text:
Talk:Diatomic molecule

Molecular Geometry Section
This is crucial for completing the set on Molecular Geometry. Because several admins thought that it was not proper to have its own page, it was moved to here. Please do not delete. Jokermole (talk) 15:43, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

 * Completing a set about which there's no agreement that it should exist at all? Please discuss it at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject_Chemistry to avoid duplicating the discussion. --Itub (talk) 15:46, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

The section now reads:-

"The Linear N/A molecular geometry in chemistry describes the stereochemistry (spatial arrangement of atoms) that is adopted by diatomic molecules . This configuration is more commonly referred to in the VSEPR theory as the AX1E*

. Due to the fact that 2 atoms are equally bonded to each other, there is no central atom ."

Perhaps it would be better if it read something like:-

"The diatomic molecule molecular geometry is the simplest spatial arrangement of atoms. . This configuration is more commonly referred to in the VSEPR theory as the AX1E* . Unlike other systems in VSEPR, there is no central atom. "

What do others think? I did not check the references so perhpas other chnages will be needed. --Bduke (talk) 23:00, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm all for it. Whatever you suggest is fine. It just needs editing. Jokermole (talk) 00:44, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Miscellaneous
is sulfur, selenium, or tellurium a diatomic molecule in the atmosphere

If atoms in a diatomic molecule are not chemically bonded, what is the link between them?

 * S, Se, & Te don't (at least normaly) form diatomic molecules. S in the atmosphere is as SO2, SO3, H2S, or sulfate aerosols. And diatomic molecules are held together with single, double or triple covalent bonds. -Vsmith 15:53, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Mono, di, tri, tetra, penta, hexa, hepta and octatomic elements and molecules
I was wondering if we should combine these in some way, as some of the articles are probably going to be pretty short. Each of them has at least two meanings. For example, a "tetratomic molecule" is one with four atoms and a "tetratomic element" is an element that forms a molecule with four atoms of that element. If they are combined, what should the article be named? "Mono and polyatomic elements and molecules"? -- Kjkolb 11:21, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

Please could we have a derivation for the ratio of specific heats for a diatomic ideal gas?

We really need a table of heteronuclear diatomic molecules, but I wasn't able to find one. (|1) — Enigma55  ( talk •  email ) 05:20, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Nonsense: Comparison between rotation and vibration
"The lowest rotational energy level is when l = 0."

Um, OK.

Erot,0 = l*(l+1)*hbar**2 / (2*I) = 0 * (0+1) hbar**2 / (2*I) = 0

Not sure how that one got screwed up.

DrF 23:11, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Harmonic oscillator?
Erm.

"exactly the same as a harmonic oscillator" - no, it isn't. The vibration of a diatomic molecule is anharmonic and more closely follows the Morse potential than the parabolic well. The article on the morse potential actually links to this one.

Natural occurrence
The latest addition to the article says that "only a few diatomics are found to be naturally-occurring on Earth. These are hydrogen (H2), nitrogen (N2), oxygen (O2), and the halogens: fluorine (F2), chlorine (Cl2), bromine (Br2), iodine (I2), and astatine (At2)". I'm not sure this list is correct. N2 and O2 are certainly correct, but the halogens (especially fluorine!) are so reactive that they are normally found only in compounds. The same might be the case for H2. On the other hand, it should be possible to find some heteronuclear diatomic molecules in nature: NO has a biological role, and can be formed directly in the atmosphere by lightning; CO is a product of incomplete combustion, which can also occur naturally. --Itub —The preceding  signed but undated.

 * You're right, the phrase "naturally occurring" is wrong. Let's see if we can find a correct way to say it.  What I intended was something along the lines of "reasonably stable near 298 K and 1 bar pressure", but that's a lot of words.  Something is needed that covers CO, HX, where X = a halogen, and perhaps more.  I'll try again if someone else doesn't get there first. Maybe just restrict the sentence(s) to elemental diatomics? - Astrochemist 20:25, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

 * I tried to correct my earlier edit, so please check it when you have time. By the way, is it worth mentioning that the translational energy of a molecule is also subject to quantum mechanics? - Astrochemist 01:05, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

 * It looks good now. I see no problem mentioning the quantum translational energy. By the way, thanks for creating the article about the Karlsruhe Congress! --Itub 05:35, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

The article says that "H2 is, in fact, the most abundant molecule seen in nature, dominating the composition of stars". I believe that molecular hydrogen is almost never found in stars, it's atomic or ionised hydrogen, i.e. plasma. I suggest the wording be altered to distinguihs between H and H2. Skaffman (talk) 17:40, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

Astatine
I'm removing the comments anonymously added today about astatine since they are not in a wiki format. As to their content, Emsley's book has redox potentials involving diatomic astatine. Are they measured or calculated ones? There are web pages giving astatine compounds, but I don't know of unequivocal statements about At2. The web page here seems reliable and gives some indirect evidence for At2. Another question to ask concerns the evidence that astatine is not diatomic. Can anyone shed light on this one way or the other? - Astrochemist 00:09, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

 * See also this page from Handbook of Inorganic Chemicals (2003), Pradyot Patnaik, McGraw-Hill: London, p. 76. - Astrochemist 00:09, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
 * According to the CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics, it is not yet known whether astatine forms diatomic astatine molecules. Unless someone can find a journal article that presents experimental data for its existence, please don't add it back. Inverse Hypercube  09:50, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

Diatomic elements are a very specific subset of diatomic molecules
I think it is a major confusion to redirect the diatomic element page to this diatomic molecule page. The seven (perhaps 8 if At is indeed naturally diatomic) elements are unique among elements and therefor should not be lumped in with chemical compounds composed of two dissimilar atoms.

Tmkkeller (talk) 02:41, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You have a good point. But you have to agree that an article on diatomic molecule has to discuss the entire scope of the topic, not the tidy categories that you or I are burdened with. As the article points out, almost all elements go diatomic in the gas phase. --Smokefoot (talk) 14:28, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

Iodine
So under standard conditions, iodine is a solid. Is this still made of diatomic molecules ?
 * Yes. The halogens are diatomic as solids,  although under pressure, I am unsure what they do. When the gases are heated - way up - they fracture to give atoms (like everything).  Diatomic sulfur (disulfur) phosphorus (diphosphorus) are also stable as gases, but they do polymerize, essentialy irreversibly, upon condensation into solid form.--Smokefoot (talk) 13:34, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

Sodium
Given that Na2 is known to exist in gas phase, is it worth adding here? Would one consider that a molecule per se? DS (talk) 02:47, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

 * I have now included Na2 with your reference. And yes, it is a molecule even if it is so reactive that it is very rarely found in nature. Dirac66 (talk) 02:42, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

Standard Temperature and Pressure (STP)
I saw STP mentioned in the article and 25° C in parentheses. This is inaccurate. STP is 1 atm or bar, but it is 273.15 K, 0° C, 32° F; not room temperature, 25° C. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 47.145.96.123 (talk) 06:05, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

And what about the cause???
Very disappointing piece! Why isn't there any information about the cause of forming diatomic molecules??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Koitus~nlwiki (talk • contribs) 16:23, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

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Periodic table illustration
Needs to be updated for the 2016 namings of elements 113, 115, 117, and 118. Double sharp (talk) 04:18, 10 April 2018 (UTC)

title: Talk:Diatomic molecule


text:
Citizen Information Project

In the United Kingdom, the Citizen Information Project (CIP) was a plan by the Office for National Statistics to build a national population register.

On 18 April 2006 it was announced that instead of continuing as a separate project, it would be integrated into the National Identity Register, the database behind the proposed national identity cards. It has been estimated that this might add £200 million to the cost of the identity cards. The National Identity Register was destroyed as the Identity Cards Act 2006 was repealed in 2011.

Scope and purpose
The register was to have been used as a single reference point for government contact, for the exchange of personal contact data, and for the collection of statistics, so reducing duplication in government departments and agencies. Government databases would have been linked together using National Insurance or other personal numbers.

In late 2003 the project moved into a definition phase. It was hoped that the CIP would be able to use data from the proposed National Identity Register.

A report on preliminary testing was due in April 2005, and it had been expected that it would have been implemented before the end of 2007 if approval had been given by Government. Initial estimates in 2004 suggested that the costs might have been £1.2 - £2.4 billion (240 million annually for a period of 5 to 10 years).

