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Talk:Norodom Sihanouk

Untitled
Well, I don't know how it is handled in Cambodia, but in other monarchies kings/queens retain the style "His/Her Majesty" when they abdicate. Gugganij 23:30, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I'm sure the late Princess Juliana of the Netherlands would dispute that with you. john k 01:22, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

 * I thought the late Queen Juliana retained her titel and her style as well, like the Queen Mum (officially known as HM Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother). The BBC referred to Juliana as Queen Juliana. Gugganij 19:54, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

 * Juliana and her mother reverted to the style of princess,but normally it has been different (Léopold III of Belgium became "His Majesty King Léopold III" when he ceased to be "His Majesty the King of the Belgians", for example).I think the wider issue here is whether the article should treat the King's announcement of his abdication as having taken legal effect just yet in the absence of legal provision for it to do so.--L.E./12.144.5.2/le@put.com

 * Thanks for the information. As far as the later point is concerned, I agree. Gugganij 22:15, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

How can you know that Norodom Sihanouk has officially abdicated, there is no official document that I know of stating this... Even his son, Rannaridh has asked his father to reconsider his decision... So as long this is pending (unless Norodom Sihanouk confirms his decision) he is technically the King of Cambodia squash 01:19, Oct 10, 2004 (UTC)

After previous abdications he reverted to being a Prince so the precedent is set in Cambodia. His successor has been proclaimed by the throne conuncil so the abdication is evidently "legal"AndyL 18:01, 16 Oct 2004 (UTC)

As for the "Queen Mum" she never abdicated because she was never Queen regnant. Look instead at Edward VIII who ceased being King Edward when he abdicated. AndyL 18:02, 16 Oct 2004 (UTC)

just two cents
Although I'm not aware of all the subtlties myself, I do know that throughout Cambodian history it has been a fairly common occurance to have more than one king at a time. Sometimes there was a Great King with other kings or sub-king sort of people, close relations usually, to have charge over specific areas. This tradition of a Grand king and lesser king may be similar to what exists now with Sihanouk and Sihamoni. It is certain though that at Sihamoni's blessing and investiture as king he was never actually crowned or enthroned in the traditional Khmer way. NguyenHue 02:20, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)NguyenHue

Title
His title right now is Samdech Euv (Father King). Though it's not the full, entire, formal version of his title. It's just what people of Cambodia refer to him now. --Dara 02:03, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)

New Category
Is it possible to create a new category for the Royal Family of Cambodia? There is one for the Monarchs of Cambodia (Category:Cambodian_monarchs), but it is only a list of kings. There are other members of the royal family of Cambodia that have their own entry here but they are aren't or were never kings. It would very convienient if there was a list of all of them on one page. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sirik_Matak http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norodom_Ranariddh

And I may add future entries for Bopha Devi (Buppha Devi), Queen Norodom Monineath, the late Sisowath Kossamak Nearireath, plus others. So grouping them all in one category may help those that are interested about the royal family of Cambodia. --Dara 02:11, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * Hello Dara, I crrated some categories for members of the Royal family at Category:Royal_Family_of_Cambodia which consists of:

 * Category:Cambodian monarchs e.g. Norodom Sihamoni Norodom Sihanouk Norodom Suramarit
 * Category:Cambodian princes e.g. Sirik Matak Norodom Ranariddh
 * Category:Cambodian princesses e.g. Bopha Devi
 * Category:Cambodian queens e.g. Norodom Monineath, Sisowath Kossamak

I see that you which I have a list of all of them on one page, I agree with you. But some people they might not agree and they go and change it. Squash 09:40, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Offsprings...
Can someone put up a list of Norodom Sihanouk's children? There are many, but I don't know exactly how many there are. I just know of Arun Rasmy, Sihamoni, Narindrdarapong (recently deceased), Ranariddh, and Bopha Devi.--Dara 23:00, July 12, 2005 (UTC)

POV issues???
Does anybody else see any POV issues here. I've just read through the entire article. Upon first reading, it seems very skewed towards giving an overly positive view of Sihanouk. For example the last paragraph talks about a "lifetime of fighting for independance for Cambodia". I've done a fair amount of study and concur with many who believe that Sihanouk is a very shrewd politician but overall a very inept leader. It seems he has spent a lifetime fighting to make sure that he gets/keeps power. The article puts a postivie slant on every area of Sihanouk's life and mentions nothing about Sihanouk's many, many failures. --WilliamThweatt 22:53, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Make any changes that you feel are justified, and NPOV. However, let's keep some sense of proportion: the failures of Sihanouk are nothing in comparison with the horrors of the Khmer Rouge. Also, perhpas Sihanouk has "spent a lifetime fighting to make sure that he gets/keeps power", but so have Roosevelt or Churchil in their own countries. Nothing particularly special about it. Finally, most Cambodians remember fondly Sihanouk's regime (at least those old enough to have lived before 1970), a time of relative peace and prosperity compared to what followed after 1970, so his leadership skills must not have been so totally bad after all. I am not a Sihanouk's apologist, but just hopping we avoid the extremes of presenting Sihanouk as either a perfect leader, or a real-evil-not-yet-uncovered. PS: I wrote only the linguistic/etymology part of this article, nothing else. Hardouin 13:38, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree about the sense of proportion. A politician is, afterall, just a politician no matter what country you look at.  I was in no way saying that Sihanouk was "evil", as you put it.  I'm just saying this article seems overly positive toward him.  I'm sure that after the horrors of the Khmer Rouge, it's easy to look back to the "good-ole-days" when Sihanouk reigned with nostalgia.  However, his independent reign lasted from the early '50's to 1970, just over 15 years.  While this may have been a time of relative peace and prosperity (key word being "relative"), Sihanouk probably had very little to do with it.  He writes in his own memoirs that he was not concerned about affairs of state and spent this time carousing after women and obsessing over his own movie production company, while various factions (Son Ngoc Thanh, the Khmer Rouge, etc) manuevered to overthrow him.  At best it can be said that Sihanouk was coasting on the foundations and bureaucracy that the French laid down and it was inevitable that he would run them into the ground and loose his country.  Since 1970, he continues to constantly switch allegiances to which ever side will allow him to keep a public face.  As I said earlier, a very shrewd politician, but overall, an inept leader.  Some good sources are his own memoirs, David Chandler's A History of Cambodia and Milton Osborne's Sihanouk.--WilliamThweatt 23:34, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

 * It wasn't just since 1970 that he switched allegiances. He has done that during his entire public life. During the "good-ole-days" he would tack back and forth between left and right politicians at home...and the communists and non-communist blocks overseas. He preserved his own position by playing everyone inside and outside cambodia off against each other. The guy is a master manipulator and his memoirs should not be trusted at face value. His political "system" could only last as long as he could balance the left against the right. As to "peace and prosperity", it was never what it seemed. Many people's impression of the country was based on what they saw (the capital) rather than the country as a whole. 205.188.116.199 06:23, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

citations for material removed as "unsourced nonsense"
These are citations for a number of recent edits that whose accuracy was questioned and which were removed from the page. I'm giving citations from Philip Short's "Pol Pot: anatomy of a nightmare". The source is well-regarded, widely available and has extensive footnotes.

 * For an account of Pol Pot sending Sihanouk to the UN in during the Vietnamese invasion, See (Short p. 396, 402-404).

 * For an account of Pol Pot's attempt to seek political asylum in the US, his rejection by the US, France/etc and the eventual deal struck where China took him, See (Short. p. 403)

 * Hun Sen's being an ex-Khmer Rouge official is well-known.

 * For an account of Sihanouk's resignation in 1976, see (Short p. 334)

205.188.116.199 06:16, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
 * For an account of Sihanouk's lifestyle in Cambodia during the rule of the Khmer Rouge (air conditioning, his deserts) see (Short p. 335)

I very strongly object to the use of Short as the sole source for the accounts of Sihanouk's resignation. Short is far from "well-regarded" and his "extensive footnotes" are primarily interviews with former Khmer Rouge officials. Short barely has a working knowledge of spoken Khmer and doesn't even read Khmer. His book is seen by most as one-sided and contrary to history. Here's an extract of a review by Yale University: I reverted to the historically accepted version and included Short's "version" as an alternative account in a separate paragraph. I am tempted to remove all material taken from Short, as it is not reliable, but I will wait and see what others may think.--WilliamThweatt 15:40, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
 * "Short is unable to read Khmer and keeps a distance from Cambodian victims. From his faulty pronunciation advice to his reliance on Khmer Rouge sources, Short's use of evidence at a remove does not stand up to scrutiny. There are too many factual errors to list, but more often he ignores existing documentation to privilege the unprovable." (see whole review here)

 * I strongly disagree with you on several points.

 * First, the book has been very positively reviewed by others. For example, David Chandler who is at least as credible as Ben Kiernan and had his review published by a much more mainstream publication. . David Chandler has the following to say about Short's sources and footnotes: "Mr. Short has made excellent use, for example, of Vietnamese, Chinese and French archives that were largely inaccessible to me. He has also profited from the newfound volubility of many former Khmer Rouge cadres who, since the demise of the movement in the late 1990s, have become eager to talk about their part in it - perhaps to sidestep their culpability for its horrors."

