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 Tomlinson, Judge, his speech to the sheriffs, 26, n. 6.

Tom Po, a name for a spectre, 316. n. 4.

Tooth-ache, charms for the, 223 and n. 3.

Tottipottimoy, 190 and n. 3.

Toy, John, Life, ii.

Treason, punishments for, 391, n. 1.

Trees, diseases of, 261.

Trepanners, 303.

Triers, 123; office of the, 123, n. 3; called Cromwell's Inquisition, 124, n. 1.

Trigons, the, 250 and n. 4.

Trismegistus, 238 and n. 5; 239.

Trojan mare, 346 and n. 5.

Trout, caught with a single hair, 211 and n. 1.

Trover, action of, 418 and n. 2.

Truckle-bed, 119 and n. 4; 174 and n. 1

Trulla, beloved by Magnano, 56 and n. 5; her valour, 57; rescues the bear, 90; attacks Hudibras, 111; takes him prisoner, 113; grants him quarter, 115; protects him from the rabble, 116; her triumphal procession, 117; commits Ralpho and Hudibras to the stocks, 118.

Trustees, unsanctified, 330 and n. 1.

Truth, revealed to the perfect, 82, n. 1; Time's daughter, 239 and n.4; 210, n. 1.

Tully, 172 and n. 4.

Turks, their personal appearance, 52, n. 2.

Tutbury, custom of bull-running at, 47, n. 4.

Tyburn, executions at, 63, n. 6.

Tyrian petticoat, 200, n. 3.

Urine, a medium of detecting diseases, 225. n. 4.

Uses, in sermons, 330 and n. 6.

Usher, 139; meaning of the term, 139, n. 5.

Utlegation, 321 and n. 5.

Uxbridge, treaty of, 378 and n. 2.

Vagrants, ordered to be whipped, 166, n. 1.

Van and rear, 142, n. 4.

Van Helmont, 172 and n. 4.

Varlets-des-chambres, 151 and n. 4.

Vaughan, Dr, his discourse on the condition of man, 26, n. 1.

Vehicles, heavenly, 446 and n. 1.

Veils et remis, omnibus nervis, 67 and n. 1.

Venables and Pen, their expedition against the Spaniards, 408, n. 4.

Venice, Dukes of, marry the sea, 202 and n. 2.

Veni, vidi, vici, 110 and n. 1.

Venus, the goddess of love, 233 and n. 2.

Verè adeptus, 26.

Vermin, 326 and n. 3.

Vertagus, a dog so called, 98, n. 5.

Vespasian, daubed with dirt, 207 and n. 4.

Vessel, 285 and n. 3.

Vickars, John, 30 and n. 1.

Victories, pretended thanksgivings for, 405 and n. 4.

Victuallers and vintners, fines imposed on, 416 and n. 5.

Vies, the proud, 62 and n. 2.

Villains, 289 and n. 3.

Vinegar, eels in, 225 and n. 1.

Virgins, buried alive, 151, n. 1.

Virtue, said to be a body, 173 and n. 1, 2; and Honour, the temple of, 165 and n. 3.

Vis. franc, pledge, 185 and n. 4.

Vitilitigation, 128 and n. 4.

Vizard-bead, 304 and n. 5.

Vizard-masks, 294 and n. 3.

Vultures, opinion respecting, 211 and n. 5.

Wait, Simon, a tinker, 55, n. 3; his skill, 56 and n. 2.

Walker's History of Independency, 62, n. 4; 70, n. 4; 96, n. 1.


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Rh taken off on an improvised raft, and cared for by volunteers who had hastily organized to help in this time of stress and trouble.

"The fire will soon burn itself out," remarked Blake, as they went back to it again. "I'll get all the pictures I can, though."

There were only a few more houses left in the row that had started to burn, and when the last of these was gone there was a wide space which would preclude the possibility of more being devoured by the flames—at least until another blaze started.

There was nothing that could be done to check the conflagration. In fact, as the boys learned later, the town was without fire protection, save a volunteer company, with a hand engine, and this was, of course, useless in the flood.

Proceeding to a house at a point below which the small boats were engaged in rescue work, those aboard the Clytie saved a number of women and children. These were taken to a place of safety, and another trip back made.

"There goes the last house!" cried Blake, as, the final one in the row caught.

"Yes, and there's a woman signaling to us!" added Joe.

"Two of 'em!" yelled Mr. Piper, as he caught sight of two forms at a third-story window.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/


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128 This house was all aflame on one side, from the water's edge to the roof, but it had not yet kindled on the side where the women appeared. They had made their way to the top floor, perhaps on account of fire being below them.

"Jump!" yelled Blake, as he put aside his camera, for the reel of film had run out, and he did not want to stop to thread in more.

"Yes, jump!" added Mr. Ringold. "We'll save you—it's your only chance!"

"I'm coming!" answered one woman, and she made a dive into some deep water an instant later, evidently being an accomplished swimmer. She came up near the motor boat, and was promptly taken in.

"Come on!" cried Mr. Ringold to the other woman.

She hesitated, and drew back, evidently being in great fear, and she seemed to be saying something, for her lips could be seen to move.

"You must jump!" the manager shouted, as he slowly backed the boat to keep her as nearly as possible in a favorable position for picking up the woman when she dived.

She gave a backward look into the house, and what she saw must have caused her to make up her mind, for she prepared to leap into the flood below her.


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Rh The one who had been at the window with her, having gotten her breath after her leap, added her entreaties to those aboard the Clytie.

"Jump, Mary! Jump!" she begged. "It's your only chance!"

The woman at the window hesitated no longer. She tumbled, rather than dived, into the water, but the rescuers were on the alert, and though the woman came up some little distance from the craft, Blake, with a boathook, caught her dress, and pulled her close enough so that Mr. Piper could haul her aboard. Then the Clytie was put in motion, for the house was burning fast, and her position was anything but safe.

For a few moments after her rescue, the second woman thus saved was hysterical. But her companion attended her, and soon she was more like herself.

"You'll be all right in a little while," said Mr, Piper. "We'll take you to high ground, and the good women there will look after you."

"Oh, what a terrible time it has been—fire and flood!" murmured the one called Mary.

"It certainly has been, but the Lord is good to us—he sent these kind men and boys to save us," the other added, as she looked at Blake and Joe.

"If only He would give me back my little


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130 boy," sobbed the second woman saved. "But oh, the flood has taken him!"

She sobbed on her companion's shoulder.

"There, there," soothed the other, "you may find him some day. Don't take on so, Mary."

"I can't help it, Ellen. Oh, my poor boy!"

It was evident that she was referring to some previous loss. Charlie, who had been in the darkened cabin, started suddenly as he heard the voice of the woman called Mary. He now came out on the open deck, and stared curiously at her. And the woman, who was supporting the head of the other on her shoulder, looked at Charlie.

A change came over her face. She tried to speak but could not. Finally she did manage to gasp:

"Mary! Look! Look! Here's Charlie now! Here's your boy!"

The woman raised her tear-stained face. For a moment she did not comprehend, and then, as a look of great joy showed itself in her eyes, she held out her arms, crying:

"My boy! My boy! Charlie! Is it possible!"

And as for the little lad, with one glad cry, he threw himself into her loving clasp, sobbing over and over again:

"Mamma! Mamma! Oh, I am so glad!"


text: The Moving Picture Boys and the Flood/Chapter 15


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Rh colleague, Lyonne. Aramis took the letter and made ready to go.

"Wait," said Fouquet. He opened his drawer, and took out ten government notes which were there, each for a thousand francs. "Stay," he said; "set the son at liberty, and give this to the mother; but, above all, tell her not"

"What, monseigneur?"

"That she is ten thousand livres richer than I. She would say I am but a poor surintendant. Go, and I hope that God will bless those who are mindful of His poor!"

"So also do I hope," replied Aramis, kissing bouquet's hand. And he went out quickly, carrying off the letter for Lyonne and the notes for Seldon's mother, and taking up Molière, who was beginning to lose patience.

CHAPTER VII.

ANOTHER SUPPER AT THE BASTILE.

SEVEN o'clock sounded from the great clock of the Bastile, that famous clock, which, like all the accessories of the state prison, the very use of which is a torture, recalled to the prisoners' minds the destination of every hour of their punishment. The timepiece of the Bastile, adorned with figures, like most of the clocks of the period, represented St. Peter in bonds. It was the supper hour of the unfortunate captives. The doors, grating on their enormous hinges, opened for the passage of the baskets and trays of provisions, the delicacy of which, as M. de Baisemeaux has himself taught us, was regulated by the condition in life of the prisoner. We understand, on this head, the theories of M. de Baisemeaux, sovereign dispenser of gastronomic delicacies, head-cook of the royal fortress, whose trays, full laden, were ascending the steep staircases, carrying some consolation to the prisoners in the bottom of honestly filled bottles. This same hour was that of M. de Gouverneur's supper also. He had a guest to-day, and the spit turned more heavily than usual. Roast partridges flanked with quails and flanking a larded leveret; boiled fowls, ham, fried and sprinkled with white wine, cardons of Guipuzcoa and la bisque écrivisses—these, together with the soups and hors d'œuvre, constituted the governor's bill of fare. Baisemeaux, seated at table, was rubbing his hands

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Page:The Commonweal (IA 0544678.0001.001.umich.edu).pdf/9

, 1885

Dispatch a paper that is cer wholly devoted tal, had in its issue of February 11 a leader on Socialism. The article is apparently a leader on the  as almost to breed contempt—embodied in the  Latin phrase“lucus a non lucendo.” The article is as  as its writer is ignorant of the meaning of Socialism.

hat the writer knows little, if anything, of Socialists in shown by his ing of the “big words and the tone of mysterious importance always adopted by a Socialist.” Whenever the writer or any one else any one in England using big words or afflicted with a tone “of mysterious importance,” he may be sure that he has not met a Socialist. His words are foolish if they are not endorsed by large numbers, and unnecessary if they are thus endorsed.

