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Red House, Bexleyheath

Red House is a significant Arts and Crafts building located in Bexleyheath, south-east London, England. Co-designed in 1859 by the architect Philip Webb and the designer William Morris, it was created to serve as a family home for Morris. Construction was completed in 1860.

Following an education at the University of Oxford, Morris decided to construct a rural house for himself and his new wife, Jane Morris, within a commuting distance of central London. Purchasing a plot of land in what at the time was the village of Upton in Kent, he employed his friend Webb to help him design and construct the house, financing the project with money inherited from his wealthy family. Morris was deeply influenced by Medievalism and Medieval-inspired Neo-Gothic styles are reflected throughout the building's design. It was constructed using Morris' ethos of craftsmanship and artisan skills and is an early example of what came to be known as the Arts and Crafts movement.

A number of Morris' friends visited, most notably the Pre-Raphaelite painters Edward Burne-Jones and Dante Gabriel Rossetti, both of whom aided him in decorating the House; various Burne-Jones wall murals remain. While at Red House, Morris was involved in the formation of his design company, Morris, Marshall, Faulkner & Co., and embarked on his earliest wallpaper designs. It was also here that his two daughters, Jenny and May, were born. Although initially intending to live there for the rest of his life, Morris found that the house proved too expensive to run and did not suit his lifestyle. After five years, he moved his family to a flat in Queen Square, Bloomsbury and sold the property.

Red House remained a private residence for various individuals from 1866 until 2002, during which period various alterations were made to the interior design. In 1950 it was designated a Grade I listed building by English Heritage. From 1952 to 1999 the architect Edward Hollamby lived at the House, initiating attempts at preservation and establishing the Friends of Red House charity in 1998. In 2003, the National Trust purchased the property, undertaking a project of conservation and maintaining it as a visitor attraction with an accompanying tea room and gift shop.

William Morris at Red House
William Morris was born in Walthamstow, Essex, on 24 March 1834, and raised in a wealthy middle-class family. Although his father died in 1847, the Morris family remained affluent as a result of shares in the Devon Great Consols copper mines. In 1853 Morris began university studies at Exeter College, Oxford, focusing on Classics. There, he developed a keen interest in Medieval history and Medieval architecture, inspired by Oxford's many medieval buildings. This interest was tied to Britain's growing Medievalist movement, a form of Romanticism that rejected many of the values of Victorian industrial capitalism. For Morris, the Middle Ages represented an era with strong chivalric values and an organic, pre-capitalist sense of community, both of which he deemed preferable to his own period. He was heavily influenced by the writings of art critic John Ruskin, being particularly inspired by his chapter "On the Nature of Gothic Architecture" in the second volume of The Stones of Venice. Morris adopted Ruskin's philosophy of rejecting the tawdry industrial manufacture of decorative arts and architecture in favour of a return to hand-craftsmanship, raising artisans to the status of artists, and creating art that should be affordable and hand-made, with no hierarchy of artistic mediums.

At Oxford, Morris became the best friend of fellow undergraduate Edward Burne-Jones; they had a shared attitude to life and a keen mutual interest in Arthurianism. Having passed his finals and been awarded a BA in 1856, Morris began an apprenticeship with the Oxford-based Gothic revival architect George Edmund Street in January 1856. There he was placed under the supervision of Philip Webb, who became a close friend. He soon relocated to Street's London office, in August 1856 moving into a flat in Bloomsbury, Central London with Burne-Jones. Morris was fascinated by London but dismayed at its pollution and rapid expansion into neighbouring countryside, describing it as "the spreading sore". Preferring rural life, Morris became increasingly fascinated with the Pre-Raphaelites and soon met one of the foremost Pre-Raphaelite painters, Dante Gabriel Rossetti, after Burne-Jones became Rossetti's disciple; the three soon became close friends. Through Rossetti, Morris came to associate with poet Robert Browning, and the artists Arthur Hughes, Thomas Woolner, and Ford Madox Brown. At Rossetti's recommendation, Morris and Burne-Jones moved in together to a flat at No. 17 Red Lion Square in Bloomsbury by November 1856. Morris designed and commissioned furniture for the flat in a Medieval style, much of which he painted with Arthurian scenes in a direct rejection of mainstream artistic tastes.

In October 1857 Morris met Jane Burden, a woman from a working-class background, at a theatre performance and asked her to model for him. Smitten with her, they entered into a relationship and were engaged in spring 1858; Burden would later admit, however, that she never loved Morris. They were married in a simple ceremony held at St Michael at the North Gate church in Oxford on 26 April 1859, before honeymooning in Bruges, Belgium. Newly married, Morris decided to construct a house for himself and his bride. He commissioned Webb, who was then setting out as and architect independent of Street, to help him design it.

Origins and construction: 1859–60
Morris envisioned Red House as being not only a family home, but also a background to his ongoing artistic work. He wanted it to be situated in a rural area that was not far from London, and chose to search in Kent because it was his favourite county; he particularly enjoyed its geographical mix of large open spaces with small hills and rivers, favourably contrasting it to the flat expanse of his native Essex. After looking at various locations for sale in the area, he settled on a plot of land in the village of Upton in West Kent; although ten miles to London by road, it was situated three miles from the nearest railway station, Abbey Wood railway station. At Upton, Morris purchased an orchard and a meadow, wanting his new home to be surrounded by an apple and cherry orchard. Morris would likely have been pleased that Upton was close to the track that pilgrims followed to Canterbury Cathedral during the Middle Ages, and would also have had the opportunity to visit the ruins of the Medieval Lesnes Abbey which were around three miles away.

While Red House was under construction, Morris and his wife lived in rented accommodations at 41 Great Ormond Street, just along the road from Webb's office, at 7 Great Ormond Street. However, as the project neared completion, the Morrises moved to Amberley Lodge, close to the site, so that Morris could monitor the builder's progress. Webb and Morris would work on the design of the house together. Thus, the National Trust have described it as "a complex fusion of Morris's romantic utopianism and Webb's practical common sense", while Edward and Doris Hollamby described it as "a collaborative effort in which we cannot separate one from the other". Red House would be Webb's first project as an independent architect, while it remained the only house that Morris ever built. The actual construction was given to a contractor, and the structure took a year to build. It cost Morris approximately £4,000, at a time when the value of his shares was dropping.

Unique in its design, Red House was designed to an L-shaped plan, with two stories and a high-pitched roof made of red tile. The large hall, dining room, library, morning room, and kitchen were located on the ground floor, while on the first floor were situated the main living rooms, the drawing room, the studio, and the bedrooms. The servants' quarters were larger than in most contemporary buildings, reflecting the embryonic ideas regarding working class conditions which would lead Morris and Webb to become socialists in later life. Windows were positioned to suit the design of the rooms rather than to fit an external symmetry; thus a variety of different window types are present, including tall casements, hipped dormers, round-headed sash-windows, and bull's eye windows. The house lacked any applied ornamentation, with its decorative features instead serving constructional purposes, such as the arches over the windows, and the louvre in the open roof over the staircase. According to Morris' biographer J.W. Mackail, the external design of the house was "plain almost to severity, and depended for its effect on its solidity and fine proportion." This was somewhat radical at the time, as most contemporary buildings were heavily furnished with ornamentation. Rosseti termed it "a real wonder of the age ... which baffles all description", while Morris biographer Fiona MacCarthy described it as "the ultimate Pre-Raphaelite building".

The architecture of Red House was inspired by styles of British design from the thirteenth century, and Morris described the building as being "very mediaeval in spirit". Historian E.P. Thompson asserted that the house "was built, not–as in previous Gothic revivals–in an attempt to combine a number of superficial medieval characteristics which pleased the taste of the architect, but in a definite attempt to adapt late Gothic methods of building to the needs of the nineteenth century." Later owners of the property, Edward and Doris Hollamby, described Red House as Webb and Morris' attempt to "apply Gothic principles to domestic architecture without archaeological imitation". While asserting that it was certainly "a far cry from the Victorian bourgeois norm", MacCarthy stated that it was "by no means a revolutionary building", having much in common with other Neo-Gothic buildings of the period, comparing its "complicated dense" interiors to those of the architect Augustus Pugin.

