text:
Talk:Leonidas I

Inconsistent date of death: 7 aug vs 11 aug
7 aug is mentioned in the text on top and 11 aug below the photo of the statue on the right —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.29.3.91 (talk) 07:47, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

300 is not a historical source
There seems to have been a lot of nonsense added to this article based only on the film "300", itself based on a comic-book of the same name, which is in turn based principally on a 1962 film called "The 300 Spartans". It should go without saying, but it's not a reliable source, and people should resist embellishing the article with its dramatic flourishes: e.g. the army was 700 strong (it was 7000 - 10,000 according to Wikipedia); the Ephors conspired against Leonidas; an Oracle controlled by the Ephors (strange that they had one given that they were a governing council, not a priesthood like in the film) foretold that Leonidas would die... It is said that there were more than 300 men present at the Battle of thermopylae, (6,ooo Foot soldiers, and 1000 archers.) The the 300 were leonidas' personal guard.

, especially when contrasted with the 1911 Encyclopædia Britannica article

 * I disagree that the 300 graphic novel is based on the 1962 movie, partly because of the huge and obvious stylistic and narrative differences between them, partly Frank Miller has never said that that movie inspired him (he claims the book mostly comes from reading Herodotus as a small boy) and partly because if you know anything about Miller's other work, it's obvious that it mostly comes out of his own weird imagination and rather simple-minded clash-of-civilisations approach to the Greco-Persian Wars. Otherwise I agree that 300 the movie, though fun, is highly inaccurate and in no way to be relied on as a source, even if it does have characters speaking lines which were historically attributed to them.  The article isn't all that great, though improving it will not be very difficult. I don't know why you think the Britannica article is so good.  It's well written, but on Wikipedia it would barely qualify as a start-class stub. Lexo (talk) 11:19, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

A Traitor Led the Persians to...
the statement that a sparton traitor led the persian army away from the path in thermopoly set by leonidas is not a historical fact and authorities on the subject have stated that it is just speculation that there was a traitor (from the book The Greeks and the Persians). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.173.205.106 (talk) 19:01, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Go Tell the Spartans
Is this quote attributed to Leonidas in the Britannica entry? I've more commonly seen it attributed to Dienekes, a Spartan soldier at the battle.--Eric 04:28, 17 Dec 2004 (UTC)

It's by neither. It was the epigraph for the Spartan dead and was written by Simonides, a poet. When you think about it, it couldn't possibly have been written by either Leonidas or Dienekes since a.) they weren't poets and b.) they had both been killed in the battle. Lexo (talk) 11:12, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Deleted text
The following anecdote was deleted from the article:

''The Persian envoy attempted to intimidate the Spartans by telling them Xerxes had so many archers, their arrows would "darken the sun". Leonidas replied, "So much the better. We shall fight in the shade."''

Anyone know why it was removed? I thought it was an interesting quote that gave some characterization to the subject. I found a description of the exchange in a published collection of miltary biographies, if it's a question of authenticity. The poster who removed it left no explanation. MK2 03:24, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)

And now it's been removed again. As I said, I found the quote in a reasonably credible source. I have no problem with it being deleted if it's not accurate but could someone actually step in here and share the facts with the rest of us. If nothing else, the rest of the paragraph needs to be rewritten if the middle of it is removed. MK2 04:54, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC)

The quote is misattributed. It is not a quote of Leonidas. It appears in Herodotus and is attributed to Dienekes. And it's inaccurate anyway; the story of Persian arrows darkening the sky was brought to the Greek lines by a terrified Greek villager, not a Persian envoy.--Briangotts 14:46, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC)

In Frank Miller's 300 (comic book) its delivered by an Envoy dude, inaccurate, but still a great comic. Highlandlord 11:43, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

There is no historical evidence that supports any of that jarbish of fighting in the shade. but again, one heck of a film.

Well yes, if you look about 3 lines above you it was mentioned that the line comes from Herodotus.

Some of the "300" vandalism seems to be spilling over here. Just deleted a line that claimed Leonidas was a cricket player.

Request that someone removes the reference to 'wailing' in response to Leonidas death as being 'un-Spartan;' the death of a king, we are informed by Herodotus (6:58) that 'men and women together strike their foreheads with every sign of grief, wailing as if they could never stop.' The comment in the text is, most likely, a reference from Xenophon's Hellenica to the Spartan defeat, and death of King Cleombrotus, at Leuctra. Unsigned User. April 23rd 3:09 GMT. Apologies, no account.

Looks like the above edit was made. I have confirmed the quote in Herodotus 6:58 regarding the death ceremonies for kings.

In the beginning of the second paragraph after the oracle quote in the Thermoplyae section, Leonidas was refered to as "Leonidas Cacharelis". I searched the article over, but didn't see the "Cacharelis" name repeated elsewhere. That, coupled with the fact that I know quite a bit about this man and have never even heard him refered to as that, has led me to remove it. If anyone has a credible source refering to him by that name, feel free to put it back in and please link to that source here in the talk page. Spartan198 (talk) 14:56, 20 June 2008 (UTC) Spartan198

Molon Labe
I wanted to note on the page that the quote "Molon Labe" has become an increasingly popular rallying cry among the pro-gun movement, at least in the United States. It's often seen as a cry against people who attempt to pass laws that would ban the sale, or try to confiscate arms. "You want my AR15? Come get it." As I am new to wikipedia, I figured I'd be better off posting here first to get opinions from the people maintaining this page. Thanks. iygijg

IMO it has nothing to do with ancient history.Dejvid 23:15, 13 May 2005 (UTC)

