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User talk:Brs165

What I have done around here.

Special:Contributions/Brs165

title: User talk:Brs165


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User talk:Chris84~enwiki

Hi,

Regarding DNA, please use the Russian Wikipedia if you want to translate the article. You can find your translated version here if it's useful on that Wikipedia. Take care! --Gutza 19:55, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

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license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:Chris84~enwiki


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Talk:Samuel J. LeFrak

Violation
While 209.244.172.209's contribution was very nice, it was also a copyright violation (see Samuel J. LeFrak, 85, Chairman of The Lefrak Organization. -- BD2412 talk 19:56, August 23, 2005 (UTC)

title: Talk:Samuel J. LeFrak


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User:RevDave~enwiki

RevDave is an ordained United Methodist pastor, currently serving churches in Emmetsburg, Iowa. He has an interest in areas related to being a spiritual director, using labyrinths and the enneagram in spiritual formation, as well as an eclectic mix of other interests (computers and the internet being part of that mix).

title: User:RevDave~enwiki


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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/BW3 Baseball

 This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was Delete. R e  dwolf24  (talk) 02:44, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

BW3 Baseball
Delete; Non-notable fantasy baseball league Cje 19:56, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom Groeck 21:33, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete ^ Drdisque
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


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Boy Commandos

Boy Commandos is a fictional organization from DC Comics first appearing in Detective Comics #64 (June 1942) by Joe Simon and Jack Kirby. They are a combination of "kid gang" characters, an international cast of young boys fighting Nazis — or in their own parlance, "the Ratzies".

Creation
Simon & Kirby were hired away from Timely Comics by DC towards the end of 1941, primarily due to their success on Captain America, but without there being a clear purpose to the decision, nor title to work on. Finding themselves initially embroiled in the Captain Marvel lawsuit, Jack Liebowitz gave them free rein to create or revamp DC heroes. Initially, the duo created new versions of The Sandman, and Manhunter (both of whom bore strong resemblance to their Captain America work), before deciding that "kid gangs seemed to be the way to go". Teenage sidekicks (Batman's Robin, Captain America's Bucky, etc.) were fast becoming a comics staple, intended to provide young characters with whom youthful readers could identify. Simon & Kirby's own Sentinels of Liberty (later the Young Allies) had already succeeded in this mold, and had an influence on their subsequent creation.

Having already created the "Sentinels of Liberty" for Timely, they now created for DC the Newsboy Legion ("a Dead End Kids-style group led by a police officer in a Captain America-like blue-and-yellow costume, toting a shield" ). Although America had not yet entered the war, headlines and news stories highlighted the role of British commandos, so Simon and Kirby fused the kid gang with the commando, and created The Boy Commandos.

The international group included the French Andre Chavard, the English Alfie Twidgett, the Dutch Jan Haasan and an American only known as "Brooklyn".

Debuting in the pages of Detective Comics #64 (the issue #65's cover (left) shows Batman presenting the gang but they appeared first in the issue before) cover-dated June 1942, the team became extremely popular, also appearing in World's Finest Comics (#8-41, 1942-1949) and were then soon spun off into their own title, launching with a 'Winter 1942' date. The title sold "over a million copies each month", and was one of DC's "three biggest hits" alongside Superman and Batman. Kirby drew around five pages a day of the title, but Liebowitz requested an even faster turn-around - fearing (as happened) that the two would be drafted, as had many other industry professionals. Simon & Kirby hired "inkers, [letterers], colorists, and writers, striving to create a year's worth of tales" (Boy Commandos was also a quarterly title until Winter, 1945). Among those hired was a young Gil Kane, who recalls being:
 * "hired to do as many Boy Commandos, Newsboy Legion, and Sandman stories as I could... they gave me scripts and they would do the splashes and they would have it inked".

According to Jess Nevins' Encyclopedia of Golden Age Superheroes, "most of their criminals are ordinary, either Germans and Japanese or merely human criminals, but there are also exotics like Crazy Quilt, Diamond Hand, and Mr. Bleak, he of the devilish shadow".

Boy Commandos ran until issue #36 (Nov/Dec 1949), and was edited throughout by Jack Schiff. Among the individuals who assisted Simon and Kirby on the title (and its covers) were future-Superman legend Curt Swan, as well as Steve Brodie, Louis Cazeneuve and Carmine Infantino.

Fictional team biography
The eponymous characters were André Chavard from France; Alfie Twidgett from England, Jan Haasan from the Netherlands, and "Brooklyn" from the United States. An elite commando squad of orphaned children, led by grown-up Captain Rip Carter, they fought on all fronts of the Second World War.

In September 1944, the Newsboy Legion teamed up with the Boy Commandos to stop armed and armored traitors based out of New York City.

The team's adventures continued well past the war, even though there were many roster changes. Jan left first, having found relatives in his homeland to stay with. Alfie was replaced by a Texan named Tex. Percy Clearweather, a glasses-wearing genius, replaced André.

It was revealed years later that Brooklyn was Dan Turpin, that André Chavard had become the head of the French Intelligence Département Gamma, and that Alfie Twidgett was now the head of the firm  Statistical Occurrences Ltd. (SOL), with his daughter Twiggie.

In addition to the aligning of Metropolis Special Crimes Unit's Detective Dan Turpin with "Brooklyn", the team have seen print in a couple of titles since the late 1940s.

In the 1970s, during Kirby's involvement at DC, several of their stories were reprinted in various books, particularly those written and drawn by Kirby himself (e.g. Mister Miracle #6 in February 1972). A reprint Boy Commandos title was published in Sep/Oct 1973 under editor E. Nelson Bridwell, but lasted only two issues before disappearing.

The four original members, minus Brooklyn, reappeared late during the run of Len Wein's Blue Beetle, which reintroduced Alfie as the founder and president of Statistical Occurrences Ltd., an insurance company specializing in properties which may attract the activities of superhumans. Using his daughter "Twiggie" as a mediator, Alfie hires Murray Takamoto, an ex-S.T.A.R. Labs administrator (and college roommate of Ted Kord) who'd worked on a "Star Wars" satellite program, which S.O.L. had received a contract concerning its protection. Joining Alfie in this venture are his old teammates Andre, now head of the fictional Department Gamma of the French Secret Service, Jan, now a professor working for the Hague Centre for Strategic Studies, and their former mentor "Rip" Carter, now a general. It was implied that they would eventually come into conflict, along with the Blue Beetle, with corrupt European industrialist Klaus Cornelius, who had already used his influence to disband Europe's lead super-hero agency, the Global Guardians, and was working to resurrect the Boy Commandos' old enemy Agent Axis. However, the series ended before the storyline could reach fruition, and no further developments have been mentioned since then, although Cornelius did make a brief cameo during Kurt Busiek's Power Company miniseries.

They made an appearance in the most recent incarnation of The Brave and the Bold (issue #9, February 2008), in which they teamed up with fellow World War II heroes, the Blackhawks.

Collection
DC published the first of 2 hardback collections of Simon and Kirby's work on the series:
 * The Boy Commandos Vol. 1, 2010, ISBN (reprints Detective Comics #64-73, World's Finest Comics #8-9 and Boy Commandos #1-2).
 * The Boy Commandos Vol. 2, 2015, ISBN (reprints Detective Comics #74-83, World's Finest Comics #10-13 and Boy Commandos #3-5).

title: Boy Commandos


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User talk:Npov~enwiki

Heya, and first of all welcome to wikipedia. You might want to consider chosing a different username, as yours is slightly confusing wrt. our NPOV policy. See Username for more info. --fvw *  19:57, August 23, 2005 (UTC)

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User talk:Cyna~enwiki

Image Tagging Image:O-Sensei bust in color.JPG
Thanks for uploading Image:O-Sensei bust in color.JPG. I notice it currently doesn't have an image copyright tag, so its copyright status is therefore unclear. Please add a tag to let us know its copyright status. (If you created/took the picture then you can use to release it under the GFDL. If you can claim fair use use  .)  If you don't know what any of this means, just let me know on the image description page where you got the images and I'll tag them for you. Otherwise, see Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use. Thanks so much. --Secretlondon 19:57, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

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Talk:Judi McLeod

Untitled
Judi McLeod is anti-racist and has written articles fiercely attacking neo-nazis and neo-nazi beliefs, holocaust denial, racism, etc., and many articles on Canada Free Press and other papers she worked on before prove that.

