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Talk:Catherine Parr

Caption rewrite?
The caption to the first picture in the article reads, "The dignified Catherine Parr, the last of King Henry VIII's wives, was married more than any other queen, four times. Her marriage to Henry was her third. She died as a result of giving birth to her first child in her mid-30s." (I've put the picture and caption here, too, at left.) Does all of that information really belong there, or can it go elsewhere in favor of a short-and-sweet caption? At the very least, it could be rewritten for clarity. — AnnaKucsma  (Talk to me!) 15:00, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Agree - I've cut that down. -- Beardo 05:26, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Daughter
"Her only child, a daughter, Mary Seymour, born 30 August, appears not to have long survived her mother. Her father, Thomas Seymour, was executed before she was a year old, and she was taken to live with Catherine Willoughby, dowager Duchess of Suffolk, a close friend of Catherine Parr. While little is known of her life thereafter, it is believed that she went on to have several children who eventually settled in the United States (then the colonies)."

Not long survived ? Or grew up to have several children ? -- Beardo 05:26, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

 * I agree that everything you quoted is accurate until "While little in known of her life thereafter" — but the rest of that section is kinda suspicious. Yes, this is around the time people started going to the Colonies. But this is the first time I've come across the suggestion that Mary Seymour was among those who did. — AnnaKucsma   (Talk to me!) 20:44, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
 * While I agree with the possibility of her daughter reaching adulthood and marrying (it's been said by a biographer of Katherine Parr that she married into the Bushey family who lived in the North of England) but as to her children emigrating to The Colonies?!No,I don't believe that story.Maybe one child,but all her children?!It's just another case of wishful thinking on the part of people who desparately seek "royal" ancestors.Sorry.jeanne (talk) 15:30, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Who is Catherine Parr?
Sorry, as a 50 year old Englishman, I have never heard of "Catherine Parr". Henry VIII married Katherine Parr. The portrait, and all the external pages cited all call her Katherine, with a K. Where does this incorrect spelling come from?? When I get an hour or so!! I will correct this, and "'enery's" pages.--Bilbo B 15:52, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I have now reverted all your changes. If the spelling with K is the correct one then this article here must move first. And youe will need to get consensus for it. FWIW the Times just last week in a listing of Kings & Queens of Britain used "Catherine" and from a google search it seems the more common variant. Agathoclea 11:23, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
 * But since there obviouly are different spellings used even in the sources for the article some more input is required. Agathoclea 12:37, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
 * The alternative spelling was removed by an IP some time ago Agathoclea 12:46, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Since there were no 'official' spellings of names in the 16th century, normal variants are all as correct as one another. It really doesn't make much difference if we spell Catherine with a 'C' or a 'K' here. She sometimes signed as 'Kateryn.' David Starkey has her as 'Catherine.' Pvc.mermaid 22:29, 20 November 2006 (UTC)PVC Mermaid
 * Yeah, I noticed it’s not even in her opening paragraph. She clearly called herself “Kateryn the quene, KP”. Lady Meg (talk) 06:52, 2 August 2023 (UTC)

In Alison Weir's novel, The Six Wives of Henry VIII, it stated that Parr's name was spelled with a 'K'. Weir must have done alot of research to find if her name was spelled with a K or C and I personally believe that it is spelled with a K. Also, in the backround of the portrait it spells it with a K.

 * Well, yes, as the editor before you stated, she spelt her name 'Kateryn'. But a) there is no longer such a spelling, and b) spellings were not standardised in that time either. It is simpler to go with the most commonly used spelling for her name - which, as was also pointed out above, is Catherine, not Katherine. Michaelsanders 17:25, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

There does not seem to be a way to change the title page! (Everyone is talking about how wrong the spelling is, & no one has changed it, so I tried to do so - and failed). How is this done??FlaviaR 17:39, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

So, let me get this right: the woman in question spelled her name "Kateryn," as confirmed by an examination of various documents that she herself wrote. But because there is "no longer such a spelling" (whatever that really means), "it is simpler to go with the most commonly used spelling of her name"? And even then, a variant spelling wins out over a less common but still "legitimate" spelling? When did clearly documented history become mutable by modern consensus? And what gives us the right to re-spell a person's name solely for the sake of our own lazy convenience, it being too "difficult" to wrap our narrow minds around the idea that personal names are exactly that: personal ... individual, and thus subject to personal whims of spelling. I have to wonder how all those people out there with unconventional names and non-traditional spellings of names would feel if we informed them all that "we" would no longer recognize as legitimate their unusual or unusually spelled names? The idea is absurd. Long live KATERYN Parr! PhD Historian 21:24, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Hear!Hear! I agree that the name should be spelled Katherine not Catherine.jeanne (talk) 15:29, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Agreed -- it's easy enough to have redirects, I think we should spell it like she did. Switching just the C to the K would not solve this. Gold Broth (talk) 04:04, 24 October 2023 (UTC)

Under the Catherine of Aragon article there is a more comprehensive debate on this topic. I have gone through the article and made sure all of them refer to "Cath" not "Kath". Jess xx (talk) 12:09, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

I was at Sudeley Castle today and even saw her tombe nowhere is her name spelt with a C these articles should be updated. LF 9/4/2012 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.177.27.115 (talk) 22:02, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

SHE SPELT HER NAME KATERYN WHY DONT WE SPELL IT THAT WAY IF SHE SPELT HER OWN NAME LIKE IT?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.151.95.105 (talk) 18:30, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Where?
I changed Westmoreland County to remove the word 'county' and instead place Westmoreland in NW England. Only Americans would call it Westmoreland, or Essex, or Kent, County. Not in Britain. --Cardicam (talk) 20:45, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Its Westmorland not Westmoreland Penrithguy (talk) 11:19, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

There is some dispute as to that Katherine Parr was born at Kendal Castle--Pandaplodder (talk) 20:12, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Queen Consort
I changed "Queen Consort" to "Royal Consort" in the succession box. Although Guildford Dudley did succeed her as Royal Consort (if you hold that Jane was a legitimate queen - I don't know enough about it to have an opinion), he didn't succeed her as Queen Consort. Also, most succession boxes do say "Royal Consort" and not "Queen Consort". It seemed more accurate vis a vis Guildford Dudley and it follows precedent. -- Charlene 05:03, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't believe most consort boxes do say royal consort. Nor is it a title which was ever used - has anyone ever described Catherine Parr as 'royal consort'? Michael Sanders 12:58, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Three out of the four I checked did. And the point is, nobody ever called Guildford Queen consort, so he didn't succeed her as queen consort. -- Charlene 03:38, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * No one ever called Mary I King of England. Would you list Henry VIII as 'monarch of England'? Michael Sanders 05:44, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Narrative Problem
In the section discussing Katherine's life following the death of Henry the article refers to a dispute over royal jewellery causing a rift between the Seymour brothers before it mentions that Katherine went on to marry Thomas. As this makes no narrative sense I have attempted to recorder this section in a more sensible manner. Happy enough for someone to revert these changes if they feel they can do better, but note the narrative issue in doing so. 94.193.220.27 (talk) 22:17, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

Catherine?
I thought it was Katheryn no it's CAtherine

 * I haven't seen that for Catherine Parr. The only two versions I've seen are Catherine and Katherine. — AnnaKucsma   (Talk to me!) 15:33, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

She wrote it herself as Kateryn and we have one example of her writing it as Katheryn. These were the most common spellings of the name in sixteenth-century England, although the spelling of names wasn't fixed and people would often vary it. Sone argue for Katherine as it's the modern version most similar to the version used by Catherine Parr, others prefer Catherine as the mose common modern-day spelling. Boleyn (talk) 17:57, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

The full-length picture
I think we can, by now, safely change this to simply "Katherine Parr" - but I would like some agreement before I just go do it.FlaviaR 17:42, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Possible birthdate
I have seen on a well-researched Polish site that Catherine Parr was born 11 November 1512. What do the other editors think? Can it be added to the article?jeanne (talk) 16:01, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Not unless it gives a reference. To my memory, Martienssen and James haven't come up with a DOB, and nobody has looked into her life more deeply than they have. I'm very doubtful of any exact DOBs given in the sixteenth-century, except for royaltyBoleyn (talk) 16:17, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Not necessarily. Many tombs list birthdates, also documents pertaining to inheritance. A child's birthdate had to have been recorded somewhere so it would be known exactly when he or she reached majority. I personally believe (and this is just my POV after a careful analysis) that Catherine could not have been born in November 1512 but instead November 1511. Seeing as her brother William was born 14 August 1513, a November 1512 date for Catherine seems impossible. Fraser thinks that Catherine was born between late 1511 and early 1512, based on letters that her mother wrote stating Catherine's age, which would fit in nicely with the 11 November 1511 DOB. I have discovered the DOB for a 12th century heiress Isabel Bolebec. It comes from a document translated from the original Latin by a scholar which says that Isabel had reached her ninth year the previous Michaelmas. So I do believe that DOB 's can sometimes (alas, not always) be ascertained by a careful study of old documents especially when the person in question was an heir or heiress. I shall continue to track down the source for the 11 November date but as I stressed before it couldn't have been 1512.jeanne (talk) 06:40, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Title after her marriage to Thomas Seymour
I notice that the section on titles and styles lists her last title as HM Queen Catherine for 1547, with no mention of her title for 1548.

