text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of free churches in Germany by dialect area of seat

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was DELETE. -Splash talk 18:05, 16 October 2005 (UTC)

List of free churches in Germany by dialect area of seat
list is just taking up space. also it doesn't make much sense to list churches based upon dialect area. Abstrakt 18:07, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment In Germany, as in China or India, I believe that it does make sense to order churches in this manner, due to the dialectical nature of the nation. I do not have an opinion, however, on it's wiki-worthiness. CastAStone 18:25, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep Makes sense to me, CastAStone, and I think, like you being unsure, that the default is to keep. Xoloz 05:33, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete I must admit that the by seat part escaped my notice until Angr's comments. That stipulation does make this list absurd. Xoloz 11:32, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. It seems important to me. Carioca 06:27, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, this "information" is completely useless. Most of these churches have a nationwide presence anyway, and most Germans avoid using their local dialect in formal situtations like going to church. The local dialect of the town where the church happens to be headquartered is utterly irrelevant. And above all, the two concepts brought together on this page have nothing to do with each other! We might as well have a List of supermarket chains in Germany by average annual rainfall of corporate headquarters. --Angr/undefined 06:57, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Question. Angr, has the avoidance of using local dialect at church always been the case?  If not, this arrangement might be of use to someone doing historical research.  The reason I ask is that I know there is at least one Church in Illinois where services are conducted in some obscure German dialect, presumably a carryover from when the church founders came over from Germany in the 19th century.
 * Probably not, but this information would not be of use to anyone doing such research, because it's based solely on where the church today happens to have its seat. --Angr/undefined 07:56, 12 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete per the arguments of Angr. --G Rutter 10:36, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete per the arguments of Angr. My point exactly. - Abstrakt 20:28, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


text:
User talk:Waffle Ninja

Hahn Durstig Cock Thristy

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:Waffle Ninja


text: User talk:81.100.129.70

title: User talk:81.100.129.70


text:
Talk:Dafydd ap Gruffydd

Comments
a phonetic transcription of Welsh names would be very nice to have! Isn't holocaust a bit of a strong word for the end of the article?

This statement is incorrect and the link is most certainly incorrect:

"Dafydd ap Gruffudd married (sometime after 1265) Elizabeth de Ferrers, daughter of Robert Ferrers, earl of Derby. Elizabeth was the widow of William Marshal."

THE William Marhsal died in 1219 and was married to Isabel de Clare. His son, another William Marshal, was married at the time of his death in 1231 to King John's daughter, Eleanor Plantagenet, who later married Simon Montfort.

Deleted "Elizabeth was the widow of William Marshal" and incorrect link.

The manor of Folesham, Norfolk came into Dafydd ap Gruffudd's possesion through this marriage and he exchanged it with John Marshal for the manor of Norton, Northampton. (see Littere Wallie 139-140, 142-3). BrynLlywelyn 04:21, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Elizabeth de Ferrers was the widow of William Marshal, 2nd baron, who died sometime shortly before 1265. (Do not confuse with William Marshal who died 1219)

Is he at all celebrated as a national hero in Wales today? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.162.94.173 (talk) 06:03, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Dafydd was pronounced DAH-viTH, with the TH sounding like the TH in rather. Gruffudd is pronounced and spelled Griffith. --174.89.26.135 (talk) 20:04, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Rubbish in this article
No mention of his role in the first Welsh war, also some nonsense about a trap for Lllwellyn the last. It was the battle of Irfon bridge. CJ DUB 14:55, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

 * If you know this to be true, and have a reference for it, add it to the article. If there is "rubbish," as you call it, in the article, remove it. ---  RepublicanJacobite  The'FortyFive'  19:49, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Name
It seems to me that, if DaG's father was named "Gruffudd", and his brother's surname was "ap Gruffudd", then DaG's surname should be listed as "ap Gruffudd" first, with "ap Gruffydd" given as a variant. Sectori (talk) 11:59, 8 January 2008 (UTC)
 * If that was the case then all Welshmen in the Middle Ages would be listed under "A" as each used ap or ab followed by their patronymic as their last name. Such a system would not only go against standard literary practice, it would also require renaming every article about any Welshman of that time and it would also be totally ridiculous; a researcher wishing to find out about Llywelyn the Last would need to know the man's father to find him. Welsh lords, princes and kings were invariably known by their first names, in the same way that other monarchs do and thus they should be listed by their first name first James Frankcom (talk) 20:09, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

"last free Welsh ruler of Wales"
What about Lloyd George? Removed. -- Joey Roe  17:40, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Dafydd's DOB
To explain: Ralph Maud's article is responsible for the notion that Dafydd was born on 11 July 1238 (Maud, Ralph. 'David, the last Prince of Wales : the ten 'lost' months of Welsh history'. Transactions of the Honourable Society of Cymmrodorion (1968), 43-62), based on the assumption that the charter of 11 July 1252 was issued on his fourteenth birthday. It is not a bad bet, but it is hardly proven! Ynyrhesolaf (talk) 19:54, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Execution
I have come across what may be the actual words of the judge:"he [Dafydd ap Gruffydd] was tried for treason in Shrewsbury and sentenced 'to be drawn to the gallows as a traitor to the king who made him a knight, to be hanged as the murderer of the gentleman taken in the Castle of Hawarden, to have his limbs burnt because he had profaned by assassination the solemnity of Christ's passion, and to have his quarters dispersed through the country because he had in different places compassed the death of his lord the king'." -

Not sure if this quote belongs here, or in Hanged, drawn and quartered. --Redrose64 (talk) 08:49, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

'... basely betrayed him'?
AD Carr notes that the two churchmen supposedly implicated in Dafydd's capture protested their innocence (Welsh History Review 19:3 (1999)). The source quoted here is therefore incorrect in that respect. Also, the ref for Dafydd's hiding-place is not given. What is its source, aside from the unscholarly website given in the footnote? If that is the only source, it should surely be removed as OR. Ynyrhesolaf (talk) 23:53, 6 November 2012 (UTC)

Six illegitimate daughters
The text mentions them, but not the section concerned with issue. Is their fate known? --NellieBly (talk) 22:17, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

His mother's name?
Sesena or Serena?

Ståle (talk) 08:33, 3 October 2015 (UTC)

Selected anniversaries - Main page
Hi, just highlighting that if the yellow tagged issue with the references can be resolved, this article would be eligible for the selected anniversaries October 3, which features on the main page. Whizz40 (talk) 19:45, 11 October 2015 (UTC)

title: Talk:Dafydd ap Gruffydd


text:
Francisco López de Gómara

Francisco López de Gómara (February 2, 1511 – c. 1566) was a Spanish historian who worked in Seville, particularly noted for his works in which he described the early 16th century expedition undertaken by Hernán Cortés in the Spanish conquest of the New World. Although Gómara himself did not accompany Cortés, and had in fact never been to the Americas, he had firsthand access to Cortés and others of the returning conquistadores as the sources of his account. However other contemporaries, among them most notably Bernal Díaz del Castillo, criticised his work as being full of inaccuracies, and one which unjustifiably sanitised the events and aggrandised Cortés' role. As such, the reliability of his works may be called into question; yet they remain a valuable and oft-cited record of these events.

Biography
He was born at Gómara on February 2, 1511. He studied at the Alcalá de Henares where he was later ordained a priest. In the 1530s he spent most of his time in Italy serving Spanish ambassador Diego Hurtado de Mendoza. He returned from Italy after 1540 and entered the service of Hernán Cortés as secretary and chaplain.

He accompanied Cortes on the Algerian expedition and, after the death of his patron, it is known that he was at Valladolid in 1556 or 1557, after which he is supposed to have retired to his native city of Seville where he probably died.

