text:
Talk:AltGr key

AltGr + Shift + s ... Impossible in US???
I spent some time trying the to do AltGr + Shift + S. I did the following experiment:

LShift + LCtrl + LAlt + s : No result

LShift + LCtrl + RAlt + s : No result

LShift + RCtrl + LAlt + s : No result

LShift + RCtrl + RAlt + s : No result

RShift + LCtrl + LAlt + s : No result

RShift + LCtrl + RAlt + s : No result

RShift + RCtrl + LAlt + s : No result

RShift + RCtrl + RAlt + s : No result

Which leads me to suspect that none of the finger acrobatics presented here actually work on American keyboards. I don't care enough to fix the wiki because I don't want the hassle of registering for it, but the instructions given here are just plain wrong. Maybe somebody else will do that for me.

I find it incredibly agitation the Mojang would be so careless to use such an obscure key in their international software. Some nations, such as the United States, don't adhere to national standards, but only author them.

timothylegg — Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.234.0.138 (talk) 22:55, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

 * These hotkeys are only supported in the US-International keyboard layout, not in the standard US keyboard layout. --Matthiaspaul (talk) 01:19, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

 * It may be outdated but
 * § = Altgr + s + o
 * ß = Altgr + s + s
 * ẞ = Altgr + S + S
 * I just found the keystrokes on their respective wikipage. FirminMartin (talk) 22:31, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

Ctrl-Alt or AltGr

 * "On US and UK keyboards, Windows maps the combination Ctrl-Alt to AltGr; in the rest of the world, the right Alt key is mapped to AltGr."
 * Anybody know what the original author is talking about here? As a counter-example, on the Japanese keyboard the Alt key does not map to AltGr, but it maps to Alt. I can use the alt key just like I use the alt key on US keyboards. I wouldn't be surprised if the same thing can be said about keyboards for other languages as well. --68.22.251.127
 * OK, I think I understand what the original author was trying to say. I am going to clarify it as follows: "Keyboards designed for some locales, such as the US and UK keyboards, do not have the AltGr key. In order to compensate for this deficiency, Windows maps the Ctrl+Alt keyboard combination to AltGr." Question: Is AltGr+Del (on keyboards that have AltGr) equivalent to Ctrl+Alt+Del? If not, maybe someone should mention that the two aren't completely equivalent. Also maybe someone could mentioin where AltGr is positioned on the keyboard, and if it's called by another name on some keyboards (e.g. for the Japanese keyboards, I've never seen an "AltGr" label on it, so if there actually is an AltGr key on Japanese keyboards, then it obviously is called by another name.) --68.22.251.127 08:42, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)

So....does anyone else who speaks English natively understand what it is that this article is trying to explain?

This is rambling and unintelligible and should be removed in the interests of the credibility of Wikipedia....Paul Trundley 01/03/14 (ie 01 March) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 49.193.187.40 (talk) 21:43, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Here are my 2 cents: In most keyboards with two ALT keys, they are actually different keys (they are mapped into different codes) even if both just have "Alt" written on top. You can use the ALT key at the right of the space bar as an AltGr key as long as you have choosen a keyboard layout that uses the AltGr key. It won't have the AltGr label on top but you know it is the one at the right of the space bar ;)

For this, you can choose US International or UK Extended options in Windows. So far, maybe you already knew it. But some US and UK keyboards do not have a physical ALT key at the right of the space bar. For some extrange reason, they preffere to put two Ctrl keys and only one Alt key (which I think should be the opposite). In that case, the AltGr key can be simulated pressing at the same time the Left Alt and Ctrl. From there on, just as usual... 24.6.198.12 (talk) 02:29, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

 * "On compact keyboards like those of netbooks, the right Alt key may be missing altogether. To allow the specific functionality of AltGr when typing non-English text on such keyboards, Windows allows it to be emulated by pressing the Alt key together with the Control key: ..."
 * Replaced "Windows allows" with "many Windows applications allow" following a discussion in https://github.com/microsoft/terminal/issues/5525; if anyone feels it should be reverted, please add a reference to an authoritative Windows specification of that behaviour. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Towopedia (talk • contribs) 12:08, 13 May 2020 (UTC)
 * "Many" is not really correct. In fact just a few rather old applications (like Windows Terminal, as mentioned in the Github discussion) that take control of the keyboard directly. And, as the discussion (which is not a WP:RS by the way) points out, there are existing applications that use Ctrl+Alt and AltGr for entirely independent and valid purposes. --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 15:40, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

Japanese on US keyboards

 * "For many other countries Alt Gr is a very important key, for example in ... Japan, where without the key you can't even type all of the kana. "
 * Again, what is the original author talking about? I can type Japanese fine using US keyboards. I use the Alt-` keyboard shortcut to switch between English and Japanese input modes: then I can simply type Japanese via romaji. --68.22.251.127
 * I removed his/her edit - I would like to see higher quality editing and better accuracy with facts. --68.22.251.127 08:42, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Meaning
A recent edit made the intro read:

 * AltGr, an abbreviation for "accent grave"...

If it stands for "accent grave", why is there an L in it? And why does it produce acute accents rather than grave ones? I know nothing about the subject, if you told me AltGr stood for "alternating grease-monkey" I wouldn't be able to say it didn't with authority, but this does seem a bit odd to me. --Camembert

 * I like the recent rewrite that deals with this (among other things) - thanks to anon :) --Camembert
 * Yeah, but on the other hand claiming that "Alt Gr" could possibly stand for "accent grave" is patent bullshit. It's a bit like adding to the IBM article that the company's TLA doesn't stand for "The Unbearable Lightness Of Being" or "World Domination".  So I would advocate throwing that section out altogether. --Maikel 15:40, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * On second thoughts and the same reasoning, I wouldn't mind throwing that "Alternative Group" bit as well ... --Maikel 15:46, 7 October 2005 (UTC)

"The meaning of "AltGr" is unclear ... but IBM unequivocally says ... that it is an abbreviation for "alternate graphic". ... but some informed pages claim that AltGr means "alternative graphic""

It seems to me that this is most likely to be simply the difference between American & British usage: British usage in this context would be "alternative". -- TrevorD 12:50, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

I completely agree with TrevorD's comments above - "alternate" and "alternative" are just two different ways of saying the same thing. Plus I find this statement somewhat ridiculous - 'Even though the meaning of "AltGr" is unclear to most people, including many computer experts...' - is everyone monumentally stupid, or is it just the author who wrote that? -- Anon, 21 September 2006.

For what it's worth, I worked at Sun during the development of the Ultra 5/10, and as a linguist by education and programmer by trade, my opinion was always that "Alt Gr" stood for "Alternate Grapheme." There were others present who shared this opinion (and some who didn't), and there were more than a few lunchtime debates about IBM's thought process. Either way, there's the $0.02 of someone who was there to see it put on the keyboard.

