text:
User talk:JabberWok

Bohr model
Thanks for your efforts with the Bohr model article. It's always good to see informed contributions to Wikipedia. --Christopher Thomas 05:32, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Welcome!
Hello, JabberWok, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thanks for your contributions; I hope you like it here and decide to stay. We're glad to have you in our community! Here are a few good links for newcomers:

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-- Sango  123  00:58, July 18, 2005 (UTC)

P.S. Feel free to leave a message on my talk page if you need help with anything or simply wish to say hello. :)

Email
Do you have an email address? PAR 17:09, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

Connection between moment of inertia and coriolis effect
Hi JabberWok,

I noticed you have been adding references to Physics articles. The coriolis effect article needs references, and there is a bit of a problem. Not all physics textbooks discuss the connection between moment of inertia and the coriolis effect explicitly. (Implicitly they do, in discussing gyroscopic precession. Gyroscopic precession and the coriolis effect are related phenomena.

So the quest is on to find a textbook that discusses that connection, I can't just throw in any physics textbook. Maybe a textbook for engineers. In helicopter design there is the matter that when a rotorblade flaps the blade's center of mass moves towards or away from the axis of rotation, causing a change in the blade's angular velocity, (hence a change in lift). Can you possibly help me? --Cleon Teunissen | Talk 11:34, 28 July 2005 (UTC)

 * I thought about it a bit, and quite honestly I have no idea what references to add to the coriolis effect. It's only briefly mentioned in a couple physics books I've read.  There is a lot of confusion about the topic so it would be nice to find a good textbook discussion of it...I'll have to keep my eyes open. JabberWok 21:33, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

 * I found a discussion in my Berkeley Physics Course, under the heading: Angular Acceleration accompanying contraction which is the coriolis effect. (But the Berkeley text doesn't mention the Coriolis effect). It mentions the obvious: in order to contract while there is rotation requires doing work, increasing the rotational kinetic energy.
 * On the Talk:Coriolis effect page, a User named William M Connolley isn't buying the newtonian dynamics in the article. If you think the content of the article is sound, then could you please say so on the Talk:coriolis effect page? --Cleon Teunissen | Talk 23:23, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

 * A colleague of mine mentioned that a good discussion of the Coriolis effect can be found in a book by the title of "Classical Dynamics". There are a couple books with this title - it might be the one by Donald T. Greenwood. From what I've been told, the Coriolis and other interesting effects occur when one derives equations of motion for things on the surface of a rotating sphere.
 * And about that article, a spinning skater bringing in her arms to spin faster is entirely due to conservation of angular momentum. Angular momentum
 * $$L = mvr \,$$
 * is a conserved quantity, when the radius r of her arms decreases, the velocity v of her arms must increase to keep L the same - which is why she spins faster. This seem totally unrelated to the Coriolis effect and I'm not sure why it's brought up in the article. The whole "The Coriolis effect in mechanics" section seems like it should be in the angular momentum article.
 * I'm going to have to read more about the Coriolis effect to be able to comment further though.

Are you kidding me? When performing calculations on a dynamics pheonmenon you can both look at the momentum and at the kinetic energy, it's not an either/or situation. Sure, very often only angular momentum conservation is discussed, I have chosen a different didactic approach.

Let me copy something I've written on the Talk:Coriolis effect page:

About the ice skater and conservation of angular momentum. Of course, conservation of ancgular momentum does apply in the case of the ice skater spinning up, but conservation of momentum is relatively unsuited for explaining the dynamics of a situation.

For example, when a cannon is fired the projectile is hurled away and the barrel recoils, as there is conservation of momentum. It sounds rather odd to say 'the projectile flies away because the barrel recoils'. That is rather unsatisfactory. A dynamic explanation focuses on what happens to the energy: the gunpowder explodes, chemical potential is converted to heat, expanding gases accelerate the projectile through the barrel. The general practice in physics is to look to the energy and to the forces. Energy is more associated with causality, because energy is associated with how processes develop over time, while momentum is more associated with symmetry of space.

In the Coriolis effect there is conversion of energy from one form to another. Potential-kinetic, kinetic-potential The general physics approach to understanding a phenomenon is to keep track of the energy conversions. --Cleon Teunissen | Talk 06:01, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

 * Well ok, whatever you like. I only mentioned it because you asked for my opinion. JabberWok 06:14, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

The problem, as I see it, is that there are two different phenomena that are both called Coriolis effect, causing a lot of Babylonian confusion

In engineering, the angular momentum conservation is known as the coriolis effect. For example I have Google searched for "helicopter blade" and coriolis, and I found the following sort of descriptions: "When the bending of the blade gets stronger, its center of mass moves closer to the main axis of the rotor. This increases the angular velocity of the blade, increasing its lift". And a Google search with "ice skater" and coriolis, gets a lot of hits. Also the operating principle of the Coriolis mass flow meter is based on changes of moment of inertia.

My apologies for the remark "Are you kidding me?", that was very unpolite. --Cleon Teunissen | Talk 06:25, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

 * The difference in the way engineers look at it and the way physicists look at it could very well be the main source of confusion over the article. I only know of it from the physics side. JabberWok 20:43, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

 * What Gustave Gaspard Coriolis describes in his 1735 paper corresponds to the engineers coriolis effect. Also the coriolis effect that needs to be taken into account in meteorology is the engineers coriolis effect. One of the few exceptions is ballistics, that is is an example where the issue is coordinate transformation between an inertial coordinate system and a rotating coordinate system. --Cleon Teunissen | Talk 20:49, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

 * Another example: orbital mechanics. Comets have orbits with the largest eccentricity. As the Sun accelerates a comet, towards the center of the solar system, the gravitation is doing work and the angular velocity of the comet with respect to the sun increases. That corresponds to the mechanical coriolis effect: angular acceleration accompanying contraction. --Cleon Teunissen | Talk 20:56, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

Period at the end of sentence
Hi. I saw you removed periods at the end of formulas in method of steepest descent. I would like to ask you to not do that in the future. Putting a period at the end of formula if formula is at the end of sentence is accepted practice in mathematics publications and also on Wikipeida, as per the math style manual. I am aware that engineers don't like that, but at least in math articles, we will use the math conventions. :) Cheers, Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 21:44, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

Lightbulb images
Hello,

I was notified that this image, which you originally uploaded and I converted to PNG, will soon be deleted, due to its image page not having information about the source. Could you please provide that information? Thanks in advance, --Fibonacci 18:25, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Flux
Re: Flux (disambiguation): Do not alphabetize disambiguation pages. Per the Manual of Style, entries on disambiguation pages should be in order from most common to least.--Srleffler 01:42, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

Image:USDA organic seal.gif listed for deletion
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sorry, i accidently deleted the agricultural piece when i just wanted to make changes. it is surprising for a PhD student to portray the whole agricultural news so subjectively. The E.coli outbreak was most likely caused by wild pigs and the 2003 review paper is very unconvincing. ncbi has several other papers that are more statistically significant stating the opposite.

