text:
Talk:American-British-Dutch-Australian Command

earlier comments
From Page 10-11 in "Defeat into Victory" by Slim. There is a page on the operational control of Burma:
 * 1937 Burma politically separated from India, fully responsible for its own military forces
 * 1939 with the outbreak of war Burma forces placed under British Chiefs of Staff but financed out of Burma taxes and locally administerd.
 * 1940 November operational control was transferred to the recently formed Far Eastern Command in Singapore  while administrative responsibility was divided between the Burma Government and the War Office in London, which now contributed substantially to the defence budget of Burma.
 * December 12 1941, when a Japanese attack was seen to be Imminent, back to India command.
 * December 30 1941, A.B.D.A., as with our passion far initials the South-West Pacific Command...Under this organization, the Burma front was to be operationally controlled from Java and administered from Delhi.
 * With the rapid break-up of A.B.D.A. following the Japanese invasion of the Dutch East Indies, back Burma came again to India. Thus in the space of about sixteen vital months there had been five separate superior headquarters in turn responsible for the defence of Burma

Looking on the net
 * At the beginning of January  it had been decided by the Allied authorities to unify the command of all their forces in the South West Pacific under a Supreme Allied. Commander.   General  Sir Archibald Wavell was appointed to this post.  He arrived in Singapore on 7th January and commenced to form his staff, absorbing into  it   the   Commander-in-Chief,   Far  East, and his staff. On 15th January he moved to the site selected for his Supreme Allied Headquarters, South West Pacific Command,  namely to Bandoeng in Java. There on 15th January he assumed command of operations throughout the S.W. Pacific, and G.H.Q. as such ceased to exist. The code name for General Wavell's H.Q. was Abdacom.

From the net
 * With the Japanese making ready for the final assault on Java, General Wavell turned to his superiors for new instructions. Their orders were to transfer command of Java to the Dutch and withdraw, but to maintain ABDACOM and keep his headquarters intact. When and where he would go was left to him. Ground forces "for whom there are arms" were to remain and continue the fight, but air forces that could operate from bases outside Java and other troops "who cannot contribute to defense" were to be withdrawn, the Americans and Australians to go to Australia. General Brett was to return to Australia, when released by Wavell, to command the U.S. forces there.50

 * The ABDA commander did not agree with the program. What he wanted was the dissolution of ABDACOM, all reason for its existence having disappeared. Burma, he pointed out, had already been separated from the ABDA theater and Java's defense was a local problem, best handled by the Dutch themselves. If the Philippines, which had never really been under his control, were taken over by the Americans again and northwest Australia by the Australians, he told the Chiefs, he could turn over his remaining forces to the Dutch and leave the area by 25 February.51

 * This recommendation was in line with the solution being proposed by the British Chiefs of Staff for the establishment of two areas in the Far East, one to be under American control and to include Australia; the other a British area encompassing India and the Indian Ocean. The Dutch opposed such a solution for fear it would mean the end of Allied assistance in the Netherlands Indies. 'For God's sake,' wrote the Dutch governor-general to Marshall, "take the strong and active decisions and don't stop sending materials and men."52

 * Still anxious to avoid the appearance of abandoning their allies, the U.S. Chiefs continued to oppose the dissolution of ABDACOM. But in recognition of the fact that Wavell had lost the confidence of the Dutch and obviously wanted to pull out, they agreed to the dissolution of his headquarters and his transfer to India, leaving control of the ABDA area to the Dutch. And lest the Dutch should think that the Americans had made this arrangement to shirk their commitments, Marshall assured the Dutch governor that the forces then assembling in Australia were "seeking opportunity to enter the ABDA battle" and would "continue their full support of the Dutch commanders in their magnificent fight."53

 * On the 25th General Wavell turned over command to the Dutch and left for India where General Brereton had already gone to organize an American air force. This move placed MacArthur technically under the Dutch, but he had already been told that "because of your special situation all procedures in your case remain as heretofore."54 The burden of defending Java was now squarely on the Dutch. Their forces, with the exception of minor ground units (including an American artillery battalion), American and British naval units, and a small U.S.-Australian fighter force, composed the entire command.

So another name for ABDA was "South West Pacific [theatre]" It seems that when the British created ADBACOM Wavell who was Comander in Chief of the Army in India used the staff of their Far East Command which had been stationed in Singapore to man ADBACOM. When Wavell turned over command [of ADBA] to the Dutch and left for India The Indian command which took responcibiltiy for Burma. The Americans (MacArthur) inherited what was left of the South West Pacific [theatre] after the Dutch lost Java.

Wavell did not become Supreme Allied Commander South East Asia he retained his position as Comander in Chief of the Army in India which took on Burma with the ending of ABDA. In August 1943 SEAC was formed. (Info from Page 168 of "Defeat into Victory"  by Slim). ''Wavell became Vicroy of India and was replaced By General Auchinleck as C in C India on June 18, 1943. '' PBS 18:57, 26 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * Good research and contribution to the article, thanks. However, the boundaries of the SWP Command were completely different to ABDA and I have edited the article to reflect this. And the only references I can find to a "Far East Command" are the RAF body. Grant65 (Talk) 00:35, Sep 27, 2004 (UTC)

Thanks. I've put in a link for the Army of India, it is not the same thing as the British Indian Army because it included British Army units in India (and after 1941 American, African etc). Both Slim in "Defeat into Victory" and [1] above(London_Gazette_1948) both mention the Far Eastern Command in Singapore. The staff of that command were very lucky to end up in ABDACOM and not in Burma under Japanese command! I don't think it is the same organisation as the RAF one. It was just that the RAF did not change their command name when they evacuated to India (as they were seperate command from the Indian Air Force) PBS 02:30, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * OK... A query: since India was not part of ABDA, did Wavell really retain control of the Army of India while he was at ABDACOM? Also, I think the comment about the US supporting ABDA for "political reasons" is not correct/NPOV, I mean all of the ABDA countries actually had forces in the Dutch E. Indies. It seems to me that Wavell was more obvious in his assessment of their prospects -- too few, spread too thin --- than the others were. Grant65 (Talk) 09:41, Sep 27, 2004 (UTC)

Yes Wavell did. It was one of the criticisms of the whole venture, because if you add up all the forces of the ABDA, numerically it would only have been a tiny fraction of the forces he commanded in India. So much of his time was devoted to the normal bureaucratic stuff that a CinC India would have to do.

When Wavell chucked in the towel on the 25th of January, the US were still willing to send troops to aid the Dutch. They seemed to have realised that this was not more than a gesture.
 * ''And lest the Dutch should think that the Americans had made this arrangement to shirk their commitments, Marshall assured the Dutch governor that the forces then assembling in Australia were "seeking opportunity to enter the ABDA battle" and would "continue their full support of the Dutch commanders in their magnificent fight." ... This move placed MacArthur technically under the Dutch, but he had already been told that "because of your special situation all procedures in your case remain as heretofore."

So how do we describe that?

The sources I have read (eg U.S. ARMY CAMPAIGNS OF WORLD WAR II East Indies) suggest that the ABDACOM was dissolved on the 25th of January. What are your sources for saying that "Following the destruction of the main ABDA naval force under Rear-Admiral Karel Doorman, at the Battle of the Java Sea, in February-March 1942, the unified ABDA command was dissolved.?

Do you have a source for the creation of the command under MacArthur? Because it seems more than a coincidence to me that MacArthur was in command of the largest piece of ADBA left after the fall of the Dutch East Indies and that his command had the same name. I would guess that he inherited the wreckage of the ABDA by now reduced to "AA" and that it was never formally disolved. But I have no evidence for this and will be intrested to know what your sources are.

Finally I have put in two links to maps which I think would be very useful if they were included in this article directly. The website where they are currently displayed is hyperwar says ''The source of the material presented here is almost exclusively U.S. Government produced, -- and therefor U.S.-oriented. This choice was made to avoid any copyright issues,'' So I guess it is OK to include these maps directly into the article. PBS 14:50, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * The maps would be a good inclusion.

 * I have removed the reference to dissolution following the Battle of the Java Sea. I don't think ABDA was ever formally dissolved. The land command seems to have devolved to local commanders after Wavell's withdrawal.

 * Personally I think ABDA was a means by which the British and US attempted to take control of the defence of the DE Indies, without offending the Dutch. Obviously Hein Ter Poorten would not have attempted to tell MacArthur what to do, any more than he would have attempted to tell Percival what to do. What that means is that MacArthur effectively held a separate "Phillipines command", in the same way that Percival did. (Likewise the ABDA navies had a "China Force" under the Australian Commodore John Collins.)

