text:
Talk:Italianate architecture

Discussion
"Italianate" is an adjective. What is the copyright status of the image? --Wetman 13:34, 26 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I'm the photographer of all images on the Italianate page. As this was my first entry in WikiPedia, it took me a while to figure out how to get images properly tagged.

Italianate is more than just an adjective. A search on Google will bring up a kazillion web sites that discuss this topic in terms of Architecture. Such as: Italianate --Piko 02:01, Mar 1, 2005 (UTC)

Judging by "what links here", this page should be made a dab and the article should be moved to Italianate (architectural style) or something along these lines. In Russia-related contexts, the epithet is used to refer to structures which use Muscovite Renaissance elements brought to Russia by Aloisio, Fioravanti, Solari, etc. Any thoughts? --Ghirla -трёп- 07:39, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
 * There is a lot to sort out with the whole of the 19th century architectural Wikipedia pages. I am wondering if we did not ought to have a Category: Neo-Renaissance architecture so they can all be sorted out, then we can see exactly what we have, already we have Neo-classical architecture and Greek revival (much if not exactly the same thing).  Today I discovered American Renaissance a completely new style to me.  I'm wondering what else we have in the 19th century department, and what pages should perhaps be merged.  Any ideas? Giano | talk 13:02, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Guest-bed.jpg|thumb|88px|left]]If I were doing this at home I'd clean off the dining room table [after getting an "Okay" from my domestic partner] and spread everything that I want to look at out on it, let it sink in, mull it over for about a week, and then reassemble it. Which is, i suspect, pretty much what Giano is suggesting. So, what is wikipedia's version of my dinning room table? Carptrash 17:29, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
 * PS the bed in the guest room works too, especially if you don't have a guest.

 * OK we have a venue here: Carp's dining room table. Please leave any thoughts there. Giano | talk 17:51, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Move?
In its current form, the article smacks of original research. I want to repeat that "Italianate" should be reserved for a disambiguation. For instance, the entry on "Italianate" in Britannica, 15th ed. reads:

ITALIANATE, group of 17th-century northern European painters, principally Dutch, who traveled in Italy and, consciously adopting the style of landscape painting that they found there, incorporated Italian models and motifs into their own works. Chief among the Italianates were Bartholomeus Breenbergh, Andries and Jan Both,  Nicolaes Berchem, and Jan Asselijn. The Both brothers, of Utrecht, were to some degree rivals of the Haarlem-born Berchem. Andries painted the figures that populated Jan's landscapes. Berchem's own compositions were largely derived from the Arcadian landscapes of the French painter Claude Lorrain; a typical scene would contain shepherds grazing their flocks among classical ruins, bathed in a golden haze. Upon his return to Holland, Berchem occasionally worked in cooperation with the local painters and is said to have supplied figures in works of both Jacob van Ruisdael and Meindert Hobbema. --Ghirla -трёп- 19:09, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Italianate (architectural style) is fine by me. Regarding your last edit summary try looking at the overall design and ethos of Osbourne and what do you see? Giano | talk 19:18, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
 * If this is a familiar term for Neo-Renaissance residential architecture, we should merge rather than move. Or perhaps insert into Neo-Renaissance a brief summary of what "Italianate" is all about, with a link to Italianate (architectural style) as the main article? --Ghirla -трёп- 19:55, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
 * This is just the confusing sort of thing, I hink we should be debating here User talk:Giano/19th century architecture rather than taking potentially rash decisions by ourselves, for what it's worth I agree with you, but the term "Italianate" seems to have far greater significance in America, and this is an international encyclopedia, so we have to consider all sides of the coin. Giano | talk 20:20, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I've just re-read it: This page is a complete mess of contradictions Giano | talk 20:58, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Speaking for the Americans here-at least until another shows up- I'm fine with moving the Italianate page to Italianate (architectural style). However there should be a redirect or discombobulation or something to send folks who search for "Italianate" there.  Or gives them the choice anyway.  I feel no need to Americanize [or should that be United Statesize] the article, but it does need to fit our needs.  Carptrash 21:44, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Italianate as a disambiguation page
"Italianate" is an adjective. Its use as a noun is jargon, which is intending to appear founded on usage like "the Baroque" or "the Rococo", but which is similar to "an equestrian" when signifying an "Equestrian sculpture" rather than the rider of a horse. "Italianate" is a blurred reference to "the Classical", in cases where the original models have been imperfectly understood by the architect, by his client and sometimes by the writer. Britannica 15th ed. is not a perfect model for Wikipedia. "Italianate", which simply means "classicizing" in some general sense, indistinguishably evokes "Roman" or "Classical" or "Neo-Palladian" or "Cinquecento Mannerist" or "Neo-Renaissance"; it could serve better as a disambiguation page:
 * "See Italianate architecture, an aspect of Architectural revivals.
 * "See Italianate painters, among whom are the Northern Caravaggisti"
 * "See Italianate hairdos" (Gosh! You learn something new everyday here! Giano | talk 06:20, 2 May 2006 (UTC))

etc. --Wetman 23:27, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I found this on the jargon page that [to me] suggests that Italianate is closer to terminology than jargon.

Jargon can be distinguished from terminology in that it is informal and essentially part of the oral culture of a profession, with only limited expression in the profession's publications.
 * Certainly there is no problem finding "Italianate" used in publications. However I too have no interest in letting Britanica determine how we deal with this issue. Carptrash 00:45, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

 * I'm in favour of having Italainate is a disambig so is it to be Italianate architecture or Italianate (architectural style) - I think I favour the former as it is less confining. Giano | talk 06:19, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
 * The word Italianate by itself more commonly refers to architecture than anything else it would seem based on, not only my own reading, but also results from a google web search. Italianate painters come in a very poor second and are unlikely to be the subject of the word Italianate by itself - as for hairdos ...  I am not sure that a dab page needs to be created but perhaps a dab top link - ie using Otheruses4 - see Disambiguation.  I note that there are a significant number of links to this page, and they are not seemingly intended for another article say on hairdos or even painters.  To me that is a criterion in determining whether or not disambiguation is necessary.--A Y Arktos\talk 09:32, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I've made a few changes to the page. Sorry carptrash your pics had to be made a little smaller to fit the page.  Could you write a little more, then they could be bigger to fit the section.  I don't want to tread on your toes by venturing across the Atlantic! I've been thinking about the page move.  I have to disagree with A Y Arktos - I think Italianate is too vague and ambiguous a name on its own.  Practically anything could be Italianate from a pair of jeans to that odd hairdo. I can't see the harm in moving to Italianate architecture especially as it's already a re-direct. Giano | talk 13:15, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

It's okay Gman, the pix are not mine. I'll write more etc. but today my whatever is so slow [we have gerbels in cages running around wheels that make the internet work out here] that it's a hassle. Today they, the rodents, seemed to have some sort of a general strike going so it's taking a minute or two between links - -  too long. Carptrash 14:51, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
 * same hear. Giano | talk 14:58, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