How did it work when a Queen Dowager remarried? Was she still entitled to her status as Queen Dowager, and to the style of HM Queen Firstname or did she take her title from her new husband, in which case Catherine would have been Baroness Seymour or Lady Seymour from her marriage to Thomas Seymour to her death? 86.47.42.32 (talk) 10:28, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

They usually retained their higher title, as in the case of Henry VIII's sister, who was known as Mary, the French Queen after her second marriage to the Duke of Suffolk. Boleyn (talk) 14:52, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Needs Clarification?
"An arrest warrant was drawn up for her and rumours abounded across Europe that he was attracted to her close friend, the Duchess of Suffolk." Can I assume that the "he" in this sentence refers to the King? I think the antecedent is unclear. Peter Delmonte (talk) 04:07, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

"As sex during pregnancy was frowned upon during the sixteenth century, Seymour began to take an interest in Lady Elizabeth." This is a nonsensical sentence. 32Flavors (talk) 08:03, 11 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I have just requested a citation for the claim about "sex during preganancy was frowned upon".--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 08:08, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

Personal qualities
The factors that are said to have endeared her to many historians make her sound like a rather priggish bluestocking. This appears to have been far from the case. She was a passionate person, in the physical sense, and evidently quite sexy well into her thirties (which was not young in Tudor times). She was also not above the use of obscenities when it suited her: see, for example, Porter (2010), p299. These facets only add to her appeal. (Incidentally, why is this subject ranked as "low" importance?) IXIA (talk) 21:12, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Why all the Wikilinks?
Why are there so many red links in the ancestry section? I honestly don't think all of these people (such as N. Septvans, Elizabeth Houby, and Lady Marina Bellers), will end up with their own articles, so some of the red links should be removed.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 16:54, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
 * This was done I believe, I agree -- looks strange.. I think it was done when I didn't know any better and I had just copied the template from another page; back then I didn't realize what the did, now I do. -- Lady Meg (talk) 07:04, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Borough or Burgh?
It would seem that there are two pages about the same person on here -- Thomas Burgh, 1st Baron Burgh and Thomas Borough, 3rd Baron Borough of Gainsborough (why am I bringing this up? well..) -- this person is the son of Edward Borough/Burgh which people are linking Catherine to as her first husband, which should probably be left with no link because we are not sure which Edward Borough/Burgh she married. If recent research and peerage books are correct, Catherine married this Thomas' son, Sir Edward. The Peerage says it's Sir Edward, son of Thomas along with other books about Catherine. The title of the barony, Burgh, is pronounced "Borough" and the Tudor Place, which people were using I'm assuming when they made these pages, uses the name 'Borough', not 'Burgh' -- therefore there are two pages of the same person. Does anyone want to help fix this? Thanks -- Lady Meg (talk) 00:10, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
 * I've fixed this by merging the info as best I could (some of the detail is a bit contradictory and uncertain) and making Thomas Borough, 3rd Baron Borough of Gainsborough a redirect to Thomas Burgh, 1st Baron Burgh. -- Escape Orbit (Talk) 00:25, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks -- I'm not super savvy on here. Much appreciated. -- Lady Meg (talk) 04:32, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Lead
The lead is very poor and does not adequately summarise her life. Is the fact that Catherine's ancestors were from Kendal Castle the most notable feature of Catherine Parr? Her strong support of the Reformation should be up there in lieu of her ancestry and birthplace!--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 07:33, 11 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I have since removed the genealogical information and replaced it with pertinent facts regarding Catherine's life.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 12:13, 12 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I put that in and was going to continue adding more to build up the lead -- but got tired and went to sleep. I know that that is not the most notable feature of Catherine Parr. Geez. The lead has been poor even before I attempted to do something with it -- but on wiki the pages are constantly changing and you can't keep up -- I started.. and was going to lead up, but didn't get the chance. I keep forgetting that this wiki is not like the Tudors Wiki. I've been researching Catherine for months now. The lead still needs some help as it just gives specifics about her during her reign as Queen and then after. Could someone look at the leads the other queens and perhaps take that as an example? Also, why are people still trying to change her birth date? -- Lady Meg (talk) 06:26, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
 * The lead has to be a summary of the main points already in the article. Most scholars believe she was born in about 1512. The ODNB says possibly in August of that year.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 06:30, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Gotcha. Yes, James, Porter, and the Oxford Dictionary say c.1512. -- Lady Meg (talk) 06:34, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Commoner
The fact that she was the fourth of Henry's consorts to have been a commoner should be in the article.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 12:13, 12 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Does it say that on Anne Boleyn, Jane Seymour, and Katherine Howard's pages? Probably not. It isn't exactly a huge fact that people need to know. If you put it on one person's page -- you need to do it with the others. -- Lady Meg (talk) 06:31, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
 * It should be noted in the others' respective articles, and it is an important fact that people need to know. If a student happened to be doing a project on Henry VIII's wives, he or she would find it helpful if the article mentioned that Catherine was the fourth commoner Henry took as his consort. It was an established practice for monarchs to marry royalty. This was what turned the Earl of Warwick against Edward IV when he wed the commoner Elizabeth Woodville. I believe it's on the latter's page that she was the first English queen consort to have been born a commoner.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 06:37, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I have since added commoner to the other's articles, in the lead. As you rightly said, we need to be consistent.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 06:55, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Perhaps it should be 'not a daughter of a monarch or duchy'. Because if you want to be politically correct -- I believe by English law all of his wives were commoners as they held no title and were not hereditary nobles. Katherine was the daughter of Isabella and Ferdinand and Anne was the daughter of a Duke. Of course most people wouldn't think of them as 'commoners', but they are, at least by today's standards. Correct me if I'm wrong. Most teachers and scholars do not allow Wikipedia as a source for a paper anyway since it can be edited by anyone at any time. -- Lady Meg (talk) 07:29, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
 * We are not intersted in political-correctness, but veracity. Four of Henry's wives were commoners as they were not the offspring of royalty or thmselves titled nobility. Henry created Anne Boleyn to the peerage to raise her status from that of an untitled commoner. Catherine de Medici was also a commoner. My daughter, who attends high school is encouraged by her teachers to use Wikipedia; and the English Wikipedia is preferred over the Italian as it's generally believed here in Italy to be more complete.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 08:01, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
 * So we should note that wikipedia is not interested in political correctness then. We know all this.. you talk as if I don't know anything about the Tudor era. I'm not being nasty about it -- in fact I was laughing when I wrote the last entry.. as most people would argue that and have with me about it, so I was just saying. Henry created Anne to the peerage, but she was still born a commoner -- kind of a desperate attempt as he didn't do anything like that again, even for Jane Seymour, the love of his life. Well here is the US and in London -- they discourage wikipedia as a primary source.. very surprised that Italy encourages it.. I've never read the Italian Wikipedia, but noticed that the German one has quite a deal more information when it comes to people like Anne of Cleves and her family. Her family and her entry needed desperate help a few months back.. they look better now. Poor Anne, she was dismissed so quickly in her marriage and in history. -- Lady Meg (talk) 00:46, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Curiously, the ambassador of Mary, Queen of Scots, John Lesley, diplomatically mentioned that Catherine de Medici was a direct descendant of Malcolm III of Scotland and St Margaret of Scotland, according to Nestor's genealogy of the Medici (Lesley, Historia, Bk. 6, Cap 86.) More to the point, in Britain there was much notice of Fergie, Duchess of York, as a commoner - 'She's One of Us'; in contrast to the daughter of Earl Spencer, not so long ago.Unoquha (talk) 01:06, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Fergie had her links as well, like Catherine de Medici.. but was not born Lady Sarah Ferguson, no. She was the second great-granddaughter of William Montagu Douglas Scott, 6th Duke of Buccleuch and a great-granddaughter of Mervyn Wingfield, 8th Viscount Powerscourt. -- Lady Meg (talk) 04:12, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I was just thinking about this. If she was Dowager Lady (Baroness) Latimer does that mean she was a commoner if she was the widow of a peer? At the time of her marriage to Henry she had already been a peeress by right of her husband. She did receive quite a bit of money and estates from him and was to take care of his daughter, Margaret, until her coming of age. So was she really a "commoner"? By birth, yes, but when she married Henry? She still held the title of Dowager Lady Latimer. Perhaps we could clear that up. -- Lady Meg (talk) 08:25, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Commoner generally means not royal. Being the widow of a baron would not have made Catherine royal.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 09:17, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I get that she was not royal -- and commoner does not mean "not royal". Commoner is someone who is not in the peerage or the monarch themselves. Was the definition different back in the Tudor times? I doubt it. Also, what's with this constant activity with IP addresses changing everything? It should be noted that for 17 years information online and here on Wikipedia was incorrect about her early life. -- Lady Meg (talk) 07:44, 11 June 2011 (UTC)

John Neville, 3rd Lord Latimer
Does anyone want to add more information on her time with Lord Latimer? -- Lady Meg (talk) 04:42, 1 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, her marriage to him should be elaborated.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 09:19, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Lady Borough "Burgh"
Does anyone think we should add a section on her short lived marriage to Sir Edward Burgh? I have something written up if anyone thinks it's worth writing about. In her biographies by Linda Porter and Susan James there are more than a few pages describing her marriage -- so anyone who is interested, let me know. -- Lady Meg (talk) 23:49, 20 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Please observe: Her mother went by Lady Parr because her husband was Sir Thomas Parr, Knt., so technically Catherine was Lady Burgh as her husband was Sir Edward Burgh, Knt., so the titles have been changed. -- Lady Meg (talk) 01:41, 15 June 2011 (UTC)

Seymour and Elizabeth
It would seem that the deposition of Kat Ashley is not copied word for word and the sentences written imply that the Dowager Queen joined in with the tickling and what not. Catherine is not accused of any sexual matter and did not "molest" [which is what the paragraph implies] Elizabeth. This source Stores from the State Papers which uses Kat Ashley's deposition.. does not state that the Dowager Queen was in the room when Seymour came in, in the morning. Rather she was still sleeping. Rather in most books Kat Ashley is not even seen as a reputable source either; Elizabeth ended up under the care of Lady Trywhitt while Kat was told by the council that she was unfit to look after Elizabeth. The wording and the credibility of the source, Kat Ashley, is regarded as somewhat unreliable. Kat Ashley waffled with her statements about Seymour. She even went as far as encouraging Elizabeth to consider marrying Seymour after the dowager queen died; saying that Elizabeth would be so lucky to have a man like him. It's rather tiring seeing people recently online accusing Catherine of being a "molester" when the full story is not presented on Wikipedia! People seem to rely on Wikipedia for history now and stop after reading these pages. They do not fully investigate the history of the situation and the credibility of the woman, the only person who gave this information under intense investigation and threat of torture after being arrested and put in the Tower. Another link and please note the separate letters sent by Elizabeth to the Queen AND Seymour AFTER she had been sent away: Katherine the Queen, Linda Porter -- Lady Meg (talk) 07:25, 5 June 2012 (UTC)

