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Patrick Young Alexander

Patrick Young Alexander (28 March 1867 – 7 July 1943) was a British aeronautical pioneer fascinated by the possibility of heavier-than-air flight. He was an enthusiastic balloonist and he was also particularly active in meteorology. He performed many meteorological and aviation experiments, designing and building his own equipment. He travelled widely, visiting Australia in his youth and later making many visits to USA – crossing the Atlantic at least 50 times – he travelled widely in Europe and visited Mexico, Russia, Siberia and Africa in pursuit of his interests.

Patrick Alexander was respected by fellow aeronautical pioneers and knew Octave Chanute, the Wright brothers, Alberto Santos-Dumont, Lawrence Hargrave, Louis Blériot, Henry Farman, Ferdinand von Zeppelin, Charles Rolls of Rolls-Royce and Major Baden Baden-Powell, as well as European heads of state and royalty. Patrick, a world traveller, arranged meetings between those interested in aeronautics, and gave lectures on the progress being made.

Early years

Alexander was born at Hern Villa, Belvedere, Erith, Kent. His mother was Harriotte Emma and his father was Andrew Alexander from Scotland. He had an elder brother, John Edmond who was three years older.

His father, Andrew Alexander, was a civil engineer of some standing and a mechanical engineer. He was interested in aeronautics and was a founder member of the Royal Aeronautical Society in 1866. He presented some papers to the society including "Power in Relation to Weight in Aerial Navigation". In 1875, he went to see Thomas Moy's Aerial Steamer at The Crystal Palace. This machine had many interesting design features and may have achieved a brief hop into the air; accounts vary. That year, Andrew Alexander became manager of the Cyclops works of Charles Cammell and Company in Sheffield, where he worked on the improvement of armour plate for warships.

Andrew Alexander was a practical-minded man, unlikely to be prone to flights of fancy, yet at a time when many ridiculed the idea of heavier-than-air flight, he told Patrick he was sure that the problems of aviation would be solved. He was clearly a major influence on Patrick's life.

In 1878, Patrick Alexander, doubtless encouraged by his father, built an elastic driven model aeroplane of the Penaud type. In the late summer of that year, Patrick was taken by his father to see the Paris Exhibition. One attraction was irresistible: the enormous hydrogen balloon of Henri Giffard, which was capable of taking 52 passengers at a time on a tethered ascent to 500 m. The experience left a deep impression on Alexander, then 11 years old.

When Andrew Alexander left the Cyclops works, the Alexander family moved from Sheffield to Bath and Patrick decided on a career in the Merchant Navy.

At sea
On 1 April 1885, just 3 days after his 18th birthday, Patrick Alexander signed as an apprentice Merchant Navy officer. The very next day he sailed upon the Minero, a barque of 478 tones bound for Fremantle in Western Australia, a distance of 12500 mi in a vessel powered only by the wind.

60 days into the journey, while aloft helping with the sails, Patrick lost his grip and fell. As he hit the deck, he broke his leg. The ship was still three weeks away from port and there was little that could be done other than to strap Patrick into a bunk for the rest of the journey, letting the leg heal without expert attention.

The Minero had left England with a crew short by one member. At Fremantle, two of the crew jumped ship, possibly encouraged by rumours of gold being found in the desert; replacement crewmen were hard to come by and only one could be found. The Minero set sail for Cossack and Port Walcott some 1000 mi to the North, seeking a cargo, probably of wool and pearl shell, for the return to London. Patrick was getting about with the aid of a crutch and, given the shortage of crew, he was helping as best he could. On 10 August, in rough weather on a wet and slippery deck, Alexander fell again and re-broke his injured leg. He was taken to Victoria Hospital at Geraldton. The Minero returned to London without him. Patrick returned to England; despite treatment, it was clear that his injuries would leave him lame for life.

In 1886, while he was away from England, Patrick Alexander's elder brother died. The following year, Patrick's mother, Emma, died. In 1890, Patrick's father, Andrew, died at the age of 62. Now aged 23, Patrick was quite alone. Patrick's father had left him everything: almost £60,000 (equivalent to £ in .) At the time it was enough for a gentleman to live in some comfort. Patrick was to use his inheritance to pursue his various interests.

Taking off
Patrick Alexander became increasingly interested in aviation and related subjects, such as meteorology, parachutes, balloons, and propellers. By about 1888 he was working on wireless telegraphy. The French aviation historian Charles Dolfus recorded that Patrick Alexander was the first to suggest that wireless could be used for the automatic direction of airships and aeroplanes and said Patrick Alexander was a "Pioneer of Space".

On 9 June 1891, Patrick Alexander made a gas balloon ascent in the company of aeronaut Griffith Brewer: this was the first of a number of balloon ascents that would lead to his becoming a licensed balloonist. Patrick ordered a three-man (some say five-man) balloon from balloon manufacturer Percival G. Spencer, naming his balloon Queen of the West. Throughout the summer of 1892, Patrick and his friend Philip Braham made a number of flights. They collected meteorological observations and measurements and took photographs. Their adventures were recorded in a number of local newspapers.

Also in 1891, Patrick Alexander acquired an 8 in aperture refractor telescope which was erected in Bath. The telescope was a substantial instrument, which together with its mounting, must have weighed several tons. The telescope was fully equipped for astronomical observations and Patrick was a member of the Royal Astronomical Society until 1921. Although he enjoyed showing his telescope to friends and distinguished visitors, any interest he had in astronomy was overshadowed by his other passions; the telescope was probably a scientific toy. Barry Bellinger suggests that the telescope was used to track pilot balloons released into the air, before releasing any main balloons; however, a telescope of this size and type seems unsuited to such a task.

In 1893, Patrick Alexander ordered a balloon of 100000 cuft capacity from Percival Spencer. At the time, C.G. Spencer and Sons' largest advertised balloon was of 80000 cuft and when it was made it attracted much public interest. Capable of lifting 12 passengers, it was one of the largest balloons yet made. Alexander named her the Majestic. In 1894, Patrick took it to Germany where he conducted scientific ascents that excited interest among German scientists and the lay public, as well as that of Kaiser Wilhelm II.

Ever since the first balloon ascent by the Montgolfier Brothers in 1783, it had been realised that for balloons to be really useful, they had to be navigable. Patrick Alexander applied his mind to this problem of airship propulsion. In 1893 and 1894 he filed a number of patents. His ideas included reciprocating oars and an adjustable-pitch propeller that resembled a pair of fans. One patent includes a means of heating the gas in the balloon envelope by using piped steam, the steam pipe also served to support the balloon in the shape of a parachute in the event of the balloon being burst or punctured. None of Patrick's ideas ever came to anything; but throughout his life, he never lost faith in the practicality of airships.

In Bath Patrick Alexander set up the first of a series of workshops. His most prestigious workshop was The Mount at Batheaston purchased in 1900 and here he had a gas supply brought into the garden and a balloon inflation valve installed. Town gas, although not as light as Hydrogen, was readily available and very much less expensive; it was, of course, highly flammable. His workshops were fully equipped and employed several people, there he designed and manufactured experimental balloons and meteorological instruments.

Patrick Alexander joined the Aero clubs of Berlin, Paris and America and, at one time, that of Austria.

In 1900 the first Zeppelin made its maiden flight, observed by Alexander. The Zeppelin was launched from a floating assembly hall on Lake Constance; Patrick observed from a motor boat in order to be as close as possible. Later that year, at the invitation of the Berlin Metrological Institute, he made a flight in the world's largest balloon, a non-dirigible with a capacity of 9000 m3. The objective was to make metrological measurements and break the existing endurance records. It is indicative of the esteem in which Patrick was held that he, a non-German, was offered a place. The balloon was equipped against every eventuality and stocked with rations for 20 days. The balloon took off on 27 September, just before 6 pm. The same evening, their trailing rope became stuck in trees and gusty winds caused the crew to lose control. In the dark it was decided to release the gas and land the balloon. The ambitious expedition ended just 20 km from the start.

Patrick Alexander was very interested in the development of heavier-than-air flying machines. Early in the 1890s, he travelled to Germany to meet Otto Lilienthal who was experimenting with gliders, and he continued to study ideas from a wide variety of sources. In 1896, Hiram Stevens Maxim came close to achieving flight when his huge steam-powered machine briefly lifted from the rails that also restrained it. Patrick was in contact with Octave Chanute and others experimenting with flight. In the US, sometime before 1903, Patrick visited Samuel Pierpont Langley whose successful models had attracted much attention. At Christmas 1902 he visited the Wright brothers at Kitty Hawk.

On hearing that Patrick Alexander was planning a return trip to the US in October 1903, the Wright brothers, not known for welcoming interruptions to their work, said they would be happy to meet him. However, Patrick missed a crucial telegram and never received their message. Patrick must have been most disappointed to have missed the opportunity to witness the first flights of the Wright Flyer on 17 December 1903.