She is not friends with Paul Fromm (she has never even had contact with him that I can find) or Ernst Zundel (and he was indeed harshly criticized in quite a few of her articles) and is not nor was ever a member of CFAR.

She also wasn't born in 1944 (I think she was born in either '48 or '49, if I recall correctly), but I'm not sure which. I know for a fact it wasn't 1944, though.

Political activist is also debatable and her activism stops at Canada Free Press, where she is editor.

This looks like a poorly done smear job to me.

Hobbes000 19:57, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

 * [[Image:Stop_hand.png|left|30px]] Or an inconvenient truth. First off, McLeod's newspaper has published racist articles including this gem "The admission of Turkey into the European Community will be the final blow to the Christian identity of Europe. Once the Turkish people are free to live in and work, legally, in the European nation of their choice, the problem will not be Paris burning but a deluge of Islamic immigrants into the Christian world which will be unstoppable. If one remembers with horror the acts of Black September, the Red Brigade, or the sectarian violence in Yugoslavia; then, just wait until every citizen of Turkey has a European Passport." The Toronto Reference Library entry proves McLeod was born in 1944. You claim McLeod has written articles denouncing Ernst Zundel, Paul Fromm, etc but these articles are nowhere to be found. Links, please. Or were you hoping you could bluff us? That's a typical Judi McLeod tactic. In fact Judi McLeod refuses to write anything against Paul Fromm and published a short letter to the editor from him. . --Cyberboomer 00:46, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I have put in a request to the editor who added this originally, who is a respected editor here, for his comment on this. Please be patient. Ground Zero 20:07, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Hi IanSeananthony 20:39, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

 * Just corrected a few typos in my first post here on the discussion page. Hobbes000 21:07, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Most of the material in question was imported from the Paul Fromm article. I was not the source of the claims that Fromm was/is a C-FAR member or that Fromm helped her found Our Toronto. I do think those claims are credible, however, based on my own experience.

I do know for a fact that she was friends with Fromm in the late 1980s, I know it because I observed it myself at a Toronto Board of Education meeting I attended (which might count as original research) and I am a witness to the fact that she "covered" a school board meeting she did not attend and was fired shortly thereafter (original research?) but these personal observations do make me think that the claims about her links to Fromm are credible since those claims are consistent with my own observations. I received third party confirmation that this was the reason she was fired, but again, this hasn't been published anywhere so it may well constitute original research. Homey 22:53, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

 * Frankly, I thought wikipedia frowned upon original research, especially such as loaded with bias, unsubstantiated and flimsy as a one-time personal observation as this. What you've done is a made an observation yourself, allegedly, that McLeod and Fromm once kibbitzed.  In the 1980s.  From this, you have concluded that they were friends and that he helped to start one of her newspapers?  This looks to be a very vicious smear job, done by a group (seen on the link you provided before for me below) that has an obvious and virulent hate of Judi McLeod and Canada Free Press.  I can provide verifiable evidence that they hire people of different creeds and colours, that they write quite a few articles trashing neo-nazis, etc.  Just because they are right-wing does not make them a valid target for this kind of vicious slander.
 * You don't seem to be able to cite proper sources for these very serious allegations. Until you can, I am removing the following statements:
 * " She was fired in 1987 after skipping a Toronto Board of Education meeting in which a plan to hold a student conference on apartheid in South Africa was to be discussed. Her column was based on notes made by her friend, white supremacist Paul Fromm, but written up as if she had attended the meeting herself"
 * Not substantiated, original research (from a very biased source), massive inferral based upon one alleged observation and if it's untrue, which it certainly seems to be, libellous.
 * "and (allegedly) Paul Fromm" Alleged by you. Please substantiate.
 * "McLeod is a member of the far-right Citizens for Foreign Aid Reform (C-FAR) having met C-FAR founder Paul Fromm through their mutual friend Richard James, a close personal friend of Ernst Zundel."
 * Please substantiate. The paper verifiably (a google search will prove that) has a very low opinion of Ernst Zundel, whom writers refer to as a neo-nazi nutbar.  I can't find any proof that she's a member of C-FAR, or that she's a friend of, or even had any contact with Paul Fromm.
 * Until I see substantiated, NPOV evidence to the contrary, including (in fact, especially) proper citations, I am removing these statements. I have problems with a few other parts of the article as well, but I shall leave those alone for now.
 * Hobbes000 15:06, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Are there other theories or explanations about why the Sun fired her?Homey 22:59, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Appreciated
Thank you very much. I really appreciate this. Also, I apologize for typos and poor etiquette. This is my first day here basically. So thanks again! ;)

NPOV Tag
Ok, this is still my first day and I'm still learning the ropes, so go easy on me if I did the wrong thing here. Anyways, until this is cleared up, I thought it might be appropriate to add the NPOV tag and then I'll leave it alone until tomorrow or the day after. Hopefully this is ok with everybody. Hobbes000 21:44, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

I've changed it to a "factual accuracy" tag since that seems to be the essence of the objection. If that's not ok we can change it to "totallydisputed" (ie both facts and POV) but since what you're disputing is the allegation regarding her and Paul Fromm I think the accuracy tag is more, well, accurate. Homey 14:46, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Ok, thanks. ;) New to wikipedia, so I have no idea how things work.  I think the totally disputed tag is justifiable, given what we have, for the moment.  I really appreciate you helping me out like this.

Hobbes000 15:06, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

 * If you like. I don't see how your criticisms are actually NPOV, though, particularly as they are isolated to the Fromm question. Homey 15:17, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Well, you would know what's appropriate more than I would, since I am only a poor newbie ;), but if it's not too much trouble to ask, I think's it appropriate. I appreciate that we can agree on many of these issues btw.  ;)  Wikipedia rocks. I should have joined months ago.

Hobbes000 15:24, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

 * There's an online reference to her firing here Homey 23:50, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

FWIW, this blog has some links and info re McLeod. Not a first rate source but given that McLeod is unlikely to be the source of a book any time soon...Homey 14:44, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

 * I checked it out. Interesting blog, but not a good source at all on this subject though I've seen the blog before and it's good for some things.  Frankly, this seems to be a hate-fest that has little to no impartiality.  There are only a few assertive statements there, beyond preferences of dislike and hate and calling her a "wingnut".  And those assertive statements are unverifiable, unsubstantiated and very hard to take seriously.
 * Hobbes000 15:11, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Yes, but are there any useful links in the blog? Certainly the Rachel Marsden imbroglio merits mention (given the Western Report as a source) and the blog may be enough to justify us including some of the information as "allegations" (eg "McLeod's critics allege that....". Homey 15:15, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

 * The links aren't useful. I checked them out.  I left the Rachel Marsden thing up, because I can substantiate that Judi did defend Rachel.  I just googled it quick and found the article.  I removed the 'right-wing' descriptor of Rachel, though.  Which I think we can both agree is irrelevant since all relevant parties in dispute are themselves right-wing (McLeod, Marsden and the Western Standard).  I also have a problem with convicted stalker, because it seems like an attempt to make her look bad, rather info relevant to the discussion, but for now, I will leave it up because that's a minor issue for me.
 * There's not enough on the blog to include it as allegations. It really is just unsubstantiated, baseless allegations.
 * Hobbes000 15:22, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Writing and sources
This is not a good article. I have tried to copy edit it, but it's virtually impossible because most of it needs to be removed as non-notable, and what's left needs to be rewritten and thoroughly sourced. We shouldn't be writing as though we dislike McLeod, nor as though we are praising her. Also, she is not notable enough for an article of this length, and most of it is reproduced word-for-word on Canada Free Press. SlimVirgin (talk) 22:40, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I strongly disagree with you. While several of your comments and changes here and on the Canada Free Press page are worth considering, many are not. You remove valid and relevant information, in several instances for no good reason. You make crucial errors of fact, i.e. replacing the word "publication" with "website" when the articles in question appeared only in the print copy. It is only out of deference to your administrator status that I haven't reverted back to Samaritan's version. --Cyberboomer 21:59, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I removed a lot of nonsense, Cyber. Which parts would you say were valid and relevant? I'm certainly willing to reconsider. SlimVirgin (talk) 22:08, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Where does it say "website," when the article only appears in the print copy? And you said "crucial errors of fact". Can you list them, please? SlimVirgin (talk) 22:10, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Could we have a source for her winning the Edward J. Hayes Award? From what I can find online, it's a prize of $100 that goes to students. SlimVirgin (talk) 00:16, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Here is the source: "Gutsy" reporter McLeod gets the pink slip; William Johnson, The Globe and Mail. Toronto, Ont.: Mar 23, 1983. pg. 8 The award is part of the Ontario Newspapers Association (ONA) Awards Here is a link. --Cyberboomer 21:32, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Have you actually seen that Globe and Mail story? SlimVirgin (talk) 21:54, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Yes. I have read both articles. --Cyberboomer 22:24, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

