text:
Talk:Anime Central

My removal
I've removed the entire "Experience" section, which seemed to be unfettered praise that didn't add any factual content to the article. This article, like all others, needs to follow the neutral point of view policy. Best, Meelar (talk) 05:55, Apr 18, 2005 (UTC)

Strongly Agree with removal. Thanks Ishmael Rufus 16:05, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

NPOV
The "Criticism" is clearly not a neutral point of view. ...especially when using phrases like "add insult to injury". While I am not disputing that some of this information may be worth mentioning, the way in which it is presented in this article was handled very poorly. I think that section should be eliminated completely and worked into a general History section instead. It's not fair to only have a "Criticism" section and not a "Praise" section...and to have both in the article would be rediculous.--PatrickD 14:49, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Re-Worked
I have reworked the criticism section and placed it into the history section, where I feel it is fairly out of place. I also disagree that a criticism section would be rediculous. If the complaints are substancial enough I do belive there should be a section devoted to them. As of late many of these criticisms have been discussed heavily in the ACen community. A former staff member has even gone on record saying these are serious problems, I personally feel they are in need of being addressed. While the neutrality of the section was indeed in need of some work I do not feel it should have been dismissed so quickly. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.57.102.211 (talk • contribs).

 * I wasn't dismissing the criticism...just saying that it should not have had such an overwhelming focus as its own section in the middle of the article. Where it is now looks a lot better.  When it comes to criticism, it tends to raise eyebrows when things like that are added anonymously. --PatrickD 18:57, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

 * The article says "In early 2007 Anime Central came under scrutiny from some fans" and cites a link on ACenGuys.com as a source. I don't see anything "under scrutiny" there.  Is that the correct link?  That source has nothing to do with what it is a reference for. --PatrickD 19:00, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

 * Oops. I left in the old source. The ACenguys link was a source for the longer artical siting where the information outside the official ACen site came from. Since I cut down the artical so drastically it no longer fits in or makes sense to be there. I have updated the source with a direct link to the criticism. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.57.102.211 (talk • contribs).

I'm going to invoke WP:BLP here and require that reliable sources be presented for such criticism in the article. Forum posts just don't cut it as reliable sources. --Farix (Talk) 21:34, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

 * Wait, why? The topic being discussed was about what people had been saying on the forums. So citing what people said doesn't count as an official source, even if thats where the information stems from? Why remove the fanbase entry as well? This is an atrical about an anime convention, something that the fans help build and have a very large hand in what happens. To ignore their contributions to the strengh of the Anime Central community is rediculous.

 * The "criticism" wasn't based on any reliable sources. Just to show you how unreliable forum posts can be, one of the references given has already been removed from the forum. All conventions receive complains on various forums, but that doesn't mean those complaints have any significants until a third-party reliable source picks up on them. As for the fanbase entry, as I said in the edit summary, it was entirely original research which is prohibited on Wikipedia. --Farix (Talk) 22:28, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

 * Alright. Theres no sense to argue it anymore with you, you know wikipedia better than me - I sort of pop in and out. I just wanted to expand the artical giving it a little more depth, but instead I ended up getting much of it removed. I try and take the information to a proper home.

Programming Rework
I am going to work on editing the programming section of the website, because that is what I have some memory of. I started by adding a section for events that were new last year, and recategorized some things. I also corrected a spelling error.

I think that perhaps the panels portion of the programming offered section should be spun off into its own section of the article if more information than is posted now is to be added. The listing elements don't convey as well the variety of events offered by the panels. For now, I recommend that we add panel names that we remember, so that they may be incorporated into the panels section later. However, failing that, specific references to panels should be removed, and replaced with categories instead.

Video Gaming, Tabletop Gaming, and CCG Gaming sections need to be added. Thanks, Thrawn1020 04:18, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Video Gaming?
Should we include something about how ACen has one of the larger video game selections, particularly arcade games, and as of the last couple years, the room has been open 24 hours a day? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by JanusZeal (talk • contribs) 17:50, 8 March 2007 (UTC).
 * Oops, forgot to sign it. -JanusZeal 17:56, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

 * "one of the larger"? As compared to who?  Saying they have video games is fine, but you should only cite them as having one of the largest video game selections if you are able to back that up with proper references.  (Some blog or forum post saying, "ACen has the biggest video game room I've ever seen!" wouldn't be a good reference.)  --PatrickD 18:03, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

 * Comparative is definitely not NPOV. Besides, I've been to both ACEN and AX. AX sports a bigger game room. Even so, the point of a bigger game room is not significant anyways. KyuuA4 04:53, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

 * It's just a personal observation of mine by visiting other conventions and from hearing from other people who've been to more conventions. Obviously, "largeness" is a general term, and can refer to room size, # of games, # of consoles, who's sponsoring the arcade machines, etc.  I'm suggesting that we should get this information into the article, both for past years and upcoming. -JanusZeal 17:42, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

 * Personal observations do not belong in the article unless they are attributable to a reliable source. If they aren't, that falls under WP:OR and would be removed.  As for adding information on upcoming years, that would fall under WP:CRYSTAL and also does not belong. --PatrickD 20:58, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

 * Again, and I quote myself: "...refer to room size, # of games, # of consoles, who's sponsoring the arcade machines, etc. I'm suggesting that we should get this information into the article, both for past years and upcoming."  As for upcoming years, WP:CRYSTAL does not apply.  Information is not, and will not, be merely speculative, nor would it be unverified.  Information about planned events and specs would be provided by ACen management itself. -JanusZeal 16:52, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

 * I was going to add a section relative to all the gaming qualities yet I'm not sure what to call it. The list of expected video games can be sited here. However, I know this list is not finalized by the Department Head yet. 12.144.116.172 20:09, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Demographic Info
I'm Rather new to working with Wiki stuff, but as ACen management I'm going to try and start a Demographic info section. I will try to get as much info on previous years as possible but will be starting with this year. Please feel free to correct any spelling or code errors, but keep the info intact. I'm not quite sure how to reference this info as it comes from our database. Anyone have a suggestion? AngelMercury 18:19, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

 * It has to come from a reliable published source, preferably something other then from Anime Central itself. Also editing of this article by Anime Central Staff can be viewed as a violation of Wikipedia's Conflict of Interest guidelines. --Farix (Talk) 20:52, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

 * I Wasn't aware of the Conflict of Interest, However after reading it I don't think this would be out of bounds. It doesn't say Don't edit it, but be careful not to do any sort of promotion or such that would make the article no longer nutural. What I'm interested in posting is pure data. AngelMercury 21:21, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Venue Locations
I am WP:COI. Can someone please remove the fact that Anime Central's venues are the Embassy Suites and the DoubleTree hotel. While Anime Central uses those hotels for rooming (very little) staff and attendees, they do not actually have programming there. Please see: http://www.animecons.com/events/info.shtml/1587 As far as I know, they've never had programming there, so the 'venue' would be invalid for both those locations, correct? JguyTalkDone 17:58, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Anime Central


text:
Path Transit

Path Transit is an Australian bus company operating Transperth bus services under contract to the Public Transport Authority. It is a subsidiary of Keolis Downer.

History
On 29 September 1996, Path Transit commenced operating services in the Marmion and Wanneroo areas from depots in Joondalup and Karrinyup with 191 Mercedes-Benz and Renault buses.

In January 1998, Path Transit gained further services in the Joondalup North area  followed on 5 July 1998 by services in the Morley area. In 1998, a new depot was opened in Wangara. In May 2011, Path Transit lost the Joondalup contract area to Transdev WA and lost the Marmion area to Swan Transit, but retained operation of the Morley contract area. However, in October the following year, Path Transit took over the Kalamunda contract from Swan Transit.

In March 2015, Keolis Downer clinched a $163 million deal to acquire Path Transit's private parent company Australian Transit Enterprises.

In October 2019, Path secured a 10-year contract to operate regional bus services in Geraldton.

