text:
Talk:Summit Series

Recurring vandalism by 47.55.11.184 (talk)
User keeps reverting opening score in intro table (7-3 as discussed in main article) to 7-399 (obviously fake)

Bomb319 (talk) 18:49, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I asked for temporary protection but was turned down. Let's hope it does not start up again. Alaney2k (talk) 20:14, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

CBC Movie
there's a movie on cbc right now called canada russia 72 in case anybody's interested. part 2 is on tomorrow. april 10, 2006 8:00 e.t.

66.135.96.152 (talk) 21:46, 27 May 2016 (UTC) 2 comments: That CBC movie re-hashes material from the eight DVD box set - "1972 Summit Series" (http://www.amazon.co/72-Complete-Ultimate-Collectors-Summit/dp/B000V5A4CS), and adds other material. It encapsulates the series, as opposed to the 8 box set, which has all the games, and then some. Second comment is offered as I do not feel qualified to edit this Wikipedia page: The verbatim, or close as can be, text rendering of some of Phil Esposito's interview with Johnny Esaw in this Wikipedia entry, while top hole, lacks a great deal of what the video footage of this interview would provide visitors. I suggest the Youtube link, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFKvB3Wnzgk be referred to/linked to, in addition to the book and Montreal Press references of it. As the video footage shows, you are observing (as were all watching it 1972) at one end of the arena while there are still a small number of game attendees milling about in the stands on the opposite end. The eyes of both Esaw and Esposito aren't idly looking off camera as they talk. They are looking at some of the very fans/Canadians Esposito is talking about, at their end of the rink. They are heckling him, and all his Team Canada teammates, coaches, trainers, etc. Its a bit perplexing why video is not included of this, while the skate-kicking incident does get footage.

Office tittle
Just thought I would add that the office title of the series was the friendship series--Mrebus 16:14, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
 * You mean official title? Do you have a Source? Kevlar67 22:55, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Goal Heard Around The World
In case anybody wants to debate this title of Paul Henderson's game winning goal, there are reliable sources at http://www.1972summitseries.com/goalheardaroundtheworld.html and http://www.hhof.com/html/t7gm02.shtml among other places. If somebody wants to add Foster Hewitt's play-by-play quote, I think that would be pretty cool. "Here's a shot. Henderson makes a wild stab for it and falls. Here's another shot. Right in front. They score! Henderson scores for Canada!" Millsy62 05:12, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

Recent changes for "The Games"
The section "The Games" used to end with a Canadian-jingoist slant. So I changed this, but as others pointed out, I went too far the other way. The current version is a compromise. I don't much like it (and I wrote it and I was trying). As Andrwsc says, it seems tough to do properly.

Michael Dorosh would like a citation for the statement "In the Soviet Union, many people thought that their country would have won if the Canadians had not fractured the ankle of their best player". If a citation is needed for this, then there are several other statements in the section that should also require a citation! The quoted statement is surely obvious: (i) the eight-game series was so close that it was decided in the final minute and (ii) Kharlamov was arguably the best player in the series--on either team (he could go up against two NHL linesmen and go through/around them to score: no one in the NHL could do that). So it is pretty natural to speculate that if Kharlamov had not had his ankle fractured, the Soviets would have performed at least a little better, and so won the series. Moreover, the slashing of Kharlamov's ankle by Clarke was captured clearly on TV, and so it could be (and was) shown repeatedly afterwards; naturally, people will then talk about it. Daphne A 06:44, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Except that Wikipedia doesn't exist on uncited inferences or speculations, however much you can defend the logic. You could certainly speculate that Kharlamov could have made the difference, and it's a defensible notion, but this isn't a discussion forum.  Wikipedia's rule is ironclad:  if you make a statement of fact, you must be prepared to back it up, and editors can and should ruthlessly pull statements that fail of support.  That's a statement that can and should be supported by primary sources.  If you find other statements in the article that should be as well, feel free to tag those too! Ravenswing 00:12, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

In fact, many of "The Games" sections are still stilted and incorporate unprofessional language. Example: "The game also featured one of the most disgraceful plays in hockey history." in Game 7. There's no need for superlatives like that in this article. Chris 18:34, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

POV issues
I think this part doesn't have a place in the wiki:

"Some observers felt that this series would serve to contrast two very different ways of life. It pitted the centrally planned society of the Soviets against the free society of Canada and the West. Victory in this series would thus be interpreted by some as a validation of the victor's society as a whole."

First: the soviet society was not centrally planed, it is impossible to do that with a society, it was centrally planed economy. If some US people think the cold war was "freedom" against "opression" doesn't mean it was like that. Then, what kind of observer does think that the victor would validate his society above the other?. Maybe the national honor, or the sport management were in the game... but the "better society" title? doubt it. At least cite the crazy source that believes it.--Bauta 16:17, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

 * Whole heartedly agreed. "Canada and the West"? As if to assume that Team Canada had interest in being the hockey representative for the West. Furthermore, as Bauta mentioned, if some Americans felt that the cold war was "freedom" against "opression", why didn't the US engage in a similar sports summit against the Soviets? Since no one else has disputed this, I'll edit it. --Bentonia School 16:23, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

 * Additionally, the "cold war" is usually regarded as NATO vs. the USSR. Not "partly as a result of the Cold War that was ongoing between Canada's close ally the United States and the Soviet Union".  Canada did contribute on the "allied" side during the Cold War.  In fact, most of the military institutions in Canada are geared for it.  Canada provided a lot of intelligence service during the "war".  Keenada 18:26, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

I see a bias -- Clarke deliberately slashes and breaks Kharlamov's ankle, that is termed "the most controversial play of the entire series"; Mikhailov kicks Bergman with his skate, that is termed "one of the most disgraceful plays in hockey history." Or is it just me? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.192.42.215 (talk) 06:54, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree with the above statement. There is a bias and i think it should be removed. I personally have come across very little evidence in my life growing up with hockey that backs up the quote "one of the most disgraceful plays in hockey history." referring to using the skate as a weapon, it is not a cardinal sin of hockey and in saying so is a bias I feel. I have found violent stick work has been punished far more severly and is sadly far more common. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.166.21.128 (talk) 17:41, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

 * Actually any kind of violence with a skate is considered the worst kind of action you can do on the ice. Which is why the NHL has a zero tollerance policy on skate related violence. -Djsasso (talk) 18:44, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

"I have found violent stick work has been punished far more severly and is sadly far more common." More common? Surely. Punished more severely? Only because skate violence is so rare that punishment is rarely needed. But using one's skate as a weapon is an automatic match penalty and would result in a severe suspension in all levels of hockey, professional and amateur, everywhere in the world. Cutting somebody open with a skate blade could be lethal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Djob (talk • contribs) 23:39, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Are any of you guys canadian? No? Then you don't understand how we felt - yes, it was the cold war, in all it's meaning. Cocky, independant individuals against robotic soldiers. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.222.148.24 (talk) 01:34, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

 * I am Canadian, and certainly anyone of my age (11 years old when it was played) and above in Canada that I know doesn't call it the "Summit Series", it's just plain old "'72 Series" and everyone knows what that means. In response to the originator of this thread, yes, it was widely seen as a match between ideologies, lifestyles and cold warriors in this country. There were underhanded things done on both sides, it was war (you might need to have played or watched Canadian hockey in the 1970's to understand that, think people inflicting and suffering grievous bodily harm on a daily basis, blood and broken bones - then the Philly Flyers came along and it got worse).
 * And responding to the IP and comentators above, we need to eventually achieve a neutral narrative here, and much of the POV as currently written needs to be moved to a new section called "Canadian response to the series" or something. In addition to the politico-confrontational aspects, there really should be more about the intense negative reaction when the Canadian players actually lost games and it became apparent just how really good the Soviet players actually were. That's why we "had to" break Kharlamov's ankle, whereas kicking someone with your skate, that's just wrong :)
 * More seriously, there was a genuine clash of hockey cultures, on the one hand there were subtle hooks'n'slashes and (perceived, but really just watch it) faking of infractions from the Soviet side, on the other hand, naked and brutal aggression from the Canadian side, and confusion and/or bias from the referees on how to deal with it all. Unfortunately, there seems to be a paucity of good sources online, which makes it hard to rewrite this in a reliable format. Anyone who can contribute any references, feel free, and we can keep poking this closer to reality. Anyone with Soviet-side resources or neutral-country additions is welcome! Franamax (talk) 03:07, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Game 7
Why is there no stats on it at the bottom ?
 * Because it was deleted by a vandal, I have gone back into the history, found it, and re-added it. Thanks for pointing it out.  Bsroiaadn Talk 01:45, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

Assessment
I have assessed this article as B Class, given its level of detail and organization, but it requires more in-line citations and referencing. I have assessed this as low importance, as it is a highly specific event within Canada. Cheers, CP 16:56, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was no consensus to move the page from "Summit Series" to "1972 Summit Series", per the discussion below. Dekimasu よ! 00:46, 3 March 2008 (UTC) I've requested to move it to 1972 Summit Series. Because it should be distinguished from 1974 Summit Series and 2007 Summit Series, the article doesn't cover any of them. Cmapm (talk) 20:26, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose the common name for the 72 series is Summit Series the 2007 one is called Super Series, and the 74 one is usually cited with its year. 132.205.44.5 (talk) 02:39, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose The common and better known one is the Summit Series. The 2007 one was not actually called the Summit Series as mentioned above it was called the Super Series. -Djsasso (talk) 02:51, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose 1972 Summit Series is incorrect. The event was simply known as Summit series. Flibirigit (talk) 06:23, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose From what I can tell, it's never been referred as the Summit Series. Everything else is distinguished from this event. Kaiser matias (talk) 02:40, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

 * I see a consensus to not move. How's this a no consensus conclusion? 70.55.84.89 (talk) 11:28, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
 * He meant it in, no concensus to move it I am sure. -Djsasso (talk) 15:50, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Location
Moscow is given as the city for game 5, but the location is not given for any of the next three games. I had a feeling facts would take a back seat when I saw the account of game six begin "Game Six was a Canadian 3-2 victory." MaxEnt (talk) 06:42, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
 * All the last four games were in Moscow, in the same arena. No facts were harmed. Franamax (talk) 02:35, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Game 8
It says: "am Canada took a number of questionable early penalties (which wasn't surprising to Canadians, as they were the same referees who were accused of being biased in Game 6.)"