Organic Food Problems:
I asked for the organic page to be delisted because it has so many errors that it was futile for me to attemp editing it. It is systematically biased. --Zeamays 02:57, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Independent scientists is commonly taken to mean scientists, such as academic scientists, without professional affiliation to a profit making entity (agribusiness) or a philosophically-based group (such as the Rodale Institute). All of the citations I added were to governmental or academic people or organizations. --Zeamays 18:14, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

hey i find your latest addition to organic food is mostly editoralizing. i don't think the article should argue for organic food, which is what your addition does. look at Amillsx last additions, he does the opposite, at least he does it in the controversy section, but i feel he also just adds his own opinion, rather than documenting criticism. must admit, me i am also a fan of short intros. as it is now i would like to take both addition off. trueblood 09:25, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

this is not gonna be easy
i have a little trouble editing the article because it is not clear to me of what should be where. i guess i am not happy with the motivations article. whose motivation, why farmers grow organic or why consumers buy organic? i feel some sections should be in the food article, all the contamination stuff, plus taste, whilst there are sections in the food article that should be in the farming article, like um the benefits of organics (except for the consumer, but that is redundant with the stuff from motivations) and the history. oh and the identifying section could be a lot shorter. i say this here because you started the motivations article, didn't you. ps do you still think i delete too much or too quickly? --trueblood 20:35, 25 July 2006 (UTC) i removed the trevawas or was it trewavas link because it was not functionable. they even put up a note that someone should tell the people at wikipedia that this link does not work anymore. he is a scientist though--trueblood 23:35, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure which is the more "general" article: Organic food or Organic farming, and since both articles seemed to list arguments for and against organics, I sort of hoped that the Motivations for organic agriculture could be an overlap between the two. After creating the page I sort of have ignored it and concentrated on the Organic food page - in the hopes that I could help make it shorter and more to the point with good references.
 * Oh, and I don't think you delete too much or too quickly. JabberWok 00:09, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Please see my comments on my own discussion page. --Zeamays 12:39, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

ii feel i got rather bogged down by this little argument. i would like to get on with improving the structure of the articles. for instance i am not sure if this whole sustainability issue shouldn't be rather in the farming article. i guess i am going to take stock of what is where and come up with some suggestion of moving sections between articles. i really would like to have criticism sections in each article and have all controversy contained in those sections.good job with creating the trevawas article. i think his nature article is based on opinion rather than evidence. most of it's links that interested me did not work though--trueblood 07:02, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

deletor
you are refering to the atrazin thing, you are right i am often to impatient to wait until i find something better to replace it. in this case i really want a link that is summarizing the research about effect of pesticide residues in food (which should than also be in the pesticide article). i think it is not helpful to just pick out some study that proves some connection, because you can also pick another study that failed to prove a connection. but you are right i ran into people for deleting things. i should be more careful. on the other hand there is the note that says that the article might to long.--trueblood 16:35, 6 August 2006 (UTC) ah and i think organic farming should be the more general article since organic food is just the outcome of it. organic farming should be the longer article of the two. and i still think the sustainability controversy should be there, since it should discuss organic farming practices.--trueblood 16:40, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

License tagging for Image:SpringsInSeries.png
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GFDL works on wikicommons
Hi, would you please upload your GFDL images, such as Image:Kaon-Decay.svg onto the Wikicommons so that I can use them on other languages? --Tevatron 12:30, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Sure, although it might be a slow process for me to do (looks like some people have a tool to transfer files from wikipedia to the commons).
 * Kaon-Decay.svg

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Electron positron Feynman diagram
Shows them undergoing a repelling reaction. I suppose it's in theory possible to scatter an electron off a positron (though I wouldn't bet that it is), however, since the most common interaction is one of attraction, not repulsion, wouldn't it make a much less confusing diagram if both of these particles had the same charge, in a diagram which shows them moving away from each other after the exchange of the photon? S B Harris 22:08, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Hey there, good point, it's just that Feynman diagrams technically don't depict where things are actually moving. Like, it is not meant to represent a positron and electron going in the same direction, getting closer, passing a photon between them, and then getting far apart. In other words, Feynman diagrams aren't a "physical picture." I can see how someone might think that, but I actually created that diagram for technical Bhabha_scattering article, which happens at particle accelerators that smash positrons and electrons head-on into eachother. But that's a good point, I should get around to creating images of the actual physical picture of what's happening in these interactions. JabberWok 00:54, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

 * But indeed SOMETIMES Feyman diagrams can be used to picture things as through actually moving, since time is one axis. So if you take a frame where both particles are moving and you use that time axis as the velocity direction the particles are moving IN, then each particle does trace out its actual physical path, moving toward (or away) from the other, changing course with emission or absorption of a virtual particle. Of course, for inertial frames in which particles head exactly at each other, it's just a graph, where this is laid out as a strip-recorder would see it. BTW, since time is an axis, you technically need your photon wavy to have an angle from origin point to absorption point, so it doesn't look like it's being transferred instanteously. Look at all real F diagrams and you'll see that angle, even for massless exchange particles S  B Harris 01:06, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

 * Hmm, the way it's always been taught to me is summed up by this quote from my first introductory course in modern physics,
 * "The lines are symbolic and do not represent the particle trajectories. It is the interaction that we are interested in describing." - Modern Physics by Tipler and Llewellen.
 * And all the feynman diagrams in this book do not have this "angle" that you're describing (you mean this, right?). In addition, the feynman diagrams I've created were drawn the same way they are in the standard graduate level particle physics book Halzen & Martin (ISBN 0-471-88741-2). So, I guess what I'm saying is that the "modern style" of drawing feynman diagrams is just as I've drawn. JabberWok 05:41, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Math on CFL article
See User_talk:MrVoluntarist for discussion. MrVoluntarist 18:02, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Replaceable fair use Image:Garden_of_Eatin_Yellow_Chips.jpg
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hostile takeover at organic food
did not drop in for a while, but now i found the article on organic food to one sided, now it seems bottom line is organic food is less sustainable, don't have the time now but i'd like to put things back into perspective a bit more sooner or later. keep up the good work trueblood 16:01, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Organic Valley, Inc. Article
Hello- I just recently joined Wikipedia and uploaded my first article, Organic Valley, Inc.. I was hoping that you might have the opportunity to read my article and provide feedback because of your envolvement in the other organic food articles. Any help would be appreticiated! Thanks Goldtome 14:54, 12 October 2007 (UTC)Goldtome