As of November 2020, Path Transit continues to operate the Kalamunda and Morley area contracts.

Depots
Path Transit operates six depots in total at Bayswater, Walliston, Malaga, Redcliffe, Welshpool, and Geraldton.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Path Transit


text:
Kubu Kubu

Kubu Kubu (or Kubukubu), born Njagi wa Ikutha, was an Embu Mau Mau leader and general. His nom de guerre, Kubu Kubu, means "heavy thud" in Kîembu, referencing the thud his feet made due to his heavy build.

He was the de facto Mau Mau military leader in the Embu country, and an important leader nationally, alongside Dedan Kimathi, Musa Mwariama, and Waruhiu Itote.

Kubu Kubu was revered among the Embu for defending their territory from British rule, leading the community for more than ten years, and repulsing colonial settlers from the southern Kenyan highlands.

Early life
Njagi wa Ikutha was born sometime in the late 1920s in a heavily forested area in Mukuuri, close to the current site of the Kubu Kubu Memorial Boarding Primary School, Embu County. Like many families from the colonial-era Mukuuri Native Reserve, Njagi's family later settled in the Kianjokoma area after independence.

Legacy
In 1987, former Embu North Constituency (later split into Runyenjes and Manyatta) legislator Stanley Nyagah built a modern boarding primary school in Kubu Kubu's memory, where his body was burned in 1955.

A street and a shopping centre in Embu Town has also been named after him. A road in Nyeri Town has also been named after Kubu Kubu. The main street in Runyenjes Town is also named after him, as well as the Kubu Kubu Tented Lodge, a luxury camp in the heart of Serengeti National Park, Tanzania.

Itote widely mentions Kubu Kubu in his 1967 autobiography, "Mau Mau" General (East African Publishing House).

title: Kubu Kubu


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sam and Fuzzy

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was keep. – Rich Farmbrough 16:43, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

Sam and Fuzzy
Webcomic, questionable notability. Firebug 06:01, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, not notable. Megan1967 08:37, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Before voting, please see my notes on Talk page. Tedzsee 19:18, 18 Apr 2005 (PST)
 * Keep. I believe that it passes WikiProject Webcomics/Notability and inclusion guidelines, but that web traffic is just, uh, barely sufficient. Shiri — Talk 02:37, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, been around in regular updates for three+ years. Radiant_* 12:45, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
 * keep this please it seems notbale Yuckfoo 00:57, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.


text:
Independence Pass

Independence Pass may refer to:
 * Independence Pass (Colorado), a mountain pass on the Continental Divide of the Americas in the Sawatch Range of Colorado, United States.
 * Independence Pass (Washington), a pass in Skamania County, Washington, United States.

title: Independence Pass


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steven Schimmel

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was delete — Xezbeth 06:55, Apr 26, 2005 (UTC)

Steven Schimmel
Vanity. Was nominated for speedy deletion; I don't believe it meets the criteria so switching to VfD. A Google search reveals several Steven Schimmels; the second link appears to refer to our Mr. Schimmel. — Knowledge Seeker দ 06:03, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. This same user also created a nonsense vanity article that was speedied - after he removed the tag from it twice. Firebug 06:06, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, not notable, vanity. Megan1967 08:40, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Good call to bring it here instead of speedy. Also a good call to delete this vanity article.  The anon user is welcome to create a user page.  Rossami (talk) 22:31, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Pavel Vozenilek 02:26, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete Vanity. --MikeJ9919 23:09, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.


title: File:Phantomlady3.jpg


text: User talk:217.238.115.229

title: User talk:217.238.115.229


text: Category:50 births

title: Category:50 births


text: User talk:63.146.46.202

title: User talk:63.146.46.202


text:
Poveglia

Poveglia is a small island located between Venice and Lido in the Venetian Lagoon, of northern Italy. A small canal divides the island into two separate parts. The island first appears in the historical record in 421, and was populated until the residents fled warfare in 1379. For more than 100 years beginning in 1776, the island was used as a quarantine station for those suffering the plague and other diseases, and later as a mental hospital. The mental hospital closed in 1968, and the island has been vacant ever since. Because of its history, the island is frequently featured on paranormal shows.

Visits to the island are prohibited, but various books and articles report on visits by writers and/or photographers. Believers in the paranormal have claimed that Poveglia is the most haunted island, or the most haunted place in the world.

History
The island is first mentioned in chronicles of 421, when people from Padua and Este fled there to escape the barbarian invasions. In the 9th century the island's population began to grow, and in the following centuries its importance grew steadily, until it was governed by a dedicated Podestà. In 1379, Venice came under attack from the Genoan fleet. The people of Poveglia were moved to the Giudecca.

The island remained uninhabited in the subsequent centuries. In 1527 the doge offered the island to the Camaldolese monks, who refused the offer. From 1645 on, the Venetian government built five octagonal forts to protect and control the entrances to the lagoon. The Poveglia octagon is one of four that still survive.

In 1776, the island came under the jurisdiction of the Magistrato alla Sanità (Public Health Office), and became a check point for all goods and people coming to and going from Venice by ship. In 1793, there were several cases of the plague on two ships, and consequently the island was transformed into a temporary confinement station for the ill (lazaretto). This role became permanent in 1805, under the rule of Napoleon Bonaparte, who had the old church of San Vitale destroyed. The old bell-tower was converted into a lighthouse. The lazaretto was closed in 1814.

The island was used as a quarantine station from 1793 until 1814. In 1922 the existing buildings were converted into an asylum for the mentally ill and later used as a nursing home/long-term care facility, until its closure in 1968. Afterwards, the island was briefly used for agriculture and then completely abandoned.

In 2014, the Italian state auctioned a 99-year lease of Poveglia, which would remain state property, to raise revenue, hoping that the buyer would redevelop the hospital into a luxury hotel. The highest bid was from Italian businessman Luigi Brugnaro, (€513,000). He planned to invest €20 million euros in a restoration plan. The lease did not proceed because his project was judged not to meet all the conditions. Other sources suggested that the deal was annulled because the bid was too low. Brugnaro initially fought the cancellation of the lease, but after he became mayor of Venice, he renounced any intentions to the island.

In 2015, a private group, Poveglia per Tutti, was hoping to raise €25–30 million for a new plan to include "a public park, a marina, a restaurant, a hostel [and] a study centre." As of 2023, the island still sat vacant.

Buildings and structures
The surviving buildings on the island consist of a cavana, a church, a hospital, an asylum, a bell-tower, housing and administrative buildings for the staff. The bell-tower is the most visible structure on the island, and dates back to the 12th century. It belonged to the church of San Vitale, which was demolished under Napoleon's orders in 1806. The tower was re-used as a lighthouse.

The existence of an asylum on Poveglia seems to be confirmed by a sign for "Reparto Psichiatria" (Psychiatric Department) visible among the derelict buildings, as photographed by Ransom Riggs in his May 2010 photo-essay documenting his visit to Poveglia. However, there seems to be no evidence of an alleged prison.

A bridge connects the island where buildings stand with the island that was given over to trees and fields. The octagonal fort is on a third, separate island, next to the island with the buildings, but unconnected to it. The fort consists solely of an earthen rampart faced on the outside with brick.

The island contains one or more plague pits. An estimate published by National Geographic suggest that over 100,000 people died on the island over the centuries and were buried in plague pits. Another source, Atlas Obscura, provides an estimate of 160,000 people.

News reports published in 2014/2015 confirmed that the building and rusting artefacts still existed. The island contained dilapidated buildings including the church of St Vitale, a hospital, an asylum, and prison plus residential and office buildings.

Popular culture
Some time after the island had become a quarantine station for ships arriving at Venice in the 18th century, a plague was discovered on two ships. The island was sealed off and used to host people with infectious diseases, leading to legends of terminally ill Venetians waiting to die before their ghosts returned to haunt the island.