 * I have no objection to a rename, for example Italianate architecture. I do have an objection to disambiguation given the number of links, all of which seem to refer to the architectural style and not jeans, hairdos, ...  I fully appreciate that there is an adjective out there used indiscriminately and without much apparent meaning, when it becomes a wikipedia aticle (I am tempting fate here), then disambiguation would be fine.  For the moment then page move yes, dab to red links - why?--A Y Arktos\talk 19:59, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Architectural opinion sought on 2nd Hotel Vancouver (d.1948)
I never got to see this building, which was torn down before I was born (1955) but was much-remembered by my parents and anybody else who had spent time in it. I added a bit on it to the Hotel Vancouver page, which is mostly about the current, third hotel, now a Fairmont and in the tradition of the Gothic railway hotels (the Frontenac, Laurier, Banff Springs, Lake Louise, Fort Garry, Empress, Royal York etc); the condition of its completion was that the second hotel be torn down (the new one didn't want the competition, which as you can see was formidable; especially the interior of the newer one is very drab by comparison). I've included pix of the interior to see if there's harmonization between exterior and interior, and would like the opinion of someone/people here as to if this is Italianate or not; I'd called it Italian Renaissance, which is the usual term for the style (at least it was in my cultural geography courses, anyway). The second hotel was by Francis Rattenbury (if that's a redlink, it's open turf to anyone interested in architectural history; yeah, there's an article, but now I'm not sure if the 2nd Hotel Van was his or not; have to check I guess; Rattenbury same designer as BC's Parliament Buildings and 1912 courthouse (now the Vancouver Art Gallery though I think in the UK he's a bit more famous for a society scandal/murder than anything else).
 * BC Archives Photo: Second Hotel Vancouver, Georgia & Granville, c.1920
 * BC Archives Photo: Billiard Room, Second Hotel Vancouver, 1920s
 * BC Archives Photo: Dining Room, Second Hotel Vancouver, 1920s

Italianate? Or am I wrong and it's Beaux-Arts or ??? I'd always called it Edwardian Pacific; the dining rooms/ballrooms were in different themes from around the Empire, there were echoes of Hong Kong and Bombay and Africa in the place, and gold-plated faucets and marble fittings in all the bathrooms....Italianate was fairly popular here, relatively speaking to Arts and Crafts and a tamer Queen Anne that's seen in the states; a famous example of an Italianate Renaissance house in Victoria is Emily Carr's old dig: http://www.emilycarr.com/main.html; despite those Gothic-flavoured finials or follies or whatever they are. Skookum1 03:09, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

hello —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.154.114.27 (talk) 23:48, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

This page would be improved with an visual example of the so-called Italianate Victorian style famous in New England (and elsewhere) as a fairly common form architecture. With a prominent "widow's walk" above it's roof, many captain's homes were built thus. The article touches well upon this style. You say Italianate Victorian to any Yankee who knows a bit about architecture and this is what they'll think of. Some were very fancy, some more plain. If anyone has an image of this classic style of house, it would make a good addition.

That said, I agree that this page seems like a research paper put on on the Wikipedia. It presses its point too hard because quite simply "Italianate architecture" is too broad a subject heading to really organize around. The article on Neo-Renaissance architecture is much more germane, even if it does involve French Renaissance too. The Palazzo Vecchio certainly influenced a great deal of 19th C. American architecture, and in it's WP article it's called Tuscan Gothic. Sir Banister Fletcher makes the same distinction. Indeed, many of the buildings shown in this article reflect more of the Gothic influence of the Palazzo Vecchio and Giotto's campanile than Renaissance. Indeed, all of English Renaissance architecture would be Italianate. If the author means that the Italianate style is a distinct style because it has the Victorian concern with the symbolic weight of any feature (as perhaps referenced by the "picturesque" influence) as opposed to a truly Classical sense of balance and proportion, then this article would fit into Victorian architecture. Best, Francis —Preceding unsigned comment added by Francis Smith (talk • contribs) 03:29, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

A question
Is this church Italianate? Its description on the Wilton, Wiltshire page says it's Romanesque with Bzyantine influences. What's the difference between Romanesque and Italianate?81.159.89.226 (talk) 15:09, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
 * An opinion. This church in the picture looks Romanesque to me.  It looks like a 1,000 year old building, give or take a few centuries.  Italianate is a 19th century architectural style.  The use of the tower as well as the sort of icicle looking corbeling around various places are details that the Italianate picked up and copied. Feel free to jump in folks, but I do not think that there were very many Italianate churches built.  I suggest that you get a basic architectural styles book, or come back with more questions.  Carptrash (talk) 23:44, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Answer This church was begun in 1845. It's certainly a very convincing "Romanesque" building, but it is Romanesque revival. It could be called "Italianate" in a general sort of way, because it imitates an Italian Romanesque building rather than a British "Norman" one. But usually the term "Italianate" is used for buildings that imitate the Italian REnaissance rather than Italian Romanesque. It probaly has some Byzantine deatils because many genuine Italian Romanesque buildings do have Byzantine details. Italian Byzantine churches were richer in carving and ornate capitals and twisted columns.

Incidentally, very few Romanesque revival churches were built in England in the early 19th century. This church is a rarity. Churches were nearly always "Gothic revival". The architect may have visited Assisi. If you look at pics on Commons of Italian Romanesque churches, you will soon find which ones were the inspriation of this one. Amandajm (talk) 15:45, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
 * The British will always call this style "Italianate" purely because of the design of the campanile. British Empire Italianate architecture took the tower (Campaniele on churches and belvedere on domestic) as a defining symbol of Italianate architecture adapting in the 19th century. Giano (talk) 16:26, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Importance
This is a generic article of top importance, rather than "high". Amandajm (talk) 15:30, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Italianate in Canada
I'm not familiar enough with the other provinces to be able to write a Canada section, but Italianate's fairly common in British Columbia, with three notable high-profile examples I can think of, though one is demolished - the Second Hotel Vancouver (1916), the Emily Carr House in Victoriaand - I think it's Italianate - Hycroft Manor in Shaugnessy; maybe it's Neo-Classical but up close it seems ab it ornate for that; the view in the image is from the north; the rear entranche's port cochere and uphill windows seem clearly italianate, sorry I can't provide an image. Italianate's often seen integrated with Queen Anne elements in Vancouver and Victoria, and seems to have also been widely used in the British Columbia Interior in Edwardian times, though most examples are now vanished; the old Exhibition Buildings at Hastings Park, which had to be demolished in the '20s due to structural deficiencies, were an Italianate-California hybrid (Italianate with distinct Mexican characteristics, that is), and also had a glass conservatory roof London-Exhibition style (the roof was, i believe, the reason the building was unstable and had to be taken down - great shame, I'll see if I can find a pic). Italianate storefronts are numerous in Gastown, sorry I can't provide examples, I'm living in Halifax now...I see the occasional bit of Italianate here, mostly smaller frame buildings, I'll try to remember to take some pics if I see one...Skookum1 (talk) 18:01, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

 * A small pic of the Emily Carr House in its linked official website seems somewhat consistent with Italianate style, though it could be Gothic Revival or other. Italianate elements that matter include brackets beneath a wide overhang of a low/flat roof, and rounded tops of windows. --doncram (talk) 19:42, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

balance vs. Vanderbilt example
The Italianate style is important and widespread in the U.S., but generally looks quite different from the Vanderbilt mansion given prominence in the article. That is so unlike the usual application in an upscale farmhouse, where it is most common, that I think the Vanderbilt photo should be removed in favor of a couple more regular examples. --doncram (talk) 19:42, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
 * The Vanderbilt mansion is the classic prime example of the Italianate style - everything else is derived from that.  Giacomo   11:06, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
 * I know from wide experience with covering Italianate houses listed on the U.S. National Register of Historic Places over the last couple years, that the Vanderbilt mansion is NOT representative. Your assertion of that particular example's importance stirs me to look into the question further, by consulting the Virginia & Lee McAlester book A Field Guide to American Houses.  They specifically cover Italianate (generally 1840-1885) in one chapter and the later Italian Renaissance architecture style (generally 1890-1935) in another.  It is pretty clear to me based on comparing diagrams and photos in this source, that the 1895-built Vanderbilt mansion is of the latter type.  The Italian Renaissance style is more genuine in following actual Italian style, rather than being the American, vernacular popular interpretation that is the Italianate.  Italianate in the U.S. was a lot like Greek Revival architecture in the U.S.: it was an idea taken by Americans in the spirit of what they might have thought to be the foreign style, but implementing it in a very American and different way.  The Vanderbilt house is more in the more genuine-like Italian Renaissance style.

