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Pope Gelasius

Pope Gelasius can refer to:

 * Pope Gelasius I, in office 492–496
 * Pope Gelasius II, in office 1118–1119

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Pope Gelasius


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Northern Seven Years' War

The Northern Seven Years' War (also known as the Nordic Seven Years' War, the First Northern War, the Seven Years' War of the North or the Seven Years War in Scandinavia) was fought between the Kingdom of Sweden and a coalition of Denmark–Norway, Lübeck, and Poland–Lithuania between 1563 and 1570. The war was motivated by the dissatisfaction of King Frederick II of Denmark with the dissolution of the Kalmar Union, and the will of King Eric XIV of Sweden to break Denmark's dominating position. The fighting continued until both armies had been exhausted, and many men died. The resulting Treaty of Stettin was a stalemate, with neither party gaining any new territory.

Context
The Kalmar Union of the three former Scandinavian Kingdoms of Sweden, Norway, and Denmark lasted on and off from 1397 to 1523, until it finally collapsed following the continued Swedish resentment of Danish domination.

A successful rebellion in 1471 led to Swedish victory at the Battle of Brunkeberg, which established a powerful anti-Union movement under the leadership of the Bonde–Sture nobles. In 1520, Christian II of Denmark reconquered Sweden and took a bloody revenge on the anti-Union faction at the Stockholm Bloodbath. More than 80 noble men and ladies, including leading citizens of Stockholm, were executed, but the result severely backfired on Christian II. The violence elicited strong reactions in Sweden for years to come, and the Union was broken by the successful Swedish War of Liberation from 1521 to 1523. Christian II was condemned by the Pope, and he abdicated in 1523. The subsequent Danish kings Frederick I and Christian III, turned their attention mainly on the Reformation in Denmark–Norway and Holstein and the Count's Feud civil war, and relations with Sweden were generally peaceful.

In Sweden, the internal power vacuum, combined with the abdication of Christian II, provided the opportunity for Gustav Vasa to consolidate control of Sweden and claim the throne in June 1523, with the support of peasants and the Hanseatic towns of Lübeck and Danzig. Under Vasa, the Kalmar Union was finally dissolved, and Sweden began establishing itself as a rival power of Denmark–Norway. Gustav Vasa's Sweden was in a weak position in 1523, as access to the North Sea was dominated by the Danish Sound Dues and limited to a 20 kilometer stretch on the Kattegat in the vicinity of Älvsborg, close to modern Gothenburg. Furthermore, Denmark controlled the Baltic, limiting Swedish movement there.

Gustav Vasa changed the military structure in Sweden, which did not bear immediate fruit in the Nordic Seven Years' War but was to have a lasting impact on Sweden's fortune. In 1544 he used the old Scandinavian concept of Uppbåd (levy or the prerogative to call up some fraction of men from each district in an emergency) to establish one of the first native standing armies in Europe. The men served on standby, remaining at home in peacetime, and being paid by tax concessions, but were required to assemble and drill. This system was later expanded as the Swedish allotment system. By 1560 when Gustav Vasa died, every ten peasants were required to provide one soldier who must serve anywhere domestic or foreign as required by the king.

Casus belli

After the deaths of Christian III and Gustav Vasa, in 1559 and 1560 respectively, both countries now had young and hawkish monarchs, Eric XIV of Sweden and Frederick II of Denmark. Frederick II envisioned the resurrection of the Kalmar Union under Danish leadership, while Eric wanted to finally break the dominating position of Denmark.

Shortly after his coronation in 1559, King Frederick II of Denmark ordered his ageing field-commander Johan Rantzau to avenge the humiliating Danish defeat against the small peasant republic of Ditmarsh, which was defeated in a matter of a few weeks and brought under the Danish-Norwegian crown. During the next year, the Danish expansion continued with the possession of the Baltic Sea island of Ösel.

In 1561, when a sizeable remnant of the Order states in the northern Baltics were secularized by its grand master Gotthard Kettler, both Denmark and Sweden were attracted to intervene in the Livonian War. During this conflict, King Eric of Sweden successfully obstructed the Danish plans to conquer Estonia. He sought to dominate the Baltic Sea, while unsuccessfully pressing for Frederick to remove the traditionally Swedish insignia of Three Crowns from the Danish coat of arms; a bone of contention since Christian III and Gustav Vasa. In February 1563, Swedish messengers were sent to Hesse to negotiate Eric's marriage with Christine of Hesse but were held back in Copenhagen. In retaliation, Eric added the insignia of Norway and Denmark to his own coat of arms and refused Danish requests to remove these symbols.

Lübeck, upset over obstacles to trade introduced by Eric to hinder the Russian trade as well as withdrawn trade privileges, joined Denmark in a war alliance. The Polish–Lithuanian union also joined, desiring control of the Baltic trade. Skirmishes broke out in May 1563, before war was officially declared in August that year.

Initial phase
In May, the first movements of the war started as a Danish fleet under Jakob Brockenhuus sailed towards the Baltic. At Bornholm, on 30 May 1563, the fleet fired on the Swedish navy under Jakob Bagge, even though war had not officially been declared. A battle arose that ended with Danish defeat.

German royal emissaries were sent to negotiate a peace, but at the meeting place of Rostock no Swedes appeared. On 13 August 1563, war was declared by emissaries from Denmark and Lübeck in Stockholm. The same month, Danish king Frederik II attacked Älvsborg. At the beginning of the war the Danes advanced from Halland with a 25,000-strong army of professional mercenaries and captured Sweden's gateway to the west, Älvsborg Fortress, after only three days of bombardment and a six-hour assault on 4 September. This achieved the Danish aim of cutting off Sweden from the North Sea, blocking the all-important salt imports. Eric then attacked Halmstad, without result; the Swedish counterattack was driven back by the professional Danish army. After the king's departure from his army, Charles de Mornay stepped in as the commanding officer and was beaten by the Danish at the Battle of Mared.

At sea a battle broke out near Öland on 11 September, whereafter the war took a pause.

South

On 30 May 1564 a battle broke out between the Swedish navy and the Danish–Lübeck navy between Gotland and Öland. The Swedish navy was under the command of Jakob Bagge, and the Danish–Lübeck navy was under the command of Herluf Trolle. Bagge was captured and the largest warship of the Baltic, the Mars (also known as the Makalös), sunk. The Swedish navy retreated to Stockholm leaving a sea blockade in effect. Klas Horn became the new commander and met the Danish fleet at the island Jungfrun north of Öland 14 August. An inconclusive fight left the sea blockade in effect.

Horn attacked the provinces Halland and Skåne in 1565 and made several attempts at Bohuslän and Uddevalla. The Danish burned old Lödöse in the province of Västergötland. Eric initially led the army against the Danish himself, but then turned over command to Nils Boije, who on 28 August 1564 took Varberg. The Danish army under Daniel Rantzau beat the Swedish army in the Battle of Axtorna on 20 October 1565.

The Swedes fared better at sea. Horn, commanding the Swedish navy, pursued a Danish–Lübeck fleet onto the German coast where most of it was destroyed. After this victory Horn steered for Öresund and levied a toll on passing ships. On 4 June 1565, the Battle at Buchow took place on the Mecklenburg coast, in which the Danish–Lübeck commander Herluf Trolle was mortally wounded. In the Battle of 7 July 1565, the Swedish navy under Horn defeated a Danish–Lübeck navy under Otto Rud near Bornholm, where Sweden captured the Danish flagship the Jegermesther. Thus ensured the command of the eastern Baltic by the Swedes that year.

In January 1566 Sweden unsuccessfully laid siege to Bohus Fortress in Bohuslän (then a Norwegian province). Daniel Rantzau then moved his forces into Västergötland. At sea Horn returned to taking toll charges in the Baltic. An indecisive battle at sea outside of Öland occurred on 26 July 1566. On 28 July, half the Danish–Lübeck Navy was lost in a storm at sea. Horn was then called to command troops on land, where he died 9 September.

North
Sweden occupied the undefended Norwegian province of Jemtland, which was quickly reconquered by a counterattack by forces under command of the Norwegian governor of Trøndelag. The forces were unwilling to launch a counterattack on Swedish land. In 1564 the Swedes marched under Claude Collart and re-occupied Jemtland, as well as Herjedalen and Trøndelag, including the city of Trondheim. Initially facing little opposition from the locals, their subsequent ill treatment of the Trøndelag natives, along with tax pressure, laid the groundwork for later resistance to Swedish invasion. Also, Trøndelag was assisted by the governor of Bergenhus, Erik Rosenkrantz, who forced 3500 local peasants to assist him and his 50 professional soldiers. The Swedes saw Bergenhus as their next target. Although the 400 Swedish soldiers were repelled from Trøndelag, Sweden continued to occupy Jämtland and Härjedalen. These provinces were later regained by Denmark–Norway following the peace process in 1570.

Sweden also launched attacks towards Eastern Norway. In the south-east Sweden captured Båhus Fortress, but lost it in 1566. Another part of the army marched through the valley Østerdalen in 1567, captured Hamar, and continued towards Oslo. They reached as far as the Skiensfjord, and torched Skien at one point. In Oslo, however, citizens torched the city before invaders could seize it. From the south-east, more Swedish forces were then sent to aid in capturing Akershus Fortress near Oslo. These forces torched Konghelle and Sarpsborg on their way. They were repelled from Oslo by local forces together with men belonging to Erik Rosenkrantz and the King of Denmark and Norway. The Swedes retreated in a north-eastern direction, torching Hamar on their way, destroying Hamar Cathedral and the bishop's fortified palace Hamarhus.

