text:
Talk:Duck and cover

Speed of Sound?
"the exact time of arrival being dependent on the speed of sound in air in their area"

A "shock wave" is, by definition, faster than sound. I'm not sure that the speed of sound has anything to do with how fast the blast from a nuclear explosion reaches you.

Does the speed of sound really differ that much from place to place? I think that other factors are far more important than the speed of sound in determining how quickly a shockwave will arrive. 198.24.6.155 (talk) 17:18, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

In response to some of the chatter here, a great many people in Hiroshima and Nagasaki survived. It is not impossible to survive a nuclear attack. Getting behind something as fast as you can is better than doing nothing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.194.160.37 (talk) 08:54, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

Those wacky Americans
Duck and cover... glad to see American intelligence was the same back in the fifties as it is now.

-G

It was used more as fodder to keep people from being upset that if a bomb WERE to drop, chances of survival would be pretty slim.

-- Liz —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.81.207.88 21:12, 13 June 2007 (talk • contribs)

Oh yeah, G, you think you're all so "superior" over the (U.S.-)Americans, don't you? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.213.0.154 (talk) 08:24, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

In fact this strategy must works where you will need to improvise. The first danger by a nuclear weapons is the shock effect, if you duck and cover your chances to survives are high, not for the radioactive protection (yes but a little) but for earthquakes, flying debris (mainly glasses and broken windows) and for protect of the shock. Before the shock effect you must look some shelter, you will have from 7h-9h to do it before the fallout... and if you can obtain a secure shelter then you must survive at least 2-3 weeks inside it. This will be the worst part ^__^

The another options is to run (opposing to the wind) and pray for the wind don't change the direction.

Even when duck and cover is a simplist way to say it, it's a effective way to explain the most common oportunity. Of course is way better to be inside a 1meter-leaded shelter with a suply of air, food and such but for many people we will be very short of options.

--Magallanes 01:13, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
 * The fact of the matter is, if you have time to react after seeing the flash, then you are most likely *not* in the complete destruction zone, so duck and cover is sound advice. Regardless of liberal spin, it was and still is a worthy idea. Gigs (talk) 02:25, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Most of the reactions to this are demonstrated by the comments, they boil down to European's/G's comment: "Haha, stupid Americans obviously ducking and covering will not save you from an atomic bomb if it lands on your head!! ROFL" (No one said it would) or for the modern American elitist: "LOL look how dumb teh peoples back in 1950s was they think stpuid things lik this will save them" (Learn how to spell). The introduction to the article needs to be changed. It's worthy noting that the idea is now satirized in popular culture, but which experts are saying that it's worthless and served only to spread paranoia? I'd like to see these experts stand with their entire body exposed to even a distant atomic explosion instead of ducking behind a wall. Otherwise the summary should accurately describe the article, because right now the summary says its a silly idea, and the body says it is not such a bad idea 130.71.241.182 (talk) 07:28, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ While most people of the world do not consider themselves superior to the people of the USA - your government, MSM and Power Elites clearly do. Otherwise, the powers-that-be would never have produced a film supporting nuclear war. With a very minimum of 20 million dead, does anyone here believe that to Duck and Cover would protect them from the long-term effects of fallout from a 'limited' nuclear attack? 84.13.14.75 (talk) 15:44, 3 August 2014 (UTC) ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

-
The "assessment" is preposterous. It's entirely a cynical, revisionist, post-Vietnam spin on history. It is indisputable that g, like "Duck and Cover" was part of some insidious plot to instill fear of the ever-harmless Soviet Union and had no practical value, this section needs to be fundamentally changed. --ArminTamzarian 09:46, 30 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * That's absurd. Cite a single source. Do you even understand basic physics? Shards of glass, flying debris, gamma rays (would be 50% blocked by a brick wall). The basic laws of physics are not cynical propaganda, they are facts. 130.71.241.182 (talk) 07:34, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Harmless, you say? I've got three words: Cuban. Missle. Crisis. They may have not attacked, but those missles were armed. How could you miss that? I dare you, right now, to find a citation of your statements. Also, define "pointy item", then define "flying at high speeds", and look at your skin after a paper cut. Next, look at a desk or a brick wall and hit it. Hit it hard. Then, should you dare, try throwing glass at it. Then shoot it with a B-B gun. Desks and walls are harder than skin, "ArminTamzarian", that is rather obvious. TurtleShroom! :) †Jesus Loves You and Died for you!† 21:49, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm assuming by the phrasing "to instill fear of the ever-harmless Soviet Union", that instead of meaning this sincerely, you are engaging in sarcasm. For myself, while I think this article is a very objective assessment of the potential value of the "Duck and Cover" technique in certain situations, this article did not answer the questions I had which caused me to seek it out. Having first heard of "duck and cover drills" from discussion of the movie Atomic Cafe when it came out, I wanted to find out during what years such drills were carried out in American schools, and in which states. Quadibloc (talk) 04:07, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

CD drills vs. fire drills in schools
I grew up on Patrick Air Force Base, the military supply and defense command for Cape Canaveral, during the Cuban missile crisis.

One reason the drills were discontinued was that elementary school children could not distinguish between civil defense drills and fire drills. Imagine a fire where all the kids hid under desks and in bathrooms. The schools involved were Patrick Elementary School and Spessard Holland Elementary school in Brevard County, Florida.

References to paranoia are wrong. There was a real threat to the safety of many Americans. The fear of nuclear attack was not illogical, projective or imaginary to Floridians during the Kennedy administration. Slang usage of psychiatric terms is best avoided in any case.

There is much opinion throughout that needs to be objectified, linked and sourced. In paragraph 2, the critics are unnamed yet "paranoia" is no sopressure groups. --Bonarien 00:09, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

merge?
Anyone want to speak to the merge issue? Tedernst 22:35, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
 * No. I created and worked very hard on the film article, and so did many others. If something is important enough to be in the National Film Registry, it deserves its own article. :) -Litefantastic 04:35, 13 November 2005 (UTC)
 * True that.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.47.128.202 (talk) 19:39, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Inane
If anything, this article is too fair and objective. I grew up in L.A. during the Seventies, and we had these drills quite frequently. As early as in the third grade we knew what a farce it was. One day, I recall, as our teacher was giving us the routine "in the event of an emergency" talk, some kid suddenly yelled out, laughing, "You mean if the Russkies nuke us?" The woman immediately snapped back, "I didn't say that," because of course they were under instructions not to "traumatize" us poor tykes. Complete dissociation from reality. Everyone knew that a nuclear attack would make us instant crispy critters. Hence: "In the event of a nuclear attack, get under the desk, cover your head with your hands, and kiss your ass goodbye."
 * Duck and cover makes sense. Of course if you are standing 10' from the bomb you will be disintegrated, but further away it will increase your chances of survival. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.225.134.150 (talk • contribs) 18:47, 18 June
 * "Everyone" knew wrong then. Kids always think they're so clever and know better then adults, nothing new there. People at my high school had similar attitudes about tornado and earthquake drills "Well if a HUGE tornado comes through here we'll all be dead anyway." 130.71.241.182 (talk) 07:37, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Highly doubtful that you were doing this drill in the 70s in LA - was abandoned long before that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.158.61.140 (talk) 18:35, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually, in Southern California the nuclear era 'desk hiding' was rolled into new earthquake preparedness procedures so it's not uncommon for children to confuse the two. Loud sirens, flashing lights, teachers' raised voices, children under desks, practised quarterly. I was a school child in the 60s and 70s. --Mensch (talk) 15:34, 16 October 2020 (UTC)

West Coast only?
I entered first grade in suburban Boston in 1971... to my knowledge, no Boston-area schoolchild ever heard of this in the 1970s. Surely this was phased out most everywhere in the U.S. by the early 1960s? --Wlindley 23:51, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

"citation needed"
with those, having one after each sentence. Can we drop at least some of those, please? It's heavily distracting.

In U.S. Army basic training in the 1970s, soldiers were taught to fall immediately down, covering face and hands and using their bodies to shield their weapons from the heat of the blast.[citation needed]

This citation needed should be dropped. It's still actively taught in Marine Corps Basic Training. Pick up any Basic Instruction manual and you'll be able to find it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.46.56.34 (talk) 19:51, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

Unique?
I'm very surprised by ridiculous claim that this is something "unique" to USA. I remember vividly "Civil Defense" days at elementary school, when we practiced "lay down and cover" with raincoats and plastic bags (to cover hands and feet). "Remember - always feet towards epicentre!"

