text:
Pithom

Pithom (pr-jtm; ; or Ἡρώωνπόλις Hērṓōnpólis, and Πατούμος Patoúmos) was an ancient city of Egypt. References in the Hebrew Bible and ancient Greek and Roman sources exist for this city, but its exact location remains somewhat uncertain. Some scholars identified it as the later archaeological site of Tell el-Maskhuta (تل المسخوطة). Others identified it as the earlier archaeological site of Tell El Retabeh (تل الرتابة).

Etymology
The English name comes from Hebrew Pithom which was taken from the Egyptian toponym pr-(j)tm, "House of Atum". Atum's cult center was in Heliopolis.

Biblical Pithom
Pithom is one of the cities which, according to the Book of Exodus, was built for the biblical Pharaoh of the oppression by the forced labour of the Israelites. The other city was Pi-Ramesses. The Septuagint adds a third, "On, which is Heliopolis." These cities are called by a term rendered in the Authorized Version "treasure cities" and in the Revised Version "store cities" (מסכְּנוֹת֙). The Septuagint renders it πόλεις ὀχυραί "strong [or "fortified"] cities." The same term is used for certain cities of King Solomon in I Kings 9:19 (comp. also II Chronicles 16:4).

Graeco-Roman Heroöpolis
Heroöpolis was a large city east of the Nile Delta, situated near the mouth of the Royal Canal which connected the Nile with the Red Sea. Although not immediately upon the coast, but nearly due north of the Bitter Lakes, Heroöpolis was of sufficient importance, as a trading station, to confer its name upon the arm of the Red Sea which runs up the Egyptian mainland as far as Arsinoë (near modern Suez)—the modern Gulf of Suez. It was the capital of the 8th nome of Lower Egypt.

Location
Early on, the location of Pithom—just like the locations of other similar sites, such as Tanis—had been the subject of much conjecture and debate.

The 10th-century Jewish scholar Saadia Gaon identified Pithom's location in his Judeo-Arabic translation of the Hebrew Bible as the Faiyum, 100 km southwest of Cairo.

Édouard Naville and Flinders Petrie were looking for Pithom along the Wadi Tumilat, an arable strip of land serving as the ancient transit route between Egypt and Canaan across the Sinai—the biblical 'Way of Shur'.

Tell El Retaba
Eight miles west of Tell El Maskhuta is the site of Tell El Retabeh. This is approximately the midpoint of Wadi Tumilat. The earliest find known from the site is the jasper weight of king Nebkaure Khety, but such an object might have been brought from elsewhere. Naville identified all these locations as being in the region of Tjeku (Sukkot), the 8th Lower Egypt nome.

Excavations at the Tell El Retabeh have shown that the site was first settled during the Second Intermediate Period of Egypt. Following the expulsion of the Hyksos during the reign of Ahmose I, a short-lived Egyptian settlement followed but ended in the middle of the 18th Dynasty. At the beginning of the 19th Dynasty of Egypt, a newer settlement was established, and Ramesses II built new fortifications, a Temple of Atum and many other structures. The site was inhabited also under the 20th Dynasty, the Third Intermediate Period (11th–7th century BC) and the Late Period (7th–4th century BC).

Some scholars, such as Manfred Bietak and Kenneth Kitchen, have argued that this was the ancient Pithom. This opinion goes back to the 19th century, when Alan Gardiner first identified Pithom with the site of Tell El Retaba, and this was later accepted by William F. Albright, and Kenneth Kitchen. Although John van Seters and Neil Asher Silberman argue that Tell El Retaba was unoccupied during the period when we find monuments relating to a town called Pithom, this claim has been disputed by James K. Hoffmeier and Gary Rendsburg based on recent findings at the site.

The joint Polish-Slovak expedition has carried out a systematic research at Tell El Retaba since 2007. It is conducted with the cooperation of several institutions: Institute of Archaeology University of Warsaw, the Polish Centre of Mediterranean Archaeology University of Warsaw, the Slovak Academy of Sciences and the Aigyptos Foundation.

More recent analyses have demonstrated that the designation for the temple of Atum, pr-itm, can be found in inscriptions at both sites—both at Tell El Retaba and at Tell El Maskhuta. This seems to demonstrate that the name 'Pithom' was used originally for the earlier site, Tell El Retaba, before it was abandoned. When the newer city of Tel El Maskhuta was built, the same name was applied to it as well, as the temple of Atum was moved to El Maskhuta. Thus, in effect, 'Pithom' was moved to a new location, a phenomenon that is attested for some other cities as well, such as Migdol.

Wadi Tumilat Project – Tell El Maskhuta
In the spring of 1883, Naville believed he had identified Pithom as the archaeological site Tell El Maskhuta. The site of Pithom, as identified by Naville, is at the eastern edge of Wadi Tumilat, southwest of Ismailia. Petrie agreed with this identification. John S. Holladay Jr., a more recent investigator of the site, also supports this opinion. Alternatively, the recent Italian excavators have suggested identifying the site as the ancient city of Tjeku (Biblical Sukkot).

Here was found a group of granite statues representing Ramesses II, two inscriptions naming Pr-Itm (Temple of Atum), storehouses and bricks made without straw. Recent excavations have also uncovered a significant New Kingdom tomb at the site. The excavations carried on by Naville for the Egypt Exploration Fund uncovered a city wall, a ruined temple, and the remains of a series of brick buildings with very thick walls and consisting of rectangular chambers of various sizes, opening only at the top and without any entrances to one another.

Modern excavations at Tel El Maskhuta were carried out by the University of Toronto 'Wadi Tumilat Project' under the direction of John S. Holladay Jr. They worked over five seasons between 1978 and 1985. These excavations have shown that the history of Tel El Maskhuta is quite complex. There was a Middle Bronze IIB settlement there (18th–17th centuries BC), associated with the Hyksos, followed by a long break until the late 7th century BC, when there was rebuilding.

This construction at the end of the 7th century may have been carried out by Pharaoh Necho II, possibly as part of his uncompleted canal building project from the Nile to the Gulf of Suez.

title: Pithom


text:
User talk:2514~enwiki

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Your account will be renamed
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The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

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Renamed
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ArbCom elections are now open!
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title: User talk:2514~enwiki


text: Category:Igbo religion

title: Category:Igbo religion


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kjetil

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was transwiki to Wiktionary moink 08:41, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

Kjetil
This is a dictionary definition of a Norwegian personal name (apparently it means "Kettle" or "War-like spirit"). The external image linked is graph with virtually no titleing, it shows "Kjetil" as a percentage (of what I don't know) over time since about 1800. I don't know if either the English or Norwegian Wikitionaries would be interested in this? Thryduulf 20:18, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Transwiki to Wiktionary and then delete here. --Angr/comhrá 21:09, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Transwiki. Megan1967 03:57, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.

title: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kjetil


text:
User talk:ExAstris

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Zzyzx11 | Talk 20:19, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

title: User talk:ExAstris


text:
Pisidia

Pisidia (Πισιδία, Pisidía; Pisidya) was a region of ancient Asia Minor located north of Pamphylia, northeast of Lycia, west of Isauria and Cilicia, and south of Phrygia, corresponding roughly to the modern-day province of Antalya in Turkey. Among Pisidia's settlements were Antioch in Pisidia, Termessos, Cremna, Sagalassos, Etenna, Neapolis, Selge, Tyriacum, Laodiceia Katakekaumene, Adada (Pisidia) and Philomelium.

Geography
Although Pisidia is close to the Mediterranean Sea, the warm climate of the south cannot pass the height of the Taurus Mountains. The climate is too dry for timberland, but crop plants grow in areas provided with water from the mountains, whose annual average rainfall is c. 1000 mm on the peaks and 500 mm on the slopes. This water feeds the plateau. The Pisidian cities, mostly founded on the slopes, benefited from this fertility. The irrigated soil is very suitable for growing fruit and for husbandry.

Early history
The area of Pisidia has been inhabited since the Paleolithic age, with some settlements known from historical times ranging in age from the eighth to third millennium BC.

Late Bronze and Iron Ages
The ancestors of the classical Pisidians were likely present in the region before the 14th century BC, when Hittite records refer to a mountain site of "Salawassa", identified with the later site of Sagalassos. At that time, Pisidia appears to have been part of the region the Hittites called Arzawa. The Pisidian language is poorly known, but is assumed to be a member of the Anatolian branch of Indo-European languages.

