text:
M62 coach bombing

The M62 coach bombing, sometimes referred to as the M62 Massacre, occurred on 4 February 1974 on the M62 motorway in northern England, when a 25-pound (11 kg) Provisional Irish Republican Army (IRA) bomb hidden inside the luggage locker of a coach carrying off-duty British Armed Forces personnel and their family members exploded, killing twelve people (nine soldiers and three civilians) and injuring thirty-eight others aboard the vehicle.

Ten days after the bombing, 25-year-old Judith Ward was arrested in Liverpool while waiting to board a ferry to Ireland. She was later convicted of the M62 coach bombing and two other separate, non-fatal attacks and remained incarcerated until her conviction was quashed by the Court of Appeal in 1992, with the court hearing Government forensic scientists had deliberately withheld information from her defence counsel at her October 1974 trial which strongly indicated her innocence. As such, her conviction was declared unsafe.

Ward was released from prison in May 1992, having served over 17 years of a sentence of life imprisonment plus thirty years. Her wrongful conviction is seen as one of the worst miscarriages of justice in British legal history.

The M62 coach bomb has been described as "one of the IRA's worst mainland terror attacks" and remains one of the deadliest mainland acts of the Troubles.

The bombing
The bombed coach had been specially commissioned to carry British Army and Royal Air Force personnel—on weekend leave with their families—to and from bases at Catterick and Darlington during a period of railway strike action sourcing from a labour dispute. The vehicle itself had departed from Manchester in the late evening of Sunday 3 February and was travelling at approximately 60 mph along the M62 motorway en route to Catterick Garrison. Shortly after midnight, as most of those aboard were sleeping and when the bus was travelling between junctions 26 and 27 of the M62, the bomb—concealed within a suitcase or similar parcel inside the coach's luggage compartment—exploded.

The explosion reduced the rear of the coach to a "tangle of twisted metal", trapping several casualties within the debris and throwing individuals and severed limbs up to 250 yd upon and around the motorway. No other vehicle was damaged in the explosion, although the vehicle travelling immediately behind the coach is known to have ploughed into the scattered debris of the rear of the coach. The coach itself travelled for more than 200 yd before the driver, 39-year-old Roland Handley (himself injured by flying glass), was able to steer the coach to a halt upon the hard shoulder.

Immediate efforts
One surviving soldier later described his recollections of having been blown through the emergency doors of the coach, only to find himself lying upon the ground viewing a "mangled wreck". This soldier later assisted a young girl aged approximately 17 with injured legs whom he found lying on her back approximately 200 yd "back up the [motorway]". According to this individual, the girl had repeatedly hysterically screamed: "My God! The floor just opened up and I fell through!" as he provided medical assistance. Another survivor, nine-year-old David Dendeck, regained consciousness to find himself trapped in the wreckage of the coach listening to his 14-year-old sister, Catherine, shouting his name as he observed other survivors "screaming and running up the verge" alongside the coach.

One of the first motorists to offer assistance after Handley had navigated the coach to a halt was John Clark, who later recollected seeing a young man lying upon the motorway with one leg partially severed and the body of a child, stating: "It was just absolutely ... unbelievable. It was dark, so you couldn't see how bad the injuries really were, but it was the smell of it. It was absolutely total carnage."

The entrance hall of the nearby westbound section of the Hartshead Moor service station was used as an impromptu first aid station for those wounded in the blast. Off-duty staff at Bradford Royal Infirmary and Batley General Hospital were also contacted and encouraged to report for duty in response to the emergency.

Fatalities
The explosion killed eleven people outright and wounded over thirty others, one of whom died four days later. Amongst the dead were nine soldiers – two from the Royal Artillery, three from the Royal Corps of Signals and four from the 2nd Battalion Royal Regiment of Fusiliers. Four of the servicemen killed in the bombing were teenagers and all but one of the serving personnel killed in the explosion hailed from Greater Manchester. Twelve others upon the coach suffered severe injuries, including a six-year-old boy, who was badly burned. One member of the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers killed in the explosion was 23-year-old Corporal Clifford Haughton, whose entire family, consisting of his wife, Linda (also 23), and sons Lee, aged 5, and Robert, aged 2, were also killed. All four had been sitting directly above the bomb, and all were killed instantly.

Reaction
Although mainland Britain had seen several IRA attacks—successful or otherwise—within the previous year, the M62 coach bombing was the most severe attack upon the mainland to date. Press and public alike were incensed, with the BBC describing the bombing as "one of the IRA's worst mainland terror attacks" and national newspapers such as The Guardian describing the atrocity as an "IRA outrage on the British mainland". In Northern Ireland, the Ulster Defence Association launched a renewed wave of revenge attacks on Irish Catholics in response to the M62 coach bomb, promising their campaign of sectarian violence would continue unabated "until the IRA ceased [their] bombing in England". Within days of the bombings, loyalists had shot and killed three Catholic civilians and wounded a further eight, some critically.

Politicians from all three major parties called for "swift justice" against the perpetrator or perpetrators and the IRA in general. Within twenty-four hours of the explosion, demands had been heard in the Parliament of the United Kingdom that Irish citizens entering Britain be required to carry passports and other forms of identification at all times. The Secretary of State for Defence, Ian Gilmour, confirmed on 5 February these existing laws were to be reviewed.

IRA Army Council response
In an interview shortly after the bombing, IRA Army Council member Dáithí Ó Conaill was challenged over the choice of target, the lack of the official IRA protocol of a given advance warning, and the resulting deaths of civilians, including children. Ó Conaill replied that the coach was selected as a legitimate target because IRA intelligence had indicated that the vehicle was commissioned to carry military personnel only.

Investigation
Although a police spokesman initially emphasised that investigators were keeping an "open mind" as to the cause of the explosion, in the days immediately following the bombing, suspicion quickly fell upon the IRA, which had extended its campaign to England the previous year and had recently begun efforts to force the British Government to transfer four IRA members serving life imprisonment in English jails and currently engaging in hunger strikes to prisons in Northern Ireland.

The construction of the explosive device was typical of those used by the IRA. An analysis of fragments of the timing device recovered at the scene of the explosion revealed the device may have been set to detonate up to one hour before the explosion. As the vehicle had stopped in Oldham, Manchester Chorlton Street coach station, and finally Huddersfield to collect returning service personnel and their families prior to travelling towards Catterick Garrison, a possibility existed the device could have been placed in the vehicle in any of these three locations, although the timing of the explosion indicated the device would unlikely have been placed upon the vehicle in Huddersfield.

Investigators initially remained open-minded as to whether the perpetrator was a member of a UK-based cell, or had travelled across from Northern Ireland to commit the atrocity, as had been the case with regards to a previous IRA bombing at the Old Bailey.

Arrest of Judith Ward
At 6:30 a.m. on 14 February, police encountered a 25-year-old mentally ill English woman named Judith Teresa Ward standing in a shop doorway in Liverpool city centre, seeking shelter from the cold and rain. As her driving licence had been issued in Northern Ireland and a letter from the Royal Ulster Constabulary was also found in her possession, Ward was detained for questioning.

Police quickly discovered the address on Ward's driving licence was false. She was then asked how she intended to travel to Ireland with very little money in her possession. In response, she claimed to have intended to telephone a friend in Ireland who would send her the money. The same evening, with Ward's consent, forensic scientist Frank Skuse obtained swab samples from her hands and fingernails to conduct Griess tests. These tests revealed what Skuse described as "faint traces" of nitrites upon one of her nails. A subsequent forensic examination by Skuse of a caravan in which Ward had recently lived prior to her arrest also revealed what he concluded to be traces of nitroglycerin upon a duffel bag and other personal possessions.

