text:
Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Bart133

Bart133
final (9/8/5) ending 02:52 21 February 2005 (UTC)

I ran across this fellow a few weeks ago when I saw that he had fixed vandalism to one of the main pages on my watchlist (About or something like that). Going to his userpage, I found that he had been awarded the exceptional newcomer award, and on his talk page I observed praise from several users regarding his quick grasp of our policies and involvement in the Vfd. I was impressed, so I looked over his edit history and found that he is quite involved in the community. I say, he's worthy. →Iñgōlemo←  talk   donate  02:54, 2005 Feb 14 (UTC)

 * I definitely accept, thanks! Bart133 (t) 03:12, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)

 * Notice: If this nomination does not meet consensus by the above deadline, I elect to extend another week. -- R yan!  |  Talk  09:40, Feb 18, 2005 (UTC)

Support
 * 1) Good User, 1000 edits is a little small but I'm willing to overlook it--Comrade Nick  @ )---^--  09:54, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 2) As long as his last name isn't Simpson. ;)  -- R yan!  |  Talk  14:43, Feb 14, 2005 (UTC)
 * 3) Edits seem useful and I recognize the name. I support. - RedWordSmith 18:01, Feb 14, 2005 (UTC)
 * 4) Looks good to me. Rje 19:51, Feb 14, 2005 (UTC)
 * 5) I generally expect users to have 1,200 edits before requesting adminship, but I can be flexible. 1166 edits is good enough. And I like his work. --Lst27 ( t a l k )  23:30, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * As they say, "On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog."—seems more mature than some editors thrice his age. Work is of good quality, seems to enjoy thankless tasks like fixing typos and tagging images.  --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 02:18, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC) Back to neutral... --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 20:45, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * How did you know that? I do.  :) Bart133 (t) 02:22, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 1) Cool. JuntungWu 04:21, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 2) Neutralitytalk 05:32, Feb 15, 2005 (UTC)
 * 3) Andre ( talk ) 13:45, Feb 15, 2005 (UTC)
 * Heh, I started editing when I was 12, became admin when I was 13... ugen 64 02:22, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Oppose
 * 1) I am hesitant.  3 months and 1000 edits is a pretty quick promotion in general.  But this chap is in 6th grade.  I'm sure he's a fine and responsible fellow.  But for someone still in elementary school, I'd rather see a somewhat longer history & evidence of behavior in tense situations.  Another couple months.  Nothing personal at all, I suppose I'm just an age bigot. Wolfman 04:02, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * If you are willing to call yourself an age bigot, it is a strong indication that you are not. :-)  →Iñgōlemo←   talk   donate  04:29, 2005 Feb 14 (UTC)
 * Well, I would happily vote to give him a Barnstar. So, maybe I'm just being circumspect. Wolfman 16:19, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Ahem, 6th grade, in the U.S., is middle school. Certainly seems responsible enough for me. Эйрон Кинни  02:44, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
 * 1) I looked through his edit history.  Over the past few days he's put a speedy tag on something up for VFD (presumably he didn't check the edit history when it was vandalized, instead just slapping a speedy tag on it – something that happened before, as well). I also found numerous grammatical errors when reverting, such as  and .   All this, combined with listing Fruit Brute for deletion (the article was vandalized, but the history of the article was still there and the article itself still had content establishing its notability), and the other objections raised lead me to believe that he's not ready for adminship yet.  I'd likely support later.  CryptoDerk 05:51, Feb 15, 2005 (UTC)
 * Also, I just noticed that from December 5 to January 7 he only made 6 contributions. So his period of activity is really more like 2 months. CryptoDerk 05:56, Feb 15, 2005 (UTC)
 * Note--the Versace goof was in his first hundred edits, so I'm willing to chalk that up to new user enthusiasm. I note that the next edit to the article was also by him—[removing the tag] a minute later.  The recent item is more troubling. --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 20:45, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 1) Oppose the hell out of this one. this user not only has been editing for 2 months, is one of the youngest users of  wikipedia being in 6th grade, I do not feel this user has the maturity level to handle the power. This can be seen by his "not notable" reasoning of an item produced before his birth, that he put up for VfD without even a simple google. If people like this become admins, I'll become an ex-user.   ALKIVAR ™[[Image:Radioactive.svg|18px|]] 06:25, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 2) Maybe after more edits. -- Jordi· ✆ 07:52, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 3) He's on the right track, but 2 months of activity and 1100 edits just isn't enough. What clinched it for me was the Fruit Brute VFD. A Google query turns up over 1000 hits. With a bit more experience, I will support. Carrp | Talk 14:01, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 4) Oppose, and extremely so. Maybe after a few more years of schooling and experience, but placing adminship responsibilities in the hands of someone who has yet to reach middle school is not a wise idea.  Also agree that his edit count is somewhat inflated due to minor copy editing.  Granted, minute copy editors are needed, but that does not convey to me that the person is ready to handle admin responsibilities.  Furthermore, this person has not displayed the maturity level that I would expect to see on VfD and has made several unnecessary listings.  Closing comments: keep up the good work and try again a few years from now.   —RaD Man (talk) 00:56, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 5) Oppose. Adminship is not a reward, it is a position of responsibility. Phils 18:18, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 6) Oppose. I'll want to see evidence of a longer editing history at Wikipedia before I can consider supporting. As Wolfman said, I may be an age bigot (I teach 6th grade, you see), but a user as young as Bart133 will need to demonstrate considerable maturity before I can see myself supporting a vote for adminship.  Joyous 15:30, Feb 19, 2005 (UTC)

Neutral
 * 1) He seems to be an exceptionally solid and mature contributor for someone his age, but I'm yet hesitant to offer my support. This is mainly because I agree with Wolfman's comment above and my personal editcount/time minimum standard is above 2000 edits/four months. Will likely support in future. jni 09:02, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 2) I'm also hesitant to offer my support, mainly for the same reasons as Jni. When the questions below are answered, I will re-evaluate and may change my vote to support. Carrp | Talk 15:11, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 3) *Due to the Fruit Brute VFD and the fact that the user has only 2 months of editing, I am opposing this RfA. I will support in the future. Carrp | Talk 14:09, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 4) I'm waiting to hear his answers to the questions below; see also my comments. --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 20:20, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC) Moved to support. --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 02:18, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC) Back to neutral on this one.  Still seems to need seasoning; a little too prompt to , and I didn't notice the month on hiatus. Check back in a couple of months. --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 20:45, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 5) Waiting for his responses. -- AllyUnion (talk) 22:42, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * See below for responses. Bart133 (t) 01:36, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 1) I am uncertain to vote either way. His praises have some merit, but the caution urge from others certain has me concern.  I think I slightly agree with the fact that this request for adminship comes premature.  I do not wish to discourage either way, therefore I wish to remain neutral. -- AllyUnion (talk) 11:48, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Comments
 * 1166 edits. First edit was in November 2004. Carrp | Talk 03:39, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Only 6 edits from December 5 to January 7. CryptoDerk 05:56, Feb 15, 2005 (UTC)

 * I looked at several pages of his contributions, and I see he has made many valuable edits fighting vandalism and nonsense. Good work. Jonathunder 04:27, 2005 Feb 14 (UTC)
 * Looking at his contribution history, there are a lot of very minor copyedits (removing doubled words and correcting single typos). This is valuable and worthwhile work, but I fear it results in an (unintentionally) inflated edit count.  I'm also a bit concerned about all the images that he's tagged as GFDL (images that were left untagged when uploaded by other users.)  I've asked him to clarify how he verified their GFDL status; hopefully they're all good. --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 20:20, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Bart133 responded quickly to my copyright questions, and a cursory examination of his other image tags suggests that he's usually quite thorough and conscientious. --TenOfAllTrades | Talk 02:18, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * I strongly urge those who have already voted to reconsider. I think he's a good editor, and I could care less about edit count, but 2 months of activity and multiple instances of putting VFD/speedy tags on articles that didn't deserve them has really got me worried – especially since so many people have already voted to support him and none of them have brought these issues up. CryptoDerk 06:15, Feb 15, 2005 (UTC)
 * Here's something to consider: one of his listings for deletion resulted in some comments that were rather harsh. In my humble opinion, those comments will probably make him be more cautious in the future.  The old adage, that one never makes a mistake more than once, holds true in this case.   →Iñgōlemo←   talk   donate  07:45, 2005 Feb 15 (UTC)
 * I know it's only been two days of voting and there's still five days left, but if my observation is correct it is now unlikely for Bart133 to achieve consensus for promotion to adminship. But don't get discouraged - many fine admins were promoted only on their second (even third) subsequent nominations. JuntungWu 16:45, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * I agree. It was just a bit too early for this RfA. The oppose votes (including mine) were mainly based on inexperience and/or a recent erroneous VfD. If Bart133 keeps up the good work for another 3 months, I will strongly support. Carrp | Talk 17:01, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * I want to remind people that please do not judge people by age only. We have many adults that vandalises Wikipedia pages. Are they mature? Hell no. SYSS Mouse 18:35, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * I believe age should not be an issue. I note that we already have sysops that are roughly the same age. JuntungWu 01:19, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC) (note that I've already voted support).
 * Indeed. Ilyanep is, if my calculations are correct, no more than two years older (more likely one) and he is a Bureaucrat.  The classic characteristics of any age group are statistical, and there will always be outliers.   →Iñgōlemo←   talk   donate  01:49, 2005 Feb 17 (UTC)
 * Absolutely, there are many young people exceptionally mature for their age who would be fine admins. Bart may be one such.  However, the average person that age would likely not be a good candidate.  The question is whether there is a sufficiently long record at this point to determine with confidence whether Bart is exceptional.  The nomination simply seems premature to some of us.  Note that I would be at best neutral even if he were 40 based on the rather brief track-record.  I think at least a couple mistakes have been made in the past with such quick nominations.  Wolfman 02:33, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * I can't support simply because the user is too new, but opposing him on the basis of nominating some breakfast cereal for deletion is utterly ludicrous. Gamaliel 06:58, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * It does sound rather funny when you put it that way, but the point is that the VfD demonstrated inexperience. A low edit count or two months of editing time doesn't automatically disqualify a candidate for me. However, I prefer that admins have enough experience to perform a basic Google test before nominating for VfD. Carrp | Talk 12:52, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Oddly, the nominator hasn't supported the nbomination. Doesn't the nominator usually support?  Bart133 (t) 21:14, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * I was the first to come to the defence of the Fruit Brute article, but it troubles me to see so many using that VfD against him in this RfA. It's perfectly understandable if he's a 6th grader that he probably hadn't heard of it.  He should have Googled before listing it as a VfD, but then lots of VfD nominators (even some current admins) don't always do that.  I think that VfD was a mistake on his part, but I don't think it's so egregiously bad that it should cost him an adminship.  Everyone who hangs out on VfD for awhile makes a bad call or two.  Andrew Lenahan - St ar bli nd  01:20, Feb 21, 2005 (UTC)
 * The Fruit Brute thing clearly touched a sore spot with some people, as does the age thing. Since I haven't chimed in from my original vote, I should point out that in my book a bad VfD or two doesn't count against someone, and age doesn't matter, but bad speedy tags do.  An administrator has three main technical abilities -- block, delete, and protect.  While it's hard to predict if someone will make a lot of bad blocks or bad protects, one can see if an administrator will make some bad speedies.  If Bart had one more month of activity and hadn't made a couple of bad speedy calls, I would have supported.  If he had several more months of activity & a thousand more edits, I would have overlooked a couple of bad speedies.  CryptoDerk 02:50, Feb 21, 2005 (UTC)
 * Oww, his Open Tasks box hurts my eyes!!! -- Riffsyphon1024 02:53, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * It hurt mine too, for the short period that it was there for. Bart133 (t) 04:56, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Questions for the candidate