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Citizen Information Project


text:
Katun (river)

The Katun (Катунь, Katuń; Кадын, Kadın) is a river in the Altai Republic and the Altai Krai of Russia. It forms the Ob as it joins the Biya some 19 km southwest of Biysk. The Katun is 688 km long, and its drainage basin covers 60900 km2. It originates in the Katun glaciers on the southwestern slope of Belukha Mountain. The river freezes up in late November or early December and breaks up in early or mid-April. The main tributaries of the Katun are, from source to mouth: Koksa (left), Kucherla (right), Argut (right), Chuya (right), Ursul (left), Sema (left) and Isha (right). The river is navigable. In its upper reach of the Katun flows down the distant and sparsely populated area, but a few kilometers downstream near the village Kuyus, the coastal population density grows steadily and the area downstream of the village Ust-Sema is the most populated. There are numerous buildings, holiday camps and various guest houses in the pine forest near the village. The main settlements along the Katun are, from source to mouth: Ust-Koksa, Katanda, Inya, Chemal, Manzherok, Souzga, Aya, Mayma, Srostki and Verkh-Katunskoye.

title: Katun (river)


text:
Talk:Operation Snow White

{|style="border-style:solid;border-width:2px;border-color:blue"

Here are some open tasks to complete this article:

Untitled

 * Former Snow White operatives, and their affiliations with Scientology after the affair
 * Unindicted co-conspirators, including L. Ron Hubbard and Kendrick Moxon
 * Add information about convicted individuals (their specific roles within Scientology, what are they doing now, duration of sentences, etc. : Mary Sue Hubbard, Cindy Raymond, Gerald Bennett Wolfe, Henning Heldt, Duke Snider, Gregory Willardson, Richard Weigand, Mitchell Herman, Sharon Thomas, Jane Kember, and Mo Budlong
 * Those who pled guilty were not "convicted." Grammar'sLittleHelper (talk) 22:06, 29 October 2015 (UTC)
 * This is untrue. In a US Court of Law, if you've pled guilty to a criminal offense, you are then convicted by that court, same as a jury verdict. You will have a criminal conviction on your record. If you pled no contest and sought an Adjudication with Contemplation of Dismissal, or otherwise deferred adjudication, then yes you can avoid a conviction. That is not the case here. Guilty vs Convicted-- Shibboleth ink (♔ ♕) 14:25, 28 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Integrate into the article Scientology's explanation of why they were naming the overall program "Snow White" and dubbing individual targets associated names such as "Witch", "Stepmother", "Prince", "Maiden", "Shoes", "Sleepy", "Bashful", etc.
 * }

Michael Meisner wasn't employed at the IRS
The article states Gerald Wolfe and Michael Meisner were able to gain employment as clerks, but Wolfe was the only one employed there. The source article does not indicate Meisner was also employed there. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.247.69.220 (talk) 11:42, 20 May 2022 (UTC)

What happened to the 4,990 other operatives?
The opening paragraph mentions 5,000 "operatives".

The article only discusses a dozen or so "operatives".

What were the rest of the "operatives" up to? Who they were?

[Thank you. I deem this an important article/subject, not the "low importance" that various metrics appear to deem it.]

2601:1C2:801:4420:1439:7F01:4A2F:D075 (talk) 19:59, 2 March 2023 (UTC) A Nony Mouse

 * If you're interested in finding out, perhaps rummage through the FBI files which have been posted online somewhere. There's also this https://vault.fbi.gov/church-of-scientology on the FBI's website. When you find out, then come back and edit this Wikipedia article.

 * An "importance tag" is based on its value to a whole topic in an encyclopedia, such as how important a particular sub-topic is for someone to understand the main topic. If someone was wanting to learn a bit about "What is Scientology?", then Operation Snow White would not be anywhere near the top of the list. It's part of the history of Scientology. As someone digs deeper, the Op Snow While might become more important to read about. The meaning of an importance tag is NOT that the information is of little importance, but that it is a mid- or low-priority article for a group of Wikipedia editors to focus on completing or enhancing for the overall topic of "Scientology" (or "Crime" or "Espionage" or "United States" — the other Wikiprojects tagged on this article). That said, there's nothing stopping anyone from updating this article if they so choose. Editors usually work on something that interests them. Grorp (talk) 06:58, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Alverzo
"Alverzo" appears 4 times in this article, all in one paragraph. Apparently he can pick locks, but there is no further context given (e.g. full name, introduction, role in the operation, relationship to others here). HyperCube03 (talk) 23:35, 7 February 2024 (UTC)
 * I added a footnote with citation, and added similar footnotes for a few more of the "players" on that page.   ▶ I am Grorp ◀  04:58, 9 February 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Operation Snow White


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Battle of Churubusco

The Battle of Churubusco took place on August 20, 1847, while Santa Anna's army was in retreat from the Battle of Contreras or Battle of Padierna during the Mexican–American War. It was the battle where the San Patricio Battalion, made up largely of US deserters, made their last stand against U.S. forces. The U.S. Army was victorious, outnumbering more than six-to-one the defending Mexican troops. After the battle, the U.S. Army was only 5 miles (8 km) away from Mexico City. 50 Saint Patrick's Battalion members were officially executed by the U.S. Army, all but two by hanging. Collectively, this was the largest mass execution in United States history.

Background
Following their defeats at Contreras, Antonio López de Santa Anna ordered Major General Nicolás Bravo Rueda with the Army of the Center, to retreat from San Antonio to Churubusco. Santa Anna also ordered Major General Manuel Rincón to hold the Franciscan Convent of San Mateo in Churubusco, with earthworks and seven guns, and placed General Francisco Pérez at the tête de pont on the south bank of the river. Two regiments were placed along the river while the convent included the Bravo Battalions of the Mexico City National Guard and the San Patricio Battalion, plus Santa Anna formed a reserve along the highway to the north.

Battle
Scott sent David Twiggs and Gideon Johnson Pillow's Divisions from San Angel to Coyoacán, while he ordered William Jenkins Worth to turn the San Antonio position. Worth sent Colonel Newman S. Clarke's Brigade and Lieutenant Colonel Charles Ferguson Smith's Light Battalion across the Pedregal lava field to the west of San Antonio, while Colonel John Garland faced San Antonio on the south.

During retreat from San Antonio, the Mexican defenders (part of the 1st Line of Defense (or sometimes the "Army of the Center") with Colonel F. Villarreal and about 2,000 men: 700 of the "Hidalgo," 500 of the "Victoria" (Lieutenant Colonel P. Jorrin) National Guards Battalions, and 800 others: under Colonels A. Zerecero and J.G. Perdigón Garay), were struck in flank by Clarke's Brigade. Garland moved forward as the Mexicans withdrew from San Antonio and captured a General and four guns.

Scott ordered an attack on the convent. In addition to the stone walls of the convent, the defenses included a series of incomplete trenches the Mexicans had begun digging prior to the attack. Some elements of the Tlapa and Lagos Battalions arrived as reinforcements. Three cannon were placed on the right; two in the center; and the remaining two on the left. Independencia was assigned to defend the upper walls, the right flank leading to the bridge, the unfortified south and north sides, and two adobe huts further forward on the battlefield. The Bravos and the San Patricios were stationed on the left, behind barricades. In support along the Rio Churubusco was the Pérez Brigade: 2,500 men (11th Line, 1st, 3d & 4th Light Infantry Regiments).

Worth's division took on the tête de pont, while Twiggs took on the convent. Rincón's gunners were able to force Taylor's battery to withdraw, and Perez's defense on the tête de pont twice repulsed Major Benjamin Louis Eulalie de Bonneville's 6th Infantry charge. The attack by Franklin Pierce and James Shields, crossing the river on the Coyoacan-Mixcoac road in an attempt to cut off the Mexican retreat, was also stopped. However, Worth turned the Mexican left and crossed the river, while the 8th and 5th Infantry took the tête de pont. Captain Duncan then set up a battery to attack the convent.

Two of the Mexican cannons had melted and a third had fallen from its mount. Lieutenant Colonel Francisco Peñúñuri of Independencia led a handful of men in a bayonet charge and was defeated. He died in battle. Captain Luis Martínez de Castro, who had accompanied him, died of gangrene on August 27, 1847. Officers from the Bravos attempted to raise the white flag over the convent walls on three occasions but were prevented from doing so by members of the San Patricios, who had resolved to fight to the end and not let the Americans capture their flag. The San Patricio Battalion was ultimately captured and court-martialed for desertion, including its leader, John Patrick Riley. U.S. Captain James Milton Smith finally stopped the fighting by putting up a white handkerchief.

Aftermath
The Americans captured 192 prisoners and three pieces of artillery at the tête de pont. They captured 1,259 prisoners, including three Generals and the San Patricios leader Lieutenant Colonel Francisco Rosenda Moreno, plus seven pieces of artillery at the convent. They captured another 380 prisoners further up the road. Winfield Scott estimated the Mexican casualties on August 19–20, at Contreras and Churubusco, at 4,297 killed and wounded; in addition to 2,637 taken prisoner.

Seventy-two men of the San Patricios Battalion were court-martialed by the United States Army as deserters. Two separate courts martial were held, one at Tacubaya on 23 August, and another at San Ángel on 26 August. Fifty were sentenced to hang, having deserted after war had been declared. Those who had deserted earlier received 50 lashes. (See Saint Patrick's Battalion for a more complete description.)

When General Anaya was asked by General Twiggs to surrender his ammunition after the end of the battle, he replied, "If I had any ammunition, you would not be here".

Scott did not continue the pursuit into Mexico City, "...willing to leave something to this republic... I halted our victorious corps at the gates of the city."

A Brigade of volunteers from New York was billeted to the convent, remaining there until September 7.

In popular culture
Parts of the battle were portrayed in the 1985 ABC mini-series North and South, based on a trilogy of novels of the same name by John Jakes, as well as the film One Man's Hero (1999).

title: Battle of Churubusco


text:
Operation Snow White

Operation Snow White was a criminal conspiracy by the Church of Scientology during the 1970s to purge unfavorable records about Scientology and its founder, L. Ron Hubbard. This project included a series of infiltrations into and thefts from 136 government agencies, foreign embassies and consulates, as well as private organizations critical of Scientology, carried out by Church members in more than 30 countries. It was one of the largest infiltrations of the United States government in history, with up to 5,000 covert agents. This operation also exposed the Scientology plot "Operation Freakout", because Operation Snow White was the case that initiated the U.S. government's investigation of the Church.