According to police, shortly thereafter, Ward—who is known to have suffered from a personality disorder —made a verbal statement claiming to have been a member of the IRA since 1971, but that "after [the M62 coach bombing] I just want out". The following day, she was transferred to the custody of West Yorkshire Police to be questioned further with regards to the M62 coach bombing.

Confessions
The ensuing police investigation was led by Detective Chief Superintendent George Oldfield. This investigation would prove to be rushed, careless and ultimately forged, but culminated in Ward claiming culpability for the M62 coach bombing and two separate, non-fatal explosions. Initially, Ward was questioned by two members of the Metropolitan Police Service at Wakefield's Police Training College. The conclusion of the Detective Inspector and Detective Constable following the first of their three interviews with Ward on 16 February was that she held "poor knowledge" of the construction of explosive devices and, although discrepancies were noted between the various oral statements Ward made and earlier statements she and others had provided to investigators, by 7:45 p.m., Ward had provided a written confession claiming culpability for the M62 coach bombing. She would initially be charged with conspiracy to cause an explosion on the M62 motorway on 18 February.

According to Ward's confessions, she was an "IRA volunteer" who had planted the M62 coach bomb in the luggage compartment of the coach while the vehicle was parked at Manchester Chorlton Street coach station. The luggage compartment had already been open when she, "shaking like a leaf", placed the bag containing the bomb between "a few army issue bags" in the luggage compartment. She had then turned and "legged it" out of the station, expecting the bomb to explode in twenty minutes.

By 25 February, West Yorkshire investigators had established that Ward's employment with a travelling circus had taken her to the market town of Chipping Norton in the Cotswold Hills on 3 February. Over a dozen independent witnesses were able to confirm this fact, thus meaning Ward could not have physically placed the bomb upon the coach as she had previously claimed. According to official records, on this date, Ward asked to see a Detective Superintendent Weight, exclaiming: "I want to see you about that statement I made to the other officers. I want to change it. I didn't put the bomb on that bus." The records further state Weight replied, "Yes, I know that." Ward then changed her statement to claim she had transported the bomb from Derby to a house in Longsight, Manchester and that, as the circus was to travel to Chipping Norton on the intended date of the bombing, she informed the two occupants of the house they would "have to do" the bombing. Ward then volunteered she "[knew] something about the Latimer job" she also wished to confess. The following day, in the presence of George Oldfield, Ward wrote a confession claiming culpability for transporting the explosives used in the September 1973 Euston bombing.

Ward also claimed to have conducted a string of operational activities for the IRA in both Belfast and mainland Britain in 1973 and 1974, to have been married to a deceased IRA member named Michael McVerry, and to have borne a child to another IRA member. However, although a supporter of Sinn Féin and likely knowing several individuals involved in IRA activity, she had no firm connections with the IRA. The IRA would subsequently issue a statement confirming this fact.

The following month, Ward was shown a written copy of the statement she had provided on 16 February. She emphatically denied sections of the statement, insisting several claims she had supposedly made had been fabricated by investigators, although she did concede she had made some false claims regarding transporting what she believed to be explosives in a direct response to pressure from a Detective Superintendent Moffatt.

On 11 and 18 June—after Ward had been formally charged with various atrocities including the M62 coach bombing and without the knowledge of her solicitor—Oldfield again questioned Ward. The records of these interviews were removed from police files and transferred to the Metropolitan Police Service for security reasons. Early the following month, Ward attempted suicide by cutting her wrist shortly after being diagnosed with severe depression and on 24 August, a night orderly officer observed her attempting to injure her wrists by incessantly rubbing them against her bed straps.

Suspect background
Ward had been born in Stockport, England, on 10 January 1949. She was the second of five children born to an English mother and an Irish father. Contemporary records indicate she was a lonely child who was raised in a broken home. Upon leaving school in 1965, Ward trained as a riding instructor and stable hand in Wiltshire, England before obtaining employment at a riding school in Ravensdale, County Louth, Ireland, close to the town of Dundalk. In the years between leaving school and her arrest, she had frequently divided her time between Ravensdale, Wiltshire, and her home town of Stockport, which she had first returned to from Dundalk in October 1970.

In February 1971, Ward enlisted in the Women's Royal Army Corps (WRAC). Her basic training saw Ward spend approximately four months at Catterick Garrison before she was transferred to Aldershot, Hampshire on 5 August 1971 to serve as a communications centre operator. Two months later, Ward went absent without leave and returned to Dundalk, where she briefly became engaged to a young man named Sean McKeowan. Although McKeowan himself was disinterested in any form of politics, Ward is known to have frequently drunk in Dundalk pubs where, according to acquaintances, she frequently socialised with men affiliated with the Official IRA. She is also known to have briefly lived under the alias Teresa O'Connell, on one occasion listing her age when briefly detained by the Royal Ulster Constabulary as 14 years, eight months.

The following year, Ward returned to England, being discharged from the WRAC shortly thereafter. She briefly worked in a restaurant before returning to Dundalk to again work as a riding instructor in August 1972. She returned to England the following summer; initially residing with family in Stanbury Place, Offerton, Stockport.

On 26 August 1973, Ward was discovered sleeping rough on the concourse of Euston railway station and detained for questioning. Shortly thereafter, she obtained employment as a chambermaid at a hotel near the Elephant and Castle. This employment lasted until she was dismissed on 10 November. The same day, Ward travelled to Ireland via Holyhead.

January–February 1974
In the weeks prior to her arrest, Ward had lived a somewhat nomadic and destitute lifestyle; alternately sleeping rough around Euston station and hitchhiking to locations such as Cardiff to temporarily sleep at the house of an acquaintance. Less than two weeks prior to her arrest, Ward obtained employment as a groom with Chipperfields Circus. She commenced her employment with the circus in Belle Vue, Manchester on 26 January. Shortly thereafter, the circus relocated to the Cotswolds, arriving at Chipping Norton at approximately 2:30 a.m. on 3 February. That evening, Ward and several colleagues visited the local Blue Boar pub on nearby Goddards Lane, remaining at this venue for several hours. The following day, Ward quit her employment.

Ward's appeals state that in the days prior to her arrest, she had most often slept rough around Euston station and Primrose Hill with a man named Ernest Mayall and a woman referred to in her appeal transcripts as a "Welsh girl", both of whom she later claimed to have first met in London on 8 February. Four days later, she and Mayall travelled by bus to Cardiff, with Ward leaving the duffel bags she had purchased in Chipping Norton inside a freight container. The following day, Ward hitchhiked from Cardiff to Liverpool, arriving in Liverpool at approximately 11:30 p.m. on 13 February. She was planning to travel to Newry, Northern Ireland when arrested early the following day.

Trial
Ward's trial began before Mr Justice Waller at Wakefield Crown Court on 3 October 1974. She was charged with fifteen separate offences consisting of twelve charges of murder relating to the fatalities of the bombing, causing an explosion likely to endanger life and property with regards to this particular incident, and two separate, non-fatal IRA attacks at Euston railway station and the Latimer National Defence College committed in September 1973 and February 1974 respectively. Ward pleaded not guilty to all charges. Initial arraignment hearings were held on this date.

Although Ward's confessions had been coerced and distorted by some members of the investigating team prior to her trial, all the content within her confessions was presented by the prosecution as being "backed up by overwhelming scientific evidence".

Prosecutor John Cobb QC described Ward as an IRA agent, active in "major operations" on mainland Britain. The prosecution's case was almost completely based on her own claims of culpability (which Ward had retracted prior to her trial), weak circumstantial evidence and what would later be described as "demonstrably wrong" scientific evidence delivered by four witnesses who testified on behalf of the prosecution, which had sourced from the Griess tests conducted by Skuse and others.