Vandalism
Hi everyone, there have been several edits of people vandalizing this page. The portrait is now missing! Is there anything we can do about this? Perhaps put a lock on it? -- Lady Meg (talk) 20:29, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Agree it should be locked Meemsworldwide (talk) 23:50, 26 November 2017 (UTC)

 * Again with the vandalism. Her death date was changed to the 7th. She died on the 5th! It was changed even in her article with someone putting in that she died 8 days after her baby daughter. I also noticed that a lot of other changes have been made, making this a shorter article. -- Lady Meg (talk) 22:58, 2 April 2019 (UTC)

Orphaned references in Catherine Parr
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Catherine Parr's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "porter": From Thomas Parr (d.1461): Linda Porter. Katherine, the Queen: The Remarkable Life of Katherine Parr, the Last Wife of Henry VIII, Macmillan, Nov 23, 2010. From Sir Edward Burgh: Linda Porter. Katherine, the Queen. Macmillan. 2010.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 20:29, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

help
hello you du not know me I am a 13 year old girl and I have a question who posted Catherine Parr's page if you are wondering why it is for a research report

Horton Northamptonshire
Did Catherine Parr live in Horton Northamptonshire? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.26.144.238 (talk) 16:43, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

Protestant
There are two sections where it says she was in trouble for being a protestant. Wasn't Henry VIII the number one protestant ? So how was she in trouble for that ? Some clarification of that would be helpful.Lathamibird (talk) 05:45, 12 July 2016 (UTC)

Henry VIII wasn't Protestant and considered Protestants heretics. The Church of England he set up became Protestant during his son and daughter's reigns, but that was not his intention. His church was not far from 'Catholicism without the Pope'. Boleyn (talk) 06:25, 12 July 2016 (UTC)

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Titles and Styles

 * Miss Catherine Parr (1512-1529)
 * Dame Catherine Burgh (1529-1533)
 * The Right Honourable The Lady Latimer (1534-1543)
 * Her Majesty The Queen (1543-1547)
 * Her Majesty Queen Catherine (1547-1548)

I notice that we usually have such a section for later individuals but in this era they are harder to find.Robin S. Taylor (talk) 22:53, 21 December 2016 (UTC)
 * All of the above is utter nonsense. Henry VIII was His Grace, why would his wife be a Majesty. It's all made-up and anachronistic, applying styles that were not developed until hundreds of years after her death. Celia Homeford (talk) 11:00, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
 * According to Robert Lacey, in his book Great Tales from English History, Richard II, King of England from 1377 until he was deposed in 1399, was the first English King to demand the title of Highness or Majesty. Lacey also noted that, “...previous English Kings had been content to be addressed as ‘My Lord’”.
 * After the reign of Richard II and prior to the reign of Henry VIII, kings and queens were styled Your Grace or Your Highness.
 * In 16th century England the titles Your Majesty, Your Highness, and Your Grace were used arbitrarily, even on legal or official documents. For example, one legal judgement issued by Henry VIII uses all three indiscriminately; Article 15 begins with, "The Kinges Highness hath ordered," Article 16 with, "The Kinges Majestie" and Article 17 with, "The Kinges Grace." In 1536, Henry’s daughter writes “Most humbly prostrate before the feet of your most excellent majesty…” Lady Meg (talk) 11:55, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Letter from Parr to Henry in July 1544 states: “your majesty’s…” and a letter to Parr from Elizabeth says, “king’s majesty…” so… Lady Meg (talk) 12:13, 12 March 2023 (UTC)

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Lock page
This page has been erased and vandalized several times in the summer and fall of 2017. Should it be locked? Meemsworldwide (talk) 23:49, 26 November 2017 (UTC)

 * Yes! It's vandalized quite frequently. - Lady Meg (talk) 00:40, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

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Title After Marriage
Catherine was considered 'Queen' after the death of King Henry and that was to hold until Edward married and then she would have been Queen Dowager. That was part of Henry's will. She was titled 'Queen Catherine' after he died. She was technically Queen Dowager but was allowed to be called 'Queen'. That is my explanation that should be included in her bio somewhere. Also, her jewels and that of the Queen's jewels were locked in the Tower for safe keeping and she never saw them again due to The Lord Protector and his wife. True that Henry said she could keep and wear the Queen's jewels, but she never saw them again after they were locked away. -- Lady Meg (talk) 20:46, 2 April 2019 (UTC)

Death Date
I would also like to add that someone changed her death date to the 7th of September. Her death date is the 5th of September. I see that since I have not been paying attention to this article, A LOT of things have been taken out or changed and not for the better. -- Lady Meg (talk) 22:53, 2 April 2019 (UTC)
 * The date of the 7th is cited. Celia Homeford (talk) 08:41, 4 April 2019 (UTC)
 * That's not right. I'm not sure where you're getting your info from but her death date is the 5th and it's cited by all the scholars I know. Alison Weir is not a definitive source on this as she still has her first husband as the elderly 2nd Baron Borough. All of the biographies of Kateryn have her death date as the 5th of September. -- Lady Meg (talk) 23:52, 5 April 2019 (UTC)

PLEASE stop changing her death date or putting that it's another date all together. If you're not familiar with Kateryn Parr or this time period, I would appreciate it if you would stick to other pages and leave these for people who are educated and have dedicated decades of their life to researching Kateryn. Pretty sure that Alison Weir has her death date correct in her Six Wives book and if she doesn't, I don't know where she's getting her information. She's not even a specialist when it comes to Kateryn. Also Encyclopedia Brittanica can be changed by people who have no specialization in areas like Kateryn. Please stop changing the date. Thank you. Sources for 5th September 1548 are as follows:
 * James, Susan (2009). Catherine Parr: Henry VIII's Last Love. Gloucestershire: The History Press. ISBN 0-752-44853-6.
 * Martienssen, Anthony (1973). Queen Catherine Parr. London: Secker & Warburg. ISBN 0-436-27328-4.
 * Norton, Elizabeth (2011). Catherine Parr. Chalford: Amberley. ISBN 1445603837.
 * Parr, Katherine (2011). Mueller, Janel, ed. Katherine Parr: Complete Works and Correspondence. Chicago: University of Chicago Press. ISBN 978-0-226-64724-1.
 * Porter, Linda (2010). Katherine the Queen: The Remarkable Life of Katherine Parr, the Last Wife of Henry VIII. New York: St. Martin's Press. ISBN 1-42991-830-6.
 * Starkey, David (2004). Six wives: The Queens of Henry VIII. New York: Harper Collins. ISBN 069401043X.
 * Fraser, Antonia (1992). The Wives of Henry VIII. New York: Knopf Doubleday Publishing Group.
 * Mosley, Charles, editor. Burke's Peerage, Baronetage & Knightage, 107th edition, 3 volumes. Wilmington, Delaware, U.S.A.: Burke's Peerage (Genealogical Books) Ltd, 2003.

There are a LOT more that I can list that have the correct date, so please stop messing with the date. - Lady Meg (talk) 22:48, 6 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Some say the 5th, some say the 7th. The number of citations saying the 7th could just as easily be expanded as the 5th. When citations disagree, both dates should be given. Celia Homeford (talk) 08:02, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * The only ones that say the 7th are the ones you have provided and I have contacted the Britannica website which is edited by anyone. I just listed a lot of sources that state the 5th of September as being her death date. I doubt you have access to all of them so you cannot justify saying that some say this and others say that. Those are her top biographers and they have studied her for decades. I would appreciate it if you would stop adding the 7th and then putting it in her article as the only date. This is not right. What you are doing is vandalizing this page. I will continue to insist that her death date is the 5th and I have provided numerous sources and you have provided two! -- Lady Meg (talk) 23:52, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
 * As of right now, you are down to ONE source as Encylclopedia Brittanica states that she died on the 5th of September. As of now, you are simply vandalizing the page. — Lady Meg (talk) 00:44, 11 April 2019 (UTC)
 * I also have a photo of the plaque next to her grave that says she died on 5 September 1548. Would you like me to post my own photo here? That’s proof enough to confirm her death was the 5th, her own grave. Thank you. —- Lady Meg (talk) 04:10, 11 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Please see Tomb of Catherine Parr -- Lady Meg (talk) 20:44, 11 April 2019 (UTC)
 * You're a liar. I have not once, ever put the 7th in as the only date. I've consistently stated and campaigned for the inclusion of both the cited dates. Your increasingly vehement and frankly bizarre ranting just makes you look like a freak. Celia Homeford (talk) 08:40, 12 April 2019 (UTC)
 * When you have edited before, you have taken out the 5th in certain places and replaced it with ONLY the 7th. As for your sources, you only have one source that says the 7th. Encyclopedia Brittanica no longer says the 7th, please check. Do you even have the book by Alison Weir that you're quoting as a source or are you just taking that from some online source like you did with Encyclopedia Brittanica? I have her own grave (that I've been to) that has a plaque that came from her original tomb/coffin that says she died on the 5th of September, not the 7th. If you would take a look at the photo I put a link to, it shows the plaque. The coffin was only marked with that, a lead plate with that inscription.

 * As for the 7th, I have that as Parr's funeral day according to Janel Mueller. Her account comes from a person who was actually there on the 7th. I have Mueller's book, along with the many others I've listed.

