text:
Talk:Djbdns

Talk
See [this page] for a discussion of trailing dots in domain names, what they mean, and why they are important.
 * 62.255.32.10 01:02, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

NPOV
This article, plain simply, does not follow the Wikipedia POV guidelines. The article is worded in such a way that only someone who is a strong advocate of DJB's software would word the article. I have tried to create a more neutral wording, but had my changes reverted. Let us look at the changes one by one that I have done.

I've added a link to the NPOV template. Until these issues are looked at by a number of different Wikipedia editors, this article can't have NPOV. I'm the author of MaraDNS, a competing DNS server. Whoever is reverting my changes is a strong DJB advocate.

Here is the first sentence in the copyright status section:

 * As a consequence, some Linux distributions (such as Debian) will not install, and possibly not even include, djbdns because by their rules they classify such software as "non-free"2

I changed this to:

 * As a consequence, most Linux distributions will not include djbdns because the software is not licensed under an Open-source license.

The IP that reverted my change said this in the edit summary: "Restored original wording that was more neutral, because it attributed the view to the people who hold it, and more accurate, because it used the actual classfication."

Let us look at the above sentence one by one:

 * "Most" Linux distributions, not "Some" Linux distributions. I can not name one Linux distribution with DjbDNS; they all  include BIND 9.  RedHat has never included djbdns.  Slackware has never included djbdns.  Mandrake has never included djbdns.  "Some" implies that a large number of Linux distributions include djbdns, when the fact of the matter is that they do not.

 * "djbdns is not licensed under an Open-source license." First of all, there is a license for Djbdns.  Now, compare this license to clause three of the Open Source Definition.  It is factual and NPOV to state that DjbDNS is not licensed under an Open-source license.

I have reworded the sentence to have as little POV as possible:

 * djbdns is Licence-Free Software; the software is not licensed under a license that meets the Open Source Definition. This stops DjbDNS from being included with some Linux distributions, such as Debian.  This is also probably why most other Linux distributions do not include djbdns.

As it turns out, few Linux distributions have a page saying "if it's not compatible with an open source license, we won't include it" page, but, as a practical matter, distributions will not include software that doesn't meet the Open Source Definition unless there is no non-OS versaion available (this is why RedHat used to include Doom, Netscape, and XV; this is why most distributions still include mp3 players). See also    etc.

Lets look at the rest of the changes:

 * Nonetheless, djbdns users point out that it is "free enough" for anyone to use; the source code is publicly available and open for inspection and modification by users; and the licensing issues haven't stopped a large number of feature-enhancing augmentations from being published.

I tried to make this a little kinder to djbdns:

 * djbdns, however, is free for anyone to use; the source code is publicly available, can be downloaded by anyone free of charge, and is open for inspection and modification by users. The licensing issues haven't stopped a large number of feature-enhancing augmentations from being published.

I don't understand why this was reverted. The fact that anyone can download, use, and modify djbdns isn't something djbdns users need to point out; anyone can look at the license and see this for themselves.

Finally, the IP removed the following sentence which clarifies the license:

 * The only limitation is that one can not legally distribute a modified version of djbdns; modifications have to be distributed as diff patches.

This sentence does nothing more than clarify that you can not distribute a modified djbdns. This is a fact and I don't see how this sentence has POV.

The IP also removed a link to a very opinionated rant against DJB's software. His edit summary for removing the link was "Removed irrelevant Moen link that has nothing to do with djbdns". The link points to a page that does discuss djbdns. I added the link to minimize POV; all of the other links are DJB's own links or links of pages belonging to DJB advocates. Obviously, as the author of MaraDNS, another DNS server, it is impossible for me to have a neutral POV. This is why I will add this page to WP:RFC to see if other editors can help this article achieve NPOV.

Samboy 18:27, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

 * (RFC response: my comments are hopefully neutral- I had never even heard of djbns 10 minutes ago)

 * weakly agree that "most" is better than "some" although I don't see it as being a hugely important point. Maybe the word "many" would be a suitable compromise.
 * strongly agree that your first rewrite of the source code sentence is both clearer, NPOV and more encylopedic.
 * strongly agree that the sentence should stay on diff patces. If the article mentions the diff patches then their limitations must also be mentioned to provide balance.
 * weak disagree on the link. Although it's good to get balance, can't you find a better one than a messy page entitled "Rick's Rants" - why is this author of this article notable to be linked to from Wikipedia? Majts 19:07, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

I made a change to the opening paragraph as "fed up with" is hardly encycopedic. I also shortened the sentence re the $500 reward as it was saying the same thing twice. However I feel that this sentence shouldn't be in this paragraph as it hardly defines the product. Majts 19:07, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the input. I very much appreciate it, and will make your proposed changes. Samboy 19:12, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

 * OK, I've changed "most" to "many", and have changed the link to one more neutral. Samboy 19:18, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

Case of djbdns when used at start of a sentence
Seeing djbdns misspelled as "Djbdns" seems as unpleasantly, itchingly wrong to me (and, I presume, many others with Unix or programming backgrounds) as seeing an apparently-incorrectly-capitalized sentence might feel to Nohat. (Of course this goes for qmail as well.) I think that for an encyclopedia article about a technical subject, technical correctness must trump ease of reading.

Here's my argument: djbdns is not an English word at all -- it's a (case-sensitive) Unix filename, and is spelled "djbdns" no matter what human language the surrounding text happens to be written in. This isn't a trendy marketing issue but is a matter of correctness: since if you try to use "Djbdns" in its place in a script or at a command prompt you'll get an error, technical writing must be very clear whenever such non-obvious significant differences exist. (Fortunately, it's now very rare to see case sensitivity in any interface exposed to ordinary users.)

It's true the resemblance of these symbols to English letters isn't accidental. But neither is the resemblance of many mathematical symbols to Greek or Latin letters, yet one wouldn't try to change σ(N) into something like Σ(N) (in the unlikely event it occurred at the start of a sentence).

I propose rewording instead of mangling the symbol. For the first sentence of this article we could use something like "The program djbdns is [blah blah blah]," although my personal preference is to keep djbdns at the front of the introductory sentence.

This seems like the kind of thing that must have been discussed at length already -- if so, please let me know, as all I can find so far is a very brief discussion here. --Saucepan 03:11, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

 * This article is written in English. In English, sentences begin with capital letters. If a sentence does not begin with a capital letter, it is incorrect English. If "djbdns" cannot be written with an initial capital letter, then it should not begin a sentence in English. If "djbdns" is not English, then it should be translated to English, because the English Wikipedia is written in English, not in whatever non-English construct "djbdns" is. It seems to me that the Unix filename for this command is indeed "djbdns", but the name of the program is "Djbdns", capitalized because it is a proper name, as proper names are capitalized in English. When writing about this program in English, we refer to the program by its name, not by its Unix filename. I don't see any reason why we should assume that people are incapable of understanding that a program's name could possibly be different from the command used to execute the program. Certainly Windows users have no trouble with this. Perhaps Unix users aren't quite as clever at catching on to things like that? Nohat 03:35, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Personal attacks and sarcasm aside, it appears you would be satisfied with the compromise of avoiding "djbdns" at the start of a sentence, thus (hopefully) allowing both types of pedants to coexist peacefully. I've gone ahead and made this change even though the resulting wording seems clumsier in places. --Saucepan 18:53, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Notha: Personal attacks, weak attempts at sarcasm and illogical comparisons serve no purpose and only take away any reason you might have had. This article is about a given thing, whose name is djbdns. It is not Djbdns, it is not dJbdns, it is not iPod. Would you also support that a sentence beginning with iPod have it written as IPod? Or Ipod? Or would you propose we "translate" iPod to something else? And exactly how do you translate a product name? This makes no sense. The name of the program is djbdns. It is clearly stated in its official site, and in fact on the title of this very article. Saying "Djbdns is blah" is wrong. Saying "djbdns is blah" is correct. Saying "The program djbdns is blah" is also correct, but it is an unnecessarily redundant sentence. Now, whether you are a Windows user is your own problem and - one would expect - should not impair your ability to understand that capitalization matters in a product's name. eBay is not the same as EBay or Ebay, iPod is not the same as Ipod. -- 87.196.193.32 21:43, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

I made an edit to the article
Since, as the author of MaraDNS, I have a conflict of interest, I have notifying other editors that I have just made a minor neutral edit correcting a factual error. The article stated that there exists three forks of DJBdns; I know of at least five, so I changed the wording to “a number of”. Here is the edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Djbdns&diff=622745383&oldid=614310840

My personal opinion is that N-DJBDNS is the best fork out there; yeah, it’s GPL, but it’s the only fork I know of that is current with all known security issues in DJBdns (which, of course, is very secure, with only five issues coming up in its 15 year of existence). Samboy (talk) 14:23, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

 * And, another edit: diff I replaced “It is worth noting that djbdns do [sic] not support NSEC3, but can with tweaks be made to serve a signed zone signed with just NSEC.” with “While djbdns does not directly support DNSSEC, there are third party patches to add DNSSEC support to djbdns' authoritative-only tinydns component .” Since the parties which didn’t like my COI edits years ago are either permabanned, no longer active users, read and did not respond to my COI notice, or didn’t respond at all to my talk page comments, I presume these edits are OK. Samboy (talk) 13:57, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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User talk:Colin Douglas Howell

Whirlwind
Hi Colin. I'm not quite sure what kind of response you were looking for, so I'll just pick out a couple of points for discussion. Please be aware that I'm not speaking for anyone but myself here, though. By way of preface, I'll note that it seems to me that we agree in at least general terms on what the intended audience for these articles are, which I think you characterise perfectly as the educated layperson interested in aero engines.

