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Arthur Krock

Arthur Bernard Krock (November 16, 1886 – April 12, 1974) was a Pulitzer Prize-winning American journalist. He became known as the "Dean of Washington newsmen" in a career that spanned the tenure of 11 United States presidents.

Early life and career
Arthur Krock was born in Glasgow, Kentucky, in 1887. He was the son of German-Jewish bookkeeper Joseph Krock and Caroline Morris, who was half-Jewish. After his mother became blind, Krock was raised by his grandparents, Emmanuel and Henrietta Morris, until he was six years old. When his mother regained her sight, he joined his parents in Chicago, graduating from high school there in 1904.

Krock went on to Princeton University but dropped out in his first year for lack of money. He returned home, and in 1906 graduated with an associate degree from the Lewis Institute in Chicago.

Journalism
Krock began his career in journalism with the Louisville Herald, then went to Washington as a correspondent for the Louisville Times and Louisville Courier-Journal. In 1927, he joined The New York Times and soon became its Washington correspondent and bureau chief. His column, "In the Nation", was noted for its opinions on public policy.

For example, amid the Hiss–Chambers and Coplon spy cases and the investigation of David E. Lilienthal's management of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission, Krock observed: The persons whose names have entered the trials and investigations, fairly and unfairly, include none who was affiliated with the Republican party ... The ideal solution from the standpoint of these strategists [President Truman's] would be: (1) the acquittal of Hiss ... (2) a find by the Joint Congressional Committee on Atomic Energy that Lilienthal has been a good manager ... (3) repudiation by public opinion of the more sensational testimony before the third Un-American Committee; (4) at least one substantial trial victory for the Department of Justice. This is a large order. But the deep-thinking Democratic politicos think there is a good chance for it.

In the mid-1930s, Krock became a friend and staunch advocate of Joseph P. Kennedy and his ambitions. Historian David Nasaw wrote that the journalist seemed to be all but in the pocket of the powerful millionaire (whose first son would become U.S. president while two others would contend for the office. In a 2012 biography of Joe Kennedy, Nasaw wrote that the Krock-Kennedy correspondence "reveals something quite disturbing, if not corrupt, about Krock's willingness to do Kennedy's bidding, to advise him or write a speech for him, then praise it in his column..."

In October 1963, less than two months before the assassination of Joe Kennedy's son, President John F. Kennedy, Krock wrote a column headlined "The Intra-Administration War in Vietnam" in which he quoted a high-ranking government official: "The CIA's growth was 'likened to a malignancy' which the 'very high official was not even sure the White House could control ... any longer.' 'If the United States ever experiences [an attempted coup to overthrow the Government] it will come from the CIA and not the Pentagon. The agency 'represents a tremendous power and total unaccountability to anyone.'"

Awards
Over his 60-year career, Krock won three Pulitzer Prizes: The organization now explains the special Pulitzer thus: "The Advisory Board on the Pulitzer Prizes as a policy does not make any award to an individual member of the Board. In 1951, the Board decided that the outstanding instance of National Reporting done in 1950 was the exclusive interview with President Truman obtained by Arthur Krock of The New York Times, while Mr. Krock was a Board member. The Board therefore made no award in the National Reporting category."
 * 1935 Pulitzer Prize for Correspondence, for his Washington dispatches
 * 1938 Prize for Correspondence, for "his exclusive authorized interview with the President of the United States on February 27, 1937."
 * 1951 Special Citation of his exclusive interview with President Truman

He was awarded a French citation for his coverage of the Versailles Peace Conference.

On April 22, 1970, he was presented with the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President Richard Nixon.

Personal life
He was married twice, first to Marguerite Polleys, daughter of a Minneapolis railroad official, from 1911 to her death following a long illness in 1938. They had one son, Thomas, who, during the Spanish Civil War, was one of a handful of Americans who fought in the war on the side of Francisco Franco. In 1939, he wed Martha Granger Blair of Chicago, a divorced society columnist for the Washington Times-Herald, who had two sons.

title: Arthur Krock


text:
Les Quatre Étoiles

Les Quatre Etoiles was a Congolese musical group active from 1982 to 1996. They played the Soukous style of dance music, which gained widespread popularity in the 1980s and 1990s.

The members were Paris-based musicians Bopol Mansiamina (bass and rhythm guitar), Wuta Mayi (vocals), Syran Mbenza (lead guitar) and Nyboma (vocals). It was commonly called a "supergroup," since each of the four members of Les Quatre Etoiles had long established individual musical careers before joining forces.

Band history
The band was formed in Paris in 1982, upon a request to Syran Mbenza from David Ouattara Moumouni, who produced their first album and released it on his Afro-Rythmes label, although they did not adopt Quatre Etoiles as the band's name until a year and a half later, when they recorded their second album in late 1983. The first album was recorded in late December 1982, and included one song by each of the four musicians.

When the group formed, each of its four members was a well-known and prolific musician. Based on its members’ negative experiences with bandleaders such as Franco and Tabu Ley Rochereau, Les Quatre Étoiles was a loose-knit arrangement rather than an exclusive one; during its existence, each of its members continued to release solo records, formed other bands, and played as sidemen in support of other musicians (notably including one another). As two of many examples, in 1988 Syran Mbenza formed another band, Kass Kass, with Passi Jo and Jean-Papy Ramazani, and all four members of Les Quatres Etoiles played on the 1995 album "Hello, Hello" by Mose Fan Fan and Somo Somo Ngobila.

The band also seemed to involve an egalitarian arrangement among the four members—for example, several of their albums contained four songs, one written by each band member. Finally, its lineup was flexible - a particular version of the band might be missing one member and/or include other African musicians.

Their polished renditions begin in the Soukous tradition, with a slow, harmonious introduction; this then breaks out, again as in the Soukous tradition, into a fast-paced chorus known as the 'sebene' with resonating, repeated electric guitar rhythms in the background, interwoven with a choice assortment of African percussion instruments accompanied by orchestras.

Following the end of Les Quatre Etoiles in 1996, in 2000 three of its members (Syran Mbenza, Wuta Mayi, and Nyboma) joined other African musicians to form Kékélé.

The group reunited for at least two concerts in 2010; on June 20, 2010, they played the Afrika Festival Hertme, in the Netherlands, and on July 11, 2010 they played Bozar at Brussels, Belgium, in honor of the 50th anniversary of the independence of the Democratic Republic of the Congo.

Discography
Although it is difficult to be complete in listing African recordings, from the discography compiled below it appears that they released seven studio albums and three live albums, although one of the three live albums may be a repackaged version of another.

Their album, Sangonini, was produced by the renowned African music producer Ibrahim Sylla. The song "Doly", from Sangoni, enjoyed worldwide popularity, reaching no. 3 in the Colombian music charts. The song "Papy Sodolo", has been covered by Tabu Ley Rochereau, another African musician of note. Another song, "Sangonini", produced in Paris and released in 1993, has also been popular.

license: Creative Commons - Attribution Share-Alike - https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

title: Les Quatre Étoiles


text: User:CheeeseDrimzi

title: User:CheeeseDrimzi


text:
21 grams experiment

The 21 grams experiment refers to a study published in 1907 by Duncan MacDougall, a physician from Haverhill, Massachusetts. MacDougall hypothesized that souls have physical weight, and attempted to measure the mass lost by a human when the soul departed the body. MacDougall attempted to measure the mass change of six patients at the moment of death. One of the six subjects lost three-quarters of an ounce (21.3 grams).

MacDougall stated his experiment would have to be repeated many times before any conclusion could be obtained. The experiment is widely regarded as flawed and unscientific due to the small sample size, the methods used, as well as the fact only one of the six subjects met the hypothesis. The case has been cited as an example of selective reporting. Despite its rejection within the scientific community, MacDougall's experiment popularized the concept that the soul has weight, and specifically that it weighs 21 grams.

Experiment

In 1901, Duncan MacDougall, a physician from Haverhill, Massachusetts, who wished to scientifically determine if a soul had weight, identified six patients in nursing homes whose deaths were imminent. Four were suffering from tuberculosis, one from diabetes, and one from unspecified causes. MacDougall specifically chose people who were suffering from conditions that caused physical exhaustion, as he needed the patients to remain still when they died to measure them accurately. When the patients looked like they were close to death, their entire bed was placed on an industrial sized scale that was sensitive within two tenths of an ounce (5.6 grams). On the belief that humans have souls and that animals do not, MacDougall later measured the changes in weight from fifteen dogs after death. MacDougall said he wished to use dogs that were sick or dying for his experiment, though was unable to find any. It is therefore presumed he poisoned healthy dogs.

Results
One of the patients lost weight but then put the weight back on, and two of the other patients registered a loss of weight at death but a few minutes later lost even more weight. One of the patients lost "three-fourths of an ounce" (21.3 grams) in weight, coinciding with the time of death. MacDougall disregarded the results of another patient on the grounds the scales were "not finely adjusted", and discounted the results of another as the patient died while the equipment was still being calibrated. MacDougall said that none of the dogs lost any weight after death.

While MacDougall believed that the results from his experiment showed the human soul might have weight, his report, which was not published until 1907, stated the experiment would have to be repeated many times before any conclusion could be obtained.

Reaction
Before MacDougall was able to publish the results of his experiments, The New York Times broke the story in an article titled "Soul has Weight, Physician Thinks". MacDougall's results were published in April of the same year in the Journal of the American Society for Psychical Research, and the medical journal American Medicine.

