamers, including sponsoring QuakeCon 2014 where 4799.9 USgal were drunk.

Name
In a 1998 interview with CNNfn, Buppert said of the name, "[it] represents a state of mind. Bawls is a very common slang term—to be bold and daring—and that's how we see the product. [...]  I think it's very difficult for a consumer to forget a product called Bawls Guarana." In 2002, The Mercury News reported that BAWLS was an abbreviation for Brazilian American Wildlife Society, "intended to promote sustainable uses for the rain forest"; Buppert repeated that story to CNN in 2003. A 2004 article by The Cornell Daily Sun said Buppert was brainstorming to emulate the strong names of existing brands (Flying Tiger, Red Bull), when "Bawls" instead came from a friend's joke of "Why don’t you just call it Balls?" When Gunnerson was asked about the name in 2015, he said, "Bounce like a ball. It gives you enough energy and fuel. That was really the inspiration of it from my understanding. […] Bounce with BAWLS was really our one key tagline for quite some time."

Product placement
Hobarama and Vivendi Universal Games made a deal in 2002 for cross-promotion. Bawls received product placement as a game mechanic in the 2002 video game, Run Like Hell: protagonist Nick Conner drinks Bawls from vending machines to boost his health. In exchange, cases of Bawls bore advertisements for the game.

In the 2004 video game, Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel, a shakeup in the management of Interplay Entertainment led to the replacement of the Fallout franchise's iconic Nuka-Cola with the real-world Bawls for the franchise's first outing on consoles. The swap was not well-received by fans.

Bawls has also been featured in TV shows and films, including The Big Bang Theory, The Hangover, and Silicon Valley.

Sponsorships
In 2002, the soda was the official soft drink of the Cyberathlete Professional League. Bawls has also been the official energy drink for the National Professional Paintball League (in 2004 & 2006), Mercedes-Benz Fashion Week (2008), and Olympus Fashion Week.

Reception
In 1998, after Bawls was positively reviewed by Stephen Heaslip of Blue's News, the company's own site traffic increased by 2700–11320 percent. In 2003, The Baltimore Sun called the drink "a smooth and tasty sip." In 2005, Hobarama shipped 20 million bottles of Bawls. Ars Technica wrote of Bawls in 2008, "the huge amounts of caffeine within each bottle—along with the fact that it tastes far better than Red Bull—have made it a favorite beverage at many a LAN party and game tournament since [2004]."

Variants
The sugar-free Bawls Guaranexx was the first variant of Bawls, released in 2003. In 2006, Hobarama partnered with 7-Eleven to produce a Bawls-based Slurpee (Sno Bawls) in the Dallas–Fort Worth metroplex. By 2008, additional Bawls variants were available, including Bawls Cherry and Bawls Exxtra. Bawls' root beer variant—G33k Beer—premiered at a 2008 Halo tournament in South Miami, Florida; that year it was named BevNET's Energy Drink of the Year.

, there were eleven combinations of Bawls flavors and packaging listed on the official website. In 10 USfloz bottles were Original Soda, Zero, Orange, Ginger, Cherry Cola, Cherry, and Root Beer. The 16 USfloz cans were sold with Original, Zero, Cherry, and Root Beer.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Bawls


text:
User talk:Ice

o.o hi, I'm Ice.

Please leave notes below, I will reply here and keep my replies up for 1 year after initial date, barring memory or laziness issues.

title: User talk:Ice


text:
Talk:SHA-1

SHA and MD5
Is it possible to find two messages that have the same SHA(1 or 2) and MD5 hashes? What is the probability of coming across such a file by chance (compared to that for SHA and MD5 individually)? 58.152.239.68 (talk) 13:49, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

 * My answer probably isn't as clear as you would want it to be, but Wikipedia is not a Q&A site (you might want to try for instance Stack Overflow). But you can have a look at birthday paradox, birthday attack, collision attack. -- intgr [talk] 16:06, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

The best public cryptanalysys is wrong
The box resuming sha-1 algorithm says that Best public cryptanalysis is 2^59. IT's WRONG. You can see it here http://ehash.iaik.tugraz.at/wiki/SHA-1

and the newest version of Stéphane Manuel paper can be found here: http://www-rocq.inria.fr/secret/Stephane.Manuel/pdfs/WCC09_paper.pdf

On it she never touch on the 2^51 algorithm and says that the best one is the on other article, that article refeerences the Wang 2^69 article.

