text:
Talk:Canberra Airport

Caution - contains propoganda!
Note that the Canberra Airport staff are editing this page to remove content they disagree with.

Several edits from 203.22.237.174 (mail.canberraairport.com.au) have removed large sections of the article.

This article should be removed totally if they continue to astro turf it.

Update: Caution!!!
203.17.154.218 continues to undo others' edits and introduce errors of fact and make unsubstantiated claims. Pdfpdf 03:44, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

=2005=

International traffic
The article presently says: "The airport today can handle traffic from Melbourne International or Sydney International (Kingsford Smith International), where weather conditions restrict landings, and is the focus of a third major hub in South-Eastern Australia for international traffic." Is this true (especially the last part)? --ScottDavis 15:29, 23 July 2005 (UTC)

User:Adz 11:19, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I think you're right Scott. While the airport owners might aspire to one day being the 'third major hub for international traffic in SE Aust', there is very very little sign of any international traffic at Canberra 'International' (with heads of overseas Governments being the possible only exceptions. I think that even the Prime Minister leaves from Sydney when he goes on international trips. It's possible that Newcastle and Avalon receive more international traffic than Canberra. Canberra is capable of handling Boeing 747s and can handle traffic from Sydney or Melbourne, but I doubt that this happens very often, at least not for international flights. (I think that the last 747 to land at Canberra was carrying the Chinese President).

 * I seem to recall I heard that the runway is long enough to carry large jets such as the 747, but it's limited width means that excesive garbage is blown off the grass on either side nesistating cleaning of the runway. Therefor the airport while technically able to carry 747s is not able to do so on a regular basis. I wonder if this information is available anywhere on the web, or if it is a load of badly remembered garbage? This is also mentioned in the Canberra article. Martyman 03:53, 26 August 2005 (UTC)
 * you may be right. A while ago, i think when Bill Clinton visited, the runway wasn't long enogh for 747s, so he had to fly here in some other sort of plane. Realising that this was an issue for heads of state, they extended the runway, and last year the presidents of the USA and China landed in thier 747s. ... but they may have needed to clear the runway first. I think the point you raise warrants some research. Maybe best to remove it from the main Canberra article for now and leave it in here until somebody is able to clarify it. Adz 04:03, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

 * I've seen 747s (or whatever Air Force One is called) land and take off at Canberra. The length of the runway is more than ample for safe operation. I understand that the runway has been widened since privatisation and is able to carry 747s without debris fouling the runway. However, it seems that there may be various political games being played here. Both Bushs and Clinton visited Canberra in their jumbos, along with associated widebodies, but the Queen was denied permission to fly a chartered BA 747 in and out of Canberra in 2000, supposedly on safety grounds. Instead her aircraft landed in Sydney and she was flown to Canberra on one of the government's light VIP transports. I'll have to see if I can find a source for this.

 * It would be interesting to see how Canberra would cope with an influx of international flights if traffic were diverted from Sydney. The facilities for passenger handling, baggage handling and customs and immigration processing are quite inadequate for anything like a fraction of Sydney's routine capacity, quite apart from the problem of where to park the aircraft. --Jumbo 04:12, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

 * As of March 2006, the runways can land 747s - but each landing degrades the runway pavement, to the point where they can only land a limited number of 747s per year. They're expanding and upgrading the runways to be able to land 747s on a more regular basis. Source: http://www.canberraairport.com.au/pl_rw_mdp.htm 202.161.13.40 22:10, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Stub status?
This article currently has and  at the bottom. However, it does not appear that this article is, in fact, a stub. It may be in need of some expansion, but i don't think it qualifies as a stub. If there are no dissenting voices between now and the next time i think of it (maybe a week) i will remove them. -- Fudoreaper 21:57:44, 2005-08-25 (UTC)

 * Looking at the definition of stub, it appears that 3-10 sentences are a standard, more for more complex articles. I'd say that this article passed stub status sometime back, as there is a reasonable amount of information. I'll remove the stub status next time I edit, as I'm planning on putting in some more information on history. --Jumbo 22:04, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

 * Sounds fine, Jumbo. I'll leave this in your hand. :)  -- Fudoreaper 01:57:44, 2005-08-26 (UTC)
 * Thanks! I've been looking at other articles and the Canberra International Airport site for information. I've asked CIA to review and possibly expand the article. More pictures and a logo would be handy. --Jumbo 02:14, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

 * I agree. Its more than a stub. I'm happy for to to remove it. Adz 02:39, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

CIA response
I've had the following response from Canberra International Airport:

 * thank you for your email, which was passed to me for attention.

 * Let me first congratulate you on the effort you have obviously put into making the listing comprehensive and totally up-to-date.

 * The only slight error I can see in the entire listing is that Brindabella fly 3x daily to Newcastle and that they start next week a new daily (mon-Fri) service to Traralgon in the LaTrobe Valley.

 * I attach an aerial photo of the airport for your information. Unfortunately I can't help with the logo - we have a policy of not providing our logo externally.

 * Hope this is of assistance,

 * Alex Ananian-Cooper
 * Manager Aviation and Environment
 * Canberra International Airport

I'll upload the picture under the GFDL for the time being, but I would like guidance from others on the status of this image. --Jumbo 07:07, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

Jumbo, I think the bast tag to put on the photo would be CopyrightedFreeUse --nixie 04:28, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

 * Thank you, nixie. Bless you for that! This whole copyright business is a puzzle. I've modified the image accordingly. --Jumbo 04:51, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

 * That photo would definitely not be CopyrightedFreeUse (which is essentially the same as releasing it to the public domain) since the Airport has not agreed to allow the photo to be used for any purpose, including commercial redistribution and/or modification. The image should be tagged as Fair Use and moved from the Commons back to the English Wikipedia. Kaldari 22:30, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Remove canberra category
I've removed the Canberra category for this article as part of the effort to tidy up the Canberra/ACT categories]]. (See Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Canberra) It's felt that the Canberra category is too cluttered and that as it is a small jurisdiction, many of the articles relating to the City should probably sit under Category:Australian Capital Territory and its subcategories. If there is strong feeling that airports should contain the category that relates to the city they are in then perhaps this warrants some discussion, either here, on on the Canberra project talk page. Adz 07:22, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

=2006=

Merge Brand Depot
I have tagged the Brand Depot article to be merged with the Canberra Airport article at the Brand Depot page. I feel that the proposed development is not yet notable and does not warrant an article of its own. I think a mention here will suffice, at least until it is built, and possibly after the fact as well, depending on its notability when it is complete. -- Adz|talk 00:45, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Brand Depot
Brand Depot is independent of the Airport - probably best in my opinion to leave it separate, just as you would leave any other companies associated with the Airport separate. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Webfive (talk • contribs).
 * But as an individual article it may not pass wikipedia's requirements for notability and therefore be deleted all together. Wikipedia is not a venue for free advertising. --Martyman- (talk) 07:52, 14 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree. It's just going to be a shopping centre, and not a big one. It's notability comes from the fact that it is situated on airport land and is consequently not subject to normal planning measures. --Jumbo 05:22, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

=2007=

Managed by...
According to the CIA website, it is managed by Capital Airport Group Pty Limited. --Jumbo 20:59, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Changes by 59.167.40.48 on 21 June 2007
I have felt it necessary to undo some of 59.167.40.48's changes because they are unsupported. I would really like it if 59.167.40.48 (or anyone else, for that matter) could reinstate them with supporting evidence. At the moment, they are simply opinion. I will reproduce them here so that reinstating them is easy.

During peak hour, there are intense traffic jams both within the airport and along the access roads - Supporting evidence?

 - in this time commuters can spend up to 30 minutes. - Up to 30 minutes doing what?

''In a recent state election it was a minor issue - with the incumbent supporting the development. The challenger, David Madew, failed to convince the electorate that the development was inappropriate.'' - When is recent? Presumably NSW election? Whose judgement is it that it was a minor issue? Who is the incumbent? What relevance has this got to the subject "Location"?