A few generic questions to provide guidance for voters:
 * 1. What sysop chores, if any, would you anticipate helping with? (Please read the page about administrators and the administrators' reading list.)
 * A. Probably, I would help with anti-vandalism and deletion tasks, since I already do as much as I can to support these already.  However, I would probably help with all I could.
 * Can you explain why you listed Gianni Versace for speedy deletion after it was vandalized rather than make the appropriate reversion?   ALKIVAR ™[[Image:Radioactive.svg|18px|]] 06:35, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * 2. Of your articles or contributions to Wikipedia, are there any about which you are particularly pleased, and why?
 * A. I mostly like all my contributions equally, although, if you look at my user page, I have a list of articles I've created.  Add Blue Hen Chicken, which I wrote anonymously, and you get a list of contributions I like.
 * 3. Have you been in any conflicts over editing in the past or do you feel other users have caused you stress? How have you dealt with it and will deal with it in the future?
 * A. No really major conflicts, although Grunt and 24.116.8.12 were in a short revert war on my user page over how quickly I revert, and there was a somewhat minor dispute over Fruit Brute.


text:
Alan Cross

Alan Cross is a Canadian radio broadcaster and a writer on music. Based in Toronto, Ontario, he is best known nationally and internationally as host of the syndicated radio series The Ongoing History of New Music, The Secret History of Rock, and ExploreMusic. In 2013, he started the Geeks & Beats podcast with BNN's Michael Hainsworth.

Background
Originally from the small prairie town of Stonewall, Manitoba, Cross began his radio career with the University of Winnipeg's campus radio station, CKUW, in 1980. He subsequently joined radio stations in Selkirk, Kenora and Brandon before returning to Winnipeg's CHIQ.

Career
He joined CFNY on October 3, 1986, as an overnight announcer.

In 1989, Cross became the station's afternoon drive-time host. The following year, he moved to the 10 a.m.-2 p.m. slot; in 1993, he returned to afternoon drive and remained there until 2001. Beginning in February 1993, he also became host of The Ongoing History of New Music. Cross left CFNY in 2001 to become program director of CJXY in Hamilton, where he oversaw the station's frequency switch to become Y108. During this time he continued to host The Ongoing History of New Music. He subsequently returned to CFNY as program director in mid-January 2004, remaining in that role until moving to Corus Entertainment's interactive media division, Splice Media (now called Corus Interactive and Integrated Solutions), in 2008 to launch the ExploreMusic project — although CFNY still aired The Ongoing History of New Music until 2011. He also hosted the television program ExploreMusic on aux.tv.

Cross left Corus Entertainment in early July 2011, after the company restructured their online content department. In an interview with the Toronto Star, Cross said that there was no ill will between himself and Corus. Cross' departure effectively brought an end to The Ongoing History of New Music, because Corus Entertainment owned the show.

He then began working on a different show, The Secret History of Rock, for Astral Media. In 2013, he joined Rock95 Broadcasting's new CIND-FM as a music consultant and part-time on-air personality. Throughout this era, Cross also maintained his own personal music blog, A Journal of Musical Things; in 2009, he attracted international attention when he became the first music critic in the world to post an advance review of U2's new single "Get On Your Boots".

In 2014, he was named as the head of music curation for Songza's operations in Canada, and curated a museum exhibition on the science of rock music for the Ontario Science Centre. In the fall of that year, he returned to CFNY and relaunched The Ongoing History of New Music, as well as a new weekday programming feature called Adventures in Vinyl. In 2015, he formed the company Major League Mixes with colleague Dave Charles; the company currently holds the contract for game music at Toronto Maple Leafs games.

Personal life
Cross is married to Mary Ellen Beninger, a journalist who has been associated with the Toronto radio stations CFNY, CFTR and CHFI.

Books

 * The Alternative Music Almanac (1995)
 * The Making of Pretty Hate Machine and The Downward Spiral (1996)
 * Over the Edge: The Revolution and Evolution of New Rock (1997)
 * 20th Century Rock and Roll: Alternative Rock (2000)
 * The History of Alternative Rock, volumes 1-4 (audio book series)''
 * The Science of Song How and Why We Make Music

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Alan Cross


text:
List of Country Music Hall of Fame inductees

This is a list of the 155 inductees to the Country Music Hall of Fame and Museum,, counting groups as a single inductee. Of these, 16 inductions are solo female performers, and 1 induction is a female duet.

To date, Roy Rogers is the only artist to have been inducted twice: first in 1980 as a member of the Sons of the Pioneers and again in 1988 as a solo artist. The induction of Harold Bradley in 2006 marked the first time two members of the same family were inducted into the Hall individually, following his brother Owen Bradley, who was inducted as part of the class of 1974. Owen's son Jerry was subsequently inducted in 2019. Hank Williams (inducted 1961), and his son Hank Williams Jr. (inducted 2020) are the only other family to have multiple separate inductees. To date, eight groups have been inducted that include members of the same family: Maybelle and Sara Carter of the Carter Family (cousins), the Delmore, Everly and Louvin Brothers; Randy Owen, Teddy Gentry and Jeff Cook of Alabama (cousins); Harold and Don Reid of the Statler Brothers (brothers), The Browns (siblings), and The Judds (mother and daughter). In addition, the Hall also includes one married couple who were inducted together: Felice and Boudleaux Bryant, and two couples who were inducted for their individual achievements: former husband and wife George Jones (inducted 1992) and Tammy Wynette (inducted 1998), and currently married couple Connie Smith (inducted 2012), and Marty Stuart (inducted 2020).

Seventeen members of the Country Music Hall of Fame are also inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.

Also in the Rock Hall of Fame
As of 2024, there are 17 members of the Country Music Hall of Fame also inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.


text: Category:History museums

title: Category:History museums


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Talk:Holy Roller

Old discussion
I removed the following because it belongs on a page perhaps about fundamentalists or somewhere else appropriate.

"In 2005, Will Smith released a song on his album "Lost and Found" which speaks out about the intolerance that he has faced in his life from people close to him and in the media. The lyric also contains a dissertation on freedom from religious oppression and fundamentalism comparing the actions that led to the September 11th attacks to those of mainstream right wing fundamentalists. "

-- Ted Wilkes 21:37, July 18, 2005 (UTC)

Holy Rollers are not literally "rolling"
I removed the specific reference to Pentecostals being Slain in the Spirit because the term is certainly broader than that applied to these churches. Many of those who oppose Pentecostalism and who think that being "Slain in the Spirit" is actually unchristian could also be guilty of being a "Holy Roller" simply because of a judgemental attitude. --One Salient Oversight 06:19, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Neutrality
I cannot, and will not, agree that this page is neutral. It fails to mention the thousands of people that gladly accept the term because they are, if fact, holy, yet nonjudgmental and wear the term with pride. It also shines a very poor light on many religions that have been labeled "Holy Rollers" in the past but over time have become well respected and rather established religions. (i.e. UPCI, ALJC, Assemblies of God, etc.) Boothcat4320 19:56, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Christians
We don't force you we let you make your own decisions. User: matt2005

Shakers!? Quakers!?
The line in the article about Shakers and Quakers makes absolutely no sense. These denominations did not "Shake" or "Quake". Someone should fix this as this article makes a mockery of the Wikipedia. Goaty 07:26, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

My understanding of the term Holy Roller
I do not believe that the term "Holy Roller" originated with the Shakers or the Quakers. According to my sources, both of whom are Pentecostal clergy, during the early years of the Holiness/Pentecostal churches in America, the term was used to degrade those who agreed with the doctrines now associated with Pentecostal/Holiness churches. It is important to note that although the term Holy Roller is often associated with Pentecostal/Holiness churches, it can also be used to refer to any member of a mainline denomination who supported the doctrines of holiness. Here's what the American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language (4th Edition)says, "NOUN: Offensive Used as a disparaging term for a member of any of various religious denominations in which spiritual fervor is expressed by shouts and violent body movements." The Holiness movement stressed the importance of living a set-apart lifestyle so as not to be conformed to the secular world. Some individuals were more radical in their lifestyle changes than others. Pentecostal church services are often known to be more expressive than other Protestant denominations and according to my sources, pioneers of the Pentecostal Movement were riddiculed for their expressive forms of worship, such as clapping, the lifting of "holy hands" and what is known by some as the "Holy Dance". On the television broadcast of a Pentecostal bishop from Memphis, Tennessee, he stated that early Pentecostals were known as Holy Rollers because it was rumored by their accusers that they rolled in sheets on the floor during their services. Here is a quote from Brother William Marrion Branham, a Pentecostal clergy in 1953 concerning the term "Holy Roller", " Would you like to know why I'm a holy-roller? I'll try to tell you from the Word of the Lord. And you know, I've done a lot of traveling for our Lord Jesus, I seen many denominational churches. But you know, I've never seen a holy-roller yet. I--I really don't know what--where they're at. I looked all over the church lists and the statistics and everything, I can't find where there's a church called holy-rollers. But you know what it is? It's just a name the devil pinned on the Church; that's all. There is no holy-roller. I've never seen one. I--the government don't know of any. So well, I--I don't know where they're at, but I... Just think, there's the devil just did that." His sermon, "Why I Am A Holy-Roller" was delivered on Sunday afternoon, 30th August 1953 at the Chicago Gospel Tabernacle in Chicago, Illinois, U.S.A.