 * These two articles provide the information you require:
 * Year after firing by (Brampton) paper (McLeods) help to publish rival; The Globe and Mail. Toronto, Ont.: Apr 3, 1984. p. M5
 * "Gutsy" reporter McLeod gets the pink slip; William Johnson, The Globe and Mail. Toronto, Ont.: Mar 23, 1983. pg. 8 --Cyberboomer 21:40, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The articles were listed as sources in an earlier version. --Cyberboomer 21:44, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Thanks, Cyber. I wonder why they were removed from the article. SlimVirgin (talk) 21:52, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
 * https://blogs1.conestogac.on.ca/news/2003/04/journalism_students_recognized.php it is indeed a conestoga college prize for the student producing "the best feature/human interest story". Ed Hayes was managing editor of the K-W Record, he died in 1996 and his widow Jackie established a $100.00 bursary at the college. 65.94.117.142 (talk) 18:47, 30 October 2023 (UTC)

Latest conspiracy theory
Read about it here http://thailandesl.chazzsongs.net/internet.wiki.htm. Alphax τεχ 05:47, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Alphax, I've de-linked the above because it's an anti-Semitic website. SlimVirgin (talk) 05:55, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Um, ok, whatever. So is someone going to add this, or isn't it important? Alphax τεχ 12:20, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

 * I'd say it shouldn't be added. The CFP is not a particularly notable publication and it's not a notable story. SlimVirgin (talk) 16:30, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

SlimVirgin's edits
Some of your changes have improved the article. You clarified the opening section. You rightly added an immediate link to the CFP. You have also polished some of the writing.

However some of your changes are ill-thought out and cross over into the ludicrous.

Your edits contain errors of fact.

 * You claim that the Toronto library link is broken. The link still works. I and third parties have checked it on different computers. The problem might be your browser settings.

 * "In 2005, McLeod and David Hawkins" is incorrect. They teamed up in 2005. A person reading what you changed might wrongly assume that the only articles they wrote together were in 2005.

 * "McLeod published nurse Cathy Crowe's home address and her photograph in Canadian Free Press is incorrect on two counts. It's the Canada Free Press, and not Canadian Free Press. The print version known as Toronto Free Press published the photographs, not the website. The revised version clarifies the statement.

 * You edited passages in the Canada Free Press article to claim that certain persons wrote for the website when in fact they wrote only for the print version. The original article made it clear that the newspaper has since become a web-only publication. HOTR corrected this error.

You claim that the article and the situation are not notable without explaining why. She is an award winning journalist who has written for many publications. Her profile is large as is her infamy. She played an integral role in the 1994 Toronto municipal election. Her influence got a veteran councillor defeated and changed the balance of power on Toronto City Council. It was that election's second biggest story.

I see that your contributions are mostly non-Canadian. Perhaps I could suggest that in future you tread more carefully in subjects you're not familiar with. Three administrators, HOTR, Bearcat and Zanimum, who is also a sys-op, have edited the article. Senior writers Samaritan has also edited the article. One of McLeod's own student writers, Hobbes000 edited the page and his contributions remain.

You removed the Antonia Zerbisias blog links for no good reason. Though it is a blog, it is owned and published by The Toronto Star, a prominent Canadian newspaper. Zerbisias herself is a prominent journalist. We weren't relying on the blog for third party sourcing. We included it because it was part of the story.

You removed the entire "Friends and enemies" subsection without explaining why. This is relevant to McLeod's history as a journalist. If Rush Limbaugh wrote a book defending the Clintons, converted to Liberalism, and smashed Dick Cheyney's political career, this would be noteworthy. In future, please explain why you want large sections removed without resorting to flip cursory explanations. You say you removed a lot of nonsense and call the article a "dog's breakfast". It helps - and as an Administrator you should already know this - if you explain your edits more thoughtfully. If a non-administrator did what you have done, editors would call it what it is: vandalism.

I'm surprised you had trouble researching the Hayes award. I had no problem finding information. In fact it appeared in a google search ahead of your find. The Proquest Canadian news index is available in all Canadian universities and it contained many citations. I have added a link to the article so that there is no further confusion.

Several changes you made to polish the writing improve the article and deserve to stay. Several must go.

 * runs the Canada Free Press website is a clumsy way of saying that she is a website publisher. I don't understand why you removed any introductory mention of her as a journalist. Whether one likes her or not, that is what she is. To reduce it to "runs a website" is missing the point and trivializes her importance.

 * Her columns being highly critical of New Democratic Party school trustees who dominated the Toronto Board of Education at the time. This speaks for itself.

 * In 2005 she engaged in a feud with the Western Standard over that magazine's criticism of Rachel Marsden's suitability to be a conservative columnist because she had pleaded guilty to a charge of criminal harassment, and was sentenced in 2004 to a conditional discharge with one year's probation. A 49 word run-on sentence. This is even worse than the original sentence, especially pleaded guilty.

 * McLeod fell victim to a hoax in 2006 when she believed she had been exchanging emails with Hollywood actor Mel Gibson through a blog purportedly run by the actor, which she later discovered was a satirical website. 37 words in a single run-on sentence. Requires two sentences.

You put the "Mel Gibson" hoax in the "Criticism" section for unknown reasons.

I have sourced The Globe and Mail articles at the bottom of the article per your request. The Globe and Mail and Now Weekly articles were "friendly" interviews.

Several source requests border on the ludicrous:

 * Rachel Marsden's legal troubles: The linked article covers this in depth. No need to verify it here when all the verification one needs - and then some - is available in the relevant article.

I will continue to do further edits, pare down items that belong in the CFP article, seek out and tighten unwieldy sentences, etc. In future it helps if you make writing style changes first. These are easier to assess and other editors often accept them without a fight. Also, if others disagree with your editorial cuts, but like your writing style, they can revert to your first revision.

