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American comic book tropes

American comic book tropes are common elements and literary devices related to American comic books.

Continuity
Comics continuity almost-always refers to the existence and use of a shared universe, although any comic can have internal continuity independent of this. Simply, the term describes a consistency of internal plot, and usually of characterisation and external references also. Initially, many comics were stand alone, "done in one" stories with a beginning and end taking place within the confines of a single comic issue, often structured in chapters as are most novels. Over time, the comics companies realised the lucrative potential of the crossover comic, whereby other characters from a company's shared universe appeared in issues of each other's comics. This ultimately led to the formation of "team" books such as the Justice Society of America, Justice League of America and Avengers.

During these crossover character interactions, editorial footnotes would often reference previous adventures and comics issues, but an actual editorially enforced "continuity" was not strictly adhered to, leading to some characters' actions appearing "out of character", or outrightly contradicting earlier plot-points. As comics were deemed largely ephemeral items, this was not considered that much of a problem, until the full advent of comics fandom. As a result of fan/reader scrutiny, the continuity both of individual characters and of the wider universes in which comics companies' characters interacted began to become more important. The Marvel "No Prize" became a humorous method by which readers could write letters to authors and editors pointing out mistakes or "continuity errors" in various comics, and were then named in print and awarded a "No Prize" (in reality a coveted sheet of paper declaring itself a non prize).

In 1985, cross-universe continuity took on new levels of depth and (intended) consistency at the two main comics companies: DC and Marvel. Marvel launched its cross-line toy-driven-event Secret Wars, which required all characters to undergo specific changes at specific times, and required considerable editorial dictates and conformity. DC launched the Crisis on Infinite Earths, one of the earliest maxi-series', to address universe-wide continuity and attempt to explain away, remove or revise all previous errors in continuity. The reader was reminded that the DC Multiverse consisted not merely of the core DC Universe, but of a number of different iterations of various heroes on a multitude of different planets. Companies and characters purchased by DC (such as the Charlton Comics characters and Captain Marvel) as well as older characters like the JSA were (re-)assigned their own Earths, which were then destroyed and folded into one, core Earth. This naturally resulted in a number of contradictions and discrepancies in individual characters' histories, so a new, uniform continuity was created and the revised origins of the resulting heroes were retold in the hopes of maintaining consistent continuity.

With hundreds of characters and dozens of writers, over the years uniform and consistent continuity is difficult to maintain, and most comics companies periodically address the erosion of internal consistency with big "events" designed to explain and simplify (although at times they do neither) discrepancies, and maintain continuity.

Canon
Similar to internal continuity, the canon of comics characters/universes is often subject to change, but refers to the stories which are, at any one point, part of the "official", "accepted" history and story of particular characters/universes. Alternate versions of characters (such as DC's Elseworlds and Marvel's speculative What if...? titles) are necessarily not canon, but the stories can change from being non-canonical to being accepted as canon - and vice versa. In particular, line-wide continuity-changing events (such as DC's Crises and Marvel's controversial recent Spider-Man: One More Day storyline) retroactively affect which stories are part of a character/universe's core canon, as they may revise or ignore previous events and happenings.

For example, DC's Crisis on Infinite Earths addressed continuity and consistency errors over almost 50 years of comics publication, and retrofitted events and characters into the history of the DCU as if they had always been there (for example, the JSA went from being JLA-contemporaries from a parallel world to being their earlier, historical counterparts some years previously). The Post-Crisis DC Universe removed many stories from "official canon", explaining them as Imaginary Tales or ignoring them completely.

Retcon
Retcon or "ret-con" is a portmanteau shorthand phrase for "retroactive continuity", and is the descriptive term used to explain continuity- and canon-affecting stories. A retcon affects the past history of characters and/or the whole shared universe, and says that the "new" changed events have always been that way. This can lead to intense confusion, as compounded events can cause even the most knowledgeable fan to falter over what is currently the accepted canon.

Linked is retrofit, retroactively embedding something (usually a plot point or subsidiary character) into a past story, for the purposes of a current story. This can give added weight to a story, implying that the impetus for a current story had been around for some time; for example, the X-Men: Deadly Genesis limited series from 2006 "retrofit" the story line from 1975's Giant-Size X-Men #1 to include new characters and plot points. It can also be used to update a character for more modern times; for instance, Iron Man (vol. 4) #1 updated Iron Man's origin story so that he was wounded in Afghanistan instead of Vietnam.

Pre- and Post-Crisis
Labels referring to DC Universe continuity and canon, with the separator being the 1985 retcon event Crisis on Infinite Earths. Simply, Pre-Crisis stories were not as stringently policed or edited, and often contained errors and internal inaccuracies (in large part because of their frequent nature as one-shot stories, rather than linked tales designed to follow evolving and changing characters). Pre-Crisis stories are often seen as throwaway and frivolous, perceived to be dominated by imaginary tales and "camp" characterisation. Neither label is entirely accurate, nor is the broad-brush assumption that a lack of cohesive continuity denotes a complete disregard for it.

The Post-Crisis DCU is that which was formed in the pages of the CoIE maxiseries, and is (or was intended to be) far more internally consistent and interlinked. Characters' origins were revised and updated, conflating previous stories and origins into one, accepted canonical one. Writer-artist John Byrne's Superman: The Man of Steel miniseries, for example, provided the Post-Crisis origin of Kal-El, while Crisis-architects Marv Wolfman and George Pérez produced the two-issue History of the DC Universe to briefly detail a broad overview of the Post-Crisis DCU, showing the sequence of events as well as the revised origins of many characters (later to be fleshed out in their own series).

Even the Post-Crisis DCU was not without its continuity problems, and several subsequent events have attempted to address them, making the "Post-Crisis" label largely defunct. However, because of the 1985 maxiseries' landmark status, the label persists in one form or another.

Imaginary tales, Elseworlds, alternates, possible futures, What If...?
All these terms refer to specific and general "non-canonical stories", often – but not exclusively – featuring alternate versions of established heroes, events, or both. For many years, some DC comics would feature stories labelled as "Imaginary Tales", signifying that the events which occurred therein did not have an active effect on continuity, and therefore that anything could happen, even the bizarre and contradictory. DC transitioned to the Elseworlds imprint, whereas Marvel created the What If...? series.

Origins
A character's "origin" is the fictional story which describes (almost always solely for superheroes) how they came to be; gained their powers; arrived on Earth; were bitten by a radioactive spider, etc. Origins need not be established immediately, they can be told in flashback, or slowly over the course of several issues or, indeed, years. Origins are often subject to revision and retcons, and may find themselves having additional information retrofitted in at a later time.

They are also frequently updated to better reflect their times. For example, the origin of Iron Man has gradually been revised and updated, so that instead of serving in the Vietnam War, he serves in Korea or the (first) Gulf War.

Events
A comics "event" describes a large storyline which almost always involves a crossover between one or more characters, titles, universes or companies, but usually denotes an internal company crossover. These then typically fall into two broad categories: character or universe events. i.e. a Batman "event" will likely only feature the Batman family of characters (an example would be the Batman: Knightfall storylines), while a multi-character crossover will usually be universe-wide and affect several different individuals (an example would be Marvel's "Civil War" event, which affected almost every character and title in their shared universe).

Cross-universe events and intercompany events are considerably rarer, but do happen. 1996's DC vs. Marvel event saw the DCU and MU brought together (and ultimately, briefly, merged), while the DC Universe has also featured in events/crossovers with, for example, the WildStorm and Milestone universes.

Shared universe
The concept of a shared universe is one in which a multitude of different characters co-exist and/or interact. Typically this concept confines itself to one publishing company's output (although concepts such as the Wold Newton family extend the boundaries considerably), and it is most common in the main superhero universes of DC and Marvel. The benefit of having a shared universe is that characters can make (sales-boosting) guest appearances and allow for team-ups between different characters, as well as allowing the "team" concept (the JLA, the Avengers, etc.) to exist at all. Stan Lee's initial Marvel Universe creations in the 1960s best exemplify the "shared universe" concept, whereby characters (and villains) would feature across multiple titles, sometimes in the foreground of the story, sometimes as cameos in passing, but always underlining the interlinkedness of the universe.

The concept of a shared universe, wherein a company's diverse cast of characters are able to interact and crossover between books and events is usually labelled the "Universe" (DC, Marvel, Image, CrossGen, Valiant, etc.). Comics fandom has produced various shorthand ways of referring to the various universes, however, and the comics themselves also refer to themselves in specific ways. These labels are usually reserved for the universes of "the Big Two" (Marvel and DC), in large part because they are the main American comics publishers and have the largest shared universes. A non-exhaustive list of terms includes:

Marvel
The Marvel Universe, sometimes abbreviated to MU, is the shared universe in which the X-Men, Spider-Man, the Avengers, etc. all exist and interact.

 * Earth-616, the Six-One-Six, etc., denotes the numerical designation of the Earth which the Marvel Universe inhabits. The term was coined in the pages of Captain Britain, by either Alan Moore or Dave Thorpe.
 * Ultimate Marvel is a separate universe created to reinvent longstanding characters without affecting the main continuity.

DC
The DC Universe, or DCU, refers to the shared universe inhabited by Batman, Superman, the Justice League of America, etc.

 * Earth-1 was the Pre-Crisis designation of the "main" DCU, in contrast to Earth-2 (featuring the JSA), and latterly dozens of individual Earths which were home to a plethora of characters, and were destroyed in the Crisis on Infinite Earths maxiseries.
 * New Earth is the designation of the "main" DCU after the events on 2005's miniseries event Infinite Crisis, in which a revised Multiverse of 52 worlds was created.