As the Weekly Dispatch writer does not know our principles, his ignorance as to the “actual work” done is as natural as it is complete. He has evidently not read a line of any of the standard works on Socialism. It is doubtful if he has even skimmed airily through a pamphlet or two. Such papers as the Sozial-Demokrat, the Neu Volkszeitung, Recht vor Allen, probably never meet his eye. be interesting to know his views on the recent elections in Germany, and the number of open-air East-End meetings he has attended—as interesting as the study of any other non-existent quantity is to mathematicians.

It may be fair, as the lead-writer hath it, to take the manifesto published in To-Day of January as typical Socialist views. It would be fairer, in our opinion, if we may trouble our critic to read as many as two articles, were he to take “for a taste” the manifesto issued in this journal. In it, to note but a single point, he will find that State regulated labour and distribution are not, in Socialistic ideas, labour and distribution regulated by the State as it is to-day. “The State” will be as changed from what it now is and is not as events will be. This idea will come with a shock to our article-writer, who is clearly no revolutionist. For he talks of “the probable course of events continuing along the old lines.” Were he an evolutionist, he might be asked if there is any domain of Nature in which things do continue “along the old lines.” Not being an evolutionist, he might seriously maintain that the principle which governs alike the origin of worlds and the of a flower, does not hold in sociology.

“Extreme poverty” is sometimes caused by idleness, intemperance revidence. Sometimes also by the greed of rich employers, un- legislation, fluctuations of trade. We should be grateful for that o.” Even a writer in the capitalistic press should know, nay, does  of a swarm of other. “The greed of rich employers,” he lust for surplus-labour, is the parent of the whole spawn.

k also, the true capitalistic whine, not without its note on, “the rich being compelled to empty their pockets for the maintenance of the poor.” Not a word as to the emptying to-day, not ets, but of lives by the workers for the maintenance of the middle and upper classes; no word as to the means by which to-day kets have been filled; no word as to the honest work to be in the future by all not incapacitated by physical weakness or  idleness; no word as to the obliteration in the future of the  distinctions now warping and marring the life of man, and the  of those very hideous words “rich” and “poor.”

—is it, alas! or well a day?—at length we are in accord with our “We believe that co-operation amongst the labourers and in education will go far.” Socialists believe these will go further than the Weekly Dispatch even dreams, and not fare worse. Co-operation amongst labourers—truly. But not for profit—for justice. Education also. Not that they may be the better tools for the capitalist, but that they may understand who and what they are, who and what their eature the capitalist is. Our accord is but brief. In the same sentence as “co-operation and education,” we have “poor laws” and “charities.” When once the means of production are in the hands of the producers, and the producers are the whole community, poor laws and charities will have vanished with the rest of the offspring of capital.

The objectless objects are once again wearily revived. “How will we force men to save capital?” But capital is a means of production, and as such can never be the property of an individual, but the community. “How will the labourers be persuaded to work, if they cross their legs and talk Socialism, &c.” The host of lost  of here! Note one or two only. Labour will not then be the burden it is, bu the joy it should be. Crossing the legs is only nt after the energies have been in action. Talking Socialism then be like counting the number of respirations one marked per  now. And the writer forgets that we exempt from our pro as a nation, not only the stick, but the criminal, whose crime is, for whom and his fellows, ever diminishing in numbers, for ing time restriction will be needed.

our article-writer wants a guarantee that the best goods are to had at the lowest prices, and with a delicious unconscienceness opens  us the infinite vistas of adulteration under the present system. thereupon he sings his monotonous chant of individual freedom. artisan may now choose his favourite amusements as taste es.” And why, in the name of man, may he not under the ist regime? Under this, the only differences will be, that not only artisan of to-day, but the millions lower than he (save the mark!)  also be in a position to choose, and that the “taste” that is to  and heightened.

“The schools, theatres,” and the like are “to be supplied by the Government.” Truly. But not the Government as it is now and ever more ought not to be—a group of non-producers. And why this outcry against this arrangement in a paper that has been a persistent inconsistent supporter of Board schools from the outset?

The lofty conception that our critic has of his fellows, on the quoque principle, it is to be feared, is evidenced by one charming sentence. “The highest ambition of a citizen will be to talk the loudest and the longest in the public assembly, and his daily endeavour will be to grab his share of the national wealth while escaping the observation of the national overseer.” He is, as so many do, reading into the conditions that are coming the competition-spirit and dishonesty that are the natural outcome of the conditions now existent, and that will die with these.

The last paragraph is not without its sneer. In reply to that let me say two things as I end: (1) The League has already taken very definite shape, and is daily enrolling members and forming branches; (2) That which we call “with unintentional sarcasm scientific socialism” does actually exist. In evidence of this, the Socialist League has had the honour to forward to the writer of the article on English Socialism in the Weekly Dispatch a ticket of admission to the lesson to be given at South Place Institute. They will be an attempt to lay down a part, and only a part, of the scientific basis of our belief. EDWARD AVELING.

Two Courses of Eight Lessons each, on “Capital,” will be given at South Place Institute, Moorgate Street, under the auspices of the Socialist League. In these an attempt will be made to give an analysis of Karl Marx' Das Kapital.

Lesson 1.—Thursday, Feb. 12, 1885.—Matter. Motion. Nature. Product. Commodity. Use-value. Exchange-value. Reactive and equivalent forms. Accidental and rare exchange. Barter. General equivalent. Money. Price.

Lesson 2.—Thursday, Feb. 19—Circulation of commodities as a measure of value. As a standard of price. As a circulation. The metamorphosis of commodities. lation. Coin. Paper-money. Thesaurisation. ment. Universal money.

Lesson 3.—Thursday, Feb. 26.—The of money  capital. C-M-C¹ (Formula for simple circulation of commodities). M-C-M¹ (general formula for capital). Comparison of the two formulæ. M¹ = M+△M. △M = surplus-value. Capital Difficulties. The exceptional commodity needed. This commodity as labour-power. Labour. The labourer. Means of subsistence.

Lesson 4.—Thursday, March 5.—Labour-processes. Primitive objects. Raw material. Means of labour. Means of production. Consumption. Result of labour. Capitalist and labourer. Labour preserves and creates value. Use-value and value of means of production. Surplus-value again. Constant and variable capital. Surplus-product. Surplus-labour.

Lesson 5.—Thursday, March 12.—The working-day. Its limits. The lust for surplus-labour. English industries under no limitation as to the length of the working-day. Day and night work. Relay system. The struggle between capitalists and labourers IP to the end of the seventeenth century. Compulsory limitation. Factory Acts, 1833-64. Effect of English legislation on other countries. Rate of surplus-value.

Lesson 6.—Thursday, March 19.—Necessary labour-time. Surplus labour-time. Absolute surplus-value. Relative surplus-value. Co-operation. Early forms. Capitalistic form. Manufacture. The piece-worker. Heterogeneous manufacture. Serial manufacture. Comparison. Capitalistic character of manufacture

Lesson 7.—Thursday, March 26.—Definition of machine. Motor, transmitter, tool. Heterogenous machinery. Serial machinery. Effect on the product; on the labourer. Lengthening of working-day. of labour. Factories. The Grand industry and agriculture. Factory legislation.

Lesson 8.—Thursday, April 2.—Recapitulation of the subject-matter dealt with in preceding lessons.

The Second Course of Eight Lessons will commence on Thursday, April 16. They will deal with the production of absolute and of relative surplus-value. Wages. Accumulation. The abstinence theory. Over-population. Expropriation and exportation. The farmer capitalist. The industrial capitalist. The colonial system.

The lessons will be given by Edward Aveling, Fellow of Univ. Coll., Lond.

On Saturday, Feb. 7, a Public Meeting will be held at South Place INstitute, at 8:30 P.m., to explain the objects of the lessons. William Morris, J. L. Mahon, Edward Aveling, S. Mainwaring, C. Mowbray, Joseph Lane, and others will speak.

Lectures free for members of the Socialist League; non-members, 3s. per course of eight lessons; 6d. one lesson. Apply to Edward Watson, 27, Farringdon.

All receipts, a ry expenses, go to the of the League.


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 Waller, his poem of Saccharissa, 159, n. 3.

Waller, Sir William, defeat of, 62, n. 2; 405, n. 1.

Walnut-shell, tire spit out of a, 223 and n. 5.

Walton, Izaak, poem quoted, 84, n. 2.

War, civil, subverts the order of things, 240, n. 2; creating and making of, 360 and n. 3; the modern way of, 407 and n. 1.

Warburton, Bishop, 132, n. 2.

Warmestry, afterwards Dean of Worcester, Life, ii.

Warts, charmed away, 223 and n. 2.

Watches, pendulums to, 284 and n. 2.

Water, objects reflected in, 270 and n. 1.

Water-rat, 408 and n. 2.

Wedlock, without love, 147 and n. 3.

Welkin, 137 and n. 5.

Wesley, Samuel, lines by, Life, xv.

Westminster Abbey, monument to the memory of Butler in. Life, xiv.

Whachum, Sidrophel's zany, character of, 225 and n. 2; 227, 231, 232, 233, 253, n. 4; 254, 256, 258, 259.

Whale, 230; with legs, 230, n. 6.

Whetstones, 138; meaning of the term, 138, n. 2.

Whifflers, 198 and n. 3.

Whimsied chariots, 264, n. 4.

Whinyard, signifies a sword, 102, n. 3; 103.

Whipping, virtue's governess, 165 and n. 5.

Whipping-post, described, 83 and n. 2.

Whitehall, cabal at, 347, n. 2.

White-pot, 16.

White, Thomas, 172 and n. 4.

Whittington, legend of, 352 and n. 2.

Whore of Babylon, 127 and n. 2; 355 and n. 4.