I must note that David Hawkins, referred to in the article is, like you, a Cambridge graduate. He even won a Foundation Scholarship. I'm sure you'll be even prouder of your old school once you read his articles detailing the international Global Custodian conspiracy. You two should get together and swap Cambridge stories. (Yes, I'm teasing you.) --Cyberboomer 23:49, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

 * First, we need citations for the unsourced claims, because without citations those points have to be deleted. Secondly, you say this is an "award-winning journalist," but we've seen no evidence of that claim, and if you're referring only to the award mentioned earlier, it's a lesser known one. Articles should relate notable facts about notable individuals; if we include a huge amount of minor detail about marginally notable people, we risk turning the page into a boring puff piece. SlimVirgin (talk) 00:01, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * On the subject of notability, could you please explain or justify the length of the following Wiki article Paul_is_Dead? I'm certain you've never seen the article before, but I still want your opinion. --Cyberboomer 02:44, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

 * On the one hand, the article's a bit silly, and on the other, quite interesting. The key in deciding length is that we publish as much as good third-party sources have published. In the case of McLeod, that would be mainstream newspapers, news sites and so on, but not her own. SlimVirgin (talk) 03:45, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Please explain your reverts in further detail otherwise I will revert you again. If so, I will keep the additional source requests you made today. As for my compromise edit, I did provide sources. The Edward J. Hayes Memorial is awarded through the Ontario Newspapers Association. I don't see how that makes it a non-award. I don't understand how you think proper detail might turn the article into a boring puff piece. Do you even know what the phrase puff piece means? --Cyberboomer 00:49, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * And please don't slip a revert in as a (m) minor edit, which you now have done twice. --Cyberboomer 00:54, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The rollback tool tags the revert as minor, not me. SlimVirgin (talk) 04:32, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * You're aware that rollback shouldn't be used except for vandalism? Alphax τεχ 04:30, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

 * You're mistaken. It doesn't say that anywhere. SlimVirgin (talk) 04:31, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Sorry, I put this lot of comments in the wrong place. Reverting. Alphax τεχ 04:37, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Exactly. Please read it. Rollback is not only used for vandalism. SlimVirgin (talk) 04:46, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
 * The award cited was not "awarded through the Ontario Newspapers Association".[no such entity found - the link leads to a dead page for Osprey media group]
 * As this is very old news, I am adding the information for the sake of clarity. According to the Conestoga College Awards co-ordinator[email 11/1/2023], "The Program faculty* were responsible for choosing the recipients of the award." The award depleted its endowment in 2018.
 * emphasis added.
 * 65.94.117.142 (talk) 20:16, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

Response
I've reviewed some of the disputed edits here. And while I will agree that some of the material does make more sense in the Canada Free Press article than it does here, I'm not too clear, for example, on why SlimVirgin seems to object to describing McLeod as a journalist and publisher. I'm not too clear on why SlimVirgin removed a significant number of the listed external sources, and then turned around and claimed there weren't enough citations. I'm not too clear on why SlimVirgin objects to mention of the award McLeod won at the same time as objecting to the description of McLeod as "award-winning". I'm not too clear on why the Rachel Marsden controversy requires extra sources here in addition to the sources already listed on Marsden's article. And on, and so forth. Bearcat 04:12, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The article looked like the vanity piece of a person of borderline notability, and to judge by the 90 edits Cyberboomer has made to the encyclopedia, s/he may have a personal interest in it. I therefore got rid of some of the cruft (some of which was arguably defamatory) and I've requested citations for the most important points. A Google search sheds very little light on McLeod's bio and I can find no reputable third-party sources at all. The award, assuming she was awarded it (and so far only Cyberboomer has seen the source, because it isn't online), is a minor one that she received 23 years ago, in the same year that the newspaper she was allegedly working for at the time supposedly fired her, so to call her an "award-winning journalist" is a little misleading. As this page has been linked to on a few of the blogs that mention her, it's particularly important that we get things right, or else we'll be at the start of a long line of Chinese whispers. For that reason, I would like to see citations provided as requested, or the material will be removed in a week or so, and reputable third-party sources provided for all edits from now on, in accordance with WP:V, WP:NOR, WP:RS, and WP:BLP. SlimVirgin (talk)  04:30, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * s/he may have a personal interest in it Please avoid innuendo. Judging by some of your comments here and elsewhere, may I please suggest that you read WP:CIVIL?

 * I'll read that if you read all our other editing policies and start editing in accordance with them. SlimVirgin (talk) 21:37, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * "and so far only Cyberboomer has seen the source, because it isn't online" Not true. The person who originally added these references to an earlier version must have seen the articles in order to cite them.

 * No worries. I'll be checking them. SlimVirgin (talk) 21:37, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * "is a minor one that she received 23 years ago, in the same year that the newspaper she was allegedly working for at the time supposedly fired her, so to call her an "award-winning journalist" is a little misleading." An Ontario Newspaper Award is not minor. I don't see how being fired renders her award-winning status "misleading". She won the award after she was fired, not before.

 * It's a provincial award won, assuming it was, 23 years ago. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 21:37, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * "I can find no reputable third-party sources at all". If you can't access Canadian news databases, which are available in all Universities, perhaps you should defer to another administrator, preferably one who is familiar with Canadian matters. --Cyberboomer 21:31, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * There are very few third-party sources available and none that I can see that are recent. Yes, I can see why you'd like me to uninvolve myself. In the meantime, please indicate in the body of the text which references are being used as sources for which parts of the article. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 21:37, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Lawsuit
Do we know what is meant by "She was fired in 1983 and sued for wrongful dismissal. McLeod maintained that local Conservative politicians had used their influence to get her fired after she wrote a series of articles about them. The suit was ultimately withdrawn"? In what sense did she sue if she withdrew the claim? How far did the case get? SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 21:53, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Ontario Supreme Court judge Donald Steele ruled January 7th 1987 that the McLeods could raise press freedom ("freedom of the press") as an issue in a suit for wrongful dismissal against Canadian Newspapers Co. Ltd., owner of the Brampton Daily Times. "The McLeods' lawyer, Anita Lerek, said she does not expect the suit to reach the courts for another two years." No Byline. "Press freedom issue in suit" The Globe and Mail, January 8 1987, p. A9. McLeod has claimed elsewhere that the suit was withdrawn for lack of funds. --Cyberboomer 21:21, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

 * The McLeods? Was there more than one of them suing? SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 01:05, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Yes. They both sued. Husband and wife. I take it you still haven't read the Globe and Mail articles I cited? Are you able to access any Canadian news database/index? --Cyberboomer 22:40, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Then why doesn't the article make that clear? What did the husband sue for? Why is this article being written in such an unclear way? Come on. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 23:36, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

"Eccentric" and "wacko news site" quotes
I'm not sure why SlimVirgin has quoted a rival journalist's opinion that McLeod is "eccentric" and the newspaper a "whacko news site." I don't think Antonia Zerbisias's personal opinion by itself belongs here and suspect that it's gratuitous and irrelevant. Zerbisias is a liberal so any opinion she has of McLeod is bound to be negative. My original edit contained a more relevant quote from McLeod complaining that Zerbisias's reportage was a "hatchet attack." OTOH, Kevin Grace's quote is relevant because he's conservative. --Cyberboomer 22:57, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Zerbisias isn't a "rival journalist." You have an odd view of McLeod's importance. Anyway, we don't use sources based on their political views, but on their reliability and notability. It was you who pointed out that the Zerbisias site is run by the newspaper, not by her, and she says on it that they check what she writes, so it counts as a reliable source. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 23:13, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

 * With all due respect you misunderstand my argument. I'll go into further detail after I've had the chance to collect my thoughts. --Cyberboomer 23:26, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Antonia's hatchet is more likelyto be directed at some recalcitrant feta than someone like jmcl 65.94.117.142 (talk) 19:11, 30 October 2023 (UTC)

It is a "wacko news site" full of articles depicting fictitious stories. I took a glimpse on what they wrote about Brazil and it is laughable. They even have an article written by two Brazilians boys who are not journalist and just have an extremely biased and surreal blog. If someone writes anything to explain they delete. Not even an e-mail to the editor is answered and the person is blacklisted which is an honour. Any person with a tiny understandment of what is going on in this world will not pay attention to this "Free Press" - this expression is used to sustain the site is not mainstream media but make no mistake they are not part of the real "independent media". I don't think this woman or this site deserves any attention from Wikipedia. "Reliable source?" please, produce your evidence. Oh, she won a prize. Dah!--Justana (talk) 09:20, 15 November 2014 (UTC)

Proxytouch in URL
As a matter of interest, Cyberboomer, why are you posting links that include the URL of an anonymizer, as in http://proxytouch.com/cgi-bin/nph-proxy.cgi/010110A/http/www.rabble.ca/columnists_full.shtml?x=32805 ? SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 22:09, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * The link came from a third party website. Very sorry. I should have checked the URL first. Thank you for mentioning it. --Cyberboomer 22:33, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

 * For what it's worth... 27 February 2006 block       --Cyberboomer

Letter
Hi Cyber, can you say exactly what the letter says? (McConnell, Pam. Letter to the Editor. Toronto Free Press. April 1997, p 3,4) SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 22:50, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