Later phase
The Danish mercenary army was superior to the Swedish peasant army, but the professional army would not fight until their pay was current. Because only a fraction of the army would march, Denmark had to give up the plan to take the fortress of Kalmar and settle for an attack on Stockholm instead. In August 1564, Eric attacked Blekinge and his army occupied it cruelly (most infamously during the Ronneby Bloodbath), though the Danish later reclaimed this.

Eric XIV turned insane, paralyzing the Swedish war effort. The Danish were exhausted and made no serious attacks until Rantzau attacked Småland and Östergötland with about 8,500 men. He burned every field and house and destroyed every head of livestock he could. An attempt to cut off his retreat over the Holaveden failed, as Rantzius' army went over the ice of lake Sommen and in the middle of February 1568 he returned to Halland.

Attempts were made to make peace between the fighting nations during these years. Negotiators included the dukes of Pomerania, French messenger Charles Dancay, and Holy Roman Emperors Ferdinand I and Maximilian II. The emperors wanted Denmark and Sweden to give back the territories won in Livonia, during the ongoing Livonian War, but Sweden refused to give in to those demands.

In 1568, the Swedish duke John staged a successful coup d'etat against his brother, King Eric. Enthroned as king with the name John III, he began negotiations with Denmark, and on 18 November the same year this led to a draft peace agreement in Roskilde. This was turned down by the Swedes, however, and in 1569 war stirred again. The Danes attacked and reclaimed Varberg, on 13 November. The Swedes on the other hand now had great success in Skåne.

Peace negotiations and consequences
At this point, both armies were exhausted, leading to further negotiations toward peace. In September 1570 a meeting began in Stettin and peace was finally reached on 13 December 1570 with the Treaty of Stettin. The Swedish king withdrew the claims to Norway, Skåne, Halland, Blekinge, and Gotland, while the Danes withdrew their claims to Sweden. The Baltic Sea was declared sovereign Danish. In addition, the Kalmar Union was declared dissolved. The Swedes ransomed Älvsborg with 150,000 riksdaler and had to hand back captured warships. The disputes concerning the Three Crowns insignia were unresolved and remained a source of future conflict.

title: Northern Seven Years' War


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Pope Pelagius

Pelagius has been the papal name of two popes of the Roman Catholic Church. The name is the Latin form of the Greek name Πελαγιος (Pelagios), which was derived from πελαγος (pelagos) "the sea".

 * Pope Pelagius I (556–561)
 * Pope Pelagius II (579–590)

title: Pope Pelagius


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Votorantim

Votorantim is a city located at the southwest of São Paulo State in Brazil. It is part of the Metropolitan Region of Sorocaba. The population is 123,599 (2020 est.). The city is located about 100 km away from the capital of the state. It has 147 km2 of rural area, 30 km2 of urban area and a total area of 183.52 km2.

Geography
It is located in a mountainous region and it has an average altitude of 557 m. The city has a tropical weather and annual average temperature is 20 degrees. It makes borders with the cities of Sorocaba, Piedade, Ibiúna, Salto de Pirapora and Alumínio. It has important access ways to highways such as Castello Branco (SP-280), Raposo Tavares (SP-270), João Leme dos Santos (SP-264) and SP-79 which binds the city to the south coast of the State.

Media
In telecommunications, the city was served by Telecomunicações de São Paulo. In July 1998, this company was acquired by Telefónica, which adopted the Vivo brand in 2012. The company is currently an operator of cell phones, fixed lines, internet (fiber optics/4G) and television (satellite and cable).

Radio station

 * Cantate FM

title: Votorantim


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Ontario Highway 61

King's Highway 61, commonly referred to as Highway 61 and historically known as the Scott Highway, is a provincially maintained highway in the Canadian province of Ontario. The 61 km route connects the Pigeon River Bridge, where it crosses into the United States and becomes Minnesota State Highway 61, with a junction at Highway 11, Highway 17 and the Harbour Expressway in Thunder Bay. The highway forms part of the Lake Superior Circle Tour.

Highway 61 was added to the highway system on October 6, 1937, following the amalgamation of the Department of Northern Development into the Department of Highways. Prior to that it was known as the Scott Highway. The bridge over the Pigeon River was originally known as The Outlaw, as it was constructed without formal approval of the Canadian or American governments.

Route description
Crossing the American border, the Pigeon River Bridge is 300 mi west of the Sault Ste. Marie International Bridge and 300 mi east of the Fort Frances-International Falls International Bridge, and is near a visitor center. Highway 61 begins at the Ontario-Minnesota border at the Pigeon River; the road continues south to Duluth as State Highway 61 on the American side. Proceeding north from the border, the route passes the customs station and curves to the north. Passing its former routing along Highway 593, the highway curves eastward to avoid mountains. It zig-zags around a range of mountains, eventually turning northward and passing to the west of Cloud Bay. The highway continues north for 20 km through Neebing, running between mountain ranges on either side. It rises at Moose Hill, meets Highway 608 and enters one of the few agricultural areas in northwestern Ontario. Shortly thereafter, Highway 61 curves to the east, passing the southern terminus of Highway 130 along the way. It then enters the outskirts of Thunder Bay.

The highway passes Chippewa Road, its former route through Thunder Bay, and returns to its northward orientation. It officially enters the city as it crosses the Kaministiquia River. The highway swerves east at Thunder Bay International Airport as it widens to four lanes then continues north, crossing Arthur Street. North of Arthur Street, the highway is also known as the Thunder Bay Expressway. It continues north for 3 km and ends at the Harbour Expressway and Trans-Canada Highway.

The northernmost section in Thunder Bay is a four-lane, undivided expressway. The remainder of Highway 61 is a conventional two-lane highway. Traffic volumes along the southern portion of the highway are generally low, with an annual average daily traffic (AADT) of 1,000 vehicles. This increases progressing north; within Thunder Bay the AADT peaks at 17,200 vehicles.

Highway 61 also forms a small portion of the Lake Superior Circle Tour, a tourist route of highways following the shoreline of Lake Superior. To the south, the tour continues along Minnesota State Highway 61; to the north it continues along Highway 17 towards Sault Saint Marie.

History

The road that would become Highway 61 was first constructed in 1916. The Pigeon River Timber Company had cleared lands surrounding the towns of Port Arthur and Fort William, but no road existed to connect to locations outside. A narrow wilderness trail reached as far as the Pigeon River, and was chosen as the route for the new road. The Department of Mines and Resources agreed to fund the project, and citizens proceeded to lay a new road as far as the river, beginning in 1913. This road was initially known as the "Scott Highway" after lumberman William Scott. On the opposite shore, Cook County and the State of Minnesota constructed a new road north from Grand Marais. The roads were completed by late 1916, but no bridge existed to connect them.

In response, the Rotary Clubs of Port Arthur and Duluth met to discuss a solution. As an international crossing, any bridge over the river would require federal approval from both governments. Both sides agreed that the approval process would be too slow, and decided to construct the bridge regardless. "The Outlaw" bridge was opened by a travelling motorcade on August 18, 1917, finally permitting travel between Ontario and Minnesota. To the surprise of the Rotary Clubs, J. E. Whitson, Roads Commissioner of Northern Ontario, and Howard Ferguson, Minister of Lands, Forest and Mines, were present at the opening, and agreed to pay the $768,000 ($ in ) bridge cost. The bridge and the Canadian road approaching it fell under the jurisdiction of the Department of Highways (now the Ministry of Transportation) on April 1, 1937, and the Scott Highway became Highway 61 on October 6. The Outlaw was rebuilt as a steel truss structure in 1934 following several accidents.

By 1962, construction was underway to bypass the inland route of the highway as well as the bridge. This bypass opened on November 1, 1963; the American approach was rebuilt along the shore of Lake Superior, and a new bridge constructed over the river 10 km to the east. This bridge was opened on May 23, 1964. Highway 61 was realigned as a result; the former route was redesignated as Highway 593 on September 1, 1964.

In 1963, Charles MacNaughton, minister of the Department of Highways, announced plans for the Lakehead Expressway to be built on the western edge of the twin cities of Port Arthur and Fort William (which amalgamated in 1970 to form Thunder Bay). Construction began in the late 1960s and progressed rapidly. Following its completion by late 1970, Highway 61 was rerouted along it as far north as Arthur Street. The former route followed Chippewa Road, turned north on James Street and then east on Frederica Street. From there, it turned north along Ford Street and followed it and Kingsway to Highway 11 and Highway 17 at Arthur Street. This route was renumbered as Highway 61B; it remained in place into the 1990s, but was decommissioned by 1999.

Beginning in 1991, Highway 61 was completely reconstructed south of Thunder Bay to the border in preparation for the 1995 World Nordic Ski Championships. This involved replacing eight bridges, improving sightlines, and adding five passing lanes and paved shoulders throughout the length of the highway. The highway was extended 3 km to the north on August 17, 2007, when the Shabaqua Highway opened, redirecting Highway 11 and Highway 17 off Arthur Street.

Highway 61B
King's Highway 61B was established in 1968 through Fort William. The former route followed Chippewa Road, turned north on James Street and then east on Frederica Street. From there, it turned north along Ford Street and followed it and Kingsway, ending at Highway 11B and Highway 17B at Arthur Street. Highway 61B was decommissioned in 1997.

Highway 61B used James Street Swing Bridge over the Kaministiquia River, connecting Thunder Bay and Fort William First Nation. A fire on October 29, 2013, prompted CN Railway to close the James Street Swing Bridge; while rail service resumed crossing later that week, the bridge remained closed to vehicular and pedestrian traffic. After lengthy negations and legal proceedings between the City of Thunder Bay, CN Railway and the Fort William First Nation, the bridge was reopened to traffic in November 2019.

title: Ontario Highway 61


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Manuel Sanchís

Manuel Sanchís Martínez (26 March 1938 – 28 October 2017) was a Spanish football defender and manager.

