text:
Talk:Wilno Voivodeship (1926–1939)

Name
Is there any historical document that would refer to the voivodship as Vilnius voivodship? If not, then this article should be merged with the article on Wilno Voivodship. Halibutt 13:57, May 23, 2005 (UTC)

 * At Gdansk discution which was/is often quoted the decition was reached to name cities (in pre-modern times) by the name which is used by the majority nationality. By the time Lithuanians were majority in Vilnius, only later it was slavinised. Therefore, it should not be merged anywhere; besides it works as a good natrual disambiguation as Wilno Voivodship and Vilnius voivodship are two very different things of different sizes and existed in different times. Previously this was section of Wilno Voivodship article and even there the section about this unit was titled "Vilnius voivodship" DeirYassin 14:14, 23 May 2005 (UTC)

 * If so, then the article should be split onto two different articles: one on Wilno Voivodship and other on Vilna Voivodship, since before Polish, Ruthenian was spoken there. At the times when Lithuanian was the most notable language of that area, there was no voivodship there. Halibutt 16:14, May 23, 2005 (UTC)

 * Not true. Ruthenian was used as a chancery language before Polish, but not spoken there; in XVII age most of territories in the voivodship were still Lithuanian speaking. I sent you one map about that and you can see for yourself and compare that with any map where Vilnius Voivodship is shown, you will see that most of area was Lithuanian-speaking. So was city of Vilnius (not nobility; but not rich people are also people so counts into majority, and there were way more of them than nobles). And the voivodship itself was established long ago, before Union of Lublin, together with Trakai Voivodship (at the time the LGD lands still weren't organised into voivodships, only these two). DeirYassin 16:39, 23 May 2005 (UTC)

 * DeirYassin, it is not known if Litvins spoke Lithuanian language before the union (similarly to Samogitians). This is just a theory and there is no proof about this. The other (and personally I think more probable) theory is that in majority they spoke Ruthenian. Otherwise why Ruthenian was used in writing ? Anyway, as you say, there is no doubt that Ruthenian was the official language then, and thus the official name was not Vilnius. I hope that's clear ? Lysy 2 July 2005 13:53 (UTC)

 * If by Litvins you mean Belorusians, then yes, they didn't speak Lithuanian of course. Nor did Samogitians, who always spoke Samogitian language; only later Samogitians and Lithuanians started to be considered as a single nation (and for example Samogitians from southwestern Latvia, where they are not exposed to Lithuanian language, find it extremely hard to understand Lithuanian). Lithuanian was spoken between Samogitian and Ruthenian. It is impossible that Lithuanian language would have suddenly appeared out of nowhere. And, as I explained bellow to Halibutt, there is whole science at determinateing influences of different languages in the past based on toponyms, hydronyms and such. Also, please note that there were no official languages back then in the way we understand term official language now. Ruthenian was the written language of GDL; however the need for writting/reading wasn't an everyday need back then as it is now, most of people were illiterate. Ruthenian was used for writting because the writting system was not developed for Lithuanian, other political reasons, also it is true that in late GDL more people spoke Ruthenian than Lithuanian. By the time there was no nationalism inside GDL and therefore there was no competing over nations over which language to use. As for official names for cities, there weren't official ones back then either; as far as I got explained once, in Wikipedia it was decided to use names for cities and such in pre-modern times depending on what the majority of population spoke at the time. I agree however that in case of Vilnius Voivodship, the exact majority might be hard to determinate.DeirYassin 4 July 2005 10:09 (UTC)

 * Sorry, I don't find that map credible. There might be some studies by Lithuanian scientists on when and which villages dropped Lithuanian, but in most cases it is magical thinking. On exactly what basis do they assume the dates of language shift, especially that the church records mention mostly Ruthenian names and were kept in either Latin or Ruthenian? Of course, if a person is mentioned as Ladislaus, we could forcibly make a Ladislovas out of him, but there would hardly be any reason for that apart from nationalism and trying to prove some point.

 * Also, my question on what document mentions such a name (I mean documents written before 20th century) is still valid. Especially that, as far as I know, Lithuanian language was reformed after 1918 and before the V letter was not even in the Lithuanian alphabet. Am I correct on that one? If so, then perhaps the name that might've been used (though I would like to see some proof) would be something like "Wilnius Woiwodija". Right? Halibutt July 2, 2005 12:43 (UTC)

 * As for writting systems, I don't think that should be taken into account much; there has always been and are language reforms, usage of some letters used to change in probably all languages over the time, and, what is more important, is that all nations started to use writting altogether only at a certain time in history. Spelling is more important. And Woiwodija or Vaivadija won't be used in wikipedia anyways, Voivodship will be, as this is more English equivalent. As for languages, where Lithuanian used to be spoken is determinated by where there are Lithuanian names of villages. towns, rivers and other places. Some of constructions are found only in Lithuanian language, e.g. ending of village name "iškis"/"iškės" and not in the nearby languages. Also, some names might be meaningful in Lithuanian, but meaningless in Belorusian or Polish, which would also indicate that they came from Lithuanian. Therefore by the percentage of Lithuanian names of villages, on the dates of their establishment/first mentioning where they are possible to find, it can be found out. River names tends to stay for longer than town names therefore data from older times is possible to find out from river names. Such science about hydronims, toponyms and such is applied not only by Lithuanians I am sure and is used in general to determinate the extent of different nations at different times of history; e.g. the situation of language groups by the time of Roman empire and such. By the way, although there are arguements to use Vilnia Voivodship here, I see almost no arguements to use Wilno Voivodship as the nobility polonized only in later time of the existance of the voivodship and the majority of people always spoke Lithuanian and Ruthenian/Belorussian. DeirYassin 4 July 2005 10:09 (UTC)

 * Yes, but then we name the article with the last used name in history, which in this case is Wilno Voivodship (BTW, note that it's English translation and not Polish, which would be województwo wileńskie). We do not make separate article for Wilno just because this is how Vilnius used to be called in certain period. Similarly, we don't need to create a separate article for Vilnius Voivodship, as all the information here already was in Wilno Voivodship. Therefore I'd ask not to split these articles, and re-integrate them back. --Lysy (talk) 4 July 2005 13:54 (UTC)

 * I agree that only one article should remain but I think that should go under name Vilnius Voivodship. There is no standartised English name here in the way say "Jerusalem" is used over "Yerushalaym" or "Cologne" is used over "Koeln". The name is made by the name of capital city (Vilnius/Wilno/Vilnia) and the name of the type of administrational unit (Voivodship). Same is done with e.g. Oblasts of Russia and most of units which are called after the capital city. And as for the city itself, the name should be used for it which was used by the majority of population by the time as the Gdansk/Danzig vote showed afak (don't think it would be viable to do Vilnius/Wilno/Vilnia vote). The city was majorly Polish-speaking for some centuries, that is true, but not at the time the voivodship was established and not for the most of time the voivodship was existing. Regardless of werether one thinks it was Belarussian or Lithuanian used there back then, it was not Polish, the nobility was not yet Polonised either at the time. While what is done is calling voivodships of Grand Duchy of Lithuania by Polish city names even though Ruthenian or Lithuanian was used in them and that might make it seem that GDL was Polish on itself - and this is somewhat true only for the latest years of GDL. Sometimes Polish names are even used for fief of East Prussia cities where they were German speaking and did not have Polish nobility. What people needs to understand is that nationalism wa snot present back then; and that the fact that the Commonwealth encompassed all these areas does not mean they were all owned by Polish people or Polish nation. Same as the fact that Grand Duchy of Lithuania encompassed vast areas does not mean that they all were Lithuanian speaking or that this would allow adding Lithuanian name for e.g. Odessa, or (if you prefer Belarussian viewpoint) Belorussian name for Palanga for that matter. Nationalism just was not present back then and therefore the history of the time should not be seen from a nationalist standpoint. Therefore I suggest (for the history of pre-modern times) using names the majority of locals used at the time as otherwise it won't ever be agreed on what name is better to use in some cases. DeirYassin 8 July 2005 10:28 (UTC)

I have merged the article and moved the talk page. Feel free to move it to Vilnius, but at least now we have one article instead of two.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 17:35, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I don't know how to remerge. Articles have to be remerged. User:Dellijks 00:51, 14 January 2007

It is paradox to see Lithuanian toponyms for example in, to know about Lithuanian islands (there are some showed here ,) in that territory some of which remained even after Polish (the campaign „we take poprostu and also Polish speaking Poles of Vilnius and otherwhere under the Warsaw – Belarusians and Lithuanians in the big gaps are also included“) and Russian sweeping of Lithuanian culture and to hear you Halibutt wondering about Lithuanian language. I am not some good knower of that (I don't know many factual material about languages; do you know? Ofcourse I don't ask about how many poprostu speaking Poles were calculated in the 20th century) but about what ladislauses are you talking? Lithuanian common language previously started to form in Vilnius under local dialect in the 17th century. To the first half of the 18th century the formation of a common language shifted to western Lithuania (Vilnius started to loose its Lithuanian nature?). At the beginning of the 18th century there where many Lithuanians not only around Vilnius, but in the town of Vilnius as well. Z. Zinkevičius has written a book: Lietuvių antroponimika : Vilniaus lietuvių asmenvardžiai XVII a. pradžioje [Lithuanian anthroponimics: the personal names of Vilnius Lithuanians at the beginning of the 18th century] / Zigmas Zinkevičius. - Vilnius : Mokslas, 1977. - 304 p. He finds that Lithuanian communty was alive and numerous in Vilnius.

A good argument of DeirYassin: "besides it works as a good natural disambiguation as Wilno Voivodship and Vilnius voivodship are two very different things of different sizes and existed in different times". There are two different Voivodeships: Polish (from 1922 02 20) and Lithuanian. I don't see any complications in this.

Wilno is Polish name. It's an nonsense to name capital Voivodeship in the state which was created by Lithuanians the Grand Dukes of Lithuania and belonged to GDL from its establishment to Russia occupation, under the Polish name.