When the building itself had been constructed, Morris set about decorating the interior, however specifically chose to design and create almost everything himself. Only a few pieces of decor were pre-bought as ready-made items, namely the Persian carpets, and blue china or delft. Morris took his painted settle from the Red Lion Square flat and had it transported in pieces to Red House, where it was reassembled in the drawing room. Many other items of furniture were specially designed by Webb, including the oak dining table, other tables, chairs, cupboards, copper candlesticks, fire dogs, and glass tableware. The plastered walls and ceilings were given simple designs in tempera, although more complex designs were planned for the hall and main living rooms. Stained glass windows were installed in the house, with designs created by Burne-Jones and Webb. In reference to the route taken by Medieval pilgrims headed to Canterbury, Morris termed the passage which connects the main hallway to the house's rear entrance, "The Pilgrim's Rest". The garden was similarly unique in its design, with Morris insisting on integration of the design of the house and garden; the latter was divided into four small square gardens by trellises on which roses grew. The flower beds were bordered with lavender and rosemary while lilies and sunflowers had also been planted in the garden. White jasmine, roses, honeysuckle and passion flower were planted to climb up the walls of the house.

Morris' life at Red House: 1860–1865
Morris and his wife moved into Red House at the end of the summer of 1860. At the time, he envisioned living there for the rest of his life, although ultimately would only stay there for five years. Morris' friends regularly came to visit; Burne-Jones and his new bride, Georgiana Burne-Jones, would often spend their Sundays at Red House, while other regular visitors included Rossetti, Faulkner and his two sisters, Webb, Swinburne, Madox Brown, and Arthur Hughes. Here, Burne-Jones and Faulkner often played practical jokes on Morris, for instance, doctoring a pack of playing cards or sewing up his clothing to make it feel much tighter. The group of friends liked to play hide and seek at the house, and in the evenings would gather around the piano to sing songs.

It was at Red House that Morris and Janey's two children were born; in January 1861, a daughter named Jane Alice Morris, who would come to be known as "Jenny". Jenny was followed in March 1862 by the birth of their second daughter, Mary "May" Morris. Morris was a caring father to his daughters, and years later they both recounted having had idyllic childhoods. However, there were problems in Morris's marriage as Janey became increasingly close to Rossetti, who often painted her. It is unknown if their affair was ever sexual, although by this point other members of the group were noticing Rossetti and Janey's closeness. Morris also hired various servants, four of whom were cited as living in the house in the 1861 census; the cook Charlotte Cooper, the housemaid Jane Chapman, the nanny Elizabeth Reynolds, and the groom Thomas Reynolds.

Morris added to both the house's interior and the design of the garden intermittently over the years, aided by his various friends. There was to be no wallpaper anywhere in the house, with the walls instead being painted or covered by tapestries. The walls of the staircase were intended to feature a painted mural by Burne-Jones depicting scenes from the Trojan War, while on the wall of the hall beneath was intended to be a picture of warships carrying the ancient Greek soldiers to Troy. Although depicting scenes from Classical mythology, Morris had wanted the designs to be Medieval in style, with the warships being based on those of the fourteenth century. On the hallway cupboard, Morris began (although never finished) a painting based on Thomas Malory's tale of how Sir Lancelot brought Sir Tristram and La Belle Iseult to the castle of the Joyous Garde. The figures themselves are depictions of some of Morris' friends, among them Jane, Faulkner, the Burne-Joneses, and Lizzie Siddel. In the dining room, Morris planned to decorate the walls with a series of embroidered female heroines, based in Geoffrey Chaucer's The Legend of Good Women. Produced by Jane and her sister Bessie, only seven or eight were completed.

Around the walls of the drawing room, Morris had wanted a mural featuring a series of scenes from the fifteenth-century Middle English romance of Sir Degrevant. Ultimately, three were executed by Burne-Jones, and survive today; they feature Morris as king and Jane as queen. Over the fireplace, Morris had inscribed a Latin motto, "Ars longa vita brevis", meaning "Life is short, but art endures." The settle from Red Lion Square was installed here, on top of which was fashioned a minstrels' gallery designed for Christmas concerts. Designs were pricked into the ceilings and then painted with simple, bold patterns. Commenting on the designs being introduced by his friend, in February 1862 Burne-Jones wrote that "Top [i.e. Morris] thrives through bandy, and is slowly making Red House the beautifullest place on Earth."

It was while living at Red House, in April 1861, that Morris co-founded a decorative arts company, Morris, Marshall, Faulkner & Co., with six other partners: Burne-Jones, Rossetti, Webb, Ford Madox Brown, Charles Faulkner, and Peter Paul Marshall. Operating from a premises at No. 6 Red Lion Square, they referred to themselves as "the Firm" and were intent on adopting Ruskin's ideas of reforming British attitudes to production. They hoped to reinstate decoration as one of the fine arts and adopted an ethos of affordability and anti-elitism. For additional staff, they employed boys from the Industrial Home for Destitute Boys in Euston, central London, many of whom were trained as apprentices. Although working within the Neo-Gothic school of design, they differed from Neo-Gothic architects like Gilbert Scott who simply included certain Gothic features on modern styles of building; instead they sought to return completely to Medieval Gothic methods of craftmanship.

The products created by the Firm included furniture, architectural carving, metalwork, stained glass windows, and murals. Their stained glass windows proved a particular success in the firm's early years as they were in high demand for the surge in the Neo-Gothic construction and refurbishment of churches, many of which were commissioned by the architect George Frederick Bodley. Despite Morris's anti-elitist ethos, the Firm soon became increasingly popular and fashionable with the bourgeoisie, particularly following their exhibit at the 1862 International Exhibition in South Kensington, where they received press attention and medals of commendation. However, they faced much opposition from established design companies, particularly those belonging to the Neo-Classical school.

Although the Firm was becoming more successful, it did not generate large profits in its early years. Mackail suggests that as a result, the Morris family were placed under increasing financial strain as they attempted to retain the lavish lifestyle to which they had become accustomed. Morris was also considering expanding operations at Upton by moving the Firm's workshops to the village. As part of this, he formulated a plan for a second wing of Red House to be constructed, to house the Burne-Jones family. Although Burne-Jones agreed and together they began to organise the design of the new house, these were disrupted when Georgiana contracted scarlet fever, resulting in the miscarriage of her second child. The plans were subsequently scrapped. It has been suggested that Burne-Jones may also have been loath to move from London at the time because his artistic career was becoming increasingly successful, and most of his contacts within the art world were in the city. Morris was deeply disappointed with this, writing to Burne-Jones: "As to our palace of art, I confess your letter was a blow to me at first, though hardly an unexpected one: in short I cried, but I have got over it now; of course I see it from your point of view".

Leaving Red House: 1865
With the collapse of his ideas regarding Upton becoming the base for the Firm's operations, Morris began to recognise various problems with the property. Being north-facing, the interior of the house was cold during winter, which aggravated Morris' various medical conditions, and its isolated location made it difficult for doctors to visit. The three-mile commute by carriage from the house to Abbey Wood railway station over an exposed and windy plateau further aggravated him, as did the daily commute from Abbey Wood to the Firm's offices in Bloomsbury, which took up three to four hours a day. Although various authors on the subject have asserted that there were financial considerations encouraging Morris to leave, it has been established that in 1865 Morris' dividends from his shares were higher than at any point since 1857.

Morris decided to move out of Red House and sell the property rather than rent it out, although no immediate purchaser appeared. He moved with his family to Queen Square in Bloomsbury in autumn 1865. Those pieces of furniture which proved too difficult to move to their new abode were left in Red House, where some of them are still present. Morris never returned to visit the Red House, commenting that the sight of it would be too emotional for him. Nevertheless, Mackail described the five years that Morris lived at Red House as being "probably the happiest and not the least fruitful of his life."

After Morris
Morris had been unable to find a buyer for Red House, and agreed to let it for £95 per annum to a retired commander in the Indian Navy named James Arnold Heathcote (1827–1877), who moved into the house in spring 1866. Having served at the siege of Multan, Heathcote had gone on to become a specialist in maritime surveying, marrying Eliza Margarita Burton and with her having two children, Marion and Rennie. After retirement he returned to England, moving to Red House with two servants. They also purchased pieces of Morris' furniture that were in the house; two of Morris' chairs remained in the Heathcote family until 1997, when they were sold at Christie's auction house in London to the Delaware Art Museum in Wilmington. After Heathcote's death at the House, it was purchased from Morris by a wealthy stockbroker, Edmund Charlesworth (1831–1890), who lived there from 1879 to 1889 with his wife Marta and daughter Laura. The Charlesworth family decorated the house's studio with Morris' "Daisy" wallpaper, which remains in place to the present.

