text:
Talk:Naga fireball

More explanation
I felt that the article needed a better explanation on the makeup and possible causes of the fireballs.

I found this information:

"But, on the other hand, science has challenged folk belief in the fireballs and fired a controversy. It began with skepticism by one of Nong Khai’s own citizens, Dr. Manas Kanoksilpa, who for a decade has conducted scientific experiments to explain the fireball phenomenon. Dismissing a human hand in their creation (a charge initially levelled at the villagers), he says that the Bang Fai Phaya Nak are globules of methane and nitrogen formed from decomposed organic matter trapped in pools deep beneath the Mekong. When the balls break the water’s surface, they self-combust and remain alight until they eventually run out of fuel and fade. This is the explanation generally given for the formation of swamp gas and will-o’-the-wisp.

In 2002, the Ministry of Science and Technology appointed a committee of experts to study the issue. The team collected soil and water samples, developed a submarine robot to probe the riverbed, and set up eight gas-collecting and gas-monitoring stations in swamps and rivers where sightings had been reported. After a two-year study, they concurred with Dr. Manas that the fireballs are caused by the sun warming organic matter on the riverbed, causing it to decompose into flammable phosphine and methane gas and combust in the presence of ionised atomic oxygen. This explains why the fireballs are of uniform colour, do not emit flares, smoke or sound, and eventually dissipate without a trace."

more info here: http://www.tatnews.org/emagazine/2215.asp — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.67.1.52 (talk) 23:19, 14 June 2005 (UTC)

Merge with Nāga
It has been proposed that Phaya Naga be merged with Nāga. I'm greatly in favor of a merger, even to include Naga fireballs, as it would help greatly in editing Rocket Festival and Funan. But then there's that paranormal tag.... I've been told by someone who has been there that the event is just a tourist draw on the Thai side, but on the Lao side, still an event imbued with religious awe, which should rate this article a Buddhist swastika.Lee 16:46, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Disagree. While I am in favor of the Phaya Naga and Nāga merger, which makes sense because Phaya Naga is duplicative, I feel the Naga fireballs is a unique enough phenomenon on its own to warrant its own article. How does merging the fireballs article with Nāga help in the editing of Rocket Festival and Funan? Perhaps Naga fireballs could even be expanded? — WiseKwai 18:56, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Agree with Disagree. It wouldn't help all that much. Pawyilee 03:52, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Removed line
"While local adherents of the legend insist they have personally seen these fireballs or know others who have, scientific discussion of the phenomenon is frowned upon and can cause considerable anger."

I removed this line as the ending seemed quite odd for an encyclopedia. "can cause considerable anger." that seems a bit dodgy. What do you lot thing? Mishka Shaw (talk) 22:56, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

True, or at least Alleged Explanation as per Film
The film Mekhong Full Moon Party should be linked here. 85.179.244.59 (talk) 15:15, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 00:46, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Article does not discuss religious context
Currently, this article does not discuss the religious context of the beliefs associated with Nagas at the Mekong river, either Buddhist or animist. The article seems to push a skeptic POV, immediately jumping to debunk report, without discussing the religious and social context of the festival sufficiently.--Farang Rak Tham (talk) 13:37, 9 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Can you point to where the source is? The article already covers the "naga fireball" phenomenon and the skeptic POV comes from the majority of the evidence which, so far, indicates that there is no mythical creature living in the river and most likely caused by man. So I would like to remove the POV template until you address my points. --Horus (talk) 03:56, 20 August 2017 (UTC)
 * , at WP:DETAG, it is recommended that an uninvolved editor remove a tag on an article page. To remove it yourself, without waiting discussion, goes against established practice.
 * I am not saying you should find a source that defends the existence of the phenomenon, but rather that you discuss its place in Buddhist or Thai history. You could first discuss the role of nāgas in Buddhism, from a historical perspective, before proceeding to a debunking section. Try for example the Encyclopedia of Buddhism by Buswell, or the Princeton Dictionary of Buddhism. You can download both from the reference list at Faith in Buddhism. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia that provides context and should give an overview of all views and perspectives. It is not a debunking website from a sceptics' society.--Farang Rak Tham (talk) 05:22, 20 August 2017 (UTC)
 * Why do you think a sentence "The phenomenon is named after the Phaya Naga, legendary serpentine creatures said to live in the Mekong." is not enough? To discuss the role of nagas in Buddhism is not necessary at all. At best you can include folklore about "Maekong naga", not just any nagas. And when you said Wikipedia is not "a debunking website from a sceptics' society", I would like to remind you that Wikipedia summarized from sources available and minority views are included just proportionally. You can insert your view with secondary sources here but to tag the article as "unfair" is too far. --Horus (talk) 08:28, 23 August 2017 (UTC)
 * , I do not think you need to cite minority views. The sentence "The phenomenon is named after the Phaya Naga, legendary serpentine creatures said to live in the Mekong." is exactly the sort of information I meant, but it is not much. You could relate more about how the cult arose. I am not saying you should start talking about the possibility that naga fireballs actually exist, since there are no secondary sources about that anyway. I am just saying describe the phenomenon more before you proceed to debunking it.--Farang Rak Tham (talk) 11:01, 23 August 2017 (UTC)
 * From what I understand, you are trying to say that the article should have substantial text describing the phenomenon and then proceed to debunk it. Well to be fair to the majority view, there is no need. You can tag the article as incomplete and wait for some supporters to write it themselves and it would be more acceptable. --Horus (talk) 17:22, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

, I wonder who the "majority view" is, and who the "supporters" are. Anyway, fair enough, I have added another kind of tag.--Farang Rak Tham (talk) 20:04, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

title: Talk:Naga fireball


text:
User talk:Joebwan

Welcome
Hello , and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! You (Talk) 23:20, Jun 14, 2005 (UTC)
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title: User talk:Joebwan


text: User talk:69.204.80.21

title: User talk:69.204.80.21


text:
Virtual representation

Virtual representation was the idea that the members of Parliament, including the Lords and the Crown-in-Parliament, reserved the right to speak for the interests of all British subjects, rather than for the interests of only the district that elected them or for the regions in which they held peerages and spiritual sway. Virtual representation was the British response to the First Continental Congress in the American colonies. The Second Continental Congress asked for representation in Parliament in the Suffolk Resolves, also known as the first Olive Branch Petition. Parliament claimed that their members had the well being of the colonists in mind. The Colonies rejected this premise.

American War of Independence
In the early stages of the American Revolution, colonists in the Thirteen Colonies rejected legislation imposed upon them by the Parliament of Great Britain because the colonies were not represented in Parliament. According to the British constitution, colonists argued, taxes could be levied on British subjects only with their consent. Because the colonists were represented only in their provincial assemblies, they said, only those legislatures could levy taxes in the colonies. This concept was famously expressed as "No taxation without representation".

Development
During the winter of 1764–1765, British MP George Grenville and his lieutenant, Thomas Whately, attempted to explicitly articulate a theory that could justify the lack of representation in colonial taxation. Grenville and Whately's theory, known as "virtual representation" put forth that, just like the vast majority of British citizens who could not vote, the colonists were nonetheless virtually represented in Parliament. Thus Grenville defended all the taxes by arguing that the colonists were virtually represented in Parliament, a position that had critics on both sides of the British Empire. Parliament rejected any criticism that virtual representation was constitutionally invalid as a whole, and passed the Declaratory Act in 1766, asserting the right of Parliament to legislate for the colonies "all cases whatsoever."

Reaction
The idea of virtual representation "found little support on either side of the Atlantic" as a means of solving the constitutional controversy between colonists and Britons. William Pitt, a defender of colonial rights, ridiculed virtual representation, calling it "the most contemptible idea that ever entered into the head of a man; it does not deserve serious refutation." Pitt said to the House of Commons in 1766, "It is my opinion, that this kingdom has no right to lay a tax upon the colonies...The taxes are a voluntary gift and grant of the Commons alone...When, therefore, in this House we give and grant, we give and grant what is our own. But in an American tax, what do we do? "We, your majesty’s Commons for Great Britain, give and grant to your majesty"—what? Our own property! No! "We give and grant to your majesty" the property of your majesty’s Commons of America! It is an absurdity in terms...There is an idea in some that the colonies are virtually represented in the House. I would fain know by whom an American is represented here. Is he represented by any knight of the shire, in any county in this kingdom? Would to God that respectable representation was augmented to a greater number! Or will you tell him that he is represented by any representative of a borough?—a borough which, perhaps, its own representatives never saw! This is what is called the rotten part of the Constitution. It can not continue a century. If it does not drop, it must be amputated." Pitt then stated to Parliament that, "I myself would have cited the two cases of Chester and Durham...to show that, even under former arbitrary reigns, Parliaments were ashamed of taxing a people without their consent, and allowed them representatives...[A] higher example [might be found] in Wales—Wales that never was taxed by Parliament till it was incorporated. Pitt pointed out that, unlike the "India company, merchants, stockholders, [and] manufacturers" who "have it in their option to be actually represented...have connections with those that elect, and...have influence over them," the colonists had no such option, connections or influence.

Benjamin Franklin told the House of Commons that, "I know that whenever taxation has occurred in conversation where I have been present, it has appeared to be the opinion of every one that we could not be taxed by a Parliament wherein we were not represented...An external tax is a duty laid on commodities imported; that duty is added to the first cost and other charges on the commodity, and, when it is offered for sale, makes a part of the price. If the people do not like it at that price, they refuse it; they are not obliged to pay it. But an internal tax is forced from the people without their consent if not laid by their own representatives. The Stamp Act says we shall have no commerce, make no exchange of property with each other, neither purchase nor grant, nor recover debts; we shall neither marry nor make our wills, unless we pay such and such sums; and thus it is intended to extort our money from us or ruin us by the consequence of refusing to pay it." James Otis Jr. reasoned that the legal liberties of British subjects meant that Parliament should, or could, only tax the colonists if they were actually represented in Westminster.

