text:
User talk:Zippanova

American vs. British spellings & improper page moves
Hi there. I've noticed you've been moving certain articles (e.g. color and fiber) from their original locations to their respective British variants without there being a real need for the change. Wikipedia is an international project, so both American and British English are tolerated here: I invite you to puruse the relevant Manual of Style guideline at Manual of Style. Changing such spellings tends to invoke hard feelings needlessly (not that there are any in this instance). While I can understand if you think what you're doing is "correct" (being a Canadian myself), your methods are improper.

Firstly, please see How to move a page. You've been moving articles via copy/paste, which destroys a page's edit history: This is not only a bad thing when our license is considered, but it's inconsiderate of other users. Such moves will be reversed. Secondly, and just as important from a wikiquette point of view, is your lack of discussion prior to moving the articles. You should propose the moves on the articles' respective talk pages (e.g. Talk:Color) before moving them, allowing a reasonable time period for discussion. I must ask you not to make such undiscussed, improper page moves in the future. Thanks for your consideration. -- Hadal 08:41, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * Regarding your spelling changes on resistor: Note that you should only change spelling variants in order to make a page consistent with itself. If that's what you're doing, say so in the edit summary. - Omegatron 22:49, Mar 23, 2005 (UTC)

Metric and Imperial/US measurements
Wikipedia policy is that we never replace one system of measurement by another, as you did at Sport utility vehicle. We instead add conversions. The original system of measurement used is generally given first, with conversions in parentheses afterwards. In this case, the US laws in question state their requirements in US measurements, so removing them and replacing them with metric is completely inappropriate.

Please do not remove comments from your user talk page without responding to them. Wikipedia is a collaborative effort; please show good faith in cooperating with other users. —Morven 01:16, Apr 2, 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, I am still a bit new to this. Didn't mean to be arrogant. After all, this is communism and I am a communist. Sorry again. --Zippanova 02:21, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Don't use piped links in albums.
WikiProject Albums's Style section states Do not use piped links to "years in music" e.g. 1991, instead add (see 1991 in music) where you feel it is appropriate. Please don't change the album pages to do this. Thanks! grendel|khan 01:53, 2005 May 2 (UTC)

Thanks for the advice. --Zippanova 02:55, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

Faux British Spellings
As you know, the British/Canadian/Australian versions of plenty of words end in -our rather than the American -or. However, even many native speakers of British English get things wrong when the word is modified — for about half of the -our endings, it should properly revert to the -or form when modified. To make this absolutely clear, this is NOT a America vs. Britain/Commonwealth distinction - in these cases, the -our form is always wrong — consult the OED. Examples as follows:

 * arbour, but arbourist -> arborist, arbouretum -> arboretum
 * clamour, but clamourous -> clamorous
 * clangour, but clangourous -> clangorous
 * colour, but colouration -> coloration
 * glamour, but glamourous -> glamorous, glamourless -> glamorless, glamourize -> glamorize, glamourise -> glamorise
 * honour, but honourary -> honorary, honourarium -> honorarium, honourific -> honorific
 * humour, but humourist -> humorist, humourous -> humorous
 * labour, but labourious -> laborious
 * odour, but odourous -> odorous, odouriferous -> odoriferous
 * rancour, but rancourous -> rancorous
 * rigour, but rigourous -> rigorous
 * tumour, but tumourous -> tumorous

Cheers, Fawcett5 15:00, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Oh, haha...wow. I did not know that one. Thanks. --Zippanova 15:28, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)

C-Train
In the future, please avoid blatent POV statements. Also, you should think about this: Calgary's C-Train has only 1/3 less track than Toronto's subway (about 20km shy) which serves a metropolitan area 5 times Calgary's size. The C-Train also has one of the highest per capita riderships of any rapid transit system in Canada. All Canadian transit systems are inadequate by, say, European standards but uh, that's just my POV. It also might be worth noting that most of the people who complain about CT live in new suburbs which have inanely low population densities. Does it really make sense to expand a train to serve 25 people (give or take)? Once the city completes its next train order, there will be one train every 3 minutes at peak... but I suppose that's simply too inadequate for a city of a million. - Tyson2k 05:58, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Ok, I agree. It was very POV. Maybe I'll do some research on that and offer some external links (both pro and con) in the article. --Zippanova 14:17, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Maxine Nightingale
Looks like I beat you to that article ;) Mike H (Talking is hot) 08:05, 22 October 2005 (UTC)

Good stuff. Doesn't matter to me who writes it, as long as it is on WP. =D --Zippanova 17:58, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

220s.png
please list this at WP:IFD with reasons of OB (Image:220sb.svg) and OR -- if it was a pixel-by-pixel reproduction could be speedied. --Admrboltz (T | C) 06:40, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Image:British House of Commons graphical representation.PNG
Was wondering if you could update this for the current info at Party standings in the British House of Commons, or if you'd mind if I did it? Ian3055 19:18, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

why do you remove this part
Hello sir

Many found reason to doubt these motives in the words of Israeli Lt. General Dan Halutz who threatened to "turn Lebanon's clock back 20 years."[3] in a reference to the destruction Lebanon suffered in it's bloody civil war--Sa.vakilian 07:57, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:2006_Israel-Lebanon_conflict"

 * I'm sorry, but you are mistaken. My edits never removed that sentence or any part of it.  You might want examine the edit history again (look in particular at adjacent edits) to find your culprit.  As for the talk page which you referenced, I have never edited that.  Cheers.
 * ☭ Zippanova  04:46, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Request clarification of image source
Hi. The source and license of an image you once uploaded to Commons is questioned. Please see http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:BirkaExcavation1.png Fred-Chess 18:07, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Ski-doo
not that the deletion of the portion pertaining 23 skidoo was incorrect, on the contrary, but i was wondering where you got the information about the 'sea-dog.' it was my understanding that first came the 'sea-doo' and the 'ski-doo' was a natural transition to a newer product. still, yours was a good edit. The undertow 09:35, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

There is a special on CBC here in Canada about the 50 greatest Canadian inventions and they mentioned it as a spelling mistake. I've also heard this before somewhere else a few years ago but can't remember where. I'll look for more evidence online although I don't have any site references right now
 * ☭ Zippanova  13:30, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Orphaned fair use image (Image:AnOtherCup back cover.jpg)
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Quality of Life in cities
Go ahead a create an article about that. I will help if I can. But it can't be just from one source. Kevlar67 04:38, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Orphaned fair use image (Image:ABBA-logo.svg)
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Image:Colin James album.jpg
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Image:Colin James Bad Habits.jpg
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Image:Colin James Fuse.jpg
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Image:Colin James Limelight.jpg
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Image:Colin James Little Big Band 3.jpg
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Image:Colin James Little Big Band II.jpg
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Image:Colin James Little Big Band.jpg
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Image:Colin James National Steel.jpg
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Image:Colin James Sudden Stop.jpg
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Image:Colin James Then Again.jpg
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Image:Colin James Traveler.jpg
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Fair use rationale for Image:I Am the Bloody Earth album cover.jpg
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162nd Ave Station
Hi, you left me a note awhile ago. I've been looking for a source forever of the train that went from Anderson to 162nd Ave station and here it is with photos. --Þadius (talk) 12:12, 5 November 2011 (UTC)