Rewritten
I rewrote the article to present two different etymologies of the term, and positive and negative views of the less derogatory. I could not, however, get good sources, though this is in line with what I've heard before, and makes more sense. I've marked the article unsourced, anyway. I've also made it a stub, and tried to keep the content to a minimum, while still covering the basic ideas one has of a holy roller, from either side of the fence. It is still moderately tainted with my POV, perhaps, but hopefully the fact that I don't really care about holy rollers (they're mostly obsolete and obscure at this point) means it isn't too bad, so I've removed the neutrality-dispute, now that it isn't a wholly ridiculous article. --Flata 01:22, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

Zechariah 5:1 - Revelations
As used in the late nineteenth century, "holy roller" often referred to the scroll mentioned in Zechariah 5:1 "Then I lifted up my eyes again and looked, and behold, there was a flying scroll" and again adverted to in the Book of Revelation - which listed the bad and the good, the ones who would be destroyed in the end times, and the 144,000 who would be saved. This group also was quite interested in the Key of David, the Church of Philadelphia, and other Revelations mysticism. But the Holy roll did not refer to rolling around on the floor, but to the mystical roll with the saved and the damned. I am sure that, in common usage, it also refers to convulsions of religious fervor. But I think the listing should at least mention the other background.

Hypercallipygian (talk) 21:46, 9 August 2016 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Move. Jafeluv (talk) 14:56, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

Holy Roller → — The term is a common noun, not a proper name, and should not be capitalized. --BlueMoonlet (t/c) 14:15, 30 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Support, definitely not a proper noun. Recury (talk) 20:21, 31 August 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Round 2

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved. Born2cycle (talk) 05:13, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Comment from closer: No clear consensus among participants or reliable sources, though tertiary sources like m-w.com seem to go with proper noun, and skimming usage at secondary sources like nytimes.com seems to reveal a preference for the proper noun form over "holly roller" and "holly-roller". Tough call but at best there is no consensus to move. --Born2cycle (talk) 05:13, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Holy Roller → Holy roller — Relisting  Ron h jones (Talk) 22:24, 30 September 2010 (UTC) Reopened move discussion, see below. Jafeluv (talk) 19:56, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

After this discussion was closed with a consensus to move, someone reverted with the justification that "every single reference used" has the term capitalized. Firstly, reverting an action arrived at by consensus without even taking part in the discussion is not good form. Secondly, the claim is not even true. This reference, which is ref #2 and the only actual reference not behind a paywall, extensively uses the term as a common noun and capitalizes it only when it is part of the article's title. Of the three examples cited under "Usage", one has it capitalized only because it is part of the title, while the other two are using the term as part of a denominational affiliation, and all are at least 70 years old. --BlueMoonlet (t/c) 00:58, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

 * While your personal preference may be "Holly roller", Merriam-Webster uses "Holly Roller", as do the majority of the usages in Google News archive and in books. Stick to the experts and not personal preferences, please. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 16:54, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

 * The sources are, at best, mixed. You have not responded to the part of my post where I pointed out that the only actual reference in the article (that isn't behind a paywall) uses the term as a common noun.  Wordnik gives examples in lowercase, and Urban Dictionary gives one example capitalized and one in lowercase.  But I'm not convinced that any of these dictionary-type references are really the best, because none of them are likely written by people actually knowledgeable about Pentecostalism.  I looked at the New International Dictionary of Pentecostal and Charismatic Movements ("search inside the book" for "holy roller") and found two examples capitalized and two examples lowercase.

 * As I said, the record is mixed. It basically depends on whether you are thinking of "Holy Rollers" as an actual denomination (and no actual denomination calls itself that) or "holy rollers" as a descriptive term for people who act a certain way.  In conclusion, I still maintain that Richard's unilateral page-move against consensus was out of order and should be reverted until consensus is reached.  --BlueMoonlet (t/c) 00:14, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Urban dictionary is not a reliable source and Wordnick states: "The definitions below are for Holy Roller. The examples and other data are for the variant you requested, holy roller." (my emphasis added) Again it is best to stick to what the dictionary uses, rather than pick and choose the examples that satisfy what you as an individual are looking to confirm. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 00:41, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Please discuss the content and not the editor. I am finding it difficult not to be angry at the manner with which you address me.  Despite your exhortations, you yourself are picking and choosing which arguments of mine you will respond to.  Several sources (including Wordnik) allow for the uncapitalized usage, and some sources (including those most knowledgeable about actual Pentecostalism) favor it.
 * We have both stated our cases, and others should now weigh in. I repeat that the page move should be undone until such time as a new consensus is reached, as it is out of order for you to have unilaterally made the change against consensus.  I would undo it, but you have edited the redirect so that your action can now only be undone by an admin, another action that I find offensive.  --BlueMoonlet (t/c) 17:33, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
 * A consensus of one. Again, its better to not second guess why all the dictionary sources use "Holy Roller" instead of your preferred "Holy roller", but to stick to what is the dictionary used spelling. You should complain to the dictionary compilers rather than try and argue why they choose that spelling here. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 19:02, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Keep as "Holy Roller", both Dictionary.com and Merriam Webster online use "Holy Roller" as do the majority of hits in Google Books and my three paper dictionaries at home. No need to reinvent the wheel, stick to what the experts have already determined to be the proper way to use the term. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 01:11, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Support not a proper name or title, simple a noun (description of a churchgoer).--Labattblueboy (talk) 00:50, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Support move per my arguments above. --BlueMoonlet (t/c) 14:00, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Keep - Two of the most widely published dictionaries used in American English use the capitalized version, additionally the cited New York Times articles does as well. These are reliable, secondary sources confirming the capitalized form is the proper format. --Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 16:50, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Not voting, but isn't it supposed to be a kind of colloquial proper noun, like "Quaker" and so on?--Kotniski (talk) 17:36, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Except that "Quaker" has become a generally accepted name for a particular denomination, while this is not true of the term in question here. --BlueMoonlet (t/c) 19:17, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Meaning
But what does it mean? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:E35:8A8D:FE80:2193:33A3:E31B:D73C (talk) 08:21, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

title: Talk:Holy Roller


text:
Hasty Pudding Theatricals

Hasty Pudding Theatricals is a student theatrical society at Harvard University known for its annual burlesque crossdressing musicals as well as its Man and Woman of the Year awards. The Pudding is the oldest theatrical organization in the United States and the third oldest in the world. Its annual production is a musical comedy that often touches on topical social and political issues.

History
Hasty Pudding Theatricals was formed in 1795 as a social club for Harvard College students to cultivate the social affections and cherish the feelings of friendship & patriotism. On December 13, 1844, the Pudding put on its first full performance - William Barnes Rhodes’ burlesque opera Bombastes Furioso. After a period of producing popular comedies by established playwrights, student members of the Pudding began to write their own shows, starting in 1882 with a production of Dido and Aeneas by Owen Wister. The event was interrupted for 2 years during each of the World Wars and the fifth time came in 2020 due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

Women played a role in the company for many years, primarily as costumers. In 1948 Felisa Vanoff became Pudding’s first female choreographer, and in 1978 Diane Nabatoff became its first female producer. In 2009 Megan Amram and Alexandra Petri became the first all-female team to write the musical comedy. The technical crew, band, and business staff has been co-ed for many years.

