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Sacrifice in Maya culture

Sacrifice was a religious activity in Maya culture, involving the killing of humans or animals, or bloodletting by members of the community, in rituals superintended by priests. Sacrifice has been a feature of almost all pre-modern societies at some stage of their development and for broadly the same reason: to propitiate or fulfill a perceived obligation towards the gods.

Crisis and sacrifice
What is known of Mayan ritual practices comes from two sources: the extant chronicles and codices of the missionary-ethnographers who arrived with or shortly after the Spanish conquest of Yucatán, and subsequent archaeological data. The historical record is more sparse than that for the Aztecs, and can only be reliable in regards to the Post-Classical period, long after the Classic Maya collapse. The chroniclers have also been accused of colonial bias, but the most comprehensive account of Maya society, by Diego de Landa, has been described by modern experts as an "ethnographic masterpiece”, despite his role in the destruction of Maya codices.

The archaeological data has continued to expand as more excavations are undertaken, confirming much of what the early chroniclers wrote. A major breakthrough was the deciphering of the Maya syllabary in the 1950s, which has allowed the glyphs carved into many temples to be understood. Excavation and forensic examination of human remains have also thrown light on the age, sex, and cause of death of sacrificial victims.

Human sacrifice
The Mayans engaged in a large number of festivals and rituals on fixed days of the year, many of which involved animal sacrifices and all of which seem to have involved bloodletting. The ubiquity of this practice is a unique aspect of pre-Columbian Mesoamerican culture, and is now believed to have originated with the Olmecs, the region's first civilization.

Ritualised sacrifice was usually performed in public by religious or political leaders piercing a soft body part, most commonly the tongue, ear or foreskin, and collecting the blood to smear directly on the idol or collecting it on paper, which was then burned. In what is today Nicaragua, the blood was smeared on corn, distributed to the people and baked into sacred bread. The blood could also be collected from the non-elite, often from the foreskins of youths, or from high-ranking women.

The site of the collection was of obvious ritual significance. Joralemon notes it is "virtually certain" that blood from the penis and the vagina was the most sacred and had "extraordinary fertilizing power" and that such rituals were essential for the regeneration of the natural world, particularly cultivated plants. In one dramatic variant men and women "gathered in the temple in a line, and each made a pierced hole through the member, across from side to side, and then passed through as great a quantity of cord as they could stand; and thus all together fastened and strung together, they anointed the statue the Spanish considered to be sun worship of "Baʿal" from the Bible. But auto-sacrifice could also be an everyday event, with those passing by an idol anointing it with blood drawn on the spot as a sign of piety.

Blood sacrifice to the Maya gods was vigorously opposed by the Spanish clergy as the most visible sign of native apostasy, as De Landa, who was later to become the second bishop of the Yucatán, makes clear: "'After the people had been thus instructed in religion, and the youths benefitted as we have said, they were perverted by their priests and chiefs to return to their idolatry; this they did, making sacrifices not only by incense but also of human blood. Upon this the friars held an Inquisition, calling upon the Alcalde Mayor for aid; they held trials and celebrated an Auto, putting many on scaffolds, capped, shorn, and beaten, and some in the penitential robes for a time. Some of the Indians out of grief, and deluded by the devil, hung themselves; but generally, they all showed much repentance and readiness to be good Christians.'"

De Landa provides the most comprehensive account of calendar festivals and rituals (chapters 34-40), but in none of these regular events is human sacrifice mentioned, which must mean his Maya informants were unaware of any instances since the cleric would hardly have suppressed such information.

The traditional view is that the Mayans were far less prolific in sacrificing people than their neighbours. Bancroft notes: "An event which in Mexico would be the death-signal to a hecatomb of human victims would in Yucatán be celebrated by the death of a spotted dog."(p. 704) But mounting archeological evidence has for many decades now supported the chroniclers' contention that human sacrifice was far from unknown in Maya society. The city of Chichen Itza, the main focus of Maya regional power from the Late Classical period, appears to have also been a major focus of human sacrifice. There are two natural sinkholes, or cenotes, at the site of the city, which would have provided a plentiful supply of potable water. The largest of these, Cenote Sagrado (also known as the Well of Sacrifice), was where many victims were cast as an offering to the rain god Chaac. A 2007 study of remains taken from this cenote found that they had wounds consistent with human sacrifice. Bancroft describes one procedure:"A long cord was then fastened round the body of each victim, and the moment the smoke ceased to rise from the altar, all were hurled into the gulf. The crowd, which had gathered from every part of the country to see the sacrifice, immediately drew back from the brink of the pit and continued to pray without cessation for some time. The bodies were then drawn up and buried in the neighboring grove. (p.705)" There is no consensus on why these sacrifices took place, their true scale at different times, or even who the victims were.

Because Maya society was organised as independent city-states, the local political and religious elites could independently initiate human sacrifices as they saw fit. De Landa notes that a common cause for temple sacrifices in many cities was the occurrence of "pestilences, dissensions, or droughts or the like ills". (p. 91) In such cases, slaves were usually purchased and after a variety of rituals were anointed with blue dye and either shot with arrows through the heart or held on an altar while the priest swiftly removed the heart using a ceremonial knife. In either case the heart was presented to the temple idol, which was also anointed with blood. According to Bancroft, one tribe sacrificed illegitimate boys twice a year, again by removing the heart, but collecting the blood in a bowl and scattering it to the four cardinal compass points within the temple.

Capturing prisoners after a successful battle also provided victims for sacrifice, presumably to propitiate whatever deity had promised victory in the first place, although there is no record of the Maya initiating conflicts solely for this purpose as was apparently the case with the Aztecs. Modern analysis of the ancient Maya art indicates a large number of representations of prisoners of war that are now understood to be sacrificial victims: "The analysis of the representations and sometimes of their context shows that the crossed-arms-on-the-chest gesture is associated with the concepts of submissiveness, captivity and death — in a word, sacrifice."

Child sacrifice
Mayanists believe that, like the Aztecs, the Maya performed child sacrifice in specific circumstances, most commonly as foundation dedications for temples and other structures. Maya art from the Classic period also depicts the extraction of children's hearts during the ascension to the throne of the new king, or at the beginnings of the Maya calendar. In one of these cases, Stele 11 in Piedras Negras, Guatemala, a sacrificed boy can be seen. Other scenes of sacrificed boys are visible on jars.

As archeologists continue to excavate, more instances of child dedicatory sacrifices are being uncovered. A dig commenced in 1974 at the northern Belize site of Lamanai turned up the remains of five children, ranging in age from a newborn to about 8 years old: "The conclusion that the five children were sacrificial victims is virtually inescapable... Nowhere else at Lamanai is there evidence of human sacrifice, either of children or adults... However, it is clear that the offering of children as part of the dedicatory activities that preceded the setting up of stelae was not uncommon at any time or place in the Maya lowlands."

In 2005 a mass grave of one- to two-year-old sacrificed children was found in the Maya region of Comalcalco. The sacrifices were apparently performed for dedicatory purposes when building temples at the Comalcalco acropolis.

An excavation at El Perú-Wakaʼ turned up the remains of an infant with, unusually, those of an adult male, in the presence of extensive evidence of feasting that had followed the expansion of a residence which had then been "ensouled" by the rituals and sacrifices. The analysis suggests that the "interments show that human sacrifice was not limited to the royal actors associated with the Classic Maya state, but could be practiced by lesser elites as part of their own private ceremonies."