 * You have wrongly attributed the Kiernan review to Yale University. It is no such thing. The author is a professor at Yale and has used a website at Yale, but that review is from the Times Higher Education Supplement. The obscurity of his platform says itself something about the review. Kiernan is a very controversal figure based on his actions in the 1970s and the political viewpoint he brings to all his work. His most solid objections to Short are (unfortunately) related to the historical dispuates between the Vietnamese Communist Party and the Khmer Rouge. The flaws that Ben Kiernan lists are all to do with promoting the idea that Vietnam was always the friend of Cambodia and that the Cambodians involved in the Viet Minh in the 1950s were independent of Vietnam. Ben Kiernan's review is so obviously political and so obviously wrong in its thin case against Short that I find it difficult to take seriously. I further personally find Mr. Kiernan to be a utterly disgusting individual based on what he wrote and did in the 1970s with regard to Cambodia. He is an opportunist of the first order who suddenly changed his mind when it was far too late and then made a career for himself attacking what he had previously supported. In that regard, he shares much in common with Sihanouk.

To give an idea of what Mr. Keirnan is about, this is a quote from him in 1979. "(explaining why he was wrong) The brutal authoritarian trend within the revolutionary movement after 1973 was not simply a grass-roots reaction, and expression of popular outrage at the killing and destruction of the countryside by U.S. bombs, although that helped it along decisively. There can be no doubting that the evidence also points clearly to a systematic use of violence against the population by that chauvinist section of the revolutionary movement that was led by Pol Pot. In my opinion this violence was employed in the service of a nationalist revivalism that had little concern for the living conditions of the Khmer people, or the humanitarian socialist ideals that had inspired the broader Kampuchian Revolutionary movement." He was a supporter of the Khmer Rouge, an apologist for Vietnam's occupation of Cambodia and I don't find his criticism credible considering he makes broad claims about Short and then backs none of them up.

 * Can you produce a less controverisal/political source that Keirnan that denounces the book. Given Chandler's presence on the other side, your contention that the book is "seen by most" doesn't seem to hold up at all.

 * You seem to have an objection to the mention of Hun Sen's membership in the Khmer Rouge. Please elaborate on why you refuse to allow it to be mentioned on the page.

 * Please present your sources for your account of his 1976 resignation. What specifically is the source for the claim that he was forced to resign.

 * Please present sources that explain why Short's account of events in New York in 1976 was wrong or inaccurate or even offer an alternative view of what happened.

 * Please present an explaination or a source to explain why Short's description of Sihanouk's lifestyle in Cambodia which comes from the works of Sihanouk himself is wrong or inaccurate.

168.127.0.51 19:26, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

 * Hmmm, Ben Kiernan is probably the most respected figure in European/North American academia who works on Cambodia.

 * That the descriptions of Sihanouk's lifestyle in Cambodia originate with himself are reason enough to doubt their historical accuracy.

 * Oh, and by the way, the Times Higher Educational Supplement is anything but obscure. The THES "is essential reading for academics and researchers in tertiary, higher and post- graduate education. It reports on and debates the latest developments in the international academic community. Every week the THES’s international news features and opinion pages report and analyse everything from academic research and training to government policy, information technology and industry links. The letters pages provide a further platform for open discussion. There are up to twelve pages of book reviews, focusing on a different subject area each week."

 * It is home to significant book reviews on academic works, and where controversial topics are thrashed out between academics. It is an honour for an academic to have their book review published in the THES.  Cripipper 21:54, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

 * Ben Kiernan is a controversial figure because of his vocal support for the Khmer Rouge in the 1970s. Even after they fell, he continued to claim that humanitarian socialist goals had inspired the broader Khmer Rouge movement. As a controverial figure with a strong political view. Using him as the sole source to discredit and denounce Philip Short's work is not acceptable.

 * Your "logic" that we should distrust Sihanouk's own account of how he lived under the Khmer Rouge is beyond sense. A man who writes, while his country is starving about shortages of Rum for his deserts should be taken at face value.

 * As far as book reviews go, the THES is a backwater. The purpose of the THES isn't hostile book reviews or debates about the history of Southeast Asia. Ben Kiernan's "review" is sloppy, makes sweeping claims he doesn't offer any support for and would not be accepted for publication in many other places.

 * But back to the main point, David Chandler who is a published historian of at least equal weight to Kiernan wrote a very positive review of the book. So the claim that Kiernan in his review is speaking for all historians or even most historians cannot be maintained. 205.188.116.199 01:16, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

 * Well, I'm back from a short Wikibreak and I see the conversation has carried on nicely. First of all, I've never said anything about Hun Sen, it is well known that he was Khmer Rouge.  Likewise, I'm not too concerned about Sihanouk's lifestyle. Knowing his proclivaties, there's no doubt he tried to lead as lavish and careless a personal lifestyle that he possibly could.  However, I'd like to redirect the discussion to my main point.  While I have read all of Chandler's books and deeply respect his work, he isn't infalible, and his praise of Short is misplaced, or at best, better condisered in light of Short's main topic, Pol Pot.  I will admit that Short's book is well-researched (though one-sidedly so) regarding Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge (and, where praised by others, it's just for the depth of interviews with former Khmer Rouge...his conclusions are controversial and rejected by most).  My objections are not with his content is this area.  My main objection is with using Short as source for Sihanouk as Sihanouk's life was neither the topic of his book nor his research.  Expecially suspicious are his accounts of Sihanouk's "resignation" and the "deal" between China and the US.  Anybody who believes that, under the Khmer Rouge regime, Sihanouk was in a posistion to voluntarily resign (or do just about anything else for that matter) is just ignoring the facts.  Likewise, Sihanouk had always had good relations with Bejing, it didn't require a deal with the US to allow him to remain there.  Sihanouk had courted Bejing's favor since probably the early 60s (if not earlier) to counter Soviet influence in Vietnam.  And here are just a few of the other that gave this book a negative review:

 * Nayan Chanda - Washington Post
 * Warren I. Cohen - Los Angeles Times
 * Scott McLemee - Chicago Tribune
 * Elizabeth Becker - Boston Globe

 * I could list many, many more if these aren't enough for you. If these specific events transpired the way Short claims, you should be able to provide other sources, especially ones directly related to the topic (Sihanouk), especially considering the amount of books that have been written about him.--WilliamThweatt 20:27, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

Silly details
"Sihanouk continued to live in luxury in Cambodia after he resigned. He was provided with an air-conditioned residence and complained in his memoirs from the period about running low on rum for his bananes flambles desert." That second sentence adds nothing to the article, and actually sounds a bit silly. So his luxury residence was air-conditioned - so what? He ran out of rum for desert - come on.... this is an encyclopedia. Silly details like this have no part in a biographical article. Patiwat 01:12, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
 * though Wikifans want very much for this to be an encyclopedia... your point suggests that in fact it is something other. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.79.62.19 (talk) 06:59, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm sure that to Americans living in the South of the USA 'air-conditioning' is the height of opulence and something only the most Neronic dictators and Kings luxuriate in, symbolizing their selfish anti-democratic decadence ! Claverhouse (talk) 17:17, 27 December 2021 (UTC)

Political Views?
I am wondering about his political position. Seems to alternate between pro and anti-left (China?). He gets first installed, then deposed by the Khmer Rouge, and, after being re-installed as king in 1993, seeks medical treatment in Beijing and takes up residence in Pyongyang. Both China and North Korea didn't strike me as very monarchy-supporting, generally speaking. Maybe someone could elaborate on his (many?) political positions over time? -- megA (talk) 19:37, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

 * Sihanouk was originally appointed ruler of Cambodia by Vichy France in 1941, presumably because they thought he was safely pro-French. The only time it mattered what his political views were was when he was in power in the 1960s. He refused aid from the U.S. from 1962 on, although this had accounted for 15 percent of Cambodia's budget. He thought that if he was anti-American enough, the communists wouldn't bother him. He turned to the Non-Aligned Movement, especially France and India, and the army confiscated massive amounts of rice from the peasants. But these tactics could not replace the refused aid. As the condition of the economy and the army deteriorated, the country became low-hanging fruit. China broke with Russia and Vietnam in 1968 and began sponsoring the Khmer Rouge. After Sihanouk went into exile in 1970, his true colors became clear: He was for sale to whoever offered him the nicest palace. Kauffner (talk) 04:31, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

number of times prime minister
Rulers.org gives him 10 separate terms as prime minister, but we say at the beginning that he had only two. john k (talk) 05:36, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Ancestry
If each group of (8, 10, 28), (16, 20, 24) and (17, 21) indicates the same person, I think they should be properly labeled. --128.122.53.15 (talk) 23:29, 15 October 2012 (UTC)

Foreign Honours
This is a minor matter, but the article Order of the Queen of Sheba says that it was for ladies. J S Ayer (talk) 16:17, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Help with stub: Kingdom of Cambodia (1975-76)
Hello, I noticed there was a gap in the former states of Cambodia so I created Kingdom of Cambodia (1975-76); any help in expanding this stub would be much appreciated. Cheers, walk victor falktalk 04:42, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

On the Title Section
A lot of Cambodia-related biographies, especially for royalty, have excessive translations for titles. I have removed part of it here in a recent edit. This article is not for teaching what every single word in his title means. The problem with this also is that they are literal translations too. I think Wikipedia provides the name in the native language in parenthesis for a reason, that is so that it can be looked up in a dictionary or Wiktionary, if one wanted to learn more about that language. --Dara (talk) 06:12, 20 April 2015 (UTC)

Dap Chhuon plot
"The Tragedy of Cambodian History" by David P. Chandler ISBN 0-300-04919-6; pp. 99-107 "The Sam Sary and Dap Chhuon Plots" - Full source posted by Facebook user: https://www.facebook.com/BhddhiKnowledge/posts/328102793980981

War with the CIA https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/soc.culture.cambodia/bikcCCUVz4g

Removed content

 * Hi, I have removed the following paragraph:

"On November 28, 2012, King Father Norodom Sihanouk was anointed by Royal Decree of HM King Norodom Sihamoni with the title Preah Karuna Preah Norodom Sihanouk Preah Borom Ratanakkot (ព្រះករុណាព្រះនរោត្តម សីហនុ ព្រះបរមរតនកោដ្ឋ) (literally meaning The King who lies in the Diamond Urn)."

