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Talk:Devo

Stylizing of DEVO name
I noticed that this article is titled "Devo" and that spelling/styling is used throughout the article. The band has always styled their name as "DEVO", which is evident by visiting their own site (http://www.clubdevo.com/). A search for "Devo" on that page turns up all entries stylized as DEVO, including the site title and copyright. That said, should the article be titled DEVO instead of Devo, and any use of their name in the article styled the same way? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sizerth (talk • contribs) 03:06, 24 February 2023 (UTC)

FanBoys?
"Devo's music and stage show mingle kitsch science fiction themes, deadpan surrealist humor, and mordantly satirical social commentary via sometimes-discordant pop songs that often feature unusual synthetic instrumentation and time signatures, and their work has proved hugely influential on subsequent popular music, particularly New Wave, industrial and alternative rock artists."

I'm surprised this person had time to let go of Devo's dicks and type this shit. Could this be any more pretentious?

 * Don't know, but it sounds completely in tune with Wiki's overall quest for quality. Jmdeur (talk) 21:38, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

 * I think you'll find plenty sources that herald Devo as pioneers and groundbreakers in the electronic,, and new wave genres, not to mention many bands that call them a primary influence and inspiration. The original verbiage may be somewhat breathless (and uncited), but it's not inherently incorrect. Also, is it really necessary to make your (unsigned) comment crude and uncivil? If you want to tone down the article, tone it down. This is Wikipedia, not the comments section of Fark. (Releaux (talk) 14:24, 23 April 2010 (UTC))

 * I agree with Releaux Joe Vitale 5 (talk) 19:24, 17 April 2016 (UTC)

Devo was one of the alternative artists in my collection when I was a kid. This was before "Whip It" came out and put them on the radar. They didn't have much on their albums that I liked but one song I liked enough to put on my mix tape for the car, is now the theme song for a hit MTV show called Ridiculousness. Back in those days, punk, new wave, glam were something to turn to if you didn't want to hear the Bee Gees, Donna Summer, The Village People, Paul Simon (slipping away), Kenny Rogers and Dolly Parton. Plus my Hotel California and Boston 8-tracks were worn out and I was tired of them. There is a scene in Revenge of the Nerds, where the nerds win a talent contest, in what is an apparent ripping off of Devo. I wouldn't say they are hugely influential, but they do account for a couple threads in the giant tapestry of music history. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2604:6000:1400:1A1:5840:BE02:B56F:447E (talk) 14:00, 3 March 2019 (UTC)

Equipment
I'd like to see a listing of equipment used by Devo and when if anyone is knowledgeable on the topic.

That would be good. Joe Vitale 5 (talk) 19:25, 17 April 2016 (UTC)

Devo 2.0 section edit
The line with '...to mixed reviews' should be supported with facts or removed. --Magus2 19:30, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

Oh, No! It's Demos!
Would whoever is changing the name of the album "Oh, No! It's Demos!" to "Oh, No! It's Devo!" please stop? There is a compilation disc named "Oh, No! It's Demos!" released in '82. This is not a mispelling of "Oh, No! It's Devo!". They are totally different albums. -St. Jimmy

I think it should be removed from the list completely. Fan made compilations should be left out... (see this link for info on the disc: http://www.sanspoint.com/basement/audiopages/D003.html ) --Weirdal 02:57, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

WordIQ Devo article
Is WordIQ affiliated with Wikipedia?

This page is word for word: http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Devo - Tezkah

Ah, they're just using Wikipedia information to install spyware on users computers. Oh well! - Tezkah

Actually, many sites use wikipedia information, and just copy and paste it into their own "encyclopedias". A prime example is dictionary.com's "encyclopedia", which mostly just features wikipedia articles - Bagel7

Article needs ?
This article needs lots. It's woefully inadequate for a band this influential.

It needs a picture of the infamous hats in the style section

Replace the term "time signature" with "meter." There is no such thing as a "time signature" in music. The proper term for beats per measure and note that has a value of one beat is "meter." This is basic Music Theory. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:484:8100:BC60:68DE:B429:C3FC:D410 (talk) 20:33, 21 March 2021 (UTC)

Added a picture of the energy domes to style section. -cmad

--ME--I'm not registered or anything. There are some things I would like to see added. For example, Soundgarden were HUGE and they did a cover of Girl You Want, and I saw Devo commenting on it somewhere. I can't remember who exactly or what he said exactly, but he pretty much said he didn't like it very much because he felt that they had already D-evolved the original song a lot, so the slow soundgarden version just didn't work. I would like to see quotes like that in there. Also, anything they said about Nirvana would be nice, seeing as they were pretty much the biggest band in the world in the last 20 years or more. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.30.210.136 (talk) 16:20, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

This article needs the personnel line-up that released I Can't Get No Satisfaction, and that performed it on TV with a guitarist who wore a baseball cap. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.147.122.14 (talk) 21:37, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

Discography template
I added a discography template to all the albums; the Total Devo page needs severe working on, and there's no Smooth Noodle Maps page at all! Stev0 04:18, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

I've cleaned up Total Devo and Smooth Noodle Maps' pages. All of their core studio albums are now covered. Tenniru 03:02, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

Touring?
"After the release of Smooth Noodle Maps in 1990, the band stopped recording and full scale touring, although it has been revived on several occasions for one-off performances and short tours in 1996, 2000 and 2004."

I've left this in for the moment but it doesn't appear to be true. They are on tour in 2005 as well. We should probably check if they were on tour in some of the other years or make it less specific. Secretlondon 23:13, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)

They are also touring in 2006. I saw them on Sunday evening in Los Angeles, California. -St. Jimmy

MTV
"Devo might have remained a cult attraction but for the advent of American cable TV music station MTV. They scored a major success in 1980 with their third album Freedom of Choice and the single 'Whip It', which became a big hit thanks to regular MTV screenings of its unique music video."

I'm disputing that and removing it. Whip It was released in mid 1980 and became a radio hit single almost immediately. MTV didn't exist until August 1981, and it remained relatively obscure for some time; many people heard of MTV and knew what it was, but few had actual access to it. For the first year or two of its existence, MTV was not carried by all major cable television providers, which is why there was the ubiquitious "I Want My MTV" campaign that ran throughout 1982 and 1983. While to some degree MTV might have kept the song in the public consciousness for a while longer than otherwise would have been the case, it played no part in the song becoming a hit. Aside from that, I recall an interview with Jerry Casale where he mentioned that the video was made after the song was already a hit, and that it was influenced by certain misconceptions radio DJs and the public at large had about the meaning of the song. Druff 21:10, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)

I second Druff's corrections. I interviewed Jerry Casale in 1985, and during the interview he derided MTV for their abandonment of the band from their playlist, and pointed out that the network had claimed - falsely - that they were responsible for giving Devo all of their video exposure and made "Whip It!" a hit. - G0m3r

In the early days of cable before MTV, Home Box Office would play music videos in-between movies to round-out the hour. Eventually HBO seeded the music video role to MTV. MTV is not the sole outlet for videos in the 1980-1981 time-frame. -- Charles Gaudette 08:33, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

I am in the process of collection sources for information on the period of time where video equipment became more readily available, around 1977, until the beginning of MTV in 1981. Many bands were pioneers in music videos, which were played in clubs like Hurrah and Danceteria in NYC. My sources thus far are the Museum of Modern Art and The Rolling Stone book of rock video by Michael Shore. I hope to edit this article and others when my research is complete. I am a newbie to Wikipedia -- just a person who was a fan back in the day and trying to fill in some gaps here from the books I have in my collection about punk, new wave, post-punk, etc. DarkCompanion (talk) 12:26, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Members
Something else this page needs: a list of members. I came to this page looking to find out when Josh Freese joined. I still haven't found it.

I can tell you when he was "officially" ousted. On January 15,2012 - at The Uptown Theater in Napa,California, Jerry Casale announced Jeff Friedl as their latest permanent drummer. Harvey J Satan (talk) 07:45, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Devo vs DEVO
I've noticed there's a lot of discrepency on various Wikipedia articles on the "all-caps" spelling of Devo. I think it should be clarified whether or not they're called "Devo" or "DEVO". I'm not sure if there was ever an official spelling or not, but the articles aren't consistent about this. Just so you guys know.

Per Mark Mothersbaugh in 1993, it can be spelled either way. "Be all caps. Or not" was the exact quote, a reference to a closer line used at the end of many concerts, "Be happy. Or not."

