text:
Track circuit

A track circuit is an electrical device used to prove the absence of a train on rail tracks to signallers and control relevant signals. An alternative to track circuits are axle counters.

Principles and operation
The basic principle behind the track circuit lies in the connection of the two rails by the wheels and axle of locomotives and rolling stock to short an electrical circuit. This circuit is monitored by electrical equipment to detect the absence of the trains. Since this is a safety appliance, fail-safe operation is crucial. Hence the circuit is designed to indicate the presence of a train when failures occur. On the other hand, false occupancy readings are disruptive to railway operations and must be minimized.

Track circuits allow railway signalling systems to operate semi-automatically, by displaying signals for trains to slow or stop in the presence of occupied track ahead of them. They help prevent dispatchers and operators from causing accidents, both by informing them of track occupancy and by preventing signals from displaying unsafe indications.

The basic circuit
A track circuit typically has power applied to each rail and a relay coil wired across them. When no train is present, the relay is energised by the current flowing from the power source through the rails. When a train is present, its axles short (shunt) the rails together. The current to the track relay coil drops, and it is de-energised. Circuits through the relay contacts therefore report whether or not the track is occupied.

Each circuit detects a defined section of track, such as a block. These sections are separated by insulated joints, usually in both rails. To prevent one circuit from falsely powering another in the event of insulation failure, the electrical polarity is usually reversed from one section to an adjacent section. Circuits are powered at low voltages (1.5 to 12 V DC). The relays and the power supply are attached to opposite ends of the section to prevent broken rails from electrically isolating part of the track from the circuit. A series resistor limits the current when the track circuit is short-circuited.

Circuits under electrification
In some railway electrification schemes, one or both of the running rails are used to carry the return traction current. This precludes use of the basic DC track circuit because the substantial traction currents overwhelm the very small track circuit currents.

Where DC traction is used on the running line or on tracks in close proximity then DC track circuits cannot be used; similarly if 50 Hz AC electrification is used then 50 Hz AC track circuits cannot be used.

To accommodate this, AC track circuits use alternating current (AC) signals instead of direct current (DC) but typically, the AC frequency is in the range of audio frequencies, from 91 Hz up to 10 kHz. The relays are arranged to detect the selected frequency and to ignore DC and AC traction frequency signals. Again, fail-safe principles dictate that the relay interprets the presence of the signal as unoccupied track, whereas a lack of a signal indicates the presence of a train. The AC signal can be coded and locomotives equipped with inductive pickups to create a cab signalling system.

There are two common approaches to provide a continuous path for traction current that spans multiple track circuit blocks. The simplest method installs insulated track circuit joints on only one of the two rails with the second being a path for the return current and a ground for the track circuit rail. This has the disadvantage of only being able to detect breaks in one rail so the more popular two rail system uses impedance bonds to permit traction current to pass between isolated track circuit blocks while blocking current at track circuit frequencies.

AC circuits are sometimes used in areas where conditions introduce stray currents, which interfere with DC track circuits.

Jointless track circuits
Modern track is often continuously welded, the joints being welded during installation. This offers many benefits, except to the signalling system, which no longer has natural breaks in the rail to form block sections. The only method to form discrete blocks in this scenario is to use different audio frequencies (AF) in each block section. To prevent the audio signal from one section passing into an adjacent section, pairs of tuned circuits are connected across the rails at the section boundary. The tuned circuit often incorporates the circuit to either apply the transmitted signal to the track or recover the received signal from the other end of the section.

Consider a railway with two block sections as in the diagram. Section 1 has frequency A injected at the left-hand end and received at the right-hand end. Section 2 continues from the right hand end of section 1 where frequency B is injected and then received at the right-hand end of section 2.

There is often a gap between where frequency A is received and frequency B is injected. This is referred to as a 'tuned zone' and is a section of track where the amplitude of frequency A reduces in the direction of section 2 and the amplitude of frequency B reduces in the direction of section 1. The tuned zone can be of the order of 20 m long.

Advantages of jointless track circuits:
 * Eliminates insulated block joints, a component liable to mechanical failure (both of insulation and by introducing stress to adjoining rails) and maintenance.
 * In electrified areas, jointless track circuits require fewer impedance bonds than any other double rail traction return track circuits.

Disadvantages of jointless track circuits:
 * Restrictions on placing impedance bonds, hence any connection for electrification purposes, in or near tuned zones as this may upset the filter properties of the tuned zone.
 * Electronic circuits are more vulnerable to lightning strikes.

CSEE UM71
CSEE (now Ansaldo STS) UM71 is another kind of jointless track circuit. It uses 1700 Hz and 2300 Hz on one track and 2000 Hz and 2600 Hz on the other. To reduce the chance of stray currents causing a wrong side failure the modulation frequency is calculated by dividing the base frequency by 128. Different rates of modulation can be detected by equipment on the trains and used for automatic train control, so long as the transmitter end (Tx) is at the front of the train.

The EBItrack (formerly TI21) and Westinghouse FS2500 jointless track circuits are similar to the UM71.

Data Pickup Unit
A jointless track circuit such as the CSEE can be divided with a data pickup unit (DPU), which is cheaper than splitting it into two track circuits. A DPU avoids the need to change the frequency of a whole series of track circuits in a cascade. The DPU consists of a tuned coil which detects the presence or absence of current in the adjacent rail and picks up or drops a relay accordingly. One use of DPUs is for timing circuits. Each track circuit frequency has its own DPU tuned to that frequency. DPUs can be located almost anywhere; they overcome the limitation that jointless tracks have a minimum length.

DC coded track circuits
In non-electrified areas, DC coded track circuits may be used. These modulate the current going from the powersource end to the relay end and control the signals and cab signals without the need for line wires. The modulated currents can be detected by equipment connected to the track to provide signaling and indication information to activate proper cab signalling if available. They can be overlain by predictor systems to operate level crossings.

Brands of coded track circuit include:
 * Alstom née GE Electrocode 5
 * Microtrax/E-Code by Hitachi née Union Switch & Signal

Cut tracks
Where the length of a section exceeds the practical length of a track circuit, cut tracks can be provided. With a cut track, the relay of the last track cuts the powersource feed of the second last track circuit, and so on. Cut tracks are only suitable for unidirectional tracks.

Track circuits with ballast contamination will be shorter than those with good ballast, thus needing more cut tracks.

High voltage tracks
One common brand of high voltage impulse track (HVIT) circuit is made by Jeumont-Schneider. The high voltage penetrates rust and other problems.

The HVIT transmits two pulses alternately, a narrow positive one at about 100VDC and a negative broader one at about 30VDC. The energy of the two pulses is the same. At the receiver end a R-C circuit integrates the two pulses which must be of the correct proportions for the relay to pick up. The R-C circuits check that the positive and negative pulses are in correct phase. The two pulses operate at about 1 Hz.

The circuit will operate on AC and DC electrified lines, with additional equipment.

Single rail and double rail
In non-electrified areas, insulated blockjoints come in pairs, one on each rail.

In electrified areas, a workaround is needed to allow the traction current, of the order of thousands of amperes, to return to the substation. This may be achieved by having no insulated block joints in one of the rails, called the return rail.

If both rails are needed to carry the heavy traction return current, then insulated blockjoints are provided in both rails, and impedance bonds are provided to carry the traction current around the insulated joints. Impedance bonds are essentially centre-tapped coils, which offer low impedance to traction current at say 50 Hz, while offering high impedance to signalling current at say 1.7 kHz.

Wheels and brakes
Railway wheels are made from steel and provide a good short circuit from rail to rail (shunt resistance).

Longer trains with more wheels have better conductivity. Short trains, light railmotors or single engines can be a problem. In New Zealand there were problems with light Rm class railmotors not always being detected; see Railway signalling in New Zealand. Trains with a single Budd railmotor, which are also lightweight, and with discbrakes, had some problems when they stopped, and had to make a double stop to ensure good contact with the rails.

Cast iron brake shoes tend to clean the wheels of non-conductive debris (such as leaves and sand-based traction compounds), while disc brakes do not. As a result, some disc-braked vehicles have "scrubber pads" cleaning the wheels to aid in proper track circuit operation.

Relays
Track circuit relays, referred to by signal maintainers as "vital relays," are specially designed to reduce the chance of wrong-side failures. They may, for example, have carbon-silver contacts to reduce the likelihood of the wrong contacts welding shut after power surges and lightning strikes.

Circuit failures
The circuit is designed so the vast majority of failures will cause a "track occupied" indication (known as a right-side failure). For example:
 * A broken rail or wire will break the circuit between the power supply and the relay, de-energizing the relay. See exception below.
 * A failure in the power supply will de-energize the relay.
 * A short across the rails or between adjacent track sections will de-energize the relay.