With the information given him by the conqueror and other persons who had returned from the New World (he himself cites Gonzalo de Tapia and Gonzalo de Umbria) he wrote his Historia general de las Indias, a work published at Zaragoza in the year 1552. It was translated into French by Martin Fumée and published at Paris in 1578; Augustin Gravaliz translated it into Italian and published it at Venice in 1560; lastly, Juan Bautista de San Anton Chimalpain Quauhtlehuanitzin translated it into Nahuatl. The author relates in the first part, which is dedicated "To Don Carlos, Emperor of Romans, King of Spain, Lord of the Indies and New World", the whole discovery and conquest of the Antilles, Peru (up to the pacification effected by Pedro de la Gasca), Chile and Central America, also the voyage of Magellan and the discovery of the Moluccas. In the second part he tells of the conquest of Mexico, and it is dedicated "To the very llustrious Lord Don Martin Cortés, Marques del Valle"—the son and heir of the conqueror.

Whether through the desire to aggrandize his patron, or through relying on the firsthand information which the latter gave him (Gómara was never in America) or from malice, or for some other reason Gómara fell into serious errors and in many instances sinned gravely against historical truth. It was perhaps for this reason that Prince Philip (afterwards Philip II of Spain), in a decree issued at Valladolid on November 17, 1553, ordered all the copies of his work that could be found to be gathered in and imposed a penalty of 200,000 maravedis on anyone who should reprint it. This prohibition was removed in 1727 through the efforts of Andreas Gonzalez Martial who included Gómara's work in his collection of early historians of the New World (Coleccion de historiadores primitivos de las Indias Occidentales). The Verdadera historia de la Conquesta de Nueva Espana ("True History of the Conquest of New Spain") of Bernal Díaz del Castillo, a companion of Hernán Cortés, was written to refute Gómara. The latter's style is concise and agreeable, the narrative running on rapidly and gracefully, all of which has had the effect of attracting readers to the work. Among other works of his which have remained unpublished are Batallas de mar de nuestros tiempos ("Contemporary Naval Battles") and Historia de Harrue y Harradin Barbarroja.

Works

 * Historia general de las Indias y todo lo acaescido en ellas dende que se ganaron hasta agora y La conquista de Mexico, y de la Nueva España (1553)
 * La segunda parte de la Historia general de las Indias que contiene La conquista de Mexico, y de la Nueva España (1553)
 * Crónica de los Barbarrojas
 * Anales de Carlos V
 * Vida de Hernán Cortés

title: Francisco López de Gómara


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Charismatic Churches in India

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was DELETE. -Splash talk 18:06, 16 October 2005 (UTC)

List of Charismatic Churches in India
Is this list really that necessary? Isn't there already a list of Christian churches in India? And aren't most of these churches on that list as well? I mean most of the churches listed are red links, and the blue links are mostly redirects. Abstrakt 18:10, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Delete Abstrakt 20:40, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Andrew Lenahan - St ar bli nd  23:12, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


text:
User talk:Sanooj345

Stop creating nonsense articles or you will be blocked from editing. Academic Challenger 18:11, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

title: User talk:Sanooj345


text:
John Hartley (tennis)

Rev. John Thorneycroft Hartley (9 January 1849 – 21 August 1935) was a tennis player from England, and the only clergyman to win Wimbledon.

Hartley won the 1879 Gentlemen's Singles title against Irish champion, Vere St. Leger Goold in three sets on 15 July, retaining his title the following year, 1880, by defeating Herbert Lawford in the Challenge Round, 6–3, 6–2, 2–6, 6–3.

Hartley lost in 37 minutes in the 1881 Gentlemen's Singles final, to William Renshaw, 0–6, 1–6, 1–6. This was the shortest final on record and it was reported that Hartley was suffering from an attack of 'English cholera'. Hartley did not compete in the 1882 championships and made a final return at the 1883 championships, losing in the second round to Herbert Wilberforce in four sets.

In 1926, at the Golden Jubilee championships, Hartley was presented with a silver medal by Queen Mary, as one of 34 surviving champions.

Early life
Hartley was born in 1849, second son of John Hartley (died 1884) and his wife Emma, daughter of ironmaster George Benjamin Thorneycroft of Wolverhampton. His parents were both of south Staffordshire industrial business families, his father's family owned the glass making firm of Hartley Chance & Company of Smethwick, while the Thorneycrofts founded Shrubbery Ironworks in Wolverhampton, in which his father became a partner. He grew up at Tong Castle in Shropshire, which his father leased from the Earl of Bradford in 1856.

In 1867, Hartley matriculated at Christ Church, Oxford. He graduated B.A. in 1870, and M.A. in 1874.

Hartley married Alice Margaret Lascelles Murray, daughter of William Murray, 4th Earl of Mansfield and a granddaughter of Henry Lascelles, 3rd Earl of Harewood, in 1875. They had no children.

Career outside sport
Hartley was a clergyman with the Church of England, and he was ordained deacon in 1872 and priest in 1873 by the bishop of Winchester and served from 1872 to 1874 as curate of Christ Church, Southwark in south London. Hartley became the vicar of Burneston, Yorkshire, from 1874 to 1919 Rural Dean of East Catterick from 1891 to 1917 and Honorary Canon of Ripon Cathedral from 1905. He died at the age of 86 in Knaresborough, Yorkshire, and he is buried at Burneston.

title: John Hartley (tennis)


text:
Epping Forest (disambiguation)

Epping Forest is a woodland in Greater London and Essex in England.

Epping Forest may also refer to:

Places

 * Australia
 * Epping Forest National Park in Queensland
 * Epping Forest, Kearns, a heritage-listed property in the south-western Sydney suburb of Campbelltown, New South Wales
 * Epping Forest, Tasmania, a town in Tasmania

 * England
 * Epping Forest District, a local government district in Essex that includes part of Epping Forest
 * Epping Forest (UK Parliament constituency), a Parliamentary constituency for the British House of Commons
 * Epping Forest College, a further education college in Loughton

 * United States
 * Epping Forest (Jacksonville), Florida, the former estate of Alfred I. du Pont
 * Epping Forest, a private, residential community near Annapolis, Maryland
 * Epping Forest, an estate in Lancaster County, Virginia

Other

 * USS Epping Forest (LSD-4), a US Navy ship
 * "The Battle of Epping Forest", a song by Genesis

title: Epping Forest (disambiguation)


text: User talk:69.183.45.190

title: User talk:69.183.45.190


text:
Talk:Ozonolysis

Nucleophile participation mechanism
The mechanistic scheme should incorporate the solvent participation mechanism. For example in methanol, the carbonyl oxide undergoes attack to give an alpha-methoxyl hydroperoxide. This can be conveniently incorporated by an arrow going right in the current scheme. I lack the technical skills to do this. DavidRKelly 17:56, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

1,3-dipolar cycloaddition
It would be better (more correct) to write 1,3-dipolar cycloaddition (in the scheme) and also mention this in the text (which would allow to link to the 1,3-dipolar overview page), or even (2+3) cycloaddition or [2+4] cycloaddition, according the IUPAC rules: www.iupac.org/goldbook/C01496.pdf

Quoting the text: which is hydrolysed to form... I have the feeling, that "hydrolysis" is a fuzzy term. But it is maybe a question of the definition of "hydrolysed"...

Criegee Intermediate is mislabeled
The diagram has the Criegee Intermediate mislabeled. The zwitterionic intermediate (sometimes with the carbonyl compound) is considered the Criegee Intermediate.

 * I confess that although I teach ozonolysis every year, I wasn't familiar with the term "Criegee intermediate", since this isn't mentioned in textbooks I have used (see for example Wade, 6th ed., page 361). However a quick web search gives [this article, and this site is usually pretty reliable.  This states that the molozonide is called the Criegee intermediate, as shown in the diagram. Can you provide an authoritative source to say otherwise?  I will check March tonight. [[User:Walkerma|Walkerma]] 22:47, 12 November 2005 (UTC)
 * The Criegee intermediate is the same as carbonyl oxide. See for example my paper in CPL and references herein. It should be corrected RedAndr 00:34, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the ref. I did a quick & dirty fix on the image, I will try and create a new one from scratch when I get time. Thank you! Walkerma 07:18, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you. I would also suggest to include to the scheme primary and secondary ozonides as synonyms for molozonide and trioxolane. Actually this scheme is correct only for liquid phase, in gas phase the primary ozonide just decomposes to carbonyl oxide and carbonyl, without formation of the secondary ozonide. Such process occurs in the atmosphere, for instance. It could be mentioned also. RedAndr 14:47, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Mechanism shown is wrong
The arrows on the molozonide are wrong, look at the charges involved and the movement of electrons. For the correct mechanism see Clayden, Greeves, Warren and Wothers page 938.