Like his son, Manolo Sanchís, he represented Real Madrid and Spain. They were one of only four father/son pairs to have won the European Cup/Champions League (the others being Cesare and Paolo Maldini, Carles and Sergio Busquets and Zinedine and Luca Zidane), and he played 213 La Liga matches over ten seasons.

An international for two years, Sanchís appeared with the national team at the 1966 World Cup.

Playing career
Sanchís was born in Alberic, Valencia. During his career, he represented CD Condal, Real Valladolid, Real Madrid and Córdoba CF, and he was a member of the successful Madrid sides in the mid-60s that won four La Liga championships in five years, with the addition of the 1965–66 edition of the European Cup (in this competition, he appeared 35 times for the club).

Sanchís earned 11 caps for Spain, and represented the nation at the 1966 FIFA World Cup. In the group stage of that tournament, he scored in a 2–1 win against Switzerland.

International goals

 * Scores and results list. Spain's goal tally first.

Style of play
An offensive-minded defender who was deployed as a forward earlier in his career, Sanchís was known for his exceptional physical qualities, including his strength as well as his class and skills.

Coaching career
After retiring, Sanchís started working as a manager. After beginning with Real Madrid Castilla, he was also in charge of CD Tenerife in the Segunda División before being appointed at the Equatorial Guinea national team.

As the nation was immersed in a situation that would lead to the coup d'état against Francisco Macías Nguema, the sporting facilities in the country suffered from a deep lack of investment, and Sanchís eventually left his post and returned to his country. He subsequently was in charge of lowly AD Torrejón, AD Parla, Daimiel CF, CD Don Benito and UD Alzira, mainly in the Community of Madrid.

Death
Sanchís died on 28 October 2017 in Madrid at the age of 79, from pulmonary embolism.

Honours
Real Madrid
 * La Liga: 1964–65, 1966–67, 1967–68, 1968–69
 * Copa del Generalísimo: 1969–70
 * European Cup: 1965–66

Individual
 * FUWO European Team of the Season: 1966

title: Manuel Sanchís


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File:Erik XIV.jpg

Painted around 1560. Domenicus ver Wilt is believed to be the artist.

title: File:Erik XIV.jpg


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São Martinho

São Martinho (Portuguese for "Saint Martin") may refer to the following places:

In Angola

 * São Martinho dos Tigres

In Brazil

 * São Martinho, Rio Grande do Sul
 * São Martinho, Santa Catarina

In Portugal

 * São Martinho das Amoreiras, a parish in the municipality of Odemira
 * São Martinho do Porto, a parish in the municipality of Alcobaça
 * São Martinho de Angueira, a parish in the municipality of Miranda do Douro
 * São Martinho (Alcácer do Sal), a parish in the municipality of Alcácer do Sal
 * São Martinho (Covilhã), a parish in the municipality of Covilhã
 * São Martinho (Seia), a parish in the municipality of Seia
 * São Martinho (Sintra), a parish in the municipality of Sintra
 * São Martinho (Funchal), a parish in the municipality of Funchal, Madeira
 * São Martinho River, a river that is a tributary of the Sado River in Portugal

Other

 * São Martinho, Portuguese Navy galleon
 * São Martinho, one of the world's largest sugarcane processing operations

title: São Martinho


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Richard Jugge

Richard Jugge (died 1577) was an eminent English printer, who kept a shop at the sign of the Bible, at the North door of Old St Paul's Cathedral, though his residence was in Newgate market, next to Christ Church Greyfriars in London. He is generally credited as the inventor of the footnote. His business was run under the name of his widow Joan Jugge after he died.

Life
It is thought that Richard Jugge was born in Waterbeach in Cambridgeshire and he was educated at Eton and King's College, Cambridge. He was admitted a freeman of the Stationers' Company in 1541 and began to print the New Testament in English, dated 1550. Joseph Ames in Typographical Antiquities says he was "very curious, in his editions of both the Old and New Testament, bestowing not only a good letter, but many elegant initial letters and fine wooden cuts." He was one of the original members of the Stationers' Company, of which he was chosen Warden in 1560, 1563 and 1566, and Master in 1568, 1569, 1573 and 1574. On the accession of Queen Elizabeth he became Royal Printer conjointly with John Cawood. He survived Cawood for a few years, in which he enjoyed the privileges of the patent alone, but he discovered that this was a heavy undertaking. With all the other work that flowed into his printing house from the patent, he found difficulty in organizing the production of Bibles. An octavo Testament took him two years to complete, and whereas Richard Grafton and Edward Whitchurch had issued seven folio Bibles in three years, Jugge managed only two in the same period. This rate of production was unsatisfactory to the Government and to the Church. After "long hearing and debating of grievances" Jugge was instructed to limit himself to the quarto Bible and to the Testament in sextodecimo.

One of Jugge's printer's devices consisted of a massive architectural panel adorned with wreaths of fruit, and bearing in the centre an oval, within which is a pelican feeding her young. On the left of the oval stands a female figure, having a serpent twined round her right arm, who is called on the tablet beneath her Prudencia, and upon the left is another female figure with a balance and a sword, called Justicia.

Jugge died in 1577, and his will was proved on 23 October that year. His business was carried on by his widow Joan Jugge [maiden name perhaps Joan Merrye], who continued the business until at least 1585 printing under her own name, dying in 1588. John Jugge who was Richard's son, appears to have inherited the rights to some titles but never printed independently.

title: Richard Jugge


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List of Royal Air Force personnel

This article lists those members of the Royal Air Force of the United Kingdom who have become either nationally or internationally famous. This could either be due to commanding squadrons or higher formations in memorable operations, by being awarded high honours or by gaining fame subsequent to their RAF service.

Notable Royal Air Force personnel

 * Hugh Trenchard, 1st Viscount Trenchard – founding father of the RAF
 * Arthur Tedder, 1st Baron Tedder – WWII RAF Commander, deputy to Eisenhower who received Germany's surrender at the end of the war in Europe, post-war Chief of Air Staff
 * Hugh Dowding, 1st Baron Dowding – Commanding officer or RAF Fighter Command before WWII, developer of Dowding system used during Battle of Britain
 * Sir Arthur "Bomber" Harris – C-in-C RAF Bomber Command during World War II
 * Sir Douglas Bader – Amputee and fighter pilot & POW during Battle of Britain
 * Sir Keith Park – New Zealander – AOC No. 11 Group RAF during Battle of Britain
 * Sir Frank Whittle – Co-inventor of the turbojet
 * Guy Gibson – Dambusters raid leader and VC holder
 * Leonard Cheshire – Charity founder and VC holder
 * Henry Allingham – World War I veteran and last surviving founder member of the RAF
 * David Henderson – founding father of the Royal Air Force.

Notable people who previously served in the RAF

 * Richard Attenborough – Actor and director
 * Pam Ayres – Poet, TV & Radio presenter
 * David Bailey (photographer)
 * Ralph Barker – Writer
 * Errol Walton Barrow – First Prime Minister of Barbados
 * Alan Bates – Actor
 * Raymond Baxter – Television presenter and commentator
 * Tony Benn – British politician
 * Frank Bossard – MI6 personnel who spied for the USSR
 * Richard Burton – Actor, served as a navigator
 * Brian Blessed – Actor
 * Arthur C. Clarke – Science fiction author
 * Alex Coomber – Bronze medalist in the 2002 Winter Olympics.
 * Roald Dahl – Author. A flying ace who rose to the rank of Wing Commander
 * Hilary Devey – Dragons Den – WRAF Air Traffic Control Assistant
 * Denholm Elliott – Actor
 * Fred Feast – Actor (Coronation Street), served as a Physical Training Instructor (PTI)
 * Bruce Forsyth – Entertainer and show host; served between 1947 and 1949 under National Service
 * Bruce Barrymore Halpenny-British military historian and Author, served Royal Air Force Police
 * Tony Hancock – Comic actor (RAF Regiment)
 * Rex Harrison – Actor, reached the rank of Flight Lieutenant
 * Rollo Hayman – Rhodesian farmer and politician
 * Godfrey Hounsfield – Nobel laureate and co-inventor of Computed tomography.
 * George Hutchinson – Professional footballer
 * Peter Imbert – Police Officer, served Royal Air Force Police
 * T. E. Lawrence – 'Lawrence of Arabia'. Enlisted first as Aircraftman J.H Ross, and later as Aircraftman T.E Shaw
 * Peter Larter – England rugby player
 * Christopher Lee – Actor, reached the rank of Flight Lieutenant
 * Laurence Meredith – Survived 1000 foot parachute-less fall in 1942, Louis Mountbatten staff officer, RAF India historian. United Press International reporter.
 * Warren Mitchell – Actor
 * Bob Monkhouse – Entertainer, comedian, game show host
 * Patrick Moore – Astronomer, broadcaster and author
 * Frank Muir – Comic writer
 * Alex Murphy (rugby league) Great Britain rugby league player
 * Peter Sellers – Comedian and actor, gained the NCO rank of Corporal
 * Josef Singer (1923–2009) – Israeli President of Technion – Israel Institute of Technology
 * Ian Smith – Rhodesian Prime Minister; reached the rank of Flight Lieutenant during Second World War service
 * Billy Strachan, pioneer of black civil rights in Britain, anti-colonial activist, leading British communist
 * Norman Tebbit – Lord Tebbit, Politician. A member of the Conservative Party
 * Gordon Turnbull – psychiatrist
 * Rory Underwood – England rugby player
 * Michael Ventris – deciphered Linear B script
 * Tony Walton – set/costume designer, director
 * Martin Whitcombe – England 'B' rugby player
 * Bill Wyman- Bass player, Rolling Stones
 * Jeff Young (rugby player) – Welsh rugby player

title: List of Royal Air Force personnel


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Talk:Old-time music

What is meant by 'Appalachia'
I've moved the heavily edited/cut N.B. from the Appalachia subsection here for discussion:
 * "N.B.: This section applies primarily to the "Central Appalachian" region of the United States ."