As far as I know, only one refee ws the same, see article Franz Baader (ice hockey):

"Alan Eagleson, a key organizer from Canada of the Series had threatened to depart from Moscow, where the game was being played. He had reached an agreement with the Canadian team about the possible departure. However, an agreement was reached, with Kompalla and Bata being the referees for Game 8."

The Article says "At that point, with the score tied 5-5 and the series tied 3-3-1, a member of the Soviet delegation unexpectedly informed Canada that, if the score and the series remained tied, the Soviets would claim victory on goal differential." I didn't find any proof for that statement. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Eltirion (talk • contribs) 09:50, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

Referring to Sweden and Czech games as "exhibition"
A common mistake is to refer to the Sweden and Czech games of the series as "exhibition" games. The entire series was an exhibition series. In fact, at the time of this series the Russians were not the World Champions... the Czechs were, which Canada played in the last game. It's true that they weren't as important as the Russian games and the Sweden games weren't even televised in Canada. However, "exhibition" infers that the games against Russia carried some official title. A better word than exhibition would be "supplementary". —Preceding unsigned comment added by BashBrannigan (talk • contribs) 17:18, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Legacy Quote
'' I played in Detroit after the Olympics, and all the guys were talking about playing the Russians. After skating with Detroit, I thought, 'Wow, these guys aren't that good.' After playing against the Russians and international competition, I thought, 'Shit, these guys are just a bunch of arrogant Canadians.' The National Hockey League was a beer and pizza league at that time. I was thinking how arrogant the guys in the NHL are. They were so arrogant thinking, 'We'll kick their ass. They're just amateurs.' ''

What relevance does this quote have with the article? The last line coincides with the view held by the players and country before the series, not after. Honestly seems out of place and acts as a commentary towards the talent pool of the NHL after the '68 expansion. 173.35.19.161 (talk) 16:17, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

slash/controversy etc.
Two things. One. I can't find a reliable source cite for Clarke's slash stating that it was a fracture. I don't think that unsourced web sites are good enough. Two, it was not the only controversy, so it shouldn't have its own section. But I'm open to either approach. Time for some editor input. ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 14:48, 6 August 2012 (UTC)

This was by far the main Controversy of the Series - if you have a source saying it wasn't please show because there are hundreds of thousands of articles over the years discussing this as the main focal point and "low-point" of the series. Adding tag because you re-wrote this as a comic book with odd style and biased perceptions and enforcements,. Broken bone link added (ESPN). HonestopL 16:32, 6 August 2012 (UTC)

Here you go (I could add about 20-30 more that say the same thing) "Why then was Bobby Clarke, not only the Flyers’ captain but the guy who broke Valery Kharlamov’s ankle with a, uh, let’s call it, a “violent, controversial, but ultimately successful” slash in Game 6 of the 1972 Summit Series against the USSR, enshrined in 1987?" http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/islanders/enshrine_shero_already_ax7OstToM3NjEwummlpi5J

"This game also featured the most controversial play of the series. Philadelphia Flyers Bobby Clarke was instructed by Team Canada’s bench to stop the high-flying Soviet star and captain, Valeri Kharlamov. During his next shift Clarke deliberately slashed Kharlomov and broke his ankle." http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2011/12/28/cold-war-on-ice-summit-series-72-airs-on-nbc-sports-network-debut-day-on-january-2/114819/

"CNNSI.com: What about the controversy surrounding your criticism of Bobby Clarke for his slash on Valery Kharlamov? " http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/hockey/news/2002/09/27/henderson_interview/

HonestopL 16:42, 6 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I was looking for some confirmation of a fracture. I am concerned that the diagnosis is based on conjecture after the fact. Are any of your sources something like that? I am concerned about one thing. I can concerned that you think I have some motives. I just want to follow the rules. I don't doubt also that the slash was controversial. However I don't think it is encyclopedic to come out and say it was the most controversial. Something more like "considered by many to be the most controversial" I don't think I am putting a slant on the article by following these principles. ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 04:02, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

I see what you mean - I don't want to accuse you of anything, you look like a decent editor who loves hockey like me, we just got off the wrong foot I guess.

A bone-fracture is technically "a brake/broken", just saying the sources do confirm is was severe and very controversial (perhaps the most). I would like just something that gives more notability (like a subsection heading)? I just feel the admissions by Kharlamov making the accusations (as Sports Experts have), and Clarke & Ferguson (later Henderson) over the years since the the slash pretty much confirmed suspicions that part of Team Canada's coaches and its players had a part in purposefully injuring the Soviet's (and one of the World's) Best players.

"Kharlamov was killing us...somebody had to do it". I'm satisfied the way it is presently, but if possible, some type of section(ing) possible I would greatly appreciate to give it greater distinction. HonestopL 02:29, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

 * I don't know what to suggest. I did the undo only because I thought it was not the only controversy, and putting it separate might be unfair -aka undue prominence- but I think I was probably wrong to do that. The incident has taken on a life of its own, as you've pointed out with your references. I think I might also suggest more prominence by adding to the lead another paragraph or sentence at least that states that the series was filled with controversy, including a deliberate attack on Kharlamov by Clarke that likely changed the course of the series. I do agree that the slash should be prominent. I don't know about a separate section of Controversy, but it's important enough that it should not be drowned with other details. Sorry about that. When I am trying to expand an article, I usually add text (too much), then subtract to get the right amount. But I opened the discussion hoping for other input, so I hope others have opinions. ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 05:16, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

Thank You for fixing it, very satisfied with the edits! HonestopL 05:19, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

The section is a bit one-sided and has little reaction from Clarke other than the presented out of context "Flin Flon" quote. For one, it presents the slash as if the big bad Clarke targeted poor little Kharlamov out of nowhere. Clarke: "As for the episode you've mentioned, we were going for the puck together, he pushed me with the stick, then turned around and skated away. I caught up with him and hit him on the leg, not thinking at all where and how I hit." He further said: "For us it was normal. The thing is that we, Canadians, are used to fighting as an integral part of hockey. When you have “misunderstandings” like this, they are often solved with the fists. Soviet hockey had no fights so the players used other methods to get the point accross. Like a little bit of “stick work” here and there, you know. And I personally don't mind this. I am a tough player and I respect toughness in others. But if I am poked with a stick I will do the same. We just had to adapt to the new ways of doing things, that’s all."''  Thus the Flin Flon quote. In the same interview he denies knowing that Kharlamov's ankle was "already sore" (how is it known his ankle was "already sore", exactly? I doubt the Soviets would broadcast that fact) and he denies Ferguson telling him what is quoted in this article. --Phifly (talk) 05:49, 9 August 2012 (UTC)

 * How do you explain Ferguson's comments? Should we use the word 'apparently at the instigation of Ferguson'? If there is more directly from Clarke it should be added, but it has to directly address the incident, I think. I don't think it is imperative that Clarke had to be aware of Kharlamov's ankle. I think that comes from Ferguson. The main point of the game report is that it occurred. There is plenty of other action reported, including Kharlamov's actions. I should add that I don't think we can 'clean up' or excuse Clarke's actions in wikipedia. Secondly, the slash has 'taken on a life of its own' since the series, and especially since the media took to the internet, so it is going to appear (arguably of course) in this article as more prominent than other incidents. I don't think that at the time it was as serious as has been made out, but it was important in the context of the series. Thanks for the cite, too. Good work. ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 15:53, 9 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I have added content from your cite. It may go too far the other way, but I think his comments are a good addition. ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 20:32, 9 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Ferguson's comments? He said, she said, and 30 years after the fact. Neither Clarke nor any other Team Canada player or coach who may have been nearby when Ferguson supposedly told Clarke to target Kharlamov's ankle have verified Ferguson's claim. Therefore, I think, "Assistant coach John Ferguson claimed in 2002(?)..." or something like that would be the best way to present the quote. -- I'm not interested in cleaning up Clarke's actions. Since he was involved he should be quoted and part of that is he feels "a lot of crap" has been written about it. The people who think the slash was such a disgrace - the propaganda outlet known as the Soviet press in 1972 (I'm sure they "widely reported" and "condemned" Mikhailov's skate attack, right?) and in modern times those who think Montreal saved hockey from Clarke and the Broad Street Bullies in '76 (not surprisingly this viewpoint is largely centered in Montreal). That's really why the Slash took on a life of its own: more ammo against Clarke and the hated 1970s Flyers. Since they can't cite a similar incident during Clarke's NHL career to blow out of proportion, they instead reference the slash. -- I think the section at present is fine with the exception of how the Ferguson quote is presented. The other thing I wonder is how long was Kharlamov playing on this sore ankle (the whole series? since game 2 or 3? and so on) and the exact nature of the soreness. The first time in this article that we discover that Kharlamov had a sore ankle is when the slash is discussed. --Phifly (talk) 10:28, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
 * According to Bill Meltzer the ankle wasn't broken, rather it was a deep bone bruise. "The most infamous incident of Clarke's career happened in Game 6 of the Summit Series, when he injured Valeri Kharlamov -- a supremely skilled but also sometimes ruthless player in his own right. There has been so much mystique and misinformation put out over the years about that one play that is not always easy to separate fact from fiction. First of all, Clarke did not "shatter" Kharmalov's ankle with the slash. In reality, the winger suffered a deep bone bruise that kept him out of Game 7 and had him at far less than 100 percent in Game 8. But no hockey player, no matter how brave -- or shot full of pain-killers -- can support enough weight to skate on a shattered ankle. In fact, Kharlamov got up shortly after the slash and (to his credit, I might add) to confront Clarke and exchange cross words with the Canadian bench before limping to the Soviet bench. He later returned to the ice." Logically, if the ankle was broken, Kharlamov could not have continued playing in the game and certainly not in Game 8. --Phifly (talk) 01:05, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I am glad that you are continuing to look into this. Unfortunately that source is just a blog, and not enough for Wikipedia. This is the issue with getting a proper cite for the injury. I think it's been accepted that it was a fracture ( but maybe Meltzer has a source?). That's what I've read in most sources. I brought this up on the SIHR list, and they felt that Kharlamov could have played on a fracture, due to the structure of the ankle. The use of the word 'broken' might imply something more substantial than a fracture, but it is also used for a fracture, too. All that said, the slashing did occur and Kharlamov was out. ʘ  alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 22:04, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