 * I note, by the way, that Richard Morris Hunt, the architect of this Vanderbilt mansion, is also the architect for the Vanderbilt family of the Biltmore mansion in North Carolina, which this same source presents as the prime example of the Chateauesque architecture style. It credits Morris as popularizing that style (as far as it went, it being limited to expensive, architect-designed mansions).  Perhaps the Vanderbilt mansion whose photo is discussed here, could also be regarded as a prime example and popularizer of the Italian Renaissance style.  It could not be the popularizer of the Italianate architectural period which was already ended or ending. --doncram (talk) 18:18, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

 * P.S. I note that Italian Renaissance architecture redirects to a general article on Renaissance architecture.  I think a separate article on the Italian Renaissance style is needed.  Perhaps i can make a start to that.  And, eventually, i am thinking the photo of the Vanderbilt mansion should be moved to that. --doncram (talk) 18:25, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * It seems to me, you would serve Wikipedia better by writing a page devoted to the Italianate style and its evolution in North America. "Chateauesque" is a ridiculous meaningless term and almost every building of note described as being in that style is French Neo-Renaissance. Those buidings not of note, would be better described as "confused Gothic with roofs loosely by Mansard." Breakers is the USA's best known building in the Italianate style, as such it should remain. That it's architect was capable of working in more than one style is immaterial. Finally. Breakers should not be included in a page on the Italian Renaissance architecture because it is not, it is Italianate not Italian. A considerable difference.   Giacomo   19:01, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

 * Hey, i resent the snooty comments that various American styles are ridiculous! Actually, u make me laugh a little;  i don't really mind. :)  I agree, factually, that the American versions are not "genuine" implementations of Italian or French styles.  They're American.  (Aside:  Go, U.S.A.!  Our football is better than your football!  Our pizza is better than yours!)  And the Vanderbilt mansion is not Italianate, as the term is defined and used in the U.S.;  your repetition does not make the assertion true.  I would be interested to see any quote or source you can providde about it being the prime example of the Italianate style started in American by Alexander Jackson Davis.  About splitting out articles, I guess upon further thought there probably should be a section in this article about both of the two American styles, and then there should also be a separate article about each one.  Both the American version of Italianate architecture and the American version of Italian Renaissance architecture seem to be noteworthy and seem to be topics for coverage in this Italianate architecture article. --doncram (talk) 19:26, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * As I insinuated, there is an amzingly large world outside of the USA. Chateauesque is not a term widely used outside of the USA, the land of the Batman Mansion and Hollywood Spooky House. However, I'm afraid that regardless of your personal views, Breakers is Italianate in the wideley and generally understood meaning of the word. It has all the features, albeit in purest form, of "American Italianate." If I had the time, I would write a page on American Italianate Architecture, but I don't and I don't really have the interest either - to me it always looks like British bourgeois seaside architecture. There is huge dearth of pages on USA architecture and how it has interpretated European forms - is there nothing native? - that needs redressing. As for football, ignoring the most recent litle hiccup, I would refer you to this. Is that The Star-Spangled Banner? - It sure sounds a lot more lively.  Giacomo   20:46, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

 * I have to concur with the above comments that Breakers is NOT Italianate, at least not "American Italianate" as you call it (a request for citation has been issued), further, that McAlester is not personal views, and that a highly respected and seminal work on the topic of American residential architecture. According to at least a couple of sources, Italianate in American as a style which was based less on Renaissance revival and more on country villas, which may be a sufficiently different spin such that a separate page is warranted. I take that challenged issued above, and may likely soon be soon creating "Italianate architecture in the United States" to help split the discrepancy, as it must be seriously and scholarly addressed. The American branch of architectural history (the field of study, not the history of architecture), unlike as suggested above, cannot be summarily dismissed, particularly when it comes to issues of American architectural heritage. Morgan Riley (talk) 03:52, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I further move that a more representative image be chosen for the American section, and further, that the article be allowed to incorporate a broader perspective of the Italianate style, with a consensus based level, rather than imposing a singular viewpoint. For instance, there is bound to be a top-level image that is of both the British and american (for instance, one of the Campanile ones from the mid-century, as the main image is far more a generic Renaissance revival, than specifically Italianate) Morgan Riley (talk) 04:05, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Looking through the examples and reading more closely, I see that much of it seems to be an issue of core stylistic concerns versus tangential ones, where some of the tangents are having problems. I have changed some images to reflect this, in hopes of reaching a more center ground, and that a separate article does not look like it will be necessary to reflect a world-wide view (the Australian examples gave me much hope). The breakers has been hidden in a comment until it can be conclusively verifiable, as other sources, e.g. McAlestar, indicate otherwise. Of note, it appears that the controversy may be that while the Breakers is derived from Italian Rennaisance revivals, it also is around the time of a number of other Mediterranean revivals, that were independent of the "Italianate" movement )which according to McAlestar had begun fading with the financial crises in the ate 19th century). See, e.g., the Jefferson Hotel in Richmond, Virginia, built around the same time period as the Breakers, and yet not classified as Italianate, despite heavy similarities in style, and drawing from Italian renaissance influences. I am going to add text when I can start assembling sufficient resources (i.e. citations). It may take some work, but I think it can all be sorted out. Cheers. Morgan Riley (talk) 05:42, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Neither Stein, Susan R., ed., The Architecture of ‘’Richard Morris Hunt, University of Chicago Press, Chicago IL, 1986 nor Downing, Antoinette F. and Vincent J Scully, Jr., The Architectural Heritage of Newport Rhode Island: 1640-1915, American Legacy Press, New York, 1967 ever use the word "Italianate" while discussion the Breakers. I feel that all the Breakers references in this article should be removed. Carptrash (talk) 06:34, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Action taken on images and Breakers references. Morgan Riley (talk) 14:14, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Thanks. Carptrash (talk) 14:44, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Bad examples used?
The examples in the gallery don't seem to typify the style. Two of them are Victorian architecture with some Italianate features. I think we should sort out some better examples to include and weed out ambiguous or inaccurate examples. Candleabracadabra (talk) 17:33, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I agree with you Candleabracadabra that a few poor examples have crept in, but which ones specifically are you objecting to. At the end of the day, Italianate architecture is just Victorian architecture which a few Italianesque features - often not very many. It's a very loose style and not easily defined.   Giano   21:41, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Your point is well taken Giano, and indeed upon looking into it further Italiate has come to be appliled rather broadly. But I think it's best to be careful and precise. I think there is a difference between Victorian architecture with Italianate features and Italianate architecture. I think we'd be best served to use examples that typify the style instead of ones that may have some features that can be described as Italianate. The Bidwell Mansion and the Farnam Mansion for starters do not seem to me to be good examples. They would be more appropriate illustrations for Victorian architecture. The images should be illustrative not ambiguous (at best). Likewise the Albury Railway Station has some Italianate features, but doesn't seem like a great example. Perhaps I'm being too strict, but I think if we're going to be loose and include style mixes then we should clarify in the captions which parts are Italianate.