Animal sacrifice
White-tailed deer were perhaps the most popular sacrificial animal, heavily featured in Maya art. After deer, the next most common sacrificial animals were dogs and various birds (whose heads were offered to the idols), followed by a wide range of other creatures, from jaguars to alligators.

Animal sacrifice also seems to have been a common ritual before the commencement of any important task or undertaking.

Examples
The Maya often raised animals for the purposes of sacrificing and eating them at ritual feasts. Spanish colonizers reported that the Maya would kill and consume massive quantities of turkey in an annual ritual sacrifice and feast.

The Dresden Codex, an 11th-12th century illustrated Maya book, depicts birds being used in ritual sacrifice, deer tied up near sacrificial sites, and pieces of deer meat placed into ritualistic containers. Both the Madrid Codex and the Borgia Codex depict a deer ritual in which deer are tied to trees and killed with spears.

At Laguna de On Island, remains of tapir, peccary, deer, crocodile, iguana, and agouti were all found concentrated around a spot believed to have been used for ritual butchering. These animals were found in much smaller proportions or are completely absent in the surrounding areas, indicating elite control over animals used for butchering. Another structure on the island was found to contain evidence of both ritual practice and deer jaw bones.

In a Maya burial chamber in Xunatunich, an upper-class adult male was found buried with both deer and jaguar bones scattered over his body. At Xunatunich and Baking Pot, deer bones and turtle shells were found without the cut marks associated with consumption, pointing towards their use in ritual sacrifice. Postclassical records describe both deer and turtles being sacrificed at these sites.

A gravesite discovered at Yaxuná featured the scattered bones of jaguars, rabbits, deer, opossum, birds, lizards, and snakes on and around the body.

Archaeological controversy & misconceptions
In many cases, animals used for sacrifices were also consumed, making the line between animals used for ritual & sacrificial practices and animals relied on for food unclear or absent. Montero-Lopez argues that on the basis of analysis of the distribution of deer parts in Classical Maya sites that the archeological record does not support a clear distinction between the secular and sacred uses of animals. This issue comes further to light when studying the lower classes. Because rituals in Maya society were conducted exclusively by elites, poorer people would get almost all of the meat in their diets from these ritual feasts. Despite this convergence, it remains common in the literature to consider food use of animals and ritual use of animals separately.

Mesoamerica lacked conventional domesticated food animals such as sheep, cows, and pigs, and some researchers have taken this to mean animal protein and byproducts could only be obtained by hunting. In reality, evidence points to the Maya having domesticated deer and dogs on a large scale. There is a well-documented practice of Maya households fattening up dogs on maize, either to eat themselves or to ritually offer to elites.

In Seibal, possible remains of animal pens were found with pieces of antler, indicating that deer were kept close at hand for consumption and ritual use. In Cozumel, stone enclosures from the Postclassic period were found to contain droppings from animals and domesticated turkey bones. These turkeys must have been imported from Northern Mexico, as they were not native to Cozumel.

Origins, meaning, and social function
Both blood and human sacrifice were ubiquitous in all cultures of pre-Columbian Mesoamerica, but beyond some uncontroversial generalisations there is no scholarly consensus on the broader questions (and specific mysteries) this raises. Most scholars agree that both practices arose among the Olmecs at least 3,000 plus years ago, and have been transmitted to subsequent cultures, including the Maya. Why they arose among the Olmecs is unknown, and probably unknowable, given the paucity of data.

Blood, and by extension the still-beating heart, is the central element in both the ethnography and iconography of sacrifice, and its use through ritual established or renewed for the Maya a connection with the sacred that was for them essential to the very existence of the natural order. Julian Lee's observation that the Maya "drew no sharp distinction between the animate and the inanimate" and the remarks by Pendergast and others that sacrifices "ensouled" buildings and idols indicate a social meaning, as Reilly suggests, most akin to transubstantiation – a literal rather than symbolic transformation on which the fate of the world and its inhabitants depended.

As with all known theocratic societies, it is likely the Maya political and religious elites played mutually reinforcing roles in supporting the position of the other and ensuring the social stability essential for both, with sacrifice rituals functioning as the performative centrepiece of communal integration. But on likely divergences of interests between different social groups in regard to sacrifice rituals, including within these elites, the historical record has so far been silent.

title: Sacrifice in Maya culture


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Talk:LeToya Luckett/Archive 1

Settlement
'''The eventual settlement with former bandmates has allowed Luckett to receive her royalties from Columbia Records for all Destiny's Child albums sold that she was apart of (Destiny's Child, The Writing's On The Wall), and albums that feature songs she was apart of (#1's, various complilation albums).

Discrepancy in the Miscellaneous section
[not verified]
 * As the Miscellaneous section no longer exists (good work!), I've removed this tag for cleanup.--Marysunshine 16:26, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Who did all of this?
It looks like LeToya herself or someone probably came on here and did this. She hasn't even had a big career and she has all of these pictures and other information

REPLY: a lot of her fans contribute to her page
 *  Yeah! Quit hatin!  : D Donmega60645 16:41, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Vocals
Whistle Register? I've never heard any of her highnotes in her short lived career with Destiny's Child...

REPLY: WELL U REALLY DUMB! Shes a soprano

REPLY 2 Reply: all sopranos cannot whistle.

 * Soprano doesn't prove anything. Alot of Soprano's ranges stop at C#6 or D6. To varify she can sing in the whistle register, a recording of her hitting at least E6 or any note in whistle voice is required for varification so others can agree with it. Myke 20:26, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

I`ve read that she`s a lyric coloratura soprano - she absolutely doesn`t sound like mezzo to me. Seems to me that to almost every pop - singer someone here in Wikipedia writes Mezzo - includes Kylie Minogue etc - who ist absolutely no mezzo, more soubrette —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.218.231.238 (talk) 22:54, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

#1's album
I doubt this should be included in this article since every one of the signles she was on was re-recorded or re-edited (mostly likely with just the current members)making it the [#1's edited version] Also Letoya didn't appear on the cover and the only mention is in writing credits. I'm just sayin.

none of the song of destinys child/the writings on the wall and this is the remix had been re-recorded. they original radio edit with letoya vocals on.

Then why did they give the edited verison a whole new name

They didnt get new names. places like iTunes say "Edit" because they are shorter than the original like say my name - 4:30 going on the album as say my name (edit) - 4:00

Discography
I'm questioning the inclusion of Destiny's Child material here. Isn't all of this already in the Destiny's Child pages? Doesn't make sense to repeat it all, especially as she is beginning to earn success as a solo artist. At the very least, perhaps just a bullet-list with wikilinks for DC stuff, then have the chart positions and album images for her solo material. -- eo 00:52, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

 * I agree; it should definitely be removed. It is unncessary to repeat all of Destiny's Child pre-2001 discography in this article.  It just clutters up the page.  --Musicpvm 06:05, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

no it is important to show her comtribution and presence in destinys child. so that will stay there.
 * Of course she contributed to DC, its mentioned within the article. But as this is an article about her we don't need all the extra DC stuff here.  It's redundant; that's what wikilinking is for.  Are you saying that all four members of, say, the Beatles should have their solo stuff and Beatles discographies in all their pages?  Same goes for any band whose members have solo success.  This article still needs work.... I also see that she is referred to by first name a few times as well... something that was already corrected before. -- eo 17:18, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

