text:
Tobruk (1967 film)

Tobruk is a 1967 American drama war film directed by Arthur Hiller and starring Rock Hudson and George Peppard. The film was written by Leo Gordon (who also acted in the film) and released through Universal Pictures.

Set in North Africa during the North African Campaign of World War II. It is a fictionalized story of members of the British Army's Long Range Desert Group (LRDG) and the Special Identification Group (SIG) that endeavour to destroy the fuel bunkers of Generalfeldmarschall Erwin Rommel's Panzer Army Africa in Tobruk. The film is loosely based on the British attacks on Italian and German forces at Tobruk codenamed "Operation Agreement". The film depicts the operation as being successful, even though actually Operation Agreement was a disastrous failure.

Plot
In September 1942, Rommel's Africa Korps is only 90 miles (144 km) from the Suez Canal, but running dangerously low on fuel. The British approve a plan to destroy German fuel bunkers at Tobruk in an attempt to cripple Rommel's attack.

The author of the plan, Canadian-born Major Donald Craig (Rock Hudson) of the Long Range Desert Group (LRDG) had been captured by Vichy French forces and is held prisoner, along with captured Italian Army soldiers, on a ship in the port of the French city of Algiers. As his expertise is considered essential to the success of the raid, Craig is rescued by Captain Kurt Bergman (George Peppard) of the Special Identification Group (SIG) and some of his men, German Jews serving with the British. They then join up with commandos of the Long Range Desert Group, under the command of Lieutenant-Colonel John Harker (Nigel Green), at Kufra in southeastern Libya.

Colonel Harker explains they have eight days to get to Tobruk and destroy the fuel depot and German fortress artillery pieces protecting the harbour, before a scheduled amphibious landing and a bombing raid on the city by the Royal Air Force (RAF). They are to drive there through enemy territory posing as prisoners of war escorted by the SIG pretending to be guards. Once they reach Tobruk they would then link up with a full British naval and RAF assault on the city and their primary objective, Rommel's underground fuel bunkers.

Craig is highly skeptical of the operation, claiming that "Staff has a genius for sitting on its brains and coming up with perfect hindsight", stating that "When I submitted the plan we could have blown up the fuel bunkers with a handful of men. How in hell are we supposed to get through their defenses now?" While warning Craig not to let personal differences of opinion interfere with the operation, Colonel Harker also reveals that he was the genius with perfect hindsight who convinced Staff to approve Craig's original plan which would now be "maximum effort, land, sea and air".

On the way, they encounter a patrol of Italian tanks, which stops a short distance from where they are resting in a gully. Later that night, Sergeant Major Jack Tyne (Jack Watson) spots a tank column approaching from the opposite direction. After Bergman and three of his men kill the Italian sentries, Colonel Harker, surmising that the approaching column "must be German -- the Italians are too fond of comfort to travel this late", tricks the two units into attacking each other by firing mortars, first at the Germans and then the Italians, enabling the raiders to sneak away.

To avoid detection the next day, Craig safely guides them through a German mine field, before they are attacked by a British Curtiss P-40 Warhawk fighter. They manage to shoot it down, but eight men are killed and one troop transport truck, their auxiliary fuel supply, and both of their radios are destroyed. The fighting attracts Tuareg tribesmen, who are friendly with the Germans. Craig, who speaks their language, exchanges some guns and ammunition for two prisoners.

The prisoners turn out to be British traitors Henry Portman (Liam Redmond), who has an Irish accent, and his daughter Cheryl (Heidy Hunt), who were shot down while flying from Benghazi to Cairo. They have papers signed by the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem (Mohammad Amin al-Husayni) and German Field Marshal Albert Kesselring: an agreement for "a group of important" Egyptian army officers to rise up against the British in a "holy war." The belief of the Germans is with Egypt conquered other Muslim, former Ottoman Empire states such as Turkey will then side with the Axis; Cheryl Portman states that the "Turks, alone, could put four million men into the war against the Soviet Union."

That night, the Portmans are told by a mysterious SIG member about the British masquerade and where to find a gun and a map to an underground telephone cable nearby where they can contact German command in Tobruk and alert them to the British column and upcoming attack. When they reach the telephone, however, they are spotted by an Italian patrol. Henry Portman fires at the patrol and is killed, while his daughter is seriously wounded.

Harker sends Bergman and Sergeant Krug (Leo Gordon) after the Portmans where they retrieve Cheryl from the Italians. When Krug asks how they knew about the telephone, Bergman replies, "Very simple. One among us is the enemy". Harker has Bergman and his men disarmed and then gives Bergman two hours to identify his traitor. The traitor kills Cheryl Portman so she cannot reveal his identity. Lieutenant Max Mohnfeld (Guy Stockwell), Bergman's second in command, appears from the tunnel the Portmans used to escape. He states the traitor is down the shaft. They find Corporal Bruckner (Robert Wolders), one of Bergman's closest friends for ten years, stabbed to death. Cheryl Portman had died from cyanide, and Bruckner's suicide tablet is missing. Bergman, however, is not convinced his friend was the traitor.

The group passes through checkpoints just outside Tobruk and after traveling through the city, they discover to their surprise that Rommel has amassed his total reserve strength at Tobruk undetected: two full panzer divisions. The discovery of Rommel's tanks puts the planned Naval assault in jeopardy, though without their radios the group have no way of warning Staff without taking the German transmitter located in the city which would alert the Germans.

The RAF then bomb Tobruk as scheduled. The LRDG blow up two of the harbour guns, and Harker orders Sergeant Major Tyne to signal the ships to abort the landing before the German tanks, which have pinned down Harker's troops, can "cut them to pieces". Harker also orders Lieutenant Boyden (Anthony Ashdown) to capture the German transmitter in the city in order to abort the landing and inform Staff of the Kesselring document. However, Boyden is killed during the bombing raid, as are Privates Alfie (Norman Rossington) and Dolan (Percy Herbert) when they discover millions in English pound notes the Germans had taken after capturing Tobruk from the British and attempt to steal the money (thereby making the German soldiers who kill them mistake them for looters and deserters). Meanwhile Mohnfeld, who volunteered to join them as Lt. Boyden did not speak German, is knocked out.

Bergman and three of his men escape on sidecar motorcycles and manage to destroy a tank and use flame throwers to buy Harker time; however, Bergman and his men are eventually killed. Meanwhile, Craig, Krug, and two other SIG men use the distraction to escape and seize a German tank well inland. After they use the tank to destroy the fuel depot, Harker and his men surrender.

Mohnfeld then appears where he reveals that he is really a German intelligence officer named von Kruger, explaining that he had told the truth the night before, only altering that "The Jew found me in the tunnel" and asks Harker for the Kesselring document. However, upon seeing the destruction of the fuel bunkers, Harker had burned the paper knowing its importance to the Germans. Harker then kills von Kruger with his pistol and is himself shot dead.

Craig, Krug and the two others manage to escape and exhausted after traveling over 70 miles on foot, make it to a scheduled back up rendezvous with a Royal Navy ship at Sallum just over the Egyptian border.

Cast
In order of appearance

 * Rock Hudson as Maj. Donald Craig
 * George Peppard as Capt. Bergman
 * Nigel Green as Col. Harker
 * Guy Stockwell as Lt. Mohnfeld
 * Jack Watson as Sgt. Maj. Tyne
 * Percy Herbert as Dolan
 * Norman Rossington as Alfie
 * Liam Redmond as Henry Portman
 * Heidy Hunt as Cheryl Portman
 * Leo Gordon as Sgt. Krug
 * Robert Wolders as Corporal Bruckner
 * Anthony Ashdown as Lt. Boyden
 * Curt Lowens as German Colonel
 * Rico Cattani as Col. Stuhler
 * Peter Coe as Tuareg Chieftain
 * Lawrence Montaigne as Italian Officer
 * Bob Hoy as British Corporal
 * Phil Adams as S.I.G. Bicker
 * Ronnie Rondall Jr. as S.I.G. Schell

Development
The film was based on an original script by Leo Gordon, who also worked as an actor. Gordon took the script to producer Gene Corman, who he had worked with several times before. Corman originally intended to make the film on a relatively low budget, around a million dollars, for United Artists – he had just made The Secret Invasion (1964) for that studio.

The scope of the film changed when Corman discovered Rock Hudson, then one of the biggest stars in the world, was about to leave his home studio of Universal because he was unhappy with the roles he had been playing (he had just signed to make Seconds at Paramount). Corman showed the script to Hudson who liked it, and he succeeded in getting the film financed at Universal, who wanted to keep Hudson within its fold. The film was a co production between Universal, Gibraltar Productions (Rock Hudson's company), and the Corman Co.

The film was known at one stage as The Cliffs at Mersa and The Cliffs. Hudson came on board in May 1965 (he would make it after Blindfold and Seconds) and Peppard was signed to co star with Hudson in July 1965, at a fee of $400,000.

Laurence Harvey was originally slated to play the role of Major Craig, while Dirk Bogarde was originally offered the role of Colonel Harker, but he declined.

Corman approached John Huston to direct who was interested. However, he wanted a fee of $500,000 and Universal was reluctant to use the director considering his recent films had been commercial failures. The job of directing eventually went to Arthur Hiller.

Corman budgeted the film at two-and-a-half million dollars. Universal felt it should be made for $5 million, but Corman was reluctant to make the movie for that much. His own fee was $200,000 while Gordon was paid $40,000 for his script. Corman wanted to shoot the film in North Africa with studio work done in England; however, Universal insisted it be shot in America as the studio was reluctant to film in Europe again after A Man Could Get Killed (also known as Welcome Mr. Beddoes) went over budget.

Gordon wrote himself a role as Sgt Tyne. Gordon normally played characters who died and wrote the script so Tyne did not die. Corman agreed to Gordon playing a role but only if the script was changed so Tyne died. Gordon instead decided to play the character of Krug, who lived.

Corman later commentated that Gordon "was a very witty, interesting conversationalist. His appearance probably worked to his disadvantage because to have him walk into a story conference was somewhat intimidating! I remember on Tobruk having director Arthur Hiller, who is a fey, gentle soul, taken aback when he met Leo – it took two or three story conferences before he could come to grips with that size and bulk."