So the correct colision algoritm would be Wang´s 2^69

thx —Preceding unsigned comment added by 187.104.242.162 (talk) 16:48, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

 * I agree, the Paper from Stéphane Manuel states no practical attack, but only a theoretical complexity of 2^51.
 * To quote its complexity evaluation: "We are not claiming that this is the best way ever to evaluate the complexity of a collision attack against SHA-1."
 * 84.133.169.233 (talk) 02:09, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Stéphane is a he. Unfortunately this WCC09_paper.pdf document is no longer accessible, but the abstract of the published version of the document ( http://www.springerlink.com/content/u320751102001580/ ) states that the most efficient vector is the Jutla & Patthak Codeword2 which complexity he evaluated to be 2^60. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jmdwp (talk • contribs) 11:21, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

XOR strings?
In the pseudo code, how are the words XORed together? XORing a string? Would you just use ASCII values? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.183.128.96 (talk) 12:44, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Bitwise. 84.209.89.214 (talk) 13:02, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

 * XOR is a bitwise operation, which doesn't care what the contents of the bits are, as long as all bit combinations are allowed. Gah4 (talk) 19:13, 5 March 2017 (UTC)
 * FWIW "word" refers to several bytes, usually 4 or 8, processed as a unit by a microprocessor. 91.148.224.66 (talk) 16:43, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

due to avalanche effect ?
I am not a native english speaker, but this does not seem right. Avalanche effect is not *cause*, its name for earlier part of sentence. "Even a small change in the message will, with overwhelming probability, result in a completely different hash due to the avalanche effect." I think this should be rewritten as "Even a small change in the message will, with overwhelming probability, result in a completely different hash (a.k.a. avalanche effect)." wiki+tomas.rozkov@gmail.com 89.103.132.159 (talk) 10:54, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
 * "due to avalanche effect" can be read either as "caused by avalanche effect" or as "resulting from avalanche effect". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.209.89.214 (talk) 13:15, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

Example Hashes wrong?
For sha1("The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog") I get be417768b5c3c5c1d9bcb2e7c119196dd76b5570 which differs from the article. However, for sha1("") I do get the published value of da39a3ee5e6b4b0d3255bfef95601890afd80709. Could someone verify the first two example hashes? 199.29.247.15 (talk) 22:05, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

For this section

These are examples of SHA-1 digests. ASCII encoding is used for all messages.

SHA1("The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog") = 2fd4e1c6 7a2d28fc ed849ee1 bb76e739 1b93eb12 Even a small change in the message will, with overwhelming probability, result in a completely different hash due to the avalanche effect. For example, changing dog to cog produces a hash with different values for 81 of the 160 bits:

SHA1("The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy cog") = de9f2c7f d25e1b3a fad3e85a 0bd17d9b 100db4b3

The hash of the zero-length string is:

SHA1("") = da39a3ee 5e6b4b0d 3255bfef 95601890 afd80709 --- Those hashes each have 40 characters. Which is 320 bits. If SHA1 has an 160 (edited to correct wrong citation from table) bit output, as claimed in the table at the top of the article, then the examples are wrong. Or the table is wrong. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.8.62.178 (talk) 14:47, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

 * The hashes are expressed in hexadecimal which uses two characters per eight bits of hash data. This is much more convenient than writing the hash is "�6�W0ᒦ��>���2"���[E�" (for example).   40 characters is needed to represent 160 bits:  160 bits divided by 8 bits per byte is 20 bytes.  20 bytes is represented by 40 hexadecimal characters.  —EncMstr (talk) 19:27, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

--- I think I can clear this up. The OP accidentially added a newline character to the hash input. SHA1("The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog\n") = be417768b5c3c5c1d9bcb2e7c119196dd76b5570, but SHA1("The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog") = 2fd4e1c67a2d28fced849ee1bb76e7391b93eb12. O.mangold (talk) 14:46, 26 August 2016 (UTC)

Broken?
While there have been several published theoretical attacks on SHA-1, the last I heard no one has produced a collision, so putting it in the Category Broken Cryptographic Hashes may be premature. At the least, a notable citation saying it is considered broken is needed.--agr (talk) 01:02, 11 June 2012 (UTC)

 * Premature in 2012, but not in 2017. Gah4 (talk) 19:16, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

SHA-1 Pseudocode Typo
I think there's a typo in the pseudo code. On page 9 of the FIPS 180-2 document, it says:
 * ft (x,y,z)=Ch(x,y,z=(x^y) xor (~x^z)    0 ≤ t ≤ 19

(Other values for the function continue for t > 19.)

And the pseudocode shows:

 * f = (b and c) or ((not b) and d)

Shouldn't that or, be an xor?

 * f = (b and c) xor ((not b) and d)

140.101.84.1 (talk) 17:38, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

 * It does not matter. They are both the same function. 178.195.225.28 (talk) 18:02, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, I see that now. I also see this fact mentioned in the last sentence of section 4.1 of the document.129.188.33.25 (talk) 14:36, 31 October 2012 (UTC)

The original FIPS PUB 180-1 specified it as :f = (b and c) or ((not b) and d), while newer versions of the publication specify it as :f = (b and c) xor ((not b) and d). Since FIPS PUB 180-1 is no longer available from NIST I would suggest referring to the newer document instead and adapting the pseudo-code and alternative forms accordingly.

General comment in the article about hash algorithms versus key derivation algorithms
"The use of plain or salted hashes for password storage is a bad idea, they are not designed for this, and key-derivation algorithms like PBKDF2 or Bcrypt or similar should be used instead." - Is this true? There's no citation for such a qualitative statement, And even if so, does it belong in an article about a specific hash function? I'm no expert so I don't feel qualified to edit the article. Dominic Sayers (talk) 10:06, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

relevance of MS-office section
I just had a read of this article and happened to note the section on MS-Office screaming out at me as being irrelevant - many if not most applications can use SHA1 so I don't think the article should contain a section on MS Office's use of SHA1. Alex Harvey (talk) 05:23, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

Phrasing query
"Although no successful attacks have yet been reported on SHA-2, they are algorithmically similar to SHA-1."