Also note that the comments I made to Trekphiler were in the context of a suggestion of adding more engine detail to articles on the aircraft; I noted that the articles on engines should and generally did include greater detail. So, having said all that...

I guess that my major problem with the article as it stands right now is the volume of pure technical specifications; which you also seem to acknowledge as a little excessive. Wikipedia articles on aero engines (and aircraft) generally provide the details of one, specific, representative subtype. I realise that in this particular case, it's complicated by the diversity of engines that were marketed under the Wasp name. IMHO, the article badly needs to be broken up, as the article family on the Wasp is.

On a more philosophical level, my stance hasn't changed; you may note that the books pictured in the stack are all encyclopedias or encyclopedia-type works; I maintain that this is the level that we should be pitching our articles at. Wikipedia is intended to be an encyclopedia, not a compendium of any and all information available on a subject. An encyclopedia is a first word on a topic, not the last :) So it's quite natural that the reader should sometimes be left "wanting something more" - perhaps this is even an ideal for an encyclopedia article - an appetite-whetter. And, again ideally, the article shouldn't just leave the reader wanting more, but should include pointers to sources of greater depth and more complete information.

Responding now to issues of reporting power, I agree with everything that you say and would only add that the best way of informing the reader of, for example, how the manufacturer coaxed more and more power out of a particular design is to explicitly discuss these developments in the article's prose rather than simply providing tables of figures that demonstrate it.

I think the guideline as it currently stands (and indeed the specifications template itself) are way over the top, and certainly can't fault you for following the model provided. Someday, when I have the time and energy to devote to it, I'd love to lobby for change there. I think it's a splendid example of what can go wrong when guidelines are formed "from the top down". Good policy, on the other hand, crystallises and codifies common practice. I certainly haven't seen much at all amongst our aero engine coverage that is reflected in the example in the guidelines!

Finally, I hope that you don't feel that I singled your contributions out for criticism; I only mentioned the Whirlwind article only because Trekphiler had suggested it as an ideal for the level of technical specifications that a Wikipedia article on an aero engine should contain. I think that you and I both agree that this probably isn't the case!

Thanks for your note - like I say, I'm not quite sure what you were hoping for by way of a reply, but I hope that I've been of some help? Cheers --Rlandmann (talk) 06:04, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

 * Hi Colin, I might be able to help here. I have been going through the engine companies slowly, making navboxes for them and generally trying to improve the individual engine articles. I have not got to the American engines yet but I have looked at the 'Wasp' family briefly. Give me a shout if you want to discuss anything. I need some more engine books for Christmas!! Cheers Nimbus (talk) 21:07, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

R-790
Hi again, and thanks for the invitation to comment. My first impression is that the "pitch" of this article is exactly spot-on.
 * Thanks! That's good to hear.  (Further replies in-line.) --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 07:55, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
 * No problem. Since you've set a pattern here, I'll continue the replies in-line below. --Rlandmann (talk) 08:58, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

... I think that one of the challenges of writing (good) engine articles is developing a historical narrative on a subject that has the potential to be nothing but facts-and-figures. I think you've achieved that! I wonder if this inherent problem is why Gunston adopted the manufacturer-based approach he did in his Encyclopedia (that I noticed you've referenced) rather than separate entries on individual engines. ...
 * Actually, I haven't referenced Gunston's encyclopedia at all, since I don't have a copy. I carried that reference over from the original article, thinking "maybe I should keep this", but all the material in the new article is from stuff I have written or looked up.  So I've just removed that reference; including it seems misleading.  (Or do you think I should keep it under "Further reading"?)
 * Yes, if you haven't used him, best to leave him out. The book is well worth purchasing though; certainly the best "general survey" of aero engines I've come across.

... Another Wikipedia contributor who is very skilled at engine narratives is User:Maury Markowitz - if you've poked around our aero engine coverage at all, I'm sure you've encountered his work. He's also got a list of his engine contributions here. If you're seeking further feedback, I'd certainly recommend dropping him a note.
 * I'll definitely take a lot and may drop him a line.

Honestly, the only "criticisms" I can offer are nothing more than stylistic nit-picking; I have nothing substantial to offer on the actual content itself. So, for whatever they're worth, I'll present these nits as dot-points:
 * The article needs an infobox; see Rolls-Royce Merlin for an example of how to implement this. (it's a recently-adopted convention, so still being rolled out)
 * Done. Though the thing (especially the image) is rather large and thus throws off the placement of the other photos.  Wasn't sure what to include under Major Applications, so I picked the three best-known aircraft types.  They aren't the most representative types, though; maybe a couple of the most numerous ones should be included.
 * Placement of other images is always going to be problematic; remember that other for people who aren't using the same screen resolution as you are going to see something different anyway. Alternatives include moving the photos to a different section of the article, or placing them in a gallery section at the end (this second option would also allow you to include more images, like the nose of the Spirit of St Louis close-up that we have on Commons in the R-760 category.

 * Lawrance Aero Engine Company, Wright-Bellanca WB-2, Stinson Detroiter, Waco 10, and Ryan B-1 Brougham should all be wikied. Don't be afraid of redlinks - they're how we grow. A few years back, most of the links around here were red. As this has changed, people seem increasingly hesitant to leave redlinks in articles. Practices like linking to a bluelink manufacturer instead of a redlink aircraft, or piping to a related (but distinct) type (as you did with the Brougham) are particularly problematic, since when the article on the Waco 10 does get created, the links that should be already in place won't exist, and will be difficult to find without a concerted hunt for them.
 * Fixed. (Actually, in the original article this was split from, I had already done this for the last three items you mention, but someone changed them:, .)
 * My apologies! I should have checked the edit history before casting aspersions.

 * Specific locations like Eisleben, Brisbane, and Oakland should also be wikied.
 * Fixed. I've now tried to be fairly consistent on that.

 * There are a number of statements in the article that attribute a motivation rather that just describing an action: the Navy feeling that air-cooled engines were more suitable than water-cooled engines, feeling that Lawrance could not supply their needs, Wright and Curtiss not being interested in producing air-cooled engines; this type of statement ideally ought to be cited to some source.
 * Actually, all the statements in that paragraph are from the same source, the one in the reference at the end of the paragraph. However, that may not be clear as written.  Should I add ref tags for all of them?
 * Yes - this makes it very clear what the source for these comments was.

 * In the "Variants" section, the designations should be bolded. ...
 * Fixed.

 * ... We often try to include production figures in here, when available. Actually, maybe the duration and volume of production are two basic "factoids" that aren't neatly encapsulated anywhere (but there's scope for them in the infobox, if nowhere else).
 * Alas, I don't have production figures for the individual versions; in fact, I can't even find a clear combined figure for all the Whirlwinds up to the J-5. The only figures I've found (from this sheet) lump all J series engines together, which means mixing figures for J-5 and J-6 Whirlwinds. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 07:55, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

 * The references in "Further reading" should be presented in a standard bibliographic style; probably only a link to the first page of the article in Flight is necessary.
 * Still need to do this. I'm a bit unclear on what you have in mind; do you mean include only the first page link for Flight as part of its Citation template, and make the McCutcheon article also a Citation template?
 * Exactly; and the annotations can still stay as they are.

 * Since all the external links are to the one website, and are to general gallery pages rather than pages specific to this engine, these should probably be replaced by a general link to enginehistory.org or its gallery page, with a note to the reader about the type of material available on the site. Link rot is a real problem for Wikipedia, and although small, privately-owned websites like this are the main culprits, they're not the only ones - when the NMUSAF opened their new website a couple of years back, it broke every one of many links that we had to their old site at WPAFB - I think we're still cleaning that up. Alternatively, since the article already has an "engines on display" section, maybe some of these links could be provided as footnotes?
 * What do you mean by "footnotes": standard "ref" tags or something else?
 * Yes - "ref" tags
 * Part of the problem is that the AEHS galleries are sorted by location or photographer, not by engine, so finding stuff is harder than it should be. Originally I was putting in links to individual images, but that was creating too many links... --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 07:55, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
 * OK - then building them into the ref tags is probably the best approach.