 * It's a lengthy letter. McConnell explains that she contacted the police and spoke to Officer Bill Blair about the "harassing incident". --Cyberboomer 22:55, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Does it support every single word of "Toronto city councillor Pam McConnell complained to the police that McLeod had sent a photographer to wait outside McConnell's home and take pictures of McConnell's and neighbours' young children"? SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 22:58, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

 * Here is an excerpt from her letter: "A still unidentified man sitting in a car parked in front of an elementary school and my home took photographs of at least one and possibly both of my daughters as they went off to school at 8:30 a.m. this morning. This man spoke to one of my daughters but did not identify himself. I am not aware as to whether there were any photos taken of my younger daughter or of any of the young children going into the school next to my home. I take this incident very seriously particularly since young people were the target. The time and proximity of this incident to the arrival of school children is very alarming. I am asking the police to ensure that there is no danger to my children or to any children in the school." --Cyberboomer 22:31, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

 * It doesn't support the edit, in that case. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 23:04, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Could you please be more specific? --Cyberboomer 23:15, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

 * The passage above doesn't say what the edit said. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 23:32, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

 * The quote is only an excerpt. We could avoid these misunderstandings if you could explain your edits in better detail. --Cyberboomer 23:42, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

 * I asked for a source four or five days ago. You have now posted what I assume is a relevant extract. It doesn't mention McLeod and doesn't say the man took photographs of neighbors' children, which are two of the things our edit said. This article must be edited in accordance with WP:V, WP:NOR, and WP:BLP. It should contain no criticism that isn't referenced to a reputable source. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 23:45, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

 * McConnell also writes, "Please confirm or deny with Staff Inspector Bill Blair of 51 Division at 808-5100 that your newspaper sent a photographer to my home today." McLeod's accompanying article in the same issue makes clear that she sent a photographer to take pictures of the co-op McConnell lives in. --Cyberboomer 23:55, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

 * You didn't say that before. Look, Cyberboomer, if you want to include this incident, go ahead, but you must stick exactly to what the source says, and without exaggerating. It's a very trivial incident, and people frequently complain about news photographers, so it really isn't notable. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 00:45, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Frank
The sources you provided don't say she wrote for Frank. Can you find third-party sources that say it explicitly if you want to re-add it please? SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 01:13, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

 * I don't understand your confusion. Here are the relevant quotes:
 * "Frank editors had decided to do a few cover stories, dateline T.O. During office hours, Woloschuk and I would work together on stories to be filed back to the Ottawa magazine."
 * "Local politicians were diving for cover when Fletch and Yours Truly collaborated on bold stories, like Married to the Mob and Frannie, get your gun."
 * "[...] were searching for a certain gravestone for a photo to illustrate Frank's upcoming Frannie, get your gun."
 * --Cyberboomer 22:22, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
 * --Cyberboomer 22:22, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Note the careful wording: she is saying she helped the person who worked for Frank. At no point does she say she worked for Frank. I also couldn't find any instance of her describing her working on a story alone for Frank. It is always "A was writing for Frank, and he was staying with me at the time. I sat up all night helping to do X ..." etc. We need to find a reference, and preferably a third-party reference, saying explicitly that Judi McLeod herself worked for Frank magazine. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 22:30, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
 * "Worked for" as in "was paid by." Not just saying she helped someone who was paid by them. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 22:32, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * I didn't say she worked for Frank. I said she contributed to the magazine. Note the wording. I don't think any version of this article has ever claimed that she worked for Frank. --Cyberboomer 22:35, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * That's what I mean. Worked for = contributed to == was paid by. Please read the references you provided on the page. They are worded too carefully. Please find a source who says "Judi McLeod (or I) worked for (contributed to, was paid by, was employed by, freelanced for) Frank magazine." SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 22:38, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Worked for does not necessarily mean contributed. Are you aware what kind of publication Frank is? Had you ever heard of or read the magazine before you started editing this page? --Cyberboomer 22:42, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Yes I am, and yes I had. I have no idea what you mean now. If you do something (whatever you want to call it) for a publication, they pay you. You have a financial relationship with them. There is no evidence that McLeod ever had such a relationship with Frank.
 * Cyberboomer, I can't keep on posting three or four replies to you every time to explain basic points. I mean no disrespect, but please read the sources you use very carefully before using them. I'm not saying you're wrong about Frank and McLeod. I'm just saying we need an explicit source for it. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 23:36, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * I agree with you that this is a very simple article and it shouldn't be prone to this degree of confusion. The Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary defines contribute as
 * transitive senses
 * 1 : to give or supply in common with others
 * 2 : to supply (as an article) for a publication
 * intransitive senses
 * 1 a : to give a part to a common fund or store b : to play a significant part in bringing about an end or result
 * 2 : to submit articles to a publication --Cyberboomer 21:55, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Can one of you email Frank, and as them to confirm or deny that McLeod worked for them? I know the former owner of Frank emailed Wikipedia once, but I can't find their contact in OTRS. -- Zanimum 00:38, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Fired
This section is a mess of inconsistency. Was she fired (not in her view) or reassigned? Did she say local conservative or Conservative politicians had interfered? Was she on the city-hall beat or the municipal-affairs beat? SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 23:44, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

 * At first the paper reassigned her. Her husband, the paper's managing editor, reinstated her. The paper then fired them both. Municipal-affairs beat and city-hall beat are the same. Please feel free to consult the Globe and Mail articles. This will make the verification and copy-editing process much easier. --Cyberboomer 00:08, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Please, I insist you take the time and read the Globe and Mail articles. Before this goes to mediation or WP:RFC. --Cyberboomer 22:23, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

 * No, please just write according to what the sources say, with no inconsistencies in the text, and then there won't be any problems. I'm sorry to write to you in this tone, but this is a very simple article and it shouldn't be prone to this degree of confusion. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 00:12, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

 * Is it conservative or Conservative? You've written both. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 00:13, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

 * There's still something about the firing that makes no sense. The managing editor of a newspaper is the person who decides who is assigned to which beat. The editor-in-chief or publisher would normally only override the managing editor's decision in the case of misconduct. So who reassigned her in the first place if not the managing editor? And once the managing editor had assigned her back to the original beat (and how could he if someone else had taken over that responsibility), who overrode him? And for him then to be fired is very serious, much more serious than firing a reporter. I wonder whether there's something about this that we're misdescribing. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 00:33, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

wiki fiddled article
Another fabulous example of a wiki fiddled article, and fiddled most likely by the subject of the article. And wiki wants to be taken seriously ??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.93.96.10 (talk) 00:19, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

No sources for "conspiracy theories?"
The "Work in Canada Free Press" section includes a paragraph of conspiracy theories which are both oddly formatted (a list with each item preceded by a hyphen and followed by a semi-colon) and cite no sources. Who decided CFP "can be best described as the Canadian version of the combination of FreeRepublic.com, InfoWars.com and Breitbart.com?" Are their sources for such vague theories as "Blacks are inherently violent, sub-intelligent people" or "The majority of Muslims are terrorists" or "Any Jewish person who isn't a rabid, neoconservative Zionist is a traitor?" I'd love to see a decent "criticism" section, but this doesn't pass muster. Sadiemonster (talk) 15:16, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

 * I completely agree. If sources substantiating those claims can't be found, the material is just nonsensical. And just because Judi McLeod shows nothing but contempt for all people and things remotely "liberal," there's no reason to treat her article as poorly as she treats everyone to the left of Attila the Hun.Bart Vandelay (talk) 21:01, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Judi McLeod


text:
TV Xuxa

TV Xuxa was a children's program on display day-by-day from 2005 until 2007 in the same format as TV Colosso, on TV Globo. Xuxa ran a game show which lasted from 2008 to 2014 in the same format as Planeta Xuxa, another game show that was a hit in the 1990s.

Children's program (2005–2007)
The first season of the show had a stage in a format almost similar to the Australian children's TV series Hi-5.