Under this program, Scientology operatives committed infiltration, wiretapping, and theft of documents in government offices, most notably those of the U.S. Internal Revenue Service. Eleven highly placed Church executives, including Mary Sue Hubbard (third wife of founder L. Ron Hubbard and second-in-command of the organization), pleaded guilty and were convicted in federal court of obstructing justice, burglary of government offices, and theft of documents and government property. The case was United States v. Mary Sue Hubbard et al., 493 F.Supp. 209 (D.D.C. 1979).

Background
As early as 1960, L. Ron Hubbard had proposed that Scientologists should infiltrate government departments by taking secretarial, bodyguard or other jobs. In the early 1970s, the Church of Scientology was increasingly scrutinized by US federal agencies, having already been raided by the Food and Drug Administration in 1963. The Internal Revenue Service (IRS) claimed the Church owed millions of dollars in taxes and the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) sent agents into the organization. The Church's response involved a publicity campaign, extensive litigation against the IRS and a program of infiltration of agency offices.

The specific branch of Scientology responsible for Operation Snow White was the Guardian's Office. Created in 1966 by L. Ron Hubbard, the purpose of the Guardian's Office was to protect the interests of Scientology. At the time of Operation Snow White, the Guardian's Office had its worldwide headquarters (Guardian's Office WW) located at Saint Hill Manor in England. Headquarters in the United States (Guardian's Office US) were in Los Angeles, California, though smaller offices existed in Washington, D.C. (Guardian's Office DC), and other cities throughout the United States. Each Guardian Office consisted of five bureaus. One such bureau was the Information Bureau, which oversaw the infiltration of the government. L. Ron Hubbard oversaw the Guardian's Office, though it was Mary Sue Hubbard, his wife, who held the title Commodore Staff Guardian.

Several years later, in 1973, the Guardian's Office began a massive infiltration of governments around the world, though the primary target of the operation was the United States. Worried about Scientology's long-term reputation, the Guardian's Office decided to infiltrate Interpol to obtain documents related to Scientology, as well as those connecting L. Ron Hubbard to criminal activity. Jane Kember handed this duty to Henning Heldt and his staff.

Around this time L. Ron Hubbard himself wrote Guardian Order 732, which called for the removal and correction of "erroneous" Scientology files. It is here that Operation Snow White has its origins. Though the order called for this to be achieved by legal means, this would quickly change. Hubbard himself would later be named by federal prosecutors as an "unindicted co-conspirator" for his part in the operation. Though extensive records of his involvement exist, many Scientologists claim his directives were misinterpreted by his followers.

Operation Snow White would be further refined by Guardian Order 1361. Addressed from Jane Kember to Heldt, Duke Snider, and Richard Weigand, GO 1361 called for, among other things, an infiltration of the Los Angeles and London offices of the IRS, and the Department of Justice.

While the order was specific to the IRS, the Guardian's Office was soon recruiting their own field agents to infiltrate other governmental offices, including the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA), the U.S. Coast Guard intelligence service, and the National Institute of Mental Health, among others, as well as the American Medical Association. The program called for rewards to be given for successful missions carried out by Scientologists.

One of the sentencing memoranda in the case also noted that, contrary to what the defendants claimed, the programs planned by the Guardian's Office were not restricted to trying to remove "false reports" but included plans to plant false information—for instance, planting false records about "a cat with a pedigree name" into US security agency computers so that later "the creature holds a press conference and photographic story results." The purpose of Operation Cat was "to hold up the American security to ridicule, as outlined in the GO by LRH."

The start of 1974 saw Michael Meisner appointed Assistant Guardian for Information in the District of Columbia (AG I DC). Meisner's responsibilities included the implementation of all Information Bureau orders, programs, and projects within the DC area. Meisner's supervisor at this time was Duke Snider, the Assistant Guardian for DC, or AG DC. This was the highest position in Washington's GO office.

In July 1974, Meisner was ordered by Duke Snider to implement the previously written plan to obtain Interpol documents, which were then located in the U.S. Department of the Treasury. Meisner had more to do than just this, though, as by August he was also taking directions from Cindy Raymond, the GO's Collections Officer for the US, who ordered Meisner to assist her in finding a loyal Scientologist agent to gain employment at the IRS headquarters in Washington, DC. This employee was to steal all documents dealing with Scientology, especially those involving current litigation by Scientology against the government. Meisner discussed this with Raymond for a period of a month before interviewing various Scientologists with no luck. A month after the order had been given, Raymond informed Meisner that she had selected Gerald Bennett Wolfe.

Implementation
The GO's actual infiltration of the government likely began when Gerald Wolfe and Michael Meisner were able to gain employment at the IRS as clerk-typists. Under direction of the Guardian Office, Wolfe monitored files on tax-exempt organizations and, when requested, illegally made copies for Scientology. Meisner supervised both Wolfe and the Information Bureau section in DC, and reported to the GO's Deputy Guardian for Information in the US.

In November 1974, Operation Snow White took an unexpected turn for the GO when they received word that the IRS would be conducting a meeting on Scientology's tax-exempt status. In response, the church sent a spy to bug the room. On the morning of November 1, the day before the meeting, a GO agent, Hermann, broke into the conference room and plugged the device into an electrical outlet. This device, in turn, then transmitted a signal on an FM frequency, which was picked up and recorded by Scientologists sitting in a car in the parking lot of the Smithsonian, which faced the office. After the meeting Hermann removed the device, and the taped recording of the meeting was sent to Los Angeles.

By December, Wolfe, Herman, and Meisner had sent a shipment of stolen documents 20 inches thick to Duke Snider. Snider, in turn, sent notification to Mo Budlong in Los Angeles. By the end of December, Wolfe was stealing documents from the IRS's Chief Counsel's office. Just days after Christmas, Wolfe broke into the office of Barbara Bird, an attorney in the IRS's Refund Litigation Service. Bird had been present at the November 1st meeting. Instead of stealing files, Wolfe took them to a copier and made photocopies using government paper.

Later, Wolfe met Meisner at a restaurant, where he reported on his most recent theft. Meisner took the documents and underlined selections that he believed his superiors would find interesting or relevant and wrote a summary of the important points. This was then routed through the Assistant Guardian for DC and on to the Deputy Guardian for the US, the Deputy Guardian for Information in the US, the Branch I Director of the Information Bureau, and the Collections Officer, all of which were in Los Angeles. A copy was also sent to Mary Sue Hubbard. This was typically standard procedure for Meisner.

In early 1975, Operation Snow White expanded again as Sharon Thomas found employment in the U.S. Coast Guard Intelligence Agency and Nancy Douglass began work at the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA). Douglass stole documents and made photocopies of others. These were transmitted to Hermann.

By spring, attention had been called back to the IRS case as Mary Sue Hubbard had instructed Kember and Heldt to "use any method at our disposal to win the battle and gain our non-profit (tax) status". Heldt wrote back telling that her request had been sent to the Information Bureau, who had been ordered to complete the collection of documents from the IRS and the Department of Justice's tax files within three months.

In April, Meisner procured a directory of the Department of Justice and located the offices that would have files pertaining to Scientology litigation. When he found what he wanted he sent in Wolfe, who broke into the offices of two attorneys on three successive Saturdays. Wolfe copied twelve files and met up with Meisner, as before, at a restaurant. These files were especially useful to Scientology, as it detailed the government's strategy in various court cases.

In May, Willardson directed Meisner to implement "Project Horn", which called for Meisner to "provide a cover for PR and legal for the way they obtained IRS docs". The idea would be for the GO's Public Relations Bureau to view the documents without worrying about being connected to the theft. Willardson's idea called for Meisner to steal documents dealing with organizations other than Scientology. Willardson also called for the theft of IRS stationery, in order to forge letters from a (fictional) disgruntled IRS employee. The files on various organizations (including Scientology, of course) would then be sent out attached to the fake letter. The idea was that it would appear that an upset IRS agent had himself sent the files to numerous organizations. There would be nothing to tie it to Scientology. Wolfe stole both the stationery and, without permission, files on the Unification Church and Bob Jones University.

During the summer and fall months of 1975, the GO launched an additional plan. In July, Meisner was told by Cindy Raymond that the Church of Scientology had initiated a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) lawsuit against the IRS. Meisner was directed to add the office of Charles Zuravin to his list of offices to monitor. Zuravin was representing the government in the case. Meisner immediately passed this duty on to Wolfe, who broke into Zuravin's office multiple times between July and November. Wolfe revealed to his superiors that Zuravin was preparing an index of Scientology files relevant to the FOIA case. IRS offices from all over the country were sending files to Zuravin. This index file, required by the courts in all FOIA cases, is a total list of the documents requested, and reasons for their exemption from the public, if any.

By October, Zuravin had finished the index, numbering each document in order to simplify location, and had provided a copy to Scientology attorneys. These attorneys, in turn, gave the index to Raymond, who passed it along to Meisner, who passed it to Wolfe. Wolfe then entered Zuravin's office and then began copying the documents listed on the index. Zuravin had essentially done the GO's job for them.

On December 5, 1975, Jane Kember issued Guardian Program Order 158, which intended to give L. Ron Hubbard early warning of impending legal action. The plan called for the infiltration of the government agencies that had either the power to issue, or the knowledge of, impending subpoenas. Specific agencies include the US Attorney's Office in D.C. and LA, the IRS Office of International Operations, the DEA, and the Coast Guard and Immigration and Naturalization. After reviewing the letter, Meisner concluded it would be a better idea to infiltrate the Department of Justice than the US Attorney's Office.