Widgeon, or Pigeon, 14, n. 1.

Widow, the, beloved by Hudibras, 96; conjectures respecting, 96; is informed of the Knight's captivity, 139; sets out to visit him, 139; her conference with him, 142; recommends hanging, or drowning. 153; ridicules love-compliments, 157; eulogizes whipping, 165; releases Hudibras on terms, 169; is visited by Hudibras, 274; her interview with him, 275; exposes his falsehood, 283; ridicules matrimony, 287, 302; treats him with a masquerade of devils, 306; receives an epistle from the Knight, 424; her answer, 436.

Widows, Indian, burnt on the funeral piles of their husbands, 290 and n. 3.

Wight, Isle of, negotiation in the, 377, n. 5.

Wind, in hypocondres pent, 244 and n. 2.

Windore, or window, 50; 151 and n. 6; 188.

Wines, working of, 146 and n. 4.

Witches, said to ride upon broomsticks, 89, n. 4; 283 and n. 1; their prayers said backwards, 98 and n. 2; drawing blood of, 136 and n. 1; thrown in water, 154, n. 2; make pictures to destroy, 186, n. 3: of Lapland, sell bottled air, 187 and n. 3; persecution of, 215 and n. 5; execution of, 216 and n. 2; ghost of one, 282 and n. 1; crony, 309 and n. 3.

Wither, George, a party writer, 30, n. 1.

Withers, a puritanical officer, 217, n. 5.

Witnesses, winding up of, 188 and n. 1; hireling, 422, n. 2.

Wives, a dose of, 252 and n. 1.

Wizards, on consulting, 211 and n. 3.

Woman, piety and energy of, 203, n. 3.

Women, old, juries of, 286 and n.


text: The Commonweal/Volume 1/Number 1/British Socialism and the “Weekly Dispatch”


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3 Mr. Sofer. Okay. We just—initially, we did a couple of quick housekeeping matters before we started, but we just wanted to confirm that this is, in fact, a closed hearing, that there's no members of the media or anybody else—I mean, we obviously saw many members of the media running around right outside the door, but I just wanted to confirm that it wasn't being piped into any other public forum or anything like that.

Nope, not at all.

No. The rules, Gregg, as we explained by phone, provide this is an executive session of the select committee, so it's not a public proceeding. No press, no one other than the people in the room. I see your lawyer, Mr. Jensen, and—

Mr. Sofer. Well, he's not technically my lawyer. I wish he was.

. Right, you're correct. So, no, that's correct, no other participants.

Mr. Sofer. Okay. And we're going to have just—I want to understand the process. We'll have some exhibits, including we want the opening statement obviously to be made part of the record.

. Sure.

Mr. Sofer. We'll have some other exhibits we'd like to be made part of the record. Is there—I'm used to courtrooms, not rooms like this, so tell us what—how you would like us to proceed procedurally with respect to exhibits.

. In terms of you providing us exhibits?

Mr. Sofer. Yeah, I mean, as we go through them, or do you want us to stop and say we'd like this to be—we've marked them already. I just want to do it in a way that's smooth for the committee.

. I'm sure it will be fine. Yeah, we'll coordinate on it. If you've marked your own numbers, that's fine. I'll mark this as 53. I think we're up to


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 Much of the substance of the lectures which I have delivered before the Royal Academy since the year 1880 has been incorporated with the present manual, but it is necessary to state that some of the original material to be found in the following pages has been long before the artistic world, and has found its way into the books and essays of other writers. I say this, not for the purpose of making reclamations of priority, but in order to prevent myself from being charged with plagiarism. For instance, so long ago as 1859, I described, for the first time, some of the artistic uses of solid paraffin in a paper on the processes of painting, read before the Oxford Architectural Society; further details were given in a lecture to the Architectural Association in 1862. On many other matters connected with the chemistry of paints and painting, new investigations and studies were published by me between the years 1867 and 1872, particularly in notes and essays entitled 'Chemical Aids to Art,' and 'The Chemistry of the Fine Arts.' But my statements and results, whether contained in the above publications or in my Academy lectures, have not been, in all instances, referred to their source, or reproduced with accuracy, while some have been overlooked or forgotten.

In preparing the present volume I have made considerable use of several of the works named in my Bibliographical Notes; I have consulted also the standard chemical dictionaries of Watts and of Wurtz, the treatise by Roscoe and Schorlemmer, besides many special papers


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 by other chemists. I wish I could have given an authority for every statement not derived from my personal experience, but in an elementary manual treating of many diverse topics such a plan, even if it could have been carried out, would have embarrassed my story with a multitude of perplexing references.

I do not know of any one text-book which covers the same ground as the volume now offered to the public. Several small books on pigments—the most important of all the materials employed by the artist — have indeed been lately published, but the chemical information they afford is generally meagre, and sometimes far from exact. One recent little brochure, which lies before me, has, I confess, caused me some amusement not wholly unshaded with regret. The writer does not pose as a humourist, yet he tells us, when we test for lead in cadmium red, first to mix the sample with white lead before applying the usual test for that metal. Chinese vermilion, he informs us, is sulphide of arsenic, though it is really sulphide of mercury. The presence of sulphides of baryta and lime is stated in one place to lend a softness to the chromates of lead ; as these sulphides instantly blacken these brilliant chromates, perhaps they may be said to soften them. Cœruleum, a stannate of cobalt, is directed to be made of carbonate of soda, powdered flint, and oxide of copper, its two essential constituents, the oxides of tin and cobalt, not being named. These and many other equally preposterous statements and directions may afford merriment to the chemist, but


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 it is indeed pitiable that such teaching should be seriously offered to artists and art-students.

It is satisfactory to know that several accomplished chemists are now devoting themselves to the practical study and improvement of pigments. Mr. A. P. Laurie, Mr. H. Seward, and Mr. J. Scott Taylor, are all doing good work in this direction.

It remains for me to express the hope that the readers of this volume will favour me with any material at their disposal which may serve for the correction and improve- ment of its pages. I am aware of having omitted to notice many interesting matters ; amongst these I include certain pigments, derived from coal-tar products, which have not yet been sufficiently tested. Then, too, the materials and methods of ceramic and glass painting have been excluded from consideration, mainly because their adequate treatment, while demanding much space, would have appealed to a comparatively limited group of students.

If painters and chemists will grant me their help, I trust that I may further justify, by means of an improved edition of my book, the favourable reception which I hope may be accorded to the first.

, March, 1890.


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SIR A. H. CHURCH, FR.S.


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332 woodcutter, to save the seedlings beneath from damage, lops off the crown of the tree with an axe at a point below the first branch before felling the trunk.

The oaks in the German forest of Spessart have been so frequently mentioned by recent writers on Forestry that I need not say anything of them, but doubt whether they equal the oaks in some of the few remaining virgin forests of Slavonia. In 1900 I saw a splendid lot of clean straight logs 3 to 5 feet in diameter, which had been felled in these forests, and floated down the Save to Bosnabrod.

We are indebted to Dr. Simonyi Semadam Sandor, a member of the Hungarian Parliament, for an account of the oaks of Slavonia in the Forest of Brod Petevarad, which is published in a Hungarian journal called Erdzesti Lapok, at Buda Pesth, June 1889, with photographs showing splendid clean-stemmed trees, 30 to 40 metres high, and 2 to 3 metres in diameter.

The European oak seems able to grow well in temperate parts of the southern hemisphere. In Chile it seems as much at home as in Europe, and not only grows much faster, but reproduces itself with such ease from seed on land capable of being irrigated that I saw no reason why it should not be cultivated for its timber.

In South Africa the original Dutch settlers planted oaks near Cape Town, and under one of these trees the Convention was signed by which the Colony was transferred to Great Britain in 1814. On 5th April 1905 my brother posted me a few acorns from this tree, the trunk of which is now hollow and bricked up. I sowed them in May to see whether they would at once revert to their proper season of growth; and out of twenty acorns, three germinated in June, and are now nice young trees, the others never coming up at all.

In North America I have seen no European oaks of any great size, though there is one in Prof. Sargent's grounds near Boston, which has puzzled several good botanists as to its origin.

The liability of the oak to be struck by lightning was noted by Shakespeare, who, in King Lear, Act III. Scene ii., wrote—

Mr. Menzies says, "Of all forest trees oaks are, In my experience, the most dangerous. If they have a large spreading head, they are shivered into shreds when struck. If they have long tapering stems, and thus can act almost as conductors, they are not so dangerous, and the lightning will run down the side, ploughing out a deep furrow. I have once seen a beech struck, an ash once, an elm once, a cedar of Lebanon once, but never any other trees, except the oak. And while the others stood comparatively singly in an open space, the oaks have been selected and struck in the midst of a thick wood."


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4 exhibit 53.

Mr. Sofer. Okay.

Okay?

Mr. Sofer. Okay. Great.

Anything else?

Mr. Sofer. No. Anybody else? I think we're ready to proceed.

The Witness. Jeff, do you got anything?

Mr. Jensen. No, I do not. Thank you.

. Okay. This is a deposition of Mr. Kash Patel conducted by the House Select Committee to Investigate the January 6th Attack on the United States Capitol, pursuant to House Resolution 503.

Could you all state your names for the record, please?

Mr. Sofer. Sure.

Ms. Lomax. Brittany Lomax with Husch Blackwell.

Mr. Sofer. Gregg Sofer with Husch Blackwell.

The Witness. Kashyap Patel.

Mr. Glabe. Scott Glabe, Husch Blackwell.

Mr. Jensen. Jeff Jensen with Husch Blackwell.

Great. On this side, the select committee members, my name is. I'm the senior investigative counsel.

I'm. I'm the chief investigative counsel.

I'm, investigative counsel.

., researcher.

. And also on Webex is, a staffer, as well as—I think that's it.