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The Flavor of Corn
Hello I am new in wikipedia and interesting in LGBT related topics too. Recently i added new article called . Its about nice Italian LGBT related film created at 1986. But my article was declined becouse of abcent of external links. To my opinion this is not fair, becouse I mentioned the page from IMD. Please help me to approve this article and make it better. Thanks in advance. The link of article is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Articles_for_creation/The_Flavor_of_Corn  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.70.13.169 (talk) 11:49, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

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Calgary community moves
FYI regarding the move of Evergreen, Calgary to Evergreen Estates. I'm guessing there is inconsistency at the City of Calgary about the official name of the community, but it appears that "Evergreen" is correct. Also, with your recent move of MacEwan, Calgary to MacEwan Glen, was it your original intent to move it to MacEwan Glen, Calgary, except that the previously established redirect got in the way? Hwy43 (talk) 17:40, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

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ArbCom elections are now open!
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license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:Zippanova


text:
Talk:Cockapoo

Reliably sourced version
& if you are not the same person, please read about WP:Reliable sources, the version you keep reverting to is not adequately attributed to reliable sources. I welcome you to add to the reliably sourced version I have written, but please stop your blind reverting to a abysmal version of the article that does not adhere to Wikipedia’s standards. Regards, Cavalryman (talk) 12:46, 8 June 2020 (UTC).

Unrealistic Standards for Reliable Sources
Some considerably large amounts of detailed information continue to be deleted from this page under the explanation that it is not reliably sourced. It seems the standards being applied are out of line with general practice across wikipedia, even if they could be (arguably) defended under the strict interpretation of wikipedia's reliable source guidelines.

The fact that a Cockapoo is a cross breed and not an official breed recognized by an association means it is impossible for there to be a definitive source or definition of what the breed is. In the absence of this, citing multiple long-standing websites that all concur on various details about the breed seems a reasonable way to cite the information.

Take for example the page about golden retrievers. This breed is one that is recognized by the American Kennel Club, which fits the the stricter definition of a reliable source, but it also relies on many websites similar in "reliability" as the American Cockapoo Club, which consistently gets removed as an unreliable source on this page. Examples of what has been allowed as a reliable source on the Golden Retriever page are www.k9web.com, www.fetchdog.com etc., This is an example of inconsistent standards being applied.

This page used to be full of what common sense would tell you is very good, detailed, reliable information. But it continues to get nuked because it is being held to a higher standard that usual. And given the fact that it is about a topic that will likely never have a "reliable source" some consideration needs to be made to aforementioned common sense.

If this unreasonable standard continues to be applied to this page it will forever remain a Stub. Given the acceptance of similarly reliable sources on other articles, it stands to reason that wikipedia would be better off retaining the old, detailed, informative, and generally agreed upon among multiple sources, version of this page, rather than have next to no information at all. Even worse, the current article is demonstrably wrong, but because of the unrealistic standards being applied it keeps being reverted to a wrong version. Examples include the weight and size range of the dog, the fact that it is a mix with a miniature poodle (it can be a mix with any poodle) and more. It is sad to see that an incorrect version of the page is being favored over a correct version because of an unfair and unrealistic standard of reliable sources. Arthurdents (talk) 15:09, 18 September 2020 (UTC)Arthur Dents
 * , if I had to choose between you and about who has more knowledge of Wikipedia's standards regarding the reliability of sources, or the reasonableness of what we can include with what kind of sources, Ima go with Cavalryman. We are not going to have content sourced to dogtime.com or poodlemixworld.com; the former is just another website with content but no editorial policy by which to judge reliability, and the latter is someone's personal website. Sorry, but no, that is not going to be accepted here. Drmies (talk) 15:26, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
 * , Cavalryman removed sources including americancockapooclub.com, dogtime.com (which is sourced on over 1,000 articles on wikipedia), and a published book (ISBN 978-0-9927843-8-6). It is a shame that you see this as a contest between who is more knowledgeable, myself or him. I see this as a loss to Wikipedia that obviously reliable information is being deleted due to demonstrably unfair standards being applied. The result is that this page now has information that is in disagreement with a very large amount of other sources on the web (that have been accepted as RS on other articles) and in published text. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arthurdents (talk • contribs)
 * Hello, americancockapooclub.com & dogtime.com are clearly short of Wikipedia’s standards for sourcing, anywhere I see the latter I remove it. As for the book, you did not include sufficient bibliographic information to WP:Verify what you were citing. I appreciate your frustration when you see other pages that are in poor shape, there are only so many working to bring these pages back into line with policy and so many hours in a day, therefore many pages are yet to be reviewed and rewritten if necessary. Cavalryman (talk) 02:02, 19 September 2020 (UTC).

 * I think it's appropriate to start having a discussion about whether Cavalryman is doing an edit war on this page, if you look at the page history, it's mostly compulsive edits of any information that he didn't personally ad to the page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gocreighton (talk • contribs) 18:47, 14 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Hello, I would welcome any review of my contributions, as you can see above an administrator has already commented on this discussion but if you think that is insufficient I suggest you post something at WP:AN. With regards to this recent contribution, as I clearly articulated in my edit summary the cited book is self published and as far as I can ascertain the author has never “previously been published by reliable, independent publications”. As such the book should be not be considered a reliable source and both it and the information attributed to it should be removed. Cavalryman (talk) 00:59, 15 March 2021 (UTC).

1950s or 1960s?
The Encyclopedia of the Dog and Designer Dogs books referenced in the article list the 1960s as the origin period for the dog. Purina also lists the 1960s.

The Cockapoos: A Complete Pet Owner's Manual at page 7, the Cockapoo Club of America, and the Cockapoo Club of Great Britain list the 1950s. Pet insurers LV and Tesco Bank also list the 1950s.

Is there a definitive answer to this ambiguity? RoanokeVirginia (talk) 05:07, 12 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Fogle and Morris are eminent sources and both say 60s, Gauge is more marginal but also says 60s. The reliable source that says 50s is Amon, it is probably more marginal again. None of the other links you have provided are reliable, secondary sources. Therefore, 60s is far better sourced. Cavalryman (talk) 11:11, 12 July 2021 (UTC).

Not to be confused with Kakapo
Is anyone really confusing the Cockapoo with the kakapo? The names are only slightly similar whilst sounding different regardless of accent Traumnovelle (talk) 03:54, 3 January 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Cockapoo


text:
Humphrey Firman

Humphrey Osbaldston Brooke Firman VC (24 November 1886 – 24 April 1916) was an English recipient of the Victoria Cross, the highest and most prestigious award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Firman was born at South Kensington in 1886 to Humphrey Brooke Firman, J.P. (of Gateforth, Selby, Yorkshire and New Malden, Surrey) and Florence Adelaide (née Cumming). He joined the Royal Navy as a cadet on 15 May 1901 and, as midshipman and sub-lieutenant, served on HMS Glory on the China Station, in the battleships HMS Albion and HMS Illustrious in the Channel Fleet, and in the Royal Yacht Victoria and Albert. Promoted to Lieutenant in 1908, he saw service in the Persian Gulf and off the Horn of Africa. During the First World War he was killed in action on the night of 24 April 1916 in Mesopotamia in an attempt to resupply the forces trapped in the Siege of Kut, at the age of 29. He was posthumously awarded the Victoria Cross for his deeds, as was a fellow naval officer, Lieutenant Commander Charles Cowley R.N.V.R.