Harries Ozonide reaction
Harries Ozonide reaction article is not up to wiki standards, images missing, mechanism already covered in ozonolysis V8rik 22:47, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Ozonolysis of Alkynes
According to Carey in Organic Chemistry, alkynes can also undergo ozonolysis to yield carboxylic acids. Unlike with alkenes, the only reagents are ozone and then water (no zinc is required). Because of this, it seems that this article should give a more general definition of ozonolysis and then maybe have a section for alkenes and a section for alkynes. Here is another reference.

Carhas0 18:51, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Article Review
- overall: this article is all over the place. there are even editorial comments right in the article! - lead: technically correct, but pretty unclear; doesn't indicate the usual purpose of ozonolysis - mechanism section: this needs to be reworked. in no case can the ozonide be considered to be hydrolysed, which implies reaction with water. the difference between malozonide and ozonide is not clearly marked. the difference between different workup conditions is not noted. the role of methanol, a common co-solvent, or pyridine, a common additive, is not mentioned. the use of dyes is not mentioned. - mechanism diagram: this is a [3+2] cycloaddition between a 1,3-dipole, ozone, and a 2pi olefin. first step: right arrow should originate from olefin. typically, "[3+2]" is written above the arrow. second step, missing arrow from rightmost oxygen lone pair. third step: lone pair should be drawn. - "corrected mechanism": also has errors. sigma bonds never attack lone pairs! - history: why does this section come after the mechanism section? - alkynes: i never see this used. are there sources for this? - what about some more modern stuff? like the schreiber procedure for giving differentially terminated products? or this new NMO-based procedure? nowhere are standard conditions given either... - summmary: good start, but article needs work.

Eugene Kwan 23:02, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

Eugenol
The structure of eugenol is depicted incorrectly in the ozonolysis example; likewise the products of the ozonolysis of eugenol are improperly depicted. This is really terrible and shows this article is not factually based.

128.61.92.32 (talk) 02:44, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. On checking the cited reference for this example, I see that there is indeed a -CH2- missing between the benzene ring and the C=C double bond in eugenol, whose structure is also shown here. The same -CH2- is missing in each intermediate and in the final aldehyde product. Could someone redraw the figure?

Please try however to avoid comments such as your last sentence. It is better to just point out the error and describe it as well as you can. Dirac66 (talk) 03:13, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

 * Fixed. I also scrapped the second copy of the intermediate. There are indeed two such structures, differing in absolute stereochemistry. However, the stereochemistry wasn't included and it doesn't matter for this reaction (they both converge to the same product) so I didn't feel like cluttering up the reaction. DMacks (talk) 03:45, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Good, the reaction is not stereoselective anyhow so there is no need to show both isomers.

128.61.92.32 (talk) 23:18, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

No mention of the kit required?
Article would be improved (IMO) if the kit and use of appratus were described. - Quantockgoblin (talk) 23:23, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree, especially along with a a photograph of typical reaction setup (O2 source, ozonizer, gas bubbling through reaction solution, maybe even the nice blue color visible). We have a whole section in ozone about generators, so a schematic there of the standard lab-bench model would be good also. Not quite sure what you mean by "the kit". DMacks (talk) 01:15, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Need details about second step (workup)
There are scattered comments in the article that after the O3 is used, other chemicals are used for workup, and that depending on their nature, the products of the overall reaction might vary. Most of these ideas are not cited (especially the assertion about which ones are more common). And there's no discussion of how they work (what are the byproducts, for example, or reaction mechanisms) or pros/cons (if there are practical or chemical reasons rather than just standard "different things work best for different substrates"). DMacks (talk) 12:45, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

title: Talk:Ozonolysis


text:
Now with Tom Brokaw and Katie Couric

Now with Tom Brokaw and Katie Couric, shortened to Now, is an American news magazine that aired on NBC from 1993 to 1994. It was hosted by Tom Brokaw and Katie Couric. The show was eventually merged into Dateline NBC.

title: Now with Tom Brokaw and Katie Couric


text:
Hyundai H-1

Hyundai H-1 is a nameplate of a van and pickup truck used by Hyundai Motor Company in European export markets for three related models:

 * Hyundai Starex, (called i800 in Europe, iLoad in Australia and H-200 in the Netherlands) a minibus/van
 * Hyundai Libero, a pickup truck

title: Hyundai H-1


text:
Talk:Distance geometry

Molecules structure
It seems that the term is only used for molecules structure?? Tosha 18:14, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

Applications
Probably, the most "real-life application" is GPS? — Mikhail Ryazanov (talk) 08:18, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Destruction of material by Toninowiki
A series of edits were done on this article on November 11 by user:Toninowiki, who destroyed all references to higher dimensions, which are crucial to the point of the article. Now someone in another forum is telling me that my link to this article is not much appreciated because it doesn't go into higher dimensions. I've restored the material that was destroyed. Michael Hardy (talk) 21:22, 25 January 2014 (UTC)

This article could use a good deal of improvement
There are numerous symbols used in the article that are nowhere defined.

This is a terrible idea for an encyclopedia article.

I hope someone can define in the article the symbols tA, tB, tC, and dij, among others. 2601:200:C000:1A0:D814:9114:E269:A7A7 (talk) 18:51, 28 April 2022 (UTC)

 * They're defined: The times it takes for a radio signal to travel from the stations to the receiver, $ t_A,t_B,t_C $ and d is defined in the sentence beginning Explicitly, we define a semimetric space MrOllie (talk) 18:55, 28 April 2022 (UTC)

Content error
Under “Characterization via Cayley–Menger determinants” it is noted that the following results are proved in Blumenthal's book [12].

Unfortunately, that's wrong. The results presented by Wikipedia only roughly reflect Blumenthal's work and contain errors.

This can easily be checked by means of a simple counterexample: According to Blumenthal, the semimetric space with the distance matrix

0    3     4     8

3    0     1     4

4    1     0     2

8    4     2     0

cannot be embedded in any space Rn, but according to the Wikipedia article it can, namely for n=3.

The Cayley-Menger determinants given by the principal submatrices with elements of the 4, the first 3 and the first 2 lines satisfy the embedding conditions of Wikipedia. However, the remaining three triangles of the potential tetrahedron do not fulfill the triangle inequality.

These misrepresentations of the central theorem of distance geometry are not peanuts.

~

K2357W (talk) 09:24, 2 July 2022 (UTC)

title: Talk:Distance geometry


text:
User:Insipid

I got bored of seeing my username link in red.

title: User:Insipid


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Williams Record

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was NO CONSENSUS. -Splash talk 18:08, 16 October 2005 (UTC)

Williams Record
A small student newspaper, I really don't see the need for an entire article devoted to this. I have taken the time to add it to List_of_college_newspapers. However most of the papers there don't have an article devoted just to themselves. Malo 18:14, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep and Expand or get rid of every last college newspaper. I think as a real media source they have encyclopedic value, that is, albiet minor, above the level of cruft. CastAStone 18:28, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete or merge school newspapers. Andrew Lenahan - St ar bli nd 20:36, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * I would suggest merge with Williams College, except that seems to have more information already. No evidence it can be expanded any further without descending into waffle. Average Earthman 20:38, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Per Earthman's point, delete it then. Dottore So 22:45, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Williams College. I was going to concur with deletion per Average Earthman. But there are two issues: having the information and finding it. When I do a Wikipedia global search on "Williams Record", Williams Record is the first hit, and Williams College does not come up at all in the remaining twenty hits. Therefore if someone actually searches on "Williams Record," they will find it if we have the redirect and they will probably not find it if we do not. (On the other hand, when I do a Google search on Wikipedia for "Williams Record" I get the relevant part of the Williams College article, so deleting this article wouldn't affect anyone trying to find the same information via Google.) Dpbsmith (talk) 23:06, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. The page claims that the publication is independent of the Williams College, so it doesn't seem quite appropriate to delete and merge it with the page of the college.  There are a bunch other articles on student newspapers (w:Category:Student newspapers) and this one does not necessarily seem less relevant than some of the others.  The article certainly has the potential to be expanded and it can easily be verified that it is a legit source of news . Btm 04:36, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


text:
Kettering Borough Council elections

Kettering Borough Council was the local authority for the Borough of Kettering in Northamptonshire, England was elected every four years. The district was abolished in 2021, with the area becoming part of North Northamptonshire.