A doctor allegedly experimented on patients with crude lobotomies. According to a 2014 report by the Travel Channel, the doctor jumped from the bell tower in the 1930s after claiming he had been driven mad by ghosts. He later died. Decades later, nearby residents claimed to still hear the bell, although it was removed many years earlier. That report, titled "Haunted History", also states that some restoration work had started recently but that "abruptly stopped without explanation".

The island has been featured on the paranormal shows Ghost Adventures and Scariest Places on Earth. It has been explored and featured by the YouTuber Shiey, and was featured on a video by Yes Theory in 2019.

In 2023, the island was explored by an Irish Youtuber named Dara Tah, who stayed on the island overnight, exploring the abandoned bell tower to search for traces of paranormal activities. His mission somewhat succeeded after he received some words in Italian on the radio including "leave", "incident", and "exploded", but he denied the existence of any ghosts.

title: Poveglia


text: Category:121 deaths

title: Category:121 deaths


text:
User talk:Seinman

Welcome!

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Thanks!
seinman, thanks for catching and deleting the vandalism on Tourette syndrome! Sandy 20:23, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

Category:Aspergian Wikipedians
Category:Aspergian Wikipedians which you have included on your user page has been proposed for deletion you can comment at Categories for deletion. The is also a proposal to create an association to meet the needs of users with mental health conditions. --Salix alba (talk) 18:57, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

tivo article
why did you delete the part on the contreversy from the free software comunity? i realy don't understand why 00 tux(my point of views(for npov), howto customise a signature) | talk 04:25, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Your recent attempt to fix two spelling errors unfortunately cut off the bottom half of the Tivo article. I've reverted your change. Thanks, Gwernol 22:34, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Suicide
Sorry I stepped on your editing of suicide. We basically made the same edit, but mine had some wikilinks in it, and I didn't notice yours until it was too late. -seinman 03:51, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

 * No problem. Thanks for the heads up. Mucus 04:43, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for putting that link request for a citation there, it's just what we needed to bring things back down to earth. Orpheus 02:47, 11 August 2006 (UTC) (edit: oops, the actual link was added by another...)

CHICOTW
I see your user name listed as a member of the WikiProject_Chicago. I do not know if you are aware that we are attempting to revive the CHICOTW. See our results history. We could use additional input in nominating future articles, voting on nominees and editing winning nominees. Should you contribute you will receive weekly notices like the following:

TonyTheTiger 01:16, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

List of Studio 60 on the Sunset Strip episodes
What did I mess up exactly? The article seems to be ok on my side. Can you be more specific so I can investigate it. (I don't put the image back, since I don't want to break the layout again) -- lucasbfr talk 09:43, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Never mind, I looked at the diffs... I don't know what happened I was sure to be editing the current version... Perhaps I missclicked at one point. Sorry about that I will double check in the future (I still don't know how I could miss the "you are editing a previous version" message. Maybe I had both windows open and I saved the wrong one)... Sorry, and thanks a lot for spotting that! -- lucasbfr talk 09:53, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Orphaned fair use image (Image:Adobe Premiere Pro 2.png)
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Image:Adobe Premiere Pro 2.png
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Chicago meetup
I've updated the Chicago meetup page with a tentative date. Please join the discussion there toward setting a final date and place. Kelly Martin (talk) 16:42, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Chicago Meetup
I hope the time and place for the Chicago Meetup are convenient. Your reply would be appreciated.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 18:35, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

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Meetup
Seinman - you've previously expressed interest in a Chicago wiki-meet. If you're interested in coming to another one, take a look at Meetup/Chicago 3 and let us know your thoughts. best — Dan | talk 18:40, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

WP:CHICAGO
You have been marked as an inactive member of WP:CHICAGO since you have not updated your status at WikiProject Chicago/members. If you consider yourself either an active or semi-active member of the project please correct your status. If you consider yourself a member you may want to get involved in the Meetup/Chicago 3. Also, if you are a member, be advised that the project is now trying to keep all the project's WP:PR, WP:FAC, WP:FAR, WP:GAR, WP:GAC WP:FLC, WP:FLRC, WP:FTC, WP:FPOC, WP:FPC, and WP:AFD discussion pages in one location at the new WikiProject Chicago/Review page. Please help add any discussion you are aware of at this location.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 16:37, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

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ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 12:57, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Seinman


text:
Talk:Gouldian finch

Image Trouble...
- Having trouble uploading an image. I'd like to use this photo (http://englishbloopers.com/Webmaster/Personal/Photos/Birds_2004/site_2_Kiro.jpg), which is from my own domain. Can't figure out how to upload. The caption for the photo should be "Male gouldian finch" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 211.218.35.59 (talk • contribs)

 * I'm uploading it. Abby724 02:27, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

tidy up
Hi, i have just tidied up this article and made some changes. I have also downgraded its conservation status to Endangered from Critical as updated from [BirdLife Species Factsheet]. Luffy487 03:36, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Aviculture
This section is in dire need of cleanup. It is repetitive, and appears to be written by a person with ESL, or who is unable to grasp the fundamentals of English grammar (not to belittle whoever wrote it). Douglas C (talk) 02:08, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Move comment to talk page
I have moved the following here, where it belongs, from article space. Maias (talk) 03:41, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

"I find this information on females controlling the sex dubious at best given the fact that red heads are the original gouldian finch. The orange and black head both came from the red heads. When breeding two red heads or two orange heads you CAN get all three head colors in one clutch. However it has been proven that when two black heads are mated they produce only black heads. This led to the belief that the other two came from the black heads. I would have to see much more scientific proof other than just breeding to make me believe that the females can control the number of males by the head color of the mate. Females carry one chromosone that determines sex. Males have two. So depending on which male chromosone fertilizes the egg you will get either a male or a female. It is also proven that some males have more of one than the other so they will produce more of that sex than the other. It has also been proven that the use of black light will help bring captive breeding populations more on an equal number of females to males. It is also possible that there was over exposure to black light in the captive breeding that could have caused the increase in males. This study needs to be done in the field and not in a lab before they can state conclusively that it is fact. They also need to rule out any dietary or environmental causes. Pollution could also be a factor and needs to be ruled out."

A self-contradiction in the article, needs correction.
In the "Description" section we have: These tubercles are commonly (and incorrectly) described as phosphorescent in spite of much scientific evidence to the contrary.

And then in the verbage of one of the images we have: A young Gouldian finch (first day out of the nest) – note the blue phosphorescent nodules on the side of its beak

Well, are the tubercles/nodules phosphorsecent or not? Can we have someone who knows FOR SURE correct the sentence that is incorrect? 121.213.121.103 (talk) 08:50, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

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More than one name
Sorry, but it just is so that there is more than one Latin name!!! Look at the common garden snail as an example -different people believe the name is different. I have given TWO citations. You have just said, "thats not how it works"!!! Remember, the name DOES mean something. Therefor, it is possible that people will have different ideas as we get better research. Qwerty number1 (talk) 20:55, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Of course one of the names is wrong, however it is still relevant because it is either unclear which is right OR many people use the wrong name! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Qwerty number1 (talk • contribs) 21:01, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Yes, there is more than one. But only one can be VALID. Which one came first? That's the valid one. The other(s) belong in the taxobox under 'Synonyms'. Oh, wait, the synonym you added was already there and has been for years. Sumanuil (talk) 21:05, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

However, the genus name DOES mean something,therefore, as our methods improve, these may change.

categories within article
Should "aviculture" and "trapping for aviculture" not be merged because the latter seems like part of the former. The former is also not very big, which makes me wonder why this was done. Qwerty number1 (talk) 08:16, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Image location
I have moved 5 images to Gallery to avoid Sandwich effect on text (see MOS:IMAGELOC) & changed selection of images at right of text to more closely coincide with that text (ie, newly-hatched chicks & juvenile finch images are now adjacent to Breeding section). Rogermccart (talk) 02:45, 27 November 2022 (UTC)

status of the bird as least concern + population estimate + flock size
Those three don't exactly contradict each other, but it seems unlikely that the bird is considered least concern when/if the wild population estimate is 2500 individuals - as well as the flock size being 1000-2000 individuals. 216.241.156.25 (talk) 06:01, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

 * @216.241.156.25 Citation from the article:
 * "[...] The population went from hundreds of thousands in the early 20th century to 2,500 or fewer by the 1980's. The current estimated population continues to be 2,500 or fewer birds. [...]
 * Behaviour
 * [...] Flocks can consist of up to 1,000–2,000 individuals. [...]" 216.241.156.25 (talk) 06:06, 27 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Australian government quoted a 2,500 figure since 2008.
 * If there is more recent research estimating a higher figure it may be better to use that. In regards to flock size that probably isn't true regardless of population size. Traumnovelle (talk) 18:13, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

1000-2000 flock claim probably not true.
Current source is a self-published site by an ecologist who may or may not be an expert on the bird.