Shooting
It was photographed in Technicolor using the Techniscope format, and shot in Almería, Spain and the Glamis Sand Dunes in the Imperial Valley, of southern California in the United States. The film had a budget of US$6 million.

Technical advice and assistance was provided by the 40th Armored Division ("Grizzly") of the California Army National Guard.

In the convoy heading to Tobruk the trucks used are actually M135 and M54, while the Sd.Kfz. 7's are American M3 halftracks with altered bodies. The tanks in the Italian column are in fact M48 Pattons.

Producer Gene Corman would again use Tobruk's Nazi occupation as the background in his 1990 parody film A Man Called Sarge, although this time set during the Second Battle of El Alamein, in late 1942.

Use of footage
The 1971 war film Raid on Rommel, directed by Henry Hathaway and starring Richard Burton, made extensive use of combat footage from Tobruk and also featured a very similar story-line about a British commando force infiltrating enemy lines and raiding the Afrika Korps supply bases.

Academy Awards
Albert Whitlock and Howard A. Anderson were nominated for the Academy Award for Best Visual Effects.

Home media
Universal first released this film on VHS on April 23, 1992 and again on May 15, 2002 in pan-and-scan format. It was released on DVD on June 12, 2012 as part of the made-on-demand Universal Vault Series. On January 21, 2020, Tobruk was released on Blu-ray by Kino International under its subsidiary "Kino Lorber Studio Classics" with licensing by Universal Pictures.

The R1 DVD release has no optional English subtitles and thus, the non-English dialogue in the film is not translated. The Blu-ray contains optional English subtitles with limited non-English ones during certain scenes and dialogue; the film's theatrical trailer is also included as a bonus feature (in pan-and-scan format).

There are also various Region 2 DVD and Region B Blu-ray releases.

Comics adaptation
Oliver Passingham adapted the film into a comic book version, published by the Lion Summer Spectacular.

title: Tobruk (1967 film)


text:
Talk:Order of magnitude/Archive 3

Example
12/09/06 - Changed th example given in the first paragraph into something more neutral.

Factor vs. Power
The first sentence of this entry is wrong. An order of magnitude is in no sense a factor of ten. In this context, the only way factor can be interpreted is as a synonym of divisor. For example, "2 and 3 are factors of 6" is correct, while "1000 is a factor of 10" is not, because no-one in their right mind would want to express 10 as 1000*(something).

I edited this entry previously to change "factor of ten" to "power of ten". I realize that I should have left a comment on this change, because it was later reverted (still incorrectly I must say). So unless there are substanciated objections, I would like to change "factor" to "power" again. If others feel that "powers of ten" is too precise, perhaps something more winded like "an order of magnitude is a range of numbers that differ from a power of 10 by a factor of order 1 (a single digit number)" would be better.

-- Igor

 * [Peak:] Whoever first wrote "factor" is correct. 6 has two prime factors, 2 and 3. 100 can be factored as 10*10, and one can therefore say that 100 has two factors of 10. It would be incorrect to say that 100 has two powers of 10.

Consider also the following from MSN Encarta:
 * If a quantity were 10 times greater than another, it would be an order of magnitude greater; if 100 times greater, it would be two orders of magnitude greater.

If you substitute "ten times" for "an order of magnitude", the meaning is unchanged. "Two orders of magnitude" means "two factors of 10", i.e. 10*10 as previously discussed.

In any case, by breaking up the preamble into separate sections about "OOM", "OOM of a number" and "OOM estimate", there is not much possibility of confusion. Peak 00:08, 28 Jan 2004 (UTC)

 * Then I suggest a slight modification to make this meaning more clear:
 * For example, two numbers are said to differ by "three orders of magnitude" if they differ by three factors of ten, that is one is approximately 1000 times larger than other. --Igor Jan 28 14:20:22 UTC 2004

Remove orders of magnitude?
Following the changes by User:Onebyone to Orders_of_magnitude_(length) and Orders of magnitude (mass) it looks like the series being removed. Is this intended? -- User:Docu

 * I'm not removing the series, and I don't intend to propose any files for deletion. However, the current situation is that large sections of some of the series (and indeed all of power before I modified it) would be a lot more usable on fewer pages. I'm in the process of modifying length, in which several of the subpages have quite a few entries on them, and it's a close call whether those should be separate lists. If the main articles become unwieldy, the more densely-populated parts can always be returned to subpages, but I strongly dislike cases where there are only 0-3 entries on a page. Onebyone 00:33, 26 Jan 2004 (UTC)

 * Then add more entries. But leave the stubs. --mav 06:39, 26 Jan 2004 (UTC)

 * It's difficult to name more than 3 things which are about the size of an atom, without just listing lots of different atoms. It wouldn't help people to get a better idea of how big atoms are if you did - I believe that's the purpose of these lists, rather than "list of all things mentioned on Wikipedia of size order an angstrom", or else they're woefully incomplete. If you can find so many atom-sized things that the length page becomes unusable as it is, you can easily move the list back to the subpage.
 * I guess what I'm saying is that these lists should have started on a single page each and migrated out. What they're actually doing is starting on a squillion empty pages and very slowly bulking up, and in the mean time they're a bit horrible. Onebyone 18:17, 26 Jan 2004 (UTC)

 * It would show the relative sizes of different atoms! This is very important in some areas, oh like chemistry. Wny not have summary/overview pages that have a whole bunch of different orders of mag on it (what you want) that only has a few notable items under each order of mag. Then have links to the individual orders of mag articles that will have a much longer listing (like every element that is in a certain order of mag). Those individual articles will in turn have back-links to the summary/overview articles. --mav

 * I agree with that principle. It is worthwhile having atomic radii in Wikipedia for comparison, certainly, but unless the purpose of these lists really is "list of all sizes mentioned on Wikipedia" (in which case I'll not touch them again, because I don't think that's worth doing), then I do not think that 1 E-10 m and 1 E-9 m are the right places for all 115 (and rising) elements. Maybe List of elements in order of atomic size would be appropriate? We could then link to that from the relevant OoM pages and from each element's page. Similarly, an article on a building will mention its height, but if there is to be a "list of the heights of every tall building in the world", then putting it in 1 E2 m would bury everything else in that list, thereby destroying its usefulness for anything except buildings. Onebyone 12:18, 27 Jan 2004 (UTC)

 * Where there are only 1-3 entries on a page, the sequence probably needs work and may be better on the main page, such as Orders_of_magnitude_(mass). I'm less sure about Orders of magnitude (length). An advantage of the series is that one finds comparable units easily. Something that is more difficulte, if the are all on the same page, or, grouped on another magnitude e.g. 1_E12_m%B3 (includes E14). Whatlinkshere can help expand the articles, but it doesn't work today. -- User:Docu

 * An advantage of the series is that one finds comparable units easily. What's difficult about a list in order of size? The advantage of having things on one page is that one finds somewhat bigger and smaller things at a glance, rather than following a link. Onebyone 18:17, 26 Jan 2004 (UTC)

 * Then have both. --mav

 * OK. Since there doesn't seem to be anyone arguing that the near-empty subarticles are vital, I'll restart doing some merging, but I'll keep in mind that the longer subarticles should be kept as they are. If there are cases where I've already merged when I shouldn't, just change things around. One important thing is to sort out the mess where (IIRC) Orders of magnitude (length) and 1 E2 m gave different heights for the Empire State Building. I assume that one includes a mast and the other doesn't, but it needs checking. Onebyone 12:18, 27 Jan 2004 (UTC)

 * I am arguing for both. Keep the stubs! I'm going to revert the redirections. --mav

 * Sorry, I misunderstood, by stubs I thought you meant those with a reasonable amount of content already. I think the compromise you've established is good. I'll still be taking a critical look at cases like 1 E13 m, 1 E14 m (1 entry each). Onebyone 21:29, 27 Jan 2004 (UTC)

OK, for length I've left the very small and very large as redirects but restored the other articles. In the future I will be less conservative in what I put in the individual OoM articles due to the fact that the summary pages exist. If somebody wants an overview, they should go there, if they want the detail they should go to an individual OoM page. I will continue to help maintain the individual entries, and others can work on the summary OoM articles. They can then concentrate on only having notable examples. Both are important and both should be kept. --mav

 * I strongly disagree that the individual subarticles should be kept. If people link to them, they can redirect to the relevant Oom page. The situation as it stands now is unacceptable because:
 * Contrary to what they claim, the individual pages do not facilitate comparison of different orders of magnitude because one has to flip between several different pages to make such a comparison.
 * Jumping "at random" between the pages is impossible because (to my knowledge) there's no central list of all the individual pages unnecessarily difficult (and would be rendered pointless by the existence of the full list at the main Oom page, anyway) . (This could be changed using categories, but I'm not recommending that.)
 * It encourages duplication of effort (in keeping the same information at two different locations).
 * As I see it, there's only one legitimate reason to have multiple pages for information like this, and that's if the main page gets too long. But as already discussed, this can be done later as needed. See also my other comment below. - dcljr 09:22, 29 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I changed my comment above because there is, of course, a central list since one appears in this very article! However, the individual Oom pages are inconsistent in linking to the subpages: see, for example, Orders of magnitude (mass) and Orders of magnitude (power). - dcljr 09:45, 29 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Page title and article text
See discussion at 1 E9 m². -- User:Docu

WikiProject Orders of Magnitude
To update this project the current pratices, we could move the templates to a new page WikiProject Orders of Magnitude. The templates may be easier to find where there are now. -- User:Docu

Moved discussion from Talk:1 E5 m*

 * * May I suggest adding a line to the top of all "chain page" talk pages referring to this page for the general discussions? --J.Rohrer 22:17, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)

This page (and I guess the related ones as well) is wrongly named: "1 E5 m" means "15 m", which of course equals "1 m", and not the intended "100 km". The name should be "10 E5 m" = "105 m". Besides, it is clearer to not separate the notation of the exponent from the number it affects, thus "10E5 m" or "10e5 m" rather than "10 E5 m"; another option is to use a caret: "10^5 m". OTOH, I think that for numbers up to a million or a billion, writing them out in full would be the clearest: "100,000 m", or even better "100 km". Using the exponential notation makes full sense when dealing with really huge zillions with dozens of zeroes; but when dealing with numbers in the commonly used range, that notation is counterintuitive because numbers like 100 or 10,000 aren't commonly spelled 10E2 or 10E4 beyond some scientific writings, and so "10E2 m" or "10E4 m" look arcane to most people, while "100 m" and "10 km" are instantly understandable for everyone (and what most people would naturally query in the Wikipedia search). Uaxuctum 13:55, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)