Hope this helps, and like I said, nothing in the lengthy section above is anything more than a nit - I like the article very much :) --Rlandmann (talk) 23:03, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Again, very glad to hear it, and also appreciate your feedback. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 07:55, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Very glad to help --Rlandmann (talk) 08:58, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Oh! One more nit - Wikipedia follows the convention of using "L" as the symbol for litres, rather than "l". --Rlandmann (talk) 09:06, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

 * No problems :). I have, however, just moved the article to Wright R-790, which is more in keeping with the naming conventions. This also displaced a redirect from that name that was still pointing to the general Whirlwind article. Once again, great work! :) --Rlandmann (talk) 21:42, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

R-540
Hi Colin - and sorry for my extreme tardiness in writing this note - my attention has been elsewhere. I'm ashamed to observe that if I'd seen problems with the article, I would probably have responded sooner, but when all I have to offer are my congratulations on what I think is a job very well done, it's taken me over a week to do so. Please accept my apologies on this account - I think that it's a great article, and should have said so sooner. --Rlandmann (talk) 00:01, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Pointe-aux-Trembles
Thanks for fixing something that had me (not local to the area) confused. It was clear from looking at a map that the modern Pointe-Aux-Trembles was way too far off for the Arnold/Montgomery story to make sense.  Magic ♪piano 21:59, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Spacecraft / Capsule
Thank you for your reasoned point on my talk page. I have made my response there. Thank you. SpaceHistory101 (talk) 16:08, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Incidentally, as you appear to be interested in this subject area, I noted on the Aurora 7 talk page that the insignia currently shown is the wrong color. Is that something you might be interested in fixing? Thank you. SpaceHistory101 (talk) 22:49, 12 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. I don't think that's something I can help with, at least not at the moment, since I don't really know anything about the Aurora 7 mission. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 07:11, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Thanks Colin - hopefully someone out there does! SpaceHistory101 (talk) 17:46, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Boeing 247 edits
Copy/edit form my talk page: "I have a few questions: I hope you don't mind my asking these. If you prefer, we can move this to the article talk page. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 03:18, 27 July 2009 (UTC)"
 * This edit reverted my edit about the 247's forward-sloped windscreen not being unique to Boeing. May I ask why?
 * That edit also restored the quote "Ordered off the drawing board", moving it to the intro. I had removed this phrase because, as written, it's not clear what it's trying to say, and I still feel this way, so I'm wondering why you restored it.
 * You seem to prefer hand-coded citations to the use of citation templates. Since you mention the MLA Style Guide, I assume this is for style reasons, and I do prefer your style for book references, but I thought that Wikipedia prefers that the templates be used.

Hi Colin, thanks for your note, one by one:
 * 1) that edit about the sloping windscreen may have simply been caught up in the maelstrom of revisions and I can re-add it or a suitable facsimile; I think it had more to do with your note rather than the edit as I saw no citation source.
 * 2) When statements are in quotes, it's because they are verbatim quotations and this one even had a reference source with it so they normally should not be removed unless there is a major reason to delete the statement or it is unsupportable. I did check with the original source and saw it was "word-for-word" so I reinserted it with a cite link right next to it. Further to the statement's significance. As you know, it was not standard practice at the time to have aircraft ordered prior to a prototype or development aircraft was proven. Although Boeing's 247 was not the first aircraft to be ordered on the strength of its design or concept, it was noteworthy to identify that the unusual "state-of-the-art" features in its conceptualization, led to immediate orders. Luckily, it was one of the cases that "if it looked right..."
 * 3) Wikipedia has not recommended, mandated or required templates for reference or bibliographical records and since the template you introduced had at least two "bugs" in it, I simply reverted it to "scratch cataloging" and kept the details intact.

BTW, I like all the edits you made, even catching the glaring error about the use of flaps which probably existed in the original article. As you know the rather docile landing speed of 62 mph for the Boeing 247 precluded the need for flaps. FWiW, I will continue to assist you in working on this article which is one of my very old, "oldies but goodies" articles. Bzuk (talk) 03:34, 27 July 2009 (UTC).

Thanks for the quick reply, and I really appreciate the feedback and compliments. Sorry it took me a little while to get back to you. I see you've updated things a bit further since this reply. Again, thanks for the feedback. I'm especially glad you noticed the one regarding flaps, and your added explanation in the article for why they weren't necessary is a nice touch. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 20:43, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) I see you've revised the sentence on the forward windshield slope to explain that some other contemporary aircraft also used it. Thanks.  My use of a footnote was kind of clumsy and didn't really fit with the surrounding references; I guess I was being lazy.
 * 2) I understood that the phrase was a direct quote; it was the meaning of the phrase itself which puzzled me. However, I argued with a friend over that meaning for quite a while, and his response convinced me that it was standard usage in certain contexts and that I was being a nitpicky twit. :D By the way, your detailed explanation above really clarifies matters, and you might consider incorporating it into the Design section of the article, since it seems to be a rather important point.
 * 3) Understood. It might be nice to get the template issues fixes, but I'm sure that's a battlefield you'd rather not wade into. :)

Thanks for the laugh
This cracked me up :) Maralia (talk) 18:42, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Wright R-540
Hi Colin, I noted your removal of an aircraft type from the applications list because only one aircraft used it. There is no rule that I know of that says single aircraft are not to be listed, indeed we list every aircraft application, if known, for completeness. There is an engine task force with guidelines at WP:AETF where this can be discussed if necessary. Cheers Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)    19:33, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm afraid it's a rule I set myself when I first started working on the Whirlwind articles, to keep the lists of Applications both manageable and meaningful for the reader. But perhaps I should have proposed it for wider discussion. As I see it, several problems arise if you allow unimportant aircraft produced in small numbers to be included in the Applications list of an engine article. Such aircraft are usually inserted there by editors who happen to be working on that aircraft, so you end up with a list biased towards those aircraft which editors happened to be interested in, rather than a representative list of common uses for the engine. To eliminate this bias, you could require every such aircraft application to be listed, so that the reader will get an unbiased picture of the full variety of uses. But if the engine was widely used, as the Whirlwinds were, such a list may be difficult to compile and may turn out to be so long that it bewilders the reader. Also the large number of trivial uses in unimportant aircraft may make it hard for the reader to see the significant uses in important aircraft. I don't consider myself a deletionist, but I guess this is really a notability argument. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 20:01, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

 * Well I suppose that your rule is at odds with what the other engine article editors are doing. Many of these application lists are uncited, put together by searching through WP for aircraft that use the engine which can lead to problems as often the aircraft article is wrong. To get round this I add an inline cite to the application sections to show that the list came from a reliable source like this one. You can see there that there are a lot of aircraft types (some very obscure) but handled with three columns keeps the list tidy. Sometimes the redlinks that appear in these lists prompt editors to create articles, one editor is certainly doing that at the moment. It all helps to build the Wiki. Cheers Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)    20:12, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

 * In my case, I used Aerofiles to get usage counts and then, for my own sanity, set a floor of 20 examples. (Of course the Spirit of St. Louis was a special case!)  But I neglected to cite. :( --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 20:28, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

 * I am afraid that I don't understand your logic at all, if a list of aircraft using a particular engine gets to an unmanageable size then it can be split into a 'list of applications' article per WP:SPLIT? We don't have one yet to my knowledge, the Bristol Jupiter is probably the biggest application list and nobody is complaining about its size. If an aircraft type is 'unimportant' then it should not have a wikipedia article and should be taken to AfD with notability concerns?

 * I'm beginning to question my thinking myself. At the time I started thinking about this and came up with that rule, all the Whirlwind engines were in a single article, which was clearly a mistake in retrospect. So the potential list of applications was huge. I was also worried that other editors might think that the applications list was excessively long, so I tried to keep it pruned myself. In so doing, I wanted to make sure that the list was "fair": that it did not exclude aircraft with a relatively large number of uses while simultaneously including ones with a very small number. I still think that's a good thing to keep in mind, but if you guys prefer "inclusive" lists, of course it would be better to add missing types rather than delete existing ones.

 * I'm still doubtful about "one-offs", though. Is it really necessary to add a aircraft type to a engine's applications list just because someone happened to convert a single, otherwise unremarkable example of that type to use the engine? That seemed to be the situation with the Waco entry which started this discussion.

 * Also quite worried that you recently removed a populated Commons category from another Wright engine article, more photos will undoubtedly fill that category in time, there are many, many Commons categories with only one image at the moment, why delete it? You are, by admission, setting your own rules which surely will cause problems when other editors add to an article? I am not following you BTW, I just have most of the aero engines on my watchlist and the Wrights are 'lighting up'. Cheers Nimbus  (Cumulus nimbus floats by)    02:56, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

 * Sorry about that, I was pretty much thinking, "gah, that empty External links section looks ugly. Hmm, it does have a Commons box there--oh, but that only has the infobox image, so it doesn't add anything new. Guess it can go--it can be added back later if more images show up." I haven't changed it back yet--would it be OK to add the box back in the same location while still not having an empty External links section?