At the time of the American Revolution, only England and Wales and Scotland were directly represented in the Parliament of Great Britain among the many parts of the British Empire. The colonial electorate perhaps consisted of 10% to 20% of the total population, or 75% of adult males. In Britain, by contrast, representation was highly limited due to unequally distributed voting constituencies and property requirements; only 3% of the population, or between 17% and 23% of males, could vote and they were often controlled by local gentry.

As virtual representation was founded on "a defect in the Constitution of England," namely, the "Want of a Full Representation of all the People of England," it was, therefore, a pernicious notion that had been fabricated for the sole purpose of arguing the colonists "out of their civil Rights." The colonists, and some Britons, consequently condemned the idea of virtual representation as "a sham". Moreover, the poor state of representation in Britain "was no excuse for taxing the colonists without their consent."

Daniel Dulany Jr.
In his influential 1765 pamphlet, Considerations on the Propriety of Imposing Taxes in the British Colonies, Daniel Dulany Jr. of Maryland likewise observed that attempting to tax subjects on the inequitable basis of "virtual" representation was unsound because, "The situation of the non-electors in England—their capacity to become electors — their inseparable connection with those who are electors, and their representatives—their security against oppression resulting from this connection, and the necessity of imagining a double or virtual representation, to avoid iniquity and absurdity, have been explained—the inhabitants of the colonies are, as such, incapable of being electors, the privilege of election being exerciseable only in person, and therefore if every inhabitant of America had the requisite freehold, not one could vote, but upon the supposition of his ceasing to be an inhabitant of America, and becoming a resident of Great-Britain, a supposition which would be impertinent, because it shifts the question—should the colonies not be taxed by parliamentary impositions, their respective legislatures have a regular, adequate, and constitutional authority to tax them, and, therefore, there would not necessarily be an iniquitous and absurd exemption, from their not being represented by the House of Commons. There is not that intimate and inseparable relation between the electors of Great-Britain, and the inhabitants of the colonies, which must inevitably involve both in the same taxation; on the contrary, not a single actual elector in England might be immediately affected by a taxation in America, imposed by a statute which would have a general operation and effect, upon the properties of the inhabitants of the colonies. The latter might be oppressed in a thousand shapes, without any sympathy, or exciting any alarm in the former. Moreover, even acts, oppressive and injurious to the colonies in an extreme degree, might become popular in England, from the promise or expectation, that the very measures which depressed the colonies, would give ease to the inhabitants of Great-Britain."

Dulany Jr. also wrote that, "the Impropriety of a Taxation by the British Parliament...[is proven by] the Fact, that not one inhabitant in any Colony is, or can be actually or virtually represented by the British House of Commons." Dulany Jr. denied that Parliament had a right "to impose an internal Tax upon the Colonies, without their consent for the single Purpose of Revenue."

James Otis Jr.
In 1764, the Massachusetts politician James Otis Jr. said that, "When the parliament shall think fit to allow the colonists a representation in the house of commons, the equity of their taxing the colonies, will be as clear as their power is at present of doing it without, if they please...But if it was thought hard that charter privileges should be taken away by act of parliament, is it not much harder to be in part, or in whole, disfranchised of rights, that have been always thought inherent to a British subject, namely, to be free from all taxes, but what he consents to in person, or by his representative? This right, if it could be traced no higher than Magna Charta, is part of the common law, part of a British subjects birthright, and as inherent and perpetual, as the duty of allegiance; both which have been brought to these colonies, and have been hitherto held sacred and inviolable, and I hope and trust ever will. It is humbly conceived, that the British colonists (except only the conquered, if any) are, by Magna Charta, as well entitled to have a voice in their taxes, as the subjects within the realm. Are we not as really deprived of that right, by the parliament assessing us before we are represented in the house of commons, as if the King should do it by his prerogative? Can it be said with any colour of truth or justice, that we are represented in parliament?"

The Stamp Act Congress
In 1765 Otis Jr. attended the Continental Congress, otherwise known as the Stamp Act Congress, along with other colonial delegates. The resolutions of the Congress stated that the Stamp Act had "a manifest tendency to subvert the rights and liberties of the colonists" and that "the only Representatives of the People of these Colonies, are Persons chosen therein by themselves, and that no Taxes ever have been, or can be Constitutionally imposed on them, but by their respective Legislature." Furthermore, it was declared that, "it is unreasonable and inconsistent with the Principles and Spirit of the British Constitution, for the People of Great-Britain, to grant to his Majesty the Property of the Colonists."

Rationalist explanations
Sebastian Galiani and Gustavo Torrens propose that virtual representation imposed a dilemma on the British elite, which had a direct influence on the outbreak of the American Revolutionary War. They suggest the call for "No taxation without representation" and proposal of the inclusion of American representatives within Parliament, had they actually been implemented, would have encouraged coalition building between Americans and the British opposition (which was opposed to the dominant elite), disrupting the power of the incumbent landed gentry (who made up the elite). Through game theoretic models, Galiani and Torrens show that, once in Parliament, Americans could not feasibly commit to political alliances independent of the British opposition. As a result, mounting pressure for democratic reform would increase, posing a threat to the established British political order. Galiani and Torrens argue that British elites would incur greater losses to their domestic clout from American representation than from simply forfeiting a colony. The implications of forfeiting virtual representation forced the British elite, which dominated the government, to decide between maintaining the rule of the American colonies, which in their minds was infeasible, and engaging in war.

19th-century Britain
Cannon argues that for 18th- and 19th-century Britain "the doctrine of virtual representation was no more than a polite fiction. Indeed the assertion that there were no fundamental differences of interest between rich and poor is hard to reconcile with the determination of the upper classes to reserve political power for men of substance."

title: Virtual representation


text:
USS Preble (DD-345)

The fourth USS Preble (DD-345/DM-20/AG-99) was a United States Navy Clemson-class destroyerin commission from 1920 to 1945. She served in China, including on the Yangtze Patrol, and later saw combat in World War II as a minelayer. She was named for Commodore Edward Preble.

Construction and commissioning
Preble was laid down by the Bath Iron Works at Bath, Maine, on 12 April 1919. She was launched on 8 March 1920, sponsored by Miss Sallie MacIntosh Tucker, and commissioned at the Boston Navy Yard in Boston, Massachusetts, on 19 March 1920.

1920–1941
After shakedown in Cuban waters, Preble was assigned special duty in Mexican waters, arriving at Vera Cruz, Mexico, on 13 June 1920. During the following weeks she made three voyages to Galveston, Texas, to obtain medical supplies including antiserum to fight bubonic plague, which had developed during the rebellion of the Sonora Triumvirate. In August 1920 she returned north to join the United States Atlantic Fleet in exercises along the United States East Coast and in the Caribbean. In January 1921 the Atlantic Fleet and the United States Pacific Fleet joined off the Panama Canal Zone and cruised to the west coast of South America. Separating on 23 February 1921, the Atlantic Fleet steamed back to the Caribbean.

Preble departed Newport, Rhode Island, on 20 June 1921 en route duty in the United States Asiatic Fleet, steaming via the Suez Canal with units of Desntroyer Squadron 15. She arrived at Chefoo, China, on 26 August 1922, and for the next seven years cruised off the coast of Asia from Manchuria to Burma, in Japanese waters, and amongst the Philippine Islands, East Indies, and Mariana Islands. In September 1923 she assisted victims of the violent 1923 Great Kantō earthquake, which shook Japan on 1 September 1923. From 12 June to 2 July 1924 she was at Rangoon, Burma, and Calcutta, India, delivering aviation gasoline and lubricating oil for a flight of United States Army planes making the first aerial circumnavigation of the world. In 1927 Preble was assigned patrol duty in strife-torn China, taking aboard American and foreign refugees and escorting merchant vessels in the Yangtze and Huangpu Rivers. On several occasions Chinese factions fired on Preble from shore, but she suffered no casualties.

Preble departed Tsingtao, China, on 12 July 1929 and returned to the United States, arriving at San Diego, California, on 17 August 1929. For several years she was based at San Diego, cruising along the United States West Coast, with operations in the waters of Mexico and in the Caribbean. During her stay at San Diego, she was used for on-board location shooting of a 1931 RKO-Pathé Pictures film about World War I destroyers, Suicide Fleet, one of the three primary ships used for the filming of the movie. She was assigned to Rotating Reserve Destroyer Squadron 20 at the Mare Island Navy Yard at Mare Island in Vallejo, California, on 24 September 1932. In May 1934 Preble engaged in Fleet Problem XV off the Panama Canal and in Cuban waters, before returning to the Pacific. She participated in Fleet Problem XVI in May–June 1935 and Fleet Problem XVIII in April–May 1937, both in the Hawaiian area.

On 19 May 1937 Preble was transferred from Destroyers, Battle Force, to duty with Minecraft, Battle Force. Converted to a light minelayer, she was reclassified DM-20, effective 30 June 1937. She departed Pearl Harboron 20 September 1937 for naval mine training operations on the U.S. West Coast and returned to Hawaii in December 1937. She remained in the Hawaiian area until the outbreak of World War II, engaging in scheduled mining exercises and fleet maneuvers.