To support the prosecution's contentions, several witnesses testified as to verbal statements Ward had made indicating her sympathies with the concept of Irish republicanism. A member of the Metropolitan Police Service was also called to testify as to statements Ward had made following her August 1973 arrest for vagrancy in London in which she had claimed to police to have "carried out assignments" for the IRA, but was not a member of the organisation. On 23 October, Ward repeated her disprovable claims to have been married to the deceased Michael McVerry.

Ward's defence attorney, Andrew Rankin, QC, refuted the prosecution contentions, insisting the forensic evidence presented could be easily explained as sourcing from cross-contamination and describing his client as a "female Walter Mitty" character, for whom fantasy had become reality, who was perhaps seeking notoriety in Irish folklore. Referencing the "rambling, incoherent and improbable" statements Ward had made to police, Rankin outlined the numerous inconsistencies and alterations she had made which indicated she had not been telling the truth and stressed to the jury the IRA would be extremely unlikely to accept or to trust an individual of sheer incompetence and who had, prior to 1974, come to the attention of the police and the Army in both Northern Ireland and England on several occasions.

The accuracy of the forensic testimony of the experts who testified that Ward's hands and possessions had tested positive for traces of nitroglycerin was seldom challenged by Ward's defence counsel, who contended she and her possessions may have become cross-contaminated via contact with an acquaintance who had been the original source of the traces of explosive materials. The prosecution witnesses refuted these claims.

Closing arguments
In the prosecution's closing argument, Cobb repeatedly referred to the physical evidence which he portrayed as conclusive proof Ward had handled explosives, emphasising the insistence of Skuse and others who had delivered forensic testimony on behalf of the prosecution that their findings were conclusive. Ward's confessions were also outlined as her willing admissions of guilt. Ward was described as a ruthless individual with a sole passion for her "political aim" to unite all of Ireland. Acknowledging that others should also be prosecuted for the three bombings, Cobb concluded his speech by stating to the jury: "You are sitting in judgment on the gravest charge, short of treason, ever known. There are, perhaps, bigger fish in the sea, but [Ward is] no sprat".

Rankin again disputed the sourcing of the traces of explosive material, insisting Ward had inadvertently become cross-contaminated and reiterating his client's ineptitude, vivid fantasy life, and the numerous inconsistencies within her repeatedly altered statements. Rankin then asked the jury to question why, had Ward been active within the IRA, did she not attempt to flee the country following the M62 coach bomb rather than travelling to London, making no attempt to conceal her identity.

Conviction
The jury deliberated for five hours and forty minutes before reaching their verdicts. On 4 November 1974, Ward was found guilty of all charges. She was sentenced to serve five years' imprisonment in relation to the Euston railway station bombing, twenty years' imprisonment in relation to the coach bombing, to be served concurrently with the sentence relating to the Euston bombing, twelve concurrent terms of life imprisonment with no recommended minimum term of imprisonment in relation to each of the fatalities of the coach bombing, plus ten years' consecutive imprisonment in relation to the Latimer bombing, thus meaning she would have to serve a minimum sentence of thirty years' imprisonment before being eligible for parole.

Ward remained impassive as the verdict was read aloud, although members of her family—who remained steadfast in their belief of her innocence—burst into tears. She did not appeal her conviction, although she repeatedly protested her innocence throughout her years of incarceration. Although the validity of her conviction was independently reviewed on three occasions between 1985 and 1989, and each review uncovered serious flaws with regards to the evidence presented at her trial and the legal conduct of various individuals prior to and following her confessions, she remained incarcerated at HM Prison Durham before being transferred to HM Prison Holloway in November 1990, where she remained as a Category B prisoner.

IRA statement
Shortly after Ward's November 1974 convictions, the Irish Republican Publicity Bureau issued a formal statement pertaining to her arrest and conviction. This statement again emphasised that Ward had not been a member of the IRA and that she had taken no role in any of the activities for which she had been convicted, stating: "Miss Ward was not a member of Óglaigh na hÉireann and was not used in any capacity by the organisation. She had nothing to do whatsoever with the [M62 coach bombing], the bombing of Euston station and the attack on Latimer Military College. Those acts were authorised operations carried out by units of the Irish Republican Army."

Court of Appeal hearing
On 17 September 1991, the Home Secretary referred Ward's case to the Court of Appeal, with the primary reasons for this referral being the validity of the scientific evidence presented by Skuse and others at her trial, and that the prosecution had failed to disclose relevant evidence to her defence team, as they had been legally obliged to do. Ward's appeal specifically listed 43 items of evidence "consisting of, or contained in witness statements, notes of interviews and reports (including medical reports)" which had not been disclosed at her trial.

In May 1992, Ward's lawyers illustrated the fundamental flaws in the physical evidence presented at her trial before three Court of Appeal judges. Her barrister, Michael Mansfield, QC, contended there had been a "significant and substantial non-disclosure" of evidence and information which had strongly indicated her innocence, and that of the 63 interviews West Yorkshire Police had conducted with Ward before and after her confession, only 34 had been disclosed at trial. Furthermore, the court also heard that the handling of lacquers, boot polish and other commodities in common public use by any individual would produce the same positive results presented at Ward's trial as proof of their having handled—or come into contact with—explosive substances, as contended by Skuse and others. This information was known to forensic experts in 1974, but had also never been disclosed at her original trial, or in the intervening years despite her protestations of innocence and subsequent developments with regards to other uncovered miscarriages of justice.

The evidence presented at Ward's appeal also heard that although police, forensic experts, psychiatrists and prosecutors had withheld multiple documents from the prosecution counsel at her original trial, that of the evidence the prosecution team had been provided access to, the prosecution had themselves withheld much of their own evidence from Ward's own defence counsel. The Crown also heard that although Ward was insistent she had not been subjected to physical violence by interrogators, at the time of her false confessions, she suffered from a severe personality disorder which had arisen from acute loneliness, insecurity and sexual identity conflicts, and that her confessions had been obtained under extreme duress and her desire to simply "be left alone".

The Court of Appeal unanimously ruled that Ward's conviction was "a grave miscarriage of justice" and conceded that her confession had ultimately been obtained by law enforcement personnel "under pressure to [obtain] a confession" from an individual regarding his or her culpability in the atrocities. Delivering final judgment at the conclusion of these appeal hearings, Lord Justice Iain Glidewell stated: "Our law does not permit a conviction to be secured by ambush."

Release
Ward was released on bail, pending the conclusion of the legal proceedings of her appeal, on 11 May 1992, with Lord Justice Glidewell not immediately dismissing the charges against Ward, but stating a reversal of her sentence was fully expected. She exited the courtroom to a positive public reaction, having wrongly served over seventeen years' imprisonment. Although Ward was the first of eighteen innocent English and Irish nationals known to have been falsely convicted of IRA atrocities, she was the last to be released from custody.

Upon exiting the court, Ward shouted to all present, "Eighteen years! Freedom! After eighteen years, it's brilliant!" before being driven to a secret, safe address pending the conclusion of the legal hearings. Shortly thereafter, on 4 June, her conviction was formally overturned. Ward was later compensated for her wrongful conviction.

Aftermath
The most enduring consequence of the M62 coach bombing was the adoption of much stricter anti-terrorism laws in Great Britain and Northern Ireland. These laws enabled police to hold individuals suspected of terrorism for up to seven days without charge, and to deport these individuals to Northern Ireland to face trial, where special courts with specific rules applying to terrorism suspects were based.