In 1889 Charlesworth sold the Red House for £2,900 to Charles Holme (1848–1923), who remained owner until 1903. Holme had become prosperous through a woollen business in Bradford before expanding into the Asian goods trade and by the 1880s he was employed as a buyer for the Liberty department store. Married to Clara Benton, they had three daughters and a son, who moved with him to the House. Holme admired Morris, and it was here in 1893 that he founded the arts magazine, The Studio, which gave importance to the Arts and Crafts movement. The earliest photographs of Red House date from the period in which it was occupied by Holme. He also contributed to the development of the building by encouraging visitors to scratch their signatures into the window panes on the screen dividing the entrance hall from the gallery with either a diamond ring or glass-scratching implement. He collected over one hundred signatures here, from family members, friends, and visitors. Notable names include those of May Morris and Georgina Burne-Jones on their visit in 1897, and the names of Japanese visitors who were in London to collect a battleship docked on the River Thames; among the latter was the future Japanese Prime Minister Saitō Makoto. This would be a tradition continued by some of the later owners, with the latest engraving dating to 1952.

In 1903 the House was purchased by Henry Muff (1850–1910), a draper from Bradford who lived there with his wife Maude and their son Edward, who later became a noted architect. The Muffs were social activists involved in a number of progressive causes, with Maude being elected to Bexley Urban District Council in 1907, being the second woman in England to have been elected to a district council. In keeping with the fashions of the time, they introduced a lighter colour scheme throughout much of the House. Henry died at the house in 1910, although Maude continued to live there for another decade. In 1920, she began renting the property to Arthur James Sherwell (1863–1942), who had previously served as a Liberal Party member of parliament for Huddersfield from 1906 to 1918, positioning himself on the radical wing of the party. He moved to the House with his wife Amy Whadcoat, which they later purchased from Maude Muff.

In 1924, Sherwell sold Red House to Walter Scott Godfrey (1855–1936), the director of a wine and spirits merchant and an author on anti-theism who had been widowed two years previously. Of all the property's residents, he would live there for the shortest time, although he carried out one of the largest alterations, by removing the dividing wall between the downstairs waiting room and bedroom to create a study-cum-library and inserted a porthole window between this library and the Pilgrims' Rest, which was designed by his son, the architect Walter Hindes Godfrey. He lived at the house with his youngest daughter and three domestic servants, however he felt lonely at Red House and found its upkeep too expensive. In 1927 an Australian, Alfred Herbert Horsfall (1871–1944), purchased the house. A medical doctor, Horsfall had served as a medic in the British Army during the South African War, before moving to Britain and becoming a lecturer for the Social and Political Education League and staunch apologist for the British Empire. In the stock market crash of the early 1930s, Horsfall lost much of his money. He was unsuccessful in selling the House in 1932.

Threats and the Hollambys: 1934–2002
Horsfall attempted to sell the house again in 1934, this time with Harrods; he put forward an asking price of £4,000. Many believed that the house would be demolished to make way for encroaching suburban development, so a campaign group emerged with the hope of preserving the house and donating it to The National Trust; founding a preservation committee, they launched an appeal to purchase the property, with Horsfall agreeing that he would be willing to sell it to them for £3,100. The group sought to raise this amount, gaining the support of writers like Rudyard Kipling, George Bernard Shaw, H. G. Wells, and John Masefield, and architects Edwin Lutyens, Giles Gilbert Scott, Herbert Baker, and Raymond Unwin, as well as the former Prime Minister Ramsay MacDonald. They asserted that "We realise that at the present time the public are interested in other and very different movements in architecture and industrial art. We are however confident that, for the sake of its association with the work of William Morris and his group, the importance of this house will be appreciated in the future, and its loss in this regard will be recognised as irreparable." By December 1934, the committee's appeal had only raised £550 and the Trust were unwilling to foot the rest of the bill. The committee returned the donations that had been offered. On learning of this, May Morris commented that "That beautiful house is fated to have bad luck, it seems!"

The House was purchased by a local estate agent, Thomas Curtis Hills (c.1883–1957), in 1935. Aware of the threats posed to the house, he moved into it with his wife, Beatrice Nellie Foster. In 1941, during the Second World War, the government's Assistance Board took control of the house's ground floor, using it as an office to aid those left homeless by The Blitz. Commenting on this situation, a visitor to the building, Prime Minister of New Zealand Peter Fraser, stated that "I think Morris would be pleased to know that a house of his is being used for such a purpose. The house is being devoted to the service of the people and Morris was for the people all the time." An air raid shelter was constructed in the House's gardens for the use of the Assistance Board's staff. After the war, the House had fallen into a poor state and the Hills were keen to sell it. In 1950, they unsuccessfully attempted to sell it to the National Trust and then the Labour Party, before offering it for £5,000 to anyone "willing to preserve it for the nation". The same year, it was designated a Grade I [listed building] by English Heritage.

The couple moved out of the building in early 1951, and it was left empty for over a year; it was purchased for £3,500 by Richard "Dick" Toms (1914–2005) and Edward "Ted" Hollamby (1921–1999) in 1952.

Both architects working for the London County Council, Toms and Hollamby had a keen interest in Morris and embraced his socialist ideals, being members of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament and the British-Soviet Friendship Society. Deciding to share the property between themselves, they were only able to afford a mortgage with the aid of a loan from Toms' father-in-law; he only agreed to provide the loan if the house was owned in Toms' name, and thus Hollamby became Toms' tenant. Both architects had wives – Mary Toms and Doris Hollamby – and children, and thus both families moved into the building in 1952, dividing the rooms among themselves, with the old kitchen being used as a communal dining room. In 1954, a third architect, David Gregory Jones, joined them at the House, and together they set about renovating much of the property. In 1957 the Toms moved out, desiring to live closer to central London, and they were replaced by Jean and David Macdonald; Jean was an architect who worked alongside Ted Hollamby, while David was an accountant and woodworker. Rearranging the former ownership arrangements, the Macdonalds and Hollambys agreed to legally own half of the property each. However, in 1964 the Macdonalds left and the Hollambys assumed sole ownership of the House.

In 1953, the newly founded William Morris Society held its inaugural meeting at Red House, subsequently holding a garden party there in 1960 to commemorate its centenary. After his retirement in 1985, Ted Hollamby decided to open the House up to visitors, offering guided tours on one Sunday per month. As the number of those attending such tours grew, especially in the 1996 centenary of Morris' death, Hollamby began to search for a way of securing future public access. In 1998 he helped to establish the Friends of Red House, a group of individuals who were largely members of the Bexley Civic Society, and who helped to maintain the House and its gardens as well as give tours to visitors. Hollamby died in 1999, and his wife left Red House to move to a care home in 2002.

The National Trust
After Doris Hollamby put the house up for sale, an anonymous benefactor purchased it and donated it to The National Trust, who completed the purchase in 2003, with the Friends of Red House continuing to organise tours. Contributions from the William Morris Society and Bexley Council also aided the Trust in purchasing the building. It has since performed further restoration and research to restore the house as much as possible to its original condition. The house is open to the public, but not every day; guided tours must be advance-booked and unguided visits are available for limited periods. There is a tea room with a gift shop.

In November 2004, the National Trust organised a seminar titled "Red House: Past and Future Lives" at the Art Workers' Guild at which various specialists in the house presented papers on the subject.

In 2013, a previously unknown mural depicting five figures from the Book of Genesis was discovered in Morris' bedroom at the house. It was believed that it resembled the joint work of Morris, Burne-Jones, Rossetti, Siddal, and Ford Madox Brown; as a result, the building's property manager James Breslin described the mural as being "of international significance".

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1 Esdras

1 Esdras (Ἔσδρας Αʹ), also Esdras A, Greek Esdras, Greek Ezra, or 3 Esdras, is the ancient Greek Septuagint version of the biblical Book of Ezra in use within the early church, and among many modern Christians with varying degrees of canonicity. 1 Esdras is substantially similar to the standard Hebrew version of Ezra–Nehemiah, with the passages specific to the career of Nehemiah removed or re-attributed to Ezra, and some additional material.

As part of the Septuagint translation, it is now regarded as canonical in the churches of the East, but apocryphal in the West; either presented in a separate section, or excluded altogether. 1 Esdras is found in Origen's Hexapla. The Greek Septuagint, the  Old Latin bible and related bible versions include both Esdras Αʹ (English title: 1 Esdras) and Esdras Βʹ (Ezra–Nehemiah) as separate books.