On the other hand, failure modes which prevent the circuit from detecting trains (known as a wrong-side failure) are possible. Examples include:
 * Mechanical failure of the relay, causing the relay to be stuck in the "track clear" position even when the track is occupied.
 * One perspex case warped in the heat, and touched the relay contacts, holding them up.
 * Another relay saw a metal washer slip off and jam the relay contacts up; the half-washers had to be replaced by full-circle washers.
 * Conditions which partially or completely insulate the wheels from the rail, such as rust, sand, or dry leaves on the rails. This is also known as "poor shunting" ("failure to shunt" in North America and Australia).  Sanding gear which operates on all wheels of an engine traveling light can temporarily insulate it from the rails until the sanding ceases and the locomotive has moved further down the track.
 * Where multiple parallel paths exist for traction return purposes broken rail detection will be lost for the rail that is used for the traction return. If more than one break occurs in that rail a false clear can occur when the train is between the breaks.
 * Conditions in the trackbed (roadbed) which create stray electrical signals, such as muddy ballast (which can generate a "battery effect") or parasitic electrical currents from nearby power transmission lines.
 * Parasitic oscillations in the equipment that controls the track circuits.
 * Equipment which is not heavy enough to make good electrical contact (shunt failure) or whose wheels must be electrically insulated.
 * A rail break between the insulated rail joint and the track circuit feed wiring would not be detected.

Failure modes that result in an incorrect "track clear" signal (known usually in the US as a "false clear") may allow a train to enter an occupied block, creating the risk of a collision. Wheel scale and short trains may also be a problem. They may also cause the warning systems at a grade crossing to fail to activate. This is why in UK practice, a treadle is also used in crossing circuitry.

Different means are used to respond to these types of failures. For example, the relays are designed to a very high level of reliability. In areas with electrical problems, different types of track circuits may be used which are less susceptible to interference. Speeds may be restricted when and where fallen leaves are an issue. Traffic may be embargoed to let equipment pass which does not reliably shunt the rails.

Sabotage is possible. In the 1995 Palo Verde derailment, saboteurs electrically connected sections of rail which they had displaced to conceal the breaks in the track they had made. The track circuit therefore did not detect the breaks, and the engine driver was not given a "Stop" indication. Another form of sabotage, not intended to cause a train crash but merely to make trains stop and slow down unnecessarily in an effort to sabotage an economy or potential injuries, is to tie a wire between the 2 rails, causing a false obstruction signal.

Railhead contamination and rust
The track circuit relies upon an adequate electrical contact between the rail and the wheel; contamination can insulate the one from the other. A common problem is fallen leaves, though there have been cases where crushed insects have also caused detection failures.

A more persistent problem is rust. Usually the railhead is kept clean of rust by the regular passage of trains' wheels. Lines which are not used regularly can become so rusty as to prevent vehicles being detected. Seldom-used points and crossovers and the extremities of terminal platform lines are also prone to rusting. Measures to overcome this include:
 * Depression bars or treadles to detect vehicles;
 * Stainless steel strips (often zig zag in shape) welded on the railheads;
 * High voltage impulse track circuits;
 * Track Circuit Assistor (TCA) - a train mounted system that breaks down the resistance of the rust layer;
 * Axle counters over the affected section; and/or
 * Tunnel sticks whereby a track circuit cannot pickup unless a train is detected in the next track circuit.

Scale
Insulated blockjoints can be bridged by wheel scale in some circumstances causing one or two track circuits to fail. This problem may be reduced by having a pair of blockjoints in series about 4m apart. The short 4m section would not itself be track circuited.

Immunization
Electric locomotives must avoid generating noise in the frequencies that track circuits use. The SNCB Class 13 had such problems.

Transitory problems
A short, lightweight and fast train passing over an insulated blockjoint may disappear from the departing track circuit before it appears in the arriving track circuit, allowing false clear signals to be given. This problem can be overcome by introducing a time delay of say 1 – 2 seconds into the departing track circuit. Electronic track circuits such as the CSEE can easily incorporate such a time delay.

Siding turnout
It is sometimes convenient to wire the detectors of a set of points through the track circuit over those points. This can be done in one of two ways:
 * A contact of the points detector can shunt the track circuit when the points are reverse, putting the signals to red, however this is not failsafe.
 * The track circuit can be split with extra blockjoints and the detectors in the points complete the track circuit when the points are normal and the signal is entitled to receive a green light. This is partially fail-safe.
 * A second relay can be installed on the turnout, with its contacts wired in series with the main relay. This is fail-safe but expensive.

Track-circuit operating clips
A simple piece of safety equipment which is carried by all heavy rail trains in Britain is a track-circuit operating clip (TCOC). This is a length of wire connecting two metal spring clips that clip onto a rail. In the event of accident or obstruction a clip applied to both rails will indicate that that line is occupied, putting the signal for that section to danger.

Emergency protection procedure in the UK requires TCOCs to be placed on all affected running lines if contact cannot be made immediately with the signaller following an accident where adjacent lines are blocked.

TCOCs are ineffective where train detection is not by means of track circuits, such as axle counters or treadles.

History
The first use of track circuiting was by William Robert Sykes on a short stretch of track of the London Chatham and Dover Railway at Brixton in 1864. The failsafe track circuit was invented in 1872 by William Robinson, an American electrical and mechanical engineer. His introduction of a trustworthy method of block occupancy detection was key to the development of the automatic signalling systems now in nearly universal use.

The first railway signals were manually operated by signal tenders or station agents. When to change the signal aspect was often left to the judgement of the operator. Human error or inattentiveness occasionally resulted in improper signalling and train collisions.

The introduction of the telegraph during the mid-nineteenth century showed that information could be electrically conveyed over considerable distance, spurring the investigation into methods of electrically controlling railway signals. Although several systems were developed prior to Robinson's, none could automatically respond to train movements.

Robinson first demonstrated a fully automatic railway signalling system in model form in 1870. A full-sized version was subsequently installed on the Philadelphia and Erie Railroad at Ludlow, Pennsylvania (aka Kinzua, PA), where it proved to be practical. His design consisted of electrically operated discs located atop small trackside signal huts, and was based on an open track circuit. When no train was within the block no power was applied to the signal, indicating a clear track.

An inherent weakness of this arrangement was that it could fail in an unsafe state. For example, a broken wire in the track circuit would falsely indicate that no train was in the block, even if one was. Recognizing this, Robinson devised the closed loop track circuit described above, and in 1872, installed it in place of the previous circuit. The result was a fully automatic, failsafe signalling system that was the prototype for subsequent development.

Although a pioneer in the use of signals controlling trains, the UK was slow to adopt Robinson's design. At the time, many carriages on UK railways had wooden axles and/or wheels with wooden hubs, making them incompatible with track circuits.

Caused by lack of track circuits
Numerous accidents would have been prevented by the provision of track circuits, including:
 * 🇬🇧 Norton Fitzwarren rail crash (1890)
 * 🇬🇧 Hawes Junction rail crash (1910)
 * 🇬🇧 Quintinshill rail crash (1915)
 * 🇦🇺 Geurie crossing loop collision (1963)
 * 🇨🇦 Lac-Mégantic rail disaster (2013)

Caused by track circuit failure
Much rarer are accidents caused when the track circuits themselves fail. For example:
 * 🇦🇺 Cowan rail disaster, which occurred when sand on the rails insulated the wheels from the rails, causing a failure to shunt that allowed a trailing block signal to improperly display a clear aspect, resulting in a rear-end collision.
 * Moravany railway crash, occurred in Moravany railway station. Broken sand dispenser caused a layer of sand being created on the rail, making it lose the shunt. The station equipment interpreted this as the track is free and allowed another train in to proceed into the station, which then crashed into the previous train from behind.
 * 🇺🇸 June 22, 2009 Washington Metro train collision, which occurred when a parasitic oscillation developed in a track circuit control module.

Broken rails
Because Track circuits operate by passing a current through one or both of the tracks, they can sometimes detect if a rail has broken completely. However, if the break is only partial or is at a turnout (set of points) detection may not be possible.
 * 🇬🇧 Hither Green rail crash (1967) - derailment due to top of rail having broken off
 * 🇺🇸 Weyauwega derailment (1996) - undetected broken rail in turnout.
 * 🇺🇸 Big Bayou Canot rail accident (1993) - undetected unbroken but badly twisted continuous welded rail on a bridge that still indicated a clear condition to the signal.

title: Track circuit


text:
Talk:Japanese

Erm...................
Ah. What am I supposed to say here? Uh.......hmm. I was just wanting to know what type of writing system is mostly used in Japan. I don't know which ones I should learn first. Katakana, Hiragana, Kanji, Handakuon, Dakuon, Kana, or Rōmaji? Just, ah....just asking is all.

I probably sound like a dork though, because I think Handakuon and Dakuon are pretty much the same. But I think Katakana and sometimes Kanji are used most constantly. I'm not positive though. So, uh......Gosh, no one is probably ever going to read this, and I'm probably never going to come back to see if there is a reply or not, so why bother?

But you know, I'd never be able to make such a vast website such as yours, so congratulations! And keep up the good work! I enjoy the forign language parts of Wikipedia. Thank you for helping me out!

 * Well, dakuten is not really a writing system, it's more like Japanese diacritics to voice a consonant sound. Kana is an umbrella term for both Katakana and Hiragana. Anyway, you should probably learn Hiragana first, and Katakana shortly afterwards (or possibly, the other way around, like me) and not start with Kanji before you begin knowing your Kana quite well. Anyway, there are already quite extensive Wikipedia articles about the Japanese writing systems.