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Joe and the others looked on in bewildered surprise at this touching scene. That Charlie should have found his mother in this fashion seemed scarcely possible, yet such was the fact.

For several moments mother and son were in each other's arms, murmuring over and over again their protestations of love, and words of wonderment at the meeting.

"Where did you find him?" the mother finally demanded, of our friends aboard the motor boat. "Oh, where ever did you find him?"

"We got him out of a house, just as we did you," said Mr. Ringold, "only it was an upside-down house, and not a burning one. And so he is really your lost boy?"

"Of course he is!" she cried, while Charlie added:

"She's my mamma! I'm awful glad you found her for me. Where have you been, Mamma?"


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132 "It's a long story," she sighed. "But first I want to hear about you. Oh, I thought I would never see you again."

"It won't take long to tell all we know about it," said Mr. Ringold, and he related the facts of the rescue of the boy they had christened Charlie House.

"His name is Charlie Wentworth," explained his mother, "and that was our house from which you saved him. It's strange he did not know his last name, and where he lived, for he has often been lost, and he could always tell where he lived all right."

"I guess the flood frightened him," said Blake, with a smile. "How did he happen to be left in the house?"

"It was because of the confusion of the flood in our town," explained Mrs. Wentworth. "My husband and I were trying to save some of our things, taking them to my mother's place on a hill. We had taken Charlie to a neighbor's house before the water actually reached our dwelling, but he must have wandered back into it again when we did not know it, and have gone to sleep in the bed."

"Yep. I went to sleep in bed," supplemented the lad, with a happy laugh.

"Then the levee gave way suddenly," went on


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5.

.

Under the House deposition rules, neither committee members nor staff members may discuss the substance of testimony provided today unless the committee approves release. You and your attorney will have an opportunity to review the transcript.

I should say that there may be members who appear via Webex, and I'll do my best to acknowledge once they are on the Webex platform. They do have the opportunity to ask questions as well.

Let me give you some ground rules. We will follow the House rules that were provided to you as part of the subpoena that you had. Under the House deposition rules, counsel for other persons or government agencies may not attend. You are permitted to have an attorney present, as obviously you do.

There is an official reporter transcribing the record of this deposition. Please wait until each question is completed before you begin your response so there's not overtalk. Obviously, the stenographer cannot record nonverbal responses. We ask that you provide complete answers based on your best recollection, and if my questions are not clear, please ask at me to clarify them.

If you need any time to consult with your attorney, feel free to do so. We'll pause. As I mentioned to Mr. Glabe, there's no rounds of questions. We'll take a break maybe every hour if you need one, and at every kind of turn of topic, I'll see if there's additional questions from staffers or from members.

If you refuse to answer a question based on privilege, staff may either respond with the deposition on seeking a ruling from the chairman on the objection, which is a separate proceeding we can talk about. But I want to remind you that it is unlawful to


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Rh his mother, "and our house, and several others, were carried away. My husband and I supposed Charlie was safe at the neighbor's until we got there and found him missing. We were frantic, and searched everywhere for him, never dreaming he was in our own house. Then the flood grew worse and we had to flee to high ground. We gave him up for drowned. Oh, it does not seem possible that I have him again!"

"Where is your husband now?" asked Mr. Ringold, as he guided the boat toward the place where the other rescued persons had been landed.

"We came on to this town, where my sister lived," went on Mrs. Wentworth. "This is my sister," she added, nodding toward the woman who had first dived into the flood. "We had to take refuge with her, as we had no other home, and we did not think the flood would come here also. But it did, and it brought my little boy to me!" she cried, as again she clasped him in her arms.

"My husband is out, doing relief work," she resumed, after a moment. "We heard a rumor, this morning, that some children had been rescued from a raft farther down the river and he went down there to investigate, thinking, and hoping against hope, that our Charlie might be one of them.


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134 "He will be more than surprised when he comes back to find my sister's house burned in the flood, and that I have Charlie. Oh, I wish he were here now!"

"I want to see papa!" broke in Charlie.

"And so you shall, my dear boy, as soon as he comes back. I expect him to-night," said Mrs. Wentworth. "Oh, I cannot thank you enough—ever!" and she gazed fondly at our friends.

"It wasn't anything," said Mr. Ringold. "We happened to visit the house out of curiosity, and of course we brought Charlie away when we found him. He's a brave little chap."

A little later the temporary camp, on the high ground, was reached, and there Mrs. Wentworth, her sister and son were cared for by loving hands. The others who had been saved from the burning houses were also being looked after.

"Well, I guess we've done all we can here," said Blake, as they prepared to resume their journey down the river.

The blazing houses were burning themselves out, down to the edge of the water, and the danger from the flames was over. But the peril of the flood still remained, for the waters slowly continued to rise.

"We found Charlie's folks," remarked Joe,


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PRECIOUS STONES. 69 Illustrations, pp. x+164. Price 2S. 3d. New Edition.

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Rh when they had bidden an affectionate farewell to the boy's mother, aunt and others of the rescued ones, "we found Charlie's folks, but we can't seem to locate our own friends."

"And yet we may find them in just as unexpected a manner as we found Mrs. Wentworth," spoke C. C. "I tell you I'm mighty glad we happened along when we did. It's just like a story out of a book."

"It would make a good moving picture, if we could show it all complete," spoke Blake.

"It could be worked up into a drama, with the flood scenes you have," declared the theatrical manager. "I could film the missing scenes later. I believe I will."

"There'll be one happy father to-night," observed Joe, thoughtfully. "When Mr. Wentworth comes back, unsuccessful, and finds his son, he sure will be happy!"

"We'll miss the little chap," spoke Blake. "He was as good as gold while he was with us."

On the chance that there might still be some in need of rescue in the town where the houses had burned, the Clytie went back through the flooded streets, but men in small boats were patrolling the district, and, thanking our friends for their work, said they would look after matters now.


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136 "But there won't be much left to look after, if this keeps on," spoke one man, gloomily enough, as he looked over the burned section, and the flooded village. "We've been smitten mighty hard."

"But we'll come up again, when the waters go down!" cried another, more cheerfully. "It might be worse. No lives have been lost, so far, that's one blessing!"

"That's a good way to look at it," said Mr. Ringold, as he directed the craft out into the main flood again, and turned her bow down stream.

As they were all tired, and wet from the work of rescuing those who had leaped into the water, it was decided to make a stop, tie up, have something to eat, and clean the boat, for there was much mud and water aboard from the clothing of the saved ones.

Accordingly, in a sheltered cove, tied to a tree that stuck up out of the flood, they made a halt. The preparation of the meal, and the cleansing of the boat took longer than they expected, and as Blake wanted to get some pictures of that flooded section, they decided to remain there over night, and proceed in the morning.

The weather had cleared again, at least for the time being, and, aside from their anxiety


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Rh about the missing ones, our friends were fairly comfortable. They had put on dry clothing, and sat in the cabin of the boat, discussing the strenuous scenes through which they had recently passed.

A loud crash awakened them all about midnight, no watch having been kept. It sounded like some great explosion, close at hand.

"What was that?" cried Blake, sitting up in his bunk.

He had his answer a second later, for there was a blinding flash, and another booming sound.

"Thunder and lightning!" exclaimed Joe. "It's a storm!"

A moment later there came a deluge of rain, that fairly roared as it struck the deck and awnings of the boat.

"Whew!" exclaimed Blake. "This is fierce! If this keeps up long the flood will exceed its own high-water mark."

"Better take a look at the cable," suggested Mr. Ringold. "We don't want to get adrift in this outburst."

Blake put on a raincoat, and stepped outside. The vivid lightning, and the deafening thunder, kept up, and he was forced to cling to the rail to steady himself against the motion of the craft,


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138 and the force of the wind. The Clytie was tugging hard at her mooring cable, which was strained taut.

"It wouldn't do any harm to put on another rope!" cried Blake.

"We'll do it," answered Mr. Ringold, from the sleeping cabin.

Blake made his way to the cleat to which the boat end of the rope was made fast. He saw, with concern, that the rope was frayed, and would not hold much longer.

"Better hurry!" he called, but he had scarcely spoken when the very sky seemed rent with a bolt of lightning, and, as the raging, roaring, flooded river was lighted up by the flash, the rope parted and the motor boat was carried away.

"We're adrift!" yelled Blake, as intense darkness succeeded the bright glare.


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 The Akuan or Spirit-Friends

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in our philosophy. Shakespeare's Hamlet.

Akuan is the term generally in use among Negri Sembilan Malays to designate the Spirit-friends which certain individuals among them are believed to have from among the inhabitants of the spirit-world. Other terms are used in other parts of the Peninsula, and the belief varies with different states in matter of details. In this paper I am speaking of it as it obtains in the "Nine States," particularly those portions of it inhabited by the descendants of the old Menangkabau tribes. The persons credited with the possession of the spirit-friends are usually those having some pretension to the knowledge of a pawang, a diviner, or a medicine-man. They may be men or women, "wizards" or "witches," but in either case they are almost always past middle-age. The word akuan is derived from aku, to own or to claim as one's own; while the thing owned is supposed to be a spirit which may either remain in its natural airy state—a sort of Ariel to the Malay Prospero—or may take the shape of the body of some animal, ordinarily a tiger, for its permanent residence. The "owner" may possess one or both of these two types. But if he is master of the first type, he is as a rule master also of the second. As for the first type, their "owners" are mostly anen, and the number of akuan belonging to each owner is always more than one, ranging from three or four to a dozen or more. They may be male or female, but more often the latter if the owners are men. Their relationship to the owner is, without exception, that of old acquaintances rather than of intimate friends or of servants and master. Hence, they are less under control and never so devoted to the owner as the animal type. Some far-off locality is assigned to each of them as dwelling place—such and such a mountain, rapid, kĕmpas tree (Cumpassia malaccensis), ravine, plain or forest. The names by which they are mentioned are not proper names, but merely epithets descriptive of their sex and dwelling. They do not come unless ceremonially conjured in a solemn séance-like-fashion. This is only done when their aid is imperatively needed on the occasion of very urgent sickness which has taxed all the wit and skill of the medicine-men to cure. Otherwise it is considered improper or even sacrilegious to mention them.