World War II
On 7 December 1941 the United States entered World War II when the Japanese forces made their attack on Pearl Harbor, beginning the war's PAcific campaign. Preble was undergoing an overhaul at the Pearl Harbor Navy Yard when the Japanese attacked the base and was unable to get underway. As antiaircraft guns and ammunition were not aboard Preble, a large number of jer crew handled ammunition, fought fires, and cared for the wounded aboard the battleship USS Pennsylvania (BB-38). On 30 January 1942, Preble completed her overhaul and joined the patrol operating just off the Pearl Harbor entrance. On 1 April 1942 she departed Pearl Harbor with units of Mine Division 1 to lay a large minefield at the French Frigate Shoals in the Northwestern Hawaiian Islands, 500 nmi northwest of Oahu. In July 1942 she assisted in laying a defensive minefield around the base at Kodiak, Alaska, returning to Pearl Harbor via Seattle, Washington, for overhaul and patrol operations. On 6 December 1942 she departed Pearl Harbor for the Fiji Islands and Noumea on Grande Terre in New Caledonia, serving on escort duty in the New Hebrides during January 1943.

On the night of 31 January 1943, Preble and the light minelayers USS Montgomery (DM-17) and USS Tracy (DM-19) laid mines in the mouth of the Tenambo River on the coast of Guadalcanal in the Solomon Islands to prevent the evacuation of Japanese troops from Guadalcanal as the Guadalcanal campaign neared its end. During the next two months Preble performed escort duties to the New Hebrides and the Russell Islands.

On the night of 6 May 1943 Preble and the light minelayers USS Gamble (DM-15) and USS Breese (DM-18) in company with the destroyeer USS Radford (DD-446) laid mines in Ferguson Passage in the Solomon Islands between Gizo and Wanawana. On the night of 7–8 May 1943 these mines sank a Japanese destroyer and damaged two destroyers which were sunk the next day by torpedo bombers from Guadalcanal.

On 24 May 1943 Preble rescued 85 survivors from the torpedoed merchant steamer SS Stanvac Manila. On the night of 28 June 1943 Breese, Gamble, and Preble mined the waters near Shortland Island in the Shortland Islands to prevent units of the Japanese fleet based there from interfering with landing operations on Rendova Island in the New Georgia Group, which were to be carried out at dawn on 30 June `943. During July and August 1943 Preble again served as an escort vessel. On 9 September 1943 she departed Nouméa for San Francisco, California.

After overhaul and duty escorting a convoy from the U.S. West Coast to Pearl Harbor, Preble reached Majuro Atoll in the Marshall Islands on 3 February 1944 where she served as antisubmarine screen and minelayer before returning to Pearl Harbor. She then made three escort voyages from Pearl Harbor to Marshall Islands ports. After minesweeping training, Preble departed Purvis Bay on Florida Island in the Solomon Islands on 6 September 1943 with minesweeping units of Rear Admiral Jesse B. Oldendorf's Task Group 32.5. Arriving off Peleliu in the Palau Islands in the early morning of 12 September 1944, while gunfire support ships began their bombardment of Peleliu, Preble separated to investigate the shoals between Anguar and Peleliu, where Allies suspected that the Japanese had planted acoustic mines. On 13 September 1944 she helped rescue survivors of the high-speed minesweeper USS Perry (DMS-17), which sank after striking a mine. As the Battle of Peleliu continued, she continued to perform various screening and minesweeping duties.

Preble arrived at Manus Island in the Admiralty Islands on 1 October 1944, where she joined minesweeping Task Group 77.5. The task group arrived off the entrance to Leyte Gulf on 17 October 1944, where Preble remained for six days, laying buoys and acting as mine destruction vessel while United States Army forces landed on Leyte in the Philippine Islands on 20 October 1944, beginning the Battle of Leyte. Preble departed Leyte Gulf on 23 October 1944 and returned to Manus. After training at Manus, she deployed to San Pedro Bay, an arm of Leyte Gulf, on 1 January 1945. A month later she departed for much-needed repairs in the United States. After a stop at Pearl Harbor, she arrived at San Francisco on 8 March 1945.

Returning to Pearl Harbor on 8 May 1945, Preble was redesignated as a "miscellaneous auxiliary" (AG-99) on 5 June 1945. She was assigned to duty escorting aircraft carriers engaged in training, acting as an antisubmarine patrol vessel and plane guard during flight operations. She reached Guam in the Mariana Islands with the escort aircraft carrier USS Vella Gulf (CVE-111) on 20 July 1945 an subsequently escorted Vella Gulf to Okinawa in the Ryukyu Islands. After returning to Guam, she escorted the escort carrier USS Sitkoh Bay (CVE-86) to Samar in the Philippine Islands, arriving there on 20 September 1945. Meanwhile, Japan had surrendered to the Allies on 2 September 1945, bringing World War II to an end.

Decommissioning and disposal
Preble steamed for the United States on 9 October 1945, arriving at Norfolk, Virginia, on 20 November 1945. She decommissioned at Norfolk Naval Shipyard in Portsmouth, Virginia, on 7 December 1945. Her name was struck from the Navy List on 3 January 1946 and she was sold for scrap to Luria Brothers of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, on 26 October 1946.

Honors and awards

 * Navy Expeditionary Medal ribbon.svg Navy Expeditionary Medal
 * Yangtze Service Medal ribbon.svg Yangtze Service Medal
 * Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal with eight battle stars
 * World War II Victory Medal ribbon.svg World War II Victory Medal
 * Army of Occupation ribbon.svg Navy Occupation Service Medal with "Asia" clasp

Preble received the Navy Expeditionary Medal for her operations at Shanghai from 4 to 31 August 1925.

Preble received the Yangtze Service Medal for operations on the Yangtze Patrol from 20 to 28 October 1926, from 24 February to 30 May 1927, and from 27 June to 4 August 1927.

Pruitt earned eight battle stars during World War II for her operations during the attack on Pearl Harbor (7 December 1941), the capture and defense of Guadalcanal (31 January–2 February 1943), the consolidation of the southern Solomons (6–7 and 12–13 May 1943), the New Georgia–Rendova–Vangunu occupation (29–30 June and 8–25 August 1943), the occupation of Kwajalein and Majuro Atolls (29 January–8 February 1944), the capture and occupation of the southern Palau Islands (6 September–14 October 1944), the Leyte landings (12–20 October 1944), and the Lingayen Gulf landings (4–18 January 1945).

Pruitt received the Navy Occupation Service Medal with "Asia" clasp for the period 25 to 28 September 1945.

In media
Preble has appeared a number of times in film and television:

 * During the first hour of the 1931 film Suicide Fleet, starring William Boyd, Robert Armstrong, James Gleason, and Ginger Rogers, Preble is seen as one of several ships assisting in rescuing survivors of a sinking ship. Later shipboard scenes are shot aboard Preble, providing a good look at the ship as she looked in 1931. One scene includes a shot of Preble passing within 50 ft of a sailing ship.
 * Preble was featured in the 1937 movie Charlie Chan at the Olympics.
 * Not named but clearly marked "345," her pre-1937 hull number when she was DD-345, Preble appears in the 1942 movie The Navy Comes Through starring Desi Arnez and Jackie Cooper.
 * In the episode "Long Live the King" from the first season (1964–1965) of the television series Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea, the long-since-scrapped Preble is plainly visible in stock footage used in the final quarter of the episode, and the Captain Lee Crane character played by David Hedison indicates that the footage is showing the advanced units of the United States Seventh Fleet during the 1970s, the time period in which the first season is set.

title: USS Preble (DD-345)


text:
Talk:Hugh Despenser the Younger

Hugh on the list of gay, lesbian and bisexual people
Hugh appears on the list of Gay, Lesbian and Bisexual people, and the link to that list appears at the bottom of the article, but no mention is made of his being Gay or Bisexual in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zekedunn (talk • contribs)

 * This entry was not signed or dated so it's not clear when it was written. Also, I do not see the need of capitalizing of several keywords (this is not the German Wikipedia). The list mentioned above does not exist as of July of 2021.

 * ICE77 (talk) 23:32, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

English Voodoo?
The article claims that "There was even a bizarre plot to kill Hugh by sticking pins in a wax likeness of him". Sounds a lot like voodoo, an African tradition clearly out of place in England of the 14th century.

Top.Squark (talk) 19:25, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

I think you'll find pin-sticking magic goes way back before, and further afield, than voodoo. It needs refing though. Johnbod (talk) 00:21, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Title of the article
What an odd title. Shouldn't it be Hugh Despenser the Younger? john k (talk) 05:54, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

 * Well his name was Hugh le Despenser, not Hugh Despenser. In historically literature he is often called "the younger Despenser". Why? Because historians are an idiosyncratic bunch. Dsmdgold (talk) 16:21, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

 * Then Hugh le Despenser the Younger. That he is called "the younger Despenser" in running text does not mean he is ever called "Hugh the younger Despenser," which is very strange.  One might call John Quincy Adams "the younger Adams" in certain contexts, but that doesn't mean our article on him should be called John the younger Adams.  Furthermore, "Despenser the Younger" gets nearly as many google hits as "younger Despenser", and none of the latter include his given name, while many of the former do.  john k (talk) 16:49, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

 * Google Scholar gives 40 hits for "Hugh le Despenser the Younger" and none for "Hugh the younger Despenser". Google Books shows 386 to seven. I think a change of title may be justified. Iain99Balderdash and piffle 17:07, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Why isn't the page name "Hugh le Despenser the Younger"? It would appear his forebears and offspring were known as le Despencer. Hack (talk) 13:09, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

I thought by now the article title would be Hugh_le_Despenser_the_Younger.24.11.170.191 (talk) 18:43, 4 February 2015 (UTC)

The title debate started in 2008 and went on until 2015. As of now, 2021, the title is "Hugh Despenser the Younger" and the introduction says "Hugh le Despenser ... also referred to as "the Younger Despenser"". It doesn't make any sense and it's inconsistent. Robert de Brus or Robert de Bruys (Norman French) was warped into an idiotic Robert the Bruce (English) which does not make any sense. Hugh le Despenser has a similar issue. I think the title should be "Hugh le Despenser (Younger)" or "Hugh Despenser (Younger)". The additional "the Younger" was not part of his name. It just happened to be the younger of the two Hugh le Despenser.