The proposed housing estates - That one is a fact!

 * the most contentious, Tralee, is under the departure paths of the aircraft and some arrival paths.
 * vs
 * the least contentious, Tralee, is considered by the Canberra International Airport group to be under the departure paths of the aircraft and some arrival paths (despite the development being nearly 10 km from the runway and the planes several thousand feet above sea level).

Ouch! Both are opinion!! How does this one get resolved!!! BTW: There is no such thing as Canberra International Airport group. Canberra International Airport. Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd. Capital Airport Group. Capital Airport Group Pty Ltd. But no such thing as Canberra International Airport group.

My opinion is that "Accidents" should be a level2 heading, not level 3, and I have changed it accordingly.

I think the references are a bit messy. I've tried to tidy them up. Pdfpdf 12:42, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

More vandalism & propoganda
203.17.154.218 continues to undo others' edits and introduce errors of fact and make unsubstantiated claims.

I've placed information on that talk page, but have received no answer or acknowledgement, so now I've stopped being polite and I'm just reverting them. Pdfpdf 03:52, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

I just reverted another case of vandalism. The whole section on housing issues and the NSW transport ministry in the "Noise and curfews" paragraph had been removed by IP 220.237.192.15. De728631 (talk) 23:27, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

 * Interestingly, those IPs don't seem to trace to the airport operators, it's somewhere in South Australia. Host ge-0.bdr01-cbr.velocity.net.au & d220-237-192-15.mit800.act.optusnet.com.au. 220  of  Borg 03:12, 9 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Ignore the trace, the IP's are Canberra based, I'll bold them. ge-0.bdr01-cbr.velocity.net.au d220-237-192-15.mit800.act.optusnet.com.au, best way is too look at the hosts since trace records will only show SA (tracing in Australia is next to useless). Also this is an archived discussion. Bidgee (talk) 12:24, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

b737-476 incident
I have just read the Incident Report of the above indicent on the ATSB website (http://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2002/AAIR/aair200205179.aspx). The statement on the Canberra Airport page was inconsistent with the ATSB report, which I have corrected to reflect the ATSB report.

I note further that this is not an accident, but rather an "incident", as defined in the ATSB report. Hence, should this be moved to another heading "Incidents", or should it be deleted?

Also, while on this subject, it strikes me that this is an odd list of "accidents". There are two aviation accidents, one non-aviation accident and one incident (not an accident at all, by anyone's definition). If the level of accidents on airports are consistent with other airports of similar size, then it's likely that there are many more accidents than listed here, and hence this is an incomplete and somewhat arbitrary list.

Is there a policy on what is supposed to be done? I've looked at other Australian airport pages, and I can't find any listings of accidents! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.108.182.144 (talk • contribs) 01:49, July 19, 200 (UTC)

 * Good catch on the correction, and the heading of accidents regardless of an ATSB definition should stay. Most people understand the word, so as long as the content is written correctly it won't make a bit of a difference. As for the incompleteness of the list, if you have the time please feel free to add the information into the article. Perth_Airport gives a good overview of how such content should be written and referenced. If you cite sources from ATSB investigation reports, please use Template:ATSBLink for this purpose. Thewinchester (talk) 03:37, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Canberra airport caught censoring this article
According to http://wired.reddit.com/wikidgame?offset=225#top an IP address traced to Canberra Airport has been editing this article to "to hide accidents, traffic chaos plus a general shining astroturf." The evidence is aparently at: http://wikiscanner.virgil.gr/f.php?ip1=203.22.237.174&ip2=&ip3=&ip4= This isn't very cool behavior and would make the airport look really dumb if it was, say, confirmed and got into the Canberra Times. --Nick Dowling 08:58, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

=2008=

Recent accidents and incidents
There was a "Recent accidents and incidents" section, but I removed it because none of the incidents were recent. So, what is wanted and/or needed? Pdfpdf (talk) 06:42, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

 * The incidents are part of the history. Wikipedia should not be condentrating on the recent events, but should have an all of history approach.  So any significant events from any time in the past should be included here.  The article is not intended as a public relations tool for the airport.  So my opinion is that the section should not include the word "recent" in its title. Incidents where people died should be included as being important. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 01:59, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

 * You make a good point. However, this topic is covered inconsistently; e.g. Melbourne Airport mentions only one incident, Kingsford Smith International Airport doesn't mention any. Pdfpdf (talk) 02:55, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

 * I think that's an argument for improving the coverage of incidents at other airports rather than removing those at Canberra. Gimboid13 (talk) 05:15, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

 * Actually, I disagree - it's not an argument one way or the other. It's just an observation that coverage is inconsistent, and addressing the use of the word "recent" in the title. Pdfpdf (talk) 09:25, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

 * Despite the fact that there must be dozens of incidents, very few seem to have found their way onto WP pages about airports. This issue must have been discussed before somewhere. (e.g. WikiProject Aviation/Aviation accident task force??). I've posted a question at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Aviation/Aviation accident task force. Pdfpdf (talk) 09:25, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

 * And, very quickly, I got a reply:

Accidents and incidents for Airport project
The Airports project has just agreed a form of words for the inclusion of accidents or incidents in airport articles. Thought it may be of interest -

 * Accidents or incidents should only be included if:
 * The accident was fatal to either the aircraft occupants or persons on the ground.
 * The accident involved hull loss or serious damage to the aircraft or airport.
 * The accident invoked a change in procedures, regulations or process that had a wide effect on other airports or airlines or the aircraft industry.

MilborneOne (talk) 17:20, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Incidents at Airports
I've noticed that the reporting of incidents on WP pages for airports is very inconsistent. Are there any guidelines? Where can I find them? Thanks, Pdfpdf (talk) 09:18, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
 * If you look a couple of lines above, the criteria for airport articles is listed. Also appears at WikiProject Airports. MilborneOne (talk) 10:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Pdfpdf (talk) 08:29, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Proposed services
A number of people have removed this section, without explanation, except "Wiki ian" who said "remove unverified information". As the information has been there less than a month (in one case, 2 days) and was flagged with "citation needed", I believe "Wiki ian" is being a bit too quick off the mark. What do other people think? Pdfpdf (talk) 06:42, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I would say keep it there unless there is some reason to think it is incorrect. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 02:01, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Destinations Table
Pdfpdf has raised some concerns about the Destinations Table. Firstly, in regards to examples of the table in use; Singapore Changi Airport, Melbourne Airport and Brisbane Airport to just name a few. In regards to why, well, it makes a lot more sense at multi-terminal airports, like those linked, as you choose whether to sort by terminal, or airline, or destinations. But even for CBR, it does have an aestetic and organisational advantage over plain flat destinations, as well as alphabetic sorting of airlines. So, after addressing Pdfpdf's concerns, I shall restore the table. Mvjs (talk) 14:01, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

 * Mmmm. I'm unconvinced that the table adds any value for Canberra. Largely, for a one terminal airport like Canberra, it just looks stupid.
 * Regarding sortability, there's no terminal number variation to sort by, the table is already in sort by airline, and you can't sort by destination for two reasons: 1) you've switched off sort on that column, and 2) the data in that column is not in a useful format to sort.
 * But even for CBR, it does have an aestetic and organisational advantage over plain flat destinations, as well as alphabetic sorting of airlines. - I have no idea what you are talking about:
 * aesthetic - Yeah, OK, the table looks a bit prettier.
 * organisational - There's nothing to organise!
 * alphabetic - It's already alphabetic!
 * So, after addressing Pdfpdf's concerns, - Pardon? You haven't addressed any of my concerns. Pdfpdf (talk) 14:57, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

 * I don't mind Mvjs' table but Pdfpdf's table was good also however I didn't like the aesthetics of it. I also agree about the Terminal being useless since there is only 1. Bidgee (talk) 15:08, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

 * For the record, I didn't like the asthetics of my table either; I was referring to Mvjs' table vs the text that was originally there. Pdfpdf (talk) 15:20, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Changing subject - Can we delete that third column please? Pdfpdf (talk) 15:20, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Again for the record, I didn't create the table. It was created by http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Canberra_International_Airport&diff=211426456&oldid=209995672
 * I agree that the terminals column should be removed. Mvjs (talk) 23:00, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was withdrawn. JPG-GR (talk) 00:34, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Canberra International Airport → Canberra Airport — The airport is known as Canberra Airport on it's website, Government, media and the Airport itself (the building). The Airport also has no direct international flights —Bidgee (talk) 14:38, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Survey

 * Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with  or  , then sign your comment with  . Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's naming conventions.

