text:
Limerick Post

The Limerick Post is a free weekly newspaper, distributed throughout Limerick city and county, parts of counties Clare, Tipperary in the province of Munster, Ireland.

The Limerick Post was established in 1986 and remains the only locally owned newspaper in Limerick. The Post is published each Thursday morning. It recently modernised its website, with more content including video, polls and a new Digital Edition. Its main competitors are the Limerick Leader. On Saturday 24 January 2009, the Limerick Post won the coveted title of Best Free newspaper in the Midwest region, at the Mid West Arts Media and Culture Awards held at the Radisson SAS Hotel.

The publication is distributed door to door to 12,500 homes and businesses in the city and 30,000 are available in shops throughout the city and county.

On Friday 14 May 2010, it launched an iPhone app, being the first newspaper in Limerick to do so, as well as the first regional newspaper in Ireland.

title: Limerick Post


text:
The Sane Asylum

The Sane Asylum is the debut album by the American thrash metal band Blind Illusion. It was originally released in 1988 through Combat Records. The album features guitarist Larry LaLonde and bassist Les Claypool before they went on to work on Primus and was co-produced by Metallica lead guitarist Kirk Hammett.

Track listing
All songs written by Marc Biedermann.

Personnel

 * Marc Biedermann – vocals, guitars, bass on "The Sane Asylum" and "Metamorphosis of a Monster", producer, mixing
 * Larry LaLonde – guitars
 * Les Claypool – bass
 * Mike Miner – drums

 * Additional musicians
 * Cristiana Lorenzo, Elisabetta Lorenzo, Francesca Lorenzo, Marisa Lorenzo, Michael Lorenzo, Jeff Wing.- backing vocals on "Metamorphosis of a Monster"

 * Production
 * Kirk Hammett – producer (uncredited)
 * Mark Needham – engineer, recording, mixing
 * Annamaria Scott – engineer, recording

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: The Sane Asylum


text: User talk:69.177.112.55

title: User talk:69.177.112.55


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Political landscaping and urban design in Ireland

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was No Consensus Ëvilphoenix Burn! 03:48, 18 October 2005 (UTC)

Political landscaping and urban design in Ireland
Was tagged for speedy but doesn't qualify. It's basically a POV essay though, and I don't see any encyclopedic merit. "Political landscaping" doesn't seem to be a term used often, and when it is used I don't think this is what it means. Also vandalism in Ireland is a redirect here, which is certainly questionable. I'm pretty sure most of it is covered elsewhere anyway. R. fiend 19:36, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Merge into Dublin statues and their nicknames, Irish Civil War and Linen Hall Library. Demiurge 19:55, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete as per nom. Merge if you like but I feel it's hardly worth the effort.   Dl yo ns 493   Ta lk   21:07, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Expand. I think the article should be expanded to cover similar activity by unionists in the northeast, and perhaps by the British before independence. If anyone can improve on the title, that would be great. Lapsed Pacifist 03:08, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.

New proposal

 * Delete. --Mal 18:00, 3 April 2006 (UTC)


text: User talk:70.95.83.137

title: User talk:70.95.83.137


text: User talk:65.170.1.10

title: User talk:65.170.1.10


text: User talk:Professor Dex

title: User talk:Professor Dex


text:
File:Goldkey3.jpg

Summary
This Gold Key, like the one in the Da Vinci Code opens a secret Swiss numbered account which holds millions available only to the bearer of the key and the account number.

title: File:Goldkey3.jpg


text:
Talk:Interstate 15

Major cities
This is not necessarily defined by population, but rather by their independence from another metropolitan statistical area, yet can stand as a prominent "stop".

San Diego, Las Vegas, Riverside, Pocatello and others fall into this category. Other cities, such as Provo, and Ogden, which are part of a greater (Salt Lake) metro area, are OK, too, since they have their own MSA area. Many cities exist in the L.A. have a population over 100,000, but are not appropriate to include in any list since they do not have their own MSA and are part of L.A.'s (excludes prominent areas such as Pasadena, LB, Santa Ana, Anaheim), North Las Vegas does not have its own MSA and is, of course, part of Las Vegas'. However, since the population is greater than 100,000 I've included it next to LV. If this is brought down again, I'll have to take the liberty to remove it permanently. However, it could be brought down as a sub-bullet.Drdr1989 19:40, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

it seems to me that Baker, California should be included on the list, as it is defined as a control city. the signs on the N 15 read Barstow Baker Las Vegas as soon as you get up into the california mountains.NeoVampTrunks 07:17, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

I added in Shelby, MT as a control city. In Great Falls, heading north, all Interstate signage shows "North, Shelby" until you reach Shelby, where it changes to "North, Lethbridge".

I'm almost positive Dillon, MT is also a control city, between Butte and Idaho Falls, on some overhead signs.

Please see California State Route 15
The southern terminus for the interstate portion of Route 15 is at Interstate 8. Route 15 then continues on southward as California State Route 15 to Harbor Drive in San Diego. Please clarify. --Geopgeop 12:02, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Well, that was the case until very recently. The I-15 now has taken its place right to Harbor Drive.  I should know since I was there recently, along with an updated AAA map. :) Drdr1989 18:32, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Should a merge take place? --Rschen7754 (talk - contribs - count) 01:13, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Actually, I changed the tense from present to past for the CA-15 page. A link (NOT a re-direct) could be made from the CA-15 to the I-15; and maybe one from I-15 to CA-15 somewhere in the article text of I-15.  Other than that I believe that is all we need to do.67.181.147.214 06:05, 8 October 2005 (UTC)

Changed exit numbers in Utah
from

Major road intersections in Arizona
If Arizona had any major road intersections for that small piece of Interstate 15 within, former U.S. Route 91 would be it. Former US 91 is Fairview Avenue southwest of I-15, and after crossing becomes Cane Beds Road north of I-15. --Geopgeop 06:51, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

As the traffic engineer currently responsible for I-15 in Arizona, I have never heard of anyone from that area referring to the road running through Beaver Dam & Littlefield as either "Cane Beds Road" or "Fairview Ave". The locals call it "County 91" or "Old 91" - and Mohave County has confirmed that their name for it is "Mohave County Route 91". The signing for that interchange (new signs in 2005) lists the two communities of Beaver Dam and Littlefield. The road name sign on the mainline is "County 91" per Mohave County's preference. RCMoeur 04:46, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

GA nom?
Has anyone nominated this article for GA status yet? — Rob (  talk  ) 04:45, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Exit List
Unless I'm missing it, I don't see a complete listing of all the exits for I-15. It seems one is already created at I-15 exit list, but is not linked here. I can't think of a good way to add it, if someone has an idea, be my guest. Brien Clark 04:10, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Some opening dates in Utah
These dates are from. --NE2 17:21, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
 * November 23, 1966: South Layton to 31st Street Ogden
 * December 20, 1966: Provo to Spanish Fork

long distance mileage sign

 * Baker, California — Salt Lake City is mentioned on a mileage sign for the first time on northbound: 534 miles.

Time for a re-write of the introductory paragraph
The intro to this article is a hodge-podge IMO. For exhibit A, I present that 3 back to back sentences in the introduction start with "It is also..." Anybody mind if I take a whack at a re-write? Davemeistermoab (talk) 07:37, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
 * OK 3 weeks later and nobody objected, I'm going to take a whack at it Davemeistermoab (talk) 03:30, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

''Due to this rapid area growth, the I-15 corridor is the focus of several mass transit projects. The Las Vegas Monorail, FrontRunner commuter rail system and TRAX light rail in Salt Lake City are mass transit lines loosely parallel to I-15 that are now in operation. Between Los Angeles and Las Vegas has long been proposed as a maglev train route; in 2004 the California-Nevada Interstate Maglev project held public meetings on the plan.''

Is the above text of importance to the I-15? Besides they share loosely the same corridor, I don't see any important relation with the Interstate 15 topic. Maybe it needs to be moved elsewhere in the article, but it's in my opinion not important enough to be referred to in the introduction already. Chriszwolle (talk) 15:44, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It's worth mentioning, but probably more appropriate in the state detail articles, or maybe in the history section of the article. As the lead section is supposed to be a summary of the rest of the article, this article needs help. Dave (talk) 18:00, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Junction list
Continuing discussion - What seems (and I want to stress seems) to be the consensus of major coast-to-coast or border-to-border interstates is to include only the junctions with other major interstates (5, 10, 15, 20, and so on). On Interstate 80, for example, there are interstate junctions in Cleveland, which is definitely a major city, yet it's not shown in the infobox because there are no major interstate junctions there. So why does it have to be different for I-15? CountyLemonade (talk) 21:38, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

"Transcontinental"
A highway that runs from the shore of the Pacific to the Canadian border is not "transcontinental", though it does cross the US from a border to a border.--Wetman (talk) 13:24, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Idaho exit list
Shouldn't this exit list be in an article instead of just the talk page? It's a shame that there is no "Interstate 15 in Idaho" article.--Gopats92 (talk) 16:48, 04 February 2015 (UTC)
 * I believe this used to be on a separate I-15 exit list article which was combined for all states. It was decided such exit lists should be divided by state-detail pages, i.e. "Interstate 15 in (state)". States like Idaho haven't had many active editors that have worked on road articles for the state, so the exit list information is stored here until someone comes along to flesh out Interstate 15 in Idaho so it is more than just an exit list. --  LJ  ↗  08:06, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