There is a lacuna (gap) in the text of Herodotus (7.76), but it is doubtful to surmise a reference to the Pisidians in that passage. There can be little doubt that the Pisidians and Pamphylians were the same people, but a distinction between the two seems to have been established at an early period. Herodotus, who does not mention the Pisidians, enumerates the Pamphylians among the nations of Asia Minor, while Ephorus mentions them both, correctly including the one among the nations on the interior, the other among those of the coast. Pamphylia early received colonies from Greece and other lands, and from this cause, combined with the greater fertility of their territory, became more civilized than its neighbor in the interior. Pisidia remained a wild, mountainous region, and one of the most difficult for outside powers to rule.

As far back as the Hittite period, Pisidia was host to independent communities not under the Hittite yoke. Known for its warlike factions, it remained largely independent of the Lydians, and even the Persians, who conquered Anatolia in the 6th century BC, and divided the area into satrapies for greater control, were unable to cope with constant uprisings and turmoil.

Hellenistic period
Alexander the Great had a somewhat better fortune, conquering Sagalassos on his way to Persia, though the city of Termessos defied him. After Alexander died, the region became part of territories of Antigonus Monophthalmus, and possibly Lysimachus of Thrace, after which Seleucus I Nicator, founder of the Seleucid Dynasty of Syria, took control of Pisidia. Under the Seleucids, Greek colonies were founded at strategically important places and the local people Hellenised. Even so, the Hellenistic kings were never in complete control, in part because Anatolia was contested between the Seleucids, the Attalids of Pergamon, and the Galatians, invading Celts from Europe. The cities in Pisidia were among the last in western Anatolia to fully adopt Greek culture and to coin their own money.

Pisidia officially passed from the Seleucids to the Attalids as a result of the Treaty of Apamea, forced on Antiochos III of Syria by the Romans in 188 BC. After Attalos III, the last king of Pergamon, bequeathed his kingdom to Rome in 133 BC as the province of Asia, Pisidia was given to the Kingdom of Cappadocia, which proved unable to govern it. The Pisidians cast their lot with pirate-dominated Cilicia and Pamphylia until the Roman rule was restored in 102 BC.

In 39 BC Marcus Antonius entrusted Pisidia to the Galatian client king Amyntas and charged him with suppressing a people of the Taurus Mountains known as the Homonadesians, who sometimes controlled the roads connecting Pisidia to Pamphylia.

Roman and Byzantine rule
After king Amyntas of Galatia was killed in the struggle in 25 BC, Rome made Pisidia part of the new province of Galatia. The Homonadesians were finally wiped out in 3 BC.

During the Roman period Pisidia was colonized with veterans of its legions to maintain control. For the colonists, who came from poorer parts of Italy, agriculture must have been the area's main attraction. Under Augustus, eight such colonies were established in Pisidia, and Antioch and Sagalassos became the most important cities. The province was gradually Latinised. Latin remained the formal language of the area until the end of the 3rd century.

Pisidia became an important early Christian centre. Paul the Apostle preached in Antioch on his first journey. He also visited the area in his second and third journeys. After the Emperor Constantine's legalization of Christianity in 311, Antioch in Pisidia (which has various namesakes, including the Patriarchate in Syria) played an important role as the Christian metropolitan see as well as being the capital of the civil province of Pisidia. Most Pisidian cities were heavily fortified at that time due to civil wars and foreign invasions.

The area was devastated by an earthquake in 518, a plague around 541–543, and another earthquake and Arab raids in the middle of the 7th century. After the Muslim conquest of Syria disrupted the trade routes, the area declined in importance. In the 8th century the raids increased. In the 11th century the Seljuk Turks captured the area and founded the Seljuk Sultanate in Central Anatolia. Pisidia frequently changed hands between the Byzantine Empire and the Turks. In 1176, Sultan Kılıçarslan defeated Manuel Komnenos in the Battle of Myriocephalon (thousand heads).

Notable people

 * George of Pisidia (7th century) - Byzantine poet

title: Pisidia


text:
Reference class problem

In statistics, the reference class problem is the problem of deciding what class to use when calculating the probability applicable to a particular case.

For example, to estimate the probability of an aircraft crashing, we could refer to the frequency of crashes among various different sets of aircraft: all aircraft, this make of aircraft, aircraft flown by this company in the last ten years, etc. In this example, the aircraft for which we wish to calculate the probability of a crash is a member of many different classes, in which the frequency of crashes differs. It is not obvious which class we should refer to for this aircraft. In general, any case is a member of very many classes among which the frequency of the attribute of interest differs. The reference class problem discusses which class is the most appropriate to use.

More formally, many arguments in statistics take the form of a statistical syllogism:

 * 1) $$X$$ proportion of $$F$$ are $$G$$
 * 2) $$I$$ is an $$F$$
 * 3) Therefore, the chance that $$I$$ is a $$G$$ is $$X$$

$$F$$ is called the "reference class" and $$G$$ is the "attribute class" and $$I$$ is the individual object. How is one to choose an appropriate class $$F$$?

In Bayesian statistics, the problem arises as that of deciding on a prior probability for the outcome in question (or when considering multiple outcomes, a prior probability distribution).

History
John Venn stated in 1876 that "every single thing or event has an indefinite number of properties or attributes observable in it, and might therefore be considered as belonging to an indefinite number of different classes of things", leading to  problems with how to assign probabilities to a single case. He used as an example the probability that John Smith, a consumptive Englishman aged fifty, will live to sixty-one.

The name "problem of the reference class" was given by Hans Reichenbach, who wrote, "If we are asked to find the probability holding for an individual future event, we must first incorporate the event into a suitable reference class. An individual thing or event may be incorporated in many reference classes, from which different probabilities will result."

There has also been discussion of the reference class problem in philosophy and in the life sciences, e.g., clinical trial prediction.

Legal applications
Applying Bayesian probability in practice involves assessing a prior probability which is then applied to a likelihood function and updated through the use of Bayes' theorem. Suppose we wish to assess the probability of guilt of a defendant in a court case in which DNA (or other probabilistic) evidence is available. We first need to assess the prior probability of guilt of the defendant. We could say that the crime occurred in a city of 1,000,000 people, of whom 15% meet the requirements of being the same sex, age group and approximate description as the perpetrator. That suggests a prior probability of guilt of 1 in 150,000. We could cast the net wider and say that there is, say, a 25% chance that the perpetrator is from out of town, but still from this country, and construct a different prior estimate. We could say that the perpetrator could come from anywhere in the world, and so on.

Legal theorists have discussed the reference class problem particularly with reference to the Shonubi case. Charles Shonubi, a Nigerian drug smuggler, was arrested at JFK Airport on Dec 10, 1991, and convicted of heroin importation. The severity of his sentence depended not only on the amount of drugs on that trip, but the total amount of drugs he was estimated to have imported on seven previous occasions on which he was not caught. Five separate legal cases debated how that amount should be estimated. In one case, "Shonubi III", the prosecution presented statistical evidence of the amount of drugs found on Nigerian drug smugglers caught at JFK Airport in the period between Shonubi's first and last trips. There has been debate over whether that is the (or a) correct reference class to use, and if so, why.

Other legal applications involve valuation. For example, houses might be valued using the data in a database of house sales of "similar" houses. To decide on which houses are similar to a given one, one needs to know which features of a house are relevant to price. Number of bathrooms might be relevant, but not the eye color of the owner. It has been argued that such reference class problems can be solved by finding which features are relevant: a feature is relevant to house price if house price covaries with it (it affects the likelihood that the house has a higher or lower value), and the ideal reference class for an individual is the set of all instances which share with it all relevant features.

title: Reference class problem


text:
Talk:International cricket

England v Zimbabwe, 2003 World Cup
I recall there were death threats against the English team, but I've forgotten what happened here, can someone add it?dramatic 20:20, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Proposed move
I have already raised this at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cricket but previously forgot to mention it here. I am proposing a page move. International cricket currently redirects to Structure of international cricket, but I think it makes sense to move the latter to the former (i.e. the article should cover all aspects of international cricket, not just structure). However, the presence of the redirect means that an admin is required to do the move. Are there any objections to this move, before I request it? Thanks. --Jameboy (talk) 00:13, 30 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Page move completed. I was wrong, no admin intervention was required. --Jameboy (talk) 20:13, 4 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Correction - the page move seemed to be successful but only the talk page got moved. Have flagged for admin attention. --Jameboy (talk) 23:46, 4 November 2012 (UTC)

External links modified
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"International Cricket in 2024-25" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect International Cricket in 2024-25 and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  J947  † edits 03:29, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

"International cricket in 2024" listed at Redirects for discussion
The redirect [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=International_cricket_in_2024&redirect=no International cricket in 2024] has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at until a consensus is reached.  J947  † edits 22:15, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:International cricket


text:
User talk:Pbook8989

(Sorry, I guess nobody has given you the standard welcome message yet, so here it is...)