 * By the way, while I have set my own rules at times, that's usually because I'm not aware of an existing rule, or because I'm hopeful that there might be wiggle-room to expand existing convention (e.g. including some specifications for additional variants). I really don't want to cause trouble for you guys. :) And don't worry, I don't mind that you're keeping an eye on those articles. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 03:50, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

 * There are no 'rules' because of WP:IAR but there are 'guidelines'! I wrote some guidelines when we started the engine task force a year ago and tried to avoid 'over-policing' it all. Some guidelines have appeared this year as the result of discussions (one I can think of is grammatical tense). Yes, the Commons tag can go at the top of the last section of an article so it does not have to be in External Links, it took me a while to find that general wiki guideline and only discovered it recently. An alternative to deleting an empty section header is to 'no-wiki' it so it is there for when links are added. I'm about to re-organise the engine task force pages so that they are the same as the other aviation task forces and will expand on the few guidelines that we have and link to general MOS ones that over-rule local 'quirks'. The 'unwritten rules' have evolved purely by comparing similar articles and formatting them if major differences of style appear. I am pleased that you are helping to improve the American piston engines, they don't get much attention, many other countries are neglected but we are getting round to them slowly, the problem is often lack of reference sources. If you are going to continue improving aero engine articles then you could join the task force, there is a userbox, we certainly need more people. Cheers Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)    11:38, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Thanks! :)
...for your kind words of welcome, and concern :) --Rlandmann (talk)

Flightglobal.com
Hi Colin, I see that you've been busy lately, adding a bunch of refs from the Flight archive.

As it's useful and full of content, you probably won't be surprised to hear that one of the admins is now trying to delete the wiki article on it. You might like to air an opinion. Andy Dingley (talk) 03:01, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

 * Yeah, I just figured that the technical descriptions in Flight might provide useful reference material for Wikipedia aircraft and aero-engine articles, so I decided to go through and add some potential reference candidates.

 * Some admins get a bit overzealous, so it's natural that false alarms happen from time to time. The situation appears to have settled down now, though, so I think piling on at this point wouldn't accomplish much. But thanks for the heads-up. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 03:30, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Happy 10th Anniversary of Wikipedia!
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WQA and the removal of citation templates
Hello, Colin Douglas Howell. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Wikiquette alerts regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.

The issue is at WP:WQA. Thanks, Andy Dingley (talk) 14:03, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

DC-3
G'day from Oz, and sorry for the delay in replying - I spent Easter a long way from 'civilisation', with no internet or mobile phone acess. Anyhoo, my comment was directed at the claim that it is the only DC-3 in regular commercial service. YSSYguy (talk) 04:42, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

68000
Looking for information on the venerable old 68000, I came across your edit

Do you have a source of/on this info? I believe the 68000 was formally introduced in September 1979. I can't find any solid info on engineering samples, quantity production, or speed grades then available. A May 1982 article states 8mhz tops, with 12.5 due.

Herein Adam Osborne states that no working 68000s were delivered in 1979  I don't know if he means internal samples, engineering samples or regular production. I would guess engineering samples.

regards

Another wiki user — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.86.252.239 (talk) 13:10, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

 * Yikes, that edit was a long time ago, before I knew what I was doing.

 * Sorry, no, I don't think I have a source suitable by Wikipedia standards, at least not one that I can remember. Looking back, I now think that bit about the release dates of various speed grades would be considered WP:Original Research. If I remember right, I was deducing speed grade introduction dates from the earliest production date codes that I could find for those speed grades on chip collector websites (examples:, , ). While that may produce valid estimates for the first production of those grades, it certainly doesn't fit Wikipedia verifiability standards. It would be better to use sources like engineering journals or datasheets from the period.

 * I suspect citations could be found to support those claims, but I don't have time to hunt them down now. Feel free to chop the claims out.

 * --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 18:03, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

Mercury-Redstone 1
Thanks for those clarifications! DMacks (talk) 17:26, 11 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Heh, I was just in the process of adding a note to your talk page to let you know, but you beat me to it. :) No problem, feel free to edit things as you see fit. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 17:30, 11 August 2012 (UTC)

Season's tidings!
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Travel Air 6000
Hello Mr Howell. Thank you for kind remarks re images etc posted on Wikipedia - I will try to continue - perhaps at a somewhat slower pace than hereto! I've absolutely no problem with your correction re the Travel Air - "the truth will out", as the saying goes - one of the strengths of Wikipedia! Yes - one Mr Ogden was a source - put no-one is perfect! Regards RuthAS (talk) 11:03, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

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RM notice
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Infobox photos of ironclads HMS Lord Warden (1865) and HMS Caledonia (1862) should be swapped.
Thanks for the heads-up on that, I'll clean up my mess.. I will also rename the photos. (wanders off lashing self with wet tea-towel). regards, Rod. Rcbutcher (talk) 22:24, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

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BMW V and VI
Afternoon Colin,

Gunston states clearly that the BMW V was a V12, so it is his mistake. Oddly, Fred Gütschow's book of German flying boats says the Robbe II had BMW VI engines, which were V12s. He gets the power right for the V12, so I think he may perhaps have confused the Robbe II with the Romar. At least some contemporary sources, eg, pair the Robbe II and BMW Vs. Cheers,TSRL (talk) 16:07, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the reply. But that led me to investigate the Robbe II, and as a result I now think the evidence shows Gütschow is right that it used BMW VIs, not Vs. It's inappropriate to give my detailed argument here; see the talk page of the Robbe article for more. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 11:45, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

bemused
In a change note for Timeline of Star Trek you said
 * Fix common misuse of "bemused"; it means "confused" or "bewildered" and is not a synonym for wry amusement.

Merriam-Webster disagrees; their definition #3 is "having or showing feelings of wry amusement especially from something that is surprising or perplexing". Dictionary.com is similar. (Several other sources do not include that variation.)

But in the context of that article I do prefer your wording.

Jordan Brown (talk) 15:59, 27 March 2020 (UTC)

 * Thanks. :) The trouble with "common misuses" is that if they are common enough, they become accepted, and dictionaries are supposed to be descriptive, stating how the language is used, rather than prescriptive, stating how it *should* be used. So it becomes a matter of opinion and a source of argument. I suppose "questionable use" would have been a better choice for the edit description. In fact, I made the change because a friend complained, quote, "someone doesn't know the difference between 'bemused' and 'amused'. colin should fix that." :D *shrug* --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 17:12, 27 March 2020 (UTC)

Uncivil editor Mark Lincoln
As an involved editor, but I would greatly appreciate your participation in the ANI discussion at Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents. — Cheers, Steelpillow (Talk) 12:36, 18 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Sorry to trouble you again, but the ANI discussion of Mark Lincoln has become increasingly bizarre and I don't think I can progress it on my own. Maybe I should retire from it? Any further participation from you would be most welcome. — Cheers, Steelpillow (Talk) 00:08, 23 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I've been kind of reluctant to get further involved with that. I do suspect you should set it aside, as it looks like you're getting rather fixated on it, which has the effect of making you look like the guilty party in the eyes of the admins there. I sure as hell don't approve of Lincoln's recent attitude, but I'm not sure what administrative sanction would be appropriate at present, if any. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 00:43, 23 October 2020 (UTC)

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Cessna 150 and Ozark Air Lines Flight 965
Since you've been making so many edits to the Cessna 150 article recently, I thought you'd be interested to see my draft article on Ozark 965. Feel free to edit. Carguychris (talk) 23:16, 26 August 2022 (UTC)

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Thank you!
I truly appreciate your help on that fire article. I had no idea what those boxcar things were but I was hoping someone like you would know and assist! jengod (talk) 02:21, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

 * Yeah, it's kind of obscure historical rail geek knowledge! I get the feel the original newspaperman didn't know what they were either, and he just dutifully wrote down what he heard from the fire chief! -- Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 02:43, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

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title: User talk:Colin Douglas Howell


text:
Ruth Bernhard

Ruth Bernhard (October 14, 1905 – December 18, 2006) was a German-born American photographer.

Early life and education
Bernhard was born in Berlin to Lucian Bernhard and Gertrude Hoffmann. Lucian Bernhard was known for his poster and typeface design, many of which bear his name and are still in use. Bernhard's parents divorced when she was 2 years old and she only met her mother twice after the divorce. She was raised by two schoolteacher sisters and their mother. Bernhard's father Lucian was a major proponent of Ruth's work, and advised her frequently.

Bernhard studied art history and typography at the Berlin Academy of Art from 1925 to 1927 before moving to New York City to join her father. She began teaching at the University of California in 1958, while also giving lectures, classes and workshops all over the United States.