 * While your interpretation of the "E" as an equivalent of "to the power of" (or the caret sign ^) is suggestive, this is not common terminology. Instead, the notation "E..." is to be read as "times 10 to the ...-th", see for example scientific notation, or the syntax of floating point literals in most programming languages.
 * The reason for the rather cryptical naming of these articles is (as far as I understand) ease of linking: the articles seem to be intended to be linked from, ideally, every occurence of a quantity of the given order of magnitude to assist in "getting a feeling" for it, especially for those not familiar with the unit system (being more accustomed to anglo-saxon measures, for example). As all these articles use a consistent naming scheme now, you do not have to remember any individual article names to implement this. You may consider creating appropriate redirects, however. --J.Rohrer 20:22, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)

 * It's not "an interpretation of mine". Do a Google search for "10E5" and you'll get scores of technical and university pages where "10E5" stands clearly for "105" - which is not suggestive of it not being common terminology. Using "1 E5" to mean "105" is an idiosyncratic, not an intuitive choice, leading to confusion of interpretation and hindering the representation of other powers, because if E means "times 10 to the power of", how on earth does one represent "205", "15", "25", etc.?
 * The notation is not intended for this, but for representation of floating point numbers in a fixed-base numeral system (usually base 10, of course), so, for instance, 205 would be 32 E5. For general powers, one would use another notation, for example using the caret.
 * The immense majority of people are not naturally going to search for "1 E5" (nor link to "1 E5") when they mean "100,000". So, even if one chooses to name all the articles with a consistent but idiosyncratic, cryptic and confusing terminology, one isn't helping to make the Wikipedia any user-friendly. Names of articles should not be cryptic, but clear and free from possible confusions of interpretation. The E method is by all parameters not the appropriate one. The two options that do not lead to confusion are the caret method ("10^5 m") and the more user-friendly "100,000 m" (or even clearer "100 km"). Uaxuctum 17:21, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * Who would search for such an article at all? You will usually come to these order-of-magnitude articles by following wikilinks, so one may argue that, from the readers' point of view, the naming is secondary. Personally, I do not particularly like the "E" notation, so I do not intend to defend the naming scheme any further, but in my opinion it is certainly not wrong and probably not even particularly misleading.
 * Whatever, if you wish to continue this discussion I suggest moving it on the parent article talk page. I will copy the above text there. Notice however that the topic seems to have been discussed before, see archive. --J.Rohrer 22:13, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * The archive mentioned above is currently at Talk:Order of magnitude/chain page names. -- Paddu 19:47, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Meanings other than "power of 10"?
The definitions given for "order of magnitude" on this page all relate to powers of 10. Which is fine, given that is what people often mean when they use the phrase, and this page is certainly useful.

However, I can think of one refinement and one addition that might be useful. It's my understanding that "order of magnitude" is dependent on the base in which one is counting. It means "raising the exponent by one" on whatever the base exponent is. For example, in base 2, one order of magnitude is one power of 2. So, 1000 binary (8) and 0010 binary (2) differ by 2 orders of magnitude. The "power of 10" definition is so often used because we (or most of us, anyway) count in base 10. But there is nothing inherently significant about powers of 10 in either mathematics or science. It's just notation. For a more general use of "order of magnitude", see here. I can't think of an easy way to work this into the current page, and given all the careful work done here, I don't want to mess things up!

My other point is that "order of magnitude" is sometimes used in mathematics to mean "asymptotic to". For a ref, see this link. Again, I don't want to screw things up, but I think this could be added as a disambiguation note at the end of the article. I don't think this usage is common, but it might be useful to include it. Gwimpey 05:50, Oct 21, 2004 (UTC)

factor thing
It is confusing. the factor thing. and it does not reflect the real feeling of the phrase. I tried to make it easier to understand and closer to the real easthetical feel. I see there had been some discussion on it. Please see that if some people here are saying it is confusing, there must be much more users out there who also find it confusing. I guess people will revert it because they seem to have been working on it for a long time, but please make it easier to understand even after that.

Order of magnitude table
The following table contains no useful information. -- 18:14, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Orders of magnitude of various quantities
In the following table the different quantities are lined up so that the following are in the same row:

 * length and the approximate time taken by light to cross that length
 * area of a square and the length of one side
 * volume of a cube and the area of one face
 * mass of some water and its volume at 4 degrees Celsius or 277.16 K

See also the separate tables for time, length, area, volume, mass, energy, power, temperature and dimensionless numbers.

* Each time shown is linked to that time. However, the time taken for light to cross the corresponding length is 3 times the time shown.

** These are the standard units but this table uses a variety of units, which can make it harder to read.

Units used in the table
The table uses units and prefixes that are commonly recognized:
 * Time:
 * femtosecond (fs)
 * nanosecond (ns)
 * microsecond (μs)
 * millisecond (ms)
 * second (s)
 * hour (h)
 * day (d)
 * year (yr)
 * Length:
 * attometre (am)
 * femtometre (fm)
 * picometre (pm)
 * nanometre (nm)
 * micrometre (µm)
 * millimetre (mm)
 * centimetre (cm)
 * metre (m)
 * kilometre (km)
 * astronomical unit (AU)
 * light year (LY)
 * Area:
 * square metre (m2)
 * hectare (ha)
 * square kilometre (km2)
 * Mass:
 * gram (g)
 * kilogram (kg)
 * tonne (t)
 * Volume:
 * millilitre (ml)
 * litre (l)
 * cubic metre (m3)
 * Energy:
 * millielectronvolt (meV),
 * electronvolt (eV)
 * megaelectronvolt (MeV)
 * gigaelectronvolt (GeV)
 * teraelectronvolt (TeV)
 * erg
 * joule (J)
 * kilowatthour kWh
 * megawatthour MWh
 * gigawatthour GWh
 * Temperature:
 * nanokelvin (nK)
 * microkelvin (µK)
 * millikelvin (mK)
 * kelvin (K)

Large numbers
This section has no practical value and seems unrelated to real-world orders of magnitude. -- 19:25, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * I agree. Let's keep discuss of extremely large numbers on Large numbers, and keep this entry about "order of magnitude". 24.63.232.5 15:20, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

Extremely large numbers
For extremely large numbers, a generalized order of magnitude can be based on their double logarithm or super-logarithm. Rounding these downward to an integer gives categories between very "round numbers", rounding them to the nearest integer and applying the inverse function gives the "nearest" round number.

The double logarithm yields the categories:
 * ..., 1.0023-1.023, 1.023-1.26, 1.26-10, 10-1010, 1010-10100, 10100-101000, ...

The super logarithm yields the categories:
 * $$0-1, 1-10, 10-10^{10}, 10^{10}-10^{10^{10}}, 10^{10^{10}}-10^{10^{10^{10}}}, \dots$$

For numbers close to zero, neither method is suitable directly, but the order of magnitude may be generalized to reciprocals.

Similar to the logarithmic scale one can have a double logarithmic and super-logarithmic scale. Generally, a point midway between two points corresponds to the generalised f-mean with f(x) the corresponding function log log x or slog x. In the case of log log x, this mean of two numbers (e.g. 2 and 16 giving 4) does not depend on the base of the logarithm, just like in the case of log x (geometric mean, 2 and 8 giving 4), but unlike in the case of log log log x (4 and 65536 giving 16 if the base is 2, but different otherwise).

Double logarithmic scale
The scale s of the pure double logarithm would have been $$\log_{10} \log_{10} {x} $$ as

x > 10: $$s = \log_{10} \log_{10} x$$ corresponding to $$x = 10^{10^{s}}$$,

but the negative outputs in input range 1 < x < 10 do not have a useful meaning, so we require that x > 10. Furthermore the input minimum is unfortunately only 1, not 0 as needed, so another kind of double-logarithmic scale is added to be used when x < 0.1.

x < 0.1: $$s = -\log_{10} (- \log_{10} x)$$ corresponding to $$x = 10^{-10^{-s}}$$

These two functions give the value s = 0 when x = 10 and x = 0.1. Because of this a third function is needed that sets s to 0 when the range is 0.1 < x < 10. If it is not desired to collapse this range to a single point, another double-logarithmic scale with offset could be defined by dividing the first function with 10 and multiplying the second with 10. Then both function correspond to the same x = 1 for s = 0.

x > 1: $$s = \log_{10} (1 + \log_{10} x)$$ corresponding to $$x = 10^{-1+10^{s}}$$

x < 1: $$s = -\log_{10} (1 - \log_{10} x)$$ corresponding to $$x = 10^{ 1 - 10^{-s} }$$

This introduces an error which is clearly visible for inputs smaller than 1010 and might make the double-logarithmic scale with offset harder to read.

