text:
User talk:UsagiM

I watch talk pages where I have recently left messages. Please reply in the same section to make discussion easier to follow.

If you leave a message on this page, I'll reply to it here.

Archive Genseiryu Karatedo

Welcome!

Hello,, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place  on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome!
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Welcome
BTW, be careful with that help page. By putting a template on it, you've marked it as a candidate for speedy deletion. An admin who isn't paying close attention may delete it as "deletion requested by author" by accident! — Gwalla | Talk 01:07, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)

 * Thank you Gwalla for letting me know about the ... Didn't know it would be such a problem. Thought they would understand. But I have changed it now. – Usagi M  01:39, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC) (this is just part of the answer copied from Gwalla's talk page!) -– Usagi M  19:02, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

Categorization of Bundestag and Bundesrat
You added a number of categories to both of these articles, notably Category:Political science terms, Category:Germany, Category:Government of Germany, Category:Politics of Germany and Category:German law.

Please note that one of Wikipedia's policies is that articles should not be members of a category and one of its subcategories at the same time. Check out Categorization if you want to read more about that. That article also goes into detail why it's in general not too good an idea to have an article use too many categories, especially if the categories are related.

I hope this makes some sense and will help you with your future categorization efforts. sebmol 03:19, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

 * Okay, so what you mean is that the mentioned articles (by the way, also Rechtsstaat and Judiciary of Germany) have a Category:Germany and at the same time also the other categories (which you mentioned), which are on their part also a sub-category of this Category:Germany... Am I right? So, either all the sub-categories should be removed or the main category... Which of these you suppose would be best??? Thanks for the clarification! BTW, I don't really see the problem (yet), but I will read the mentioned Wiki page about that. Maybe it'll become clear then... – Usagi M  17:06, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
 * P.S.: I took the liberty of wiki-linking some part of your message. Makes it a bit easier, don't think you'd mind...

 * That's exactly what I was trying to say. I would try to be as sparing as possible with categories on an article, especially if the categories themselves are related. In other words, it would be appropriate for Bundestag to be in the category "German Government" (or some equivalent) and maybe in another category "National Legislatures" (if one exists).
 * It is also often common for an article to be in a category named the same as the article IF there are other articles that explain parts of the main article. "Bundestag", for example, is in a category called "German Bundestag" where that category also contains other (usually more detailed) articles about the "Bundestag". That way, the main article doesn't get too long and there's a one-stop page where you can find everything about the Bundestag you ever wanted to know.
 * I'm going to redo the categorization of Bundestag so you can see what I was trying to express.
 * sebmol 18:26, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

 * Alright, I also removed category:Germany from Bundesrat of Germany. However, I do not fully understand why you also deleted Category:Government of Germany and Category:German law. I mean, the Bundestag has everything to do with the government and with the law. Why not put in these categories as well? Because of an overflow? I don't think that is such a problem, some items (articles) do belong in several different categories, nothing to do about that... If it's really an overflow thing, then there are just too many categories and maybe some categories should be removed! Don't you agree with me? Regards, – Usagi M  22:08, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
 * P.S.: I also must add that the system of categories is not really transparent. It's difficult to see which categories are also a sub-category of another category. You can only see by checking it manually... That can be a time-consuming job...
 * I took out category:Government of Germany because category:Legislative Branch of the German Government is a sub-category of category:Government of Germany. I took out category:German law because Bundestag didn't really fit in with the other articles contained in that category. I added a full-length explanation of my category changes to the Bundestag article.
 * sebmol 21:04, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

New category
This may be of interest to you:. Best regards, C HAIRBOY (☎) 16:57, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Sorry for the late reply. Thanks for this information! – Usagi M 22:39, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

karate
Hello, I am researching a karate style called Gembukai, founded in Japan by Tsuneyoshi Ogura. Do you have any info on Ogura Sensei, or where he studied?? Is he realted in any way to the style you study? I can be emailed at sixt3@hotmail.com

many thanks

 * Sorry for the late reply. I don't believe that Gembukai and Genseiryu are related in any way, apart from the fact that they are both karate styles... I do believe that Gembukai has to do something with Shito ryu karate, since I did find something on the internet about a "Gembukai Shito Ryu Tournament"... Try with some Shito Ryu school or maybe even Shorin Ryu... Sorry I can't be more of help in this. Good luck with your research! – Usagi M 14:38, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

Genwakai
UsagiM-san,

I saw your contribution on the talk page of Genwakai. If at all possible, I would like to correspond with your friend in Tokyo. I myself am a karate-ka of Genwakai of America, and I'm very interested in the history of Genwakai. I also aspire to go over to Japan for my education (and hopefully to train in Genwakai).

If you can point me to any direction, it would be much appreciated!

--There is no knowledge that is not power 17:22, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

 * Hello Mofokuban,
 * Zach, I will send you an email (found on your user page). We can then talk further about it... Osu! – Usagi M 20:51, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

AN/I
Hi I wanted to let you know there is a conversation regarding you [] here regarding your recent edits. Regards - 4twenty42o (talk) 05:39, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Indeed this is leading nowhere like this. As much as you and I like to see it, there will never be an understanding between Peter and me. It goes too far to explain everything here, but believe me, it will never happen. Not because I don't want to, but because he doesn't want to... – Usagi M 08:13, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Erroneous warnings
Edits by User:74.104.96.51 are clearly not vandalism. Do not accuse editors of vandalism because you dispute content. Even the most misguided edits are not vandalism, a principle documented at Vandalism, and in fact these edits comport with the Manual of Style, documented at Manual of Style (icons). —Centrx→talk • 06:14, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

 * Looked to me like User:74.104.96.51 was deleting every American flag he could find. Later I found him deleting every flag he could find. Why is it okay to remove the flags? As far as I can see in the mentioned document, it's okay to put the flag next to the name of the country. It is not inappropriate use. I agree it goes too far to call it vandalism. The most it might have been was a mis-edit. Sorry for that. Now about the reverts you did. Again, why should the flag not be there, next to the country name, inside the info box? – Usagi M 16:08, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

 * At best, these flags are needless decoration. At worst, they misrepresent the topic, often by inflating the article with nationality or by using flags of the wrong time period or for nations not yet existing. Therefore, Manual of Style (icons) states that icons and flags specifically need an encyclopedic purpose not purely decorative, should not emphasize nationality without good reason, and especially warns against rewriting history. The primary appropriate purposes for flags are in tables for international sporting events and military conflicts. —Centrx→talk • 20:49, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

 * Okay, noted. Thanks for the clarification! – Usagi M 20:59, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks
For reverting the blanking on my talk page. -- Neil N   talk to me  19:46, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
 * No sweat... – Usagi M talk to me 20:10, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

Ito versus Itō
Per WP:MOS-JA, macrons are to be used in the titles of article where the Japanese name uses macrons, with the non-macroned redirect linking to the title with the macron (and not vice-versa). the exceptions to this rule are settled through discussion, and are very few. This system is being used in hundreds, if not thousands of biographical articles on Japanese subjects at present. Please see WP:MOS-JA. Please also refer to WP:MOS-JA. People born before the start of the Meiji period are always referred to by family name first. Please correct your numerous edits. --MChew (talk) 04:00, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

 * I am a bit uncomfortable with your remark here. I did make a mistake with a historical figure (Itō Sachio, who was born just a few years before the start of the Meiji period), and I saw you already reverted the page move yourself (plus I changed my edits in the article itself), but I don't see any mistakes with other figures... I do not see why I have to "correct my numerous edits"... According Japanese (in the part about names):

Names of modern figures
For a modern figure, a person born after the beginning of the Meiji period (1868 onward), always use the Western order of given name + family name for Western alphabet, and Japanese style family name+ +given name for Japanese characters. For example:
 * Junichiro Koizumi (小泉 純一郎 Koizumi Jun'ichirō, born January 8, 1942) is a Japanese politician …

Spelling, including macron usage, of the name of a modern figure should adhere to the following, in order of preference:
 * Use the official trade name if available in English/Latin alphabet;
 * Use the form found in a dictionary entry from a generally accepted English dictionary;
 * Use the form publicly used on behalf of the person in the English-speaking world;
 * Use the form publicly used on behalf of the person in any other popular Latin-alphabet-using language (French, Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, German, and Dutch, or variations); or
 * If none of the above is available, use the macronned form.

 * In the case I changed it from the macronned form to the non-macronned form, rule 3 was usually the appropriate rule to adhere to: the form publicly used on behalf of the person in the English-speaking world! I did not change any macronned form where there was no information on the person in the English-speaking world... I will have a look at the articles again and will revert edits, if it is was incorrect. I am pretty certain though that for the majority of the articles my edits were correct, because I did follow Wikipedia guidelines! If there is still an article where you think I did not follow the guidelines above, please mention that article to me (and why you think it's incorrect). I will then correct what I did wrong... – Usagi M talk to me 12:42, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

 * I am sorry that you took my remark as hostile - it was meant constructively, and there is no need to get all bent out of shape. Further up in WP:MOS-JA, the text states

Article names
Article titles should follow all of the points above, with the following exceptions:
 * 1) Article titles should use macrons as specified for body text except in cases where the macronless spelling is in common usage in English-speaking countries (e.g., Tokyo, Sumo and Shinto, instead of Tōkyō, Sumō and Shintō).
 * 2) Where macrons are used in the title, appropriate redirects using the macronless spellings should also be created which point to the actual title (e.g., Tessho Genda and Tesshou Genda pointing to Tesshō Genda).
 * 3) For proper names, redirects should be created for the Japanese name order which point to the actual title of the article (e.g., Genda Tesshō, Genda Tessho, and Genda Tesshou pointing to Tesshō Genda).