Montana exit list

 * rowspan=15|Beaverhead
 * 0
 * 9
 * Snowline
 * Lima
 * 15
 * Lima
 * 23
 * Dell
 * 29
 * Kidd
 * 37
 * Red Rock
 * 44
 * – Clark Canyon Resevoir
 * 51
 * Dalys
 * Southbound exit and northbound entrance
 * 52
 * Grasshopper Creek
 * 56
 * Barretts
 * 59
 * 62
 * Dillon
 * 63
 * 74
 * Birch Creek, Apex
 * 85
 * Glen
 * Madison
 * 93
 * Melrose
 * rowspan=11|Silver Bow
 * 99
 * Moose Creek Road
 * 102
 * 111
 * Feely
 * 116
 * Buxton
 * 119
 * Hub Access, Silver Bow
 * 121
 * South end of I-90 overlap
 * 122
 * rowspan=4|Butte
 * 124
 * Northbound exit and southbound entrance
 * 126
 * Montana Street
 * 127
 * Signed as exits 127A (south) and 127B (north) northbound
 * 129
 * East end of I-90 overlap
 * rowspan=9|Jefferson
 * 134
 * Woodville
 * 138
 * Elk Park
 * 151
 * Bernice
 * 156
 * Basin
 * 160
 * High Ore Road
 * 164
 * 176
 * Jefferson City
 * 182
 * Clancy
 * 187
 * rowspan=10|Lewis and Clark
 * 190
 * South Helena, Nob Hill Area
 * rowspan=3|Helena
 * 192
 * , Capitol Area
 * South end of US 287 overlap; signed as exits 192A (east) and 192B (west/south) northbound
 * 193
 * 200
 * 209
 * Gate of the Mountains
 * 216
 * Sieben
 * 219
 * Spring Creek
 * 226
 * 228
 * 234
 * Craig
 * rowspan=14|Cascade
 * 240
 * Dearborn
 * 244
 * Canyon Access
 * 247
 * Hardy Creek
 * 250
 * Local Access
 * 254
 * 256
 * 270
 * 277
 * Great Falls International Airport
 * rowspan=2|Great Falls
 * 278
 * South end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 116
 * Buxton
 * 119
 * Hub Access, Silver Bow
 * 121
 * South end of I-90 overlap
 * 122
 * rowspan=4|Butte
 * 124
 * Northbound exit and southbound entrance
 * 126
 * Montana Street
 * 127
 * Signed as exits 127A (south) and 127B (north) northbound
 * 129
 * East end of I-90 overlap
 * rowspan=9|Jefferson
 * 134
 * Woodville
 * 138
 * Elk Park
 * 151
 * Bernice
 * 156
 * Basin
 * 160
 * High Ore Road
 * 164
 * 176
 * Jefferson City
 * 182
 * Clancy
 * 187
 * rowspan=10|Lewis and Clark
 * 190
 * South Helena, Nob Hill Area
 * rowspan=3|Helena
 * 192
 * , Capitol Area
 * South end of US 287 overlap; signed as exits 192A (east) and 192B (west/south) northbound
 * 193
 * 200
 * 209
 * Gate of the Mountains
 * 216
 * Sieben
 * 219
 * Spring Creek
 * 226
 * 228
 * 234
 * Craig
 * rowspan=14|Cascade
 * 240
 * Dearborn
 * 244
 * Canyon Access
 * 247
 * Hardy Creek
 * 250
 * Local Access
 * 254
 * 256
 * 270
 * 277
 * Great Falls International Airport
 * rowspan=2|Great Falls
 * 278
 * South end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 164
 * 176
 * Jefferson City
 * 182
 * Clancy
 * 187
 * rowspan=10|Lewis and Clark
 * 190
 * South Helena, Nob Hill Area
 * rowspan=3|Helena
 * 192
 * , Capitol Area
 * South end of US 287 overlap; signed as exits 192A (east) and 192B (west/south) northbound
 * 193
 * 200
 * 209
 * Gate of the Mountains
 * 216
 * Sieben
 * 219
 * Spring Creek
 * 226
 * 228
 * 234
 * Craig
 * rowspan=14|Cascade
 * 240
 * Dearborn
 * 244
 * Canyon Access
 * 247
 * Hardy Creek
 * 250
 * Local Access
 * 254
 * 256
 * 270
 * 277
 * Great Falls International Airport
 * rowspan=2|Great Falls
 * 278
 * South end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 209
 * Gate of the Mountains
 * 216
 * Sieben
 * 219
 * Spring Creek
 * 226
 * 228
 * 234
 * Craig
 * rowspan=14|Cascade
 * 240
 * Dearborn
 * 244
 * Canyon Access
 * 247
 * Hardy Creek
 * 250
 * Local Access
 * 254
 * 256
 * 270
 * 277
 * Great Falls International Airport
 * rowspan=2|Great Falls
 * 278
 * South end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 240
 * Dearborn
 * 244
 * Canyon Access
 * 247
 * Hardy Creek
 * 250
 * Local Access
 * 254
 * 256
 * 270
 * 277
 * Great Falls International Airport
 * rowspan=2|Great Falls
 * 278
 * South end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 254
 * 256
 * 270
 * 277
 * Great Falls International Airport
 * rowspan=2|Great Falls
 * 278
 * South end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 277
 * Great Falls International Airport
 * rowspan=2|Great Falls
 * 278
 * South end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 280
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 282
 * 286
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * Manchester
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 290
 * North end of US 89/MT 200 overlap
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 297
 * Gordon
 * 297
 * Gordon

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 1 one external link on Interstate 15. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20070615184246/http://www.dot.ca.gov/dist8/projects/15/I-15%20Brstw%20-STLN.revsd%206-2004%20copy.pdf to http://www.dot.ca.gov/dist8/projects/15/I-15%20Brstw%20-STLN.revsd%206-2004%20copy.pdf

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers.—cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 20:55, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Protection level change
Note that the semi-protection on this article could be replaced with Pending Changes if an edit filter is made. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.224.254.163 (talk) 03:37, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Interstate 15. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080117034523/http://www.utah.com/visitor/state_facts/population.htm to http://www.utah.com/visitor/state_facts/population.htm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 16:38, 15 November 2017 (UTC)

title: Talk:Interstate 15


text: User talk:80.121.105.184

title: User talk:80.121.105.184


text:
Talk:Kevin Max

Untitled
Do we have source to site for the information that he married Amanda in April and London was born in October?

There was an interview at crossrhythms.co.uk where Kevin stated that was true.

I do not see any evidence that Kevin Max won Grammy awards for his solo projects. I searched the Grammy website and he is not listed as a winner.

I also looked and could not find anything stating Kevin won a Grammy for anything as a solo artist.

Perhaps it was only a nomination.--Lucius funk 22:53, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

No, the dc talk album "Solo" won a grammy in 2001, the 44th Grammy Awards. See the Grammy website for details on that. Other than that, no Grammy wins for Kevin Max that I'm seeing. Or Kevin Smith for that matter. --- Kevin Smith 18:24, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but "Solo" featured two songs from "Stereotype Be," two songs from TobyMac's "Momentum," and two songs from Tait's "Empty." It was a demo album advertising dc Talk's solo ventures. So technically, the claim, "Two songs won a Grammy - BE and Return of the Singer" is correct, right? (thedano81@hotmail.com, 26 July 2006).

But is it counted as the two songs winning if only the album received the award?--Lucius funk 22:38, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

I would think it would be. These songs were created completely independently of dc Talk, Toby McKeehan, or Michael Tait. So that means that even though they were first seen on an album released under the name "dc Talk", it still means that those songs won an award. They both contributed to the album winning the Grammy.-- C hil  e  14  16:55, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

But still, the EP won the award, not any individual song.--Lucius funk 15:00, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

Unsourced statements
There are at least two "unsourced" statements in this article. Everybody who pays attention to Kevin Max's life knows that these statements are true I would love it if these tags were removed.-- Chili14 ( Talk to me! 17:07, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Well find on his message board where he talks about his daughter being born.--Lucius funk 19:16, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

It's been fixed-- Chi l  i  1  4  15:28, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Not everyone can access that forum. I think we need better sources.--Lucius funk 22:44, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

Most of the forums at dctalkunite.com should be available to everyone. As far as I know, the only closed forum on the website is the "Dc Talk (Kevin Max|Tait|Tobymac) Pictures" message board. If you want a better source, there's a very in-depth interview at crossrhythms.co.uk which talks a lot about KMAX's personal life. I think the article is listed in the "External links" section of this article.--Teebs101 07:13, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, that's why I changed the sources from the dc talk unite boards to the Cross Rhythms interview less than a week after I put the above statement about the dctalkunite board not being accessible to everyone.--Lucius Funk 17:43, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks!--Teebs101 04:59, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

You're a bit behind in your responses, don't you think? I said it needed different sources in July and in September (two months after I had changed the sources) you said there's another source I could use.Lucius Funk 20:21, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

"Similar artists" section
To me, this section of the article is too subjective. By who's standard are those musicians listed similar to Kevin Max? It doesn't seem all that encyclopedic to have them listed there with no quote from someone else or reference, and I typically don't see that kind of section in other articles about musicians. I personally think it would be best to delete that part, because there's no reference to the comparisons, nor does it seem encyclopedic, especially without any citations or quotes from others about the comparisons. -- Jamie  S93  22:30, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree. I deleted the section. Really, this entire article needs a re-write. Each section has only 2 or 3 sentences each, and almost everything is unsourced. --Managerpants (talk) 15:06, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Didn't mean to get back to this late (I thought nobody would see my comment here!) I'm glad that section is deleted now, and yes, I agree about the article needing a re-write. I'd recently noticed that it needed a lot of help, but I just haven't gotten around to it yet. I'm planning on trying to improve it soon, especially with organization and wikification. Thanks for the response.  Jamie  S93  19:53, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * No problem. It's already looking much better. :-)  --Managerpants (talk) 02:11, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Spirituality

 * Max also expressed interest in both the Swedenborg and Unitarian Churches, as examples of a more refined and understanding group of believers.