Notable alumni

 * BJ Averell, a Grand Prize winner of The Amazing Race
 * Megan Amram
 * Paris Barclay, Emmy-winning director and producer for dozens of film and television projects including NYPD Blue, Sons of Anarchy and Glee, and in 2013 was elected President of the Directors Guild of America
 * Nell Benjamin, who herself wrote the award-winning play The Explorers Club
 * John Berman, news anchor for CNN
 * Andy Borowitz, humorist
 * Josh Brener, actor in Silicon Valley, Maron, and The Big Bang Theory, and former Pudding President
 * Francis Cabot, American financier, gardener and horticulturist
 * Henry Ives Cobb Jr., artist
 * Jerry Colker, who won the Drama Desk Award for authoring the book for the Off-Broadway musical Three Guys Naked From the Waist Down
 * Edward Everett, politician and orator at Gettysburg
 * Fred Gwynne, Actor
 * William Randolph Hearst, newspaper publisher
 * Rashida Jones, actress in Parks and Recreation, The Office, Boston Public, and the film I Love You, Man
 * Oliver Wendell Holmes Sr., physician, poet, and polymath
 * David Javerbaum, playwright who has won 13 Emmy Awards, including 11 as head writer for The Daily Show
 * Jack Lemmon, Oscar winner
 * Alan Jay Lerner lyricist and librettist notable for collaboration with Frederick Loewe
 * J.P. Morgan Jr., financier
 * Dean Norris, actor in Breaking Bad and Under the Dome
 * Mark O'Donnell, librettist who won a Tony Award in 2003 for co-authoring the book for Hairspray
 * Michael O'Hare, Actor
 * Laurence O'Keefe, actor and composer, wrote the music and lyrics for the Off-Broadway shows Bat Boy: The Musical and Heathers: The Musical
 * Mark O'Keefe, co-wrote and co-produced the movies Bruce Almighty and Click
 * Alexandra Petri
 * Joe Raposo, composer, songwriter, pianist; for stage, screen, television Sesame Street etc.
 * Mo Rocca, comedian and former Pudding librettist and president
 * Franklin Delano Roosevelt, US President
 * Theodore Roosevelt, US President
 * Felisa Vanoff (1925–2014), who became the company's first female choreographer in 1948 (although women had been included as costumers for many years prior)
 * William Weld, former Governor of Massachusetts
 * Fairfax Henry Wheelan, American businessman, philanthropist, and political reformer.
 * Owen Wister, novelist and biographer

Origins of name
The Hasty Pudding name comes from a Colonial era (originally British) dish called hasty pudding, a kind of porridge made from cornmeal with molasses, honey or other ingredients. It is not clear whether the dish was originally a staple or a dessert, but it is now served for dessert at the banquets thrown by the Pudding, such as opening night celebrations and the annual 'roasts' for their Man and Woman of the Year.

Honorary awards
The society is notable for their annual selection of famous entertainers as Woman of the Year since 1951 and Man of the Year since 1967. These awards are usually treated with great seriousness by the honorees. Since the unanticipated personal appearance of Jane Fonda to accept her award in 1961, always attend the awards ceremony, and are treated to a celebratory "roast," and a parade.

Symbols
The Hasty Pudding Theatricals has adopted many significant symbols. It has two official logos: The first is a sphinx holding a pudding pot, and the second is a pudding pot depicted hanging over a fire. Its main colors are deep blue, crimson, green and yellow. The shade of yellow used by the club is an ode to the color of traditional hasty pudding. The Hasty Pudding Theatricals, Hasty Pudding Club, and Harvard Krokodiloes are all organizations of the Hasty Pudding Institute of 1770 and share the same meeting space and social events on Harvard's campus.

Concordia Discors is the official motto of the Hasty Pudding, literally meaning: Discordant Harmony, or organized chaos, in English.

title: Hasty Pudding Theatricals


text:
Ten American Painters

The Ten American Painters (also known as The Ten) was an artists' group formed in 1898 to exhibit their work as a unified group. John Henry Twachtman, J. Alden Weir, and Childe Hassam were the driving forces behind the organization. Dissatisfied with the conservatism of the American art establishment, the three artists recruited seven others from Boston, New York City, and elsewhere on the East Coast, with the intention of creating an exhibition society that valued their view of originality, imagination, and exhibition quality. The Ten achieved popular and critical success, and lasted two decades before dissolving.

Foundation
In America, popular painting styles usually originated on the east coast in cities like New York and Boston. The Ten continued a tradition of artists forming new groups in reaction to a lack of support from existing artists' groups. Thus, the National Academy of Design (founded in 1825 by students dissatisfied by the conservatism of the older American Academy of the Fine Arts) eventually became too conservative to suit the artists who in 1877 initiated the Society of American Artists so they could meet and exhibit their work as a collective. The Ten American Painters was born from this group in 1898, when Twachtman, Weir, and Hassam found the Society hostile to the Impressionist style they had adopted. Leaving the group was considered a bold move by the general public, but the Society of American Artists felt that it was easier to let the members that were leaving go than appease them.

Impressionism
Impressionism was a French art movement that emerged in the 1870s, and was picked up by American painters towards the end of the 19th century. Painters like Edgar Degas, Claude Monet and Auguste Renoir are generally considered the masters of the impressionist movement. An Impressionist painting will often use small dabs of color in order to make the painting distinguishable from afar, but indistinguishable from up close.

Members
The founding members of The Ten were Frank W. Benson, Joseph Rodefer DeCamp, Thomas Wilmer Dewing, Childe Hassam, Willard Leroy Metcalf, Robert Reid, Edward Simmons, Edmund C. Tarbell, John Henry Twachtman, and J. Alden Weir. All were former members of the Society of American Artists. Winslow Homer declined an invitation to join the group; Abbott Handerson Thayer accepted membership but withdrew before the group's first exhibition. After J. H. Twachtman died in 1902, William Merritt Chase joined in his place. Unanimous approval was required to admit a new member to the society. It was also decided that there would never be less than ten members active for the group to remain as one.

For twenty years The Ten exhibited in New York, Boston, Philadelphia, and other American cities. After this it dissolved due to death in its ranks and lack of public interest.

title: Ten American Painters


text:
Talk:2005 WTA Tour

Untitled
What are the legends for the chart? For example, what does the blue shade denote?

title: Talk:2005 WTA Tour


text:
User talk:Jag123/Archive1

Welcome
Don't forget to sign your VfD nominations with ~. JRM 13:28, 2004 Dec 12 (UTC)

Oh, I almost forgot.

Welcome!

Hello,, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place  on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! JRM 13:28, 2004 Dec 12 (UTC)
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Help pages
 * Tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Manual of Style

Thank you for helping clean up Wiki Syntax
Just a quick note to say thank you for all your help with fixing Wiki Syntax, such as the redirects you fixed. And also thank you for fixing the numbering of the links that I had stuffed up! :-) All the best, -- Nickj 23:40, 12 Dec 2004 (UTC)

WP:RfD
No, there's no need to delete entries - the admins will clear it away. In fact, of them, I (at least) prefer what you did - leave a note saying it's dealt with. That way I know what the resolution was without having to go look. Noel (talk) 14:16, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)

PS: You might want to look at Hawke to see a more preferred style/formatting for disambig pages. Noel (talk) 14:20, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * For the signatures, it's a Wikipedia feature that people have discovered how to be "creative" with. Click on the "Preferences" link, and then look under "Your nickname (for signatures):". You have to get a little creative to make all the extended ones (e.g. the direct links to talk pages work); AFAIK there's no page on how to do it, it's left as a sort of "graduate exam" in Wiki syntax... :-) Noel (talk) 12:10, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)

CSE
In fact, somebody had created Canadian security establishment consisting of - besides the comparison to the NSA - nothing but content about and a link to the *Communications* one. I tagged it for a speedy but User:fvw disagreed, and by gosh, it turned out he appears to be right. This PMO backgrounder is pretty unambiguous ("the bill would not apply to the Canadian Security Establishment, Canadian Security Intelligence Service, the Communications Security Establishment and uniformed members of the RCMP or the Armed Forces").

At the same time, many people using the Canadian SE wording seem to be referring to the Communications SE, and the Canadian SE makes no information about itself available on the web that can be found at all. I know secrecy is a reasonable quality in a spy, but come on!

I'm once again not entirely sure what to believe. Samaritan 10:18, 20 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * He didn't provide anything. And there's no Canadian Security Establishment in business section (no government section seems to exist) of the Canada411 online phone directory. Back to square one, I guess? (I've redirected Canadian Security Establishment and Canadian security establishment to Communications and removed the disambig.) Samaritan 10:47, 20 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Redirects
Hi Jag123, It's honestly not a big deal to have added the Hawke redirect. There were a very small percentage of things that got added (like I added 13th centuries → 13th century), which I thought later probably weren't so great (which I guess is pretty inevitable if we add enough redirects). Some of these can be left, but some should probably either be deleted or turned into disambiguations. I like the Hawke disambig page, by the way.

I'm not quite sure I understand the question about striking through; the reason for the strikethrough is that once all the pages are completed, I'll feed those completed pages into a bit software that makes a list of everything that has been struck through, so that it won't be suggested again in the future. Things that have already been added won't be suggested again, so what's left is stuff that's both not been added and not been struck through, or new suggestions (which can happen as the Wikipedia is constantly growing). So if we don't get something resolved one way or the other the first time round, then that's OK, as it can be sorted out in the next run.

All the best, -- Nickj (t) 22:26, 20 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Ah, OK, I think I understand. The next run will include anything that hasn't been added (so if it's not struck out, and not added, then it will be included in the next set of lists), even if nothing links there. Basically the suggestions are not being generated by looking at what links there currently - instead, it's looking at how links are used in all the articles in the Wikipedia, so it's a completely different approach to adding redirects. So taking "Geoffrey IV" as an example, there are 11 pages where "Geoffrey IV" is used as the label, but the target is "Geoffrey IV of Anjou", namely:

mysql> select dest, label, found_on_page from redirect_candidate where label = "Geoffrey IV"; +--+-+---+ +--+-+---+ +--+-+---+ 11 rows in set (0.00 sec)
 * dest                | label       | found_on_page                     |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of Counts and Dukes of Anjou |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | Fulk IV of Anjou                 |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1101    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1102    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1103    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1106    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1105    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1104    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1100    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1098    |
 * Geoffrey IV of Anjou | Geoffrey IV | List of state leaders in 1099    |

So because it's used more than a certain number of times, and because it seems to be unambiguous, the software suggests that maybe "Geoffrey IV" should be a redirect to "Geoffrey IV of Anjou".

Note that at the moment nothing may link to "Geoffrey IV" - but making it a redirect will make it easier for people to find the correct article, and in a fair number of cases there will be something that linked to the redirect, which now goes to the right place.

The other benefit is that the LinkBot software will use these redirects to suggest links. So for example, a few lines down from Geoffrey IV is the suggestion for "Giant Sequoias → Giant Sequoia". If this redirect gets made, then the LinkBot will suggest that any occurrence of "Giant Sequoias" be linked to "Giant Sequoia" (unless that article already links to the "Giant Sequoia" article). So using this example, the Yosemite Valley article includes a line that mentions "Giant Sequoias", but doesn't link to "Giant Sequoia". When the redirect is made, and then the LinkBot runs on this article, then it will automatically suggest that link. So even if a redirect isn't linked to, it still provides very useful information about which concepts are related.