Political control
From the foundation of the council in 1973 until its abolition in 2021, political control of the council was held by the following parties:

Leadership
The leaders of the council from 2003 until the council's abolition in 2021 were:

Council elections

 * 1973 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 1976 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 1979 Kettering Borough Council election (New ward boundaries)
 * 1983 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 1987 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 1991 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 1995 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 1999 Kettering Borough Council election (New ward boundaries)
 * 2003 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 2007 Kettering Borough Council election (New ward boundaries reduced the number of seats by 9)
 * 2011 Kettering Borough Council election
 * 2015 Kettering Borough Council election

title: Kettering Borough Council elections


text:
Sidney Breese

Sidney Breese (July 15, 1800 – June 27, 1878), a lawyer, soldier, author and jurist born in New York, became an early Illinois pioneer and represented the state in the United States Senate as well as served as Chief Justice of the Illinois Supreme Court and Speaker of the Illinois House of Representatives, and has been called "father of the Illinois Central Railroad".

Early and family life
Breese was born in 1800 in Whitesboro, New York, the second son of Arthur Breese (1770–1825) and his first wife, Catherine Livingston (1775–1808). His maternal grandfather was Henry Beekman Livingston and a member of the Livingston family. His elder brother became U.S. Navy commodore Samuel Livingston Breese, and he also had elder sisters Sarah Breese Lansing (1795–1879) and Elizabeth Breese Sands (1796–1890) as well as a half-sister, Sarah Ann Breese Walker (1811–1882). Samuel Morse was a cousin.

Education
Breese's mother died when Sidney was eight, and although his father remarried, Rev. Jesse Townsend helped raise Breese. During this time, Sidney befriended his distant (and slightly elder) cousin Elias Kent Kane, also a member of the Schuyler family of New York. Under Townsend's guidance Breese entered Hamilton College at just 14 years old, then transferred to Union College in 1816. In 1818, he graduated third in his class of 64 and was a member of the New York Alpha of the Phi Beta Kappa. In Illinois, as discussed below, Breese also read law under Kane in 1820.

Family
In 1823, Sidney Breese married Eliza Morrison (1808–1895), daughter of wealthy merchant William Morrison. They did not own slaves and had fourteen children, including daughters Eloise Philips McClurken (1824–1885) and Elizabeth Breese (1841–1845), and sons William Arthur Breese (1826–1838), Charles Broadhead Breese (1828–1844), (Samuel) Livingston Breese (1831–1899; who served in the U.S. Navy during the Civil War, attaining the rank of Commander by war's end), Daniel L. Breese (1832-after 1860, who was a Lieutenant in the U.S. Army in 1860), Sidney Samuel Breese(1835–1891), Edward Livingston Breese (1837–1838), William Morrison Breese (1838-after 1860, when he was a land agent and living at home), James Buchanan Breese (1846–1887, who would serve as a Second Lieutenant in the Marine Guard during the Civil War), Elias Dennis Breese (1848–1851) and Alexander Breese (1850–1851).

Illinois pioneer
Kane had moved to Illinois following his graduation from Yale College in 1814, and suggested Breese join him after his graduation. Breese accepted, and would become a pioneer of Illinois.

Assistant Secretary of State
Illinois became a state in 1818 and after Kane had become Illinois Secretary of State, he appointed Breese his assistant (as well as continued to oversee his legal studies). Breese also was admitted to the Illinois bar in 1821.

In 1820, Illinois's capital was moved from the flood-prone Kaskaskia in Randolph County, Illinois, on the Mississippi River to Vandalia, on the National Road. Breese was responsible for moving the State Department's records, which he did by wagon. He remained Asst. Secretary of State until the end of the legislative session in 1821, when he returned to Kaskaskia and began a private law practice.

Postmaster of Kaskaskia
By chance in 1821, he was approached in his law office one day by the Post-Office Department to assume the duties of Postmaster for Kaskaskia. Breese accepted and thereafter earned commissions on postage stamp sales.

Prosecutor
In 1822, Breese was appointed as the Circuit-Attorney for the Third Judicial District in Illinois. He served in that capacity until 1826, when he was removed by the new Governor, Ninian Edwards. In 1827, U.S. President John Quincy Adams, a Whig appointed Breese United States Attorney for the State of Illinois. He remained in that capacity until newly inaugurated Democrat Andrew Jackson replaced him in 1829.

"Breese Reports"
Having removed to private practice following his dismissal in 1829, in 1831 Breese also began compiling the reports of the Illinois Supreme Court. These were the first books published in Illinois, and were known as the "Breese Reports". Also during this time under the pseudonym R. K. Fleming he edited the Western Democrat.

In 1831 he ran for the US congress on a platform favoring transfer of all public lands to each state.

Black Hawk War
Following the outbreak of the Black Hawk War in 1832, Breese volunteered for military service, enlisting as a private. He was thereafter elected a Major. The battalion assembled at Beardstown, Cass County, Illinois, and marched to the Illinois River near Peru. After arriving at Camp Wilborn, the Lieutenant-Colonel Theophilus W. Smith (a Judge on the Illinois Supreme Court) resigned, and Breese was elected to fill the open position. Under his command were future Civil War General Robert Anderson and future U.S. President Zachary Taylor.

Further legal career
Following the war, he returned to private practice. In 1833, he was the lead counsel in the defense of Illinois Supreme Court Justice Theophilus W. Smith, whom he had replaced in military command earlier, during his impeachment trial by the Illinois House of Representatives. The defense team also included future-Illinois Governor Thomas Ford and future-U.S. Senator Richard M. Young. Judge Smith remained in office as the legislature failed to achieve a 2/3ds vote required for conviction. Breese also platted an addition to the new town of Chicago, and helped early settler and trader Jean Baptiste Beaubien with his land claim which included the soon-decommissioned Fort Dearborn, which succeeded with the Illinois Supreme Court but was reversed by the United States Supreme Court, despite the efforts of appellate counsel Francis Scott Key and Daniel Webster in Wilcox v. Jackson (1837).

State judge
Following the establishment of the circuit courts in Illinois in 1835, the legislature appointed Breese a judge, responsible for the 2nd Circuit. A case filed in his court in 1838 concerned whether the Governor (then Whig Joseph Duncan) could remove a Secretary of State (Democrat Alexander Pope Field) and appoint another. In a heated partisan atmosphere, Breese delivered a purely legal opinion which upheld the Governor's power. The opinion was appealed to the supreme court, where his opinion was overturned. In retaliation, during the aftermath of the Panic of 1837, Democrats in the state legislature increased the number of judges on the court from four to nine (although the number would again be reduced following the adoption of a new state constitution in 1848), and Breese received one of the new positions.

Justice of the Illinois Supreme Court
In 1841, following the contested legal dispute, Breese assumed the duties as a Justice in the Illinois Supreme Court on February 22. Among the five new appointees to the court made by the legislature, along with Breese, was future-U.S. Senator Stephen A. Douglas. Of the 131 opinions rendered by the court during his tenure, Sidney delivered 34 of them.

U.S. Senate
In December 1842, Breese was elected as a U.S. Senator from Illinois as a Democrat. During his term he was considered a poor politician by insiders because he devoted his time and energy to the official duties of his office and people of Illinois versus the financiers and special interests of the Democratic Party and Washington establishment. Rumors circulated about his possible candidacy for the U.S. Presidency, but Breese was more interested in working for his state. He was an associate of future-President Abraham Lincoln during this time, as Lincoln served in the Illinois delegation of U.S. House of Representatives.