Per the rules of normal typography (which we stick to for wikipedia articles), though, it should thus just be "Devo". Writing it in block caps will make some readers think its an acronym.--feline1 10:05, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

I'll add my comments: Yes, it appears that Devo is a proper noun from "Devolution"; the band's name is not the acronym DEVO. Wikipedians should strictly enforce the proper noun format. But, if any of the artwork titles have DEVO (in capitals) in them as listed by credible sources (for instance, Billboard Magazine) then that should remain as originally titled. --Charles Gaudette 08:22, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

 * All the artwork is in capitals because that's just how it appears, all the wording is all in caps for the most part. And I personally just don't like having it read DEVO because it makes you scream DEVO in your head... Plus I'm pretty sure when reading the backs of tapes, CDs etc. they generally use both, so it doesn't really matter, but i don't think it should be typed DEVO throughout the article cuz thats just annoying.Thakmere (talk) 01:22, 17 July 2009 (UTC)

They have used it both ways.. as well as "Dev-O." In all of their recent press releases, Twitter postings, and Facebook postings, they are using the all caps version "DEVO." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.152.70.214 (talk) 06:25, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Home Video Releases + The Beginning Was The End
I just added links to DEVO's various home video releases, and a stub article on The Beginning Was the End. Let's fill these in, Spuds! DarKrow 02:24, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

Kent State
Just wanted to say that Bob Mothersbaugh said in an interview that he was at Kent State during the riots as well. Quote is from an interview at http://www.sanspoint.com/basement/bob1.html. 130.157.66.153

Industrial
The part of the article about Devo mentioning their music as "industrial" in a late '70s interview is not accurate - It is widely known that Monte Cazazza & Genesis P-Orridge coined this term (in the context of their music/art) in '75 or earlier. In fact the label on which Throbbing Gristle released their music, starting in '76, was called Industrial Records.

In the liner notes of their "Greatest Hits" album, there is a transcript of a late '70s interview in which the band describes their music as "industrial", underscoring the dehumanization (devolution) of their art. (In this context, the term predates the posthumous application of the label to '70s avant-garde noise bands such as Throbbing Gristle.)

Interstate '82
I'm kind of surprised that nobody's mentioned the work that Devo did for the game Interstate '82 - if I remember correctly, they did the tracks Faster And Faster (used during the mine escape), Kaboom! (used during various desert/highway battles), and One Dumb Thing (end credits). --SpecOp Macavity 13:43, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

Live Albums in the 00's and Career Albums in the 80's
The band is not working on Career Albums this year. I kind of think that they can make a album called Freedom Of Choice 2. But Devo's Whip It went on iTunes for Devo's Top 10. It ranked number 1. Why are'nt they??? There are good! Put more songs! It ranked #14 on Billboard! --Sonic79267 21:57, 21 July 2006 (UTC)Sonic79267

DEV-O
On 14:23, 1 August 2006, User:17.232.151.165 made an edit and said "(Dev-O is not a proper spelling of Devo; it is not found on any of their albums, and does not reflect the origin of the name. "de-evolution".)". This is not true: they released the album DEV-O Live, obviously.Derek Balsam 14:52, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

Discography
Why no discography page for Devo?

 * There's one now! DarKrow 23:53, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Manifesto
HOW CAN THERE BE NO DEVO MANIFESTO?!?!

- 	The Devo manifesto means: - 	#Be like your ancestors or be different, it doesn't matter. - 	#Lay a million eggs or give birth to one, so shall your species survive. - 	#Wear gaudy colors or avoid display, it's all the same. - 	#The fittest shall survive yet the unfit shall live. - 	#We must repeat.

Somebody more knowledgable than me, PLEASE ADD THIS. -BudhaCronX 22:07, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

 * That's the Devolutionary Oath, and taken from Jocko Homo Heavenbound DarKrow 04:33, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Actually rather popular in the UK
If anyone cared to look at the discography it may be noted that the band had several small hits in the UK two years before the US breakthrough, and had more hits in the UK than the US. The UK new wave scene quickly embraced the band, who had several successful tours and were distributed by the two biggest/well known independent record labels. They were also featured cover artists on issues by all the leading music papers, who covered their theories as well as their releases and gigs. Not that you would know any of this from reading this article. LessHeard vanU 22:06, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

The movie Heavy Metal is missing
I notice that the movie Heavy Metal is not mentioned.

Devo not only has two songs in the film, but performed (animated) in the film.

In the last section of the movie Heavy Metal, Taarna is searching for the Loc-Nar and stops in a bar to gather information. Devo, or an later animated version is playing 'Through Being Cool' at the bar.

Just thought other fans should know. (Someone with writting skills should update both sites)

Heavy Metal (film)

--LifeIsStudy 05:16, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Urgh! A Music War Appearance
Devo also appeared in the Stewart Copeland produced documentary film Urgh! A Music War performing "Uncontrollable Urge". Would it be appropriate to create a section for film appearances? (Releaux (talk) 14:33, 23 April 2010 (UTC))

Should there even be a Devo 2.0 section?
Should there really be an entire section for Devo 2.0 within the Devo article. If anything this is a side project that already has it's own page. Why include so much information here? Ridernyc 04:43, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Devo Picture
TopherMadden 22:25, 12 June 2007 (UTC) I e-mailed the webmaster of the official Devo page to tell him about the picture here being removed and he e-mailed me back a picture of the band he said that "we have the right to use." Anyway, I only know little about editing here, so if anyone would like me to forward this e-mail to them with the picture and credentials included, please contact me via wikipedia (I would post my e-mail, but I'm not sure it's allowed)...

 * Thanks for doing that, Topher! I'm not quite sure what the next step is, but I have asked for help from an admin, Shell Kinney, who has assisted me before. Presumably there is an email address to which this message from the webmaster can be forwarded, but I'm not sure what it is. None of the links at Contact us seem to match this situation, so hopefully Shell can help us out. --GentlemanGhost 01:08, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

 * Shell Kinney replied:
 * ''To confirm this release, we need an email from someone at the official website (that can clearly be identified as coming from that website) sent to permissions at wikimedia dot org. It needs include the following:

 * ''Identification of the specific content they are releasing by giving the url of the image in question or the location on their website where the content can be found.

 * ''A clear statement that they are releasing the content under the GFDL or into the public domain, or in the case of images and other media, a similar license (such as certain Creative Commons licenses).

 * ''For more information, please see Copyrights. Let me know if there's anything more I can do to help. Shell babelfish
 * --GentlemanGhost 22:51, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

 * I forwarded the e-mail sent to me by Michael Pilmer, Devo webmaster, to the above address, along with a brief message. Please tell me if there is anything more I can do. Glad to help my fellow Devotees. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TopherMadden (talk • contribs) 18:38, 17 June 2007

Brian Chojnowski?
I removed "Brian Chojnowski" from the Former members section unless someone can provide a citation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.81.99.245 (talk • contribs)

 * A Google search for "Brian Chojnowski" "Devo" only gives results from the Wikipedia articles for Devo and Kent State University. Doesn't sound legitimate at all. I've never heard of this guy. --Lyght 05:02, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:BANDDevoLOGO.svg
Image:BANDDevoLOGO.svg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 19:22, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Contradiction
The article states that Devo's first performance was in 1971 at Kent State, but then it later says that the first incarnation of Devo assembled in 1973. Can someone clarify this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.57.214.150 (talk) 17:22, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Radio interview
http://ckuw.ca/index.php/schedule

I made an edit saying that there was an interview in which Gerald Casale states that Devo was not releasing a new album. But someone said it was a broken link, so I thought I would explain in more detail. The above link takes you to the archives of a particular station. Click on "jump to a show" then scroll to "radio schizophrenio".

Another window should be brought up with a list of past shows (link):

http://ckuw.ca/cgi-bin/ckuw-gridnew.pl?show=4%2C00%3A00&action=showaudio

The Thursday, April 17th, 2008 show is a Devo special in which the host interviews Gerald Casale. Somewhere in the first hour he makes the above statement. Just click "steam" to listen to it. Just to make it clear to people. (Stapler 9 42 (talk) 01:49, 22 May 2008 (UTC))

Someone check the article and remove the the text that follows the reading of the article. It says something about Avril Troll. Someone with more HTML knowledge than I have should take care of it.