The sentence says that no successful hacks have been reported; what is the "they" referred to here? Unsuccessful hacks? (Edit: er, I mean attacks, not hacks.)

--150.101.105.198 (talk) 23:31, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

Apparent Inconsistency - Relationship of SHA-1, SHA-2 Algorithms
The first paragraph contains the statement SHA-2 on the other hand significantly differs from the SHA-1 hash function.

The third paragraph states Although no successful attacks have yet been reported on SHA-2, they are algorithmically similar to SHA-1.

How to reconcile the statements ??
 * they significantly differ
 * they are algorithmically similar — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.73.158.94 (talk) 13:13, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
 * I wanted to add the same. Except without 'apparent': DEAR WIKIPEDIANS, your article is fucking stupid. Correct it or stop calling WP an 'encyclopedia'. An 8 year old could write things that make more sense--are you below that age? 5.12.154.157 (talk) 07:04, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

Collision Attack
Hi, Stépane Manuel, author of the 2^51 attack, removed this claim from the final paper (see here). The best attack is today the one from Stevens (here). Do you have any other information that I may have missed? --Dduuhh (talk) 15:52, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

What is rot?
In the section Comparison of SHA functions, the table lists bitwise functions that include "rot". The bitwise function article has no mention of "rot". Now I assume that rot means some form of rotation (covered in the bitwise function article) but which one is it? Or is it more than one form of rotation? A simple footnote clarifying the "rot" term would suffice. 99.245.230.104 (talk) 20:46, 30 April 2014 (UTC)

 * It refers to Rotate no carry (Circular shift). I don't know if a footnote is necessary since this is really the standard set of bitwise operations, and I'm not sure what else "rot" could be reasonably confused with. But I have no real objection to someone adding one. Mlkj (talk) 09:04, 29 May 2016 (UTC)

 * Rot is not quite as common as many other bitwise operations. It exists in some computer architectures, where it allows one to use it to build up other operations. Rotate through carry allows for a multiple register shift, for example. Architectures that include a multiple register shift, such as IBM S/360 and successors, don't have it.  (It might have been added more recently, I can't keep track of all the new instructions.) I suspect that it could use a little documentation. Gah4 (talk) 20:01, 7 January 2018 (UTC)

Big endianness!?1717
The description of the algorithm uses big endianness as a notation for multibyte integer units (words). Of course, how constants are represented in a pseudocode it doesn't matter, but it seems the algorithm itself makes the big endian view the part of its requirements. It treats a chunk of the input 512 bits as an array of 32 unsigned integers on which operations such as addition modulo 2^32 are applied. And it does matter if the algorithm dictates to treat every 32 bits of the input bit string as a word with big endian byte order on it as is in the pseudocode. A BE computer just will load the next 4 bytes from the message buffer into its variables (registers) and do its math, but a LE computer will need shuffle those 4 bytes all around before to continue on the steps required by the standard. Does really the algorithm require that, and for what a reason in this little endian dominated world this requirement has been done by designers? Every computer which almost certainly is little endian now needs to perform such an overhead by the will of the designers just like in the case of stupid choice for the network order which at least was motivated by dominating of BE systems at the times networking was born. But at the times sha appeared, little endian systems was dominating, so why why this choice? This is totally needless overhead where performance requirements are so desirable. I'm note sure if LE systems have some tweaking features to overcome this stupidity. Eg reading (at once) 4 bytes from the buffer back to forth (from the addr a to a-3 incl.). The case is in the same principle - standard should be designed for the real system in minds, not for sphaerical horse in vacuum. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.52.153.89 (talk) 18:08, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia talk pages are for discussing changes to the article. Sorry, this is not the place to argue about the design decisions of SHA-1. -- intgr [talk] 18:18, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, it could be discussed here if it was for consideration of changing the article. Most LE architecture, though, have a single and presumably fast instruction for doing the conversion. Easy enough. Gah4 (talk) 13:54, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Well, it could be discussed here if it was for consideration of changing the article. Most LE architecture, though, have a single and presumably fast instruction for doing the conversion. Easy enough. Gah4 (talk) 13:54, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Well, it could be discussed here if it was for consideration of changing the article. Most LE architecture, though, have a single and presumably fast instruction for doing the conversion. Easy enough. Gah4 (talk) 13:54, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

Performance column in table
The performance column only refers to a CPU used, and smacks of Original Research. Although some might be pedantic, I don't mind. But these numbers differ from what I see using OpenSSL - I find that SHA-1 is almost as fast as MD5 (within ten or twenty percent, perhaps), but that SHA-256 is substantially (four times?) slower. Anybody know what algorithms were benchmarked here, or ideally, external references to benchmarks?

Ketil (talk) 06:30, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

 * Oh, I see there was an external link, but from 2009. Time for an update, perhaps? Ketil (talk) 06:44, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Document SHAppening/Fappening/Snappening name relationship?
I added a footnote, for the benefit of readers years later when the terms are no longer current, explaining that "The SHAppening" is a reference to The Fappening (and, I should have added, Snapchat). User:Intgr reverted it on the grounds that it lacked a WP:reliable source. I hadn't included one because, per WP:V, I hadn't expected the statement to be challenged.