 * Support - The airport is known as Canberra Airport on it's website, Government, media and the Airport itself (the building). The Airport also has no direct international flights —Bidgee (talk) 14:38, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose - After new facts have come to light (See Discussion4 at the bottom of the talk page) I now oppose the move. Bidgee (talk) 06:28, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Oppose - I have to disagree with you on the fact that the airport identifies itself as "Canberra Airport". The website, as well as the logo states "Canberra International Airport". Mvjs (talk) 21:53, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - At the time of adding the request the old site had Canberra Airport. Issue now is that it classes itself as a International Airport but has no International flights and the media class it as Canberra Airport. Bidgee (talk) 21:33, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - I think on the rationale that the website is Canberra International Airport as well as all the branding (I haven't been to CBR for a while but last time I was there the parking tickets had Canberra International Airport on them) we should honour that in the title of the article. Although it may be colloquial to simply call it Canberra Airport and even though there are no international flights, the airport's name is Canberra International Airport. It is common practice at a lot of airports to call themselves international when there are no international flights. (a great irony is Melbourne International Airport is a domestic airport in Florida, whilst Melbourne Airport is the international airport in Melbourne. Mvjs (talk) 21:53, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - Last time I was at Canberra Airport was in December 2007. The Airport itself had Canberra Airport but I'm unsure about the tickets for parking. Bidgee (talk) 21:58, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - The airport building is "labelled" "Canberra Airport" (refer Image:Canberra Airport.jpg), but I'm not sure what that means. Pdfpdf (talk) 15:23, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Oppose - Contrary to my personal opinion that the name "Canberra International Airport" is both pretentious and undeserved, I'm afraid I must oppose the move because, quite simply, that is the "official" name of the airport. Like Mvjs "I have to disagree with you on the fact that the airport identifies itself as "Canberra Airport".". Pdfpdf (talk) 12:23, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * There is a stack of easy-to-find evidence:
 * The airport logo says "Canberra International Airport"
 * Look at any (every?) page on their website http://www.canberraairport.com.au/. At the top each page has the logo and the words "Canberra International Airport". At the bottom it says "Copyright Canberra International Airport"
 * Look at any issue of their newsletter "The Hub" http://www.canberraairport.com.au/ne_hu.htm
 * Similarly http://www.brindabellabusinesspark.com.au/
 * Etc.
 * Yes, it's interesting that the building is labelled "Canberra Airport" (Image:Canberra Airport.jpg), but so what?
 * Pdfpdf (talk) 12:23, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - Thanks Soredwa, I wasn't distinguishing between the name of the airport (which I don't know), the name of the company that owns the lease (Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd), and the name of the company that operates the airport (Capital Airport Group Pty Ltd). As you imply, the "stack of easy-to-find evidence" is about the lease owner, not about the name of the airport. Pdfpdf (talk) 15:23, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

It is Canberra Airport operated by Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd.--Soredewa (talk) 13:44, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Support - The name on the CASA site is C013 Canberra Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd 19/05/05
 * Comment - Found another federal site referring it as Canberra International Airport. Aerodrome name could be different from an airport incorporating it. But I maintain Support for simplicity and majority. -- Soredewa (talk) 12:55, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Abstain - I surrender with my own evidence shown in Discussion4. I cannot argue strongly enough that the article should be, or should have been "Canberra Airport". I turn to "Abstain." --Soredewa (talk) 04:13, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Oppose - I think if they self-identify as "Canberra International Airport" then the article should be named "Canberra International Airport" with a redirect from "Canberra Airport". Arguments for using something but which the airport itself uses, which is prominent throughout their website on press releases and other documents, doesn't make a great deal of sense to me. If the airport is often called "Canberra Airport" then lets make that clear in the article but let's not rename the airport. Sarah 04:27, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Oppose - as per Sarah and others below. I find myself agreeing with much of what those who support the change are saying, but there is more than enough justification to leave the article name alone. Pdfpdf (talk) 06:25, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Discussion1

 * Comment - Thanks Soredwa, I wasn't distinguishing between the name of the airport (which I don't know), the name of the company that owns the lease (Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd), and the name of the company that operates the airport (Capital Airport Group Pty Ltd). As you imply, the "stack of easy-to-find evidence" is about the lease owner, not about the name of the airport. Pdfpdf (talk) 15:23, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - I don't see where the ambiguity is coming from here. Mvjs (talk) 22:45, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment Bureau of Meteorology uses Canberra Airport. Bidgee (talk) 22:50, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * With respect, that's why we're discussing the matter. So far we have:
 * Bidgee (Support) - It's "Canberra Airport".
 * Mvjs (Oppose) - It's "Canberra International Airport".
 * Soredewa (Support) - The company that leases the land is "Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd". Other sources suggest the name of the airport is "Canberra Airport".
 * Pdfpdf (Don't know) - Yes, the name of the company that leases the land is "Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd". and they refer to it as "Canberra International Airport". But I haven't seen anyone else refer to it as "Canberra International Airport", and there are a number of other examples of it being referred to as "Canberra Airport", not the least of which is Australia Post. (And CIA P/L themselves "acknowledge" this on their own contact details page.)
 * Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * The logo clearly says "Canberra International Airport". Mvjs (talk) 22:45, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes. So what? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * In the same vein, the sign on the wall of the airport clearly says "Canberra Airport". This is the exact opposite. But again, so what? Neither are "proof" of the name of the airport. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:14, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * The title of the webpage as well as the top banner clearly reads "Canberra International Airport". The bottom of the webpage reads "Copyright Canberra International Airport". Have a look further up this page, in an email from the airport, the signature clearly reads "Canberra International Airport". Mvjs (talk) 22:45, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes. So what? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * In terms of the CASA register, that lists SYD as "Sydney (Kingsford Smith) INTL" while, as it was determined on the SYD talk page, the name of the airport is simply "Sydney Airport". Mvjs (talk) 22:45, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes. So what? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * While CASA might give up some aerodrome-catalogue name, the official name of the airport shouldn't be determined from that list. Mvjs (talk) 22:45, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't that rather depend on what it actually is a list of? For example, (and I'm not saying that this is the case), if the list was a list of official airport names, then it would indeed be an appropriate list from which to get the name. (If.) It would seem to me that the crux of the matter is that we don't have a list of "Official Names", and some of "us" are trying to infer the "official" name from a variety of sources that, themselves, are not purporting to be such a source. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * What exactly are you looking for here? Mvjs (talk) 22:45, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Good question! To whom are you addressing it? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Discussion 1b

 * In the light of Discussion2 below, I'm going to follow Mvjs's lead and also ask: "What exactly are we looking for here?"
 * The proposal is to change the article name from Canberra International Airport (CIA) to "Canberra Airport" (CA).
 * This begs the questions: "Why?" and "Why not?"
 * There are lots of answers to both of these questions. But once we have those answers, where does that leave us? For example, you could look at all the answers and say: "So what?".
 * It would seem to me that we need a better question which would give us a more useful answer.
 * As a first pass, I suggest we try to answer the question: "What exactly are we looking for here?".
 * (Or perhaps it's easier to start with: "What are we NOT looking for?"?)
 * If you think this is a useful way to attack the problem, please add to the following list, and/or discuss what's on the list.
 * Note that words in the list in quotes are, at this stage, not defined. They will need to be defined before we pursue their use. Pdfpdf (talk) 18:02, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * What exactly are we looking for here?
 * 1) The "best" name for the page.
 * 2) The "official" name of the airport.
 * 3) The "popular" name of the airport.
 * 4) The "most widely used" name of the airport.
 * 5) The "most accurate" name of the airport.
 * 6) etc.