Criticism
Following the publication of the experiment in American Medicine, physician Augustus P. Clarke criticized the experiment's validity. Clarke noted that at the time of death there is a sudden rise in body temperature as the lungs are no longer cooling blood, causing a subsequent rise in sweating which could easily account for MacDougall's missing 21 grams. Clarke also pointed out that, as dogs do not have sweat glands, they would not lose weight in this manner after death. Clarke's criticism was published in the May issue of American Medicine. Arguments between MacDougall and Clarke debating the validity of the experiment continued to be published in the journal until at least December that year.

MacDougall's experiment has been rejected by the scientific community, and he has been accused of both flawed methods and outright fraud in obtaining his results. Noting that only one of the six patients measured supported the hypothesis, Karl Kruszelnicki has stated the experiment is a case of selective reporting, as MacDougall ignored the majority of the results. Kruszelnicki also criticized the small sample size, and questioned how MacDougall was able to determine the exact moment when a person had died considering the technology available at the time. Physicist Robert L. Park has written that MacDougall's experiments "are not regarded today as having any scientific merit", and psychologist Bruce Hood wrote that "because the weight loss was not reliable or replicable, his findings were unscientific". Professor Richard Wiseman said that within the scientific community, the experiment is confined to a "large pile of scientific curiosities labelled 'almost certainly not true'".

An article by Snopes in 2013 said the experiment was flawed because the methods used were suspect, the sample size was much too small, and the capability to measure weight changes too imprecise, concluding: "credence should not be given to the idea his experiments proved something, let alone that they measured the weight of the soul as 21 grams." The fact that MacDougall likely poisoned and killed fifteen healthy dogs in an attempt to support his research has also been a source of criticism.

Aftermath
In 1911, The New York Times reported that MacDougall was hoping to run experiments to take photos of souls, but he appears to not have continued any further research into the area and died in 1920. His experiment has not been repeated.

Similar experiments
In December 2001, physicist Lewis E. Hollander Jr. published an article in Journal of Scientific Exploration where he exhibited the results of a similar experiment. He tested the weight of one ram, seven ewes, three lambs and one goat at the moment of death, seeking to explore upon MacDougall's purported findings. His experiment showed that seven of the adult sheep varied their weight upon dying, though not losing it, but rather gaining an amount of 18 to 780 grams, which was lost again over time until returning to their initial weight. In 2009, Hollander Jr.'s experiment was subjected to critical review by Masayoshi Ishida in the same journal. Ishida found Hollander's statement of a transient gain of weight was "not an appropriate expression of the experimental result", though he admitted "the cause of the force event remains to be explained". He also warned about possible malfunctions of the weighing platform in two of the cases.

Similarly inspired by MacDougall's research, physician Gerard Nahum proposed in 2005 a follow-up experiment, based on utilizing an array of electromagnetic detectors to try to pick up any type of escaping energy at the moment of death. He offered to sell his idea to engineering, physics, and philosophy departments at Yale, Stanford, and Duke University, as well as the Catholic Church, but he was rejected.

In popular culture
Despite its rejection as scientific fact, MacDougall's experiment popularized the idea that the soul has weight, and specifically that it weighs 21 grams. The title of the film 21 Grams references the experiment.

The concept of a soul weighing 21 grams is mentioned in numerous media, including a 2013 issue of the manga Gantz, a 2013 podcast of Welcome to Night Vale, the 2015 film The Empire of Corpses a 2021 episode of Ted Lasso, and a 2023 issue of the manga One Piece. Songs entitled "21 Grams" which reference the weight of a soul have been released by Looptroop Rockers (2005), Niykee Heaton (2015), Fedez (2015), August Burns Red (2015), Thundamentals (2017) and Arena (2022). In 2024, German musicians KLAN and Madeline Juno released "21 Gramm". Travis Scott references the concept in the 2018 song "No Bystanders". MacDougall and his experiments are explicitly mentioned in the 1978 documentary film Beyond and Back, and episode five of the first season of Dark Matters: Twisted But True. A fictional American scientist named "Mr. MacDougall" appears in Gail Carriger's 2009 novel Soulless, as an expert in the weight and measurement of souls.

title: 21 grams experiment


text:
Talk:Punjab (disambiguation)

Move to Punjab

 * Support: move dab to Punjab Tobias Conradi (Talk) 03:39, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Support - Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 11:13, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

ugh
My God, my God. I remove links to this page every week – within 7 days, at least 50 new links have cropped up. Which is good in a way – new articles are appearing. But it's a bloody pain in the neck!!! — riana_dzasta • t • c • e  • ER • 10:02, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Sikh Empire
Am I missing something here but why does Sikh Empire keep getting put back into the "former countries, states and provinces" section. All the others contain the word Punjab, in any case Sikh Empire is a redirect. Pahari Sahib 20:22, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

 * It seems to be a political campaign by Wjkk20 to insert "Sikh Empire" and "Khalistan" into a series of articles related to the Punjab. He has been warned not to keep doing this without discussion and general agreement on the talk page of the articles in question. Sunray (talk) 02:29, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

Khalistan
I had a question and that is that everytime when somebody enters Khalistan as well on this article, somebody deletes it. Why? Is it not a major part of happenings of Punjab region? Khalistan is not something foreign. It is of Punjab region that why it shouldn't be there? Reply. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wjkk20 (talk • contribs) 17:24, 31 October 2008 (UTC)
 * From what I understand. Currently, Khalistan isn't a major happening in Punjab. It was in the 80s, but not at this moment. And I think that if we were going to mention Khalistan in this article, it would go under history. But ask the other editors on this page also. Deavenger (talk) 18:22, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

 * Yes go ahead consult it with others, it will be the best solution as consulting others seems to be the proper way to resolve it. Wjkk20 (talk) 18:22, 01 November 2008 (UTC)

 * Firstly, Wjkk20, I'm sorry that none of us who've been deleting your entries has dropped by your talk page to explain precisely why. That was rude of us and the templates you've been left are not, IMO, helpful.  I'm glad that you've stuck around.  So, why have we been deleting your entries?  Whether Khalistan is or is not a major happening in Punjab at this moment or any other moment in history is not what's at issue here.  The reason people keep deleting it and Sikh Empire is that people feel they're out of place on this disambiguation page.  Guidelines for what a disambiguation page is can be found here.  The way I think people are interpreting this is to say that neither Khalistan nor Sikh Empire begin with or include the word Punjab and therefore links to these pages simply don't belong here.  That both Khalistan and Sikh Empire existed in or are proposed to exist in the area currently known as Punjab isn't relevant because people aren't likely to be typing in 'Punjab' when they mean 'Khalistan' or 'Sikh Empire'.  The function of a DAB page is simply to quickly shuttle people to the correct page when what they typed in to the search function could have more than one possibility.  Hope that's helpful.  Ka Faraq Gatri (talk) 09:56, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

 * To User:Ka Faraq Gatri, I see what you're trying to say here but also remember that the links I've had been trying to post here also called Punjab, people also call them Punjab. Matter of fact, the names by which they're known as aren't frequented as much as is frequented name Punjab with them. Wjkk20 03:43, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

 * Just to say I agree with Ka Faraq Gatri on this, anyone specifically looking for Khalistan or Sikh Empire would search for those terms. I think everyone is aware that the Sikh Empire ruled the area but it isn't the same as the area. It's a bit like having the Norman dynasty on the England (disambiguation) page, also Khalistan is a proposed state in Punjab.
 * Not having these links on the Punjab page is in no way demeaning to any community. For example to go with the English example, no one could deny that the Norman dynasty had a tremendous influence on England and that they ruled over what is England (with some border changes here and there) - but the entry is not on the DAB page because it doesn't belong there (for similar reasons).

 * Pahari Sahib 16:57, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

 * I think that Ka Faraq Gatri has explained this well. I agree with his comments and those of Pahari Sahib. Simply put, the purpose of a disambiguation page is to provide alternative uses for a word or phrase. In this case, the word is "Punjab." Only variants of that word should appear here. The relevant section of the guideline on disambiguation pages can be found here. I have reverted Wjkk20 for the nth time. Continuing to insert "Khalistan" and "Sikh Empire," on this page consitutes vandalism. Sunray (talk) 22:41, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

Sikh Empire to Punjab Empire
Why don't we change the article's name again from Sikh Empire to Punjab Empire as it is the most authentic and most original name of the country. Because nobody has ever called or known this country by name of Sikh Empire/Confederacy, everybody has always known it by name of Punjab Empire or just Punjab. And also because if anybody would be come looking for the former Punjabi country then they would most likely type in Punjab, not Sikh Empire/Confederacy. Plus it would also give the Sikh Empire (originally Punjab) a permanent place on Punjab disam. page. What do you say? Wjkk20 04 December 2008 (UTC) If agree, kindly also contact User:Sunray and User:Ka Faraq Gatri

 * Actually that's a very good point, I agree with this. Pahari Sahib  02:20, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Hope This Solves It
There was a conflict about how to write the name of former Sikh country of Punjab as to should it be written Sikh Empire or Punjab Empire. To help in ease the matter, I have written certain labels with both names and written them both as both share equal importance. For example, the name Punjab Empire holds the geographical importance whereas the name Sikh Empire holds the political and authoritative importance. Hope this helps. Wjkk20 05 December 2008 (UTC)

Persian or Sanskrit
Just an explanation of this, the word Punjab is made up of two Persian words Panj and Aab. This is commonly accepted, see here. There may be similarities with Sanskrit because both languages are related (for example Persian Āb is cognate with Sanskrit Āp) - but the word is of Persian origin. Pahari Sahib 12:53, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Move
Punjab → Punjab (disambiguation) – Punjab refers mainly to Punjab (region), so best is to redirect Punjab to Punjab region and move this page to disambiguation. New linkings keep coming so better to move it to disambiguation and redirect. Alertedlevel2 (talk) 04:34, 11 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Support This is a pretty clear WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. --BDD (talk) 20:31, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