The problem is, due (I believe) to a combination of not wanting to be condescending to readers and the unsavoury nature of the nude photo leaks, I haven't managed to track down a source explicitly documenting that fact.

So per the WP:BOLD, revert, discuss cycle, I'd just like to canvas other people's opinions. Do y'all feel: Personally, I think it's very marginally notable (which is why I put it in a footnote and not the main text), but in a spirit of inclusionism, might be informative to a non-native English speaker or future reader when the terms have faded from people's awareness. 71.41.210.146 (talk) 09:31, 27 October 2015 (UTC)
 * 1) It's not true that it's a deliberate reference to those terms, or at least there's a reasonable chance it's not.  (E.g. it might be a reference to The Happening (2008 film) instead.)
 * 2) It is a deliberate reference, but that fact isn't WP:notable enough to be worth mentioning at all.
 * 3) It would be worth mentioning if we could find a WP:RS, but if we can't, it should be omitted per policy.
 * 4) It is worth mentioning.  (FWIW, User:Intgr has expressed a willingness to be persuaded by consensus here to drop the challenge.)

 * The discussion between OP and me is at User talk:71.41.210.146. -- intgr [talk] 10:09, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

Collisions not yet found (Dec 2015)
The section "Comparison of SHA functions" is indicating that collisions for SHA-1 have been found. As far as I understand the quoted source this is only true for the compression function within SHA-1. No two inputs for SHA-1 have been found (yet) that produce the same hash value. --KommX (talk) 09:06, 15 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks! You are correct, as per the source: "freestart collisions do not directly lead to actual collisions for SHA-1". The table is now hidden away in a separate template page, that's why editors watching the article probably didn't notice this IP address edit. -- intgr [talk] 09:23, 15 December 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree no collisions have been found for SHA1, AIUI the attach has been demonstrated by attacking the compression function only which is not the same as finding a collision. The reference seems clear about this. I edited the template to no collisions found and included the SHAppening cost estimate to give indication of near term risks of finding collision with explanation that less than 80 is not a good representation of none. My template edit has been reverted and I don't see any good reason for this. I think it should be reverted back to my version or something better unless someone has good reason to support "<80" crandles (talk) 10:12, 16 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Should the template have security bits in one column and security information in a separate column? crandles (talk) 10:36, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Revision control
Revision control systems such as Git and Mercurial use SHA-1 not for security but for ensuring that the data has not changed due to accidental corruption. Am I the only one who thinks this is nonsense? When you sign a git commit, what really is signed is the SHA-1 id of the commit, thus the security clearly relies on SHA-1 not being broken. However Git does not require the second preimage resistance of SHA-1 as a security feature, since it will always prefer to keep the earliest version of an object in case of collision, preventing an attacker from surreptitiously overwriting files. This is only true as long as you pulled the commit in question first from a trusted source. But this is not always the case, for example when using Gittorrent. Even worse seems to be the situation when a malicious actor is able to get commits merged upstream. Then the security not only depends on second-preimage resistance of SHA-1 but also on collision resistance.

O.mangold (talk) 11:11, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

Pronounciation
How is "sha" pronounced? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.37.140.38 (talk) 13:51, 29 September 2016 (UTC)

"Announced an attack" vs "performed an attack"
Re : To me, "announced an attack" could refer to mathematically proving that a collision is feasible, which had already been done several years ago, without actually committing the processing resources to do it. Furthermore, the article collision attack clearly shows that the phrase can be used to refer to just finding a collision, whether or not the collision was used for an "advantage". Smyth (talk) 14:29, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

 * See if anyone else wants to say, one way or the other. I was thinking in terms of a physical attack.  (Country X) attacked (country Y) usually doesn't mean that they just collected enough guns and ammo, and even went to live rounds practicing, but that they actually used them in the country.  But maybe the analogy isn't right. It was really close when I decided to do the rv, and maybe others will add to the discussion.  Thanks. Gah4 (talk) 17:11, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

 * OK, for now I reverted the change. Unlike countries, there can be an attack against SHA-1 vs. an attack using SHA-1.  This distinction isn't so easy to make in words.  As in the paper, one could make two copies of a document, for example with different monetary values.  Verifying using SHA-1 would allow one to cheat using the second document.  As far as I know, that hasn't happened.  The form of the collision documents makes detection fairly easy, though, if one decides to check.  Gah4 (talk) 20:00, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

Javascript
There seems to be something against linking to SHA-1 calculators, but if it could be done in Javascript, it could be done from this page. Not that JS is a very convenient language for it, but it is nice for embedded web pages, without linking to somewhere else. Gah4 (talk) 21:54, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

2017
There is a comment that some browsers will stop accepting SHA-1 certificates in 2017. Since it is now 2018, this should be known. Did they, or didn't they? Gah4 (talk) 20:03, 7 January 2018 (UTC)