Duck universe
Disney's Uncle Scrooge and associated titles take place inside the Duck universe, a fan appellation.

Imprints
In addition to the core shared universe, some companies have subsidiary universes/imprints, which can be part of the main universe, or cannot be (or can be thoroughly confusing). DC Comics' mature readers' imprint Vertigo Comics, for example, mainly publishes stand-alone ongoing series, miniseries and maxiseries, but also variously includes characters who were once part of the DCU, or have interacted with it in such a way as to make them at least an honorary part of it. Characters such as The Sandman family of titles, the Doom Patrol and the Swamp Thing all began publication as part of the DCU, but have gradually drifted to a corner of it quite far removed, if still nominally a part. The WildStorm Universe, which was initially published by Image Comics, is now largely accepted as part of the wider DC Multiverse, but not part of the DCU-proper. Similarly, the Ultimate Marvel Universe is not part of the 616, while the MAX imprint is on the fringes in a similar way to the Vertigo/DC interaction.

Crossovers
Crossovers can be both internal and between different universes and companies. At their most basic level, a crossover can refer simply to a character making a guest appearance in a different comic (e.g. Daredevil "crossing over" into an issue of a Spider-Man comic), but typically a "crossover" implies more than a simple appearance and denotes a cohesive storyline spanning more than one title, often as part of an event. These may also include a tie-in.

Superheroes
As of 2010, superhero comics are the most popular genre of comic book in North America. There are many definitions of a superhero, and the subject is debated by scholars and industry professionals. Peter Coogan identifies influences to comic book superheroes in the form of super-strong comic strip characters, pulp heroes, masked vigilantes dubbed "mystery men", and precursors, who lack specific elements of modern superhero convention. According to Coogan, Superman is the first character to bring together all of the necessary elements. Coogan defines the superhero as "a heroic character with a selfless, pro-social mission" who has powers, a codename, colorful costume, and usually a secret identity.

Technical terms
American comic books can be sold through the direct market. Formats include single issues, trade paperbacks, and graphic novels. Graphic novels may also be known as "prestige format" comics for single issues. Issues may be published as one-shots or periodically.

title: American comic book tropes


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Alaotra grebe

The Alaotra grebe (Tachybaptus rufolavatus), also known as Delacour's little grebe or rusty grebe, is a recently extinct grebe that was endemic to Lake Alaotra and its surrounding lakes in Madagascar. Experts say that the grebe became extinct after carnivorous fish were introduced into its native habitat.

Description
The grebe was about 25 cm long. Its ability to fly long distances was restricted because of its small wings. It exhibited no marked sexual dimorphism, although males were slightly larger than females.

Diet
The Alaotra grebe fed mostly on fish, although insects were found in the stomachs of a few specimens. Its hefty bill was considered typical of a piscivorous grebe.

Breeding
The breeding behavior of the Alaotra grebe was largely undocumented. Because little and Alaotra grebes were able to successfully pair off, it is suspected that courtship and pair formation took place in December, while most breeding activity took place between January and March. However, based on some observations of older juveniles with their mothers in late May and early June 1929, it is suspected that some egg laying must have occurred in April to June. Otherwise, the behavior of this grebe is undescribed, although it is suspected to have behaved similarly to the closely related little grebe.

Extinction
The species declined in the course of the 20th century, mainly because of habitat destruction, entanglement with monofilament gillnets and predation by the introduced blotched snakehead (Channa maculata). Also, the few remaining birds increasingly hybridized with little grebes; as the species differed in several key aspects, the hybrid birds may have suffered from decreased fitness, to the detriment of the rufolavatus gene pool.

The Madagascar pochard, which also lived on Lake Alaotra, was thought to be extinct but was rediscovered in 2006. Unlike this species, however, the grebe had poor powers of dispersal and was never found elsewhere.

The last sighting (which may have been a hybrid with the little grebe) was in 1985 and the species was declared extinct in 2010. Only one photograph of the species is known to exist. Although some species have been classified as extinct and later have been found to still exist, Leon Bennun, the director of the conservation organization BirdLife International has stated that "no hope remains for this species" and blames the "unforeseen consequences" of human action.

This extinction brought the number of confirmed bird extinctions since 1600 AD to 162. The previous declaration of a bird species as extinct was that of the Liverpool pigeon (Caloenas maculata) in 2008. However, that was more a problem of taxonomic recognition as that species was last recorded alive in the late 18th or early 19th century.

Distribution and habitat
"This aquatic species exhibited endemism to the island of Madagascar, exclusively inhabiting the environs of Lake Alaotra and adjacent water bodies. Notably, this grebe displayed a marked preference for the reed beds and papyrus clusters in the vicinity of the lake, which served as its primary nesting habitat."

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Alaotra grebe


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Elli-class frigate

The Elli-class frigates are a series of frigates operated by the Hellenic Navy. The ships are of Dutch origin and are also known as Kortenaer-class frigate or Standard-class or S-class frigates. The first two ships (Elli and Limnos), which have lengthened hangars and different armament were built specifically for the Hellenic Navy. The remaining ships are ex-Royal Netherlands Navy S-frigates of the Kortenaer class transferred to the Hellenic Navy in the 1990s and early 2000s. These robust and reliable ships constitute the backbone of the Hellenic Navy. GREEK FRIGATE Elli, for which the class is named, is itself named after two famous Greek cruisers, one of which was sunk during peacetime before the Greco-Italian War.

Mid-life modernization project
There was a mid life modernization programme for six of the ten Greek ships which started in 2004 and was completed in 2009. The program was performed at Hellenic Shipyards and the upgraded frigates were the following: Kountouriotis (F-462), Adrias (F-459), Navarinon (F-461), Limnos (F-451), Elli (F-450), and Aegaeon (F-460).

The main modernization work included the following:
 * Replacement of the combat management system with the Thales TACTICOS
 * Installation of new sensors, like the Thales Mirador electro-optical target tracker
 * Installation of Thales Scout MkII LPI navigation radar
 * Overhaul and improvement of radars (WM25 and LW08 long range air-search radar)
 * Installation of EDO (now part of Harris Corporation) CS-3701 ESM system
 * Replacement of navigation systems and upgrade of communications systems
 * Replacement of propulsion control system and of defined platform systems.

Bouboulina (F-463) was decommissioned on 18 February 2013. It will be used as a source for spare parts.

Incidents at sea
On 2 November 2017 Kanaris ran aground near the islet Atalanti, southwest of Psyttaleia in the Saronic Gulf, on the way back to the Salamis Naval Base. There were no personnel injuries and no fuel leaks but there was serious hull damage which according to news reports affected the SONAR shell. After 8 months of absence for repairs the ship was again operational in July 2018 using the SONAR and dome from decommissioned Bouboulina (F-463).

title: Elli-class frigate


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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ez publishing

 This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete. Sjakkalle (Check!)  08:14, 21 July 2005 (UTC)

Ez publishing
Advertising; no evidence that this is an encyclopedic company. CDC  (talk)  21:12, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, advertizing. --PrologFan 21:23, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, agreed. Gwk 21:26, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, I specifically wrote this article to be included on the List of U.S. Companies. There are a fairly wide variety of companies on this list, some of which are not famous. Why do you favor large corporations over small businesses for listing? We are a U.S. company. That seems to be the criteria. Thanks. manatee123
 * I kindly suggest you read What Wikipedia is not. Gwk 21:46, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete - advert. Manatee, just being a company is not enough; you need to do something notable. Naturenet | Talk 21:43, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Many if not most of the companies on the list have only one notable thing about them: they are large corporations. Frankly, most are quite uninteresting. Only a very small number of the companies on the list have actually done something notable (e.g., Apple). Thanks. manatee123
 * Whether or not the list of companies has a bias in favor of large corporations, the fact is that it is Wikipedia policy to not include things that are not notable. Besides that, Wikipedia policy also does not allow advertising and the article is clearly written as if it were an advertisment. Gwk 22:27, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * The article states basic facts and is less promotional than many of the current company sites taht are currently on Wikapedia. Very few of the companies that are currently on Wikapedia have done *anything* notable at all. The *only* thing they have in common is size. Most of them are large companies. This seems unfair that large companies -- boring ones at that -- get to have entries on Wikapedia, yet our small company cannot have an entry. manatee123
 * If you want to debate the policies of Wikipedia, you can do that on my talk page. As to this article, I leave it to the community to form a consensus. Gwk 23:45, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * I don't want to debate policies but am merely saying that my page is no less in line with policies than the current entries that are cataloged in "List of United States Companies".manatee123
 * Delete. Vanity page. Can't even properly spell "wikipedia". --Vizcarra 23:52, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * I made a careless spelling error but am well aware of how to spell wikipedia. It is kind of rude to call attention to petty errors. manatee123
 * Delete, ad for non-notable company. Dcarrano 01:16, July 12, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete advertising. JamesBurns 07:16, 12 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, sorry Manatee, but Wikipedia is not here for you to advertise on. —Stormie 11:16, July 12, 2005 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


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User:Harmil/Mayo Cleanup Project

The Mayo Cleanup Project is an effort to preserve some of the more useful links This project was a misguided effort on my part to preserve spam injected by a rather abusive user at 129.176.151.6. There is now no ongoing effort....