Welcome!

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!
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Zzyzx11 | Talk 20:22, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

AAL5
Hello Becarlson,

I'll add my 'Welcome' to the above (and thanks to Zzyzxll) for getting in way before me. As you've found out, I'm a sporadic contributor myself, so apologies for taking a while to reply. Many thanks for the AAL5 article, which I was happy to Wikify as an excellent (in my opinion) contribution. I hope you didn't object to any of my edits. WLD 09:32, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

For more information on using images, see the following pages:
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This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. If you need help on selecting a tag to use, or in adding the tag to the image description, feel free to post a message at Media copyright questions. 21:08, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Rename
You've been renamed, enjoy. -- Pakaran 03:33, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

title: User talk:Pbook8989


text:
Talk:Coutts & Co

In my view the three pages named Coutts Bank, Coutts & Co and Coutts and Company should be deleted, since all the relevant information is contained in the considerably more complete article: Coutts. Within the UK, Coutts & Co is much more commononly referred to as just "Coutts", and that would seem a more appropriate way of describing the entry in the encyclopedia. Sir George Athelstone II 21:42, 9 September 2005 (UTC)

In 1987 a Swiss company was formed. anyone a better explanation? --Vamp:Willow 20:22, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

title: Talk:Coutts & Co


text: User talk:69.165.41.109

title: User talk:69.165.41.109


text: Category:Polish attack aircraft

title: Category:Polish attack aircraft


text:
Talk:Cyc

Reads like an advert
I marked this article with the Advert template because I think it violates the NPOV and encyclopedic style. Some illustrative quotes:

"The need for a massive symbolic artificial intelligence project of this kind was born in the early 1980s."

"There have been over a hundred successful applications of Cyc"

"It is based on the experience that we often have thought we understood something, but only really understood it after we had to explain or teach it to someone else."

Despite the name, the whole "Criticisms" section is somewhat positive towards Cyc.

This seems to be mostly due to a single user who added large amounts of promotional-sounding edits both to this page and the page for Douglas Lenat in 2017. Brambleboy (talk) 05:02, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Cyc


text: User talk:69.33.238.98

title: User talk:69.33.238.98


text:
Ibos

Ibos may refer to:

 * The Igbo or Ibo people, an ethnic group of Nigeria
 * Ibos, a commune of the Hautes-Pyrénées département, in southwestern France.

title: Ibos


text:
Iben Hjejle

Iben Hjejle (22 March 1971) is a Danish actress, notable for starring in the Stephen Frears film High Fidelity (2000). In Denmark, she is perhaps best known for appearing in the Danish television sitcom Langt fra Las Vegas (Far from Las Vegas) and playing the girlfriend of Danish comedian Casper Christensen, her former real life partner. She also plays Christensen's girlfriend in the sitcom Klovn (Clown) and the title role in the TV crime series Dicte.

Career
Iben Hjejle has starred in a range of Danish movies, including a Dogme 95 film and Danish-produced action films such as Old Men in New Cars. She played the Swedish Queen Sofia Magdalena in SVT's successful period drama production of The Marriage of Gustav III (2001).

Hjejle also appeared in such films as Portland (1996), Mifune's Last Song (1999), The Emperor's New Clothes (2002), and in Dreaming of Julia and Flickering Lights, both in 2003.

For her performance in Mifune's Last Song, she won an Honourable Mention at the 49th Berlin International Film Festival. She was discovered by British director Stephen Frears at this same festival.

He offered her a part in his film High Fidelity (2000), in which she played Laura, girlfriend of John Cusack's character. In 2008 Frears offered her a part in Chéri, in a cameo as Marie Laure. This was part of a kind of international comeback for her. That same year she also worked on Defiance with Daniel Craig. In 2009 she filmed The Eclipse, which received a limited theatrical release in 2010.

Hjejle was for three seasons a part of the Danish popular television series Anna Pihl until it ended in April 2008. In 2012, she was cast as the lead in the crime show Dicte The show debuted in early 2013, and while its reviews were mixed, Hjejle received good reviews for her performance.

She had a part in Lars von Trier's Direktøren for det hele (2006, also known as The Boss of It All).

In June 2024, Hjejle received a Reumert Award for the Lead Actor of the Year for her performace in Lægen (The Doctor) at Folketeatret.

Personal life
Hjejle was born in Copenhagen. From 1996 to 1999, she was married to Emil de Waal.

title: Iben Hjejle


text:
Pinerolo

Pinerolo (Pinareul ; Pignerol; Pineròl) is a town and comune in the Metropolitan City of Turin, Piedmont, northwestern Italy, 40 km southwest of Turin on the river Chisone. The Lemina torrent has its source at the boundary between Pinerolo and San Pietro Val di Lemina.

History
Archaeological remains found in the center of Pinerolo in the early 1970s testify the human presence in the area in prehistoric times Remains of the Roman necropolis of Dama Rossa, found during works for the Pinerolo-Turin highway in 2003, show that the area at the time was the seat of agricultural activities

The toponym of Pinerolo appears only in the Middle Ages, in an imperial diplom dating from 981, by which Otto II confirmed its possession, within the March of Turin, to the Bishops of Turin. The town of Pinerolo was one of the main crossroads in Italy, and was therefore one of the principal fortresses of the dukes of Savoy. Its military importance was the origin of the well-known military school that still exists today. The fortress of Fenestrelle is nearby. Later, Pinerolo was ruled by the abbot nullius of Pinerolo, who ran the abbey of Abbadia Alpina, even after the city had established itself as a municipality (1247) under the government of Thomas II of Savoy.

From 1235, Amadeus IV of Savoy exercised over the town a kind of protectorate, which became absolute in 1243, and was continued thereafter by either the House of Savoy, or its cadet-branch, the House of Savoy-Acaia.

When French troops invaded Piedmont (1536), Pinerolo was conquered; it remained under French control until 1574. It fell again to France in 1631 with the treaty of Cherasco.

France agreed to hand Pinerolo back to the house of Savoy under the Treaty of Turin (1696), with the conditions that its stronghold's fortifications be demolished and that Savoy withdraw from the League of Augsburg against Louis XIV.

Economy
The economy of the Waldensian Valleys (right slope of Val Chisone, Valle Germanasca and Val Pellice) and of the plain between these valleys and the Po (river) course revolves around Pinerolo.

Several industries have their base in this area, particularly mechanical, paper making, chemical and textile industries, and also absorb manpower from the nearby population centers.

The leading companies are Freudenberg Sealing Technologies (former Corcos), which produces seals for rotating shafts and valves sterns, Raspini, a meat processing company, TN Italy (former NN Inc.), which manufactures ball bearings, the Trombini Group (ex Annovati), which supplies the furniture industry with chipboard, and PMT Italia, which supplies the pulp and paper industry with paper machines. Moreover, Pinerolo is the trade center of the surrounding mountain area. The agriculture and the breeding of the livestock are conducted with advanced techniques. Pinerolo is the centre of the community called Comunità Montana Pinerolese Pedemontano, and the reference city for three valleys: Val Chisone, Val Pellice and Val Lemina.

Pinerolo is famous for being the house city of the first society of mutual help, foundend in 1848. Today, it is still active and also hosts a museum, the Museo Storico del Mutuo Soccorso with historic archives and a library. Health assistance is guaranteed by the Civil Hospital of Pinerolo Ospedale E. Agnelli and by a network of public and private health assistance centres. The Public assistance is inserted in the bigger frame of the Local Sanitary Company (or Azienda Sanitaria Locale ASL TO3).