This article needs a major cleanup
I just looked it over and cleaned it up, but there is still an excess of unnecessary information that should be removed. LeToya's article should not have all of these charts and lists. As User:Ericorbit stated above, the Destiny's Child portions of the discography should be removed from this article and replaced with a link to Destiny's Child discography. The awards section should also be removed as LeToya has won no solo awards. If necessary, a link can be added to Destiny's Child awards and accolades. The songwriting credits and especially the live performances sections are too much. I have never seen any other article about a musican at Wikipedia which had a list of all the songs they have co-written or all the live performances they have partipated in. The "Miscellaneous" section should also be removed as it is not very encylopedic to have such a section. If any of the information in the section is notable, it should be moved into LeToya's actual biography section. --Musicpvm 21:16, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

 * Please stop reverting my edits. I am trying to make this article meet Wikipedia's standards and its current state is far from it.  This is not a fanpage but an article in an encylopedia.  As stated above, there should be no "Miscellaneous" section.  If this information is enyclopedia-worthy, it should be moved into her bio as I did.  Also, a paragraph with a list of all the artists and producers she has worked with is unncessary.  Fancruft such as the date the "Torn" video debuted on 106 & Park does not belong in here.  My modifications to the intro follow Manual of Style (biographies).  Also, LeToya's solo career should at least be mentioned in the lead section as it should summarize the main points of the article (Lead section).  Many of these edits have been reverted.  --Musicpvm 03:56, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

and as wikipedia standards

guest vocals are presented that way for most artists

===Guest Vocals===

====Album appearances==== ====Soundtrack appearances====

so there's no reason it wont be the case for letoya.

concerning the awards. she won a grammy award under HER name and not under destinys child for the songwrting of "say my name". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.84.182.78 (talk • contribs)

A "Guest vocals" section has never been a Wikipedia standard. Why should soundtrack appearances be under guest vocals? She is not a guest in "What Love Can Do" from the Coach Carter soundtrack. She is the main artist. Also, when making new headings, only the first word should be capitalized unless it's a proper noun - "Guest vocals" instead of "Guest Vocals" (Manual of Style (headings)). All the song titles in the discography need to once again be placed in quotes instead of being italicized. Album titles are italicized, and song titles are placed in quotes. --Musicpvm 18:27, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

I understand what you say. if it is not needed to put guest vocals. go ahead and go. but this must be changed to ALL artists page. and it is presented that way in 99% of the cases. destiny's child girls as well as christina milian, mya, and more more more.

OK. If you have time for that. u can do it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.84.182.78 (talk • contribs)

ascap
songwritings is not part of the settlement. ASCAP pays songwriters independly of the record company. so letoya is still getting money from her songwriting. there is no proof needed. it's just logic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.84.182.78 (talk • contribs)

 * That is the case for ALL songwriters, so there is no reason for that information to be included in her article. It is unncessary.  --Musicpvm 01:14, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

it is necessary because a lot of people misunderstand this fact. they think since she got booted from the group she had gave up on her rights, including on the songwriting. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.84.182.78 (talk • contribs)

random trivia
some facts are not pertinent enough to be moved in the main solo carreer article. but it's still interesting to know them. like the fact that she's a soprano singer. wikipedia is a source for everyoone and also for journalists. information you judge unecessary migh be necessary for others. we already let you changed several stuff but we're not gonna let anyone do anything and vandalize letoya's page. thank you for your understanding.

by the way the random trivia appears in many artists pages --) marques houston, mila j, destiny's chil and more.

standards like you say are always about to change and evoluate to people's needs. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.84.182.78 (talk • contribs)

 * It doesn't matter if those articles have trivia sections. You changed one of the section titles in the Destiny's Child article to "Random Trivia" to prove your point.  Please see Featured Articles Mariah Carey and Celine Dion which are considered two of Wikipedia's best articles on musicians.  The soprano mention can be added somewhere in her biography, but that glass-cutting sentence needs a source.  And I am not vandalizing this article; I am doing exactly the opposite.  This page is filled with fancruft and useless info/charts, and I am trying to clean it up.  You are the one that seems to be unaware of Wikipedia's policies.  Please sign your talk page comments by clicking the signature button and please add comments on other users' talk pages at the end of the page and not somewhere in the middle.  --Musicpvm 17:44, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
 * In my opinion, I would suggest that one saw Mariah Carey and Kylie Minogue. Céline Dion is not the best article to go to on a musician because it lacks sound samples and a thorough "image" section. —Eternal Equinox | talk 20:27, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

what up toya
I kiera from TN. in a small town brownsville and I am a big Fan of u I followed u every since u was wit destinys child I all ways now u could be a solo artist well e-mail me at  love allways your number #1 fan

 * She most likely doesn't visit this page and probably won't respond to anything you put here.  69.145.123.171 Hello!  Thursday, June 22, 2006, 01:24 (UTC)

grammy award + charts table
1: letoya won 2 grammy awards in 2001. one under destinys child and one under her name The info about the award under her name should stay on her page since she won this award under her name. if u check whos the grammy award winner for r&b song in 2001. LETOYA LUCKETT. NOT destiny's child. it's a songwriting award. source: Best R&B Song and

2: the table charts on all those pages are the same. it should be the same too for letoya. Christina Milian, Mýa (singer),Brandy (entertainer), Monica (singer), Nelly, Keyshia Cole and much more. + The she don't is said to be released early july: source:

Seems like Ericorbit is changing this chart table to all of those artists mentioned in your list. I don't know if he does that to prove his point. But for now I tried to please everyone and put the "official" wikipedia chart table that he is claiming. I still would like to have a link that shows and proves what is the official table chart used in wikipedia line so we can stop this unecessary dispute. I see that now half of the artists are using one model and the other half another one. So what is the right one? Once it will be clearly defined what is the right one then we will have to edit all artists pages that doesn't match the official one. And I repeat It's about a half. Kareubeu

the chart table he put is not clear for reugular people that are not professional. the other chart table used by "half of the artists" like u say mention "charts position" on the top of ... the chart positions. people who checkin a artist page when they see ericorbit's model page they wont notice and undertand right away what it all those numbers means. so since "half of the artists" use a table that mentions "chart positions" i dont see why we wouldn choice that one. and yeah id like to see a prove too of what he sayin that it is official. cuz it's not. they're no mention of that a table should mention chart positions or not. --Letoyabrigade 16:48, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