 * Some people may have referred to ABDA as the "SW Pacific Area" in early 1942, but not many, and it doesn't even make any geographical sense to do that, if you think about it. ABDA never included the bulk of Australia, New Guinea or the neighbouring islands, which were under direct Australian control. However, once the Dutch East Indies fell, it was a unilateral US decision to re-organise the greater "Pacific Theatre" into two new US-defined theatres. With MacArthur based in Brisbane or Melbourne for most of the war, Australia virtually became a US-occupied country and its forces became a US colonial army. According to an Australian Defence Department account:

 * Subsequently, with the disappearance of Wavell’s command in the ABDA area, decisions were made by the US in March 1942 to divide the Pacific area, on grounds of strategy, into the SWPA and the Pacific Ocean Area. General MacArthur was designated Supreme Commander of the SWPA and Admiral Nimitz was designated Supreme Commander of the Pacific Ocean Area. The Australian Government had no part in any of these decisions and was told about them after they had been made. Grant65 (Talk) 00:22, Sep 28, 2004 (UTC)

I think you are being a bit hard on the Americans. The decision to divide the Pacific was made before that (which is why the ABDA had the geographic limits it did). The Churchill speach to the House, referenced in the external links, show that 60 years ago he considered Britian, Canada, Australia, South Africa and New Zealand to be much closer to each other than any of them are today. [ It would have been very unlikly that in those days that NZ Prime Minister would have been body searched as a potential terrorist when passing throught Australia ;-) ] Look at the mention of the PMs of those countries sitting in the British Cabinate when ever they were in the UK and that it was a pitty they were there so infrequently. So I think the Amercan decision, (which if I am right about the name, the Pacific Area was set up by inheriting ABDA agreement with extended boundries, just as the Indian theatre command was), would have to be seen in the context of the British, Australian and New Zealand debate about what to do with ANZAC divisions in North Africa and Europe "Should I Stay Or Should I Go/ If I stay there will be trouble/ If I leave it will be double". But that is for another article, this one is about finished :-) || PBS 08:00, 28 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * If you you look at how close the Japanese got to Australia in early-mid 1942, with major air raids on Darwin and other northern towns, the battles of the Coral Sea, the Kokoda Track and Milne Bay, and with most of the army still in the Middle East...and a promised torrent of US forces, it's not hard to see that the Australian gov't had no option but to go along with whatever MacArthur said. (And he never was easy to get on with, which is why Truman sacked him in 1951.) I'm sure 99% of Australians preferred US occupation to the prospect Japanese occupation, 99% of the time. Thanks for your help with the article. :-) Grant65 (Talk) 11:06, Sep 28, 2004 (UTC)

C in C India
Hmmm...www.regiments.org lists the C-in-Cs India as:

1941.01.27 F.M. Sir Claude John Eyre Auchinleck 1941.07.05 Gen. Sir Alan Flemming Hartley 1942.03.07 F.M. The Rt Hon Archibald Percival (Wavell), 1st Earl Wavell 1943.06.20 F.M. Sir Claude John Eyre Auchinleck

http://www.regiments.org/biography/defchiefs/inCinC.htm

Grant65 (Talk) 00:18, Sep 30, 2004 (UTC)

I think that this needs more research:

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORCES/Army/Army-Chiefs/Chiefs-Army-Old.html This list seems to confirm www.regiments.org

wikipedia biography agrees with http://www.britannica.com "commander in chief in India 1941–43;". http://www.bartleby.com/65/wa/Wavell-A.html says "He then exchanged commands with General Auchinleck, becoming commander in chief of India. After Japan entered the war, he was for some months (1942) supreme commander of the Allies in East Asia, but the command was abolished as the Allies lost control of the area. Resuming his command in India". http://www.geocities.com/dutcheastindies/wavell.html "Commander-in-Chief, India, 1941-1943. Supreme Commander, South West Pacific, ABDA Command, January - March 1942"

I checked Slim and he met Wavell on 12th March when he is given Burma and mentions that Wavell has India and Burma. But that does not help us because all the above sources agree that he could be C in C by that date.

Just found a definative source: http://www-archives.chu.cam.ac.uk/perl/node?a=a&reference=CHAR%2020%2F68A-B

04 Jan 1942
 * ''Telegram from WSC to the Viceroy and Governor-General of India [2nd Lord Linlithgow, earlier Lord Hopetoun] refusing to remove General Sir Claude Auchinleck from command in Middle East [? to be Commander-in-Chief, India], asks if [? General Sir Alan Hartley, General Officer Commanding- in-Chief, Northern Command, India] or [? General Sir William Platt, General Officer Commanding-in-Chief, East African Command] would be acceptable.

04 Jan 1942
 * ''Telegram from WSC to General Sir Archibald Wavell, Commander-in-Chief, India, refusing to remove General Sir Claude Auchinleck from command in the Middle East.

04 Jan 1942
 * ''Telegram from WSC to General Sir Archibald Wavell, Commander-in-Chief, India [and Supreme Commander, South West Pacific], advising he should set up his headquarters in Java [Dutch East Indies, later Indonesia] as also advised by the United States.

So on the January 4 1942 Wavell was C in C India and Hartley was not. So www.regiments.org is wrong.

You might find this one interesting 09 Jan 1942:
 * ''Telegram from WSC to the Prime Minister of Australia [John Curtin] on the co-ordination of defence between Britain, the United States, Australia and New Zealand, including the need to incorporate the United States contribution into the south western Pacific, and the defence of Australia itself; Australian, New Zealander and Dutch representatives will report via London to Washington until a Supreme Commander has been appointed.

PBS 03:24, 30 Sep 2004 (UTC)

http://www-archives.chu.cam.ac.uk/perl/node?a=a&reference=CHAR%2020%2F71A-B 28 Feb 1942
 * ''Telegram from General Sir Archibald Wavell, Commander-in-Chief, India, to WSC: comments on the question of appointing a Military Governor in Ceylon [later Sri Lanka] and suggests Admiral Sir Geoffrey Layton [Commander- in-Chief, China]; refers to the confused situation in Burma and proposes going there; hopes that General Sir Alan Hartley will be left in India as his Deputy. 	28 Feb 1942

So it looks like Hartley was premoted Deputy C in C under Wavell while Wavell was SAC ABDA. PBS 03:35, 30 Sep 2004 (UTC)

When I did the above search the site: http://www.fepow-community.org.uk/Research/London_Gazette/Burma_Dec_1941_to_May_1942/ Was down. It is up now and it is well worth a read because it is a report by the main British actors published by the War Office in 1948 about:

 * ''OPERATIONS IN BURMA FROM 15th DECEMBER 1941 to 20th MAY 1942

 * ''The following Despatch was submitted to the Secretary of State for War on the 14th July, 1942, by GENERAL SR ARCHIBALD P. WAVELL, G.C B., C.M.G., M.C., A.DC., Commander-in-Chief, India.

 * ''(To cover Reports by Lieut.-General T. J. Hutton and General The Honourable Sir Harold R L G. Alexander.)

Here are some bits which relate to the questions we have had Wavell writes section 3:
 * ''Burma had been included, for operational purposes, in the Far East Command when this was established in November, 1940, with headquarters in Singapore... I paid a visit to Burma and Malaya and discussed the question with the Commander-in-Chief Far East, Air Marshal Sir Robert Brooke-Popham, and with the Governor of Burma, Sir Reginald Dorman-Smith...

So the Far East Command in Singapore was established in 1940 and the commder was neither Navy or Army but Airforce. Hence the confusion in the other sources we have seen.

Section 5:
 * ''On 12th December, five days after the entry of Japan into the war, I received a telegram from the Prime Minister placing Burma under the Commander-in-Chief, in India for defence.

Section 14:
 * ''On 30th December, 1941, I received a telegram appointing me to the newly constituted South-West Pacific Command (afterwards known as A.B.D A.). Burma was included in this Command. I at once recommended that the defence of Burma should remain the responsibility of Commander-in-Chief, India, for the same reasons for which I had previously urged its transfer to India from the Far East Command (see paragraph 3). I was, however, overruled on the grounds that Marshal Chiang-Kai-Shek must feel himself connected with the new South West Pacific Command. I think that this decision was a serious error from the military point of view.... General Sir Alan Hartley who succeeded me as Commander-in-Chief, India, did everything possible to meet Burma's requirements.

Section 15.
 * ''I took over control of South West Pacific Command on 15th January, and established A.B.D.A. Command Headquarters in Java, near Bandoeng, a few days late.