There has been considerable debate on the WP:MOS-JA talk page as to what is meant by "common usage" and consensus up to now has generally limited macronless spelling to words that have come into day-to-day English usage, as per the above examples. Very few of the authors whose family name is Itō are household names outside of Japan. Noe Itō is a typical example of an author whose name may appear in specialized literature, but would hardly be known to a typical person on the street, and her name appears is several different transliterations in print. Although not an author, Tesshō Genda used in the above WP:MOS-JA example is another. All Japanese family names 伊藤 are transliterated Itō under the modified-Hepburn transliteration system which Wikipedia has chosen to standardize on, and per the above, unless the person in question is either a name most people immediately recognize (i.e. Junichiro Koizumi), or has chosen to publish consistently under an alternative transliterion (such as Itou, Ito, Itoh, etc) by which they are well-known, it seems that the section in WP:MOS-JA specifically pertaining to "Article names" should take precedence over the section you quoted. This, at least, is my position, and I hope that you do not feel in any way affronted or upset if you do not agree. The wording in WP:MOS-JA could certainly be improved on this topic and the topic of macron usage in general, and we could take this whole issue to the discussion board at Wikiproject Japan if you do feel really strongly about it and want to see what the general consensus is. --MChew (talk) 15:33, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

 * I do agree that WP:MOS-JA needs to be improved. It seems contradictory to say in "Articles" that "Article titles should use macrons as specified for body text...", where a bit further in "Names" it states (for modern figures) to "Use the form publicly used on behalf of the person in the English-speaking world". So, what if the article IS a name??? Most Japanese people that write their name in romaji, don't use macrons (which is revised Hepburn romanization) but rather use traditional Hepburn romanization and sometimes they don't even use Hepburn but the Nihon-shiki romanization. Macron are not common for Japanese. It seems more logical for them to write Itō (in hiragana: いとう) as Itou, or don't write the u at all (Ito).
 * But I think this will always be a discussion, also about "common usage". One (Japanese) person can be very "famous" for one person, simply because he is familiar with this field of subject, while this person doesn't ring any bell for another one who is not active in that field. Have you ever heard of Shukumine Seiken? Okay, no macrons there, but just as an example: for me and everybody else in my karate school a very "famous" person, but I'm sure you have never even heard of him... Another example (with macron!): Chōjun Miyagi. He is all over the internet (20.000+ hits) as "Chojun Miyagi" and everybody in Goju-Ryu karate will know him. Yet, here on Wikipedia he's written with a macron, so he is not considered "common usage". Not that I disagree with the use of the macron, I prefer the revised Hepburn system myself! But, who is going to decide which name is in "common usage" and which not? In the end, with Itō, I made it easy: I googled the name (in romaji) and the one that came out most, I figured would be "common usage"... But again, MY personal preference is to use the revized Hepburn system at all times. But that's just me (and you, 'coz I do understand that you also prefer that system?) and I also just have to follow Wikipedia guidelines. But if they are not 100% clear, then what??? Then you get discussions like this... Unfortunately... Happy holidays! – Usagi M talk to me 16:50, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Boardwalk
Well, we may know something exists, but we need a reliable source to know that something is relevant or discussed within a subject. Wikipedia uses secondary sources (such as newspaper articles, journal articles, etc) to determine which parts of a topic are relevant or important enough to discuss in an article. WhisperToMe (talk) 18:51, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Let me explain the point: We know that there is a boardwalk/Wendy's/Lutheran Church in X town - We know it exists. The question is -- "is it important to note in the article?" - If you want you can start a discussion at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Cities and they can explain whether it is important or noteworthy to mention. WhisperToMe (talk) 20:20, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Cities - I am aware that people go to the Kemah Boardwalk (which has its own article), but the Kemah Boardwalk Marina is not managed by the same people as the actual Kemah Boardwalk is - The marina is a separate entity. WhisperToMe (talk) 20:29, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

Sjeng (Name)
This is an automated message from CorenSearchBot. I have performed a web search with the contents of Sjeng (Name), and it appears to include material copied directly from http://www.maastrichtuniversity.nl/web/file?uuid=89fd5cc5-f994-40c2-94fb-bfc5bd529c88&owner=1aca1e32-087d-4a2a-8758-6d4b6c570875.

It is possible that the bot is confused and found similarity where none actually exists. If that is the case, you can remove the tag from the article. The article will be reviewed to determine if there are any copyright issues.

If substantial content is duplicated and it is not public domain or available under a compatible license, it will be deleted. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material. You may use such publications as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences. See our copyright policy for further details. (If you own the copyright to the previously published content and wish to donate it, see Donating copyrighted materials for the procedure.) CorenSearchBot (talk) 16:02, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Somebody should rewrite this bot... Don't know how he comes up with this message, but I created the article myself. Mainly by translating it from the DUTCH wikipedia!! – Usagi M talk to me 16:06, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

A kitten for you!
Sound like a good guy!

Kintetsubuffalo (talk) 14:08, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Eh? Exactly WHAT is this about??? --– Usagi M talk to me 19:22, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:01, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:UsagiM


text:
Stacey Travis

Stacey Elaine Travis (born August 29, 1966) is an American actress. She has appeared in films Hardware (1990), The Super (1991), Only the Strong (1993), Traffic (2000), Ghost World (2001), Bandits (2001) and Intolerable Cruelty (2003).

Life and career
Travis was born in Dallas, Texas. Her brother is actor and comedian Greg Travis. She attended the London Academy of Music and Dramatic Art (LAMDA) and graduated from University of Southern California (USC) with a degree in film. She began her career appearing in low-budget comedies and genre films include, Phantasm II, Dr. Hackenstein and Earth Girls Are Easy (1988). From 1989 to 1992, she was regular cast member in the MTV comedy series, Just Say Julie where she played a variety of characters.

In 1990, Travis played a female leading role in the science fiction horror film Hardware opposite Dylan McDermott. She next starred in the comedy film The Super (1991) and martial arts film Only the Strong (1993) opposite Mark Dacascos. The following years, Travis played supporting roles in many films, include Mystery Men (1999), Traffic (2000), Ghost World (2001), Bandits (2001), Intolerable Cruelty (2003), Venom (2005), and Easy A (2010). In later years she starred in a direct-to-video sequel to the 1983 film A Christmas Story, A Christmas Story 2 (2012), and the supernatural horror film The Manor (2021).

On television, Travis has made more than 50 appearances. She appeared in a season 7 episode of Seinfeld as Holly, Elaine's cousin and Jerry's current love interest. She had a recurring role in Highlander: The Series as Renee Delaney in the season 2 episodes "Unholy Alliance" Part 1 and Part 2, returning in season 4 in the episode "Double Jeopardy". In 1998, she starred on the short-lived UPN comedy series, Love Boat: The Next Wave as Cruise Director Suzanne Zimmerman. She had a recurring role as Jordana Geist, Lynette’s friend in the Desperate Housewives. Her other guest-starring credits include Picket Fences, Dream On, ER, Diagnosis Murder, Touched by an Angel, Dharma & Greg, The Practice, Frasier, Angel, The Big Bang Theory, Modern Family, Mom and S.W.A.T..

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Stacey Travis


text:
Talk:Treaty of Hadiach

Second treaty
Was the second treaty a historic re-enactment of the signing of the treaty, or an attempt to sign an actual new treaty? —Michael Z. 2005-06-7 01:14 Z
 * An attempt to sign an actual new treaty. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 07:19, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)

 * Thanks. I changed the wording just a bit to make it perfectly clear.  —Michael Z. 2005-06-7 21:47 Z

External links modified
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title: Talk:Treaty of Hadiach


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/J-lay

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was delete. Sjakkalle (Check!)  09:03, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)

J-lay
Marked for speedy but isn't a candidate. One-line substub is uninformative but verifiable. Nominator abstains from voting.  — Gwalla | Talk 01:14, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete: Product announcement/advertising. We gather nothing from this about pipe laying in general, only that this product exists.  The industry is not well known enough for there to be no context given and escape the charge of promotionalism. Geogre 01:44, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete promo/ad. --Etacar11 23:54, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages.  Please do not edit this page .

title: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/J-lay


text: User talk:69.47.30.209

title: User talk:69.47.30.209


text:
PrimeCo

PrimeCo Personal Communications, L.P. (later known as Chicago 20 MHz, LLC ) was a joint venture of Bell Atlantic, Nynex, US West and AirTouch Communications, and was the first wireless telecommunications provider to turn up CDMA service on the PCS (1900-MHz) band in November 1996. When the company was founded, it had its headquarters in Westlake, Texas. At a later point its headquarters were in Itasca, Illinois.