 * Oppose without further evidence that the region is the primary topic ("...more likely than all the other topics combined—to be the topic sought when a reader searches for that term."). The Indian state and the Pakistani province are each very important topics.  —  AjaxSmack   01:27, 21 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I think this is one of those cases where it makes more sense to have a comprehensive article at the basic title, rather than defaulting to a dab page, like we do at Football and Ireland (although the latter sure is a can of worms). I don't see the advantage to having a dab page where an article works just as well. --BDD (talk) 03:09, 21 September 2012 (UTC)
 * The article is not a "comprehensive article". It is a weak article with a too-long intro, some history info largely terminating a couple of centuries ago, and some pictures.  —  AjaxSmack   16:58, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm not saying Punjab region is a comprehensive article, but it should be. Don't let the article's current state turn you off. I've tagged it with your concerns. --BDD (talk) 16:02, 23 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Then this move should wait until such improvements are made (an application by analogy of WP:CRYSTALBALL). —  AjaxSmack   01:04, 24 September 2012 (UTC)
 * See lot of new links to this dab page, here. I fixed few, but more links will come, it will be better if it redirected to Punjab region. Alertedlevel2 (talk) 05:38, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
 * The incoming links to "Punjab" as of this writing are primarily for the Indian state with a couple for the Pakistani province and a couple for Punjab Province (British India). None were intend for the region and in cases like the List of Indian states and territories by Human Development Index, sending readers to the Punjab (region) article is patently misleading.  This is an additional strong argument against a move.  —  AjaxSmack   16:58, 22 September 2012 (UTC)

 * Support. The problem here is that "Punjab" is primarily WP:DABCONCEPT to variations of what is ultimately a single area of land. This is much like Germany, which is not a disambiguation page even though it has, over the centuries, had substantially varied borders and governments, and has even been split into different countries. bd2412  T 16:08, 29 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I think you have a point about DABCONCEPT but the current Punjab region article doesn't pass muster. Fix the article first and then conduct a move.  The use of "Punjab" today is far more likely to be about the state or the province than the region so a pretty impressive concept article is needed before directing all traffic there.  —  AjaxSmack   03:01, 1 October 2012 (UTC)

Requested move 02 September 2015

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. The consensus is that the region remains the primary topic for "Punjab". Jenks24 (talk) 16:27, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Punjab (disambiguation) → Punjab – Punjab should be a disambiguation page. The exisiting links to it are intended for Punjab, India, or Punjab, Pakistan, Punjab Province (British India), Punjab region, Punjabi language etc. The page currently redirects to Punjab region, which is not a WP:PRIMARYTOPIC and is inappropriate in most cases. – Apuldram (talk) 17:51, 2 September 2015 (UTC) Relisted. Jenks24 (talk) 05:16, 10 September 2015 (UTC)
 * This is a contested technical request (permalink). Steel1943  (talk) 18:04, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment: This move request is controversial, given the section above. Discussion of this move is necessary. Steel1943  (talk) 18:04, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

 * Strong oppose – The Punjab transcends the borders of either India or Pakistan, and it is right that "Punjab" links to the page on the entire region. RGloucester  — ☎ 20:36, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

 * Support. The region is not the primary topic ("...more likely than all the other topics combined—to be the topic sought when a reader searches for that term.").  The Indian state and the Pakistani province are each very important topics.  —  AjaxSmack   23:49, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
 * They are mere (recent/modern) administrative divisions within a region that has existed for centuries and centuries, and which has rich and diverse history. Please note the "long term significance" criteria for primary topic status. RGloucester  — ☎ 02:34, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

 * Support as proposer. Few links to Punjab have Punjab region as their target. Many more are intended for Punjab, Pakistan or Punjab, India. I agree that ‘’Punjab’’, without a context, implies the whole region, but we are dealing here with links from articles where the contributor clearly meant to point at the Pakistan province or the Indian state, and the redirect to the whole region is incorrect or unhelpful. For example in the articles Pakistan, Delhi, Chhattisgarh, Islamabad etc. ’’Punjab’’ is part of the subject of several different Wikipedia articles and should be a disambiguation page. New links to it would then stimulate a bot to invite their editors to be more specific. Apuldram (talk) 08:25, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Oppose - Punjab should redirect to Punjab region. We can fix those links which don't have Punjab region as their target. As it implies the whole region, it should be redirected to the whole region. Again, if there are some links which need to be fixed, redirecting it otherwise would not be a solution. Faizan (talk) 12:18, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
 * that's over two thousand links you feel you can fix! On top of that, new incorrect links coming in every week. Making Punjab a disambiguation page is a better solution. Apuldram (talk) 14:39, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
 * No, it isn't. It is just confusing. If one is searching for the Punjab, one wants the Punjab, not a dab page. Fixing inappropriate links that are meant for the administrative divisions can be done. RGloucester  — ☎ 15:44, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

 * Oppose – "The Punjab transcends the borders of either India or Pakistan, and it is right that "Punjab" links to the page on the entire region" and "long term significance" per RGloucester. Pincrete (talk) 20:57, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Oppose. "Punjab" as a proper noun means Greater Punjab regardless of a recent political division. Khestwol (talk) 20:56, 5 September 2015 (UTC)

The problem: I sampled the first hundred articles listed in Pages that link to "Punjab", omitting from the sample the talk pages and ten pages which did not have a direct link to Punjab. Some of the links relate to the whole region, but the majority do not, and to redirect them to Punjab region is unhelpful. Of the 100 links in the sample, 42 were for Punjab, India 31 were for Punjab region 20 were for Punjab, Pakistan 5 were for Punjab Province (British India) 2 were for Punjabi language The page was originally a disambiguation page, but it was moved in September 2012 without regard to the effect the move would have on the disambiguation list. Those who oppose the move back consider that Punjab implies the whole region and I have sympathy with that view, but approximately 69% of the 2400 Wikipedia contributors who added links to Punjab had other destinations in mind. The belief that we can fix those links which don't have Punjab region as their target is unrealistic. That would require 1600 or more fixes. Apuldram (talk) 08:49, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Punjab which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 01:45, 16 June 2020 (UTC)

Section needed on kidnapped Christian Girls in Punjab Pakistan!!!
simple.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Punjab_(Pakistan)&diff=prev&oldid=9578000#Religion

who are forced to marry older muslim men n convert to islam! Real tragedy but not on wikipedia! 107.77.210.160 (talk) 02:52, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

very true: google.com/search?q=punjabi+kidnapped+christian+girls — Preceding unsigned comment added by 181.46.185.58 (talk • contribs) 18:45, 28 December 2022 (UTC)

Farah Hatim, one of many kidnapped (mostly christian) women/young girls in Punjab Pakistan
forced to marry agaihst her will, then overtime she thinks it was the right decision... ALLA (OR ANY OTHER GOD) WANTED IT THAT WAY:

nazmissions.wordpress.com/2011/07/27/pakistani-christian-woman-forced-to-marry-muslim-man-change-her-faith/#:~:text=Farah%20Hatim%2C%2024%2C%20a%20resident,and%20then%20marry%20the%20Muslim.

07:42, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

christianitytoday.com/ct/2024/may-web-only/pakistan-christians-fear-forced-marriages-punjab-court-hope.html

 * Hello; wikipedia fake cenosred "encyclopedia" is made so that anyone can edit almost any article. If you think that content should be added, please do

www.pcworld.com/article/525199/the_15_biggest_wikipedia_blunders.html WIKIPEDIA ENORMOUS MISTAKES, OF COURSE - THE USUAL nbcnews.com/id/wbna32588168

--Eptalon (talk) 15:53, 1 June 2024 (UTC) 51.253.128.254 (talk) 10:18, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

title: Talk:Punjab (disambiguation)


text: User talk:83.92.127.10

title: User talk:83.92.127.10


text:
Arne Norell

Arne Norell (1917–1971) was a Swedish furniture designer and entrepreneur.

Arne Norell started his own workshop in 1954 in the town of Solna, Sweden. Thereafter he moved to Småland and established his own company Möbel AB Arne Norell - today known as  'Norell Furniture' (or 'Norell Möbel AB' in Swedish). He was known for his versatile use of wood, leather, fabric, and metal in furniture characterized by comfort and ease. Arne Norell was a household name within the interior design-world of Europe. Several models were also produced in other parts of the world under a license. He was to a great extent inspired by Danish design. One example of this influence is the safari chair 'Sirocco'. Another of his designs is the lounge chair 'Ari'. It was awarded the British Furniture Manufacturer’s greatest award “showpiece of the year” in 1973. Many of the models he designed came into production after his death in 1971. His designs are still in production today.

title: Arne Norell


text:
User talk:DasBub

Welcome!

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lots of issues | leave me a message 15:25, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:09, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:33, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

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title: User talk:DasBub


text:
Bansko, North Macedonia

Bansko (Банско in Macedonian) is a village in North Macedonia. It is situated in the Strumica Plain, near the Belasica range. It is known for the Bansko spa.

The ancient site of Doberus is located nearby.

Population
As of North Macedonia's 2021 census, Bansko had 2,414 residents, with the following ethnic composition:
 * Turks: 1,142
 * Macedonians: 827
 * Albanians: 2
 * Romani: 2
 * Persons for whom data are taken from administrative sources: 434
 * Others: 7

title: Bansko, North Macedonia


text:
Julian Goodman

Julian Byrn Goodman (May 1, 1922 – July 2, 2012) was an American broadcasting executive and journalist.