That's sort of a provocative claim to be made without substantiation (not that I don't think it wouldn't be possible, but it's easy to see that this can be read in a lot of ways and cause a lot of confusion about Mr. Max's position - i.e. the churches behavior towards people vs. their doctrines). I've added the citation needed tag, but since the user that added this info is anonymous (the edit was made on January 22nd 2011 at 23:45(GMT-3) if anyone cares), I'd rather do away with that sentence entirely if it's ok with you (unless, of course, it can be otherwise substantiated). --CronoT 01:56, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Collaborations/Guest Appearances
Can we work to merge these together or weed out the redundancies? For example, his work with Newsboys, Manic Drive, and Sonicflood is listed both under collaborations and guest appearances. Lucius Funk (talk) 21:59, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 1 one external link on Kevin Max. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20141127205248/http://www.streetbrand.com:80/20090325929/headlines/christian-music-act-kevin-max-and-wife-has-new-baby.html to http://www.streetbrand.com/20090325929/headlines/christian-music-act-kevin-max-and-wife-has-new-baby.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers.—cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 04:10, 8 January 2016 (UTC)
 * but all of the archives are bad. I will revert. Walter Görlitz (talk) 06:05, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 1 one external link on Kevin Max. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20141127205248/http://www.streetbrand.com:80/20090325929/headlines/christian-music-act-kevin-max-and-wife-has-new-baby.html to http://www.streetbrand.com/20090325929/headlines/christian-music-act-kevin-max-and-wife-has-new-baby.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers.—cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 06:37, 10 February 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Kevin Max. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120316051458/http://listenin.org/player/playpost.aspx?PostID=17040 to http://listenin.org/player/playpost.aspx?PostID=17040
 * Added tag to http://www.ology.com/music/album-review-kevin-max-fiefdom-angels-side-one/03052012

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 00:53, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

title: Talk:Kevin Max


text:
V/Vm Test Records

V/Vm Test records was a record label based in Stockport, England and was started by James Leyland Kirby (V/Vm) and Andrew Macgregor (Jansky Noise, Animal) in 1996. It did not have an overseas division, so releases on it tend to be collectable outside of the United Kingdom.

The label released artists works from a wide variety of genres, including noise, soundscape, breakcore, mashup and many more that don't fit comfortably into any genre. Notable acts on V/Vm Test included Jega, Kid606, Hell Interface (Boards of Canada), Kevin Blechdom, Goodiepal, Knifehandchop and Datach'i.

V/Vm Test Records were notable for their rebellious approach, often involving blatant copyright infringement, the most notable of which were the artists V/Vm themselves, often taking a popular song and running it through various filters, the end result being a de-tuned and distorted version of the original. The album Sick Love contains several notable examples of this style, as well as the frequent references to pigs that colour most V/Vm releases.

V/Vm Test was instrumental in giving away free and unrestricted downloads since 1997 on his website and via various V/Vm Test associated Microsites. In 2006, V/Vm set up an additional label, Vukzid, and also a number of extra microsites which gave away free audio and visual content along with working on a unique daily project which saw the artist V/Vm record at least one piece of audio per day which was then uploaded and given away for free (for the whole of 2006).

In 2007, V/Vm Test also launched the Freenoise Archives, which has over 3GB of out of print noise releases available for free download via a microsite.

At the end of 2008, V/Vm Test Records ceased its operations and changed to History Always Favours The Winners.

title: V/Vm Test Records


text:
User:Ocohen

 {|cellspacing="0" style="width: 238px; background: navy;"
 * style="width: 45px; height: 45px; background: ; text-align: center; font-size: pt; color: #000;" |
 * style="font-size: 10pt; padding: 4pt; line-height: 1.25em; color: white;" |

title: User:Ocohen


text:
Classical Age of the Ottoman Empire

The Classical Age of the Ottoman Empire (Klasik Çağ) concerns the history of the Ottoman Empire from the conquest of Constantinople in 1453 until the second half of the sixteenth century, roughly the end of the reign of Suleiman the Magnificent (r. 1520–1566). During this period a system of patrimonial rule based on the absolute authority of the sultan reached its apex, and the empire developed the institutional foundations which it would maintain, in modified form, for several centuries. The territory of the Ottoman Empire greatly expanded, and led to what some historians have called the Pax Ottomana. The process of centralization undergone by the empire prior to 1453 was brought to completion in the reign of Mehmed II.

Territory
The Ottoman Empire of the Classical Age experienced dramatic territorial growth. The period opened with the conquest of Constantinople by Mehmed II (r. 1451–1481) in 1453. Mehmed II went on to consolidate the empire's position in the Balkans and Anatolia, conquering Serbia in 1454–5, the Peloponnese in 1458–9, Trebizond in 1461, and Bosnia in 1463. Many Venetian territories in Greece were conquered during the 1463–79 Ottoman-Venetian War. By 1474 the Ottomans had conquered their Anatolian rival, the Karamanids, and in 1475 conquered Kaffa on the Crimean Peninsula, establishing the Crimean Khanate as a vassal state. In 1480 an invasion of Otranto in Italy was launched, but the death of Mehmed II the following year led to an Ottoman withdrawal.

The reign of Bayezid II (r. 1481–1512) was one of consolidation after the rapid conquests of the previous era, and the empire's territory was expanded only marginally. In 1484 Bayezid led a campaign against Moldavia, subjecting it to vassal status and annexing the strategic ports of Kilia and Akkerman. Major Venetian ports were conquered in Greece and Albania during the 1499–1503 war, most significantly Modon, Koron, and Durazzo. However, by the end of his reign, Ottoman territory in the east was coming under threat from the newly established Safavid Empire.

Rapid expansion resumed under Selim I (r. 1512–1520), who defeated the Safavids in the Battle of Chaldiran in 1514, annexing much of eastern Anatolia and briefly occupying Tabriz. In 1516 he led a campaign against the Mamluk Sultanate, conquering first Syria and then Egypt the following year. This marked a dramatic shift in the orientation of the Ottoman Empire, as it now came to rule over the Muslim heartlands of the Middle East, as well as establishing its protection over the holy cities of Mecca and Medina. This increased the influence of Islamic practices on the government of the empire, and facilitated much greater interaction between the Arabic-speaking world and the Ottoman heartlands in Anatolia and the Balkans. Under Selim's reign the empire's territory expanded from roughly 341,100 mi2 to 576,900 mi2.

Expansion continued during the first half of the reign of Suleiman I (r. 1520–1566), who conquered first Belgrade (1521) and Rhodes, before invading Hungary in 1526, defeating and killing King Louis II in the Battle of Mohács and briefly occupying Buda. Lacking a king, Hungary descended into civil war over the succession, and the Ottomans gave support to John Zápolya as a vassal prince. When their rivals the Habsburgs began to achieve the upper hand, Suleiman directly intervened by again conquering Buda and annexing it to the empire in 1541. Elsewhere, Suleiman led major campaigns against Safavid Iran, conquering Baghdad in 1534 and annexing Iraq. Ottoman rule was further extended with the incorporation of much of North Africa, the conquest of coastal Yemen in 1538, and the subsequent annexation of the interior.

After the annexation of Buda in 1541 the pace of Ottoman expansion slowed as the empire attempted to consolidate its vast gains, and became engrossed in imperial warfare on three fronts: in Hungary, in Iran, and in the Mediterranean. Additional conquests were marginal, and served to shore up the Ottoman position. Ottoman control over Hungary was expanded in a series of campaigns, and a second Hungarian province was established with the conquests of Temeşvar in 1552. Control over North Africa was increased with the conquest of Tripoli in 1551, while the Ottomans shored up their position in the Red Sea with the annexation of Massawa (1557) and the extension of Ottoman rule over much of coastal Eritrea and Djibouti. By the end of Suleiman's reign the empire's territory had expanded to approximately 50,00,000 km2.

1451–1481: Mehmed II
The conquest of Constantinople allowed Mehmed II to turn his attention to Anatolia. Mehmed II tried to create a single political entity in Anatolia by capturing Turkish states called Beyliks and the Greek Empire of Trebizond in northeastern Anatolia and allied himself with the Crimean Khanate. Uniting the Anatolian Beyliks was first accomplished by Sultan Bayezid I, more than fifty years earlier than Mehmed II, but after the destructive Battle of Ankara back in 1402, the newly formed Anatolian unification was gone. Mehmed II recovered the Ottoman power on other Turkish states. These conquests allowed him to push further into Europe.

Another important political entity which shaped the Eastern policy of Mehmed II was the White Sheep Turcomans. With the leadership of Uzun Hasan, this Turcoman kingdom gained power in the East but because of their strong relations with the Christian powers like Empire of Trebizond and the Republic of Venice and the alliance between Turcomans and Karamanid tribe, Mehmed saw them as a threat to his own power. He led a successful campaign against Uzun Hasan in 1473 which resulted with the decisive victory of the Ottoman Empire in the Battle of Otlukbeli.

After the Fall of Constantinople, Mehmed would also go on to conquer the Despotate of Morea in the Peloponnese in 1460, and the Empire of Trebizond in northeastern Anatolia in 1461. The last two vestiges of Byzantine rule were thus absorbed by the Ottoman Empire. The conquest of Constantinople bestowed immense glory and prestige on the country.