More reliable sources instead state a smaller figure for flock size: https://animals.sandiegozoo.org/animals/gouldian-finch

"The Gouldian finch is a medium-sized grass eating bird that lives only in the northern savannas region of Australia. It is a strikingly colourful bird which was once very common. Although Gouldian finches are popular as pets around the world, less than 2500 adult finches remain in the wild. These remaining finches are broken up into isolated flocks, most with less than 100 birds each."

https://www.dcceew.gov.au/environment/biodiversity/threatened/publications/gouldian-finch-erythrura-gouldiae-2008

https://www.environment.gov.au/biodiversity/threatened/species/pubs/413-conservation-advice-07122016.pdf

Traumnovelle (talk) 18:13, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Gouldian finch


text:
Talk:Newgrange

Translation of Brú na Bóinne
Bru na Boinne should be translated as the Mansion, or Palace, of the Boyne, according to all the Irish I have consulted. The translation the Bend of the Boyne is probably derived from the title of the book (I myself made that mistake, which is why I started asking several people for translations). The title deals with the whole river bend, not just Newgrange (which is depicted on the front cover), that is the reason for the choice of word.

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New indication of Henge as of July 2018
https://www.sciencealert.com/never-before-seen-ancient-henge-appears-once-in-a-lifetime-discovery-ireland-heatwave-archaeology  "An Ancient Mystery Henge Has Appeared in 'Once in a Lifetime' Discovery in Ireland"   2601:1C2:4E02:3020:B4BB:D41:7D7B:FCF0 (talk) 20:44, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

Archaeogenetics
I've put in a line about the confusion between Neolithic people and Celts, as some websites still suggest that the builders of Newgrange were ancestral to the Celts, or just plain Celts. This has been disproved in many studies over the past 15 years.78.17.11.129 (talk) 21:05, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Well, you need some citations for that, and genetics can't actually tell you what language people spoke, which is the only useful definition of "Celts". Johnbod (talk) 01:27, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
 * No problem; the Yamnaya culture supplanted the neolithics, and the Celtic languages derived from the Indo-European languages that were brought west by the Yamnayans.78.17.48.107 (talk) 06:51, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
 * This was far too emphatic, and Reich is not a big name in Europe. Note that the article did not mention Celts or Celtic until YOU put it in! The subject is far from settled, & unlikely to be so for some decades. Johnbod (talk) 13:46, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Oxford University Press published his book, a very big name in Europe. If you are saying that Celtic languages were not Indo-European, then you should bring some evidence.78.17.48.107 (talk) 22:10, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Obviously I'm not saying that, & OUP publish vast numbers of books. Johnbod (talk) 23:31, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Reich is a professor of genetics at Harvard University and you can find out more at David Reich (geneticist).78.17.32.83 (talk) 10:22, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Newgrange


text:
Talk:Pagadian

This doesn't sound very believable.... ? Confirm/Deny? Notthe9 06:07, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Dead link
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!

 * http://elgu.ncc.gov.ph/ecommunity/pagadiancity/
 * In Pagadian City on Mon Jul 17 15:13:34 2006, Socket Error: (110, 'Connection timed out')
 * In Pagadian City on Thu Jul 27 00:42:26 2006, 404 Not Found

--maru  (talk)  contribs 04:42, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

On Pagadian City Entry
I removed the following contents:

Natural attractions
 * Dao Dao Island- A Big island has an area of 1.1057 hectares and is a 7-10 minute ride by motorboat from the seaport. It has artificial coral reefs and is ideal for swimming, boating and fishing.

 * White Beach- A stretch of white sand beach just five minutes via motorboat southeast of the seaport. Clear, deep, blue waters (even at low tide) are ideal for swimming and diving.

 * Pulacan Falls- Found in the town of Labangan, 12 km. from Pagadian City, and covering an area of 400 square meters. It is the source of water for the Labangan irrigation system. Two kilometers from the area is the 134-hectare Home Defense Center. The falls can be reached easily by any motor vehicle. With the opening of the PADAP road, Pulacan Falls became a beautiful camping and picinic site. It now has a permanent Boy and Girl Scout site with facilities and has been the location of regional and provincial jamborees.

 * Muricay Beach- Located in barangay Muricay, just a little over 4 km. from the city proper, the white sand beach is available for swimming but is as yet undeveloped. Mangrove tracts and seaweed plantations are nearby.

 * Bomba Beach- Located in barangay Bomba, about 2 km. from Pagadian proper, available for fishing and swimming with a bomba bridge and shed as well as a coral reef. Under study for development.

 * Poloyagan Beach- Rocky beach with coral reef, also under study. About km. from Pagadian proper.

 * Lourdes Hot and Cold Spring- Natural hot springs at barangay Lourdes, about 32 km. northwest from the urban area. This is tapped by the Pagadian City Water District as a piped water source for barangay Kagawasan.

 * Lison Valley Waterfalls- Barangay Lison Valley boasts of these falls (about 42 km. northwest of Pagadian proper) with a height of about 20-25 meters. Its spherical-shaped basin, 20 meters in diameter, with cool and invigorating water is ideal for picnic. Located in sitio Santa Lucia, about 18 km. from Lison proper, the area is ringed by verdant greenery, giant ferns, orchids and moss-covered rocks as well as lime and marble stones. It overlooks ricefields and Chocolate Hill lookalikes.

 * Lourdes Waterfalls- Also located at barangay Lourdes, about 32 km. from Pagadian proper. Ideal for bathing.

 * Manga Falls- Located in barangay Manga, just 7 km. from the Pagadian poblacion. This is a two-layered cascading fall surrounded by huge trees which are home to monkeys as well as the ibid lizard. Still under study.

 * Mt. Palpalan- This is the promontory within the Pagadian City area on whose apex are located the transmitters of major commercial communication systems. About 30 minutes of steep climbing from the boundary of Pagadian City and Dumalinao municipality along the Pagadian-Zamboanga national highway. From 684 feet above sea level, Mt. Palpalan gives a sweeping vista of urban Pagadian City, neighboring municipalities, and the deep blue waters of Pagadian Bay.

 * Mt. Susong Dalaga- Found in barangay Lourdes, 32 km. from Pagadian proper and 10 km. from the barangay center, Susong Dalaga is a semi-perfect cone with good forest cover. It can be reached by horseback.

 * Mt. Pinokis- This one's in barangay Lison Valley, 42 km. from the Pagadian poblacion. Mt Pinokis is 2 km. from Mt. Susong Dalaga as 12 km. from barangay Lourdes. The mountain features virgin forests inhabited by native wildlife such as monkeys, birds, lizards as well as numerous species of reptiles, amphibians and insects. It can also be reached by horseback and is now under study for development.

 * Bulatoc Hill- Situated at barangay Bogo, only 4 km. from Pagadian proper. The hill is haven to agricultural land and offers a panoramic view of Pagadian Bay.

 * Kendis Cave- About 14 km. from Pagadian poblacion and 5 km. from barangay Ditoray. Kendis Cave is an open-end cave with plants and vegetation. Has large overhead crevices with two interior chambers. Can be reached on horseback and currently under study.