A memorial to those killed in the M62 coach bombing was later erected at Hartshead Moor service station, where many of the casualties had received impromptu first aid following the explosion. Following a campaign by relatives of the deceased, a larger memorial was later erected several yards away from the entrance hall to the service station, close to an English oak tree planted in 2009 in memory of the deceased. This memorial stone also bears a plaque inscribed with the names and ages of those who died.

The service station itself is the venue for annual memorial services commemorating those killed, injured and bereaved by the atrocity. These annual services are regularly attended by the Mayors of Kirklees, Calderdale and Oldham in addition to members of the Royal British Legion. A memorial plaque engraved with the names and ages of the fatalities of the M62 coach bomb was also unveiled in Oldham, the home town of two of the fatalities, in 2010.

Ward initially struggled with life as a free woman following the overturning of her conviction, in part because of the lack of a support structure she received from society after she had been formally exonerated. In 1996, Ward recollected to a reporter that, immediately prior to her release from prison, she was simply "given £35 and a hand-written note to produce at [the] DSS" before being released from custody with no individuals to offer advice, therapy, or other forms of support. As had earlier been the case with Gerry Conlon of the Guildford Four, Ward initially resided with solicitor Gareth Peirce until a secure home could be found for her.

Ward later wrote an autobiography, Ambushed: My Story, detailing her life, conviction, exoneration, and subsequent experiences following her release from prison. She later became a campaigner for prisoners' rights with the Britain and Ireland Human Rights Centre.

In October 1985, Frank Skuse was ordered by the Home Office to retire on the grounds of "limited efficiency" just days after the broadcasting of a World in Action documentary which strongly questioned his competency. Within a year of his retirement, all 350 cases in which Skuse had provided forensic evidence throughout his career had been reassessed.

The actual perpetrator or perpetrators of the M62 coach bombing were never arrested or convicted.

title: M62 coach bombing


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text:
User:Francis Tyers/Fuck the Border

For inspiration, see the song Fuck the Border by the band Propagandhi

Confirmed (more than 10 people confirmed) Partial confirmation (more than one person confirmed) Unconfirmed (written by one person)

* Transliterated, or otherwise not written in the correct writing system.

Confirmed
Fuck the border (English)

Scheiß auf die Grenze (German)

Scheiss auf die Grenze (Swiss German), (Liechtensteinian German)

Á merda coas fronteiras (Galego)

Nique les frontières (French)

Persetan dengan perbatasan (Indonesian)

На хуй границу / В пизду границу / (Да) Ебал я (эту) границу (Russian)

Да и го начукам на границата, Еби я границата, Да я еба границата (Bulgarian)

Schaiss op d'Grenz (Luxembourgish)

Chinga la frontera (Mexican Spanish)

Putiar la frontera (Colombian Spanish)

Piedrāzt robežu (Latvian)

Foda-se a fronteira (Portuguese)

Jebeš mejo (Slovenian)

Să fut granițele (Romanian)

Γαμώ τα σύνορα (Greek)

Cəhənnəm olsun sərhədlər (Azeri)

Sınırları sikeyim (Turkish)

Jebeš granicu / Јебеш границу (Serbo-Croatian)

Јебеш границу (Bosnian), (Serbian), (Montenegrin)

Jebeš granicu (Bosnian), (Croatian), (Serbian), (Montenegrin)

Еби ја границата (Macedonian)

Bazd meg a határokat (Hungarian)

Fottitene dei limiti (Italian)

זין על הגבול (Hebrew)

くたばれ国境 (Japanese)

نيك الحدود (Arabic)

Velniop sienas (Lithuanian)

Pierdol granicę (Polish)

Fuck grænsen (Danish)

Persse kõik piirid (Estonian)

Të qifsha kufirin (Albanian)

سرحد كو چود دو (Urdu)

سرحد وغیه (Pashto)

পৃথিবীর সব সীমান্ত জাহান্নামে যাক (Bengali)

सीमाओं को चोदो (Hindi)

Twll din i'r ffin (Welsh)

Futã-le madzinle (Aromanian)

Fuck de grens (Dutch)

Partial Confirmation
Сархадро гой (Tajik)

مرز را بگای // به مرز فاتحه بخوان // بی خیالِ مرز (Persian)

Chegarani sikay (Uzbek)

Me cago en la puta frontera / ¡Al diablo las fronteras! (Spanish)

Muga zirikatu (Basque)

De grens kan mijn kloten kussen (Vlaams)

Til helvítis með landamærin (Icelandic)

Vittuun raja // Vitut rajoista // Vitut rajasta (Finnish)

Síos leis an teorainn / Don diabhal leis an teorainn / Scrios ar an teorainn (Irish)

Skit i gränsen (Swedish)

Til helvete med grensa (Norwegian)

Fuck les frontières / Merde aux frontières (Quebec French)

Harzoù, kaoc'h ki / Kaoc'h d'an harzoù (Breton)

Քունեմ սահմանը (Armenian)

Fiku la landlimon (Esperanto)

打破边界 / 打破邊界 (dǎpò biānjiè) (Chinese)

ᎠᏟᎶᏛ ᎬᎪᏛ ᎪᏣᎴᏍᏗᏱ (Cherokee)

Fines perfutue (Latina)

Unconfirmed
Pal' carajo con la frontera / Me cago en la frontera (Cuban Spanish)

Fok die grens (Afrikaans)

te korgretro .i'enaicai. (Lojban)

Zkurvené hranice / do prdele s hranicemi (Czech)

Immorru jitnejku l-konfini bejn il-pajjiżi (Maltese)

Sempadan jahanam / Sempadan yang musnah (Malay)

Ora aturan (Bahasa Jawa)

Brukim olgeta arere (Tok Pisin)

Jwaa afabai (Ga)

Sangsar yek hos (Nepali) *

S-fut marzinili (Megleno-Romanian)

דרעק אױף די גרענעץ  (Yiddish)

الیه نگری سنور نیم (Sorani Kurdish)

Ez di sînora nim (Kurmancî Kurdish)

Skurvené hranice / Jebat hranice (Slovak)

Нахуй з кордоном (Ukrainian)

നാശം അതിറ്ത്തികള് (Malayalam)

Ko malspo le jecyjimte (Lojban)

Fute-ți-ai granițele! (Urban Transylvanian Romanian)

Frecaténn e le cunfénera (Napolitan)

Incorrect
不 必 拿 用 復 曹 (Traditional Chinese)

不 必 拿 用 复 曹 (Simplified Chinese)

Bawah dengan sempadan / pergi jahanam dengan undang-undang (Malay)

국경을 성교하요 (Korean)

Navê sînoran nim (Kurmancî Kurdish)

ﺑﻴﮕﯽ ﺣدود (Soraní Kurdish)

国界是猪想出来的！ (Simplified Chinese)

Bwchio y goror / Lawr a'r ffiniau / Ffwci a'r ffin / Wfft i'r ffin / Fwwcio y goror / Ffwrcho yr gororau (Welsh)

Til helvede med grænsen (Danish) — correct but superceded

title: User:Francis Tyers/Fuck the Border


text:
Talk:Canadian women's national ice hockey team

Untitled
Feb 14, 1998: Canada 4-7 USA @ Nagano, Japan Mar 22, 1990: Canada 18-0 Japan @ Ottawa, Canada

The team jerseys in today's game against Italy were black and red.. have they changed? 131.111.8.96 22:21, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

That is Team Canada's third jersey. But yes, the jerseys have changed. There are vertical stripes added to the side of all of Canada's jerseys.