The previous version seems inaccurate according to the definition of Appalachia in Wikipedia itself, but the above version seems either unnecessary or inaccurate, too.

Other related discussion includes: Artaxerxes (talk) 18:41, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

Mid Atlantic?
I think it is reasonably clear to everyone that "Old Time" generally refers to the traditional, fiddle dominated, music of North America and that it is subdivided into regional styles as the article says. What bothers me is that the MID ATLANTIC STATES are missing entirely from the discussion. Where is Pennsylvania's contributions such as collected by Samuel P. Bayard, or the music of Jehile Kirkuff? While I don't personally know much about it, surely there must also be something to say about similar music in western New York and New Jerseys pine barrens. The mid atlantic region is the bridge between Southern Appalachian Old Time and New England Old Time. Surely somebody must have something to say.DHBoggs 16:34, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Arkansas?
I see no mention of Mountain View, Arkansas, the self-proclaimed "Folk Music Capital of The World," or the Ozark Mountains tradition in this discussion. While I believe the style performed there most closely approximates that of Appalachia, I'd still like to know what others think. Perhaps the area is an amalgamation of the different styles, probably because many of the folk musicians who live there came from other parts of the country (or world) and brought the style with them. jtylerhenderson 13:23, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

 * Yes, it should be added. Alan Lomax did some recording in Timbo, Arkansas as well.  Badagnani 19:08, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

The Arkansas State Park: Ozark Folk Center and the Hackensack Society's sole purpose is to preserve the music and cultural heritage of the Ozark Mountains. Not to mention the the Arkansas State Fiddle Championship, Old Time Fiddle Weekend, and numerous bluegrass festivals around the state. Mountain VIew was the home of Jimmy Driftwood, another individual that spent a lifetime making sure our musical heritage did not disappear. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JaaPeeGee (talk • contribs) 10:25, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

"Non-Appalachian South"
Calling North Carolina and Virginia the "Non-Appalachian South" is grossly inaccurate. The Appalachian Mountains run through both states (significantly) and the Appalachian folk culture is significantly represented in both states. This section needs to be seriously revised or omitted entirely, and NC and VA should be included with the Southern Appalachian folk culture, as they are by so many members of that community.

Claire H. 6/29/2007

A bit of tweaking would make it clear that the article is referring to the piedmont regions of Virginia and North Carolina. The development of the banjo, the incorporation of African music into American music, and the interplay of piedmont and mountain music are areas that can be further developed.Steventatum (talk) 17:37, 26 December 2007 (UTC)Steve T.

English Folk Songs from the Southern Appalachians
Link to: English Folk Songs from the Southern Appalachians http://www.traditionalmusic.co.uk/english-folk-songs/ Holger Terp editor, the Danish Peace Academy Adde —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.60.252.127 (talk) 09:46, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

Terminology?
If this term is not synonymous with Appalachian folk music (this kind of implies it is, then it should be explained what the difference is. I tend to think it's the same thing, and that article should be merged here.  But I don't really know. Tuf-Kat 00:14, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)

 * I do, and it's pretty close. Appalachian folk is one of many forms of "old time music", a genre which can be found across america. Old time music is what bluegrass was before Bill Monroe called it "bluegrass", and it's what people called the music they played that has similarities to both blues, and guitar and fiddle emphasizing european folk music. The distinction with blues is sometimes very obvious, but other times it was just a racial distinction, with white guys playing "old time music" versions of the same songs black guys would play and call blues. The distinction w euro-folk can be similarly hard or easy to detect at times, depending on the style of the recording. In summary yes, Appalachian folk music should be merged here. Sam Spade 01:33, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * And I did. Sam Spade 01:41, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Great! Tuf-Kat 21:42, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)
 * In my experience as a banjo player, the term "old-time music" is far more narrow than the definition given by this article. I have noticed that musicians who play instruments like concertinas and mandolins do not tend to refer to themselves as "old-time" musicians if they do not play music of the southern Appalachians.  Although other music in the United States and Canada may have come from the same (or similar sources) as what I hear referred to as "old-time," and even though "old-time" (by this definition) has spread to other parts of the continent, it seems that the original "old-time" was the string band music of the South.  My experience may be unusual, however.  Also, Bascom Lamar Lunsford is listed as being a non-Appalachian musician, despite the fact that he was from Buncombe County, North Carolina, near Asheville.  This is most certainly in Appalachia. Messor

I agree that 'old-time' is usually considered to be southern string-band music, from Appalachia to the Ozarks or even Oklahoma/NE Texas, but not further.

I'm also going to change 'centered on the fiddle' to 'centered on the fiddle and the banjo', since, unlike bluegrass, old-time is meant for dancing and the canonical minimum 'band' is a fiddle and a banjo.

(on edit) I also added a few lines about OT banjo styles. Katzenjammer 22:20, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

 * The amount of information about banjo playing styles seems disproportionately detailed and probably belongs primarily in the Banjo article. Badagnani 23:31, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

 * Actually, the oldest "old time" traditions are those of French Canada and New England and yes, the term "old time" is used to describe the fiddle-based music of these regions, which often features many of the same tunes; and square dancing isn't all that different from New England-style contradancing. Since the fiddle-based traditional musics of these regions are not as well known, people tend to overlook this.  There's a reason the banjo wasn't mentioned in the lead paragraph, and that's because the fiddle is the common instrument (accompanied by either guitar, or banjo, or piano, or any combination of the above), but the banjo is not used much in the Northeast or in Canada.  As wonderful as Appalachian old-time music is, please don't make the article Southern/Appalachian-centric.  Badagnani 22:24, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

 * I feel uncomfortable with that kind of expansion. The tradition with which I have the greatest connection is Cape Breton, and that's as 'old-time' as any.  But it's not labelled 'old-time' except locally to distinguish traditional from newly-written tunes.  Similarly, I live in New England, but the fakebooks such as the copy of New England Fiddler's Repertoire that I have sitting at my elbow right now don't call their contents 'old-time', they call it 'New England'--a completely eclectic mix of Scots, Canadien, Irish, English, and local tunes.

 * If we say that anything not newly-written qualifies as 'old-time', and that this article should be general enough to reflect that, then it seems to me that we lose definition. Why wouldn't some 15th-century court music played on shawms and bombards qualify in that case, and what would we get out of it?  Katzenjammer 23:20, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

 * The construction "old-time" is a neologism anyway, but logically all the fiddle-based traditions from Canada and New England down to the South are related in instrumentation and repertoire, as North American musical traditions based largely on British Isles dance repertoire (with a small amount of German mixed in). (Two exceptions might be Cape Breton and Cajun music which, while fiddle-based, are different enough from the others to be excluded from the "old-time" category, though they should probably at least be mentioned in the article.) The article is already constructed with the regional subcategories of "old-time" thus the expansion you refer to has already taken place.  I did not imply that any music that is not newly written qualifies as "old time," thus that statement is a red herring.  "Early music" such as you mention already has its own term.  Badagnani 23:31, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

 * The "neologism" dates back to the 20s. It was a term that the record companies came up with for music the Victor Talking Machine Company also called "old Southern tunes."  I think the latter synonym gives weight to my argument, as does the fact that by and large, if not entirely, no Canadian, Western (beyond Texas, that is) or even Northern music was sold under the original use of the term "old time" in reference to traditional music. messor (talk) 22:24, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

 * I really don't see how you can have it both ways. Either you include everything 'related in instrumentation and repertoire' --which would include music being played in Scotland, Ireland, England, Wales, and even Brittany-- or you leave off anything that's already got an accepted, distinctive name, such as 'New England', 'Quebecois', 'Cape Breton', 'PEI', 'Texas Swing', etc.  In other words, either it's a proper noun/term of art, or it's just a very general description. Katzenjammer 23:49, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

 * I was referring specifically to North American acoustic folk dance music of primarily British Isles origin. Again, the reference to original British Isles traditions is a red herring, as it's clear that most musicians from these traditions don't self-identify as "old time," as most New Englanders and Canadians do.

 * If proof were needed that the New England traditional fiddlers have used the term "old time" to describe their music for some time, here are three links:  and .  These are links describing the primary New England traditional fiddle organizations, musicians, and contests.  Many people think "old time" is a term applied only to Appalachian and other Southern fiddle-based music (because the New England and other traditions aren't as well known today) but it just isn't true.  Badagnani 00:19, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

 * Okay, you and I aren't going to agree on this, so let's hear what others think, eh? Because I live in New England -Massachusetts, the epicenter- and I can tell you that, in general, people don't call it 'old-time' unless they're talking about southern-string-band music, or they mean 'not modern'.  If they mean the regional repertoire, they say 'New England' just as Buddy MacMaster calls his 'Cape Breton' and would only say 'old-time' to distinguish his trad style from his niece Natalie's Irish-influenced one. And as far as I can tell, the pointers you offer do nothing to impeach my experience. Katzenjammer 00:57, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

 * What a coincidence that you live in the area I was bringing up in my examples. How do the links not prove that some local Vermont and other New England fiddlers describe their music and festivals with the term "old time"?  Also, have you ever seen Jodi Maranchie play?  She's great in the video "New England Fiddles" as a young student of the Maritime/New England player Gerry Robichaud and must be even better now.  Badagnani 01:14, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

 * Why would it be a coincidence? I moved to Mass 22 years ago, first over by Boston working in the computer industry and as of 3 years ago, out here in western Mass.

 * As to the links, they point to the use of the term to mean 'not modern', if they point to anything. Around Boston, it's not unusual to hear (e.g.) a Greek quartet call their music 'old time'.  All they mean is that it's not Greek pop, they're playing the trad repertoire.  They don't mean they're using fiddles or that what they're doing has any musical connection to the knees-up that's going on at the Canadian Social Club in Watertown, or the music that Doc Watson is playing at the Iron Horse out here in Northampton.