, Merchants Bank Building (commercial example). Anyway. Those are my thoughts. Happy New Year. Candleabracadabra (talk) 23:04, 3 January 2014 (UTC)

 * The Villa Vizcaya also looks Italianate to me, but I see it has a whole bunch of its own architectural descriptors applied to it. So perhaps what's really meant by italianate is just that there are arches and maybe some columns? Seems rather loose to me. But perhaps I'm mixin up italianate with Italian Villa architecture or these other styles. Candleabracadabra (talk) 23:10, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I fully understand and appreciate where you are coming from Candleabracadabra, over the years I have removed the photo's of many dodgy examples. Before studying architecture, I used to think there must be a style called Spooky American Gothic, but I now know that's the American take on Italianate. However, the Bidwell Mansion is Italianate by any nation's definition - the others you mention just scrape in too. Take a look at Osbourne House (considered a prime example) really it's only a hybrid of "Georgian architecture" (itself a loose imprecise term evolved from Italian/Palladian architecture) with a couple of seigneurial/belvedere towers stuck on the top for good measure. It's a pity we can't say that only attempts to faithfully copy Italian architecture (like Cliveden) can represent the style, but we can't because that would be wrong. I think it has to be accepted that it's a pretty loose and all encompassing style - do alter the captions to explain this though if you want to, and in the text to; but it'll be hard to find references to state a particular building is a poor example of the style - that's the problem.    Giano   08:45, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I think you are absolutely correct on all counts. Thank you for the cogent explanation and happy new year. Candleabracadabra (talk) 14:23, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
 * The whole subject is a debatable ambiguity. From you post, I just checked out Category:Italian Renaissance Revival architecture in the United States and saw Humble Oil Building and Kindel Building to name but a few in that category; to be frank' I don't think I have the energy or will to even go there. All we can do is make sure that the images shown here at Italianate architecture are at least vaguely in that style. Happy New Year to you too Candleabracadabra. Regards.  Giano   21:09, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Italianate architecture


text:
Talk:Sabian Cymbals

Notable Artists?
It looks like someone deleted the Notable artists section of the page. Any reason why? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chasdenonno (talk • contribs) 06:18, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

Untitled
I suggest the section listing notable artists who use Sabian be alphabetized by last name rather than first. 30/06/2011 Chumbukket (talk) 14:22, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

I'm gonna call NPOV on the Paragon line section. It reads like an ad for Sabian please, please edit it.

I hope my comments on the consistency of the AA line aren't POV or original research. They do come close! I was there to see it happen. My first Sabian was a 12" AA Mini Chinese, another Sabian initiative.

Up until that time the most consistent top-of-the-line manufacturer by far had been Paiste, who had adopted many automated techniques but played down the degree of mechanisation. Sabian AAs were unapologetically produced by mechanised hammering, and IMO it wasn't a coincidence that they achieved a level of consistency that up until then had only been available in some student cymbal lines, none of which were the still well regarded bell bronze alloy. Andrewa 13:37, 26 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Don't know what to do with this, from 24.36.86.157; feel free to delete: "The famed hammersmith Ken Thompson worked on peart for 21 straight hours for the 19" China." 69.169.49.12 06:51, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

This article reads like an ad for sabian more than a useful source of information on the company.

My dad says he used Sabian ccymbals in the early 70s-maybe he got confused with zildjian, but anybody has any info on cymbal manufacturers with similarities to sabian (other than zildjian) i would appreciate it-maybe zildjian had a temporary sabian line or something?

No, it's not possible, Sabian was incorporated in 1981. 2006 marked it's 25th year. The only other major cymbal company around before that was [Paiste], a Swiss company that was formed (or brought to America) in about 1936. He probably just gets Zildjian/Sabian confused, as Sabian today is more similar to Zildjian then.ReignMan

Sabian Symbols
Does anyone know whether the Sabian Symbols (astroligical) might have had something to do with the name? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.80.125.229 (talk) 02:18, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Sabian and Zildjian use absolutely the same alloy, so it's a complete absurd to say and wright it here, that the sound of zildjians is more mellow as compared to sabian.. moreover, there's diversity of different models, some of them are designed to sound rough and loud (rock or metall models), some designed to have more warm and quiet tone.. for instance, Sabian HH Sound Control Crash is way and way softer and more musical than Zildjian Z Custom Power Crash; it all depends on the intended characteristics of specific models. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.163.6.63 (talk) 18:18, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

History
I haven't been able to find out when it went in, but this line appears at the end of the history section

"In 2012 a new manufactory was opened in Armenia."

This doesn't sound credible to me, and it has no reference or other information with which to verify it. A search of the Sabian web site reveals no announcement, and a Google search reveals nothing either. I have flagged this for now as citation needed (because I'm a newbie) and will come back and remove it at some future date.

Zenstat (talk) 07:06, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

Requested move 2 June 2021

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved with a DAB at Sabian (technical move requested at WP:RMT) (non-admin closure) Lennart97 (talk) 14:09, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

Sabian → Sabian Cymbals – Not primary for the singular. "Be he a Muslim, a Jew , a Christian or a Sabian.." the page views for the mysterious Quran group Sabians are 6 times greater than the cymbal manufacture, and in books Sabian is found frequently relating to the Quran not to cymbals. Sabian Cymbals would be a more WP:NATURAL and WP:CRITERIA fitting title than Sabian (company) or (cymbals), and Category:Cymbal_manufacturing_companies has several articles with Cymbals such as Crescent Cymbals. Not sure what to do with the singular, redirect to Sabians probably. "Sabaean" redirects to Sabaeans, or maybe a dab. In ictu oculi (talk) 08:31, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
 * "Sabian Cymbals" with caps does occur in books though "Sabian cymbals" is inevitably more common https://www.google.co.uk/search?tbo=p&tbm=bks&q=%22sabian+cymbals%22&num=10
 * The comparison of Sabians and Sabian https://pageviews.toolforge.org/?project=en.wikipedia.org&platform=all-access&agent=user&redirects=0&range=latest-20&pages=Sabian|Sabians

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
 * Support, and support dab at basename, since we have Kip Sabian, Sabian (wrestler), Sabian Cox, and possibly more. 162 etc. (talk) 14:58, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Support and DAB at basename.--Ortizesp (talk) 00:49, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Support per nom--RicardoNixon97 (talk) 14:45, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

Post-move comment: DAB created at Sabian. Not sure if Kip Sabian and Sabian Cox should be included as they are PTMs, but feel free to add them if you do think so. Lennart97 (talk) 15:00, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Sabian Cymbals


text: Category:Turkish Cypriot politicians

title: Category:Turkish Cypriot politicians


text:
Twisted cubic

In mathematics, a twisted cubic is a smooth, rational curve C of degree three in projective 3-space P3. It is a fundamental example of a skew curve. It is essentially unique, up to projective transformation (the twisted cubic, therefore). In algebraic geometry, the twisted cubic is a simple example of a projective variety that is not linear or a hypersurface, in fact not a complete intersection. It is the three-dimensional case of the rational normal curve, and is the image of a Veronese map of degree three on the projective line.

Definition

The twisted cubic is most easily given parametrically as the image of the map

 * $$\nu:\mathbf{P}^1\to\mathbf{P}^3$$

which assigns to the homogeneous coordinate $$[S:T]$$ the value

 * $$\nu:[S:T] \mapsto [S^3:S^2T:ST^2:T^3].$$

In one coordinate patch of projective space, the map is simply the moment curve

 * $$\nu:x \mapsto (x,x^2,x^3)$$

That is, it is the closure by a single point at infinity of the affine curve $$(x,x^2,x^3)$$.

The twisted cubic is a projective variety, defined as the intersection of three quadrics. In homogeneous coordinates $$[X:Y:Z:W]$$ on P3, the twisted cubic is the closed subscheme defined by the vanishing of the three homogeneous polynomials
 * $$F_0 = XZ - Y^2$$
 * $$F_1 = YW - Z^2$$
 * $$F_2 = XW - YZ.$$

It may be checked that these three quadratic forms vanish identically when using the explicit parameterization above; that is, substitute x3 for X, and so on.