So we from the telegrams that on the January 4th that he Wavell was both CInC India and SAC ABDA Hartly must have become CinC Inda after that date a possible date is the day Wavell took command of South West Pacific on January 15th.

Section 21
 * '' On 23rd February I was ordered to close down A.OB.D.A. Command Headquarters and to reassume my appointment as Commander-in-chief, India. I thus against became responsible for the defence of Burma within a few days of having handed it over. [sic (the "OB" and "against" are in the source) PBS]

So Hartley did take ovder as CinC India after January 4, probably before January 15, He became Deputy Commander between Febuary 23 when Wavell was "ordered to close down" ABDACOM and to reassume his appointment as CinC India and 28 Feb 1942 when Churchill sent Wavell a telegram address to him as CinC India. It was probably the 25th if the US source is correct.

Bit tought to be promoted CinC only to be told 5 weeks later you are demoted to Deputy! PBS 10:58, 30 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Certainly was...very interesting material. We were thinking along similar lines and here are a few other impressions I've gained from my research:

 * It seems to me that we can also talk about a British India Command --- which as we know included Burma from early 1942, and which (officially at least) had the combined Allied SEAC imposed from above in 1943.

 * Yes but not in this article as it happend in the future. I think it is coverd already in South-East_Asian_Theatre_of_World_War_II but you might think it needs an expansion.

 * References to Wavell as "Supreme Commander SW Pacific" seem to almost always exclude the word Allied, which suggests to me that the title referred to British forces only and was a secondary/subsidiary one to the ABDA Command. Considering that there was no continuity between Wavell and MacArthur, and the latter was appointed unilaterally, it seems to me we are dealing with somewhat different beasts in talking about ABDACOM and SWPC.

 * I don't think the fact the word "Allied" is missed out is significant see the telegram above which starts 09 Jan 1942: Telegram from WSC to the Prime Minister of Australia.... It implies that it is an interchangable phrase with ABDA. It helps to keep them seperate, so that people who have not looked at all this stuff, realize that it is diffrent (if only in who ran the show) from the American MacArthur command of the same name. Although as I said before I suspect that once the British and Dutch had gone, he inherited commander postion and used the name as an alternative to calling it AACOM ;-)

 * I think we need to change the present wording slightly, about the British "Far East Command" being the "kernel" of ABDA. That overlooks the significant US and Dutch input. The Far East Command does seems to have been swallowed up by ABDA, but it also looks to have been diminutive: apparently Brooke-Popham was appointed in October 1940 and succeeded (briefly) by Pownall from December 23, 1941. The point being that Percival and Wavell are well-known, but not Brooke-Popham. (Perhaps he should be, considering that it was an air marshal who oversaw the failure to deploy any significant Allied air power on the Malayan Pensinsula!) Grant65 (Talk) 11:26, Sep 30, 2004 (UTC)

 * By all means change it, but I think kernel is fine because there would have been plane loads of REMFs in the command not just the high profile names and in the lenght of time ABDA existed there would not have been much time to gather any one else. It seems that Wavell specifically went to Singapore to collect them, but so long as you include the fact that the British Far East Command made up part of the ABDA command it does not matter. I want that handle left so that it can be expanded on in a sub-article at some point in the future.

 * I suspect that the Far East Command ended up in India as the part of the staff to the CinC and ran theatre ops outside India for him. But that is for further research and belongs in a seperate article.

What do you think? Grant65 (Talk) 11:26, Sep 30, 2004 (UTC)

I've put my thoughts between your bullet points under each one. PBS 14:26, 30 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * The maps look great, well done. I may mention the major land battles and then leave the article alone for a while :-) Grant65 (Talk) 01:06, Oct 2, 2004 (UTC)

Re MacArthur & ABDA: my recollection (without a source in front of me) is he got a separate SWPA command after (or concurrent with) the dissolution of ABDA, as the defense of the "Malay Barrier" was seen to be impractical (or impossible...). This followed the destruction of Doorman's scratch force. To confirm, look to Willmott's Barrier & the Javelin (1983). Trekphiler 12:45, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

 * Check the article, it says: "MacArthur was ordered to re-locate to Australia. On March 17, the US Government appointed him as Supreme Allied Commander South West Pacific Area." BTW I have reverted your last edits because the titles you added were U.S. Navy ones not joint ABDA (Allied) positions. Grant65 | Talk 16:21, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

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Request for more information (2016)
I have removed this request for more information, as user:Indy beetle who made the request did not explain here on the talk page what information (s)he) considers desirable to add. -- PBS (talk) 11:20, 2 May 2018 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Duchy of Athens

Untitled
Can we get a coat of arms in the article for the Duchy? --Daniel C. Boyer 18:57, 26 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * I don't think I've ever seen one, although I'm sure they had some sort of heraldry. Do you know where one might be found? Adam Bishop 05:06, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I want to know about how much power the duke of Athens would have, and how the politics worked. Also, if you added a popular culture section or something, it's worth noting that in Shakespeare's "A Midsummer Night's Dream," Theseus is portrayed as the Duke of Athens. 24.42.74.140 (talk) 16:57, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

This article currently states:

 * Athens was originally a vassal state of the Kingdom of Thessalonica, but after Thessalonica was captured in 1224 by Theodore, the Byzantine Despot of Epirus...

However, according to the Thessaloniki article, it was conquered by Michael Ducas (which makes sense, as Theodore had already died by that time). Is it agreed that this should be changed? -- Itai 10:13, 3 Dec 2004 (UTC)

The photo of the so called Frankish Tower, reportedly dismantled in 1874!
I would beg to argue that this tower, which may or may not have been of Frankish origin (Possibly Ottoman?) was dismantled in 1874! This date, from whatever sources the author used, is most incorrect! The tower even existed when Athens again? hosted the Olympic Games! I am sure that the author of this site might well be able to find out the same information as did I? But, perhaps I will post my sources in a later post!69.92.23.64 (talk) 02:03, 16 February 2011 (UTC)Ronald L. Hughes 96.19.152.171 (talk) 03:29, 1 August 2013 (UTC)Ronald L. Hughes, Long Beach, MS, 2013, Perhaps I was wrong above concerning the demolition of the great tower on the Acropolis. Perhaps it did occur in the era of 1874? But that does not explain the Fig. numbered 7.44 shown in A. T. Fomenko's Vol. I, on page 433, showing the tower still standing in 1896,as it seems upon the winner of the bike racing event!! But further problems can be found within Fomenko's "History: Fiction or Science" Volume I, on pages 427 through page 435! ref!

Name two famous rivers that ran along side Ancient Athens?
96.19.152.171 (talk) 03:36, 1 August 2013 (UTC)Can any of you "experts", Name two famous rivers that ran along side Ancient Athens? If you can, can any of you name famous battles that could have occured there? Ronald L. Hughes, Long Beach, MS Note that I consider the letters spelled "issus" to mean the same as modern English as "issue" or the "issue" of a "river", and thus "issus" merely means "stream" or "river!"

Article titled "The Duchy, Dante Alighieri, and William Shakespeare"
What is the whole point of this section? It doesn't contain anything that warrants it being its own section. It's already been flagged for needing citation, which I would assume also comes only from it being a "coincidental" piece of information (at least based on what it has now).

If this were to have its own portion, this warrants it having a "In literature" or "In popular media" section instead, and expanded beyond those two. If none otherwise, I believe it should be ommited. RayaOstrinsula (talk) 15:08, 22 October 2023 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Duchy of Athens


text:
Talk:Aymara language

Comment
Some of the praise given to Aymara should be removed. Aymara is just a linguistic anomaly, just as Spanish and English are. [[User:Poccil|Peter O. (Talk)]] 18:57, Sep 26, 2004 (UTC)

In my opinion, leaving those quotes of Umberto Eco should be put back in. The article clearly stated that it was his opinion, and did not suggest that his opinion was right. Perhaps if his quotes were put in, along with some sort of rebuttal? I'm not aware of the issue enough to refute Eco's claims. --Bletch 18:25, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I put the stuff about umberto Eco and the like back in - they are interestign and should be mentioned. I reworked them so as to make them less POV. No more "Aymara is a perfect language and kicks all the other's asses, w00t !" :) Maybe some rebutal would be nice, I don't know what claims are contested. Anyway, it's after reading the lecture by Eco that I came over here, so I expect to see some mention of its "three valued logic" feature, even if it's a rebuttal. I've also moved in some stuff from the Aymara article. Flammifer 04:53, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Could anyone provide some examples of the three-value logic system of Aymara? As it is, the section on "Unique Features" is somewhat vague and ambiguous. Concrete examples would make it more objective and a lot more useful. Stephanos1ko 04:11, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

"Reverse" concept of time
Even though this statement appears in the research article, it is simply wrong:
 * "Until now, all the studied cultures and languages of the world – from European and Polynesian to Chinese, Japanese, Bantu and so on – have not only characterized time with properties of space, but also have all mapped the future as if it were in front of ego and the past in back. The Aymara case is the first documented to depart from the standard model," said Nunez.