 * The phrase, or its popularity? The phrase is attested in Plutarch's Moralia, 225.11.  I agree that its adoption by people against gun control is irrelevant to the article. Lexo (talk) 10:54, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Lizard King
Ηταν ένας μεγάλος πρωτεργάτης της αντίστασης κατά των Περσών,αφού αψηφησε τρομερά το μεγαλήτερο στρατό που υπήρξε ως εκείνη την εποχή.Για τον λόγο ότι οι Σπαρτιάτες πίστευαν πολλή στην θρησκεία τους οι Βασηλία της Σπάρτης επέλεξε κάτι που δεν ήταν πολλή καλό για αυτήν. Ακολουθόντας των χρισμό του μαντείου για τον προτότοκο γιό ξεκίνησαν 300 και κάτι πολεμικες μηχανες για το πιο θερμές πύλες της ιστορίας με αρχηγό έναν από τους βασηλιάδες τους τον Λεωνιδα. Οι μέρες της μάχης ήταν σχετικά λίγες ομως οι αναλογίες εδείξαν το μεγαλείο των Ελληνικων στρατευμάτων, αφού μέσα σε 4 ημέρες βεβήλωσαν 10000 βάρβαρους μπροστά στα μάτια του βασηλιά τους όπου παρακολουθούσε την σφαγή του κράματος που είχε για στρατό!!Η αποδειξη του μεγαλείου του Λεωνιδα φάνηκε τις τελευταίες ώρες τις μάχης δίνοντας την διαταγη στους υπόλοιπους Έλληνες να φύγουν με μια εντολη...να πουν αυτα που έγιναν και ότι παρέμηναν οι Σπαρτιατες μέχρι τέλους υπηρετόντας τους νόμους Λακωνίας.
 * That's just ...nonsense. And your spelling is awful! 77.49.2.144
 * I'm sorry but....what the hell is this? Why write in greek if this is the English page?167.206.69.62 (talk) 15:25, 6 November 2008 (UTC)Leonidas

Question
I once heard that when asked for military aid, Leonidas would send one man. Apparently this goes along with the saying "One man, one riot, one ranger." Can anyone explain this?

Re: question above

This is probably regarding dialogue from the movie Spartan (2004). In conversation, the character being saved (the first daughter I believe) questions why only one man was sent to save her. The lead character, a no questions asked intelligence agent played by Val Kilmer, replies with the analogy "one riot, one ranger" and asked if she's heard this term. It refers to a story regarding a Texas Ranger (a state peace officer) responding to a riot, alone. The girl being saved, then responds to the agent, with a statement and question of her own, the concept of Leonidas sending one man to the neighboring state for military aid and asks if he has heard of that. The agent's coy response is, "I think we went to different schools baby."

=
I want to learn more about this person! Is there anyone who can help me understand who he is a little bit better than I already do? thanks!!!!!!!!!

Ditto, Leonidas seems like a very interesting person. Try looking in a good library, or a prevelant university libary.

 * When you leave a question on the talk page, it is useful to leave a user name too, otherwise how is anyone going to be able to know who you are so that they can answer you? If you want to read more about Leonidas, a good place to start is Plutarch's biography of him.  Try the Penguin Classics anthology of Plutarch's wrtings about Sparta, helpfully titled On Sparta. Plutarch is not always very reliable and I advise you to read some modern histories of Sparta as well. Lexo (talk) 11:10, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

-

Re "one riot, one ranger"- see here http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/director_staff/texas_rangers/

I am highly skeptical that Leonidas would send one Spartan as aid- their strategy was to use the phalanx to break apart enemy lines and then kill the enemy. This is impossible without a group of similarly trained and equipped people doing same thing alongside.

-

Re: It is not Leonidas but Spartan policy/law/tradition that sometimes when Greek states asked for military support or aid, only one man was sent instead of a contingent of hoplites. That one man was usually a well trained Spartan general or military advisor in strategy, tactics and training. He would be sent to the Greek sate/ally in need and train/prepare or lead their army. This was especially common when Spartans were at war themselves (i.e. with the Aegina their perpetual domestic rival) and unable to spare soldiers or when they were participating in the Carneian Festival.

Note* Sparta's domestic rival was Argos, Aegina was a common adversary of Athens.

 * Xanthippus, for example. The Jackal God 04:51, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Better Illustration, Please...
There exists an impressive statue of Leonidas that could be used to illustrate this article. Why insult his memory with a swishy 19th century painting of Leonidas daintily pointing his foot like King Louis XIV? It isn't a very accurate representation.

They should add a pic from "300" preferable the one where he tells the aremy of his plans to dine in hell. I don't know how much that actually looks like him, but it should certainly be added. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.63.62.56 (talk) 05:49, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

69.107.77.208 04:36, 29 August 2006 (UTC)C. Poloynis

King Leon
Leon (king of Sparta) links here, which is kinda inaccurate as apparently King Leon is not a nickname but an ancestor from 590-560, so if someone who knows how (I'm noobish) could fix it please do. Highlandlord 13:02, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
 * If you think Leon is worthy of an article on his own, click on the King Leon link that appears just below the article title when you search on King Leon. Then edit away on the redirect page.  An alternative solution would be to mention him in passing here on the Leonidas I page. (John User:Jwy talk) 14:54, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I don't know anything about Leon, I was just checking out the kings of Sparta reading about him and clicking on Leon brought me here. I don't know if hes worthy of an article of his own, although most of the Agiads just say (name) Agiad King of Sparta ruled from (date) to (date), but I do know that hes Leonidas' grandfather and shouldn't direct to here. I just figured out right now how to get it to not redirect here, so fixing it. Highlandlord 00:15, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Fight for Leonidas' body
Leonidas fell in the thickest of the fight; the Spartans attempted to retrieve his body, but given the numbers they faced, the king's body was taken by the Persians.