 * You can reference this guideline: WikiProject Music/Tables for charts and also its Talk Page, in which many editors contributed. The guideline discourages the separation of U.S. charts from other countries, the boldfacing of chart positions and use of the "#" symbol, among other things.  You may also want to check out Manual of Style (lists of works) which not only pertains to music, but also to books and films.  I have changed many many pages (not just LeToya, Brandy, Monica, etc. to adhere to this format and for the record many of the articles I have changed are for artists I neither like nor dislike.... I simply am following a formatting guideline).  For other article (biography) style guides, see links provided by Musicpvm above. -- eo 16:51, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

u just proved u point is wrong. one of the reference for discographies is Nine Inch Nails and it says "peak chart positions" on the top of the countries. now dont go there and edit it cuz i will revert it since it's supose to be right. --Letoyabrigade 17:10, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Just because you find one article that doesn't follow the guideline doesn't mean a guideline doesn't exist or that it is "wrong". Am I supposed to police the entire encylcopedia for every article that needs formatting changes?  Why don't you change it?  Or contribute to Nine Inch Nails' Discussion Page?  Or contribute to a WikiProject discussion about chart position presentation?  Have you read Nine Inch Nails' Talk page?  Or the Talk Page for any artists besides LeToya or Destiny's Child?  Have you collaborated (i.e. worked with or compromised) with editors on the layout of any page in this encyclopedia?  Have you read any of the style guides or links provided to you by me, Musicpvm, or any editor who has left comments for you on your User Talk Page or any of the User Talk Pages of your aliases and IP addresses?  It's pretty obvious that your agenda is to specifically make the LeToya article a fanpage and format it to your liking rather than contributing positively to the Wikipedia as a whole. -- eo 17:24, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

im not gonna change something that is supose to be right. so the question is what is right what is wrong. of course because i want the chart table to be clear and be like other artists that means i wanna keep that page as a fan page. of course... uh huh. unless you getting paid for that u seem to be like a very bored person.--Letoyabrigade 17:35, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

 * P.S. Thanks for directing me to Nine Inch Nails - the table there was outdated (i.e., the columns were different widths, the # symbol was used, chart positions were boldfaced, albums were repeatedly wikilinked). So I fixed it.  Your tactic of reverting the LeToya page over and over again is eventaully going to get you banned from here, especially because of your refusal to work cooperatively with other editors and your blantant admission that you aren't interested in Wikipedia standards and you're only here to make LeToya's page look the way you want.  It's not going to work.  -- eo 17:42, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

i do work cooperatively. you dont! i let the table like you wanted it to be. i let u erase all the stuff on the page. i let u edit lot a lot. the few that i try to keep u dont give me no chance. so YOU are the one whos is not tryin to compromise. u just deleting information just like that because of your judgment i explained my point of view for the award. this is hers not destinys child so i'll keep that info. + u erase each time all awards information each time u edit and that girl got those awards so as it is an encyclopedia like u say, more info are present the better it is. i did my part on the compromise thing so now its ur turn.--Letoyabrigade 17:50, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
 * If the only problem you have was the inclusion of the award, why do you revert the charts table? Why are you logging on and off with different user names?  Why all this commotion and drama on this page and various User Pages?  Something as simple as the inclusion of one award on LeToya's page could have easily been resolved a long time ago if your approach was a little more civil.  No one is trying to take away her award or elude that she never won anything - of course she has accomplished a lot - and most of it (up to this point) was with Destiny's Child, which is why there is a wikilink there to show people that there is more info about LeToya on another page.  As she wins awards and accomplishes things as a solo artist then most definitely it should (and will) be included here. -- eo 17:58, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

seems like u dont understand that im not the only one watchin that page. u underestimate letoya's success. and i was not ok with that chart table you and User:Kareubeu made either but he proved his point so i COMPROMISE. so now i'm not gonna revert that part. hope we done with that cuz its crazy.--Letoyabrigade 18:07, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

 * If you want to keep that one award listed, I personally don't have an issue (i.e. I can compromise on that).... and if you had presented your point a little less aggressively people would have been a lot more open to listening to your reasons. What I and others were trying to explain to you is that no one here is trying to say LeToya isn't successful or that she doesn't have lots of fans, etc., etc.  We're simply bringing articles in an encylcopedia up to certain standards.  Everyone here contributes to a lot of different articles - not just people or subjects of which we are fans.  We all like to read and browse the Wikipedia and when we see things that need correction or cleanup - we work together to clean them up.  It's that simple.  -- eo 18:12, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

iight then. i got that. im glad that u willing to compromise and that we finally found a solution. have a good day.--Letoyabrigade 18:17, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

 * The award was not individually won by LeToya. It states: "La Shawn Daniels, Fred Jerkins III, Rodney Jerkins, Beyoncé Knowles, LeToya Luckett, LaTavia Roberson & Kelly Rowland for "Say My Name" performed by Destiny's Child".  It mentions ALL four members of Destiny's Child along with three other songwriters, so I do not understand how the award was only given to LeToya or how it is different from any other Destiny's Child award.  There is already a link to the Destiny's Child awards article, so it does not make sense to pick and choose certain awards to display on the main article.  That is not a neutral point of view.

This award is given individually to each writer. on the statue it is written the writer's name and not the performer's name. so this award is not considered as destiny's child. + when u revert u erase all information concerning the awards including the link that redirect to destinys child award section.--Letoyabrigade 09:21, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Also on your talk page, you claimed "LeToya's single she don't will be released Early july not the 25th". I fail to understand why that is an issue.  As you can see here and here you reverted a version that already stated that "She Don't" was "Scheduled for release in July."  I see no mention of the 25th.  This is NOT something I have ever disagreed with you about.

oh ok i thought u put back 25. but u still not mentioning the point of the charts table. i dont get why u keep reverting and putting back that old stylistic table charts. please tell ur friend Ericorbit to stop reverting that table the one he made looks horrible.it seems like he just want to fight. Letoya's chart table has been based on the same one that is used by all other artists. Maybe u wanna the info "currently active on charts" and "release schedule for july" to appear. I'm ok with that but just add those infos on the notes on the table charts that is more elaborate (with the indication of "chart positions" on the top of each chart) on the bottom of "1.release on a vinyl format only" u can just add those info. --Letoyabrigade 09:21, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

 * On your talk page, you stated that you and "2000 users" are watching this article through a LeToya forum. Please understand that this is an encylopedia with specific guidelines and policies.  You and your "friends" have shown a disregard for these guidelines over the past few weeks and have continually reverted edits (while making personal attacks, vandalizing userpages with hateful comments, and without discussing issues on talk pages) to versions with poor grammar and fancruft that do not follow Wikipedia's style guidelines.  The LeToya Luckett article is NOT a fanpage; it is an article in an enyclopedia.  Ericorbit and I have tried to clean the article up, so it looks professional.  And not that it matters as anybody is free to edit any page at Wikipedia, I am not a "hater" as you have claimed and am actually a fan of LeToya's, which is one reason why I have tried to bring this page up to Wikipedia's standards. --Musicpvm 04:26, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

i never disagreed on that. and if u really a fan u would not act the way you do and tryin to hide on what letoya has contributes to destiny's child. (which is not clearly explained and identified on destinys child's pages since new fans are kind of hating on original members. they actin like they never existed and put as little as possible information about them; in other group former members always has a large space like Spice Girls or En Vogue) + if u were REALLY fan of letoya u would be on her forum. so i'm kinda not believing u beeing a fan. --Letoyabrigade 09:21, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Creating a good encyclopedia article has nothing to do with being a fan of LeToya or any other artist. These are not fanpages, its an encyclopedia. -- eo 22:21, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

would both of you quit it? I'm not a big fan of her but I think she deserves what she get right now, I mean for Destiny's Child girls, she also become succesful just like Kelly Rowland and Beyonce Knowles (I admitted that it's still LONG way for LeToya to combat Beyonce)... but I mean, for a starter, I think she doing just fine... -justame-

Discography Page
It says it needs to be cleaned up, read the pages discussion!