Najro 20:21, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Order of magnitude/Archive 3


text:
User talk:Gunter

Page Blanking
On 30-June, you blanked Baron Ricasoli. Blanking pages is generally considered a bad idea. I've reverted it to the previous version. If you believe a redirect should be deleted, please follow the redirect portion of the deletion procedures. If you believe an article should be written instead of the redirect, please write a stub. However, the rationale provided in your edit summary (this is a company unrelated to the statesman) is incorrect. The company name is actually Barone Ricasoli (notice the e). If you have questions, please let me know. Thanks! -- JLaTondre 16:04, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

I apologize, thank you for the correction Gunter 22:32, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

List of oldest companies
I am confused by some of your contributions to List of oldest companies. For example, on the latest diff you added 3 breweries from the Czech Republic. Can't only one of them, by definition, be the oldest? -- RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib Reverts 12:32, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
 * The list is of any company founded before (in the current revision) 1852. Gunter 17:30, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
 * OK. Hope you like what I started this morning. I will try to finish up tonite, it is a few simple regex's just was already over two hours late to work this morning... ;) — RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib Reverts 20:11, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes thanks! i've wanted to start that for a long time, but never got around to it. This morning i started a couple...and now wham, you got a hold of it :) Gunter 22:09, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Maybe do the years as well? Gunter 00:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Nah, I think that is overkill. Having multiple links to the same things are already kinda against WP:MOS. I might get to the other stuff later tonite. — RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib Reverts 00:32, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
 * OK, I've now asked for help on the main talk page. Please help. ;) — RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib Reverts 02:52, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm done. — RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib 16:45, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Excellent! Gunter 22:10, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Why did you change the Gunsmith links to Firearm? Beretta, et al. make guns, which, by definition, makes them gunsmiths. — RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib 13:33, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

A Gunsmith definition could be used for all the small English makers which really handmake their products. But companies that mass produce like Colt, Reminginton, Beretta are better placed under Firearms. Gunter 13:38, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Gunter, would you mind explaining where you got some of your dates from? Specifically there has been a dispute over the year of formation of the rolling paper company Bambu.  Several of us did a lot of research and found several verifiable references that the formation year was 1907.   These references included the University of Barcelona, a historical book and Spanish trademarks.  The company Bambu has been relying on your list as t's own citation and hasn't provided any actual reference as of yet.  Could you confirm where you got the year from?  Was it from seeing the year on their webpage or perhaps earlier text on the Bambu rolling papers page?  Sorry for the hassle but I am trying to resolve a dispute (if you're in the mood to read a lot see Talk:Bambu rolling papers ) so any input you could give would be great! (ps, the Bambu promoters are stalking so you might get a long arduous post below from one of them - regardless please do answer my query and thank you for your patience.)Nahome (talk) 01:29, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

Warka, Tyskie
Tyskie is a brand, not a company, and the name comes from Tychy, where the brewery is located. Similarly, Warka is a brand and also a name of the town the brewery is located. So why exactly did you edit them? --P.B. 14:29, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

My understanding is the brand "Tyskie" is old. Whereas the brewery/company has changed ownership and name since inception and merely taken over the brand name, is this not correct? Gunter 16:33, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

 * Well yeah, the Tychy Brewery is now a part of Kompania Piwowarska, but the brand of course remains. But isn't that a list of oldest companies? If you prefer it this way, you may list brands as well, I don't mind. But in this case at least fix Warka link to point to another article, rather than the one about a town. --P.B. 16:38, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

In the intro paragraph i stated that it is a list of companies & brands. I will fix the Warka link. Thanks Gunter 18:29, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

SpinyNorman
Have your say about him here. his 3RR violation on the bottom. Add your say. Amoruso 11:17, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

He should be banned, he is continually disrupting wikipedia pages, his own talk page is full of people complaining about his 3RR and other bad behaviour. In my case, the "List of the world's fastest cars by acceleration", besides 3RR, he continually removed entries without talk page discussion. Of the few items that are discussed he make statements ridiculing vendors and stating his own POV as an authority, whereas all he shows is an arrogant ignorance of the subject. Gunter 18:33, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Although we don't entirely agree, could I suggest you comment at SpinyNorman's RfA. Extra opinions are always welcome and will aid the arbitration process. Thanks, Addhoc 17:41, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Hi. SpinyNorman is now under investigation from the ArbCom (See [|here]) for his constant edits on other car-related pages and his refusal to compromise. I suggest tying in this case with that one (to be presented on the Evidence page there) so that any ArbCom judgment on SpinyNorman can be effected on all car-related pages. Jsw663 12:03, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Gunter, I moved your statement to the evidence page. Your statement will be more useful to the Arb comm if you make an argument and use diffs which support your assertion; for example, your first assertion might be "So-and-so engages in edit warring", which should be the title of this section. Here you would show specific edits to specific articles which show So-and-so engaging in edit warring. FloNight 14:32, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Dr. Strangelove
I'm sure but that is original research and is too much trvia that is unnotable. It is also unwikified (but I would remove it either way). Cbrown1023 20:39, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

A transcription from a film is not original research. Too much trivia is just your POV. If you don't like the format, ask for it to be cleaned up. Don't remove other people edits without discussion. Gunter 20:44, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
 * What do you call this? And make sure you understand that policies apply both ways. Cbrown1023 20:46, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Um... you have not read the WP:OR, technically, a transcription from film is original research because you are originally researching it yourself. Please also read WP:TRIVIA and WP:NOT before you dispute them. 20:57, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Dalek
The amount of detail is not needed for a general understanding of Genesis of the Daleks - the essential points are that Davros experimented on the Kaled mutants to create the Daleks; there's no need to specify the travel machines as "Mark III"s - that's in the Genesis of the Daleks article. Also, the reason there's a "Main article: History of the Daleks" tag there is because there's more detail in that sub article for those who want that detail, and the stuff about experimentation, et al. is all there. It's not necessary to place every single thing about it within the main article because the sub article covers it. If you read History of the Daleks, you'll see all the information you placed there, in the correct context. --khaosworks (talk • contribs) 16:28, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

I apologize, i didn't not see the sub article Gunter 17:15, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Unspecified source for Image:12 18 2004 3 10 PM 0001.jpg
Thanks for uploading Image:12 18 2004 3 10 PM 0001.jpg. I notice the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this file yourself, then there needs to be a justification explaining why we have the right to use it on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you did not create the file yourself, then you need to specify where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.

If the file also doesn't have a copyright tag, then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the GFDL-self tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media meets the criteria at Fair use, use a tag such as or one of the other tags listed at Image copyright tags. See Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following [ this link]. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If the image is copyrighted under a non-free license (per Fair use) then the image will be deleted 48 hours after 02:38, 8 January 2007 (UTC). If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Nv8200p talk 02:38, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Can we add the Warner Company?
Can we add the Warner Company to the list of oldest companies? Waste Management has 1,674 subsidiaries. They will not be listed on its website. However, another website contains the list and it does include the Warner Company. See www.corporations.org/wmi/subs.html. For verification of the 1794 date please see chapter 34 of the History of Delaware (you will need to scroll down). It is at www.accessible.com/amcnty/DE/Delaware/delaware34.htm. The company is located in Morrisville, Pennsylvania. The website www.pennsburymanor.org/Guide.html explains how the Warner Company (located next door) gave the land where William Penn’s house once stood. The company was operated by the Warners from 1794-1960. It was on the New York Stock Exchange (WAR) from 1959-1977 where it was bought off by Robert A. Fox in 1960. See www.rafind.com/Key%20Management.htm. In 1978 Warburg Pincus purchased the Warner Company. Then, in 1981, Waste Management purchased the Warner Company and ran all of its plants. Each of the plants eventually closed except for the one in Morrisville, Pennsylvania. It was sold to Thomas Lafferty in 1985 who sold it back to Waste Management in 1990. They still own it as a wholly owned subsidiary to this day and it still bears the name “Warner Company”. (Notably, the company you list as the oldest company in the world, Kongō Gumi, is also a wholly owned subsidiary.) For further verification feel free to call the Warner Company at 215-295-7193 or write to them at 600 Tyburn Road, Morrisville, PA, 19067. A book was once written on the Warner Company called “Of Gold, Ships, and Sand.” The Warner Company (my family’s company) is 213 years old this year. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.82.21.86 (talk) 03:52, 8 February 2007 (UTC).

ok :) Gunter 11:58, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! :) - Rob

List of oldest companies
Do you want this AWB stuff for anything? — RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib 22:29, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Was that the script your wrote to change all the Fields? I thought that was very useful. I don't know how to use it, are you giving up on keeping the fields unified :) Gunter 22:39, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

 * Yes it is the XML for WP:AWB. I don't plan on working it, I was gonna have it erased for me. — RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib 02:42, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

Image:AlexR.jpg
Hello, the statement "Since this company is no longer in business the copyright on the photo has lapsed." is not valid. If you have any questions feel free to ask them here or at WP:MCQ. If you know the license of the image please update it at the image page. Do not revert my edit unless you do add a license however. This is required by the image use policy. Thanks. - cohesion 23:12, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

 * Ok, just so you know, you still have to provide a fair use rationale or the image will be deletd. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 16:27, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

October 2007
Hello. Please don't forget to provide an edit summary. MBK004 23:45, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Germany Invitation
--Zeitgespenst (talk) 17:57, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

List of oldest companies
(→1300 to 1399: Gaffel was founded 1908 by the family Becker and never changed name or hand. Please ask the company Gaffel or the Family Becker or look up the old Adressbooks in Cologne. Your statement is not correct:The brewery was founded 1302 and has changed names/hand numerous times. Farina-Archiv (talk) 16:04, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Gaffel's own web site states the brewery has existed since 1302, the ownership has just changed hands.Gunter (talk) 11:39, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

http://www.gaffel.de/index.php?nc=2 Die Geburtsstunde der Marke Gaffel Am 24. Mai 1908 war die kurze, wechselvolle und zugleich unruhige Zeit der Brauerei beendet. Denn zu jener Zeit übernahmen die Gebrüder Becker die Brauerei. Sie hatten klare Vorstellungen, bauten das Haus im Stile eines alten Zunfthauses... 87.79.66.147 (talk) 15:46, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

So Proudly We Hail!
I agree with your edit, removing the POV statement about the film being "effective propaganda." However, your edit summary "removing arrogance/ignorance" disregards WP's guidelines for both good faith and civility. A wrong or POV edit is not arrogant or ignorant just because you don't agree with it, and there seems to be no reason to denigrate the previous editor. Let's keep things on a high level, okay? Monkeyzpop (talk) 00:20, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Gift economy
An editor over at Gift economy has reinsreted what I think are dubious examples of "gift economy." To my mind, they are not examples of an economic system, but rather gifts or altruism; every gift or altruisitc act is not an example of a "gift economy." Anyway, I see you have removed irrelevent text from that article in the past. Feel free to weigh-in. Novaseminary (talk) 15:11, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Bambu
Hello Gunter. I see that you stated a few years ago that a company is "as old as it's oldest business entity. Changing the name after a merger does not affect the founding date" Can you explain how this pertains to Bambu which is on the list, and c2learly traces its origins back to 1764...Thanks again.. Best —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.175.21.67 (talk) 14:19, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