I don't know about the other languages listed, but Chinese definitely also uses this "reverse" model. It also uses the word for back to refer to the future and the word for front to refer to the past. For instance: —Umofomia 23:55, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
 * = behind
 * = in front
 * = three years later
 * = three years ago

 * Hmm... much of the recently added content about this, including the quote above, looks to be pulled right out of news articles about this (see the numerous word-for-word similarities to this article for instance). I'm gonna pull this due to copyvio for now.  —Umofomia 00:05, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

 * I added a note to the article indicating how this might not be as unique as they thought. —Umofomia 00:45, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Something is wrong somewhere. Your note says that the Chinese word for front means future, and back means past - this is the conventional way of thinking, and does not contradict the researchers' assertions.  The stuff above on the talk page does, but the example in the article actually supports the uniqueness of the Aymara concept of time. -Elmer Clark 09:00, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

 * No, I said the opposite. The Chinese word for front means past, and back means future.  Look at the example above more closely (e.g. three year [SUBORD] back = three years later).  —Umofomia 09:04, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Oh, I see what you mean. I screwed up on the note I made in the article itself.  The above examples are correct though.  I'll fix the article note. —Umofomia 09:08, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

 * The Chinese data is actually not a counter-example to the claims made about Aymara. There are two widely-used metaphors for time, one ego-centered and one event-centered. In the latter, events can be ahead of and behind other events in a queue, and this queue moves wrt the speaker, though not necessarily from front to back. E.g., it may be from the speaker's left to right. We get "Christmas follows Thanksgiving" and all of the above-mentioned Chinese words from this metaphor. On the other hand, the ego-centered one explicitly involves the speaker, e.g., "all that is behind us; we must look ahead of us for better ideas." The Chinese words do not (necessarily) involve spacial relations between events and speakers, just between events and events. The Aymara system is ego-centered but has the past in front of the speaker. This is related to the gestural data. The claim, as far as I know, is that very very few languages have an ego-centered future-in-back system of time. (Also, it is possible to have "conflicting" metaphors for time, so one language may have both; especially for Aymara speakers, many of whom are bilingual with Spanish, which has the familiar future-in-front system. Some discussion of this on language log. --rikdzin 02:27, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Now that I think about it, it should be removed regardless, as per WP:NOR. A source making this assertation would be nice, but an editor simply coming to this conclusion himself is clearly a violation of NOR. -Elmer Clark 07:15, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

 * I have read the link you rikdzin gave above and there may indeed be some misunderstanding. However, the text in the article currently fails to convey this sublety and as it stands, is extremely misleading.  As for the NOR issue, the single sentence I have added:
 * However, contrary to this assertion, there are other languages like Chinese that appear to have the same feature, with the word for "front" (前) that refers to the past, and the word for "back" (後) that refers to the future.
 * ...is mostly a statement of fact and can be verified using any Chinese dictionary (the links to Wiktionary for both words are present as well). The part that can be construed as original research would be the part where it says "contrary to this assertion."  So essentially, the question is, whether the original assertion is properly stated.  If it currently is not being stated properly, then it needs to be fixed.  However, if it is indeed the case that the sentence as it is currently written is what the research actually claims, then I do not see why stating verifiable facts about Chinese words that serve as counterexamples to the claim would be original research.  —Umofomia 10:46, 18 June 2006 (UTC) [correction in bold, 10:49, 18 June 2006 (UTC)]
 * I believe that the article by Nunez and Sweetser is quite clear about what conception of time they are talking about. The claim is that the Aymara have a future in back of ego and past in front of ego conceptualization, both of which are part of the MOVING EGO metaphor of time. English before/after (and Chinese 前/後), the claim goes, are not part of the MOVING EGO metaphor, but part of the MOVING TIME metaphor. In fact, historically/archaically "before" means 'in front of', and "after" means 'in back of' just like 前 and 後. In this respect Chinese is parallel to English. I think that the phrase "fearful of what may lie before us" and the word 未來 'future' indicate that both Chinese and English have a future in front of ego conceptualization. A word like 後來 'after' is about things that "come behind" other events, not behind the speaker him/herself. Pages 4 and 6 through 12 of the linked article explicitly entertain the idea that English also has a future in back of ego metaphor, and eventually conclude that it (and thus Chinese, I think) does not work like Aymara. Page 13 deals with previous research that attempts to show Aymara-like systems for other languages. Of course this does not mean that no other system comparable to Aymara could exist, and such claims should be called to task. In any case the situation is rather complicated and evidently not easily communicated, so I think some mention of this would be worthwhile. --rikdzin 21:58, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

 * I'm not necessarily claiming that Aymara is not unique. You obviously know more about this subject than I do.  I'm just saying that the wording of the claim as it stands in the article is very misleading because it appears to make a bigger claim than what you have explained.  The solution is to fix the text in the article such that bringing up Chinese would be irrelevant (or perhaps explain how its claim of uniqueness is different from other languages like Chinese as you have explained above).  Do you think you can clean up the current text?  I noticed you are a pretty new user here with no article edits so far, but I encourage you to be bold and make the text better.  —Umofomia 00:56, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Sorry if I seemed to get uptight about it; it's mostly because I recently saw a talk on the topic. I updated the article, though I had to add a fair amount of background info that might be better located in a separate article that I probably can't do justice to.--rikdzin 22:37, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Thanks, your new additions explain the situation very well. I did a bit of minor copy editing for style and readability.  —Umofomia 04:52, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

The statement is very definitely false. Akkadian warki "behind, in the future," and probably also in other Semitic languages though I can't think of examples off the top of my head. Note also the etymology of English "before" and "after" (cf. the nautical terms forecastle and aftercastle) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.34.182.39 (talk) 07:31, 21 September 2013 (UTC)

regional differences
This was a lot of uninformative and parochial blather:

 * While the Aymara language is basically the same wherever it is spoken, there are regional differences. The Aymara spoken in La Paz, Bolivia is sometimes claimed to be the 'purest' form of the language, though this seems a rather arbitrary favouritism. Of the regional variations, the 200,000 Aymara speakers from the border of Peru to Puno use the form most similar to the Aymara spoken in La Paz.  There are also about 90,000 Aymara speakers in the provinces of Huancané and Moho in the department of Puno in Peru.  While understood by Aymaristas from other regions, the Aymara spoken in Huancané and Moho seems to contain the most regional differences.

 * 1) I'm not sure whether the first sentence was edited into incoherence at some point or if it was trying to express that the language has mutually intelligible varieties. From the last sentence I guessed it was the latter; if I was mistaken please correct me.
 * 2) The second sentence is obviously an argument between editors in the narrative voice of the article, which sucks. I couldn't tell if the La Paz form is a standard language of some kind, and if so, how it's standardized.
 * 3) The third and fourth sentences take a long time to get to the simple point: "Two varieties of the language are similar to each other. A third is similar to neither of the others. All are mutually comprehensible."
 * 4) It would be helpful (but beyond my abilities) to describe exactly what these regional differences are. Are the regional forms as distinct as varieties of Arabic? Or are they as distinct as U.S. regional variations?  Are they somewhere in between? Are the differences in accent? Grammar? Vocabulary? All of the above? —Charles P._ (Mirv) 06:19, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Official language of Peru?
I was under the impression that the '93 Constitution did away with that. Does anyone have a source? --Descendall 03:55, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I actually just dug up a source. "Achievements of Excluded Goups in the Andes" by Donna Lee Van Cott in State and Society in Conflict:  Perspectives on Andeans Crises edited by Paul W. Drake and Eric Herberg.  Page 167 has a chart that says that "Indigineous languages" are not official in Bolivia according to the 1994 Constitution and are official "in Indigenous territories" in Peru according to the 1993 Constitution.  --Descendall 04:03, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Age of Aymara Language
Does anyone know what the earliest record of this language is? How long has it been spoken?--Funhistory 15:50, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

 * I certainly don't know much about Aymara, but it appears from the article that the "earliest record" is that of the Spanish missionaries, which I suppose dates to the 1500s. Before that, it was an unwritten language.