Thanks Jay Jayguy95@gmail.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.192.38.172 (talk) 03:33, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Album Title "Fresh!"
Re-reading the wording in the article cited, I'm not sure if we should be jumping to conclusions about the new album title. Casale said, "Regardless of the final title, it will be 'Fresh!'" not "The final title will be 'Fresh!'". You could interpret that he's saying the album title will be new, and he makes reference to the song "Fresh" in the process. Just thought I'd put that out there until we've confirmed it. Stapler 9 42 (talk) 23:57, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

"quirk and jerk"
I am curious about the use of this term to describe Devo's music. I first heard this description around their first Saturday Night Live performance in 1978. I thought it was or would become a common term for describing Devo's style, referring to their discordant, twitchy, robotic sounds and movements. Yet I have never heard its use again. Is it possible that it was coined by an earlier reviewer and never caught on? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.220.3.235 (talk) 20:26, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

I'd like to suggest eliminating the word "poshumously" from the article. It is confusing. No one has died. Perhaps "post break-up."Cospelero (talk) 17:06, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

Is Devo not techno?
Maybe my understanding of techno is not exactly by the books (and "new wave" is more accurate), but Devo was the epitome of techno for us youngsters. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.3.39.232 (talk) 21:13, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Devo is definitely not Techno it may have been borderline proto-techno as described in the article, but most of their work just doesn't hit it like Kraftwerk does (proto.) Centerone (talk) 09:13, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Dare to Be Stupid
Should we mention "Weird Al" Yankovic's parody of Devo, "Dare to Be Stupid"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by MaraquanWocky (talk • contribs) 20:57, 21 August 2010 (UTC)

Any more than the numerous other DEVO parodies? "Al" was not unique in his premise, and not the first ,as proven on the KROQ / DEVOTEES album, featuring many pre-AL, parodies.

"Weird" used to tell a story, about after the release of his album ""Weird Al" Yankovic in 3-D", where he used a snippet of "Jocko Homo" in the albums' polka medley. He was label-mates with Devo, and met Jerry and Mark at a corporate function, where they jokingly razzed him about not being worthy of a "full song parody". So... he writes and records "Dare to Be Stupid", upon the albums' release he meets Jerry & Mark at another party, and they wouldn't even talk to him! (Apparently being referred to as "stupid", didn't go down so well.). (Not to mention "Weird" stole the title from a show he saw by the comedy group "Ducks Breath Mystery Theater". ) Harvey J Satan (talk) 07:58, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Kent or Akron
I changed the city of origin to Kent instead of Akron based on the source from Bob Lewis. I am fully aware that the Devo website says the band formed in Akron, Ohio, but that could also mean the Akron area, which Kent is a part of. Lewis has a rather explicit quote that states that Devo is "not a phenomenon of Akron, Ohio" and the first performance of the Sextet Devo was most definitely in Kent at KSU (link to photos in a "see also" for the Lewis citation). While the founders came from Akron or the Akron area, the details from Lewis indicate that he and Casale were in Kent at the time they came up with the band and were heavily influenced by what happened during the Kent State shootings in 1970. --JonRidinger (talk) 05:39, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

I put the Akron metropolitan area as the origin being that both cities are in it and the statement comes from a non-current member who co-founded the old lesser known group. The Devo website and other websites claiming it to be Akron are more reliable and I think Kent is known enough through the University to fall under Akron which is in a different county. Not all Motown artists did their first performances in Detroit but have it as their origin, so we cant really rely on that.--Duename (talk) 13:48, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
 * The history in this article and the Devo website puts the origins of the group at the "Sextet Devo" group which was formed in Kent. That Bob Lewis isn't a "current" member is irrelevant; he was one of the founders and is listed as such. Being a former member does not invalidate that fact. The first performance being in Kent is part of it; Casale and Lewis were living in Kent at the time they came up with the idea (Lewis graduated from KSU in 1970) and mention frequently the effects the events at KSU had on them in forming the band. I have no idea what you mean by "Kent is known enough through the University to fall under Akron which is in a different county". Kent is part of the Akron metropolitan area, but the infobox doesn't ask for "metro area of origin" it asks for city of origin. Kent is notable enough because of the university to stand on its own, on top of the fact that this is Wikipedia, so we can be more specific.  What other Motown artists/bands have as their city of origin is irrelevant here since we're not talking about a genre that is clearly and easily associated with one city (Detroit). And in many larger cities, people often fail to differentiate between the central city and the suburbs.  --JonRidinger (talk) 15:11, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

 * Also, this link to Chapter 7 of their book "We Are Devo" seems to indicate the origins of the band are at Kent State (the band was formed just before the first performance at KSU and as a result of that festival) as all the talk is about Kent and the university; no mention of Akron is made. I would love to get the entire book to see if there is anything else that explains it more definitively. I do think using "Akron metropolitan area" is a bit vague, especially for a Wikipedia article. --JonRidinger (talk) 15:43, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

 * Excuse me I meant that Kent is prominent enough that it would not likely be replaced/substituted by Akron. The article isn't about "Sextet Devo", who is rarely known. You're basing the place of foundation on the words of a former member, of which usually says undetail things to stir up controversy to sell items such as books. He didn't say the day or city, just the school, while many other websites plainly say Akron including one from Mark Mothersbaugh. It would only be fair if we go by what all or a majority of the members word on where they formed, rather it be Sextet or the current version. While I thought to put Akron, Akron metropolitan area seemed appropriate due to the reasonable doubt. But saying Akron would not be a stretch seeing as Devo became mainstream after their first two music videos which were filmed in Akron with most members being from there. --Duename (talk) 16:59, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

 * Sextet Devo is simply the first name of the group. Nowhere does it imply that Sextet Devo was a separate entity from the current Devo. Nothing in the history states that the "current" Devo is something distinct from what performed at KSU in 1973. This article in particular includes Sextet Devo as the beginning part of the history. Also, being a former member is again irrelevant. Your personal opinions on whether or not his writing is "fair" or "undetail" (which isn't a word) have no justification. No other member has publicly stated that Lewis's writing was incorrect and there is no reason to believe that he would simply ignore Akron and use Kent "to sell books" or "cause controversy". Indeed, the source used is not from a book he sold, but something he wrote. The "We Are Devo" book is not written by a Devo member, but the authors interviewed several members of the band (past and present) to write it. Akron being the site where they filmed their videos should be mentioned, however, that would not mean the band had it's origins in Akron; it was simply where several members were from and where the videos that really launched their fame were made. Origin is where the idea and formation of the band took place, not necessarily the location where fame was achieved. --JonRidinger (talk) 21:13, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

 * Sextet Devo is a precursor, which may or may have not formed in Kent, to Devo. Many rock n roll groups had name and member switch before their current form. My point about him being a former member is that constantly through history they say things contrary to popular opinion in order to gain relevance. For years Akron has widely been accepted as Devo's origin, without members really publicly denouncing it. I can list numerous of bands and solo artist who formed in their hometown but has New York or Los Angeles as their origin cause they moved there and became famous. So your move of their origin to Kent from Akron was more opinionated than my move to the Akron metropolitan area which includes both cities, and other cities they were most likely located at when choosing to form. --Duename (talk) 22:06, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
 * As for their "current form", that doesn't negate the origins of the group, which detailed sources put at Kent State, not only physically but where the ideas were formed and developed. This isn't a case of Lewis giving his opinion that Devo was started in Kent, he's telling what happened.  The separate Devo book, which incorporates all or most Devo members, backs this up and is clear of any possible question of neutrality or bias.  It's not so much him changing or contradicting history as it is being more specific.  Akron is also "widely accepted" as the general Akron area, and many people do not differentiate between the various cities and towns around Akron.  The same is true with any metro area; people will say something is from "New York", "Chicago", or "Cleveland" when it was actually from a suburb or nearby smaller city.  In Wikipedia we do not have to use the broad definition because we have wikilinks and additional sources which narrow down "Akron metropolitan area" to Kent.  Doesn't mean Kent is where the band fully developed or even rose to fame; it only means that's where the band had its beginnings (i.e. origin), in this case both physically (guys getting together to play) and as an idea (the "devolution" idea was clearly developed at KSU).  It also doesn't mean that the band did not have anything happen in Akron.  But there is a difference between developments and origins.  Akron seems to be where the band "matured", but not where its origins are.  Sextet Devo is the origin of "modern" Devo, which is why it's mentioned on this article and why it's mentioned in the Devo book.  It's connected not only in the Devo name, but with members as well.  It's not like they started Sextet Devo, broke up, then started a new band called Devo.  No, they started Sextet Devo and it evolved and developed from there to what it is now.  Nothing abnormal or unusual about that at all.  --JonRidinger (talk) 00:28, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

 * May you provide the sentence that directly states Devo formed in Kent, from a detailed source? Yonkers and New York City are really close, yet it is widely stated that DMX is from the former, such is the case with many other artist. As I came close to saying in my above post, (guys getting together to play) happened in many hometowns of bands that have New York City or Los Angeles as their origin cause they relocated and gained fame there, though the hometown was in a different state.--Duename (talk) 15:42, 27 January 2011 (UTC)
 * If you're looking for a sentence that says "Devo formed in Kent" then you won't find it. The detailed histories are the ones I have already cited, that being Bob Lewis's own words and the Devo book "We Are Devo", both of which show that the founders were living in Kent at the time of the formation of the band and that the band formed as a result of experiences at KSU.  I don't have a problem listing "Kent and Akron, Ohio" in the "origin" since Kent is obviously where the band had it's beginnings as an idea (the whole de-evolution concept) and as a physical entity.  It is also where Lewis and Casale were living when they came up with the idea to make a band (Lewis mentions "coming back to Kent in 1972" even though he had already graduated in 1970).  Akron, on the other hand, is where the band was when they gained fame playing at the Crypt, so it's easy to see why it is often associated with the beginnings of the band.  It's where the band was when they were "discovered", so is also part of the origins. But to ignore where the band really started doesn't do the reader any service.  The band formed in Kent and developed further and became famous in Akron.  Note the opening sentence in this article even uses 1973 as the founding year (i.e. Sextet Devo), which was in Kent.  Perhaps it needs to be expanded upon to indicate it formed in Kent and later moved to or rose to fame in Akron.  --JonRidinger (talk) 17:11, 27 January 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree, it was going to be my initial action but i thought it would be less proper and more confusion, but this case calls for it as we proved.--Duename (talk) 21:59, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