Main sights

 * Pinerolo Cathedral: 9th century Roman Catholic church with a Romanesque bell tower and a Gothic façade (restored after the 1808 earthquake)
 * San Maurizio: Gothic style church
 * Galup factory, which is famous for the local sweets and cake
 * Historical center
 * Train station
 * Town hall
 * Historic Museum of Mutual Help
 * Museum of Chivalry
 * Santuario della Madonna delle Grazie

People
People born in Pinerolo include:
 * Lidia Poët (1855-1949), the first Italian female lawyer and an important figure in female emancipation
 * Luigi Facta (1861-1930), politician, journalist and last Prime Minister of Italy before the dictatorship of Benito Mussolini
 * Ferruccio Parri (1890-1981), partisan and politician who served as Prime Minister of Italy for several months in 1945
 * Patrizia Polliotto (1962-), Italian corporate lawyer, entrepreneur
 * Fabio Miretti (2003-), professional football player who currently plays as a midfielder for club Juventus

People who died here include:
 * Anna Canalis di Cumiana (1680-1769) (morganatic spouse of King Victor Amadeus) died in the convent here.
 * Nicolas Fouquet, marquis de Belle-Île, vicomte de Melun et Vaux, (1615–1680) superintendent of Finances in France under Louis XIV, was imprisoned in Pignerol from 1665 until his death in 1680.
 * David Llewellyn Snellgrove (29 June 1920 - 25 March 2016), a British Tibetologist noted for his pioneering work on Buddhism in Tibet as well as his many travelogues.
 * The "Man in the Iron Mask" was imprisoned in Pinerolo's dungeon from 1669 to 1681.
 * The Venerable Bruno Lanteri, priest and founder of the Oblates of the Virgin Mary, died here in 1830.

Sports
The venue Pinerolo Palaghiaccio hosted curling events at the 2006 Winter Olympics. The 2011 Tour de France featured a stage in the area.

The Uruguayan football team Peñarol takes its name from the Montevideo neighbourhood of Peñarol, which in turn takes its name from this town.

Twin cities

 * 🇫🇷 Gap, France, since 1963
 * 🇩🇪 Traunstein, Germany, since 1986
 * 🇦🇷 San Francisco, Argentina, since 1996
 * 🇧🇦 Derventa, Bosnia and Herzegovina, since 2005

title: Pinerolo


text:
Talk:Dorchester, Dorset

Roman baths
Dorchester also has a Roman Baths which they covered with sand and then built a shopping centre over the top of!!!!!! (unsigned) 21:24, 24 April 2005 User:62.252.192.12 (talk)

Judge Jeffreys Lodgings

 * Don't think that Judge Jeffreys Lodgings is a mediaeval building -evidence, please?HeartofaDog 00:33, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

Please explain the relationship, history:
Dorchester%2C_Dorset

Dorchester%2C_Oxfordshire

Thank You.

Hopiakuta 04:13, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Hello - there are two towns called Dorchester, in Britain. One is in the county of Oxfordshire and the other is the County Town of Dorset. I hope this helps. - Ballista 05:03, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Incorrect. Dorchester-on-Thames is a village in Oxfordshire, not a town. Dorchester is a town in Dorset. As for their relationship or connection - I have no idea. For the record, I'd describe them as in England, rather than Britain! White43 15:25, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

This article needs some revision.
I find it a little odd that this article begins with 'Roads', 'Railways' and then 'History'. Surely this should be the other way around.

There is no Anglo-Saxon history of which Dorchester was a very important part of, in fact the history section is very poor.

The Mediaeval section is laughable. Athelhampton House is in Puddletown if anywhere, not related to Dorchester. The Tolpuddle Martyrs were tried in Dorchester, and imprisoned. And Yes. Judge Jeffreys the now restaurant and former residence of the man should get a mention.

There's no mention of the Keep, Dorchester's Military history, the Roman wall at Top o' Town, Eldridge Pope Brewery(and subsequent developments), it's relationship with Fordington and The Dorchester Magpies Football Team!!

Any other ideas? I'd really like to improve this article. White43 22:42, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

"Prince charles designed the estate(of Poundbury)..."!!! Surely not, at most he helped guide the design which according to the Poundbury website (http://www.poundbury.info/) was designed for him (by architect Leon Krier) .195.75.83.25 (talk) 10:21, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Updates
I've enlarged the early history of Dorchester, regarding varying names, the Durotribes, Romans and Anglo-Saxons. White43 14:13, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

Daniel Defoe quote
Shame that appears as the header for 17th Century, when it's an 18th Century quote!!! Would be better moved somewhere else or put in an 18th Century section. White43 13:19, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

What does this mean?
"Little evidence exists to suggest continued occupation after the withdrawal of the Roman administration from Britain."
 * Was the town left empty?
 * Where the Romans immediately replaced by Saxons?
 * Or where they first replaced by Celts?
 * Was it a part of Wessex directly after the first Saxons settled or only later?
 * Oh, and "little evidence" means that there exists evidence for continued Roman occupation, just not much. I don't think that was intended? If it was, what is it? Or do you mean that some Romans remained but most left? Or that no evidence exists? Please try to be more clear. 82.139.86.4 (talk) 19:10, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

 * Little evidence = the area seems to either have diminished significantly or might have turned into a noble estate, farm, whatever. It means we don't know and it's speculation for which pretty much nobody is able to state a definite "Durnac/Durnovacia was still a major romano-british or british city when the saxons conquered it" or inversely "they took off, left it empty and moved the capital of the durotriges to the Badbury rings", and no, the celts wouldn't have replaced the romans as most of the romans of Britain were britons. 70.55.56.156 (talk) 10:19, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

The Dinosaur Museum: incomplete redirect?
Recently I have been tackling the backlog of articles requiring assessment under the Dorset WikiProject. On the Project's assessment page "The Dinosaur Museum" is listed as one of the articles which is classed as a stub, but which lacks an 'importance' rating, so I clicked on its listing in order to update the assessment, but was instead taken to this page via a redirect. Obviously "The Dinosaur Museum" no longer exists as an article, but the assessment bot used by the Project doesn't seem to be aware of this fact. Any suggestions for correcting the anomaly? PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 14:11, 16 January 2012 (UTC)
 * P.S. Interestingly, if you search directly for Talk:The Dinosaur Museum, that brings you to The Dinosaur Museum's own talk page, although if you then click on the 'Article' tab, it redirects you to Dorchester, so it's currently a talk page without an article. PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 14:15, 16 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't know if you're aware of this but you can still access the article and its history here . It was possibly an oversight by the admin who redirected the article so I've changed the rating to "class=Redirect". Barret (talk) 17:30, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for attending to this. I notice that The Dinosaur Museum's talk page still exists, albeit in a semi-mothballed state; is this normal after a redirect has been executed (excuse my ignorance)? PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 17:46, 16 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't think there is any official policy regarding talk pages of redirected articles. I used to redirect talk pages together with the article but Redirect doesn't say much apart from the bottom bullet point in this section. Barret (talk) 18:31, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

Dorchester Radio Station
One use of the Duchy owned land to the west of Dorchester (not mentioned) was for the construction of one of Guglielmo Marconi's "Beam Wireless" stations. This was, at the time it was built, a high tech piece of modern electronics, very new to rural Dorset in 1928. During its early years, in 1929, it changed ownership from Marconi to Cable & Wireless and then to the GPO in 1950. The station was part of a world wide network of stations providing communications to the USA, South America, the far east and many other locations. Its modern technology kept it in the fore front of international telecommuincations until satellite communications commenced in the 1960's. Transferring its operations to long distance ship to shore communications, it stayed in business until 1979. It had a number of important visitors in the 1930's including Marconi himself and other radio "pioneers". The distinctive Beam antennas could be seen for many miles around and several were built and renewed in its 50 year lifetime. During WW2 the station was covered in camouflage netting to hide it, at least until a large snow fall wrecked it. During that time a second transmitting station, 'B' station, with 5 extra transmitters was built in the field to the south of the station. The winter of 1947 damaged many of the antenna wires with huge ice loadings. The station employed many local people at all skill levels and provided apprenticeships to young lads. 88.111.13.122 (talk) 21:04, 23 January 2012 (UTC) Paul Hawkins

Notable people from Dorchester
I don't understand the rationale for removing the recent addition of an entry for the novelist John Cowper Powys. Can the someone explain, please? The inclusion of a writer, whose father was a clergyman in Dorchester when he was a child, and wrote a novel set in Dorchester, seems totally appropriate. Rwood128 (talk) 19:43, 1 August 2012 (UTC)

Were two novels by Hardy set in Dorchester? Rwood128 (talk) 16:43, 10 August 2012 (UTC)