Need to add another Gold championship to the Nations Cup chart, Canada just recently defeated the US in a shootout to win it in Kamloops, BC.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.237.224.154 (talk) 03:58, 11 November 2014 (UTC)

24.84.150.172 06:51, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

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text:
Talk:China women's national ice hockey team

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Image copyright problem with File:China national ice hockey team Home & Away Jerseys.png
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history?
The history section starts with: "The Chinese women's national team is ranked 7th in the world." When? Sometime in their history? The infobox has the latest ranking as #20, and their best result was 4th, most lately at 1998 Olympic Games, and they most recently played in top level at 2010 Olympics. That claim badly needs a citation. 109.240.175.208 (talk) 22:32, 13 April 2019 (UTC)
 * It is just out of date, they were ranked 7th or 8th from the beginning of the rankings (2003) until 2010.18abruce (talk) 23:37, 13 April 2019 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Finland women's national ice hockey team

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Talk:Germany women's national ice hockey team

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text:
Talk:Kazakhstan women's national ice hockey team

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text:
Talk:Ranald MacDonald

Discussion
I just started this article, additions and further editing highly appreciated.

The information is mostly based on the first article cited as an external link, as it was the best I could find, but some of it is based off other things I've read. Sources do no agree on the number of samurai selected to study English under MacDonald. My Japanese texbook has an article that claims 12, and I have a tendency to believe that, but I've found more online sources proclaiming 14, so that is the number I used in the article. I also saw 7 mentioned somewhere.--Lord Shitzu 22:31, Apr 18, 2005 (UTC)

Wow this page really took off, nice work PHG and others!--Lord Shitzu 14:54, Jun 17, 2005 (UTC)

I get the feeling that this story is being handled with kid gloves, or bowderized, and it's a little obnoxious. Nothing at all makes sense. How did he possibly convince the captain to give him a boat to go to shore? Was there deception involved?

Then he gets on a warship and leaves Japan 10 months after teaching English. Was he expelled from the country or was it voluntary?

Not even the most basic, and I would say, complete essential details of this incident (the defining incident of Macdonald's life) are provided. Without those details it's more or less impossible to understand the context or why these events happened. I didn't even know about Macdonald until this last hour. But I might have to do some research just to try to make this story not sound like someone describing a dream they had, where everything happens for no reason at all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.173.101.236 (talk) 13:50, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

I have issues with one line of this article "This mixed heritage made MacDonald a Métis, a person who straddles two cultures." - there are several problems with it. a Métis (capital M) is not simply "a person who straddles two cultures" - it's a member of a specific community that arose out of multiple cultures, and membership is not automatic because of coming from a mixed heritage. Ranald was Métis not only because of the mixed heritage, but also because the Métis community in BC/Oregon routinely adopted the mixed-blood children of fort employees. In addition to his mixed heritage, his step-mother was Métis, and he was educated in the Red River and raised around Métis, as a Métis, and as a result he was Métis. If it was just as a result of his biracial/mixed heritage, he would be métis, not Métis. I have changed the line to "MacDonald was a Métis." as I'm not sure how to clarify all of this, and don't think that this page is really the place to specify exactly what is or is not a Métis, or to differentiate between métis and Métis.--User:muskwatch —Preceding undated comment added 16:45, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Archibald McDonald
I edited the name of Ranald MacDonald's father, for though all of his sons spelled it MacDonald, Archibald himself spelled his surname McDonald. I can find citations for this, immediately if you like links, but I can find offline reference to it as well, if necessary. I know a bit about this because Samuel MacDonald, Ranald's half-brother, was my great-great-great grandfather, and I was actually just gathering up the research to write an article, at least a stub, on Archibald, when I noticed that someone had reverted my edit. Please do not do this again, as McDonald is in fact the proper spelling. Thanks.

embryomystic 16:32, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the clarification. In the future, if you use edit summaries your legitimate changes will be less likely to be reverted. Happy editing and thanks for fixing the redirect to Chief Comcomly. If you find more on him please be sure to add it. Katr67 16:56, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

 * That explanation makes sense. Since it was also spelled MacDonald on Chief Comcomly's page (until Katr67 fixed it), it looked like a mistake.  Thanks for your edits. Neier 22:16, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

title: Talk:Ranald MacDonald


text:
Talk:Russia women's national ice hockey team

Fair use rationale for Image:Hockeyrussia.PNG
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text: Talk:Cumbia rap

title: Talk:Cumbia rap


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Talk:Sweden women's national ice hockey team

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text:
Talk:Allan Cup

Columns
The current "div" format for columns is not resolving. We need a better solution. Flibirigit (talk) 23:55, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
 * At first, I left out the trailing close div tag. I fixed that. Is it still not ok in your browser? In my browser, using the tables created a 'huge' white area to the right of the table, and three columns fit it well. I am using 1024x768. Alaney2k (talk) 00:16, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Must be nice to have a big screen. But it's still not working on any computer I use. Flibirigit (talk) 01:19, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Fort Frances Canadians
Just a note that information on the 1952 Allan Cup winning Fort Frances Canadians can be found at Fort Frances Times website —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.45.184.101 (talk • contribs)

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Template:Allan Cup
Template:Allan Cup should be created as an Infobox with all the seasons.  TheAE  talk / sign  05:27, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

title: Talk:Allan Cup


text: Talk:U Sports men's ice hockey championship


text:
Talk:Calder Cup

Work
Adding full team names an wikify is on my to do list ccwaters 13:26, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:CalderCupTrophy.gif
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text: Talk:Stafford Smythe Memorial Trophy

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Talk:Bill Masterton Memorial Trophy

Flags
I've removed the flags people put on some players. They're not necessary. RasputinAXP  c   14:30, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

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The TROPHY
Judging by the photograph, it should be possible for someone to add some text to the article about the trophy itself, perhaps 2-3 sentences of description, info about what it's made of, who designed it, etc. (Whatever such info is available.) If this is done, please be sure to add the article to Category:Sports trophies as well. Thanks! Anomalous+0 (talk) 10:57, 29 April 2019 (UTC)

2019
https://www.lighthousehockey.com/2019/6/19/18692275/nhl-awards-2019-robin-lehners-bill-masterton-trophy-fight-stigma

I don't know how to format this page. The Mo-Ja'al (talk) 01:34, 20 June 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Bill Masterton Memorial Trophy


text:
Talk:Calder Memorial Trophy

2004-2005 and 2005-2006
As far as I can see on the NHL website and some others, no calder was awarded in 04-05 and the 2005-2006 trophy was not awarded yet. Please wait for the NHL to annouce it before handing Ovechkin the trophy... BobbyJTHais 16:08, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Ovechkin isn't even a shoe-in, Dion Phaneuf of the Calgary Flames is a contender also, Crosby though is out of the race. The awards are tonight!! Max.pwnage 15:37, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Calder trophy runner ups
I would like to see this data added to the wiki. Sometimes it's interesting to see when a player wins the Calder and then disappears or is overshadowed by a runner up over the length of a full career. Does anyone know where to get this data?