 * Just to let you know my thoughts.
 * What exactly are we looking for here?
 * The "best" name for the page. - Canberra Airport would be best but the issue is should we use a official name. Jard one to pick.
 * The "official" name of the airport. - Issue here is we have on conflicting names on the official site.
 * The "popular" name of the airport. - Media uses Canberra Airport however some businesses (Rental cars, Brand Depot ect) use Canberra International Airport
 * The "most widely used" name of the airport. - I would say almost 50/50
 * The "most accurate" name of the airport. - I would say Canberra Airport since it's got no International flights. Bidgee (talk) 21:42, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

It's pretty obvious that official name of the airport by the company is Canberra International Airport. I don't think any one can reasonably argue that the company call the airport officially Canberra Airport, any references to the airport as simply Canberra Airport on the website is a lazy writer. Just take a look at the website - what's in the banner at the top, what's in the title? The official name of the airport is Canberra International Airport - where convenient, that name is used. Maybe there wasn't enough plastic in the factory to carve out the word international for the sign. But it is clear at an easy glance that the name the company has given the airport is Canberra International Airport. I feel that it's more of a question of are we going to use the name that the company has named the airport or are we going to say, "Stuff the official name, some other organisations are lazy and call it Canberra Airport so let's use that." Here's an example of one page that lists both names. - Canberra Airport in the headline but Canberra International Airport in the article. In terms of most accurate, the airport has operated international flights in the past and there's no reason why they wont resume in the future. Would we then go and rename the article Canberra International Airport when those flights resume? Mvjs (talk) 00:21, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
 * In terms of common use, here's some example of the airport being called "Canberra International Airport".   Mvjs (talk) 00:26, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Additionally, the airport is listed in the White Pages as Canberra International Airport. I'm not going to try and link to it as the URL is a sham. Mvjs (talk) 01:40, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Discussion2

 * Comment Google News: Canberra Airport Google News: Canberra International Airport Bidgee (talk) 23:03, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry Bidgee, what's your point here? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

''The majority of what "Discussion2" originally contained is irrelevant to the topic. The full discussion up to this point has been archived at Talk:Canberra International Airport/Archive. What remains above is the relevant bit.''

 * Try this again. If you still don't understand please say so.
 * The Bureau of Meteorology uses Canberra Airport for it's recording station and not Canberra International Airport as a name. Using Google News to search for news sites that use Google News: Canberra Airport (A few news outlets use Canberra Airport within their articles such as the Canberra Times) or Google News: Canberra International Airport however no stories where found with Canberra International Airport in any articles by news outlets. Bidgee (talk) 16:59, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Now I'm confused by this which is on CIA(Canberra International Airport) which does have the CIA logo but also say Canberra Airport on the page . Bidgee (talk) 17:09, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * So, if I understand you correctly, you're saying that there are plenty of easy-to-find examples of the place being called "Canberra Airport" (CA), but (with the exception of material produced by Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd - CIA P/L), it's very hard to find anything that calls the place "Canberra International Airport" (CIA).
 * Some examples of the use of "Canberra Airport" are:
 * Australia Post (e.g. "CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609")
 * Bureau of Meteorology
 * The sign on the airport building
 * The CASA register
 * Numerous newspaper articles
 * Various parts of the CIA P/L website
 * Yes? Pdfpdf (talk) 17:29, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Yes to those above but there are a few sites that do use CIA ALP (Uses both CA and CIA). Also another link from the BoM (Bureau of Meteorology) that has "CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609" and the ABC NEWS uses Canberra Airport Bidgee (talk) 17:38, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * OK. So where do we go from here? Pdfpdf (talk) 18:05, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Discussion3

 * Comment - http://www.canberraairport.com.au/contact.htm says Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd's address is:
 * Canberra International Airport
 * 1/2 Brindabella Circuit
 * CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609
 * I think this means that Australia Post thinks the land on which the airport is located is in an area named "Canberra Airport". However, that doesn't necessarily say anything about the airport's name ...
 * Pdfpdf (talk) 15:23, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * You would find that Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd is usings it's company's name (Minus Pty Ltd) for the postal address and website. Bidgee (talk) 22:53, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, but what about Australia Post usage? (I think you missed my point about the suburb name. And also my point that, even if that's what Australia Post call the land, it's still not necessarily the "official" name of the airport.) Pdfpdf (talk) 12:19, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * It's not a suburb name! I've seen many times before that AustPost use a building's name rather then a suburb. Bidgee (talk) 12:23, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Pardon? "CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609" is not a suburb name? Well then, what is it? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:34, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * 2609 is used by Fyshwick, Majura, Piallio, Symonston. 12:41, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Perhaps so, but you didn't answer my question as to why "CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609" is not a suburb name. Nor did you tell me what it is. Pdfpdf (talk) 13:25, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * "I've seen many times before that AustPost use a building's name rather then a suburb." - Really? Could you be a little more explicit and give some examples? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:34, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Parliament House, ACT 2600 is a building not a suburb but that how the mail is sent there. Bidgee (talk) 12:41, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I guess so. Although not a building, "University of Adelaide, SA 5005" is not a suburb either. Perhaps it is a "Postal Area"?
 * You've just answered your own question. Bidgee (talk) 13:38, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Pdfpdf (talk) 14:08, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Anyway, we digress. How is this helping us determine the "official" name of the airport? Pdfpdf (talk) 13:25, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Comment Australia Post now lists the postcode 2609 as Canberra International Airport. Additionally, the lack of international flights does not necessarily determine whether an airport is international or not, but rather it is more often the existence of customs and/or immigration facilities at the airport which determines whether an airport is international. CBR has these facilities and as such it is an international airport. As to the name, leave it as Canberra International Airport with the redirect of Canberra Airport to point to this article. --Россавиа Диалог 04:18, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Discussion4

 * Comment ... Additionally, the lack of international flights does not necessarily determine whether an airport is international or not, but rather it is more often the existence of customs and/or immigration facilities at the airport which determines whether an airport is international. CBR has these facilities and as such it is an international airport. ... --Россавиа Диалог 04:18, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

 * I don't know if CIA has customs or immigration. Some links/sources could be handy if you have any as it could go into the article. Something of interest http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/aviation/international/icao/desig_airports.aspx . Bidgee (talk) 04:26, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Yes, it is interesting. (Isn't it? Or do I just need to "get a life"?) Pdfpdf (talk) 06:13, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
 * The definitions of the terms used can be found at http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/aviation/international/icao/index.aspx Pdfpdf (talk) 06:13, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
 * In particular: "The categories of airports are:
 * Major International
 * airports of entry and departure where all formalities incident to Customs, Immigration, Health and similar procedures are carried out, and which are open to scheduled and non-scheduled flights;
 * Restricted Use International
 * airports of entry and departure at which the formalities incident to Customs, Immigration, Health and similar procedures are made available on a restricted basis, to flights with prior approval only;
 * Alternate International
 * airports specified in the flight plan to which a flight may proceed when it becomes inadvisable to land at the airport of intended landing;"
 * (The quoted table classifies Canberra as "Restricted Use International" and "Alternate International".)
 * Pdfpdf (talk) 06:13, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Interesting. Some thing else that now could be added to the article to explain why it has International status. Bidgee (talk) 06:25, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Agreed. Are you offering? ;-) Pdfpdf (talk)
 * Added. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:30, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