In January 1976, Hermann, the Southeast US Secretary for the Information Bureau, informed Meisner that Heldt and Weigand had approved a plan to send Don Alverzo to Washington. Alverzo arrived on the 17th, and on the 18th he picked the locks on the doors belonging to the office of Lewis Hubbard (no relation to L. Ron Hubbard) and the file room housing Zuravin's files. Wolfe stood guard at the end of the hallway while Alverzo worked on Hubbard's door. A few doors down Meisner worked on Zuravin's door. After an hour and a half with no success, Meisner was getting upset. In frustration, Meisner hit the top of Zuravin's door, which popped right open. The three Scientologists entered the office and took the remaining Scientology related documents. They then traveled to another floor where they made photocopies. Wolfe continued to make copies while Alverzo and Meisner tried again to open Hubbard's office. The trio then worked well into the night photocopying files from Hubbard's office. When they left, sometime around 2 AM, they left with a foot tall stack of documents. Less than a month later Richard Weigand wrote to Jane Kember, telling her that the IRS documents that had been ordered to be produced in Guardian Order 1361, over two years earlier, had been obtained.

Gerald Wolfe, along with Meisner, were later able to break into a room and make false IRS identification cards, which allowed them access to the federal courthouse in Washington. Wolfe and Meisner then used these cards to gain access to restricted areas and steal more documents.

While Wolfe and Meisner continued their work at the IRS, Mary Sue Hubbard, along with other Guardian Office members, were coming up with further plans. Guardian Program Order 302, written by Cindy Raymond and approved by Hubbard, amongst others, directed the infiltration of all government agencies that had withheld files from Scientology's various FOIA requests.

On the night of April 14, Meisner and Wolfe were on the tenth floor of the IRS building housing the Office of International Operations. Trying to enter an office, the pair found it locked. A passing cleaning lady noted Meisner and Wolfe's suspicious behavior, and notified a security guard. The guard confronted the pair and was presented with Wolfe's genuine IRS card and Meisner's fabricated one. Satisfied, the guard had the cleaning lady open the door. Inside, the pair grabbed a hefty load of files. Unable to find a photocopier, the pair then took the files to the main IRS building, where the pair again used their identification to gain access. After copying the files, they returned them to Crate's office. The entire process took some four hours.

In May, Wolfe broke into the United States Courthouse and stole keys to the office of Assistant United States Attorney Nathan Dodell. Wolfe then took these keys to have them duplicated, and returned them unnoticed. Almost three weeks later, Wolfe and Meisner broke into Dodell's office, stealing documents and, as usual, forwarding them to Guardian headquarters in Los Angeles. The GO's interest in Nathan Dodell stemmed from a Scientology FOIA case. In April, Judge George L Hart asked Dodell whether the US had considered taking a deposition of L. Ron Hubbard. Dodell responded that it was an "interesting thought". Furthermore, he promised to discuss it with the Department of Justice.

In May, Meisner and Wolfe entered the US Courthouse for the District of Columbia around four in the afternoon. They went to the third floor, which was the home of both the US Attorney's Office and the Bar Association Library. They planned to locate Nathan Dodell's office, which was in the back of the Civil Division area, near an elevator. They then searched for the building's photocopiers. After mapping out these locations, they left. Later, Wolfe and Meisner made a copy of Dodell's keys.

On May 21, Meisner and Wolfe entered the Courthouse, signing in to do research in the library and were issued an elevator key. After riding the elevator to the floor of the library, the pair entered the library and removed several books from shelves and sat at a table. After a few minutes, they exited through a backdoor and emerged in a hallway. In this hallway was Dodell's office, which they entered using their keys. The duo stole a number of documents related to Scientology and walked through the hallway to the two copy machines they had previously located. The pair photocopied some six inches of documents before returning the originals to Dodell's office.

One week later, Wolfe and Meisner again met outside the IRS building. The duo then walked to the US Courthouse, and signed in under fake names. They repeated their actions from the previous week, copying another group of documents from the District of Columbia Police Department as well as the Food and Drug Administration. Returning to Dodell's office through the library, they were stopped by the night librarian, who asked if they had signed in. While they had signed in at the front desk, they had failed to do the same at the front desk of the library. When they announced that they had not, Johnson, the night librarian, told the pair not to come back unless they had specific authorization from the day librarian. The pair promptly left. Three days later Johnson notified the US Attorney's Office that two individuals had been seen using the photocopying machines of the Attorney's Office. Johnson and the night guard were told to immediately contact the FBI if the individuals returned.

Less than two weeks later, Hermann phoned Meisner, and ordered him to return to Dodell's office and steal his personal files. The goal was to formulate a plan that would result in Dodell being removed from his position as an Assistant US Attorney for the District of Columbia.

Meisner and Wolfe entered the United States Courthouse on June 11 around 7 in the evening. They signed in as they did before, and headed to the library. Johnson, the night librarian, recognized the pair and immediately stopped them. Meisner was prepared for this, and showed the man a letter from the head librarian. Wolfe and Meisner continued to the back of the library where they exited into the hallway. Outside Dodell's office the two saw that cleaning ladies were still at work.

While Meisner and Wolfe waited for the cleaning crew to vacate the office, Johnson called the FBI, which sent two agents over immediately. The two agents confronted the Scientologists and demanded to see their identification. Wolfe used his real identification. Meisner presented his fake card, and told the agents that he had recently resigned from the IRS. Meisner told Hansen that the pair was in the library to do legal research, and that they had used the photocopiers to copy books and cases. Neither mentioned Scientology. After roughly twenty minutes of questioning, the FBI agents allowed them to leave. Meisner then phoned Hermann to inform him of the news and was told to immediately fly to Los Angeles.

Aftermath and trial
Meisner and Wolfe were given cover stories by the Guardian's Office. On the last day of June, Gerald Wolfe was arrested. Wolfe was charged with "the use and possession of a forged official pass of the United States." The day after Wolfe's arrest, Mary Sue Hubbard wrote a letter to Weigand ordering him to keep her abreast of the situation. Hubbard also conversed with Mo Budlong and Richard Weigand about Wolfe's arrest, cover story, and subsequent plan to destroy evidence linking Wolfe and Meisner to Scientology.

At the end of July a judge decided that the case against Wolfe warranted an investigation by a grand jury. A week later the judge issued an arrest warrant for Meisner, who, at the time, was being hidden in LA. The FBI was able to connect him to Scientology. By January 1977, it was becoming increasingly likely that Scientology would be unable to escape Operation Snow White without serious penalty. Though Meisner was still in hiding, he was growing increasingly anxious about the situation. By April, Meisner wanted to surrender to the authorities. Meisner was quickly put under the control of several guards.

On May 13, Gerald Wolfe entered a guilty plea. Later in the month, Meisner escaped his captors, only to be convinced to rejoin the GO the following day.

In June, Wolfe, after being sentenced to probation and community service, testified before the Grand Jury. Instead of the truth, Wolfe told the latest incarnation of his cover story. Several days later Meisner would again escape his captors, though this time he would contact the FBI. Meisner was eventually taken to Washington, where he agreed to plead guilty to a five-year conspiracy felony and cooperate with the Grand Jury.

On July 8, the FBI raided Church of Scientology locations in Los Angeles, Hollywood and Washington, D.C. The Los Angeles raid involved 156 FBI agents, the most that had ever been used in a single raid. It lasted 21 hours and filled a 16-ton truck with documents and other items.

The raids turned up documentation of not only the group's illegal activities against the United States government, but also illegal activities carried out against other perceived enemies of Scientology. These included "Operation Freakout", a conspiracy to frame author Paulette Cooper on false bomb-threat charges, and conspiracies to frame Gabe Cazares, mayor of Clearwater, Florida, on false hit-and-run charges. The papers also revealed that Sir John Foster (author of the official UK Government inquiry into Scientology) and Lord Balniel (who had requested the report) were targets, along with the National Association for Mental Health (NAMH) and World Federation for Mental Health.

Comparing the FBI to the Gestapo, the Church declared that all the files seized from the Church were taken illegally, though the FBI produced a 40-plus page affidavit detailing 160 specific items they were looking for.

By July 20, 13 days after the raid, a Washington judge ruled that the documents should be returned, at least temporarily, to the Church, and that none of the documents could be shared with branches of the government, unless that specific branch was investigating Scientology. Scientology's lawyers had successfully argued that in order to prepare for an August 8 hearing on the legality of the raid, they must be able to see the documents. By July 27, a judge in Washington had ruled the warrant authorizing the raid was too broad and, as such, violated the Church's 4th Amendment rights. In August, this ruling would be overturned, with Scientology promising to take the case to the Supreme Court, which would, early in the next year, refuse to hear the case.

In August 1978, 11 high-ranking members of Scientology were indicted on 28 charges. One of the indicted was Mary Sue Hubbard, wife of Scientology's creator L. Ron Hubbard. The other ten were Gerald Wolfe, Cindy Raymond, Henning Heldt, Duke Snider, Gregory Willardson, Richard Weigand, Mitchell Herman, Sharon Thomas, Jane Kember, and Mo Budlong. Kendrick Moxon and L. Ron Hubbard were named unindicted co-conspirators.

Over the course of the investigation, the Church of Scientology attempted to have a judge removed, and subpoenaed almost 150 federal agents in what appeared to be a large stalling scheme. The Church also offered several shifting explanations for their actions. Ultimately, these tactics failed and the defendants agreed to a plea deal.

Seven of the 11 members of the Guardian's Office pleaded guilty to just a single count of conspiracy to obstruct justice. One more pleaded guilty to a similar charge and a ninth pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor. The Scientologists were allowed to argue for the suppression of the government's evidence. The remaining two Scientologists were in England, pending extradition.