Image:Newsweek-May-22-2005.jpg
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Bohr model image wrong
Hello, thanks for all your effort. I just noticed that your picture which is prominently featured at the top of the article Bohr model seems to be wrong. 1) The atomic nucleus is missing (which in itself is probably not a big deal); 2) The electron on the lowest level (n = 1) should be on its orbit and not in the center of the atom. Please let me know what you think. 149.217.1.6 09:50, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

 * Sorry, apparently you are not the author of the current version. 149.217.1.6 15:32, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Compton@Commons
Hi JabberWok, I have uploaded your diagrams on Compton scattering on Wikipedia Commons (links on my page there) to use them in the german WP, which only had the s-channel diagram. I had a bit of trouble figuring out the exact meaning of the gnu licence you used but according to the guys in the WP chat -and considering the is a function on Commons explicitely doing this- I hope that is ok. timo, 15 November 2007 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.51.250.44 (talk) 02:16, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

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Diagram of Higgs particle production
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Quark Image
Hi JabberWok, I noticed that your Image:Quarks_and_decays.png is in a nice prominent place up at the top of the quark article. However, I am concerned that the image is incorrect, since it neglects the (admittedly very rare) weak decays t → d and b → u. Have you thought about making a version that correctly indicates these decays? Xerxes (talk) 19:54, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

body doubles source request
Hi Jabber you have tagged a statement re body doubles in the toplessness articles - does this reference from IMDB satisfy reliability guidelines or do we need something more? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0235280/trivia cheers IdreamofJeanie (talk) 13:07, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

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Direct evidence vs. indirect evidence
Perhaps a typo, but the observations of the Bullet Cluster and MACS J0025.4-1222 qualitatively and quantitatively comprise INdirect evidence for the existence of dark matter. Also, I'm of the opinion that yet other wording in the MACS J0025.4-1222 article would give the uninformed reader the impression that dark matter is canonical fact instead of an unconfirmed (though promising) scientific hypothesis. But this is a more subjective interpretation of the semantics; so I've limited myself to simply removing the "in" from "direct" in the MACS J0025.4-1222 article, which is a more cut & dry matter. Keep up the good physics work! --bd, 11/11/09 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.87.64.48 (talk) 08:12, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

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137 + 1/27 + .5%
Help, Help. I am caught in the 137 black hole and can't rationalize the last .5%. Can't eat, can't sleep. I like the Feynman diagrams, three circles or two circles with one circle cluttered with an extra photon. If someone would please give me the mathematical expressions for these diagrams, I might be able to come up with an explanation for that last piece. If someone could send me the math corresponding to those diagrams, there is a small chance I could find a wormhole out of the black hole I am trapped in. Please use my email address nasapt.summers@aol.com. Or send me a reference that has it.

Sincerely,

Sleepless in Philadelphia

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:05, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

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title: User talk:JabberWok


text:
Christie Golden

Christie Golden (born November 21, 1963) is an American author. She has written many novels and several short stories in fantasy, horror and science fiction.

Career
Golden has written many novels and several short stories in the fields of science fiction, fantasy and horror. Among her many projects are over a dozen Star Trek novels, over a dozen for gaming giant Blizzard's World of Warcraft and StarCraft novels, and three books for the now finished Fate of the Jedi series of Star Wars novels. Her co-authors on that series were Troy Denning and Aaron Allston.

She launched TSR's Ravenloft line of novels in 1991 with her first novel – Vampire of the Mists. and is the creator of the elven vampire archetype in fantasy fiction. She followed up with Dance of the Dead and The Enemy Within. Golden has also written short stories set in the Forgotten Realms, appearing in anthologies in which she further explores the character of the elven vampire Jander Sunstar, whom she established in Vampire of the Mists. Golden has written at a dozen Star Trek: Voyager novels including the popular Dark Matters trilogy, the Homecoming duology, and the Spirit Walk duology.

Golden is also the author of two original fantasy novels from Ace Books, King's Man & Thief and Instrument of Fate, which made the 1996 Nebula Preliminary Ballot.

Among her work in the gaming fantasy novels, she wrote Warcraft: Lord of the Clans (2001), and World of Warcraft: Rise of the Horde (December 2006). She also authored a trilogy titled StarCraft: the Dark Templar Saga for Blizzard Entertainment and Simon and Schuster Pocketbooks. She also wrote World of Warcraft: Arthas: Rise of the Lich King which was released April 21, 2009. It was Golden's first New York Times bestseller. Subsequent Warcraft novels are The Shattering: Prelude to Cataclysm, Thrall: Twilight of the Aspects, Jaina Proudmoore: Tides of War, and War Crimes.

Under the name Jadrien Bell she wrote a fantasy thriller entitled A.D. 999, which won her the Colorado Author's League Award for Best Genre Novel in 1999.

She is currently hoping to reissue her original fantasy series, the Dancers Pentad. The first book in the series On Fire's Wings follows the discovery of the first of five dancers, Kevla the flame dancer. The second book In Stone's Clasp records both the flame dancer, Kevla and the stone dancer, the element of earth, Jareth. The book won her a second Colorado Author's League Award for Best Genre Novel in 2005. This series was released through Luna Books.

Golden has also written for Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angel anthologies. She has written novels based on Steven Spielberg's Invasion America animated television show, and film producer and screenwriter Harve Bennett was so impressed with her Invasion America work that he invited her to Hollywood to write for the show - however, the show was not renewed for a second season.

Golden has authored four Assassin's Creed works. Her first, "Blackbeard: The Lost Journal", is a companion piece for the video game Assassin's Creed IV: Black Flag. Another Assassin's Creed book, the in-universe "Abstergo Employee Handbook" hit shelves in December 2014. "The Accidental Knight," a novel set in the world of Cryptozoic's online card game, HEX, will be published later in 2014 as an online book, with a hard copy version to follow. Her Star Wars: The Clone Wars novel titled Star Wars: Dark Disciple was published in July 2015. And in 2017 she published the official movie novelization of Valerian and the City of a Thousand Planets through Titan Books - ISBN 978-1-7856-5384-1.