Hardened SHA1
Not sure if it's quite notable enough to mention it, but there is a "hardened" SHA1 hash function that produces identical SHA1 hashes in almost all cases (2^-90 chance of different hash), except when it detects collision attempts occurring. https://github.com/cr-marcstevens/sha1collisiondetection

Apparently this is now on the mainline git (from v2.13) so if you were to put the SHAttered pdf files into git, it would not cause any issues. If this sees wider adoption it would certainly be worth mentioning in the article. --Nanite (talk) 16:11, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

Request for Review in Leurent-Peyrin Attack Section
A few days ago I added coverage of the Leurent-Peyrin attack based on skimming the paper in question and referenced papers. One particular sentence I wrote is "This method is also capable of finding chosen-prefix collisions in the MD5 function, but at a complexity of 246.3 does not surpass the prior best available method at a theoretical level (239), though potentially at a practical level (≤249)." This was based on the belief that references to MD5 attacks with a specific block count referred to basing the search for solutions on a given number of blocks there is information for, making smaller numbers of blocks more difficult to solve theoretically than larger numbers (as reflected in the complexity for 3-block solutions and general solutions). But now I'm doubting this assumption, thinking they were referring to hashing messages of that number of blocks length, where shorter messages are much easier to analyze to find collisions for than longer messages (though that doesn't really explain why the attack against a 3-block message would take longer than the theoretical attack in general); if true, the claim that the Leurent-Peyrin attack is more practical than the prior best attack is completely wrong. Justin.olbrantz (talk) 10:11, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

Second attack
I have just published a (the?) second public pair of colliding files. https://privacylog.blogspot.com/2019/12/the-second-sha-collision.html Thought you might be interested Full Decent (talk) 06:33, 31 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Right in time for it to still be in 2019, I see. "Processing power used: none. No brute force processing was necessary to generate these two files based on the other files above." Which other files were these based on? BernardoSulzbach (talk) 16:15, 31 December 2019 (UTC)
 * This is not new -- the same 320 byte vectors were used to win the Bitcoin SHA1 collision challenge, back in 2017. (See 'sigscript' here https://www.blockchain.com/btc/tx/8d31992805518fd62daa3bdd2a5c4fd2cd3054c9b3dca1d78055e9528cff6adc ). I'd link to the bitcointalk thread but that site is blacklisted on wikipedia. --Nanite (talk) 23:44, 1 January 2020 (UTC)

 * All you did was to take the first 320 bytes of the two files of Stevens et al! As is clear from their paper, you can put whatever you want after those 320 bytes, so long as you put the same thing in both files. You just left that part out! Big deal. Eric Kvaalen (talk) 08:36, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

Is the collision really useful?
Stevens et al] found a way to create two different files having the same SHA-1 digest. In fact, what they did was to create two beginnings of a PDF file, and then one can put whatever one wants after that so long as it's the same in the two files. They say "We exploit these limited differences to craft two colliding PDF documents containing arbitrary distinct images." But that doesn't seem to be true! Since the content after the first 320 bytes has to be the same, the images will be practically the same. They give an example at https://shattered.io. The two PDFs are the same exxcept for the colors. I suppose the colors are determined by the two blocks that differ in the first 320 bytes.

So in that case, how is this useful? At https://shattered.io they say "For example, by crafting the two colliding PDF files as two rental agreements with different rent, it is possible to trick someone to create a valid signature for a high-rent contract by having him or her sign a low-rent contract." But not with the collision they found! All it would do is give two rental agreements with different colors! No? Please Ping me if you answer. Eric Kvaalen (talk) 08:36, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
 * As well as I know, it is possible, but it is also possible to check that one did that, so you can easily show that someone used this case. It just means one extra test in programs using it. Gah4 (talk) 13:59, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
 * As well as I know, it is possible, but it is also possible to check that one did that, so you can easily show that someone used this case. It just means one extra test in programs using it. Gah4 (talk) 13:59, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

When was SHA-3 first published?
The SHA-1 article claims 2015, but the SHA-3 article claims 2016. 85.230.7.52 (talk) 16:41, 30 November 2022 (UTC)

 * I wonder if the Data integrity section rather should be put here in Talk instead. Feilretter2468 (talk) 20:59, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Edit needs to be reversed
Looks like someone modified the page from Rivest to Guinness. Not sure if there's other fake edits too Silversplash (talk) 05:21, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

Ain’t gona be Fun when the rabbit gets the gun 146.85.96.234 (talk) 13:39, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:SHA-1


text: User talk:192.115.106.236

title: User talk:192.115.106.236


text:
Stephanie Seymour

Stephanie Michelle Seymour (born July 23, 1968) is an American model and actress. During the 1980s and 1990s, she was one of the most popular supermodels, being featured in the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Issue and the cover of Vogue, as well as being a former Victoria's Secret Angel. She had a book published about beauty tips and has participated in advertising campaigns for clothing and cosmetic products. In 2017, Seymour launched her own line of lingerie. She has ventured into acting with one appearance in each medium of film, television, and video games.

Early life and career
Born in San Diego, California, the middle child of a California real estate-developer father and hairstylist mother, Seymour started her modeling career working for local newspapers and department stores in her hometown at the age of 16. In 1983, at 15, she was a finalist at the inaugural Elite Model Management Look of the Year modeling contest (now called Elite Model Look).