Several sources, albeit modern perhaps, state that a small group of Spartans fought down the hill to retrieve his body:

When Leonidas was killed, he was some distance away. Some of the Spartans formed a tight group, fought their way to his body, picked it up, then fought their way back to the main group on the hill.

They demanded the body of Leonidas in return for the Spartan's lives, but the men refused to abandon the body of their King, declaring: "A Spartan leaves the field with his shield or upon it". --Asososocrates 06:56, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

...Xerxes felt remorse and, forty years later, Leonidas' corpse was returned to the Spartans.

This doesn't make any sense. After 40 years, a corpse is no longer a corpse. Slyfoxman7 08:15, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Corpse, what was left of it, so skeleton.

--- Well it also doesn't make sense considering that Xerxes was already dead 40 years after Leonidas was killed.

I'm not positive about this, but i'm pretty sure, according to Herodotus, that Leondias' body was fough over for several hours, first captured by the persians, then retaken by the Spartans, recaptured by the persians, and finally taken back by the Spartans167.206.69.62 (talk) 15:31, 6 November 2008 (UTC)Leonidas

leonidas wife
the wife of leonidas, after the battle, became voluntarily became a sexual servant of Xerxes because, she moaned, that "no greek has the capabilities to please a woman". —Preceding unsigned comment added by User: (talk • contribs)

 * Can someone please provide a reliable source for this ?I have removed it since I have studied extensively the persian wars and I can't recall reading this anywhere .Thus I have removed it. I will check about what happened to Leonidas wife and I will add information about her... Tbere 23:38, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

This is pure vandalism and trolling, there's nothing to source. I'll report this sad fellow right away. Thanks for removing it Tbere. Miskin 23:45, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

quotes
i created a quotes section...if i did something wrong I am sorry I am still noob here and don't know much :P Tbere 02:07, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

gorgo queen of sparta
i created a small article about gorgo with all the info I managed to gather about her.if anyone is interested here is the link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gorgo_queen_of_sparta. I think that the movie is good on the violence and the war- it like alot of drama. You know, alot of blood and war, I belive that the people that see it got their attention.

Temporary Protection
Does anyone think temporary protection may be needed for this article due to the near-release of 300(movie)? There has already been (at least) one vandal edit in regards to it.--William H. Bigsby 00:00, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

well i don't think so...I checked the history page and most of the vandalisms were minor with various refers to the movie...Nothing really major...If it get's worse and vandalisms happen more often then I think it would be ok.

 * I do think so. Not only this, but all Thermopylae-related articles. Miskin 01:45, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

I agree. Temporary protection is a good idea, I've had to fix this article, and reading other articles related to the film show rampant vandalism. -- Ennuified 15:16, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Unclear reference - trembler
The article near the end states:

A second Spartan, Pantites, was sent by Leonidas to attempt to raise support in Thessaly but returned to Thermopylae only after the battle's conclusion. Pantites hanged himself in disgrace after being shunned as a "trembler".

Anyone know what a "trembler" is? --64.242.28.5 20:54, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

i guess the guy who wrote this article was greek.He probably meant the one who trembles.This in our language means something like chicken in yours :)

Maybe we should change the word, to something like "coward" so everyone will understand it? Morrock 21:25, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

A 'trembler' is the term used to refer to those Spartans who were deemed to have shamed themselves in battle, it is a social state bringing with it various forms of 'dishonour' within Spartan society. and does not really liken itself to words like 'coward' or 'chicken'. Tylerdurden289 (talk) 12:20, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

300 fim pic of Leonidas
It's only fair that someone dig up a pic of the 1960's version "The 300 Spartans" and the actor who played Leonidas. --198.254.16.201 22:02, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

and a pic of him from the new remake. i only say this because pretty much every single article concerning characters, real or not, has several interpreations of them. 69.108.83.255 (talk) 22:44, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

 * I have a DVD of The 300 Spartans and will take a screenshot. It's not a very good movie.  The actor was named Richard Egan, btw. Lexo (talk) 10:57, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Vandalism Incoming
Incoming from World of Warcraft forums:

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=84468596&sid=1 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Moheezy (talk • contribs) 18:37, 15 March 2007 (UTC).
 * Thanks for the heads-up. I've temporarily semi-protected the page. Kafziel Talk 18:41, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Clean Up and Factual dispute
I have tagged this article for cleaning due to the factual problems and the fact that the article disputes itself about what happened after the death of Leonidas. There are many different sources that contradict some of the facts on this page. A History Channel documentary titled "Last Stand of the 300" has different numbers for the fources that stayed behind, also that documentary uses different qoutes, plus many other things. I know that this is only one source, but there are others. This article needs some help. K1000 23:12, 17 March 2007. (UTC)

Too many vandalisms
Suggest this article be locked -- there have been quite a few vandalisms. 199.5.204.100 14:32, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

This article is complete bullshit. Not historical at all, and sources are not credible. Methinks person who wrote this watched 300 too many times. I suggest someone with historical credentials rewrite the whole thing. –The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.46.41.178 (talk)
 * It will probably tend that way until the movie fades away. But feel free to fix it with what you can cite. (John User:Jwy talk) 03:22, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

How many soldiers?
First the article states that "Leonidas went to Thermopylae with 300 of his finest soldiers and 1100 allies", then is says that he split his army, staying in the pass with the 300 spartans, 400 thebans and 700 thespians, while the others retired. Since I don't think that the number of soldiers who retired amounts to zero, there must be an error somewhere. 84.220.161.102 18:56, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

I read that he took 7000 men in addition to his 300 Spartans. I got that from 'The Dangerous Book for Boys', which isn't exactly a dedicated history book, but it is suppossed to be educational so one would assume the writers researched it. Definetely a defenite source needed on this one. Phoenix1985 22:49, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