History
Hailed as the largest wireless phone service launch in U.S. history, the company successfully launched in 19 major U.S. cities. The company's original cell site equipment suppliers were Motorola and AT&T (now Lucent Technologies), and the original telephone supplier was Qualcomm Personal Electronics, a joint venture between Qualcomm and Sony Electronics. The company served parts of the Midwestern and Southern United States. The two primary service areas included Wisconsin, northern and central Illinois, and northern Indiana; and parts of Virginia and North Carolina, as well as the Gulf Coast from Key West, Florida to Houston, Texas. PrimeCo had the license to operate in Hawaii.

PrimeCo won many marketing awards for innovative advertising campaigns. The first "tease" campaign had scenes like a pizza delivery man "beaming" onto a beach a few seconds after the order is placed. The viewer is left to wonder what the product or service is. The tag line was "Someday, everything will work this well." Overall, the tease campaign featured looks into the future, where technology could create a utopian existence, in part brought on by the advent of inexpensive and easy to use wireless PCS phone service.

The original corporate logo contained a red rounded edge box with an antenna projecting out of the top right corner.

The second campaign, which ran after the company started service, featured a bright-pink computer-animated alien named Primetheus, who comes to Earth from planet Primeco, loses his "communicator" (which the Earthlings find and replicate), and then gets into various comical situations looking for it. The company set a new record for the number of subscribers signing up for service the first year. These campaigns were created by Dallas-based The Richards Group, and conceived by Creative Director Timothy Stapleton and Creative Director Brian Nadurak, now of Click Here.

AirTouch received takeover bids from Bell Atlantic, MCI, and finally Vodafone, which was the winner and merged with AirTouch in January 1999. Later the same year, Bell Atlantic approached Vodafone Airtouch about merging all three wireless operations (Bell Atlantic Mobile, AirTouch Cellular, and PrimeCo Communications) into a joint venture to be called Verizon Wireless. Due to FCC regulations regarding duplication of frequencies, the PrimeCo territories were split up with: most of the Gulf Coast going into Verizon Wireless, except in Houston, where Verizon Wireless retained 10 MHz of spectrum and the remaining 20 MHz were sold to AT&T Wireless;  Virginia and North Carolina territories sold to CFW Communications, a regional landline telecom provider since 1987, now operating under the name of nTelos; and the Midwest territories split up, with Wisconsin going into Verizon Wireless, and the Illinois and Indiana territories – like Houston – were disaggregated, with Verizon Wireless retaining 10 MHz of spectrum, and the remaining 20 MHz placed into a trust fund. The Illinois-Indiana PrimeCo territories were purchased by Clarity Partners, a Los Angeles–based private equity firm in 2001, who successfully improved the company's operations and later sold it to U.S. Cellular. PrimeCo's operations in Hawaii were sold to Sprint PCS in 1999.

Headquarters
When the company was founded, PrimeCo was headquartered in the Solana Office Complex in Westlake, Texas, a suburb of Fort Worth. The headquarters site was selected in 1995. In 1999 the parties splitting PrimeCo agreed that the former headquarters would become the headquarters of the PrimeCo operations taken over by Vodafone AirTouch. The later version of PrimeCo was headquartered in Itasca, Illinois.

Popular culture
PrimeCo was referenced in Lil' Troy's Wanna Be a Baller song with the lyric "Switched from Motorola to a PrimeCo phone". This was meant to reference the smaller phones allowed by digital cellular service.

title: PrimeCo


text:
Harrison's Cave

Harrison's Cave is a tourist attraction in the country of Barbados, first mentioned in 1795. Tourists can access the subterranean environment on a tramway.

History
The caves were first mentioned in historical documents in 1795, and were rediscovered in the early 1970s by Jack Peeples.

They were developed by the government as part of a tram tour, and opened to the public in 1981.

Description
Harrison's Cave is in the central uplands of Barbados. It is situated at 700 ft above sea level. The three characteristics of the central uplands are gullies, sinkholes and caverns. It is also an entrance for another place of interest: Welchman Hall Gully which is closed.

The caves are naturally formed by water erosion through the limestone rock. The calcium-rich water that runs through the caves have formed the unusual stalactites and stalagmites formations.

Travel through the caves is by tram, at certain points during the tour visitors are allowed to alight from the tram and get close up to the formations. One main area of the caves is a huge cavern, termed "The Great Hall", measuring over 50 feet in height. After the great Hall the tram stops at "The Village". At The Village, some of the formations have joined to form columns after thousands of years. Other areas the tram stops along the tour is "The Chapel," "The Rotunda," and "The Altar." Visitors travel through the Boyce Tunnel via tram to all depths of the cave.

title: Harrison's Cave


text:
User talk:Jcrwiki~enwiki

Welcome!

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! Samw 01:18, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
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Your account will be renamed
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The developer team at Wikimedia is making some changes to how accounts work, as part of our on-going efforts to provide new and better tools for our users like cross-wiki notifications. These changes will mean you have the same account name everywhere. This will let us give you new features that will help you edit and discuss better, and allow more flexible user permissions for tools. One of the side-effects of this is that user accounts will now have to be unique across all 900 Wikimedia wikis. See the announcement for more information.

Unfortunately, your account clashes with another account also called Jcrwiki. To make sure that both of you can use all Wikimedia projects in future, we have reserved the name Jcrwiki~enwiki that only you will have. If you like it, you don't have to do anything. If you do not like it, you can pick out a different name. If you think you might own all of the accounts with this name and this message is in error, please visit Special:MergeAccount to check and attach all of your accounts to prevent them from being renamed.

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Yours, Keegan Peterzell Community Liaison, Wikimedia Foundation 00:49, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

Renamed
 This account has been renamed as part of single-user login finalisation. If you own this account you can |log in using your previous username and password for more information. If you do not like this account's new name, you can choose your own using this form after logging in: . -- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 14:20, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Jcrwiki~enwiki


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Talk:List of commercial failures in video games

Google Stadia
Google Stadia deserves a spot on this list as many sources have commented on the system being a "failure" from at least late 2020/early 2021 onwards towards September 2022 (and its cancellation announcement); in terms of sales, reports and losses, a report from Bloomberg News states that Google missed both Stadia's controller sales target, and active use base count "by hundreds of thousands". ( https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-26/google-video-game-unit-stadia-struggled-to-be-googley-enough#xj4y7vzkg?leadSource=uverify%20wall from February 26, 2021). Also accounting for this is reports saying that Google lost money on making Stadia ports of AAA-games which cost the company "tens of millions" to port. There is also extensive coverage over Google's lack of communication over the Stadia, as well as reportedly closing its own development studio, Stadia Studios, due to the company being unwilling to invest in the company. (https://www.gamedeveloper.com/business/google-scrapped-stadia-studios-due-to-level-of-investment-required-to-reach-scale-say-ex-stadia-devs) There is plenty of critique of the console and comment on it being a failure in light of Google's scaling back of its support.

The only problem or question I have here is where abouts on this list should it go? While Stadia is a "cloud gaming service" which means no direct hardware is involved (unlike a console), peripherals and Google technologies i.e. Chromecasts and suitable tech were needed; also to mention how Stadia was sold with a "founders edition" with the controller, a Chromecast Ultra, which sort of places the "service" into hardware territory. Basically; Is it a hardware failure or a software failure?? While I'm more leaning towards it being a "hardware" thing due to the controller, box set and whatnot, I will settle for software if need be. Comments on where the Stadia fits in this are desperately needed here; thanks.Chchcheckit (talk) 19:08, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

 * I'd like to see more sources that are stating Google's own determination it was a failure rather than the estimates, but if it were to be added, I would definitely put it as Hardware, since it required the server-side aspects Google was to provide as well as the controller. M asem (t) 03:46, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * I'll see what I can find. ty. Chchcheckit (talk) 18:43, 4 October 2022 (UTC)
 * For what it's worth, during the closure announcement, Google stated that it "hasn't gained the traction with users that we expected". Does that count as Google's own determination?  Naruto love hinata 5 (talk · contributions) 13:57, 6 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Not as much though supports the idea. They could have been pulling a small profit but not as large as they expected, which would not be z commercial failure per se. M asem (t) 15:14, 6 October 2022 (UTC)

AC Valhalla should be on the list.
AC Valhalla was a complete failure in my mind and I played ET on atari, at least I didn't feel like I was abandoning anything with ET, but Valhalla is just functional enough that I feel like I'm just giving up on it because of the various mechanics issues not to mention the fact that it crashes regularly. 97.118.119.89 (talk) 13:09, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

Fallout 76?
Fallout 76 while a sucsess now, when it was released the game was horrible. It was harshly criticized, many people returned the game or tried to with no avail, and had to cut the price massivley to attempt to get people to buy the game. There also was many other fallout failures with the bag, and Nuka Cola Dark. Should we include this> Melofy (talk) 19:50, 15 February 2024 (UTC)

 * Do you have proof it was a commercial failure? The reception, refunds, etc don't mean anything in that regard. It seems unlikely that it's a commercial failure seeing as it remains under active support. -- ferret (talk) 19:54, 15 February 2024 (UTC)
 * F76 is listed on List of video games notable for negative reception. We have no idea if it was a financial flop though. M asem (t) 19:54, 15 February 2024 (UTC)

Two new entries
Can't add at immediate time but the Embracer based reboots of Alone in the Dark and Outcast failed to meet expectations. per IGN — M asem (t) 17:01, 23 May 2024 (UTC)


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User talk:Occuserpens

Welcome!