Photography career
In 1927 Bernhard moved to New York City, where her father was already living. She worked as an assistant to Ralph Steiner in Delineator magazine, but he terminated her employment for indifferent performance. Using the severance pay, Bernhard bought her own camera equipment. By the late-1920s, while living in Manhattan, Bernhard was heavily involved in the lesbian sub-culture of the artistic community, becoming friends with photographer Berenice Abbott and her lover, critic Elizabeth McCausland. Her first realization that she was attracted to other women occurred on New Year's Eve 1928 when she met the painter Patti Light. She wrote about her "bisexual escapades" in her memoir. In 1934 Bernhard began photographing women in the nude. It would be this art form for which she would eventually become best known. In 1935, she chanced to meet Edward Weston on the beach in Santa Monica. She would later say;

"I was unprepared for the experience of seeing his pictures for the first time. It was overwhelming. It was lightning in the darkness ... here before me was indisputable evidence of what I had thought possible—an intensely vital artist whose medium was photography."

Bernhard was so inspired by Weston's work that, after meeting him in 1935, she moved to California (where he lived). In 1939, Bernhard moved back to New York for eight years, during which time she met photographer Alfred Stieglitz.

Bernhard was inspired by the small things in her life. In an interview from 1999 with Photographers Forum, Ruth states," I’m most interested in—the little things that nobody observes, that nobody thinks are of any value". In the same interview she stated that,"Everything is universal" and that she was "very much aware of that". This idea of minimalism drove her passion for photography.

In 1934 Ruth received a commission from the Museum of Modern Art (MoMA) to photograph works for the Machine Art exhibition catalog. Her father Lucian Bernhard set up the meeting with MoMA for her.

Life on the West Coast
By 1944 she had met and became involved with artist and designer Eveline (Evelyn) Phimister. The two moved in together, and remained together for the next ten years in Carmel, California. Here, Bernhard worked with Group f/64. Soon, finding Carmel a difficult place in which to earn a living, they moved to Hollywood where she fashioned a career as a commercial photographer. In 1953, they moved to San Francisco where she became a colleague of photographers such as Ansel Adams, Imogen Cunningham, Minor White, and Wynn Bullock.

Most of Bernhard's work is studio-based, ranging from simple still lifes to complex nudes. In the 1940s she worked with the conchologist Jean Schwengel. She worked almost exclusively in black-and-white, though there are rumours that she had done some color work as well. She also is known for her lesbian themed works, most notably Two Forms (1962). In that work, a black woman and a white woman who were real-life lovers are featured with their nude bodies pressed against one another.

A departure was a collaboration with Melvin Van Peebles (as "Melvin Van"), then a young cable car gripman (driver) in San Francisco. Van Peebles wrote the text and Bernhard took the unposed photographs for The Big Heart, a book about life on the cable cars.

In the early 1980s, Bernhard started to work with Carol Williams, owner of Photography West Gallery in Carmel, California. Bernhard told Williams that she knew there would be a book of her photography after her death, but hoped one could be published during her lifetime. Williams approached New York Graphics Society, and several other photographic book publishers, but was advised that "only Ansel Adams could sell black-and-white photography books." Bernhard and Williams decided to sell five limited edition prints to raise the necessary funds to publish a superior quality book of Ruth Bernhard nudes. The ensuing edition was produced by David Gray Gardner of Gardner Lithograph, (also the printer of Adams's books) and was called The Eternal Body. It won Photography Book of the Year in 1986 from Friends of Photography. This book was often credited by Ruth Bernhard as being an immeasurable help to her future career and public recognition. The Eternal Body was reprinted by Chronicle Books and later as a deluxe limited Centennial Edition in celebration of Ruth Bernhard's 100th birthday in October 2005. Carol Williams credited Ruth Bernhard with encouraging her to venture into book publishing, and later published several other photographic monographs.

In the 1980s Bernhard also started to work with Joe Folberg. Folberg bought Vision Gallery from Douglas Elliott (who founded it in 1979) in San Francisco in 1982. Bernhard and Folberg worked together until Folberg's death. The gallery split with Debra Heimerdinger taking over operations in North America and Folberg's son Neil moving the "Vision Gallery" to Jerusalem.

In 1967, Bernhard began a teaching career. This same year, Bernhard met United States Air Force Colonel Price Rice, an African American man ten years younger than her, and the two became lovers. They would remain together until his death in 1999. In her 90s, Bernhard cooperated with biographer Margaretta K. Mitchell in the book Ruth Bernhard, Between Art and Life, publicly revealing her many affairs with women and men throughout her lifetime.

In 1984 Ruth worked with filmmaker Robert Burrill on her autobiographic film entitled, Illuminations: Ruth Bernhard, Photographer. The film premièred in 1989 at the Kabuki Theater in San Francisco and on local PBS station KQED in 1991.

Bernhard was inducted into the Women's Caucus for Art in 1981. Bernhard was hailed by Ansel Adams as "the greatest photographer of the nude".

Bernhard died in San Francisco at age 101.

Publications by Bernhard

 * Bernhard, Ruth. Collecting Light: The Photographs of Ruth Bernhard. Edited by James Alinder. Carmel, Calif.: Friends of Photography, 1979
 * Bernhard, Ruth. Gift of the Commonplace. Carmel Valley, Calif.: Woodrose Publications / Center for Photographic Art, 1996. ISBN 0-9630393-5-0
 * Bernhard, Ruth. The Eternal Body: A Collection of Fifty Nudes. Carmel, Calif.: Photography West Graphics, 1986. San Francisco: Chronicle, 1994. Essay by Margaretta K. Mitchell. ISBN 0-8118-0801-7 ISBN 0-8118-0826-2
 * Van, Melvin, and Ruth Bernhard. The Big Heart. San Francisco: Fearon, 1957.
 * Mitchell, Margaretta K., and Ruth Bernhard. Ruth Bernhard: Between Art and Life. San Francisco: Chronicle, 2000. Print.

Awards

 * 1976 Dorothea Lange Award by the Oakland Museum
 * 1987 Distinguished Career in Photography Award. Society of Photographic education. Midwest Regional Conference, Chicago, Illinois November 8, 1987
 * 1990 Presidential Citation for Outstanding Service to Utah State University. Logan, Utah, October 25, 1990
 * 1994 Cyril Magnin Award for Distinguished Service in Photography. Presented by the San Francisco Chamber of Commerce
 * 1996 Lifetime Achievement Award. Women's Caucus for Art. California Regional Chapter, Presented at Mills College, Oakland, March 30, 1996
 * 1997 Honorary Doctor of Humane Letters. The Academy of Art, San Francisco, June 1, 1997
 * 2003 Lucie Awards for achievement in fine art

Solo exhibitions

 * 1936: Jake Zeitlin Gallery, Los Angeles
 * 1936: Pacific Institute of Music and Art, Los Angeles, Eye Behind the Camera
 * 1938: P.M. Gallery, New York
 * 1956: Institute for Cultural Relations, Mexico City
 * 1986: San Francisco Museum of Modern Art The Eternal Body
 * 2014: Peter Fetterman Gallery The Eternal Nude

Collections
Bernhard's work is held in the following permanent collections:
 * Indianapolis Museum of Art, Indiana
 * J. Paul Getty Museum, Los Angeles, California
 * Museum of Contemporary Photography at Columbia College Chicago, Illinois
 * Museum of Photographic Arts (MOPA), San Diego, California
 * Portland Museum of Art, Oregon
 * San Jose Museum of Art, California
 * Minneapolis Institute of Art
 * International Photography Hall of Fame, St.Louis, Missouri

General references

 * Ruth Bernhard Minnesota Public Radio (audio)
 * Samples of Bernhard's works
 * Various photographs at artnet
 * Lavender, Lisa Ann. "Ruth Bernhard." In The Oxford Companion to the Photograph, ed. Robin Lenman. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2005. ISBN 0-19-866271-8
 * Rosenblum, Naomi. A History of Women Photographers. New York: Abbeville, 1994. ISBN 1-55859-761-1
 * Bernhard, Ruth, and Margaretta K. Mitchell. Ruth Bernhard: Between Art and Life. San Francisco: Chronicle, 2000. ISBN 0-8118-2191-9
 * Corinne, Tee A. "Ruth Bernhard." In An Encyclopedia of Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, Transgender, and Queer Culture. 2002.
 * "Ruth Bernhard" at Women in Photography: an unsigned article, with photographs by Bernhard
 * Ruth Bernhard, Joe Folberg of meeting Bernhard
 * Primary documents regarding her life and career are housed at Princeton University's Special Collections. An inventory of their holding can be found in this finding aid.

title: Ruth Bernhard


text:
Stanislaus Joyce

John Stanislaus Joyce (December 17, 1884 – June 16, 1955) was an Irish teacher, scholar, diarist and writer who lived for many years in Trieste. He was the younger brother of James Joyce. He was generally known as Stanislaus Joyce to distinguish him from his father, who shared the same name.