More strongly, the homogeneous ideal of the twisted cubic C is generated by these three homogeneous polynomials of degree 2.

Properties
The twisted cubic has the following properties:
 * It is the set-theoretic complete intersection of $$XZ - Y^2$$ and $$Z(YW-Z^2)-W(XW-YZ)$$, but not a scheme-theoretic or ideal-theoretic complete intersection; meaning to say that the ideal of the variety cannot be generated by only 2 polynomials; a minimum of 3 are needed. (An attempt to use only two polynomials make the resulting ideal not radical, since $$(YW-Z^2)^2$$ is in it, but $$YW-Z^2$$ is not).
 * Any four points on C span P3.
 * Given six points in P3 with no four coplanar, there is a unique twisted cubic passing through them.
 * The union of the tangent and secant lines (the secant variety) of a twisted cubic C fill up P3 and the lines are pairwise disjoint, except at points of the curve itself. In fact, the union of the tangent and secant lines of any non-planar smooth algebraic curve is three-dimensional. Further, any smooth algebraic variety with the property that every length four subscheme spans P3 has the property that the tangent and secant lines are pairwise disjoint, except at points of the variety itself.
 * The projection of C onto a plane from a point on a tangent line of C yields a cuspidal cubic.
 * The projection from a point on a secant line of C yields a nodal cubic.
 * The projection from a point on C yields a conic section.

title: Twisted cubic


text:
USS Erie (1813)

USS Erie was a three-masted, wooden-hulled sloop-of-war of the United States Navy in the early 19th century.

Launch
Erie was launched 3 November 1813 by Thomas Kemp, Baltimore, Maryland; and first put to sea 20 March 1814, Commander Charles G. Ridgeley in command.

Service in the Mediterranean
Unable to reach the open sea because of the British blockade at Hampton Roads, Erie was forced to return to Baltimore 7 April 1814 where she remained berthed at Baltimore without a crew until early in 1815. On 8 May she sailed to Boston, Massachusetts to join Commodore William Bainbridge's squadron sailing for the Mediterranean 2 July. With peace concluded with Algiers before the squadron reached the area, the squadron returned to the United States, leaving Erie to cruise with the naval force assigned to protect commerce and guard against any further disturbance of peace by the Barbary States. She remained on station for 4 years, sailing from Gibraltar for home 27 November 1819. After calling at Madeira and in the West Indies, she reached New York 20 January 1820, and was laid up there for repairs for 3½ years.

Lengthened to 122 ft and with her tonnage increased to 611 tons, Erie sailed from New York in November 1823 to serve in the Mediterranean until 1826. From 1827 to 1832, she was based at Pensacola, Florida, returning north to New York or Norfolk, Virginia for necessary repairs. Erie patrolled in the West Indies and off the coast of Mexico, protecting American citizens and property, suppressing the slave trade, and convoying merchantmen.

Service in South America
After lying in ordinary at Boston from 21 August 1832 to 24 June 1834, Erie served on the Brazil Station for 3 years, as flagship during the last two. During a period of revolution and other political disturbance, her squadron gave protection to Americans and their commerce, and provided vital intelligence concerning Brazil, Uruguay, and Argentina. She was again in ordinary at Boston from 15 September 1837 to 4 February 1838, and on 9 February sailed to cruise the Atlantic coast, to aid any merchantmen she might find in distress. In July, she sailed to Pensacola to patrol the West Indies and Gulf of Mexico for 2 weeks, guarding American interests during the French blockade of Mexican ports.

Service in the Pacific
Between July 1840 and February 1843, Erie was rebuilt at Boston, and converted into an armed storeship. She sailed for the Pacific 9 February, delivered supplies to ships on the Brazil Station en route, and reached Callao, Peru, 27 July. During a cruise to the Hawaiian and Society Islands between November 1843 and January 1844, she served as flagship and in June 1844, she sailed for New York, arriving 10 November.

Erie crossed the Atlantic to supply the African Squadron, then repaired at New York, returning to the Pacific Squadron 18 November 1845. When the Mexican–American War opened, Erie was in the Hawaiian Islands, but she returned to the coasts of Mexico, California, and Panama in August 1846, to supply the fleet in its operations at sea and in landings. She participated in the occupation of Mazatlán 11 November 1847, and shortly thereafter sailed for the east coast, reaching New York 24 June 1848.

Last Voyages
Erie set sail for the coast of Africa and the Mediterranean 15 September 1848 to deliver supplies to ships on those stations. She returned to New York 11 July 1849 and between 6 September 1849 and 12 September 1850, twice more voyaged to the Mediterranean with supplies. She was sold in New York 26 November 1850.

title: USS Erie (1813)


text:
Talk:Murcia

old edits
I have edited the article erasing two references that,IMHO, were wrong

- Jewish festival marginally celebrated: I was born and bred in Murcia and never ever heard about any Jewish community or festival there. Of course, maybe some jewish people live in Murcia and celebrate their festivals, but no more than any other community. As an exemple, Im sure that St.Patricks day is much more celebrated in Murcia by Irish community As of march 2010 the jewish community numbers 850 more or less and the irish community has yet to be counted.

- Civil War suffering: Of course all of Spain suffered greatly during Civil War, but it is difficult to maintain that there were any special suffering in Murcia. On the contrary, Murcia was not at any moment during the war, near to the front line. In fact it was always in the heart of the republican controlled area and it was taken by the nationalist troops the day before the end of the war when all resistence had ceased

External Link
I added a link to www.bootsnall.com/articles/06-09/a-handful-of-spanish-towns-elche-orihuela-murcia-cartagena-and-alicante-spain.html "A Handful of Spanish Towns" It's a travel story covering Elche, Orihuela, Murcia, Cartagena and Alicante.

Scribbleman 09:45, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

 * Is that link really needed? It is a very short story, in a page full of adds. Does it add something that could not be otherwise included in the article? Remember that Wikipedia is not a collection of links, people can use Google to find links like that. --Anna Lincoln 09:53, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, the piece about Murcia is short, but that's the idea: snapshots of five neighboring towns. The link needed? Not if you see Murcia as a place alone in space - but maybe needed if you accept that your article will also be studied by tourists, for whom my link could serve as a brief introduction and a mutual reminder that each of those towns has also interesting neighbors. The link does not add cool facts, but tries to broaden the view. You write about a page "full of ads". Well, that's part of getting one's message out, isn't it? Shall we drop the link?

Scribbleman 06:08, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
 * External links policy on Advertising and conflicts of interest states You should avoid linking to a website that you own, maintain or represent, and in this case, you are Terje Raa . Unfortunately your conflict of interest editing involves contributing to Wikipedia in order to promote yourself and your articles. Such a conflict is strongly discouraged. Your contributions to wikipedia under Scribbleman  consist entirely of promoting Terje Raa / bootsnall.com / travellady.com and is considered  WP:Spam. Looking through your contributions as a whole, the all seem to be Terje Raa/bootsnall.com/travellady.com related only . Please do not continue adding links to your own websites to Wikipedia. It has become apparent that your account are only being used for spamming inappropriate external links and for self-promotion.  Wikipedia is NOT a "repository of links" or a "vehicle for advertising" and persistent spammers will have their websites blacklisted. Any further spamming may result in your account and/or your IP address being blocked from editing Wikipedia. Avoid breaching relevant policies and guidelines. You're here to improve Wikipedia -- not just to promote yourself, right?  --Hu12 13:55, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

Probably when tourists worldwide think about visiting a place called murcia they google it and wikipedia is in the top aspot thanks to great editos like yourself. What they read here must must must be FACTS not falsehoods. However there are facts that although not big are facts and would attract tourism money jobs to our city. Your job is not to MARKET murcia ,thats mine!! comunidadjudia murcia es mi responsibilidad I know youll never allow anything false nor unimportant .Youre the judge and that means your opinion your view is what counts. If you never heard of it it can still enter here if well documented.Proof is the word!