The Doubleclick connection
It took a while for me to notice that each of the linked database pages had a doubleclick link to a sponsor. While I support any site's right to get their own sponsorship however they like, I won't be a part of a link-spam operation that abuses another site, run from the same organization that hosts the database (and thus reaps the "rewards"). Damn.

Criteria for keeping
Since reversions were made in good faith, it would be wrong of me to just re-revert all of them (not to mention counter-productive in many cases). Thus, I will use the following criteria:

 * 1) The article in question must be a stub or contain fairly little data.
 * 2) The linked article on the Mayo site must contain more information than the WP article
 * 3) The link must be accurate (correct disease or condition is linked)

The great TODO list

 * Absence seizure
 * Acromegaly
 * Actinic keratosis
 * Acute lymphoblastic leukemia
 * Acute myelogenous leukemia
 * Addison's disease
 * Adjustment disorder
 * Alzheimer's disease
 * Anaphylaxis
 * Anemia
 * Angioedema
 * Ankylosing spondylitis
 * Anthrax disease
 * Aortic aneurysm
 * Aortic valve
 * Aortic valve stenosis
 * Aplastic anemia
 * Arteriosclerosis
 * Asbestosis
 * Asperger's syndrome
 * Atrial fibrillation
 * Avoidant personality disorder
 * Back pain
 * Baldness
 * Barotrauma
 * Binge eating disorder
 * Bipolar disorder
 * Body dysmorphic disorder
 * Bulimia nervosa
 * Bunion
 * Callus and Corns of the Skin
 * Cardiomyopathy
 * Carpal tunnel syndrome
 * Cellulitis
 * Cerebral aneurysm
 * Cervical cancer
 * Chickenpox
 * Chronic lymphocytic leukemia
 * Chronic myelogenous leukemia
 * Cirrhosis
 * Cluster headache
 * Coeliac disease
 * Colic
 * Common cold
 * Conjunctivitis
 * Conn's syndrome
 * Constipation
 * Cushing's syndrome
 * Cystic fibrosis
 * Cystitis
 * Dandruff
 * Dependent personality disorder
 * Dermatomyositis
 * Diabetes mellitus
 * Diabetes mellitus type 2
 * Diabetic retinopathy
 * Diaper rash
 * Diffuse parenchymal lung disease
 * Diverticulitis
 * Dizziness
 * Drug addiction
 * Dyslexia
 * Encephalitis
 * Endocarditis
 * Endometrial cancer
 * Endometriosis
 * Epilepsy
 * Esophageal cancer
 * Essential tremor
 * Fecal incontinence
 * Fetal alcohol spectrum disorder
 * Fibromyalgia
 * Fifth disease
 * Flat feet
 * Folliculitis
 * Food allergy
 * Frozen shoulder
 * Gallstone
 * Gastroesophageal reflux disease
 * Gingivitis
 * Glaucoma
 * Goitre
 * Gonorrhoea
 * Group A streptococcal infection
 * Guillain-Barré syndrome
 * Haemochromatosis
 * Halitosis
 * Hammertoe
 * Hashimoto's thyroiditis
 * Hay fever
 * Hepatitis A
 * Hepatitis B
 * Hepatitis C
 * Hiatus hernia
 * Histoplasmosis
 * Hodgkin's disease
 * Huntington's disease
 * Hyperparathyroidism
 * Hypersexuality
 * Hyperthyroidism
 * Hypoglycemia
 * Hypopituitarism
 * Hypotension
 * Hypothermia
 * Hypothyroidism
 * Infertility
 * Iron deficiency anemia
 * Jock itch
 * Juvenile arthritis
 * Kawasaki disease
 * Keratoconjunctivitis sicca
 * Lactose intolerance
 * Laryngitis
 * Leukoplakia
 * Louse
 * Malignant melanoma
 * Menorrhagia
 * Menstrual cramp
 * Metabolic syndrome
 * Mitral valve prolapse
 * Motor neurone disease
 * Mouth ulcer
 * Multiple myeloma
 * Myocardial infarction
 * Nicotine
 * Non-Hodgkin's lymphoma
 * Oral cancer
 * Otitis externa
 * Pancreatic cancer
 * Peptic ulcer
 * Periodontal disease
 * Peyronie's disease
 * Postpartum depression
 * Pre-eclampsia
 * Prostate cancer
 * Pulmonary embolism
 * Pulmonary hypertension
 * Renal cell carcinoma
 * Rubella
 * Sarcoma
 * Septic arthritis
 * Sickle cell anemia
 * Sinusitis
 * Skin cancer
 * Stomach cancer
 * Stye
 * Sudden infant death syndrome
 * Tennis elbow
 * Tension headache
 * Testicular cancer
 * Thrombophlebitis
 * Thyroid cancer
 * Urinary incontinence
 * Vaginitis
 * Vasculitis
 * Viral hemorrhagic fever
 * Vulvodynia
 * Wilms' tumor

title: User:Harmil/Mayo Cleanup Project


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User talk:Toadboy

Welcome
Hello , and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! Double Blue (Talk) 21:13, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
 * The Five Pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Editing tutorial
 * Picture tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Naming conventions
 * Manual of Style

Isaac Bruce
He is not wearing No. 80 in San Francisco.► Chris Nelson Holla! 16:20, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

title: User talk:Toadboy


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Riggs v. Palmer

Riggs v. Palmer, 115 N.Y. 506 (1889), is an important New York state civil court case, in which the Court of Appeals of New York issued an 1889 opinion. Riggs was an example of the judiciary using the "social purpose" rule of statutory construction, the process of interpreting and applying legislation.

Facts
In Riggs, a probate suit, the plaintiffs, Mrs. Riggs and Mrs. Preston, sought to invalidate the will of their father Francis B. Palmer; testated on August 13, 1880. The defendant in the case was Elmer E. Palmer, grandson to the testator. The will gave small legacies to two of the daughters, Mrs. Preston and Mrs. Riggs, and the bulk of the estate to Elmer Palmer to be cared for by his mother, Susan Palmer, the widow of a dead son of the testator, until he became of legal age.

Knowing that he was to be the recipient of his grandfather's large estate, Elmer, fearing that his grandfather might change the will, murdered his grandfather by poisoning him. The plaintiffs argued that by allowing the will to be executed Elmer would be profiting from his crime. While a criminal law existed to punish Elmer for the murder, there was no statute under either probate or criminal law that invalidated his claim to the estate based on his role in the murder.

Judgment
Judge Robert Earl (in office 1870 and 1875–1894) wrote the majority opinion for the court, which ruled in favor of the plaintiffs. The court reasoned that tenets of universal law and maxims would be violated by allowing Elmer to profit from his crime. The court held that the legislature could not be reasonably expected to address all contingencies in crafting laws and that, had they reason to suspect one might behave in the manner Elmer did, they certainly would have addressed that situation.

Judge Earl, in an analogy to a similar case, wrote: "The principle which lies at the bottom of the maxim, volenti non fit injuria ['to a willing person, no injury be done'], should be applied to such a case, and a widow should not, for the purpose of acquiring, as such, property rights, be permitted to allege a widowhood which she has wickedly and intentionally created."

Judge John Clinton Gray (in office 1888–1913) dissented. He argued that the criminal law established punishment for the murder of Francis Palmer. For the court to deny the estate to Elmer was to, in effect, add significant further punishment to what Elmer received under the criminal statute, something the court was not permitted to do without the express, written statute. The written statutes that existed did not sanction the action of the court and the court cannot simply create or imagine such statutes so as to obtain a morally pleasing result. Gray's view of literal interpretation of the statute was in contrast with the majority opinion which gave the legislators' intentions influence over the actual statutes in place.
 * Dissent

Significance
Legal philosopher Ronald Dworkin uses Riggs in an argument against legal positivism, focusing on a version of legal positivism by H. L. A. Hart. Positivism holds that all legal decisions by courts are classified into one of two categories. Some are central to the legal rules at issue. In these cases, judges merely apply the rules which fall within their jurisdiction. The other category of decisions occupy the penumbra of legal rules, where the direction of the legal rule is unclear. In these cases, judges must decide which of the possible applications of the legal rules are best social policy and then apply the rule which is best.

Dworkin argues that Riggs has two features which contradict Hart's interpretation of the legal process. First, this case does not appear to lie at the edge of legal rules, instead it is very clearly central. Despite this, the majority did not apply the legal rule as required. Second, there appears to be a legitimate debate about what the law is, and not what the law should be, in this case. According to Dworkin, under most versions of legal positivism, Hart's included, there should rarely be debate about what counts as law.

title: Riggs v. Palmer


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Marysvale Canyon

Marysvale Canyon (sometimes referred to as Sevier Canyon) is a canyon in Piute and Sevier counties in southwest Utah, United States, which runs 8 mi north from just north of Marysvale north to the town of Sevier.

Description
The canyon is a steep walled canyon formed by the flow of the meandering Sevier River. The narrow canyon lies between Sargent Mountain on the northeast corner of the Tushar Mountains to the west and the margin of the small Antelope Range of Sevier County to the east. The canyon ends to the north at the intersection of the Sevier River with Clear Creek Canyon which forms the north margin of the Tushars. To the south the canyon starts about 2 mi north of Marysvale where the broad Sevier Valley narrows abruptly from a broad 5 - 8 mi valley to a narrow gorge.