Mehmed II advanced toward Eastern Europe as far as Belgrade, and attempted to conquer the city from John Hunyadi at the Siege of Belgrade in 1456. Hungarian commanders successfully defended the city and Ottomans retreated with heavy losses, but at the end, Ottomans occupied nearly all of Serbia.

In 1463, after a dispute over the tribute paid annually by the Bosnian kingdom, Mehmed invaded Bosnia and conquered it very quickly, executing the last Bosnian king Stephen Tomašević and his uncle Radivoj.

In 1462 Mehmed II came into conflict with Prince Vlad III Dracula of Wallachia, who had spent part of his childhood alongside Mehmed. Vlad had ambushed, massacred or captured several Ottoman forces, then announced his impalement of over 23,000 captive Turks. Mehmed II abandoned his siege of Corinth to launch a punitive attack against Vlad in Wallachia but suffered many casualties in a surprise night attack led by Vlad, who was apparently bent on personally killing the Sultan. Confronted by Vlad's scorched earth policies and demoralizing brutality, Mehmed II withdrew, leaving his ally Radu cel Frumos, Vlad's brother, with a small force in order to win over local boyars who had been persecuted by Vlad III. Radu eventually managed to take control of Wallachia, which he administered as Bey, on behalf of Mehmet II. Vlad eventually escaped to Hungary, where he was imprisoned on a false accusation of treason against his overlord.

In 1475, the Ottomans suffered a great defeat at the hands of Stephen the Great of Moldavia at the Battle of Vaslui. In 1476, Mehmed won a pyrrhic victory against Stephen at the Battle of Valea Albă. He besieged the capital of Suceava, but could not take it, nor could he take the Castle of Târgu Neamț. With a plague running in his camp and food and water being very scarce, Mehmed was forced to retreat.

Skanderbeg, a member of the Albanian nobility and a former member of the Ottoman ruling elite, led Skanderbeg's rebellion against the expansion of the Ottoman Empire into Europe. Skanderbeg, son of Gjon Kastrioti (who had joined the unsuccessful Albanian revolt of 1432–1436), united the Albanian Principalities in a military and diplomatic alliance, the League of Lezhë, in 1444. Mehmed II was never successful in his efforts to subjugate Albania while Skanderbeg was alive, even though he twice (1466 and 1467) led the Ottoman armies himself against Krujë. During this period Albanians achieved many victories against the Ottomans like the Battle of Torvioll, Battle of Otonetë, Battle of Oranik, Siege of Krujë 1450, Battle of Polog, Battle of Ohrid, Battle of Mokra 1445, and many others, culminating at the Battle of Albulena where the Albanian army destroyed the Ottoman army, inflicting nearly 30,000 casualties on the Ottomans. After Skanderbeg died in 1468, the Albanians couldn't find a leader to replace him, and Mehmed II eventually conquered Krujë and Albania in 1478. The final act of Mehmed II's Albanian campaigns was the troublesome Siege of Shkodra in 1478–79, a siege he led personally against the combined Venetian and Albanian force.

Mehmed II invaded Italy in 1480. The intent of his invasion was to capture Rome and "reunite the Roman Empire", and, at first, looked like he might be able to do it with the quick (15-days to completion) Ottoman invasion of Otranto in 1480, but Otranto was retaken by Papal forces in 1481 after the death of Mehmed. After his death, he was succeeded by his son, Bayezid II.

1481–1512: Bayezid II
When Bayezid II was enthroned upon his father's death in 1481, he first had to fight his younger brother Cem Sultan, who took Inegöl and Bursa and proclaimed himself Sultan of Anatolia. After a battle at Yenişehir, Cem was defeated and fled to Cairo. The very next year he returned, supported by the Mameluks, and took eastern Anatolia, Ankara and Konya, but eventually he was beaten and forced to flee to Rhodes.

Sultan Bayezid attacked Venice in 1499. Peace was signed in 1503, and the Ottomans gained the last Venetian strongholds on the Peloponnesos and some towns along the Adriatic coast. In the 16th century, Mameluks and Persians under Shah Ismail I allied against the Ottomans. The war ended in 1511 in favor of the Turks.

Later that year, Bayezid's son Ahmet forced his father into making him regent. His brother Selim was forced to flee to Crimea. When Ahmet was about to be crowned, the Janissaries intervened, killed the prince and forced Bayezid into calling Selim back and making him the sultan. Bayezid abdicated, and he died immediately after leaving the throne.

1512–1520: Selim I
During his reign, Selim I (so called Yavuz: "the Grim") was able to expand the empire's borders greatly to the south and east. Around 1512 the Ottoman naval fleet developed under his rule, such that the Ottoman Turks were able to challenge the Republic of Venice, a naval power which established its thalassocracy alongside the other Italian maritime republics upon the Mediterranean Region. At the Battle of Chaldiran in eastern Anatolia in 1514, Ottoman forces under Selim I won a decisive victory against the Safavids, ensuring Ottoman security on their eastern front and leading to the conquest of eastern Anatolia and northern Iraq. He defeated the Mamluk Sultanate and conquered most of Syria and Egypt, including Jerusalem as well as Cairo, the residence of the Abbasid caliph.

1520–1566: Suleiman the Magnificent
Suleiman the Magnificent first put down a revolt led by the Ottoman-appointed governor in Damascus. By August, 1521, Suleiman had captured the city of Belgrade, which was then under Hungarian control. In 1522, Suleiman captured Rhodes. On August 29, 1526, Suleiman defeated Louis II of Hungary at the Battle of Mohács. In 1541 Suleiman annexed most of present-day Hungary, known as the Great Alföld, and installed Zápolya's family as rulers of the independent principality of Transylvania, a vassal state of the Empire. While claiming the entire kingdom, Ferdinand I of Austria ruled over the so-called "Royal Hungary" (present-day Slovakia, North-Western Hungary and western Croatia), a territory which temporarily fixed the border between the Habsburgs and the Ottomans.

The Shi'ite Safavid Empire ruled Persia and modern-day Iraq. Suleiman waged three campaigns against the Safavids. In the first, the historically important city of Baghdad fell to Suleiman's forces in 1534. The second campaign, 1548–1549, resulted in temporary Ottoman gains in Tabriz and Azerbaijan, a lasting presence in Van Province, and some forts in Georgia. The third campaign (1554–55) was a response to costly Safavid raids into the provinces of Van and Erzurum in eastern Anatolia in 1550–52. Ottoman forces captured Yerevan, Karabakh and Nakhjuwan and destroyed palaces, villas and gardens. Although Sulieman threatened Ardabil, the military situation was essentially a stalemate by the end of the 1554 campaign season. Tahmasp sent an ambassador to Suleiman's winter quarters in Erzurum in September 1554 to sue for peace. Influenced at least in part by the Ottoman Empire's military position with respect to Hungary, Sulieman agreed to temporary terms. The formal Peace of Amasya signed the following June was the first formal diplomatic recognition of the Safavid Empire by the Ottomans. Under the Peace, the Ottomans agreed to restore Yerevan, Karabakh and Nakhjuwan to the Safavids and in turn would retain Iraq and eastern Anatolia. Suleiman agreed to permit Safavid Shi’a pilgrims to make pilgrimages to Mecca and Medina as well as tombs of imams in Iraq and Arabia on condition that the shah abolished the taburru, the cursing of the first three Rashidun caliphs. The Peace ended hostilities between the two empires for 20 years.

Huge territories of North Africa up to west of Algeria were annexed. The Barbary States of Tripolitania, Tunisia and Algeria became provinces of the Empire. The piracy carried on thereafter by the Barbary pirates of North Africa remained part of the wars against Spain, and the Ottoman expansion was associated with naval dominance for a short period in the Mediterranean.

Ottoman navies also controlled the Red Sea, and held the Persian Gulf until 1554, when their ships were defeated by the navy of the Portuguese Empire in the Battle of the Gulf of Oman. The Portuguese would continue to contest Suleiman's forces for control of Aden. In 1533 Khair ad Din known to Europeans as Barbarossa, was made Admiral-in-Chief of the Ottoman navies who were actively fighting the Spanish navy.

In 1535 the Habsburg Holy Roman Emperor, Charles V (Charles I of Spain) won an important victory against the Ottomans at Tunis, but in 1536 King Francis I of France allied himself with Suleiman against Charles. In 1538, the fleet of Charles V was defeated at the Battle of Preveza by Khair ad Din, securing the eastern Mediterranean for the Turks for 33 years. Francis I asked for help from Suleiman, then sent a fleet headed by Khair ad Din who was victorious over the Spaniards, and managed to retake Naples from them. Suleiman bestowed on him the title of beylerbey. One result of the alliance was the fierce sea duel between Dragut and Andrea Doria, which left the northern Mediterranean and the southern Mediterranean in Ottoman's hands.

Surveys

 * Mikhail, Alan. God's Shadow: Sultan Selim, His Ottoman Empire, and the Making of the Modern World (2020) excerpt on Selim I
 * Mikhail, Alan. God's Shadow: Sultan Selim, His Ottoman Empire, and the Making of the Modern World (2020) excerpt on Selim I
 * Mikhail, Alan. God's Shadow: Sultan Selim, His Ottoman Empire, and the Making of the Modern World (2020) excerpt on Selim I
 * Mikhail, Alan. God's Shadow: Sultan Selim, His Ottoman Empire, and the Making of the Modern World (2020) excerpt on Selim I
 * Mikhail, Alan. God's Shadow: Sultan Selim, His Ottoman Empire, and the Making of the Modern World (2020) excerpt on Selim I
 * Mikhail, Alan. God's Shadow: Sultan Selim, His Ottoman Empire, and the Making of the Modern World (2020) excerpt on Selim I

title: Classical Age of the Ottoman Empire


text:
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Christopher Burke Gibson

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was Delete (4d/1k/2dis) Ryan Norton T 07:46, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

Christopher Burke Gibson

 * Various formating, & italicized annotations relevant to vote, by Jerzy•t 07:10, 7 October 2005 (UTC).