I have been checking in and seeing a User (talk) attacking this brands est. date while there seems to be others like me trying to not have this rouge users do this unfounded. After reading all of this bickering, I have looked back to see that Bambu was one of the very first companies place in this article, added by you on 15:40, 18 January 2006. If you look at this users history- He/She is only interested in cigarette or marijuana related posts making it seem like she works in there industry. As well, there is an abnormally high history of this user making strictly negative posts on the Bambu Page. I even see the user placing very favorable posts for other cigarette paper brands, along with false establishment dates such as for the brand Pay Pay. There is another user (talk) who is fighting it, however all I keep seeing is each other claiming "you work for the company" or "you work for a competitor brand." Or "the business added itself to this list." After reading that, I looked through the history to find you. There is plenty of info on these two- and others- Including on editors talk pages, for they have "frozen" the worlds oldest company page, Bambu, and others I think.... As I am not a supper active Wikipedier and do not have an account, I thought I would bring it to your attention since it seems like there are other Wiki-people going after a page you created and a company you researched and placed on there.. I will check back in here later. Thanks for your time in advanced.-- Lawrence
 * Oh geez, looks like another Bambu Promoter Sockpuppet (this time using their Blackberry account). This has all been discussed on Talk:Bambu rolling papers, let's keep your conversation about Bambu's date of formation and how I'm a bad bad person in one place, Please talk here: Talk:Bambu rolling papers,   See you there and thanks!  Nahome (talk) 16:11, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

Just to update you on what has perspired since this post Gunter- User NAHOME has been banned from Wikipedia after having being revealed as a competitor to Bambu in the tobacco industry. They tried to do whatever the could to attack the establishment date, product, various aspects of history and so on. As well as pretending to be a woman when actually a man. Sounds ridiculous, I know. Im am speaking with editor SlimVirgin right now to have the removal of Bambu from worlds oldest companies list reverted.. Something you placed on there, even though it was taken down by the slanderers. All the best. Arnaud..--ArnaudMS (talk) 20:33, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Drum memory and G. Taushek
With reference to this edit, can you provide a source and explain a little better what Taushek actually invented and how it worked? Robert K S (talk) 21:46, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Adding Campbell Hausfeld
Gunter,

Can you add our company?

Campbell Hausfeld http://chpower.com/ 1836 United States

Not sure of category, perhaps tools or powered equipment.

See our history page for more info on the history:

http://www.chpower.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/XAboutCH?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10001

E-mail if you have any questions.

Thanks for your help

dsanchez@campbellhausfeld.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.40.152.102 (talk) 20:29, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

RE: Your edits
I disagree entirely, but cannot be bothered to argue - the article needs lots of work (as per the talk page - the place that civil editors go to discuss differences of opinion) and while you're turning it into a collection of external links, the article was shit beforehand, so never mind ay! I will leave you to it, enjoy,  Nik the  stoned  09:20, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for August 20
Hi. When you recently edited List of oldest companies, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Hampton Ferry (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ* Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 11:57, 20 August 2012 (UTC)

August 2012
In this edit you accuse me of being a vandal, when I added sources. That is not only patently absurd, it is a personal attack, which is against Wikipedia policy. I have no patience for insults, the next insult from you will be brought to administrator attention. Please not that if you continue to violate Wikipedia policies you may get blocked or even banned, so it is in your interest to follow policies. --OpenFuture (talk) 15:21, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

You added no source, and no value to the page, you are simply disruptive, i suggest you report yourself to an administrator and stop wasting my time and effort. Gunter (talk) 15:40, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Hello. There is currently a discussion at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. --OpenFuture (talk) 15:51, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Gunter - please take this as a final warning. If you continue to remove reliable sources from any article - including the List of oldest companies - then that will be viewed as disruption and dealt with accordingly. Please read WP:RS, WP:V and WP:OWN for more information. This matter should be discussed further on the article talk page. GiantSnowman 16:12, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

No reliable sources were removed, if anything adding these are disruptions of the webpage. Referring me to WP:OWN is absurd, if you would monitor this page you would see without someone taking interest is this article it is vulnerable to butchering and castration of information. Where were you when that happened? Gunter (talk) 16:20, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Gunter, what Giantsnowman said is 100% correct in every possible way. This list is not an exception to general policy here.  Dennis Brown -  2¢    ©   Join WER 16:25, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Gunter - your edits are not useful, there is zero support for them and a helluva lot of opposition. Please taken on board what we are saying. GiantSnowman 16:38, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

You edits are simply bullying and intimidation. I have spent 6 years putting this list togther, and out of nowhere people like you come along.... Fine i will leave the source column since you value it so much and just making my work more difficult. Gunter (talk) 16:43, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Gunter, please read some of our policies. We prefer secondary sources to company websites. -- SPhilbrick (Talk)  16:46, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Nobody has bullied or intimidated you. You have spent 6 years on the article? Great, thanks for your hard work - but you do not own the article and other editors are free to make changes as they see fit, and as governed by consensus, as these changes are. GiantSnowman 16:47, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * To claim that the *addition* of reliable sources to an article is vandalism is really remarkable. I hope you do not intend to continue with this plan. EdJohnston (talk) 16:58, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I concur that no "bullying" or "intimidation" has taken place. Gunter, with every edit you make, you renew your agreement to Wikipedia's Terms of Use, which includes editing under the policies and guidelines set by Wikipedia.  WP:V is one of the core content policies of this encyclopedia.  It applies to you as well to every other editor, and applies to this article as well as to every other article, and you cannot unilaterally declare that it does not apply to articles you edit.  This is not "your" list.  It is Wikipedia's list, and any Wikipedia editor may likewise - with as much right as you - seek to edit it, to add reliable sources, to remove invalid sources, and to remove unsourceable content.  If you can operate within Wikipedia's rules - as you agreed to do when you joined this site, and agree to do with every edit you make - then your further contributions are welcome.   Ravenswing   21:24, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

And yet again with the "Vandalism" claims. . Stop calling other people trying to improve the article "vandalism". OK? It's not vandalism. --OpenFuture (talk) 21:53, 23 August 2012 (UTC) No, sorry, my bad, that was an EARLIER case, from the 6th of August. --OpenFuture (talk) 21:58, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Doesn't matter, they did it again. Drmies (talk) 00:19, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Final Warning
Perhaps I haven't made myself clear, so I will rectify the situation. The way you are going about editing List of oldest companies is disruptive. Calling good faith edits that are based on the information from an ANI and the talk page of the article, "Vandalism"  is disruptive. You are at the end of your disruptive rope. If you continue, you will be blocked. Use the article talk page. This is absolutely your last warning. Dennis Brown - 2¢    ©   Join WER 01:07, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

You are asking to be reported for abusing admin privileges. If you think removing valuable data from a long standing article after a couple of hours biased chit chat between friends on the talk page are valid good faith edits, you need to start doing some serious rethinking of what possible purpose you even serve on wikipedia. Considering that i wrote the majority of the article and all you and your buddies have done is try to trash it, saying that i am disruptive is quite ignorant. Gunter (talk) 01:13, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Gunter, you've ignored warnings on the article talk page, in WP:ANI, and here. You're repeatedly accused other users, whose contributions are positive, of vandalism, despite being explicitly told not to. You've edit-warred extensively on List of oldest companies. You've misused the long-term alternate account user:RebeccaH to continue edit warring. You've shown no interest in abiding by Wikipedia's mandatory policy on reliable sources, in favour of your own opinion. So I've blocked you from editing, to protect Wikipedia from you. Before you can be allowed to edit again, you need to demonstrate clearly and unambiguously that you understand wikipedia's policies on reliable sources, on dispute resolution, and on treating others civilly and with respect. Your repeated hostile responses today show you're very far from that understanding. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 01:26, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

 * Gunter, you do not own the article. You also need to stop making personal attacks and to stop refusing to listen. Edits that follow policy are not vandalism. Reverting them and calling them vandalism is. You need to understand all this before you even think about requesting unblocking. - The Bushranger One ping only 01:34, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Socking
CU confirms that User:Gunter and User:RebeccaH are socks. --Elen of the Roads (talk) 17:03, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

title: User talk:Gunter


text:
File talk:Usbkey internals.jpg

Note about the use of template for the text here
I've been a bit unconventional about using Template:Keydrive internals to store the descriptive text for this image, but I think I have good reason. There needs to be a caption, plainly, on the article in which this image is used (otherwise the numbers on the diagram are just annoying). But the caption needs to be on the image page too, as that's what someone will see when they click on the image, and they should be able to figure out what the numbered bits and bobs are without having to flip back and forward been the big image page and the page in which the image is displayed (as a thumbnail). To make this easy, and to ensure there's no divergence, I used a template as a caption. Naturally the template needs to contain text that makes sense both in the actual wikipedia page and also on the image page (so that's why the title isn't in the template, and why the image licencing info isn't either). -- John Fader
 * I see your point about using the template for layout. It's not that appropriate for a caption, however, on the Keydrive page.  It's too long.  Would you be interested in making something like an info-box you see for presidents and airplanes for the numbered items, and integrating the other information into the main article?  I think that would lead to a clearer, more understandable article rather than two semi-articles side-by-side.  --ABQCat 23:47, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Can they do chin-ups too?
What does it mean that the resistors serve as pull-ups? Does it have anything to do with pull-up and pull-down transistors? — Brim 08:23, Feb 5, 2005 (UTC)

 * It means they are pull-up resistors. A pull up resistor means that the value of the pin is logic-high unless a current is actively asserted on that pin.  Without a load (either active circuitry or pull-up or pull-down resistors) the voltage on a pin will float freely, and the logic value will change spontaneously.  Pull up resistors are typically pretty high values (1000 ohms or more) so it won't be very difficult for an ordinary active signal to overcome the drain they represent.  It's really not related to a pull-up transistor. -- John Fader 18:04, 5 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your reply. I wasn't able to find anything about pull-up resistors or pull-up anything in Wikipedia, that's why I asked.  Would you be able to write a small section under resistor (or another appropriate article) about this topic? — Brim 00:00, Feb 6, 2005 (UTC)
 * Yes, you raise an excellent point. My reasons for adding this (rather excessive, perhaps) exploration of the components on the keydrive was to serve as an introduction to numerous digital electronics topics.  It doesn't make much sense when important topics, like pull-ups, don't have articles. I'll add writing something about pull-ups and downs to my to-do list. -- John Fader 17:33, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I think that will be a great contribution to Wikipedia.  I'll be looking forward to your article. — Brim 04:28, Feb 17, 2005 (UTC)
 * I also wondered what a pull-up was, and there has been a pull-up resistor article writen since the above comments, so I've linked to it within the caption. —Pengo 23:46, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

title: File talk:Usbkey internals.jpg


text:
Tomb of the Unknown Soldier (Romania)

The Tomb of the Unknown Soldier (Mormântul Soldatului Necunoscut) is a monument located in Bucharest, Romania. Dedicated to the soldiers who died while fighting for Romania. It is one of many such national tombs.