I tried to Google search the title in Khmer and English, but no results from credible news agencies (AKP, Kohsanteap, Phnompenhpost etc) turned up on the exact term and date reporting the news. Removing this sentence as per Wiki guideline Citing sources. Would appreciate if any editors can find and provide URL link, book or other reference material to this. Mr Tan (talk) 05:23, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

 * I believe this source should be sufficient. Khmer kings traditionally have up to three different names at different times: 1) their birth name (from the time they're born until they take the throne), then 2) they may take a Regnal name upon being crowned king, then 3) a Posthumous name is often bestowed after their death by the succeeding king. Sihanouk's posthumous name is ព្រះបរមរតនកោដ្ឋ. If you want more sources you can google "ព្រះបរមរតនកោដ្ឋ" and narrow the results to November-December 2012 like this.--William Thweatt TalkContribs 05:55, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

 * Ok, I"ll re-include this in the "Titles" section. I found a Cambodian government source here . Mr Tan (talk) 10:03, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

Works section
Hi, I have removed the list of material from "Works". I am re-pasting the content here below.

I do not feel it would be appropriate to chunk in the whole list of such works into the main article, and I would feel such content would be more appropriate for other sister projects such as Wikisource or Wikibooks. Alternatively, a specialised list article maybe created to accomodate the content below, taking "List of events during the Silver Jubilee of Elizabeth II" as an example. My take is that the content structure of Elizabeth II would be a good example, and all list materials should be created in seperate "list" articles except for references and used book materials in the Bibliography section. One may also refer to Manual of Style/Layout as general guideline. Mr Tan (talk) 10:03, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

 * Traced the article history, this removed section below was added around December 2011. Mr Tan (talk) 10:31, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

Works

 * The position of Cambodia in a dangerous world San Francisco : Asia Foundation, 1958
 * Speech delivered by His Royal Highness Prince Norodom Sihanouk, President of the Council of Ministers on the occasion of the inauguration of the Khmer-American Friendship Highway Phnom-Penh, 1959
 * Ideal, purpose and duties of the Khmer Royal Socialist Youth; interpretation and commentary of the statute of the K. R. S. Y., N.p., c.1960s
 * Address of H.R.H. Norodom Sihanouk, Chief of State of Cambodia [at the] conference of heads of state or government of non-aligned countries. New York: Permanent Mission of Cambodia to the United Nations 1961
 * Address of H.R.H. Prince Norodom Sihanouk, Chief of State of Cambodia to the Asia Society. New York: Permanent Mission of Cambodia to the United Nations 1961
 * Address at the sixteenth session of the General Assembly of the United Nations New York: Permanent Mission of Cambodia to the United Nations 1961
 * Articles published in "Realités cambodgiennes" 22 June – 27 July 1962. Washington, D. C., Royal Cambodian Embassy 1961
 * Speech by Prince Norodom Sihanouk, Head of State, at the opening of the sixth Asian Conference organized by the Society of Friends. [Phnom-Penh] Information 1962
 * Open letter to the international press Phnom Penh: Imprimerie du Ministere de L'Information, 1964
 * Interview with Prince Sihanouk. with William Worthy Phnom Penh: The Ministry of Information, 1965
 * Are we "false neutrals"?: editorial in Kambuja review no. 16; 15 July 1966  Phnom Phen: Head of State's Cabinet, 1966
 * The failure experienced by the United States in their dealings with the "Third World," viewed in the light of Cambodia's own experience, Phnom Penh? 1968
 * Brief notes on national construction in Cambodia Phnom Penh : Impr. Sangkum Reastr Niyum, 1969
 * Message and solemn declaration of Samdech Norodom Sihanouk, Head of State of Cambodia (March 23, 1970). [S.l.]: Royal Government of National Union of Cambodia; New York: Indochina Solidarity Committee, 1970
 * Prince Norodom Sihanouk of Cambodia talks to Americans, Sept.–Oct. 1970. [n. p., 1970
 * Message to American friends by Prince Norodom Sihanouk of Cambodia. [n. p., 1970
 * Letter of Samdech Norodom Sihanouk, Head of State of Cambodia, to their majesties and their excellencies the heads of government of non-aligned countries. [n. p., 1970
 * Cambodia today: an interview with Prince Norodom Sihanouk. (with Ken Coates and Chris Farley) Nottingham, Eng.: Bertrand Russell Peace Foundation, 1970
 * Prince Norodom Sihanouk replies to Mr Norman Kirk M.P., Leader of the Opposition (New Zealand) [New Zealand? : s.n., 1971
 * Prince Norodom Sihanouk of Cambodia speaks; January–February 1971. [S.l. : s.n., 1971
 * Third World liberation: the key: speech to the Algiers summit conference Nottingham, Eng.: Bertrand Russell Peace Foundation, 1973

 * The Cambodian resistance Auckland, Auckland Vietnam Committee, 1973
 * Statements by Prince Norodom Sihanouk, 1965–1973 Washington, Embassy of the Khmer Republic, Press Sectin, 1973
 * War and hope: the case for Cambodia New York, Pantheon Books 1980
 * Prince Sihanouk on Cambodia: interviews and talks with Prince Norodom Sihanouk (with Manola Schier-Oum and Peter Schier) Hamburg: Institut für Asienkunde, 1980
 * The Democratic People's Republic of Korea, seen by Norodom Sihanouk Pyongyang: Foreign Languages Publishing House, 1980

Awards (in category)
Hi, just to inform you, I have removed the categories pertaining to Sihanouk's awards, as I have shifted them to List of honours received by Norodom Sihanouk. There was a category clutter of awards in the past and I created that list page. If you can find any awards concerning Sihanouk, feel free to add them to the list page. (For your reference see the state of clutter in old version at ) Thanks.

(Also posted to User_talk:1982vdven) Mr Tan (talk) 11:25, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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The first paragraph literally repeats the second and third paragraphs of the article
I struggle to understand how did this become a good article by Wikipedia's standards.

Can somebody fix this? --193.34.160.162 (talk) 05:16, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

First sentence of lede
In the very first introduction to this person, how should we present him? The current lede paragraph is

Although I'm not sure, I would think that his composing and filmmaking career is distinctly secondary to his political career, certainly to the wider world outside Cambodia, which is by far most of our readership (in Cambodia, I don't know). It's what he's famous for, and what's most important about him -- by far. (He did have an influence as a patron of the Cambodian pop music movement and Cambodian film industry) So I was suggesting a lede which dispensed with the artistic accomplishments (in the lede paragraph; they can be mentioned later in the article, and in fact there's a whole long section about them). Something like this (although the exact wording isn't important):

An editor who was favoring the existing version averred that "Sihanouk is famous for 'fiddling while Rome burns', some the biggest criticisms against him involve how he was obsessed with the 'artsy stuff' and neglected his responsibilities as King/Prince leading to disaster in the following decades. It's a very relevant part of his biography."

So but the lede doesn't indicate that (the criticism), in fact I don't think its mentioned anywhere in the article. Anyway, colleagues, any thoughts on what a good lede paragraph would be? Herostratus (talk) 09:54, 1 March 2019 (UTC)

 * I'm not sure the 'fiddling while Rome burns' criticisms were ever that significant; Sihanouk was more often accused of political micromanagement than of neglect. Svejk74 (talk) 10:54, 1 March 2019 (UTC)

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 * Sihanouk.jpg

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 15:36, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Khieu Samphan and Norodom Sihanouk.jpg

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 * Statue of King Father Norodom Sihanouk.jpg

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....... 36.37.142.47 (talk) 21:37, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Norodom Sihanouk


text:
1997 MLS expansion draft

The 1997 MLS Expansion Draft was held November 6, 1997. Two teams participated, the Chicago Fire and Miami Fusion F.C., both expansion Major League Soccer clubs starting play in the 1998 season.

Format
Each team in the league made ten players, including at least one foreign player, available for the Fire and Fusion to select. From this pool of available players, the two teams then selected twelve players. Although Paul Caligiuri of the Los Angeles Galaxy was listed as exposed, he had recently won a lawsuit against the league which forced the league to place him with the Galaxy as his original contract with the league had stipulated. Consequently, he was not available for selection. The Fire won the first selection through a coin toss. The draft was held via conference call.