Personal life
Golden was born on November 21, 1963, in Atlanta, Georgia, US.

Assassin's Creed

 * Assassin's Creed IV Black Flag: Blackbeard – The Lost Journal, Insight Editions, March 2014
 * Assassin's Creed Unity: Abstergo Entertainment – Employee Handbook, Insight Editions, November 2014
 * Assassin's Creed: Heresy, Ubisoft Publishing, November 2016
 * Assassin's Creed: The Official Movie Novelization, Ubisoft Publishing, December 2016

The Final Dance

 * The Final Dance Book 1: On Fire's Wings, LUNA Books, July 2003
 *  The Final Dance Book 2: In Stone's Clasp LUNA Books, September 2005
 * The Final Dance Book 3: Under Sea's Shadow, LUNA Books, October 2007 (e-book only)

HEX: Shards of Fate

 * The Accidental Knight, Hex Entertainment, LLC., November 2014

Invasion America

 * Invasion America, Roc, February 1998
 * Invasion America: On the Run, Roc, November 1998

Ravenloft

 * Ravenloft: Vampire of the Mists, TSR, September 1991
 * Ravenloft: Dance of the Dead, TSR, June 1992
 * Ravenloft: The Enemy Within, TSR, February 1994

StarCraft

 * StarCraft II: Devil's Due, Pocket Books, April 2011
 * StarCraft II: Flashpoint, Gallery Books, November 2012

StarCraft: The Dark Templar Saga

 * StarCraft: The Dark Templar Saga: Firstborn, Pocket Books, May 2007
 * StarCraft: The Dark Templar Saga: Shadow Hunters, Pocket Books, November 2007
 * StarCraft: The Dark Templar Saga: Twilight, Pocket Books, June 2009

Star Trek: Gateways

 * Star Trek: Voyager: Gateways Book 5: No Man's Land, Pocket Books, October 2001
 * Star Trek: Gateways Book 7: What Lay Beyond: In the Queue, Pocket Books, November 2001

Star Trek: The Next Generation

 * Star Trek: The Next Generation: Double Helix Book 6: The First Virtue (with Michael Jan Friedman), Pocket Books, August 1999

Star Trek: The Original Series

 * Star Trek: The Last Roundup, Pocket Books, July 2002

Star Trek: Voyager

 * Star Trek: Voyager #6: The Murdered Sun, Pocket Books, February 1996
 * Star Trek: Voyager #14: Marooned, Pocket Books, December 1997
 * Star Trek: Voyager #16: Seven of Nine, Pocket Books, September 1998
 * Star Trek: Voyager: Endgame, (with Diane Carey), Pocket Books, July 2001
 * Star Trek: Voyager: Homecoming, Pocket Books, June 2003
 * Star Trek: Voyager: The Farther Shore, Pocket Books, July 2003

Star Trek: Voyager: Dark Matters Trilogy

 * Star Trek: Voyager #19: Dark Matters #1: Cloak and Dagger, Pocket Books, November 2000
 * Star Trek: Voyager #20: Dark Matters #2: Ghost Dance, Pocket Books, November 2000
 * Star Trek: Voyager #21: Dark Matters #3: Shadow of Heaven, Pocket Books, November 2000

Star Trek: Voyager: Spirit Walk

 * Star Trek: Voyager: Spirit Walk Book 1: Old Wounds, Pocket Books, November 2004
 * Star Trek: Voyager: Spirit Walk Book 2: Enemy of My Enemy, Pocket Books, December 2004

Star Wars

 * Star Wars: Fate of the Jedi: Omen, Del Rey Books, June 2009
 * Star Wars: Fate of the Jedi: Allies, Del Rey Books, May 2010
 * Star Wars: Fate of the Jedi: Ascension, Del Rey Books, August 2011
 * Star Wars: Dark Disciple, Del Rey Books, June 2015
 * Star Wars: Battlefront II: Inferno Squad, Del Rey Books, July 2017
 * Star Wars: The Bucket (short story) published in Star Wars: From a Certain Point of View, Del Rey Books, October 2017
 * The Truest Duty (short story) published in Star Wars: From a Certain Point of View: The Empire Strikes Back, Del Rey Books, November 2020

World of Warcraft

 * Warcraft: Lord of the Clans, Pocket Books, October 2001
 * World of Warcraft: Rise of the Horde, Pocket Books, December 2006
 * World of Warcraft: Beyond the Dark Portal (with Aaron Rosenberg), Pocket Books, June 2008
 * World of Warcraft: Arthas: Rise of the Lich King, Pocket Books, May 2009
 * World of Warcraft: The Shattering: Prelude to Cataclysm, Pocket Books, October 2010
 * World of Warcraft: Thrall: Twilight of the Aspects, Pocket Books, July 2011
 * World of Warcraft: Jaina Proudmoore: Tides of War, Pocket Books, August 2012
 * World of Warcraft: War Crimes, Gallery Books, May 2014; Pocket Books, May 2015
 * Warcraft: Durotan: The Official Movie Prequel, Titan Books, May 2016
 * Warcraft: The Official Movie Novelization, Titan Books, June 2016
 * World of Warcraft: Before the Storm, June 2018
 * World of Warcraft: Exploring Azeroth - Eastern Kingdoms, November 2020
 * World of Warcraft: Sylvanas, March 2022