Tess of the d'Urbervilles?
I don't think Tess of the d'Urbervilles is set in Dorchester. Rwood128 (talk) 22:36, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I think you're right. I've removed the statement in the article. PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 23:04, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * It's "set" all over - Bere Regis, Marnhull, Bournemouth, Stonehenge and finally (and tragically) Winchester. But note: "Hardy himself chose Gertrude Bugler, a Dorchester girl from the original Hardy Players - an amateur group from Dorchester who re-enacted Hardy’s novels - to play Tess in the first theatrical adaptation of his novel." Not sure if this is noteworthy here? Martinevans123 (talk) 23:15, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I would have thought perhaps not, though perhaps I'm just meaner than you are Martin...
 * Actually you could have added a few more places to the list of settings - Pentridge, Beaminster, Cranborne, the Frome Valley, Maiden Newton, Evershot, the Downs... am I right in thinking Dorchester/Casterbridge is one of the few places in Dorset really featured? PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 23:48, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * You could have been right. Meanwhile, a snippet from last year (100th anniversary)-: . I do hope it was good. However, sorry to disappoint, but: "The capital city of Wessex, Casterbridge, mentioned several times in Tess of the D’Urbervilles, is Hardy’s version of Dorchester." ! Martinevans123 (talk) 19:50, 3 August 2012 (UTC)
 * No disappointment here! Though of course, being is one thing....
 * I'm sure I've read that info about the resurrection of the Hardy Players before, though can't remember where. There must be an article somewhere that could accommodate those facts. I wonder if they have genuine Dorset accents? I admit that would add to the performance, though there's something about the phrase "amateur thespians" that conjures an unflattering image in my head (Miss Mountshaft and all that....). As an aside, I've often wondered if the Stereophonics used a Hardy reference in their song Have a Nice Day (as in the line that sounds to my ears like "He asked where we're from/We told him Marlott")? PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 22:11, 3 August 2012 (UTC)

Commerce
Little is so far mentioned of the commercial activities of Dorchester over the past centuries.

As the county town of Dorset, Dorchester has always been an important commercial centre for the town and surrounding villages.

Important commercial activities have included and in some cases continue:

 * The brewery of Eldridge Pope (mentioned in a separate Wiki page entry). The Eldridge Pope site is now the town's major development known as Brewery Square, comprising apartments, a square, shops and resturants. In the development plan is a 400 seat theatre, The Maltings, and a hotel.
 * Eddisons of Fordington, agricultural contractors and in the late 1800s/early 1900's had a large fleet of Steam Traction engines used for ploughing and threshing etc.
 * Lott & Walne Ltd of Fordington who, in their early years, manufactured agricultural machinery, and also had a foundry where casting were produced and many of Dorchester's drain covers were cast.
 * The market, which attracted people and agricultural products to the town for many years. It is now popular for more modern market traders. Once public transport had commenced, many of the outlying villages had bus services that ran on Wednesdays only, for the market.
 * The radio station, an important telecommuniations business set up by Marconi and mentioned elsewhere on this page.
 * Channons the automobile company, one of the first in the county to sell cars from their showrooms in High East Street.
 * The retail shopping area in South Street and surrounds, which has/had long established stores, some still in business some not. Also the street traders of South St who established a trading right many years ago, which is perhaps under threat in the future? The retail commerce of the town has always been very dynamic reflecting the continued growth and life of the town.
 * The commercial service sector. Builders, plummers, electricians, car repairs, domestic appliances etc. This had a large growth in the late 20th century with many small industrial trading units on the outskirts of the town.
 * The banks, essential for any economy.

There are probably other businesses worth a mention, perhaps someone else could add to this topic...................?

Paul Hawkins 8/12/12 79.77.226.146 (talk) 19:15, 8 December 2012 (UTC)

The Arts Centre
The Arts Centre was relocated to the Corn Exchange in 2015. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.139.218.189 (talk) 16:27, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

The West Country Challenge
Would you like to win up to £250 in Amazon vouchers for participating in The West Country Challenge?

The The West Country Challenge will take place from 8 to 28 August 2016. The idea is to create and improve articles about Bristol, Somerset, Devon, Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly, Dorset, Wiltshire and Gloucestershire, like this one.

The format will be based on Wales's successful Awaken the Dragon which saw over 1000 article improvements and creations and 65 GAs/FAs. As with the Dragon contest, the focus is more on improving core articles and breathing new life into those older stale articles and stubs which might otherwise not get edited in years. All contributions, including new articles, are welcome though.

Work on any of the items at: or other articles relating to the area.
 * Core articles
 * Missing article hotlist
 * Missing photograph hotlist

There will be sub contests focusing on particular areas:
 * Bristol (Day 1-3)
 * Cornwall and Scilly (Day 4-6)
 * Devon (Day 7-9)
 * Dorset (Day 10-12)
 * Gloucestershire (Day 13-15)
 * Somerset (Day 16-18)
 * Wiltshire (Day 19-21)

To sign up or get more information visit the contest pages at WikiProject England/The West Country Challenge.— Rod talk 16:04, 18 July 2016 (UTC)

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Coat of Arms
Is there any evidence of the linked coat of arms existing? As a someone born and raised in the town, I have never seen this coat in shield form before. The town's seal, as depicted around the town, has always been in circular form - as referenced by the Town Council's page https://www.dorchester-tc.gov.uk/About+Us/Civic+History/The+Town+Seal] Dorsetpete123 (talk) 14:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * You could well be right. If you click through to the image page on Commons you can see that this image is "Based on the town seal from and ." Neither of which supports the form shown. Would be better to get a new version drawn in round form. MichaelMaggs (talk) 15:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dorchester, Dorset


text:
User:Gavardo

Welcome!

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!
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Image copyright tags
Thanks for uploading Image:Conference13 1.jpg. I notice it currently doesn't have an image copyright tag.

Could you add one to let us know its copyright status? (You can use if you release it under the GFDL, or  if you claim fair use, etc.) If you don't know what any of this means, just let me know where you got the images and I'll tag them for you.

Thanks so much, Zzyzx11 | Talk 20:25, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

title: User:Gavardo


text:
Yushan National Park

Yushan National Park is one of the nine national parks in Taiwan and was named after the summit Yushan, the highest peak of the park. The park covers a total area of 103,121 hectares that includes large sections of the Central Mountain Range. The park contains more than thirty peaks over 3,000. m in elevation, and two-thirds of the area within the park is above 2,000. m. The elevation difference in the park is 3,600. m, and there are many canyons, cliffs, and valleys.

Because of its remote location and entry control, Yushan National Park is not among the most visited national parks in Taiwan. Even so, the park attracted 1,044,994 visitors in 2015.

Geology
Taiwan, which owes its existence to the power of plate tectonics, remains a place of regular seismic activity. Examples of geological features such as fault lines, joints, and folding can be seen throughout Yushan National Park:
 * Great Precipice (大峭壁) — Great Precipice (|Coordinates: 23.4683339 120.9396649) is located 1.2 km before Paiyun Lodge (排雲山莊) on the Yushan Trail.  A precipitous cliff with fossils of ancient marine species and a few wavy marks in the rock can still remind us of its oceanic past.
 * Scree slope at the foot of Main Peak
 * Fault scarp in Laonong (荖濃) between Main Peak and Batongguan (八通關)
 * Fuzi Cliff (父子斷崖) and Guanshan Cliff (關山斷崖)

The Southern Cross-Island Highway and the Yushan Scenic Highway both offer countless opportunities to witness the area's special geological features.

Hydrology
Yushan is an important watershed of main river systems in central, southern, and eastern Taiwan. It is the water sources of the Zhuoshui River (濁水溪), Kaoping River (高屏溪), and Siouguluan River (秀姑巒溪). The Chenyoulan (陳有蘭溪), Jyunda (郡大溪), Nanzaisian (楠梓仙溪), Laonong (荖濃溪), and Lekuleku (拉庫拉庫溪) rivers are all young rivers from Yushan with V-shaped river beds. Jinmentong cliffs (金門峒斷崖) is a unique landmark along the Chenyoulan River (陳有蘭溪). It was formed when Chenyoulan River (陳有蘭溪) cut through land traversed by a fault line, and it showcases one of the best examples of headway erosion. Jinmentong cliffs (金門峒斷崖), Yunlong Waterfall (雲龍瀑布) and Yinyu Waterfall (乙女瀑布; also known as 七絲瀑布) are some popular scenic points in the park.