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6 deliberately provide false information to Congress.

Since this is a deposition under oath, I'm going to ask to swear you in, if you could stand and take that oath.

Court Reporter. Do you solemnly declare and affirm under the penalty of perjury that the testimony you shall give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

The Witness. I do. Thank you.

Mr. Sofer. Can I just—I'm sorry to interrupt already—

Sure.

Mr. Sofer. —but can I just ask a couple quick questions? Are the two of you the only people that are going to be asking questions in this room other than the potential members who join us?

Yes.

Yes.

Mr. Sofer. Okay. And I just want to warn everyone that we were told this was going to be a 4-hour block, and we're up against a—my flight in particular, so it's a pretty hard stop.

We should get started.

Mr. Sofer. So we're willing to push as quickly as we can.

Great. Mr. Patel, I see that you have an opening statement that you'd like to provide. I've marked it as exhibit 53, but go ahead and read it or submit it for the record.

. If you want to read it, you can, or if you want in the interest of time.

The Witness. I'd appreciate it if I could read it into the record. Thank you.


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7 Sure.

The Witness. Members of the select committee and staff, good afternoon. I am here today because I am willing and able to share with you and the American people the truth about the events of January 6th, including the Department of Defense's preparation for and response to the unrest at the Capitol.

I am and will remain proud of my 16 years in public service, including during the Trump administration. Let me say unequivocally that I have no information about and never would have participated in any attempt to improperly maintain power following the conclusion of President Trump's term.

I'm also proud to have been the first person of color to serve in several of the positions that I held in government.

I want to state for the record that I'm here voluntarily, and the subpoena served on me on September 24th was not necessary to secure my appearance. The committee contacted me privately and asked me to voluntarily could've contact me—excuse me—provide information as it has done for dozens, if not hundreds, of other witnesses. Instead I—

Mr. Sofer. Slow down for the stenographer.

The Witness. Sorry. I should know that.

Instead, I first learned that I had been issued a subpoena without prior reach from the committee when members of the media contacted me on the evening of September 23rd on my personal cell phone. I had still yet to be served with a subpoena or any notice of it.

I was subsequently the victim of vile, racist, and physically threatening messages. To quote some, "Pack your fucking carpet bag and start swimming, you fucking treasonous bitch. America is going to chew you up and they'll slice that fucking sand


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 The method of conjuring them, which is more or less the same in main details for every "owner," may probably be of some special interest to students of modern Spiritualism. A general description of it like the following which has been gathered from a number of villagers who have themselves seen the proceeding independently of each other at different places and times, may be obtained almost anywhere among the rustic population of Ulu Jĕmpul, Kuala Jĕmpul, Batu Kikir, Juasseh, Sungai Dua, Sĕri Měnanti, Rĕmbau, Jělěbu, Lĕngging, Bĕranang and other places. The ceremony is called Běrějin (from Jinn, genii or demon) or Bĕrhantu, literally to call up spirits or to have spirit-meetings. It is always performed during the first part of the night at the patient's house, and occupies some three hours, say from 8 to 11 p.m. The function being one not often met with, the people within one mile and a half around regard it with great interest and come to attend in crowds. The owner of the akuan plays the part of a medium, and some one, usually his wife or one of his closest lady-friends or pupils, takes up the rôle of an interpreter, as the medium will talk in some language unknown to the uninitiated audience. Before the meeting begins the preparations for it have to be got ready. This consists of bĕrteh (toasted wet rice-in-the-husk), three or five or seven pots (pěrěni or buyong) of water, betel-leaves and all their accompaniments arranged in the most ceremonial manner in a richly ornamented bujam, or pĕrminangan. To all these are added new, rich little mats, spread specially for the expected spirit-guests, so that the scene presented "is just like one when there is going to be a marriage ceremony" (macham orang na' nikah). All the relatives and friends of the patient are informed and asked to be present, as the occasion will finally settle whether the sickness is curable or fatal. As the expected hour comes, the actor of the evening arrives. All is now solemn and silent. He takes his seat on the rich mat reserved for him near the other articles of preparation. He veils his face, and then recites some strange songs of invocation in a weird appealing tune, and in a language partly unintelligible. He begins to be unconscious as the trance state of mind gradually overmasters and takes possession of him. He shivers terribly while the smell and smoke of the burning incense (kĕměnyan) becomes suffocatingly diffused in the air. He may dash his hands and feet against the floor and his body against the wall. He may even rise, walk about the room, throw off his veil, disclose his flashing blood-shot eyes, sit upon the earthenware pots, snatch some of the red-hot cinders from the incense-urn (pěrasapan, pěbaran or tĕmpat bara) and chew them in his mouth—all these without causing himself the least injury. The house shakes and the spectators are full of awe. As the medium grows more and more frantic in his movements and recitations, the spirits invoked come one by one. Sometimes only one of them turns up, the others excusing inability. If they are Moslems their greeting on arrival would be "Assalāmu 'alai-kum" communicated through the


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8 monkey neck of yours in prison on day one. They always need a couple token niggers to use. We may even be able to execute you bastards, cut your fucking head off the way they do in your country. You are a traitor and will pay," end quote.

These threats have been reported to the FBI and marked as exhibit—our exhibit 1 for entry into the record.

Mr. Sofer. So we have that exhibit here, and it's marked as K. Patel Exhibit No. 1. We'd like to submit it for the record.

. Great. Thank you.

Mr. Sofer. I ask that it be made part of the record.

. You can just pass it to the reporter. Thanks.

The Witness. I was therefore extremely upset when, after these threats of violence were made known to the committee, Representative Schiff personally attacked me in an October 14th New York Times podcast as a, quote, "evil Zelig," end quote, and part of a group of, quote, "unscrupulous," end quote, advisers.

These inflammatory remarks caused me to question whether I could or would receive a fair hearing before this committee. Nevertheless, my attorneys communicated my continued willingness to appear and answer your questions.

On October 19th, they were told that I had been subpoenaed because the committee had incorrectly assumed that I would not be cooperative. During that meeting, committee staff expressly reclassified me as a cooperative witness and committed to withdrawing the subpoena in connection with my agreement to appear for a voluntary interview.

On November 20th, the committee abruptly reversed course. During a call on November 20th, staff apologized for misleading my lawyers while insisting that I appear under subpoena. The committee then showed extreme reluctance when we tried to


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 by the interpreter. Those of them who are not Moslems employ some other polite formula. At each arrival the interpreter introduces the guest to the audience—as Dato' of this mountain or that mountain, etc. They are, of course, not visible but to the unconscious medium who, through the interpreter, most politely motions them each to their reserved seat. When all have arrived and seated themselves, one of them asks: "What is it that you all want, friends, that you call us? We shall always be pleased to do you any little service that we can." These words are spoken by the medium to the interpreter in a strange language. On their being interpreted, the relative sitting closest to the patient speaks out, describing the patient's sickness, the length of the time he or she has suffered, the powerlessness of the medicine-men to cope with it, and asking for an explanation of the cause, the possibility of cure, and the treatment for such a cure. The interpreter communicates this to the medium who, as the embodiment of all the spirit-guests for the time being, replies after a few minutes' real or pretended meditation. The reply will be that the sickness was caused by such and such evil influence (kĕlĕguran or badi); malicious persons (di-buatkan orang) or whatever it may be, at such and such place and on such and such occasion: that such and such is the treatment for its cure. Or he might say: "This so-and-so's sickness is incurable. There is no hope. Be resigned." If many of the spirits are present, they all agree in the decision given. This done, they all leave; and after some half-an-hour's more exertion, the medium comes back to his senses, extremely exhausted. He will immediately quit the house without a word, and go home accompanied, it is alleged, by "his" mysterious tiger.

On the other hand, if the akuan is one that permanently assumes the form of an animal, it is to all appearance sexless. Even if it belongs to any particular sex, the distinction is regarded indifferently. As for number, never or very seldom more than one of such animal—akuan belong to any one master. But that one acts towards him more like a faithful attendant than a far-off friend. The animal is not known by any special name. Its dwelling place depends upon the nature of the animal whose form is adopted by the spirit. Mostly the form adopted is that of a tiger, and so it lives in the forest over which it is supposed to wander like all ordinary tigers. Its assistance is not invoked, as it is always ready to help when the need arises, provided such emergency occurs, so to speak, within its "sphere of influence," that is to say, where it can make its appearance consistently with its natural form. A tiger, for instance, cannot live in the water, but in the jungle or in the dark it can render services to the "owner" in many ways. When he loses his way in the forest, the tiger would come and lead him out by distinct marks and scratches on the ground. He has no cause to fear anything, as the spirit-beast is always close by, assuring him of assistance and protection by making familiar


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9 find a mutual—mutually agreeable date for testimony this week.

On Monday, December 6th, our final preparations were disrupted when we were made aware that the committee had been provided 3,000 additional pages of DOD documents that we were first able to access on Tuesday, just 2 days ago. Additionally, among the exhibits transmitted to my team by the committee on Monday were several documents to which I had not previously been given access.

Much of what has transpired to date, included but not limited to those events I've just described, lead me to question the fundamental fairness of these proceedings. Nevertheless, I am here of my own volition and plan to answer your questions to the best of my ability.

As a former congressional senior staffer, I understand and appreciate the role of this body and the value of congressional oversight. However, to provide additional context, in the extent—excuse me—in the event I am unable to answer any of your questions, I wanted to highlight some concerns I have about the proceedings today.