 * The 300 is only ever presumed to refer to Spartiates (full Spartan citizens) and not the lower class Spartans, such as the Helot slaves, who probably made up the bulk of the 7,000 men. But guys, historians have been arguing the figures of Thermopylae for thousands of years, it's not going to be resolved here. Just accept that the best we can hope for are somewhat accurate estimates based on the accounts we have at our disposal. Conor 20:22, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Try to look for some sources at scholar.google.com or books.google.com to make it more easier just a suggestion. Lakers 07:14, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The [Battle of Thermopylae] article has it that there were 9000 helots with Leonidas and the 300 warriors, hence, this passage "In 480 BC Leonidas went to Thermopylae with 300 of his finest soldiers," ought to be edited.--81.190.109.245 11:37, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Leonidas took only 300 men. The rest of the 6700 were Greek allies who met Leonidas at Thermopylae and accepted Spartan command. They didn't come from Sparta. This is what Herodotus says and what is generally accepted. Miskin 11:15, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Also the dispute at Thermopylae is restricted to the numbers of the Persians not of the Greeks. But even there, a figure around 200,000 is generally accepted. Miskin 11:15, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Is there a disparity between the number 700 and 7,000? 700 thespians are referenced in the Battle of Thermopylae article. Which is right? I'm not disputing anything, just thinking things should match. Only your source is cited, Phoenix1985. Viscouse 13:56, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Unsourced Opinion
Towards the beginning fo the article, when discussing the size of the force sent, we quite rightly go "Well, contemporary sources say this" but then say:

"'Instead it seems likely that the ephors supported the plan half-heartedly due to the festival of Carneia and their policy of concentrating the Greek forces at the Isthmus of Corinth.'"

Well, that's really nice, but says who? What source said the Ephors limited the number of troops? the factor of the festival is probably an important one, but the statement as it stands is very woolly. I think it either needs substantiating or deleting.

Herodotus does. Miskin 06:08, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

"one of the most famous battles in ancient history." removed this line from introduction because i felt it was POV and weasel words. if i'm wrong please correct. Tca achintya (talk) 17:44, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

 * I think there is probably a good argument that it is, especially if one restricts it to Western ancient history, but until there's proper sourcing of such a claim, you did the right thing. (John User:Jwy talk) 21:26, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

A few comments...
Just wanted to comment that the way that the name Leonidas is pronounced in the film 300 is not the way that the name is pronounced by any Greek whether it be in Greek or English. I should know as Leonidas is my name. The name is pronounced as Leon-ee-thus not Leeon-eye-das.

Also can someone please comment on where "Lion's son", "Lion-like" came from. Reference? It is true that the Greek word for Lion is similar, but that is an assumption to my knowledge and to make that leap seems like seems like a non-Greek wrote that. Greek names don't work like that. Happy to be told otherwise.

Leon V. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 202.147.46.214 (talk) 05:49, 12 April 2007 (UTC).

 * Generally, in Greek culture, names which are similar to an object, animal, or other such entity, are meant to depict that which the root word defines. In Leonidas' case, though the name is not directly "Lion-like", it contains part of the Greek word for lion, λεων (leon). My name, Giorgio, which in Greek is Γιεωργιος (Yiorgos), means "farmer, earthworker," deriving from the elements γη, or γι (ge), "earth" and εργον (ergon), or εργασία, "work." Nidht 07:34, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia generally follows the Erasmian pronunciation, according to which ancient name are pronounced with b, d, g rather than bh, dh, gh. As for the etymology, "leon" is the ancient Greek word for "lion" (the modern Greek "liondari" is its diminutive), and "-ides" (pronounced "idis" in modern Greek) is a common Greek suffix meaning "son of", similar to the Germanic "-son", of the Byzantine Greek '-poulos'. The "-ides" (or -edes) suffix is common in ancient Greek names e.g. Archimedes, Diomedes etc. but also in Modern Greek names e.g. Petrides = son of Petros (Peter), Paulides = son of Paulos (Paul) etc. The reason why the Spartan king is not spelled "Leon-ides" but "Leon-idas", is because the latter is the Doric Greek version of the name, in which the letter alpha is frequently in the place of eta. For example the Spartan word for demos was "damos", emera -> amera etc. In other words, Leonidas did also exist as a name in ancient Greece, usually in non-Dorian societies. The reason why only the Doric version of the name survived in Greek forenames today, is the historical popularity and importance of the Spartan king in Greek culture. Miskin 13:29, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Well I know someone who was named after Leonidus, and they claim it's pronounced "Lay-oh-nigh(like night)-dus." Does anybody have any proof of the actual pronunciation of his name. Morrock 21:33, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

 * Leonidus is not Greek. If anything it would be a Latinisation of a Greek name, though I've never heard of it. Miskin

Leonidas is pronounced as Leh-o-ni-thas both in modern and ancient Greek, the name runs in my family for generations (father, son, grandfather, 3 cousins) as part of a tradition. It is still a popular name in the region of Mani and its people who are direct descendants of the ancient Spartans; there today you could see many of the ancient Spartan characteristics, traditions and idiomatic Doric Greek language alive. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.118.78.105 (talk) 23:38, 12 September 2014 (UTC)

Who did Gorgo ask?
In the sentence: 'According to Plutarch, Leonidas's wife Gorgo asked him how she could aid his mission. He responded "marry a good man, bear good children, and live a good life."'. Who did Gorgo ask? Did she ask Leonidas or Plutarch? I don't know much about this history, so i wouldn't know if it was obvious that it was one or the other. Thanks :) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 202.147.43.82 (talk) 21:59, 12 April 2007 (UTC).