 * I might be late in this story but the most letters that are used are Hiragana and Kanji. You should first learn Hiragana first to get the hang of the rest, but romaji is easier. user:Englishfun

 * Well, I'm totally late for this, but you should get a solid footing in hiragana before going anywhere. Then go to katakana, and then you can start kanji. Romaji is a great tool during this time, but don't get used to it, it can very quickly become a crutch. Hope I helped. :)ILuvEire (talk) 06:58, 20 May 2009 (UTC) No no nope. you should'nt be here.

Link repair
see also:
 * the Japanese language, a Japonic language spoken mainly in Japan
 * Japanese writing system
 * Kanji, characters of Chinese origin,
 * Hiragana, a syllabary, and
 * Katakana, a syllabary.
 * Rōmaji, Japanese term for the Latin alphabet.
 * the Japanese people, the dominant ethnic group in Japan
 * Ethnic Japanese
 * Korean Japanese
 * Japanese-American
 * Japanese-Brazilian
 * Japan, referring to the country
 * Okinawa
 * Culture of Japan
 * J-pop, Japanese pop - refers to Western-influenced Japanese popular music
 * Japanese idol, a celebrity who achieves widespread popularity and fame in Japan largely by virtue of her looks
 * Religion in Japan
 * Buddhism
 * Shinto
 * Budo (武道), a term for Japanese martial arts
 * Japanese Art
 * Anime, Japanese animation, sometimes referred to by the portmanteau Japanimation
 * Japanese cuisine, including japanese food like Sushi etc.
 * Japanese tea ceremony, traditional tea drinking ceremony
 * List of Pokémon by name, Japanese name for Pokemon characters

Japanese wiki
The Japanese wiki contains a lot of Kanjis. I'm trying to add the span class title thing for clarity, but does not work out very well, since it's not with the wikitext editor. What do we do? --2A01:E35:2F23:5EA0:25C2:1A8F:9A98:53D2 (talk) 08:08, 26 August 2019 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Japanese


text:
Talk:Pain management

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 19 August 2021 and 10 December 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): MStearns21. Peer reviewers: Jasmineab3.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 02:03, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 25 August 2020 and 1 December 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Speka3. Peer reviewers: Gadishu, Arblanks.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 06:01, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

2005 comment
Given that the management of pain is a separate discipline, with a variety of disparate opinions, would it not make sense for "pain management" to be a separate article?

 * Certainly! JFW | T@lk  01:48, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)

 * So done. Please contribute. Polacrilex

From local anesthesia
Text removed from local anesthesia which IMO might be better placed here, please review. Kosebamse 08:44, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Generally, a certain risk of local tissue damage is involved when using local anesthetics often and regularly during a longer period at a specific location of your body. For example, the chronic use of topical eye anesthetics in chronic eye pain would almost certainly and relatively quickly lead to serious eye damage (corneal damage). Before using local anesthetics, chronic local pain should not only carefully be assessed with medical specialists for the local problem (for example an ophtalmologist, dermatologist, dentist or a neurologist/specialist for peripheral nerve blocks), but also by specialists for centrally active pain medication.
 * Medical specialists (ophtalmologists, dermatologists, dentists or neurologists for peripheral nerve blocks) for the local problem can assess how big the risk of chronically using local anesthetics at that particular location is.
 * In most cases of chronic pain, it is not the peripheral nervous system but the central nervous system that is not able to cope with the pain impulses coming from the location in the peripheral nervous system where the damage that causes the pain is actually located. Therefore, medical specialists for the central nervous system (usually a neurologist or pain specialist) can assess if and what kind of centrally acting medication can or should be taken. Very often, it is less harmful and risky to use centrally active substances (especially when they are only taken in low doses) against chronic pain in the peripheral nerve system than chronically using local anesthetics at a particular location of the body. Relatively risk free, especially when taken in small doses, and at the same time often effective against chronic peripheral pain are antidepressants of the SSRI class and the stronger tricyclic antidepressants like for example amitriptyline. Furthermore, modern anticonvulsants like pregabalin or gabapentin are relatively risk free and at the same time relatively effective against chronic pain, at least when taken in very low or low doses. One of the strongest and more risky options in the reduction of peripheral pain are anticonvulsants like carbamazepine. On the other hand, some other classes of centrally acting substances like for example opioids (they are unfortunately still often used in the treatment of chronic pain, including local pain in the peripheral nerve system) are extremely harmful and should be avoided in the treatment of chronic pain at all costs.

End of moved text.

I tend to think the above is much better suited to this section than Local Anesthesia, where it was before. I still have problems with the last sentence of it however! What medical basis is there for On the other hand, some other classes of centrally acting substances like for example opioids (they are unfortunately still often used in the treatment of chronic pain, including local pain in the peripheral nerve system) are extremely harmful and should be avoided in the treatment of chronic pain at all costs, when proper use of opioids have virtually no adverse affects other than dependence and tolerance? Yes, abuse leads to addiction, and abuse includes use with alcohol and other drugs, but that is not the topic of this article - see Drug Addiction for that.

IMHO the entire 'all fruit of the poppy is evil and should be discouraged' stance is politics, and not medicine, and has no place in Wikipedia outside of articles on The War on Drugs.

To make things even clearer, I've been taking opioids for Chronic Pain for over 10 years now. I have to take some care to avoid constipation (so I eat fruit and get exercise), and I don't drink alcohol. In this time I've had no medical conditions develop as a result of my daily intake of pain killers. Nor have I taken to crime and thuggery to get more, as I take the dose recomended by a Pain Specialist, and no more. Yes, I take a higher dose of a stronger drug now than I did 10 years ago. I also still have a marriage and a family, and I haven't been tempted to take drastic action to stop my pain (i.e. suicide) since I've been taking opioids. Rther than just huddling on my bed whimpering I can now be involved in life and my family. None of my Doctors (my GP and my Pain Specialist, my Neurologist and my Orthopaedic Surgeon) have mentioned any adverse effects or risks due to use of opioids other than constipation and dependence if I stay within their guidelines. So what are these extremely harmful effects?

 * Ignorance by people who believe all the negative misinformation over the years. Opioids certainly have their place, and other alternatives should be tried before relying on them, but for some cases, they can make life bearable as you noted.  Even some doctors and nurses are ignorant of recent research that show that tolerance does not equal addiction. MeekMark 22:11, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

BTW, my problem is due to neuralgia of the brachial plexus and supraspinatal nerve, complicated by the legacy of septic arthritis, which is certainly a peripheral nervous system problem. Nothing I've tried over many many years comes even close to the efficacy of opioids for day-to-day management of my pain. Johnpf 07:45, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Merge Pain medicine into Pain management
The References and External Links are the only things in Pain medicine that are not in Pain management. Therefore, merge the former into the latter. Pan Dan 21:18, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

See also section
I removed two links from the See Also. Re EMFT, I don't think we should list therapies, as that would just be a huge list. Any specific recommendation from WP:MEDRS should go in the body, supported by sources. The other see also was to Coccydynia, which is a medical term for a type of pain. I see a justification for linking Coccydynia to this article, but not the other way around - there are many medical terms for different kinds of pain, and many things that cause pain, and they should not all be listed. Verbal  chat  18:15, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
 * "Wikipedia is not a paper encyclopedia; there is no practical limit to the number of topics it can cover, or the total amount of content, other than verifiability and the other points presented on this page.". The subject matter, EMFT and electrotherapy, discusses the pain management. In particular the ET article as demonstrated in my recent inter-wiki link here to this article "Pain management". When I first looked at it, I too did not see a reason for linking Coccydynia to this article. It after all a type of pain. However, if the (or an) article does have a section on managing the pain from a condition, I see no reason why we can't link to it. It would be appropriate, ie.: "Cancer = morphine." However the link towards the condition is not as obvious as the modality. Hence I agree with Verbal. I'm not going to go out of my way, anyways to make a list of conditions. There are many medical terms for different conditions. ie. Cancer, cuts, etc., which have different kinds of pain. However, per WP:Paper, if someone wants to make a list on the conditions, I'm not going to stop them. I will however ask that after 5 or 10 conditions that we create a content fork. Similarly, for the modalities, ie. EMFT, tylenol, etc., I think we should a different list. Hence:
 * == See also ==
 * === Modalities ===
 * ==== Medication ====
 * ==== Devices ====
 * ==== Other ====
 * === Conditions ===
 * This is my suggestion for implementing the see also. --CyclePat (talk) 18:34, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I disagree, and not paper is not a good argument. The see also section should only contain links that would appear in a comprehensive article on the subject, and these wouldn't. Links shouldn't go both ways. Verbal   chat  18:39, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
 * There's no real arguing here regarding conditions. I agree with your suggestion and would prefer not to see the conditions listed here in "Pain management". However, if a condition exists which is notable, ie Cancer, then this article, "Pain management", should talk about it. However, this might be overburdening (considering the amount of medical conditions that exist). Also, if an article is already well referenced why should we repeat everything in here at "Pain management"? It seems out of place to go into such details here at "Pain management". Hence, a "see also" section feels a bit more relevant and less controversial. In fact, in your first comment you specifically indicated "Any specific recommendation from WP:MEDRS should go in the body." I agree. I also agree with Wp:See also which states
 * "A reasonable number of relevant links that would be in the body of a hypothetical "perfect article" are suitable to add to the "See also" appendix of a less developed one. Links already included in the body of the text are generally not repeated in "See also"; however, whether a link belongs in the "See also" section is ultimately a matter of editorial judgment and common sense. A "perfect" article then might not require a "See also" section at all, though some links may not naturally fit into the body of text and others may not be included due to size constraints. Links that would be included if the article were not kept relatively short for other reasons may thus be appropriate, though should be used in moderation, as always. These may be useful for readers looking to read as much about a topic as possible, including subjects only peripherally related to the one in question."
 * But sometimes, That point is conceded. However, I still strongly believe we can and, if someone wants to they could should add it. In fact, despite our personal preference, we should add it. Please feel free to take out the condition, but also please note my logic which dissents upon our "personal preference". As for EMFT that is a modality and should remain. --CyclePat (talk) 18:59, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Nul edit proposal
Proposal: Add content regarding electrotherapy. See page 100 here. --CyclePat (talk) 20:41, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Oppose for the reason given above. We're not going to link to every pain killer, therapy, etc, from this and every other article involving pain. I think you should take your proposal to the medicine wikiproject to get their opinion of it (please drop a note here). Also, please don't make null edits to draw attention here - people can watchlist talkpages. Thanks, Verbal   chat  20:51, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