On December 6, 1979, some five years after Operation Snow White began, it officially came to an end. Five of the Scientologists were sentenced to four years in jail, with four of the convicted being taken immediately. Mary Sue Hubbard, wife of L. Ron Hubbard, was sentenced to five years. Each of the six faced a fine of $10,000. The next day the four remaining Scientologists were sentenced. Three of the four faced a fine of $10,000 and five years in jail. The fourth was fined $1,000 and sent to jail for six months. Upon release Mary Sue Hubbard was given five years of probation and community service. All of the Scientologists immediately appealed, but the verdicts were confirmed.

In November 1980, the two remaining Scientologists, Jane Kember and Mo Budlong, were finally convicted on nine counts of aiding and abetting burglary in connection with break-ins at government offices, and were sentenced to six years.

Kember and Budlong had claimed political asylum in the UK, arguing that they should not be extradited to the US because the burglaries had political objectives. Their application against extradition was denied by the British High Court on the grounds that it did not fall within the political offence exception to the Extradition Act 1870; Mr. Justice Griffiths said:

I am unable to accept that organising burglaries either for the purpose of identifying persons in Government offices hostile to the Scientologists, or for the purpose of gaining an advantage in litigation, or even for the wider purpose of refuting false allegations thus enabling a better image of the Church of Scientology to be projected to the public, comes anywhere near being an offence of a political character within the meaning of the Extradition Act.

The Applicants did not order these burglaries to take place in order to challenge the political control or Government of the United States; they did so to further the interests of the Church of Scientology and its members, and in particular the interest of Ron L. Hubbard, the founder of Scientology. In my view, it would be ridiculous to regard the Applicants as political refugees seeking asylum in this country, and I reject the submission that these were offences of a political character.

Involved parties
Mary Sue Hubbard, Cindy Raymond, Gerald Bennett Wolfe, Henning Heldt, Duke Snider, Gregory Willardson, Richard Weigand, Mitchell Herman, Sharon Thomas, Jane Kember, and Mo Budlong, all high-ranking Scientologists, were convicted; prison sentences were as long as six years, though no defendant served that amount. L. Ron Hubbard was named by federal prosecutors as an "unindicted co-conspirator" and went into hiding for the rest of his life.

Effect of the scandal
The Church has been reluctant to discuss the operation's details; typical statements by members and operatives are often vague comments saying that the Guardian's Office (GO) had been "infiltrated" and "set up" to fail in its mission to protect the Church, that those involved were "purged" from the Church, without detailing what actually happened (although it has been suggested many of those involved and "purged" remained in important positions of power within the church). Church spokespersons on the Internet and elsewhere have been known to claim that the operatives "had done nothing more serious than steal photocopier paper."

Operation Snow White extended to Canada and resulted in legal proceedings against the Church.

By 1990, all eleven defendants in Operation Snow White were free.

title: Operation Snow White


text:
Talk:Hakeem Olajuwon

Draft Position/Jordan
I have deleted the section stating, "It is to his credit that very few have ever criticized Houston for picking Olajuwon ahead of third pick Jordan, who went on to have a spectacular NBA career (in stark contrast to the second choice, Portland's Sam Bowie."

The statement is speculative, and with all due respect to Michael Jordan, the article should be about the life and accomplishments of Hakeem Olajuwon. Not how his career compared to that of Jordan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jmurdock21 (talk • contribs) 21:25, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

Derrick Becker
olajuwon did not give money to al-qaeda. please try not to slander people.

too bad about him giving money to al-qaida —Preceding unsigned comment added by Derrickbecker74 (talk • contribs)

just because hes muslim doesnt it mean that he gives money to al-qaida, btw why write he was undisciplined under the muslim faith contents?

 * He was undisciplined and readily admits it we need a source on that though. Quadzilla99 02:59, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

 * Source was added. Quadzilla99 14:59, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Name
I think that he was born Hakeem, then changed it to Akeem because people were incorrectly pronouncing the H, and then when he felt that pronunciation would no longer be the problem, he changed it back to Hakeem. I think that the article thus incorrectly notes his birth name as Akeem.

NPOV violation
I edited out the following part of a sentence, "and making him look like an utter fool" in the "Dream Shake" section. Judgements on who is and isn't a fool do not belong in an encyclopedia article. JRed 21:40, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Two quadruple-doubles?
I remember him having a quadruple-double once, but two in the same month ? Seems a little dubious. BTW, the info was repeated on the quadruple-double article. Anyone who could check it ? Mrbluesky 23:45, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
 * This says he had only one. It is probably the best source of this information available on the net, and as such I am changing it.  Cdcon   16:46, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Never mind, already done on both pages.  Cdcon   16:47, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

Quadruple-double
Olajuwon did actually have two quadruple-doubles in the space of a few weeks. The first, however, which was against the Golden State Warriors, was not made official. According to the box score, Olajuwon only had 29 points, 18 rebounds, 9 assists and 11 blocks. However, the Rockets reviewed the game tape and found an assist that had not been recorded. This was reported to the NBA. The league agreed that the assist had been missed, and added it to Olajuwon's season assist total, but said that old box scores could not be changed. And so the quadruple-double was not made official.

Dennis Rodman's mistake in the '95 WCF
I made a change, removing the sentence that said that part of the reason Robinson was outplayed in the 1995 Western Conference Finals was because Dennis Rodman refused to help out in guarding Olajuwon. This is simply untrue. The much talked-about mistake that Rodman made throughout the series was to refuse to move away from the basket and guard Robert Horry, who was hovering around the three-point line.

Nationality
Listed as Nigerian in the infobox... shouldn't that reflect his status as an American citizen (as mentioned in the article)?

Photograph
We really need a photo for him. Any help would be greatly appreciated.Quadzilla99 12:57, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

I added a photograph, but it was removed. Why?Danielleelder (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:26, 9 November 2010 (UTC).

style of play, player profile
the two sections look like they can be merged.

"despite never having an All-Star colleague as a second option in his team."
This technically might be factually corrrect because I am not sure if Clyde Drexler made the All-star team in 94-95 season when the Rockets won the second of back to back championships. Regardless, he was a perenial all star, an all time great, and was a major contributor to winning the championship that season.

Top 5 Centers of All-Time
Apparently some users feel that Patrick Ewing is deserving of being mentioned as one of the top NBA centers of all-time. If this is your belief, please provide a source supporting the statement before adding Ewing to the list (or replacing one of the others in the list). Thank you. - Raetzsch 19:42, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

 * I agree with the list but the source is fairly weak. Unless we can get a better source perhaps the list should just be removed and some other statement can be used to sum up his great career and place in history in the opening paragraph. Harvey100 01:26, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

 * I agree with Harvey. Quadzilla99 02:54, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Print source has been added for Top 5 centers. - Raetzsch 17:16, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

 * Good work Raetzsch. Quadzilla99 15:28, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

It's still opinion. It would be more reasonable to just call him "one of the greatest centers of all-time." TheyCallMeBruce

 * Well another source was added. A survey of 19 ESPN journalist and retired players, the 5 listed were the top 5. In addition there was a wide gap between the top 5 and the number 6 center. The top five received between 130 and 174 points and the number 6 center received 76 points: Quadzilla99 00:28, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

I'll admit bias; he's my all time favorite player. It's a heavily justified opinion, as according to the statistics on Basketball-reference.com: Only 4 centers have scored more points; No center has blocked more shots (600 ahead of the next), No center has garnered more steals(800 ahead of the next center), only 7 centers have grabbed more rebounds; only 2 centers have dished out more assists. Stats seem to say he's top 5. Bill Simmons puts him in there. Various polls put him in there. I think it's a recognition he deserves. In addition, he is statistically the greatest defensive center of all time. He ranks 3rd All-Time, 2nd among centers (behind Robert Parish), in defensive rebounds...and I've already mentioned his steals and blocks. Claghorn (talk) 02:36, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

GA Review
Honestly, I think you should go on and add this to the good article candidates. It is well-written, factually verifiable, broad in coverage, NPOV, stable, and contains images. In other words, it follows WP:WIAGA perfectly. I'd promote it no problem (I'd add it myself, but it may take a month to get approved that way) -- Wizardman 17:31, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I added it. Quadzilla99 15:20, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Alright. I'd like to see the lead improve on a bit though. It's certainly good enough now for a GA though.-- Wizardman 16:47, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ok, I'm going too continue to work on it and improve it. I just got his autobiography so I expect to make several additions to it in the near future. Quadzilla99 21:04, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Copyedit in progress
Hello! A copyedit was begun on this article about 6 months ago, but was not completed. Due to the volume of changes since then, I have removed this article from our current list of copyedit requests. If you would still like to have a copyedit, feel free to relist it on our request page. Thanks! Galena11 16:18, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Reasons For Edit
Since, people see fit to revert it, I'll explain:

My issue with the old player profile, is that it consists entirely of stats and opinion. You get no idea of how Hakeem actually played.

This kind of stuff: "legitimate two-way threat" "smothering defense" "legendary footwork" is opinion. You can find sources that agree with your opinion, but it is still opinion. Check out some articles on Hannibal. Rather than go on about how "great" of a general he was and how "cunning" he was and rattle off stats about how many people he killed, they talk about his actual tactics.

If the only issue with what I wrote was a lack of sources, how heavily sourced should it be? If there were other issues, what are they?68.190.73.79 05:35, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Back to Quadruple Double
Up above, it mentions that Hakeem had a second quadruple-double (well, it would have been his first) and talks about the story. Do you have a source for this? I've heard this same story but the guy who told me told me in such a way as "this is what I've heard." This would be interesting to talk about on here, or at least on the quadruple-double page. That game is listed on the Five-by-five (Basketball) page as not only did he get a quadruple-double (unofficial, yes) but he also had 5 steals so it was a five-by-five.