Breese had several accomplishments as a Senator, including serving as Chairman of the Public Lands Committee and as a member of the District of Columbia Committee. He was offered the more prestigious position as Chairman of the Judiciary Committee, but turned it down for the Public Lands Committee, which was crucial for the state in which he advocated for a transcontinental railroad, eventually securing the Illinois Central Railroad for his state. He also served as regent of the Smithsonian Institution during the Polk administration.

Texas Annexation
One of his first speeches was in favor of Texas Annexation, and Breese introduced supporting legislation in 1845, which ultimately occurred later that year. Sidney supported the Mexican–American War which followed, delivering one of the most famous speeches in Senate history concerning of war tactics and opposing Senator John C. Calhoun.

Oregon Treaty
Breese was a Democrat expansionist who was vehemently opposed the Oregon Treaty of 1846 with Great Britain, insisting that Britain remain isolated from the Pacific Coast and calling for the current boundaries of Oregon Country to be extended to the 54th parallel, bordering Russian Alaska. The treaty was ultimately signed, in which Sidney proclaimed his country had been unjustly stolen by the British.

Tariff Act of 1846
He cast the deciding the vote in favor of the Tariff Act of 1846.

Failure to be renominated
In 1849, he ultimately failed to secure his party's renomination. However, bittersweetly, a project he had long advocated and pushed for while in Washington, the Illinois Central Railroad, was approved as he left office.

Illinois Central Railroad
Starting in 1835, Breese began lobbying for a railroad connecting the Illinois and Michigan Canal with the lower Mississippi River and ultimately the Pacific Ocean. Upon arriving in Washington, one of his first acts was to introduce legislation, which was passed in 1844, providing for the examination of the possibility of a naval depot and shipyard at the confluence of the Ohio and Mississippi Rivers, This would encourage the government to authorize land for the railroad by having a governmental interest in connecting the depot with the Great Lakes. In 1846, Breese offered another bill requesting the government grant Illinois land to construct the road, which as the Chairman of the Public Lands Committee, Breese made the first full report ever made to Congress on the subject. In the report, Breese urged the importance of the railroad, which would connect the country coast-to-coast in four days, China and the American Atlantic cities in 30 days, China-to-Great Britain in 45 days, and the world with America in 30 days.

Sidney offered two more extensive reports in 1848, including constitutional analysis of Senator Douglas's bill in support of the railroad. The railroad bills were consolidated with a bill from Senator King, passed, and signed by President Millard Fillmore in 1850, shortly after Sidney left office. In 1851, the Illinois Central Railroad Company was charted by the State of Illinois, and received the land grants from the federal government.

For his efforts, Breese is remembered as the "father of the Illinois Central Railroad".

Speaker of the Illinois House of Representatives
In 1850, Breese was elected to the Illinois House of Representatives, where he was immediately elevated to the position of speaker. He served a term there, leaving in 1852.

Return to private practice
Breese left the assembly in 1852 and returned to private legal practice, as well as served as a director of the Ohio and Mississippi Railroad Company. His name was offered as a nomination for Governor of Illinois at numerous conventions, while talk continued of his possible candidacy for the U.S. Presidency, including in 1868, when some thought he could have won for the Democrats.

Illinois judicial service
Breese rejected a nomination to the Illinois Supreme Court in 1853, and many speculated he wanted to return to the U.S. Senate. However, legislators forced him back into judicial service. Breese accepted an appointment as a Judge on the Circuit Court in 1855, before being elected to the Illinois Supreme Court as an associate justice in 1857. He would serve the rest of years on the bench of that court, including stints as the Chief Justice during multiple terms. By 1850, Breese was living in Carlyle, Illinois, the county seat of Clinton County, Illinois, and relatively centrally located within the state.

Civil War
During the 1860 U.S. Presidential election, Breese was by then an elder statesmen of the Democratic Party. As the American Civil War loomed, Breese was a Peace Democrat who was strongly pro-states' rights, but opposed secession. Two of his sons served in the Union Army and Navy. As the war raged on, in 1863, Breese proposed radical amendments to the Constitution for the inevitable reconstruction process that would follow the war, one which promised non-interference with slavery. The amendments also included a complete overhaul of the federal election system, including how the President was elected, and enumerating a new power for the Senate to be the court of last resort for states' rights issues or for the constitutionality of a law to be decided. The amendments were presented to the pro-peace Chicago Times for publication, but the editor deemed them too radical.

Author
The transcontinental railroad that Breese had advocated as a Senator was completed. In 1869, Breese published a volume on Illinois history, and another Origin and History of the Pacific Railroad.

Death and legacy

Breese died in Pinckneyville, Illinois, on June 27, 1878.

A philanthropist who gave his earnings to every church denomination and many worthy causes, Breese accumulated little personal wealth. He was later also remembered for inflexible justice which prevented corruption from ever reaching the court he sat on. Breese encouraged young people studying law, and was noted as being a man who has "a tear for pity, and a hand open as day to melting charity". The Illinois State Historical Society has "The Sidney Breese Papers", which consist of the letters and papers belonging to Breese, including personal letters from U.S. Senator Stephen A. Douglas, U.S. President Martin Van Buren, Lincoln's Secretary of War Simon Cameron, Illinois Governor John Reynolds, U.S. Ambassador to Spain Gustav Körner, and U.S. Secretary of State Lewis Cass, among many others.

The town of Breese, Illinois, is named in his honor.

title: Sidney Breese


text:
VPD

VPD may refer to:

Science and technology

 * Vaccine-preventable diseases
 * Vapour phase decomposition, a method used in the semiconductor industry
 * Vapour-pressure deficit, a measure of the difference between air humidity and saturation

Computing

 * Virtual private database, masks data in a larger database
 * Virtual product development, developing and prototyping products in a completely digital 2D/3D environment
 * Vital Product Data, in computer hardware or in AIX Object Data Manager terminology

Other uses

 * Vancouver Police Department

title: VPD


text:
Talk:SMPTE color bars

When
When was introduced the SMPTE color-bar test pattern?

The original color test pattern generator was developed by RCA circa 1951.

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/2f/b4/90/ed6fcccbba109f/US2742525.pdf — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.91.176.10 (talk) 00:05, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

 * Developed by Al Goldberg of CBS Laboratories. Adopted by SMPTE in 1978.

 * Well, the article says the color bars started in the 1980's. But, I had never seen a TV station sign-off with color bars where I lived, but this happens on occassion from some Indianapolis TV stations in the overnight hours for no reason.

Why are the color bars apparently so restrictively licensed? Even if I made a piece of art using it, released under GNU licensing, it'd be illegal from what I can tell. Thats messed up. Bars of color on a site that uses the word free alot, near-totally unusable. Where is this world going to? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.81.58.56 (talk • contribs) 15:09, 12 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Where did you get that idea? While the SMPTE document itself is copyrighted (you can buy it from the  SMPTE website), and SMPTE might impose restrictions on the use of their name; I'm not aware of any patents one must license--from SMPTE or anyone else--to implement SMPTE bars.  Certainly, color bars are not copyrightable subject matter (as the colors used are determined entirely by technical considerations, and are not the expression of an author, they fall under the scenes a faire exception to copyright law).  I work in the video industry, and I've never heard of any restrictive licensinc on SMPTE colorbars.  And my employer produces several products which generate them.  --EngineerScotty 03:10, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Other color bars
While the SMPTE bars are interesting and useful; especially in NTSC land; there are other color bars signals that are useful:

 * Plain old 100% and 75% bars
 * The newer colorbar standard from SMPTE (can't remember the number) intended for high definition television systems

Perhaps the article should be renamed color bars, and its scope expanded. Thoughts? --EngineerScotty 03:13, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Why the focus on NTSC?
These bars are widely used, not just for NTSC signals. On shoots, whether PAL or Digital (SD or HD), they are used to calibrate the monitors. I would suggest removing the references to NTSC in the article, which suggest that these bars are somehow specific to NTSC while they are not. Reading the article, I had the impression these bars would not be useful for PAL, which is obviously wrong.

Were they originally designed with NTSC in mind? If so, a mention of that fact near the end of the article would be enough.