Colorado Rapids

 * Withdrew Sean Henderson upon selection of Matt Kmosko(18)
 * Withdrew Paul Grafer upon selection of Brian Bates (19)
 * Reached maximum upon selection of Steve Patterson (23)

Columbus Crew

 * Withdrew Billy Thompson upon selection of Jason Farrell(7)
 * Withdrew Mike Clark upon selection of Jorge Salcedo (9)
 * Reached maximum upon selection of A.J. Wood (21)

D.C. United

 * Withdrew Scott Garlick upon selection of David Vaudreuil (2)
 * Withdrew Roy Wegerle upon selection of John Maessner (4)
 * Reached maximum upon selection of Kris Kelderman (6)

Dallas Burn

 * Withdrew Eric Dade upon selection of Joey Martinez (8)
 * Withdrew Temoc Suarez upon selection of Jeff Cassar (10)
 * Reached maximum upon selection of Wade Webber (22)

Kansas City Wizards

 * Withdrew Brian Johnson upon selection of Diego Gutierrez (15)

Los Angeles Galaxy

 * Withdrew Harut Karapetyan upon selection of Danny Pena (1)
 * Withdrew Steve Jolley upon selection of Kevin Hartman (3)
 * Reached maximum upon selection of Bryan Taylor (24)

MetroStars

 * Withdrew Brian Bliss upon selection of Manny Lagos (5)
 * Withdrew Jeff Zaun upon selection of Zach Thornton (11)
 * Reached maximum upon selection of Andrew Lewis (17)

New England Revolution

 * Withdrew Steve Klein upon selection of Francis Okaroh (13)

San Jose Clash

 * Withdrew Shawn Medved upon selection of Ramiro Corrales (16)

Tampa Bay Mutiny

 * Withdrew Alan Prampin upon selection of Nelson Vargas (12)
 * Withdrew Sam George upon selection of Cle Kooiman (14)
 * Reached maximum upon selection of Scott Budnick (20)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: 1997 MLS expansion draft


text:
Casiotone

Casiotone was a series of home electronic keyboards made by Casio in the early 1980s. Casio promoted the Casiotone 201 (CT-201) as "the first electronic keyboard with full-size keys that anyone could afford". The name "Casiotone" disappeared from Casio's keyboard catalog when more accurate synthesis technologies became prevalent, but the brand was reused for new models launched in 2019.

The first Casiotone keyboards used a sound synthesis technique known as vowel-consonant synthesis to approximate the sounds of other instruments (albeit not very accurately). Most Casiotone keyboards were small, with miniature keys designed for children's fingers, and were not intended for use by professional musicians; they usually contained a rhythm generator, with several user-selectable rhythm patterns, and often the means to automatically play accompaniments.

Families
The original Casiotone keyboards came in three distinct families, separated by the method of synthesis.

 * The famous VL-Tone VL-1 (1981) uses a method of sound synthesis based on the Walsh function.
 * Keyboards such as the CT-202 (c. 1981) use vowel-Consonant synthesis. The later model of this family, the MT-65, is one of the more well known and sought after models, as it also contains auto-accompaniment drum beats and bass lines.
 * Some other keyboards (such as the MT-35 and MT-45) use a combination of two different binary weighted numbers (1 and 64). The larger weight bit provides the fundamental, and the smaller weight bit provides the harmonic complexity.

The later, more professional range of keyboards, the CZ series (1984–1986), used phase distortion synthesis, which is mathematically almost identical to Yamaha's frequency modulation synthesis, although implemented slightly differently in order to avoid patent infringement.

After the release of the Casio SK-1 in 1985, gradually PCM sample-based tone generators became dominant in Casio's keyboards line. After the 1990s, most Casio keyboards utilized PCM tone generator or its variants.

Some early 1980s models in the PT series of keyboards, such as the PT-30, PT-50, PT-80 and PT-82, were not marketed under the Casiotone name. The name was revived again later for models such as the PT-87 (which is basically the same as the PT-82) which was again sold as Casiotone.

ROM packs

Some models sold from 1983 onwards included a cartridge bay to accept Casio ROM Packs which contained sheet music in a digital format. The keyboards could play the notes automatically, or (with the exception of the PT-50 ) illuminate LEDs above each key to teach the user how to play the song. Most keyboards came with one ROM Pack as standard, but a large number of additional packs, covering a wide range of musical genres, were available to purchase separately. The last ROM Pack model was the CT-840, which came out in 1990.

Users
The low cost and abundance of Casiotone keyboards made them fairly common fixtures in garage rock bands. Musicians and bands known to use Casiotone keyboards include Alexis Taylor of Hot Chip, TG Miller of Black Camaro, Dan Deacon, Lettie, Maurizio Arcieri of Krisma, Kevin Parker of Tame Impala, Turnstyle, Trio, Ozma, Hedluv, and Chiara Lee of Father Murphy.

Relaunch
In 2019, Casio relaunched the series with three new Casiotone keyboards.

title: Casiotone


text: User talk:68.239.230.230

title: User talk:68.239.230.230


text: User talk:68.53.211.84

title: User talk:68.53.211.84


text:
Ubykh people

The Ubykh (Ubykh: Tuex̂ı /tʷɜxɨ/; Убых, Ubyx; Убыхи; Ubıhlar / Vubıhlar) are one of the twelve major Circassian tribes, represented by one of the twelve stars on the green-and-gold Circassian flag. Along with the Natukhai and Shapsug tribes, the Ubykh were one of three coastal Circassian tribes to form the Circassian Assembly (Adyghe: Адыгэ Хасэ) in 1860. Historically, they spoke a distinct Ubykh language, which never existed in written form and went extinct in 1992 when Tevfik Esenç, the last speaker, died.

History
The Ubykh used to inhabit the capital of Circassia, Sache (Circassian: Шъачэ, lit. seaside) — present-day Sochi, Krasnodar Krai, Russia. The province of the Ubykh tribe was situated between the Shapsug tribe near Tuapse and the Sadz (Dzhigets) in the north of Gagra. The Ubykh tribe were mentioned in book IV of Procopius' De Bello Gothico (The Gothic War), under the name βροῦχοι (Bruchi), a corruption of the native term tʷaχ. In the 1667 book of Evliya Çelebi, the Ubykh were mentioned as Ubúr without any other information.

The Ubykh were semi-nomadic horsemen, and had a finely-differentiated vocabulary related to horses and tack. Some Ubykh also practiced favomancy and scapulimancy. However, the Ubykh gained more prominence in modern times. By 1864, during the reign of Tsar Alexander II, the Russian conquest of the Northwestern Caucasus had been completed. The other Circassian tribes and the Abkhaz were decimated, and the Abaza were partially driven out of the Caucasus.

Faced with the threat of subjugation by the Russian army, the Ubykh, as well as other Muslim peoples of Caucasus, left their homeland en masse beginning on 6 March 1864. By May 21, the entire Ubykh nation had departed from the Caucasus. They eventually settled in a number of villages in western Turkey around the municipality of Manyas.

In order to avoid discrimination, the Ubykh elders encouraged their people to assimilate into Turkish culture. Having abandoned their traditional nomadic culture, they became a nation of farmers. The Ubykh language was rapidly displaced by Turkish and other Circassian dialects; the last native speaker of Ubykh, Tevfik Esenç, died in 1992.

Today, the Ubykh diaspora has been scattered about Turkey and—to a much lesser extent—Jordan. The Ubykh nation per se no longer exists, although those who are of Ubykh ancestry are proud to call themselves Ubykh, and a couple of villages are still found in Turkey where the vast majority of the population is Ubykh by descent.

Ubykh society was patrilineal; many Ubykh descendants today know five, six, or even seven generations of their agnatic ancestry. Nevertheless, as in other Northwest Caucasian tribes, women were especially venerated, and the Ubykh retained a special second person pronoun prefix used exclusively with women (-).

Notable people

 * Keriman Halis Ece of Пщызэмыгъу family – winner of Miss Turkey 1932 and Miss Universe 1932 beauty pageants
 * Perestü Valide Sultan of Гогэн family – Valide Sultan (Empress mother) of Abdulhamid II of the Ottoman Empire
 * Şevkefza Valide Sultan of Заурмыкъу family – Valide Sultan (Empress mother) of Murad V of the Ottoman Empire
 * Düzdidil Kadın - consort of Sultan Abdulmejid I of the Ottoman empire.
 * Setenay Özbek - artist
 * Tevfik Esenç - politician, last known speaker of the Ubykh language (1904-1992)

title: Ubykh people


text:
Talk:Oxbow lake

Picture
Can anyone get a picture of one of these, especially an overhead picture? I think it'd really help. Derrick Coetzee 23:38, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * The picture is of an oxbow. Not "an oxbow in the making."  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.125.68.34 (talk) 19:30, 6 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I agree. Rather, the picture most likely shows several oxbows. I will edit the picture text to reflect this. Joeldaalv (talk) 15:51, 11 December 2015 (UTC)

Confusing
The wording of this article is terribly confusing. I had to do a search for another explanation, and found one which did so simply and clearly. A brief diagram could quickly explain the matter to people not familiar with geographical terminology. The link below is what I used:

http://mbgnet.mobot.org/fresh/lakes/oxbow.htm

Jackmont, Feb 9, 2006

Rincon
Is this the same as a rincon, linked from meander? --NE2 02:04, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Not exactly. I have tried to disambig;  see Meander. --Una Smith (talk) 16:20, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

Reelfoot Lake not an oxbow
Reelfoot Lake is not widely considered an oxbow lake. It's a poor example on other grounds, too.173.101.236.43 (talk) 13:25, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Even more confusing
Is the center section - "formation" - and its 7 long paragraphs full of explanations really just three different attempts to say what seems should only require a few short paragraphs? This needs some serious editing for legibility and to reduce confusion. I may tackle it later when I have a few hours to spare. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.89.56.194 (talk) 09:49, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Missing Information
While this article does cover the basic information on oxbows lakes, I feel that there is still information needing to be covered. Now I know how oxbow lakes are formed when their river's meander becomes too wibbly weebly wobbly to maintain the course it's on, and that the main flow of the stream then diverts itself accordingly leaving the oxbow lake behind. But here's my question, son: What on earth is an oxbow? Are our bovine friends fashoning weaponry? Someone should inform me, do I need to buy a shield? Oxen are not well known for their dexterous abilities.