Hello,, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place  on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 01:19, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
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 * Thanks :-) Occuserpens 16:02, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Belarusian presidential election, 2006
Please, follow standart for the references formating. Thanks, --tasc 20:33, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Is that so hard to comprehend? --tasc 10:00, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Issues with <ref> tag
-- In general, this tag is significantly more complicated to use than plain []. In fact, [] is supposed to simplify HTML <a>, but <ref> is more complicated than <a>!

-- Checking correctness of [] is easy. Quite unfortunately, Show Preview does not seem to support the checks. But what if the link or formatting is wrong for some reason?

-- To go to the actual link in the ready text, <ref> needs 2 clicks, not 1 :-( I am sorry, but this is _extremely_ inconvenient!

-- In current events, the name of the source is especially important because news coverage of BBC, Fox, Itar TASS, Aljazeera, etc is very different. So, IMO, it makes sense to put the name of the source inside the article, not just in the separate Reference section. But this is not the way <ref> tag works.

-- Suppose there are lots of references in the article and we want to know what [17] refers to. Then it needs a special click - instead of just saying that this is Reuters.

-- All these problems are especially disturbing when current events are concerned - in this situation, maintenance of links is critical.

-- Contributor needs to do meaningful abstracting of the source and then incorporate the result into wiki entry. So, I really can't imagine how to do any serious work with current events using <ref> dorectly. IMHO, the initial contributor is simply too busy to get involved with this clumsy thing.

-- Manual of Style does not even mention <ref> for external linking.

Occuserpens 16:27, 25 March 2006 (UTC)
 * initial contributor busy? sorry, most of the text of your contributions is planly copied from corresponding sources. You don't have to be too busy, it's encyclopedia, not a newspaper. Manual is only a guideline, disputed and quite old. I personallyl think that there are too many links already in the article, i don't think that every word or citation should have web ref. the link for citation news sources is pretty easy . --tasc 18:50, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

IMO, Current events is much more than a newspaper, it is a brand new way to present news. So, this way needs to be as convenient as possible. The alternative is a blog where every news story is properly documented with title and link, for example (which is much simpler than ref tag).

Wiki entry looks better than linear blog because it is structured into sections. However, IMO, links to news stories are essential because otherwise the blog is better.

Anyway, I'd like to contribute these remarks on ref tag to wiki admin, but I don't know how.

Occuserpens 23:18, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Yuval Ne'eman
Hi, I need help with uploading his photo to the English value..http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%A7%D7%95%D7%91%D7%A5:Neman_yuval.jpg

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:05, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

title: User talk:Occuserpens


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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Ages of Ilathid

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was delete. Sjakkalle (Check!)  09:40, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)

The Ages of Ilathid
The Ages of Ilathid is an upcoming Myst fan game, being done legally with permission from Cyan Worlds. Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. Vanity, spam. Delete. - Mike Rosoft 01:19, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete: Unverifiable as it does not exist yet, and an extremely minor event that is not sufficiently notable to require an encyclopedia entry. Hie them to GameFAQs. Geogre 01:45, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep Some things are notable before their release, and the 8,480 Google hits suggest that this is one of them. My guess is that they wouldn't have been able to get an okay from Cyan unless they were seriously planning to release this and had something to show for their efforts.  I would certainly support deletion if this ends up being vaporware though. Andrew Lenahan - St ar bli nd  01:49, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
 * Merge and redirect to Myst. Split into its own article only when it actually exists.  -Sean Curtin 03:28, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete As of now, there's far to little information on it. I don't think there's a need to delete it persay because of SPAM or because it "doesn't belong in an encyclopedia" or whatever pretentious things one might hting, but I think it's currently too short to even be considered a stub. - 69.215.14.212 04:10, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Merge and redirect to Myst as per Sean Curtin. —Wahoofive (talk) 05:55, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * As is, this is an advertisment and a link to an external website. As such, I would vote delete.  If it were expanded into a proper article, dealing with the background to this Myst-expansion, I would reconsider the postion. --Simon Cursitor 07:10, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete for reasons given by nominator. Dpbsmith (talk) 19:26, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete until it exists. RickK 19:43, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. NeoJustin 20:14, June 7, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. Fan works have an incredible ability to be vaporware. --Carnildo 22:02, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete: fancruft. Wile E. Heresiarch 05:06, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Crystal ball. -Phantym 07:13, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages.  Please do not edit this page .


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User:Dkostic

My name is Dimitrije Kostiĉ (my parents are Serbian, which makes me a first-generation American!) and I'm a doctoral student in mathematics at Texas A&M. I'm a pretty busy guy, but if you've got something to say to me you can edit my discussion page.

Some articles I began: Richard P. Stanley (before I set up my account), Azzaman

title: User:Dkostic


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Talk:Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence

Metal Gear Saga Vol. 1
I just picked this up at my Gamestop tonight, so I imagine most places should have it by now. I have yet to watch it however, as my wife is currently watching a movie. But as soon as I am done watching it, I may (depending on how tired I am) create an article for it. Is anyone opposed to this? There is an article for The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2, so should there also be an article for this new addition? Agree, disagree? captbananas 04:26, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I think the current description in this article is good enough. The Document of MGS2 was interactive and had a _lot_ more features to explore, whereas this is just a 30-minute video chronicle of the series interspersed with interview bits. 24:19, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Create the article. It is supposed to reveal Kojima's intensions (according to the website) for the characters returning in Mgs4 and will explain more on MG 2: Solid snake. (The Bread 02:14, 12 March 2006 (UTC))

 * I did create the article (Saga Article, Redirecting to Subsistence), however it was merged (unfortunatly, and without asking) by another user (User:A Man In Black), to Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence. If someone wants to move it back, go ahead. But I wont personally (although I created the article) simply because it will look like i'm being stubborn . *sigh* captbananas 02:44, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Is there any reason I'm not aware of that it should be a separate article? Is the description of the disc going to get any longer? Is available except with Subsistence? - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:31, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

 * You dont get it WITH the game. The game has not yet been released. You only were able to get it with a pre-order of Subsistence (which are no longer being taken, considering its days away release), which severly limits its availability. captbananas 08:41, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I'm fully aware that it is included with preorders; I have my own copy from my own preorder. You're splitting hairs instead of answering my questions: Is there any reason I'm not aware of that it should be a separate article? Is the description of the disc going to get any longer? Is available except with Subsistence? - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:08, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

 * No, I suppose the DVD will not magically get any longer. However, it is titled "Volume One", which generally would mean there are supposed to be further volumes. So perhaps the "Saga" itself will at once point be a series of DVD's. But whatever, like I said above. I'm not going to move it back personally. You obviously felt that it needed to be moved. captbananas 04:05, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

 * In the event there are further volumes, then, if necessary, this can be merged out and an article about all of the Metal Gear Saga volumes could be made. In the meantime, it's just a pre-order bonus incapable of sustaining a standalone article. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 04:14, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The disc is not only available with Subsistence, and not only in North America. In Europe, it's scheduled to be released on March 23, bundled with the re-release of Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater, as a 2-disc set. I don't think creating an article for it was a bad idea - though what was there obviously needed work. I was actually thinking of doing it myself before it went up. There's additional info that can be included, like its Euro release as described above, and why it's named Vol. 1. - DoubleCross 04:32, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

 * If you notice, I did ask for help fixing up the article on the talk page. But no one did anything to it from the time I created it, untill it was merged (granted that was only a few days). Honestly, I dont know what else could have been added. captbananas 08:45, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Hmm, I knew Saga was coming out in Europe, but I thought it was going to be released with Subsistence. Apparently it's being released with the Platinum Hits version of MGS3: Snake Eater, instead. (As for being named Vol. 1, turns out it's wishful thinking on the part of the creator of the documentary, which is good to know.)

Well, I'm gonna merge Saga out again, then, but I'm not entirely sure it should stay that way. I've been considering merging Substance and Subsistence with their parent games for a while (I've already merged MGS: Integral into MGS), and if I did that, Saga would definitely go into the MGS3 article.