I will come back later to see if someone has commented on this. If not, I will try to edit the article by removing the NTSC references. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Milivoj (talk • contribs) 15:36, 25 March 2006
 * This is about SMPTE color bars, which includes tests that are NTSC-specific. The NTSC references should remain in this article.  Denelson83  22:17, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Color Bars in Pop Culture

 * Elliott Smith wrote a song titled "Color Bars". There is no indication that there is a connection between the song and SMPTE color bars —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.230.161.1 (talk • contribs) 04:59, 7 June 2006

 * In the music video Video Killed the Radio Star by The Buggles, the female singers' costumes include a 100% color bar pattern on their belt buckles.

The 1000 Hz Sound clip
The sound clip's format should be changed into a more user feiendly version like mp3 or something. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.149.149.200 (talk • contribs) 19:54, 18 November 2006

The sound clips on Wikipedia are in Ogg Vorbis format. This is an open source format similar to MP3. To play an Ogg Vorbis file, a suitable media player will be needed, see. Winamp is the best known freeware player for.ogg files. --Ianmacm 11:57, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

That 1000MHz sound is also used to "bleep" offensive stuff, right? Curvebill 23:03, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
 * 1000 Hz. --  Denelson83  05:15, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Waveform monitor picture requested
to better illustrate "this sequence of bars thus appears on a waveform monitor in luminance mode as a downward staircase from left to right." in the Useage section. --Thomprod (talk) 01:31, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

 * Is this (figure 2) the sort of thing that you had in mind?-- ♦Ian Ma c M♦  (talk to me) 11:01, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

 * Yes, that would do nicely. Can you please upload it and add it to the article? --Thomprod (talk) 01:25, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * He can't, because it would be a copyvio. --  Denelson83  03:21, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

 * Since an image here would need to comply with WP:NFCC, as the saying goes, here is one I made earlier. This shows color bars in a software oscilloscope.-- ♦Ian Ma c M♦  (talk to me) 20:37, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It would be nice to have the luminance value of each of the bars (gray is 77 IRE -- I have to get out Ennes to look up the rest). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.12.176.20 (talk) 17:56, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

 * I have added the luminance values obtained directly from Ennes, as well as a link to the Tektronix pdf on NTSC video measurements where there are plenty of scope shots. Some web sites give erroneous luminance values for color bars. Ennes and Textronix are in agreement (yellow = 69 IRE, etc.) and I consider them authoritative. Chris319 (talk) 20:55, 24 June 2016 (UTC)

HD Bars and Studio Swing
Confining the color-bar values to the studio swing range of 16 to 235, we get (0.75 x (235-16)) + 16, or 180. The magenta bar, for example, consists of R = 180, G = 16, B = 180. 100% white is thus equal to 235.

The pluge values would then be:

+2 * ((235-16)/100)+16 = 20 (R = 20, G = 20, B = 20) for +2%.

+4 * ((235-16)/100)+16 = 25 (R = 25, G = 25, B = 25) for +4%. (SD)

-2 * ((235-16)/100)+16 = 12 (R = 12, G = 12, B = 12) for -2%. (HD)

See SMPTE RP 219 Fig. 3-9 and paragraphs 4.3, 4.31 and 4.32.

Chris319 (talk) 06:01, 16 October 2016 (UTC)
 * This is called superblack or toeroom or blacker than black. 2A00:1370:812D:F205:C0A5:95D7:D09C:EE8C (talk) 14:34, 18 April 2021 (UTC)

Inaccurate
The illustration of HD bars does not conform to SMPTE RP 219.

As stated above, the primary and secondary RGB values should be either 16 or 180. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.1.203.20 (talk) 11:58, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

Again, Denelson has posted an image of SMPTE color bars which he wrongly claims are RP 219 conformant but which are grossly out of RP 219 spec. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.228.2.244 (talk) 10:40, 24 October 2019 (UTC)
 * No, Denelson posted a pattern, in that "colours calculated to make RGB(0,0,0) correspond to -2% black, or "blacker-than-black." That is of course wrong, since no superblack values are possible in full range. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SMPTE_Color_Bars_16x9.svg also, obviously 180 and 16 values are for limited range RGB. And his ones are full range. 2A00:1370:812D:F205:C0A5:95D7:D09C:EE8C (talk) 13:48, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
 * This guy also confirms that those bars are recalculated, so I am going to add that info. https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1361635#post1361635 2A00:1370:812D:F205:483:61BE:52C6:8DA0 (talk) 10:43, 19 April 2021 (UTC)

doom9 is not a standards-setting body.

This article is about SMPTE color bars which are codified in SMPTE RP 219, where no distinction is made between "full" and "limited" range. Per BT.601 and BT.709, 8-bit luma levels are confined to the range 16 - 235. There is no provision for a 0 - 255 luma range in BT.601, BT.709 or RP 219. In digital video the values of 0 and 255 are reserved for sync. Having picture data at 0 or 255 would wreak havoc with the video signal.

If you're talking about sRGB, that is a separate standard and belongs in a separate article.

The SMPTE and EBU standards are authoritative, not what some guy on a web site says. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.91.176.10 (talk) 2021-07-24T19:00:14 (UTC)
 * PNG does not use sRGB. It has a gAMA chunk. As for your point about full range... Here full range RGB is used in PNG file and original SVG. Valery Zapolodov (talk) 11:14, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

This article is about the television test signal, not computer graphics formats such as png. Read the first sentence of the article:

SMPTE color bars are a television test pattern used where the NTSC video standard is utilized, including countries in North America.
 * "In digital video the values of 0 and 255 are reserved for sync" Actually only for limited range, neither full range YCbCr, nor full range RGB have that problem. Valery Zapolodov (talk) 14:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)

To reiterate: This article is about SMPTE color bars which are codified in SMPTE RP 219 where no provision is made for "full" range. Per BT.601 and BT.709, 8-bit luma levels are confined to the range 16 - 235. There is no provision for a 0 - 255 luma range in BT.601, BT.709 or RP 219. Your exception for a non-existent "full-range" video standard is invalid. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.91.176.10 (talk) 22:13, 6 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, there is none. Full range YCbCr does exist though. Still, I was talking about full range RGB. Valery Zapolodov (talk) 12:30, 15 January 2022 (UTC)
 * BTW, I was wrong. The bars are not recalculated. I also updated them fixing wrong -I, +Q signals and fixing ramp. Ramp must have 100% white region. Valery Zapolodov (talk) 21:05, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

If we agree that full-range (0 - 255) signals are not part of the SMPTE RP 219 spec then why are we including them in an article about SMPTE color bars? In SMPTE RP 219 and subsequent ARIB specs all signals are confined to the 16 - 235 range. This article is not about sRGB, PNG or doom9.
 * We should only show the signals indicated on the standard. But providing approximate sRGB values for the sake of illustration  is not problematic I think. Limited vs full-range discussion should be moved to a specific article.4throck (talk) 23:50, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Agreed that we should stick to the SMPTE standard. sRGB is not a video standard so why are we dealing with this non-standard approximation in this article? sRGB bars should be in the sRGB article, but is there even a standard for sRGB color bars? I think it IS problematic to have sRGB bars in this article because you are documenting a true standard and a pseudo non-standard side by side which is potentially confusing and ambiguous. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.91.176.10 (talk) 22:48, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

 * Mention to sRGB makes sense on the images, if we wish to illustrate the bars on a properly calibrated screen. Other than that it's "original research" and really unsupported by references.
 * Took the liberty of removing that column from the table, but kept the colors (now on the first column background) for illustrative purposes. Also added a better caption to images (I hope) mentioning the diferent color spaces. 4throck (talk) 23:45, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Check the background colors in the first column with a color picker program. Viewed with Chromium, Firefox or Edge the colors range from 0 - 191 per the codes you have entered, but the numbers in the 2nd column range between 16 - 180 which is correct. The background colors in the 1st column do not agree with the RGB values in the 2nd column. There is no explanation of this and you've created a confusing mess. I think it is best to leave these "sRGB approximations" out of it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.91.176.10 (talk) 23:01, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
 * The first column has limited range R'G'B' (Studio) using BT.1886 EOTF. The sRGB is always full range in PNG and that is what you see in Chrome, obviously. Wow. "The background colors in the 1st column do not agree with the RGB values in the 2nd column" they were not supposed to, morover they also are from YCbCr 8 bit, so additional off-by-ones were done by me. "sRGB approximations" they are not approximations. They are precise. Just you may want to switch your BT.709 primaries display to EOTF of BT.1886 and it will be perfect. But BT.1886 is complex, it may be 2.2 gamma on LCD display and here you get sRGB, except for linear part. As for sRGB when you color pick you are supposed to color pick the R'G'B', not caring for its transfer or primaries. It does not happen that way, except on android on recent galaxy S21, for example. I will also point out that this is reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5tcHp1kBmQ (on 0:21). It has correct 100% white part and both +Q and -I are correct. My galaxy devices apply BT.1886 transfer to the picture on display. This is also correct and has a lonk to githib script. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAWGwhC1VVw Valery Zapolodov (talk) 04:36, 27 February 2022 (UTC)