 * As for how long it has been spoken, that's kind of a nebulous question. All languages descend from earlier languages and (apart from pidgins and creoles) by way of more or less gradual changes.  The English spoken today is descended by way of gradual changes from the English spoken in Shakespeare's time, which in turn descended from that spoken in Chaucher's time, which in turn came from that spoken in the era of Beowulf (with large admixtures from the Normans and Vikings, among other sources), which in turn came by way of gradual changes from Germanic languages spoken on the Continent, which came from proto-Germanic, which came from proto-Indoeuropean, which came from...no one knows what.  The point is that (apart from Pidgins, Creoles, and many sign languages), languages change gradually, and there's no way to assign a date to a particular language's origin. Mcswell (talk) 21:28, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Peru, Bolivia, Chile, Argentina
To the best of my knowledge, Aymara was declared an official language of Bolivia recently. Anyway, most speakers live in Bolivia, so the claim that "it is spoken to a much lesser extent in Bolivia" was incorrect. There are some speakers left in Chile, though the potential sources are very vague here. On Aymara in Argentina, Ethnologue has: "Quite a few have come from Bolivia looking for work. Sugar mill workers". We can thus safely assume that there are no more native Aymara communities in Argentina than there are in New York or Paris.

Three value logic system
In the article it is said that Aymara is based on a three value logic system. Can anyone add some example and details to show how Aymara based on this system? And how is it different from the binary logic in language? Without examples, it is very difficult to understand this unique feature. Salt 17:37, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I doubt it is unique. I suspect it's a simple evidential system, as in Quechua, but without examples, I can't look into the grammar of it. I'll flag the statement. kwami (talk) 21:50, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Since this has been asking for a site for over two years and hasn't received one, I've removed it. Also, moved the stuff from Eco et al. to a new section, "References in literature." Suomichris (talk) 07:19, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Numbers
The citation given for number of speakers is a dead link, and I couldn't track down the data myself. The Ethnologue counts for ayr and ayc add up to about 2,400,000. Unless anyone has another citation, I suggest changing the number and dropping the "more than 3 million speakers" bit (that's the main thing that prompted me to check). -- Shimmin Beg (talk) 20:00, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Aymara language


text:
Laxå

Laxå is a locality and the seat of Laxå Municipality in Örebro County, Sweden with 3,064 inhabitants in 2010.

History
The town was founded in the mid-19th century when the main line railway between Gothenburg and Stockholm (Västra Stambanan) was built in 1883. Laxå is exactly 229 km from both those cities.

In the vicinity of the town Laxå lies the Porla Well. Its iron rich water made it a popular spa between 1724 until 1939. Although not a spa anymore, its water is sold in bottles with the brand "Porlavatten" and have been distributed nationwide since the 1920s.

On August 17, 2012, it was reported in Dagens Nyheter that Laxå is Sweden's poorest municipality and the only one in the country with a net debt.

title: Laxå


text:
Beaverbrook

Beaverbrook may refer to:

People

 * Baron Beaverbrook, of Beaverbrook in the Province of New Brunswick in the Dominion of Canada and of Cherkley in the County of Surrey, a title in the Peerage of the United Kingdom
 * Max Aitken, 1st Baron Beaverbrook, newspaper publisher and World War II Minister of Aircraft Production
 * Beaverbrook Newspapers
 * Maxwell Aitken, 3rd Baron Beaverbrook, British politician and honorary RAF officer

Places

 * Beaverbrook, Alberta, Canada
 * Beaverbrook, Ottawa, Canada
 * Beaver Brook Station, New Brunswick, from which Baron Beaverbrook is named
 * Beaverbrook, Connecticut, United States

Other uses

 * Beaverbrooks, a British jeweller
 * Beaverbrook Art Gallery, in Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada

title: Beaverbrook


text:
The Hay Wain

The Hay Wain – originally titled Landscape: Noon – is a painting by John Constable, completed in 1821, which depicts a rural scene on the River Stour between the English counties of Suffolk and Essex. It hangs in the National Gallery in London and is regarded as "Constable's most famous image" and one of the greatest and most popular English paintings.

Painted in oils on canvas, the work depicts as its central feature three horses pulling what appears to be a wood wain or large farm waggon across the river. Willy Lott's Cottage, also the subject of an eponymous painting by Constable, is visible on the far-left. The scene takes place near Flatford Mill in Suffolk, though since the Stour forms the border of two counties, the left bank is in Suffolk and the landscape on the right bank is in Essex.

The Hay Wain is one of a series of paintings by Constable called the "six-footers", large-scale canvasses which he painted for the annual summer exhibitions at the Royal Academy. As with all of the paintings in this series, Constable produced a full-scale oil sketch for the work; this is now in the Victoria and Albert Museum in London. Another small oil-sketch, the first in his experimentation with extending of the composition of the painting to the right, is now in the collection of the Yale Center for British Art. Constable originally exhibited the finished work with the title Landscape: Noon, suggesting that he envisaged it as belonging to the classical landscape tradition of representing the cycles of nature.

The painting measures 130.2 x.

History
Flatford Mill was owned by Constable's father. The house on the left side of the painting belonged to a neighbour, Willy Lott, a tenant farmer, who was said to have been born in the house and never to have left it for more than four days in his lifetime. Willy Lott's Cottage still survives practically unaltered, but none of the trees in the painting exist today.

Although The Hay Wain is revered today as one of the greatest British paintings, when it was originally exhibited at the Royal Academy in 1821 (under the title Landscape: Noon), it failed to find a buyer.

It was considerably better received in France where it was praised by Théodore Géricault. The painting caused a sensation when it was exhibited, along with View on the Stour near Dedham and Yarmouth Jetty, at the 1824 Paris Salon (it has been suggested that the inclusion of Constable's paintings in the exhibition was a tribute to Géricault, who died early that year). In that exhibition, The Hay Wain was singled out for a gold medal awarded by Charles X of France, a cast of which is incorporated into the picture's frame. The works by Constable in the exhibition inspired a new generation of French painters, including Eugène Delacroix. The French writer Stendhal, who visited the exhibition, wrote: "We have never seen anything like these pictures before. It is their truthfulness that is so striking." According to Christine Riding, Director of Collections and Research at the National Gallery, though, "In some ways, he's offering up a fiction: a highly curated landscape containing elements that have been added later to improve the composition and broaden its appeal (…) There's nothing natural about that landscape (…) It's all man-made (…) The fields are agriculture, a managed landscape".

Sold at the exhibition with three other Constables to the dealer John Arrowsmith, The Hay Wain was brought back to England by another dealer, D. T. White; he sold it to a Mr. Young who resided in Ryde on the Isle of Wight. It was there that the painting came to the attention of the collector Henry Vaughan and the painter Charles Robert Leslie. On the death of his friend Mr. Young, Vaughan bought the painting from the former's estate; in 1886, he presented it to the National Gallery in London, where it still hangs today. In his will, Vaughan bequeathed the full-scale oil sketch for The Hay Wain, made with a palette knife, to the South Kensington Museum (now the Victoria and Albert Museum).

The Hay Wain was voted the second most popular painting in any British gallery, second only to Turner's Fighting Temeraire, in a 2005 poll organised by BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

A study produced by the charity Art History in schools suggests that the waggon has stopped in the river to allow the horses to drink and to cool down, but also to cool the waggon's wheels. The hot weather prevailing at the time of the harvest would cause the wooden wheels to shrink while the iron rims around them would expand, leading the wheels to wobble. Cooling the rims in the river addressed the problem. It notes that such details of agricultural life would have been well known to Constable.

On 28 June 2013, a protester, reported to be connected with Fathers 4 Justice, glued a photograph of a young boy to the painting while it was on display at the National Gallery. The work was not permanently damaged. On 4 July 2022, two Just Stop Oil protestors attached their own modified "apocalyptic vision of the future" version of the painting to the original and glued themselves to the frame. The National Gallery said the surface varnish of the painting and its frame suffered minor damage.

title: The Hay Wain


text:
Level structure

In the mathematical subfield of graph theory a level structure of an undirected graph is a partition of the vertices into subsets that have the same distance from a given root vertex.

Definition and construction
Given a connected graph G = (V, E) with V the set of vertices and E the set of edges, and with a root vertex r, the level structure is a partition of the vertices into subsets Li called levels, consisting of the vertices at distance i from r. Equivalently, this set may be defined by setting L0 = {r}, and then, for i > 0, defining Li to be the set of vertices that are neighbors to vertices in Li − 1 but are not themselves in any earlier level.