"TV Xuxa" presented the segment "Notícia da Hora", the news program hosted by Edna Tureza, Artur Ismo and Felipe Mingau; "Triângulo em Ação", featuring the Txutxucão Gang's characters, the dogs:Felícia Fênix, Dinha, Max Well, Otar, Dongo, and Dona Vânia Catxorra, all walk-around puppets built by Grupo 100 Modos with facial animations controlled by remote control (as Priscilla from TV Colosso); and "Kéka Tóke Xou", a talk-show parody hosted by Bruxa Kéka and Urubu João, in TV Pirata (1988 - 1990 and 1992), Mais Você and Programa do Jô cross-over formats.

The second stage was in a spaceships,as reminds of her career trademark. In the same year, Xuxa completed 20 years on TV Globo and had a special program.

The third and last of the children's program, the stage is now on top of tables.

Sessão X
"Sessão X" was a TV Xuxa section, which airs some cartoons. Some of them are The Fairly OddParents, SpongeBob SquarePants, Stickin' Around, Potatoes and Dragons, Avatar: The Last Airbender, Power Rangers, He-Man and the Masters of the Universe (2002), Sonic X and Dungeons & Dragons.

Game show (2008–2014)
TV Xuxa was reformulated to change public and debuting new format, hourly and attractions. When it became game show came to be viewed weekly on Saturdays with the intention of rejuvenating the public. The program stopped showing cartoons, invested in play, and Xuxa began to receive her guests on a stage designed to interviews and musical numbers. At this stage, Xuxa talked with singers Justin Bieber (outside the studio, when he came to show in Brazil), and Taylor Swift, who put everyone to dance to the sound of live hits "We Are Never Ever Getting Back Together" and "Long Live" (song that was a duet with Brazilian singer Paula Fernandes).

title: TV Xuxa


text:
Talk:Anime/Archive 1

ABe Yoshitoshi
Are people really unable to see the comment in the source basically yelling at them not to change what they're about to change anyway? :p - Korpios 18:11, 22 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Accent mark on the e in anime
Why do people put an accent mark on anime: animé? Is it because of the claim of the derivation from French? To try to look cool (but end up looking stupid)? The accent in Pokémon? Or to hint that the "e" should be pronounced (technically a diaeresis should be used for that)?

--Furrykef 01:50, 22 Feb 2004 (UTC)

 * It's to hint that the "e" should be pronounced. I for one used to think it was pronounced "a-neem" (cringe) before I became a fan. I see this a lot with the word "sake" written as "saké" so people don't pronounce it like the English word "sake". Yes, a diaeresis is the proper accent mark for this purpose in English, but it's fallen out of use and people are more familiar with the French way. I think a pronunciation note in the beginning of the article (like it is now) is far preferable to using an accent in any case. DopefishJustin 00:02, Apr 15, 2004 (UTC)

I've seen an old english (not Old English) translation of a Kobo Abe novel that called him "Kobo Abé". It may be an obsoleted transliteration convention. -℘yrop (talk) 05:58, Jan 20, 2005 (UTC)

Doraemon
Just curious... such an old series as Doraemon should deserve some kind of mention in this article. --[[User:AllyUnion|AllyUnion (talk)]] 11:20, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)

History section badly needed.
This page badly needs a "History of anime" section (similarly, the History of anime page (currently a stub with virtually no information) needs to be expanded). There are but a small number of historical facts on this page, and if it's going to be encyclopedic it needs far more. -℘yrop (talk) 01:38, Dec 25, 2004 (UTC)

Link suggestions
An automated Wikipedia link suggester has some possible wiki link suggestions for the Anime article, and they have been placed on this page for your convenience. Tip: Some people find it helpful if these suggestions are shown on this talk page, rather than on another page. To do this, just add to this page. — LinkBot 10:26, 17 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * I've gone through and applied the changes this suggested. -℘yrop (talk) 18:43, Dec 17, 2004 (UTC)

Lists that are too long
The following lists are getting to be rather excessive:
 * Several well-known Japanese animation studios
 * List of non-Japanese anime distributors
 * The list of "some of" the important conventions
 * Notable names in anime

My concern is that the lists are starting to get in the way of the communication of the information in this article. Comprehensive lists in all four cases might be useful, but they should be in separate articles (especially the first two, which I am about ready to move to their own articles as they stand). Can I get some input from someone who actually knows which items on these lists are of sufficient significance? (The lists in this article do not claim to be comprehensive. They are supposed to be short and by definition should leave out many items that are of major secondary importance.) [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 03:21, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I fully support what you are doing good luck :). I personally am someone who wishes to eliminate any fan oriented misinformation or idolitry (writing statements about how great an author or creator is - something an encyclopedia shouldn't do).

Good luck, and thank you for your contributions to this topic. As for more detailed information it probably should be linked outside this article. Yes I had the little issue with anipages daily, but in general I am fully supportive of your goal.

--Neilworms 16:55, 7 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Long vowels
Most anime-related topics in Wikipedia seem to use kana spelling for long vowels (shoujo, doujinshi, bishounen, etc) instead of following the Manual of Style for Japan-related articles, which recommends short vowels in titles and macrons in content (shōjo, dōjinshi, bishōnen, etc). I know that otaku circles like pretending they know Japanese, but this is an encyclopedia for the general public we're dealing with here and some consistency would be nice. How loudly would y'all object to shifting all articles to their short-vowel titles, and adding redirects for the long forms? --Jpatokal 14:36, 31 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * Opposed because of search engines. Incorrect or not, shoujo is a more widely-recognized Anglicization than shojo, doujinshi more than dojinshi and bishounen...well, those two are about equal, but bishounen has a slight edge on search results.  Yes, we can have redirects to the "preferred" spelling, but that harms the Google rankings (whatever they may be).  Beyond one spelling's popularity over the other (we're also charged with making the article titles whatever is most likely to be searched for), I don't really have a preference, although when I do write those three, I still naturally write the "ou" transliteration.  R ADICAL B ENDER  ★  16:33, 31 Mar 2004 (UTC)

 * The Google ranking argument seems to be a bit of a red herring, since Wikipedia doesn't show up in the top 100 for either form of shōjo... and can you decide if you're opposed or don't have a preference?  8)  Any other opinions on the subject? Jpatokal 06:41, 12 Apr 2004 (UTC)

 * I thought the whole point of having article names without long vowels is because English readers are much more familiar with them that way in most cases (people look for Tokyo, not Tōkyō). Since anime terms are more familiar with long vowels indicated, there doesn't seem to be any point in moving them for that reason. Long vowels are quite important in Japanese so I would object to not indicating them when there's no compelling reason for it. Consistent romanization is a concern, though. I personally prefer the "ou" style more than proper Hepburn "ō" because it's closer to the Japanese spelling and people won't turn around and ignore an extra letter when they use the term like they often do with accents. This kind of discussion probably belongs more on Wikipedia_talk:Manual_of_Style_for_Japan-related_articles though. DopefishJustin 00:02, Apr 15, 2004 (UTC)

 * The problem with "ou" is that, while it matches the kana, it doesn't make sense in English: most anime fans probably read "doujinshi" phonetically as dough-jin-she (or even dough-u-jin-she?), when it should be doh-jin-she. Most English-speakers aren't capable of making the distinction between short and long vowels anyway, so ignoring the macron is IMHO the lesser of two evils.

 * As for the Manual of Style, it's already been decided that Hepburn is the One True Standard and macrons are the One True Long Vowel Indicator, and I'm trying to standardize this in the otaku domains as well... Jpatokal 02:36, 15 Apr 2004 (UTC)

 * I'm fine with that. I just don't like the idea of moving articles to titles with short vowels. shōjo means "young girl", but shojo is "virgin"! DopefishJustin 20:49, Apr 15, 2004 (UTC)

After thinking about this more I've changed my mind, I think it's better that we follow a consistent standard. If people search with "ou" they'll get redirected anyway. I'll start changing minor stuff as I find it and if no one objects, the "big stuff" like shoujo should move too. DopefishJustin 15:59, May 10, 2004 (UTC)

Manga Artists under notable Names in Anime??
Personally I think there should be a seprate entry for manga artist who had influence on anime so that artists such as Go Nagai, Rumiko Takahashi and Masamune Shirow (who people seem to constantly confuse with Mamoru Oshii) should be moved to a seprate category to reduce the common confusion that these artists have amongst anime fandom.