Then again, I really should be working on getting Metal Gear Solid up to at least GA status. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 04:48, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
 * In the midst of this cruftian debate, not a single one of you has bothered to adjust the mention of this Saga disc as being available prior to the actual release of the game, which apparently did not ship on the 14th to many places here in the US. If two of you were able to get the Saga disc then it needs to be mentioned that it isn't "bundled" with the limited edition of the game itself but it was instead given at the time of pre-order. 4.225.106.97 05:29, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
 * What that person is getting at is it should be listed as a pre-order incentive 4.224.165.155 10:47, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

 * If you actually read the article, it does say that it is already released. "It is included as a bonus for pre-orders." I.e. When you had a pre-order, you got it as a bonus. In general, you get pre-order bonuses BEFORE the game itself is released. When Silent Hill 4 was released, I got the official soundtrack as a bonus over a month in advance from the games release. And furthermore, instead of wagging your finger at us. Why dont you just fix it to your liking? Sheesh. captbananas 12:54, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The wording "bundled with pre-orders for Subsistence" does make it sound like the disc is included with the game itself for those who pre-ordered it. I am also wondering, though, why the anon editor couldn't be bothered to fix it, especially after taking the time to post about what others have(n't) bothered to do. - DoubleCross 21:07, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

when is this being released in aus?

European release date?
The article says under the release dates that Subsistence will be released in Europe on June 30th 2006.

What's the source on the release date?

SAA deflects bullets?
I've never had this done before. I twirl it around with tricks while a friend of mine shot at me with an XM16E1 in a SNEAKING mission on the mountaintop map. Unless someone says otherwise, I'm deleting that bit.

title: Talk:Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence


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Fondant icing

Fondant icing, also commonly just called fondant, is an icing used to decorate or sculpt cakes and pastries. It is made from sugar, water, gelatin, vegetable oil or shortening, and glycerol. It does not have the texture of most icings; rolled fondant is akin to modelling clay, while poured fondant is a thick liquid. The flavor is generally considered a weak point, as it is sweet and chalky. It is generally chosen for its appearance rather than the way it tastes.

The word, in French, means 'melting,' coming from the same root as fondue and foundry.

Rolled fondant
Rolled fondant, fondant icing, or pettinice, which is not the same material as poured fondant, is commonly used to decorate wedding cakes. Although wedding cakes are traditionally made with marzipan or royal icing, fondant is increasingly common due to nut allergies, as it does not require almond meal. Rolled fondant includes gelatin (or agar in vegetarian recipes) and food-grade glycerine, which keeps the sugar pliable and creates a dough-like consistency. Rolled fondant is rolled out like a pie crust and used to cover the cake. The result is a perfectly smooth surface that is well-suited for aesthetic expression, especially for complex shapes, such as large ruffles, that would be difficult to make with a softer icing. It also takes food coloring well.

Rolled fondant is very sweet but otherwise is not considered to taste good or to have an appealing texture. Some bakers who use it recommend against eating it.

Alternatives to rolled fondant include marzipan and mochi.

Types include:

 * Ready-made rolled fondant
 * Commercial, shelf-stable, pre-made rolled fondant often consists principally of sugar and hydrogenated oil. However, different formulations for commercial shelf-stable fondant are available and include other ingredients, such as sugar, cellulose gum, and water.

 * Marshmallow fondant
 * Marshmallow fondant is a form of rolled fondant often made and used by home bakers and hobbyists. Marshmallow fondant is made by combining melted shelf-stable marshmallows, water, powdered sugar, and solid vegetable shortening. Home bakers use this recipe for homemade fondant due to the readily available access to required ingredients.

 * Sculpting fondant
 * Sculpting fondant is similar to rolled fondant but with a stiffer consistency, which makes it a good sculpting material.

 * Sugar paste
 * Sugar paste, also called gum paste, is similar to rolled fondant, but hardens completely—and therefore is used for bigger cake decorations, such as bride and groom figures, bigger flowers, etc. Sugar paste is made mainly of egg whites, powdered sugar, and shortening. Tylose can be added to make gum paste more pliable for detailed work.

title: Fondant icing


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User:Runner06

Welcome Comments

title: User:Runner06


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Big Blue Bus

Big Blue Bus (stylized in lowercase) is a public transit agency that provides public bus services for the city of Santa Monica and the greater Westside region of Los Angeles County, California. The service, operated by the city of Santa Monica, was founded on April 14, 1928 and throughout its existence has used a blue color scheme for its buses, leading to the Big Blue Bus nickname that would later become the official name of the agency. In, the system had a ridership of , or about per weekday as of. Big Blue Bus receives funding from the Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority (Metro) and offers connections to its Metro Bus and Metro Rail systems, but is operated independently from Metro.

History
The agency was founded on April 14, 1928 as the Santa Monica Municipal Bus Lines and the agency picked a unique blue color scheme for its buses, later leading to the Big Blue Bus nickname. It holds the distinction of being the second oldest public transit bus system still operating in Los Angeles County; only the neighboring Culver CityBus (founded March 4, 1928) is older.

Santa Monica established the bus line in response to a fare increase on the Pacific Electric interurban trains between Santa Monica and Los Angeles.

While independent from other agencies in the Los Angeles area, the Big Blue Bus has always offered connections to the other systems, most notably near the intersections of Pico and Rimpau Boulevards in the Mid-City section of Los Angeles. The historic transfer point was established by Santa Monica, the Los Angeles Railway and Pacific Electric Railway and is known today as the Pico/Rimpau Transit Center and is used the Big Blue Bus and Metro Bus.

In 1978, Santa Monica became the first transit operator in California to operate a bus with a wheelchair lift, the Grumman-Flxible Model 870. It was the third agency to order the bus after Atlanta's MARTA, and Connecticut's CT Transit. The Big Blue Bus was one of the last transit agencies using the iconic GMC New Look "fishbowl" bus, the last of which was retired in 2005.

The Big Blue Bus has been honored with the American Public Transportation Association’s Outstanding Transportation System award in 1987, 1992, 1997, 2000 and 2011.

Routes
Big Blue Bus operates 18 bus lines: 12 regular routes, 4 rapid routes, and 2 circulator routes. On weekends and holidays with weekend service, the agency operates 10 bus lines: 9 regular routes and 1 rapid route.

The agency is currently undergoing a COA (Comprehensive Operational Analysis) which will inform service and route changes over the next five years. These aim to help the agency better connect with future Metro Rail extensions, most notably the D and K lines, adjust to new travel patterns, increase service frequency, and make service blocks compatible with a zero emissions bus fleet.

Local routes
Sunday schedules are operated on New Year's Day, Memorial Day, Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day and Christmas Day.

Bus fleet
Big Blue Bus currently maintains a fleet of 195 buses of various lengths including 29', 40', and 60' articulated, with 35-footers set to be delivered in 2025. In 2018, Big Blue Bus received its last ever internal combustion vehicle. 19 buses out of its total fleet are currently battery-electric. All buses feature destination signs. Newer buses (units 1801 and later) feature white LED destination signs, while older units feature a variety of other colors. The fleet is currently being equipped with passenger information displays in place of the older dot-light signs. These are part of a fleet-wide communications system replacement with Clever Devices systems. The new passenger displays currently feature a three-day weather forecast, upcoming stops with time to arrival, and the line's final destination. As part of this upgrade, electric buses also gain access to Clever's EV fleet integration software during the agency's transition to a zero-emissions fleet. This also enables vehicles to generate more frequent and accurate GPS data for tracking purposes, such as the Transit app. Buses 1808 and newer currently offer complementary onboard Wi-Fi. However, as part of the system upgrade program, older buses are also being equipped with Wi-Fi.

Big Blue Bus has evaluated two main options for zero-emissions propulsion of its buses in an effort to decarbonize its fleet by 2030. Both hydrogen fuel cell and battery-electric buses have been considered. The agency has determined that battery-electric buses can replace their CNG buses at current service levels with a 1:1 replacement ratio. Big Blue Bus is installing charging for 100+ buses at its depot using a canopy with overhead reel dispensers, a project set to be complete by the end of 2024. 2010 and 2011 El Dorado EZR II- BRT 32' CNG models are in need of replacement and are set to be replaced with 15 35-foot Gillig Low Floor Plus EV models. Moreover, Big Blue Bus' 2011 NABI LFW 40' and NABI BRT 60' units are nearing the end of their life expectancy and have already passed federal minimums by age.

Future and Electrification
Following the success of Big Blue Bus' pilot with a prototype Gillig/Cummins BEB (unit 1827), the agency committed to only purchasing zero-emission vehicles moving forward. Big Blue Bus charges its electric fleet with 100 percent renewable energy. The second batch of battery-electric buses are expected in 2025. The agency has set itself a 2030 deadline for full conversion to zero-emissions operation, which as of February 2023, it has determined it can achieve with exclusively battery-electric buses.

The agency is slated to replace vehicles as they reach the end of their useful service lives. Next to be replaced are El Dorado 32' BRT models, with delivery of replacement Gillig 35' Low Floor EVs slated for 2025. The agency's fleet of remaining NABI vehicles is the next group of buses to be replaced.

Due to dynamic service changes, the impact of the COVID-19 pandemic, and ridership changes, amongst other factors, the agency is pursuing a more dynamic fleet replacement timeline than that which was outlined in their original CARB document.