I always thought AltGr stood for Alt Grey because they used to be in darker grey colour than the other keys --Anon, 26 Feb 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.87.129.234 (talk) 13:45, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

 * My father had IBM PC/AT computers (which was the first computer with the AT keyboard layout) at his office and I very clearly remember the AltGr key being printed with Green letters. This is why I have always thought it stood for **Alternate Green**.  I will go for the Alternate Graphic explanation, but I think it would be worth mentioning that the key was printed in Green, while none of the others were, as far as I can remember.  jason404 (talk) 07:53, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Proposed move
Can I propose we move this article to AltGr key, which currently redirs here? This would make it consistent with all the other modifier key pages. Felix the Cassowary 8 July 2005 10:49 (UTC)
 * As no-one objected, I went ahead and did it.
 * I'm not one to split hairs, but on all keyboards I know the key is labelled "Alt Gr", i. e. with a space between the "Alt" and the "Gr". Is this different on US keyboards? --Maikel 15:54, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * AFAIK, US keyboards don't even have the key. I suppose the reason this page is at AltGr is the very same one Caps lock is at Capslock and Pause Break is at PauseBreak...oh wait. Why on earth is this page at AltGr key and not Alt Gr key? -- Dandelions 19:45, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
 * On most keyboards I've seen the AltGr key is just labelled Alt. Shinobu 16:51, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Alt Gr On US Keyboards
So, do ordinary US keyboards now feature the Alt Gr key or don't they? --Maikel 15:51, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * "AltGr" is just the right "Alt" key, in most cases it is up to the operating system to treat it as a different key or same key. In windows you can change your US Keyboard's "Alt" to function as "AltGr" by changing your keyboard layout to " US International"--165.125.144.16 20:08, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
 * So I take it that the US keyboard doesn't have an Alt Gr key, just an ordinary Alt key to the right of the spacebar? PS:  I use a foreign keyboard. --Maikel 17:18, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
 * The US keyboard layout is different from the US international keyboard layout in two ways:
 * In the US layout the right Alt key is an Alt key, just like the left Alt key, whereas in the US int. layout the right Alt key is an AltGr key, unlike the left Alt key, which is an Alt.
 * The US layout doesn't have dead keys, the US int. layout has. "'", "a" produces "'a" on a US layout, while it produces "á" on a US int. layout.
 * I use the layout switching feature to use shortcuts to switch between US int. (normal everyday use), US (programming, entering long stretches of English text), and Japanese (with IME). Shinobu 15:36, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Errors
The refernce to AltGr being commonly used in BIOS settings is completely false and should be removed to avoid confusion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.33.105.192 (talk) 09:52, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
 * It is said in the article that "It is used extensively in French and Spanish to type the accented vowels áéíó and ú", but it's totally false at least in Spanish.
 * Typing an accented vowel in Spanish is a two step process: first the acute accent key (´) and then the vowel. So the AltGr key doesn't have anything to do with this. In Spanish (I think it's the same in French) AltGr is used to produce some symbols like: @, {, }, [, ], |, ~, \, #, €.
 * Well, you could type the accented characters with AltGr, but no one I know does it that way. The reason is probably that it isn't faster than using the dead keys, and the dead keys are a lot more intuitive. Shinobu (talk) 07:36, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Merge with AltGr?
Both AltGr key and AltGr have nearly identical definitions. Would it not be worth merging the two? M0RHI 22:31, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Merge has already been done. Shinobu (talk) 07:39, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Problems with Ctrl-Alt vs. AltGr in Windows
I made a couple of changes to the "History" section, regarding the problems with Ctrl-Alt vs. AltGr and the reason why keyboard shortcuts using Ctrl and Alt should be avoided (now that I'm writing this, I wonder if this should even be in this section, in this page).

First, the original text said:

 * Windows began to allow all keystroke combinations involving AltGr to be typed by using Ctrl+Alt in its place (except that AltGr+Del is not equivalent to Ctrl+Alt+Del).

My understanding here is that this is a one-way conversion: Ctrl-Alt will be interpreted as AltGr, as implied by the first part of the sentence, but that doesn't mean that AltGr would ever be interpreted as a Ctrl-Alt, therefore what's between the parentheses doesn't make any sense. I removed it.

Then it says that Ctrl-Alt should be avoided as a part of a shortcut combination ...

 * as those using non-US keyboard layouts may inadvertently trigger the shortcut when typing normal text using the AltGr key

Likewise, it seems to me like the problem is not that pressing AltGr+something will trigger a shortcut that has been assigned Ctrl+Alt+something (same as above, the AltGr doesn't get translated into Ctrl-Alt), but that there could be problems when someone presses Ctrl-Alt instead, either

1. as a substitute for AltGr, as exemplified by the following segment from the linked MSDN blog:

 * Sometimes a program accidentally uses Ctrl+Alt as a shortcut modifier and they get bug reports like, "Every time I type the letter 'đ', the program thinks I want to start a mailmerge."

or possibly even, depending on the scenario, I suppose,

2. trying to activate the actual shortcut, in which case the OS could interpret the keypress as an AltGr combination as opposed to a Ctrl-Alt shortcut, and outputting a special character instead of activating the shortcut.

However, the following comment, about certain emulator/virtual machine software running on Windows, on that same page seems to conflict a bit with the interpretation that AltGr doesn't get "translated" into Ctrl-Alt:

 * The additional Ctrl generated by AltGr makes it through to the hosted OS and usually confuses it, because the release of the key doesn't get through. Ctrl is 'stuck' down until you press and release Ctrl.

It's possible, though, that this stems from the virtual machine software trying to interpret the keypress (as opposed to the OS passing the keystroke to the software as a Ctrl-Alt).

I hope my changes were correct; I haven't used AltGr much in my life. --Cotoco 21:31, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Here's what happens on a technical level: the keyboard sends keycodes to the keyboard driver. At this point no kind of layouting is done. No dead keys, no special treatment of Caps Lock, nothing. It is in this way that it enters the kernel, and this is where the OS looks for the Ctrl-Alt-Del combo. Note that it has to be done at this level for security reasons: after entering the phyisical Ctrl-Alt-Del combo, you have to be absolutely sure that you can safely enter your password. Then, the keyboard layout is applied and by the time applications access it through the Win32 subsystem, all kinds of postprocessing have been done. Note that the AltGr key at this point functions identically to Alt + Ctrl. Entering "Ctrl+Alt+a" yields the same keycode and shiftmask as "AltGr+a". Shinobu 15:45, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I am using swedish layout on Windows XP. If I have a shortcut on the Start-menu bound to e.g. Ctrl-Alt-M, and press AltGr-M that shortcut is still activated. Without the shortcut I get the µ (Greek Mu) symbol. MizardX (talk) 06:13, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Which is exactly what you would expect. Shinobu (talk) 07:39, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Ctrl-Alt-Del with one hand.
I remove this:
 * Whilst this has benefits for computer accessibility in Windows, ironically it doesn't work in conjunction with the Delete key to produce the oft-used Control-Alt-Delete command. This means, for example, that computer users with only one usable hand can find logging in to a Windows 2000 / XP / NT4 computer very difficult.

from the article because I can tell you by personal experience that it's very easy to give the three-fingered salute one-handedly. Depending on the location of my keyboard, I prefer either ringfinger+thumb+middlefinger (keyboard stowed away to the right) or ringfinger+thumb+pink (keyboard in front - but then I usually use both hands since the only reason I have the keyboard in front of me is because I'm typing). Shinobu 15:49, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I've readded that you can't use alt-gr+del instead of ctrl+alt+del. Because you can't. Accessibility issues aside, it's just not possible. -- Dandelions 19:40, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes, you're right on that one. Did I delete too much? Glad you fixed it then. Shinobu 01:41, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Actually, wouldn't that paragraph have been referring to not being able to use Ctrl-AltGr-Del to log in? Or does AltGr work like Alt in that instance? If there is only one Alt key that works to log in, and it's far away from the Delete key, then that could present a usability problem for some people. --

The Alt in Ctrl-Alt-Del can be either the left or the right Alt (or AltGr) key, regardless whether the right Alt key is actually (according to the keyboard layout) an AltGr key or not. (If you can find a Windows box, try it. If you're logged in, Task Manager will open, otherwise the login screen will be shown.) It just doesn't work as Ctrl+Alt, that's all. Note that it's important for security that keyboard layouts are not in effect at the stage where the operating system checks for Ctrl-Alt-Del. Shinobu 12:26, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

UK keyboards

 * ''In UK keyboard layouts, the only two symbols which require the AltGr key are:

* € the Euro currency symbol. Located on the "4/$" key. * Either |, the vertical bar ("pipe symbol") or ¦, the broken vertical bar ("broken pipe symbol"). Located on the "`/¬" key, to the immediate left of "1".''