The events about today, which you are inquiring, occurred 11 months ago or more. I do not, as I sit here today, have a clear recollection of these specifics of the—of that period of time and do not want to speculate or guess when answering your questions. I know that the committee respects my need to ensure that my answers are completely accurate.

As you know, I am no longer a United States Government employee and do not have access to my own government communications or records that relate to your questions to the extent that such records exist. DOD has made available to us certain documents that it has produced to the committee, and these documents likely represent just a small fraction of the official records relevant to the topics you have indicated that you wish to discuss. My attorneys have requested your assistance in facilitating access


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 noises. Those in the company of the "owner" at such times may feel justly frightened. The more courageous of them may be inclined to use their weapons. But the master of the akuan will keep on urging: "Be reverent and silent. It is nothing. It is our protector. It need not cause any alarm, nor should any harm be done. There is no danger." And so on and so forth. What he says always turns out true, and never a mishap has been heard of, though the monster really does keep pace with them not many yards away. Besides these the tiger would do the master other services also. Such little courtesies as scaring away thieves and mischief-makers from his house are common-place examples. Popular belief goes even so far as to say that, in extraordinary cases, the "owner" even rides on the tiger when he goes out at night.

I know an old woman at Bukit Kerdas (Jĕmpul) who died three years ago and who, besides having a reputation as a fairly successful medicine-woman, was believed to have akuan of both descriptions. The spirit type were seven in number, scattered all over the country, and the animal type was in the form of a tiger. Her husband from whom, it is said, she inherited these akuan as well as her art of medicine, had died many years previously. Many people believed that the husband turned into a tiger after his death (see "The Tiger-Breed Families" Journal 85, pp. 36-39) and that the tiger-akuan was no other than himself. The spirit-akuan were conjured many times. Once the old woman herself was seriously ill. In her illness she herself invoked their assistance, and she got better. But during her last illness nothing came, and she died. The tiger-akuan, on the other hand, used to accompany her when she went into the forest, or was going out at night. Besides, the animal always came to the rescue whenever she or any member of her family happened to fall into circumstances which made them wish for companionship and protection. Many curious incidents occured [sic] as evidence of the animal's attention. One, quite romantic, was as follows: The old woman had a pretty daughter (who is still alive). As is usual with love-sick Malay swains, those who entertain a fancy for a girl, delight to go stealthily to the house of their lady-love at night to be able to steal fuller glimpses (mĕngintai) of her face and doings than they could ever do anywhere during the day. Now, in the present case, two lads were specially enamoured of the young lady. One night the two arranged to go to měngintai to the house. Many friends had warned them that the house was always guarded by the old woman's tiger. But partly impelled by the desire to test the report and more especially by mad love, they decided to act against the warning. When they reached the house and each bad taken up a position to command the view through the chinks in the bamboo walls and floor, they succeeded in enjoying the coveted sight only for a few moments. On one of them turning round to relieve his strained neck and eyes, he found himself, to his unspeakable horror, face to face with a tiger, sitting about two yards from him and watching


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10 to additional records. Without such access, my recollection may be particularly limited.

As you know, I have a deep background in national security matters. My priority has always been the national security of the United States. I believe that many of the communications, records, and facts related to certain lines of inquiry are classified. Specifically, many matters relating to defense, intelligence, and foreign policy, including communications with and among senior White House officials about such matters are classified.

To date, neither I nor my attorneys have been cleared to review or provided with access to any classified information related to this inquiry. Indeed, to the extent that I have knowledge of classified information relevant to this inquiry, I am unable to share or discuss it with my attorneys. As I'm sure you will understand, I must err on the side of protecting classified information, and thus not may be able to answer certain questions that appear to call for a classified answer.

The select committee was authorized by House Resolution 503. Pursuant to section 4 thereof, the committee's functions are to, quote, "investigate the facts, circumstances, and causes relating to the domestic terrorist attack on the Capitol; identify, review, and evaluate the causes of and the lessons learned from the domestic terror attack on the Capitol; and issue a final report to the House containing finding, conclusion, and recommendation for corrective measures," end quote.

Given the legislative purpose set forth in H.R. 503, I was therefore astounded by some of the potential lines of inquiry, many expressly derived, according to staff, from books such as Bob Woodward and Robert Costa's "Peril," that were shared with my attorneys before today's deposition. These topics include but are not limited to personnel changes at DOD in November 2020, 2 months before January 6th; my potential appointments to CIA and/or FBI; a purported directive about withdrawal from Somalia


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11 and Afghanistan. Although I am here voluntarily to answer as many questions as possible, I request the committee explain how questions on topics—

Mr. Sofer. Slow down.

The Witness. Sorry. I should know this. We used to work together.

I request that the committee explain how questions on topics with no discernible connection to H. Res. 503 serve a, quote, "valid, legislative purpose," end quote, as required by Supreme Court precedent.

Although I was a DOD official on January 6th, I understand the committee may wish to ask me about events that occurred while I was a senior White House official at the National Security Council, as well as about directed communications I may have had with the President and some of his most senior advisers. I am aware that former President Trump has initiated litigation, which is currently ongoing, to block the release of certain records from the National Archives and could take similar action with respect to the testimony of myself and others.

To the extent the committee's questions today implicate core executive privilege concerns, I'm committed to trying to expeditiously resolve any issues, including by consulting with representatives of the current and former President, if necessary.

However, I want to state for the record my serious concerns about how the committee's attempt to bulldoze any and all claims of executive privilege, which is virtually unprecedented, infringes on the separation of powers and will likely have a negative, long-term consequence of the effect—of the effective functioning of the executive branch.

Because some, including in this room or on video, have mistakenly claimed that I was unqualified for the positions I held or was considered for, I want to briefly describe


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 apparently with great interest what he and his companion were doing. He pulled back his companion and the two had to beat a retreat as stealthily as they had come, and make the best of their way home, resolved never to try the experiment again in future.

Another one: On one occasion the old woman was spending a night at a friend's house about half-a-mile away, leaving only her daughters and grand-daughters at home. As they were sitting with their mat-plaiting and basket-work and chatting light-heartedly they heard the silent panting of an animal like a cow under the house. On turning their torches upon it to see what it was, they found it to be a tiger. So terrified were they that they put up wild screams for help till people came, and the tiger sneaked away into the darkness. (I can vouch for so much of the story as a fact, for I was one of those neighbours who heard the screams and went to help). The old lady came home and told them that the beast was only keeping them company and protecting the house. If they had harmed him, she told them, some terrible catastrophe would certainly befall the family. On another occasion, the old lady with three of her granddaughters went out měnimba (i.e. fishing by baling dry the water of a shrinking pool and then catching the fish—a favourite pastime in the village during the hottest part of the year) at a certain pool close by the road-side. When they had baled the pool dry and were beginning to secure the fish, one of the party saw two tigers crossing the road in their direction from the thick jungle on the other side. The grand-mother's attention was instantly called, and she, realising the danger, had no other alternative but to tell them to be quiet and calm. Suddenly from beneath the scrub, a few yards away between them and the two tigers, rose a third and bigger tiger. Without seeming to notice the panic-stricken youngsters, the beast walked right towards the advancing pair, and after persuading them, as it seemed, to turn to another direction, he marched away from the scene. The two followed suit. But the young girls could not regain control of their nerves, and their grand-mother had to hurry them home, taking only whatever fish they had caught and leaving the remainder without further search.

It may be added as a digression that the grave of the old lady's husband used to be regarded by many as an object of pious reverence. The chĕmpaka trees (Michelia champaca) planted over it were overhung with strips of white cloth (panji-panji) as emblems of sanctity, and indications of the number of "vows" (niat) that had been paid there. I daresay they still continue to be so overhung at the present time. Credulous people have for long been attracted to "make their vow" by the grave. Incidentally, this practice may be described here in a few words: A person, for the fulfilment of some great prayer, "makes a vow" saying: "If I recover from this illness" or "If a male baby be born to me" (or whatever that desire is) "I will cut two goats at so-and-so's grave and call people to eat there." If the prayer is granted he


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12 my career up to and including my service in the Trump administration.

I have devoted the vast majority of my professional career to public service and the protection of American lives and liberties. I started my legal career as a State public defender, where I safeguarded the rights of individuals'—charged with serious criminal offenses—standing for due process.

I then became an assistant Federal public defender representing individuals charged with, among other things, complex international and national security related crimes that included narcotrafficking, arms, human smuggling, and large-scale fraud.

During the Obama administration, I joined the Justice Department's National Security Division where I led investigations and oversaw prosecutions of terrorists aligned with Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups. I also served as DOJ's liaison to Joint Special Operation Command, where I worked closely with our Nation's most elite and effective terrorism—counterterrorism units.

In 2017, I became a congressional staffer and served as national security advisor and senior counsel for counterterrorism for the U.S. House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence. In these roles, I conducted oversight of sensitive programs and worked on legislation to authorize funding for intelligence and counterterrorism operations worldwide.

In 2019, I joined the National Security Council, where I held several positions and eventually served as deputy assistant to the President, senior director for counterterrorism.

In early 2020, I was asked to serve on detail as the principal deputy to the Acting Director of National Intelligence, whom I assisted in leading 17 intelligence community agencies. I also worked to prioritize the collection of intelligence to focus on hard targets and global threats.


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Dacrydium.] (usually 3–4), oblong, obtuse, compressed, striate, about ⅛ in. long.—Kirk in Trans. N.Z. Inst.x. (1878) 390, t. 19; Forest Fl. t. 97; ''Hook. f. Ic. Plant. t. 1219; Pilger in Pflanzenreich,'' iv. 5, 46.