Points of interest in the canyon are Big Rock Candy Mountain, old mining sites, and the rail tunnels along the old Marysvale Branch of the Denver and Rio Grande Western Railroad that has been converted to a hiking/biking path.

title: Marysvale Canyon


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Talk:Chain letter

Too Focused on Negative Aspects
There is no suggestion that a chain letter is a form of mass communication. I would guess a high percentage of the efforts are fraudulent. Though many other forms of mass communication are not motivated with good intentions. This article should describe how a chain letter compares to other forms of communication. How it compares in participatory dialogue? Is it a many to many or one to many form of communication? How does it funnel conversation? From one to the masses. Does it provide engagement? Does it propagate understanding or provoke a continuation of thought? BenDoGood (talk) 11:04, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

Could "purely accidental imperfect copying" really make a chain letter more likely to be sent? This seems a little far-fetched, considering the time span that most chain letters last. --Berdidaine 21:14, 11 July 2005 (UTC)

, a kid at my school got a chain letter and it didn't purport to offer any kind of financial award, and didn't threaten the recipient with bad luck, it only wanted to be replicated as a kind of deliberate attempt to create a meme, like a viral marketing campaign with no actual product. Are chain letters inherently bad? --Victim Of Fate 10:32, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

 * If nothing else it wasted paper, postage and time. I suppose one possible example of a "good" chain letter might be Samizdat publication, but "good" is inherently POV - I'm sure Soviet officials didn't consider it so. :) Bryan 00:23, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

I spent hours copying and sending chain letters that promised real rewards, i.e. Little Golden Books, recipes, postage stamps from around the world, quilt squares. You sent the item to the first person on the list and added your name to the bottom. I never got a single thing back, but somebody got the things I sent them - so you could say some good came of them. Chocklit 23:43, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

 * What good came to them, other than free toilet paper? --Mista-X 23:08, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

 * The item Chocklit wrote about is known as a pyramid scheme and is illegal, matter of fact it is a Federal Offense, and would not qualify as a chain letter, chain letters while annoying to some, are not illegal.--75.17.193.238 (talk) 23:15, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

The page today says chain letters are either hoaxes or urban legends. This is way too narrow a definition. I like David Mikkelson's take on Snopes because it matches my experience: many chain letters are harmless or at worst annoying. Meonkeys (talk) 03:13, 15 April 2020 (UTC)

examples....
Should we include some examples? I get plenty of these I could donate :) 70.59.187.173 00:00, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

 * no.Dunc|☺ 00:22, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

 * Actually, perhaps you could put some on Sourceberg? I wonder what sort of licence a chain letter would be considered to be under, since the letter grants permission to freely copy it. :) Bryan 00:25, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

Oh, the dreaded afflictions of the chain letter....

examples of the longest lasting, or forwarded by the most people, would be good. Saccerzd 16:33, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Nice examples would be the ones from the series with include the Baklaliviatatlaglooshenian boy... That's just so sad.. =( lol 200.230.213.152 02:54, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

"#09/90 hoax" chain letter has been circulation around for some time. Now it has arrived to Latvia. It's translated to Latvian language and even got published into largest daily newspaper together with police warning to not follow any callers instructions. Unfortunately newspaper article is only in Latvian: http://www.diena.lv/lat/tautas_balss/lasitaji_vaica/bridina-par-telefonkrapniekiem —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.234.162.11 (talk) 10:45, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

Memes and human hosts

 * A chain letter can be considered a type of meme, a self-replicating piece of information that uses a human host to distribute copies of itself.

The present language of this article carries certain assumptions that may not be widely held. Perhaps they are good assumptions, but it would be nice to distance the article from them. Eric 08:27, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

The Amy Bruce chain letter hoax
Hey, I was wondering if this was something good to write an article about. I`ve heard about this infamous chain letter hoax that started back in the 1990`s.

The letter talked about a 7 year-old girl named Amy Bruce who said she was dying from lung cancer(from "second hand smoke") and a brain tumor(from "repeated beatings"). She said every time her letter was forwarded, the Make-A-wish foundation would donate 7 cents to her cause because her parents couldn`nt pay her hospital bills.

Of course, the whole letter was a hoax. But I thought it was intresting. I was wondering if i could... ummm... write an article about it. I first had some doubts about asking since Amy does`nt exist and the whole thing is a hoax. Please tell me what you think. 67.33.252.42 22:04, 11 March 2006 (UTC)4.153.2.35 5:02 10, march 2006
 * It would be best to mention it in this article first. Then, if there is enough information, a separate article  yea one time after dark alex hale was walking and  he heard his name 5 times then that was the eand ==YouTube==

Chain posts have been popping up all over YouTube lately. Just look around. World Challenge 01:23, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, here's a good example:

In 1945,a young girl named katu lata kulu came over to America in a grey boat from Africa. A mysterious man killed her by cutting the word "LATUALATUKA" into her back. now that you have read this measge she will come to your house on a full moon and steal your soul unless you follow these directions: 1. Retype this message as a comment for three other videos

It also appears on Bebo.com. Dessydes 01:57, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

There's also a similar story about a ghost coming out of a mirror and killing you. I hate those friggin' chain e-mails!

Yeah, me too. Here's another one:

PLEASE DON'T READ THIS. You will get kissed on the nearest possible Friday by the love of your life. Tomorrow will be the best day of your life. However, if you don't post this comment to at least 3 videos, you will die within 2 days. Copy and paste this, to be saved

Dessydes 15:25, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

More YouTube
I f*cking hate those chain letters on YouTube, pisses me off everytime i see one. Like this one: 'this is a true thing that can happen! its not a chain letter! its kinda scary at first but it really works!! paste this message into 3 comments and press ATL F4 and your crushes name will appear on your screan!!! is so weird this is a true thing that can happen! its not a chain letter! its kinda scary at first but it really works!! paste this message into 3 comments and press ATL F4 and your crushes name will appear on your screan!!! is so weird'

Retards. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.132.49.27 (talk • contribs) 19:25, March 23, 2007 (UTC)

LOL. The very act of instructing them to copy it off to others qualifies it a chain letter, hilarious that they deny it. --Stratadrake 04:00, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
 * 'Now uv started readin dis dunt stop. This is so scary. Send this to 5 ova videos in 143 minutes. When ur done press F6 and ur crushes name will appear on the screen in big letters. This is scary cause it actually works. If u break the chain u will have problems with relations p.s for the next five years x-x-x '. Never fails to amuse. Is there a name for this kind of chain mail? --86.152.105.70 22:16, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah. its called "chav mail". --Coolspanner 19:55, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

More of this
I found this teddy crap on Newgrounds first.

Hi, I am Teddy. Once you read this youkill you. Don't believe me? Case 1: Patty Buckles WAIT IM JENNIFER IF UR READIND THIS UR STUPID IT AINT REAL GOD IS ND HE IS COMING BACK GET READY get saved b4 its to late!!!!!!!!!!!!! Got this e-mail. She doesn't believe in chain letters. Well, Foolish Patty. She was sleeping when her TV started flickering on and off. Now she's not with us anymore. Ha ha patty, Ha ha! You don't want to be like Patty, do you? Case 2: George M. Simon Hates chain mail, but he didn't want to die that night. He sent it to 4 people. Not good enough George. Now, George is in a coma, we don't know if he'll ever wake up. Ha ha George, Ha ha! Now, do you want to be like George? Case 3: Valarie Tyler She got this letter. Another chain letter she thought. Only had 7 people to send to. Well, That night when she was having a shower she saw bloody Mary in the mirror. It was the BIGGEST fright of her life. Valarie is scarred for life. Case 4: Derek Minse This is the final case I'll tell you about. Well, Derek was a smart person. He sent it to 12 people. Later that day, he found a $100.00 bill on the ground. He was premoted to head officer at his job and his girlfriend said yes to his purposal. Now, Katie and him are living happily ever after.The have 2 beautiful children. Send this to at least 12 people or you'll face the consequences. 0 people- You will die tonight 1-6 people- you will be injured 7-11 people- you will get the biggest fright of your life 12 and over- you are safe and will have good fortune!

Not only that one but it is on the entire internet!!!

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Hi%2C+I+am+Teddy.+Once+you+read+this+you&btnG=Search

--203.81.161.151 17:18, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Here's some short crap that I also found on YouTube: If you don't repost this 3 times, a penguin will come to your house and pee on your sofa. WTF????? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.188.19.16 (talk) 21:38, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Viral
There should be someplace where they define this as viral, but I'm not sure where. AkvoD3 16:48, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Legality?
I remember hearing that chain letters are illegal in Germany? Anybody know more about this? It needn't be forbidden by law, post regulations would suffice. -- 62.143.101.71 (talk) 17:19, 11 December 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.174.249.100 (talk) 22:20, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

Age
I recall reading that these letters were common after the first world war - letters purporting to have been started by a soldier in the trenches.There was a sort of superstition that it was bad luck to break it. Fainites barley 22:50, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Meme Again
Memes are bullshit - the term "meme" is neologism equipped with lots of new vocabulary but no new ideas. I removed this bullshit. Those who defend "memes" are worthless idiots deserving of scorn. They are opportunist of last years' intellectual prostitution. Out with them. And "viral phenomenon"? Pu-lease! Let's keep the tone encyclopedic folks, at least on the encyclopedia page. It is true that there have chain letter without religious overtones or threats - perhaps these could be described without Robert-Anton-Wilson-tardation. '''GOD IS COMIN BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ''' —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.174.249.100 (talk) 22:22, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

What Really Happened To Carmen Winstead
Carmen Winstead-The Things People Believe Some people believe Carmen was pushed in a drain, some people think she was choped up by her mother, well ill tell you the story to both-

At a school fire drill 5 girls wanted to embaress Carmen, they thought pushing her down a open sewer would do perfect.When she didnt submerge, the police were called, they said that Carmen fell, everybody believed them. They went to retrive the body, when they got the body up, the neck was broken from hitting the ladder, and concrete. Six months later David Gregory Read this post, but thought it was a myth that she will kill you if you dont repost, so he didnt. That night he was in the shower and he heard laughter from his drain, he was spooked, so he ran to his computer to repost this. He went to bed perfect that night. 5 hours later his mother was awakend to a loud noise, to find David was gone. That morning, a few hours later, the police found his body in a near by sewer. Has neck was broken and the skin on his face was peeled off.