It's also the easiest way of producing an acute accent. Isn't that worth mentioning? – TheJames 21:33, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

using the pipe symbol(|) on uk key boards
I think the section that currently reads: e two latter symbols interchange places in UK keyboards according to the operating system in use. In OS/2, the "UK keyboard layout" (specifically: the UK166 layout) requires AltGr for the vertical bar and the broken vertical bar is a shifted key — which,..

should have a backslash (\) instead of the dash (-) at the end, as the vertical bar is achieved with shift \.Georgeryall 00:16, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Poland
it wasn't the communist government that prohibited import of computers, actually it was a prohibition by the USA and the western world to export hi=tech to the East because of theCoCom —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.155.151.233 (talk) 12:40, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

Ground
I have seen some people calling this key "Alternate Ground" ?Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.84.240.111 (talk) 10:58, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

I heard something like tha myself. No source, though. Something to do with the fact that the third function of one key was drawn near the ground on the physical key itself.

Dubious
It says in the article that the situation in Czech is similar to Polish; but from my limited knowledge and what the link shows it's actually quite different. It seems to me that Czech adopted a 'typist' layout with accentuated characters directly obtainable. Perhaps it's so that the situation used to be similar, but nowadays it's not anymore? Any Czech would care to clarify that? --Divide (talk) 03:02, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

On AltGr and Alt + Ctrl
Note that AltGr = Right Alt + Ctrl, not just Left Alt + Ctrl, and this is how e.g. Word distinguishes between H1 and ¡.

http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/word-help/alt-gr-keys-HP005259063.aspx?redir=0 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.87.151.1 (talk) 11:08, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

Keypress and keyboard
Some recent edits have involved the difference between characters which can be generated by use of the AltGr key, and characters which are printed on a particular standard keyboard to indicate that they can be so generated. I have added a note to the German section to cover this, but a more general coverage of this somewhere may be better. An implication that only the mentioned keys are active when AltGr is pressed would be misleading. --Mirokado (talk) 21:41, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

 * The presence of additional characters like AltGr-h → ħ appears to be a property of recent Linux (i.e. XKb) keyboard drivers, and is covered as such under AltGr key. I don't think it is necessary to list them separately in each of the individual language sections, which should focus on those parts of the layouts that are cross-vendor industry standards (or, in the case of the German Quertz layout, a DIN norm, see de:DIN 2137). By the way, the presence of h→ħ in the list was the result of somebody trying to fix a piece of vandalism ([//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=AltGr_key&diff=439698000&oldid=438217770][//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=AltGr_key&diff=440194017&oldid=439698000]). Fut.Perf. ☼ 06:03, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the explanation. I had not noticed that section. It looks as if callouts to a note in virtually every section would be a bit clunky, so I have removed the note in the German section again. I've left the wording clarifying keyboard markings for others to consider, perhaps the other sections could also be updated so that they are more correct when read on their own. --Mirokado (talk) 19:40, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Belgian
The official Belgian keyboard layout standard is available in English and in PDF for 53 € from the NBN (Belgian Standards Institute). I haven't read it. The new section is based on this page which merges the Belgian standard with the additional "X11 international" keystrokes. — Tonymec (talk) 01:48, 6 August 2012 (UTC)

Move

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: no consensus to move, no reason given for the move proposal. Dekimasu よ! 07:59, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

AltGr key → Alt Gr key – Please place your rationale for the proposed move here. 99.104.5.78 (talk) 22:31, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

 * Oppose in the absence of a rationale for moving the page. For what it's worth, my superficial investigation on Google seems to show that "AltGr" predominates and a substantial fraction of Web mentions use the confusing spelling "Alt-Gr". Any added rationale for moving the page needs to address these points. 209.211.131.181 (talk) 02:10, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

 * Oppose for much the same reasons as above. No reason provided. None of the references use "Alt Gr", though two seem to be 404s and need to be cleaned up. Alt Gr key already redirects to here. Unless an older technical references can be found there is no reason to change it. The Sanest Mad Hatter (talk) 18:36, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

A : leads to little hole--US International Degree Symbol Section 3.1.1
What's the sidebar on shift + AltGr + : for the degree symbol °?

Too funny. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.56.69.206 (talk) 13:29, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

There's a story here. The anonymous designers chose intuitive AltGr combo's to represent additional characters. Who selected the combo for the degree symbol, and how did it pass puritanical review? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.170.249.135 (talk) 19:48, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

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Canadian French layout
In Quebec/Canada this key is labelled "Alt Car" ( https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt_Gr ->  Il arrive qu'elle soit nommée « Alt Car » (pour « alterner caractère », par exemple, pour les claviers de type canadien-français) ) I had trouble with my keyboard and it took me a while to realize the entire world call this key Alt Gr, I believe it could also be an useful addition to add "Canadian French" to the list between "Brazilian" and "Finnish multilingual".

This layout is very different from European French, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QWERTY#Canadian https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cc/KB_Canadian_French_text.svg/2000px-KB_Canadian_French_text.svg.png

71.19.190.194 (talk) 21:25, 25 September 2018 (UTC)

Alt Gr + C
When I do the combination Alt Gr + C on my computer, it does a party effect.

title: Talk:AltGr key


text:
Talk:Kemono

Redirect or article?
Kemono is totally different from the Furry fandom and should not be confused with it. I've restored the page for now. If people still think this article should be deleted, I suggest it should be merged with something it has more to do with such as funny animal or Japanese art, not the furry fandom, which is an unrelated phenomenon that originated much later in the US. Tai Ferret (talk) 18:11, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
 * This might well be, but there is an old AfD discussion whose decision should be respected. Nothing has changed about the problems that were identified then and there, so the decision to redirect this stands. --Pgallert (talk) 11:39, 18 March 2017 (UTC)
 * On second thought, the redirect is not proper because the word does not occur in the target article, and neither in the alternative targets mentioned by . I have thus listed it at Redirects for discussion/Log/2017 March 18, please join the discussion there. --Pgallert (talk) 16:11, 18 March 2017 (UTC)

Kemonomimi redirects to Moe anthropomorphism and this article should too, or be deleted.
This article adds no new information that can't be found in there. Besides, the meaning of "Kemono" cannot be solely attributed to what it says in the article anyway.