The level structure of a graph can be computed by a variant of breadth-first search:

algorithm level-BFS(G, r): Q ← {r} for ℓ from 0 to ∞: process(Q, ℓ) // the set Q holds all vertices at level ℓ mark all vertices in Q as discovered Q' ← {} for u in Q:            for each edge (u, v): if v is not yet marked: add v to Q'        if Q' is empty: return Q ← Q'

Properties
In a level structure, each edge of G either has both of its endpoints within the same level, or its two endpoints are in consecutive levels.

Applications
The partition of a graph into its level structure may be used as a heuristic for graph layout problems such as graph bandwidth. The Cuthill–McKee algorithm is a refinement of this idea, based on an additional sorting step within each level.

Level structures are also used in algorithms for sparse matrices, and for constructing separators of planar graphs.

title: Level structure


text:
Talk:Anne de Mortimer

Untitled
Suggested entry for another, contemporary 'Anne Mortimer'. How does one add an entry as an 'alternative' to a primary entry?

Anne Mortimer (b 1960) Artist and book illustrator, well known for her super-realist cat illustrations and botanical work. Anne Mortimer ranks among Britain's most talented illustrators and is widely recognized as one of the finest contemporary painters of cats anywhere in the world. Anne is also an accomplished painter of birds, botanicals and miniatures and has won awards from the Society of Botanical Artists and the Royal Miniature Society.

 * I've asked about this at Wikipedia Help. NinaGreen (talk) 16:26, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Apparently nobody has yet deemed the artist worth the effort of creating an article about. If you know enough and have reliable sources (i.e., nothing from her own website, just solid neutral reports), then create one and title it Anne Mortimer (artist); then put hatnotes on both articles to distinguish them from each other. We don't do disambiguation pages if there are only two notable persons of that name. However: leave out all the peacock words: promotional crap garbage like "...well known for...", "...ranks among Britain's most talented illustrators...", "...widely recognized as one of the finest contemporary painters of cats anywhere in the world. Anne is also an accomplished painter..." will get you tossed out on your ear as a spammer of some kind. -- Orange Mike |  Talk  16:40, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the tips. I'll leave it up to someone who knows more about the artist. NinaGreen (talk) 17:16, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Reference for place of Anne Mortimer's birth
Jeanne boleyn, thanks for adding the citation for the place of Anne Mortimer's birth. I've added it to the References section of the article. NinaGreen (talk) 15:51, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
 * No problem. I have long been fascinated by the Mortimer family and indeed, I have created articles on various family members and those connected by marriage.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 19:23, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Date of birth
The article states that she was "Born on 27 December 1388". However, Genealogics gives 1390. Her mother's article says that her parents' marriage took place "on or about 7 October 1388 . Although it is of course possible for a child to be born less than three months after her parents' wedding, I suggest that premarital cohabitation would be unlikely between two fourteenth-century aristocratic teenagers. Her maternal grandparents would have had too much to lose if the wedding had failed to take place for any reason. Comments? Alekksandr (talk) 18:58, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

The Yorkist Claim
The lede includes the statement "It was her line of descent which gave the Yorkist dynasty its claim to the throne". The statement is again repeated on the "House of York" wiki page but gives it in terms of cognatic primogeniture vs agnatic primogeniture. Both lack references so I was wondering if any could explain how the Yorkist dynasty did not already have a claim through Edmund Duke of York being the son of Edward III. As such should the lede perhaps instead say that "her marriage and line of descent strengthened the Yorkist claim to the throne" Kind Regards, NotAnotherNameGuy (talk) 09:13, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

 * Anne was descended from Lionel of Antwerp, who was Edward III's second son, whereas her husband Richard was the descendant of Edmund of Langley, Edward III's fourth son. So from a strictly genealogical point of view, Lionel's line had priority over Edmund's.
 * However, the succession had already been taken out of the realm of the strictly genealogical in 1399 when Henry IV overthrew Richard II. Henry was the descendent of John of Gaunt, who was Edward III's third son. Richard had no children, and during his reign had recognized Lionel of Antwerp's descendants as his heirs. At the time of Henry's usurpation, the senior heir from this line was Anne's brother Edmund, who was only eight years old, and he never pressed his claim to the throne.
 * At any rate, when the Yorkists began claiming a genealogical right to the throne, they did so based on their descent from Lionel of Antwerp (son #2) via Anne, because that was the more senior line. The Yorkists were Plantaganets because of their male-line descent from Edmund of Langley (son #4), but England considered royal succession through female lines to be OK -- that was their whole argument as to why Edward III and his heirs were the rightful heirs to the French throne, after all! Obviously the Yorkists could only make their claim good through gaining political support and through force of arms, but when they made their genealogical argument, they did it using the best claim available to them, which was through Anne. --Jfruh (talk) 17:37, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Also (and perhaps this better answers your question) it was only the Yorkists who were descended from Anne who actually claimed the throne. After Anne died, her widower Richard participated in the Southampton Plot to overthrow Henry V, but the aim of that plot had been to put Anne's brother Edmund, not a Yorkist, on the throne. (They did so without Edmund's consent and the plot was actually unraveled when Edmund reported it to the King.) The first Yorkist to stake a claim on the throne was Anne and Richard's son, Richard of York. So it doesn't make sense to say "her marriage and line of descent strengthened the Yorkist claim to the throne," because the Yorkists didn't have or make a claim to the throne until after she had married into the family. Jfruh (talk) 18:09, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Anne de Mortimer


text:
.es

.es (españa) is the country code top-level domain (ccTLD) for Spain. It is administered by the Network Information Centre of Spain.

Registrations are permitted at the second level or at the third level beneath various generic second level categories. Some qualifications and restrictions apply to third-level registrations depending on which second-level domain they are within. Second-level registrations have had some limitations including requiring registrants to have a connection with Spain, but these restrictions were lifted in a multi-stage process completed by the end of 2005, at which point registrations at the second level of .es were open to anybody worldwide.

The .es domain does not have a conventional WHOIS server operating on port 43, but WHOIS queries can be made using a page on ESNIC's website.

Second-level domains
There also exist a number of second-level domains:
 * .com.es - open to all applicants (intended for commercial entities)
 * .nom.es - open to all applicants (intended for personal names)
 * .org.es - open to all applicants (intended for noncommercial organizations)
 * .gob.es - for governmental entities
 * .edu.es - for educational institutions

Alternatives
Until the liberalization in November 2005, registering in .es was expensive and encumbered compared to other ccTLDs. The second-level word had to be either a trade mark valid in Spain, the exact name of the registering business or association, or the first name and at least the first surname of the registering individual. Common words and placenames were unregisterable. There was also a requirement of a minimum of three characters in the name, though some exceptions like hp.es (Hewlett-Packard Spain) and pp.es (People's Party) were allowed. As an alternative many Spanish organizations registered under .com, .org or .net.

Usage
Although very popular in Spain for its intended use, .es has been used for domain hacks such as geociti.es, a website mirroring Geocities; adspac.es, a mobile-based advertising firm; thelettervsixtim.es, for the game VVVVVV; and iTun.es for iTunes Ping URL shortening.

title: .es


text:
Holalkere

Holalkere is a town and taluk headquarters located near Chitradurga in the Indian state of Karnataka.

Places of worship
The town has a temple to the deity Ganesha and was established in 1475 CE by Guthyappa Nayaka. The temple contains Ganesha's monolithic statue, which is about 6 m (20 ft) tall. According to local legends, if one worships Ganesha's statue with true devotion, their wishes will be fulfilled. Leela Visranti Dhama, the burial site of late Sri Mallikarjuna Murugharajendra Swamiji at Holalkere is developing into a tourist spot due to the efforts of the present Seer Sri Shivamurthy Sharanaru of Chitradurga.

Ontikallu matha
Senior Muruga Rajendra Swami, who died on 8 August 1994, requested that his remains be buried beside the Ontikallu Matha near Holalkere. Today, a sprawling park exists here with blooming plants and trees covering 15 acres (61,000 m2), along with a fruit garden on a 40-acre (162,000 m2) plot beside the Leela Visranti Vana (at a cost of Rs 5 crores). The burial, designed in the Sharana style, was built at the cost of Rs 3 crores. A Sharana Smaranotsava is arranged in January every year to pay tribute to the late Swamiji, and to recall the silent revolution that changed ordinary people's lives by the twelfth-century humanists led by Basavanna.

Regional
There are 4 hobli headquarters in the taluk called Bharmannaikanadurga, Kasaba, Talya and Ramgiri.