I guess
to be truly honest latoya doing her thing b-cuz if she wasn't haters wouldn't be wasting they time puttin trash on here we have way more bigger problems than worring about some one else

Sales
She was certified platinum Right now it's saying she's sold over 5 million in the US. And only 4 million+ worldwide. Someone's getting a little crazy.- Bryan

Official Singles
according to the billboard website letoyas offical singles are:

 * 1) She Don't
 * 2) Torn
 * 3) All Eyes on Me
 * 4) U Got What I Need
 * 5) No More
 * 6) Somethin' 4 Ya

my source is here at the bottom of the page. can someone please make sure ALL of these singles have single pages? please and thank you. Ratizi1 04:29, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

 * No More is B-side for All Eyes On Me tracklist, but Somethin' 4 Ya was never sent to any radio stations and was just available for d/L as special bonus through walmart. --E d u e m o n  i ↑ talk ↓ 17:06, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Failed GA
There's a POV tag in the Destiny's Child section, which means it must be quick failed as a GA unfortunately. Also, the lead and early life sections need expanding before this article is ready to pass GA. Once these issues have been addressed, feel free to contact me via my talk page and I'll rereview. CloudNine 09:41, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Ok, thanks for addressing those points quickly. However, I have several issues with the article:
 * "Shortly thereafter, she joined the children's choir and began performing in plays at her elementary school, one day she was walking to her desk a girl was sitting in her seat and she called her teacher to remove the girl out of her assigned seat, the girl turned out to be Beyoncé Knowles." Hard to read; needs rephrasing as it's a run-on sentence.
 * best friends and quotes in general shouldn't be italicized
 * "BET promoted LeToya heavily not only on 106 & Park, The Center, and The Black Carpet, but with a 3-part reality series special called, The H-Town Chick." Why a comma at the end of the sentence?
 * At the end of the reference section, there's a URL which needs a title, publisher etc.
 * "U.S. Billboard 200, Top R&B and Comprehensive Albums. Hip-Hop charts" Is the full stop supposed to be there?
 * "Her father, whom is also a singer, spread the word of his daughter vocal talents" needs rephrasing (whom is also a singer, which may be correct, doesn't flow too well)
 * There are more examples; you may want to read the article out loud to help improve some of the prose. I'll put this article on hold until these issues have been solved. CloudNine 07:52, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I've passed this article as a good article (sorry for the delay!). Some improvements you may want to make include adding a "Musical style" section for her solo material and expanding the lead and early life sections. CloudNine 09:44, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Orphaned references in LeToya Luckett
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of LeToya Luckett's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "Allmusic": From Lady Love (album):  From Michelle Williams (singer):

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 13:38, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

title: Talk:LeToya Luckett/Archive 1


text:
Category talk:Volcanoes of the United Kingdom

Cfd 18 Aug 2005
Consensus was to keep; see discussion for details. ∞ Who ? ¿ ? 02:23, 25 August 2005 (UTC)


text:
Laugh Track

Laugh Track is the tenth studio album from American indie rock band The National. The surprise album was released on September 18, 2023, having been announced only days prior. The album's material was mostly written and recorded alongside the band's earlier 2023 album, First Two Pages of Frankenstein, with several songs being re-recorded at producer Tucker Martine's studio after honing their arrangements while on tour in 2023. Preceded by the singles, "Weird Goodbyes", "Alphabet City" and "Space Invader", the album features guest vocal appearances from Justin Vernon, Phoebe Bridgers and Rosanne Cash. Laugh Track has received positive reviews from critics.

Recording and release
After taking a break during the COVID-19 pandemic, the band reunited and began working on a ninth studio album. Initially going through a difficult period of writers block and depression, lyricist Matt Berninger and the band eventually produced enough material to fill two albums. Their first release from the sessions was the single, "Weird Goodbyes", which was released on August 22, 2022 and featured guest vocals from Bon Iver.

They released their ninth studio album, First Two Pages of Frankenstein, on April 28, 2023. The album did not contain "Weird Goodbyes", with bandmate Aaron Dessner hinting at a different "future home" for the song. The song was originally planned to be a stand-alone single, with Dessner noting "It was its own thing. But it also felt related to what we were doing. That was part of the logic for making another record—let’s give "Weird Goodbyes" its own home."

During the National's tour in support of First Two Pages of Frankenstein, the band debuted new material and continued to workshop the remaining unreleased songs from the recording sessions, with the newly-recorded material favoring live drums over pre-programmed percussion. A press release accompanying the release of Laugh Track wrote: "Revelling in the license to radically upend its creative process, The National honed most of this material in live performances on tour this year, and captured those invigorated versions in impromptu sessions at producer Tucker Martine’s Portland studio, Flora Recording & Playback." The album's closing track "Smoke Detector" was recorded in June 2023, during a soundcheck in Vancouver, when the band felt inspired to continue jamming in a rare move for them. The band consciously wanted to highlight Bryan Devendorf's drumming on the album, after having a more "compartmentalized role" on First Two Pages of Frankenstein: "This time we had the desire to make something that was more alive so that Bryan’s playing would drive more.”

Prior to the album's release, the singles "Alphabet City" and "Space Invader" were released on streaming services in August 2023 with artwork matching the single artwork for "Weird Goodbyes". In September, at the band's Homecoming 2023 festival in Cincinnati, the band publicly announced a second album called Laugh Track would be coming out digitally the same weekend. At the performance where the album was announced, 1,000 early vinyl LP copies of the album were sold, signed by each band member, with Berninger saying the full vinyl release would be sometime in November.

Reception
Editors at AnyDecentMusic? characterized Laugh Track as a 7.6 out of 10, based on sixteen reviews.

Editors at AllMusic rated this album 3.5 out of 5 stars, with critic Stephen Thomas Erlewine writing that the music is at "a precisely modulated temperature, bringing the songs to warmth slowly and steadily". Spencer Kornhaber of The Atlantic called this work "hopeful music about everything getting worse", with "bleak" lyrics paired with "music [that] still has the light-seeking quality of Frankenstein". Editors at BrooklynVegan shortlisted this as a notable release of the week and critic Andrew Sacher wrote that this music has "the same passion and attention to detail that they’ve had for two decades straight". At Clash Music, Sahar Ghadirian gave this release a 9 out of 10, writing that it speaks "to the duality of human emotion" with a playful title accompanied by emotional lyrics and highlights several tracks for their atmospherics. Mary Siroky of Consequence called this album "a fine but forgettable companion" to their previous release, continuing that the music is "at its best when things get full and rich" and it "serves as a gentle reminder that there’s a difference between tenderness and boredom; long, meditative music is fine and good, but often more interesting when there’s a destination in mind". In Exclaim!, Alex Hudson rated Laugh Track an 8 out of 10, calling it stronger than its predecessor: "where the earlier album sounded meek, the follow-up finds the National easily sinking into what they do best". In Evening Standard, David Smyth wrote that this "has a greater number of diversions from the set sound" for the band and "it sounds like they’re starting to come back to life"; he scored it 4 out of 5 stars.