電放三葉 (RadioTrefoil) 14:29, 15 November 2017 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Radiotrefoil (talk • contribs)

 * I have redirected to Kemonomimi now. Skoyt (talk) 09:58, 9 April 2020 (UTC)
 * I've just restored what is essentially a dab page: this was the outcome of the discussion at Redirects for discussion/Log/2017 April 30. Retargeting Moe anthropomorphism was also specifically debated there, so the page can't be retargeted there without further formal discussion. I don't understand the topic area but from has been said on wikipedia so far, it seems that Kemonomimi is only one aspect of "kemono" so we can't equate the two, though if I'm wrong please let me know. There's no scope for any more bold actions because of the previous discussions, so the correct way forward if anybody would like the page to be turned into a redirect, or deleted altogether, is to start an WP:AfD. Pings to, and . – Uanfala (talk) 13:29, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

 * However, Uanfala, while that discussion might be deemed inconclusive, it did specify that the redirect to furry fandom was not right, because noone voted for that option. Reading it now, it seems the administrator who ended the talk, found that a set index article should be created. Beats me why that never was done. Skoyt (talk) 14:00, 9 April 2020 (UTC)
 * But a set-index article was created right after the discussion was closed (and that's the version I've restored now). It was just that a few month later it got turned back into a redirect again. – Uanfala (talk) 14:49, 9 April 2023 holl

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Kemono


text:
Talk:Davis, California

Kim Stanley Robinson
Hey, I put the Kim Stanley Robinson link on the page, and I was wondering if anyone knows where i should put it if it doesn't belong in the top? Phil179 08:28, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

 * I don't know why you're so eager to put a link to Robinson in the article, but if you must, create a new section where it would be appropriate. It's clearly not appropriate to mention it beside facts like "It is located in the Sacramento valley", a highly important fact about Davis, worthy of being in the opening.  It's also not appropriate for the current sections.  Maybe a new section along the lines of interesting trivia would be a good home for your link. --C S 10:34, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

Well I'm eager to put it in here because I think he's famous enough to be listed with the Davis article, and I can't think of anyone else who is famous enough to go on there as a famous Davis resident. If you can think of anyone else to add, then by all means I think they should be added to it. Phil179 15:44, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

Maybe a link to Published Authors on the Davis Wiki?

What about John Lescroart? He is an author too. And Robinson should be mentioned, he is probably one of the leading authors of modern sci-fi so he deserves to be mentioned.

Notable natives
I think I will start a "notable natives" section of the article sometime soon. This will include Kim Stanley Robinson (cf discussion above), some other writers, and people like Paul Moller of Moller Skycar fame/infamy. One problem is determining who is "notable"; after all, Sean Stewart, despite having made it into Wikipedia, is probably not as well-known as many UC Davis professors. Others are welcome to beat me to this edit :-) --C S 22:37, July 9, 2005 (UTC)
 * I stole your idea. It still needs some work though.  --Phoenix Hacker 05:28, July 22, 2005 (UTC)

I can't verify (although I didn't really check that hard) that all the people currently listed as a notable native actually live in Davis. For example, the astronaut Stephen Robinson's bio doesn't list anything about him living in Davis. And if my recollection is correct, astronauts all live in certain neighborhoods near the launch site in Cape Canaveral anyway! --C S 06:24, September 3, 2005 (UTC)

Miss E Kelly 07:22, 20 June 2020 (UTC)We need to add DHS Class of 2001 - Elliot Cohen, he is the co-founder of "Pill Pack" - the company that delivers medication through Amazon to your doorstep - He should be added to "Notable Natives". However, the current link from "Pill Pack" is linked to this "Eliot A. Cohen" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eliot_A._Cohen. He is NOT the correct co-founder of Pill Pack both pages need to be edited. I'll add an alert to the "Pill Pack" wiki page also.

Sights
I added some sights and events to the page. --Phoenix Hacker 10:54, Apr 16, 2005 (UTC)

There are sooooo many other Davis things that should be put on this page:

Dr. Moller and his flying car: Skycar. He lives near Davis and once was a UC Professor.
 * What about the radio flyer car?
 * These are both awesome things, and both featured on pages on DavisWiki.org!
 * DavisWiki rocks my socks!

Movie Location?
According to another website about Davis, the movie Phenomenon was filmed in Davis. Can anyone confirm this? I haven't found that anywhere else. --Phoenix Hacker 05:03, July 22, 2005 (UTC)

One of several locations according to IMDB -- http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0117333/locations PxT 18:50, 3 August 2005 (UTC)

From my understanding it was not filmed in Davis, but in Auburn. As far as I know Davis has not been used as a filming location in any major movie.

Davisites vs. Natives
You may want to reconsider your recent repeated reverts, changing "Notable Davisites" to "Notable Natives" in the Davis, California article. Please refer to the Merriam-Webster dictionary for the definition of "native" in this context. This article is about an American town, so American usage and spelling pertain in this instance, in accordance with Wikipedia policy. The Oxford English Dictionary (OED) has no standing here. --QuicksilverT @ 06:19, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

 * You mean the definition listed at your link:

Main Entry: 2native Function: noun 1 : one born or reared in a particular place 2 a : an original or indigenous inhabitant b : something indigenous to a particular locality 3 : a local resident; especially : a person who has always lived in a place as distinguished from a visitor or a temporary resident
 * somehow contradicts my rationale for my reverts? It doesn't seem so, especially in light of definition 3.  I think using the word native here is better because definitions 1 and 3 is more inclusive (than Davisite) and less likely to cause problems in the long run.

 * BTW, I did check Webster first and noted it agreed with OED. I should have been more precise.  I apologize for any confusion.  --C S (Talk) 07:19, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

 * I'm not trying to insult you, but perhaps you are confused over the definitions of "native" as an adjective versus a noun? That's a very important distinction.  In any case, the dictionary definitions are certainly compatible with my experience, e.g. "Native of New York" does not mean "born in New York" necessarily...it can indicate "reared" (per definition 1) or a permanent resident (per definition 3).  I think if you reconsider, you will agree.  --C S (Talk) 07:30, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

 * Polite proposal from complete outsiders: keep “natives” (which seems to be usual, though it stems from Latin: natus = born). But please do not miss the nice word “Davisites” – maybe you put it in brackets behind or mention it somewhere in the text.
 * The fine English/German dictionary http://dict.leo.org/ says:
 * native of = born in
 * native to = living in
 * Maybe you make a difference between people born in and people living in Davis?
 * Anyway: Davis seems a really fine place to be! Congrats! Erkabo 08:08, 28 November 2005 (UTC)  (Hi Chan-Ho!)

Wikipedia's own definition of native is instructive. Quoting: Native is an adjective meaning "from birth", as in native language, native speaker. It is also a noun indicating a person who was born in a place or lived there for most of the person's childhood. When used as a noun to refer to a member of an indigenous ethnic group, it sometimes carries pejorative connotations. When linked to a place or nationality the term has ambiguity in English. Native literally denotes "having been born in" the place referred to. It usually implies residence in the area, at least in childhood, and familiarity or identification with the culture. However, native is also often used to mean "belonging to an ethnic group historically inhabiting that region at the time Western writers became acquainted with the region." In this sense it is synonymous with "indigenous", as in "Native American" or "First Nations.

So Native is someone resident from birth or (arguably) lived there for most of the person's childhood -- do any of the 'Natives' qualify? I note that our own definition of Native states that when linked to a place (say, Davis), born in is the choice with the additional implication that some childhood residence in the area... So let's examine our list of eminent Davisites: None were born there -- see the linked biographies --, which is the touchstone of nativeness; and no one has cited ANY SOURCES that indicate that any of them have lived there for most of their childhood -- reading the biographies show that most of them have spent their childhoods elsewhere, in fact. Best to keep to Davisites -- truth is better than a fiction based on semantics that are inconsistent with our own definition of 'Native' or remove all the people who were neither born there or (arguably) lived there for most of their childhoods.