2. D. biforme, Pilger in Pflanzenreich, iv. 5, 45.—A small tree 15–30 ft. or 40 ft. high, in alpine localities often dwarfed to a few feet; trunk short, 1–2 ft. diam.; bark dark-brown; branches stout, clothed with the persistent and indurated leaves; mature branchlets tetragonous. Leaves of two forms; those of young plants and on the lower branches of old ones spreading, ⅓–¾ in. long, $1⁄15$–$1⁄12$ in. broad, linear, acute, narrowed into a very short broad often twisted petiole, flat, coriaceous; midrib distinct. Leaves of old or fertile branchlets small and scale-like, densely quadrifariously imbricate and closely appressed, $1⁄20$–$1⁄12$ in. long, triangular or rhomboid-triangular, obtuse, very thick and coriaceous, stoutly and prominently keeled on the back. Flowers dioecious. Males solitary, terminal, sessile, about ⅛ in. long; anthers 4–6; connective ovate, obtuse. Female flowers near the tips of the branchlets. Nuts 1–2 (usually solitary), oblong, obtuse, striate, compressed, about $1⁄10$ in. long.—D. Colensoi, ''Hook. f. Fl. Nov. Zel. i. 234, and Handb. N.Z. Fl. 259 (not of Hook. Ic. Plant. t. 548); Kirk in Trans. N.Z. Inst. x. (1878) 390; Forest Fl.'' t. 96. Podocarpus(?) biformis, ''Hook. Ic. Plant.'' t. 544.

3. D. Bidwillii, Hook. f. ex T. Kirk in Trans. N.Z. Inst. x. (1878) 388.—A closely branched erect or prostrate shrub 2–10 ft. high; lower branches spreading, sometimes reclinate and rooting; upper more erect, frequently giving a pyramidal form to the plant; trunk short, 3–9 in. diam. Leaves of two forms; those of young plants and on the lower branches of old ones spreading, crowded,


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13 In November of 2020, I was asked to serve as chief of staff at the Department of Defense, and thereby became a senior member of a leadership team responsible for, among other things, a budget over $700 billion and nearly 3 million employees. It was one of the greatest honors of my life to be able to serve the American people in this capacity. My time at DOD was extremely eventful. In addition to the matters we will discuss today, I was deeply involved in and most of my time was devoted to senior-level operational decisions to counter our adversaries around the globe.

With respect to the events surrounding unrest at the Capitol, I supported the Acting Secretary in my role as his chief of staff. Additionally, I directed the creation of a timeline of events that my lawyers have marked as exhibit 2, I believe, but—

Mr. Sofer. And we'd ask at this time that the committee receive that exhibit into the record. It's a 9-page document marked as K. Patel Exhibit 2.

The Witness. Additionally, I directed the creation of a timeline of events that my lawyers have marked as exhibit 2 and would like to submit for the record. Thank you.

GreatGreat. [sic]

The Witness. This timeline was created and signed off by the Office of the Secretary of Defense, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the Secretary of the Army, and other sections within the Department of Defense.

Although I look forward to discussing these events in detail, I would like to make three things clear at the outset—excuse me—at the outset: One, the actions the DOD took before January 6, 2021, to prepare for the planned protest in Washington, D.C., on January 5th and 6th, 2021, were appropriate, supported by requirements, consistent with the DOD's roles and responsibilities, and compliant with laws, regulations, and other applicable guidance; two, the DOD's actions to respond to the United States Capitol Police request for assistance on January 6th, 2021, were appropriate, supported by


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 goes there to execute his promise. He cuts (sĕmběleh) the promised goats or whatever it may be; cooks some saffroned-rice (nasi kunyit), invites people to eat, has prayers of thanksgiving (do'a sĕlamat) read for him by some lĕbai, (cf. Skeat, Malay Magic, p. 42), and fires some big crackers as expression of peace and joy. Thus he "pays his vow," discharging himself of the binding promise he made to the spirit of the grave. If he fails to do so the spirit will appear to him in a dream demanding fulfilment, and in case of further default some toward event is certain to follow.

One more story about the tiger-akuan will finish the matter. A man living in Mĕmpanas, an outlying corner of Kuala Pilah, on the right bank of the Muar River, told me that he once had a long illness. No effort of the medicine-men was spared to restore him to health, and yet he did not recover. But he had a tiger-akuan which, by the way, he is believed to have even now. During his delirium the animal appeared to him and told him that his affection had become clironic and that his only chance of life would be in having his body licked by it. On coming to himself, he told this to his people and asked to be exposed the following night in the open verandah without any light. This was done. The door was bolted and the people kept themselves inside breathlessly watching what was to happen. The tiger came, stripped him naked and began to lick all over his body, so that the "lip-lap" sound of its tongue was clearly heard. Then it went away leaving him drenched with its salivary fluid. Two days after, he was completely cured.

The akuan in the shape of any other animals than tiger is probably very rare. I have heard only of one single case, occuring in Jnasseh, where a certain man is reported to have a crocodile-akuan, living in the river opposite his house. He feeds it, treats it kindly and at his call the animal comes up to the surface. Не is even said to ride upon the animal's back when necessary. Nobody but he dares to bathe in that part of the river. The crocodile is always there. According to his own story, the spirit came to him in a dream asking to be "owned" and protected (běla) in return for which it would look after the water-supply of his paddy-fields, bring him luck and protect him and his family from evil spirits. He accepted the offer and was told that he could always find the new friend in the shape of a crocodile in the river opposite his house. The next day he found this to be true, and thenceforward he has been the "owner" of the crocodile. The terms of agreement seem to have been faithfully adhered to by both. The man gathers in a good harvest every year,—quite above the average,—is always at ease and contented, and never gets ill, neither any member of his household. One striking fact about this case is that the "owner" is no medicine-man. The animal is not to be harmed, or all the benefits accruing from its friendship will be withdrawn, and some disaster threatened to the unfaithful "owner." Before the animal came to this man it had offered


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14 requirements, consistent with the DOD's roles and responsibilities, and compliant with the laws, regulations, and other applicable guidance; and, three, DOD officials did not delay or obstruct the DOD's response to the United States Capitol Police request for assistance on January 6th, 2021.

These are not just my words but, in fact, the findings of the DOD's independent inspector general under President Biden's administration. The IG's November 16, 2021, report has marked—has been marked as exhibit 3, I think.

Mr. Sofer. Three, uh-huh.

The Witness. And I respectfully request to submit it for the record.

Mr. Sofer. And I'll hand it to the committee for entrance into the record as well, the whole report.

The Witness. In conclusion, thank you for the opportunity to provide these opening remarks, which I respectfully request to enter into the record along with the accompanying exhibits, and I look forward to your questions.

Great. Thanks, Mr. Patel. I'm not going to address each point you made in your statement, but I appreciate the statement. I understand your concerns.

A couple things off the bat. Any question I ask that you think might trigger a classified answer, I'm asking it in a nonclassified way. If you feel you have to—if it triggers some sort of classified answer, you can let us know, but it's certainly—this is an unclassified interview, and I don't expect or intend to get into classified information.

As far as the scope concerns, we can address that when a topic that you think is outside the scope of the House resolution when we begin to address such topic.

I just want to spend a minute on your section on executive privilege where you stated you're committed to trying to expeditiously resolve these issues, including by


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 "Oh, heavens! (cried Madeline, trembling so she could scarcely stand) what evil do you apprehend? who is that stranger? why, if he knew you, as I suppose he did from your knowing him, did he fly from you?"

"Because he is a villain," (replied Agatha, as she rushed into the chapel followed by Madeline, whose terror and amazement were beyond language to express.) The moon then at its full, aided by the twilight of summer, gave a full view of the interior of the chapel; and as they entered it, they beheld another man darting out of a small door opposite to them. Madeline involuntarily caught the arm of Agatha, and both pausing, strained an eye of agony and terror after him: they paused however but for a moment; for a deep groan reaching their ears, made them hastily rush up the aisle from whence it proceeded, where, with feelings too dreadful to relate, they beheld their friend, their benefactress, lying stretched before the monument of her husband, apparently lifeless, and a


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 to a woman-neighbour of his. But on its commencing to stay in the river in front of her house, the woman's people disturbed it with sticks and fish-spears (tirok) so that the animal could not rest in peace. When it was leaving the place, the woman had a dream in which the spirit said to her, "I (awak) desired to act to your profit, but it seems you do not care to have my service. You disturbed me. Now I don't want to have anything more to do with you. If you want my friendship again yon must sacrifice one of your children to me." I do not know if any similar case occurs anywhere in the Peninsula.

To sum up such are among the alleged phenomena purported to lend support to the numerous spirit-beliefs of the Malay peasantry. An upholder of the doctrine of Transmigration of Souls may possibly be tempted to suspect some connection between this akuan-belief and the doctrine. But apart from mere suspicion, there is nothing in the popular conception of it to show that its believers have even the barest idea of that theory. The "owners" themselves never have any such idea. But that the akuan may pass down as a legacy from parents to children or from a dead husband to a surviving wife appears to be a generally accepted possibility. With the introduction of modern ideas and surroundings the belief in akuan is gradually dying out among the younger generation of Malays. But among their old-fashioned elders of the purely conservative type, whose contact with this new influence has not gone to any extent beneath the surface, the grip of the belief and other kindred superstitions is still very strongly in evidence. However, it is remarkable that in matters of this kind, investigators can hardly have much data to go upon owing to the scarcity of "actual cases." One must also allow for the Malay habit of exaggeration and their fondness for the marvellous and mysterious. The same applies to the wide-spread belief in polong, pontianak, pěnanggalan, pělĕsil, etc., etc., which is now confined only to the most superstitious. The difference between the polong, pontianak, etc., and the akuan is that the former are malignant spirits, kept for inhuman purposes, (cf. Skeat, Malay Magic, pp. 327-331) while the latter are good and serviceable auxiliaries.

The Muhammadan religion, it is true, discountenances all such belief in the powers of the devils. Any recognition of a power, other than God, as a being superior to man is repugnant to it. But ignorance is as much a power as knowledge: where it exists the impossible becomes possible. The most opposite beliefs and doctrines can subsist side by side in two water-tight compartments in any raw and uncultivated mind. And so it is with the majority of the Malays. With all these they "are among the most orthodox of Muhammadans."