So, that's the background. I don't feel it's neccessary for you cross everything off, but what you either don't cross off or add will come up again in the next run (even if nothing links there). Personally, if there's only a couple of things left over that were neither good enough to add, nor bad enough to strikeout, then I don't mind at all if it's marked as complete.

I know what you mean about slowness crossing stuff out. If the pages are too slow to edit and save in sections, then what I sometimes do is to do a whole page (adding the redirects I think are good), and then after that edit the whole page, and strikeout that ones I thought were bad in one big go. All the best, -- Nickj (t) 00:18, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I'm not sure about striking out a whole section with a multi-line <s> (I haven't written the code for reading the processed redirect files yet, but I will when it's needed). If it's not too painful, then please use a different <s> on each line, but if is too painful then I guess use a multi-line strikeout, and I'll just have to find a way to make it work! :-)

I don't know of a way to strikeout using an easy-preview type thing, but that doesn't mean it's impossible. I'm open to suggestions if anyone knows how to do it or something similar.

With the numbers next to each redirect, their meaning is sort of half way between those two meanings you mentioned. So "germ cells → gamete 11" means that on eleven different pages that "germ cells" points to gamete. However, if there were 12 or 13 suggestions, and 11 of them were to gamete, and the others to something else, then it would still be listed a redirect with the number 11 next to it; But if there were 14 suggestions, with 11 saying gamete, and the other 3 all pointing to bacteria, then it would be listed as a disambig to both gamete and bacteria. So if it's a redirect suggestion, then either everything agreed on that suggestion, or most things agreed on that suggestion. Disambigs on the other hand are suggested where there is definite disagreement.

All the best, -- Nickj (t) 03:28, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * Hey, just had a thought... Maybe we could change it so that it's not necessary to strikeout the bad ones... maybe people could just move the list down to the "completed pages" section, strikeout the name of that list, and then anything that they haven't added should be taken to mean the same thing as striking it out. It'd mean a bit more work for me, but it's probably worth it because it'd let people get through a lot more suggestions in the same amount of time ... What do you think? All the best, -- Nickj (t) 03:43, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Abortion in Canada Talk Page
thanks for leaving the note on my page. I do appreciate it. I'm not all that good at PHP yet...i started learning when i joined Wikipedia. So some of the ideas like how to hive off information on a certain topic...I'm actually on dialup but i wasn't sure how else to get a common background since i thought at the time that was the problem.

As for the page being a pet project...well yes to some extent. I wanted a page that was good and written properly. Part of my interest stems from wanting to see if there is some way to have a page that is NPOV on genetic testing during pregnancy---but it seemed the page on abortion should be complete first. Also once i get involved with a project i tend to stay. If you go back you will see for a while i just put info in the talk page--my writing wasn't good enough yet to put on the page.

As to you offer...i'll take you up on it. I have done the best i can to try and NPOV it. And the POV mark came from an American at a time when the page was considered more or less finished i think. Some of the areas that hit me as more POV (such as counseling centres) weren't written by me. But its always easier to see POV in what others are writing than what you are. On a couple of pages i've written only or mostly on the talk pages to try and get the info correctly on the page. I see you point as to what to include as well being an issue.

I do wish it was more than two people mostly. But that being the case i think its a good way to proceed. The main problem with it is that it will likely be slow. I have a very hard time summarizing and couldn't really do it until mid university. So it won't be that i care less its just that it is a lot slower for me to provide the info in summary so that then you could write it in in a NPOV manner. But there isn't any real rush either as far as i'm concerned...i've been working on it on and off for quite a while. The only caveat i would want to add is if there was just some little section we disagreed about it might be better to try and continue working on it than give up. I don't know how often that would come up---hopefully not at all or infrequently. I guess at that point we could discuss why back and forth perhaps

I'll look into a way to try and hive off the information as you suggested. Give me a few days and the page should be shorter.

One idea that did occur to me is that there might be some validity in having a history of abortion in Canada and a abortion in Canada page. We could still work on it together but it might tighten the writing up in a way that works better. Or a section on precedent setting cases with more explanation? Just a thought.

I'm aware i do tend to look at the world in a political manner. I appreciate the fact that you don't think i intended to write it politically (and a fair bit was written by other folk too). I think i took a comment that was vaguely show it happened" maybe a bit too literally. Could have been meant very differently. Certainly the entry on my talk page shows a lot of respect and i think it is a good beginning. I wasn't quite sure where to go from where we were.

Look forward to hearing back from you. I'll try and make future entries here smaller but i wanted to respond to your suggestions in depth.--Marcie 21:45, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the reply. Enjoy your holiday...everyone deserves it..."I see what you mean about including being an issue" what i meant was i could see why you might feel that say putting in political parties positions might be an issue and so on.

 * Thanks for the help Tony...hopefully we'll be able to get the page together...enjoy your holidays too!

--Marcie 05:06, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Hi Jag got your message. I figurecd folks were on holiday and i'd take a break from the Wiki. It was nice but i figured i'd get back to it now...although perhaps slower than before...I'm going to work first on trying to clean up the talk page as we discussed. If i run into problems with the PHP i'll let you know...maybe check in once and a while to let me know what you think.--Marcie 18:33, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)

 * Jag---i summarized two sections and moved them onto another page (the first entry has the name of it). I'm really not sure this is the right way of doing it though...and this goes beyond my PHP really (i don't know how to create a talk page without a page---or maybe the page should be labelled differntly?). I was also thinking that if people could link up more directly with the actual part that is summarized (ie not have to find it on a page that is chock full of the full versions) that this could be helpful...is there any way of putting something like a link to the middle of a page?--Marcie 19:45, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)

VfD proc: Who makes changes?
Hey Tony, I know you didn't participate in this particular vfd but you're the only admin I'm familiar with and you seem pretty newbie friendly. If you look at Votes for deletion/Messner's corpuscle, you'll see that I nominated this for deletion. I wasn't aware of the mispelling policy (prior to nominating) and the majority seems to agree on the redirect. So I went ahead and created the redirect. This page seems to have disappeared from the main VFD page (I guess that happens after the tag is removed?), so I'm not sure if anyone else will see it and address my question. I'm wondering who usually does the changes (if it's agreed to redirect, as in this case, for instance) and how long one needs to wait? Thanks in advance! --jag123 19:34, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Thanks for the promotion! I'm not really an admin (at least, not yet). When the change gets done depends on what decision is made. It's all outlined in Deletion policy, in particular the sections "1.5 Decision Policy" and "1.6 Unlisting a page from VfD". Jerzy cleared all the December 22 entries from Votes for deletion this morning. He or another admin will take care of any decisions, deletions and whatnot, according to policy. Your placement of the redirect was quite in order and it would have been quite in order for you to unlist the discussion at that point if someone else hadn't already done so, provided your actions were backed by a clear working consensus (section 1.6).

Section 1.6 says:

Unlisting a page from VfD
If another solution has been found for some of these pages than deletion, leave them listed on Votes for deletion for a short while, so the original poster can see why it wasn't deleted, and what did happen to it. This will prevent reposting of the same item. After the original poster has seen the explanation, or in any case after about a day, the page can be delisted from VfD.

(Proposed) Any page that has been listed on VfD for 24 hours that has not received a single delete vote beyond that of the original lister can be removed from VfD after twenty-four hours. The discussion for these debates should be kept, but it does not need to be archived.

Hope this helps. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 20:07, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Just to confirm (and contrary to that quoted part), it is okay for me to fix a page in accordance with the consensus? I don't want to step on any toes or pass off as presumptuous. Also, if you could peek at Votes for deletion/Human cells, what would usually happen here? Will it just get overlooked? Thanks again! --jag123 20:33, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Yes, as long as the original list is made aware (or after 24 hours in any case). So you'd say "consensus seems to be X" and wait for a bit (or go to lister's talk page and get confirmation). Then you'd do the change. This applies where the decision is against deletion. For deletion, the decision should be made by an admin (I don't know how they arrange which admin does it, I suspect it's just a task that people take upon themselves).

In the case of the human cells article, there seems to be no consensus for deletion, but there's no reason why you shouldn't edit it to redirect--you don't need consensus for this, anybody can do it and if someone disagrees they'll just revert. As I've suggested elsewhere, it's a good idea to announce what you intend to do on the talk page for the article and then wait for a day or two before redirecting, then people will understand that you're not just doing this on the spur of the moment. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 20:49, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I guess I placed some kind of special status on pages with a vfd tag. --jag123 22:11, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Well, don't do this with just any ongoing VfD discussion, only one in which there has been time for discussion and the consensus is clearly not for deletion but redirection has been discussed and found favor. If you plan to do this, it doesn't do any harm to say so on the VfD page first. It's all about not getting people pissed off at you. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 22:34, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)

BioChem Stub
Hi check out this as per our discussion on IRC Onco p53 07:09, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Can you put together all the possibilities on to one page? Onco p53 08:01, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)

nice cyt p450 pic
Good to have another biochemist here. Is your pic really legal for us to use (i.e., pub domain)? And can you find a legal pic for glucokinase, which I have been working hard at? thanks alteripse 00:37, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Left-handed DNA
I was looking for a good public domain DNA graphic when I found this page that I thought you might find interesting:

The Left Handed DNA Hall of Fame http://www.lecb.ncifcrf.gov/~toms/LeftHanded.DNA.html

From the same website, the DNA at the top right of the page look like it might work nicely if turned into a negative image and then cleaned up a bit. It's a corrected version of an Israeli stamp. Another possibility, the ASCII representation at the bottom of the following page is not bad when you do a screen capture and then shrink. Microsoft also has some clipart, that if I read their User Agreement correctly, it is okay to use on the Wikipedia (two are left-handed versions, but they can be fixed by "mirroring" them. ;-). Here I found a nice public domain image of DNA, but unfortunately it doesn't shrink well. Although this page says nothing about copyright, the DNA image looks like it might be the best looking one at small sizes gK ¿? 05:35, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * from User:Jag123/Sandbox I got the idea that you were trying to decide on what would be a good graphic for the biochem-stub. The single spiral that you have now is not bad, but I thought that it might be better to have a "real" DNA double-helix. The one page on left-handed DNA was an interesting bit of trivia that I found when Googling on "public domain DNA". In all, it was not much more than a half hour a searching while I was finishing my dinner. gK ¿? 09:30, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * Will there be enough stubs for a genetics stub? For the biochem-stub, what about using some simple organic compound that is based upon a benzene ring (although the benzene ring itself is already used for chemistry stubs)? gK ¿? 22:09, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

 * The current pic is not DNA it is a alpha helix in a protein represented in the ribbon form. Onco p53 23:20, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Still just trying to clean up the talk page
Jag, i'm still just trying to clean up the talk page...although it sounds like i took a little bit too much out of that one...as for where the reaserch came from i did both the statistical and the historical at the same time...if you look through the historical you'll see a lot of it is from pro life groups. I didn't look to see where my stats stood in balance...as for the numbers you asked about specifically they are supposed to be pro life activists...although i thought i moved enough of that too the sumary page for that too make sense.