It was built in 1923 to commemorate the Romanians who died during World War I.

History
In 1923 it was decided to choose one of the fallen soldiers to represent all who had sacrificed their lives during the war.

The order no. 567/1 May 1923 of the Ministry of War ruled that a war orphan in the 1st grade of a military school would choose the coffin of the Unknown Soldier. The military schools in Iași, Craiova, Chișinău and Dealu Monastery submitted the names of their best students who met the respective criteria. Out of the four candidates the war orphan Amilcar Săndulescu, a 12-year student at the Dimitrie Sturdza Military High School in Craiova (nowadays "Tudor Vladimirescu" Military College), whose father died on the front in 1917, was selected.

Ten unidentified soldiers who died at Mărășești, Mărăști, Oituz, Târgu Ocna, Jiu, Prahova, Bucharest, in Dobruja, Transylvania and Bessarabia were exhumed and laid in oak coffins, doubled with zinc, inside the "Assumption of Mary" Church in Mărășești.

On May 14, 1923, during the solemn ceremony organized at Mărășești, Amilcar Săndulescu knelt in front of the fourth coffin and said: "This is my father". After the Unknown Soldier had been chosen, the other nine coffins were buried with military honors in the Heroes' Cemetery in Mărășești.

On May 15, 1923, the Unknown Soldier's coffin, wrapped in a Romanian Tricolor, was placed on board of a special train to Bucharest, where it was waited for by the King Ferdinand, state officials and an honor guard. Laid on a cannon carriage pulled by eight horses, the coffin was transported in a long procession to the "Mihai Vodă" Church and remained there for 2 more days, so the people could pay their last respects.

On May 17, 1923 (which was also Heroes' Day/Ascension Day), the coffin was buried inside a crypt in Carol Park with full military honors in the presence of the royal family, the Government, members of Parliament, and numerous members of the public. The stone slab of the crypt read: "Here lies at rest happily unto the Lord the Unknown Soldier, who sacrificed his life for the unity of the Romanian people. On his bones lies the land of united Romania. 1916–1919."

On June 6, 1923, The United States War Department announced that the Congressional Medal of Honor was to be awarded to the Romanian Unknown Soldier. This is one of only five U.S. Medals of Honor to be awarded to soldiers of foreign armies allied with the United States during World War I.

On the night of December 22/23, 1958, the Unknown Soldier's monument was dismantled and moved, in great secrecy, to the Mărășești Mausoleum by the Communist regime to make room for the Mausoleum of the Communist Heroes, where several leaders of the Party were later interred (among them Gheorghe Gheorghiu-Dej).

In 1991, after the fall of the regime, the Tomb was moved back into the Carol Park, closer to its original location.

In 2007 the Tomb was moved even closer to its original 1923 location, right next to the Communist mausoleum.

title: Tomb of the Unknown Soldier (Romania)


text:
User talk:Akulkarni

Wired for Sound, Wanderlust, Shutterbug, Eternal Dreamer

Welcome! (We can't say that loudly enough!)

Here are a few links you might find helpful:

 * Be Bold!
 * Don't let grumpy users scare you off
 * Meet other new users
 * Learn from others
 * Play nicely with others
 * Contribute, Contribute, Contribute!
 * Tell us about you

You can sign your name on talk pages and votes by typing ~~~~; our software automatically converts it to your username and the date.

If you have any questions or problems, no matter what they are, leave me a message on my talk page. Or, please come to the New contributors' help page, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type   on your user page, and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions.

We're so glad you're here!

I saw you adding external links to your website to various articles. They are likely to get removed sooner or later. The best way to add your pictures to wikipedia is to upload them here and then link them to articles. Please go through these links: Uploading images, Image use policy, Featured pictures. -- Lost(talk) 09:48, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Where Everybody Knows Your Name
Please do not post copyrighted material to Wikipedia without permission from the copyright holder. See Copyrights. Copyright violations are unacceptable and persistent violators will be blocked. Your original contributions are welcome. -- Merope Talk 19:45, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

title: User talk:Akulkarni


text:
Modification

Modification may refer to:

 * Modifications of school work for students with special educational needs
 * Modifications (genetics), changes in appearance arising from changes in the environment
 * Posttranslational modifications, changes to proteins arising from protein biosynthesis
 * Modding, modifying hardware or software
 * Mod (video gaming)
 * Modified car
 * Body modification
 * Grammatical modifier
 * Home modifications
 * Chemical modification, processes involving the alteration of the chemical constitution or structure of molecules

title: Modification


text:
Talk:Modification

Untitled
changeing the origional to make it different to your likeing

title: Talk:Modification


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Odinic Rite

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was - kept

I feel this was incorrectly tagged as a speedy. Is this an ad? Is it notable enough for an article? No vote from me. [[User:MacGyverMagic|Mgm|(talk)]] 20:25, Dec 4, 2004 (UTC)

Note: was tagged for speedy by an anon. Wolfman 21:32, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * Keep I created the article. This article is very early in the making but I will improve it. I certainly didn't post it to be an "advertisment" for the Odinic Rite but because they certainly should be recognised on this Wikipedia Encyclopedia for their achievements in the Asatru / Odinism community worldwide. It is undisputed that they are the longest running Odinist organisation in the world and have influenced the other two major groups - the Asatru Folk Assemnbly and the Asatru Alliance. They were even in the forefront and prevented a sacred heathen stone here in England from being destroyed by a telecommunicatrions pole. I ask you to reconsider this article and to keep it up. There will be NO requests to join this organisation but will be a recognition on this excellent encyclopedia. I am organising to get "real" historical information for this article so please bear with me so I can make it a "true" article. Many thanks, Fjorn.
 * Keep. It is a reasonably well-known organisation and the article doesn't seem to make any untrue claims. Could do with a bit of clean-up though. Dbiv 21:09, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep I see no cause to delete. Wolfman 21:28, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep The Odinic Rite is a valid org with legal status in UK, Australia and various US states. I say give the submitter a chance to reword it but that the OR should definitely have a listing.
 * Above vote left anonymously at 15:01, 4 Dec 2004 by IP address 81.77.15.128. —[[en:RaD Man|RaD Man (talk)]] 07:23, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep, of course. —[[en:RaD Man|RaD Man (talk)]] 07:23, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep, I don't see what is wrong with the article.--Wiglaf 12:42, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * keep (of course), verify and wikify. [[User:Dbachmann|dab ( T ) ]] 14:03, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep This is what Wiki is for. Improve and wikify. Wyss 20:21, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep Keep, but needs some expansion. The OR is a legitimate religious organisation and is worth an entry Pinlighter 16:10, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Many thanks to you all for this, it is looking like a great vote. Believe me, the article is now better than when it first appeared, of which I appreciate the help that was given. In relation to now still expanding it, well, I am pulling some real statistical data to make this a real educational document - hopefully to contribute to the standard of Wikipedia. Many thanks, Fjorn.
 * Keep, notable enough for an article. [[User:GRider|GRider\talk]] 17:54, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep ¨- I've heard about them before outside Wikipedia so they are at least notable. // Liftarn 07:54, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep, It does need work, but the organisation is large enough to warrant an entry in the Wikipedia. "'Keep'" -Loki's Advocate.
 * I have moved the entry above to where it is as it was posted at the top of the screen to keep the same convention. Hope this was ok, Fjorn.
 * Merge and Redirect. A real organization that should be mentioned in the Wikipedia.  However, it currently largely duplicates information in the Asatru/Ordinism article, which already mentions it.            --BM 19:48, 11 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.


text:
Talk:Burkinabe

Untitled
"Burkinabe" is not a synonym of "Burkina Faso"! It's the correct name of somebody from Burkina. Therefor i'll delete the redirect. --80.109.68.52 20:25, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * You're probably long gone, but... Redirection is not just for exact synonyms. It's also useful for topics that are presented as sub-topics of larger articles, exactly like this. There isn't much to say about the term "Burkinabe" outside of its dictionary definition, but there's more information about the Burkinabe people at the Burkina Faso article. FreplySpang (talk) 18:22, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Requested move 2015

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved to Burkinabe. DrKiernan (talk) 19:06, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Burkinabé → Burkinabè – Either use the correct French diacritic (grave accent) according to the Burkinabè state (source / source) or the unaccented English Burkinabe (source). The current form with the acute accent is the preferred form of the French state (source) but that should not be relevant in articles about Burkina-related topics in an English-language encyclopedia. Here are Google Books results but make sure to click through to the book images; the grave accent doesn't always show up in the Google text even if it is used in the book. The consensus here should ideally also be applied to other pages using this term as well. —  AjaxSmack  03:59, 18 July 2015 (UTC) --Relisted. George Ho (talk) 17:02, 25 July 2015 (UTC)  --Relisted.  —  AjaxSmack   02:12, 5 August 2015 (UTC)  --Relisted.  Number   5  7  09:16, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

The result of the move request was: Moved to Burkinabe (pending db-move of the target location). This is not Fulani WP, so it doesn't really matter which diacritic is used in Pulaar (è). Or in French (é). In English, the accentless form predominates. (Since this is a dab page, it's not terribly important either way.) We don't seem to be getting more comments. Could relist with notification in appropriate Wikiprojects if you think this move is infelicitous. — kwami (talk) 21:28, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
 * I think this move is infelicitous as I and one other user prefer the è and the nomination calls for the reuslt to be applied to other articles and so I am relisting. I have posted notes at relevant WikiProjects to gain more input.  There's no reason to close the discussion prematurely.  —  AjaxSmack   02:12, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