Alpine lakes such as Dashueiku (大水窟), Tafen Pond (塔芬池), Jiaming Lake (嘉明湖), and Tienchih (天池) are formed from rain and melting snows in the shadows of surrounding mountain peaks. These lakes provide both visitors and animals precious water from the mountains. However, the ecosystem around them is fragile and needs further protection.

Flora
Yushan National Park is well known for its diverse climate zones and rich biodiversity. The plants found in the park span from subtropical on its foothills to alpine at its summits.

Differences in altitudes, precipitous cliffs, and plunging valleys in the Yushan National Park lend to the park highly unstable weather conditions. Temperatures can vary from warm to cold at the same time at places relatively close. While accounting for merely 3% of Taiwan's total land area, the park has half of Taiwan's native plant species growing within its boundaries. Surveys have found that there are 2,522 different kinds of plants in the park.

With increasing elevation, there are the following six vegetation zonations in the park:

Fauna
The park is home to a large variety of birds, mammals, reptiles, amphibians, and butterflies. Between the months of March and May, visitors have the chance to see processions of butterflies fluttering through mountain valleys. In the following table, it shows total different kinds of animals found in the park:

In the past, many of these species became endangered due to over-hunting; but with the establishment of the Yushan National Park, they are gradually making a comeback. Larger mammals such as the black bear, sambar deer, Taiwan macaque, and serows can sometimes be seen, and their call is often heard.

The National Park is an important nesting ground for the Taiwanese population of Mountain hawk-eagle.

Cultural heritage
Prehistoric relics, such as stone tools and pottery, found in the Wangshiang (望鄉) and Dongpu (Tungpu;東埔) areas, provide evidence of early human occupation. The Bunun (布農), an aboriginal tribe, presently inhabits the villages of Dongpu (Tungpu;東埔) and Meishan (梅山). They emigrated from the coastal plains to the mountains some 300 years ago. Another tribal people, Tsou, who live in the west of the park, have been largely assimilated by the Bunun. Displacement of aboriginals by settlers occurred during the Qing dynasty with the construction of the Batongguan Trail in 1875 for defense purposes. Some stone steps, walls and guard-posts are the remains from that past.

Eco-tourism
To promote eco-tourism, the park has established protection laws and raised public awareness of the importance of nature conservation on one hand and provided public facilities for easy access on the other hand. Public facilities provided in the park include: For public safety, a lot of bridges and wooden pathways have been installed on difficult terrain.

There are three visitor centers in the park:
 * Tataka Visitor Center
 * Nanan Visitor Center
 * Meishan Visitor Center

title: Yushan National Park


text:
Talk:Protection (Massive Attack album)

Untitled
Where is the verification for this album.--Iclaudius2 08:47, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Track 7 is given as "Euro Child" in the CD booklet.--109.193.211.159 (talk) 08:05, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

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Requested move 5 October 2016

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved doesn't require RM, see naming guidelines. In ictu oculi (talk) 12:14, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

Protection (album) → Protection (Massive Attack album) – homonymy with respect to Protection (Face to Face album). Horcrux92 (talk) 10:12, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.
 * There was no consensus reached here, and no comments besides the nomination. I moved it back per WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. If consensus decides it's not the primary topic, then I will respect that, but this is the album that has been the primary topic (see page views and Google search results) for years and in my opinion, is more notable than an album that did not chart. If you want to re-open it, that's fine, just commenting about actions taken.  Ss 112  12:43, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

 * are you proposing the other article for deletion, or are you proposing that Wikipedia's naming guidelines be changed? What are you doing? In ictu oculi (talk) 13:01, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I'm saying that you shouldn't have moved the page without consensus when somebody asked for community input. I believe I also just cited a naming guideline, WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, so I don't know where you got the impression I wanted to change a guideline. If I were proposing the other article for deletion, I would have nominated it already. I don't particularly care about it.  Ss 112  13:04, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Please read WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. I ask again, are you proposing the other article for deletion, or are you proposing that Wikipedia's naming guidelines be changed? What are you doing?  In ictu oculi (talk) 13:09, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I've read it, and I believe I just told you Google search results and page views show the Massive Attack album is the primary topic. Don't just repeat silly questions at me.  Ss 112  13:12, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * If you have read it then you have not paid attention, please re-read it. Primary topic applies to Protection, which is a dab page. In ictu oculi (talk) 13:14, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * And where does it say the primary topic cannot mean an album already disambiguated with "(album)"?  Ss 112  13:15, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Here "If no article is preferred to be the primary topic, then the disambiguation page will remain the primary landing page." In ictu oculi (talk) 13:17, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Of course this isn't preferred to be the primary album to you, hence why you're debating it? The discussion should have been had to disambiguate ie further first. This is going nowhere.  Ss 112  13:20, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * there is no such thing as "primary album". You are not a new user, you should know how titling works. In ictu oculi (talk) 13:22, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Many albums under the same title as a pre-existing album come out years later and only those are disambiguated by artist and album, leaving the original album as is. If others disagree with those, they should have a discussion, as was being done here. I will bear in mind that your interpretation is that this can't apply to articles with the title "(album)" in future, but from my reading of WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, it doesn't exclude qualified pages. If you still have an issue, please re-nominate it to be moved.  Ss 112  13:26, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * It shouldn't be needed to teach someone the basics of WP:DISAMBIGUATION: "Although a word, name or phrase may refer to more than one topic, it is sometimes the case that one of these topics is the primary topic. This is the topic to which the term should lead, serving as the title of (or a redirect to) the relevant article. If there is no primary topic, the term should be the title of a disambiguation page (or should redirect to a disambiguation page on which more than one term is disambiguated). In ictu oculi (talk) 13:28, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Look, that's great, but you're being condescending now because you think I don't know what it says when I'm telling you I'm focusing on a different part that I interpret to mean an item one considers to be primary (in this case, an album) under an already disambiguated namespace can stay there while others are only disambiguated further (as in, later albums). Also, please stop attempting to have a tandem discussion on my talk page. It isn't going to achieve anything you can't already say here.  Ss 112  13:30, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * And everyone else is wrong? Eventually other comments are going to accumulate here, and you'll be saying the same to them. But then eventually they're going to mount up, and then what, you're going to notice that the article corpus doesn't have "primary xyz" with incomplete (parentheses) in every subject area? In ictu oculi (talk) 15:46, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Actually, no, I won't be fighting this like you fought the consensus that established that the only song or album that has an article doesn't have to be disambiguated (that logic doesn't apply to this discussion, just saying). At no point did I say that the guideline explicitly said "primary album"; I said it doesn't say that and that was in conjunction with what I read on the page. I don't care anymore. If you have an issue, IIO, either request a move or start another discussion—one that doesn't involve me.  Ss 112  15:55, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * But Protection (Face to Face album) has an article. This isn't a case where content on an album is included in a band article. What are you doing here? Do you intend to propose deletion of the other album? In ictu oculi (talk) 17:14, 5 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I believe I've already said all I want to say. You're going around in circles. Goodbye.  Ss 112  17:18, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

Requested move 6 October 2016

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Move. The nominator is right, this is a mess. The governing guideline here is incomplete disambiguation: generally speaking, when a specific, disambiguated title could refer to more than one article, it's not a suitable name and should point to a dab page instead. There are exceptions to this, eg Tommy (album), but those generally come about through consensus that one topic is so much more prominent that the standard rule should be ignored. Clearly, this isn't one of those situations. Additionally, the early close on October 5 caused more confusion than it resolved; I'll remind everyone that if there's a chance that a move will be challenged by someone, it's best to let the RM process run its course. Cúchullain t/ c 14:42, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

Protection (album) → Protection (Massive Attack album) – What a mess! First it was further disambiguated without consensus soon after the first RM was started. Then someone else reverts it. I'm re-proposing on Horcrux92's behalf. George Ho (talk) 03:57, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Please just let it be known that I never actually had an issue with this being moved to Protection (Massive Attack album) if consensus established such. It was only the undiscussed move by IIO I had an issue with, as they do many of these types of moves, which then led to policies being quoted and interpreted and IIO unnecessarily posting on my talk page at least 10 times. I will post more at the Arbitration discussion.  Ss 112  05:02, 6 October 2016 (UTC)

 * Support obviously. Per WP:Naming conventions (music), WP:Disambiguation and WP:Move. Thank you for having spotted this. In ictu oculi (talk) 07:52, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
 * It's a hard case. I don't agree that there can never be such as thing as "primary sub-topic" such as a "primary album" in this case. Let me give an example. "Tommy (album) is album by The Who, very famous, and very famous over a good length of time, and also seminal such that it might be of (at least minor) interest even a century from now or longer. "Tommy (The Wedding Present album)" is a very obscure album but with (barely) enough refs to qualify for an article. Because the article "Tommy (The Wedding Present album)" exists, are we required to rename "Tommy (album)" to "Tommy (The Who album)"?