ICE77 (talk) 23:43, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

Worst Britons List
In 2006, he was selected by BBC History Magazine as the 14th century's worst Briton.[4] Inclusion of this information seems non-encyclopedic to me. St Thomas a Becket also made this list but no one (quite rightly) added that fact to his article.Nitpyck (talk) 18:56, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

 * You can either say "Thomas Becket" or "Thomas à Becket" but not "Thomas a Becket". Phonetic signs are not an option given to the discretion of the writer. Yes: whether Despenser or Becket made the list really does not matter and it's totally irrelevant to this article. Similarly, we could say that nobody cares about a list of fastest or slowest cars either.

 * ICE77 (talk) 23:49, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

Too Violent for Children
The raw violence of Hugh's death is not suitable reading material for children. The vivid description should be softened for the general audience of an encyclopedia.67.185.161.127 (talk) 01:48, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

That's a pity. I had a lot of fun describing De Spenser's execution in graphic detail. In my experience, children love that sort of thing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.138.56.109 (talk) 11:09, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

That's crazy, don't change facts and history for wiki. Why would Froissart lie about the execution? The softer version of the execution might well be made to soften the story, for same purposes you describe here. --Dude0853 (talk) 11:43, 10 June 2019 (UTC)

Buggery Act 1533
This post is just for information on why the trial for treason probably would not have included charges of sodomy. Before the passing of the Buggery Act 1533 sodomites were dealt with in the ecclesiastical courts. So it is quite possible that "his genitals sliced off and burned" but it would not have been as legal part of the punishment for alleged sodomy. -- PBS (talk) 08:06, 4 March 2011 (UTC)

Although some writers, such as Alison Weir, have speculated that De Spenser was castrated because of his "orientation", in fact, castration was usually practised on convicted tratiors, such as William Wallace. It was not mentioned in the judgement of Sir William Trussell, but it would have been assumed that it would be carried out. In this case, we can be reasonably sure that Froissart was correct.

As an aside, "sodomy", in medieval England, did not have exclusively homosexual connotations. It meant any form of illict sexual intercourse. At this stage, it would have been unusual for a homosexual to be executed or castrated, and more likely, he would have been required to perform a penance. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.138.56.109 (talk) 11:07, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
 * There is also little evidence that the relationship was sexual, and there is nothing in Edward II life to assume that he was homosexual, he fathered a number of children outside of marriage. John lilburne (talk) 11:33, 17 June 2011 (UTC)

Is Julie Frusher a reliable source
From the article "Despenser expert Julie Frusher has identified another source for the castration, and writes that although castration was not listed as an official punishment, it had been used on earlier traitors such as Simon de Montfort and was a plausible punishment for Despenser, even absent the charges of sexual or amorous deviancy."

Citing:

What makes Julie Frusher a reliable source? What makes the website www.hughdespenser.com a reliable publisher? -- PBS (talk) 08:25, 4 March 2011 (UTC)

"Gay lover" headline from the Telegraph
If this claim is going to stick, it needs a real academic source. Mangoe (talk) 14:09, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

 * Considering the fact this article provides two distinct descriptions of the execution, I would say that Laura Clout's article from 2008 is inconsistent with what is in this article, primarily because she merges two modes of execution by saying "He was hanged and, still conscious, castrated, disembowelled and then quartered before his head was displayed on London Bridge". In addition I must say Laura Clout does not qualify herself by saying what her title or specialty is and what is the source that would label Hugh as a gay person. All I see is "Miss Lewis, a biological anthropologist at the University of Reading" which is not even related to Hugh's sexual orientation but just to the way Hugh was beheaded and cut into pieces. The argument of the Telegraph sounds similar to the story of Edward II and Piers Gaveston, another friend of the king that did not end up so well. Compare "Abbey body identified as gay lover of Edward II" and "A mutilated body found in an abbey graveyard has been identified as that of a notorious medieval villain rumoured to have been the gay lover of Edward II". You can clearly conclude that the second sentence, just a rumor, turned into the proof Hugh was the gay lover of Edward (this is how history is distorted and fabricated, just like for the way Edward II was killed (a story that emerged decades after his death and that is likely invented to disparage the king for the convenience of somebody).

 * ICE77 (talk) 00:12, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

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Despenser/Spencer?
If this is the same family as the famous Spencers, could this be detailed? Valetude (talk) 23:43, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 18 September 2020

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: No consensus  (t · c)  buidhe  00:54, 4 October 2020 (UTC)

Hugh Despenser the Younger → Hugh le Despenser the Younger – Per other le Despencers Staszek Lem (talk) 10:35, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose. His father's article is titled Hugh Despenser the Elder, so the nominator's argument for consistency in titles isn't very strong. Rreagan007 (talk) 18:48, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Well, of 12 le Dispencers I saw only one named insonsistently. I missed another one, sorry, but the consistency argument is still strong. It terms of name usage, to my uneducated search it seems that the frequencies of both versions are about the same. Staszek Lem (talk) 21:02, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Support Hugh le Despenser is certainly how I know him and come across him, and I assume it is commonname. But looking around, there seems to be an uptick in recent books that opt to drop the "le", so I am not sure how dominant it is anymore (but I think that's across all Despensers).  I'm sticking with support out of consistency. Walrasiad (talk) 10:13, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose. No "le" in the ODNB for any of them that I can see. Our coverage looks like a mess: we have Despencer and also Despenser and the use of "le" is very inconsistent. Do not trust the links as presented on the dab pages. Srnec (talk) 02:33, 21 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Do we care about ODNB? We have our own naming system. If you want to make them match, you are very welcome to request hundreds of page moves. :-) Yes it is a mess. And my suggestion is to decrease it at least in one surname. Staszek Lem (talk) 03:36, 21 September 2020 (UTC)
 * We care about using the name scholarship uses. As for consistency, we are much further form it than you think. See here. Srnec (talk) 23:54, 22 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes we care what scholarsip uses, but in Wikipedia we have other criteria, such as the most common use. Please start the discussion about "le" in the appropriate forum to see whether we have to get rid of it. Staszek Lem (talk) 00:30, 23 September 2020 (UTC)

Sources for the execution
This article mentions "contemporary accounts" that do not include castration, unlike the account of Jean Froissart who, apparently, as explained in this article, if I interpreted correctly, relied on the account of Jean le Bel (Froissart's Chronicles include the execution of Hugh le Despenser (younger) of 1326 in Book I (years 1322–1377) and I assume they are based on Jean le Bel's account which Jean Froissart likely copied). Hence, there are X plus 1 accounts.

How many X accounts are we talking about?

Should the box on the top right mention both modes of execution, including the castration which is equally plausible and the one typically used in narrated documentaries?

ICE77 (talk) 00:40, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Execution
The article states that the method of hanging, drawing, and quartering usually did not involve castration, which is incorrect. Even Wikipedia’s own page on that method of execution specifically mentions emasculation as part of the process. 2601:805:600:DA50:0:0:0:2A15 (talk) 15:58, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

title: Talk:Hugh Despenser the Younger


text:
Cape Apostolos Andreas

Cape Apostolos Andreas (Ακρωτήριο Αποστόλου Ανδρέα, "Cape Saint Andrew"; Zafer Burnu, "Cape Victory") is the north-easternmost point (promontory) of the Mediterranean island of Cyprus (35.695°N, 34.58667°W). It lies at the tip of the finger-like Karpass Peninsula.

The Apostolos Andreas Monastery is located 5 km southwest of the promontory itself.

The city of Latakia in Syria is located about 68 mi to the east.

Herodotus mentions it as "Keys of Cyprus", where the Phoenicians were sailing with their ships in a war between Darius I and the Ionians.

title: Cape Apostolos Andreas


text: Wikipedia talk:Wikimedia In Memoriam 9/11


text:
Kostis Palamas

Kostis Palamas (Κωστής Παλαμάς; 13 January 1859 – 27 February 1943 ) was a Greek poet who wrote the words to the Olympic Hymn. He was a central figure of the Greek literary generation of the 1880s and one of the cofounders of the so-called New Athenian School (or Palamian School, or Second Athenian School) along with Georgios Drosinis and Ioannis Polemis.

Biography
Born in Patras, in the same house as born the Italian novelist Matilde Serao, he received his primary and secondary education in Mesolonghi. In 1877 he enrolled at the School of Law, Economics and Political Sciences of the University of Athens, but he soon abandoned his studies. In the 1880s, he worked as a journalist. He published his first collection of verses, Songs of My Fatherland, in 1886.

He was nominated for the Nobel Prize for Literature on 14 occasions, but never received it.

He held an administrative post at the University of Athens between 1897 and 1926, and died during the German occupation of Greece in World War II. His funeral was a major event of the Greek resistance: the funerary poem composed and recited by fellow poet Angelos Sikelianos roused the mourners and culminated in a demonstration of 100,000 people against Nazi occupation.

Work
Palamas wrote the lyrics to the Olympic Hymn, composed by Spyridon Samaras. It was first performed at the 1896 Summer Olympics, the first modern Olympic Games. The Hymn was then shelved as each host city from then until the 1960 Winter Olympics commissioned an original piece for its celebration of the Games, but the version by Samaras and Palamas was declared the official Olympic Anthem in 1958 and has been performed at each celebration of the Games since the 1960 Winter Olympics.

Honors
The old administration building of the University of Athens, in central Athens, where his office was located, is now dedicated to him as the "Kostis Palamas Building" and houses the "Greek Theater Museum", as well as many temporary exhibitions.

Palamas has been informally called the "national" poet of Greece. He was an influential voice in Greek literature for more than 30 years, and greatly influenced the entire political-intellectual climate of his time. Romain Rolland considered him the greatest poet in Europe.