Some facts about Lithuanian language:
 * The lands of Lithuanian predecessors have bordered Ruthenian lands since the 9th century, as the oldest Slavicisms in Lithuanian is from these times.
 * When Jogaila was executing his obligations of the Act of Kreva he established parishes in some territories where pagan Lithuanians had lived. Two of the seven parishes were linguistical islands in Slavic lands: in Gajna (northward of Minsk) and Obolci (near Orsha).
 * Lithuanian speaking area located most to the South in modern times was Dziatlava (Lithuanian Zietela). It was one of common Lithuanian speaking islands in the land. Several villages lieyng by Dziatlava constituted Lithuanian speaking area of Dziatlava island in the 20th century there. The last local Lithuanian died here at the eight decade of that century. The subdialect of Zietela belongs to a Western Aukštaitian Dialect which had been stretching from Labguva (today Polessk; German Labiau), Šventapilė (today Mamonovo) in East Prussia to for example Dziatlava at the upper reaches of Nemunas. This dialect is supposed by linguists to have gotten some features from assimilated Yotvingians.

There is no need for politics (very strange arguments, we don‘t have a letter w and such an end of a word for nominative (o) in Lithuanian: "we don't need to create a separate article for Vilnius Voivodship, as all the information here already was in Wilno Voivodship"). If you want to have a last name, then have "Wilno Voivodship in Poland". The placenames of GDL in English would (must) have to be named as they are today in separate states. When you choose Wilno, you say with that: Vilnius is rather city of Poland than Lithuania's one. It must be chosen Švenčionys instead of Polish Święciany, Vilkmergė instead of Polish of Wiłkomierz in the English article. May be the Polish variant (but then Ruthenian also) may be written also. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dellijks (talk • contribs) 16:22, 13 January 2007

Name is POV
The old discussion showing some remarks about this. The name itself is not used in google b. much. Can anybody clarify how this article was moved because it looks like two articles were merged. Also it would be good to split the articles leaving one only for Grand Duchy of Lithuania and PLC and other for 20c. events. M.K. 21:47, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * What's POV about the name? Wilno: 2+2. Vilnius: 0+0. 1 for Vilna. The entity is known as Wilno Voivodeship. I don't see what's POVed about this title?--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 21:55, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * You presented sources yields hits for the 20th century Voivode. not Grand Duchy of Lithuania period. Clearly you failed to produce arguments why it was to be keep on this name as well as why it should not be split. As majority of contributors agree on splinting I will initiate this process. M.K. 10:13, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * by 2 sources you judge about article name usage? M.K. 21:59, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Google books is not library, it's nut much more than bibliographical research tool, to find book to read, and certainly not a statistic research tool.
 * And another one thing - I really do think, that 20th century Wilno voivodeship should go to separate article.--Lokyz 13:30, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I have presented my sources, what are your sources for Vilnius voivodeship? As for split, I agree that eventually each voivodship should be split, but for now the article doesn't look to long to merit such an action.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 17:39, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Split
We have a number of articles on other historical voivodeships on Poland, see Category:Polish historical voivodeships (1921–1939). Why should this one not have an article ? On the other hand I think it does not belong to Category:Voivodeships of Lithuania. I agree with M.K that maybe it should be better split into two articles (until 1795 and 1921-1939) ? --Lysytalk 00:28, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Before we split it (which I am not supporting but not opposing), I'd just like to be clear if we are going to be using the term Wilno of Vilnius Voivodeship? I believe that W. is the correct term in this context (per arguments above).--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 22:45, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Speedy rename
I suggest to rename this article to Wilno Voivodeship (1923-1939) and Wilno Voivodeship make an disambiguation page. Any opposition? M.K. 21:26, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Following the Soviet invasion in 1939, the Voivodeship was divided between the newly created Vileyka Voblast of the Belarusian SSR and the [1] Lithuanian SSR

 * False, it was Lithuania, not the LSRR.
 * It's a POV statement. Many countries didn't recognise the annexations in 1939.
 * The year 1939 in the title is also POV. Xx236 (talk) 15:04, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Another Map
We have a map in the article identified as coming from a Polish middle school textbook (2001). Although I suspect its legend originally was in Polish, someome probably translated it into flawed, almost pidgin English, with the moniker, "Polish Mother Tongue, 1931". That aside, I am trying to ascertain what the map is telling us regarding the area (looks like Tarnopol) with the Roman numeral VIII. It says that 63% of its inhabitants possessed an "other", and not stated, "mother tongue". Any ideas on what their mother tongue might have been? Dr. Dan (talk) 20:49, 4 January 2008 (UTC) [Poleszuk]. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polesie_Voivodeship ''In 1921 it was inhabited by 879 417 people, and its population density (20.8 persons per sq. km.) was the lowest in interwar Poland. In 1931 the number of population rose to 1 132 200, and density - to 31 persons per sq. km. According to the 1931 census, majority of population (62.6%) insisted on calling themselves the “locals” (tutejsi). Poles, scattered everywhere, made around 15% (which meant that it was the least “Polish” of all Voivodeships), Ukrainians (mainly in the south-east) - about 5%, Belarusians - 6.6% and Jews (mainly in towns) - around 10%. Also, there were smaller communities of Russians. Illiterate was 48.4% of population, the largest number in Poland, well above national average of 23.1% (as for 1931).'' --Molobo (talk) 11:20, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * It's actually for High School students if you want to translate it to English school system, you are mistaken it is not Tarnopol, but Polesie,and to be precise [Polesie Voivodeship] wholy different region, if you would follow the link you gave yourself you would have noticed Tarnopol is in diferent region. The people in question in Polesie are
 * Thanks for the explanation about middle school vs. high school. Interestingly, I had originally put Polesie as the link rather than Tarnopol (mixed up the maps of the country with the Voivodeship). So thanks for clearing that up too. What remains unclear is what these peoples' mother tongue was. It actually appears that this "dialect" is a Ukrainian one, sort of like Kashubian or Podhalian are Polish ones. These statistics seem to attempt to manipulate ethnic composition based what was "spoken", sort of like what we have in the article, Ethnic history of the Vilnius region. In any case 63% is quite a lot, and I suspect that the Pilsudski dictatorship didn't want to count over a half million additional Ukrainians in the figures. Dr. Dan (talk) 15:25, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Poleszuks feel more closely to Belarusians not Ukrainians, as to the rest please, no OR, sources please.--Molobo (talk) 17:39, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry, but growing up in the U.S., I still feel comfortable expressing my opinion on the talk pages. It might stimulate the discussion. Until I make changes to the article, no sources are required to express an opinion. The WP article on the "language" itself suggests that it is an Ukrainian dialect. But same argument; the manipulation of censuses by dictators to implement a policy is a well known fact on the continuum of history (and not only dictators). If these people "felt" more closely to Belarusians (whatever that means), instead of Ukrainians, evidently the Pilsudski dictatorship felt it prudent not to try to say they were Polish, and add them to the Polish population. It's likely that Stalin used these demographics to lop off over a third of Poland. On an OT subject, is there an available website where one can trace former members of the PZPR? Dr. Dan (talk) 18:52, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I suggest to read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:What_Wikipedia_is_not#Wikipedia_is_not_a_publisher_of_original_thought

Also your whole argument is flawed because the people in question didn't respond that they were Poles,Ukrainians,Belarussians but said simply "tutejsi" in polls. It is mentioned quite cleary in relevant article which I gave link to before. Their national identity became crystallized due to WW2.--Molobo (talk) 20:20, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Like I said, I believe that the above policy does not preclude me from expressing my opinion on the talk pages (see No. 4). I often get confused with your train of thought. What does the 1931 census map, out of this High School textbook, have to do with Their national identity became crystallized due to WW2? Does that fall under your premise that WP:OR is not permitted, or only when I express a similar opinion? The war started in 1939. What were these people crystalized into? Who crystalized them? Dr. Dan (talk) 01:26, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I suggest reading the article Poleszuk-the wikilink to it was contained in article I already gave you as a link before.--Molobo (talk) 02:53, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Read it before and read it again. Short story, they weren't Polish, and the "various powers that be" didn't see any purpose in allowing the development of their national identity. Not in Tsarist Russia, nor during the Pilsudski dictatorship in Poland. Dr. Dan (talk) 14:43, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Nobody claimed they were Polish in census, the censuses were made during the whole interwar era, not in the brief period when Pilsudski took temporary control.--Molobo (talk) 13:23, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

puzzled
I confess that I simply don't understand this edit or the edit summary. What numbers? Are you seriously suggesting that the majority of Voivodeship's inhabitants were Jews rather than Poles? What numbers are you referring to? The ones in ''Majority of population was Polish (59.7% claimed Polish as their native tongue). Among minorities there were: Belarusians (22.7%), Russians (3.4%), Jews (8.5%) and Lithuanians (5.5%)"''? As far as I know 59.7>8.5. Or is this some kind of "anyone but the Poles" kind of edit?   Volunteer Marek   21:32, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Wondering
Why someomone is trying to revert the factual version of the article and keeps reverting to Polish bias. The articles mentioned are present. --Lokyz (talk) 00:41, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I have to agree referenced information is constantly removed is a sign of disruptive editing pattern. M.K. (talk) 08:22, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

 * The sprinkling of the "puppet-state" and the like through the article is an obvious attempt at POV pushing. Same thing for the constant and unreasonable changing of "It was created in 1926 and populated predominantly by Poles with notable minorities of Belarusians, Jews, and Lithuanians. "The region was populated by Poles, Belarusians, Jews, and Lithuanians." - even if you don't buy the Polish census of 1931, all of other estimates still put Poles as the majority of the region (and no sources put Lithuanians anywhere near close that).
 * If you're referring to your insertion of the word "tendentious" then first, please include a full citation not just a title. Second, I was actually in the process of putting that part back in, properly referenced, but you reverted me in less than three seconds (literally) so I never got a chance. If you're gonna auto revert somebody, then don't complain. Third, you might want to keep reading that source to the next paragraphs where it talks about how "Lithuanian figures are a gross exaggeration in favor of their own people in the city" - don't cherry pick quotes from sources, that's as much of POV pushing as not using sources at all to support tendentious text.Volunteer Marek (talk) 08:28, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * That is the reason why "predominantly" is not correct as we dont have accurate account, Poles Germans, Lithuanians made their different "accounts". And that is NPOV. puppet state is referenced part and important one. Your feelings about that it don't give the right to remove it. M.K. (talk) 08:32, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