Shaad D'Souza of The Guardian rated this work 4 out of 5 stars, stating that it "feels like a fresh start" for the band and that it adopts "a more grownup take on the existential conundrums of earlier National records". In Hot Press, Edwin McFee gave this work a 7 out of 10, concluding that "There is an unmistakable flavour of “B-Side Material” off some tracks, especially on the aimless ‘Dreaming’, and you have to wonder what might have been if they combined the very best cuts from both LPs". The Independent's Helen Brown also gave Laugh Track 4 out of 5 stars, calling this a "loose, upbeat album" that has a "lower-slung" guitar sound. In The Irish Examiner, Ed Power gave this album 4 out of 5 stars, calling it "a refinement of the themes and textures of its predecessor". Irish Independent editors declared this album of the week and critic praising the lyric's exploration of romantic relationships and "artfully constructed" arrangements featuring live drumming. Tony Clayton-Lea of The Irish Times stating that this music "uses a similar sonic template" to their last, but also mixes different styles to show that the band "are as good at stillness as they are at movement"; he scored Laugh Track a 4 out of 5. At musicOMH, John Murphy gave this album 4 out of 5 stars, writing that "it’s musically not such a close cousin of First Two Pages, but more its identical twin – the same brooding atmosphere, that bottled up tension that seems to have become Matt Berninger’s vocal trademark – yet over a few plays, it seems to slowly take a life of its own".

In The New Zealand Herald, Graham Reid called Laugh Track "the wallowing of a troubled soul" with "alluring songs" that serve as "are beautifully played, atmospheric" therapy. Thomas Smith of NME rated Laugh Track 4 out of 5 stars, characterizing it as "a surprise companion record that’s louder, more immediate and rawer than its predecessor" and in comparison to First Two Pages of Frankenstein, this album has "the looser structures and [the] decision to allow the songs room to grow, melodically and lyrically pays off". Editors at Paste chose this as Album of the Week, with critic Matt Mitchell scoring it a 9.0 out of 10, calling it one of the band's best "and maybe their single greatest feat since Sleep Well Beast"; the editors also included it among the best albums of September 2023. Writing for Pitchfork, Evan Rytlewski scored this release a 6.8 out of 10, writing that it "extends its predecessor's subdued mood and reclusive purview" and that both "albums over-relied on programmed drums", but this release has more of a "blissful, easy groove" than First Two Pages of Frankenstein. Rolling Stone UK published a 4-out-of-5 star review from Will Richards that calls this release "an impulsive, fearless sister record" that is "the freest they’ve ever sounded" and the songs "flow with unfiltered energy and spontaneity". At Sputnikmusic, JohnnyoftheWell rated this album a 2.7 out of 5, stating that the band "have seemed less and less like a band firing on all cylinders, and increasingly franchise-esque" in recent years and continuing that with this work, "there is little here that substantively rectifies the underlying issues with the National’s ongoing phase". Ryan Leas of Stereogum wrote that the band feel "looser—more —than they did on its predecessor" and continues to "travel that “ultimate National” path" from their prior release, with this one being "overall more dynamic and vibrant". At Uproxx, critic Steven Hyden created the mixtape Frankenstein Laughs made of tracks from The National's two 2023 albums and included this compilation among his favorite music of September.

At musicOMH, this album was rated 39th best of 2023. Editors at NME ranked this the 32nd best album of 2023. John Meagher of Irish Independent chose "Smoke Detector" as the third best foreign song of 2023, describing it as "a gnarlier, brighter companion record that was rapidly completed once their mojo had been reignited". Paste included this among the 30 best rock albums of 2023. At Under the Radar, this was rated the 61st best album of 2023.

Track listing
All lyrics by Matt Berninger, except where indicated.
 * 1) "Alphabet City" (music: Bryce Dessner) – 3:44
 * 2) "Deep End (Paul's in Pieces)" (music: Aaron Dessner) – 4:29
 * 3) "Weird Goodbyes" (music: A. Dessner) – 5:03
 * 4) "Turn Off the House" (music: B. Dessner) – 4:35
 * 5) "Dreaming" (music: A. Dessner) – 3:46
 * 6) "Laugh Track" (music: A. Dessner) – 4:24
 * 7) "Space Invader" (music: A. Dessner and B. Dessner) – 6:58
 * 8) "Hornets" (music: A. Dessner) – 4:35
 * 9) "Coat on a Hook" (music: A. Dessner) – 4:58
 * 10) "Tour Manager" (lyrics: Carin Besser and Berninger, music: B. Dessner) – 4:26
 * 11) "Crumble" (music: A. Dessner) – 4:35
 * 12) "Smoke Detector" (music: A. Dessner and B. Dessner) – 7:47

Personnel
The National
 * Matt Berninger – lead vocals, production
 * Aaron Dessner – guitar, keyboards, backing vocals, production
 * Bryce Dessner – guitar, keyboards, backing vocals, string arrangement on "Weird Goodbyes", production
 * Bryan Devendorf – drums, percussion, programming, backing vocals, production
 * Scott Devendorf – bass guitar, backing vocals, production

Additional musicians
 * Phoebe Bridgers – vocals on "Laugh Track"
 * Rosanne Cash – vocals on "Crumble"
 * London Contemporary Orchestra – strings on "Weird Goodbyes"
 * Justin Vernon – vocals on "Weird Goodbyes"

Additional personnel
 * Tony Berg – production on "Laugh Track"
 * John Leventhal – production on "Crumble"
 * Tucker Martine – production on "Deep End (Paul's in Pieces)", "Turn Off the House", "Dreaming", "Space Invader", "Hornets", "Coat on a Hook" and "Crumble"
 * Pentagram – design
 * John Solimine – cover photography

Charts
As a product of "Crumble" appearing on the Adult Alternative Airplay chart, Rosanne Cash appeared on a Billboard chart for the first time in 30 years.

title: Laugh Track


text:
Talk:Islam in India

Post Mughal era (Decline of Muslim Politics in India)
How can this not have even a mention of the Maratha Confederacy, which is considered (to a certain extent) to have ended Muslim rule in India? I am mentioning it as a passing note. Credible references provided here. -- talk 19:15, 5 August 2015 UTC

Islam
What about Islam in tamilnadu? 59.97.37.44 (talk) 23:08, 6 November 2023 (UTC)

 * I was researching India's major religions. Clicked islam to learn the basics and couldn't help but notice a separate wiki page for "Islam in India" almost as if apart and yet apart of the islam from there origins (basics, location and original?). My guess would be the reason is that the local atmosphere of other religions added to helped, enriched Islam in some fundamental way that couldn't be argued with. (Maybe denomination of?) "Islam in India". So to finally maybe answer your question?!? The same might hold true for "Islam in Tamil Nadu" local, regional, national and.....so on and so forth. Tomnookmr (talk) 19:49, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
 * There is Tamil Muslim. Capitals00 (talk) 10:07, 7 January 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 January 2024
Please add this redirect template at the top of the page. Summerindiasummer (talk) 06:55, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