The other story is - Carmen was fighting with her mom over cuerfue, and she threw a punch, her mother blocked the punch and punched her back, hard enough to knock her out, when she fell, her neck was broken from hitting the dinning room chair. Her mother cut her up into little peices and flushed her down the toilet. And she was discoverd in the sewer the next day.

Six months later David Gregory Read this post, but thought it was a myth that she will kill you if you dont repost, so he didnt. That night he was in the shower and he heard laughter from his drain, he was spooked, so he ran to his computer to repost this. He went to bed perfect that night. 5 hours later his mother was awakend to a loud noise, to find David was gone. That morning, a few hours later, the police found his body in a near by sewer. Has neck was broken and the skin on his face was peeled off. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.130.65.125 (talk) 07:29, 14 December 2008 (UTC) THIS IS FAKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKEEEEEEEEEEE —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.174.249.100 (talk) 22:23, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

 * it is fake 2600:8807:A797:FD00:CE4A:8603:D709:2E5B (talk) 21:12, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
 * True. 2601:1C0:CC00:5A20:FC3E:F379:113E:FB78 (talk) 03:20, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

Purpose
Can someone explain what would be the motivation of any person to initiate a chain letter if it doesn't ask for anything? The e-mail services can make money of this? Or anyone can, without asking for it? Because one thing in common is that all of them ask to be sent, sowhat's to gain? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paranoidhuman (talk • contribs) 21:19, 3 May 2009 (UTC) i think the purpose might be to scare other people into reposting, but for what reason i don’t know.

Chain Posts On Youtube
These chained-together messages that users re-post and re-post on comment boxes are called chain posts. These chain posts on Youtube are circulating indefinitely because of its pyramid scheme. Every Youtube user should check their video(s) daily for this kind of posting waste and disable commenting so that it stops. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.233.4.135 (talk) 04:10, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

Chain spiders
Is this original research? A Google search  showed only a couple of references to the term "Chain Spider" in relation to chain letters, and most (if not all) of those are copies of this article. – → Adrian Lozano (talk) 18:04, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

More book and studies about Chain letters
Michel-Louis Rouquette has written books about rumors (hoaxes in french) and has been doing a great study about Chain Letters and Rumors at Internet. His book "Chaînes magiques - les maillons de l'appartenance" seems to be rare, I just found it at the catalog of the Université Paris (sorbonne). It would be cool if somebody could tell us where to find it do buy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.88.213.152 (talk) 03:42, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

More stuff
http://www-ccs.cs.umass.edu/cris/internet-myths.html

This is a page on the UMASS site about the Jessica Mydek hoax. WhisperToMe (talk) 04:46, 2 October 2011 (UTC)

THIS TALK PAGE IS PERFECT EXAMPLE OF TALK PAGE POSTING VIOLATIONS
What is the only real rule to posting on Talk Pages? This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. Unfortunately, or Fortunately, depending upon your viewpoint, this talk page is not one yet visited by the Self Appointed Talk Page Police. Most of this Talk Page is exactly how a general discussion of the article's subject would be defined.--75.17.193.238 (talk) 23:37, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

chain letter
what happens if you don't send it then what happens to you nothing bad can really happen, sometimes the things if you believe a chain mail and something happens it could be all in your head but who knows. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.188.187.166 (talk) 15:46, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Sana May taong Totoo
Sa bawat oo may mali. pero sana maalala mo naman ako, at mapatawad dahil lahat naman pwede mag bago eh! sana pwede pa kasi nag hihintay ako sorry ha! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 112.208.193.102 (talk) 05:43, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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Terrible introduction
The introduction condenses much information into extremely few words, such as this sentence:

"The "chain" is actually an exponentially growing pyramid (a tree graph) that cannot be sustained indefinitely."

which is the most essential aspect of chain letters. (How many people understand either "exponentially growing pyramid" or "tree graph"???) The sentence quoted above is highly unlikely to be understood by most people coming to this Wikipedia article to find out what a chain letter is.

I thought maybe this brief description would be elaborated on later in the article. It is not.

With an article like this, there might as well be no article.2600:1700:E1C0:F340:E5F0:9F2A:785A:2778 (talk) 17:35, 4 May 2018 (UTC)

yaaas

Unsupported claim of being sarcastic, added by 73.60.41.24.
I and another user have reverted the additions made by 73.60.41.24 on Chain letter. The edits are subjective and personal opinions, without any supporting references. The information has been added 4 times by the user. I have left a 3RR warning, and there seems to be a pattern of constant warnings on the page. (Yes, I know with IP addresses it could be a few different people). Not wanting to fall foul of 3RR myself, could someone else have a look over the edit history and give some guidance. --Dmol (talk) 09:37, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

H
H — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.118.20.73 (talk) 14:41, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 21:56, 6 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Discord Chain Message.png

Detected malware threats.
Saturday, January 23rd, 2021.

Hi, just dropping by to bring the following to your attention in order to (double-)check these findings for yourself, and possibly edit, delete, or attach caution to the specific links/texts.

It's to be expected (consequently accepted) that even today many users still don't have any suitable anti-virus/-malware program/software installed, which is the reason why I'm approaching you, since I wouldn't like having the PC/laptop/phone of this 'type of user' to risk any infections.

I'm using "Malwarebytes Premium" and my settings are at a "moderate" detection level (opposed to a 'neurotic' or 'hysterical' modus), so any detections should be taken as pretty much valid (ie, not as "absolute", but as "valid" nonetheless).

MBAM blocked the following links mentioned in the "External links" section:

•An example of a "Send-a-dime" letter •Chain Letter Evolution, Daniel W. VanArsdale. A historical analysis, including an archive of actual letters.

Reason for blocking was the detection of potential "Trojan" malware, and both links share the exact same source: Domain: www.silcom.com – IP address: 207.154.88.26

I do believe that there's something to these, bc if it were a mere matter of the website not using the secure version of the hypertext protocol, it would've just labelled the blocked attempt as "possibly unsafe website"; MBAM is quite careful, and hands out "Trojan" warnings sparsely in my experience (reason I took it seriously).

So, to finish... please take a look and preferably test these yourself with adequate precautions, taking any necessary steps you see fit.

Have a nice weekend, and a good week.

Jennie.--64.44.80.172 (talk) 15:15, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

TikTok "Manifestation" Videos
On TikTok, there is a very popular genre of video along the lines of "don't skip or something bad will happen! Now, comment and use this sound for good luck." I would classify this as the most recent evolution of the chain letter, and suggest that it be added to this article. IHasAnAvocado (talk) 15:02, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Chain letter


text:
User talk:SPUI/random rail stuff archive

Photos or maps ohio
Do you know of any good PD sources for photos or maps in Ohio? Warren County Canal is in need (up for FAC). thanks. Mark in Richmond. Vaoverland 20:01, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks. This is a copy: Dear User:PedanticallySpeaking: Please look at my talk page (most recent item for User:SPUI). I had asked him to see what we could do about a map (or images) for the article. He has done some outstanding map creation work for other transportation article and also found image sources when I couldn't. However, if you can give him good information, maybe even a handdrawn map if possible, he may be able to create something nice for the article. I encourage you to communicate directly with User: SPUI I am having some computer broadband problems, so can't be on as much as usual. I will copy this message to both of you. And, my thanks to both of you for the good work on transportation articles, which are dear to my heart.  Mark in Richmond. Vaoverland 20:23, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)

Salve, SPUI! Vaoverland suggested I get in touch with you re the Warren County Canal article about possibly creating a map. The route of the canal is spelled out in the article. Basically, it started at Middletown, Ohio, went southeast for about fifteen miles to about four miles southwest of Lebanon, Ohio, then turned northeast to Lebanon. It roughly ran along the route of the Middletown and Cincinnati Railroad to Hageman's Crossing, Ohio, then followed the Cincinnati, Lebanon, and Northern Railroad into Lebanon. The only map I've seen in Elva Adams's book (cited in the canal article) depicts a lazily drawn "U" shape. I did see a map in another book yesterday that says it ran through Sect. 28 in western Turtlecreek Township, Warren County, Ohio, which is bounded by State Route 741 on the east and Hamilton Road on the south. The co-ordinates for the termini are in their articles already. The railroads routes can be seen by looking at the Warren County property records. The Indiana and Ohio Railroad and the City of Lebanon now own the railroad routes. If you will search for parcel 12145020010, owned by the City and running between Hageman's and Lebanon you will find a map come up. Click on that map for a larger version. The railroad is easily picked out from the parcel map because it is a long and narrow parcel. Let me know if I can help further. PedanticallySpeaking 14:36, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)

SPUI, Thanks for your reply. Up there between Monroe and Middletown I recall one of the references, I believe the Bogan "Warren County Canal" piece, said the canal went north along Cincinnati-Dayton between Greentree and State Route 122. Of course, at this scale, I don't think anyone would be able to tell the difference if you weren't precise. PedanticallySpeaking 17:50, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)