Personal
He was born in Glasgow, Kentucky and graduated from Glasgow High School. Goodman took a hard stance in support of the first amendment.

Career
Goodman was known for never asking for a raise or promotion. He started his career as a reporter working $3 a week for The Glasgow Daily Times. He attended Western Kentucky State Teachers College from 1939 to 1942 as an economics major. He left in 1943 to join the United States Army and served for a few months. After serving in the Army, he moved to Washington. He graduated from George Washington University in 1948. Here he met William McAndrew and was given a job for the night news desk. He served as president of NBC from 1966 to 1974. Goodman helped establish Chet Huntley and David Brinkley as a well-known news team and led the network from 1966 to 1974. While working for NBC, he negotiated a $1 million deal to retain Johnny Carson as host of The Tonight Show. He also spent some time attempting to put an end to the Fairness Doctrine.

Goodman was included on the master list of Nixon political opponents. He was also a member of the Peabody Awards Board of Jurors from 1986 to 1992.

Family
Goodman was married to his wife Betty Davis, who was also from Kentucky. Together they had four children, John, Jeffrey, Gregory, and Julie, along with six grandchildren.

Death
Goodman died on July 2, 2012, at his home in Juno Beach, Florida, at the age of 90. The cause of his death was from kidney failure.

Accolades

 * 1973: Paul White Award, Radio Television Digital News Association

title: Julian Goodman


text:
Talk:Anti-elitism

NPOV? POV? I think there is a problem, at least with the intro of this, since I don't think anti-elitism is necessarily about hostility towards the elite itself (although it often is), more about hostility to elitism in general. Seems to me, this was written by someone who considers themself a member of an elite!
 * I partiually agree. I tend to ignore anything that involves grouping by political ideal's like communism. --203.214.95.52 09:22, 12 November 2005 (UTC)

The Elitist Superstructure finds this article distasteful
Anti-elitism should be frowned upon because it brings with it the communist mods. I have had bad experiences with these guys and let me tell you something, anti-elitisim should be crushed or we are going to have a headache!Aruma 11:21, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Elitism carries out and is w Zisakuzienn ~*~FaBuLoUs~*~ im gay 18:35, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Philosophy and Lit Section of Article
This section of the article seems to have problems with references, POV, and WP:BLP (possibly). I really can't see any easy way to solve these issues, so I'm going to tag it with templates, and see if it survives the AfD. If it does, and no one makes improvements, I think deletion of the section should be considered. -- B figura (talk) 20:34, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm working on overhauling the entire thing. I'm sorry that I published it but I do not know how to save a draft, how to edit, or even how to skip lines without pressing enter. I saved a copy on Microsoft word, so if someone can help me I will further elaborate on anti-elitism within the United States, add references, and hopefully edit the document satisfactorily. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.81.110.224 (talk) 23:57, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

title: Talk:Anti-elitism


text:
Hananiah

Hananiah, Hanina, Chaninah, Haninah, Chananiah (חנינא, חנניה) or Ananias may refer to:

Hebrew Bible

 * Hananiah ben Zerubbabel, (Old Testament: Chronicles)
 * Hananiah of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego
 * Hananiah (Samaritan), 4th century BC, governor of Samaria under the Achaemenid Empire
 * Hananiah ben Azzur, a false prophet mentioned in Jeremiah 28

Rabbis

 * Hanina Segan ha-Kohanim first generation Tanna
 * Hanina, third generation Amora the Land of Israel
 * Hanina bar Hama (d. 250)
 * Haninah, or Chaninah, 2nd century AD Rabbinic sage, contemporary of Judah ben Bathyra and Jonathan
 * Hanina ben Hakinai, 2nd century AD Rabbinic sage, contemporary of Ben 'Azzai and Simon the Temanite
 * Haninah ben Teradion, 2nd century AD Rabbinic sage, contemporary of Eleazar ben Perata I and Halafta
 * Hanina of Sura 5th generation Amora
 * Hanina of Sepphoris

Hellenistic

 * Ananias ben Onias, son of the priest who founded the Jewish Temple at Leontopolis
 * Hananiah of Damascus, known as Ananias of Damascus, Hellenized Jewish mystic, mentioned in the Acts of the Apostles as a convert to Christianity and early companion of Saul of Tarsus

Modern era
A personal name, including:
 * Hananiah Harari (1912–2000), American painter and illustrator
 * Hanania Baer, award-winning cinematographer

title: Hananiah


text:
User:MelancholieBot

This Bot is operated by User:Melancholie!

See de:Benutzer:MelancholieBot for more information.

de:Benutzer:MelancholieBot eu:Lankide:MelancholieBot fr:Utilisateur:MelancholieBot io:User:MelancholieBot ia:Usator:MelancholieBot nds:Bruker:MelancholieBot

title: User:MelancholieBot


text:
Wikipedia:Arbitration Committee Elections January 2006/Candidate statements/Fred Bauder

Communism
I notice you are very focused on Communism in your edits. Do you support communism, and if so, how does it affect your views of the way wikipedia should be run? PS this is not some mcarthyist b.s., i respect you very much and plan to support.--Urthogie 20:52, 6 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I am a sort of natural communist in the sense that I am comfortable working in that environment. I certainly don't support imposition of communism on anyone. I guess I have a preconception that everyone should pitch in and make Wikipedia a success, an excellent reverence source we can all be proud of. This is a voluntary cooperative enterprise. Fred Bauder 21:36, 6 January 2006 (UTC)
 * How would you make sure that a dictatorship theoretically "in favor of the users" doesn't occur?--Urthogie 14:14, 7 January 2006 (UTC)
 * As a practical matter, being an arbitrator takes so much time and effort that I am not able to participate effectively in Wikipedia politics. So the short answer is that there is nothing effective I could do from the position of an arbitrator. Fred Bauder 14:54, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

Some questions being asked of all the candidates by jguk
''Q: How old are you and what do you do? (If student, please state what subjects you are studying.)''

A: 63, retired attorney

Q: How many hours a month do you think you will need to be a good Arbitrator and are you really willing to put in the time?

A: About 30 hours a week, yes, that is how much I put in.

''Q: If chosen, you will need to arbitrate on disputes arising from the creation or revision of articles. Experience of creating and revising articles yourself, particularly where it has involved collaboration, is very valuable in understanding the mindset of disputants who come to arbitration. With reference to your own edits in the main article namespace, please demonstrate why you think you have the right experience to be a good arbitrator.''

A: I think the articles which have involved the most successful collaboration have been Communist Party USA, Tiananmen Square protests of 1989, China and People's Republic of China. Although these are controversial articles the breakdowns which occurred have, with the help of others, been successfully resolved. It should be noted that several years of service as an arbitrator has somewhat limited my editing recently.

Q: Please list out what other Wikipedia usernames you have edited under.

A:

Questions by Snowspinner

 * 1) As a current arbitrator, you're particularly well-suited to know the current problems with the arbcom. In your mind, what is the biggest problem with the arbcom, and what what will you do differently if reelected to help fix it?
 * Our biggest problem is folks who struggle hard to get elected, do a lot of work for a few days, then either quit completely or slow way down, limiting themselves to voting on conclusions, not doing the hard work of investigating problems and proposing solutions. It is hard to predict who might do this, other than in the case of arbitrators who have previously served. Fred Bauder 13:48, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

 * 1) You write the lion's share of the proposals for the arbcom at present. Do you see this as a potentially negative thing? Do you think it would be beneficial for other arbitrators to take on a larger share of the proposed decisions? Snowspinner 19:37, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
 * We have so much work that those with the time and energy to investigate and make proposals need to do it. The problem with overdoing it is somewhat allayed by the /Workshop page which makes propositions more tentative, allowing feedback before propositions are advanced for actual voting. Recusing from a few cases helps too. Fred Bauder 13:48, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Questions by Ted Wilkes
I note here and on your User page you state you are a retired lawyer (attorney) and on your Talk page other Wikipedians have referred to you in your capacity as a lawyer. For myself and others, assessing someone's legal training and experience is an important factor for consideration in electing them to serve on the Arbitration Committee. Therefore, would you kindly advise from which university you received your law degree and which State Bar, past or present, you have been admitted to. Thank you. - Ted Wilkes 17:16, 13 November 2005 (UTC)
 * University of Denver I practiced in Colorado. Fred Bauder 18:13, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

Thank you for the partial answer, but could you please tell us if you are now or have ever been a member of the State Bar?. - Ted Wilkes 19:30, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

Yes Fred Bauder 19:33, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

Thank you. You were disbarred by the Supreme Court of Colorado in 1999 as per the record here. Could you please tell us if you were reinstated? Thank you. - Ted Wilkes 19:52, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

I was suspended for 30 days, but was never reinstated. I retired. Fred Bauder 20:29, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

When Jimmy Wales asked if you would be interested in serving on the Arbitration Committee did you advise him that you were under disbarment by the Colorado Supreme Court? - Ted Wilkes 22:02, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

No, such a statement would not be factually correct and is irrelevant anyway, If I had actually done something serious it would be a different matter. Fred Bauder 22:05, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

When the Supreme Court of Colorado declares a lawyer unfit to practise law and a danger to the public and forbids them to practise law until they prove otherwise, that is not serious? - Ted Wilkes 20:51, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Fred, I'd just like to say that I appreciate your honesty here, and the fact that you didn't lose your temper with this line of questioning. Jacqui ★ 15:45, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

 * What a preposterous line of questioning!! Fred has the patience of a saint! Babajobu 01:05, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

Ditto on that, as well on the completely inappropriate comment below by Carnildo. karmafist 03:20, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

 * What, you don't recognize a question with no correct answers when you see one? It's always interesting to know how people deal with such a question. --Carnildo 06:47, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

Question by Carnildo
Q: Have you stopped beating your wife?