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15 consulting with representatives of the current and former President. I just want to make sure that you and your counsel were aware of the letter received by DOD counsel from the White House. Do you have this?

Mr. Sofer. I don't know. I'd have to take a look at it.

. This is the letter provided from Jonathan Su to Mr. Richards, which states that the—the second paragraph sentence says, "Despite"—

. Excuse me,. It's in your binder, I think, Mr. Sofer. Yeah.

The Witness. Yeah. Thank you.

. Great. I'll wait until you have it.

Mr. Sofer. Is this—this is the December 7th letter?

. Uh-huh.

Mr. Sofer. Okay. Yeah.

. "Despite efforts made to do so, we have been unable to discuss with Mr. Patel's counsel the nature of Mr. Patel's communications with former President Trump and his advisers about the events that are subject of the planned interview. For that reason, we are unable to provide specific guidance regarding any privileges that may be associated with those communications," which seems in contrast to your statement that you would consult with representatives of the current President.

So I just wanted to give you an opportunity to address that, as well as acknowledge that several representatives that have joined us today, including Representative Cheney, Representative Kinzinger, and Representative Aguilar, and Representative Lofgren. And then we can start with your—with January 6th itself.

Mr. Sofer. Can we just respond? Mr. Glabe would like to briefly respond to your concern regarding the letter of December 7th.

. Sure.


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 small stream of blood issuing from her side. A shriek of mingled grief and horror burst from Madeline, and, unable to stand, she sunk beside her and clasped her trembling arms around her. Agatha, though equally afflicted, was not so much shocked as Madeline; for from the moment she beheld the stranger whom she had addressed outside the chapel, she had from secret reasons of her own been almost convinced, on entering it, she should behold a sight of horror. From being in some degree prepared for it, she was in some degree collected; and kneeling down, soon discovered that her lady still breathed, and trusted, that from the small quantity of blood which issued from it, her wound was not of a very dangerous nature. She now called upon Madeline to assist her in staunching it, ere she went to the castle for some of the servants to assist in carrying her thither.

The almost fainting senses of Madeline were recalled by her voice, and starting up, she wildly demanded if the Countess lived.


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 "Thank heaven! she does," said Agatha.

Madeline dropped upon her knees in a transport of joy. "Gracious heaven! (she exclaimed) receive my thanks. (Then hastily rising) had I not better fly to the castle (said she) for assistance."

"First help me to bind her wound (cried Agatha). Madeline was habited in a lawn dress; she now instantly tore it from her waist, and giving it to Agatha, supported the head of the Countess upon her bosom, while a bandage was bound round her. The motion of raising her and binding her wound, served to bring the Countess to herself; as she regained her sensibility, with a deep groan, and without opening her eyes, she extended her hand, and made a feeble effort to push away Agatha, exclaiming as she did so—

"Murderous ruffian, forbear! 'tis not in mercy to me, but to your unnatural employer I ask you to spare my life; for never will peace or joy revisit his heart, if my blood rests upon his head."


text: Journal of the Straits Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society/Volume 86/The Akuan or Spirit friends


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654 ¼–⅓ in. long, linear, obtuse, sessile by a comparatively broad base, flat, coriaceous; midrib usually distinct. Leaves on the upper and fertile branches small and scale-like, densely quadrifariously appressed, $1⁄25$–$1⁄12$ long, triangular, obtuse, very thick and coriaceous. Flowers diœcious. Males solitary, terminal, sessile, $1⁄10$–$1⁄8$ in. long. Female flowers near the tips of the branchlets. Nuts 1 or 2, small, striate, compressed, obtuse, about $1⁄12$ in. long.—Forest Fl. t. 37; Pilger in Pflanzenreich, iv. 5, 46.

4. D. cupressinum, ''Soland. ex Forst. Pl. Escul.'' 80.—A tall forest-tree 60–80 ft. or even 100 ft. high, with a comparatively small round-topped head when mature, but pyramidal when young, with very long pale-green pendulous branches; trunk 2–5 ft. diam.; bark dark-brown, scaling off in large flakes. Leaves imbricating all round the branch; of young trees lax, ascending, ⅙–¼ in. long, linear-subulate, acute, almost acerose, decurrent at the base; gradually passing into those of the mature trees, which are much smaller and more closely set and more appressed to the branch, $1⁄12$–$1⁄8$ in. long, linear, acute, trigonous, keeled at the back. Flowers diœcious. Males solitary or rarely 2 together at the tips of the branchlets, oblong; connective broadly ovate, acuminate. Female flowers solitary on the curved tips of the branchlets. Nut ovoid, barely compressed, about ⅛ in. long, seated within a cup-shaped aril; receptacle and bracts sometimes enlarged, fleshy and coloured, at other times remaining dry and unaltered.—''A. Rich. Fl. Nouv. Zel. 361; A. Cunn. Precur. n. 332; Raoul, Choix, 41; Hook. f. FL. Nov. Zel. i. 233; Handb. N.Z. Fl. 258; Kirk, Forest Fl. t. 18-22; Pilger in Pflanzenreich,'' iv. 5, 53. Thalamia cupressina, ''Spreng. Syst.'' iii. 890.

Abundant in forests throughout. Sea-level to 2500 ft. Rimu; Red-pine.

A well-known tree, the young state of which, with its graceful shape and pale-green pendent branches, is perhaps as beautiful and attractive as any tree


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16 Mr. Glabe. Sure. Thanks for bringing the letter to our attention. I think, as we've endeavored to communicate, our position is that, if there are questions or topics that implicate core executive privilege concerns, we'd rather address those in a concrete manner rather than in the abstract. But, that being said, I just want to reiterate that our client is here of his own volition, and our hope and his hope is that he's able to answer as many of your questions as possible today.

The Witness. Can I just say good morning to the Representatives? It's nice to see you all again, and thank you for joining.

Scott, I think the question was, were efforts made to communicate with Mr. Patel's attorneys, and were those efforts met or not met? I didn't get your answer.

Mr. Glabe. Maybe we could touch base on that offline.

Okay. All right. We'll follow up on his efforts to kind of resolve this with the current and former President.

 * BY :

So I appreciate you going through your career background, Mr. Patel, so I won't go through it as I had planned to. Do you have one kind of highlight that you think, in terms of your 16-year background, that you're most proud of that you—

I wasn't expecting that. I guess, one that stands out is the night we killed al-Baghdadi when I was senior director for counterterrorism at the National Security Council. It's probably one of the most memorable moments for me in government.

I know you started in at DOD coming straight from the NSC, is that right, I think in your—

Yes. Yeah, I think you have that right.


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17 And, in the NSC role, were you an advisor to the—to the President himself, or was there a layer of—in between you and the President?

I think if you could help me the navigate what timeline you're referring to because, as I stated in my opening, I served as a couple of roles—

Sure.

—while I—

Right before DOD.

Right before DOD. Thank you. So I think that's about the summer, fall-ish of 2020, my best estimation. I was the deputy assistant to the President, which means I was a credentialed, designated officer of the President of the United States; and I was the senior director for counterterrorism, which meant I was the individual responsible for the entire counterterrorism directorate, where we had approximately anywhere from, ballpark, 8 to 16 directors under me working on various portfolios. And they reported through me. And depending on the topic, I reported to the—what's called the APNSA, the Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs, which was Robert O'Brien, Ambassador O'Brien, and then he would report to the President. But, again, depending on what topic, sometimes that system varies.

Were there times when you reported directly to the President depending upon what the topic was?

Yes. Thank you for that clarification. Depending on the topic, and also I was one of the few individuals who were charged with the—as the what we call national security rep. So I took numerous trips with the President

On a lot of those trips, the ambassador was not present. It was usually myself, him, or another one of the few individuals who were read into those programs. So I


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18 might have had contact directly on those flights.

Got it. And how long did you have this position where you were a little bit closer to the President than the other—than the positions that preceded it?

So I'm not entirely sure. I didn't—I didn't check those dates before coming in today, but I would—it—my best guess would be for most of 2020 or the bulk of 2020—

Got it.

—I think, is a fair way to put it.

So would you say—would you estimate you had daily contact with Robert O'Brien and you might have daily contact with the President himself?

It honestly just depended on the day.

Did you feel that you—it's been described that you were a trusted ally of the President. Do you think that's accurate?

I'm not sure who said that, but I was told to do a job, and that was to run the counterterrorism portfolio and assist the President on national security matters as they arose during his travels, and I tried to fulfill that to the best of my ability.

Did you advise him on issues other than just national security issues?

As I sit here today, not having looked at any of my work from the National Security Council, emails or logs or anything, I don't believe so. I think he and I probably talked about sports was a common topic. When you're stuck in an airplane for 6, 10, 17 hours, other matters come up.

Both New York guys?

We're both from Queens.

Did you work with Chris Miller before the DOD appointment?

Yes. Former Acting Secretary of Defense Chris Miller and I have known


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 "Oh! my friend, my more than mother, (exclaimed Madeline, pressing her cold cheek to the yet colder one of the Countess) no murderous ruffian is now near you."

The Countess sighed heavily, and opening her dim eyes, looked round her some minutes before she spoke, as if doubting the reality of what she saw; then in a faint voice, but one that evidently denoted pleasure, she cried, "Great and glorious Being, I thank thee—I shall not die far from those I love, beneath the cruel hand of an assassin."

"Dearly shall he, who raised that hand against you, rue his crime! (exclaimed Agatha); I know the villain—I discovered his accursed confidant near the chapel, and I will bring him to punishment, though my own life should be forfeited by doing so."

"Mistaken woman, (said the Countess in a hollow voice) how would you avenge me? is it by exposing to infamy and death those more precious to me than life—by giving to my heart a deeper wound than my body has sustained?