 * We're not, in my book. We're not required to do anything that doesn't make sense and serve the reader. Most people clicking on "Tommy (album)" in the search box are expecting the Who album, we assume, so we serve them that.

 * So the question is, is this case like that? To my mind, we should only deploy the concept of "primary album" when there's a clear and very large disparity between the albums, of an order of magnitude, as in the Who/Wedding Present example. I don't know enough about these bands to form an opinion yet. Massive Attack is not the Beatles, and Protection is not Sergeant Pepper. And Face to Face are not chopped liver. They actually have a longer discography than Massive Attack. On the other hand, they have apparently a much lower sales volume, and according to the article "Protection [by Massive Attack] was featured in the top ten of Rolling Stone magazine's 'Coolest Albums of All Time List'" which if true (there's no ref) sounds pretty important.

 * I guess one question to ask is "what percentage of people, on clicking on 'Protection (album)' in the search box, would be surprised and annoyed to be taken to the Massive Attack album rather than the Face to Face album?" Well according to |Protection_(Face_to_Face_album) this pageview data, for every person who reads the Face to Face album article, 30 people read the Massive Attack album article. I'm not going to vote yet, but that's a pretty big disparity, and I'd like to hear how people supporting the move address that. Herostratus (talk) 10:58, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
 * isn't the problem with having 1 exception out of 10,000 articles in any scenario that a singular exception in itself is disruptive? There are in fact four Tommy albums with articles not 2, so to have (album) on only one of them does not even help Who fans looking for the other two Who-related soundtrack and musical albums. In ictu oculi (talk) 06:53, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Exceptions are not a problem for the reader. We are here to serve the reader, who neither knows nor cares about our internal standards. Exceptions could be a problem if they are sufficiently disruptive to our internal functioning such that it materially impeded our editing process. But it would be silly to claim that is the case here. (Re the detailed particulars of that particular album, I don't have an opinion, but it's just an example.) Herostratus (talk) 14:54, 7 October 2016 (UTC)

 * Support per nomination and In ictu oculi. Upon a qualifier being appended to the main title header, there should be no further subdivision to create a putative "primary topic qualifier". Thus, Protection (album) should redirect to Protection in the same manner as Tommy (album) should redirect to Tommy, although, as usual, there was no unanimity among the participants in the lengthy discussions at Talk:Tommy (album)/Archive 2 [July 2008], Talk:Tommy (album) [August 2014] and Talk:Tommy (album). —Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 16:46, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
 * OK. It says |Tommy_(The_Wedding_Present_album) here that "Tommy (album) gets viewed 706 times a day while for "Tommy (The Wedding Present album)" it is 4 times a day. Given that, I guess my questions would be:
 * What do people clicking on "Tommy (album)" in the search box mostly expect, in your opinion?
 * Assuming that the answer is "The Who album", what goes in the blank: "But even so, when readers click on "Tommy (album)" in the search box, we unfortunately have to amaze and inconvenience them by going to Tommy, in order to serve this greater good: __________". I'm genuinely interested in what goes in the blank. I must be missing something? Herostratus (talk) 18:43, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Other Wikipedians may feel differently, but I would have no objection to "personalized redirects", formulated as Tommy album or Protection album, that would point directly towards such heavily-trafficked "prime" topics. Logically, those who have only a rudimentary familiarity with Wikipedia searches would type "Tommy" / "Protection" or "Tommy album" / "Protection album", rather than the "official" / "Wikified" forms "Tommy (album)" / "Protection (album)" which should point to the respective dab pages, thus following closely and upholding standard forms of qualifier-based disambiguation, rather than raising some qualifiers as "more equal" than others. —Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 20:16, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I think that the Wikipedia searchbox doesn't distinguish parens when filling out the the search box -- thus typing "Tommy album" will bring up "Tommy (album)" as the autosuggest and you can then click on that. That's what I meant. Herostratus (talk) 22:11, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
 * As of this writing, typing "Tommy album" will, indeed, bring up "Tommy (album)" as the autosuggest. However, if the proposed theoretical redlinks were to be actually created, then the search will display "Tommy album" above "Tommy (album)". Clicking upon Tommy album would link directly to Tommy (The Who album), while clicking upon Tommy (album) would lead to Tommy in the same manner as clicking upon Protection (album) would lead to Protection. —Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 04:25, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Maybe, but anyway all those redirects don't exist and it would take some heavy lifting to get that scheme accepted. Or, maybe better, the software could be directed "If the user types 'X Y' and hits Enter but 'X Y' does not exist but 'X (Y)' does, go to 'X '(Y)'". But again, if wishes were horses... Herostratus (talk) 14:54, 7 October 2016 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

James Brown
Why doesn't James Brown have a writer credit on the title track when he has one for "Better Things"? The samples in Protection are well known to be from a JB song and they're essential to the fabric of the entire song. Weird. I know he wouldn't have been listed as co-composer of every single track that ever sampled him, but the samples here really are part of what drives the new track. 192.121.232.253 (talk) 08:01, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

 * Oh yeah, so because the band themselves didn't list those samples in the cd booklet it means they aren't legit. You people are simply stupid. The samples exist, they're obvious and they are quite well known by people in the hiphop and r'n'b scene. Oh by the way, I thought Wiki Peeky had some RULE nixing sources provided by the person/s an article is dealing with, in their own name: the cd booklet is a typical primary source and thus picking material from it that isn't cited by an RS elsewhere should not be allaaaawed? ;)

 * Come on, now where's your secondary RS that Eurochild samples this or that track by James Bradbury? :D 195.67.149.171 (talk) 15:06, 2 April 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Protection (Massive Attack album)


text:
Surfel

Surfel is an abbreviated term for a "surface element," analogous to a "voxel" (volume element) or a "pixel" (picture element). In 3D computer graphics, the use of surfels is an alternative to polygonal modeling. An object is represented by a dense set of points or viewer-facing discs holding lighting information. Surfels are well suited to modeling dynamic geometry, because there is no need to compute topology information such as adjacency lists. Common applications are medical scanner data representation, real time rendering of particle systems, and more generally, rendering surfaces of volumetric data by first extracting the isosurface.

title: Surfel


text:
Lisa Gets an "A"

"Lisa Gets an 'A" is the seventh episode of the tenth season of the American animated television series The Simpsons. It first aired on Fox in the United States on November 22, 1998. In the episode, Lisa cheats on a test for which she fails to study and receives an A+++ grade, but becomes guilt-ridden. In the subplot, Homer buys a lobster with the intention of fattening him up to eat, but he bonds with the crustacean and keeps him as a pet named Pinchy.

"Lisa Gets an 'A was directed by Bob Anderson, and although it was written by Ian Maxtone-Graham, neither the main storyline nor the subplot was conceived by him. The main storyline was instead pitched by former staff writer Ron Hauge, while Richard Appel, who also was a staff writer, had pitched the episode's subplot for a long time. The episode satirizes educational establishments, and features a parody of the video game Crash Bandicoot.

In its original American broadcast, "Lisa Gets an 'A was seen by approximately 8 million viewers, and finished in 51st place in ratings the week it aired. Following its broadcast, a scene in the episode garnered criticism from the Catholic League, but the controversy went largely ignored by The Simpsons ' staff. The episode received very positive reviews from critics, and is considered one of the best episodes of the season.

Plot
After a long morning at church, the Simpsons go to the grocery store Eatie Gourmet's to take advantage of free samples in lieu of a Sunday brunch and Bart's suggestion that the family go Catholic so they can have "communion wafers and booze". At the store, Homer wants to buy a lobster, but since the larger ones are too expensive at $8 a pound, he decides to buy a baby lobster at $8 and fatten it up to 5lb ($40) for him to eat. Homer also tries to look for normal flavors of ice cream among the unusually named flavors at the "Ken & Harry's" factory plant, so he puts Lisa into the freezer to look for some in the back, which ultimately causes her to catch a cold.