 * Support as correct In ictu oculi (talk) 04:18, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Support Burkinabe Burkinabè as correct. Ogress smash! 01:09, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

 * I'm not familiar with a Pulaar orthography using è. However, è is used in French for /ɛ/ as opposed to é for /e/ and e for /ə/. None of this is really relevant as a plurality of the English sources I linked above use è (click through to the book images to see the accent marks used). —  AjaxSmack  01:39, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
 * To clarify, you reopened because I hadn't moved the page yet, but that is being held up by the target page. Will move when that clears up.
 * In French sources it's generally "Burkinabé". I don't know if the Fulfulde "è" is equivalent to French "è", but French sources don't follow it even when citing the Fulfulde form.
 * Not much explicit evidence given in the discussion. The LoC subject heading is without diacritic. When English sources do use a diacritic, they seem to be fairly evenly split between acute and grave. The rationale given in the request, of using the correct French diacritic, is spurious, as both are correct in French. Omitting it is the agnostic choice. — kwami (talk) 02:04, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
 * This should be discussed further with input from others. As I noted above, I have relisted the discussion and have posted notes at relevant WikiProjects.  There's no reason to close the discussion if you can't even execute the move. —  AjaxSmack   02:12, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

 * Support "Burkinabe", oppose "Burkinabè". LoC subject heading has no diacritic. English usage is otherwise divided. Argument that grave accent is "correct" is spurious: French uses both, even in the same text, with the grave accent for the Fulfulde form and the acute accent for French derivations of the Fulfulde form (e.g. in "Burkinabée culture, language, history" etc.). In any case, English isn't French of Fulfulde. English usage seems largely arbitrary. The agnostic form without a diacritic would avoid the problem. — kwami (talk) 03:39, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Support "Burkinabe". It is an established loanword, so we don't need to take recourse to French. English usage appears to be split between accented and unaccented; however, since French and Fulani use a different accent, I tend to agree with kwami that using the unaccented form would be wiser. Alakzi (talk) 08:56, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Paging and  in case they've got any further input. Alakzi (talk) 09:30, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment I am seeing conflicting reports of English usage; since it's a dab, I'm changing my vote. Ogress smash! 17:18, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Support Burkinabe, although I'm fine with Burkinabè too. Interestingly, the French Wikipedia article says, "La constitution nationale burkinabée nomme les habitants du Burkina Faso les Burkinabè (mot invariable), où le suffixe «bè» désignant l’habitant (homme ou femme) est en foulfouldé, langue parlée par les Peuls," and, "Les habitants du Burkina sont Burkinabé ." It is clear that the forms burkinab é  and burkinab ée  are indeed used adjectivally. — the Man in Question (in question)  20:23, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Support Burkinabe per Kwami and Alakzi. Jenks24 (talk) 20:03, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

title: Talk:Burkinabe


text:
Talk:Game over

Luigi's Mansion
Have you seen Good Night Screen in Luigi's Mansion? See this mariowiki.com/Game_Over#Gallery and find 2000-2009. Apollo C. Quiboloy fans (talk) 06:25, 16 February 2018 (UTC)

What is the animation and voiceclip in Super Mario 3D World
According to ProfasiaGaming on youtube.com, he say that the game over animation (On a red background, the character fell down and Game Over fall in the position, and zoom out and doing a posing, after that Continue/Quit button combo appears after the music finish).

Example: Mario: Mama mia!

Luigi: No! NOO! Owwww!

Peach: Huh! What! What! What!

Toad: (crying like a baby and lie down)

Rosalina: Oh no!

It is accurate right? Apollo C. Quiboloy fans (talk) 06:30, 16 February 2018 (UTC)

Is which type of United States coin was traditionally inserted into an arcade machine to continue playing relevant?
I have added a "relevant?" tag to this article, after a statement which mentions what type of United States coin was traditionally inserted into an arcade machine to continue playing. I'm not personally of the opinion that this is any more relevant than adding which type of coin another country's arcade machines would generally accept. Should it be removed or not? Regards, DesertPipeline (talk) 09:11, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
 * It's...true, quarters are typically what's used, but I see your concern that it's not particularly necessary to know to explain the concept of a Game Over. I think it's just a good example of how some editors always feel obligated to provide explanation or examples to concepts that don't particularly require it. Sergecross73   msg me  13:27, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
 * User:Sergecross73: Typically used in the United States; but obviously not in other countries. I just think it's strange for the article to be singling out one country's monetary system over all others. Is there a suitable article on arcade machines where, possibly in a note, a list of commonly-used coin denominations for arcade machines could be placed? Regards, DesertPipeline (talk) 04:24, 15 July 2021 (UTC)
 * I think it's just trivia that can be trimmed out. Sorry, I might of worded that wrong. It's a good example...of how people write bad prose on Wikipedia. That's just how some editors are sometimes. You take a sentence like "Refrigerators can be used to store food." Then someone adds "Refrigerators can be used to store food, like chicken." And then you check back in a few months and see that it's swollen out to "Refrigerators can be used store good, like chicken, beef, meatloaf, blueberries (though it's not required for fruits), and various drinks (like beer and soda)." It's not wrong, just completely unnecessary to give examples for such a simple concept. I imagine the same thing happened here - some person probably erroneously thought it was necessary to give an example of money, as if the concept was abstract or something. Sergecross73   msg me  12:44, 15 July 2021 (UTC)
 * User:Sergecross73: Okay. But is information about coin denominations commonly accepted by arcade machines in different countries something that we might want to move to another article? Or is it the type of trivia that would be more suited to some other site, like a wiki devoted to arcade machines? DesertPipeline (talk) 13:41, 15 July 2021 (UTC)
 * I don't think it's really that important. I think it would be pretty widely known in the United States. Sergecross73   msg me  15:53, 15 July 2021 (UTC)
 * User:Sergecross73: Thank you for your input. I'll remove the text from the article now, and link this talk page section in the edit summary so that if anyone objects they can participate in the discussion here. Regards, DesertPipeline (talk) 11:57, 16 July 2021 (UTC)
 * @Serge that's a really apt example of what happens on this dumb great site lmao. Need to remember that one. Axem Titanium (talk) 20:34, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Game over


text:
Talk:Church Bus and School Bus Safety

I believe that this article should be split into two articles, one on the accident discussed, and the other on the subject of church bus and school bus safety. I intend to begin copying into thsi section the proposed new article about the accident itself. Can anyone help me, as I believe that my efforts are better utilized on content articles? Thanks, Vaoverland 05:08, 12 Dec 2004 (UTC)

title: Talk:Church Bus and School Bus Safety


text:
Sigelwara Land

"Sigelwara Land" is an essay by J. R. R. Tolkien that appeared in two parts, in 1932 and 1934. It explores the etymology of the Old English word for the ancient Aethiopians, Sigelhearwan, and attempts to recover what it might originally have meant. Tolkien suggested that its two elements were most likely sun/jewel and coal/hearth, perhaps meaning something like a soot-black fire-demon.

The Tolkien scholar and philologist Tom Shippey suggests that Tolkien's detailed study of the word may have influenced him in his creation of elements of his fantasy world of Middle-earth, including the Silmarils or forged sun-jewels, the Balrogs or dark fire-demons, and the Haradrim, men of the hot south.

Essay
Tolkien's essay treats the etymology of the Old English word for the ancient Aethiopians, Sigelhearwan. Tolkien concluded that, while the meaning of the first element was evidently sigel "Sun", the meaning of the second element hearwan was not definitely recoverable, but might be guessed at:

"a symbol ... of that large part of ancient English language and lore which has now vanished beyond recall, swa hit no wære."

The phrase Sigelwara land appears in Exodus, a free translation of the Book of Exodus (Codex Junius 11):

The main thrust of Tolkien's argument in this two-part paper seems to have been that Sigelwara was a corruption of Sigelhearwa, and had come to mean something different in its later form than it had in its original. He begins by pointing out that Ethiopians in the earliest writings are presented in a very positive light, but by the time they written of as "Sigelwarans", the perception has become the opposite. He does not speculate why, but instead demonstrates a clear relationship between sigelwara and sigelhearwa and shows how discovering the original meaning of the word Sigelhearwa is almost impossible; that trying to do so must be "for the joy of the hunt rather than the hope of a final kill".

The word sigel as a conflation of two words, the inherited word for Sun, the feminine sigel and an Old English neuter sigle or sygle for "jewel, necklace", loaned from Latin sigilla.

Suggesting a connection of hearwa with Gothic 𐌷𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌹 hauri "coal", Old Norse hyr-r "fire", Old English heorþ "to roast", heorð "hearth", Tolkien tentatively concludes that in the Sigelhearwan we may be looking at "rather the sons of Muspell than of Ham", an ancient class of demons "with red-hot eyes that emitted sparks and faces black as soot", English equivalent of the Norse fire giants ruled by Surtr, that had been forgotten even before the composition of this version of Exodus.

Influence on Tolkien's fiction
Tom Shippey notes that the demons "with red-hot eyes" make appearances in Tolkien's fiction as Balrogs.

One of the many peoples encountered in The Lord of the Rings are "black men like half-trolls". This description recalls the Sigelwara as black demons; furthermore their homeland of Far Harad, the great southern region of Middle-earth, recalls Sub-Saharan Africa, sometimes referred to as Aethiopia in pre-modern times. In drafts of The Lord of the Rings Tolkien toyed with names such as Harwan and Sunharrowland for the Haradrim generally and their land; Christopher Tolkien notes these names are derived from the Old English Sigelwara, and refers to Tolkien's essay Sigelwara Land.

title: Sigelwara Land


text:
Patrick McEnroe

Patrick William McEnroe (born July 1, 1966) is an American former professional tennis player, broadcaster, and former captain of the United States Davis Cup team.

Born in Manhasset, New York, he is John McEnroe's youngest brother. He won one singles title and 16 doubles titles, including the 1989 French Open. His career-high rankings were world No. 28 in singles and world No. 3 in doubles.