Incidents
On November 20, 2012, a Big Blue Bus turned left in front of an oncoming motorcyclist, which resulted in the 25-year-old man's death. The accident occurred at approximately 10:33 a.m. at the triangular intersection of Sunset Boulevard and Marquez in the Pacific Palisades. Only buses are allowed to make the left turn, a maneuver that has been determined to be too dangerous for other vehicles.

On June 7, 2013, Bus 4057 of Big Blue Bus was among several vehicles fired at during a thirteen-minute killing spree that left six people dead, including the gunman, and four others wounded. Three women suffered minor injuries aboard the bus, one from shrapnel-type injuries and the other two from injuries unrelated to the gunfire. Approximately two dozen people were inside the bus at the time of the shooting. The attack on Bus 4057 marked the first time a Big Blue Bus came under attack by a gunman in its 85-year service.

Speed
Two humorous slogans Santa Monica Bank used on Big Blue Buses appeared in the film Speed. The bus operator in the movie is called the Santa Monica Intercity Bus Lines, a fictionalized version of the Big Blue Bus's official name, the Santa Monica Municipal Bus Lines.

Raymond Chandler
In Raymond Chandler's novel Farewell, My Lovely, first published in 1940, he writes as protagonist Philip Marlowe, describing a scene in Bay City (Chandler's version of the City of Santa Monica):
 * "Outside the narrow street fumed, the sidewalks swarmed with fat stomachs. Across the street a bingo parlor was going full blast and beside it a couple of sailors with girls were coming out of a photographer's shop where they had probably been having their photos taken riding on camels. The voice of the hot dog merchant split the dusk like an axe. A big blue bus blared down the street to the little circle where the street car used to turn on a turntable. I walked that way."

Curb Your Enthusiasm
In the Curb Your Enthusiasm episode ”Namaste" (season 9, episode 7), Larry David is forced to catch a bus, an activity he is not accustomed to. The endeavor ends with Larry being kicked off the bus. The bus station is the Montana/San-Vincente station in Brentwood which serves lines 14 and 18.

The Doors
The lyric from The Doors song “The End” “The blue bus is calling us” is sometimes said to refer to the Big Blue Buses but according Ray Manzarek this is apocryphal.

title: Big Blue Bus


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User talk:Runner06

Welcome!

Hello,, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place  on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! -- Infrogmation 19:13, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Help pages
 * Tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Manual of Style

A tag has been placed on Alex Schmitz, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done for the following reason:

Already deleted once for lack of notability. Completely unreferenced and unsourced. Also, I reckon the gay bits are meant as a slur, though I could be wrong

Under the criteria for speedy deletion, articles that do not meet very basic Wikipedia criteria may be deleted at any time. Please see the guidelines for what is generally accepted as an appropriate article, and if you can indicate why the subject of this article is appropriate, you may contest the tagging. To do this, add  on the top of the page and leave a note on the article's talk page explaining your position. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the article that would confirm its subject's notability under the guidelines.

For guidelines on specific types of articles, you may want to check out our criteria for biographies, for web sites, for bands, or for companies. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this. Chris 16:27, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

title: User talk:Runner06


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Margaret Garner

Margaret Garner, called "Peggy" (died 1858), was an enslaved African American woman who killed her own daughter and intended to kill her other three children and herself rather than be forced back into slavery. Garner and her family had escaped enslavement in January 1856 by traveling across the frozen Ohio River to Cincinnati, but they were apprehended by U.S. Marshals acting under the Fugitive Slave Act of 1850. Garner's defense attorney, John Jolliffe, moved to have her tried for murder in Ohio, to be able to get a trial in a free state and to challenge the Fugitive Slave Law. Garner's story was the inspiration for the novel Beloved (1987) by Nobel Prize-winning author Toni Morrison and its subsequent adaptation into a film of the same name starring Oprah Winfrey (1998).

Early life
Garner, described as a mulatto, was born a house slave to the Gaines family of Maplewood plantation, Boone County, Kentucky. She may have been the daughter of the plantation owner John Pollard Gaines. In 1849 she married Robert Garner, an enslaved man. That December, the plantation and all the people enslaved there were sold to John P. Gaines's younger brother, Archibald K. Gaines. The Garners' first child, Thomas, was born early in 1850.

Three of Garner's younger children (Samuel, Mary, and Priscilla) were described as mulattoes; each was born five to seven months after a child born to Archibald Gaines and his wife. These light-skinned children were likely the children of Archibald Gaines, the only adult white male at Maplewood. The timing of the pregnancies suggests that the children were each conceived after Gaines's wife had become pregnant and was sexually unavailable to him.

In a contemporary account, abolitionist Levi Coffin described Margaret Garner at her arrest as "a mulatto, about five feet high ... she appeared to be about twenty-one or twenty-three years old." She also had an old scar on the left side of her forehead and cheek, which she said had been caused when a "White man struck me." Her two sons were about four and six years old, and her daughter Mary was two and a half, and baby girl Priscilla, an infant.

The escape
On January 28, 1856, Robert and Margaret Garner, who was pregnant, together with family members, escaped and fled to Storrs Township, a rural area just west of Cincinnati, along with several other enslaved families. Robert Garner had stolen his enslaver's horses and sleigh along with his gun. Seventeen people were reported to have been in their party. In the coldest winter in 60 years, the Ohio River had frozen. At daybreak, the group crossed the ice in Boone County, Kentucky, just west of Covington, and escaped to Storrs Township before dividing to avoid detection.

The Garners and their four children, with Robert's father Simon and his wife Mary, made their way to the home of Margaret's uncle Joe Kite, who had himself been formerly enslaved, and who lived along Mill Creek below Cincinnati. The other nine people in their party reached safe houses in Cincinnati and eventually escaped via the Underground Railroad to Canada. Kite went to abolitionist Levi Coffin for advice on how to get the group to safety. Coffin agreed to help them escape the city, and told Kite to take the Garner group further west of the city, where many free Black people lived, and to wait until night.

Slave catchers and U.S. Marshals found the Garners barricaded inside Kite's house before he returned. They surrounded the property and then stormed the house. Robert Garner fired several shots and wounded at least one deputy marshal. Margaret killed her two-year-old daughter Mary with a butcher's knife rather than see the child returned to slavery. She had wounded her other children, preparing to kill them and herself, when she was subdued by the posse.

Trial
The entire group was taken to jail. The subsequent trial lasted for two weeks, after which the judge deliberated another two weeks. It was "the longest and most complicated case of its kind." A typical fugitive slave hearing would have lasted less than a day. The core issue was whether the Garners would be tried as persons, and charged with the murder of their daughter, or tried as property under the Fugitive Slave Law. The defense attorney argued that Ohio's right to protect its citizens should take precedence. The slave catchers and owner argued for the precedence of federal law over the state.

The defense attempted to prove that Margaret Garner had been liberated under a former law covering slaves taken into free states for other work. Her attorney proposed that she be charged with murder so that the case would be tried in a free state (understanding that the Governor would later pardon her). The prosecuting attorney argued that the federal Fugitive Slave Law took precedence over state murder charges. Over a thousand people turned out each day to watch the proceedings, lining the streets outside the courthouse. Five hundred men were deputized to maintain order in the town.

The presiding judge, Pendery, ruled that Federal fugitive warrants had supervening authority. Defense attorney John Jolliffe then tried a strategy of arguing that the Fugitive Slave Act violated the guarantee of religious freedom, by compelling citizens to participate in evil by returning slaves. Pendery rejected this argument.

On the closing day of the trial, the antislavery activist Lucy Stone took the stand to defend her earlier conversations with Margaret (the prosecution had complained). She spoke about the interracial sexual relationship that underlay part of the case:

"Recalling to everyone's memory the faces of Margaret's children, and of A. K. Gaines, Stone told the packed courtroom: 'The faded faces of the Negro children tell too plainly to what degradation the female slaves submit. Rather than give her daughter to that life, she killed it. If in her deep maternal love she felt the impulse to send her child back to God, to save it from coming woe, who shall say she had no right not to do so?'"

Margaret Garner's actions were driven by her master's abuse and the well known abuse slaves faced nationwide. Women were known to commit infanticide to alleviate the burden of slavery from their children; however, in Garner's case her children faced even more oppression due to their being mulattos. Mulattos were seen as a threat as well as a disgrace among the plantation and white families because the birth of mulatto children highlighted infidelity within the slave-owning families. They reminded the family of a perceived sin, and were often beaten or sold. Garner underwent drastic measures to protect her child not only from the cruelty of the institution of slavery but from the double threat, due to the child's mulatto status.

Margaret Garner was not immediately tried for murder but was forced to return to a slave state along with Robert and their youngest child, a daughter of about nine months old. When Ohio authorities got an extradition warrant for Garner to try her for murder, they were unable to find her for the arrest. Archibald K. Gaines, her enslaver, kept moving her between cities in Kentucky.