Valery: No offense intended, but it is clear from your remarks that you do not understand some basic concepts: 1. SMPTE color bars are a standard for video, not for computer graphics. As such, concepts of sRGB and PNG do not enter the discussion. 2. As a test signal, color bars are display independent. Therefore, EOTF is not a consideration for the signal itself. The signal is agnostic with regard to transfer characteristic. This is where it becomes clear that you do not understand the role of color bars in the video signal chain. 3. Not being device- or display-dependent, how your galaxy device displays them is irrelevant. 4. There is no standardized test signal for sRGB and if there were, it wouldn't be relevant to this article. You can ignore these points and continue to argue to the contrary, but by so doing you continue to reveal that you are in over your head in this discussion. Again, no offense intended. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.91.176.10 (talk) 19:24, 28 February 2022 (UTC)
 * "SMPTE color bars are a standard for video, not for computer graphics." Yes, but Apple for example does everything correctly by color managing the transfer and primaries as everyone is supposed to. My main display supports BT.1886 too in HW. "signal is agnostic with regard to transfer characteristic." No, it is not. The signal is supposed to use BT.1886. "There is no standardized test signal for sRGB" There is none, but we are forced to use sRGB in CSS. Were it PNG image we could have tagged it as gAMA chunk 2.4 but we cannot. Valery Zapolodov (talk) 10:16, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
 * "The signal is supposed to use BT.1886."
 * This is another unwarranted assumption on your part, Valery. Nowhere in the RP-219 specification is BT.1886 mentioned. 172.91.176.10 (talk) 15:21, 27 March 2022 (UTC)
 * BT.1886 only came in 2006, 4 years after RP 219:2002. 2A00:1370:8184:164:B0F7:6BD5:B11E:E81D (talk) 05:04, 12 April 2022 (UTC)
 * "Yes, but Apple for example does everything correctly by color managing the transfer and primaries as everyone is supposed to." Apple does not set standards for the video industry. Again you are conflating video and computer graphics, revealing your ignorance of video. There is no "yes but Apple" about it, no PNG and no sRGB. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.184.247.128 (talk) 18:37, 30 May 2022 (UTC)
 * "Apple does not set standards for the video industry" In fact it did at least create the Display P3: P3-D65 +sRGB transfer (all photos and all screenshots) which is now also used by my Galaxy S21 FE, S22 (screenshots only). All HDR Blu-rays target P3-D65 + PQ transfer but that is Dolby + SMPTE tech. As for Dolby Vision Apple also more or less created their own HLG Dolby Vision. Please note that I am not saying that Apple did create a lot of standards, I am only saing it follows them, that cannot be said about most of the world. 2A00:1370:8184:54CA:71A0:7D29:2D84:BA9F (talk) 23:12, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
 * What are you talking about ? Do you use a signal analyzer to test your phone's TV output ? What's the relation between your phone and video ?
 * If you wish to analyze color profile display conformance, you don't use SMPTE color bars. You use other patterns with a Tristimulus colorimeter... 4throck (talk) 08:17, 2 June 2022 (UTC)
 * You do not need signal analyser on your phone, which BTW are more color accurate than most displays in the world, even older reference ones, galaxy s series and iPhones. You did not know that? Shame. Both support TrueTone, which is mandatery for SDR, be it sRGB or BT.709 (PQ is really absolute). You can just use ffplay -vf extractplanes=y and color picker like Pixolor, that you can take a mod apk from 4pda or buy here: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.embermitre.pixolor.app 212.248.24.235 (talk) 07:17, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

Digital values with references
After some searching, I was able to find references for digital values, for both SD and HD 100% and 75% bars.
 * https://www.leaderamerica.com/pdf/vol03_no04.pdf
 * https://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/bt/R-REC-BT.1729-0-200504-I!!PDF-E.pdf

The first document shows the usage of signal analyzers (LV5100 for SD - http://www.valtechvideo.com/partneri/leader/LV5100D.pdf and LV5152 DA for HD - https://assets.tequipment.net/assets/1/26/Documents/Leader/lv-5152da_manual.pdf) with SD and HD patterns. Both SD and HD values for 75% and 100% bars are explicitly listed. Here's the explanation provided for the values shown:

For digital video sources, the 10-bit YCbCr values for color bars are diferent depending if we have a SD or HD signal. SD values are based on the SMPTE formula for Y from the NTSC system ( Y = 0.299R + 0.587G + 0.114B). HD values are according to SMPTE RP-177 and 274M ( based on the formula Y= 0.2126R + 0.7152G + 0.722B)

Note: Values sourced from "Leader Teleproduction Test Volume 3 Number 4 - Digital Video Levels" ; also matching Recommendation ITU-R BT.1729 (2005) for 100% SD and HD bars

I'll eventually update the article with this information (currently sourced from a blog...), but for now I'm adding it here for easy reference. 4throck (talk) 07:49, 31 May 2022 (UTC)

 * >currently sourced from a blog...
 * As I already said it is not sourced from the blog (which is actually a good article, I would argue). The blog is only secondary source that is required to represent the standard by Wikipedia policy. In fact you can get the standard from sci-hub. The problem with your table is that the standard only specifies HD (so BT.709 limited matrix). Which is the only thing described here. Also #page=18 and other such are not allowed in the URL, that is Chrome extension. 2A00:1370:8184:54CA:71A0:7D29:2D84:BA9F (talk) 23:18, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Contrary to what you say, the first source explains the usage of signal analyzers (LV5100 for SD - http://www.valtechvideo.com/partneri/leader/LV5100D.pdf and LV5152 DA for HD - https://assets.tequipment.net/assets/1/26/Documents/Leader/lv-5152da_manual.pdf) with SD and HD patterns. Both SD and HD values for 75% and 100% bars are explicitly listed.
 * The second source is a ITU standard. It only considers 100% bars but shows both SD and HD values, that match the first source.
 * These references are solid, and the values are original 10-bit YCbCr - not calculated or transformed in any way. This is what's needed for Wikipedia.
 * The problem with the blog is that the original values are never cited and it only shows personal calculations (using MathCAD ?), so it's not a good reference. 4throck (talk) 08:06, 2 June 2022 (UTC)
 * >Contrary to what you say, the first source explains the usage of signal analyzers
 * There is is nothing contrary to what I said. Again, SMPTE (not ITU) standard only discusses HD values while it says SD is just autoconverted. I do not think that ITU standard should be put here. One mention of it is enough. It is publicly available after all. Are you going to add BT.2020nc matrix too? What about BT.2111 PQ and HLG values (suddenly they remembered HDR has too different of a transfer, wow)? What about the correction for BT.2020 primaries they also did a mistake about? We cannot put it all here, can we? All the links to all of those public though and in the article!
 * >The problem with the blog is that the original values are never cited and it only shows personal calculations (using MathCAD ?), so it's not a good reference
 * Were it an actual blog, it would not even be considered as WP:RS. But it is not really a blog or even a blog of a company. Those are actual good articles THAT show how the standard derived 10 bit values using BT.709 spec's .xx notation, they also have some research into what SDR white in HDR should be, so I consider them notable. http://blog.videoq.com/2019/08/20/unified-hdr-reference-white/ Also what about MathCAD? You want it to be done in LaTeX and calculated in Wolfram Mathematica? The fact is I checked those values are the same as in SMPTE standard (when you convert .xx notation in the way 709 specifies), so what is the problem? You think this is original research from me? Well, the article does mention this is 100/0/75/0 (yes!) “EBU Bars” (sic!) so I would think that this is obviously SMPTE standard? 2A00:1370:8184:1B49:5070:FC27:5212:D052 (talk) 23:02, 3 June 2022 (UTC)
 * You can insert your table, but please do not delete my tables. Please, thank you. 212.248.24.235 (talk) 07:18, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

All you have to do is read SMPTE RP 219. The values are spelled out explicitly and unambiguously in Fig. 3-2 for both 10-bit and 8-bit systems. The test signal is agnostic with respect to display hardware, BT.709, BT.601, BT.1886, BT.2020, sRGB, PNG, EOTF, OETF, "full range", some blog on the Internet and all the other gymnastics you people are going through. For 8 bits, white is 235 and black is 16; for 10 bits white is 940 and black is 64. The SMPTE standard does not conflate video and computer graphics.