In the late 1980s and early 1990s, Seymour appeared in numerous issues of the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Issue and on the cover of Vogue as well. During the same period, Seymour was a primary lingerie and hosiery model for the relatively new Victoria's Secret company in its mail-order catalogs and retail stores. In March 1991, and again in February 1993, Seymour posed for Playboy. She was one of the most famous supermodels of the 1980s and 1990s along with Kate Moss, Naomi Campbell, Linda Evangelista, Christy Turlington, Helena Christensen, Cindy Crawford, and Claudia Schiffer. Vanity Fair would later have several of these models appear on the cover of an issue photographed by Mario Testino, called "—A League Of Their Own".

In the 2006 book In Vogue: The Illustrated History of the World's Most Famous Fashion Magazine, the editors cite the "original supermodels" and Seymour when quoting Vogue editor-in-chief Anna Wintour, who said, "Those girls were so fabulous for fashion and totally reflected that time ... [They] were like movie stars." The editors name famous models from previous decades, but explain that, "None of them attained the fame and worldwide renown bestowed on Linda Evangelista, Christy Turlington, Cindy Crawford, Naomi Campbell, Tatjana Patitz, Stephanie Seymour, Claudia Schiffer, Yasmeen Ghauri, and Karen Mulder in the late 1980s and early 1990s. These models burst out beyond the pages of the magazines. Many became the faces of cosmetics brands and perfumes, had their own television programs and physical-fitness videos and their own lines of lingerie. Their lives, activities, influences, and images were the subjects of all types of sociological and historical analysis."

In 1998, Seymour wrote Stephanie Seymour's Beauty Secrets for Dummies. In 2000, Seymour was ranked #91 on the North American FHM 100 Sexiest Women of 2000 list. In 2006, she appeared in a campaign for Gap with her children.

Salvatore Ferragamo's creative campaign for his fall/winter 2007/2008 collection featured Seymour and Claudia Schiffer, shot on location in Italy with Mario Testino. In the promotional photos, the supermodels play film stars protected by bodyguards and pursued by the paparazzi. Seymour was joined by other fellow supermodels Naomi Campbell, Kate Moss, Linda Evangelista, Daria Werbowy, Christy Turlington, and Amber Valletta for the September 2013 issue of Interview magazine titled "Model".

In 2014, Seymour was named a global spokesmodel for Estée Lauder.

Seymour co-founded and launched the lingerie line Raven & Sparrow in 2017. The line features high end vintage inspired pieces designed for comfort, ranging from camisoles and rompers to silk robes and nightgowns. It is available exclusively at Barneys New York.

Acting
Seymour's first acting role was as explosives expert Cynna Stone in the video game Hell: A Cyberpunk Thriller. She played the unusual part of a live actor in a game whose characters and scenery were nearly all CG renders.

In 2000, Seymour played Helen Frankenthaler in the movie Pollock. In 2002, she played the role of Sara Lindstrom in the "Crazy" episode of Law & Order: Criminal Intent.

Personal life
At the age of 14, she began dating 42 year old John Casablancas, the head of Elite Model Management, who was, at the time, married to model Jeanette Christiansen. The couple lived together before Seymour broke off the relationship.

From 1989 to 1990, she was married to guitarist Tommy Andrews. They have a son named Dylan together.

By mid-1991, she had become involved with Axl Rose, the lead singer of Guns N' Roses. She appeared in two music videos by Guns N' Roses: "Don't Cry" and "November Rain". The couple were engaged, but they broke up in February 1993. In August 1993, Rose sued Seymour claiming she assaulted him and stole more than $100,000 worth of jewelry. Seymour countersued claiming he was physically abusive. Seymour subpoenaed Erin Everly, Rose's ex-wife, to testify that she was also abused by him. The lawsuits were eventually settled.

Shortly after her breakup with Rose, Seymour began dating business man Peter Brant, who was married and the father of five children. She gave birth to the couple's first son, Peter II, in December 1993. Seymour and Brant married in July 1995 in Paris. Seymour gave birth to a second son, Harry, in 1996, and a daughter in 2004. In March 2009, Seymour filed for divorce from Brant after almost 14 years of marriage. The couple reconciled in 2010. In January 2021, Harry died at age 24 from an accidental prescription medication overdose, after struggling with addiction for several years.

title: Stephanie Seymour


text:
Leroy Vinnegar

Leroy Vinnegar (July 13, 1928 – August 3, 1999) was an American jazz bassist. Born in Indianapolis, Indiana, United States, the self-taught Vinnegar established his reputation in Los Angeles, California, during the 1950s and 1960s. His trademark was the rhythmic "walking" bass line, a steady series of ascending or descending notes, and it brought him the nickname "The Walker". Besides his jazz work, he also appeared on a number of soundtracks and pop albums, notably Van Morrison's 1972 album, Saint Dominic's Preview.

Music career
He recorded extensively as both a leader and sideman. He came to public attention in the 1950s as a result of recording with Lee Konitz, André Previn, Stan Getz, Shorty Rogers, Chet Baker, Shelly Manne, Joe Castro and Serge Chaloff.