Discussion5

 * I am afraid that it is a bit off-topic: whether an airport is international (de jure or de facto) is irrelevant to the main argument: "Which name is appropriate as the name of this article?"
 * Many Australian airports which handle scheduled flights do not call themselves international.
 * On the other hand, there is a clear statement "The Hobart International Airport is operated by Hobart International Airport Pty Ltd (HIAPL). " HBA official website
 * On the CIA P/L website, the "phrase" "Canberra International Airport" appears almost always in the way readers cannot distinguish CBR (airport) from CIA P/L. In fact, the website looks like trying to mislead readers the airport name is "Canberra International Airport" without claiming that it is, or should be called so. --Soredewa (talk) 04:11, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Uh huh. But I'm not sure what your point is?
 * Agreed that the main argument should be: "Which name is appropriate as the name of this article?"
 * You seem to be saying: "The CIA website doesn't make it clear what the airport's name is." Is that correct?
 * If so, that doesn't seem to have much relevance to: "Which name is appropriate as the name of this article?". Does it?
 * (Yes, I'm confused.) Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 05:47, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

 * My concern is that Discussion4 could have been a off-topic.
 * I wished people rather continue Discussion4 using my input than separated as Discussion5.
 * "The CIA website" could be misleading. It is the "CIA P/L" website.
 * Who has the true authority to name the airport?
 * The name by it would be the "official / formal" name. But it does not necessarily assume the article name.
 * In 1998 when I skydived from CBR, the driver of the pick-up van of the skydiving operator said "now we are arriving at Canberra International Airport."
 * I don't think her tongue was controlled by the airport operator. --Soredewa (talk) 05:18, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Discussion4 explains somewhat on why it has International status which means the article should stay how is. I don't agree with it however the source in Discussion4 and the owner of the airport (CIA) over rides my thoughts Bidgee (talk) 06:14, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Soredewa: I'm still confused by what you're saying; it doesn't seem to have much relevance to: "Which name is appropriate as the name of this article?".
 * I agree with Bidgee that Discussion4 was about the International status. It's just that I don't see how Discussion5 is related to Discussion4. (I'm not saying that it isn't; I'm just saying I don't see the relationship.)
 * You say: "My concern is that Discussion4 could have been a off-topic." - I would prefer to classify Discussion4 as being about a related topic, rather than "off-topic"
 * Then you follow with: "I wished people rather continue Discussion4 using my input than separated as Discussion5." - I'm afraid I don't understand. Which input are you refering to? Your input which is now at the start of Discussion5? If so, well, it seems like a different topic to me. (i.e. I don't think you have very much interest at all in whether Canberra has international status. I think your interest is on what the name of the article should be. i.e. a different topic. Please correct me if I'm wrong.)
 * Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 07:05, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Sorry, my inputs are to follow Discussion3 rather than Discussion4, somewhat contrary to Россавиа. --Soredewa (talk) 04:09, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Stocktake
The "Survey" section above now says:
 * Oppose - Bidee
 * Oppose - Mvjs
 * Support - Soredewa
 * Oppose - Sarah
 * Oppose - Pdfpdf
 * Abstain - Soredewa

That looks pretty close to consensus to me ... Pdfpdf (talk) 07:17, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

 * I concur. Sounds like a consensus to me. Mvjs (talk) 07:27, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

 * I surrender with my own evidence shown in Discussion4. I cannot argue strongly enough that the article should be, or should have been "Canberra Airport". I turn to "Abstain." --Soredewa (talk) 04:13, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

 * Well, it would seem that now we do have consensus. What happens next? Pdfpdf (talk) 06:51, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Post Script comments
"Canberra International Airport" have release the 10th Anniversary issue of their publication "The Hub". I'm amused to see that they refer to the place as "Canberra Airport" ... Ho hum. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:53, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Access
The website claims that there are ACTION services from the airport itself to the city. This isn't quite correct as the only bus company to run buses from the airport to the city is Deanes. If you look at the ACTION website and click the link for airport it will direct you to the Deanes website (a competing bus company). There are bus services which run close (eg Brindabella business park) but none I (or ACTION) would call services to the airport. What are peoples thoughts on cleaning up this section?Harvyk (talk) 04:06, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

 * The problem(s) seem(s) to have been introduced by this edit which occurred on 18 July 2008. Pdfpdf (talk) 17:10, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

 * So is that a vote to change it? Harvyk (talk • contribs) 00:57, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

 * Oh dear me - and I complain when people don't answer my questions! Sorry!!
 * Yes, that is indeed a vote to change it.
 * It is still possible to simply revert the abovementioned edit - that would be the simplest/quickest solution, but I convinced myself that it might not be the best solution. However, I also concluded that the best solution looked like a lot of work, so I went to bed (and forgot about it).
 * Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 04:46, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

 * I just shoved my finger in the pie. (Or is the metaphor "thumb"?) Feel free to modify it if it grates with your view of the situation. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 12:41, 20 August 2008 (UTC

=2009=

Diverted flights
I've just removed this statement from the article's lead: In addition to regular traffic, the airport handles diverted traffic from Melbourne (Tullamarine) and Sydney (Kingsford Smith) Airports when weather conditions restrict landings there. This is routine for all airports, and is particularly unnotable for Canberra airport as the large distances between Canberra and Sydney and Melbourne and the unavailability of fast alternate transportation mean that passengers on the diverted flights have to wait until they can fly out of Canberra to their destination: Canberra airport is in now way an alternate for Sydney or Melbourne airports. Nick-D (talk) 11:06, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

Curfew 4 Canberra
Under Noise, noise sharing and curfews, the last paragraph for Curfew 4 Canberra reads in a very similar nature to one of their pamphlets, especially the words "and the impact this will have on the quality of life for all residents of the Canberra region". Now as a Canberra resident I feel the exact opposite, I feel that a curfew would in fact negatively impact my life. Could someone please fix this section up otherwise I'll be removing it as blatant propaganda. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.167.251.161 (talk) 06:03, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

 * "Could someone please fix this section up otherwise I'll be removing it as blatant propaganda."
 * I have sympathy for your point-of-view, but there is nothing "wrong" with that paragraph - it states, with a supporting reference, the platform of "Curfew 4 Canberra". Of course it's their point of, but never-the-less, it is a statement of fact, the fact being that this is their platform / point of view.
 * It is not purporting to be the view of everyone in Canberra.
 * What would you want it changed to?
 * P.S. Please sign your contributions - it also puts a timestamp. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 10:01, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Change of Name
I'm a newbie here, but Canberre Airport changed its name some time last year to drop the "international" component. See their website and all the aricles and press. I've even checked the asic register and it's changed. Perhaps suggest that a more experienced user change the page tilte too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.78.240.201 (talk) 21:40, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

 * Sounds like a good idea, but you can see there was a big discussion on this above, so I think we need to have a bit more consensus before moving it again. I can confirm that the company web site has no "international" on it now. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 22:48, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

 * I agree, but even more than consensus, we need reliable quotable supporting evidence.
 * Experience has shown that the Canberra Airport website is NOT a reliable source on this matter.
 * Also, as discussed above at length, there is:
 * "the "official" name;
 * "the name(s) the public calls it";
 * "the name(s) Canberra International Airport Pty Ltd call it";
 * "the name(s) on the Canberra Airport website";
 * etc
 * What is the "official" name? --Pdfpdf (talk) 01:24, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

 * How does one check the ASIC register?
 * On what date did this change occur?
 * When there is some reliable supporting evidence, then the page name change can proceed. --Pdfpdf (talk) 01:24, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

=2010=

Aviation weather links
Canadian and American airports generally contain a link to an aviation weather source in their external link section. Why should airports in this country be different?DSatYVR (talk) 22:21, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

high speed rail
just because people talk about it doesn't mean it's encyclopaedic. people have spoken about recently a high speed rail link between Beijing and Europe, does that mean it gets a mention in the Beijing article? there are nowhere any concrete plans to build high speed rail to Canberra. it's just something we would like, but is unlikely to happen in next 30 years. LibStar (talk) 12:11, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * the cited source is also a dead link. 210.56.73.99 (talk) 12:15, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * I have toned down the expectation of it, and made it more NPOV in terms of it is being considered along with other airports. LibStar (talk) 12:26, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * I think you did a very good job there. The section is MUCH better with your contribution. Thank you. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:33, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * thanks, to someone not familiar they would think it was a certainty. LibStar (talk) 12:35, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Fair comment. All the more reason why your contribution is valuable. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:40, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Minor problem:
 * ... however it was the most expensive project considered ...
 * ... this option ... would be the cheapest and quickest to implement. ...