Citation
"The General Officer Commanding, Indian Expeditionary Force 'D', reported on this attempt in the following words:- ' At 8 p.m. on April 24th, 1916, with a crew from the Royal Navy under Lieut. Firman, R.N., assisted by Lieut. Comdr. Cowley, R.N.V.R., the Julnar, carrying 270 tons of supplies, left Falahiyah in an attempt to reach Kut. Her departure was covered by all artillery and machine gun fire that could be brought to bear, in the hope of distracting the enemy's attention. She was, however, discovered and shelled on her passage up the river. At 1 a.m. on the 25th, Gen. Townshend reported that she had not arrived, and that at midnight a burst of heavy firing had been heard at Magasis, some 9 miles from Kut by river, which had suddenly ceased. There could be but little doubt that the enterprise had failed, and the next day the Air Service reported the ' Julnar ' in the hands of the Turks at Magasis. The leaders of this brave attempt, Lieut. H.O.B. Firman, R.N., and his assistant, Lieut. Comdr. C.H. Cowley, R.N.V.R. – the latter of whom throughout the campaign in Mesopotamia performed magnificent service in command of the 'Mejidieh' – have been reported by the Turks to have been killed; the remainder of the gallant crew, including five wounded, are prisoners of war. Knowing well the chances against them, all the gallant officers and men who manned the 'Julnar' for the occasion were volunteers. I trust that the services in this connection of Lieut. H.O.B. Firman, R.N., and Lieut. Comdr. C.H. Cowley, R.N.V.R., his assistant, both of whom were unfortunately killed, may be recognised by the posthumous grant of some suitable honour.' The account of the award is preceded by the following paragraph:- 'The King has been graciously pleased to approve of the posthumous grant of the Victoria Cross to the undermentioned officers in recognition of their conspicuous gallantry in an attempt to re-provision the force besieged in Kut-el-Amara."

Legacy
In New Malden, Surrey, a plaque bearing his name was unveiled on the war memorial in April 2008, while Firman Close is named after him. A stone slab memorial to Firman is set into the pavement on the south side of South Kensington tube station and was unveiled on 25 April 2016. He is commemorated on the Basra Memorial.

His Victoria Cross is held at the York Castle Museum.

title: Humphrey Firman


text:
Donald Farmer

Lieutenant-Colonel Donald Dickson Farmer VC (28 May 1877 – 23 December 1956) was a Scottish recipient of the Victoria Cross, the highest and most prestigious award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Early military service
Farmer joined the Queen's Own Cameron Highlanders on 29 March 1892, and served with the 1st Battalion in the Sudan Campaign, 1898, and was present at the battles of Atbara and Khartoum.

Details on Victoria Cross
Farmer was 23 years old, and a sergeant in the 1st Battalion, the Cameron Highlanders, during the Second Boer War when he won the VC on 13 December 1900 at Nooitgedacht, South Africa. His citation reads: "During the attack on General Clements Camp at Nooitgedacht, on the 13th December, 1900, Lieutenant Sandilands, Cameron Highlanders, with fifteen men, went to the assistance of a picquet which was heavily engaged, most of the men having been killed or wounded. The enemy, who were hidden by trees, opened fire on the party at a range of about 20 yards, killing two and wounding five, including Lieutenant Sandilands. Sergeant Farmer at once went to the Officer, who was perfectly helpless, and carried him away under a very heavy and close fire to a place of comparative safety, after which he returned to the firing line and was eventually taken prisoner."

Later military career
He served in South Africa throughout the war, and returned home with other officers and men of the 1st Battalion Cameron Highlanders on the SS Dunera, which arrived at Southampton in October 1902.

During World War I he served with the King's Regiment (Liverpool).

The medal
His Victoria Cross is displayed at the Regimental Museum of Queens Own Highlanders, Fort George, Inverness-shire, Scotland.

title: Donald Farmer


text:
Bambang

Bambang may refer to

Philippines

 * Bambang, Nueva Vizcaya
 * Several barangays:
 * Bambang in Calaca, Batangas
 * Bambang in Pasig, Metro Manila
 * Bambang in Taguig, Metro Manila
 * Bambang in Candaba, Pampanga

Indonesia

 * Bambang, a district in the Mamasa Regency, West Sulawesi

People

 * Bambang Dwi Hartono, Mayor of Surabaya, 2002-2005 and 2005-2010
 * Bambang Hendarso Danuri, Chief of National Police of Indonesia, 2008-2010
 * Bambang Pamungkas, Indonesian footballer
 * Bambang Permadi Soemantri Brodjonegoro, Indonesian Minister of National Development Planning
 * Bambang Soesatyo, Indonesian politician and businessman
 * Bambang Trihatmodjo, third son of Soeharto
 * Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono, President of Indonesia, 2004-2014

title: Bambang


text:
Alfred Edward Durrant

Alfred Edward Durrant VC ISM (4 November 1864 – 29 March 1933) was an English recipient of the Victoria Cross, the highest and most prestigious award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Details
He was 35 years old, and a private in the 2nd Battalion, The Rifle Brigade (Prince Consort's Own), British Army during the Second Boer War when the following deed took place on 27 August 1900 at the Battle of Bergendal, South Africa, for which he was awarded the VC: "At Bergendal, on the 27th August, 1900, Acting-Corporal Wellar having been wounded, and being somewhat dazed, got up from his prone position in the firing line, exposing himself still more to the enemy's fire, and commenced to run towards them. Private Durrant rose, and pulling him down endeavoured to keep him quiet, but finding this impossible he took him up and carried him back for 200 yards under a heavy fire to shelter, returning immediately to his place in the line."

He later achieved the rank of lance-corporal. His Victoria Cross is displayed at the Royal Green Jackets (Rifles) Museum, Winchester, England.

title: Alfred Edward Durrant


text:
Talk:Lushootseed

Untitled
Whoever wrote up the Ethnologue classification obviously knew nothing about Salishan language. What an idea, putting Lushootseed, Skagit, Snohomish, the Southern Puget Sound dialects and Twana all on the same level and calling it "Twana"!!! Lushootseed (dxwleshucid) is a name for the mutually intelligible dialects spoken along the eastern and southern shores of the Puget Sound - Skagit and Snohomish are northern dialects, Duwamish, Niqually, Puyallup and Squaxin are southern dialects. Twana on the other hand is a closely related but not mutually intelligible language, and it has far fewer speakers than Lushootseed so calling the grouping "Twana" just makes no sense; a much better term is Southern Coast Salish, as used in the Handbook of North American Indians (vol. 7).

example sentences
if anybody knows some example sentences, write them here. example

 * aaa- aaa-aaa- aaa-aaa
 * man-boy-fish-past-give
 * the man gave the boy a fish

 * and more sentences would be great!!  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.104.195.115 (talk) 04:28, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

xwəlšucid.Whulshootseed
xwəlšucid is southern Puget sound, dxwləšúcid is northern sound

 * Whulshootseed article now exists; I'm unfamiliar with terminologies, it may be that the entire "Southern" section ehre could/should be migrated to that page, or it should be merged here....Skookum1 (talk) 17:24, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Lushootseed orthography
The salmonid terms on this page appear to be taken from the http://www.lushootseed.net/ web page. It should be noted that the spellings rendered here are thus not standard; see the "Spelling and Pronunciation" page on the site. Notably, the lushootseed.net spellings lack characters such as: ə, ƛ, etc.