 * Actually it is not referenced at the moment because all you did was put "Historical Dictionary of Poland" there. There are many of these. Please provide full citations, it's really not that much work to include author, publisher, etc.
 * While we don't have exact numbers, and the census of 1931 might have exaggerated number of Poles, the fact that Poles predominated in the Vovivodeship is pretty well established. Hell, Poles are STILL a majority in the Vilnius district municipality, according to the LITHUANIAN census of 2001.Volunteer Marek (talk) 08:37, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

 * Actually, this is pretty funny. If the "Historical Dictionary of Poland" which you're using to source "puppet state" is this one, which it appears it is, then in the same exact paragraph it states that for Wilno itself, Lithuanians were only 4% of population, with Poles and Jews a clear majority, while the rural population around the city was "predominantly Polish". Here's another source which says the same thing: . So ok, I'll give you the "puppet-state" for CLR (just don't get crazy with the adjective), and you stop removing "predominantly Polish" - both pieces of info are in the same source and the second one can be sourced to many many other sources.Volunteer Marek (talk) 08:41, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually I gave title and page now added author and date. Besides it is rather new way of asking quotes - by blind reverts. M.K. (talk) 08:42, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * So how about adding that Lithuanians were 4% in there, per source?Volunteer Marek (talk) 08:50, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Another problem with your edit is that this article is about "Wilno Voivodeship" not "Wilno" - "Poles and Jews" were a clear majority IN Wilno. In the Voivodeship/region as a whole, including rural areas, Poles were the predominant majority - as this source (and others) state.Volunteer Marek (talk) 08:53, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

 * Per VM. Adding puppet state to every second sentence is hardly neutral, nor relevant. We don't add such terms to all instances Congress Poland or People's Republic of Poland or such appears, only if it is relevant in the context (discussing political autonomy or such). PS. And anyway, we discussed this years ago; per Republic_of_Central_Lithuania - not all scholars call this entity a "puppet state". A neutral version mentions disputed elections, following annexation, and refers the reader to the dedicated articles, without using loaded, simplified terms. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 10:10, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The Republic of Central Lithuania known as a sham state is the illegal precedent, that does not allow to talk about legality of the region belonging to Poland during the interbellum. Simple as that.--Lokyz (talk) 13:20, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * WP:SOAPBOX. This is not what's being discussed.Volunteer Marek (talk) 16:30, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * And this whole "sham" thing - it's a single source out of hundreds, and it makes this statement only in passing, and it isn't even about CLR but about Soviet and German occupation of Lithuania. Why don't you guys go and use that source in articles that are actually relevant? There it might not be UNDUE.Volunteer Marek (talk) 16:38, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Any citation please? League of Nations, preferably.--Lokyz (talk) 21:44, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Citations for what? That the source being used is mostly about Soviet and German occupation? Anyone can click on it already. Or citation for the reason why Lithuanian editors aren't using that source for what it is about - Soviet and German occupation of Lithuania - but rather are cherry picking a couple of words of text from it here? Can't answer that one for you.Volunteer Marek (talk) 21:48, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * My question was about annexion by Poland of the 'sham state. And, of course, editors should be reminded to abstain from WP:PA.--Lokyz (talk) 22:16, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I am sorry, but can you rephrase your points in English? I am having trouble understanding what you are saying. First you mention some weird term "sham state", and now you are demanding references... for your own statement? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 03:48, 4 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm asking to provide citations about legal status of the Republic of Central Lithuania, that, to my knowledge was never recognised de jure as a state, hence the legality of Polish annexation is rather questionable.--Lokyz (talk) 06:17, 4 March 2011 (UTC)
 * This is a valid request, but it is already addressed at Republic_of_Central_Lithuania, and was discussed at talk. I provided all relevant links earlier, above. I don't see why this is relevant here. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 06:30, 4 March 2011 (UTC)

Lot's of "information" is being bantered around in this discussion. As for the claim that ... "Poles and Jews" were a clear majority IN Wilno (aka Vilnius)...", there are articles on English Wikipedia dealing with Lithuanian Jews and Polish Jews and Russian Jews. I believe most Jewish references call the Jewish inhabitants of Vilnius, "Litvaks" speaking the Litvish dialect of Yiddish. Or am I mistaken? Dr. Dan (talk) 17:03, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Unwarranted removal
@Cukrakalnis can you explain this removal? Marcelus (talk) 20:53, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

 * The Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth is not Poland, so his changes were inaccurate. In addition, the things he added are irrelevant. The banning of Polish language is irrelevant to an article about an administrative unit. No one talks about the ban on Latin-alphabet Lithuanian-language books when it comes to an interwar administrative unit in Lithuania. Cukrakalnis (talk) 20:57, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Third Partition of Poland is accepted on Wikipedia, see: Third Partition of Poland. Situation of Polish language after 1863 seems quite important for the background section. I don't know why Lithuanian administrative units articles should be standard here. Also what about (at that time, Vilnius and its vicinity were mostly inhabited by Polish people), why did you remove that? Marcelus (talk) 21:05, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Because the last claim is very contentious and doubtful. There's already a separate article called the Demographic history of the Vilnius region and there's no need to copy information from there to here. Cukrakalnis (talk) 06:51, 15 June 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Wilno Voivodeship (1926–1939)


text:
Gladstone Branch

The Gladstone Branch (also known as the Gladstone Line) is a commuter rail line operated by NJ Transit from Gladstone station, in the U.S. state of New Jersey, to either Hoboken Terminal or New York Penn Station. It is one of two branches of the Morris & Essex Lines.

The Gladstone Branch junctions with the Morristown Line at Summit. East of Newark Broad Street station, trains may either continue to Hoboken Terminal, where PATH trains or NY Waterway ferries allow connection to New York, or use the Kearny Connection to diverge to New York Penn Station; two peak-hour trains from Gladstone offer direct trips to/from New York Penn Station.

On weekdays during rush hours, the line operates in two zones: all stops from Hoboken to Summit; or express from Hoboken to Short Hills (one station east of Summit), and then local to Gladstone. All weekend and off-peak service is local across the entire line.

The part of the line west of Summit is single-tracked with passing sidings at Murray Hill, Stirling, Bernardsville and west of Far Hills. The line primarily operates in the eastbound direction weekday peak hours, except for a small number of reverse peak trains. On weekends the line operates Gladstone-Summit service hourly along the branch. Until August 13, 2006 all trains continued to Hoboken. On that date, service between Hoboken and Summit was cut back to once every two hours on weekends. On May 11, 2008, off-peak weekday Hoboken-Dover trains (600 Series) were cut. In addition, weekend Gladstone trains were cut back to Summit, and a shuttle train operated every two hours between Newark Broad Street and Hoboken Terminal. (This shuttle train was later extended to provide bihourly service to Bay Street on the Montclair-Boonton Line). Passengers for Penn Station connect at Summit to/from a Dover/Penn Station train.

The line is colored pale green on system maps and its symbol is a horse, a reference to the Grand National Hurdle Stakes steeplechase race held in the area.

History
The only part of the New Jersey West Line Railroad that was completed was from Summit west to Bernardsville. The New Jersey West Line Railroad was dissolved in 1878 and the assets were sold off. The Summit to Bernardsville line was then purchased by the Passaic and Delaware Railroad. The Delaware Lackawanna and Western Railroad (DL&W) leased the line on November 1, 1882 as a branch of the Morris and Essex. The Passaic and Delaware Extension Railroad was chartered in 1890 and opened later that year, extending the line to its current terminus in Gladstone, New Jersey. The DL&W continued to operate this line throughout its lifespan as the Passaic and Delaware Branch, later becoming labelled the Gladstone Branch. In 1960, the DL&W merged with the Erie Railroad to form the Erie Lackawanna Railway, who took over the branch line. In 1983, New Jersey Transit assumed control of the line, and continues to operate it to this day.

The branch received severe damage from Hurricane Sandy on October 29–30, 2012, especially to the catenary and signal system, causing a suspension of service for one month. High winds brought down five tall catenary poles (whose replacements had to be custom-made), approximately five miles of catenary, and 49 trees across the tracks. Gladstone service resumed on Monday, December 3 with electric Midtown Direct trains to Penn Station and diesel-powered trains to Hoboken; full electric operation was impractical until substation damage near Hoboken was repaired in early 2013.

Description
The Gladstone Branch begins at Hoboken Terminal, with the exception of two weekday trains which run in and out of New York Penn Station. The line parallels the Morristown Line all the way from Hoboken or New York to Summit. At Summit, schedules are timed for most Morristown trains and Gladstone branch trains for easy transfers across the platform or one right after the other.

Just west of Summit, the Morristown Line separates and the line curves left at the Summit substation before entering New Providence. After New Providence, the line passes its first grade crossing at a 4 way intersection of Central Avenue and Livingston Avenue. This crossing is one of the few 4 way crossing along NJ Transit rail lines. The line then continues, crossing Foley Place and entering Murray Hill station. At Murray Hill, the track splits in two to allow eastbound trains and westbound to pass each other, since most of the line is single tracked. There is a wooden plank at Murray Hill to allow passengers on westbound trains to get off before the eastbound train arrives on the track closest to the station platform. Schedules are timed for a convenient meetup at Murray Hill. After Murray Hill, the line passes three more grade crossings: at Warner Field Path, at Union Avenue, and at Snyder Avenue. There used to be a siding for the general Chemical Company plant just west of the Snyder Avenue crossing, but this was removed between 2018 and 2019.

The line crosses Plainfield Avenue and enters Berkeley Heights station, which also contains a siding for parking equipment. The line then continues and crosses the Passaic River a second time and enters Morris County.

There are three stations in Long Hill Township. The first is Gillette station. After Gillette, the line crosses Morristown Road and enters Stirling station. At Stirling, the track splits in two, to again allow eastbound and westbound trains to pass each other. The line also crosses Central Avenue at the station. Continuing westward, the line crosses Northfield Road by Millington Elementary School before banking right and crossing Division Avenue and entering Millington station. At Millington, there used to be another gateless crossing on the other side of the platform, where the line will cross River Road, a small connection road between Commerce Street and Long Hill Road, but this crossing was closed off sometime around 2014-2015.