Futurama
Is it worth mentioning that Devo appeared as mutated versions of themselves on Futurama? It was in the episode 'The Mutants Are Revolting.' It was broadcast on September 2, 2010, and Mark Mothersbaugh voiced himself. Legionaireb (talk) 22:38, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

 * Surprisingly - amazingly - there doesn't seem to be a Devo in Popular Culture section, which heartens me. Of all the bands that I would expect to have an In Popular Culture section, complete with a page-filling list of trivial meaningless references in Family Guy, the Simpsons, and especially Futurama, this band would be near the top of the list. So, admirable restraint there. To answer your question, it would not be worth mentioning etc. It's just fluff. As I understand it the long-term management strategy for this impulse is to hive such lists off to a separate X in Popular Culture article, which will just shrivel up until at some point it is deleted. -Ashley Pomeroy (talk) 15:36, 10 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, people tend not to like "in Popular Culture" sections.. that being said, I don't think making a mention of this would be the same as 'in pop culture' sections would be, since Mark Mothersbaugh actually did voice work for the episode, and they used an actual Devo song -- it's more like an appearance. There were certainly a lot of references one could draw from, and even a wikipedia page about the episode. Centerone (talk) 06:39, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Get a Better photo for Gods Sake!
That photo is horrendous. Most people when they think of Devo think of skinny guys in funny hats, not chubby neckbeard unix system administrators. Get a better photo, stat! 50.0.136.137 (talk) 08:28, 24 September 2012 (UTC)
 * That is what they look like now, while they are still performing to sold-out venues. We don't need 30-year-old-photos.  Also, don't you mean photos, plural?  Since there are several recent ones in the article.  BTW, they are not unix system administrators, they are successful musicians with commercial production studios, if they need system administration they have people to do that for them.  Oh, and none of them have beards.  Perhaps you are confusing this article with one about RMS.  Also, Bob 1 is still skinny. Centerone (talk) 15:11, 24 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Michael Pilmer (Devo-Obsesso) has a cornucopia of pics he took of Devo. Perhaps he would be willing to give one to the article? —oh,no! it's N A T E 547 03:48, 4 December 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nate547 (talk • contribs)
 * I'm sure they "look like that now". But essentially they're a nostalgia act with middle age spread like the OP says. If the Rolling Stones started out looking like they do now and only played their post-1970s material, they would have never got anywhere. It's odd that Devo had several changes in style back in the day, but haven't changed their act much in twenty plus years.

Yes I agree. Regardless of how many tickets they sell these days, they are still trading on past glories 30+ years ago. Let's get a picture of them in their heyday when they were actually something. Seems to be a common problem on Wikipedia with hasbeen rock bands. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 31.52.208.249 (talk) 14:03, 12 July 2018 (UTC) p.s. Put the 1978 picture at the top.
 * That's just not wikipedia policy. Typically the most up-to-date and best representative image is chosen. Since they didn't stop playing in 1978, an image of them then would be not representative of their growth and changes over time.  I understand your point, but it's not policy and standard practice on Wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Images  Centerone (talk) 15:55, 13 July 2018 (UTC)

 * I'm sure it is "not current policy" or whatever, but it is a classic example of where Wikipedia bureaucracy gets it wrong. It might be appropriate for John Lee Hooker or Louis Armstrong, but it's plain wrong for Devo or the Sex Pistols. Few of these bands would be anywhere today without their past years ago. Least of all Devo which has shown little devolution in the past twenty or more years and is a pastiche act. Ditto the Rolling Stones - sure they sell out stadiums but they've been a nostalgia act for forty years.-31.52.208.249 (talk) 22:56, 16 July 2018 (UTC)

Broken link and "Bob 1" question
Hi. I noticed that the first link used on this page (for the pronunciation) that points to a URL at cluefree.org now is broken and that site's TLD seems to only be an ad for a specific user's social networking. However, that link seems to be somewhat important to justify two different pronunciations in the first sentence of the article. Maybe there is an saved copy in archive.org. Also, I see the use of "Bob 1" in this article and in comments on the talk page. I have read other offsite online references to a "Bob 2" as well. However, nowhere in this article does it mention who "Bob 1" is or how that reference originated. This is like using an acronym in an article without first introducing its meaning. I am not sufficiently knowledgeable on the article topic to make this edit, but I would think if it is important enough to be included, the meaning of that term should be explained since this is an encyclopedia. Thanks for listening.Xblkx (talk) 01:05, 24 October 2012 (UTC)

 * As a general rule, I pronounce the band's name DEE-vo. I don't know of anywhere online where this can be substantiated however, but most people tend to pronounce it DEE-vo. I don't really see the point in sourcing that at all, frankly. Vis-a-vis Bobs 1 & 2. Robert Mothersbaugh is Bob 1 and Robert Casale is Bob 2. I haven't read the article lately so I don't know about the lack of identification (if I did, I dismissed it because I know who Bob 1 is). If this is still a problem since the last edit, I'll fix it shortly. Nate547 (talk) 06:27, 10 November 2012 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the Bob 1 / Bob 2 clarification. The name mapping is now in the infobox, so when these are used in the article, that preceding information makes it possible to know who is being discussed.  So that issue is closed.

 * The only remaining issue then -- and I reiterate it is not specifically how to correctly pronounce the name as I agree with you -- rather, with the fact that the first link in the article is broken (it's the one that's the ref to "originally" the other way to pronounce it). I spent a half hour at archive.org trying to get it to find and load the archival pages and finally found it in the February 6, 2005 snapshot of the ref'd website to the 1993 conversation with Jerry Casale that is being referenced as the source to the alternate "original" pronunication.  The link to that interview (though, more accurately, it is a summarized recollection based on an interview so I'm not sure it is a WP:RS anyway, is here.  I am not an expert on the article subject, but IMO either the ref should change to that, or the alternate "original" pronunciation and ref should be removed.Xblkx (talk) 08:52, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Jeff or Josh?
The article contradicts itself, giving Jeff Friedl's name as a "Past Member" and Josh Freese's name as a "Current Member" in the infobox but exactly the opposite in the Lineup (Personnel?) secion. Are they both current members? Is Devo without permanent drum personnel right now? Is it an oversight? What? Since ClubDevo.com (which is admittedly not updated very often) still lists Josh as Devo's drummer, I'm "demoting" Jeff in the Lineup section. Feel free to switch it around if necessary. —'''oh,no! it's N A T E 547''' 04:05, 4 December 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nate547 (talk • contribs)
 * I've been reverting the edits by unknown (non-registered) editors who keep switching Josh and Jeff. Mainly I noticed the edits in the infobox, but I guess someone at some point edited the lineup section too and I didn't revert that.  According to all published reports from both Josh Freese and Devo's archivist, Josh is still their primary drummer. Jeff did play some shows with them in 2010 and 2011 when Josh was unavailable. I guess I can understand the confusion, but it's still annoying when people make these edits without any recent statements otherwise. Centerone (talk) 06:30, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

 * I propose listing both Freese and Friedl as current members until there is a statement from themselves or from Devo that they have left the band. Josh and Jeff now alternate drumming duties for Devo. For instance ClubDEVO.com posts show that Jeff performed several dates with Devo in 2012 and 2013. They both recorded for SFE and both appeared in different SFE videos. On their official websites, Josh and Jeff list themselves as members of Devo. Josh and Jeff are not available exclusively for Devo because both are members of bands other than Devo and because both also record as session drummers. Devolicious77|03:50, 6 July 2013 (UTC)
 * UGH! Someone has YET AGAIN reversed Jeff and Josh. Is it possible to semi-protect just one section of the article?  Josh has NOT retired from Devo and their official site, http://www.clubdevo.com/bio.html lists him under "Band Members" and not Jeff. Centerone (talk) 00:08, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

Devolicious77's statement from last July makes sense. Devo has used both Jeff and Josh as they are both session musicians. I'll need to go digging out references as the 'official record' seems to indicate Josh has an actual contract. Jeff toured with them in 2010-2012 (at least), made live appearances on TV and at festivals, and is on record in several videos. jzp (talk) 14:52, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