SPUI, Thank you, thank you, thank you for the map of the canal. Wonderful that you should find this. Could I trouble you for more maps? I've been working on the articles for townships (see my new WikiProject Ohio townships), but lack maps for many of them. I wonder if you could zoom in on the counties of Butler, Warren, Clinton, and Hamilton and save them as individual files for me. They show the townships clearly and I'd like to add them to the township articles. And though I said it before, thank you. PedanticallySpeaking 14:16, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

SPUI, I should have looked a bit closer on that map. I see that two of the Warren townships are missing; they hadn't been created yet (Massie and Harlan). Oh, well, scratch my request. PedanticallySpeaking 14:19, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

SPUI, Thanks for the tip. Alas, I work at the public library, so I don't have the ability to down- and up-load or manipulate pictures. PedanticallySpeaking 16:11, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

List of urban heavy rail systems
What is the motivation for moving List of metro systems? Susvolans (pigs can fly) 12:34, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Uberarticles
Wikipedia policy is to have subjects covering discrete topics by their common names. Commonality does not justify mixing broad topics with observable physical and history differences into super-articles; and titles are supposed to be the common names of things: Naming conventions (common names). There is no such industry generic nomenclature as "heavy urban rail" which also more suggests commuter railroads. The generic term is rapid transit. If you wish to continue to make super-articles, I won't interfere, but please leave the individual articles alone. How can you justify making micro-articles for subway cars, but merge huge and diverse industries into one article? -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 20:18, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * A redirect is not an article; "urban heavy rail" is a non-expression; and overlap does not justify merger where there are discrete differences in understanding. Regional differences, when they are large, need to be respected rather than deciding that one or the other version or a neologism is the "right" name for the article. --- Cecropia | explains it all ® 20:25, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Rapid transit is better than Urban heavy rail, but my main argument is with the mergings. Light rail is a neologism that has a different meaning than streetcar both in existing systems and in history. There are streetcars (New Orleans, Toronto) that are streetcars first, and light rail only by extension. There are lines officially called light rail (JFK AirTrain) that are in no way streetcars.

 * I suggest we revert to the former names and place a poll on each article in the form:

Article merger
Should (tram or streetcar) by merged into a common article with light rail?

Yes

No

Comment

I will be bowled over if there is a consensus to merge. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 20:35, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

1-9, F-V, J-Z
You said: ''By the way, note how I combined some subway services like the 1-9, F-V and J-Z. This is a similar case.''

Therein is the core of our disagreement. Except for F-V (which should really be separate), these are simple clones with skip-stop being the only difference. Streetcars, trams and light rail have different discrete meanings. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 20:48, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

3RR
I apologize on the 3RR issue. I miscounted what was going on. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 22:53, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * Yes, Wikicheerfulness seems to be restablishing. Please note, I didn't mess with any of your edits on the "new" articles--just reverted the redirects. I think this can work out. Cheers, Cecropia | explains it all ® 23:02, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Tram
OK but could you please leave the tram/streetcar articles as they were until we come to some sort of agreement on what to do. G-Man 23:25, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Warren County Canal
Thansk for your effort on this article. Mark in Richmond. Vaoverland 01:14, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)

Trams, Streetcars, Light Rail, Metros, Subways et al
Hi.

You wrote:

 * I see you formerly discussed this split on Talk:Streetcar. There's a current discussion going on there now; I'd appreciate more opinions, no matter what side. Thanks. --SPUI (talk) 20:49, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

 * Sorry to bother you again - there's also a poll now on Talk:Metro about whether metro and subway should be merged. --SPUI (talk) 21:04, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads-up. I've now voted (merge) in the metro/subway vote, and I'm pondering the other one.

I think there are two issues here. There are cases where we have two different article for what is to all intents and purposes the same animal, largely driven by the use of different names in different cultures. Metro and Subway is one such case, and (as you have noticed) I also believe Streetcar and Tram is another.

But those are easy issues compared to the ones where we have to draw boundaries between related and often overlapping terms on a continuous spectrum. So I don't think that streetcar/tram is quite the same thing as light rail, which isn't quite the same thing as metro/subway, which isn't quite the same thing as suburban rail, which isn't quite the same thing as commuter rail. But equally I cannot come up with a fail-safe way of distinguishing them. I think the only way to deal with this is to take arbitrary decisions, and then write lots of text to explain the arbitrariness. Although I worry that we try doing that on Wikipedia then someone will take a dislike to the arbitrary decisions, and change it all, again and again.

So on the whole, and right now, I do think we should merge Tram and Streetcar, but leave Light rail as a separate article. Now how to inject that into the discussion. -- Chris j wood 10:26, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Surface rail
Fine by me, except that it's ambiguous. I would have used 'surface rail' instead of 'at-grade urban transit', but 'surface rail' could reasonably mean _all_ non-subway, non-elevated rail, rather than just trams, trolleys, light rail, and the like. How about 'Urban surface rail?' It has 3 google hits, but we can always replace it with a better term when we come up with one. jdb ❋ (talk) 23:29, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Park St and others
Taking a modern view of the same angle (and a bunch of other spots) is something I want to fit in this summer. I hope they've calmed down a bit with the photo paranoia by now. --iMb~Meow 05:10, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

BERy map
It looks like the tracks match up great to the BERy versions, yay! Nice-to-have but not killer additions would be the demo date for the Atlantic section (1942, but a portion from Tower C out to Commercial St was kept around for layovers), and maybe some of the switch towers (for example, Boston transportation mentions towers C and D for the Atlantic Ave branch). --iMb~Meow 11:25, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Union stations
Those names are confusing, for sure. It works out roughly like this: --iMb~Meow 12:41, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
 * 1893, Union Station opens, just the one. Life is simple.
 * 1898/1899: South Union Terminal is built and opens. The old Union station starts being called North for obvious reasons.
 * 1927: The old (North) Union is hacked into tiny bits and replaced by North Station (officially this time) under the new Boston Garden.
 * Informally, the North/South Station names were used "forever".
 * As best I can tell, South Station wasn't the super duper officially official name until the 1980s redevelopment, even though it was pretty much universally known as that.
 * Just to make things a little more clear, one of the Main Line platforms at what's now Haymarket was also named Union (but Friend on the other side, just to keep people guessing).

ancient streetcar map: nope.
I thought I had something that ancient, but it's from 1930 and adds nothing new. Sorry. --iMb~Meow 17:45, 17 May 2005 (UTC)

 * It's going to be a few weeks at best :( I do like the idea of scanning though, the artwork on those old maps was cool. --iMb~Meow

UrbanPlanet link
What is your objection to the UrbanPlanet forum link I added to the MBTA article? --DeanoNightRider 08:21, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

Silver Line
Would you mind if I changed all the Silver Line stops so they have the same sort of navigation bar things as the other lines?

--Knuckle50 03:03, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I wasn't really sure about how I would fit it, I guess I'll think about it and get back to you... --Knuckle50 03:08, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Template:MNRR acc
Hi SPUI,

I just came across this copy of Template:acc. Is there a reason why this exists in addition to acc? If not then we should probably delete this template along with acc. The easiest way of achieving that would probably be to redirect it. --MarSch 15:42, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

 * Why don't you link them now, instead of waiting for the creation of those articles?--MarSch 15:49, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Okay, what I don't understand is what happens to the wheelchair when you make them into redirects. --MarSch 15:54, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

 * It works!!! I think this is a brilliant hack, I don't even understand where the picture is. Or is Image:NYCS acc.png an image AND a redirect? --MarSch 16:09, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Okay, I think I understand now. What you really want is  only that doesn't exist. Nothing I came up with works either :( Image:NYCS acc.png  Image:NYCS acc.png

Does any image tutorial/guide say anything about this?--MarSch 16:33, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

QUACK
QUACK QUACK QUACK!!!

Charlie Card machine photos
I have permission from the photographer. See

I will get permission now, don't bother taking them down, I'm sure he'll be fine with it...

Got it.

What is a frog?
Hi, SPUI. Just thought you might like to know that someone (me) has finally answered your question at Talk:Railroad_switch... Picapica 8 July 2005 17:43 (UTC)

Alameda Corridor
Nice touch-up! Thanks for adding the map. I'll see what other information I can scrape off the net. Can you find a map for BNSF Harbor Subdivision? - Lucky 6.9 02:44, 11 July 2005 (UTC)

SM&B Charter
According to Kulp, the SM&B name was applied to two companies (NJ & NY), so they probably only had charter rights to the state line in the vicinity of Boston Corners. The line from State Line to Northampton would have been an extension of the Mass. Central, but it's not clear whether it would have been built under their charter, or whether they did/would have had to charter another railroad to construct that line. As for the route east of Boston Corners, my educated guess would be that the original SM&B (NY) charter had rights Liberty Corners (NY/NJ state line) to Boston Corners. However, the SM&B (NY) doesn't seem to have been included in the renaming and subsequent mergers/reorganizations of the SM&B (NJ) which were limited to PA and NJ. Per Kulp, the line from Liberty Corners to Pine Island (on the Erie RR) was graded by the PS&NE and track laid by the PP&B, which then chartered the Campbell Hall Connecting Railroad in NY and turned over the track to it, presumably because the loss of the SM&B (NY) left them with no NY charter. By this time, the route beyond Campbell Hall was CNE&W. Choess 22:00, July 23, 2005 (UTC)

Chicago rail stations
Nice work on the Chicago rail terminals template. I'm impressed that, in the 24 hours since I wrote/expanded those articles, they're getting so much attention.