Collections of poems

 * Songs of my Fatherland (1886)
 * Hymn to Athena (1889)
 * Eyes of my Soul (1892)
 * Iambs and Anapaests (1897)
 * The Grave (1898)
 * The Greetings of the Sun-born (1900)
 * Ή Ασάλευτη Ζωή (The Motionless Life)(1904)
 * Twelve Lays of the Gypsy (1907)
 * The King's flute (1910)
 * Yearnings of the Lagoon (1912)
 * Satirical Exercises (1912)
 * The State and Solitude (1912)
 * Altars (1915)
 * Extempora (1919)
 * The 14 verses (1919)
 * The 5 verses - The passionate secret whispers - The Wolves - Two flowers from afar (1925)
 * Cowardly and Harsh verses (1928)
 * The 3 Verse Cycle (1929)
 * Passages and Greetings (1931)
 * The Nights of Phemius (1935)
 * Evening Fire (1944, posthumous edition by his son, Leander Palamas)

Prose

 * Death of a Youth (novel, 1901)
 * Novels (1920)

Theater

 * The Thrice-noble (drama, 1903)

Criticism
Palamas was one of the most respected literary critics of his day, and instrumental in the reappraisal of the works of Andreas Kalvos, Dionysios Solomos and the "Ionian School" of poetry, Kostas Krystallis et al.

Translations

 * The King's Flute, tr. T. P. Stephanides, G. C. Katsimbalis (1982) [Greek and English texts]
 * The King's Flute, tr. F. Will (1967)
 * The Twelve Lays of the Gypsy, tr. G. Thomson (1969)
 * The Twelve Words of the Gypsy, tr. T. P. Stephanides, G. C. Katsimbalis (1974; repr. 1975)
 * A Hundred Voices, tr. T. P. Stephanides, G. C. Katsimbalis (1976)
 * Ruins, Grief, On The Trip You Are Taken, Rose Fragrance, tr. A. Moskios

title: Kostis Palamas


text:
Don't Go Down That Street

"Don't Go Down That Street" is a song by 1980s new wave band Culture Club. It was released as the B-side to their 1984 single "The Medal Song" (a song about the 1930s American actress Frances Farmer, who was featured on the sleeve of the single). It later appeared as a bonus track on the 2003 CD reissue of the album Waking Up with the House on Fire.

In the tradition of earlier Culture Club songs, "Don't Go Down That Street" includes chatting, but instead of Jamaican patois, it features Japanese chatting by Miko, Boy George's friend at the time. That song was recorded especially to be a B-Side, after the other songs were made for the Waking Up album. There are two versions of the track: one short for the single in Japan, and another, around six minutes long, which can be found as the B-Side of various singles.

Even though the song was available as a B-side in most countries (it was also the B-side of "Mistake No. 3" in Canada and the U.S.), it still received a separate release in Japan as a single in 1985 for the Japan-only "Love Is Love EP", where it peaked at number 69.

title: Don't Go Down That Street


text:
User talk:Amplimax

Welcome
Hello , and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! You (Talk) 23:24, Jun 14, 2005 (UTC)
 * The Five Pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Editing tutorial
 * Picture tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Naming conventions
 * Manual of Style

title: User talk:Amplimax


text:
User:Denjo

Hobbies
Reading, Video Games

Interests
Bionicle, Xiaolin Showdown, Star Wars, Jackie Chan Adventures, Transformers, Power Rangers (don't mock me), Sonic the Hedgehog, Shannara*, Redwall*, Digimon, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, the Inheritance Trilogy, Avatar: The Last Airbender, Danny Phantom, Star Trek, Star Fox, Kingdom Hearts, Harry Potter, Medabots, Naruto, etc.

 * Because of my dedication to the Shannara storyline, I am now part of Wikipedia Project Shannara.
 * I am also a part of WikiProject Redwall.
 * My Wiki Contributions

[Special:Contributions/|User contributions]]

Fandom History
Denjo here, and I've been a fan of Transformers for years. I started out with Beast Wars, and moved into Generation 1 and Robots in Disguise (cartoon) as a result. I've seen a couple episodes of Armada (cartoon), nothing of Energon (cartoon), but a lot of Cybertron (cartoon). Aside from the Vehicons, I found Beast Machines to be a drag. I've written a number of Beast Wars fanfictions, and am in the process of writing more. As some of you have no doubt noticed, I like to keep it clean, and hope that others will agree that making this site funnier than your average Wiki doesn't mean it has to be crude.

Beast Wars

 * Maximals:
 * Dinobot-he's gruff, mean, and has a chip on his shoulder the size of Unicron's head. He's also an honorable warrior who always chooses the right side in the end. Besides which, who wouldn't like a sword with spinning serrated blades?
 * Silverbolt (BW)-corny and a bit of a wimp in the show, but romantic and loyal. Even the Transformers Universe could use some chivalry. Add that to a killer beast mode and heroic robot mode, and you've got a rocking dude.
 * Depth Charge-a lot like Dinobot, but with sick modes that make him the only Transformer in Beast Wars who can fight anywhere, be it land, sea, or air.
 * Rhinox-smart, funny, and with a set of sweet looking chain guns.
 * Tigatron-proving that you can be a gentleman without acting like an imbecile.
 * Airazor-the one girl in the Beast continuity who didn't turn out evil at some point. Being the midpoint between Strika's butt ugly and Blackarachnia (BW)'s less than ladylike appearances doesn't hurt either.
 * Predacons:
 * Megatron (BW)-so diabolical, yessssss.
 * Rampage (BW)-he's psychotic, murderous, and with a twisted sense of humor. In essence, a perfect villain, with devastating firepower to match.
 * Dinobot II-a bad guy who looks like a good guy who sacrificed himself in a noble cause. The ultimate desecration makes one sick Transmetal 2.
 * Waspinator-you just can't help but feel sorry for him.
 * Inferno (BW)-who doesn't love a little psychosis?
 * Ravage (G1)-a patriot with a Russian accent: what a combo.

G1

 * Autobots:
 * Optimus Prime-do I even need to say anything?
 * Silverbolt (G1)-I like him mainly because of his Beast Wars namesake, but he's still an awesome guy.
 * Omega Supreme-world's biggest Autobot. Bigger isn't always better, but Omega does it well.
 * Hot Rod/Rodimus Prime-not nearly as cool as Optimus, but a better substitute than most.
 * Ultra Magnus-looks close to Optimus without totally ripping him off.
 * Grimlock-something about an egotistical moron just strikes me as entertaining.
 * Kup-reminds me of myself, as I am also always being reminded of past knowledge by present situations that I just have to bring up.
 * Blurr (G1)-this guy is just plain funny.
 * Decepticons:
 * Megatron (G1)/Galvatron (G1)-the original bad guy and his crazy second identity.
 * Cyclonus (G1)-reminds me a bit of Dinobot, but also an excellent villain.
 * The Combaticons-one of the first batch of combiners I knew much about.
 * The Predacons-the first evil animal Transformers, nice contrast to the Dinobots.
 * Skywarp (G1)-he may be a repaint, but he's cooler than the original.

Beast Machines

 * Vehicons
 * Tankor (BM)-sad as it is to see a good guy go bad, he does a good job.
 * Jetstorm (BM)-for once, Silverbolt looked cool in Beast Machines, even if he was evil.
 * Obsidian (BM)-a helicopter and a brilliant strategist.
 * Strika (BM)-a big mean female Transformers.

Robots In Disguise

 * Autobots:
 * Optimus Prime (RID)-who else could take a firetruck and make it into a devastating force of justice?
 * Ultra Magnus (RID)-every team needs just a little attitude.
 * Rail Racer (RID) and his components-one sick Autobot combiner.
 * Predacons/Decepticons:
 * Megatron (RID)/Galvatron-this guy has more alt-modes than Beast Wars Megatron had bodies.
 * Scourge (RID)-an evil twin version of Optimus Prime: 'nough said.

Armada

 * Decepticons:
 * Megatron (Armada)-I'm sorry, but this guy was just too cool.

Cybertron

 * Autobots:
 * Optimus Prime (Armada)-this guy is just plain awesome.
 * Vector Prime-an ancient paladin and one of the few old guys in the bunch.
 * Jetfire (Armada)-an Aussie Autobot is hard to go wrong with.
 * Snarl (Cybertron)-reminds me of a winged wolf I always liked.
 * Metroplex (Cybertron)-a giant robot with a Scottish accent; what's to complain about.
 * Decepticons:
 * IMegatron/Galvatron-a character so very true to the original.
 * Menasor (Cybertron)-giant robot, Irish accent, enormous drill.
 * Starscream-for once he's not a high voiced little backstabber, but a genuine threat.
 * Soundwave (Cybertron)-G1 Soundwave meets Jazz (G1) with a flying mode.
 * Sideways-definitely more evil looking than Armada's motorcycle.

Transformers (2007) Series

 * Autobots
 * Optimus Prime (Movie)-hearing that voice again after so many years was awesome!
 * Ironhide (Movie)-attitude with enormous guns...sweet.
 * Bumblebee (Movie)-nice use of radio.
 * Decepticons
 * Megatron (Movie)-Even more terrifying than the old school Megatron.
 * Blackout (Movie)-nastiest helicopter I've ever seen.
 * Barricade (Movie)-a cop car with a bad attitude; so awesome.
 * The Fallen (Movie)-looks like a sweet bad guy.