Form question by Snowspinner
Being an arbitrator requires a finely tuned bullshit detector. What in your life has prepared you to detect bullshit with ease? Phil Sandifer 21:21, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Questions from FuelWagon
On November 16th, Ted Wilkes requested arbitration against you. That same day, you voted to "reject" Wilkes case against you. Do you find a conflict of interest to exist when a case is brought against yourself?

On November 17th, Redwolf24 requested arbitration to be reopened against Ted Wilkes regarding the case involving user Onefortyone. That same day, you voted to "accept" the case against Wilkes. Do you find it to be a conflict of interest to vote on a case involving Wilkes, when just the day before, Wilkes had requested arbitration against you?

Most editors are not privy to the inside goings on of arbitration committee. Most editors are outsiders who can only look at diffs and histories of edits made by members of arbcom. From an editors point of view, how would someone objectively know that a member of arbcom is not misusing their power when they vote against a case critical of their behaviour? How would someone objectively know that a member of arbcom is not misuing their power by accepting a case against an editor who had criticized them the day before?

 * I am upset, but all of the accusations by Ted Wilkes came after the case was accepted. If I recuse myself it opens the door for a user to pick a fight with an arbitrator so they are forced to recuse. If after a case is started you pick a fight with an arbitrator you just have to live with the consequences. Besides I think I can do right by Ted Wilkes and Wyss anyway. They have a good point regarding Onefortyone's edits, they just went a little too far. Fred Bauder 03:42, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

User:Fred Bauder states: "but all of the accusations by Ted Wilkes came after the case was accepted. - What kind of total fabrication is this? Please explain. Thank you. - Ted Wilkes 20:33, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

 * I don't quite understand what you mean when you say "all of the accusations ... came after the case was accepted". The Wilkes request arbitration here and it clearly lists you as the main defendant, and the opening statement of his request states: Fred Bauder said on his Arbitration Committee Elections December 2005/Candidate statements. It seems clear to me that you had an immediate conflict of interest in Wilkes RfA against you, and that you should have recused yourself there. And given the dispute with Wilkes there, you should ahve recused yourself from the RfA against Wilkes made the next day by Redwolf24. Don't you see a conflict of interest when you are specificially named as the defendent in an RfA regardless of whatever accusations come out of the RfA? FuelWagon 21:33, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

 * This is real simple and applies to you too. You can't pick a fight with an arbitrator and force recusal. Fred Bauder 21:45, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

 * So, at what point could an outside editor bring an arbiter to an RFA and expect that the arbiter recuse himself? Wilkes RfA against you seemed more focused on you being a member of arbcom and whetehr or not you purposefully hid your disbarment or whatever. You tried to say that it was an attempt by wilkes to appeal a prior decision. Do you see it a good rule of thumb to simply let a member to decide if he should recuse or not, even if to an outside observer it seems there is an obvious conflict of interest? FuelWagon 21:51, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

 * That's very simple: you cannot bring an arbitration case against an arbitrator, as the ArbCom has decided they don't have jurisdiction over themselves. All such complaints must go to Jimbo or the Board. --Carnildo 23:29, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

"you cannot bring an arbitration case against an arbitrator, as the ArbCom has decided they don't have jurisdiction over themselves" OK, then this raises some more questions. FuelWagon 13:47, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

(1) is there a URL that points to this decision or a URL that points to a policy page that shows this is official arbcom policy?

 * If (1)==no, then we're talking about a subjective interpretation previous rulings and recusal for Fred would still be the appropriate response.

 * if (1)==yes, then please provide the URL. and continue with question 1.1

 * (1.1) Was this URL provided to Wilkes at any time during his RFA re. Fred Bauder or on that talk page?

 * If (1.1)==yes, then please provide a diff because I cannot find it here.

 * If (1.1)==no, then how exactly would an uninvolved editor know that some objective policy was the basis for the decision, rather than subjective interpretation on the part of the arbiters?

(2) There is a conversational thread on the RFA talk page regarding this case, excerpted below

 * Ted Wilkes' request for an RfA is not an appeal of a prior arbcom decision and therefore any votes to reject it which are based on that reason should be disqualified. Wyss 22:11, 16 November 200 (UTC)

 * It looks like an appeal to me Fred Bauder 22:21, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

 * You're mistaken, it's an RfA about your behaviour. Wyss 22:52, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

(2) The thread ends at this point. If this RfA is so "very simply" as Carnildo states, then why wasn't Wyss informed that an RfA about a member of arbcom's behaviour is not within arbcom's "jurisdiction", ending this whole debate immediately rather than allow the talk page to explode?

(3) If it is clearly a case that arbcom is outside of arbcom's jurisdiction, then what harm could come of Fred Bauder recusing himself from the vote? Fred could have voted "recuse", knowing "very simply" that it was such a straightforward case that the other arbiters would reject as "out of jurisdiction".

(3.1) Wouldn't a vote to "recuse" on Fred's part have maintained a separation of any possible conflict of interests, still knowing that the rest of the members of arbcom would reject it as out of jurisdiction?

Form Question from karmafist
Many policies contradict and overlap with each other, and then WP:IAR makes things even more complicated while making them paradoxically more flexible. When two or more policies apply and conflict, what do you do? karmafist 18:36, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

My experience is that looking at the concrete cases we consider, most involve violation of a core Wikipedia policy or guideline on which there is agreement, such as Neutral point of view, What Wikipedia is not, No personal attacks, etc. When difficult situations arise you must consider whether the behavior helps or hinders the building of an encyclopedia. Fred Bauder 21:21, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

Questions from User:-Ril-

 * The following questions are for each candidate, and do not specifically target you

''Do you hold any strong political or religious opinions (e.g. concerning George Bush, Islam, or on which end you should break a boiled egg)? If so, would you recuse yourself from cases centred on these?''

 * I recuse myself from cases regarding users I have had serious trouble with and subjects on which I hold extreme opinions Fred Bauder 19:03, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Could you tell us what those subjects are, so that we can examine your record to see how extreme a case must be before you recuse it? --Victim of signature fascism

 * A list would be rather misleading Fred Bauder 19:31, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
 * In what manner? Sam Spade, for example, has a whole page filled with a list of all the biases he thinks he exhibits. Maybe you could give some more general themes? Or are you unwilling to be open about some? And if so, why? --Victim of signature fascism 19:54, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

How willing are you to contest the decisions of other arbitrators rather than just "go with the flow"?

 * To the death Fred Bauder 19:03, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

Do you view all requests to re-address cases, particularly requests made by those most penalised, as being automatically without merit?

 * No, full consideration is given to such requests Fred Bauder 19:03, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

''In the case against Yuber, it was decided by the arbitration committee that it is the duty of arbitrators to investigate, and rule on the behaviour of not only one party involved, but all of them. Do you support this decision? [if current arbitrator] Does your visible behaviour on recent cases reflect this decision?''

 * I was the one who did that in Yuber (proposed remedies regarding Guy Montag) and fully support that practice. If there is a dispute it is rare that only one is causing all of it. Fred Bauder 19:03, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I apologise for asking you this question, when the answer is so obvious, but that is a side effect of stock questions.

--Victim of signature fascism 16:46, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

Secret ArbCom Ballots
In many ArbCom workshops, I've seen other members wait for days until you start the ball rolling. More than 90% of the ArbCom opinions given after yours seem to be in agreement with you, even on some very controversial issues. To address possible influencing of other members in a case, secret balloting of Arbcom members has been suggested. If the results of each vote were shown after the case is closed, would you support such a measure? --Peter McConaughey 06:53, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

 * I am rather disappointed with my "leading" role. I would much rather have colleagues with the kind of time I have to work the cases up. I'd like to sit back and say yes or no too. I've been set on my ear a few times though. I don't think anyone is intimidated but I sometimes wonder if they had time to dig into the evidence extensively they might come to different conclusions. As to a secret ballot there are problems as the community needs to know how people vote. We do a lot of talking about cases on irc and the arbcom mailing list anyway. Anyone needs feedback so when they make a mistake it can be corrected. That's the wiki way. Fred Bauder 14:05, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

I think the solution is to find other arbitrators who have the time and energy to work cases up and propose decisions. Fred Bauder 14:05, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

I wouldn't support the procedure you suggest as one of the things we do is discuss with the arbitrators who are voting why they are voting the way they do. We then discuss their reasons. Sometimes votes, including mine, change as the result of these conversations. Fred Bauder 14:05, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

 * The suggestion allows for unrestricted communication during the process, the ability to change votes at any time, and complete transparency of the votes after the case is closed. The only difference would be that Arbcom members could vote their conscience without other members singling them out as a problem. I hope that clarifies the suggestion. Given this information, are your feelings on the subject any different? --Peter McConaughey 15:11, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

 * No you need to know who has an opinion in order to discuss it with them. And they need to reply. There needs to be a dialogue Fred Bauder 07:14, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

 * If you are communicating in an open forum, why would you need to know who is voting which way? --Peter McConaughey 18:33, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

So you can ask them about the reason for their votes then discuss it. Fred Bauder 19:51, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