Nom & vote Del. (Copyvio now mostly resolved & presumably fully resolvable.) Apparently lovable but apparently non-notable "philosopher". * Only Google hits on full name are WP and a personal site apparently connected with the same on-line pub (Contrary Magazine) that did the obit that was the source of the initial article. * First relevant hit of 153 Google non-dupes on
 * "Christopher Gibson" philosopher

is #9,  local paper whose most notability-suggestive content is
 * On Tuesday, friends of Gibson described him as a self-taught scholar and storyteller with a "voracious love of knowledge."
 * "What was remarkable about Chris was that he was an extraordinarily astute communicator," said Peter K. Kardel, who had known Gibson for 15 years. "When he would tell a story, it was hypnotizing to listen to."

_* Nothing else that looks relvant thru the 40th hit. * He's described as a writer; the only item listed under "Original works" [Did he do unoriginal works, but nevermind] is apparently now published posthumously, bcz after urging him "for years" to submit, the publisher lost the file for 3 years and the author chose not to keep copies of what he wrote. --Jerzy•t 19:42, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. I will assert that he was a notable philosopher. That his obituary contains description of being "the most intense person that I have ever met," written by notable thinker and commentator on society and technology, Langdon Winner, lends credence to this.  Jerzy's comments regarding "unorginal works" do not add anything constructive to this discussion.  That Gibson's only item listed under Original Works--since changed to Publications-- was published posthumously is irrelevant.  Chris Gibson was an important figure on the modern American literary and philosophical scene.  A walking encyclopedia in his own right, meeting the definition of polyhistor if not polymath, he certainly belongs in wikipedia.  The "notability" of his life is already attested to by the numerous external links, containing references to his life and work from publications in New York, Chicago, Portland, OR and San Luis Obispo, CA.  I also do not understand how copyvio now only mostly resolved, as the original publisher granted permission on the articles talk page.  And in any case, although the initial template for this article was based on his obituary, significant revisions have already been undertaken. Granted, it may require further additions and clarifications.  That Google does not produce many hits on his full name could be due to the fact that he often did not go by his full name. -Daniel Lotspeich, MD. --Daniel Lotspeich 20:40, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
 * First of 53 edits.
 * I risk distraction by several red herrings, in addressing them:
 * _ _ To quote without the misspelling you introduced, and with relevant context, i said, parenthetically, "... unoriginal works, but nevermind]", bcz i thot the point too minor to make in a way that would invite effort to respond to it; as to "[nothing] constructive", i suppose you are free to regard anything you disagree with as unconstructive. Since you have taken issue with that throw-away thot, i point out its relevance to the air of vagueness and the bizarre that pervades the assertions of Gibson's notability. You quote "the most intense person that I [the eulogist] have ever met", and i have two reactions. One is to recall the description of Spinal Tap's status among the English heavy-metal bands: "certainly the [skipped beat] loudest", and to wonder whether the eulogist was conscious of damning with faint praise. The other is to wonder whether the eulogist was deficient in experience with under-medicated schizophrenics, or whether Gibson, who ended arguements by screaming obscenities, said he wanted to die, and did so by drowning in the dark, perhaps was an under-medicated schizophrenic. I hasten to add that schizophrenia, even under-medicated, doesn't preclude notability; still, it can interfere with attaining it, and a brilliant schizophrenic IMO can attract a sympathy that makes it hard to keep clear the distinction between achieving notability and being brilliant enough to deserve a notability that the schizophrenia denies them.
 * _ _ Your being non-plussed by my other parenthetical (tho i would hope it made clear that the subject as not germane to the purpose of this page) is understandable, as i was intentionally terse. I needed to mention it as being no longer germane, since an unresolved Copyvio problem precludes consideration under AfD; i thought this one might still be technically unresolved, since i had read an instruction earlier this week that permissions (i.e., placings of works under GFDL by a copyright holder who did not perform the relevant edit) should be directed to the WP publicity dept, rather than e.g. being placed on the talk page.  I did not feel at liberty to give the impression that everything was taken care of, when there was no indication of that step being taken. (FWIW, i've since seen suggestions to put permissions on the corresponding talk pages, without mention of Pub Dept., so my scruple may have been unnecessary. [shrug]). --Jerzy•t 11:19, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * In addition, Jerzy's references regarding the events which kept Chris Gibson's work from being published before his death are misleading, if not inaccurate. Reviewing the available information in the refereces shows that the article was not lost, but the publisher's computer crashed and all files were unreachable.    Gibson was approached prior to his death for an additional copy, but stated "I don't save things because it increases my natural tendency towards self-deleteriousness."  This is very much in keeping with his philosophy revealed on even a superficial reading of his text Wages of Insomnia, which coins the phrase "Profligate Metaphysic."  The text was later recovered using software that could salvage material on the hard-drive.  Admittedly this article is overly detailed.  However deletion is too harsh a penalty for the long-windedness of the submitter. --Daniel Lotspeich 05:24, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
 * The only relevance of the content or its long-windedness (i doubt i mentioned that) is as evidence on the issue in this process:
 * Is it reasonable to hope that this article, or some other, with Christopher Burke Gibson as its topic, could turn into an asset to WP.
 * Attention to the relevant pages in the Wikipedia: ("project") namespace, and to other AfD discussions on bios claimed to be non-notable, will arguing relevantly on question, than will going with your gut in responding. --Jerzy•t 11:19, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * _ _ (It's time for me to risk rubbing salt in a wound by calling a spade a spade: If he ever published anything else, one of you should have bloody well said so before now. I assume he did not. ... Yet, you also should have been gracious enough to say explicitly "While it's true that he never published anything, ...", and i may be trusting something obvious but false. But the first full calendar day is almost half gone, so time is a-wasting. Onward.)
 * _ _ Well. I actually made a fool of myself by consulting my dictionary to be sure that lost has verifiable senses like "ruined or destroyed" and "no longer possessed", before re-reading Chris Gibson, philosopher, 1954-2005. Congratulations, you sucker-punched me: he says "I lost [emphasis added by Jerzy•t] the file when I transferred data from the old computer on which I'd received his essay to the new one on which we built the magazine." Now, i'm not going to beat you up with a technical discussion about what it takes to lose sectors without scraping the oxide off the platter, and the claims that Apple software protects you against what MS carelessly doesn't, and how i've read and altered raw sectors on an IBM PC long before this file got lost. Our Spotlight (software) feature list may be out of date, and i admit "unindexed bowels of the hard drive" would be more accurately used to mean "lost sectors" than (what i inferred at my first reading) "cryptically named files that you can only locate in a content search". Nor do we need the missing contemporaneous accounts of whether he "grimaced for three years at the loss."
 * _ _ That's bcz we have what we need at hand: There was a time when he had no way of recovering the essay. Then there came a time when he had "the penetrating vision of a new search technology", but did not use it. Then, the day he got word, "suppos[ing] the irony appropriate" would no longer wash, and the same day, it stopped being lost. If your belief is that the period of not using the available technology was insignificant in length compared to a day, you should cite something more convincing than this eulogy as evidence.
 * _ _ Because here's the picture i find most plausible: [Repeat N times, on N visits:] "Gibson, you should really write some of this down." "- - - ". [Visit N+1:] " ... and now I can be your publisher." "OK, you asked for it." "Oop, send another copy." "Sorry, no gots." [Some selection from the following:] "It was good, give me more of whatever catches your fancy." "Why don't i publish me interviewing you on the same subject?" "I wish i'd read more than the first and the final 'graphs, so i could interview you on the same subject."  "Why don't i publish me interviewing you on the another subject of your choosing?"  "Here's a tape recorder, do some raconting and i'll be your editor." [One selection from the following, for each of the preceding:] "No."  "Maybe." "Not now." [Repetition of these exchanges, with decreasing frequency.]  "Grimace." [Once only:] "Regret to inform you..." [Whatever:] "Gosh, he's dead, why him and not me?" "Could I have been more helpful in pulling together something publishable?" "Could I have made his death less likely?" "Well, at least i can get off my ass and try to recover the file again." In a line, there's been no evidence that his intellect was stunning enuf to produce another essay, or a fistful of aphorisms, or to motivate recovery of the essay a week, a month, or a year before grief or survivor guilt had an opportunity to change the subjective situation, where the objective situation was on a clear track toward him either dying, in a "timely"  or untimely fashion, but in any case unpublished.
 * _ _ So it appears he impressed a bunch of first-hand acquaintances -- something loads of physicians, and pastors, and community-theater actors, and really cool mail carriers do, without becoming notable -- and produced an essay that has not yet had a chance to get evaluated in the cold light of day. In the unlikely event that a single essay is compelling enough to develop him a following, or that one of the first-hand acquaintances can produce a memoir that develops him (rather than the memoirist) a following, that will not be clear until others, less willing than i to speak ill of the recently dead, have their chance to mull and then speak.  In a world where a million people amount to small change, the claim that acquaintances can make you notable does little more than impeach the credibility of those who present it. --Jerzy•t 11:19, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Although this man is not amazingly well-known, and although the article is over-detailed, it is definitely solvable. Google isn't the best metric of the notability of philosophers, because they generally don't have a huge internet presence. Grobertson 09:08, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
 *  Not a new editor: 59th and 60th edits. First 25 in 2004 Nov; two in two sessions, 2004 Dec; one each in April & June; 19 in 8 or 9 sessions in Sept.; 14 in 5 sessions, Oct. 3-6.
 * Of course it doesn't. Google is only the best metric that has been presented. We start by assuming non-notability.  Failure of a straight forward Google test merely assures voters that verifying notability is not a trivial task.  Come up with a better metric that does verify notability. --Jerzy•t 11:19, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. First of all, he went by "Chris Gibson." Try googling ["Chris Gibson" philosopher]. He was more than simply a philosopher. Raconteur is a title he wore just as well. It is true that Mr. Gibson is not yet widely known nor widely published, but the same facts were true of Vincent van Gogh when he died. It is a consequence of Mr. Gibson's embodiment of his philosophy that he did not participate in the culture nor the orthodoxies of philosophy, academia, publishing, nor much else in society. Nonetheless, the brilliance and originality of his mind is recognized by a select few and by all accounts an increasing number. Check with Langdon Winner, professor of humanities at Rensselaer University. http://www.langdonwinner.org/index.html This is a good opportunity for Wikipedia to rise above the tyranny of the mundane order that decides who gets famous, instead of appealing to it as a justification for reproducing it. By these rules, you would have excluded Emily Dickinson early in her posthumous career.  Jeff McMahon.
 * 5th thru 7th edits by IP.
 * Indeed we would exclude those two figures, and without apology. Magazines can discover unappreciated geniuses; encyclopedias consolidate established knowledge. --Jerzy•t 11:19, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Point Taken, and it's your encyclopedia after all. I'm sorry to be a "meat puppet," if that's what I am; I only entered the conversation because I was asked to clear the copyright, which I was happy to do for Wikipedia. And I confess to misunderstanding the mission of Wikipedia. I thought it meant to be larger and more inclusive and not necessarily to conform to the confines of the standard paper versions. Because it would be easier to just scan in the Brittanica after all. I'll mind my own business. Jeff McMahon
 * I like this...I suppose it forces me to take a step back and consider whether or not I should have any interest whatsoever in Wikipedia's mission. Apparently, this place is unwilling to admit anything that is not already widely accepted.  What is its purpose then, really, other than to satisfy the needs of amateurs and hobbyists who find pleasure in cataloging and arranging articles and facts?  I put up another couple of articles, out of boredom one evening (just that hobbyist's inclination to catalog something).  I stuck in an article on John Brombaugh and another organ builder (Hendrik Niehoff, 16th century Dutch) than I learned about by studying Chris Gibson's life and work.  I stuck in another couple of articles as well:  one on an artist whose works I admire and another on an interesting, but somewhat unknown song by Woody Guthrie.  But truthfully, if Wikipedia is stictly the province of mirroring accepted dogma,  my time may well be best spent pursuing other, more fruitful endeavors. --Daniel Lotspeich 02:25, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
 * _ _ At the risk of rudely appearing to respond to two people as if i thot they were of one mind, i'm going to address some common threads between DL & JM'M. And worse yet, compare their situation to my own, vaguely similar, initial response.
 * _ _ My reaction was "Nice that i found what i needed, but i don't need a WiccaPedia." -- falsely assuming that "Wiki" was just a cognate of "wicca" and "witchcraft". I had to stumble on WP a few more times before i realized anything about what it is, and edit for months before beginning to suspect its significance.
 * _ _ The WP issues that you each are raising are ripples on an ocean. While such numbers prove nothing important, something about that ocean is hinted at by Alexa rankings: IMDb tied WP on only 3 days in the last 3 weeks, and can be expected to drop increasingly far behind; WP's starting to contend w/ Craigslist.  Those are (depending on the timescale you look at) 40th to 43rd and 32 to 34 on the whole Web, and 23 and 18 among English-language sites. (Compare with caution: WP is 40% foreign languages.)  I usually can stop myself before i say "a new force of nature", but WP is certainly a phenomenon sui generis; while i have only suspicions about what it means, i feel confident that you two have so far almost nothing but misconceptions about it; my guess is that even if you walk away at this point, it's going to tap you on the shoulder sooner rather than later.
 * _ _ I'm gonna shut up quickly, but the last things i need to say are
 * the issues you are raising are so far from central that if WP's approach started changing in that respect tomorrow (started, bcz WP changes course like a supertanker), i'd go "tsk; too bad", shrug, and carry on with my work here;
 * almost no decision affects the big picture, except the choice of MediaWiki as infrastructure, GFDL, and NPoV;
 * this all has to have a lot to do with information "wanting" to be true and free (tho i am no expert on those theories).
 * And IMO explaining in any detail why i believe that would be an arrogant waste of our time. I dunno if they get it in Peoria, but the points you raise convince me you're going discover it for yourself before too long, with >90% probability. --Jerzy•t 20:22, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
 * BTW, abt the "meatpuppet" thing (mentioned in JM'M's first sentence, above), the term itself is IMO a more offensive one than "sock puppet", applied to a less offensive behavior, and i wish i had promptly objected to an editor raising their "annoy[ance]" (below) as being contrary to our policy of "not biting the newcomers" (whether or not i may have strayed into that as well). It suppose it annoys me somewhat too, but i'm opposed to complaining about it, bcz it's part of the "cost of doing business" rather than being the result of bad behavior, and there's no point in complaining about it as if the newcomers were in the wrong. --Jerzy•t 20:22, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete article on non-notable figure. And meatpuppets annoy me. Ambi 11:32, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * WP:SOCK clarifies this term, which i found new and not immediately transparent. --Jerzy•t 19:03, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
 * ''The following contrib is restored, but struck thru, after deletion by its original contributor; this avoids changing the meaning of my response by removing it from its context. Hopefully the strike-thru captures the intent of removing it, presumably withdrawl of the request.