 * Please stop putting the 7th in the article (or in addition to) for her death date and questioning things that have proof without a doubt (like the plaque at her tomb) or official documents from her funeral on the 7th. Alison Weir is not a good enough source for this page and a lot of us have stopped using her as a source because she is not a reputable or reliable source. If she was reliable for Kateryn Parr, we would use her, but we don't anymore because she is the one who had Sir Edward Borough, her first husband, incorrect for decades. Thank you. -- Lady Meg (talk) 22:38, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

RFC on death date
We need to further discuss the death date, please feel free to chime in above. -- Lady Meg (talk) 00:04, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

 * I've not worked out what you want to discuss.  Sorry if I'm missing something obvious.    Presumably there was a burial record (which may still be accessible) giving the date of her burial and it seems vanishingly unlikely - especially given the known circumstances of her death - that she'd have been buried on the day she died.  And you seem to have plenty of respectable sources for the agreed death date if you want to pack the entry with sources giving her date of death as 5 September.   But there's no harm in adding half a line stating that some sources give her death date not as 5 September but as 7 September because they conflate the date of burial and the date of death.   And no doubt sources can be found to support that too.   It's a very very common error.  Where sources differ, readers may very well have noticed, and you are doing your wiki-readers a service if you stop off to explain why sources differ.   But I still haven't worked out why it needs to generate a wiki-p**sing contest.   But I apologise - again - if I'm completely missing the point of your request.   Success Charles01 (talk) 14:42, 13 April 2019 (UTC)
 * At this point, I think the discussion probably isn’t needed anymore as we have that her coffin says that she died on 5 September 1548. You can’t get a more primary source than that. I just needed someone to intervene because it had turned into a conversation that was becoming hostile. — Lady Meg (talk) 02:44, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
 * I have every book written on Katheryn Parr and can find no death date of 7th. We definitely want to reflect different historians' views, but we don't want to perpetuate an error, and errors are easily made, especially in old articles like Britannica and the old DNB. Unless there is a substantial amount of other reliable sources citing the 7th, with some evidence, it should just stay as it is, with just the 5th. Boleyn (talk) 07:43, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
 * The date of her death being recorded as the 5th on her coffin really should be enough for any reasonable person and it's incredible that users are trying to claim that some random source using the date of 7 is on parr (heh) with the coffin as a reliable source. PraiseVivec (talk) 13:46, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
 * You chose to turn things hostile. You were the one who started telling other editors they were uneducated and vandals, and then ran to your friends to spread lies about them. You can hardly be surprised if people treat you with contempt when you started it. I think you'll also find that canvassing is frowned upon at wikipedia. Celia Homeford (talk) 09:26, 15 April 2019 (UTC)
 * , I'm sorry to see two editors, both trying hard, ending up upset and angry. I hope we can all draw a line under it and move it. It is difficult when a source gives a different piece of information and definitely worth discussing, but I think it's right that it was removed (unless other sources are found, of course.) Thank you both for you rhard work trying to improve Wikipedia - now let's move on and continue making the encyclopaedia better. Thanks, Boleyn (talk) 17:13, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

I look forward to seeing this article improved at least to a Good Article level, since y'all are so passionate about the subject and have access to every book written on it. Surtsicna (talk) 00:16, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

Ancestry
Was just wondering what’s going on with the ancestry trees? They seem to have been taken out not just for Catherine, but the other queens. Is wiki just not doing them anymore? A lot of us worked hard on it. Just disappointing. — Lady Meg (talk) 21:57, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

Kateryn
Is there a reason “Kateryn” isn’t featured as the alternative spelling? That’s how she signed her name. Is that not a good enough source? When and why did we settle on “Catherine” again? Lady Meg (talk) 11:19, 12 March 2023 (UTC)

 * I wrote this in March and the alternate spelling put in her opening isn’t “Kateryn” yet? Ok. Guess I’ll just do it then. No response. Lady Meg (talk) 07:01, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
 * There's a lot of earlier discussion on this Talk page about the issue, but it seems that those concerned are no longer wish to say anything. I think your addition is justified, and indeed believe that the modern spelling 'Katherine' should be used in the article title - but it seems that is somewhat unfashionable for children nowadays and this page is collateral damage.Sbishop (talk) 07:29, 2 August 2023 (UTC)

Date(s) of death
The first paragraph states Henry died on January 28, 1547.The info under her picture says she died January 28, 1547. The first paragraph says she lived over a year after his death. 2603:6010:BE00:498C:ED29:6893:312A:8450 (talk) 00:05, 30 June 2023 (UTC)
 * The info under her picture does not say she died January 28, 1547. You've misread it. Celia Homeford (talk) 07:39, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Photo of Tomb
I noticed this must have happened a few years ago now. I had uploaded my own photo of the tomb. Then it was taken out for this small photo from the back of the tomb? Surely people want to see the whole tomb. How is this photo now in the article better than the photo I took? Kind of astonished by the constant editing and deletions and whenever I edit I’m like stalked and people undo my edits. Even here on Cat Parr of whom I’ve been studying since 2007. Lady Meg (talk) 06:11, 2 August 2023 (UTC)

 * I've put the old one back, for WP:BRD. It's more personal to the subject and may even be a likeness. There may well be room for both. AntientNestor (talk) 08:25, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
 * I've just nominated the current picture as a featured picture candidate on Commons. Not relevant to inclusion here, of course—just an aside.--AntientNestor (talk) 10:29, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Actually Alison Weir tells us that it's from 1862, so little chance that it's a likeness—apologies.--AntientNestor (talk) 20:51, 4 August 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Catherine Parr


text:
User talk:Wrodina

Welcome
Saw your test over on the tutorial page, thought I'd say 'Howdy' and 'Welcome' -Tel Janin 13:41, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

Boo to you --MarkMascolino 04:06, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

Your deletion of Gandhi's participation with the British against the Zulu tribes
Dear Wrodina, you have deleted the section "M. K. Gandhi's participation" from the Anglo-Zulu War and given a reason like "unrelated and possible defamation of Ghandi". The information in that section is very much related and well researched and verified. Its not encouraged to delete sections on wikipedia just because the information is not known to you and you think something is "possible". Also, its not encouraged to delete sections without first discussing on the talk page. If you have contention to the content or about the factual correctness of the information please start the discussion on the talk page and I am sure authors who have knowledge about this issue will be happy to discuss this with you. A. S. Aulakh Talk 06:46, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

 * Hi Wrodina, thanks for the reply and sane discussion. The intention of my message was not as it got perceived, rather was to highlight a wikipedia policy of deleting sections. Please note that your comment in the edit log can also be perceived as rude since it tags the contributer as a Gandhi defamer. Anyway, you are always welcome to critique even the current form of that section and thus contribute towards increasing the quality. Unfortunately, we all have been a victim of long time propaganda about M. K. Gandhi and hence its normal to see any such less known facts coming as a surprise. Regards, A. S. Aulakh Talk 07:09, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: User talk:Wrodina


text:
Ravensthorpe, Western Australia

Ravensthorpe is a town 541 km south-east of Perth and 40 km inland from the south coast of Western Australia. It is the seat of government of the Shire of Ravensthorpe. At the, Ravensthorpe had a population of 2,085.

In 1848, the area was surveyed by Surveyor General John Septimus Roe who named many of the geographical features nearby, including the nearby Ravensthorpe Range that the later town was named after.

There was one of the Western Australian Government Railways isolated branch lines between Hopetoun and Ravensthorpe. This line opened in 1909.

Alluvial gold was discovered at the Phillips River in 1892. At the goldfield a de facto town emerged, known as Phillips River. The government completed construction of a copper and gold smelter about 2 km south east of the town in 1906, used to cast copper and gold ingots.

History
A temporary pastoral lease ("Free Run") was registered by James Dunn senior in 1868. His five sons and daughter started sheep farming at the property, Cocanarup (20 km west of the present town), in 1871, after George and John Dunn drove a herd from Albany. In 1873 the family was granted a permanent lease of 4049 ha.

The region is infamous for the Ravensthorpe Massacre, also called the Cocanarup Massacre, where many Noongar people were massacred in revenge for the fatal spearing of John Dunn in 1880. Dunn had allegedly raped a 13 year old Noongar girl.

By 1901, the population had climbed to over 1,000 and the government gazetted the town, renaming it Ravensthorpe. The area continued to prosper and the population grew accordingly, by 1909 the population was over 3000. The prosperity was short-lived; World War I took its toll on the town and by 1918 the local copper smelter had closed and many of the copper and gold mines had closed. The population of the town in 1968 was approximately 800 people. Ravensthorpe Airport opened in 2004.

Agriculture
After the war Ravensthorpe survived servicing the farming in the district. Agriculture in the area began to grow following the Great Depression and pastoral land releases occurred in the 1960s and 1970s. The surrounding areas produce wheat and other cereal crops. The town is a receival site for Cooperative Bulk Handling. A bulk wheat bin was constructed in the town in 1947 capable of holding over 30,000 bushels.

Nickel

BHP Billiton commenced a feasibility study in 2002 into opening a nickel and cobalt mine and processing plant 35 km east of the town. The project was approved in 2004 and construction commenced shortly afterward. The plant known as the Ravensthorpe Nickel Project was commissioned in late 2007 with first production occurring in October and the first 5000 tonnes being produced by December 2007. The plant was officially opened in 2008.

In January 2009, BHP Billiton announced that it was suspending production at the Ravensthorpe nickel mine indefinitely, due to the reduction in world nickel prices caused by the global economic crisis. The decision cut 1,800 jobs and had a major impact on the local economy.

On 9 December 2009, BHP sold the Ravensthorpe mine, on which it had spent A$2.4 billion to build, to Toronto-based First Quantum Minerals for US$340 million. First Quantum was one of three bidders for the mine and actually produced the lowest offer. The Canadian company planned to have the mine back in production in mid-2011. In 2017 the mine was put into care and maintenance due to low nickel prices. Production resumed in January 2020 with First Quantum Minerals selling a 30% shareholding in the mine to POSCO in May 2021.

Lithium
The Mt Cattlin mine is a spodumene-tantalite mine 2.2 km north of the town. It was operated by Galaxy Resources between 2009 and 2012 before being placed on care-and-maintenance in 2013. Mine production restarted on 31 March 2016. In January 2017 the first shipment of 10,000 tonnes of lithium concentrate was consigned from Esperance to Lianyungang, China.

Copper
The Ravensthorpe Copper Mine operated in the area in the 1960s. In 1967 the mine produced 3276 t of copper concentrate averaging about 23% Copper. The concentrate was trucked to the port of Esperance for shipment to Japan.