 * Manga Cave- Twin caves along the two-layered Manga waterfalls. Currently under study.

 * Ditoray Waterfalls- This is 14 km. from the Pagadian poblacion and 5 km. from the center of barangay Ditoray. Large stones ring the falls.

How can you reach Pagadian?

 * Plane: South East Asian Airline (SEAIR) flies to Cebu 2x weekly. Pagadian to Manila flights and v.v. by Asian Spirit airline are suspended temporarily while work is going on at the airport runway. Hopefully flights will resume soon.

 * Bus- It has direct bus trips from Pagadian City to any key cities and municipalities in Mindanao like Davao, Zamboanga, Dipolog, Dapitan, Cagayan de Oro and many more.

 * Ferry Boat- It offers vessel trips to Zamboanga City and Cotabato City.

Places to Eat

 * Greenhouse Fishing Station and Restaurant
 * Sunburst Sunburst Restaurant
 * Pinchik Restaurant
 * Kamayan sa Pagadian. Chicken Ati-Atihan.
 * Jollibee Pagadian
 * Chowking Pagadian
 * Chuckles
 * Dunkin Donuts Pagadian
 * Peoples Plaza Food Court
 * Night Market
 * Andy's Food House
 * KG Food Haven
 * KJ Food Junction
 * INKS
 * Sams Fastfood
 * Pidros Lechon Manok
 * Ogis Lechon Manok
 * Susanok's
 * Spicy Food Haus
 * Payag de Cora
 * JB's Inato
 * Sunflower Coffee Shop
 * Little Italy Coffee Shop
 * Golda's Kaffe
 * Liga City (Kusina Lakambini)
 * Djangos Bar and Restaurant
 * Muzeo Resto Lounge Muzeo Restolounge and Bar
 * Avenue foodland Avenue Foodland
 * Guiller Cafe Guiller Cafe
 * Resto Grande

Hotels

 * New Roxan Hotel- F.S. Pajares Avenue, Pagadian City. Tel.: (6362) 214-1683

 * Hotel Camila- J.Ariosa St., Pagadian City. Tel.: (6362) 214-2934

 * Hotel Guillermo- J.Rizal Avenue, Pagadian City. Tel. (6362) 214-2934

 * Springland Pavilion/Springland Resort- Tuburan Dist., Pagadian City. Tel.: (6362) 214-1881 or (6362) 214-2992

 * Alindahaw Hotel - J.Rizal Avenue, Pagadian City (as of 2007: leading premiere hotel)

 * Pilgrims Hotel- National Highway, Tuburan, Pagadian City.

 * Princess Hotel- Pagadian City.

 * Bay Plaza Hotel -it is a 8 story hotel with a 5 star style hotel with elevators and a function hall that can hold up to 500 persons.

 * Hotel Grande(soon to be in Pagadian City) it will be the first 5-star hotel in Pagadian City with complete 5-star facilities such as a 890sqm swimming pool, 240sqm suites, 160sqm regular rooms, the first luxurios Resto Grande, a Mercedes Benz hotel service, a 5 million worth lobby, a luxury spa, a mini mall, a mini grocery but everything is still part of a proposal.

Shopping

Major Shopping centers in Pagadian City:

 * Peoples Plaza(major shopping center)- on Pajares Avenue. The Peoples Plaza has 2 buildings, the department store (bldg. 1) & building 2. Building 1 has a snack center, bakeshop (Rosette's Bakeshop), grocery store on the ground level, a depatrment store on 2nd & 3rd level while a newly opened In-house (furniture & in-house shop). Building 2 has foodcourt on the ground floor, a book store, mini-grocery, a drugstore and a cafe, in the 2nd level, an extension of the department store which has the children's wear in the 3rd level and on the 4th floor is the only token-controlled arcade machine den in the city. The 2 buildings are connected by a bridge which has a Character shop and a display center for bikes. There are also several shops in the vicinity including Penshoppe and Bench outlets.

 * Best Emporium or simply B.E (major shopping center) on Pajares Avenue. It has grocery on the ground floor and the bookstore, clothing and apparel, household materials are located on the 2nd floor. It has a cinema before but it was later closed due to some management decisions.

 * Pagadian Shopping Center (soon to be constructed) - it is a five story shopping mall with a high technology facility the 1st-3rd Floor will be the said shopping centr and the 4th-5th Floor will be the new offices of the Regional Center in Zamboanga Peninsula.

 * D'Beam General Merchandise- which has a fastfood chain, bookstore,jewelry shop, grocery, furniture shop & a fireworks store during Christmas seasons.

 * Cariaga Traders' Mart is considered as one of the city's savings shops. It has a grocery, a bookstore, toy store, musical instrument store & etc. The divisions of Cariaga Shops are located in different locations.

 * Edmar's is considered as one of the city's savings shops. It has a 2 branches since before the restoration of the original which was destroyed of fire but the 2nd branch only sells magazines, newspapers and birthday give-aways. Branch 1 has a bookstore, newspaper stand, loading station, give-away shop, toy store.

 * Gaisano City Pagadian. The Gaisano Corporation is starting to construct its branch in the city. Its lot is located at Brgy. San Pedro. And it will also be cited as the largest establishment in Zamboanga del Sur

 * Best Emporium Megamall is considered as the first mall and to be the largest establishment in Zamboanga del Sur announced before Gaisano was constructed. The establishment is fully owned by the Best Emporium Business Group but the cost of the construction is said to be funded by Metrobank Pagadian. The mall will soon open after the extension will be finished.

Elementary Schools

 * Saint Columban College Grade school Department

 * Balangasan Elem. School

 * Pagadian City Pilot School

 * Dumagoc Elementary School

 * Sto Niño Elementary School

 * San Pedro Elementary School

 * Sta. Lucia Elementary School

 * Napolan Elementary School

 * Camp Abelon Elementary School

 * Sta. Maria Elementary School

 * Pagadian City Chamber School

 * Santiago Elementary School

Secondary Schools

 * Saint Columban College High School Department

 * Holy Child Academy

 * SMC Annex High School

 * Pagadian City National High School

 * PJC High School

 * Zamboanga del Sur National High school

 * ZSSAT High School

 * Good Shephered High School

Colleges

 * Saint Columban College

 * Southern Mindanao Colleges

 * Zamboanga del Sur Maritime Institute of Technology

 * Pagadian Institute of Technology

 * Eastern Mindanao College of Technology

 * Medina College

 * Pagadian Capitol College

 * STI Pagadian

 * Western Mindanao State University-External Studies Unit (ESU)

 * J.H. Cerilles State College of Law & Nursing

 * Pagadian Technological & Marine School

 * Lucan Polytechnic State College

 * Philippine Paramedical & Technical School-Pagadian City Campus

Hospitals

 * Borbon General Hospital

 * Zamboanga del Sur Provincial Hospital

 * Pagadian City Medical Center / Mendero Hospital

 * 6 storey Pagadian City Medical Center-Extension (Soon to Rise)

 * Pagadian City Community Hospital/Jamelarin Hospital

 * Pagadian City Doctor's Hospital

 * Cabahug Hospital/St. Martin Clinic

 * Magbo-o Clinic/Clinica y Pamaran

 * St. Francis Clinic

 * Hofileña Clinic

 * Zamboanga del Sur Cooperative Hospital

 * Zamboanga del Sur Medical Center (Soon to Open)

 * Zamboanga Peninsula Medical Experts Centre (soon to rise)

Reason: Wikipedia is not a guide nor a directory. Mbell 791983 03:08, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Help on Pagadian City Seal
This article needs to have a city seal attached. I'm asking if anyone can help me with this. It would be very much appreciated! Razzmatazz143 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 04:46, 21 March 2009 (UTC).

Needs pics
We need to improve this article through pictures. Any pictures of Pagadian, especially old ones, and also a very good picture of the inclined tricycle are needed. Please help.