Expanded Universe

 * Autobots
 * Optimus Prime (Shattered Glass)-so evil it's scary.
 * Rodimus (Shattered Glass)-Rodimus Prime gone evil is sick.
 * Nova Prime-just goes to show you that not every Decepticon is bad and not every Autobot is good.
 * Sentinel Prime (G1)-if he was Optimus Prime's hero, he was doing something right.
 * Arcee (G1)-talk about one nasty spider.
 * Sentinel Maximus-not as cool as Primal Prime, but a close third.
 * King Atlas-just plain cool.
 * Decepticons
 * Unicron-included here because of his Cybertron form and because he's cooler outside movies and cartoons.
 * The Fallen (G1)-talk about pure evil.
 * Megazarak-all the coolness of Armada Megatron without the continuity issues.
 * Nemesis Prime (Universe 2003)-another evil Prime, with a sweet look.
 * Maximals
 * Primal Prime-Optimal Optimus' shape meets Optimus Prime's color scheme: instant winner.
 * Apelinq-again, the repaint is better than the original; plus, he's a geek who kicks butt.
 * Windrazor-looks like Silverbolt, but a lot meaner.
 * Ramulus-there's that attitude again.
 * Big Convoy-Optimus Prime is gone, but there's another Prime on the block with a really big gun.
 * Leo Prime-about time the Primes got a carnivore in their midst.
 * CatSCAN-simple-minded perhaps, but undoubtedly funny.
 * The Dinobots-a team of repaints with some sweet moves.
 * Torca-I do believe we've found Omega Supreme's grandson.
 * Cybershark-his Transmetal 2 form is off the hinges.
 * Jawbreaker-he looks a bit like Silverbolt gone completely insane.
 * Predacons
 * Rotorbolt-a little ego makes life funny.
 * Cryotek-an ideal villain, even if he is a repaint.
 * Shokaract-combine the look of one mass murderer with the evil of another, and you've got one nasty Predacon.
 * Magmatron-if ever there was an archnemesis worthy of Dinobot, it was this guy.
 * Fractyl-an angry midget never goes amiss.
 * Manta Ray-always liked the toy, but rather like Samus Aran, I didn't know for years that she was a girl. Of course, I didn't know she was a Predacon, either.
 * Scarem-had the toy and loved it.

My User Name
In my spare time I like to create new characters in stories I like. Denjo is the name of a Xiaolin Showdown character I made up.

title: User:Denjo


text:
Talk:Samuel Eliot Morison

Failure to discuss what Morison said that was offensive
I have looked through the archive and have browsed the varied posts there about Morison and racism and what is and isn't appropriate for a biography, etc., etc.

I have no interest in that fight.

What I am interested in, however, is what Morison wrote that is so offensive. Sure, the section on "Slavery" goes on about how African American scholars objected to certain views and statements from Morison's work, but it never in any way describes what those views or statements were. The reader is left feeling as though he has only seen half of the story and cannot give a critical eye to that section because the criticism is all that is present. This needs to change.

Philologick (talk) 03:38, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

SE Morison on Robert Calef, the Mathers, and some shameful aspects of the Mather history at Harvard
Just a note to those interested in this fellow that he has recently been discussed on the Talk page of the Robert Calef wiki article. I have been disappointed to find SE Morison's contributions to this particular discussion in the 1930s naive and/or ignorant and easily disproven when applying what Morison himself might call "proper historic method." But I cannot comment on Morison's work as a scholar other than this one issue, where superstitious theological yearnings managed to fatally undermine rational jurisprudence, and which (unlike say GL Burr) does not seem to have been a primary interest of Morison.

title: Talk:Samuel Eliot Morison


text:
GFFA

The acronym GFFA can refer to:
 * the Star Wars galaxy, also called the "Galaxy Far, Far Away"
 * the Galactic Federation of Free Alliances, a government in the Star Wars expanded universe

title: GFFA


text: User talk:210.8.100.240

title: User talk:210.8.100.240


text:
Palamas

Palamas (Greek: Παλαμάς) is a town and a municipality in the Karditsa regional unit, Greece. Palamas is located south-southwest of Larissa, the capital of Thessaly, northwest of Lamia, north of Sofades, east-northeast of Karditsa and east-southeast of Trikala. Palamas is linked with the road linking Karditsa and Larissa. It also serves roads with the GR-6 (Larissa - Trikala - Ioannina - Igoumenitsa) and Sofades. The Pineios River is to the north as well as the Trikala regional unit.

Municipality
The municipality Palamas was formed at the 2011 local government reform by the merger of the following 3 former municipalities, that became municipal units:
 * Fyllo
 * Palamas
 * Sellana

The municipality has an area of 382.722 km2, the municipal unit 154.077 km2.

Subdivisions
The municipal unit of Palamas is divided into the following communities:
 * Agios Dimitrios
 * Gorgovites
 * Kalyvakia
 * Koskina (Koskina, Psathochori)
 * Markos
 * Metamorfosi
 * Palamas
 * Vlochos (Vlochos, Lykorema)

Notable people

 * Manthos Falagas (born 1992), football player

title: Palamas


text:
Karpasia

Karpasia may refer to:
 * Karpass Peninsula, the long, finger-like peninsula of northeastern Cyprus
 * Karpasia (town), an ancient townsite on the peninsula.

title: Karpasia


text:
Jesse Garon and the Desperadoes

Jesse Garon and the Desperadoes were a Scottish band formed from around, and within, the Edinburgh indie pop scene of the mid-1980s. The band had a distinctive guitar-jangle sound with male and female vocals. The band took their name from Elvis Presley's stillborn twin brother, Jesse Garon Presley.

History
The original members of the band were Andrew Tully (guitars/vocals), Eric Webster and Angus McPake (bass guitar), Fran Schoppler (vocals), Margarita Vasquez-Ponte (drums), Kevin McMahon (guitars), and Stuart Clarke (guitar). Tully and Vasquez-Ponte were also members of Rote Kapelle, a band that was active from 1985–1988.

This initial line-up recorded the first two singles, "Splashing Along" and "The Rain Fell Down" (described by one reviewer as a "pop gem that's not to be missed") on Narodnik Records. With the departure of McMahon and Clarke, Bruce Hopkins and John Robb (not the Manchester writer) were drafted in for third single, the Billy the Whizz EP; these being replaced on a more permanent basis by Michael Kerr (of Meat Whiplash). Next release was a flexi-disc featuring the track "Hank Williams Is Dead" along with a track by The Fizzbombs, a side-project of Margarita and Angus, along with Ann Donald of The Shop Assistants. Moving to Velocity Records, the band released two more well-received singles, "The Adam Faith Experience" and "You'll Never Be That Young Again", followed by first album, A Cabinet of Curiosities, which collected the tracks released to date.

In 1989, Robb left to join The Darling Buds, and the band returned in 1990 with single "Grand Hotel", a reference to the IRA bombing of Brighton's Grand Hotel, the venue for the Conservative Party conference. Tully described this as a "fuck Thatcher and fuck the IRA for not killing her when they had the chance" song. The album Nixon followed, and in October 1990, they released their final single, the Hold Me Now EP.

Schoppler released a solo album, 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 in 2000, recorded with Mick Cooke of Belle & Sebastian and Roy Hunter.

Albums

 * A Cabinet of Curiosities (Jan 1989, Velocity, SPEEDLP111 [LP]) - UK Indie #20
 * Nixon (Mar 1990, Avalanche, ONLYLP001/ONLYMC001/ONLYCD001)

Singles and EPs

 * "Splashing Along" (Oct 1986, Narodnik, NRK001 [7"])
 * "The Rain Fell Down" (Mar 1987, Narodnik, NRK002 [7"]) - UK Indie #21
 * Billy the Whizz EP (May 1987, Narodnik, NRK005T [12"]) - UK Indie #16
 * "Hank Williams Is Dead" (1987, Wild Rumpus, ? [7" flexi])
 * "The Adam Faith Experience" (Jan 1988, Velocity, SPEED001 [7"]/SPEEDT001 [12"]) video - UK Indie #9
 * "You'll Never Be That Young Again" (Jan 1989, Velocity, SPEED002 [7"]) - UK Indie #15
 * "Grand Hotel" (Jan 1990, Avalanche, AGAP002 [7"]) video
 * Hold Me Now EP (Oct 1990, Avalanche, AGAP001 [12"])

title: Jesse Garon and the Desperadoes


text:
Coincidence point

In mathematics, a coincidence point (or simply coincidence) of two functions is a point in their common domain having the same image.

Formally, given two functions
 * $$f,g \colon X \rightarrow Y$$

we say that a point x in X is a coincidence point of f and g if f(x) = g(x).

Coincidence theory (the study of coincidence points) is, in most settings, a generalization of fixed point theory, the study of points x with f(x) = x. Fixed point theory is the special case obtained from the above by letting X = Y and taking g to be the identity function.

Just as fixed point theory has its fixed-point theorems, there are theorems that guarantee the existence of coincidence points for pairs of functions. Notable among them, in the setting of manifolds, is the Lefschetz coincidence theorem, which is typically known only in its special case formulation for fixed points.

Coincidence points, like fixed points, are today studied using many tools from mathematical analysis and topology. An equaliser is a generalization of the coincidence set.

title: Coincidence point


text:
Christoph Blumhardt

Christoph Friedrich Blumhardt (1842–1919) was a German Lutheran theologian and one of the founders of Christian socialism in Germany and Switzerland. He was a well-known preacher. In 1899 he announced his support for socialism and joined the Social Democratic Party of Germany; for this, he lost his position as minister. The next year, he was elected to the state parliament of Württemberg.

As the First World War broke out, he declared his belief in a coming Kingdom of God, declaring "we live in the time before a massive change in the world. This darkness will be vanquished through the Lord Jesus Christ." He was a significant influence on the theologians Karl Barth, Hermann Kutter, and Leonhard Ragaz, who were also Christian socialists.

The son of Johann Christoph Blumhardt, Christoph Blumhardt was born at Möttlingen on 1 June 1842, at the very time his father was becoming involved in the struggle with Gottliebin's demons. As his father had done before him, he took university training pointing toward a Reformed pastorate. However, he became disillusioned with the church and theology and so decided simply to return home to Bad Boll and act as a helper there. Upon his father's death, then, he took over as housefather and continued the work until his own death in 1919.