No Bob 2 page
I'm not totally sure why there isn't an article about Bob Casale. I'm also not sure why you get directed back to the Devo article if you search for him. He's only mentioned like 3 times. Whatever. Anyway, until someone more intrepid than myself can get round to making a Bob 2 article, it would probably be best not to wikilink his name in the article, since it won't take you anywhere. '''oh,no! it's N A T E 547''' 03:35, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
 * There is now a Bob2 page: Bob_Casale. Perhaps this part of the talk can be clobbered? jzp (talk) 13:09, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

Death of Bob Casale
CBS News is reporting the death of Bob Casale, aka Bob 2. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/devo-guitarist-bob-casale-dead-at-61/ 130.49.235.177 (talk) 20:11, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

 * I noted the Facebook cite was the band's official Facebook, which I think would be a reasonable cite. The CBS piece is basically straight from the Facebook post and isn't really a better source - David Gerard (talk) 21:42, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

 * Gerald Casale confirms, fwiw - David Gerard (talk) 21:46, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

 * http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/18/showbiz/devo-bob-casale-dead/ & http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/devo-guitarist-bob-casale-dead-at-61-20140218 are two good sources. Ckruschke (talk) 19:26, 21 February 2014 (UTC)Ckruschke

Time signatures? Source?
From the first section of the article:

"Their often discordant pop songs feature unusual synthetic instrumentation and time signatures that have proven influential..."

Yes, the songs may be wonky and occasionally discordant, but I don't know of any Devo songs not in 4/4. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:4898:80E0:EE43:0:0:0:3 (talk) 22:23, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

"Whip It" has 8 bars of 6/4, for starters. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.251.122.138 (talk) 04:46, 1 April 2015 (UTC)
 * No, it doesn't. 67.169.106.43 (talk) 21:01, 18 July 2015 (UTC)

Wait... Post-Punk is an argument?
So I added post-punk to the genres in Devo and I got a very... hostile response on my talk page and it was reverted. Is this really that controversial? In all the circles and discussion I've frequented, Devo's always mentioned post-punk as a premier post-punk band. Yes, they moved away from it as time went on, I don't think anyone disputes that...but... well, I'm just surprised that "Rip It Up and Start Again" isn't considered a reliable source (apparently, at least according to the messages I got,) and at the idea that Devo wasn't playing post-punk music. I'd try to find another article to reference it but... well, is this one of those situations where it doesn't matter if it's sourced, Devo's not considered post-punk by Wikipedia for this or that reason? 142.55.48.18 (talk) 21:34, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

 * Genre changes without WP:RS or discussion are considered disruptive, if your argument is valid it should be easy to provide a reliable source such as AllMusic.com who is readily accepted as reliable.  Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 21:55, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

 * Well, as soon as I click on it, I see post-punk right there among the genres so... can I add it or am I going to risk getting banned? 142.55.48.18 (talk) 22:24, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

 * Well, that's under "style" not genre.  Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 22:36, 30 November 2015 (UTC)
 * It sounds to me like now you're just talking semantics. The genre there is listed as pop/rock, not new wave, punk, or synth pop, all of which are covered in style, but which Wikipedia considers genres. It seems to that generally, Devo (like any band,) is generally considered rock and pop, so that's put as the main genre for easy categorization, with the sub genres being listed below as "style." If you, I'll happily pull a ton of other sources out of my hat that list Devo as post-punk, just as easily as I could find sources considering Black Sabbath to be metal or Bob Marley to be reggae. This isn't a hotly contested issue. Anyone the slightest knowledge of Devo knows that their early work is considered post-punk. Did they move away from it? Sure, but so did New Order, Public Image Limited, The Cure, and essentially any other post-punk band that lasted beyond the late seventies. 142.55.48.18 (talk) 22:52, 30 November 2015 (UTC)
 * You don't need "a ton" you just need one reliable source and a discussion gaining consensus.  Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 23:54, 30 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Oh, come off it. We both know I'll need a ton, you've already squinted your eyes at two reliable sources to see what you want to avoid admitting you're wrong. You're saying a book a post-punk music that is generally used for articles on the genre and considered a a reliable source isn't good enough, and you're also distinguishing between styles and genre to discount the AllMusic link you yourself provided. Your ego is more important than article accuracy. I made sure all of these are reliable sources. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Albums/Sources#Online_and_print I'm looking forward to seeing how you back out of these, but hopefully other editors will be more interested in an accurate article than their personal opinions about what Devo played.

http://www.ew.com/article/2009/03/11/devo-records-fi "Devo, the flower pot hat wearing post-punk band of the 1980s, is cracking the whip for the first time in 19 years, finishing its first studio album since 1990, according to Reuters."

http://www.billboard.com/articles/news/59116/its-devolution-baby "Devo hasn't made a new album in years, and the pioneering post-punk band only tours every now and then."

http://www.chartattack.com/news/2009/04/01/devo-movie-on-the-way/ "The R&B singer formerly known as Santogold (informercial jeweller Santo Gold threatened legal action against her in 2008, after which she changed her name) told Paste magazine she's helming the legendary post-punk band's upcoming new album, which the band recently said they want to release this spring."

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2014-02-18/entertainment/sns-201402181243reedbusivarietyn1201110676-20140218_1_gerald-casale-mark-mothersbaugh-bob-mothersbaugh " "Bob Casale, original member and rhythm guitarist of the sui generis post-punk/New Wave band Devo, died on February 17 at age 61."

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/devo-assemble-synthetic-blues-in-auto-modown-song-premiere-20130624 "Before they were men, they were still Devo: five oddballs tinkering with fragments of New Wave and post-punk in a basement in Akron, Ohio." http://thequietus.com/articles/14876-poor-but-sexy-agata-pyzik-extract-polish-80s-futurism "Like outré new wave/post-punk outfits Xex or Devo earlier, they reacted with its absurdisation."

http://www.clashmusic.com/feature/through-being-cool-devo-interview "Their conceptual dressing up, thought-provoking leftfield theories provided by Gerry and the oddly catchy quirky, tough, post punk pop written by Gerry and Mark were ironically starting to attract the attention of the mainstream."

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/aug/04/entertainment/la-et-pickdevo4-20110804 "The '80s were much more diverse than today's crop of synthy revivalists might have you believe. At this bill, post-punk pranksters Devo team up with the ambitious dance experimentalists Tom Tom Club and modish two-tone ska act English Beat for a night showcasing the decade's range."

http://exclaim.ca/music/article/devo-live "When Devo arrived on the post-punk scene from Akron, OH in the late '70s, initial audiences might have seen them as some kind of novelty act."

http://www.clashmusic.com/live-review/devo "With Mark Motherbaugh’s opening cry "Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah ye ye ye ye ye yeah," groups of men who should know better slam past the unprepared younguns to get to the front, creating a mosh pit of rather heavier and sweatier proportions than your current post punk/art rock band could muster."

 * You should probably use the RollingStone reference, that one would be easier to accept. Cheers, Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 03:56, 1 December 2015 (UTC)

Should appearances at private functions be mentioned?
Should appearances at private functions be mentioned (if signifiant)?

e.g. The "greatest hits" set that they performed at the 2006 "Oracle Openworld Customer Appreciation Event" at Cow Palace (Devo wasn't even the headliner...Elton John had the top billing)

--193.35.254.234 (talk) 15:23, 1 April 2016 (UTC)

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The Wipeouters
Were the Wipeouters the same as Devo (just with a different name), or were they meant to be a separate band altogether? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.237.40.132 (talk) 02:19, 17 December 2016 (UTC) : They were meant to be a separate band from Devo. The band members of "The Wipeouters" are Mutato Muzika employees. This includes Josh Mancell, who never was a member of Devo, but was employed by Mark. There were other guest musicians who were Devo-related.--204.38.4.81 (talk) 21:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
 * This is potentially problematic. Josh Mancell is currently listed under "Former members" in the infobox, however, while he has worked with Mutato and The Wipeouters, he's never, to the best of my knowledge, been a member or contributor to Devo.  Perhaps under "Band members" we can have a subheading for The Wipeouters? Centerone (talk) 20:05, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

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Devo opening genre
Devo was never Post-Punk or New Wave, they were lumped into these categories. Devo's true genre was originally Art Punk moving on to Synth-Pop later on. "Whip It" is a good example of their later material. What genre do you think the opening should be? I think it should be rock, but that's just my opinion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by FreakyBoy (talk • contribs) 17:30, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Industrial
I removed industrial from their genres. It was sourced to without a page number. However, Reynolds never describe them as an industrial band, and the only attribute to industrial in the book is a comment about "industrial rhythms" and their self-description as an "eighties industrial band"—which is irrelevant to industrial as a musical genre. RoseCherry64 (talk) 19:14, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Green Day side-project The Network
Does anyone know if members of Devo appeared with the Green Day side project The Network? It had been mentioned on The Network article a while back that members of Devo were involved, but no one as of 2013 were able to confirm their participation as true, so that statement was removed.