On May 1, 2023, McEnroe began his tenure as President of the International Tennis Hall of Fame.

Juniors
McEnroe started playing tennis as a young boy and was taught at the Port Washington Tennis Academy, where his brother John also played. As a junior, Patrick reached the semifinals of Wimbledon and the US Open boys' singles in 1983. He partnered with Luke Jensen to win the French junior doubles and the USTA Boys' 18 National and Clay Court titles in 1984. He also made his first impact on the professional tour that year, teaming up with brother John to win the doubles title at Richmond, Virginia. He won the men's doubles gold medal at the 1987 Pan American Games with Jensen, and helped Stanford University win the NCAA team championship in 1986 and 1988. While at Stanford, he was a member of the Sigma Alpha Epsilon fraternity. McEnroe graduated from Stanford in 1988 with a degree in political science, and then joined the professional tennis tour.

Professional career
In 1989, McEnroe won the French Open men's doubles title and the Masters doubles title, partnering with Jim Grabb.

His first career singles final came in 1991 at Chicago, where he faced his brother John, who won the match 3–6, 6–2, 6–4. (This was the second time in tour history where two brothers faced each other in a tournament final, after Emilio Sánchez and Javier Sánchez met in the Madrid final in 1987.)

His best Grand Slam singles performance came at the 1991 Australian Open, where he reached the semifinals before being knocked-out by eventual-champion Boris Becker. (Commenting on his fellow semifinalists, he told the press: "It's just like you all expected – Edberg, Lendl, McEnroe and Becker".) He was also runner-up in the men's doubles at the Australian Open that year, partnering with his former Stanford teammate David Wheaton.

McEnroe won the men's singles at the Sydney Outdoor Championships in 1995, to claim his only career singles title. He also had some notable Grand Slam singles results that year – beating Boris Becker in the first round of the Australian Open (before eventually losing in the fourth round), and then reaching the quarterfinals of the US Open where he lost to Becker in an epic four-hour and seven-minute four-set marathon.

McEnroe acted as a catalyst for fellow tennis champion (and older brother John's own rival) Jimmy Connors's run during the 1991 US Open. In the first round of the 1991 US Open, McEnroe led Connors two sets and 3–0 in the third set but Connors came back to win in five sets, walking off the court at 1:35 in the morning, after 4 hours and 18 minutes of play.

McEnroe retired from the professional tour in 1998.

Davis Cup
In the Davis Cup, McEnroe represented his country as a doubles player in 1993, 1994 and 1996, compiling a 3–1 record. In 2000, after older-brother John resigned following an unhappy 14-month spell as captain, he was named the 38th captain of the United States Davis Cup team.

With McEnroe as captain, the Davis Cup team won the Cup for the U.S. in December 2007. He resigned the position of team captain on September 6, 2010. His time as captain is the longest of any US Davis Cup captain.

General manager of USTA player development
In 2008, McEnroe became general manager of USTA player development. A series of mandates aimed at promoting junior tennis, including a requirement that all players age ten and under (U10) compete on miniature courts using new lightweight "green dot" tennis balls, have been controversial. The smaller format is designed to make tennis more accessible to children but critics argue that it will inhibit development. Coach Robert Lansdorp said in September 2013 that the format "is wrong for the very talented players" that become champions and noted that Maria Sharapova, Monica Seles and the Williams sisters were already competing on regular courts by age 7.

In 2012, tennis coach Wayne Bryan, father of the Bryan brothers, wrote a letter expressing concern about the effects USTA mandates were having on players and coaches around the country. McEnroe responded, calling Bryan's criticisms "scattershot" and "filled with holes, hearsay and half truths". At the December 2012 "Riv It Up" USPTA Education Event held at the Riviera Country Club in Pacific Palisades, California, professional coaches united to support Bryan in a "packed" meeting with USTA director Craig Jones that drew attendees from as far away as Arizona. Fox News commentator Sean Hannity, the father of two junior players, posted his own analysis online "urging the immediate reversal of the USTA's new rules for juniors competition". Former world No. 1, John McEnroe, owner of Sportime Tennis Center on Randalls Island, New York, agrees that the tennis federation his younger brother Patrick advocates is unlikely to produce a champion.

On September 3, 2014, Patrick McEnroe was relieved of his duties as Head of Player Development for the USTA. Jon Wertheim of Sports Illustrated reports McEnroe was "forced out of his job" after a six-year tenure. The announcement was made during the US Open Tennis Championship in Flushing Meadows, New York, where for the second consecutive year, and only the second time in its 134-year history, no American men advanced past the third round. It is the latest indicator that the United States has lost its place in the upper echelon of professional tennis. The last American man to win a Grand Slam title was Andy Roddick in 2003.

On April 5, 2015, Martin Blackman was announced as the new Head of Player Development for the USTA.

Broadcast career
McEnroe currently works as a broadcaster for ESPN and a contributor to CNN. He previously worked for CBS from 1996 to 2008. McEnroe has worked for ESPN since 1995, where his versatility allows him to work play-by-play, as a studio host, or analyst. He is regularly paired with his brother John or Darren Cahill. Patrick works as the lead play-by-play man for many of ESPN's tennis events.

Personal life
On December 19, 1998, McEnroe married singer and actress Melissa Errico. They have three daughters, Victoria Penny (born 2006) and twins Juliette Beatrice and Diana Katherine (born 2008). They live in Bronxville, New York.

Honors

 * McEnroe served as captain of the US men's tennis team at the 2004 Summer Olympics in Athens.
 * In November 2012, McEnroe was announced as a 2013 recipient of the NCAA Silver Anniversary Award, presented annually to six distinguished former college student-athletes on the 25th anniversary of the end of their college sports careers.

Doubles runner-ups (21)

 * 1988: Schenectady (with Paul Annacone, lost to Alexander Mronz/Greg Van Emburgh), Cincinnati (with Jim Grabb, lost to Rick Leach/Jim Pugh)
 * 1989: Key Biscayne (with Jim Grabb, lost to Jakob Hlasek/Anders Järryd), Rio de Janeiro (with Tim Wilkison, lost to Jorge Lozano/Todd Witsken), Washington (with Jim Grabb, lost to Neil Broad/Gary Muller)
 * 1990: Indian Wells (with Jim Grabb, lost to Boris Becker/Guy Forget), Rosmalen (with Jim Grabb, lost to Jakob Hlasek/Michael Stich)
 * 1991: Australian Open (with David Wheaton, lost to Scott Davis/David Pate), Vienna (with Jakob Hlasek, lost to Anders Järryd/Gary Muller)
 * 1992: Cincinnati (with Jonathan Stark, lost to Todd Woodbridge/Mark Woodforde), New Haven (with Jared Palmer, lost to Kelly Jones/Rick Leach), Brisbane (with Jonathan Stark, lost to Steve DeVries/David Macpherson), Antwerp (with Jared Palmer, lost to John Fitzgerald/Anders Järryd)
 * 1993: San Francisco (with Jonathan Stark, lost to Scott Davis/Jacco Eltingh), Key Biscayne (with Jonathan Stark, lost to Richard Krajicek/Jan Siemerink)
 * 1994: Tokyo Outdoor (with Sébastien Lareau, lost to Henrik Holm/Anders Järryd), Toronto (with Jared Palmer, lost to Byron Black/Jonathan Stark), Toulouse (with Jared Palmer, lost to Menno Oosting/Daniel Vacek)
 * 1995: Key Biscayne (with Jim Grabb, lost to Todd Woodbridge/Mark Woodforde), Tokyo Indoor (with Jakob Hlasek, lost to Jacco Eltingh/Paul Haarhuis)
 * 1996: Sydney Outdoor (with Sandon Stolle, lost to Ellis Ferreira/Jan Siemerink)

title: Patrick McEnroe


text:
Sonor

Sonor is a German musical instrument manufacturing company headquartered in Bad Berleburg. Established in 1875, it is one of the oldest percussion companies in the world. Sonor currently manufactures drum kits and hardware.

Apart from drum kits, Sonor also manufactured a wide range of other percussion instruments through its history. Some of them were frame drums, bongo drums, djembes, Cajons, timbales, congas, tambourines, maracas, guiros, glockenspiel, cymbals and mallets.

History
The company was founded in 1875 as a percussion instruments manufacturer. One of the oldest existing models of drums manufactured by Sonor is a 1942 Johannes Link Parade Snare, a very heavy snare drum with an aluminum shell and thick tension rods.

In the 1980s, Sonor's tagline was "The Rolls of drums". The drums were made of very thick (13 mm) and heavy shells that were beech wood, with an innermost and outermost ply of furniture-grade veneers, such as rosewood and bubinga. Nicko McBrain of Iron Maiden was one of the most prominent Sonor artists of the 1980s and 1990s, along with Mikkey Dee of Motörhead, Steve Smith of Journey, Phil Rudd of AC/DC, Danny Carey of Tool, Thomas Haake of Meshuggah, Glenn Kotche of Wilco, Gavin Harrison of Porcupine Tree, jazz/fusion artist Jojo Mayer and jazz legend Jack DeJohnette.

Sonor invented the modern screw thread drum-construction and the metal snare drum in the early 20th century. William F. Ludwig got this idea in his early years back in Germany from Sonor and began to use it later in Chicago.

As the 1980s progressed, the market began to stray away from thick heavy shells and Sonor started slimming down its shells with a line called "Sonorlite" and "Hilite", a step more towards the idea a drum shell should resonate like a violin or guitar body. The thinner the shell, the lower the fundamental tone.

Sonor drums have several design features, including undersized shells (a similar concept to a violin bridge - designed to enhance response), and tension rods that are round and feature a slot instead of the traditional square style (though recently Sonor made square heads standard, with slotted heads available as an option). Recently, Sonor re-introduced the designer X-Ray Acrylic drums, the first time in 20 years Sonor offered acrylic drums. These shells are made from seamless, extruded acrylic and feature acrylic hoops.

In 1953, the Orff instruments were officially included in Sonor’s production plan. In close collaboration with Professor Hans Bergese, a student of Carl Orff, Sonor developed a range of instruments. The basic idea was that the instruments should grow with the mental abilities and playing techniques of the child, thus encouraging active music making.

title: Sonor