 * i changed it to fit the standard. of course, it needs to be checked against a dictionary as there are ambiguities – ishwar  (speak)  04:10, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Would someone be so kind as to add some information to the article on how to read the orthography? There are letters and notations used here that I don't recognize (maybe just because I'm not that up on the IPA?), so some explanation would be welcome.

 * And it appears that the domain name for http://www.lushootseed.net/ expired -- it now has some blurb in German about nose jobs (Nasenkorrektur). -- Cheers, Erik Anderson -- 205.166.76.15 (talk) 21:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Tillicum/Steilacoom
Hi; figured this might be the place to ask if Steilacoom is a Lushootseed name/word, or if maybe it's a "Salishanized" form of Tillicum (i.e. with s- added). They're just so close to each other - Tillicum, Washington and Fort Steilacoom...I mean geogrpahically, as well as phonologically.....Skookum1 (talk) 20:12, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Salmon vocabulary
I don't think it belongs here, it maybe moved to Wiktionary. Attafei (talk) 12:19, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Nasal consonants
The text of the article says Lushootseed has no nasal consonants, and the vocabulary lists (which I liked) show no nasal consonants, but the table of the alphabet shows two kinds of m and two kinds of n. Can anyone straighten that out? —JerryFriedman (Talk) 21:14, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

b' and l'
This is confusing to me because the IPA /ɓ/ is a bilabial implosive, and it is called a "glottalized b." I've usually heard "glottalized" in the context of ejectives, which can't be voiced. I wasn't quite sure what to do to correct that though, because it seemed like the second column was what the actual speakers called the sound, rather than what linguists called it. /l'/ looks like an ejective lateral in IPA, which I didn't think was possible. If it's not that, than what is it, and what differentiates it from ɫ (velarized l)? Alázhlis (talk) 00:02, 8 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Fixed thank you! Alázhlis (talk) 06:02, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Number of speakers
The article gives 200 as the number of Lushootseed speakers. Marianne Mithun's 1999 reference work The languages of native North America states that there were "a handful", so 200 seems highly unlikely. Is there any recent, reliable information? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ohammer (talk • contribs) 13:34, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

No mention of Juliet Shen?
Juliet Shen was commissioned by the tribe to design a font to help with the language revitalisation. There's an article about it at Designing a font to preserve a vanishing language, being linked from Going Global: The last decade in multi-script type design. — OwenBlacker (Talk) 00:00, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

I was just in a lecture by Julia Shen. She should absolutely be mentioned here, as well as an external link to the font file. Kyleleitch 14:05 PDT, 4 November 2016 —Preceding undated comment added 21:05, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

phonology section
I created a phonology section based entirely on the Alphabet section. I recognize the original research issues, but phonology tables are expected on all language articles and there wasn't one yet. If anyone who has access to the books mentioned in the bibliography could source (or correct, if necessary) my phonological interpretation, please do so. Alázhlis (talk) 06:05, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * User:Fdomanico51997 I'm a bit confused by your changes. The conventions for phoneme tables are as follows: If a phoneme is marginal, it should be in parentheses. If it is an allophone, it should not be in the table but explained in a footnote. If it is neither, it should not be marked as all entries in the table are assumed to be phonemes. Please see English phonology and other phonology articles for examples. Thanks. Catrìona (talk) 14:11, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your contributions, User:Fdomanico51997. Could you please explain why you have deleted the reference to the true palatal consonants (ç and so forth)? I derived them from the alphabet section of this article, which, while needing clear inline citations seems to be based on Lushootseed-specific linguistic work which I consider more reliable then the source that you cited (Browner 2009). Browner is not a meaningful language learning resource if only two pages are devoted to Lushootseed language. Catrìona (talk) 16:10, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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Bed (bad?) example
One of the syntax examples given appears to be wrong: "šəqabac ʔal tə dqəl’qəlub" is said to mean "On top of the bed", but it actually means "On top of my eyes," since d- is the prefix for "my" and "qəl’qəlub" is "qəluʔb" which means eye, reduplicated to give the plural (and missing /ʔ/ which I assume is a typo.) See Hess p. 176.

To read as "On top of the bed" it should be "šəqabac ʔal ti piit" (See Hess p. 162 for piit, which comes from Chinook Jargon from English "bed.") The rest of the examples look okay, so I'll just make this change. Amabelles (talk)

Skykomish dialect
Hello, I removed Skykomish as a Southern dialect, because sources seem to indicate that there is no scholarly consensus. However, I am not an expert and if other more knowledgeable editors think this was foolish, please revert. Thanks! -  Paulie 27   talk  10:06, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

 * I was taught that it's a southern dialect, but I don't have any sources on hand to state that. I will update if I do. PersusjCP (talk) 18:43, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Lushootseed


text:
Ernest Albert Egerton

Ernest Albert Egerton VC (10 November 1897 – 14 February 1966) was an English recipient of the Victoria Cross, the highest and most prestigious award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Egerton was born on 10 November 1897. When he was 19 years old, and a Corporal in the 16th Battalion, The Sherwood Foresters (The Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire Regiment), British Army during the First World War, he was awarded the VC for his actions during the Battle of Passchendaele.

On 20 September 1917 southeast of Ypres, Belgium: ...during an attack, visibility was bad owing to fog and smoke. As a result, the two leading waves of the attack passed over certain hostile dugouts without clearing them and enemy rifles and machine-guns from these dugouts were inflicting severe casualties. Corporal Egerton at once responded to a call for volunteers to help in clearing up the situation and he dashed for the dugouts under heavy fire at short range. He shot a rifleman, a bomber and a gunner, by which time support had arrived and 29 of the enemy surrendered.

He later achieved the rank of sergeant. He served in the Home Guard in World War II and died on 14 February 1966.

His Victoria Cross is displayed at the Sherwood Foresters Museum in Nottingham Castle.

title: Ernest Albert Egerton


text: File:Maria McKee - Live in Hamburg.jpg

title: File:Maria McKee - Live in Hamburg.jpg


text:
Arthur Henderson (VC)

Arthur Henderson VC, MC (6 May 1893 – 24 April 1917) was a Scottish recipient of the Victoria Cross, the highest and most prestigious award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Henderson was born 6 May 1893 to George Henderson OBE, a Magistrate of Paisley, and Elizabeth Purdie.

He was 23 years old, and an Acting Captain in the 4th Battalion, The Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders (Princess Louise's), British Army, attached to 2nd Battalion during the First World War. On 23 April 1917 near Fontaine-les-Croisilles, France, he performed the deed for which he was awarded the Victoria Cross. He died the following day.

Citation
"2nd Lieutenant (acting Captain) Arthur Henderson, M.C., late Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders.

For most conspicuous bravery.

During an attack on the enemy trenches this officer, although almost immediately wounded in the left arm, led his Company through the front enemy line until he gained his final objective.

He then proceeded to consolidate his position, which, owing to heavy gun and machine gun fire and bombing attacks, was in danger of being isolated.

By his cheerful courage and coolness he was enabled to maintain the spirit of his men under most trying conditions.

Captain Henderson was killed after he had successfully accomplished his task."

Further information
Buried at the Commonwealth War Graves Commission's Cojeul British Cemetery, Saint-Martin-sur-Cojeul, Pas-de-Calais, France.