Climate
Ravensthorpe has a semi-arid climate (BSk) with a Mediterranean rainfall pattern.

title: Ravensthorpe, Western Australia


text:
Herman Schultz

Herman Schultz may refer to:

 * Shocker (comics), a Marvel Comics supervillain with the alter ego Herman Schultz
 * Herman Schultz (sport shooter) (1901–?), Monegasque sports shooter
 * Herman C. Schultz (1860–?), member of the Wisconsin State Senate
 * Herman Schultz (astronomer) (1823–1890), Swedish astronomer

title: Herman Schultz


text:
Talk:Buff Bagwell

Proof, please
When Bagwell showed up for SmackDown'' a few days later, someone (reportedly Bradshaw) had punched a hole through the top hat. It was also rumored that when he arrived at the July 9 Raw with a new top hat, several wrestlers (rumored to be Big Show, Hardcore Holly, and the APA, among others) defacated in Bagwell's new top hat, either or both in response to his poor attitude (which made him quite unpopular with the other wrestlers backstage) and/or as a hazing incident''.

Can you provide facts that Bagwell was being hazed by these aformentioned people listed in bold? Duo02 *Shout here!** 18:08, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

TERROR TRACT (2000) - needs to be added to Buff's filmography.

Neck Injury Screenshot
I was going through an old VHS tape of WCW footage I have when I came across the moment of Bagwell's neck injury and when WCW officials waited for an ambulance to take him from the ring. Since no one has offered an image to this article, I added one of the moment he hit his head against Steiner's back to illustrate exactly how he was injured (it's not specified in the article, only that it was due to a botched bulldog). Someone immediately removed it, and I honestly don't know why. I would've gotten a better shot of Bagwell, but he's mostly covered by WCW officials and fellow wrestlers. Would a shot of him laying on the mat be more appropriate? I've been getting screenshots for all sorts of wrestling articles, including Latino World Order, Al Green (wrestler), and Barry Darsow, and no one seems upset with those. Cale 01:25, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Someone needs to post that Bagwell was involved in a cosmetic surgery accident that almost lef the amputation of his legs below the knee when he was having his calfs muscles ogmented. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.115.108.120 (talk) 19:38, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Anthony Carelli (Santino Marella) manager of Buff Bagwell ??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.248.109.3 (talk) 20:39, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

ex-girlfriend
who is this Julia Fletcher, former WCW Womens champion he dated? What was her ring name? I can't find anything showing this. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.189.35.24 (talk) 22:57, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Confusing Organization in the Career Section
I think it's a little confusing that Bagwell's car accident is not mentioned at all in the pro wrestling career section of the article. It mentions Bagwell returning from injury, but there's not even a cursory mention of the accident prior to that, so someone reading the article has no idea what injuries he'd be returning from. I get that it may be redundant to repeat the whole account of the accident, but at least mentioning it will make the article a little more clear in my opinion. 67.164.203.212 (talk) 18:42, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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Shane Douglass
Why is his tag title win with Shane Douglas as a partner not mentioned anywhere in the article as at any part of his career, even though it's listed as titles held? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:189:c381:5a60:c41e:c372:8547:68dd (talk) 08:27, 28 April 2020 (UTC)

 * Why don't you add it yourself. Don't forget to attribute it to reliable sources. Lava Lamps (talk) 08:29, 28 April 2020 (UTC)

title: Talk:Buff Bagwell


text: User talk:212.188.129.30

title: User talk:212.188.129.30


text:
Talk:Hami

Interwiki ug
Please don't add links to the article with the title "قۇمۇل" in the Uyghur version of Wikipedia as long as that article doesn't have any contents. It doesn't make sense. —Babelfisch 01:22, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
 * This is a stub, I guees... Eskimo ☼ 14:07, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Look at it, it's not even a stub, it just contains the name of the place, nothing else! The whole project of that Uyghur Wikipedia is a stub. —Babelfisch 01:28, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

Grrr ... stop that bot! Do I have to delete the article in the Uyghur version completely? —Babelfisch 01:28, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved to Hami City per the agreement in the discussion below. Hami City is an existing redirect to this city's article. Contact me if this is not the best result. EdJohnston (talk) 12:24, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Kumul, Xinjiang → Kumul City – The current name is ambiguous, as the Kumul Prefecture is also in Xinjiang. What distinguishes the two is that one is a city, and the other is a prefecture. Zanhe (talk) 07:58, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

Survey

 * Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with  or  , then sign your comment with  . Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.

 * Support per nom, making the current title a disambiguation link redirecting to Kumul -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 23:34, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Any additional comments:

 * Actually, I think "Hami" is the correct name in English. It's the official name as promulgated by Xinhua, as it appears on Atlases, and on similarly authoritative sources like Encyclopedia Britannica. Shrigley (talk) 23:35, 12 May 2013 (UTC)
 * You're probably right. When I submitted the move request, my immediate concern was proper disambiguation of the two titles. It didn't occur to me that Hami is probably a more common name than Kumul. -Zanhe (talk) 06:20, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Rename the page to Qumul

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 23:52, 24 September 2023 (UTC)

Requested move 17 September 2023
Hami → Qumul – the native name of the city is not Hami. To decolonize the discussion on Uyghurs, we should employ the native Uyghur name of the city which is Qumul. Also consult: https://uhrp.org/report/decolonizing-the-discussion-of-uyghurs-recommendations-for-journalists-and-researchers/ Yokubjon Juraev (talk) 20:59, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * From the report:
 * Uyghur Human Rights Project (UHRP), given the increased prominence and frequency of writing on Uyghurs, requests journalists, academics, as well as governmental and non-governmental researchers to use Uyghur versions of names.
 * Use of Uyghur and Turkic versions for geographical locations recognizes the language and owners of the land before the imposition of the Chinese Communist Party administration in 1949. For example, regular use of the Chinese name “Hami” for the city of “Qumul” has similar colonial associations for Uyghurs.  Yokubjon Juraev (talk) 21:14, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

Against: Reasoning is obviously based on a POVPUSH that is against WP:COMMONNAME as well as official name. This user has been tendentiously changing common names and name order to fit their narrow interests. Qiushufang (talk) 21:05, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * You are trying to use Wikipedia’s rules to your advantage. You should remember WP:5P5, namely, that: Wikipedia has no firm rules. Wikipedia has policies and guidelines, but they are not carved in stone; Yokubjon Juraev (talk) 21:25, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * The premise of the move and your name changes are both against policy and false. Hami and Kumul and both native names. Qiushufang (talk) 21:37, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

Against: According to Article titles, the commonly used English name should be used as the article title, regardless of name usages in other (non-English) languages. Indeed, the most commonly used English name is "Hami", and also neutral point of view (NPOV) is a core principle of Wikipedia (without POVPUSH in WP). --Wengier (talk) 23:13, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

 * Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. In my experience "Hami" is more common than "Qumul" in English, and search results bear this out: on Google Scholar, "Hami, Xinjiang" gets 2050 hits while "Qumul, Xinjiang" gets only 7. "Hami Prefecture" gets 148 hits while "Qumul Prefecture" gets 5. On Google Ngrams, "Qumul Prefecture" doesn't even show up. —Mx. Granger (talk · contribs) 04:09, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

 * Oppose. Clear attempt at POV, which nom seems to admit has no basis in policy (or "rules" as they call them). They accuse others of using these rules to push the opposite POV. Interesting. While I strongly support this cause, this is not the place to promote it. Andrewa (talk) 22:10, 24 September 2023 (UTC)

Yi... qu(?)
In the 19th century, the historical name I-chu, I-chou, I-cheu, &c. is also frequently encountered. It's probably a mangled form of Yizhou but it should be clarified and noted. — Llywelyn II   19:58, 2 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Hami


text:
Mike Dash

Mike Dash is a Welsh writer, historian, and researcher. He has written books and articles about dramatic episodes in history.

Biography
Dash was born in London. He attended Peterhouse, Cambridge, particularly noted for teaching history, and completed postgraduate work at King's College London, where he obtained a Ph.D.

Dash authored a series of books covering incidents in the history of the Dutch East India Company, the Netherlands, India under British rule, and New York during the Progressive Era. Each focuses on a single event or series of events, among them the wreck of the East Indiaman Batavia, the Dutch tulip mania of 1634–1637, and the early years of the American Mafia. He has written for a history blog, "Past Imperfect", published by Smithsonian Magazine. In 2014, his blog post on the Lykov family, "Lost in the Taiga," was named one of "Nearly 100 Fantastic Pieces of Journalism" by The Atlantic.

Dash's 2009 book, The First Family, is a new history of Giuseppe Morello and the establishment of the Mafia in the United States. He began writing for the Smithsonian in July 2011 when the Institution acquired his history site, A Blast from the Past, shortly after the History News Network awarded it the 2010 Cliopatria prize for history blogging. In addition to blogging, Dash regularly contributes to r/AskHistorians, and since January 2019 he has republished material written for AskHistorians on his personal blog's "Ask Mike" page.

title: Mike Dash


text:
Michael Strange

Blanche Marie Louise Oelrichs (October 1, 1890 – November 5, 1950) was an American poet, playwright, and theatre actress. Oelrichs first used the masculine pen name Michael Strange to publish her poetry in order to distance her society reputation from its sometimes erotic content, but it soon became the name under which she presented herself for the remainder of her life.

Early life
Born to Charles May Oelrichs and Blanche de Loosey, Blanche Oelrichs was the youngest of four children. Her Austrian mother was the sister of Emilie de Loosey, wife of Theodore Havemeyer. The family spent summers in Newport, Rhode Island, amidst the Astors, the Vanderbilts, and numerous other wealthy elites of American society during the Gilded Age.

Her sister Natalie, always known as Lily, married and divorced Heinrich Borwin, Duke of Mecklenburg (son of Duke Paul Frederick of Mecklenburg), after the premature death of her first husband, Peter Martin of San Francisco. Her brother, Charles de Loosey Oelrichs, was the father of Marjorie Oelrichs, who was married to bandleader Eddy Duchin.

Life and career

Oelrichs was a writer and an involved activist for women's suffrage. French portrait artist Paul Helleu described Strange as the "most beautiful woman in America."