In time, the younger Blumhardt became quite renowned as a mass evangelist and faith healer. But after a very successful "crusade" in Berlin in 1888, he drastically cut back both activities, saying, "I do not want to suggest that it is of little importance for God to heal the sick; actually, it now is happening more and more often—although very much in quiet. However, things should not be promoted as though God’s kingdom consists in the healing of sick people. To be cleansed is more important than to be healed. It is more important to have a heart for God’s cause, not to be chained to the world but be able to move for the kingdom of God."

Blumhardt's interest gradually took what could be called "a turn to the world", namely, a focus upon the great socioeconomic issues of the day. Under the impetus of this concern Blumhardt chose, in a public and conspicuous way, to cast his lot with democratic socialism, the much-maligned workers' movement that then was fighting tooth and nail for the right of the working class. Although it brought upon his head the wrath of both the civil and ecclesiastical establishments, he addressed protest rallies, ran for office on the party slate, and was elected to a six-year term in the Württemberg legislature. He was asked to resign his ministerial status in the church. Blumhardt began as a very active and energetic legislator, but as time passed he greatly curtailed this activity and bluntly declined to stand for a second term of office. Clearly, the pattern was of a piece with his earlier retreat from mass evangelism and faith healing.

Blumhardt's disillusionment with democratic socialism – i.e., with the party politics, not with the movement's purposes and ideals – and the even greater disillusionment which came toward the close of his life with the dark years of the First World War. These brought him to a final position expressed in the dialectical motto: Wait and Hasten. Staunchly anti-war, his understanding was that the call of the Christian is still for him to give himself completely to the cause of the kingdom. To do everything in his power to help the world toward that goal. Yet, at the same time, a Christian must remain calm and patient, unperturbed even if his efforts show no signs of success, willing to wait for the Lord to bring the kingdom at his own pace and in his own way. And, according to Blumhardt, far from being inactivity, this sort of waiting is itself a very strong and creative action in the very hastening of the kingdom. Blumhardt suffered a stroke in 1917 and died a peaceful death on 2 August 1919 in Jebenhausen.

title: Christoph Blumhardt


text:
Talk:SCIgen

Russian story
Two years ago the "Rooter" paper was translated into Russian by machine translator and was send to some Russian scientific journal. It was reviewed, and published after minor corrections! The case got high attention of the Russian mass media. You can gen get additional information in the Russian version of the page.195.208.224.130 (talk) 11:45, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Deletion of See also section
I deleted the "See also" section, which consisted only of a link to the Sokol Affair. Since the Sokol article was not randomly generated, and since there is no evidence in this article that SCIgen has ever been used for a similar hoax (that is, with real intent to deceive--the hoax mentioned was 'fessed up right away, and was not for publication), I really don't see any relationship between the two. Furthermore, the inclusion implies something that is not the case--that the Sokol hoax was as obvious as would be a SCIgen article submitted to a scholarly publication. On the contrary, Sokol went out of his way to make his hoax believable, which the "Rooter" article did not. Incidentally, a source should be cited for that information. Chick Bowen 22:54, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
 * It belongs there. See also doesn't mean they're exactly the same thing.  Just that maybe you'd like to read about this too.  Which is another hoax used to point fingers at people for sloppy reviewing of academic papers.  If you'd like, you might add a bit explaining the differences between the two hoaxes, but I don't see why an internal link is wrong. NickelShoe 23:49, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

Wild card?
I remember reading somewhere that the conference in addition to review papers had a few wild-card slots, and this paper was accepted as a wild card. That may not be true, but if it is, it should be included in the article. I just have no idea where I read it--it could have been about a different event. But if it really was accepted as a wild card, I'd say the conference is off the hook. NickelShoe 23:42, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Yep, it was accepted as a "non-reviewed" paper. This information is in the article, though not prominently. SpuriousQ 01:47, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

Page Down?
was anybody able to see the page in the last couple of months? i always get a "(110) Connection timed out"

Not an IEEE entry
This Wikipedia entry gives information about the SCIgen tool and is not about paper getting accepted at IEEE. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.220.147.28 (talk) 10:56, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

'Criticism concerning publishers' does not fit into the article
You could include this criticism to the wikipedia 'IEEE' article. This article is about a software tool for generating random paper and some of the paper which has been accepted. And please discuss this issue here instead of editing and re-editing all the time. This is a childish behavior. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.78.201.162 (talk) 18:45, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

Removal of institution from “List of works with noticeable acceptance”*
I am removing the Wessex Institute of Technology from the list as it is clearly malicious. Firstly, unlike the others institutions on the list citing a specific incident, the entry is written as if all conferences organized by this institute would or have accepted SCIgen papers. The blog posting on the SCIgen site (http://pdos.csail.mit.edu/scigen/blog/index.php?m=07&y=05 ) lists its creation as 2005 but the source for the Wessex inclusion relates to the VIDEA conference held in 1995, ten years prior to the creation of the program. Therefore, this clearly has no place in this article. Incedently no spoof paper was either accepted or published by Wessex Institute for the 1995 conference (or any other before or since) which is evident from the published proceedings. Please refere to the Transactions of the Wessex Institute where all the accepted papers for that conference are available on open access. (http://library.witpress.com/pages/listPapers.asp?q_bid=201) --Curuxz (talk) 14:43, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

Page just used to attack IEEE
It seems this page has little use other than to attack IEEE conferences, would it not be better served to split the two issues rather than use this backwater article about a minor piece of software to say what can't be said on the more prominent IEEE page? --Curuxz (talk) 19:03, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Since no one has shown interest in this other than to further use this page for their own ends I am moving for it to be deleted.--Curuxz (talk) 05:32, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Ike Antkare
Xe should be mentioned here, and perhaps at Google scholar as well. Tijfo098 (talk) 14:47, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

New software to detect such hoaxes
"John Bohannon It all started as a prank in 2005. Three computer science Ph.D. students at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology—Jeremy Stribling, Max Krohn, and Dan Aguayo—created a program to generate nonsensical computer science research papers. The goal, says Stribling, now a software engineer in Palo Alto, California, was "to expose the lack of peer review at low-quality conferences that essentially scam researchers with publication and conference fees." The program—dubbed SCIgen—soon found users across the globe, and before long its automatically generated creations were being accepted by scientific conferences and published in purportedly peer-reviewed journals. But SCIgen may have finally met its match. Last week, academic publisher Springer released SciDetect, a freely available program to automatically detect automatically generated papers."

HOAX-DETECTING SOFTWARE SPOTS FAKE PAPERS

Science 3 April 2015: Vol. 348 no. 6230 pp. 18-19 DOI:10.1126/science.348.6230.18 Dougweller (talk) 11:50, 5 April 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:SCIgen


text:
Talk:Chersonesus

Name of the article (vote on move in the next chapter)
Some aggressive nationalist has moved Chersonesos to its current Ukrainian (I suppose) spelling, unknown in English: Khersones. Is this an aid to the Wikipedia reader? Truly offensive. --Wetman 23:32, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Сполучені Штати Америки is the page for United States of America in the Ukrainian Wikipedia. If I went in there and changed it to United States of America, I would be recognized as a vandal— and an aggressive horse's ass. Chersonesos may not be a household word among players of Grand Theft Auto, but it is the name of long standing that identifies these Greco-Scythian archaeological sites, a title recognizable to every educated person. It happens to be Greek. These are the conventions of English. Why do we have to have every toxic little nationalism inflicted on us? --Wetman 23:44, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

 * As far as I understand, there used to be a page here and a separate page at Chersonesos. Charles Matthews merged the two at this title. platypeanArchcow 01:44, 15 Jun 2005 (UTC)

 * As per above discussion I fully agree that the article should exist under the name Chersonesus. Britannica also uses this name. The page cannot be moved because there is a history in both articles. I intend to submit a request at Requested moves but before I would be interested to hear whether there are possible reasons against the move. Thanks1 -Irpen July 1, 2005 00:07 (UTC)

 * The whole article is using the name Chersonesos, the other name appears only in the title. I think a move should be done. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 1 July 2005 00:15 (UTC)
 * I agree completely. The article should be moved to "Chersonesos". --Valentinian 1 July 2005 13:19 (UTC)
 * At worst, make a reference on the Khersones page and explain why the actual entry exists under Chersonesos. Although I would more likely search Khersones rather than Chersonesos. -- mno July 6, 2005 22:14 (UTC)
 * This can be easily handled. Khersones and Hersones would redirect to Chersonesos (to answer your mole likely search consern) and Khersones would be mentioned in the beginning of the Chersonesos articles as an UA/RU name. OK, no one seem to really mind. I will post a request at Requested moves soon. -Irpen July 6, 2005 22:24 (UTC)

(I'm abashed to read how vituperative I was above: but this is not just one isolated incident, nor just one slightly flawed move. I've seen so much of this manner of cultural bullying that I'm quite cross and raw-spirited on the subject. --Wetman 6 July 2005 22:42 (UTC))
 * Take it easy :). The vote below will be smooth, I am sure. --Irpen July 7, 2005 00:37 (UTC)

Move/Rename to Chersonesos
It is hereby proposed to move Khersones to Chersonesos to reverse current redirect. Historic name, most frequent ref, the article name in Britannica, more reasons above. The article is already written as if named Chersonesos. Please vote below. -Irpen July 7, 2005 00:37 (UTC)
 * Support --Irpen July 7, 2005 00:37 (UTC)
 * Support -- mno July 7, 2005 00:45 (UTC)
 * Support --Ghirlandajo 7 July 2005 07:55 (UTC)
 * Support —Michael Z. 2005-07-7 21:51 Z

 * It's done. Talrias (t | e | c) 10:19, 10 July 2005 (UTC)

Greek for 'Crimea'?
Perhaps I'm wrong, but my understanding is that Cherosonesos is applied to the whole of the Crimea Peninsula.