Given that Plutarch lived six hundred years after Gorgo, I'm going to go with her asking Leonidas. john k 05:37, 11 May 2007 (UTC) Come on, dont be a prat, plutarch, did gorgo even know who this bloke is?

Wrong person listed under children
Currently, the child of Leonidas II is listed as the child of Leonidas I (Cleomenes III). It should be Pleistarchus, as listed here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kings_of_Sparta I would have fixed it, but apparently this page needs protection? Who would've thunk it.--67.158.178.157 03:33, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

WWE Profile???
Anyone knows why King Leonidas has a profile under the SmackDown! roster of WWE? Weird. —User: (talk • contribs • email) 03:30, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
 * That's a good question. Shouldn't that be listede under the "In popular culture" section?-Gdfanatic21594 20:44, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

There's a King Leonidas in the WWE? After nearly ten years of watching it, I've never seen or heard of him. Spartan198 (talk) 14:45, 20 June 2008 (UTC) Spartan198

Internet Memes
Why is Leonidas in the category "Internet Memes"? Nothing about it is mentioned in the article and I can't think of a situation wherein he would be included. Introducing Numa Numa, Star Wars Kid, and the Hero of Sparta??? Childe Roland of Gilead 20:03, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I have seen the openmouthed screaming headshot of Gerard Butler as Leonidas (in "300") used on multiple bulletin boards as an avatar, and I have seen this still of his face photoshopped on various bodies (Star Trek fans, especially, seem to love to put his screaming head on Kirk's body over at the TrekBBS). So that is what I think is referred to under "Internet Memes."  Sir Rhosis 02:12, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

You guys haven't seen it? The open-mouthed picture is almost always accompanied with the caption "THIS IS SPARTA!" And it's gone on to be mocked in several ways, one of the more popular ones is "THIS IS BEOWULF," since Leonidas' line and Beowulf's "I AM BEOWULF" sound so similar167.206.69.62 (talk) 15:09, 7 November 2008 (UTC)Leonidas

Fair use rationale for Image:300 pic.jpg
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BetacommandBot 04:58, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:300 pic.jpg
Image:300 pic.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 23:15, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Oracle?
My Greek history is a little rusty, but wasn't there an oracle in the history? When the Spartans were called upon by the rest of the Greek world, they consulted an oracle which said that (roughly) the Greeks would be victorious if a Spartan king died in battle. Consequently, Leonidas (one of the two reigning Spartan kings!) assembled a suicide squad and marched out at their head, prepared to die to save Greece. Seems like this article begins in the middle, no discussion on the Greek/Persian history and the role of Sparta, no discussion of the Spartan governmental/social system. 65.54.154.46 (talk) 08:26, 25 January 2008 (UTC) Ubberflubber (talk) 18:21, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
 * yes there was an oracle, it was either the oracle at delphi or the spartan oracle, this is in legends but it could be a myth

Major abuse
I was perusing this article for my Latin class, and it has been horribly abused. Poor Leo is referred to as a "pimp" and a "gangsta." This needs to be fixed ASAP... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.19.180.46 (talk) 01:20, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

And some a..hole put THIS as the prophecy of the oracle: '''O ye men who dwell in the streets of chocolate and death Lacedaemon! Either your glorious town shall be sacked by the children of Perseus, Or, in exchange, must all through the whole puppy country Mourn for the loss of a milk carton, descendant of great Heracles.''' —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.136.243.141 (talk) 20:27, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

That's actually pretty funny, although obviously you're right to delete it. I'm afraid this Sparta-related-article nonsense will continue until stupid teenagers the world over forget about 300. Lexo (talk) 10:59, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

No picture of Leonidas from 300?! :o
Surely 300, as inaccurate as it is, is still an example of a popular modern depiction? Perhaps we could have a picture of King Leo near the end of the article under a legacy section eh? Like it or not, wikinerds, he's made a lasting and notable impression on the public at large; one that should be recorded! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.161.144.236 (talk) 20:13, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree with the first paragraph but this passage should have more info on Loenidas and i mean Olympias's uncle Leonidas. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.138.25.237 (talk) 17:48, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

I don't think we should put a picture of Leonidas from 300, because the actual king was 60 years old, and it would lead people to believe that he was younger than he was. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.199.37.5 (talk) 02:47, 17 November 2019 (UTC)

Sources for the article
In response to the box that says that this article needs sources, I've found 7 links to help verify the history of Leonidas I: --Fede-lasse (talk) 13:54, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
 * http://www.yourdictionary.com/biography/leonidas-i
 * http://ancienthistory.about.com/cs/people/g/leonidas.htm
 * http://www.helium.com/items/671109-biography-king-leonidas-i-of-ancient-sparta
 * http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/Bios/LeonidasI.html
 * http://answers.encyclopedia.com/search.aspx?q=leonidas+i
 * http://www.encyclopedia.com/topic/Leonidas.aspx#1E1-Leonidas
 * http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1O48-Leonidas.html

Contradiction
The section in question says: ' He chose only 300 Spartans because if he had taken the entire Spartan Army, he would need the permission of the Council, who he knew would not agree with him.' and later in the same paragraph: 'Leonidas took only his personal bodyguards,[3] and not the army, because the majority of the Spartan Army was coordinating with the massed naval forces of the Greeks against the Persian Navy.' the former statement lacks references while the latter has one I have not checked. (Drn8 (talk) 16:11, 30 June 2010 (UTC))

 * I'm also responsible for the addition of the contradict template which I added while not logged in. (Drn8 (talk) 16:13, 30 June 2010 (UTC))

No editorializing please
This edit basically says "a Wikipedian was of the opinion that the 540 date is rather too early". Having an opinion on things isn't a replacement for actually supporting it based on references. --dab (𒁳) 14:10, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