The line continues westward, crossing the Passaic River a third time before entering Somerset County and Bernards Township and crossing Pond Hill Road. After this crossing, the Millington quarry can be seen on the left (going westbound). Here, the track splits in two for a short period of time, acting as a siding, although trains going opposite directions can also pass each other here, but this area is not usually used for that. Lyons station is the next stop. The line enters the station after crossing a bridge over South Finley Avenue. After another crossing at Lake Road near Ridge High School and another bridge over West Oak Street, the line enters Basking Ridge station at the crossing at Ridge Street. Until recently, the original semaphore signal from the DL&W years used to sit atop the Basking Ridge station over the platform, one of the last vestiges of the previous operator of the line.

Afterwards, the line crosses over Interstate 287 before curving left and entering Bernardsville station after crossing under Mount Airy Road. At Bernardsville, the track splits in two again to allow trains to pass each other if necessary and the line crosses Depot Place. Continuing westward, the line parallels U.S. Route 202 and crosses Old Quarry Road, Meeker Road, and Whitenack Road. At Whitenack Road is the site of the former Mine Brook station, a former flag stop from the line's DL&W years. Mine Brook is the only station that was never rebuilt or even acquired by New Jersey Transit. Today, all that is left of the station is gravel where the platform used to be and a small gravel road where the parking used to be. The line then crosses Route 202 and enters Far Hills station, which has a station depot and a freight house to the west. Just west of the station near the freight house, the track splits in two again to allow eastbound and westbound trains to pass each other.

After Far Hills, the line snakes through the Far Hills area before entering the borough of Peapack and Gladstone while crossing over the North Branch Raritan River and under Peapack Road. Peapack station is next at the crossing at Holland Avenue. The line then crosses a walkway in Liberty Park before entering Gladstone yard. At Gladstone yard, the track splits into 5 to allow for parking of trains. One of the tracks switches back to condense into one or can act as a siding, while the other 4 tracks condense back into one. West of the yard, the tracks enter Gladstone station and its freight house. One track leads to the freight house, while two lead to the station.

Something to note is that the timetables are arranged so that most of the trains meet at Far Hills and Murray Hill. While Bernardsville and Stirling each have two tracks at the station, the second track is less commonly used unless a train is running late.

Rolling stock
Most service is provided by Arrow III electric cars built by General Electric and Avco in 1978. The two weekday round trips to New York use Bombardier MultiLevel Coach or Comet coaches powered by ALP-46 Electric or ALP-45DP Dual-Power locomotives, since Arrows cannot make the voltage change at the Kearny Connection. In the months following Hurricane Sandy, service to Hoboken used Comet trains powered by ALP-45DP locomotives.

Freight service
At the time of NJT acquisition, freight service was operated by Conrail. Upon the breakup of that company, the Norfolk Southern Railway inherited the business. Customers on the line dwindled, and the last customer, the Reheis Chemical Company, was bought out by the General Chemical Company and planned to close down in 2008. The apparent last freight train made its run on November 7, 2008; however, seven months later the facility began receiving shipments again, on June 19, 2009. Although this industry is east of the Berkeley Heights station, the freight trains actually operate as far west as Stirling, where the engine uses the siding to run around the train to reverse direction. In 2019, the Dover and Delaware River Railroad took over freight service along the line.

Electrification
Like the Morristown Line, the Gladstone Branch is electrified using overhead catenary at 25 kV 60 Hz. Traction power comes from the NJT substation at Summit, which also powers much of the Morristown Line. The Summit substation is located north of New Providence on the Morristown Line, between the Summit and Chatham stations, and receives power from the nearby Summit Utility substation. In addition to the NJT Summit traction substation, three other switching facilities are located along the line.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Gladstone Branch


text:
Marginal revenue

Marginal revenue (or marginal benefit) is a central concept in microeconomics that describes the additional total revenue generated by increasing product sales by 1 unit. Marginal revenue is the increase in revenue from the sale of one additional unit of product, i.e., the revenue from the sale of the last unit of product. It can be positive or negative. Marginal revenue is an important concept in vendor analysis. To derive the value of marginal revenue, it is required to examine the difference between the aggregate benefits a firm received from the quantity of a good and service produced last period and the current period with one extra unit increase in the rate of production. Marginal revenue is a fundamental tool for economic decision making within a firm's setting, together with marginal cost to be considered.

In a perfectly competitive market, the incremental revenue generated by selling an additional unit of a good is equal to the price the firm is able to charge the buyer of the good. This is because a firm in a competitive market will always get the same price for every unit it sells regardless of the number of units the firm sells since the firm's sales can never impact the industry's price. Therefore, in a perfectly competitive market, firms set the price level equal to their marginal revenue $$(MR = P)$$.

In imperfect competition, a monopoly firm is a large producer in the market and changes in its output levels impact market prices, determining the whole industry's sales. Therefore, a monopoly firm lowers its price on all units sold in order to increase output (quantity) by 1 unit. Since a reduction in price leads to a decline in revenue on each good sold by the firm, the marginal revenue generated is always lower than the price level charged $$(MR < P) $$. The marginal revenue (the increase in total revenue) is the price the firm gets on the additional unit sold, less the revenue lost by reducing the price on all other units that were sold prior to the decrease in price. Marginal revenue is the concept of a firm sacrificing the opportunity to sell the current output at a certain price, in order to sell a higher quantity at a reduced price.

Profit maximization occurs at the point where marginal revenue (MR) equals marginal cost (MC). If $$MR > MC$$ then a profit-maximizing firm will increase output to generate more profit, while if $$MR < MC$$ then the firm will decrease output to gain additional profit. Thus the firm will choose the profit-maximizing level of output for which $$MR = MC$$.

Definition
Marginal revenue is equal to the ratio of the change in revenue for some change in quantity sold to that change in quantity sold. This can be formulated as:

$$MR = \frac{\Delta TR}{\Delta Q}$$

This can also be represented as a derivative when the change in quantity sold becomes arbitrarily small. Define the revenue function to be
 * $$R(Q)=P(Q)\cdot Q ,$$

where Q is output and P(Q) is the inverse demand function of customers. By the product rule, marginal revenue is then given by
 * $$R'(Q)=P(Q) + P'(Q)\cdot Q,$$

where the prime sign indicates a derivative. For a firm facing perfect competition, price does not change with quantity sold ($P'(Q)=0$), so marginal revenue is equal to price. For a monopoly, the price decreases with quantity sold ($P'(Q)<0$), so marginal revenue is less than price for positive $$Q$$ (see Example 1).

Example 1: If a firm sells 20 units of books (quantity) for $50 each (price), this earns total revenue : P*Q = $50*20 = $1000

Then if the firm increases quantity sold to 21 units of books at $49 each, this earns total revenue : P*Q = $49*21 = $1029

Therefore, using the marginal revenue formula (MR) = $$\frac{\Delta TR}{\Delta Q} = \left ( \frac{\$1029 - \$1000}{21 - 20} \right ) = \$29$$

Example 2: If a firm's total revenue function is written as $$R(Q)=P(Q)\cdot Q ,$$

$$ R(Q)=(Q)\cdot (200 - Q) $$

$$ R(Q)=200Q - Q^2 $$

Then, by first order derivation, marginal revenue would be expressed as

$$ MR = R'(Q)=200- 2Q$$

Therefore, if Q = 40,

MR = 200 − 2(40) = $120

Marginal revenue curve
The marginal revenue curve is affected by the same factors as the demand curve – changes in income, changes in the prices of complements and substitutes, changes in populations, etc. These factors can cause the MR curve to shift and rotate. Marginal revenue curve differs under perfect competition and imperfect competition (monopoly). Under perfect competition, there are multiple firms present in the market. Changes in the supply level of a single firm does not have an impact on the total price in the market. Firms follow the price determined by market equilibrium of supply and demand and are price takers. The marginal revenue curve is a horizontal line at the market price, implying perfectly elastic demand and is equal to the demand curve.

Under monopoly, one firm is a sole seller in the market with a differentiated product. The supply level (output) and price is determined by the monopolist in order to maximise profits, making a monopolist a price maker. The marginal revenue for a monopolist is the private gain of selling an additional unit of output. The marginal revenue curve is downward sloping and below the demand curve and the additional gain from increasing the quantity sold is lower than the chosen market price. Under monopoly, the price of all units lowers each time a firm increases its output sold, this causes the firm to face a diminishing marginal revenue.

Marginal revenue curve and marginal cost curve
A company will stop producing a product/service when marginal revenue (money the company earns from each additional sale) equals marginal cost (the cost the company costs to produce an additional unit). Therefore, a company is making money when MR is greater than marginal cost (MC). And when MC = MR, it is called profit maximization. After this point; the company can no longer make a profit. Therefore, it is in their interest to stop production.

Relationship between marginal revenue and elasticity
The relationship between marginal revenue and the elasticity of demand by the firm's customers can be derived as follows:

 * $$R=P(Q)\cdot Q,$$
 * Taking the first order derivative of total revenue:
 * $$\left ( \frac{dR}{dQ} \right )= \left ( \frac{dQ}{dQ} \right )\cdot P + \left ( \frac{dP}{dQ} \right ) \cdot Q$$

 * $$MR = dR/dQ = P + \frac{dP}{dQ} \cdot Q = P + \left(\frac{dP}{dQ} \frac{Q}{P}\right) \cdot P = P \cdot \left(1 + \frac{1}{e} \right),$$

where R is total revenue, P(Q) is the inverse of the demand function, and e < 0 is the price elasticity of demand written as $$e = \left(\frac{dQ}{dP}\frac{P}{Q}\right)$$.

Monopolist firm, as a price maker in the market, has the incentives to lower prices to boost quantities sold. The price effects occur when a firm raises its products' prices and increased revenue on each unit sold. The quantity effect, on the other hand, describes the stage when prices increased and consumers quantity demanded reduce. Firms' pricing decision, therefore, is based on the tradeoff between the two outcomes by considering elasticity.

When a monopolist firm is facing an Inelastic demand curve (e<1), it implies that a percentage change in quantity is less than the percentage change in price. By increasing quantity sold, the firm is forced to accept a reduction of price for all the current and previous production units, resulting in a negative marginal revenue (MR). As such, as consumers are less sensitive and responsive to lower prices movement and so the expected product sales boost is highly unlikely and firms lose more profits due to reduction in marginal revenue. A rational firm will have to maintain its current price levels instead or increase the price for profit expansion.