Although Lisa hates the idea, Marge wants her to stay home from school for the next few days to recover from her cold. Lisa is derisive about playing one of Bart's video games in order to pass the time, but soon becomes addicted to it, and consequently ignores the homework on The Wind in the Willows that she is given by Ralph. She even fakes the perpetuation of her illness so that she can continue playing the game. When Marge finally compels her to return to school, Lisa realizes she is unprepared for a test on the book, having not read it. In a panic she visits Bart, who brings her to Nelson, from whom she gets the test answers. Miss Hoover grades the tests over lunch, and Lisa is awarded the rare grade of A+++. Meanwhile, Homer becomes attached to his lobster and names him Pinchy. When the time comes to cook Pinchy, Homer cannot bring himself to do it, and instead declares him a part of the family.

The family is extremely proud of Lisa's "achievement", although she is guilt-ridden at having cheated. The next day at school, Principal Skinner informs Lisa that her test grade has brought Springfield Elementary's GPA up to the state's minimum standard, and they now qualify for a basic assistance grant. Lisa admits that she cheated on the test, but Skinner and Superintendent Chalmers persuade her to keep it a secret so the school can keep the money. During the presentation, Lisa says that she understands how desperately the school needs the basic assistance grant money, but also says that the truth is more important, confessing that she cheated. The comptroller appears moved by her confession and decides the school may keep the money. After she leaves the auditorium, however, it is revealed that Skinner, Chalmers and Bart have fooled Lisa by staging a fake presentation before the real one as the "comptroller" was Otto in a rubber mask. When the real comptroller arrives, Bart manipulates a puppet of Lisa, allowing the school to keep the money. Meanwhile, Homer discovers that he has accidentally cooked Pinchy while giving him a hot bath. Later that night, a distraught Homer eats Pinchy, finding him delicious.

Production
"Lisa Gets an 'A was written by Ian Maxtone-Graham and directed by Bob Anderson. Although the episode was written by Maxtone-Graham, neither of the plots were conceived by him. The main plot involving Lisa was pitched by fellow Simpsons writer Ron Hauge, and the sub-plot involving Homer adopting a lobster was conceived by former staff writer Richard Appel. The writers found it difficult to "get the subplot go[ing]," and it took a long time to come up with the third act, according to Maxtone-Graham. The writers debated what name Homer would give his lobster. Hauge pitched that his name would be "Shelly", however they eventually settled on naming him "Pinchy". Hauge also pitched the name of the grocery store Eatie Gourmet's. At the end of the episode, when Homer is eating Pinchy, a lot of the dialogue was ad-libbed by Dan Castellaneta, who portrays Homer among other characters in the series. It took a long time for the writers to come up with an ending to the episode's main storyline. Eventually, they settled on an ending that parodied the 1973 caper film The Sting.

In real life, lobsters are black in color, turning red after being cooked. However, in "Lisa Gets an 'A, Pinchy is red throughout the whole episode. The Dash Dingo video game was difficult to animate, according to Hauge, as the animators had to "make it look less than The Simpsons style". In order to achieve the desired effect, the animators decided to pixelate the video game. The episode features the second appearance of Gavin, who first appeared in the season seven episode "Marge Be Not Proud", and "Range Rover Mom", Gavin's mother. They were both voiced by Tress MacNeille. The false Comptroller Atkins was portrayed by series regular cast member Harry Shearer, while the real Atkins was voiced by Hank Azaria, who is also a regular cast member for the series. The name of the character was based on the name of Jacqueline Atkins, a writer's assistant on The Simpsons. The episode also features Marcia Wallace, Pamela Hayden, Maggie Roswell, Russi Taylor and Karl Wiedergott.

The episode satirizes the "skewed priorities" sometimes associated with educational establishments. Even though Principal Skinner knows that Lisa cheated on her test, he "looks the other way" so that the school meets the requirements for government funding. In the DVD commentary for the episode, the episodes showrunner Mike Scully opined that "there is a lot of truth in this story[...] There are certain requirements that the school has to meet in order to get state funding, and there are things that they'd rather look the other way on if it's gonna cost them money. This does really happen."

While staying home from school, Lisa plays a video game called Dash Dingo. The video game is a spoof of the 1996 platform video game Crash Bandicoot. In a scene in the episode, Lisa imagines that she will fail the test. She imagines that the president of Harvard University, voiced by Dan Castellaneta, will be disappointed in her and recommend her to Brown University, where Otto was apparently on faculty. The scene was conceived by Maxtone-Graham, whose alma mater was Brown University. He stated that all his friends from Brown and Harvard "loved" the joke. The liqueurs Kahlua and Drambuie are mentioned in the episode by Miss Hoover. With the government-funded grant money, Springfield Elementary are able to afford a Coleco, a 1980s home computer.

Broadcast and controversy
In its original American broadcast on November 22, 1998, "Lisa Gets an 'A received an 8.0 rating, according to Nielsen Media Research, translating to approximately 8 million viewers. The episode finished in 51st place in the ratings for the week of November 16–22, 1998, tied with the ABC program Sabrina the Teenage Witch.

After its original broadcast, the episode garnered scrutiny from The Catholic League, an American Roman Catholic advocacy group. In a scene in the episode, the Simpsons are on their way home from a church service, and Bart says "I'm starving. Mom, can we go Catholic so we can get Communion wafers and booze?" To which Marge replies "No, no one is going Catholic. Three children is enough, thank you." In an issue of the Catholic League's monthly newspaper Catalyst, the organization wrote "The Fox animated TV show, The Simpsons, is loved by millions for its engaging characters. It was with regret, therefore, that we were forced to take issue with its November 22 episode ['Lisa Gets an "A]." They added that William Anthony Donohue, the current president of the organization, had sent a letter to Fox, reading "Can you possibly explain why this dialogue was included in the show?" In response, Thomas Chavez, Fox's manager for broadcast standards and practices, wrote a "lengthy" letter, in part re-printed on the same issue of Catalyst. It read:

In your letter you questioned an exchange in dialogue between Bart and his mother, Marge. Because Bart is starving, he suggests they convert to Catholicism since he is aware communion wafers and wine are dispensed in the Catholic ceremony. Just like other children that are not knowledgeable, Bart sees the wafer merely as food and wine as a forbidden drink. Because many families wait to eat after they have attended Church, it is not atypical that a child would pose a question such as this unknowingly. The writers chose not to have Marge respond to Bart’s ridiculous desire to satisfy his hunger with the Sacrament but rather, elected to have Marge respond by stating why she would not be comfortable converting to Catholicism. Her views regarding birth control are obviously contrary to the Catholic Church's belief. While Marge's response may be perceived as short and curt, it also conveys the impression that one's choice of religion is based on more than the religion's rituals.

According to Mark I. Pinsky, author of The Gospel According to The Simpsons, the Catholic League was "not persuaded" by Chavez's letter, and stated that they "sarcastically" responded in Catalyst: "Now why didn't we think of that? Just goes to show how thoughtful the Hollywood gang really is." According to Pinsky, the controversy did not have any impact on the show and was "simply ignored" by The Simpsons' staff.

Home media and critical reception
On August 7, 2007, the episode was released as part of The Simpsons: The Complete Tenth Season DVD box set. Matt Groening, Mike Scully, George Meyer, Ian Maxtone-Graham, Ron Hauge, Yeardley Smith and Mike B. Anderson participated in the DVD's audio commentary of the episode.

Following its home video release, "Lisa Gets an 'A received very positive reviews from critics.

Warren Martyn and Adrian Wood of I Can't Believe It's a Bigger and Better Updated Unofficial Simpsons Guide described it as "A fabulously defining moment in Lisa's life, showing what happens if you let your guard slip." They continued by writing "What makes this work even more is the false ending which shows that everyone in Springfield is as adept at predicting Lisa's morality as the viewers are." They concluded their review by calling it "An absolutely inspired piece of comedy."

Colin Jacobson of DVD Movie Guide wrote that he "[took] great delight in the way this episode skewers the skewed priorities of the educational establishment." He added that "Lisa acts like her usual prissy self, but that factor acts to allow the show to succeed." He concluded by writing that the episode "connects to real emotions pretty well and offers some funny moments."

Digital Entertainment New's Jake McNeill described it as one of the season's best episodes, giving particular praise to its subplot, which he called "great".

James Plath of DVD Town wrote that "the real fun in this episode comes from Homer's attachment to a lobster he brings home."

title: Lisa Gets an "A"