Life - typo
Hi All, "Because Leonidas was not heir to the throne, he was not lol from attending the agoge". I don't know what was intended here (lol). Someone else perhaps? VelhinhoEstoniano (talk) 17:50, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Life - typo
Hi All, "Because Leonidas was not heir to the throne, he was not lol from attending the agoge". I don't know what was intended here (lol). Someone else perhaps? VelhinhoEstoniano (talk) 17:50, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Date of death
These edits changed his date of death without a decent source. Admittedly the previous version of the article was internally inconsistent. Logically, we would expect the article to agree with the article on the Battle of Thermopylae. That gives two dates, relating to two different sources. One of these dates is the same as one of the dates that used to be in this article. Yaris678 (talk) 18:36, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
 * More edits on the subject. I am inclined to agree with this edit by Dougweller, although that did leave an overly precise date in the lead.  I have removed all such dates.  Yaris678 (talk) 11:43, 2 August 2012 (UTC)

Selecting the 300 soldiers
I read somewhere that when Leonidas chose his soldiers, he chose only those who had sons or brothers who could provide for their family when they didn't return. Is there any historical basis for this claim? Or is this from the imagination of some modern storyteller? —MiguelMunoz (talk) 19:40, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Leonidas' Mother
The article claims that according to Herodotus, Leonidas' mother was his father's niece. Greeks still today use  the  terms  nephew  and  niece loosely, it does not necessarily  mean a  blood  relative,  rather  can be a  close  friend who is a generation younger. The article is therefore misleading, as if  Leonidas' father practiced incest, which is false. This sort of misleading statements by Wikipedia occurs far too often. 71.98.133.88 (talk) 02:19, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Leonidas I in Agoge
I am unable to find any academic references to Leonidas being in the Agoge. The citation itself is most unhelpful, for it is about the Agoge in general, and should not be a part of this article anyways. --97.120.44.158 (talk) 22:58, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Accession date kooky.
It says Cleomenes I became king in 520, Leonidas took the throne some time between then and 516, then that Cleomenes died in 490. Slight discrepancy there. 98.225.182.131 (talk) 08:14, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Modern section
The modern section presents and affinity to historic entry. This affinity has nothing to do with history. 72.69.236.247 (talk) 03:24, 3 February 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 October 2017
In the first paragraph describing the heritage of Leonidas, the writer mistakenly identifies Leonidas as "the daughter of Cleomenes..." Obviously, this must be changed to "the son of Cleomenes..." HumesHat (talk) 23:50, 21 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: It's actually describing Gorgo, his wife's heritage Cannolis (talk) 02:26, 22 October 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 May 2018
Change "daughter of Cleomenes I" to "son of Cleomenes I" in the opening paragraph. Torahime (talk) 08:47, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: It refers to Leonidas' wife, Gorgo, Queen of Sparta. Favonian (talk) 09:15, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Rearranged it somewhat. Previous version could be read that Leonidas was 1) the husband of Gorgo, 2) the daughter of Cleomenes I, and 3) the 17th of the Agiad line OR that Leonidas was the husband of Gorgo who was the daughter of 1) Cleomenes I and 2) the 17th king of the Agiad line. Neither is what was intended. --Khajidha (talk) 14:21, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 October 2018
164.215.199.192 (talk) 17:56, 20 October 2018 (UTC)

this page based over lie and fake history of greece !!!! before upload any page i suggest check both side ancient historys !!!! in persia ancient history book and also babylonian point to persians easily defeat king of sparta and conquer athens !!!!! but here ........ lie and over lie from father of the lie herodotus ! https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D8%AE%D8%B4%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%B4%D8%A7 this proof enough to show what's really wikipedia did!!! stop publish the fake post's !
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Danski454 (talk) 18:19, 20 October 2018 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 07:37, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Leonidas at Thermopylae.jpg

AC Odyssey part is misleading
The AC Odyssey part in this article mentions you play as Kassandra. It's missing 50% of the playable characters. You can play as Kassandra or her brother, Alexios. This game was the first in the series where you can choose your character, so it is odd that half of the options are not mentioned. This implies that you can only play as Kassandra. Probably whoever wrote it played it through only once and forgot that you can choose in the beginning.

88.130.48.199 (talk) 14:16, 8 September 2020 (UTC)Just someone with no account or wish to have one so I can't edit semi-locked articles

Spartians
Under one of the images there is the title "The Spartians throw Persian envoys into a well." I believe Spartians should be Spartans. I would change this, but looks like I have only done 8 edits in my wiki life. SticksOfTheSwizzleKind (talk) 13:12, 8 September 2021 (UTC)

Done. Thank you for notifying fellow editors. Dimadick (talk) 08:01, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for updating! SticksOfTheSwizzleKind (talk) 17:23, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Leonidas I


text:
File:Golden Earring - Millbrook USA.jpg

Cover for album Millbrook U.S.A. by Golden Earring.

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license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: File:Golden Earring - Millbrook USA.jpg


text:
Eva Ibbotson

Eva Maria Charlotte Michelle Ibbotson (née Wiesner; 21 January 1925 – 20 October 2010) was an Austrian-born British novelist, known for her children's literature. Some of her novels for adults have been reissued for the young adult market. The historical novel Journey to the River Sea (Macmillan, 2001) won her the Smarties Prize in category 9–11 years, garnered an unusual commendation as runner-up for the Guardian Prize, and made the Carnegie, Whitbread, and Blue Peter shortlists. She was a finalist for the 2010 Guardian Prize at the time of her death. Her last book, The Abominables, was among four finalists for the same award in 2012.