Unfortunately, I have no evidence aside my own memory from late 1980s Czechoslovakia. Podlesh 21:58, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

 * After the meteor of 2012, a news story came out about Yulia Karbysheva, a fourth-grade teacher in Chelyabinsk, who remembered her old cold war drills. When she saw a bright flash in the sky she had her class take shelter under their desks -- so when the shockwave blew in the windows not a single child was hurt. (Ms. Karbysheva remained standing and took a piece of glass in her arm.) Not only was it taught over there, it worked! http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/17/world/europe/russians-seek-clues-and-count-blessings-after-meteor-blast.html?_r=0 Wyvern (talk) 22:56, 14 August 2013 (UTC)

Masonic Eye
Just watched this video and was intrigued by the image used after the credits. It's attached. This looks very similar to the All Seeing Eye, which I know is frequently brought up in conspiracy theories and stuff like that. Anyway, is there a spot for this observation on this page? I don't really know anything about it beyond the fact that it is there.

Hendo1769 20:21, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

 * I don't think so. The triangle in a circle had been the Civil Defense logo since 1951 and is the international symbol. I wouldn't put that on the page. --GABaker 20:27 11 November 2007 (UTC)

 * Fair enough. Thanks. Hendo1769 22:25, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

In Defense of Ducking and Covering (and other things...)
It makes me really sad that people criticize the whole "duck and cover" tactic.

I also think that the "in popular culture" section should be taken down. That, or changed to "list of media spoofs and insults", or something like that.

I hate that section; it's nothing but a list of people and shows that all call the ideal stupid. It's not informative, it's not very encyclopedic, and it is very Biased. I'm not a politically correct person, but the section in question really does violate the "Wikipedia is Neutral" policy. There is nothing neutral about a list of people and shows calling it stupid. It sways opinions.

Really, all that does is fuel the belief that the whole protection theory is ludicrous, and I hate that. To all of you "superiors" and mockers, I bet that if any bomb, not just a nuclear type, exploded, you too would jump under a desk or cower in your cellar, "ducking and covering" just like everyone else. So, unless you have somehow survived an explosive and seen exactly what happens, I would wait and give criticism when criticism is due. That, or do some serious reading.

This isn't just a paranoid video, either.

In the 1950s, WWII just ended, and the Hiroshima and Nagasaki explosions were still fresh in every one's minds. Russia (then the USSR) was starting to build its nuke-arsenal, and the Cold War was just around the corner.

People lived in fear that a war might break out at any time, and the Air Raid system was established for this reason. In the Blitz of WWII, people in England often had to duck and cover, be in basements or otherwise, to avoid being blasted sky high by Nazi bombers. This tactic is also employed in tornado drills, and I have actually done it for actual tornado purposes. For your information, I have seen, first handed, people saved by this tactic in severe weather, and I've read about it in earthquakes. I say that you need to read. Also, if you've ever heard of "Cuban Missle Crisis", perhaps it would make sense... especially in Florida, where I happen to have some friends living.

On the subject of nukes, however, you have somewhat of a point. Anyone too close to an Atomic Bomb will instantly be vaporized, with no hope of survival. Anyone near the fall-out (the zone where radiation sickness occurs) region will suffer a similar fate of radiation sickness.

Yet, if you have ever watched a video of a nuclear weapon exploding, you will notice how blinding it is, and the wall of dust flying outward. This is where ducking and covering comes in handy.

You see, the "flash" mentioned in this video is in fact the blinding light of the bomb undergoing fission. Though the mushroom cloud itself is huge, the fall-out region is enormous, and the light can be seen for miles. Whenever a massive explosion or collision happens, it will send out a high speed, pressurized wall of air and debris with it. This is called a "shock wave", and its force can literally blow off windows and tear down houses without any actual help from the bomb itself. It comes before the bomb, and extends far from the mushroom cloud's reach. It is highly destructive in its own right.

The "flash" can also blind any of its unlucky viewers. Have any of you ever stared at the sun? If you look at it for too long, you can damage your eyes. Now, a nuclear bomb's flash is much brighter than the sun for an instant or so. It will blind in seconds.

Where does ducking and covering come into this?

Okay. Let's think. When a shard of glass comes your way at high speeds, what would happen? That's right! It would slice you to bits!

Now, if that same shard of glass hit something thick and/or heavy, say... a wall or a desk you are taking shelter in or under, it would collide with the item, and if it managed to penetrate, said projectile would do less damage than if you were out in the open.

I learned in elementary school that covering your face and neck, as well as putting something heavy on top of you, would prevent the ceiling from killing you instantly, or being guillotined from a beam falling from above. It would hurt severely, and you may lose a hand, a leg, or get paralyzed, but would you rather be in an Emergency Room or in a grave?

By getting away from windows and attempting to seek shelter, your chance of surviving would greatly increase.

In the case of a bomb, it's location, location, location. If you are within the blast range or the fall-out, of course you would die. If you are far enough away to survive vaporization or radiation sickness or cancer, that shock wave could still get you.

Before you criticize it, try using some common sense. Anyone who would want a chance of survival would seek some kind of shelter. It's logic!

I would say "duh", but this is an encyclopedia.

I kind of feel like making a userbox that says "this user believes that ducking and covering may save lives", and link it to the actual article (not the talk page).

I believe I've spoken my point, TurtleShroom! :) †Jesus Loves You and Died for you!† 21:39, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Ok. The assessment is simply misleading. "Within a considerable radius—depending on the explosion's height and yield—ducking and covering would offer negligible protection against the intense heat, shock waves, and radiation following a nuclear explosion." Negligible meaning not practically different than doing nothing. Source here: Real life example Hiroshima destructive radius of total destruction 1 mile, Closest known survivor Akiko Takakura 300M from ground 0 saved by the building she was in. But the entry of Yoshitaka Kawamoto should stand the most testament. He was only a kilometer away from ground 0, well within the total destruction zone, meaning he had approximately 3 seconds between the visible explosion and the arrival of the blast. A number of his classmates survive the collapse of the school. To give you an idea, at 1km radius blast area is about 3km2 at 1 mile radius blast area is about 8km2 meaning that more of the area WITHIN the radius of total destruction was as far or further out than Kawamoto and his classmates. All of the people in that area potentially benefit from "Duck and Cover". And that is just the total destruction zone, the light damage zone is much much larger such that the entirety of the total destruction zone (less than half of which is practicably unsurvivable) makes up only about 10% of the area of the blast. So think about that, in a dense population center, OVER 90% of the people potentially effected by the nuclear blast would benefit from "Duck and Cover"

Considering the total destruction radius is less than a third of the blast radius, and more than 90% of the effected area benefits from "Duck and Cover" The statement "Within a considerable radius..." is misleading to the point of either being deliberately deceptive or so uniformed about explosions and their effects that they should steer clear of writing about them.

Unless someone responds with a serious, scientifically based cite in the next couple of days, I will change the opening of this assessment to be more realistic. Yes I did work in the nuclear weapons business.

Next, unless someone can cite me a pole showing most people believe that the purpose behind the civil exercises was "less practical use than psychological use to keep the danger of nuclear war high on the public mind" I will change the opening of that sentence from "The exercises of civil defense are now seen" to "Some people now believe the civil defense exercises "

Mikethemoose (talk) 06:30, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Parody
I can't remeber how it went, but there was a popular parady that ended "and put your head between your knees and kiss your ass goodbye".

It would be interesting to have a section about the paradys in the article.

Wendingwanderer (talk) 07:26, 24 January 2009 (UTC)WendingWanderer

 * I agree. I have two more Soviet jokes:
 * - What should a Soviet soldier do in an event of a nuclear explosion near?
 * - To stand up and keep his rifle in front of him on outstretched arms, to prevent the red-hot iron from dripping on his state boots!
 * and
 * - What should I do after the blast?
 * - First duck yourself, cover with a white sheet and slowly crawl to the cemetery!
 * - Why "slowly"??
 * - So you wouldn't create panic among others!
 * --Yuriy Lapitskiy ~ 17:06, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

duck and cover needs a realistic appraisal
The radiological defense book I had access to in the late 1950s detailed effects of actual atomic bomb tests (early 1950s 20 kiloton range) on material and personnel. Some of the nukes in todays arsenals are that size down to 0.5 kilotons. Not all nukes are megaton city-busters and those are actually hard to deliver. But for 1949 to 1954: Nuclear explosions in the actual tests were not instant universal destruction. At sufficient distance and sometimes with minimal cover material survived. It seems insane that they had soldiers in some of those tests, but soldiers who ducked-and-covered in trenches surprisingly near the test sites survived. The preferred tactic for maximum material damage--air burst--generally sent the radioactive material into the stratosphere so blast and heat were bigger problems that radioactive fallout. Scoffing at duck-and-cover as a first response to nuclear attack is as unrealistic as saying no point in building a tornado shelter, no one can resist a Force Five tornado. Naaman Brown (talk) 18:13, 23 August 2009 (UTC)
 * A nuclear attack on Los Angeles for example would target the military bases, not the elementary schools.
 * Schools and similar civilian concentrations would generally be miles from the military targets.
 * For blast (flying glass or debris) and heat, duck-and-cover at first flash actually would be a practical defense.