Also, should we include a section on the dangers at hand? One needs to carefully watch one's self around them, or they might end up losing an eye. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.143.116.8 (talk) 22:34, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Merge with Meander cutoff
Shouldn't this be merged with Meander cutoff? To me it seems as both articles describe the same under a different title. noclador (talk) 06:21, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
 * you don't always get a lake after the cutoff. Also a dry creek bed, or a billabong. --Dave Rave (talk) 23:26, 26 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Don't merge. Per Dave Rave and also it's useful to have separate articles for specific geographical terms that can be expanded with e.g. processes and examples. --Bermicourt (talk) 15:24, 16 December 2014 (UTC)

The bow, not the bow pin
The shape is similar to the bow of an oxbow, that is, the U-shaped wooden portion that goes around the draft animal's neck. The bow pin is the device that holds the bow in place. The oxbow article is a little confusing on this point. If there are no objections, I'll update both articles. The Uninvited Co., Inc. 02:53, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

External links modified (January 2018)
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Billabong and Resaca (channel)
If Billabong and Resaca (channel) are just alternate terms for this, why do they need separate articles? FunkMonk (talk) 03:59, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Good point.  Now, to argue against myself, sometimes there can be articles on terms.  North8000 (talk) 10:49, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Yeah, but terms for the same natural phenomena? FunkMonk (talk) 12:28, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
 * I dunno. Billabong looks like a flat-out synonym and probably shouldn't have an article.   Resaca (channel) raises some questions.    This Oxbow Lake  article talks about  Oxbow lake as  as semi-permanent item.   Resaca (channel) purports to talk about something a little different which includes seasonal ones.   Either the laws of physics are different in Texas or one of the articles needs to be revised.  North8000 (talk) 13:16, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Oppose in the case of Billabong of the grounds of the independently notable cultural roles of the Billabong in both aboriginal culture and Australia folklore. The description also suggest seasonality, and the reference indicating equivalence doesn't appear to be reliable (archived, unreferenced page aimed at schoolchildren). Klbrain (talk) 21:10, 8 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Strongly endorse that Oppose. Though it isn't reflected well in the article, the name billabong is often used in the Top End of the Northern Territory to refer to mostly permanent areas of water left behind after the wet season. During The Wet, they are part of the wider river itself. They don't exist because the river changes its course, but just because of seasonal changes of water level. HiLo48 (talk) 00:44, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose as per Klbrain. The Drover's Wife (talk) 23:26, 10 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose as per Klbrain.Fleet Lists (talk) 23:29, 10 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose as per Klbrain North8000 (talk) 23:53, 10 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose: On a  geological  time  scale,  billabongs  are  ephemeral.  Meandering  rivers  move  back  and  forth  across  their  floodplains,  leaving  scrolls,  swales  and  cut-off  meanders.  In  southern  Australia the latter are specifically termed billabongs, although elsewhere on the continent the term  applies  to  a  wide  range  of  standing  waters . This notes that it is described as an oxbow lake for international audiences but: After the 'flood' the evidence remains: a 'drift' is deposit of sand and gravel left by floodwaters; a 'billabong', 'blind creek' or 'anabranch' is formed by the greatly varying water levels and volumes of most Ausatralian watercourses. An increased volume of water will form a braided pattern of stream; when the volume is reduced, water is left in a hydrological cul de sac. ~Hydronium~Hydroxide~(Talk)~ 00:36, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose: as per Klbrain, HiLo48 & Hydronium Hydroxide. Many rivers in Australia are seasonal - when the flow stops & the river dries up, it separates into billabongs, or pools of standing water. They are not ox-bow lakes as when the rains come, the river will flow through those channels once again. --Find bruce (talk) 04:40, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose Not the same geological feature. There can be oxbows in Australia, and probably would be referred to as billabongs too, but most billabongs are not oxbows.  (Can see why the merge has been suggested, the current billabong article is a mess.)  Aoziwe (talk) 07:28, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose I complete oppose merging these articles for an entirely different reason. Billabongs are not just a geological feature in Australia. They are a culturally significant term and used in some foundational Australian literature. In no way should the article be merged. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 14:35, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose as per Chris' (and others) arguments above. Hughesdarren (talk) 09:44, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Oxbow lake


text:
Zork Nemesis

Zork Nemesis: The Forbidden Lands is a graphic adventure game developed by Zombie LLC, published by Activision, and released in 1996 for Windows 95, MS-DOS, and Macintosh. It is the eleventh game in the Zork series, and the first title not to be marketed under the Infocom label, while featuring a darker, less comical story within the Zork setting. The story focuses on players investigating the sudden disappearance of four prominent figures and their children to the hands of a mysterious being known as the "Nemesis", and uncovering a sinister plot during their investigations that they must thwart. The game features performances by Lauren Koslow, W. Morgan Sheppard, Allan Kolman, Stephen Macht, Paul Anthony Stewart, Merle Kennedy, and Bruce Nozick.

The game received favorable reviews, despite some criticism of the puzzles and lack of relevance to the Zork setting, and won the 1996 Spotlight Award for "Best Prerendered Art". The MS-DOS edition of the game was later released by GOG on their website, who made it compatible for use with Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7, Windows 8, and Windows 10.

Gameplay
Zork Nemesis operates from a first-person perspective and uses a simple point-and-click system. The cursor fundamentally allows for interaction with the player's surrounding, changing to symbolize what can be done; an arrow going forward or back allows for movement; arrows for side-to-side or up-and-down allow for examining locations from different viewpoints; a gold arrow allows for interaction with objects; and a hand icon allows for objects to be picked up or to symbolize where objects can be used. Each location, ranging from corridors, small rooms, and vast halls, can be viewed in panoramic 360-degree to find objects to examine and interact with, with a still screen used when zooming in to examine an object in more detail (i.e. a book). Items collected by the player are stored in a simple inventory that be cycled through the right mouse-button.

Puzzles in the game generally require the player to find clues that will help them solve it, ranging from finding certain objects or triggering something in the right combination; a score system mostly denotes when a player has completed a section of the game's story.

Setting
The game takes place in the fantasy world of Zork, with players initially solving puzzles and exploring the Temple of Agrippa, a large complex situated in a mountainous region within the Forbidden Lands. Later the player has the ability to travel and explore the following locations: Frigid River Branch Conservatory - a musical school and performance hall near to Flood Control Dam #7; Steppinthrax Monastery – an abandoned monastery in disrepair; Grey Mountains Asylum – a mental institution in the frigid, frozen peaks of the Grey Mountains; Castle Irondune - a military fort with private museum of battles, situated in the Irondune desert.

Characters

 * Madame Sophia Hamilton (portrayed by Lauren Koslow) - An alchemist of water and copper, and head of the Frigid River Branch Conservatory, who teaches music to Alexandria.
 * Bishop Francois Malveaux (portrayed by W. Morgan Sheppard) - An alchemist of fire and lead, father of Alexandria, and a religious man who runs the Steppinthrax Monastery.
 * Doctor Erasmus Sartorius (portrayed by Allan Kolman) - An alchemist of air and tin, and a doctor who is head of the Grey Mountains Asylum. Separated Alexandria from her birth mother during her infancy.
 * General Thaddeus Kaine (portrayed by Stephen Macht) - An alchemist of earth and iron, father of Lucien, and a decorated officer in charge of Castle Irondune. Responsible for separating his son from marrying Alexandria.
 * Lucien Kaine (portrayed by Paul Anthony Stewart) - Thaddeus' son and a skilled soldier. Despises his father's actions while growing affectionate for Alexandria, before being arrested for desertion when planning to marry her.
 * Alexandria Wolfe (portrayed by Merle Kennedy) - A young woman born at the Grey Mountains Asylum, raised by Francois with no knowledge of her real parents, taught music by Sophia, and fell in love with Lucien while performing concerts. Died a mysterious death in the Temple of Agrippa.
 * "Nemesis" (voiced by Bruce Nozick; portrayed by Paul Anthony Stewart) - A mysterious entity that took over the Temple of Agrippa, torturing Sophia, Malveaux, Sartorius and Kaine after entrapping them. The Nemesis seeks to find the fifth alchemical element so that it can grant it what it desires, and sees the player as nothing more than a problem.
 * The Player - A nameless adventurer, charged by Vice Regent Syovar the Strong to enter the Forbidden Lands and investigate the disappearance of four prominent citizens, replacing a previous agent named Karlok Bivotar who disappeared on the same mission.