Increases in consumer's responsiveness to small changes in prices leads represents an elastic demand curve (e>1), resulting in a positive marginal revenue (MR) under monopoly competition. This signifies that a percentage change in quantity outweighs the percentage change in price. Firms in the imperfect competition market that lower prices by a small portion benefit from a large percentage increase in quantity sold and this generates greater marginal revenue. With that, a rational firm will recognize the value of price effects under an elastic demand function for its products and would avoid increasing prices as the quantity (demand) lost would be amplified due to the elastic demand curve.

If the firm is a perfect competitor, where quantity produced and sold has no effect on the market price, then the price elasticity of demand is negative infinity and marginal revenue simply equals the (market-determined) price $$(MR = P)$$.

Therefore, it is essential to be aware of the elasticity of demand. A monopolist prefers to be on the more elastic end of the demand curve in order to gain a positive marginal revenue. This shows that a monopolist reduces output produced up to the point where marginal revenue is positive.

Marginal revenue and Marginal benefit
Example 1: Suppose consumers want to buy an additional lipstick. If the consumer is willing to pay $50 for this extra lipstick, the marginal income of the purchase is $50. However, the more lipsticks consumers have, the less they pay for the next lipstick. This is because as consumers accumulate more and more lipsticks, the benefits of having an additional lipstick will be reduced.

Example 2: Suppose customers are considering buying 10 computers. If the marginal income of the 11th computer is $2, and the computer company is willing to sell the 11th component to maximize its consumer interest, the company's marginal income is $2 and consumers' marginal income is $2.

Law of diminishing marginal returns
In microeconomics, for every unit of input added to a firm, the return received decreases. When a variable factor of production is put into a firm at a constant level of technology, the initial increase in this factor of production will increase output, but when it exceeds a certain limit, the increased output will diminish and will eventually reduce output in absolute terms.

Law of increasing marginal returns
In contrast to the law of diminishing marginal returns, in a knowledge-dependent economy, as knowledge and technological inputs increase, the output increases and the producer's returns tend to increase. This is an example of increasing marginal revenue; suppose a company produces toy airplanes. After some production, the company spends $10 in materials and labor to build the 1st toy airplane. The 1st toy airplane sells for $15, which means the profit on that toy is $5. Now, suppose that the 2nd toy airplane also costs $10, but this time it can be sold for $17. The profit on the 2nd toy airplane is $12 greater than the profit on the 1st toy airplane.

Marginal revenue and markup pricing
Profit maximization requires that a firm produces where marginal revenue equals marginal costs. Firm managers are unlikely to have complete information concerning their marginal revenue function or their marginal costs. However, the profit maximization conditions can be expressed in a “more easily applicable form”:

 * MR = MC,
 * MR = P(1 + 1/e),
 * MC = P(1 + 1/e),
 * MC = P + P/e,
 * (P − MC)/ P = −1/e.

Markup is the difference between price and marginal cost. The formula states that markup as a percentage of price equals the negative (and hence the absolute value) of the inverse of the elasticity of demand. A lower elasticity of demand implies a higher markup at the profit maximising equilibrium.

(P − MC)/ P = −1/e is called the Lerner index after economist Abba Lerner. The Lerner index is a measure of market power — the ability of a firm to charge a price that exceeds marginal cost. The index varies from zero (when demand is infinitely elastic (a perfectly competitive market) to 1 (when demand has an elasticity of −1). The closer the index value is to 1, the greater is the difference between price and marginal cost. The Lerner index increases as demand becomes less elastic.

Alternatively, the relationship can be expressed as:
 * P = MC/(1 + 1/e).

Thus, for example, if e is −2 and MC is $5.00 then price is $10.00.

Example If a company can sell 10 units at $20 each or 11 units at $19 each, then the marginal revenue from the eleventh unit is (11 × 19) − (10 × 20) = $9.

title: Marginal revenue


text:
Talk:Foreign relations of the Marshall Islands

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Louie Crew

Erman Louie Clay (né Erman Louie Crew Jr.) (1936–2019) was an American professor emeritus of English at Rutgers University. He was best known for his long and increasingly successful campaign for the acceptance of gay and lesbian people by Christians in general, and the Episcopal Church in particular.

Biography
Louie Crew was born December 9, 1936, in Anniston, Alabama. He has written about "Growing Up Gay in Dixie"

Crew graduated from The McCallie School (1954), and received a B.A. from Baylor University (1958) a M.A. from Auburn University (1959) and a Ph.D. from the University of Alabama (1971).

Crew taught at Auburn University, Darlington School, St. Andrew's School (Delaware), Penge Secondary Modern School, London, University of Alabama, Experiment in International Living, Claflin University, Fort Valley State University, University of Wisconsin–Stevens Point, Beijing International Studies University, Chinese University of Hong Kong and Rutgers University.

Louie Crew Clay died on November 27, 2019, 12 days shy of his 83rd birthday.

Activism
While teaching at Fort Valley State University, Crew founded Integrity USA, a gay-acceptance group within the Episcopal Church (1974). With Julia Penelope, Crew co-founded the LGBT caucus of the National Council of Teachers of English (1975). He served on the board of directors of the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force from 1976 to 1978. After he moved to Wisconsin, he served on the Wisconsin Governor's Council on Lesbian and Gay Issues in 1983.

When Crew first began working for the inclusion of LGBT people in the Episcopal church, he was widely denounced and dismissed, but today the Episcopal Church has come to agree with many of his views, while some churches and dioceses are strongly opposed.

Crew sat on the Episcopal Church's executive council (2000–2006). He was elected by the Episcopal Diocese of Newark to serve as a deputy to six triennial national General Conventions (1994, 1997, 2000, 2003, 2006, 2009). He was a devoted Anglo-Catholic and for many years a member of Grace Church in Newark.

Crew maintained a comprehensive Web site with information about the Episcopal Church and the Anglican Communion. Professor Ed Rodman at the Episcopal Divinity School says that Crew's first and foremost contribution was that "he brought internet literacy to the church".

Marriage
Louie Crew married Flora Mae Friedrich on May 25, 1968. She was his freshman English student in the spring of 1967. The marriage ended 5 years later in divorce.

Louie Crew married Ernest Clay on February 2, 1974, although at the time their marriage had no legal standing. They married legally on August 22, 2013 and Crew took on his husband's last name. The two are featured together in "Not That Kind of Christian", an 80-minute documentary film by Andrew Grossman, which premiered at the Breckenridge Film Festival in 2007.

Queer Poet and Writer
Editors have published more than 2,638 of Crew's manuscripts, including his most recent book Letters from Samaria: The Prose & Poetry of Louie Crew Clay edited by Max Niedzwiecki (Morehouse, New York, 2015) plus four poetry volumes: Sunspots (Lotus Press, Detroit, 1976) Midnight Lessons (Samisdat, 1987), Lutibelle's Pew (Dragon Disks, 1990), and ''Queers! for Christ's Sake!'' (Dragon Disks, 2003) Crew sometimes uses the noms de plume Li Min Hua, Quean Lutibelle, and Dr. Ddungo. YouTube has numerous videos of Crew reading his own poems.

Crew wrote the first openly LGBT materials ever published by Christianity & Crisis, Change Magazine Chronicle of Higher Education, FOR (Fellowship of Reconciliation), The Living Church and Southern Exposure. With Rictor Norton, Crew co-edited a special issue of College English on "The Homosexual Imagination" (November 1974). He served on the editorial board of the Journal of Homosexuality (1978–83; 1989-2012). He edited the 1978 book The Gay Academic, the book Telling Our Stories and the book 101 Reasons to Be Episcopalian.

Crew's papers are deposited in The Labadie Collection at the University of Michigan.

Recognition

 * Crew received honorary Doctor of Divinity degrees from Episcopal Divinity School in 1999 and from General Theological Seminary in 2003, and an honorary Doctor of Humane Letters degree from the Church Divinity School of the Pacific in 2004.
 * He had been a Fellow for the National Endowment for the Humanities three times: University of California, Berkeley 1974, University of Texas at Austin 1977, and University of Chicago, 1981.
 * He was a poet in residence at Helene Wurlitzer Foundation of New Mexico (1963) and at Ragdale (1988)
 * Episcopal Divinity School established scholarship under his name.
 * He was the recipient of the Bishop's Cross from the Rt. Rev. John Shelby Spong, Diocese of Newark, in 2000.

title: Louie Crew


text:
User talk:Genesis234

www.mypsace.com/genesis234 please come through and support ya boy

title: User talk:Genesis234


text:
User:Dder

I am David De Roure from University of Oxford, UK. For more info about me, please take a look at my home page

title: User:Dder


text:
User:Davidcannon/Biography-3

Political Leaders
Note: My biographies of Fijian and Lebanese politicians have been moved to separate pages.

 * Awolowo, Obafemi: Nigerian statesman (1909-1987). (major edit)
 * Beetham, Bruce: New Zealand statesman of the 1970s and 1980s. (major edit)
 * Bérénger, Paul: Prime Minister of Mauritius (2003-2005). (major edit/stub)
 * Botha, Pieter Willem: Prime Minister and President of South Africa (1978-1989). (major edit)
 * Buhari, Muhammadu: Nigeria's former head of state. (major edit)
 * Cabral, Luís: Former President of Guinea-Bissau. (original)
 * Cavaco Silva, Aníbal: Prime Minister of Portugal (1985-1995) and President of Portugal (2006 — present). (rewrite)
 * Steve Christian: Pitcairn Islands' Mayor (1999-2004), dismissed following his convictions for rape. (major edit)
 * Daddah, Moktar Ould : The founding father of Mauritania (original)
 * Durão Barroso, José Manuel - Portuguese Prime Minister (2002-2004), and President of the European Commission (2004-). (major edit)
 * Gil, Eddie: Filipino politician. (original)
 * Gutch, Sir John: 18th High Commissioner for the Western Pacific and second Governor of the Solomon Islands (1953-1955). (original)
 * Hertzog, Barry: South African Prime Minister (1924-1939). (original/stub)
 * Joyce, Barnaby: Australian Senator from Queensland. (original)
 * Malan, Daniel François: South African Prime Minister (1948-1954). (major edit)
 * Obasanjo, Olusegun: President of Nigeria (1976-1979; 1999-2007). (major edit)
 * Ohira, Masayoshi: Prime Minister of Japan (1978-1980). (major edit/stub)
 * Ojukwu, Chukwuemeka Odumegwu: Biafran warlord (1960s). (major edit)
 * Pinto Balsemão, Francisco: former Prime Minister of Portugal (1981-1983). (rewrite)
 * Ramgoolam, Navin, former Prime Minister of Mauritius. (major edit)
 * Sá Carneiro, Francisco, Prime Minister of Portugal (1980). (major edit)
 * Smith, Ian: Rhodesian Prime Minister (1964-1979). (major edit)
 * Stanley, Sir Robert: 17th High Commissioner for the Western Pacific (1952-1955) and 1st Governor of the Solomon Islands (1953-1955). (original)
 * Tudor, Margaret, Regent of Scotland. (major edit)
 * van Schalkwyk, Marthinus: South African politician. (major edit)
 * Vorster, Johannes: South African Prime Minister (1966-1978). (original)
 * Warren, Jay: Mayor of Pitcairn. (original)

title: User:Davidcannon/Biography-3


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Schrader valve

The Schrader valve (also called American valve ) is a type of pneumatic tire valve used on virtually every motor vehicle in the world today. The Schrader company, for which it was named, was founded in 1844 by August Schrader. The original Schrader valve design was invented in 1891, and patented in the United States in 1893.