Boxscores
Maybe switch the boxscores to the standard ones used in articles like 2012 Stanley Cup Finals or 2012 Stanley Cup playoffs? Jmj713 (talk) 16:54, 8 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I kind of like these ones better. At least for this page. They seem to fit the topic better and condense the information down into a smaller amount of space which is always nice. But I am not married to them. -DJSasso (talk) 16:56, 8 August 2012 (UTC)
 * The ones in the final series are really large. In fact, I kind of dislike them. There was so much going on in the series, that if were to use those boxscores, I'd suggest using a separate page/article. The ones for the playoffs are ok, but I'm not sure about section headlines. Remove "Game six" e.g. and just use the templates? ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 17:44, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

Would it be possible to add boxscores for the exhibition games too? Jmj713 (talk) 15:29, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
 * I've not seen summaries for those games anywhere. ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 01:51, 17 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, I've now found two sources, so I've added them. ʘ alaney2k  ʘ ( talk ) 16:27, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Great! Thank you. Jmj713 (talk) 16:56, 28 October 2012 (UTC)

Legends
Apparently, a team called Russian Legends has been playing commemorative games in Russia, Europe, and the US, for the 40th anniversary of the Summit Series, culminating with a game between Russian and Canadian Legends teams. There's an official website, but it's difficult to make sense of the schedule of games and who's exactly involved. I haven't researched this deeply enough, just stumbled upon it, but I think this definitely should be mentioned here, with a separate article to build later on. Jmj713 (talk) 16:04, 7 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Not really any different than any other oldtimers series. They are quite common, this one just happens to be in the theme of commemorating the 72 series. I wouldn't think it was notable enough to mention. -DJSasso (talk) 16:26, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

I still think the Legacy section should be fleshed out more with information regarding these Legends games, at least a list could be added of games specifically played by Canadians and Russian legends and stars in commemoration of '72. Jmj713 (talk) 17:49, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

"Height" of the Cold War?
As much as I would like to glorify the 1972 Summit series I don't think it is fair to say it was played during the "height" of the Cold War. If anything tensions were actually pretty relaxed during the 70s (see: Détante). The height would be in the early 50s, 1962 (see: Cuban missile crisis) or in the early 80s Second Cold War. Kndimov (talk) 00:57, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

Gordie Howe was retired
Gordie Howe retired in 1971 and signed with the Houston Aeros on September 30, 1973. AFTER the Summit Series. He was retired during the Series, despite what thetyee.ca says: Please stop adding Gordie Howe to this article Alaney2k (talk) 20:06, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Retirement
 * Signing with Aeros

Game 8: Exactly when did the third period start?
I suspect the paragraph beginning "Sinden told the players to try to get one back quickly..." refers to between periods, but nowhere is there a statement indicating when the third period started. Humphrey Tribble (talk) 22:30, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

Soviet TV coverage
Obviously, Soviet television (first program, which was carried nationwide?) carried Games 5 through 8 using their own cameras.

How did Soviet television cover the four games in Canada? With their own cameras? Or did they pick up CBC/CTV cameras, convert to their broadcast signal type and add their own commentator? GBC (talk) 22:38, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

 * That's an interesting question, but I doubt that an editor will ever find a reliable source that answers it. I assume they didn't bring Soviet cameras over because of the difference in voltage and AC frequency. Indefatigable (talk) 22:49, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Good point, but I would say that using adapters to convert power would be far easier than converting the signal from System M (525-line, 6 MHz channel, 60 Hz frame rate, negative visual modulation, FM sound, NTSC colour) to System D (625-line, 8 MHz channel, 50 Hz frame rate, negative visual modulation, FM sound, SECAM colour). Contrarily, since the Soviets did not use geosynchronous orbit for their Molniya satellites, they could not beam the picture over those satellites as their perigee would take them quickly over Canadian longitudes, so would have to use an Intelsat bird. GBC (talk) 23:02, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Summit Series


text:
Talk:Ice hockey at the 1924 Winter Olympics

final ranking
I corrected and notated the standings for official sources. I noticed that Wallechinsky's book on the Olympics agrees with IIHF, I do not know if that means anything or not.18abruce (talk) 00:42, 9 October 2019 (UTC)

 * The official 1924 Olympic report (page 706) indicates that France and Czechoslovakia mutually agreed to share 5th place and not play-off for it (page 706). The report also indicates that Belgium and Switzerland were not placed (page 706, 708). In those days, there was an unofficial point competition among nations involving all sports, with points being awarded for 1st-6th places. This should line up with the IOC's database...Joel225sp (talk) 21:09, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The IOC database appears to be incomplete, but the official report does confirm the rankings we have presented. I don't know if additional notation is needed or not.18abruce (talk) 21:38, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I once had Wallechinsky's book, but lost it when I moved three years ago. It was/is a great resource. Agreed, the IOC's database is woefully incomplete. Regarding this 1924 case, it would be good to notate that the Official Report recognizes the top 6 positions, the IOC database recognizes the top 4 (as of today, at least), and the IIHF recognizes all 8 positions. I hesitate to mention all three, but in this case, I do trust the Official Report.
 * Many kudos to the writers/editors of this 1924 Report. It was this Report which described the first Olympic curling competition, which was widely considered unofficial until 2006. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Joel225sp (talk • contribs) 16:31, 3 March 2020 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/


text:
Talk:Ice hockey at the 1928 Winter Olympics

Final ranking
Why at final ranking table Austria placed at 5th place, France - at 6th, Czechoslovakia - at 7th? Due to different number of teams in group more correctly all of them would share 5th place. The same case are 8-10 places. Are there any official sources clarifying teams arrangement after 4th place? Nitobus (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 08:55, 11 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes there are, are there any sources confirming your ranking system? The trouble with the IIHF is they disagree with themselves depending on where you look.18abruce (talk) 01:01, 9 October 2019 (UTC)
 * The Official Report agrees with the IOC database for this year, thankfully. No teams below 4th place were ranked. Even though there was a "point competition," based on the rankings of the top six finishers in each sport's events (similar to 1924), the organizers simply chose not to confer any rankings on teams that did not reach the final pool.Joel225sp (talk) 19:40, 3 March 2020 (UTC)

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text: Talk:Ice hockey at the 1984 Winter Olympics


text:
Talk:Ice hockey at the 1988 Winter Olympics

total goals
It is unclear whether Poland should have 3 or 9 goals in the preliminary round, according to the IIHF. They say that the 6 goals against France were nullified, however their official pool totals still give them 9. Further compounding the issue is their official total for the tournament is listed as 310, but adding up the totals they list gives 316.18abruce (talk) 02:14, 2 October 2015 (UTC)


text:
Roke

Roke is a hamlet in South Oxfordshire, about 3 mi north of Wallingford. It has a sixteenth-century public house, the Home Sweet Home. It is now included in the neighbouring civil parish of Berrick Salome.

Culture
Roke hosts the annual Rokefest Beer and Music Festival.

title: Roke


text:
Talk:Ice hockey at the 2002 Winter Olympics

Untitled
Anyone know if the As and C again member of one of the teams actually means anything or is this just meaning vandalism. If it means something please someone add a legend. :: Kevinalewis  :  (Talk Page)  09:02, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Assistant Captians and Captians, of course. -- Earl Andrew - talk 00:56, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the input on this answer - but where on the page does this become obvious. As this arena is meant to be an educational aid, it would be nice to have a "key" somewhere to these code. :: Kevinalewis  :  (Talk Page)  22:47, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

 * "A" actually stands for "Alternate", not "Assistant". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Djob (talk • contribs) 22:35, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

Location
why doesn't the article say in the very top where (which country) the games were held?!John wesley 14:12, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

Reference to 1994 Stanley Cup Finals
In my opinion, using Bob Cole's final call of the 2002 tournament is relevant, as is the note that it was the highest-rated sports show in Canadian history. Referring to the previous record (the '94 Finals) is vaguely relevant. But adding Cole's final call of that is just going too far down that tangent. If anybody cares about that information, they can click on the link to the 1994 Finals or Bob Cole.Djob (talk) 10:25, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Since nobody objected, I removed the tangent (again).Djob (talk) 10:15, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Summary
As far as I am aware, the team captain of Canada's women's team was Cassie Campbell, and not Hayley Wickenheiser. Can somebody factcheck this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.6.250.133 (talk) 13:16, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

number of titles
it is true that Canada won their seventh title, but according to the IIHF (here) that did not tie them for first. No source has been presented that makes any other claim other use of WP:OR.18abruce (talk) 16:21, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

I'm glad that you have initiated that dialogue. Thank you. As far as I'm concerned, the IOC doesn't combine medals of the Soviet Union (Soviet Union at the Olympics tells that) and Unified team, hence the USSR won seven gold medals and it can be checked on IOC's website. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.170.74.124 (talk) 16:30, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

Source: Ice hockey at the Olympic Games As you can see, the Soviets have seven gold medals, hence Canada tied them, winning seventh in 2002. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.170.75.113 (talk) 16:42, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

Here you can check official stats — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.170.75.113 (talk) 16:45, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

 * Since it is plainly controversial, and the governing bodies themselves do not seem to agree, we need something definitive from a source that is discussing number of championships if we wish to make a definitive statement.18abruce (talk) 18:23, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

Ranking of teams that lost in the men's quarterfinal round
According to the regulations of the 1998 and 2002 Olympic tournaments agreed upon by the IOC, the IIHF and the NHL, classification games to determine 5th-8th places were not scheduled and the losing teams in the quarterfinal round were all ranked equal. This is confirmed by the Official Reports and also by the IOC results database.