New Intro'
In light of the following I have changed the introductory sentence. I'm no expert, so please improve (with references) if possible.
 * Chronic pain management: the essentials By Paul A. J. Hardy. "Pain management " is concerned with the reduction of suffering and enhanced quality of life rather than a reduction in the pain complaint. Pain management is central to the treatment of chronic, that is long duration, pain. P. 10.
 * Approaches to pain management: an essential guide for clinical leaders By Joint Commission Resources. The goal of pain management is to relieve the physical and psychosocial symptoms associated with pain while maintaining the patient's level of function. Pain is intimately linked to overall quality of life. P. 129.
 * Pain management: an interdisciplinary approach By Chris J. Main, Chris C. Spanswick. Pain management is a growing area of interest for many health care professionals. It is a truly interdisciplinary concept, involving a team comprising medical practitioners, clinical psychologists, physiotherapists, occupational therapists, and nurse practitioners. (Back page)

Anthony (talk) 10:28, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Temporary free access to IASP journal Pain
I just saw this. "For a limited time, this title is open to the public in a free trial period." Anthony (talk) 02:17, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Low level laser therapy (LLLT)
I have amended the expression in this contribution but have not read the cited sources. Anthony (talk) 14:25, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

What's needed

 * Gene therapy isn't mentioned in the article, but according to this there's at least one clinical trial that shows some promise. I leave it to the regular editors of this article to decide if it should be mentioned or if it's too early.Sjö (talk) 11:26, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
 * An explanation of the WHO analgesic ladder would be useful. --Anthonyhcole (talk) 03:39, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Caffiene
The article doesn't mention caffeine. See "Caffeine as an analgesic adjuvant for acute pain in adults" Vernon White  '''. . . Talk''' 07:26, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

 * Every possible drug solution is far outside of the scope of this article. Just as every technological solution is as well. We'd end up with an article that would be as long as a book!Wzrd1 (talk) 00:48, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

Under-treatment: this whole section, including the title could be less biased (see talk)
(moved discussion to Talk:Undertreatment of pain  Blue Rasberry   (talk)  14:57, 29 July 2016 (UTC))

Interventional Pain Management
I would appreciate some input about the possibility of expanding this article to include some of the latest breakthroughs in interventional pain management. Atsme  ☯ talk  00:16, 7 April 2014 (UTC)

 * Please just go ahead and do what you will. This article contains a brief summary of interventions, per Summary style. If you intend adding more detail about a topic already covered, it may be more appropriate to add it to the main article, Interventional pain management. But just do what you think is appropriate and I'm sure others will chime in with suggestions if they think they're warranted. --Anthonyhcole (talk · contribs · email)  09:08, 7 April 2014 (UTC)

Forked content about treatment
There is a list of many treatments in this article. I do not think it would be worthwhile to develop the text of those treatments here, when already, those treatments are better described in their own articles. Much of the content here is original writing a a duplicated effort with those other articles.

Ideally, content in the subsections here could be brief and direct readers to the fuller other article. Personally, I like to take information out of the leads of the main article when I am making subsections. I was looking through what is here - I am not even sure that all pain management strategies are well covered. If a single authoritative source gave an overview of the treatments, then it might be useful to list them and cite that source. The list would be useful to a reader, and also provide an internal check that everything is covered.  Blue Rasberry  (talk)  16:25, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

Moved section on undertreatment to own article
I moved all the content here that was in the "undertreatment" section to undertreatment of pain. See more information at Talk:Undertreatment of pain.  Blue Rasberry  (talk)  14:17, 29 July 2016 (UTC)

spam for my employer - added external link
There was no external links section here. I created one with a link to a publication by my employer.
 * Pain Management Guide

Here are some pros and cons for this source -

 * pros
 * layman language and patient perspective
 * relevant content
 * produced in partnership with medical specialty organizations
 * nonprofit
 * no ads, except for the publication itself
 * all free to read

 * cons
 * I work for this org, see WP:COI
 * there are ads to subscribe to the publication in some places
 * content is United States-centric

If any of this gives anyone pause, please remove the link immediately.  Blue Rasberry  (talk)  21:03, 29 July 2016 (UTC)

I removed the link per comment at Talk:Analgesic. Here it is again. This is now a request for any reviewer to consider adding this to the external links section of this article and the article Analgesic, if it is relevant. I would not have expected anyone to say, "lots of ads" The publication advertises itself. This link has no ads to any other product or organization than itself, and there is no commercial sponsorship in this publication.
 * Pain Management Guide

Here are some other potential external links which I think have the similar intent of being consumer health guides. Any of these might be shared also or instead of the one I proposed.
 * Pain Management Health Center from WebMD
 * Resource Guide to Chronic Pain Treatment from the American Chronic Pain Association
 * Treatment Guidelines on Pain from the WHO
 * PAINedu.org Pocket Manual from the Inflexxion Health Series
 * NINDS Chronic Pain Information Page from the NIH

I did some searches and at first look, these all seem to be popular recommendations by search engines. What does anyone think of these?  Blue Rasberry  (talk)  16:39, 1 August 2016 (UTC)
 * This article is labeled start-level and high-importance. (I think it could use a review, since at a glance it looks C-level.) As such, I'd expect some external links covering areas not yet addressed in this article or perhaps having alternative presentations. In the long term, I'm not sure what external links would meet WP:ELNO#1. --Ronz (talk) 02:09, 2 August 2016 (UTC)
 * By "alternative presentations" I mean different media, less technical, etc. --Ronz (talk) 21:29, 2 August 2016 (UTC)

 * I added the WHO Treatment Guidelines on Pain because it didn't look like a consumer guide. That is, it discusses the topic of the article, approaches to pain management, rather than "Here's what you can do if you have a headache." Analgesic already has quite a lot of information; I'm not sure the link would add much. BlackcurrantTea (talk) 05:25, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

Merger proposal
I propose that Algology (medicine) be merged into Pain management. I think that the content in the Algology article can easily be explained in the context of pain management, and the Pain management article is of a reasonable size that the merging of Algology will not cause any problems as far as article size or undue weight is concerned. Kwekubo (talk) 17:45, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Support. I think it would be an uncontroversial merge.CV9933 (talk) 19:14, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
 * ✅ Jytdog (talk) 23:06, 1 November 2018 (UTC)

Proposing to delete the sentence : "However, no studies have compared hypnosis to a convincing placebo, so the pain reduction may be due to patient expectation (the "placebo effect")"
Because of this basically where placebos where used in recent RCT: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0149763418304913Walidou47 (talk) 12:23, 21 April 2020 (UTC)

Pain management speech
Pain management type 223.186.216.68 (talk) 16:08, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Psychology Capstone
— Assignment last updated by Hayelizabeth24 (talk) 04:19, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Pain in Hindi
Hindi language 2409:4052:2E96:196C:0:0:A849:B700 (talk) 14:53, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Psychology Capstone
— Assignment last updated by Tolber2K (talk) 03:48, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

Herbal Pain Managment
Herbs and essential oils are known as natural pain relievers. Lavender has been known to aid in sleep, for some, lavender oil may relieve migraine headaches. Ginger root reduces muscle aches and reduces inflammation as well. Mercedesgeorge (talk) 00:38, 16 October 2022 (UTC)

OxyContin -> Oxycodone
I have made the following change, replacing OxyContin with oxycodone: Its main slow-release formula is known as OxyContin. Short-acting tablets, capsules, syrups and ampules which contain OxyContin oxycodone are available making it suitable for acute intractable pain or breakthrough pain.