Razzmatazz143 (talk) 03:52, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Needs Subdivision info
please do give information about subdivision and vacancy or lot for sale ...just interested to know thank debah78@yahoo.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 112.202.21.248 (talk) 01:19, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Hi i'm one of article writer pls comunicate with me 09089924659 MR> H pagadianon —Preceding unsigned comment added by Halil marx07 (talk • contribs) 04:31, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

There is a discussion regarding the removal of the word "city" from the article titles of Philippine cities. This may imminently affect the article name for . For city names which are not unique, disambiguation alternatives are also being presented. Formal request for page move may follow after a reasonable time of discussion. If you wish to participate, please post your comments here. --JinJian (talk) 04:33, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Time line
Pano nangyari cancelled lahat ang transfer ng offices????Halil marx07 (talk) 13:07, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Re:Timeline
Hello there, Merry Christmas Halil! Hope you're doing well. I dont log into Wikipedia as often as before, these days.

By the way, are you refering to the move of Regional Offices from Zambo to Pagadian? I dont know about that just yet...will go check on it. Thanks for the info. Just BUSY BUSY these days w/ work and Holiday rush. =) Razzmatazz143 (talk) 21:28, 24 December 2010 (UTC) Can i have your FB .Merry Christmas to, Hope you be active again in wikipedia...

Re:Re: Timeline
Yes you may. You can search for my name: Moe Lacierda. Happy New Year too! I'm actually at work right now, SPENDING the New Year here. Hehehe.

Re:Re:Re:
We are the same happy new year too i already added you on FB happy new year...

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Independence Pass (Colorado)

Independence Pass, originally known as Hunter Pass, is a high mountain pass in central Colorado, United States. It is at elevation 12095 ft on the Continental Divide in the Sawatch Range of the Rocky Mountains. The pass is midway between Aspen and Twin Lakes, on the border between Pitkin and Lake counties.

State Highway 82 traverses it, and after Cottonwood Pass to the south, is the second highest elevation of a paved Colorado state highway on a through road. It is also the second-highest pass with an improved road in the state, the fourth-highest paved road in the state and the second highest paved crossing of the Continental Divide in the U.S. Because of the heavy snowfall at its elevation, it is closed in wintertime, isolating Aspen from direct access from the east during the ski season.

When the pass is open in warmer weather, it is a popular destination. A scenic overlook near the pass allows visitors to take in the alpine tundra environment above treeline, and offers excellent views to the east of Mount Elbert, Colorado's highest peak and the second-highest mountain in the contiguous United States. Rock climbers are drawn to nearby bouldering opportunities, and informal paths lead to nearby mountain summits of even higher elevation. Backcountry skiers make use of the slopes during the late spring and early summer. Since 2011 the pass has been on the route of the USA Pro Cycling Challenge.

The pass was formed by glacial action and erosion in the region, and its first recorded sighting was by Zebulon Pike in 1806. Ferdinand Hayden surveyed it in 1873. As part of the Continental Divide, it was the limit of European settlement in the region at the time, with the land to the west reserved for the Ute people. Prospectors who defied governor Frederick Walker Pitkin's order crossed the pass on July 4, 1879, giving it its current name and setting up a similarly named village (now a ghost town) to its west. A toll road built across the pass was abandoned and neglected after a railroad connection was made to Aspen. A new road replaced it in the 1920s; portions of the old route can still be seen along the western approach. The Independence Pass Foundation, based in Aspen, works to repair damage to the pass's environment caused by both roads since 1984.

Geography
At the pass, the main ridge of the Sawatch Range, and thus the Continental Divide, turns from running generally south to more southwesterly. North of the pass slopes rise to an unnamed 13440 ft peak a half-mile (1 km) away; a ridge of about the same length connects it to the nearest named summit, 13711 ft Twining Peak. To the south the ridge rises more gently around Mountain Boy Gulch to an unnamed 13198 ft summit 2 miles (3.2 km) distant. The first named summit in this direction is Grizzly Peak, Colorado's highest thirteener. The terrain is level enough, and the ridge broad enough, to allow for a 500-foot (150 m) parking lot along the south side of Highway 82 at the height of land. The pass is split evenly between Pitkin and Lake counties, as well as White River and San Isabel national forests. Boundaries of the Collegiate Peaks Wilderness and the Mount Massive Wilderness are near the pass on the south and north respectively. The Hunter–Fryingpan Wilderness is also nearby.

West of the parking area is a small maintenance shed; on the east are toilet facilities. Both are maintained by the U.S. Forest Service. A paved walkway system extends to a pair of overlooks 500 feet (150 m) to the south allowing views in that direction over the Lake Creek valley to Mount Elbert, at 14440 ft the highest peak both in Colorado and the Rocky Mountains, and La Plata Peak, another fourteener and the state's fifth-highest peak. A wide dirt path continues southward three miles (4.8 km) along the ridge to an unnamed 13020 ft summit. Across the road a use path leads 2.5 mi to the summits of the unnamed peak and Twining. The overlook, maintained by the Colorado Department of Transportation, includes an inaccurate demarcation of the Continental Divide dating back to estimated surveys taken during the Pike Expedition. Geologists have since determined the true Divide to be along the popular trailhead leading to Linkins Lake 2 miles (3.2 km) west of the current marker.

The pass comes roughly in the middle of a 32 mi stretch of Highway 82 between the two winter gates, a corridor that is sometimes referred to in its entirety as Independence Pass. Aspen is 19 mi to the west, with Twin Lakes 18 mi to the east. Beyond Aspen the highway continues down the valley to the mouth of the Roaring Fork at Glenwood Springs. East of Twin Lakes Highway 82 continues a short distance to its eastern terminus at U.S. Highway 24, 15 mi south of Leadville.

On both approaches, the dropoff is steep enough for Highway 82 to require a 6 percent grade and switchbacks: one on the west and three on the east. The former approach uses the narrow valley of the Roaring Fork River, a tributary of the Colorado, which rises from Independence Lake west of the pass. Its walls are steeper but shallower than those of the North Fork of Lake Creek, which drains into Twin Lakes Reservoir and the headwaters of the Arkansas River, on the east. The pass is above tree line, so the surrounding terrain is alpine tundra. Open grassy expanses are occasionally broken by low shrubbery and bare patches of rock, particularly on the steep slope to the north. Snow lingers in some areas year-round. Adjacent to the road and parking area are small ephemeral pools on the southwest, with a larger, permanent one north of the road.

Climate
Independence Pass has a subarctic climate (Köppen Dfc). Independence Pass experiences a large amount of snowfall, receiving an average of 335 inches (852.7 cm) a year.

The weather station, Brumley, is situated on the eastern side of Independence Pass, at an elevation of 10600 feet (3231 m).

History
Like the surrounding mountains, the pass was created by glaciation and erosion over thousands of years. Before European-American settlers arrived, it was in the territory of the Ute Native American tribe. One of the earliest sightings by a European-American was in 1806, when Zebulon Pike, mapping the southern boundary of the Louisiana Purchase, spotted the gap in what would later be named the Sawatch Range from the upper Arkansas River valley. It was not explored until Ferdinand Hayden and his team surveyed it in 1873. At the time it was known as Hunter Pass.

Three years later, in 1876, Colorado became a state. At the time settlement had pushed as far west from its capital, Denver, as Leadville. There was a variety of metals and minerals in the surrounding mountains, and some miners had become rich from their claims there. Those who had not been so successful heard about reports from prospectors of abundant silver deposits farther west, over the Divide.

Governor Frederick Walker Pitkin had ordered all settlers to stay to the east of the Divide, as the state and federal governments had not made peace with the Utes. Nevertheless, some defied the order, drawn by the prospect of mining fortunes. Settlers sometimes used Hunter Pass to get to Ashcroft, an early camp on Castle Creek above the Roaring Fork. However, they preferred to take the southern route over the slightly higher Cottonwood Pass through Taylor Park and then back over Taylor Pass to get there, even though this made for a 100-mile (160 km) journey, 40 miles (64 km) more than the direct route offered by Hunter Pass.