Plot
Following the demise of Agent L. Bivotar, Vice Regent Syovar the Strong assigns the player with the task of continuing their investigations within the region known as the Forbidden Lands, in which Bivotar had been instructed to discover what had happened to four prominent figures of the Empire who went missing – Doctor Erasmus Sartorius, General Thaddeus Kaine, Bishop Francois Malveaux, and Madame Sophia Hamilton - while determining if rumours of a mysterious curse that had emerged from within the region were substantiated, and investigate possible illegal magic being conducted. Travelling to the Temple of Agrippa, an ancient temple within the Eastlands that Bivotar had learnt about during their investigations, the player uncovers a message left behind by the spirit of Alexandria Wolfe, a young woman who seeks help to deal with a great evil that resides within the temple.

Entering the main building of the temple, the player uncovers information revealing that Sartorius, Kaine, Malveaux and Sophia were operating in secret as alchemists, each mastering one of the four elements: Air, Fire, Earth, and Water. The group had been seeking the mysterious fifth element called "the Quintessence", until a mysterious entity known as the Nemesis killed them. After finding each member's corresponding element, the group explain that Nemesis not only killed them but also Alexandria, Francois' daughter, and Thaddeus' son Lucien. Using their combined power, the group stop Nemesis from attacking the player, and advises them to visit their homes and seek out the elemental metals aligned to each of them. Using a special planetarium, the player travels to each member's home – Steppinthrax Monastery, Castle Irondune, Grey Mountains Asylum, and Frigid River Branch Conservatory – and find the pure samples of each metal within each alchemist's personal laboratory.

Whilst in each of these locations, the player slowly learns more about the Alchemists' work and the identity of the Nemesis, through visions and various letters. The player learns that Sartorius sought to complete the research of his father into the Quintessence which could grant eternal life. Learning that it required mastery of the four elements and their pure metals, both of which he could not accomplish on his own, Sartorius recruited the assistance of Sophia, Francois and Thaddeus, each for their own reasons: Francois sought to avoid his death from an incurable disease; Thaddeus sought power to win a war against a rival; and Sophia sought to live forever, having fallen in love with Thaddeus. The group soon learned that they needed to create a child, who had to be born when an alignment of planets, each corresponding to each alchemical element, occurred at the same time of a solar eclipse, who would lead them to finding the fifth element.

Sartorius sourced the child, Alexandria, from one of his patients at his asylum, and left Francois in charge of raising her. Alexandria was taught a special song by Sophia, unaware it would purify her soul for a ritual the group would perform on her. However, the alchemists had not foreseen Lucien falling in love with Alexandria when he attended one of her concerts, thus Thaddeus had him arrested on a false charge of draft-dodging. Knowing the fifth element would be theirs at the next solar eclipse, the group lured Alexandria to the Agrippa Temple for sacrifice. Lucien, learning of their plan, escaped from his cell, but arrived too late to save Alexandria. Angered, Lucien killed the group in revenge, and became the Nemesis in order to find the fifth element himself, and revive Alexandria with it. When the player returns, having revived the group, the alchemists attempt to convince them to drink from a chalice, but seeing them not willing, chose to send them away, while resuming their ritual.

Lucien, knowing they must not find Alexandria's body, beseeches the player for help since they know the truth, and passes on a gold ring. Entering a hidden chamber below the temple, the player creates a special Alchemy symbol, representing Infinity, from both Lucien's and Alexandria's rings. With the rings now purified and imbued with the fifth element, representing pure love, the player quickly uses it to stop the Alchemists. The resulting power from the fifth element kills them, revives Alexandria, and destroys the temple. This ends the curse in the Forbidden Lands, and the game ends with Lucien and Alexandria walking away together to live in peace.

Production
Zork Nemesis employed technology Activision dubbed "Z-Vision Surround Technology," which gives users a simulated 360-degree view of each location visited. It was one of the first games to employ such technology, though Zork Nemesis only allows panning in either horizontal or vertical where both panning options are available, unlike in later games such as The Journeyman Project 3: Legacy of Time or Myst III: Exile. Furthermore, details were far more difficult to make out in the panoramic scenes than in the still screens; the sequel, Zork: Grand Inquisitor, made significant improvements to the Z-Vision system. Technical director Laird Malamed felt the game suffered from time constraints, saying that once the advanced game engine was completed, the team didn't have enough time left to implement anything more than simple control panel puzzles.

Like other adventure games of its time, Zork Nemesis made use of live actors. The game features a significant amount of screen-time for the actors, thanks to its use of flashbacks at key locations (or objects) and the use of monologues in which characters address the player explaining and justifying their actions.

The game's plot was written by Cecilia Barajas, Nick Sagan and Adam Simon and is a departure from the series usual comedic treatment in its games, by featuring a much darker and less humorous story than previous games. The budget of Zork Nemesis surpassed $3 million. The live-action scenes contributed to this cost, which ultimately rose to around USD$3.5 million. The game was heavily marketed, with an estimated $1 million spent on this aspect.

Reception
The game received "favorable" reviews according to the review aggregation website GameRankings. Next Generation said, "With 3D sound and stunning graphics (the game is almost worth the price just to examine the fantastic architectural environments), this game was destined for five stars, until the puzzles – and these are what really count, to us, anyway – dragged the game back down."

Zork Nemesis placed 10th on PC Data's monthly computer game sales chart for April 1996. It secured positions 12 and 11 the following two months, respectively. By November 1996, Zork Nemesis had sold above 100,000 units. According to Activision, strong sales of the game during the 1996 holiday shopping season contributed to high revenues in the company's third quarter, which increased 78% over the third quarter of 1995.

Zork Nemesis won the 1996 Spotlight Award for "Best Prerendered Art" from the Game Developers Conference. It was also nominated for the 1996 "Adventure Game of the Year" awards of Computer Games Strategy Plus, PC Gamer, CNET Gamecenter and Computer Game Entertainment, but these went variously to The Neverhood, The Beast Within: A Gabriel Knight Mystery and The Pandora Directive. PC Gamer highlighted Nemesis's "charm and vitality", and called it "graphically gorgeous".

In 2011, Adventure Gamers named Zork Nemesis the 51st-best adventure game ever released.

title: Zork Nemesis


text:
Category:Astrologers

Practitioners of astrology.

title: Category:Astrologers


text:
John Varley (painter)

John Varley (17 August 1778 – 17 November 1842) was an English watercolour painter and astrologer, and a close friend of William Blake. They collaborated in 1819–1820 on the book Visionary Heads, written by Varley and illustrated by Blake. He was the elder brother of a family of artists: Cornelius Varley, William Fleetwood Varley, and Elizabeth, who married the painter William Mulready.

Life and work
John Varley was born at the Old Blue Post Tavern, Hackney, on 17 August 1778. His father, Richard Varley, born at Epworth in Lincolnshire, had settled in London after the death of his first wife in Yorkshire. His mother was an alleged descendant of the regicide Oliver Cromwell through the marriage of his daughter, Bridget, and the Parliamentarian soldier and politician General Charles Fleetwood. Varley's parents discouraged his leanings towards art, and placed him under a silversmith. But on their death he was for a brief time employed by a portrait painter in Holborn and then, at the age of 15 or 16, he became a pupil of Joseph Charles Barrow (fl. 1789–1802) who had an evening drawing school twice a week at 12 Furnival's Inn Court, Holborn. It was Barrow who took Varley on a sketching tour to Peterborough from which he emerged as a professional painter. In 1798 he exhibited a highly regarded sketch of Peterborough Cathedral at the Royal Academy and became a regular exhibitor at the RA until the foundation of the Old Watercolour Society in 1805.

In 1799 he visited North Wales, and in its wild mountain scenery found the subjects best suited to his brush. He returned there in 1800, and again in 1802, and the impressions then received powerfully influenced the whole course of his art. He married Esther Gisborne on 14 November 1803 at St. James, Piccadilly, London, and became brother-in-law to Muzio Clementi in 1810 when the latter married Emma Gisborne.

Varley exhibited more than 700 works at the OWS, of which he was one of the  founders. He also became a highly successful drawing master, his pupils including Copley Fielding, David Cox, John Linnell and William Turner (artist) of Oxford. Despite his success, his growing family meant he was constantly in financial difficulties, "since he was both a hopeless businessman and by temperament something of a Micawber". (Mallalieu). Varley was particularly skilled at the laying of flat washes of watercolour which suited the placid, contemplative mood that he often sought to evoke.

Varley published A Treatise on the Principles of Landscape Drawing, 1816–21 and A Practical Treatise on the Art of Drawing in Perspective. He also wrote an astrological text (with illustrations) entitled A Treatise on Zodiacal Physiognomy in 1828.

He is buried at Kensal Green Cemetery.

Works
According to the Encyclopædia Britannica Eleventh Edition, "Varley's landscapes are graceful and solemn in feeling, and simple and broad in treatment, being worked with a full brush and pure fresh transparent tints, usually without any admixture of body-colour. Though his works are rather mannered and conventional, they are well considered and excellent in composition. Some of his earlier water-colours, including his "Views of the Thames," were painted upon the spot, and possess greater individuality than his later productions, which are mainly compositions of mountain and lake scenery, produced without direct reference to nature."
 * J Varley's List of Colours, published by John Varley, London 1818, 1pp.
 * A Treatise on the Principles of Landscape Drawing...
 * A Practical Tratise on the Art of Drawing in Perspective: adapted for the study of those who draw from nature; by which the usual errors can be avoided (printed for Sherwood, Gilbert, and Piper,...and R. Ackermann, ..., London ?1815/1820?).
 * A Treatise on Zodiacal Physiognomy, illustrated by engravings of heads and features, and accompanied by tables of the time of rising of the twelve signs of the zodiac; and containing also new and astrological explanations of some remarkable portions of ancient mythological history (published for the author, 10½, Great Tichfield Street, London 1828; sold by Longman) IV, 60pp.: 6 Plates, (8vo), 25 cm; plates engraved by J. Linnell.

title: John Varley (painter)


text: User talk:67.122.26.94

title: User talk:67.122.26.94


text:
User:Martyman

Unfortunately due to new work commitments I am on a bit of a forced wikibreak. I will still be trying to drop by occasionally, but don't be surprised if your comments take a while to be answered.