Technically speaking if you are in a tornado shelter and you take a direct hit from a category 5 tornado you are dead no matter what Puma6374 (talk) 21:17, 26 October 2020 (UTC)

Latest U.S. gov't policy:
The New York Times today has a good article about the current U.S. policy; it's not too far from this one. Might be a good article to use. --Bobak (talk) 18:28, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Which is it?
This article states: "assume the fetal position, lying face-down and covering their heads with their hands" Which is it? The fetal position doesn't even resemble "covering their heads with their hands" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.158.61.140 (talk) 18:40, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Intergrated classrooms
The movie shows intergrated classrooms in 1951 with black and white students in the same classroom. While this may have been somewhat common in Northern cities, it would be unheard of in Southern cities. I wonder if a different version was produced for showing in the Southern states? Seki1949 (talk) 15:33, 19 July 2012 (UTC)

Miscellanea
I came here to mention the fact that a lot of POV-pushers have infiltrated this article in an interesting way. There is a lot of blather and fluff that needs rewriting and purging. But I am torn as to how to see this subject even now.

Not too long ago I was reading up about the effects of nuclear weapons. Add to this the facts versus the inevitable propaganda and hype associated with this topic. Nuclear warfare quickly touches political and conspiratorial views, plus societal and emotional sentiments, with a smattering of logic, scientific debate, and the occasional esoteric platitude thrown in for good measure. Yeah, well, so I am stricken by the latter in this case.

It would seem that regardless of the many things you and I know about the effects of nuclear weapons, the truth of the matter is that they can be a lot more bark than bite. Now, I am not trying to minimize the real danger of them, but I think that there is a legitimate discussion to be had about how a nuclear weapon would damage a modern, industrial target.

Recall that the proponents of the bomb always intended them to be used against industrial targets. Yeah, the silly capitalists wanted to target, uh, the infrastructure of capitalism: the city that manufactures products that are in turn necessary for waging war. In today's world the developed nations are producing most of their products in and around city centers, or at least that is where they warehouse and distribute them. So the Bomb needs to be dropped on a city for maximum effectiveness against an enemy state.

The problem is this. A modern city is made of virtually indestructible buildings... reinforced concrete, blocks, bricks, etc. Obviously there are many steel-framed buildings, too, and some of the concrete is poorly designed, but those are considerable stronger than a typical stick-frame house like the one shown on this page. Keep in mind that hospitals and schools are very likely to be some of the strongest buildings in town.

With that background, understand that a lot of work was done estimating the effects of a bomb blast. Stage left: Enter the films of blast waves hitting mock-up homes, people, animals, and trees. Yea for the scientists, they have their blast curves! Let's print them and give them out to the weapons designers and the folks aiming the missiles. The problem is going to be a shock... The blast curves are not accurate; they overstate the amount of damage done to modern cities because they neglect the shielding effect of structures.

There was really no major push to consider the fortification and protection afforded by modern buildings. The blast curves and practically every bomb that was ever test are geared for deserts, tropical islands, and uninproved land. There is no consideration given for the fact that buildings will tend to shield and protect people inside and people and facilities further from ground zero.

Now, this won't be much of a comfort to anyone directly below a blast or someone outside and within the true kill radius. But there is some unknown factor which will greatly attenuate blasts that are inside a modern city, making the likely effects less severe for a great number of people who might be within the kill radius of a bomb dropped on a desert. And so the bombs are more survivable that the hype would suggest, especially at the fringes.

The issue now becomes how a person reacts to the initial flash of light. As much as I might laugh and wryly joke about Duck and Cover hysteria, I am becoming convinced that it does serve a legitimate purpose in a survivable bomb situation. Yeah, there will be vaporized people, and blown away people, and third-degree burn people, and even a few radiation sick people. But there are going to be those who might potentially survive a blast wave with this type of simple counter-measure.

I just wish the POV was left out of the article. While I may be able to write convincing one way or the other, I know that the issue needs to be scrutinized, even agonizingly so, in a way the permits alternative conclusions. I like to saw logs! (talk) 01:24, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

Agree with the above, and would like to suggest improvements. I came to the page interested in duck-and-cover in terms of the broader debate on nuclear weapons/policy. I had no idea the technique is useful. At the same time, those who mock the technique have a potentially valid point of view in that the publicizing of the technique may have had some political effects, that is, in discouraging anti-nuclear opinions among some U.S. citizens (and maybe elsewhere). Certainly, the anti-nuclear movement made extensive political use of the matter. I realize wikipedia is an encyclopedia, and pop culture aspects must be controlled. In this case, however, duck-and-cover has had a huge presence in pop culture/politics. For example, I don't remember being taught the technique when in school (1970s New England), and given the info here, I assume that's because the matter had become politicized, thus it was much easier to retire the drills, especially given declining concern regarding nuclear attack (and the lack of tornadoes in that region). Readers who are strongly anti-nuclear weapons might not read the page far enough to learn anything. I'd recommend an earlier statement to the effect that criticism of the technique was partly due to a misperception as to its aims, following by a link to a separate section or page about the contested politics of duck and cover. That section/page should include some of the more prominent pop culture references. ProfessorAndro (talk) 20:41, 16 March 2017 (UTC)

Hiroshima Book citation?
I believe the paragraph that mentions the book Hiroshima (John Hersey) is incorrect. I just read through the book and no where does it mention police going to Nagasaki to train them about the duck and cover technique. 2 possiblites...I can't read and it needs a proper citation, or it's not real information and needs to be taken off. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.151.152.127 (talk) 03:27, 10 October 2013 (UTC)

 * Hmm, what copy do you have, as there is also the magazine version, maybe the person who wrote that paragraph was referring to that, or maybe they were referring to the USSBS: US strategic bombing survey, reports?
 * 86.44.239.203 (talk) 08:56, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

Shelter in place
Shelter in place (SAME code: SPW) is the use of a structure and its indoor atmosphere to temporarily separate individuals from a hazardous outdoor atmosphere. It entails closing all household doors, windows and vents and taking immediate shelter in a readily accessible location, such as a basement or central medium to small room, and trying to make it as airtight as possible by shutting off all ventilation/HVAC systems and extensively sealing the shelter's doors and windows from all outside air contaminants with damp towels, or if available, plastic sheeting and adhesive tape. Diagrams of what sheltering in place entails following a (CBRN)Chemical, biological, radiological or nuclear threat, and how long it is advised to be done for, is provided by the FEMA affiliated website ready.gov.

Shelter-in-place effectiveness has been evaluated and experimental results show that proper sealing can make a substantial difference to a normal home shelter, finding it to be at least twice as effective against a host of airborne substances when compared against simply staying inside and not implementing the countermeasure, and in most airborne contaminant cases, it is usually much more effective, depending on the particle size of the substance in question. If the occupant's breathing produced carbon dioxide is the only consumer of oxygen in the room then carbon dioxide levels would not begin to reach dangerous values until 3+ hours had passed, in all likely, 4 family home, scenarios.

In the military, "Shelter-in-Place" is comparable to "buttoning up" and has proved life saving in many instances.

If an individual finds themselves outside during an emergency that calls for shelter-in-place, then effective but low-tech decontamination is required before entering into the shelter.

In practice, depending on the exact situation, everyone within a specific distance of the airborne incident may be ordered to shelter in place or people within a closer range may be ordered to evacuate while everyone else shelters in place to minimize public exposure as much as possible. Sheltering in place is generally only used for a short period of time, typically a few hours. However it can be extended if the occupants are equipped with common drain cleaner that contains sodium hydroxide- which is an effective carbon dioxide scrubber in addition to self contained oxygen candles or the more common welding Oxygen tanks, both of which also have the added benefit of producing and maintaining a shelter positive pressure which keeps any shelter leaks, leaking out rather than leaking in.

The phrase has also erroneously been used, instead of the more accurate lockdown, to describe precautions to be taken by the public when violence has occurred or might occur (particularly in shootings) in the area and the perpetrator is believed to still be in the area but not apprehended. The public in the area is advised to carry out all the same tasks as a typical shelter-in-place but without the key step of sealing the shelter up to prevent outside air from circulating indoors, in this scenario people are simply urged to lockdown - stay indoors and "close, lock and stay away from external doors and windows."

flash blindness & shelter effectiveness

 * "Children were lying around with their hands covering their eyes as if they were playing hide-and-seek." Some mention to flash blindness is needed. Many people who experience a flash may be blinded and thus have to "Duck"/drop flat to the ground while temporarily blind.
 * Possibly Isamu Inoue, but definitely Shizue Jinno ran into air raid shelter/blast shelters when they heard the B-29 and/or air raid siren overhead at Nagasaki, and survived.
 * http://www.asahi.com/hibakusha/english/shimen/happened/happened-02-2.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.41.239.213 (talk) 21:15, 11 March 2014 (UTC)

There's been improvements made by various IP users to the Lucky Dragon 5 & Kuwait oil fires articles recently that might be worth considering. 92.251.133.92 (talk) 11:42, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

article suggestions
That duck and cover has its origins in advice given to soldiers and civilians during, and probably prior to, WWII. To reduce the lethality of conventional bombs and bombing, and that just like nuclear bombs, conventional bombs similarly have various probability of killing/lethality zones for standing adult males/soldiers in the open at particular distances.