Wkipedia is the window on our city and you are the window cleaner. We are the little stickers that one puts on a window so that nobody runs into it when the glass is very clean.. Please consider this. Murcia will hold its head high by telling the facts.But facts that are attractive might be given a place here as long as they are facts.

thank you for your support raquel samper comunidadjudia murcia —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.38.17.233 (talk) 22:19, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

add ons to our history
Pedestrian areas cover most of the old town centred around Platería and Trapería Streets. Plateria refers to the silver and other precious metals once brokered on this street by the jewish community. Traperia or cloths refers to this street once being center of the murcia garment area.(my addon contains no link to any personal site.It simply explains the interesting meaning history of our city) Trapería goes from the Cathedral to the Plaza de Santo Domingo, the former market square. Located in Trapería is the Casino, a social club erected in 1847, with a sumptuous interior that includes a Moorish-style patio inspired by the Alhambra royal rooms —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.148.97.68 (talk) 20:06, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Tourism
Im a murciano born and raised. I know quite alot about murcia as i work as a lawyer in the consejeria de cultura.First,we are number 3 in all spain for language tourism.Our university of murcia attracts many people worldwide to come here to study spanish.We speak english here too but not like in madrid or salamanca where on every corner the spanish student bumps into a fellow american. We are in the top five in all spain for general tourism as we have better weather transport priced hotels than many other cities.We attract many spanish people to la manga as well as countless foreigners.We say "next time youre in madrid since youre very close,why not take a few days off and visit spain?"In cnn mtv and tbs we are "More & More Murcia",a very successful campaign.

We have the top rated spas in archena mula and fortuna according to michelin guide. Finally and not official, Paramount Park has chosen murcia for its new park which will be the largest amusement park in all spain and second only to disneyparis in europe.Paramount chose murcia not to increase our tourism but because we already have big tourism and paramount wants to take advantage. Murcia will continue to clearly market itself in wikipedia according to your rules. Too many people just google to find out about holiday possibilities and wikipedia shows up first so weve got to talk straight here and be here according to your rules.We say the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth about our city of murcia rsamper —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.148.97.68 (talk) 07:23, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Your English is problematic... --'''Attilios''' (talk) 16:18, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Climate charts
I fixed them, they had reverted to text for some while before I turned them back in to Wiki tables for you.--Wipsenade (talk) 17:13, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

education
3 types of ts schools...private public and semi private...the private might be limonar ingles y colegio san jorge. No need to mention DOS colegios del ingles.WHY!! also monteagudo is private so you have 3 types..ingles.religioso y secular...VOILA!!

public you have alfonsox ceip san pablo etc etc etc

ceoncertado maristas jesus maria capuchinos.. I dont see why you paint murcia as having only private english language schools and no other type.. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.43.122.132 (talk) 16:35, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

Education
As a teacher in Limonar and kings college I just say you are quite aware Of murcia .one improvement might be to clarify that Limonar is an American school .our license is from the USA not England.Kings college is British. And all Colegios publicos in my city are bilingual .Alfonso ies being the only trilingual with English French German  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.139.193.163 (talk) 06:48, 17 May 2016 (UTC)

murcia is on the map we got a starbucks in 2016
having a Starbucks might be considered to be recognized in a funny way by an international company.They finally see Murcia as cosmopolitan enough for locals to drink 4 dollar coffees and sit on sofas..Murcia has other signs of arriving like a el corte ingles the Macy's of Spain.Well the Starbucks is really inside the el corte ingles.Not here to promote coffee of Starbucks..Just to say Murcia is the last Mohican in Spain to have this franchise.Tourists might come.Erasmus students love expensive coffee.But locals mostly will learn soon that having this franchise might show that Murcia earnings are higher. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.139.193.163 (talk) 18:50, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
 * Hi 2.139.193.163, unfortunately having a Starbucks is not an important enough fact to include on this page. Quasar G. (talk) 12:38, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

About the Economy section
Most content of this section is not about Murcia municipality economy facts but about Region of Murcia economy facts. The hectares devoted to growing vineyards, General Electric (which is placed in Cartagena municipality) and Paramount Studios entreprises (which is placed in Alhama de Murcia municipality, and the golf contribution to the economy are some facts that I have researched by Internet.

In tried to getr through some editors who have added these pieces of information, but I have not received any response.

--Yolanda95 (talk) 13:32, 7 January 2021 (UTC)Yolanda95

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Murcia&type=revision&diff=9724425&oldid=9236134

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Murcia&type=revision&diff=246212706&oldid=246212427

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Murcia&type=revision&diff=405055161&oldid=404432384

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:141.155.57.139

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:79.148.97.68

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:69.251.161.203

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:MattinScotland

Famous people from Murcia
I don’t know how to edit, would someone add Ana Carrasco to famous people. She is the 2018 World SSP300 motorcycle world champion. 66.211.127.141 (talk) 21:15, 7 November 2022 (UTC)
 * ❌, Ana Carrasco was born in Cehegín, 66 km away from Murcia, this article is for the city not the region. I will add it there. Alexcalamaro (talk) 13:53, 24 November 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Murcia


text:
Henry Lazarus

Henry Lazarus (1 January 1815 – 6 March 1895) was the leading British clarinet virtuoso of the 19th century. George Bernard Shaw wrote of Henry Lazarus: He was the best clarionet [old spelling, now clarinet] player in England; when you were sitting behind Costa at the Opera you listened for certain phrases from the clarionet just as you did from the prima donna, except that you were much less likely to be disappointed in the former case.

Lazarus was born in London. Raised as an orphan in the Royal Military Asylum in Chelsea, he there learned the instrument from the bandmaster John Blizzard. He later studied under Charles Godfrey, bandmaster of the Coldstream Guards. His solo debut came in 1838.

"After fulfilling engagements in various theatrical and other orchestras, he was appointed second clarinet in the Sacred Harmonic Society in 1838. In 1840, he became first clarinetist at the opera, and at the principal concerts in London and the provinces, and was immediately recognized as the foremost clarinetist in all England. " In 1871 he gave a highly successful concert tour of England and Wales with the pianist Stephen Kemp.

Lazarus was professor of clarinet at the Royal Academy of Music from 1854 to 1895 and at the Military School of Music (Kneller Hall) "for a considerable period" from 1858. He wrote a Method for the Clarinet based on the Boehm system, although he used primarily Albert System instruments, made by Eugène Albert, himself – some horns are even stamped, "Approved by Mr. Lazarus". His method books are still in use today, and include duets, etudes, studies, finger exercises, scales, etc.

Lazarus also played the basset horn and saxophone.

"In both orchestral and solo playing, the beauty and richness of his tone, his excellent phrasing, and his neat and expressive execution were equally admired. He gave a farewell concert in St. James Hall, [on] 31 May 1892, and died in London, [on] 6 March 1895, and was buried in Brompton Cemetery, London, after having given to the world the wonderful method which bears his name (Lazarus Clarinet School), and which will stand as a monument to his greatness. "

Compositions
Works include

 * Fantasia on Favorite Scotch Melodies
 * Fantasia on Airs from Bellini's 'I Puritani'

and many others.

title: Henry Lazarus


text:
Category:GnRH agonists

GnRH agonists are drugs that act like gonadotropin releasing hormone (GnRH).

title: Category:GnRH agonists


text:
Abdur Rehman (cricketer, born 1980)

Abdur Rehman (Punjabi, عبدالرّحمٰن; born 1 March 1980, Sialkot, Punjab) is a Pakistani former cricketer who played for Pakistan in all formats. He is a slow left-arm orthodox bowler and a left-handed batsman. In October 2018, he announced his retirement from international cricket.