StatisticsMan 04:20, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I already added it to the quadruple double page with a source a while back. Quadzilla99 04:44, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

 * The only source I see is for the box score. I'm talking about the story. And, the note on the quadruple double page does not match the story told above.  The note says the initial figure reads 10 and the league corrected it.  The story above, same as the one I heard, says the initial read 9, Rockets watched the tape, found another, added it on, then the league said they could not change it after the fact.StatisticsMan 17:06, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't know, you'll have to look around I don't really care that much. Quadzilla99 23:14, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I have looked and have never seen anything on it. I was just asking if any one had a source, especially whoever put the story up on the talk page. StatisticsMan 16:10, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Click the history button on top of the page and you can see who posted the message and then leave him/her a message. Quadzilla99 16:37, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Yoruba v. Yoruban
So perhaps the word "Yoruban" exists, but none of the Yoruba people I know have ever used that word. That, combined with the fact that you call an adult male Yoruba a "Yoruba man", not a "Yoruban man" make me suspect that "Yoruban" is simply erroneous, or analagous to calling someone from England an Englander rather than English...

In response to Quadzilla: You googled the word Yoruban and saw many hits, but I don't think this is a valid way of demonstrating that it is the proper adjective. Consider the following article from a Nigeria newspaper: http://www.sunnewsonline.com/webpages/features/showtime/2004/sept/03/showtime-september-03-006.htm

Observe that it uses the expressions "Yoruba language", "Yoruba programmes", "Yoruba land", "Yoruba people", "Yoruba news", but certainly not "Yoruban."

Hopefully this is enough to convince you. I shall change it back to "Yoruba" now.

Best, Dapo

Dapo Omidiran 20:43, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Okay, I guess you're right. It will have to be re-worded as it sounds awkward to an English reader now though. Something like "of the Yoruba ethnicity" or the sort. Incidentally, to most of the English speaking world ethnicities/nationalities that end in a vowel end in -n (American, Indian, Canadian, Russian) or -ese (Chinese etc.) I've never heard one that doesn't change form. Of course I'm not the most wordly guy. Quadzilla99 21:22, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Rationale for recent edits.
Olajuwon gained a reputation of being a great clutch performer and also as one of the greatest centers of his generation based on his performances in the 1993–94 and 1994–95 seasons. He outplayed centers such as Ewing, Dikembe Mutombo and O'Neal, and other defensive stalwarts like Dennis Rodman or Malone. His most difficult battles were with his fellow Texas-based rival David Robinson of the San Antonio Spurs where Olajuwon would usually outplay Robinson in the stat sheets. While both players played for their respective Texan franchises, Olajuwon's Rockets were only 12–30 against Robinson's Spurs in 42 head–to–head games, but held the 4–2 advantage in the playoffs. From the 1989–90 season to the 1995–96 season, when both Olajuwon and Robinson were considered to be in their primes, in their 30 head–to–head matchups Olajuwon averaged 26.3 ppg, shooting 47.6% from the field. Robinson averaged 22.1 ppg, at 46.8% from the field.

Here are the parts I see problems with:

"His most difficult battles were with his fellow Texas-based rival David Robinson". Nowhere in the source for this part does it say that. Statistically, Olajuwon had a more difficult time with Shaq throughout his career.

"where Olajuwon would usually outplay Robinson in the stat sheets." Again, look at the source. It says he "outplayed" him and nothing more. It is not original research to say only that he outplayed him, as the source states this quite clearly.

"While both players played for their respective Texan franchises, Olajuwon's Rockets were only 12–30 against Robinson's Spurs in 42 head–to–head games, but held the 4–2 advantage in the playoffs." I don't particularly doubt that this is true, but aside from being not sourced (and therefore OR), it is also making this section unnecessarily long and much more about David Robinson and the Spurs than it should be. We should make sure to keep this article about Olajuwon and his accomplishments and not deviate too much by writing about his matchups with one opponent he played (or outplayed). --Ubiq 20:35, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Looking at it now a lot of your points are valid, I think putting the stats in there (which I didn't add incidentally) puts their matchup in the 95 WCF in perspective. People here are very converned with POV almost too much in my opinion. Maybe we can work up some compromise, I'll attempt that. Quadzilla99 20:44, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Okay I edited it. I removed the whole thing about the outplaying to avoid perceived POV; the head to head stats and the section on the 95 WCF put his performance relative to Robinson in perspective. The reader can see there respective positions in history pretty clearly for themselves. I removed the word "notably" as people aren't usually happy with that over on WP:FAC. "It should be noted" or "notably" is usually seen as someone telling people what to note. Quadzilla99 20:51, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

 * I was actually about to remove the word 'notably' myself until I saw you beat me to it. I'm also fine with removing the "outplaying" parts, as statistics can be provided to let the reader decide for themselves on that. Thanks for not letting this get too out of hand and compromising. Sorry for not including edit summaries in my initial edit. In the meantime I'll try to find some sources to support the last bit about the spurs being 30-12 against the rockets in that time. I think you may be right about it providing some context, I just initially saw it as unnecessary (i.e. there could be many reasons the spurs were 30-12 against the rockets in the regular season and none of them may have had to do with olajuwon himself). But in the grand scheme of things, it's not vitally important to exclude it as long as it's sourced.

 * The article on the whole is quite better than I remember it being a year or so ago, keep up the good work. --Ubiq 21:02, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks, a fresh eye is always welcome—I've got over 500 edits to the article and perhaps can't see the forest for the trees at times. It's being copy-edited right now by the League of Copyeditors so that should also provide some fresh eyes. Quadzilla99 21:07, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Possible addition
I'm currently looking through the article to improve it as much as I can. I added some stats/records and while fact checking for one of the quotes from the Early life section, I stumbled upon this interview with Michael Jordan in which he chooses Hakeem to be in a theoretical starting 5 along with himself, Larry Bird, Scottie Pippen, and Magic Johnson. I like how the Michael Jordan article has a Legacy section and I think, after some work, we can do something similar for this article, perhaps including a few quotes from other players and various other things like what current players were influenced by Olajuwon (similar to how it is in the Jordan article). Note that I don't necessarily want to model this article after the Jordan one, but I think it wouldn't hurt to use a few stylistic techniques from it (afterall it was featured and one of the best sports BLPs on wikipedia). Thoughts anyone? --Ubiq 10:11, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Bronze Statue at the Toyota Center?
Does someone want to add a new section about Houston erecting a statue in his honor? -RocketsFan —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.246.6.169 (talk) 19:28, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Picture
We need a better picture of Olajuwon at the top of the page. This is really a picture of Kevin McHale; we cannot see Olajuwon's face or even his name on his jersey. Hpanic7342 (talk) 16:04, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah there isn't a free image available. I've been looking for a while now. I'm pretty good at finding free ones so if one becomes available I should be able to find it pretty quick depending on how active I am. A good way to check is on Google and flickr's advanced image searches filtering for images with the appropriate license. Then you also have to make sure its labelled properly; some people mistakenly label posters and movie screenshots under creative commons licenses. You can usually tell a fan taken image by looking at the uploaders other photos or just by generally seeing if it looks bogus like this one here:[ http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=Hakeem+Olajuwon&l=commderiv&ss=0&ct=0&mt=all&w=all&adv=1] or these: AaronY (talk) 06:36, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, we have a picture now. Its actually one I uploaded a while ago, but which I removed when there was some question as to whether is was free or not. But from a quick glance at the discussion I see over on Commons it looks free. AaronY (talk) 10:06, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Height update
Hakeem himself and other sources have stated that his height is closer to 6'10" (2.08 mt).

Here are two examples:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1005285/index.htm

http://www.nytimes.com/1994/06/08/sports/on-pro-basketball-feet-of-dancer-touch-of-surgeon-and-a-shot-too.html

I think it's time for an update. Aloncho11 (talk) 16:23, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Relationship with Lita Spencer
Unless you count common law marriage, he was never married to Lita Spencer. In fact this is what lead to them separating, because she wanted to get married. Considering that fact, the article should not say he was married to her. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:5B0:23FF:3CF0:0:0:0:34 (talk) 20:37, 27 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Do you have a source?Hoops gza (talk) 00:56, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Just search the internet, she sued him to get child support. I would like you to however find a source of their marriage. The best you will find is unsubstantiated/ unsupported claims when his current marriage is discussed, most likely to make his reputation not look bad. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:5B0:23FF:3CF0:0:0:0:32 (talk) 03:27, 1 May 2014 (UTC) http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=861&dat=19681218&id=pzRSAAAAIBAJ&sjid=NTYNAAAAIBAJ&pg=7183,3941801 http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1988-12-18/sports/0090140255_1_spencer-olajuwon-boston-garden http://www.paklinks.com/gs/religion-and-scripture/41552-just-another-muslim-hakeem-olajuwon.html http://www.deseretnews.com/article/12983/OLAJUWON-SUED-FOR-BREACH-OF-PROMISE.html?pg=all http://books.google.com/books?id=Tp_63QIH11MC&pg=PT162&lpg=PT162&dq=lita+spencer+olajuwon&source=bl&ots=jvGzFQLQMS&sig=xEqLKJ_OzY7nutvqnsUj3y062qI&hl=en&sa=X&ei=IcFhU9uLBpS3yATm44GYAw&ved=0CEoQ6AEwBDgU#v=onepage&q=lita%20spencer%20olajuwon&f=false