Although conventional bombs are limited in energy when compared to nuclear weapons, due to the unlikelihood that a nuclear weapon would be detonated directly beside the individual, but some distance away, the duck and cover countermeasure has greater efficacy under a nuclear attack scenario than a conventional strategic bombing - as the space of time between observing first light, being stunned in surprise by the explosion and the arrival of potentially lethal blast and flash burn effects is sufficiently long to permit a slower reaction response time from first light to completing a duck and cover maneuver.

The psychological sense of awe from observing a large, and oft described as beautiful,[chicago ref & others] explosion is chief amongst the distractions that usually prevent individuals from hitting the deck immediately, particularly so for megaton class explosions.

What countries was it taught in, for how long & how frequent?
We have indirect evidence that Duck and Cover was taught at some point in time to those who are 20 and older in Russia, due to the response of Yulia at Chelyabinsk in 2013. There is also a prior Czechoslovakia wiki user here in the talk page archive that describes the advice also being given in that former Soviet republic.

According to this alleged 1950-60s child, the film was shown roughly every year in the 1960s and although he's not very clear on this latter bit, but they appeared to practice fire drills weekly and perhaps rolled duck and cover practice up with the fire drill.

Real aim of Duck and Cover was to protect nuclear policy
“Now then, Dmitri, you know how we've always talked about the possibility of something going wrong with the Bomb... The *Bomb*, Dmitri... The *hydrogen* bomb!... Well now, what happened is... ahm... one of our base commanders, he had a sort of... well, he went a little funny in the head... you know... just a little... funny. And, ah... he went and did a silly thing... Well, I'll tell you what he did. He ordered his planes... to attack your country... Ah... Well, let me finish, Dmitri... Let me finish, Dmitri... Well listen, how do you think I feel about it?... Can you *imagine* how I feel about it, Dmitri?... Why do you think I'm calling you? Just to say hello?... *Of course* I like to speak to you!... *Of course* I like to say hello!... Not now, but anytime, Dmitri. I'm just calling up to tell you something terrible has happened... It's a *friendly* call. Of course it's a friendly call..." (See how long before some nuclear war supporter takes this down)

84.13.14.75 (talk) 16:21, 3 August 2014 (UTC)
 * You should really get your head out of the fiction section Dr.Strangelove. Saying that it was to protect US policy is like saying the British were attempting to protect their weapons policy in WWI-WWII when they issued citizens with masks on some occasions & info on how to use them in anticipation of planes bombing them with gas. It appears that only in the area of nuclear matters do you have all manner of wacky ulterior motives being seen by folks like yourself.
 * 178.167.254.79 (talk) 05:47, 8 August 2014 (UTC)

Only someone with no understanding of history would think that those gas masks had real world applications. Tell all the british people who died in conventional air raids about the terror of gas bombs. Puma6374 (talk) 21:14, 26 October 2020 (UTC)

I think skyshine may also be termed cloudshine
http://www.remm.nlm.gov/nuclearexplosion.htm According to the above, cloudshine is radiation emitted from the mushroom cloud 178.167.196.163 (talk) 13:14, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

"Skyshine" is a technical term for gamma rays that reach a target from all directions because of scattering in the atmosphere, as opposed to those rays that travel to the target in a straight line from the fireball. See Glasstone and Dolan, Effects of Nuclear Weapons, 3rd ed, U.S. Atomic Energy Commission, 1977, §8.44 and Fig. 8.45a. Jessegalebaker (talk) 08:30, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

Another survivor used Duck and Cover
Drawing by Goro Kiyoyoshi of his memories of the Hiroshima attack. “I got on a streetcar of the Kabe line about 8:10 AM. The door was open and I was standing there. As I heard the starting bell ring, I saw a silver flash and heard an explosion over the platform on which l had just walked. Next moment everything went dark. Instinctively I jumped down to the track and braced myself against it. Putting a handkerchief to my mouth, I covered my eyes and ears with my hands.” https://archive.org/details/UnforgettableFireDrawingsByAtomicBombSurvivors1967

 * A section that lists these cases would be ideal.
 * 92.251.232.209 (talk) 15:46, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

Port Chicago info removed and supplanted with near identical case
In a rare example of binksternet actually trying to make a productive contribution to articles I have essentially re-written entirely by myself, he removed the following and simply inserted the similar, but less direct halifax story. '' with one such incident being the 1944 Port Chicago explosion, where about 4,600 tons (4,173 metric tons) of chemical explosive accidentally detonated in a series of events. Survivor, Robert Routh, reported enjoying the sight of the wonderfully bright fireball and then suddenly never seeing anything again, as following the blast arriving, he was permanently blinded by the window he was viewing the fireball from, shards of which pierced his eyes and face. '' I'll leave his edit there for the time being, although as can be seen, it actually fails in getting the full point across, contrary to Routh's story. I will be summarizing the Halifax story, stating it was known after that, and merging the two stories as time permits.

Significant cleanup needed
I tried to clean up this article, but there appears to be a lot of problems with it, some of which may be related to how the article was written and the information therein. The sources being cited may not all be reliable, though most appear to be, and this article may need some review by an expert. I wish I could do more, but this is out of the scope of my expertise. I've added a template header for now, though more may be added in the future if needed. I'll continue to work on this page, but I can only do so much with what little I know, and it'll probably be exclusively copy editing. ―Nøkkenbuer (talk • contribs) 00:02, 15 April 2015 (UTC)

 * Your edits have inserted unreferenced and misleading falsehoods that have included the insertion of this laughably incorrect and totally unsourced statement: "This individual, like many others fully exposed to the blast, were instantly vaporized; many left carbon imprints at the place of their vaporization."
 * Really, please take a physics class before editing again. I'm sure you could find some basement level reference that says people were insta-vaporized etc. but no physics or educated medical reference will. I could explain to you why this did not happen, and how it could not have happened, but unless you honestly acknowledge "this is out of the scope of my expertise" again, I don't see the point in helping you out.

 * Secondly, While the reference style is indeed sloppy at times, that does not give you the freedom to remove references entirely. You will hopefully note that were you did improve the way a reference is cited, I have attempted to keep your improved way of citing it. However you unfortunately did more harm than good in a lot of your citations, such as removing time-stamps from referenced videos and in terms of the "Nuclear Matters" & "Planning Guidance" references to specific quotes and figures found in those documents, you also removed them too.

 * Thirdly, I really mean it when I said that your edits have inserted a myriad of misleading statements that required a total reversion. For example, you don't have to venture far to find the first, in the very intro/lede of this article you also wrote "It is also used during the event of a sudden earthquake or tornado when emergency evacuation is not an option". Yet, not a single reference states "Duck and cover" specifically is used to deal with either of those two things. In my recent edit of the article I am actually careful to state exactly what earthquakes and tornadoes have to do with "duck and cover" and why they're even mentioned in this article to begin with.
 * I could go on, but this type of thing was really so endemic that a total re-editing was necessary.
 * 31.200.186.10 (talk) 02:37, 21 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Do you have specific instances of this? I have only been removing references which do not comply with Wikipedia's policies on citations. Citing *.GIFs and images are not acceptable, and a lot of the references were to extraneous or otherwise inappropriate and superfluous information. A lot of this content moreover violates WP:NOTHOWTO, among other policies. If you have specific concerns, then please propose them here, or edit them in. Removing all of the work of numerous editors doesn't help. As for the vaporization claim, that was an addition I made from my knowledge about the effects of the fireball during a nuclear explosion, as well as the numerous images depicting so-called "nuclear shadows" of people left when the atomic bomb hit. You don't need to remove that part, since I already have. Please assume good faith, however, and keep in mind that a lot of the work I did was just cleaning up the problems previous editors left. A number of claims, many unsourced, were retain for the time being because they were there previously. I simply reworded them, and have been planning to start searching for references. If I made a mistake, it may have not came from me. Even if it did, I can assure you it wasn't intentional.