The Schrader valve consists of a valve stem into which a valve core is threaded. The valve core is a poppet valve assisted by a spring. A small rubber seal located on the core keeps the fluid from escaping through the threads. Using the appropriate tools, a faulty valve core can be immediately extracted from the valve stem and replaced with a new one.

Uses
The Schrader valve is used on virtually all automobile tires and motorcycle tires and most wider-rimmed bicycle tires. In addition to tube and tubeless tires, Schrader valves of varying diameters are used on many refrigeration and air conditioning systems to allow servicing, including recharging with refrigerant; by plumbers conducting leak-down pressure tests on pipe installations; as a bleeding and test port on the fuel rail of some fuel injected engines; on bicycle air shock absorbers to allow adjustment of air pressure according to the rider's weight; for medical gas outlets within hospitals and some medical vehicles; and in the buoyancy compensator (BC) inflators of SCUBA systems where the ability to easily disconnect an air hose (even underwater) without the loss of tank air is critical. Schrader valves are also widely used in high-pressure hydraulic systems on aircraft.

Many domestic fire extinguishers use an internal valve identical to a Schrader valve, but with a lever on top to enable quick release of the pressurized content. It is also the same thread specification used on the shutter button of some old Leica, Yashica, and also Nikon F and F2 cameras.

Valve

A Schrader valve consists of an externally threaded hollow cylindrical metal tube, typically nickel-plated brass. In the center of the exterior end is a metal pin aligned with the long axis of the tube; the pin's end is approximately flush with the end of the valve body.

All Schrader valves used on tires have threads and bodies of a single standard size at the exterior end, so caps and tools generally are universal for the valves on all common applications. The core of the valve can be removed or tightened with a tool.

Industrial Schrader valves are available in different diameters and valve core variants and are used in refrigeration, propane, and a variety of other uses.

With the advent of miniature electronics, Schrader valve stems with integrated transmitters for tire pressure monitoring systems (TPMS) became available.

Cap
A valve cap on a Schrader valve prevents the entry of contaminants that may interfere with the sealing surfaces and cause leakage.

Metal, and some hard plastic valve caps, have a rubber washer or O-ring inside, both to prevent the cap from loosening and falling off due to vibration. These caps also serve as a mechanical seal or hermetic seal to prevent air from leaking from a faulty valve core. Simple caps without a seal do not reliably prevent leaks. Some metal caps are equipped with prongs to enable removing and replacing valve cores, thereby serving two functions: seal and emergency tool.

In refrigeration and air conditioning applications, the valve cap is considered to be the primary seal, with the Schrader valve only being used for service access.

Schrader versus other valve types

There are three valves used on tires worldwide: Schrader valves, Presta valves, and Dunlop valves. Each goes by multiple names. Schrader valves are also known as American valves or car valves. Presta valves are also known as French valves, Sclaverand valves, and road bike valves. Dunlop valves are also known as German valves, English valves, Holland valves, Woods valves, flash valves, and alligator valves.

Schrader valves are almost universal on car, truck, and motorcycle tires worldwide. Presta and Dunlop valves are mostly found on bicycle tubes. Both the Schrader and the Presta types are effective for sealing high pressures. Their chief differences are that Schrader valves are larger and have springs that close the valve except when the pin is depressed. Schrader valves are used in a wide variety of compressed gas and pressurized liquid applications such as small torch and grill cylinders, and air shocks. Schrader valves are also viewed as more complex (requiring two seals over one). They weigh 4 to 5 g more than Presta valves.

Schrader and Dunlop valve stems are 8 mm in diameter, whereas Presta valve stems are 6 mm, allowing Prestas to be used on narrower, high-performance rims as on road racing bicycles. Another disadvantage of the Schrader is that debris may be introduced into its spring-loaded pin, impairing inflation, whereas the Presta valve relies only on air pressure and a small knurled nut to keep it shut.

Inflating a bicycle tire equipped with a Presta or Dunlop valve at an automobile filling station requires an adaptor, while a Schrader-valved tube does not. Inflating at home or on the road requires either 6mm air chuck for Presta and Dunlop valves, or an 8mm chuck for Schrader valves. An important advantage of Schrader valves relative to Presta is that Schrader valves allow for quick air pressure checks. Some chucks have dual orifices to inflate all three.

Dimensions

 * External 8V1 thread: 0.305 in x 32 TPI (1/32 in pitch; tap size 8v1-32)
 * Internal 5V1 thread: 0.209 in x 36 TPI (1/36 in pitch; tap size 5v1-36)

title: Schrader valve


text:
Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Geni

Geni
final (17/5/1) ending 07:40 22 December 2004 (UTC)

I have made about 1200 edits to the Wikipedia since I started editing on 30 Mar 2004. Aside from creating articles on canals for no readily apparent reason I have edited a wide range of articles with edits ranging from wikifying through cleanup to writing about wars in places I’d never heard of. I do RC patrol from time to time and not being able to speedy delete is slightly annoying.Geni 07:40, 15 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Support
 * 1) Whohoa! I get to be the first to support! Theresa Knott (The snott rake) 11:12, 15 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 2) Why not? Johnleemk | Talk 13:08, 15 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 3) Seems like a good user to me. --Lst27 ( t a l k )  00:18, 16 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 4) [[User:Neutrality|Neutrality/talk]] 07:34, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * 5) OK. Tom - Talk 07:40, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * 6) Support. utcursch 10:15, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * 7) Ambi 10:48, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 8) Support. [[User:MacGyverMagic|Mgm|(talk)]] 11:14, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * 9) Andre ( talk )A| 12:36, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * 10) Support to break the tie. Anyone with more than a 1000 edits is good for me. Anárion 13:03, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 11) Support. I can't find a reason why not. jni 15:36, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 12) Support. Down with edit-counting. -Fennec (はさばくのきつね) 19:49, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 13) Support. Sure, no real reason that I can see for this user not to be an admin. Yelyos 19:55, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * 14) Support, as Yelyos. Rdsmith4— Dan | Talk 20:21, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 15) Support, extra points for the self-nomination. Down with expecting self-noms to exceed the standards.--[[User:Bishonen|Bishonen (talk)]] 00:45, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 16) Support. MPerel 01:31, Dec 22, 2004 (UTC)
 * 17) I let this go an extra half-day to see if anything new would develop or another bureaucrat wanted to make a decision, but the voting stands where it did since before formal closing. I considered the formal objections (nature, quality and strength), I looked at the Thimerosol page that ElBenevolente cited, I looked at a sampling of Geni's work and I read over Theresa Knott's explanation of the nature of Geni's "edit warring." Taking all into account, Geni's apparent temperament, and length of time here, I find that, this falling into the "grey zone," there is no compelling reason to withhold adminship, therefore I am supporting and promoting. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 20:28, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Oppose
 * 1) Short on edits. Evidence of "RC patrol" only within the last 3 days.  They should become more active in the maintenance area, and then check back in a couple months (hopefully with a full nomination).  -- Netoholic @ 20:58, 2004 Dec 15 (UTC)
 * 2) Oppose. Seems like a good user and I would support in all liklihood with some more experience.  RC patrol is good, but I would like to see more content creation. Self nom's should exceed the standards by a good margin. - Taxman 13:13, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * 3) Oppose.  User has very strange understanding of NPOV, claiming that "mercury-based" indicated a POV in the Thimerosal page (see Talk:Thimerosal), despite the fact that thimerosal is clearly mercury-based, and that this assertion is even supported by proponents of thimerosal.  ElBenevolente 18:13, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 4) Wanting to delete things is a bad reason for adminship. [[User:Sam Spade|Sam]] Spade wishes you a merry Christmas! 19:01, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * 5) Good editor, but I agree with Sam on this, particularly for speedies.  Sorry. Michael Ward 22:18, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Neutral
 * 1) I'm not sure what you mean by saying "Speedy delete {delete} is becoming annoying." Do you mean you'd rather delete than just tag them? Could you clarify? Also, edit war activity leaves me doubtful. I am aware of Health's, Iris's, and Treason's, ahem, backgrounds, but I don't see why good contributors should get into edit wars. Just request protection and walk away for a while; if the other persists, use the dispute resolution process. --Slowking Man 08:48, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * To answer your first part yes. As to the second article protection was not really an option when dealing with Mr natural health unless you wanted to lock anything remoltly related to CAM. there is also the issue that he knew a fair bit about the subject which meant a reasonable number of his edits were worthwhile and still exist. I ran into Irismeister after he had already been banned from editing the irdiology article so he was mostly working with MNH. As for Mr Treason his attack style is not for the most part posible to deal with with article locking. Since his edits broke so many rules anyway Reverting on site was not an issueGeni 12:57, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * To clarify a few points.(for those who don't already know) Irismeister was barred by the AC from editing iridology, and for the most part repected that ban so protection was not needed on that article. What he did do was post numerous personal attacks and legal threats all over the place. He would cut and paste the same rant to numerous pages. The AC decreed that these should be removed, he would put them back in - the only way to deal with him was by reverting. Protecting the village pump for example was not an option. Mr Natural Health tired vto take over and own all the pages that he felt had anything to do with alternative medicine. This included articles that had nothing to do with the subject according to most other people. Walking comes to mind as an example. Protecting and walking away would have meant protecting literally hundreds of articles. It wasn't an option. Mr Treason was an AOL vandal. He went on massive vandalism rampages for weeks on end. He kept many admins (including myself) tied up for hours. He vandalised pages at random so protection wasn't an option, he couldn't be blocked without blocking the whole of AOL. I personally did do that a number of times, so did other admins, but blocking the whole of AOL is not a solution and the blocks were for a few hours at most to give us a chance to revert everything back. There is no way, that anyone who reverted Mr Treason could be described as edit warring. Theresa Knott (The snott rake) 02:39, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Thank you both for responding. Theresa has alleviated my concerns regarding edit warring. However, I still hold reservations. Geni's comment below regarding the three revert rule, stating, "I'm pretty sure I have not broken the three revert rule with more than three reverts in 24 hours," seems to indicate to me that he's not as familiar with policy as I would like him to be. Some of the issues raised by the opposers also make me doubtful. Coupled with my belief that self-nominations should be somewhat above the bar for nominations by another editor, I choose to remain neutral. --Slowking Man 03:00, Dec 22, 2004 (UTC)