Aldershot in Hampshire was an insignificant village until, in 1854, it was selected as the home of the British Army. It was in Aldershot that the army established the Army Balloon section. In June 1904 the American born aviation pioneer Samuel Franklin Cody came to Aldershot to test his kites. There, in collaboration with the Army, he worked on balloons, kites and aeroplanes. That same year Patrick Alexander moved to nearby Mytchett in Surrey where he was involved with the Army Balloon section. He shared a house with Cody who later went on to become the first man in England to fly an aeroplane.

1905 was a year of public generosity. Chard in Somerset had been the location of some remarkable aviation experiments by John Stringfellow in 1848: he constructed a model aeroplane that is claimed to have achieved the first ever power flight. Some of the relics of these experiments were eventually bought for the Washington Museum. Patrick Alexander obtained and had restored at his expense, Stringfellow's earlier models and presented them to the Victoria and Albert Museum in London. Also, Patrick offered his telescope – the 8" refractor – to the War Office. The offer included the cost of construction of a suitable observatory to house it. The offer was accepted and a site was chosen. In December 1906 the Aldershot Observatory was officially opened, the opening ceremony was attended by several high-ranking officials and guests from Aldershot civic council, and Patrick Alexander himself.

In January 1910, Patrick Alexander issued the conditions of a £1,000 Alexander Award, a prize that he would offer for the development of a lightweight engine suitable for aviation. The prize was offered through the auspices of the Aerial League of which Alexander was a founding member and the testing would be performed by the National Physical Laboratory. (The prize, which was Alexander's own money, was a considerable sum; £1,000 in 1910 is equivalent to £0 in .) Tests were carried out one year later. The Green Engine by Aster Engineering Ltd performed particularly well and, by unanimous agreement, won the prize.

First World War
With the outbreak of war, Patrick Alexander was keen to make himself useful. He was soon in America again where he aided British propaganda by making statements in the American press. He was well known to New York journalists who reported his views at length and naturally Patrick expressed his view on the importance of aviation in the conflict. In 1917 he was given a job by the newly formed Air Ministry at the Metrological Office at Falmouth; here he worked until the end of the war.

Teaching
At the end of the First World War, Patrick Alexander was fifty years old and his inheritance was all but gone. Even his prodigious energies had been unable to keep up with the developments in aviation that had taken place during the conflict. He spent the rest of his life at the Imperial Service College, Windsor. There he taught students the basics of aeronautical principles.

Legacy
Patrick Alexander died on 7 July 1943, almost penniless – having given most of his money away. Today, he is not well known; having failed to make any singular, lasting contribution to aviation and there being just a few modest memorials to his name. His primary contribution to the history of aviation was that through his tireless efforts, many journeys, writings, public speeches, and generous donations he was responsible for collecting and disseminating ideas across nations and continents without which development in the field would have proceeded more slowly.

He was a generous man – generous with his time, his intellect and with his money. An inheritance and his business ability made him wealthy, but financial success meant little to him. He was driven by native curiosity and ambition, and yet he was always supportive of the efforts of others, often making generous financial contributions, and was not jealous of their achievements.

Patrick Alexander was buried in a small churchyard in Windsor. Ironically his headstone faces the flight path from Heathrow Airport, and features a simple inscription:

Something Attempted Something Done

title: Patrick Young Alexander


text:
Talk:Hong Kong national football team

Requested move
This article has now been moved despite no discussion has been taken. The reasons for which it was moved, as I see it, was that Hong Kong itself is not a sovereign state, and the word "national" was therefore considered by the users who moved the article as incorrect (the users also have past records to equate country with sovereign state, and asserts only sovereign states are countries). The users who have moved this article has no intention to nominate it for discussion, and one of them has declined to restore it to the original title to allow a discussion to take place.

One of the two users who moved this article has also moved Macau national football team (talk) and Guam national football team (talk) based on the same reasons. — Instantnood 18:45, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one sentence explanation, then sign your vote with ~

 * Oppose the move. China Daily,  InvestHK , BBC Sport , Hong Kong Football Association  and Man Utd  calls it Hong Kong national team. The English word "national" is not exclusively for sovereign states. The word is not always used in a manner that stick with the definitions of "nation". Please don't equate "nation", "country" and "sovereign state". — Instantnood 18:45, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Oppose If China Daily has no problem with the term, then I dont see why we should have a problem.--Jiang 18:48, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH I don't know what I'm opposing or supporting. HKFA calls it "representative team" so that's where I moved it to.  That's what I support. SchmuckyTheCat 19:43, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Oppose 1. IOC calls their members National Olympic Committees, which include Hong Kong and Guam, so I don't see the problem of the teams being called national teams. 2. The team name is not a trademark or a brand name, so whatever the FA calls it does not take precedence over clarity and accuracy. From Naming conventions:
 * Generally, article naming should give priority to what the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize, with a reasonable minimum of ambiguity, while at the same time making linking to those articles easy and second nature. Chanheigeorge 19:34, 6 October 2005 (UTC)

It was requested that this article be renamed but there was no consensus for it be moved. Dragons flight 00:09, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Add any additional comments

 * I wonder what is the purpose of this move request when the move has already been made.--Huaiwei 19:14, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Response to user:Huaiwei's comment at WP:RM : The HKFA calls it Hong Kong national team too, as well as a quote of the HKFA president in an article on the website of a department of the Hong Kong Government (see above). — Instantnood 19:36, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * And that was in just 5 occasions in the entire site. "Hong Kong Representative Team" on the other hand produces 59. The numbers speaks for itself.--Huaiwei 19:42, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

Moved from WP:RM page (Philip Baird Shearer):
 * The Hong Kong team is not refered to as a national team by its governing body, and it is not a national team. I would caution admins in carrying out these moves, as instantnood did not follow the steps required for RM as above.--Huaiwei 19:08, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Instantnood has the arrows backwards, methinks, he is proposing to move them to where they actually are. Regardless, the articles are currently in their correct places "regional" for regions, and the HK team goes by "representative team" by it's association. SchmuckyTheCat 19:51, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * 1. IOC calls their members National Olympic Committees, which include Hong Kong and Guam, so I don't see the problem of the teams being called national teams. 2. The team name is not a trademark or a brand name, so whatever the FA calls it does not take precedence over clarity and accuracy. From Naming conventions:
 * Generally, article naming should give priority to what the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize, with a reasonable minimum of ambiguity, while at the same time making linking to those articles easy and second nature. Chanheigeorge 01:27, 6 October 2005 (UTC)

Historical Flags
Conventionally, the flag in use at the time of the historical event is used when applied to a sports team. As such, the Hong Kong Flag adopted in 1910 should be used for Hong Kong's first international, and the Hong Kong Flag adopted in 1959 should be used for Hong Kong's worst defeat which came in 1980. I do not know how to do this, however. Both are available at Flag of Hong Kong. - RPIRED 02:23, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

 * What was the colour before 1997? Iianq 16:32, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Neologism reverted
In English the team is officially referred to as the "Hong Kong national team": Hansard, InvestHK, InvestHK. Other sources: Manchester United, Manchester United. Antineologism (talk) 21:56, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
 * This is absolute nonsense. The team is officially known simply as the "Hong Kong team" in English as far as the The Hong Kong Football Association is concerned, with its Chinese name as "香港代表隊", translated as "Hong Kong Representative Team".--Huaiwei (talk) 23:48, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

 * Hong Kong is bilingual. Please present the evidence that the team is known in English as the "Hong Kong football representative team". Antineologism (talk) 13:27, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * If you are similarly bilingual, I do believe you are able to comprehend my post above which I would think already addresses your query sufficiently.--Huaiwei (talk) 20:42, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

in Wikipedia, all team were ended at "national football team" except some were "national soccer team" or "Men's national". Matthew_hk  t  c  05:51, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Has this been established as a naming convention? Even if so, a naming convention which is not based on wikipedia policies of WP:NPOV. and WP:V, and which does not conform to WP:Commonname is certainly likely to come under contestation, as is happening now.--Huaiwei (talk) 20:42, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Requested move (2nd)
The result was Move per the general naming convention. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  22:36, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Hong Kong football team → Hong Kong national football team — Just follow the MOS of the title please. — Matthew_hk   t  c  05:56, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Survey

 * Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with  or  , then sign your comment with  . Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's naming conventions.