And as I recall, doesn't Euripides' Iphigeneia in Tauris take place here? --FourthAve 08:48, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

This article could be enriched, and further differentiated from that on the Crimea by adding mention of the literary traditions associated with it (as above), and also from Herodotus, who refers to the Kerch Strait as the Cimmerian Bosphorus and the Sea of Azov as Lake Maeetis, fed by the Tanaïs (Don) River. --FourthAve 22:49, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

You're all wrong!!!
Sorry I didn't post this last month, but I had no idea it was going on until now. You're all wrong! The traditional English is Chersonese. Just as Peloponnese doesn't belong at Peloponnesos or Peloponnesus, neither does this article belong at any of the alternative names. I don't know about Google testing, but applying the definitive Byron Test proves it beyond a doubt:
 * The tyrant of the Khersonesos Chersonesus  Hersonesos Chersonese
 * Was freedom's best and bravest friend
 * That tyrant was Miltiades!
 * Oh! that the present hour would lend
 * Another despot of the kind!
 * Such chains as his were sure to bind

See? --Jpbrenna 07:40, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Your right. Make the move.

 * If someone is going to move this, do it the right way (by using the Wikipedia "Move" function), not by creating a duplicate article with a different title!! And while you are at it, fix all the different spellings contained in the text of the article, please. --Russ Blau (talk) 15:08, August 31, 2005 (UTC)

I'm confused
It is quite difficult understanding if the article's title refers to the city or the region. If it's the region, as I think, the article should be renamed Tauric Chersonese. If instead it means the town, the article should be renamed Cherson. I'm willing to do it, but first I wanted to hear your opinions Aldux 11:45, 26 November 2005 (UTC)
 * I'll rename the article Tauric Chersonese in a day or two. Aldux 11:22, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

Needs information about the bell
I came here because I saw the image of the day -- the photo of the bell -- and I was curious about the bell. It seems odd to have nothing in the text of the article that relates to or discusses the picture that's featured most prominently. Can someone add something about it? JamesMLane t c 14:46, 4 November 2009 (UTC) I have published an article with some photos of mine about the bell a long time ago :) ISasha (talk) 09:53, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

Again on the article title
Once the disambiguating Taurica was added, the Latin Chersonesus seems to make more sense. I looked through the discussions above and did not find strong sentiment on the -os/-us issue, so I was bold and made the move. If this doesn't work for someone, perhaps we should consider the fully English Tauric Chersonese (in fact no objection from here if someone wants to move there).

Google Books
 * Tauric Chersonese = 6640x (= Taurica, not the subject of this article, according to this article)
 * Chersonesus Taurica = 3530x (moved to this title)
 * Tauric Chersonesus = 2540x (= Taurica)
 * Taurica Chersonesus = 1750x
 * Chersonesos Taurica = 437x (moved from this title: so you see why a move was necessary)
 * Tauric Chersonesos = 375x
 * Chersonesos Taurike = 191x
 * Chersonesos Taurika = 41x
 * Chersonesus in Taurica = 11x

(Feel free to add to the list above if this discussion continues.) Wareh (talk) 21:04, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

 * P.S. I was careless in not even noticing that our article states clearly, "It should not be confused with the Tauric Chersonese..." So I retract my statement of no objection to that name. Moreover, I would like to confess to some doubt now. If I had infinite time, I would go and verify whether "Chersonesus Taurica" in English usage refers to the city or to the larger region. If the latter, this article should probably be called Chersonesus with a parenthetical disambiguator. I take some slender & momentary comfort from:
 * the fact that B. de Koehne's work published in St. Petersburg with the title Issledovaniya ob istorii i drevnostyakh goroda Khersonesa Tavricheskogo has been Englished as "city of Chersonesus Taurica" in both Minns, Scythians and Greeks (CUP 1913), and in North Pontic archaeology: recent discoveries and studies (2001).
 * p. 389 of this book says "the early 4th c. BC, the period when - as most scholars believe - the city ofChersonesus Taurica was established."
 * All I can say for absolute sure is that the present title, Chersonesus Taurica, was an improvement over the ungainly Greek-Latin hybrid Chersonesos Taurica. If someone were to come along and prove that the present title is infelicitous and not the best English scholarly usage for the city, I wouldn't be surprised. Wareh (talk) 15:27, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I was bold and, noticing clear evidence of "Chersonesus Taurica" in reference to the region, moved to a version of Chersonesus. I'm pretty sure this is the WP:COMMONNAME & that the "Taurica" that someone added at some point in the article history was needlessly confusing. Wareh (talk) 16:54, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

Proposed merge into this page
Saw someone else had proposed merging Chersonesos Taurica into this page, there's a little bit of thread on another user's talk page User_talk:NTox. I'm holding off doing anything to the other page until seeing the consensus on whether to merge or not. Beth Holmes 1 (talk) 19:29, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

 * I was tempted to just make Chersonesos Tuarica into a redirect, but let me explain first in the hope that what to do will appear as straightforward to you as it does to me. The tourist attraction is already a part of this page, which has existed for more than seven years, namely the section Chersonesus_Taurica, so there is no need to break off that aspect into a new article. Simply add any important information from the Ukrainian page (which is already listed in the sidebar as the Ukrainian version of this article!) to the appropriate section. Chersonesos Tuarica, as a brand-new article (with a misspelled title) simply shouldn't stick around, but its content certainly can if it adds to what we already have. So, I say "yes" to the merge, as a no-brainer. I'm not sure what NTox's relation to the subject is, but that user may simply not have noted that we already have a unified article on ancient city and modern archeological site? Wareh (talk) 20:40, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

 * Thanks, that all makes sense. I've merged them now.Beth Holmes 1 (talk) 06:07, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the new content you've contributed to this article! Wareh (talk) 00:36, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

Requested move to Chersonesos

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: move to Chersonesus. Number   5  7  16:10, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Chersonesus (Crimea) → Chersonesos – Clearly the most notable place of this name. Existing page at Chersonesos should be moved to become a disambiguation page. – Relisted. BDD (talk) 18:39, 21 April 2014 (UTC) Kudzu1 (talk) 01:19, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Object to speedy this should be a regular discussion, its the type of move that WPRM was created for. -- 70.24.250.235 (talk) 03:54, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose – it does not even appear to be the right spelling for the one in Crimea; not to mention recentism; or that "most notable" is not a concept in WP. Leave the disambiguation page.  Dicklyon (talk) 05:00, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
 * "Most notable" isn't a concept? I think WP:PRIMARYTOPIC applies in this case. -Kudzu1 (talk) 16:19, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

 * I'd support moving the page to Chersonesus and Chersonesus to Chersonesus (disambiguation). The Crimean site is the most notable by far. Chersonesos (Sicily) is barely remembered, with no pages linking to it, apart from the disambiguation page. The article about the Cretan town is called Hersonissos, the "Chersonesus" form is out of use. Kherson was never known as Chersonesus at all. --Ghirla-трёп- 06:05, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
 * I support Ghirla on this one. Kudzu1, can you explain why you would want to use the different Greek transliteration of the name? To continue using the Latin name seems to make more sense: Google Books shows twice the amount of results for "Chersonesus Crimea" over "Chersonesos Crimea". --AlexanderVanLoon (talk) 11:41, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

 * I'm fine with Chersonesus, if that's what the community prefers. I listed Chersonesos in the move request because that's what the National Preserve of Tauric Chersonesos in Sevastopol calls it -- but if it's outweighed by other English-language sources, it's outweighed. -Kudzu1 (talk) 15:29, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

 * Support treating as primary meaning of whatever spelling is adopted, but there could be a legitimate debate about the exact spelling. PatGallacher (talk) 21:28, 22 April 2014 (UTC)

 * Support Ghirla's proposal (Chersonesus), but the margins seem closer than you think: the actual number of GBook hits for Chersonesus is 279, while for Chersonesos is 239. Jeez, when I click those links and re-count, it's 353:315. Anyway, the ratio seems to be about 5:4, and the site is primary topic for "Chersones*s". No such user (talk) 09:10, 12 May 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

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Russia map discussion
A Russia map was added whenever, then removed, then reinstated without discussion (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Chersonesus&diff=1093107376&oldid=1093066961). What's the policy on illegaly annexed territories? JidGom (talk) 14:16, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

Alledged destruction by russian authorities
Please note, the theatre that was allegedly built over the archaeological site by Russian authorities, was in fact built on a former military compound south of the archaeological site. Thus, it appears that the claim that the site was erased and built over is incorrect or is greatly exaggerated. --Diamonddavej (talk) 20:05, 2 July 2024 (UTC)

 * Which is not really surprising when media write about smth sensational they can not factcheck. Ymblanter (talk) 20:20, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
 * It is true that the main part of Chersonesus is fine, but the protected zone was damaged nevertheless. "An illegal new building in the southern suburbs of antique Chersonese has completely destroyed a cemetery dating back to the Roman Empire" per the Mission of the President. It is located in the buffer zone right on the border with the main site, see the map of the World Heritage Site. So the claim is not entirely false, only exaggerated. Shwabb1  ⟨ ta  co  ⟩  15:04, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Today, we got this article, which is clearly a reliable source. It does not confirm the claim of Ukrainian media about the "total destruction" but says indeed that some damage has been made to the site. Ymblanter (talk) 07:59, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
 * The article confirms the President's Mission's claim as well: "Комплекс возводят в так называемом Южном пригороде заповедника, где находились остатки некрополя с культовыми и мемориальными сооружениями. Эти территории относятся к буферной зоне ЮНЕСКО, где строительство возможно только с разрешения всемирной организации." So it does seem that the media exaggerated the claim despite the government never saying anything about total destruction. Shwabb1  ⟨ ta  co  ⟩  08:54, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Chersonesus