He played bass on Previn and Manne's My Fair Lady album, one of the most successful jazz records ever produced. He also performed on another of jazz's biggest hit albums, Eddie Harris and Les McCann's Swiss Movement, released in 1969. Vinnegar also performed at the Lighthouse in Hermosa Beach, California, and Diggers in East Los Angeles in the late 1950s, with drummer and pianist Don Joham along with other musicians. He moved to Portland, Oregon in 1986. In 1995, the Oregon State Legislature honored him by proclaiming May 1 Leroy Vinnegar Day.

Vinnegar died of a heart attack, at the age of 71, on August 3, 1999, in a hospital in Portland.

As leader

 * Leroy Walks! (Contemporary, 1958)
 * Leroy Walks Again!! (Contemporary, 1963)
 * Jazz's Great "Walker"  (Vee Jay, 1964)
 * Glass of Water (Legend, 1973)
 * The Kid (PBR, 1974; Q-Tape, 2005)
 * Walkin' the Basses (Contemporary, 1992)

As sideman
With Pepper Adams With Stan Getz and Lionel Hampton With Chet Baker With Tom Ball and Kenny Sultan With Conte Candoli With Benny Carter With Joe Castro With Serge Chaloff With Dolo Coker With Buddy Collette With Sonny Criss With The Doors With Barbara Dane & Earl Hines With Kenny Dorham With Kenny Drew With Harry Edison With Teddy Edwards With Victor Feldman With Red Garland With Stan Getz With Dexter Gordon With Eddie Harris and Les McCann With Hampton Hawes With Elmo Hope With The Jazz Crusaders With Fred Katz With Barney Kessel With Eric Kloss With Harold Land With Gordon Lee With Shelly Manne With Les McCann With Howard McGhee With Frank Morgan With Van Morrison With Gerry Mulligan and Ben Webster With Phineas Newborn, Jr. With Art Pepper With Carl Perkins With Randy Porter With Sonny Rollins With Shorty Rogers With Jimmy Smith With Sonny Stitt With Cedar Walton With Tut Taylor With Jessica Williams With Don Wilkerson With Gerald Wilson With Jack Wilson
 * Pepper Adams Quintet (Mode, 1956)
 * Hamp and Getz (Norgran, 1955)
 * Quartet: Russ Freeman/Chet Baker (Pacific Jazz, 1956)
 * Who Drank My Beer? (Kicking Mule, 1983)
 * Bloodshot Eyes (Flying Fish, 1986)
 * West Coast Wailers (Atlantic, 1955) with Lou Levy
 * Little Band Big Jazz (Crown, 1960)
 * Jazz Giant (Contemporary, 1958)
 * Swingin' the '20s (Contemporary, 1958)
 * Sax ala Carter! (United Artists, 1960)
 * BBB & Co. (Swingville, 1962) with Ben Webster and Barney Bigard
 * Live at Falcon's Lair! (Pablo, 1956)
 * Groove Funk Soul (Atlantic, 1959)
 * At Falcon's Lair with Joe Castro (1959)
 * Blue Serge (Capitol, 1956)
 * Dolo! (Xanadu, 1976)
 * California Hard (Xanadu, 1977)
 * Third Down (Xanadu, 1977)
 * Xanadu in Africa (Xanadu, 1980) with Al Cohn, Billy Mitchell and Frank Butler
 * Night Flight to Dakar (Xanadu, 1980) with Al Cohn, Billy Mitchell and Frank Butler
 * Nice Day with Buddy Collette (Contemporary, 1957)
 * Saturday Morning (Xanadu, 1975)
 * Waiting for the Sun (Elektra, 1968)
 * Livin' with the Blues (Dot, 1959)
 * Inta Somethin' (Pacific Jazz, 1961)
 * Talkin' & Walkin' (Jazz: West, 1955)
 * Home Is Where the Soul Is (Xanadu, 1978)
 * For Sure! (Xanadu, 1978)
 * "Sweets" for the Sweet (Sue, 1964)
 * Teddy Edwards at Falcon's Lair (MetroJazz, 1958)
 * It's About Time (Pacific Jazz, 1959)
 * Sunset Eyes (Pacific Jazz, 1960)
 * Teddy's Ready! (Contemporary, 1960)
 * Good Gravy! (Contemporary, 1961)
 * Heart & Soul (Contemporary, 1962)
 * Young at Heart (Storyville, 1979) with Howard McGhee
 * Wise in Time (Storyville, 1979) with Howard McGhee
 * Mississippi Lad (Verve/Gitanes, 1991)
 * Vic Feldman on Vibes (Mode, 1957)
 * Keystones! (Xanadu, 1977)
 * West Coast Jazz (Norgran, 1955)
 * ''Hamp and Getz (Verve, 1955)
 * Stan Getz and the Cool Sounds (Verve, 1953–55, [1957])
 * The Steamer (Verve, 1956)
 * Daddy Plays the Horn (Bethlehem, 1955)
 * Dexter Blows Hot and Cool (Dooto, 1955)
 * Swiss Movement (Atlantic, 1969)
 * The Sermon (Contemporary, 1958 [1987])
 * Something Special (Contemporary, 1976 [1994])
 * The Elmo Hope Quintet featuring Harold Land (Pacific Jazz, 1957)
 * Live at the Lighthouse '66 (Pacific Jazz, 1966)
 * Talk That Talk (Pacific Jazz, 1966)
 * Fred Katz and his Jammers (Decca, 1959)
 * Let's Cook! (Contemporary, 1957 [1962])
 * First Class Kloss! (Prestige, 1967)
 * Harold in the Land of Jazz (Contemporary, 1958)
 * On the Shoulders of Giants (Unity Label Group, 1994)
 * Concerto for Clarinet & Combo (Contemporary, 1955 [1957])
 * Swinging Sounds (Contemporary, 1956)
 * More Swinging Sounds (Contemporary, 1956)
 * Shelly Manne & His Friends (Contemporary, 1956)
 * My Fair Lady (Contemporary, 1956)
 * Les McCann Ltd. Plays the Truth (Pacific Jazz, 1960)
 * Les McCann Ltd. Plays the Shout (Pacific Jazz, 1960)
 * From the Top of the Barrel (Pacific Jazz, 1960 [1967])
 * On Time (Pacific Jazz, 1962)
 * Les McCann Plays the Hits (Limelight, 1966)
 * Bucket o' Grease (Limelight, 1967)
 * Much Les (Atlantic, 1968)
 * Fish This Week (United Artists, 1973)
 * Maggie's Back in Town!! (Contemporary, 1961)
 * Young at Heart (Storyville, 1979) with Teddy Edwards
 * Wise in Time (Storyville, 1979) with Teddy Edwards
 * Frank Morgan (Gene Norman Presents, 1955)
 * Saint Dominic's Preview (Warner Bros., 1972)
 * Gerry Mulligan Meets Ben Webster (Verve, 1959)
 * The Great Jazz Piano of Phineas Newborn Jr. (Contemporary, 1963)
 * The Newborn Touch (Contemporary, 1964)
 * The Return of Art Pepper (Jazz: West, 1956)
 * Introducing Carl Perkins (Dootone, 1956)
 * Modern Reflections
 * Sonny Rollins and the Contemporary Leaders (Contemporary, 1958)
 * Martians Come Back! (Atlantic, 1955)
 * Way Up There (Atlantic, 1955 [1957])
 * Bluesmith (Verve, 1972)
 * Sonny Stitt Blows the Blues (Verve, 1959)
 * Saxophone Supremacy (Verve, 1959)
 * Sonny Stitt Swings the Most (Verve, 1959)
 * Cedar! (Prestige, 1967)
 * 12 String Dobro (World Pacific Records, 1964)
 * Encounters (Jazz Focus, 1994)
 * Encounters II (Jazz Focus, 1997)
 * The Texas Twister (Riverside, 1960)
 * Portraits (Pacific Jazz, 1964)
 * The Two Sides of Jack Wilson (Atlantic, 1964)