Short stories and essays

 * "One Last Drink," Realms of Valor, TSR, February 1993
 * "Blood Sport," Realms of Infamy, TSR, December 1994
 * "Witch Hunt" and "The Angel," 100 Wicked Little Witch Stories, Barnes & Noble, July 1995
 * "One Good Bite," 100 Vicious Little Vampire Stories, Barnes & Noble, August 1995
 * "Breathtaking Music," Blood Muse, Donald I. Fine, December 1995
 * "The Quiet Place," Realms of Magic, TSR, December 1995
 * "Summer Storms," Lammas Night, Baen Books, February, 1996
 * "Stag Party," OtherWere, Ace Books, September 1996
 * "The Play's the Thing," Miskatonic, DAW Books, Inc., November 1996
 * "Though Hell Should Bar the Way," with A.C. Crispin, Highwaymen: Robbers and Rogues, DAW Books, Inc., June 1997
 * "The Remaking of Millie McCoy," Urban Nightmares, Baen Books, November 1997
 * "The Ultimate Weapon, Tales from Tethedril, Del Rey, September 1998
 * "A Night at Sandrine's," Amazing Stories, December 1998
 * "A Light in the Sky," Whitley Strieber's Aliens: An HWA Anthology, Pocket Books, December 1998
 * "The White Doe," Tales of the Slayer, Simon & Schuster, 1999
 * "Hard Crash," Star Trek S.C.E.: Have Tech, Will Travel, Pocket Books, 2001
 * "The Sun Child," Angel: The Longest Night, Simon & Schuster, 2002
 * "Where's the Religion in Willow's Wicca?", BenBella Books, 2003
 * "Promises to Keep", Halo: Fractures, Gallery Books, 2016
 * "The Bucket", Star Wars: From a Certain Point of View, Random House, 2017
 * "Elegy", World of Warcraft: Battle for Azeroth, 2018
 * "The Vow Eternal", World of Warcraft: Dragonflight, 2022

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Christie Golden


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Daniel Urtiz

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was DELETE. Golbez 06:58, Jun 18, 2005 (UTC)

Daniel Urtiz

 * Delete - not notable... what is this? gren 05:34, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete non notable. JamesBurns 05:49, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * keep notable Chubby Chicken 15:38, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment. Above recently created account, Chubby Chicken, is voting "keep, notable" for numerous clearly non-notable (indeed bordering on speedy) articles. Please keep that grain of information in mind when counting votes. -- BD2412 talk 20:14, 2005 Jun 11 (UTC)
 * I'm a Usenet poster, too. Delete. Uncle G 16:12, 2005 Jun 11 (UTC)
 * Delete not notable. You 19:32, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete - not notable. - DS1953 19:36, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * delete not notable, description bordering on nonsense --TimPope 22:58, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete I've seen this guy, he's a retard.  Grue   13:29, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages.  Please do not edit this page .


text:
File:Eden's Bowy (front cover).jpg

Cover for Eden's Bowy. Fair use per WP:FU, meets all criteria. This image constitutes Fair Use with the conditions that:

 * 1) It alone identifies the article in question (Eden's Bowy).
 * 2) No free equivalent is available.
 * 3) In no way does displaying this image in an encyclopedic fashion inhibit sales or marketing of the original product.

title: File:Eden's Bowy (front cover).jpg


text:
User:Astadt

Albert Stadt Victoria BC Canada

Albert Stadt's Home Page

title: User:Astadt


text:
Marina Cooper

Marina Cooper is a fictional character on the popular CBS daytime soap opera, Guiding Light. The character is the only child of the police chief, Frank Cooper, and ex-wife, Eleni Andros and was born on-screen on May 8, 1993. In December 2001, her birth year was SORASed to 1985. The character has been portrayed by six different actresses with Mandy Bruno currently playing the role on Guiding Light since May 24, 2004.

Character history
Marina became a police recruit after being accepted at Springfield's Police Academy following the footsteps of her father and aunt before her. Her love interest at the time, Danny Santos, was a former mobster. As of 2007, she became a detective.

In 2009, the character of Marina has become embroiled in the Edmund Winslow murder mystery and has been featured very prominently when she was thought to be his killer, even though he was revealed to be alive. Marina married A.C. Mallet but is confronted by the return of her ex-boyfriend Shayne Lewis. After adopting a son, Henry, with Mallet, it was soon revealed that Shayne and his girlfriend Lara were the child's biological parents. After annulling his marriage to Dinah, who fled town to avoid being charged with the murder of a man she thought was Edmund Winslow, Shayne wanted to become a real father to his son. Later, Mallet left town, because he didn't want his son to have two fathers, and left Marina to raise Henry with Shayne. After divorcing Mallet, Marina is shown with Shayne parenting Henry, they are possibly married.

Family
Marina is the only child of Frank Cooper and Eleni Andros, who married the same day of Marina's birth. They separated in 2000 as their workaholic personalities led them to drift apart. After Eleni's affair was discovered, they divorced; it was an event that Marina did not forgive her mother easily for. Though she moved away and lived with Eleni in Los Angeles after her parents' break-up, she returned in December 2001 after running away from California. Though her parents considered re-uniting for Marina's sake, Eleni eventually left Springfield once more acquiescing to Marina's desire to live with her family, garnering extremely negative reaction from fans because of the characters unpopularity.

title: Marina Cooper


text:
Talk:Australian anti-terrorism legislation, 2004

NPOV
This article is very strong in its opposition to the Howard government's anti-terror laws. It needs to be looked over and NPOVed to give some quality info on these important laws. Harro5 05:38, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)

The POV paragraphs were inserted by the LaRouchite editor Herschelkrustofsly aka Weed Harper, who has now been banned. I have deleted them. I'm not really sure what the point of this article now is. Perhaps it can be incorporated into a wider article on the Australian response to terrorism. Adam 07:11, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

External links modified
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text:
User:Sigma-Chi-Guy

.

title: User:Sigma-Chi-Guy


text:
User talk:Sigma-Chi-Guy

.

title: User talk:Sigma-Chi-Guy


text:
Talk:Beta Theta Pi

2006 comment on early version
this is the shittiest wikipedia page ever Every single other wiki entry on fraternities and sororities contains all of the same types of information. If you are going to delete the history and other bits of information that provide people with answers about what Beta Theta Pi is then you need to do so for every other greek organization on this board. The information in this entry is simply information about the history and background of this organization. Just like just about every other entry on wikipedia. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rrude (talk • contribs) 15:27, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
 * If you think that putting copyrighted in quotes makes it less a serious legal offense to plagiarize someone else's material you are wrong. What I did was to remove a threat to the legal standing of the Wikimedia Foundation as you seem to have an insistence on trying to host and display illegally copied material on our servers. The information in this entry is simply copyrighted information about the history and background of this organization. If you care so strongly about having it included, which for the record I think should happen as it is a notable organization, then you must rewrite it in your own words and not violate the expressly stated (at the bottom of the website you copy&pasted from) copyright of the Beta Theta Pi Fraternity. Aside from the relevant laws regarding copyright in the State of Florida, United States, and whichever jurisdiction you happen to be editing from, it is also a violation of Wikipedia policy found at Copyrights. —WAvegetarian•(talk) 19:46, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Arturo Ritti's vandalism of various articles
I have moved this section to my own user page. Nova SS 17:00, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Lay/Skilling Controversy
Can we just agree to put them under an "infamous" category and use my revision? I have no problem separating them out and explaining (briefly) what they did, but 1) assigning various adjectives like "fraudster" and the like is not "encycopaedic", 2) labelling them as "Beta Criminals" is unfair (which is what the section name "Criminals" does, though their actions have nothing to do with the fraternity), and 3) it would seem more appropriate to set them aside in their own category because they're now more famous for their notoriety than being famous Betas in "Business."