 * Request to JerzyJerzy, please move comments above that you are placing in the middle on mine and others requests that the article on writer Chris Gibson be kept. They would be better placed at the bottom of the page They create an unnecessary disctraction from the points that I and others make, which stifles discussion. Your comments would be less disruptive, though should still able to be reviewed if listed at the bottom of the discussion, giving everyone an opportunity to make their point in turn. Thanks! --Daniel Lotspeich 15:07, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm afraid your expectations are badly out of synch with WP practice, & i've already over-invested in responding to you. In lieu of my going into detail, WP:AfD should be a reasonably efficient starting point for self-orientation. --Jerzy•t 19:03, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
 * The following was used to replace the entire text except for the section hdg:
 * I have blanked the discussion for the following reason: as the original submitter of this article, I would like for this article to be removed from wikipedia. --Daniel Lotspeich 21:12, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

Due to the less than flattering conjectural remarks regarding Christopher Burke Gibson (who was in fact a living member of a real--not virtual or abstract) community, I repeat my request:

I have blanked the discussion for the following reason: as the original submitter of this article, I would like for this article to be removed from wikipedia

Those wishing to review the history of this article may do so, but out of respect for Chris' memory and regards for his family & friends, I request the article not appear here any longer. --PooterCobb 05:30, 12 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Changing my vote. Strong Delete or Speedy or whatever.  Abstain.  The guy was a close personal friend of mine and the article is clearly not written from a neutral point of view.  Additionally, his notability hinges on a few scraps gathered from internet blogs and local press (one article from an alternative newspaper).  The page would be better placed on a personal website. Daniel Lotspeich 15:35, 12 October 2005 (UTC)PooterCobb 06:48, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Delete Sounds like a fascinating man but doesn't pass WP:BIO. The entry, of course, is far from encylcopedic. And what the hell is going on with above verbiage and subsequent cross-outs? Marskell 17:45, 12 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete - seems like he may have been an interesting fellow to know - but not notable enough for this encyclopedia. Like someone above said, magazines are free to discover unknown people or the "next best thing" - encyclopedias, even one that is not paper, should stick to subjects that are notbale before we write about them.  We can and do have broader inclusiveness than a paper encyclopedia, but we still need to keep a threshold of notability. Johntex\talk 20:42, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.


text:
Assent

Assent can refer to:
 * , a village between Bekkevoort and Diest
 * Assent (philosophy), the mental act of accepting a statement as true
 * Offer and acceptance
 * Royal assent
 * Assent (military), Austrian mil. accept (s.o.) for military service (Assentierung)
 * The Assent, a 2020 American horror film by Pearry Reginald Teo

title: Assent


text:
Steven T. Byington

Steven Tracy Byington (birthname Stephen) (December 10, 1869 – October 12, 1957) was a noted intellectual, translator, and American individualist anarchist.

Life
He was born in Westford, Vermont, and later moved to Ballardvale section of Andover, Massachusetts. A one-time proponent of Georgist minarchism, he converted to individualist anarchism after associating with Benjamin Tucker. He was a firm believer in the promotion of individualist anarchism through education. He said "Anarchism has undertaken to change men's minds in one point by removing their faith in force" (Quasi-Invasion and the Boycott in Liberty, X, 2). He began a "Letter Writing Corps" in 1894 which targeted specific individuals, including newspapers, to familiarize others with the philosophical doctrine. He is known for translating two important anarchist works into English from German: Max Stirner's The Ego and Its Own and Paul Eltzbacher's Anarchism; exponents of the anarchist philosophy (also published by Dover with the title The Great Anarchists: Ideas and Teachings of Seven Major Thinkers).