title: Leroy Vinnegar


text:
Talk:Worzel Gummidge

Losing your head
My whole family loves Worzel (the TV series) very much. The stories are simple and the character's are fun. The "head thing" has been explained to and understood by all of our children and has actually helped them understand many of life's other real and unreal conundrums too. Compare this with what our elite and hubristic society accepts as normal for our children to watch today. Worzel wins heads & hands down. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)

now i remember this tv series scared me to death as child :)
 * Me too - just looking at the pictures of him on this page gives me the creeps! I think it was the interchangable heads that did it...
 * I'll third that. He's just so bloody creepy looking. Don't like it pomegranate 18:10, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

more information about the books would be useful

Head
Was his head a turnip or a Mangelwurzel? Jooler 09:35, 29 August 2005 (UTC) I think it was a turnip! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.15.42.128 (talk) 13:00, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

Story line section
The last paragraph of this section seems quite disjointed. Reads like its been copy and pasted from somewhere. pomegranate 18:10, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Starting date
The year given, 1947, might be for the first television show soon after TV returned from its wartime closure. Worzel Gummidge ran on radio Children's Hour during the war, probably before it too.--SilasW 20:17, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Worzel Gummidge Turns Detective
According to IMDb there was a 1953 TV series called Worzel Gummidge Turns Detective. Does anyone have information on this?--The Shadow Treasurer (talk) 05:15, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Identity crisis?
This page doesn't quite seem to know whether it's subject is the 1970–80s TV series starring Jon Pertwee, or Worzel Gummidge the character as featured in the series. The vast majority of the data relates to the TV series, but there is some info on the earlier books, radio series, TV series, Jackanory, etc.

I think the existing page needs to become 'Worzel Gummidge (TV series)' with 'Worzel Gummidge' continuing to exist for the other/earlier incarnations of the character. Any thoughts? I'll leave things as they are for the time being, but unless anyone can put up a good case for not doing so, I intend to proceed with 'the split' after a suitable period. Thanks. 86.2.48.247 (talk) 07:37, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

stop swearin
Plz tell me y u find wurzel scary?

title: Talk:Worzel Gummidge


text:
User:Panzi

de:Benutzer:Panzi

Read more about me in German: german wikipedia

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title: User:Panzi