His name appears on the war memorial in Gordon in the Scottish borders, showing the fact that he won the VC.

His VC is on display in the Lord Ashcroft Gallery at the Imperial War Museum, London.

title: Arthur Henderson (VC)


text:
George Gardiner (VC)

George Gardiner (c. 1821 – 17 November 1891) was born in Clonallon, Warrenpoint, County Down and was an Irish recipient of the Victoria Cross, the highest and most prestigious award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Details
He was about 34 years old, and a sergeant in the 57th Regiment of Foot (later The Middlesex Regiment (Duke of Cambridge's Own)), British Army during the Crimean War when the following deed took place for which he was awarded the VC.

On 22 March 1855 at Sebastopol, Crimea, Sergeant Gardiner acted with great gallantry upon the occasion of a sortie by the enemy, in having rallied the covering parties which had been driven in by the Russians, thus regaining the trenches. On 18 June during the attack on the Redan he himself remained and encouraged others to remain in the holes made by the explosions of the shells, and whence they were able to keep up a continuous fire until their ammunition was exhausted, and the enemy cleared away from the parapet.

He later achieved the rank of Colour-Sergeant. He died at Lifford, County Donegal, 17 November 1891. He is buried at Clonleigh Church of Ireland Churchyard, Lifford.

His Victoria Cross is displayed at the Princess of Wales's Royal Regiment (Queen's and Royal Hampshires) (Dover Castle, England).

title: George Gardiner (VC)


text: Wikipedia:POTD/December 3, 2004

title: Wikipedia:POTD/December 3, 2004


text:
Talk:Supertask

What about a bouncing ball? In terms of raw physics the ball technically bounces an infinite number of times but because the interval between bounces are increasingly short the total time converges to a finite sum (rather than diverging to infinity which would mean it bounces forever). This seems to be a supertask that happens all the time in the world. But if that is so then what does that mean? --Mike (July 24th 2006)

An infinite number of people sneezing simultaneously - is this a supertask? By the current definition it is since an infinite number of actions have been performed in a finite space of time. However I'm not sure I would classify this as a supertask and so believe the definition needs refining. Anyone any opinions?? --NoizHed 20:17, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

You're right. This isn't a supertask, since these infinite actions would take place in parallel. It's only a supertask when an infinite number of actions happen sequentially. For that reason, I don't see Hilbert's Hotel scenarios as a supertask either. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.113.89.96 (talk) 16:23, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Ok I've completely redone this page, although only given a bare backbone to each section. Hopefully someone can bust it up a bit. NoizHed 18:10, 2005 Aug 23

Newton and determinism
I just came across this article and was thinking about some things. "Laraudogoitia’s Beautiful Supertask" reminds me of Zeno's arrow paradox (at least, one aspect of it). Even though the arrow has to travel through an infinite number of points, it still travels through all of them. Likewise, the moving particle in this "Beautiful Supertask" still transfers its motion (which travels at a constant speed through the line of particles) and causes the "last" particle to come off the end at whatever that speed is. In fact, couldn't this physical fact be used to dispute the assumption that an finite-length space can hold an infinite number of particles? 12:54, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
 * The particles in the experiment are point masses so that would beg the question. However you    could do a similar experiment where all the particles have non-zero volume, provided there is no lower bound on the radius a particle can have. You have each particle having half the radius of the one to its right, and let the far right particle have a radius of 10cm say. Also there is no "last" particle, so nothing comes out of the end after one second. That is part of strangeness of this experiment since when time is reversed there are no moving body's yet they spring into motion nontheless. --NoizHed 16:27, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

 * Pardon my last question about if "finite-length [spaces] can hold an infinite number of particles"; it would seem I forgot they are point masses.
 * Well my point is that assuming each point mass passes all of its kinetic energy on to the next mass in line, the effect would be that of one point mass traveling from one side of the line to the other at a constant speed (even though at every collision, the mass stops and the one it collided with continues on). This means that collisions would be happening more and more frequently (first after X/2 time units, then X/4, then X/8, etc.) until at X time units when the particle (if uninhibited by other particles) would have reached the end of the line. According to the supertask, all of the kinetic motion ceases immediately at the end of the line because there is no last particle on line. It is -that- which is violating conservation of energy, not the time reversal. The time reversal is just the same violation in reverse. So assuming that conservation of energy must hold, and assuming the existence of point masses and a non-discrete space in which they may reside and collide with perfect elasticity, does that not invalidate this supertask? 20:10, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

 * That is exactly correct. However it isn't claimed that the time reversal is the cause of the violation of conservation of energy, it's the time reversal that causes the violation of determinism which was commonly thought to be a property of Newtonian particle mechanics. It is also true that if you assume conservation of energy the supertask is a contradiction. However Laraudogoitia considers CoE to be a derived result (so to assume CoE would be to beg the question against him), and he gets his conclusion from more basic assumptions - namely that particles draw continuous space-time paths, the exchange of velocity for equimassive particles (finally he assumes time reversal invariance - however that isn't needed to derive the violation of CoE as you quite rightly pointed out)--NoizHed 21:54, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

 * It is assumed that Newtonian/Classical mechanics govern the environment in which the point masses exist? Determinism, etc. 22:57, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

 * Newtonian mechanics is assumed, (to be more precise the result is derived from even weaker assumptions, namely the three I listed above). Determinism obviously isn't assumed, especially since the experiment shows Newtonian mechanics isn't deterministic after all! --NoizHed 17:50, 13 September 2005 (UTC)

 * If you begin with those three assumptions (particles draw continuous space-time paths, velocity exchange for equimassive particles, and time reversal invariance), you've assumed determinism. Every particle has one path and only one path it can take through space-time (in both "directions of time"); this is because of time reversal invariance and particles having continuous space-time paths. I believe the apparent contradiction stems from the infinite number of particles in a line. -- 21:50, 13 September 2005 (UTC)

 * What you just described isn't *causal* determinism. Trivially, talking about 4 dimensional space-time always involves a brand of determinism, but of a different (weaker) sort. Causal determinism is the kind outlined by Laplace, where given the velocities and masses of every particle at a particular time means you can deduce their positions, velocities, masses etc... at every future point. --82.43.139.208 19:02, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

 * You can align an infinite number particles on the number line, but on the other hand you can't let the momentum go through all of them? There seems to be some inconsistency in the modelling, and/or that some parts are not as clearly defined as they seem to be. One thing I would like to point out is, the set-up actually assumes a mathematical system different to that based on the real number set, on which Newtonian mechanics is defined, by allowing us to think of infinitesmal quantities besides of the dimensions of objects. 218.250.190.110 (talk) 08:44, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

218.250.190.110 (talk) 08:44, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Newtonian mechanics simply do not apply well to infinite densities as here.--Hagman (talk) 20:34, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
 * What's being claimed as infinitesimal? An infinite number of particles on a line seems trivially realizable in real numbers (say, take a particle at each integer). CRGreathouse (t | c) 20:45, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

What's the difference between causal determinism and what I've described? Unless it's something like "a particle's velocity remains the same unless it collides with another particle" (which I assumed but should have included). I also noticed the definition at the beginning of the determinism article: "Determinism is the philosophical proposition that every event, including human cognition and action, is causally determined by an unbroken chain of prior occurrences." (emphasis added) This seems to imply that the phrase "causal determinism" is redundant - in that determinism already implies causality. Your thoughts? -- 00:28, 9 October 2005 (UTC)

Thomson's lamp
There seem to be two brief discussions about this. Is this desirable or redundant? —DemonThing talk 05:23, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Real Infinity??
The question of whether supertasks are possible - ie. can exist in the 'real' world (whatever that is) - hinges on whether or not infinite is meaningful in that same world. I believe that the intuitive answer is the correct one: infinite is not a meaningful term in the real world.