User:Carlossuarez46

 * Frankly, I think you have an issue with terminology. For one, you did not "revert vandalism" (as you claim in your edit summary) when you reverted my change.  Please acquaint yourself with what vandalism is before you get yourself into trouble in the future with such misconceptions.  Second, your claim that my choice of terminology is " a fiction based on semantics" is your POV and not a "truth".  I regard the standard dictionaries as more authorative than Wikipedia's page on native, which incidentally does not have sources.  --C S (Talk) 01:55, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

 * I should add that I find your use of a disambiguation page to argue your case strange. Wikipedia is not a dictionary and does not pretend to be one, although occasionally some are confused by this.  --C S (Talk) 02:08, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/native also says native is born there. -- [unsigned comment by anon 64.166.72.195]

 * No it doesn't. Or rather, it is only one of the several definitions given.  Please at least try and read the previous discussion before repeating errors, e.g. using a definition of native as adjective instead of noun (it is being used as noun in this context).  See my response to Quicksilver above.  --C S (Talk) 02:08, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

I am a "native of", born in, Davis. Actually Woodland, since Davis didn't have a hospital in the 60's. I was looking over this Wiki section and noticing how unorganized it is (the whole thing). What if there was a section on "Notable UCD Professors" and "Notable Davis Authors" and "Famous People From Davis"...etc... It just seems so disorganized. I do think that whomever cleans it up deserves a big round of applause from all Davisites, as the town is important to many Davisites and therefore how it is presented to the outside public may also be important to some Davisites. I hope that someone is willing to devote some time to reorganizing this section of Wiki California. However, if vandalism is an issue, I can see why someone wouldn't want to take the time. I wonder...Is there any way to stop the vandals here in Wiki?

Bicycling
Why isn't there more in the page about bicycling? I am disappointed, because I think that bicycles are one of the things that really makes Davis different from any other University town.TrogdorPolitiks 19:58, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

 * This is a free encyclopedia anyone can edit. So get editing! :-)  --C S (Talk) 20:11, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Yeah, yeah, I know, I'm just too lazy sometimes... ;-)TrogdorPolitiks 20:23, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

"Others note that the facilities have arguably hindered the popularity of cycling, since Davis was already known as the bicycle capital in the 1960s prior to the creation of any bike paths or bike lanes, and the per capita ratio of Davis bicyclists has not increased, but declined if anything, since the facilities movement started in the late 1960s"

This needs referenced. It's also serious spurious reasoning: cycling has declined virtually throughout the western world since the 1960's as a result of the rise of the automobile, suburbanisation, rising incomes, safety-fears, car-centric planning etc. etc. If Davis has managed to maintain anything like 1960's levels of cycling, it's a major success story. 86.0.203.120 23:45, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Toad Tunnel
There are a set of Salamander tunnels under Junipero Serra near Campus Drive (east) at Stanford. Openwire 21:50, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations.

Flatlander
For those of you who are Davisites (or Davis Natives, if you will), do you think it's worth mentioning The Flatlander under the same section as the Davis Enterprise? Heavy Metal Cellist talkcontribs

I think that it would be a good idea.--The Great Honker 18:54, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Asian Population More Than Ten Times Larger Than the Page Says
The Asian population is much larger than mentioned here. I added up the figures from http://www.city-data.com/city/Davis-California.html

I got 17.5 percent for all the Asian groups, 8 percent for Chinese alone. When I added the 17.5 for Asians with the other figures given I got pretty close to 100 percent.

As this is way off, it should be corrected.

Richard Bruce 17:00, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

I checked the census and the census said 17.5 percent Asian in the year 2000, the year and the source the article gave. So as I had it from the offical source that the article had given I went ahead and changed it.

Richard Bruce 05:14, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

 * Great work. I wonder how the misleading number was originally entered...vandalism, negligence or whatever.  I gave a link as a reference to your edit.   --C S (Talk) 07:10, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

What an excellent article!
Hats off to all contributors. Bryan 01:18, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Local/State Tax Burden?
I am considering a move to Davis. This article is fine and dandy, but it actually tells me nothing about what really matters for deciding whether I want to live here or not: The tax burden and the cost of living. I must weigh the job offers I have received versus the local and state taxes and the average costs of typical products in order for me to determine whether it is worth my while to live in Davis or not. Would a local please set up a new section entitled "Tax Burden Facts", or something of that nature? Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.236.95.21 (talk • contribs) 4 September 2006

What is "West Davis"?
The article says that "West Davis" is west of 113. But the old West Davis Elementary and West Davis Intermediate are both east of 113. Davisites I know who lived around those schools---near Villanova, Anderson, and Sycamore---considered themselves to be from West Davis. Is that still true? I recognize that the article is very freeway-heavy in its definitions, but I would nominate Anderson Road as the dividing line. Anyone agree or disagree? Theleek 00:05, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I always thought the divider was the railroad tracks that seperate the kids who go to Holmes from the kids who go to Emerson. Not sure how Harper affected things though. I used to live in what was definitely East Davis and haven't spent much time in West Davis though, so I don't think I can say for sure. I do seem to think of Anderson as West Davis though.  Ungovernable Force  Got something to say? 06:30, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

 * It depends on how many "Davises" there are. If there's just a West and East, then I think you're right---the railroad tracks (roughly, F St.), or the Holmes-Emerson line, is a pretty good marker.  But if "North Davis" comes into the picture, then there's the question of what divides West Davis from North Davis.  When I grew up in West Davis (the part east of 113 ;-) ), I thought North Davis meant north of Covell---there wasn't much up there at the time---but now that I'm arguing that West Davis has to be defined to include an area east of 113 because that's where WDE was, I guess I have to acknowledge that North Davis Elementary was south of Covell.  Theleek 18:50, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

 * I would say that West Davis is certainly west of 113. Those elementary schools were built before much of today's West Davis was built. The names of those schools are changed now, which makes them almost completely irrelevant in determining what is West Davis. In any case, I don't think West Davis should be completely removed from the front page, like it is right now. Hollerama 28 November 2006

 * I don't think the deletion of West Davis (and other neighborhoods, and the rest of the article after that) was intentional. It looks like the article never recovered from a spate of vandalism from Nov. 17-21.  I'm doing some reverting and editing to restore the article to its previous state.  At the same time, I'm revamping the Neighborhoods section, which is (a) a total mess, and (b) not accurate (I can't imagine anyone living just north of I-80 saying they live in "North Davis").  Hope this is satisfactory to people.  Theleek 16:31, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

 * I live very close to Chavez (formerly West Davis Elementary), and I consider myself to be a central Davisite.  I'm pretty sure most other people around here do the same.  It's important to remember that the schools were built before much of the more recent housing developments (notice how neither of the "West Davis" schools kept their names).--The Great Honker 18:54, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

 * I just have to mention the concrete egg that used to be on the hilltop behind the tennis court. As a former student of West Davis Elementary, now Chavez Elementary, we used to play in a giant concrete egg that was painted with bright colors and had a concrete slide inside of it during recess.  On weekends, we used to bring a piece of wax paper to the park and use it to slide down the slide inside the concrete egg faster.  Those were the days!