Domestic career
Abdur Rehman in 1999 took hauls of five and six wickets in successive matches while representing Pakistan Under-19 against South Africa. He was picked for the side even though he only had two first-class outings. His performances in domestic competitions have been notable, especially during the 2006–07 season where he ended up as the highest wicket-taker in the Pentangular Cup including an 11 wickets for champions Habib Bank Limited in the penultimate match of the season. He is the signed professional for 2017 playing for Newcastle City in the Northumberland and Tyneside Senior League.

He was the leading wicket-taker for Habib Bank Limited in the 2018–19 Quaid-e-Azam Trophy, with 46 dismissals in nine matches.

English county cricket
Abdur Rehman signed on as one of the two overseas players for Somerset County Cricket Club in July 2012, after the county had suffered a series of setbacks in securing a second overseas signing. After delays over his work permit visa, he played his first match against Nottinghamshire on 7 August. In the last four-day championship match of the 2012 season at the County Ground, Taunton, in September, Abdur Rehman took a career-best tally of 9–95 against Worcestershire.

On 7 November 2014, Abdur Rehman signed a contract to return to Somerset as their overseas player for the entirety of the 2015 season.

International career
In January 2012, Abdur Rehman took his first five-wicket haul in a Test, taking 6/25 as Pakistan bowled England out for 72 in the second innings of the second Test of their series in the United Arab Emirates. He took another five-wicket haul (5/40) in England's first innings of the Third Test in Dubai, as Pakistan won the series 3–0.

In 2012 he was banned for 12 weeks by the ECB after testing positive for the drug cannabis.

He bowled three consecutive beamers in an ODI match against Bangladesh on 4 March 2014 and had to be taken off for the match; he became the first bowler to concede 8 runs in one over without bowling a ball. After this performance in this series he has not been picked in all three categories ever since. He was picked by Peshawar Zalmi (PSL's Team) in draft on 22 December 2015.

title: Abdur Rehman (cricketer, born 1980)


text:
Talk:Rama (disambiguation)

Untitled
Isn't Rama also the demon that seduces people from acquiring nirvana. (Budhist) ??

 * No, it's 'Mara'.  :)  Jakris 12:45 4 Mar 05 UTC.
 * Cool. My next (well, first) novel will have twin sisters named Maya and Mara Samsara. [grin] --Jerzy•t 20:30, 2005 August 18 (UTC)

Leads
Note Well: Don't add a Dab entry on a topic until it has at least a mention in a WP article. Unless it is the subject of an article, lk only to the article with the mention (rather than creating a red lk). See Dab MoS).

These senses don't even have a mention in a stub. They need to find a better place than clogging a Dab, to advertise their (possible) article-worthiness via red lks. Here, for instance:
 * Rama is a city in Nicaragua
 * ''' .... Also, it is the name of a small region around the town of Prozor.
 * Rama, Nicaragua
 * Rama River
 * Rama, Herzegovina
 * Prozor --Jerzy•t 20:30, 2005 August 18 (UTC)
 * Duchy of Rama --Jerzy•t 06:18, 2005 August 23 (UTC)

"Rama (disambiguation)" is not an Article but a Navigational Facility
A recent edit made Rama (disambiguation) significantly more informative abt the Rama, aka Sri Ramachandra and described as a king in India, at an indefinable time at the very least 2500 years ago, who was an incarnation of the god Vishnu.

Of course, that Rama is the subject of Rama, while Rama (disambiguation) is not an article about him, nor an article at all. It is a navigational mechanism for the aid of certain users looking for various articles on topics they might call "Rama". But to be more precise, not any such topic. Because of the fact of Rama (disambiguation) not being lk'd from any article except Rama, the users this page is supposed to help are almost exclusively those who The exceptions are those who do 1 and 2, and then click on the same lk, but by mistake.
 * 1) Either type "Rama" in the "Go" box, or click on a lk (possibly piped) for Rama;
 * 2) Then encounter at the very top of that article this text (or a future variation on it): "This article is about a Hindu incarnation of God (i.e., Vishnu) and king of ancient India, for other meanings see Rama (disambiguation).";
 * 3) Then click on the lk at the end of that text bcz they are looking for a different Rama.

So the Dab page is almost entirely not about that Rama. And enhancing the Dab page's information on that Rama (beyond the meager hint that might be needed by those who clicked by mistake) is not only wasted effort, but clutter interfering with fulfilling the Dab's purpose for existing.

For that reason, the Wiktionary lk to "Rama" (solely about Ramachandra and solely a dictdef), and most of the additional substance added on that Rama in the edit cited, and some earlier information on that Rama put here mostly bcz i was confused by reading the lead 'graph in Rama, has been removed.

The 9 Thai kings have also been restored here, saving their readers a click that would do no one any good. --Jerzy•t 06:18, 2005 August 23 (UTC)

Changing text on Frederick Lenz to be less opinioned and stick with the facts. Changing, "Frederick Lenz, spiritual guru and alleged cult leader, called himself Rama" to "Frederick Lenz, a spiritual teacher who used Rama as his teaching name". Changing for several reasons: LibHead 19:02, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
 * the phrase "spiritual guru" is redundant, the word guru implies spiritual. Changing to spiritual teacher as this is less ambiguous in the English language than the word guru.
 * removing the word "alleged" that is an opinion. wiki focuses on encyclopedic content, not allegations, unless perhaps in a criticism section found in the article, not the disambiguation page.
 * clarifying that Frederick Lenz used the name Rama as a part of his spiritual teachings. In the workplace, business, and common day affairs, he used his given name, Dr. Frederick Lenz.

Game Redundancy
The computer game RAMA is listed twice, under "Fiction" and then under "Misc." I'm leaving only the one under "Fiction" because of its relation to the novel. -MisterStark 15:18, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

title: Talk:Rama (disambiguation)


text:
C.mmp

The C.mmp was an early multiple instruction, multiple data (MIMD) multiprocessor system developed at Carnegie Mellon University (CMU) by William Wulf (1971). The notation C.mmp came from the PMS notation of Gordon Bell and Allen Newell, where a central processing unit (CPU) was designated as C, a variant was noted by the dot notation, and mmp stood for Multi-Mini-Processor. , the machine is on display at CMU, in Wean Hall, on the ninth floor.

Structure
Sixteen Digital Equipment Corporation PDP-11 minicomputers were used as the processing elements, named Compute Modules (CMs) in the system. Each CM had a local memory of 8K and a local set of peripheral devices. One of the challenges was that a device was only available through its unique connected processor, so the input/output (I/O) system (designed by Roy Levin) hid the connectivity of the devices and routed the requests to the hosting processor. If a processor went down, the devices connected to its Unibus became unavailable, which became a problem in overall system reliability. Processor 0 (the boot processor) had the disk drives attached.

Each of the Compute Modules shared these communication pathways:
 * An Interprocessor bus – used to distribute system-wide clock, interrupt, and process control messaging among the CMs
 * A 16x16 crossbar switch – used to connect the 16 CMs on one side and 16 banks of shared memory on the other. If all 16 processors were accessing different banks of memory, the memory accesses would all be concurrent. If two or more processors were trying to access the same bank of memory, one of them would be granted access on one cycle and the remainder would be negotiated on subsequent memory cycles.