Sent south and death
Ohio officials missed finding Margaret in Covington by a few hours, missed apprehending her again in Frankfort, and finally caught up with her enslaver in Louisville, only to discover that he had put the enslaved people on a boat headed for his brother's plantation in Arkansas. The Liberator reported that, on March 6, 1856, the steamboat Henry Lewis, on which the Garners were being transported, began to sink after colliding with another boat. Margaret Garner and her baby daughter were either thrown overboard during the collision or, according to an alternate account, Garner deliberately jumped overboard after tossing her baby into the river. The baby drowned. It was reported that Margaret expressed "frantic joy" that her baby had died, and that she had tried to drown herself. She and Robert were kept in Arkansas only a short time before being sent to Gaines' family friends in New Orleans as a household servant. The Garners then disappeared from sight.

In 1870, a reporter from The Cincinnati Chronicle found Robert Garner and gathered more about his life. Robert and Margaret Garner had worked in New Orleans, and in 1857 were sold to Judge Dewitt Clinton Bonham for plantation labor at Tennessee Landing, Mississippi. Robert said Margaret had died in 1858 of typhoid fever, in an epidemic in the valley. He said that before she died, Margaret urged him to "never marry again in slavery, but to live in hope of freedom."

Memorialized
Garner's life story was the basis of Frances Harper's 1859 poem "Slave Mother: A Tale of Ohio". She also inspired Kentucky painter Thomas Satterwhite Noble's 1867 painting, The Modern Medea; Medea was a woman in Greek mythology who killed her own children. The painting, owned by Cincinnati manufacturer Procter and Gamble Corporation, was presented as a gift to the National Underground Railroad Freedom Center, where it remains on permanent display.

Garner's life also inspired Toni Morrison to write her Pulitzer Prize-winning novel Beloved (1987). Morrison also wrote the libretto for the opera Margaret Garner (2005), composed by Richard Danielpour.

Other fiction writing inspired by Garner's story includes John Jolliffe's Belle Scott (1856), N. K. Jemisin's The Fifth Season (2015), and K. A. Simpson's A Coven's Lament (2017).

Robert Dafford's mural "The Flight of the Garner Family" depicts the group crossing the frozen Ohio River. Painted on a floodwall beneath the John A Roebling Suspension Bridge in Covington, Kentucky, the mural is part of an 18-image series depicting events from Cincinnati and Northern Kentucky history.

title: Margaret Garner


text:
Bluecoats Drum and Bugle Corps

The Bluecoats Drum and Bugle Corps, or simply The Bluecoats, is a World Class competitive drum and bugle corps. Based in Canton, Ohio, the Bluecoats are a member corps of Drum Corps International (DCI). The Bluecoats were the 2016 Drum Corps International World Class Champions.

History
The Bluecoats Drum and Bugle Corps was founded in 1972 by Canton businessman Art Drukenbrod and Canton Police officers "Babe" Stearn and Ralph McCauley (the head and assistant directors of the Canton Police Boys' Club). The corps members chose the name both because of their sponsorship and to honor the city's police officers, particularly those who had retired from the ranks. The corps made its competition debut in 1974 and, in their first major show, finished thirty-second of thirty-seven corps in the U.S. Open Class A prelims in Marion, Ohio. The corps improved year by year, and began touring in both the U.S. and Canada and making U.S. Open finals in 1976, taking second place in 1977 and third in 1978. The Bluecoats made their first DCI appearance in Denver, Colorado in 1977, scoring thirty-fifth place among forty-five corps.

Although the corps was maturing musically, it was struggling to survive financially. In 1979, the corps only performed at local parades, as it attempted to reorganize its financial situation. With the return to the field in 1980, the corps was competitive in Class A competitions but only managed a thirty-eighth-place finish of the forty-four corps performing in Open Class at the DCI World Championships. In the next two seasons, the corps attempted to compete exclusively in Open Class, but they met with small success. In 1983, it was announced that the Bluecoats Drum and Bugle Corps would cease operations.

At the time that the corps' folding was announced, present-day corps President Scott Swaldo was a marching member. When he told his father, Canton industrialist Ted Swaldo, the elder Swaldo took over as director. Under the new director, the corps returned to the field after only a one-year hiatus. As a full-fledged Open Class corps, the Bluecoats improved with each passing year until, in 1987, the corps became the first corps from Ohio to earn a place in the DCI World Championship finals, finishing in eleventh place. Since then, the corps has failed to make finals only once in 1999.

In 2010, the corps medaled for the first time at the DCI World Championships, taking the bronze with their production "Metropolis: The Future Is Now". In 2014, they once again took home the silver medal for their show "TILT", which is now cited as one of the most influential shows in the marching arts.

In 2016, the Bluecoats won first place in World Class Finals, becoming only the tenth corps to be DCI Champions since the competition began in 1972. The winning show, "Down Side Up", earned the corps' highest score (at the time) of 97.650 while winning the General Effect and Music captions. For 2016, the Bluecoats abandoned their traditional uniforms in favor of a more informal costume designed with the show's near-constant motion in mind; the brass and percussion wore white and the color guard yellow, both with a swirling, sequined blue accent stripe running from the left hand to the shoulder, across the chest, and down the right leg; Bluecoats also became the first corps to win the DCI title while not wearing any type of headgear. This trend of non-traditional uniforms has continued since then, and has been emulated by numerous other corps since.

At the 2019 DCI World Championships, the Bluecoats came second place while scoring the corps' highest ever score of 98.238. Post-COVID the activity resumed competitions in 2022 with Bluecoats landing in 2nd place for the third time since 2014. They also attained medalist standing for the sixth time in seven competition years, a feat to which only one other corps can currently attest.

Celebrating its 50th anniversary in 2022, the organization also produced an Alumni Corps that performed at the Drum Corps International semi-finals.

Show summary (1974–2024)
Source:

Caption awards
At the annual World Championship Finals, Drum Corps International (DCI) presents awards to the corps with the high average scores from prelims, semifinals, and finals in five captions. The Bluecoats have won these captions:

Don Angelica Best General Effect Award
 * 2016, 2019

Fred Sanford Best Percussion Performance Award

 * 2022

Blooooo...
At the Bluecoats first appearance at DCI Finals in 1987, their over-the-top arrangement of the "Autumn Leaves" brought forth the spontaneous long shouts from the audience of "Bloooo..."– a crowd reaction that began with one former member during the 1985 and 1986 seasons and amplified by Drum Corps Midwest announcer Joe Bruno and grew throughout the 1987 season. This has since come to be the audience's traditional greeting as the corps enters the field and response as they finish their show, which has become one of the most recognizable acts of audience participation in the drum corps activity.

Corps song
The Bluecoats' corps song is, "Autumn Leaves", which became the corps' song after the 1987 season, in honor of the corps making its first Finals appearance. The song has remained a part of the corps' repertoire since 1987, and it reappeared in their 1988 and 1998 shows.

Home show
Like most drum corps, the Bluecoats hold an annual home show near their hometown, usually in Massillon, Ohio. Through 2018 it was a local tradition that the Bluecoats' home show is a part of the induction festivities for Pro Football Hall of Fame, which is located in Canton. In 2019, the corps performed during halftime for the Pro Football Hall of Fame Game.

title: Bluecoats Drum and Bugle Corps


text: User talk:70.20.114.166

title: User talk:70.20.114.166


text: User talk:69.231.165.51

title: User talk:69.231.165.51


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Japanese expansion in mainland Asia

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was No consensus to delete. The article should be merged to Japanese nationalism. Zzyzx11 (Talk) 03:42, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Japanese_expansion_in_mainland_Asia
Article is very poorly written and is more a nationalistic justification than historical facts. Another similar article is much better written and sufficient. UnHoly 01:27, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Merge and redirect both to Japanese nationalism. Both articles are messy and POV.   — Gwalla | Talk 01:41, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Japanese nationalism; honestly, I don't see what there is to merge. Geogre 01:46, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Merge both to Japanese nationalism. JamesBurns 07:21, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Japanese nationalism. Nothing worth keeping here that isn't far more authoritatively discussed in that article. However, I would Keep Japanese strategic planning for mainland Asia (1905-1940), which is not about ideology per se but about military strategy. carmeld1 20:06, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, or at the very least redirect to Japanese nationalism. Very unlikely someone would search for something this specific anyway. Ridethefire3211 21:38, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * It is linked to on Japanese strategic planning for mainland Asia (1905-1940) under "Analizes over Japanese Expansion in Asia Mainland". UnHoly 18:52, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Not written in the English language. -EDM 23:06, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete...reluctantly. I've been involved in cleaning up this contributor's articles in the past.  This contributor is a spanish speaker translating Japanese text into bad english.  That process, coupled with additional "translation" involved in the english cleanup calls into serious question the integrity of the information.  Single-step translation is hard enough.  I believe this person is contributing in good faith, but that the integrity of the final content is highly questionable.   This contributor is highly prolific and we'll continue to see his articles here at VfD, I fear. Tobycat 05:46, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. One of the worst written articles that I have seen recently. -Willmcw 09:26, Jun 12, 2005 (UTC)

SirTobycat ,and some others i stay agreed much for understand my real intentions,still my some english grammar difficult.over present article,yours can to decided,if liked,deleted this...

for certain i no encounter why when your realizing the profounds cleanups at information why sended,this are non losses of the real escence of these dates,at contrary these escence if mantain intact,(i can to comparing with original sources) and i liked to read and understand perfect your reedition,and i appareing more interests and easy to understand.for me stay more well..