The artists that should be under anime that were also manga artists are Leiji Matsumoto for his large contributions to anime such as Starblazers etc., Osamu Tezuka, Katsuhiro Otomo, and Hayao Miyazaki. All others did little to no anime work with Shirow only co-directing one OVA series

I deleted a comment that was basically unobjective shirow worshiping that didn't get any facts straight siting him as the creator of the Ghost in the Shell film, a film that he had very little to do with, and is much more a product of Mamoru Oshii's philsophies on storytelling than Shirows.

I was just curious what people thought of this idea??

Neilworms 11:53 pm July 27, 2004

Just link it to "Notable names" in the Manga article. --AllyUnion 13:29, 11 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Manga sentence
Currently: Anime is influenced by the drawing style of manga, or Japanese comics.

I don't know, I don't like the wording of this particularly. I always thought, and was under the impression both anime and manga art styles influence each other, and also depends on the style of the artist as well. It is not always the case, I think, that mangaka are Japanese animators animating for an anime. In some cases, the character design is reflected upon the art style of the original mangaka... isn't it? Well, thing I have a problem with is that some anime is produce before the manga, and some manga is produced before the anime. Whatever the character design and art style is selected for whichever is produced first, it seems that becomes the basis for what influences the production of the next anime or manga series, or anime based on the manga, or manga based on the anime. -- AllyUnion (talk) 12:46, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Other comments
implying that most criticizes low framerates and lack of "animation" is the critic's fault for not recognizing different animation styles is pov and apologetic.

Regarding the quality of animation to budget, see this link:. There was also a more detailed article in AWN magazine that's about anime budgets, but the article is locked now and open to subscription only. Usually anime budget is a lot lower than american animation. Even some inconspicuous western series such as Sherlock Holmes in 22nd Century costs approximately a couple million US dollars per episode to produce, a lot higher than Japan production costs. But Sony specifically said they spent much more money to revive Astro Boy, and the animaton shows. Remember Miyazaki said in an interview that he quit TV animation in the early 80s because he couldn't muster enough budget to produce the quality animation he wanted. Hope this clarifies stuff up. Wareware 22:09, 24 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I think there is some confusion in what I was getting at in my statments. I was refering to radical animators who used completely different shortcuts to achieve different effects than most anime. I think that while Astroboy and SAC are a lot more fluid in animation than most anime due to higher budgets, they still use many techniques that are common to anime (though far less than a standard tv show like Naruto). I wanted to show examples that deviated from the norm to illustrate that anime isn't entirely unified in its style (which is a very common misconception). I'm not so sure about the level of deviation from the norm in regards to Astroboy and SAC.

I need an expert to help me out on this, I based the information I recieved on comments from a friend who is an animator, as well as Benjamin Ettinger's excellent anime blog (anipages daily). I need to ask Ettinger to retool this entire article, he'd provide much more solid information than any of us could in regards to production and history of anime, not so much on "fandom." I think a big problem with anime is that knowledge is extremely scarce, and misinformation combined with fan oriented glorification and exaggeration seems to rule the day.

Neilworms01:54 29, September (EST)

People who pay a lot of attention to pages like these...
...should consider joining WikiProject Anime and Manga. -Pyrop 00:36, Nov 27, 2004 (UTC)

Pokémon info
I edited and then removed this: " Several video games, a manga series, McDonalds toys, soundtracks, five theatrical release movies, a couple of direct-to-video releases, and a trading card game (with some cards valued enough to be sold at $100 each) are only the most prominent of the money-making goods.  With more than 300 "monsters" on the show, and the show’s slogan "Gotta catch em all" plastered on every package, there's no end to the market for action figures and character collectibles. There is even a store in New York City run by the owners of the Pokemon trademark dedicated to selling Pokemon-based goods."

If anything, it belongs in the Pokémon article. This article is already a bit detail-heavy. [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 00:39, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)

By the way, I am currently mid-copyedit. My goal is to cut down on some of the excess detail that tends to be generated by excessive enthusiasm. I know from my experience with Tolkien articles that when you are very close to the subject matter, it is very difficult to keep track of how much of the information present may be extraneous. This article, at the moment, is so long and complicated, with so many detailed notes and references, that it is not as effective as it could be at communicating the information it contains. If I cut out something that actually was crucially important, please let me know! [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 00:52, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Pronounciation of "anime" in the UK
"The word anime appears in written form in three katakana characters a, ni, me (アニメ). Japanese pronunciation is /ɑnimɛ/, but in the United States speakers typically pronounce the word as /ˈænɪˌmei/ and in England it is generally pronounced /ænɪmi/." -

As a resident of the UK, I have never heard anime pronounced the way described in the last sentence. We pronounce it the same as in the US. I corrected this, but it was deemed a "random deletion" and changed back. -ObsessiveTougaFan
 * Well, I fixed it. Hopefully, no one will change it back again. Josh 01:36, Dec 3, 2004 (UTC)
 * Sorry; you should have said something in the edit summary beforehand. -℘yrop (talk) 04:38, Dec 3, 2004 (UTC)
 * Oh no, you misunderstand. I did not make the first comment. That was by ObsessiveTougaFan. I didn't notice that he or she forgot to sign it. Josh 04:56, Dec 3, 2004 (UTC)
 * Erm, what i said was directed towards ObsessiveTougaFan, not you. I should have made that clearer, perhaps. -℘yrop (talk) 05:08, Dec 3, 2004 (UTC)

Sub-category for anime series or terms
On Category:Anime, anime series are intermingled with anime terms, like chibi and shoujo. I think that one or the other (or both) should be split of into a sub-category of anime. The easiest route would be to re-categorize non-series articles as Category:Anime Terms, since there are far fewer of these than anime series. -- Khym Chanur 01:56, Nov 6, 2004 (UTC)
 * It would need to be Category:Anime terms, of course, but is that the best catch-all for such articles? Don't many of them apply equally to manga? [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 22:37, 6 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Vandalizm

 * How did yourevert the page back so quickly? Is there a revert button? I've been here almost a year, and I've never found it. -Litefantastic 15:34, 11 Nov 2004 (UTC)
 * Administrators actually do have what basically amounts to a "revert button". For everyone else, the simplest way to do it is to pull up the last good version from the history page (like this, for example: ), edit that page (the old one), and save it, which has the effect of saving over the vandalism. See How to revert a page to an earlier version. -[[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 15:49, 11 Nov 2004 (UTC)

ænɪˌmei?
Somewhere in the main article, it said that in the UK and US, it is pronounced like ænɪˌmei sometimes. So is that pronounce eh-nee-mey? -User:Dara

 * That's written in the International Phonetic Alphabet. æ is like the a in "accent". -℘yrop (talk) 04:52, Dec 30, 2004 (UTC)

 * In australia, where I am, it's pronounced /ˈænəˌmei/, but that is entirely regular and does not need to be noted

title: Talk:Anime/Archive 1


text:
User:Thanatos1

I am thanatos1

I did most of the goauld language article and almost all of the unas language article.

I speak, in order of fluency, English (Fluent), Chinese(not really), Gao'uld(not even close), Unas, Klingon, Spanish, French, and Newspeak, and several words of german.

I was thinking about putting Wikipedia into Goa'uld, but it would take too much work, but if anyone wants to do it, let me know.

resistance is futile.