 * And no, I've never to my knowledge heard Jodi Maranchie play. Or Gerry Robichaud, for that matter, though at least I know who he is.  In the Boston area, a person could spend every night of their life going to one performance or sessiun after another, if they had the money and didn't go mad from exhaustion. Katzenjammer 14:30, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Fiddlesticks!
"The fiddle is sometimes played by two people at the same time, with one player using the bow and fingers, while another player stands to the side and taps out a rhythm on the fiddle strings using small sticks called fiddlesticks."

I'm suspicious of this statement - it sound like someone is making a joke. Can anyone provide other sources to corroborate it?

Gavin Gourley 12/23/05

 * Yes, it's true. In the Appalachians they also call it "straws."  Al and Emily Cantrell do this (Emily plays the sticks while Al fiddles; I've seen it in person.  Here's a link describing it (about halfway down): http://thepost.baker.ohiou.edu/archives/070298/cantrells.html

 * By the way, you can sign your post by typing four tildes, like this: ~ .  Badagnani 00:25, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Playing the strings with sticks wasn't/isn't a proper part of the tradition, though. It's always been a little vaudeville-ish and show-offy.  Katzenjammer 22:20, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

 * In the little information about this that can be found, it's sometimes claimed that it's a very old tradition. Do you have evidence for the lack of antiquity of this mode of playing?  Badagnani 01:19, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

 * A lot of things are old, but it doesn't mean they're part of a tradition. A fiddle is a one-person instrument. In its modern form it goes back approximately to Andrea Amati in the 1500s, and 99 point mumble percent of the repertoire since then has involved one person sawing away using a bow. So I'd think that to have a second person treating it like a hammered dulcimer while the 'official' player saws away is pretty clearly not part of any traditional canon regardless of how long ago it started. Katzenjammer 14:30, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

 * Makes sense but I hope we can find further sources on this. Probably the Cantrells know most of all about the history of this mode of playing since it's part of their schtick.  I might as well write and ask them about it.  Badagnani 16:20, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Coming in late here as I just discovered this page, but I've created a page Fiddlesticks (musical instrument). I saw a Dewey Balfa video on YouTube, and the page has what little information I was able to find on the web. If anyone could add more that would be cool. There is a list of other YouTube videos here, in the history of the old redirect page for Fiddlesticks. -- Margin1522 (talk) 18:53, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Instrumentation
I see no discussion of the great variety of other instruments associated with this style of music, to wit: spoons, jugs, bones, saws, pans, washboards, kazoos, harmonicas, whistles, cans, washtub bass, tamborines, etc. (perhaps "hollerin'" could also be considered a form of instrumentation). This might be viewed as "a tribute to the ingenuity shown by impoverished rural Blacks in expressing themselves musically on whatever they found at hand," a tradition that would seem to include the banjo. That old-time music was played by other than string bands, e.g., jug bands, skiffle bands, spasm bands, etc., would not seem to dilute rather to strengthen the tradition. If this great variety of other instruments does not belong in the discussion at all, perhaps some mention should be made of why not.Artaxerxes (talk) 23:39, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

 * The genres you're discussing aren't usually considered part of "old-time music." They're separate, though related genres. However, spoons, bones, washtub bass, harmonica, etc. are mentioned in the article. I'm not familiar with the jug used in old-time music, though it's definitely used in jug band music. If you have sources showing that old-time tunes were played by jug bands, that would be interesting. Badagnani (talk) 23:49, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

List of advert links
Many if not all of the links at the end of this article appear to be in breach of WP:EL. Can someone with subject knowledge please take a look and remove such links. Thank you. --HighKing (talk) 16:08, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

Misleading/inaccurate?
Currently, While in the year 2000 African Americans made up only eight percent of the Appalachian population[11], their numbers were greater in the 19th and early 20th centuries, due not only to the presence of slaves but also free blacks working in timber, coal mining, and other industries.

I doubt that the black population of Appalachia was ever higher than single digits- there were very, very few slaves in the mountains; the population was overwhelmingly small farmers, mostly quite poor, who couldn't begin to afford a slave. If need be I can go back to the 1850 or 60 census, but I'm pretty sure I recall correctly.

The popularity of the banjo is not really indicative of the racial composition of any area, since by the later 1800s the banjo was THE American instrument, everywhere from rude cabins to Carnegie Hall (yes, there was white-tie classical banjo!). It's rather like asserting that the prevalence of the guitar implies a heavy Spanish population.

The African-American *stylistic* elements are very definitely present. However these could well have spread by diffusion up from the Piedmont. Solicitr (talk) 15:08, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Changing the order of sections of the article
I don't understand why the section "Regional Styles" are below the sections of "Learning old-time music", since I think that regional styles should be dealt with more and higher importance and more closely related to the history and instrumentation of the old-music. To me, the article would be more coherent and better hung-together to place the regional styles section right below the instrumentation section, and move the learning section right below the "Festivals' section. Please tell me what you people think. Davidmjeong926 (talk) 15:16, 8 February 2010 (UTC)

The Appalachia subcategory is too long
Considering there's already an existing article on Appalachia music, the subsection related to it in this article contains too much information and is unnecessarily lengthy. How about editing the subsection into shorter, more concise format? And, if necessary, the part of information that the subsection can be added to the main article Appalachian music. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.150.66.99 (talk) 07:23, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Do we want to contend that Texas swing is old time?
[Old-time_music#Texas_and_the_West] seeems to say that swing is old time. Who's the real expert on what is what with regard to that opinion? For now, citation needed. Geo Bard  Rap 02:48, 1 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, it would be nice if there was a "real expert" on this issue. The trouble is, nobody seems to be able to create a stable definition of what OT music even *is*, much less who should be considered an expert in it.  It seems that this article keeps going back and forth on whether Canadian and New England traditional music should be called "old time" or not.  I think that the only resolution to this issue would be for the article to say that the term is inherently ambiguous and used in different ways, or to officially come down on one side or the other, and have editors enforce that decision from now on. messor (talk) 01:07, 15 February 2020 (UTC)

I created a suggested working policy
If you go to edit the External Links section, you get an edit notice.

This is it:

Please prefer links which are meta-indexes or highly authoritative on account of the fact some WP editors get mad if you put too many links up- -IF YOU REMOVE ANY LINKS PLEASE PASTE THEM INTO THE TALK PAGE that way we can make sure a good resource doesn't get lost in the shuffle. We can replace the link somewhere else thanks. --

I am asking people to stick with it. Personally, I like lots of links but others won't so that is that.

For reference, this is what they are at this point in time.
Perhaps some must go?? I'd rather have talk first, deletions later. Prob'ly we are OK for now but if the section gets too big, I suggest we weed out the insrument-specific ones first. If it gets to that point.

- Geof 01:57, 18 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Hillbilly Music: Source and Symbol
 * Old Time Fiddlers Hall of Fame
 * Appalachian Traditional Music: A Short History
 * Old Time Music Source list
 * Oldtime Banjo
 * Sheet music, lyrics & midis for 200+ traditional old-time songs
 * The Henry Reed Collection at the Library of Congress Collection of traditional fiddle tunes performed by Henry Reed of Glen Lyn, Virginia. Recorded by folklorist Alan Jabbour in 1966-67.
 * Honkingduck.com, Listen to 700+ 78rpm recordings of old time music and search a discography of 319,000+ more.
 * Nashville Old-Time String Band Association, a 501(c)(3) organization that provides string band MP3s, midis, chord charts, notation, song histories, jukeboxes, newsletter, mailing lists, and sponsors an annual retreat, special workshops, and at least five public jam sessions each month.
 * Monster index of resources

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I have changed external link to oldtimemusic.com/otdef.html. I have changed it to archive org version, as someone bought oldtimemusic.com and changed it to affiliate website. So it is no more connected to Old Time music — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mark.barkan (talk • contribs) 07:03, 24 January 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Old-time music


text:
Talk:Wolfram Research

Links,, references, advertising?
The page only has 3 references, and one of those is self published. 3 out of 5 external links lead to the company's own website, and I count at least 3 links in the text to the wolfram website. The presence of this page seems to be part of a carefully crafted promotional exercise. DMcMPO11AAUK/Talk/Contribs 08:50, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I’m starting to get that notion too. Some of the paragraphs feel like they were copy-pasted from an ad campaign. Wrgfruit (talk) 00:53, 13 March 2022 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Wolframscreenshot.jpg
Image:Wolframscreenshot.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 21:41, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

How many employees are there in Wolfram Research?
The box to the right of the main page says 300+, but where does this information come from? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Drkirkby (talk • contribs) 10:31, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Innovation Award
My searches for sources e.g. Wolfram "Innovator Award" on google and google news don't turn anything but press releases, wolfram's website or rehashes of press releases. WP:WEIGHT requires that we summarise subjects in proportion to the coverage they have received in independent coverage. There's nothing to indicate to me that this is an important award and certainly no way enough coverage to merit 80 % of the article being about it. SmartSE (talk) 23:21, 11 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Agree, moreover there is a lack of sourcing for any of the claims in this section of the article. Support removal Lyndaship (talk) 08:42, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
 * How does a press release from independent sources (e.g., institution of award winner, any non-Wolfram affiliated source, etc.) not constitute independent coverage? WP:WEIGHT relates to the subject's coverage. There's actually very little coverage on the "subject" itself (two sentences, actually). The rest is simply those who have won the award, which isn't the subject of the section. I could see shortening the bios that are listed as some of them are rather lengthy. But to remove them all together seems excessive. Duplo surrogate (talk) 15:17, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
 * A press release is never an independent source for anything - they are primary sources. The rest is simply those who have won the award - quite right - it's absolutely nothing to do with Wolfram at all, so why is it in an encyclopedia article about them? If the award was notable, then it could be a standalone article, but it isn't. SmartSE (talk) 17:56, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Why should the winners of a non-notable award be included in the article about the business that is known for creating the Wolfram suite of programs? At most the award can be mentioned in the article (if you can find a third-party source) but including all the winners is tantamount to WP:SPAM. I support deleting the list of winners and not mentioning the award at all. SWL36 (talk) 19:51, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