On July 4, 1879, a group from Leadville struck gold in the uppermost Roaring Fork valley below the pass. Four miles (6.4 km) to the west, they established a settlement in the upper Roaring Fork Valley that eventually took the name Independence from the holiday on which it was established. The pass, the lake from which the Roaring Fork rises and another nearby mountain all took that name as well. The Twin Lakes and Roaring Fork Toll Company, established to build a road through to the camps in the lower Roaring Fork Valley, improved the original path over the pass sufficiently enough by 1880 that horses could be used for the trip.

Independence grew quickly when more gold was found in the nearby mountains. Within two years of its settlement permanent buildings had replaced the original tents, and a mining concern from Leadville had bought up all the claims. In two years they produced gold worth $190,000 ($ in modern dollars), funding the construction of a stamping mill and sawmill. In Aspen, farther down the valley, silver was found in even greater abundance than Independence's gold. B. Clark Wheeler, an early investor in those mines, funded the construction of a stage road to Leadville, the first road to cross the pass. It opened in November 1881, with winter already in full swing at the pass.

The road charged 25 cents ($0 in modern dollars) for saddle horses and twice that for two-axle stagecoaches. The tolls, collected at three separate gates, primarily reflected the cost of retaining a large crew of men with snow shovels to keep the road open in wintertime; they were able to keep the road open through its first five winters. When the snow was too deep, sleighs were used instead. During the summer the stages were able to take the switchbacks at full speed, with dogs running in advance to warn other traffic. A typical voyage over the pass required 10–25 hours and five changes of horses. The road improved Independence's economy, since coaches often stopped there on the multi-day journey. However, the year of its construction would turn out to be the settlement's economic peak year. Gold production dropped off after 1884. Independence's decline in population, remote location and severe high-altitude winters cost it the opportunity to be seat of newly formed Pitkin County to Aspen, located on a larger plain farther down the river and growing much more rapidly due to the Colorado Silver Boom. When a rail connection was made to that city in 1888, the stage road fell into disuse, further hurting Independence's economy. All but one of the remaining residents decamped as a group to Aspen on improvised cross-country skis during the severe winter of 1899. The holdout, J.R. Williams, remained until 1920. The nearby Williams Mountains were named for him.

By then Aspen's prosperity had receded as well. Congress repealed the Sherman Silver Purchase Act in response to the Panic of 1893, which took the largest buyer of the city's silver out of the market. Aspen began a period of steady decline known today as "the quiet years" as mines gradually closed down. The route over the pass remained useful, however. In 1895 a telephone line was routed over it.

Although its population had dropped below a thousand by the late 1920s, in 1927 the state replaced the stage road with what eventually became Highway 82. Unlike the stage road, it was closed during the winter months. While most of the old route was used for the new road, a portion of the original grade remains three miles below the pass on the east side. It includes the foundation of the gatekeeper's house and the remains of the gate.

During the Great Depression, another large public works project involved the pass. The federal Works Progress Administration (WPA) oversaw the construction of the Twin Lakes Tunnel, which diverted water from Grizzly Reservoir, on Lincoln Creek, a southern tributary of the Roaring Fork, to Twin Lakes, where it was used for irrigation purposes by beet and watermelon farmers in the Rocky Ford and Ordway areas. Starting in 1935, a volume of 50,000 acre-ft were made available this way. Another WPA effort recognized the pass as a scenic attraction. A travel guidebook for automobile touring produced by the Federal Writers' Project gave as one route the trip along Highway 82 from Twin Lakes. It noted the distinctive landscape of the pass:

"The highway rises in a series of loops and curves towards the Continental Divide. Thinning pines, gnarled and stubby from their fight for existence, give way to bare boulders, hardy grasses and the alpine vegetation of a world above the clouds. The road along the sheer face of the mountain, while steep, is one of the safest traversing a pass in Colorado.

A stone monument and several small lakes mark the summit of Independence Pass, the highest and probably the most impressive automobile pass in the state. An arctic meadowland overshadowed only by the topmost notches of the Sawatch Range, it rises far above the peaks that towered high when viewed from the Lake Creek valley."

After World War II, Aspen began to grow and prosper again due to the establishment of a popular ski resort, an annual music festival, and a relaxed lifestyle which attracted many celebrities and corporate executives to the city. Visitors to Aspen generally had to take Highway 82 up from Glenwood Springs or fly in, as few wanted to drive over the unpaved pass road. In 1967 the State Highway Department remedied this by paving the road over the pass. It has since been designated part of Colorado's "Top of the Rockies" scenic byway by the state and federal departments of transportation.

Environment
The alpine tundra biome of the pass extends below it on either side to an elevation of approximately 11500 ft, or about the altitude of the Linkins Lake trailhead on the western side, Highway 82's uppermost crossing of the Roaring Fork. Below it is a subalpine zone where lodgepole pine, Engelmann spruce, subalpine fir and aspen dominate the forest. A few patches of those trees persist above that elevation, but they are mostly stunted krummholz. Tree growth above those patches is curtailed by the alpine climate of the pass. It is characterized by severe changes in temperature, high winds and the deep winter snow. The resulting short growing season is made even shorter by the thin soil.

The most predominant plant species in the alpine zone around the pass are the grass species adapted to the harsh climate. Other alpine flora, such as moss and lichens on the rocks, and wildflowers in season, make appearances. Shrubs that survive among them include strawberry, snowberry, willows and bog birch. Animals in the alpine zone include ptarmigans, small burrowing species like pika, marmots, and pocket gopher, and mountain goats.

Two types of rock are found in the pass and its vicinity. Quartz monzonite forms many of the cliffs, while the crags are biotite gneiss. The glaciation, which dates to as recently as 12,000 years ago, smoothed much of the rock to the point of it being slippery.

Visitor attractions
Many visitors stop at the parking lot and walk the paved path to the scenic overlook. In clear enough weather it offers views east of Mount Elbert, Colorado's highest peak, and La Plata Peak, the state's fifth-highest at 14336 ft. To the west more fourteeners—the Maroon Bells, Snowmass Mountain and Capitol Peak—stand out among the mountains. A trail with Braille interpretive plaques is available for visually impaired visitors.

Other outdoor recreation opportunities exist at and near the pass. Between the pass and Difficult Campground, 3 miles (4.8 km) east of Aspen, there are many popular rock climbing areas, some with grades up to 5.12 under the Yosemite Decimal System. The Grotto Wall across from Lincoln Gulch campground is a frequent destination. Closer to the pass are Instant Karma Cliff and Putterman's Dome. A pair of rocks along either side of Highway 82 on the east approach to the pass are popular bouldering spots.

On the days after the pass reopens in the spring, backcountry skiers often take advantage of the remaining snow on the slopes. In years following heavy winters, skiing is possible into July.

Water-based recreation is available near the pass as well, particularly on the Roaring Fork side. At the Grottos climbing cliffs eight miles (14.4 km) to the west of the pass, a short trail leads to an area along the river known as the Devil's Punchbowl, with high stone cliffs on either side and waterfalls. It is a popular swimming hole due to its deep and cool waters. The river is popular with anglers casting for trout as well, and some even make the hike from the pass up to Blue Lake for its lake and cutthroat trout stocks.

Four miles (6.4 km) west of the pass is the site of Independence, the village whose establishment on July 4 led to the pass's current name. It has been a ghost town since the early 20th century. In 1973 it was listed on the National Register of Historic Places. Most of its buildings were cannibalized for their building supplies, but a few log cabins remain. The Aspen Historical Society, in conjunction with the U.S. Forest Service, built an interpretive trail with plaques.