I can edit and summarize...or i can try and improve immediately what is on the talk page---personally i'd prefer to edit and then discuss it (and get stats from other sources if you'd prefer and go to the hansard to see if i can find Svends statement directly)...without a date i'm not sure...likely can be found there. To me it makes better sense to get rid of what we (or i) have been asked to make a lot smaller and then go over the problems (i'm sure there will be many).

OTOH it makes me aware of ideas...how about i'll read them but no big action until its summed up (which should i hope reduce the problems especially if you are pointing them out).

As for the PHP i do have a favour to ask for you. (i believe i mentioned earlier i'm not all that good at PHP? i see you've gotten a little award at cleaning up a page (congradulations). If you go to the top of the talk page there was a page that i opened which was then altered by Tony (correctly). I still don't understand much about opening new pages (only done it a few times) and not just one's to collect talk in a consistent way). Is there a way of renaming it so its clear it a summary of the talk generally of what is on the talk page at the moment? For now i'll continue to move the summarizing there. Also the first section is a good example of how i'm going to try and summarize it down to as little as possible (take a look at it now and before).

Good to see you are back keeping me on my toes Marcie PS You might want to leave some of the old PHP options when folks are writing from here..it took me a while to figure out how to sign my name and its still missing the time and date which are about 9:30AM on the 3rd.

Problem with Java Tag
Turned out it was because i was using a different browser...--Marcie 14:38, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Summary is about half done
Hi Jag...thanks for the info on naming pages...i decided not to mess with it today (i was more in a summarizing type of mood). I've got about half the talk abortion in Canada page summarized at the moment...up to the section of Non Statistical Historical/Present Position Articles/Timelines. I was wondering if you could take a look in and let me know what you think as we are going to be working with the summarized data afterwards from what i can tell (and i left a link on where we could get other stats from Stats Can although i'm not sure what would be considered relevant...you could take a stab at that one maybe...). I can see why you were concerned if you thought i'd finished summarizing the page when you looked at it...nope i'm slow at summarizing (heck i'll likely have it done by the end of the month maybe before!)--Marcie 15:04, 6 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Exceptional Newcomer Award
Jag123, I award you this Exceptional Newcomer Award for your service to Wikipedia! In a very short time, you have shown yourself to be a prolific and valuable contributor. May you have many happy days on Wikipedia! Johntex 00:39, 13 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Calcium oxide
Hi. Thanks. I've removed this article from the list of pages needing attention. Please note, however, that your link to Calcium Oxide from my talk page did not work because you incorrectly capitalized the "O"; these conventions are useful. (I've now created a redirect page so that if anyone links to that it will work.) Michael Hardy 19:15, 20 Jan 2005 (UTC)

glucokinase and meissner corpuscles

 * 1) Thanks for the glucokinase pic, but tell me why the pic appears to be of two different molecules side by side. Are they back and front of the same?
 * 2) Thanks for the minor copyediting. However, you removed a couple of subject headings that I had not filled in yet. As you probably noticed, I've been working on this slowly by myself for awhile and I haven't finished. Replacing the headings is not a big deal, but you accidentally corrupted and duplicated a couple of whole sections. I fixed.
 * 3) I am not certain your change of the PO4- to PO4+ is accurate. I took the equation directly from the book referenced at the bottom, and I don't think PO4 ever has a net + ionization. Convince me or I'll switch back.

PS: I see you discovered our problem children engaged in their usual antics at Meissner's corpuscles. As you will notice, RB inspires a new version of the old joke, "Q: What's the difference between a terrorist and an "anti-anti-circumcision zealot"? A: You can negotiate with the terrorist." alteripse 03:16, 21 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Osteon pic
moved from user page, signed by me from edit history (I hope this is the right place to address you, Jag123; I find Wik very confusing.) Do you have a picture of osteons that you could post? I have a number of them, but I don't have copyright freedom to post them. (I don't know my Wik name, but I'm the person who made the tiny changes on the Osteon page.) 134.76.162.9 (talk) 11:35, 26 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Free nerve ending
Hello - I saw your rewrite on Meissner's corpuscle. Looks like you're a wealth of knowledge. I've just written a (very short) article on free nerve endings - can you help to expand it? Cheers. - Jakew 03:24, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Meissner's corpuscle
I keep googling and hitting biology sites saying stuff like "Meissner's corpuscles respond to stroking and fluttering types of tactile stimuli." As far as I can tell this is what pretty much all the sources say. I'm still uncomfortable about your removing this. Do you think you could have a word with someone at your school or look in some primary literature where the modality is discussed in depth? I don't think it's fair to attack Ashley Y's good faith in the way that you have done recently because he is probably looking at the same clinical sources I am, not some propaganda site, and if so he's only reporting what he has good reason to be the case. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 15:08, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC)

 * I'm not sure what you would expect Ashley to say. To me I'm fine if an editor doesn't want to discuss, particularly if the reason for his edit is plain.  the reference to stroking and fluttering sensations is apparently the standard description of the modality of Meissner's corpuscle.  That fact trumps any beliefs I may have about his motive for putting the information there, and any aspersions others might want to cast on him for putting it there.  It's a fact and it doesn't unbalance the article (if it did I'd probably add other facts).

 * All of Jake's and Robert's arguments seemed to boil down to the fear that this fact may aid the case of those they disagree with, apparently because anti-circumcision activists have some semi-established theory about a ridged band that is supposed to be rich in these mechanoreceptors. Well sure, let them pour legitimate doubt on this theory, I may even aid them.  But the expressed fears of Robert and Jake, for me, are a signpost to a path that would lead to the death of NPOV, where they are used as justifications for suppressing facts that may aid their self-designated opposition and they enlist others to aid in that suppression.

 * Ashley Y doesn't owe us a thing. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 18:50, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Evidence presented by Jag123
Hi Jag. I'm a bit confused by your note on my talk page. Since you've now removed the sections, do you still want me to change anything? - Jakew 04:40, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Template:Fungi-stub
Thank you for creating this template. I was just looking for one like it yesterday!

(Just a note: In general, when you create new stub templates, it helps if you list them at Stub categories so that other people can find and use them.) -Aranel (" Sarah ") 20:18, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)

About stub sorting (response ... original included)
You wrote: I appreciate your help with recategorisation and re-stubbing of articles. However, adding two stubs to articles, especially with the recent concerns regarding the use of templates, is not necessary. I believe the animal stub is for actual animals; otherwise, a good chunk of what's in biology could end up there. In addition, nerve endings (Meissner's corpuscle, Pacinian corpuscle) and osteon are not related to cell biology. It is debatable whether or not virii/viruses are living organisms, so a med stub should be sufficient. --jag123 03:09, 7 Feb 2005 (UTC)

 * I'll explain myself a bit and make a couple of comments ...
 * two stubs - in some cases the article could go into either of two categories ultimately; as there are folks who concentrate on one category for their efforts, the addition of a second stub is helpful in 'advertising' the stub's existence. However, I'll refrain from adding two stubs to any future stub-worthy article.
 * ?? what concern over using templates ??
 * animal stub - I took a look at the contents of the animal stub category and determined that it included both specific animals and named groups of animals. If one would like it to be restricted to specific animals, then a change of name might be in order to 'Specific Animals' and keep the stub template name the same.
 * plant stub - should the same 'specific plants only' be the rule of thumb for this stub as well?
 * nerve endings are related to cell biology in being subjects of research into specific cell types. There is a general misconception about 'cell types' in general, that there are X cell types and that's it; in reality, it is quite difficult to enumerate the total cell type complement in an organism due to regional specification that occurs due to juxtacrine and paracrine influences and extracellular matrix cues.  I put osteon into cell biology because of the impact on osteocyte function and cellular anatomy the structure has.
 * viruses - you'd be hard pressed to find a virologist who did not think that virology is a subdiscipline of microbiology.
 * last question - should I go back and fix all of the stubs I've touched according to your suggestions here, or simply apply them going forward?
 * Thanks for the thanks and the advice. Courtland 03:24, 2005 Feb 7 (UTC)

 * about that last question ... I see that you had reverted some of my changes; I've gone through and reverted or restricted most of the questionable changes based on your input ... I don't think there are any remaining with two stub tags, but I might have missed one or two. Regards Courtland 03:55, 2005 Feb 7 (UTC)

re: orphaned cats
Hi - You asked about how Orphaned categories is set up. There's a description at the "semi-automated suggestions" header (immediately before the listing of categories), but, yes, if you categorize (or otherwise fix) one you should delete the bullet listing the category itself up to the next (major) bullet. The sub-bullets are "suggestions" for categories that might be relevant (based on word matching, and often not at all useful). When I work on these I first try to decide whether the category is remotely rational and, if not, edit the referring articles and/or list the category for renaming/deletion on WP:CFD. -- Rick Block 19:08, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)

 * User:Beland runs the program that creates the list. He generally dumps a given run under one header (I've taken to splitting the massive chunk into at least a few subheaders).  I think most people who work on these do them in batches, so one header per category might be overkill.  Feel free to make suggestions about the formatting of the list.  I think Beland watches the orphaned categories page, so you could post suggestions either on Category talk:Orphaned categories or on User talk:Beland.  I see user:ssd suggested including sub-headers some time ago on the category talk page. -- Rick Block 20:52, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)

title: User talk:Jag123/Archive1


text:
Talk:Hater

Untitled
whoever created this is living in michael jacksons neverland ranch

raver has absolutely nothing to do with hater

 * Comment re copyvio notice. I have no problem deleting this but you may be wrong on the copyvio.  The first half of the "hater" definition was created over two years ago and the second paragraph was added by another user (or user name at least) over a year later, and still more than a year ago.  The web site you cited in your copyvio notice, on the other hand, has no entries in the Internet Archive, while the Wikepedia page appears twice.  Though not dispositive, it strikes me that it is more than likely that the other site lifted the definition from Wikipedia, not vice versa.  Why should we have to start rewriting articles just because other sites take Wikipedia works without attribution? DS1953 23:15, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

"party of individual" what does that mean? more slang?