UPE
Hello. I have just tagged this article undisclosed paid, because it was very heavily edited by a (highly likely paid) sockfarm that is focused almost exclusively on promoting Stephen Wolfram and his work. Please see this COIN thread (perma) and the related SPI for more information. The article will need a thorough review before the tag is removed. Thanks and best, Blablubbs | talk 15:15, 13 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Hello, I am not affiliated with Wolfram, but I think I have a pretty good knowledge of the company. I find the page correct and informative, containing relevant information. Maybe the information about Science World should be removed completely since that website seems not to have been updated since 2006. I see that there can be problems if someone has been paid to update the page, but the important thing must anyway be that the information is correct without unmotivated hyperbole. According to my opinion, the tagging should be removed. Ingolf Dahl (talk) 20:22, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
 * While has done some cleanup already, I disagree that the tag should be removed. An article doesn't have to contain the phrase "BUY IT NOW!!!" to be subtle advertising; undisclosed paid editors (who were almost unquestionably involved here – hence the tag) can also lend undue weight to feature lists and such, or insert wording that appears to be neutral prima facie but actually serves to promote nonetheless. To pick just a single passage (unnecessary promo words in bold, indiscriminate listings that could come straight from a product catalogue in italics): Mathematica is a modern technical computing system spanning all areas of technical computing — including neural networks, machine learning, image processing, geometry, data science, visualizations, and others. The system is used in many technical, scientific, engineering, mathematical, and computing fields. In addition to the computational abilities of the system, Mathematica includes a unique and powerful notebook interface.
 * Most of the article is currently sourced to Wolfram itself (or not sourced at all); even if it's a neutral-sounding re-hash of their press kit, it's still a re-hash of their press kit, and it was still done in large part by undisclosed paid editors, so the tag strikes me as appropriate for the time being. Blablubbs | talk 20:41, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

 * Agree the tag should stay. You can see on a former employee's resume that is publicly available on a popular job-focused social networking site that one of their duties as an employee was to work on Wikipedia. This has been happening since at least 2016 and probably longer. --Montesquieu1789 (talk) 22:42, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
 * The little bit about ScienceWorld is one of the better-referenced parts, I think. And we don't remove material about a website just because that website is moribund (we have a whole article on Citizendium, for example). XOR'easter (talk) 16:30, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

Help with sources
I updated the number of employees to 800. I need help sourcing the template. ScientistBuilder (talk) 14:14, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
 * The government data cited in the CNN article when Wolfram Research applied for a received a PPP loan shows Wolfram Research employs roughly 400 people, not the 800 claimed by Stephen Wolfram. If you are going to update this page, please try to avoid using Wolfram-published blog posts. Montesquieu1789 (talk) 04:33, 11 February 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Wolfram Research


text:
User:Orz

Orz
Nice meeting you guys. (Orz=3)

title: User:Orz


text:
Joseph Gurney

Joseph Gurney (15 October 1804 – 12 August 1879), was a British shorthand writer and biblical scholar, notable for his publications and work with the Religious Tract Society.

Life
Gurney was the eldest son of shorthand writer William Brodie Gurney, and he was born in London on 15 October 1804. His grandfather and great grandfather had also been shorthand writers.

He first attended an important committee of the House of Commons in 1822, and continued to take notes till 1872. On his father's resignation in 1849, he was appointed shorthand writer to the Houses of Parliament. Like his father, he was interested in religious and philanthropic movements. He was for more than fifty years a member of the committee of the Religious Tract Society, and latterly its treasurer. He was also treasurer of the Baptist college in Regent's Park.

On Gurney's retirement as shorthand writer to the houses of parliament in 1872, the post was given to his nephew William Henry Gurney Salter. Gurney died at Tyndale Lodge, Wimbledon Common, on 12 August 1879, and was interred at the Norwood Cemetery.

Works
Gurney brought out popular commentaries on the Bible. The best known of these was The Annotated Paragraph Bible, containing the Old and New Testaments according to the authorised version, with explanatory Notes, Prefaces to the several Books, and an entirely new selection of references to parallel and illustrative Passages, two vols., London, 1850–60, published by the Religious Tract Society. It was successful, and widely praised. The notes were prepared under Gurney's supervision.

Besides other bibles, Gurney published also The Revised English Bible, London, 1877, closely resembling the Revised Version (1885). The profits of his literary works he gave to the Religious Tract Society.

Family
Gurney married first Emma, daughter of E. Rawlings, and they had three children, William, Amelia and the educationalist Mary Gurney. Emma died and he had more children with his second wife Harriet Tritton of Lombard Street.

title: Joseph Gurney


text:
User:Andychun

Andy Chun is my real name. I work at the Prudential Corporation Asia as the Regional Director, Technology Innovation. My homepage is here.

title: User:Andychun


text: User talk:70.27.36.216

title: User talk:70.27.36.216


text:
All About Mormons

"All About Mormons", also known as "All About the Mormons?", is the 12th episode of the seventh season of the American animated television series South Park and the 108th overall episode of the series. It was originally broadcast on Comedy Central in the United States on November 19, 2003. The episode revolves around the religion and culture of Mormons, as a Mormon family moves to the town of South Park and influences the beliefs of the family of character Stan Marsh. The story of Joseph Smith's founding of Mormonism and the origin of the Book of Mormon is told through a number of comedic 19th-century flashbacks, with a musical narration.

The episode was written and directed by series co-creator Trey Parker, and it was rated TV-MA in the United States. The episode evolved from personal experiences of creators Parker and Matt Stone, who grew up in Colorado. Growing up in Colorado both Stone and Parker often visited Utah, and both had Mormon classmates. The scene in which Stan is invited to dinner by the Mormon family was inspired by Parker's first girlfriend in high school, who was Mormon and invited him over for Family Home Evening. They found the religion ridiculous but hard to parody due to the good-natured attitudes of many Mormons.

The episode received positive reviews from television critics, and it has been placed on "best-of" South Park lists. Parker found that younger audiences found the episode unfunny, but many of his Mormon friends found it hilarious. "All About Mormons" was released on DVD along with the rest of the seventh season on March 21, 2006. Parker and Stone later carried over many themes from the episode for their musical The Book of Mormon, which opened on Broadway in 2011.

Plot
A new family, the Harrisons, move into South Park, and their son, Gary, stereotypically depicted as unusually perfect (achieving high grades, being state champion in sports, being perfectly polite, etc.), invokes the wrath of the other boys. Stan is drafted into the job of beating him up by the other children, but Gary's sheer politeness leads Stan to discover himself walking away with an invitation to dinner that night. Stan meets Gary's family, an overly friendly, loving, talented family (including a very articulate infant). After dinner, the five-child, two-parent family has "Family Home Evening" where they play games, do performance art and read from the Book of Mormon. Stan is intrigued and confused by all this, and he asks his parents about the Mormon family's beliefs. Randy (his father) concludes that they must be religious fanatics attempting to brainwash Stan, and he heads over to confront Mr. Harrison and beat him up. Instead, he too finds himself quelled by the family's perfection and politeness, and, in the end, actually decides to convert to Mormonism himself. The next day, Kenny, Cartman and Kyle cruelly mock Stan for hanging around with Gary and his family, accusing Stan of going on a date with Gary. When the Harrisons and Gary show up, the three children walk off lying about going to "put in some volunteer work at the homeless shelter".

Throughout the episode, characters ask questions about Mormonism, and the story then breaks off to a sub-story about Joseph Smith and the founding of the religion. For satirical purposes, the show deviates from the original accounts of Mormonism's founding by adding extra details to stories originally left vague (e.g. the precise location where Martin Harris lost the only transcript of the Book of Lehi given to him by Joseph Smith); furthermore, during the narration, an upbeat tune plays in the background, with a choral "Dum, dum, dum, dum, dum" following the lyrical lines of the song. When skeptic Lucy Harris appears in the sub-story, the chorus changes to "Smart, smart, smart, smart, smart", and it becomes clear that the voices are actually singing "Dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb" after the specifics of Smith's story. The show asserts flaws in the religion's founding, which especially concern Stan (for example, that Joseph Smith offered no proof to the general public of finding the golden plates, and that he claimed to have translated from a slightly different plate after the first translation was lost while in the possession of Martin Harris). Stan ends up shouting at the Mormons that they are ridiculous for believing in it without proof; they smile and patiently explain that it is a matter of faith, while Stan argues that it should be a matter of empirical evidence. He further lashes out at them for acting unusually nice all the time, claiming it blindsides stupid people like his father into believing in Mormonism (to which Randy Marsh responds with a determined "Yeah!").

Stan's anger does not upset anyone in the Mormon family other than Gary, who confronts Stan and the other boys the next day, pointing out that he believes his religion does not need to be factually true because it still supports good family values and helping the poor. Gary also condemns their bigotry and ignorance in language that is normal for the main characters but extremely surprising and powerful coming from Gary, as he ends his dialogue telling Stan to "suck my balls". He walks away, leaving the boys in utter shock. The episode ends as Cartman, with a new-found respect for Gary, says "Damn, that kid is cool, huh?".

Production
The episode was written and directed by South Park co-creator Trey Parker. The character of the new Mormon student Gary is voiced by South Park writer Kyle McCulloch, who himself grew up Mormon.