Byington was a cum laude graduate of the University of Vermont in 1891 and a member of the prestigious Phi Beta Kappa. He was considered a master of at least twelve languages, including classical languages. Paul specifically mentions his "some ability" in Arabic and Zulu, plus European languages. His writings included observations on new forms and changed usage of English words, publishing 25 articles in the journal American Speech from 1926-1946. However, he had a "handicap of speech" which made preaching difficult so despite his seminary training, he spent many years working as a proofreader.

Over the course of sixty years he translated the Bible from original texts and entitled it The Bible in Living English. It was published posthumously in 1972 in New York by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. He published a review of the New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures, the English translation usually associated with Jehovah's Witnesses, in The Christian Century magazine, November 1, 1950, in which he indicated the translation was "well supplied with faults and merits," and that "the book does not give enjoyable continuous reading; but if you are digging for excellent or suggestive renderings, this is among the richer mines"

Works online

 * "An Introduction to the Book of James," Liberty XIV.15 (November 1903). 4-5.
 * "That Article on Laws," Liberty XIV.21 (June, 1904). 4.
 * Libertarian Labyrinth: a small collection of his works

title: Steven T. Byington


text: User talk:Jasonmorales

title: User talk:Jasonmorales


text:
Certified Professional Electrologist

Certified Professional Electrologist (CPE) credential signifies that an electrologist's knowledge has been tested and measured against a national standard of excellence. The credential was developed and is administered through the American Electrology Association's International Board of Electrologist Certification (IBEC). The CPE must obtain seventy-five hours of continuing education, in a five-year period, to maintain this voluntary credential, or be re-tested.

title: Certified Professional Electrologist


text: User talk:70.19.37.106

title: User talk:70.19.37.106


text:
Talk:Ator

Untitled
no reason why detail can't appear on two pages -- especially when the the details differ, and actually cover different films. (Ator 2 vs. Cave Dwellers)

 * not a question of "can" or "can't" but "should" or "shouldn't". Material about Ator as a character should appear on the Ator page.  Material about bloopers that happened to happen in the films where he appeared is irrelevant. -- Antaeus Feldspar 15:40, 6 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Pseudoscholarship is always irrelevant. Congratulations, AF.

 * If you want to actually help Wikipedia, why not try adding material that Wikipedia doesn't already have, in places where it is appropriate? If you just want to swing your mighty "I can point out errors in a film that Mystery Science Theater 3000 pointed out for me" wang, why not find somewhere other than Wikipedia to do it? -- Antaeus Feldspar 15:33, 7 October 2005 (UTC)

 * Wow. You're very well informed; and very smart, too! Please provide any other free anaylsis. Thanks.

 * Sure. Try going to List of Mystery Science Theater 3000 episodes, finding a red link for an episode you know, and starting an article on it.  Remember to put   at the end of the article.  Also keep in mind as you write that the article is about the movie itself, rather than the episode MST3K built around the movie; while its appearance on MST3K may be all that makes the movie notable, try to keep the comments relevant to the movie itself, not just to MST3K's rendition of it.  Good luck! -- Antaeus Feldspar 22:11, 7 October 2005 (UTC)

 * whoops; you went a little bit far with the conjecture -- i haven't seen that episode of mst; my friends and i bought a blademaster vhs tape in the dollar bin one night in 1994. BTW -- i have a large number of scientific journal articles in print; your encouragement to write is cute, but you're too late. don't be so serious, homie.

Ridiculous
This film is not a parody of Conan, and the article is even wrong about the demographics of Conan. Was there a lick of research here? If we are going to say Ator was borrowed from Conan, then so was Krull and a host of other fantasy heroes. Conan was Cimmerian from the Hyborean age, not European in any form. Jeesh! 99.24.188.140 (talk) 19:47, 22 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm sure the author(s) is/are thinking of the first Conan film, which the first Ator movie clearly mimics, and not the character as a whole. That being said, the rest of your points still stand. Conan of the stories is proto-Celtic, while Schwarzenegger is Austria, so neither of them are "East European" as the article claim. Both the Conan films and the literature take place in a specified part of prehistory, not "an unspecified time periods based on the Middle Ages". Furthermore, the film took more from early Asian culture than medieval Europe, whereas the literature took inspiration from a multitude of different cultures from human history. I'll clean this up shortly. --Painocus (talk) 01:35, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

Incorrect IMDB Information
The entry for Ator l'invincibile 2 stated "It has remained in the top twenty of IMDB's Worst Films List ever since the website's creation." Not only is this not cited, IMDB's Bottom 100 list (the site does not have a "Worst Films List") has the film listed as #44 (under the title "The Blade Master (1984)"). Last I checked #44 is not in the top 20.

Source: http://www.imdb.com/chart/bottom — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.178.50.157 (talk) 08:45, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

title: Talk:Ator


text:
WLLD

WLLD (94.1 FM) is a commercial radio station licensed to Lakeland, Florida, and serving the Tampa Bay area. Owned by Beasley Broadcast Group, it broadcasts a rhythmic CHR format. WLLD's studios and offices are located in St. Petersburg, and its transmitter site is located in southeastern Hillsborough County near the "Four Corners" approximately 30 miles southeast of Tampa.

94.1 FM
94.1 signed on the air on. The original call sign was WVFM and it and aired an easy listening format. The station played quarter hour sweeps of soft instrumentals, along with some mellow vocals. It was largely automated.

The station was off the air for almost a year between November 1966 and September 1967. The owners didn't want to broadcast while it was in the process of being sold. Easy listening remained the format at WVFM for almost three decades. The station changed its call letters to WEZY in 1988. WEZY later evolved from mostly instrumental beautiful music into soft adult contemporary before changing to smooth jazz WSJT on July 1, 1995.

WiLD format
The kayfabe line is that the station was started by two friends, Josh and Brian, who had been drinking on Josh's father's boat claiming to have pirated radio waves. The duo bragged of their contraband and irregulated airwaves until they were bought and turned into what is now the station that is broadcasting today. In reality, the station just had a very small budget to start with, often resulting in the same songs playing over and over again. Tone Lōc's "Wild Thing" was the first song the station had played over the air. The fictional friends would claim to have allegiance toward the song during their drunken stupor and continued to play the song repeatedly over the course of days. For the first few days the station was on the air, the song continued to be played in an effort to spark word of mouth attention.

At first, WLLD's musical direction included a balanced mix of hit-driven R&B, Hip-Hop music and Dance tracks, mostly to counter Top 40 rival 93.3 WFLZ-FM, a move that would pay off up until WBTP (WFLZ's sister station) debuted as an urban contemporary station. Today, WLLD's playlist is atypical of most rhythmic stations as it consists of mostly hip-hop and R&B hits, thus is considered to be a rhythmic crossover by "Billboard".

Change in frequency
WLLD was located on the 98.7 frequency from May 15, 1998, until 5:00 p.m. on August 19, 2009. At that point, it swapped frequencies with smooth jazz station WSJT (now the current WPBB). The first song played after the switch was Tone Loc's "Wild Thing", the same first song that was played when WLLD was first launched in 1998 when it was on the 98.7 frequency.

On October 2, 2014, CBS Radio announced that it would trade all of the company's radio stations in Charlotte and Tampa (including WLLD), as well as WIP (AM) in Philadelphia, to the Beasley Broadcast Group. This was in exchange for five stations in Miami and Philadelphia. The swap was completed on December 1, 2014.

The Last Damn Show and WiLD Splash
The Last Damn Show is an annual concert put on by WLLD. It is put on in late October or early November every year since 1999. The show got its title from being the "last damn show" before the world ended in Y2K; hence, in continuation with the world remaining unscathed. Past performers include Eminem, Lil Wayne, Destiny's Child, P. Diddy, Busta Rhymes, Bubba Sparxxx, Lil Jon and the Eastside Boyz, Trick Daddy, Luke, Ludacris, Kanye West, and Twista among others. The concert was originally held at The St. Pete Times Forum, but is held in other locations, such as Tropicana Field. It has pulled in over 20,000 in attendance almost every year.

On the evening of September 11, 1999, WLLD broadcast the Last Damn Show concert live from 6 to 11 p.m. Because WLLD did not censor profane language and other instances of indecency from the broadcast, the Florida Family Association filed a complaint with the Federal Communications Commission (FCC). The Association wanted the FCC to revoke WLLD's license. The FCC fined WLLD owner Infinity Broadcasting (now the defunct CBS Radio) $7,000 the following year. Infinity filed an appeal, but the FCC denied the appeal in 2004.

WiLDsplash is the annual concert during spring break out on by WLLD in Clearwater Beach. It has been a Bay Area staple since 2001 and pulls crowds in excess of 15,000 fans consistently. Past performers Wiz Khalifa, Snoop Dogg, Busta Rhymes, Bubba Sparxxx, 50 Cent, Sean Paul, Buju Banton, JoJo, 112, Bone Thugs-n-Harmony, Ziggy Marley, Young Jeezy, Stephen & Damian Marley among others.

'WILD' branding
WLLD uses the "WiLD" branding in Tampa. The brand has since been trademarked by Clear Channel Communications (now iHeartMedia) years later. Because that happened since the debut of WLLD, this Beasely-owned station is permitted to continue using this moniker.

iHeart owns several "WiLD" stations including KYLD in San Francisco, which has used the "WiLD" branding since its launch in 1992.

title: WLLD


text:
User talk:Blazotron

Wikification and adding links
Hi. If you just add a link, for example here, please don't add the term "wikification" in the edit summary, just name it link, links of liunkcorrection, because I think that is waht you did. Thank you. -- Marcel Douwe Dekker (talk) 09:38, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

You are invited to join Stanford's Wikiproject!
ralphamale (talk) 21:30, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
Hi, You appear to be eligible to vote in the current Arbitration Committee election. The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. For the Election committee, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:14, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Continuous facility

The article Continuous facility has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern: "Non-notable"

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. JMHamo (talk) 20:47, 17 October 2018 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Blow down facility

The article Blow down facility has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern: "Non-notable"

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. JMHamo (talk) 20:14, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

title: User talk:Blazotron


text:
Talk:Kittie

Hannah Hansen
Hannah Hansen Is not a new member of the band. There was no Official announcement to support this.