What about Wildhorse and North Davis? I removed the 'west of the RR tracks' North Davis definition because neither the current North nor the current East definitions include Wildhorse. Wildhorse is included as North Davis in the Enterprise real estate listing so the edit removing the tracks would be consistent with that definition, but there's also the option of including it as part of East Davis. 14 July 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.48.31.207 (talk) 19:49, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

John Oster
Ok, so someone put him in the "Notable Davisites" section which I just removed. He isn't really notable for mention on wikipedia--Davis wiki sure, but not here. He's a great teacher and a cool guy but neither he nor his band meet notability standards as far as I can tell. I was even looking online a week or two ago for info on him because I was considering adding him myself. But there just isn't enough info out there.  Ungovernable Force  Got something to say? 21:46, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Railroads
I am thinking of deleting the section now called "railroads." Previously, it included such un-encyclopedic information as the actual schedules for certain trains. I removed that, but basically what's left is a statement that Davis has a train station, which strikes me as unworthy. But if anyone wants to comment, I'm all ears. Thanks. Theleek 23:05, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

 * Sorry to disagree, but the fact that Davis has a train station is worthy, considering the fact that Davis itself was built around the railroad, and those who don't live there can't say what Theleek said. There you go. User:StephenHjellum13 19:04, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Comment: Theleek was referring, in November 2006 (see timestamp), to a now non-existent section which was merged into the current transportation section. All relevant information on Davis railroads and history is currently included in a suitable manner in the article, partly due to Theleek's improvements to the article. --C S (Talk) 19:48, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Louis Warren and Alan Taylor
Should Louis Warren be added to Notable Natives? He has a book published, Buffalo Bill's America, that just won the Beveridge Award, a Western Writers of America Spur Award, a Great Plains Distinguished Book Prize, and a Caughey Western History Association Prize.--The Great Honker 18:58, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Also, how about Alan Taylor (read about him at the hyperlink)?. --The Great Honker 23:02, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

 * I've added Alan Taylor, he's certainly notable enough as compared to the others listed. I also alphabetized the list.  I think Louis Warren also should be notable enough, though he currently doesn't have a page of his own.  If someone who has the inclination to do so wants to find enough information to create one, I would think that would be a good addition. —Krellis 03:47, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

see also section
what happened to it? Well... I took out both links that were there. "davis people" is not a good title or topic (this isn't the daviswiki); and see also links should only be to other wikipedia pages -- so I took out the link to the daviswiki bike loop page. There's already a general link to the daviswiki; good enough. -- phoebe / (talk to me) 07:46, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Davis Enterprise redirect
Why does Davis Enterprise redirect to the Davis, California page??? There not nearly enough info here in this article about the newspaper to warrant the redirect. And by the way, do you think its about time to archive the discussion page? Killiondude (talk) 05:26, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Some clean up stuff
I changed the source (and consequently the population estimate) in the lead because city articles are only supposed to use US Census numbers for population figures per WP:USCITY. I also changed the current population later in the article to reflect that.

Per WP:LINKSTOAVOID I'm inclined to think that the links in the article to the Davis wiki shouldn't be included. It doesn't say anything in MOS:LINKS about linking to other wikis, but I have yet to see another article that has done so (outside of the External Links section). I have left the outside wiki links intact in this article (for now) until maybe I get clarification. Of course, everything is open to discussion here. Killiondude (talk) 08:13, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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Central Park (Davis) with Sensory Garden?
Hello, I am looking at sensory garden locations and need some more information. It would be nice to see the park mentioned on this page, as it is not. Is anyone interested in filling this gap? If so, I would like to see the "Sensory garden" if it is still up, added to List of Sensory gardens. Thanks! Twillisjr (talk) 18:51, 24 July 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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Cleaning up the "Erik Frederiksen" Mentions and Misinformation
As of 6/22/2021, there are multiple mentions of "Erik Fredericksen" on the Davis, CA page. The first sentence read "Davis, home of Erik Fredericksen,...". He is listed falsely as mayor. Under neighborhoods, I am seeing "South Davis (Erik's hood)". Under History, we have "From its inception as a farming community, Davis is known primarily for Erik Fredricksen...". This is obviously some jokester, so I am cleaning these things up. ALso some vandalism in the notable resident section. I am Ferdinand von Aegir (talk) 17:55, 22 June 2021 (UTC) —

Possible notable person addition?
I don't want to add it myself because 1. I know the guy personally (we did Davis High theatre stuff together) and 2. I saw the old conversation above regarding natives vs. long time residents and understand he may not qualify for the list, especially since he doesn't reside there anymore. All of that said Cole Stratton is a notable person. He wasn't born there but mostly grew up there. So I figured it was worth suggesting to more active editors who are more familiar with this kind of thing. I'm good either way y'all decide. Cheers. Millahnna (talk) 18:43, 5 February 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Davis, California


text:
User talk:Sterntreiber

Hey! Actually, I may have added some of that misinformation. Not on purpose, I assure you. I didn't start watching the show until 1999 (after AW was canceled) and what I do know about earlier years is what I've gathered from message boards and my grandmother. I love her and all, but she's 86 and I can acknowledge that she isn't all there anymore.

So you're doing grad school, huh? Are you on thefacebook? I'm addicted to that thing. Mike H 08:31, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

 * [Luckily (?)] thefacebook doesn't include my school -- not to worry though, I do have LiveJournal and Tribe.net to keep me from my studies. Are you on either of those? I was just looking at the list of articles you've started. Very impressive. I guess someone had to start an article on Ana Alicia! I realize I've read a number of the soap-related articles over the past months. Which shows do you currently follow? I only watch ATWT now (since 1982) and GL (since 1983, with several breaks). My first was AW, from the time I was an infant in the early 70s. (My grandmother and great-grandmother never called AW by name -- it was always "my story" or "my 3 o'clock show".) I found Y&R on my own around 1979 (and wrote my first fan letter to Jamie Lyn Bauer!) and watched it until about 1983, by which time I'd realized the writing and acting were much better on the New York shows. I also watched Search for Tomorrow from 1983-86, Ryan's Hope off and on for several years (I sometimes lived near affiliates that didn't carry it), and One Life to Live only when Claire Labine wrote it in the '90s.--Sterntreiber 09:02, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

 * I got into AW when my mother would pick me up from elementary school. She'd take me to her work and set me down in front of the TV, and when it was 5PM I'd tell her what went on that day (blah blah Vicky doesn't really want Grant, she wants Ryan but she's with Grant blah blah). I guess I was cheaper than a VCR in the rectory, I suppose (my mother was a housekeeper at the Catholic Church). I started watching that one in 1992, so I guess that'd be around first grade? I wrote the entry for Summer Desire. Not sure if I remember all of that correctly, but I think I did a decent entry on it. Then my mother seemed to get more efficient in picking me up, and I got to see most of the 1 o'clock show, too. I started watching DAYS in 1993. I distinctly remember it was when Vivian buried Carly alive. I tried chronicling that in Days of Our Lives and James E. Reilly. When AW went off the air (which coincided with my coming back from Japan), my grandmother was into the CBS soaps. She had been since about '92 or so when they changed the Bo actor on DAYS (coincidentally, my mother stopped watching DAYS around then because "that Sam Fowler started playing Bo and he just wasn't Bo"). I think I've rambled on enough. Mike H 10:32, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

 * I also saw your edits about Penny and Jeff being the first supercouple. I wrote the article on supercouple as saying that Doug and Julie were. Maybe you can edit it to mention Penny and Jeff before them? It'll kinda throw the whole image thing off, though. Mike H 12:39, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

Edited ATWT to leave out the term "supercouple". I think I was a bit fast and loose with using it there. Seeing the Doug and Julie magazine cover made me think that one criterion of a supercouple probably ought to be recognition of their supreme couplehood beyond the daytime medium. I think you were right to award Doug and Julie that particular honor.--Sterntreiber 15:39, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

 * I liked your write-up on the show's premise. I have an old soap book, All My Afternoons, with good interviews from Helen Wagner, Don MacLaughlin, and Henderson Forsythe. IIRC, they talked about why the show only focused on WASPy professionals instead of black characters, or homosexuals, etc. These interviews were originally taken in the mid-1970s, when ATWT was still really popular. Mike H 10:20, Dec 8, 2004 (UTC)

Soap history
Juppiter listed History of As the World Turns (1956-1959) on VFD. Please vote. Mike H 01:55, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)

Much belated welcome to Wikipedia.
Welcome!