I did add to both this page and The Network page that there was an unsubstantiated rumor that members of Devo were involved, but that their alleged participation has not been acknowledged by either band. If anyone has any more info about Devo's alleged participation with The Network, please do drop the sources.

Currently, there are two members of The Network who's identities remain unknown; Z and Captain Underpants. If you go to the Gerald Casale article and edit it, you'll see in the deprecated associated acts section of the info box that it lists The Network as a band he was associated with, but again, there has been no official confirmation of his or other Devo members' participation by the members of both bands.

Mark Mothersbaugh has cited a like for the band Green Day and The Network has cited Devo as an influence, but that does not cement the latter's participation in the project. Again, if anyone has sources about Devo's involvement, please do drop it below.

Oh yeah, The Network also practice the same fictional religion as Devo too. Moline1 (talk) 00:28, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
 * There was a lot of speculation and some evidence that Bob Casale was possibly in The Network, although it was repeatedly denied.Centerone (talk) 19:01, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Interesting. Do you have any sources that cite his rumored, and repeatedly denied, involvement by chance? Moline1 (talk) 19:02, 22 August 2022 (UTC)

John Zabrucky
Shouldn't John Zabrucky be mentioned in this article? 173.88.246.138 (talk) 01:29, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

Confrontational?
The statement that early concerts were confrontational needs some elaboration. There's mention of venue management once unplugging the band at a show, but not why, and no other examples are offered. Did people attend for the precise purpose of harassing the band? Did the band intentionally antagonise the audience or staff? A sentence or two fleshing out this statement would make it a valuable part to the article. Laodah 19:54, 22 October 2023 (UTC)

 * @Laodah I know it's been a while, but thanks for pointing this out! I thoroughly reviewed all the cited sources I could access, and none of them lent any support or context to the super weird sentence you flagged, so I've BOLDly removed it. Happy editing! Chiselinccc (talk) 19:59, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
 * @Chiselinccc Thanks! It's just that this is the first I've seen Devo described as confrontational. Laodah 04:12, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Devo


text:
User:Cavalier~enwiki

Hi. I don't really exist.

Wikipedia is this really awesome social experiment and I'm fascinated with how well it is surviving. We all know out here on the internets there are some facetious folks (wanna buy some wood?) who would gladly tear something down rather than build it up for a good time. It's a testament to wikipedia that it not only survives but thrives!

I'll try to contribute where I can, probably just a punctuation fix there and a minor sentence addition yonder. I don't get much kicks out of being a watchdog (even though I've been a SysOp, had an efnet O line,  adminned a UBB, hm... ahem..)  so I probably won't be playing that role here. Ego wars are so annoying, and like the saying goes, even if you win an argument on an online forum,  you're still retarded.

wOot!

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User:Cavalier~enwiki


text:
Belʹkovich (crater)

Belkovich is a large lunar impact crater of the form termed a walled plain. The formation has been heavily eroded by a history of subsequent impacts, leaving it reshaped, worn, and the features softened and rounded. Belkovich is located along the northeastern limb of the Moon, and so its visibility is subject to libration effects. From the Earth this crater is viewed from the side, making it difficult to view it in detail.

Belkovich intrudes into the northeast portion of the Mare Humboldtianum, and the mare area outside the rim consists of hilly, irregular surface that covers much of the northern half of the lunar mare. The younger crater Hayn intrudes into the northwest rim of Belkovich, and the satellite crater Belkovich K lies across the northeast rim. In the south, the lava-flooded crater Belkovich A cuts across the southern rim, and its western rim is overlain in turn by the small, bowl-shaped Belkovich B.

Apart from the intersecting crater formations, the outer rim of Belkovich has been degraded and reshaped until it now consists of a roughly circular range of mountains and hills. The northern and northeastern parts of the crater floor and rim is an irregular surface of many small hillocks. The southeast quadrant of the interior is nearly as irregular, and contains a number of small craterlets. Only in the western part of the floor is the surface relatively flat. From here a slender rille extends to the east-southeast before bending to the southeast.

Satellite craters
By convention these features are identified on lunar maps by placing the letter on the side of the crater midpoint that is closest to Belkovich.

title: Belʹkovich (crater)


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Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian

Indo-Trinidadians and Tobagonians or  Indian-Trinidadians and Tobagonians are people of Indian origin who are nationals of Trinidad and Tobago, whose ancestors came from India and the wider subcontinent beginning in 1845 during the period of colonization.

Indo-Trinidadians and Tobagonians are a subgroup of Indo-Caribbeans, which is a subgroup of the wider Indian diaspora. Generally, most Indians in Trinidad and Tobago can trace their ancestry back to northern India, especially the Bhojpur and Awadh regions of the Hindi Belt, which lies in the Gangetic plains, a plain that is located between the Ganga and Yamuna rivers and faces the mountain ranges of the Himalayas, the Kaimur, and the Vindhyas. However, some Indians may trace their ancestry to other parts of South Asia, notably southern India. Indians first arrived in Trinidad and Tobago as indentured laborers from India through the Indian indenture system from 1845 till 1917, and some Indians and other South Asians, along with their families, later came as entrepreneurs, businesspeople, religious leaders, doctors, engineers, and other professional occupations beginning in the mid-20th century and continuing till present day. Some Indians from many other Caribbean nations, such as Guyana, Grenada, Martinique, and Saint Croix, also immigrated to Trinidad and Tobago.

Indo-Trinidadians and Tobagonians are the largest ethnic group in Trinidad and Tobago, identified by the official census, about 35.43% of the population in 2011.

History
In his book Perspectives on the Caribbean: A Reader In Culture, History, and Representation, Philip W. Scher cites figures by Steven Vertovec, Professor of Anthropology; Of 94,135 Indian immigrants to Trinidad, between 1874 and 1917, 50.7 percent were from the United Provinces of Agra and Oudh, 24.4 percent hailed from Oudh State, 13.5 percent were from Bihar Province and lesser numbers from various other parts of the British Raj, such as the Madras Presidency, Bengal Presidency, Central Provinces, Chota Nagpur Division, Bombay Presidency, and Punjab Province. Out of 134,118 indentured labourers from India, 5,000 who left from the Port of Madras distinguished themselves as "Madrasi" and the immigrants who left from the Port of Calcutta distinguished themselves as "Kalakatiyas". However, this did not equate to their ethnolinguistic group. While, most Indians who left from the Port of Madras were Tamils (Madrasis), not all were ethnic-Madrasis, some were Telugu, Kannadiga, Malayali, Gondi, Kodava, Tulu, or Deccani, and most Indians who left from the Port of Calcutta were not ethnic-Bengalis (Kalakatiyas), but they were Purabias (Bhojpuri and Awadhi), however there were small numbers of Bengalis, as well as small numbers of Maithils, Magahis, Baghelis, Brajis, Bundelis, Kannaujis, Kauravis, Pashtuns, Nagpuris, Kurukhs, Haryanvis, Gujaratis, Marwari, Sadans, Chhattisgarhis, Kashmiris, Dogras, Punjabis, Marathis, Odias, Garhwalis, Kumaonis, Madheshis, Parsees, Assamese, Newars, Tharus and Khas who came via the Port of Calcutta.

Many were people who were escaping poverty in India and seeking employment offered by the British for jobs either as indentured labourers, workers or educated servicemen, primarily, between 1845 and 1917.

The demand for Indian indentured labourers increased dramatically after the abolition of slavery in 1834. They were sent, sometimes in large numbers, to plantation colonies producing high-value crops such as sugar in Africa and the Caribbean.

Religion
According to the most recent census (2011) conducted in Trinidad and Tobago, Hinduism is the religion followed by a plurality of Indo-Trinidadians. The breakdown of religious affiliation for Indo-Trinidadians is as follows -
 * 1) Hinduism – 49.54%
 * 2) Islam – 11.64%
 * 3) Pentecostalism/Evangelicalism/Full Gospel – 9.67%
 * 4) Roman Catholicism – 6.48%
 * 5) Not Stated – 6.30%
 * 6) Other – 5.81%
 * 7) Presbyterianism/Congregationalism – 5.68%
 * 8) None – 1.04%
 * 9) Spiritual Baptist – 0.96%
 * 10) Seventh-day Adventist Church – 0.91%
 * 11) Jehovah's Witnesses – 0.73%
 * 12) Anglicanism – 0.56%
 * 13) Trinidad Orisha – 0.31%
 * 14) Other Baptists – 0.21%
 * 15) Sikhism – 0.06%
 * 16) Methodism – 0.05%
 * 17) Rastafari – 0.02%
 * 18) Moravian Church – 0.007%

Hindus in Trinidad and Tobago are represented by several sects, organizations and entities the largest of which is the Sanatan Dharma Maha Sabha, a Sanātanī Hindu organization. Other Hindu organizations and sects include SWAHA International, Arya Samaj, Chinmaya Mission, Kabir panth, ISKCON, the Sathya Sai Baba movement, Shirdi Sai Baba movement, Ramanandi Sampradaya, Seunariani (Sieunarini/Siewnaraini/Shiv Narayani), Aughar (Aghor/Owghur), Kali Mai (Madrasi), Murugan (Kaumaram), Bharat Sevashram Sangha, Jagadguru Kripalu Parishat (Radha Madhav), Ganapathi Sachchidananda movement, Divine Life Society, Brahma Kumaris, and Blue Star.