There is scope for considerable confusion with references to 1 Esdras. The name refers primarily to translations of the original Greek 'Esdras A'. The Septuagint calls it Esdras A and the Vetus Latina calls it 1 Esdras, while the Vulgate calls it 3 Esdras. It was considered apocryphal by Jerome. The Vulgate book of Ezra, translated from the Hebrew was, from the 8th century onwards, occasionally split into two books, which were then denoted 1 Esdras (Ezra) and 2 Esdras (Nehemiah) respectively. Vulgate Bible editions of the 13th century, and in what later became the usage of the Clementine Vulgate and the Anglican Articles of Religion, '1 Esdras' is applied to the Book of Ezra; while the Book of Nehemiah corresponds to '2 Esdras'. Septuagint version Esdras A is called in the Clementine Vulgate 3 Esdras. The 'Apocalypse of Ezra', an additional work associated with the name Ezra, is denoted '4 Esdras' in the Clementine Vulgate and the Articles of Religion, but called '2 Esdras' in the King James Version and in most modern English bibles. 3 Esdras continues to be accepted as canonical by Eastern Orthodoxy and the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church, with 4 Esdras varying in canonicity between particular denominations within the Eastern churches.

Overwhelmingly, citations in early Christian writings claimed from the scriptural 'Book of Ezra' (without any qualification) are taken from 1 Esdras, and never from the 'Ezra' sections of Ezra–Nehemiah (Septuagint 'Esdras B'), the majority of early citations being taken from the 1 Esdras section containing the 'Tale of the Three Guardsmen', which is interpreted as Christological prophecy.

Contents
1 Esdras contains the whole of Ezra with the addition of one section; its verses are numbered differently. Just as Ezra begins with the last two verses of 2 Chronicles, 1 Esdras begins with the last two chapters; this suggests that Chronicles and Esdras may have been read as one book at sometime in the past.

Ezra 4:6 includes a reference to a King Ahasuerus. Etymologically, Ahasuerus is the same as Xerxes, who reigned between Darius I and Artaxerxes I. In 1 Esdras, the section is reorganized, leading up to the additional section, and the reference to Ahasuerus is removed.

The additional section begins with a story variously known as the 'Darius contest' or 'Tale of the Three Guardsmen' which was interpolated into 1 Esdras 3:4 to 4:4. This section forms the core of 1 Esdras with Ezra 5, which together are arranged in a literary chiasm around the celebration in Jerusalem at the exiles' return. This chiastic core forms 1 Esdras into a complete literary unit, allowing it to stand independently from the book of Nehemiah. Indeed, some scholars, such as W. F. Albright and Edwin M. Yamauchi, believe that Nehemiah came back to Jerusalem before Ezra.

Author and criticism
The purpose of the book seems to be retelling the Return to Zion in a way that it revolved around the story of the dispute among the courtiers, the 'Tale of the Three Guardsmen'. Since there are various discrepancies in the account, most scholars hold that the work was written by more than one author. However, some scholars believe that this work may have been the original, or at least the more authoritative. Most scholars agree that the original language of the work was Aramaic and Hebrew, with a few arguing for the originality of the Greek. The text contains similarities to the vocabulary in the Book of Daniel and II Maccabees, and it is presumed that the authors came either from Lower Egypt or Palestine and wrote during the Seleucid period. Assuming this theory is correct, many scholars consider the possibility that the book made use of an Aramaic chronicle.

Josephus makes use of the 1 Esdras which he treats as Scripture, while generally disregarding the canonical text of Ezra–Nehemiah. Some scholars believe that the composition is likely to have taken place in the second century BC. Many Protestant and Catholic scholars assign no historical value to the sections of the book not duplicated in Ezra–Nehemiah. The citations of the other books of the Bible, however, provide an early alternative to the Septuagint for those texts, which increases its value to scholars.

In the current Greek texts, the book breaks off in the middle of a sentence; that particular verse thus had to be reconstructed from an early Latin translation. However, it is generally presumed that the original work extended to the Feast of Tabernacles, as described in Nehemiah 8:13–18. An additional difficulty with the text appears to readers who are unfamiliar with chiastic structures common in Semitic literature. If the text is assumed to be a Western-style, purely linear narrative, then Artaxerxes seems to be mentioned before Darius, who is mentioned before Cyrus. (Such jumbling of the order of events, however, is also presumed by some readers to exist in the canonical Ezra and Nehemiah.) The Semitic chiasm is corrected in at least one manuscript of Josephus in the Antiquities of the Jews, Book 11, chapter 2 where we find that the name of the above-mentioned Artaxerxes is called Cambyses.

Some scholars, including Joseph Blenkinsopp in his 1988 commentary on Ezra–Nehemiah, hold that the book is a late 2nd/early 1st century BC revision of Esdras and Esdras β, while others such as L. L. Grabbe believe it to be independent of the Hebrew-language Ezra–Nehemiah.

Use in the Christian canon
The book was widely quoted by early Christian authors and it found a place in Origen's Hexapla. According to Jerome, 3 Esdras was considered apocryphal. As Jerome's Vulgate version of the Bible gradually achieved dominance in Western Christianity, 1 Esdras no longer circulated. From the 13th century onwards, Vulgate Bibles produced in Paris reintroduced a Latin text of 1 Esdras, in response to commercial demand. Clement VIII placed it in an appendix to the Vulgate along with 2 Esdras and the Prayer of Manasseh "lest they perish entirely". However, the use of the book continued in the Eastern Church, and it remains a part of the Eastern Orthodox canon.

1 Esdras is called 3 Esdras in the Latin Vulgate, which was translation from the Greek version of the Septuagint called 1 Esdras or Esdras A.

In the Roman rite liturgy, 1 Esdras is cited once in the Extraordinary Missal of 1962 in the Offertory of the votive Mass for the election of a Pope. Non participentur sancta, donec exsurgat póntifex in ostensiónem et veritátem ("Let them not take part in the holy things, until there arise a priest unto showing and truth.") (3 Esdras 5, 40).

The New Cambridge History of the Bible writes that 1 Esdras was finally "declared apocryphal by the Council of Trent". The New Catholic Encyclopedia writes that "The Council of Trent definitively removed it [1 Esdras] from the [Catholic] canon".

Nomenclature
The book normally called 1 Esdras is numbered differently among various versions of the Bible. In most editions of the Septuagint, the book is titled in Greek: Ἔσδρας Αʹ and is placed before the single book of Ezra–Nehemiah, which is titled in Greek: Ἔσδρας Βʹ.

Summary

 * Septuagint and its derivative translations: Ἔσδρας Αʹ = 1 Esdras
 * King James Version and many successive English translations: 1 Esdras
 * Clementine Vulgate and its derivative translations: 3 Esdras
 * Slavonic Bible: 2 Esdras
 * Romanian Synodal Version: III Ezdra
 * Ethiopic Bible: Ezra Kali

title: 1 Esdras


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Alt.fan.douglas-adams

Alt.fan.douglas-adams was proposed for deletion. This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was DELETE

The article claims that the newsgroup "is notable for several posts made to the group by Adams himself". I don't think so. Does a forum become notable just because somebody famous posts on it (whether or not the forum is about the poster)? Now, if this attracts great attention from people other than those who frequent the forum, may be, but I don't think this newsgroup is, on the whole, notable to the point that it deserves its own article. Certainly it may deserve a mention somewhere, but a whole article? - Furrykef 13:58, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * That fact should be mentioned in the Douglas Adams article. Delete. —Rory ☺ 16:21, Oct 9, 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. It is now mentioned in the Douglas Adams article. The mention is completely new text written by me, not copied from this article, so there should be no issues with losing the history of this one. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 16:48, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. Good result, great work team. Andrewa 18:15, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. JamesMLane 18:48, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. Not notable. I hope we don't start seeing other newsgroups listed on Wikipedia. --Improv 19:29, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * mmm see: Category:Newsgroups, some are OK articles. Richard Taylor 03:18, 10 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * There are certainly some vfd candidates in that category. alt.config for one. —Rory ☺ 10:09, Oct 10, 2004 (UTC)
 * Not really. The present article on alt.config is too substubby for it to matter whether it's deleted or not, but alt.config itself is quite an interesting newsgroup. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 01:42, 12 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete, non notable newsgroup — siro  χ  o  21:01, Oct 9, 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. Not notable.Gamaliel 07:23, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete seems useless --ScottyBoy900Q ∞ 04:09, 14 Oct 2004 (UTC)

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like other '/delete' pages is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion or on the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.


text:
User talk:Rolfmueller

ClockworkTroll 13:58, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Image:Threegorges.png
Very nice map. Any chance you could do one for Banqiao Dam? --Duk 17:54, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Wow, that was fast. wonderfull image, thanks. Duk 16:55, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Hi Rolfmueller, first of all, thanks for the map for Banqiao. I've checked my atlas -- the dam is at its correct location. ;) Is it fine with you if I add a small map of China in the bottom left corner, showing where the place is relative to the rest of the country?