That sounds contradictory to me. Am I missing something? Pdfpdf (talk) 12:47, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * because the latter text was from a questionable source that is now a dead link. I've removed that text. the Sydney Morning Herald, is far more reliable. LibStar (talk) 12:51, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Far more informative, too. Pdfpdf (talk) 13:15, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Name change (Canberra Airport)
The website has changed over to using "Canberra Airport". Is this enough to warrant changing the page name? News reports all seem to use "Canberra Airport" as well.

Qantas refers to it as both "Canberra Domestic Airport" and "Canberra Airport"

Also, has there ever been any international flights? Does it have the required facilities (customs, quarantine etc)?

--RobBrisbane (talk) 21:39, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

 * There was once an international flight to New Zealand. Also the Prime Minister's jet often leaves from Canberra so there are international flights.  Customs travel out from Civic on request to do the paperwork. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 08:01, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

 * a) Look at Talk:Canberra International Airport and Talk:Canberra International Airport.  Also of possible interest are Talk:Canberra International Airport and Talk:Canberra International Airport
 * b) Yes, there was once a sheduled service to Fiji. (Probably the same flight stopped in New Zealand.)
 * c) No, it doesn't have the required facilities on-site. (Customs travel out from Civic on request to do the paperwork.)
 * d) What used to be called RAAF Base Fairbairn is on the opposite side of the runway. The PM's jet leaves from there - not from Canberra Airport. Similarly, foreign heads of state and other official VIPs fly in and out of whatever RAAF Base Fairbairn is now called - not Canberra Airport.
 * Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 14:01, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

 * When I said New Zealand, it was one flight to take a rugby team from Canberra. Which I mentioned half in jest.  However one issue to sort out is exactly what is Canberra airport, if you are excluding the other side.  I would have counted that as part of the airport too. I suspect that the other side of the airport facilities pay rent. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 21:07, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

 * When I said New Zealand, it was one flight to take a rugby team from Canberra. Which I mentioned half in jest. - I see. I thought you were talking about a regular service. Mea Culpa.
 * Yeah. Well, for a period of time (I don't know when), there was a regular scheduled service to somewhere in the Pacific (I'm not sure where, but I think it was Fiji), and this was why Mr Snow's cohorts were able to feel justified in registering the company name and naming the airport accordingly.
 * I suspect it has been an embarassment to them that they have not been an "International Airport" for some years, and hence their change of letterhead, signs and references on their website.
 * However, none of that addresses the question of "What is the 'Official' name of the Airport?", nor the predecessor question, "What does 'Official' mean?". Pdfpdf (talk) 12:46, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

 * Now you raise an equally important question: "Exactly, what is Canberra airport?" Isn't "What does 'Official' mean?" already a big enough can-of-worms for you? ;-)
 * I would have counted that as part of the airport too. - I sincerely doubt the answer is that simple.
 * I suspect that the other side of the airport facilities pay rent. - Yes. The Fairbairn, Canberra page either states or implies that. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:46, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

No passenger pickup
The airport seems to be against passenger pickup:

"Private vehicles are not permitted to pick-up passengers at the road kerb immediately outside the terminal. Vehicles may not park or 'stand' for extended periods while awaiting arriving passengers, or while carrying out any other function. Like unattended luggage, idle vehicles within close proximity to the terminal represent a potential security threat."

--RobBrisbane (talk) 21:39, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

=2011=

=2012=

External links modified
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Qatar Air
We can't add an entry to the airlines and destinations section until an exact start date is found see WP AIRPORT content for guidelines. The reference says that they are looking at serving Canberra along with 8 other cities in either 2017 or 2018.CHCBOY (talk) 20:31, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

=2017=

Marriage Equality
The following two sentences were removed:

''Canberra Airport supports Marriage Equality,[55] with the airport lit up in rainbow colors prior to the 2015[56] and 2017[57] parliamentary sittings. The airport is linked to the lobby group, Australians for Equality.[55][58]'' with the justification that, "a marriage equality section in an airport article is absurd"

Canberra Airport's involvement with Marriage Equality is substantial. Since 2015, it continues to make its position on this, very clear. The airport uses rainbow lighting, plus electronic and 3D message boards, as a message to incoming national parliamentarians prior to national debates on Marriage Equality. Canberra Airport was intimately involved with the establishment of the lobby group 'Australians for Equality', headed by the successful by Irish marriage campaigner Tiernan Brady. Airports are not just 'physical infrastructure', they are a vital component of the nation's social fabric. To say it is "absurd" to link an airport with equality, is no doubt a view Canberra Airport is working to overcome. Recommend reinstate the sentences. B20097 (talk) 10:14, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

 * This is ridiculous: what other major airport article in the world has a big section about their owner's involvement with political issues? You being extremely passionate about a subject does not make it relevant to every single topic that has ever tangentially come into contact with it. The Drover's Wife (talk) 10:29, 2 April 2017 (UTC)
 * If there are enough independent reliable sources to establish notability of the airport's involvement then it can be mentioned, however most links you've provided there are primary. Can you provide evidence of in-depth secondary sources for the topic? -- Whats new?(talk) 23:16, 2 April 2017 (UTC)
 * The two sentences removed were supported by 3 secondary source citations: [55],  [56], [57] and one (non-critical and dispensable) primary source citation: [58].  There are dozens of independent, in-depth, secondary, reliable sources available for this topic : Search > "Canberra Airport" rainbow.  B20097 (talk) 09:55, 3 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Agree with The Drover's Wife, article is about an airport, not marriage equality rights. The causes or campaigns an owner choses to support are of no relevance to the article. Laliglu (talk) 05:35, 4 April 2017 (UTC)
 * It would be undue to include it as there are other advertisers at the airport with long running ppromotions that should also be left out. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 11:00, 4 April 2017 (UTC)
 * @User:Graeme Bartlett: What advertisers are those? Were their advertisements reported by major news sources? Did they involve an elaborate multi-color lighting scheme? Were they ordered by the airport's general manager? This seems rather different. @User:Laliglu: that would likely be true if the owner didn't choose to make extremely conspicuous public statements about those causes at his own airport. @User:The Drover&: what "big section" are you referring to? The section you removed contained 32 words. On my browser, that renders just over one line. I realize that "big" is often subjective, but really? Thirty-two words?
 * I wonder if anyone who favors excluding the contested content actually read the ABC news article linked above (and linked again here for convenience). The Sydney Morning Herald covered it in similar detail, so we have multiple major news sources covering it. B20097 also linked a secondary source showing sustained secondary-source coverage, this time two years later and at a site dealing with airport passenger terminals, which indicates specialized as well as general interest. It looks noteworthy to me. Rivertorch   FIRE WATER   05:01, 5 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Actually it is interesting that the canberra airport does not comply with ACT legislation in repect to billboards. eg https://www.canberraairport.com.au/corporate/business-services/advertising/ . I will also make the point that "Marriage Equality" is not a neutral term, and is biased to make a point. The neutral term is "Same-sex marriage". Graeme Bartlett (talk) 05:59, 5 April 2017 (UTC)
 * I see no reason it can't be briefly mentioned given multiple RS exist, and it is not given undue weight in the article. The term 'marriage equality' is arguably more commonly used in Australia than same-sex marriage in recent times. -- Whats new?(talk) 06:06, 5 April 2017 (UTC)
 * @User:Graeme Bartlett: I accept that "same-sex marriage" is standard Wikipedia terminology, but I assure you it is far from neutral. In any event, I believe the exact wording isn't at issue here; the exclusion of noteworthy, reliably sourced content is. Rivertorch   FIRE WATER   07:22, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Statistics > Projections made in 2003 for Total passengers and aircraft movements
The Total passengers and aircraft movements projections were based on a 2005 Primary Source, Master Plan. Comparing with actual movements, some of these Airport-provided-projections are obviously 100%+ wrong. While there are later PS projections, available suggest drop these projections altogether, or at least use any BITRE projections. 110.147.145.160 (talk) 02:59, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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Canberra Airport or Canberra International Airport
There are subsubsection International flights, but the title is only Canberra Airport, I think must be Canberra International Airport.Gsarwa (talk) 19:50, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
 * There are plenty of airports with international service but don't have international in their name. Andrewgprout (talk) 20:59, 26 August 2019 (UTC)