The thought exercises produce logical paradoxes because they are impossible. String an infinite number of point masses together and what do you have? A black hole that swallows the universe. At that stage it becomes rather pointless to consider what happens when you try to move one, doesn't it.

So as fun as it may be to think of these things, it just seems silly to consider them in relation to reality. 3:39, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The point of the Zeno paradoxes was to show that these supertasks actually *do* occur in the real world. The ensuing literature from Thomson and Benacerraf concerned the question as to whether this was really a paradox or not. Also a distinction should be made between physically possibility and logical possibility. Many of the experiments are physically impossible yet, the claim is, they are logically possible. --NoizHed 13:53, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

 * I think we don't understand nearly enough about our universe to conclusively decide whether or not "infinite" is a meaningful word within it or not, or whether these supertasks actually are occurring or not (consider very-small-scale discrete time/space vs. continuous). -- Ben-Arba 11:03, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Comuputer Science and Supertasks
There still is no link to a definition of supertask re computer science. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.83.14.130 (talk) 17:13, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

It'd be nifty if the computer science definition of a supertask was available inside the wikipedia too.

Agreed! After seeing the PDF I still don't know what a supertask (or any of the other things mentioned there) is! Brianjd 06:08, 2004 Dec 12 (UTC)

The meaning of the term supertask in popular computer science and in hypercomputing agrees with the one from mathematics and philosophy. There is no need for additional definition of supertask in the context of computer science. As far as the article about supertasks in multi-processor scheduling is concerned , this is just one of the uses, that is not widely known and accepted. Using this narrow definition to computer science in general would be stretching the point. Maybe just adding a section about other uses of the term supertask would be appropriate. --Marni 00:30, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia
Wouldn't Wikipedia be one, since everything must be sourced, and to be trusted, sources must be sourced, which must be sourced, ad infinitum? 70.184.32.37 00:19, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

 * No. The regress stops at primary sources and secondary sources acceptable under WP:RS; meta-sourcing of sources is also stopped by WP:AGF. --Gwern (contribs) 02:41 15 May 2007 (GMT)

Kafka
Would anyone object if I added an example from Kafka to the Interesting Examples section? - all his characters seem to be struggling with a supertask of one kind or other, often internal - but one of the clearest examples is from his story 'The Great Wall of China':

 * ...The messenger started off at once, a powerful, tireless man. Sticking one arm out and then another, he makes his way through the crowd. ... he moves forward easily, unlike anyone else. But the crowd is so huge; its dwelling places are infinite ... If there were an open field, how he would fly along, and soon you would hear the marvelous pounding of his fist on your door. But instead of that, how futile are all his efforts. He is still forcing his way through the private rooms of the innermost palace. He will never win his way through. And if he did manage that, nothing would have been achieved. He would have to fight his way down the steps, and, if he managed to do that, nothing would have been achieved. He would have to stride through the courtyards, and after the courtyards the second palace encircling the first, and, then again, stairs and courtyards, and then, once again, a palace, and so on for thousands of years...

What do you all think? Adambrowne666 09:20, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

 * Well, according to the definition a supertask is an infinite sequence of tasks that occurs in a *finite* amount of time. It is implied that Kafka's messenger carries out his tasks for ever. --NoizHed 12:35, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Nonsense in section on Ross-Littlewood (infinitely many marbles) paradox
The section on the Ross-Littlewood paradox is filled with utter nonsense. Such as:

"Of course, it would be wise to heed Benacerraf’s words that the states of the jars before t = 1 do not logically determine the state at t = 1."

The following sentence is also unsupported by logic, for there is no reason to believe that this just-change-the-numerical-labels version ought to have the same result as the original problem (or any result at all!!!).

"A bare-naked variation that really goes straight to the heart of all of this goes as follows: at t = 0, there is one marble in the jar with the number 0 scribbled on it. At t = 0.5, the number 0 on the marble gets replaced with the number 1, at t = 0.75, the number gets changed to 2, etc."

Most important, this is not one of those paradoxes that remains ultimately unresolved! There is only one correct way to think of this, and all the ways of thinking that lead to different conclusions are flawed by reasoning that assumes facts not in evidence regarding infinities. A fully correct analysis of this paradox was given by Martin Gardner when he described the paradox's resolution in Scientific American. An erroneous analysis is given in the second edition of the book "Paradoxes from A to Z" by Michael Clark.Daqu (talk) 15:07, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

 * You really need to explain why you make these statements. What is Gardner's analysis, and why is that one correct? What is Clark's analysis, and why is that one incorrect? And finally, the bare-naked variation is a variation, so why should one suppose that it should have the same result as the original problem?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.248.252.86 (talk) 13:35, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

 * In response to your last question: The "bare-naked variation" is problematic because the article describes it as one "that really goes straight to the heart of all of this". But in fact it is only tenuously related, if at all.Daqu (talk) 10:42, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

 * I will at some point explain why I have made these statements. But on what basis should *I* need to explain why I make these statements???  The ones who need to explain their statements are those who wrote unsupportable claims in the article (something I have not done).Daqu (talk) 10:46, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

 * The idea that the state at t=1 is not determined is eminently sensible. Gardner's analysis is fine for supertasks done in a well-ordered manner, but nonsense otherwise. And what "fact in evidence" about infinity allows for only well-ordered supertasks? --Unzerlegbarkeit (talk) 01:22, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Most subsequent philosophers reject Zeno's bold conclusion in favor of common sense.
lol this sentence. very neutral. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.241.29.178 (talk) 23:51, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

no actual infinity
these supertasks only show that the nature of infinity is potential, not actual...such thought experiments are entertaining as novelties, but vacuous if meant to be taken seriously...

take the case of "guessing the positive integer"...I am thinking of a positive integer, can you guess which one?...let's say you approach this in an orderly way and ask is it 1? is it 2? is it 3? etc... were I thinking of an integer between 1 and 10, there would be an N such that after N "no" answers, the answer would have to be a "yes" answer, i.e. N=9... but since there are infinite positive integers, in our case there is no such N...in other words, even though it is true that one of the integers is my number, it is also true that for any N, I can logically, without contradicting myself (lying), have given you a series of N "no" answers...put this in the form of a supertask, and at T = 1, you have run through all the positive integers, have not received a "yes" answer, and so have not been able to guess my integer, although it certainly seems as if you should have!