 * ✅ Meteorname (talk) 12:19, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 January 2024
Please replace current redirect with this corrected redirect template at the top of the page. Islam in the Indian Republic redirect works better in this situation to distinguish between India as a republic and South Asia as a whole. Summerindia0 (talk) 03:16, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: People coming here via that redirect are not likely to be looking for Islam in South Asia. On the other hand, people coming via the Indian Muslims link might be. —C.Fred (talk) 03:21, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
 * I actually lost the password to my previous account Summerindiasummer from which last redirect semi protected request was submitted by me as well. I initially wanted (Islam in the Indian Republic) redirect to be mentioned in the redirect hatnote but it did not exist as a redirect at that time, as of now it does exist as a redirect (Islam in the Indian Republic). Initially adding (Indian Muslims) was a temporary fix. The Idea was to distinguish between India and South Asia. If you keep Indian Muslims as text in the hatnote than you are taking a chance as Muhajirs of Pakistan who are also sometime referred to as Indian Muslims. Historically, India as a term used to be referred to as South Asia or Indian subcontinent. Since 1947 that is not the case as more countries exist in the South Asia that are not referred to as India. Redirect hatnote created on Islam in South Asia article is trying to fix a geographical problem. It must be done the same here. The title of the article is Islam in India and not Indian Muslims. Indian Muslims is just a redirect here and addon until separate Indian Muslim article is created. Thanks Summerindia0 (talk) 04:10, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Quoting the redirect documentation: It is placed at the top of the article or section that is the primary topic of a redirect, and links to other topics that are ambiguous with the name of that redirect. This template is used instead of the generic for in order to reduce reader confusion.
 * It is reasonable to assume there is ambiguity in a reader who followed the redirect Indian Muslims. Are they looking for Islam in India or Islam in South Asia?
 * I do not see the ambiguity in somebody who followed the redirect Islam in the Indian Republic. They are clearly looking for information about the country, not the subcontinent.
 * Is Muhajir (Pakistan) also reasonably likely to be an ambiguous meaning that it should be mentioned in the hatnote? In other words, are proposing this as the hatnote?
 * —C.Fred (talk) 14:24, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Quoting the Indian subcontinent wiki article: In many historical sources, the region surrounding and southeast of the Indus River was referred to simply as "India". Historians continue to use this term to refer to the whole of the Indian subcontinent in discussions of history up until the era of the British Raj. During this period, "India" came to refer to a distinct political entity that later became a nation-state.
 * It is a common problem. Please take a look at this article.
 * "Is the Term ‘South Asia’ Correct? – The Diplomat" https://thediplomat.com/2021/03/is-the-term-south-asia-correct/
 * "Is the Term ‘South Asia’ Correct? – The Diplomat" https://thediplomat.com/2021/03/is-the-term-south-asia-correct/

 * Please see this quora link.
 * "Why is India often referred to these days as South Asia? - Quora" https://www.quora.com/Why-is-India-often-referred-to-these-days-as-South-Asia Summerindia0 (talk) 18:15, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
 * @Summerindia0 None of that indicates why anybody who followed the link Islam in the Indian Republic would be confused on arrival at this article. This is clearly what they're looking for. —C.Fred (talk) 20:27, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
 * @ Quoting the redirect documentation: It is placed at the top of the article or section that is the primary topic of a redirect,...
 * This clearly says the primary topic. So for example on, Islam in South Asia article, the primary topic is Islam in the Indian subcontinent which is added on that article instead of other nonsense like Desi Muslims or even South Asian Muslims. Summerindia0 (talk) 23:13, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
 * @Summerindia0 Completing the quotation: It is placed at the top of the article or section that is the primary topic of a redirect, and links to other topics that are ambiguous with the name of that redirect. So again I ask, who refers to the subcontinent as a whole as the "Indian Republic", such that there would be ambiguity? —C.Fred (talk) 04:14, 21 January 2024 (UTC)
 * @ Then why would this redirect be placed as a hatnote on Islam in South Asia article?

 * This clearly mentions Islam in the Indian Republic, see Islam in India.

Summerindia0 (talk) 04:19, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

 * I've removed that redirect hatnote. —C.Fred (talk) 13:36, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

CORRECTION NEEDED
Lede comment "India also has the third-largest number of Muslims in the world." appears to be incorrect based on the reflink on which it is purportedly based. 65.88.88.200 (talk) 01:10, 1 February 2024 (UTC)

British Largely Ignored?
The British enjoyed pitting various ethnic groups under their control against eachother. In my understanding, they did this a fair amount with the Hindus and Muslims. Yet the period of British rule is strikingly glossed over throughout this article. Certainly we have records from that time. Why aren't there sections about this era? Jdftba (talk) 19:51, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
 * There is Islam_in_India. What type of content do you want to add? REDISCOVERBHARAT (talk) 05:05, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
 * There is a lot of emphasis on this trope in old-school Indian Nationalist writing, which should be taken with a large pinch of salt frankly. The British found the Muslims largely in charge in many parts of India, and as with many other aspects of the country, were reluctant and slow to change things much. "Divide and rule" is claimed to be the slogan, but really the British found India pretty pre-divided for them. But you are right, there is a big gap in the article. Johnbod (talk) 05:19, 8 March 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Islam in India


text:
User talk:Johnmahoney

Welcome, from Journalist
Welcome!

Hello,, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place  on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! Journalist C. Holla @ me
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Help pages
 * Tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Manual of Style

title: User talk:Johnmahoney


text:
Talk:Final Fantasy Collection

Enhanced remakes?
Do the games really qualify as enhanced remakes? Aren't they really just ports with a couple of FMV videos? Nova Prime 17:34, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Cross split
Could this article be split into the different games it included? Judgesurreal777 06:21, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I think a redirect to List of Final Fantasy titles could perhaps be clearer for readers. Kariteh 12:49, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

title: Talk:Final Fantasy Collection


text:
User talk:Scnbenstein

Welcome, from Journalist
Welcome!

Hello,, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place  on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! Journalist C. Holla @ me
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Help pages
 * Tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Manual of Style

Image Tagging Image:Authorphoto.jpg
Thanks for uploading Image:Authorphoto.jpg. I notice the image page currently doesn't specify who created the image, so the copyright status is therefore unclear. If you have not created the image yourself then you need to argue that we have the right to use the image on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you have not created the image yourself then you should also specify where you found it, ie in most cases link to the website where you got it, and the terms of use for content from that page.

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title: User talk:Scnbenstein


text:
User:Dave weimar

My name is David Weimar and I live in Utah. More information will be uploaded as I log on more.

I have never used drugs or anything else like that. The pages that say that were a joke by a friend of mine who will remain nameless at this point. He's a big joker though.

I'm looking into joining the Air Force though. This is something that I believe could make me a much better person. Gotta go now. I'll be on more and more as time goes on, I think... maybe...

title: User:Dave weimar


text:
PAST Foundation

The PAST Foundation, Partnering Anthropology with  Science and Technology. PAST is a federal 501(c)(3) non-profit educational and research team located in the United States that builds partnerships around compelling scientific and educational projects, making them accessible to students and the public through transdisciplinary program-based learning, experiential field schools, documentary film, and interactive websites.

History
The PAST Foundation was founded in 2000 by an ad hoc organization of anthropologists and scientists who were determined to make ongoing scientific research across a broad spectrum of professions accessible to the public. Immediately, the PAST team began building partnerships and programs for seamless education. The initial work in 2001 included a partnership with the Zoo School from Lincoln, Nebraska, Yellowstone National Park, and PAST. The year-long program featured the first Thermal River archaeological investigation on the Marshall Hotel in the Firehole River and culminated in a published book on the archaeology of the site garnering PAST the National Park Service John L. Cotter Award for Excellence in American Archaeology.

For the next five years, PAST continued to partner with both public and private organizations building educational programs like Riverboatin' on the Red for Oklahoma's Department of Education and SCRUNCH for the US Minerals Management Service. Both programs pivoted around ongoing research such as the discovery of a shipwreck in the Red River dating to Oklahoma's early 19th century settlement period and the effects of pressure on Styrofoam cups that were taken down on the AUV (Autonomous Underwater Vehicle) that studied World War II shipwrecks in thousands of feet of water in the Gulf of Mexico. These program-based learning projects that crossed disciplines have become the cornerstone of PAST.