Personal life
Wiesner was born in Vienna in 1925 to non-practising Jewish parents. Her father, Bertold Paul Wiesner, was a physician who pioneered human infertility treatment. He is now believed to have used his own sperm to sire perhaps 600 of the children his clinic helped to be born. Her mother, Anna Wilhelmine Gmeyner, was a successful novelist and playwright, who had worked with Bertolt Brecht and written film scripts for Georg Pabst.

Wiesner's parents separated in 1928 when she was two years old. What followed for Eva was, in her words, a "very cosmopolitan, sophisticated and quite interesting, but also very unhappy childhood, always on some train and wishing to have a home," as she later recalled. Her father took up a university lectureship in Edinburgh, while her mother left Vienna for Paris in 1933 after her work was banned by Adolf Hitler, putting a sudden end to her successful writing career.

In 1934, her mother moved to England, settling in Belsize Park, north London, and sent for her daughter. Other family members also escaped from Vienna and joined Anna and Eva Maria in England, avoiding the worst of the Nazi regime, which had already affected the family. The experience of fleeing Vienna was a strong thread throughout Ibbotson's life and work.

Wiesner attended Dartington Hall School, which she later fictionalised as Delderton Hall in her novel The Dragonfly Pool (2008). Originally, she intended to become a physiologist like her father, and earned an undergraduate degree from Bedford College, London, in 1945. During her postgraduate studies at Cambridge University, she met her future husband, Alan Ibbotson, an ecologist.

Marriage and family
Eva married Alan Ibbotson in 1947. They moved to Newcastle-upon-Tyne, where they raised a family of three sons and a daughter.

Appalled by the thought of having to make a career out of conducting experiments on animals, she decided to discontinue her pursuit of scientific research. She returned to college, graduating with a diploma in education in 1965 from the University of Durham. She briefly became a teacher in the 1960s before embarking on her writing career.

Ibbotson's husband died in 1998. Being "too sad to write in her usual humorous style", she then wrote her ecological classic Journey to the River Sea. She died at her home in Newcastle on 20 October 2010, having just edited the proofs of her last children's book, One Dog and his Boy, and started work on another children's ghost story to add to her long and successful series.

Through her father, Ibbotson was half-sister of the writer Paul Newham and the Canadian filmmaker Barry Stevens, but never met them.

Career
Eva Ibbotson began writing with the television drama Linda Came Today, which the British "Television Playhouse" series broadcast in December 1962. Her first English-language book was The Great Ghost Rescue, a juvenile fantasy novel published in 1975 by Macmillan in the UK and Walck in the US, with illustrations by Simon Stern and Giulio Maestro respectively.

Children's books
Ibbotson wrote more than a dozen books for children, including Which Witch?, The Secret of Platform 13, Dial-a-Ghost, Monster Mission, Journey to the River Sea, The Star of Kazan, The Beasts of Clawstone Castle, and The Dragonfly Pool. She won the Nestlé Smarties Book Prize for Journey to the River Sea, and was a runner up for major awards in British children's literature several times. WorldCat libraries report holding Which Witch? and Journey to the River Sea in more than five and ten languages respectively.

The books are imaginative and humorous, and most of them feature magical creatures and places. Ibbotson said that she disliked thinking about the supernatural, and created the characters because she wanted to decrease her readers' fear of such things. Some of the books, particularly Journey to the River Sea, also reflect Ibbotson's love of nature. She wrote Journey in honour of her husband, a former naturalist who had just died; the book had been in her head for years. Ibbotson had said she disliked "financial greed and a lust for power", and often created antagonists in her books who have these characteristics.

Her love of Austria is evident in works such as The Star of Kazan, A Song for Summer and Magic Flutes/The Reluctant Heiress. These books, set primarily in the Austrian countryside, display the author's love of nature.

Adult books
Ibbotson was also noted for several works of fiction for adults. Several have been reissued successfully for the young adult market, some under different titles. Ibbotson was surprised by the repackaging, as she believed they were books for adults, but they have been very popular with teenage audiences. Three are The Secret Countess (originally published as A Countess Below Stairs), A Company of Swans, and Magic Flutes (in some editions published as The Reluctant Heiress)

Ibbotson's writing for adults and teens took a new direction in 1992, when she began to move toward romantic novels that dealt with the harsh realities of war and prejudice. Two of her acclaimed books are set in Europe at the time of World War II and reflect her experience of the time. The first of this setting, The Morning Gift (1993), became a best-seller. Her last novel for adults was A Song for Summer (1997), also set during World War II.

The Secret of Platform 13 and Harry Potter
Critics have found similarities between Ibbotson's "Platform 13" in The Secret of Platform 13 (1994) and J.K. Rowling's "Platform 9 3/4" in the Harry Potter books (from 1997), both set in King's Cross station in London. The journalist Amanda Craig has discussed the similarities: "Ibbotson would seem to have at least as good a case for claiming plagiarism as the American author currently suing J. K. Rowling but unlike her, Ibbotson says she would 'like to shake her (Rowling) by the hand. I think we all borrow from each other as writers.'"

German language
These translations were published as small books in Switzerland (Zurich: Verlag die Arche).