Growing up in Colorado, Parker and Stone knew a lot of Mormon people, and Parker's high school ex-girlfriend was a Mormon, whose family he had visited while they held Family Home Evening. Through these experiences, Parker learned a number of things about the religion, and he did more research for his film Orgazmo, in which he played the Mormon main character.

Reception
Cameron Adams of the Herald Sun, a tabloid Australian newspaper, highlighted the episode among "Top Choice" picks in television. Chris Quinn of the San Antonio Express-News placed the episode at number 7 on his list of "Top 10 Most Offensive South Park Episodes and Therefore, Maybe The Best, List". In 2013, fans voted the episode as the best of the 7th season. The episode was used as an exhibit in discussing Mormonism in popular culture by Utah Valley State College religious studies professor Kelli Potter in a presentation titled "The Americanization of Mormonism Reflected in Pop Culture". KUER's Radio West host Doug Fabrizio used the episode as a case study in a discussion about "Mormonism and Popular Culture".

title: All About Mormons


text:
Main Upgrading Programme

The Main Upgrading Programme, or MUP, was formally launched as the Singapore government’s pioneer housing upgrading programme in 1992, by then Prime Minister Mr Goh Chok Tong. Under the MUP, residents enjoyed an improved living environment without the need to move out from their familiar surroundings. The MUP has been brought to 128 precincts island-wide, benefitting 131,000 households.

History
In 1992, the government experimented with the concept of upgrading HDB flats while they were still being occupied on 6 precincts in a Demonstration Phase. These precincts were in Marine Parade, Kim Keat, Telok Blangah, Ang Mo Kio, Lorong Lew Lian and Clementi. The Demonstration Phase was a success, and was hence, expanded island-wide.

Under the MUP, improvements are carried out to the precinct's surroundings, the blocks, as well as within each individual dwelling unit.

The programme was absorbed into Home Improvement Programme in 2007.

The priority of HDB upgrading programme was linked to support by electoral wards, as stated by then-Prime Minister Goh Chok Tong, "by linking the priority of upgrading to electoral support, we focus the minds of voters on the link between upgrading and the people whose policies make it possible. This has the desired result." It has been used as a tool to canvass votes for PAP politicians campaigning in eligible opposition-held constituencies, such as Eric Low in the 2006 general elections.

title: Main Upgrading Programme


text:
Lant

Lant is aged urine. The term comes from Old English, which referred to urine. Collected urine was put aside to ferment until used for its chemical content in many pre-industrial processes, such as cleaning and production.

History
Because of its ammonium content, lant was most commonly used for floor cleaning and laundry. According to early housekeeping guides, bedpans would be collected by one of the younger male servants and put away to ferment to a mild caustic before use.

In larger cottage industries, lant was used in wool-processing and as a source of potassium nitrate for black powder. In times of urgent need and in districts where these were the chief industries, the whole town was expected to contribute to its supply.

""Lant. Stale urine. It was preserved in a tank and having been mixed with lime used for dressing wheat before it was sown to keep the birds from picking up the seeds.""

- Sidney Addy

title: Lant


text:
Talk:Deadwood (TV series)

Filming locations?
Where was it filmed? 2600:1702:1ED0:1120:BD65:48CF:E2A4:B2F3 (talk) 00:30, 3 March 2022 (UTC)

Cancelation
This article needs to cover the cancelation and the given reasons for it. This happening is mysterious given the ratings and award-winning rate of the show, and readers are often going to be looking for this information in particular. I think it extremely unlikely that various sources have not covered this subject in considerable detail by now. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  09:34, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Deadwood (TV series)


text:
Talk:Jet aircraft

Jet sizes
There are both compact and bus-size jetplanes. We should make multiple articles about different size jetplanes just like there are articles about different size automobiles. The article I am suggesting are compact jet and commercial jet. --SuperDude 00:18, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * Not a bad idea. There's an article at business jet but commuter jet and commercial airliner are coming up blank.  I don't know if "commuter jet" or "compact jet" are proper terms, however.  I personally don't know much about jet aircraft, but my younger brother does.  I might give him a call.  Let me know what you want to do on this, SD. - Lucky 6.9 00:56, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

First flight
Actually, the first operating jet was a British aircraft, the name of which escapes me. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.101.101.78 (talk • contribs).

Hi, I think the first british commercial jet was the comet -- Maj. Templeton —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.64.204.143 (talk) 15:21, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

Coanda
The Coanda-1910 is listed above, but the Canadian biplane ca. 1912 is not. Reference needed: Older printed material on early flight. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Roy.crabtree@gmail.com (talk • contribs).

The Coanda-1910 was the first jet plane ever built, however, this article doesn't display its picture. Please display the picture of the Coanda-1910 jet plane. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.82.134.77 (talk • contribs)

 * No, see the arguments below. The Coanda-1910 has been very seriously challenged as to its supposed status as the first jet, a relatively recent claim. The acknowledged first jet is the Heinkel. Binksternet (talk) 21:17, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

First sentence
I changed the first sentence to plural. Sounded better. Spaomark 16:33, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Aircraft is the plural per http://www.answers.com/aircraft&r=67 Kind Regards -  Heligoland  |   Talk  |   Contribs  16:45, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Space Shuttle aerodynamic lift during launch
I have searched around and can find no mention of this. Since the shuttle is more or less belly-up during launch, it seems counterintuitive that the lift surfaces would be of any help. In fact, it seems the opposite would be true. I would suggest deletion of this if the author can not provide citation. BigDaveB (talk) 19:26, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

co invented
Every book and article I have read on this subject matter, give each of these men credit, not just Whittle. I suggest that you rewrite, stating so. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.64.176.190 (talk) 17:07, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

History
The history section mentions that the first manufactured turbine jetplane was the Heinkel He 178 turbojet prototype of the German Air Force (Luftwaffe), piloted by Erich Warsitz on August 27, 1939. I've got an article by Sir Frank Whittle here in an old aircraft magazine, entitled 'Contact' The Magazine for Air-minded New Zealand. Feb 1954, which contains a section wherein he discusses this, relating to the question of whether the Germans flew the first jet. He writes that in the sense that they got one off the ground for a few minutes but that if it was a question of the first flight of an efficient and successful airplane then no, and adds that Britain was certainly first in the field. He describes the test flight of the Heinkel on August 27 1939, saying; "A tiny single-seater jet Heinkel -the HE.178-flew for ten minutes in Germany on August 27, 1939, four days before the invasion of Poland. What happened on that flight is a mystery to me; but the engine was not further developed, and the plane never went into production." No mention of the Italian test flight mentioned in this article either, but Frank Whittle would have been aware it, it apparently having been heralded internationally as the first successful jet flight at the time according to the linked article, and may not have counted it as a successful flight for similar reasons to the above. I think it's worth noting in the article, if he's correct, that the Heinkel, while the first manufactured jetplane, was not successful, only flew for ten minutes, and was then not continued. And maybe something similar for the Italian prototype test if details can be determined.Number36 (talk) 22:44, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

 * During its initial flight tests the He 178 was, due to the low power of its engine, unable to fly on its original set of wings and it was only after a new larger set of wings was fitted that it was able to become airborne. It was therefore a very marginal aeroplane, whereas the Gloster E.28/39 was a perfectly usable and practicable aircraft from the beginning. The He 178 was designed for a retractable undercarriage however it was fixed in the down position and the wheel wells faired-over for all the flights, and so the aircraft was never able to demonstrate the performance advantages of jet propulsion whereas the E.28/39 was soon achieving speeds equal to or better than the fastest contemporary piston-engined fighters and with better engines was eventually able to exceed 500 mph, and reach altitudes of around 40,000 feet. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.173.127 (talk) 09:30, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

NIGEL BROWN
Hey I Think I —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.148.83.141 (talk) 22:31, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Coanda not a jet
Coanda's 1910 aircraft was an attempt at a ducted fan. He described it as such in painstaking detail in several patents (British patent #GB191112740(A), Swiss patent #CH58232(A), etc). Aviation journals and magazines which covered the air show described it as a ducted fan as well(Cassier's Magazine (1911) Volume 39, page 199; Popular Mechanics March 1911 page 359; Technical World Magazine (1911) Volume 15 page 615; Aircraft (1910) Volume 1 page367). Coanda didn't change his story and start claiming it was a jet until others had invented jet engines; and when did he had a great deal of trouble keeping his story straight. Does anyone really think he should be credited with building a motorjet when there's no evidence whatsoever that he did, and a huge mountain of evidence that he didn't?Romaniantruths (talk) 23:59, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

 * verifiable reffrences are needed in order to make an edit of the article. please understand if we don't take your word for it 79.113.9.72 (talk) 10:42, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

If verifiable scources are needed to make an edit, User 79.113.9.72, then I guess I'd better remove the totally unreferenced assertion that the 1910 Coanda was a jet. I know you'll want whoever made those assertions to please understand if we don't take their word for itRomaniantruths (talk) 18:02, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

The magazines referenced are all public domain and can all be found with a search of Google books. The patents are all also available on the internet, but just to make it easy for you here are some simple directions: Go to the Henri Coanda Wikipedia page and scroll down to the references. Click on The patents of Henri Coanda. Scroll down the patents until you find the patents I specified (the French one is there too! And if you can't read French, I think there's even an automatic translation available). Once you've read Coanda's own description of how his turbopropulseur works and seen his diagrams, please let me know if you have any evidence to the contrary other than his much later unsupported personal assertions, or re-iterations of same by lazy aviation historians. If you do find anything else perhaps we can discuss wether what you found should trump these primary scources in Coanda's own words.Romaniantruths (talk) 20:26, 5 August 2010 (UTC) And while we're at it, I notice that you've made quite a few edits to aviation articles without references(like the claim on the aircraft engine page that Jatho was the first person to attempt to fly using only on-board means, do you really mean that nobody ever tried this before 1903?). I don't spend a lot of time on Wikipedia so maybe you can explain why these rules apply to my edits, but not to yours.--With warmest regardsRomaniantruths (talk) 20:26, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