Hello, Sterntreiber, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes ( ~ ); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place  before the question. Again, welcome! Chris (talk) 15:13, 22 June 2010 (UTC)
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Audio theatre
Hi, I am a person from Germany. Possibly you can look on the discussion of the article: Audio theatre, because you have made edits in the past on articles which are related with it. with friendly greetings, Soenke --Soenke Rahn (talk) 00:19, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

title: User talk:Sterntreiber


text:
TIMED

The TIMED (Thermosphere • Ionosphere • Mesosphere • Energetics and Dynamics) mission is dedicated to study the influences energetics and dynamics of the Sun and humans on the least explored and understood region of Earth's atmosphere – the Mesosphere and Lower Thermosphere / Ionosphere (MLTI). The mission was launched from Vandenberg Air Force Base in California on 7 December 2001 aboard a Delta II rocket launch vehicle. The project is sponsored and managed by NASA, while the spacecraft was designed and assembled by the Applied Physics Laboratory at Johns Hopkins University. The mission has been extended several times, and has now collected data over an entire solar cycle, which helps in its goal to differentiate the Sun's effects on the atmosphere from other effects. It shared its Delta II launch vehicle with the Jason-1 oceanography mission.

Atmospheric region under study

The Mesosphere, Lower Thermosphere and Ionosphere (MLTI) region of the atmosphere to be studied by TIMED is located between 60 and 180 km above the Earth's surface, where energy from solar radiation is first deposited into the atmosphere. This can have profound effects on Earth's upper atmospheric regions, particularly during the peak of the Sun's 11-year solar cycle when the greatest amounts of its energy are being released. Understanding these interactions is also important for our understanding of various subjects in geophysics, meteorology, aeronomy, and atmospheric science, as solar radiation is one of the primary driving forces behind atmospheric tides. Changes in the MLT can also affect modern satellite and radio telecommunications.

Scientific instruments
The spacecraft payload consists of the following four main instruments:

 * Global Ultraviolet Imager (GUVI), which scans cross track from horizon to horizon to measure the spatial and temporal variations of temperature and constituent densities in the lower thermosphere, and to determine the importance of auroral energy sources and solar extreme ultraviolet sources to the energy balance in that region.
 * Solar Extreme ultraviolet Experiment (SEE), a spectrometer and a suite of photometers designed to measure the solar soft X-rays, extreme-ultraviolet and far-ultraviolet radiation that is deposited into the MLT region.
 * TIMED Doppler Interferometer (TIDI), designed to globally measure the wind and temperature profiles of the MLT region.
 * Sounding of the Atmosphere using Broadband Emission Radiometry (SABER), multichannel radiometer designed to measure heat emitted by the atmosphere over a broad altitude and spectral range, as well as global temperature profiles and sources of atmospheric cooling.

The data collected by the satellite's instruments are made freely available to the public.

Specifications

 * Mass: 660 kilograms
 * Dimensions:
 * 2.72 meters high
 * 1.61 meters wide (launch configuration)
 * 11.73 meters wide (solar arrays deployed)
 * 1.2 meters deep
 * Power consumption: 406 watts
 * Data downlink: 4 megabits per second
 * Memory: 5 gigabits
 * Control and data handling processor: Mongoose-V
 * Attitude:
 * Control - Within 0.50°
 * Knowledge - Within 0.03°
 * Processor: RTX2010
 * Total mission cost:
 * Spacecraft: US$195 million
 * Ground operations: US$42 million

Satellite operations
TIMED experienced minor problems with attitude control when, after launch, the magnetorquers failed to slow the spacecraft's spin as intended. An engineer installing the magnetorquers had mistakenly recorded the reverse of their actual polarities, which generated a sign error in the flight software. The problem was fixed by temporarily disabling the orbiter's magnetic field sensor and uploading a software patch to fix the sign error. In a separate incident, another software update fixed a problem caused by faulty testing of the Sun sensors. After these corrections, the attitude control system functioned as intended.

Kosmos 2221 conjunction
At approximately 06:30 UTC on 28 February 2024, TIMED passed within 10 meters of the defunct Kosmos 2221 satellite. As neither TIMED nor Kosmos 2221 can be maneuvered, the conjunction was unavoidable. LeoLabs, a satellite tracking company, had estimated a satellite collision probability of as high as 8% prior to the encounter. A collision between the two satellites, both traveling at hypervelocity speeds relative to each other, was projected to generate between 2,500 and 7,500 fragments of space debris, a figure potentially exceeding that of the 2009 satellite collision between Iridium 33 and Kosmos 2251. This close miss was particularly concerning to NASA, which highlighted the event at the 39th Space Symposium in Colorado Springs in a broader speech on NASA's new space sustainability strategy plan.

Scientific results
TIMED has improved scientific understanding of long-term trends in the upper atmosphere. The SABER instrument has collected a continuous record of water vapor and carbon dioxide levels in the stratosphere and mesosphere.

SABER is able to collect 1,500 water vapor measurements per day, a vast improvement from previous satellites and ground-based observations. SABER had a flaw in its optical filter that caused it to overestimate water vapor levels; this error was discovered and the data were corrected. Based on the corrected data, SABER found that between 2002 and 2018, water vapor levels in the lower stratosphere were increasing at an average rate of 0.25 ppmv (around 5%) per decade, and in the upper stratosphere and mesosphere, water vapor levels were increasing at an average rate of 0.1-0.2 ppmv (around 2-3%) per decade. Growth in methane levels is thought to be partially responsible for the growth in water vapor levels, as methane decomposes into carbon dioxide and water vapor, but changes driven by the solar cycle may also be responsible.

SABER has also monitored carbon dioxide levels in the upper atmosphere. The instrument found that carbon dioxide levels in the upper atmosphere are increasing: at an altitude of 110 km, levels were rising at an average rate of 12% per decade. This rate is faster than what has been predicted by climate models, and suggests that there is more vertical mixing of than previously thought.

By collecting upper atmosphere data, TIMED assists the modeling of environmental impacts. Water vapor and carbon dioxide are greenhouse gases and their growth in the upper atmosphere must be factored into climate models. Additionally, upper atmosphere water vapor contributes to ozone depletion.

United States

 * University of Alaska, Fairbanks, Alaska
 * University of California, Berkeley, California
 * Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, California
 * University of Colorado, Boulder, Colorado
 * National Center for Atmospheric Research, Boulder, Colorado
 * National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, Boulder, Colorado
 * Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory, Laurel, Maryland
 * Air Force Research Laboratory, Hanscom Air Force Base, Massachusetts
 * Stewart Radiance Laboratory, Bedford, Massachusetts
 * University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan
 * Southwest Research Institute, San Antonio, Texas
 * Utah State University, Logan, Utah
 * Hampton University, Hampton, Virginia
 * Computational Physics, Inc., Fairfax, Virginia
 * Naval Research Laboratory, Washington, D.C.
 * NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton, Virginia
 * G&A Technical Software Inc., Hampton, Virginia

International

 * Hovemere Limited, Kent, England, United Kingdom
 * British Antarctic Survey, Cambridge, England, United Kingdom
 * CREES-York University, Toronto, Ontario, Canada
 * Astrophysical Institute of Andalucia (IAA), Granada, Spain
 * Rostock University, Rostock, Germany

title: TIMED


text:
Grappling hook

A grappling hook or grapnel is a device that typically has multiple hooks (known as claws or flukes) attached to a rope or cable; it is thrown, dropped, sunk, projected, or fastened directly by hand to where at least one hook may catch and hold on to objects. Generally, grappling hooks are used to temporarily secure one end of a rope. They may also be used to dredge for submerged objects.