 * Having said that, I've restored the current iteration. Please don't do a blanket revert again. We can discuss this later, after I've had some sleep (I've been up for a long time). There's no rush, especially on such a low-trafficked, low-importance, forgotten article like this. We can continue this together later, alright? I'm glad that you want to improve this article, and I hope that we can accomplish this together. If you'd like, we can collaborate tomorrow (if I'm available, but I'll be busy, so perhaps in 1.5–2 days from now) and ensure that we both improve this article. In the mean time, while I'm away, please refrain from blanket reverts and removals. If you wish to edit the article in its current state, even to the point of adding or removing substantial content, then that is your choice. Keep in mind, however, that disruptive editing is not tolerated. Oh, and maybe consider creating an account (or logging in) so that we can keep better track of each other from hereon out. That's just a suggestion, though, so feel free to ignore that last bit. Have a great day/night! ―Nøkkenbuer (talk • contribs) 03:09, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

 * Seeing as you have elaborated, I'll elaborate: I removed some timestamps because they were unnecessary and usually not common practice in citations from what I could see. I did change the video link to actually go to the specific time in question, however, and the conclusion of that section should be obvious from the video's contents. I removed the specific quotes because if I didn't, the same page would have to be cited multiple times, which is incredibly poor practice. I (or you or someone else) could add a separate note where necessary to clarify what passage in particular is important to note, but to do this within the citation itself is problematic because so many different quotations are cited. If we included them all in a single citation, the citation would be so large, obtrusive, and confusing that it would render the citation unwieldy. Thus, it's best to either remove the quoted text and let the reader find it (which is extremely easy), or to add it in a separate note. I opted for the former at that time because I was going to go over and add notes where necessary after I was done with the major revisions, seeing as quotation notes are unnecessary and a lesser priority than actual content revision.

 * I actually did cite in the body numerous drills and similar procedures used in the event of tornadoes and earthquakes, in Duck and cover § Procedure. I was going elaborate on this later, but was sidetracked to addressing more important matters on far more notable articles (see my contributions). Keep in mind that, as you can see, I never got down to the sections about tornadoes and earthquakes—I stopped just short of it, which was intended for my second "major cleanup" the following day. I intend on expanding on this part soon. You are right on one point, however, namely that the current description in the lead claims that "duck and cover" is a procedure used during earthquakes and tornadoes. This is technically not true; a similar procedure is used. I have corrected the article lead to reflect this.

 * If you wish to include your content. I recommend merging it into mine and the other editors whose work I haven't touched yet. I don't want you to feel like your work has gone to waste, and I don't want you to feel like your work isn't worthwhile to include. I don't mind you merging it into my work and stitching it together until we can address it more in-depth later. If you encounter a conflict between your work and mine, then use your discretion to consider whether it's necessary to replace your work with mine, or whether it's suitable to keep until we can collaborate. In my opinion, only if one of the claims in the current article is so egregiously bad as to be 100% false, and your replacement claim is vital to the article's contents, then replace it. Otherwise, it's probably best to just leave it for now. We can discuss this matter further, and I can review your changes, tomorrow or in two days.

 * This article is still a work in progress, after all, and the page isn't viewed very much. (Compare other pages to see how insignificant this is.) I hate to put this all off, by the way, but I am very tired and was just about to go to bed when you showed up on my watchlist. I hope you understand. ―Nøkkenbuer (talk • contribs) 03:47, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

 * You have once again made this article into a shambles. I have already explained to you why I had to do the edits I did. I have also already given you "specific instances of this". My edit broke down the article into headings and subheadings and kept original pertinent content in its place, including gifs made by REMM, a reputable source.

 * You on the other hand have chosen to delete these reputable sources and have once again put the article into a state that includes totally misleading information, for example again, I didn't have to go past the 2nd sentence of the lede to find your nonsensical unsourced claptrap about duck and cover being used in earthquake and tornadoes scenarios. When it is not. I fixed that, but unsurprisingly once again you've reverted the article back to your error filled mess.

 * I'm really not in the mood to spell out each case of error on your part, piece-by-piece as we'll be here for days! Moving from the lede into the beginning of the body of the article, I also removed the tag you put in, as it is not needed in my edit etc. I could go on and on ad nauseum. So listen, you know I fixed the vast majority of the errors you have put in, yet you resist the error-free content being visible to readers?

 * So really what is your opposition to my edit? As you didn't even read my initial edit at 02:20 you just felt it was a "blanket revert" and undid it within 8 minutes, not enough time to even read the new article and compare it to its previous state, so forgive me for seeing your conduct as one of inertia & WP:OWN. Indeed your recent edits would be classed as disruptive editing, and as you can imagine, I won't tolerate them, neither would the dispute resolution board. You're even here admitting that you don't find this article important and you "got side-tracked" with your allegedly exceedingly more "notable" contributions. That's supposed to re-assure me that you're careful with this article, how exactly?

 * Get some rest, you really aren't thinking straight. I will be here tomorrow night to put the article back into its superior state, without your misleading claptrap sown throughout it.

 * First, I'd like to apologize for yesterday. I was indeed very tired, and as a result I mistook your edits as massive reversion. Although it is true that you appeared to revert a lot of my work, I don't think that was your entire purpose. You appeared to add a lot of more content. Due to your edit summary, however, I mistook your edit as just a mass reversion. Whenever an IP does add substantial content, I'm suspicious, since vandalism is so common and a lot of the time, it's done by IPs. I decided that it was best to wait until later, and I'm glad you did. I know it must have been frustrating, but I appreciate it. Having said that, I don't mind you adding or removing content, even my content. We need to take things slower, though, since there are now two active editors on this article.

 * Having said that, your hostile attitude really isn't necessary. I understand that there may be significant flaws in the article, but keep in mind that the majority of my work was simply cleanup. You're blaming me for the past mistakes of others. I normally wouldn't care a whole lot, but seeing as we'll be working together, I'd rather you not continue your collaboration under the impression that I'm some idiot filling this article with unsourced crap. That's how I found the article. I have been cleaning it up, but I haven't been doing much about the article's claims. This is because, first and foremost, I am not very knowledgeable on this topic. Secondly, I thought it would be more important to clean the article first, and proceed to edit the content later. This is because I'm much better at the latter, and it would give me time to research in preparation for the former. Seeing as you noticed some of the changes I made to the article in terms of citation cleanup, however, I don't see why you're still blaming me for the article's contents. Unless you skipped over a vast majority of the changes, or you misunderstood them, you should be able to see that I didn't actually add much of anything, with the exception of content about tornadoes and earthquakes in the lead. Most of my work was deleting superfluous or otherwise unnecessary content.

 * Perhaps we're misunderstanding each other here, but like I already said, using images as citations is not common practice, nor is it acceptable. If an image is included, it is included as an image. Many of these images better belong on other articles, such as the ones linked in this article. I removed them because even though they are from reliable sources, you do not cite images except under very specific circumstances. Usually, images are embedded, but not linked to, in an article. As for the tornadoes and earthquakes bit, I've already explained why I kept it above, as well as my rationale for it. It's not "claptrap" or anything of the sort. Did you even look at the sources which were provided?

 * No, I don't "know" your content fixed errors. All I knew at the time I reverted it was that it as a whole bunch of changes, and a lot of content was removed. Your edit summary didn't help, seeing as you called me "arrogant" and derided my work. If you want to work on this page, then let's work on it together. Treating me like a child, behaving uncivilly, and assuming bad faith won't get us anywhere. So please drop the deprecatory remarks. In the mean time, I'll review your changes and I'll see whether to submit the whole edit, or let you know to only submit some while we discuss the rest. I don't own this article, but I am concerned when an IP comes in and adds 9,036 bytes to an article. Seeing as you seem so versed in Wikipedia policies, however, I don't see why you remain an IP. People would be less suspicious of your intent if you were signed in. My edits have not been disruptive, however, so there is no need to accuse anyone of that. If you wish to take this to an administrator, then feel free to do so. I don't think that admin would approve of your behavior either. ―Nøkkenbuer (talk • contribs) 22:43, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

First review: Lead
I've been reviewing your changes. Some of them are worthy to keep, but a lot of it involves simply reverting my wording and reintroducing extraneous information. For example, Here are the two leads, the first being the current one (mine):This is your proposed lead:These are the problems I'm seeing with your proposal: What is your rationale for these changes? Why did you remove the content about tornadoes and earthquakes, while keeping it in the article (which is not how it works)? Why did you arbitrarily change the sentence structure to be worse? You added some important information which could be added to the lead, but the way you did—along with your deletion of otherwise important information—renders your lead inferior. I can continue reviewing your proposal, but let's start here. Your other changes are more substantial, and will require more discussion. ―Nøkkenbuer (talk • contribs) 23:19, 21 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Although you are correct that the original wording of "duck and cover" being a "method of personal protection" as compared to a "safety precaution" is better, I don't see any reason why you're removing the information about tornadoes and earthquakes. Not only is the relevant to the article, and it's true that similar methods are used, but you even kept the sections about "duck and cover" being used in natural disasters. Why is that? If it's in the article, it should be mentioned in the lead. Otherwise, that content should be removed altogether so that "duck and cover" remains as a historical article exclusively about what to do during a surprise nuclear attack.
 * You also reverted a lot of the cleanup on wording that I did without any justifiable reason to do so. The wording in the original and in your proposal is poor English and difficult to read. For example, there is no reason to specify "which might come at any time without warning". This sounds like scaremongering propaganda or sensationalist reporting, neither of which belongs in an encyclopedia. The entire sentence in which this clause in situated is poor English, hence why I revised it.
 * There is no reason to actually link to Element of surprise. That automatically redirects to Surprise (emotion), a general emotion of no relation to this article. There is no article describing surprise military attacks, let alone nuclear ones, on Wikipedia. The closest is Principles of war and List of military strategies and concepts, neither of which has a section or subsection on surprise attacks. This is why I removed it from the article, and this is why it shouldn't be re-added per your proposal.