Also, so we're all clear, I am a Beta and I don't see this as a cheerleading page; I also believe this is supposed to be as NPOV as possible. Age or whatever, the first revision was entirely unacceptable by Wikipedia standards, and the removal of the section entirely was equally unacceptable. We're adults here. Let's get over this and make the page better and, most importantly at this stage, NPOV'd.

By the way, could you both get user names please? I hate "anonymous" revisions. Pat 19:42, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

There is a convicted sex offender in the list of prominent Betas along with a couple of alcoholics, people who have been convicted of speeding and a couple of homosexuals (not that there is anything wrong with that). The point is is that those individuals are not "described" by those things as is trying to be done to Skilling and Lay. The criminal conduct should be addressed on their pages but not here. It has nothing to do with explaining Beta Theta Pi. Rrude 20:12, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

 * So that everyone can take a breather, DO NOT remove the "Infamous" section. It's an entirely appropriate section, and if it is removed, this revert war will only grow. Embrace the fact that they're convicted, let it be noted, and move on. Otherwise, this is going to become an outright-vandalized page, and we don't need that. Sheath your swords, and if you have discussion on this matter, put it here.-- Pat 07:03, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Pat, do you know how to request mediation on this issue? I'm fairly new to all this and just don't see that this is going to be resolved without some help. This page is being threatened with vandalization and that is simply not necessary. It appears that someone has a personal issue with these two individuals and is simply using wikipedia and all the pages associated with these two as his personal playground. The bottom line is what is appropriate information on a page and what isn't. By all means the pages devoted solely to Skillings and Lay should have all the information on it. But simply an association with an organization or a school many, many years ago should have little to do with the page. Thoughts??? Rrude 15:04, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Just as an FYI, this Arturo Ritti guy (the one who is on an Enron agenda and edits with 80.4.x.x. IPs) is repeatedly vandalizing the Southern Methodist University home page with his invectives or commentaries about Jeffrey Skilling. I have allowed him to use the descriptions "convicted felon" and "former" on Skilling, and I am allowing him to move Skilling to an "Other" sub-section. However, I am not allowing him to take it further because he clearly has an agenda and is being highly POV. I am not allowing him to add "disgraced" because it repeats what us already implied by the combination of "former" and "convicted felon". I am also not allowing him to add a sub-section of notable alumni called "Infamous" because the sections are about one's profession, not one's place in life. Nova SS 14:07, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Can anything be done to get him to stop vandalizing the site while on this personal and pointless crusade? Rrude 21:51, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes. Just make sure multiple authors are watching, and revert him every time. Nova SS 22:11, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Sorry for the late reply! When worse comes to worst, users can request that a page be protected. We requested semi-protection here because the problem was with an unregistered user. Full protection disables all edits to the page. Hope this helps! Pat 04:22, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Thus far it appears he is using the following IPs:
 * 80.41.127.153
 * 80.41.113.114
 * 208.251.56.210
 * All of this is made clear by his repeated declaring that one must call him on the phone to get him to stop and all three accounts put forth the same number to call. IrishGuy 22:52, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I think this "Pat" guy has the best motives/intentions. For good or for bad, Beta Theta Pi ended up with two notorious criminals in its ranks.  But this is just the law of averages working - probably every fraternity has swindlers in its honor roll.  The question here is, why doesn't anybody want to point it out.  Probably because this is a cheerleading page, controlled by Betas.  But Pat didn't seem too fazed by it.  Again, I have no problem with discussing this with anybody.  But nobody seems to either have the balls or the nickel so far.  So, until then, let the games continue. Betathetapi545
 * User:Betathetapi545 is a serial vandal. (See User:Novasource for more info). His vandalism should be reverted immediately. He is not a member of Beta Theta Pi despite what his username implies. He thrives on making changes here to push his own point of view and agenda.

Other debates
I think it would be nice that next to the names of the Famous Betas is the field in which they gained noteriety. Right now, they're just names.
 * I agree,let's work on it JMM tau 1270
 * I have made several changes. Tried to segregate famous brothers into their fields of expertise. Added a few and deleted a couple who I had never heard of. Would recommend that all future additions to Famous Betas include name, school and graduation year, and exact accomplishment so there is no question as to qualification and it is verifiable. Also changed the "motto" to our beloved _kai_. Added "of ever honored memory" to the list of founders. I have studied Beta Lore for 30 years and served as a Lore Examiner to several Indiana chapters. __kai__Jon Myers, Wabash 1981, Tau Chapter 1270. j-myers@earthlink.net
 * gentlemen,

 * Dissent is a valuable component of open discourse. The section on dissent to the Men of Principle initiative has been toned down, but I think it is important that it is there, to counterbalance the extensive endorsement that previous authors have written. if you have a problem with it, contact me and let's talk.  _kai_  Chris Petelle, Cornell, '02.

Beta secrets
Should we post stuff like what kai means and what the motto is etc? i dont see why not. i know them and they are no big deal.
 * I don't think that's appropriate. The secrets are in large part what make a fraternity; catalouging those is a dangerous precedent for Wikipedia set. Pat 03:45, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I've changed the motto twice now to reflect "kai" instead of "Cooperation Makes Strength", which was the motto of Miami's Union Literary Society. Changes submitted more for accuracy than for secrecy matters. User:chasroyal 08:32, 08 Aug 2006 (UTC)
 * The answers to questions that begin with "Should we post stuff like..." are often clearly answered in wikipedia's policies and guidelines. In this case, it should be clear that "secrets" are not verifiable. If you can cite your sources, and the sources are good, then you could add the "secrets" and they shouldn't be reverted or deleted. Good luck with that.
 * I highly doubt you'll find any official fraternity statement written in any published source that exposes any "secrets" for any fraternity. They wouldn't be very secret, then; would they?
 * Also, keep in mind that wikipedia is not a home for original research. That is, "I know blank" does not qualify as a source to add blank to the wikipedia. You may also want to check the WikiProject:Fraternities and Sororities to see if there are any guidlines set up there. — gogobera (talk) 19:02, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Broken Lizard
Is it confirmed anywhere that all five members of Broken Lizard (Jay Chandrasekhar, Kevin Heffernan, Steve Lemme, Paul Soter, Erik Stolhanske) are in Beta Theta Pi? This interview says that only four of the actors are fraternity members, but this article says that all five are. Kevin Heffernan (comedian) does not mention the fraternity. Is there anyone who can provide clarification on the situation? Olessi 07:42, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I believe they were all members of the Colgate University Beta Theta Pi chapter. I cannot personally verify that information, but among current university undergraduate members of Beta, it is accepted as common knowledge. ShawnHorton 21:47, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
 * All were students at Colgate University. Jay Chandrasekhar, Kevin Heffernan, Steve Lemme, and Erik Stolhanske are members of Beta Theta Pi. Paul Soter is a member of Theta Chi. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ColgateUHockey (talk • contribs) 13:40, 6 August 2014 (UTC)