The NHL requested that such classification games not take place in order to prevent players (specifically, the top six seeded teams) from being injured in games that had no bearing on the medals.

The IOC preferred to keep these classification games in place in order to separate the teams into 5th-8th places for purposes of awarding diplomas, while the IIHF wanted to keep all classification games in place to separate all the teams into 5th-14th places.

Neither the IOC nor the IIHF wanted to separate the teams according to the criteria used at the IIHF World Championships, as this would set a precedent, rendering future classification games unnecessary.

Despite this, the IIHF does in fact maintain separate rankings for these quarterfinalists based on their World Championship criteria. They elected to separate the 1998 quarterfinalists in order to determine the six teams that would skip the preliminary round at the 2002 Olympics; and they separated the 2002 quarterfinalists so that results in the Olympics and World Championships would receive equal weight in the IIHF World Rankings, which debuted in 2003.

After the 2002 Olympics, the classification games for 5th-8th places and all other places were completely eliminated. The World Championship criteria were implemented at the 2006 Olympics to determine all rankings below 4th place, and this continues until present. Joel225sp (talk) 19:46, 10 September 2019 (UTC)

 * Two things: 1. there is a lot of information there, some of it would need considerable sourcing to validate the motivations of the IOC and the IIHF, and 2. what is the point of all this for you? What is it that you want to happen?  The IIHF immediately, officially, ranked 5th through 8th, as had been their practice since 1992.  They ranked those places every year (except 1997 which had a different format) without placement games. It is doubtful that a common practice, that had also been used for 1998 Olympic ranking, was in any way unusual or unexpected for this tournament.  It is true that the IOC chooses to rank 5th through 8th as equal for 1998 and 2002, so what.  Source it and notate the table if you want.18abruce (talk) 22:34, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

 * Thank you for the feedback! My aim is to indicate on the Article pages for the 1998 and 2002 Olympics that the IOC/NAOC/SLOC rankings exist and are as valid as the IIHF rankings. I won't try to prove the motivations of any organization, but I think good arguments can be made.

 * Indeed, the IIHF's practice of immediately releasing their tournament rankings upon completion of the World Championships, using criteria to determine 5th-8th places, was in place from 1992 until present (except the aforementioned 1997 tournament). But the Olympics were a different story: At Albertville 1992 and at Lillehammer 1994, a full set of four placement games were played to determine 5th-8th places. The lack of such placement games at Nagano 1998 and Salt Lake 2002 resulted in the disparate rankings.Joel225sp (talk) 23:49, 19 September 2019 (UTC)

 * I was able to find the official NHL records as well, they rank QF losers equal in their 'guide and record book.' When I get some time I will source and notate the standings to demonstrate the issue. Thank you.18abruce (talk) 10:17, 20 September 2019 (UTC)

 * Interesting! I commend the NHL for observing the event regulations. Joel225sp (talk) 20:28, 25 September 2019 (UTC)

 * I notated the standings. If better sources for the Olympics are available please replace, but the Olympic.org site is missing the standings.18abruce (talk) 22:17, 1 October 2019 (UTC)

 * Thank you 18abruce.Joel225sp (talk) 19:41, 7 October 2019 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Ice hockey at the 2006 Winter Olympics

the So-called Super Six?
I removed the "So called" from the beginning of "Super six". It looks incredibly biased and unprofessional. especially considering all six teams qualified anyway.

Women's portion
The women's portion and half of the men's final information was completely missing (as of 7pm Feb 28) so I added it back from an older version.

Second paragraph
"The 2006 competition marks the first time that neither Canada nor the United States finished second in a major International Women's Ice Hockey tournament. This is the first major change in the status of the top four women's teams since the competition at the 1998 Winter Olympics, when the US team established itself as a power on par with Canada, and Finland established itself as being on par with Sweden."

I don't understand what this paragraph is talking about, nor why it is at the top of the page. The tournament is not even over yet. Why claim that Canada will not finish in second place? Maybe it is just poorly written.

GIF
I feel like the motion gif of the italian women's team flailing about seems out of place. The gif itself is pretty short, and to me, doesn't add anything.
 * I agree, it is rather deprecating towards the Italian team, I say axe it. mhunter 01:44, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

officials
I think on this page perhaps should be included the on-ice officals for mens ice hockey, who were recently named: Paul Devorski, Dennis LaRue, Dan Marouelli, Don Van Massenhoven from the NHL and Thomas Andersson, Vyacheslav Bulanov, Timo Favorin, Danny Kurmann, Christer Lärking and Vladimir Sindler from the IIHF. SD6-Agent 02:31, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

times
What about the times, I don't see which system they are in. I'm trying to figure out if I'm going to be able to watch the game live. Tawker 01:48, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Local Turin time, which is CET. Subtract nine hours, I think, if you're in British Columbia. So I hope you like getting up in the morning. -- Jao 19:50, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

 * I thought that all wikipedia articles should use Coordinated Universal Time? Anarchist42 22:33, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Nope. See Manual of Style (dates and numbers). -- Jao 19:07, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

box scores
Are we really going to put the name of every athlete who scored a point in the Olympics on the page? The page will get cluttered real fast, and it's just a huge mess. Just my two cents, though. -- Jjjsixsix (talk)/(contribs) @ 06:10, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

 * My two cents concur. Wouldn't that be what Ice hockey at the 2006 Winter Olympics match stats (men) and Ice hockey at the 2006 Winter Olympics match stats (women), linked from the top box, are for? -- Jao 13:10, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

update
we really need somebody to make the women's canada russia match like the canada italy one including the times and scorers. thanks somody 19:24, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

GP 	G 	A 	Pts 	PIM	Mins 	GA 	GAA 	SV%
The "Leading scorers" and "Leading goaltenders" tables are probably informative, but the table headers aren't in English :-(

 * It's in Hockey English -
 * Games Played
 * Goals
 * Assists
 * Points
 * Penalties in Minutes
 * Minutes Played
 * Goals Against
 * Goals Against Average (average goals scored on goalie per game)
 * Save Percentage (percentage of shots on goal stopped by goalie)

rules
hi, im doing a school project, and am looking for information on the rules for the olympic Ice hockey games. Are they playing NHL rules or what? -- TheOneCalledA1 18:35, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

 * No, they use IIHF rules. ccwaters 18:59, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

Goalies
Why is the goalie stats reduced to top 4? There are only 16 goalies for the Women's side, so a complete list isn't all that large. 132.205.45.110 21:59, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

Bracket
Hey guys, what do you think of this:

I modified the template from one on Football World Cup 2006. I'm still messing around with it. If people think it would be nice to have something like this, I can put it into template space and make some more for various levels of starting brackets (i.e., starting with quarterfinals for men). Let me know if you want something like this, and if you have any suggestions to the specific format. Thanks! -- Jonel | Speak 22:19, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Looks great to me! Good idea. --x-Flare-x 23:23, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

 * It needs to add the Bronze medal match. 69.156.69.205 21:00, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I've added it. -- Jonel | Speak 02:20, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Table of Contents
There's a lot of editing going on right now but can someone add some headings to this article to create a Table of Contents? It's very long and it's annoying to have to scroll through looking for results. --Do Not Talk About Feitclub (contributions) 04:17, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

Sweden ahead of Finland before 1998?
"This is the first major change in the status of the top four women's teams since the competition at the 1998 Winter Olympics in Nagano, when the US team established itself as a power on par with Canada, and Finland established itself as being on par with Sweden."

Considering the fact that Sweden to that point hadn't won a single medal at neither the World Championships nor the Olympics and Finland had taken the bronze medal at every World's that had taken place, it sounds strange to claim that Finland didn't reach Sweden's level until 1998.

Officiating Can / Sui
Can anyone make a (non biased) comment regarding (what I believe to be) clear incompetence by the ref on
 * The calls that lead to the 2-0 SUI goal (4 very weak penalties vs Canada)
 * The disllowed goal (the one with the puck in the glove that was (bias) clearly over the goal line which video replays showed however the intellegent person who put the overhead cameras couldn't position properly to give an additional angle (/bias)

That is very biased, if anyone can make a non-biased comment, I think it would be something to note. Tawker 16:21, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
 * If the officials can't see the puck in its entirety having crossed the goal line, then it's no goal. --Madchester 18:05, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

Result table
What do you think about a table like this? You can put all this additional information which overcrowds current article into subpages.