Talikatte is a village of Ramgiri hobli which has a locally famous temple called "Kariyamma Devi Temple", it is a popular hotspot for devotees, with many of them coming from the state of Karnataka.Talikatte, is one of the villages of this taluk. It has a major population of nearly more than 10,000.

Spandana Global Foundation is situated at Kalkere Lambani Hatti Shivamoga-Chitradurga road, from the city 15 kilometers. NGOs' activities are to give education, Health, Employment, Training to Society through Karnataka State.

Murada is situated at Holalkere, Davanagere road, from the city 2 kilometers. NGOs' activities are building the poor people institutions like self-help groups and watershed activities like World bank assisted Sujala watershed project implementation and giving training on different activities. Talikatte is the biggest village in the taluk. According to the 2011 census, it had a population of 5829 people.

Geography
Holalkere is located at 14.03°N, 76.18°W. It has an average elevation of 711 metres (2332 feet).

Chikkandavadi village is 4 km from Chikjajur. It is famous for progressive Arecanut crop growers and large areas covered by Arecanut plantation. It also had access to the train.

"The major part of taluk falls under semi malnad(Aree Malenadu) with Arecanut and coconut plantations and semi-arid forest with bushy trees widely spread around Madikeri Pura, Mincheri, Bhemasamudra, holalkere kavalu, HD Pura", making it as trans malnad and link to dry land.

Demographics
India census, Holalkere had a population of 14,571. Males constitute 52% of the population and females 48%. Holalkere has an average literacy rate of 73%, which is lower than the national average of 77.7%: male literacy is 79%, and female literacy is 66%. In Holalkere, 11% of the population is under 6 years of age.

Public attractions
Holalkere: 32 km from Chitradurga and taluk headquarters, this was an important Jain settlement in the 10th century A.D. It is also famous for its nine-foot-high statue of the child-god Baal Antipathy, built by Gallops NAACO.

Malladihalli: 45 km from Chitradurga, and 6 km from Holalkere, towards Shimoga. This new village is well known for the Raghavendra Swamy Seva Ashram that runs an orphanage, Yoga education, and Ayurvedic Centre.

Ramagiri: This place is known for the Veerabhadraswamy temple and the Karisiddeshwara Mutt, built on a hillock.

Doddahotterangappa's hill: The Ranganathaswamy temple is situated on top of a hill.

title: Holalkere


text:
Korolev (lunar crater)

Korolev is a large lunar impact crater of the walled plain or basin type. It is a basin of Nectarian age.

Korolev is named for Soviet rocket engineer Sergei Korolev. It lies on the far side of the Moon, and the northern part of its floor crosses the lunar equator. Notable nearby craters include Galois just to the southeast, Das to the south-southeast, Doppler attached to the southern rim, and Kibal'chich to the northeast. Rays of the crater Crookes (to the southwest) cover parts of the basin.

The outer rim of Korolev is heavily worn and eroded, with a multitude of small craters lying across the wide rim and the low inner wall. The interior floor is relatively flat compared to the surrounding terrain, but is pock-marked with many craters of varying sizes. The most notable of these interior craters are Korolev M in the southern part of the floor, and Korolev D next to the northeast rim.

Within the interior of Korolev is the remains of a second, inner ring. This is roughly half the diameter of the outer wall, and is the most intact in the eastern half. Here it forms a curving arc of ridges across the floor. At the midpoint of the formation, there is nothing resembling a central peak. However the craters Korolev B, Korolev T, and Korolev L lie within the diameter of the inner ring.

A small crater to the southwest of Korolev L was a designated control point, CP-1, during the Apollo 8 mission. Measurements taken from orbit on this point improved the accuracy of mapping of the lunar far side, although they were likely surpassed by subsequent Apollo missions.

Until formal naming in 1970 by the IAU, the crater was known as Basin XV.

Korolev lies to the south of the similar-sized Dirichlet-Jackson Basin.

Satellite craters
By convention these features are identified on lunar maps by placing the letter on the side of the crater midpoint that is closest to Korolev.

title: Korolev (lunar crater)


text: Category:Figure skaters at the 1980 Winter Olympics


text:
Assist

Assist or ASSIST may refer to:

Sports

 * Assist (association football), a pass by a player or players that helps set up a goal
 * Assist (Australian rules football), the last pass by a player that directly helps set up a goal
 * Assist (baseball), any touching of the ball by a defensive player after it has been hit by the batter and prior to the recording of a putout
 * Assist (basketball), a pass by a player that facilitates a basket by another
 * Assist (ice hockey), a pass by a player or players that helps set up a goal
 * Assist (ultimate), a pass by a player on which a goal is scored
 * Assist (water polo), the last pass by a player that directly helps set up a goal

Other uses

 * ASSIST (computing), Assembler System for Student Instruction and Systems Teaching
 * Assist (Scientology), Scientology practices
 * ASSIST (student exchange organization), American Secondary Schools for International Students and Teachers
 * Seoul Business School at aSSIST University, a Korean business schools with several international campuses

title: Assist


text: Category:Polish computer scientists

title: Category:Polish computer scientists


text: Category:Plasma physics

title: Category:Plasma physics


text:
Category:1980 Winter Olympics

__NOGALLERY__

title: Category:1980 Winter Olympics


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vote bondsac

Vote bondsac was proposed for deletion. This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was delete

Silly Google-bombing campaign that didn't even work, In-joke for a couple of blogs. 39 Google hits (attempts made to remove wiki from results, not entirely successful). Everyking's edit summary from April reports 3 Google hits at the time. Delete please. - RedWordSmith 19:12, 26 Sep 2004 (UTC)

 * Delete nonsnese. RickK 19:35, Sep 26, 2004 (UTC)
 * Merge/redirect to Google bomb. Or just delete. Not notable.   — Gwalla | Talk 19:38, 26 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. Non-notable nonsense. Spatch 21:51, 26 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete, do not merge. Thue | talk 22:55, 26 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. Everyking 12:10, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete: non-encyclopaedic nonsense. Jongarrettuk 22:29, 30 Sep 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. If whoever wrote this can't tell us more who Bondsac was, then it isn't worth it. Dieter Simon 22:34, 3 Oct 2004 (UTC)

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like other '/delete' pages is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion or on the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.


text:
User:Uttam h

= WELCOME ಸುಸ್ವಾಗತ =

{| width="450px"
 * Name:
 * Uttam H
 * Location:
 * Bangalore and Mangalore, India
 * Age:
 * 24
 * Birthday:
 * June 29, 1982
 * Zodiac sign:
 * Cancer
 * URL
 * http://www.geocities.com/uttam_hin
 * Gender:
 * Male
 * On wikipedia since:
 * September 30, 2004
 * URL
 * http://www.geocities.com/uttam_hin
 * Gender:
 * Male
 * On wikipedia since:
 * September 30, 2004
 * On wikipedia since:
 * September 30, 2004

title: User:Uttam h


text: User talk:24.19.167.184

title: User talk:24.19.167.184


text:
Talk:Deinococcus radiodurans

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Ana Gallego Cortés.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 19:14, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Heat resistance
Where's the evidence that it is resistant to heat? I've read that it is resistant to cold but not to heat.
 * I see no evidence that it is, nor is there anything in reference no. 6 that indicates this. The sentence by the below poster is not found in that article.  We use heat to kill it.  Other species of Deinococcus *are* thermophilic but not this one.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.39.115.49 (talk) 22:12, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
 * I have removed "heat" from the first line. Please source your evidence if you revert.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.39.115.49 (talk) 22:19, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

The link in reference no. 5 is incorrect.

 * I think that you meant the PMID in reference no. 6, which I have just fixed. The organism is resistant to all forms of stress, including dessication and heat. Reference no. 1 has information on this. I had to fix the PMID for that reference as well. --Ben Best 00:23, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

I'll have to contact someone to find the links to relevant research but IIRC the heat resistance of D. radiodurans was evidenced by its reaction to dessication. They were able to heat it to a high degree evaporating most of the liquid (dessication) and when it was re-introduced to fluids it re-hydrated with very little/no genetic disruption. This is not true of most single cell structures. For example blood has to be kept fluid (and cold) and cannot be stored in a powdered form. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JMBattista (talk • contribs) 05:22, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

Martian origins?
Should there be any mention about potentially Martian origins? There's a BBC article about that here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6191197.stm
 * Maybe, but it's uncertain. I do agree that most likely panspermia happened between Earth, Mars, and some other planet/moon.137.118.105.152 (talk) 20:54, 20 February 2019 (UTC)

Removed statement
I have removed the statement: " Certain scientists are trying to implement genes into D. radiodurans that will cause its protein to disable metals with which they come into contact. In doing so, this bacterium may be able to metabolize heavy metals such as plutonium, uranium, and other radioactive metals into harmless matter. " This cannot be correct. Radioactive materials do not lose their radioactivity through chemical processes.