 * A good source of info on old rail infrastructure is HABS/HAER, the files for which you can find at the Library of Congress website here. Each entry has photos from the 60s or 70s as well as extensive history and, sometimes, measured drawings (although the entry for Central Station seems to be missing the history).

 * The Nickel Plate did indeed use Illinois Central Station (Central Station) until the mid-50s, I think, at which point its association with the New York Central caused its trains to be moved to LaSalle Street, which was the NYC's Chicago terminal. If you've got any other questions, please feel free to ask.  This is an area of interest for me. --Boreas231 03:31, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Hey, nice work on the train stations, especially the Chicago Terminals infobox. I've been agonizing over what to do with them for weeks now, but what you've done tops anything I could come up with. Bravo! 14:11, August 12, 2005 (UTC)

 * You're right; I must have been mistaken about the NKP's association with the NYC. What I am certain about, though, is that (Illinois) Central Station was the only major terminal to have existed at the eastern end of 12th Street (aka Roosevelt Road).  It was sometimes referred to as "12th Street Station".  The remaining commuter station's name is "12th Street-Roosevelt Road".  The non-electrified intercity tracks on the IC alignment have now been reconfigured, but there used to be a direct link of quadruple tracks from Central Station to a junction just south of LaSalle Street Station.  The connection has now been reduced to double tracks and simplified so that northbound freight trains cross over the commuter tracks under McCormick Place and turn west, connecting to the BNSF (ex-CBQ) over the old St. Charles Airline bridge.

 * As for pinning down the date of the terminal switch, you might try looking for a series called The Official guide of the railways and steam navigation lines of the United States, Porto Rico, Canada, Mexico and Cuba. It was published annually by the National Railway Publication Company, and includes maps and timetables for every passenger railroad in the U.S., as well as some scheduled freight info.  I think it's available in most large university libraries.  The Library of Congress call number for the series is HE2727.O3. --Boreas231 14:58, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Park Avenue
See Forgotten NY. Sounds from their description as if the 1830s construction predates the street. Choess 04:34, August 15, 2005 (UTC)

Un-speedied 1980 SEPTA map
I don't believe "only had a category, which are not for images on Wikipedia" is one of the criteria for speedy deletion, so I removed the tag from Image:SEPTA_Rapid_and_Commuter_Rail_System_1980.png. It is used in the article SEPTA Regional Rail, so it is not true that it "only had a category"; moreover, images are categorized throughout Wikipedia, both in dedicated categories like Category:Wikipedia_images_by_topic or mixed with articles like Category:Flags_of_the_United_Kingdom. Thought I would drop a note in case I missed something. - choster 01:47, 24 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Ah, the Commons. Thanks, sorry for the bother. - choster 18:04, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

3RR
Please do not keep undoing other people's edits without discussing them first. This is considered impolite and unproductive. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing Wikipedia under the three-revert rule, which states that nobody may revert an article to a previous version more than three times in 24 hours. Thank you. --Ryan Delaney talk 22:24, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

I am warning you based on these edits. You have not violated the rule; I am just providing you with a friendly reminder that if you revert again prior to 05:10, 25 August 2005 UTC, you will have broken the 3RR. --Ryan Delaney talk 22:29, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Trenton
And just as before as in the the debate for Wilmington Station (Delaware), Trenton (Amtrak station) is not going to cut it. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 07:36, 25 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I'll offer a compomrise, becuas i rather not see the rons get involed on RM, Trention Rail Station (New Jersey), that should remove most of the "ambiguity" and a disambig note for West Trenton, as that would be the only other New Jersey station that could be confused with Trenton. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 07:46, 25 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Fime, i moved the page, i'll fix the redirect in a sec, what "main station" are you talking about. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 07:53, 25 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Nifty, i could only guess that those stations were better then the present. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 08:25, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

SEPTA
I think using Center City Philadelphia for the SEPTArr infobox would be an improvement. --Luciuskwok 11:25, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

I think it should be consistent with what a passenger would see before boarding a train. The problem is that on through trains, SEPTA crews sometimes put a "Center City Philadelphia" sign on the train, and other times use the ultimate destination of the train. I think "Center City Philadelphia" without a link works best.--Luciuskwok 11:57, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

I think as long as it's clear in the article that the station is in the Philadelphia area, "Center City" works. My preference is to be more verbose in situations where there is ambiguity. --Luciuskwok 12:14, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

VIA stations
The form Kitchener, Ontario railway station (see Category:Canadian railway stations) seems to me much more effective for stations named after the city they serve than Grimsby (VIA station); for a start, it specifies the province, which is important given that not all city names are unique. It also matches the form that has been used quite successfully for articles about Britain (see examples such as Windermere railway station), which has far more passenger railway services than anywhere in North America, not to mention all sorts of cities with multiple stations, complicated routes, and the like.

In many cases, the stations also pre-date VIA, and a number are shared with other railways (I was planning to rename shared VIA-GO stations such as Aldershot (GO Station) to the more generic form). David Arthur 21:04, September 2, 2005 (UTC)

 * I see no reason why information about a railway station's predecessor couldn't be included in the same article, though it seems there are few enough people interested in writing articles about even the stations that do still exist (Pacific Central Station (Vancouver) still lacks an entry). When two railways operate from separate stations, there may be call for separate articles (for a parallel of sorts, see Canary Wharf tube station and Canary Wharf DLR station), but when there's only one station, I don't think it's productive to attach an individual carrier's name to it, especially when it's shared. The pipe trick is useful, but I personally don't think it's worth having a less-appropriate title in order to save typing. David Arthur 21:19, September 2, 2005 (UTC)

Buckingham Branch
Oops!! It came through e-mail. Let me get on that right away. Thanks. Mark in Historic Triangle, Vaoverland 22:36, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

 * An image (admittedly not as stunning) from Ken Moss has been substituted. Thanks!! Vaoverland 22:50, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

Norfolk Southern Railway (former)
I was pleased to see that you created a new (and long-overdue) WP article on this railroad. Harry Bundy of our Virginian Railway group on Yahoo is a retiree of the original Norfolk Southern and an excellent source for information,a s is warren Calloway. We may be able to get some good ikages, logo help, etc. There is also a group on Yahoo for the original Norfolk Southern. I moderate one and belong to the other. I will pass along the good news about your new WP article, and surely some additional facts and some links will emerge to enhance the article. Good job! (and thanks again for catching my screw up on the Buckingham Branch image!). Yours in Virginia's Historic Triangle, Mark. Vaoverland 11:09, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

Norfolk Southern (former)
I hope you did not mind my nominating your NS article for the DYK feature and adding to it. The various Yahoo rail groups are excited about it. A fellow named Harry Bundy who is active in my Virginian railway Enthusiasts Yahoo group (550 members online!) is something like a 50-year veteran. Railfans have noted that the original NS (as they seem to call it) may hold some kind of record for its many financial reorganizations. Here are some notes from Harry about the article:

"Mark: A few corrections: There is reference to Mackey. Prior to the trestle (1910), this was listed in timetables as Mackey's Ferry.  After, the station became Mackeys. It also notes that this station is "on the other side of the Albemarle Sound from Elizabeth City". It's on the other side of the Albemarle Sound from Edenton. Virginia and Carolina Coast Railroad - later the Suffolk & Carolina.  In addition to the line between Suffolk south to Edenton, the S&C also had a line from Beckford Jct. (on the Suffolk-Edenton section) to Elizabeth City. The Egyptian Railroad.  It isn't said, and not many people know, but North Carolina had coal near Cumnock.  It was known as the Egyptian field.  NS steam locomotives burned coal from the Egyptian field until about 1935.  As one engineer noted - "it packed all the btu's of a day-old cow pie". Trivia - Chocowinity was named Marsden to reduce having to send the eleven- alphas.   As Texas Gulf Sulphur began receiving shipments, Marsden became the governing agency.  In 1966 BZC (before zip codes),  the agent at Timbuktu would  send any correspondence regarding shipments to AGENT-Marsden, NC. Marsden wasn't a post office. The mail would usually be received by the SAL agent at Marston, NC and he, being a railroad familiar, would forward it to Chocowinity. So at one midnight in 1966, Marsden became Chocowinity and the NS went back to 1917 because in repeating train orders, stations are spelled out letter-by-letter. Care to guess what dunce was working the night ALL bulletin orders had to be rewritten showing Chocowinity instead of Marsden, and then repeated to the dispatcher?"                                                              Harry Bundy

I must learn to do spell checking before releasing my work (due to my motor coordination disability, I transpose letters, creating misspelling a 2nd grader could avoid). Thus, the image file of the night shot of the NS passenger train on the Albemarle Sound was misspelled. I highly recommend the ieSpell program. Good article. I hope it makes the main page.