A majority of Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian Muslims are Sunni, however there are notable Shia and Ahmadiyya minorities. The major Muslim organisation representing Muslims in Trinidad and Tobago is the Anjuman Sunnat-ul-Jamaat Association (ASJA). Other Islamic organizations include the Trinidad Muslim League, Darul Uloom, Ummah T&T, the Muslim Federation, and the Tackveeyatul Islamic Association.

The Sikh community in Trinidad and Tobago, numbering at about 300, consists of the descendants of the few Punjabis who came during the indentureship period, Punjabi Sikhs who came in the twentieth and twenty-first century, and Sindhi Hindus and Punjabi Hindus who also came in the twentieth and twenty-first century and who are, in addition to being Hindu, Nanakpanthis, followers of the Sikh Guru Nanak. The Sikhs have a gurdwara (temple) in Tunapuna dating back to 1929.

Politics
Most Indo-Trinidadians have traditionally given their political support to parties opposed to the People's National Movement (PNM) which has historically been perceived as a Christian African-Creole party. Voting patterns amongst Indo-Trinidadians have also been influenced by religion where, for periods of time Muslim Indo-Trinidadians and non-Presbyterian Christian Indo-Trinidadians supported the PNM because the prevailing parties for Indo-Trinidadians – the PDP, DLP, and ULF were felt to be Hindu and Presbyterian Indian dominated parties. With the advent of the NAR and then the UNC this polarization by religion has been on the decline however its existence is still felt with the UNC fielding a Muslim candidate in every election for the San Juan/Barataria seat since 1995 owing to the presence of a large Indo-Trinidadian Muslim population within this constituency.

Notable Indo-Trinidadian politicians include:
 * Basdeo Panday – first prime minister of Indo-Trinidadian descent and the first Hindu to hold the office
 * Kamla Persad-Bissesar – first female prime minister of Trinidad and Tobago
 * Noor Mohamed Hassanali – first Muslim head of state in the Western Hemisphere and the first Muslim and Indo-Trinidadian to hold the office of President of Trinidad and Tobago (1987-1997)
 * Christine Kangaloo – first female president of Trinidad and Tobago of Indian descent
 * Rudranath Capildeo – Leader of the opposition at the time of independence
 * Bhadase Sagan Maraj – Leader of the Parliamentary wing (1958–1960)
 * Ashford Sinanan – Opposition leader (1951-1956); West Indies Federation Opposition Leader (1958–1961)
 * Rudranath Capildeo – party leader (1960–1969)
 * Stephen Carpoondeo Maharaj – acting opposition leader (1963–1965)
 * Simbhoonath Capildeo – opposition leader (1965)
 * Vernon Jamadar – opposition leader (1965–1972); party leader (1969–1972)
 * Adrian Cola Rienzi – mayor of San Fernando and Member of the Legislative Council for Victoria (1937–1944)
 * Raffique Shah – opposition leader (1977-1978)
 * Winston Dookeran – UNC party leader (2005-2006); COP party leader (2006-2011)
 * George F. Fitzpatrick – first Indian member of the Legislative Council, nominated in 1912
 * Sarran Teelucksingh – Member of the Legislative Council for Caroni (1925–1946); first Indian elected to the Legislative Council, a predecessor of the Parliament of Trinidad and Tobgao
 * Isaac Hyatali – first chief justice of Trinidad and Tobago of Indo-Trinidadian descent
 * Satnarine Sharma – first Hindu chief justice of Trinidad and Tobago

Culture
Indo–Trinidadian and Tobagonians have retained their distinctive heritage and culture, while also functioning in a multicultural society. The South Asian languages of their ancestors have largely been lost, although a number of these words have entered the Trinidadian vernacular. Indian movies, music, and cuisine have entered the mainstream culture of Trinidad and Tobago. Chutney and chutney soca music rivals calypso and soca music during the Carnival season.

Holidays and festivals
Diwali, Eid ul-Fitr, and Indian Arrival Day are national holidays, and Phagwah/Holi, Maha Shivratri, Hanuman Jayanti, Ram Naumi, Sita Naumi, Navratri, Vijayadashami, Krishna Janmashtami, Radhastami, Saraswati Jayanti, Raksha Bandhan, Vivaha Panchami, Guru Purnima, Ganesh Chaturthi, Kartik Snan, Ratha Saptami, Karagam Puja, Kalbhairo Jayanti, Mesha Sankranti, Makar Sankranti, Tulsi Vivah, Gita Jayanti, Datta Jayanti, Ratha Yatra, Gurpurab, Buddha Purnima, Ramadan, Hosay (Ashura), Eid al-Adha, Mawlid, Shab-e-barat, Chaand Raat, Islamic New Year, and other Hindu and Muslim holidays are widely celebrated.

Cuisine
Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian cuisine is mostly derived from the Bhojpuri and Awadhi cuisines of North India, with considerable South Indian, especially Tamil, influence on preparation and ingredients in the tropical environment of Trinidad and Tobago that was similar to the tropical environment of South India, where a significant minority of Indians came from. There is also influence from other ethnic cuisines on the island such as Creole, Chinese, West African, Indigenous, French, British, North American, Portuguese, Arab, and Latin American cuisines. It is unlike the mainstream Indian-South Asia cuisines, which is mostly based on Punjabi, Rajasthani, Mughlai, Gujarati, Bengali, Udupi, and Tamil cuisines. This "mainstream" Indian cuisine was brought to the country by more recent immigrants and is termed as East Indian cuisine in Trinidad and Tobago and is contrasted from the local Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian or local-Indian cuisine.

Breakfast
A traditional Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian breakfast consists of sada roti, a type of unleavened bread made with flour, baking powder and water. The dough is rolled out and cooked on flat, cast-iron skillet, called a tawa. The cooked dough is cut into quarters and served with a variety of fried vegetables, tarkaris or chokhas. Sometimes fried bake is eaten instead and is made using with flour, baking powder and yeast and is then fried in oil. Usually breakfast is vegetarian, however salt fish is sometimes added. Some breakfast dishes include baigan chokha (roasted and mashed eggplant), damadol chokha (roasted and mashed tomatoes), pepper chokha (roasted and mashed peppers), aloo chokha (boiled, roasted, and mashed potatoes), karaili chokha (roasted and mashed bittermelon), murtani or upar ghar (combination of roasted and mashed eggplant, tomato, pepper, and okra), fried or curried bodi (long beans), fried or curried aloo (potatoes), fried or curried ochro/bhindhi (okra), fried or curried seim (hyacinth beans), fried or curried karaili (bittermelon), pumpkin or kohra tarkari (pumpkin simmered with spices and seasoning), fried or curried saijan (drumstick), fried or curried lauki (bottle gourd), bhaji (made with young dasheen bush (taro) leaves, spinach leaves, saijan (drumstick) leaves, or chaurai (spiny amaranth) leaves), and/or fried plantains.

Street foods

Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian foods like doubles, aloo pie, pholourie, saheena, baiganee, bara, and kachori are popular street foods throughout the country and are served with various chutneys, achars, and pepper sauce. Doubles is made with two baras (flat fried dough) and curried channa (chickpeas) and is served with toppings, like pepper sauce, kuchela, and tamarind, mango, pommecythere, cucumber, coconut and bandhaniya chutneys. It is one of the most popular breakfast foods eaten on the islands, however, it is eaten at any time throughout the day. Another Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian street food that is popular is roti, which consists of roti (usually paratha or dhalpuri) that wraps curried vegetables, curried channa (chickpeas) and aloo (potatoes), curried chicken, curried shrimp, curried goat, curried duck, curried conchs, or any other spicy fillings. The town of Debe in southern Trinidad is a popular destination for these street foods.