OxyContin is the long-acting/extended-release preparation, for oral administration, of oxycodone. Short-acting formulations, especially ampules (for non-oral administration) would be oxycodone; oxycodone (not as OxyContin) would also be what is used for breakthrough pain. Also, the previous sentence mentions the slow-release formulation OxyContin seemingly in juxtaposition to this short-acting formulation. I believe this was a typo when originally written so have made this change. I'm hoping I didn't miss something obvious here in making this change. Kimen8 (talk) 20:54, 14 October 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Psychology Capstone
— Assignment last updated by Rahneli (talk) 16:50, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Pain management


text:
Jennings Randolph Lake

Jennings Randolph Lake is a reservoir of 952 acre located on the North Branch Potomac River in Garrett County, Maryland and Mineral County, West Virginia. It is approximately 8 miles upstream of Bloomington, Maryland, and approximately 5 miles north of Elk Garden, West Virginia.

Construction and management
The lake was constructed by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers (USACE), as authorized by the Flood Control Act of October 23, 1962 (Public Law 87-874) and is described in House Document No. 469, 87th United States Congress, second session. Originally named "Bloomington Dam", it was renamed Jennings Randolph Lake in 1987 to honor the US Senator from West Virginia who was instrumental in this and many other water resource projects across the nation. Construction of the lake was completed in 1981, and resulted in the flooding of the community of Shaw, West Virginia and the realignment of West Virginia Route 46. The dam, rolled earth and rock fill, is 296 feet high, has a crest length of 2,130 feet and contains 10 e6cuyd of material. Jennings Randolph Lake strives to provide water quality improvements and reduce flood damages downstream of the lake, provide a source of water supply for downstream municipalities and industries, and provide the public with recreation opportunities. With a full conservation pool, the lake controls a drainage area of 263 sqmi, is about 5.5 miles long, and has a surface area of 952 acres. The lake serves as an emergency reservoir for the Washington, D.C. metropolitan area and is managed by the Corps of Engineers. Coordination of the lake's use for water supply purposes is managed by the Interstate Commission on the Potomac River Basin (ICPRB).

The impoundment also collects acid mine drainage from coal mines located upstream, which improves the water quality of the river downstream.

Planned hydroelectric facility
In 2008 Fairlawn Hydroelectric Company filed a proposal with the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission (FERC) to construct a hydroelectric facility at the dam. FERC approved a license for a 14 MW facility on April 30, 2012. In 2016, Fairlawn Hydroelectric reported that it had not yet obtained construction permits from USACE, and it obtained an extension of time from FERC to begin and complete the project.

Recreational facilities

 * Howell Run Picnic Area
 * Howell Run Boat Launch
 * Robert W. Craig Campground
 * Shaw Beach
 * West Virginia Overlook
 * Maryland Overlook
 * Maryland Boat Launch

title: Jennings Randolph Lake


text:
User talk:NorCalHistory

Archives

 * Discussions to December 2005
 * Discussions January 2006 - July 2006
 * Discussions August 2006 - December 10, 2006
 * Discussions December 11, 2006 - March 2007
 * Discussions April 2007 - March 2008

Thanks to all for everything!
This has been an very interesting experience - thank you, thank you! BTW, according to a wikichart, it appears that some 2,500,000 readers saw the Feb. 14, 2007 Main page with the article intro, and some 100,000 readers clicked through to the article itself. NorCalHistory 17:27, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

California star
Ronbo76 23:03, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Triple Crown

Thank you for contributions to the project, Great work on California Gold Rush, and congrats on getting it as a WP:TFA back in February! May you wear the crowns well. Cirt (talk) 20:04, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Britannica
The major objection to using the Britannica is that it is a tertiary source, as we are; it would be better to use the Britannica's sources, in an effort to be as reliable as EB is.

The accessibility issue is minor; we normally don't worry about accessibility if something is published, because someone will be able to check; and most of the Britannica's articles are also in the print edition, widely available. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 21:32, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I would not view it as an absolute prohibition; but it is a weak citation; and certainly should be deprecated. Anything which can be sourced outside EB really ought to be; on the other hand, EB is one step up from the matters of common knowledge which don't require citation at all, even in FA's. See WP:WHEN. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 22:42, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Mount Shasta, California and semi-protect request
Replied on my talk page. -- Spireguy (talk) 21:19, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

California Gold Rush
You're welcome: the current semi-protection is for a month, so we'll see how it goes after that. Acalamari 22:44, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * On a similar note, I noticed you revert vandalism occasionally. Would you like me to grant your account rollback rights? It'll help you revert vandalism more quickly, but just remember it's only for reverting vandalism, and not to revert good-faith edit or for use in revert wars. Acalamari 22:54, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Rollback granted. :) If you're interested in practice before use in the mainspace, see New admin school/Rollback. Good luck. Acalamari 23:10, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * You're welcome! Acalamari 23:18, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Image:California Clipper 500.jpg
First, thank you really for your work ! I translated the article about the California gold rush for the french wikipedia.

I would like to know more about your. What kind of document is it ? and what's written on ? Thank you again ! Marion Touvel 62.35.238.79 (talk) 22:59, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

ps. You can answer to me here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.35.238.79 (talk) 23:01, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

Thank you...
...for your quick answer, and see ya, maybe, for next collaborative works between English and French portal of California !

Marion Touvel--62.35.238.79 (talk) 10:22, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

California Clipper 500.jpg

An improved version. I hope it could be useful. Marion Touvel--62.35.238.79 (talk) 18:22, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

 * Yes I want to submit this article as a featured article in French. For the French version, I need to translate the maps and to explain the French historic context (French Revolution of 1848, French Second Republic, and Second French Empire). For example, there is a French book (500 pages!) only about the Breton people in the California gold rush. --62.35.238.79 (talk) 10:14, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject California roll call
Hello from WikiProject California!

As part of a recent update to our project main page we are conducting a roll call to check which members are still active and interested in working on California related content. If you are still interested in participating, simply move your username from the inactive section of the participant list to the active section. I hope you will find the redesigned project pages helpful, and I wanted to welcome you back to the project. If you want you can take a look at the newly redesigned:

 * [[Image:Crystal Clear app Community Help.png|25px|]]Main Page
 * [[Image:Crystal Clear app Login Manager.png|25px|]]Talk page
 * [[Image:Broom icon.svg|25px|]]Cleanup listing
 * [[Image:Template icon.svg|25px|]]Template list

As well as the existing pages:
 * [[Image:Crystal Clear app clean.png|25px|]]Assessment
 * [[Image:Crystal Clear app kedit.png|25px|]]Article Worklist
 * [[Image:Crystal Clear action editdelete.png|25px|]] Deletion sorting

If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask at the project talk page, and add it to your watchlist, if it isn't already.

Again, hi! Optigan13 (talk) 00:16, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Like two bad pennies
You're back; I'm back. What's Wikipedia coming to these days? Jimbo Wales must be rolling his eyes! Nice barnstars! --Ronbo76 (talk) 13:36, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

Getting back in the WP CA ballgame - Felipe de Neve
NorCal, please take a look at Felipe de Neve. I want to bring it out of Stub status. --Ronbo76 (talk) 17:10, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

Strait of Anian map
I just updated Strait of Anián. In 2006 you released. Do you still have the source? If so: Who was the author or publisher? Does the word Anian appear on it or accompany it? If so the first publication of this name will have to be backdated 20 years. In the upper left corner, what is the word following 'India'? It may be Superior or Septentrionalis or something. Thanks, Benjamin Trovato (talk) 23:57, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:05, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject United States/The 50,000 Challenge
--MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:38, 8 November 2016 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of File:California Gold Rush relief map.jpg

The file File:California Gold Rush relief map.jpg has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern: "Orphaned map."

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the file's talk page.

Please consider addressing the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and files for discussion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. ~ Rob 13 Talk 17:14, 7 March 2018 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of The Hero's Journey (film)

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. This is a notice to inform you that a tag has been placed on The Hero's Journey (film) requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section A3 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is an article with no content whatsoever, or whose contents consist only of external links, a "See also" section, book references, category tags, template tags, interwiki links, images, a rephrasing of the title, a question that should have been asked at the help or reference desks, or an attempt to contact the subject of the article. Please see Wikipedia:Stub for our minimum information standards for short articles. Also please note that articles must be on notable subjects and should provide references to reliable sources that verify their content.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. BigHaz - Schreit mich an 01:08, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

Image source problem with File:Okwanuchu Tribal Territory.jpg
Thank you for uploading File:Okwanuchu Tribal Territory.jpg.

This image is a derivative work, containing an "image within an image". Examples of such images would include a photograph of a sculpture, a scan of a magazine cover, or a screenshot of a computer game or movie. In each of these cases, the rights of the creator of the original image must be considered, as well as those of the creator of the derivative work.

While the description page states who made this derivative work, it currently doesn't specify who created the original work, so the overall copyright status is unclear. If you did not create the original work depicted in this image, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright.

If you have uploaded other derivative works, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have created [ in your upload log]. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been tagged, as described in section F4 of the criteria for speedy deletion. If the image is copyrighted under a non-free license (per Fair use) then the image will be deleted 48 hours after 16:18, 12 January 2024 (UTC). If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. --TheImaCow (talk) 16:18, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

title: User talk:NorCalHistory


text:
Sarah Shahi

Aahoo Jahansouzshahi (born January 10, 1980), known professionally as Sarah Shahi, is an American actress. She played Carmen on The L Word in 2005, Kate Reed in the USA Network legal drama Fairly Legal (2011–2012), Sameen Shaw on the CBS crime drama Person of Interest (2012–2016), and Billie on the Netflix series Sex/Life. She has also appeared in the main role Det. Dani Reese in Life, and in a supporting role in Alias. In 2018, she starred in the series Reverie. In 2019, she appeared in a recurring role in City on a Hill on Showtime, and appeared in seven episodes of the series The Rookie as romantic interest Jessica Russo. In 2023, she received critical praise for her role of White House Deputy Chief of Staff Zahra Bankston in the LGBTQ romantic comedy film Red, White & Royal Blue.