Early life
Born in County Dublin, Stanislaus was considered a "whetstone" by his more famous brother, who shared his ideas and his books with him. He was three years younger than James, and a constant boyhood companion. Stanislaus rebelled against his native Ireland as his brother had done, and, in 1905, he joined James's household in Trieste on Via Caterina, 1.

Career
Joyce worked as an English-language teacher in the Berlitz School alongside his brother. In 1903, he had already begun to keep a diary that recorded his own thoughts on philosophical and literary matter as well as those of his brother; he later resumed this diary in Trieste. This Book of Days, as he called it, sheds light on James Joyce's life between the years 1906 and 1909. The diary indicates that Stanislaus, truly "his brother's keeper", was called upon to rescue his brother from financial difficulties time and time again. After 1908, he maintained his own address, although he may have lived with his brother again for a time in 1909. Arrested as a subversive on December 28, 1914, at the beginning of World War I, he was interned by the Austrians at Katzenau, near Linz. After his release, he moved in with his sister Eileen's family. Stanislaus took his brother's teaching position at Trieste's Scuola Superiore di Commercio "Revoltella" in 1920; this school later became assimilated into the University of Trieste and he continued on as a non-tenured professor of English until his death. Due to his anti-Fascist views, Stanislaus moved to Florence sometime in 1941, where he may have been protected from the Germans by various wealthy Italian and American families.

Books
Joyce later published Recollections of James Joyce (1950); published after his death on June 16 ("Bloomsday") were My Brother's Keeper (1957), Dublin Diary (1962), and Complete Dublin Diary (1971). In the 1950s, Stanislaus had also assisted Richard Ellmann, his brother's biographer, with Ellmann's monumental James Joyce (1959). He also wrote an introduction for the translated version of Italo Svevo's As A Man Grows Older.

Stanislaus often fought with his brother, as well as with his brother's wife Nora Barnacle, but they shared a common literary philosophy despite the fact that Stanislaus had received less advanced schooling than his brother. Stanislaus, however, channelled these instincts into sober academic study rather than wild flights of literary fancy. Of his brother, Stanislaus wrote, "It seems to me little short of a miracle that anyone should have striven to cultivate poetry or cared to get in touch with the current of European thought while living in a household such as ours, typical as it was of the squalor of a drunken generation. Some inner purpose transfigured him."

Personal life
On 13 August 1928 Stanislaus married Nelly Lichtensteiger. They had one son, James, who was born in February 1943.

Death
Stanislaus died in the Free Territory of Trieste, and is buried in Trieste at the Via della Pace cemetery.

title: Stanislaus Joyce


text:
User talk:0101CHANlc

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You might want to use more descriptive image names, such as Image:Chinesebook1.jpg. Image names like Image:Image4.jpg are liable to be deleted, and are not descriptive. Thanks, ugen64 01:20, Oct 20, 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:0101CHANlc


text: User talk:Armeck

title: User talk:Armeck


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User talk:Jacius

Wikinews demo up and running
Hi!

I'm writing to let you know that the Wikimedia Board of Trustees has approved the first stage of the Wikinews project. There's now a fully operational English demo site at demo.wikinews.org. This will be used for experimenting with various review models and basic policies before the site is launched officially in about a week. demo.wikinews.org will become the English version later. You voted for the Wikinews project, so I'm asking for your participation now. Everything is open, nothing is final. What Wikinews will and can be depends in large part on you. There already is a global Wikinews mailing list for discussing the project. If you are interested at all, please subscribe -- coordination is of key importance. There's also an IRC channel #wikinews on irc.freenode.net. Realtime discussion can help to polish up articles. If you're looking for something to do, check out the articles in development and articles in review. Or start a new story in the Wikinews workspace, or ignore the proposed review system - it's up to you. I hope you'll join us soon in this exciting experiment.--Eloquence* 01:59, Nov 17, 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:Jacius


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Mary Kingsley

Mary Henrietta Kingsley (13 October 1862 – 3 June 1900) was an English ethnographer, writer and explorer who made numerous travels through West Africa and wrote several books on her experiences there. Historians have credited Kingsley's work with helping to shape Western perceptions of the culture of Africa and colonialism.

Early life
Kingsley was born in London on 13 October 1862, the daughter and oldest child of physician, traveller and writer George Kingsley and Mary Bailey. She came from a family of writers, as she was also the niece of novelists Charles Kingsley and Henry Kingsley. The family moved to Highgate less than a year after her birth, the same home where her brother Charles George R. ("Charley") Kingsley was born in 1866, and by 1881 were living in Southwood House, Bexley in Kent.

Her father was a physician and worked for George Herbert, 13th Earl of Pembroke and other aristocrats and was frequently away from home on his excursions. During these voyages he collected information for his studies. Dr. Kingsley accompanied Lord Dunraven on a trip to North America from 1870 to 1875. During the trip, Dr. Kingsley was invited to accompany United States Army officer George Armstrong Custer's expedition against the Sioux. The subsequent Battle of the Little Bighorn terrified the Kingsley family, but they were relieved to learn that bad weather had kept Dr. Kingsley from joining Custer. It is possible that her father's views on the brutal treatment of Native Americans in the United States helped shape Mary's later opinions on European colonialism in West Africa.

Mary Kingsley had little formal schooling compared to her brother, other than German lessons at a young age; because, at that time and at her level of society, education was not thought to be necessary for a girl. She did, however, have access to her father's large library and loved to hear his stories of foreign countries. She did not enjoy novels that were deemed more appropriate for young ladies of the time, such as those by Jane Austen or Charlotte Brontë, but preferred books on the sciences and memoirs of explorers. In 1886, her brother Charley entered Christ's College, Cambridge, to read law; this allowed Mary to make several academic connections and a few friends.

There is little indication that Kingsley was raised Christian; instead, she was a self-proclaimed believer with, "summed up in her own words [...] 'an utter faith in God'" and even identified strongly with what was described as 'the African religion'. She is known for criticizing Christian missionaries and their work for supplanting pre-existing African cultures without proving any material benefits in return.

The 1891 England census finds Mary's mother and her two children living at 7 Mortimer Road, Cambridge, where Charles is recorded as a BA Student at Law and Mary as a Student of Medicine. In her later years, Kingsley's mother became ill, and she was expected to care for her well-being. Unable to leave her mother's side, she was limited in her travel opportunities. Soon, her father was also bedridden with rheumatic fever following an excursion.

Dr. Kingsley died in February 1892, and Mrs. Kingsley followed a few months later in April of the same year. "Freed" from her family responsibilities and with an inheritance of £8,600 to be split evenly with her brother, Kingsley was now able to travel as she had always dreamed.

Adventures to Africa
After a preliminary visit to the Canary Islands, Kingsley decided to travel to the west coast of Africa. Generally, the only non-African women who embarked on (often dangerous) journeys to Africa were the wives of missionaries, government officials, or explorers. Exploration and adventure had not been seen as fitting roles for English women, though this was changing under the influence of figures such as Isabella Bird and Marianne North. African women were surprised that a woman of Kingsley's age was travelling without a man, as she was frequently asked why her husband was not accompanying her.

Kingsley landed in Sierra Leone on 17 August 1893 and from there travelled further to Luanda in Angola. She lived with local people, who taught her necessary surviving-skills for living in the wilderness, and gave her advice. She often went into dangerous areas alone. Her training as a nurse at the de:Kaiserswerther Diakonie had prepared her for slight injuries and jungle maladies that she would later encounter. Kingsley returned to England in December 1893.

Upon her return, Kingsley secured support and aid from Dr. Albert Günther, a prominent zoologist at the British Museum, as well as a writing agreement with publisher George Macmillan, for she wished to publish her travel accounts.

She returned to Africa yet again on 23 December 1894 with more support and supplies from England, as well as increased self-assurance in her work. She longed to study "cannibal" people and their traditional religious practices, commonly referred to as "fetish" during the Victorian Era. In April, she became acquainted with Scottish missionary Mary Slessor, another European woman living among native African populations with little company and no husband. It was during her meeting with Slessor that Kingsley first became aware of the custom of twin killing, a custom which Slessor was determined to stop. The native people believed that one of the twins was the offspring of the devil who had secretly mated with the mother and since the innocent child was impossible to distinguish, both were killed and the mother was often killed as well for attracting the devil to impregnate her. Kingsley arrived at Slessor's residence shortly after she had taken in a recent mother of twins and her surviving child.

Later in Gabon, Kingsley canoed up the Ogooué River, where she collected specimens of fish previously unknown to western science, three of which were later named after her. After meeting the Fang people and travelling through uncharted Fang territory, she daringly climbed the 4040 m Mount Cameroon by a route not previously attempted by any other European. She moored her boat at Donguila.