Since the PDP-11 had a logical address space of 16-bits, another address translation unit was added to expand the address space to 25 bits for the shared memory space. The Unibus architecture provided 18 bits of physical address, and the two high-order bits were used to select one of four relocation registers which selected a bank of memory. Properly managing these registers was one of the challenges of programming the operating system (OS) kernel.

The original C.mmp design used magnetic-core memory, but during its lifetime, higher performance dynamic random-access memory (RAM) became available and the system was upgraded.

The original processors were PDP-11/20 processors, but in the final system, only five of these were used; the remaining 11 were PDP-11/40 processors, which were modified by having extra writeable microcode space. All modifications to these machines were designed and built at CMU.

Most of the 11/20 modifications were custom changes to the wire-wrapped backplane, but because the PDP-11/40 was implemented in microcode, a separate proc-mod board was designed that intercepted certain instructions and implemented the protected operating system requirements. For example, it was necessary, for operating system integrity, that the stack pointer register never be odd. On the 11/20, this was done by clipping the lead to the low-order bit of the stack register. On the 11/40, any access to the stack was intercepted by the proc-mod board and generated an illegal data access trap if the low-order bit was 1.

Operating system
The operating system (OS) was named Hydra. It was capability-based, object-oriented, multi-user, and a microkernel. System resources were represented as objects and protected through capabilities.

The OS and most application software was written in the programming language BLISS-11, which required cross-compiling on a PDP-10. The OS used very little assembly language.

Among the programming languages available on the system was an ALGOL 68 variant which included extensions supporting parallel computing, to make good use of the C.mmp. The ALGOL compiler ran native on Hydra OS.

Reliability
Because overall system reliability depended on having all 16 CPUs running, there were serious problems with overall hardware reliability. If the mean time between failures (MTBF) of one processor was 24 hours, then the overall system reliability was 16/24 hours, or about 40 minutes. Overall, the system usually ran for between two and six hours. Many of these failures were due to timing glitches in the many custom circuits added to the processors. Great effort was expended to improve hardware reliability, and when a processor was noticeably failing, it was partitioned out, and would run diagnostics for several hours. When it had passed a first set of diagnostics, it was partitioned back in as an I/O processor and would not run application code (but its peripheral devices were now available); it continued to run diagnostics. If it passed these after several more hours, it was reinstated as a full member of the processor set. Similarly, if a block of memory (one page) was detected as faulty, it was removed from the pool of available pages, and until otherwise notified, the OS would ignore this page. Thus, the OS became an early example of a fault-tolerant system, able to deal with hardware problems which arose, inevitably.

title: C.mmp


text:
Charles G. Ridgely

Charles Goodwin Ridgely (July 2, 1784 – February 8, 1848) was an officer in the United States Navy. He fought under Edward Preble in the First Barbary War (1804–1805), before serving as the commander of the Pacific Station (1820–1822), the West Indies Squadron (1827–1830), the Brooklyn Navy Yard (1833–1839), and the Brazil Squadron (1840–1842).

Early life and family
Charles Ridgely Goodwin was born in Baltimore, Maryland on July 2, 1784 to Dr. Lyde Goodwin (February 4, 1754 – August 19, 1801) and Abby Levy (August 12, 1760 – July 29, 1821). After joining the United States Navy, he legally changed to "Charles Goodwin Ridgely" at the behest of his uncle Charles Ridgely III, who also requested that his other nephew Charles Carnan Ridgely change his name from "Charles Ridgely Carnan".

Career
Ridgely was registered as a warranted midshipman in the United States Navy on October 17, 1799.

First Barbary War
Ridgely served as an officer under Edward Preble during the First Barbary War from 1804 to 1805. For their actions in the Second Battle of Tripoli Harbor, the United States Congress awarded a Congressional Gold Medal to Preble and "through him to the officers, petty officers, seamen and marines attached to the squadron under his command". Congress also presented "swords to each of the commissioned officers and Midshipmen who had distinguished themselves in the several attacks", including Ridgely.

Great Lakes and Mediterranean Squadron
He was appointed an acting lieutenant in May 1804 before being commissioned as a lieutenant on February 2, 1807. He was promoted to master commandant on July 24, 1813 and then commanded the USS Jefferson on Lake Ontario in 1814. Ridgely was promoted to captain on February 28, 1815. From 1815 to 1817, he was given command of the USS Erie and the USS Independence in the Mediterranean Squadron.

Pacific Squadron and the Peruvian War of Independence
In 1820, Ridgely was placed in command of the Pacific Station and sailed from Boston to his new post. He took the position hoping to support Chilean and Peruvian patriots of the Liberating Expedition of Peru in the Peruvian War of Independence.

During a delay in Rio de Janeiro to have the main mast on the USS Constellation replaced in preparation for rounding Cape Horn, Ridgely sought to reduce their midshipmen casualties to duels by enforcing mandatory pledges to refrain from dueling. 3 of his 29 midshipmen refused and were sent back home to resign their positions, but the Department of the Navy disagreed with Ridgely's policy and allowed them to remain in service. Nevertheless, the USS Constellation did not suffer further losses to duels after the incident.

On January 14, 1821, Ridgely arrived aboard the Constellation in Valparaíso, Chile to relieve John Downes, the previous commander of the Pacific Squadron, and the USS Macedonian. They met in March 1821 and then traveled together to Santiago, Chile to the American chargé d'affaires in Chile and meet Chilean officials. He soon befriended Sir Thomas Hardy commanding the South America Station of the British Royal Navy, but grew discontent with Lord Cochrane of the Chilean Navy and the independence fighters, whom he found to be "base and vulgar". He grew sympathetic towards the Spanish and offered political asylum to the former Viceroy of Peru, Joaquín de la Pezuela, aboard the Constellation, to the protest of the independence fighters.

Ridgely and HMS Conway independently and unsuccessfully tried to capture the royalist semi-pirate Vicente Benavides, who operated against local patriot vessels and against American shipping in the Pacific. They were unsuccessful but still managed to limit his effectiveness. Ridgely requested additional support from the US Navy as his lone frigate was significantly outgunned by the British and French squadrons. Charles Stewart set sail with the USS Franklin and USS Dolphin in September 1821 and arrived in April 1822 to relieve Ridgely.

West Indies Squadron, Brooklyn Navy Yard, and Brazil Squadron
From 1827 to 1830, Ridgely served as the flag officer of the West Indies Squadron and engaged in anti-piracy activities. From June 10, 1833 to November 19, 1839, he was the Commandant of the Brooklyn Navy Yard  At the Brooklyn Navy Yard, Ridgely also served as the first president of the Naval Lyceum. He was then appointed as the flag officer in command of the Brazil Squadron from 1840 to 1842.

Death
Ridgely died in Baltimore, Maryland on February 8, 1848.

Personal life
Ridgely married Cornelia Louisiana Livingston in Clermont-on-Hudson, New York on December 1, 1822. They had four children, including Elizabeth Augusta Ridgely who married William H. Hunt.

title: Charles G. Ridgely


text:
Bilkent

Bilkent is a district in Ankara, Turkey, with the postal code 06800 where Bilkent University is located.

Besides Bilkent University, a technological improvement and tech start-up center called CYBERPARK is also located inside the district. CYBERPARK hosts more than 250 developing tech companies.

Three housing sites situated in green fields and woods provide its residents with natural settings, social facilities, sports areas and children's playgrounds. These are among Ankara's most prestigious addresses and 3,500 residential and commercial units serve a variety of demands and needs.

title: Bilkent