 * Der Weihnachtskarpfen (1967) (The Christmas Carp; orig. The great carp Ferdinand)
 * Am Weihnachtsabend (1968) (On Christmas Eve; orig. A child this day is born)
 * In den Sternen stand es geschrieben (1971) (In the stars it was written; orig. The stars that tried)

Children's fiction

 * The Great Ghost Rescue (1975)
 * Which Witch? (1979)
 * The Worm & the Toffee Nosed Princess (1983)
 * The Haunting of Hiram C. Hopgood (1987); later, The Haunting of Hiram (1988) and The Haunting of Granite Falls (2004)
 * Not Just a Witch (1989)
 * The Secret of Platform 13 (1994)
 * Dial-a-Ghost (1996)
 * Monster Mission (1999); later, and in the US, Island of the Aunts
 * Journey to the River Sea (2001)
 * The Star of Kazan (2004)
 * The Beasts of Clawstone Castle (2005)
 * The Haunting of Hiram (2008)
 * The Dragonfly Pool (2008)
 * The Ogre of Oglefort (2010)
 * One Dog and his Boy (2010)
 * The Abominables (London: Marion Lloyd Books, 2012, ISBN 978-1-4071-3297-6), published posthumously

Adult and young adult fiction

 * A Countess Below Stairs (1981); later, The Secret Countess (2007)
 * Magic Flutes (1982); later, The Reluctant Heiress (2009)
 * A Glove Shop in Vienna: And Other Stories (1984), a collection
 * A Company of Swans (1985)
 * Madensky Square (1988)
 * The Morning Gift (1993)
 * A Song for Summer (1997)

Awards

 * Best Romantic Novel of the Year Published in England, Romantic Novelists Association, 1983, Magic Flutes
 * Carnegie Medal
 * shortlist 1978, Which Witch?
 * shortlist 2001, Journey to the River Sea;
 * shortlist 2005, The Star of Kazan

 * Best Books designation, School Library Journal, 1998, The Secret of Platform 13
 * Nestle Smarties Book Prize
 * shortlist 1998, The Secret of Platform 13
 * winner 2001, ages 9–11 years, Journey to the River Sea
 * silver medal 2004, 9–11 years, The Star of Kazan

 * Whitbread Children's Book of the Year, 2001 shortlist, Journey to the River Sea
 * Guardian Children's Fiction Prize
 * highly commended runner up 2001, Journey to the River Sea
 * shortlist 2010, The Ogre of Oglefort 28 May 17 Sep
 * shortlist 2012, The Abominables

Film and television

 * Ibbotson wrote Linda Came Today (1962) for television
 * In 1978, she wrote Der Große Karpfen Ferdinand und andere Weihnachtsgeschichten for German television.
 * In 2004 Enda Walsh was adapting Island of the Aunts for a feature film.
 * A film adaptation of The Great Ghost Rescue was completed in 2011, directed by the French Yann Samuell.
 * The Haunting of Hiram C. Hopgood was adapted by Gail Gilchriest.

title: Eva Ibbotson


text: Category:Languages of Austria

title: Category:Languages of Austria


text:
Ian McDonald

Ian McDonald may refer to:
 * Ian McDonald (civil servant) (1936−2019), Ministry of Defence spokesman during the Falklands War
 * Ian McDonald (musician) (1946−2022), member of King Crimson, 1969−70, and Foreigner, 1977−79
 * Iain Matthews (born 1946), previously known as Ian McDonald, member of Fairport Convention
 * Ian McDonald (cricketer) (1923−2019), Australian cricketer
 * Ian McDonald (footballer, born 1951) (born 1951), Scottish football midfielder with Darlington
 * Ian McDonald (footballer, born 1953), English football midfielder with York City and Aldershot, among others
 * Ian McDonald (footballer, born 1958) (born 1958), Scottish football midfielder with Partick Thistle and Greenock Morton, among others
 * Ian McDonald (Guyanese writer) (born 1933), Caribbean-born writer
 * Ian McDonald (British author) (born 1960), British science fiction novelist
 * Ian Donald Roy McDonald (1898−1920), World War I flying ace
 * W. Ian McDonald (1933−2006), New Zealand neurologist, academic, and specialist in multiple sclerosis

Ian MacDonald may refer to:
 * Ian MacDonald (1948−2003), pen-name for British music critic Ian MacCormick
 * Ian MacDonald (footballer) (born 1953), Scottish football defender with St. Johnstone and Carlisle, among others
 * Ian MacDonald (oceanographer), American Biological Oceanographer, Florida State University
 * Ian MacDonald (actor) (1914−1978), American actor and producer
 * Ian MacDonald (politician), former public school teacher and former Mayor of Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island, Canada
 * Ian Macdonald (Australian politician) (born 1945), Australian federal politician
 * Ian Macdonald (Scottish politician) (born 1934), Scottish nationalist activist
 * Ian Macdonald (barrister) (1939−2019), Scottish barrister
 * Ian Macdonald (New South Wales politician) (born 1949), former Australian state politician
 * Ian G. Macdonald (1928−2023), British mathematician
 * L. Ian MacDonald (born 1947), Canadian writer, broadcaster, and diplomat
 * H. Ian Macdonald (born 1929), Canadian economist, civil servant, and President of York University, 1974−1984
 * Ian MacDonald (architect) (born 1953), Canadian architect
 * Ian Verner Macdonald (1925–2022), Canadian writer and diplomat
 * Ian MacDonald (physician) (1873−1932), Scottish physician
 * Ian MacDonald (rugby union) (born 1968), South African rugby union player
 * Ian Macdonald, Canadian musician, keyboard player for the 1990s band Punchbuggy
 * Ian Macdonald, character in the 1927 film Annie Laurie

Iain MacDonald or McDonald may refer to:

 * Iain MacDonald (businessman), Irish entrepreneur
 * Iain B. MacDonald, British television director
 * Iain Fraoch MacDonald (died 1368), founder of Clan MacDonald of Glencoe
 * Iain Sprangach MacDonald (died 1340), founder of Clan MacDonald of Ardnamurchan
 * Iain McDonald (born 1952), Scottish football winger with Rangers and Dundee United
 * Iain MacDonald, Scottish bagpiper, member of the MacDonald Brothers

title: Ian McDonald


text:
User talk:Q10

Welcome!

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~ ~ ~. Four tildes (~ ~ ) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! -- Graham ☺ | Talk 04:33, 17 Dec 2004 (UTC)
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title: User talk:Q10