Possible source
Does this source of 7 May 2003 relate to this page, or the RAAF Fairbairn one? 🤔

''"Work on a massive aircraft hangar at an RAAF base in Canberra has been suspended after the structure collapsed. The accident happened just before 12:00pm AEST, injuring 12 construction workers." The $11 million hangar is a joint project between the Defence Department and the Capital Airport Group." @ https://www.abc.net.au/news/2003-05-07/hangar-work-suspended-after-collapse/1850180

--220  of  Borg 06:42, 14 February 2020 (UTC)

 * Seems to be RAAF Fairbairn? The Drover's Wife (talk) 10:51, 14 February 2020 (UTC)

Accidents and Incidents
Noting the previous discussion of accidents and incidents that dates back to 2008, i'd like to seek some consensus on the inclusion of the Link Airways/Virgin Australia flight 633 incident where a propellor strap was left attached and punctured the fuselage on take off in November 2022. The damage to the aircraft was minor and I can see that the ATSB's investigation is still ongoing so not sure what the impact will be on procedures across the industry just yet, however its interesting that the airline denied any injuries, but the ATSB/AFP have stated 3 minor injuries. And its also just a very strange occurrence, not only that a strap was left in place, but that it stayed secure during taxi and only hit the aircraft while on the take off roll! Are there any objections to including this one in the article, or would you prefer we wait? Dfadden (talk) 05:48, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Given it's a serious enough incident to have led to an ATSB investigation, it should be included. Nick-D (talk) 06:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
 * In the absence of any objections, I've included the incident per WP:BOLD, but happy for a discussion should anyone consider it not worthy for inclusion! Dfadden (talk) 12:48, 22 February 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Canberra Airport


text:
C. F. Varley

Cromwell Fleetwood Varley, FRSA (6 April 1828 – 2 September 1883) was an English engineer, particularly associated with the development of the electric telegraph and the transatlantic telegraph cable. He also took interest in the claims of parapsychology and spiritualism.

Family
Born in Kentish Town, London, Cromwell Fleetwood Varley was the second of ten children. His father was Cornelius Varley, an active member of the Society of Arts (now the Royal Society of Arts), best known for his scientific research. His mother was the former Elizabeth Livermore Straker. C.F. Varley's brothers, Samuel Alfred Varley and Frederick Henry Varley, were also improvers and inventors in connection with telegraphy. The family believed themselves the descendants of Oliver Cromwell and General Charles Fleetwood, hence his given names. The family were Sandemanians, part of the same congregation as Michael Faraday, but Varley did not continue his association with the sect into adult life. A first cousin was the microscopist Andrew Pritchard.

Telegraph engineer
Varley joined the newly founded Electric Telegraph Company in 1846, becoming chief engineer for the London area by 1852 and for the entire company by 1861. He devised many techniques and instruments for fault-finding and for improving the performance of the telegraph. In 1870, he patented the cymaphen, a kind of telegraph that could transmit speech. The first transatlantic telegraph cable failed in 1858 and Varley was appointed to an investigative committee, set up jointly by the first Atlantic cable in 1858, he was appointed to a joint investigative committee established by the Board of Trade and the Atlantic Telegraph Company.

The committee reported in 1861 and resulted in a second cable in 1865, Varley replacing Wildman Whitehouse as chief electrician. Despite the difficulties of the second cable, it was an ultimate success and Varley developed many improvements in technology. Varley was an astute businessman and the partnership that he formed with the 1st Baron Kelvin and Fleeming Jenkin to exploit their respective telegraphic inventions yielded large profits for the three men.

Spiritualism
He was sympathetic to the claims of Spiritualism and carried out investigations with fellow physicist William Crookes using a galvanometer to make measurements of the supposed phenomena.

Cathode rays
In 1871, he authored a scientific paper suggesting that cathode rays were streams of particles of electricity. Varley believed cathode radiation was caused by the collision of particles. His belief was based on the idea that because the rays were deflected in the presence of a magnet, these particles have to be considered carriers of an electric charge. This led him to believe that the electrically charged particles should be deflected by the presence of an electric field. He was never able to prove this.

Scandal
Varley had two sons and two daughters with his first wife, Ellen Cayley (née Rouse) (1837-1920), whom he married on 4 October 1855. The children's names were Hebe, Ada aka Nard Almayne (1856-1928), Cromwell Oliver (1857-1934), and Fleetwood E. Varley. Upon returning from a trip abroad, he discovered that his wife had gone off with Ion Perdicaris, a wealthy Greek-American. After the divorce was granted in 1873, she and the children settled with Perdicaris at Tangiers, Morocco. In 1904, Varley's elder son, also named Cromwell, was kidnapped along with Perdicaris by Mulai Ahmed er Raisuni, precipitating an international incident before both men were released unharmed.

On 11 January 1877, Varley married Heleanor Jessie Smith, daughter of Capt. Charles Smith of Forres, Scotland.

Death
C.F. Varley died at Cromwell House, Bexleyheath, Kent, in 1883, aged 55, from undisclosed causes.

Honours

 * Member of the Institution of Civil Engineers, (1865);
 * Fellow of the Royal Society, (1871);
 * Founder member of the Society of Telegraph Engineers which became the Institution of Electrical Engineers.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: C. F. Varley


text:
Bernhardus Varenius

Bernhardus Varenius (Bernhard Varen) (1622, Hitzacker, Lower Saxony – 1650) was a German geographer.

Life
His early years (from 1627) were spent at Uelzen, where his father was court preacher to the duke of Brunswick. Varenius studied at the gymnasium of Hamburg (1640–1642), and at Königsberg (1643–1645) and Leiden (1645–1649) universities, where he devoted himself to mathematics and medicine, taking his medical degree at Leiden in 1649. He then settled at Amsterdam, intending to practice medicine. But the recent discoveries of Abel Tasman, Willem Schouten and other Dutch navigators, and his friendship for Willem Blaeu and other geographers, attracted Varenius to geography. He died in 1650, aged only twenty-eight, a victim to the privations and miseries of a poor scholar's life.

Works
In 1649 he published, through L. Elzevir of Amsterdam, his Descriptio Regni Japoniae. In this was included a translation into Latin of part of Jodocus Schouten's account of Siam (Appendix de religione Siamensium, ex Descriptione Belgica Iodoci Schoutenii), and chapters on the religions and customs of various peoples. Next year (1650) appeared, also through Elzevir, the work by which he is best known, his Geographia Generalis, in which he endeavored to lay down the general principles of the subject on a wide scientific basis, according to the knowledge of his day. Varenius followed the Sphaera mundi (1620) of Giuseppe Biancani, though he also introduced ideas that had come into thinking during the intervening decades. The work is divided into (1) absolute geography, (2) relative geography and (3) comparative geography. The first investigates mathematical facts relating to the earth as a whole, its figure, dimensions, motions, their measurement, etc. The second part considers the earth as affected by the sun and stars, climates, seasons, the difference of apparent time at different places, variations in the length of the day, etc. The third part treats briefly the actual divisions of the surface of the earth, their relative positions, globe and map-construction, longitude, navigation, etc.