— Antineologism (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * Support or move to the name of "Hong Kong football representative team" - Yeah, I agree that Hong Kong is not a national country. However, MOS decided what name we should use. And "Hong Kong football team" may lead confusion. I mean it could be refer to the local football teams such as South China AA, Eastern AA, Convey Sunhei, Happy Valley, or so on. However, if wanting to avoid confusion on the view of Hong Kong is a country, "representative" is a good idea. Raymond "Giggs" Ko 06:51, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose or move to the name of "Hong Kong football representative team" - In fact, this article was originally at "Hong Kong football representative team" until some individuals in wikipedia decided to unilaterally accord it "national" status when the club has never accorded itself that designation. The MOS is merely a guideline, and it will not supersede wikipedia policies of WP:NPOV (inserting a "national" tag may be interpreted as a promotion of "HK nationalism"), WP:OR (the team's entire site doesn't mention the word "national" anywhere) or WP:V (the only sources who do on the internet are not authoritative on such matters, using the word "national" out of mere convenience or assumed "convention"). And if we are to consider Wikipedia's naming conventions, "Hong Kong national football team" actually has less google counts than "Hong Kong football team", so COMMONNAMES will not be in the favour of this move request either.--Huaiwei (talk) 07:26, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Support Matthew_hk's proposal, and oppose "Hong Kong football representative team". It should be Huaiwei to request instead. But what he did was to move it without consultation, and made an irrelevant edit to the redirect to avoid his act being undone. Antineologism (talk) 13:32, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment It may be noted that this or this were not "consulted" moves either. I fail to comprehend how adding categories to redirects can be considered "irrelevant".--Huaiwei (talk) 20:48, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose or move to the name of "Hong Kong football representative team" - I think the fact that Hong Kong is not a nation is a good enough reason that the team should not be called Hong Kong national football team. However, Hong Kong football team is a relatively general term. I think changing the name to "Hong Kong football representative team" is a better choice. Checkiema (talk) 14:30, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It would be important to note that the word national is not so restrictive. Those that are not sovereign states can use it too. Both the Hong Kong government and the legislature use it, as well as the state-run English-language newspaper of communist China. "Hong Kong football representative team" is Huaiwei's invention. There is no result on Google. Antineologism (talk) 20:39, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment If I may repeat comments already made in the above section, the The Hong Kong Football Association calls the team "Hong Kong Team" in English and "香港代表隊" in Chinese, translated as "Hong Kong Representative Team"[]. Google searches for "Hong Kong Representative Team" certainly shows up entries, so it must have been a case of sheer coincidence that each of those sources conjures up the same name as I did? Of course, we only add "football" to ""Hong Kong Representative Team" to avoid confusions with similar teams for other sports who may bear the same name.--Huaiwei (talk) 20:36, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Support - We have England national football team and Wales national football team and they're not sovereign states, so why shouldn't we have Hong Kong national football team. – PeeJay 13:13, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment The name of one entity does not necessarily determine the name of another. If we are to use the same logic, the word "national" should be dropped from both examples listed above, since neither has the word "national" in their team names.--Huaiwei (talk) 20:54, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Support proposed move, but oppose Hong Kong football representative team. As noted in the earlier discussion at the top of this page, many media agencies (including some Chinese) have no problem at all with referring to Hong Kong as a "national" team, and nor should we. Lets not start inventing terms which may technically be "correct", but have no common usage whatsoever. PC78 (talk) 17:20, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment There is simply no evidence presented to suggest that "Hong Kong national football team" has greater common usage than "Hong Kong football team". If we may ignore the fallacies of a google search for now, ""hong kong football team"-wikipedia" has 158 results and ""hong kong national football team"-wikipedia" has 122, which would not be convincing as far as COMMONNAMES is concerned. It should be further noted that this search dosent include "Hong Kong Team" itself, which is the official name. When one tries "football national "hong kong team" -wikipedia", we get 683 results. "football -national "hong kong team" -wikipedia" produces 1390.
 * A highly selective range of sources do a bad job of establishing usage patterns. The People's Daily published in China uses "hong kong football team", as does Microsoft, IHT and the Sports Federation & Olympic Committee of Hong Kong. The South China Morning Post uses "Hong Kong Team" , as does Channelnews Asia, Bangkok Post, KNCA, BBC, FIFA, China Sports Today etc, etc. The EAFF mentions "Hong Kong Representative Team". For every instance of the word "national" appearing in a source, there will be at least two other sources without.
 * As for the claim that Chinese news agencies use the word national, do note that both sources cited from the China Daily site are news pieces from agencies other then Xinhua. All news written by Xinhua are indicated prominently.--Huaiwei (talk) 21:24, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Support "Hong Kong national football team" as per general association football naming consensus. --Jimbo[online] 19:07, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment. Kindly cite this naming consensus, and if this is applicable in the context of a team's actual name.--Huaiwei (talk) 03:52, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Support. The team competes in international football, therefore it is by definition a national team. See also Chinese Taipei national football team and Macau national football team. I think we need to call this team a national team to create a clearer difference between it and the Hong Kong League XI. Jmorrison230582 (talk) 21:28, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment. And this remains an unverified self-definition not supported by credible sources. Both the Hong Kong and Macau teams are officially called "representation teams", for they represent a region, not a nation. One will be hardpressed to find credible sources which rebukes this.--Huaiwei (talk) 19:51, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Any additional comments: Matthew_hk   t  c  05:56, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:HKFA crest.svg
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2010 Long Teng Cup
How come the 2010 Long Teng Cup has been removed from the article although you won it? Druryfire (talk) 07:35, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

Coaches
The table contradicted with Hong Kong national football team results. According to the search of newspaper Hsu King Shing was supposed the coach of Hong Kong in 1970 Jakarta Anniversary Tournament, which for unknown reason, NOT in FIFA.com database. However, the tournament consisted of 4 games, so the 3 games under Hsu in the table of Hong Kong national football team came from?

Also, according to another news, in 1971 Chan Fai Hung was leading Hong Kong League XI for a friendly against an Austrian club, while the coach of Hong Kong was. It is worth to mention it. Matthew_hk  t  c  19:43, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

 * In June 1971 against Thailand national football team the coach was yet another people 曾啟榮 Matthew_hk   t  c  20:23, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

First game
I think the Macau-Hong Kong Interport was not the first unofficial game. In 1937 Shanghai-Hong Kong Interport was held. Matthew_hk  t  c  22:48, 12 September 2017 (UTC)

Caps
Where are the sources for the number of caps each player has won? Any official source? CityPride (talk) 10:47, 12 September 2019 (UTC)

Source for this Page
Found this website that includes all-time records Hong Kong national football team statistics. But I am confused about the sites authenticity. Need help from any other editor who can verify if the site is trustworthy or not. As far as I belive, I am feeling positive about it. But,double check is a better option. here's the site link:https://www.11v11.com/teams/hong-kong/tab/stats/season/1962/ Mommmyy (talk) 08:48, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Afghanistan national football team which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 15:25, 23 September 2023 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Afghanistan national football team which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 14:55, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Talk:Hong Kong national football team


text:
VocalTec

VocalTec Communications Inc. is an Israeli telecom equipment provider. The company was founded in 1985 by Alon Cohen and Lior Haramaty, who patented the first Voice over IP audio transceiver. VocalTec has supplied major customers such as Deutsche Telekom, Telecom Italia, and many others.

History
VocalTec was founded in 1985 by Alon Cohen and Lior Haramaty while still serving together in the IDF, and was officially incorporated in 1989. Its initial operations were devoted to research, development and commercialization of products which provided audio and voice capabilities to personal computers and over computer networks. Cohen and Haramaty developed and manufactured a PC sound card (SpeechBoard TM) that was sold mainly to the local market for various uses such as educational, advertising, radio broadcasting and to the visually-impaired community in Israel with a unique Text to Speech software enabling blind people to use a computer in Hebrew as well as English. As Text to Speech was not available in Hebrew at all, and rarely available in English, they developed both from scratch, utilizing Haramaty's voice, and a user-update-able dictionary of words that was periodically merged between all users.

Other projects during the mid to late 80s included Audio editing software, external audio card (mainly for laptops) that was connected the parallel (printer) port, standalone digital audio playback device for frozen desert trucks, multimedia presentation with audio (based on IBM's Story Board presentation software), a system for the disabled (mute) with text to speech which enabled "talking" and conducting phone calls, broadcasting recording, editing and transfer system for offshore radio station, automated IVR information systems, voice messaging over LAN and many other projects utilizing digital audio.

In 1990, technology entrepreneur Elon Ganor joined the company to manage International Sales & Marketing, and later on was nominated as CEO.

In 1993, VocalTec introduced The CAT to the international market, a peripheral device that provided audio capability for personal computers. In 1993 and 1994, the company introduced additional products, including CATBoard, a full duplex audio card, an internal audio card that provided high level compression. Net sales of these products totaled approximately $0.3 million, $0.4 Million and $0.2 Million in 1993, 1994 and the first nine months of 1995, respectively, and the Company did not expect to recognize significant revenues from sales of these products in the future.

In early 1993 the company partnered with ClassX, a group of innovative teenagers led by Ofer Shem-Tov (a childhood friend of Haramaty) to develop MS Windows audio drivers and related software. ClassX was acquired by VocalTec in 1993 and became the core of VocalTec's software and network development team, and the company recruited Rami Amit as a hardware engineer (also a childhood friend of Haramaty and Shem-Tov).