In addition, PAST continued to partner with public agencies, universities, businesses, and industry building adult field study programs, anthropological research projects, and interactive websites. Years after their launch, websites for the Deep Wrecks Project and USS Arizona still have high volume visitation. The adult field schools have partnered with the Ohio State University, California State Parks, the Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary, Nebraska Wesleyan University, Oklahoma Historical Society, Indiana University, and East Carolina University providing participants with rigorous field experience and the partners with published reports and searchable databases.

Transition
In 2005, through a startup donation, PAST transitioned from a loose knit project driven organization to a program-based non-profit. Additionally, PAST moved the main office to Columbus, Ohio centrally located within the United States. The move allowed PAST to strategically address the organization's growth. Continuously on the quest to partner with schools to pilot PAST programs, in 2006 the foundation formed a partnership with the Ohio State University, the Battelle Memorial Institute, the Central Ohio Educational Council, and the innovative STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math) and Metro Early College and Demonstration High School, located on the OSU campus. Forming the PAST/Metro Program Design Center, PAST set about working with the high school faculty to design transdisciplinary programs that pivot on global issues. The very first program, Garbology, built on the work of Dr. William Rathje of the Stanford University Archaeology Center and pivoted on the very real, global issues of waste management, drew national attention and was rewarded the Emerald Award for Excellence in Environmental Education. The students, the program, and the project director, Dr. Sheli O. Smith, were bestowed with this award. Employing STEM as a delivery vehicle for education, PAST has continued to build popular programs that excite students and allow teachers and students to join on an educational journey. From Forensics in the Classroom to The Cultural Landscape of a Michigan Ghost Town, from The Web of Life to Get Real, from Marine Ecology of the Florida Keys to Growing America, the PAST programs continue to draw on the anthropological base of the organization and to building holistic learning.

Utilizing the guidance of a strategic plan, PAST has been able to also grow on several other fronts. The PAST adult field schools, now in their ninth year, continue to study known archaeological sites and collections assisting public agencies in better understanding, interpretation, and protection of America's maritime heritage treasures, as well as forging ahead in areas of anthropology. PAST field schools helped California Parks move forward in nominating the Gold Rush Era, shipwreck, Frolic on the Mendocino Coast for inclusion in California's State Underwater Parks. The 2005 through 2008 field schools assisted the Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary in better understanding and interpreting the 19th century, Sanctuary shipwrecks, Slobodna, Tonawanda, and Memanon Sanford. Since 2006, PAST and partners have hosted a summer field program dedicated to allowing students to fully explore the world of Forensic Anthropology. Similarly, PAST partnered with the respected documentary film program at Montana State University to offer teachers and students a summer practicum in documentary filmmaking that embeds the process in scientific projects.

In 2006, PAST sought out a new avenue of public access in order to bring the educational programs and field work and research to the public. PAST Publications utilizes the print-on-demand process to enable students, professionals, programs, and organizations to publish scientific and educational work in a timely and cost-effective way.

In 2007, after a year of working with STEM educational reform, PAST and the Battelle Center for Mathematics and Science Education Policy embarked on a combined, ethnographic and policy network study of STEM at Metro Early College and Demonstration High School. The interdisciplinary approach and findings of the study have added a new dimension to the national consideration of how STEM is developed.

Growth
Closing in on its first decade of operation, the PAST Foundation continues to be dedicated to the original goal of bringing public access to compelling scientific research. Currently, PAST works with emerging STEM schools across the US to build transdisciplinary programs for K-20 education and to better understand through anthropological ethnography, the underlying systems that make STEM successful. PAST continues to build learning programs for both high school age students and adults. The impact of these programs help drive their success. PAST Publications is also growing, helping graduate students publish their theses and academic institutions maintain the tradition of publishing research in a timely manner.

Awards
Since its establishment in 2000, recognition of PAST’s achievements have steadily accumulated. PAST was honored the 2001 National Park Service Cotter Award for Excellence in Archaeology, the 2007 Wiley Award for Excellence in Documentary Film, the 2007 Secretary of the Interior’s Conservation Collaborative Partnership Award, the 2007 National Oceanic Partner’s Program Award, the 2007 Emerald Award for Excellence in Environmental Education, and the 2007 Ohio State University Kellogg Award for Excellence in Experiential Learning.

Individually, the PAST research team and its research associates have garnered Emmy Awards, the Society of Historical Archaeology’s Cotter Award for New Promising Professional, and the Ohio State University’s Graduate Student of the Year Award.

Partnerships
The PAST Foundation seeks partnerships for ongoing program-based learning opportunities, field programs, documentary film programs, and publications. It is PAST's contention that strong public networks ensure robust learning opportunities. Currently, PAST partners with public agencies, private businesses, public organizations, non-profit institutions, academic institutions, and industries in building programs, underwriting research, and furthering scientific endeavors. See Partnerships Below.

Field schools
The PAST Foundation field schools consist of anthropological and scientific work that impact humans and their environment, culture, and heritage. All PAST field opportunities are structured as a course with an authentic learning product that benefits the community. Field studies include supervised training, introduction to scientific techniques and methods, as well as organized presentation of field study results. Students have the opportunity to acquire high school and college credit for the field study programs. Field schools currently include work in cultural landscapes, underwater archaeology, marine ecology, entomology, forensic anthropology, urban gardening, and documentary filmmaking.

Students are connected with leading professionals and researchers from around the world in person and through the Internet creating robust experiences and good practice science. All field programs explore real needs, engage community partners, and produce tangible outcomes that both assist the community partners and further the education of the participating students.

Research
Ongoing research is also key in the organization's interests.

The PAST Foundation supports new research and methodologies in linking field projects and researchers with educational programs in the classroom. Through the PAST/Metro Program Design Center, graduate students build upon their graduate research creating programs that are ultimately published for public consumption. Forensics in the Classroom, the Web of Life, and Growing America  are examples of ongoing, doctoral research that have been crafted into programs aimed at engaging young students in scientific methods and potential, lifelong careers.

Ongoing ethnographic studies of STEM are producing results intended to help schools better understand the universal structure that supports STEM delivery systems and how to successfully grow and sustain the necessary community and public networks that support it.

Research on the deepwater shipwrecks and other underwater archaeological sites have spurred the PAST research team to initiate a web driven database that will allow researchers from around the world to share and compare information regarding historic ship construction details. VirtualVessel.com, currently under construction, is planned for launch by the close of 2009.

Publications
PAST Publications, initiated in 2006, recognizes that large quantities of anthropological research does not reach the public. It is the intention of PAST Publications to fill the niche for small-production printing of student theses and dissertations, special publications, cultural resource management (CRM) firm reports, educational programs, and field studies and research.

PAST Publications has a bookstore that is available through the foundation’s website. Through partnerships with universities, professional organizations, CRM firms, and public agencies, the department now features an array of anthropological master’s thesis, archaeological reports, manuals, journals, and proceedings.

Authors and organizations are also sought after in searching for an efficient and cost-effective method of publishing and printing their work. The relatively new process of inline, on-demand printing allows production of one or more copies without changing the cost. All PAST Publications follow the Library of Congress protocol including ISBN numbers.

title: PAST Foundation