The device was invented by the Romans in approximately 260 BC. The grappling hook was originally used in naval warfare to catch ship rigging so that it could be boarded.

Design
A common design has a central shaft with a hole ("eye") at the shaft base to attach the rope, and three or four equally spaced hooks at the end, arranged so that at least one is likely to catch on some protuberance of the target. Some modern designs feature folding hooks to resist unwanted attachment. Most grappling hooks are thrown by hand, but some used in rescue work are propelled by compressed air (e.g., the Plumett AL-52), line thrower, mortar, or a rocket.

Military

Grappling hooks are used by combat engineers to breach tactical obstacles. When used as such, the grappling hook is launched in front of an obstacle and dragged backwards to detonate tripwire-fused land mines, and can be hooked on wire obstacles and pulled to set off booby traps on the wire. The rifle-launched grapnel (LGH), a single-use grappling hook placed on the end of an M4/M16 rifle, is used for this purpose. A crossbow-launched version has been produced. A grapnel can clear up to 99% of the trip-wires in a single pass. During WW2 British and German ships towed grappling hooks in the hope of snagging or damaging enemy submarines, a tactic also employed by the Japanese. Grappling hooks were used by soldiers at the D-Day landings to aid in climbing the cliffs at the Normandy beaches. Some were rocket-propelled and launched from mortars.

Maritime
As well as the grapnel anchor, grapnels are used in the removal and repair of subsea cables. Large cable layer ships drag huge grapnels across the seabed until they snag a cable.

In popular culture
Grappling hooks, grapple guns, and their many variants have been a staple in many video games.

title: Grappling hook


text:
User:Skollur

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I find Wikipedia a great data base giving information which no other encyclopedia would give.

I do my bit when somebody tries to mutilate (not edit) an article by, for instance, deleting whole paragraphs or links just because he/she does not like it.

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title: User:Skollur


text:
Norman Hunter (writer)

Norman George Lorimer Hunter (23 November 1899 – 23 February 1995) was a British writer of children's literature. He is particularly known for creating the Professor Branestawm book series.

Early life
Hunter was born in Sydenham, England, on 23 November 1899. He attended Beckenham County School for Boys (later known as Beckenham and Penge Grammar School and then Langley Park School for Boys). He left school to volunteer for service in the London Irish Rifles in the First World War.

Career
After the war Hunter became an advertising copywriter. In the 1930s he performed as a stage magician in Bournemouth. He also wrote popular books on writing for advertising, brain-teasers and conjuring, among many other topics, but his best-known works were about the character Professor Branestawm, originally written for radio. The first book, The Incredible Adventures of Professor Branestawm, was published in hardback in 1933 with illustrations by W. Heath Robinson; the second, Professor Branestawm's Treasure Hunt in 1937 with drawings by James Arnold. George Adamson illustrated the reissue of Professor Branestawm's Treasure Hunt in 1966, and when Norman Hunter brought out his third book in the series in 1970 after a gap of more than thirty years, Adamson provided the illustrations. Two further Professor Branestawm titles were then published with Adamson's drawings. Other artists were to provide illustrations for later books in the series: Gerald Rose; David Hughes; Jill McDonald, and Derek Cousins. Many of the books were reissued in Puffin Books, The Incredible Adventures of Professor Branestawm under Eleanor Graham's editorship in 1946, and many others under Kaye Webb's in the 1960s and 1970s.

Hunter returned to London during the Second World War and lived on a boat on the Thames. In 1949 he went to work in South Africa and stopped writing fiction. After his retirement in 1970, he once again returned to London, where Thames Television had just produced an eight-part TV series, Professor Branestawm. He continued writing in his retirement and his last book was published in 1983.

Works
(Incomplete):
 * Simplified Conjuring for All: a collection of new tricks needing no special skill or apparatus for their performance with suitable patter, C. Arthur Pearson (1923)
 * Advertising Through the Press: a guide to press publicity, Sir I. Pitman & Sons (1925)
 * New and Easy Magic : a further series of novel magical experiments needing no special skill or apparatus for their performance with suitable patter, C. Arthur Pearson (1925)
 * The Bad Barons of Crashbania: Vol. 42, Continuous Stories, Jolly Books (Blackwell, 1932), illustrated by Eve Garnett
 * The Incredible Adventures of Professor Branestawm, John Lane (1933), illustrated by W. Heath Robinson
 * New Conjuring without Skill, Bodley Head (1935)
 * Professor Branestawm's Treasure Hunt, John Lane (1937), illustrated by James Arnold; Bodley Head (1966), illustrated by George Adamson
 * Larky Legends (1938), republished as The Dribblesome Teapots and Other Incredible Stories (1973)
 * Successful Conjuring for Amateurs, Pearson (c.1951)
 * The Puffin Book of Magic (1968), republished as Norman Hunter's Book of Magic, Bodley Head (1974)
 * The Peculiar Triumph of Professor Branestawm, Bodley Head (1970), illustrated by George Adamson
 * The Dribblesome Teapots and Other Incredible Stories (1971), illustrated by Fritz Wegner
 * Professor Branestawm Up the Pole, Bodley Head (1972), illustrated by George Adamson
 * Professor Branestawm's Dictionary, Bodley Head (1973), with cover by George Adamson
 * The Frantic Phantom and Other Incredible Stories (1973), illustrated by Geraldine Spence
 * Wizards Are A Nuisance, BBC (1973)
 * Professor Branestawm's Great Revolution, Bodley Head (1974), illustrated by David Hughes; Puffin (1977), illustrated by George Adamson
 * The Home-made Dragon and Other Incredible Stories (1974), illustrated by Fritz Wegner
 * Dust up at the Royal Disco: and Other Stories (1975), illustrated by Fritz Wegner
 * Long Live Their Majesties (1975)
 * Professor Branestawm's Compendium of Donundrums, Riddles, Puzzles, Brain Twiddlers and Dotty Descriptions, Bodley Head (1975)
 * Professor Branestawm's Do-It-Yourself Handbook, Bodley Head (1976); Puffin (1979), illustrated by Jill McDonald
 * Professor Branestawm Round the Bend, Bodley Head (1977), illustrated by Derek Cousins
 * Vanishing Ladies, and Other Magic, Bodley Head (1978), illustrated by Jill McDonald
 * Professor Branestawm's Perilous Pudding, Bodley Head (1979), illustrated by Derek Cousins
 * The Best of Branestawm, Bodley Head (1980), with illustrations by George Adamson, Derek Cousins, W. Heath Robinson and Jill McDonald
 * Sneeze and Be Slain and Other Incredible Stories (1980)
 * Professor Branestawm and the Wild Letters, Bodley Head (1981), illustrated by Gerald Rose
 * Professor Branestawm's Pocket Motor Car, Bodley Head (1981), illustrated by Gerald Rose
 *  Professor Branestawm's Mouse War, Bodley Head (1982), illustrated by Gerald Rose
 * Professor Branestawm's Building Bust-Up, Bodley Head (1982), illustrated by Gerald Rose
 * Count Bakwerdz on the Carpet and Other Incredible Stories (1982), illustrated by Babette Cole
 * Professor Branestawm's Crunchy Crockery, Bodley Head (1983), illustrated by Gerald Rose
 * Professor Branestawm's Hair-Raising Idea, Bodley Head (1983), illustrated by Gerald Rose

title: Norman Hunter (writer)