In 1910, Oelrichs married her first husband, Leonard Moorhead Thomas, the son of a prominent Philadelphia banker, with whom she had two sons, Leonard Jr. (1911–1968) and Robin May Thomas (1915–1944). Leonard Moorhead Thomas was a Yale University graduate who had worked in the diplomatic service in Rome and Madrid and served with the United States Army in Europe during World War I, earning the Croix de Guerre. Blanche Oelrichs developed a "literary urge" in 1914 when she began creating works of poetry and theatrical plays. Her first collection of poems was published in 1916 under the pen name Michael Strange. Her interests caused a rift with her husband and they divorced in 1919.

Through her social activities, Strange met popular actor, John Barrymore. They were introduced by actress Cathleen Nesbitt, Barrymore's leading woman in the 1916 production of the play Justice. She continued seeing him for four years; and, after divorcing Thomas, she married Barrymore on August 5, 1920. She was already pregnant with their only child, Diana Blanche Barrymore, who was born on March 3, 1921.

With drawings provided by John Barrymore, Strange published a book in 1921 titled Resurrecting Life. Her pseudonym was intended to separate her society family from the erotic content of the volume and its connection to her affair from Barrymore, but instead the vast popularity of the volume led to greater fame and notoriety, and her adoption of the Strange name permanently. She then turned her writing skills to the creation of theatrical plays including a 1921 Broadway production titled Clair de lune. Based on L'Homme qui rit by Victor Hugo, her play starred her husband and his sister Ethel Barrymore. It was made into a 1932 movie of the same name in France by director Henri Diamant-Berger.

In 1921, Strange was among the first to join the Lucy Stone League, an organization that fought for women to preserve their maiden names after marriage.

Strange spent a great deal of time in Paris during the next few years while her husband performed abroad. After returning to live in New York, she began acting in live theatre. Her marriage to John Barrymore ended in May 1925. She then joined a summer stock company in Salem, Massachusetts, and appeared in two Broadway plays in 1926 and 1927.

Another book of Strange's poetry was published in 1928 under the title Selected poems, by Michael Strange and, the following year, she married a third time to the prominent New York attorney Harrison Tweed who later became Chairman of Sarah Lawrence College. During the second half of the 1930s, Strange hosted a poetry and music program on New York radio station WOR that gained a strong audience. In 1940, Strange published her autobiography, Who Tells Me True. In 1942, she and Harrison Tweed divorced, and in 1944, her son Robin died at the age of 29.

Starting in the summer of 1940 until her death, Strange was in a long-term relationship with Margaret Wise Brown, the author of many children's books. The relationship began as something of a mentoring one, but became a romantic relationship and they lived together at 10 Gracie Square in Manhattan beginning in 1943.

Strange was a registered communist and – until Hitler's June 1941 invasion of the Soviet Union – part of the America First Committee's weekly radio show.

Her final professional tour was Great Works with Great Music, a re-creation of a radio program she had done previously, in which she read great literature and classical works of music were played.

Michael Strange died in Boston in 1950 from leukemia. She was interred with her son Robin, who had died in 1944, in the Oelrichs family plot in Woodlawn Cemetery in The Bronx, New York. Robin had been buried in Indiana with his predeceased lover, but Strange's will asked for his body to be moved to be with the rest of the family.

Margaret Wise Brown was made Strange's literary executor. Upon Brown's death two years later, Strange's papers were delivered to Brown's sister, Roberta; she contacted Diana Barrymore, who instructed her to burn them.

Legacy
In 1960, Strange's daughter, Diana Barrymore, died at age 38 after several years of drug and alcohol addiction. Her older son, Leonard, was married to painter Yvonne Thomas and they had two daughters together, the only grandchildren of Michael Strange.

In the 1950s, there was a Michael Strange Poetry Award.

Broadway productions

 * 1921 Clair de Lune
 * 1926 Easter One Day More
 * 1928 L'Aiglon

title: Michael Strange


text: User talk:212.219.203.105

title: User talk:212.219.203.105


text:
Route des Grands Crus

The Route des Grands Crus (roughly, "road of the great wines") is the name of a tourist route situated in Burgundy, France.

The approximately 60-kilometre route runs along the foot of the Côte d'Or escarpment, from Dijon in the north to Santenay in the south. Thus it runs through many of the great appellations of Burgundy wine, hence the name of the route. It takes the visitor through the vineyards of the Côte de Nuits and the Côte de Beaune and the back hills (Hautes-Côtes) behind and above the wine slopes.

It is punctuated by 33 villages or little towns, including Beaune, many of which have picturesque churches.

Route
From north to south:
 * Marsannay-la-Côte
 * Côte de Nuits
 * Fixin
 * Gevrey-Chambertin
 * Morey-Saint-Denis
 * Chambolle-Musigny
 * Vougeot
 * Flagey-Echézeaux
 * Vosne-Romanée
 * Nuits-Saint-Georges
 * Côte de Beaune
 * Aloxe-Corton
 * Savigny-Lès-Beaune
 * Beaune
 * Pommard
 * Volnay

 * Meursault

title: Route des Grands Crus


text:
User:Litefantastic/Animated sitcoms

For my own amusement
Feel free to add.

...and on and on it goes. -Litefantastic 23:33, 27 September 2005 (UTC)

 * Lite, I don't mean to be a dull fork here, but the comparisons between the shows have caused a lot of contention and NPOV unsubstantiated opinions. As its not really related to the content of the article, would you mind moving this to your User space?  --DropDeadGorgias (talk) 00:54, 28 September 2005 (UTC)
 * I see your point, but this is a talk page. But if you still think the comparison chart is inappropriate, then I'll move it elsewhere. -Litefantastic 11:32, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

 * It's nothing on you, but there has been some pretty nasty edit-warring about vague generalizations  about the two shows (see the section above this).  If this stays here, it may not stay the light-hearted comparison you want.  I think it's still a funny idea, but will probably be better received on your user space. --DropDeadGorgias (talk) 13:29, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

 * Okay. -Litefantastic 13:48, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

title: User:Litefantastic/Animated sitcoms


text:
Rutherford College

Rutherford College may refer to:

 * Rutherford College, North Carolina, Burke County, North Carolina, United States
 * Rutherford College of Technology, predecessor of Northumbria University, Newcastle upon Tyne, United Kingdom
 * Rutherford College, Auckland, New Zealand
 * Rutherford College, Kent, University of Kent, United Kingdom
 * Rutherford College (North Carolina), former Christian college

title: Rutherford College


text:
My Babu

My Babu (1945–1970) was a French-bred Thoroughbred racehorse who became one of the most influential sires in American breeding of show jumpers, eventers and hunters. His descendants include Bruce Davidson's former eventing mount JJ Babu, Anky van Grunsven's dressage horse Bonfire, and puissance and grand prix jumper Sympatico. Also, the grand prix jumper Napur is related to him through his sire Damascus dam Kerala. My Babu was the sire of Kerala, and therefore one of Napur's grandsires.

Racing career
During My Babu's racing career in England, the bay colt had 16 starts, 11 wins, 2 places, and 0 shows, with career earnings of £29,830. His most important win came in the 1948 Classic, the 2000 Guineas Stakes in which he set a new stakes record time. He was later sold in 1955 to Americans Leslie W. Combs II and John W. Hanes for over $600,000, the highest price ever paid for a Thoroughbred imported to the United States. The stallion stood at Spendthrift Farm in Kentucky during his breeding career.

Stud record
My Babu was a sire of 47 stakes winners and was a broodmare sire of 95 winners. He earned the title of Leading Juvenile Sire in 1960. His son, Better Boy, was the Leading sire in Australia four times. By 1965, his racing descendants had won over $3,000,000. My Babu was the grandsire of National Museum of Racing and Hall of Fame inductee Precisionist, and the damsire of Hall of Fame inductees Damascus and Gamely as well as the damsire of Little Current, the 1974 American Champion Three-Year-old Colt and winner of the Preakness and Belmont Stakes.

Sire line tree

 * My Babu
 * Better Boy
 * Craftsman
 * Tolerance
 * Century
 * Double Century
 * Burglar of Bamff
 * Bigamy
 * Stylish Century
 * Dual Scope
 * Centaine
 * Cordero
 * Kinjite
 * Super Fit
 * Perfect World
 * Cheiron
 * Taupo Retreat
 * Century Kid
 * Rubiton
 * Monopolize
 * Flavour
 * Adam
 * Fields of Omagh
 * Patezza
 * Bulleton
 * Lucky Secret
 * Average Game
 * Chevoit
 * Tampir Lane
 * Centro
 * Euclase
 * Reckless
 * Eubulides
 * Our Babu
 * Dowdstown Charley
 * Prince Florimund
 * Babur
 * Dionisio
 * Saint Denys
 * Billycan
 * Bregawn
 * Milesian
 * Atlantis
 * Mystery
 * Ionian
 * Rocked
 * Partholon
 * Mejiro Asama
 * Mejiro Titan
 * Mejiro McQueen
 * Sakura Shori
 * Sakura Star O
 * Symboli Rudolf
 * Tokai Teio
 * Ayrton Symboli
 * Tsurumaru Tsuyoshi
 * Western Wind
 * Falcon
 * Drobny
 * King Babar
 * Primera
 * Shearwater
 * The Hammer
 * Sympatico
 * Tong
 * Babu
 * Babu Dancer
 * JJ Babu
 * Bronze Babu
 * Crozier
 * Inverness Drive
 * Bad'n Big
 * Wedge Shot
 * Beat Inflation
 * Crested Wave
 * Drought
 * Gennaker
 * Surfers Paradise
 * Surface
 * Sportful
 * Journey At Sea
 * Precisionist
 * Garwol
 * Prudent
 * Manitoba
 * Mazarin
 * Babu's On
 * Santanas

Pedigree
* My Babu is inbred 4D x 4D to the stallion Swynford, meaning that he appears fourth generation twice on the dam side of his pedigree.

title: My Babu


text:
Hundreds of Cornwall

The hundreds of Cornwall (Keverangow Kernow) were administrative divisions or Shires (hundreds) into which Cornwall, the present day administrative county of England, in the United Kingdom, was divided between c. 925 and 1894, when they were replaced with local government districts.