 * Feel free to respond anytime, 31.200.186.10 (talk). Meanwhile, I guess I'll review your other changes and continue working. ―Nøkkenbuer (talk • contribs) 12:17, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

 * I am not too concerned with the rejigging of sentences as long as the message, in its entirety, remains present. One man's "poor English" is another's "clear and all-encompassing". So knock yourself out in that respect. In response to your query about why I removed the tangentially related material on Earthquakes & Tornadoes from the lead, well I wonder if you've caught it yet, it is tangentially related and as we do not have any reliable sources that mention Duck & Cover along with Earthquakes or Tornado(E&T) countermeasures in the same breath, they should not be in the lead of an article about Duck and Cover, as that truly is bad practice. It would be great if we did have a reliable reference that did link the two, but as it stands now, the E&T material just about warrants being in the body of the article, but definitely not in the lede, not least because we have far more important and fully referenced material to get across in the lead, instead of that stuff on E&Ts. Do you disagree?

 * Secondly, with respect to Surprise, there is a reason to link to Surprise (emotion), as that is exactly the feeling one would be experiencing in the event of a surprise nuclear attack, and it is the exact emotional state one would find themselves in during the crucial few seconds that they must complete the Duck and Cover maneuver, which is, the subject of this article. Not so much about the military tactic of surprising someone offensively.

 * Thirdly you have written - If an image is included, it is included as an image. Many of these images better belong on other articles, such as the ones linked in this article. I removed them because even though they are from reliable sources, you do not cite images except under very specific circumstances - My primary concern with your edits is this removal of well referenced material. While you say there is some sort of golden wikirule about not citing images, in a technical article such as this, citing images of graphs is fundamental, do you disagree? So you'll have to come up with a better reason why you've blanked all these references to pertinent graphs provided by REMM/Radiation Emergency Medical Management www.remm.nlm.gov etc. Moreover you'll also have to give me a reason why you went to the extent of not only doing the above, but once you were finished whittling the ref list down in support of the fact in the article's sentence, you took the truly incoherent step to ascribe the once well cited fact as some kind of fringe "Theoretical physicist" opinion, rather than the well established fully corroborated by REMM etc fact, that it is.

 * Fourthly what you have communicated in your People would be less suspicious of your intent if you were signed in paragraph, is that, you are telling me you just assumed bad faith because I was an IP editor, and that because I am an IP my motives are suspect. I find that this is just another example of the unwarranted prejudice IP editors routinely confront on a daily basis on this site. Believe me, if you spend long enough on this side of the fence, you'll soon find that it is the registered users who are the most biased and destructive to this project. As the juvenile vandalism perpetrated by IPs is automatically fixed by BOTs, so the true destruction is therefore that of motived editing. So as you can imagine, the most effective at ensuring that their bias edits go unrectified are those very registered users who are in the Gentleman's club so to speak. Believe me, try being an IP for a while, you'll see what I mean.

 * I recognise that you may, despite your aforementioned prejudices, have good intentions. However I still find it incomprehensible why you're even editing on an article that you are openly unfamiliar with? While you know that I have recognised, and therefore kept in, every instance that your edits sentence construction is superior to what was there previously in the article. I strongly feel it would best serve this article if you simply stayed to that realm, and just didn't go near the reference deleting arena. Is this unreasonable? If we could agree on the above, I think we could genuinely improve the article with your flair for sentence composition.

 * 31.200.157.49 (talk) 10:12, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

 * I also see that since your review of the lead above, that you have finally acknowledged that the longer procedure section that I penned, was superior to your own and you used my edit for this section to improve the article. I appreciate this new found display of professionalism on your behalf. As prior to this edit you had simply blanked this edit of mine without rhyme or reason. " 23 April 2015 Nøkkenbuer (talk | contribs) . . (72,137 bytes) (+2,129) . . (fixed next section using the edit provided by IP) "
 * 31.200.163.187 (talk) 12:40, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

 * I'm the same IP as above and re-wrote the lead again. Let me know what you think?
 * 92.251.190.243 (talk) 14:52, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

 * It appears Nokkenbuer is no longer interested, that's a shame I was looking forward to collaborating as I noted above.
 * 178.167.206.134 (talk) 21:55, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

Refs to incorporate
http://www.johntreed.com/duckandcover.html Good summary info on it commonly being ridiculed but that the maneuver and those who advocated it, veterans of WWII to the Korean war, were well aware of its capabilities and the various zones in which the countermeasure would be both useless and effective. 178.167.178.178 (talk) 04:31, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

"See also" and "See related" sections
Hello 185.51.***.***

In early December I spent about an hour going through the "See also" and "See related" sections. I checked to see if any of the links in those sections were present in the body of the article. There were many, and as those two sections were excessively-large, I removed the duplicates per WP:SEEALSO. Once the duplicates were removed, I replaced redirects with their targets, then placed the remaining items in alphabetical order. Dawnseeker2000 21:34, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

 * Hmm, but the articles linked in the see also were arranged together in related categories, and injecting an alphabetical order simply destroys that arrangement.
 * 109.125.16.122 (talk) 04:52, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

 * These "See also" sections have a tendency to grow. The same is true for the "External links" sections. Many editors add to these sections, but few take on the task of reducing items, even if they're not operational. The sections often get to the point where it seems like it's a good idea to create subsections and/or group by category. Look, if the article's "See also" or "External links" section needs subsections, that's the point where we should realize that the quantity is just excessive. At that point, work needs to be done to integrate the items into the article with the section "See also" templates or into the text. Dawnseeker2000  03:32, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

Reaction times
"R. A. Langevin and others in 1958 compared the ability of trained troops and the untrained civilian population to duck and turn away, covering exposed skin (Operations Research, vol. 6, p. 710). Trained troops duck and cover in 0.75 second when a very bright flash occurs. The untrained civilians fared less well: 2% protected themselves within 1 second, 15% by 2 seconds, 50% by 3 seconds, 70% by 4 seconds, 80% by 5 seconds, 90% by 7 seconds, but 7.5% are still fully exposed at 10 seconds after detonation. The young and the old react most slowly if they lack clear simple knowledge of the dangers. Langevin shows that even this untrained protective reaction increases the amount of energy required to cause burns to an exposed population, especially in the case of high-yield weapons which expose the most people." Boundarylayer (talk) 20:54, 20 December 2016 (UTC)

 * Then you best sign in, self.
 * 185.51.75.43 (talk) 16:43, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

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External links modified
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Foolish tone.
This entire article is an exercise in proving that “scientists” and the US government have little to no understanding of war, weapons, or ballistics. This entire article is cargo cult craziness aimed at the obsessive people who want to try to ensure they will somehow survive a hydrogen bomb going off a mile away from them. The people who survived attacks who are cited in the article are so clearly random as to be outwardly laughable. It is true that at least one person has been in a situation around a nuclear bomb in which ducking and covering likely saved their lives. However the real savior in all those events is not the act of ducking, but rather the topography, the nature of the explosive, and the ballistics of the explosion that put those few people in a position where ducking actually would make a difference. Plenty of people ducked and covered and got cooked like a thanksgiving turkey anyway, because that is how munitions work. It’s like taking examples of air raids in which people saved themselves by crossing the street and changing the ballistic angles of shrapnel and saying that because these people clearly saved their lives everyone should focus first on crossing the street during all potential air raids. If you are close enough to the blast to be seriously imperiled, even the scientists admit that ducking and covering will only change a .01% survival rate into a .02%, while if you are far away ducking and covering changes a 94% survival rate into a 95% survival rate. You can use those statistics as proof that ducking and covering is the most important move you can make, or you can be straight up with people and actually teach them about the weapons we all point at each other. Talk to actual soldiers about the laughable drills for the potential of being on the battlefield during a tactical nuclear weapon strike and you will soon realize how much of this government research is all claptrap. I understand this article is edited by busybodies who desperately want hope and something tangible they can do about a nuclear blast, but you have to understand that this is all an exercise in wishful thinking and a waste of time. If you are going to somehow be close to a nuclear weapon detonation, you are likely dead. That’s why they build nuclear weapons. Superpowers don’t build and maintain them because they are easy to survive. If you are far enough away to not die you will likely not die. If you cannot come to an understanding with those simple facts no pamphlet from 1950 is going to save you. Puma6374 (talk) 21:02, 26 October 2020 (UTC)