Timeline
The timeline here is contradictory to its own article. It says in the article that Jennifer and Lisa left the band on 3/23/2005, and your timeline says 01/01/2005. Also your timeline says Until the End was released on October 27 instead of the factual July 27. I changed these, but they were reverted because apparently there needs to be a "consensus" to change information that's literally from its own article. I was also warned not to, and I quote, "cause disruption on Wikipedia by purposely inserting immature schoolyard attacks or other defamatory and/or bullshit into an article, or any other Wikipedia page again, as you did at Kittie,". So you guys can work on your consensus, and in the meantime I would love to hear how correcting dates is adding schoolyard attacks or bullshit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.74.77.154 (talk) 03:12, 17 June 2019 (UTC)

title: Talk:Kittie


text:
User:John W. Browning

Greetings from Colorado USA. After discovering Wikipedia it has become an addiction. I have an undying thirst for knowledge and an absolute hate of misinformation. I think that is why this site is so appealing to me.

I am married with two college age children. I enjoy motorcycling, photography and shooting sports. I am a history buff and it is said by my friends that I am full of more useless trivia and fact than anyone they know. Not sure how to take that one.

title: User:John W. Browning


text:
Talk:Comprehensive System

Whilst I appreciate - and welcome - the additional detail I am not happy about the tone and approach of recent edits. References in favour of comprehensive education have been removed and replaced with dubious party political references. For example you have deleted the reference to the fact (please note - fact) that Margaret Thatcher during her time as education secretary continued the policy of the previous Labour government on comprehensive schools. In fact most of the changeover from the tripartite system to the comprehensive system happened in the period 1968-75, mostly under a Conservative administration.

The material on the merits of the system is now biased because you have deleted the main arguments in favour which were:

"Supporters of the comprehensive system argue that it is unacceptable on both moral and practical grounds to select children on the basis of their ability. They also argue that comprehensive schools in the UK have allowed millions of children to gain access to further and higher education, and that the previous selective system relegated children who failed the eleven plus examination to a second class and inferior education."

Additionally the current article makes a whole series of evidence free value judgements about comprehensive education – such as:

“There is a widespread perception, shared by many of the system's advocates, that the comprehensive system has not been the success hoped for.”

“Academic performance is usually well below selective schools. This is unsurprising, since selective schools will have a natural advantage over comprehensives. However, it can be argued that the difference cannot be explained by differences in students alone.”

Who argues this? Where is the evidence for this assertion?

“In spite of the intentions of a ‘grammar school education for all’, many comprehensive schools lack resources and good teachers.”

Whose intention was it to provide a 'grammar school for all'? What evidence exists that the lack of resources and teachers is worse in comprehensives schools? Supporters would argue that teaching in a grammar school is easier than teaching in a comprehensive and that grammar school teachers would not be able to cope in the comprehensive environment.

These are not isolated examples and I am considering a wholesale rewrite of both these pages. But I feel I ought to seek comment from the authors – a courtesy not extended to me as the original author – before I do so.

Shropshire Lad

Response
While I understand that you feel strongly on the changes I have made here, I'm not certain that you're aware of the context in which it took place. Over the past two months I have been researching and writing revisions to the articles on the tripartite system, a subject that suffers from considerable neglect on the internet. Partly because of the large amount of information on comprehensive education I picked up in the process, and partly as a result of the major changes in the information carried by related articles, I felt that a thorough rewrite would help improve the situation. I found myself making so many changes that it seemed sensible to undertake a full rewrite to give the article a coherent style. I did not do so lightly, knowing that it would upset previous authors. However I hoped that they would understand the scale of surrounding changes and the organisational changes that had taken place.

I suspect that you may be unaware of some of the new information put up as a result. In partciular, you may wish to look at Debates on the grammar school, which puts the arguments for both sides on the merits of the tripartite system as articulated since the 1940s. You may also not have seen the large amount of information about discussions over the introduction of comprehensive education in the 1960s, located in the main Tripartite System article. While I would sympathise with the idea that this information should be put in the article on the comprehensive, I personally think that debates in the fifties and sixties were about the failings of the existing system, not the merits of its replacement. If you would like to include this information in the article on the Comprehensive system, I would fully understand.

As for what you classify as 'value judgements', I fully accept that these are matters of opinion. However I am saddened that you think I have included these out of personal belief rather than a desire to note contemporary debates about the system. In response to the specific criticisms you raised:

 * “There is a widespread perception, shared by many of the system's advocates, that the comprehensive system has not been the success hoped for.” I took this from the recent radio 4 series 'Comp', which was quoting educationalist Clive Chitty and journalist Melissa Benn, both of whom were and are noted advocates of the Comprehensive system.

 * “Academic performance is usually well below selective schools. This is unsurprising, since selective schools will have a natural advantage over comprehensives. However, it can be argued that the difference cannot be explained by differences in students alone.” This has been argued by Ruth Kelly, Estelle Morris and anyone associated with the government's policy of turning comprehensives into selective schools. While I agree that it is a matter of opinion, it seems to be one shared by the two main parties and many of those preparing the forthcoming White Paper.

 * As for your questions about a 'grammar school education for all', that phrase was the one used in Labour manifestos for several years prior to the issuing of Circular 10/65. If you want a specific use of it, you can find it footnoted at the bottom of the Tripartite System article. It was regularly said by Gaitskell, Crosland and Wilson. I don't think it is unreasonable to point out the difference between intentions and reality in the same way I think it is correct to show that secondary modern schools did not receive the parity of esteem that their architects envisaged.

I recommend that you have a look at the Tripartite article, since other concerns of yours (for example the lack of a reference to the Thatcher-era comprehensivisation) would, in my opinion, be met by the content there.

I suspect that the best way to resolve this dispute is for us to create a new page, counterpart to that about debates on the grammar school. Debates on the comprehensive school could then give space for arguments for and against, and we could remove the inflamatory material from the main page on the comp. I considered doing this earlier, but felt that it overlapped with the grammar debate article. In light of what you have said, I can now see that there is a strong case for such a page, and would be happy to help you flesh it out.

As for wider rewrites, I personally cannot see anything politically motivated in the article on the Comprehensive System. If you see anything, I would be happy for you to correct it. In the article on Comprehensive schools, aside from the section on debates, I accept that there are a few sentences in the history section that could be interpretted in a negative light. This was not my intention, and if you can think of better ways to phrase them it would certainly benefit the article. However I think you might be overreacting in sugesting a full rewrite of both- it seems rather unnecessary to reproduce 80% of the information content. But, if you have the time and genuinely think my writing and research are that poor that they should be replaced, I can do nothing to stop you.

I hope that we can find a way of resolving this calmly and to the benefit of the articles' readers. --Evil Capitalist 17:50, 6 October 2005 (UTC) (Copies on both Shropshire Lad's talk page and at both the relevant articles)

Reply
It is a huge jump to go from individual quotes (from Chitty and Benn) to an assertion that this is an opinion shared by many of the system's advocates. The highest profile advocate of the Comprehensive system at the moment is Roy Hattersley, and his view, stated on many occasions, is that the system cannot be judged because it was never fully implemented. In areas where comprehensives have a genuinely mixed intake the schools are usually seen to be very successful.

I also stand by my view that the entire tone of these entries (and I have read the entries on the related pages) is biased. Specifically the argument in favour of academic selection is taken as a given, whilst the main arguments against are either badly put, possibly because you are not familiar with them, or omitted.

The creation of a new page will not solve this dilemma because this is an encyclopaedia, not a debating society. The entries should be as far as is possible factually correct. If a debate exists, as it does in this area, the safest course of action is to attempt a factual summary of the position one leans towards, and leave the opposition to state their own case. You have committed the cardinal sin of putting the opposition's case for them - badly.

Shropshire Lad 19:28, 6 October 2005 (UTC)

Reply to reply
On the first point, I think we are talking at crossed purposes here. The people who I said had found the comprehensive system a disappointment also argue that it had not been properly implemented. We are not discussing an abstract idea here, but the comprehensive system as it operates. Hattersley also thinks that the system has not lived up to its initial promise, because of failed implementation. I think we're arguing about unclear wording rather than philosophy here.

You are quite right to point out that this is an encylopedia, and it is one that deals with a number of contentious issues. If you look at pages such as atheism, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict or abortion you'll see that one of the important functions of this encyclopaedia is to state differing views on a single topic. To characterise such a function as a 'debating society' is, in my opinion, to underate one of wikipedia's greatest strengths as a source of knowledge.

You are also right to say that I have not done justice to the arguments against selection. However, the alternative was to put no arguments at all, and as you have shown in your response to the section on 'debates' in the Comprehensive Schools article, people find that much more irritating. Those counterarguments are only placeholders until someone better equipped comes along to replace them. I would be very happy to see you edit them so that they meet your standards. --Evil Capitalist 00:21, 8 October 2005 (UTC)

Is Differentiated learning simply another term for Comprehensive education? Bastie 04:43, 11 November 2005 (UTC)
 * In a word, no. Tafkam 18:42, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

title: Talk:Comprehensive System