Return to England
When she returned home in November 1895, Kingsley was greeted by journalists eager to interview her. The reports that were drummed up about her voyage, however, were most upsetting, as the papers portrayed her as a "New Woman", an image which she did not embrace. Kingsley distanced herself from any feminist movement claims, arguing that women's suffrage was "a minor question; while there was a most vital section of men disenfranchised women could wait". Her consistent lack of identification with women's rights movements may be attributed to a number of causes, such as the attempt to ensure that her work would be received more favorably; in fact, some insist this might be a direct reference to her belief in the importance of securing rights for British traders in West Africa.

Over the next three years, she toured England, giving lectures about life in Africa to a wide array of audiences. She was the first woman to address the Liverpool and Manchester chambers of commerce.

Kingsley upset the Church of England when she criticised missionaries for attempting to convert the people of Africa and corrupt their religions. In this regard, she discussed many aspects of African life that were shocking to English people, including polygamy, which, she argued was practiced out of necessity. After living with the African people, Kingsley became directly aware how their societies functioned and how prohibiting customs such as polygamy would be detrimental to their way of life. She knew that the typical African wives had too many tasks to manage alone. Missionaries in Africa often required converted men to abandon all but one of their wives, leaving the other women and children without the support of a husband – thus creating immense social and economic problems. Kingsley's also criticised teetotal missionaries, suggesting that those who drank small quantities of alcohol had better survival rates.

Kingsley's beliefs about cultural and economic imperialism are complex and widely debated by scholars today. Though, on the one hand, she regarded African people and cultures as those who needed protection and preservation, she also believed in the necessity of indirect rule and the adoption of European culture and technology by indigenous populations, insisting that there was some work in West Africa that had to be completed by white men. Yet in Studies in West Africa she writes: "Although a Darwinian to the core, I doubt if evolution in a neat and tidy perpendicular line, with Fetish at the bottom and Christianity at the top, represents the true state of affairs." Other, more acceptable, beliefs were variously perceived and used in Western European society – by traders, colonists, women's rights activists and others – and, articulated as they were in great style, helped shape popular perception of "the African" and "his" land.

Writings
Kingsley wrote two books about her experiences: Travels in West Africa (1897), which was an immediate best-seller, and West African Studies (1899), both of which gained her respect and prestige within the scholarly community. Some newspapers, such as The Times under pro-imperialist editor Flora Shaw, refused to publish reviews of her works. Though some have argued that such refusals were grounded in the anti-imperialist arguments presented in Kingsley's works, this unlikely explains her frequently unfavourable reception in Europe, because she was both a supporter of the activities of European traders in West Africa and of indirect rule.

The notable success of Travels in West Africa was due in no small part to the vigour and droll humour of her writing, that, in the guise of a ripping yarn, never wavers from its true purpose—to complete the work her father had left undone. Between poles of manifest wit and latent analysis Kingsley constructs in images – "… not an artist's picture, but a photograph, an overladen with detail, colourless version" – a discourse of poetic thought; a phenomenon oft-noted in the texts of Walter Benjamin. Of her method she said: "It is merely that I have the power of bringing out in my fellow-creatures, white or black, their virtues, in a way honourable to them and fortunate for me." Of her purpose she said: "[M]y motive for going to West Africa was study; this study was that of native ideas and practices in religion and law. My reason for taking up this study was a desire to complete a great book my father, George Kingsley, had left at his death unfinished." Of her father she said: "The work that he did seemed to promise a career of great brilliancy and distinction – a promise which, unfortunately, was never entirely fulfilled." In truth George Kingsley produced but a few scattered fragments, not a scrap of which found its way into the great book of Mary Kingsley. It is, rather, in the text of his daughter – a forerunner of Lévi-Strauss and his Tristes Tropiques – that the dream wish of the father is finally accomplished; and family honour sustained.

Death
After the outbreak of the Second Boer War, Kingsley travelled to Cape Town on the SS Moor in March 1900, and volunteered as a nurse. She was stationed at Simon's Town hospital, where she treated Boer prisoners of war. After contributing her services to the ill for about two months, she developed symptoms of typhoid and died on 3 June 1900. An eyewitness reported: "She rallied for a short time but realised she was going. She asked to be left to die alone, saying she did not wish anyone to see her in her weakness. Animals she said, went away to die alone." In accordance with her wishes, she was buried at sea. "This was, I believe, the only favour and distinction that she ever asked for herself; and it was accorded with every circumstance and honour ... A party of West Yorkshires, with band before them, drew the coffin from the hospital on a gun carriage to the pier … Torpedo Boat No. 29 put to sea and, rounding Cape Point, committed her to the element in which she had chosen to be laid." "A touch of comedy, which would 'have amused' Kingsley herself, was added when the coffin refused to sink and had to be hauled back on board then thrown over again weighed down this time with an anchor."

Legacy
Kingsley's tales and opinions of life in Africa helped draw attention to British imperial agendas abroad and the native customs of African people that were previously little discussed but misunderstood by people in Europe. The Fair Commerce Party formed soon after her death, pressuring for improved conditions for the natives of British colonies. Various reform associations were formed in her honour and helped facilitate governmental change. The Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine founded an honorary medal in her name. In Sierra Leone, the Mary Kingsley Auditorium at the Institute of African Studies, Fourah Bay College (University of Sierra Leone), was named after her.

Published works

 * with an Introduction by Anthony Brandt
 * with an Introduction by Anthony Brandt
 * with an Introduction by Anthony Brandt

title: Mary Kingsley


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Calder Highway

Calder Highway is a rural highway in Australia, linking Mildura and the Victoria/New South Wales border to Bendigo, in North Central Victoria. South of Bendigo, where the former highway has been upgraded to freeway-standard, Calder Freeway links to Melbourne, subsuming former alignments of Calder Highway; the Victorian Government completed the conversion to freeway standard from Melbourne to Bendigo on 20 April 2009.

Calder Alternate Highway connects to Calder Highway at either end – just north of Ravenswood, and at Marong – and provides a bypass west of Bendigo.

Route
Calder Highway commences at the intersection with Silver City Highway in Curlwaa (officially a branch of Silver City Highway, yet sign-posted as Calder Highway) and crosses the Murray River into Victoria over the Abbotsford Bridge, then continues in a southeasterly direction as a two-lane, single carriageway rural highway through Merbein and intersects with Sturt Highway just outside the major regional town of Mildura, where widens to a four-lane, dual-carriageway road through southern Mildura and Irymple, in the state's north-west. It narrows back to a two-lane single carriageway road and continues in a southerly direction, meeting Mallee Highway at Ouyen, then in a south-easterly direction through Sea Lake, Wycheproof, Charlton and meeting the northern end of Calder Alternative Highway at Marong eventually to the western suburbs of Bendigo, where it widens to a four-lane, dual-carriageway road as it weaves through the rural city, intersecting with Loddon Valley Highway and meeting with Midland Highway, where it narrows back to a single carriageway road and shares a concurrency through south-western Bendigo, widening again to a dual carriageway through Kangaroo Flat to eventually meet the southern end of Calder Alternative Highway at an interchange in Ravenswood.

Calder Highway becomes Calder Freeway at the Ravenswood interchange and continues in southerly direction as a four-lane, dual-carriageway rural freeway which bypasses the towns along the highway's former alignment. Calder Freeway passes Harcourt - where the shared concurrency with Midland Highway ends, as it travels in a south-westerly direction to the major regional centres of Castlemaine, Ballarat, and Geelong - and continues in a south-easterly direction past Elphinstone, Kyneton, Woodend and Gisborne, to reach the western suburban fringe of Melbourne. It continues in an south-easterly, and then easterly, direction past Calder Park Raceway and Keilor, before eventually terminating at an interchange with Tullamarine Freeway at Airport West.

Within the urban section of Calder Freeway (between Kings Road and Tullamarine Freeway), the standard travel time, in each direction, is 10 minutes; 5 minutes between Kings Road and the Western Ring Road and 5 minutes between the Ring Road and Tullamarine Freeway.

Between Red Cliffs and Wycheproof the highway has a speed limit of 110 km/h.

History
The passing of the Country Roads Act of 1912 through the Parliament of Victoria provided for the establishment of the Country Roads Board (later VicRoads) and their ability to declare Main Roads, taking responsibility for the management, construction and care of the state's major roads from local municipalities. (Melbourne-) Bendigo Road was declared a Main Road over a period of months, from 30 December 1913 (Castlemaine via Harcourt to Ravenswood), to 30 November 1914 (from Keilor through Diggers Rest to Gisborne, and from Woodend through Kyneton and Elphinstone to Castlemaine), to 20 September 1915 (from Ravenswood to Bendigo); (Ouyen-) Sea Lake Road from Ouyen to Mittyack, (Ouyen-) Mildura Road from Ouyen to Hattah, and Wycheproof-Sea Lake Road from Wycheproof to Sea Lake were declared Main Roads on 14 December 1914; and (Charlton-)Wycheproof Road between Charlton and Wycheproof was declared a Main Road on 28 May 1915; and Charlton-(Bridgewater-)Bendigo Road was declared a Main Road, between Bridgewater and Wedderburn to Charlton on 28 May 1915, and between Bendigo and Bridgewater on 20 September 1915.