Question from BDell555
You have proposed that User:Nobs01 be banned for a minimum of one year. A review of this editor's contributions suggests that he may be considered by many to be a "controversial expert". How do you propose to deal with the problem of expert exodus?Bdell555 09:27, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

 * If he were an expert he would not make the gross errors he does. He lists one man as having been convicted of a crime and being dead when I sometimes chat with the same man at our local library. Nobs copied it from a book, but on notice of the error, did not bother to check out the facts. Nobs is engaged in serious personal attacks. That is the issue. If Cberlet, or any expert, did the same thing, the same remedy would be proposed. Fred Bauder 14:11, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

 * According to the Blocking policy policy, "Blocks may be imposed in instances where threats have been made or actions performed (including actions outside the Wikipedia site) which expose other Wikipedia editors to political, religious or other persecution by government, their employer or any others." If actions by User:Cberlet with respect to a certain Catholic clergyman were to directly or indirectly result in that clergyman's dismissal, would that not constitute grounds for a ban?  Also, do you agree with the application of that endangerment policy to the case of User:Amalekite?Bdell555 01:38, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Assuming the story about the Catholic clergyman is well sourced, it might be included in the article Chip Berlet as criticism. The block of User:Amalekite is justified, although I doubt any one on Stormfront cares who is Jewish here. I would base it more on troublemaking than on endangerment. Fred Bauder 02:58, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Question from Marsden
Many people have noted that Wikipedia's original communitarian structure is no longer functioning very well. One editor has suggested that ArbCom is "about getting the trains to run on time," which is a reference to a fulfulled promise of Mussolini's fascist government. Do you agree that Wikipedia needs to become more orderly, and if so, do you think there are any options other than a move toward a more centrally controlled authoritarian system? Do you think that the spirit of cooperation in Wikipedia would survive such a change? Marsden 15:55, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

 * We don't really try to get the "trains to run on time", perhaps prevent repeated head on collisions is more like it. Most disputes need to be worked out in the wiki way through consensus and negotiation. Basically we don't get involved unless more communitarian solutions have broken down. There is far too much eagerness to take things to arbitration. Some folks think we will crack down by enforcing the "rules"; they are often disappointed. Fred Bauder 19:32, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Further question from jguk
You are often asked to recuse yourself from cases on the ArbCom (and are probably the Arbitrator most often asked to do so). Before deciding whether or not you have a conflict of interest requiring recusal do you consider it appropriate to discuss the matter with your fellow Arbitrators? I'd also be grateful if you'd explain your answer, jguk 19:07, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Generally not, but the general question of whether we should recuse in the case of an editor who has attacked us has been considered, especially those, such as yourself, who are dissatisfied with the result of an arbitration. It has been decided that is not a basis for recusal. Fred Bauder 19:24, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Question from nobs
You appear to attribute a Verifiable citation to nobs which was the genesis of your decision to take up the "acting in concert" case. Verifiability, not truth is the standard. (a) Why do you consider what reputable and verifiable published sources say about a Wikipedia editor to be a "personal attack", by a user citing the source. (b) What evidence do you have that nobs did not attempt to discern the facts, which then may be original reseach? nobs 19:45, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

 * This question does not make a lot of sense. You might try supplying some diffs to what you are talking about? The material you placed on Talk:Chip Berlet may or may not be accurate, there is one major error involving Francisco Kiko Martinez who is alive, has never been convicted of a felony and is an attorney in good standing in Colorado, but placed where they are, are clearly a personal attack unrelated to the content of the article except by virtue of Guilt by association. Fred Bauder 21:40, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Should you when informed that Francisco Kiko Martinez is alive and well, contrary to the information in your source, then investigate? After all, you can claim the falsehood is in your quoted source. Perhaps you should call and ask him at 1-719-589-6543. Fred Bauder 21:40, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Specifically, the citation was made to Arleigh McCree, A Case For Self-Defense, Military Police (Summer 1981), quoted in Laird Wilcox, Political Research Associates: A Study in "Links & ties", subchapter Chip Berlet and the National Lawyers Guild, (Editorial Research Service, 1999). You made an assertion the man was alive here ; nobs supplied the complete cited entry here . How does a verifiable citation to a reputable published source constitute a "personal attack".  The standard is verifability, not truth.  And what evidence can you cite that nobs did not act to verify your assertion the man was alive?  nobs 22:18, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Do you support the creation of a Arbitration Committee Code of Conduct as I have just now suggested at User talk:Jimbo Wales? - Ted Wilkes 18:34, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

 * That would help clear up a number of matters for everyone. Fred Bauder 19:27, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Someone created the article without my knowledge. As such, would you mind offering some input? Thank you. - Ted Wilkes 21:40, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Support Wikipedia:User Bill of Rights?
Do you support User Bill of Rights? (SEWilco 05:35, 21 December 2005 (UTC))

Criticism of ArbCom
Do you believe that users have the right to criticize ArbCom and its decisions?

 r  speer 05:47, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

 * Yes, although if it extends to a general condemnation of the entire site and all its works all focus is lost. Likewise a general condemnation of me and everything I have ever done in life. Criticism to be useful needs to focus on practical alternatives to what was done. Fred Bauder 04:05, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

Sam Spade

 * Why shouldn't users view your proposal to chastize Sam Spade  as reminiscent of Vladimir Putin throwing his opponent, Mikhail Khodorkovsky, in prison just before an election?  nobs 23:03, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Questions being asked by Titoxd to all candidates
I spend about about 4 hours a day. Fred Bauder 04:09, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
 * 1) How much of your Wikipedia time do you plan to spend on ArbCom business?

Wikinfo, WaterWiki at Wikicities and my bookselling business Fred Bauder 04:09, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
 * 1) If you were elected and had to spend most of your time in ArbCom delibations, which projects would you consider to be the most negatively affected by your absence?

Quite a bit. I'll continue to work hard on WaterWiki, but not get the kind of work I would like done. Fred Bauder 04:09, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
 * 1) To what extent would those projects be affected?

Tito xd (?!? - help us) 06:40, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

Neutrality question and Censuring questions from -Ril-
(Being asked of all candidates)

Do you believe that regardless of Jimbo Wales' own views on the matter, the community should be able to strip arbitrators of their position under certain circumstances, and if so, what circumstances?
 * Yes, by consensus. That was more or less what we responded to in the case of Ed Poor. Fred Bauder 04:14, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

As a corollory:Do you believe, regardless of Jimbo Wales' view on the matter, that a large number of signatories (e.g. 150 requesting censure against 50 supporting the arbitrator) to an RFC against an arbitrator is enough that the arbitrator should be judged as having been rejected by the community in light of their actions, and consequently for them to be forcibly stripped of their post?
 * I think that would be an example of consensus Fred Bauder 04:14, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

''wikipedia has a policy of NPOV. Excepting straw men, have you ever introduced a substantial opinion or fact that contradicts your own political or religious viewpoint into an article on a topic of which you have strong opinions, and if you have, how frequently do you do so compared to your other substatial edits to articles?''
 * I had occasionally written entire articles from an opposing political point of view, Jack Shulman is an example Fred Bauder 04:14, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

--Victim of signature fascism 01:38, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

Recusal, Code of Conduct, Expansion
I am asking these questions of all candidates:

1. Do you pledge to abide by the proposed recusal guidelines at Arbitration Committee Code of Conduct?

2. Are there any parts of Arbitration Committee Code of Conduct that you do not agree with? If so, please describe in detail how you would improve them.

3. Will you please pledge to support expanding the number of seats on the Arbitration Committee? If not, how would you propose alleviating the present arbitration backlog?

4. Have you voted over at Arbitration Committee Elections January 2006/Proposed modifications to rules? If not, why not? If so, please summarize your votes.

Thank you for your kind consideration of and answers to these questions. —James S. 06:30, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

 * The Code you are referring to was made up by disaffected users who had committed serious violations of Wikipedia policies such as (Requests for arbitration/Wilkes, Wyss and Onefortyone),  (Requests for arbitration/Nobs01 and others),  (Requests for arbitration/Rangerdude), and  (Requests for arbitration/Lyndon LaRouche 2). There has been minimum participation by the community at large, especially by those who support our policies. It is long, extremely detailed and is not policy. That said, I will recuse in any instance I cannot be fair with any user. I don't have time to go through the proposed policy in detail, much of it is wrong-headed. Increasing the number of arbitrators is not an answer in itself. What we need is a few, more active arbitrators. That may involve trying out quite a few users, problem is, once an arbitrator, always an arbitrator so folks who think they could do it, but turn out not to be able to often continue in the position but don't do too much. I did not vote regarding alternatives to arbitration selection. Fred Bauder 12:57, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

Workshop (question from AndriyK)
You have proudly stated the following: "I have innovated with respect to Wikipedia:Probation and creation of a /Workshop". According to my experience, nothing or nearly nothing of what was discussed on the Workshop page was used in the Proposed decision. Morover, a great part of the Proposed decision have not been discussed on the Workshop page. So I had no chance to comment on what you were going to vote. What is the purpose of your innovation then?--AndriyK 16:39, 10 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Usually they are but remember anything on the proposed decision page can be discussed on the talk page of /Proposed decision. However you make a good point about the expectations raised that there will be discussion before a proposal to be voted on is made. Fred Bauder 16:44, 10 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I tried to discuss on the talk page, but my message was ignored as well.--AndriyK 19:17, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

I hope Fred won't mind if I speak up in advocacy here. Please look at some other workshops, Andriyk. In the Webcomics decision, most of the final decision (or the pending final decision; last time I looked it had passed a motion to close but still hadn't yet been closed) came directly from the workshop. Principles, findings of fact, and remedies, mostly word-for-word. The committee was highly selective in its use of workshop material, choosing that which it felt was appropriate, but the concept has been an overwhelming success and I'm sure it has cut clerical work by the committee down immensely. It has also provided editors with a substantial stake in the arbitration process, and experience of the kind of material and considerations that are useful to the committee in producing its final decision, although the deliberation itself remains largely opaque. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 17:48, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

 * Well, /Workshop surely a good idea. Still I wonder why it was completely ignored in my case. Was there any particular reason?--AndriyK 19:04, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Punishment (one more question from AndriyK)
James F. have written in his statement the following:
 * "I strongly believe that the Committee's real purpose is to prevent further damage to the project by taking measures as we see fit, not to mete out some form of 'justice' as punishment of those deemed to have done wrong. Where I have considered banning people, it is not because I think that they "deserve" it in some way, but more that I regretfully doubt that their continued presence is not damaging to the project."