Early life
Sarah Shahi was born Aahoo Jahansouzshahi on January 10, 1980 and raised in Euless, Texas. Her father Abbas Jahansouzshahi and her mother Mahmonir Soroushazar, an interior designer, divorced when she was ten years old. Her mother was born in Spain to an Iranian father and a Spanish mother. Her father is from Iran. Her father's family left Iran two years before the Iranian Revolution. Her father, who was working at the American embassy in Iran, was slated for execution when the last Shah's regime collapsed in 1979, but was able to flee the country. Shahi has an older brother, Cyrus, and a younger sister, Samantha, who is a production assistant.

Her birth name, Aahoo, means 'gazelle' in Persian. Shahi adopted Sarah as her name in second grade after hearing a song called "Sarah" because she was "tormented" by other children about her birth name, Aahoo. At her father's behest, she grew up speaking Persian in addition to English. Shahi's parents began entering her in beauty pageants at the age of eight. Shahi attended Trinity High School, and Southern Methodist University. She was a member of Alpha Chi Omega during her time at SMU. Shahi won the Miss Fort Worth pageant in 1997. Hoping to become an actress, she joined the Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders (1999–2000) squad, despite not having cheered before. Later, she moved to Los Angeles.

Career
While working as an extra on the set of Dr. T and the Women in Texas, Shahi met director Robert Altman, who encouraged her to move to Hollywood, where she received roles in several series, including Alias, Dawson's Creek, Reba and Supernatural. In 2005, she appeared in the supporting character role of DJ Carmen de la Pica Morales on The L Word, which she joined in its second season. Shahi's two-year contract was not renewed after the end of the fourth season, and her character was written out. Also that same year, Shahi appeared in the pilot episode of Supernatural as Constance Welch, AKA The Woman in White, the first ghost that Dean Winchester (Jensen Ackles) and Sam Winchester (Jared Padalecki) encounter.

Shahi was named number 90 on the Maxim "Hot 100 of 2005" list, moving up to number 66 in 2006 and 36 in 2012. She appeared on the cover of Maxims 2012 'TV's Hottest Girls' Issue in October 2012. She ranked number 5 on the AfterEllen.com hot list in 2007.

She played Farah in the second season of Sleeper Cell, and also appeared in HBO's The Sopranos in 2007, in the Season 6b episode "Kennedy and Heidi" as Sonya Aragon, a stripper and college student who spends a weekend with Tony after a death in his family. In 2007, she secured a small role in Rush Hour 3 as Zoe, a scantily clad rich girl who is pursued by Chris Tucker's character, Detective Carter.

In 2007, she took on her first permanent leading role on a TV series, co-starring with Damian Lewis in the NBC series Life as homicide detective Dani Reese. The series ran for two seasons.

In October 2009, Shahi landed the lead role in the USA Network pilot, Facing Kate. Shahi began filming in November 2009. The show followed the life of Kate Reed, a legal mediator who is frustrated with the bureaucracy and injustice she witnesses in the legal system. The series title was later changed to Fairly Legal. The show was cancelled after two seasons in November 2012.

Shahi was cast as a recurring love interest for Taylor Kinney's character Lt. Kelly Severide on NBC's show Chicago Fire in October 2012. She was cast in the recurring role of Sameen Shaw on Person of Interest, making her first appearance in the second season episode "Relevance", which aired in February 2013. In May 2013, CBS President Nina Tassler announced that Shahi would be added as a series regular for its third season. She played the daughter of Sylvester Stallone's character in the 2012 action film Bullet to the Head. Her co-star on this film was Jason Momoa, who she worked with again in the 2014 film Road to Paloma. Following the January 7, 2015, episode of Person of Interest, Shahi and the show's producers announced she would be going on maternity leave.

In February 2016, she was cast as iconic detective Nancy Drew in a planned TV series based on the books. In May 2016, CBS passed on the series. Also in May, Shahi resumed her appearances as Shaw on Person of Interest, until June 21, 2016, when the show ended. She starred in the new TV series Reverie in 2018, but it was cancelled after one season.

In 2019, Shahi joined the cast of Showtime's City on A Hill as recurring character Rachel Behnam, an investigator for the district attorney. In August 2020, Shahi started filming Sex/Life, a Netflix series inspired by BB Easton's book "44 Chapters About 4 Men", in Toronto, Canada. She played Billie, a housewife struggling to remain a devoted wife and mother when tempted by an old flame and the freer days of her youth. In October, she was cast as Adrianna Tomaz in the 2022 DCEU film Black Adam opposite Dwayne Johnson and Pierce Brosnan.

Personal life
Shahi married actor Steve Howey on February 7, 2009, in Las Vegas. In July 2009, she gave birth to their first child, a son, during an at-home water birth. In January 2015, she announced that she was pregnant with twins. In March, a daughter and son were born during another home birth. Shahi and Howey filed for divorce in May 2020. Their divorce was finalized in January 2021.

In 2021, Shahi revealed that she was in a relationship with Australian actor Adam Demos, whom she met on the set of Sex/Life.

Shahi studied karate in her youth becoming a 1st dan black belt in Shorin-Ryu karate.

Lawsuit
In 2016, Shahi and Howey were sued by a former nanny of their children for sexual harassment and religious discrimination. The lawsuit claimed Shahi mocked her Islamic customs of dress and fasting. The lawsuit also alleged sexual harassment, with Shahi sharing a lewd photograph with the nanny, and grabbing her backside commenting "you have a perfect little butt." In 2017, the nanny asked for the case to be dismissed.

title: Sarah Shahi


text:
Cliff Bartosh

Clifford Paul Bartosh (born September 5, 1979) is a former left-handed relief pitcher in Major League Baseball who played for the Cleveland Indians and Chicago Cubs.

He was selected in the 29th round of the 1998 Major League Baseball Draft by the San Diego Padres. He made his MLB debut on May 15, 2004, and was with the Indians in four different stints over the year. He improved as the year went on, posting an ERA of 2.70 in his last 30 appearances. His role in the bullpen often was to come in against a lefty, sometimes for just one out. For the Indians in 2004, he went 1–0 in 34 appearances in relief, posting a 4.66 ERA. In 2005, he went 0–2 with an ERA of 5.49 in 19 relief appearances.

A 2005 single in his only at-bat left Bartosh with a rare MLB career batting average of 1.000.

title: Cliff Bartosh


text: Category:X-Men videos

title: Category:X-Men videos


text:
Strombus

Strombus is a genus of medium to large sea snails, marine gastropod molluscs in the family Strombidae, which comprises the true conchs and their immediate relatives. The genus Strombus was named by Swedish Naturalist Carl Linnaeus in 1758. Around 50 living species were recognized, which vary in size from fairly small to very large. Six species live in the greater Caribbean region, including the queen conch, Strombus gigas (now usually known as Eustrombus gigas or Lobatus gigas), and the West Indian fighting conch, Strombus pugilis. However, since 2006, many species have been assigned to discrete genera. These new genera are, however, not yet found in most textbooks and collector's guides.

Worldwide, several of the larger species are economically important as food sources; these include the endangered queen conch, which very rarely also produces a pink, gem-quality pearl.

In the geological past, a much larger number of species of Strombus existed. Fossils of species within this genus have been found all over the world in sediments from Cretaceous to Quaternary (age range: 140.2 million years ago to recent).

Of the living species, most are in the Indian and Pacific Oceans. Many species of true conchs live on sandy bottoms among beds of sea grass in tropical waters. They eat algae and have a claw-shaped operculum.

Anatomy
Like almost all shelled gastropods, conches have spirally constructed shells. Again, as is normally the case in many gastropods, this spiral shell growth is usually right-handed, but on very rare occasions it can be left-handed.

True conches have long eye stalks, with colorful ring-marked eyes at the tips. The shell has a long and narrow aperture, and a short siphonal canal, with another indentation near the anterior end called a stromboid notch. This notch is where one of the two eye stalks protrudes from the shell.

The true conch has a foot ending in a pointed, sickle-shaped, operculum, which can be dug into the substrate as part of an unusual "leaping" locomotion.

True conches grow a flared lip on their shells only upon reaching sexual maturity. This is called an alated outer lip or alation.

Conches lay eggs in long strands; the eggs are contained in twisted, gelatinous tubes. Strombus moves with a leaping motion.

Shell description
Strombus shells have a flaring outer lip with a notch near the anterior end called the stromboid notch through which the animal can protrude one of its stalked eyes.