Despite Ganor's initial objection, VocalTec's management decided to shift the company's focus to software, and in 1993 VocalChat was born, a software that enabled voice communication from one PC to another on a local and wide area network, and VocalChat LAN/WAN, hardware and software products that enable real-time voice conversations over local and wide area computer networks. The software was developed, based on Cohen & Haramaty's Audio Transceiver design, by a group of developers including Ofer Shem Tov, Ofer Kahana, Elad Sion (died young in a car accident), Dror Tirosh, Rami Amit and others. The software was presented in Atlanta in May 1993 at the Network InterOp trade show. In 1994 support for Internet Protocol was added and on Friday, February 10, 1995 “Internet Phone“ was launched with a near full page Wall Street Journal article by WSJ Boston Correspondent Bill Bulkeley, “Hello World! Audible chats On the Internet” was the header.

VocalTec Internet Phone
VocalTec released the first ever Internet VoIP application in February 1995. The product was named Internet Phone but according to Wired magazine many people simply called it iPhone; and was the world's first VoIP software.

The software was invented by Alon Cohen and Lior Haramaty, the two co-founders of VocalTec Ltd. At the base of the Internet Phone was the invention of Alon Cohen and Lior Haramaty named the "Audio Transceiver", which managed the dynamic jitter buffer that was critical for achieving adaptive lower possible audio latency along with handling packet loss, packet re-ordering, and receiver transmitter sample rate adjustments. The first implementation of the "Audio Transceiver" was carried out by Elad Sion.

Initial Public Offering
VocalTec had an initial public offering on the NASDAQ on February 6, 1996. The company sold 2,500,000 shares for $19 a share. 1,750,00 shares were sold by the company and 750,000 were sold by selling shareholders including Elon Ganor, VocalTec's CEO and his brother in law, Ami Tal, through their holding of La Cresta International Trading Inc. VocalTec's leadership who managed its successful IPO included: Elon Ganor - chairman of the board and CEO, Ami Tal - Director and Chief Operating Officer, Alon Cohen - Director and Chief Technology Officer, Lior Haramaty - Director and Vice President Technical Marketing, Yahal Zilka - Chief Financial officer and Secretary, Daniel Nissan - Vice President Marketing, Ohad Finkelstein - Vice President International Sales,

In 1997, Deltathree, an American company engaged in the business of voice over IP telephony services, launched an Internet-based international low cost calling service using VocalTec's VoIP technology, and VocalTec Internet Phone "PC to Phone" system. The same year, Europe's largest telecommunications company, Deutsche Telekom, bought a 21.1 percent stake in VocalTec for $48.3 million, in addition to purchasing $30 million in telephony products, services, and support over the following two-and-a-half years. During the Dot-com bubble the company's share peaked at a price of $3,363 per share on March 3, 2000 (split adjusted).

In 2005, the company completed a business combination with Tdsoft, a provider of VoIP Gateways. and refocused on providing carrier-class multimedia and voice-over-IP systems for communication service providers. The company's Essentra suite, comprised the essential building blocks required to develop a next-generation-network, addressing customers’ specific requirements in trunking, peering and residential/enterprise VoIP applications.

Reverse merger with magicJack
On July 16, 2010, MagicJack took over VocalTec in a reverse takeover.

ITXC
In 1997, VocalTec founded ITXC Corporation a US-based wholesale provider of Internet-based phone calls. The ITXC voice-over-IP network was powered by the VocalTec technology. The company was founded after Vocaltec's CEO at the time, Elon Ganor met Tom Evslin from AT&T (who led at the time WorldNet AT&T ISP initiative) in a conference, ITXC was founded, with Tom Evslin as its CEO and cofounder. VocalTec invested an initial $500K ITXC Corporation and gave a credit of $1Million in VoIP Gateway equipment in exchange of 19.9% of the company, AT&T followed with an additional investment. ITXC became the world's largest VoIP Carrier reaching a market cap of about $8 Billion as a Nasdaq company in 2000 (prior to the March 2000 Dot com crash).

In 2003 ITXC was acquired by Teleglobe.

title: VocalTec


text:
Talk:Guam national football team

Requested move
This article has now been moved despite not discussion has been taken. The reasons for which it was moved, as I see it, was that Guam itself is not a sovereign state, and the word "national" was therefore considered by the user who moved the article as incorrect (the user also has a past record to equate country with sovereign state, and asserts only sovereign states are countries). The user who have moved this article has no intention to nominate it for discussion, and has declined to restore it to the original title to allow a discussion to take place.

The user who moved this article has also moved Macau national football team (talk) and was one of those involved in moving Hong Kong national football team (talk) based on the same reasons. — Instantnood 18:45, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one sentence explanation, then sign your vote with ~

 * Oppose the move. The English word "national" is not exclusively for sovereign states. The word is not always used in a manner that stick with the definitions of "nation". Please don't equate "nation", "country" and "sovereign state". — Instantnood 18:45, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Agree with reasons given above by Instantnood. A team that takes part in international competitions is a national team. A regional team (e.g. Guangdong football team) means they are not eligible to compete in international competitions. It is obvious where Hong Kong, Macau, Guam, etc. belong Chanheigeorge 19:45, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

It was requested that this article be renamed but there was no consensus for it be moved. Dragons flight 00:08, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Add any additional comments

 * Please take note that the member associations of the International Olympic Committee are called National Olympic Committees. And they include Hong Kong, Guam, etc. . Chanheigeorge 19:57, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * After doing some research, I must say that I STRONGLY OPPOSE the move of Guam national football team to Guam regional football team. The reasons are:
 * The name Guam national football team is correct (by the definition of nation), commonly used (evidenced by IOC calling Guam a National Olympic Committee), easily understandable by people inside and outside of Guam, and the convention used by Wikipedia.
 * The name Guam regional football team is incorrect. From the definition of region in Wikipedia, a region can mean two things:
 * An administrative subdivision, used by some countries. USA is not one of them and does not call Guam a region.
 * A sometimes vaguely-defined geographical area of a country or continent. Guam is clearly defined so it does not fit this category.
 * Therefore it is incorrect to call Guam a region. This "naming" seems to come from the poor translation of the Chinese word 地區 back to English.

 * I visited the Guam Football Assocation webpage to see how they call their team. I found three pieces of evidence that they would call their team Guam national football team:
 * Mr. Kambe reports that the U12 National program will start on 17 May.
 * Women's national team party is scheduled for Sunday at Mr. Renfro's residence.
 * For the Women's National Team, Mr. Renfro reminds ....
 * On the contrary, I found none of these words used for the description of their national team: regional, representative, territorial, etc.

 * Finally, it is clear that the person who moved this page have no evidence to do so, is not particularly interested in discussion about this move, and only did it out of convenience and/or showing off. Except Hong Kong and Macau, he/she did not move the other dozens of pages of football teams belonging to non-soverign nations, including England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland (I doubt he/she has the guts to do so).
 * I really do not see a case for this move, and suggest it be moved back to its original place ASAP. Chanheigeorge 23:09, 6 October 2005 (UTC)

Why in AFC?
Why is Guam in the AFC and not the OFC? If it was a matter of the OFC not existing when it joined AFC, have they not considered switching, due to the OFC is more to their level (no offense meant to the strength of the OFC teams). Paploo 20:13, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Anybody? --Paploo (talk) 19:34, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

 * Talk pages are meant to be about the article, not for debating the decisions of the subject of the article. That notwithstanding, Guam's nearest neighbours are Indonesia, the Philippines, and Indonesia, all of which are in the AFC, and is referred to as America in Asia, not America in Oceania, so links to Asia are clearly there.  Although other Micronesian states are linked to the OFC, they play very few fixtures, and are only associate members.  If Guam were to apply to the OFC, they may well be accepted, but the only ones who can answer why they did not is the Guam Football Association: have you asked them? Kevin McE (talk) 20:57, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Afghanistan national football team which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 15:24, 23 September 2023 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Afghanistan national football team which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 14:54, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Guam national football team


text:
Mattias Asper

Nils Mattias Joacim Asper (born 20 March 1974) is a Swedish former professional footballer who played as a goalkeeper. Starting off his career with Mjällby AIF in the mid-1990s, he went on to play professionally in Spain, Turkey, and Norway before returning to Mjällby in 2008. A full international between 1999 and 2002, he won three caps for the Sweden national football team and was a squad member for them at UEFA Euro 2000.

Club career
Asper was the first choice goalkeeper for Mjällby AIF in four seasons before signing to the Allsvenskan side AIK in 1998. Lee Baxter began the 1998 season as the first choice. But after seven games AIK had only managed to collect seven points, including only one win. On the 8 of June, Asper made his debut against Östers IF putting Lee Baxter on the bench, which would last for the rest of the season. With Asper in the net, AIK did not lose a single game in the 1998 season and they also won Allsvenskan the same year.

In 1999, AIK qualified for Champions League making it all the way to the group stage. This year, Asper held a clean sheet for 797 minutes in Allsvenskan which was a new record.