About the Three Gorges picture -- "Chongching" should actually be spelled "Chongqing". -- ran (talk) 06:36, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)

 * For the new map, upload it under the same name it and it will replace the old name. (You'll get a warning message though, just click replace.) -- ran (talk) 07:03, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the new map! ;) I don't think I can do better, so let's use yours. What do you use to make your maps, btw? -- ran (talk) 17:05, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)

Longhua temple
Hi, I didn't want to call the section "History" because it isn't the entire history. It only deals with its use as execution/internment grounds. What do you think? --Sumple (Talk) 00:14, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

New Bedford Whaling National Historical Park
I was wondering if you'd like to move your photos of the New Bedford Whaling National Historical Park to Wikimedia Commons, where a category for it has been created (see the article for a link to it). Thanks for your contributions, by the way; I thought I was the only one doing photos of the area. :) -- LGagnon 01:00, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject Vietnam
Hi, I see that you're knowledgeable about Vietnam-related subjects, so I'd like to let you know about the new WikiProject Vietnam. If you'd like to join, please add your name under "Participants." Badagnani 05:16, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Possibly unfree Image:Picasso three musicians moma 2006.jpg
An image that you uploaded or altered, Image:Picasso three musicians moma 2006.jpg, has been listed at Possibly unfree images because its copyright status is disputed. If the image's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the image description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Lupo 12:14, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Wuzhi Mountain
Saw you edited the article. There is a move request at Talk:Wuzhi Shan to fix the recent move. TrueColour (talk) 01:27, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

Three Gorges Dam
Hi! Just a heads up, I think you pressed the wrong button here, as my edit removed the vandalism, not added it. Thanks! TN X Man 21:38, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

File:Xindamen.jpg
Hello. I saw that you put a Puf tag on this image, but you did not notify the uploader and you did not create the subsection on Possibly unfree files/2010 January 29. Please be advised that the image will not be reviewed for deletion if you do not complete these steps. --After Midnight 0001 16:04, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Autoreviewer
Hi Rolfmueller, after seeing one of your articles at New Page Patrol, I was surprised to see that an editor who contributes such interesting well written articles over such a long period hadn't already been approved as an Autoreviewer. So I've taken the liberty of rectifying that.  Ϣere Spiel  Chequers  21:52, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

Some useful pictures
Hi Rolfmueller, your article and photos about Shandong University are perfect, and I will try my best to improve the same article in zh. Wikipedia. I saw you're also interested in Cheeloo University, here are some useful pictures you may use, they're all PD-old in China.--猫猫的日记本 (talk) 00:14, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:Shandong university logo.jpg
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Jinan / Jyutping
I noticed that you re-inserted the Jyutping for Jinan, un-doing HkCaGu's reversion. Firstly, I thank you for this. I don't understand why Jyutping must not appear on articles not relating to Guangdong, Hong Kong, or Macau; it certainly helps, and MOS:Chinese states nothing against adding Jyutping to such articles. 华钢琴49 (TALK) 13:47, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

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Donglin Temple
Hi, per WP:FIXDABLINKS, would you be interested in cleaning up the 45 or so pages that now point to a disambig page? Thanks, -- Ja Ga  talk 10:20, 18 July 2010 (UTC)

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Thanks!
Thank you for creating the articles Shou Qiu and Shaohao Tomb. If you had not done it, I probably would never get around to doing it! -- Vmenkov (talk) 05:09, 6 March 2011 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/Shi Jianqiao
I've not fully reviewed Shi Jianqiao yet, but I recommend that you review an article that you majorly did not contribute, even if at this time you are not required to do so. I've discussed this already in the discussion page. --George Ho (talk) 08:54, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

DYK for Shi Jianqiao
( X! ·  talk )  · @224  · 08:01, 15 January 2013 (UTC)

Shi Jianqiao
I am going to nominate this article as a Good Article. Feel free to contribute to the review once it commences. Excellent work! QatarStarsLeague (talk) 22:51, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

Great Grandson of Watson M. Hayes
Hi Rolfmueller,

My name is John Robin Hayes, great grandson of W.M Hayes. My Grandfather, William Hayes and my father Robin Ernest Hayes. I knew John D. Hayes, my aunt Barbara well enough to say I knew her.

Are there any questions I can answer or maybe information I don't know? What inspired your interest in W.M. Hayes?

Thank you, John Robin Hayes — Preceding unsigned comment added by Johnrobinhayes (talk • contribs) 23:25, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

Shi Jianqiao
You'll be pleased to hear I have promoted this to GA. The review follows. Adam Cuerden (talk) 22:21, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

October 2013
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permission of image
Dear Rolfmueller,

I will publish a academic paper in a journal, I will use the following image in my paper.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Threegorges.png

How could I request the official permission of this image? And I need an signed permission document for publishing my paper.

With best regards,

WAN Yuanyang — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sway110 (talk • contribs) 12:01, 17 January 2018 (UTC)

Joseph-Antoine Provana
Joseph-Antoine Provana Thanks for your fascinating article! I wrote up a transcription of his grave: 1初六日{?}康熈2恩差往大西洋公幹絲3皇恩特賜安塟4欽差{?}西5Hic jacet L. Josephus Provana Societatis JESV Professussa cerdoset Miſsionarius Sinensis6康熈六十 Also, if his Chinese name is really 艾若瑟, then I can't imagine that the pinyin for his name is Ài Xùnjué. Should be Ai Ruose right? Thanks again for your work, really cool stuff.Geographyinitiative (talk) 09:14, 24 January 2018 (UTC)

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Talk:Cowrie

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Standard Spelling
Why is this article insisting on the spelling "cowry" as normative? Most dictionaries don't even list "cowry" as a variant of cowrie, and most of the exceptions just cite it as a exactly that -- a variant of cowrie. See Webster's Revised Unabridged, American Heritage, Dictionary.com Unabridged, the Encyclopedia Britannica, etc. In accordance with the WP:MOS, I have looked into whether this is a difference between national varieties of English, and I found no evidence that it is. I intend to move the page and change the misleading leading line about the word "sometimes" being spelled cowrie, unless I'm missing something. Mtiffany (talk) 20:15, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
 * My dictionaries are not brand new, but OED, American Heritage, and Random House all give both spellings. The first two give them equal weight, whereas Random House prefers cowrie. I agree the article should not say that the word is only "sometimes" spelled cowrie (which is the spelling I'm used to), but I also don't think it's important which spelling the article itself uses. Richard K. Carson (talk) 18:01, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Size of European cowries
I do not think there is any European cowry with size as small as 5 mm. Probably some confusion with family Triviidae. Charles Geerts

as a currency
From the lecture notes of "Economics, 3rd Edition" (Audio course by The Teaching Company) by Timothy Taylor (professor at Macalester College and Managing Editor of the Journal of Economic Perspectives): "In the history of the world, the item used for money over the broadest geographic area and for the longest period of time is probably the cowrie, a mollusk shell found mainly off the Maldive Islands in the Indian Ocean." —Preceding unsigned comment added by DKEdwards (talk • contribs) 07:00, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Video in Commons of two live-collected Cypraea caputserpentis...
Aloha!

I have uploaded a brief (~20 sec.) video of a Honey cowry (C. helvola) and a Snakehead cowry [generally named Cypraea caputserpentis Linneaus, 1758 but these are Hawaiian cowries and may be the subspecies caputophidii, a.k.a. Erosaria (Ocellaria) caputophidii Schilder, 1927]. I'm not experienced at editing these articles but I will try to make it possible for anyone to view the video by clicking on the image already in the Cowry article,... unless, of course, someone else beats me to it! (Nudge, nudge,... wink, wink!)

The video is at http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Cypraea_caputserpentis.ogg (There is no soundtrack.)