Goa'uld language Unas Language

title: User:Thanatos1


text: User talk:207.86.126.200

title: User talk:207.86.126.200


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mysterious Order of the Veiled Prophet of the Enchanted Realm

 This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was Keep. R e  dwolf24  (talk) 02:47, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

Mysterious Order of the Veiled Prophet of the Enchanted Realm
This page makes no sense. Gibberish. Fang Aili 20:00, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep - seems genuine info but could do with a rewrite & wikification. -- Zanaq 20:28, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I would agree, but it's so badly written. Perhaps a deletion of everything but the first two sentences (and reworking those sentences into standard English). I've tried to read this article several times and have gotten nothing out of it except that the society has something to do with Sufism. Fang Aili 21:25, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Yes. It's pretty bad, ain't it? When the voting's over a or something should be added. -- Zanaq 21:33, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

 * Keep I think I've made sense of who they are, see newer revision, I'm not particulary interested in this one and it needs a lot of work. Alf 23:23, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Thanks to Alf for taking the time to turn nonsense into something worth having in WP. --GraemeL (talk) 10:20, 24 August 2005 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


text:
August 11 (Eastern Orthodox liturgics)

August 10 - Eastern Orthodox liturgical calendar - August 12

All fixed commemorations below are observed on August 24 by Eastern Orthodox Churches on the Old Calendar.

For August 11, Orthodox Churches on the Old Calendar commemorate the Saints listed on July 29.

Feasts

 * Afterfeast of the Transfiguration of Our Lord, God, and Savior Jesus Christ.

Saints

 * Virgin-martyr Susanna and those with her (295):
 * Hieromartyrs Gaius, Pope of Rome; the priest Gabinus; Martyrs Maximus, Claudius and his wife Praepedigna; and their sons Alexander and Cuthias.

 * Holy Hieromartyr Archdeacon Euplus of Catania (304)
 * Martyrs Neophytus, Zeno, Gaius, Mark, Macarius, and Gaianus, by fire.
 * Martyr Ia and 9,000 with her in Persia (363)  (see also: August 4 and September 11)
 * Venerable Passarion, Bishop in Palestine (428)   (see also: May 10)

Pre-Schism Western saints

 * Saint Rufinus and Companions, an early bishop (Episcopus Marsorum), martyred with companions in Italy.
 * Saint Tiburtius, a martyr in Rome, connected with the soldier-martyr St Sebastian and was entombed at the Via Lavicana (c. 288)
 * Saint Chromatius, the Prefect of Rome and father of St Tiburtius the martyr (3rd century)
 * Saint Digna, a holy virgin in Todi in Umbria in Italy, lived as an anchoress in the mountains nearby during the persecution of Diocletian (4th century)
 * Saint Taurinus, first Bishop of Evreux, Gaul (c. 412)
 * Saint Attracta (Athracht), an anchoress, first in Killaraght on Lough Gara and then in Drum near Boyle (5th century)
 * Saint Equitius, founder of a number of monasteries in the province of Valeria in Italy (c. 540)
 * Saint Bláán (Blane), Bishop of Bute, Scotland (c. 590) (see also: August 10)
 * Saint Gaugericus (Gau, Géry), Bishop of Cambrai and Arras in France, Confessor (c. 625)
 * Saint Lelia, a holy virgin connected with Limerick and Kerry; several places in Ireland are named after her.

Post-Schism Orthodox saints

 * Monk-martyrs Basil and Theodore, of the Kiev Caves (1098)
 * Saint Theodore (in monasticism Theodosius) of the Kiev Caves, Prince of Ostrog in Volhynia (1483)
 * Saint Niphon, Patriarch of Constantinople (1508)
 * New Martyrs Anastasius Paneras of Asomaton, and Demetrius Begiazis of Agiasos on Lesbos, at Kasamba in Asia Minor (1816)
 * Saint John, recluse of Svyatogorsk Monastery (1867)

New martyrs and confessors

 * Venerable Martyr St Rafaela (Tertatska), (Rafaela of Chyhyryn), Igumenia (1926)

Other commemorations

 * Commemoration of the Miracle (1716) of St. Spyridon (348) on Corfu with the Hagarenes.
 * Repose of Elder Sampson (Sievers) (Edward von Sievers), Spiritual Director at Poltava's Monastery of the Exaltation of the Precious Cross (1979)
 * Repose of Archpriest Nicholas Guryanov of Talabsk Island, in Pskov (Chudskoye) lake (2002)

title: August 11 (Eastern Orthodox liturgics)


text:
Talk:Interstate 12

Thank God for I-12!
Whoever decided to build that highway really must have had a lot of foresight. Now with I-10 gone as a result of Hurricane Katrina, it will become the "de facto" I-10 for several years...at least. Long after the flood waters are finally gone. Without it, there would be years, if not decades, of traffic nightmares on secondary highways inland - and Interstate traffic would be forced all the way to I-20. It would also kill the economy. Now if only they could accelerate I-14 in case it happens again somewhere else... CrazyC83 22:05, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

Wording in Introduction
The last sentence in the introduction says, "...in order to highway the unique history of Louisiana's Florida Parishes." Should highway be replaced with highlight? I would have edited it myself, but I'm not sure if there's some meaning to the word I might be overlooking. Stratosphere 20:22, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

 * My mistake, just a small typo that should have said "highlight", thanks for pointing it out. VerruckteDan 20:38, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Interstate 8?
It has always seemed to me that if I am travelling cross country, that it would be very confusing to jump onto I-12. If I noticed that I-10 ran from coast to coast, it seems that the fastest route would be to stay on I-10 and keep going. But as the article points out, it is faster to use I-12 as a shortcut. It seems to me that I-12 should actually be part of I-10 and the section of I-10 that loops under Lake Ponchatrain should actually be called I-8. That way you could stay on I-10 for your entire trip. I do realize that I-12 was built after, but I wonder if anyone ever thought of renaming the two highways. Van Vidrine (talk) 16:13, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
 * This is a talk page for discussing the article, not the subject of the article. --Rschen7754 22:11, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
 * It's just as much about the article as the first post. I even referenced the article about I-12 being used as a shortcut.  The article, however, doesn't mention that if you are travelling coast-to-coast on I-10, that this is the ONLY portion of the highway that you will actually depart from I-10.  It also doesn't mention WHY I-10 didn't initially take this route.  Perhaps there was some political motivation in having it pass through New Orleans.  Maybe you had a part in creating this article, but there are unanswered questions, which I was attempting to get an answer.  By your tone, it appears you are satisfied with this article.  Maybe someone with a little more skill and knowledge can improve it. Van Vidrine (talk) 15:07, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I would assume it's due to the economic importance of New Orleans, but that's only a guess. What I find odd is that it was named as a main interstate instead of an auxiliary, given its short length.  It seems to me that it would be more logical to call it something like I-410 XinaNicole (talk) 05:46, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
 * If you read the article, you will notice that I-12 and I-10 were not originally slated to intersect in Slidell. I-10's alignment was closer to US 90's (i.e. further south) in the original 1957 plan.  And I-8 is already in use on the west coast, so it would have likely labeled I-6 or I-810.74.173.105.47 (talk) 21:50, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

title: Talk:Interstate 12


text:
Juniperus excelsa

Juniperus excelsa, commonly called the Greek juniper, is a juniper found throughout the eastern Mediterranean, from northeastern Greece and southern Bulgaria across Turkey to Syria and Lebanon, Jordan, the Caucasus mountains, and southern coast of Crimea.

A subspecies, J. excelsa subsp. polycarpos, known as the Persian juniper, occurs in the Alborz and other mountains of Iran east to northwestern Pakistan, and an isolated population in the Jebal Akhdar mountains of Oman; some botanists treat this as a distinct species, Juniperus polycarpos.

Description
Juniperus excelsa is a large shrub or tree reaching 6 - 20 m tall, rarely 25 m. It has a trunk up to 2 m in diameter, and a broadly conical to rounded or irregular crown. The leaves are of two forms, juvenile needle-like leaves 8–10 mm long on seedlings, and adult scale-leaves 0.6–3 mm long on older plants.

It is largely dioecious with separate male and female plants, but some individual plants produce both sexes. The cones are berry-like, 6–11 mm in diameter, blue-black with a whitish waxy bloom, and contain 3-6 seeds; they are mature in about 18 months. The male cones are 3–4 mm long, and shed their pollen in early spring.

It often occurs together with Juniperus foetidissima, being distinguished from it by its slenderer shoots 0.7–1.3 mm diameter (1.2–2 mm diameter in J. foetidissima), and grey-green, rather than mid green, leaves.

The Algum wood mentioned in the Bible may be from this species, but is not definitely so.

title: Juniperus excelsa