Stipulations
What exactly are the stipulations for a "Rookie in the NHL"? Gretzky did not win in his first season because of prior professional experience, whereas Ovechkin won, despite playing pro in Russia. Furthermore, Ken Dryden won it after winning the Stanley Cup and Conn Smythe with the Canadiens. 21:10, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

i believe that the stipulation for gretzky was that if you played in the whl (wha i cant remember what it was called) your were not a contender for the award. the reason dryden won the stanley cup and conn smythe before the calder was because he did not play the required number of games in the nhl to count towards being considered a rookie the year he won the cup. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.110.227.163 (talk) 19:15, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Also what are the minimum number of games a rookie needs to play to qualify for the Calder trophy? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.204.201.172 (talk) 17:37, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Photos
Can we please add a picture of Bryan Berard here? There is not even a picture of him on his own main page. I have a picture below that was taken the same year he won the Calder: http://i24.tinypic.com/iqamol.jpg Bryan Berard is an inspiration to anyone with a disability.
 * Is it your image or one you found somewhere? -- Scorpion0422 15:48, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

How to insert pictures
I tried to place Pavel Bure in but i messed up.Starwars1791 (talk) 03:14, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
 * The page has enough images. If you're going to add one, at least remove one. -- Scorpion 0422  03:15, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Sorry, but thanks for adding Pavel Bure.--Starwars1791 (talk) 03:16, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

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Copyright problem removed
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Eligibility Requirements (and odd priorities more generally)
Shouldn't the article state what the eligibility requirements are?

I believe you can't have played more than 30 games in any previous season or 6 games in more than one previous season. There's also an age maximum which was added after Sergei Makarov controversially won it in his age 30 season.

(I don't think there's a minimum number of games but I don't know 100% for sure, in fact that's what I came here to check! It's often claimed Dryden didn't win a year earlier because of some minimum he didn't meet but I'm pretty sure that isn't true.)

These are among the most obvious things for this article to include, but none of it is explicitly stated anywhere in the current article (which would be a stub if not for the list, frankly). The 30-game part is sort of implied in the odd digression about Belfour but that's weird too. What's so notable about Belfour's season that it warrants a paragraph in this very scanty article, whereas other players who had more of an impact on the award's history (Makarov) or are more notable for other reasons (Dryden winning the Conn Smythe before the Calder, why Gretzky didn't win) are nowhere to be seen.

I swear this article used to be much more in-depth and include this information. Where did it go? 50.72.61.76 (talk) 11:18, 29 August 2023 (UTC)

 * What's notable about Belfour's season is that some editor sought to include it; nothing weirder than that. I agree that the eligibility requirements should be in the article, but one factor is that they've changed, and more than once.  I'll address a few of them.   Ravenswing      11:59, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Looks great! Thanks for your work on this. You should know at least one person appreciated it. (Probably a lot more will over time, whether they realize it or not.) 50.72.61.76 (talk) 09:52, 31 August 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Calder Memorial Trophy


text:
Talk:Clarence S. Campbell Bowl

Untitled
I'd like to see someone write about the supposed 'curse' of lifting up the bowl? I don't really remember exactly what happened to spur that one. Did have something with Trevor Linden lifting it up and dropping the lid? Or did he lift it up in spite of the 'curse'. Marcus1060 07:55, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

 * As a Red Wing fan, I'm pretty I've seen Steve Yzerman lift the bowl up when the Wings have won the conference title. The Prince of Wales Trophy seems to be more consistently shunned. 69.137.220.179 03:36, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Depends on the year. You bring up the example of Mr. Yzerman; in 1995 he made quite a demonstration of winning the Campbell Bowl and was criticized when the team was swept by NJ; in 1998 he skated off the ice basically holding the trophy with one arm at his side as though he planned on throwing it in a trash receptacle in the locker room; in 2002, he raised it above his head and celebrated in a reserved but noticeable fashion. I'm not sure that there's any generalizable comment to be made about any kind of "jinx," and it's funny you mention an interesting case study of one man who exhibited the entire spectrum of reactions to the trophy.

 * In 2003 Paul Kariya refused to touch the Bowl while ScottStevens picked up the Prince of Wales Trophy and skated off with it. And who won the Cup? The Devils did. Goes to show the superstitions are stupid. I watched when Vancouver won the West, they called it the Clarence Campbell TROPHY Did they suddenly change the name of it?MrNWA4Life 22:16, 4 June 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.202.119.152 (talk)

Shift in Criteria
This might demand a separate article about the Campbell/Western Conference, but I would like to see the list of teams that would have won the trophy had the criteria not been changed (or, alternatively, if the present criteria had been in effect all along).
 * As for the current reorganization of the chart, I think it was better when we grouped the two regular season champion lists into one, and the two playoff champion lists into one. It took me quite a while before I actually understood the boilerplate convoluted chronology of the trophy's meaning at the NHL website. Once I realized that the Campbell Conference was the successor to the Western Division, and that the Western Conference was the successor to the Campbell Conference, I realized the only thing that had really changed was the trophy switched from a regular season award to a postseason award, and that for the duration of its entire history it's been awarded to a team from the "same" institution, an institution that has gone through 3 names (Western Division, Campbell Conference, Western Conference). So I liked it better when the chart suggested that when it put "Western Division/Campbell Conference" and "Campbell/Western Conference."
 * For your information, we already have seperate articles on each conference and division. Please see Category:Historical National Hockey League Divisions for a list of them. Zzyzx11 (Talk) 15:22, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I am aware of this, but it seems (to me) like an unnecessary cross-reference to make a person go through. I am reasonably knowledgable on how the NHL operates and like I say, when I first was exposed to the NHL's description of the history of the Campbell Bowl (and the PoW Trophy) I was a bit befuddled before I realized there weren't quite as many jumps as it sounded, since a lot of the "changes" were just name changes and not substantive shifts in the criteria.

1878-1967
Does anyone know where this trophy was, and if it had ever been awarded for anything, between its construction in 1878 and its inception into the NHL in 1967? The article feels incomplete without addressing this ninety year time gap. Aspirex (talk) 04:53, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, the only reliable sources I have seen just merely state where and when the piece was made, but not its physical history or where it came from before the league obtained it. The closest I have seen is this forum thread, where posters compare the Campbell Bowl to other similar decorated cups, but even they do not have any information on the Campbell Bowl's physical history. Cheers. Zzyzx11 (talk) 05:23, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

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2021
In mid-May 2021, the league had announced that with the suspension of conferences because of COVID-19, both conference trophies would not be awarded this season. Now in June that the 2021 Semifinals are now known, that the Canadiens will face the Knights and the Islanders will go against the Lightning, the NHL PR dept is now saying that they will be presented after all. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Zzyzx11 (talk) 04:26, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

It should also be reiterated here (for WP:CONSENSUS purposes) that the 2021 award was NOT for a conference championship per the per the NHL, it was awarded to the semifinals winner: "Because of temporary divisional realignment due to COVID-19 this season, the third round of the playoffs was renamed the semifinals, instead of the conference finals." Just as a pointer for the IP edit war going on at Montreal Canadiens. Yosemiter (talk) 16:01, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Clarence S. Campbell Bowl


text: Category:Nova remnants

title: Category:Nova remnants


text:
Talk:Conn Smythe Trophy

Flags
I removed the flags from the players; they're not necessary. RasputinAXP  c   14:37, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Positions
Added positions to winners. Some added as the generic Forward instead of an individual position. Corrections welcome. MrDolomite 18:15, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Picture
Could we use a different picture? The picture of that random kid in the background is inappropriate and kind of annoying. It looks very unprofessional. And silly, too. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jdjd021 (talk • contribs) 04:08, 16 August 2014 (UTC)

Table position
On my computer in both Chrome and Edge browsers the list of winners appears below the references, although editing it seems to show nothing wrong. Not sure if this is happening for others but if it is perhaps someone with more editing experience can find out what's wrong LilSanta (talk) 22:53, 8 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Fixed. An editor broke the code that closed the table and caused that error.  Thanks for noting it! Resolute 23:57, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