Makuabob 14:46, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

OK! I could not find a way to make the still image have a link to the video, so I have replaced the still image WITH the video. There may be formatting issues with the long list of species names, depending on just how wide a person's browser is set. More than 800 pixels may have the list bleeding into the Taxobox.

I will try to find a formatting guide on how to keep the list below the end of the Taxobox. Makuabob 22:14, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Wow! Thanks, Mgiganteus1 !!

That's a great fix. Looks good!

Makuabob 00:11, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

Added another video but forgot that being logged-in on Commons did not mean logged-in here; thus, the IP number vice my log-in name. Makuabob 01:11, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

Why did "Invertzoo" chop up the article?...
It seems the COWRY article has been demoted from semi-coherent english to near gibberish. As in,

Cowry, rarely spelled cowrie, plural always cowries, is the common name for a one group of sea snails, marine gastropod mollusks. The word cowry is perhaps most often used for the shells of these sea snails.

Cowries are scientifically known as the genus Cypraea and family Cypraeidae.

(It is worth noting that a few species in the family Ovulidae are also often referred to as cowries, and in the British Isles the local Trivia species Triviidae are sometimes called cowries. These other two famlies are somewhat closely related to the Cypraeidae.)

Many people find the shiny, porcelain-like shells of cowries pleasing to look at and to handle.

I see "cowrie" rather frequently. It is not a 50-50 split but certainly much more than once in a hundred. One-in-a-hundred, to me, is rare. What source says "cowrie" is rare?

What is "name for a one group of sea snails, marine gastropod mollusks" supposed to mean? If "Invertzoo" is a native speaker of the english language, he/she shouldn't drink heavily AND edit Wikipedia. I have a half century of experience using edited American english and I am having trouble trying arrange that phrase into something sensible.

"Cowries are scientifically known as the genus Cypraea and family Cypraeidae" is redundant. It's in the Taxobox. Why not describe the entire sequence?

"...the local Trivia species Triviidae..." Is the local Trivia species named Triviidae?

"These other two famlies are somewhat closely related to the Cypraeidae." What about the Erato, or the Cypraeacassis, or Jenneria, OR Pseudocypraea? All are "closely related" to the Cypraeidae. Erato are frequently mistaken for tiny cowries. Jenneria also is mistaken for an unusual type of cowry. See the article at http://cowrys.org/archive/NSN127CY.HTM#C for more info.

I suggest that the original text be restored until something more comprehensible is available.

Makuabob 17:40, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Taxonomy issues are vague...
The Cypraea, according to Wikipedia's own item on the Cypraeidae, is a 'tribe' in the sub-family of Cypraeinae, not a genus of its own. The deleted line asserted that the Cypraea was a genus in the family Cypraeidae. Either this line in the 'Cowry' article had to go, or the item on Cypraeidae has to be changed. By deleting this particular reference, I am NOT saying that I agree with the Cypraeidae item (which has internal problems), only that the two statements are at odds.

Some taxonomists make finer distinctions than others when it comes to just how different one 'group' of cowries is from another. Linneaus coined the genus Cypraea to include all cowry-like shells. Times are different now and some of the animals turn out to be not so similar to those generally associated with the vast majority of cowry-type shells.

There is a standing debate between Conchologists (shell morphology) and Malacologists (animal characteristics, of which the shell is one part). If the Malacologists take over defining cypraeid species, what is to happen in the studies of extinct Cypraea? A large number of Cypraeid fossils are true fossils, i.e., all of the original material has been lost and other minerals have assumed the shells' shapes; no tissue remains, none of the original structures.

(The parenthetical paragraph in the Cowry article will be worked on next...) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Makuabob (talk • contribs) 16:26, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Both the Cypraeidae article and this one list Cypraea as a genus. However, I think the sentence you removed was redundant to the taxobox anyway. Mgiganteus1 16:57, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Species list needs help...
The listing of "species" is in need of some truly professional moderation. Well-known species have been found to be misspelled, or missing altogether, while many 'new' names nonetheless get inserted.

In fairness to the Users of Wikipedia, reviews need to be independent of any person, or persons, who have vested interests the listing (and, unavoidably, the appearance of 'orthodoxy') of species names.

It was some time ago, also, that the ICZN obviated the need for "-ii" ending on specific names. One "i" is considered sufficient. Makuabob (talk) 18:44, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Still more evidence for moderation of the species list can be seen in the entry for Cypraea alfredensis Schilder & Schilder, 1929. The 'species' was actually proposed as a sub-species by the Schilders (Luponia edentula alfredensis Sch.-Sch., 1929 Ann. Museum Wein, Vol. 43, p. 231). Someone needs to quote their authority for elevating this to a species, or the entry should be eliminated. (Eliminated the name on 4SEP08. No response to the above request for citing authority for its specific rank.) Makuabob (talk) 21:16, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

I removed Cypraea geographica Schilder, 1933 because Schilder himself proposed it as a sub-specific name for Mauritia mappa, as in Mauritia mappa geographica Schilder, 1933 (Zool. Meded. Leiden, Vol. 16, p. 198). Makuabob (talk) 11:27, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

I have added Cypraea mauiensis Burgess, 1967 (The Nautilus, Vol. 81 (1), pp.6-11, Pl. 2) to the species list. Makuabob (talk) 01:53, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

More names of long-standing species have been added; several dates were corrected on other entries: C. picta, Gray — Zool. Jour., Vol. 1, n. 54, pp. 389, 390, Pl. 12 C. schilderorum, Iredale — Aust. Zool., Vol. 9, p. 303 C. ventricullis, Lamarck — Ann. Mus., Vol. 15, n. 13, p.452 Makuabob (talk) 16:31, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

Concerning Cypraea spadicea Swainson, 1823... The ITIS entry is an error. The molluscan data in the ITIS was taken from: Turgeon et al., eds. 1998. Common and Scientific Names of Aquatic Invertebrates from the United States and Canada: Mollusks, second edition. AFS Special Publication 26. In this publication, the date is 1823. An entry error has slipped into the ITIS database. I am reverting the date to 1823. Makuabob (talk) 16:01, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

Genus/Family
I cannot understand why this article is entitled Cowry, surely that name should be kept as a common name for Cypraeidae. Shouldn't this article be renamed Cypraea, one of the genera in Cypraeidae? GrahamBould (talk) 23:33, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I think this article functions more as a 'gateway' to enhanced understanding for those who may have heard of a seashell named "cowry" than it does as a scientific reference article. Those like you & I, already familiar with the genus Cypraea, should be comfortable enough with its common name to allow others to gain access to basic facts simply by knowing "cowry."
 * Makuabob (talk) 20:11, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, but why use one genus in Cypraeidae as the gateway? The intro to Cypraeidae reads "Cypraeidae, common name the cowries,...".  Wouldn't this be the appropriate level? GrahamBould (talk) 21:33, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

 * OK! Now I know why we use one genus, Cypraea, as the 'gateway.' I went to the Cypraeidae item (which, BTW, needed some extra info) in Wikipedia and followed every link on the list and only one, Cypraea, led to any information. When some industrious person starts filling in the all those dead-end links, maybe we should come back to your original question. For now, it seems that Cypraea is all we have and, for now, I can live with "Cowry" as the name of the only article that gives any info on a genus in the family Cypraeidae,... in Wikipedia. If, after looking at this article, someone has an unfulfilled need for more information, there are wikilinks here to take them to Cypraeidae.
 * Makuabob (talk) 23:46, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

External links to commercial sites
Does Wikipedia allow external links to commercially-oriented sites where the item/s in the Wikipedia article is/are for sale? One of the external links in this article does just that while all others lead to educational/not-for-profit sites. Should it be eliminated? Makuabob (talk) 17:34, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

Reference/external link added
Added a link to an on-line article that gives the earliest period (Shang Dynasty) that cowries were used as money. Makuabob (talk) 03:22, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Species list may need to be eliminated
I continue to find omissions of long-standing, undisputed species names. Also, the change of case to the authors' names and dates of publications made me look around WP to see how similar groups of animals were handled. No other group that I could find has author/date information.

Cones shells were the closest, both in popularity and availability, to the cowries. At best, it equates specific names to popular names,... fraught with peril for any group. What's to stop adding the popular names from all areas of the globe?

At the least (not my preference), the list should be stripped of authors and dates; better would be to eliminate the list altogether. Having the data in the article smacks of authority to include and exclude. I have no such authority and claim none. Find an "authority" to set the list's contents and someone will find another "authority" to oppose it. This doesn't sound like what WP is about (not to say it doesn't happen).