 * Actually what happens is the radioactive metal is reduced or is caused to form a compound. The resulting product, while still radioactive, becomes insoluble and easier to sequester.  So it's true that the metals are metabolized, but false that they become harmless.  Ask google about nuclear bioremediation for some links.Viracocha (talk) 22:18, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

DNA repair in other species
In several locations within this article, the DNA repair capability of D. radiodurans is described as "unique". This is not the case. The process of repairing a DSB is common, what is unique however, is the accuracy (lack of errors) of the process in D. radiodurans compared to other prokaryotes, such as E. coli. See the below paper. The radioresistance of D. radiodurans is more likely attributable to the protection of its proteome by ROS scavenging. (which protects the DNA repair machinery, making it less error prone than in E. coli). --Appelflappenn (talk) 15:00, 29 April 2021 (UTC)

I've removed this statement:

Some have speculated that mechanisms of DNA repair used by D. radiodurans could be incorporated into the genome of higher species as a means of rejuvenation.

I don't know of anyone who suggests that possibility, and the referenced article certainly doesn't. The special repair mechanism would require multiple copies of each chromosome to be stacked on top of each other, which I can't imagine would be feasible in eukaryotes due to the more complicated chromosome structure. But feel free to add it back if you find a better reference.Viracocha (talk) 22:18, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

Info on bacterium?
Where does it live, how big is it, what does it do all day? AxelBoldt (talk) 23:47, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

And, what -does- kill it? high enough heat to decompose the organic molecules has to at some point, but anything short of holding it in a flame? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.116.67.106 (talk) 05:06, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Just out of curiosity, is D. radiodurans potentially harmful to humans or any other animals? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.192.149.119 (talk) 22:37, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
 * No, there aren't any known pathogenic extremophiles. Viracocha (talk) 22:18, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

Transliteration of the name
Previous version: 'terrifying berry that withstands radiation'

The Greek deinos can mean terrifying or marvellous, as in deinos legein (marvellous in speaking) but marvellous is more likely for the bacterium, we marvel at it's resistance rather than being scared of it.

Aksel89 (talk) 08:16, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

 * Please read talk page. δεινός doesn't exclusively mean terrifying.

 * See |en|%CE%B4%CE%B5%CE%B9%CE%BD%CF%8C%CF%82 here for translations of deinos which include "awesome" and |el|terrible here for the Greek adjective "terrible". Aksel89 (talk) 06:40, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Viability for amount of grays? Not for amount of gray per day?
D. radiodurans is capable of withstanding an instantaneous dose of up to 5,000 Gy with no loss of viability Point of improvement: Does viability not mean that it can survive under constant irradiation? So shouldn't the unit be how much gray per time unit? (Also, viability does not get me a link to an article) 88.159.73.156 (talk) 22:42, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

"consuming" heavy metals

 * Deinococcus has been genetically engineered for use in bioremediation to consume and digest solvents and heavy metals, even in a highly radioactive site.

Could a knowledgeable editor rephrase this so it doesn't sound like it's able to actually destroy heavy metal atoms? Comet Tuttle (talk) 19:53, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Evolution
An article about a bacterial species can never be complete without a description or an account of its evolution. How does DR's genome contribute to its survival and how did it evolve? Wayne Hardman (talk) 01:25, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

Laboratory simulation of interplanetary ultraviolet radiation
Laboratory simulation of interplanetary ultraviolet radiation (broadspectrum) and its effects on Deinococcus radiodurans:. BatteryIncluded (talk) 22:07, 23 September 2012 (UTC)

Deinococcus radiodurans has the unique ability to repair DNA
Deinococcus Radiodurans is a species of bacteria capable of repairing DNA and in the absence of this gene, the bacteria can still repair DNA damage, but will not grow. Deinococcus radiodurans can withstand an acute ino radiation of 5,000 Gy. Lý Lượng Tử (talk) 06:32, 1 May 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Deinococcus radiodurans


text:
Artivism

Artivism is a portmanteau word combining art and activism, and is sometimes also referred to as Social Artivism.

History
The term artivism in US English has its roots in a 1997 gathering of Chicano artists from East Los Angeles and the Zapatistas in Chiapas, Mexico. The words "Artivist" and "Artivism" were then popularized through a variety of events, actions and artworks via artists and musicians such as Quetzal, Ozomatli, and Mujeres de Maiz, among other East Los Angeles artists, and at spaces such as Self Help Graphics & Art.

Artivism further developed as antiwar and anti-globalization protests emerged and proliferated. In many cases artivists attempt to push political agendas by the means of art, but a focus on raising awareness of social, environmental, and technological problems is also common.

Besides using traditional mediums like film and music to raise awareness or push for change, an artivist can also be involved in culture jamming, subvertising, street art, spoken word, protesting, and activism. Since 2013, Cromoactivismo, a Brazilian group of women artists, works with collectives, groups and schools in direct actions using color for social change.

Artivist Eve Ensler stated: "... This passion has all the ingredients of activism, but is charged with the wild creations of art. Artivism—where edges are pushed, imagination is freed, and a new language emerges altogether.' Bruce Lyons has written: '... artivism ... promotes the essential understanding that ... [humans] ... can, through courageous creative expression, experience the unifying power of love when courage harnesses itself to the task of art + social responsibility."

By 2005, the term had made its way into academic writing when Slovenian theatre scholar Aldo Milohnic used the term to discuss "autonomous ('alter-globalist', social) movements in Slovenia that attracted wide attention. In carrying out their political activity they made use of protests and direct actions, thereby introducing the 'aesthetic', willingly or not". In 2008, Chela Sandoval and Guisela Latorre published a piece on Chicano/a artivism and M. K. Asante using the term in reference to Black artists.

There is a chapter on artivism in the book It's Bigger Than Hip Hop by M. K. Asante. Asante writes of the artivist:'' "The artivist (artist + activist) uses their artistic talents to fight and struggle against injustice and oppression—by any medium necessary. The artivist merges commitment to freedom and justice with the pen, the lens, the brush, the voice, the body, and the imagination. The artivist knows that to make an observation is to have an obligation."

The impact of artivism vs. conventional activism was tested in a public scientific experiment in Copenhagen, Denmark, in 2018. The results, reported in the journal of Social Movement Studies, suggest that artivism may be more effective than conventional activism.

Artivists
Notable artivists and self-identified artist-activists include:

 * Above
 * Ai Weiwei
 * Aja Monet
 * Aloe Blacc
 * Annie Sprinkle
 * Anomie Belle
 * Banksy
 * Bleepsgr
 * Bordalo II
 * Daniel Arzola
 * David Wojnarowicz
 * Deborah De Robertis
 * Deeyah Khan
 * Donald "C-Note" Hooker
 * Ernest Zacharevic
 * Favianna Rodriguez
 * Fredericka Foster
 * Gianluca Costantini
 * Guillermo Gómez-Peña
 * JoFF Rae
 * JR
 * Jeanmarie Simpson
 * Judy Baca
 * Julio Salgado
 * Kwame Akoto-Bamfo
 * Las Cafeteras
 * Lila Downs
 * Lost Children of Babylon
 * Lydia Canaan
 * Lynnette Haozous
 * Martha Gonzalez
 * Marina DeBris
 * Martin Aveling
 * Maya Jupiter
 * Michel Platnic
 * Milo Moiré
 * Norm Magnusson
 * Pavel 183
 * Peter Joseph
 * Quetzal (band)
 * Qween Jean
 * Reverend Billy and the Church of Stop Shopping
 * Sabo_(street_artist)
 * Saul Williams
 * Self Help Graphics & Art
 * Tania Bruguera
 * Tinkebell
 * Valie Export
 * Walela Nehanda
 * Weapons of Mass Creation
 * Will St Leger

Collectives and organizations
Artivists often work in interdisciplinary collectives that are stand-alone' or operate as a creative part of the greater activist groups, such as Gran Fury of AIDS Coalition to Unleash Power (ACT UP). Other groups include:
 * Artivist Film Festival
 * Crass
 * Da! collective
 * The Fearless Collective
 * Gran Fury
 * Guerrilla Girls
 * Sol Collective
 * The Yes Men

title: Artivism


text: File:Deep Purple - Burn.jpeg

title: File:Deep Purple - Burn.jpeg