Or is it that people skilled at slang are unskilled in general "schoolbook" english?

Do they mean "party or individual'?

Does this page really warrant existence? Not only is it shockingly written, I think everybody knows what hate is, and I highly doubt that we need another page on those who hate that doesn't just redirect to hate. --^pirate 20:40, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Redirected to hate. --Dangherous 15:08, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Hater (band) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 15:44, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Hater


text:
Meridian (comics)

Meridian is a comic book series published by CrossGen Comics. It was written by Barbara Kesel, and penciled by a number of artists including Joshua Middleton and Steve McNiven. Meridian ran for 44 issues, from July of 2000 to April of 2004.

Storyline details
Meridian, the series' namesake, is one of many island city-states upon the world of Demetria. At some point in the world's history, a great natural cataclysm threw massive chunks of earth into the sky, creating the current system of floating islands. The islands, as well as the airships crucial to trade and transport, defy gravity due to the mysterious properties of a certain 'ore' which is not named. Each island is headed by a Minister, who has more or less monarchic power over their respective island, and while many communities still survive on the surface, contact and trade between the surface and the islands is rare.

The main character of the series is Sephie, the daughter of Turos, the Minister of Meridian. Her childhood friend Jad Takarty is in love with her. Her father dies at the beginning of the series, and Sephie becomes Minister of Meridian, acquiring at the same time a mysterious Sigil, a mark upon her forehead, which grants her an array of powers. Gradually, she learns to use it to allow her to fly, to heal others, to repair things, and in a handful of other ways. However, her Uncle Ilahn, Minister of Cadador, another of the floating island city-states, has a Sigil as well, which allows him to destroy things and teleport. He attempts to use his powers, and his significant political influence, to seize Meridian from Sephie's control, and to create an economic and industrial empire, demanding tribute from other islands, if not conquering them outright.

Sephie sets out to stop him. After learning more about her powers and her family's past, acquiring equipment and support, and meeting new friends and allies, she sets about perpetrating piracy upon her uncle's trade routes and fights him directly on a number of occasions.

As with most of the core CrossGen titles, Meridian crosses over into the other titles to some extent, and into the underlying 'uberplot' that connects all the core titles together. While not fully central to the conflict between Sephie and her uncle Ilahn, there are appearances by members of The First who are the Gods of the CrossGen universe, as well as by Samandahl Rey, the main hero of the title Sigil, and others. In the end, Sephie and Ilahn join the heroes (and villains) of the other core titles to fight an enemy called "the Negation" in a limited series called Negation War. Negation War was left unfinished when CrossGen filed for bankruptcy in the middle of 2004.

The background of the series is expanded upon in CrossGen Chronicles #3, which concerns the early life of Turos and Ilahn.

Collections
Four trade paperbacks compiling the story arcs of Meridian were released before the bankruptcy of Crossgen:
 * Meridian Volume 1: Flying Solo - issues #1-7
 * Meridian Volume 2: Going to Ground - issues #8-14
 * Meridian Volume 3: Taking the Skies - issues #15-20
 * Meridian Volume 4: Coming Home - issues #21-26

The next three collections were solicited, but never published:
 * Meridian Volume 5: Minister of Cadador - issues #27-32
 * Meridian Volume 6: Changing Course - issues #33-38
 * Meridian Volume 7: The Mystery of Sheristan

There was also a small 5.5in x 8in "Traveller" edition of Volume 1 released.

title: Meridian (comics)


text:
Luis Ángel Arango Library

Luis Ángel Arango Library (Biblioteca Luis Ángel Arango or BLAA) is a public library located in Bogotá, Colombia. It is one of the largest and most important libraries in the world. It was founded in 1958 as a small library with a few books on economics, currently its collection has about 2'000.000 works. Today the library has been expanded and occupies two entire city blocks spanning about 45,000 m2 (nearly 54,000 sq. yards). Its collection has grown to become the country's premier library and has come to be considered the most important public library in Latin America, and one of the most visited in the world. It has over 1.1 million books and seating for 1900 readers; it received 6.7 million visitors in 2008. The library is named after the lawyer and businessman Luis Angel Arango, the general director (Governor) of the "Banco de la Republica" in Colombia from 1947 to 1957, and a champion of culture and literature for all. The library is part of the cultural affairs wing of Colombian Central Bank (Banco de la República), Banrepcultural network, which today runs 23 additional libraries, cultural centers and museums across Colombia.

Notable Books and documents of its collection include, multimedia documentary materials of the Colombian Constitution, rare books and manuscripts purchased from private collections from around the world, as well as the Luis López de Mesa periodicals archive (Hemeroteca) which is an extensive newspaper archive collection. The Library also offers a collection of audio-visual materials. Additionally, there is a Concert Hall, art exhibits, reprography service, a cafeteria and parking facilities. It centralizes the "digital collection" and the "Virtual Library" (Biblioteca Virtual del Banco de la República) a growing repository of digitized content from the network of libraries of the Banco de la República. The Botero Museum is housed in one of the contiguous buildings purchased for the expansion of the library. The main entrance features a bronze statue of Athena or Minerva, Greek goddess of wisdom, the arts, trade and defense.

There is also a bookstore in the first floor of the library. The bookstore specializes in books about Colombia, scientific magazines, and literature related to Colombia and its values.

History
The first library of the bank, was established in 1932. It was located on the second floor of the Pedro A. López building in the bank headquarters in the Avenida Jiménez. Its collection comprised documents on economic, legal and fiscal issues and issues pertaining the activity of the central bank, with the archives from the currency council of the Banco de la República.

The bank acquired several private libraries, objects and documents of historic and patrimonial value to the Colombian nation as well as receiving donated private collections. Consequently, the bank conditioned a room then with only 25 people seating capacity and limited viewing time (open then from 2:00pm to 4:30pm Monday through Friday) to the general public. In 1945 the bank purchases the largest collection to date the Laureano García Otiz personal library. After the bank moved its headquarters to a new building, General Director, Luis Ángel Arango, sought to relocate the library. The Old Mint House (Casa de la Moneda) was nearly destroyed in the Bogotazo riots and it was decided that the new expanded location of the library would be the remodeled and reconditioned building. The bank purchased the adjacent buildings to the Old Mint House and the block north from it. In all two entire city blocks (Manzana Sur y Manzana Norte), each were unified and communicated internally. For the new expanded building of the library the architect firm was Esguerra Saenz Urdaneta Samper in three separate expansions. Some of the buildings that make up the library are, The Vengoechea building, an art deco building (also described as "Arquitectura Racionalista") where administrative offices are located, the Republican House (Casa Republicana) which houses the Museum of Religious Art, the Colonial House (Old Mint House, Casa de la Moneda), the Old Bishop Palace (Palacio Arzobispal) now the Botero Museum of Pastiche architecture and the two modern sections. The first opened in 1958 when the new location opened, currently the main entrance and the Periodicals Archive (Hemeroteca) of "Modern Architecture" and the second of International architecture opening on May 5, 1990, in which the chamber music concert hall, the art gallery and the Musical Instruments Collection are located. Across the street, the Miguel Urrutia Museum of Art (MAMU).

Computerization
In 1983 Cultural Vice-director Jaime Duarte French, promoter of many of the cultural enterprises of the Bank retired while a major overhaul of the library was under study. He was succeeded by Lina Espitaleta de Villegas. After approval of the project and years of construction the new sections of the library opened on May 5, 1990. Part of the overhaul included the systematization of requests and circulation. For that purpose, the then state-of-the-art system, NOTIS was purchased in 1986. In 1990 the NOTIS database handled 200,000 entries and by its retirement in 1998 had about 780,000 and included bibliographical inventory of several databases of other local and national institutions.