Chapter Houses: Notability, Speedy Deletion, and Reliable Sources
Several articles that were speedy deletion candidates have been redirected here, as well as several large, well-layed out articles that looked good but still made no claim to notability per the notability guideline. Nothing against "chapter" articles, but unless they can demonstrate using multiple non-trivial coverage from reliable sources that they are something worth inclusion in an encyclopedia, they are all going to end up either deleted or redirected. brenneman 08:52, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Tables
I just wanted to see if there was a consensus about converting the lists of Famous Betas to tables. I personally find it much easier to read, but when I tried to do the first one, it was promptly reverted with an explanation that it was harder for "noobs" to edit; for myself, that's how i learned how to do things on wikipedia, by seeing someone do it then following the pattern or looking up how to do it in the help section.

Also, I found a link to cite all the Famous Betas with, but I haven't had a chance to edit it in. See Beta Quick Facts] Jameschipmunk 19:28, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

 * Prepare for the beginning of the Reignstorm. I'll be waiting.  -King Beta  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.160.163.135 (talk) 22:52, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

Status of Chapters
Does the "Status" column belong in the Chapters section? The information isn't encyclopedic, and is subject to change at any time. No source is cited for the information, and no mechanism exists to update it when it changes. Unless someone can provide a compelling defense for the column, I suggest it be removed. I'll check back here in a couple weeks and see if anyone's commented. James A. Stewart 06:18, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * No one's replied, so I'm going to go ahead and remove the column. James A. Stewart 00:46, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

Ashton Kutcher
Kutcher is listed as a member of Delta Chi and as a Beta. Which is it? He is listed on the NIC website as a Delta Chi--which I am inclined to believe. I'll remove him from the Beta page unless someone can provide some proof that he is in fact a Beta.DIDouglass 18:07, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Ashton Kutcher is not a member of Beta Theta Pi according to our records at the General Fraternity. Umstadter (talk) 13:37, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Ben Stiller
Ben Stiller is not a member of Beta Theta Pi. Robert Umstadter, Associate Director of Communications, Beta Theta Pi Foundation and Administrative Office Umstadter (talk) 04:00, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Driveway Name
Why is the name of the driveway leading to the administrative office included in the introduction? Hardly seems relevant to be included in the article, much less a place of prominence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.10.243.27 (talk) 00:30, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Notability
The issue of notability of persons is explained in the article Notability in Wikipedia the specific Wikipedia notability guidelines are linked from there as well. Quick google searches of James Desanto and Justin Bates do not indicate any possible backup for claims of notability.DIDouglass (talk) 14:57, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

Men of Principle
The "The recent Men of Principle campaign has caused much controversy between undergraduates and fraternity officials" line strikes me as odd, since the men of principle campaign is not described, nor any reason for the controversy. I'm a member and I only have a vague idea of what the program is and no idea what the possible controversy could be. Citation for this? Lyle (talk) 04:12, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Beta Theta Pi


text:
Stateless nation

A stateless nation is an ethnic group or nation that does not possess its own sovereign state. Use of the term implies that the nation has the right to self-determination, to establish an independent nation-state with its own government. Members of stateless nations may be citizens of the country in which they live, or they may be denied citizenship by that country. Stateless nations are usually not represented in international sports or in international organisations such as the United Nations. Nations without a state are classified as fourth-world nations. Some stateless nations have a history of statehood, while some were always stateless.

History
The term was coined in 1983 by political scientist Jacques Leruez in his book L'Écosse, une nation sans État about the peculiar position of Scotland within the British state. It was later adopted and popularized by Scottish scholars such as David McCrone, Michael Keating and T. M. Devine.

Ethnicities described as stateless nations can be dispersed across a number of states (for example, the Yoruba people found in the African states of Nigeria, Benin and Togo) or form the native population of a province within a larger state (such as the Uyghur people in the Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region within the People's Republic of China). Some stateless nations historically had a state, which was absorbed by another; for example, Tibet's declaration of independence in 1913 was not recognized, and it was reunited in 1951 by the People's Republic of China - which claims that Tibet is an integral part of China, while the Tibetan government-in-exile maintains that Tibet is an independent state under an unlawful occupation. Some ethnic groups were once a stateless nation that later became a nation state (for example, the nations of the Balkans such as the Croats, Serbs, Bosniaks, Slovenes, Montenegrins and Macedonians that were once part of the multinational state of Yugoslavia and gained independence during the breakup of Yugoslavia).

Stateless nations can have large populations; for example, the Kurds have an estimated population of over 30 million people, which makes them one of the largest stateless nations.

Nation-states and nations without states
The symbiotic relationship between nations and states arose in Western Europe during the 18th century, and it was exported to the rest of the world through colonial rule. Whereas the Western European nation-states are at present relinquishing some of their powers to the European Union, many of the former colonies are now the zealous defenders of the concept of national statehood. However, not all peoples within multi-cultural states consider themselves stateless nations. As not all states are nation states, there are ethnic groups who live in multinational states that are not considered "stateless nations".

Only a small fraction of the world's national groups have associated nation states; the rest are distributed in one or more states. While there are over 3000 estimated nations in the world, there were only 193 member states of the United Nations as of 2011, of which fewer than 20 are considered to be ethnically homogeneous nation states. Thus nation states are not as common as often assumed, and stateless nations are the overwhelming majority of nations in the world.