I work at the Australian National University in Canberra, Australia.

I created my wikipedia account on the 3rd of October 2004. My goals are to increase wikipedia's content in relation to Canberra (and to a lesser extent the rest of Australia) and the areas of research I am involved in at work. I have also become interested in making sure articles are properly categorised.

I also enjoy making maps and illustrations in Adobe Illustrator. Please feel free to request maps or diagrams from me, if I have time I will see what I can do.

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If you are from Canberra please consider joining the Canberra Wikiproject.
 * WikiProject Canberra - (talk)

Some pages I have started or substantially improved
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Some pages I have worked on
Australian National University, Royal Military College, Duntroon, List of suburbs of Canberra, Lake Ginninderra, Government House, Canberra, Canberra, History of the Australian Capital Territory, Walter Burley Griffin

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See Martyman/My_Images

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title: User:Martyman


text:
Talk:Talksport

Untitled
This page seems extremely POV. It tells me nothing about the channel, only how great the hosts are... I may change this to VfD after thinking about it for a while. Luigi30 23:47, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC)

 * Guess it was fixed. Hooray whoever did that. Luigi30 23:50, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I think that the comment about Jewish presenters may not be intended as anti-semitic, but as a point that there are no female presenters because of the content. the employment of jewish presenters, is to show that this is not because, of predjudice on the stations part Lazmac 15:46, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Surly the comment about the fact that there aren't any female presenters being such a problem is superflous. Readers need only look at the list of presenters below to see that there aren't any female hosts. I think that the problem is the IP address with a false sense of selfimportance, who seems to think that their judgement lies over that of the rest of contributers. If we are going to conclude that the only reason that the majority of listeners are men just beacause of the presenters, we need citations (not just discrediting newspaper articles, but solid facts), and not the opinion of one anonymous IP, who has continually walked over the community side of the Wikipedia project (which means finding concensus) in the name of overiding "censorship". Otherwise, all we should do is state the facts (that there aren't any female presenters, and that the majority of listeners are men). There is no reason that there are Jewish presenters working there needs to be mentioned. Yellowmellow45 17:56, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

 * It is possibly worthy of mention that Charlie Wolf is Jewish, as he often expresses political views in support of Israel.SimonMayer 23:17, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

 * As does George Galloway, who is Catholic Brooza 20:45, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

 * No female presenters? Not true, there's Robyn who does the news... --Kiand 17:27, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

I would like to see a more descriptive passage about the station, about its history and output as someone who had not listened to station, would have little idea what it was like. Lazmac 12:05, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Why the hell has the page been reverted back to what it was after I had put up more detailed introductions and information about each show on the weekday schedule!??!?!?!

 * I reverted it thought I it was good, and should be edited not removed Lazmac 14:22, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Buy why did you revert and remove EVERYTHING I had put on?

 * You can't add information lifted straight off their website 1) because it is copyrighted and 2) there is sponsorship detail and contact information which is a form of advertising. Yellowmellow45 16:49, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

 * I did no such thing whatsoever. I did not lift any information from their website and typed it all using my own words. Fair enough with the sponsorship details but I very much doubt they will be bothered me putting schedule and programme information on this site. If the sponsorship stuff is true then why does the current schedule stil say "Fiat Vans Sportswatch"????

the "predominately male audience"
Theres one real reason the station has a predominately male audience. It covers sports. Thats why. The presenters are mostly (but not entirely - listen to their news team) male due to it, oh, covering sports. Theres no other reasons. --Kiand 17:01, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

 * EXACTLY, which is what I've been trying to point out to the anon IP, who really should read the second problem with Wikipedia Yellowmellow45 17:02, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Just to clarify, the article is entitled "Why Wikipedia Must Jettison Its Anti-Elitism (Op-Ed)". Yellowmellow45 has revealed his agenda too all. 195.92.67.75 17:25, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

errrr no, merely pointing out that he has a point. I have no agenda and please refrain from personal attacks, its quite rude. I see you haven't really read it, the guy co-founded Wikipedia, and is also a supporter. Yellowmellow45 17:27, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

 * You are censoring unbiased information to suit your "Elitist" agenda, so kindly desist. And FYI, newsreaders are provided by Sky. Not one woman hosts her own show on the station. 195.92.67.75 17:37, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
 * And how is that relevant, really? Its a sports station, and its a fact that far, far, far fewer women have any interest in sport than men. There -are- women broadcasters on the station, who provides them is completely irrelevant. As long as the station is predominately about sport it will have a predominately male audience. They could get all the female sportscasters in the world to present the current content and it would still have a predominately male audience because of the programme content. --Kiand 17:42, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I think someone broke the WP:3RR (or will soon) Yellowmellow45 17:44, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

 * James Whale, Ian Collins, Charlie Wolf, Mike Dickin, Howard Hughes, Mark Keen, Mike Mendoza and Duncan Barkes are not sports presenters, and any mention of sports issues is stricly forbidden on their shows. talkSPORT's news bulletins are provided by Sky, as are the newsreaders. 195.92.67.73 18:03, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
 * So? Its still mostly a sports station, and those are still women on the air who are acknowledged by talkSPORT as presenters on their homepage.
 * You're pushing a (pointless) POV on to the page that is entirely unprovable. If you can provide a reputable third-party source that says that its mainly male audience is down to the male presenters and NOT the programme content, it'd be OK then. But I'm sure you can't. And don't even think of reverting again for at least 24 hours. --Kiand 18:07, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
 * All those shows have female callers, so the IP's point is disproved, there are female listeners who aren't put off. This is no plce to make political statements or unprovable points. I'm assuming good faith, but, if anyone has an agenda, it's the IP Yellowmellow45 18:08, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Actually, the problem with the revert rule is that the IP uses a proxy server and so edits under different IPs and is therefore, thoretically (and unfairly) exempt Yellowmellow45 18:12, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
 * IP editors are -not- exempted from the 3RR. And this one has broken it, quite heavily, today alone. --Kiand 18:14, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Attempt at Resolution
CHECK and MATE to those intent on disrupting Wikipedia Yellowmellow45 18:27, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

It would be nice for ther personal attacts, slights on motives and assumptions of viewpoints to stop. Then progress could be made. Enough opprobrism thankyou very much. Yellowmellow45 18:50, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

So now we learn that the IP had no interest in the matter anyway. What does that make them? A troll? Never!!Yellowmellow45 19:02, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Lack of station history?
There seems a disappointing lack of info on the change from Talk Radio to talksport, why this happened, who arranged it, what happened to the presenters etc etc. Magic Pickle 00:41, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

While there is no non-white presenters, Lisa Francesca Nand who does the traffic is of Fijian descent. There is also a couple of female newsreaders: Robin, Rachel etc.
 * For some reason the slightly mad anon contributor refuses to accept that the traffic and news teams are "presenters" and reverts back on sight, going over the 3RR in the process if need be... --Kiand 00:10, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Lowest audience
It has the lowest audience of any national station? That must be untrue -- anybody heard of 1Xtra, 3C, etc., etc.? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andrew.boulton (talk • contribs) 2006-05-20
 * Indeed it is - its actually the 7th highest commercial national in the latest RAJAR figures. Theres at least 15 commercials and a few BBC's behind it. Both 1Xtra and 3C actually do fairly well, mind - the lowest figure goes to Fun Radio, and thats just among those who pay to be reported. --Kiand 10:11, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Schedule - Unencyclopedic?
As I discussed on some BBC radio articles, What Wikipedia is not under section 1.7.7 states that Wikipedia is not a TV/Radio guide. Rather than delete the information in the schedule, would it be better for someone with knowledge of TalkSPORT edited the schedule and make it into sections like Presenters and Programmes? Sonic 08:29, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Someone just deleted the schedule as I was writing the above comment. My suggestion still stands. Sonic 08:30, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

I did that once but I was told it was against copyright even though I wrote it all myself! I don't see anything wrong with listening the presenters and on-air staff....

Needs an overhaul
I've just gone through this page and done what I could to get the opening section into better shape. The vast amount of text before the TOC was ridiculous, so I've put most of that into a history section and just left the basic details at the beginning.

I haven't even bothered touching the presenters section, but it's pretty clear there's way too much information there. It reads too much like advertising material. I really don't think we need to detail every single programme on the station... it's just too unwieldy. It needs to be trimmed back to remove the, uh... less notable... presenters/programmes. It'd be cool if someone more in the know about the station could tackle it.

I've made another section into which I've put the most recent programming developments at the station. This can be edited as necessary for those who like to tell everyone about what's going on lately at talkSPORT.

Furthermore, I have no idea what purpose the large list of presenter names with links is meant to serve... the bit below the Twenty20 Cup Live section. Can anyone justify keeping it? If not I'm going to delete it in a few days time. I'm also looking at the ratings section as needing a good clearout, because it's so shamelessly POV and far too long for the average reader to give a damn.