Group A Preliminary round
(Igny 16:36, 18 February 2006 (UTC))

Looks good. Might center the scores (and why are they wikilinked?). Most of the stuff on the main page right now could then be moved onto the "match stats" page. -- 128.197.249.61 17:55, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

 * It occurs to me we can be a bit more concise by combining the above table with the round robin w/l/t table. How about:

How about this?
Centered the numbers, made top row IOC country codes to make the table more compact (it's still easy to tell the meaning of the code just by looking in the left-hand column). -- Jonel | Speak 20:56, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

Group B Preliminary round summary
Mre5765 05:51, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

A little confused?
I have no idea what in the world that second paragraph meant? Considering Canada could end up in second (Well, not really but thats my POV...) I removed it. If someone figures out what it was trying to say go ahead and re-write it.

CanadianPhaedrus 17:28, 19 February 2006 (UTC)CanadianPhaedrus

Men's competition
The first sentence says "..format was changed from the much-maligned version...". Much maligned by who? Its POV as is and as far as the reader knows could be the opion of the editors of the page. It needs to either be removed or some references to the large number of offical groups that didn't like it or it needs to say that certain fans did not like the set up. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 17:47, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Looks better now. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 08:46, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

Why is Canada placed 3rd in group A when they have more wins than Switzerland? Anarchist42 19:00, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Tiebreaker is head to head. John wesley 18:53, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Thanks. Now what does head to head mean? Anarchist42 19:00, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

 * The Swiss team beat the Canadian team. ccwaters 19:06, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

women's Sweden vs Canada
the women's sweden vs. canada game has the score listed as 8-1, but i count 10 goals for canada? something is amiss.. 131.111.8.99 22:50, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Something certainly was amiss. 8-1 is correct, not sure what happened with the extra listings.  Also, it is somewhat hard for both teams to score at exactly the same time... I've fixed the game's scoring legend to be in line with the official results. -- Jonel | Speak 00:24, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

Leading goaltenders
Dominik Hašek played only about 10 minutes i first match.

Consolation round?
Is there a consolation round in the men's tournament to determine classification of teams? CrazyC83 16:36, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Nope: http://www.torino2006.org/ENG/IDF/IH/X05.html ccwaters 16:58, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

Swedish cheating
What about them throwing the last game in the first round to get in position to play the Swiss? The virtue of the old round robin system of play in the medal round was that all games counted, the games in the first round were carried over! John wesley 14:36, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

 * Please provide credible source. -- Jonel | Speak 01:47, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

 * The NBC broadcast on the last night of the first round. The announcers were all saying that Sweden wanted to lose so they can be in 3rd place.  Someone must have Tivo.  Didn't you watch all the games? John wesley 13:39, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

 * NBC announcers cannot credibly speak to the intentions of the Swedish ice hockey team. -- Jonel | Speak 01:07, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The Swedish coach Bengt-Ake Gustafsson said things prior to the game which could be interpreted as if Sweden would do exactly this. It was much quoted in Swedish news media. John Anderson 16:11, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Can you give any serious reference  to possible disqualifications by the IOC and/or IIHF? I can't find a thing. If there is a real possiblity, then sure the mention is warranted, but otherwise it is just speculatory and should be removed. ccwaters 17:57, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Quotes from Gustafsson in news media would be credible. -- Jonel | Speak 19:18, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Even if this were true, it would not be cheating. It might be considered poor sportsmanship, but frankly it's up to the team to decide how hard they wanted to play. Maybe they were simply trying not to tire themselves out in preparation for the medal rounds. DJ Clayworth 19:22, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Agreed (though either way, I'd say it's worth a one-sentence mention if verifiable). -- Jonel | Speak 19:32, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I'll ask again: Are there any sources citing a statement about possible disqualification from the IOC and/or IIHF. A) Gustafsson apparently admitted to throwing a game. That's great, but B) I don't see any mention of possible action taken against the team for it. I know the IOC is after them for breaking sponsorship rules, but that's something completely different. If I don't see a sources for A or B this weekend, it will being removed. ccwaters 13:41, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
 * This is interesting. Well, 6 years later we are no closer to an answer but this is from the article Peter Forsberg: As part of a subsequent interview about the championship over five years later, Forsberg was interpreted to insinuate that Sweden lost their preliminary round game against Slovakia on purpose, so as to draw Switzerland as their quarterfinal opponent, rather than Canada or Russia. Swedish forward Henrik Sedin, who played alongside Forsberg on the 2006 team denied the notion while adding that Forsberg's comments in the interview were misconstrued.01:00, 3 August 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by TurtleMelody (talk • contribs)

Trivia
I moved a portion of the text to the trivia section. It doesn't deserve to be at the beginning of the article. 213.67.244.185 13:18, 22 January 2007

 * Someone erased this information, but I put it back now. I think it is relevant to have this information in the article and I also find it nice that the article consists of more than just statistics. John Anderson 12:13, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Ice hockey 2006.gif
Image:Ice hockey 2006.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 05:00, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Using template 'hockeybox2'
Not sure if anyone is still checking here, but I went and replaced the first part (Group A) of the old style of game summary with the 'hockeybox2' template. It provides more information, makes the file a bit smaller (not much) and is collapsible, for better viewing. The games no longer link to the 'game stats' page, but since most of the information on that page is now here, I think it is a net benefit. I hope to have this done for all the games in the article within the next week, unless someone has an objection. Edged (talk) 10:13, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

 * Looks good to me. -- Jonel (Speak to me) 12:37, 23 February 2009 (UTC)


text:
Talk:1996 World Cup of Hockey

Comments
russia did not recieve the bronze medal at this world cup there was no bronze medal awarded unless some one objects in the next couple of days I am going to remove the line Ranul 08:21, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

title: Talk:1996 World Cup of Hockey


text:
The Damage Done (book)

The Damage Done is a book by Australian Warren Fellows. It portrays his time in the notorious Bangkwang prison, nicknamed "Big Tiger". Fellows was sentenced to life imprisonment in 1978, convicted of heroin trafficking between Bangkok, Thailand and Australia.

title: The Damage Done (book)


text: User talk:24.161.251.72

title: User talk:24.161.251.72


text:
Talk:2004 World Cup of Hockey rosters

The next WCH
Anybody have any sources or knowledge of when the next tournament is? GoodDay (talk) 18:00, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

title: Talk:2004 World Cup of Hockey rosters


text:
Talk:2004 World Junior Ice Hockey Championships

mvp
IIHF encyclopedia only shows MVP awards beginning in 2005, however the archived official site indicates Zach Parise was awarded with the MVP. Don't know why.18abruce (talk) 15:40, 15 July 2017 (UTC)


text:
Talk:2006 World Junior Ice Hockey Championships

Playoff positions
For the preier competition, there should only be the top 3 in each group, not the top 4. Kingjeff 18:58, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Iceland-Armenia
With Iceland beating Armenia 50-0, isn't it possible that it is one of the highest scoring games in international play? Kaiser Matias 5:57 7 January 2005 (UTC)
 * I believe the Armenian senior team lost by even more to the Mexicans last year. -- Earl Andrew - talk 00:37, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Is there link to this somewhere? Kaiser Matias 3:00 9 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Oh sorry, it was *only* 48-0. -- Earl Andrew - talk 03:55, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Wjhc2006.gif
Image:Wjhc2006.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

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External links modified
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Smokey the Cannon

Smokey the Cannon is a replica Civil War artillery cannon that has served as part of the pageantry of college football games at the University of Texas at Austin since 1953. Smokey the Cannon is owned and operated by the Texas Cowboys (an honorary men’s service organization at Texas) and is stationed in the left corner of the south endzone at Darrell K Royal–Texas Memorial Stadium during every Texas Longhorns home football game. After each football season, Smokey the Cannon is generally displayed in the Red McCombs Red Zone atrium for the spring semester.

Smokey the Cannon is shot off at every Texas Longhorns score, kick-off, end of quarter, and most importantly, it is fired off after the world-famous college school song, "The Eyes of Texas" at the conclusion of every Texas football game.

In addition to all home football games, Smokey the Cannon is present at the annual Texas vs. Oklahoma Red River Rivalry game in Dallas, Texas every October, as well as at other select football games outside of Austin, Texas (barring local and stadium permission). Recently, Smokey the Cannon was present at the 2011 Holiday Bowl, in which the Texas Longhorns beat the Cal Golden Bears 21-10 on December 29, 2011; former Texas Cowboy Oldman, Blaine Irby caught 1 pass for 30 yards in the win.

The Cannon has appeared at countless charity and volunteer events across the country and is maintained and transported by the Cannon Crew — a team of four Oldmen, voted on by the entire organization each spring. During the 2012 spring semester, "Smokey III" appeared at Congregation Beth Yeshurun Synagogue in Houston, Texas to honor the Berry family who lost two parents in a car accident in July 2011.

History
Originally, Smokey I was created by the University of Texas at Austin's mechanical engineering lab in 1953, in response to shotgun blasts often heard at the Red River Rivalry. Two years later, Smokey I was modified in 1955 to shoot twin 10-gauge shotgun shells and the revision was renamed "Smokey II". "Smokey II" was used by the Texas Cowboys for over 30 years.

The current version of the cannon, Smokey III, weighs 1,200 pounds and fires up to four blank 10-gauge shells at a time. Smokey III was built by Lupton Machine of Austin, out of the trunk of an oak tree in 1988 and purchased by the Texas Cowboys Alumni Association for $15,000. Smokey III is transported in the Texas Cowboys’ trailer along with a wooden toolbox containing all necessary items to operate the cannon.

title: Smokey the Cannon


text:
Searchlight (disambiguation)

A searchlight is a device to illuminate the sky while searching for aircraft.