His performances in AIK attracted interest from Spanish club Real Sociedad, who bought him just before the 2000-01 season. However, he did not have much of a success in Spain and eventually returned to Sweden and Malmö FF in 2002, after being on loan to Beşiktaş J.K. He won the Swedish championship with Malmö FF in 2004.

He announced his retirement on 26 November 2014.

International career
Asper made his international debut for Sweden on 27 November 1999 in a friendly game away against South Africa, replacing Magnus Kihlstedt at halftime. He made his second appearance for Sweden on 29 March 2000 in a friendly game away against Austria. He was selected for Sweden's UEFA Euro 2000 squad, and served as third-choice goalkeeper behind Magnus Hedman and Magnus Kihlstedt as Sweden was eliminated after the group stage. He won his third and last international cap in a friendly game against Russia away on 21 August 2002.

Honours
AIK Individual
 * Allsvenskan: 1998
 * Svenska Cupen: 1998–99
 * Malmö FF
 * Allsvenskan: 2004
 * Swedish Goalkeeper of the Year: 1998, 1999

title: Mattias Asper


text:
Workforce management

Workforce management (WFM) is an institutional process that maximizes performance levels and competency for an organization. The process includes all the activities needed to maintain a productive workforce, such as field service management, human resource management, performance and training management, data collection, recruiting, budgeting, forecasting, scheduling and analytics.

Workforce management provides a common set of performance-based tools and software to support corporate management, front-line supervisors, store managers and workers across manufacturing, distribution, transportation, and retail operations. It is sometimes referred to as HRM systems, Workforce asset management, or part of ERP systems.

Definition
As workforce management has developed from a traditional approach of staff scheduling to improve time management, it has become more integrated and demand-oriented to optimize the scheduling of staff. Besides the two core aspects of demand-orientation and optimization, workforce management may also incorporate:
 * forecasting of workload and required staff
 * involvement of employees into the scheduling process
 * management of working times and accounts
 * analysis and monitoring of the entire process.

The starting point is a clear definition of the work required through engineered standards and optimal methods for performing each task as efficiently and safely as possible. Based on this foundation and demand-based forecasts, workers are scheduled, tasks are assigned, performance is measured, feedback is provided and incentives are computed and paid. In addition, online training is provided along with supervisor-based coaching to bring all workers up to required levels of proficiency. Workforce management is a complete approach designed to make workforce as productive as possible, reduce labor costs, and improve customer service.

Field service management
Workforce management also uses the process of field service management in order to have oversight of company's resources not used on company property. Examples include:
 * Demand management – to help forecast work orders to plan the number and expertise of staff that will be needed
 * Workforce scheduler – using predefined rules to automatically optimise the schedule and use of resources (people, parts, vehicles)
 * Workforce dispatcher – automatically assigning work orders within predefined zones to particular technicians
 * Mobile solutions – allowing dispatchers and technicians to communicate in real time.

Market growth
In the 1980s and 1990s, entrepreneurs focused on topics such as supply chain management, production planning systems or enterprise resource planning. As cost pressures have increased, managers have turned their attention to human resources issues. In all personnel-intensive industries, workforce management has become an important strategic element in corporate management. The process has experienced growth in all sectors, including healthcare. The rise of the gig economy has also gone hand in hand with the rise of workforce management preactices.

Mobile workforce management
As our society continues to adopt new technologies such as smartphones and enterprise mobility tools, more companies are allowing employees to become mobile. Mobile workforce management refers to activities used to schedule the employees working outside the company premises. It helps distribute workforce efficiently across various departments in an institution. The need for social distancing imposed by the COVID-19 pandemic has brought about major changes in both employer's and employee's vision of remote work, which will likely have a long-lasting impact on workforce organization and management in the coming years.

Software
Workforce management solutions can be deployed enterprise-wide and through mobile platforms. While special software is commonly used in numerous areas such as ERP (enterprise resource planning), SLM (service lifecycle management), CRM (customer relationship management) and HR (human resources) management, the management of the workforce is often still handled using spreadsheet programs or time recording. This often results in expensive overtime, non-productive idle times, high fluctuation rates, poor customer service and opportunity costs being incurred. By using a software solution for demand-oriented workforce management, planners can optimize staffing by creating schedules that at all times conform to the forecasted requirements. At the same time, a workforce management solution helps users to observe all relevant legislations, local agreements and the contracts of individual employees – including work-life balance guidelines.

A key aspect of workforce management is scheduling. This is achieved by establishing likely demand by analyzing historical data (such as the number and duration of customer contacts, sales figures, check-out transactions or orders to be handled). Many workforce management systems also offer manual adjustment capabilities. The calculated forecast values are then converted into actual staffing requirements by means of an algorithm that is adjusted to the particular use case. The algorithm itself is based on the work of Erlang though most modern adaptations of workforce management have shifted towards a richer state management, and optimizations to the original idea.

Current and future staffing requirements, short-term peak loads, availabilities, holidays, budget allowances, skills, labour law-related restrictions, as well as wage and contractual terms have to be integrated into the planning process to guarantee optimal staff deployment. In the workforce management process, the integration of employees is an important factor. In several workforce management systems, employees can log in their availability or planned absences and they can bid for specific shifts so long as they have the necessary skills for the activities planned for these shifts.

Delivery
The three methods of delivery for contact center technologies are on-premises solution, hosted or cloud-based computing.

 * An on-premises system is one in which hardware and software must be physically installed, deployed and maintained at the business. All equipment is purchased up front. It is traditionally associated with large enterprises with the budget and the space to acquire the capabilities deemed necessary, and the personnel available to configure and modify systems.
 * A hosted system relies on an outside service provider. Software is purchased and installed in a data center on either physical or virtual servers that may be owned or leased by the business. Implementation is similar to an on-premises solution, but the cost is typically lower because hardware need not be purchased. However, the business must pay an initial provisioning fee as well as a monthly fee for the rental or usage of the hosting center’s equipment and personnel.
 * Cloud computing converts such physical resources as processors and storage into Internet resources. By developing applications in a virtual environment, a company’s computing infrastructure is treated as a utility service, and the company pays only for the time and capacity it needs. Cloud eliminates issues such as computing capacity, physical space, bandwidth and storage.

title: Workforce management


text:
Georg Lunge

Georg Lunge (15 September 1839 – 3 January 1923) was a German chemist.

Biography
Lunge was born in Breslau on 15 September 1839. He studied at Heidelberg (under Robert Bunsen) and Breslau, graduating at the latter university in 1859, to work with Ferdinand Cohn. Turning his attention to technical chemistry, he became chemist at several works both in Germany and England, and in 1876 he was appointed professor of technical chemistry at ETH Zurich.

Lunge's original contributions cover a very wide field, dealing both with technical processes and analysis. In addition, he was a voluminous writer, enriching scientific literature with many standard works. His treatises Coal Tar and Ammonia, Destillation des Steinkohlentheers and Sulphuric Acid and Alkali, established his position as the highest authority on these subjects, while the Chemische-technische Untersuchungs-Methoden, to which he contributed, testified to his researches in technical analysis.

His jubilee was celebrated in Zürich on 15 September 1909 and he died in Zürich on 3 January 1923.

title: Georg Lunge


text:
Talk:Enemy Territory: Quake Wars

System Requirements
These are from the Quake Wars BETA installer, and subject to change, but as accurate a sign as you can get, and better than "Similar to Quake 4's" (these are MUCH higher :. HARDWARE REQUIREMENTS: CPU:          Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 3.2 Ghz or AMD(R) Athlon(TM) XP 3200+ processor  RAM:          1GB RAM  VIDEO CARD:     128MB NVIDIA(R) Geforce(TM) 6600GT or ATI(R) Radeon(R) X800 (full list of supported chipsets below)  SOUND CARD:     100% DirectX 9.0c compatible sound card  HDD SPACE:     950MB of free hard drive space, plus 700MB for Windows swap file  INTERNET:     Broadband connection and service required for full gameplay and downloads.  Features may change without notice.