No offense in my earlier comment, but with the internet now it seems that one article prints something unsubstantiated and then it gets "passed on" to other articles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:5B0:23FF:3CF0:0:0:0:32 (talk) 03:47, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

Name change note
The article had stated that Olajuwon changed his name "to the correct Arabic spelling of Hakeem". I changed this to "the more conventional spelling of Hakeem," because Arabic does not use the Roman alphabet. The "correct Arabic spelling" of the name is حكيم. The form Hakeem is an English transliteration of حاکم (and not the only one, either; the form Hakim is probably even more common). 108.254.160.23 (talk) 23:45, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

Change main picture of Olajuwon to his playing days
Typically you see all NBA players on their Wiki pages show pictures of them in their playing days, not in street clothes. I think somebody should change it to something like the one here http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/visual/whatshot/92412_Dream.jpg — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:8B83:4860:F0D6:EAB8:EEF5:99A0 (talk) 06:41, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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I have just modified 7 external links on Hakeem Olajuwon. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071214135956/http://www.nba.com/playerfile/hakeem_olajuwon/ to http://www.nba.com/playerfile/hakeem_olajuwon/
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080516203041/http://www.nba.com/playerfile/hakeem_olajuwon/bio.html to http://www.nba.com/playerfile/hakeem_olajuwon/bio.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20061103224751/http://www.nba.com/history/players/olajuwon_summary.html to http://www.nba.com/history/players/olajuwon_summary.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071214135956/http://www.nba.com/playerfile/hakeem_olajuwon/ to http://www.nba.com/playerfile/hakeem_olajuwon/
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.newdream.org/newsletter/taylor.php
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080410220737/http://www.hoophall.com/genrel/040708aaa.html to http://www.hoophall.com/genrel/040708aaa.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090622072004/http://www.slamonline.com/online/the-magazine/features/2009/06/the-new-top-50/ to http://www.slamonline.com/online/the-magazine/features/2009/06/the-new-top-50/

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External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060529072810/http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=HOU&lg=n&yr=1996 to http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=HOU&yr=1996&lg=n
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071014222951/http://databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=HOU&yr=1997&lg=N to http://databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=HOU&yr=1997&lg=N
 * Added tag to http://databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=HOU&yr=1998&lg=N
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071016070403/http://chron.com/CDA/archives/archive.mpl?id=1995_1276886 to http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/archive.mpl?id=1995_1276886

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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20051104124225/http://www.nba.com/rockets/history/Hakeem_Olajuwon_The_NBAs_Bes-91094-34.html to http://www.nba.com/rockets/history/Hakeem_Olajuwon_The_NBAs_Bes-91094-34.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20051104124225/http://www.nba.com/rockets/history/Hakeem_Olajuwon_The_NBAs_Bes-91094-34.html to http://www.nba.com/rockets/history/Hakeem_Olajuwon_The_NBAs_Bes-91094-34.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060306115933/http://www.backtoislam.com/?p=8 to http://www.backtoislam.com/?p=8
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140817102052/http://www.uh.edu/pride-stories/hakeem-olajuwon/hakeem-story/index.php to http://www.uh.edu/pride-stories/hakeem-olajuwon/hakeem-story/index.php
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060629194456/http://soundvision.com/info/peace/hakeem.asp to http://soundvision.com/info/peace/hakeem.asp
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070517014157/http://www.soundvision.com/info/ramadan/r.school.asp to http://www.soundvision.com/info/ramadan/r.school.asp

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A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 22:22, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Hakeembillboard.jpg

Hello Mr akeen ali I have a gold basketball that you
basket ball that you made when you came to Houston Texas at bill heard Chevrolet and you were saying to everyone that brought a car would get one wellsir I brought one from you now indeed to see if you would like to buy it from me.my name is Cornell turner please give me a call sir.281-415-5560 thanks very much and God bless you. 2600:100D:B082:54DF:0:19:27EF:A201 (talk) 10:00, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Hakeem Olajuwon


text:
Dirk Maggs

David George Dirk Maggs (born St. Helier, Jersey, February 1955) is a British freelance writer and director. During his career as a Senior Producer in BBC Radio he made radio drama adopting a cinematic-sounding approach, combining filmic story construction, layered sound effects, orchestral music and digital recording technology. Maggs introduced productions in Dolby Surround in BBC Radio and termed the result, "Audio Movies".

Maggs studied Drama for a BEd degree from 1974 to 1978 at King Alfred's College, Winchester. The college gained university status in 2005, when he was invited to become one of the first Honorary Fellows of the University of Winchester for his work in the Dramatic Arts. In 2019 he was awarded an Honorary Doctorate for his work in the Arts by Bournemouth University. In December 2021 Maggs was on a team representing the University of Winchester in BBC TV's Christmas University Challenge.

Maggs was awarded "Best Audiobook Producer" Award by the Audio Publishers Association at the 2021 Audio Production Awards at the BFI in London.

Maggs is married to Lesley Maggs, née Snow, whom he met in 1978 when they were Studio Managers in BBC World Service. They have three grown-up sons.

Radio comedy productions
As a senior or producer in BBC Radio Light Entertainment Maggs produced six seasons of the gently satirical radio comedy seriesThe News Huddlines between 1989 and 1991.

Between 1990 and 1992 he produced three series of Flywheel, Shyster, and Flywheel, an updated version of a 1932 Marx Brothers radio show of the same name. The actors were specifically chosen for their ability to impersonate the Marx Brothers, so that an accurate recreation could be achieved. One of the episodes won the gold medal at the New York International Festival.

In the late 1990s Maggs produced several series of It's Been a Bad Week and The Russ Abbot Show for Celador Productions, aired on BBC Radio 2.

Maggs produced Goon Again in 2001 for the 50th anniversary of The Goon Show with the permission of Spike Milligan. Starring Andy Secombe in his father's role of Neddie Seagoon and featuring the John Wilson Orchestra, it became in the words of Maggs, "a genetically-engineered tribute band" to the Goons. The show won the 2002 Best Comedy Award from the Spoken Word Producers Association (now the Audio Publishers Association).

In 2002 Maggs directed the Johnny Vegas radio series Night Class. This show won the Bronze award in the Comedy category of the 2003 Sony Radio Academy Awards.

In 2019 Maggs directed The Goodies in "The Big Ben Theory" for Audible (service)

Drama and science fiction productions
Early in his career, Maggs worked on audio adaptations of comic book material. He started in 1988 with the 50th Anniversary Man Of Steel docudrama Superman on Trial, carried on with a 50th birthday tribute to the Dark Knight: Batman: The Lazarus Syndrome. This was followed by The Adventures Of Superman, Batman: Knightfall, The Amazing Spider-Man and his final BBC Radio superhero series, Judge Dredd in 1995. Along the way his production of Superman: Doomsday and Beyond ("Superman Lives" in the US) won the 1994 Audie Award for Best Dramatisation from the American Booksellers Association and Spoken Word Audio of The Year from Publishers Weekly.

In 2005, Time Warner audiobooks re-released Maggs's Batman: Knightfall and Superman Lives in the US, prompting a UK re-release by BBC Audiobooks.

In 1996, Maggs was contacted by 20th Century Fox and asked to create a British-based "parallel-quel" to their summer science fiction blockbuster Independence Day. The resulting programme, Independence Day UK, took place in the same world, and at the same time as the film, but showed a British perspective on the alien invasion. This also won the 1996 Talkie Award for Best Production. The next year, with the blessing of director John Landis, Maggs produced and directed his own adaptation of An American Werewolf in London for BBC Radio One. For this he won the 1997 Talkie Award for Best TV/Film Adaptation.

In 1999, he produced a five-part adaptation of Stephen Baxter's alternative history novel Voyage, the story of a space-race that never was but so easily might have been. Maggs' adaptation was presented on BBC Radio 4, and received the 1999 Talkie Award for Best Use of Music as well as the 2000 Sony Radio Academy Bronze Award for Best Drama.

Maggs directed adaptations of several Agatha Christie short stories for Radio Four, and a production of Bill Naughton's Alfie for the BBC World Service.

In 1992, Douglas Adams approached BBC Radio Light Entertainment to ask if Maggs would collaborate on bringing Adams's science fiction comedy series The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy "back home to BBC Radio", as Adams put it. Contractual issues delayed the production and was not until 2003 to 2005 that Maggs adapted, produced and directed new episodes from Adams's last three novels which were based on the premise of the original radio series written by Adams.

In 2013, Maggs wrote and co-directed (with Heather Larmour) a dramatisation the BBC Radio 4 radio play Neverwhere, based on the television series Neverwhere by Neil Gaiman. This was followed by similar productions of Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett's Good Omens, and BBC Radio versions of Neil Gaiman's Stardust and How The Marquis Got His Coat Back, a spin-off of Neverwhere, and finally a production of Gaiman's Anansi Boys (script only), which won the British Fantasy Society's Best Audio Award.

In 2016, Maggs was approached by Audible Originals to adapt and direct Alien: Out Of The Shadows by Tim Lebbon, the first in a series of three stories set in the Alien film universe. This was followed by Alien: River Of Pain and Alien: Sea Of Sorrows. As part of the Alien's 40th anniversary, Maggs adapted and directed an audiobook version of William Gibson's unproduced screenplay of Alien 3, which was then released on May 30, 2019, and made available on Audible. The production starred Michael Biehn and Lance Henriksen, who reprised their roles of Corporal Hicks and Bishop from the film Aliens. This was followed by Executive Producing and adapting from the IDW comic book continuation by Joe Harris, The X-Files as a full-cast audio drama reuniting David Duchovny and Gillian Anderson as Mulder and Scully, with Mitch Pileggi as Skinner and William B. Davis as a different iteration of the Cigarette-Smoking Man. The two adaptations, Cold Cases and Stolen Lives were released in 2017.