BTW, if you get a chance to come up with a simple map of the Historic Triangle, it would enhance that article a great deal, I believe. Thanks! Mark. Vaoverland 21:36, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

BC Rail a class I?
Hi, do you have a source for this edit? My understanding was that BC Rail was a provincially-chartered railway, and since it was provincially-chartered and not federally-chartered, it would be a Class II, regardless of how much revenue it earned. Thanks, JYolkowski // talk 01:23, 26 September 2005 (UTC)

Union Station (Chicago)
Ok, I see you point. I thought by intercity you were talking about anywhere outside of Chicago because Ogilvie serves Kenosha and other smaller cities in the metro area. --Gpyoung talk 00:52, 27 September 2005 (UTC)

interurbans / chicagoland
left you a note at Template talk:CTA Tedernst 16:03, 8 October 2005 (UTC)

Winchester and Western Railroad and South Branch Valley Railroad
As I don't know much or at least close to nothing about railroads in the United States, I was wondering if you could please share with me where these railroads fit into the fabric of the B&O railroad system. I've seen that you have written extensively on many American railroad lines. I know both were at times parts of the B&O System. Had you ever heard of them? I've always known of them from a local standpoint. The W&W is mostly abandoned and the SBVR was bought by the State of West Virginia as a tourist attraction and to haul grain and feed. I'd appreciate if you could offer up your estemed opinion of these two railroads.

Oh, and as a West Virginian, I have to agree with 71Demon, the West Run Expressway as a named highway is dead and it's back to being referred to as I-268. It is incorrect to redirect I-268 to an article named so. I suggest an article for West Run Expressway as a former concept that can be linked to from a separate I-268 article. --Caponer 00:17, 9 October 2005 (UTC)

 * I looked at some topo maps in that area and the abandoned rail bed of the W&W is still listed and the SBVR is still functioning but I was wondering how they fit in with the grand scheme of things. I was wondering if they could get included on the Railroad template but I'm not sure what class they were, most definitely not high on the list of importance. --Caponer 00:49, 9 October 2005 (UTC)

re: Class I template
Aw, jeez, now I'll have to think about it. B-) Good points, all.  I was going through several articles looking for new facts for Portal:Trains/Did you know and WP:GA candidates when I ran across these two in the template.  I've always known Columbus and Greenville as CAGY, but I'll be the first to admit that I hadn't really researched it yet.  As to Montour, as far as I know, reporting marks were always a minimum of two letters.  For both of them, I just looked at the articles and used the mark that is listed in the lead since that seemed the most natural to me.  Having M and C&G in the template just looked wrong and inconsistent with the rest of the template to me.  I'll have to research and think about it a little more before I really come to an opinion, but right now I think the more modern marks look better in the list.  Whether they are more appropriate is a question that I don't have an answer to right now.  I'll get back to you on it... slambo 21:57, 14 October 2005 (UTC)

Conrail
Congratulations are in order for your efforts to cleanup and present Conrail, one of the more complicated railroad articles. I guess we should have known you would be the one to face this challenge after your work on the original Norfolk Southern Railway, with a history of bankruptcies and reorganizations which was almost complex, save the government ownership aspect. Mark Vaoverland 06:00, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

Image:Chessie 255x70.png
You reverted my removal of a speedy tag on Image:Chessie 255x70.png. Under exactly which CSD does this qualify for speedy deletion? I don't see any that apply. DES (talk) 19:31, 17 October 2005 (UTC)

 * I have now created Orphaned fairuse and a short-cut or-fu to tag images in this situation, on the model of nosource or unverified. That should help, i hope. DES (talk) 19:56, 17 October 2005 (UTC)

 * The one reason to name the variable is that in the rare case where the new image name includes an equals sign, the positional form breaks and the named form doesn't, as I understand it. But that is a reare case. DES (talk) 20:12, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Yes subst: will probably do for the rare case. i picked this up when someone altered nothanks-sd to use a named parameter, after I created it with a positional one. Of course, a URL is far more likely to include an equals sign than is an image name. DES (talk) 20:22, 17 October 2005 (UTC)

Template:Chicago L
Actually, I was thinking that Assume good faith was meaningful, and the reason that you were "waiting" for an explanation is that you hadn't read the reasons on the talk page that were waiting for you, and that the reason you hadn't answered the questions posed to you on said talk page was because you hadn't seen them. Apparently, I thought wrong; perhaps you should review No personal attacks and Civility before editting any further. siafu 20:13, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Have you considered making a template for Chicago interurban trains, rather than mixing it in with L? You could include Metra and South Shore, as well, which makes much more sense.  We also wouldn't have to fight about it. siafu 02:38, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Amtrak_schematic.png
Your image Amtrak_schematic.png shows up as broken on Amtrak and the image history only shows deleted edits on the Wikipedia side. However, Image:Amtrak_schematic.png is in Commons and therefore should be showing up. Any idea what's up with that? Thatdog 01:00, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

1842
I've changed the 1842 extension back to Mount Carbon. However, the line to Pottsville already existed, as the Mount Carbon Railroad (originally built to connect the canal to mines), so I clarified that. --SPUI (talk) 23:26, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Thanks, good job, that is true Scott 00:50, 29 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Scottfisher"

Image:Amtrak California simplified map.svg
This image, Image:Amtrak California simplified map.svg, has two San Joses, with one of them located where San Diego should be. Blank Verse 13:36, 20 November 2005 (UTC)

Alaska
Regarding your recent edit to the Alaska article stating that many commuter rail services still offer flag stop service - do you have any sources to support this? —akghetto (talk) 07:11, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the cite, however as you also stated, it is a bit different than flagging down a train on a platform; even calling the Alaska Rail Road an "intercity" service is a tad of a stretch. The train literally goes through the middle of nowhere - it is the only means of getting to and from some areas of the state. You're not flagging down the train on a platform, you're in the woods standing along the track with no one else in a 50 mile radius trying to flag down a speeding full-size locomotive. Anywho, unless you streniously object, I think I'm going to re-add this notation to the Alaska article.

OK, how about, "It's one of America's last flag stop trains."? —akghetto (talk) 06:45, 8 December 2005 (UTC)


text:
Oxford University Democratic Socialist Club

The Oxford University Democratic Socialist Club (OUDSC) was a splinter group from Oxford University Labour Club (OULC), formed in 1940 after disaffiliation by the national Labour Party of OULC over its opposition to the Second World War and its support for the Soviet Union. Its first chair was Tony Crosland, who cofounded the club together with Roy Jenkins who subsequently became chair. David Ginsburg was also a chair, and George Orwell spoke to the club in 1941. OUDSC merged with OULC again in 1943.


text:
Social purpose

Within the context of law, "social purpose" is a scheme of statutory construction declaring that a statute should not be construed in a way that would violate normal societal values or good. Example of cases in which this rule of construction was used include Riggs v. Palmer (1889) and Holy Trinity Church v. United States (1892).

title: Social purpose


text:
Spittal an der Drau District

Bezirk Spittal an der Drau (Okrože Śpital ob Dravi) is an administrative district (Bezirk) in the state of Carinthia, Austria.

Geography
With an area of the district is 2,763.99 km², it is Austria's second largest district by area (after Liezen), even larger than the Austrian state of Vorarlberg, and by far the largest district in Carinthia. The administrative centre is Spittal an der Drau, other major settlements are Gmünd, Greifenburg, Millstatt, Obervellach, Radenthein, Seeboden, Steinfeld, and Winklern.

Together with the neighbouring districts of Hermagor and Feldkirchen, Spittal forms the Upper Carinthia (Oberkärnten) region according to the Nomenclature of Territorial Units for Statistics (NUTS). It borders on East Tyrol (Lienz District) in the west and the Austrian state of Salzburg in the north.

The mountainous area comprises the southern ranges of the High Tauern and the Möll valley, the western Gurktal Alps (Nock Mountains), as well as the broad Drava Valley and the northern slopes of the Gailtal Alps. The highest point is the peak of the Grossglockner, Austria's highest mountain at 3798 m. The district also includes Millstätter See and Weissensee, two of the major Carinthian lakes.

Administrative divisions
The district is divided into 33 municipalities, three of them are towns and ten of them are market towns.

Towns

 * 1) Gmünd (Sovodje; 2,520)
 * 2) Radenthein (Radenče; 5,777)
 * 3) Spittal an der Drau (Špital ob Dravi; 15,270)

Market towns

 * 1) Greifenburg (1,737)
 * 2) Lurnfeld (Lurnsko polje; 2,661)
 * 3) Millstatt (Milje; 3,462)
 * 4) Oberdrauburg (Gornji Dravograd; 1,203)
 * 5) Obervellach (Zgornja Bela; 2,206)
 * 6) Rennweg am Katschberg (1,705)
 * 7) Sachsenburg (1,366)
 * 8) Seeboden (Jezernica; 6,645)
 * 9) Steinfeld (Kamen; 2,009)
 * 10) Winklern (Kotlje; 1,202)

Municipalities

 * 1) Bad Kleinkirchheim (Cirkniške Toplice; 1,682)
 * 2) Baldramsdorf (1,848)
 * 3) Berg im Drautal (Gora v Dravski dolini; 1,373)
 * 4) Dellach im Drautal (Dole v Dravski dolini; 1,229)
 * 5) Flattach (1,157)
 * 6) Großkirchheim (Veliko Cirkno; 1,321)
 * 7) Heiligenblut(Sveta Kri) (964)
 * 8) Irschen (Rženo; 1,966)
 * 9) Kleblach-Lind (1,159)
 * 10) Krems in Kärnten (1,683)
 * 11) Lendorf (1,753)
 * 12) Mallnitz (Malnice; 766)
 * 13) Malta (1,902)
 * 14) Mörtschach (Morče; 834)
 * 15) Mühldorf (Mlina Vas; 1,012)
 * 16) Rangersdorf (1,690)
 * 17) Reißeck (Rajžek; 2,09q)
 * 18) Stall (1,476)
 * 19) Trebesing (Trebežinče; 1,162)
 * 20) Weißensee (Belo jezero; 769)

(Population figures as of May 9, 2024)

title: Spittal an der Drau District