paradoxical results such as this only mean there is a mistake somewhere in our reasoning...the more intractable the paradox, the more subtle the mistake, that's all...and a mistake can be so damned subtle that most thinkers to this point have missed it, or for reasons of their own, chosen to miss it... 24.58.142.63 (talk) 22:41, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Laraudogoitia’s supertask impossible
since all particles have width, it will be impossible to put infinity of them in a line, and all the particles will all be vibrating, so it is impossible for them to stop completely. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.206.23.16 (talk) 01:45, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Davies' super-machine
The version of the Supertask article edited by user:Quuxplusone at 18:40, May 1, 2013, in the section Davies' super-machine says that the Supertask construction in the Davies paper "Building Infinite Machines" is physically impossible because it requires the infinite divisibility of space and time. However I just read the Davies paper and it doesn't seem to mention that, nor does the Wikipedia article Atomic theory, cited by that same version of the article. While there are some speculative theories in which space and time are discrete (for example Causal sets), in both General Relativity and the Standard Model, currently the two most widely accepted fundamental theories of physics, space and time are explicitly formulated to be infinitely divisible. In both those theories events in space and time are represented using points in a Differentiable manifold, which is infinitely divisible. I'm going to edit the article to reflect the issues that Davies actually raised in his paper. Pmokeefe (talk) 14:52, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Deleting the section The diary of Tristram Shandy
"A supertask is a countably infinite sequence of operations that occur sequentially within a finite interval of time." "Tristram Shandy, the hero of a novel by Laurence Sterne, writes his autobiography so conscientiously that it takes him one year to lay down the events of one day." Shandy is only doing a finite amount of work (laying down the events of one day) in a finite amount of time (one year), so that is not an example of a supertask. I'm going to delete the section. Pmokeefe (talk) 15:33, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

contradiction
A supertask sets up a sequence of events that never stops, then asks what happens after the sequence never stops. How is this not a contradiction? 108.20.114.62 (talk) 13:38, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

 * This contradiction appeared when you added
 * 'a sequence of events that never stops',
 * which itself contradicts the actual assumption:
 * ' a supertask is a countably infinite sequence of operations that occur sequentially within a finite interval of time'.
 * And a finite interval obviously ends, hence anything that happens within the interval, stops.
 * You may, of course, see a contradiction in the infinite sequence of events happening within a finite time, but that's a different topic. CiaPan (talk) 15:28, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

Wrong definition
"In philosophy, a supertask is a countably infinite sequence of operations that occur sequentially within a finite interval of time."

That is simply and fundamentally wrong: beside that "philosophy" proper has little to do with it (or "cardinality" for that matter), a "supertask" is the *limit* of any such sequence, and "time" is totally irrelevant if not as an expository device.

(For example, Achilles does eventually reach the tortoise, but how long it takes is irrelevant, crucial is that it happens in the *limit* of the sequence of steps taken.)

LudovicoVan (talk) 13:28, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

 * Claims abaout correctness or wrongness of a definition should be supported by references to literature. No definition is inherently right or wrong. A definition is correct if it correctly identifies the meaning of the defined term. Unless otherwise specified the correct meaning is the one most commonly used in the literature. If there is variation in the literature that should be mentioned in the article. 2001:14BB:C3:9C72:5146:A4F2:587B:CD5 (talk) 10:42, 15 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I understand the idea of backed-up by references, but that is just not all there is to any argument or article and certainly not in a comment: moreover here I should literally reference at least three centuries of mistakes pervading all the literature. This article does reflect common understanding and even common literature, that doesn't change that fact that it is essentially and fundamentally wrong and in a way that is blatant as I do have in fact explained, for how briefly.  This article should be rewritten from scratch. LudovicoVan (talk) 11:27, 15 November 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Supertask


text:
Julian Royds Gribble

Captain Julian Royds Gribble VC (5 January 1897 − 25 November 1918) was a British Army officer and an English recipient of the Victoria Cross (VC), the highest and most prestigious award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Life
Born to George James Gribble and Norah Gribble (née Royds) of 34 Eaton Square in London. His siblings included Vivien Gribble, a wood engraver, who spent World War I in the Women's Land Army.

He was 21 years old, and a temporary captain in the 10th (S) Battalion, The Royal Warwickshire Regiment, British Army during the First World War when he performed a deed for which he was awarded the Victoria Cross on 23 March 1918 at Beaumetz, Hermies Ridge, France.

Citation
"For most conspicuous bravery and devotion to duty. Capt. Gribble was in command of the right company of the battalion when the enemy attacked, and his orders were to ' hold on to the last.' His company was eventually entirely isolated, though he could easily have withdrawn them at one period when the rest of the battalion on his left were driven back to a secondary position. His right flank was ' in the air,' owing to the withdrawal of all troops of a neighbouring division. By means of a runner to the company on his left rear he intimated his determination to hold on until other orders were received from battalion headquarters - and this he inspired his command to accomplish. His company was eventually surrounded by the enemy at close range, and he was seen fighting to the last. His subsequent fate is unknown. By his splendid example of grit, Capt. Gribble was materially instrumental in preventing for some hours the enemy obtaining a complete mastery of the crest of ridge, and by his magnificent self-sacrifice he enabled the remainder of his own brigade to be withdrawn, as well as another garrison and three batteries of field artillery."

Death
He was taken prisoner and died of pneumonia at the Niederzwehren prisoner of war camp in Germany, aged 21. Although he died 14 days after the end of the war, systems were not yet in place to repatriate those held prisoner.

He is commemorated on the War Memorial at Long Bredy in Dorset, close to Kingston Russell House, which had been purchased by his father in 1913. His sister Vivien designed a memorial window for him at Preston, Hertfordshire.

The medal
His VC was destroyed in a house fire and no replacement has been issued.

title: Julian Royds Gribble


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Neo-Tech

Neo-Tech was proposed for deletion. This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was keep

Neo-Tech
Original research, neologism. Obscure crackpot ideas. --[[User:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway Talk]] 07:41, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * NPOV and clear keep. Said to be "like a Scientologist's interpretation of Objectivism" . Accused of being a cult, with a history that seems to date back at least as far as 1976 when the "Neo-Tech Reference Encyclopedia" was published . A new religious movement active for the past three decades, even a fairly obscure one, and "crackpot" or not, is ipso facto notable. Samaritan 09:48, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * NPOV and keep. I agree that it's notable.  --PJF (talk) 10:00, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete. This is notable? --Calton 11:02, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * Although it may seem strange, on reflection I am going to vote against my own proposal. I think I've a tendency to dismiss objectivist ideas as cranky, whereas they're actually quite influential (they may still be cranky, though).  I recently discovered that Alan Greenspan was  one of Ayn Rand's groupies and still admires her.  Neo-Tech and the whole Zon Power thing is a fringe phenomenon of objectivism--and Samaritan is right, at least to an outsider it looks like Ayn Rand's objectivist ideas dressed up in Hubbardesque formulism.  The Neo-Tech people almost always respond to criticism of their stuff by claiming that an piecemeal attack is being made out of dishonest motives, and that Zon Power must be apprehended as a whole (people who attack Neo-Tech ideas are neocheaters and "pips" and it is said that they are acting out of a wish to conceal the benefits of Neo-Tech, which they feel threaten them).  Very Hubbardesque.  |Neo-Tech has been around long enough and annoyed enough Objectivists to be worthy of note.  NPOV and keep --[[User:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway Talk]] 14:37, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * Abstain: The problem with Neo-Tech is that it's generating every facet as an article. If we make the decision to keep, then we have to, at the same time, agree that this sets no precedent for neo-cheat or pip or any of the other things, plus no precedent for whatever power chair or thetan removal apparatus they have.  I.e. a single article on a fringe religion is one thing, but I think we have member editors who wish to propagate their beliefs via our site, which is not permissable.  We can say "NPOV and keep," but will it stay NPOV?  Is anyone motivated (as motivated as the believers) to keep monitoring this article to clean it up?  We have folks who watch the Mormon, Scientology, and Randian pages -- all of which attract furious POV warriors -- do we have the same for Neo-Tech?  If so, keep.  If not, merge and redirect.  Geogre 16:12, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * I agree with Geogre here. I think my vote has to be cleanup this article to NPOV, and if no one can or will clean it up, delete it instead.  -- Antaeus Feldspar 16:22, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)  Keep.  I'll be rather disappointed, though, if none of the people voting to keep it because they're notorious crackpots edit the article to balance its current description of the movement as A Vary Legitimite Philosophy Sar.  -- Antaeus Feldspar 18:41, 3 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep, it appears to describe an actual movement and I see no reason to delete it. We just need to watch out for activism, it seems like the kind of topic that could attract true believers to Wikipedia. Rhobite 23:07, Nov 29, 2004 (UTC)
 * Note that someone's posted to a (mostly dead) usenet group to try and skew the vote: for Neocheating and for Neo-Tech. Just a quick heads-up. Shimgray 19:55, 30 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep. VfD is not a Cleanup page. [[User:GRider|GRider\talk]] 23:52, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep - these guys have been around for ages. Notable in the field of cultist crackpots - David Gerard 10:15, 2 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep A legitimate and unique Neo-objectivism philosophy. (RJII) -- Note: This vote is from the author of the article.