The recommended are similar, just with a 3.4 P4, and a 6600GTS or X850 videocard instead. On a related note, what the hell is Splash Damage thinking, with these ridiculous requirements most PC gamers can't reach that would be a huge drain of power for most players who CAN run it? For a large-scale multiplayer shooter like this, performance is of utmost importance. :( I attempted to play it, but it refused to launch, saying I was missing support for a number of OpenGL features. 71.185.137.90 04:15, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Probably depends on where you're living. Here, the cheapest boxes from the local walmart-counterpart fulfill the specs. Besides, I got the beta running well on a machine below those specs. Can't see how those requirements are "ridiculous". --10:22, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

I have my doubts about the actual System Requirements of the game, some have rumored that they mimic or even succeed in under requiring Doom3, Quake4, etc.... This is the BETA, they're going to want High Performance machines to test the game. And I disagree with your definition of Gamers, gamers are people who live and breathe gaming, they build a system for one purpose, games, and playing them. These specs aren't asking a whole lot. Now I don't know anymore than you guys do but when I hear that this game will be running on an "optimized" Doom 3 engine, it makes me think it's going to take around the same or even less resources (CPU, RAM consumption, HD Space, GPU power) of Quake 4 or Doom 3. I would put my money on something more along the lines of these system specs for this game. Quake 4 System Requirements CPU: Pentium 4 2GHz or AMD Athlon XP 1.8GHz or better RAM: 512MB of RAM (I would bet an old 256MB would run this, just not well) GPU: ATi Radeon 9500 and up/ nVidia Geforce 3 and up HD: 5GB of space. Internet: Broadband, or push your luck on 56k

It's easy to mistake what the "real" requirements are for a game, normally anymore it's taken as "this is what you need to get 30+ Frames per second. A system with an Athlon XP 1.8GHz CPU, 256MB of RAM, and a Radeon 9500 is most likely going to be able to "RUN" the game, but it'll scoot by on the bare minimum. I thought I ought to throw in my 2 cents, like I said, I could be all wet here because I don't know anything more than you guys do, just taking an "educated guess" at the situation regarding system requirements. ~Victis_Omega

Edit History
Cleaned some of the page up, and removed a lot of the empty headline tags. Slinky317 23:21, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Cross Platform Compatability
Does anyone know which (if any) of the platforms will be able to play on the same servers?

I believe it was mentioned in one of the IRC chats with the devs, that the systems would all have thier seperate servers. (Not a cross-system game) Not 100% sure though. Iatchi

 * 'evilinc asked: 	 will a PC player be able to play a console player?
 * '[b]adman answers: 	pc players and console players will not be able to play on the same servers
 * From http://community.enemyterritory.com/index.php?q=node/66 (about a third of the way down) --KASanderson 20:31, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Engine
QUAKERS, the engine used by ET:QW is the Doom 3 engine, not "MegaTexture". Don't believe me? Look at the SplashDamage official site itself, and you will see it clearly printed: "we are in production of Enemy Territory: QUAKE Wars™ based on the cutting-edge Doom 3 engine" (emphasis mine). Therefore, that is what should go in the "Engine" box. Please stop reverting it. Haeleth 18:50, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Indeed, MegaTexture is a technology and shouldn't even be mentioned in the Engine section, by my opinion. It's just a feature of the engine. Xxovercastxx 06:25, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

 * Imho, it's relevant to include the word modified, but the megatexture feature (as important as it is) should probably feature in the article itself.--KASanderson 21:37, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

More info
I've got lots of information about this game here from magazines about the engine, vehicles, classes and gameplay, but i'm fairly new to wikipedia i still have to learn about lay out. Could i just give the information here so somebody else could make a good looking article out of it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lantern (talk • contribs)

 * Sure, post whatever information you have in the talk page. Others can put it in for you. We used to have a big section on classes and such, but it was deleted by someone.--Da newb 23:26, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

On EBgames for reserving collector edition, one feature is quoted as: "A unique keycode that lets you reserve your username now!" I did some searching on the internet, could not find more information. Anyone have more information on this? --WebSurfinMurf, 10 June 2007 (EST)

 * There's a fair bit of info on the site - check  for a list of retailers. In brief, you get a code through from your retailer that allows you to reserve a character name as yours and preventing others from registering it when the game is released.--KASanderson 13:36, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

I have added a paragraph on the XP rewards system in the gameplay section. Since the unlocks from the XP rewards alter the gameplay significantly, that would be a very appropriate addition for that section. --fatka, 24 September 2008 —Preceding undated comment was added at 01:45, 25 September 2008 (UTC).

In-game Advertising
Some info about the in-game streaming advertisements in this game. This is from developers blog post which you can find here Not sure how to make a new section for it, if someone else can do it to fit in with this page thats fine, just wanting to add more info about this game. --Simbot 14:07, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * the reasons given in the post (see link above) sound quite hollow to me. if someone has more information on in-game advertising in quake wars, especially on the third party checking if and and how long you look at the advertisments, please enlighten us. maybe there is even a way to eliminate/circumvent the mechanism? aren't such advertisements illegal in some countries - any info on that too?
 * I don't think it's really remarkable enough to be put in the article itself. It's trivial. Xihr 04:03, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

86.15.3.89?
I find it odd a geust would make an edit like that, so A I safe to assume hes someone who forgot to log in? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deuxhero (talk • contribs)

Copyright infringement?
Isn't a lot of content here copyrighted?

See e.g this and the article content. I spotted even more in the Classes section, in addition to that example in the Vehicles section. Is this quoted unattributed here with permission?

Wikipedia strongly oppose the use of work where the author did not comply to the GFDL license. -- Northgrove 10:12, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Free?
Will the game still be free? Some people say it's going to be sold for $39.95 and some others say $0. Still, some say there is going to be a free and paid version. I need some clarification. -- hello, i'm a member  |  talk to me!  18:44, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

 * I've never seen any claim that ET:QW will be free. I'm sure there will be demos, but I can't imagine why anybody would think it would be free.  The only reason W:ET was released for free was because the single player project was cancelled when the multiplayer part was nearly complete, so they took the extra (relatively minor) effort to finalize the multiplayer portion and released it for free as an act of good will.  It wasn't like they were planning on not selling the game in the first place -- and they're certainly making ET:QW with the intention of making money. Xihr 21:56, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

 * The fact that ET was free is a good enough reason to think if that game was also free. 71.102.74.156 (talk) 06:33, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

 * Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory was released for free because the commercial project it was to become was cancelled, and Splash Damage was nice enough to polish up the almost-complete multiplayer and release it as an act of goodwill. Quake Wars is not free. Xihr (talk) 18:37, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

QuakeCon
Should it be mentioned somewhere that this will be showcased and playable at this year's QuakeCon? --70.129.149.24 06:33, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Postponed to 07
The game has been postponed to 2007 to make sure the team meets the 'desired quality' --Jort227 19:05, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Class types
I had difficulty understanding the strogg classes, so I added human equivilants next to it. Any problems? Jackpot Den 10:32, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Since someone has deleted the class types I added a short list of each side. Feel free to add on to them. As of now, they aren't that good.--Da newb 23:47, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Covert Ops radar
Does anyone know how the Covert Ops radar works? Is it like the UAVs from Battlefield 2? Xihr 20:22, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Needs screenshots
Add screenshots please. 67.76.183.192 17:07, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Special Edition
Isn't the special/collector's edition out for sale already? The enemyterritory.com page has a link on it's home page. --203.99.197.2 13:12, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

 * It is not out yet. The website link might be something for pre-ordering, but ET : QW isn't out yet.--Da newb 14:43, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Deletion of Sections
I have noticed that the whole section about different classes and vehicles has been deleted. Why is this?--Da newb 01:32, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

 * I move to have it restored from a previous edit - Revision as of 19:53, 16 April 2007 by Pkaulf was the last with this extra info in--KASanderson 22:24, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

 * Having examined the missing content I'm sad to say that it appears to violate copyright as Northgrove suggested and has been lifted from various non-attributed sources. It cannot simply be reinstated as-is and will need a rewrite. The user who removed it appears to have a habit of deleting information, considering it to constitute a game guide but in this case it may have been a blessing. Using Battlefield 2142 as a GA-Class example I believe the information is valid Wiki material and, once re-written, it's presence is valid.--KASanderson 22:03, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Can we please discuss the extra details and stop an edit-war before it starts? Personally, I don't see that class information constitutes a game guide (read the article for what this is actually defined as) and that this article is almost only a stub. Please look at Unreal Tournament 3 and Battlefield 2142 as examples of community-accepted articles --KASanderson 21:33, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Listing things that can only be described as in-game material is game guide material. That includes enemies, techniques/skills, levels, and stuff like character classes. They need a general overview, not a detailed one. Halo: Combat Evolved is what you want to look at for a quality article, not those. TTN 21:37, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

 * I believe we will have to agree to disagree - I'm afraid that while I agree that game-playing techniques and skills should not be listed on the article (for example, 'the north clock tower is an excellent vantage point for a sniper') details about the game such as classes and vehicles are valuable. Please bear in mind that Halo: Combat Evolved is predominantly a single-player, storyline game as opposed to, for instance Halo Wars and the the articles structures will be significantly different as a result. Does anyone else have input on this? --KASanderson 22:43, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

 * I think that detail as modeled in Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory would not be bad, maybe just a little less. However, we need to wait for it to come out to see what we really need to include, I think. User:kylesandell

 * I have also cut that article. There is no need for specific statistics or descriptions. TTN 02:55, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

I believe that listing character classes, vehicles, and maybe weapons is a good thing. I disagree with those who say that it makes this a game guide. It is information about the game. Not specific tips and similar information. It is valuable enough content that it should be listed. I wrote a little bit about it that I don't believe was copywrite infringement but it go deleted. If we add it back in it will need editing so it sounds better. The quality of what I wrote wasn't as good as it could be.--Da newb 04:19, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