Searchlight may also refer to:

Arts and entertainment

 * Search-Light, a publication by William George Jordan
 * Searchlight (album), a 1989 album by Runrig
 * Searchlight (magazine), a British anti-fascist magazine
 * Searchlight (short story), a 1962 science fiction short story by Robert A. Heinlein
 * Searchlights (album), a 2009 album by Abandon
 * "Searchlights", a song by Falling Up from the album Dawn Escapes

Businesses and organizations

 * Searchlight Pictures, a film studio
 * Searchlight Capital Partners, a private equity firm
 * Searchlight BBS, developer of Searchlight BBS software (SLBBS)

Other uses

 * Operation Searchlight, a military pacification program carried out by the Pakistan Army in 1971, in Bangladesh
 * Searchlight (workshops), workshops and home founded by Matron Powell in Denton, Sussex
 * Searchlight, Nevada, a town in Clark County, Nevada, United States
 * Searchlight Airport
 * Searchlight signal, a type of railway signal
 * Searchlight, an annual Canadian music competition mounted by CBC Music

title: Searchlight (disambiguation)


text:
John Ward

John Ward may refer to:

Academia

 * John Ward (academic) (1679–1758), English Gresham Professor of Rhetoric
 * John Clive Ward (1924–2000), British physicist
 * John Manning Ward (1919–1990), Vice-Chancellor and history professor at the University of Sydney
 * John Mason Ward (1921–2014), British chemist
 * John Milton Ward IV (1917–2011), musicologist and Professor of Music at Harvard University
 * John Sebastian Marlowe Ward (1885–1949), British historian, Freemason and spiritualist
 * John William Ward (professor) (1922–1985), professor of English and history, and president of Amherst College

Arts

 * John Ward (actor) (1704–1773), English actor
 * John Ward (American actor) (1923–1995), American actor
 * John Ward (composer) (1590–1638), English composer
 * John Ward (painter) (1798–1849), English marine artist
 * John Ward (potter) (1938–2023), British potter
 * John Powell Ward (born 1937), English poet and academic
 * John Quincy Adams Ward (1830–1910), American sculptor
 * John Stanton Ward (1917–2007), English painter
 * Johnny Ward (actor) (born 1987), Irish actor
 * Johnny Ward (travel blogger) (born 1983), Irish world traveller

Military

 * John Ward (Medal of Honor) (1848–1911), American Indian Wars soldier and Medal of Honor recipient
 * John Ward (RAF officer) (1918–1995), British airman, member of Polish resistance during Warsaw Uprising
 * John Hubert Ward (1870–1938), British army officer and courtier

Public officials

 * John Ward (1779–1855), British Member of Parliament for Leominster
 * John Ward, 1st Earl of Dudley (1781–1833), British statesman, 1st Earl of Dudley
 * John Ward, 1st Viscount Dudley and Ward (1704–1774), British peer and politician
 * John Ward, 2nd Viscount Dudley and Ward (1725–1788), British peer and politician
 * John Ward (banker) (c. 1650–1726), British MP, Lord Mayor of London, Governor of the Bank of England
 * John Ward (Conservative politician) (1925–2010), Conservative MP for Poole, 1979–1997
 * John Ward (diplomat, died 1890) (1805–1890), British diplomat in Germany
 * John Ward (economist) (born 1942), British trade unionist and opera administrator
 * John Ward (loyalist) (1753–1846), businessman and politician in New Brunswick
 * John Ward (Minnesota politician) (born 1950), retired educator and member of the Minnesota House of Representatives
 * John Ward (South Carolina politician) (1767–1816), intendent (mayor) of Charleston, South Carolina, 1801–1802
 * John Ward (trade unionist) (1866–1934), English politician, trade union leader and soldier
 * John Durbin Ward (1819–1886), Ohio lawyer, politician, newspaper publisher and American Civil War officer
 * John Elliott Ward (1814–1902), American diplomat and politician
 * John F. Ward (1904–1973), Speaker of the Maine House of Representatives and President of the Maine Senate
 * John Guthrie Ward (1909–1991), British ambassador to Argentina and Italy
 * John M. Ward (1865–1948), Member of the Maine House of Representatives
 * Sir John MacQueen Ward (born 1940), Scottish businessman
 * T. John Ward (born 1943), United States federal judge, Eastern District of Texas
 * John Ward (died 1501), Lord Mayor of London buried in St Paul's Cathedral

Religion

 * John Ward (archbishop of Cardiff) (1929–2007), Roman Catholic Archbishop of Cardiff, 1983–2001
 * John Ward (auxiliary bishop of Los Angeles) (1920–2011), Roman Catholic auxiliary bishop in Los Angeles
 * John Ward (bishop of Leavenworth) (1857–1929), Roman Catholic Bishop of Leavenworth, 1911–1929
 * John Ward (priest) (died 1860), English Anglican Dean of Lincoln
 * John Ward (prophet) (1781–1837), Irish preacher and prophet
 * John Ward (vicar) (1629–1681), English vicar of Stratford-upon-Avon
 * John C. Ward (1873–1949), bishop of the Episcopal Diocese of Erie

Cricket

 * John Ward (cricketer, born 1946) (born 1946), Australian cricketer
 * John Ward (Derbyshire cricketer) (born 1948), English cricketer for Derbyshire
 * John Ward (Hampshire cricketer) (active 1877), English cricketer for Hampshire
 * John Ward (Kent cricketer) (active 1800–1806), English cricketer in Kent
 * John Ward (New Zealand cricketer) (1937–2021), New Zealand cricketer
 * John Ward (umpire) (born 1962), Australian cricket umpire

Other sports

 * John Ward (1920s footballer) (active 1925–26), English footballer
 * John Ward (American football, born 1907) (1907–1907), American football player and coach
 * John Ward (American football, born 1948) (1948–2012), American football player
 * John Ward (Australian footballer) (1928–2017), Australian rules footballer
 * John Ward (broadcaster) (1930–2018), American radio broadcaster
 * John Ward (footballer, born 1951) (born 1951), English footballer and manager
 * John Ward (outfielder) (active 1884), American baseball outfielder
 * John Ward (pitcher) (1862–1899), American baseball pitcher
 * John Ward (rugby) (1873–1939), English rugby player
 * John Montgomery Ward (1860–1925), American baseball player
 * John T. Ward Jr. (1945–2021), American horse trainer
 * Johnny Ward (rugby league) (c. 1941–2019), English rugby player
 * Jay Ward (baseball) (John Francis Ward, 1938–2012), American baseball player and coach

Other

 * John Ralph Hansford Ward, known as Hansford Ward (1817–1903), also his son with the same name, ship owners and captains of South Australia

title: John Ward


text:
Talk:Ice hockey equipment

History section
This article could really use a history section- it'd be nice to document how ice hockey equipment basically evolved from sticks and blades to kevlar body armour and carbon-compound whips. --Wafulz 05:01, 16 March 2007 (UTC) jnjn — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.30.79.146 (talk) 05:43, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

I agree that the History Section was a really good addition to the article, however I think it could still use improvement and expansion. For example, the history of hockey skates, essentials to the sport, is glazed over in two short sentences leaving the reader confused and unsatisfied with the explanation. I understand that a long history section might go off topic from the article's main purpose but it could still use some work to satisfy the reader. Also citations are needed to add credibility. A.anderson.20 (talk) 19:23, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

for the bums?
I want to know the name of the protective gear for the bums and hips. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.112.12.109 (talk) 04:28, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

Pants, though they're known as breezers in some locations (really just Minnesota). 128.153.218.220 (talk) 17:39, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

What about Hockey Girdle? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.203.88.208 (talk) 10:37, 20 April 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Ice hockey equipment


text:
Talk:Goaltender mask

Correction
Quote: " . . . Plante gave Blake an ultimatum, refusing to go back out onto the ice without the mask, to which Blake obliged not wanting to forfeit the game since the Canadiens did not have a back-up goaltender."

There would not have been a forfeit. Had Plante not returned, the Canadiens would have been forced to use one of their other players in goal, or else use the "house goalie" provided by the home team. That was the standard practice throughout the 1950s. This would have been Joe Schafer who was a trainer in the Rangers organization, and actually did see action in a few NHL games in similar circumstances. WHPratt (talk) 18:47, 4 June 2009 (UTC) That's "Schaefer." His New York Times obituary was published on January 24, 2001, and it stated that he worked for an office equipment company, but was also a part-time Ranger employee as a statistician, penalty timekeeper, goal judge and practice goalie. On a couple of occasions in 1960 and 1961, Gump Worsley got injured and Schaefer tended the Ranger goal, losing both times, but not too badly.WHPratt (talk) 17:42, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

"House Goalie" (or "Emergency Goalkeeper," as the rulebook used to have it) could be a fascinating article to research. I'd guess that it is unparalled in team sports. One position on the team is singled out as entirely too specialized for just any teammate to staff. . . so we draft a civilian, who may even have loyalties to the wrong team. (Did someone decide that the paying spectators deserved to see a "real" goalkeeper in the nets, wherever he came from?) Can you imagine a major league baseball team with an injured catcher refusing to let its utility infielder assume the role, but instead using a retired minor league catcher who happens to be under contract to the opposing team? Or a pro football team borrowing a kicker for the fourth quarter? Ridiculous! WHPratt (talk) 16:52, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Fans of goaltender trivia should check the talk page on Jerry Toppazzini, for my notes on his short stint as a goalie and identification of another house goalie, Wally “Gunzo” Humeniuk. WHPratt (talk) 19:24, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Images
Can someone add the mage and non-mage styles of current masks? 70.29.208.247 (talk) 06:36, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

Mask season Blueoister (talk) 22:31, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

New Section
Should there be a section on how the mask is produced?24.15.175.163 (talk) 15:05, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

Tactical face masks...
I think this article needs to mention/link to an article about these: http://www.bluedefense.com/ballistic-face-masks/ (not public domain) tactical face masks. Khallus Maximus (talk) 22:42, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Dead external link

 * Head Case: Weird, Wild Hockey Masks - slideshow by Life magazine

Life.com no longer has this slide show on their site, at all, according to their search function (for hockey mask). Removed from article. Khallus Maximus (talk) 01:43, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

In Film claim
Is the claim made in the 'in film' section correct? What other examples are there of horror villains other than Jason that wears a goalie mask? The claim is also unsourced, so it seems questionable as to whether this section should be included. Deleting unless some sources could be supplied. -Xcuref1endx (talk) 03:47, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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Hamburgler Mask
There's a number of examples of decorative masks at the bottom of the page...but where is the iconic Hamburgler? Can someone do the legwork and use this picture? :) [] The Legacy (talk) 01:11, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

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What about Hannibal Lecter?
Since there's a pic of movie character "Jason Voorhees" wearing a hockey mask, why not have a pic of another well-known villainous movie character wearing a different hockey mask?