This is not a zoological reference item, just general information. The average user doesn't care about "authority" or "date of publication." Look at other WP items about genera with many species; it is not included. A poorly constructed list of names is not of much use, unless confusion is the object of the list.

I think the Cowry article will be better without a list of species names. Makuabob (talk) 21:51, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

 * OK, I'll eliminate the authors and dates on the first of February (or ASAP thereafter). Barring some reasonable and coherent argument to have the Cowry article become a zoological authority on the genii of the Cypraeidae, the list itself will be squelched at some point thereafter. Makuabob (talk) 23:08, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

 * After carefully checking other gastropod entries (conchs, cone shells, murex,... etc.), it can be seen that no other group includes author and date with the specific binomial. Cowry should be no worse than these others but the authors and dates are unnecessary for an article that is fundamental in scope. Makuabob (talk) 22:20, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

 * If whitespace is a concern, the list itself should go or could be formatted into three columns. Also, the Contents box creates a large blank space, should that be reformatted? No other major genus in Wikipedia gives long lists of species with authority and date. See explanation above. Makuabob (talk) 13:58, 12 April 2009 (UTC)
 * See Conus. The inclusion of binomial authorities is a personal style preference of some editors (many fish articles include them, for example). This was the original format of the list and should not be changed unless there is a compelling reason to do so, as such an edit removes relevant information which some readers may find useful (as I do myself). mgiganteus1 (talk) 14:57, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

 * It is clearer now: a personal style preference of some editors. The question was raised previously about whether this item presumed to be authorative. Apparently, it does. I will observe and see just how that plays out. Makuabob (talk) 18:52, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

Please explain why "Further reading" was added
I found the index (only) online of ACTA CONCHYLIORUM NR. 10 and saw nothing that could reasonably be considered as 'novice' or 'beginner' subject matter. There appear to be numerous color plates, but the full issue itself is not available online and seems to be of limited print circulation. How does this "Further reading" enhance a curious web surfer's understanding? Is this an advertisement for that particular club? How does it tie with the Wikipedia article "Cowry?" With no reason for being part of this article, it begs to be Reverted. Makuabob (talk) 01:04, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Removed redundant comment at top of Discussion page
And removed the commercial URLs... Makuabob (talk) 23:11, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Behavior and anatomy
I think this article needs some information on Anatomy and general behavior of the Cowries. I don't know if the behavior is widely varied or relatively constant from species to species but it should at least be noted if it is variable. Some general information on anatomy, like average life span, life cycle, Senses, and so on should be included as well. I think diet should be included as well. As far as I know they are almost all opportunistic omnivorous. Most sites say they are scavengers but there are a few (sketchy) claims of them also being predators to small slow moving animals.--Tsar bomber (talk) 19:27, 16 May 2010 (UTC)

 * I second this request. See my comment below. Dough34 (talk) 21:08, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

Cowry and Cypraea
Should Cowry and Cypraea be merged? -- Basilicofresco  (msg) 00:29, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

 * It would be better to merge Cowry and Cypraeidae since most cowries are not now considered to be members of the genus Cypraea.Therealsleepycat (talk) 07:39, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

 * I have removed the content that was completely duplicite with Cypraea, moved one of its section to the Shell money article. The article may redirect either to the Cypraeoidea or more likely to the Cypraeidae and then merge to them. Or it can stay as a short article about the vernacular name (I would suggest this option). --Snek01 (talk) 14:51, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Move
As noted above, "cowry" exists. It's also not the  form of the word in any dialect. Cowrie's been more common since the 19th century at least; and remains more common than "cowry" at Google Scholar. The page is and has been in the wrong place. — Llywelyn II   18:20, 28 August 2019 (UTC)

Thai
This—กปรฺท—was placed agrammatically at the end of the Etym section without explanation. I removed it as presumptive vandalism, but if it's somehow connected to the etymology, kindly add it back and flesh that part out. — Llywelyn II   18:24, 28 August 2019 (UTC)

Cowrie-shell divination
Various forms of cowrie-shell divination are used throughout West Africa and the African diaspora. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 8.25.157.161 (talk) 20:54, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

Merger proposal
I propose merging Whiteshell into Cowrie. The former is only two sentences with one source on a specific use of cowrie shells already mentioned in the Cowrie article, and seems like it would fit in more naturally here. — Moriwen (talk) 19:32, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
 * ✅ Klbrain (talk) 11:34, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

etymology
etym online gives the other way around definition of porcelain, not the shells name from itbut porcelain from the schells name.don't know how to change it here, sorry here's the link https://www.etymonline.com/word/porcelain#etymonline_v_18472 89.209.173.63 (talk) 22:17, 5 September 2023 (UTC)

Lacks biological content
This article focuses almost totally on the uses of cowrie shells and has very little info about the biology of the organism. Maybe the missing biology should be in one article (Cowrie) and the shell content (Uses of cowrie shells) should have it's own separate article? -- Dough34 (talk) 21:04, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Cowrie


text:
Santa Maria delle Grazie

Santa Maria delle Grazie (St. Mary of Graces) may refer to:

 * Our Lady of Graces, a devotion to the Virgin Mary in the Roman Catholic Church

Churches in Italy

 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Alcamo
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Arezzo
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Brescia
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Este
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Foce di Amelia
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Loro Piceno
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Milan
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Montefiascone
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Pesaro
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Pistoia
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Riccia
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, San Severino Marche
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Scandriglia
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Senigallia
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie, Varallo
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie a Capodimonte, Naples
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie a Mondragone, Naples
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie a Toledo, Naples
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie a Via Trionfale, Rome
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie alle Fornaci fuori Porta Cavalleggeri, Rome
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie di Montevergine, Palermo
 * Santa Maria delle Grazie Maggiore a Caponapoli, Naples
 * Basilica of Santa Maria delle Grazie, Cortemaggiore

Other structures

 * Santa Maria delle Grazie Tower, a watchtower in Xgħajra, Malta

title: Santa Maria delle Grazie


text: Category:Marine parks

title: Category:Marine parks


text:
User talk:Charles Geerts

ClockworkTroll 14:01, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:Charles Geerts


text:
South Miami station

South Miami station is a station on the Metrorail rapid transit system in South Miami, Florida. This station is located at the intersection of South Dixie Highway (US 1) and Sunset Drive (SW 72nd Street/SR 986), two blocks west of Red Road (West 57th Avenue). It opened to service May 20, 1984.

South Miami provides access to The Shops at Sunset Place, as well as a number of local hospitals.

Station layout
The station has two tracks served by an island platform, with a parking garage immediately west of the platform.

title: South Miami station


text:
Lake Charlevoix

Lake Charlevoix is a lake in Charlevoix County in the U.S. state of Michigan. It is the third largest inland lake in the state with a surface area of over 17,200 acre and 56 mi of shoreline. The maximum depth in the main basin is 122 ft and in the south arm, 58 ft.

The lake's largest tributaries are the Jordan River, feeding into the south arm at East Jordan, and the Boyne River, flowing into the main basin from the east at Boyne City. Other significant tributaries include Horton, Stover, Porter, and Loeb Creeks. The outflow of Lake Charlevoix is the short Round Lake/Pine River complex which discharges into Lake Michigan at Charlevoix. The lake's watershed covers 335 sqmi in Charlevoix and Antrim Counties, and a small portion of the northwest corner of Otsego County.

The lake occupies portions of Charlevoix Township, Marion Township, Hayes Township, Eveline Township, Bay Township, and Evangeline Township.

Young State Park is located on the shore of the lake just northwest of Boyne City. The Ironton Ferry at Ironton, a designated Michigan Historical Site in operation since 1876, crosses the south arm where it branches off from the main basin, saving about 20 minutes of driving time around the south arm by the shoreline route.

The lake was also known previously as Pine Lake and Long Lake. It was renamed from "Pine Lake" to its current name ("Lake Charlevoix") in 1926.

title: Lake Charlevoix


text:
User talk:Dovy

ClockworkTroll 14:05, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

title: User talk:Dovy


text:
User talk:Hulleye

ClockworkTroll 14:05, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Pakistanis
Please consider listing yourself at Wikipedians/Pakistan —iFaqeer | Talk to me! 22:01, Oct 21, 2004 (UTC)

COTW on Partition of India
The Partition of India article is up for a Collaboration of the Week if yer interested in helping out. Article needs a lot of work but for the moment you can simply add yer vote for it. Hulleye 08:18, 27 Nov 2004 (UTC)

 * Yaar, That should be fun! But you do realize that it will be controversial. For example, the following statement is not just a POV, but patently inaccurate:

 * Very shortly after being awarded of dominion status by the British Empire (independence), on August 15, 1947, the colony of British India was divided into two independent nations, India and Pakistan...