ESRB Rating
This game is rated Teen? It would be the first bloodless Quake game if this so.--Deuxsonic 10:30, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

 * The ESRB have rated it as Teen, but I can't cite from them as their site doesn't use perma-links.--KASanderson 22:46, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

 * Well, the packaging also contains the rating, so it's not really so much whether it's been said as just being hard to believe that a Quake game, with the messy-by-nature Strogg no less, would get a Teen rating.--Deuxsonic 09:13, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

 * Apologies, I mis-understood and thought you were asking for confirmation on the rating.--KASanderson 16:34, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

PC version
Unless someone can cite for the release date edits by 145.48.183.146 I move to roll them back to Q2. I've had a look around and can find no official confirmation of any date that doesn't come from a retailer--KASanderson 16:46, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

 * I've reverted the article and left a message for 145.48.183.146--KASanderson 21:44, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Gamestop dates are not reliable and should not be included in this article. The developer insists that the only release date they're willing to give is "when it's done," as is standard for id projects. The publisher has slated it for Q1 Fiscal 2008 (which is April-July 2007 in the real world). Recent id products have released right before Quakecon, which begins on August 2, 2007. The first fiscal quarter coincidentally ends a couple of days before this, and it seems likely that the companies involved would like to have the game released in time for quakecon, but there is no official word yet on ANY release date.Slemmons 15:27, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

 * For the sake of keeping the article correct, I've updated the EBGames release date (it was changed this morning.) If people want to pull it I won't strongly object.--KASanderson 22:02, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Added a section with citations about release dates.

According to Splash Damage themselves, the game doesn't have a specific release date yet. Most people believe that the game will be released anytime from July to September, but in my opinion July is highly unlikely because that would be around a month of notice time, which generally doesn't happen in the game industry. I would change it to Q3.--Da newb 04:24, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

 * Edit: nevermind my above post. Has already been changed in the article.--Da newb 04:26, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Console version
I reverted the latest changes because the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 versions have already been released and the latest edit said it was to be released. Also the edit reverted the capitalized 'S' in PlayStation 3. Since Wikipedia lists PlayStation 3 with the 'S' capitalized I decided that would be the appropriate way to include it in the article. If anyone feels otherwise feel free to discuss here. --Fatka (talk) 02:44, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Media format
I don't know where DVD-DL, Blu-ray Disc snuck in from, but according to the released box art, both the standard and collector's edition are being released on DVD. If someone has more info, please correct me.--KASanderson 22:06, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

if your the one who removed it then do some research before you remove things the game is going to be released on the ps3 hence the blu-ray format and as for DVD-DL i suspect that is xbox 360 format im not certain

 * I had forgotten momentarily about the PS3 version, my humble apologies--KASanderson 22:10, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Wolfenstein?
I realize the first ET was tied to the Wolfenstein series, but this installment certainly isn't. Why is it listed as part of the Wolfenstein series? Xxovercastxx 06:18, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

 * It's a good point, and probably a mistake. Anyone object to it being removed? --KASanderson 21:29, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

 * Having thought about it - it is a logical progression from Wolfenstein:Enemy Territory, perhaps that [was] what the original author intended? --KASanderson 22:14, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

 * It has the same gameplay as W:ET, but it's not in the Wolfenstein universe at all, so it's probably not appropriate. Xihr 22:22, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

 * Indeed, and from the other side of the fence this must look very strange on the Wolfenstein pages. I've pulled the relevant code --KASanderson 23:34, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

 * This bears part of the same name as W:ET, and therefore I think it is part of the series, if not chronologically and therefore should be added in there. Jedibob5 20:48, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

 * I understand what you mean, but Enemy Territory is the game type - capturing areas to progress missions. The Quake and Wolfenstein universes are completely seperate and I feel QW really doesn't fit in the Wolf' series. If we had an Enemy Territory series, they could both go in that. Of course, that is only my opinion on the matter. --KASanderson 22:25, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

 * Yes, the thing they have in common is the gameplay, not the universe. They're both Enemy Territory games, but they're not both Wolfenstein games (just as they are not both Quake games). Xihr 22:32, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

 * what they basically have in common is the team creating et and qw --Leladax 16:07, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

 * It says in the main page that it is a follow-up to Quake4, which is untrue. It's a follow-up to W:ET. It has nothing in common with Quake4, except set in the same fictional universe. Developer and gameplay wise it is the direct descendent of W:ET. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.145.226.49 (talk) 15:21, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Abbreviation
I made the abbreviation ET:QW redirect to this page for easier viewing. Redsox7897 03:19, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

 * I had to redo it because ET: was apparently a prefix for a different language, so now it is ETQW instead. Redsox7897 03:22, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * yeah, that's really fucking gay that we can't use "ET:QW" —Preceding unsigned comment added by VTNC (talk • contribs) 02:49, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

ETQW maybe, but QW?
QW is widely known in the FPS community to refer to QuakeWorld, which is a multiplayer addon for Quake I. I haven't seen anyone refer to ETQW as QW yet. Why do we need all the confusion just to shorten an abbreviation from 4 letters to 2?

 * Abbreviation meanings change over time, and my guess is that QW will be commonly used to refer to Quake Wars - especially once it's released. Chandon 23:14, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

I use the QW abbreviation, and I just call it "Quake Wars" when I'm talking about it. -- FatalError (t|c) 05:44, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 * id & SD call it "ET:QW", i'd say that's the official abbreviation. "QW" is only assumed if you're already talking about the game, just like "Windows" is assumed MS Windows if you're already talking about PC computers with a MS OS.  Worth noting that on the system's release for, it says "Microsoft Windows" so I'd say saying "ET:QW" should be done. --TheHappyFriar (talk) 13:17, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Netcode
I found the netcode pretty crappy, as so did a lot of other people in the beta. Can we comment on this? It seems relevant to know if multiplayer games played over the internet employ client side prediction or not.

 * Doing so would violate WP:NOR. Not to mention you're just indicating your personal opinion at this point, which is hardly encyclopedic.  See WP:NOT. Xihr 00:15, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

 * I myself found the Netcode to be vastly superior than most online FPS games. It's been deemed "Area-of-Relevance" and it involves a unique way of letting the CPU know the location of an object or player when you cannot see it, but gives no instructions to have the CPU or GPU render or process effects, Physics, textures until target is visible. This also works with Distance, you won't be able to see the wires in a strogg's stomach from 40 yards away, so no rendering is taking place. Alot of Lag in Online games comes from the CPU and GPU rendering and processing irrelevant Data, I've even heard of Netcodes halting every other cycle on the GPU and CPU till target object or person becomes visible or audible. It also helps players by accuratly reading where you shoot in accordanc with where someone's really laggy would've last stepped, kind of like an estimation. I got most of this information from various articles I've read on the game and I've found it to be true just playing the BETA. However, this could be one of the things that keeps pushing back the release date, I heard they were having problems with something during first BETA (I wasn't able to get in, I'm in BETA 2). ~ Victis_Omega —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.115.87.96 (talk) 15:00, August 27, 2007 (UTC)

Number of players?
Does anyone have a confirmed the number of players the game support? It would be an usefull addition. Or does it even have a maximum number? Or is the platform dependent? (Psykocyber 14:46, 1 September 2007 (UTC))

 * The most I've seen listed is 32. I've also heard that the max number is dependent upon what the map is built for. ~Victis_Omega —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.114.216.9 (talk) 15:37, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

 * The maximum per ranked game is 24, as enforced by the latest 1.5 patch. Players aren't map-dependent, I believe the maps were made with 24 in mind. Paril (talk) 04:28, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

There are still some 32 players severs around. 24 players mas are the only one ranked though.Varlinx (talk) 19:55, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Clan
Anyone here part of a clan? Drnoitall.hello 00:18, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Earthquakers clan has been around since 1996 and has some of the Splashdamage staff in its ranks http://etqw.splatterladder.com/?mod=claninfo&idx=73 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.71.32.112 (talk) 17:00, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Name
Both the Splash Damage website, as well as the Steam store page and the icons once installed write "QUAKE" capitalized, so I changed the page to reflect that this is most likely the official way to spell it. Comments? → Nehletalk ҉ 13:12, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I think "Quake" is better. The Wikipedia Manual of Style (capital letters) and Manual of Style (trademarks) say to avoid all caps words, even if the company wants it that way. --Lijnema 13:37, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, I've seen that QUAKE is capitalized on the promotional materials and official text. I honestly don't know what the motivation of this is; the name was not capitalized in any other games or official literature that I'm familiar with.  As Lijnema points out, it's a violation of Wikipedia style, so I suggest we use Quake instead. Xihr 23:52, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you both for your comments. I didn't know about the Manual of Style, which clearly disagrees with me here :), so I'll just revert back. And I learned something, too. Thanks again → Nehletalk ҉ 18:09, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

 * No problem. We live and learn. :) --Lijnema 20:17, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