Comments
 * Neroholic is incorrect. While it is true that recent activities outside Wikipedia (exams) have meant that I have not been involved in RC patrol I have certainly been active in that area before the last three days.Geni 02:05, 16 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Questions for the candidate

A few generic questions to provide guidance for voters:
 * 1. What sysop chores, if any, would you anticipate helping with? (Please read the page about administrators and the administrators' reading list.)
 * A. Speedy delete {delete} is becoming annoying
 * 2. Of your articles or contributions to Wikipedia, are there any about which you are particularly pleased, and why?
 * A. Slightly strangely chelation therapy. Sure the initial article I wrote was third rate at best. Sure it got listed on VFD and latter became part of an edit war but the result was pretty good. The wiki process worked.
 * 3. Have you been in any conflicts over editing in the past or do you feel other users have caused you stress? How have you dealt with it and will deal with it in the future?
 * A. A few. I was part of a large edit war with User:Mr-Natural-Health which resulted in him being banned for three mounths. I've been in a couple of minor scraps with User:Irismeister. That is pretty much it (well unless you count User:Mr. Treason). None this caused me any stress. I suspect that I future I would deal with the problem much as I have in the past

 * New questions
 * 1) Can you explain what is happening with regards to the Sathya Sai Baba article?  It appears  that you're involved with an anonymous editor(s), and are having disagreements over the content.  Do you feel these opposing viewpoints are a valid reason for breaking the Three revert rule (1, 2, 3, 4)?

 * I'm pretty sure I have not broken the three revert rule with more than three reverts in 24 hours (ok it's posible but I don't think so). I don't quite understand what the anon user is doing. His edits involve deling almost all the negative comments about Sathya Sai Baba and putting in some posertive ones. They also give a fixed date for his birth although I think there is only enough data to fix a range. I've tried getting the indivdual to go to the talk page and other users have left comments on his user page. I don't want to see the article locked because that would prevent other people from makeing useful edits.Geni 22:31, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

title: Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Geni


text:
C6H6

The molecular formula C6H6 (molar mass: 78.114 )

 * Benzene
 * Benzvalene
 * Bicyclopropenyl
 * 1,2,3-Cyclohexatriene
 * Dewar benzene
 * Fulvene
 * Prismane
 * [3]Radialene
 * 3-Methylidenepent-1-en-4-yne
 * Hexadiyne
 * 1,3-Hexadiyne
 * 1,4-Hexadiyne
 * 1,5-Hexadiyne
 * 2,4-Hexadiyne
 * Hexadienyne
 * 1,2-Hexadien-4-yne
 * 1,2-Hexadien-5-yne
 * 1,3-Hexadien-5-yne
 * 1,5-Hexadien-3-yne (Basavraj)
 * 2,3-Hexadien-5-yne

Historical and hypothetical compounds:
 * Claus' benzene

title: C6H6


text:
User:Davidcannon/Biography-2

Religious Leaders

 * Akinola, Peter: Anglican Primate of Nigeria. (rewrite)
 * Bryce, Jabez: Anglican Bishop of Polynesia. (original)
 * Cho, David Yonggi: Korean Christian pastor. (original)
 * Forlong, Gordon: Scottish-born New Zealand evangelist (1819-1908). (rewrite)
 * Houston, Brian: Senior Pastor of Australia's Hillsong Church. (major edit)
 * Hughes, Wayne: New Zealand pastor. (original)
 * P.C. John: Indian evangelist (1876-1937). (major edit)
 * Malik, Charles: Lebanese academic, diplomat, statesman, and Greek Orthodox theologian. (major edit)
 * Mataca, Petero: Roman Catholic Archbishop of Fiji. (original)
 * Willem Ouweneel: Dutch theologian. (translated)
 * Pethrus, Lewi (1884-1974): founder of the Swedish Pentecostal movement. (original)
 * Philip, Johnson: Indian Brethren theologian (born 1954). (original)
 * Rosen, Moishe: founder of the Jews for Jesus movement. (rewrite)
 * Sarfati, Jonathan: scientist, chess champion, and creationist theologian. (major edit)
 * Sharma, Gabriel: First Indo-Fijian Anglican Bishop in Fiji. (original)
 * Simon, K.V.: Indian Christian apologist and poet (1883-1944). (major edit)
 * Tatham, Ernest: Canadian Open Brethren theologian, co-founder of Emmaus Bible College. (original)
 * Ting, K.H.: Chinese church official. (original)
 * Watchman Nee: Chinese Christian evangelist and founder of the Local Churches movement. (major edit)

title: User:Davidcannon/Biography-2


text:
User talk:Kyungmin

Hello, world. :-)

title: User talk:Kyungmin


text:
Video 5 8 6

"Video 5 8 6", originally titled "Prime 5 8 6", is an electronic instrumental piece and twenty-fourth single written and produced in 1982 by the British group New Order. In December 1982, the track was initially released in two sections in Touch Music's first cassette magazine, Feature Mist. Touch re-released the entire track as a CD single in 1997.

Composed primarily by Bernard Sumner and Stephen Morris, "Prime 5 8 6"/"Video 5 8 6" was an early version of "5 8 6" (from Power, Corruption & Lies), which contained rhythm elements that would later surface on "Ultraviolence" and the 1983 hit "Blue Monday". After Factory Records' Tony Wilson asked New Order for twenty minutes of "pap", it was first played in public during the opening of The Haçienda on 21 May 1982.

On release it reached #86 on the main British singles chart and #19 on the British indie chart. Bassist Peter Hook has said the key to the title "5 8 6" can be found in another of the group's songs, "Ecstasy"; 5, 8 then 6 is the song's bar structure.

A video was released for the song called Primitive 586 on the FACT 56, IKON 3 VHS and BETA tape 'A Factory Video', the footage is mostly primitive 80s computer graphics.

title: Video 5 8 6


text:
Talk:Carl Panzram

Sodomy? No rape?
Not necessarily because he was homosexual? No female victims? I find it hard to believe that statement. He obviously was a very bad person. But performing sodomy on over 1000 male persons and NOT a SINGLE recorded female victim? 97.103.81.29 (talk) 01:48, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The way the article is written, it seems like the claim is Panzram's own, taken from his autobiography. I wouldn't know as I haven't read it. PenguinJockey (talk) 07:32, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Why does he have to have raped women? I wasn't aware that there was a code of conduct in place as far as who you are required to rape. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.17.242.221 (talk) 03:38, 4 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Super late reply.... but.... he himself says that he sodomized men because he was sodomized by four men as a teenager on a train. —  - dain   omite    02:00, 11 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Rape isn't about sex. Its about power and control. He hated men more than women. Asarelah (talk) 01:56, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
 * He had sexual intercourse with a women early on in his life and got some kind of STD as a result. Basically that put him off, it's in the Panzram papers — Preceding unsigned comment added by Commasavoy (talk • contribs) 22:10, 26 January 2019 (UTC)

That must be the cause of his evil infamies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.108.113.209 (talk) 20:13, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

Raped by hobos
How is turning homeless persons into hobo considered vandalism? He explicitly stated that he was raped by a group of New York Hobos, and there is a difference between hobos, tramps, bums, etc. Homeless persons is kind of vague. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.85.239.90 (talk) 16:06, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree, 'hobos' is probably the more accurate word and more likely to have been the word Panzram actually used. I'll change it back.  --CliffC (talk) 18:26, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

 * Wikipedia is good for at least one laugh every day - a bit of history: apparently the article has said 'gang-raped by a group of hobos' ever since it was first written on October 22, 2004.  On October 17, 2007 some anon changed it to 'a group of New York hobos', without a citation or edit summary.  On September 20 of this year some sensitive soul changed it to 'a group of homeless people in New York'.  I'll take out the 'New York' reference.  --CliffC (talk) 20:13, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Birth year
Given as 1891 in Killer: A Journal of Murder (novel), purportedly by Panzram himself (the book mixes his own words with those of the authors), but as 1892 in this page, evidently in Panzram's own hand. I haven't read the book in a several years; maybe this discrepancy is addressed therein. I'm guessing he simply didn't know his own birth year, due to his limited education and rough upbringing by poor and probably even less educated immigrant parents, who he describes as "ignorant." He describes himself as "too dumb to learn anything," but his handwriting is legible and spelling decent if imperfect, so he evidently leaned something in the time he attended school. One might expect him to know his own birth year. Anyway, it's a minor puzzle that I thought was worth mentioning. Perhaps a more authoritative source will appear. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.105.246.237 (talk) 03:21, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

His birth date was June 28, 1892, handwritten by Carl Panzram in his own papers at SDSU Special Collections. Filmmakerjohnb (talk) 18:50, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Strange Sentence
This is a very well written article apart from one odd sentence in the lead, i.e.: "In graphic detail, Panzram confesses to 21 murderes (22 after confession), and a over 1,000 sodomy's on male humans." I kind of get the gist of it... but it sounds like it has been written by someone whose grasp of English isn't so great. Could someone who knows exactly what they mean rewrite? 88.111.128.18 (talk) 23:43, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

Irrelevant link in external links
"Is this what you're looking for?" keeps appearing in the external links section. It is an irrelevant link.