"'Hannibal the Cannibal' Lecter" wore a mask in The Silence of the Lambs (granted it was not worn for the entire movie) that appears to be based on Jacques Plante's fiberglass one from 1959.

How about a pic of that?

Maybe combine the Voorhees and Lecter pics & info into a "Popular culture" or "In film" section?

Just a thought. 2600:8800:786:A300:C23F:D5FF:FEC4:D51D (talk) 00:41, 1 November 2017 (UTC)

title: Talk:Goaltender mask


text:
Talk:Ice resurfacer

Price
What is the range of prices for these machines? That seems noteworthy for the article. You're looking at a minimum of $70,000 for a new machine. However a wide array of features are available: automatic snow breaker, extra seats, seatbelts, fuel (gasoline, propane, CNG, electric), rear-mounted edger, tire wash, and much more. A laser guided blade system will run about another $10,000 and the FastIce System runs for around $20,000 to $30,000 depending on the options.

For less than full size rinks, don't forget the compact Sport Ice 124,  much lower cost than full size machine. Great2b1 (talk) 15:47, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm not quite sure where you got the half million figure for a new resurfacer. Everything I have ever heard has always been in the range of $80,000 (USD) to $100,000. All of these previously mentioned prices are about 10x more than I have ever seen or heard. If I recall, Philips Arena's ice maintenance head said they only paid about $30,000 each for FastIce and a STAR rep there said the laser system was about $10,000. The big deterrent in implementing these systems is that they require a higher degree of proficiency that is not as high at most rinks operating. --66.32.173.126 (talk) 07:32, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

According to a 1996 Road & Track test drive of a Zamboni Model 500 (http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/download/0504_zamboni_data_panels.pdf) the list price is $41,750 and the machine they tested being $51,110. Adjusting for inflation, $50,000 in 1996 is $68,458.57 in 2008.--66.32.173.126 (talk) 23:12, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

"Improperly refer..."
From this sentence:

Frank J. Zamboni & Co, Inc. and other companies manufacture ice resurfacing machines, and although some people improperly refer to ice resurfacers as "a Zamboni", the name ZAMBONI is a federally and internationally registered trademark.

This is just ridiculous. No matter how much they'd like to try, the ZAMBONI company does not have the slightest power over linguistics. The things are called Zambonis at every hockey rink in the English-speaking world. I strongly suggest a rewording of this line.  JHMM13  21:12, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

While the company cannot actually prevent people from referring to ice resurfacers as "Zambonis", they are required by US law to make all possible efforts to prevent such usage. Failure to do so could result in the loss of the company's ownership of the name and design of the vehicle.--66.32.173.126 (talk) 07:32, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The Zamboni was created in the city of Paramount, CA. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.188.96.2 (talk) 15:53, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

 * As noted, Zamboni being trademarked ensures only that company can call their ice resurfacer a Zambonis; however it is undoubtedly used as a generic term by many. Not that it needs to be explained in such excruciating detail in the main article; I just reworded the opening paragraph in a manner that should suit all parties here. WWB (talk) 22:22, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Advert template
I added an advert template. The Frank Zamboni company is overly prominent in the article. We may all applaud Frank's invention, which it'd be great to see written up in a more complete 'history' section. Twang (talk) 20:34, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Removing irrelevant pollution section
These machines generally run on natural gas, which is very clean burning. It sounds to me like this section was added to promote the sales of electric machines. The basic fact is, all combustion engines have deleterious effects on air quality. This is like explaining that ice is both dangerous and made from frozen water in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.148.4.31 (talk) 02:49, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks like someone re-added the pollution section without discussion here. I also agree that the pollution is not significant considering the scope of the article, or the scope of pollution in general, and should probably be eliminated. The only thing that might seem relevant in my mind is the potential increase in asthma symptoms, but certainly that does not require a whole top-level section. Brianski (talk) 15:54, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I have no axe to grind, here, but I understand that roof vents are required when using non-electric resurfacers. The electric machines emit no exhaust and require no ventilation system. Avoiding indoor pollution is a strong reason to switch to electric machines, manufactured by SportIce USA,  Zamboni and Olympia. TreacherousWays (talk) 17:00, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Trivia/In popular culture
IMO, everything currently in the "In popular culture" section is trivia and has been removed. The list has been posted here, in the event that anyone wishes to expand these trivial notes into actual notable tidbits -TinGrin 17:37, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

In popular culture
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Tingrin87 (talk • contribs) 17:37, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * A Zamboni resurfacer made repeated (and always nonsensical) appearances in the Peanuts comic strip, first appearing in a strip during the 1980 Winter Olympics. Snoopy usually drove the Zamboni, although Woodstock had a small Zamboni for his bird bath. As a result many people who have never seen resurfacers associate them with the Zamboni name. One time Linus thought that the Great Pumpkin was rising out of the pumpkin patch, only to realize, much to Sally's outrage, that it was merely a Zamboni.
 * In a Drabble comic strip, Norman's new "exotic foreign sports car" turned out to be a Zamboni.
 * On the TV series CSI: Crime Scene Investigation, Gil Grissom commented in the episode "Primum Non Nocere", "There are three things in life people like to stare at: a rippling stream, a fire in a fire place, and a Zamboni going around and around." Sara Sidle noted immediately afterward that this was a quote from Peanuts.
 * Former baseball third baseman Ken Reitz was nicknamed "The Zamboni" for his skill at scooping up ground balls on the artificial turf of Busch Memorial Stadium.
 * In the Canadian cartoon series Chilly Beach, Dale is a professional Zamboni driver.
 * An episode of the comedy/history series History Bites made a throwaway reference to the Zamboni family, employed to tidy the Colosseum between gladiator matches, circa AD 100.
 * WWE wrestler Stone Cold Steve Austin once drove a Zamboni to the ring to confront WWE chairman Vince McMahon at Joe Louis Arena.
 * On the television series Cheers, Carla's second husband Eddie was killed when he was run over by a Zamboni. Cheers writer Ken Levine has said that the show's writers were initially concerned that they would not legally be able to use the name "Zamboni", but that when Frank J. Zamboni & Co. was contacted about it, the Zamboni family loved the idea and readily granted permission for the name to be used.
 * A hit song by the Gear Daddies is called "Zamboni".
 * In the Canadian movie Bon Cop, Bad Cop, one of the bodies is found attached to a Zamboni.
 * In their song "King of Spain", Moxy Früvous sings that the Toronto Maple Leafs call the narrator to drive their Zamboni.
 * In the musical Dirty Rotten Scoundrels, Freddy sings that he wants his "own personal Zamboni" in the song "Great Big Stuff".
 * A Zamboni is mentioned in the "Weird Al" Yankovic song "Canadian Idiot".
 * In the ER episode "A Miracle Happens Here", a drunken Zamboni driver levels a group of ice skaters, sending them to the ER.
 * In an episode of Spongebob Squarepants where Plankton freezes the Krusty Krab, Mr. Krabs has ice resurfacer referred to as a Clamboni Machine.
 * In the film D2: The Mighty Ducks, three of the "Ducks" crash a resurfacer through the boards.
 * In the pilot episode of Reaper, a Zamboni driver gets underneath the Zamboni after it stalls and is killed when it starts up and runs over him.
 * In an episode of Dead Like Me, a Zamboni accident leads to the death of a hockey coach.
 * A quote from comedy film Blades of Glory, about two male ice skaters trying to compete as pairs team, refers Zamboni: "These guys put the bone in Zamboni!".
 * Alaska Governor Sarah Palin has expressed, in an interview with People magazine, that she "always wanted a son named Zamboni."
 * The Providence Bruins (American Hockey League affiliate of the Boston Bruins) have a mascot named Sam Boni.
 * On the show 6teen, Jude Lizowski says that in Canada, a zamboni driver is a respected member of the community, when questioned why by Wyatt Williams, Jude replied "I don't know, I guess here in Canada people just like Zambonis for some reason".
 * The Plants vs. Zombies video game features a zombie-driven ice resurfacer called a 'Zomboni' as an opponent.
 * A pro-war propaganda clip in the comedy film Canadian Bacon references Canada's "threatening lead in Zamboni technology."
 * In the movie Analyze That the character mistakes a Stromboni for a Zamboni while in conversation with gang members.
 * In the ALIAS Episode 16/Season 2 "Firebomb", Sydney (Jennifer Garner) & Vaughn (Michael Vartan) come home from a hockey game, and Vaughn teases Syd: "The Zamboni is your favorite part?" and Sydney replies, "No, coming home with YOU is my favorite part. The Zamboni is a close second." Later in the same episode, Sydney is in the bathtub; and Vaughn says, "The Kings are in town next week. You could watch the Zamboni..."