 * Keep. Yes, it will probably be one more headache but that's a reason to care for it, not to delete it. Dr Zen 06:55, 30 Nov 2004 (UTC)

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like other '/delete' pages is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion or on the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.


text:
Population Connection

Population Connection (formerly Zero Population Growth or ZPG) is a non-profit Grassroots organization in the United States that believes population growth should be controlled. The organization was founded in 1968 by Paul R. Ehrlich, Richard Bowers, and Charles Remington in the wake of Ehrlich's best-selling book, The Population Bomb. The organization adopted its current name in 2002.

Issues and campaigns

 * Connections between population, health, and the environment, in the United States and around the world
 * U.S. foreign assistance funding for international family planning
 * U.S. funding for the domestic family planning program for low-income Americans, Title X
 * Ending U.S. policies that restrict access to family planning and reproductive health care, including abortion, domestically (e.g. Hyde Amendment) and internationally (e.g. Mexico City policy, Helms Amendment, restrictions on funding for UNFPA)
 * Comprehensive (as opposed to abstinence-only) sex education for American teens

Education
Population Connection's education program, known as Population Education or PopEd, develops K-12 curricula and conducts professional development workshops for teachers that focus on human population issues. Since 1975, the program has developed age-appropriate curricula to complement students’ science and social science instruction about human population trends and their impacts on natural resources, environmental quality, and human well-being. The program staff and their network of regional volunteers facilitate approximately 550 workshops each year for 11,000 teachers and future teachers throughout Northern America. PopEd lesson plans educate over three million American and Canadian students on population challenges each year. Population Education also hosts an international student video contest each year through their World of 7 Billion website.

Population Connection Magazine
Population Connection is Population Connection's quarterly publication. The magazine highlights the connections between overpopulation, the environment, poverty, and women's empowerment. It provides important population news, research, program developments, and legislative updates. Annual membership ($25) includes a one-year subscription to Population Connection magazine. All contributions, bequests, and gifts are fully tax-deductible in accordance with current laws.

title: Population Connection


text:
Alfred Gaby

Alfred Edward Gaby, VC (25 January 1892 – 11 August 1918) was an Australian recipient of the Victoria Cross, the highest award for gallantry in the face of the enemy that can be awarded to British and Commonwealth forces.

Born in Tasmania, Gaby worked as a farmer and then a labourer before enlisting in the Australian Imperial Force in 1916 and volunteering to serve overseas. Serving initially in the ranks, Gaby was quickly promoted, having previously served as a part-time soldier before the war, and was commissioned in 1917. He was one of 64 Australians to receive the award for their actions during the First World War, receiving it for his actions during an attack around Villers-Bretonneux in France during the Battle of Amiens that took place at the start of the Allied Hundred Days Offensive. He was killed three days later, at the age of 26, while leading another attack around Lihons.

Early life
Born in Springfield near Ringarooma, Tasmania, he was the seventh son of Alfred Gaby, a farmer, and his wife Adelaide, née Whiteway. While working on the family farm, he joined the militia and served for three years with the 12th Infantry Battalion (Launceston Regiment). Two of his brothers had served overseas during the Second Boer War.

Military service
Gaby was labouring in Katanning, Western Australia, when he enlisted in the Australian Imperial Force (AIF) in January 1916. He had been twice previously rejected for enlistment. He embarked from Fremantle on board HMAT A38 Ulysses in April 1916, and was assigned to the 28th Battalion – an infantry battalion that was formed mainly from Western Australian recruits, which was assigned to the 7th Brigade, 2nd Division – as part of the unit's tenth draft of reinforcements. Over the course of the next twelve months while in the frontline on the Western Front, he was promoted through the ranks at a rapid speed, reaching sergeant before being selected for officer training in the United Kingdom. He was commissioned as a second lieutenant in April 1917 and graduated from the course in May. Further promotion came in September when he made lieutenant. On 29 October, Gaby was gassed during the 28th Battalion's involvement in the Battle of Passchendaele.

Victoria Cross details
Gaby was 26 years old lieutenant when the following deed took place for which he was awarded the Victoria Cross (VC). On 8 August 1918, at the start of the Allied Hundred Days Offensive, Gaby was acting as commander of his battalion's 'D' Company, which was committed to an attack around Villers-Bretonneux, France, during the Battle of Amiens. When the advance was checked by a large German force about 40 yards beyond the wire, Gaby found a gap and approached the strong point under heavy machine-gun and rifle fire. He emptied his revolver into the garrison, drove the crews from their guns and captured 50 prisoners and four machine-guns. Three days later, on 11 August 1918 while leading his men during an attack at Lihons, he was killed.

His VC citation from the London Gazette of 30 October 1918 reads:

"For most conspicuous bravery and dash in attack, when on reaching a wire in front of an enemy trench, strong opposition was encountered. The advance was at once checked the enemy being in force about 40 yards beyond the wire, and commanding the gap with machine guns and rifles. Lieutenant Gaby found another gap in the wire, and, single handed, approached the strong point while machine guns and rifles were still being fired from it. Running along the parapet, still alone, and at point blank range, he emptied his revolver into the garrison, drove the crews from their guns, and compelled the surrender of 50 of the enemy with four machine guns. He then quickly reorganized his men, and led them on to his final objective, which he captured and consolidated. Three days later, during an attack, this officer again led his company with great dash to the objective. The enemy brought heavy rifle and machine gun fire to bear upon the line, but in the face of this heavy fire Lieutenant Gaby walked along his line of posts, encouraging his men to quickly consolidate. While engaged on this duty he was killed by an enemy sniper."

He is buried at the Heath Cemetery in Harbonnieres, France. He was unmarried at the time of his death. The Alfred Gaby ward at the former Repatriation General Hospital, Hollywood was named in his honour.

title: Alfred Gaby