Kane's draft status on table
Can we get rid of the special distinction for Patrick Kane having been a first overall draft choice / still active player? I don't think that's relevant to the Conn Smythe discussion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:547:4180:1B10:2954:50BE:8A1A:51BF (talk) 15:50, 7 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Agreed and done. I removed the shading for retired first overall picks as well. Those were just colour for the sake of colour. Resolute 16:39, 7 June 2016 (UTC)

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion: You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. Community Tech bot (talk) 22:51, 12 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Alex-ovechkin 14r7ml8k4c66j1j8ia8qygwxjy.jpg

Justin Williams
Justin Williams is listed as being on the losing team but winning the Conn Smythe. This is incorrect. The Kings won the Cup in 2014. 207.107.158.42 (talk) 14:37, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Conn Smythe Trophy


text:
Talk:Frank J. Selke Trophy

The Other Guy in photo
See Image talk:SelkeGainey.jpg -- MrDolomite 17:02, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Frank J. Selke Trophy


text: User talk:24.141.44.232

title: User talk:24.141.44.232


text:
Talk:Hart Memorial Trophy

Change Format
I was thinking that maybe we should change the format to something similar to the format used for the NBA MVP. It's easier to read, plus it lists the number of times that player has won the Hart Trophy. Feedback appreciated. ~Scorpion0422

 * Mixed support -- the number of times column would be ok to add. I prefer the most-recent at the top format of the current list tho -- MrDolomite 21:37, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Positions? --- hit save to soon above. If thinking reformat, should positions be added parenthetically ala Conn Smythe Trophy or as separate column?  -- MrDolomite 21:45, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

 * I think having multiple winners listed in a separate list (either above or beneath, i prefer above) as per the NBA example is a better format than a Win # column on the side full of "1"s. Canuckle 16:50, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
 * You may also want to note the # of players in the sentences about team wins. For instance, Edmonton players are said to have won nine trophies combined. Yet, really 2 Edmonton players have won 9 trophies combined. (That's Messier's 1 win as an Oiler + Gretzky's 8 wins as an Oiler). Leaving it as it is slightly misleading regarding teams' historic depth of talent. It may be better off as a list itself with columns of Team | # of players | # of MVP trophies won (9 and up). Canuckle 16:50, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Thornton
As we all know, this year the league faced for the first time a scoring champion/MVP-caliber player being traded during the season. This makes how to properly document this sort of thing more difficult. As near as I can tell, the league's press releases that list the winners simply say Thornton was a Shark this year. Should we list him as such as well, and delete the "Boston Bruins/"?
 * Under no circumstances. Any time a traded player is listed in the scoring leaders, both teams are listed.  "BOS-SJ" should do just fine.  Ravenswing 21:25, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
 * What, then, of the following? http://www.nhl.com/trophies/ross.html or http://www.nhl.com/trophies/hart.html or http://www.nhl.com/news/2006/06/275470.html or http://www.nhl.com/news/2006/06/275398.html

 * Keep both -- list both teams. During his acceptance speech, he acknowledged both teams.  And he played 23 games for Boston -- MrDolomite 21:42, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Oughtn't our preferences give way to the official records kept by the league? Although the above may or may not be official, it certainly is closer to being an official piece of record-keeping than his comments in his acceptance speech or the mere fact that he played those 23 games. I mean, I can construct a contrary argument. For example, we say a certain "team" wins the team awards, even if over the course of a season that team has changed its roster and is no longer the same "team" as it was at some prior point during the same season. Yet that "team" wins the team award.
 * The official records of the league mention both teams; see any copy of the NHL Official Guide & Record Book.

Cecil Hart

 * Small correction needed. The article says Cecil Hart was a "former" coach/GM. When the original trophy was first awarded, he was active. Canuckle 21:32, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Definition of Hart Memorial Trophy
the definition of the hart trophy is "the player judged to be most valuable to his team." I seem to have to change the info every time i come here. Someone seems to think it is the player most valuable in the league. It is misleading, but the player voted to be most valuable in the league wins the lester B trophy. How do I prevent this mis-information from continuing? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dezoe (talk • contribs) 10:18, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Mentioning Messier/Bourque
While I don't oppose mentioning extremely close voting results, we need to be consistant and mention every close vote. In 1999/2000, Pronger won out by a single vote as well. -- Scorpion0422 15:59, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Works for me.   Ravenswing  16:02, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Gretzky picture
Why is Wayne Gretzky picture in a NYRangers uniform? He won eight time with the Edmonton Oilers, once with the LA Kings. Even worst, on the Gretzky page, two pictures of the greatest player of all time, both with the Rangers. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.70.7.236 (talk) 12:30, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
 * It's because we have to use freely licensed images and unfortunately, we don't have any of him with the Oilers. It's unfortunate, but we have to use what we have. -- Scorpion 0422  12:51, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I've better idea, replace Gretzky's photo with another Hart Trophy winner. We've more then enough Gretzky photos, splattered through out the hockey articles. GoodDay (talk) 14:08, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Alex Ovechkin 2012/13
Why is Ovechkin listed as RW in the table for his 3rd Hart? Is this a mistake or did he play Right Wing that year? EDIT: Okay, found it... he did play mostly on the right that year... https://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/puck-daddy/phwa-ovechkin-star-vote-controversy-know-got-wrong-210535864.html Tatlayoko (talk) 21:35, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

On use of flag images.
You think flag images shouldn’t be used except in limited circumstances. Yet, consider the hundreds of tennis tournament pages. All the players have flags beside their name. They are playing for themselves not as internationals. The same is true for football clubs throughout the world. From Toronto FC to Man United to Inter Milan to Santos. The players and staff listed have flags. How about all the players listed on the NHL draft entry pages and the club pages? And all the club teams in Europe. Check out Davos HC. And it’s not just in English, mais en français, italiano, Deutsch, και ελληνικά. According to you all these pages are wrong and should be changed. YOU don’t understand the policy. Your changes were wrong. My changes added info to the pages while you wanted to destroy it because you didn’t like them. You made the change to protect your fragile ego. But you won’t agree with me. You have a lot of pages to change. Start with the NHL, then the CHL. Next year jump to Sverige and the SHL and head south to the NL and east to the KHL... Next decade you can tackle the thousands of football club pages. Actually write some code to automate it and start with FCs and piss off millions of users. Your use of a sock puppet account is telling. καληνυχτα αγορι RDWES DRSHR OETVE FLTTY RCTDD 104.157.243.232 (talk) 09:28, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Hello IP, please check out MOS:FLAG for the rules regarding flag use. Masterhatch (talk) 13:30, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Yes. Now you have thousands of pages related to hockey to change. When are you going to do it? 104.157.243.232 (talk) 16:59, 1 January 2024 (UTC)

 * I'm assuming that you & are the same individual. GoodDay (talk) 15:39, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
 * You don't need that. "I assume you..." is much better than what you wrote. 104.157.243.232 (talk) 17:16, 1 January 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Hart Memorial Trophy


text:
Talk:Jack Adams Award

Changes to Jack Adams Award
The last change made to this page was by by myself, before I registered as a user. I updated the no. of folks that have won the Jack Adams Award with different teams to include Scotty Bowman. Happy New Year to you all.

Isn't the math here a little off?
"The league's Coach of the Year award has been presented 48 times to 40 coaches. The winner is selected by a poll of the National Hockey League Broadcasters Association at the end of the regular season. Five coaches have won the award twice, while Pat Burns has won three times, the most of any coach." 2603:6011:9923:9300:DD22:AF58:77DA:22F7 (talk) 06:11, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Jack Adams Award


text:
New York State Tenement House Act

The New York State Tenement House Act of 1901 banned the construction of dark, poorly ventilated tenement buildings in the U.S. state of New York. Among other sanctions, the law required that new buildings must be built with outward-facing windows in every room, an open courtyard, proper ventilation systems, indoor toilets, and fire safeguards. One of the reforms of the Progressive Era, it was one of the first laws of its kind in the U.S.