Before
how about a discription of how they did it before the zamboni? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.71.148.1 (talk) 19:51, 16 January 2013 (UTC)
 * A team of men with shovels, slush, snow, and water, went about and cleared the ice, patched up ruts, during play. Before and after play, you'd flood the rink with a hose. ; in current outdoor rinks, a snowplow would clear the surface, a snowblower would get rid of the snowpiles, and a tanker truck would flood the surface. -- 76.65.128.43 (talk) 03:30, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

"Zamboni"
I suggest that most of the history section be split to a new article Zamboni Company (current corporate name ) and a summary be left behind here. This article is about ice resurfacers in general, so the specific corporate history detail should be in a corporate article. As the corporation seems very notable, there should be no problem with its existence. -- 76.65.128.43 (talk) 03:28, 17 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Agreed, cause there are more producers of Ice resurfacers than just the Zamboni company, see for example the dutch or the German article, and by splitting this section it gives it a chance of a more balanced view of this type of machine. Regards Migrant (talk) 18:19, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Agree per nom. Roger (talk) 08:54, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

I have now copied the relevant material to the Zamboni Company article but I need help with trimming down the History section of this page to just the main points. Roger (talk) 09:06, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Original Zamboni – photo requested
The original Zamboni machine is parked in the skating rink that the family still owns, just down the street from the factory. See here. Could an L.A.-based Wikipedia editor drop by and take a photo, and upload it for the history section of this article? Thanks, Wbm1058 (talk) 18:57, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Google Doodle link
The LA Times article is no longer valid. Making linking directly to the Google Doodle would be a better idea? --69.85.88.55 (talk) 15:29, 27 July 2013 (UTC)

Promotional?
There seems to be alot of Promotion information about specific brands and models throughout the article. I think it needs to be cleaned up.Fusion2186 (talk) 21:31, 12 February 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 24 December 2018

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

No consensus. See no general agreement below to rename this article or the other changes mentioned. COMMONNAME args cited were unconvincing and need to be strengthened if used in the future. As is usual with a no-consensus outcome, editors can strengthen their args and try again in a few months to garner consensus for these or similar changes. Kudos to editors for your input, and Happy Publishing! (nac by page mover)  Paine Ellsworth , ed. put'r there 19:05, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

Ice resurfacer → Zamboni – This machine is almost universally called a "Zamboni". The second sentence of the article acknowledges this fact. The generic term "ice resurfacer" makes logical sense, but is clearly not the common name. As with "Jet ski" or "Hovercraft" (both brand names), this is another case where people barely know what the generic object is actually called, and simply use the brand name to refer to all models of it. Same is true with the Zamboni. Mathglot (talk) 18:27, 24 December 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. Dekimasu よ! 23:49, 31 December 2018 (UTC) --Relisting.   SITH   (talk)   21:50, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

Even the job description yields to this.

Compare: and these two searches, each showing documents containing only one of the two terms, and excluding the other:
 * Ice resurfacer :
 * Zamboni :
 * "ice resurfacer" -zamboni
 * zamboni -"ice resurfacer"

If approved, this would imply the following concomitant actions: Mathglot (talk) 18:27, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
 * 1) Zamboni (disambiguation) – delete (this is a redirect to the disambig page Zamboni) to make room for #2
 * 2) Zamboni – move to Zamboni (disambiguation) leaving no redirect behind
 * 3) Ice resurfacer – move to Zamboni, leaving redirect behind

 * Support – as nom; per WP:COMMONNAME. Mathglot (talk) 18:27, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
 * WP:RM: "Nomination already implies that the nominator supports the name change, and nominators should refrain from repeating this recommendation on a separate bulleted line." Dekimasu よ! 23:49, 31 December 2018 (UTC)
 * struck Mathglot (talk) 23:56, 31 December 2018 (UTC)

 * Support per WP:COMMONNAME. עם ישראל חי (talk) 19:24, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: there is a very long previous RM discussion on the same topic at Talk:Zamboni that also discusses Zamboni Company. Dekimasu よ! 21:34, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Oppose per the previous points made at Talk:Zamboni. Dicklyon (talk) 05:01, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:PRECISION. Rreagan007 (talk) 05:13, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Support per WP:COMMONNAME. Slurmboy (talk) 01:17, 2 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support per common name and WP:CONCISE Red   Slash  23:42, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:Precision. While one of the best examples of a genericized trademark ever, it would be imprecise to rename this article as there are many other companies than make ice resurfacers, even if this article is deficient in listing them as is done in other language Wikipedias. oknazevad (talk) 00:47, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Well, perhaps the best genericized trademark ever is Aspirin, but now everybody calls it by that name, not just Bayer. But the Acetylsalicylic acid article is nevertheless called "Aspirin". Oknazevad, may I ask you: would you be in favor of renaming the Hovercraft article "Air cushion vehicle"? There are, after all, other companies that make them. And if not, on what grounds do you base your vote here? Mathglot (talk) 05:25, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Aspirin and hovercraft are terms that have been legally determined to no longer hold trademark status, at least in some countries, so they're not the same situation. They're not current twademarks of a particular company (except where Bayer's lawyers were able to convince people otherwise). oknazevad (talk) 12:37, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia article titles are not based on who owns, or doesn't own, a trademark. The point I was making was, that I believe the article title should be changed because it is the common name of the device. That is, this article should be called "Zamboni" for the same reason that the Air cushion vehicle article is called "Hovercraft" and the Acetylsalicylic acid article is called "Aspirin": namely, the are the common names for their respective topics.  If you vote to keep "Hovercraft" named that way because it legally is determined not to hold trademark status, then that is not a Wikipedia policy-based argument and doesn't hold any weight; likewise for the Zamboni.  You are aware that Rfcs are not based on simple preference-based vote-counting, right? WP:ACD says regarding Rfc closure: Arguments based on misconceptions of policy/guidelines, or which do not contain policy/guideline-based reasoning at all, should not be considered in your analysis. If you want your vote to count, invoking trademark status won't help; you need to use a policy-based argument. Mathglot (talk) 12:56, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * I'm saying that in those cases they really are genuinely generic terms that are the common name. I don't see Zamboni as the same because it is still a company's name, just as adhesive bandage is not at Band-Aid, nor photocopy at Xerox. The policy based reason is that using the genericized trademark is imprecise, and can cause confusion for readers. Which I've already said. You need to take it down a notch. You are coming off way too hostile to an editor who knows and says what he means. oknazevad (talk) 13:27, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * You say that the genericized trademark is imprecise, and can cause confusion for readers and claim that's a policy-based reason. But I say there is no such policy about genericized trademarks being imprecise. If there is one, please cite it. Btw, that's a disagreement on WP policy interpretation; please don't mistake disagreement with your PoV for hostility; people can disagree calmly in a discussion, and up till now, that's been what's going on here. Accusing someone of being "hostile" just because they disagree with you in a discussion is uncivil; please don't do it.  Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 21:42, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * And in saying that the imprecision in question is beyond just Wikipedia policy but a property of the English language. That's my interpretation of the policy, based on common sense. To state that you disagree with my interpretation is one thing, to say I'm not basing my reason on policy because I have my own interpretation is to fail to assume good faith. But let's both of us walk away. We've each had out input in the discussion, and in the spirit of not albadvering the discussion let's both let others state their views. oknazevad (talk) 19:46, 6 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Listed at related WikiProjects. Mathglot (talk) 08:18, 10 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support: COMMONNAME issue, pure and simple. That many other companies make the machines is true, but that's not really relevant. (I'm failing, as well, to see where PRECISION fits in to this argument.)   Ravenswing    20:42, 10 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Because there's Zamboni the company, and both the company and their products can be referred to by the bare term, so the bare term is too imprecise for an article title. Using one company's name as a genericized trademark is also an imprecise use for the object. That's a reason the vast majority of terms at List of generic and genericized trademarks have separate links for he brand and the objects, unless the trademark has lost legal protection in at least some jurisdictions. oknazevad (talk) 22:37, 10 January 2019 (UTC)
 * It's not too imprecise; that's the point of PRIMARYTOPIC. If this is not the primary topic for Zamboni, then no ambiguous title could have a primary topic. --В²C ☎ 01:32, 11 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support per WP:COMMONNAME. This is the name used almost universally to refer to this subject.  And it's WP:PRIMARYTOPIC relative to the company, the inventor, other uses, etc. Too bad for other ice resurfacer companies. Not our problem. --В²C ☎ 01:30, 11 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support per WP:COMMONNAME.ZXCVBNM (TALK) 11:09, 11 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Oppose being that it is ambiguous in itself the current title is better. So I suppose PRECISE does apply. -DJSasso (talk) 18:46, 11 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:PRECISION. Flibirigit (talk) 23:50, 11 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support per WP:COMMONNAME.  on camera  02:14, 12 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support per WP:COMMONNAME. Sammy D III (talk) 14:30, 12 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Has this been shown to be an international WP:COMMONNAME? It is in the US, but is that US-centric? Sammy D III (talk) 17:55, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

 * Support per WP:COMMONNAME. -- Necrothesp (talk) 15:02, 17 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Oppose'Many other companies make them, it's not precise. I am aloe unsure that internationally WP:COMMONNAME applies. Blethering  Scot  17:09, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Notification of requested move at Zamboni
The requested move proposes renaming Zamboni (a disambiguation page) to Zamboni (disambiguation) in order for "Zamboni" to redirect to ice resurfacer. Wracking 💬 04:07, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Ice resurfacer