Consequences of colonialism and imperialism
During the imperial and colonial era, powerful nations extended their influence outside their homeland; resulting in many colonized nations ceasing to be self-governing and being described as stateless nations thereafter. Some nations have been victims of "carve-outs" that left their homeland divided among several countries. Even today, the colonial boundaries form modern national boundaries. These boundaries often differ from cultural boundaries which results in situations wherein people who speak the same language or have the same culture are divided by national borders; for example, New Guinea is split into the regions of West Papua (a former Dutch colony) and Papua New Guinea (a former Australian colony). During decolonization, the colonial powers imposed a unified state structure irrespective of the ethnic differences and granted independence to their colonies as a multinational state. This led to successor states with many minority ethnic groups in them, which increased the potential for ethnic conflicts. Some of these minority groups campaigned for self-determination. Stateless nations were not protected in all countries and as a result, they became victims of atrocities such as discrimination, ethnic cleansing, genocide, forced assimilation, and the exploitation of labor and natural resources.

Nationalism and stateless nations
People with a common origin, history, language, culture, customs, or religion can turn into a nation through the awakening of national consciousness. A nation can exist without a state, as is exemplified by the stateless nations. Citizenship is not always the nationality of a person. In a multinational state different national identities can coexist or compete: for example, in Britain English nationalism, Scottish nationalism, and Welsh nationalism exist and are held together by British nationalism. Nationalism is often connected to separatism because a nation is considered to achieve completeness through its independence.

Throughout history, numerous nations declared their independence, but not all succeeded in establishing a state. Even today, there are active autonomy and independence movements around the world. The claim of the stateless nations to self-determination is often denied due to geopolitical interests and increasing globalization of the world. Stateless nations sometimes show solidarity with other stateless nations and maintain diplomatic relations.

Unionism vs separatism
Not all ethnic groups claim to be a nation or aspire to be a separate state. Some of them see themselves as part of the multinational state they are located in and believe that their interests are well represented in it. The favoring of a united single state is associated with unionism (such as Pakistani nationalism, Indian nationalism, and Belgian nationalism) ). In many countries, unionism is also encouraged by governments and separatism is considered illegal.

title: Stateless nation


text:
Talk:Special-purpose entity

NPOV
This article would benefit from clean-up. First off, the coup d'etat example in the lead paragraph is quite sensational and sets the tone that SPEs are used primarily to circumvent laws and control environments. And as we all know, the SPE would not protect the owners from prosecution for committing the crime described.

The abuses (like Enron's) should be discussed in more detail, but so should the Itanium project and like SPEs.Bollar 12:20, Jun 23, 2005 (UTC)

 * I will have to admit that the example may stuck out a bit. I honestly can't even remember reading SPE used in that manner except on a novel, Dogs of war by Frederick Forsyth. That doesn't however mean it hasn't happened. See, by giving that example, I wasn't implying that you wouldn't get in trouble for evil committed through an SPE, but it certainly make it hard to get in trouble. That is supported by the fact that, most of the SPE are doing jobs that their mother companies would not like to be associated with. i.e. It make them feel safe to decouple themselves from work that is ethically in the grey area or completely evil. I can restate your complains this way, "Sarbanes Oxley garantee companies will not lie about their financial state". That statement is however false. Sarbanes Oxley only make it hard for such event to happen. 64.229.8.117 13:32, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

Grammar and spelling errors
I was reading a slashdot discussion the numerous writing errors that exist on most on line work. That triggered me to read some of my post here (Something i rarely do) and couldn't help being ashamed. The only consolation was this post, a post that explain most of my errors. The only thing we disagree on is I am open to criticism. gathima 2 July 2005 16:02 (UTC)

Removal
I removed the following text because it lends negative bias to the article. Something is either legal or not, and is not barely legal due to the morals or ethics of the author.

 * They allow a company to operate in a barely legal manner. For example, companies sometimes use special entities to employ workers without paying them benefits. This is the bone of the relationship between Walmart and Orientex Inc, an apparel company whose sole client is Walmart. Orientex is located in Torbay Road, Toronto.

Removed EDS SEC reference
The SEC questions regarding EDS are around the former CEO's statements and use of options on its own stock, not SPEs. So, I removed the EDS SEC reference.

Conduit
I got here via the disambiguation page for "conduit". If conduit is a synonym for "special purpose entity", it probably should be mentioned briefly in the Article.--Goodmorningworld (talk) 11:47, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

The Roaring Nineties quotation
This is a paragraph in "The Roaring nineties" by Joseph Stiglitz page 129

...The ethos at the time was to avoid as many taxes as possible, and the Reagan administration helpfully provided business (and affluent citizens) with host of new tax-dodging techniques. A firm was entitled to an investment tax credit, for example, when it bought a machine. But if the firm had no income to begin with, the credit had little value. To get around this difficulty, companies resulted to complex lease deals. Instead of buying a machine with borrowed money from say GE credit, a company would have GE credit buy it and rent it back to the company. The payment was the same....

Boy, i don'y feel like typing the whole section, so i will dive to the relevant section

..In the succeeding years, even more complicated devices were invented, partly to take advantage of different tax laws in different countries. It become common for numerous parties to figure in a single transaction-the kind of equipment purchase that in the past, would have entailed only one buyer and a seller or at most a buyer, a seller and a bank, which rent money. An American firm might sublease a piece of computer equipment to a foreign firm, created for that express purpose, and the foreigh firm might go to sublease it to another American firm (Also created for that purpose), who would make a single up-front payment to the foreign firm, but borrow the money from one branch of the bank and (to make sure the foreign firm didn't run off with the money) immediately deposit it into another branch of the same bank. The foreign firm might then contribute the capital - which consist of nothing more than the bank account and its pledge to pay the lease payments its obligated - to a partnership. A year later (Seemingly by agreement), the partner would buy out the new "partner," recording loss on its books on the deal. Other firms might be brought into the tax scam. This whirl of mini-transactions was meant to make the mind spin-to obscure the fact that nothing real was going on, and, to rob the US treasury.

I typed the second paragraph for two reasons: —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wk muriithi (talk • contribs) 05:41, 11 June 2005 (UTC)
 * To support an edit i intend to include in the special purpose entity article.
 * Seek assistance - I am sincerely lost. Would someone reword the paragraph above and potentially include some text graphic of what Stiglitz described above please ?

Negative point of view
I am reading this entry because I am getting into the power plant business (microgrids) and I must say that the introduction is overly negative. If I may suggest, please make it more neutral, with the idea that SPEs may serve a positive commercial purpose. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.67.114.195 (talk) 02:17, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Special-purpose entity