 * But a lot of Indians might fight to keep it.

 * The 35 votes seem like they will easily be found—and it will be fun to be part of this. —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 20:40, Nov 27, 2004 (UTC)

 * I entirely agree this will be a contentious issue for several people... myself included... but at the same time, it should be an exercise worth doing Hulleye 14:16, Nov 28, 2004 (UTC)

 * I did end up voting for it. I guess I am just reacting from having had similar discussions with Indian friends here in the US. Even with those Indians whom I have major agreement with on almost every other topic (human rights, tolerance, and so on), the differences on topics like this can be stark and often startling.

 * BTW, are you the same person who wrote this:   —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 21:20, Nov 28, 2004 (UTC)

 * yup. write a monthly column for the magazine. but rather pissed with what they do online. they just pick two random paragraphs and stick them together so you really don't even get an idea of the context. irritating as hell. Hulleye 07:57, Nov 29, 2004 (UTC)

Partition of India
You voted for Partition of India, this week's Collaboration of the week. Please come and help it become a featured-standard article.

Habib R. Sulemani
On the Talk:Habib R. Sulemani page, there is a question as to whether Mr. Sulemani's biography meets the Criteria for inclusion of biographies.

We also need a reality check about Mr. Sulemani. I expressed the opinion that, because of your position at Herald, you might possibly know something about him. Do you have any information about Mr. Sulemani, or is he - as I think - nearly unknown? Egalitus 23:57, 13 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * I've asked some senior reporters in Dawn and nobody has heard of this guy.

 * I've posted your reply to the talk page. Thanks. Egalitus 17:57, 15 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Dubious User:Egalitus with vengeance: This user User:Egalitus is a dubious person and seems out of vengeance here … He/she is involved in acts of vandalization and seems a ‘negativist.’ Either he/she is User:Hulleye  or some one relating to him/her. Thus there can be some professional rivalery with the title of the article. User:Egalitus has chosen User:Hulleye the sole authority for an ‘oral verification’ leaving the written articles aside. Moreover, in the main article Habib R. Sulemani, it is no mentioned that he was an employe of Dawn. Also see Verifiability 20:44, 15 Dec 2004 202.176.255.170

 * To User 202.176.255.170: I am a little saddened by your reaction. I realize it must be hard to maintain perspective in the face of criticism of Mr. Sulemani, if you are him, or are close to him. This is one of the reasons it is not a good idea to write Wikipedia articles about yourself or people that you intimately know (To quote Auto-biography, ".. articles have been a source of dismay to their original authors after a period of editing by the community, and in at least three instances have been listed for deletion by their original authors." Also see the criterion from Criteria for inclusion of biographies, "has this been written by the subject or someone closely involved with the subject?".)
 * I have contributed over 250 edits to Wikipedia since March 24, 2004. I have never before been accused of vandalism. That charge is unmerited.
 * For the record, I'd like to say the following:
 * I am not Hulleye or a relative of his, and do not know him personally. I believe he lives in Pakistan. I have lived in the USA for a very long time. That is why I needed a "reality check" from a journalist in Pakistan - not as an employment reference, but to ask if Mr. Sulemani was well-known in the profession. The article does not use Hulleye as an authority for any assertion, let alone the "sole authority."
 * I have no professional rivalry or personal enmity towards Mr. Sulemani. I never knew of him before I saw his name here on Wikipedia. I am not and have never been a journalist or poet, or a professional editor or writer. Other than an article I co-authored long ago in the American Journal of Hematology, I have never had an article published in a subscription-based periodical.
 * Finally, if I have hurt your feelings, I am regretful. Egalitus 22:46, 16 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * Well said, Egalitus. Are you going to/shouldn't you copy this to the Talk page on Sulemani? —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 23:09, Dec 16, 2004 (UTC)

Dawn
Just created Dawn, Karachi and added a line to Dawn. Want to help/add? —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 01:03, Dec 22, 2004 (UTC)

 * Hola iFaqeer. would love to help out with this, but really bad timing. haven't been in front of a 'puter in days. am currently busy with some personal things and completely caught up with that.

dunno if you've already seen this or not but there already was a Dawn (newspaper) stub out there. so one or the other will prob need to be merged. And as far as that line you added to Dawn is concerned, it should not have been there at all. that article specifically refers to the natural phenomenon. will remove it from there. Hulleye 15:16, Dec 29, 2004 (UTC)

 * I don't know what I was smoking. Sorry. Have merged the two. I guess I should stay on Wikivacation for a bit. Thanks for your help. —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 23:29, Dec 29, 2004 (UTC)

Congrats?
You've moved to Spider? Promotion? Congrats? —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 00:02, Feb 18, 2005 (UTC)

 * is this:
 * http://spider.tm/editorial.html
 * hopelessly out-of-date?
 * Shouldn't there be a Wikipedia entry about Spider?
 * —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 00:13, Feb 18, 2005 (UTC)

 * haha... yeah. it'll probably stay that way for a while as well... though the print version will prob start carrying my name on the masthead from this month. dunno why, but these chaps at dawn are serious technophobes... they despise new technologies. and thus our websites get treated worse than poor stepson cinderfella.

anyhow, was wondering if i could get yer permission to reproduce some of the stuff from rickshaw.blogspot ?

Muslim educational institutions
Just started Muslim educational institutions. Please take a look and see if you can help. —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 00:27, Feb 26, 2005 (UTC)

I take it you got my e-mail?
You added the Urdu template to your page, so ... —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 17:29, May 18, 2005 (UTC)

yeah, did get your mail... will reply soon. just gotta say, that's a really ugly looking template... uggh... hate the green! Hulleye 07:55, May 19, 2005 (UTC)

American radio show about wikipedia
Hi

My name is Robin Amer and I’m a producer for an American public radio show called Open Source, which you can check out at www.radioopensource.org.

I’m writing you because this week we’re doing a show on Wikipedia including an interview with Jim Wales. We’re also looking for some particularly passionate and interesting Wikipedia users to talk to, especially users outside the US. I would love to talk to you about your involvement with the site. If you are interested, please give me a call at 617-497-8096, or email me at robinamer@riseup.net and send me your phone number.

Thanks so much.

Best, Robin Amer www.radioopensource.org

Discussion at Talk:Pakistan
Would you like to join the animated discussion on the Pakistan's talk page? The current issue is whether "Pakistan is famous for its support of Taliban and 9/11 terrorist" is a suitable sentence to start the article's first paragraph or not. Your contribution would be much appreciated, as the current discussion seems to be more of a dialog between User:Ragib and SamTr014 (talk • contribs). Thanks !--Sheikhu 05:50, 18 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Benazir Bhutto
R you interested in to join the discussion of cleaning up the article of Benazir Bhutto? Talk:Benazir Bhutto .--Raju1 03:05, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Imran Khan
Replacing overs with balls does make more sense. I'll get back to you in a while Tintin 14:13, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

'Lo
So you're back editing here, huh? Cool!!

BTW, I have requested Wikia to turn off the spam filter for WikiPak. Try editing again. —iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 08:36, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

 * yeah, actually never really left... just didn't have the time to sit down and do proper edits... still don't. Just do a "hit and run" edit whenever I get a chance, revert some vandalism or add some tags here or there. Still nothing heavy-duty. How about yourself, staying active here or is Wikicities taking up more of your time? I'll swing by there and see if I can create an account now. Hulleye 09:20, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

Urdu Wikipedia
Asalam-o-Alikum

I request you to please contribute to Urdu wikipedia. We are trying hard to build this wiki. Current article count is 617. Your help in any way would be appreciated.Wisesabre 06:24, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

Adab
Adab from an Indian wikipedian. --Bhadani 09:24, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 12:52, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Hulleye


text:
User talk:Dbroda

ClockworkTroll 14:05, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Neptune Technologies

The article Neptune Technologies has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern: "No sources to indicate this company meets the notability requirements of WP:CORP"

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. UnitedStatesian (talk) 17:05, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

title: User talk:Dbroda