The SMPTE spec is authoritative. A blog on the Internet is not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.184.247.128 (talk) 11:57, 26 February 2023 (UTC)

Color bar copyright
The article says that SMPTE owns copyright on at least some of the color bar images, but that seems to be quite a stretch: Of course I'm just some guy on the Internet, and this is definitely original research... but the only source we have is someone alleging to represent the SMPTE claiming that the SMPTE owns the copyright (not independent), posted as a reply to a discussion on a public message board (not reliable). Given that the copyright claim is prima facie blatantly false, I don't believe it should be in the article. Accordingly I'm about to remove it.
 * Images must meet the threshold of originality to become subject to US copyright law. See the Commons guidance on this for examples. It is pretty certain that the color bars aren't creative enough to qualify.
 * In fact by definition, images that are created by exactly following a technical standard demonstrate no creativity at all, and are not considered "works of authorship"
 * US copyright law does not apply at all to "business operations or procedures; mathematical principles; formulas or algorithms; or any other concept, process, or method of operation.". The color bar images are the result of following such a procedure, algorithm, process etc.
 * The original standards documents defining these images (not created by SMPTE) are explicitly in the public domain (as noted in our own article).
 * You can't take something out of the public domain once it's out there.
 * Regardless of the copyright status of the standards documents, the images that result from following the standard aren't owned by whoever owns the standard.
 * Our own use of the older version images is from Commons where the license statements is "This simple sign is ineligible for copyright and therefore in the public domain, because it contains no original authorship." Anyone familiar with Commons knows they are VERY strict about these things, and yet this has never been considered remotely controversial.
 * The newer versions (that the article claims SMPTE own copyright on) are visually just small tweaks to the previous ones... certainly not enough to create a new copyright.

If anyone disagrees and wants to put it back, that's fine, but perhaps at least it should say "The SMPTE claims that..." rather than just baldly state the copyright claim as if it was a plain fact.

Thparkth (talk) 14:27, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

 * I contacted SMPTE when I originally reverted this. We can leave it out for now because you've made good points and I was not able to find a reliable source. I'll post here again if/when I hear back from them. ~Kvng (talk) 15:15, 5 September 2022 (UTC)
 * I don't think SMPTE are themselves a reliable source for whether they own copyright on these images; at most they are reliable for saying they *claim* copyright ownership. But many organizations claim copyright on things they don't own because there are no consequences and so no downside for them. Thparkth (talk) 18:22, 4 November 2022 (UTC)

 * A cursory search at copyright.gov does not turn up any copyright claim by SMPTE for color bars. As I understand it, they were originally patented by RCA and modified by CBS Labs circa 1978. I don't see how SMPTE can legitimately claim a copyright. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.184.247.128 (talk) 11:21, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:SMPTE color bars


text:
Charles Lory

Charles Lory (30 July 1823 – 3 May 1889) was a French geologist.

He was born at Nantes. He graduated D. Sc. in 1847. In 1852 he was appointed to the chair of geology at the University of Grenoble, and in 1881 to that of the École Normale Supérieure in Paris.

He was distinguished for his research on the geology of the French Alps, being engaged in the geological survey of the départements of Isère, Drôme and the Hautes-Alpes, for which he prepared maps and explanatory memoirs. He dealt with disturbances in the Savoy Alps, described fan-like structures, and confirmed the views of Jean Alphonse Favre with regard to overthrows, reversals and duplication of the strata.

His contributions to geological literature also include descriptions of the fossils and stratigraphical divisions of the Lower Cretaceous and Jurassic rocks of the Jura. He died in Grenoble on 3 May 1889.

title: Charles Lory


text:
Aulestes

In some accounts, Aulestes was the brother of Ocnus. He was said to have founded Perusia.

title: Aulestes


text:
Jarl André Storbæk

 Jarl-André Storbæk (born 21 September 1978) is a Norwegian footballer who played as a defender. Between 2005 and 2008, he was capped 17 times for the Norway national team.

Storbæk has previously played for Tippeligaen clubs HamKam and Vålerenga, Panetolikos at the second tier in Greece, and SønderjyskE in the Danish Superliga. His cousin, Håvard Storbæk, is also a footballer and has played for Odd Grenland and FK Haugesund.

Club career
Storbæk was born in Trysil and grew up in Ljørdalen, 50 km outside Trysil. After playing for Østre Trysil during his youth, Storbæk first club was the local Nybergsund. After playing for Raufoss in the First Division from 2000 to 2003, Storbæk joined the Tippeligaen side HamKam ahead of the 2004 season.

Half-way through the 2005 season, Vålerenga was looking for a left back and made a NOK3 million offer for Storbæk. HamKam, who were struggling against relegation, rejected the offer, and their coach, Ståle Solbakken, stated that NOK6 million would be a suitable price for Storbæk. Vålerenga instead signed Tommy Stenersen from Stabæk. The two clubs agreed on a transfer for Storbæk after the season, and he signed a four-year deal with Vålerenga on 14 November 2005. According to the newspaper Østlendingen, the transfer fee for Storbæk was around NOK5 million. Storbæk played a total of 51 matches for HamKam, scoring five goals.

The next season, Storbæk scored the equalizing goal on a penalty kick in the 1–1 draw against his old club HamKam. He played for Vålerenga from 2006 to 2009, and played a total of 99 matches and scored nine goals. Storbæk's contract with Vålerenga ended after the 2009-season, and he didn't want to sign a new deal with the club as he wanted to try playing abroad.

In February 2010, Storbæk signed a short-term contract with the Greek second tier club Panetolikos till the end of the 2009–10 season. Storbæk then joined the Danish club SønderjyskE in June 2010, as a replacement for Sölvi Ottesen who had transferred to F.C. Copenhagen. Storbæk played 68 matches in the Danish Superliga before he moved back to Norway and joined Strømsgodset in August 2012. Strømsgodset's coach Ronny Deila praised Storbæk as a "long-term signing" and believed that the 33-year-old would help Godset both in the race for the 2012 Tippeligaen-title and in the next few seasons.

Storbæk made his debut for Strømsgodset in the 1–1 draw against Sogndal on 2 September 2012. Deila made Storbæk captain in his first match, due to the absence of Alexander Aas and Adam Larsen Kwarasey.

Storbæk returned to former club Nybergsund in January 2015 in a dual role as player and assistant coach, having agreed a three-year contract.

International career
From 2005 to 2008, Storbæk played 17 matches for Norway.

Managerial career
After retiring at the end of 2016, Storbæk became the head coach of the club he just left, Nybergsund IL. The club announced that they did not wanted to be a player-coach as he wanted, so he retired at this point. He had already been a player-assistant at the club until he retired.

In the 2018 season, Nybergsund was relegated to the 3rd Division and Storbæk got sacked. After the sacking, Storbæk sued the club due to lack of pay and holiday pay.

In 2022 Storbæk managed Eidsvold Turn, but left due to disagreements over Eidsvold Turn's direction forward. In 2023 Storbæk managed Brumunddal, but left due to disagreements over Brumunddal's direction forward.

Honours
Vålerenga
 * Norwegian Football Cup: 2008

Strømsgodset
 * Tippeligaen: 2013

title: Jarl André Storbæk