Early tenement acts prior to 1901
This was not the first time that New York State passed a public law that specifically dealt with housing reform. The First Tenement House Act (1867) required fire escapes for each suite and a window for every room, the Second Tenement House Act (1879) ("Old Law") closed a loophole by requiring windows to face a source of fresh air and light, not an interior hallway. An amendment of 1887 required privies interior to the building. The failures of the Old Law — the air shafts developed to meet the minimum intent of the Act proved to be unsanitary as they filled with garbage, bilge water, and waste — led to the 1901 "New Law" and its required courtyard designed for garbage removal.

Agitation for reform

Prior to these housing laws, most reforms were undertaken by philanthropists and private individuals or organizations. This sequence of laws serves as an example of the Progressive belief that cleaner cities made better citizens. Jacob Riis, in his ground-breaking, muckraking journalistic expose of 1890, How the Other Half Lives: Studies Among the Tenements of New York attributes the reform movement to the fear of contagious disease emanating from the ghettos, especially following an outbreak of smallpox, far more contagious than the cholera and tuberculosis that had long dwelt in the Lower East Side of New York, the hub of immigrant ghetto life. He views the laws and the progressive reform movement that motivated them as a confluence of the cynically-minded with the civic-minded, eventually working towards the benefit of the burgeoning city's labor force.

The reform movement culminated in a prominent Tenement-House Exhibit of 1899 held in the old Fifth Avenue Sherry's, a Gilded Age center of elegant society. The comprehensive exhibit, marshaled by Lawrence Veiller, covered a wide range of urban concerns including bathhouses and parks, pushing reform for the first time far beyond mere building design into the broader concerns of urban planning. The exhibit was followed by a two-volume report to the New York State and Texas Tenement House Commission, leading directly to the writing of the 1901 New Law.

Architectural developments
Aesthetically, the New Law coincided with the introduction of Beaux-Arts architecture. The curious sandstone faces and gargoyles and filigreed terracotta of the previous twenty years of tenement design gave way to the more abstractly classical ornamentation of this urbane, international and more grandiose Parisian style. Because the New Law's required courtyard consumed more space than the 1879 law's air shaft, New Law tenements tend to be built on multiple lots or on corner lots to conserve space for dwelling units—the source of revenue for the tenement owner. A typical Lower East Side or East Village street will be lined with five-story, austerely unornamented pre-law (pre-1879) and six-story, fancifully decorated old law (pre 1901) tenements with the much bulkier grand-style New Law Tenements on the corners, always at least six stories tall.

title: New York State Tenement House Act


text:
Talk:King Clancy Memorial Trophy

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title: Talk:King Clancy Memorial Trophy


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Talk:Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

NHL is NOT the only sport with a sportsmanship award
I have removed that bit but someone has restored it as it was. That paragraph needs to be removed: it is factually incorrect and editorial in nature. For the record, the NBA has a sportsmanship award, the WNBA has one, the NCAA has one, most football/soccer leagues have "fair-play" awards, FIFA has a fair-play award, the Olympic committee has a fair-play award and the list goes on... Let's stick to facts people... Pascal.Tesson 20:45, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

And the fact is that none of those awards, in any other of those sports, is considered a major or significant award. While (as I've said elsewhere) any serious hockey fan can name many past Lady Byng winners, I doubt most sports fans could even give the name of the trophy in their respective sports, let alone have any idea who the current winner is, let alone have any idea about past winners. Those trophies are far under the radar. Ravenswing 23:51, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure that anyone seriously considers the Lady Bing a "major award" even though it is perhaps not quite as obscure as sportsmanship awards in other sports. But to say that "some consider it telling that the NHL is the only sports association with a sportsmanship award" is clearly not a neutral way of stating things. Pascal.Tesson 04:00, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

 * You would be very wrong there. As far as NPOV goes, it's quite acceptable to make such a statement; there would be no way to describe controversies without presenting the clear fact that many people hold partisan viewpoints on various issues.  Ravenswing 13:44, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

I get your point but does it really make sense to consider the Lady Bing trophy as controversial? Also, compare the two sentences that I keep deleting with their counterpart in the NHL violence article. The latter are much clearer and neutral, especially since they are in context. In the end we both agree that this last paragraph should be deleted in the Lady Bing article. Pascal.Tesson 23:20, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Frank Boucher
Just wondering, does anyone have a photo of Frank Boucher. Boucher has won the Lady Bing trophy, more often then any other player. Not meaning any disrespect to Gretzky fans, but a Boucher picture should be added to this article. GoodDay 19:34, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Boucher certainly became synonymous with the award, and it'd be fitting. Ravenswing 20:55, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Try the Hockey Hall of Fame website. Frank Boucher is in the Hall of Fame and there should probably be a couple pictures of him with the award. ~Scorpion0422

Vandalism
Some of the idiots at HFBoards have decided to have a little fun here.

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?p=5618490

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title: Talk:Lady Byng Memorial Trophy


text:
Talk:Ted Lindsay Award

Trophy Picture
Here are the pictures of the Ted Lindsay award, the current image on the article is the Lester B. Pearson. This images are listed under the "Media Downloads" section of the NHLPA website so I assume it's copyright free but whoever knows for sure can update the image correctly. http://www.nhlpa.com/Ted-Lindsay-Award/Media.aspx One95 (talk) 22:40, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Those are copyright as at the bottom of the site says "Copyright © 2010 National Hockey League Players' Association.  All rights reserved." -- / MWOAP |  Notify Me \ 22:46, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

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Adding some interesting trivia to furstratingly dry and boring articles
User:Sabbatino, i'm asking for advice here. The NHL and almost everything surrounding it comes of as extremely stiff and puritan. NBA, NFL are great at promoting their players, awards and titles. Heck the semifinals (NFC and AFC) get more attention than the Stanley Cup finals. Also, their awards aren't confusing. Outside some old heads, emphasis on the old, casual viewers and even some regular ones have no idea what going on in the NHL award season. This is to the detriment of the NHL. Becoming an NHL fan turns into a chore and isn't fun. How to make it read easier and more interesting without adding anything new or changing the dry hard to consume format? Belevalo (talk) 14:41, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Ted Lindsay Award


text:
Talk:Lester Patrick Trophy

Mulitple winners per year?
Why is there more than one winner in many years? This probably deserves an explanation. Pburka 00:03, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * It's simply awarded to more then one person, per year. GoodDay 21:49, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * This really should be mentioned in the article, since it is an exception to the situation with most athletic trophies (IMHO), which are awarded to one person at a time. Lou Sander (talk) 18:40, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

No award in 2006?
Hmm, there was no mention on nhl.com or loh.com or [espn.com. Did I miss something, or is this one of those awards which does not have to be given each year? — [[User:MrDolomite|MrDolomite]] | Talk 21:49, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Yzerman, Berenson, Larson, Sonmor, M.Dionne have won the Award in 2006 & 2007. GoodDay 21:41, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Fitzgerald unprobable recevier
He was only 10 in 1978, when he is said to be a receiver. There must be another ice hockey player with the same name. LarRan (talk) 14:37, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Tom Fitzgerald (journalist) is the correct person, and now has a biography. Flibirigit (talk) 10:13, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

John Sollenberger
This name redirects here, but doesn't seem to be mentioned in the article. What's going on? Lou Sander (talk) 03:04, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

title: Talk:Lester Patrick Trophy


text: Template:Xinjiang

title: Template:Xinjiang