In 2011 the USA Pro Cycling Challenge bicycle race around Colorado was held for the first time. A 131 mi stage from Gunnison to Aspen was routed over both Cottonwood and Independence passes. Spectators were allowed to camp at the pass; their impact on the pass's environment led to a ban on camping within 10 miles (16 km) of it for the following year's event. The Forest Service posted signs reminding spectators at the pass of the fragility of the surrounding tundra

Travel advisories and restrictions
The Colorado Department of Transportation (CDOT) restricts the use of Highway 82 through the pass. Most significant is the winter closure. The road is typically closed after the first significant winter snowfall, or by November 7 at the latest (but there have been exceptions. ). CDOT tries to reopen just before Memorial Day weekend in late May, the traditional beginning of summer in the United States, when enough of the accumulated snowpack has melted to make it possible to clear and repair the road. Some years, after light winters, the pass has reopened as early as May 12. Two gates, just east of Aspen on the west end and west of the remaining buildings of the stage stop of Everett on the east, prevent motor vehicles from passage. When the road is closed, Aspen is isolated from the east and Highway 82 up the valley from Glenwood Springs becomes the only vehicular access to the city during its busy ski season. Even when the pass is open, not all vehicles may use the road. Oversized and overweight vehicles are prohibited from the pass, as are all vehicles or vehicle combinations longer than 35 ft regardless of weight or size. This precludes use of the pass by tractor trailers, buses, and recreational vehicles.

Some truck drivers use the pass despite the prohibition. They are generally either unaware of the restriction and following routes plotted by their GPS devices, or aware of it and willing to risk the fine for the sake of the time and distance saved. The resulting accidents have sometimes forced the closure of the pass. CDOT put up larger signs advising drivers of the ban and worked with GPS device manufacturers so their software notes the restriction. Aspen officials have suggested increasing the fines as a deterrent. Driving through the pass is challenging. Both approaches require 6% grades due to the height of the pass, and require navigating hairpin turns with advisory speeds of 10 mph (15 km/h). Rockfalls, particularly on the approach from Aspen, have narrowed some sections to a single lane 12 feet (4 m) wide with temporary traffic lights. On the Twin Lakes approach, they have resulted in temporary closures. Other vehicles frequently enter the road unexpectedly at the many parking areas for campgrounds and other recreational attractions, and bicyclists make frequent use of Highway 82 as well. Lastly, the weather at the pass can be unpredictable and vary considerably from conditions in either Aspen or Twin Lakes. There may be thunderstorms on otherwise clear days, and snow can occur at any time of the year. CDOT advises anyone coming to the pass for outdoor recreation to take precautions against the effects of the high altitude and the changeable weather.

Independence Pass Foundation
Since the days of the stage road avalanches and rockfalls often forced closures of the highway, partly due to the massive disturbance of the land during the road's construction. No attempt was made to remedy this until shortly after the automobile road was built. In the 1930s, as a relief project during the Great Depression, a crew from the Civilian Conservation Corps replanted the slopes around Independence, by then abandoned for two decades.

At that time, Aspen was a faded mining town whose population had dwindled to fewer than a thousand. Later in the decade the first efforts to develop a ski resort began. They continued after World War II, and in the later decades of the 20th century the city began to grow again. Other than paving the road, CDOT was unable to undertake any significant improvements to the highway corridor due to its projects elsewhere in the state and the requirement to coordinate efforts with the Forest Service, which owns most of the damaged land.

Beginning in 1976, Bob Lewis, an environmental activist in Aspen, organized revegetation efforts on some sections of the pass near the road that were having serious erosion problems. He realized eventually that a dedicated nonprofit organization would be a better way to address the many issues that remained. The Independence Pass Foundation (IPF) was established in 1989. Its first project, coordinated with the Forest Service, CDOT and Pitkin County, was the reconstruction of a curve near the popular Weller Lake trailhead.

The success of the Weller Curve project cleared the way for work on the Top Cut, the 1.5 mi stretch just below the summit on the western side, which includes the most seriously eroded slopes anywhere in the pass corridor. Lewis had always intended to focus the IPF's efforts on it, and the organization began the first of several ongoing projects there in 1996. Work included the construction of stone retaining walls as well as revegetation. By the 2010s the results were evident.

With the success of these projects, IPF has been doing revegetation projects along the road below the Top Cut since 2004. Compost blankets were applied to large sections of the soil to replace lost nutrients. In 2009 the foundation began removing metal and rebar snow fences embedded in the soil just below the pass summit during the 1960s as part of an abortive project to increase meltwater capture by the Twin Lakes Tunnel. According to the IPF, they were an aesthetic blight as well as an environmental problem, and had to be removed using a team of mules and helicopters due to the wilderness area restrictions. The last fence material was removed in 2012.

IPF has undertaken other projects to promote awareness of the work that needs to be done at the pass to protect its distinctive environment. Groups from local schools have spent a day up in the pass working and learning. Many have adopted the same sites and work on them with a new class each year. Along with the Aspen Center for Environmental Studies, the foundation also cosponsors a "My Independence" all-day walking tour of the pass for adults that covers ecological topics in depth.

Since 1994, the foundation has held a 'Ride for the Pass' charity bicycle race in May, just before CDOT reopens the pass. The event serves as an outreach event and fundraiser. It follows a 9.5 mi route from the gate east of Aspen to the Independence townsite, climbing 2500 ft in the process. By 2012, the IPF had canceled the event twice due to poor weather.

title: Independence Pass (Colorado)


text:
Talk:Red Shoe Diaries

Untitled
i removed the tv and porn stub designations to this article since it is not a stub anymore (in my opinion anyway.) the article is still rather short but i feel complete. uri budnik 06:11, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Red Shoe Diaries.jpg
Image:Red Shoe Diaries.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 23:12, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Movies
This article suggests that the Red Shoe movies were stand-alone films independent of the TV show. Except for the movies Red Shoe Diaries (1992) and Red Shoe Diaries: Las Vegas (2006), all of the numbered movies were DVDs that compiled three episodes each. So the movies section, to be informative, should list the films compiled in each numbered Red Shoe movie. Deanbrockton (talk) 06:25, 10 May 2017 (UTC)

 * There does not seem to be any articles covering the Red Shoes movies at all!!!--WickerGuy (talk) 18:28, 10 October 2020 (UTC)

 * PREPOSTEROUS. Snarevox (talk) 17:39, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

Stars
Should we list the stars of each episode ?

In particular, which actresses get their kit off ? -- Beardo 05:34, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

"get their kit off.." just sounds a bit too... classy and refined for the everyday wikipedia reader, and i just dont think its all that necessary.

Snarevox (talk) 17:38, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

Synopses
More importantly than stars, can we get a synopsis of each episode? --70.23.19.31 (talk) 03:09, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

More importantly, how about accurate info, hmm? You've got an external link right to IMDB and mention channels that show it and provide more accurate info but your list of episodes is short and off. Me, I'm not bold, I just thought your episode list looked off. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.137.207.191 (talk) 23:52, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

title: Talk:Red Shoe Diaries


text:
File:Bravewords.jpg

Fair use in Brave Words
Cover of The Chills' album Brave Words. Only to be used for the article on the album - this complies with all points of Wikipedia's policy on non-free cover art, as per criterion I1 of Non-free content.

There is No free equivalent. The image is not used in a manner that is likely to replace the original market role of the original copyrighted media. It has minimal usage. As cover art, it automatically has previous publication. It meets Wikipedia's content requirements and is encyclopedic. It meets Wikipedia's image-use policy. It is used in at least one article and is only used in articles. Its presence significantly increases readers' understanding of the topic, and its omission would be detrimental to that understanding.

This description page contains an attribution, a copyright tag and the name of the article for which fair use is claimed.

Actually, it has had all of those for quite a while, but I just thought I'd spell things out more thoroughly since some bots are getting vindictively prissy about how they interpret such things, despite them being adequately covered by Wikipedia's policies. As such, such bots should have their licences revoked.

title: File:Bravewords.jpg