 * Coanda was a jet, acording with most of qualified scholars who search on the subject, and the endless talk on "Coanda-1910" page clearly show that. Fact that some unreliable and not qualified ones may disagree, its another thing, but we should stick with the facts and dont go with some stupid bias again and again, its unproductive and will just lead to a war all over all kind of wikipedia articles —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.116.207.185 (talk) 14:13, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Just as there are sources which agree that the Coanda-1910 was a jet, there are sources which say that it was not a jet; that it did not fly. Both sides of the dispute have good sources to cite. Our representation of the aircraft cannot state flatly that any of the disputed facts are indeed facts. Binksternet (talk) 18:15, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

 * Once again, this article cannot state with certainty that the Coanda-1910 aircraft was the first jet aircraft. Gibbs-Smith and Winter performed extensive historical research and determined that it did not fly, ever, and that it did not have combustion in the air stream, a requirement for flight in air, as without it there would not be enough thrust. No matter who else says that the aircraft was the first jet (quoting Coanda's assertion from the 1950s and '60s), these two giants of aviation history are enough to stop us from being certain. Binksternet (talk) 15:03, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

 * you're funny. If those are giants of aviation i am soviet cosmonaut. Only relaible and qualified to talk about Coanda-1910 are Stine, Craciunoiu, Antoniu, and i may add Boyne. All this not that just researched all Coanda documents and archives, but, unlike those 2 clowns, have too the qualifications needed to understand them. Gibbs was a delusional nut who believe in ghosts and paranormal and was good at searching for Bayeux tapestry and old stuff from world exhibitions too, and Winter was a former journalist with a degree in history. Compare that with a rocket scientist and author of aeronautic books, a former Air Force colonel, director of Air and Space Museum and aviation historian or phd engineer aviations who write aviation history books since decades, and who had acces to all Coanda documents and atents. Is this a joke from you to still promote those "giants"? Are you have a clear scale of values or you live in alternative worlds as your idol, Gibbs? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.116.206.207 (talk) 18:43, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
 * If you have an issue with Gibbs-Smith status as a reliable source take it to the appropriate forum for a third part opinion. GraemeLeggett (talk) 15:11, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

 * i think the problem is pretty solved, since even Gibbs agree in his book that <<>>  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.116.208.76 (talk) 20:12, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Including of Coanda -1910
I will post some references (there is an abundance of them on "Henri Coanda" and "Coanda-1910" page, and i hope the personal bias of some peoples will not stop to be added

"Romanian inventor Henri Coanda attempted to fly a primitive jet aircraft in 1910, using a four-cylinder internal combustion engine to drive a compressor at 4,000 revolutions per minute. It was equipped with what today might be called an afterburner, producing an estimated 500 pounds of thrust. Countless loyal Coanda fans insist that the airplane flew. Others say it merely crashed." "The Coanda effect is familiar to most hydraulicians, although perhaps not by name. The effect was first observed in 1910 by Henri-Marie Coanda, in connection with exhaust flow from an experimental jet engine (Stine, 1989)."
 * http://books.google.com/books?id=CYpTAAAAMAAJ&q=Coanda+1910+first+jet+aircraft&dq=Coanda+1910+first+jet+aircraft&hl=en&ei=I1t9TMnOAtOQjAedztzSDg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEMQ6AEwBg —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.116.208.76 (talk) 06:43, 30 September 2010 (UTC)
 * http://www.airforce-magazine.com/MagazineArchive/Pages/2006/January%202006/0106engines.aspx
 * http://www.newfluidtechnology.com.au/Henri_Coanda_The_facts.pdf
 * Stine, G.H., "The Rises and Falls of Henri-Marie Coanda", Air & Space Smithsonian, Sept. 1989
 * http://www.usbr.gov/pmts/hydraulics_lab/pubs/PAP/PAP-0672.pdf
 * http://books.google.com/books?id=Pwi2AAAAIAAJ&q=Coanda+1910+jet&dq=Coanda+1910+jet&hl=en&ei=oEV-TKCjOYnLswaS_pSWCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CDYQ6AEwBDg8
 * http://siris-archives.si.edu/ipac20/ipac.jsp?session=1S834B9787474.9894&profile=all&uri=link=3100006~!132480~!3100001~!3100002&aspect=Browse&menu=search&ri=5&source=~!siarchives&term=Coanda%2C+Henri-Marie%2C+1885-1972&index=

And there are more, i dont think is needed to put them all, and is pretty clear by now. So i propose an introduction phrase as: I hope this sound good enough and is a neutral point of view who can be posted —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.116.208.76 (talk) 06:37, 30 September 2010 (UTC)
 * "The first jet aircraft (fact still contested by some aviation historians-Gibbs) was "Coanda-1910", build by Romanian Henri Coanda and exhibited at Paris Air Show in 1910. It was considered an "experimental jet" or a "primitive jet" (see Stine and Boyne above), and used the same type of engine design as later "Caproni Campini N.1" and Japanese "Tsu-11". However, the "turbojet", the most common type of jet in use today, was invented in 30's, independently by Frank Whittle and Hans von Ohain".

According to the def. in dictionary, Coanda 1910 was a jet plane
Even if Coanda 1910 had used just a ducted fan powered by a piston motor, the overall engine fits the definition of a jet engine (see below) and in consequence the picture of the airplane has to be added. Coanda 1910 used oxigen to burn fuel and produced a backward discharge of gases that pushed the plane forward. This is in the definition of a jet engine.

"Definition of JET ENGINE

 * an engine that produces motion as a result of the rearward discharge of a jet of fluid; specifically : an airplane engine that uses atmospheric oxygen to burn fuel and produces a rearward discharge of heated air and exhaust gases" source: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/jet%20engine

"jet engine

1. An engine that develops thrust by ejecting a jet, especially a jet of gaseous combustion products.

2. An engine that obtains the oxygen needed from the atmosphere, used especially to propel aircraft and distinguished from rocket engines having self-contained fuel-oxidizer systems." Source: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/jet+engine — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.203.73.246 (talk) 05:44, 17 February 2013 (UTC)

 * A 'jet' engine discharges gasses rearwards through a propelling nozzle in the form of a high-velocity jet, hence the name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.173.127 (talk) 10:07, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

Planes with ducted fan engines can fly. Binksternet is wrong as usual
There is enough power to fly a ducted fan jet engine. If you do not believe just take a look at this aircraft that flew in October 1932. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stipa-Caproni

"Once again, this article cannot state with certainty that the Coanda-1910 aircraft was the first jet aircraft. Gibbs-Smith and Winter performed extensive historical research and determined that it did not fly, ever, and that it did not have combustion in the air stream, a requirement for flight in air, as without it there would not be enough thrust."(Binksternet) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.83.160.23 (talk) 20:40, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

Coandă-1910
User:MilborneOne Okay, we're here now. Can you please speak out? What's your beef with Coanda? Romanian-and-proud (talk) 19:00, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

 * Nothing, Coanda was a rather clever man in his field. MilborneOne (talk) 19:04, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Then why did you delete the picture of his plane that I added? Romanian-and-proud (talk) 19:07, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

 * Because this is an article on the jet engine which the piston-engined Coanda 1910 is clearly not, refer to the Coanda-1910 article for more information. MilborneOne (talk) 19:14, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

It was still a start. I didn't even say what it was, I just put the picture and it's name, let the reader decide whether it's a jet or not. It was a precursor. Can you respect that and give it the place it deserves, namely on this page? Romanian-and-proud (talk) 19:17, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

 * Sorry this is an encyclopedia we dont add pictures for the reader to ponder over we use reliable sourced information. So as the Coanda-1910 had nothing to do with the development of the jet engine either directly or by influence then it would be misleading to add it. Refer to the Coanda-1910 talk page for more information, thanks. MilborneOne (talk) 19:35, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

How do you know it had absolutely no influence? Hm? Can you prove that beyond any doubt? Romanian-and-proud (talk) 19:41, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

 * Because jet engines dont work the same way as Coandas piston-engined Turbo-Propulser, have a read of the Coanda-1910 talk page not much point in repeating the same discussion here. MilborneOne (talk) 20:32, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Year of invention of the turbojet
The article claims that "[t]he turbojet was invented in 1939". While the exact date on which the turbojet engine was invented is debatable, it was unquestionably before 1939, since Frank Whittle was testing a fully operational turbojet engine in 1937, having developed his design many years earlier. The article should be updated. BertyRussell (talk) 12:27, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

 * That was changed by an IP in October 2019, and looks to have been either sneaky vandalism or incompetence. Thanks for spotting the discrepancy. BilCat (talk) 18:12, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

Ngl, this article is kinnda bad
There are a ton of bad generalizations and factual inaccuracies. Some parts are good, but others are riddled with typos

Things that I think could be better:

The jet engine section states a rocket engine is a type of jet. This is not true, as jets are fundamentally different in form, performance, and use. According to the Britannica definition, a rocket engine is not a jet because it does not intake air.

The flying characteristics section is a mess. It is only stated that jets preform differently with no further explanation. Jet engine’s response time varies massively between different jets and aircraft, which makes stating that they respond slower inaccurately.

There are several grammatical errors throughout the article.

I.E: The Lockheed SR-71 was one of the fastest jet flying at Mach 3.35 (3,661 km/h (2,275 mph

Mach is used in the article without any mention of the altitude or temperature, which makes the measurement useless as it changes depending upon the situation.

i might add stuff later

Mr Balding (talk) 11:28, 11 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Jet aircraft