Are you agree with your colleague? If not, please explain your view on the purpose of the Arbitration Committee and the role of punishment.--AndriyK 19:14, 10 January 2006 (UTC)
 * The purpose of all rational remedies is to further the project. If sanctioning a user will result in a change of behavior, that is useful. If banning or blocking them prevents disruption or damage that also helps. Like all people we occasionally lapse into punishment, but that does not advance the project. Fred Bauder 02:06, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

General statement vs. particular case (a further question from AndriyK)
You've just written:
 * The purpose of all rational remedies is to further the project. If sanctioning a user will result in a change of behavior, that is useful. If banning or blocking them prevents disruption or damage that also helps.

On the other hand, you voted for banning me for one month "for creating irreversible page moves". Putting aside the question whether and how much the "irreversible page moves" disrupt Wikipedia, I promised do not do it anymore. How and in which way the one-month-ban would "prevent disruption or damage"? Would not just saying "Do not do it any more!" do the same job? Is there no contradiction between your statement and your vote? If ArbCom would like to change my behavior, why not just tell me clearly, what exactly should be changed?--AndriyK 12:24, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Good point Fred Bauder 14:20, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Concerns over personal attack templates
User:Improv, who is also a candidate for the arbitration committee, has placed the following statement on Village pump (policy):

 * I am concerned about |recent templates surviving AfD that appear to contrast with established policy. In particular, I feel that these templates are Poisoning the well when it comes for how we treat our fellow wikipedians. There are circumstances where knowing too much about one's neighbours politicises how one deals with them. This is, to an extent, unavoidable in society, but wearing signs of hate as badges on our shoulders takes what is a small problem that we can usually deal with into the realm of being damaging to the community. Already, there have been signs of people refusing to help each other because they are on different ends of a political spectrum -- this seems likely to get worse if this trend continues. Some people cry that this is an attack on their first amendment rights (if they're American, anyhow), but that doesn't apply here because Wikipedia is not the U.S. government -- it is a community that has always self-regulated, and more importantly it is an encyclopedia with a goal of producing encyclopedic content. We have a tradition of respecting a certain amount of autonomy on userpages, but never absolute autonomy. We might imagine, for example, templates with little swastikas saying "this user hates jews". I am not saying that such a thing would be morally equivalent to this template against scientology, but rather that we should aim to minimise that aspect of ourselves, at least on Wikipedia, so we can make a better encyclopedia. The spirit of NPOV does not mean that we cannot have strong views and still be wikipedians, but rather that we should not wear signs of our views like badges, strive not to have our views be immediately obvious in what we edit and how we argue, and fully express ourselves in other places (Myspace? Personal webpage?) where it is more appropriate and less divisive.

I am inviting all candidates, including Improv, to expand on this theme on their questions pages. Do you agree that this is a cause for concern as we move into 2006? How do you see the role of the arbitration committee in interpreting the interpretation of Wikipedia policy in the light of this concern? --Tony Sidaway|Talk 20:36, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

 * It is a cause for concern on many levels. Not only is it a problem in itself, but the dispute over it is a problem with a vote on Templates for deletion to keep, followed by its deletion by those opposed to it. The more extreme of these templates violate No personal attacks and Civility. In those cases deletion is justified, but as they become less offensive it becomes harder to make a determination. Just saying you oppose superstition would seem OK. Putting a specific label on it that singles out a group that may participate here can cross the line. Fred Bauder 21:38, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

 * The question of userboxes as a whole is a policy dispute that needs to be fully discussed. Fred Bauder 21:38, 12 January 2006 (UTC)


text:
Talk:Antigua

Wadadli
It is also known as Wadadli, from the original Amerindian inhabitants, and means approximately "our own".[citation needed]

I used to work a few months on the island, and heard Wadadli more in the meaning like warrior. Can anyone confirm this? By the way: Wadadli is also a slendid type of local beer. I highly recommend it, along with Carib and Red Stripe —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.4.146.54 (talk) 15:12, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

Chief Towns?
To user 65.19.76.218

I am curious why you changed the entry on Antigua that read 'The three chief towns are St John's, Parham and Falmouth' to 'St John's, All Saints and Liberta'. That might be true in population terms but I don't think that is the gist of the article. Liberta and All Saints are bedroom communities whilst Parham and Falmouth are industrial and commerce centres as well. Unless you can substanciate that edit, or we re-word that paragraph to be clearer than it is then I would suggest we change that edit back to the way it was. Adam777 15:17, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

 * Thanks for the reply on my talk page. As the 'Chief towns' is a very ambiguous term then perhaps that line can be adjusted to reflect that St John's, Liberta and All Saints are the three largest population centres according to the last census (and perhaps include their respective populations).  Parham could be highlighted as it was the original capital of Antigua as well as its industrial base and Falmouth/English Harbour obviously for its prominence in the Yachting world. Will you take care  of the change to the chief towns entry? Adam777 17:40, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

God forsaken hell hole
I reverted that addition by an anon editor. Nelson never actually set foot in Antigua so I cant see how he formed an opinion on it one way or the other. Adam777 12:18, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Geography
What are the elevation extremes?  Drahcir  my talk 01:08, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Jamaica Kincaid' sporting achivements
Why is Ms Kincaid's writings about Antigua under the Sports section? And she is also listed under residents when she is nothing of the kind, to the best of my knowledge she has never returned here after leaving as a child. Perhaps we need a literary section to correctly cover her links to Antigua....any thoughts? Adam777 13:41, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Customs?
What were the customs in Antigua during the late 1950's and early 1960's??? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.110.138.72 (talk) 02:17, 25 February 2007 (UTC).

 * Mostly it’s beaches, foods, and some left for wind rush 146.90.176.87 (talk) 12:10, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Anti-Guam
> Internet hosting and gaming <

USA has just announced it trashes GATS treaty starting 1st September 2007. US invasion starts 5th September 2007, George Herbert Walker Bush has just signed the executive order for "Operation Eggnog" (a tongue-in-cheek reference to Reagan's 1983 invasion of the pro-cuban island of Granada). Afterwards half of the island will be leased for a permanent USAF base for 99 years for 5000USD/year. There is a reason America's military motto is: "Don't thread on me!" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.131.210.162 (talk) 07:33, August 28, 2007 (UTC)

Lord Nelson
The section on Lord Nelson at the moment is quite badly written. It looks like it was cribbed from elsewhere, it uses the same quote twice, and it is not in keeping with the tone of the article or of wikipedia. I don't know enough about the subject to clean it up though. 121.45.34.183 00:31, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Page Structure
Hey,  Just thinking the page layout for is unlike the standard that other countries/regions etc take within wikipedia. Unfortunately my skills are poor to say the least so if anyone who is more capable that I could rectify it into a more standard form that would be great! Euanmoo 15:51, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Flag
Why is there not a picture of Antigua's Flag with their Countries Motto?

I have just signed up to this site and I don't really know my way around yet. Please could someone add these details to Antigua. --Cardella 10:20, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm not really familiar with all this stuff, but my guess would be because its not a country. Antigua and Barbuda has the flag/motto stuff. Bawolff (talk) 01:45, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Is this a tourist piece?
In light of recent events, perhaps more attention on government and crime is called for.Ykral (talk) 14:29, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

Government?
There doesn't seem to be any information regarding the type of government in Antigua. Might someone add this? Basket of Puppies 06:06, 20 February 2009 (UTC)'Bold text' ==

Now, a year after that comment, as conditions have turned for the worse, it is IMHO time to reveal what is going on here.

Pronunciation
I was going to comment on the "An-TEE-gwa" pronunciation as being inappropriate, even though I acknowledge that WP is a predominantly US-driven site.

Having come to edit and seen that the page is supposedly written in British English, then this should be removed. British English would never be An-TEE-gwa, but as the local An-TEE-ga. 195.88.237.18 (talk) 16:48, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I've corrected it. "An-TEE-gwa" isn't correct in American English either. It's a fairly rare spelling pronunciation. AHD simply has the wrong end of the stick. Angr (talk) 07:50, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Curious. Since Christopher Columbus (according to Wikipedia) named the island 'Antigua' and he was from Spain, then why wouldn't the pronounciation be 'An-TEE-gwa' ?Mylittlezach (talk) 16:10, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

Disputed slave conspiracy of 1736
Kittybrewster  ☎  22:42, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 one external links on Antigua. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
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Assessment comment
Substituted at 08:00, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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An old lack of logic
The following sentences were added by an IP a decade ago, within a quite large contribution to the article, here:
 * According to A Brief History of the Caribbean, European and African diseases, malnutrition and slavery eventually destroyed the vast majority of the Caribbean's native population. No researcher has conclusively proven any of these causes as the real reason for the destruction of West Indian natives. In fact, some historians believe that the psychological stress of slavery may also have played a part in the massive number of native deaths while in servitude. Others believe that the reportedly abundant, but starchy, low-protein diet may have contributed to severe malnutrition of the "Indians" who were used to a diet fortified with protein from sea-life.