Festival foods

Traditional Diwali and other Hindu festivals and prayers foods include appetizers such as pholourie, saheena, baiganee, bara, and kachori. Main dishes include roti (most commonly dalpuri and paratha) and karhi and rice served with condiments such as achar or anchar, kuchela, mother-in-law (pickled vegetables), pepper sauce, and dishes such as curried mango, bhaji (dasheen bush or any spinach), pumpkin or kohra tarkari (pumpkin), curry channa and aloo (chickpeas and potatoes), fried or curried baigan (eggplant), fried or curried bodi (long beans), fried or curried seim (hyacinth beans), curry eddoes (arui), curry chataigne or katahar (breadnut), and other tarkaries (vegetarian curries). Desserts include mohan bhog (parsad), lapsi and suhari, burfi, khurma, gulab jamun, pera, rasgulla, batasa, gujiya, gulgula, roat, kheer (sweet rice), laddu, and jalebi. It is traditionally served on a sohari (Calathea lutea) leaf.

Special Eid, Hosay, and other Muslim festival foods include curry goat, curry channa and aloo, sawine, burfi, rasgulla, sirnee, maleeda, and halwa.

Condiments

Indo-Trinidadians and Tobagonians accompany their meals with various condiments; these can include pepper sauces, chutneys and pickles and are often homemade.

Pepper sauces are made by using scotch bonnet or other hot peppers, either minced or chopped and added to vinegar or lime or lemon juice and sometimes pickled together with carrots, sour cherries, bitter melon, or daikon (murai). Mother-in-law is another popular condiment which is a coarsely chopped spicy medley of peppers, pimentos, carrots, bitter melon, and other spices.

Chutneys are popular as well and often include mango, tamarind, cucumber, pommecythère, bandhaniya, dhaniya, chalta, and coconut. They are most commonly eaten with doubles, aloo pie, saheena, baiganee, kachori, and pholourie. There are a variety of popular pickles known locally as achar or anchar which are commonly used. Kuchela a grated spicy version, usually made from mango but sometimes made from pommecythère, the mango version being most popular. Other version of achars are made from mango, pommecythère, tamarind, amla, lemon, lime, chayote, chalta, and green apple.

Sweets and Desserts
Indian sweets and dessers are commonplace in Trinidad and Tobago and are distributed especially at Indian weddings and religious events. They include kheer (sweet rice or meetha bhat), sawine, khurma, gulab jamoon, burfi, roat, laddu, jalebi, halwa, mohan bhog (parsad), sirnee, lapsi and suhari, rasgula, tilly cake, gulgula, paynuse, pera, modak, gujiya, and batasa.

Dance
Indian dance forms are prevalent among Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonians. Kathak, Odissi, and Bharatanatyam are the most popular Indian classical dance forms in Trinidad and Tobago. Indian folk dances, such as launda ke naach, Bollywood dancing, and chutney dancing are also popular Indian dance forms.

Theatre
Indian theatre is also popular throughout Trinidad and Tobago. Nautankis and dramas such as Raja Harishchandra, Raja Nal, Raja Rasalu, Sarwaneer (Sharwan Kumar), Indra Sabha, Bhakt Prahalad, Lorikayan, Gopichand, and Alha-Khand were brought by Indians to Trinidad and Tobago, however they had largely began to die out, till preservation began by Indian cultural groups. Ramleela, the drama about the life of the Hindu deity Rama, is largely popular throughout the country during the time between Sharad Navaratri and Vijayadashami leading up to Diwali, with almost each locale having their own celebration. The Ramlila celebrations end with the burning of an effigy of Ravana, the main antagonist of the ancient Ramayana and its 16th century vernacular variation, popular among Hindus in Trinidad and Tobago, the Ramcharitmanas. Rasleela (Krishnaleela), the drama about the life of the Hindu deity Krishna, is popular around the time of Krishna Janmashtami.

Influence on Trinidad and Tobago
The Indian–South Asian influence is very much noticeable in Trinidad and Tobago as they are the largest ethnic groups in the country. Mandirs, masijids, jhandis (Hindu prayer flags), Hindu schools, Muslim schools, roti shops and stalls, puja stores, Indian groceries/markets, and Indian clothing stores and expos dot the landscape of the country. Many businesses also bear names of Indian-South Asian origin. Many towns, settlements, villages, avenues, traces, and streets in Trinidad and Tobago are named after Indian cities and people, such as Calcutta Settlement, Madras Settlement, Delhi Settlement, Jai Ramkissoon Housing Settlement, Raghoo Village, Jaraysingh, Hasnalli, Hindustan Village, Patna Village, Gandhi Village, Kandahar Village, Cawnpore (Kanpur) Village, Nepal Village, Abdul Village, Samaroo Village, Basta Hall, Gopaul Lands, Sumadh Gardens, Mohammed Ville, Gobin Village, Nancoo Village, Malabar, Matura (Mathura), Bangladesh, Morang Village, Chandanagore (Chandinagar), Sadhoowa, Divali Nagar, Golconda, Barrackpore, and Fyzabad. The holidays of Diwali, Eid al-Fitr, and Indian Arrival Day are national holidays in Trinidad and Tobago. Trinidadian Hindustani and other South Asian languages has had a great influence on the Trinidadian English lingua franca. Most people of South Asian descent in Trinidad and Tobago also speak a unique Hinglish macaronic dialect of Trinidadian English and Trinidadian Hindustani and they incorporate more Hindustani vocabulary into their Trinidadian English dialect than other ethnic groups in the country.

title: Indo-Trinidadian and Tobagonian


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Bellot (crater)

Bellot is a small lunar impact crater that is located on the southwest edge of Mare Fecunditatis. It lies between the craters Goclenius to the northwest and Crozier to the southeast. To the southwest is Colombo, and to the west is Magelhaens.

This crater is circular and bowl-shaped, with a small interior floor with inner sides that slope down relatively smoothly to the bottom. The inner walls have a higher albedo than the nearby lunar mare.

Satellite craters
By convention these features are identified on lunar maps by placing the letter on the side of the crater midpoint that is closest to Bellot.

title: Bellot (crater)


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kimberly Rolland

Kimberly Rolland was proposed for deletion. This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was to speedy delete.

Kimberly Rolland
The page's entire contents are "Kimberly was a Godess known to live during the 5th century.". I'm unsure what this even means, and there are no relevant hits on google or my university library, so I'm leaning towards assuming this is made up. --Delirium 01:25, Oct 25, 2004 (UTC)

This sounds like it could be speedy deleted to me. Indrian 01:26, Oct 25, 2004 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't have even bothered to google this. I think it's kinda funny that you did, to be honest. Mike H 01:48, Oct 25, 2004 (UTC)
 * I have since deleted it. Mike H 01:49, Oct 25, 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. I don't think the name "Kimberly" was popular in the fifth century. Indeed, I don't think it was popular before the 1970s. And and  seem to confirm this. I think that someone named Kimberly Rolland may have an admirer at IP address 141.209.34.211, however. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 01:54, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC) P.S. Agree this could be a speedy, under newbie test, patent nonsense, and very short articles with little or no context. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 01:54, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * A final remark: I think my sister Kimberly is pretty damn great, and she was born in 1969. :-o That has no point, but I had to share. Mike H 01:55, Oct 25, 2004 (UTC)
 * She was a trendsetter, obviously. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 00:05, 26 Oct 2004 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.


text: Category:Artillery shells

title: Category:Artillery shells


text:
Talk:HP-150

Various particulars
This wasn't, however, the first HP machine to use 3.5" Sony floppies. I'm afraid I can't remember the model name offhand. Four digits, beginning with a 9, I think.

It was billed as a computer, not a calculator.

It came out circa 1983, maybe late 1982. It cost about $10,000 with 65K of RAM. It had a full bitmap-addressable CRT screen and built-in IEEE-488 interface. It was based on a 68000 processor, and aimed at the scientific and engineering market. It used a very nice, very sophisticated version of BASIC with all the usual control structures, optional line numbers, etc. Programs executed at very, very roughly 1000 lines of BASIC per second. A dual-floppy unit was the main form of storage; I don't believe a hard drive was a common option.

Oh, and it supported version of Context MBA, the now-forgotten program which completely out-featured 1-2-3 but had been written in Pascal and was therefore unusably slow on a PC, though perfectly acceptable on this HP machine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dpbsmith (talk • contribs) 01:25, 25 October 2004 (UTC)

title: Talk:HP-150


text: Template:GE diesels

title: Template:GE diesels


text:
Bernoulli (crater)

Bernoulli is a lunar impact crater that is located in the northeast part of the Moon. It lies to the south of the crater Messala, and east of Geminus.

This formation is nearly circular with several slight outward bulges around the perimeter. There is a sunken depression along part of the southern wall, forming an outward triangular bulge in the rim. The rim is highest along the eastern side, climbing to 4 km. At the midpoint of the crater floor is a central peak formation.

Satellite craters
By convention these features are identified on lunar maps by placing the letter on the side of the crater midpoint that is closest to Bernoulli.

title: Bernoulli (crater)