 * I think it was just capitalized so it went along with the text. I had a font for Quake 1 a long time ago and all of the lower-case letters were capitalized already. Whether or not it's an ID Software thing or a Splash Damage thing, I don't know, but Quake and QUAKE are the same thing ;) Paril (talk) 04:31, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

ATI Issues
currently the quake wars developers are working with ATI to fix a problem that crashses the game. I think this is worthy to put in the article somewhere. The patch is version 1.4 which seems to show a very significant modification to the game. It has a tenuous release date of early janurary 2008 (however no announcements have been made so im going to assume its been delayed). Look it up on google for yourself. - Thero —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.205.70.254 (talk) 09:53, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

 * It's not warranted, especially if it's going to be fixed soon. This is an encyclopedia, not a news site. Xihr (talk) 22:59, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

 * But still, its a major issue that has yet been resolved (the patchhas been delayed several times), many of their customers are "out of luck" with the issue for now. Not to mention i think it falls under the pervue of criticisms or reception or bugs or something in the article.  There are other articles of games that have similar issues pointed out in the article.  Battlefield 2 is a prime example. - Thero  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.205.70.254 (talk) 04:26, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

 * That other articles contain such material does not mean it is warranted. Xihr (talk) 05:15, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

 * Wouldn't it make more sense that if most other articles have such material and information, that this one would warrent it too? This is information, this isnt an opinion or anything, ATI and Splash Damage has both acknowledged this problem. - —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.205.70.254 (talk) 05:09, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

 * It's not warranted. That's the point:  Wikipedia is not a news site. Xihr (talk) 05:16, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

Differences between PC and Xbox/PS3?
Would the differences between PC and Xbox/PS3 releases be a good idea to include on the page? Paril (talk) 04:29, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

Engine Update
IMHO, engine should be changed to "Doom3/Id Tech 4". It was known as Doom 3 before Rage was announced as "Id Tech 5" & Megatextures works in Doom 3 (they are being experimented with), so since the original engine supported it it's not worth mentioning it as an added feature. --TheHappyFriar (talk) 13:12, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

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title: Talk:Enemy Territory: Quake Wars


text:
Haymarket Shopping Centre

The Haymarket Shopping Centre is a shopping centre in the city centre of Leicester, England. It was opened on 4 June 1973 as part of the Haymarket Centre and was the country's second shopping centre after the Bull Ring, Birmingham. It is located east of and adjacent to the Clock Tower.

The Haymarket Shopping Centre has around 65 outlets and shares the Haymarket Centre with a bus station, a two-stage theatre, and a Travelodge hotel in the former Haymarket House.

The Haymarket Centre previously featured two nightclubs (located either side of the clock tower entrance), Dino's restaurant (adjacent to the theatre entrance) and two enclosed foot bridges (one crossing Charles Street in to Kildare Street and the other crossing Humberstone Gate linking to Lewis's department store).

During 2021 Leicester City Council purchased the shopping centre for £9.9million

History
Plans for the redevelopment of the Haymarket site were originally drawn up in 1960, but these were superseded by the 1961 declaration of a larger Comprehensive Development Area. Tenders for development of the site were invited, with Taylor Woodrow awarded it in early 1966. The plans originally included a motel, an office block, a 500-seat cinema, and, at the request of the Town Planning (Development) Subcommittee, a 650-seat theatre (later increased to 710), to replace the Phoenix Theatre, which had been built in 1963 as a temporary facility.

In May 1967, the newly built Littlewoods store was opened by Sir Barnett Janner MP. The building is of an imposing concrete construction close to the clock tower. It is four stories high and features three balconies on the two frontages.

In February 1969, a planning application for the new shopping centre was submitted by Taylor Woodrow, which received conditional approval from Leicester City Council the following month.

In 1970, Lea's store on the corner of Humberstone Gate and Charles Street was demolished to make way for the construction of a new store for C&A. Construction is of standard brick and three stories high.

During clearance of the site, buildings demolished including four historic hotels (the Bell Hotel, the Stag and Pheasant, the White Hart and the George), and buildings on Bread Street, which ran between Belgrave Gate and Charles Street, and which disappeared completely. Other major buildings originally on the site included a tram depot and the Leicestershire Horse Repository.

Construction of the Haymarket Centre began in 1971 of red brick, linking Littlewoods and C&A (located 120 metres apart). The centre was opened on 4 June 1973. It is six stories high; levels 1-2 are for retail, levels 3-4 are for car parking, levels 4-6 are Haymarket House and levels 2 plus for the theatre. Level 2 balconies feature on Humberstone Gate and outside the theatre.

In 1993, Lewis's department store was demolished prompting the removal of the foot bridge linking Lewis's and the Haymarket Shopping Centre.

In 1996, the Haymarket Shopping Centre closed for refurbishment. The general colours of brown and beige were replaced with white, a new glass roof was built, and the escalators and staircase switched sides and were replaced with new ones. The toilets were moved from above the clock tower entrance to above the Charles Street entrance. The children's ladybirds ride was removed. The spiral road to the high level car park was demolished in favour of a straight ramp, with access being moved from Charles Street to Belgrave Gate. In a separate, publicly funded project by the Leicester City Council, a row of shops was purchased on Charles Street and demolished in order to build the Haymarket Bus Station.

In 1997, the foot bridge crossing Charles Street was closed; it was removed in 2007.

In May 2006 it was announced that Woolworths were to vacate their unit in the centre in early 2007 after being "made an offer they could not refuse" by the landlords. In October 2007 Peacocks opened in the former Woolworths unit.

The bus station was demolished in 2015, along with two food outlets (McIndians and Subway) and the Bohemian Public House on the corner of Charles Street and Belgrave Gate in order to build a larger bus station.

Stores
Retailers currently occupying units include: Ryman, T.K. Maxx, Holland & Barrett, B&M, Primark, The Entertainer, Deichmann, Card Factory, Heron Foods, OneBeyond, Cards Direct, Blue Banana, Matalan, Tesco Express, Metro Bank, Costa Coffee, Burger King, Halifax Building Society.

A number of independent retailers operate from some of the smaller units within the centre.

Notable stores past and present include Littlewoods (including Index), C&A, Somerfield (later The Co-operative Food), HMV, British Home Stores, Poundworld, Allders, Bejam, MK One, Habitat and Woolworths.

Haymarket Theatre
Leicester City Council purchased a 99-year lease of the theatre in 1974. The theatre operated until 2007 when it was closed and replaced by the newly built Curve Theatre in Leicester's Cultural Quarter. The theatre was reopened in early 2018.

Located on Belgrave Gate at the front of the entrance to the Haymarket Theatre is The Metal Tree sculpture by Hubert Dalwood ARA. It was unveiled in 1974 and used to be the only piece of major abstract sculpture in Leicester City Centre.

Nightclubs
To the left of the Clock Tower entrance was the entrance to the George Bar. This took its name from the George Hotel that had previously stood on this site. In 2001 it was called U R Zeus. It opened on 23 September 2005 as Niche, followed in November 2007 by Ice. It closed in 2008 and on 30 May 2009, it opened as the D9 Nightclub.

To the right side of the Clock Tower entrance was the entrance to a nightclub which was located on the first and second floors. This has now been converted to ordinary retail space and is currently occupied by Costa Coffee. This was first known as the Top Rank Suite, Bailey's Nightspot, then changed to The King of Clubs in 1980. It subsequently changed its name to Mr Kiesa's Discothèque, after owner Martin Kiesa.

Bailey's hosted many music and comedy acts such as Tommy Cooper, Bernard Manning, Mud, Slade, Gary Glitter (March 1978), Showaddywaddy, The Three Degrees and The Drifters.

Transport
Opening in mid 2016, the Haymarket Bus Station has been rebuilt and expanded and now forms a major transport hub for the north of the city centre. It is located on Charles Street to the northeast of the Haymarket Shopping Centre.

title: Haymarket Shopping Centre


text:
Not A Cornfield

"Not A Cornfield" was a 2005 art project that transformed a 32 acre industrial brownfield (today part of Los Angeles State Historic Park in the historic center of Los Angeles) into a cornfield for one agricultural cycle. The project took place north of Chinatown.

Lauren Bon created this work with funds from the Annenberg Foundation and considered the piece to be a sculpture. The installation cost $3 million and took place at the proposed site of Los Angeles State Historic Park, which had been referred to as "The Cornfield", because of the crops growing there prior to its industrial development. Fifteen hundred truck loads of soil were transported to the site and one million seeds were planted.

Some people complained that the project delayed the construction of the public park at that site, that the project was approved too quickly, and that it was a waste of money.

There was a small edible garden in the cornfield, and the site was used for film screenings and drum circles. Group and school tours were available.

The corn was harvested in November and December 2005, allowed to dry and put on display in the nearby empty Capital Milling Co. building for six months. It was then used for the production of biodegradable containers. The project left behind fertile soil.

"Not A Cornfield" was located at 1201 North Spring Street, Los Angeles, California, 90012.

title: Not A Cornfield