The paragraph is still there, with little change, but some "unsourced" templates.

There was a brief skirmish about the second sentence some weeks ago, here and here. Now, after reading the full contribution of the IP, I do not at all find it clear that the contested sentence was intended as "racist claptrap", but nor I find its removal "unhelpful" or "disruptive". Instead, I find the paragraph unclear or illogical. The point of the next sentence is to specify precisely how either slavery or malnutrition may have been the cause of the demise of the major part of the indigenous population. This should not be put into contrast with the hypothesis that those were among the main causes, as now seems to be the case.

I do not know whether the second sentence is part of a synthesis from the given source, or is the conclusions of the IP. In the first case, one possible explanation could be, that the source wanted to stress that no single cause alone has been established for the (near) extinction. Indeed, if some historians advocate slavery as a major cause, and other propose malnutrition, then one of these has not been conclusively proven as the cause. However, if this really is the intended meaning, then the paragraph is rather unclearly written. The "In fact" and "also" in the next sentence also clashes with this interpretation.

If, on the other hand, either the IP or other editors would take differences of opinion on whether slavery or malnutrition alone may have been the main cause as a pretext for doubting that diseases, malnutrition and slavery together were the main causes, then this would not only be OR, but also grossly illogical. Therefore, I believe that either the paragraph should be rewritten to make it stress that the doubt only concerns which one of the factors which is the main cause, or it should essentially be edited according to Maherkr's suggestion. I do not have access to the source, which makes it harder to decide which option is best.

I've tried to explain the problem I see as precisely as possible, and apologise if this has damaged the accessibility of my explanation. JoergenB (talk) 12:35, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

 * I have no particular knowledge of this subject. It now seems that my revert may have been meant for something else/someone else.  Please continue working on this article as you see fit. Hmains (talk) 17:20, 5 November 2017 (UTC)
 * OK; I'll try to remove the contradiction, and replace the 'synthesis' with just a remark about the existence of various suggestions about details. JoergenB (talk) 10:42, 16 November 2017 (UTC)

Clean up.
Partly copyedited by GOCE in October 2019 but much of the prose remains less formal than it should be - as if written for Simple English Wiki. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 03:57, 1 October 2019 (UTC)

Mainland
I tagged an use of the word "mainland" with Where in the "Early Antiguans" subsection. The context is unclear. Does the word refer to North or South America or another island? - Presidentman talk · contribs (Talkback) 20:35, 11 January 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 12:11, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Antigua and Barbuda location map Topographic.png

Recent history
The Cameroonian migrants stranded on an island they had not heard of - BBC News 2600:6C67:1C00:5F7E:346B:BF9F:F25B:F90E (talk) 04:16, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Etymology
I have created an Etymology section, and moved etymological info there.

When looking for citations related to why Columbus named the island Santa Maria de la Antigua, I discovered that many sources claim it's named after the "church in Seville" by that name. However, the church/cathedral in Seville is Santa María de la Sede ('Saint Mary of the See'), not Santa Maria de la Antigua. So I've added some info and additional citations related to other claims: that it's named after the image of Santa Maria de la Antigua (in the Seville Cathedral) or the chapel in the Seville Cathedral.

If someone could look at my additions and provide any feedback or suggestions, that would be appreciated. Thanks!! CareAhLine (talk) 21:18, 11 April 2023 (UTC)

title: Talk:Antigua


text:
User talk:139.78.10.1

Proposed deletion of Battle of Châlons (disambiguation)

The article Battle of Châlons (disambiguation) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern: "Disambiguation page not required (WP:ONEOTHER). Primary topic article has a hatnote to the only other use."

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 18:35, 30 June 2024 (UTC)

title: User talk:139.78.10.1


text: Category:Villages in North Macedonia

title: Category:Villages in North Macedonia


text: Category:Railway culture in Japan

title: Category:Railway culture in Japan


text:
Lampros Choutos

Lampros Choutos (sometimes Lambros; born 7 December 1979) is a Greek former professional footballer who played as a striker.

During his career, he played equal periods of time in his country and Italy.

Early years
Born in Athens, Choutos started his career with Asteras Polygonou, being discovered by scouts of Panathinaikos FC. After only two years, he moved to Italy to finish his football grooming with AS Roma.

Professionals
Choutos' first stop as a senior was back in his country, loaned by Roma to Olympiacos F.C. after stellar performances during the qualifying stages for the 2000 UEFA European Under-21 Championship, as he netted 15 goals in only ten matches. He gradually made his way into the first team under the direction of Alberto Bigon, forming a productive attacking trio with Slovenia's Zlatko Zahovič and Giovanni from Brazil.

Although he suffered from an injured knee, Choutos managed to score decisive goals. He helped the Piraeus club win the 2000, 2001 and 2003 Superleague championships before returning to Italy, with Inter Milan.

Choutos signed a three-year contract with Inter in summer 2004, but could never settle there, being constantly loaned to other minor sides in both the country and abroad (Spain's RCD Mallorca, where he quickly fell out of favour with manager Héctor Cúper). He made his competitive debut for the Nerazzurri on 9 November 2006, coming on as a 78th-minute substitute for Mariano González in a Coppa Italia clash against F.C. Messina Peloro, which took place more than two years after his arrival; he left at the end of the campaign.

Choutos returned to his country in the 2007 off-season after signing with Panionios FC, but was only eligible to start playing in the following January. He again began experiencing first-team football, and notably scored two of three at Athens Olympic Sports Complex to help defeat hosts AEK Athens F.C. and collect the Man of the match award; he finished his half season with 12 goals, as his team finished in sixth position and participated in the second stage.

Choutos started his second year in scoring fashion, netting twice against OFK Beograd in the UEFA Intertoto Cup (3–1 home win, 3–2 on aggregate). After a run-in with the club's assistant coach that supposedly turned physical, however, the player was forced to leave.

On 2 February 2009, Choutos signed a six-month contract with PAOK FC, appearing in eight scoreless matches. On 25 August he returned to Italy once again, joining lowly A.S. Pescina Valle del Giovenco for two years; his contract was cancelled in July 2010, after the club was excluded from the Italian football league system due to financial issues.

International career
Courtesy of his solid under-21 performances, Choutos soon made his debut for the Greek full side, going on to win ten caps in four years. He was overlooked for the squads that appeared at both UEFA Euro 2004 and 2008.

Personal life
Choutos origin is from the village Agioi Thedoroi, Trikala.

Honours
Olympiacos
 * Alpha Ethniki: 1999–2000, 2000–01, 2002–03

Inter
 * Serie A: 2006–07
 * Coppa Italia: 2004–05

title: Lampros Choutos


text:
User talk:SimpleMan

Welcome!

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Where to ask a question or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! Blank Verse  ∅  15:28, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
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title: User talk:SimpleMan


text: User talk:86.105.232.120

title: User talk:86.105.232.120


text: User talk:68.72.148.124

title: User talk:68.72.148.124


text:
Talk:Lakkopetra

Kalamaki
This article refers to Kalamaki as being a neighboring town. I would be grateful for advice as to whether it is one of the towns mentioned in that article or another place. I would also be grateful for any references. If any responses could be left on my talk page, that would be greatly appreciated. Capitalistroadster 15:29, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

title: Talk:Lakkopetra


text:
Glacier Peak Wilderness

Glacier Peak Wilderness is a 566,057 acre, 35 mi, 20 mi wilderness area located within portions of Chelan, Snohomish, and Skagit counties in the North Cascades of Washington. The area lies within parts of Wenatchee National Forest and Mount Baker National Forest and is characterized by heavily forested stream courses, steep-sided valleys, and dramatic glacier-crowned peaks. The dominant geologic feature of the area is 10,541 ft Glacier Peak. It is the most remote major volcanic peak in the Cascade Range and has more active glaciers than any other place in the lower forty-eight states. Glacier Peak is a volcanic cone of basalt, pumice, and ash which erupted during periods of heavy glaciation.

History
Glacier Peak Wilderness was created by the U.S. Forest Service in 1960 through the efforts of the North Cascades Conservation Council, four years before the 1964 wilderness legislation of the Congress.

Ecology

Forest vegetation comprises several species of fir, Douglas fir, hemlock, red cedar as well as stands of mixed pine and Douglas fir on its eastern slopes. Various species of wildlife inhabit the area and include deer, elk, black bear, mountain goat, cougar, marten, and lynx. Smaller animals, such as field mice are common. The last confirmed grizzly bear sighting in the United States portion of the North Cascade ecosystem occurred in this wilderness. The high mountain lakes often give good catches of fish during their ice-free months. The primary fishery is cutthroat trout, however, other species do exist.

Access
No roads approach Glacier Peak, and many miles of hiking through extremely rough terrain are required to reach its base. Normally, hikers can reach the volcano from the west via the White Chuck River Valley, or the Suiattle River Valley; from the east, it may be approached from the western tip of Lake Chelan or the White River or Chiwawa River valleys.

Trail conditions
Most years the wilderness is still buried under 10 to 20 ft of snow in May. Usually most trails and passes are snow free by mid-August, but this varies from year to year. Snow and cold rain can occur in mid-summer.

title: Glacier Peak Wilderness