Phylogeny
The phylogenetic relationships among the Strombidae have been mainly accessed in two different occasions, using two distinct methods. In a 2005 monograph, Simone proposed a cladogram (a tree of descent) based on an extensive morphoanatomical analysis of representatives of the Aporrhaidae, Strombidae, Xenophoridae, and Struthiolariidae. However, according to Simone, only Strombus gracilior, Strombus alatus, and Strombus pugilis, the type species, remained within Strombus. In Simone's cladogram, these three species constituted a distinct group based on at least five synapomorphies (traits that are shared by two or more taxa and their most recent common ancestor). The remaining taxa were previously considered as subgenera, and were elevated to genus level by Simone in the end of his analysis.

In a different approach, Latiolais and colleagues (2006) proposed another cladogram that attempts to show the phylogenetic relationships of 34 species within the family Strombidae. The authors analysed 31 species in the genus Strombus and three species in the allied genus Lambis. The cladogram was based on DNA sequences of both nuclear histone H3 and mitochondrial cytochrome-c oxidase I (COI) protein-coding gene regions. In this proposed phylogeny, Strombus pugilis, Strombus alatus, Strombus granulatus and Strombus gracilior are closely related and appear to share a common ancestor.

Species
This genus of sea snails used to comprise about 50 species, 38 of them occurring in the Indo-Pacific region. Species within the genus Strombus include:

 * Strombus alatus Gmelin, 1791
 * Strombus gracilior Sowerby, 1825
 * Strombus pugilis Linnaeus, 1758
 * Strombus fragilis (Röding, 1798)

Extinct species within this genus include:
 * Extinct species
 * †Strombus arayaensis Landau and Marques da Silva 2010
 * †Strombus bifrons Sowerby 1850
 * †Strombus contortus Forbes 1846
 * †Strombus coronatus Defrance 1827
 * †Strombus cossmanni Dey 1961
 * †Strombus daviesi Dey 1961
 * †Strombus evergladesensis Petuch 1991
 * †Strombus floridanus Mansfield 1930
 * †Strombus glaber Martin 1879
 * †Strombus herklotsi Martin 1879
 * †Strombus inflatus Martin 1879
 * †Strombus javanus Martin 1879
 * †Strombus junghuhni Martin 1879
 * †Strombus labiatus Röding 1798
 * †Strombus lindae Petuch 1991
 * †Strombus mekranicus Vredenburg 1925
 * †Strombus proximus Sowerby 1850
 * †Strombus sedanensis Martin 1899
 * †Strombus triangulatus Martin 1879
 * †Strombus uncatus Forbes 1846
 * †Strombus urceus  Linnaeus 1758
 * †Strombus vomer Röding 1798
 * Species brought into synonymy :

 * Strombus accipiter Dillwyn, 1817 : synonym of  Lobatus costatus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus aurisdianae Linnaeus, 1759: synonym of Euprotomus aurisdianae (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus bituberculatus Lamarck, 1822 : synonym of Lobatus raninus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus boletus Röding, P.F., 1798 : synonym of Clionella sinuata (Born, 1778)
 * Strombus bulla Röding, 1798: synonym of Euprotomus bulla (Röding, 1798)
 * Strombus canarium Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Laevistrombus canarium (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus costatus aguayoi Jaume & del Valle, 1947 : synonym of Lobatus costatus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus decorus (Röding, 1798): synonym of Conomurex decorus (Röding, 1798)
 * Strombus dehelensis: synonym of Conomurex fasciatus (Born, 1778)
 * Strombus dentatus Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Tridentarius dentatus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus epidromis Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Labiostrombus epidromis (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus erythrinus is a synonym for Canarium erythrinum Dillwyn, 1817
 * Strombus fasciatus Born, 1778: synonym of Persististrombus latus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus fusiformis is a synonym for Canarium fusiforme Sowerby, 1842
 * Strombus galeatus Swainson, 1823 : synonym of Titanostrombus galeatus (Swainson, 1823)
 * Strombus gallus Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Aliger gallus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus gibberulus Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Gibberulus gibberulus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus gigas is a synonym for Eustrombus gigas L., 1758
 * Strombus guidoi Man in t'Veld & De Turck, 1998: synonym of Laevistrombus canarium guidoi (Man in 't Veld & De Turck, 1998)
 * Strombus goliath Schröter, 1805 : synonym of Lobatus goliath (Schröter, 1805)
 * Strombus haemastoma Sowerby, 1842: synonym of Canarium haemastoma (Sowerby II, 1842)
 * Strombus hickeyi Willan, 2000: synonym of Dolomena hickeyi (Willan, 2000)
 * Strombus inermis Swainson, 1822 : synonym of Lobatus costatus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus integer Swainson, 1823 : synonym of Lobatus costatus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus jeffersonia Van Hyning, 1945 : synonym of Lobatus costatus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus labiatus is a synonym for Canarium labiatum Röding, 1798
 * Strombus labiosus Gray in Wood, 1828: synonym of Dolomena labiosa (Wood, 1828)
 * Strombus latus Gmelin, 1791: synonym of Persististrombus latus (Gmelin, 1791)
 * Strombus lentiginosus Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Lentigo lentiginosus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus listeri Gray, 1852: synonym of Mirabilistrombus listeri (Gray, 1852)
 * Strombus luhuanus Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Conomurex luhuanus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus magolecciai Macsotay & Villarroel, 2001: synonym of Lobatus magolecciai (Macsotay & Campos, 2001)
 *  Strombus marginatus C. Linnaeus, 1758 : synonym of Margistrombus marginatus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus mutabilis Swainson, 1821: synonym of Canarium mutabile (Swainson, 1821)
 * Strombus oldi Emerson, 1965: synonym of Tricornis oldi (Emerson, 1965)
 * Strombus persicus (Swainson, 1821): synonym of Conomurex persicus (Swainson, 1821)
 * Strombus plicatus Röding, 1798: synonym of Dolomena plicata (Röding, 1798)
 * Strombus sinuatus Humphrey, 1786: synonym of Sinustrombus sinuatus ([Lightfoot], 1786)
 * Strombus terebellatus Sowerby, 1842: synonym of Terestrombus terebellatus (G.B. Sowerby II, 1842)
 * Strombus tricornis (Humphrey, 1786): synonym of Tricornis tricornis (Lightfoot, 1786)
 * Strombus urceus Linnaeus, 1758: synonym of Canarium urceus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus ustulatus (Schumacher, 1817): synonym of Canarium urceus urseus (Linnaeus, 1758)
 * Strombus variabilis Swainson, 1820: synonym of Dolomena variabilis (Swainson, 1820)
 * Strombus wilsoni Abbott, 1967: synonym of Canarium wilsonorum (Abbott, 1967)
 * Strombus wilsonorum Abbott, 1967: synonym of Canarium wilsonorum (Abbott, 1967)
 * Strombus yerburyi E. A. Smith, 1891: synonym of Dolomena plicata yerburyi (E. A. Smith, 1891)
 * Strombus zonatus Wood, 1828: synonym of Cerithium zonatum (W. Wood, 1828)

title: Strombus


text:
Allium ampeloprasum

Allium ampeloprasum is a member of the onion genus Allium. The wild plant is commonly known as wild leek or broadleaf wild leek. Its native range is southern Europe to southwestern Asia and North Africa, but it is cultivated in many other places and has become naturalized in many countries.

Allium ampeloprasum is regarded as native to all the countries bordering on the Black, Adriatic, and Mediterranean Seas from Portugal to Egypt to Romania. In Russia and Ukraine, it is considered invasive except in Crimea, where it is native. It is also native to Ethiopia, Uzbekistan, Iran and Iraq. It is considered naturalized in the United Kingdom, Ireland, the Czech Republic, the Baltic States, Belarus, the Azores, Madeira, the Canary Islands, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Afghanistan, China, Australia (all states except Queensland and Tasmania), Mexico, the Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, Haiti, the United States (southeastern region plus California, New York State, Ohio and Illinois), Galápagos, and Argentina. In tidewater Virginia, where it is commonly known as the "Yorktown onion", it is protected by law in York County.

The species may have been introduced to Britain by prehistoric people, where its habitat consists of rocky places near the coast in south-west England and Wales.

Allium ampeloprasum has been differentiated into five cultivated vegetables, namely leek, elephant garlic, pearl onion, kurrat, and Persian leek.

Wild populations produce bulbs up to 3 cm across. Scapes are round in cross-section, each up to 180 cm tall, bearing an umbel of as many as 500 flowers. Flowers are urn-shaped, up to 6 mm across; tepals white, pink or red; anthers yellow or purple; pollen yellow.

Vegetables
Allium ampeloprasum comprises several vegetables, of which the most notable ones are:
 * leek
 * elephant garlic or great-headed garlic
 * pearl onion
 * kurrat, Egyptian leek or salad leek – this variety has small bulbs, and primarily the leaves are eaten.
 * Persian leek (Allium ampeloprasum ssp. persicum) - a cultivated allium native to the Middle East and Iran, grown for culinary purposes and is called tareh in Persian. The linear green leaves have a mild onion flavor and are eaten raw, either alone, or in food combinations.

title: Allium ampeloprasum


text:
User:Sleepyron

Ron

Born: High Point, NC

Date: January 1, 1936

Degree: English/History

Have lived in: High Point (briefly) Norfolk, Richmond, Savannah, and DC Metro area.

Retired: in Shenandoah Valley of Virginia.