By the mid 90s, the library begun to offer access to remote databases like Juriscol (about Colombian jurisprudence) and other specialized databases, CD-ROM, and Internet. Since 1995 under the direction of Jorge Orlando Melo, there was an increased interest in the acquisition of new collections, the use of Internet for academic research and the creation of the Virtual Library with special interest in compiling and digitizing entire entries of the Colombian cultural heritage. By 2007 the system migrated to the system AbsysNet for easier and more effective national coverage of other nodes of the Banrepcultural network of libraries. Currently the Virtual Library has 80,000 texts, audio and video with 860 books, 4,700 magazine articles, 815 biographies and a considerable number of interactive pages for children and of art related topics.

title: Luis Ángel Arango Library


text:
Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Woodrow Wilson/archive1

Woodrow Wilson
Very detailed and well written. --Flockofpidgeons
 * Object. 1) Lead section gives no summary. 2) References should be sorted out. Currently only two "what happened on this day" articles and one 1992 newspaper article. More references are mentioned in the article, list them here as well. 3) "Political career" is ridiculously short. 4) The "misc facts" section should be removed. Already most facts are incorporated in the article, so should the rest. Jeronimo 08:34, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Object. What Jeronimo wrote, plus consider moving the quotes to Wikiquote and bottom pic needs a caption. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 19:16, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Object - Follow the suggested procedure: get it first in Peer Review. You'll get good pointers how to improve the article before submitting to FA.--Zappaz 03:59, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)


text:
Gillian Lynne Theatre

The Gillian Lynne Theatre (formerly New London Theatre) is a West End theatre located on the corner of Drury Lane and Parker Street in Covent Garden in the London Borough of Camden. The Winter Garden Theatre formerly occupied the site until 1965. On 1 May 2018, the theatre was officially renamed the Gillian Lynne Theatre in honour of choreographer Gillian Lynne. It is the first theatre in the West End of London to be named after a non-royal woman.

Previous buildings
The modern theatre is built on the site of previous taverns and music hall theatres, where a place of entertainment has been located since Elizabethan times. Nell Gwynn was associated with the tavern, which became known as the Great Mogul by the end of the 17th century, and presented entertainments in an adjoining hall, including "glee clubs" and "sing-songs". The Mogul Saloon was built on the site in 1847, which was sometimes known as the "Turkish Saloon" or the "Mogul Music Hall." In 1851, it became the Middlesex Music Hall, known as The Old Mo. This in turn was rebuilt as the New Middlesex Theatre of Varieties, in 1911 by Frank Matcham for Oswald Stoll.

In 1919, the theatre was sold to George Grossmith Jr. and Edward Laurillard, refurbished and reopened as the Winter Garden Theatre. They produced Kissing Time (1919, with a book by P. G. Wodehouse and Guy Bolton and music by Ivan Caryll), followed by A Night Out (1920), both starring Stanley Holloway. Grossmith and Laurillard also became managers of the Apollo Theatre in 1920. But expanding their operation caused Grossmith and Laurillard to end their partnership, with Grossmith retaining control of the Winter Garden.

Grossmith then partnered with George Edwardes's former associate, Pat Malone, to produce a series of mostly adaptations of imported shows at the Winter Garden between 1920 and 1926: Sally (1921), The Cabaret Girl (1922, with book by Wodehouse and music by Jerome Kern), The Beauty Prize (1923, with Wodehouse and Kern), a revival of Tonight's the Night (1923), Primrose (1924, with music by George Gershwin), Tell Me More (1925, with words by Thompson and music by George Gershwin) and Kid Boots (1926 with music by Harry Tierney), many of them featuring Leslie Henson. Grossmith co-wrote some of the Winter Garden pieces, directed many of his own productions and starred in several, notably as Otis in Sally. Several of the later productions lost money, and Grossmith and Malone ended the partnership.

The Vagabond King was produced here in 1927, and in 1929, Fred and Adele Astaire starred in Funny Face. In 1930, Sophie Tucker played in the Vivian Ellis musical Follow a Star, and in 1931, Gracie Fields appeared here in Walk This Way. In 1933, the theatre hosted Lewis Casson in George Bernard Shaw's On the Rocks, followed in 1935 by Love on the Dole, starring Wendy Hiller. The theatre has been temporarily closed in the late 1930s, reopening in 1942. In 1945, it hosted a Donald Wolfit season, and in 1953, Agatha Christie's Witness for the Prosecution played. 1956 saw The Water Gypsies by Vivian Ellis and A P Herbert; Hotel Paradiso starring Alec Guinness, Douglas Byng, Irene Worth and Billie Whitelaw; and Tyrone Power starred in Shaw's The Devil Disciple. 1958 included The Iceman Cometh.

The theatre closed permanently in 1959 when it was sold by the Rank Organisation to a developer. It was then gutted and remained vacant until 1965 to be replaced in 1973 by the current building.

New London and Gillian Lynne
Designed by architect Paul Tvrtkovic and scenic designer Sean Kenny (Blitz!, Oliver!, Pickwick (musical)), modelled after the Walter Gropius Total-Theater, and seating 960 on 2 levels, the theatre's auditorium first opened with a television recording of Marlene Dietrich's one-woman show. The theatre officially opened on 2 January 1973 with a production of The Unknown Soldier and His Wife starring Peter Ustinov. It then hosted Grease, starring Richard Gere as Danny and Elaine Paige as Sandy. Beginning in 1977, the theatre was used as a television studio for several years and then returned to use as a theatre. The theatre's biggest hit was the Andrew Lloyd Webber and Trevor Nunn musical Cats, choreographed by Gillian Lynne which premièred in the theatre on 11 May 1981. Closing in 2002, this production became the then longest running musical in West End history, although it has since been overtaken by Phantom Of The Opera and Les Misérables.

The theatre also hosted the 1977 BBC Sports Personality of the Year and the Masters snooker between 1976 and 1978. Also in 1977, the theatre hosted the BBC's A Song For Europe contest, the preliminary heat to choose the UK entry for the Eurovision Song Contest. However, the show was blacked out on TV due to a last minute strike by technicians. The music video for the song "We Are the Champions" by Queen was shot there in October 1977, following a 70-min. concert.

Between 2003 and September 2005 the theatre hosted Bill Kenwright's revival of Andrew Lloyd Webber's musical, Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat. The venue played host to the London transfer of the off-Broadway production, Blue Man Group, which closed in June 2007, to make way for the Royal Shakespeare Company's repertory productions of The Seagull and King Lear, starring Ian McKellen. In spring 2008, a new musical adaptation of Gone with the Wind ran for only two months. New musical Imagine This closed after only being open for one month.

The National Theatre production of War Horse transferred into the theatre from 28 March 2009 where it stayed until 12 March 2016 after over 3,000 performances.

The theatre was home to the Sheffield Crucible's production of the musical Show Boat which opened on 9 April 2016. Despite positive reviews, the production closed early, on 27 August 2016. On 22 October 2016 the London production of Andrew Lloyd Webber's School of Rock the musical opened, direct from Broadway, and closed after a three-and-a-half-year run before undergoing a refurbishment.

Lloyd Webber's Cinderella had its world premiere on 14 July 2021 with previews starting 25 June. The opening, originally scheduled for August 2020, was delayed due to the COVID-19 pandemic. The production closed on 12 June 2022.

Following seasons at the Leeds Playhouse, the Bridge Theatre, and a UK and Ireland tour, the new adaptation of The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe by C. S. Lewis opened at the theatre from 18 July 2022 running until 9 January 2023. The 2022 Chichester Festival production of Crazy for You is scheduled to play at the theatre for a limited 30-week West End engagement beginning 24 June 2023, prior to an official opening July 3.

The theatre has been owned since 1991 by Lloyd Webber's Really Useful Group. The theatre building also contains an underground car park, a cabaret venue, a basement nightclub, shops and a residential tower. In 2014, Lloyd Webber reorganized the group; the entity that owns the theatre is Really Useful Theatres.

Recent and present productions

 * Cats (11 May 1981 – 11 May 2002) music by Andrew Lloyd Webber from T. S. Eliot's Old Possum's Book of Practical Cats, starring Elaine Paige
 * Umoja (6 September 2002 – 8 February 2003)
 * Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat (3 March 2003 – 3 September 2005) lyrics by Tim Rice, music by Andrew Lloyd Webber, starring Stephen Gately, Ian Watkins and Darren Day
 * Blue Man Group (10 November 2005 – 24 June 2007)
 * King Lear and The Seagull (14 November 2007 – 12 January 2008) by, respectively, William Shakespeare and Anton Chekhov, starring Ian McKellen, Frances Barber, Romola Garai and William Gaunt (transferred from the Royal Shakespeare Company).
 * Gone with the Wind – A New Musical (22 April – 14 June 2008) by Margaret Martin and Trevor Nunn, starring Darius Danesh, Jill Paice and Edward Baker-Duly
 * Imagine This (19 November – 20 December 2008) by Shuki Levy, David Goldsmith (lyricist) and Glenn Berenbeim
 * War Horse (28 March 2009 – 12 March 2016) by Nick Stafford, adapted from the novel by Michael Morpurgo (transferred from the National Theatre)
 * Show Boat (9 April – 27 August 2016) book by Oscar Hammerstein II, lyrics by Hammerstein and P. G. Wodehouse, music by Jerome Kern (transferred from Crucible Theatre Sheffield)
 * School of Rock (22 October 2016 – 1 March 2020) book by Julian Fellowes, lyrics by Glenn Slater, music by Andrew Lloyd Webber
 * Cinderella (18 August 2021 – 12 June 2022) book by Emerald Fennell, lyrics by David Zippel, music by Andrew Lloyd Webber
 * The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe (18 July 2022 – 8 January 2023) based on the book by C S Lewis
 * The Lehman Trilogy (14 January – 20 May 2023) by Stefano Massini, adapted by Ben Power, directed by Sam Mendes, starring Nigel Lindsay, Hadley Fraser, Michael Balogun (transferred from National Theatre)
 * Crazy for You (24 June – 31 December 2023), music and lyrics by George Gershwin and Ira Gershwin, book by Ken Ludwig, choreographed and directed by Susan Stroman, starring Charlie Stemp, Carly Anderson and Tom Edden (transferred from Chichester Festival Theatre)
 * Standing at the Sky's Edge (8 February 2024 - 3 August 2024), is an Olivier Award-winning musical with music and lyrics by Richard Hawley and a book by Chris Bush.
 * 2024: the Wizard of Oz

Nearby tube stations

 * Covent Garden (Piccadilly line)
 * Holborn (Central, Piccadilly lines)
 * Tottenham Court Road (Central, Northern, Elizabeth lines)

title: Gillian Lynne Theatre