The passing of the Highways and Vehicles Act of 1924 provided for the declaration of State Highways, roads two-thirds financed by the State government through the Country Roads Board. North Western Highway was declared a State Highway on 1 July 1925, cobbled from a collection of roads from Melbourne through Kyneton, Castlemaine, Bendigo, Sea Lake and Ouyen to Mildura (for a total of 324 miles), subsuming the original declarations of Melbourne-Bendigo Road, Charlton-Bridgewater-Bendigo Road, Charlton-Wycheproof Road, Wycheproof-Sea Lake Road, Ouyen-Sea Lake Road and Ouyen-Mildura Road as Main Roads. North-Western Highway was renamed Calder Highway in 1928, after William Calder, chairman of the Country Roads Board from 1913–28. In the 1959/60 financial year, another section from Elphinstone to Harcourt was added as a deviation bypassing Castlemaine, along the former Elphinstone–Harcourt Road (already having been declared a Main Road by the Country Roads Board in 1937/38 financial year ); the previous alignments of Calder Highway from Elphinstone to Castlemaine, and Castlemaine to Harcourt, were subsumed into Pyrenees Highway and Midland Highway respectively. The first section of Calder Freeway in Melbourne was opened in 1972, over time stretching west to ultimately become a project to convert the road to freeway standard all the way to Bendigo; the freeway upgrade has made sections of the original Calder Highway redundant, either incorporated into the new freeway or acting as local access roads. Calder Alternative Highway was declared in 9 May 1983, along the former Ravenswood–Marong Road.

Calder Highway was later signed National Route 79 in 1955; when Midland Highway was allocated State Route 149 in 1986, it shared it as a concurrency along Calder Highway between Harcourt and Bendigo. With Victoria's conversion to the newer alphanumeric system in the late 1990s this was altered to route A79 for the highway portion, and route M79 for the freeway portion into Melbourne (and the concurrency with Midland Highway was replaced with route A300); the New South Wales section was left unallocated when they switched to the alphanumeric system in 2013. Calder Alternative Highway was signed Alternative National Route 79 between Ravenswood and Marong, and was later replaced by route A790.

Originally, Calder Highway ran through northwestern Melbourne as an undivided highway, ultimately through Niddrie as Keilor Road and terminating in Essendon; traffic continued south along Mount Alexander Road to reach central Melbourne. Keilor Road – already heavily congested and supporting a tram line – was eventually bypassed by a freeway-standard road in 1972 to terminate at a junction with Lancefield Road (later upgraded to Tullamarine Freeway), rejoining Calder Highway at the western end of Niddrie; the freeway-standard was extended further west to East Keilor (the future location of the Western Ring Road interchange) in 1975, and to Keilor by the early 1980s. However, it was not until the 1990s that work began to duplicate the rest of the highway to Bendigo.

The Howard government broadened the criteria under which roads qualify for Commonwealth road funding by introducing Roads of National Importance program in the 1996–97 financial year where such declarations were based on the recognition that roads outside the National Highway system also provide social benefits, and were funded jointly with the States and Territories usually on a 50:50 basis. As a major road link between Melbourne, Bendigo, and the state's northwest, supporting the region's primary manufacturing and tourism industries, Calder Highway was declared a Road of National Importance between Melbourne and Bendigo in December 1996.

The passing of the Road Management Act 2004 granted the responsibility of overall management and development of Victoria's major arterial roads to VicRoads: in 2004, VicRoads re-declared the road as Calder Alternative Highway (Arterial #6200) between Ravenswood and Marong, and in 2011 as Calder Highway (Arterial #6530) between the border with New South Wales at Yelta and the interchange with Calder Alternate Highway and Ravenswood Street in Ravenswood, and as Calder Freeway (Freeway #1530) between Ravenswood and Tullamarine Freeway, Airport West.

Timeline of construction

 * 1950–54 – Calder Highway, straightening of the "Hattah deviation", a 21 mi circuitous course through Hattah replaced by 14.6 mi of straight alignment, south of Nowingi, started construction in 1950, was delayed a year in 1952 due to lack of funds, and eventually completed two years later in 1954.
 * 1972 – Calder Freeway, initial 1.2 mi section of freeway with 3 lanes in each direction, from the Tullamarine Freeway/Lancefield Road intersection to Calder Highway at Niddrie, opened by Minister for Local Government, the Hon. A J Hunt MLC, 21 April 1972, at a cost of $3 million.
 * 1975 – Extended 2 km from The Avenue in Niddrie to Erebus Street in Keilor East, opened December 1974 at a cost of $2.5 million.
 * 1982 – Extended 3.8 km from Erebus Street to Arundel Road, Keilor, with two lanes each direction plus emergency stopping lanes, opened by Minister for Transport, the Hon S M Crabb MP, 18 May 1982, at a cost of $15.5 million.
 * 1984 – Keilor bypass, Bendigo-bound carriageway from Arundel Road to west of Oakbank Road, opened by Assistant Minister of Transport, the Hon Jack Simpson MP, 17 April 1984; the opening of this carriageway completed the bypass of Keilor. The cost of the entire bypass from Erebus Street to west of Oakbank Road was $30 million.
 * 1989 – Gisborne bypass opened 17 March 1989. The 6 km bypass cost A$25m.
 * 1990/1991 – Oakbank Road, Keilor North to Duncans Lane, Diggers Rest. 7.7 km of newly duplicated '2 lane carriageway' opened to traffic at a cost of A$14m. No exact date was given, however VicRoads Annual Reports cover the previous financial year.
 * 1991/1992 – 2 km of duplication completed at Ravenswood during 1991/1992 at a cost of A$1.3m.
 * 1993 – Diggers Rest bypass. $A32m 6.5 km bypass opened to traffic in July 1993, followed by the Vinyard Road interchange in November 1993.
 * 1994 – Ravenswood section. Duplication of the highway completed 'in 1994'
 * 1995 – Kyneton bypass opened to traffic in April 1995, at a cost of A$31m.
 * 1996 – Gap Hill section (Diggers Rest to Millett Road). Opened in May 1996, at a cost of A$32m.
 * 1998 – Gisborne South to Gisborne. 6 km completed at a cost of A$31 and opened to traffic on 3 April 1998.
 * 2000 – Gisborne to Woodend (Black Forest section). 6.8 km section opened to traffic on 17 March 2000. Completed at a cost of A$51m.
 * 2001 – Woodend bypass. 13.5 km bypass opened to traffic on 19 December 2001. The total cost of the project was A$85m.
 * 2003 – Carlsruhe section. 6.5 km section opened to traffic on 16 April 2003, at a cost of A$46m. This section completed the dual carriageways from Keilor to Kyneton.
 * 2005 – 2.5 km north of Kyneton completed in January 2005.
 * 2005 – Ravenswood. 6.5 km duplication south of Ravenswood completed in May 2005
 * 2008 – 15 km Malmsbury section opened in April 2008.
 * 2009 – Harcourt North to Elphinstone opened on 20 April 2009. This 19 km section cost A$404m and completed the duplication of the highway between Melbourne and Bendigo. The project was jointly funded by the state and federal governments.
 * 2012 – Kings Road interchange, opened in January 2012, at a cost of $62 million, jointly funded by state and federal governments.
 * 2018 – Ravenswood (Calder Highway, Calder Freeway and Calder Alternative Highway) interchange, reconstruction started May 2016 and completed in March 2018, at a cost of $86 million, jointly funded by state and federal governments.

1969 Melbourne Transportation Plan
The Calder Highway between the Melton Highway and the Western Ring Road is shown in the 1969 Melbourne Transportation Plan as part of the F4 Freeway corridor, which extends past the Tullamarine Freeway and Bell Street to Templestowe.

Western Ring Road to Kings Road
In 2008, VicRoads completed the widening of the Calder Freeway from the Western Ring Road to Melton Highway. The road was widened from 2 lanes each direction to 3 lanes in each direction. The speed limit was reduced permanently from 100 km/h to 80 km/h. The 80 km/h limit applies northbound from Keilor Park Drive to Melton Highway, and southbound it applies from the Green Gully Road bridge to just prior to the Western Ring Road interchange. In October 2010, it was announced that as part of a year long trial, the speed limit on this section of freeway will be increased back to 100 km/h in off-peak times (8pm-5am), with 30 variable speed limits to be installed along the stretch of freeway. A further upgrade completed in 2012 resulted in a new interchange at Kings Road (the freeways's urban / metropolitan limits) and closure of three at grade intersections in the area. Despite these upgrades the 80 km/h speed limit remained in place.

title: Calder Highway