The Sandman Audio Dramas (Audible Originals/DC Comics)
In the early 1990s Maggs was introduced to Neil Gaiman by a mutual friend, Phyllis Hume, of DC Comics International Business Affairs. For nearly three decades Maggs and Gaiman looked for a way to turn Gaiman's The Sandman comic book series into audio drama. With combined support from Audible and DC Comics, the project finally got under way in 2019.

On July 15, 2020, Audible released an adaptation of the comic book series as a multi-part audio drama directed by Dirk Maggs with music by James Hannigan. The voice cast included Gaiman as the Narrator, James McAvoy as Dream, Kat Dennings as Death, Taron Egerton as John Constantine, Michael Sheen as Lucifer, Riz Ahmed as the Corinthian, Andy Serkis as Matthew the Raven, Samantha Morton as Urania Blackwell, Bebe Neuwirth as The Siamese Cat, Arthur Darvill as William Shakespeare, and Justin Vivian Bond as Desire. The production spent two months at #1 in The New York Times Best Seller list

The follow-up, The Sandman: Act II, was released on 22 September 2021, and featured most of the original cast. New additions to the cast included: Regé-Jean Page as Orpheus, Jeffrey Wright as Destiny, Brian Cox as Augustus, Emma Corrin as Thessaly, John Lithgow as Joshua Norton, David Tennant as Loki, Bill Nighy as Odin, Kristen Schaal as Delirium, Kevin Smith as Merv Pumpkinhead, and Niamh Walsh as Nuala. Neuwirth also returned, but portrayed Bast.

The Sandman: Act III is again adapted and directed by Maggs and was released in October, 2022.

Productions in other media
Maggs was audio director for the first Animated Mr Bean television series 1999-2001 starring Rowan Atkinson.

For the feature-length animated film of The Magic Roundabout, Maggs voice-directed principal character sessions with actors including Robbie Williams, Kylie Minogue, Jim Broadbent, Ray Winstone and Joanna Lumley.

Maggs is credited as Voice Director on the highly acclaimed adventure game, Broken Sword: The Sleeping Dragon featuring Rolf Saxon and Sarah Crook.

title: Dirk Maggs


text:
User:Faethon32

This account is no longer an open account --John Chang

title: User:Faethon32


text: Talk:University of Wisconsin–Eau Claire

title: Talk:University of Wisconsin–Eau Claire


text:
43 Things

43 Things was a social networking service established as an online goal setting community. It was built on the principles of tagging, rather than creating explicit interpersonal links (as seen in Friendster and Orkut). Users created accounts and then listed a number of goals or hopes; these goals were parsed by a lexer and connected to other people's goals that were constructed with similar words or ideas. This concept is also known as folksonomy. Users could set up to 43 goals, and were encouraged to explore the lists of other users and "cheer" them on towards achieving their goals. In 2005, 43 Things won the Webby Award for the best social networking service.

The 43 Things website went offline on New Years Day, 2015.

History
43 Things was launched on January 1, 2005, by the Robot Co-op, a small company based in Seattle founded by blogger and developer Buster Benson (né Erik Benson), Maktub keyboardist Daniel Spils, and former Amazon.com and Microsoft executive Josh Petersen. 43things.com became read-only on August 15, 2014, and shut down January 1, 2015.

Critique
According to "43 Things: A Community Study," 43 Things had two shortcomings: (1) it failed to have a central area containing documentation about the website and (2) it relied heavily upon RSS, which is unfamiliar to a large portion of users. Regardless, it received solid reviews in regards to responsiveness and user suggestion integration.

Awards
In 2005, 43 Things won the Webby Award for the best social networking service.

title: 43 Things


text:
Talk:William Q. De Funiak

William Quinby De Funiak → William Q De Funiak
(from Requested moves)

I created this article with the title William Q De Funiak. This is because this writer is named William Q De Funiak. This is the name the man himself calls or called himself. (Please see all his books or citations of the man.) I am not allowed to edit any articles I created, or do barely anything on the wiki, without being banned. So will someone please rename the page to William Q De Funiak?WikiUser 20:06, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * This move does not require admin action. One can always move a page back over a redirect pointing at it, so long as there aren't any extra edits in the redirect's history. -- Netoholic @ 20:18, 2005 Feb 9 (UTC)
 * I've moved the page back to William Quinby De Funiak with a redirect at William Q De Funiak. The former is the man's birth name and how he is listed in library catalogues (see e.g. the Library of Congress catalogue), while the latter is, as WikiUser says, what he called himself (effectively a pen name). On the whole, I think it's more likely that he will be searched for under the former name rather than the latter. -- ChrisO 20:59, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)

TO NET (chriso'e edit conflict beat mine as usual);Thanks, someone seems to have done it; perhaps you? I don't understand about how redirect pages work. Whoever did the page name change will have trouble making it stay that way though. As I (partly) mentioned; I am NOT allowed to make edits as other users can, because of a group of users clearly headed by User:ChrisO who do not like me to use the wiki. He (chriso, appears to have already changed it [back]. (AS I was typing this)! [?]. He probably thinks I did the page move, you see. (Everywhere I go almost he follows and posts abuse and automatically reverts all I do.) He's now changed it from "William Quinby De Funiak (1901–?), was a ..." to "William Quinby De Funiak (1901–?), who wrote under the name of William Q De Funiak,". He DIDN'T "write under" the name, it wasn't an alias. He is entitled to have his own name. Can you expect now every biography or mention of every person on wikipedia to have their names changed to include their full middle-names, or whatever chriso and his friends want? No, don't worry, he not going to do it to anyone else. Just ME. He's obsessed with me that lad. I've never been able to find out why?! (Such is his obsession he's put POV claims in too. He does this with everything I do. It's INSANE!WikiUser 21:10, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * "(effectively a pen name). On the whole, I think it's more likely that he will be searched for under the former name rather than the latter. User:ChrisO" Bizzare nonsense. He calls himself as HE wishes to. Authors are searched for under their name, not under "the name user chriso says you must look under cos he's gotta appear (in seconds) after wikiuser and revert all his edits and trash his articles with POV and other mis-use." AS I ALREADY SAID: (Please see all his books or citations of the man.)WikiUser 21:15, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * WikiUser, please remain calm. Even if you are right about the article title, this is not anywhere near as vital a problem as your mood suggests.  As it stands, anyone looking at either title will find the article.  I suggest you and Chris discuss this move on the article's talk page (and that others talk there also) until a consensus is reached.  If that consensus is to return to your title, you can request again. Jwrosenzweig 21:23, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I'd like to add an opinion - I can't find anything conclusive in my admittedly short search to say that either option is dominant. In this case, though, I would defer to the name the author refers to themselves as. See the debate around e. e. cummings for another example of this. In either case, there is an appropriate redirect for whichever version is not chosen, in the end. -- Netoholic @ 21:37, 2005 Feb 9 (UTC)
 * I don't really care about the title either just as long as in the article his full name is used at least once. When I was trying to add more information to the article a while back I basically gave up as there was so little information on him. I mean I couldn't even find the year he died if he has in fact died. Evil Monkey∴Hello 21:42, Feb 9, 2005 (UTC)

I'm inclined to put this back the way WikiUser had it to start with. I don't think that it was worth changing it in the first place and it's barely worth changing it back. After all the information about the subject's name should be in the article, not in the title of the article. As long as the title allows users to find the article and doesn't have any POV issues it should be acceptable. Abbreviating de Funiak's middle name is not going to stop people finding him. We don't use the author's full name for Edward Estlin Cummings or for Iain Menzies Banks so there's no reason why we have to do it here. -- Derek Ross | Talk 23:44, Feb 11, 2005 (UTC)

 * Fair enough. I'll move it back; as long as there are redirects, it shouldn't make much difference in practice.

title: Talk:William Q. De Funiak


text:
User:Pnh

"pnh" is Patrick Nielsen Hayden, a book editor, writer, and musician in Brooklyn, New York.

title: User:Pnh


text: User talk:80.42.4.193

title: User talk:80.42.4.193


text:
Samuel Sterett

Samuel Sterett (1758 – July 12, 1833) was a Representative from the fourth congressional district of Maryland.

Born in Carlisle in the Province of Pennsylvania in 1758, Sterett moved with his parents to Baltimore, in 1761. After he completed preparatory studies, he went to and graduated from the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia. Afterwards held several local offices, was a member of the independent company (military) of Baltimore merchants in 1777, and in November 1782 he was appointed private secretary to the President of Congress.

Sterett was elected to the Maryland State Senate in 1789. Following his service in the State Senate he was elected to the Second Congress (March 4, 1791 – March 3, 1793), during which he also served as secretary of the Maryland Society for Promoting the Abolition of Slaver] in 1791.

In 1812 Sterett became a member of the Baltimore committee of safety. He also served as captain of an independent company at the Battle of North Point, fought on September 12, 1814. Sterett was grand marshal in Baltimore at the laying of the foundation stone of the Baltimore and Ohio Railroad on July 4, 1828.

Sterett died in Baltimore, Maryland, in 1833 and is interred in the burying ground of Westminster Church.

title: Samuel Sterett