Some of the names of the hundreds ended with the suffix shire as in Pydarshire, East and West Wivelshire and Powdershire which were first recorded as names between 1184 and 1187.

In the Cornish language the word keverang (pl. keverangow) is the equivalent for English "hundred" and the Welsh cantref. The word, in its plural form, appears in place names like Meankeverango (i.e. stone of the hundreds) in 1580 (now The Enys, north of Prussia Cove and marking the southern end of the boundary between the hundreds of Penwith and Kerrier), and Assa Govranckowe 1580, Kyver Ankou c. 1720, also on the Penwith – Kerrier border near Scorrier. It is also found in the singular form at Buscaverran, just south of Crowan churchtown and also on the Penwith-Kerrier border. The hundred of Trigg is mentioned by name during the 7th century, as "Pagus Tricurius", "land of three war hosts".

History
The division of Wessex into hundreds is thought to date from the reign of King Athelstan, and in the Geld Inquest of 1083, only seven hundreds are found in Cornwall, identified by the names of the chief manors of each: Connerton, Winnianton, Pawton, Tybesta, Stratton, Fawton and Rillaton (corresponding to Penwith, Kerrier, Pydar, Powder, Trigg, West Wivel and East Wivel). At the time of the Domesday Survey of 1086, the internal order of the Cornish manors in the Exeter Domesday Book is in most cases based on the hundreds to which they belonged, although the hundred names are not used.

All of the lordships of the Hundreds of Cornwall belonged, and still belong, to the Duchy of Cornwall, apart from Penwith which belonged to the Arundells of Lanherne. The Arundells sold their lordship to the Hawkins family in 1813 and the Hawkinses went on to sell it to the Paynters in 1832. The Lordship of Penwith came with a great number of rights over the entire hundred. These included: rights to try certain cases of trespass, trespass on the law, debt and detinue, to appoint a jailor for the detention of persons apprehended, to receive high-rent from the lords of the principal manors and to claim the regalia of the navigable rivers and havens, the profits of the royal gold and silver mines, and all wrecks, escheats, deodands, treasure trove, waifs, estrays, goods of felons and droits of admiralty happening within the hundred. The Lann Pydar joint benefice is a benefice combining those of St Ervan, St Eval, St Mawgan and St Columb Major. It is in Pydar deanery of the Diocese of Truro.

Origin of the hundred names
The origins of the names have puzzled some earlier writers on the subject: Penwith is certainly the name of Land's End in Cornish (earliest occurrence in the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle for 997); Kerrier (sometimes Kirrier) is thought by Thomas to be derived from an obsolete name (ker hyr = long fort) of Castle Pencaire on Tregonning Hill, Breage; Lesnewth denotes a place where a 'new court' has been established (the 'old court' having been at Henlis(-ton): Helstone, formerly Helston-in-Trigg); Powder has no certain derivation: 'pou' means 'territory' in Cornish; Pydar (or Pyder) has been variously explained: perhaps it derives from a Cornish word meaning 'a fourth part'; Stratton was at the time of Domesday an important manor and 200 years earlier it is mentioned as 'Strætneat' (etym. dub.); Trigg is explained in the separate article; East and West (Wivelshire) must have originally had a Cornish name but it is not recorded. The original English name was Twofold-shire, because it was divided into the two parts, East and West. The names East Twofold-shire and West Twofold-shire were then misdivided, giving the name Wivelshire.

List of hundreds in 1841
By 1841 Cornwall was composed of ten hundreds as listed below here:
 * Penwith (Penwyth)
 * Kerrier (Keryer)
 * Pydarshire (Pedera)
 * Powdershire (Pow Ereder)
 * Triggshire (Trigor)
 * Lesnewth (Lysnowyth)
 * Stratton (Stradneth)
 * East Wivelshire (Ryslegh)
 * West Wivelshire (Fawy)
 * Scilly (Syllan)

Penwith

 * St Buryan, Camborne, Crowan, St Erth, Gulval [alias Lanisly], Gwinear, Gwithian, St Hilary, Illogan, St Ives, St Just in Penwith, Lelant [Uny Lelant], St Levan, Ludgvan, Madron, Morvah, Paul, Perranuthnoe, Phillack, Redruth, Sancreed, Sennen, Towednack, Zennor.

Kerrier

 * St Anthony-in-Meneage, Breage, Budock, Constantine, Cury, Falmouth, Germoe, St Gluvias, Grade, Gunwalloe [alias Winnington], Gwennap with St Day, Helston, St Keverne, Landewednack, Mabe, Manaccan, St Martin-in-Meneage, Mawgan-in-Meneage, Mawnan, Mullion, Mylor, Perranarworthal, Ruan Major, Ruan Minor, Sithney, St Stithians, Wendron

Pydarshire

 * St Agnes, St Breock, Colan, St Columb Minor & St Columb Major, Crantock, Cubert, St Enoder, St Ervan, St Eval, St Issey, Lanhydrock, Lanivet, St Mawgan-in-Pydar, St Merryn, St Newlyn East, Padstow, Perranzabuloe, Little Petherick, St Wenn, Withiel

Powdershire

 * St Allen, St Anthony-in-Roseland, St Austell, St Blazey, St Clement, Cornelly, Creed-with-Grampound, Cuby-with-Tregony, St Dennis, St Erme, St Ewe, Feock, Fowey, Gerrans, Gorran, St Just-in-Roseland, Kea, Kenwyn, Ladock, Lamorran, Lanlivery, Lostwithiel, Luxulyan, Merther, Mevagissey, St Mewan, St Michael Caerhays, St Michael Penkevil, Philleigh, Probus, Roche, Ruan Lanihorne, St Sampson Golant, St Stephen-in-Brannel, Truro St Mary, Tywardreath, Veryan

Triggshire

 * Bodmin, Blisland, St Breward, Egloshayle, St Endellion, Helland, St Kew, St Mabyn, St Minver, St Teath, Temple, St Tudy

Lesnewth

 * Advent, Altarnun, St Clether, Davidstow, Forrabury, St Gennys, St Juliot, Lanteglos-by-Camelford, Lesnewth, Michaelstow, Minster, Otterham, Poundstock, Tintagel [with Bossiney], Treneglos, Trevalga, Warbstow.

Stratton

 * Boyton, Bridgerule, Jacobstow, Kilkhampton, Launcells, Marhamchurch, Morwenstow, Poughill, Stratton, North Tamerton, Week St Mary, Whitstone

East Wivelshire

 * Antony St Jacob, Botus Fleming, Callington, Calstock, Egloskerry, Landulph, Landrake [with St Erney], Laneast, Launceston St Mary Magdalene, Lawhitton, Lewannick, Lezant, Linkinhorne, Maker, St Mellion, Menheniot, North Hill, Pillaton, Quethiock, Rame, Sheviock, South Hill, South Petherwin, St Germans, St John, St Stephens-with-Newport, Stoke Climsland, St Dominick, St Ive, St Stephen-by-Saltash, St Thomas Apostle-by-Launceston, Torpoint, Tremaine, Tresmeer, Trewen

West Wivelshire

 * Boconnoc, Braddock, Cardinham, St Cleer, Duloe, St Keyne, Lanreath, Lansallos, Lanteglos by Fowey, Liskeard, St Martin-by-Looe, Morval, St Neot, Pelynt, St Pinnock, Talland, St Veep, Warleggan, St Winnow

Scilly

 * St Agnes, St Mary's, St Martin's, Bryher, Tresco, Samson

Other medieval divisions of Cornwall

 * Brannel – Bronel, meaning hilly place
 * Meneage – Manahek, meaning monastic lands
 * Roseland – Ros, meaning moor/heath
 * Rame Peninsula – Ros, meaning moor/heath

References and bibliography

 * Padel, O. J. (1985) Cornish Place-name Elements. Nottingham: English Place-name Society ISBN 0-904889-11-4

title: Hundreds of Cornwall


text:
SpeedTree

SpeedTree is a group of vegetation programming and modeling software products developed and sold by Interactive Data Visualization, Inc. (IDV) that generates virtual foliage for animations, architecture and in real time for video games and demanding real time simulations.

SpeedTree has been licensed to developers of a range of video games for Microsoft Windows, and the Xbox and PlayStation console series since 2002.

SpeedTree Cinema has been used in more than 40 major films since its release in 2009, including Iron Man 3, Star Trek Into Darkness, Life of Pi and Birdman, and was used to generate the lush vegetation of Pandora, in Avatar.

SpeedTree was awarded a Scientific and Technical Academy Award in 2015, presented to IDV founders Michael Sechrest and Chris King, and Senior Engineer Greg Croft.

History
SpeedTree was conceptualized at IDV in circa 2000, and originated due to the firm's lack of satisfaction with 3rd-party tree-generation software on the market.

The initial version of SpeedTreeCAD (CAD standing for "computer-aided design") was developed by IDV for a real-time golf simulation. Although backers pulled out of the golf project, IDV refined the CAD software as a 3D Studio Max plug-in for an animated architectural rendering, dubbing it SpeedTreeMAX.

SpeedTreeMAX was released in February 2002, and toward the end of 2002, IDV released SpeedTreeRT, a real-time foliage/tree middleware SDK, which allowed automatic levels of foliage detail, real-time wind effects, and multiple lighting options. IDV eventually released plug-ins for Maya as well, appropriately named SpeedTreeMAYA. In early 2009, IDV discontinued the SpeedTreeMAX and SpeedTreeMAYA plugins, replacing them with SpeedTree Modeler and Compiler products.

IDV released SpeedTree 5 in July 2009, a version representing a "complete re-engineering" of the software and the first versions of SpeedTree enabling hand modeling and editing of vegetation models: SpeedTree Modeler (replacing SpeedTreeCAD), SpeedTreeSDK (replacing SpeedTreeRT) and SpeedTree Compiler, which prepares SpeedTree files for real-time rendering.

SpeedTree Cinema was first released by IDV in 2009, based on version 5 technology. SpeedTree for Games (version 6) was released on November 7, 2011, and was essentially a re-branded version of SpeedTree 6 (Modeler + Compiler). The product was identified as SpeedTree for Games to distinguish it from other products not meant for gaming/real-time use.