Injury during escape attept
In Carl Panzram: The Spirit of Hatred and Revenge (2011) it was stated that during an escape attempt, Carl Panzram injured his spine and broke his legs and was given no medical attention for these injuries. This seems like important information, because this would have caused him a lot of physical pain for the remainder of his life. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.61.40.188 (talk) 01:24, 21 April 2013 (UTC)

"One neck" quotation
The remark about wishing "the entire human race had one neck, and he had his hands around it" is actually a quotation. Panzram may not have been aware of its origins, but it was originally attributed (in Suetonius' "Lives of the Caesars") to the Roman Emperor Caligula ("Would that the Roman people had but one neck!"). It shows up, much later, in Oscar Wilde's play "Vera; or, The Nihilists" (1880), where it is paraphrased and attributed to the Czar of Russia (in the play, the line is: "I would to God that this people had but one neck that I might strangle them"). --- Peterravn (talk) 00:31, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Gay?
He raped over 1,000 men---all political correctness aside, shouldn't he be categorized as gay/LGBT?Dozzzzzzzzzing off (talk) 00:24, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
 * No. Why should he? I also removed the lgbr cat. Regards, Hermodhr (talk) 10:14, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Why shouldn't he?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:CFA2:6980:1594:155C:5DBC:DF1 (talk) 16:49, 19 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Maybe he could be categorized as gay, although this is a little bit beside the point. Most serial killers attack prostitutes (male and female), homeless folks, little kids, vulnerable person. It goes beyond sexuality, these are target of opportunity. And Panzram was surrounded with mostly men, be it in jail or as a hobo. In africa he went after under-aged girls for some reasons (he had the opportunity). Commasavoy (talk) 22:18, 26 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Asking for it on this entry is to ask it on every entry containing repeated or exclusive sodomy and/or male on male rape. Strangely (or not should you live in a cave) such requests are absent from nearly every page on correctional facilities where male inmates claim rape, abuse and sodomy by male guards. Such as each and every facility Carl Panzram was sent to. 73.188.142.252 (talk) 13:01, 16 July 2022 (UTC)

Incorrect Dates
Date of birth says June 28, 1891. The first date in date apprehended says 1899, which would make him 8-9 years old. Early life says "First sign of criminal activity occurred when he was 12". I am going to correct the first date apprehended. 95.45.113.179 (talk) 21:17, 3 August 2014 (UTC)
 * I would suggest consulting the sources rather than using the dates already in the article for this. - - MrBill3 (talk) 22:01, 3 August 2014 (UTC)

Confirmed murders
Besides the acessory killing of Minto and his last killing of Warnke, Panzram murders that can be confirmed are: George Henry McMahon in MAss in 1922; ; a "John Doe" in Conn in 1923 ; Alexander Lusszock and Alexander Uszacke in Philadelphia in 1923 and 1928. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.102.156.37 (talk) 14:22, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

Panzram himself refers to killing 21, yet the article refers to more than that.Royalcourtier (talk) 20:26, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Its possible that Lusszock and Uszacke are mistakes for the same person-both 14 years old; both residents of Philadelphia and both killed by Panzram. Likewise after his last arrest in 1929 Panzram claimed to have committed a murder in Texas in 1910: In the winter of 1910 after serving a short sentence at Rusk, Texas Panzram claimed that he went to Juarez, Mexico to try to enlist in the Mexican Federal Army; he then left on a train for Del Rio, Texas and got off at a small town 50 to 100 miles east of El Paso, Texas where about a mile south of that town he allegedly abducted, assaulted, kicked and strangled a man and stole #35.00 from his victim. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.5.88.36 (talk) 12:09, 21 August 2016 (UTC)

LGBT categories
I don't think that he should be put into the LGBT categories simply because he primarily attacked men. Rape is about control and power, not sexual desire. I'm removing the LGBT categories. Asarelah (talk)

Execution Rocks Lighthouse
I am trying to find proof that he dumped his bodies near Execution Rocks Lighthouse. He was based at City Island and said, "Then I would take a rope and tie a rock on them and put them into my row boat, row out in the main channel about 1 mile and drop 'em over board. They are there yet, 10 of 'em". Looking at the maps, Stepping Stones lighthouse is much closer (about 1 mile) from City Island, whereas Execution Rocks is close to 4 miles away. Rowing 8 miles there and back from City Island in a busy channel at night seems very unlikely. It seems he never explicitly mentions Execution Rocks, and it seems much more likely it is Stepping Stones.

https://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/nas/streaming/dept/scuastaf/collections/Panzram/Panzram-Box01Folder03.pdf 24.45.196.39 (talk) 17:07, 23 July 2022 (UTC)

Bad sources, much is alleged or just fantasy
Many sources have 0 backing. Some are even private blog links. Some are just links to Google or Bing search. Much of this info is based on creative writing exercises it seems. If the info is non verifiable it should be labeled as such and not as fact. 2600:1700:2054:190:3D72:85C8:2EC8:2748 (talk) 18:05, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Carl Panzram


text:
P. C. Sorcar

Protul Chandra Sorcar (23 February 1913 – 6 January 1971) was an Indian magician. He was an internationally active magician throughout the 1950s and 1960s, performing his Indrajal show before live audiences and on television. Sorcar died of a heart attack at the age of 57 in Asahikawa, Hokkaidō, Japan, on 6 January 1971, where he was performing. P.C. Sorcar is known also as P.C. Sorcar Senior (as his son P.C. Sorcar Jr. also performs under the same name), is renowned as "Father of Modern Indian Magic".

Career
At the age of 21, Sorcar decided to give up formal education (he was likely to study to become an engineer), and decided to become a conjuror despite the profession's low esteem in India.

Sorcar became famous in the mid-1930s, when he performed shows in Kolkata and also in Japan and several other countries. Among other routines, he performed a Floating Lady routine featuring aerial suspension in 1964. Ganapati Chakraborty was his mentor.

In 1956, he performed the sawing a woman in half illusion on the BBC's Panorama program. When he performed it on live television, it drew huge attention in the United Kingdom because the climax made it appear as though the women had actually been cut in half and died, which caused a public panic.

His self-appointed title was "The World's Greatest Magician".

Sorcar died in Japan in 1971.

Personal life
Sorcar was married to Basanti Devi. They were the parents of the animator, director and laserist Manick Sorcar and magicians P. C. Sorcar Jr. and P. C. Sorcar, Young.

Awards

 * Jadusamrat P.C. Sorcar Sarani The Government of India has named a major street in Calcutta after him
 * Padma Shri (the Lotus), awarded by the President of India on 26 January 1964
 * The Sphinx (Oscar of Magic), US, 1946 and 1954
 * The Royal Medallion, German Magic Circle

Postage stamp
On 23 February 2010, India Post issued a commemorative stamp to honour him.

Publications

 * Magic for You (1966)
 * More Magic for You (1965)
 * History of Magic (1970)
 * Indian Magic (1983)

title: P. C. Sorcar


text:
Talk:Citrus Springs, Florida

What is going on in and around Citrus Springs that has resulted in several mailings to me offering to purchase my lots for large sums of money, much more than they were worth just a couple of years ago?

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title: Talk:Citrus Springs, Florida


text:
Chanson d'Antioche

The Chanson d'Antioche is a chanson de geste in 9000 lines of Alexandrin in stanzas called laisses, now known in a version composed about 1180 for a courtly French audience and embedded in a quasi-historical cycle of epic poems inspired by the events of 1097–99, the climax of the First Crusade: the conquest of Antioch and of Jerusalem and the origins of the Crusader states. The Chanson was later reworked and incorporated in an extended Crusade cycle, of the 14th century, which was far more fabulous and embroidered, more distinctly romance than epic.

The subject is the preaching of the First Crusade, the preparations for departure, the tearful goodbyes, the arrival at Constantinople and the siege of Antioch of 1097–1098.

The lost original poem was said to have been composed by an eye-witness, Richard le Pèlerin, (Richard the Pilgrim), a North French or Flemish jongleur, who began it partly on the spot, during the eight-month siege of Antioch. The oldest version now known was recast by Graindor de Douai, a contemporary of Louis VII of France. Graindor borrowed details from the chroniclers to make his work more lively and more accurate, for his object from the start was to tell the true praiseworthy tale, not cozen his listeners of their coin:

 * Seignor, oïés canchon, qui moult fait à loer
 * Par itel convenant la vos puis-je conter...
 * Je ne vous vorrai mie mensonges raconter
 * Ne fables, ne paroles pour vos deniers embler
 * Ains vous dirai canchon où il n'a hamender
 * Del barnage de Franche qui tant fait à loer!

Such claims of truth-telling are part of the poet's epic repertory. Hyperbole and epic lists are other major features in this chanson: the poet takes care to mention every knightly name that would cause a rustle of recognition among his hearers, in a tradition as old as Homer, with the result that the Chanson d'Antioche was taken as history by heralds and genealogists of a later generation. In some of its details it has won the admiration of modern historians (see links).

Crusade cycles had a wide medieval audience: free translations and versions of the Chanson d'Antioche appeared in Old Occitan, Spanish, English, Dutch, and German.

The Chanson d'Antioche was forgotten, until it was printed and published in 1848 by Alexis Paulin Paris, at the height of the Romantic Gothic Revival. The most recent edition is "The Chanson d'Antioch: An Old French Account of the French Crusade," translated by Susan Eddington and Carol Sweetenham. New York: Routledge, 2011.

title: Chanson d'Antioche


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Wikipedia talk:Articles for deletion/Special Weapons Dalek

I understand the Special Weapons Dalek page is poorly made, but it can be editted rather than deleted. Instead of deleting it, may I suggest that it be merged with Remembrance Of The Daleks rather than delete the entry. After all, the Special Weapons Dalek has appeared in several Doctor Who books, and I believe that these can count towards its fame rather than TV appearances.


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SASE

SASE may refer to:

 * Society for the Advancement of Socio-Economics, an academic association based in the US, founded in 1989 by Amitai Etzioni.
 * Sarajevo Stock Exchange, in Bosnia and Herzegovina
 * Secure access service edge, a networking and security technology
 * Self-addressed stamped envelope, used for expediting a reply via mail
 * Self-amplified spontaneous emission, a process by which a laser beam is created
 * Snow and Avalanche Study Establishment, a laboratory of the India Defence Research & Development Organization
 * Specific application service element, in the OSI computer networking model

title: SASE