Varenius, with the materials at his command, dealt with the subject of geography in a truly philosophic spirit; and his work long held its position as the best treatise in existence on scientific and comparative geography. The work went through many editions. Sir Isaac Newton introduced several important improvements into the Cambridge edition of 1672; in 1715 James Jurin issued another Cambridge edition with a valuable appendix; in 1733 the whole work was translated into English by Dugdale; and in 1736 Dugdale's second edition was revised by Shaw. In 1716 an Italian edition appeared at Naples; in 1750 a Dutch translation followed; in 1751 Osman b. Abdulemennan translated it into Turkish; and in 1755 a French version, from Shaw's edition, came out at Paris. Among later geographers d'Anville and Alexander von Humboldt especially drew attention to Varen's genius and services to science.

title: Bernhardus Varenius


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Breathanach

 This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete

Keep votes accepted: IJzeren Jan, malathion, Almafeta, Grace Note, arj, Phroziac,

Keep votes not accepted (and reasons why): Assdl (only 44 edits, mostly to conlang articles), Firespeaker (only 37 edits), Elemtilas (only 17 edits, all to conlang vfd debates), BenctPhilipJonsson (only 8 edits), SamuelRiv (only 4 edits, all to conlang vfd debates), one unsigned keep vote

Delete votes accepted: ishwar, mikka, MH, Wile E. Heresiarch, Angr, Prosfilaes, Mustafaa, Felix the Cassowary, The Literate Engineer, Trilobite, Sjakkalle, Indrian,

-- Francs2000 | Talk 12:41, 5 August 2005 (UTC)

Breathanach

 * Delete. This article is about a conlang. I believe that it is not notable for inclusion in Wikipedia. – ishwar  (speak)  15:30, 2005 July 23 (UTC)
 * Keep - If you delete this article, please proceed and remove all the constructed languages that appear in this list. If you delete this one, but keep the others, it'll be unfair. I think this kind of articles is worth enough, and they hurt no one. Thanks. Assdl 15:44, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * User has made less than 50 edits. Wile E. Heresiarch 19:35, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * But more edits about this particular subject than you did. --IJzeren Jan 23:20, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Nonnotable. mikka (t) 18:19, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep - I think that if someone would like information on a conlang, there's no reason Wikipedia shouldn't be a place to start. -Firespeaker 18:20, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * User has made less than 50 edits. Wile E. Heresiarch 19:35, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Has been here since March 30 though...
 * Delete, nonnotable. MH 18:52, July 23, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete: vanity, advert, nonnotable. Wile E. Heresiarch 19:25, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, nonnotoable conlang. --Angr/undefined 19:59, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete: of all the conlang articles listed, I've never heard of it even in my time in the conlang community, and there's nothing significant about it, or anyone who's felt it important enough to translate it into other Wikipedias. --Prosfilaes 20:54, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete this and all other members of Category:Ill Bethisad. - Mustafaa 20:58, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Several other of the members of Category:Ill Bethisad are up for VfD, but they aren't so certain of deletion. Each of those articles is going to have to be dealt with individually. --Prosfilaes 21:04, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Hmm, Brithenig might be notable enough to survive, actually; the rest should go, though. - Mustafaa 22:22, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * If some of these articles are certain, perhaps they can all be merged into the Ill Bethisad article to make one large, but solid, article? Almafeta 04:02, 24 July 2005 (UTC)

 * Keep, notable enough for me. --IJzeren Jan 23:20, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep Notability is not the standard here --malathion talk 23:34, 23 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete Felix the Cassowary 01:07, 24 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Per CONLANG, no points of notability (#189 most popular out of top 200 on Langmaker).  Almafeta 01:31, 24 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep. Part of understanding Brithenig, which is notable (see its VfD page for why).  Almafeta 04:16, 24 July 2005 (UTC)
 * How is this the case? The Brithenig article barely mentiones Breathanach, and if the Breathanach article is necessary for the understanding of Brithenig, shouldn't they be combined? dhasenan 1734, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete No indication of having, now or ever, been a vernacular for any sized group of people. No pop culture notability, as per Klingon.  No academic notability, as due to the fact that I couldn't find a reference to it after searching over a half dozen scholarly journals' online editions.  Not even the bizarre quasi-notability of having spawned other misbegotten conlangs the way Brithenig claims to have.  The Literate Engineer 06:12, 24 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. As a conlanger, and much as I would like to make public the art of conlanging to the greatest extent possible, I really don't see the need for grammatical treatises and descriptions of individual conlangs here on the Wikipedia. There is already a good Wikipedia article, Artistic language, which should serve as a central locus for this particular art form and has already got a quite a long list of conlangs there. I think it vèry meet and right for conlangers to link to their own pages or to some other conlang oriented source, if they wish to do so. I wouldn't create a Wikipedia article for any of my conlangs, even though at least one of them ìs "notable" per these criteria, and if I found one, I'ld delete it for the reasons stated. Elemtilas
 * Weak Keep -- having found and read the deletion policies, I have to reconsider my opinion. I still don't think most conlangs warrant individual articles, but they are works of art and as such should not necessarily be removed simply because some people don't get the artform or can't think of anything better than personal attacks against the artists that create languages. Anyone who wants to create such an article on a conlang should be responsible enough to really consider whether this piece of artwork warrants an individual and unique article of its own. If possible, this article should be merged with Constructed languages or Artistic languages or Ill Bethisad. Elemtilas
 * Keep. Harmless nonsense. Has been around for a while and is of interest to those who are interested in this stuff. Grace Note 05:14, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep Here is a fine example of how artists inspire each other. Conlanging is a very sociable art form, whose participants love to exchange ideas and inspiration. The creation of Brethanach, inspired by Brithenig, shows this at work.
 * Delete. Nonnotable conlang. — Trilobite (Talk) 19:10, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. BenctPhilipJonsson 19:23, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
 * User has no other edits but voting for keeping conlangs.mikka (t) 19:39, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Constructed languages are not inherently notable, and notability is not estabished in this article. Sjakkalle (Check!)  11:05, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Notable in the context of constructed languages. arj 12:40, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Weak Keep Notability is somewhat on the questionable side, 528 google hits on "Breathanach language". But, I think that's notable enough, and, vfd'ing all conlangs because "its a goofy way to spend your life" is a goofy way to spend your life. Wikipedia is not paper. --Phroziac (talk) 19:58, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Does not meet the high bar of notability for a conlang. Indrian 20:43, July 26, 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment: Why is there are a "high bar of notability for a conlang" as opposed to anything else, and where is this bar? --Prosfilaes 22:20, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
 * Notability being subjective, this is my own personal opinion that you are free to disagree with. We all set the bar in different places. Indrian 00:13, July 27, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. After reading through the deletion policy in its entirety, it seems clear that this article has a place here. SamuelRiv 16:41, 27 July 2005 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


text:
Eşref Apak

Eşref Apak (born 3 January 1982 in Kalecik, Ankara) is a Turkish hammer thrower. Apak was a member of Fenerbahçe Athletics in Istanbul then transferred to Enkaspor, where he was coached by Artun Talay. The 185 cm tall athlete at 115 kg was a student of physical education and sports at Gazi University in Ankara.

Apak took part at the 2004 Summer Olympics in Athens and originally took a fource place with 79.51 m result. After a series of doping-related disqualifications he moved up to second place after the gold medalist Koji Murofushi of Japan. However as he had been suspended from the sport for doping offenses since 2004, the IOC decided not to award the both silver and bronze medals. In 2005 Apak participated at the 2005 Mediterranean Games in Almería and won the gold medal.

Eşref Apak is married to sprinter Sema Aydemir, and the couple has a son Ali.

He served a 2-year doping ban for the use of a prohibited substance, Stanozolol. The ban lasted from 8 June 2013 to 25 June 2015.

title: Eşref Apak


text: User talk:68.82.56.39

title: User talk:68.82.56.39