 * AGREED not just foolish but biased in a way which contradicts Wikipedia policy. I added a few facts to back up what Puma6374 mentions: "It's worth noting that the Hiroshima and Nagasaki explosions were "atom bombs" which are much weaker than nuclear hydrogen devices, also known as "H-bombs", by a factor of 1000 or more. The force of the bombs dropped on the Japanese cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki in 1945 was equivalent to 16 kilotons (16,000 tons) and 21 kilotons of TNT, respectively. On November 1, 1952, the US detonated the first hydrogen bomb at Enewetak atoll in the Marshall Islands. Codenamed "Mike," the bomb produced the energy equivalent of about 10 megatons — or 10 million tons of TNT Detonated by the Soviet Union in 1961, the Tsar bomb created a 50 megaton explosion — nearly 1,500 times more powerful than the atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined I propose most of the references to Hiroshima and Nagasaki be removed as they were very far below destructive nuclear capacities just seven years afterwards. Cuvtixo (talk) 00:52, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

 * The entire article is a rambling mishmash. EEng 00:13, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Duck and cover


text:
CKLN-FM

CKLN-FM was a community radio station based in Toronto, Ontario, Canada.

From 1983 to 2011, CKLN Radio Inc. was licensed by the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission as a campus-community FM radio station affiliated with Ryerson University, and broadcast at 88.1 MHz on the FM dial with the call sign CKLN-FM. It ceased FM broadcasting on April 15, 2011, after its licence was revoked on January 28, 2011 and continued as an internet radio outlet until it ceased operations on December 26, 2011.

In its final months, most of the internet broadcaster's programs were produced in the Regent Park neighbourhood of Toronto. After CKLN was officially dissolved as an organization, its remaining resources and volunteers were transferred to Regent Park Focus Youth Media Arts Centre, which launched Radio Regent, a new Internet radio operation, in early 2012. After a round of licence hearings on new applications for CKLN's old frequency, the CRTC awarded the licence to Rock 95 Broadcasting, which launched CIND-FM under the name Indie 88 in September 2012, while a new campus radio station for Ryerson University was launched as CJRU in 2016.

History
CKLN began as a closed circuit station set up in 1970 as Ryerson Community Radio, its broadcasts piped to loudspeakers around campus. In 1972, it became independent of Ryerson's Radio and Television Arts department and adopted the call letters CRFM. In 1978, the station adopted the call letters CKLN and was broadcast through campus via closed circuit cable. It was licensed as an over the air FM broadcaster by the CRTC in 1983 as a Ryerson University-based campus-community radio station and assigned the frequency of 88.1 MHz on the FM band and allowed to retain the CKLN call letters. Ryerson had announced that it would close its earlier radio station, CJRT-FM, in 1973 due to financial constraints; that station was saved in 1974 by the Ontario government headed by Bill Davis in 1974 as a government funded public radio station without formal ties to Ryerson.

Among CKLN's early accomplishments was the launch of Ron Nelson's new show The Fantastic Voyage in 1983, Canada's first radio show devoted to Rap. The program was influential in promoting and developing many of Canada's early hip hop stars. According to poet Clifton Joseph, the show was "the single most important agent responsible for the breaking of rap music in Toronto and laying the groundwork for the emergence of Canadian rap artists such as Michie Mee and Maestro Fresh Wes."

Other artists such as Blue Rodeo and k.d. lang received airplay on CKLN prior to being picked up by mainstream radio. The Globe and Mail says of the station that "it sat at the forefront of independent music and radical politics in the city for more than three decades, working with a shoe-string budget, and yet it somehow always managed to survive."

In the 1980s, the station helped create a news service to share content among left-wing stations worldwide including those run by the African National Congress and the FMLN in El Salvador. The station aired live coverage of the release of Nelson Mandela from prison.

CKLN was the first broadcast outlet to air Toronto's Gay Pride Day Parade.

In its coverage of the Rwandan genocide, CKLN aired an investigation of the colonial history behind the events.

In 1985, the station was estimated to have 50,000 weekly listeners. By 1991, its audience had grown to an estimated 140,000 listeners a week. In 1989, The Toronto Star voted CKLN as "best radio station" in its annual Sammy awards. In April 1992, one student successfully petitioned for a referendum to decide if the station should continue to receive student funding; CKLN won the referendum.

Former station manager Adam Vaughan, later a Member of Parliament, said in a 2015 interview that "What was great about CKLN is that it combined the strength of Ryerson with the diversity of Toronto... The diversity of the city and the diversity of the voices and the culture on air came to define CKLN and it was a huge part of our success." He added, however, that "The station, after I left, got very heavily invested in identity politics. And instead of bringing diversity together, groups kind of started to fight with each other and it was hugely problematic in terms of trying to unify an audience... You could see the station drifting further and further away from a position of strength and experimentation into bitterness and at times, straight up incompetency."

By September 2003, following the departure of station manager Conrad Collaco, CKLN was teetering on the brink of insolvency. As a result, the Ryerson Students' Union bailed out CKLN of $110,000 in debts. An earlier proposal by Collaco to deal with the station's financial problems with a $6 increase to the student levy was not approved by the student government which cited various issues such as the lack of audited statements, the lack of airtime for Ryerson students or acknowledgment of Ryerson on the air.

In August 2005, CKLN shifted its broadcast studios from the basement of Jorgenson Hall at Ryerson University to the second floor of the newly constructed Ryerson Student Campus Centre.

Internal conflict and loss of licence
In November 2007, CKLN's board appointed board member Mike Phillips as interim station manager. It had been over four years since the position had been filled. On December 21, 2007, CKLN program director Tim May resigned "suddenly and questionably" and within days CKLN's board appointed board member Tony Barnes as interim program director without first advertising the post. The new hires, and the manner in which the hirings were carried out, proved unpopular with some and resulted in a special general meeting being called, which was attended by over 150 members, more than 90% of whom voted to impeach the board of directors. The management and board of CKLN viewed the Special General Meeting as illegitimate along with the impeachment vote and subsequently dismissed several dozen volunteer programmers as well as two paid staff, including the station's news director, who was allegedly told she was being fired for not seeing "eye to eye" with the board. Station manager Mike Phillips claimed that members of the Canadian Union of Public Employees and Ontario Coalition Against Poverty had stacked the February meeting and defended the dismissal of volunteer programmers by arguing, "If you have people decrying the station that is allowing them to go on the air, and breaking CRTC rules in the process, that can't be allowed to go on for very long."

For a time, the station had two rival boards of directors, both claiming to be the legitimate management. The first board, which hired Barnes and Phillips, was chaired by Josie Miner while a second board led by Arnold Minors was elected by opponents of the first board. The Ryerson Students' Union, which administered a student fee that, at the time, provided the station with 60 per cent of its budget, withheld funds until the conflict between the two rival boards was resolved. Responding to this action, the first board initiated a statement of claim in the Ontario Superior Court of Justice naming the RSU and Ryerson University as defendants.

With CKLN's financial situation deteriorating due to the RSU's withholding of funds, and with members of the first board fighting among themselves, on February 28, 2009, CKLN's studios were made inaccessible except to a faction on the first CKLN board and those they chose to admit. Live programming was suspended and previously aired material was repeated in its place.

On March 1, 2009, two individuals, Paulette Hamilton, one of the members of the first board who had been locked out the previous day, and Daibhid James, a programmer, were arrested after they "barricaded themselves into the radio station's studios." Ryerson University president Sheldon Levy reacted to the incident by stating that "I think they've overstayed their welcome if that's the welcome that we have on our property. I don't like it, I don't want it, and we don't need it here."

Later that month, the Ryerson Student Centre board voted unanimously to close the station until both sides of the dispute could negotiate CKLN's future. The Palin Foundation, which governs the student centre, consists of representatives of Ryerson University, the Ryerson Students' Union and the Continuing Education Students' Association of Ryerson (CESAR).

During the period of the lockout, which lasted until mid-September 2009, CKLN broadcast unattended loops of previously aired programs, jazz and pre-recorded speeches. Dead air was heard for sometimes weeks at a time. In June 2009, CKLN's broadcast antenna was damaged resulting in the signal strength being drastically reduced. CKLN's online stream was still operational through this period.

On July 9, 2009, in a statement by Chris McNeil, president of CESAR and chair of the Palin Foundation, CKLN was provided a deadline of July 24, 2009 for the station to elect a new board of directors or risk eviction. The July 24, 2009 meeting and elections were held, but became the subject of a legal action filed in the Ontario Superior Court of Justice Commercial Court by former CKLN board member Mary Young claiming it was "improper and illegal". On December 14, 2011, the legal action against CKLN was permanently stayed and a motion by Young to launch a derivative action was dismissed with Young ordered to pay CKLN $10,000 in costs.