Traveled: 49 States (not Hawaii) and most of Europe

Interests: All things English including Medieval Cathedrals and Shakespeare. History of religions but am not at all religious.

Hobbies: HTLM, the Internet, bridge, theater, and beekeeping.

title: User:Sleepyron


text:
Talk:The Red Violin

Title
Since this movie is in several languages (all of which appear in the title card), why is the French title given preference? I would understand if it is a legal issue for a movie from Quebec, but I hope it is for no other reason. -Acjelen 01:01, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Special issuses
I've written some text about this film. My english isn't good enough. So I don't add this text directly to the page. I hope somebody correct it and add:

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Film is based on one main editing trick. Been effectively used, it makes you feel the gratest emotions. You fall in abyss of controversal empathies applying to heroes. One scene is repeated many times over the film line. Different views, different accentuated details. Scene intermits with stories from the past. Every single story builds some information about man or woman presented in the main scene. So, you see the final minutes of the whole film with best knowledge of any detail of whole story. Every person on the screen is congenial for you. You may hate him. You may like him. You overfilled with them all. Detective and mystical (very accuretly represented!) components raise your spirit more and more. And no more film brings you such experience. ru:Участник:Qkowlew

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Austrian?
Why is one of the film's languages listed as "Austrian"? I realize that Austria has some dialects which vary from standard German, but the term "Austrian" for the German spoken in this movie seems nonstandard. --Metropolitan90 July 8, 2005 05:45 (UTC)

Other >4 multi-language films
This seems incidental, but both Grand Illusion and Apocalypse Now have only four languages listed on IMDb (and only one each listed on their WP articles). Obviously four is not "more than four". I haven't seen Grand Illusion and couldn't make it through Apocalypse Now, so I can't say if IMDb is incorrect. -Acjelen 23:16, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

 * I removed the whole section. Apocalypse Now isn't "in four languages", the relevant dialogue is always in English even if there are occasional words in other languages; this is nothing like The Red Violin. Cop 633 01:00, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Historical figures?
Vienna Oxford What historical figures are these based on?-69.87.199.48 12:05, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Christoph Koncz - Kaspar Weiss
 * Jean-Luc Bideau - Georges Poussin
 * Jason Flemyng - Frederick Pope
 * Greta Scacchi - Victoria Byrd

Khe-khe. Nice freaks, not real persons. Georges Poussin is from present time. Look for him in Google, for example. Film provocates you to look for more links. Nice job. ru:Участник:Qkowlew

Poster image (woman / violin)
I'm trying to remember who it was, but a very early famous photographer pioneered that idea for a photo and I think the picture is trying to emulate the photo which I saw reproduced in an issue of Mental Floss. I'll have to remember who the photographer was. --Bobak 21:20, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
 * You're thinking of Man Ray. Here's a link. http://www.roland-collection.com/rolandcollection/section/18/568.htm --Mrs Scarborough 17:08, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Redviolin.jpg
Image:Redviolin.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 22:58, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Pope's "presumably shattered" left hand
diff The last time we see Pope, he has the violin in his left hand, holding it by the root of the neck. In following scenes, there is an obvious patch in the wood of the neck root, looking very much like repaired bullet damage, commented on and re-done to a higher standard at the auction house. Without other motive plainly stated, the bits of cinematography mentioned above strongly suggest that the loss of the hand, or the loss of the use of it, is what prompts him to end his life. Comment? __Just plain Bill (talk) 00:56, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Criticism re: length of description
Whomever put that criticism about the description being 'excessively long' has obviously NEVER seen this beautiful film. One can't talk about this move and keep it concise. It has many facet to it and to 'dummy' down the description would be absolutely CRIMINAL. Please keep it as is. Don't cater to people with short attention spans. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.21.115.10 (talk) 19:25, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
 * In my work on this article (expanding production, release, reception, etc.) I've tried to condense the plot summary. It's not just summarizing for low attention spans- needless detail can infringe copyright, and there were a lot of details. But you do have a point that this was a very tough one to condense. There's a lot of plot packed in. It's still a little bit longer than conventional, but "There is no universal set length for a plot summary" Ribbet32 (talk) 08:07, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

The big reveal?
The revelation for the reason behind the violin's unique color was kept for the end of the film. Not just the scientific analysis, but the scene where it's creator, the Nicolò Bussotti character, in his grief, brings his dead wife {the Anna Rudolfi character) to his workshop and collects her blood to use in the varnish. He even creates a brush from her hair with which to apply it. It's the climax of the film and the reason why the tarot card reading follows the history of the instrument beyond the life of Anna Rudolfi. The theft is another, milder climax, then the rest is dénouement. In this article, the reveal occurs in the text in the earliest chronological section, Cremona, 1681, diluting it's significance. Thank you, Wordreader (talk) 04:45, 6 July 2016 (UTC)

 * Much better now in my opinion. Thank you! Wordreader (talk) 05:32, 17 September 2017 (UTC)

Original research?
The “Plot” section of this article contains no citations. Is it original research? It is also perhaps too long and detailed. Additionally, based on my own original research (!), the identity of the violin which Morritz takes home at the end of the film is deliberately ambiguous. Stating otherwise is, I believe, an error. Design (talk) 22:36, 7 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Plot sections on Wikipedia are never referenced; the film itself is the source for plots. You are incorrect about the ending. Ribbet32 (talk) 01:01, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * The Film is the source for the plot, but the written summary here is an ‘original research’ interpretation. The assertion that Morritz leaves with the Red Violin is not supported by the film. The identity of the violin Morritz takes is ambiguous, and actions in the film can support the contention that he leaves with the London copy violin.Design (talk) 04:52, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Specifically, which "actions in the film can support the contention that he leaves with the London copy"? Just plain Bill (talk) 12:50, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I’m not here to fight! Why the ending is ambiguous. Here’s my take on it: No-one verbally confirms the identity of the violin Morritz leaves with. [EDIT: We see the two violins together very briefly when Morritz makes the swap, but with not enough detail for the audience to make their own visual judgement]. The identity is implied, open to interpretation, and ambiguous.
 * In the movie we have seen Morritz arrive at the auction house from multiple angles and views, each time we revisit we are given more information about the characters. This device is part of the unfolding of the movie, and is used to create suspense. Will he steal it? Will he get away with it? The very first time we see Morritz arrive he seems calm. The final scene is a ‘twist’ where the audience’s expectations are confounded.
 * As I recall in the final scenes: (1) Morritz is leaving Montreal to go home to NY to his wife and daughter, then changes his mind and rushes to the auction house, (2) where he swaps violins at the last minute. He is not calm. (3) Evan the tech (and Morritz’ confidant/accomplice) is shocked to see him arrive at the auction house. (4) Morritz is not struck by a car, while crossing the road. (5) He phones his wife and apologises for not being in contact.
 * (1)(2) and (3) are all consistent with Morritz arriving with the Red Violin or the London copy; which violin is not explicit. The haste and shock could be for either scenario.
 * (3) Evan assists Morritz in making the swap. Given that there are more people present and watching this violin than at any other point in the Montreal timeline, which is more likely: Evan hastily helping to return the Red Violin, or steal it?
 * (4) In the ‘mythology’ of the film, those who try too hard to hold onto the Red Violin usually meet a bad end. The violin holds a sort of curse. It’s not logical or consistent, but it is there in the film. Morritz is not struck by the car because he doesn’t have the Red Violin!
 * (5) Throughout the film Morritz has been lying to others that he is calling his wife when he is secretly researching the Red Violin. We learn at the end that he has not contacted his wife. The revelation of the blood in the finish of the Red Violin has shocked him. Perhaps he has learnt that relationships are more important that material possessions! The moral of the story! And he still has an excellent 19th C. violin to give to his daughter. Design (talk) 21:21, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * That's a huge amount of original research and analysis, and completely novel. Everyone saw Morritz stole the Red Violin and this is observable in more reputable sources than the above   Ribbet32 (talk) 05:30, 9 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Is there a director’s commentary, or similar, on the DVD? I’d be interested to know their take on this issue of the ‘ambiguous’ ending. Design (talk) 01:53, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I realize this is rather pointless since this is original research but I figured I would share. I recently viewed the movie again and came across this discussion on the talk page, so I figured I would go back into the film and see if I could actually find any evidence supporting either narrative, and I did realize one thing. Since the violins are deliberately designed to be identical, perhaps the only way of distinguishing them visually would be by the tuning pegs:
 * (1) At about the 1:59:55 mark (the scene where Morritz swaps them) we get a clear shot of both violins side-by-side. The G and D pegs of both violins are both oriented nearly perpendicular to the viewing angle (and parallel to the body of the violin), so no help there. However, the A and E pegs of the fake are roughly parallel to the viewing angle, while the A and E pegs of the real violin are roughly perpendicular to the viewing angle. This is perfect. Now we just need a clear shot of the tuning pegs for the violin that got put up for auction.
 * (2) At about the 2:00:36 mark (when the wall rotates) we get that exact opportunity. The A and E pegs are clearly both roughly parallel to the front of the violin, and roughly perpendicular to the body, just like the fake violin.
 * I mention this in case this discussion somehow evolves in the future, but since it's been two years without comment I doubt that will happen. -- Mocha2007 (talk) 00:38, 24 February 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:The Red Violin