Any thoughts?

--EddieBernard 10:41, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

Is there a possibility we could split this article into two and have Talk Radio UK as a seperate article? Just a thought.Olaf Legend 16:35, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

AFD on company operating TalkSPORT transmission sites
There's an AFD on Alice Soundtech, a leading UK supplier of studio and transmission equipment for ILR and RSL radio stations (from mixing consoles to AM/FM transmitters) also operating some transmission sites for TalkSPORT and Virgin Radio. People in the biz or in the know can chime in at Articles for deletion/Alice Soundtech. -- 62.147.39.76 10:31, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

POV
I've cleaned up one major bit of POV for The Jon Gaunt Show, hopefully someone can expand on the description for that show and go through the other shows with a fine toothcomb for other WP:NPOV violations. --tgheretford (talk) 21:19, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * And as soon as I do that, someone else has added what I believe is a WP:NPOV violation (diff). As I am not prepared to violate WP:3RR, can someone suggest what else I can do apart from whack a POV template to the section? --tgheretford (talk) 00:05, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * What I will try and say is that either the information placed in the article be verified with reliable sources, otherwise as per WP:V and WP:NPOV policy as well as WP:WEASEL guidelines, it can be removed. --tgheretford (talk) 00:12, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

I surprised it wasn't mentioned that Steve Wright was a presenter on Talk Radio in 1994, on the same frequencies (1089, 1053 AM) that only a year earlier he was broadcasting his show for Radio 1 before it went to FM. 86.133.156.8 09:31, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

George Galloway
There has been some very libelous statements apperaing on the politics section of the page such as describing him as a |leading anti-semite and supporter of the terrorist organisation, Hezbollah. I have reworded it for the moment, but it is being repeatedly reverted or changed. As the politics section doesnt seem relevent, perhaps it is time to remove this section. Willow177 (talk) 21:17, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Are we really supposed to put up with this kind of libellous nonsense on Wikipedia? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.9.46.14 (talk) 22:19, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Galloway supports Hezbollah - he has made various speeches to this effect. Galloway makes no secret of his hatred of the Jews (or the English for that matter), listen to his radio show - the man is a modern day Lord Haw Haw. The fact that the left wing "intelligentsia" will support any murderer (Saddam, Guevara), tin pot dictator (Chavez, Castro) or nutter (Galloway) provided they are anti-Semitic and anti-American should not get in the way of the truth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.194.90.253 (talk) 13:45, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Willow177 & Anon IP: May I be so bold so as to suggest that what you've both said is libellous? Galloway does support Hezbollah. He has said so himself. And rightly so. But Hezbollah being a terrorist organisation is dependent on POV. And the anti-semitism charge is a load of nonsense. And you know it. He is anti-Zionist, as are a lot of people out there. But that does not make him an anti-semite. --Charliewbrown (talk) 20:02, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, you're wrong. 1) It is a libel to say that he is an anti-semite. And 2), he is a supporter of Hizbullah, but it is a subjective opinion that they are terrorists. Not only that, but how does that fit in with the claim to "common sense" views in the previous paragraph? It is gratuitous.

Just look at the bile in the comments above. The idea that Galloway can be accused of making "no secret of his hatred of the Jews" is absurd (I am the same person who has been reverting the libel and non-NPOV, and will continue to do so until this is resolved).

In addition, how can "campaigns of liberation" be considered neutral? It is liberation in some people's opinion. To me it is mass slaughter - but I didn't alter the article to say that. The only way it can fulfil POV is to call it the most basic thing: Military action. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.9.46.14 (talk) 19:45, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Just what we need, another left wing apologist for terrorism eh ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.194.90.253 (talk) 20:04, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

 * OK I just reverted some of the comments above that were changed by the anon IP 87.194.90.253 (talk). S/he edited the comments by Charliewbrown (talk) as well Willow177 (talk) so that it appears as if they agreed that Galloway is an anti-semite when in fact the original statements were to the contrary. Unfortunately we were all fooled by this...And to you, anon IP 87.194.90.253 (talk): this is your final warning, if you persist in this behavior of editing against consensus and changing other editor's comments, you will be banned. --Nuttycoconut (talk) 16:09, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Biographies of living persons Violation
I am getting a little tired with the constant adding of potentially libellous details to this article about George Galloway. This is explicitly a violation of the biographies of living persons policy. Just because this isn't an article about a person doesn't mean it is acceptable - BLP applies to all Wikipedia articles. If information is being added back in, then please feel free to remove it immediately as per BLP policy, add the relevant template (adding unreferenced controversial information about living persons) from here and if it continues, report it at Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard. --tgheretford (talk) 12:05, 27 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I noticed that as soon as the semi-protection has ended, the libellous biographies of living persons policy violations have resumed. I don't know whether we should also request page protection again as well as report the relevant user at the incidents noticeboard for administrators? --tgheretford (talk) 22:14, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

Mr Galloway has frequently gone out of his way while broadcasting on Talksport to defend Jewish people from 'hate speak' which many callers have aimed at them. One time Mr Galloway said; 'any man who wants to attack a Jew is going to have to fight his way past me first, (George is an ex Boxer)'. Mr Galloways stated views on Israel on Talksport are also curious. He says Israel is a 'Settler State' founded and supported by aithiest none Jews. To say Mr Galloway is Anti Jewish is rediculious.Johnwrd (talk) 03:47, 21 August 2010 (UTC)

Traditionalist Attitudes
" ... traditionalist attitudes towards issues such as capital punishment, immigration, and the ongoing military action in Iraq and Afghanistan". A circumlocution, I'd say: unless the tradition is crudity and pig ignorance. --OhNoPeedyPeebles (talk) 20:31, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Return of Talk Radio
Main page mentions the return of Talk Radio - a talk-only station running parallel to TalkSPORT on DAB - in July 2008 but AFAIK nothing has happened. Any news? Looks like this section of the page needs revision. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alansausse (talk • contribs) 04:35, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Legal Grammatical Error
Excuse the lack of vocabulary here, I'm into Law not Literacy so much. Under the header "Controversies" on the first bullet point: "a call from someone who wanted to shoot the Royal Family" Legally this is incorrect. He expressed the sentiment of them being shot. Also noting that barely anyone who called this fellow's show viewed it as anything but serious. No prosecution of this caller resulted. And Sedition is not personal intent. Thus the above is incorrect.

It may also be a trivial note to add that Boyd also claims to have wandered off in his mind, as the caller was mourning the death of the Queenmother and had heard it several times before that day.

89.100.60.94 (talk) 11:53, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Talk Radio (UK) era
This article is unfortunately recentist, concentrating on Talksport post-rebrand without going into much detail about its time as Talk Radio UK and Talk Radio. For example, the 'programming highlights' and 'controversies' sections which list events not particularly distantly separated in time begin after the rebrand, mysteriously not saying anything about the station before it was known as Talksport, and the 'former presenters' sections talks about Talksport's original line-up, which I think means the line-up at the point of the rebrand (James Whale was on at midnight and I remember listening!).

The article does not mention when the 'UK' on the end of the name was unceremoniously dropped. One thing that might also merit inclusion since the format from the outset was wall-to-wall phone-in is the phone number the station used and its changes over the years (not because the numbers themselves are important but because the pricing of calls is highly relevant to a phone-in station, given that people waiting on the line can potentially be a significant source of revenue). As I recall it started off as the local rate 0345 105389 and at some point became a free 0500 number, before changing back to something that charged (possibly more than a local rate), but I don't know when these changes occurred. Finally, are the medium wave frequencies used vacated BBC ones from the days before widespread FM reception? If so, what was on them before, and when they were freed up was it always intended to license a new national independent talk radio broadcaster, or might we have had a music station like Virgin/Absolute Radio instead? Since national wall-to-wall phone in was new to the UK in 1995, I wonder if anyone can dig up anything about how the new station was received when it went on air. Were analogies drawn, for example, with AM talk radio in the USA?

Can future editors of this article try to bear in mind what I've said here about recentism, and look at this station in a broader historical perspective in which everything notable that has happened from 1995 (and potentially before) to the present is equally important. Credulity (talk) 18:17, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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"TalkSPORT.com" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect TalkSPORT.com. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. The Banner talk 14:08, 18 September 2019 (UTC)

Seven medium wave transmitters to be turned off in 2020
See here. 1107 kHz Torbay no longer works, so it looks like this has been turned off. The transmitter site was here and the service began in 1995.-- ♦Ian Ma c M♦  (talk to me) 09:37, 5 June 2020 (UTC)

FA Cup Final
The current version under live sport heading states "FA Cup final (simulcast with BBC Radio 5 Live)" - normally in broadcast terms I've always taken a "simulcast" as being the broadcast of the same programme on multiple stations. It would be unlikely that Talksport and the BBC would be broadcasting the same programme - i.e. the same commentators and presenters. While it could be quite possible that the event would be broadcast on both stations, they would most likely have two completely separate broadcast teams.

It's not unusual for the same matches to be covered by multiple broadcasters and indeed the section introduction notes that some events are "non exclusive" as such I would have thought the simulcast with BBC 5Live reference is not needed. Unless my assumption that it is two separate programmes is incorrect in which case it would be worthy of note.

--Philedmondsuk (talk) 19:40, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Talksport