If certain i in my limits treated to send somes dates and first hand informations of previous wartimes about Japan for see in japanese position and you think manners in these moment,and additional somes dates of japanese side in pacific war.

Reiterally i no poses any imagination or great capacity to inventive for created all type of cyphers or social and military details,more less inside of japanese side or from these times.

i reconoited why if certain why poses more limits in english,but i observed why always in all parts,if one require obtain any really and very detail information,always stay in english, the Universal Lingua Franca.these information stay more limited or never exist in any other languages always stay more detail in english. for other part the most important experts in any theme or topic,or the mosts important analisis of any topics...for suppose stayed in english,one situation no encountered in another languages,for this certain themes can t understand in other languages,all in english.

in personally i sende more hate for statisticts or numbers or any cyphers groups,or all great mass of dates,but in particulary respect at Japanese side before and ww2, i sense particulary more simpathy and over my personal hate,disagree or disdain respect at statistics or dates i having decide to sended these first hand and ancient dates of ancient japanese times,more oftheirs are forgetting or some remembered for persons why living in these times only.

other special interest stay in why i in past years one old parent sayed at my,over one acient parent why at final result no chinese,without one Japanese Nikkei why are little merchant,one thing why causing in me more prided,and remember somes japanese friends why stayed for work reasons in my land and poses some personal friendship.

other personal reason if i entered why between the Japanese Plans against Panama Canal(I-400 Mission), ones parents knowed ones suppose Japanese fishers, but results why theirs poses short wave radios and stay in comunication with Japanese Navy officer Jakuji Oshi and the submarine I-9 poses orders to patrol Panama Gulf waters for reconoited areas.

this if my principal founts of my incredible and highly questionable or dudous information over General Japanese civil andMilitary comments:

General sources:(oldest editions of 40s to 60s)

 * Cressey,G.B.Peoples and lands of Asia
 * Scion,Jules. Asie des Moussons(english edition)
 * Behr,Edward.The Last Emperor
 * Book Asia,the great Continent
 * Newman, Joseph. "Goodbye Japan"
 * Whitney Hall, John."Japanese Empire"
 * Gonzales-Hontoria,M.African and Asian States(Estados Asiaticos y Africanos)

over Chinese japanese War comments if my sources:

 * Max,Alphonse.Southwest Asia,Reality and Destiny.
 * American First-hand and Chinese side relate "China In Weapons" or "China in Arms" about chinese-japanese conflict. unsigned comment (vote?) by

 * Hi,200.46.215.181
 * The grammar is not the main reason I posted this article on the votes for deletion. I appreciate that people from all around the world want, and should, continue to collaborate to wikipedia. I myself am french-speaking, and you are right, it is difficult to stay on the frech wikipedia when almost all articles are more complete in english.
 * However, the problem with this particular article is that it is a justification of japanese nationalism and not a neutral description of events. I do not think this is justified in an encyclopedia.
 * For example, you say "this if motif for Russian-Japanese War of 1904-05,for why obtain some concessions socalled "Treated Rigths" in South Manchuria.in 1910,Korea having formally annexed,during first decades of century the territorial security are principal military motif." The way I read this, you imply that Japan had all rights to gain concessions in South Manchuria. This is a one-sided analysis.
 * If you want to try to re-write this article, you should at least cite sources, and put your sentences in the form "according to xxx, ...". But even then, it should be included in Japanese nationalism, which is where it belongs. We do not need separate articles for different opinions on the same subject.
 * I hope I have the chance to read more of your work in the future,
 * UnHoly 19:19, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)

to present the japanese point of seeing,for comparing and analized your think at respect,with historical pourposes.
 * -if one interested and logic point,but in particular i treated

respect at much reading of my work,i am readed the material analized and writing the importants parts,(exist much informations) and still my grammar deficiences i understand your english writing form with correct gramar in clear form.

respect at another sides of question,for all exist the respectives analizes why present your respective side.i am no treated to enter in conflict with any side,i only treated to present the japanese viewpoint for knowed the respective ideas in these times,more diffrent at present days.

reiterally if your desired deleted,i no poses any problem for this. if part of the sistem and understand more well.

''

 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages.  Please do not edit this page .


text:
Talk:List of Chinese administrative divisions by GDP per capita

PPP
The page lists PPP GDP per capita for Hong Kong and Macau based on the notion that 2 renminbi are roughly equal to $1. On average this is true across the entirety of China, but it is spectacularly untrue in Hong Kong (and I would assume but do not know in Macau). I'm inclined to remove the notes about PPP, but I will leave this for comments first. --Jsolinsky 01:27, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * The Renminbi isn't used in Hong Kong though. But I do agree that PPP is somewhat unreliable since living costs vary from region to region. -- ran (talk) 18:56, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm going to remove the use of renminbi to describe PPP amounts unless somebody comes up with a reference to how currencies can be converted in PPP. It just doesn't make any sense to talk about conversions between national currencies in PPP$. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jsolinsky (talk • contribs) 12:17, December 19, 2005 (UTC).

After editing the GDP PPP for Beijing and Shanghai, I noticed that the ratios to nominal were not the same for the two. Beijing is 1.6 something, Shanghai is 1.8 something. Can someone clear up this discrepancy?Chironares (talk) 05:13, 11 May 2010 (UTC)

Fujian
Does the figure for Fujian exclude Quemoy, Wuchiu, Matsu, etc.? — Instantnood 19:10, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

There is no reason for this list to include the ROC as a separate administrative division of the PRC, the ROC claims the entirety of China (as well as Mongolia). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.108.101.129 (talk) 16:03, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Tibet???? —Preceding unsigned comment added by PhDStudent (talk • contribs) 21:36, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Regarding PPP conversion
The previous practice of converting HK, MO and TW rates to Yuan doesn't make sense, because:

 * The conversion from HK$, MO$ and NT$ to US$ is by PPP;
 * But the conversion from US$ to RMB is by exchange rate.

As a result, those figures cannot be used as a basis for comparison.

What I'm doing instead is:

 * The conversion from HK$, MO$ and NT$ to US$ is by PPP;
 * The conversion from RMB to US$ is also by PPP.

This way the figures can be compared to each other, while acknowledging issues like different prices in different regions, etc.

-- ran (talk) 00:08, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

PPP for Shanghai, Beijing
It is doubtful that PPP rates for the Shanghai	and Beijing are the same as for the rest of the country. Using the same coefficient for these areas is likely to overestimate the PPP. Is there any specific data available for the cost of living in these cities? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.206.66.120 (talk) 22:40, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

About a Chinese provinces map
I don't know if this map is appropriate or not. Paracel and Spratly Islands is still a territorial disputes with many country if put it in map it just like propaganda that Islands belong to China.Tnt1984 (talk) 15:41, 27 May 2011 (UTC)

Don't use PPP this way
China doesn't produce provincial-level PPP data, and neither to international agencies. Hence, this is purely original research, and therefore inappropriate for Wikipedia.

Recommend for deletion.

DOR (HK) (talk) 02:37, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

Inflation
How is inflation handled with this data? PPP comparisons over time require some sort of inflation adjustment. These numbers seem to have been adjusted, but the method is not listed. If no adjustment was made, then calculated growth rates will be exaggerated. Plutologist (talk) 19:26, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

Taiwan
Is there any reason why Taiwan has been removed from this page? I wanted to see comparative stats between the ROC and PRC provinces. The header clearly states Taiwan is under a separate government so I see no reason why the data should not be included here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 175.113.46.93 (talk) 03:14, 22 October 2013 (UTC)

Shenzhen
How come the list does not include Shenzhen? Moreover, the introduction says Hong Kong and Macao are included for comparison but they are not in the tables. Either the sentence should be removed or the data included. Maybe the title could clearly state that this is about cities in mainland China.--Ghormax (talk) 01:59, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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gdp of every province added to be about 86000 not 82000. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 112.80.111.112 (talk) 19:37, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

stat
gdps of every province added to be about 86000 not 82000. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 112.80.111.112 (talk) 19:38, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

Inclusion of Taiwan
Since "Taiwan" has been added and removed from this article, as well as related articles, it would be good if we could get consensus as to its inclusion or exclusion. It seems to me that it is reasonable to include it as long as there are clear disclaimers that it is governed by the ROC and not the PRC. This is in the spirit of neutrality for a disputed territory, and it also seems reasonable that anyone wanting to know this data for provinces of the PRC would likely also be interested to know the same data for Taiwan for comparison purposes. I know that this information is certainly of interest to me. As long as there are clear disclaimers, I don't think it seems political or confusing to include Taiwan. What do others think? Vontheri (talk) 23:27, 1 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Many people (especially Chinese people) think Taiwan is Indivisible territory of China. That makes things different. Since this case is approved, we can see Taiwan has been added on the list anything involved with the GDP statistics of China. --Beta Lohman (talk) 09:35, 6 June 2019 (UTC)