SpeedTree Architect was released on October 15, 2012, and is designed for architectural 3D CAD use and 3D fly-throughs. IDV released updated versions of SpeedTree Cinema, SpeedTree Studio and SpeedTree Architect in November 2013. IDV released SpeedTree v7 for Unreal Engine 4 in July 2014. IDV released SpeedTree v7 for Unity 5 on the new engine version's launch date, in March 2015. IDV released SpeedTree for Games v7 on April 16, 2015.

IDV and three of its engineers received a Scientific and Technical Academy Award in 2015, for their SpeedTree Cinema product suite.

IDV was acquired by Unity Technologies in July 2021.

SpeedTree 9 was released on January 10, 2022. This version added new features such as freehand editing for branch bending. New branch features, zig-zag, jink, texture map skew correction can be found on the branch generator. Mesh Converter to help turn 3d trunk and branch scans into full tree models. Atlas control, HDRI lighting, USD export, material for backside of the leaf geometry

Suites
SpeedTree Cinema was released by IDV in 2009, and saw its first major use in Avatar by James Cameron. SpeedTree Cinema is designed for use in the film industry, and generates high-resolution meshes and high-quality textures for Autodesk 3ds Max, Autodesk Maya and Cinema4D. The Cinema edition includes SpeedTree Modeler, and the complete Tree Model Library designed by IDV, while with some other suites tree packs must be purchased separately. Several members of the SpeedTree line can simulate animated growth of trees and plants and seasonal changes, and can export data for animated wind effects.

SpeedTree Studio was released by IDV in 2009 as a less expensive companion to SpeedTree Cinema. It does not include all Cinema features, nor the complete Tree Model Library.

SpeedTree Architect was released in 2012, is designed for use in 3D architectural CAD. It generates meshes compatible with typical architectural applications such as Autodesk 3ds Max, Autodesk Maya and Rhino. The Architect edition also exports normal maps and UV maps, for physically-accurate rendering engines such as V-Ray and mental ray.

SpeedTree for Games is the edition of SpeedTree for video game development, contrasting with the Subscription edition offered to users of the Unity game development engine and certain versions of the Unreal Engine 4 engine. The Games edition includes the Modeler, Compiler, and SDK. This edition permits game developers to integrate SpeedTree runtime technology into any game engine of their choice. Meshes generated with the system are low poly, with multiple levels of detail, use texture atlases, and are typically stored in an efficient binary format.

SpeedTree Subscription Edition is a low-cost edition of SpeedTree Modeler and Runtime, targeted at independent game studios. The licensing fee is a US$19 monthly charge, as well as additional charges for tree packs. Subscribers get access to the SpeedTree editor, the ability to generate 3D models of trees and plants, such plants being exclusively usable with either Unreal Engine 4 or Unity, depending on the license. Subscribers can download additional tree model packs from the Model Library, and pricing varies between packs.

Components
SpeedTree Modeler is a Windows-based specialized modeling tool for designing foliage. The modeler features a combination of procedural tree generation, and hand-editing tools, to draw trees or transform individual tree parts. Procedural tree generation uses configuration such as branch length, branching angles and bark texture to generate a tree in a variety of formats. Newer versions support a drag-and-drop interface that automatically blends branch intersections and handles branch collisions.

SpeedTree Compiler is a software that enables creation of efficient tree models for use in real-time rendering or video games. It generates texture atlases and compiles and optimizes tree models for real-time use.

SpeedTree SDK is a multi-platform C++ SDK that efficiently handles rendering of SpeedTree-generated trees and forests. The engine is designed to integrate and operate within a larger game engine, with ready-made support for Unreal Engine, Unity and OGRE. The engine contains optimized systems to cull off-screen trees, and to determine level of detail for on-screen trees. Full source code is available to licensees for use in video games and other real-time applications, and modification of the engine is supported. The engine is built to work with Microsoft Windows, Mac OS X, Xbox, PlayStation and PlayStation Vita.

Partners
IDV is a licensed middleware partner with PlayStation 3, PlayStation 4, Xbox 360 and Xbox One.

IDV has partnered with Epic Games in order to integrate the software with Epic's Unreal Engine 4 and Unreal Engine 3 and the free UDK engine released in November 2009. Partnerships have also been formed between IDV and BigWorld Tech, the Vision Engine by Havok, Multiverse Network, the Gamebryo engine by Emergent Game Technologies and the OGRE open-source rendering engine by Torus Knot.

Awards

 * SpeedTree won a Scientific and Technical Academy Award in 2015.
 * SpeedTree was accorded a Primetime Emmy Engineering Award in October 2015.
 * 2015 Develop Industry Excellence Award Winner, in the Design & Creativity Tool category. Develop, a UK-based magazine and website serving the game industry, first recognized industry achievements in a variety of categories in 2003.
 * 2016 Develop Industry Excellence Awards Finalist, in the Design & Creativity Tool/Tech & Services category.
 * 2008 Develop Industry Excellence Awards Finalist, in the Technology & Services, Tools Providers category.
 * 2005 Frontline Award, Middleware category. This award program, sponsored by Game Developer magazine, recognizes exceptional game development tools.
 * Frontline Award Finalist: 2003, 2004, 2006, 2009, 2012
 * MT2 Top 100: 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013. The MT2 Top 100 awards are sponsored by Kerrigan Media International and Military Training Technology to recognize companies and technologies that have made a significant impact in the military training industry.

Video game industry
SpeedTree for Games was licensed for its first video games, including The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion, in December 2002. SpeedTree has been licensed for PC and next-generation console titles in a wide variety of genres. Studios that have used SpeedTree, or published games featuring the technology, include:

 * Activision
 * Bethesda Softworks
 * BioWare
 * Blue Byte
 * Bungie
 * Capcom
 * CD Projekt Red
 * The Creative Assembly
 * DICE
 * Electronic Arts
 * Epic Games
 * FromSoftware
 * Frontier Developments
 * Funcom Productions
 * Gearbox Software
 * Hello Games
 * Insomniac
 * Koei
 * Larian Studios
 * Massive Entertainment

 * Microsoft Game Studios
 * Namco Bandai
 * NCsoft
 * Ninja Theory
 * Obsidian Entertainment
 * Epic Games Poland
 * Piranha Bytes
 * Rockstar Games
 * Rocksteady Studios
 * SEGA
 * Sony Computer Entertainment
 * Sony Interactive Entertainment
 * Square Enix
 * Sucker Punch
 * Take-Two Interactive
 * Tango Gameworks
 * Ubisoft
 * Volition
 * Warner Bros.
 * WEBZEN

Selected recent, upcoming and/or popular titles featuring SpeedTree for Games:

Film and animation industry
Following the release of SpeedTree Cinema in 2009, SpeedTree saw its first major cinematic use in 2009's Avatar, in which the technology provided the vegetation for the flyover of the planet Pandora in the first frames of the movie, as well as other scenes. Known movies and television productions featuring SpeedTree include:

Real-time applications
SpeedTree is being used in the following real-time projects and offerings:
 * America's Army project, both the America's Army game and in non-public applications used for training, simulation, education, virtual prototyping and outreach
 * An optional foliage module with the Vega Prime visualization product line. Vega Prime is a 3D visual simulation software package used by the global military industry and in other game and non-game markets.
 * An Apache attack helicopter FLIR simulation developed for the US Army by Camber Corp. for pilot training under night flying conditions
 * The Expresso Fitness Virtual Reality Bike, a cardio exercise system developed by Expresso Fitness and sold to gyms and home users
 * A combat simulation developed by Emergent Game Technologies for the US Department of Defense
 * A project under development by the Germany-based division of European Aeronautic Defence and Space (EADS)
 * The Forest Fire project, developed by the Media Convergence Laboratory (MCL) at the University of Central Florida. The project is helping to determine if a virtual reality presentation of wildfires can influence local residents to invest in prescribed burns and other protective efforts.

title: SpeedTree


text:
Talk:Walther Model

The correct Name is Walter Model, so why is the lemma with this h in the title? Could somebody move the page (delete the redirect before)? Thanks. Darkone 13:49, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

 * Page moved to Walter Model. Jim_Lockhart 13:38, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Wargames
There's a story Model in Nov '44, while at 5h Pz Army, fed real combat data into a running map exercise & used the results in action. Trekphiler 19:32, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

title: Talk:Walther Model


text:
Talk:Mainstream (terminology)

The statement "Mainstream is thought to be the antithesis of individuality, yet this is only the view of a small number of people." may not have been accurate. It is hard to accurately say just how many people might agree with that statement since it would seem that many people might not want to go against the mainstream due to societal pressure even if they had a different view then the mainstream. Thus few people would express agreement with the above statement as it would indicate a disagreement with concept of the mainstream. Thus I change the statement to one that states they some people people have expressed the above opinion without trying to quantify how many people agree with it. --Cab88 13:49, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

Mainstream-Cult 2 articles
By their "majority rule" definitions,classical music is subculture music (hence Fricsay has Cult following),and Chaucer's becomes subculture English?

Mainstream in Education
Removed addition because of being off-topic in that section and not being NPOV. Slightly rewritten it could be added to the sociology section. Intinn 08:19, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

literature
We need a section on mainstream literature. It's mentioned at the top, but is not explained below.

Mainstream Music
"This music in most cases involves little talent and does not push any musical boundaries."

that sounds an extreme opinion to me.

Mainstream Music
Good god who wrote this section? 'This music in most cases involves little talent and does not push any musical boundaries'. So The Beatles didn't push any boundaries? So Radiohead pushed no boundaries? So Nirvana pushed no boundaries? So The Who pushed no boundaries? So Oasis pushed no boundaries? I could go on and on... and not just boundaries. Many artists in the mainstream are there because they are the MOST talented. If this section wasn't written by one of those obscure underground supporters then who the hell wrote it?!!

It needs to be changed...quickly 60.224.193.180 11:53, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

But we must remember that they where not mainstream to start off with, and thats why they broke boundaries. the moment these bands became mainstream they slowly lost their "original sounds" and became just that, mainstream

title: Talk:Mainstream (terminology)