Licence revocation
Even before CKLN resumed scheduled programming in late September 2009, the CRTC expressed concerns over the station's inability to comply with licence requirements during the dispute, such as playing the aforementioned loop for several months in 2009, its failure to properly submit on-air logger tapes, program logs and complete annual financial returns since 2007, and that the CRTC licence for CKLN had been transferred to a third party without authorization.

In March 2010, the CRTC called CKLN to a hearing for May 12, 2010 in which the licensee was to "...show cause why the Commission should not take steps to suspend or revoke the broadcasting licence in question or why the Commission should not issue mandatory orders requiring the licensee to comply with the Regulations and its conditions of licence..." The hearing was postponed in part due to ongoing mediation efforts in the aforementioned Mary Young case. The CRTC made it clear soon after the postponement that CKLN would be called to a hearing by no later than the end of 2010. During this period, the CRTC required the station to file monthly progress reports on its efforts to improve its licensing compliance.

The CRTC called CKLN to a hearing that took place in Toronto over a two-day period beginning December 8, 2010.

On January 28, 2011, the CRTC revoked the licence of CKLN-FM due to continual breaches of the Broadcast Act and violations to their conditions of licence, ordering them to cease broadcasting by February 12, 2011.

Calling the decision "premature, disproportionate and inequitable", CRTC Commissioner Louise Poirier issued a dissenting opinion stating that she was "firmly opposed" to the decision and that licence revocation "should not have been used as a first step for this station"; according to Poirier, "the Commission has never revoked a licence without first issuing a mandatory order or reducing the licence term." The decision was also opposed by the National Campus and Community Radio Association, which stated in a press release that the commission "could have taken other reasonable steps to ensure regulatory compliance while allowing CKLN to continue serving the community".

CKLN has stated that most of its regulatory failures were committed by former staff who were no longer with the station. CKLN appealed the decision to the Federal Court of Appeal. On February 11, the station was granted a temporary stay, allowing it to remain on the air pending the Federal Court's decision on whether or not to grant the station leave to appeal the CRTC's order.

On April 15, 2011, the Federal Court of Appeal announced that it would not be hearing the appeal and said the station must cease broadcasting on 88.1 FM immediately. CKLN continued broadcasting and podcasting via the internet as its exclusive outlet from that point.

Reaction to loss of licence
CKLN station manager Jacky Tuinstra-Harrison said that the CRTC failed to follow its own policy of graduated discipline: "The CRTC could have followed their own policy, but did not; they did not pursue avenues such as warnings, fines, mandatory orders or other options against CKLN, but moved directly to the most serious of measures- revocation. We were not at any point offered alternatives" and that the claim that "CKLN's 'demise' could have been avoided is an admonishment, which could have been made to any of the last six CKLN boards".

On April 18, 2011, in his inaugural television broadcast on Canada's Sun News Network, as well as his column in the Sun Media newspaper chain, conservative commentator Ezra Levant claimed that the CRTC's decision on CKLN was just another oppressive example of arbitrary government bureaucracy and interference into the lives and businesses of ordinary Canadians.

Toronto city councillor Adam Vaughan said: "It's just astonishing that the CRTC can do this to a station that's been true to its mandate, that's sustained its commitment to community-based programming, the damage it does to communities served by this station, you couldn't even begin to quantify." Vaughan told the Toronto Star that "It's very sad that the CRTC couldn't sit down and work with this clearly volunteer organization and give them the benefit of the doubt and help them solve the problem rather than simply render a very tough decision against them."

Referring to previous boards of directors, outgoing Ryerson Students Union president and CKLN director Toby Whitfield observed: "There's been so much infighting for so many years, people lost sight of the purpose of the station. The privilege of having a licence is amazing, and I think that's what was missing," adding that the current board had gotten more students involved.

Move to Regent Park
On August 2, 2011, in a statement posted on CKLN's website, it was announced that the Palin Foundation would evict CKLN on August 27, 2011. It was confirmed officially by CKLN on August 4, 2011, that, after the eviction, CKLN internet streaming would emanate almost exclusively from the Regent Park Focus Youth Media Arts Centre, a community group which offers media training programs for economically disadvantaged youth in the neighbourhood and which had already produced a weekly program for broadcast on CKLN for a number of years.

According to then station manager Jacky Tuinstra-Harrison, "They have a social mission which is very similar to ours, which is to have citizens participate in their media.... It's a wonderful opportunity to expand on our social mission, representing marginalized communities or communities that don't get to represent themselves a lot in mainstream media."

Dissolution
At a CKLN membership meeting held on October 11, 2011, a motion was passed to seek court approval for the dissolution of CKLN Radio Incorporated. Court approval for dissolution was granted on December 14, 2011. CKLN.fm ceased operations on December 26, 2011, with most of its programs and volunteers moving to Radio Regent, a new internet radio service owned and operated by Regent Park Focus Youth Media Arts Centre and unaffiliated with CKLN Radio Inc.

Fate of 88.1 and new Ryerson application
On September 28, 2011, Evanov Radio Group (via licensee Dufferin Communications) submitted an application to move CIRR-FM (which carried a contemporary hit radio format targeting the LGBT community) from 103.9 to CKLN's former frequency on 88.1. Per its competitive licensing process, the CRTC issued a call for competing applicants, and received 27 submissions in total. The applications included submissions by MZ Media, Astral Media, Newcap Radio, Larche Communications, the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, Trust Communications, Intercity Broadcasting, CHIN Radio/TV International, La Coopérative Radiophonique de Toronto and numerous ethnic broadcasters, as well as a new student group from Ryerson University that planned to relaunch the station with a new governance model.

On September 11, 2012, the license was awarded to Rock 95 Broadcasting Ltd., which launched its new station CIND-FM on the frequency in 2013.

In 2013, Radio Ryerson Inc. launched The Scope, an internet radio station whose application for an AM radio licence was heard by the CRTC on September 25, 2014  and was granted by the CRTC on December 11. The new station began broadcasting on 1280 AM, with the call sign CJRU, on March 31, 2016.

In 2016, the CKLN-FM call sign was taken by Newcap Radio for a transmitter in Clarenville, Newfoundland and Labrador, which operates as a rebroadcaster of CHVO-FM in Carbonear.

CKLN alumni

 * Ralph Benmergui - former CKLN news director and producer (1980s), later a host on CBC Television, CBC Radio, and CJRT-FM
 * Kolter Bouchard - former CKLN host and board member, as of November 2018 afternoon drive co-host on CFNY-FM.
 * Tanya Kim - Ryerson graduate and former voice-over artist for CKLN promos and announcements circa 1998, current co-host of CTV's etalk
 * Kirk LaPointe - CKLN station manager (late 1970s), later managing editor at the Vancouver Sun, CTV, The Canadian Press and the National Post. From 2010 to 2012 he was ombudsman for the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation. Vancouver mayoral candidate in 2014.
 * Eun Sook Lee - CKLN News Director (1990–1991), and Station Manager (1992–1993). Currently the Executive Director of the AAPI Civic Engagement Fund.
 * Min Sook Lee - CKLN news director (1996–1998), later a documentary filmmaker and political candidate
 * Jeffrey Morgan - Authorized biographer of Alice Cooper and The Stooges
 * Alex Narvaez hosted Off Da Tracks on CKLN, currently the lead host on Complex Canada.
 * Dames Nellas DJ'd, currently afternoon drive-time/evening DJ on CKFM-FM in Toronto.
 * Ron Nelson - host of The Fantastic Voyage and Reggaemania, CKLN Board chair from 2009 to 2011. Currently a concert promoter, producer, and lecturer at York University.
 * Richard Paul - host of Latin Party, later a host of Two New Hours on CBC Radio
 * Norman "Otis" Richmond - host from 1983 until 2011 of various programs including Diasporic Music and the flagship news magazine Saturday Morning Live, longtime news director
 * Kobena Aquaa-Harrison - hosted Sounds of Africa (1989 - 2010) replacing founders Sam Mensah and Thaddy Ulzen. Later president/ artistic director Music Africa/ AfroFest, Michèzo! founder, writer WORD Magazine. Composer/ performer for film, theatre, dance, television, stage
 * Paul Romanuk - DJ and hockey play-by-play announcer (Toronto Marlies) from 1981 to 1985, later a sports broadcaster with TSN and Hockey Night In Canada.
 * Adam Vaughan - CKLN station manager (1985–1987), later a municipal affairs reporter for CBLT and CITY-TV, city councillor, and then a Liberal Member of Parliament (Trinity—Spadina)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: CKLN-FM